Confederate Yankee
April 03, 2006
Dixie Check
Natalie Maines, this one's for you (Via Instapundit).
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
09:16 PM
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Mainstream Media Math
This morning, a U.S. Air Force C-5 Galaxy reported problems after takeoff and crashed while trying to make an emergency landing at Dover Air Force Base in Delaware. The plane broke into three large sections, with the nose and tail assembly separating from the fuselage. There are survivors, and perhaps miraculously, there are no confirmed fatalities at this time.
CNN's coverage of the crash provides us with this
gem of information about the C-5:
The C-5 can carry 270,000 tons of cargo almost 2,500 miles on one load of fuel. The C-5's wingspan is 28 feet wider than a 747 and the military jet is 16 feet longer than the civilian airliner.
270,000 tons? Wow. That's impressive, especially when considering that the massive
Iowa class battleships, at 887 feet,
weigh less than 60,000 tons when fully loaded. Is CNN trying to say that a single C-5 can carry four battleships with room left over, or are the much-vaunted multiple layers of editorial oversight in the professional media not all it is cracked up to be?
Here's a hint, CNN: try 270,000
pounds, not 270,000
tons.
I report, you deride.
Correction: Dover is in Delaware, not Maryland. I blame daylight savings time for the error...
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
08:42 AM
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1
It is tons displaced not actual weight for BB's and most ships.
Posted by: jon-hudson spencer at April 03, 2006 11:37 AM (zP0D7)
2
Uhmm. Dover AFB is in Deleware not Maryland. Maryland has Adnrews AFB.
Posted by: Bruce at April 03, 2006 11:42 AM (LYo9h)
3
Didn't Archimedies figure out that if it floats, then tons displaced is the weight?
http://physics.weber.edu/carroll/Archimedes/principle.htm
Posted by: allgreektome at April 04, 2006 03:29 PM (t1Y1G)
4
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• Clonazepam may also be used for purposes other than those listed in this medication guide.
Posted by: CLONAZEPAM at April 08, 2006 11:39 AM (avWiB)
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Nuts in Texas
Tom Elia at the New Editor makes me wonder:
Who is more insane, the college professor who gave a speech
calling for the destruction of humanity with the ebloa virus, or those in attendence who gave him a standing ovation?
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
06:06 AM
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1
If he is really so concerned, wouldn't you think he'd be the first to VOLUNTEER to leave? Why wait for a pandemic - suicide NOW!
Oh, typical liberal....YOU do what I say, not what I do!
Posted by: Maggie at April 03, 2006 06:30 AM (QKXCW)
2
I bet he wants to be in the 10% that he believes should live.
Posted by: Retired Navy at April 03, 2006 11:11 AM (y67bA)
3
Oh, naturally. When he says "we are no better than bacteria" one finds it hard to believe he has in mind himself and his family.
Posted by: Amber at April 03, 2006 12:39 PM (9uWiP)
Posted by: Chad Evans at April 03, 2006 04:27 PM (uimQk)
5
Sounds like a militant form of VHEM
Posted by: Purple Avenger at April 04, 2006 08:44 PM (WjdPM)
6
WorldSex Daily Updated Free Links to Hardcore Sex Pictures, Movies, Free Porn Videos and XXX Live Sex Cams
Posted by: SEXMENS at April 06, 2006 11:11 PM (hPjZG)
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April 02, 2006
And What Was It Before?
The NY Times released an anonymous editorial Sunday titled, "The Endgame in Iraq." To read it is to understand why the Times is failing both financially and intellectually.
Iraq is becoming a country that America should be ashamed to support, let alone occupy.
And what was it before? A brutal dictatorship that ran rape rooms and torture centers, a thugocracy that twice invaded its neighbors and used chemical weapons against civilian and soldier alike.
The nation as a whole is sliding closer to open civil war. In its capital, thugs kidnap and torture innocent civilians with impunity, then murder them for their religious beliefs.
And what was it before? A country where the government itself kidnapped and murdered not dozens, but hundreds or thousands at a time. Does the
Times simply prefer state-sanctioned mass murders to
ad hoc slaughter?
The rights of women are evaporating.
And what were they before? Rape rooms, RAPE ROOMS were run by the government itself.
The head of the government is the ally of a radical anti-American cleric who leads a powerful private militia that is behind much of the sectarian terror.
And what was it before? The head of government ran what was once the fourth largest army in the world, not 10,000 ragtag thugs, and Saddam's "state security" murdered more civilians in "peacetime" that Iraq lost during the war and occupation combined.
The Bush administration will not acknowledge the desperate situation. But it is, at least, pushing in the right direction, trying to mobilize all possible leverage in a frantic effort to persuade the leading Shiite parties to embrace more inclusive policies and support a broad-based national government.
One vital goal is to persuade the Shiites to abort their disastrous nomination of Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari. Mr. Jaafari is unable to form a broadly inclusive government and has made no serious effort to rein in police death squads. Even some Shiite leaders are now calling on him to step aside. If his nomination stands and is confirmed by Parliament, civil war will become much harder to head off. And from the American perspective, the Iraqi government will have become something that no parent should be asked to risk a soldier son or daughter to protect.
And what was it before? When at any time, was this war not a "desperate situation" for those reporting for the
New York Times? Since before this war began, the
Times has consistently prescribed clouds of doom for every lining of silver. The very fact that even Shiites are calling for al-Jaafari to step down is a measure many did not expect. Iraqis want peace, having seen enough death and destruction in the hands of the dictator the
Times presumably would prefer to remain in power. It is hardly surprising that the Times would feel that no soldier should risk his life to fight in Iraq or Afghanistan. They didn't support this from the beginning and helped create this situation by giving the insurgency hope, so why should they change their approach now?
Unfortunately, after three years of policy blunders in Iraq, Washington may no longer have the political or military capital to prevail. That may be hard for Americans to understand, since it was the United States invasion that toppled Saddam Hussein and helped the Shiite majority to power. Some 140,000 American troops remain in Iraq, more than 2,000 American servicemen and servicewomen have died there so far and hundreds of billions of American dollars have been spent.
Yet Shiite leaders have responded to Washington's pleas for inclusiveness with bristling hostility, personally vilifying Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad and criticizing American military operations in the kind of harsh language previously heard only from Sunni leaders. Meanwhile, Moktada al-Sadr, the radically anti-American cleric and militia leader, has maneuvered himself into the position of kingmaker by providing decisive support for Mr. Jaafari's candidacy to remain prime minister.
A faction,
one faction of Shiites lashed out after an elite Sunni-Shiite anti-terrorist unit took on the Madhi Army militia and destroyed one of its bases, and freed a kidnapped hostage without sustaining a single casualty. The Iraqi Army has quietly relegated al Qaeda in Iraq and the Sunni insurgency to near irrelevance.
Do you doubt this?
When is the last time you heard the name Zarqawi? When was the last major success of the insurgency against the Iraqi Army, much less the U.S. or British militaries?
al Qaeda and the remaining Sunni insurgency can still take lives and they may be able to do so far years, but they cannot win. With this threats behind them the Iraqi Army now turns to clearing out a just one corrupt Shiite faction and its Madhi Army milita allied with Iran. al-Sadr is no kingmaker. He has no great constituency outside of his slums, only poor political skills, and an alliance with Iran that has made him a legitimate military target. No one can play kingmaker from beyond the grave.
It was chilling to read Edward Wong's interview with the Iraqi prime minister in The Times last week, during which Mr. Jaafari sat in the palace where he now makes his home, complained about the Americans and predicted that the sectarian militias that are currently terrorizing Iraqi civilians could be incorporated into the army and police. The stories about innocent homeowners and storekeepers who are dragged from their screaming families and killed by those same militias are heartbreaking, as is the thought that the United States, in its hubris, helped bring all this to pass.
And what was it before? Under Saddam, Iraqis knew who it was who was dragging innocent people away in the middle of the night. Today, they at least stand a fighting chance.
As it now stands, the Army is increasingly able to handle its own areas of responsibility; predominately Shiite Army units successfully defended Sunni sections of Baghdad during "sectarian" fighting. This fact is something the
Times prefers not to cover as it undermines their three-years-and-counting "all it lost" narrative, but this truth that is establishing trust all the same. With the Iraqi Army on legs that grow steadier day by day, the U.S and Iraqi Army forces like the ones that cleaned out the Madhi Army militia nest last week can now focus on weeding out militiamen. Things are bloody and fluid in Iraq, but perhaps not as dire as the
Times predicts over and over again.
It is conceivable that the situation can still be turned around. Mr. Khalilzad should not back off. The kind of broadly inclusive government he is trying to bring about offers the only hope that Iraq can make a successful transition from the terrible mess it is in now to the democracy that we all hoped would emerge after Saddam Hussein's downfall. It is also the only way to redeem the blood that has been shed by Americans and Iraqis alike.
Conceivable? Most certainly. al Qaeda can take lives, but it is far past the point that it can win. The Sunni insurgency is quietly melting away as Iraqis take the lead in "clear, hold and build" operations, and Sunnis see that the government is operating in their best interests.
The biggest threat to Iraq's future at the moment is a lightly armed Madhi Army militia that is held together by a cult of personality surrounding Moktada al-Sadr and Iranian special forces soldiers.
The situation in Iraq is far from ideal, but individuals now have a say in their own future, which is something they have not had in decades. Iraq isn't what we want it to be now, but it is better than it was before, under Saddam. The
Times, of course, decided their approach to this war before it began, and no Coalition success was too large to overlook, and no Coalition setback was too small to ignore. Don't expect their coverage to change. The
Times coverage in Iraq is brutal, one-sided, and superficial.
But then, that's what it was before.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
11:38 PM
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Posted by: Jim Hoft at April 03, 2006 08:02 AM (mLkAh)
2
Media Bias??? What media bias???
Posted by: Ticketplease at April 03, 2006 08:31 AM (MF225)
3
We could have handled the Iraq situation in a smarter way. We knew we could take out Sadam with our military strength in conventional warfare but don't seem to understand the Iraqi society and its history of internal religious and ethinic hostility. When the all powerful dictator was in charge he kept the lid on with ruthless efficiency and by playing the ethnic groups against each other. We don't have the stomach for Nazi type methods of controling a restive population like the Turks and Sadam used to.
Our only hope is to set up a puppet government and supply them with military back up and tons of
money ( a lot of which will end up in Switz bank
accounts). When the situation cools down a little
we can declare victory and bring the troops home
just like Viet Nam. Then the the real bloodletting
will start. Such a situation occured in India as
the British finally decided they couldn't hang on to the jewel of their empire. The walked out and left the waring religious factions to fight it out
and divide the country along ethnic lines.
We have already lost too many lives and too much money trying to maintain a hold over a people who don't want us there. Let the Iraqis settle it
among themselves. We can send guns and money to the faction we favor and buy oil from the winners.
Where is Lawrence of Arabia when we realy need him?
Posted by: John Sage at April 03, 2006 11:36 AM (9P8+h)
4
Your arguments are empty. How do smart and motivated folks like yourself support the constant and repeated missteps of this President? You justify this pre-emptive war by saying that things were bad under Saddam also? that's it? How do you reconcile that logic with other human atrocities in the world? Where is the line drawn? Of course that is a very difficult question - i wonder if you have such a strong and confident answer? Darfur? Iraq? N. Korea? Do you really think we have the ability to address these problems without the help of the rest of the civilized world? You sound like a person who says "Screw wworld opinion" (maybe not. Also, killing Al-Sadr? that is plain dumb. Of course we'd prefer him dead but the consequences are worse. And yes he is clearly a kingmaker - HE chose Jaafari.
This was was BS from the start. We were lied to about WMD (at the very least we were led by the nose by the Neocons and selective intelligence was their currency) Even Powell is embarrassed by his own claims to Congress and UN. The notion we went in to spread democracy is simply a bunch of crap sold after the fact. The mistakes and lies are numerous without shred of regret. Multiple Generals, Zinni and Shinsecki and others call the endeavour inept and criminal. Why do folks like you refuse to believe we made a mistake and we simply must put our best foot forward and clean up the mess. You can love this country and hate this foolish and inept administration. It's plain crazy for you guys to attack the "media" and NYTimes when the big picture is clear - Bush messed uo and his underlings gave him horrible advice. Do you think we are succeeding in Iraq? If yes you are utterly delusional - NO ONE thinks we are succeeding. Respectfully yours, another patriotic American.
Posted by: Thomas Ram at April 03, 2006 11:39 AM (SLmXw)
5
First of all, let me get this straight. You are blaming the people who did not want to go to war in Iraq for the problems there. Maybe you should blame the people who did want to go to war in Iraq for the situation. I don't think that statement needs any argument to back it up, it seems pretty straight forward to me. Second, I have heard so much about these rape rooms, but I want to know when and how often women were raped in Iraq before the war compared to after. Do you know? Article after article reads how college women could walk streets of Baghdad unafraid before the war, but now require escorts. A lack of functioning government created a situation where rapes and killings can me committed by anyone and go unpunished because the Iraqi forces are trying to prevent a civil war. Similairly, Christians were not also unafraid to walk the streets, but now that sectarion warfare has broken out, they too are scared. Also I don't see how counting on Iraqis to fight the war is progress. The TImes didn't elude to that, they called the fighting the problem, not just the fighting the troops are involved in. Just because we train Iraqis to fight other Iraqis isn't progress. Peace is winning the war, not a troop pullout as the country continues to fight each other. This is real people with real lives we interrupted, not a cage match we want to watch.
Posted by: What?! at April 03, 2006 11:51 AM (pWUwe)
6
Regarding "And What Was It Before?" post, yes, we did a really good job with this invasion thing and of course, we are completely justified in putting these people through whatever hell we decide to because, hey, we're Americans and we're always right, right?
-Dave
Posted by: Dave at April 03, 2006 11:57 AM (hzjMr)
Posted by: Amber at April 03, 2006 12:43 PM (9uWiP)
8
Three years ago, Bush supporters attacked the 'liberal' media for questioning the doctrine of pre-emptive war. Fine. Now that the situation in Iraq has become far worse than even the most pessimistic war critic had predicted, the burden of proof now falls on you, conservative blogger. YOU must prove that the situation in Iraq is better now than it was under Saddam Hussein using YOUR reliable, un-biased sources. Simply writing RAPE ROOM in capital letters ain't gonna git 'er done. If the NYTimes is biased, then show us the light. Where's the real story about Iraq? 40,000 Iraqi civilians have died since the U.S. invasion. At which time did they choose to make that sacrifice? All the money we set aside to rebuild Iraq is gone because . . . you finish that sentence.
Posted by: William Payne at April 03, 2006 12:49 PM (mxFvK)
9
You want numbers, William? Try these:
Ronald Hilton estimates that, over the 24 years of Saddam Hussein's rule, about 600,000 people were killed by the Iraqi government. Now, maybe I ain't all that good at cipherin', but by my math, if you assume that Saddam Hussein was in power for 24 years (8,646 days, including leap years), and 600,000 people were executed during that time, you come up with an average of 69.4 people a day executed by Saddam Hussein's regime. That doesn't, by the way, include the 1,000,000 or so Iraqis who died during Mr. Hussein's wars of aggression agsint Iraq or Kuwait. That's just executions.
So, Mr. Steele's argument, essentially, is that Iraqis were better off when they had a tranquil public life with 70 people being bumped off by their own government every day, than they are now with 13 people dying in sectarian violence each day. Nevermind that, at the current rate, it will take 126 years for the daily death toll in Iraq to equal the death toll under Saddam Hussein. It just feels really unsafe.
And, frankly, Iraq is really unsafe. But it'as a fundamentally different kind of threat that existed under Saddam. Now the threat is overt violence; easily seen, and easily identified. Under Saddam Hussein, the threat was far more subtle. Your neighbors merely disappeared in the middle of the night, with hardly a ripple to mark their passing.
Saddam was responsbile for executing 600,000 Iraqi civilians (we're not even counting the estimated million dead from wars he started) versus the 40,000 that have died since we invaded (including insurgents, which become "innocent" civilians when someone else picks up their RPG or AK before they hit the morgue).
At a bare minimum, Bush's war is five times safer for Iraqi civilians that Clinton's peace with Saddam in power.
Those are your numbers.
Enjoy your denial.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at April 03, 2006 01:09 PM (g5Nba)
10
2300 American and untold numbers of Iraqi lives to trade Saddam for THIS??
We began breaking Iraq fifteen years ago with sanctions, and Bush finished the job. We've broken apart a nation, and as Colin Powell warned, now we own it.
Does the "confederate yankee" wax nostalgic for our own civil war, such that we should visit that on other nations in the name of American hegemony?
Posted by: Doug Thompson at April 04, 2006 02:33 AM (K3kkE)
11
Personally, I am tired of the bleeding hearts in this country crying about all the dead Iraqi civilians. Is it sad that some civilians are dying? Yes, of course it is. Is Iraq pretty unstable? Yes, it is as of now. However, said bleeding hearts often conviniently forget the brutal Regime Saddam headed. The unfortunate thing is that while I can listen to the arguments that these bleeding hearts make and agree that what is going on is a travesty, the bleeding hearts cannot bring themselves to at least admit that the fact Saddam is no longer in power is a very very good thing.
I wonder if any of them have talked to anyone in Iraq lately. I happened to have had a friend in Iraq before the war and after the war "ended" I asked him if he is happy Saddam is gone. He said he is very happy, and so are many Iraqis in Baghdad (his home). I asked him if he hated America. He said while he is not thrilled with the occupation, he is happy that we ridded their country of Saddam. But I suppose that we should completely neglect the testimony of someone who actually lives there right? I mean, his opinion can't mean anything.
Posted by: Brian at April 04, 2006 06:28 AM (zLQa2)
12
Brian,
Just because they are happy Saddam is not in poer does make them better off. Hell I would be happy if Bush wasn't in power but I wouldn't want to live through a war to see tha happen.
Posted by: judith at April 04, 2006 07:57 AM (gOpuZ)
13
I have a couple simple questions. If you gave every one whom wanted a automatic weapon one and a full magazine here in our country, who do you think would have those weapons? What do you think would happen in our very own society? Who would or could control our criminals and our fanatics? The Bush administration was well aware of the situation it created is any one willing to debate that fact?
Posted by: a soldiers wife at April 04, 2006 08:07 AM (J/87w)
14
Confederate Yankee: You're putting a spin on the NYTimes story that's not supported by the actual text of the editorial. Nowhere in the text does it say that Iraq is worse off now than before the U.S. invasion. By asking repeatedly "what was it before" you make it seem like the NYTimes is arguing that the situation in Iraq is somehow worse now than before.
But that's not the intent of the editorial. The point is rather that the U.S. administration was and continues to offer a woefully inadequate plan for the stabilization of Iraq. Starting with the poor post-war planning done before the actual invasion started, and continuing through today, the administration seems to be bewildered by Iraqi society and how to stabilize it.
It's pointless to argue whether 600,000 secret deaths are better or worse than 40,000 open and violent deaths -- you can't really compare human lives as if they're apples or bananas. But we CAN argue with the administration that its post-invasion planning continues to be befuddled and dangerously confused.
Posted by: bobbem at April 04, 2006 09:45 AM (7Ksti)
15
Its rather amusing to me how people, especially Condfederate Yankee continually refer to how brutal Saddam was. Maybe he should pick up a history book and read how we supported Saddam in the 80's with weapons and $$$$ to fight Iran. Where was the outcry about the rape rooms then? When he gassed the Kurds in '88 what was America's response?
The fact of the matter is, the United States will turn a blind eye to just about anything as long as it suits our interests. So spare me the the Saddam was a bad guy and we had to take him out B.S.
Posted by: Bryan at April 04, 2006 10:35 AM (pK5QI)
16
May I cry foul in regards to Mr. Yankees' earlier display of 'statistics' about Saddam's rule? Fist, the link he included as a source leads only to another blog, nothing substantive. Secondly, attempting to assess the safety of civilians in Iraq in 2003 by dividing the number of deaths in previous conflicts with the number of days the guy was in power is absurd. There is no evidence that 69.5 people a day were dying in Iraq. That number is the product of some long division done with two numbers that have nothing to do with civilian safety in Iraq in 2003. In addition, it's my understanding that the 500,000 wrongful deaths that occured in Iraq between the 1990s and the present were a result of severe economic deprivation brought on by the embargo of Iraq which contributed heavily to the current instability of the country.
No one is arguing that Saddam was a good leader. He was a tyrant, whose actions were a byproduct of poor British and U.S. foreign policy in the 60s and 70s. However, there are roughly 300 dictators operating in today's world, the majority of whom either instigate or at least condone huge injustices. In the past, the U.S. has actively supported these dictators just as we supported Saddam. (In the 1970s, the NYTimes praised General Suharto in Cambodia shortly before he fought 'communism' by fire-bombing 500,000 peasants.)
Now, the U.S. is unilaterally, without the support of the world, blaming some dictators for terrorism while continue to support other dictators. I wish I had a clear suggestion for how to end evil dictatorships, but I know that toppling a country's regime, smashing its infrastructure and arming the desperate religious sects is not the answer.
Posted by: William Payne at April 04, 2006 01:21 PM (mxFvK)
17
Lies, William, you're drownig in lies. You are wrong virtually across the board.
If you bothered to follow the link embedded in the blockquote above, you'd be able to see that the figures above were pulled from Ronald Hilton at the World Association of International Studies at Stanford University. Hilton, in turn, pulled data from a Stephen Cass article, who had compiled statistics from the (Iran-based) Documental Centre for Human Rights in Iraq and Human Rights Watch, hardly charter members of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy.
The 600,000 dead cited did not include the estimated one million killed in the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq War, nor did it include a single soul killed in the 1991 Gulf War. The 600,000 dead cited above does not include the half million you say died of starvation as a result of sanctions.
The 600,000 human beings cited above were those coldly executed—murdered—by Saddam Hussein’s regime, just as I stated.
Saddam Hussein is not a byproduct of the 1960s-70s, but an unnatural partition of the Ottoman Empire and the humiliation Iraq—including Saddam’s uncle Khairullah Tulfah,a pro-Nazi nationalist—faced by being bested by Britain in World War Two was a main influence on Saddam's life well before the United States entered his life in any way.
You argument is that since we can’t depose 300 hundred dictators at once, that we should allow all of them to operate with impunity. You are an apologist for murderers, sir, and in my opinion, a vile human being.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at April 04, 2006 02:16 PM (g5Nba)
18
I am drowning in lies, though not my own. The problem with blogging is people like you . . . you are operating on one bogus statistic: you claim Saddam tortured and killed 600,000 people independent of any known conflict. You have one source: The Documental Centre for Human Rights in Iraq. (????) The fact that two hawkish individuals quoted this source, one from the other, does not lend it any validity. The Doc. Center for Human Rights in Iraq (www.marqud.org/en/partners/DCHRI/intro.htm) currently distributes no information to the U.S. public, is based somewhere in Middle East and has a useless Web site. I'll stick with the Times. Hell, I'll stick with the Heritage Foundation. The 600,000 figure is not supported by any news article or any other human rights groups. Your case against the NYTimes and me is based on one, obscure and probably invented statistic.
Here are real facts. In 1996 on 60 Minutes, when Madeliene Albright was presented with the fact that 500,000 children under the age of 5 had died as a result of the U.S. led United Nations embargo on Iraq starting in 1991, she said she thought it was worth it. A Columbia professor did a study a year later on child mortality in Iraq revealing that only 350,000 children had died and the number of adults was well below one million. Phew! I guess it was worth it.
Your point that Iraq is an unnatural partition of the Ottoman Empire is well taken. The British and the U.S. agreed to leave Saddam in charge of Iraq in the 1970s after years of lousy Western occupation because he was westernized and malleable. But Iraq was a fictional country, an "unnatural" blend of opposing religions. Despite the fact that Saddam's reign turned sour early on, we armed and funded him heavily. After he invaded Kuwait, we wrecked his country with the worst embargo in history, crushing the economy, and then acted surprised when he became increasingly totalitarian in his behavior.
I have never suggested that dictators be allowed to exist with impunity. I simply believe that totalitarian violence cannot be remedied with more totalitarian violence, and my belief is strongly supported by the fact that our aggression in Iraq has opened a Pandora's Box of sectarian disarray and cruelty, which far surpasses the state affairs in Saddam's poverty stricken Iraq in 2003.
Posted by: William Payne at April 04, 2006 10:30 PM (YyA3w)
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March 31, 2006
A Conventional Nuke
Sometimes the outright stupidity and shallowness of thinking in the general news media staggers me. But before I blast them, I need to start with myself, for getting so close initially, and then not putting 2+2 together.
Last night
I mocked the U.S. military's plan to test a 700-ton bomb in the Nevada desert. I noted that no plane every built could come close to delivering a conventional bomb even a third that size. I wrote it off as a blustering response to Iran's refusal to stop uranium enrichment, but not the test of a serious munition.
I suggested, "If the Pentagon wants to send a real message to the Iranians, they could test a B61-11. I think the folks in Las Vegas and Tehran would be much more impressed with the show."
It wasn't until over 12 hours later that I figured out that something very similar to that might be the point of the test.
The 700-ton bomb will use close to
600-tons of a special mixture of ammonium nitrate-based explosives.
According to
Global Security.org, the B61 Mod 11 thermonuclear bomb has a W-61 EPW (earth penetrating warhead) that ranges in yield from 360-kiloton strategic bomb down, if
Nuclear Weapon Archive.org is correct, to a tactical penetrator with a yield
as low as .3 kilotons. If I'm doing my math correctly, a 0.3 Kt weapon is the theoretical equivalent of 300 tons yield in a convention explosive under certain conditions.
Could the 700-ton bomb test be a surrogate for the shockwave effect of a low-yield .3 Kt B61-11 nuclear warhead?
Neither the
Washington Post nor
Reuters, nor any other news agency seems to have caught on to this possibility. Then again, they haven't figured out yet that this massive bomb being tested could never get airborne, so this shouldn't be a surprise.
We appear to be running a "nukeless" nuclear test of the kind of ground-penetrating and literally ground-breaking bomb we may be forced to use again Iran. The "empty threat" I mocked yesterday isn't very funny anymore.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
03:25 PM
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1
I think you might be on to something here. The stated reason for the test makes some sense, but not a lot. Maybe they just want a high-end number for their data, and intend to go down from there. Yours makes somewhat more sense, and seems appropriate for the kind of Army I'd like to think we have.
Although another possibility does occur to me. I know little about military explosives, and the article seems to contain some misstatements, but one thing jumped out at me: why are they using ANFO (ammonium nitrate/fuel oil)? It has a yield below that of TNT, and the wikipedia entry on it implies it might be difficult to prepare ANFO in such quantities for a single bomb. The military has thousands of tons of higher-yield explosives around.
Thus the second possibility: that the press release about "700 tonnes of ANFO" is a complete fabrication, and what's being detonated is a real tactical nuke with a yield in the 600-ton range. That would explain the notification of the Russians.
(Incidentally, since it's an AFP article and the word is spelled "tonne," they probably mean metric tons: 1000kg = about 2200 lbs.)
Posted by: wolfwalker at March 31, 2006 06:44 PM (UxlUT)
2
Think of it in these terms. Iran desperately wants nukes. They know we have had a lot of them for a long time. This detonation will say to them - you can go after nukes but look what we can do to you without going that far.
Posted by: Stephen Macklin at March 31, 2006 07:15 PM (DdRjH)
3
God;it took you this long!
It might be a scientific test of operational parameters and one is not the weight of thew bomb the aircraft has to deliver!!!!!
Get some help!!
Posted by: RFYoung at March 31, 2006 08:17 PM (TFpgY)
4
egg on my face dude. Although the .7 kiloton yield of the test might also indicate an as of yet unknown, low yield penetrator mini nuke. If you want to test a .3 kiloton explosion for modelling purposes, you dont blow a .7 kiloton device.
Posted by: Rey at April 01, 2006 12:35 AM (/GnnS)
5
Rey,
It isn't a .7 Kt (700 ton) yield, but 593 ton ammonium nitrate explosive, which burns slower that the TNT KT standard.
I don't claim to be a physicist, but a larger, slow burning explosive might be close to the shock effect of a much smaller, faste burning explosive, like a .3 Kt nuke.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at April 01, 2006 01:07 AM (0fZB6)
6
This is my home turf and I will say only this:
New DOE supercomputer upgrade by IBM, classified 3-D software program simulating multivector forces of a nuclear explosion, Comprehensive Nuclear Test Ban Treaty.
This test is very important...
End of discussion.
Posted by: WB at April 01, 2006 03:46 AM (10w6K)
7
Just to add to your perceptive post and the comments above mine - this test simulates the destruction of bunkers of certain depth and hardness. This may mean that the US is getting serious about an Iranian campaign.
chsw
Posted by: chsw10605 at April 02, 2006 07:27 PM (WdHqZ)
8
"A saber being rattled makes much noise. A saber being drawn is quiet."
A nice bit of rattling with this test. Kinda 'one-ups' the Iranian stuff, especially that goofy ground effect "invisible boatmobile".
Wait for the quiet bit... Coming soon.
Posted by: heldmyw at April 04, 2006 02:09 PM (LvGT1)
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Cut Her Some Slack... For Now
Freed hostage Jill Carroll is being bad-mouthed by some, but after spending three months as a hostage to a group that murdered her translator right in front of her I, like Rusty, am willing to cut her some slack. She's seen a lot of things that none of us ever will, and endured mental stresses none of us will likely ever have to face, so I can excuse the anti-Americanism she expressed in captivity. I suggest that her comments both before and after her ordeal should be viewed through the new prism of her recent experience.
Remind me, however… what were
Eason Jordan's excuses for coddling terrorists?
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
10:33 AM
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C.Y., I agree. Remember U.S.S. Pueblo when it was captured by North Korea in 1968 and the 82 surviving crewmen were held for 11 months. They were forced to sign false confessions, and appear on film, but they extended their middle fingers in what they told their captors was a "Hawaiian good luck sign".
Posted by: Tom TB at April 02, 2006 09:42 AM (y6n8O)
2
What was her opinion of America before this ordeal? I'm trying to figure out if this is just Stockholm Syndrome, or something else.
Posted by: Jordan at April 02, 2006 06:31 PM (pLJN7)
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The Signs are There
I guess we can consider this indicative of Democratic competence in their "cut-and-run-and-gun" national insecurity program.

This campaign the DNC is running on is going to generate a lot of votes.
Republican votes.

Ian at Expose the Left
has the video.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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CY,
First the stealth estes....I laughed on that. But I almost choked on my coffee when I saw the picture of Pelosi with the sign. You gotta give us fair warning man....LOL
Posted by: Specter at March 31, 2006 09:27 AM (ybfXM)
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Now if I can only find some paper towels to clean the coffee off my screen.....
Posted by: Specter at March 31, 2006 09:27 AM (ybfXM)
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Is that a sign that the Democrats are in distress? We know that the US flag flown upside down is a sign of distress, so is Pelosi secretly stating that the Democrats are in distress over national security and are hoping for relief?
Posted by: lawhawk at March 31, 2006 10:38 AM (eppTH)
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Iranian Stealth Missile
This is interesting. We talk of 700-ton bombs that will never get off the ground (an M-1 Abrams main battle tank, by comparison weighs 65 tons), and the very next day, the Iranians counter in the bluster war with this:
Iran successfully test-fired a locally made missile with the ability to carry a warhead and avoid radar, the airforce chief of the elite Revolutionary Guards said Friday.
"Today, a remarkable goal of the Islamic Republic of Iran's defence forces was realized with the successful test-firing of a new missile with greater technical and tactical capabilities than those previously produced," Gen. Hossein Salami said on state-run television.
The missile, while locally made, is of
American design.
I'd translate the last part about “greater technical and tactical capabilities” to mean they're now using
B4-4 rocket engines instead of their earlier designs using
A8-3s.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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The 700-ton bomb isn't being tested for use itself; it's to see what a 1 kiloton detonation does to a buried structure. If the effect is sufficient, then development will procede on a 1 kiloton penetrator nuke.
At least, that's the best speculation I've read. You're absolutely right that there's no way to deliver 700 tons of explosive.
Posted by: Robert Crawford at March 31, 2006 09:08 AM (n5eDP)
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LOL.....love the estes rockets. Maybe they have a silkworm in the catalog now. But I bet they are counting on the heavy lift capability of the tried and true "Big Bertha". guffaw.....
Posted by: Specter at March 31, 2006 09:14 AM (ybfXM)
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New Orleans: Out of Time?
As they say, timing is everything:
A full recovery in New Orleans could take 25 years as homeowners, businesses and tourists are coaxed back to the city devastated by Hurricane Katrina, the Bush administration's Gulf Coast recovery coordinator said Thursday.
"We kind of want it to happen overnight, or I do, but it's going to take some time," White House coordinator Don Powell said in an interview with Associated Press reporters and editors. "This could be five to 25 years for it all to fit into place."
Powell added: "It's been a bottom-up process and it's complex."
Well, the "bottom" part is right. Guess where New Orleans will be in the next half-century or so?

Give yourself two points if you correctly answered "The Gulf of Mexico."
The original (snark-free) version of this Louisiana wetlands projection comes courtesy of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, and is used at LSU's Louisiana Energy & Environmental
Resource & Information Center (LEERIC) in
this article.
Back in September I
interviewed the former chair of a Coastal and Marine Studies Department, and asked him the following question:
1. Are estimates that the continued rate of wetland loss in Louisiana will place New Orleans on or in the Gulf of Mexico in the 2050-2090 time frame accurate?
He responded:
The estimates are probably accurate. There are three main factors: Global sea level rise, delta subsidence, Mississippi River sedimentation. Sea level is rising, the delta is sinking and the river is depositing much less sediment on the delta now than in the past (for multiple reasons).
In other words, by the time New Orleans
can recover from Hurricane Katrina, it may do so just in time to disappear under the waves of the Gulf of Mexico forever.
I don't have any problems with spending our tax dollars to rebuild New Orleans, I just don't think it wise to rebuild the city in the same nearly indefensible location.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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This prediction is if nothing is done to protect and restore the wetlands. "Nothing" is exactly what the US government course of action has been since Katrina. I live in your yellow circle and I can tell you, as a conservative Republican, I will never trust a word this government says again. All they do is say the correct, caring flowery words and desert you to your own devices. They know America will move on. Well America has moved on and the gulf coast is left to suffer and die. Thanks for nothing America.
Posted by: doctorj at March 31, 2006 08:44 AM (z35qt)
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Well, doctorj, America hater, don't let the door hit your behind as you "Move On"!
Posted by: Tom TB at March 31, 2006 09:01 AM (wZLWV)
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Doctorj,
You must not be a geologist. The wet lands are vanishing because of the levies. They are vanishing due to natural subsidence. The only way to restore them is by dumping sediment on them. You can not save them with plants or any of these other crazy environmentalist ideas.
When the core forced the river to stay where it is, instead of going down the Atchafalaya system, the river began dumping it’s sedimentation over the shelf break. All of the “dirt” that used to deposit on Louisiana is now deposited on the abyssal plane of the gulf of Mexico.
The river was forced to stay in its present location, in order to save New Orleans, the port, in the first place. Therefore, all they did was buy time. I would love to hear from you how the US government is supposed to stop mud, South Louisiana, from sliding off into the Gulf of Mexico. Or how they are supposed to keep the second longest river in the world from going where it wants.
The present day Atchafalaya River, which is where the Mississippi wants to go, has the only healthy wet lands in the state. It is also the only place that the state is growing.
Rusty
Posted by: Russell E. Wilson at March 31, 2006 09:13 AM (2drzM)
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I live in Louisiana. I know that if you send a bunch of money or anything else into our state that the politicians will take most of it. New Orleans is not sinking. It has sunk. Only small portions are above sea level and that will difinitely change soon. It is rediculous to spend money in that area. The New Orleans of historical fame died in the mid 1970's. The thing that was distroyed by Katrina was a tribute to our idiotic social programs to the extent that no one could enter the city without a gun. Despite recent claims that the danger was blown out of proportion, it was real and I have the personal history of several people to attest to this. Before Katrina you could not go into most of the city without being killed. Therefore let it die, do not give large sums of money to this thing!!
Posted by: David Caskey at March 31, 2006 10:47 AM (6wTpy)
5
I agree with David Caskey that rebuilding New Orleans or any of the ravaged delta area is a huge mistake considering the current ecological use of the Mississippi. It is really the channeling of the Mississippi with levis all the way up to St. Louis and beyond that is the root source of the problem. The Mississippi delta was created when the Mississippi river was flowing free without restraints and it would take something like that to restore it.
Posted by: docdave at April 01, 2006 08:57 PM (lekzA)
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The Big Nothing
On the day that Iran stated it would not halt uranium enrichment, the U.S. military made what some are interpreting as a thinly-veilled threat:
The US military plans to detonate a 700 tonne explosive charge in a test called "Divine Strake" that will send a mushroom cloud over Las Vegas, a senior defense official said.
"I don't want to sound glib here but it is the first time in Nevada that you'll see a mushroom cloud over Las Vegas since we stopped testing nuclear weapons," said James Tegnelia, head of the Defense Threat Reduction Agency.
Tegnelia said the test was part of a US effort to develop weapons capable of destroying deeply buried bunkers housing nuclear, chemical or biological weapons.
"We have several very large penetrators we're developing," he told defense reporters.
"We also have -- are you ready for this - a 700-tonne explosively formed charge that we're going to be putting in a tunnel in Nevada," he said.
Not to put too fine a point on it, this would be one of the most pathetic messages we've ever sent, as it is by far the emptiest threat we can make. To put it plainly (or perhaps planely), this bomb project could never get off the ground.
Literally.
According to the article, this bomb weighs "700 tonnes." It doesn't exactly specify if this is 700 long tons ( 2,240 lbs/ton, or a total of 1,588,000 lbs) or 700 short tons (2,000 lbs/ton, or a total of 1,400,000 lbs), but in the end the key detail is that no airplane on earth can carry such a payload.
The massive
American C5 Galaxy carries a payload of 240,000 lbs. The world's largest cargo airplane is the
Antonov An-225, which carries a maximum payload of "just" 551,150 lbs.
This is an empty threat, as the Iranians surely know.
If the Pentagon wants to send a real message to the Iranians, they could test a
B61-11. I think the folks in Las Vegas and Tehran would be much more impressed with the show.
Update: a closer look reveals that the 700-lb bomb may be a surrogate for a low yield B61-11.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Ah...dude...a 1 megaton bomb does not weight a thousand tons and this bomb doesnt really physically weight 700 tons. It refers to the explosive power as compared to the baseline (TNT). Modern explosives are much more effective than TNT. I would guess that this bomb might physically weight 1-2 tons.
Posted by: Rey at March 31, 2006 01:59 AM (/GnnS)
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Rey, I think yo ae misreading this.
The U.S military seems to measure conventional bombs by their rough gross weight, while nuclear weapons are measured by explosive yield.
They were not talking explosive power but raw weight when they referred to a "700-tonne explosively formed charge," just like a "250-lb" bomb is the weapons weight, even though it has has just 50 lbs. of explosives.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at March 31, 2006 02:19 AM (0fZB6)
3
I'd go with one of the "crowd pleasers" as a demo to enhance a mental image of us being crazed, rabid, and maybe just twitchy enough to maybe use one on them.
Posted by: Purple Avenger at March 31, 2006 06:32 AM (WjdPM)
4
I think it's time to field test the b61-11. LOL
Posted by: Specter at March 31, 2006 09:22 AM (ybfXM)
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March 29, 2006
Fact or Fiction?
In news related to the five FISA court judge's testimony, competing articles today by Eric Lichtblau of the New York Times and Brian DeBose of the Washington Times paint radically different pictures of the judge's testimony today, with Lichtblau's article making it appear that the five judges were siding against the president, and DeBose stating that the judges said Bush's executive order was legal. Obviously, one is wrong, and possibly being deceptive. The "verdict" from the lawyers of Powerline:
Having reviewed the transcript, I conclude that the Washington Times' characterization was fair, but arguably overstated. The New York Times, however, badly misled its readers...
...New York Times reporter Eric Lichtblau has a considerable career investment (and, I suspect, an ideological investment as well) in the idea that the NSA program is illegal. It would seem that Lichtblau's preconceptions and biases prevented him from accurately reporting what happened in the Judiciary Committee hearing yesterday. His suggestion that the main thrust of the judges' testimony was to "voice skepticism about the president's constitutional authority" is simply wrong; in fact, I can't find a single line in more than 100 pages of transcript that supports Lichtblau's reporting.
Eric Litchblau seems to have either lost his objectivity on this story so completely that he cannot even report facts, or he has made the conscious decision to misrepresent the story to the point of outright fabrication.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Evidently the NYT reporters (sic) are so accustomed to lying about anything involving the president they can't bring themselves to break the habit. They had to know they would get caught in the lie, but they also know that half of the people that read their lies will never find out it was a lie. Most lefties aren't capable of reading and understanding more than one sentence per day.
Posted by: scrapiron at March 30, 2006 12:14 AM (y6n8O)
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The quoted judges specifically discussed the case where a judge refuses a warrant. Bush never went to the court for warrants, as the law required.
Also - why would you rely on the Washington Times as a source? The LaRouches carry very little credibility so why should their newspaper? Thisarticle's twisting of what the judges said is ust one example.
Posted by: Dave Johnson at March 30, 2006 01:05 AM (a+eEb)
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Dave, your argument is irrelevant.
This post is about the fact Lichtblau misrepresented what occurred during the hearings, and the Washington Times is only important in that it pointed out the glaring difference in coverage of the same event, one that warranted further review.
A quick read of the available parts of the transcript shows that the judges agreed, like the FISA Court of Review in In RE: Sealed Case (2002), that the Executive has inherent constitutional authority to conduct foreign intelligence for military purposes, and that FISA is no valid restriction upon this duty.
More here, but the basic gist is that if ever challenged directly in a court of law, FISA and similar restrictions would be struck down as unconstitutionally infringing on the President's inherent powers.
Congress can pass unconstitutional laws like this all day long, but the Presidency does not have to follow them, and would be in violation of his oath of office if he did.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at March 30, 2006 01:37 AM (0fZB6)
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Dave,
Try reading the transcripts of what was said first, and then speaking. You will look a lot less foolish by backing up the NYT. Remember - they will keep trying to spin it their way since they are under investigation for possibly violating several laws. Get a grip!
Posted by: Specter at March 30, 2006 10:06 AM (ybfXM)
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**Not at all relevant** And I refuse to defend the Times today.
But Confederate Yankee, have you gambled today!? NC Lottery in the school house! (Sorry didn't know where to put it.)
Posted by: Nick D at March 30, 2006 03:03 PM (Y4d9q)
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The NYTimes printed an ideologically biased article? What a shock!
Posted by: benning at March 30, 2006 03:46 PM (GXvlP)
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There should be a concerted effort to out those journalist who may be using their by-line for supporting an upcoming book instead of reporting the news.
Posted by: davod at March 30, 2006 05:10 PM (AM62A)
8
I note today that Dave Johnson follows the "Murtha Doctrine" meticulously. That would be, "If Things Look Hard, Cut and Run."
Posted by: Specter at March 31, 2006 09:24 AM (ybfXM)
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Full of Sound and Fury
...Signifying nothing.
Classic Macbeth to be sure, but in this instance, the "nothing" has turned out to be claims from Democrats, libertarians, and some weak-willed Republicans that President Bush's executive order that authorized the creation of a terrorist intercept program by the National Security Agency is in some way illegal.
Yesterday, five FISA judges testified before the Senate Judiciary Committee about this
very program:
FEINSTEIN: Thank you very much. Now, I want to clear something up. Judge Kornblum spoke about Congress' power to pass laws to allow the president to carry out domestic electronic surveillance. And we know that FISA is the exclusive means of so doing. Is such a law, that provides both the authority and the rules for carrying out that authority — are those rules then binding on the president?
[U.S. District Judge Allan] KORNBLUM: No president has ever agreed to that.
When the FISA statute was passed in 1978, it was not perfect harmony. The intelligence agencies were very reluctant to get involved in going to court. That reluctance changed over a short period of time, two or three years, when they realized they could do so much more than they'd ever done before without...
FEINSTEIN: What do you think, as a judge?
KORNBLUM: I think — as a magistrate judge, not a district judge — that a president would be remiss in exercising his constitutional authority to say that, "I surrender all of my power to a statute." And, frankly, I doubt that Congress in a statute can take away the president's authority — not his inherent authority but his necessary and — I forget the constitutional — his necessary and proper authority.
FEINSTEIN: I'd like to go down the line, if I could, Judge, please. Judge Baker?
[U.S. District Judge Harold] BAKER: Well, I'm going to pass to my colleagues, since I answered before. I don't believe a president would surrender his power, either.
FEINSTEIN: So you don't believe a president would be bound by the rules and regulations of a statute. Is that what you're saying?
BAKER: No, I don't believe that. A president...
FEINSTEIN: That's my question.
BAKER: No, I thought you were talking about the decision…
FEINSTEIN: No, I'm talking about FISA and is a president bound by the rules and regulations of FISA?
BAKER: If it's held constitutional and it's passed, I suppose he is, like everyone else: He's under the law, too.
FEINSTEIN: Judge?
[U.S. District Judge Stanley] BROTMAN (?): I would feel the same way.
FEINSTEIN: Judge Keenan?
[U.S. District Judge John] KEENAN: Certainly the president is subject to the law. But by the same token, in emergency situations, as happened in the spring of 1861, if you remember — and we all do — President Lincoln suspended the writ of habeas corpus and got in a big argument with Chief Justice Taney, but the writ was suspended.
KEENAN: And some of you probably have read the book late Chief Justice Rehnquist wrote, "All the Laws But One." Because in his inaugural speech — not his inaugural speech, but his speech on July 4th, 1861, President Lincoln said, essentially, "Should we follow all the laws and have them all broken, because of one?"
FEINSTEIN: Judge?
(UNKNOWN) [probably U.S. District Judge William Stafford]: Senator, everyone is bound by the law, but I don't believe, with all due respect, that even an act of Congress can limit the president's power under the necessary and proper clause under the Constitution.
And it's hard for me to go further on the question that you pose, but I would think that (inaudible) power is defined in the Constitution, and while he's bound to obey the law, I don't believe that the law can change that.
While a full transcript of the five judge's testimony is not yet available, Spruill notes that all five—his word was "each"—of the five judges seems to hold that the President's argument that he has the inherent Constitutional authority to conduct warrantless wiretapping.
This is consistent with the FISA Court of Review's findings in
In re: Sealed Case when the Court
recognized "the President's inherent constitutional authority to conduct warrantless foreign intelligence surveillance."
These judges seem to agree with the
exact point I made in December:
Every President from the dawn of international wire communications well over 100 years ago until 1978 assumed this right, and the courts have always deferred to this particular power inherent to the Presidency. This is supported by case law and precedent, and is summed up in the five-page Department of Justice briefing (PDF) delivered last week. In short, the Department of Justice seems willing to make the case that Bush was well within his constitutional powers. If anything, Congress may have exceeded their constitutional powers in passing FISA.
Even after passing FISA, Carter himself did not feel strictly bound by it, nor has any President since, from Reagan, to George H. W. Bush, Clinton, to George W. Bush. They have all asserted (and over the past two weeks, their DoJ attorneys have as well) that the Office of the Presidency has the Constitutional authority to authorize warrantless intercepts of foreign intelligence. This power has been assumed by every president of the modern age before them, dating back, presumably to the Great Eastern's success in 1866 of laying the first successful transatlantic telegraph cable. From Johnson, then, through Grant, Hayes, Garfield, Arthur, Cleveland, Harrison, Cleveland (again), McKinley, Teddy Roosevelt, and Taft, through Wilson, Harding, Coolidge, Hoover, to FDR and on to Truman, Eisenhower, John Fitzgerald Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Ford and into the Carter administration, the Presidency has had the inherent and unchallenged power to conduct warrantless surveillance of foreign powers for national security reasons.
This is a simple, unassailable fact, not matter how loudly demagogues shriek.
FISA is a case of Congress infringing upon the inherent power of the executive branch, and if it comes up as a direct constitutional challenge, FISA will most likely be struck down as Congress infringing upon the constitutional authority of the executive branch to perform foreign intelligence functions.
Statutory law cannot override the President's constitutional powers and duties;
only a constitutional amendment has that power. Neither FISA nor other current statutory proposals in the Senate can infringe upon the President's Article II powers.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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I want to respond to this because well I do. But work calls and I well have to answer.
But highlight this "the Presidency has had the inherent and unchallenged power to conduct warrantless surveillance of foreign powers for national security reasons."
Now we are not going up against the traditional foreign powers. And did this program warrant american spying? I think thats where the FISA law line was drawn correct? The FISA judges may approve the President's actions, but weren't they themselves appointed to the court for that very reason? (I'm not sure if their Bush appointees, i'd have to research later.)
Posted by: Nick D at March 30, 2006 12:53 PM (Y4d9q)
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Nick, show me where in the Constitution that it restricts the President to "traditional" foreign powers, or for that matter, traditional methods. It doesn’t.
FISA does not touch international surveillance for military means (which is what Bush apparently authorized with his EO), and Bush has used FISA for law enforcement more than any president in history. Thee isn’t a real conflict in practice, but one has been ginned up by the NY Times just the same.
International surveillance for national security and domestic surveillance for law enforcement are not the same thing, and FISA only truly applies to the later. If FISA encroaches upon the Executive's Constitutionally-mandated duty to conduct foreign surveillance for the nations defense, then FISA is unconstitutional. Period. Any laws made to amend FISA that restrict these same Presidential duties will be unconstitutional as well, and Bush doesn’t even have to raise a legal challenge. If I understand the constitutional law properly as some have argued it, a President (perhaps only in his Commander in chief roll, I don’t know further than that) may merely sidestep such laws, and he doesn’t necessarily have to challenge them, very much the same way a soldier has both the right and responsibility to ignore an illegal order given to him.
Bush, based upon guidance for the White House Counsel, the NSA legal team, the Department of Justice, and two Attorney’s General, and predicated upon the fact that no case law in American history has ever even seriously challenged the President’s duties, obligations, and rights in the kind of action, appears wholly in the right. You don’t have to like it, but you do have to learn to accept it is constitutional.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at March 30, 2006 01:38 PM (g5Nba)
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Now with traditional powers, I knew I should have been more specific. I mean to harp on the fact that this is not a traditional "war" we are waging nor our the powers we are up against. In regards to that the law, lawyers, and perhaps the Constutition need to be discussed in a different light.
I understand international spying and domestic spying are two different things, yet not in this instance. National Security and Law Enforcement are the same when it comes to the war on terror, is it not? A FISA law does not inhibit the President in his duties to act as the chief law executor in the land. However I can understand if it does with his Commander in Chief role.
That is a Constitutional issue that needs to be addressed.
Which begs the question, in a time of war does the President have to abide by the laws of justice? The War on Terror is not a traditional war, as I've acknowledged. I don't believe we give up our laws rght there tho.
It comes down to what this really is. Is it spying on Americans or is it spying on international citizens? Who are the ones we are after, one's that lawfully require a warrant to pursue, or someone who we could just swoop down and nab?
I can see where the judges, lawyers, EO's are coming from, if they look at it as purely wartime powers. But thats the question. Its not as simple as a NYT slam down would say it to be.
Posted by: Nick D at March 30, 2006 02:01 PM (Y4d9q)
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It is the NYT and other media of course eagerly assisted by the Democrats that have made something an issue that for the entire history of this nation has never been questioned, that is in the name of national security and in time or war, the president, as commander in chief, has virtually unlimited power to protect and defend the nation in what ever way he deems necessary.
Posted by: docdave at April 01, 2006 09:14 PM (lekzA)
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Cut-And-Run-And-Gun
The new, "aggressive" 2006 Democratic platform advocates shifting 140,000 American soldiers out of Iraq to attack a nuclear-armed nominal ally to capture a figurehead dialysis patient that Harry Reid already thinks is dead.
More. Please.
Note: Bad link fixed.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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It must have been a dowzy, they've already have pulled the article.
Posted by: Fersboo at March 29, 2006 03:27 PM (x0fj6)
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Do they actually say they're going to attack Pakistan with those troops? Because I'm not getting that from the platform statement. It's too much of a leap for me from "eliminate Bin Laden through deploying more spies and special forces," which sounds like if anything it would involve more cooperation and diplomacy with Pakistan, not war.
Actually, the platform says very little at all. It is typical politican-speak... notice no time is set for the withdrawal. The true fill-in-the-blank is, of course, "when it's politically convenient." But if it were "when the d@mn job is done," then it would be indistinguishable from the Republican position, and they can't say the Dems didn't say that... the Dems can argue one way to one audience and another to another. Where have we seen that before? The rest is rhetoric without a plan, again all too familiar. CYA.
Posted by: Amber at March 29, 2006 04:56 PM (9uWiP)
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Wouldn't that be normal for Dusty Reid. Nothing he does or says makes sense. The people of Nv. should be real proud of the idiot they elected to serve them. His stupidity is a direct reflection on the citizens of Nv and it's not good.
Posted by: scrapiron at March 30, 2006 12:18 AM (y6n8O)
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I have a point you might want to consider. I have heard that Osama is on dialysis. There are two methods of doing this, one is hemodialysis which requires very sophisticated machines and tubing that has to be changed every time it is used which is about three times per week. The other is peritoneal that requires a special solution and again tubing that is changed with each use and is preformed daily. The key is that dialysis for one individual uses considerable fluid and tubing that is limited in manufacture and distribution. If he is on dialysis, is anyone following the distribution of this material? In my town of 200,000 people it would be easy to see who is receiving the dialysis and where. In a remote area it would be very simple to follow the distribution route. So why haven't we gotten this guy?
Posted by: David Caskey at March 30, 2006 10:26 AM (6wTpy)
5
So why haven't we gotten this guy?
Because the dialysis story is 100% USDA pure B.S. strikes me as a distinct possibility.
Posted by: Purple Avenger at March 31, 2006 06:35 AM (WjdPM)
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Handcuffs, Not Kid Gloves
The Washington Times editorial on illegal immigration by Tony Blankley this morning really set me off (h/t Drudge), especially this part:
...The senators should remember that they are American senators, not Roman proconsuls. Nor is the chairman of the Judiciary Committee some latter-day Praetor Maximus.
But if they would be dictators, it would be nice if they could at least be wise (until such time as the people can electorally forcefully project with a violent pedal thrust their regrettable backsides out of town). It was gut-wrenching (which in my case is a substantial event) to watch the senators prattle on in their idle ignorance concerning the manifold economic benefits that will accrue to the body politic if we can just cram a few million more uneducated illegals into the country. ( I guess ignorance loves company.) Beyond the Senate last week, in a remarkable example of intellectual integrity (in the face of the editorial positions of their newspapers) the chief economic columnists for the New York Times and The Washington Post — Paul Krugman and Robert Samuelson, respectively — laid out the sad facts regarding the economics of the matter. Senators, congressmen and Mr. President, please take note.
Regarding the Senate's and the president's guest-worker proposals, The Post's Robert Samuelson writes: "Gosh, they're all bad ideas ... We'd be importing poverty. This isn't because these immigrants aren't hardworking, many are. Nor is it because they don't assimilate, many do. But they generally don't go home, assimilation is slow and the ranks of the poor are constantly replenished ... [It] is a conscious policy of creating poverty in the United States while relieving it in Mexico ... The most lunatic notion is that admitting more poor Latino workers would ease the labor market strains of retiring baby boomers ? Far from softening the social problems of an aging society, more poor immigrants might aggravate them by pitting older retirees against younger Hispanics for limited government benefits ... [Moreover], [i]t's a myth that the U.S. economy 'needs' more poor immigrants.
[my bold, not in original - ed.]
It does not help that a small but growing number have no intention to assimilate, as shone in
these disturbing images captured yesterday noted on both
the left and the
right.
It also inspired my to
contact my Senators, Richard Burr (R) and Elizabeth Dole (R), to whom I sent the following email:
Dear Senator,
It is with a great deal of concern, and even anger that I write to you this morning, regarding the subject of illegal immigration before us this day.
According to an article this morning in the Washington Times:
Gallup Poll (March 27) finds 80 percent of the public wants the federal government to get tougher on illegal immigration. A Quinnipiac University Poll (March 3) finds 62 percent oppose making it easier for illegals to become citizens (72 percent in that poll don't even want illegals to be permitted to have driver's licenses). Time Magazine's recent poll (Jan. 24-26) found 75 percent favor "major penalties" on employers of illegals, 70 percent believe illegals increase the likelihood of terrorism and 57 percent would use military force at the Mexican-American border.
An NBC/Wall Street Journal poll (March 10-13) found 59 percent opposing a guest-worker proposal, and 71 percent would more likely vote for a congressional candidate who would tighten immigration controls.
An IQ Research poll (March 10) found 92 percent saying that securing the U.S. border should be a top priority of the White House and Congress.
And yet those of you in the Senate, including 73 percent of Republicans, support guest worker legislation, rewarding those that would break the law, repeating polices that have failed miserably in the past.
This must not stand. Immigration must be legal. Amnesty is not an option. Illegals must leave this country, and return legally. Employers who hire illegals must be heavily fined. Illegal immigrants must be charged as felons. We must have our southern border sealed with fences and walls to enforce legal immigration, and prevent illegal immigration.
I am but one voice of many, but mine is a loud voice, getting louder, with more than 60,000 influential readers coming to my conservative political blog (http://confederateyankee.mu.nu) last month alone.
I will use that digital pulpit to highlight the fact that you specifically voted against the will of North Carolina's Republican voters. I will questions your motives. I will question your reasoning. I will examine your other legislation. I will examine your connection to lobbyists. And I will do so relentlessly.
America is a land of immigrants. Immigration is good for America's soul. But this immigration must be legal, and every immigrant must come here legally, without exception.
Those of us who can legally vote, including legal immigrants, will have it no other way.
Sincerely,
As I stated in my email to the good senators, I'm completely behind the concept of immigration, but it must be
legal immigration.
Those who break our laws should be treated with handcuffs, not kid gloves.
Update: The hihg school students who ran up the Mexican flag at Montebello HS (cluelessly but appropriately running the American flag in the "in distress" upside down position) were not from Montebello HS, but nearby El Rancho High School and both "
a board member and the acting administrator of the El Rancho High School were present" according to Ward Brewer, who called Montebello and El Rancho high schools in running this story down.
It sounds to me like a couple of folks need to be fired from El Rancho.
Another reader who claims to be from the area states that many of the students and families of students from El Rancho are *gasp*
illegals, though I have no way of verifying this.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
10:50 AM
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1
Damn you and all your liberal blogger friends, you're ruining America.
Don't think you can weasel out of it, a few weeks ago you said that The President's plan of painting a spy plane in UN colors and hoping to get the American Pilot shot down by Saddam Hussein was a stupid plan and clearly a forgery.
Well, what do you have to say for yourself now, America-hater? The facts are clear: The President wanted to do it, therefore if you were against it, you hate America and The President and The Troops.
This is just another example of you liberal bloggers and Islamo-Fascist lovers subverting Our President's Wartime powers. I hope Ann Coulter kicks your skinny Democrap ass, Freedom-hater.
Posted by: Why Do You Hate America? at March 29, 2006 01:41 PM (XUcXU)
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Oh wait, you hate liberals too. I must have been confusing you with Al Franken.
Posted by: Why Do You Hate America? at March 29, 2006 01:45 PM (XUcXU)
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Employers who hire illegals must be heavily fined.
Why not put them in handcuffs? Why not charge them as felons?
Posted by: Sven at March 29, 2006 01:59 PM (fWTnt)
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You seem to think the US Government is set-up to help out us "common" Americans.
It's not. It's set up to do the bidding of the corporations.
It doesn't matter what you (or I) want, it only matters what the corporations want.
If they want cheap labor, cheap labor they will get.
Posted by: Robert at March 29, 2006 02:13 PM (ByaZN)
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What part of "illegal" do the honorable senators not understand? By this twisted logic, if I show up with my camping gear and settle down on their "private property", I'm not a trespasser, merely "un-documented". Watch out boys and girls in congress, election day is coming!
Posted by: Tom TB at March 29, 2006 02:29 PM (Ffvoi)
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If these illegal immigrants are taking jobs away from Americans (they're not), and this is a problem for those on the right(or the left), where is the outrage over outsourcing of customer service and manufacturing jobs? Those are jobs Americans actually WANT - as opposed to picking strawberries while being sprayed with insecticide. "American" corporations have moved tens of thousands of jobs South of the border. Everyone will make noises about "Illegal Immigration" and "Civil Rights", Congress will pass laws, but in the end nothing will change. This country is addicted to cheap labor. Always has been.
Posted by: Jake at March 29, 2006 02:36 PM (HDz9U)
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CY you got it right... My wife and I were in traffic court two weeks ago (wifes minor violation) they were at least four hispanic males for court. They were charged with FAILURE TO STOP FOR A SCHOOL BUS...YIKES!!! These guy's had no drivers license, no proof of insurance. no I.D. of any kind. No proof of residency. Furthermore they could not speak or understand english. The court provided a TAXPAYER FUNDED interpreter @ $80.00+ dollars an hour. They paid there fines and walked away. This is intolerable. These guy's were constuction workers. They pay no Taxes, they use county public TAXPAYER funded medical facilities. Their Kids go to Public schools (and don't speak english). At the time of their violation they were driving company trucks.... I totally agree with you we need to get them out of here and prosecute the companies that hire these guy's. The business owners know these guy's are illegal. They do not pay Social security, Medicare or workmans comp on them. I know alot of more than qualified construction workers that are unemployed. Do you think for a second that when these companies bid to build your house or build a road that they give you a discount because they only pay these guy's $5.00 an hour and no employer related taxes! I don't think so... We need to get off our collective rears and scream about this to our so called leaders. I went to MM's site and went through the roof. You are absolutely right, the school officials that took part in this need their asses fired. As I have stated in previous post's my wife is foreign born. My son was born overseas while I was stationed there (U.S. Citizen) it took over a year to apply and process for my lawfully wedded wife and American son to get Visa's and Passsorts. We had to provide all the necessary Medical Examinations, Affidavites of support, background investigations etc. So... If I had to do it they should have to. Amnesty is bullshit. Thats another invitation for more of them to come. Whether Latino's choose to believe it or not this is THE UNITED STATES of AMERICA not Mexico we are for the most part a collection of Law Abiding Immigrants. So if you are here legally you are all my brothers and sister. If you are not, you need to leave and come back after you have been documented and screened. This is a country based on the rule of law if you can't abide by it we don't need you!!!
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at March 29, 2006 02:39 PM (FzhYM)
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So what do you propose to do with the 11 million illegals already in America? Deport them all? Please give me a feasible way of doing so.
What's the plan for makign sure Mexico sticks to its end of a new bargin helping stop illegal immigration?
I am of the mind that these illegals wouldn't be coming here if there WAS NO PLACE FOR THEM TO WORK. Thats the problem. Our ability to crave cheap labor for cheap goods and then turn the other way when asked to take responsiblity for it.
And news flash, sometimes the masses are wrong. Sometimes whatever is popular is not just.
Posted by: Nick D at March 29, 2006 03:11 PM (Y4d9q)
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I agree with you Nick. Sometimes we are our own worst enemy. But, we have to do something these folks cannot be absorbed into our society by the wave of a magic wand. Just stop and think for a moment. These folks by and large are good hardworking people. But, they are not highly skilled. I donot mean thatin a derogatory manner. They earn $5.00 to $7.00 an hour. alot of these folks are senior's our social security system is going to collapse. Our medicare system is overburdened. At that wage scale most if not all will qualify for food stamps and public housing. I for one do not want to pay for all of that. Schools are at capacity now with students who can't speak english, teachers try to give them as much attention as they can but, what about the kids that their parents pay taxes. I don't blame anyone for wanting a better life but, there is a right way and a wrong way. There is no doubt their home countries Govt's are corrupt and there are no welfare systems. But, I as a vast majority of Americans cannot fix that problem. A program that rewards ciminals is not the answer.
I for one will vote against any of my elected officials that support an amnesty program.
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at March 29, 2006 03:55 PM (BuYeH)
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What immigration problem?
Posted by: BigDuke at March 29, 2006 04:06 PM (kuyD/)
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So what do you propose to do with the 11 million illegals already in America? Deport them all? Please give me a feasible way of doing so.
A former Border patrol supervisor has what sounds like a very workable plan I found over at Sister Toldjah’s site. It is too long to post in its entirety, but here are the main points:
The 1st order of business is to get Congress serious about stopping this flow. To actually do it will require several things to happen at once. There has to be a Guest Worker program. It should be run by the Homeland
Security and would have several steps.
The employer would place an order for the number of workers he would need for the year. He would guarantee to provide Housing, Medical and a legal wage. He would also withhold FICA and income taxes. 50% of the worker’s net wages would be held in an escrow account and paid to the worker upon his return to Mexico at the end of his contract.All contracts would be issued in Mexico. The Homeland Security team would have their offices in Mexico (U.S. Consulates could be used) and would screen all applicants for contract for health problems or a criminal record. No family members would be allowed to enter the United States as dependents of the worker. A spouse could have her own contract but could not bring any children.Illegals presently working in the United States could have their employer request that they be given a contract under the new program, but they would have to return to Mexico to make application for the contract. (Self-deportation.) All contracts would be for one year or less and would have to be renewed in Mexico.Enact laws requiring severe mandatory fines ($5000 per alien) for hiring an illegal alien outside of the Guest Worker Program and aggressively enforce them.
In short, you kill the market for illegal jobs by building a controlled legal market that is competitive, while simultaneously making the illegal market too risky to engage in. It will not result in mass government run deportations, but a gradual, economics-run repatriation of illegals.
What's the plan for makign [sic] sure Mexico sticks to its end of a new bargin [sic] helping stop illegal immigration?
First off, by making illegal immigration unprofitable as the plan above and similar ones would do, Mexico’s involvement wouldn’t matter. If we felt we needed to send a message, economic penalties would certainly suffice. Remember all those jobs that people are outsourcing? Tariffs imposed for non-cooperation can make those go away as well. They could of course retaliate with oil production, but they are more economically fragile than we are, and they know it.
I am of the mind that these illegals wouldn't be coming here if there WAS NO PLACE FOR THEM TO WORK. Thats the problem. Our ability to crave cheap labor for cheap goods and then turn the other way when asked to take responsiblity for it.
Again, taken care of by the plan above. There would be no place for them to work, because nobody would hire them, hence no attempt to try to illegally immigrate. What you and none on the left never mention is that by allowing illegals into the marketplace in the first place, they hurt low-skilled and trade-skilled Americans, most notably American blacks, recent legal immigrants, and young Americans. If you want more Americans off social services (which Democrats don't, they want the nanny state instead of independence), quite depressing the labor market. Americans will do the work, when they are paid a fare market rate for their efforts.
And news flash, sometimes the masses are wrong. Sometimes whatever is popular is not just.
You are correct, but this is not one of those times.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at March 29, 2006 04:19 PM (g5Nba)
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Robert,
What rock do you live under? Corporations want the illegals? Maybe the big agriculutural outfits....but most corporations who want cheap labor just build plants in Mexico - they don't import illegals.
When I lived in San Diego the illegals were hired every day for about $20 per day mostly by contractors and landscapers. I guess those small outfits might be incorporated.....
But the problems do exist. There were quite a few Mexican nationals - people with money mind you - caught bringing their kids over the border to drop them off at bus stops in Chula Vista. Better education here - and they paid not taxes. Free health care to - we have to take care of the indigents.
The biggest problem is how to handle and control it all. Until that is solved - and until the government gets serious about solving it - nothing will change.
Posted by: Specter at March 29, 2006 04:55 PM (ybfXM)
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For a wicked satire on the immigration problem and the proposed amenesty, see http://www.nicedoggie.net/2006/?p=456 for A Brilliant Proposal To Deal With Car Theft.
Posted by: Amber at March 29, 2006 05:10 PM (9uWiP)
Posted by: Amber at March 29, 2006 05:12 PM (9uWiP)
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"What rock do you live under? Corporations want the illegals? Maybe the big agriculutural outfits....but most corporations who want cheap labor just build plants in Mexico - they don't import illegals."
Any corporation that deals with construction, landscaping, food service, or janitorial services benefits from illegal immigration. Just about every corporation deals with these in some form or another.
Republican's will never do anything that hurts the bottom line. They will use harsh enforcement of existing laws as a wedge issue for the '06 election then pass the guest worker plan that no one wants. In other words it will be what gay marriage was in 2004. The plan was spelled out in a memo from Lamar Smith to Karl Rove that was accidentally sent to the wrong fax machine in Sept. 2005.
Posted by: John Gillnitz at March 29, 2006 06:04 PM (eHLUP)
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i hate to go all new-agey right out of the box, but there is one, and only one, way to stop illegal immigration, and that is by severely punishing both the people, as individuals, and the corporations that hire illegals.
that's it.
we cannot, and will not, disciple mexico's behavior as a nation. we, as a nation, have shown neither the will or the ability.
we cannot stop the individuals who cross the border. each arrest is arresting a drop of rain in rainstorm. jailing one opens a job for another.
what is left is discipling our own behavior -- that is the new-agey part -- and specifically, the behavior of those fellow citizens who hire these people. it was said earlier, but if there are no jobs, there are no illegals.
that is the only thing that will work, and we are not prepared to do that, because it would mean and least two things:
1. there would have to have a living wage.
2. the people who hire illegals must go to jail.
we can bloviate all we want about what the mexicans need to realize. what we, as a nation, need to realize is that it is our brothers and sisters -- fellow citizens of the good ol' USA -- who are hiring these folks. they are betraying us. they, not the mexicans. the mexicans have nothing to betray.
Posted by: @#$! at March 29, 2006 06:18 PM (S0c7k)
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Visiting Lefty here -- and I deeply apologize for all the fools on my side of the fence who want to be nice to the poor, oppressed illegals (sorry, "undocumented workers," or whatever the euphemism du jour is). But what's your excuse for the Republican pols, huh?
This is something that both sides should be able to agree on -- there are far too many Americans out of work, or under-employed, for us to justify giving ANY American jobs away to illegals. To Jake, who said they're NOT taking American jobs away -- please, I don't understand how you could possibly say that. If the illegals weren't here, the jobs WOULD be taken by Americans -- because the employers would be forced to pay free-market (which means: HIGHER) wages -- wages for which Americans would happily work. Isn't it funny how these staunch supporters of the free market suddenly blanche, have attacks of the vapors, and yell for Uncle Sugar to give them a nice amnesty program by which they can continue to pay SUB-market wages to people who shouldn't be part of the market at all.
And if THIS doesn't prove to you that the Republican politicians are NOT ON YOUR SIDE (except when it comes to RHETORIC), then I don't know what will.
Not that any of our Dem "leaders" are any bettter on this issue, of course. They're ALL selling us down the river for their corporate masters -- and we're ALL just standing here and taking it! Why is that?
Posted by: smartalek at March 29, 2006 10:34 PM (kUXZr)
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Walmart is one of the biggest employers of illegal aliens in the country although they try to hide the fact by using firms that hire illegals so that they don't get sued.
Posted by: madmatt at March 30, 2006 10:02 AM (J8hqn)
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It's like the drug problem. As long as Americans have a craving for cocaine, some enterprising indiviuals will find a way to provide it. As long as US employers crave low wage workers, enterprising Mexicans will be here to fill the jobs. Don't kid yourself, illegal Mexicans are now doing jobs that many Americans would love to have. I was at a construction site in Washington State last year and observed that there were very few Engish speakers to be seen. Mexicans were framing, hanging drywall etc. I have nothing against Mexicans, but I curse the construction company that sold American jobs down the river.
Posted by: Randy at March 30, 2006 12:32 PM (XtZLb)
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smartalek - you're honestly making the point that americans would pick strawberries and lettuce with no bathrooms and no protection against the cropdusting? the agricultural industry wouldn't survive the retooling needed to bring wages and conditions up to american standards, even as low as they've become lately.
there are jobs americans just won't do anymore. funny you should mention the free market - it's free market forces that bring the flow of cheap labor north from mexico and central america. all the supporters of nafta seem to think that it's good and proper for goods and capital to flow across the borders freely, but somehow not labor. whether republican or democrat or whatever, i see a lot of people like smartalek laboring under the misconception that (as you just posited)if all the illegals were somehow regulated, deported, whatever, that "free market forces" would bring the wages up to a point where americans would want them. nice fantasy. surprised to see a "lefty" trotting out that tired canard. "free market" in today's america means "unchecked capitalist greed" - see the wal mart post above. that's your free market for ya. outsourcing, selling our ports to dubai, enron, worldcom...
assuming our agricultural industries could adjust to a completely new wage structure and pool of (imaginary)american workers is just that -an assumption with no basis in fact. they've got you distracted with this immigrant boondoggle - the real american middle class manufacturing and service sector jobs are going overseas. if you think migrant farm labor and carwash jobs are going to drive american prosperity, you are deluded enough to be a bush supporter. i know you're happy to have a little wedge issue to taunt the righties with, but both sides have been wrong on this issue for a long, long time.
have you ever heard of the phillipines? or puerto rico? or guam? there are plenty of other sources of non-native cheap labor. so build your fence. throw out every single illegal from mexico, etc. both guam and pr are american territories so there is no documentation issue. the corporate masters of both parties will do all they can to keep wages low, corporate taxes likewise.
Posted by: jake at March 30, 2006 12:38 PM (HDz9U)
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I have several thoughts on this subject that are bothering me. First, most of the businesses large and small that employee illegals pay less than the minimum wage. But congress seems to think this is ok, so those businesses that follow the federal dictates lose contracts or must close because of the minimum wage issue. This seems ok with our congressional representatives. Second, the main power in the Democratic party (aside from special interest) is the labor unions. Yet the Democratic party is very much for the cheaper labor thus undermining their base. Third, the media and some states are forcing Wal-Mart to provide health insurance. Yet our politicians and the media support the businesses that employ the illegals who clearly do not provide any fringe benefit. Finally, if the illegals are allowed to stay then they will be registered and are no longer cheap labor. They will then be replaced by another batch of illegals who work cheaper. The first group will then be on welfare. Is something wrong with the logic here? As to writing your congressman, do they really listen? Mine don't.
Posted by: David Caskey, MD at March 30, 2006 12:39 PM (6wTpy)
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The plan seems solid to me on many levels. It definitly makes it not worth it to business to hire illegals. However Self deportation? For some reason unless we get real serious real quick, thats never going to happen.
And doesn't it seem awfully beaurcratic to you? It seems like it give Homeland Security another tool to be inept. I would have to place in Labor or Commerce .
And secondly I resent the fact that you believe all Democrats want a welfare state, and all liberals wont talk about the minorities here that are jobless b/c of illegals.
First off most hard working middle class Dems arent for welfare/socialist states. We want to make sure everyone can be protected from the beast of capitialism if they one day need it. Some would suggest Republicans will never relate to that, but I won't slander you all.
Second, if there was such a demand for these jobs by our underclass citizens, then why are they there? Why aren't they taken up with the giddyness people believe they have for them. Its because no American wants them. Even in our poorest people can have too much pride.
Posted by: Nick D at March 30, 2006 03:00 PM (Y4d9q)
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Shoveling shit against the tide for 40 hours a week is a terrible job no Americans would want.
BUT, shoveling shit against the tide for 40 hours a week at $35/ hour is something i think many Americans could handle.
The jobs don't suck, the pay does.
The person up-post who says those that believe in the invisible hand of the free market suddenly blanche is 100% correct.
If strawberries cost $20 a pint because we have to pay $15/hour to Americans who pick them, then demand for strawberries may go down. Isn't that a free market effect?
Posted by: Robert at March 30, 2006 06:56 PM (ByaZN)
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I don't really have much else to add to this immigration debate that hasn't already been said by someone else above, but I will say this: I'm about sick of the characterization of illegal immigrants having committed "crimes" and of being themselves "criminals." I really want to know if people who honestly think that(and aren't simply flogging a talking point to death) really believe if illegal immigrants are on par with thieves, murderers, rapists, drug dealers, child abusers, embezzlers and the other assorted types of criminals we lock up in our prisons. Yeah it's true that if you make an act a crime, and someone commits that act, then they are a criminal. But it's not the same thing, and I don't honestly know how anyone can think so; there's just not any criminal culpability there, like real criminals possess. Whatever you think of them, most illegals are just trying to get over here to work so they can send some money home to their families, and I don't really know how that can be characterized as a "crime" in the common sense meaning of the word. So all this talk about treating them with handcuffs, just like we drug dealers and murderers, is ridiculous.
Posted by: Alexander Wolfe at April 01, 2006 01:03 PM (018Z+)
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Isn't reconquista the same as Zionism?
Posted by: Isrealcool at April 01, 2006 11:30 PM (piepP)
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There are many jobs that American workers will not do because of low wages, no benefits, and bad working conditions. But if the pay and benefits are good, they will do them, which is clearly demonstated by the fact that there are many Americans willing to work as coal miners, a dirty and dangerous job, because the pay is good.
As far as the agricultural industry is concerned it is totally unacceptable for anybody (even illegal aliens) to be expected to work without protection from cropdusting. This simply should not be permitted, no matter who is doing it. Without the illegal aliens things like porta potties would have to be supplied the agricultural workers, just as they are for construction workers. With higher labor costs, a lot of the back-breaking work would be done by machines with workers driving them while sitting in air conditioned cabs.
Posted by: CaptainVideo at April 02, 2006 07:58 PM (Qs6g6)
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I would say that illegal aliens are on par with American tourists who bring items subject to import duties bought abroad into the country without declaring them so that they can avoid paying import duties on them. But they are not on par with bank robbers, or something similar.
Posted by: CaptainVideo at April 02, 2006 08:04 PM (Qs6g6)
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"Illegal immigrants" are not "immigrants," they are criminals. If any of us were to drive without a license we expect to be punished. An illegal alien who was pulled over and handcuffed is now claiming that the handcuffs hurt her and violated her civil rights.
Those who state that all of "the people" have rights need to reread the Constitution, not just the Bill of Rights, but the Constitution, particularly the 14th Amendment (1866) where citizenship was defined. The "people" were given definition. Certainly, we accord visitors in our country certain rights, but to reward criminals with the rights that we, our ancestors, and fellow citizens fought and died for is a travesty. We are shouldering the responsibilities of maintaining and securing this land for ourselves and our children. In order to do these, we must include immigrants seeking legal employment, persons requesting shelter from a hostile, abusive government, and those who wish to join us as citizens of our great land.
Those who come as criminals, earn money as illegal workers, send their money to a foreign country to support that countries citizens and benefit from the services provided by our citizens are not shouldering responsibility. I was aghast when I found that they could apply for a tax ID number so that they could pay taxes! They are saying that this entitles them to our rights. They believe that tax money is all that we require of them? The few dollars that a handful of these criminals pay from the minimum wage jobs that they claim our citizens do not want is a not even a drop in the bucket.
We give much more than tax money. We have served and many have died in our military. We vote. We serve on juries. We volunteer in our communities. We run for elected office and support our candidates and elected officials. We are Americans. We do not take our citizenship lightly and we surely can't give it away to satisfy an ever-increasing mass of criminals who call themselves "illegal aliens..."
It is time that we stood up and were counted!
Posted by: Margie at April 27, 2006 12:23 AM (itqg3)
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People who march into our country illegally in mass, try to change our national policy while remaining a citizen of another country, and place our flag in the conquered position are not people who wish to assimilate into our country and culture. Those who put another country's flag above ours, and put ours in the conquered position should either be considered invaders, or citizens whose actions are paramount to treason. We should treat them as such.
Posted by: Michael S. Hartman at May 01, 2006 12:23 AM (eEpFH)
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For Sale...

School Buses
Slightly damp, a total of 259. Previously used as a symbol of incompetence. Works great as anchors and fish attractors. Ask for Ray.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Ray's too busy compaigning to answer the phone. Just ask the reporters who tried to find out if New Orleans had changed any of it's zoning to allow for FEMA trailers.
Posted by: seawitch at March 29, 2006 10:15 AM (b4c6N)
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Changing the zoning regulations would be another admission of failure in the local government. Let them sleep in the street instead of making the mayor look bad. Sad state of affairs but wanna bet he's reelected?
Posted by: scrapiron at March 30, 2006 12:22 AM (y6n8O)
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March 28, 2006
This Cult Smells Fishy...
According to Michelle Malkin, British Muslims are carping about a pair of fish they claim are inscribed with the names of Allah and Mohammed, calling it a miracle. Frightening as it all may seem, this "miracle" just goes to reinforce the truth of the being they once called the Arafish.
Certain dhimmi liberals of course, are falling for this hook, line and sinker, and are all too willing to pander to fish-fascinated fanatics here in the United States.
Some are willing to praise the Allah fish:

Some are so intent on capturing votes that they are willing to go the extra mile to look like the Allah fish:

Not surprisingly, they're all famous bottom feeders, doncha know.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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I don't recall the WingNet getting as worked up whenever a bunch of Christians spots the Virgin Mary on a tree trunk. See my point?
Posted by: john at March 28, 2006 02:50 PM (0Dfz8)
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Sure, they do- see here- read the comments- Stupidity is stupidity the world over.
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=19815_Religious_Rooster_Avoids_Death#comments
Posted by: Claire at March 28, 2006 04:46 PM (ez8Yg)
3
Woooow! Attack of the Living Carp!
Posted by: Eg at March 28, 2006 07:43 PM (PG+qd)
Posted by: Specter at March 29, 2006 10:38 AM (ybfXM)
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Those Tools At The Times
For those of you who have read this NY Times article about captured Iraqi war documents being placed on the web, you'll note that the Times did not deem to give Ray Robinson, the blogger interviewed in the article, a link to his blog, nor did they bother to give you his entire background. Ray Robinson worked for the Defense Intelligence Agency as a member of the Iraq Survey Group that collected and in-processed this documentation when it was captured. He isn't just a blogger, but a person with some hands-on expertise.
Too bad that the
Times couldn't be bothered to provide a link or give his bona fides.
I guess that would go against their "bloggers are hacks, and we're so accurate" meme, wouldn't it?
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
12:09 PM
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Thanks Bob, that was a crock, but the NRO has an article setting the record straight and I think the guardian may be supporting my conclusion about the al-quds document
Posted by: Ray Robison at March 28, 2006 02:48 PM (CdK5b)
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Flailing Fukuyama
One can only hope that the truth brigade of the liberal blogosphere that so effectively curtailed the career of Ben Domenech will maintain their high standards of integrity in the pursuit of accuracy, and be among the first to call for the head of famous ex-neocon Francis Fukuyama.
Fukuyama's life-altering revelation that caused him to turn away from neoconservatism was supposedly triggered by a speech calling the Iraq war "a virtually unqualified success." It turns out Fukuyama's story was instead the unqualified fabrication, according to the man who gave the speech, Charles Krauthammer,
who calls Fukuyama out:
I happen to know something about this story, as I was the speaker whose 2004 Irving Kristol lecture to the American Enterprise Institute Fukuyama has now brought to prominence. I can therefore testify that Fukuyama's claim that I attributed "virtually unqualified success" to the war is a fabrication.
A convenient fabrication -- it gives him a foil and the story drama -- but a foolish one because it can be checked. The speech was given at the Washington Hilton before a full house, carried live on C-SPAN and then published by the American Enterprise Institute under its title "Democratic Realism: An American Foreign Policy for a Unipolar World." (It can be read at http://www.aei.org/publications/pubID.19912,filter.all/pub_detail.asp.) As indicated by the title, the speech was not about Iraq. It was a fairly theoretical critique of the four schools of American foreign policy: isolationism, liberal internationalism, realism and neoconservatism. The only successes I attributed to the Iraq war were two, and both self-evident: (1) that it had deposed Saddam Hussein and (2) that this had made other dictators think twice about the price of acquiring nuclear weapons, as evidenced by the fact that Moammar Gaddafi had turned over his secret nuclear program for dismantling just months after Hussein's fall (in fact, on the very week of Hussein's capture).
It's all right there in black and white pixels, with an easily followed link to a copy of the speech above. Fukuyama misrepresented the content of Krauthammer's speech as being something else, which certainly as vile as misrepresenting the content of the speech as his own.
I'm sure the intrepid truth squad of the far left - at
Firedoglake,
Media Matters, the
Daily Kos, and others - will press Fukuyama for a full accounting for his transgressions with the same righteous fury they unleashed last week in their relentless pursuit of truth.
Seriously.
Any minute now.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
09:40 AM
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1
I'll bet the speech FF claims to remember was "seared, just seared" into his memory.
Posted by: Locomotive Breath at March 28, 2006 10:29 AM (W7Snj)
2
You must be having an ecstatic time with the family to drift off into fantasy land like that.
Posted by: Old Soldier at March 28, 2006 01:30 PM (X2tAw)
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Screw 'im. His "End of History" book was not only boring, it turned out to be dead wrong too.
Posted by: Thrill at March 28, 2006 03:17 PM (8MU2I)
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March 27, 2006
What They Saved
News is now breaking in the trial of the so-called "20th hijacker" Zacarias Moussaoui that Moussaoui and shoe bomber Richard Reid were supposed to hijack a fifth plane on 9/11 and fly it into the White House.
Via
Breitbart:
Al-Qaida conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui testified Monday that he and would-be shoe bomber Richard Reid were supposed to hijack a fifth airplane on Sept. 11, 2001, and fly it into the White House.
Moussaoui's testimony on his own behalf stunned the courtroom as he disclosed details he had never revealed before. It was in stark contrast to Moussaoui's previous statements in which he said the White House attack was to come later if the United States refused to release a radical Egyptian sheik imprisoned on earlier terrorist convictions.
Quite frankly, it is hard to trust anything Zacarias Moussaoui has to say, but if he is telling the truth that his target was the White House, it might provide an answer to the question of Flight 93's target that September morning.
It has long been suspected that the hijackers on Flight 93 were likely targeting either the Capitol Building or the White House. As Moussaoui was arrested just one month before the attacks, it seems likely that the other the terror cells would stick with their original targets instead of trying to retarget shortly before the attack. If Moussaoui's statement it true that his target was the White House, then it would seem likely that the terrorists on Flight 93 had the Capitol Building as their target.
We know that the
heroes of Flight 93 prevented an attack on a Washington target when they stormed the cockpit over Pennsylvania that September morning. If Moussaoui is correct, we now have a reason to suspect exactly what it was they saved.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
01:48 PM
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I think he's lying. Originally, he stated that the White House was only going to be targeted at some point in the future, not on 9/11. The guy is a nutcase.
Posted by: Thrill at March 27, 2006 09:47 PM (8MU2I)
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So, if he's nuts, why should we feed and cloth the bastard for the rest of his life. Scew him give him the needle... We have spent millions of dollars on a legal battle for an islamic extremist. Why should American tax payers continue to have to support this idiot.
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at March 28, 2006 07:16 AM (JYeBJ)
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Bush Lied, Yadda Yadda Yadda
The NY Times has a huge non-story today, where it was found that President Bush and Prime Minister Blair did not wait until the week before the invasion of Iraq to do their war planning.
When presented in that context, of course, it really is a non-story, other than the fact that the document provides some interesting historical context of the kind of commentary that goes on between leaders in a run-up to a conflict.
Ed Morrissey says pretty much what I would say about the matter,
summing it up:
In short, the Times presents us with a memo that shows the US and UK understanding that Saddam would not cooperate with the UN nor voluntarily disarm or step aside; history proved them correct on all those assertions. Given those as reality, the two nations prepared for war. If the Times finds this surprising, it demonstrates their cluelessness all the more.
I suspect it isn't cluelessness as much as it is political opportunism by the
Times, which has consistently covered this conflict in a way that makes al Jazeera unnecessary.
Bush Lied, People Died. I think I've heard that before.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
08:49 AM
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Reminds me of the Downing Street Memo, which was an equal nonstory for anyone who stops and thinks about the desirability of the President being prepared for reasonably likely contingencies. If he wasn't, the NYT would run a story about that instead: more evidence of hasty planning and poor forethought leading to disaster, etc. You can't win once there's a preconceived storyline about you that all new information will be jammed into fitting one way or another, or else simply ignored.
Posted by: Amber at March 27, 2006 01:13 PM (9uWiP)
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You're kidding me right? No big deal? The fact that President Bush and PM Blair both stated that regardless of International Cooperation, war was and is the only answer to Iraq. Even if there was no WMDs. Even if Saddam wouldn't be provoked into an attack.
And there was poor planning. Former Administration members have stated such things in the past year. Heck here's Bush's own words that he doesnt think inter-religious warfare would be a problem.."was unlikely there would be internecine warfare between the different religious and ethnic groups". (BBC article)
What gets me is that most diehard republicans refuse to believe that there is more wrong here than what is leaked out every day. First its no WMDs. Then there's no AlQueda connection. then there's no yellowcake from Sudan. Then there's hitting Plame. Then there's high oil prices, still. Iraq's in a very close civil war. No one admits not planning, blame it on the DoD. No one admits at fault for speeches leading up to war. President Bush saying he never said "Alqueda = Iraq". Now US and UK seen directly planning for war regardless of what the UN finds. Hell lets paint a US plane UN colors!
Come on.
Posted by: Nick D at March 28, 2006 11:41 AM (Y4d9q)
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Strange that you haven't already explained that you were completely wrong last month about the memo. I hope it doesn't slip your mind.
Posted by: grh at March 28, 2006 11:49 AM (flYa4)
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Nick D,
As I alluded to in my post, folks such as yourself drifting in on your tin-foil parachutes from the Huffington Post and Peter Daou's site can't seem to grasp that combat operations don't happen over night. These notes came from January 2003, just a few months before the invasion.
You must have forgotten that WMDs and terrorism were not our only reason to invade Iraq. Is that information to hard for you to find? Look at the White House web site, and read why there. Funny how you always tend to forget things like that, just as you always forget that all Saddam had to do to prevent a war was to step down.
No WMDs? Tell that to Georges Sada. Tell that to other sources that also insist the weapons were shipped out by plane and truck to Syria in the weeks before the war.
No terrorist connection?
The 1993 WTC bomb builder Abdul Rahman Yasin flew back to Baghdad where he lived as Saddam's guest until the 2003 War. Saddam's other Baghdad guests were Abu Nidal and Abu Abbas, two of the world's most infamous terrorists before Osama bin Laden came around. As for al Qaeda, Zarqawi came into Iraq in late 9/11 and has stayed there ever since, while Saddam financed al Qaeda franchise Abu Sayyaf and is famous for giving money to Palestinian suicide bombers.
No Yellowcake from Sudan?
We never claimed there was. But the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence Report and the U.K.'s Butler Report both concluded he was making contacts in Niger and other parts of Africa to secure yellowcake, but it didn't say he was successful in obtaining it yet.
After that I just kind of lost interest in what you had to say, as facts aren't something you seem interested in as much as rhetoric.
grh,
When I see something more credible that an exact rehash of what I've already forcefully debunked once before, I'll worry about printing an update. If you read closely, the Times is very careful to say the idea of the U-2 was attributed to Bush. That is a far cry from them claiming the comments actually came from Bush, isn't it?
As my previous post on the subject states (and former and active duty military pilots corroborated in the comments), if we wanted to use planes flying a U.N. mission as the excuse, we had our choice to choose form, with attacks of this type occurring consistently since the 1991 Gulf War.
Sometimes, the lack of reading comprehension and critical reasoning skills displayed by folks such as yourself is frightening.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at March 28, 2006 01:03 PM (g5Nba)
5
So GWB planned this war in advance. and this is where we are 3 years in.
Genius, I mean Jenius.
Of course this isn't news to you.
So are you saying bush is not evil, he's just an idiot and incompetent?
Agreed.
Posted by: Robert at March 29, 2006 10:45 PM (ND8TX)
6
Re: movement of WMDs to syria.
So Iraq moved them WMDs to syria weeks before the war that you say we had been planning for months (BTW, I say years) and we didn't see it happening?
Do me a favor. Write about NOTHING on your blog other than calling for the President to step down and take the morons he plans wars with.
There should be nothing more important to you (or any American) than getting this idiot frat boy who's in a job WAY over his head out of his position and replaced with an adult.
Not immigration, not iran, not katrina, not the supreme court, not abortion, not euthanasia, not global warming, nothing.
Posted by: Robert at March 29, 2006 10:52 PM (ND8TX)
7
That is a far cry from them claiming the comments actually came from Bush, isn't it?
Not if we're using the English language, no.
But since you're so interested in this, maybe we can agree on something: that the U.S. and England should release the records of this meeting, including the British memo. What do you say?
As my previous post on the subject states (and former and active duty military pilots corroborated in the comments), if we wanted to use planes flying a U.N. mission as the excuse, we had our choice to choose form, with attacks of this type occurring consistently since the 1991 Gulf War.
Nope. The U.S. and U.K. flights were not flying U.N. missions, nor were they flying under U.N. colors.
I realize there's some tiny percentage of people who believe they were, but then there's a tiny percentage of people who believe the holocaust didn't happen. In both cases I think it's better to go with the judgement of the majority.
Posted by: grh at April 01, 2006 05:18 AM (HePgk)
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