Historical Echoes [Dave in Fla]

The Election of 1824

The election of 1824 represented the end of the Era of Good Feelings, and the rise of the party system in Presidential elections. After the war of 1812, the Federalist Party had collapsed, and in its wake twelve years of political unity was expressed by all candidates being members of the Democratic-Republican Party. This period came to a sudden end due to the contested election of 1824.

Four candidates were running for President: Andrew Jackson, John Quincy Adams, William Crawford, and Henry Clay. When the election was over, Andrew Jackson had won 41% of the popular vote, and 99 electoral votes, while Adams had 31% of the popular vote and 84 electoral votes. Despite having won a plurality, Jackson lost the election in the US House of Representatives. During the contingent election, Henry Clay used his influence to have delegates ignore the instructions of their states, and vote for Adams instead. Andrew Jackson is the only candidate ever to have won a plurality of the electoral college, but lose the election. When Clay was offered the Secretary of State position, Jackson and his supporters were incensed, believing that Clay had been offered the position in exchange for his influence.

Many of you learned about this election in your history classes. What you may not be aware of is the positions of Andrew Jackson and the platform he ran on. While he was an immensely popular figure after his military success in Florida and at the Battle of New Orleans, he was also a populist and champion of the working class. His major driving issue was the elimination of growing corruption in the Federal Government. He was a vocal opponent of the Second Bank of the United States, believing that the institution existed solely to enrich the elites of the country. The economic crises of 1819 and 1820 broadly harmed the working class, a voting block that strongly supported Jackson nationwide during the election.

The Election of 1828

Andrew Jackson and his supporters did not go quietly into the night. The next four years was a continuous campaign as the nation divided into the Jacksonians and the Anti-Jacksonians. The congressional elections in 1826 were a harbinger of things to come, as the Jacksonians took 9 seats from the opposition, and control of the House. During this period more states converted to direct election of electors, leaving only South Carolina and Delaware where the legislatures chose electors.

Andrew Jackson was nominated for President by Tennessee in 1825, only months after John Quincy Adams was inaugurated. During the Adams presidency, the Jacksonians continued continuous criticism of the Administration, while support for the Jackson candidacy grew nationally under the backdrop of economic disparity between the industrial states in New England and mid-Atlantic vs. the more agrarian economies of the southern and the western states. In 1828, the "Tariff of Abominations" passed Congress, greatly impacting Adam's support after he signed it.

The campaign of 1828 was an ugly affair, with accusations leveled by both sides. Jackson's wife Rachel was accused of bigamy due to a legal mistake in her divorce, and she died of a heart attack weeks after the election. Andrew Jackson blamed his political opponents for her death. In the end Jackson won the election with 56% of the popular vote, and 178 electoral votes to Adam's 83.

Shortly after the election, the Jacksonians organized into the Democrat Party, and continued electoral domination for a generation, until the Civil War. Jackson easily won reelection in 1832, and his Presidency was focused on elimination of Federal corruption, the expansion of the United States into Western territories, and the relocation of Native Americans out of the Carolinas, Georgia, and Florida (the Trail of Tears).

Similarities to the Present

There are a number of parallels between these elections and today. Jackson was a popular figure, a champion for the working class, and deeply critical of corruption in Washington. He was also denied the Presidency through chicanery. The nation was sharply divided between states with deeply divergent cultural values, turmoil that continued throughout the Adams presidency.

Jackson took the loss in 1824 personally and spent 4 years building a populist base that began to win politically in 1826, and then led to decisive victory in 1828. He served two terms, and was succeeded by his Vice President, Martin Van Buren.

While it is tempting to consider Trump to be a more divisive political figure than Andrew Jackson, that is debatable. The divisions within the country from 1824 to 1828 were deep. The personal animus between Jackson and Adams went unchecked during the Adams presidency.

Also, the Adams Presidency was filled with conflict. He was a strong proponent of expanding the role of the Federal government, in an era where there was a strong belief in the supremacy of the States. Adams was unable to enact most of his agenda, having angered those both in and out of his Administration with his message to Congress at the end of 1825. John Quincy Adams, his supporters, and his opponents established many of the hostile conditions that festered for 30 years, until finally leading to the Civil War.

The Price of Fraud

Election fraud is not new in the United States. There are now 5 Presidential elections that are believed to have been won through fraud and/or political dirty tricks. The election of Adams is considered the first, at least from the perspective of the Jacksonians. Once the electorate believes that their good faith participation in the political process was cast aside, they have historically reacted strongly against those who played those dirty tricks.

Shortly there is going to be convincing proof that the election was stolen from Trump in Arizona and Georgia. Possibly more audits will follow. In many ways the Republicans have already won the messaging war, since the narrative is that an audit is being conducted. That term alone wins the argument. Everyone knows what an audit is, and the only people who object are those with something to hide.

However, remember there is no Constitutional mechanism to overturn a Presidential or Senate election. The Arizona audit won't result in decertification of the election. Biden or Harris will be President until 2024.

The only way to get anyone to obey the rules is to expose that the rules were violated in the first place

- Robert Barnes, Civil Rights Attorney

What the audit does is show everyone in graphic detail that their votes were invalidated through fraud. It has already generated anger and determination in the next elections, and political support for election reform. The reason that Florida had a clean election is because the debacles in 2000 and 2018 forced the state to clean up its act. The voters have received a thorough education on election procedure, and for the first time are paying attention to how important Secretaries of State and Election Supervisors are. Election reform is polling with strong majority support nationwide.

Without a doubt, the Democrats will try to retain control through media manipulation, attempts to thwart election legislation, and additional fraud. It is a rational argument that they now wield sufficient power to ensure that future elections will be rigged in Democrat favor, perhaps through a new round of Covid lockdowns, abuse of election systems, or outright cancellation of elections.

But *if* historical precedent is predictive, then the proof of election fraud will result in voter maturation and a strong backlash against the Democrats in 2022 and 2024. Unfortunately, this will also result in the victory for bad actors on the Republican side who will win re-election and congressional power despite having betrayed the voters in 2020. It is up to the voters to be educated and hold those who betrayed us accountable in their primaries.

Regardless of whether the Democrats cheat their way to victory, or the GOP establishment holds onto power, there will be a surge of a populist, working class voting block over the next two elections. This block is can lead to victory, if someone is smart enough to leverage it. And if Andrew Jackson is a guide, it can last for a generation.

Posted by: Open Blogger at 04:05 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Might've saved a lot of trouble if we still had state legislatures choose electors.

Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:07 PM (z5Vrg)

2 here we are

Posted by: runner at July 30, 2021 03:07 PM (V13WU)

3 It's encouraging to see one of the COBs didn't put a clown nose on this portrait like what happened to LeBron.

Posted by: Dr. Bone at July 30, 2021 03:09 PM (bCkNL)

4 I seem to recall Jackson headed off an early possible civil war?

Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:09 PM (z5Vrg)

5 However, remember there is no Constitutional mechanism to overturn a Presidential or Senate election.

==

uh oh, you are about to be pelted with rotten tomatoes...

Posted by: runner at July 30, 2021 03:09 PM (V13WU)

6 RTG, The election of 1824 was the last time that a number of states did that. Election went to Congress because of no majority of EC votes for any candidate.

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:10 PM (pO7gM)

7 "This block is can lead to victory, if someone is smart enough to leverage it. And if Andrew Jackson is a guide, it can last for a generation."

Nice thought. Hopefully time isn't up and we're not close to the balloons going up because of some foreign (mis)adventure our Tech/Dem Overlords have planned out.

Posted by: Thrawn at July 30, 2021 03:10 PM (5aFbR)

8 Everyone knows the election was stolen, exposing it is the first step.
The most important and most difficult step is to force the Republicans to admit they were willing participants in this theft and to make them understand that they are one step from oblivion if they don't do something about it.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 30, 2021 03:11 PM (QnTgm)

9 Very nice, Dave. Thank you.

There are a number of parallels between these elections and today. Jackson was a popular figure, a champion for the working class, and deeply critical of corruption in Washington. He was also denied the Presidency through chicanery. The nation was sharply divided between states with deeply divergent cultural values, turmoil that continued throughout the Adams presidency.

There are parallels, but I don't think they are directly comparable. Jackson got screwed by a backroom deal and caused massive fractures as a result. Trump got screwed through endemic, system-wide corruption, lawbreaking and complicity - and it was done in the full light for all to see, defended by the Press, ignored by the courts and certified by the government. Those same groups are all now holding the line hard on ensuring both that they are never questioned *and* that they suffer no consequences and are free to do it again. This last election is the single dirtiest thing I have ever seen this government do - and we sent Iran billions in cash on pallets.

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at July 30, 2021 03:12 PM (3p5uk)

10 Thanks Dave

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:13 PM (XvPQV)

11 Holding out hope that this option comes to pass. I waver day to day on whether the fraud/media machine is strong enough to dominate the vote regardless.

I just hope those behind the audit are legit and it's not kabuki theater.

Posted by: What's a Seawolf? at July 30, 2021 03:14 PM (khAeP)

12 awesome, good for the BP.

Posted by: clutch cargo - processed in a facility that may contain lead at July 30, 2021 03:15 PM (wAnMi)

13 1824

It's a signal.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, hunting lycans with Kate Beckinsale at July 30, 2021 03:15 PM (LvTSG)

14 Shortly there is going to be convincing proof that the election was stolen from Trump in Arizona and Georgia
.......

The Democrats will shrug and say: "Oh well Trump was really president. Now he can't run for a third term. Neener, neener."

Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 03:15 PM (v0R5T)

15 Jackson did a lot of good but he was an absolute monster to Indians as Daniel Boone so earnestly spoke and wrote of.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at July 30, 2021 03:15 PM (KZzsI)

16 1824

It's a signal.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison

Go long on Hickory shampoos.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 30, 2021 03:16 PM (OCTRt)

17 as I said, we need a Secretary of Revenge in the next admin

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at July 30, 2021 03:16 PM (oEn12)

18 Your masters do not care if you believe that you are right. They do not even wish for you to give in and make the concession that you are wrong and that they are right.

They only want you to understand that you are a slave.

Posted by: banana Dream at July 30, 2021 03:16 PM (ZOfsH)

19 Proving fraud is only the beginning. An important beginning, but there must be a reckoning. And punishment.

Justice. And Judgement.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:17 PM (XvPQV)

20 The tone deaf democrats think the election reform Americans want is mail in ballots and no voter ID. Look at the shit the democrats do at their won primaries and national convention. They actually played rock/paper/scissors for undecided delegates??? and strangely enough Hillary won because of that.

Posted by: Lemmiwinks at July 30, 2021 03:17 PM (h1jJh)

21 It is a rational argument that they now wield sufficient power to ensure that future elections will be rigged in Democrat favor
That is were I am at and I see no solution to the problem until such time as the govt starts to shoot people protesting the fraud in great numbers.* Sad, but it will take those deaths for an actual uprising.
*Ashli notwithstanding, bless her soul.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at July 30, 2021 03:17 PM (r+sAi)

22 17 as I said, we need a Secretary of Revenge in the next admin
Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at July 30, 2021 03:16 PM (oEn12)

Needs to sound less intimidating. How about the Secretary of Payback and Come-up-ins?

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at July 30, 2021 03:18 PM (Y5qcH)

23 Might've saved a lot of trouble if we still had state legislatures choose electors.
---------

It would have created a different kind of trouble.

Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at July 30, 2021 03:18 PM (AQwdI)

24 Obviously Jackson was a racist and hated persons of color. All his statues must be torn down and replaced be Saint George of Floyd !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: James at July 30, 2021 03:18 PM (24+Vp)

25 Jackson was an asshole but he was right about the National Back/Federal Reserve.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:18 PM (XvPQV)

26 The Democrats will shrug and say: "Oh well Trump was really president. Now he can't run for a third term. Neener, neener."
Posted by: wth

And they get a hickory shampoo when they say that.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 30, 2021 03:18 PM (OCTRt)

27 Very good essay, but it overlooks the fact that people could get outraged in 1824 and their outrage could lead to action.

In 2021, we have Twitter, TikTok and YouTube to lull the masses to sleep.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at July 30, 2021 03:18 PM (19g6/)

28 15 Jackson did a lot of good but he was an absolute monster to Indians as Daniel Boone so earnestly spoke and wrote of.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at July 30, 2021 03:15 PM (KZzsI)

That was one of the big political issues of the day and something that earned him a lot of enmity. A general pattern is that with few exceptions Democrats have been President when the US was expanding its territory and global power though.

Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:19 PM (z5Vrg)

29 Jackson did a lot of good but he was an absolute monster to Indians as Daniel Boone so earnestly spoke and wrote of.
___

Which is why I have little to say about the man.

Posted by: SMH at July 30, 2021 03:19 PM (+tqLU)

30 I seem to recall Jackson headed off an early possible civil war
--------

Maybe that's the problem. A bit of bloodshed earlier might have resulted in a more acceptable arrangement for all parties.

Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at July 30, 2021 03:19 PM (AQwdI)

31 I think Trump was cheated the Presidency (or at least several states he won but was given to Biden)

It is funny that there's really no credible historian that would say the US has never had a fraudulent Presidential election, but this one time you're not even allowed to discuss the possibility it happened in 2020. Nevermind the media basically saying Putin had won 2016.

FWIW, I don't think Trump has a comeback in him like Jackson did. I think a big part of Trump's problem is that his own party was in on the fraud in the sense they were willing to look the other way. Also, Jackson was the "real deal" and an actual hero with credibility. Trump is something of a retard and I think deep down, a lot of conservatives know that. His personnel screw ups alone have convinced me he just can't govern. But he's good as a firebrand.

Posted by: Blago at July 30, 2021 03:20 PM (PwNLq)

32 That is were I am at and I see no solution to the problem until such time as the govt starts to shoot people protesting the fraud in great numbers.* Sad, but it will take those deaths for an actual uprising.
*Ashli notwithstanding, bless her soul.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk

I see no solution until those engaging in fraud are made to be afraid to do it. Same with all other crimes. They only stop committing crime when they are afraid to do it.

Posted by: Taqiyyologist, Rickrolled by Jesus at July 30, 2021 03:20 PM (OssQ4)

33 Your masters do not care if you believe that you are right. They do not even wish for you to give in and make the concession that you are wrong and that they are right.

They only want you to understand that you are a slave.
Posted by: banana Dream

Dems play the long game. Almost took them 200 years to get their slaves back.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 30, 2021 03:20 PM (OCTRt)

34 DIF, your last paragraph is the crux of the matter. California, N.Y, MI, and PA are lost. It will take someone from the outside to unite the voters. ( Trump can't unite all the States as the well has been poisoned. )

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at July 30, 2021 03:21 PM (0HXfn)

35 So where do we petition the government for a redress of grievances?

Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 03:21 PM (v0R5T)

36 They only want you to understand that you are a slave.
Posted by: banana Dream at July 30, 2021 03:16 PM (ZOfsH)
----
That about sums it up. They ARE the boot stomping on a human face forever. They want you to know it in your bones.

Posted by: Lord Squirrel at July 30, 2021 03:22 PM (ZIoLS)

37 I'm willing to bet that Jackson never demanded that anyone take medicine that was experimental, nor demanded that everyone wear a mask.

Posted by: tcn in AK, Hail to the Thief at July 30, 2021 03:22 PM (EHSip)

38 So where do we petition the government for a redress of grievances?
Posted by: wth

You don't. If you try, they will shoot you.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 30, 2021 03:22 PM (OCTRt)

39 They only stop committing crime when they are afraid to do it.
And they won't be afraid while they have military backing.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at July 30, 2021 03:22 PM (r+sAi)

40 Great synopsis. There certainly seem to be historic parallels. Thanks.

Posted by: Buck Throckmorton at July 30, 2021 03:23 PM (d9Cw3)

41
as I said, we need a Secretary of Revenge in the next admin
Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at July 30, 2021 03:16 PM (oEn12)

Chief Knouter, Department of Reprisals, a section of the Ministry of Social Correction and Conquest of Nature. Equal in rank to the Excavator Plenipotentiary, and a close collaborator in operationalizing success on the Grand North American Dignity Canal.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at July 30, 2021 03:23 PM (JN3xP)

42 Proving fraud is only the beginning. An important beginning, but there must be a reckoning. And punishment.

Justice. And Judgement.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:17 PM (XvPQV)
++++
And that, Mr. Edwards, is where I lack faith. Even if the audits prove out and demonstrate incontrovertible, outcome-flipping fraud, I don't see anything more than wrist-slap (if even that). The people who would be responsible for punishing are the ones who - at very least - enabled this fraud in the first place. If it proves out, I suspect some lower-level functionaries will see the inside of the Gray Bar Hotel for a few months and some SoSes or AGs might - maybe - lose their jobs. I have less than no confidence, however, that there will be serious punishment or meaningful reform.

Indeed, serious punishment is a precondition for meaningful reform. New laws and new practices don't matter on their own. After all, nothing they did *last time* was legal in the first place. What's the problem with breaking a few more laws next time? No problem at all, unless there are serious punishments.

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (3p5uk)

43 Great article Dave

what were the other stolen Presidential elections? Kennedy, right? who else?

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (oEn12)

44 "Shortly there is going to be convincing proof that the election was stolen from Trump in Arizona and Georgia."

Huh? I doubt it. That would mean literally documenting X number of votes were switched, or Trump votes tossed, or fake/illegit Biden votes counted, to change the official results.

Is that the sort of thing that can possibly result from these audits?

Posted by: rhomboid (OTzUX) at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (OTzUX)

45 30 I seem to recall Jackson headed off an early possible civil war
--------

Maybe that's the problem. A bit of bloodshed earlier might have resulted in a more acceptable arrangement for all parties.
Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at July 30, 2021 03:19 PM (AQwdI)

========

I've thought this for a while. Essentially, under Jackson the federal government blinked in the nullification crisis.

South Carolina walked away victorious to a certain degree, enough to convince the next generation of South Carolina politicians that they could win the next fight with the feds. That generation was John C. Calhoun. Calhoun taught the next generation after him that they were morally justified in tearing apart the nation to preserve the "moral good" of slavery.

The nullification crisis radicalized South Carolina politicians in particular. Conflict was avoided in the 1830s, but it just planted the seeds that led to the explosion in the 1860s.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, hunting lycans with Kate Beckinsale at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (LvTSG)

46 what Jackson's election did was to break the then uniparty. This sort of electioneering cartel ends when one part decides to cheat on the others and get ahead.

As with other cartels (banking, railroads, steel) is that the members being unable to enforce compliance with the agreement have to let it break up or find a third party with greater force to enforce compliance.

With steel banking and railroads they found the government a wonderful way to enforce it.
Surprisingly American railroads and American steel is worth very little any more since once a cartelization has been acheived all need to improve has disappeared. No idea if banking will collapse or not, it owns everything now it seems.
However, this leads to the uniparty trying to get compliance in the face of Trump, and that is what the Federal voting act H1 is all about.

Posted by: Kindltot at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (qaiJN)

47 38 So where do we petition the government for a redress of grievances?
Posted by: wth

You don't. If you try, they will shoot you.
Posted by: rickb223 at July 30, 2021 03:22 PM (OCTRt)

You can sue the government. If they allow themselves to be sued, that is.

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (Y5qcH)

48 Call me a doomsayer, but I don't think producing indisputable evidence of fraud will do anything.

Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2021 03:25 PM (QU5/8)

49 I should have a newsletter, but there are others that are sufficient already

Posted by: Kindltot at July 30, 2021 03:25 PM (qaiJN)

50 STEINER WILL COME

Posted by: Commisar of Sciencing at July 30, 2021 03:25 PM (K9paK)

51 "Shortly there is going to be convincing proof that the election was stolen from Trump in Arizona and Georgia."

So what. If they go to the Supremes, the response will be "no standing."

Posted by: Unrepentant Cynic at July 30, 2021 03:25 PM (dYmWY)

52
as I said, we need a Secretary of Revenge in the next admin
Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at July 30, 2021 03:16 PM (oEn12)

Needs to sound less intimidating. How about the Secretary of Payback and Come-up-ins?
Posted by: sniffybigtoe

Secretary Of Recourse

Posted by: Soothsayer can't live without Jackstraw at July 30, 2021 03:26 PM (Ss8Md)

53 Interesting post, Dave, and nice of you to put us some knowledge.

Might've saved a lot of trouble if we still had state legislatures choose electors.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:07 PM (z5Vrg)

I'm not going to be the guy who says we should never have given women the vote, but I will be the guy who says that the vote should be restricted bigly.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at July 30, 2021 03:26 PM (2JVJo)

54 The election of 1824 represented the end of the Era of Good Feelings
----------

Kinda like the election of 2020.

Thanks, Dave in Fla. I always enjoy your guest posts. I can actually read this one while it's still live!

Posted by: bluebell at July 30, 2021 03:26 PM (wyw4S)

55
I suspect some lower-level functionaries will see the inside of the Gray Bar Hotel for a few months and some SoSes or AGs might - maybe - lose their jobs.

--------

I said similar to that about the coup attempt, and all that happened was, for a very brief time, they pretended they would punish one no-name (Clinesmith), and then let him off the hook.

There will be no punishment for *anyone* in this, not even a single desultory, pretend punishment like that.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at July 30, 2021 03:27 PM (JN3xP)

56 I seem to recall Jackson headed off an early possible civil war?
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:09 PM (z5Vrg)

I believe it was senator John Calhoun who was making noises about secession, and Jackson made it clear he would hang Calhoun and anyone else who dared split the Union.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at July 30, 2021 03:27 PM (2JVJo)

57 I love calling him Best President Jackson whenever possible--partly because he was one of the better ones but mostly because it pisses off all the right people.

Looking like I'll be in Nashville later this summer. Perhaps I'll visit the Hermitage.

Posted by: CppThis at July 30, 2021 03:27 PM (8h1h1)

58 Dave I like that you slipped in the proviso that potentially renders any election results in 2022 effectively moot. Well, very likely, not just potentially.

I don't see or sense anything resembling a wave of GOP replacement happening, or impending.

The dumbed-down GOP voter base is likely an insuperable obstacle. We see examples right here in this thread, and here about them here constantly. Tribal voters with an MSNBC-level "understanding" of Trump, policy, or politics.

Posted by: rhomboid (OTzUX) at July 30, 2021 03:27 PM (OTzUX)

59 Good work Dave.

Posted by: Hoyt's Paid Turkish Provocateur at July 30, 2021 03:27 PM (49Exr)

60 > However, remember there is no Constitutional mechanism to overturn a Presidential or Senate election.

There are other mechanisms available to a properly motivated population, other than the Constitution, that can overturn a Presidential election.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at July 30, 2021 03:28 PM (BFigT)

61 But...........But..........But............But the TRUMP DEVELOPED VACCINE is DANGEROUS !!!!

Quote from Dr. KUMALA WHORESS

Posted by: James at July 30, 2021 03:28 PM (24+Vp)

62 This is really good post.

2. Arguing for audits is kind of silly. They should be a given. EVERYTHING is either subject to audits, or the threat of audits. from the weight of cherries in the package you bought, to the amount of money in your bank account, to the claims in an add, .... everything. humans cheat at anything they can, and the way to stop is trust, but verify. The audit is the verify part.

Not sure there has ever been anything on the scale of 2020. What Adams did was dirty, but not provably illegal. (quid pro quo). Other elections were dirty and illegal, but not coordinated by such an extent by such a corrupt cabal. No, I do not think anything in past can be compared to how evil 2020 was.

Posted by: Jonah Goldberg at July 30, 2021 03:28 PM (/aCr8)

63 Covid: "The Science changes daily!"
Global Warming: "The Science is Settled!"

Do I have that right?

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at July 30, 2021 03:28 PM (PiwSw)

64 15, CRT, you might want to take a look at the Georgia cessation of the territories of Alabama and Mississippi. Essentially the law from Congress that approved the Yazoo cessation of territory by Georgia required the federal government to remove Native Americans from Georgia. This was the quid pro quo of giving to Congress the future states of Alabama and Mississippi. The feds reneged on that part of the 1802 cessation law until Jackson. See https://tinyurl.com/z283dxnu

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:28 PM (pO7gM)

65 Andrew Jackson is the only candidate ever to have won a plurality of the electoral college, but lose the election.

------

*Before the 2020 Steal.

Posted by: ShainS at July 30, 2021 03:29 PM (gi6t4)

66 All this erection talk has me flustered, I expected more at a fine establishment such as this. For shame.

Posted by: Emily Litella at July 30, 2021 03:29 PM (+uavY)

67 Very interesting essay, Dave. Thanks.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at July 30, 2021 03:29 PM (k39e/)

68 Covid: "The Science changes daily!"
Global Warming: "The Science is Settled!"

Do I have that right?

You forgot "Trust Dr. Fauci, he is a God!"

Posted by: Unrepentant Cynic at July 30, 2021 03:29 PM (dYmWY)

69 There will be no punishment for *anyone* in this, not even a single desultory, pretend punishment like that.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at July 30, 2021 03:27 PM (JN3xP)

That lawyer that tried to extort $10 billion from Exxon just got a 6 month jail sentence. 6 months for a $10 billion scam.

With that kind of deterrent, I don't see why everyone isn't running a $10 billion scam.

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at July 30, 2021 03:29 PM (Y5qcH)

70
As I wrote yesterday, we have to only go back to 2004-2008 to see "historical echoes" to today.

Posted by: Soothsayer can't live without Jackstraw at July 30, 2021 03:30 PM (Ss8Md)

71 Great article Dave

what were the other stolen Presidential elections? Kennedy, right? who else?
Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (oEn12)

Trump, Nixon, Hayes, Jackson at least, are the ones I can think of.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at July 30, 2021 03:30 PM (2JVJo)

72 The Dems were always impeaching Trump for something. That is not who we are though.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:30 PM (Tnijr)

73 I was the only President to ever pay off the national debt. It was $0.
It happened only one time in US history.
Look at us now.

Posted by: Andrew Jackson at July 30, 2021 03:30 PM (aAP3z)

74 Oh, and anyone who whines about his Indian removal policy should take a good, long, hard look at the Middle East in general and Israel in particular. Because that's what the Southeast would have been like if he didn't do what he did.

Was it nice? No. Was it necessary? Yes.

Posted by: CppThis at July 30, 2021 03:30 PM (8h1h1)

75 I'm not going to be the guy who says we should never have given women the vote, but I will be the guy who says that the vote should be restricted bigly.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at July 30, 2021 03:26 PM (2JVJo)
++++
I'm with you. You have a net-positive tax burden (though I don't care how big - a penny or a billion dollars, makes no difference) or you don't get to vote.

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at July 30, 2021 03:30 PM (3p5uk)

76 "Needs to sound less intimidating. How about the Secretary of Payback and Come-up-ins?"

Secretary of Reparations. Get inside the NPC OODA loop

We need to put them on defense, instead of always being the ones to react. Just like with Chess.

Posted by: Hoyt's Paid Turkish Provocateur at July 30, 2021 03:31 PM (49Exr)

77 Many of you learned about this election in your history classes.

-----

Nah, Boomer brah. It was all cucumbers and condoms all the time ...

/

Posted by: ShainS at July 30, 2021 03:31 PM (gi6t4)

78 That's a great piece Dave, and some things I didn't know, like Jackson's wife. I knew she passed, but didn't know those sordid details. Thanks!

Posted by: clutch cargo - processed in a facility that may contain lead at July 30, 2021 03:31 PM (wAnMi)

79 I said similar to that about the coup attempt, and all that happened was, for a very brief time, they pretended they would punish one no-name (Clinesmith), and then let him off the hook.

There will be no punishment for *anyone* in this, not even a single desultory, pretend punishment like that.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at July 30, 2021 03:27 PM (JN3xP)
++++
Kevin Clinesmith is the example that makes me think - when I am more pessimistic than usual - that even my assessment in 42 is wildly unrealistic.

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at July 30, 2021 03:32 PM (3p5uk)

80 56, Calhoun was Jackson's VP and the crisis was the South Carolina tariff bill of 1828 during the waning administration of JQ Adams and it hurt economically the very coalition that Jackson was assembling. This led to the Nullification crisis of 1832-3 centered on South Carolina which was ended mainly by Congress replacing the 1828 tariff bill with a new one.

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:32 PM (pO7gM)

81 Call me a doomsayer, but I don't think producing indisputable evidence of fraud will do anything.
Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls

Nothing is beyond dispute to the enemy. That's kinda what the problem is in a post-rational society. I've seen videos, for instance, of protesters saying "Let's do this!", causing a car to crash, and then saying " We didn't do that!" literally all within fifteen seconds. So "indisputable evidence" is an outright impossibility.

Posted by: Taqiyyologist, Rickrolled by Jesus at July 30, 2021 03:32 PM (OssQ4)

82 80 56, Calhoun was Jackson's VP and the crisis was the South Carolina tariff bill of 1828 during the waning administration of JQ Adams and it hurt economically the very coalition that Jackson was assembling. This led to the Nullification crisis of 1832-3 centered on South Carolina which was ended mainly by Congress replacing the 1828 tariff bill with a new one.
Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:32 PM (pO7gM)

========

"Threats of secession work!"
-South Carolina

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, hunting lycans with Kate Beckinsale at July 30, 2021 03:32 PM (LvTSG)

83 Maybe that's the problem. A bit of bloodshed earlier might have resulted in a more acceptable arrangement for all parties.
Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at July 30, 2021 03:19 PM (AQwdI

politicians in Washington were honestly scared of Jackson, which is what Respect in politics is all about. Although several soldiers have been President, there is no doubt that Jackson killed far more men up close and personal (face to face) than any other President in our history; he seemed to enjoy it.

as to secession, during his term some South Carolina reps starting talking about secession. Jackson publicly vowed that if the state of South Carolina voted to secede, he would go down there and personally hang the men who voted for it from the first tree he could get them to. No one doubted that he would do exactly that, and so they backed down.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2021 03:33 PM (trdmm)

84 Another couple of differences is that the federal governement is now all powerful, and we are at war with China.

These are end times and evil has the bridge. If we do not unseat the deep state/china/annointed class cabal in charge, humanity is in for 1000 years of pain. (i believe.)

Posted by: Jonah Goldberg at July 30, 2021 03:33 PM (/aCr8)

85 You condemn my policies regarding the natives. You never saw what they did to white settlers.

Posted by: Andrew Jackson at July 30, 2021 03:34 PM (aAP3z)

86 I'm not going to be the guy who says we should never have given women the vote, but I will be the guy who says that the vote should be restricted bigly.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at July 30, 2021 03:26 PM (2JVJo)

We should have gone with only property owners being able to vote from the get-go.

Posted by: clutch cargo - processed in a facility that may contain lead at July 30, 2021 03:34 PM (wAnMi)

87 Indeed, serious punishment is a precondition for meaningful reform. New laws and new practices don't matter on their own. After all, nothing they did *last time* was legal in the first place. What's the problem with breaking a few more laws next time? No problem at all, unless there are serious punishments.
Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (3p5uk)

Exactly.
If...IF...the Republic is to be reformed and revived from this mortal wound, there has to be real punishment for those who seized power and are abusing their stolen authority.

Without that, then the hate and disunity will continue.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:34 PM (XvPQV)

88 I think we are post elections except for the kabuki part.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at July 30, 2021 03:34 PM (r+sAi)

89 74 Oh, and anyone who whines about his Indian removal policy should take a good, long, hard look at the Middle East in general and Israel in particular. Because that's what the Southeast would have been like if he didn't do what he did.

Was it nice? No. Was it necessary? Yes.
Posted by: CppThis at July 30, 2021 03:30 PM (8h1h1)

We basically end up in that same situation repeatedly ultimately leading to the reservation system. We kicked them west and then moved west and had new conflicts.

The federalist position iirc was something like forced assimilation. Which is also not pretty but seems less like procrastination.

Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:34 PM (z5Vrg)

90 To even suggest the two periods are similar is deluded. There is nothing remotely similar given the foundation: a relatively homogeneous, morally disciplined, united populace VS a half caste, wholly depraved, balkanized group of warring factions.
Any theory based on such utterly dissimilar variables is ridiculous.

Posted by: Chronicle at July 30, 2021 03:35 PM (cH0wQ)

91 So like history repeats itself?

Posted by: Joe XiDen at July 30, 2021 03:35 PM (oZBum)

92 In many ways the Republicans have already won the messaging war

The writer is so naive. The GOP was complicit of the fraud against Trump. The audits are nothing but kabukki theater. The GOP could have conducted audits when it mattered. They did squat. That proves they were complicit.

Posted by: BinHim at July 30, 2021 03:35 PM (tWyc9)

93 >>> Another couple of differences is that the federal governement is now all powerful, and we are at war with China. These are end times and evil has the bridge. If we do not unseat the deep state/china/annointed class cabal in charge, humanity is in for 1000 years of pain. (i believe.)
Posted by: Jonah Goldberg at July 30, 2021 03:33 PM (/aCr

I hope you have a book on offer we can buy to read about all that.

Posted by: banana Dream at July 30, 2021 03:35 PM (ZOfsH)

94 Good write up, Dave. Thanks!

Posted by: Pod Hamp at July 30, 2021 03:36 PM (RBFmA)

95

Special Executive for Counter-intelligence, Terrorism, Revenge and Extortion

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at July 30, 2021 03:36 PM (63Dwl)

96 No one doubted that he would do exactly that...
Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2021 03:33 PM (trdmm)

I LOL'd.

Posted by: clutch cargo - processed in a facility that may contain lead at July 30, 2021 03:36 PM (wAnMi)

97 "You condemn my policies regarding the natives. You never saw what they did to white settlers.
Posted by: Andrew Jackson "

There is a creek near here called Savage Creek. It's not because it has whitewater. There was a massacre of a bunch of white people there, sometimes called the Savage Creek Massacre.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:37 PM (Tnijr)

98 Oh, and anyone who whines about his Indian removal
policy should take a good, long, hard look at the Middle East in general
and Israel in particular. Because that's what the Southeast would have
been like if he didn't do what he did.

Was it nice? No. Was it necessary? Yes.

Posted by: CppThis at July 30, 2021 03:30 PM

Jackson was a loud mouth bully with a mean temper but he did what he thought he needed to do for the Country.

Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at July 30, 2021 03:37 PM (JUOKG)

99 The tone deaf democrats think the election reform Americans want is mail in ballots and no voter ID.
-----------

Is that what they think, Lemmi, or just what they want?

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2021 03:37 PM (pBZEU)

100 62, The election of 1876 did have massive fraud by Republicans and Democrats plus active voter suppression by Dems in the South --how much, we do not know because of voting laws at the time.

Rutherford B. Hayes became known as his Fraudulency and only served one term. To win the after the election political battle, Hayes did a quid pro quo with the S. Democrats to end Reconstruction and withdraw the military from the South.

They created an extraconstitutional "commission" that lacked either constitutional or statutory authority that would award the electoral votes of Florida and Hayes won these votes because the 'nonpartisan' Supreme Court justice cast his deciding votes for Hayes on each of the contested votes.

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:37 PM (pO7gM)

101 This is a fascinating period of our history that got scant attention during my school years. I just read a book that covered this period and Clay's influence during this period was unknown to me. If you haven't read about this period get a couple of books and start reading!

Posted by: WarEagle82 at July 30, 2021 03:37 PM (+Kpte)

102 I could tell you some of the things that happened at the Savage Creek Massacre but it might spoil your dinner.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:37 PM (Tnijr)

103 Dave, you are a gentleman and a scholar.

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (PiwSw)

104
Without regard to the morality of what Jackson did to Indians, his refusal to permit the Turd Branch to arrogate his powers was *exactly* the kind of leadership we need to see today.

We really, really need a leader who will look at the Supreme Court, laugh in their faces, and carry on with his agenda while humiliating them publicly. Put them back in their place.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (JN3xP)

105 Posted by: Chronicle at July 30, 2021 03:35 PM (cH0wQ)

Couldn't think of anything positive to say about the time and thought spent on this essay? Contact Ace and please see if you can put up your own.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (k39e/)

106 Also, the Adams Presidency was filled with conflict. He was a strong proponent of expanding the role of the Federal government...
........

200 years ago. The country has been dying a slow death.

Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (v0R5T)

107 The Rule of Law is gutted. Equal Protection is gone. We're not going to get justice via legal methods until we put it back together.

Posted by: Hoyt's Paid Turkish Provocateur at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (49Exr)

108 83 politicians in Washington were honestly scared of Jackson, which is what Respect in politics is all about. Although several soldiers have been President, there is no doubt that Jackson killed far more men up close and personal (face to face) than any other President in our history; he seemed to enjoy it.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2021 03:33 PM (trdmm)

You have to respect a guy who responded to an assassination attempt by whipping out his pimp cane and going to work on the assailant for a while before his own guys managed to pull him off. IIRC he was also known to joke about how he rattled from all the bullets he'd taken in duels.

Posted by: CppThis at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (8h1h1)

109 f---ing sock. I am not jonah goldberg.

I am also not montel williams.

Posted by: Gentlemen, this is junta manifest at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (/aCr8)

110 The GOP won the messaging war? That is a funny thing to say. Like not funny as in, interesting. Funny as in laugh out loud fucking hilarious.

Posted by: Joe XiDen at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (oZBum)

111 That's a great piece Dave, and some things I didn't know, like Jackson's wife. I knew she passed, but didn't know those sordid details. Thanks!
Posted by: clutch cargo - processed in a facility that may contain lead at July 30, 2021 03:31 PM (wAnMi)

Jackson and his wife Rachel married not knowing that her husband (who had deserted her years before) was still alive, and during the election, the Federalists slimed her as an adulteress and Jackson as a lustful paramour, though it's not believed JQA ordered the slander.

When she died, Jackson remarked, "She may have forgiven her enemies, but God knows I never will."

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (2JVJo)

112 The GOP was complicit of the fraud against Trump. The audits are nothing but kabukki theater. The GOP could have conducted audits when it mattered. They did squat.
----------

Yep.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (pBZEU)

113 Andrew Jackson was lucky. He didn't have a Ronna Romney slurping up the money, while stabbing him in the back, like PDT has.

Posted by: EveR at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (MUpk6)

114 >>>You condemn my policies regarding the natives. You never saw what they did to white settlers.<
>Has bowling or billiards become an Olympic sport yet?

Posted by: Dr. Bone at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (bCkNL)

115 On the plus side, Jeff Bezos is worth 7.6% less today.

Posted by: spindrift at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (h5TKJ)

116 I think we are post elections except for the kabuki part.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at July 30, 2021 03:34 PM (r+sAi)
.......

Without the kabuki, modern politicians wouldn't know what to do.

Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 03:41 PM (v0R5T)

117 "... there will be a surge of a populist, working class voting block over the next two elections. This block is can lead to victory, if someone is smart enough to leverage it. And if Andrew Jackson is a guide, it can last for a generation."

Internet (if not completely controlled with censorship and social credit scoring) can speed up the timelines ... imo America can rapidly be educated on the criminal acts of the current Junta. ...

Sure there is no precedent for "overturning a rigged election" ... but IF it is proven there was massive malfeasance, that can overturn even the votes of the electors. They can be recalled ...

Four years of a commie Junta is No Remedy ... it is like saying "yes, we now know who the murderer is, but we must allow him to continue murdering till the next election". That is crazy ... proof Trump won (assume we can find that, with hard evidence) ... Demands a removal of the criminals that forced the stolen election. Allowing a Coup to win because "we can find no precedent for removal" is absurd. Something ALWAYS sets the new precedent.

Posted by: illiniwek at July 30, 2021 03:41 PM (Cus5s)

118 I'm not convinced that there will be an election in 2024. I know it sounds crazy but with so much crazy sounding shit turning out to be true...

Posted by: Guzalot at July 30, 2021 03:41 PM (prSvo)

119 109 f---ing sock. I am not jonah goldberg.

I am also not montel williams.
Posted by: Gentlemen, this is junta manifest at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (/aCr

Are you a cat?

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:42 PM (XvPQV)

120 Bush stole 2004 with Diebold in Ohio. Sorry, not sorry, he wasn't popular at all in 2004.
Obama stole 2012. Romney played the loser after crushing Obama in the first debate. He never broke character.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at July 30, 2021 03:42 PM (8akOE)

121 106 Also, the Adams Presidency was filled with conflict. He was a strong proponent of expanding the role of the Federal government...
........

200 years ago. The country has been dying a slow death.
Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (v0R5T)

All countries do. And in our case it tended to wiggle back and forth. Wilson and FDR had extremely large and invasive bureaucracies and nationalization.

Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:42 PM (z5Vrg)

122 My victory at New Orleans was so complete that no one in the press could even believe it. My troops killed more than a thousand of the finest military force in the entire world at the time, fresh from fighting Napoleon.
I lost less than 10 men and these are supposedly deaths that occurred after the battle had ended and these men ventured out to the field to loot the dead only to catch a bayonet or a pistol ball.

Posted by: Andrew Jackson at July 30, 2021 03:42 PM (aAP3z)

123 118 I'm not convinced that there will be an election in 2024. I know it sounds crazy but with so much crazy sounding shit turning out to be true...
Posted by: Guzalot at July 30, 2021 03:41 PM (prSvo)

Canceled because of the COVID Foxtrot Uniform variant

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:42 PM (XvPQV)

124 Bezos could lose 99% of his money and he probably wouldnt notice.

Posted by: Joe XiDen at July 30, 2021 03:42 PM (oZBum)

125 I am also not montel williams.

Posted by: Gentlemen, this is junta manifest at July 30, 2021 03:39 PM (/aCr

Are you a cat?

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:42 PM

I don't like cats.

Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at July 30, 2021 03:43 PM (JUOKG)

126 You want: a Secretary of Revenge

You'll settle for: the Secretary of Payback and Come-up-ins

You'll get: Kamala Harris' Secretary of Truth and Reconcilation, dictating who gets how many decades on the Gulag Rat meal plan

Posted by: cool breeze at July 30, 2021 03:43 PM (UGKMd)

127 "serious punishment is a precondition for meaningful reform. New laws and new practices don't matter on their own."

Be prepared for the "let bygones be bygones" crowd who simply don't have any tolerance for drama or want to virtue signal how merciful and righteous they are at our expense.

Posted by: Hoyt's Paid Turkish Provocateur at July 30, 2021 03:43 PM (49Exr)

128 I love these idiots on the left on how they judge things in 1824 based on current situations. They assume today's conditions were the same conditions then. If you were not physically there in 1824 then you only can recount based on someones historical written opinion (Which is probably biased).

They cannot mentally or physically unbiasedly place themselves in the time-frame to look at the situation factually. Has to be politically manipulated to fit their small minds (Like Pelosi, Harris, etc...)

Posted by: James at July 30, 2021 03:43 PM (24+Vp)

129 Call me a doomsayer, but I don't think producing indisputable evidence of fraud will do anything.
Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2021 03:25 PM (QU5/

===

"It worked, didn't it?"
-Dingy Harry Reid

Posted by: San Franpsycho at July 30, 2021 03:44 PM (n0pev)

130 Jackson's expedition into Florida is one of the great but seldom told stories of American expansion. Jackson was sent down to Georgia to punish/retaliate against the Seminoles who had been making cross border raids. He wasn't given many men, and consequently had to raise his own army for the most part. (this had consequences later) On his own, without any official authority to do so, he decided that the situation required him to invade Spanish territory and start a war with Spain. When the administration in Washington found out, they were furious, and wanted him stripped of command and arrested.
BUT the Spanish were facing worldwide revolts in all their colonies, as their military forces had been wiped out in the Napoleonic wars. So they just surrendered without any fight at all, and sailed home, handing Florida to Jackson. The administration didn't know what to do since they were still furious at him for doing it - but recall the army that Jackson raised himself; he now had an army, personally loyal to him, which was actually bigger than the official US army. Back in Washington they made a virtue out of necessity and pretended that they had been behind him all the way.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2021 03:45 PM (trdmm)

131 " proof Trump won (assume we can find that, with hard evidence) ... Demands a removal of the criminals that forced the stolen election. Allowing a Coup to win because "we can find no precedent for removal" is absurd."

I don't get the defeatism either. If he's not legit then he must split.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:45 PM (Tnijr)

132 "serious punishment is a precondition for meaningful reform. New laws and new practices don't matter on their own."

Be prepared for the "let bygones be bygones" crowd who simply don't have any tolerance for drama or want to virtue signal how merciful and righteous they are at our expense.
Posted by: Hoyt's

Fuck that noise. I want a body count.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 30, 2021 03:45 PM (OCTRt)

133 Are you a cat?

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:42 PM

I don't like cats.
Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at July 30, 2021 03:43 PM (JUOKG)

How do you feel about lawyers who can't figure out Zoom filters?

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:46 PM (XvPQV)

134 Also, Jackson was the "real deal" and an actual hero with credibility. Trump is something of a retard and I think deep down, a lot of conservatives know that. His personnel screw ups alone have convinced me he just can't govern. But he's good as a firebrand.
Posted by: Blago at July 30, 2021 03:20 PM (PwNLq)

Oh fuck off with that bullshit

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2021 03:46 PM (pBZEU)

135 Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2021 03:45 PM (trdmm)

Cortez invading Aztec-Mexico was also approximately unsanctioned I believe.

Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:47 PM (z5Vrg)

136 Also, the Adams Presidency was filled with conflict. He was a strong proponent of expanding the role of the Federal government...
........

200 years ago. The country has been dying a slow death.
Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (v0R5T)

All countries do. And in our case it tended to wiggle back and forth. Wilson and FDR had extremely large and invasive bureaucracies and nationalization.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy

Marbury v Madison.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 30, 2021 03:47 PM (OCTRt)

137 IIRC Rachel Jackson obtained a divorce and they did a remarriage, all of this long before the Presidency, but at the time of their first marriage she was unknowingly still married.

Posted by: Caesar North of the Rubicon at July 30, 2021 03:47 PM (KVvnE)

138 Also a template and precedent for bringing DC and PR into the union:

Abraham Lincoln violated the law and manipulated the electoral college in order to win by rubber stamping the Constitution of Nevada and bringing into the Union even though Nevada didn't meet the population requirements.

Lincoln wanted those electoral votes to cheat out a win of the Presidential Sweepstakes which allowed him to wage war on his own country that he thoroughly antagonized.

Posted by: Reuben Hick at July 30, 2021 03:48 PM (/Ma92)

139 It was England, Spain and France that originally brought the slave trade to America before their was a USA. Why don't black leaders hold these countries responsible for slavery and bad treatment of blacks????

We doesn't Sharpton ask these countries to pay their fair share of suffering ????

Posted by: James at July 30, 2021 03:48 PM (24+Vp)

140 I think the Union also wanted the silver from the Silver State, then a territory. Played a significant part in Union finances, no?

Posted by: rhomboid (OTzUX) at July 30, 2021 03:49 PM (OTzUX)

141 For some more amusement, the Atlantic is running an article by Anne Applebaum about Mike Lindell (My Pillow guy) calling him a threat to democracy. The premise is that even if the Dems did steal the election along with China, that challenging that is unAmerican and evil.

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:49 PM (pO7gM)

142 About the only thing that gives me hope is seeing how panicked the dems are about --

- Needing a reichstag fire (jan 6th incident of the unruly tourists.)

- importing millions of illegals to shore up their base

- "ahhhh delta", "murder", "we all must run and hide from the sniffles"

- Trump. Seriously, if he is such a buffoon, why are they so afraid of him they have to ban him from all media?

They are scared because they know they are driving a stolen car.

Posted by: Gentlemen, this is junta manifest at July 30, 2021 03:50 PM (/aCr8)

143 Wow, sorry to go off-topic, but the Northsiders just unloaded their whole team. Wrigley fans are being defrauded.

Guess baseball is going to have to reckon with shrinking payrolls

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at July 30, 2021 03:50 PM (rDpL4)

144 Call me a doomsayer, but I don't think producing indisputable evidence of fraud will do anything.
We at the society for doomsayers would like to invite you to apply for membership in our growing group based on your logical and cogent argument.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at July 30, 2021 03:50 PM (r+sAi)

145 "Threats of secession work!"
-South Carolina

Why does a dogshit state like South Carolina send so many fuckheads to DC?

Posted by: Captain Hate Won't Forget Ashli Babbitt at July 30, 2021 03:50 PM (y7DUB)

146 I carried a lead ball in my body to the day I died, the result of a duel in which I killed my opponent.
I survived 2 assassination attempts, one of which I personally bludgeoned my assailant after his 2 pistols misfired.

Posted by: Andrew Jackson at July 30, 2021 03:50 PM (aAP3z)

147 This is a fascinating period of our history that got scant attention during my school years. I just read a book that covered this period and Clay's influence during this period was unknown to me. If you haven't read about this period get a couple of books and start reading!
Posted by: WarEagle82 at July 30, 2021 03:37 PM (+Kpte)

Sadly, it looks like Volume 1, covering 1788-1896, is OOP, but Running for President: The Candidates and Their Images is a great layman's history of presidential campaigns as well as illustrations of campaign ephemera. I own the set and can say it is very well written.

https://tinyurl.com/fmufa6xc

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at July 30, 2021 03:50 PM (2JVJo)

148 Thanks for taking one for the team, whig. Applebaum I vaguely recall sort of being not entirely laughably idiotic at one point, years ago, though I never read much of her stuff, but she certainly seems to be a standard issue Beltway airhead.

Posted by: rhomboid (OTzUX) at July 30, 2021 03:51 PM (OTzUX)

149 141 For some more amusement, the Atlantic is running an article by Anne Applebaum about Mike Lindell (My Pillow guy) calling him a threat to democracy. The premise is that even if the Dems did steal the election along with China, that challenging that is unAmerican and evil.
Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:49 PM (pO7gM)

=========

It's only fair. It's not like Democrats ever proved their assertion that the election was stolen in 2016. It's only fair that Republicans return the favor and don't prove the assertion that the 2020 election was stolen.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, hunting lycans with Kate Beckinsale at July 30, 2021 03:51 PM (LvTSG)

150 Wow, sorry to go off-topic, but the Northsiders just unloaded their whole team. Wrigley fans are being defrauded.

Guess baseball is going to have to reckon with shrinking payrolls
Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at July 30, 2021 03:50 PM (rDpL4)

Sorry but I don't know what that means, other than baseball.

Posted by: Brother Northernlurker just another guy at July 30, 2021 03:51 PM (cSyAR)

151 Cortez invading Aztec-Mexico was also approximately unsanctioned I believe.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:47 PM (z5Vrg)

Can't remember if he was or wasn't, but several of the Conquistadores were not. As long as your conquered and sent gold back to Spain, you were in the crown's good graces.

For much of human history, being the winner was typically the only authority you needed.

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at July 30, 2021 03:51 PM (Y5qcH)

152 Great post Dave. Almost enough to give one hope. At least in my case.
Posts like this bring out the fantastic knowledge base of the horde in the comments and I thoroughly enjoy the read.

Posted by: Bosk who also misses the heck out of Jackstraw at July 30, 2021 03:51 PM (FgPjD)

153 "... if someone is smart enough to leverage it. And if Andrew Jackson is a guide, it can last for a generation."

It could, IF you get over the uniparty obstacles baked into the systemic and bureaucratic cake, and IF those elements don't simply just take that person out in some manner.

And if - and this is the bigger issue - those who could be leveraged in that fashion are amenable in suitable numbers to participating.

I'm not. None of my people are either. We don't see the long term benefit of our descendants having a future including the leftmost third or so of the country, in any fashion whatsoever, even given the astonomical cost involved in reaching a place where they're no longer included in our polity. Building the sort of government we'd want to live under is pointless if it includes them.

They have demonstrated conclusively and permanently that they're unwilling and incapable of playing well with others. The stab-in-the-back is inseparable from their belief system.

Who knows, maybe we'll just leave. But those people are no longer our countrymen and never will be again, no matter what happens going forward. We are DONE with them.

Posted by: somedood at July 30, 2021 03:51 PM (Q87rR)

154 Larry Schweikart considers Van Buren to be the father of the bureaucratic-propaganda state

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at July 30, 2021 03:52 PM (rDpL4)

155 People think Lindell is nut. I think people are probably right.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:52 PM (Tnijr)

156 "a" nut

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:52 PM (Tnijr)

157 Why does Lindell stay in Minnesota ???

Posted by: James at July 30, 2021 03:53 PM (24+Vp)

158 138 Also a template and precedent for bringing DC and PR into the union:

Abraham Lincoln violated the law and manipulated the electoral college in order to win by rubber stamping the Constitution of Nevada and bringing into the Union even though Nevada didn't meet the population requirements.

Lincoln wanted those electoral votes to cheat out a win of the Presidential Sweepstakes which allowed him to wage war on his own country that he thoroughly antagonized.
Posted by: Reuben Hick at July 30, 2021 03:48 PM (/Ma92)

Uh what? Dude wasn't even in office when things first kicked off and have you seen the 1864 electoral map?

And this whole "We're a separate country" "Waaah we're being invaded by a tyrannical government thing" is silly. All of the US land was acquired at some point, much of it by force.

Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:53 PM (z5Vrg)

159
Marbury v Madison.
Posted by: rickb223 at July 30, 2021 03:47 PM (OCTRt)

That's why I like Jackson. He looked at that pompous fraud John Marshall and said "Get it straight - you can miss me with that judicial review crap you just made up back in the day. You have no power to stop me from *anything I want to do.* Now go get your fucking shinebox, old man river."

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at July 30, 2021 03:53 PM (JN3xP)

160 The next four years was a continuous campaign as the nation divided into the Trumpers and the Anti-Trumpers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCs6Tpd5sFQ

Posted by: Braenyard at July 30, 2021 03:53 PM (qAxsL)

161 Also a template and precedent for bringing DC and PR into the union:

Abraham Lincoln violated the law and manipulated the electoral
college in order to win by rubber stamping the Constitution of Nevada
and bringing into the Union even though Nevada didn't meet the
population requirements.

Lincoln wanted those electoral votes to cheat out a win of the
Presidential Sweepstakes which allowed him to wage war on his own
country that he thoroughly antagonized.

Posted by: Reuben Hick at July 30, 2021 03:48 PM

lincoln also made a State (West Virginia) out of part of an existing State (Virginia) something expressly prohibited in the Constitution.

Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at July 30, 2021 03:53 PM (JUOKG)

162 I'm gonna get confused. Not a joke. Has my butt been wiped? The Thing . . .

Posted by: The Joetard at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (ufJfM)

163 Well SOMETHING concrete needs to come from the audits and if it isn't some form of invalidation of the Biden 'win' then verified/audited vote totals should be the sledgehammer used to smash any and all opposition to verifying votes and voters.

The suppression/disenfranchisement stuff is bunk and the people pushing it know it's bunk.

States that can calculate their lottery take to the penny every hour of every day can certainly do a hell of a lot better in counting votes. If they don't want to, force them.

Posted by: Patchy at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (I/Pe0)

164 People think Lindell is nut. I think people are probably right.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:52 PM (Tnijr)

personally I can not say. His pillows are pretty good though. They don't last for ever but most of them last a long time. My family has purchased them for well over a decade and long before we knew his politics.

Posted by: Quint at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (F2/Ok)

165 The federal government has grown too large to be reformed.

It must be abolished.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (R/m4+)

166 Andrew Jackson looks a bit like The Fonz.

Posted by: SFGoth at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (5/exA)

167 Bezos could lose 99% of his money and he probably wouldnt notice.

But muh next dick rocket will have a boy perched on the tip!!

Posted by: Daddy BBBzee0hs! at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (XyYpF)

168 I would like to read some more about the Presidency of John Quincy Adams. I know he was a brilliant man. I know about some of his history because it is included in the John Adams biography which I just read.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (k39e/)

169 149 Applebaum is married to a Polish politician and is virulently anti Russian and before that a critic of the Soviets.

Find it interesting that she would bring up that even if fraud occurred that affected the election, stability of the country demands that we go forward with the junta. From my recollection, she was one of the firebrands on Ukraine and its stolen election in 2013.

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (pO7gM)

170 I imagine that when the fraud is laid bare for all to see there will be a good sized group of Americans that have had enough of the progressive uniparty bs. I'm not really certain that war can be avoided. Americans love America. Too many of us served and sacrificed to let her fall to fraud and communism.

Posted by: USNtakim deplorable still. at July 30, 2021 03:55 PM (0OmEj)

171 Oh, btw, Biden credited Trump with the vaccine development yesterday in a public speech. Sounds like the Dems want to make the vaxx debacle bi partisan.

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:55 PM (pO7gM)

172 I see absolutely nothing indicating "fear" on the part of the racist-authoritarians. Every action noted is SOP, every policy is the same as for many years now. Idiotic theater like Jan 6 "commission", who knows, may be seen as useful fodder for the dumbest part of their robot tribal base.

One thing I do see, going on a year or more now, is how almost everything under the sun is interpreted as "fear" by the Dems. Not a single time did it seem clear that was the case, mostly it seemed almost silly to interpret things that way.

Posted by: rhomboid (OTzUX) at July 30, 2021 03:55 PM (OTzUX)

173 Oh, btw, Biden credited Trump with the vaccine development yesterday in a public speech. Sounds like the Dems want to make the vaxx debacle bi partisan.
Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:55 PM (pO7gM)

Setting him up to shift blame onto, if you ask me.

Posted by: Jordan61-(Ez6QX) at July 30, 2021 03:56 PM (Ez6QX)

174 Find it interesting that she would bring up that even if fraud occurred that affected the election, stability of the country demands that we go forward with the junta. From my recollection, she was one of the firebrands on Ukraine and its stolen election in 2013.
Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (pO7gM)

Well they all know the fraud happened. They've known since day 1. Phase 3 of the messaging is always the same.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2021 03:56 PM (pBZEU)

175 Posted by: Gentlemen, this is junta manifest at July 30, 2021 03:50 PM (/aCr

None of these give me comfort. They are all being used in incredibly dangerous ways that will necessarily lead to outcomes none of us will like.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2021 03:57 PM (KbCG3)

176 someone mentioned never hearing this history in school. Nothing could shock me less. I recall in my public school, in a very moderate area that is now deep crazy blue, we very much did learn about people like this.

Two fellow students and I reenacted the debates leading up to the Compromise of 1850. One guy was Webster, the other Clay, and I was Calhoun. We didn't play games with the history, we said their words. The end result was an A on the project, an A in the course, and the teacher pushing me into AP government.

Posted by: Quint at July 30, 2021 03:57 PM (F2/Ok)

177
You know who the biggest winner of the Trump presidency was?

Rod Blagojevich. This forgotten Democrat turd was freed from prison by the only person in the world who would release Rod Blagovich from prison and have the power to do so.

Posted by: Soothsayer can't live without Jackstraw at July 30, 2021 03:57 PM (Ss8Md)

178 One thing I do see, going on a year or more now, is how almost everything under the sun is interpreted as "fear" by the Dems. Not a single time did it seem clear that was the case, mostly it seemed almost silly to interpret things that way.
Posted by: rhomboid (OTzUX) at July 30, 2021 03:55 PM (OTzUX)

I'm pretty sure Pol Pot was "scared" too.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2021 03:57 PM (pBZEU)

179 Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:55 PM (pO7gM)

So as more deleterious side affects are reported about the vaccines they can blame Trump.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at July 30, 2021 03:57 PM (k39e/)

180 This thread....THIS thread of all threads...is getting weird trolls.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, get ready now at July 30, 2021 03:58 PM (XvPQV)

181 lincoln also made a State (West Virginia) out of
part of an existing State (Virginia) something expressly prohibited in
the Constitution. Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at July 30, 2021 03:53 PM (JUOKG)

New California, New Washington, and New Oregon will make 50 states again after their parent states leave the Union. Hard borders.

Posted by: Caesar North of the Rubicon at July 30, 2021 03:58 PM (KVvnE)

182 Manifest destiny? Wasn't me.
That was Monroe.

Posted by: Andrew Jackson at July 30, 2021 03:58 PM (aAP3z)

183 "It's only fair that Republicans return the favor and don't prove the assertion that the 2020 election was stolen." Posted by: TheJamesMadison

your whit sometimes obscures your point, for me at least.

I assume you are saying ..."there is a big difference between Falsely claiming an election was stolen ... and providing multiple arguments for saying this election WAS stolen, AND going further to provide the Hard Evidence."

The easy evidence is Biden didn't campaign, no one showed up at his rallies, and all sorts of chicanery is in evidence. ... The Hard Evidence ... we hope Lindell has it, but it is out there, in any case, and FBI and others are obstructing access, destroying evidence that is required to be saved.

Posted by: illiniwek at July 30, 2021 03:58 PM (Cus5s)

184
Come to think of it, President Trump pardoned a few people in prison that would still be in prison today if not for President Trump.

Posted by: Soothsayer can't live without Jackstraw at July 30, 2021 03:58 PM (Ss8Md)

185 All we need is 3 more states to make it a round number again.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2021 03:59 PM (pBZEU)

186 I don't have the answers but "there is no Constitutional remedy" is a lame excuse to just have to deal with these commies for 4 years if and when election fraud is proven.

Posted by: Fool Otto at July 30, 2021 03:59 PM (DB16e)

187 185 your whit sometimes obscures your point, for me at least.

Posted by: illiniwek at July 30, 2021 03:58 PM (Cus5s)

=========

Nah, I'm just witless.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, hunting lycans with Kate Beckinsale at July 30, 2021 03:59 PM (LvTSG)

188 People think Lindell is nut. I think people are probably right.
Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:52 PM (Tnijr)
*********
He's a really sweet and nice guy, but he lost a lot of credibility and keeps thinking Trump is somehow going to magically be reinstated. He was like a 100% positive which makes him look nuts. I wish he would stop the crazy talk.
I am glad though that he's helping out RSBN.

Posted by: redridinghood at July 30, 2021 04:00 PM (NpAcC)

189 Can't remember if he was or wasn't, but several of the Conquistadores were not. As long as your conquered and sent gold back to Spain, you were in the crown's good graces.

For much of human history, being the winner was typically the only authority you needed.
Posted by: sniffybigtoe at July 30, 2021 03:51 PM (Y5qcH)

In Merrye Olde England, Henry II played the reverse of this process with Ireland. A couple hundred Norman knights were broke and needed to make some money, so they decided to sail over and conquer Ireland. Henry kept tabs on them, but stayed out of it, he wasn't going to risk anything. Ireland was so disorganized that this bunch was able to conquer most of Ireland - at that point Henry II sailed over with 5,000 soldiers, camped on the beach and said "well I am so glad you conquered this place for me. You did do it for me, didn't you?" Of course they agreed, he outnumbered them 10 to 1. Then he went back home. An ultimate Boss move.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2021 04:00 PM (trdmm)

190 "Manifest destiny? Wasn't me.
That was Monroe.
Posted by: Andrew Jackson"

Manifest Destiny sounds like a nice patriotic stripper name.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 04:00 PM (Tnijr)

191 I'm gonna get confused. Not a joke. Has my butt been wiped? The Thing . . .
Posted by: The Joetard at July 30, 2021 03:54 PM (ufJfM)
........

I know, history is tough. This all happened long before you were a trucker.

Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 04:00 PM (v0R5T)

192 No doubt if Sundowner's ear piece told him to credit President Trump with the vaccine it's a beginning of a campaign to strangle him with it.
That's how Leftist roll with the pass along the blame, one starts and all the others pile on.

Posted by: Skip at July 30, 2021 04:00 PM (Cxk7w)

193 "However, remember there is no Constitutional mechanism to overturn a Presidential or Senate election. The Arizona audit won't result in decertification of the election. Biden or Harris will be President until 2024."

That said, Biden-Harris (Bi-ris the virus) will be deemed illegitimate - by the people.

Posted by: john at July 30, 2021 04:00 PM (T2wkl)

194 The same folks horrified by Trump were aghast at the uncouth, low-class Jackson supporters.

"They stood on the velvet seats with their muddy boots just so they could get a view of that man at the inauguration!"

Old Hickory was the first President all the "right" people hated

Posted by: Mrm88 at July 30, 2021 04:00 PM (4wtra)

195 "Trump is somehow going to magically be reinstated."

Other than that he seems completely sane.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 04:01 PM (Tnijr)

196
nood

Posted by: Soothsayer can't live without Jackstraw at July 30, 2021 04:02 PM (Ss8Md)

197 I recently had a thought - what if biden was picked because all the other potential candidates were asked, but they thought the dems could not get away with it, and even if they did it would be a presidency marred by fraud. What if they said no way I am going to be your puppet to a stolen election and go down in history as the world'd biggest cheat.

Posted by: Gentlemen, this is junta manifest at July 30, 2021 04:02 PM (/aCr8)

198
Lindell might be way off the reservation when it comes to Trump being reinstated, but that's a helluva lot better than being a disingenuous con-artists, like every other businessman who pretends to be on the Right.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at July 30, 2021 04:02 PM (JN3xP)

199 Oh, btw, Biden credited Trump with the vaccine development yesterday in a public speech. Sounds like the Dems want to make the vaxx debacle bi partisan.
Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 03:55 PM (pO7gM)

Setting him up to shift blame onto, if you ask me.
Posted by: Jordan61-(Ez6QX) at July 30, 2021 03:56 PM (Ez6QX)

Considering Joe said it was his vaccine not 6 months ago, yeah. I think we're going to be finding out all kinds of things we'd predicted but will be shocking the media any minute now.

Posted by: clutch cargo - processed in a facility that may contain lead at July 30, 2021 04:02 PM (wAnMi)

200 197 "Trump is somehow going to magically be reinstated."

Other than that he seems completely sane.
Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 04:01 PM (Tnijr)

No more crazy or delusional than AOC or a dozen other leftist mouth pieces. The left uses crazy to make what they are doing seem less extreme.

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at July 30, 2021 04:03 PM (Y5qcH)

201 It's farfetched, but there is a Constitutional remedy. Impeachment and removal, or resignation, or death/25th Amendment incapacity, of Harris, with Trump being appointed VP by Biden and confirmed by the Senate, then Biden's impeachment and removal, or resignation, or death. It could happen, with enough popular outcry. Or an 18th of Brumaire solution.

Posted by: Caesar North of the Rubicon at July 30, 2021 04:04 PM (KVvnE)

202 169 Fenelon, JQ Adams was a brilliant man but lousy politician, sort of like his father. The push to build national infrastructure died in Congress, Congress passed an idiotic tariff bill that punished a lot of the country, and JQ was not able to do much in office at all due to no control over Congress. Despite Henry Clay being in the administration as Sec. of State, Clay effectively scuttled his own political career over the move from the Speaker of the House to being in JQ Quincy's administration.

John Randolph has a spectacular House denunciation of the alleged corrupt bargain that is eerily repulsive--he described Henry Clay as someone who "shines and stinks like a rotten mackerel by moonlight." among other pejoratives. Clay and Randolph fought a duel over those remarks with both living through it with no injury.

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 04:04 PM (pO7gM)

203 People think Lindell is nut. I think people are probably right.
Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:52 PM (Tnijr)
.........

I think he just needs to get the best night's sleep in the whole wide world.

Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 04:05 PM (v0R5T)

204 I recently had a thought - what if biden was picked
because all the other potential candidates were asked, but they thought
the dems could not get away with it, and even if they did it would be a
presidency marred by fraud. What if they said no way I am going to be
your puppet to a stolen election and go down in history as the world'd
biggest cheat. Posted by: Gentlemen, this is junta manifest at July 30, 2021 04:02 PM (/aCr

You're talking about Democrats. Not a chance.

Posted by: Caesar North of the Rubicon at July 30, 2021 04:06 PM (KVvnE)

205 People think Lindell is nut.

Those TV ads behind the bathroom mirror. I keep wanting the wife to ask "hey you don't watch me pee do you?"

Posted by: Commisar of Sciencing at July 30, 2021 04:06 PM (XyYpF)

206 Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 04:04 PM (pO7gM)

I don't think John Adams was a lousy politician. That's not the impression I get from reading his biography. He just had a lot of people against him in his Presidency who stabbed him in his back-a situation which seems to repeat itself during the history of various Presidencies.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at July 30, 2021 04:07 PM (k39e/)

207 Sundowner and his DOJ are all out to stop states from audits, if the did complete them, Georgia, Arizona, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania it would destroy the Democrats.

Posted by: Skip at July 30, 2021 04:08 PM (Cxk7w)

208 "Manifest destiny? Wasn't me.
That was Monroe.
Posted by: Andrew Jackson"

Manifest Destiny sounds like a nice patriotic stripper name. Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 04:00 PM (Tnijr)
Pretty sure it was Polk, a Jacksonian.

Posted by: Caesar North of the Rubicon at July 30, 2021 04:09 PM (KVvnE)

209 As for Trump, he's no Jackson.

I think at some point he lost his nerve. He's broken. I just don't any see any fire in him anymore. I see nothing that says he's plotting revenge. He's just ... going through the motions of a man acting he's still living.

My wild thought is, he was told he could fight the coup, he might even win, but-- they would kill him for it.
And that's horrifying and terribly sad.

Posted by: Mrm88 at July 30, 2021 04:10 PM (4wtra)

210 165 People think Lindell is nut. I think people are probably right.

Posted by: f'd at July 30, 2021 03:52 PM (Tnijr)
--------------

He's a zealot. He was in the muck and pulled himself out. He sees clearly where we are and knows what it will take to get us/US out and he had devoted himself to that goal.

God bless him.

Posted by: Braenyard at July 30, 2021 04:12 PM (qAxsL)

211 " Americans love America. Too many of us served and sacrificed to let her fall to fraud and communism."
and worked with a Vietnam Vet guy ... he told me of going out to measure incoming mortars, the angle they came in, so they knew where to return fire. ... I think it was from him I also heard of how some college edumacated elite pukes got fragged in their own tents, because they were idiots commanding their troops into getting killed, because they were advanced based on lame degrees (or whatever).

In any case ... the elitists in the Pentagon have long become detached from The American Mission and are willing to sacrifice America for the "Greater Deep State Good" (and their own ego/stars). While that (military counter-attack) was maybe a fake narrative from Q-anon ... there do seem to be a lot of vets that are ready to fight the DeepState Mafia ... God Bless Them.

Posted by: illiniwek at July 30, 2021 04:13 PM (Cus5s)

212 Inspiring essay, Dave. Thank you.

Posted by: Weak Geek at July 30, 2021 04:13 PM (Apbdw)

213 208 JQ Adams, probably because of his upbringing and early career as a diplomat, simply did not speak to Americans of his era. He primarily appealed to the older parts of the nation based on his name rather than his policies. Adams was a very effective bureaucrat and actually was an effective rabble rouser for abolition in the House after his presidency but he was not very effective in office as President because of his personality.

His father had similar problems too. That is often why genius level intelligence does not necessarily make a good leader of people because genius does not mean wisdom. A good leader like Washington excelled despite not necessarily being a genius because of his other qualities as a leader.

Posted by: whig at July 30, 2021 04:14 PM (pO7gM)

214 it is not just Lindell, it is Patrick Byrne (former CEO of Overstock.com) ... many others really. I am not fully sold on Bannon being the real deal .. but maybe. ... Sidney Powell I believe is real. There are others ... but facing down the DeepState means being willing to sacrifice fortune/reputation/life ... not many survive if they become nationally known.

Posted by: illiniwek at July 30, 2021 04:19 PM (Cus5s)

215 Yes, Thank you Dave in Fla.
And thank you Ace for presenting it.
May there be many more.

Posted by: Braenyard at July 30, 2021 04:23 PM (qAxsL)

216 Thanks Mr Dave. If i did watch the news....they only go back 1year in history.

No comparison....no numbers but lots of vibrant surges.

Posted by: Humphreyrobot at July 30, 2021 04:31 PM (qoz/n)

217 >>>and American steel is worth very little any more since once a cartelization has been acheived all need to improve has disappeared. No idea if banking will collapse or not, it owns everything now it seems.
However, this leads to the uniparty trying to get compliance in the face of Trump, and that is what the Federal voting act H1 is all about.

Posted by: Kindltot at July 30, 2021 03:24 PM (qaiJN)
-------

The federal grab of private property (no foreclosures and moratorium of eviction) will culminate in a Big Deal between govt and Banks or a Big Problem.

Do banks become part of the government? Will big bankers accept that?

Posted by: Braenyard at July 30, 2021 04:35 PM (qAxsL)

218 1 Might've saved a lot of trouble if we still had state legislatures choose electors.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy (z5Vrg) - The Republic is Already Dead at July 30, 2021 03:07 PM (z5Vrg)

And Senators.

Posted by: West at July 30, 2021 04:40 PM (QY+6a)

219 BTW, Thanks, Dave! Always good to refresh (cough) relearn(*cough*) history.

Posted by: West at July 30, 2021 04:42 PM (QY+6a)

220 "The reason that Florida had a clean election is because the debacles in 2000 and 2018 forced the state to clean up its act. The voters have received a thorough education on election procedure, and for the first time are paying attention to how important Secretaries of State and Election Supervisors are. Election reform is polling with strong majority support nationwide."

And yet, Dave in FL, you know we dodged an asteroid in 2018, coming within 33,000 votes of electing a black radical governor later found face down dead drunk in a sleazy Miami hotel room in which meth was used in abundance.

Every day I thank God that even if I have to live in Joe Vegetable's America, I can still live in Ron DeSantis' Florida. Let's pray we can keep Florida red.

Posted by: 370H55V at July 30, 2021 07:49 PM (UsbFe)

221 106 Also, the Adams Presidency was filled with conflict. He was a strong proponent of expanding the role of the Federal government...
........

200 years ago. The country has been dying a slow death.
Posted by: wth at July 30, 2021 03:38 PM (v0R5T)

Yes, especially if you are talking about John Adams Sr, the 2nd president of the USA. He and Thomas Jefferson were close friends until they became political opposites. That friendship ended it was so bad and they didn't speak/write letters again until their twilight years.

Posted by: Bonnie Blue no longer gives a shit at July 30, 2021 08:30 PM (hlxe7)

222 One thing I do see, going on a year or more now, is how almost everything under the sun is interpreted as "fear" by the Dems. Not a single time did it seem clear that was the case, mostly it seemed almost silly to interpret things that way.
Posted by: rhomboid (OTzUX) at July 30, 2021 03:55 PM (OTzUX)

You are SO correct and this really irks me every time (which is pretty much every day) I read someone post/comment such nonsense. They are fearless and they don't give two shits that everything they do is unconstitutional and illegal and evil.

Posted by: Bonnie Blue no longer gives a shit at July 30, 2021 08:32 PM (hlxe7)

223 214 it is not just Lindell, it is Patrick Byrne (former CEO of Overstock.com) ... many others really. I am not fully sold on Bannon being the real deal .. but maybe. ... Sidney Powell I believe is real. There are others ... but facing down the DeepState means being willing to sacrifice fortune/reputation/life ... not many survive if they become nationally known.
Posted by: illiniwek at July 30, 2021 04:19 PM (Cus5s)

Agree about Sidney, and I feel bad for her because I think she stepped up to help Trump and he blew her off, along with the others and then he just up and quit (which of course, who could blame him given the situation and the likely threats he received)

Posted by: Bonnie Blue no longer gives a shit at July 30, 2021 08:43 PM (hlxe7)

224 Nope. I'm not supporting the Republicans ever again, unless Trump runs for office. This wasn't just on the Democrats in 2020.No sir. No way. They had an assist from every Republican legislature and governor in battleground states who either ignored their legal duty or worse, were presented solid evidence (here's looking at you Pennsylvania and Georgia) of massive vote fraud but approved Biden electors anyway. Anyone who believes the Republicans weren't eager to rid themselves of President Trump, you are living in a fool's reality. The Republicans could have stopped this steal dead in it's tracks but not a single Republican lawmaker stepped forward to stand with the President. It needs to be a mark of shame this party is tagged with for what remains of the rest of their history. Go to hell, G.O.P.
I'll work tirelessly till I leave this Earth to make sure you suffer at the ballot box and cease to exist as a political party. I hate you. You will pay. You and all your "big donors" need to lose EVERYTHING. I dream of the day I get to see you up against a bullet riddled brick wall for your crimes. Karma is coming. It always does for scum like you.

Posted by: Tracy at July 31, 2021 07:04 AM (lxkTg)

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