THE MORNING RANT: 2025 Has Been an Awful Year for EVs, and It Keeps Getting Worse

2025 has been a disaster for the electric vehicle industry in the United States. But as bad as it’s been, it just got a lot worse. As I documented a few days ago, The One Big Beautiful Bill that has now become law eliminates the $7,500 federal tax credit for buying a new EV, and it also kills the $4,000 credit for buying a used EV. These tax credits permanently go away in less than two months.

Irrespective of the Big Beautiful Bill, sales of EV’s were already falling way short of expectations in the first quarter of 2025, and then the bottom fell out in the second quarter of 2025.

“Electric Vehicle Sales Fall in 2nd Quarter” [WSJ – 7/02/2025]

US car buyers continue to sour on electric vehicles. Ford Motor, Hyundai, and Kia all reported steep declines in EV sales for the second quarter, with Ford saying its fell more than 30% and Kia saying sales of two models dropped by half.

Ford’s flagship electric vehicle, the F150 ~~Conflagration~~ Lightning pickup truck, is in a sales free fall. Ford sold just 5,842 of these abominations in Q2 of 2025, which represented a 26% decline from the already-pathetic sales volume in the prior-year Q2. 2025 Lightning sales are annualizing to just 23,000 per year, while actually trending even lower.

Now is a good time to remember that Ford built an all-new plant near Memphis to produce 500,000 electric pickup trucks per year. That plant is now mothballed and heading toward obsolescence/repurposing without having ever manufactured one vehicle. Overall, Ford’s Q2 sales were up 14% year-over-year. Maybe that Memphis plant can be refitted to build cars and trucks that people actually want to buy.

For Volkswagen, the EV sales collapse is even worse. VW sold a paltry 1,992 electric ID.4s in Q2 2025, a 65% collapse year-over-year. These sales figures are approaching what might be constituted “nominal” sales volume. VW makes some great gasoline-powered cars, but it has been so distracted with the EV push, that its entire product lineup is collapsing, with total US sales down 29% year over year. Meanwhile, most other major manufacturers are seeing increased ICE vehicle sales in the U.S. If VW doesn’t get back to focusing on cars that Americans will buy, their U.S. operations are at risk. I am a fan of VW’s non-electric cars and I would hate to see them exit the US market, but VW will have to give up the EV dream if it is going to regain lost ground.

The same story plays out with other manufacturers who made major commitments to EVs. While BMW’s overall year-to-date vehicle sales in the U.S. are up, its EV sales are collapsing, with Q2 EV sales of just 11,094 units, a 21% year-over-year decrease.

Even Tesla sales are down significantly. Elon Musk’s EV company does not break its sales out by country or region, but its global sales have been down significantly in 2025, with Q2 sales down 14%. Mr. Musk famously angered the left by aligning with President Trump to clean out government waste, which clearly caused a backlash from some of Tesla’s left-wing customer base. But those lost Tesla sales didn’t go elsewhere. They just went away, or back to ICE vehicles.

And then there is Rivian. Not only is it not gaining sales from disaffected Tesla shoppers, but its sales are going the wrong way…rapidly. Having sold right at 50,000 units each of the past two full years, the company set a guidance for about the same number of sales in 2025. Halfway through the year, Rivian has sold less than 20,000 vehicles, which annualizes to under 40,000 per year. It really doesn’t matter. Be it 40,000 or 50,000 units per year, these are the sales figures of a zombie company. Rivian’s original business plan when it seduced more than $1 billion for a proposed Georgia plant from governor Brian Kemp was to be selling hundreds of thousands of vehicles per year by now. Rivian’s Illinois plant alone can produce more than 200,000 vehicles per year. The proposed Rivian plant in Georgia was not built, but Gov. Kemp did build a beautiful “Parkway to Nowhere” in rural Georgia for it. Rivian’s sales have been tumbling with the EV tax credit in place. It will be a financial bloodbath for the company when sales plummet further - with a bigger loss per unit - when the tax credit goes away.

In fact, all of these horrible EV sales results I’ve discussed are with the $7,500 EV tax credit still in place. There may be an uptick in EV sales in Q3 due to manufacturers desperately discounting their glut of unsold electric vehicles before the tax credit goes away. In fact, they’d better make those vehicles go away in Q3, because any unsold EVs on dealer lots on October 1 will become un-moveable boat anchors.

*****

One more quick item…

Do you remember that story a few weeks ago about a fire on a ship transporting EVs across the Pacific Ocean? The crew had to abandon ship due to the intensity of the fire. That car carrier, the Morning Midas, has now sunk.

“Cargo Ship That Caught Fire Carrying Electric Vehicles Sinks in the Pacific” [NY Times – 6/25/2025]

Three weeks after a fire broke out on the ship off the coast of Alaska, the Morning Midas sank, along with thousands of cars on board.

This is becoming a disturbing trend. Ships carrying vehicles have had occasional fires over the years, but these EV fires that are causing cargo ships to be abandoned and sometimes sink is an all-new maritime hazard. In fact, insurers were already concerned about insuring cargo ships that transport EVs. In 2022, the Felicity Ace was consumed by fire thanks to its load of EVs, and it sank. A year later, a similar fire destroyed the Fremantle Highway, which was transporting EVs.

Insurers and cargo carriers were already getting wary of transporting EVs, as evidenced by a lawsuit against VW for its role in the Felicity Ace’s sinking, which was believed to have been precipitated by an electric Porsche spontaneously erupting in flames.

“Volkswagen Sued by Mitsui OSK Lines for the Loss of Felicity Ace Car Carrier”

The ongoing debate over the safety of transporting electric vehicles is gaining new attention with reports that the owners and insurance company for the car carrier Felicity Ace are suing Volkswagen Group blaming the auto company for the 2022 fire that destroyed the vessel.

Traditional fire suppression systems aboard cargo ships are little help against the virtually unextinguishable runaway thermal fires from a load of burning EVs.

The “EV transition” is now de-transitioning. The next big conversation needs to be on where these explosive ordnance vehicles are allowed and not allowed. Following the Morning Midas’ sinking, it may become tougher for cargo lines to obtain insurance for ships carrying EVs. Insurers would also be well within their rights to deny coverage to buildings with parking garages put at structural risk by EV fires.

[buck.throckmorton at protonmail dot com]

Posted by: Buck Throckmorton at 11:00 AM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Is this where I can get the talley man to talley me bananas?

Posted by: tankdemon at July 11, 2025 11:00 AM (/BLT9)

2 Of course !

Posted by: Lizzy at July 11, 2025 11:00 AM (GbwPZ)

3 Bzzzzz

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at July 11, 2025 11:01 AM (60s6u)

4 Elon has a sad

Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 11:01 AM (dCxaZ)

5 seeing increased ICE vehicle sales

To sweep up wetbacks.

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at July 11, 2025 11:03 AM (60s6u)

6 4 Elon has a sad
Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 11:01 AM (dCxaZ)

Hard to care, these days

Posted by: night lifted at July 11, 2025 11:03 AM (/YboP)

7 >>The ongoing debate over the safety of transporting electric vehicles is gaining new attention with reports that the owners and insurance company for the car carrier Felicity Ace are suing Volkswagen Group blaming the auto company for the 2022 fire that destroyed the vessel.

Safety of storing them, too - your home garage, parking garages, battery warehouses. Pretty much everywhere.

Also note that antifa has been using electric cars and scooters in protests, such as the Waymo cars in LA and the EV scooters to attack an ICE building in Seattle (IIRC) by piling them up by an entrance and then setting them on fire. Weaponized EVs.

Posted by: Lizzy at July 11, 2025 11:03 AM (GbwPZ)

8 I never went over 2 cups per gallon.

Posted by: Boss Moss at July 11, 2025 11:03 AM (bvNHo)

9 >>Elon has a sad

Man, does that guy have public mood swings!

Posted by: Lizzy at July 11, 2025 11:04 AM (GbwPZ)

10 Russell Brand@RustyRockets

I think people like RFK Jr., Tommy Robinson, and even Andrew Tate would die for what they believe. You may not agree with them, but their conviction is real.

In a culture hell-bent on weakening men, true strength comes from submission to something higher, and that is God.

Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 11, 2025 11:04 AM (TGPs7)

11 has now sunk.

But still burning.

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at July 11, 2025 11:04 AM (60s6u)

12 5 seeing increased ICE vehicle sales

To sweep up wetbacks.
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at July 11, 2025 11:03 AM (60s6u

Good! And since "only traitors help invaders" sweep up the democrats organizing the anti-ICE violence

Posted by: night lifted at July 11, 2025 11:04 AM (/YboP)

13 Ford is requesting components be made in the US. J’s company is looking at bringing manufacturing back here. They are avoiding California and Massachusetts, despite having an HQ there, and looking at rural VA outside of NC, not Charlotte. Potentially other southern states.

Posted by: Piper at July 11, 2025 11:05 AM (pZEOD)

14 EVs?

I pass 2 8 stall (1 for Tesla, 1 for ??)charging stations cutting thru the Target lot on my way to the gas station. When I come back from filling up my car, the same cars are sitting there, no matter the weather, for who knows how long.

I laugh every time

Posted by: Bruce at July 11, 2025 11:05 AM (BHLaI)

15 We actually had an EV fire screwing up traffic on 93N this morning.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at July 11, 2025 11:05 AM (kgE5c)

16 Time for a second look at steam power?

Posted by: Polka will never die at July 11, 2025 11:06 AM (6LBk0)

17 Also note that antifa has been using electric cars and scooters in protests, such as the Waymo cars in LA and the EV scooters to attack an ICE building in Seattle (IIRC) by piling them up by an entrance and then setting them on fire. Weaponized EVs.
Posted by: Lizzy
=======
I knew about the Waymo but not the EV scooter tactic. I think the slow moving cold Civil War part Deux is getting a bit hotter in deep blue states. Dems are fighting to keep their illegals as hard as they fought to keep their slaves in the original ACW.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:06 AM (ctrM5)

18 I hear that the real problem on the Felicity Ace was its poor shelving.

Posted by: Bulg at July 11, 2025 11:07 AM (77rzZ)

19 Not to worry, EV folks. Once the country whipsaws back to radical leftism in a few years, I'm sure we'll be forced to buy them.

Posted by: Tinfoil Dispenser at July 11, 2025 11:07 AM (ERYKL)

20 Yea but ... Bentley announced a new concept car this week, and it's a megabucks EV. The EXP15. So there's that.

https://tinyurl.com/2bk83d6

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (iFTx/)

21 The EV future is gone like Disney’s Tomorrowland. He has his car that will run on Mars, if he ever gets there. He’d best concentrate on his other businesses if he’s looking for profit to fund his vision.

Posted by: NemoMeImpuneLacessit at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (WK0PT)

22 10 Russell Brand@RustyRockets

I think people like RFK Jr., Tommy Robinson, and even Andrew Tate would die for what they believe. You may not agree with them, but their conviction is real.

In a culture hell-bent on weakening men, true strength comes from submission to something higher, and that is God.
Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 11, 2025 11:04 AM (TGPs7)

=======

Andrew Tate?

Bruh...

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (GBKbO)

23 What about hemp powered cars made out of hemp?

Posted by: Boss Moss at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (bvNHo)

24 10 Russell Brand@RustyRockets

I think people like RFK Jr., Tommy Robinson, and even Andrew Tate would die for what they believe. You may not agree with them, but their conviction is real.

In a culture hell-bent on weakening men, true strength comes from submission to something higher, and that is God.
Posted by: Mister Ghost
======
Submission to something greater than oneself. I think some are submitting to the opposite of the Lord though.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (ctrM5)

25 He = Musk!

Posted by: NemoMeImpuneLacessit at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (WK0PT)

26 Time for a second look at steam power?
Posted by: Polka will never die

The first automobile was actually steam-powered. Invented by a Frenchman in 1770 (or thereabouts).

Posted by: Bulg at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (77rzZ)

27 I have an old Ford Focus, Titanium, model. Other than the double clutch its been a good car. Its got 114k miles and runs like a top. I tell myself its a James Bond car which makes me happy. When I fill her up with CostCo premium Imma rocking.

Posted by: pudinhead at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (W3T6M)

28 Hey, guess who the cloud seeding guy in Texas was hanging out with?

Would you believe, Bill Clinton?

I guess you would...

Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 11, 2025 11:09 AM (TGPs7)

29 Correction: It was electric bikes, not scooters:

https://tinyurl.com/3cs6tznu

Posted by: Lizzy at July 11, 2025 11:09 AM (GbwPZ)

30 Awful year for EV's, wonderful year for the restoration of my faith in humanity.

I don't know if I want to see California rescind its EV mandate or not. Yes, it would be a wonderful lesson in the real world intruding on fantasy when they realize how inadequate their current power generation capabilities and grid infrastructure is to charge all those additional EV's, and that is bit the tip of the iceberg. Maybe this time the California electorate will finally realize that voting for something means you might actually receive it, and adjust their future behavior accordingly.

Posted by: tankdemon at July 11, 2025 11:10 AM (/BLT9)

31 Don't worry, folks, the Segway is gonna change everything!

Posted by: Bulg at July 11, 2025 11:10 AM (77rzZ)

32 Felicity Ace

Keri Russell and an Ewok walk into a bar ...

Posted by: far cry at July 11, 2025 11:10 AM (a302Y)

33 kids on electric bikes and scooters have exploded here today, and they are move like Dirt Bikes but since they have pedals they are allowed on the paths here, but they go so so fast, I have been nearly hit by these kids. I had a moped and i had to get a license but you can't ride a moped on the paths because it has a motor, Golf Carts are ok???

Posted by: Patrick From Ohio at July 11, 2025 11:11 AM (FCrpy)

34 I agree with just about everything except the description the EVs just spontaneously catching fire. Not that it makes it much better but there has to be a trigger such as damage, loose connections, manufacturing defect, etc combined with an event. Something as simple as water infiltration or impact.

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 11:11 AM (VofaG)

35 The house we will be renting on the Outer Banks, in the contract it stated no EVs are to be parked or charged on the property.

I've notice in my bolshevik neighborhood, the people with EVs typically charge their vehicles away from the house/garage/carport. Gee I wonder why? ?

Posted by: Ganowicz Commie Exterminators, Ltd. at July 11, 2025 11:11 AM (m5P/4)

36 "This ship be sinking".

Posted by: Michael Ray Richardson 1981 at July 11, 2025 11:11 AM (G5+As)

37 In a culture hell-bent on weakening men, true strength comes from submission to something higher, and that is God.
Posted by: Mister Ghost
======
Submission to something greater than oneself. I think some are submitting to the opposite of the Lord though.
Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (ctrM5)

It's a Demon Haunted World to say the least...

Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 11, 2025 11:11 AM (TGPs7)

38 Its really too bad VW made their retro Van as an EV. They could have scored big with the model if it ran on gas.

Posted by: pudinhead at July 11, 2025 11:11 AM (W3T6M)

39 Manufacturers! Do you want to empty your parking lots of unsold EVs? Ship them away, the insurance will pay for the sunken crap.

Posted by: Anacleto Mitraglia at July 11, 2025 11:11 AM (HUqpb)

40 9 >>Elon has a sad

Man, does that guy have public mood swings!
Posted by: Lizzy
=======
Elon has been running a series of spinning plates for awhile. Leverage via debt and investors, etc. is great on the upside but not so good on the downside.

Tesla, for example, is probably overvalued based on standard measures and it is difficult enough to focus on one thing--the EV car business but now the AI part of Tesla is what is driving the stock valuation.

Space X has first mover advantage but now competitors are beginning to catch up. And so on.

X is probably still not profitable.

And so it goes.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:12 AM (ctrM5)

41 Russell Brand@RustyRockets

I think people like RFK Jr., Tommy Robinson, and even Andrew Tate would die for what they believe. You may not agree with them, but their conviction is real.

In a culture hell-bent on weakening men, true strength comes from submission to something higher, and that is God.
Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 11, 2025 11:04 AM (TGPs7)
_______

Tate might die to get a few more SM followers. So there's that.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 11, 2025 11:12 AM (iFTx/)

42 It's a Demon Haunted World to say the least...
Posted by: Mister Ghost
========
Sounds like something Disney would put in for Disneyworld. As a good thing.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:13 AM (ctrM5)

43 > Even Tesla sales are down significantly.
-----------
So's Tesla's stock price. After his tiff with Trump it tanked. So, while the left takes their anger out on the EV's the right takes it out on Tesla's stock value.

Which is worse?

It doesn't matter... Musk's flagship enterprise is being torched from both ends. He should probably stick to rockets, EV's and flamethrowers and leave politics to the adults.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 11, 2025 11:14 AM (Q4IgG)

44 The automotive press has been pushing EVs as the greatest thing since sliced bread for a decade. Their credibility is shot.

Posted by: mr tmz at July 11, 2025 11:15 AM (rJ48h)

45 44 It doesn't matter... Musk's flagship enterprise is being torched from both ends. He should probably stick to rockets, EV's and flamethrowers and leave politics to the adults.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 11, 2025 11:14 AM (Q4IgG)

=======

Maybe the Democrat establishment will decide to cast off the Pritzker family donations to try and secure Musk donations by cutting the tranny shit out of the party completely.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:15 AM (GBKbO)

46 It doesn't matter... Musk's flagship enterprise is being torched from both ends. He should probably stick to rockets, EV's and flamethrowers and leave politics to the adults.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 11, 2025 11:14 AM (Q4IgG)

Just an aside, most people don't know that
Space X came before Tesla.

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 11:15 AM (VofaG)

47 But it's a MAGA victory!
Beth@beth_cronk
We are doing that now, thanks to Trump:

Hyundai: Announced a $21 billion investment in the U.S., including $5.8 billion for a new steel plant in Louisiana to support EV production at its Georgia and Alabama facilities. Additionally, Hyundai is expanding its Georgia Metaplant to increase production capacity from 300,000 to 500,000 vehicles per year.

• Ford: Invested $9.6 billion in a loan to fund three U.S. battery plants and broke ground on a $5.6 billion EV “mega campus” in Tennessee. Ford also announced a $3.5 billion investment for a lithium iron phosphate (LFP) battery plant in Michigan, creating 2,500 jobs.

• Stellantis: Committed $5 billion to the U.S., including reopening an assembly plant in Belvidere, Illinois, previously shuttered in 2023.

• Volkswagen: Plans to invest $20 billion in North America, with $10 billion allocated to its Chattanooga, Tennessee plant, $5 billion for a joint venture with Rivian, and $5 billion for Scout Motors to produce extended-range EVs.

Posted by: andycanuck at July 11, 2025 11:15 AM (2yoRf)

48 • Toyota: Invested $1.4 billion in its Princeton, Indiana plant for EV assembly and has announced approximately $4 billion in U.S. investments over the past year, including $88 million in 2025 for plants in Kentucky, Alabama, Texas, and West Virginia.

• Tesla: Reported a cumulative investment of $44 billion in U.S. manufacturing and infrastructure, with $10 billion spent in the last fiscal year alone.

• General Motors: Part of a $7 billion investment across four Michigan sites to repurpose plants for battery cell and EV manufacturing.

Posted by: andycanuck at July 11, 2025 11:15 AM (2yoRf)

49 Elon is just trying to get to Mars to escape his future creditors.

Posted by: Get your ass to Mars! at July 11, 2025 11:15 AM (y+qgR)

50 Seems mother erf don’t like EV going round pollutin’.

Posted by: Eromero at July 11, 2025 11:16 AM (jgmnb)

51 35 The house we will be renting on the Outer Banks, in the contract it stated no EVs are to be parked or charged on the property.

Posted by: Ganowicz Commie Exterminators, Ltd.

The oceanfront house we rented last week in South Nags Head had an EV charger prominently mounted on the building.

Posted by: Nobody Used It at July 11, 2025 11:16 AM (G5+As)

52 There's one good thing about spending tens of billions of taxpayer dollars on a few charging stations: Cleanup costs to remove them will be much reduced.

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:16 AM (Riz8t)

53 33 kids on electric bikes and scooters have exploded here today
Posted by: Patrick From Ohio at July 11, 2025 11:11 AM (FCrpy)

Watch out for exploding kids!

Posted by: Emmie at July 11, 2025 11:16 AM (rF2iL)

54 4 Elon has a sad
Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 11:01 AM (dCxaZ)

Mr. Musk, to cheer you up a bit, I have a deal for you. Have the Boring Company re-introduce the Not-a-Flamethrower on the market, and I will buy two.

I promise to keep them a safe(-ish) distance from any Teslas.

Posted by: tankdemon at July 11, 2025 11:16 AM (/BLT9)

55 >>It doesn't matter... Musk's flagship enterprise is being torched from both ends. He should probably stick to rockets, EV's and flamethrowers and leave politics to the adults.

I saw he was imaging one of his tunnels from the USA to the UK - holy crap, what a bad idea. Why would we want to make it easier for "Brits" to get to our country.

*By "Brits" I mean the new 'Yookay' https://x.com/MythoYookay

Posted by: Lizzy at July 11, 2025 11:18 AM (GbwPZ)

56 34 I agree with just about everything except the description the EVs just spontaneously catching fire. Not that it makes it much better but there has to be a trigger such as damage, loose connections, manufacturing defect, etc combined with an event. Something as simple as water infiltration or impact.
Posted by: polynikes
=========
EVs in their current form are simply a niche market. Hard to balance weight of the batteries, rechargeability, and less flammability requirements.

Gas, propane, CNG, on the other hand, not so much.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:18 AM (ctrM5)

57 Put a mast and sail through the sunroof and sail it to the dealership.
-Panamanian Shipping Co.

Posted by: Eromero at July 11, 2025 11:19 AM (jgmnb)

58 @21

>>He has his car that will run on Mars, if he ever gets there. He’d best concentrate on his other businesses if he’s looking for profit to fund his vision.

Going to Mars is stupid, pointless and a vanity project.

If Musk wants to waste his money doing it, more power to him, but taxpayer money should not be thrown that rabbit hole.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:20 AM (XV/Pl)

59 Why would we want to make it easier for "Brits" to get to our country.
Posted by: Lizzy

So Keir Starmer can come after those of us who call him a poopy head online.

Posted by: Bulg at July 11, 2025 11:20 AM (77rzZ)

60 Maybe the Democrat establishment will decide to cast off the Pritzker family donations to try and secure Musk donations by cutting the tranny shit out of the party completely.

That is the funniest thing I have read this week.

Posted by: GloboHomo at July 11, 2025 11:21 AM (D0HYP)

61 Put a mast and sail through the sunroof and sail it to the dealership.
----
Look at me! I am the driver now!
-- Somali carjacker

Posted by: andycanuck at July 11, 2025 11:22 AM (2yoRf)

62 33
‘ but they go so so fast, I have been nearly hit by these kids.’

I’d carry a stick or an umbrella.

Posted by: Dr. Claw at July 11, 2025 11:22 AM (jbnUc)

63 Andrew Tate?

Bruh...
Posted by: TheJamesMadison

Climbs on my soapbox

When boys are getting told from the beginning that they are basically defective girls with dangly bits, the source of all evil in the world and potential rapists waiting to happen, some dude who tells people like that to fuck off is going to get attention.

He's a scum bag and I'd rather see more positive male role models stepping up but that will take a while.

Posted by: NR Pax at July 11, 2025 11:22 AM (lXoJ5)

64 I can see Musk selling X to a liberal conglomerate at a loss if he keeps getting rejected by the Right.

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 11:22 AM (VofaG)

65 Maybe the Democrat establishment will decide to cast off the Pritzker family donations to try and secure Musk donations by cutting the tranny shit out of the party completely.

That is the funniest thing I have read this week.

Things are changing fast. John Kerry says Trump was right about wanting to close the border. This is how you know the Dems are seriously worried about their future.

https://is.gd/7WZLry

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:23 AM (Riz8t)

66 Thx Buck. Gasparino at the NY Post has an opinion column today setting for that the Tesla board of directors has to rein in Musk. Losing the tax credits could be the death knell of EVs.

Posted by: Smell the Glove at July 11, 2025 11:23 AM (JtH6i)

67 I've notice in my bolshevik neighborhood, the people with EVs typically charge their vehicles away from the house/garage/carport. Gee I wonder why? ?
Posted by: Ganowicz Commie Exterminators, Ltd.

If EVs keep being A Thing, I foresee the return of the carriage house/detatched garage as desirable property element for those who own them.

Posted by: FeatherBlade at July 11, 2025 11:24 AM (a+4eV)

68 7 ...
Safety of storing them, too - your home garage, parking garages, battery warehouses. Pretty much everywhere...

Not only are parking garages subject to fire damage, but some of the structures could collapse due to the added weight, (EV's are much heavier than ICE vehicles.)
https://tinyurl.com/3rnj8uwk

Posted by: tankdemon at July 11, 2025 11:25 AM (/BLT9)

69 68 If EVs keep being A Thing, I foresee the return of the carriage house/detatched garage as desirable property element for those who own them.
Posted by: FeatherBlade at July 11, 2025 11:24 AM (a+4eV)

=======

Kitchens used to be built separately from the house because of chances of fire.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:25 AM (GBKbO)

70 I can see Musk selling X to a liberal conglomerate at a loss if he keeps getting rejected by the Right.

Posted by: polynikes

Is the Right rejecting him, or just hoping that he'll take a chill-pill?

Posted by: FeatherBlade at July 11, 2025 11:25 AM (a+4eV)

71 Maybe the Democrat establishment will decide to cast off the Pritzker family donations to try and secure Musk donations by cutting the tranny shit out of the party completely.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison
=====
Civil war among Dems in NYC and Gruesome's embrace of violent foreign flag waving assholes in CA is likely to be causing heartburn as well.

Dems seem to be repeating their ACW years with the 'fire eaters' and the older pseudo populist scatering to wealthy oligarchs.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:25 AM (ctrM5)

72 setting for that the Tesla board of directors has to rein in Musk.

I don't think they are very happy about his plan to start a new political party

Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 11:26 AM (dCxaZ)

73 If EVs keep being A Thing, I foresee the return of the carriage house/detatched garage as desirable property element for those who own them.
Posted by: FeatherBlade at July 11, 2025 11:24 AM (a+4eV)

JT Marlin upgrades Amalgamated Asbestos Industries to STRONG BUY.

Posted by: JT Marlin at July 11, 2025 11:27 AM (muwun)

74 Is the Right rejecting him, or just hoping that he'll take a chill-pill?

Schlichter clearly thinks it's the latter. I agree with him.

https://is.gd/qB47Vy

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:27 AM (Riz8t)

75 I saw he was imaging one of his tunnels from the USA to the UK - holy crap, what a bad idea. Why would we want to make it easier for "Brits" to get to our country.

*By "Brits" I mean the new 'Yookay' https://x.com/MythoYookay
Posted by: Lizzy
=======
Basically sci fi at this point due to plate tectonics. Boring would do better doing what it is doing--focusing on tunnelling in cities for services and roads, etc.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:28 AM (ctrM5)

76 23 What about hemp powered cars made out of hemp?
Posted by: Boss Moss at July 11, 2025 11:08 AM (bvNHo)

Probably not a lot of people who would complain if they started burning.

Posted by: tankdemon at July 11, 2025 11:28 AM (/BLT9)

77 @168

>>If EVs keep being A Thing,

EV's can never be a thing, there are over 280m vehicles in America, the current power grid can barely support the current stock of sold EV's, which to date is slightly under 7m since 2010.

In order to displace ICE vehicles, it would take the building of nuclear power generation plants in pretty much every state to handle the load.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:28 AM (XV/Pl)

78 If EVs keep being A Thing, I foresee the return of the carriage house/detatched garage as desirable property element for those who own them.

I can't imagine having a detached garage in someplace where the weather is cold and snowy/icy but damn if they didn't build them where we were in CO.

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at July 11, 2025 11:29 AM (3Ope8)

79 Thanks for that Archimedes.

This paragraph in real think pops out.

"There’s simply no constituency to not do that at the moment. Who is the voter who is in favor of a 40% cut to Social Security, Medicaid, and Medicare, the real drivers of debt? There are some. Probably about 5% of voters. There is a huge theoretical constituency for balancing the budget today, and nearly zero constituency for doing the things required to make it happen.

Elon Musk felt betrayed by this, which he wasn’t. His coalition faction just didn’t get everything that it wanted. "

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:29 AM (ctrM5)

80 It doesn't matter... Musk's flagship enterprise is being torched from both ends. He should probably stick to rockets, EV's and flamethrowers and leave politics to the adults.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 11, 2025 11:14 AM (Q4IgG)

=======

Maybe the Democrat establishment will decide to cast off the Pritzker family donations to try and secure Musk donations by cutting the tranny shit out of the party completely.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:15 AM (GBKbO)
________

We'll know when Dems start making Hitler salutes

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 11, 2025 11:29 AM (iFTx/)

81 In order to displace ICE vehicles, it would take the building of nuclear power generation plants in pretty much every state to handle the load.
Posted by: Thomas Bender

Screams in Greta Thunberg

Posted by: NR Pax at July 11, 2025 11:30 AM (lXoJ5)

82 I have been nearly hit by these kids.’

A scooter punk hits me there will be injuries. Theirs.

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at July 11, 2025 11:30 AM (8QPXz)

83 Is the Right rejecting him, or just hoping that he'll take a chill-pill?
Posted by: FeatherBlade at July 11, 2025 11:25 AM (a+4eV)

Creating another party against Trump ain't much of a chill pill. I think he's past chilling.

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 11:30 AM (VofaG)

84 Civil war among Dems in NYC and Gruesome's embrace of violent foreign flag waving assholes in CA is likely to be causing heartburn as well.

Dems seem to be repeating their ACW years with the 'fire eaters' and the older pseudo populist scatering to wealthy oligarchs.

It's not just them. Ed Martin, the head of the DNC, welcomes violent anti-semites into his party's "big tent". I wonder when he'll give a big hug to the Einsatzgruppen.

https://is.gd/ySIZhj

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:30 AM (Riz8t)

85 @71

>>Is the Right rejecting him, or just hoping that he'll take a chill-pill?

The right is not rejecting Musk, Musk has gone off the rails.

If he can reign it in, then the unpleasantness will be over.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:30 AM (XV/Pl)

86 Bulg -

Here’s a link to the Wikipedia article on the inventor:

https://is.gd/yuEfcQ

But steam was already tried when it was a fully developed technology and lost out to ICE, partly due to the improved efficiency of internal vs. external combustion. That can’t be helped: it’s built in to the physics. Why should steam work any better today? You still have to burn something to heat the boiler! Note the heat being applied externally means more of it is lost to the environment: that is why an ICE is inherently more efficient than an ECE (External Combustion Engine).

Posted by: NemoMeImpuneLacessit at July 11, 2025 11:31 AM (WK0PT)

87 Maybe EVs should re-brand themselves as "External Combustion" vehicles.

Posted by: t-bird at July 11, 2025 11:31 AM (9tkmY)

88 Breaking EV news: the Rivian remains butt ugly.

Posted by: But you already knew that at July 11, 2025 11:31 AM (XQo4F)

89 @89

>>Breaking EV news: the Rivian remains butt ugly.

Not as ugly as the new 4Runner, that thing is fugly as all get out.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:32 AM (XV/Pl)

90
More "the floor is collapsing" on this-or-that lefty-pushed industry (cf. Hollywood and the MSM). End, already! I want to know when someone big goes bankrupt and we can look at EV charging stations as quaint relics that are soon to revert to normal parking spaces. Thank you for your attention to this matter!

Posted by: Blonde Morticia at July 11, 2025 11:33 AM (UmB+t)

91 Elon Musk felt betrayed by this, which he wasn’t. His coalition faction just didn’t get everything that it wanted. "

De nada. It really is a case study in the different ways of thinking of engineers and pols. For an engineer, there's a right way and a wrong way, and only his way is the right way. For a pol, success is the art of the possible.

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:33 AM (Riz8t)

92
Aaaaaaand good morning!

Posted by: Blonde Morticia at July 11, 2025 11:33 AM (UmB+t)

93 Doesn't Musk also dig holes in the ground?

Posted by: It's boring at July 11, 2025 11:33 AM (XQo4F)

94 Going to Mars is stupid, pointless and a vanity project.
--------------
Matt Damon has been to Mars.

Posted by: pudinhead at July 11, 2025 11:34 AM (W3T6M)

95 Is the Right rejecting him, or just hoping that he'll take a chill-pill?

Schlichter clearly thinks it's the latter. I agree with him.

https://is.gd/qB47Vy
Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:27 AM (Riz8t)
______

I don't think the Right has rejected him, because a lot of what he wants to get done is what the Right wants too. In a perfect world. But this is far from a perfect world. Kurt is right that everyone wants a balanced budget, but nobody wants to make any cuts that effect them (or even one day will effect them). Elon seems to be delusional that there's some constituency out there for taking a chainsaw to SS.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 11, 2025 11:34 AM (iFTx/)

96 Nothing is uglier than a Cybertruck.

Posted by: Bulg at July 11, 2025 11:34 AM (77rzZ)

97 Musk being an engineer looks at every problem as solvable. Political problems, not so much. Thus, his frustration and meltdown. FWIW I doubt his 3rd party idea will gain any further traction than it currently has.

Which isn't much.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 11, 2025 11:35 AM (Q4IgG)

98 I saw he was imaging one of his tunnels from the USA to the UK - holy crap, what a bad idea. Why would we want to make it easier for "Brits" to get to our country.

*By "Brits" I mean the new 'Yookay' https://x.com/MythoYookay
Posted by: Lizzy
=======
Basically sci fi at this point due to plate tectonics. Boring would do better doing what it is doing--focusing on tunnelling in cities for services and roads, etc.
Posted by: whig

Mars. Musk wants to go to Mars. Tunnel boring on Mars. Underground cities.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:35 AM (8v2yu)

99 I don't think the Right has rejected him, because a lot of what he wants to get done is what the Right wants too. In a perfect world. But this is far from a perfect world. Kurt is right that everyone wants a balanced budget, but nobody wants to make any cuts that effect them (or even one day will effect them). Elon seems to be delusional that there's some constituency out there for taking a chainsaw to SS.

See my #92. An engineer wants 100% right, or people die. A politician knows that isn't possible in his world, so gets what he can, and then goes back for more.

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:35 AM (Riz8t)

100 In order to displace ICE vehicles, it would take the building of nuclear power generation plants in pretty much every state to handle the load.
Posted by: Thomas Bender
======
Things are moving that way anyway. Saw projections of the next gen AI models--some of the projected projects require up to three full scale nuke plants to power them. Since AI is hot, the techlords have realized that solar, wind, and all the other bullshit won't serve base loads for these plants. That means nukes. Fortunately, some of the Green Nude Eel money can be reprogrammed into spurring a renaissance of American nuke power along with Trump's three EOs that cut through some of the bullshit. Some favorable aftermath of Scotus decisions helps.

Because of model degradation, AI companies are basically retraining new models constantly which is the largest initial suck of energy and comp time resources.

Beyond my paygrade to figure out whether fixing decaying models or continuing to build new models with new data by scaling is something that can be consistently done. But that is what all the big AI companies are projecting as necessary.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:35 AM (ctrM5)

101 For energy density and ease of handling ? Its mighty tough to beat a gallon of gas.
Posted by: Doug Roberts

My inner 10 year old is thinking up fart jokes.

Posted by: Dark Litigator at July 11, 2025 11:35 AM (KAi1n)

102 One Farley is famous for being a buffoon. The other is a decaeased comic actor.

Posted by: 2009Refugee at July 11, 2025 11:36 AM (sOfnX)

103 Everything is fake, and gay. Not merely manufactured consent, a veritable smorgasbord of phony preferences and polls, opinions, “nudging” and the rest of it.

I noticed this morning, it finally dawned on me, my “Favorites” listed for my online grocery store shopping cart at the tail end include a huge swath of vegetables, grapes, yogurt &c. Some Algorithm somewhere isn’t happy with my overall food selections, apparently. Or probably automatic.

At this point in society, I suggest you believe nothing you are told, and maybe half of what you see.

Posted by: Common Tater at July 11, 2025 11:36 AM (+0VYM)

104 96 I don't think the Right has rejected him, because a lot of what he wants to get done is what the Right wants too. In a perfect world. But this is far from a perfect world. Kurt is right that everyone wants a balanced budget, but nobody wants to make any cuts that effect them (or even one day will effect them). Elon seems to be delusional that there's some constituency out there for taking a chainsaw to SS.
Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 11, 2025 11:34 AM (iFTx/)

======

*cough* affect *cough*

If Elon wants to primary GOPers who are preventing rescission packages, I wish him luck.

But making Massie, who did nothing to improve the OBBB while on the Rules committee, his cornerstone of a new political party is just...weird.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:36 AM (GBKbO)

105 Mars. Musk wants to go to Mars. Tunnel boring on Mars. Underground cities.
Posted by: rickb223
=======
Mebbe but Musk is talking about Boring projects on Earf not Mars at present. Creative types often have very volatile personalities.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:37 AM (ctrM5)

106 and $5 billion for Scout Motors to produce extended-range EVs.

Extended-range is sales speak for a tow bar on the front.

Posted by: t-bird at July 11, 2025 11:37 AM (BIMpQ)

107 @101

>>Things are moving that way anyway.

Sure, but they will have to decide which is more important and I think AI wins out over EV's.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:37 AM (XV/Pl)

108 Want to know the energy potential in a gallon of gas? Go push your car 20 miles.

Posted by: Weasel at July 11, 2025 11:38 AM (idFWj)

109 Nothing is uglier than a Cybertruck.
——

Maybe ugly is not the right word. Definitely weird though. Like Mad Max meets De Lorean?

Posted by: Common Tater at July 11, 2025 11:39 AM (gzzK/)

110 So if the Right is not rejecting him right now and what he has been proposing and his own rejection of Trump that means they are accepting him or neutral?

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 11:39 AM (VofaG)

111 It's not just them. Ed Martin, the head of the DNC, welcomes violent anti-semites into his party's "big tent". I wonder when he'll give a big hug to the Einsatzgruppen.

https://is.gd/ySIZhj
Posted by: Archimedes
====
Well, that too is similar only differing in targets. Fire Eaters were notorious for their dismissal of black personhood and comparing them to various animals. They continued in this strain well into the 20th century.

Upper class 'strivers' are often the source of woes in a society because they are not getting to the top like they think they should. So they usually try to burn it all down rather than suffer a blow to their fortunes.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:40 AM (ctrM5)

112 Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:29 AM (ctrM5)

Anyone who pays any attention to me (basically you) knows that I have been adamant that all one has to do is look at a pie chart of the budget and see that significant cuts will never occur until there is literally no money left to fake, steal or print, which will be around the 38th of never.

Just look at the pie chart. Waste fraud etc is great, cut the shit out of it. But it won't make a pimple on a pig's dick dent in anything at all. Not until you want to cut the military and "entitlements".

Posted by: ... at July 11, 2025 11:40 AM (Qr870)

113 I live in a state (NYS) where EV's are mandated, starting in just a few short years and only EV's of all types by 2033-2035. Even the big trucks and probably farm equipment, firetrucks etc. Will they hold to that mandate, come hell or high water I can't see Kathy H. changing it. I know California is now unable to push for the mandate, does that include other states that follow California.

Posted by: Coliin at July 11, 2025 11:40 AM (wlQdF)

114 Though I do agree ... all this BBB does is add more debt. More debt isn't suddenly good because Trump signs it.

There is iron in your words of death, HOWEVER, as Schlichter says, BBB is an attempt to change the policies and ways of doing things that put us on this path to insolvency, while later bills will deal with the existing expenditures more severely. IOW, Trump is patching the holes in the bucket first.

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:40 AM (Riz8t)

115
~bat-bat-bat,, bat, BAT-BAT~

Posted by: Jasmine Crocketts' Eye Lashes at July 11, 2025 11:41 AM (5hfjS)

116 Mars. Musk wants to go to Mars. Tunnel boring on Mars. Underground cities.
Posted by: rickb223
=======
Mebbe but Musk is talking about Boring projects on Earf not Mars at present. Creative types often have very volatile personalities.
Posted by: whig

That was a total WAG.
Perfect it here, deploy it there.
I have no idea if that's what he's thinking, but that's what Tesla and SpaceX are geared for.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:41 AM (8v2yu)

117 112 So if the Right is not rejecting him right now and what he has been proposing and his own rejection of Trump that means they are accepting him or neutral?

Posted by: polynikes
======
I have nothing against Musk but that does not speak for those that he had harsh words with or behaved outrageously toward in person.

Thinking you bought or own the government for whatever you did to put it into power is never wise as centuries of monarchs versus key nobles should have told him.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:42 AM (ctrM5)

118 ~bat-bat-bat,, bat, BAT-BAT~

Posted by: Jasmine Crocketts' Eye Lashes

I think she's more of an owl, with the eye feathers making almost no noise.

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:42 AM (Riz8t)

119 So far, the only planetary object that where we have successfully landed a craft with human and returned is the moon, and round trip journey to the moon is 6-12 days.

The theoretically minimum round trip from Mars is 18 months, and max is 3 years.

And currently, we have never sent something to mars and returned it to the earth.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:42 AM (XV/Pl)

120 That was a total WAG.
Perfect it here, deploy it there.
I have no idea if that's what he's thinking, but that's what Tesla and SpaceX are geared for.
Posted by: rickb223
======
I would call that a very shrewd guess.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:43 AM (ctrM5)

121 121 And currently, we have never sent something to mars and returned it to the earth.
Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:42 AM (XV/Pl)

======

What about Matt Damon, huh?

Check and mate.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:43 AM (GBKbO)

122 I don't think going to Mars is pointless. A lot of resources out in space. Musk driving down costs is essential to make it worthwhile, and what works for Mars will work for the moon. Better that USA entrepreneurs get there before the Chinese.

Posted by: Chuck Martel at July 11, 2025 11:43 AM (Dv3i1)

123 Just look at the pie chart. Waste fraud etc is great, cut the shit out of it. But it won't make a pimple on a pig's dick dent in anything at all. Not until you want to cut the military and "entitlements".
Posted by: ... at July 11, 2025 11:40 AM (Qr870)

I've heard a lot of expressions in my 29 years of life -- but this is the first ever instance of "pimple on a pig's dick". So, um -- thanks??

Posted by: Doof at July 11, 2025 11:43 AM (5jU2p)

124 I have nothing against Musk but that does not speak for those that he had harsh words with or behaved outrageously toward in person.

Thinking you bought or own the government for whatever you did to put it into power is never wise as centuries of monarchs versus key nobles should have told him.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:42 AM (ctrM5)

Elon risked a ton thinking there was a great opportunity.

Him lashing out was stupid, but I won't blame him for feeling aggrieved at where things ended up.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 11, 2025 11:43 AM (j/vBG)

125 noticed this morning, it finally dawned on me, my “Favorites” listed for my online grocery store shopping cart at the tail end include a huge swath of vegetables, grapes, yogurt &c. Some Algorithm somewhere isn’t happy with my overall food selections, apparently. Or probably automatic.

Crickets, grasshoppers.......

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at July 11, 2025 11:43 AM (trxpo)

126 "Volkswagen confirmed to buyers after the vessel was lost that its highly sought-after ID.4 electric SUVs were among the cars lost"

Highly sought after? Sooooo 2022. Not anymore!

Posted by: Craig Pirrong at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (vFerH)

127 Nothing is uglier than a Cybertruck.
——

Maybe ugly is not the right word.

Definitely weird though. Like Mad Max meets De Lorean?
Posted by: Common Tater

Like kindergarten drawing meets Lego.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (8v2yu)

128 Posted by: Doof at July 11, 2025 11:43 AM (5jU2p)

Definitely not mine

Posted by: ... at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (Qr870)

129 > If Elon wants to primary GOPers who are preventing rescission packages, I wish him luck.

But making Massie, who did nothing to improve the OBBB while on the Rules committee, his cornerstone of a new political party is just...weird.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:36 AM (GBKbO)
----------
I would support a real effort to primary GOP RINO's. It would take a lot of money to do it. Musk has a lot of money. And a grudge.

I would not support a 3rd party under Musk's direction, or Massie's. Or about anyone else.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (Q4IgG)

130 130 Nothing is uglier than a Cybertruck.
——

Maybe ugly is not the right word.

Definitely weird though. Like Mad Max meets De Lorean?
Posted by: Common Tater

=======

*waves seductively*
-Lena Dunham

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (GBKbO)

131 78 In order to displace ICE vehicles, it would take the building of nuclear power generation plants in pretty much every state to handle the load.
Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:28 AM (XV/Pl)

We should proba ly be doing that anyway. The number of things needing power is increasing every day, we need to at least try to make supply outpace demand.

Posted by: tankdemon at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (/BLT9)

132 Just waiting for the day when one of those electric vehicles ignites on one of the big ferries between Vancouver and Vancouver Island, or Seattle and the Islands.

Full evacuation, loss of all the other vehicles, and then new rules--no electric vehicles allowed. Industry killer.

Posted by: Kevin Canuck at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (/xmMU)

133 The theoretically minimum round trip from Mars is 18 months, and max is 3 years.

And currently, we have never sent something to mars and returned it to the earth.
Posted by: Thomas Bender
========
I think the engineering is solid enough to do just that, it is just that no one wants to pay the cost for it yet.

Easier if you have lunar or orbital bases to launch such missions because of the gravity well here.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (ctrM5)

134 Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:42 AM (ctrM5

It's not what you think . It's what Musk thinks . He believes he was rejected by Trump and a large contingent of the Congressional GOP .

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (VofaG)

135 Like kindergarten drawing meets Lego.
Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (8v2yu)

Reminds me of Playstation 1

Posted by: ... at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (Qr870)

136 Musk isn't young enough to get humans to Mars. He's in his 50's. Assuming he lives long enough to even see humans land on Mars, he'll be doing it from his retirement home.

Posted by: Dark Litigator at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (KAi1n)

137 Want to know the energy potential in a gallon of gas? Go push your car 20 miles.
———

Yes! I’ve been saying this for years. Load it up good, with 2000 pounds in f stuff, too. Uphill the whole way. In July when it is 97 degrees.

You’ll get paid four (4) dollars. You can explain energy density to people. Cost of energy inputs on EVERYTHING else. Lay everything out. After you’re done they always whine…

“Yeah, but still”…. One idiot simply declared that it’s time to move on, because of the age of the oil and gas technology.

No argument from me per se, but they forgot about the part you have to invent a reliable replacement first. These people are insane, and have a death wish. Those at the top understand what they are doing.

Posted by: Common Tater at July 11, 2025 11:45 AM (P55mL)

138
What about hemp powered cars made out of hemp?
Posted by: Boss Moss

============

I like it! Disposable cars. Suitable for mulching.

Posted by: Blonde Morticia at July 11, 2025 11:45 AM (UmB+t)

139 all this BBB does is add more debt.
____

It prevented my current tax rate from increasing, which is not insignificant to me. So there's that.

Posted by: Chuck Martel at July 11, 2025 11:45 AM (Dv3i1)

140 Nothing is uglier than a Cybertruck.
——

Maybe ugly is not the right word. Definitely weird though. Like Mad Max meets De Lorean?

Calling it a 'truck' is what makes me instinctively reject it. Shallow, I know. Calling it the Cyber De Lorean might have been cool.

Posted by: t-bird at July 11, 2025 11:45 AM (emDE2)

141 > Nothing is uglier than a Cybertruck.
---------
There's one around here that's been painted black. It has some serious Darth Vader vibes.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 11, 2025 11:46 AM (Q4IgG)

142 @124

>>What about Matt Damon, huh? Check and mate.

I'll tell you, he didn't just eat potatoes, IYKWIMAITYD.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:47 AM (XV/Pl)

143 I would support a real effort to primary GOP RINO's. It would take a lot of money to do it. Musk has a lot of money. And a grudge.

I would not support a 3rd party under Musk's direction, or Massie's. Or about anyone else.
Posted by: Martini Farmer

So did Bloomberg. He tried to buy the Dem nomination. Elon had a choice, he can try to create a new party which will take several cycles to do (see Reform for an example) and a LOT of money. Or he could have tried to primary what he saw as obstacles to clear cutting the federal debt (not all of them are what I would call RINOs).

Trying to do both is guaranteed to not work out well.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:47 AM (ctrM5)

144 I can't explain it, but I find myself interested in Korean golf.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/XGoRLbefdFI?feature=share

Posted by: Archimedes at July 11, 2025 11:47 AM (Riz8t)

145 145 @124

>>What about Matt Damon, huh? Check and mate.

I'll tell you, he didn't just eat potatoes, IYKWIMAITYD.
Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:47 AM (XV/Pl)

=====

You'd be wrong.

Because...

I don't get it.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:48 AM (GBKbO)

146 117
~bat-bat-bat,, bat, BAT-BAT~
Posted by: Jasmine Crocketts' Eye Lashes at July 11, 2025 11:41 AM

Here. Have a drink.

Posted by: Old Lady Emhoff at July 11, 2025 11:48 AM (XQo4F)

147 > Nothing is uglier than a Cybertruck.
---------
There's one around here that's been painted black. It has some serious Darth Vader vibes.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 11, 2025 11:46 AM (Q4IgG)

Probably had a red door once

Posted by: Doof at July 11, 2025 11:49 AM (5jU2p)

148 What about hemp powered cars made out of hemp?
Posted by: Boss Moss

I saw that Cheech & Chong movie!

Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:49 AM (8v2yu)

149 142 all this BBB does is add more debt.
____

It prevented my current tax rate from increasing, which is not insignificant to me. So there's that.

Posted by: Chuck Martel at July 11, 2025 11:45 AM (Dv3i1)

It raised debt, but not by further redistributing wealth from the middle class to others...so that's a win...

And the debt was always getting raised with Trump's previous tax cuts getting extended...in theory, I believe the debt is rising less than just a pure extension and status quo everywhere would have raised it...so that's an even bigger win...

Posted by: Nova Local at July 11, 2025 11:49 AM (tOcjL)

150 >What about Matt Damon, huh? Check and mate.

I'll tell you, he didn't just eat potatoes, IYKWIMAITYD.
Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:47 AM (XV/Pl)

=====

The wind storm on Mars totally took me out of the story.

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 11:49 AM (VofaG)

151 146 So did Bloomberg. He tried to buy the Dem nomination. Elon had a choice, he can try to create a new party which will take several cycles to do (see Reform for an example) and a LOT of money. Or he could have tried to primary what he saw as obstacles to clear cutting the federal debt (not all of them are what I would call RINOs).

Trying to do both is guaranteed to not work out well.
Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:47 AM (ctrM5)

======

If he's serious about a third party, I suggest short term goals of getting a hundred or so state legislators elected next year and upwards of 5 federal House members. In 2028, aim for 300 state legislators and 25 House members, 2 Senators, and 1-3 governors.

Continue this slow growth over about 20 years until you have the political base to challenge for the presidency with at least a third of the House in your party.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:49 AM (GBKbO)

152 Going to Mars is stupid, pointless and a vanity project.
--------------

No it's not. Exploration is in the human genome. I want to see humans on Mars and on the moon and on Europa. I'm curious. I want to see different places. I want to walk on the ground of these places.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at July 11, 2025 11:50 AM (g8Ew8)

153 Cybertruck = electric El Camino.

Posted by: Put astroturf in the back at July 11, 2025 11:50 AM (XQo4F)

154 Its got 114k miles and runs like a top.

Spins really fast in one location and then falls over?

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at July 11, 2025 11:50 AM (ExV1e)

155 If EVs keep being A Thing, I foresee the return of the carriage house/detatched garage as desirable property element for those who own them.
Posted by: FeatherBlade

My last house had one, and I miss it. Much lower homeowners' insurance, too.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (Vfq+S)

156 I don't have any objection to going to Mars. But we might want to try going to the moon first.

Posted by: It's Made of Cheese at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (y+qgR)

157 No it's not. Exploration is in the human genome. I want to see humans on Mars and on the moon and on Europa. I'm curious. I want to see different places. I want to walk on the ground of these places.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at July 11, 2025 11:50 AM (g8Ew

Yeah, I'll keep my feet on Mother Earth - thanks. Lots and lots of places I need to explore here 1st...

Posted by: Nova Local at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (tOcjL)

158 Von Braun had plans (in the early 60s) for an early 1980s manned Mars mission, as it was the next “window” for optimal launch time in terms of distance.

Very dangerous indeed. They could have probably pulled it off. Congress, and Sen. William Proxmire killed the “clearly leading role” the US had in space.

Sometimes I think it was clearly sabotage. We were told by the media, that Americans weren’t interested in space or the moon any longer. The networks wouldn’t cover it.

But maybe they were bullshitting us. They lie about everything. Why not that? Apollo was dangerous as hell, but the alternative wasn’t simply to kill the whole thing. The absolute waste is unbelievable.

They can’t even orbit the moon. Complete failure on NASA

Posted by: Common Tater at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (XeHN6)

159 Probably had a red door once
Posted by: Doof at July 11, 2025 11:49 AM

ISWYDT.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (kgE5c)

160 Operations for directional boring rigs is spotty at best. However long long they say it will take, multiply by.at least 3. Spare parts, insane working conditions, etc.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (trxpo)

161 159 I don't have any objection to going to Mars. But we might want to try going to the moon first.
Posted by: It's Made of Cheese at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (y+qgR)

=======

The light side is double stilton. The dark side is an Italian bleu cheese.

Only some will enjoy the mining process.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (GBKbO)

162 What about Matt Damon, huh? Check and mate.

I'll tell you, he didn't just eat potatoes, IYKWIMAITYD.
Posted by: Thomas Bender

What would be easier? Sending up 100's of cloth covered pre-fab units to create flimsy buildings, ala Matt Damon, or a piece together a boring machine and make a virtually impenetrable cave?

Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:52 AM (8v2yu)

163 I pass 2 8 stall (1 for Tesla, 1 for ??)charging stations cutting thru the Target lot on my way to the gas station. When I come back from filling up my car, the same cars are sitting there, no matter the weather, for who knows how long.

I laugh every time
Posted by: Bruce at July 11, 2025 11:05 AM (BHLaI)

I’m pissed because my favorite grocery store recently installed a shit ton of Tesla chargers. It was a small lot to begin with and it really screwed up my parking. And I never see it being used. I’m guessing they got some Biden Bucks for it.

Posted by: haffhowershower at July 11, 2025 11:52 AM (03kKB)

164 It's because the need or desire for EV's is not organic. Even if you are all in, there is no infrastructure to support the retarded Biden mandates.

Posted by: Pamazon at July 11, 2025 11:52 AM (b5MGU)

165 Start a third political party?
I'm all ears.

Posted by: Ross Perot at July 11, 2025 11:52 AM (XQo4F)

166 Maybe that is why those moon landers keep falling over.

Posted by: Boss Moss at July 11, 2025 11:52 AM (bvNHo)

167 So I'm told locally that all the onions grown in a valley near me will never get picked. No one wants to do that work, and its all Trumps fault of course. I have driven by the fields and onions are almost ready to be picked (I think) big ones. Hugh fields with onions. Oh, the humanity of it all. Western NY, not NYC!

Posted by: Coliin at July 11, 2025 11:53 AM (wlQdF)

168 In order to displace ICE vehicles, it would take the building of nuclear power generation plants in pretty much every state to handle the load.
Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 11, 2025 11:28 AM (XV/Pl)

We should proba ly be doing that anyway. The number of things needing power is increasing every day, we need to at least try to make supply outpace demand.

Posted by: tankdemon

Yes, what we need are 2,000 aircraft carrier sized reactors spread around the country, supplying power to their region.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at July 11, 2025 11:53 AM (Vfq+S)

169 143 Nothing is uglier than a Cybertruck.
——
Calling it a 'truck' is what makes me instinctively reject it. Shallow, I know. Calling it the Cyber De Lorean might have been cool.

would've needed gull-wing doors, though. on the upside, plenty of space for mr. fusion...

Posted by: anachronda at July 11, 2025 11:53 AM (v3pYe)

170 142 all this BBB does is add more debt.
=====
Actually no. Ignore the stupid CBO scoring which is what most people are figuring on when they say that. CBO treated all the current tax cuts as expense and adding to the debt. But if the US had a massive tax increase due to expiration of these cuts (which have been the law since 2017 btw) in 2026, it might well have put the US into recession costs far more in welfare spending and benefits.

CBO scoring is NOT dynamic and does not try to fix the obvious problem. Raising taxes beyond a certain point produces less revenue and slower and slower (if not negative) economic growth. That means more and more costs for entitlements.

UK is in that trap and it is probably coming close to a massive wipeout of Labor because of it.

Second is the debt limit which a lot of people confuse with more debt. A) it has and will be increased as needed period. Default would skyrocket the deficit by raising interest rates for government debt. B) all it does is allow Treasury to do what is necessary on raising funds which is dependent on revenues/economic conditions/spending and the damn stupid Fed which is keeping interest rates far too high.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:53 AM (ctrM5)

171 Probably had a red door once
Posted by: Doof at July 11, 2025 11:49 AM

ISWYDT.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (kgE5c)

*grins*

Posted by: Doof at July 11, 2025 11:53 AM (5jU2p)

172 170 So I'm told locally that all the onions grown in a valley near me will never get picked. No one wants to do that work, and its all Trumps fault of course. I have driven by the fields and onions are almost ready to be picked (I think) big ones. Hugh fields with onions. Oh, the humanity of it all. Western NY, not NYC!
Posted by: Coliin at July 11, 2025 11:53 AM (wlQdF)

=======

Farmers should know about this piece of machinery, then.

https://turbotopharvester.com/

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:54 AM (GBKbO)

173 170 So I'm told locally that all the onions grown in a valley near me will never get picked. No one wants to do that work, and its all Trumps fault of course. I have driven by the fields and onions are almost ready to be picked (I think) big ones. Hugh fields with onions. Oh, the humanity of it all. Western NY, not NYC!

Posted by: Coliin at July 11, 2025 11:53 AM (wlQdF)

Put out a notice to the local homeschooling community that they can come and pick the onions and keep 1/2 of what they pick...there won't be any left within the week...

Posted by: Nova Local at July 11, 2025 11:54 AM (tOcjL)

174 Its got 114k miles and runs like a top.

Spins really fast in one location and then falls over?
Posted by: I used to have a different nic

I'll take "what is a Pinto" for $400 Alex.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:54 AM (8v2yu)

175 I don't have any objection to going to Mars. But we might want to try going to the moon first.
Posted by: It's Made of Cheese

Well, the giant mutant tardigrades that the Israelis sent up there could make things difficult for us.

Posted by: Bulg at July 11, 2025 11:55 AM (77rzZ)

176 But maybe they were bullshitting us. They lie about everything. Why not that? Apollo was dangerous as hell, but the alternative wasn’t simply to kill the whole thing. The absolute waste is unbelievable.

They can’t even orbit the moon. Complete failure on NASA
Posted by: Common Tater
======
Nixon did it because to him the Space program was a Democrat program of JFK and LBJ. Nixon also did the stupid ABM treaty. Nixon is a perfect example of a guy who was very smart but unable to see the forest for the trees. Not visionary and horrible on domestic affairs.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 11:56 AM (ctrM5)

177 So I'm told locally that all the onions grown in a valley near me will never get picked. No one wants to do that work, and its all Trumps fault of course. I have driven by the fields and onions are almost ready to be picked (I think) big ones. Hugh fields with onions. Oh, the humanity of it all. Western NY, not NYC!
Posted by: Coliin

You had that many wetbacks in WNYS?

Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:56 AM (8v2yu)

178 The China Observer reports, "In the first four months of 2025, China's car exports to Russia plummeted to just 155,000 units, nearly half of the 305,000 units sold during the same period in 2024. April alone saw a dramatic 70% drop in sales, marking a sharp decline from the previous high."

It seems that the post sale support is a major issue. These include a lack of service locations, mechanics, and parts.

https://youtu.be/IfnLcRLzsaw

Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions. at July 11, 2025 11:56 AM (NXz8h)

179 Musk isn't young enough to get humans to Mars. He's in his 50's. Assuming he lives long enough to even see humans land on Mars, he'll be doing it from his retirement home.
Posted by: Dark Litigator at July 11, 2025 11:44 AM (KAi1n)
----
Well, if he does a brain upload into cyberspace, which may be one of his goals, he could "live" a lot longer, I suppose.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at July 11, 2025 11:56 AM (7fElN)

180 180 You had that many wetbacks in WNYS?
Posted by: rickb223 at July 11, 2025 11:56 AM (8v2yu)

========

"Yes."
-Biden's middle of the night flights throughout the country for 3+ years

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:56 AM (GBKbO)

181 I don't have any objection to going to Mars. But we might want to try going to the moon first.
Posted by: It's Made of Cheese at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (y+qgR)

Pffft. You believe in the moon??

Posted by: Doof at July 11, 2025 11:57 AM (5jU2p)

182 No argument from me per se, but they forgot about the part you have to invent a reliable replacement first.

The response is that they don't want us to have replacements. They just want cars gone.

Posted by: NR Pax at July 11, 2025 11:57 AM (lXoJ5)

183 I like the cyber truck. I didn’t at first, but it’s cool. It’s the polar opposite of the retro look of my car.

Posted by: Piper at July 11, 2025 11:57 AM (p4NUW)

184 I have driven by the fields and onions are almost ready to be picked (I think) big ones. Hugh fields with onions. Oh, the humanity of it all. Western NY, not N

employers have used temporary visas since forever to accomplish the work they need done, whether in agriculture, landscaping, restaurant biz, what have you. They come in for a work visa for as long as the employer needs them, then they go home.
Lather, rinse, repeat

Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 11:57 AM (dCxaZ)

185 I'll take "what is a Pinto" for $400 Alex.
Posted by: rickb223

People always get this wrong. People could tell Alex that they'll take a particular category. "What is a Pinto" would be the response that a player gives to a clue. They didn't need to "take" that from Alex.

Posted by: Bulg at July 11, 2025 11:58 AM (77rzZ)

186 187 employers have used temporary visas since forever to accomplish the work they need done, whether in agriculture, landscaping, restaurant biz, what have you. They come in for a work visa for as long as the employer needs them, then they go home.
Lather, rinse, repeat
Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 11:57 AM (dCxaZ)

=======

"But I have to pay for housing if I do it legal. Better to do it illegally and not pay for housing."
-that farmer, apparently

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 11:58 AM (GBKbO)

187 NASA started by Ike.

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 11:58 AM (VofaG)

188 Trump wrote the book on how to win with a third party. The Uniparty has a David Carradine Vulcan Death grip on our electoral process. They have six ways to Sunday of putting third parties down. So you have to take over one of the parties, like the commies are doing with the Democrats.

Posted by: ... at July 11, 2025 11:58 AM (Qr870)

189 Ford built another Huge EV plant in Sheffield Lake, OH. I’m betting ZERO units get built.

Posted by: TrainmanTim at July 11, 2025 11:58 AM (lycPY)

190 I watched the potato harvesting in western NY, by the Gennesee River. Dump truck loads.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at July 11, 2025 11:59 AM (trxpo)

191 How come EV's don't come with warning labels on them like cigarettes telling us how dangerous and toxic they are?

Posted by: torabora at July 11, 2025 12:00 PM (KtOUo)

192 THese new EV plants are going to have to go emergency retrofits for gasoline engines. I can see some hybrids may be successful, those have a far better record than the pure evs do.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 11, 2025 12:00 PM (uWKK8)

193 I watched the potato harvesting in western NY, by the Gennesee River. Dump truck loads.

My brethren!
-- Tater Stelter

Posted by: Bulg at July 11, 2025 12:01 PM (77rzZ)

194 Don’t get me started on Mach-Es.
I own at 98 Mustang GT. Ford’s management team are idiots!

Posted by: TrainmanTim at July 11, 2025 12:01 PM (lycPY)

195 it is not so much the ev thing with tesla, it more the smart driving and associated technology, whether or not youre a fan of eves the tech is unmatched

Posted by: n at July 11, 2025 12:01 PM (XI9+E)

196 the temporary visa program for migrant farm workers is the H-2A

https://tinyurl.com/4j2xutss

Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 12:01 PM (dCxaZ)

197 wh is somebody buying an ev from a mfr they would not buy ice from?

Posted by: n at July 11, 2025 12:02 PM (XI9+E)

198 199 the temporary visa program for migrant farm workers is the H-2A

https://tinyurl.com/4j2xutss
Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 12:01 PM (dCxaZ)

=======

Question:

Are unaccompanied children in country illegally allowed to apply for this visa?

Asking for a marijuana farm in CA.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 12:02 PM (GBKbO)

199 "There may be an uptick in EV sales in Q3 due to manufacturers desperately discounting their glut of unsold electric vehicles before the tax credit goes away. In fact, they’d better make those vehicles go away in Q3, because any unsold EVs on dealer lots on October 1 will become un-moveable boat anchors."

In Russia, EVs in certain cases were being unloaded with a 2 for 1 sale. Chicom cars are junk and have little to no support after the sale. Russian dealers are getting wiped out.

Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions. at July 11, 2025 12:02 PM (NXz8h)

200 Posted by: kallisto at July 11, 2025 12:01 PM (dCxaZ)

Yes . I always called it the migrant farm worker temporary visa .

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 12:03 PM (VofaG)

201 Continue this slow growth over about 20 years until you have the political base to challenge for the presidency with at least a third of the House in your party.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison
======
Given Durverget's Law, I just don't see a path forward unless one of the major parties collapses like the Federalists' swan dive or the collapse of the Whig party. Both of those left a vacuum to be filled. If you want to read some excellent historical and game theoretic research on it--Look up Aldrich's Why Parties Book. For social science, very well done with triangulated analysis techniques and applying them to why and how American political parties (first past the post/majority) operated and will operate in the future absent changes in the electoral system.

There are also funding problems in what Musk wants to do. Perot or even Trump could spend unrestricted amounts of money on their campaigns. Musk is limited because not a presidential candidate, he is limited in how much he can contribute. He can contribute to the sky on his own candidacy for governor or senator but not to a political party. Running it a virtual superpac facsimile is doomed to failure.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 12:03 PM (ctrM5)

202 BMW is investing imperial fucktons of $ in a battery plant in Woodfuff, SC.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at July 11, 2025 12:03 PM (trxpo)

203 A company that I did consulting for, EVBox, was a European based manufacturer of electric vehicle charging stations. It shut down its Libertyville, IL plant after a big investment from the Eurotrash and the Eurotrash wannabees in Illinois. They stiffed me so I was glad to see them fold.

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at July 11, 2025 12:03 PM (qwx/I)

204 THese new EV plants are going to have to go emergency retrofits for gasoline engines. I can see some hybrids may be successful, those have a far better record than the pure evs do.

Posted by: Tom Servo

They can haul their mothballed stamping machines to them and start making parts in the US again.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at July 11, 2025 12:03 PM (Vfq+S)

205
BMW is investing imperial fucktons of $ in a battery plant in Woodfuff, SC.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory

===============

They must be looking for a tax writeoff. They write it off, Jerry!

Posted by: Blonde Morticia at July 11, 2025 12:04 PM (UmB+t)

206 194 How come EV's don't come with warning labels on them like cigarettes telling us how dangerous and toxic they are?

this comment is known by the state of california to cause cancer in laboratory animals.

Posted by: anachronda at July 11, 2025 12:04 PM (v3pYe)

207 204 There are also funding problems in what Musk wants to do. Perot or even Trump could spend unrestricted amounts of money on their campaigns. Musk is limited because not a presidential candidate, he is limited in how much he can contribute. He can contribute to the sky on his own candidacy for governor or senator but not to a political party. Running it a virtual superpac facsimile is doomed to failure.
Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 12:03 PM (ctrM5)

=======

On my timeline, he wouldn't need to spend billions of dollars in the next year.

Max he'd need is probably $50 million.

That should be easily gettable from a donor network, especially if he has other billionaires like Mark Cuban interested.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 12:05 PM (GBKbO)

208 I suspect the residential neighborhood fruit vendors , icee bicycles and taco trucks are illegals here in Sacramento.
There are not a lot but question: where do they pee and #2 at and wash?

Are they scouts sizing us up?

It's third world and I don't like it.

Posted by: torabora at July 11, 2025 12:05 PM (KtOUo)

209 202 BMW is investing imperial fucktons of $ in a battery plant in Woodfuff, SC.

wood fuff is best fuff

Posted by: anachronda at July 11, 2025 12:06 PM (v3pYe)

210 EVs are neat toys. Like scooters. But they are not a great choice as a lifestyle. Unless you never travel far from your home.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, buy ammo at July 11, 2025 12:06 PM (xcxpd)

211 nood ice shooting (a new one)

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, searching for thrills with John Frankenheimer at July 11, 2025 12:06 PM (GBKbO)

212 I've got a Chinese company USA based golf cart.

Evolution. They are 40% less expensive and have double the warranty years on the battery.

Posted by: polynikes at July 11, 2025 12:07 PM (VofaG)

213 FWIW, for all the calls that Trump threatened to go 3rd Party, he did not do that because he had already run as the Reform Party candidate in 2000 briefly and saw from the inside the dysfunction that these movements bring. Plus the federalized and decentralized US election system makes it much harder than in a parliamentary unitary system like the UK for a third party to suddenly shove one or the other major party into the ditch. Liberals had it done to them by Labor post WWI, and Reform is threatening to do it to Conservatives next election, but you only have to have a slate and nexus of workers, advertising agencies, etc. for a NATIONAL election.

The US, instead, has 50 separate state elections where two parties are institutionalized by law into running the elections and in some cases, the elections themselves are not synchronized.

Hard to pull off for someone not a Presidential candidate--even for a past president like Teddy Roosevelt.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 12:08 PM (ctrM5)

214 181 I don't have any objection to going to Mars. But we might want to try going to the moon first.
Posted by: It's Made of Cheese at July 11, 2025 11:51 AM (y+qgR)

Pffft. You believe in the moon??

handy if you suddenly need some cheese

Posted by: wallace & gromit at July 11, 2025 12:10 PM (v3pYe)

215 On my timeline, he wouldn't need to spend billions of dollars in the next year.

Max he'd need is probably $50 million.

That should be easily gettable from a donor network, especially if he has other billionaires like Mark Cuban interested.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison
======
He would need a lot more than that. Workers, GOTV, etc. Running adverts is not really the problem--the problem is getting voters that favor you to the polls and Musk is simply not that charismatic. Neither is Cuban.

I think you are underestimating how much power that local party establishments have in states and are looking at it from a generic national election ideal.

Back in the day, the Koch brothers spent megabucks trying to make the Libertarian Party a thing. And for a substantial length of time. But it never developed deep roots because top down never creates a deep party structure nor does it particularly compel a message other than these other two parties are for losers.

Musk does not have a compelling idea of politics bu the usual engineering attitude if I build it, the voters will come. Instead, what you get is what the other two parties don't want--the cranks, the losers, the washed up.

Posted by: whig at July 11, 2025 12:13 PM (ctrM5)

216 We should build cheese mines on the moon first.

Posted by: Boss Moss at July 11, 2025 12:16 PM (bvNHo)

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