Sunday Morning Book Thread - 03-19-2023 ["Perfessor" Squirrel]

Welcome to the prestigious, internationally acclaimed, stately, and illustrious Sunday Morning Book Thread! The place where all readers are welcome, regardless of whatever guilty pleasure we feel like reading. Here is where we can discuss, argue, bicker, quibble, consider, debate, confabulate, converse, and jaw about our latest fancy in reading material, even if it's nothing more than the abstracts for an online conference. As always, pants are required, especially if you are wearing these pants...(astute pants enthusiasts will note this is the exact same model from last week--pants are photoshopped in.)

So relax, find yourself a warm kitty (or warm puppy--I won't judge) to curl up in your lap, warm up some leftover corned beef and cabbage, and dive into a new book. What are YOU reading this fine morning?

PIC NOTE

Today's pic is of the Yangzhou Zhongshuge, a library/bookstore in China. This is one example where form seems to trump function, in very interesting ways. The reflective floors give the illusion of floating through a tunnel of books. The zig-zag shape in the ceiling is meant to evoke the image of a winding river. The adult reading room is reminiscent of an arched cathedral (to me at least), even though the ceilings are not that high. Very strange building, but one I could probably lose myself in. Of course, with L-Space being what it is (see Terry Pratchett's Discworld), I might exit from an entirely different library...

LIVES OF CHARACTERS

When you read a story, do you ever get a sense that you are just seeing a very tiny slice of the main character's life? Although a fairy tale might end with, "and they lived happily ever after," we know that people in the real world don't get to have that experience. After the hero and his bride ride off into the sunset, their relationship will have its ups and downs, just like the real world, though we'll most likely never get to see that. Unless the author writes a sequel, which does happen sometimes.

Often, characters will refer to their past exploits, usually to either give us some exposition related to their current adventure or because they are demonstrating some character development, or both. However, unless the author gives us a flashback or extended exposition, we seldom get to see all of the details of their past exploits. For instance, a throw away line in Arthur Conan Doyle's "The Sussex Vampire" indicates that Sherlock Holmes had an encounter with a giant rat of Sumatra:

"Matilda Briggs was not the name of a young woman, Watson," said Holmes in a reminiscent voice. "It was a ship which is associated with the giant rat of Sumatra, a story for which the world is not yet prepared. But what do we know about vampires?"

Believe it or not, that one line, in a rather obscure Sherlock Holmes story written late in Doyle's career, has created a small cottage industry of authors attempting to fill in that gap. What is the giant rat of Sumatra? What was the adventure? Was it supernatural? Alien? Scooby-Doo-esque? Since Doyle never gave Holmes an official narrative around the giant rat of Sumatra, we'll never know what he intended.

Most authors will give their characters a colorful past to flesh them out. Michael Ende (The Neverending Story) is unusual in that he gives many of his side characters future adventures, without describing them in detail, to illustrate that each character, each story, truly is neverending. He gives a short description of their future exploit, but then says, "that is another story for another time."

Do YOU have any favorite characters that have unexplained adventures in their past (or future)? Do you ever imagine what the details behind those stories might be? Do characters have lives beyond the stories in which they are found?

++++++++++

IT PAYS TO INCREASE YOUR TROPE AWARENESS

Noodle Incident -- A Noodle Incident is any event from a character's past which is never fully explained and is possibly too ridiculous to be believed. This trope comes from a Calvin and Hobbes comic where Calvin stresses that he can't be blamed for what happened during the incident in question. I'm sure all of us Morons have at least ONE Noodle Incident in our past...*cough*SquirrelAtStonehenge*cough*

Comment: One of the books I read this week, Sherlock Holmes and the Giant Rat of Sumatra is one of many attempts to describe a "Noodle Incident" mentioned in passing in the Sherlock Holmes Case Book story "The Adventure of the Sussex Vampire." Holmes simply says that this is "a story for which the world is not yet prepared." and leaves the details up to the imagination of the reader.

Black Comedy -- This is a subgenre of comedy and satire where serious events are treated in a lighthearted manner, while still portraying them as the negative events they are. Usually involves a lot of death, violence, crime, insanity, drug abuse, racism, sexism, etc. A large part of Black Comedy is taking something that is usually portrayed as serious and exaggerating it for comedic effect. For instance, A Series of Unfortunate Events starts out with making young children orphans when their parents are killed in a fire and then making their situation worse and worse throughout the series, even as the narrator continues to warn the reader that things *always* get worse for the Baudelaire children.

Comment: Bring Me the Head of Prince Charming by Roger Zelazny and Robert Sheckley is an excellent example, as the main character is a demon who engages in demonic activity, such as playing poker with his fellow demons using human body parts as currency. Then complaining when the body parts he's harvesting for his Frankenstein-Monster-like creations don't measure up to his expectations. Lots of humorous digs at classical fairy tales, such as Cinderella and especially Sleeping Beauty (or Napping Beauty in this story). The latter character attends a ball hosted by the former, and is almost kidnapped to become a Sultan's concubine by one of the attendees. She's not happy about that. Meanwhile Prince Charming finds a magical sword (Excalibur) that convinces him to slay a group of wandering merchants because they looked evil. Oh, and the sword betrays him to a group of demon knights who almost roast Prince Charming for dinner. That's Black Comedy in a nutshell.

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MORON RECOMMENDATIONS

We're going to try something different and start off with an ANTI-recommendation. Just as it's useful to find books that are good to read, it can be just as useful to identify books to avoid. Feel free to post more ANTI-Recommendations in the comments below...

This month's family book read is done and over with, thank God. My daughter chose, and here is my ANTI-recommendation: Hollow Beasts by Alisa Lynn Valdes. It happens to be this month's Amazon Prime Free Book.
Wokeness level: eleventy. It has everything--white supremacists who kidnap young latina women, Hispanic American game warden and sheriff, wolves, Hispanic American sheriff who thinks there should be a border wall (author frowns on this), grrrl power, one nice white guy, adoption, corrupt Democrats (whose only purpose appeared to be the author's shock that there could be such a thing as corrupt Democrats).
I don't know how this author gets to be a NYT best selling author. Her prose is mediocre, at best. She can't tell a story without preaching.
Despite all of that, there are good points. She does try to balance her stereotypes with characters from "her side" who also do bad things. Several of the characters do the right thing, even when it would be easier not to. Pro-adoption, in the sense that a pregnant teenager did not seek an abortion (she wanted to keep the baby rather than give it up, but at least did not try to kill it).
Overall, 1/2 star.
Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 12, 2023 08:38 AM (OX9vb)

Comment: This one of the problems of modern writers. They are so, so keen on inserting ***THE MESSAGE*** (cue Critical Drinker's voice) that they are forgoing the basic elements of storytelling. Slavery is wrong. Period. It doesn't matter who does it. I've read a number of books recently that featured slavery in some fashion or another and the authors are one and all consistent in portraying slavery as bad. You don't have to insert additional messages. The book I recently finished had Sherlock Holmes teaming up with a Black Muslim ship captain (a former slave himself) and a Chinese druglady to take down a slavery ring masterminded by hyperevolved rats (it makes sense in context). And yes, there were some bad English colonialists, but again, it made perfect sense in context.

+++++

Starting some fluff called Bring me the Head of Prince Charming, by Roger Zelazny and Robert Sheckley. We shall see.
The other thing I am reading is IRS instructions on certain investments. Ugh!
Posted by: NaCly Dog (u82oZ) at March 12, 2023 08:42 AM (u82oZ)

Comment: NaCly Dog's comment reminded me that I, too, have this book in my library and it was flagged as "unread" so I thought I'd give it a whirl. It's a lot of fluff, poking fun at the demonic supernatural realm, while turning a standard fairy tale inside out. Weirdly, the picture of the castle on the back cover is reminiscent of Neuschwanstein Castle, which was built almost 900 years after the story takes place (AD 1000). The premise is that every thousand years, the forces of Good and Evil have a contest to see who will dominate for the next thousand years. An argument could be made that the forces of Good may have lost in AD 2000.

+++++

With all of the woke and cancellation going on, I would recommend picking up a copy of Empire by Niall Ferguson. Empire is the story of the rise and fall of the British empire, and the colonies they set up. Were it to be published today, it would certainly be attacked, as it documents that British colonialism benefited those lands where it was installed. True colonialism was about installing the infrastructure and rules of the home country on the colony, so that those colonized were given the tools to grow and the rule of law, something that was lacking in every colonized land. If one looks at the former British colonies after independence, every one is well ahead of its neighbors, excepting those that have been taken over by Marxists after separation. The book is an enjoyable read, and well documented, and full of the facts that so annoy those that disparage the British empire.
Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 12, 2023 09:15 AM (cPQrn)

Comment: By now, we as a species should be well-versed in the forces of colonialism and how they work. We only have thousands of years of documented history to show us. Yet, still people seem to think that Empires will last forever and that the world can be dominated by a few for all time. The British Empire was neither wholly good nor wholly evil, which is true of most empires. For all their faults, the British brought a great deal of stability, education, and civilization to remote parts of the world that had never known that those things were possible.

+++++

I am currently reading Memoir of Hungary 1944-1948 by Sandor Marai.
It concerns the time after WWII up until the full communist takeover.
The book starts with an anecdote of a family drinking party just as the National Socialists were all running for the exits in Hungary. (It seems they were aware that if they didn't drink up all the wine, the approaching Russians would)
One guest turns the subject to whether they should be supporting the German alliance.
Sandor Marai posits that no one needs the German alliance. A guest, a bit drunk at this point shouts, "I am a National Socialist! YOU can't understand this because you are talented. But I'm not, and that is why I need National Socialism! YOU can't possibly understand... Now it's about us! The untalented! Our time has come!"
With this prophecy, the National Socialists move out, and the International Socialists move in, and the time of the untalented begins. (Sound familiar?)
This forms the main theme of the memoir, of untalented people rising to great power, and talented people selling their souls to gain power/fame, up until the author can no longer live in Hungary and flees to America.
It is EXCELLENT.
Posted by: Taft at March 12, 2023 09:36 AM (6Aj7n)

Comment: It really is sad to think that we are not being ruled by truly elite, enlightened people, but by the dregs of mediocrity. It would be *slightly* more palatable if we knew that the people in charge really could back up their so-called "expertise" with notable achievements. As it is, these people would fail to run a frozen banana stand. Yet they have control of all the levers of power in society. Calling them "untalented" is being charitable. Is there such a thing as "anti-talented?" *sigh*

More Moron-recommended reading material can be found HERE! (684 Moron-recommended books so far!)

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WHAT I'VE ACQUIRED IN THE PAST WEEK

Gamearth by Kevin J. Anderson -- Like the Guardians of the Flame series, this involves a table top role-playing game that suddenly becomes real for the players. One of them gets a bit annoyed by this and tries to destroy the game world. The series as a whole has a rather neat twist at the end.

WHAT I'VE BEEN READING THIS PAST WEEK:

Sherlock Holmes and the Giant Rat of Sumatra by Alan Vanneman -- He manages to capture the essence of a Sherlockian tale, while adding in some extraordinary elements that take Holmes a bit out of his comfort zone.

Bring Me the Head of Prince Charming by Roger Zelazny and Robert Sheckley -- An amusing tale of one demon's attempt to win control of Earth for the next thousand years by subverting a classic fairy tale.

"The Sussex Vampire" by Arthur Conan Doyle -- The story that mentions in passing the giant rat of Sumatra. Also features this memorable quote from Watson: "I have read, for example, of the old sucking the blood of the young to retain their youth." This is about the limit of Watson's knowledge on the subject of vampires. Naturally, there is a simple, elegant solution to this puzzle...

Forgotten Realms - The Harpers 5 - The Ring of Winter by James Lowder -- An explorer goes searching for a legendary artifact in a fantasy version of Dark Africa (with dinosaurs!). Another "fluff" novel because I just needed something light and entertaining this week.

That's about all I have for this week. Thank you for all of your kind words regarding the Sunday Morning Book Thread. This is a very special place. You are very special people (in all the best ways!). The kindness, generosity, and wisdom of the Moron Horde knows no bounds. Let's keep reading!

If you have any suggestions for improvement, reading recommendations, or discussion topics that you'd like to see on the Sunday Morning Book Thread, you can send them to perfessor dot squirrel at-sign gmail dot com. Your feedback is always appreciated! You can also take a virtual tour of OUR library at libib.com/u/perfessorsquirrel. Since I added sections for AoSHQ, I now consider it OUR library, rather than my own personal fiefdom...

PREVIOUS SUNDAY MORNING BOOK THREAD - 03-12-23 (NOTE: Do NOT comment on old threads!)

Posted by: Open Blogger at 09:00 AM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 First?

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at March 19, 2023 09:00 AM (PiwSw)

2 Tolle Lege

Posted by: Skip at March 19, 2023 09:00 AM (xhxe8)

3 Tolle Lege!

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at March 19, 2023 09:00 AM (PiwSw)

4 Skip!

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at March 19, 2023 09:00 AM (PiwSw)

5 "Luke, I am your father"
Nooooooooooooooooo!

That what picture reminds me of.
Anyway reading Patrick O'Brian The Yellow Admiral, biography of Nelson after that.

Posted by: Skip at March 19, 2023 09:01 AM (xhxe8)

6 I do not often suggest comics here in the book thread.

Took the plunge last night on "The Black Hood" trilogy under the Dark Circle imprint on Kindle.

https://tinyurl.com/New-Black-Hood

Reads as much like Noir as a capes and cowls

Posted by: sven at March 19, 2023 09:02 AM (Lzpvj)

7 Do characters have lives beyond the stories in which they are found?

Yes and no. Yes, because they're story is only an incident in their lives. No, because they're not real people.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:02 AM (Angsy)

8 Good morning!

Posted by: Moonbeam at March 19, 2023 09:03 AM (rbKZ6)

9 This warm kitty in my lap hurts. Those claws! Ouch!

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:03 AM (Om/di)

10 hiya

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 09:03 AM (T4tVD)

11 Whoa! That's some bookstore picture.

Posted by: Count de Monet at March 19, 2023 09:03 AM (4I/2K)

12 (astute pants enthusiasts will note this is the exact same model from last week--pants are photoshopped in.)

Yeah, always gives the impression it's a girl, but you know it's a twink.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:04 AM (Angsy)

13 Good morning fellow Book Threadists. I hope everyone had a great week of reading. My was delightful.

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 09:05 AM (7EjX1)

14 Speaking of Sherlock Holmes, anyone read the Sherlock Holmes books written by Kareem Abdul-Jabbar?

Posted by: Lizzy at March 19, 2023 09:06 AM (mqu1M)

15 Greetings!
I'm in the middle of a historical work on the Tudors, gonna hold off on a review until done. But it is a very thorough book, so far with lots of details and background information I was previously unaware.

Posted by: gourmand du jour binge watching Celtic Woman at March 19, 2023 09:07 AM (jTmQV)

16 That library is cool -- would love to visit it and take pictures.

However, give me a well-stocked used bookstore or the Tattered Cover any day and I'm lost for hours

Posted by: Lizzy at March 19, 2023 09:07 AM (mqu1M)

17 Yay book thread!

Alas, I won't be able to stay long today, but I had to drop in to thank everyone who gave Walls of Men some glowing reviews. Thank you!

Whether our Moron authors are cranking out intelligent, non-woke fiction or combating lies in non-fiction, good reviews are essential. No need to write anything, just add that five-star after your purchase so that other people will take a glance.

Each time you do it, Jeff Bezos cries.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:07 AM (llXky)

18 15 Posted by: gourmand du jour binge watching Celtic Woman at March 19, 2023 09:07 AM (jTmQV)

If it is thorough enough my surname will crop up.

Posted by: sven at March 19, 2023 09:08 AM (Lzpvj)

19 Speaking of Sherlock Holmes, anyone read the Sherlock Holmes books written by Kareem Abdul-Jabbar?
Posted by: Lizzy at March 19, 2023 09:06 AM (mqu1M)

So, Watson plays point guard, no?

Posted by: dantesed at March 19, 2023 09:08 AM (88xKn)

20 Good Sunday morning, horde!

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 09:09 AM (OX9vb)

21 (astute pants enthusiasts will note this is the exact same model from last week--pants are photoshopped in.)

Yeah, always gives the impression it's a girl, but you know it's a twink.
Posted by: OrangeEnt

So ixnay on the weedwhacker.

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 09:09 AM (T4tVD)

22 Not much reading this week, but a couple of book-related bits to amuse the Horde.

I'm working through Remington Steele, which I find not just fun, but remarkably erudite. In the episode I watched last night, Steele goes undercover as "Lord Marchmain." Waugh reference for the win!

I'm also getting my youngest kid into watching the North and South miniseries, which was based on John Jakes' books. The show is arguably the greatest melodrama of the decade, and pretty good history. It portrays heroes and villains on both sides and does not skimp on showing how badly southerners suffered. Also, Kirstie Alley's turn as wacko pre-woke Abolitionist Virgilia is by far her best performance.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:10 AM (llXky)

23 The early Matt Helm books had references to past missions we never got to read, including one in Cuba.

And I read once -- an essay by Gaiman? -- that an author had to have his characters' lives plotted from point A, but not start the story until points B or C.

Finally, another quote, whose origin I've forgotten: "Fiction is love and sex. Real life is marriage and children."

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:11 AM (Om/di)

24 I wonder what books are in a Chinese library. And what books are not.

Posted by: fd at March 19, 2023 09:11 AM (iayUP)

25 Something makes me think the available reading material I China would be limited.

Posted by: Skip at March 19, 2023 09:11 AM (xhxe8)

26 This week I read Good Omens: The Nice and Accurate Prophecies of Agnus Nutter, Witch by Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett. This was recommended here awhile ago. This is a very funny story of the Antichrist being delivered to the world and promptly misplaced. I enjoyed the laughs.

Posted by: Zoltan at March 19, 2023 09:12 AM (sDFJU)

27 I did acquire another Joseph Conrad anthology, and my collection is getting quite duplicative because at this point it's something of a scavenger hunt to find the short stories I don't already have. I wanted this one only for "The Shadow-Line."

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:12 AM (llXky)

28 Morning, all,

I've always imagined that my favorite heroes had lives beyond the adventures their creators chronicled, and been pleased when we heard even a little about them. We know, for instance, that in the period around 1947 Ellery Queen had one of his most prolific years; the cases are hinted at in a late chapter of Ten Days' Wonder. Archie Goodwin tells us in passing of minor, non-murder cases he and Wolfe tackled, such as "The Hardest Guy to Deal With," whatever that was about.

And I've always thought that Napoleon Solo and Illya Kuryakin of The Man From U.N.C.L.E. had incidents or adventures we never saw or read about. In their cases, too, we don't know very much about their pasts, so we're free to imagine all sorts of things.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:12 AM (omVj0)

29 >>I wonder what books are in a Chinese library. And what books are not.

or. . . it's thousands of copies of the same book?

Posted by: Lizzy at March 19, 2023 09:13 AM (mqu1M)

30 I'm going to pick up, Carthage Must Be Destroyed, it may or may not have any relevance to our current moment, but it sounds like it should.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at March 19, 2023 09:13 AM (up/3i)

31 Something makes me think the available reading material I China would be limited.

Posted by: Skip at March 19, 2023 09:11 AM (xhxe

---
I think the Classics are back in fashion. China is now all about the nationalism. Sorry, Comintern, your day is done.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:13 AM (llXky)

32 I always wondered what kind of super secret spy adventures Studebaker Hoch had before the incident with the flies.

Posted by: Guy who relates everything to a Zappa song at March 19, 2023 09:14 AM (iayUP)

33 And I've always thought that Napoleon Solo and Illya Kuryakin of The Man From U.N.C.L.E. had incidents or adventures we never saw or read about. In their cases, too, we don't know very much about their pasts, so we're free to imagine all sorts of things.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:12 AM (omVj0)
---
The stupidity of the Star Wars franchise is that it tried to iron out stuff like that. The Clone Wars, why Kenobi was a general, Lando's "little maneuver at the Battle of Tanaab," Han's Kessel Run record - all of these should never have been explained.

What those hints do is also allow us to imagine *our version* of what makes them cool. Defining it never can measure up to that.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:15 AM (llXky)

34 I just put up the next in the Lone Star Sons series - Lone Star Blood, in Kindle - the paperback version will be available late in the month, but the eBook version is available for pre-order here
https://tinyurl.com/khaaz2ap
I'll send the information on it for next weeks thread, but I thought I'd mention it today!

Posted by: Sgt. Mom at March 19, 2023 09:15 AM (xnmPy)

35 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome. "

John 1:1-5

Posted by: Marcus T at March 19, 2023 09:16 AM (8Voqu)

36 I'm going to pick up, Carthage Must Be Destroyed, it may or may not have any relevance to our current moment, but it sounds like it should.
Posted by: Thomas Bender at March 19, 2023

***
I happened to flip through my old 1974 text, The Immense Majesty by Thomas W. Africa, a history of Rome and the Empire. In one chapter he mentions an author named Ronald Syme and his 1939 The Roman Revolution, focusing on the late Republic and the Augustan Age. Africa says that Syme deals with his topic with "cold realism and biting wit." This I gotta find.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:17 AM (omVj0)

37 Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:12 AM (omVj0)

So, mysteries inside mysteries.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:17 AM (Angsy)

38 33 Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:15 AM (llXky)

Disney chose the stupidest of all solutions- Lucasfilms had written in some corners by filling in "nest of gundarks" which was bad....

Disney then delcared "nah bro all that canon you spent all that time learning is gone" and then wrote swill to replace the pap.

Posted by: sven at March 19, 2023 09:18 AM (Lzpvj)

39 Thanks for the anti-reco, Perfesser. In a minute, I will compare and contrast my daughter's second choice (short books, she chose two this month).

But, first, I want to mention that I read and reviewed Scarboy by Rip Pauley (was a featured Moron Author a couple of weeks ago).

It is a moving story, full of pain and miracles, and I am glad I kept reading it. It will especially appeal to dog lovers. I gave it four stars.

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 09:18 AM (OX9vb)

40 >>The stupidity of the Star Wars franchise s that it tried to iron out stuff like that. The Clone Wars, why Kenobi was a general, Lando's "little maneuver at the Battle of Tanaab," Han's Kessel Run record - all of these should never have been explained.

Current Hollywood uses "origin stories" to completely re-write/redefine characters we've known and loved since childhood. They're like ISIS erasing history..

Posted by: Lizzy at March 19, 2023 09:18 AM (mqu1M)

41 I just now finished an excellent autobiography -- Alvarez: Adventures of a Physicist, by Luis Alvarez. It's kind of in the vein of Feynman's more well-known memoir, though Alvarez focuses more on his scientific work and less on shenanigans with strippers and bongo drums. This may be due to Alvarez being a happily-married family man. He pioneered two sub-branches of particle physics, flew on the chase plane for the atomic bomb missions, helped develop radar and the atomic bomb, did acoustic analysis of the gunshots of the Kennedy assassination, and of course teamed up with his son to figure out what killed the dinosaurs.

Posted by: Trimegistus at March 19, 2023 09:18 AM (QZxDR)

42 While waiting for delivery of a library order, I reread what I have of Marvel's Sub-Mariner series of the late '60s through early '70s. Still not sure whether to keep these issues.

However, it was fun to go through the letters pages and spot the names of future notables in the comics business.

I got the least part of the order yesterday. It was a compilation of books five and six of the "Star Trek Log" series by Alan D. Foster. I own the books; I got this just for the introduction by Foster. Some introduction -- one page.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:19 AM (Om/di)

43 I wonder what books are in a Chinese library. And what books are not.

or. . . it's thousands of copies of the same book?

Posted by: Lizzy at March 19, 2023 09:13 AM (mqu1M)

Does it really matter? An hour after reading it, you want to read it again.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:19 AM (Angsy)

44 Current Hollywood uses "origin stories" to completely re-write/redefine characters we've known and loved since childhood. They're like ISIS erasing history..

Posted by: Lizzy at March 19, 2023 09:18 AM (mqu1M)
---
The current generation has no actual creative spark. They were raised from birth to be conformists, to color inside the lines. They write what they know.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:20 AM (llXky)

45 The urge to fill in backstories has gotten completely out of hand. I hear the most recent Kenneth Branagh film about Hercule Poirot (Death on the Nile) includes an origin story for his mustache.

Posted by: Trimegistus at March 19, 2023 09:21 AM (QZxDR)

46 Marcus T, thank you for the scripture. What version of the Bible is that? Thanks.

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 09:21 AM (OX9vb)

47 Last week Perfessor mentioned Baen Books' Fantasy Adventure Story contest. The deadline is not until 4/30, so I have a little time to go over my entry. It's a short story I wrote a few years ago in my hard-boiled fantasy universe, involving a doctor and his peculiar alliance with a griffin. My writing group people, whom I've told about the contest, are going to look this script over to see if it has any bad flaws or breaks any of Baen's rules.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:21 AM (omVj0)

48
One of the books I read this week, Sherlock Holmes and the Giant Rat of Sumatra is one of many attempts to describe a "Noodle Incident" mentioned in passing in the Sherlock Holmes Case Book story "The Adventure of the Sussex Vampire."

==

How do you like it ? There were several books, that attempted to shed light on THAT incident.

Posted by: runner at March 19, 2023 09:22 AM (V13WU)

49 After Man of Destiny came out, a couple of people asked me to write about the Deimos War, which was the last major conflict before the story takes place. It gets lots of references for the precedents it set, etc.

I thought about doing it, but this thread has convinced me that it's better left unexplored. I'm really hating on the whole "prequel" concept these days.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:23 AM (llXky)

50 One of the books I read this week, Sherlock Holmes and the Giant Rat of Sumatra is one of many attempts to describe a "Noodle Incident" mentioned in passing in the Sherlock Holmes Case Book story "The Adventure of the Sussex Vampire."

==

How do you like it ? There were several books, that attempted to shed light on THAT incident.
Posted by: runner at March 19, 2023 09:22 AM (V13WU)
---
It was surprisingly good. Very Holmesian, yet with an added layer of adventure that is more akin to an "explorer" type novel. Holmes even gets taken out of the picture for a good chunk of the novel, leaving Watson on his own to continue the adventure until Holmes returns near the end.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 09:24 AM (BpYfr)

51 Well, time's up. Until next week!

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:24 AM (llXky)

52 Does it really matter? An hour after reading it, you want to read it again.
Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:19 AM (Angsy)

*snort

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 09:24 AM (OX9vb)

53 A Noodle Incident is any event from a character's past which is never fully explained and is possibly too ridiculous to be believed.

*******

A couple come to mind. I would share with y'all, but I wouldn't be able to fully explain them and they are too ridiculous to believe.

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 09:25 AM (ykeLU)

54 A guest, a bit drunk at this point shouts, "I am a National Socialist! YOU can't understand this because you are talented. But I'm not, and that is why I need National Socialism! YOU can't possibly understand... Now it's about us! The untalented! Our time has come!"

Think Alexander Vindman

Posted by: weirdflunky at March 19, 2023 09:25 AM (cknjq)

55 Last week Perfessor mentioned Baen Books' Fantasy Adventure Story contest. The deadline is not until 4/30, so I have a little time to go over my entry. It's a short story I wrote a few years ago in my hard-boiled fantasy universe, involving a doctor and his peculiar alliance with a griffin. My writing group people, whom I've told about the contest, are going to look this script over to see if it has any bad flaws or breaks any of Baen's rules.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:21 AM (omVj0)

Good luck! I don't have anything that fits that description.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:25 AM (Angsy)

56 One of the books I read this week, Sherlock Holmes and the Giant Rat of Sumatra is one of many attempts to describe a "Noodle Incident" mentioned in passing in the Sherlock Holmes Case Book story "The Adventure of the Sussex Vampire."

==
How do you like it ? There were several books, that attempted to shed light on THAT incident.
Posted by: runner at March 19, 2023

***
Long ago (the '70s) in Fantasy and Science Fiction, someone wrote what might have been the first in that cottage industry about the Giant Rat. Holmes is the lead, but his name is never given. When I brought it up here, one of you recognized the story and mentioned the author and title, but I've forgotten. Sterling Lanier, maybe?

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:26 AM (omVj0)

57 I thought about doing it, but this thread has convinced me that it's better left unexplored. I'm really hating on the whole "prequel" concept these days.
Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:23 AM (llXky)
---
You'd probably be better off writing a sequel that explores the aftermath of the war in some new way. Details can be filled in via exposition along the way.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 09:26 AM (BpYfr)

58 "Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 09:21 AM (OX9vb)"

You're welcome. That passage is the NIV.

Posted by: Marcus T at March 19, 2023 09:26 AM (8Voqu)

59 "You would not believe what happen to me when I was undercover !"

Posted by: runner at March 19, 2023 09:27 AM (V13WU)

60 Perry Mason the series was before my time. But I knew the basics. I didn't know the characters were based on books.

Found that out watching HBOs Perry Mason...thing. The first season was bearable though of course the maxim "the past must be destroyed" was well followed.

This season - whoo boy. Let's count the ways this show craps on the IP. Takes place in early depression era LA. Though from the timeline it would be Prohibition era, too, bars and drinking are quite open. And Mason is a drunk. And haunted by war crimes he committed in WWI. And he's a biker. And Della and Hamilton Burger (whatever the DAs name was) are gay. Gay gay gay. And of course every under represented group is part of Masons universe. White people are terrible. And don't get started on the religious! And Della is of course the real hardworking brains behind the lawyering.

Posted by: blaster at March 19, 2023 09:29 AM (pwExq)

61 I also read The Mountains Sing by Nguyen Phan Que Mai. This is an engaging story of a North Vietnam family, the Tran family, told through the matriarch, Dieu Lan and her granddaughter, Huong. Huong's parents and uncles have gone south to fight in the war. Chapters alternate between the present told by Hung and chapters told by Dieu Lan as she teaches her granddaughter their family history. The family was a prosperous land owner family which suffered greatly during the Viet Minh's land distribution program and also suffered during the Vietnam War. It's a story of hope and determination to keep the family together and to always work for a better life. I enjoyed it very much.

Posted by: Zoltan at March 19, 2023 09:29 AM (sDFJU)

62 I thought about doing it, but this thread has convinced me that it's better left unexplored. I'm really hating on the whole "prequel" concept these days.

Posted by: Ace-Endorsed Author A.H. Lloyd at March 19, 2023 09:23 AM (llXky)

I had no plans to do any continuing character in the crap I "write." But now, one of them seems to be ripe for following in further stories.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:29 AM (Angsy)

63 Yesterday we had a Medical Myth-teries thread, and I couldn't recall this statement from Pliny, but I went and looked it up.

"Inguinalis again, or, as some persons call it, "argemo," a plant commonly found growing in bushes and thickets, needs only to be held in the hand to be productive of beneficial effects upon the groin."

It was interesting to me because we now have the medical term "Inguinal canal", and I found no other reference to the word "argemo", at least as far as plants go.

Anyway, the Romans had their own versions of medical quackery. You have to wonder about the real motivations when they say things like a particular plant must be boiled and mixed with axle grease to be administered on the first rising of the dog star by a naked virgin.

Posted by: Guy who relates everything to a Zappa song at March 19, 2023 09:29 AM (iayUP)

64 Like Helm, some Saint stories refer to adventures and swindles that never saw print.

I remember one in which he talks about a fabulous gem whose existence is known to only three people, and he's one of them. I would love to read that story.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:30 AM (Om/di)

65 oh darn it

Posted by: fd at March 19, 2023 09:30 AM (iayUP)

66 I read two books by Immaculée Ilibagiza, Left to Tell and Led by Faith. She is a survivor of the Rwandian genocide that wiped out most of her family. First book tells about how she was hidden by a minister in a tiny bathroom with 9 other women for three months. Second is the story of her life after, marrying and moving to the US. She is Catholic, credits her strong faith with saving her and was able to forgive the man that murdered her family. I've read about Rwanda before but I think this was the first time for a first person report. Well told story.

Posted by: Notsothoreau at March 19, 2023 09:31 AM (6lj/r)

67 guest, a bit drunk at this point shouts, "I am a National Socialist! YOU can't understand this because you are talented. But I'm not, and that is why I need National Socialism! YOU can't possibly understand... Now it's about us! The untalented! Our time has come!"

Think Alexander Vindman
Posted by: weirdflunky

Or a Union Boss

Posted by: Sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 19, 2023 09:31 AM (Y+l9t)

68 I'm of two minds about the prequel/origin story concept. On the one hand, it can be fascinating. Robert Parker wrote a "young adult" Spenser story featuring the teenage Spenser in Wyoming, where he grew up, and he infused it with many of the tropes and concepts the adult Spenser mentions and deals with. And there was that prologue to the 3rd Indiana Jones film showing the young Henry as a risk-taker even at age 16 (River Phoenix played him). Have Gun -- Will Travel did one script showing how Paladin became what he was.

If the prequel/origin smacks of "We're doing this to get our hands on more money," then no, it doesn't work.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:31 AM (omVj0)

69 The co-authors Preston and Child often have characters in their books who have left the scene in one novel, only to show up in another novel. Sometimes we get an inkling of what they have been doing in the meantime, and sometimes not. Recently, one character, the paleontologist Nora Kelly, was spun off into a series of novels of her own, and is joined by other characters from Preston and Child's earlier series. To a reader that has been involved in the series, this can aid the story, as their character traits are already known. This technique can be done with protagonists as well as antagonists, like Moriarity.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 09:32 AM (H8Mi4)

70 I've been in a mood for children's books this week, especially with the original illustrations. (No Disney fluff!) Wind in the Willows, Winnie-the Pooh, and Beatrix Potter. Charming writing accompanied by wonderful creative art. Ernest Shepard and Arthur Rackham are incredible.

That led to a new to me series, the "Brambly Hedge" books written and illustrated by Jill Barklem. They are about a village of mice, circa late Victorian era, in a rural section of England. The stories are charming and would appeal to little kids as well as adults who will enjoy the playful names and situations. And the illustrations are superb. Very much with the 'feel' of Beatrix Potter but not a rip off. Part of the difference is the amount of detail Barklem includes. As an example, She mentions the mills that the mice use to make butter, cheese, and flour. Her watercolor drawings show the various wheels and belts and how they churn or grind, all the many store rooms in the tree trunk and how the mice get from one to another.

to be continued ...

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 09:34 AM (7EjX1)

71 I just started reading C.J. Cherryh's Morgaine Saga this morning. Although the blurb on the back sounds like interesting science fiction, the first few chapters read like fantasy. Not sure if she's doing a bait-and-switch on me...

However, it is quite good so far. We are introduced to the mysterious "Morgaine" who shows up out of a strange Gate 100 years after she supposedly wiped out an entire tribe during a war.

Now she's teamed up with an exiled warrior to pursue a quest into the lands of an immortal sorcerer-king.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 09:35 AM (BpYfr)

72 Anyway, the Romans had their own versions of medical quackery. You have to wonder about the real motivations when they say things like a particular plant must be boiled and mixed with axle grease to be administered on the first rising of the dog star by a naked virgin.
Posted by: Guy who relates everything to a Zappa song at March 19, 2023

***
Cato the Elder swore by the urine of a person who ate cabbages, and used it in his own medical ministrations on his family. (Spoiler: His wife and child died thanks to his "medicine.") Urine baths, diets that gave you nightmares, and voodoo. He was a fascinating old coot, but I would not have wanted to be under his control.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:35 AM (omVj0)

73 Finally, I read The Alchemist: 25th Anniversary Edition, translated by Alan R. Clarke. This modern classic tells the story of Santiago, an Andalusian shepherd boy who wants to travel and find worldly treasure. Along his journey, he learns to listen to his heart, recognize opportunities, and read the omens on his path. Most importantly, he learns to follow his dream.

Posted by: Zoltan at March 19, 2023 09:35 AM (sDFJU)

74 Anti-recommendation - "Timeline" by Michael Chrichton. An utterly pointless waste of time. Made into a movie (because Chrichton), and that was utterly pointless as well.

Posted by: Taro Tsujimoto at March 19, 2023 09:36 AM (5YmYl)

75 In one novel, Perry Mason refers to his last hunting trip; apparently he's a lousy camp cook.

Adds a whole new dimension to the character for me.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:37 AM (Om/di)

76 I had no plans to do any continuing character in the crap I "write." But now, one of them seems to be ripe for following in further stories.
Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023

***
I had a major character sacrifice himself heroically at the end of a novel. But he's such a vivid and lively fellow that I've been penning some short stories about his early career.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:37 AM (omVj0)

77 Family Book Club: The second book was Ring Shout by P Djeli Clark. It is speculative fiction, set in 1922. It's a fantasy wherein a trio of black women are fighting the supernatural--in this case, Ku Kluxes, who are demons posing as Klansmen.

This is a much more talented author. He doesn't go on about how evil the KKK was; we all know it already. The story is about how these women (yeah, grrrl power, but it was ok for me in this story) come by their powers and talents, their partnership with a Gullah spiritualist, and their battle against demons.

I don't think this is too much of a spoiler: the main character fights with a sword that was forged of the pain and suffering of slaves, and the "chiefs and kings who sold them." I appreciated the acknowledgement that slavery was an interracial industry.

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 09:37 AM (OX9vb)

78 I remember one in which he talks about a fabulous gem whose existence is known to only three people, and he's one of them. I would love to read that story.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:30 AM (Om/di)

We're waiting too. So, start writing it!

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:38 AM (Angsy)

79 This technique can be done with protagonists as well as antagonists, like Moriarity.
Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 09:32 AM (H8Mi4)
----
Yep. R.A. Salvatore has played around with this a bit. After introducing the characters Artemis Entreri (once a villain, now an anti-hero) and Jarlaxle (mercenary anti-hero) in the Legends of Drizzt novels, he eventually teamed them both up in the Sellswords series to give them their own set of adventures that don't involve Drizzt.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 09:38 AM (BpYfr)

80 In "Young Ahab" we discover the real reason for the captain's mad search for the Racist White Whale was not that he lost his leg to the creature, but that he was a early crusader for DEI. Just look at the diversity of his crew on the Pequot. You don't get that by being a transphobic racist bigot homophobe hater.

Posted by: Call Me Fishsmell at March 19, 2023 09:39 AM (iayUP)

81 OK, missed a week for skiing (it was great) but I'm back to annoy. In the meantime I finished Wolf Hall by Hilary Mantel, and it was just a fantastic read, extremely well written with a fantastic story to tell. Just started the next book in the trilogy, Bring Up the Bodies. Somebody here a couple of weeks ago mentioned A Man For All Seasons and now I want to watch that to get the other side of the story, so to speak. But Mantel has pretty much assured that I will be on Thomas Cromwell's side. I also started Germinal by Zola and I've never read a more depressing description of labor conditions in my life. Bleak has never been a better descriptive. Read Talk SHow by Dick Cavett (a collection of online pieces he wrote for the NYT). Some of the anecdotes were good (especially those about Groucho Marx and John Wayne) but the writing was without any wit. His political pieces were about as astute as you'd expect form a talk show host and comedy writer (i.e. boring and predictable).

Posted by: who knew at March 19, 2023 09:40 AM (4I7VG)

82 Good morning fellow lovers of reading books late into the night.
I read Anne Cleeland's latest book in her Acton and Doyle series, Murder in Admonishment. I liked it better than her last one which seemed kind of confused. There was a weird part though. The characters kept referring back to a previous story so I went to my Kindle library. Apparently I have the books starting at book 3 except I know I owned all of them because the library didn't have any. Anne may have sent me a couple(she used to post here). Would that work differently from buying them?
Does Amazon take them back after a certain time? Did I miss something?

Posted by: Sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 19, 2023 09:40 AM (Y+l9t)

83 I have decided to relax the brain and read Jeeves and Wooster novels. Queens has a lot of Wodehouse's books.

Posted by: Jamaica NYC at March 19, 2023 09:41 AM (Eeb9P)

84 If the prequel/origin smacks of "We're doing this to get our hands on more money," then no, it doesn't work.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:31 AM (omVj0)

Aw crap! He's on to us.

Posted by: Outstretched Greedy Hands of Hollywood at March 19, 2023 09:41 AM (Angsy)

85 abrams and miller (for the star trek redux and solo) ruined the kobayashi maru and the kessel run) of course the clone wars could have gone on for three films if not for the wooden writing.

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 09:41 AM (PXvVL)

86 I liked timeline for the world building if the characters were sort of flat

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 09:42 AM (PXvVL)

87 Neverland is heaven and Peter Pan is an angel. Right.

Anyone can do this. Lord of the Flies takes place in Hell and all those children are children because they never grew up, i.e. they are dead.

No, wait, I've got it: The Hardy Brothers were Jesus and Saint Peter. And their chubby friend (what was his name? Chet?) was John the Baptist.

Ah, here's one: Watership Down wasn't really about rabbits. They were the inhabitants of Limbo in Dante's underworld. And Dante's Inferno was really about rabbits.

(Am I doing this right?)

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 09:42 AM (ykeLU)

88 Guten morgen horden!
Let's get this book party started!

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 09:43 AM (fUnHJ)

89 One great noodle incident is in Hamlet (some guy named Shakespeare) with the announcement late in the play that "Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are dead". Well, maybe that just ties up a loose end, given that R&G showed up and Hamlet gives instructions to have them killed. (pretty sure it was Hamlet). Then Tom Stoppard wrote his play about what happened. Great fan-fic.

Posted by: yara at March 19, 2023 09:43 AM (QdFtX)

90 "Cato the Elder swore by the urine of a person who ate cabbages"

St Patrick's day was hell at our house.

Posted by: Cato the Younger at March 19, 2023 09:43 AM (iayUP)

91 So, when the power went out a couple weeks ago, I opened the blackout curtains in the bedroom and laid down and read an actual paper book. I have a few things to choose from:

1) I could try to continue my 20 year slog of getting through all of Conquest's 'The Great Terror'.

2) Read the Latimore translation of the Illiad (and actually try to read the whole thing instead of selected passages.)

3) Dove back into Wheel of Time series.

Instead, I went with the literary version of White Castle: The Elenium series by David Eddings. Nothing great, just a fun read. It was fun.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 09:44 AM (zZu0s)

92 continued from 70 ...

Other illustrations in the Brambly Hedge books are also detailed: many individual mice in their own outfits, lots of touches in every room portrayed, etc. Charming in their own way, I imagine a child could be kept busy for a long time by telling them to find all the mice in the picture or point to the different foods in the drawing. Even the many, many flowers mentioned and drawn are accurate for the time and place and are completely recognizable. (Something the author tried for.)

I got "The Complete Brambly Hedge" in hardcover and it was worth every penny. This is a shining example of having the physical book over any digital version. It needs to be held in the hand, turning pages where each new page reveals new delights.

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 09:46 AM (7EjX1)

93 abrams and miller (for the star trek redux and solo) ruined the kobayashi maru and the kessel run) of course the clone wars could have gone on for three films if not for the wooden writing.
Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023

***
The first of Abrams's Trek movies had a few good things to recommend it -- the casting for one, and showing us how Kirk outmaneuvered the Maru test. So much else was terrible. Lens flares in scenes on the bridge (which looked like an Apple Store), Kirk as a juvenile delinquent before entering the Academy, the notion that it's okay to leave your post without permission if you have a reely reely good reason, and making McCoy a contemporary of Kirk and Spock and goes through the Academy with them.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:46 AM (omVj0)

94 I remember a book fair around 1994 where turow promoted his latest which seemed great but whem i read it

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 09:46 AM (PXvVL)

95 ...cont re: Ring Shout:

It's not a five star book by any stretch, but as a magical fantasy, it's all right. I think it could have been longer, with better story development. Needs an explanation of how the demons inhabit and turn human Klansmen, and more background on major characters. I'd give it three.

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 09:47 AM (OX9vb)

96 Perry Mason refers to his last hunting trip; apparently he's a lousy camp cook.

*******

I can't imagine Perry Mason wanting to get his wing tips muddy.

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 09:47 AM (ykeLU)

97 90 "Cato the Elder swore by the urine of a person who ate cabbages"

St Patrick's day was hell at our house.
Posted by: Cato the Younger at March 19, 2023 09:43 AM (iayUP)

Huh. I had to check, but cabbages were cultivated according to wiki probably sometime in Europe before 1000 BC.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 09:49 AM (zZu0s)

98 Perry Mason refers to his last hunting trip; apparently he's a lousy camp cook.

*******
I can't imagine Perry Mason wanting to get his wing tips muddy.
Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023

***
In the early novels (1934 to the war years), he's shown to be a pretty rugged guy and closer to a hardboiled detective hero in some aspects than he was to Raymond Burr's polished attorney.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:49 AM (omVj0)

99 @87 --

I've read that the creator of "Gilligan's Island" based the castaways on the Seven Deadly Sins.

Have fun assigning which to whom.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:50 AM (Om/di)

100 I also started Germinal by Zola and I've never read a more depressing description of labor conditions in my life. Bleak has never been a better descriptive.
Posted by: who knew

Zola was a master of setting the scene. Germinal was one of those books I read multiple times during my university days, though it was indeed depressing. There are twenty-something books in the Rougon-Maquart series, of which this is the most famous, but I have found only a half dozen translated into English. La Bete Humaine is probably my favorite of those I have read.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 09:50 AM (YY3n3)

101 I had a major character sacrifice himself heroically at the end of a novel. But he's such a vivid and lively fellow that I've been penning some short stories about his early career.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:37 AM (omVj0)

I know this has been done before: you can have him at the judgement seat recalling adventures to explain why he lived his life the way he did....

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:51 AM (Angsy)

102 80 In "Young Ahab" we discover the real reason for the captain's mad search for the Racist White Whale was not that he lost his leg to the creature, but that he was a early crusader for DEI. Just look at the diversity of his crew on the Pequot. You don't get that by being a transphobic racist bigot homophobe hater.
Posted by: Call Me Fishsmell at March 19, 2023 09:39 AM (iayUP)

Huh. I would have thought that Capn Ahab was based AF.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 09:51 AM (zZu0s)

103 Morning Hoard.
I actually started to do some writing, well organizing of notes and scribbles. I'm constantly writing just not in a way that would make scence to anyone... including me a few months later.

Story will take place in 1320 up to 1360 ish or so. Court of King Edward III. London and Cambridge.

I'm going to try and nail down whether or not the Austins who arrived in the Americas in the 1620's are direct decendents of the Black Prince and The Fair Maiden of Kent, Joan. I argue they are and have enough circumstantial evidence but I want to prove it... as much as possable.

This has been a 5 year project so far that started with me wanting to do custom geneology charts/posters for all my neices and nephews for a Christmes present. I had no idea the rabbit hole I was diving down. A more apt description would be briar patch I threw myself into.

Working title Kindergaten of the King. A semi histoical novel of one womens magnetic charm and the 3 men who loved her.

I am actually surprised Joan of Kent isn't featured in history more than she is. She really punched above her weight. Fathered Richard II.

I think therin is the story I want to try and bring out.

Posted by: Reforger, him who confuses kings at March 19, 2023 09:51 AM (Ragqh)

104 I've read that the creator of "Gilligan's Island" based the castaways on the Seven Deadly Sins.

Have fun assigning which to whom.
Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023

***
In the relatively early days of the Internet, somebody wrote a Friends fan fiction script (in teleplay form) where the six Friends are cast (in a dream of Monica's, I think) as characters from the Wizard of Oz. I haven't been able to find it again. But it did capture the spirit and dialog of the Friends series, i.e., it was actually funny.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:52 AM (omVj0)

105 Sometimes a whale is just a whale.

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 09:53 AM (ykeLU)

106 One of the best examples of characters having a story after the story ends is Sam Gamgee at the end of LOTR. The appendices mention later matters for some of the characters: Legolas and Gimli, Merry and Pippen, Aragorn. Any of them could be made into their own books as follow-ons to the original.

Want to try some VERY speculative fiction? What happens to Tom Bombadil (if anything) after the events of LOTR? (Of course, first you might have to figure out what the heck he is.)

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 09:54 AM (7EjX1)

107 I know this has been done before: you can have him at the judgement seat recalling adventures to explain why he lived his life the way he did....
Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023

***
A grand idea! A sort of envelope for a novel-length story, encompassing the earlier tales in between his explanations!

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:54 AM (omVj0)

108 I've read that the creator of "Gilligan's Island" based the castaways on the Seven Deadly Sins.

Have fun assigning which to whom.
Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:50 AM (Om/di)

Ooooooo.

Gilligan: Sloth
Skipper: Rage
Mr. Howell: Greed
Professor: Pride
Ginger: Vanity
Mrs Howell: Despair?
Mary Ann: Lust?

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 09:54 AM (zZu0s)

109 66 I read two books by Immaculée Ilibagiza, Left to Tell and Led by Faith.
Posted by: Notsothoreau at March 19, 2023 09:31 AM (6lj/r)

I read Left To Tell some years ago. I do like personal memoirs, especially those of triumph over adversity. Maybe it's a little like self-flagellation to read these, but I think it is important to understand what life is like for people less fortunate than myself, and it increases my gratitude.

I didn't realize she wrote a second book--will definitely read it.

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 09:54 AM (OX9vb)

110 One of the books I read this week, Sherlock Holmes and the Giant Rat of Sumatra is one of many attempts to describe a "Noodle Incident" mentioned in passing in the Sherlock Holmes Case Book story "The Adventure of the Sussex Vampire."

The writer June Thompson has done a number of Sherlockian pastiches (The Secret Chronicles of Sherlock Holmes, The Secret Files of Sherlock Holmes and so forth) and did one on the Giant Rat. The Rat - rather, "Rats" - are real, specially bred man-eating specimens that a mad scientists threatens to let loose in the East End unless he is paid a massive ransom by the British government.

IMO, very few writers can capture Conan Doyle's 'voice.' Thompson stumbles sometimes, but in general manages to pull off the trick very well. She is also a masterful plotter.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 19, 2023 09:55 AM (AW0uW)

111 Catch up comment:

"When you read a story, do you ever get a sense that you are just seeing a very tiny slice of the main character's life?'

* In the well written books I do

"Bring Me the Head of Prince Charming"

* I need to find this

"The premise is that every thousand years, the forces of Good and Evil have a contest to see who will dominate for the next thousand years. An argument could be made that the forces of Good may have lost in AD 2000."

*Aiyeeeee

"

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 09:55 AM (fUnHJ)

112 Want to try some VERY speculative fiction? What happens to Tom Bombadil (if anything) after the events of LOTR? (Of course, first you might have to figure out what the heck he is.)
Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 09:54 AM (7EjX1)
---
Good luck with that! Tolkien himself didn't know what Tom Bombadil was...

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 09:56 AM (BpYfr)

113 @98 --

And Paul Drake in the books is nothing like William Hopper's civilized tough guy.

One of the few examples in which the adaptation is better than the original.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 09:56 AM (Om/di)

114 Chris pine isnt a match for shatner as for quinto omg a disaster. Of course the kelvin timeline us the culprit

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 09:57 AM (PXvVL)

115 Saw this in Bring Up the Bodies: "If in the late wars of York and Lancaster, their fathers and grandfathers picked the wrong side, they keep quiet about it. A generation on, lapses must be forgiven, reputations remade; otherwise England cannot go forward, she will keep spiraling backwards into the dirty past" You can apply this to the current world as you see fit.

Posted by: who knew at March 19, 2023 09:58 AM (4I7VG)

116 "The premise is that every thousand years, the forces of Good and Evil have a contest to see who will dominate for the next thousand years. An argument could be made that the forces of Good may have lost in AD 2000."

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 09:55 AM (fUnHJ)

Sorry to drag this around to Fantasy again, but the cyclical nature of these things was a great concept that was included in Dragon Age: Origins. I really liked the idea that they knew the struggle would keep on occurring and that the Wardens were the foot soldiers of that ever present conflict.

They had done something similar with the Reapers in Mass Effect which is why I think they downplayed it in the sequels to Dragon Age, but I really liked that Manichean kind of idea (even though it might be heretical.)

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 09:58 AM (zZu0s)

117 I would say the pretext and into darkness should have put everyone involved in an agonizer

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 09:59 AM (PXvVL)

118 Gilligan: Rudolph
Skipper: Donner UND Blitzen
Ginger: Dancer
Mary Ann: Vixen
Mrs Howell: Comet
Mr. Howell: Gumpy
Professor: Doc

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 09:59 AM (ykeLU)

119 114 Chris pine isnt a match for shatner as for quinto omg a disaster. Of course the kelvin timeline us the culprit
Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 09:57 AM (PXvVL)

This is all the fault of JJ Abrams, may his bones be broken.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 09:59 AM (zZu0s)

120 I could try to continue my 20 year slog of getting through all of Conquest's 'The Great Terror'.

Posted by: Aetius451AD

If you want a shorter, but more horrendous Conquest story, pick up a copy of 'Kolyma, The Arctic Death Camps'. It documents the transportation and working to death of hundreds of thousands of political prisoners in the Soviet far east. The Soviets lost about a quarter of their prisoners before they even reached the camps.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 09:59 AM (YY3n3)

121 I hate metaphors. They're big blatant obvious midwit English teacher bait, and they make the story pointless.

Example: I'm apparently the only person in the USA who wasn't all that impressed by the movie Everything Everywhere All At Once. Nice acting, good cast . . . but the whole thing was such an obvious metaphor (and I'm sure that's why midwit movie reviewers and Academy members loved it) that it made me absolutely not care. None of it was "real" -- any more than the personifications of Virtue or Justice in a Renaissance masque were supposed to be real.

I wanted a story that took the concept of alternate universes seriously, and what I got was hot dog fingers.

Posted by: Trimegistus at March 19, 2023 09:59 AM (QZxDR)

122 Wolfus,

That was Sterling Lanier, and the story was "A Father's Tale" in the July '74 F&SF (and according to isfdb.org also included in the anthology SHERLOCK HOLMES THROUGH TIME AND SPACE). Think I may have read it but I've slept since then and don't remember any details at all.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023 10:00 AM (a/4+U)

123 If you want a shorter, but more horrendous Conquest story, pick up a copy of 'Kolyma, The Arctic Death Camps'. It documents the transportation and working to death of hundreds of thousands of political prisoners in the Soviet far east. The Soviets lost about a quarter of their prisoners before they even reached the camps.
Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 09:59 AM (YY3n3)

Kolyma was that one on the island in the river, right?

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:01 AM (zZu0s)

124 Sorry to drag this around to Fantasy again, but the cyclical nature of these things was a great concept that was included in Dragon Age: Origins. I really liked the idea that they knew the struggle would keep on occurring and that the Wardens were the foot soldiers of that ever present conflict.

They had done something similar with the Reapers in Mass Effect which is why I think they downplayed it in the sequels to Dragon Age, but I really liked that Manichean kind of idea (even though it might be heretical.)
Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 09:58 AM (zZu0s)
---
The cyclical nature of time is hardly confined to fantasy literature, though it does show up there quite frequently (e.g., The Wheel of Time). It extends deep into both physics and philosophy. As the saying goes, history doesn't repeat itself but it often rhymes.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 10:01 AM (BpYfr)

125 But now, one of them seems to be ripe for following in further stories.
Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 09:29 AM (Angsy)

***

The Continuing Misadventures of H** L** H**

Kinda like A Series of Unfortunate Events

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 10:02 AM (fUnHJ)

126 I can't imagine Perry Mason wanting to get his wing tips muddy.

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 09:47 AM (ykeLU)

No mud where Raymond Burr did his "hunting."

Posted by: Raymond Burr is so fat.... at March 19, 2023 10:02 AM (Angsy)

127 @108 --

I'd classify Ginger as Lust (although I'm a Mary Ann man).

But you make a good argument.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 10:02 AM (Om/di)

128 23 ... "The early Matt Helm books had references to past missions we never got to read, including one in Cuba."

In that vein, Keith Wease wrote "Matt Helm: The War Years". He took many of the references to his WW II exploits in the earlier books and fills them out. Wease does a creditable job with the details and with capturing Donald Hamilton's tone. If you are a Matt Helm fan, it is worth the read.

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 10:03 AM (7EjX1)

129 And akiva goldman they did good with fringe at least for a time

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 10:03 AM (PXvVL)

130 "Everything Everywhere All At Once" was, for me, simply a science/paranormal fantasy-comedy. I found myself laughing more than I do most films that bill themselves as comedies.
But, if you are looking for loose ends to get tied up, keep looking.

Posted by: gourmand du jour binge watching Celtic Woman at March 19, 2023 10:03 AM (jTmQV)

131 That was Sterling Lanier, and the story was "A Father's Tale" in the July '74 F&SF (and according to isfdb.org also included in the anthology SHERLOCK HOLMES THROUGH TIME AND SPACE). Think I may have read it but I've slept since then and don't remember any details at all.
Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023

***
That sounds right -- I was reading F & SF quite often in those days. Thanks!

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 10:04 AM (omVj0)

132 127 @108 --

I'd classify Ginger as Lust (although I'm a Mary Ann man).

But you make a good argument.
Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 10:02 AM (Om/di)

I 'think' Ginger works better as Vanity because she is concerned about her looks than Mary Ann (either would work as Lust.) Despair also limps for Mrs Howell, but she is the one who was usually the most worried about things. The others are trivial.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:05 AM (zZu0s)

133 I don't know about a thousand years... It could happen. Certainly evil will reign supreme for at least a couple hundred. That's inevitable. Western Civ is in its death throes, and China/Asia is unable to carry the torch we've dropped. Islam is the likeliest contender for the next dominant civilization and they are not morally or intellectually prepared to be a decent steward of global order. Buckle up, world.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at March 19, 2023 10:06 AM (oINRc)

134 I just finished Way Station, a 1963 Hugo award winning novel by Clifford D. Simak. He managed to grab my attention by the second page.

He tells an interesting story and keeps things moving. At least 3.5 out of 5 stars. Ymmv.

Posted by: GnuBreed at March 19, 2023 10:07 AM (JOtiF)

135 Mentions of past elements, not even cases, in a character's life round him out. We know, for instance, that Spenser was in Korea; Napoleon Solo was too. (I always wanted to see a crossover where the young Lt. Solo passes through the 4077th MASH and charms Margaret Houlihan.) Lord Peter Wimsey suffered a certain amount of shell shock from WWI.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 10:07 AM (omVj0)

136 OT, but we are over 100. I got woken up this morning to multiple phone calls at the site. I was thinking the plant was on fire or someone got shot, but one of the most trusted employees and the supervisor got into it.

So, I decided to take a drive this morning and happened to stop by. What a coincidence!

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:07 AM (zZu0s)

137 I hate metaphors. They're big blatant obvious midwit English teacher bait, and they make the story pointless.

Posted by: Trimegistus

*******

I think I'm with you. The story should be the garment, full of colorful threads and rich faabric that you hang on the metaphor, which serves as a coatrack which serves to support the story. As opposed to the metaphor being the shoehorn that squeezes the story into a shoe that doesn't quite fit.

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 10:08 AM (ykeLU)

138 Take person of interest, thsy took the plot of winter soldier seriously the deep state ai, the nolans did this over several seasons they flopped over westworld

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 10:08 AM (PXvVL)

139 Ok, point blank: is the Man From Uncle movie worth while? I was looking at getting Maverick and wondered about that one as well.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:08 AM (zZu0s)

140 Kolyma was that one on the island in the river, right?
Posted by: Aetius451AD

It was a goldd mining area to the north of Magadan. Prisoners were taken by converted freighters, thousands stacked like cordwood in the holds. Periodically, a ship would get iced in, in which case only the crew would be evacuated, and the the following spring, new prisoners would be tasked with cleaning out the bodies of the prisoners from the unsuccessful voyage.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 10:10 AM (Qg9GY)

141 @128 --

Keith Wease wrote "Matt Helm: The War Years"

I know of that book. A copy will be mine someday.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 10:10 AM (Om/di)

142 I hate metaphors. They're big blatant obvious midwit English teacher bait, and they make the story pointless.

Posted by: Trimegistus

Tolkien thought the same about allegory.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:10 AM (zZu0s)

143 I thought it was, as a back story ehich borrows elements from moonraker thd book

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 10:10 AM (PXvVL)

144 It was a goldd mining area to the north of Magadan. Prisoners were taken by converted freighters, thousands stacked like cordwood in the holds. Periodically, a ship would get iced in, in which case only the crew would be evacuated, and the the following spring, new prisoners would be tasked with cleaning out the bodies of the prisoners from the unsuccessful voyage.
Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 10:10 AM (Qg9GY)

Got to love the Soviets. Less mechanized and methodical than the Nazis, but it worked out the same way.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:11 AM (zZu0s)

145 Currently hopping around in a book of interviews with Dana Gioia and in Gioia's poetry -- good stuff. I shouldn't read books of interviews with writers I like, because they always wind up mentioning other writers I haven't read or meant to revisit. Then I start browsing through those books instead of the ones I told myself were next on the agenda. (BLEAK HOUSE and ANNA KARENINA are glaring at me from the kindle even as I type this post.)

Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023 10:13 AM (a/4+U)

146 Ok, point blank: is the Man From Uncle movie worth while? I was looking at getting Maverick and wondered about that one as well.
Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023

***
It is. It captures the spirit of the original, but even if you know nothing about it, the film is a high-spirited Cold War spy story with humor, grand performances, and great chemistry between Cavill's Solo and Hammer's Illya.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 10:13 AM (omVj0)

147 The story proves the metaphor, not the other way around.

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 10:13 AM (ykeLU)

148 Currently hopping around in a book of interviews with Dana Gioia and in Gioia's poetry -- good stuff. I shouldn't read books of interviews with writers I like, because they always wind up mentioning other writers I haven't read or meant to revisit. Then I start browsing through those books instead of the ones I told myself were next on the agenda. (BLEAK HOUSE and ANNA KARENINA are glaring at me from the kindle even as I type this post.)
Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023 10:13 AM (a/4+U)
---
I dunno...I think it can be fascinating to read about the authors that influenced other authors. Those writers they mention almost certainly had an effect on their own writing, so they might be worth investigating to find out WHY they were influential.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 10:14 AM (BpYfr)

149 I start browsing through those books instead of the ones I told myself were next on the agenda.

This is the story of the Book Thread.

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 10:16 AM (Om/di)

150 There was no surviving Kolyma. Very few did.

Posted by: runner at March 19, 2023 10:18 AM (V13WU)

151 "When you read a story, do you ever get a sense that you are just seeing a very tiny slice of the main character's life?'

* In the well written books I do

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 09:55 AM (fUnHJ)

Until I read some Star Trek book or post a few years ago discussing it, I never really considered that. The gist was that even though the episode had a happy ending, there really isn't a happy ending because it was just one incident in a character's life. That would certainly apply to a continuing set of stories about a character, say like Harry.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 10:19 AM (Angsy)

152 @110 --

MP4, glad to see you're back!

Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 10:19 AM (Om/di)

153 148 -- Perfessor, it is fascinating. Almost too fascinating. I'm kinda trying to cut back book acquisitions at this point -- if I never bought another book, I'd still have enough on the bookshelf and the kindle to last until I'm planted. Probably enough to last my grandkids until they're planted too. Can't help it, though -- I've always been a sucker for writers' shop talk and comments on their own favorites.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023 10:19 AM (a/4+U)

154 My birdbath is still frozen.

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:23 AM (T4tVD)

155 Perfessor, it is fascinating. Almost too fascinating. I'm kinda trying to cut back book acquisitions at this point -- if I never bought another book, I'd still have enough on the bookshelf and the kindle to last until I'm planted. Probably enough to last my grandkids until they're planted too. Can't help it, though -- I've always been a sucker for writers' shop talk and comments on their own favorites.
Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023 10:19 AM (a/4+U)
---
Same here...I was reading an introduction Philip Jose Farmer wrote for a series he coordinated with other authors. He took all of his influences, tossed them in a blender, and then got several other authors to turn out a weird, wonderful series of adventures...

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 10:23 AM (BpYfr)

156 Good morning Horde. Rereading The Best and The Brightist. Halberstram was a leftist but this book is well researched. The thing that pops up is that these guys were probably the best but they walked themselves right into a mess. The collection of ideological loons in the Biden administration is no where near the best and therefore the damage they are doing will be horrific

Posted by: Smell the Glove at March 19, 2023 10:24 AM (NJxWu)

157 134 I just finished Way Station, a 1963 Hugo award winning novel by Clifford D. Simak. He managed to grab my attention by the second page.

**"

Read that as a kid and still remember the sense of humbled awe it gave me.

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 10:24 AM (fUnHJ)

158 No he had it entirely wrong see moyar

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 10:25 AM (PXvVL)

159 The world was not prepared for the Giant Rat of Scranton.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 10:25 AM (FVME7)

160 121 ... "I hate metaphors. They're big blatant obvious midwit English teacher bait, and they make the story pointless."

This sounds like Tolkien explaining why he dislikes allegory. Allegory, or in this case metaphor, means the writer is trying to make a point and tries to control the reader. Tolkien preferred telling the story and letting the reader find his own comparisons and personal connections.

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 10:26 AM (7EjX1)

161 Don Rickles was the Giant Rat of Sinatra.

NO ONE was safe from him !

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:28 AM (T4tVD)

162 Last weekend my father came up for a visit, and as usual during his visits, in the evening I retreated from the living room up to my bedroom to read a short Robert E Howard story. This time it was "The Blood of Belshazzar" from the 'Sword Woman' collection.....By Crom, there were more named characters in that story than there were pages! I'm not sure if readers were expected to keep track of all those characters (most of whom just died) or if we were just supposed to nod along and assume that the author knew what he was doing....

Posted by: Castle Guy at March 19, 2023 10:30 AM (Lhaco)

163 The Continuing Misadventures of H** L** H**

Kinda like A Series of Unfortunate Events

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 10:02 AM (fUnHJ)

Wrote a third, then deleted it. Too big of a plot hole to fix. Thinking whether to come up with an idea, then write, or a title and try to write to it.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 10:30 AM (Angsy)

164 I'm currently reading Below Zero by C.J. Box.
A Joe Pickett novel , the Game Warden of Wyoming.

Its pretty good.

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:30 AM (T4tVD)

165 I clicked on the pic link - the photos are something else. I'd love to visit in person

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 10:31 AM (fUnHJ)

166 Empire by Niall Ferguson.

-
I've forgotten the details but he was cancelled for racism years ago for some innocuous comment (despite the fact that he is married to a black women).

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 10:31 AM (FVME7)

167 I dislike allegory because he is a bloated hypocrite who flies on private jets to climate conferences and wrote that An Inconvenient Truth abomination.

To his credit though, he was the inspiration for Love Story and he coined the phrase world wide web.

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 10:32 AM (ykeLU)

168 Posted by: Weak Geek at March 19, 2023 10:19 AM (Om/di)

Thanks. Just popping in here.

Much, much too depressed and angry to show up and keep repeating myself on the regular threads. No one listens, anyway.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 19, 2023 10:33 AM (AW0uW)

169 I just finished Special Operations, a Badge of Honor book by W.E.B. Griffin.

It was good as well.

About cops in Philadelphia.

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:34 AM (T4tVD)

170 154 My birdbath is still frozen.
Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:23 AM (T4tVD)

---------

It's shaping up to be a bad day for the bookies in Vegas.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero43) at March 19, 2023 10:35 AM (Qzn2/)

171 Much, much too depressed and angry to show up and keep repeating myself on the regular threads. No one listens, anyway.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 19, 2023 10:33 AM (AW0uW)

Ohhhhhh, we listen, all right. j/k

It's good to see you. Is it pissing you off more not to have a place to vent or less?

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:35 AM (zZu0s)

172 Long-time lurker. I love the book thread. I’ve been reading The Lord of the Rings chronologically, reading about the events on the day they happened. That worked fine for volume one, which occurs Sep-Feb, but not so much volumes two and three, which are packed into March. Let’s just say we won’t be throwing the Ring into Mt. Doom on Mar 25. I suppose that idea works better for some books than others. Not so much with Gibbon for instance.

Posted by: Norrin Radd at March 19, 2023 10:36 AM (smRzi)

173 I hope you have half as much fun writing your essays as I do reading them, Perfessor.

Posted by: Wenda at March 19, 2023 10:36 AM (Tzk4s)

174 Man From UNCLE was a souffle that didn't rise. Not bad, but something was missing so it wasn't great

Posted by: Ignoramus at March 19, 2023 10:36 AM (RqMSv)

175 For those who like their mysteries a little different, I would recommend Polar Star, by Martin Cruz Smith. This is a follow up to the best seller Gorky Park. Inspector Renko is now a prisoner of the Soviet union, and assigned as a laborer on a fish catching/processing ship in the north Pacific. The ship is coordinating with American fishing ships in the new detente. A mysterious death takes place, and Renko, who is known to have been a police inspector, is asked to help solve the mystery. Smith always shows Renko to be sometimes stumbling, and sometimes brilliant, and this theme continues in Polar Star. One never knows if Renko is about to crack the case open or be killed for getting into a bad situation with no backup. I found it to be a very enjoyable read, in fact I liked it better than Gorky Park.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 10:36 AM (mwX6k)

176 One of the nice things about the sf/horror/mystery fields was always the generosity to other writers. Interviews with them always seemed to contain recommendations of other writers, and they weren't always other genre writers -- often they pointed back to writers that had been almost ruined by classrooms and so prompted a second look. Just the question on influences in 1969's DOUBLE-BILL SYMPOSIUM questionnaire to sf writers provided enough recommended reading to last for years.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023 10:36 AM (a/4+U)

177 The book starts with an anecdote of a family drinking party just as the National Socialists were all running for the exits in Hungary.

-
Although I don't remember the details, I recall reading of a similar drinking party during Gotterdammerung awaiting the Russian forces although this was a German family. During the debauchery, a few of the celebrants leave to kill a few Jews imprisoned at a nearby rail station because why not?

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 10:39 AM (FVME7)

178 I hope you have half as much fun writing your essays as I do reading them, Perfessor.
Posted by: Wenda at March 19, 2023 10:36 AM (Tzk4s)
---
It's always a challenge to find a good topic. But if the regular COBs (CBD, Buck Throckmorton, Joe Mannix) can do it a few times a week, then I should be able to figure *something* to write once a week. I'm glad you enjoy my little screeds!

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 10:39 AM (BpYfr)

179 Mfu is a caper film that is supposed to be an origin story hugh grant beling the character that funds uncle

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 10:40 AM (PXvVL)

180 vmom have at it, but don't take electronic devices you like to keep

Posted by: Skip at March 19, 2023 10:40 AM (xhxe8)

181 I dunno...I think it can be fascinating to read about the authors that influenced other authors. Those writers they mention almost certainly had an effect on their own writing, so they might be worth investigating to find out WHY they were influential.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 10:14 AM (BpYfr)

That might work with dead authors, but I'd shy away from currently active ones because you know at some time during the interview they'll have to disparage Trump and his supporters....

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 10:41 AM (Angsy)

182 I liked it better than Gorky Park.

-
Gorky Park is one of my all time favorite mysteries although the movie sucks donkey dongs.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 10:43 AM (FVME7)

183 It ain't warm out thar, Skip !

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:43 AM (T4tVD)

184 That might work with dead authors, but I'd shy away from currently active ones because you know at some time during the interview they'll have to disparage Trump and his supporters....
Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 10:41 AM (Angsy)
---
Sadly true. But then, I don't read much contemporary fiction (fantasy, science fiction, horror, mystery, etc.) these days.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 10:44 AM (BpYfr)

185 Books with aliens as characters turn me right off. To me, it seems like the author cannot move the plot along or say what he wants to say within the confines of reality, so he has to resort to aliens. I like when the author stretches within the limits, not resorting to coloring outside the lines to cover the material. Just my opinion.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:44 AM (45fpk)

186 vmom have at it, but don't take electronic devices you like to keep
Posted by: Skip

But bring your fave stabber, in case ya hafta peel a potato or sumpin'.

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:45 AM (T4tVD)

187 25 here.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:45 AM (zZu0s)

188 Much, much too depressed and angry to show up and keep repeating myself on the regular threads. No one listens, anyway.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing

Anyone who isn't depressed and angry doesn't understand the situation.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 10:45 AM (FVME7)

189 Hiya Grammie !

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:45 AM (T4tVD)

190 186 vmom have at it, but don't take electronic devices you like to keep
Posted by: Skip

But bring your fave stabber, in case ya hafta peel a potato or sumpin'.
Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:45 AM (T4tVD)

And by 'Potato', he means Irishmen.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:46 AM (zZu0s)

191 Hiya JT!

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:46 AM (45fpk)

192 My Zoom book club is reading The Forever War by Joe Haldeman.

It is informed by his experience in Vietnam. And coming home.

Weird how he thought by the 2020s the world would be using weird pronouns for people because so much gay.

Posted by: blaster at March 19, 2023 10:46 AM (pwExq)

193 Raked up sawdust, it's cold windy so came back to book and thread

Posted by: Skip at March 19, 2023 10:46 AM (xhxe8)

194 All I have is Firesign Theaters “Tale of the Giant Rat of Sumatra” with Hemlock Stones and Dr Flotsam

Posted by: FortWorthMike at March 19, 2023 10:47 AM (wbIlJ)

195 4 Man From UNCLE was a souffle that didn't rise.

*******

soufflé translates as breath or more loosely, whisper. So, what we call a heart murmur, in French is known as a Soufflé au coeur or whisper of the heart. Spanish uses the word soplo (to blow). But German being German, heart murmur is framed as Herzgeräusch (literally "heart noise")

So Romance languages render it as the lovely "Heart whisper" or "breath of the heart", and German is the much more industrial "Heart noise"

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 10:48 AM (ykeLU)

196 Books with aliens as characters turn me right off. To me, it seems like the author cannot move the plot along or say what he wants to say within the confines of reality, so he has to resort to aliens.

-
I feel the same regarding billionaires. They can't make an interesting interesting story with interesting characters so let's make him a billionaire.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 10:48 AM (FVME7)

197 Polar Star, by Martin Cruz Smith. ...I liked it better than Gorky Park.
Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 10:36 AM (mwX6k)

I like the Renko series very much. I think when it's my turn for family book club, I'll recommend Gorky Park. Get the millennials out of the woke rut.

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 10:48 AM (OX9vb)

198 After watching "Twelve O'Clock High" last weekend I decided my knowledge of the 8th Air Force was woefully lacking. Currently reading "Masters of the Air" by Donald L. Miller.

Posted by: Tuna at March 19, 2023 10:49 AM (gLRfa)

199 It's good to see you. Is it pissing you off more not to have a place to vent or less?

At this point, frankly, I'm done. I know despair is a sin, but I've given up on any meaningful resolution to the coming apocalypse. And I'm sick of my own life these days, as well.

I plan especially to stay offline once The Donald has cuffs slapped on him. The orgasmic screams from the left and the shrugged-shoulder response of the right will be beyond endurance. I should be writing, but all I want to do lately is get stupidly falling-down drunk and forget everything.

Anyway, I'm re-reading Nixon: The Life by John Farrell (well-done and even-handed, BTW). Think I'll make some tea, cut a thick siice of soda bread and hide for the rest of the day.

Hope you all have a lovely weekend.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 19, 2023 10:49 AM (AW0uW)

200 FFS, Insty, you have a story about Trump being perp walked and then have Ed shill for PJ membership with the code 'Loyalty'?!

You guys are fucking hopeless retards.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:51 AM (zZu0s)

201 Hope you all have a lovely weekend.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 19, 2023 10:49 AM (AW0uW)

You too man. Don't give in to the despair.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:52 AM (zZu0s)

202 If you want a shorter, but more horrendous Conquest story, pick up a copy of 'Kolyma, The Arctic Death Camps'. It documents the transportation and working to death of hundreds of thousands of political prisoners in the Soviet far east. The Soviets lost about a quarter of their prisoners before they even reached the camps.
Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 19, 2023 09:59 AM (YY3n3)

Kolyma was that one on the island in the river, right?
Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:01 AM (zZu0s)

A better read might be "Kolyma Tales" by Varlam Shalamov, a guy who was actually a prisoner there.

Short, grim tales about survival there.

Not the feel good book of the year.

And...

Good morning! Late to the book thread today.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 10:52 AM (L1tQx)

203 Hope you all have a lovely weekend.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 19, 2023 10:49 AM (AW0uW)

You as well, Mr. Poppins. I don't hang around much for the political threads either. Bad for my disposition. I do enjoy seeing you here.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:53 AM (45fpk)

204 Moyar pointed out that diem had thingd under control thr buddhists were mostly drama queens

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 10:54 AM (PXvVL)

205 When did despair become one of the seven deadly sins?

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 10:54 AM (ykeLU)

206 You as well, Mr. Poppins. I don't hang around much for the political threads either. Bad for my disposition. I do enjoy seeing you here.
Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:53 AM (45fpk)

Second that emotion!

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 10:55 AM (OX9vb)

207 When did despair become one of the seven deadly sins?

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 10:54 AM (ykeLU)

Last Thursday.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:55 AM (45fpk)

208 204 Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 10:54 AM (PXvVL)

They still set themselves on fire for fun occasionally.

You could see a lot of today's idiocy in the smoke back then.

Posted by: sven at March 19, 2023 10:55 AM (Lzpvj)

209 Gilligan: Rudolph
Skipper: Donner UND Blitzen
Ginger: Dancer
Mary Ann: Vixen
Mrs Howell: Comet
Mr. Howell: Gumpy
Professor: Doc

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 09:59 AM (ykeLU)

Smart Alec...and just who is Alec?

Posted by: BignJames at March 19, 2023 10:55 AM (AwYPR)

210 @195

Does language make the people, or do people make the language.

Germans are generally humorless, and even souless

Posted by: Ignoramus at March 19, 2023 10:56 AM (RqMSv)

211 Germans are generally humorless, and even souless

Posted by: Ignoramus at March 19, 2023 10:56 AM (RqMSv)

And then there are the Finns.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:57 AM (45fpk)

212 "Second that emotion!"

Third that emotion

Lately the highlights of my week days are the Art Thread and the evening Cafe.

Posted by: Tuna at March 19, 2023 10:57 AM (gLRfa)

213 And by 'Potato', he means Irishmen.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:46 AM (zZu0s)

Whew! That's a relief!

Posted by: Brian Stelter at March 19, 2023 10:57 AM (Angsy)

214 Hope you all have a lovely weekend.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 19, 2023 10:49 AM (AW0uW)

You too man. Don't give in to the despair.
Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop

Seconded !

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 10:58 AM (T4tVD)

215 So Romance languages render it as the lovely "Heart whisper" or "breath of the heart", and German is the much more industrial "Heart noise"
Posted by: Muldoon

Butterfly in French is papillon, in Spanish mariposa, in German Schmetterling. Sounds like an attacking infernal machine. "Prepare the big guns! The Schmetterlings are coming!"

What I just learned from Urban Dictionary: Schmetterling is a German cuss word, created recently, as an urban swear. The definition roughly translates to “b*tch-f*ck”.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 10:58 AM (FVME7)

216 205 When did despair become one of the seven deadly sins?
Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 10:54 AM (ykeLU)

Doh! Devotions, that were trimmed to the Seven deadly sins.
Gula (gluttony)
Luxuria/Fornicatio (lust, fornication)
Avaritia (avarice/greed)
Tristitia (sorrow/despair/despondency)
Ira (wrath)
Acedia (sloth)
Vanagloria (vainglory)
Superbia (pride, hubris)

Gluttony made the cut, sorrow did not.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 10:58 AM (zZu0s)

217 I, too, like "Polar Star" better than "Gorky Park".

Bu-u-u-ut, the story wouldn't have worked half as well without the set-up and character established in "Gorky Park".

So, there you go.

The later Arkady Renko novels aren't half as good. The fall of the Soviet Union let all the air out of his stories. The one set in Cuba was it for me. Lousy.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 10:59 AM (L1tQx)

218 70

[The Brambly Hedge Books]

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 09:34 AM (7EjX1)

Turns out we had 'The High Hills' from that series hanging around my parents' house. They got it back out for my nieces/nephews, and I paged through it recently. Greaaaaaat illustrations. Everything has that cluttered homestead feel to it. Food and supplies hanging from the ceiling and stuffed in every nook and cranny of the house.

...The illustrations had a very Redwall-before-the-siege vibe.

Posted by: Castle Guy at March 19, 2023 10:59 AM (Lhaco)

219 Books with aliens as characters turn me right off. To me, it seems like the author cannot move the plot along or say what he wants to say within the confines of reality, so he has to resort to aliens. I like when the author stretches within the limits, not resorting to coloring outside the lines to cover the material. Just my opinion.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:44 AM (45fpk)

Joo no like my book, Run For The Border?

Posted by: Hose A Himenez at March 19, 2023 11:00 AM (Angsy)

220 I did buy a copy of History of the Ancient World. And I recently picked up The Way of Beauty by David Clayton. The problem is that I don't seem to have time to read unless I'm sick.

Posted by: Notsothoreau at March 19, 2023 11:00 AM (6lj/r)

221 When did despair become one of the seven deadly sins?

Posted by: Muldoon

I have read that sloth includes the concept of despair.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:01 AM (FVME7)

222 Sooooo. Maybe:

Gluttony for Mary Ann (all those coconut cream pies.*)

Vanity for Mrs Howell.

Lust for Ginger?

*glad I added 'coconut' to that at the last minute.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 11:01 AM (zZu0s)

223 181 & 184 -- Probably true. But I find I'm not reading a whole lot of contemporary work these days so I'm not watching for interviews or commentaries from the current crop of writers, just people I've already been reading for some years. I look at my bookshelves and find that most of my favorites are dead and the ones that aren't are well up there in years and not likely to be active too much longer.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023 11:02 AM (a/4+U)

224 The one set in Cuba was it for me. Lousy.
Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 10:59 AM (L1tQx)

True. I know I read that, but it was so bad I don't even remember it.

Posted by: Dash my lace wigs! at March 19, 2023 11:02 AM (OX9vb)

225 Books with aliens as characters turn me right off. To me, it seems like the author cannot move the plot along or say what he wants to say within the confines of reality, so he has to resort to aliens. I like when the author stretches within the limits, not resorting to coloring outside the lines to cover the material. Just my opinion.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:44 AM (45fpk)

Give "Roadside Picnic" a whirl.

The aliens are never seen. They came and left leaving behind their garbage so to speak.

The story is about the human characters reaction to something they can't or can barely understand.

One of the Greatest SF stories in my opinion. And a novella, so a quickie read.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 11:03 AM (L1tQx)

226 Despair: Trying on last summer's shorts and seeing that new shorts are in my future.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 11:04 AM (45fpk)

227 After watching "Twelve O'Clock High" last weekend I decided my knowledge of the 8th Air Force was woefully lacking. Currently reading "Masters of the Air" by Donald L. Miller.
Posted by: Tuna

I loved that book. HBO has threatening to make a series from it for decades.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:04 AM (FVME7)

228 One of the Greatest SF stories in my opinion. And a novella, so a quickie read.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 11:03 AM (L1tQx)

Thanks! I'll see if my library has it.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 11:05 AM (45fpk)

229 Gluttony made the cut, sorrow did not.
Posted by: Aetius451AD

*******

So despair is to deadly sins like Rudolph is to reindeer?

Like the fifth Beatle, or Curly Howard?

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 11:06 AM (ykeLU)

230 199 ... MP4,
Take the day but don't let the bullshit control you.

Then get back to writing. I want some more Theda Bara stories, dammit! They are so enjoyable.

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 11:06 AM (7EjX1)

231 It is the abandonmemt of hope so yes.

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 11:06 AM (PXvVL)

232 "Despair: Trying on last summer's shorts and seeing that new shorts are in my future."

LOL. I know that feeling sister.

My despair is having a husband with Alzheimer's and knowing that there is nothing I can do to make it better.

Posted by: Tuna at March 19, 2023 11:07 AM (gLRfa)

233 Jesus felt sorrow, so don't know why that would be a sin.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 11:07 AM (45fpk)

234 The first of Abrams's Trek movies had a few good things to recommend it -- the casting for one, and showing us how Kirk outmaneuvered the Maru test. So much else was terrible. Lens flares in scenes on the bridge (which looked like an Apple Store), Kirk as a juvenile delinquent before entering the Academy, the notion that it's okay to leave your post without permission if you have a reely reely good reason, and making McCoy a contemporary of Kirk and Spock and goes through the Academy with them.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at March 19, 2023 09:46 AM (omVj0)

The first reboot movie was a fun space-opera adventure with a cool sci-fi gimmick, and a neat what-if version of the original crew....But it was a terrible launching-point for a new Star Trek series. Wrong vibe, ruined a lot of characters (and species)....

Basically, it was a fun fan-fic, but nothing more than that.

Posted by: Castle Guy at March 19, 2023 11:07 AM (Lhaco)

235 My despair is having a husband with Alzheimer's and knowing that there is nothing I can do to make it better.

Posted by: Tuna at March 19, 2023 11:07 AM (gLRfa)

{{{ Tuna }}}

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 11:08 AM (45fpk)

236 If you've been waiting for the Gope tweets saying arresting political opponents must stop, your time has arrived.

If you're waiting for something stronger than that, I have bad news for you.

Posted by: Last Days of the Republic at March 19, 2023 11:08 AM (8s+bW)

237 Like the fifth Beatle, or Curly ~~Howard~~ Joe?

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 11:06 AM (ykeLU)

Fixed it for you. Unless you meant the original Curly.

He, Moe, and Shemp were brothers. Surname how'd.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 11:08 AM (L1tQx)

238 "I loved that book. HBO has threatening to make a series from it for decades."

I think Apple TV is airing one soon. Hope they don't mess it up.

Posted by: Tuna at March 19, 2023 11:09 AM (gLRfa)

239 huh.

how'd = Howard

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 11:09 AM (L1tQx)

240 233 Jesus felt sorrow, so don't know why that would be a sin.
Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 11:07 AM (45fpk)

Despair would be different than Sorrow in my opinion. At least to an extent, Despair is a rejection of the idea that God's Plan will win out.

It's rejection was an element of stoicism that on the other hand bordered on fatalism.

Posted by: Aetius451AD Work Laptop at March 19, 2023 11:09 AM (zZu0s)

241 The Insane Left thinks they'll win by keeping the rest of divided and even atomized. We'll see. Developing ...

Posted by: Ignoramus at March 19, 2023 11:09 AM (RqMSv)

242 The language of love:

French - whisper in my ear
Spanish- blow in my ear
English- murmur in my ear
German- make a noise in my ear

Heh!

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 11:11 AM (ykeLU)

243 So despair is to deadly sins like Rudolph is to reindeer?

Like the fifth Beatle, or Curly Howard?

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 11:06 AM (ykeLU)

Don't you mean Joe Besser, or Emil Sitka?

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 11:12 AM (Angsy)

244 You know what countries lock up political opponents based on made up charges? Sh*thole countries, that's who!

Posted by: Trumpfoonery at March 19, 2023 11:14 AM (DhOHl)

245 Help, I'm beset by Three Stooges pedants!!!!

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 11:14 AM (ykeLU)

246 I dunno...I think it can be fascinating to read about the authors that influenced other authors. Those writers they mention almost certainly had an effect on their own writing, so they might be worth investigating to find out WHY they were influential.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at March 19, 2023 10:14 AM (BpYfr)

It is reasoning like that that convinced me to by Harold Lamb's 'Wolf of the Steppes' collection and shelve it next to my Robert E Howard collections. Well, that, and because it has some really cool late-era-Mongols vs the Chinese adventures.

Posted by: Castle Guy at March 19, 2023 11:15 AM (Lhaco)

247 We know, for instance, that Spenser was in Korea; Napoleon Solo was too. (I always wanted to see a crossover where the young Lt. Solo passes through the 4077th MASH and charms Margaret Houlihan.)

-
Both Joe Mannix and Jim Rockford were POWs in Korea.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:16 AM (FVME7)

248 I was listening to sympsthy for the devil for reasons and its unsurprising that they miss the sgnificance of the anecdote

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 11:16 AM (PXvVL)

249 Jesus had to die in the way that isiah predicted

Posted by: No 6 at March 19, 2023 11:17 AM (PXvVL)

250 On the question of the Giant Rat of Sumatra, for me a favorite answer to that literary riddle is Fred Saberhagen's "The Holmes-Dracula File" (197

. The second in Saberhagen's Dracula series (which begins with "The Dracula Tapes" in which the Count gives his version of the story told by Bram Stoker) it tells a story involving Sherlock Holmes, Count Dracula and the aforementioned Giant Rat. Among other juicy details it turns out that Holmes and Dracula are related.

I am usual quite wary of attempts by authors to tell a story using well known characters from another writer. When well done it can be a delight but, IMHO, more often than not it is, at best, boring and all too often seriously annoying.

Posted by: John F. MacMichael at March 19, 2023 11:18 AM (2SWLc)

251 Moe, Larry, the cheese!

Posted by: Sitting on a three legged stooge at March 19, 2023 11:18 AM (DhOHl)

252 Lots of fine comment threads available for politics.

This is books. A refuge.

Thank you.

Posted by: Taro Tsujimoto at March 19, 2023 11:19 AM (5YmYl)

253 Help, I'm beset by Three Stooges pedants!!!!

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 11:14 AM (ykeLU)

Just watch the finger pokes, I have glasses on.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 11:19 AM (Angsy)

254
I think '7 Deadly Sins' was the original clickbait - long before the internet came into fruition.

"Number 2 will shock you!"

Posted by: Divide by Zero at March 19, 2023 11:21 AM (enJYY)

255 {{{Tuna}}}

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 11:21 AM (fUnHJ)

256 I've been rereading Louise Penny and Barbara Hambly. For some reason or another, I like Penny's earlier books much more than her later ones.

Hambly has written a raft of books over the years. My favorite series is the Antryg Wind rose books. Mystery readers know her for writing the Benjamin January novels. I'm reading her James Asher books, a vampire series. Her vampires are not nice, loveable, or fun. They are vicious, always ready for their next snack, and will do anything to stay hidden from the real world.

Posted by: Captain Josepha Sabin -- I wasn't particularly fond of the '70s the first time around at March 19, 2023 11:21 AM (k5jR3)

257 German - sounds like a language of war.

Italian - sounds like a language of love, passion and art.

English - sounds like a language of business.

Chicken/egg.

Posted by: Taro Tsujimoto at March 19, 2023 11:21 AM (5YmYl)

258 "Number 2 will shock you!"

Probably a cure for toenail fungus.

Posted by: Tuna at March 19, 2023 11:22 AM (gLRfa)

259 Ackshewallee, IIRC-

The "Lost Boys" in Peter Pan are said by Barry to be boys(babies/toddlers) who fall out of their strollers unnoticed by their mothers or nannies and are "lost".

After a week or so, if not found they are taken away to Neverland.

So, it's pretty strongly implied that the "lost boys" might be dead.

And this also explains why they long so much for a 'mother'.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 11:25 AM (L1tQx)

260 I've been rereading Louise Penny and Barbara Hambly. For some reason or another, I like Penny's earlier books much more than her later ones.

Penny's later books are woke, and heavily influenced by Hillary. They even wrote a book together I think.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 11:27 AM (45fpk)

261 Suppose I should give some thought to screwing up some things around the house -- have a good one, Horde, and thanks for the thread, Perfessor.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at March 19, 2023 11:27 AM (a/4+U)

262 Help, I'm beset by Three Stooges pedants!!!!

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 11:14 AM (ykeLU)

*boink! clunk! kablong!*

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 11:27 AM (fUnHJ)

263 Also...

the reason there are no "lost girls" is because..."girls ar too smart to fall out of their strollers."

S-o-o-o-o-o, what is Disney trying to say by adding Black girls to the lost boys"?

Sounds pretty racist to me.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 11:29 AM (L1tQx)

264 Do people actually read G.K. Chesterton or just quote him?

Posted by: Just Wondering at March 19, 2023 11:29 AM (DhOHl)

265 'How To Hide Your Stuff, Even From Yourself'
-Eromero

Posted by: Eromero at March 19, 2023 11:29 AM (DXbAa)

266 They even wrote a book together I think.
Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 11:27 AM (45fpk)

That's why I refuse to give her books a try.

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 11:29 AM (fUnHJ)

267 Quiet, numbskulls!

Posted by: Moe the Pedant at March 19, 2023 11:29 AM (Xrfse)

268 characters from the Wizard of Oz.

-
I don't know if this is a metaohor or not.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D3O9aM_bDZc

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:30 AM (FVME7)

269 Although a good thing that Penny did in one of her later books is having one of the characters give birth, joyfully, to a Downs baby, instead of choosing abortion.

Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 11:31 AM (45fpk)

270 I'm right here if you need me.

Posted by: The ball peen hammer at March 19, 2023 11:32 AM (DhOHl)

271 Do people actually read G.K. Chesterton or just quote him?

Posted by: Just Wondering at March 19, 2023 11:29 AM (DhOHl)

Chesterton can be an acquired taste.

Some of his fiction is good to great if quirky.

There are the famous "Father Brown" stories, also "The Napoleon of Notting Hill", "The Club of Queer Trade", and "The Man Who Was Thursday".

There's also his religious and philosophical writings, which i suppose get the Quotation Treatment.

If you want to read him, I'd start with his fiction.

IIRC... TMWWT is his most famous novel.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 11:36 AM (L1tQx)

272
Who are these Stooges you speak of?

Posted by: Gina at March 19, 2023 11:37 AM (enJYY)

273 Who are these Stooges you speak of?

*******

Ahem...
Of which you speak.

Posted by: Stooge pedant at March 19, 2023 11:39 AM (ykeLU)

274 In Re “Twelve O’clock High” series ther was one made in the ‘60’s. I have watched some of the episodes on YouTube

Posted by: FortWorthMike at March 19, 2023 11:41 AM (wbIlJ)

275 A follow up to the comment @122 by Just Some Guy: the story "A Father's Tale" by Sterling A. Lanier (in which an unnamed but very recognizable Sherlock Holmes encounters the Giant Rat(s) of Sumatra) can also be found in the second collection of the Brigadier Ffellows stories "The Curious Quests of Brigadier Ffellows" which available on Kindle (as is the first collection "The Peculiar Exploits of Brigadier Ffellows"). I will caution that these excellent stories suffer from being very badly copy edited in their Kindle editions. They are still readable but it is annoying.

Posted by: John F. MacMichael at March 19, 2023 11:43 AM (2SWLc)

276 Speaking of Sherlock Holmes, anyone read the Sherlock Holmes books written by Kareem Abdul-Jabbar?
Posted by: Lizzy

I read them some while ago and they're OK but not great. Surprise! The bad guys are white racists.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:43 AM (FVME7)

277 246 ... "Harold Lamb's 'Wolf of the Steppes' collection and shelve it next to my Robert E Howard collections. Well, that, and because it has some really cool late-era-Mongols vs the Chinese adventures."

I wasn't aware of Lamb and his influence on Robert Howard. Another reason to stop at the local used book store.

Posted by: JTB at March 19, 2023 11:45 AM (7EjX1)

278 I listened to The Man Who Was Thursday via audiobook last year. I enjoyed it, but it was almost exhausting. So much to keep track of and sort out. But in the end the meaningful symbolism, the metaphors and plot twists were satisfying. And yet, I felt like I'd run a marathon and haven't been able to steel myself to start another Chesterton book.

Posted by: Quarter Twenty at March 19, 2023 11:47 AM (DhOHl)

279 I have read that sloth includes the concept of despair.

-------------

And both are forms of weasel.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero43) at March 19, 2023 11:49 AM (Qzn2/)

280 “Jurassic Park” Star Sam Neill Reveals He Has “Ferocious” Stage 3 Blood Cancer

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:52 AM (FVME7)

281 Speaking of Sherlock Holmes, anyone read the Sherlock Holmes books written by Kareem Abdul-Jabbar?
Posted by: Lizzy

I read them some while ago and they're OK but not great. Surprise! The bad guys are white racists.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:43 AM (FVME7)

"I say, Holmes. I suppose this means that we as white men are the real guilty party here."

"Quite right, Watson. Well, Old Chap, we should just shoot ourselves and be done with it."

"Brilliant solution, Holmes. Ta-ta then."

*shoots self in head*

*Holmes overdoses on cocaine*

FIN

Posted by: The climax of "The Final Solution", a Sherlock Holmes Mystery by Kareem Abdul-Jabbar at March 19, 2023 11:52 AM (L1tQx)

282 Amalgamated Association of Morons

Local 6 7/8

Posted by: JackStraw at March 19, 2023 11:52 AM (ZLI7S)

283 Hi, horde (especially JT),

My puppy is running me ragged today, but I wanted to stop by to say how much I am enjoying PD James' mysteries. I rate her higher than Christie.

I'm also reading "A History of the English Speaking Peoples Since 1900" by Andrew Roberts (now Lord Roberts of Belgavia). His take is a corrective to the fashionable notion that the British Empire and modern day America are somehow no better than the Nazis and Soviets. However, the book was published in 2005 and Roberts clearly was a big supporter of the Iraq invasion (to be fair, so was I at the time). His notion that the English-speaking democracies would conquer the Middle East and bring peace and the rule of law to Iraq like they did to Germany and Japan certainly hasn't aged well.

Posted by: Donna&&&&&&&&V at March 19, 2023 11:52 AM (HabA/)

284 Hambly has written a raft of books over the years. My favorite series is the Antryg Wind rose books. Mystery readers know her for writing the Benjamin January novels. I'm reading her James Asher books, a vampire series. Her vampires are not nice, loveable, or fun. They are vicious, always ready for their next snack, and will do anything to stay hidden from the real world.
Posted by: Captain Josepha Sabin

She started in fantasy iirc. Her Benjamin January series didn't really grab me but I'll try the Windrose books.
That reminds me - has anyone read the Murder Bot books by Martha Wells? I've heard it's good...

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 11:52 AM (fUnHJ)

285 funny, I always assumed that the lost boys were lost souls of dead children.

Posted by: Tom Servo at March 19, 2023 11:52 AM (r46W7)

286 Problem solved!

New York Responds to Dramatic Fall in Test Scores Since COVID Lockdowns by Permanently Lowering Standards

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:53 AM (FVME7)

287 And both are forms of weasel.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero43) at March 19, 2023 11:49 AM (Qzn2/)

Not our Weasel! He's no sloth, why he does shooting vids for us every week. Or, every other week. Well, maybe once a month. Or two.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 11:53 AM (Angsy)

288 "Perfessor" Squirrel

Thank you for the shout out. In the past, I enjoyed well-done dark comedies. Grunts is one example.

But as well done as Bring Me the Head of Prince Charming is in bringing back memories of dealing with the Navy Supply system and the hot-house conflicts onboard ships, it left me cold. Perchance the last 16 years, and especially the last three, have blown my light-heartedness to tip-toe through a dark comedy to flinders.

Posted by: NaCly Dog (u82oZ) at March 19, 2023 11:55 AM (u82oZ)

289 Which headline is stupider?

Secretary of Navy Names Climate Change as “Top Priority”

Black DEI Director Reportedly Bullied Out of Job, Branded “White Supremacist” for Considering Perspectives of All Races

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:56 AM (FVME7)

290 Good morning!

Let's smile & be happy & strike fear in the hearts of killjoy leftists everywhere.

Been working my way through the preamble of the chore list, which is why this is delayed.

Posted by: NaCly Dog (u82oZ) at March 19, 2023 11:56 AM (u82oZ)

291 Good morning Salty!

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 11:58 AM (fUnHJ)

292 /lose the sock

Posted by: Muldoon at March 19, 2023 11:59 AM (ykeLU)

293 Well, saddest time of Sunday morning is here. Thanks for the thread, Perfessor.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at March 19, 2023 12:00 PM (Angsy)

294 Which headline is stupider?

Secretary of Navy Names Climate Change as “Top Priority”

Black DEI Director Reportedly Bullied Out of Job, Branded “White Supremacist” for Considering Perspectives of All Races
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:56 AM (FVME7)
***

Go with the second. Sec of the Army said the same crap.

Posted by: Diogenes at March 19, 2023 12:00 PM (anj39)

295 WE HAZ A NOOD

Posted by: Skip at March 19, 2023 12:01 PM (xhxe8)

296 Anonosaurus Wrecks

Having the prime US force for good, that enforces free trade throughout the world, not focus on Naval Supremacy is a very, very, bad event.

The new net zero is a standard Leftist purity campaign, where even meeting those unobtainable goals would lead to more extreme demands. Like any faith beyond reason, climate control is a religion. This religion's insiders know it is a scam, but the useful idiots enable the insiders to get what they really want, which is power over others.

Nb books: The Collapse of Complex Societies is spot on.

Posted by: NaCly Dog (u82oZ) at March 19, 2023 12:03 PM (u82oZ)

297 the problem with the star drek, was from the beginning when nero kills kirk's father, he was a formative figure in young kirk's development, he turned out more brattish,

eric bana tried to give depth to nero, but he was essentially a retread of thomas hardy's character, in nemesis, but with less motivation,

Posted by: no 6 at March 19, 2023 12:03 PM (PXvVL)

298 Characters that live outside of books include a large part of the Diskworld saga and the Vorkosigan tales.

Posted by: NaCly Dog (u82oZ) at March 19, 2023 12:05 PM (u82oZ)

299 Thank you, "Perfessor" Squirrel.

Posted by: NaCly Dog (u82oZ) at March 19, 2023 12:07 PM (u82oZ)

300 >>>@104 ... RE: Friends fan fiction script (Rachel's "Wizard of Oz" dream)
================
Greetings, Wolfus ... This link might help you in your search ... https://tinyurl.com/mv6rkjzk

Posted by: Kathy at March 19, 2023 12:10 PM (JklXp)

301 Hiya Donna of the Ampersands !

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 12:19 PM (T4tVD)

302 Books with aliens as characters turn me right off. To me, it seems like the author cannot move the plot along or say what he wants to say within the confines of reality, so he has to resort to aliens. I like when the author stretches within the limits, not resorting to coloring outside the lines to cover the material. Just my opinion.
Posted by: grammie winger at March 19, 2023 10:44 AM (45fpk)

Aliens are perfectly fine as characters if the nature of the story has humans dealing with aliens, either as friends or adversaries.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 19, 2023 12:19 PM (tkR6S)

303 Shout out to Heidi and The Artist Formerly Known as Da Cannibal !

Posted by: JT at March 19, 2023 12:20 PM (T4tVD)

304 Invulnerable
…The only time his mood faltered from nigh-ecstatic was when I pried into his past, or his inner state beyond the superficial. As Andy Walsh suggested to me, I think he doesn't know, or isn't telling us, his real name. There was never a real last name. A nickname of Paul the Man started as a joke, and stuck. Not to his face. He really had a child-like innocence — and remarkable ignorance — about his unique position, not just as the origin of our revivification, but revered as the one who brought this gift to us all.…

Posted by: mindful webworker - click for a story at March 19, 2023 12:55 PM (s8sOe)

305 221 When did despair become one of the seven deadly sins?

Posted by: Muldoon

I have read that sloth includes the concept of despair.
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? at March 19, 2023 11:01 AM (FVME7)

Canadian author Robertson Davies published a collection of essays and speeches called "A Voice from the Attic." In one speech (a commencement speech, IIRC), he talked about acedia/sloth. He thought that "apathy" was a good translation, because one who does not care about anything often thinks that caring or acting would be futile. He thought it one of the deadlier sins.

He also has a good essay on the "clerisy," the secular elites to whom too many people deferred to as authority. The essay was written in 1960.

Posted by: Wethal at March 19, 2023 01:08 PM (NufIr)

306 264 Do people actually read G.K. Chesterton or just quote him?
Posted by: Just Wondering at March 19, 2023 11:29 AM (DhOHl)

Actually read- I just finished "The Outline of Sanity"- but
it's pretty much just fabulous quotes strung together.
i was turning down page corners, thinking of the Horde.

In the Chesterbelloc world, I'm a Hilaire fan.

Posted by: sal: tolle adversarium et afflige inimicum at March 19, 2023 01:49 PM (wE246)

307 So, it's pretty strongly implied that the "lost boys" might be dead.

And this also explains why they long so much for a 'mother'.
Posted by: naturalfake at March 19, 2023 11:25 AM (L1tQx)

They why did he take the Darling kids there?

Posted by: CN at March 19, 2023 02:21 PM (Zzbjj)

308 They why did he take the Darling kids there?
Posted by: CN

Peter Pan is a kind of monster, if you think about i

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at March 19, 2023 02:44 PM (fUnHJ)

309 I read two books by Immaculée Ilibagiza, Left to Tell and Led by Faith. She is a survivor of the Rwandian genocide that wiped out most of her family. First book tells about how she was hidden by a minister in a tiny bathroom with 9 other women for three months. Second is the story of her life after, marrying and moving to the US. She is Catholic, credits her strong faith with saving her and was able to forgive the man that murdered her family. I've read about Rwanda before but I think this was the first time for a first person report. Well told story.
Posted by: Notsothoreau at March 19, 2023 09:31 AM (6lj/r)

She has several prayers and talks on Hallow- what an amazing story she has.

Posted by: LASue at March 19, 2023 02:54 PM (Ed8Zd)

310 Yay! Book thread!

Lots of various fiction reading with a dollop of non-fiction.

Posted by: 13times at March 19, 2023 08:25 PM (NYb90)

311 The giant lizard that Bobby Shaftoe (Cryptonomicon) raves about seems to me to be a sly reference to that giant rat.
Robertson Davies, in his book The Cunning Man, created an acronym for them : VELAWIG. The initials stood for Vanity, Envy, Lechery, Avarice, Wrath, Idleness, and Gluttony.

Posted by: Linda Roberts at March 21, 2023 10:29 AM (NPfdt)

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