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GDP Grows Strong 3% in Second Quarter

The 3% rate is the annualized growth rate, that is, what the annual growth rate would be if this quarter were repeated four times.

It's a solid number -- a strong number. In my own mind 3% is the baseline for a "strong" rate of growth. The economy can grow more, but 3% is where the "strong" range begins.

Even the AP is forced to concede this is "strong" growth.

But note that immediately after conceding that the second quarter showed "surprising" (that means "experts predicted the opposite") "strong" growth, they immediately begin undermining that fact, talking up foreigners' and leftists' "concerns" about the economy.

And then they keep talking about the 0.5% contraction in the first quarter, talking about the old news of the first quarter more than the new news of the second quarter.

The U.S. economy expanded at a surprising 3% annual pace from April through June, bouncing back at least temporarily from a first-quarter drop that reflected disruptions from President Donald Trump's trade wars.

Still, details of the report suggested that U.S. consumers and businesses are wary about the economic uncertainty arising from Trump's radical campaign to restructure the American economy by slapping big taxes -- tariffs -- on imports from around the world.

Weird, huh, that the only time that the left admits that taxes slow economic growth is when Trump imposes tariffs? They deny that Democrat tax hikes slow growth. In fact, they've been screaming about Trump's tax cuts without ever once conceding that lower taxes spur growth.

"Headline numbers are hiding the economy's true performance, which is slowing as tariffs take a bite out of activity," Nationwide chief economist Kathy Bostjancic wrote.

The "experts" keep predicting rising inflation and slowing economic growth which never actually arrives, and of course the Steno Pool Media repeats these Democrat talking points.


America gross domestic product -- the nation's output of goods and services --rebounded after falling at a 0.5% clip from January through March, the Commerce Department reported Wednesday. The first-quarter drop, the first retreat of the U.S. economy in three years, was mainly caused by a surge in imports -- which are subtracted from GDP -- as businesses scrambled to bring in foreign goods ahead of Trump's tariffs.


Boy you almost forget that the new GDP number is 3.0% because they won't stop talking about the brief Biden-era 0.5% contraction six months ago.

Check this out:

The bounceback was expected but its strength was a surprise: Economists had forecast 2% growth from April through June.

The "experts" keep failing in their predictions, so let's keep making the "experts'" predictions the main topic of conversation, rather than the 3% growth.

The New York Times takes the "let's keep talking about the first quarter even though we have the second quarter's data in now" tactic to the next level.

The Times doesn't want to acknowledge that the GDP grew by a strong 3%, so they average it with the first quarter number -- still suffering under Biden, and with Trump's policies not even close to enacted yet -- to talk about the first half-year's average GDP growth.

firsthalfdata.jpg

I think this is the first time in economic reporting history that anyone has ever descended to this level of hackery -- let's ignore the actual new numbers to focus laser-like on numbers from six months ago.

One claim these hacks are making is that the GDP growth isn't really that strong because a drop in imports boosts domestic GDP. So, they're saying, we just stopped importing foreign goods, and this sparked domestic production, so it doesn't really "count."

Two things, though:

1, the whole Trump economic plan is built on the idea of taxing foreign imports to reduce the levels of imports to spark domestic economic production. So the left is saying that even though Trump's plan is working as designed, it doesn't count, because they're neoliberal c*nts who want to offshore all production to foreign countries.

2, the only reason we had a "contraction" in the first quarter is because businesses overbought foreign goods to buy them before Trump's tariffs kicked in, and increasing imports reduces the GDP. So while they're saying that the 3% growth isn't "really real" because it's based on falling imports, they continue to insist that the first quarter's "contraction" is really real even though that "contraction" was largely an artifact of HIGHER imports.

When trade effects reduce GDP, highlight the lower GDP and pretend it's all really real. But when trade effects increase GDP, highlight the trade effects and denigrate strong 3% growth as not really real at all.

Chuck Schumer insisted that Biden presided over a Miracle Economy, and now says that Trump's strong 3% growth is "just a mirage" because people are worried about foreign imports and importing illegal foreign labor.

You're not going to believe this, but the entire leftwing propaganda media is repeating Chuck Schumer's talking points:

Democrat partisan hack Jerome Powell admits the economy is "strong" and that inflation is only "slightly" above the 2% rate the Fed considers idea and the "target" rate, but still refuses to reduce interest rates from the high 4.5% level.

I was going to say this yesterday, so I want credit for the prediction I thought but did not yet write: I don't mind if Powell keeps interest rates up because I'm anticipating a Reagan-level BOOM and a booming economy often results in inflation.

So I don't think Trump needs a lower inflation rate. I think the BOOM is coming, and, in fact, already begun. And maybe the higher inflation rates will dampen the natural price increases due to a roaring economy.


Trump's already negotiated several trillions of dollars in foreign investment and guaranteed purchases. That's a lot of fresh money coming into the economy. Do we need additional stimulus? I don't think we do.

In addition, Trump's closed deals with our biggest trading partners, the EU and Japan, and so there is now a stable platform for business investment going forward. (We still have to negotiate with Canada, India, China, etc.) This ends a lot of the uncertainty that Trump began his term with. I think Trump's tariff war is like Reagan and Volcker greatly increasing interest rates to wring out the Carter inflation -- there is early pain, yes, but in service of future plenty.


I'm not an economist, of course, so this is just the halfway-informed speculation of a layman. If you know better, let me know.


Posted by: Ace at 03:13 PM




Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 first.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at July 30, 2025 03:13 PM (e5NfL)

2 Open channel D

Posted by: Open Channel D at July 30, 2025 03:13 PM (gYnrv)

3 And powell will use this news to refuse to lower interest rates because the economy is growing too fast.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at July 30, 2025 03:14 PM (e5NfL)

4 Trump's already negotiated several trillions of dollars in festive little hats.

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at July 30, 2025 03:16 PM (rleWK)

5 harbinger of great economy to come...

looking forward to it

shuffling around investments in anticipation

Posted by: kallisto at July 30, 2025 03:16 PM (dCxaZ)

6 But enough about this temporary issue, let's get back to the Epstein story....

Posted by: This. Is. CNN. at July 30, 2025 03:16 PM (PiwSw)

7 Glad I didn't post this in the previous thread.

I go back to Obama saying that Trump would never *see* 3%.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:16 PM (Q4cxx)

8 Every time a leftwing "economist" opens his mouth, just imagine a big fat dick in there. That's the natural state of an economist's mouth. Ignore what he says.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:17 PM (iFTx/)

9 But enough about this temporary issue, let's get back to the Epstein story....
Posted by: This. Is. CNN. at July 30, 2025 03:16 PM (PiwSw)
---
This is definitely a distraction from the matter that the Democrats and their media have been ignoring for 4 years.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:17 PM (Q4cxx)

10 Here's one for Ace...

Nick Sortor@NickSortor

BREAKING: Danville, VA city council member Lee Vogler has just been SET ON FIRE by an attacker

The suspect entered Vogler's office, doused him in gasoline, and lit him ablaze.

Vogler has been transported to a local hospital, & attacker arrested

This is HORRIFIC. WTF

Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 30, 2025 03:18 PM (TGPs7)

11 >>>it doesn't count, because they're neoliberal c*nts who want to offshore all production to foreign countries.

Counts?

Coconuts?

Contestants?

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:18 PM (i24o9)

12 The U.S. economy expanded at a surprising 3% annual pace from April through June, bouncing back at least temporarily from a first-quarter drop that reflected disruptions from President Donald Trump's trade wars.

They like that word 'temporarily'.

The inflation from 2021 - 2024 was temporary and transitory also, as I recall.

Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:18 PM (6ydKt)

13 Unexpectedly, right?

Posted by: Jetto at July 30, 2025 03:18 PM (9pFUj)

14 It's a mirage like Chuckie's cheeseburger.

Posted by: Lutheran Love at July 30, 2025 03:19 PM (63Dwl)

15 This is really what DC hates.

Trump get things done. The bar to clear is no longer bills with key words, and called "solutions".

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:20 PM (Q4cxx)

16 "...it doesn't count, because they're neoliberal c*nts who want to offshore all production to foreign countries."

Oh, I don't think you are being fair Ace. These c*nts have always been liberal. And not the classical definition...these f*cks are soft leftists, and just hid it better before Trump.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at July 30, 2025 03:20 PM (n9ltV)

17 I object to " the Steno Pool Media." Stenographers have some agency in what and how they perform.

Nah, I much prefer "the Parrot Media"; parrots being trained to squawk they know not what.

Posted by: LCMS Rulz! at July 30, 2025 03:20 PM (bufu1)

18 25% Tariff on H1Bistan.

Posted by: Boss Moss at July 30, 2025 03:20 PM (uqNg8)

19 Who are the RINOs that are eating crow right now

Posted by: kallisto at July 30, 2025 03:20 PM (dCxaZ)

20 The U.S. economy expanded at a surprising 3% annual pace...

Surprising?? Is that the new word replacing unexpected?

Posted by: dantesed at July 30, 2025 03:21 PM (Oy/m2)

21 CNN: all fagz, all the time.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:21 PM (u/tSt)

22 floridanow1@floridanow1

The suspect in the attack on Danville, Virginia, City Councilman Lee Vogler is Shotsie Michael Buck Hayes, a 29-year-old resident of Danville. On July 30, 2025, Hayes allegedly entered Vogler’s workplace at Showcase Magazine, confronted him, doused him with a flammable liquid (reportedly gasoline from a five-gallon bucket), and set him on fire outside the building. Hayes fled the scene but was apprehended by police during a traffic stop shortly after.

Authorities confirm that Hayes and Vogler knew each other, and the attack stemmed from a personal matter, not Vogler’s role as a councilman or any political affiliation. Charges against Hayes are pending, but specific details about his background or motive beyond the personal dispute remain limited in available sources.

Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 30, 2025 03:21 PM (TGPs7)

23 BREAKING: Danville, VA city council member Lee Vogler has just been SET ON FIRE by an attacker

This is HORRIFIC. WTF
Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 30, 2025 03:18 PM (TGPs7)
---
Maybe it was the Burninator?

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:21 PM (Q4cxx)

24 "I don't mind if Powell keeps interest rates up because I'm anticipating a Reagan-level BOOM and a booming economy often results in inflation."

Powell is a leftwing hack who's prime directive is to hurt Trump and especially the GOP's chances in 2026. So if he is refusing to lower rates, I take that as a very strong sign that lowering rates would be beneficial for the economy and the country. Or at least he thinks so.

I realize there is some debate even on the right about lowering rates. Some on the right want rates to remain where they are. I will not engage in such debate other than to say I think these people are wrong.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:21 PM (iFTx/)

25 There was a day in 2012 when Obama started lecturing Mitt Romney that the government's money is actually the People's money and I had to laugh and laugh.

They know. They love watching us try to "explain" why they're wrong. Love it. Keeps us busy while they connive more.

They already know why they're wrong. They don't want to be right - they just want to destroy.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 03:21 PM (RLuzd)

26 CNN: all fagz, all the time.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:21 PM (u/tSt)
---
Fake AND Gay.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:22 PM (Q4cxx)

27 Lower interest rates would spur housing, cars, and especially reduce govt debt payments. That's why Trump keeps banging on it.

Posted by: the dandy at July 30, 2025 03:22 PM (X+Nnd)

28 "Inflation is running somewhat above our 2% objective"...

oh yeah like what 2.356%...as opposed to 20% when Autopen was in charge?

Posted by: kallisto at July 30, 2025 03:22 PM (dCxaZ)

29
refuses to reduce interest rates from the high 4.5% level.

When I bought the house I'm living in now the interest rate on my mortgage was 10.25%. 1989



Posted by: Lutheran Love at July 30, 2025 03:22 PM (63Dwl)

30 Where's the pumping-iron gym video from CNN claiming the economy is actually shit?

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:22 PM (iFTx/)

31 You guys are defending Putin about the earthquake off the Russian coast, are you?!

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:23 PM (Q4cxx)

32 Fire the Feral Reserve.

Posted by: Boss Moss at July 30, 2025 03:23 PM (uqNg8)

33 11 >>>it doesn't count, because they're neoliberal c*nts who want to offshore all production to foreign countries.

Counts?

Coconuts?

Contestants?

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:18 PM (i24o9)

C U Next Tuesday?

Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (6ydKt)

34 If you're going to douse your city council member in flammable liquid and set them alight, use kerosene. Much less danger to yourself.

Posted by: And No Fumar! at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (G5+As)

35 It is interesting to see ace optimistic.

It just does not happen that often. About anything.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (zZu0s)

36 Those grapes are in fact sour.

Posted by: Chuckie Cheese Schumer at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (RLuzd)

37 WNBA moment of the day.

https://is.gd/QyYZtS

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (L/fGl)

38 Tariffs are a radical campaign....yet somehow every nation in the world has tariffs on us without an comment.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:25 PM (8avO+)

39 It is interesting to see ace optimistic.

It just does not happen that often. About anything.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (zZu0s)

Get to your bunkers.

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:25 PM (i24o9)

40 WNBA moment of the day.

https://is.gd/QyYZtS
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (L/fGl)
_____

Funny, but I feel bad for the mascot. He or she isn't one of these putrid worm-pit clamdiggers. He's just hired for the mascot part.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (iFTx/)

41 Aetius451AD work phone

Two women at one time?

Posted by: NaCly Dog at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (u82oZ)

42 So if imports is counted as negative growth, what is $200 billion in remittances to foreign countries count as?

Posted by: MAGA_Ken at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (PNGId)

43 I think it's prudent to consider that the biggest trading partners with the US (Mexico followed by Canada) and essentially on the back burner for now. The USMCA (NAFTA) is revisited in 2026, and I can guarantee that it disappears.

There will be individual trading agreements with Canada and Mexico alone. Right now, Trump is removing the leverage of both countries from the equation by securing trade agreements with the EU and China. These last few months of securing those trade agreements take away a country like Canada's little scheme to open up more active trade with the EU. Mexico relies heavily on China to gain leverage on agreements with the US.

Those two entities won't be able to make the same promises they were expecting to make just 30 days ago.

Canada, particularly, is in a bad place. They are going to end up just agreeing to whatever is presented, or face Venezuela type inflation. And, don't forget the tariffs going into place on schedule August 1st. I'll bet Carney wishes he would have continued in his previous positions of resume building instead of ending up being the scapegoat on what happens to Canada next.

Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (dIske)

44 Every good piece of economic news with Trump has a yeah but component in the msm.

Meanwhile 10% inflation was seen as no biggie under Biden.

And who could forget FUNemployment during Obama’s days.

And yet people still fucking listen to the msm and their experts.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (Vvm2m)

45 You should never listen to Lizzie Warren on the economy. Her people sold Manhattan Island for $24 of pretty beads.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (L/fGl)

46 In my neighborhood, wages for entry-level jobs are considerably higher than two years ago, probably enough to adjust for inflation during that time.

Posted by: Bombadil at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (MX0bI)

47 What about the employment and marriage rate of fat middle-aged white wiccans with purple hair and a nose ring? Abysmal!

Posted by: Media at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (CwhoI)

48 Coagulants?

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:27 PM (i24o9)

49 A GAINZZZ thread, before Friday?

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:27 PM (Q4cxx)

50 >> but still refuses to reduce interest rates from the high 4.5% level.


4.5% isn't high at all.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:27 PM (NjhIg)

51 Authorities confirm that Hayes and Vogler knew each other, and the attack stemmed from a personal matter, not Vogler’s role as a councilman or any political affiliation. Charges against Hayes are pending, but specific details about his background or motive beyond the personal dispute remain limited in available sources.
Posted by: Mister Ghost at July 30, 2025 03:21 PM (TGPs7)

I don't care who it was, or what his reasons were, put the attacker to death by the most gruesome means possible.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:28 PM (u/tSt)

52 37 WNBA moment of the day.

https://is.gd/QyYZtS

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (L/fGl)

I like how everybody sitting in the chairs is so totally bored that watching a man in a dog costume get back flipped right to the head and laid out on the floor doesn't even get a reaction.

Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:28 PM (6ydKt)

53 When Trump gets the economy really rolling is when they start saying we should thank Biden for a good economy.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:28 PM (Q4cxx)

54
You should never listen to Lizzie Warren on the economy. Her people sold Manhattan Island for $24 of pretty beads.
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks

But what would those beads be worth today?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at July 30, 2025 03:28 PM (63Dwl)

55 >>> 47 What about the employment and marriage rate of fat middle-aged white wiccans with purple hair and a nose ring? Abysmal!
Posted by: Media at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (CwhoI)

Lose the nose ring and get a blonde wig, easy peasy!

Posted by: Cincinnati PD Chief at July 30, 2025 03:28 PM (ULPxl)

56 So I don't think Trump needs a lower inflation rate. I think the BOOM is coming, and, in fact, already begun. And maybe the higher inflation rates will dampen the natural price increases due to a roaring economy.
=
Well it would help if the interest rates were actually high, rather than kept low in order to produce that 2% inflation (which robs anyone who is responsible with their money), rather than the 0% which was the fed's original mandate.

Posted by: Methos at July 30, 2025 03:29 PM (zLwRl)

57

Obama re Trump and jobs:

“Well, how exactly are you going to do that? What exactly are you going to do? There’s no answer to it,” Obama said.

“He just says, ‘Well, I’m going to negotiate a better deal.’ Well, what, how exactly are you going to negotiate that? What magic wand do you have? And usually the answer is, he doesn’t have an answer.”

'Answer' according to who , Barky?

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at July 30, 2025 03:29 PM (XeU6L)

58
The U.S. economy expanded at a surprising 3% annual pace...
---------

WHAT!1?/?!1/?!?

EM' NANNER-PUDDIN' FOADDY-SEBUN!111!!!

Posted by: Maxine Waters' Hair at July 30, 2025 03:29 PM (5hfjS)

59 I remember the 80s when it was a decade of this - great current economic news, doomscreamers daily saying it was all going to come to an and and it never did.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:29 PM (8avO+)

60 the squawk box guys made me lol

thank goodness becky and the limp wrist ring wearing guy weren’t included…they’re both TDSers

Posted by: cherries in season at July 30, 2025 03:30 PM (a5CpQ)

61
4.5% isn't high at all.
Posted by: garrett

So many people were used to near zero interest rates and thought they were the norm.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at July 30, 2025 03:30 PM (63Dwl)

62 >>> 59 I remember the 80s when it was a decade of this - great current economic news, doomscreamers daily saying it was all going to come to an and and it never did.
Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:29 PM (8avO+)

80s - decade of greed
90s - decade of prosperity

Posted by: presstitutes at July 30, 2025 03:30 PM (ULPxl)

63 Will Trump never run out of magic wands?

/"Obama, you magnificent bastard ... thank you for giving us The One True Magic King!"

Posted by: ShainS -- The Marshall Plan is MORTE! at July 30, 2025 03:30 PM (33n1u)

64 I remember the 80s when it was a decade of this - great current economic news, doomscreamers daily saying it was all going to come to an and and it never did.
Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:29 PM (8avO+)
---
Just like NFL analysts, if it doesn't happen like they said, they just move on.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:30 PM (Q4cxx)

65 Great news from Deadline

Kamala will not be running for Governor of California.

She may still run for POTUS in 2028....after the EPIC bender.

Posted by: Stateless - HAPPY NOT HOMELESS! - New Life Creation 15.5 % at July 30, 2025 03:30 PM (jvJvP)

66 >>>So I don't think Trump needs a lower inflation rate. I think the BOOM is coming,
----

We have a shrinking employment rate which will slow down that Boom.
Lowering interest rates will promote small and mid size companies growth which will increase employment thus helping to stabilize our growing economy and decrease the probability of inflation.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 03:30 PM (85azL)

67 My penis grew 3 inches just thinking about all the winning we've been getting.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (iFTx/)

68 So I don't think Trump needs a lower inflation rate. I think the BOOM is coming, and, in fact, already begun. And maybe the higher inflation rates will dampen the natural price increases due to a roaring economy.

—

What counts is REAL growth. Growth of 5% with 3% inflation is better than 3% growth with 2.5% inflation.

Lower rates would increase inflation but that would be more than offset by the higher growth, stimulated by low rates. Housing would go parabolic again if mortgages got down to even 5%.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (Vvm2m)

69 Canada, particularly, is in a bad place. They are going to end up just agreeing to whatever is presented, or face Venezuela type inflation. And, don't forget the tariffs going into place on schedule August 1st. I'll bet Carney wishes he would have continued in his previous positions of resume building instead of ending up being the scapegoat on what happens to Canada next.
Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (dIske)

Carney is no scapegoat. He is a corrupt piece of shit who was fully involved in wrecking Canada's economy.

I don't know if he is a kiddie diddler, but he could play one in a movie.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (u/tSt)

70 4.5% interest rate is about right. I agree with. Mr. O'Spades. But there needs to be incentives (or disincentives) for banks to pass those interest rates to savings accounts.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (g8Ew8)

71 The TIMES headline is an outright LIE, and should be treated as such--growth did NOT "slow" in the first half, period, full stop.

No matter what word-smithing they INTENDED to portray with that headline, what they ended up with as written is an outright LIE.

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 03:32 PM (TN0g+)

72 I'll bet Carney wishes he would have continued in his previous positions of resume building instead of ending up being the scapegoat on what happens to Canada next.

Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (dIske)

Carney thought he and Chrystina Freeland we're going to come in and buffalo Trump into whatever they wanted, like Trudeau tried to do with the USMCA and succeeded in part.

That plan isn't working out this time and they didn't have a Plan B.

Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:32 PM (6ydKt)

73 Canada, particularly, is in a bad place. They are going to end up just agreeing to whatever is presented, or face Venezuela type inflation. And, don't forget the tariffs going into place on schedule August 1st. I'll bet Carney wishes he would have continued in his previous positions of resume building instead of ending up being the scapegoat on what happens to Canada next.
Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:26 PM (dIske)

Half of Canada will be in a good place indeed as they will be independent and trading with us with good terms

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:32 PM (8avO+)

74 Tired of the gaslight media.

Posted by: Don't believe your lying eyes at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (TbWk/)

75 My penis grew 3 inches just thinking about all the winning we've been getting.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (iFTx/)

Mine's so hard that scientists are considering tossing out the Brinell hardness test in favor of the Flounder hardness test.

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (i24o9)

76 61
4.5% isn't high at all.
Posted by: garrett

So many people were used to near zero interest rates and thought they were the norm.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at July 30, 2025 03:30 PM (63Dwl)

I'd gladly go back to 10% interest rates if the cost of housing aligned even a little with salaries in the way that they did back in the day.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (KbCG3)

77 Carney thought he and Chrystina Freeland we're going to come in and buffalo Trump into whatever they wanted, like Trudeau tried to do with the USMCA and succeeded in part.

That plan isn't working out this time and they didn't have a Plan B.
Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:32 PM (6ydKt)

They are going to be squatting on a bit of Tundra when Quebec AND the West all exit.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (8avO+)

78 Trump still polling well with working class convicted pedophiles

Posted by: Aliassmithsmith at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (9f/51)

79 >>>My penis grew 3 inches just thinking about all the winning we've been getting.

But it's only been 3 inches for the first half of 2025.

Posted by: Media at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (CwhoI)

80 BREAKING: Danville, VA city council member Lee Vogler has just been SET ON FIRE by an attacker

-
Danville City Council member Lee Vogler, 39, of Danville, was working in the Showcase Magazine office at about 11 a.m. local time, when Shotsie Michael Buck Hayes, 29, of Danville, allegedly forced his way into the building carrying a five-gallon bucket of gasoline
. . . .
"Based on the investigation at the time of this release, the victim and the suspect are known to each other and the attack stems from a personal matter not related to the victim’s position on Danville City Council or any other political affiliation," according to a statement from the department.

-
"Shotsie"?

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (L/fGl)

81 >>> I'm not an economist, of course, so this is just the halfway-informed speculation of a layman. If you know better, let me know

As an expert in everything I will confirm that economics is both fake AND gay and everything everyone says on the subject is bullshit.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (uCjyK)

82 Wonder what happened when the unemployment of all those government employees hits. They do not improve productivity, so does it all even out?

Posted by: Field Marshal Zhukov at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (wBaIH)

83 Bidenomics!

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (RLuzd)

84 Trump still polling well with working class convicted pedophiles
Posted by: Aliassmithsmith at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (9f/51)
---
Well, I guess you know your own demographic.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (Q4cxx)

85 Lol. Ass is back on epstein.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (zZu0s)

86 the attack stems from a personal matter not related to the victim’s position on Danville City Council or any other political affiliation," according to a statement from the department.
-------

So the attacker is a lib.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (RLuzd)

87 Carney is no scapegoat. He is a corrupt piece of shit who was fully involved in wrecking Canada's economy.

I don't know if he is a kiddie diddler, but he could play one in a movie.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (u/tSt)

__________________________

I'm not arguing that he isn't corrupt or even somewhat responsible for the current state of affairs. But, when the time comes, the Liberal party will have to choose....losing personal elections, or finger pointing at the new guy who promised prosperity and failed miserably.

Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (dIske)

88 So the attacker is a lib.
Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (RLuzd)
---
Possibly white.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (Q4cxx)

89 If there is any evidence that Powell is getting money from contractors for the overpriced rebuild of the Fed bldg , frog march that hack

Posted by: Smell the Glove at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (A7hgX)

90 Lol, because we know all the upper crust convicted pedophiles are democrat die hards.

Like Chuck Schumer.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (zZu0s)

91 I'd gladly go back to 10% interest rates if the cost of housing aligned even a little with salaries in the way that they did back in the day.
Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (KbCG3)

What if I told you the home ownership rate today (65%) is higher than all of the 1970s, most of the 1980s and half the 1990s? You know back when homes were “cheap”.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (Vvm2m)

92 I thought ASS wanted to Vote Vance.

Is it regretting its Kamala vote too now???

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (ULPxl)

93 "Shotsie"?
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (L/fGl)



In German, "schatze" (pronounced just like Shotsie) means "sweetheart".

Could be a gay romance gone sour. The ASS troll might know.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:37 PM (u/tSt)

94 "Shotsie"?
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (L/fGl)

Bitch better have my moneys is all Is saying or I bees whooping his ass.

Posted by: Shotsie Hayes's Pimp at July 30, 2025 03:37 PM (Sdlpf)

95 A factor that will help the boom that the naysayers don't even understand is the great boost of cutting enviro regs. That's going to have the benefit of adding disposable income, while at the same time will not be inflationary because it's freeing up a lot of money that was going for nothing.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2025 03:37 PM (uWKK8)

96 Based on the investigation at the time of this release, the victim and the suspect are known to each other and the attack stems from a personal matter not related to the victim’s position on Danville City Council or any other political affiliation," according to a statement from the department.

-
"Shotsie"?
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (L/fGl)

Must have been having an affair with Muffy.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at July 30, 2025 03:37 PM (g8Ew8)

97 You know back when homes were “cheap”.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (Vvm2m)

Huh. I am really surprised by that stat. Considering home prices.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at July 30, 2025 03:37 PM (zZu0s)

98 If there is any evidence that Powell is getting money from contractors for the overpriced rebuild of the Fed bldg , frog march that hack
Posted by: Smell the Glove at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (A7hgX)

Just move them out to another empty building and give some other department the amenities.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (8avO+)

99 I'd gladly go back to 10% interest rates if the cost of housing aligned even a little with salaries in the way that they did back in the day.
Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (KbCG3)

This is the real issue. We once again find ourselves with a massively inflated real estate bubble where in many markets the average household income in that area would not be enough money to qualify for a mortgage on a starter home.

While obviously interest rates play a role in that there are also about 5000 other variables in play as well.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (uCjyK)

100 67 My penis grew 3 inches just thinking about all the winning we've been getting.
Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (iFTx/)

Must be all the new pants everyone is buying that's causing the boom, eh? Not to mention those underpants.

Posted by: tcn in AK at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (1Gsou)

101 Seth Meyers: Americans Should Get Their News from Us
---

Nah, Seth, they really shouldn't....

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (Q4cxx)

102 They are going to be squatting on a bit of Tundra when Quebec AND the West all exit.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (8avO+)

Carney keeps running his mouth about more integration with the UK & EU, especially.

Like that's going to be any better for you, numbnuts?
It's a scare tactic aimed at Trump, and Trump didn't blink.

But yeah, he's going to keep screwing around until Danielle Smith decides to have a referendum on separation in Alberta, I hope.

Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (6ydKt)

103 People who build or expand small business often borrow to do it. If the interest rate is too high, you can't make the numbers work, as your profit is eaten up by the evil Jooish bankers.

Posted by: Candace Owens Enterprises at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (G5+As)

104 Ace, generally concur with your take on interest rates as a brake on economic growth”excess” but one sector of our economy that is really struggling is housing. Considering that the vast majority of wealth in the middle class is their home equity is it really wise to depress demand via high mortgage rates while simultaneously deporting ten million housing occupants? Illegals oughta go but making it more difficult for young wage earners to buy makes no sense.

Posted by: Pete Bog at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (wGPHk)

105 82 Wonder what happened when the unemployment of all those government employees hits. They do not improve productivity, so does it all even out?

Posted by: Field Marshal Zhukov at July 30, 2025 03:34 PM (wBaIH)

As the best and brightest among us, it's nice to see them set free from their selfless service to the American people.

They now have the opportunity to unleash their considerable talents and bring the American economy to even greater heights.

Posted by: Stateless - HAPPY NOT HOMELESS! - New Life Creation 15.5 % at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (jvJvP)

106 What if I told you the home ownership rate today (65%) is higher than all of the 1970s, most of the 1980s and half the 1990s? You know back when homes were “cheap”.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (Vvm2m)

Well, that 65% includes all the legacy homeowners who bought years ago, and still hold them. Might be worthwhile to look at the home ownership rates for the 25 to 40 cohort in each era.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (u/tSt)

107 "Shotsie"?

Man, I thought that dog died 30 years ago.

Posted by: Citizen Cake at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (CwhoI)

108 97 You know back when homes were “cheap”.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (Vvm2m)

Huh. I am really surprised by that stat. Considering home prices.
Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at July 30, 2025 03:37 PM (zZu0s)

Most people are surprised. Because the media has been telling everyone nobody can afford houses for the past 10-15 years. Yet magically more people can afford housing now than back I the “good old days”.

It’s like how a bar is so crowded nobody ever goes there anymore.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (Vvm2m)

109 I watched that Led Zep documentary. JB is of course dead, but I was very surprised how good the remaining three looked and talked. I was expecting 75-year old versions of Vince Neil or Axel Rose. Nope. They looked quite good for their ages, and talked intelligently and charismatically. And they weren't sucking their own dicks.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (iFTx/)

110 Funny how the Epstein, Epstein, Epstein went away as soon as DOJ started to officially talk to Ghislane, and rumors spread that she might get some kind of pardon for talking, yes ?

Posted by: runner at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (g47mK)

111 What if I told you the home ownership rate today (65%) is higher than all of the 1970s, most of the 1980s and half the 1990s? You know back when homes were “cheap”.

well yeah

the homebuyers of the 1970s left their inheritance to their children who in turn left their money to their own kids

Half the home purchases around here are financed by the Bank of Mom and Dad...usually the down payment

Posted by: kallisto at July 30, 2025 03:40 PM (dCxaZ)

112 So the attacker is a lib.
Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (RLuzd)
---
Possibly white.
Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (Q4cxx)

LOL.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at July 30, 2025 03:40 PM (g8Ew8)

113 Now, to spark energy production in this country…

Posted by: Cow Demon at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (WeMfR)

114 Booming US economy is a Zionist plot to take over the world.

Posted by: Candace Owens at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (g47mK)

115 103 People who build or expand small business often borrow to do it. If the interest rate is too high, you can't make the numbers work, as your profit is eaten up by the evil Jooish bankers.
Posted by: Candace Owens Enterprises
------------------

Well, two out of three keeps you in business, eh?

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (85azL)

116 A couple of reminders: Canada is actually our largest trading partner; foreign investment increases the trade "deficit"; tariffs (taxes) are always paid by the last person to pay for the product (foreign companies are merely the tariff collector similar to state sales taxes).

I would read Daniel Mitchell about macro economics. He's very good and pretty cool (even though he went to Georgia). Not too much inside baseball so regular people can mostly understand what he is talking about.

Posted by: Earl Schlobodowicz at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (P7Iz+)

117 Possibly white.
Posted by: Axeman

Shotsie's wedding website.

https://is.gd/ytOYq3

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (L/fGl)

118 So who is going shoot Jerome Powell?

Posted by: pudinhead at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (W3T6M)

119 The U.S. economy expanded at a surprising 3% annual pace

We never thought he would win!

Posted by: The MFM at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (zK360)

120 89 If there is any evidence that Powell is getting money from contractors for the overpriced rebuild of the Fed bldg , frog march that hack
Posted by: Smell the Glove at July 30, 2025 03:35 PM (A7hgX)

I find it exceedingly difficult to allow any federal building to use marble as a construction component when we can't even build decent housing for our soldiers on base. Ft. Wainwright only recently allowed air conditioning in housing, and then only in new buildings, even though the temperatures in those rooms reach about 98 degrees F and the smoke from all the wildfires all summer makes the air unbreathable.

Fuck that little skunk and his cost over-runs. He is single handedly causing a lack of good housing for soldiers.

Posted by: tcn in AK at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (1Gsou)

121 >>Ace, generally concur with your take on interest rates as a brake on economic growth”excess” but one sector of our economy that is really struggling is housing.


Supply and Demand will fix the Housing Cost issue in a healthier manner than lowering rates will.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (NjhIg)

122 It is a bit paradoxical for Trump to be touting a booming economy while arguing for an interest rate cut. You cut interest rates to stimulate a lagging economy. I think Trump's thundering reflects two realities.

First, the 3% second quarter number is good, very good, but it's not a fully booming economy. There is some rebound from the falsely low first quarter numbers. But also, the economy is recovering from 4 years of President Auto-pen and the crack smoker. It's going to take more than 1-2 quarters to get the U.S. economy to get firing on all cylinders (which will likely occur when the coming energy boom is fully realized. It's starting to be priced in, but users of energy products still have to pay the current price).

Second, I think Trump wants lower interest rates in part for his ego. He wants a massive GDP number or two, even if it sparks higher inflation. He'd prefer 6% growth with 5% inflation than 3.5% growth with 2% inflation, even though the latter is actually better.

Posted by: Virginia SoCon at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (a/dOO)

123 Half of Canada will be in a good place indeed as they will be independent and trading with us with good terms
Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:32 PM (8avO+)
__________________________

I can pretty much guarantee that's not going to happen. The way the law is written in Canada is vague even though they named it the "Clarity Law." Essentially, for a province to secede, they have to show a "clear majority" and a "clear will of the people." The House of Commons wrote it that way so it gets tied down in the Courts (Liberal Courts) to determine what that means.

At the same time, Carney has shown his domestic strategy is all about bait and switch. Make promises that can't immediately be realized, and then draw it out as long as possible. I think next February is when the vote occurs in Alberta....he (and the east Liberals) only need to make promises at that time frame to stop the momentum of Albertan residents to leave. Then there is another hiatus. Then, the same strategy in the following elections.

Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (dIske)

124 I like how everybody sitting in the chairs is so totally bored that watching a man in a dog costume get back flipped right to the head and laid out on the floor doesn't even get a reaction.
Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:28 PM (6ydKt)

I just came to see the Flying Wig...

Posted by: That guy in the stands at July 30, 2025 03:42 PM (PiwSw)

125
"Shotsie"?
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks

Happy Days?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at July 30, 2025 03:42 PM (63Dwl)

126 Most people are surprised. Because the media has been telling everyone nobody can afford houses for the past 10-15 years. Yet magically more people can afford housing now than back I the “good old days”.

It’s like how a bar is so crowded nobody ever goes there anymore.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (Vvm2m)

Would love to see how many are like me and had to rely on things like FHA.

This is not a sustainable market.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 03:42 PM (KbCG3)

127 116 A couple of reminders: Canada is actually our largest trading partner;
-----------

Thought Canada was broke? How does it make it's money.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (85azL)

128 Schumer is absolutely a vile nasty SOB.
What a slimy piece of crap.

Posted by: Diogenes at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (W/lyH)

129 Unexpectedly.

The experts are always surprised.

Which kinda calls into question their expertise.

Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (wKJf5)

130 I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40. That's not good. It used to be closer to 30.

Posted by: Your Ever Smiling Real Estate Agent at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (G5+As)

131 I never understood how some faceless entity decides what expectations are in these matters.

Posted by: Bitcoin Fixes Everything at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (V6W16)

132 "Shotsie"?
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks

Happy Days?
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at July 30, 2025 03:42 PM (63Dwl)
---
Sit on it, Shotsie!

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (Q4cxx)

133 A couple of reminders: Canada is actually our largest trading partner; foreign investment increases the trade "deficit"; tariffs (taxes) are always paid by the last person to pay for the product (foreign companies are merely the tariff collector similar to state sales taxes).

I would read Daniel Mitchell about macro economics. He's very good and pretty cool (even though he went to Georgia). Not too much inside baseball so regular people can mostly understand what he is talking about.
Posted by: Earl Schlobodowicz at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (P7Iz+)

A lot of stuff we get from Canada we could get from our own stuff trivially. Cars, lumber, that kind of thing.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (8avO+)

134 >>I watched that Led Zep documentary. JB is of course dead, but I was very surprised how good the remaining three looked and talked. I was expecting 75-year old versions of Vince Neil or Axel Rose. Nope. They looked quite good for their ages, and talked intelligently and charismatically. And they weren't sucking their own dicks.


Robert Plant looks like hell. JPJ and Page don't look too bad, though.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (NjhIg)

135 You know back when homes were “cheap”.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (Vvm2m)

Huh. I am really surprised by that stat. Considering home prices.
Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at July 30, 2025 03:37 PM (zZu0s)

Most people are surprised. Because the media has been telling everyone nobody can afford houses for the past 10-15 years. Yet magically more people can afford housing now than back I the “good old days”.

It’s like how a bar is so crowded nobody ever goes there anymore.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (Vvm2m)
_____

I would also add that homes are also much bigger and more sophisticated now. Sure, they are more expensive than in the 1970s, but you are getting a lot more for your money. Same as cars.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (iFTx/)

136 What if I told you the home ownership rate today (65%) is higher than all of the 1970s, most of the 1980s and half the 1990s? You know back when homes were “cheap”.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (Vvm2m)

Id say that may be technically true but is also pretty misleading.

Homeownership since the boom years after WWII has fluctuated between 61% and 65% of households owning the home they live in.

So basically unchanged since the 1950s. What has changed is the composition of households. In 1957 a mother father and two kids may have rented an apartment while they saved up to buy a house.

Now there are a lot of single parent households or roommate situations where there is no hope / expectation of ever being able to buy a house.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (uCjyK)

137 Once I finish the Protocols of the Elders of Zion (have you heard of it ? It is an excellent , well known source of real information about the Jews) I will post a youtube video review of this important work !

Posted by: Candace Owens at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (g47mK)

138 Considering that the vast majority of wealth in the middle class is their home equity is it really wise to depress demand via high mortgage rates while simultaneously deporting ten million housing occupants? Illegals oughta go but making it more difficult for young wage earners to buy makes no sense.
Posted by: Pete Bog at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (wGPHk)

Deport them all. Time to be a serious country.

When interest rates come down as they should, housing will become more affordable…but that is also a function of local housing markets, something which the feds have little control over.

Posted by: Cow Demon at July 30, 2025 03:44 PM (WeMfR)

139 I liked the stupid poll the Democrats put out to console themselves during the reign of the Orange Menace: that Obama would beat Trump in a head to head election. WTH? Imaginary World must be nice.

Posted by: Jmel at July 30, 2025 03:44 PM (bVhJi)

140 Ace, generally concur with your take on interest rates as a brake on economic growth”excess” but one sector of our economy that is really struggling is housing. Considering that the vast majority of wealth in the middle class is their home equity is it really wise to depress demand via high mortgage rates while simultaneously deporting ten million housing occupants? Illegals oughta go but making it more difficult for young wage earners to buy makes no sense.

---------
As a Realtor, I'm on the front lines for this one. There is a growing awareness that the Fed isn't inline with economic reality, and what that has lead to is a LOT of potential buyers who feel squeemish about making an offer "today" when they feel that any minute now rates should be going down. That "any minute now" thing has been going on for 90 days, and its really causing the housing market some discomfort due to paused activity, waiting on the rate cut that never seems to come.

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 03:44 PM (TN0g+)

141 I watched the Powell presser and my takeaway is that Powell isn't going to change rates until ALL of the data comes in from ALL of the risk factors for the FORESEABLE FUTURE.

And then the Fed will contemplate its collective navel before possibly doing something based on their risk assessments.

Oh, and Powells' labor risk metrics have changed, too. Which means shifting targets based on shifting goalposts. Effing weasel.

Anyway, Friday's job reports are supposed to be meaningful, whatever that means.

Posted by: mrp at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (rj6Yv)

142 Supply and Demand will fix the Housing Cost issue in a healthier manner than lowering rates will.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (NjhIg)

pay in gold coins !

Posted by: runner at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (g47mK)

143 Everyone focuses on home prices without factoring in income and interest rates. A $200k home with a 11% interest rate is the same cost as a $350k home with a 5% mortgage. What really counts is mortgage payment as a percent of after tax household income. And that metric hasn’t changed that much over the years.

Plus a few coastal cities really skew the numbers. Take out San Francisco, NY, Seattle and Los Angeles and housing is t that expensive on average.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (Vvm2m)

144 I watched that Led Zep documentary. JB is of course dead, but I was very surprised how good the remaining three looked and talked. I was expecting 75-year old versions of Vince Neil or Axel Rose. Nope. They looked quite good for their ages, and talked intelligently and charismatically. And they weren't sucking their own dicks.


Robert Plant looks like hell. JPJ and Page don't look too bad, though.
Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (NjhIg)
____

Plant put on weight, yes. But he looked fine to me. Certainly much better than the much-younger Neil and Rose.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (iFTx/)

145 A lot of stuff we get from Canada we could get from our own stuff trivially. Cars, lumber, that kind of thing.
Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (8avO+)

Yeah, but right now the loonie is cheaper than the dollar, making Canadian imports more lucrative.

Posted by: Cow Demon at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (WeMfR)

146 Schumer is absolutely a vile nasty SOB.
What a slimy piece of crap.
Posted by: Diogenes at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (W/lyH)
---
And a coward.

He's okay where the IC can get the sitting president of the United States back "6 ways to Sunday." To him, deference to the IC from the highest levels of government is just something that you deal with.

He can't take that abdication back.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (Q4cxx)

147 I can pretty much guarantee that's not going to happen. The way the law is written in Canada is vague even though they named it the "Clarity Law." Essentially, for a province to secede, they have to show a "clear majority" and a "clear will of the people." The House of Commons wrote it that way so it gets tied down in the Courts (Liberal Courts) to determine what that means.

At the same time, Carney has shown his domestic strategy is all about bait and switch. Make promises that can't immediately be realized, and then draw it out as long as possible. I think next February is when the vote occurs in Alberta....he (and the east Liberals) only need to make promises at that time frame to stop the momentum of Albertan residents to leave. Then there is another hiatus. Then, the same strategy in the following elections.
Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (dIske)

The "Clarity Law" isn't worth the paper it's printed on. Make a Unilateral Declaration of Independence, like those guys down South did in '76.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (u/tSt)

148 I can pretty much guarantee that's not going to happen. The way the law is written in Canada is vague even though they named it the "Clarity Law." Essentially, for a province to secede, they have to show a "clear majority" and a "clear will of the people." The House of Commons wrote it that way so it gets tied down in the Courts (Liberal Courts) to determine what that means.

At the same time, Carney has shown his domestic strategy is all about bait and switch. Make promises that can't immediately be realized, and then draw it out as long as possible. I think next February is when the vote occurs in Alberta....he (and the east Liberals) only need to make promises at that time frame to stop the momentum of Albertan residents to leave. Then there is another hiatus. Then, the same strategy in the following elections.
Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (dIske)

You forget Trump. Pull any of that crap and the 101 Airborne lands in Edmonton and its all over. The Governor of Alberta is already finalizing plans for a pipeline to the west coast that the federal government has been blocking for a long time.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (8avO+)

149 By the way, few economists have been predicting inflation as a result of the tariffs. Only the most partisan lefties perhaps. That's kind of a straw horse argument that Ace is beating to death. What economists have been saying is that tariffs will increase cost because that is literally what they are designed to do and how they work. They increase the cost of foreign produced items to provide room for domestic producers to increase prices themselves or to increase market share.

Posted by: Earl Schlobodowicz at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (P7Iz+)

150 >>Posted by: Harry Paratestes at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (uCjyK)


So a concerted Government effort, from Clinton through Obama, to increase Home Ownership has done nothing at all to increase Home Ownership...

let's sick the Government on increasing home ownership. What's the worst that could happen?

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (NjhIg)

151 Powell is gone in a little bit less than 10 months no matter what, so there's not a big reason to push to get rid of him now. He's a problem that will solve itself.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (uWKK8)

152 What if I told you the home ownership rate today (65%) is higher than all of the 1970s

We went off the gold standard. Houses were a way to hold your value against inflation. Gov't would reward itself by taxing that inflation as "capital gains", but it was still much better than using a savings account.

Posted by: The MFM at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (ZzBhN)

153 I learned a long time ago that this is how commies talk.

Not to inform, but to deceive.

Posted by: Minuteman at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (47/pr)

154 WTH? Imaginary World must be nice.
-------

They're marxists--Imaginary World is the only one that functions in the way they wished it would.

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 03:47 PM (TN0g+)

155 >>> 106 What if I told you the home ownership rate today (65%) is higher than all of the 1970s, most of the 1980s and half the 1990s? You know back when homes were “cheap”.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:36 PM (Vvm2m)

Well, that 65% includes all the legacy homeowners who bought years ago, and still hold them. Might be worthwhile to look at the home ownership rates for the 25 to 40 cohort in each era.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:39 PM (u/tSt)

Not many people switch back and forth from owning to renting and back again.

A house is *supposed* to last for decades, so it makes sense that the ownership rate would be pretty stable and tend to increase long-term.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at July 30, 2025 03:47 PM (ULPxl)

156 My penis grew 3 inches just thinking about all the winning we've been getting.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (iFTx/)

Mine's so hard that scientists are considering tossing out the Brinell hardness test in favor of the Flounder hardness test.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (i24o9)
***

Mine is so awesome, The Paolo sent ME a friend request.

Posted by: Diogenes at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (W/lyH)

157 The "Clarity Law" isn't worth the paper it's printed on. Make a Unilateral Declaration of Independence, like those guys down South did in '76.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (u/tSt)

Yep, and Trump isn't gonna wait a few years to pitch in to help out like France and Spain and Holland did.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (8avO+)

158 What economists have been saying is that tariffs will increase cost because that is literally what they are designed to do and how they work. They increase the cost of foreign produced items to provide room for domestic producers to increase prices themselves or to increase market share.
Posted by: Earl Schlobodowicz at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (P7Iz+)

If by increased costs you mean that companies will have to pay a good wage here in the US, rather than paying slave labor wages in China, I'd say that is overall a very good thing.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (uWKK8)

159 I learned a long time ago that this is how commies talk.

Not to inform, but to deceive.
--------

Its true for commies, but also for the bulk of "our" side (aka GOPe). Why else would we be 6 months in and so little legislation turning executive orders into solid law, and why else would we have such a backlog of Trump nominees.

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (TN0g+)

160 I think home ownership would be much higher today if the left didn't spend the last 20 years trying to convince impressionable younger generations that home ownership was bad and they should rent instead. That is of course terrible advice, but a lot of people swallowed it.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (iFTx/)

161 That "any minute now" thing has been going on for 90 days, and its really causing the housing market some discomfort due to paused activity, waiting on the rate cut that never seems to come.
Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 03:44 PM (TN0g+)

I bought when I did because the property was absolutely perfect, but I would refi in a heartbeat if rates went lower.

Posted by: tcn in AK at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (1Gsou)

162 Homeownership since the boom years after WWII has fluctuated between 61% and 65% of households owning the home they live in.

—

Yuuge difference between 61 and 65. Even at the absolute peak of the 2000s boom it never got higher than 69 (insert joke here). So every 1% is a big difference. Saying 65 is kinda like 61 isn’t accurate

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (Vvm2m)

163 Maybe it was the Burninator?

[ DeathMetalScream ]
TROGDOOOOORRRR!!!!!
[ /DeathMetalScream ]

Like Ace, I also kinda don't mind not lowering the Fed rate. I think it was kept artificially low for too long and I'm in no hurry to go back to the pre-conditions that led to the Biden era inflation. Also, a booming economy is a good thing generally but I have no reasonable expectation that my salary will boom along with it so I have a pretty serious built-in bias.

Posted by: Oddbob at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (/y8xj)

164 >>> 130 I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40. That's not good. It used to be closer to 30.
Posted by: Your Ever Smiling Real Estate Agent at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (G5+As)

Yeah *that* is fcked up. I'd think a "good" number would be more like 20-25 years old, you know, right around when it would be best for people to start having children.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at July 30, 2025 03:49 PM (ULPxl)

165
But wymyn, children, people of color and LBGTQ+ continue to suffer economically.

Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 03:49 PM (Y8DZL)

166 138 Considering that the vast majority of wealth in the middle class is their home equity is it really wise to depress demand via high mortgage rates while simultaneously deporting ten million housing occupants? Illegals oughta go but making it more difficult for young wage earners to buy makes no sense.
Posted by: Pete Bog at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (wGPHk)

If you deport all the illegal housing occupants, prices will moderate with no need for the interest rate to come down unless other forces dictate it should.

Housing prices have gotten ridiculous during the illegal surge, especially at the lower ends of the scale. The deportation will only help younger buyers...

Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 03:49 PM (tOcjL)

167 My penis grew 3 inches just thinking about all the winning we've been getting.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (iFTx/)

Mine's so hard that scientists are considering tossing out the Brinell hardness test in favor of the Flounder hardness test.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (i24o9)
***

Mine is so awesome, The Paolo sent ME a friend request.
Posted by: Diogenes at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (W/lyH)
________

[Golf clap]

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:49 PM (iFTx/)

168 The fed has lots of tools to lower mortgage rates that they are not using. Private equity companies buying house has generally been not a great bet over the last few years and many are now reversing course. Want to deflate the bubble? Remove all the road blocks to absorbtion while simultaneously reducing the population competing for the housing.

Avoid a 2008 scenario where lots of people were wiped out

Posted by: Pete Bog at July 30, 2025 03:49 PM (wGPHk)

169 >>That "any minute now" thing has been going on for 90 days, and its really causing the housing market some discomfort due to paused activity, waiting on the rate cut that never seems to come.


I'd bet you any amount of dollars to donuts that these same people are carrying debt in the form of Credit Cards (30% interest) and still use them each week.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:50 PM (NjhIg)

170 Interest rates are fine where they are for now. My sense is there's still room for the economy to grow, and at a 3% rate that isn't too shabby.

Alternative is to encourage inflation.

Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 03:50 PM (AWZXb)

171 I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40. That's not good. It used to be closer to 30.
Posted by: Your Ever Smiling Real Estate Agent at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (G5+As)

Yeah *that* is fcked up. I'd think a "good" number would be more like 20-25 years old, you know, right around when it would be best for people to start having children.
Posted by: Helena Handbasket at July 30, 2025 03:49 PM (ULPxl)
____

See my comment above about the younger generations

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:50 PM (iFTx/)

172 So a concerted Government effort, from Clinton through Obama, to increase Home Ownership has done nothing at all to increase Home Ownership...

let's sick the Government on increasing home ownership. What's the worst that could happen?
Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (NjhIg)

Yes they all failed. Or had minimal impact at best.

Although the rates of black household ownership (which really drove a lot of that government policy) did go up a bit. (Or a lot depending on what year you use as year 0)

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at July 30, 2025 03:50 PM (uCjyK)

173 Would love to see how many are like me and had to rely on things like FHA.

This is not a sustainable market.
Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 03:42 PM (KbCG3)

FHA has been around since the 1930s. Nothing new about your situation.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:51 PM (Vvm2m)

174 I liked the stupid poll the Democrats put out to console themselves during the reign of the Orange Menace: that Obama would beat Trump in a head to head election. WTH? Imaginary World must be nice.
Posted by: Jmel at July 30, 2025 03:44 PM (bVhJi)

It's the only world they've ever known.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at July 30, 2025 03:51 PM (g8Ew8)

175 WTH? Imaginary World must be nice.
-------

They're marxists--Imaginary World is the only one that functions in the way they wished it would.
Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 03:47 PM (TN0g+)
---
They've booked a room in Marx's imagination, and probably already paid the reserve fee.

Jacobinism came first, so that wasn't about Marx's 6 ages. But leftism since then, since Marx basically took over the remnant of revolutionaries and convinced him his scheme, it's all been about his theory of what's going to happen in history.

That's where Marx's reading public was, in France, among the revolutionaries that rallied for a short-lived revolution in ~1870. But since then, they've invested pretty heavily into the imagination of a Western academic.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:51 PM (Q4cxx)

176 By the way, few economists have been predicting inflation as a result of the tariffs. Only the most partisan lefties perhaps. That's kind of a straw horse argument that Ace is beating to death. What economists have been saying is that tariffs will increase cost because that is literally what they are designed to do and how they work. They increase the cost of foreign produced items to provide room for domestic producers to increase prices themselves or to increase market share.
Posted by: Earl Schlobodowicz at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (P7Iz+)

But the experts do the stupid thing of claiming that purchasers will not adjust their purchases to compensate for a tariff. So what will happen instead of US Customers paying more for French wine, is that US Customers will quit buying French wine and buy wine from sources with low tariff costs. Or start smuggling.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:51 PM (8avO+)

177 133 A couple of reminders: Canada is actually our largest trading
______________________________

Well, Mexico is our largest trading partner. BUT, Canada is a close second.

Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:51 PM (dIske)

178 Oh, and Powells' labor risk metrics have changed, too. Which means shifting targets based on shifting goalposts. Effing weasel.

Anyway, Friday's job reports are supposed to be meaningful, whatever that means.
Posted by: mrp at July 30, 2025 03:45 PM (rj6Yv)


I'm thinking Powell better watch his ass. Ya gotta believe Trump has a plan and if Powell doesn't get on board, he may find he is no longer relevant and PDT sidesteps the whole thing.

Posted by: Diogenes at July 30, 2025 03:51 PM (W/lyH)

179 Robert Plant looks like hell.
Posted by: garrett

So does Kieth Richards, but he'll outlive you.

Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 03:52 PM (Y8DZL)

180 …without ever once conceding that lower taxes spur growth.

Hm… taxing foreigners spurs growth, and taxing citizens kills growth?

Fascinating.

Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at July 30, 2025 03:52 PM (EXyHK)

181 Housing prices have gotten ridiculous during the illegal surge, especially at the lower ends of the scale. The deportation will only help younger buyers...
Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 03:49 PM (tOcjL)

Exactly, and even rents should go down, which could help those renters disciplined enough to be saving for a down payment.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 03:52 PM (U+MR7)

182 Saw a house (been looking) for 'cash' or 'hard currency'.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 03:52 PM (85azL)

183 138 Considering that the vast majority of wealth in the middle class is their home equity is it really wise to depress demand via high mortgage rates while simultaneously deporting ten million housing occupants? Illegals oughta go but making it more difficult for young wage earners to buy makes no sense.
Posted by: Pete Bog at July 30, 2025 03:38 PM (wGPHk)

Deport them all. Time to be a serious country.

When interest rates come down as they should, housing will become more affordable…but that is also a function of local housing markets, something which the feds have little control over.
Posted by: Cow Demon at July 30, 2025 03:44 PM (WeMfR)

Entry level housing (and rents) should become more affordable when a few million illegals are removed. The demand will go down, supply will be increased. And the supply that becomes available will be more entry-level. Yes, that means that young adults will need to be satisfied with a starter home (not new construction or a mansion, but only 2-3 bedrooms with some items needing work), but expectations are a separate matter.

Posted by: Virginia SoCon at July 30, 2025 03:52 PM (a/dOO)

184 I guess they really are Nazis.

𝐆𝐫𝐞𝐠@WaywardGreg
“Hey, wanna go into American Eagle?”
“Oh! I can’t go in there because I’m black.”
I swear that these people fantasize about being discriminated against.

https://is.gd/X7EeM1

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:52 PM (L/fGl)

185 I learned a long time ago that this is how commies talk.

Not to inform, but to deceive.
Posted by: Minuteman at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (47/pr)

When your boss's nickname is the Father of Lies...

Best part of that is they don't realize, because they're stooopid and greedy, that even his promises to *them* are lies. They think they have the "in" because they're helping. Would love to be a fly on the wall for THAT little wakeup call.

Nancy: Hi Satan, great to finally see you in the flesh. I served you faithfully. I even called it "women's health" like you asked. I'm here for my riches and rewards?

Satan: Yes, yes, my child. Now, about that, I'd like you to meet some of my assistants. They will take care of you, get you on your way to those riches and rewards you so desperately craved.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 03:52 PM (RLuzd)

186 156 My penis grew 3 inches just thinking about all the winning we've been getting.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (iFTx/)

Mine's so hard that scientists are considering tossing out the Brinell hardness test in favor of the Flounder hardness test.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:33 PM (i24o9)
***

Mine is so awesome, The Paolo sent ME a friend request.
Posted by: Diogenes

The guano is getting deeper than a Mexican Bat Cave in here!

Posted by: Kevin Bullshit at July 30, 2025 03:53 PM (G5+As)

187 I'm thinking Powell better watch his ass. Ya gotta believe Trump has a plan and if Powell doesn't get on board, he may find he is no longer relevant and PDT sidesteps the whole thing.

Posted by: Diogenes at July 30, 2025 03:51 PM (W/lyH)

Actually, he better watch his real estate project...that is definitely the way Trump will out him if he wants to. It won't be over "not cutting rates" - it will be over "fraudulent and wasteful spending on a reno"...

Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 03:53 PM (tOcjL)

188 >>So does Kieth Richards, but he'll outlive you.

As long as he keeps buying the occasional guitar from me, I'm fine with that.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:53 PM (NjhIg)

189 I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40. That's not good. It used to be closer to 30.

Kids are getting thrown out of the parents' basements during the estate sales.

Posted by: t-bird at July 30, 2025 03:53 PM (x9AaX)

190 160 I think home ownership would be much higher today if the left didn't spend the last 20 years trying to convince impressionable younger generations that home ownership was bad and they should rent instead. That is of course terrible advice, but a lot of people swallowed it.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (iFTx/)

I think home ownership would be much higher if home prices were in any way connected to household income.

Looking at a chart now. In 1985, median household income was $22K, house prices $78K.

In 2022, income was $74K while housing was $433K.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 03:53 PM (KbCG3)

191 If by increased costs you mean that companies will have to pay a good wage here in the US, rather than paying slave labor wages in China, I'd say that is overall a very good thing.

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (uWKK
---
Until it isn't.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:53 PM (Q4cxx)

192 181 Housing prices have gotten ridiculous during the illegal surge, especially at the lower ends of the scale. The deportation will only help younger buyers...
Posted by: Nova Local
--------

Other costs for low end buyers; target, walmart and amazon have gone up while items for high end buyers have gone down.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (85azL)

193 If by increased costs you mean that companies will have to pay a good wage here in the US, rather than paying slave labor wages in China, I'd say that is overall a very good thing.
Posted by: Tom Servo
---------------

This is in reference to the manufacture of green dildos, I assume

Posted by: Just asking at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (5hfjS)

194 Cormorants?

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (i24o9)

195 My guess about home ownership being delayed is that some of that is attributable to failure to launch/helicopter parenting. A lot of young people don't seem to leave the nest - sometimes literally, sometimes financially - until much later in life than we did.

Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (wKJf5)

196 Actually, he better watch his real estate project...that is definitely the way Trump will out him if he wants to. It won't be over "not cutting rates" - it will be over "fraudulent and wasteful spending on a reno"...
Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 03:53 PM (tOcjL)


Could be. I won't even pretend I am smart enough to figure out what it might be, but PDT is.

Posted by: Diogenes at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (W/lyH)

197 Robert Plant looks like hell.
Posted by: garrett

He's using the stairway wrong...

Posted by: Tex Lovera at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (wtvvX)

198 My penis grew 3 inches just thinking about all the winning we've been getting.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:31 PM (iFTx/)
---
Some say his penis grew three sizes that day.

Posted by: Dr. Seuss at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (Q4cxx)

199 Its true for commies, but also for the bulk of "our" side (aka GOPe). Why else would we be 6 months in and so little legislation turning executive orders into solid law, and why else would we have such a backlog of Trump nominees.
Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 03:48 PM (TN0g+)

Spoiler: They're communists too, hence the lying

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 03:55 PM (RLuzd)

200 Would American Eagle benefit if it were widely regarded as a "white" brand?

Posted by: mr tmz at July 30, 2025 03:55 PM (rJ48h)

201 172 So a concerted Government effort, from Clinton through Obama, to increase Home Ownership has done nothing at all to increase Home Ownership...

let's sick the Government on increasing home ownership. What's the worst that could happen?
Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (NjhIg)
_________________________________

There is a very important caveat to Clinton and Obama's goals. They focused toward home ownership in Urban centers only. They actively tried to discourage suburban and rural home ownership. Obama did this more than Clinton. He even involved the Dept. of Transportation in these goals by forcing use of mass transit and increasing the costs on personal transportation.

Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 03:55 PM (dIske)

202 I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40. That's not good. It used to be closer to 30.
Posted by: Your Ever Smiling Real Estate Agent at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (G5+As)

Everything is more delayed now. People get married later have kids later. Makes sense they buy a home later.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:55 PM (Vvm2m)

203 Quit pickin' on me! I'm five months younger than Mick!

Posted by: Keith Richards at July 30, 2025 03:55 PM (G5+As)

204 By the way, few economists have been predicting inflation as a result of the tariffs. Only the most partisan lefties perhaps. That's kind of a straw horse argument that Ace is beating to death. What economists have been saying is that tariffs will increase cost because that is literally what they are designed to do and how they work. They increase the cost of foreign produced items to provide room for domestic producers to increase prices themselves or to increase market share.
Posted by: Earl Schlobodowicz at July 30, 2025 03:46 PM (P7Iz+)

A lot of the problem in 2008 was that buyers of homes were already wiped out. The agencies were approving loans that could not seriously be paid so they could resell them as "money". This false demand encouraged building in distant areas that had no economic support, so one things took a downturn people ditched the asset and moved elsewhere.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:56 PM (8avO+)

205 Would American Eagle benefit if it were widely regarded as a "white" brand?
Posted by: mr tmz at July 30, 2025 03:55 PM (rJ48h)

Yes!

Posted by: FUBU at July 30, 2025 03:56 PM (Sdlpf)

206 200 Would American Eagle benefit if it were widely regarded as a "white" brand?
Posted by: mr tmz at July 30, 2025 03:55 PM (rJ48h)

Hmmm.
- Carnival Cruises

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:56 PM (Vvm2m)

207 Other costs for low end buyers; target, walmart and amazon have gone up while items for high end buyers have gone down.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (85azL)

Wrong - low end buyers are concerned with food, gas, and utilities, not durable goods (like furniture and appliances). For them, that has also gone down.

As a low end buyer who is still in my low end buy, I don't change things til stuff breaks...and neither would low end buyers. There are no "home renovations b/c they'd be nice and I'm sick of my 10 year old kitchen"...

Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 03:56 PM (tOcjL)

208 And even with strong growth, and low Inflation... and Tax revenues UP... the Fed Res kept interest rates at the same high level, costing the US Taxpayer a few extra BILLION in debt...

Posted by: Romeo13 at July 30, 2025 03:56 PM (mP0Kj)

209 >> I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40. That's not good. It used to be closer to 30.


Look up the age when people start/started their first Full-Time Jobs.
Now look up the avg debt for those workers.

I'm guessing you will see the origin of this phenomenon.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:56 PM (NjhIg)

210 I guess they really are Nazis.

𝐆𝐫𝐞𝐠@WaywardGreg
“Hey, wanna go into American Eagle?”
“Oh! I can’t go in there because I’m black.”
I swear that these people fantasize about being discriminated against.

https://is.gd/X7EeM1
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:52 PM (L/fGl)
_____

I see that vid with the black girl as a parody of the woke meltdown over AE. It's obviously staged. The girl is well-dressed and at least pretending to be affluent. She's smiling the whole time she's saying "oh, I can't go in there, I'm black." She then saunters off in exaggerated steps. I think it's a parody.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 03:57 PM (iFTx/)

211 My guess about home ownership being delayed is that some of that is attributable to failure to launch/helicopter parenting. A lot of young people don't seem to leave the nest - sometimes literally, sometimes financially - until much later in life than we did.
Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (wKJf5)
---
Also owning your own house fits a do-it-yourself-er better than it does somebody without handyman skills.

A lot of our boys are growing up with no handyman skills.

Renting is "The super needs to come and fix this!"

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 03:57 PM (Q4cxx)

212 195 My guess about home ownership being delayed is that some of that is attributable to failure to launch/helicopter parenting. A lot of young people don't seem to leave the nest - sometimes literally, sometimes financially - until much later in life than we did.

Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (wKJf5)

No, it was also illegals and H1-Bs taking all entry level FT jobs...if you can't get your foot in the door, you can't save for a house...

Getting rid of all that should also help...

Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 03:57 PM (tOcjL)

213 202 I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40. That's not good. It used to be closer to 30.

Posted by: Your Ever Smiling Real Estate Agent at July 30, 2025 03:43 PM (G5+As)

Everything is more delayed now. People get married later have kids later. Makes sense they buy a home later.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 03:55 PM (Vvm2m)

Being in student loan debt up to your eyeballs at 22 is a pretty vicious way to start adulthood.

That's the knot to unravel.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 03:57 PM (KbCG3)

214 I'd bet you any amount of dollars to donuts that these same people are carrying debt in the form of Credit Cards (30% interest) and still use them each week.
-------

Yes, I didn't say it was entirely rational to forego a perfectly good house because the rate might be lower later--I was just pointing out that humans do some predictably human things.

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 03:57 PM (TN0g+)

215 I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40.

I didn’t buy my first home until I retired. Where I worked (San Diego) owning a home was always just out of reach. I expect it’s even worse in other cities.

Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at July 30, 2025 03:58 PM (EXyHK)

216 Wait... just hit me... the Fed Res bank holds a LOT of Government debt in bonds and such... Trillions... so... them being able to set a High interest rate is directly in their own interest.

Just looked, as of Jan 1 they held $4.44 TRILLION in US Gov Debt... that that was months ago.

Posted by: Romeo13 at July 30, 2025 03:58 PM (mP0Kj)

217
WNBA moment of the day.

https://is.gd/QyYZtS

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:24 PM (L/fGl)

I like how everybody sitting in the chairs is so totally bored that watching a man in a dog costume get back flipped right to the head and laid out on the floor doesn't even get a reaction.
Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:28 PM (6ydKt)




Everybody was kung fu fight-iiing! Those cats were fast as light-niiing!

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at July 30, 2025 03:58 PM (y9nCu)

218 Agree that Powell is a cunt, but he’s inadvertently helping Trump.

Trump wants some white hot economy and that will spur inflation. Let the interest rates stay high and let’s just keeping things running strong but not redline it.

Posted by: Maroon at July 30, 2025 03:58 PM (AKjAJ)

219 Would American Eagle benefit if it were widely regarded as a "white" brand?

I don't think it's good for any company to be widely regarded as a niche brand. But if you're gonna be, might as well make it the biggest niche. Hint: it's ain't trannies.

Posted by: Oddbob at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (/y8xj)

220 3% is where the "strong" range begins.

Pffft. China was hitting above 10%, sometimes year after year.

Posted by: Operator Error at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (UKjVg)

221 >>>𝐆𝐫𝐞𝐠@WaywardGreg
>>>“Hey, wanna go into American Eagle?”
>>>“Oh! I can’t go in there because I’m black.”

And gay, apparently. Like black dudes don't like hot white chicks, or something.

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (i24o9)

222 Could be. I won't even pretend I am smart enough to figure out what it might be, but PDT is.
Posted by: Diogenes
------------

Haven't seen Trump's daily humiliation of Powell today.
Of course, the day's not over yet.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (85azL)

223 I'm guessing you will see the origin of this phenomenon.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 03:56 PM (NjhIg)

Are you telling me the general wealth of the "middle class" has over the course of a few decades, been transferred to educational administrators, bureaucrats, the federal government, and banks, all of whom are decidedly NOT middle class?? Mind, blown.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (RLuzd)

224 My guess about home ownership being delayed is that some of that is attributable to failure to launch/helicopter parenting. A lot of young people don't seem to leave the nest - sometimes literally, sometimes financially - until much later in life than we did.
Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (wKJf5)

Houses also got larger as families were smaller. When I went to college I knew I wouldn't ever be back to stay since there wasn't room in the house. When my older brother went to college we threw out the slide out mattress under the bunk bed.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (8avO+)

225 Heh, awesome name (Trump has added some High-T Fight to some Rs) -- Preventing Elected Leaders from Owning Securities and Investments Act (PELOSI Act):

Leading Report
@LeadingReport

BREAKING: PELOSI Act, to ban Congressional stock trading, has just passed out of committee

https://is.gd/vUep2M

Posted by: ShainS -- The Marshall Plan is MORTE! at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (4Wyt5)

226 215 I read just last week that the average age of first time homeowners was 40.

I didn’t buy my first home until I retired. Where I worked (San Diego) owning a home was always just out of reach. I expect it’s even worse in other cities.
Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at July 30, 2025 03:58 PM (EXyHK)

Wow... I thought I was late... bought my first home in South Denver when I was 41... a couple years after retiring from the Navy.

Posted by: Romeo13 at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (mP0Kj)

227 Honestly, Alberta probably wouldn't need our help.

Saskatchewan would probably join them.
Manitoba would have to pick a side.

The Frenchies would set things off in Montreal.

B.C. would probably join in as soon as the siege of Vancouver ended.

That leaves Ontario and Ottawa City with Elbows Up.

What's Carney going to do?
Send in the Mounties?

They don't have a big enough army to do anything.

Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (6ydKt)

228 Again. 4.5% Rates are NOT high.

If they were, people would be rushing to buy into CDs at 4.5%.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 04:00 PM (NjhIg)

229 I care way more about inflation than GDP or unemployment. Or even the stock market.

Main Street is the same way.

Posted by: Maroon at July 30, 2025 04:00 PM (AKjAJ)

230 Robert Plant looks like hell.
---------

In his time of dying
He don't want nobody to moan
All he wants for you to do...

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 04:00 PM (TN0g+)

231 Again. 4.5% Rates are NOT high.
------

30 Year Fixed rate housing loans are in the 6s and 7s.

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (TN0g+)

232
Contrary to the Dave Ramsey model I have a friend who has always rented rather than owned a dwelling and has done extremely well.

Appreciation of value has to be set against property taxes and upkeep.

Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (Y8DZL)

233 195 My guess about home ownership being delayed is that some of that is attributable to failure to launch/helicopter parenting. A lot of young people don't seem to leave the nest - sometimes literally, sometimes financially - until much later in life than we did.
Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (wKJf5)

That’s a bingo!!

I know a few 20-something’s with good jobs who live at home. Neighbors across the street is a good example. They have 3 sons, one is in HS one is in college the other graduated and then moved back. I’ve talked to the parents and they said straight up he won’t leave, to which I said why don’t you make him, to which they say that would be mean. Even though he has a good paying job.

Well guess what, he’s never gonna leave. Why would he? Lives in a nice house for free, not a care in the world.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (Vvm2m)

234 My guess about home ownership being delayed is that some of that is attributable to failure to launch/helicopter parenting. A lot of young people don't seem to leave the nest - sometimes literally, sometimes financially - until much later in life than we did.
Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 03:54 PM (wKJf5)

______

Agree

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (iFTx/)

235 Well of course Sydney Sweeney is a nazi, just look at her initials!

Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2025 04:02 PM (uWKK8)

236 117 Possibly white.
Posted by: Axeman

Shotsie's wedding website.

https://is.gd/ytOYq3
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (L/fGl)

Shotsie does have a lasso on their wedding registry. States he wants something fun to take a run at the guests with. Barring any extenuating circumstances -- he'll want soap with his rope.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at July 30, 2025 04:02 PM (N39Ws)

237 Hate to think what the average would really be if it wasn't for all of us 29-year-old homeowners on this board.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (Q4cxx)

238 232
Contrary to the Dave Ramsey model I have a friend who has always rented rather than owned a dwelling and has done extremely well.

Appreciation of value has to be set against property taxes and upkeep.

Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (Y8DZL)

There is simply no way renting in the long run will be a more fiscally sound decision.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (KbCG3)

239 217
WNBA moment of the day.

https://is.gd/QyYZtS

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks,
---------------------

Appears that on the first flip the flipper keeps his feet together whereas on the second flip the flipper's feet are apart.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (85azL)

240 Honestly, Alberta probably wouldn't need our help.

Saskatchewan would probably join them.
Manitoba would have to pick a side.

The Frenchies would set things off in Montreal.

B.C. would probably join in as soon as the siege of Vancouver ended.

That leaves Ontario and Ottawa City with Elbows Up.

What's Carney going to do?
Send in the Mounties?

They don't have a big enough army to do anything.
Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 03:59 PM (6ydKt)

Alberta is taking the lead, but the other 4 western lower states are moving strongly that way too.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (8avO+)

241 Appreciation of value has to be set against property taxes and upkeep.
Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (Y8DZL)

I'm no economist, but either way you are still paying yourself to live there. The other way is dead money.

Posted by: ... at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (RLuzd)

242 Lower rates help refinance the absurd levels of debt. Reduced government spending also helps ... but there is a huge omnibus coming again, end of September.

Fleckenstein says they will roll debt into the short end of the curve. (and they should have rolled into the long end when it was very low, but Biden didn't do that).
https://tinyurl.com/2ebwxd8n

Posted by: illiniwek at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (vbXSk)

243 Like black dudes don't like hot white chicks, or something.

-----

Sydney is too thin for the 'brothers.

Somebody had to say it.

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (TN0g+)

244 I agree 4.5% is not high, but tell that to Trump

Every president wants easy money. It the only thing that kept Obama from being thrown out.

Very easy to artificially juice the economy with ZIRP

I think everyone is better off with “non zero” interest rates.

Posted by: Maroon at July 30, 2025 04:04 PM (AKjAJ)

245 Well of course Sydney Sweeney is a nazi, just look at her initials!
Posted by: Tom Servo at July 30, 2025 04:02 PM (uWKK
---
Also, just rotate one of the S's 90 degrees!

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 04:04 PM (Q4cxx)

246 Shotsie's wedding website.

https://is.gd/ytOYq3
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 03:41 PM (L/fGl)

Mary Alice got some nice cans.

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 04:04 PM (i24o9)

247 Get Wall Street out of housing and you’d fix it real quick.



Posted by: Maroon at July 30, 2025 04:05 PM (AKjAJ)

248 238 232
Contrary to the Dave Ramsey model I have a friend who has always rented rather than owned a dwelling and has done extremely well.

Appreciation of value has to be set against property taxes and upkeep.

Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (Y8DZL)

There is simply no way renting in the long run will be a more fiscally sound decision.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (KbCG3)

That's my wife's take also.

I'm a little more conflicted, having replaced the roof, AC, and water heater in the last couple of years.

Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 04:05 PM (wKJf5)

249 Contrary to the Dave Ramsey model I have a friend who has always rented rather than owned a dwelling and has done extremely well.

Appreciation of value has to be set against property taxes and upkeep.
Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (Y8DZL)

lol. You are still paying all that with your rent, and a little bit more. Otherwise the property owner goes down.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 04:05 PM (8avO+)

250 Umm, I believe President Trump made some moves which removed government spending from GDP calculations. Hence the "contraction."

More lies and misrepresentations from the media.

But, lying and MSM sort of go hand in hand.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at July 30, 2025 04:05 PM (tT6L1)

251 >>>Well guess what, he’s never gonna leave. Why would he? Lives in a nice house for free, not a care in the world.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald
--------------------

The extra expense would cause him to alter his lifestyle.

Same as those we pay not to work.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 04:06 PM (85azL)

252 There is simply no way renting in the long run will be a more fiscally sound decision.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 04:03 PM (KbCG3)

That's my wife's take also.

I'm a little more conflicted, having replaced the roof, AC, and water heater in the last couple of years.

Posted by: bear with asymmetrical balls at July 30, 2025 04:05 PM (wKJf5)

I paid for new HVAC a few years ago. Sucked balls but figured I'd get that back if I ever went to sell.

Equity vs. no equity. I'll take the equity every time.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 04:06 PM (KbCG3)

253 When mortgage rates went ridiculously low, it caused housing prices to artificially inflate. Then, we had the influx of probably 10% more population, inflating property prices even more....
Losing 10% of the illegals will deflate property values all by its lonesome. My first mortgage was at 8.5%.
Historically, this Fed rate ain't all that bad.

Posted by: MkY at July 30, 2025 04:07 PM (cPGH3)

254 Well guess what, he’s never gonna leave. Why would he? Lives in a nice house for free, not a care in the world.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald

That's like getting your hookers and coke for free!

Posted by: Operator Error at July 30, 2025 04:07 PM (UKjVg)

255 Being in student loan debt up to your eyeballs at 22 is a pretty vicious way to start adulthood.

That's the knot to unravel.
Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 03:57 PM (KbCG3)

This is more left wing propaganda. The average student loan balance for graduates is… waaaait for it. $31k.

No not a typo. Not $310k, $31K.

Now of course you’ll never hear this statistic. You hear about the edge cases of people who borrowed $250k to get a degree in lesbian poetry from some no name liberal arts college. Well OK, you’re fucked. But you’re also a fucking idiot. And by no means the typical student.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:07 PM (Vvm2m)

256 Cincinnati Councilman Victoria Parks (D) on the viral white attacks: "They begged for it"

-------

Go ahead, google her.

Nah, I'll save you the trouble: "Fundamentally non-serious" choice.

Posted by: Crusader at July 30, 2025 04:08 PM (TN0g+)

257 Contrary to the Dave Ramsey model I have a friend who has always rented rather than owned a dwelling and has done extremely well.

Appreciation of value has to be set against property taxes and upkeep.
Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (Y8DZL)

lol. You are still paying all that with your rent, and a little bit more. Otherwise the property owner goes down.
Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 04:05 PM (8avO+)
_______

Yea, when you rent you are paying every expense and tax and other thing you'd pay if you owned. Maybe not paying it directly, but it's included in your rent. Plus, you're also paying the landlord a nice profit. And not getting the tax write-off of the mortgage interest.

Posted by: Elric The (One and Only) Blade at July 30, 2025 04:08 PM (iFTx/)

258 And by no means the typical student.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:07 PM (Vvm2m)

You mean . . . the media . . . lied to us?

Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at July 30, 2025 04:08 PM (i24o9)

259 Now of course you’ll never hear this statistic. You hear about the edge cases of people who borrowed $250k to get a degree in lesbian poetry from some no name liberal arts college. Well OK, you’re fucked. But you’re also a fucking idiot. And by no means the typical student.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:07 PM (Vvm2m)

But the archetypical Democrat voter.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at July 30, 2025 04:08 PM (U+MR7)

260 I'm betting the overwhelming majority of Horde Homeowners paid off a Mortgage that was +6% to buy their homes.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 04:09 PM (NjhIg)

261 Lowering interest rates will only spur more consumer debt in an already booming economy, leave them where they are until such time as there is a slow down and you need to goose it.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at July 30, 2025 04:09 PM (XV/Pl)

262 >>>lol. You are still paying all that with your rent, and a little bit more. Otherwise the property owner goes down.
Posted by: Oldcat
---

No tangible asset, no equity.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 04:09 PM (85azL)

263 Home ownership may not make sense for everyone.

My house in NoVA was just appraised at $1mm. No fucking WAY do I have a house that meets that value. But it's NoVA and housing here is still nutso.

This is to say that people in service jobs or early career aren't going to qualify for that kind of loan for a plain old suburban house. If we incentivize too much via lending policies (FNMA, etc), and such, we end up with a lot of people buying houses they can't afford and we get another bubble like we had in the mid 90s.

Things in an economy tend to stabilize on their own. Too much interference isn't a great thing in many cases.

Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 04:10 PM (fz7Mb)

264 Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:01 PM (Vvm2m)

Yup, out of the 12 houses on my 'block'.... we have multiple generations of ADULTS living in 7....

Had never really thought about it before, but that is totally different then when I was raised here 60 years ago.

Posted by: Romeo13 at July 30, 2025 04:10 PM (mP0Kj)

265 This is more left wing propaganda. The average student loan balance for graduates is… waaaait for it. $31k.

No not a typo. Not $310k, $31K.

Now of course you’ll never hear this statistic. You hear about the edge cases of people who borrowed $250k to get a degree in lesbian poetry from some no name liberal arts college. Well OK, you’re fucked. But you’re also a fucking idiot. And by no means the typical student.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:07 PM (Vvm2m)

Not to be pedantic but I just read $38K. Either way, your point is taken.

Now, that's still something for a 23-year old whose first job is likely to pay very little.

The crazy part to me is that in my "lived experience," rent was usually higher than the cost of a mortgage. But I couldn't qualify for a mortgage for awhile.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 04:10 PM (KbCG3)

266 I'm betting the overwhelming majority of Horde Homeowners paid off a Mortgage that was +6% to buy their homes.
Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2025 04:09 PM (NjhIg)
-----------

Refinanced to a lower rate and 15 year. Paid the loan off in 8 years, I think it was. Amazing how fast principle goes down when one makes the mortgage payment then, shortly after, makes a principle only payment.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at July 30, 2025 04:11 PM (tT6L1)

267 I got my first house when I was 26. I look back at it with older and wiser eyes and think I either had balls with moon gravity, or I was completely out of my fucking mind. I still don't know which.

I remember when I told my father I was doing it. He looked at me put his fingers of both hands together to make a pair shaped opening and said "you're going to open your asshole to pay for that". lol

Posted by: Berserker-Dragonheads Division at July 30, 2025 04:11 PM (snZF9)

268 260 I'm betting the overwhelming majority of Horde Homeowners paid off a Mortgage that was +6% to buy their homes.
Posted by: garrett
----

Yep, but I sold it to happy new homeowners within three years and paid cash for the next one.

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 04:11 PM (85azL)

269 "Shotsie"

++++
Named for Lauren Bacall in how to marry a millionaire?

Posted by: Smellslikevictory at July 30, 2025 04:12 PM (19Jrv)

270 253 When mortgage rates went ridiculously low, it caused housing prices to artificially inflate. Then, we had the influx of probably 10% more population, inflating property prices even more....
Losing 10% of the illegals will deflate property values all by its lonesome. My first mortgage was at 8.5%.
Historically, this Fed rate ain't all that bad.

Posted by: MkY at July 30, 2025 04:07 PM (cPGH3)

But we're coming off an environment where Fed rates were anywhere from .25% to 2% for years.

You've got to wean people off of that kinda drug.

The Japanese were seeing those kinds of rates for 20 years and still couldn't/can't get inflation and growth where they want it.

There needs to be a balance of rates versus our economy and the rest of the world.

Currently among the largest economies, the U.S. and U.K. are highest with rates over 4%, everybody else is well below that.

Posted by: SpeakingOf at July 30, 2025 04:12 PM (6ydKt)

271 I think a little 25 basis point reduction is supported by the data, is unexpected and would thereby have amplified effect.

Powell does not want the Fed to be seen as "kow-towing" to Trump.

Posted by: San Franpsycho at July 30, 2025 04:12 PM (JvZF+)

272 I don't mind if Powell keeps interest rates up because I'm anticipating a Reagan-level BOOM and a booming economy often results in inflation.
---
Yes, but the rates need to be raised in reaction to the boom, you can retard a boom if the rates are ahead of the economy.

Inflation is going to happen with an increase the demand or velocity of money. So any economy where participants can't wait to get their hands on more dollars, that is an economy that rewards activity and investment, it's going to have attendent inflation.

So rates should be raised to calm it down. Not in anticipation of its uptake.

Posted by: Axeman at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (Q4cxx)

273 Alex Thompson@AlexThomp
Kamala decides not to run for Gov.

“I have given serious thought to asking the people of CA for the privilege to serve as their governor. I love this state, its people and its promise. It is my home. But after deep reflection, I’ve decided that I will not run for Gov. in this election”

-
Musta sobered up long enough to read the polls.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (L/fGl)

274
Powell does not want the Fed to be seen as "kow-towing" to Trump.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at July 30, 2025 04:12 PM (JvZF+)
-------------

Obviously, Jerome helping out Joe by lowering rates was completely above board.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (tT6L1)

275 Yup, out of the 12 houses on my 'block'.... we have multiple generations of ADULTS living in 7....

Had never really thought about it before, but that is totally different then when I was raised here 60 years ago.

Posted by: Romeo13 at July 30, 2025 04:10 PM (mP0Kj)

If you're a young'en who doesn't care, it makes sense not to waste money on rent.

I've lived on my own since college, but I can see someone doing what they can to save what they can while they still can.

That said, I wonder how many of these young'ens have a plan.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (KbCG3)

276 263 Home ownership may not make sense for everyone.

My house in NoVA was just appraised at $1mm. No fucking WAY do I have a house that meets that value. But it's NoVA and housing here is still nutso.

This is to say that people in service jobs or early career aren't going to qualify for that kind of loan for a plain old suburban house. If we incentivize too much via lending policies (FNMA, etc), and such, we end up with a lot of people buying houses they can't afford and we get another bubble like we had in the mid 90s.

Things in an economy tend to stabilize on their own. Too much interference isn't a great thing in many cases.

Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 04:10 PM (fz7Mb)

You live in a detached house. Townhomes are 50-60% of that number in NoVA. If you want land here, you pay for it. But starter families can easily have a postage stamp yard and still get 3 bedrooms and 2 baths to have a family...even if the kitchen is subpar and the garden is miniscule.

Ask me how I know...

Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (tOcjL)

277 Renting long term is just dumb. You need to try really hard to lose money in real estate over the long run.

I suppose if you can find an ultra low rental comparable to what you’d pay to own and invest the rest wisely? Possible I suppose. But even then that doesn’t last long term because landlords don’t rent below market long term either.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (Vvm2m)

278 Are those student debt figure averages counting students that took no debt?

There’s some segment of the population that has “zero” that could vastly bring down those average numbers.

Even local state universities for locals is like $20k a year for just tuition. Throw in housing, books, living costs and I don’t know how anyone gets a degree for under $100k without community college.

Posted by: Maroon at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (AKjAJ)

279 If this was a Democrat in office, we'd have nightly news videos showing old school credit card swiping machines running every day!

Posted by: Shenanigans at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (RrIy1)

280 @233 The Bum wants their house. Greedy bastard.

Posted by: Case at July 30, 2025 04:14 PM (q3kYF)

281
Obviously, Jerome helping out Joe by lowering rates was completely above board.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (tT6L1)


Beat me to it...

Posted by: It's me donna at July 30, 2025 04:14 PM (VE6XX)

282 Don’t be so humble, you are doing a pretty good job Ace.

Posted by: H at July 30, 2025 04:14 PM (QnBZl)

283 out

@zerohedge
·
8s
*KAMALA HARRIS WILL NOT RUN FOR CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR NEXT YEAR

Posted by: JackStraw at July 30, 2025 03:01 PM (viF8m)

-------------

Steve Hilton hardest hit ...

Posted by: ShainS -- The Marshall Plan is MORTE! at July 30, 2025 04:15 PM (4Wyt5)

284 SpeakingOf
San Franpsycho

Right you are, both of you!
Things can take time. How impatient we've become! 6 months in this Admin, and we're expecting miracles. The pendulum swings but no one wants to see-saw.

Posted by: MkY at July 30, 2025 04:16 PM (cPGH3)

285 Homes like any asset are worth what someone will pay. $1M for a starter home in NoVa isn’t overpriced. It’s the going rate.

Is it expensive? Sure. But expensive doesn’t mean over priced.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:16 PM (Vvm2m)

286 "Trump's closed deals with our biggest trading partners, the EU and Japan, and so there is now a stable platform for business investment going forward. (We still have to negotiate with Canada, India, China, etc.) This ends a lot of the uncertainty that Trump began his term with."

And each deal outs more pressure on those who haven't signed a deal to sign. Because they will get left out of the U.S. economy.

If India doesn't sign...won't Vietnam and Indonesia eat their lunch in the U.S.? Will they ever get that market share back? If India signs, WTF can China then do? Now the Europe is on board, what hell can Chile, Canada, and Mexico do? They have to agree, the sooner the better. The worst thing to do is wait, then agree at some later date.

Posted by: El Mariachi - Attorney at Law at July 30, 2025 04:16 PM (gDhA9)

287 The problem with the fed holding on rates is housing. We aren't getting rid of illegals fast enough to bring housing prices down to where people can afford them at 6 percent plus.

Posted by: Thomans Paine at July 30, 2025 04:16 PM (Vfq+S)

288 Dave Ramsey is still on the air? Couldn't you choose any 30-45 minute snippet of any of his shows and hear his entire shtick?

Posted by: Profligate Spender at July 30, 2025 04:17 PM (G5+As)

289 Musta sobered up long enough to read the polls.
Posted by: Anonosaurus 04:13 PM (L/fGl)

I think the powers in CA told her that the day she moved back. No idea what knuckleheaded cutout they have planned but not Harris.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 04:17 PM (8avO+)

290 You live in a detached house. Townhomes are 50-60% of that number in NoVA. If you want land here, you pay for it. But starter families can easily have a postage stamp yard and still get 3 bedrooms and 2 baths to have a family...even if the kitchen is subpar and the garden is miniscule.

Ask me how I know...
Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (tOcjL)

FWIW I just looked on Zillow (yeah, I know...) at my first house, a townhouse. I paid a bit under $200k for it late 90s. It's showing at $550k now. And it isn't that great of a townhouse. Location is a few miles from where I am now.

Fairfax county is still crazy. Agree that a supply side shock will bring all of it back to reality.

Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 04:18 PM (Mmf4/)

291 I think the powers in CA told her that the day she moved back. No idea what knuckleheaded cutout they have planned but not Harris.
Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 04:17 PM (8avO+)
---------------

Bonta will be able to get the "votes." He'll play to the overwhelming white guilt of CA and win in a landslide.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at July 30, 2025 04:18 PM (tT6L1)

292 288 Dave Ramsey is still on the air? Couldn't you choose any 30-45 minute snippet of any of his shows and hear his entire shtick?

Posted by: Profligate Spender at July 30, 2025 04:17 PM (G5+As)

I'm amazed people still call into that show. If you're wondering what Ramsey's advice will be, you're already a dum dum.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 04:18 PM (KbCG3)

293 Even local state universities for locals is like $20k a year for just tuition. Throw in housing, books, living costs and I don’t know how anyone gets a degree for under $100k without community college.
Posted by: Maroon

Anyone that pays for level 100 and 200 classes at a Uni where you get TA's instead of actual experiences teachers deserves to pay extra.

Posted by: MkY at July 30, 2025 04:19 PM (cPGH3)

294 NOOD

Kamala

will not run

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at July 30, 2025 04:19 PM (ULPxl)

295 279 If this was a Democrat in office, we'd have nightly news videos showing old school credit card swiping machines running every day!
Posted by: Shenanigans

I miss that ker-chunk sound!

Posted by: Beltone Bob at July 30, 2025 04:19 PM (G5+As)

296 Who do they think they are convincing anymore?

Like, who do they envision reads or sees this and says, "I've changed my mind--the economy is not good."

Posted by: People's Hippo Voice at July 30, 2025 04:19 PM (lDIPK)

297
Kamala out in Kalifornia Klown Kar Governor race.

Posted by: Auspex at July 30, 2025 04:20 PM (Y8DZL)

298 Homes like any asset are worth what someone will pay. $1M for a starter home in NoVa isn’t overpriced. It’s the going rate.

Is it expensive? Sure. But expensive doesn’t mean over priced.
Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:16 PM (Vvm2m)

It's out of reach for an early career making $50k, esp when he may be moving in a couple of years to pursue other opportunities.

Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 04:20 PM (Mmf4/)

299 Are those student debt figure averages counting students that took no debt?

There’s some segment of the population that has “zero” that could vastly bring down those average numbers.

Even local state universities for locals is like $20k a year for just tuition. Throw in housing, books, living costs and I don’t know how anyone gets a degree for under $100k without community college.
Posted by: Maroon at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (AKjAJ)


Median student loan value (which would obviously not include no loan) is $25k. Which shows what I said earlier a few outliers have enormous debt but they’re not anywhere near normal.

As for $20k a year, that’s without any aid or scholarships. I think if you include that it’s closer to $12-15k. Which a summer job could cover a lot of.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:20 PM (Vvm2m)

300 Even local state universities for locals is like $20k a year for just tuition. Throw in housing, books, living costs and I don’t know how anyone gets a degree for under $100k without community college.
Posted by: Maroon at July 30, 2025 04:13 PM (AKjAJ)

Scholarships help if you are the kind of student they want. No way I could have gone to my college in the 80s without grants and scholarships. My loans were a small fraction.

Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 04:20 PM (8avO+)

301 Nood. Kamala.

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at July 30, 2025 04:20 PM (ExV1e)

302 With a name like "Shotsie Buck" and the information that Shotsie Buck knew Vogler, and that Shotsie Buck's wife recently divorced this guy, my gaydar has blasted off into orbit.

Posted by: gKWVE at July 30, 2025 04:21 PM (gKWVE)

303 Housing prices have gotten ridiculous during the illegal surge, especially at the lower ends of the scale. The deportation will only help younger buyers...
Posted by: Nova Local at July 30, 2025 03:49 PM (tOcjL)

This is ridiculous. Lowering borrowing costs benefit everyone except the people that hold the mortgages. I’m not saying set rates at zero or give anyone a loan that wants one. How many great businesses or even steady ones were started by taking a second mortgage? The conceit that you can so precisely target economic policy to only benefit one group while requiring others to pay their “fair share” sounds vaguely and similarly misguided.

Posted by: Pete Bog at July 30, 2025 04:21 PM (wGPHk)

304 It's out of reach for an early career making $50k, esp when he may be moving in a couple of years to pursue other opportunities.
Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 04:20 PM (Mmf4/)


And?

Where is it written someone making $50k and choosing to live in one of the most expire parts of the country has to own a home?

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:21 PM (Vvm2m)

305 And?

Where is it written someone making $50k and choosing to live in one of the most expire parts of the country has to own a home?

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at July 30, 2025 04:21 PM (Vvm2m)

I believe I said that upthread. Keep up.

Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 04:22 PM (Mmf4/)

306 291 I think the powers in CA told her that the day she moved back. No idea what knuckleheaded cutout they have planned but not Harris.
Posted by: Oldcat at July 30, 2025 04:17 PM (8avO+)
---------------

It going to be Bass all the way.
Look what she did for L.A. 👀 👀

Posted by: Braenyard - some Absent Friends are more equal than others _ at July 30, 2025 04:22 PM (85azL)

307 273 Alex Thompson@AlexThomp
Kamala decides not to run for Gov.

“I have given serious thought to asking the people of CA for the privilege to serve as their governor. I love this state, its people and its promise. It is my home. But after deep reflection, I’ve decided that I will not run for Gov. in this election”
________________________________

"Instead, I'm decided to write my autobiography to encourage young girls to pursue their dreams. My autobiography will be a pop-up book written for 10 year olds. Pay particular attention to the animated section involving Willie Brown. On that page I am picking up a pencil from the floor while on my knees...over and over again if you move the cardboard lever on the side of the page. (*cackle cackle*)"

Posted by: Orson at July 30, 2025 04:23 PM (dIske)

308 FWIW I just looked on Zillow (yeah, I know...) at my first house, a townhouse. I paid a bit under $200k for it late 90s. It's showing at $550k now. And it isn't that great of a townhouse. Location is a few miles from where I am now.

Fairfax county is still crazy. Agree that a supply side shock will bring all of it back to reality.

Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 04:18 PM (Mmf4/)

Zillow is showing mine for 940K. There is no frigging way in the planet of hell I would ever..like ever pay that for this place. Yeah its nice, mostly all new, but hell no. I wonder if sites like zillow are part of the problem. Somebody hands my 940K I'll hand them the keys and leave them a harley.

Posted by: Berserker-Dragonheads Division at July 30, 2025 04:25 PM (snZF9)

309 252
Equity vs. no equity. I'll take the equity every time.
Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at July 30, 2025 04:06 PM (KbCG3)

Absolutely. Mrs OCiS and I spent more on the house we currently have (and need) when we purchased it in the early 2000s. I have 2 years left on the mortgage, house has doubled in value plus the 16 acres of field behind me was just converted into conservation forever wild surely adding another 70k-100k in value for never having a housing development back there. Can't get that lucky by renting.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at July 30, 2025 04:26 PM (N39Ws)

310 Fort Cavazos officially restored as Fort Hood

-
You know, "Hood" as in KKK.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Lying Dogface Pony Soldier at July 30, 2025 04:26 PM (L/fGl)

311 Zillow price estimates are BS.

Posted by: runner at July 30, 2025 04:26 PM (g47mK)

312 Zillow is showing mine for 940K. There is no frigging way in the planet of hell I would ever..like ever pay that for this place. Yeah its nice, mostly all new, but hell no. I wonder if sites like zillow are part of the problem. Somebody hands my 940K I'll hand them the keys and leave them a harley.
Posted by: Berserker-Dragonheads Division at July 30, 2025 04:25 PM (snZF9)

Hah!!

Yeah, I take Zillow with a grain of salt too. I figure that if the methodology is stupid, at least it's consistently stupid for comparison purposes.

Posted by: WitchDoktor at July 30, 2025 04:27 PM (Mmf4/)

313 When I see NoVa.I'm thinking DC swamp creature.

Posted by: Case at July 30, 2025 04:28 PM (q3kYF)

314 I know I'll want to see a lower interest rate when I buy my house. Though I can refinance, I guess, later on.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at July 30, 2025 04:33 PM (omVj0)

315 Your problem is that you believe that (for example) 6% growth is “overheating!!!!”. You believe that 3% is the “right” growth. Look at Argentina!!!! Wake up!

Posted by: JackWayne at July 30, 2025 04:33 PM (22a00)

316 Open channel D
Posted by: Open Channel D at July 30, 2025

***
"I'm afraid Mr. Waverly is not available. Transferring you to Mr. Solo, Acting Chief for North America."

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at July 30, 2025 04:35 PM (omVj0)

317 Zillow price estimates are BS.
Posted by: runner at July 30, 2025

***
What about Realtor?

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at July 30, 2025 04:35 PM (omVj0)

318 Something else could be names Cavasos. Just be glad Fort Hood was named Fort Hissan. Glad to see Fort Hood back. We have heroes they can't take away.

Posted by: Eromero at July 30, 2025 04:41 PM (LHPAg)

319 @ 318,
My grammar teacher would be so disappointed in me.

Posted by: Eromero at July 30, 2025 04:43 PM (LHPAg)

320 Your comments about cherry picking are valid. That is why the only metric I pay attention to is real wage growth. I want humans to succeed. We are winning, it's a very good thing. Let's hope we can export some of this, Europe need a free speech kick in the ass. Poland might save Europe one again!

Posted by: Daniel Hayes at July 30, 2025 05:56 PM (p7jsm)

321 The New York Slimes and Chuck-E-Sleaze sitting and moping in their Dark Rooms with the Lights Turned Off

Posted by: Tamaa the Drongo Bird at July 30, 2025 06:07 PM (wGqjj)

322 Very accurate post, Ace. The first quarter of 2025 is a result like you describe.

"GDP Grows Strong 3% in Second Quarter"

Just wait... Wuhan is being spun up again...

Posted by: Danimal28 at July 30, 2025 06:27 PM (mNOhh)

323 I am just fine with a 4.5% interest rate. I can keep getting 4%+ guaranteed interest on my savings with CDs.

Posted by: Angel at July 30, 2025 07:59 PM (P1KWe)

324 this is helpful if biased

https://www.politico.com/interactives /2025/trump-tariff-income-tracker/

Posted by: TallDave at July 31, 2025 02:11 PM (fST/n)

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