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Missing The Forest Through The Trees: The U.S. Military Has Bigger Problems Than Just Budgets
For a 7 percent decrease in active-duty Army garrison strength, the Navy could purchase 40 new ships over the current procurement plan and extend the service lives of 10 guided missile cruisers. Reprioritizing the budget this way would also enable the Navy to increase its readiness funding by roughly $700 million dollars each year from 2021 to 2025. This plan would keep the fleet above 300 ships, rather than sinking beneath that number within the next few years. This proposal is not a comprehensive restructuring of the entire budget. It is intended to highlight the need for a significant redistribution of defense spending from land-focused efforts to the maritime domain. In fact, the only cut made anywhere outside the Army budget in my proposal is to retire the U.S. Air Force’s A-10 fleet. This redistribution of funds within the Department of Defense assumes a static budget top line and generates a savings of $210 million over the course of five years.Except for the ridiculous proposal to retire the A-10 fleet without a functioning replacement,I guess this is a good place to start the discussion. Except...who will sail these ships? who will do the incredibly difficult and terrifying and bloody and deadly work of fighting? The men and (increasingly) women who spend more time on gender and bias issues than how to shore up a bulkhead and launch missiles and interpret electronic information and resupply while underway in a storm? American military history is filled with stories of ill-equipped and supplied men doing amazing things. I imagine the Hessians in Trenton would agree, or the Germans at the top of Pointe du Hoc, or the Japanese fleet at Midway... But it was the men who fought and won these battles, and the current state of our armed forces suggests that the martial spirit and resolve that won so many battles and wars for America is no longer of much value to the current hierarchy of the United States military. Even the most modern weaponry will be of limited value if our soldiers and sailors and marines aren't fighting men, but rather some pale, post-modern reflection of what they once were.
Comments
(Jump to bottom of comments)1
I'll, fetch em
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:01 AM (Cxk7w)
2
You're on a roll, Skip.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:04 AM (kTF2Z)
3
who will do the incredibly difficult and terrifying and bloody and deadly work of fighting? The men and (increasingly) women who spend more time on gender and bias issues than how to shore up a bulkhead and launch missiles and interpret electronic information and resupply while underway in a storm?
Judging by what we know of the Navy lately I think their problems are a lot more fundamental than that. They can't even seem to sail their damned ships any longer.
Judging by what we know of the Navy lately I think their problems are a lot more fundamental than that. They can't even seem to sail their damned ships any longer.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor, world's most respected Fantasy Hero writer at June 13, 2021 11:05 AM (KZzsI)
4
$210million....that ain't even walkin' 'round money for this admin.
Posted by: BignJames at June 13, 2021 11:06 AM (AwYPR)
5
I weep for what our country once was.
Posted by: rickb223 at June 13, 2021 11:06 AM (OCTRt)
6
Go look at almost any foreign press coverage of the USA if you want to know what the rest of the world thinks of us. (It helps to be able to read a few additional languages other than English.)
Contrast with US news services.
Contrast with US news services.
Posted by: Wait, what? at June 13, 2021 11:06 AM (aAP3z)
7
This is what happens when you are not a serious country anymore.
A day of reckoning will change that, unfortunately.
And when that bill has to be paid, no high heels will be allowed.
A day of reckoning will change that, unfortunately.
And when that bill has to be paid, no high heels will be allowed.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy at June 13, 2021 11:06 AM (R/m4+)
8
Sundowner made a speech at RAF Mildenhall saying global warming is the biggest threat for the military. So no need to buy equipment I guess is their mission.
A-10s came on line 1978. Sure it's been updated but how long can it go? I have no idea, but the need for ground attack surely hasn't gone away.
A-10s came on line 1978. Sure it's been updated but how long can it go? I have no idea, but the need for ground attack surely hasn't gone away.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:07 AM (Cxk7w)
9
They might consider spending some of that money on training their people how not to run into other ships in the middle of the fucking ocean.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:08 AM (kTF2Z)
10
The character of the military "leadership" is currently being demonstrated by the meek compliance with the stupefyingly idiotic and vile racist nonsense (and "gender", too) being inflicted on current personnel.
Not even a hint of a leak of an inkling of dissatisfaction.
And the academies are probably gone, or close to it, too.
Budgets and strategies, separate from this, but consumed by them, to a degree.
Not even a hint of a leak of an inkling of dissatisfaction.
And the academies are probably gone, or close to it, too.
Budgets and strategies, separate from this, but consumed by them, to a degree.
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 11:09 AM (OTzUX)
11
Sundowner made a speech at RAF Mildenhall saying global warming is the biggest threat for the military.
The week before that the biggest threat was white supremacy.
Sundowner made a speech at RAF Mildenhall saying global warming is the biggest threat for the military.
The week before that the biggest threat was white supremacy.
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at June 13, 2021 11:10 AM (63Dwl)
12
My rail these last few days in the Left has wanted to destroy the military since I was a kid and Vietnam was raging. They have taken all the head commands and going woke and hunting straw men white supremacists I think its the end of it .
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:10 AM (Cxk7w)
13
A day of reckoning will change that, unfortunately.
And when that bill has to be paid, no high heels will be allowed.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy
Prays it never comes to that.
Knows it will.
And when that bill has to be paid, no high heels will be allowed.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy
Prays it never comes to that.
Knows it will.
Posted by: rickb223 at June 13, 2021 11:12 AM (OCTRt)
14
High heels are optional.
I don't wear them.
Why in the world are the men wearing heels to get in touch with "wymyn's struggles"?
Completely stupid exercise (as we know).
Can you speak Mandarin?
I don't wear them.
Why in the world are the men wearing heels to get in touch with "wymyn's struggles"?
Completely stupid exercise (as we know).
Can you speak Mandarin?
Posted by: Flyover at June 13, 2021 11:12 AM (Rbu5d)
15
My rail these last few days in the Left has wanted to destroy the military since I was a kid and Vietnam was raging. They have taken all the head commands and going woke and hunting straw men white supremacists I think its the end of it .
Posted by: Skip
Until the shit hits the fan and the adults have to take over. Expect to see some actual fraggings in the pentagon.
Posted by: Skip
Until the shit hits the fan and the adults have to take over. Expect to see some actual fraggings in the pentagon.
Posted by: rickb223 at June 13, 2021 11:13 AM (OCTRt)
16
Really depressing seeing the comparison of Russian recruiting ads to the US army.
Russian: Join our army to blow shit up and kill our enemies!
US army: Hey, I had two moms!
Russian: Join our army to blow shit up and kill our enemies!
US army: Hey, I had two moms!
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (kTF2Z)
17
I have no clue how to fix it, but it seems to me some time ago the Army decided its best recruiting tool was to focus on all the different JOBS one could do in the Army, and how wonderful it would be to get out and go to college on Uncle Sam's dime.
Well, now it would appear you have an Army that is overstuffed with REMFs. Too many support personnel, not enough combat trained troops.
Also, they bend over backwards to support families. Which, sure, that's nice and all, but you're much less likely to want to go and kill and die in foreign lands, if you have little ones back home.
So again, I don't have a solution. I just happen to think an Army that has as its MAIN job, the killing of enemies, that's much better than the one we have now.
Well, now it would appear you have an Army that is overstuffed with REMFs. Too many support personnel, not enough combat trained troops.
Also, they bend over backwards to support families. Which, sure, that's nice and all, but you're much less likely to want to go and kill and die in foreign lands, if you have little ones back home.
So again, I don't have a solution. I just happen to think an Army that has as its MAIN job, the killing of enemies, that's much better than the one we have now.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (naMR+)
18
"Pictured here, pregnant fighter pilots scramble to attack a Cold Front moving into area"
Posted by: The Gipper Lives at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (Ndje9)
19
For a 7 percent decrease in active-duty Army garrison strength,
I've seen this bullshit before. It never, EVER works out that way. The result would be losing two combat-ready Brigades to way below readiness. 6 months of train-up below readiness.
I've seen this bullshit before. It never, EVER works out that way. The result would be losing two combat-ready Brigades to way below readiness. 6 months of train-up below readiness.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (axyOa)
20
These gentlemen have no sense of fashion. Why wouldn't you get camo pumps?
Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 13, 2021 11:16 AM (2k5ha)
21
Sundowner made a speech at RAF Mildenhall saying
global warming is the biggest threat for the military. So no need to buy
equipment I guess is their mission.
A-10s came on line 1978. Sure it's been updated but how long can it
go? I have no idea, but the need for ground attack surely hasn't gone
away.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:07 AM
The real issue is no one is even working on a replacement for the A-10 even though most people agree we need to replace them.
global warming is the biggest threat for the military. So no need to buy
equipment I guess is their mission.
A-10s came on line 1978. Sure it's been updated but how long can it
go? I have no idea, but the need for ground attack surely hasn't gone
away.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:07 AM
The real issue is no one is even working on a replacement for the A-10 even though most people agree we need to replace them.
Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at June 13, 2021 11:16 AM (JUOKG)
22
US army: Hey, I had two moms!
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (kTF2Z)
I had two moms when I was in the Army. But not the same way they're talking about.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (kTF2Z)
I had two moms when I was in the Army. But not the same way they're talking about.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:17 AM (naMR+)
23
Also, they bend over backwards to support families. Which, sure, that's nice and all, but you're much less likely to want to go and kill and die in foreign lands, if you have little ones back home.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (naMR+)
-------------
I remember hearing the company Gunny tell a lance corporal "if the Corps had wanted you to have a family they would have issued you one."
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (naMR+)
-------------
I remember hearing the company Gunny tell a lance corporal "if the Corps had wanted you to have a family they would have issued you one."
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:17 AM (kTF2Z)
24
A fundamentally unserious country, which the US has been for a while (Trump was a completely unexpected, but ephemeral, speed bump) = unacceptable moral hazard for *any* use of forces that puts them at risk.
Out of politeness one just can't say here what the implications are, but it's been true for some time.
Out of politeness one just can't say here what the implications are, but it's been true for some time.
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 11:19 AM (OTzUX)
25
The real issue is no one is even working on a replacement for the A-10 even though most people agree we need to replace them.
Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at June 13, 2021 11:16 AM (JUOKG)
Do they? Other than the fact that the A-10s are "old," and military contractors can't get bazillions of dollars out of selling them like they can some new platform, what does the AF need that the A-10 isn't delivering?
That's a serious question, btw.
Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at June 13, 2021 11:16 AM (JUOKG)
Do they? Other than the fact that the A-10s are "old," and military contractors can't get bazillions of dollars out of selling them like they can some new platform, what does the AF need that the A-10 isn't delivering?
That's a serious question, btw.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:19 AM (naMR+)
26
I pray that the draft is never enacted. I do not want my son to fight for the flag of a dead republic
Posted by: Jmel at June 13, 2021 11:19 AM (DQgbI)
27
I've seen this bullshit before. It never, EVER
works out that way.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (axyOa)
As I said, it's a good place to start the conversation. But I'll take a smaller army that doesn't wear red pumps over a larger one that has Marines wearing pregnancy prosthetics to get in touch with their feminine sides.
works out that way.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM (axyOa)
As I said, it's a good place to start the conversation. But I'll take a smaller army that doesn't wear red pumps over a larger one that has Marines wearing pregnancy prosthetics to get in touch with their feminine sides.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 11:20 AM (Q9lwr)
28
How old are B-52's?
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at June 13, 2021 11:21 AM (63Dwl)
29
A-10s came on line 1978. Sure it's been updated but how long can it
go? I have no idea, but the need for ground attack surely hasn't gone
away.
=====================
Near as I can tell, the A-10 is still pretty much the perfect platform for its intended mission. I believe it has (barely) survived 2 attempts to have it mothballed. I believe if you talk to any infantry grunt, they will place their faith in Jesus Christ and a squad of A-10s.
go? I have no idea, but the need for ground attack surely hasn't gone
away.
=====================
Near as I can tell, the A-10 is still pretty much the perfect platform for its intended mission. I believe it has (barely) survived 2 attempts to have it mothballed. I believe if you talk to any infantry grunt, they will place their faith in Jesus Christ and a squad of A-10s.
Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 13, 2021 11:21 AM (7Fj9P)
30
Somebody will event a bomb that only kills white people 51 % of the time.
Posted by: Humphreyrobot at June 13, 2021 11:22 AM (rB4m/)
31
For a 7 percent decrease in active-duty Army garrison strength,
I've seen this bullshit before. It never, EVER works out that way.
The result would be losing two combat-ready Brigades to way below
readiness. 6 months of train-up below readiness.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM
Yep, same thing happened when they went below 12 active air craft carriers in the Navy. 6+ months to work up and that extended the deployments for every single carrier battle group operating out there in peace time. Used to be 6-8 months now it's almost always 9 months for deployments. If an actual shooting war breaks out we are screwed.
I've seen this bullshit before. It never, EVER works out that way.
The result would be losing two combat-ready Brigades to way below
readiness. 6 months of train-up below readiness.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 11:14 AM
Yep, same thing happened when they went below 12 active air craft carriers in the Navy. 6+ months to work up and that extended the deployments for every single carrier battle group operating out there in peace time. Used to be 6-8 months now it's almost always 9 months for deployments. If an actual shooting war breaks out we are screwed.
Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at June 13, 2021 11:22 AM (JUOKG)
Posted by: Warai-otoko at June 13, 2021 11:23 AM (6FeV1)
33
What's the purpose of the armed forces, now?
Other than evacuating embassies - which could become a fairly busy practice - why have any expeditionary forces at all (Marines)?
And Navy? To what end? Being, literally, the world's policeman, when it comes to freedom of navigation and security on the high seas? Why is that America's burden, still?
Even without the installation of idiot children into power in Washington, the unseriousness of the country, which is comprehensive, not just limited to the lightweights and Beltway dimwits, what is the point of a military larger than that needed for, literally, defense of CONUS?
Other than evacuating embassies - which could become a fairly busy practice - why have any expeditionary forces at all (Marines)?
And Navy? To what end? Being, literally, the world's policeman, when it comes to freedom of navigation and security on the high seas? Why is that America's burden, still?
Even without the installation of idiot children into power in Washington, the unseriousness of the country, which is comprehensive, not just limited to the lightweights and Beltway dimwits, what is the point of a military larger than that needed for, literally, defense of CONUS?
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 11:23 AM (OTzUX)
34
Near as I can tell, the A-10 is still pretty much the perfect platform for its intended mission. I believe it has (barely) survived 2 attempts to have it mothballed. I believe if you talk to any infantry grunt, they will place their faith in Jesus Christ and a squad of A-10s.
Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 13, 2021 11:21 AM (7Fj9P)
Yup, never been in actual combat, but I've been in the simulated ones, where those suckers flying so low you had to keep your head down... they were... well, let's just say when they started burping their rounds... it moved.
Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 13, 2021 11:21 AM (7Fj9P)
Yup, never been in actual combat, but I've been in the simulated ones, where those suckers flying so low you had to keep your head down... they were... well, let's just say when they started burping their rounds... it moved.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:24 AM (naMR+)
35
Well, now it would appear you have an Army that is overstuffed with REMFs. Too many support personnel, not enough combat trained troops.
Also, they bend over backwards to support families. Which, sure, that's nice and all, but you're much less likely to want to go and kill and die in foreign lands, if you have little ones back home.
The Army has always had a massive number of support troops, because logistics wins wars. The reality is that training support personnel takes a lot longer than training infantry. If you need to spin up for a full-scale war, it's far easier to focus on combat troops while taking advantage of your existing support capabilities.
It costs upwards of $500k to $1 million to train a soldier, depending on their specialty. There's also the loss of experience and institutional knowledge that comes from replacing someone. This makes turnover one of the bigger costs to the military. And you can't just hire from the civilian sector, because a lot of the necessary skills can only be learned on the job, moving up through the ranks. If you want good leadership you need to retain good soldiers, which means accommodating their desire for a family.
Also, they bend over backwards to support families. Which, sure, that's nice and all, but you're much less likely to want to go and kill and die in foreign lands, if you have little ones back home.
The Army has always had a massive number of support troops, because logistics wins wars. The reality is that training support personnel takes a lot longer than training infantry. If you need to spin up for a full-scale war, it's far easier to focus on combat troops while taking advantage of your existing support capabilities.
It costs upwards of $500k to $1 million to train a soldier, depending on their specialty. There's also the loss of experience and institutional knowledge that comes from replacing someone. This makes turnover one of the bigger costs to the military. And you can't just hire from the civilian sector, because a lot of the necessary skills can only be learned on the job, moving up through the ranks. If you want good leadership you need to retain good soldiers, which means accommodating their desire for a family.
Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at June 13, 2021 11:24 AM (jOcSX)
36
Just got back. One of the best things when I was in the Corps was when I was assigned a private room in the corner of an old wooden barracks. I was a Corporal, soon to be Sergeant. Not much of a room, a bed (cot) and two wall lockers and a table and chair. I had to supervise barracks field day.
Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin at June 13, 2021 11:24 AM (I58tH)
37
Do they? Other than the fact that the A-10s are
"old," and military contractors can't get bazillions of dollars out of
selling them like they can some new platform, what does the AF need that
the A-10 isn't delivering?
That's a serious question, btw.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:19 AM
The Air Force doesn't want them, they want out of the ground attack job. They keep trying to get congress to get rid of them. The Army wants to keep them flying because they are extremely good at what they do. And yes they can simply build new planes but but like you said there is no $$$$ in that.
"old," and military contractors can't get bazillions of dollars out of
selling them like they can some new platform, what does the AF need that
the A-10 isn't delivering?
That's a serious question, btw.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:19 AM
The Air Force doesn't want them, they want out of the ground attack job. They keep trying to get congress to get rid of them. The Army wants to keep them flying because they are extremely good at what they do. And yes they can simply build new planes but but like you said there is no $$$$ in that.
Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at June 13, 2021 11:25 AM (JUOKG)
Posted by: JT at June 13, 2021 11:25 AM (arJlL)
Posted by: creeper at June 13, 2021 11:25 AM (XxJt1)
40
The best description of an A-10 I've heard is a big ass gun with an airplane built around it.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:26 AM (kTF2Z)
Posted by: rickb223 at June 13, 2021 11:26 AM (OCTRt)
42
I worked on the first A-10s to be deployed in Europe at RAF Bentwaters
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:26 AM (Cxk7w)
43
Remember those crazy days of old when we would ponder the impact of having women alongside men fighting in cramped combat ships? Now we have that same ship's male executive (co, xo, etc) wandering the decks in high heels chanting BLM slogans.
Doomed.
Doomed.
Posted by: Cringe Biscuit at June 13, 2021 11:27 AM (Lozsj)
44
How old are B-52's?
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at June 13, 2021 11:21 AM (63Dwl)
Holy smokes! Kate Pierson is 73. Cindy Wilson is 64.
Egad, everyone gets old. Except those who don't.
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at June 13, 2021 11:21 AM (63Dwl)
Holy smokes! Kate Pierson is 73. Cindy Wilson is 64.
Egad, everyone gets old. Except those who don't.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:27 AM (naMR+)
45
The Marines were the last holdouts as a military branch against the PC cancer that's been spreading since the 1990s.
The woke brainwashing today dials the PC to 11.
Even SOCOM is buying into diversity.
We're in deep, deep kimchee.
The woke brainwashing today dials the PC to 11.
Even SOCOM is buying into diversity.
We're in deep, deep kimchee.
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 11:28 AM (2Xmlz)
46
I'm of 2 minds about the soi-ification of the services. If we're talking about an aggressive, well armed foreign foe, I fear we may be fooked. Whoever is running the admin, probably a cocktail of Obambi, Jarrett and Rice, won't defend us. They'll roll over like a pup getting his belly scratched. ("Serves your Colonial ass right!!").
On the other hand, if we're talking CWII, sure, keep prancing around in high heels, and try to run that APC on bio-diesel.
On the other hand, if we're talking CWII, sure, keep prancing around in high heels, and try to run that APC on bio-diesel.
Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 13, 2021 11:29 AM (7Fj9P)
47
Oh, the "tortured women". We need to force men to walk around in high heels so they understand. Do they force women to drink 10 beers and then go to work with the hangover the next day? So they understand "tortured men"? Young women sometimes choose to wear high heels, and young men choose to drink 10 beers the night before work. Choices have consequences.
Posted by: azjaeger at June 13, 2021 11:29 AM (3/XaG)
48
The XB-52 was in developmental stages in 1949.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at June 13, 2021 11:29 AM (nFuTj)
49
The actual weakness of a "sissified" PC military is bad, and the projection of weakness to China is maybe worse.
The Great Bioweapon War launched by China, was responded to by people in power with "Racism to blame China", along with lies from within, to the point of "murdering" an extra 100k Americans by refusing them HCQ/Ivermectin and other protocols.
China is our #1 foreign threat, but the enemy within is worse. #2Weeks we may find out how The Cheat was On in AZ, but will it matter?
Patrick Byrne was saying he had big stuff coming down (his dates came and went #2weeks ago), he just hopes Americans are patient and don't do anything radical (like the "Insurrection") since Byrne and gang will win in the courts. .. I hope so .. but it was too reminiscent of #2Weeks promises, controlled resistance -- #Byrne/Lindell/Bannon will come.
The Great Bioweapon War launched by China, was responded to by people in power with "Racism to blame China", along with lies from within, to the point of "murdering" an extra 100k Americans by refusing them HCQ/Ivermectin and other protocols.
China is our #1 foreign threat, but the enemy within is worse. #2Weeks we may find out how The Cheat was On in AZ, but will it matter?
Patrick Byrne was saying he had big stuff coming down (his dates came and went #2weeks ago), he just hopes Americans are patient and don't do anything radical (like the "Insurrection") since Byrne and gang will win in the courts. .. I hope so .. but it was too reminiscent of #2Weeks promises, controlled resistance -- #Byrne/Lindell/Bannon will come.
Posted by: illiniwek at June 13, 2021 11:29 AM (Cus5s)
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (hOUT3)
51
Do they? Other than the fact that the A-10s are "old," and military contractors can't get bazillions of dollars out of selling them like they can some new platform, what does the AF need that the A-10 isn't delivering?
That's a serious question, btw.
Posted by: BurtTC
What does the A-10 have that the Sopwith Camel didn't deliver?
Time marches on. Tech develops. The idea that the A-10, while venerable and effective, is the ultimate of all ultimates is obviously sedimentary.
How about just plain old stealth tech? How about fragmenting elements with independent action? How about skipping the whole thing and invest in remote systems? How about any number of tech that China is investing heavily in?
That's a serious question, btw.
Posted by: BurtTC
What does the A-10 have that the Sopwith Camel didn't deliver?
Time marches on. Tech develops. The idea that the A-10, while venerable and effective, is the ultimate of all ultimates is obviously sedimentary.
How about just plain old stealth tech? How about fragmenting elements with independent action? How about skipping the whole thing and invest in remote systems? How about any number of tech that China is investing heavily in?
Posted by: weft cut-loop at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (nI1Kq)
52
The Air Force doesn't want them, they want out of the ground attack job. They keep trying to get congress to get rid of them. The Army wants to keep them flying because they are extremely good at what they do. And yes they can simply build new planes but but like you said there is no $$$$ in that.
Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at June 13, 2021 11:25 AM (JUOKG)
If I recall, one of the recent attempts to mothball them, the Army said "Fine, then let us have them." The AF then backed down, because they didn't want to give up the role, and they had nothing else to replace them.
Posted by: Mister Scott (formerly GWS) at June 13, 2021 11:25 AM (JUOKG)
If I recall, one of the recent attempts to mothball them, the Army said "Fine, then let us have them." The AF then backed down, because they didn't want to give up the role, and they had nothing else to replace them.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (naMR+)
53
70+
From the fifties.
Posted by: rickb223 at June 13, 2021 11:26 AM (OCTRt)
First delivered in June '55....H models in '62.
From the fifties.
Posted by: rickb223 at June 13, 2021 11:26 AM (OCTRt)
First delivered in June '55....H models in '62.
Posted by: BignJames at June 13, 2021 11:31 AM (AwYPR)
54
We're in deep, deep kimchee.
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 11:28 AM (2Xmlz)
CC: I think we are "Toast", and very badly burned Toast at that.
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 11:28 AM (2Xmlz)
CC: I think we are "Toast", and very badly burned Toast at that.
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar at June 13, 2021 11:31 AM (hOUT3)
55
>>>The best description of an A-10 I've heard is a big ass gun with an airplane built around it.<
>How many other countries are flying A-10s? There is your sign.
>How many other countries are flying A-10s? There is your sign.
Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 13, 2021 11:32 AM (2k5ha)
56
If you concentrate on the top pic, you'll hear a whirring sound.
Its ALL of our military heroes spinning in their graves.
Its ALL of our military heroes spinning in their graves.
Posted by: JT at June 13, 2021 11:32 AM (arJlL)
57
The A-10 has to last forever, because any replacement for it will be another F-35, and so expensive that it will be fiscally impossible to build enough of them. The A-10 is as close to perfect for purpose as any aircraft ever built.
Posted by: grayishpanther at June 13, 2021 11:32 AM (4gr6V)
58
Stumbled across the WH paper on G7 priorities.
My gawd. It's like the declaration of 11th graders at a Model UN time-waster, or something out of the Berkeley city council.
Just nonsense and gobbledegook and the incredibly idiotic buzzwords that now substitute for any kind of serious "ideas". Sure, G7 has long been mostly pointless and nonsensical side-issues, if that, or, rarely, a convenient mechanism for business not on the official agenda.
But this is now the reality of US "leadership". This is their level. They literally don't know any more, or any better, than this crap. And of course Biden and Harris together couldn't have even landed intern spots in some of the better Hill offices back in the day - they're nothings.
My gawd. It's like the declaration of 11th graders at a Model UN time-waster, or something out of the Berkeley city council.
Just nonsense and gobbledegook and the incredibly idiotic buzzwords that now substitute for any kind of serious "ideas". Sure, G7 has long been mostly pointless and nonsensical side-issues, if that, or, rarely, a convenient mechanism for business not on the official agenda.
But this is now the reality of US "leadership". This is their level. They literally don't know any more, or any better, than this crap. And of course Biden and Harris together couldn't have even landed intern spots in some of the better Hill offices back in the day - they're nothings.
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 11:32 AM (OTzUX)
59
B-52s have been rebuilt several times though..they really aren't like the 25-30 year old fighters that used to sit untouched on the airfields of South American countries more or less since they were received as military aid. They are more like a 57 Chevy that has gotten a frameoff restoration and then maintained without expense worries by a crew of mechanics.
Posted by: azjaeger at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (3/XaG)
60
No need for a Navy. There are no white supremacists a sea.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (QZBA7)
61
The Marine Corps should have had the A10. Catapault launch and cable recovery.
Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (I58tH)
62
Choices have consequences.
Posted by: azjaeger at June 13, 2021 11:29 AM (3/XaG)
Ladies, you volunteered to join the military.
Lace up those combat boots, load up that pack, and get to marching!
Posted by: azjaeger at June 13, 2021 11:29 AM (3/XaG)
Ladies, you volunteered to join the military.
Lace up those combat boots, load up that pack, and get to marching!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (hOUT3)
63
IMO the majority of people in the military (any branch) today are there for a paycheck, not to fight.
The corruption with CRT, transgenderism, etc. is a symptom and not the cause of the rot. The cause is leadership's inability to prioritize the DoD's mission as defense of the homeland and projecting death and destruction where it needs to fall.
The corruption with CRT, transgenderism, etc. is a symptom and not the cause of the rot. The cause is leadership's inability to prioritize the DoD's mission as defense of the homeland and projecting death and destruction where it needs to fall.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (3H9h1)
64
What does the A-10 have that the Sopwith Camel didn't deliver?
Time marches on. Tech develops. The idea that the A-10, while venerable and effective, is the ultimate of all ultimates is obviously sedimentary.
How about just plain old stealth tech? How about fragmenting elements with independent action? How about skipping the whole thing and invest in remote systems? How about any number of tech that China is investing heavily in?
Posted by: weft cut-loop at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (nI1Kq)
You really aren't answering the question. All those sexy new techs you're describing, in service of what function, would they improve things?
Fine, you could send in drones, or remote firing devices, or stealth planes, but how would they improve precision ground operations?
And if you're worried about what China is doing, and whether our A-10s are the right machine for the job, you got bigger problems than this one airplane.
Time marches on. Tech develops. The idea that the A-10, while venerable and effective, is the ultimate of all ultimates is obviously sedimentary.
How about just plain old stealth tech? How about fragmenting elements with independent action? How about skipping the whole thing and invest in remote systems? How about any number of tech that China is investing heavily in?
Posted by: weft cut-loop at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (nI1Kq)
You really aren't answering the question. All those sexy new techs you're describing, in service of what function, would they improve things?
Fine, you could send in drones, or remote firing devices, or stealth planes, but how would they improve precision ground operations?
And if you're worried about what China is doing, and whether our A-10s are the right machine for the job, you got bigger problems than this one airplane.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (naMR+)
65
If I recall, one of the recent attempts to mothball them, the Army said "Fine, then let us have them." The AF then backed down, because they didn't want to give up the role, and they had nothing else to replace them.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (naMR+)
That was years (decades?) ago, and I pretty sure the Army wasn't serious about it. They don't want the A-10s because trying to keep them flying with the Army would be a pain in the ass. The A-10 still requires close integration with the AF for protection and logistics. You also don't have a training pipeline for new pilots, nor a career path for them. In the AF, an A-10 pilot can move into other aircraft as well as staff and instructor positions in order to advance his career.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (naMR+)
That was years (decades?) ago, and I pretty sure the Army wasn't serious about it. They don't want the A-10s because trying to keep them flying with the Army would be a pain in the ass. The A-10 still requires close integration with the AF for protection and logistics. You also don't have a training pipeline for new pilots, nor a career path for them. In the AF, an A-10 pilot can move into other aircraft as well as staff and instructor positions in order to advance his career.
Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (jOcSX)
66
So yes, there are bigger problems than budgets, but also bigger problems then the amazing Gleichschaltung degradation currently happening to the services.
Lack of a purpose, or a need, for most of what they - nominally - are supposed to be able to do.
Inertia's the greatest force in nature. In this context, inertia is mindlessly assuming there's a need or purpose to much of this. Examination of the underlying basics quickly leads to lots of questions that can no longer be answered.
Lack of a purpose, or a need, for most of what they - nominally - are supposed to be able to do.
Inertia's the greatest force in nature. In this context, inertia is mindlessly assuming there's a need or purpose to much of this. Examination of the underlying basics quickly leads to lots of questions that can no longer be answered.
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 11:37 AM (OTzUX)
67
Just because they come out with a new hammer it doesn't mean you have to run out and get one.
Posted by: f'd at June 13, 2021 11:37 AM (Tnijr)
68
The "mothball the A-10" argument comes from people who want to make gobs of money in grifting off of a very expensive, not as good, replacement. Give them to the Army, along with the CAS mission, and I'd have pilots lined up down the street looking to fly them.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 11:38 AM (QZBA7)
69
My collection
Front a 9mm round, left a 30mm A-10, center a 20mm round, right a 50 cal cassing
https://i.postIMG.cc/pL0sdyRj/20200403-104833.jpg
Front a 9mm round, left a 30mm A-10, center a 20mm round, right a 50 cal cassing
https://i.postIMG.cc/pL0sdyRj/20200403-104833.jpg
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:38 AM (Cxk7w)
70
>How many other countries are flying A-10s? There is your sign.
Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 13, 2021 11:32 AM (2k5ha)
-----------
How many other countries are flying B-52s?
Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 13, 2021 11:32 AM (2k5ha)
-----------
How many other countries are flying B-52s?
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:38 AM (kTF2Z)
71
That was years (decades?) ago, and I pretty sure the Army wasn't serious about it. They don't want the A-10s because trying to keep them flying with the Army would be a pain in the ass. The A-10 still requires close integration with the AF for protection and logistics. You also don't have a training pipeline for new pilots, nor a career path for them. In the AF, an A-10 pilot can move into other aircraft as well as staff and instructor positions in order to advance his career.
Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (jOcSX)
I know nothing about the logistics of it, but the Army seems to have plenty of pilots for their helicopters. And I'm sure if the brass making the offer had any experience with ground combat, they would have been dead serious about wanting the A-10s.
Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (jOcSX)
I know nothing about the logistics of it, but the Army seems to have plenty of pilots for their helicopters. And I'm sure if the brass making the offer had any experience with ground combat, they would have been dead serious about wanting the A-10s.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:38 AM (naMR+)
72
man this is a tough one CBD. I want to say something but I don't want to offend anyone. Not that I mind offending others, but not the troops and Hordians. I will be honest though. I am starting to wonder if The Navy is fully a military branch. What I mean is, something seems really off.
In general, I agree that naval force projection is our most dangerous and most powerful asset. At the same time, I seriously wonder what the Hell is going on. All services are lesser when they waste time playing grab ass. And sadly we see that in the Army, and even the US Marines. They must not listen to former Marines or they would never have gone this far.
In the end I don't know what to say. But any branch that wants to take over and be above others, needs to prove it's worth. To Hell even with strategy. We have seen any force that is not fully committed to winning is a shell of itself. You can have all the assets in the world, but if you are not focused on winning, they will not be enough.
In general, I agree that naval force projection is our most dangerous and most powerful asset. At the same time, I seriously wonder what the Hell is going on. All services are lesser when they waste time playing grab ass. And sadly we see that in the Army, and even the US Marines. They must not listen to former Marines or they would never have gone this far.
In the end I don't know what to say. But any branch that wants to take over and be above others, needs to prove it's worth. To Hell even with strategy. We have seen any force that is not fully committed to winning is a shell of itself. You can have all the assets in the world, but if you are not focused on winning, they will not be enough.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 11:41 AM (gJfTA)
73
The post I tried to make that Pixy rejected would have pointed out that there are still 172 DC3 varients flying, including the original American Airlines flagship "Detroit", manufactured in 1937. (picture a line break here) Old is not necessarily bad.
Posted by: creeper at June 13, 2021 11:41 AM (XxJt1)
74
This is depressing. I'm going back downstairs to the book thread....
Posted by: Cringe Biscuit at June 13, 2021 11:42 AM (Lozsj)
75
You also don't have a training pipeline for new pilots, nor a career path for them. In the AF, an A-10 pilot can move into other aircraft as well as staff and instructor positions in order to advance his career.
The Army has multi engine fixed wing pilots. The Army has attack pilots. Most of the Army's pilots are Warrant Officers (like myself), who do not need a bunch of career massaging to make retirement rank. The Army has a schoolhouse, and instructor pilots. The only reason NOT to do it is, the Air Force doesn't want to be seen giving up a flying combat mission to the Army.
The Army has multi engine fixed wing pilots. The Army has attack pilots. Most of the Army's pilots are Warrant Officers (like myself), who do not need a bunch of career massaging to make retirement rank. The Army has a schoolhouse, and instructor pilots. The only reason NOT to do it is, the Air Force doesn't want to be seen giving up a flying combat mission to the Army.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 11:42 AM (QZBA7)
76
B-52s: The B-52 was produced between 1955 and 1962. A total of 744 were built. It remains in service and has been upgraded a million times; I don't know what the plans are to retire it.
Posted by: grayishpanther at June 13, 2021 11:43 AM (4gr6V)
77
Front a 9mm round, left a 30mm A-10, center a 20mm round, right a 50 cal cassing
https://i.postIMG.cc/pL0sdyRj/20200403-104833.jpg
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:38 AM (Cxk7w)
When I was a kid, I wondered about those WW2 German fighters w/a 30mm "cannon"....cannon? on an airplane?....Yeah....cannon.
https://i.postIMG.cc/pL0sdyRj/20200403-104833.jpg
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:38 AM (Cxk7w)
When I was a kid, I wondered about those WW2 German fighters w/a 30mm "cannon"....cannon? on an airplane?....Yeah....cannon.
Posted by: BignJames at June 13, 2021 11:43 AM (AwYPR)
78
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (3H9h1)
I trace the rot to the renaming of the Department of War* to the Department of Defense**!
*War is a highly declarative functional name for an activity with clear winners and losers as its end game.
**Defense is a vague term describing almost everything under the sun and requiring no particular clear unambiguous definitions for the declaration of success!
I trace the rot to the renaming of the Department of War* to the Department of Defense**!
*War is a highly declarative functional name for an activity with clear winners and losers as its end game.
**Defense is a vague term describing almost everything under the sun and requiring no particular clear unambiguous definitions for the declaration of success!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar at June 13, 2021 11:43 AM (hOUT3)
79
I seem to recall the Army being rather excited at the prospect of getting back into fixed wing CAS.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 11:43 AM (3H9h1)
80
Whelp, about 2 weeks ago I told WeaselWoman I would vacuum the upstairs. Guess it's time to get on that.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 11:43 AM (MVjcR)
81
Ladies, you volunteered to join the military.
Lace up those combat boots, load up that pack, and get to marching!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar
___
Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.
Lace up those combat boots, load up that pack, and get to marching!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar
___
Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:44 AM (8WCBI)
82
Given that the the most likely future targets for attack by the U.S. military are the U.S. States, shouldn't we be welcoming the Navy's slide into into incompetence and irrelevance?
Posted by: KasperHauser at June 13, 2021 11:44 AM (VV8Y9)
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 11:45 AM (3H9h1)
84
The Army has multi engine fixed wing pilots. The Army has attack pilots. Most of the Army's pilots are Warrant Officers (like myself), who do not need a bunch of career massaging to make retirement rank. The Army has a schoolhouse, and instructor pilots. The only reason NOT to do it is, the Air Force doesn't want to be seen giving up a flying combat mission to the Army.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 11:42 AM (QZBA7)
That was my understanding too.
Us enlisted men really liked the Warrant Officers, by the way, because as a general rule, they weren't douchebags like the fellas with bars and clusters on their uniforms.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 11:42 AM (QZBA7)
That was my understanding too.
Us enlisted men really liked the Warrant Officers, by the way, because as a general rule, they weren't douchebags like the fellas with bars and clusters on their uniforms.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:45 AM (naMR+)
85
As I said, it's a good place to start the conversation. But I'll take a smaller army that doesn't wear red pumps over a larger one that has Marines wearing pregnancy prosthetics to get in touch with their feminine sides.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 11:20 AM (Q9lwr)
The problem is the smaller army is it isnt even. You cannot just go through the ranks and cull out every 10th person. The army fights as a team. A tank crew needs every man. Same with an artillery gun and its supporting fire direction center. A four man signals intelligence team cannot work with three without dropping a significant part of the mission. Better to cut a whole brigade...and sit back and watch the politicians howl. " Not from MY district! "
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 11:20 AM (Q9lwr)
The problem is the smaller army is it isnt even. You cannot just go through the ranks and cull out every 10th person. The army fights as a team. A tank crew needs every man. Same with an artillery gun and its supporting fire direction center. A four man signals intelligence team cannot work with three without dropping a significant part of the mission. Better to cut a whole brigade...and sit back and watch the politicians howl. " Not from MY district! "
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 11:46 AM (axyOa)
86
Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:44 AM (8WCBI)
Thank you, ma'am.
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:44 AM (8WCBI)
Thank you, ma'am.
Posted by: creeper at June 13, 2021 11:46 AM (XxJt1)
87
Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:44 AM (8WCBI)
Dear {{{SMH}}}, you know I would never ever worry about you not being combat ready!
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:44 AM (8WCBI)
Dear {{{SMH}}}, you know I would never ever worry about you not being combat ready!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar at June 13, 2021 11:46 AM (hOUT3)
88
22 These gentlemen have no sense of fashion. Why wouldn't you get camo pumps?
Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 13, 2021 11:16 AM (2k5ha)
-
They have great fashion sense! But it was a hot day and they were allowed to leave their redcoats in the barracks.
Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 13, 2021 11:16 AM (2k5ha)
-
They have great fashion sense! But it was a hot day and they were allowed to leave their redcoats in the barracks.
Posted by: Biden's Dog at June 13, 2021 11:47 AM (sdXdm)
89
"Even the most modern weaponry will be of limited value if our soldiers and sailors and marines aren't fighting men, but rather some pale, post-modern reflection of what they once were."
I hope this is true, because if it is, China doesn't have a chance.
I hope this is true, because if it is, China doesn't have a chance.
Posted by: Commander Tacticool at June 13, 2021 11:48 AM (4Ru5B)
90
I'm so old I can remember the GOP saying they'd never let this happen.
Posted by: Captain Hate Won't Forget Ashli Babbitt at June 13, 2021 11:48 AM (y7DUB)
91
"Marines! Follow xer!" Doesn't exactly inspire, does it?
Posted by: West at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (QY+6a)
92
Us enlisted men really liked the Warrant Officers, by the way, because as a general rule, they weren't douchebags like the fellas with bars and clusters on their uniforms.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:45 AM (naMR+)
Very much seconded.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:45 AM (naMR+)
Very much seconded.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (nFuTj)
93
You can have a woke military or a ready military.
Can't have both.
Those poor marines and sailors drowning in an amtrak proved that.
Not to mentions the many training "mishaps" as of late.
Can't have both.
Those poor marines and sailors drowning in an amtrak proved that.
Not to mentions the many training "mishaps" as of late.
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (8WCBI)
94
The military's weapons procurement department has been wrong so many times I don't know how we became the greatest military in history.
From the Spencer rifle to the Maxim machine gun to the Christie tank suspension and slope armor to the F-35 and numerous small arms decisions in between , they seem to always make a lot of wrong decisions ( admittedly we have created many winners which include the F 22 and A 10 which they what to get rid of)
From the Spencer rifle to the Maxim machine gun to the Christie tank suspension and slope armor to the F-35 and numerous small arms decisions in between , they seem to always make a lot of wrong decisions ( admittedly we have created many winners which include the F 22 and A 10 which they what to get rid of)
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (2DOZq)
95
IMO the majority of people in the military (any branch) today are there for a paycheck, not to fight.
The corruption with CRT, transgenderism, etc. is a symptom and not
the cause of the rot. The cause is leadership's inability to prioritize
the DoD's mission as defense of the homeland and projecting death and
destruction where it needs to fall.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (3H9h1)
that was true in the 80s as well. But they did raise their right hand. But in the 80s, they didn't have CRT, transgenderism, lefty indoctrination, etc. So in the end troops would do what they were told and what they were taught to do. I can't even imagine serving today. What are their chants in basic, something from American Idol? I was in not long ago really. But it seems like a world that no longer exists. Very strange, and there is not a single good reason for the change.
The corruption with CRT, transgenderism, etc. is a symptom and not
the cause of the rot. The cause is leadership's inability to prioritize
the DoD's mission as defense of the homeland and projecting death and
destruction where it needs to fall.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 11:34 AM (3H9h1)
that was true in the 80s as well. But they did raise their right hand. But in the 80s, they didn't have CRT, transgenderism, lefty indoctrination, etc. So in the end troops would do what they were told and what they were taught to do. I can't even imagine serving today. What are their chants in basic, something from American Idol? I was in not long ago really. But it seems like a world that no longer exists. Very strange, and there is not a single good reason for the change.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (gJfTA)
96
The problem is the smaller army is it isnt even. You cannot just go through the ranks and cull out every 10th person. The army fights as a team. A tank crew needs every man. Same with an artillery gun and its supporting fire direction center. A four man signals intelligence team cannot work with three without dropping a significant part of the mission. Better to cut a whole brigade...and sit back and watch the politicians howl. " Not from MY district! "
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 11:46 AM (axyOa)
But every unit in every branch of the military could use one fewer typist, and probably one fewer ass-scratching mechanic sitting around doing nothing more than smearing grease on his hands to make himself LOOK like he's been busy.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 11:46 AM (axyOa)
But every unit in every branch of the military could use one fewer typist, and probably one fewer ass-scratching mechanic sitting around doing nothing more than smearing grease on his hands to make himself LOOK like he's been busy.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (naMR+)
97
I'm so old I can remember the GOP saying they'd never let this happen.
Posted by: Captain Hate Won't Forget Ashli Babbitt at June 13, 2021 11:48 AM (y7DUB)
-------------
Well, see, the dems wanted 100% wussification of the military and the GOP fought like hell to limit it to 95%.
Posted by: Captain Hate Won't Forget Ashli Babbitt at June 13, 2021 11:48 AM (y7DUB)
-------------
Well, see, the dems wanted 100% wussification of the military and the GOP fought like hell to limit it to 95%.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 11:50 AM (kTF2Z)
98
48 I'm of 2 minds about the soi-ification of the services. If we're talking about an aggressive, well armed foreign foe, I fear we may be fooked. Whoever is running the admin, probably a cocktail of Obambi, Jarrett and Rice, won't defend us. They'll roll over like a pup getting his belly scratched. ("Serves your Colonial ass right!!").
On the other hand, if we're talking CWII, sure, keep prancing around in high heels, and try to run that APC on bio-diesel.
Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 13, 2021 11:29 AM (7Fj9P)
Two ways of looking at this. First, China controls DC now. Why would they attack? Second, we need the soi-marinated military to keep all these weapons maintained for when the time comes for the individual states to commandeer them for the patriots' use.
On the other hand, if we're talking CWII, sure, keep prancing around in high heels, and try to run that APC on bio-diesel.
Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 13, 2021 11:29 AM (7Fj9P)
Two ways of looking at this. First, China controls DC now. Why would they attack? Second, we need the soi-marinated military to keep all these weapons maintained for when the time comes for the individual states to commandeer them for the patriots' use.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 11:50 AM (Fs5vw)
99
What does the A-10 have that the Sopwith Camel didn't deliver?
Time marches on. Tech develops. The idea that the A-10, while venerable and effective, is the ultimate of all ultimates is obviously sedimentary.
Posted by: weft cut-loop at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (nI1Kq)
Except...you missed my point. I have no attachment to the A-10 other than it is a fully functional ground attack plane. Getting rid of it before we have a fully functioning replacement is just dumb.
Time marches on. Tech develops. The idea that the A-10, while venerable and effective, is the ultimate of all ultimates is obviously sedimentary.
Posted by: weft cut-loop at June 13, 2021 11:30 AM (nI1Kq)
Except...you missed my point. I have no attachment to the A-10 other than it is a fully functional ground attack plane. Getting rid of it before we have a fully functioning replacement is just dumb.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 11:50 AM (Q9lwr)
100
Excellent thread CBD. I was going to post my two cents worth but reading the comments that would seem a paltry sum compared to the rich comments posted by our more articulate morons. That and commenting with an inch and a half by two inch keyboard is most often an exercise in frustration. Well said almost everyone.
Posted by: Sock Monkey * nut here tae mess aboot at June 13, 2021 11:51 AM (sgK7E)
101
But every unit in every branch of the military could use one fewer typist, and probably one fewer ass-scratching mechanic sitting around doing nothing more than smearing grease on his hands to make himself LOOK like he's been busy.
___
Were you a tanker, gun bunny, or bullet catcher?
___
Were you a tanker, gun bunny, or bullet catcher?
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:51 AM (8WCBI)
102
And this, my friends, is why the word "militia" appears in the Second Amendment.
Posted by: creeper at June 13, 2021 11:51 AM (XxJt1)
103
One of the Guys Who Love Wearing Uniforms in the Pentagon responded to criticism of the New Woke Military by stating that "America has the best trained, best equipped, best educated, most diverse fighting force in history"
Yet it's not the barely literate camel jockeys equipped with AK's, Toyota pickups, homemade bombs, and 7th century social attitudes that's bugging out of Afghanistan.
Yet it's not the barely literate camel jockeys equipped with AK's, Toyota pickups, homemade bombs, and 7th century social attitudes that's bugging out of Afghanistan.
Posted by: kbdabear at June 13, 2021 11:52 AM (qAR6u)
104
I'm so old I can remember the GOP saying they'd never let this happen.
Posted by: Captain Hate Won't Forget Ashli Babbitt at June 13, 2021 11:48 AM (y7DUB)
Trump said it too. He said these things would not happen while he was in office. So many wanted him out, to not have to vote for him, that they gave up everything. No doubt when most Americans vote, they are not taking everything into account. I bet many who did not vote Trump lament what has happened if they even know about it.
I'm so old I can remember the GOP saying they'd never let this happen.
Posted by: Captain Hate Won't Forget Ashli Babbitt at June 13, 2021 11:48 AM (y7DUB)
Trump said it too. He said these things would not happen while he was in office. So many wanted him out, to not have to vote for him, that they gave up everything. No doubt when most Americans vote, they are not taking everything into account. I bet many who did not vote Trump lament what has happened if they even know about it.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 11:52 AM (gJfTA)
105
"Time marches on. Tech develops."
idk military stuff, just the various videos that pop up on my smart TV, and a few articles. But I saw some military thing, they were trying to shoot down a couple small (practice) drones with a machine gun. Took them some time, but hurray, they got two of them.
New tech warfare might be a cloud of small drones, as well as the hypersonic weapons ... lots of new tech, and China still is allowed right inside our research, it seems. (Hillary arranged the Skolkovo tech sharing with Silicon Valley, supposedly some of our hypersonic tech was "shared")
idk military stuff, just the various videos that pop up on my smart TV, and a few articles. But I saw some military thing, they were trying to shoot down a couple small (practice) drones with a machine gun. Took them some time, but hurray, they got two of them.
New tech warfare might be a cloud of small drones, as well as the hypersonic weapons ... lots of new tech, and China still is allowed right inside our research, it seems. (Hillary arranged the Skolkovo tech sharing with Silicon Valley, supposedly some of our hypersonic tech was "shared")
Posted by: illiniwek at June 13, 2021 11:52 AM (Cus5s)
106
A-10s came on line 1978. Sure it's been updated but how long can it go? I have no idea, but the need for ground attack surely hasn't gone away.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:07 AM (Cxk7w
The B-52 was introduced in 1955 and will most likely still be flying in 2055.
The still fastest plane in the world, the SR-71, was designed with a slide rule on the back of a napkin, as it were, not sophisticated computers like modern aircraft, that are obsolete as soon as they take to the air.
The air force is already talking about retiring the F-22, and the F-35...phfft! What a boondoggle.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 11:07 AM (Cxk7w
The B-52 was introduced in 1955 and will most likely still be flying in 2055.
The still fastest plane in the world, the SR-71, was designed with a slide rule on the back of a napkin, as it were, not sophisticated computers like modern aircraft, that are obsolete as soon as they take to the air.
The air force is already talking about retiring the F-22, and the F-35...phfft! What a boondoggle.
Posted by: That Guy What Always Says Yeah Buddy TM at June 13, 2021 11:53 AM (R5lpX)
107
But every unit in every branch of the military could use one fewer typist, and probably one fewer ass-scratching mechanic sitting around doing nothing more than smearing grease on his hands to make himself LOOK like he's been busy.
___
Were you a tanker, gun bunny, or bullet catcher?
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:51 AM (8WCBI)
A grunt. But spent considerable time in a mechanized unit.
___
Were you a tanker, gun bunny, or bullet catcher?
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:51 AM (8WCBI)
A grunt. But spent considerable time in a mechanized unit.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:53 AM (naMR+)
108
Us enlisted men really liked the Warrant Officers, by the way, because as a general rule, they weren't douchebags like the fellas with bars and clusters on their uniforms.
Heh. That's because most of us were prior enlisted, and knew the deal. My son and younger daughter are RLO's, but they were raised by a Warrant, which is not unlike being raised by wolves...
Heh. That's because most of us were prior enlisted, and knew the deal. My son and younger daughter are RLO's, but they were raised by a Warrant, which is not unlike being raised by wolves...
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 11:54 AM (QZBA7)
109
95 You can have a woke military or a ready military.
Can't have both.
Those poor marines and sailors drowning in an amtrak proved that.
Not to mentions the many training "mishaps" as of late.
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (8WCBI)
Good training in the military will always have casualties. It's a dangerous job in war and peace.
Can't have both.
Those poor marines and sailors drowning in an amtrak proved that.
Not to mentions the many training "mishaps" as of late.
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (8WCBI)
Good training in the military will always have casualties. It's a dangerous job in war and peace.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 11:54 AM (Fs5vw)
110
A grunt. But spent considerable time in a mechanized unit.
Posted by: BurtTC
___
Ah.
So did I.
I didn't spend much time smearing grease on my hands.
Kinda made it hard to grip my SAW whenever I had to go on patrols or missions.
Posted by: BurtTC
___
Ah.
So did I.
I didn't spend much time smearing grease on my hands.
Kinda made it hard to grip my SAW whenever I had to go on patrols or missions.
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 11:55 AM (8WCBI)
111
Good training in the military will always have casualties. It's a dangerous job in war and peace.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 11:54 AM (Fs5vw)
The training fatalities have exceeded the KIA in Iraq and Afghanistan significantly in the past decade and more .
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 11:54 AM (Fs5vw)
The training fatalities have exceeded the KIA in Iraq and Afghanistan significantly in the past decade and more .
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 11:56 AM (2DOZq)
112
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things; fighting Climate Change with Prada heels and a mismatched Givenchy handbag is."
I quote from memory. Public Pvt. Manning's.
I quote from memory. Public Pvt. Manning's.
Posted by: The Gipper Lives at June 13, 2021 11:57 AM (Ndje9)
113
In the 20's and 30's between the wars, the army was near-illiterates who enlisted to stop being bums. Their officers were polo and golf playing socialites. Training took a back seat to sports. Obsolete equipment, obsolete doctrine, obsolete officers. So maybe today's nonsense is only different in type.
In the 20's and 30's between the wars, the army was near-illiterates who enlisted to stop being bums. Their officers were polo and golf playing socialites. Training took a back seat to sports. Obsolete equipment, obsolete doctrine, obsolete officers. So maybe today's nonsense is only different in type.
Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at June 13, 2021 11:59 AM (mht8P)
114
The last mr. creeper was a helicopter mechanic in 'Nam...'67-'68. He couldn't remember the name of anyone he served with, save one Warrant Officer. He swore Officer Burge could fly a helicopter on its side. I guess he would have known. He was on it.
Posted by: creeper at June 13, 2021 11:59 AM (XxJt1)
115
Don't give up or in, American citizens!
https://twitter.com/DanScavino/status/1402795678640873472
https://twitter.com/DanScavino/status/1402795678640873472
Posted by: Biden's Dog at June 13, 2021 11:59 AM (sdXdm)
116
The A-10 is great for shooting up enemy troops in the Third World sorts of conflicts we have been in. The RAF used WW1 Bristol Fighters to do the same sort of thing effectively well into the 30s. I do wonder two things..would the A-10 be survivable in a conflict against a modern sort of opposition any more? And will there actually ever be a conflict against a modern sort of opposition or was the US-Iraqi war the closest that will ever happen? It's hard to imagine an all out war between truly major powers because at the end of the day the major powers have nukes and nukes make a war unwinnable really.
Posted by: azjaeger at June 13, 2021 12:00 PM (3/XaG)
117
But every unit in every branch of the military could use one fewer typist, and probably one fewer ass-scratching mechanic sitting around doing nothing more than smearing grease on his hands to make himself LOOK like he's been busy.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (naMR+)
Not when you go to the field...or to war.
There you work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. That ass-scratching mechanic is now pulling track, calibrating systems, keeping generators running AND pulling security at night. And guess what the typists are doing? Yup. Same shit. Pulling guard duty, holding PWs if you have any, being part of the reaction force if hit by ground attack, and oh yeah, typing up the next set of orders, awards, messages to higher and lower, and the suck job of drafting the next of kin notices.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 11:49 AM (naMR+)
Not when you go to the field...or to war.
There you work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. That ass-scratching mechanic is now pulling track, calibrating systems, keeping generators running AND pulling security at night. And guess what the typists are doing? Yup. Same shit. Pulling guard duty, holding PWs if you have any, being part of the reaction force if hit by ground attack, and oh yeah, typing up the next set of orders, awards, messages to higher and lower, and the suck job of drafting the next of kin notices.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:00 PM (axyOa)
118
Heh. That's because most of us were prior enlisted, and knew the deal. My son and younger daughter are RLO's, but they were raised by a Warrant, which is not unlike being raised by wolves...
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 11:54 AM (QZBA7)
Ha! I know a guy who was a (Vietnam era) Navy pilot, but had been enlisted before going that route to being an officer. People either make the mistake of expecting him to be hoity toity, or they meet him and think "no way he was an officer."
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 11:54 AM (QZBA7)
Ha! I know a guy who was a (Vietnam era) Navy pilot, but had been enlisted before going that route to being an officer. People either make the mistake of expecting him to be hoity toity, or they meet him and think "no way he was an officer."
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:00 PM (naMR+)
119
New tech warfare might be a cloud of small drones,
as well as the hypersonic weapons ... lots of new tech, and China still
is allowed right inside our research, it seems. (Hillary arranged the
Skolkovo tech sharing with Silicon Valley, supposedly some of our
hypersonic tech was "shared")
Posted by: illiniwek at June 13, 2021 11:52 AM (Cus5s)
technology is overrated in some ways. Sure you should always want to be ten steps ahead of the opponent. But command and morale is even more important than technology. WE have seen this over and over, in every war this nation has fought. The Brits realized this too long, long ago. You can crush an enemy by simply being better, by being more determined. We have seen small units take over entire countries around the world. I think professionalism and esprit de corps are things that matter more than can even be quantified.
as well as the hypersonic weapons ... lots of new tech, and China still
is allowed right inside our research, it seems. (Hillary arranged the
Skolkovo tech sharing with Silicon Valley, supposedly some of our
hypersonic tech was "shared")
Posted by: illiniwek at June 13, 2021 11:52 AM (Cus5s)
technology is overrated in some ways. Sure you should always want to be ten steps ahead of the opponent. But command and morale is even more important than technology. WE have seen this over and over, in every war this nation has fought. The Brits realized this too long, long ago. You can crush an enemy by simply being better, by being more determined. We have seen small units take over entire countries around the world. I think professionalism and esprit de corps are things that matter more than can even be quantified.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:01 PM (gJfTA)
120
Not when you go to the field...or to war.
There you work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. That ass-scratching mechanic is now pulling track, calibrating systems, keeping generators running AND pulling security at night. And guess what the typists are doing? Yup. Same shit. Pulling guard duty, holding PoWs if you have any, being part of the reaction force if hit by ground attack, and oh yeah, typing up the next set of orders, awards, messages to higher and lower, and the suck job of drafting the next of kin notices.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:00 PM (axyOa)
___
This^^^
There you work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. That ass-scratching mechanic is now pulling track, calibrating systems, keeping generators running AND pulling security at night. And guess what the typists are doing? Yup. Same shit. Pulling guard duty, holding PoWs if you have any, being part of the reaction force if hit by ground attack, and oh yeah, typing up the next set of orders, awards, messages to higher and lower, and the suck job of drafting the next of kin notices.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:00 PM (axyOa)
___
This^^^
Posted by: SMH at June 13, 2021 12:01 PM (8WCBI)
121
>>>Except for the ridiculous proposal to retire the A-10 fleet without a functioning replacement,I guess this is a good place to start the discussion.
The A-10 is one of the greatest assets we have, considering what they were doing in Afghanistan. Cripes, just the sound of the Vulcan cannon had people running for the hills.
The A-10 is one of the greatest assets we have, considering what they were doing in Afghanistan. Cripes, just the sound of the Vulcan cannon had people running for the hills.
Posted by: Wyatt Earp at June 13, 2021 12:01 PM (bkUtD)
122
Meanwhile back in Beijing, Tehran, Goatherdistan, and other glamorous tourist destinations, serious bad guys are refining their strategies, TTPs, and logistics.
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 12:01 PM (2Xmlz)
123
In case no asshoe hasn't already gotten to it here, let me the first to say
Christopher Sign did not kill himself.
Mr. Sign was the investigative Phoenix reporter that revealed the Bent-dick Bill / Loretta Lynch infamous tarmac meeting. He wrote a book about it, including the constant death threats, credit cards hacked, etc and so on anytime you cross a Clinton.
"Police say his death is being investigated as a suicide, or another Clintoncide, but mostly another Clintoncide."
I may have editorialized that quote a bit.
Christopher Sign did not kill himself.
Mr. Sign was the investigative Phoenix reporter that revealed the Bent-dick Bill / Loretta Lynch infamous tarmac meeting. He wrote a book about it, including the constant death threats, credit cards hacked, etc and so on anytime you cross a Clinton.
"Police say his death is being investigated as a suicide, or another Clintoncide, but mostly another Clintoncide."
I may have editorialized that quote a bit.
Posted by: GnuBreed at June 13, 2021 12:02 PM (F0YaR)
124
Remember boys, over that ridge lies home...and the Gucci store, but mostly the Gucci store!
-George Pickett
-George Pickett
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:02 PM (kTF2Z)
125
A argument, and not saying one way or the other, is helicopters are a viable alternative to the A-10.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 12:03 PM (Cxk7w)
126
>I have no attachment to the A-10 other than it is a fully functional ground attack plane.
Ground attack is a mission, not a platform. F-16s kill things on the ground. F-15Es and Xs kill things on the ground. F/A-18s kill things on the ground. And yes, even the F-35 kill things on the ground. And each of those platforms do so more effectively in non-permissive environments than the A-10.
It's really easy to build a legacy when the opposition rarely has the ability to shoot back and make it stick.
And as to the USAF not wanting it, the point isn't that the Air Force doesn't want the A-10; the point is that the Air Force wants the role for which the A-10 was built- interdiction, not CAS. Army bought the AH-64 exclusively because it wanted its own CAS platform, and dictated the terms of what they'd be responsible for with their own controllers.
Instead, Army skipped on what it was supposed to do with the Apache, and the Air Force was stuck building an infrastructure and training regime to do that job.
And for the record- Army doesn't want it. Multiple heads of that service have said they have no interest in taking it. So with the Air Force it stays.
Ground attack is a mission, not a platform. F-16s kill things on the ground. F-15Es and Xs kill things on the ground. F/A-18s kill things on the ground. And yes, even the F-35 kill things on the ground. And each of those platforms do so more effectively in non-permissive environments than the A-10.
It's really easy to build a legacy when the opposition rarely has the ability to shoot back and make it stick.
And as to the USAF not wanting it, the point isn't that the Air Force doesn't want the A-10; the point is that the Air Force wants the role for which the A-10 was built- interdiction, not CAS. Army bought the AH-64 exclusively because it wanted its own CAS platform, and dictated the terms of what they'd be responsible for with their own controllers.
Instead, Army skipped on what it was supposed to do with the Apache, and the Air Force was stuck building an infrastructure and training regime to do that job.
And for the record- Army doesn't want it. Multiple heads of that service have said they have no interest in taking it. So with the Air Force it stays.
Posted by: fringe at June 13, 2021 12:04 PM (FPur3)
127
Remember boys, over that ridge lies home...and the Gucci store, but mostly the Gucci store!
-George Pickett
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:02 PM (kTF2Z)
Close. Isn't that the old story? Confederate heard their were boots to be had in Gettysburg.
Fashionable boots, I'm sure.
-George Pickett
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:02 PM (kTF2Z)
Close. Isn't that the old story? Confederate heard their were boots to be had in Gettysburg.
Fashionable boots, I'm sure.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:05 PM (naMR+)
128
In the 20's and 30's between the wars, the army was
near-illiterates who enlisted to stop being bums. Their officers were
polo and golf playing socialites. Training took a back seat to sports.
Obsolete equipment, obsolete doctrine, obsolete officers. So maybe
today's nonsense is only different in type.
Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at June 13, 2021 11:59 AM (mht8P)
America historically did not like standing Armies. The Army before the Civil War was tiny and the Army after the war was tiny. I can't speak for the 20s and 30s, but there might be some truth in it. Since the 80s, we have always had a strong, professional force. The bullshit being taught today is by design. I doubt even the Left wants to shrink the military. No, they want to remake it in their image, not shrink it.
near-illiterates who enlisted to stop being bums. Their officers were
polo and golf playing socialites. Training took a back seat to sports.
Obsolete equipment, obsolete doctrine, obsolete officers. So maybe
today's nonsense is only different in type.
Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at June 13, 2021 11:59 AM (mht8P)
America historically did not like standing Armies. The Army before the Civil War was tiny and the Army after the war was tiny. I can't speak for the 20s and 30s, but there might be some truth in it. Since the 80s, we have always had a strong, professional force. The bullshit being taught today is by design. I doubt even the Left wants to shrink the military. No, they want to remake it in their image, not shrink it.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:05 PM (gJfTA)
129
The Deep State might find the A10 handy if/when it comes to a shooting war here. Maybe retiring it isn't such a bad idea after all.
Posted by: creeper at June 13, 2021 12:06 PM (XxJt1)
130
113 Good training in the military will always have casualties. It's a dangerous job in war and peace.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 11:54 AM (Fs5vw)
The training fatalities have exceeded the KIA in Iraq and Afghanistan significantly in the past decade and more .
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 11:56 AM (2DOZq)
It's because we never really commit to "wars" anymore. If we did, we'd see a change in that stat if it's true. Can't believe anything coming from the government anymore.
You statement may be total bullshit for all we know. Remember, the Wuflu killed millions.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 11:54 AM (Fs5vw)
The training fatalities have exceeded the KIA in Iraq and Afghanistan significantly in the past decade and more .
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 11:56 AM (2DOZq)
It's because we never really commit to "wars" anymore. If we did, we'd see a change in that stat if it's true. Can't believe anything coming from the government anymore.
You statement may be total bullshit for all we know. Remember, the Wuflu killed millions.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:08 PM (Fs5vw)
131
Quint, yes. We're dealing with enemy action.
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 12:08 PM (2Xmlz)
132
GnuBreed Yeah not buying this, any from a article not many close around him are either.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 12:08 PM (Cxk7w)
133
One of the wargaming sites I frequent had a discussion about the ongoing obsession the DoD has with "unmanned" shit. Planes, tanks, ships, subs, etc. There's a consensus that "leadership" (such that it is) would love to get rid of the human component. That complicates things, from a certain perspective.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 12:09 PM (3H9h1)
134
And for the record- Army doesn't want it. Multiple heads of that service have said they have no interest in taking it. So with the Air Force it stays.
Posted by: fringe at June 13, 2021 12:04 PM (FPur3)
I'm not disputing anything you are saying, just that as I'm reading your comment I'm picturing contractors giving handies and bj's to men (and women... and in between!) in uniform, which kinda makes the decision-making process somewhat more complicated on all these matters.
Posted by: fringe at June 13, 2021 12:04 PM (FPur3)
I'm not disputing anything you are saying, just that as I'm reading your comment I'm picturing contractors giving handies and bj's to men (and women... and in between!) in uniform, which kinda makes the decision-making process somewhat more complicated on all these matters.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:09 PM (naMR+)
135
One of the wargaming sites I frequent had a discussion about the ongoing obsession the DoD has with "unmanned" shit. Planes, tanks, ships, subs, etc. There's a consensus that "leadership" (such that it is) would love to get rid of the human component. That complicates things, from a certain perspective.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 12:09 PM (3H9h1)
I've seen Terminator, is all I'm sayin'.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 12:09 PM (3H9h1)
I've seen Terminator, is all I'm sayin'.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:10 PM (naMR+)
136
Close. Isn't that the old story? Confederate heard their were boots to be had in Gettysburg.
Fashionable boots, I'm sure.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:05 PM (naMR+)
that is the old story, but even still it didn't matter. Confederate forces went through Gettysburg days before the battle. If there were shoes there, they would have taken them and still it would have changed nothing. Those forces went way past Gettysburg and had to come back later to join the battle. I think some of them reached Harrisburg days before Gettysburg.
Fashionable boots, I'm sure.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:05 PM (naMR+)
that is the old story, but even still it didn't matter. Confederate forces went through Gettysburg days before the battle. If there were shoes there, they would have taken them and still it would have changed nothing. Those forces went way past Gettysburg and had to come back later to join the battle. I think some of them reached Harrisburg days before Gettysburg.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:11 PM (gJfTA)
137
Posted by: fringe at June 13, 2021 12:04 PM (FPur3)
The A 10 was built specifically as a tank killer. It became a CAS platform.
The A 10 was built specifically as a tank killer. It became a CAS platform.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:11 PM (2DOZq)
138
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:05 PM (naMR+)
that is the old story, but even still it didn't matter. Confederate forces went through Gettysburg days before the battle. If there were shoes there, they would have taken them and still it would have changed nothing. Those forces went way past Gettysburg and had to come back later to join the battle. I think some of them reached Harrisburg days before Gettysburg.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:11 PM (gJfTA)
Maybe they heard there were purses in Harrisburg.
that is the old story, but even still it didn't matter. Confederate forces went through Gettysburg days before the battle. If there were shoes there, they would have taken them and still it would have changed nothing. Those forces went way past Gettysburg and had to come back later to join the battle. I think some of them reached Harrisburg days before Gettysburg.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:11 PM (gJfTA)
Maybe they heard there were purses in Harrisburg.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:13 PM (naMR+)
139
Right the Navy is SO frugal and results oriented in its f*cking spending....
Plaintiff's exhibit one-the Littoral Combat Ship....
Hats off Navy, it takes a lot of gumption and effort to spend 30 billion dollars on 35 vessels and call them "inexpensive and plentiful."
Plaintiff's exhibit one-the Littoral Combat Ship....
Hats off Navy, it takes a lot of gumption and effort to spend 30 billion dollars on 35 vessels and call them "inexpensive and plentiful."
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:14 PM (Lzpvj)
140
Maybe they heard there were purses in Harrisburg.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:13 PM (naMR+)
God help us.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:13 PM (naMR+)
God help us.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:14 PM (gJfTA)
141
Hrothgar, re burned toast. I don't know if the U.S. military is past the point of no return.
I know it's in big trouble against a top shelf bad guy who takes logistics and asymmetric warfare seriously.
I know it's in big trouble against a top shelf bad guy who takes logistics and asymmetric warfare seriously.
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 12:14 PM (2Xmlz)
142
"I think professionalism and esprit de corps are things that matter more than can even be quantified." Posted by: Quint
there was video of some of the young China boys being sent toward the India border ... they were crying. But China plans to win the other wars ... infiltration and threats, ownership of ports and raw resources, bribes/threats to break countries from within. They are leaning hard on Australia now, and have broken deals around the world, where they just move their own people in (by the thousands?).
The Show of Force and unit cohesion is no doubt very important ... but Biden (his puppeteers) is leading the destruction of that cohesion. But China is already using Unlimited Warfare ... we need a strong
response, economic, plus fighting their drug infiltration, their buying up power within the US ...
there was video of some of the young China boys being sent toward the India border ... they were crying. But China plans to win the other wars ... infiltration and threats, ownership of ports and raw resources, bribes/threats to break countries from within. They are leaning hard on Australia now, and have broken deals around the world, where they just move their own people in (by the thousands?).
The Show of Force and unit cohesion is no doubt very important ... but Biden (his puppeteers) is leading the destruction of that cohesion. But China is already using Unlimited Warfare ... we need a strong
response, economic, plus fighting their drug infiltration, their buying up power within the US ...
Posted by: illiniwek at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (Cus5s)
143
Have mentioned this in the past. There is a great book, Americas First Battles 1776-1965, published in the 80's. It was, and hopefully still is, mandatory reading for army profesionals. It studies 10 first battles of our country. Guess what? We suck. We go 1-8-1.
Fast forward to today and the dangers of losing the first battle have seriously escalated. Losing the first battle can also mean losing the war. In an age of swarm drones, hypersonics, stealth, EMP, and biologics, there is no substitution for preparedness.
Global warming will not kill us.
Diversity bullshit disappears in a firefight.
But getting our ass kicked in our next fight could kill millions.
Fast forward to today and the dangers of losing the first battle have seriously escalated. Losing the first battle can also mean losing the war. In an age of swarm drones, hypersonics, stealth, EMP, and biologics, there is no substitution for preparedness.
Global warming will not kill us.
Diversity bullshit disappears in a firefight.
But getting our ass kicked in our next fight could kill millions.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (axyOa)
144
139 Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:11 PM (2DOZq)
The CAS potential was baked in the cake, and thank God.
The USAF's best CAS aircraft prior was the A-1 Skyraider which they borrowed off the Navy.
The CAS potential was baked in the cake, and thank God.
The USAF's best CAS aircraft prior was the A-1 Skyraider which they borrowed off the Navy.
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (Lzpvj)
145
Not when you go to the field...or to war.
There you work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. That ass-scratching mechanic is now pulling track, calibrating systems, keeping generators running AND pulling security at night. And guess what the typists are doing? Yup. Same shit. Pulling guard duty, holding PWs if you have any, being part of the reaction force if hit by ground attack, and oh yeah, typing up the next set of orders, awards, messages to higher and lower, and the suck job of drafting the next of kin notices.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:00 PM (axyOa)
We need to ask what the military typists and mechanics did during the '68 Tet offensive in Vietnam.
Not when you go to the field...or to war.
There you work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. That ass-scratching mechanic is now pulling track, calibrating systems, keeping generators running AND pulling security at night. And guess what the typists are doing? Yup. Same shit. Pulling guard duty, holding PWs if you have any, being part of the reaction force if hit by ground attack, and oh yeah, typing up the next set of orders, awards, messages to higher and lower, and the suck job of drafting the next of kin notices.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:00 PM (axyOa)
We need to ask what the military typists and mechanics did during the '68 Tet offensive in Vietnam.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (Fs5vw)
146
Maybe they heard there were purses in Harrisburg.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:13 PM (naMR+)
It's a messenger bag....hmpf.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:13 PM (naMR+)
It's a messenger bag....hmpf.
Posted by: BignJames at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (AwYPR)
147
Ha! I know a guy who was a (Vietnam era) Navy pilot, but had been enlisted before going that route to being an officer. People either make the mistake of expecting him to be hoity toity, or they meet him and think "no way he was an officer."
Posted by: BurtTC
Drank my brains out this week with a retired Navy Captain who started out life as a Corpsman - then went to Annapolis in '60. Hell of a guy. I was not worthy.
Posted by: BurtTC
Drank my brains out this week with a retired Navy Captain who started out life as a Corpsman - then went to Annapolis in '60. Hell of a guy. I was not worthy.
Posted by: Tonypete at June 13, 2021 12:16 PM (Rvt88)
148
We need to ask what the military typists and mechanics did during the '68 Tet offensive in Vietnam.
Posted by: Justsayin'
Same thing as the FMF Corpsmen - fought when they had to.
Posted by: Justsayin'
Same thing as the FMF Corpsmen - fought when they had to.
Posted by: Tonypete at June 13, 2021 12:17 PM (Rvt88)
149
Everyday that passes the federal government becomes more obsolete.
The state of most militaries in the world is bad to worse. Few can project any power outside their own borders except for Russia and Red China and Israel.
Eliminate or reduce the US military and let the States handle their own defense. They would do a better job than the foreign adventures we have today thanks to the criminals in washington, who defend nothing here at home.
The state of most militaries in the world is bad to worse. Few can project any power outside their own borders except for Russia and Red China and Israel.
Eliminate or reduce the US military and let the States handle their own defense. They would do a better job than the foreign adventures we have today thanks to the criminals in washington, who defend nothing here at home.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy at June 13, 2021 12:17 PM (R/m4+)
150
Original comment was flagged as spam. So here's the condensed version. Troop strengths have been slashed since the early 90s. Missions have doubled and tripled since then. Budgets have absolutely no connection to strategy or reality, it's all about funneling money to the industries who buy off congressmen. I've been doing this for 36 years, not sure how much longer I'm going to stick around.
Posted by: Stacy0311 at June 13, 2021 12:18 PM (SqpTW)
151
Maybe they heard there were purses in Harrisburg.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:13 PM (naMR+)
It's a messenger bag....hmpf.
Posted by: BignJames at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (AwYPR)
And since we were talking about George Pickett, probably curlers and hairspray.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:13 PM (naMR+)
It's a messenger bag....hmpf.
Posted by: BignJames at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (AwYPR)
And since we were talking about George Pickett, probably curlers and hairspray.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:19 PM (naMR+)
152
There has been no mention in this thread of the serious combatants in today's armed forces, the special operations forces. Rangers, SEALs, SF, Delta, Force Recon and the like have been very, very busy over the last 40 years. Without it being noticed, they have effectively become the business end of the Department of Defense. They are still doing fine and would prefer to continue not to be noticed.
Posted by: Caesar North of the Rubicon at June 13, 2021 12:19 PM (BMmaB)
153
Every time I see that photo I want to puke. How utterly demoralizing and degrading.
Posted by: Notorious BFD at June 13, 2021 12:20 PM (W4eKo)
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 12:21 PM (2Xmlz)
155
And since we were talking about George Pickett, probably curlers and hairspray.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:19 PM (naMR+)
Well...ringlets...yeah, could be.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:19 PM (naMR+)
Well...ringlets...yeah, could be.
Posted by: BignJames at June 13, 2021 12:21 PM (AwYPR)
156
We need to ask what the military typists and mechanics did during the '68 Tet offensive in Vietnam.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (Fs5vw)
Probably killed a lot of NVA soldiers, since we won that battle.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:15 PM (Fs5vw)
Probably killed a lot of NVA soldiers, since we won that battle.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:21 PM (Q9lwr)
157
Every time I see that photo I want to puke. How utterly demoralizing and degrading.
Posted by: Notorious BFD at June 13, 2021 12:20 PM (W4eKo)
I read somewhere and for the life of me i cannot recall the source, but it stated that picture was responsible for the single biggest quarterly drop in recruiting since the end of the draft.
Posted by: Notorious BFD at June 13, 2021 12:20 PM (W4eKo)
I read somewhere and for the life of me i cannot recall the source, but it stated that picture was responsible for the single biggest quarterly drop in recruiting since the end of the draft.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:22 PM (axyOa)
158
152 Posted by: Stacy0311 at June 13, 2021 12:18 PM (SqpTW)
When I joined the Army there were roughly 3/4 million US Soldiers.
It is maybe 510,000 now....
We plan to run the world on 4 divisions I guess.
When I joined the Army there were roughly 3/4 million US Soldiers.
It is maybe 510,000 now....
We plan to run the world on 4 divisions I guess.
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:22 PM (Lzpvj)
159
Drank my brains out this week with a retired Navy Captain who started out life as a Corpsman - then went to Annapolis in '60. Hell of a guy. I was not worthy.
Posted by: Tonypete at June 13, 2021 12:16 PM (Rvt8
I knew a guy who was a Marine grunt in Korea, and a Naval Aviator in Vietnam. I knew another guy who was a Marine Gunny so long, Gunny became his first name. He retired as Captain. Everyone goes their own path. Those two guys were special, but they were surrounded by many special men.
Posted by: Tonypete at June 13, 2021 12:16 PM (Rvt8
I knew a guy who was a Marine grunt in Korea, and a Naval Aviator in Vietnam. I knew another guy who was a Marine Gunny so long, Gunny became his first name. He retired as Captain. Everyone goes their own path. Those two guys were special, but they were surrounded by many special men.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:22 PM (gJfTA)
160
> I'm not disputing anything you are saying, just that as I'm reading your comment I'm picturing contractors giving handies and bj's to men (and women... and in between!) in uniform, which kinda makes the decision-making process somewhat more complicated on all these matters.
Yeah, well until people who are constantly complaining about China's military expansion while demanding the A-10 remain on the books can viably express how the latter gets involved in a shooting war with the former, its immaterial to what the services need to be focused on.
There aren't any cattle-fucking short bus riding hadjis in the Chinese force structure. They're full up on modern IADS hardware and fighter aircraft with BVR capability- none of which the A-10 can deal with. And they're also looking to make sure we have to come from as far away as possible while maintaining mission viability. Rather difficult when you cruise at half the speed as everyone else, and thus require your own tanking tracks to drag you to the fight.
We're supposed to be leaving Afghanistan- not rearming for it.
Yeah, well until people who are constantly complaining about China's military expansion while demanding the A-10 remain on the books can viably express how the latter gets involved in a shooting war with the former, its immaterial to what the services need to be focused on.
There aren't any cattle-fucking short bus riding hadjis in the Chinese force structure. They're full up on modern IADS hardware and fighter aircraft with BVR capability- none of which the A-10 can deal with. And they're also looking to make sure we have to come from as far away as possible while maintaining mission viability. Rather difficult when you cruise at half the speed as everyone else, and thus require your own tanking tracks to drag you to the fight.
We're supposed to be leaving Afghanistan- not rearming for it.
Posted by: fringe at June 13, 2021 12:22 PM (YNYza)
161
152 Original comment was flagged as spam. So here's the condensed version. Troop strengths have been slashed since the early 90s. Missions have doubled and tripled since then. Budgets have absolutely no connection to strategy or reality, it's all about funneling money to the industries who buy off congressmen. I've been doing this for 36 years, not sure how much longer I'm going to stick around.
Posted by: Stacy0311 at June 13, 2021 12:18 PM (SqpTW
The military/industrial complex. I'm pretty sure we were warned about that back in the 50's.
Posted by: Stacy0311 at June 13, 2021 12:18 PM (SqpTW
The military/industrial complex. I'm pretty sure we were warned about that back in the 50's.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:23 PM (Fs5vw)
162
I work with a fair number of veterans who say that training accidents are often "training accidents" because admitting the real cause would compromise ongoing operations.
Posted by: leoncaruthers at June 13, 2021 12:23 PM (UfRqq)
163
read somewhere and for the life of me i cannot
recall the source, but it stated that picture was responsible for the
single biggest quarterly drop in recruiting since the end of the draft.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:22 PM (axyOa)
those guys should sue. Not the photographer, but the Army.
recall the source, but it stated that picture was responsible for the
single biggest quarterly drop in recruiting since the end of the draft.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:22 PM (axyOa)
those guys should sue. Not the photographer, but the Army.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:24 PM (gJfTA)
164
161 Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:23 PM (Fs5vw)
Ike also just as sternly warned of Faultless Fauci and Pfizer...
Ike also just as sternly warned of Faultless Fauci and Pfizer...
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:24 PM (Lzpvj)
165
I read somewhere and for the life of me i cannot recall the source, but it stated that picture was responsible for the single biggest quarterly drop in recruiting since the end of the draft.
I can certainly see why.
I can certainly see why.
Posted by: Notorious BFD at June 13, 2021 12:24 PM (W4eKo)
166
OT: A bunch of nurses in Houston were fired because they did not want to take the COVID injection. A federal judge has said it is within the rights of an employer for FORCE an experimental vaccine on their workers.
If you don't want to take this, prepare to be destitute, since you can't get unemployment if you're fired.
https://tinyurl.com/yhd92d6e
/can your employer also make you have an abortion? Just wondering
If you don't want to take this, prepare to be destitute, since you can't get unemployment if you're fired.
https://tinyurl.com/yhd92d6e
/can your employer also make you have an abortion? Just wondering
Posted by: vyx at June 13, 2021 12:25 PM (Z/QB3)
167
28 I pray that the draft is never enacted. I do not want my son to fight for the flag of a dead republic
Posted by: Jmel at June 13, 2021 11:19 AM (DQgbI)
All he has to say is there are only 2 genders and the military will have no place for him.
Of course he'll then probably be in a different camp and a political prisoner. What a brave new world is coming.
Posted by: Jmel at June 13, 2021 11:19 AM (DQgbI)
All he has to say is there are only 2 genders and the military will have no place for him.
Of course he'll then probably be in a different camp and a political prisoner. What a brave new world is coming.
Posted by: Bete at June 13, 2021 12:25 PM (Ojki1)
168
The military/industrial complex. I'm pretty sure we were warned about that back in the 50's.
Posted by: Justsayin'
Ancient History - not applicable, no bearing, irrelevant.
--- Damn near all the newspukes
Posted by: Justsayin'
Ancient History - not applicable, no bearing, irrelevant.
--- Damn near all the newspukes
Posted by: Tonypete at June 13, 2021 12:25 PM (Rvt88)
169
Speaking of asymmetric warfare, I'm of the opinion China has been engaged with this against us for the last half dozen years, at least. I'm also of the opinion the Chinese have in fact overthrown the US government. They apparently have the White House. They have infiltrated our Intelligence Community, most other agencies and have a huge influence on the education, media, business and logistical sectors of society.
You have to ask yourself what would one do differently if you wanted to take over a country without firing a shot?
You have to ask yourself what would one do differently if you wanted to take over a country without firing a shot?
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 12:25 PM (3H9h1)
170
A federal judge has said it is within the rights of an employer for FORCE an experimental vaccine on their workers.
Posted by: vyx at June 13, 2021 12:25 PM (Z/QB3)
That's not what he said. In fact, he said just the opposite.
Posted by: vyx at June 13, 2021 12:25 PM (Z/QB3)
That's not what he said. In fact, he said just the opposite.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:26 PM (Q9lwr)
171
Of course he'll then probably be in a different camp and a political prisoner. What a brave new world is coming.
Posted by: Bete at June 13, 2021 12:25 PM (Ojki1)
if we said we were gay, we were out, period. That was not that long ago. Not saying it was right, but it was a hell of a lot better than this. What is so difficult to understand about the military being there to win wars and that is it? Why do they have to constantly F with it?
Posted by: Bete at June 13, 2021 12:25 PM (Ojki1)
if we said we were gay, we were out, period. That was not that long ago. Not saying it was right, but it was a hell of a lot better than this. What is so difficult to understand about the military being there to win wars and that is it? Why do they have to constantly F with it?
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:27 PM (gJfTA)
172
Eliminate or reduce the US military and let the States handle their own defense. They would do a better job than the foreign adventures we have today thanks to the criminals in washington, who defend nothing here at home.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy at June 13, 2021 12:17 PM (R/m4+)
Heh.
Back in the 70's-80's, Washington and oregon agreed to the I-205 bypass route and bridge. Washington was on schedule but oregon was lagging in construction and threatened a special tax on washington drivers in oregon. Washington responded with something similar.
I was at Ft Lewis at the time so some friends and i drew up attack plans for seizing portland. It was a great staff exercise and fun too. The colonel found out and was not amused.
I'd still like to invade Oregon.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy at June 13, 2021 12:17 PM (R/m4+)
Heh.
Back in the 70's-80's, Washington and oregon agreed to the I-205 bypass route and bridge. Washington was on schedule but oregon was lagging in construction and threatened a special tax on washington drivers in oregon. Washington responded with something similar.
I was at Ft Lewis at the time so some friends and i drew up attack plans for seizing portland. It was a great staff exercise and fun too. The colonel found out and was not amused.
I'd still like to invade Oregon.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:27 PM (axyOa)
173
That's not what he said. In fact, he said just the opposite.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo
Can you please explain it then?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo
Can you please explain it then?
Posted by: vyx at June 13, 2021 12:28 PM (Z/QB3)
174
I'd still like to invade Oregon.
Posted by: Diogenes
The only real resistance you'd have is from the seagulls. They're vicious as hell.
Posted by: Diogenes
The only real resistance you'd have is from the seagulls. They're vicious as hell.
Posted by: Tonypete at June 13, 2021 12:29 PM (Rvt88)
175
Caesar, with respect, that's no longer entirely true.
Units through Tier 2 -- Rangers, SF -- are being forced to accept some females.
That's a PC, political decision that undermines combat effectiveness.
Units through Tier 2 -- Rangers, SF -- are being forced to accept some females.
That's a PC, political decision that undermines combat effectiveness.
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 12:29 PM (2Xmlz)
176
We're supposed to be leaving Afghanistan- not rearming for it.
Posted by: fringe at June 13, 2021 12:22 PM (YNYza)
As noted elsewhere, the upcoming war with Chi Nah is something else altogether. So it's not really about whether they A-10 is the right platform there. Maybe it isn't.
Once upon a time we could do MORE than just fight one war at a time.
Also, the upcoming war with Chi Nah, I think our bigger problem is having too many people inside the government (including the military) who we're REALLY not sure are not already on Chi Nah's side.
Posted by: fringe at June 13, 2021 12:22 PM (YNYza)
As noted elsewhere, the upcoming war with Chi Nah is something else altogether. So it's not really about whether they A-10 is the right platform there. Maybe it isn't.
Once upon a time we could do MORE than just fight one war at a time.
Also, the upcoming war with Chi Nah, I think our bigger problem is having too many people inside the government (including the military) who we're REALLY not sure are not already on Chi Nah's side.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:30 PM (naMR+)
177
Even the most modern weaponry will be of limited value if our soldiers
and sailors and marines aren't fighting men, but rather some pale,
post-modern reflection of what they once were.
Does anyone believe the Democrats and their government would ever use the military in support of our national interests? Yes, they're making the military useless, but it's only going to be tasked with pursuing European / UN / Chinese interests anyway.
and sailors and marines aren't fighting men, but rather some pale,
post-modern reflection of what they once were.
Does anyone believe the Democrats and their government would ever use the military in support of our national interests? Yes, they're making the military useless, but it's only going to be tasked with pursuing European / UN / Chinese interests anyway.
Posted by: Methos at June 13, 2021 12:30 PM (kOpft)
178
Probably killed a lot of NVA soldiers, since we won that battle.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:21 PM (Q9lwr
We pretty much wiped out the Viet Cong in the south in that battle. Then Walter Crankcase gave his opinion.
Probably killed a lot of NVA soldiers, since we won that battle.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:21 PM (Q9lwr
We pretty much wiped out the Viet Cong in the south in that battle. Then Walter Crankcase gave his opinion.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Fs5vw)
179
Can you please explain it then?
Posted by: vyx at June 13, 2021 12:28 PM (Z/QB3)
The judge said that it WASN'T an experimental vaccine, and since Texas is an "at will" state, the hospital had every right to demand certain things of their employees.
Posted by: vyx at June 13, 2021 12:28 PM (Z/QB3)
The judge said that it WASN'T an experimental vaccine, and since Texas is an "at will" state, the hospital had every right to demand certain things of their employees.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Q9lwr)
180
Stopping a order for mandatory vaccinations might be a good hill to die on
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Cxk7w)
181
OK. Finished the upstairs vacuuming. We're getting a housekeeper.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (gJfTA)
183
179 Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Q9lwr)
It not being an experimental vaccine is why I had to sign waivers to take it right and the three providers were indemnified from culpability for "oopsies?"
It not being an experimental vaccine is why I had to sign waivers to take it right and the three providers were indemnified from culpability for "oopsies?"
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:32 PM (Lzpvj)
184
I think those were ROTC cadets in the high heels. They should have refused to wear them. It was an unlawful order to begin with. If someone had given me that order, I would have taken my chances with a court martial.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (kTF2Z)
185
180 Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Cxk7w)
Nah neither will enforced sterilizations be, whatever Fauci cooks up we will be told is sensible.
Nah neither will enforced sterilizations be, whatever Fauci cooks up we will be told is sensible.
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (Lzpvj)
186
We're getting a housekeeper.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Just buy WeaselWife a really nice new vacuum. She'll love it!
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Just buy WeaselWife a really nice new vacuum. She'll love it!
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (Q9lwr)
187
The judge said that it WASN'T an experimental vaccine, and since Texas is an "at will" state, the hospital had every right to demand certain things of their employees.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Q9lwr)
The judge also incorrectly said the vaccine was perfectly safe.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Q9lwr)
The judge also incorrectly said the vaccine was perfectly safe.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
188
Well, I think that the new crapola the military (meaning the Obama brass) is pushing is utter nonsense, but so do the rank and file. There are LOTS of stupid things the military requires, and most of them are tolerated so that soldiers, sailors and airmen can just get back to work. This is just one more in a line of garbage spewed by folks "tweaking" military life.
The truth is that those who joined to serve will serve, and those who joined to improve their lives will do so, and those who joined because they couldn't think of something else to do will continue to serve as well.
I was put through mandatory "training" on extremism, whereupon I pointed out that I was probably an extremist because I'm a Catholic, and that it is unconstitutional to limit the free exercise of my religion, so anything I say about being pro-life is off limits to my military chain of command. I'm sure I'm on somebody's list, but fuck 'em. We can all play that game. I'm still working, and I'm still there, and I guess most folks are.
The truth is that those who joined to serve will serve, and those who joined to improve their lives will do so, and those who joined because they couldn't think of something else to do will continue to serve as well.
I was put through mandatory "training" on extremism, whereupon I pointed out that I was probably an extremist because I'm a Catholic, and that it is unconstitutional to limit the free exercise of my religion, so anything I say about being pro-life is off limits to my military chain of command. I'm sure I'm on somebody's list, but fuck 'em. We can all play that game. I'm still working, and I'm still there, and I guess most folks are.
Posted by: tcn in AK, Hail to the Thief at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (SDdx5)
189
You could follow the Swedish Military model.
They cut HALF their military budget by getting rid of 90% of their actual warfighting units.
Or Belgium that cannot participate in many wargame exercises because they cannot pay the overtime for their unionized soldiers.
Maybe we can be like the mighty German Bundeswehr, that has no functioning submarines, and over 75% of their Panzers are deadlined?
They cut HALF their military budget by getting rid of 90% of their actual warfighting units.
Or Belgium that cannot participate in many wargame exercises because they cannot pay the overtime for their unionized soldiers.
Maybe we can be like the mighty German Bundeswehr, that has no functioning submarines, and over 75% of their Panzers are deadlined?
Posted by: rd at June 13, 2021 12:34 PM (Z32m1)
190
OK. Finished the upstairs vacuuming. We're getting a housekeeper.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Why i live in a rambler style house.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Why i live in a rambler style house.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:34 PM (axyOa)
191
I was at Ft Lewis at the time so some friends and i drew up attack plans for seizing portland. It was a great staff exercise and fun too. The colonel found out and was not amused.
I'd still like to invade Oregon.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:27 PM (axyOa)
Sounds like you guys had fun!
Our military today does everything from delivering pizzas to Haiti to building skools in Iraq and then some but not it's one job that it is there for.....defending the United States and it's borders.
I'd still like to invade Oregon.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:27 PM (axyOa)
Sounds like you guys had fun!
Our military today does everything from delivering pizzas to Haiti to building skools in Iraq and then some but not it's one job that it is there for.....defending the United States and it's borders.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy at June 13, 2021 12:34 PM (R/m4+)
192
The underlying assumption that allows the military to chase, diversity, woke-ism, whatever one might call it, is that, should push truly come to shove, we'll nuke 'em. Horrifying.
Posted by: occam's brassiere at June 13, 2021 12:35 PM (8HvsU)
193
We pretty much wiped out the Viet Cong in the south in that battle. Then Walter Crankcase gave his opinion.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Fs5vw)
a massive victory became a loss, thanks to the media. I guess they have their own battle streamers. Tet is one for sure.
Posted by: Justsayin' at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Fs5vw)
a massive victory became a loss, thanks to the media. I guess they have their own battle streamers. Tet is one for sure.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:35 PM (gJfTA)
194
186 We're getting a housekeeper.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Just buy WeaselWife a really nice new vacuum. She'll love it!
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (Q9lwr
---
I already did that! And knowing her as you do, you won't be surprised she really liked it. Still, I agreed to help out with vacuuming and I'm going to help by hiring a professional.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Just buy WeaselWife a really nice new vacuum. She'll love it!
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (Q9lwr
---
I already did that! And knowing her as you do, you won't be surprised she really liked it. Still, I agreed to help out with vacuuming and I'm going to help by hiring a professional.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:35 PM (MVjcR)
195
We're getting a housekeeper.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Just buy WeaselWife a really nice new vacuum. She'll love it!
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (Q9lwr)
Don't do it!!!
That damned bread maker i got for Mrs D is still in the box.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Just buy WeaselWife a really nice new vacuum. She'll love it!
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (Q9lwr)
Don't do it!!!
That damned bread maker i got for Mrs D is still in the box.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:36 PM (axyOa)
196
187 The judge said that it WASN'T an experimental vaccine, and since Texas is an "at will" state, the hospital had every right to demand certain things of their employees.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Q9lwr)
The judge also incorrectly said the vaccine was perfectly safe.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
Norton Sound Health (hospital in Nome) decided to fire anyone who wasn't vaccinated. They lost a shit-ton of nursing staff, and I doubt they will be able to replace them. Who in their right mind would relocate to Nome when there are nursing shortages in Texas or Florida? So, that means the Native Corp who runs the hospital just shit all over the Natives who live in the broad region Norton Sound covers.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (Q9lwr)
The judge also incorrectly said the vaccine was perfectly safe.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
Norton Sound Health (hospital in Nome) decided to fire anyone who wasn't vaccinated. They lost a shit-ton of nursing staff, and I doubt they will be able to replace them. Who in their right mind would relocate to Nome when there are nursing shortages in Texas or Florida? So, that means the Native Corp who runs the hospital just shit all over the Natives who live in the broad region Norton Sound covers.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Posted by: tcn in AK, Hail to the Thief at June 13, 2021 12:36 PM (SDdx5)
197
192 Posted by: occam's brassiere at June 13, 2021 12:35 PM (8HvsU)
Had Gore won recounts 2000 I suspect strongly he would have nuked somewhere in the region and the media would have stood mute.
Had Gore won recounts 2000 I suspect strongly he would have nuked somewhere in the region and the media would have stood mute.
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:36 PM (Lzpvj)
198
I for one am thankful for this nightmare.
I am riding my motorcycles harder and faster than I ever have w 45 years of riding experience.
I'm 64 and I've signed up for Keith Code's California Superbike School.
See, I feel like I no longer have much to lose. Soon I will feel like I have nothing left to lose. So, I guess Bonneville Salt Flats, see ya in October.
I am riding my motorcycles harder and faster than I ever have w 45 years of riding experience.
I'm 64 and I've signed up for Keith Code's California Superbike School.
See, I feel like I no longer have much to lose. Soon I will feel like I have nothing left to lose. So, I guess Bonneville Salt Flats, see ya in October.
Posted by: Charles W. Ridiculous, Jr. at June 13, 2021 12:37 PM (xfSPn)
199
186 We're getting a housekeeper.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
I need a housekeeper who also yells at the boy to do his homework.
I told DH he could have a girlfriend so long as she knows how to clean my oven.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
I need a housekeeper who also yells at the boy to do his homework.
I told DH he could have a girlfriend so long as she knows how to clean my oven.
Posted by: tcn in AK, Hail to the Thief at June 13, 2021 12:37 PM (SDdx5)
200
grab all the Pinot in sight.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (gJfTA)
some of my fav reasonable pinots come from the Russian River valley
which neither in OR or Russia
but it does make me a pinko
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (gJfTA)
some of my fav reasonable pinots come from the Russian River valley
which neither in OR or Russia
but it does make me a pinko
Posted by: REDACTED at June 13, 2021 12:37 PM (8o8kf)
201
Has anybody noticed that our president is so fucking feeble that he can't even show up for tea without looking like he'll fall down and break his neck before supper?
Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 13, 2021 12:37 PM (2k5ha)
202
I'd still like to invade Oregon.
Posted by: Diogenes
grab all the Pinot in sight.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (gJfTA)
Damned skippy!
And then do a recon in force to seize the microbreweries in Hood River.
Posted by: Diogenes
grab all the Pinot in sight.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (gJfTA)
Damned skippy!
And then do a recon in force to seize the microbreweries in Hood River.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 12:38 PM (axyOa)
203
David Horowitz (and two other authors) just wrote an essay on the destruction of American military capability by the Biden administration. They call it "Betraying America".
https://tinyurl.com/2wssjzt2
https://tinyurl.com/2wssjzt2
Posted by: Huck Follywood at June 13, 2021 12:38 PM (Zny85)
204
Stopping a order for mandatory vaccinations might be a good hill to die on
We never should have tolerated any mandatory vaccination. It gives government and friends too much room for mischief.
Stopping a order for mandatory vaccinations might be a good hill to die on
We never should have tolerated any mandatory vaccination. It gives government and friends too much room for mischief.
Posted by: Methos at June 13, 2021 12:38 PM (kOpft)
205
Clinton associated mortality update:
"The journalist who broke the story about the controversial 2016 tarmac meeting between former President Bill Clinton and then-Attorney General Loretta Lynch was found dead Saturday morning, according to police."
_Washington Examiner
"The journalist who broke the story about the controversial 2016 tarmac meeting between former President Bill Clinton and then-Attorney General Loretta Lynch was found dead Saturday morning, according to police."
_Washington Examiner
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:40 PM (p+6gN)
206
The judge said that it WASN'T an experimental vaccine, and since Texas is an "at will" state, the hospital had every right to demand certain things of their employees.
I don't see a single positive thing with that scenario but I guess that's just me.
I don't see a single positive thing with that scenario but I guess that's just me.
Posted by: Notorious BFD at June 13, 2021 12:40 PM (W4eKo)
207
OK. Finished the upstairs vacuuming. We're getting a housekeeper.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Sounds like you already have one.
Posted by: Weasel at June 13, 2021 12:31 PM (MVjcR)
Sounds like you already have one.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:40 PM (naMR+)
208
Dr Bone as long as its before July 1 I would be happy asall get out.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 12:41 PM (Cxk7w)
209
Just buy WeaselWife a really nice new vacuum. She'll love it!
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo
Don't do it!!!
That damned bread maker i got for Mrs D is still in the box.
Posted by: Diogenes
The chainsaw I got my wife works great! She does seem to avoid me for a day or so after I use it. Hmmmm..
Nah, couldn't be. . . .
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo
Don't do it!!!
That damned bread maker i got for Mrs D is still in the box.
Posted by: Diogenes
The chainsaw I got my wife works great! She does seem to avoid me for a day or so after I use it. Hmmmm..
Nah, couldn't be. . . .
Posted by: Tonypete at June 13, 2021 12:41 PM (Rvt88)
210
Again, aside from evacuating embassies, what's the point of "power projection" in 2021? With this country? With this "leadership"? With this set of global conditions, including a world pretty much bereft of any adversaries with power projection capacity, and also bereft of almost any identifiable concrete interests that would be threatened by the few plausible scenarios?
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 12:41 PM (OTzUX)
211
Do you rememberv the Greeks supposedly had more than twice the number of battle ready tanks during the depths of the Greek Economic crises than the mighty German Army.
Probably because the greeks are right next to their historic enemies, the Turks, while Germany has Poland and Ukraine between them and Russia.
When you do not see any enemies, your military is disrespected and atrophies.
Just ask France, Belgium, Holland, and Britain in 1938.
After all, who is afraid of a Billion Screaming Chinese equipped with the best military equipmnt they can copy?
Probably because the greeks are right next to their historic enemies, the Turks, while Germany has Poland and Ukraine between them and Russia.
When you do not see any enemies, your military is disrespected and atrophies.
Just ask France, Belgium, Holland, and Britain in 1938.
After all, who is afraid of a Billion Screaming Chinese equipped with the best military equipmnt they can copy?
Posted by: rd at June 13, 2021 12:41 PM (Z32m1)
212
The judge also incorrectly said the vaccine was perfectly safe.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
That's what a nation that respects the rule of law does.
Has judges ruling on the safety and effectiveness of medical matters.
If you don't agree with this judge, you don't agree with science.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
That's what a nation that respects the rule of law does.
Has judges ruling on the safety and effectiveness of medical matters.
If you don't agree with this judge, you don't agree with science.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:42 PM (naMR+)
213
The CV19 drugs are the Schrödinger's cat of pharma.
They're not vaccines if you read the fine print.
But they are vaccines when a company or politician wants to inject you with experimental tech.
They're not vaccines if you read the fine print.
But they are vaccines when a company or politician wants to inject you with experimental tech.
Posted by: callsign claymore at June 13, 2021 12:42 PM (2Xmlz)
214
The judge also incorrectly said the vaccine was perfectly safe.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
-----------
How would the judge know?
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
-----------
How would the judge know?
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:43 PM (kTF2Z)
Posted by: Tonypete at June 13, 2021 12:44 PM (Rvt88)
216
>>> 214 The judge also incorrectly said the vaccine was perfectly safe.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
-----------
How would the judge know?
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:43 PM (kTF2Z)
He's SMAAHHHHRRRT like me!!!
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
-----------
How would the judge know?
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:43 PM (kTF2Z)
He's SMAAHHHHRRRT like me!!!
Posted by: Hawaiian Judge #347 at June 13, 2021 12:44 PM (d5OIB)
Posted by: Niccolo Machiavelli at June 13, 2021 12:44 PM (XGAZE)
218
Honest elections in '22 will bring Republican control to the house and the senate leaving Biden's pipe dreams in the same shape as the Bonhomme Richard.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:44 PM (p+6gN)
219
The only (barely) plausible scenario of interest is a cutoff of Gulf oil - but the only candidate for this - Iran - obviously would be the biggest loser from that, so, not so plausible.
In addition to which, Iran is in the process of getting everything it currently wants - and more - and boy howdy when the gold rush by our "allies" in Europe ramps up, the regime will face few limits or challenges. Going the bad thriller novel route and blocking the Straits makes no kind of sense for Iran today, and it is laughable for the much more secure, confident, solvent, and unthreatened regime of the next few years.
In addition to which, Iran is in the process of getting everything it currently wants - and more - and boy howdy when the gold rush by our "allies" in Europe ramps up, the regime will face few limits or challenges. Going the bad thriller novel route and blocking the Straits makes no kind of sense for Iran today, and it is laughable for the much more secure, confident, solvent, and unthreatened regime of the next few years.
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 12:45 PM (OTzUX)
220
The judge also incorrectly said the vaccine was perfectly safe.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
How would the judge know?
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:43 PM (kTF2Z)
He watches CNN.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:33 PM (2DOZq)
How would the judge know?
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 12:43 PM (kTF2Z)
He watches CNN.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:45 PM (naMR+)
Posted by: Rodrigo Borgia at June 13, 2021 12:46 PM (XGAZE)
222
197 192 Posted by: occam's brassiere at June 13, 2021 12:35 PM (8HvsU)
Had Gore won recounts 2000 I suspect strongly he would have nuked somewhere in the region and the media would have stood mute.
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:36 PM (Lzpvj)
==================
No, the News Media would have been Full On Pom Pom Waving Cheerleaders. YEA GORE!!! What a MAN!!!
Had Gore won recounts 2000 I suspect strongly he would have nuked somewhere in the region and the media would have stood mute.
Posted by: sven at June 13, 2021 12:36 PM (Lzpvj)
==================
No, the News Media would have been Full On Pom Pom Waving Cheerleaders. YEA GORE!!! What a MAN!!!
Posted by: rd at June 13, 2021 12:47 PM (Z32m1)
223
This creeper person is pretty high strung about line breaks
Posted by: Too Bad Costa Rica Sucks at June 13, 2021 12:47 PM (xEIoY)
224
Bitchute. Must Watch. Retired Canadian pathologist speaks out against vaccination program.
https://tinyurl.com/25erw4d5
https://tinyurl.com/25erw4d5
Posted by: You Really Don't Want to Know at June 13, 2021 12:48 PM (AHq56)
225
"For a 7 percent decrease in active-duty Army garrison strength,"
How much could we get for a 25% reduction in Pentagon strength?
My bet is a whole lot more.
How much could we get for a 25% reduction in Pentagon strength?
My bet is a whole lot more.
Posted by: rd at June 13, 2021 12:49 PM (Z32m1)
226
Honestly, Dubya should have followed the advice of his military leadership after 9-11, and blown Kandahar off the face of the earth. That would be a different place if he had, and we would have been long gone by now, with no Taliban in sight.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 12:49 PM (QZBA7)
227
A corrupted and feeble military might not be a bad thing when the shooty stuff goes down. IYKWIM.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 13, 2021 12:49 PM (3H9h1)
228
Braenyard, 95% of Biden's dream (translation: the grab-bag of destructive idiocy his handlers and the Dems current dominant faction of fringe nuts cherish) does not require congressional action. Nor does most of it depend on the judiciary continuing to be the ramshackle lawless farce that it's become.
But speaking of righteous congressional backlash, Cotton actually raised this jaw-dropping racist harassment and vandalism currently going on in the military ("training") with the pathetic SecDef in a hearing. And the WashTimes had reporting claiming that morale, separations, etc were already showing some notable problems.
But Cotton had better listen to his own wisdom from Jan. 6. Tom, if you provoke these people, by asking such uncomfortable questions, you're risking them doing much worse, you're risking provoking them. Someone should email Tom a copy of his own comments, he is venturing into dangerous territory.
But speaking of righteous congressional backlash, Cotton actually raised this jaw-dropping racist harassment and vandalism currently going on in the military ("training") with the pathetic SecDef in a hearing. And the WashTimes had reporting claiming that morale, separations, etc were already showing some notable problems.
But Cotton had better listen to his own wisdom from Jan. 6. Tom, if you provoke these people, by asking such uncomfortable questions, you're risking them doing much worse, you're risking provoking them. Someone should email Tom a copy of his own comments, he is venturing into dangerous territory.
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 12:50 PM (OTzUX)
229
221 (looks in, notices that the thread has, once again, been derailed onto vaccine crap, moves on)
Posted by: Rodrigo Borgia at June 13, 2021 12:46 PM (XGAZE)
---------------
It's binary, one will either do git or not. We are past the point of conversation changing another's mind and we are past the point of believing scientists or experts.
It's a privy of thoughts.
Posted by: Rodrigo Borgia at June 13, 2021 12:46 PM (XGAZE)
---------------
It's binary, one will either do git or not. We are past the point of conversation changing another's mind and we are past the point of believing scientists or experts.
It's a privy of thoughts.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:50 PM (p+6gN)
230
Honestly, Dubya should have followed the advice of his military leadership after 9-11, and blown Kandahar off the face of the earth. That would be a different place if he had, and we would have been long gone by now, with no Taliban in sight.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 12:49 PM (QZBA7)
There was too much money to be made in Iraq, and I suspect the actual military leadership was drowned out by all the Military Industrial Complex boys who were circle jerking and creaming themselves over how much money they were going to make with endless war.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 12:49 PM (QZBA7)
There was too much money to be made in Iraq, and I suspect the actual military leadership was drowned out by all the Military Industrial Complex boys who were circle jerking and creaming themselves over how much money they were going to make with endless war.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 12:52 PM (naMR+)
231
>>> 218 Honest elections in '22 will bring Republican control to the house and the senate leaving Biden's pipe dreams in the same shape as the Bonhomme Richard.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:44 PM (p+6gN)
That's adorable.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:44 PM (p+6gN)
That's adorable.
Posted by: Maasive Fcking Voter Fraud LLC, GOPe, Democomms at June 13, 2021 12:53 PM (d5OIB)
232
And CBD, the Israeli leadership thing really merits some fat-chewing. Sort of ties in to this thread.
Posted by: rhomboid at June 13, 2021 12:53 PM (OTzUX)
233
Interesting question raised above, project power? Where and why? Been a long time since we subdued a country with force. I can't even imagine what the next real war looks like though I suspect it features a lot of mushroom clouds.
Posted by: Too Bad Costa Rica Sucks at June 13, 2021 12:54 PM (xEIoY)
234
Did go san-masque at grocery store today, was self identifying as a vaccine recipient
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 12:54 PM (Cxk7w)
235
231 >>> 218 Honest elections in '22 will bring Republican control to the house and the senate leaving Biden's pipe dreams in the same shape as the Bonhomme Richard.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:44 PM (p+6gN)
That's adorable.
Posted by: Maasive Fcking Voter Fraud LLC, GOPe, Democomms at June 13, 2021 12:53 PM (d5OIB)
-------------------
Chairman Xi applauds your courage.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:44 PM (p+6gN)
That's adorable.
Posted by: Maasive Fcking Voter Fraud LLC, GOPe, Democomms at June 13, 2021 12:53 PM (d5OIB)
-------------------
Chairman Xi applauds your courage.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:54 PM (p+6gN)
236
DJT ending the "endless wars" is a big reason why the Steal happened, and why we are stuck with Biden, who was mysteriously approved by both parties.
Posted by: Wait, what? at June 13, 2021 12:54 PM (aAP3z)
237
Keep having faith that we'll have clean elections and that the government/media overclass loves you and only wants to the best for you and would never push a potentially risky therapy that has never been widely tested before. They definitely care about American Democracy and Science and don't want to break any eggs to make an omelette.
Posted by: Dworkin Barimen - anarcho-tyranny? you're soaking in it! at June 13, 2021 12:55 PM (DXFDM)
Posted by: You Really Don't Want to Know at June 13, 2021 12:56 PM (AHq56)
239
It's binary, one will either do git or not. We are past the point of conversation changing another's mind and we are past the point of believing scientists or experts.
Meh. I already did it. I took the old school J&J shot months ago. Doesn't mean I want people who made a different decision to lose their jobs. Fortunately, those hospitals need staff a LOT more than the staff need those particular hospitals. Let them fire you, ride unemployment for six months, then take your pick of desperate medical offices.
Meh. I already did it. I took the old school J&J shot months ago. Doesn't mean I want people who made a different decision to lose their jobs. Fortunately, those hospitals need staff a LOT more than the staff need those particular hospitals. Let them fire you, ride unemployment for six months, then take your pick of desperate medical offices.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 12:56 PM (QZBA7)
240
IAF is doing summer drills with USA and Italy in Italy.
F-35 city.
F-35 city.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:56 PM (p+6gN)
241
At some point our enemies will pounce. They always have.
Posted by: torabora at June 13, 2021 12:58 PM (Y274z)
242
I haven't seen any one discuss the Israeli study of the effects of their vaccine which indicated an effect on cardio function in those vaccinated under the age of 25.
Posted by: Just a side note at June 13, 2021 12:58 PM (2DOZq)
243
237 Keep having faith that we'll have clean elections and that the government/media overclass loves you and only wants to
----------------
It's not faith it's tough, hard willed work.
Ask the people on the ground fighting in
AZ, GA, WI, MI, and NH.
----------------
It's not faith it's tough, hard willed work.
Ask the people on the ground fighting in
AZ, GA, WI, MI, and NH.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 13, 2021 12:59 PM (p+6gN)
244
What is so difficult to understand about the military being there to win wars and that is it? Why do they have to constantly F with it?
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:27 PM (gJfTA)
Because you can force social experiment with it and the soldiers don't have a lot of space to refuse to comply, given the rights they forego when enlisting.
This is why Cletus was big on it in office, and Obumbles was ready to play with it in zeal. Get to practice being a dictator before figuring out how to bring it to the masses.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 12:27 PM (gJfTA)
Because you can force social experiment with it and the soldiers don't have a lot of space to refuse to comply, given the rights they forego when enlisting.
This is why Cletus was big on it in office, and Obumbles was ready to play with it in zeal. Get to practice being a dictator before figuring out how to bring it to the masses.
Posted by: Bete at June 13, 2021 12:59 PM (Ojki1)
245
CBD, I saw an article saying the G7, or whatever, has agreed to set tax rates at a uniform level, in order to prevent countries from becoming tax havens for companies.
An agreement, I'm quite sure, will benefit China enormously.
I find it astonishing the leaders of these countries are willingly selling out their citizens for this nonsense. Of course, power is all that matters to these people, so, I'm sure they really don't care.
Anyway, I'm quite sure degrading our fighting forces is also being done in order to benefit China.
Welcome to the Vassal States of America.
An agreement, I'm quite sure, will benefit China enormously.
I find it astonishing the leaders of these countries are willingly selling out their citizens for this nonsense. Of course, power is all that matters to these people, so, I'm sure they really don't care.
Anyway, I'm quite sure degrading our fighting forces is also being done in order to benefit China.
Welcome to the Vassal States of America.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (2SdPm)
246
Folks, we were screwed back in the forties when the Demonic party changed the name of the War Department to the Department of Defense. That was the first big sign that we were going in the wrong direction.
Posted by: Beverly at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (2Karq)
247
Did go san-masque at grocery store today, was self identifying as a vaccine recipient
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 12:54 PM (Cxk7w)
I will never wear one again. I went to dominos, against my best thoughts, yesterday. It was carry out and in person, I am old school. I made the order and before the guy rung it up, he told me to put on a mask. He had a mask on, there was a huge plastic barrier they put up. Right then I told him to forget it, cancel the order. I could not go forward in good faith and the guy left me no other legit option. I was 20 seconds from paying him and then going outside to wait the ten minutes. Now I will never do business with them again. The funny part is what really got me was the idea of putting on a Kabuki theater for bad pizza. That was too much.
Posted by: Skip at June 13, 2021 12:54 PM (Cxk7w)
I will never wear one again. I went to dominos, against my best thoughts, yesterday. It was carry out and in person, I am old school. I made the order and before the guy rung it up, he told me to put on a mask. He had a mask on, there was a huge plastic barrier they put up. Right then I told him to forget it, cancel the order. I could not go forward in good faith and the guy left me no other legit option. I was 20 seconds from paying him and then going outside to wait the ten minutes. Now I will never do business with them again. The funny part is what really got me was the idea of putting on a Kabuki theater for bad pizza. That was too much.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (gJfTA)
248
An old friend who is an attorney says his firm is shying away from forcing people to get the shot due to liability. Of course, if this vaccine goes wrong I'm not sure it matters.
Posted by: Too Bad Costa Rica Sucks at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (xEIoY)
249
242 I haven't seen any one discuss the Israeli study
@ 224 https://tinyurl.com/25erw4d5
@ 224 https://tinyurl.com/25erw4d5
Posted by: You Really Don't Want to Know at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (AHq56)
250
242 I haven't seen any one discuss the Israeli study of the effects of their vaccine which indicated an effect on cardio function in those vaccinated under the age of 25.
Posted by: Just a side note
link?
Posted by: Just a side note
link?
Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (oEn12)
251
There was too much money to be made in Iraq, and I suspect the actual military leadership was drowned out by all the Military Industrial Complex boys who were circle jerking and creaming themselves over how much money they were going to make with endless war.
Oh, I'm not saying we should or shouldn't have gone into Iraq. (We shouldn't have, Saddam was keeping Iran in check.) I'm JUST saying, lead off the A-Stan effort with an ICBM on Kandahar before midnight on 9-11-01, and the whole Middle East would be a very quiet place right now. And no other nuclear power would have said a damned thing about it.
Oh, I'm not saying we should or shouldn't have gone into Iraq. (We shouldn't have, Saddam was keeping Iran in check.) I'm JUST saying, lead off the A-Stan effort with an ICBM on Kandahar before midnight on 9-11-01, and the whole Middle East would be a very quiet place right now. And no other nuclear power would have said a damned thing about it.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 01:01 PM (QZBA7)
252
Let them fire you, ride unemployment for six months, then take your pick of desperate medical offices.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 12:56 PM (QZBA7)
A lot to be said for this. In Washington state, a family of four with both parents working average wage jobs, can on the current covid-enhanced unemployment, make $107k a year.
Posted by: Hawkpilot at June 13, 2021 12:56 PM (QZBA7)
A lot to be said for this. In Washington state, a family of four with both parents working average wage jobs, can on the current covid-enhanced unemployment, make $107k a year.
Posted by: Diogenes at June 13, 2021 01:01 PM (axyOa)
253
FIRST NOOD
Posted by: Skip guy who says NOOD at June 13, 2021 01:01 PM (Cxk7w)
Posted by: You Really Don't Want to Know at June 13, 2021 01:02 PM (AHq56)
255
I can understand W not wanting to use nukes in 2001, although I think he'd have been justified. He should have made the rubble bounce. Then tell whoever is left don't make us come back.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at June 13, 2021 01:02 PM (kTF2Z)
256
Now I will never do business with them again. The funny part is what really got me was the idea of putting on a Kabuki theater for bad pizza. That was too much.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (gJfTA)
-------------
In a generation, we've gone from the hippie counter culture damn the consequences to a nation of frightened sheep.
It's appalling.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (gJfTA)
-------------
In a generation, we've gone from the hippie counter culture damn the consequences to a nation of frightened sheep.
It's appalling.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing at June 13, 2021 01:03 PM (2SdPm)
257
Right then I told him to forget it, cancel the order. I could not go forward in good faith and the guy left me no other legit option. I was 20 seconds from paying him and then going outside to wait the ten minutes. Now I will never do business with them again. The funny part is what really got me was the idea of putting on a Kabuki theater for bad pizza. That was too much.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (gJfTA)
I had a similar experience in a McDonalds. The little manager guy was running himself ragged (not enough staff), and I had ordered at one of the kiosks. Got to the point where it said "take a table number," but they didn't have table numbers anywhere for me to take. When I asked the guy, he said "we don't have inside dining."
Okie dokie then. I said "I'm not eating in my car like a savage" and walked out. if you don't have inside dining, I'm leaving. If anyone tells me to put a mask on, I'm leaving. Period.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 01:00 PM (gJfTA)
I had a similar experience in a McDonalds. The little manager guy was running himself ragged (not enough staff), and I had ordered at one of the kiosks. Got to the point where it said "take a table number," but they didn't have table numbers anywhere for me to take. When I asked the guy, he said "we don't have inside dining."
Okie dokie then. I said "I'm not eating in my car like a savage" and walked out. if you don't have inside dining, I'm leaving. If anyone tells me to put a mask on, I'm leaving. Period.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 13, 2021 01:04 PM (naMR+)
258
I've spammed the NOOD @3 with the link above which discusses the Israeli study on Myocarditis and the cases that are being reported to VAERS.
Posted by: You Really Don't Want to Know at June 13, 2021 01:05 PM (AHq56)
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks aka Hangdog Barkston at June 13, 2021 01:06 PM (d9FiS)
260
I was in a liquor store a couple of days ago. Two ditzy old broads were trying to come up with what they needed to make a Tequila Sunrise. Like the dolt I am, I decided to help them out. I told them what was in it and how to make it. Just then one of them asked me why I was not wearing a mask. She asked if I had been vaccinated and whether I had a card to prove it.
I said the entire line of questioning was out of line, here I was helping these random biddies. Even her biddie friend realized it was dumb. They apologized and then tried to turn it around and say they were "anti mask". yeah right, you asked me for my card.
But those were two examples in a day or so. Other than that, even in a blue area, no one says shite. The numbers are going against the maskers, people are tired of it. They had a majority but it is dwindling every day. They really have no future. Let the bitter enders cling to their masks and mask up their children. In the end, they will lose and the virtue signaling will fail. People don't want to live like zombies for life.
I said the entire line of questioning was out of line, here I was helping these random biddies. Even her biddie friend realized it was dumb. They apologized and then tried to turn it around and say they were "anti mask". yeah right, you asked me for my card.
But those were two examples in a day or so. Other than that, even in a blue area, no one says shite. The numbers are going against the maskers, people are tired of it. They had a majority but it is dwindling every day. They really have no future. Let the bitter enders cling to their masks and mask up their children. In the end, they will lose and the virtue signaling will fail. People don't want to live like zombies for life.
Posted by: Quint at June 13, 2021 01:06 PM (gJfTA)
261
259 Styx666 ?
Posted by: You Really Don't Want to Know at June 13, 2021 01:09 PM (AHq56)
262
Hawkpilot
Ever been to Kandahar? Ever seen a lot of dead people ?
Ever been to Kandahar? Ever seen a lot of dead people ?
Posted by: Proud Moderate at June 13, 2021 01:16 PM (84jfY)
263
223 This creeper person is pretty high strung about line breaks
Posted by: Too Bad Costa Rica Sucks at June 13, 2021 12:47 PM (xEIoY)
If I could just figure out what the magic combo is. But what works one day doesn't the next (and sometimes on the next post). I'm a grammar nazi. What can I say.
It's bad enough having every other post willowed without being lectured about annoying unbroken strings of text.
Anyway, point taken. I need to clean the kitchen. Keep yer hand on it, Horde.
Posted by: Too Bad Costa Rica Sucks at June 13, 2021 12:47 PM (xEIoY)
If I could just figure out what the magic combo is. But what works one day doesn't the next (and sometimes on the next post). I'm a grammar nazi. What can I say.
It's bad enough having every other post willowed without being lectured about annoying unbroken strings of text.
Anyway, point taken. I need to clean the kitchen. Keep yer hand on it, Horde.
Posted by: creeper at June 13, 2021 01:26 PM (XxJt1)
264
It is time to examine the military academies. With teaching shifting from war fighting to social justice it diminishes the reason for having an academy. Over 50 cadets were caught cheating and only a few were expelled. So much for no cadet will lie, steal, or cheat, but they do look good in heals.
Posted by: Ron at June 13, 2021 01:27 PM (pOrFv)
265
Hrothgar, you are so right!
No veteran I (4-F), but I never liked the name Department of Defense. And it's been DoD since I was born.
"War" is active. "Let's git them bastards!"
"Defense" is passive. "Take cover!"
Same with the advertising of the '70s. "Join (service branch) and learn skills you can use as a civilian." In other words, tax-funded school.
I know not everyone can be career military, but it seemed wasteful.
No veteran I (4-F), but I never liked the name Department of Defense. And it's been DoD since I was born.
"War" is active. "Let's git them bastards!"
"Defense" is passive. "Take cover!"
Same with the advertising of the '70s. "Join (service branch) and learn skills you can use as a civilian." In other words, tax-funded school.
I know not everyone can be career military, but it seemed wasteful.
Posted by: Weak Geek at June 13, 2021 01:45 PM (Om/di)
266
"I believe if you talk to any infantry grunt, they will place their faith in Jesus Christ and a squad of A-10s."
For the Marines, nothing sounds sweeter than A-10s arriving on station.
For the Marines, nothing sounds sweeter than A-10s arriving on station.
Posted by: Hoyt's Paid Turkish Provocateur at June 13, 2021 02:52 PM (83lwH)
267
"Meh. I already did it"
Would not be surprised to learn my medical file will be cross-indexed with my political opinions, ordering my Doc to administer Directive 66.
Would not be surprised to learn my medical file will be cross-indexed with my political opinions, ordering my Doc to administer Directive 66.
Posted by: Hoyt's Paid Turkish Provocateur at June 13, 2021 03:01 PM (83lwH)
268
Hello, all the time i used to check web site posts here in the early
hours in the daylight, since i like to gain knowledge of
more and more.
hours in the daylight, since i like to gain knowledge of
more and more.
Posted by: Custom Made Evening Dress for Wedding at June 13, 2021 03:35 PM (csRBj)
269
Never fear! Our Armed Forces will be fully-versed in anti-racism, anti-patriarchy, LGBTQ+, and everything else they need to surrender so fast it'll knock our enemies on their arse.
Posted by: setnaffa at June 13, 2021 03:54 PM (hSCJ/)
270
"Even the most modern weaponry will be of limited value if our soldiers and sailors and marines aren't fighting men, but rather some pale, post-modern reflection of what they once were."
That will be a feature when our Shining Ones point them at American citizens.
That will be a feature when our Shining Ones point them at American citizens.
Posted by: Rowsdower says Ashli Babbitt is Crispus Attucks and so will you be soon at June 13, 2021 04:13 PM (hRMuo)
271
Did they ever find that missing $21 trillion? I would like it back. Oh and cancel that F35 program once and for all. Almost 20 years later it still isn't worth a damn except hundreds of billions for Lockheed-Martin.
Posted by: JBirks at June 13, 2021 04:19 PM (JeTeQ)
272
What would the fleet look like if we just gave them the 50% of the Department of HHS budget, the Army got half of the Department of Education budget, and we split 75% of the budgets of Housing and Urban Development, Interior, and Labor between Air Force and Space?
I doubt we'd ever be able to kill off that much bureaucracy--they raise a stink if we discuss cutting their annual increase--but it's something to consider...
I doubt we'd ever be able to kill off that much bureaucracy--they raise a stink if we discuss cutting their annual increase--but it's something to consider...
Posted by: setnaffa at June 13, 2021 05:31 PM (lrLl2)
273
I weep for my Navy.
Posted by: GGE of the Moron Horde, NC Chapter at June 13, 2021 06:59 PM (CcOog)
274
The French progressives in 1890 purged the military of its conservative elements. This stunted the military so by 1914 the French Army was a poor joke that ultimately mutined in 1916 due to its incredibly bad leadership, outmoded tactics and bankrupt policies. Its navy was a bad joke that didn't even figure into the balance of power since its design concerns appear to have been centered on including cathouses rather than armor or water tight compartments. Its air force was notable for training the Germans in live fire exercises.
Aside from that its a miracle that the Americans arrived in 1918 to save the French and the war.
Now after the Russians, Chinese, and North Koreans all die laughing at our clever queer be all you can be recruiting ads, we can be sure that the Biden's, Obamas, Bushies, Clintons all send their children to defend America. Oops my bad, I meant to volunteer for the People's Fifth Assault Brigade, PRC.
All hail Chairman Pudding Cup!
Aside from that its a miracle that the Americans arrived in 1918 to save the French and the war.
Now after the Russians, Chinese, and North Koreans all die laughing at our clever queer be all you can be recruiting ads, we can be sure that the Biden's, Obamas, Bushies, Clintons all send their children to defend America. Oops my bad, I meant to volunteer for the People's Fifth Assault Brigade, PRC.
All hail Chairman Pudding Cup!
Posted by: I am not corey Booker at June 13, 2021 09:30 PM (EcD5Y)
275
I am a Marine well former Marine so is my Brother my son and his two sons, all veterans of some war or other.
I was wondering about my grandsons and their ideas on whether to enlist and what branch/MOS so I asked them both separately.
Both basically said the same thing, "We aren't gay", well they used the "Q" word which cannot be said here.
I said well all of them aren't gay and they said they didn't care to be associated as being the "Q" word which is how their peers and friends see the current military.
The youth of America, who may one day be asked to serve by enlistment or draft considers the US Military as the "Q" words.
China just one the war.
I was wondering about my grandsons and their ideas on whether to enlist and what branch/MOS so I asked them both separately.
Both basically said the same thing, "We aren't gay", well they used the "Q" word which cannot be said here.
I said well all of them aren't gay and they said they didn't care to be associated as being the "Q" word which is how their peers and friends see the current military.
The youth of America, who may one day be asked to serve by enlistment or draft considers the US Military as the "Q" words.
China just one the war.
Posted by: obsidian at June 15, 2021 11:18 AM (7+yqP)
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