When you're a leftist, how do you choose?

How do you know when quiet neighborhoods are not a sign of white supremacy?

Somehow, Ace consistently finds a story on Fridays about which there is more. This week, in his The Wages of Woke post, there's a discussion of a piece in The Atlantic . .

which instructs us that wanting your neighborhood to be peaceful and quiet -- so that people can sleep at night and children can be well-rested for school and adults refreshed for productive work -- is white supremacy.

But what happened when the author of that piece finished the degree for which she apparently didn't need to study and became an adult? David Thompson provides some insight in: Don't Oppress My People With Your Expectations Of Politeness And Basic Consideration

The Atlantic is currently promoting an article from its archive, one selected by the editors as a "must-read," a measure of the magazine's importance to the progressive lifestyle. A choice that is perhaps more telling than intended.
The chosen article, by novelist Xochitl Gonzalez, poses the question, "Why Do Rich People Love Quiet?" It is sub-headed, "The sound of gentrification is silence." A racially judgemental tone prevails. Such that the term rich people can be read as meaning white people. Followed by implied tutting.
It begins with an account of life at university - Brown, since you ask - and the merits of Brooklyn hip hop combos

Ah, those downtrodden minority students, huddled together for mutual safety. Lest the roaming tigers find them.

Then the other students arrived -- the white students.

Some pointed, rather thorough fisking of the text of the Atlantic piece follows. Fisking like in the old days.

Oh, and for those of you curious about the author's precise level of brownness, and thereby magical qualities, and all those rather handy exemptions from reciprocal proprieties, I'll just leave this here:

Well, the photo kinds of leads into the next part of the story, surviving Covid in the city and . .

At which point, readers may wonder how Ms Gonzalez, a novelist, manages to write her books amid the fashionably vibrant racket that she recommends to others. All that shouting and shrieking and “ceaseless music” that she finds so liberating and authentic. Wouldn’t those extended and rather complicated trains of thought be disrupted, and likely made impossible, by all the shouting and laughing, all the whumping and thumping, all those jolly sirens?
Happily, an answer is provided in the pages of Elle Décor, in which Ms Gonzalez opined some two months earlier:

Writing novels is intrinsically solitary. Which is no small part of why I switched professions in the first place. Despite wearing the coat of an extrovert, I am pure Greta Garbo. I want to be alone.

(!)

And so, our silence-needing novelist sought out “a gorgeous historic house in downtown Kingston, New York.” Ah, yes. An “upstate vacation rental.”
Perhaps Ms Gonzalez was hoping that readers of her Atlantic article – the one about noise being so vibrant and racially affirming – would not stumble across her Elle Décor piece, published weeks earlier, which rather calls into question her own later claims. And which, it has to be said, suggests a certain pretence, a certain hypocrisy. . .

It's kind of fun to compare the description of The Atlantic at the beginning of the post on this article by David Strom which Ace linked with the other goof-ball pieces described at the end of David Thompson's post.

h/t goes to Ed Driscoll, who also found this great meme from Jon Gabriel:

In our own neighborhood, we sometimes have some loud and vibrant "culturally-affirming" activities. But often the neighbors across the street will bring us a plate of food when the band gets going, and will wind up the wild stuff before it gets too late.

Plus, they give us eggs from their hens. Cultural enrichment without The Atlantic.

* * * * *

Antisemitism, Racism and Decolonization

Before Ace's link disappears from the sidebar:

Douglas Murray absolutely merks paid Hamas propagandist (and former MSNBC host) Mehdi Hassan at the Munk debate on antisemitism and the "anti-Zionism" it's usually disguised as.
One style point deducted from Douglas Murray because he is very mean on a personal level, but two points rewarded because Mehdi Hassan deserves it so much
Murray brings up Pakistan, a state "created" about the same time as Israel, and notes that if someone said "I think the state of Pakistan should be abolished, and I don't believe Pakistanis have the right to their own state," we would not believe them when they then added, "Of course, I have nothing against the Pakistani people myself. . ."

You know, the Pakistan thing could be problematic for hard-core decolonization ideologues. Weren't the Muslims colonizers in the Indian subcontinent? How does today's leftist choose between support for India or Pakistan?

I thought it might be interesting to review what a couple of the big think tanks thought about Pakistan 10 or 11 years ago:

Aspen: Why is there such a difference between India and Pakistan now? (well, 11 years ago)? What are today's wokesters doing about the crisis with Pakistan kicking out all those refugees from Afghanistan?

10 years ago: Is Pakistan the most dangerous place in the world as a poor country with nukes? (Did they help us with the draw-down in Afghanistan?)

Brookings: The Pakistani army remains obsessed with India. It has lost every war with India and now turns to nuclear and "asymmetric warfare" (terrorism). Pakistan thinks this works because India doesn't retaliate (because Pakistan has nuclear capability).

Examples of war between India and Pakistan, plus numerous incidents of terrorism by Pakistan, one of which was an early challenge for Obama.

So . . . Hamas is not the only organization that thinks this way?

There are some short highlight videos from the Munk debate included in the Duane Patterson piece linked above by Ace. Here is another one which includes the comparison Ace noted between Pakistan and Israel:

Why were the no protests or college campus tent protests set up after Sudan?

What makes this current conflict different?🤔

Douglas Murray is, of course, unmatched! 👏pic.twitter.com/yqUdLLKEeu
— Kat Kanada (@KatKanada_TM) June 18, 2024

Facebook/Meta has added a thing called "Stories". These are typically enhanced memes or GIFS which disappear from view quickly, and can be quite irritating when you don't have time to read the whole thing, or when they are political in nature.

One which showed up on my feed was from a young woman I know, which suggested (among other suggestions) that if you were upset by 10/7 but had not been more upset by unspecified horrors in Sudan (there are already a lot), you were a Racist. No explanation for how "caring" or being upset would make a difference. I really think that this young woman just hates to see kids die and has not thought through the implications of these "stories", but it's troublesome that she's being fed this kind of stuff.

Anyway, a simplified form of Douglas Murray's argument about Sudan in the debate has apparently already been used by the other side.

About Sudan:

Things were much worse there a few years ago. Strategy Page was happy to sign off on regular updates in 2020. Looks like everybody just got tired of fighting.

But apparently, 14 months ago the "international community" sparked a new war by strongly insisting that the paramilitary Rapid Support Forces join with regular government forces as a step toward "democracy" or something.

The generals on the opposing sides of the new conflict used to be on the same side.

In the past few days, there has been a flurry of news items on Sudan.

UAE accused of fueling war by providing weapons to Sudan's paramilitary rivals

The Sudanese government on Tuesday accused the United Arab Emirates (UAE) of fueling the 14-month war in the African country by providing weapons to a rival paramilitary force.
The UAE dismissed the allegation as "ludicrous," calling it "a shameful abuse by one of the warring parties."
The clash came during a UN Security Council meeting at which Assistant Secretary-General Martha Pobee warned that atrocities are being committed along ethnic lines in Sudan's western Darfur region.
She urged an immediate cease-fire in the North Darfur capital, El Fasher, which is besieged by the paramilitary Rapid Support Forces "to prevent further atrocities, protect critical infrastructure, and alleviate civilian suffering."
Sudanese Ambassador Al-Harith Mohamed accused the paramilitary Rapid Support Forces of "destructively launching" its war with the Sudanese military and attacking civilians, aided by weapons from the UAE.

U.N. experts monitoring an arms embargo in Darfur reported "credible" evidence in January that the UAE sent weapons to the Rapid Support Forces several times a week from northern Chad.
U.S. Ambassador Linda Thomas-Greenfield on Tuesday reiterated a U.S. appeal to all "external actors to stop fueling and prolonging this conflict and enabling these atrocities by sending weapons to Sudan."
Speaking to reporters after the meeting, Sudan's Mohamed urged the council to "walk the extra mile by naming and shaming the United Arab Emirates."

Sudan plunged into conflict again in mid-April 2023, when long-simmering tensions between its military and paramilitary leaders broke out in the capital, Khartoum, and spread to other regions including Darfur.
The U.N. says over 14,000 people have been killed and 33,000 injured.
The paramilitary Rapid Support Forces were formed from Janjaweed fighters by then Sudanese President Omar al-Bashir, who ruled the country for three decades before being overthrown during a popular uprising in 2019.
He is wanted by the International Criminal Court on charges of genocide and other crimes during the conflict in Darfur in the 2000s.
Last Thursday, the Security Council adopted a resolution demanding the Rapid Support Forces immediately halt its siege of El Fasher -- the only capital in Darfur it doesn't control.

I wonder if anyone will care about this report by the BBC that Iran may have been supplying drones to the military in Sudan?

This looks to me like a descent back into the misery engulfing Sudan (remember Darfur?), South Sudan and Chad not so long ago. Which people should the left "care" about? Which side do they demand that you care about? Should the RSF get "decolonization" points for being (partly) descendants of indigenous nomadic Janjaweed fighters defending their grazing rights against sedentary colonizer farmers long ago?

Better check with your local leftist faction before speaking.

Music

Better than our locals, and if they had a tuba, it would probably be in tune.

* * * * *

Hope you have something nice planned for this weekend.

This is the Thread before the Gardening Thread.

Serving your mid-day open thread needs

* * * * *

Last week's thread, June 15, Men Exiting Cancel Culture

Comments are closed so you won't ban yourself by trying to comment on a week-old thread. But don't try it anyway.

Posted by: K.T. at 11:08 AM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 first.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at June 22, 2024 11:08 AM (QNSds)

2 Quiet...one of the reasons I bought a little acreage to build my house on.

Posted by: BignJames at June 22, 2024 11:13 AM (AwYPR)

3 When everything is white supremacy nothing is.

Posted by: blaster at June 22, 2024 11:14 AM (IFNME)

4 Yonder

Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 22, 2024 11:14 AM (Q4IgG)

5 I did NOT suffer white supremacy when I stayed at a hotel in El Paso; Shouts, screams, commotions after midnight. Will I ever go back to that hotel again? Hell no. Give me my lily-white privilege of sleeping in a neighborhood that's quiet at night.

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at June 22, 2024 11:15 AM (ynpvh)

6 You know how the Washington Post hired a new editor and then ran a hit piece on him? I gave him until August.

Ha! I was wrong! He decided not to take the job at all!

Posted by: blaster at June 22, 2024 11:16 AM (IFNME)

7 Douglass Murray is one of the few remaining journalists.

He's fearless.

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:16 AM (LkLld)

8 With that scythe in her hand she's prepared for the fall or Autumn.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 11:17 AM (mP6Ur)

9
Autumn is a great word. It has been used by the British more than by we here in the States.

It is fun to draw it out as your speak it:
"Autumnnnnnnnn"

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars (TM) at June 22, 2024 11:17 AM (xG4kz)

10 In that Murray debate video, there are warnings as the video starts from several platforms alerting viewers of the "F word" being used. Not a warning to viewers that two of the panelists are calling for the murder of Jews, but because someone used the "F word". Idiocracy.

Posted by: Son of Dad at June 22, 2024 11:18 AM (8JB5s)

11 Good morning KT

Posted by: Skip at June 22, 2024 11:18 AM (fwDg9)

12 . . . Because when my people start hooting and hollering and screaming at each other, someone usually winds up in the ER and the cops come by to take statements.

Restraint has a cultural purpose. It avoids the generational feuds.

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 11:19 AM (D7oie)

13 Ever get the feeling you are being played?

>>Russia overtakes US in gas supplies to Europe for first time in 2 years

https://tinyurl.com/4tx9uskb

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:21 AM (LkLld)

14 I don't know if this still happens but I can recall when mariachis in similar regalia would stand on the street playing music on a weekend, some cars would pull up, a deal was made and off they would all go to play a wedding or some such event.

Posted by: gourmand du jour at June 22, 2024 11:21 AM (MeG8a)

15 Our moderately-wealthy, for the area, subdivision features people of palor, some black, and transplants from Mexico, Brazil, India, Taiwan, and China.

Ironically, the most consistently obnoxiously noisy family moved in from one of the nearby towns, which often is pronounced with an extra '-tucky' on the end.

Posted by: 2009Refugee at June 22, 2024 11:22 AM (8AONa)

16 I assume most people here haven't listened to Dave Smith's response to Douglas Murray's "debate" performance.

Smith has publicly offered to debate Murray. I would imagine if Murray were to accept, the event would go quite differently.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:23 AM (pBHM9)

17
Having a name such as "Xochitl" makes one "authentic"?

Great!

You may now call me, "Xokrebs v Xocarnot"

Posted by: Xokrebs v Xocarnot: My Authenticity is Off the Charts (TM)! at June 22, 2024 11:23 AM (xG4kz)

18 As for leftists and they're desire to constantly be pointing out they rayciss, I will say this. I don't know WHY this has to be a left/right, white/black thing.

It's a city thing, and those who don't live in cities are not going to write articles about how noisy cities are... but they are! People who don't live in cities, don't want to live in cities, because the things that happen in cities don't appeal to them.

I don't understand why city folk don't understand this.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (pBHM9)

19 17
Having a name such as "Xochitl" makes one "authentic"?

Great!

You may now call me, "Xokrebs v Xocarnot"

Posted by: Xokrebs v Xocarnot: My Authenticity is Off the Charts (TM)! at June 22, 2024 11:23 AM (xG4kz)

Mexican name. Normally go by shortened version, Xochi.

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (ynpvh)

20 that by the way is a proper reaping hook, she is ready to harvest grain.
Most sickles made now are smaller, and the scythe has replaced the sickle in most places.

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (D7oie)

21 We're rural.

Neighbors out here pretty much keep to themselves. It's not uncommon for me to go outside and hear.... nothing.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (Q4IgG)

22 You know how the Washington Post hired a new editor and then ran a hit piece on him? I gave him until August.

Ha! I was wrong! He decided not to take the job at all!

Posted by: blaster at June 22, 2024 11:16 AM

Would you take a job knowing that the people there hate you? I wouldn't.

I went to a job interview once and the personnel guy low balled my starting pay. This was after a recruiter for the company and I had a meeting and he really wanted me to join the company with my skill set. I told him nope, not gonna work for the company for that and went home.

A few days later I got a call from the owner and he offered to double my starting pay if I took the job. I said nope, not gonna take a job in a place where the personnel manager already hates me.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (QNSds)

23 Leftists always choose what is best for them, period. They do not consider anything to do to be hypocritical because the standard rules do not apply to them. They are Yard Sign Calvinists, and by these signs they are saved.

It's partly a callback to the Pelagian heresy, which holds that salvation is possible without God and denies Original Sin. That describes these people perfectly. They are just better than you, and entitled to do whatever they want.

You, on the other hand, are condemned. You cannot be redeemed.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (llXky)

24 There was a mass shooting here in Arkansas yesterday. Three dead, nine wounded including the perp (don't fuck with Arky State Troopers, they will shoot and he's lucky just wounded). His picture is being shown and he's a white guy, not gender confused, pretty much a nut thug. Anything other than that, the picture would be pixied.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 11:26 AM (V5eKu)

25 By the way, Strategy Page is effectively dead.

They're information is garbage, completely unreliable, often outright false. Not to be trusted.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:27 AM (llXky)

26 Countries in Africa are only there for the convenience of cartographer. In reality it's tribe against tribe against tribe. The only time Africa has had peace was when it was imposed on it from outside.

Posted by: Beckoningchasm Phone at June 22, 2024 11:27 AM (MJADG)

27 Having a name such as "Xochitl" makes one "authentic"?

Great!

You may now call me, "Xokrebs v Xocarnot"
Posted by: Xokrebs v Xocarnot: My Authenticity is Off the Charts (TM)! at June 22, 2024 11:23 AM (xG4kz)

Isn't it the name of one of those old Aztec temples or something?

You know, the people the Spaniards ethnically cleansed and genocided?

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:27 AM (pBHM9)

28 My old house was relatively quiet save for the fact that we were DIRECTLY on the final approach path for Runway 32. I quickly learned to sleep through the noise of a 737 passing over my roof just a few hundred feet off the deck.

My new house is in a very quiet neighborhood full of people who manage to be courteous and keep the lawns nice without the totalitarian oversight of an HOA. If that's white supremacy in action, I'm fine with that.

Posted by: PabloD at June 22, 2024 11:27 AM (OS34I)

29 Sorry. When people refer to Brown as Ivy League I have to laugh.

Posted by: Field Marshal Zhukov at June 22, 2024 11:28 AM (wBaIH)

30 My neighborhood is quite thankfully

Posted by: Skip at June 22, 2024 11:28 AM (fwDg9)

31 >>Smith has publicly offered to debate Murray. I would imagine if Murray were to accept, the event would go quite differently.

Doubtful at best.

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:28 AM (LkLld)

32 That Aspen Institute video… the detestable Jane Harman makes a brief appearance. She used to be my Congress critter in SoCal and is a Wilsonian through and through. She went from Congress to the Wilson Institute IIRC….. one of those think tanks I’ve no doubt now are part of the deep state intelligentsia always agitating to get us involved in at least funding conflicts everywhere. Woodrow Wilson was a particularly bad president and human being. One of our worst. Why doesn’t he receive more opprobrium from historians?

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2024 11:30 AM (xT8gx)

33 Isn't it the name of one of those old Aztec temples or something?

You know, the people the Spaniards ethnically cleansed and genocided?
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:27 AM (pBHM9)
---
They did a piss-poor job of it because there are lots of Aztecs still around. The empire is gone, but the people are still around.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:31 AM (llXky)

34
Is that creature with the white hair in that oh-so-earnest looking quartet of boobs on stools a woman?

Yikes! What a nightmare!

Posted by: Xokrebs v Xocarnot: My Authenticity is Off the Charts (TM)! at June 22, 2024 11:31 AM (xG4kz)

35 ***So ...Hamas is not the only organization that thinks this way?***
-------------------

It is the muslim way.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (mP6Ur)

36 We're rural.

Neighbors out here pretty much keep to themselves. It's not uncommon for me to go outside and hear.... nothing.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (Q4IgG)

There's also another basic concept, homeostasis (stop it, knuckleheads!). Simply put, people who were raised in a tranquil home will want to live in tranquility, and people who were raised in chaos and noise will seek out chaos and noise and disorder and disruption and conflict.

You return to what you know, and it takes significant effort for those who were raised in chaos to realize this isn't "normal," and that a life without chaos is not only possible, but preferred.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (pBHM9)

37 Why doesn’t he receive more opprobrium from historians?
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2024 11:30 AM (xT8gx)

He formalized the American administrative state, and that makes him a cultural hero. Ivy league president, New Englander, transformed the US into a system controlled by agencies reaching into every segment of life.

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (D7oie)

38 Bagpipes.

When the marachi music starts to blare, load a CD into the boombox and blast a few hours of Scottish bagpipes out in the yard.

Diversity and all that.

Posted by: Ju at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (aTmM/)

39
I don't even cut my grass until the afternoon. I *used* to have a neighbor who was a night shift ER doctor and I did not want to disturb his sleep. Common courtesy. My leaf blower is battery powered and low decibel level. In fact 90% of my outdoor noise-making stuff is battery powered and very quiet.

I do have a gasoline powered chain saw (along with a quiet battery powered one) when I have some heavy duty tree work to do.

All the south-of-the-border landscaping crews are still using the stuff that makes as much noise as a jet airplane at takeoff. They roll up in the morning, slam the tailgate to the ground, and raise holy hell for the next hour.

Posted by: Divide by Zero at June 22, 2024 11:33 AM (RKVpM)

40 The lack of quiet in my neighborhood is mostly a first-world problem. A continuous symphony of lawn mowers, weed eaters and Mexican bagpipes from Saturday morning through Sunday evening. I guess I'll survive. Heh.

Posted by: Notorious BFD at June 22, 2024 11:33 AM (mH6SG)

41 Given Boeing's recent track record, I'm glad I no longer live on a flight path. I can tolerate the noise of a plane overhead; I don't think I could sleep through a flaming jet engine crashing through my roof.

Posted by: PabloD at June 22, 2024 11:34 AM (OS34I)

42 The last house the Ex and I had was in my home town in Ohio. Railroad right of way going through the middle of the block, not uncommon in old steel mill towns. When we first moved in, the wife was fretting about the noise. Pretty soon she got used to it and found the 3:05 heading to Republic Steel with a load of taconite was restful.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 11:35 AM (V5eKu)

43 Heh, read the girthy post and then find no one has commented.
What a rookie!

Thanks for the thread KT.

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 11:35 AM (UC3nL)

44 The thing that I find most annoying in the whole Hamas situation is people whining about "war crimes" when Hamas completely ignores the laws of war and the fact that they are and always have been based on reciprocity.

We won't kill your prisoners if you don't kill ours. We'll spare your civilians if you spare ours.

I don't encounter many Hamas apologists, but my position is simply: "What is the rank structure of Hamas? What do their uniforms look like? How do you tell a private from a sergeant?"

Can't answer? Then they're all unlawful combatants. Kill anyone you want.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:36 AM (llXky)

45 We had a little Mexican joint in the ‘hood years ago with that Xochitl name. We pronounced the way it sounds when you’re hocking up a loogie

Posted by: DanMan at June 22, 2024 11:37 AM (8uzBS)

46 I lived pretty much next door to LAX airport for more than 30 years. You get used to the jetliner noise pretty quickly… it becomes part of the background. Other than the continuous jet noise that neighborhood I would describe as genuinely peaceful and quiet…. With the aforementioned jets taking off and landing…

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2024 11:38 AM (xT8gx)

47 I was honored to be invited to a birthday party for one of the surgeons I work with last night. It was at a Benihana type place. I was one of three non Chinese people at the table of 16.

I had a fun time. They partied like maniacs. And I was the least educated person at the table at a masters degree.

Yellow supremacy? Is that a thing?

Posted by: nurse ratched at June 22, 2024 11:38 AM (X96e+)

48 Smith has publicly offered to debate Murray. I would imagine if Murray were to accept, the event would go quite differently.
------
Doubtful at best.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:28 AM (LkLld)

No, I'd say damn near certain he would make Murray look foolish.

Murray is making basic arguments that are easily refuted.

Which I think has nothing to do with the question of whether Israel has a right to exist, which was ostensibly the purpose of the "debate," which turned into a simple-minded "if you don't agree with me you're an anti-Semite" diatribe.

Which worked on the muzzie anti-Semite, because he is.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:38 AM (Ntc77)

49 Is Sudan the genocide between the Hutus and the Tutsies or the genocide in Rwanda. I know that Clinton and the media punted on the Hutu / Tutsi thing. Don't know about Rwanda.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 11:38 AM (mP6Ur)

50 All the south-of-the-border landscaping crews are still using the stuff that makes as much noise as a jet airplane at takeoff. They roll up in the morning, slam the tailgate to the ground, and raise holy hell for the next hour.
Posted by: Divide by Zero at June 22, 2024 11:33 AM (RKVpM)
---
To be fair, the best time to do that stuff is in the early morning before the heat builds. I always try to knock my yard work out when it's still cool.

In my teen years, I spent the summer as an indentured servant with my grandmother. Got up same as if I was going to school to get that work done.

However, come the afternoon, it was off to the country club. Swim in the pool and when I got tired and hungry, order a burger from the grill and write my grandfather's name for payment.

I miss those days.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:40 AM (llXky)

51 44 Franc tireurs. The term started in the Franco Prussian war, and later applied to individuals shooting at Krauts in Belgium during WW1. No uniform, no rights.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 11:40 AM (V5eKu)

52 He formalized the American administrative state, and that makes him a cultural hero. Ivy league president, New Englander, transformed the US into a system controlled by agencies reaching into every segment of life.
Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (D7oie)

Selective memory I guess. For all the talk of racism today they forget that Wilson was a genuine racist. Conveniently forgotten

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2024 11:41 AM (xT8gx)

53

Garbage Behavior = Gabage People.

Forward Observers, Call Adjust and Fire For Effect...

Posted by: Just Sayin at June 22, 2024 11:41 AM (ViNgA)

54 One which showed up on my feed was from a young woman I know, which suggested (among other suggestions) that if you were upset by 10/7 but had not been more upset by unspecified horrors in Sudan (there are already a lot), you were a Racist. No explanation for how "caring" or being upset would make a difference. I really think that this young woman just hates to see kids die and has not thought through the implications of these "stories"

Other than "caring", what does she propose? I'm willing to bet she's never once considered joining our military. Perhaps she could build a pier.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 11:41 AM (xCA6C)

55 Why doesn’t he receive more opprobrium from historians?
Posted by: LinusVanPelt

Because 'they' agree with Wilson completely.

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 11:41 AM (UC3nL)

56 The last house the Ex and I had was in my home town in Ohio. Railroad right of way going through the middle of the block, not uncommon in old steel mill towns. When we first moved in, the wife was fretting about the noise. Pretty soon she got used to it and found the 3:05 heading to Republic Steel with a load of taconite was restful.
Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 11:35 AM (V5eKu)
---
I did a TDY at Ramstein AB one summer. Off-base housing at the end of the runway. No A/C so windows open at night. First C-17 flight to Dover left promptly at 0530. Took a week to get used to it.

Got home and the first morning back I woke up at 5:30 because I missed the plane noise.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:42 AM (llXky)

57 20 that by the way is a proper reaping hook, she is ready to harvest grain.
Most sickles made now are smaller, and the scythe has replaced the sickle in most places.

Posted by: Kindltot
---------------------------

Call it what you want. That girl is ready.
A proper good wife she'd make.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 11:42 AM (mP6Ur)

58 In my teen years, I spent the summer as an indentured servant with my grandmother. Got up same as if I was going to school to get that work done.

However, come the afternoon, it was off to the country club. Swim in the pool and when I got tired and hungry, order a burger from the grill and write my grandfather's name for payment.

I miss those days.

Was Lacey Underalls a member at that point?

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 11:42 AM (xCA6C)

59 "Russia overtakes US in gas supplies to Europe for first time in 2 years"

It seems like the US is just incapable of doing anything consistently wrt according to any long range plan.

This is how you squander your empire and destroy the living standards of your middle class.

Posted by: pawn at June 22, 2024 11:43 AM (QB+5g)

60 You know, the people the Spaniards ethnically cleansed and genocided?
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:27 AM (pBHM9)
---
They did a piss-poor job of it because there are lots of Aztecs still around. The empire is gone, but the people are still around.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:31 AM (llXky)

I'm pretty sure this was one of the examples VD Hanson used in his book. I haven't read it, but I listened to him doing a 2 hour podcast on it. From his perspective, civilization ending events are not about wiping out everybody, but wiping out (to varying degrees of totality) the culture and influence of the people.

So yeah, nobody's ever really been wiped out completely.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:43 AM (Ntc77)

61 "10 years ago: Is Pakistan the most dangerous place in the world as a poor country with nukes? (Did they help us with the draw-down in Afghanistan?)"

A.Q. Khan was responsible for making Pakistan a nuclear power. They did that by setting up shell companies and stealing the tech from Western countries. They then exported the knowledge to North Korea and Iran. The fact that he died peacefully at his home in Pakistan is an obscenity to me.

Posted by: Darrell Harris at June 22, 2024 11:43 AM (q4+Ef)

62 Was Lacey Underalls a member at that point?
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 11:42 AM (xCA6C)
---
I wish.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:44 AM (llXky)

63 So yeah, nobody's ever really been wiped out completely.

*kicks dirt*

Posted by: Neanderthals at June 22, 2024 11:44 AM (xCA6C)

64 >>No, I'd say damn near certain he would make Murray look foolish.

And I'd say you are wrong.

Murray has spent months living in the region since the Hamas massacre and years before that reporting on the region on the ground.

Guys like Smith think history started yesterday and they constantly ignore what the Palestinians and their backers in the muslim world have done to Israel and Jews since before there was an Israel.

The Palestinians have turned down multiple opportunities for their own state since 1948. They prefer to insist they will kill all of the Jews and take the land. You don't have to believe me, just ask them. Go to a college campus and listen to them.

From the river to the sea is not just a slogan, it is a call for genocide. The real kind.

Smith would get his ass kicked by Murray because Murray actually understands what's going on.

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:44 AM (LkLld)

65 >>>people whining about "war crimes"
----------------------

I avoid those people.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 11:45 AM (mP6Ur)

66 From the river to the sea is not just a slogan, it is a call for genocide. The real kind.

Smith would get his ass kicked by Murray because Murray actually understands what's going on.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:44 AM (LkLld)
---
See Kissinger's take that a "moderate Muslim" is one who has run out of ammunition.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:46 AM (llXky)

67 From what I saw of the Munk debates, the (Israeli?) girl on his side did just as well as Murray did.

Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 11:46 AM (1bNHn)

68 Every day I'm confronted with evidence that other Big Dick Conservatives around here dwell among a Master Race I have yet to encounter. In my neighborhood, "white people" are just as rackety as the next tribe. Troublesome, too. You all must have found something truly special after you died. Or, maybe you just don't get out much, or are mostly full of shit. Always a possibility.

Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at June 22, 2024 11:46 AM (zdLoL)

69 37 Why doesn’t he receive more opprobrium from historians?
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2024 11:30 AM (xT8gx)

He formalized the American administrative state, and that makes him a cultural hero. Ivy league president, New Englander, transformed the US into a system controlled by agencies reaching into every segment of life.
Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (D7oie)

The US military was well on its way to becoming desegregated naturally, until Wilson resegregated it. It wasn't until Truman that that trend got reversed. Wilson was a horrible human being.

Posted by: Darrell Harris at June 22, 2024 11:47 AM (q4+Ef)

70 Wilson was a Virginian, not a New Englander. An asshole wherever he was from.

Posted by: From about That Time at June 22, 2024 11:47 AM (4780s)

71 We lived near a CalTrain station in Mountain View for a while. We got used to the trains. They did actually have a schedule and mostly kept to it on weekdays. Weekends were minimal.

Here, the train tracks are miles away and the horn, when going through town has a mournful, eerie sound to it.

The other noise I actually listen to is farm machinery. I'm getting pretty good at identifying a mower from a combine, a sprayer from a disc and so on.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 22, 2024 11:48 AM (Q4IgG)

72 We're rural.

Neighbors out here pretty much keep to themselves. It's not uncommon for me to go outside and hear.... nothing.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (Q4IgG)

Same here. The most consistently noisy things I hear are farm equipment, and that is seasonal, of course. And not obtrusive, anyway.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2024 11:48 AM (Q87aE)

73 So yeah, nobody's ever really been wiped out completely.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:43 AM (Ntc77)
---
A friend of mine insisted that the ancient Egyptians are extinct, having been replaced by Arabs. He's well-read, watches The Great Courses, but had apparently never heard of the Copts, who still speak their ancient language. Millions of them, hiding in plain sight.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:48 AM (llXky)

74 He formalized the American administrative state, and that makes him a cultural hero. Ivy league president, New Englander, transformed the US into a system controlled by agencies reaching into every segment of life.
Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (D7oie)

Or, he was a Democrat, so nobody in our ivory towers are going to look too closely at his crimes.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:48 AM (1xjGZ)

75 "Why do rich people like silence so much?" is a great example of asking the wrong questions. Or asking questions at all, when simple statements answer them for you, like... "Loud, obnoxious people are poor because they're loud and obnoxious"

Just like "Why does the homeless problem keep getting worse even though we're spending more money on it" and "You have more bums because you're paying for them to relocate here, and they're not bums because they're homeless, they're homeless because they're bums".

Posted by: somedood at June 22, 2024 11:49 AM (Ti5sz)

76 23 Leftists always choose what is best for them, period. They do not consider anything to do to be hypocritical because the standard rules do not apply to them. They are Yard Sign Calvinists, and by these signs they are saved.

It's partly a callback to the Pelagian heresy, which holds that salvation is possible without God and denies Original Sin. That describes these people perfectly. They are just better than you, and entitled to do whatever they want.

You, on the other hand, are condemned. You cannot be redeemed.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (llXky)
_______
Mixed metaphors abounding. You cannot be a Calvinist Pelagian.

Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 11:49 AM (1bNHn)

77 >>> Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at June 22, 2024 11:46 AM (zdLoL)

If everyone around you is an asshole...

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 11:49 AM (llON8)

78 "23 Leftists always choose what is best for them, period. They do not consider anything to do to be hypocritical because the standard rules do not apply to them. They are Yard Sign Calvinists, and by these signs they are saved.

It's partly a callback to the Pelagian heresy, which holds that salvation is possible without God and denies Original Sin. That describes these people perfectly. They are just better than you, and entitled to do whatever they want.

You, on the other hand, are condemned. You cannot be redeemed.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (llXky)"

This. The only tenet of progressivism is that what is right is defined as what they want right now, because they believe they have achieved permanent moral authority.

Posted by: somedood at June 22, 2024 11:49 AM (Ti5sz)

79 Same here. The most consistently noisy things I hear are farm equipment, and that is seasonal, of course. And not obtrusive, anyway.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2024 11:48 AM (Q87aE)
---
Our neighborhood is very quiet, so much so that when emergency vehicles turn into it, they kill the sirens so as not to disturb people.

About a month ago, some nut wrecked a car by hitting a tree. People wandered outside, gawked and dispersed after only a few minutes. It was past everyone's bed time.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:50 AM (llXky)

80 Got distracted by the Xoxilololol awfl story
People who are loud in libraries are the worst

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at June 22, 2024 11:50 AM (MXs8Q)

81 Smith would get his ass kicked by Murray because Murray actually understands what's going on.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:44 AM (LkLld)

Nonsense, Jack. You don't know what you're talking about, but I'm going to leave this alone.

People are fixed in their beliefs on these things, and we'll see what happens, if Murray has the balls to debate Dave.

Which I doubt he does.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:51 AM (1xjGZ)

82 thursday i had to walk down six floors via the stairs due to a dodgy hellevator. two days later i find i still have a bit of a presidential swagger in my step.

being 29 sucks.

Posted by: cheap fake anachronda at June 22, 2024 11:51 AM (edU/H)

83 >>> 80 Got distracted by the Xoxilololol awfl story
People who are loud in libraries are the worst
Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at June 22, 2024 11:50 AM (MXs8Q)

This. is. LIBRARY!

Posted by: Library Guy at June 22, 2024 11:51 AM (llON8)

84 being 29 sucks.

Obligatory: beats the alternative.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 11:52 AM (xCA6C)

85 A friend of mine insisted that the ancient Egyptians are extinct, having been replaced by Arabs. He's well-read, watches The Great Courses, but had apparently never heard of the Copts, who still speak their ancient language. Millions of them, hiding in plain sight.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:48 AM (llXky)

I worked alongside a doc years ago, who was an Egyptian Copt. He was generally avoided by all our muzzie docs, but he was a smart and decent man. I remember once I asked him when his church broke off from the Catholic church.

His response? We didn't break off, you did!

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:52 AM (1xjGZ)

86 71 In my home town, when railroad traffic was heavy, the engineers showed a lot of respect in the wee small hours in residential areas. They had to hit the locomotive horn at crossings, but would just give it a "beep" rather than laying on it. Most crossings were guarded anyway, so if the B&O runs over you, tough shit.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 11:52 AM (V5eKu)

87 This. The only tenet of progressivism is that what is right is defined as what they want right now, because they believe they have achieved permanent moral authority.
Posted by: somedood at June 22, 2024 11:49 AM (Ti5sz)
---
The distinction between ideology and religion is an artificial one. It is an attempt to kill off conventional morality by ruling it out of bounds. This is why pride flags - which have clear religious implications - can be put on public buildings but not religious symbols.

And then you get gimp-for-hire David French to explain why this is a good thing and part of muh conservative principles.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:53 AM (llXky)

88 >>Nonsense, Jack. You don't know what you're talking about, but I'm going to leave this alone.

Good decision.

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:53 AM (LkLld)

89 37 Why doesn’t he receive more opprobrium from historians?
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2024 11:30 AM (xT8gx)

He formalized the American administrative state, and that makes him a cultural hero. Ivy league president, New Englander, transformed the US into a system controlled by agencies reaching into every segment of life.
Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (D7oie)
______
Wilson was from Staunton, VA. Which is pronounced "Stanton", BTW.

Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 11:54 AM (1bNHn)

90 Wilson was from Staunton, VA. Which is pronounced "Stanton", BTW.

He was born in 1856, and so was old enough to remember the late unpleasantness. Apparently he took the south's loss badly.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 11:55 AM (xCA6C)

91 >>>if they had a tuba, it would probably be in tune
--------------

Ah, Mexican polkas and such. In the vehicle when talk radio becomes annoying I punch in the Mexican station. Don't know what to call it.

It's 'modern traditional', happy, with those old fashioned things; a melody, a beginning, a middle and an end.
Instrumentally with a clarinet, accordion, trumpet, and tuba, and drums plus or minus other instruments. It usually has an interesting syncopation in sections.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 11:55 AM (mP6Ur)

92
The most consistently noisy things I hear are farm equipment, and that is seasonal, of course. And not obtrusive, anyway.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2024 11:48 AM

I enjoy the farm equipment. It's fairly quiet actually. The guy sits in his cab in air conditioned comfort, waves when he goes by, and is done in a couple of hours. The 'landscapers' are pushing 100 decibels from a half mile away and the farm equipment is maybe 70 at one hundred feet. Like a fairly quiet office noise level.

Posted by: Divide by Zero at June 22, 2024 11:55 AM (RKVpM)

93 His response? We didn't break off, you did!
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:52 AM (1xjGZ)
---
Before he decided to bless teh gheys, Francis was making serious strides in healing the schism. Fiducia Supplicans has not been formally rescinded, but the author was sent to Cairo a couple of weeks ago to personally explain that Catholic doctrine is unchanged and the document doesn't say what people says it does.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:55 AM (llXky)

94 School Apologizes for Telling Children ISIS is a Terrorist Group

-
How could they defame a swell bunch like ISIS?

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks at June 22, 2024 11:55 AM (L/fGl)

95 69
Truman's reversal just lasted twenty years until Johnson's new deal reversed it. Les, actually.

Posted by: From about That Time at June 22, 2024 11:56 AM (4780s)

96 Weren't the Muslims colonizers in the Indian subcontinent?
Actually, except, maybe, for the Arabs, EVERYWHERE Muslims have ever been has been colonization. It's written into their not-so-holy book. It's a command from their god. Every Muslim spot on the planet has been made so by murderous invasion and slaughter of the non-Muslims. Even the places they were then thrown out of, Islam (and Arabism) remains as an invading culture/religion (as in Iran).

Posted by: GWB at June 22, 2024 11:56 AM (AWrpC)

97 I enjoy the farm equipment. It's fairly quiet actually. The guy sits in his cab in air conditioned comfort, waves when he goes by, and is done in a couple of hours. The 'landscapers' are pushing 100 decibels from a half mile away and the farm equipment is maybe 70 at one hundred feet. Like a fairly quiet office noise level.

You can set a watch to the time that the neighborhood lawnmowing crews start up. It's like an infestation of really annoying cicadas.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 11:56 AM (xCA6C)

98 91 A reason for liking "the Bakersfield Sound".

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 11:57 AM (V5eKu)

99 >>> 93 His response? We didn't break off, you did!
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:52 AM (1xjGZ)
---
Before he decided to bless teh gheys, FakePope Francis was making serious strides in healing the schism. Fiducia Supplicans has not been formally rescinded, but the author was sent to Cairo a couple of weeks ago to personally explain that Catholic doctrine is unchanged and the document doesn't say what people says it does.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:55 AM (llXky)

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 11:57 AM (llON8)

100 Jane Harman's husband makes good speakers.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 11:57 AM (mP6Ur)

101 I have been reading Difficulties, an exchange between Mgr Ronald Knox, and (then) agnostic Arnold Lunn.

It was amusing to see Lunn admit that he'd suppress speech in extreme cases. The two he cited were promoting "unnatural vice, or the seduction of young girls."

That was 1932. Times have changed.

Knox received Lunn into the Catholic Church two years later. He also had anticipated Orson Wells's Martian hoax by several years. 1926, IIRC.

Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 11:57 AM (1bNHn)

102 See Kissinger's take that a "moderate Muslim" is one who has run out of ammunition.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:46 AM (llXky)

Kissinger was a monster, who is as responsible for all the trouble in the world today as anybody.

May he rot in hell.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:58 AM (dVaoo)

103 Railroad goes through Gilbert Arizona's downtown.
The city pissed off the railroad some years ago.
A friend moved to Gilbert and repeats every time we meet that the trains blow for each street crossing every single time day or night.
Moral of the story: don't piss of the choo-choo engineers.

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 11:59 AM (UC3nL)

104 Weren't the Muslims colonizers in the Indian subcontinent?

There's a reason the mountains separating India from Afghanistan are named Hindu Kush (Killer of Hindus). Many Indians taken as slaves died of cold while being forced to cross the passes.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 11:59 AM (xCA6C)

105 >>> 102 See Kissinger's take that a "moderate Muslim" is one who has run out of ammunition.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:46 AM (llXky)

Kissinger was a monster, who is as responsible for all the trouble in the world today as anybody.

May he rot in hell.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:58 AM (dVaoo)

I'm not a fan of Kissinger for various reasons, but are you disagreeing with his statement? He's hardly the only one who has said something along those lines.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 11:59 AM (llON8)

106 Don't Oppress My People With Your Expectations Of Politeness And Basic Consideration

Ok...bitch.
Use that megaphone one more time and you're gonna eat it. Now get the hell out of my way.

Posted by: Diogenes at June 22, 2024 11:59 AM (W/lyH)

107 Bonk bonk on the head

Posted by: Dr. Varno at June 22, 2024 11:59 AM (Hsitb)

108 Don't Oppress My People With Your Expectations Of Politeness And Basic Consideration

This library! You quiet! You go now!

Posted by: Diogenes at June 22, 2024 12:00 PM (W/lyH)

109 "School Apologizes for Telling Children ISIS is a Terrorist Group"

Sounds like a good opportunity to anonymously forward 100 hours of ISIS execution video. Or still images of the several thousand people they crucified. There is a particular young Yazidi woman whose head they sawed off because she refused to be a sex slave that I'm sure I'll never un-see, so I don't see why the progs should be allowed to un-see it either.

Sauce for the goose and all. Anyone remember during the Kavanaugh hearings when dem staffers broke into congressional offices, accessed some workstations, stole contact info for GOP family members, and then proceeded to spam them with cartel chainsaw execution videos?

somedood remembers.

Posted by: somedood at June 22, 2024 12:01 PM (Ti5sz)

110 Don't Oppress My People With Your Expectations Of Politeness And Basic Consideration

I'd settle for not shooting each other at every Juneteenth get-together.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 12:01 PM (xCA6C)

111 People are fixed in their beliefs on these things, and we'll see what happens, if Murray has the balls to debate Dave.

Which I doubt he does.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:51 AM (1xjGZ)
---
What is there to debate? I supposed it is possible for someone to be philosemitic and think that Jews are better off spread out in communities than concentrated in one, dense, targetable mass, but in practical terms, it's irrelevant because the ultimate decider is military power, which is what it has always been.

The notion that sanctions, or "soft power" or even military aid will amount to jack diddly in an existential conflict. Look at how Russia is doing in Ukraine. How's that American might working out there?

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:01 PM (llXky)

112 The distinction between ideology and religion is an artificial one. It is an attempt to kill off conventional morality by ruling it out of bounds.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:53 AM (llXky)

The greatest propaganda victory of Progressivism (one style of Marxism) is the idea they are NOT a religion, simply because they have no supernatural god. It's how they established secularism as the official god of schools and government. It's a worship of Reason - man's own intellect - and it IS a religion. It's ultimately a religion of self. (Marx set out specifically to displace Christianity because he hated it.)

Posted by: GWB at June 22, 2024 12:01 PM (AWrpC)

113 Very very interesting. I think. I could be wrong.

cancel comment.

Posted by: Outside. In my garage. at June 22, 2024 12:02 PM (79C+z)

114 So . . . Hamas is not the only organization that thinks this way?
gain, all of Islam thinks that way, unless they have become non-fundamentalist. And even then, if you scratch them, you'll find they're not as far from the fundamentalists as they appear.

Posted by: GWB at June 22, 2024 12:03 PM (AWrpC)

115 I'm not a fan of Kissinger for various reasons, but are you disagreeing with his statement? He's hardly the only one who has said something along those lines.
Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 11:59 AM (llON

Yeah, my basic opinion is, all humans are shitty. The people who would subjugate you are those who can.

So while everyone in this country is getting all angry about what some people are doing half the world away, we're being subjugated by people who look and sound (and sometimes go to church) the same as you and me.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:04 PM (dVaoo)

116 >>> 113 Very very interesting. I think. I could be wrong.

cancel comment.
Posted by: Outside. In my garage. at June 22, 2024 12:02 PM (79C+z)

I don't get it.

Posted by: lace wigs at June 22, 2024 12:04 PM (llON8)

117 Bagpipes.

When the marachi music starts to blare, load a CD into the boombox and blast a few hours of Scottish bagpipes out in the yard.

Diversity and all that.
Posted by: Ju at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (aTmM/)

Yeah, that'll being on mass suicide.

Posted by: thatcrazyjerseyguy now with twice the crazy at June 22, 2024 12:04 PM (iODuv)

118 Powerline Week in Pictures is up. As one might expect, Chuck Schumer's adventures in grilling figure prominently.

https://tinyurl.com/2d4wpn66

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 12:04 PM (xCA6C)

119 Kissinger was a monster, who is as responsible for all the trouble in the world today as anybody.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:58 AM (dVaoo)
---
He's the designated fall guy. Never actually wielded executive power but everyone did what he said as if they had no choice.

I like Dave Barry's description of him as an avacado-shaped genius who rose to prominence despite the handicaps of having no morals or neck.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:04 PM (llXky)

120 103 Times I have RON'd in Kingman AZ I have noticed that. I mean, really laying on to the horn at every crossing, and Kingman has a bunch.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 12:06 PM (V5eKu)

121 Sudan situation is just like news in the US; nobody cares about black on black crime, don’t fit the Narrative. No media will ever say a word about it.

Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2024 12:07 PM (pgG81)

122 I'm not a fan of Kissinger for various reasons, but are you disagreeing with his statement? He's hardly the only one who has said something along those lines.
Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 11:59 AM (llON

---
He's got a lot of great quotes, like how the Palestinians never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

I found his embrace of Realpolitic refreshing and at times appropriate. His book on diplomacy is great.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:07 PM (llXky)

123 The Beirut airport is absolutely jammed, as people flee the impending Hezbollah-Israel war.

Nasrallah is going to destroy Lebanon, at the behest of his Iranian masters.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at June 22, 2024 12:08 PM (uxCna)

124 What is there to debate?
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:01 PM (llXky)

A lot, actually. But the point regarding Murray's arguments was basic and simple, which is to say Murray was basing his debate argument on the principle that anyone who disagrees with him is an anti-Semite.

Which again, the dude he was debating, probably is. But it really didn't get to any of the questions as to when and where and how Israeli policy (and American policy) is in the wrong.

Anyone who is willing to have an honest debate about that would find there are points that can be made that will stand up to theirs, quite effectively. And the dodge that people like Murray are using, which is to point to one's anti-Semitism as the response, is not a very good one.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:08 PM (dVaoo)

125 Smith would get his ass kicked by Murray because Murray actually understands what's going on.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 11:44 AM (LkLld)

Dave Smith thinks it has been the US that has been fomenting chaos in the region to maintain the Empire, Tom Luongo thinks it is the UK and the City of London roiling thing to keep the need for credit high and continue their control, there are others who say that the insistent demands for "restraint" and "humanitarian considerations" are making things far worse for Israel and the Palestinians who are being held as shields between Hamas and Israel.

However, after October 7, this was inevitable. The founding mythos of Israel is "no more pogroms" and they cannot let this one go.

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 12:08 PM (D7oie)

126 Bagpipes.

When the marachi music starts to blare, load a CD into the boombox and blast a few hours of Scottish bagpipes out in the yard.

Diversity and all that.
Posted by: Ju at June 22, 2024 11:32 AM (aTmM/)

Yeah, that'll being on mass suicide.
Posted by: thatcrazyjerseyguy now with twice the crazy at June 22, 2024 12:04 PM (iODuv)
---
When I was a teenager I took gaming very seriously. Axis and Allies, Shogun - I played to WIN.

I often hosted, and if I was starting to lose, I popped in a cassette of the Black Watch Regimental Band. Worked every time.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:09 PM (llXky)

127 It begins with an account of life at university - Brown, since you ask - and the merits of Brooklyn hip hop combos
-----------
"What is the color of shit? Broooooown!"
--authentic Ivy League taunt from the 70s

Probably wouldn't be allowed, today.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at June 22, 2024 12:10 PM (3Fz6p)

128 123 I can remember "old salts" in USMC outfits talking about liberty call in Beirut while on Med Cruise. And then, guess who fucked it up?

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 12:11 PM (V5eKu)

129 He's the designated fall guy. Never actually wielded executive power but everyone did what he said as if they had no choice.

I like Dave Barry's description of him as an avacado-shaped genius who rose to prominence despite the handicaps of having no morals or neck.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:04 PM (llXky)

Politicians are generally stupid and easily led by "smart" guys whispering in their ears.

Kissinger is basically Valerie Jarrett... except better looking.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:11 PM (dVaoo)

130 I often hosted, and if I was starting to lose, I popped in a cassette of the Black Watch Regimental Band. Worked every time.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:09 PM (llXky)
---------
Would only have encouraged me, were I your opponent.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at June 22, 2024 12:11 PM (3Fz6p)

131
Tejano music is something peculiarly Texas, a combination of Mexican mariachi and the polka.

When you eat at a German-Mexican restaurant, you want to invade Poland, tomorrow.

Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at June 22, 2024 12:12 PM (MoZTd)

132 Anyone who is willing to have an honest debate about that would find there are points that can be made that will stand up to theirs, quite effectively. And the dodge that people like Murray are using, which is to point to one's anti-Semitism as the response, is not a very good one.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:08 PM (dVaoo)
---
If you made a Venn diagram of anti-Zionists and Jew-haters, they would almost perfectly overlap. That's not opinion, but objective fact.

I also think that the shitshow in Ukraine (and Afghanistan, and Iraq) shows how feeble US influence is. Americans like to think that international relations began in 1945 and are remarkably ignorant of foreign culture.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:13 PM (llXky)

133 >>>The US military was well on its way to becoming desegregated naturally, until Wilson resegregated it. It wasn't until Truman that that trend got reversed. Wilson was a horrible human being.
Posted by: Darrell Harris
=---------

Black Jack Pershing wore his moniker with dignity.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:13 PM (mP6Ur)

134 It begins with an account of life at university - Brown, since you ask - and the merits of Brooklyn hip hop combos

A classic example of someone who looks entirely white checking the "opressed" box on forms all her life.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at June 22, 2024 12:14 PM (uxCna)

135 126 As a rap music counter weapon I have used the Introduction of the Guests from Tannhauser.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at June 22, 2024 12:14 PM (V5eKu)

136 >>> 129 He's the designated fall guy. Never actually wielded executive power but everyone did what he said as if they had no choice.

I like Dave Barry's description of him as an avacado-shaped genius who rose to prominence despite the handicaps of having no morals or neck.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:04 PM (llXky)

Politicians are generally stupid and easily led by "smart" guys whispering in their ears.

Kissinger is basically Valerie Jarrett... except better looking.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:11 PM (dVaoo)

Is this about us?

Posted by: EXPERTS! at June 22, 2024 12:15 PM (llON8)

137 However, after October 7, this was inevitable. The founding mythos of Israel is "no more pogroms" and they cannot let this one go.
Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 12:08 PM (D7oie)

I think that's part of the problem (heh) with these arguments. People who are pro-Israel want to make this all about Oct. 7, and there are obviously things that led up to Oct. 7 that are at least relevant to talk about.

But if you want to talk about them, people like Murray will call you an anti-Semite.

Fine. Which is why I revert back to my basic position: The U.S. should remove itself from ALL foreign conflicts, and spend some amount of time reconsidering who we are, and what we want to be.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:16 PM (dVaoo)

138 Kissinger is basically Valerie Jarrett... except better looking.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:11 PM (dVaoo)
---
He was far more competent. Another bon mot from Dr. K: It is often dangerous to be America's foe but usually fatal to be her ally.

As I said, he gets all the blame for what other people did, and he clearly didn't mind it. I think he had a keen eye for what was possible, and it was interesting that just before he died, he was talking about the huge mistake we are making with Russia.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:16 PM (llXky)

139 This exactly sums up Obama "escorting" Biden off stage.

https://tinyurl.com/yumzytx3

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 12:16 PM (xCA6C)

140 Smith has publicly offered to debate Murray. I would imagine if Murray were to accept, the event would go quite differently.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:23 AM (pBHM9)

I hope y'all aren't trying to say Hamas should come in and relieve us of JJ and CBD.

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:17 PM (FD5dr)

141 The US military was well on its way to becoming desegregated naturally, until Wilson resegregated it. It wasn't until Truman that that trend got reversed. Wilson was a horrible human being.
Posted by: Darrell Harris
=---------

Black Jack Pershing wore his moniker with dignity.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:13 PM (mP6Ur)
--------------
And Barry Goldwater desegregated the AZ NG before Truman got around to the Army.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at June 22, 2024 12:17 PM (3Fz6p)

142 Getting quite hot and little air moving, even birds seem quiting down

Posted by: Skip at June 22, 2024 12:17 PM (fwDg9)

143 A classic example of someone who looks entirely white checking the "opressed" box on forms all her life.

Australian columnist Tim Blair got sued years ago for mocking several "aboriginal" academics and political activists who obviously had overwhelmingly white ancestry.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at June 22, 2024 12:18 PM (uxCna)

144 Getting quite hot and little air moving, even birds seem quiting down

The leaves are all hanging down like laundry that didn't get all the way dry.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 12:18 PM (xCA6C)

145 Quiet isn't racism.

Stop seeking constant stimulation.

Go sit somewhere peaceful, shut the fuck up for once, and try to cultivate an inner life. Do this as much as you can. You may even learn to disconnect from the endless cacophony of modern life and grow a personality of your own after awhile.

It know this sounds crazy, but if your willing to take a walk on the mild side, you may like it.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2024 12:19 PM (0FoWg)

146 If you made a Venn diagram of anti-Zionists and Jew-haters, they would almost perfectly overlap. That's not opinion, but objective fact.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:13 PM (llXky)

Dave Smith is Jewish. So are several of the Israeli critics who have been effectively silenced.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:19 PM (dVaoo)

147 A classic example of someone who looks entirely white checking the "opressed" box on forms all her life.

Australian columnist Tim Blair got sued years ago for mocking several "aboriginal" academics and political activists who obviously had overwhelmingly white ancestry.

I have no idea what you mean.

Posted by: Lieawatha at June 22, 2024 12:19 PM (xCA6C)

148 I asked him when his church broke off from the Catholic church.

His response? We didn't break off, you did!
Posted by: BurtTC
----------

There we go, another rabbit hole.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:19 PM (mP6Ur)

149 Back in the day, it was de rigeur to invite the neighbors to the shindig, a least a week in advance. That way they had time to make other arrangements.

Oh yeah. And turn down the volume at 10pm.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:20 PM (VuZH8)

150 I think that's part of the problem (heh) with these arguments. People who are pro-Israel want to make this all about Oct. 7, and there are obviously things that led up to Oct. 7 that are at least relevant to talk about.

But if you want to talk about them, people like Murray will call you an anti-Semite.

Fine. Which is why I revert back to my basic position: The U.S. should remove itself from ALL foreign conflicts, and spend some amount of time reconsidering who we are, and what we want to be.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:16 PM (dVaoo)
---
I agree that we need to disengage globally. Build up the Navy and Air Force, reduced the army to a rapid-reaction corps-strength force backed by a million reservists.

As for Israel, the biggest problem is that Israel has never prosecuted a war to completion and once again we're trying to stop it. Let Israel fight a total war just once and then dictate a peace settlement. It's long over due.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:20 PM (llXky)

151 "destructively launching" its war
How do you launch a war non-destructively?
I know this person is a progressive not merely by their UN affiliation, but by stupidity like this. "Sure, let's have a war to decide things, but not a destructive one. We'll just sort of play at it for a bit, until a bunch of politicians decide who should win, but we won't kill too many people or destroy any infrastructure."

These people are some of the most destructive on the planet.

Posted by: GWB at June 22, 2024 12:21 PM (AWrpC)

152 Stop seeking constant stimulation.

Go sit somewhere peaceful, shut the fuck up for once, and try to cultivate an inner life. Do this as much as you can. You may even learn to disconnect from the endless cacophony of modern life and grow a personality of your own after awhile.

Many of today's people are simple bundles of appetites in constant need of gratification. An inner life plays no role.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 12:21 PM (xCA6C)

153 Kissinger is basically Valerie Jarrett... except better looking.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:11 PM (dVaoo)
---
He was far more competent.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:16 PM (llXky)

Maybe, but I'd hardly consider that a good thing.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:21 PM (dVaoo)

154 I have no idea what you mean.

There are several "Obamas" among the race hustlers in Portland - people who are half white who grew up in affluent white neighborhoods.

Oppression!

Posted by: The ARC of History! at June 22, 2024 12:21 PM (uxCna)

155 I must disagree. Pope Saint Pius X explained it very clearly back in the day. Look it up.

I can be anti-zionist AND not anti-semitic.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:22 PM (VuZH8)

156 Dave Smith is Jewish. So are several of the Israeli critics who have been effectively silenced.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:19 PM (dVaoo)
---
This in no way refutes what I wrote and I do not think that there is any shortage of anti-Zionist opinions.

The problem for these guys is that they have no actual constituency. They're politically irrelevant. What is their solution? Partition? Abolish Israel?

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:23 PM (llXky)

157 Inner life? Didn't Plato or Aristotle write that an unexamined life is not worth living? I am sure I messed that up.

But, apparently, there are some folks that do not have any inner life.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:24 PM (VuZH8)

158 I can be anti-zionist AND not anti-semitic.

Perhaps true in theory, but almost never found in practice.

Remember, being "anti-Zionist" these days means that you support the destruction of the State of Israel, and the mass murder or exile of the seven million Jews residing there.

Kind of hard to support that without being a Jew hater.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at June 22, 2024 12:25 PM (uxCna)

159 How do you launch a war non-destructively?
I know this person is a progressive not merely by their UN affiliation, but by stupidity like this. "Sure, let's have a war to decide things, but not a destructive one. We'll just sort of play at it for a bit, until a bunch of politicians decide who should win, but we won't kill too many people or destroy any infrastructure."

These people are some of the most destructive on the planet.
Posted by: GWB at June 22, 2024 12:21 PM (AWrpC)
---
They see conflict as something to be managed, not something that renders a decision. Victory is messy, so better just keep things simmering rather than risk actual map-changing outcomes.

Better still is to get foreigners to kill each other for our fun and profit. You just know these clowns want to put US boots in Ukraine but at this point we won't have anyone to send.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:26 PM (llXky)

160 No, I do not support the destruction of Israel. But Pope Saint Pius X did not support its creation.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:27 PM (VuZH8)

161 The greatest worry for the US is that the long threatened war between Israel and Hezballah, the US moves carrier into the eastern Med for support, and Hezballah manages to sink it. They have Chinese made ballistic anti ship missiles that might do it.

Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2024 12:27 PM (pgG81)

162 Times I have RON'd in Kingman AZ I have noticed that. I mean, really laying on to the horn at every crossing, and Kingman has a bunch.
Posted by: bill in arkansas

Kingman didn't piss the engineers off: the engineers know that everyone that lives near Kingman is old and deaf.

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 12:27 PM (UC3nL)

163 >>> 160 No, I do not support the destruction of Israel. But Pope Saint Pius X did not support its creation.
Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:27 PM (VuZH

That's nice.

It exists *now*, so what is *your* opinion, not your argument-from-authority?

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 12:28 PM (llON8)

164 >>>A friend moved to Gilbert and repeats every time we meet that the trains blow for each street crossing every single time day or night.
Moral of the story: don't piss of the choo-choo engineers.
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron
-------------------

The engineers, by and large, don't mind plowing through your vehicle parked on the tracks. However, by law, they must blow the horn at street crossings.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:28 PM (mP6Ur)

165 The problem for these guys is that they have no actual constituency. They're politically irrelevant. What is their solution? Partition? Abolish Israel?
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:23 PM (llXky)

From what I've seen, these people generally point toward partition. They use the fruity 2-state solution euphemism, because partition reminds them of colonialism, and we can't have that.

It's the lefty version of the nation-building thing in the neocon bullshit-o-sphere. Outdated platitudes that were fully discredited at least 20 years ago, but provide fey Western intellectuals with a talking point they'll never let go.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2024 12:28 PM (0FoWg)

166 Maybe, but I'd hardly consider that a good thing.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:21 PM (dVaoo)
---
Credit where it is due: he found a path to get us out of Vietnam with some shred of honor (which the Dems then threw away).

Opening China was a masterstroke that was subsequently pissed away by the Clintons, who were blinded by greed (and aided by the corporatists who run the GOP).

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:28 PM (llXky)

167 The long arm of the blog has found JT. When I have further information I will pass it along. Patience please.

Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2024 12:29 PM (8i5Iz)

168 No, I do not support the destruction of Israel. But Pope Saint Pius X did not support its creation.

So what?

Israel won its independence by fighting a bloody war against the entire Arab world, losing 1% of its population in the process.

This was not something handed to Israel by some foreign actor.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at June 22, 2024 12:29 PM (uxCna)

169 >>> 167 The long arm of the blog has found JT. When I have further information I will pass it along. Patience please.
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2024 12:29 PM (8i5Iz)

Yay! Hope JT and the birdbath are ok.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 12:29 PM (llON8)

170 Dave Smith is a Kapo. He deserves the same treatment Kapo’s got in 1945.

Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2024 12:30 PM (pgG81)

171 Indeed. Aircraft Carriers may go the way of the Battleships.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:30 PM (VuZH8)

172 Yay! Hope JT and the birdbath are ok.
Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 12:29 PM (llON

Likewise!

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2024 12:30 PM (Q87aE)

173 >>Dave Smith thinks it has been the US that has been fomenting chaos in the region to maintain the Empire, Tom Luongo thinks it is the UK and the City of London roiling thing to keep the need for credit high and continue their control,

You mean the two countries who had their intelligence community frame Trump as a Russian asset and then impeach him when he tried to look into what was really going on in Ukraine?

No way.

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 12:31 PM (LkLld)

174 No, I do not support the destruction of Israel. But Pope Saint Pius X did not support its creation.
Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:27 PM (VuZH

---
It's kind of a moot point, though, so why bring it up?

I will say that I'm more sympathetic to St. Pius X's views than I used to be. I think US policy on Israel should be based on national interest, not weird dispensationalist theology, which increasingly seems to be the case.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:31 PM (llXky)

175 167 The long arm of the blog has found JT. When I have further information I will pass it along. Patience please.
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2024 12:29 PM (8i5Iz)

Great news!!!

Birdbaths everywhere await any news in eager anticipation...

Posted by: Quarter Twenty at June 22, 2024 12:32 PM (dg+HA)

176 The problem for these guys is that they have no actual constituency. They're politically irrelevant. What is their solution? Partition? Abolish Israel?
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:23 PM (llXky)

You'll have to listen to them to get the answers.

And there are many people who have been both right and "politically irrelevant" throughout the years.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:32 PM (feq9a)

177 112 The distinction between ideology and religion is an artificial one. It is an attempt to kill off conventional morality by ruling it out of bounds.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 11:53 AM (llXky)
-------------------

Well said.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:32 PM (mP6Ur)

178 Dave Smith is a Kapo. He deserves the same treatment Kapo’s got in 1945.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2024 12:30 PM (pgG81)

I knew a person by that name at university. Also Jewish, and also a lefty. He would be close to 80 years old now, if he is still among the living.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2024 12:32 PM (Q87aE)

179 >>> 174
==
I will say that I'm more sympathetic to St. Pius X's views than I used to be. I think US policy on Israel should be based on national interest, not weird dispensationalist theology, which increasingly seems to be the case.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:31 PM (llXky)

Crazy talk! Next you'll be telling us our policy towards *any* country should be based on national interest!!!

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 12:33 PM (llON8)

180 If you made a Venn diagram of anti-Zionists and Jew-haters, they would almost perfectly overlap. That's not opinion, but objective fact.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:13 PM (llXky)

Smith is Jewish. Please don't decide to go all in on this statement and go down the road of talking about "self hating jews" since that is a) incredibly lame b) incredibly useless and c) not really an objective fact by definition.

Unfortunately when I see "this is an objective fact" used as a defense in an argument I start looking for all the other possible attempts at proof through assertion. It is my suspicious mind and low cunning.

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 12:33 PM (D7oie)

181 So what?

I cannot recall finding a place in the Books of Daniel, Ezekiel, or Revelation whereby the United States of America comes to Israel's defense.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:33 PM (VuZH8)

182 The greatest worry for the US is that the long threatened war between Israel and Hezballah, the US moves carrier into the eastern Med for support, and Hezballah manages to sink it. They have Chinese made ballistic anti ship missiles that might do it.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2024 12:27 PM (pgG81)

There are many people who seem to know what they're talking about, who believe the U.S. hegemony is about the be exposed as a paper tiger.

Are they right? Hell if I know, but we have politicians who seem to be hellbent on finding out.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:34 PM (feq9a)

183 You'll have to listen to them to get the answers.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:32 PM (feq9a)
---
Can't you articulate his position? Surely you know how he feels or you wouldn't be so passionate about giving him a larger platform.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:34 PM (llXky)

184 Oh yeah. And turn down the volume at 10pm.
Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:20 PM (VuZH

And don't stand in the front lawn drunkenly playing your instruments at 11 PM as loud as possible because chingate buey

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 12:35 PM (D7oie)

185 But if you want to talk about them, people like Murray will call you an anti-Semite.

Fine. Which is why I revert back to my basic position: The U.S. should remove itself from ALL foreign conflicts, and spend some amount of time reconsidering who we are, and what we want to be.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:16 PM (dVaoo)

I would say the US should be a nation that supports Israel. Israel is not just another nation…. It’s not Iceland or Sweden or Sudan…. It was a nation thousands of years ago and was re-instituted in 1948 after the unique horror of the Nazi holocaust. I do not want to treat them like just another country. And even if I did, they are the only decent and modern country in that corner of the world. For that reason alone we should support them… and 10/7 was uniquely barbaric and savage and uncivilized. Oh and BTW…. My Bible (the OT) came out of that ancient nation…. To a lot of us that means something

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2024 12:35 PM (SlNuN)

186 >>I cannot recall finding a place in the Books of Daniel, Ezekiel, or Revelation whereby the United States of America comes to Israel's defense.

Where's the chapter on the United States of America coming to the defense of Europe?

Twice.

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 12:35 PM (LkLld)

187 >>> 181 So what?

I cannot recall finding a place in the Books of Daniel, Ezekiel, or Revelation whereby the United States of America comes to Israel's defense.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:33 PM (VuZH

1) I am hardly a theologian, but a lot of people say they can't find *any* reference to the US in *any* book of the Bible.
2) You're being *awfully* coy about making a clear statement about what *you* think.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 12:36 PM (llON8)

188 The engineers, by and large, don't mind plowing through your vehicle parked on the tracks. However, by law, they must blow the horn at street crossings.
Posted by: Braenyard

I agree completely they need to comply with the law.
They can toot or they can lay on the horn.
In Gilbert they lay it on, in Mesa, Tempe, and Phoenix you hear a toot.

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 12:37 PM (UC3nL)

189 Smith is Jewish. Please don't decide to go all in on this statement and go down the road of talking about "self hating jews" since that is a) incredibly lame b) incredibly useless and c) not really an objective fact by definition.

Unfortunately when I see "this is an objective fact" used as a defense in an argument I start looking for all the other possible attempts at proof through assertion. It is my suspicious mind and low cunning.
Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 12:33 PM (D7oie)
---
It made a statement that is provably, objectively true. Take all the philo-semites in the world. All of them. Now split off the anti-Zionists.

Compare that total with anti-semitic anti-Zionists. They are grossly outnumbered.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:37 PM (llXky)

190 The long arm of the blog has found JT. When I have further information I will pass it along. Patience please.
Posted by: Ben Had

Hope all is okay with him and the birdbath is filled and in use.

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 12:37 PM (UC3nL)

191 Dave Smith is a Kapo. He deserves the same treatment Kapo’s got in 1945.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2024 12:30 PM (pgG81)

I knew a person by that name at university. Also Jewish, and also a lefty. He would be close to 80 years old now, if he is still among the living.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2024 12:32 PM (Q87aE)

I don't know what any of that means, but Smith would have been the Libertarian candidate for President, if he'd chosen to run.

He's not a lefty. And if anyone is accusing him of being a "self-hating" Jew, I'd dare you to say it to his face.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:39 PM (feq9a)

192
However, after October 7, this was inevitable. The founding mythos of Israel is "no more pogroms" and they cannot let this one go.
Posted by: Kindltot
---------------------------

This is their opportunity to kill it and they should.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:39 PM (mP6Ur)

193 In Gilbert they lay it on, in Mesa, Tempe, and Phoenix you hear a toot.
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 12:37 PM (UC3nL)

And Apache Junction has no trains at all!

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2024 12:39 PM (Q87aE)

194 No way.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 12:31 PM (LkLld)

You might like Luongo's Gold Goats 'n' Guns podcast. He is personally a very likeable neolaruchite, and has a very based way of looking at the world.

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 12:39 PM (D7oie)

195 You just know these clowns want to put US boots in Ukraine but at this point we won't have anyone to send.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd

Fresh troops are pouring in over every border these days. And thanks to the GOPe, everyone that fights gets citizenship.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at June 22, 2024 12:40 PM (IG4Id)

196 I think US policy on Israel should be based on national interest, not weird dispensationalist theology, which increasingly seems to be the case.

Christians should at least listen to Genesis 12:3 even if they're not into Revelation. But beyond that there are a lot of practical reasons to think Israel is pretty cool. The dirty secret of Silicon Valley is that most of their actually interesting tech post-2000 came from Israel (as opposed to the shitty censorship algorithms, which are home-grown). And Mannix could do months of just IDF bikini babes with AKs.

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:41 PM (FD5dr)

197 There are many people who seem to know what they're talking about, who believe the U.S. hegemony is about the be exposed as a paper tiger.

Are they right? Hell if I know, but we have politicians who seem to be hellbent on finding out.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:34 PM (feq9a)
---
The weapon platforms are one debate, but the real problems are with readiness, training, leadership and morale.

In the span of a few years, our Army lost 10% of its strength, and there is no sign of recruiting improving. Our Navy is undermanned as well, its ships covered in rust.

Our National Security Strategy places Climate Change as the greatest risk facing the country.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:41 PM (llXky)

198 >>You might like Luongo's Gold Goats 'n' Guns podcast. He is personally a very likeable neolaruchite, and has a very based way of looking at the world.

I'll give him a listen. Thanks.

BTW, Nigel Farage is 100% correct on the idiotic war of western choice in Ukraine. That's why he is being attacked by the elites and surging with ordinary people.

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 12:41 PM (LkLld)

199 I often hosted, and if I was starting to lose, I popped in a cassette of the Black Watch Regimental Band. Worked every time.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd
--------------------------

The music is still here but, regretfully, those Scots are gone.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:42 PM (mP6Ur)

200 Crazy talk! Next you'll be telling us our policy towards *any* country should be based on national interest!!!
Posted by: Helena Handbasket

After that you'll be telling us that the U.S. shouldn't be passing out US citizen's funds to every country in the world like the money comes from Modern Monetary Theory.

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 12:42 PM (UC3nL)

201 Here is Farage in 2014. Right then, right now.

https://tinyurl.com/2tx52762

Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2024 12:43 PM (LkLld)

202 196
...
And Mannix could do months of just IDF bikini babes with AKs.
Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:41 PM (FD5dr)
________
About 2 weeks ago I actually saw a picture of a plain Israeli girl. Until then, I'd have sworn every one was hot.

Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 12:43 PM (1bNHn)

203

I cornholed Jill St. John.

She SCREAMED when she came, over and over.

Lick me where I shit, bitches...

Posted by: Zombie Henry Kissenger at June 22, 2024 12:43 PM (ViNgA)

204 Kissinger is basically Valerie Jarrett... except better looking.
Posted by: BurtTC
----------------------------

You need a drink. Or something stronger.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:43 PM (mP6Ur)

205 Our National Security Strategy places Climate Change as the greatest risk facing the country.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:41 PM (llXky)

If they really believed that, they would do a better job of securing the southern border, since clearly all those invaders are being drive North by the Klimate Katastrophe in Centroamerica.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2024 12:44 PM (Q87aE)

206
And Apache Junction has no trains at all!
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon

There is a method to our madness after all!

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 12:44 PM (UC3nL)

207 Nobody in the region wants partition. The Palestinians famously never did. The other Arabs never did either, but for a different set of reasons. The Jews were willing to entertain the notion for a long, long time, because the Americans desperately wanted it. It wasn't a desultory effort, either. Two generations of Israeli and American statesman gave it their Yankee damnedest, so to speak.

But it didn't work. That's in the past.

And after 10/7/23, it's off the table for the foreseeable future.

Talking about this is fruitless, and the Arabs and Jews both know it. But that will never stop fey Western intellectuals from yammering.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2024 12:44 PM (0FoWg)

208 Wow, getting late! Hopefully see some of you on the book thread tomorrow.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:45 PM (llXky)

209
Say, that musical ensemble of orcs is not bad

... for orcs!

Posted by: Xokrebs v Xocarnot: My Authenticity is Off the Charts (TM)! at June 22, 2024 12:45 PM (xG4kz)

210
and 10/7 was uniquely barbaric and savage and uncivilized

It was horrible yes. But if one were to separate out Jews from the equation and read the Wiki on 'Christianity in the Middle East' they would discover this type of barbarism goes back centuries against anyone not willing to become a muslin (sic).

It will continue. I support all effort by Israel to find a permanent solution, but I doubt that there is one short of elimination of every adherent of that ideology. It will be a never ending war with very short pockets of peace.

Posted by: Divide by Zero at June 22, 2024 12:46 PM (RKVpM)

211 Can't you articulate his position? Surely you know how he feels or you wouldn't be so passionate about giving him a larger platform.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:34 PM (llXky)

Ok, in summary, he believes the 1967 borders are not written in stone, that a reckoning is possible, if the state of Israel will acknowledge some of its gains, going all the way back to 1948, were a violation of the rights of the people who lived there at the time.

So... I think he'd be fine with a "two state solution" that had the borders written to pre-1967 lines, in exchange for an end to the argument that Israel is not a legitimate state, in and of itself.

There's more to it than that, but it's a fairly basic human rights, libertarian point of view, that people should be allowed to live in freedom, to the extent possible, and that Israel's great crime here is subjugating a people for decades.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:46 PM (k9bXa)

212 The question about carriers is whether something can take their place in attacking at a distance, wherever we want.

There is a silly belief that battleships were given up because they were vulnerable. E.g., D O'Connell's Sacred Vessels argues that. It got a good reception from those who don't know anything about the subject, but was slammed by those who do.

What happened is that carriers hit harder and farther.

Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 12:47 PM (1bNHn)

213 How do you know when quiet neighborhoods are not a sign of white supremacy?

Gee I don't know. Ill have to pray to Jesus the Prince of Peace on this one...

Fruits of the Spirit anyone?

Posted by: Im Gumby Damn It!/George Carlins Pencil at June 22, 2024 12:47 PM (o3Uyl)

214 We had a little Mexican joint in the ‘hood years ago with that Xochitl name. We pronounced the way it sounds when you’re hocking up a loogie

Posted by: DanMan at June 22, 2024 11:37 AM

Nemo, you color of orange and white. You have been called forth to the summit of Mount Wannahockaloogie, to join with us in the eternal bonds of tankhood.

From this point on, you will now be known as Shark Bait!

Shark Bait, ooh ha ha!

https://bit.ly/3KXapJW

Posted by: Clyde Shelton at June 22, 2024 12:47 PM (P5BPp)

215 Talking about this is fruitless, and the Arabs and Jews both know it. But that will never stop fey Western intellectuals from yammering.

One of the conservative ex-State Department types on Xwitter had a good post a few weeks back. He said people at the State Department would rather be in charge of something they know is stupid than allow someone else to do the right thing.

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:48 PM (FD5dr)

216 The trouble with any two state solution is the Musselmen just won't keep it.

Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 12:49 PM (1bNHn)

217 I don't understand why city folk don't understand this.
Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 11:25 AM (pBHM9)

Because they are Metropolitan, not cosmopolitan, and lack imagination. It takes an amount of sophistication often lacking in people to even comprehend that their personal lived experience is vastly different from most other people's. Nowhere is this more applicable than in those who are quick to reference "my Truth" as a basis for argument.

Posted by: tankdemon at June 22, 2024 12:49 PM (VSht7)

218 After that you'll be telling us that the U.S. shouldn't be passing out US citizen's funds to every country in the world like the money comes from Modern Monetary Theory.
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at June 22, 2024 12:42 PM (UC3nL)

Money... AAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Posted by: The Keynsians! at June 22, 2024 12:50 PM (k9bXa)

219 Yes it’s about white people and not rich people because there are a lot of instances of rich entertainers being the bane of their multi million dollar home neighborhoods.

Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2024 12:50 PM (SHMXB)

220 Kissinger is basically Valerie Jarrett... except better looking.
Posted by: BurtTC
----------------------------

You need a drink. Or something stronger.
Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 12:43 PM (mP6Ur)

You think she's better looking???

Ewww! Gay.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:51 PM (k9bXa)

221 So... I think he'd be fine with a "two state solution" that had the borders written to pre-1967 lines, in exchange for an end to the argument that Israel is not a legitimate state, in and of itself.

There's more to it than that, but it's a fairly basic human rights, libertarian point of view, that people should be allowed to live in freedom, to the extent possible, and that Israel's great crime here is subjugating a people for decades.

So, the official policy view of Barack Obama and Valerie Jarrett.

The problem with that is that the Muslims can't accept a two state solution. The Quran is quite clear on that point. And "subjugating" is highly relative. Arabs who didn't flee in 1948 became full citizens, with more rights than any Arab government grants.

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:51 PM (FD5dr)

222 It made a statement that is provably, objectively true. Take all the philo-semites in the world. All of them. Now split off the anti-Zionists.

Compare that total with anti-semitic anti-Zionists. They are grossly outnumbered.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at June 22, 2024 12:37 PM (llXky)

I notice you are starting to split hairs and demand again that you are right by your own definition.

look, don't try to win the internet. You wrote a book, It was nice. thank you for your condensation of information from multiple sources on the Spanish civil war. I disagree with you on a number of points because I view economics as an essential element in general, and the legacy of being a world spanning empire that was unable to transition into a modern state specifically, then again I had to learn a lot of Spanish history and it was from the Spanish and South American perspective.

anyways, if you want to be righteous about something you depend on emotion to carry your point. If you want to carry your argument of facts, argue the facts. If you want to push your emotional appeal by facts, some people (me I suppose) say, Nah bro, I want to see your sources

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 12:52 PM (D7oie)

223
No doubt there are entire floors full of "experts" at State whose rice bowls are filled again and again because they are wedded to the idea of a two state solution. They need to be sent packing, carrying their rice bowls and their balls, much as in "The Last Emperor", all the court functionaries were expelled from the Imperial Palace.

There is a two state solution already in place:

Israel - on / 1 and "Palestine" - off / 0

Time to move on ...

Posted by: Xokrebs v Xocarnot: My Authenticity is Off the Charts (TM)! at June 22, 2024 12:52 PM (xG4kz)

224 216 The trouble with any two state solution is the Musselmen just won't keep it.
Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 12:49 PM (1bNHn)

Also the fact that the "Palestinians" have shown themselves to be incapable of running a state.

Posted by: tankdemon at June 22, 2024 12:52 PM (VSht7)

225 Okay. Thanks for the info. By the modern definition, I am not anti-zionist.

Maybe not a zionist either.

I am a serious pessimist. I just see everything (Western Christendom) going to shit everywhere.

Sorry if I rubbed someone's rhubarb too harshly.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:54 PM (VuZH8)

226 It's a psyop. The culture-destroyers are attempting to mis-calibrate our moral compasses. It's okay to kill babies, it's okay to harm people, even children, with our deviancies, it's okay to threaten Jewish classmates, it's okay to loot and burn down people's businesses.

But don't you dare use a term or a gesture that was fine last week, don't you dare display any resistance to bullying, don't you dare ask questions that used to be polite conversation-starters, don't you dare engage in righteous behavior that might make others question their moral standing, don't you dare allow any information out that might show that some decisions could come with regrets. A "good person" doesn't do things like that.

Posted by: Emmie at June 22, 2024 12:54 PM (Sf2cq)

227 The problem with making an “independent state” of Palestine now is that it instantly becomes a forward operating base for the IRGC with thousands of missiles and tens of thousands of combat troops. The war, when it began, would then have to go nuclear immediately and would probably grow to encompass the entire Middle East.
And with all that going on, Russia may decide its time to get rid of the eastern NATO bases and China may decide it’s time to get rid of Taiwan.

Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2024 12:54 PM (pgG81)

228 Because they are Metropolitan, not cosmopolitan, and lack imagination. It takes an amount of sophistication often lacking in people to even comprehend that their personal lived experience is vastly different from most other people's. Nowhere is this more applicable than in those who are quick to reference "my Truth" as a basis for argument.
Posted by: tankdemon at June 22, 2024 12:49 PM (VSht7)

I kinda see myself as the frog in the frying pan who managed to jump out before being boiled alive.

Every time I'm tempted to move back to a large city, something remembers me why I left in the first place.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:55 PM (k9bXa)

229 181 So what?

I cannot recall finding a place in the Books of Daniel, Ezekiel, or Revelation whereby the United States of America comes to Israel's defense.

Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:33 PM (VuZH

When you find Mog let me know where that is .

Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2024 12:56 PM (SHMXB)

230 So, the official policy view of Barack Obama and Valerie Jarrett.

The problem with that is that the Muslims can't accept a two state solution. The Quran is quite clear on that point. And "subjugating" is highly relative. Arabs who didn't flee in 1948 became full citizens, with more rights than any Arab government grants.
Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:51 PM (FD5dr)

And this is where I bow out of the argument. I am neither Israeli nor Muslim.

I'm gonna leave it to them to figure out.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 12:57 PM (k9bXa)

231 Because they are Metropolitan, not cosmopolitan, and lack imagination.

Yup. It's not a new observation that all the world's alleged cosmopolitans jet around between largely identical cities in the US, Europe, and Asia. As long as all the cities are largely like the one they live in they're fine.

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:57 PM (FD5dr)

232 There is a silly belief that battleships were given up because they were vulnerable. E.g., D O'Connell's Sacred Vessels argues that. It got a good reception from those who don't know anything about the subject, but was slammed by those who do.

What happened is that carriers hit harder and farther.

I don't see a distinction. If carriers hit harder and farther, battleships are vulnerable by definition.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 12:57 PM (xCA6C)

233
When you find Mog let me know where that is .
Posted by: polynikes
---------

No one knows where Uz was.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at June 22, 2024 12:58 PM (XeU6L)

234 I cannot recall finding a place in the Books of Daniel, Ezekiel, or Revelation whereby the United States of America comes to Israel's defense.

The usual interpretation is that the US is destroyed or decayed into uselessness before anything interesting happens with Israel. I can't disagree with that theory anymore.

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:58 PM (FD5dr)

235 No one knows where Uz was.

About 8 letters from Ur.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 12:59 PM (xCA6C)

236 >>> 234 I cannot recall finding a place in the Books of Daniel, Ezekiel, or Revelation whereby the United States of America comes to Israel's defense.
==
The usual interpretation is that the US is destroyed or decayed into uselessness before anything interesting happens with Israel. I can't disagree with that theory anymore.
Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:58 PM (FD5dr)

Our "elites" are sure trying to make that happen.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at June 22, 2024 12:59 PM (llON8)

237 Maybe not a zionist either.

I am a serious pessimist. I just see everything (Western Christendom) going to shit everywhere.

Sorry if I rubbed someone's rhubarb too harshly.
Posted by: No one of any consequence at June 22, 2024 12:54 PM (VuZH

I generally reject the George Bush stupidity of "you're either with us or you're against us."

No, how's about you all go f**k off and leave me alone.

But being left alone is so antithetical to American foreign policy in my lifetime, I too have resolved to sit back and watch the world burn as a result.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 01:01 PM (k9bXa)

238 It's not as if this thing in 2024 is the first time someone's proposed a two-state solution that Jews would be willing to negotiate in good faith. It's happened many times. Going back 107 years, now.

It didn't work. It's not happening.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2024 01:02 PM (0FoWg)

239 The usual interpretation is that the US is destroyed or decayed into uselessness before anything interesting happens with Israel. I can't disagree with that theory anymore.
Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 12:58 PM (FD5dr)

It could also be that the authors were talking about their own world which went from Anatolia to Egypt, to Persia and Rome and really wasn't so much about objective facts as about the shape of the world and God and Man's place within it.

I do know that if you try to use the Bible as a electronics reference manual, or an alternate to the Chilton's manual for the 1985 Taurus station wagon, you will not have much success in your endeavors

Posted by: Kindltot at June 22, 2024 01:03 PM (D7oie)

240 "experts" at State whose rice bowls are filled again and again because they are wedded to the idea of a two state solution.
...
Time to move on ...
Posted by: Xokrebs v Xocarnot: My Authenticity is Off the Charts (TM)!
--------------------------

Their rice bowls are filled again and again with money. They are wedded to money not any idea or ideal.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 01:04 PM (mP6Ur)

241 232 There is a silly belief that battleships were given up because they were vulnerable. E.g., D O'Connell's Sacred Vessels argues that. It got a good reception from those who don't know anything about the subject, but was slammed by those who do.

What happened is that carriers hit harder and farther.

I don't see a distinction. If carriers hit harder and farther, battleships are vulnerable by definition.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 12:57 PM (xCA6C)
_______
No, they take more damage than any other warship. It is pretty clear that a single US carrier, in 1945, could not sink a single Iowa, or even N Carolina.

Posted by: Eeyore at June 22, 2024 01:06 PM (1bNHn)

242 The Economist magazine, shilling as always for the Deep State:

Is America approaching peak tip?
The country’s gratuity madness may soon calm, so long as Donald Trump does not get his way

Damn you, Trump!

Posted by: The ARC of History! at June 22, 2024 01:06 PM (uxCna)

243 It didn't work. It's not happening.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2024 01:02 PM (0FoWg)

And this is where it gets dicey, argument-wise.

It didn't happen because Israel never really tried to make it happen.

The politicians in that country are no better or worse than the ones we have here, and their "solution" for all of my lifetime has been to pretend to be trying to find a solution, while keeping the status quo in place.

Including and up to, funding Hamas a mere couple weeks before October 7.

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 01:07 PM (k9bXa)

244 Is America approaching peak tip?

That's pretty funny coming from a mainstream media that really loves to touch tips.

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 01:10 PM (oyazo)

245 Time to move on ...
Posted by: Xokrebs v Xocarnot: My Authenticity is Off the Charts (TM)!

Their rice bowls are filled again and again with money. They are wedded to money not any idea or ideal.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 01:04 PM (mP6Ur)

I would again hope to appeal to good people here, to see a basic truth that is staring you right in the face.

Yes, our foreign policy "experts" have been involved in this whole mess for decades. And whatever "solutions" they tried... had NOTHING to do with solving the problem.

I'm no expert either, and I don't know what the "solution" is, but the argument that it's been tried is on its face, a distortion of reality... when you look at the people who have been doing the "trying."

Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 01:11 PM (k9bXa)

246 No, they take more damage than any other warship.

Of course they can. However:

From the US Naval Institute:
A battleship or even a large cruiser could very easily sink an aircraft carrier if she could close the range sufficiently to bring the carrier under fire. How such a ship can close the range from 200 to 20 miles in the face of a hostile air group and against a ship which is as fast or faster is something of a mystery.

It is pretty clear that a single US carrier, in 1945, could not sink a single Iowa, or even N Carolina.

Argument by assertion. Just because Yamato was sunk by planes from several carriers doesn't mean she couldn't have been sunk by the planes from one carrier, but if you have them, why wouldn't you use them.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 01:12 PM (xCA6C)

247 It didn't happen because Israel never really tried to make it happen.

Israel in the 90s offered Arafat everything he said he wanted, no strings attached. Arafat rejected it and launched missiles the same day.

The Palestinian "leadership" is a self-licking ice cream cone. They can't allow their "problem" to be solved, because their entire purpose is the "problem".

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 01:13 PM (oyazo)

248 I'm not white, I'm part Sicilian.

So there!!

Posted by: Tonypete at June 22, 2024 01:13 PM (WXNFJ)

249 didn't happen because Israel never really tried to make it happen.

Israel in the 90s offered Arafat everything he said he wanted, no strings attached. Arafat rejected it and launched missiles the same day.

The Palestinian "leadership" is a self-licking ice cream cone. They can't allow their "problem" to be solved, because their entire purpose is the "problem".
Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 01:13 PM (oyazo

Why the race hustlers have to keep making up racist events.

Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2024 01:14 PM (SHMXB)

250 Posted by: BurtTC at June 22, 2024 01:07 PM (k9bXa

I'm not sure what you mean here. Prior to 1948, Jews proposed three separate partitions, each more generous to Arabs than the last, to the point of a Jewish rump state in the Negev. All categorically rejected by the Grand Mufti.

They agreed to pursue a partition in 1978 and did so until Israel ended its military occupation in 2005. The Arabs effectively had a state since then.

None of this has worked.

It will never work.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2024 01:16 PM (0FoWg)

251 None of this has worked.

It will never work.

Secularized westerners make the mistake of thinking Muslims believe in their religion the same amount that Joe Biden or Bernie Sanders do in theirs: it's all for show, and occasionally a useful political cudgel.

But they're actually serious about the trees telling them where to go to shoot Jews. (Yes, this is actually in the Quran. M. Night Shalamar owes Mohammed royalties).

Posted by: Ian S. at June 22, 2024 01:22 PM (oyazo)

252 Refurbish the battleship. Put in a nuclear engine use the turret and magazine areas to fire missiles and rockets, R&R for modernized projectile weapons on deck, also drone launch capability.
Those ships are big and with modern systems, all smaller and more efficient. Yuge storage capacity would become available.
They would be formidable.

The money spent on Littoral combat vessels could have done that.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 01:22 PM (mP6Ur)

253 The money spent on Littoral combat vessels could have done that.

I don't see anyone defending the LCS.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 01:24 PM (xCA6C)

254 >>>But they're actually serious about the trees telling them where to go to shoot Jews. (Yes, this is actually in the Quran. M. Night Shalamar owes Mohammed royalties).
Posted by: Ian S.
----------------------

Anyone that does not acknowledge muslim history and the validation of their ethos by action today is Pollyanna. We will either realize that or die.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 01:25 PM (mP6Ur)

255 253 The money spent on Littoral combat vessels could have done that.
I don't see anyone defending the LCS.
Posted by: Archimedes
---------------------------

I referenced money spent on LCS against the argument that it's too expensive to refurbish a battleship. A refurbished battleship is money better spent than money spent on the LCS class.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 01:30 PM (mP6Ur)

256 GARDEN THREAD IS BLOOMING 💐

Posted by: Skip at June 22, 2024 01:30 PM (fwDg9)

257 I doubt any more battleships will be built by anyone
Just like drone technology small cheap nmeans now can destroy large vessels

Posted by: Skip at June 22, 2024 01:35 PM (fwDg9)

258 >>> wanting your neighborhood to be peaceful and quiet -- so that people can sleep at night and children can be well-rested for school and adults refreshed for productive work -- is white supremacy.

OK, ok, you sold me already!

Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at June 22, 2024 01:43 PM (cOq4q)

259 I doubt any more battleships will be built by anyone
Just like drone technology small cheap nmeans now can destroy large vessels

Agree. I predict fleets of small explosives-packed drones that travel under or just under the surface.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 01:51 PM (xCA6C)

260 I somewhat commented on this last night, but I was probably mistaken about Xochitl Gonzales being a Didn't Earn It admission. Parents are well-heeled champagne socialists so they probably just waved the necessary cash to let their little girl in.

Either way, that was an unnecessary amount of words to just say "I'm a coddled rich girl went to college to party but all those squares who went to actually study were ruining my partying, o woe is me."

That, and fair treatment always looks like oppression to the spoiled and entitled.

Posted by: Saber Alter at June 22, 2024 01:51 PM (G/gy4)

261 I think we have some mothballed battleships.
How many small cheap drones could a battle ship launch?
What if it fired a hollow projectile (20 miles) that opened and released a multitude of small drones? Or launched a cruise type missile full of drones?

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 01:54 PM (mP6Ur)

262 Saber Alter at June 22, 2024 01:51 PM

Heh.

Posted by: KT at June 22, 2024 01:56 PM (rrtZS)

263 h/t goes to Ed Driscoll, who also found this great meme from Jon Gabriel:

That mugshot looks familiar.

Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at June 22, 2024 01:59 PM (cOq4q)

264 I think we have some mothballed battleships.
How many small cheap drones could a battle ship launch?
What if it fired a hollow projectile (20 miles) that opened and released a multitude of small drones? Or launched a cruise type missile full of drones?

BBs are labor-intensive and very expensive to operate, to say nothing of the cost of the refit. You'd be much better off with arsenal ships or other lower cost platforms.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 02:01 PM (xCA6C)

265 Ain't no racism in this household.

I've been playing Deeez Nuuuts since Wednesday on a continuous loop.

Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 22, 2024 02:09 PM (dmXQN)

266 Zionism was always the word used by the most rabid vile jew haters. And the Left have mainstreamed it in an instant, making it not only acceptable, but mandatory. Shameless and gross.

How long before we start hearing of Jewish Supremacy? Or Jewish Extremists?

Posted by: ... at June 22, 2024 02:10 PM (lX8VI)

267 Disney VP Takes Leave of Absence After Date with Undercover Reporter for James O'Keefe

Posted by: SMOD at June 22, 2024 02:13 PM (GITLP)

268 Ain't no racism in this household.

The loudest mutherfucking concert I've ever attended was Motorhead.

OSHA has a standard written specifically for Lemmy when working from home.

Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 22, 2024 02:15 PM (dmXQN)

269 Then the other students arrived -- the ~~white~~ actual students.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at June 22, 2024 02:30 PM (YqDXo)

270 Archimedes at June 22
See
http://acecomments.mu.nu/?blog=86&post=410117#c39792964

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 02:31 PM (mP6Ur)

271 The future of drones against battlefield infantry is analogous to farmers against swarms of locusts.

Posted by: Braenyard at June 22, 2024 02:32 PM (mP6Ur)

272 Archimedes at June 22
See
http://acecomments.mu.nu/?blog=86&post=410117#c39792964

I think you copied the wrong thing. The link takes me to this comment thread.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 02:35 PM (xCA6C)

273 The future of drones against battlefield infantry is analogous to farmers against swarms of locusts.

Which, not coincidentally, figures prominently in The Three Body Problem.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2024 02:36 PM (xCA6C)

274 >>>I think you copied the wrong thing. The link takes me to this comment thread.

Posted by: Archimedes

>This is how your CO gets popped in the jungles of Cambodia.

Posted by: Dr. Bone at June 22, 2024 02:38 PM (dmXQN)

275 22..."I said nope, not gonna take a job in a place where the personnel manager already hates me."

Slightly related, I had an interview years ago with a personnel manager that had a reputation for chiseling down offers, thus losing good candidates. So she hands me a copy of a summary of the offer she sez she worked out with the hiring manager. I notice a handwritten note in the margins like "max $80K".

I also notice her copy does NOT have such a note. She has given me HER copy, the one that includes the salary max from the manager!

I let the chiseling go on for a few minutes, as she assured me my opening bid of 80K was outrageous, before I showed her my copy. Hilarity ensued!

Posted by: Ray Van Dune at June 22, 2024 03:01 PM (fvaUq)

276 Wilson was not a New Englander. Born in VA, grew up in GA.

Posted by: butch at June 22, 2024 05:59 PM (9cHCB)

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