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MORNING RANT: The Iran Situation and Trump’s MOU – What Constitutes “Finishing the Job” After the Lessons of Iraq and Afghanistan?
Our political class has repeatedly told us that the only allowable “solutions” to pressing problems are alternatives not embraced by the majority of Americans. That is why we finally turned to Donald Trump. Just one example was the border crisis – Democrats argued for mass amnesty and a wide-open border, while establishment Republicans countered by also proposing mass amnesty with a slightly less porous border. Trump laughed in all their faces, shut the border, and started deporting criminal aliens. In the matter of foreign military engagement, we have also been presented just two bad options over the past few decades. 1) Massive military commitment to foreign wars, including nation building and boots on the ground in perpetuity, all with an endless airlift of fallen troops being flown home to Dover AFB. 2) Pacifism, with the U.S. never unleashing its military might, even where it is appropriate. There is another much better option, which President Trump just demonstrated – the use of our military to destroy what needs destroying, and then leaving the mess as a lesson. If Iran attempts to rebuild its nuclear program in coming years, we can bust it all up again. We don’t have to occupy Iran or pretend that it will become a western democracy. It can figure out whatever it wants to become, but if Iran restarts its nuclear program or exports terror again, it can also face our wrath again. I have been waiting for the U.S. to strike against Iran for more than 45 years. The lost wars of the Bush-Cheney era have driven home the futility of trying to impose democracy on those not capable of it. But still, I’ve never stopped wanting there to be righteous retribution against Iran’s mad mullahs. They attacked America on American territory when they took our embassy personnel hostage in 1979, and they’ve been killing Americans wherever they can ever since. One of the dubious lessons learned from World War II was that we must always rebuild what we destroy in war. In that spirit, Colin Powell famously told President George W. Bush regarding the Iraq War debacle, “If you break it, you own it.” Donald Trump has put that idea to rest. We broke it (Iran’s nuclear program) and Israel has destroyed Iran’s war fighting capabilities. And now we’re done fighting. What Iran does now is not our problem, unless/until we have to break it again sometime in the future. With all that said, there are plenty of reasons why the mainstream American right has become so anti-war in recent years. The awful loss of young Americans’ lives in service to other countries interests - but not America’s interests – is paramount. But it is also the realization that the war-pushers have a deep reserve of ashamed-to-be-American guilt that motivates them. There is an inherent contradiction in how they go about waging war. Quite simply, they rush into foreign wars, but then refuse to fight for victory, because they believe: 1) The United State has a moral obligation to fight other countries’ wars because of our power, wealth, etc. 2) It is culturally offensive for the United States to inflict what is necessary to actually win a foreign war. Donald Trump’s America-First position is rejected by this same war-loving crowd whose loyalty is to the “international community” that wants Americans to fight and to die, but not to win. A repellant aspect of the “we broke it, we bought it” mindset is the belief that all wars require a Marshall Plan to rebuild the infrastructure and economies of lands where we battled. Perhaps Western Europe would not have rebuilt so quickly without all the American aid post-WWII, but maybe they wouldn’t now be failing welfare states either. We taught them that Uncle Sam will pay to (re)build their countries and provide their defense, thus allowing cradle-to-grave welfare, all while their politicians and populace screech about how awful the United States is. By contrast, Eastern Europeans who suffered under communism received nothing from America, but they are vocally pro-America now because they simply crave freedom, and they learned how awful the alternative was. By rejecting “we broke it, we bought it,” President Trump is also rejecting any more 21st century occupations and Marshall Plans. That doesn’t mean the enemies of civilization will not incur the fearsome wrath of our military if they try to cause problems outside their borders. But under President Trump, if we have to break it, we’re just going to leave it.[buck.throckmorton at protonmail dot com]
Comments
(Jump to bottom of comments)1
First
Posted by: Cosda at June 22, 2026 11:00 AM (ibZ/e)
2
Bounce the rubble
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at June 22, 2026 11:02 AM (Kt19C)
3
Hi there
Posted by: Cow Demon at June 22, 2026 11:03 AM (T6aVk)
Posted by: L - No nic, another fine day at June 22, 2026 11:03 AM (NFX2v)
5
>>>What Constitutes “Finishing the Job”
We must all join in hands and sing Kumbaya over a nuclear fire in Tehran or Trump is a doodyhead. And we all get a pony.
We must all join in hands and sing Kumbaya over a nuclear fire in Tehran or Trump is a doodyhead. And we all get a pony.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:04 AM (dK+Kv)
6
I can't think of ANYONE who is in favor of boots on the ground in Iran. That is a long way from saying we shouldn't have done what we did.
Most of the noise about Iran is just the left trying to set it up as a failure.
Most of the noise about Iran is just the left trying to set it up as a failure.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:04 AM (Riz8t)
7
if we have to break it, we’re just going to leave it.
I can accept that. I would have liked Iraq and Afghanistan to be a final resting place for bombs that had "Best if used by" stamped on it and we tell them to never get our attention again.
I can accept that. I would have liked Iraq and Afghanistan to be a final resting place for bombs that had "Best if used by" stamped on it and we tell them to never get our attention again.
Posted by: NR Pax at June 22, 2026 11:05 AM (RjOoY)
8
Reluctantly its lunch time
Posted by: Skip at June 22, 2026 11:05 AM (sgkY8)
9
5 >>>What Constitutes “Finishing the Job”
We must all join in hands and sing Kumbaya over a nuclear fire in Tehran or Trump is a doodyhead. And we all get a pony.
What about Coke? Do we all get a Coke?
We must all join in hands and sing Kumbaya over a nuclear fire in Tehran or Trump is a doodyhead. And we all get a pony.
What about Coke? Do we all get a Coke?
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:05 AM (Riz8t)
10
The first step is to have the wisdom to know that we don't know jack, about what's really going on, or how best to handle it.
Lack of humility has led us to some pretty messed up things in my lifetime. And well before.
Lack of humility has led us to some pretty messed up things in my lifetime. And well before.
Posted by: Brother Tim sez: Fiat Justicia, Ruat Caelum at June 22, 2026 11:05 AM (OUMaO)
11
Eesh, an Iran thread. I’m out. Please, Y’all, don’t start throwing the crockery at each other.
Posted by: Bulg at June 22, 2026 11:06 AM (77rzZ)
12
Iran? Nobody is talking about Iran.
U.S. Rep Debbie Dingell claims algae in the Washington, DC reflecting pool is all that her constituents were talking about over the weekend in Michigan.
"Algae, that's all anybody talked at home this weekend. They were outraged."
I'll take things that never happened for $500.
U.S. Rep Debbie Dingell claims algae in the Washington, DC reflecting pool is all that her constituents were talking about over the weekend in Michigan.
"Algae, that's all anybody talked at home this weekend. They were outraged."
I'll take things that never happened for $500.
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:07 AM (ndZc7)
13
Don't blame the Turtle Wax. Blame the Turd.
Some very bad people that needed to be killed were killed.
The Middle East won't improve much until the islamic reformation.
And that will happen approximately the day after I get my handjo from Scarlett Johansson.
Trump still has my support for what that's worth.
Some very bad people that needed to be killed were killed.
The Middle East won't improve much until the islamic reformation.
And that will happen approximately the day after I get my handjo from Scarlett Johansson.
Trump still has my support for what that's worth.
Posted by: sifty boones of strawberry hill at June 22, 2026 11:07 AM (nptZK)
14
The Reluctant Lunch - a new novel by Thomas Pynchon.
Posted by: Pendant Publishing Presents at June 22, 2026 11:07 AM (pBJ6M)
15
My only problem is we stopped our targeted attacks too soon (only 39 days) which allowed the IG to regroup and kill thousands of the opposition and for them to claim victory and delay and dilute any MOU.
I contemplated this while staying at a Holiday Inn.
I contemplated this while staying at a Holiday Inn.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:08 AM (GP8V/)
16
What about Coke? Do we all get a Coke?
Posted by: Archimedes
Last I head, Coke is haram because they do business with Israel.
Posted by: Archimedes
Last I head, Coke is haram because they do business with Israel.
Posted by: NR Pax at June 22, 2026 11:09 AM (RjOoY)
17
My reading of leftwing forums has found the most common view is disappointment that Trump isn't going to pull a Shrub and send 200K American troops to occupy and police it.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:10 AM (sKqQm)
18
What about Coke? Do we all get a Coke?
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:05 AM (Riz8t)
Have a Coke and a smile . . . .
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:05 AM (Riz8t)
Have a Coke and a smile . . . .
Posted by: Richard Pryor at June 22, 2026 11:10 AM (dK+Kv)
19
And we all get a pony.
You want a pony.
You'll settle for a bicycle.
You'll get a mule dick tied in a knot.
You want a pony.
You'll settle for a bicycle.
You'll get a mule dick tied in a knot.
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at June 22, 2026 11:10 AM (Kt19C)
20
The country of iran as they are now needs to be ended. I have no idea how to make that happen short of complete and total war against them and that is simply not going to happen.
I was over there in 87-88 during the tanker wars escorting reflagged kuwati oil tankers through the gulf because iran was throwing a temper tantrum and closed the straits. They have been doing that off and on for almost 50 years and it has to stop or the gulf oil countries need to get their $hit together and build some pipelines to remove the threat of potentially constant closing of the straits by iran.
I was over there in 87-88 during the tanker wars escorting reflagged kuwati oil tankers through the gulf because iran was throwing a temper tantrum and closed the straits. They have been doing that off and on for almost 50 years and it has to stop or the gulf oil countries need to get their $hit together and build some pipelines to remove the threat of potentially constant closing of the straits by iran.
Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at June 22, 2026 11:11 AM (0N4FZ)
21
Time out for the IAEA? and GOPe to do BDA.
Posted by: DaveA at June 22, 2026 11:11 AM (FhXTo)
22
Count me in the camp of I'd rather just send a few bombs in when and as needed and call it a day. If we have to send more in next month - do so.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:12 AM (qCV5n)
23
the gulf oil countries need to get their $hit together and build some pipelines to remove the threat of potentially constant closing of the straits by iran.
I think that's already happening. They've had enough of Iran's nonsense.
I think that's already happening. They've had enough of Iran's nonsense.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:12 AM (Riz8t)
24
Trump wasn't going to put boots on the ground. He was hoping for regime change but just got more of the same and I don't believe he fully factored in the Straight gambit by Iran which worked.
He set their military and nuclear program back significantly and called it a day. He wants gas prices down and win the mid terms.
He set their military and nuclear program back significantly and called it a day. He wants gas prices down and win the mid terms.
Posted by: WisRich at June 22, 2026 11:12 AM (G0vdT)
25
"We will give you $300 billion to build up your industry and infrastructure if you just act like a normal country."
-the Gulf States, primed to invest
"Yes, please."
-Iranian civil government
"LEEEROY JENKINSSSSSS!"
-IRGC retards with a Twitter account
-the Gulf States, primed to invest
"Yes, please."
-Iranian civil government
"LEEEROY JENKINSSSSSS!"
-IRGC retards with a Twitter account
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:12 AM (Zn6QU)
26
Count me in the camp of I'd rather just send a few bombs in when and as needed and call it a day. If we have to send more in next month - do so.
Agree. If a country the size of Ukraine can hit Moscow, we can hit Tehran, or anywhere else of our choosing.
Agree. If a country the size of Ukraine can hit Moscow, we can hit Tehran, or anywhere else of our choosing.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:13 AM (Riz8t)
27
Thx Buck.
First of all , Western political leaders have to recognize that Islam sucks. Everything about it is regressive. When dealing with Islam countries and regions, all choices are bad. Find the least bad path. Whatever is happening in Iran is not over either from our point of view or the Iranians. We don't have troops on the ground (maybe special forces), so thus far Trump chas chosen wisely.
First of all , Western political leaders have to recognize that Islam sucks. Everything about it is regressive. When dealing with Islam countries and regions, all choices are bad. Find the least bad path. Whatever is happening in Iran is not over either from our point of view or the Iranians. We don't have troops on the ground (maybe special forces), so thus far Trump chas chosen wisely.
Posted by: Smell the Glove at June 22, 2026 11:13 AM (Iurxt)
28
IMO there is no comparison of Iraq /Afghanistan and Iran operations.
Different reasons, goals and logistics.
Different reasons, goals and logistics.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:13 AM (GP8V/)
29
And, no we don't have to fix it if we break it. We can just keep breaking things.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:13 AM (qCV5n)
30
Remember, it was the Likud Party who, eyes wide shut, had no security on the Gaza border. A lot of Israelis think Likud has outlived its usefulness and needs to go. Tough to do while there’s a war on.
Unnecessary satire: All the Israelis who don’t vote Likud; yeah, they hate Jews.
Unnecessary satire: All the Israelis who don’t vote Likud; yeah, they hate Jews.
Posted by: Going deep. Out. at June 22, 2026 11:14 AM (UFHYa)
31
24 Trump wasn't going to put boots on the ground. He was hoping for regime change but just got more of the same and I don't believe he fully factored in the Straight gambit by Iran which worked.
He set their military and nuclear program back significantly and called it a day. He wants gas prices down and win the mid terms.
Posted by: WisRich at June 22, 2026 11:12 AM (G0vdT)
======
The funny thing is that almost nothing has actually changed since the signing of the MOU in terms of practicals.
Iran is selling some oil they loaded up 3 months ago, and they have some grain shipments coming from Brazil.
But...it's going to take weeks for any of that to actually materialize (money from the oil sales and the actual grain showing up at Bandar Abbas).
All of their funds are still frozen. The $300 billion investment fund is still just an idea.
And gas prices were falling before the MOU.
I don't think the MOU has anything to do with the midterms, actually.
He set their military and nuclear program back significantly and called it a day. He wants gas prices down and win the mid terms.
Posted by: WisRich at June 22, 2026 11:12 AM (G0vdT)
======
The funny thing is that almost nothing has actually changed since the signing of the MOU in terms of practicals.
Iran is selling some oil they loaded up 3 months ago, and they have some grain shipments coming from Brazil.
But...it's going to take weeks for any of that to actually materialize (money from the oil sales and the actual grain showing up at Bandar Abbas).
All of their funds are still frozen. The $300 billion investment fund is still just an idea.
And gas prices were falling before the MOU.
I don't think the MOU has anything to do with the midterms, actually.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:14 AM (Zn6QU)
32
Israel is probably not history's greatest monster but nor are they the foremost singular force for good in the world.
Should they exist as a safe haven for Jews given the events of the 20th century? Yes. Would they if the world - particularly the Left and their pals Militant Islam - had its way? Absolutely not.
What is our role, and the role of civilized countries in that?
One thing the 21st Century has taught us is "Never Again" and "Never Forget" are in the end just neat slogans. A hard lesson that can only be learned, not taught.
Should they exist as a safe haven for Jews given the events of the 20th century? Yes. Would they if the world - particularly the Left and their pals Militant Islam - had its way? Absolutely not.
What is our role, and the role of civilized countries in that?
One thing the 21st Century has taught us is "Never Again" and "Never Forget" are in the end just neat slogans. A hard lesson that can only be learned, not taught.
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 11:14 AM (22ggK)
33
Modern geo-politics are amusing in a lot of ways
We had a debate as to whether Iran could be completely defeated via airpower but honestly Trump didn't try and the reason is fascinating and horrifying.
We could level bomb or even use drone strikes on the neighborhoods Iran's elites live in. Yes plenty of them are true believers that don't mind martyrdom but...nowhere near all of them.
But even "right wing genocidal maniac" Trump won't go anywhere near that because...its mean or something.
You can kill thousands of soldiers but the world damns you for targeting enemy leaders. Yes "the world" in this context are people that would kill Trump given a chance and well, us too, but for some reason the right also listens to these people.
We had a debate as to whether Iran could be completely defeated via airpower but honestly Trump didn't try and the reason is fascinating and horrifying.
We could level bomb or even use drone strikes on the neighborhoods Iran's elites live in. Yes plenty of them are true believers that don't mind martyrdom but...nowhere near all of them.
But even "right wing genocidal maniac" Trump won't go anywhere near that because...its mean or something.
You can kill thousands of soldiers but the world damns you for targeting enemy leaders. Yes "the world" in this context are people that would kill Trump given a chance and well, us too, but for some reason the right also listens to these people.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:15 AM (sKqQm)
34
Seems to me that making a bunch of mullahs comfortable and confident enough to come out in public would be beneficial to our military.
Might be some benefit long term to a deal drawing the bigger roaches out of their hidey-holes.
Maybe get them to visit Davos or Martha's Squishmitten.
Might be some benefit long term to a deal drawing the bigger roaches out of their hidey-holes.
Maybe get them to visit Davos or Martha's Squishmitten.
Posted by: sifty boones of strawberry hill at June 22, 2026 11:15 AM (nptZK)
35
My primary objection to Trump’s approach is that he’s tried negotiating at all. I believe we could’ve used exactly the same playbook except never even attempt negotiations. Just bomb the crap out of them and then sit back and play whack a mole and blockade the strait indefinitely. No boots on the ground ever… minimal risk to service personnel
Whether it’s fair or not, trying to negotiate with these maniacs only projects weakness especially when you negotiate publicly and make so many threats with no follow through they become empty and kind of a joke. Whatever happened to the old rule: never negotiate with terrorists
Whether it’s fair or not, trying to negotiate with these maniacs only projects weakness especially when you negotiate publicly and make so many threats with no follow through they become empty and kind of a joke. Whatever happened to the old rule: never negotiate with terrorists
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2026 11:15 AM (m6Mib)
36
We must resist the urge to put boots on the ground unless we want to seize their territory and treasure. The oppression will bring about a breaking point not withstanding.
Posted by: Rev. Wishbone at June 22, 2026 11:16 AM (fkjGs)
37
Who is going to fix Iran's water problem, and along with it their agriculture issues?
Who is going to sell them refined fuels? They pump crude but nothing beyond.
Who is going to be their ally? Russia and China are collapsing. Sunnis hate Shia.
But Trump's a blustering blowhard.
Who is going to fix Iran's water problem, and along with it their agriculture issues?
Who is going to sell them refined fuels? They pump crude but nothing beyond.
Who is going to be their ally? Russia and China are collapsing. Sunnis hate Shia.
But Trump's a blustering blowhard.
Posted by: Auspex at June 22, 2026 11:16 AM (Y8DZL)
38
I don't think the MOU has anything to do with the midterms, actually.
---------------
Gas prices and inflation will have far more impact on the mid-terms than an uncertain outcome in Iran. Trump can sell Iran as a victory to people who want it to be a victory. His opponents (Dems and GOPe) will sell it as defeat. If gas goes down, people won't care.
---------------
Gas prices and inflation will have far more impact on the mid-terms than an uncertain outcome in Iran. Trump can sell Iran as a victory to people who want it to be a victory. His opponents (Dems and GOPe) will sell it as defeat. If gas goes down, people won't care.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:16 AM (qCV5n)
Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at June 22, 2026 11:16 AM (O0L8i)
40
Is any government monolithic?
Is Belgium's? Is China's? Is ours?
Is your local HOA?
Why would Iran's be?
Is Belgium's? Is China's? Is ours?
Is your local HOA?
Why would Iran's be?
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:17 AM (Zn6QU)
41
Gas prices and inflation will have far more impact on the mid-terms than an uncertain outcome in Iran. Trump can sell Iran as a victory to people who want it to be a victory. His opponents (Dems and GOPe) will sell it as defeat. If gas goes down, people won't care.
Concur.
Concur.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:17 AM (Riz8t)
42
The purpose and outcome of military action should be the cessation of it, not the prospect of it continuing on endlessly.
THAT is the very definition of "endless wars."
"Oh, well, we tried" is not a worthy war strategy and is not a satisfactory outcome.
THAT is the very definition of "endless wars."
"Oh, well, we tried" is not a worthy war strategy and is not a satisfactory outcome.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:17 AM (mWKAz)
43
38 I don't think the MOU has anything to do with the midterms, actually.
---------------
Gas prices and inflation will have far more impact on the mid-terms than an uncertain outcome in Iran. Trump can sell Iran as a victory to people who want it to be a victory. His opponents (Dems and GOPe) will sell it as defeat. If gas goes down, people won't care.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:16 AM (qCV5n)
======
Gas prices never have major impacts on elections, actually. Like, ever.
---------------
Gas prices and inflation will have far more impact on the mid-terms than an uncertain outcome in Iran. Trump can sell Iran as a victory to people who want it to be a victory. His opponents (Dems and GOPe) will sell it as defeat. If gas goes down, people won't care.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:16 AM (qCV5n)
======
Gas prices never have major impacts on elections, actually. Like, ever.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:17 AM (Zn6QU)
44
It's a MOU point. It's like a cow's opinion. It's MOU.
Posted by: Joey Tribbiani, super-genius at June 22, 2026 11:18 AM (pBJ6M)
45
The Afghan mess was sort of what is described above for a preferred outcome with Iran, at least for a few weeks. However, the punitive action was then turned into 20 years of death and destruction, waste fraud and abuse, and oh yeah, heroin production. Be careful who has their hands on the levers of power and influence. Even those you think are on the side of good may fall under the sway of those who are not.
Posted by: Ex Rex Reeder at June 22, 2026 11:18 AM (QaH55)
46
Trump can sell Iran as a victory to people who want it to be a victory. His opponents (Dems and GOPe) will sell it as defeat. If gas goes down, people won't care.
Yep.
After defeating Saddam in Kuwait in the most lopsided battle in human memory Bush 41 lost re-election in '92 over a minor recession and tax increases.
Yep.
After defeating Saddam in Kuwait in the most lopsided battle in human memory Bush 41 lost re-election in '92 over a minor recession and tax increases.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:18 AM (sKqQm)
47
37
Who is going to fix Iran's water problem, and along with it their agriculture issues?
Who is going to sell them refined fuels? They pump crude but nothing beyond.
Who is going to be their ally? Russia and China are collapsing. Sunnis hate Shia.
But Trump's a blustering blowhard.
Posted by: Auspex at June 22, 2026 11:16 AM (Y8DZL)
======
Oh, and Trump destroyed their manufacturing base which they took decades to build.
And our manufacturing base wasn't touched.
Which means that Iran can rearm instantly and we can't rearm at all, I believe.
Who is going to fix Iran's water problem, and along with it their agriculture issues?
Who is going to sell them refined fuels? They pump crude but nothing beyond.
Who is going to be their ally? Russia and China are collapsing. Sunnis hate Shia.
But Trump's a blustering blowhard.
Posted by: Auspex at June 22, 2026 11:16 AM (Y8DZL)
======
Oh, and Trump destroyed their manufacturing base which they took decades to build.
And our manufacturing base wasn't touched.
Which means that Iran can rearm instantly and we can't rearm at all, I believe.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:18 AM (Zn6QU)
48
Bush 41 lost re-election in '92 over a minor recession and tax increases
--------------
And jazz. Don't forget jazz.
--------------
And jazz. Don't forget jazz.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:19 AM (qCV5n)
49
>>My reading of leftwing forums has found the most common view is disappointment that Trump isn't going to pull a Shrub and send 200K American troops to occupy and police it.
Anyone who has been following and listening to Trump for the last decade plus, and that doesn't include leftists, has known how Trump plans to use power and it never included full scale invasions unless we were in a break glass situation.
Trump is all about using power, hard and soft, to produce outcomes that help the American people and when possible spare human life. Unlike most previous presidents that have little relevant private sector experience, Trump has been using soft power his entire life to achieve his goals so military power to him is a 2nd choice not a first and he doesn't rely on the same old DC gang to tell him the only solution is all out war.
People who refuse to see his actions through his lens and still rely on old models assume is flailing because he isn't doing what the old playbook said. Whether you like Trump or not if you don't understand what he is trying to accomplish and equally important how he is trying to accomplish it you will always think he is failing. And he isn't.
Anyone who has been following and listening to Trump for the last decade plus, and that doesn't include leftists, has known how Trump plans to use power and it never included full scale invasions unless we were in a break glass situation.
Trump is all about using power, hard and soft, to produce outcomes that help the American people and when possible spare human life. Unlike most previous presidents that have little relevant private sector experience, Trump has been using soft power his entire life to achieve his goals so military power to him is a 2nd choice not a first and he doesn't rely on the same old DC gang to tell him the only solution is all out war.
People who refuse to see his actions through his lens and still rely on old models assume is flailing because he isn't doing what the old playbook said. Whether you like Trump or not if you don't understand what he is trying to accomplish and equally important how he is trying to accomplish it you will always think he is failing. And he isn't.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:19 AM (viF8m)
50
Which means that Iran can rearm instantly and we can't rearm at all, I believe.
For some reason, I don't think you really believe that.
For some reason, I don't think you really believe that.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (Riz8t)
51
What is our role, and the role of civilized countries in that?
One thing the 21st Century has taught us is "Never Again" and "Never Forget" are in the end just neat slogans. A hard lesson that can only be learned, not taught.
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 11:14 AM (22ggK)
From my perspective, arming them for self-defense with weapons and intel. It is a mistake, from my perspective, to let the MOU hinge on Lebanon clusterfuckery, but that is clearly what Iran wants, in its continued belligerence with Israel.
That may be the best we can hope for, for now, while we retain all military options in the region, when (not if) Iran gets out of hand again, re: IAEA inspections, Hormuz shenanigans, etc.
It's not going to be a silver bullet. I suspect it will be a slower normalization of relations with both carrot and stick used as tools to bring around the regime by appealing to self-interest.
One thing the 21st Century has taught us is "Never Again" and "Never Forget" are in the end just neat slogans. A hard lesson that can only be learned, not taught.
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 11:14 AM (22ggK)
From my perspective, arming them for self-defense with weapons and intel. It is a mistake, from my perspective, to let the MOU hinge on Lebanon clusterfuckery, but that is clearly what Iran wants, in its continued belligerence with Israel.
That may be the best we can hope for, for now, while we retain all military options in the region, when (not if) Iran gets out of hand again, re: IAEA inspections, Hormuz shenanigans, etc.
It's not going to be a silver bullet. I suspect it will be a slower normalization of relations with both carrot and stick used as tools to bring around the regime by appealing to self-interest.
Posted by: Richard Pryor at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (dK+Kv)
52
"Boots on the ground" is a false specter being used to scare the normies.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (mWKAz)
53
50 Which means that Iran can rearm instantly and we can't rearm at all, I believe.
For some reason, I don't think you really believe that.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (Riz8t)
======
IRAN IS GOING TO SEND A FLEET OF DRONES ACROSS THE WORLD AND DESTROY THE WHITE HOUSE!
For some reason, I don't think you really believe that.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (Riz8t)
======
IRAN IS GOING TO SEND A FLEET OF DRONES ACROSS THE WORLD AND DESTROY THE WHITE HOUSE!
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (Zn6QU)
54
My $.02 - this is the neighborhood bully issue. You knock him on his ass, then offer a hand up. Either way, you then continue on your way.
He now knows he can't do s*it, and more importantly, those in his corner (China) now know that.
Will he reform? Dunno. Will he go back to his buds and boast of his prowess? Don't care. Will that stop him from being an ass? Probably not.
There is no final solution. Killing 93 million people there would solve exactly jack.
He now knows he can't do s*it, and more importantly, those in his corner (China) now know that.
Will he reform? Dunno. Will he go back to his buds and boast of his prowess? Don't care. Will that stop him from being an ass? Probably not.
There is no final solution. Killing 93 million people there would solve exactly jack.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (cGjQu)
55
My measure of whether it is worth it to put grunts on the ground are a few basic checkboxes first:
1) Have we tried level bombing their cities?
2) Have we tried destroying their infrastructure?
3) Have we tried killing their leaders?
If the answer to any of these is no, then you don't care enough to risk the lives of our soldiers so no, no grunts on the ground.
1) Have we tried level bombing their cities?
2) Have we tried destroying their infrastructure?
3) Have we tried killing their leaders?
If the answer to any of these is no, then you don't care enough to risk the lives of our soldiers so no, no grunts on the ground.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (sKqQm)
56
Problem for the GOP is that any and I mean any fluctuation in the economy will be framed and gaslighted as the worse thing ever by the MSM. We still have the LIV out there who will fall victim to this. Not as bad as it once was but still bad.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (GP8V/)
57
Which means that Iran can rearm instantly and we can't rearm at all, I believe.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:18 AM (Zn6QU)
What an asshole.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:18 AM (Zn6QU)
What an asshole.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:21 AM (dK+Kv)
Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at June 22, 2026 11:21 AM (O0L8i)
59
56 Problem for the GOP is that any and I mean any fluctuation in the economy will be framed and gaslighted as the worse thing ever by the MSM. We still have the LIV out there who will fall victim to this. Not as bad as it once was but still bad.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (GP8V/)
======
In the middle of covid, six states had to shut down ballot counting in the middle of the night to ballot box stuff like Tammany Hall to barely beat Trump in the electoral college.
The media's ability to spin things is...diminished. This ain't the 90s.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (GP8V/)
======
In the middle of covid, six states had to shut down ballot counting in the middle of the night to ballot box stuff like Tammany Hall to barely beat Trump in the electoral college.
The media's ability to spin things is...diminished. This ain't the 90s.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:21 AM (Zn6QU)
60
So hard (or impossible) to get clean info on Iran. Some reports say the good people ("Persian majority"?) have taken back whole cities, others say IRGC is in confusion and conflict, others say we are getting arms to the good people (and maybe they'd be willing to fight?)
. idk
Same with Ukraine ... are they actually almost winning now? Reports say Russia dumps their draftees into zones with no real support or mission, and drones bring in erratic supplies, and some of them are killing each other. Parts of Europe seem more interested than before in backing Ukraine ... I still prefer Ukraine "WIN", but can't get a good grip on the intel.
. idk
Same with Ukraine ... are they actually almost winning now? Reports say Russia dumps their draftees into zones with no real support or mission, and drones bring in erratic supplies, and some of them are killing each other. Parts of Europe seem more interested than before in backing Ukraine ... I still prefer Ukraine "WIN", but can't get a good grip on the intel.
Posted by: illiniwek at June 22, 2026 11:21 AM (vbXSk)
61
Bounce the rubble
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at June 22, 2026 11:02 AM (Kt19C)
-
Bounce the rubble > rocking the kasbah
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at June 22, 2026 11:02 AM (Kt19C)
-
Bounce the rubble > rocking the kasbah
Posted by: Biden's Dog sniffs a whole lotta malarkey, at June 22, 2026 11:22 AM (V6d0j)
62
The media's ability to spin things is...diminished. This ain't the 90s.
--------------
Trump will tout this as the greatest economy of all time ... in history. It will be fun to listen to. The GOP never had someone so bold.
--------------
Trump will tout this as the greatest economy of all time ... in history. It will be fun to listen to. The GOP never had someone so bold.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:22 AM (qCV5n)
63
This not a US / Iran deal only. The negotiations are part of a larger Middle East realignment .
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:22 AM (afJtY)
64
Boots on the ground" is a false specter being used to scare the normies.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (mWKAz)
Agree. I think the problem most people had is the same as mine. We stopped the air campaign way too soon.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (mWKAz)
Agree. I think the problem most people had is the same as mine. We stopped the air campaign way too soon.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:22 AM (GP8V/)
65
There's 90 million people in that country. That's more than Great Britain. It's bigger than Alaska. It's got lots of black gold, Texas tea. In the late 70s it was an educated advanced country with culture, technology, travel, infrastructure and commerce.
Get the Mohammedans out of the way and let a hundred thousand entrepreneural enterprises bloom.
Get the Mohammedans out of the way and let a hundred thousand entrepreneural enterprises bloom.
Posted by: Quarter Twenty at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (Ov6Yl)
66
Local military experts here tell us that this is the most "humiliating surrender" in US military history.
So, you know, we really should have just voted for Kamala ....
So, you know, we really should have just voted for Kamala ....
Posted by: People's Hippo Voice at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (73/SM)
67
"Boots on the ground" is a false specter being used to scare the normies.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (mWKAz)
"Regime change" is a nebulous unspecified concept used to appeal to the same.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (mWKAz)
"Regime change" is a nebulous unspecified concept used to appeal to the same.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (dK+Kv)
68
AI and auto cucumber sucks balls.
Posted by: Rev. Wishbone at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (fkjGs)
69
11 Eesh, an Iran thread. I’m out. Please, Y’all, don’t start throwing the crockery at each other.
Posted by: Bulg at June 22, 2026 11:06 AM (77rzZ)
Agreed.
Posted by: Bulg at June 22, 2026 11:06 AM (77rzZ)
Agreed.
Posted by: Cow Demon at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (T6aVk)
70
Killing 93 million people there would solve exactly jack.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (cGjQu)
I'm not going to argue for that; it's not a realistic option at this juncture.
But it would definitely solve the problem, and it's silly to say it wouldn't... If Iran is no more, then Iran is not a problem.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (cGjQu)
I'm not going to argue for that; it's not a realistic option at this juncture.
But it would definitely solve the problem, and it's silly to say it wouldn't... If Iran is no more, then Iran is not a problem.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (BI5O2)
71
One big issue is believing that the Iranians will react like rational western societies would; but there's every indication that they will openly and laughingly violate the MOU at every single point - because their goal is not to get an "agreement", but to humiliate and ridicule America in the most open possible way.
The leadership now is, if anything, even more radical than the leadership before.
The leadership now is, if anything, even more radical than the leadership before.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (edUvp)
72
66 Local military experts here tell us that this is the most "humiliating surrender" in US military history.
So, you know, we really should have just voted for Kamala ....
Posted by: People's Hippo Voice at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (73/SM)
========
"As a student of history, all wars are WWII."
So, you know, we really should have just voted for Kamala ....
Posted by: People's Hippo Voice at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (73/SM)
========
"As a student of history, all wars are WWII."
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (Zn6QU)
73
Agree. I think the problem most people had is the same as mine. We stopped the air campaign way too soon./i]
Yes. You know the air campaign is done when your enemies are begging you to come to the table to negotiate.
Though I guess here the civilian leadership was, while the IRGC was not.
Yes. You know the air campaign is done when your enemies are begging you to come to the table to negotiate.
Though I guess here the civilian leadership was, while the IRGC was not.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (sKqQm)
74
The negotiations are part of a larger Middle East realignment ."
Let us not forget what this has done to China...
Let us not forget what this has done to China...
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (cGjQu)
75
This not a US / Iran deal only. The negotiations are part of a larger Middle East realignment .
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:22 AM (afJtY)
Personally I think it has a lot to do with China and the meeting Trump had with Xi.
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:22 AM (afJtY)
Personally I think it has a lot to do with China and the meeting Trump had with Xi.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (GP8V/)
76
It's not complicated at all, really: as long as it's still called "the ISLAMIC REPUBLIC of Iran," the job ain't done yet.
Posted by: Mike Hendrix at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (fYChK)
77
Betty Rubble bouncing >Bounce the rubble > rocking the kasbah
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:24 AM (Riz8t)
78
The price of a venti double caramel half-caff latte goat piss pumpkin spice kale mocha at Starbucks is more influential on the crowd who decides whether America is every allowed to win a war than gas prices.
The average urban gay Fed in DC doesn't give two shits whether I can fill up my Tundra as long as it/wtf is that has what it needs.
The average urban gay Fed in DC doesn't give two shits whether I can fill up my Tundra as long as it/wtf is that has what it needs.
Posted by: sifty boones of strawberry hill at June 22, 2026 11:24 AM (rR5Mv)
79
Bounce the rubble
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at June 22, 2026 11:02 AM (Kt19C)
-
Bounce the rubble > rocking the kasbah
Posted by: Biden's Dog sniffs a whole lotta malarkey, at June 22, 2026 11:22 AM (V6d0j)
Better than burning down the house?
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at June 22, 2026 11:02 AM (Kt19C)
-
Bounce the rubble > rocking the kasbah
Posted by: Biden's Dog sniffs a whole lotta malarkey, at June 22, 2026 11:22 AM (V6d0j)
Better than burning down the house?
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:24 AM (dK+Kv)
80
>>I was over there in 87-88 during the tanker wars escorting reflagged kuwati oil tankers through the gulf
Oh, was that you?
/flying out of Masirah, Oman during Earnest Will, providing overwatch/ISR to the battle group escorting tankers in the PG.
Oh, was that you?
/flying out of Masirah, Oman during Earnest Will, providing overwatch/ISR to the battle group escorting tankers in the PG.
Posted by: one hour sober at June 22, 2026 11:24 AM (J4Dwc)
81
Same with Ukraine ... are they actually almost winning now? Reports say Russia dumps their draftees into zones with no real support or mission, and drones bring in erratic supplies, and some of them are killing each other. Parts of Europe seem more interested than before in backing Ukraine ... I still prefer Ukraine "WIN", but can't get a good grip on the intel.
Posted by: illiniwek at June 22, 2026 11:21 AM (vbXSk)
No one wants to understand that in war I am the first to die.
Posted by: illiniwek at June 22, 2026 11:21 AM (vbXSk)
No one wants to understand that in war I am the first to die.
Posted by: The Truth at June 22, 2026 11:24 AM (T6aVk)
82
71 One big issue is believing that the Iranians will react like rational western societies would; but there's every indication that they will openly and laughingly violate the MOU at every single point - because their goal is not to get an "agreement", but to humiliate and ridicule America in the most open possible way.
The leadership now is, if anything, even more radical than the leadership before.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (edUvp)
=======
There are obvious signs that the civilian government is splitting with the IRGC.
The civilian government seems to want to live and take in the Gulf State investment. The IRGC seems to want to ride around the Strait of Hormuz threatening Indian tankers while getting wiped out by US Apache helicopters.
The leadership now is, if anything, even more radical than the leadership before.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (edUvp)
=======
There are obvious signs that the civilian government is splitting with the IRGC.
The civilian government seems to want to live and take in the Gulf State investment. The IRGC seems to want to ride around the Strait of Hormuz threatening Indian tankers while getting wiped out by US Apache helicopters.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:24 AM (Zn6QU)
83
Breaking stuff is all well and fine up to a point. Maybe we have to break all of Iran/IRGC's shit. I've no idea. But I too reject having to go back in a year or whatever and pay to rebuild Iran's petro-infrastructure because we wrecked all of it.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 22, 2026 11:24 AM (jehhT)
84
Gas prices here in Florida have already plummeted by close to a buck a gallon in just the last week… I doubt gas prices affect the midterms
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (gZZCh)
85
But I too reject having to go back in a year or whatever and pay to rebuild Iran's petro-infrastructure because we wrecked all of it.
---------------
If we rebuild it, we own it.
---------------
If we rebuild it, we own it.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (qCV5n)
86
84 Gas prices here in Florida have already plummeted by close to a buck a gallon in just the last week… I doubt gas prices affect the midterms
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (gZZCh)
=======
I remember when Goode and Pretti getting themselves killed was going to lead to Democrat wins in the midterms.
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (gZZCh)
=======
I remember when Goode and Pretti getting themselves killed was going to lead to Democrat wins in the midterms.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (Zn6QU)
87
84 Gas prices here in Florida have already plummeted by close to a buck a gallon in just the last week…
saw this morning as i was driving in to work that gas prices are under $6/gal here. 'bout fainted from shock.
saw this morning as i was driving in to work that gas prices are under $6/gal here. 'bout fainted from shock.
Posted by: anachronda at June 22, 2026 11:26 AM (sGtp+)
88
>>This not a US / Iran deal only. The negotiations are part of a larger Middle East realignment .
Agree 100%. And not just about Iran. Anyone who has traveled to the ME over the last few decades know that China has been making significant inroads in that region and to a lesser extent Russia. It's also about neutering their influence.
Agree 100%. And not just about Iran. Anyone who has traveled to the ME over the last few decades know that China has been making significant inroads in that region and to a lesser extent Russia. It's also about neutering their influence.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:26 AM (viF8m)
89
Whatever happened to the old rule: never negotiate with terrorists
Posted by: LinusVanPelt
We ALWAYS negotiate with terrorists.
Whatever happened to the old rule: never negotiate with terrorists
Posted by: LinusVanPelt
We ALWAYS negotiate with terrorists.
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at June 22, 2026 11:26 AM (Cqx++)
90
Maybe we have to break all of Iran/IRGC's shit. I've no idea. But I too reject having to go back in a year or whatever and pay to rebuild Iran's petro-infrastructure because we wrecked all of it."
Exactly so.
Exactly so.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:26 AM (cGjQu)
91
85 But I too reject having to go back in a year or whatever and pay to rebuild Iran's petro-infrastructure because we wrecked all of it.
---------------
If we rebuild it, we own it.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (qCV5n)
=======
The idea is that the Gulf States will rebuild it (they'll fund the $300 billion, not us) and own it. Tying key infrastructure and industry to regional powers that are antagonistic to the Islamic Republic's terrorism.
---------------
If we rebuild it, we own it.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (qCV5n)
=======
The idea is that the Gulf States will rebuild it (they'll fund the $300 billion, not us) and own it. Tying key infrastructure and industry to regional powers that are antagonistic to the Islamic Republic's terrorism.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:26 AM (Zn6QU)
92
Concur.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:17 AM (Riz8t)
Pushing $4 a month ago. Down to $3.19 now at one station I frequent.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:17 AM (Riz8t)
Pushing $4 a month ago. Down to $3.19 now at one station I frequent.
Posted by: Cow Demon at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (T6aVk)
93
MOU or ultimate agreement doesn't matter. Iran won't abide. My answer to the question is keep the pressure on economically peppering with occasional bombing and rebel arming until the islamic regime falls.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (n5tGW)
94
Why is there some assumption that if we were to destroy the Iranian oil industry that we must or should rebuild it? That would seem to be a fruity European and heathen Chinaman problem, FWIW.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (BI5O2)
95
I doubt gas prices affect the midterms
---------------
I disagree because I think indirectly they reinforce the narrative. Trump will say we won the Iran deal, the Dems and GOPe will say we lost. Lower gas prices will be his proof we won. And his proof that the Dems and hawks are clueless. There is the side benefit of costing less, but I think it more just reinforces the narrative Trump is selling.
---------------
I disagree because I think indirectly they reinforce the narrative. Trump will say we won the Iran deal, the Dems and GOPe will say we lost. Lower gas prices will be his proof we won. And his proof that the Dems and hawks are clueless. There is the side benefit of costing less, but I think it more just reinforces the narrative Trump is selling.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (qCV5n)
96
Pushing $4 a month ago. Down to $3.19 now at one station I frequent.
So YOU'RE the guy siphoning gas out of my car!?
So YOU'RE the guy siphoning gas out of my car!?
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (Riz8t)
97
If gas goes below $3 Trump and the Rep candidates will compared prices to what they were under the Biden Junta and the FNM will tell us the government has no impact on the price of gas.
Of course if it was >$4 the FNM would tell is it was Trump's fault.
Of course if it was >$4 the FNM would tell is it was Trump's fault.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (sKqQm)
98
The Atlantic had a piece crowing how the war has been a failure. I also suspect they'll try to pin any perceived failures on JD's involvement as well when he runs for president. But any arguments on its failure pales in comparison to Ukraine, so...
Also, to wound Trump, they make damning comparisons to Obama's Iran deal that hurt Obama! Interesting.
Trump in Defeat
By Jonathan Lemire
"President trump lost. The war he waged against Iran promises to conclude in a humbling whimper with the signing of a cease-fire agreement later this week. The United States is left weaker—diminished militarily, strategically, economically, and perhaps morally...
The war has cost trump. It has rattled the nation’s economy. The Pentagon estimated that it had spent roughly $29 billion on the conflict by mid-May, but independent experts believe that it has spent tens of billions more. The U.S. military’s munitions supply has been depleted, putting at risk its ability to defend its interests in Asia and Europe. The United States’ failure, despite its overwhelming military might, to bring Iran to its knees could encourage China, Russia, or North Korea to take aggressive action."
Now do Ukraine...
Also, to wound Trump, they make damning comparisons to Obama's Iran deal that hurt Obama! Interesting.
Trump in Defeat
By Jonathan Lemire
"President trump lost. The war he waged against Iran promises to conclude in a humbling whimper with the signing of a cease-fire agreement later this week. The United States is left weaker—diminished militarily, strategically, economically, and perhaps morally...
The war has cost trump. It has rattled the nation’s economy. The Pentagon estimated that it had spent roughly $29 billion on the conflict by mid-May, but independent experts believe that it has spent tens of billions more. The U.S. military’s munitions supply has been depleted, putting at risk its ability to defend its interests in Asia and Europe. The United States’ failure, despite its overwhelming military might, to bring Iran to its knees could encourage China, Russia, or North Korea to take aggressive action."
Now do Ukraine...
Posted by: LizLem at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (gWBY1)
99
Long drawn out war = Russia Winning. And it will go longer. And yes this is what I said would happen when the majority of the back and forth noise was guaranteeing quick wins for respective sides.
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (22ggK)
100
Granted I don't fill up often but I haven't paid over $4 since the war started in the Houston area. Maybe my timing is just good.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (GP8V/)
101
68 AI and auto cucumber sucks balls.
in the end, isn't the real ai the friends we made along the way?
in the end, isn't the real ai the friends we made along the way?
Posted by: anachronda at June 22, 2026 11:29 AM (sGtp+)
102
67 "Boots on the ground" is a false specter being used to scare the normies.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (mWKAz)
"Regime change" is a nebulous unspecified concept used to appeal to the same.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (dK+Kv)
I agree with both statements; the thing is, opening the straits for traffic can be done without "regime change" or a full invasion. Hegseth submitted plans for this 2 months ago, but was never given approval. The strategic islands in the straits need to be taken (small garrisons, not difficult) and all port facilities and radar installations along the straits need to be eliminated, also not a difficult task.
A great mystery is the reason why, in our original series of attacks, we only eliminated a few major targets in the straits, but left so much else unscathed. Such as the surveillance facilities on Qeshm island, we hit a couple every now and then, but the island is still Iran's forward military base in the straits. And it's still fully operational.
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:20 AM (mWKAz)
"Regime change" is a nebulous unspecified concept used to appeal to the same.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:23 AM (dK+Kv)
I agree with both statements; the thing is, opening the straits for traffic can be done without "regime change" or a full invasion. Hegseth submitted plans for this 2 months ago, but was never given approval. The strategic islands in the straits need to be taken (small garrisons, not difficult) and all port facilities and radar installations along the straits need to be eliminated, also not a difficult task.
A great mystery is the reason why, in our original series of attacks, we only eliminated a few major targets in the straits, but left so much else unscathed. Such as the surveillance facilities on Qeshm island, we hit a couple every now and then, but the island is still Iran's forward military base in the straits. And it's still fully operational.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:29 AM (edUvp)
103
Iran should be wiped off the face of the earth. No difference between them and the nazis, imperial japs or russian commies. But that would mean millions dead and billions in cost, so we get what we got today Which is a shit sandwhich.
Posted by: Take A Bite at June 22, 2026 11:29 AM (g7saB)
104
Gas prices affect other prices as well because goods have to be shipped to stores or delivered to your house
The left wants to use an inflation narrative against Trump so they'd love to have increased prices due to fuel costs
The left wants to use an inflation narrative against Trump so they'd love to have increased prices due to fuel costs
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:29 AM (sKqQm)
105
An absolutely outstanding post Buck. Thank you
Posted by: Rufus T. Firefly at June 22, 2026 11:29 AM (rRKh+)
106
97 If gas goes below $3 Trump and the Rep candidates will compared prices to what they were under the Biden Junta and the FNM will tell us the government has no impact on the price of gas.
Of course if it was >$4 the FNM would tell is it was Trump's fault.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (sKqQm)
=======
We're going to have an oil glut by September (we were going to have one with the strait being in flux no matter what because of rerouted supply and decreasing demand for a couple of major reasons).
If refinement can keep up, we'll probably see a sans-CA national average of no more than $2.50. Probably less.
Of course if it was >$4 the FNM would tell is it was Trump's fault.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (sKqQm)
=======
We're going to have an oil glut by September (we were going to have one with the strait being in flux no matter what because of rerouted supply and decreasing demand for a couple of major reasons).
If refinement can keep up, we'll probably see a sans-CA national average of no more than $2.50. Probably less.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:29 AM (Zn6QU)
107
Why is there some assumption that if we were to destroy the Iranian oil industry that we must or should rebuild it? That would seem to be a fruity European and heathen Chinaman problem, FWIW.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (BI5O2)
I agree completely. I see no reason why we’d have to fix anything we broke… big picture they started the whole thing with embassy hostages in 79… FAFO delayed by 47 years
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (BI5O2)
I agree completely. I see no reason why we’d have to fix anything we broke… big picture they started the whole thing with embassy hostages in 79… FAFO delayed by 47 years
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at June 22, 2026 11:30 AM (gZZCh)
108
MOU or ultimate agreement doesn't matter. Iran won't abide."
Probably not. So? Recall JRR Tolkien's take on the future...
Probably not. So? Recall JRR Tolkien's take on the future...
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:30 AM (cGjQu)
109
My reading of leftwing forums has found the most common view is disappointment that Trump isn't going to pull a Shrub and send 200K American troops to occupy and police it.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:10 AM (sKqQm)
Which is entirely because they wanted to bitch about that. So, instead, they'll bitch that he didn't do that because all they do is bitch about Trump.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:10 AM (sKqQm)
Which is entirely because they wanted to bitch about that. So, instead, they'll bitch that he didn't do that because all they do is bitch about Trump.
Posted by: I used to have a different nic at June 22, 2026 11:30 AM (ExV1e)
110
When Trump demanded "unconditional surrender", I assumed he meant the Iranians.
I was wrong.
I was wrong.
Posted by: proudvastrightwingguy at June 22, 2026 11:30 AM (MNCvZ)
111
The Atlantic had a piece crowing how the war has been a failure. I also suspect they'll try to pin any perceived failures on JD's involvement as well when he runs for president. But any arguments on its failure pales in comparison to Ukraine, so...
Also, to wound Trump, they make damning comparisons to Obama's Iran deal that hurt Obama! Interesting.
Trump in Defeat
By Jonathan Lemire
Oh no! Now neither of their readers will vote for Vance.
Also, to wound Trump, they make damning comparisons to Obama's Iran deal that hurt Obama! Interesting.
Trump in Defeat
By Jonathan Lemire
Oh no! Now neither of their readers will vote for Vance.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:30 AM (Riz8t)
112
Does anyone believe Iran will abide by anything it agrees to on a piece of paper?
Posted by: Heroq at June 22, 2026 11:30 AM (JpaWp)
113
That would seem to be a fruity European and heathen Chinaman problem, FWIW.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (BI5O2)
====
In a rather saucy mood today, eh?
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (BI5O2)
====
In a rather saucy mood today, eh?
Posted by: San Franpsycho at June 22, 2026 11:31 AM (mWKAz)
114
Iran is not our only problem.
Chicago mayor ignores dozens of shootings over the weekend, discusses "Transfemicide State of Emergency" instead
Chicago mayor ignores dozens of shootings over the weekend, discusses "Transfemicide State of Emergency" instead
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:31 AM (ndZc7)
115
Look at what is happening in South America. Taking out Maduro paved the way for the election results that are being realized. That hurt China in a big way too.
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:31 AM (afJtY)
116
how much cheaper would gas be if we didn't add corn to it?
we already know gas mileage would increase
we already know gas mileage would increase
Posted by: DanMan at June 22, 2026 11:31 AM (8uzBS)
117
MOU or ultimate agreement doesn't matter. Iran won't abide. My answer to the question is keep the pressure on economically peppering with occasional bombing and rebel arming until the islamic regime falls.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (n5tGW)
A sensible take on the issue.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (n5tGW)
A sensible take on the issue.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2026 11:31 AM (1z8ji)
118
Does anyone believe Iran will abide by anything it agrees to on a piece of paper?"
Nope. So what?
Nope. So what?
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:32 AM (cGjQu)
119
No difference between them and the nazis, imperial japs or russian commies.
Posted by: Take A Bite at June 22, 2026 11:29 AM (g7saB)
Well, we nuked Japan, and we allied with the Russians to defeat the Nazis. So, there are just a few small differences. Not to be THAT guy.
Posted by: Take A Bite at June 22, 2026 11:29 AM (g7saB)
Well, we nuked Japan, and we allied with the Russians to defeat the Nazis. So, there are just a few small differences. Not to be THAT guy.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:32 AM (dK+Kv)
120
MOU or ultimate agreement doesn't matter. Iran won't abide.
-------------
Obviously Trump knows that and you use that fact to your advantage.
-------------
Obviously Trump knows that and you use that fact to your advantage.
Posted by: SH at June 22, 2026 11:32 AM (qCV5n)
121
I believe very strongly that the ruling class should stop supporting the bad guys and resisting Trump.
Posted by: Emmie, celebrating 250 years of God's grace at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (VTKnR)
122
>>Does anyone believe Iran will abide by anything it agrees to on a piece of paper?
Do you believe we no longer possess the means to keep punishing Iran when they inevitably break their promises?
Some of you seem to think Iran can live on air and the destruction of their economy is simply a mild inconvenience.
Do you believe we no longer possess the means to keep punishing Iran when they inevitably break their promises?
Some of you seem to think Iran can live on air and the destruction of their economy is simply a mild inconvenience.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (viF8m)
123
what polynikes said...gas is close to $3 sw of Houston
Posted by: DanMan at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (8uzBS)
124
121 I believe very strongly that the ruling class should stop supporting the bad guys and resisting Trump.
Posted by: Emmie, celebrating 250 years of God's grace at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (VTKnR)
=====
"Look at that bitch eating crackers like he owns the place."
-the ruling class when viewing Trump
Posted by: Emmie, celebrating 250 years of God's grace at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (VTKnR)
=====
"Look at that bitch eating crackers like he owns the place."
-the ruling class when viewing Trump
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (Zn6QU)
125
117 MOU or ultimate agreement doesn't matter. Iran won't abide. My answer to the question is keep the pressure on economically peppering with occasional bombing and rebel arming until the islamic regime falls.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (n5tGW)
A sensible take on the issue.
It lacks certainty and simplicity. That's always the way to go.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 11:27 AM (n5tGW)
A sensible take on the issue.
It lacks certainty and simplicity. That's always the way to go.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (Riz8t)
126
I don't listen to opinions coming from people who believe a man can be a woman, that 29 billion is a lot compared to 150 billion for Ukraine and that celebrating our 250th anniversary is jingoistic.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:34 AM (GP8V/)
127
So YOU'RE the guy siphoning gas out of my car!?
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (Riz8t)
(Spits) um, no, not me! Why do you ask???
: )
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:28 AM (Riz8t)
(Spits) um, no, not me! Why do you ask???
: )
Posted by: Cow Demon at June 22, 2026 11:34 AM (T6aVk)
128
Anyone know how much money Iran has received since the signing of the MOU?
Remember, we were told that they would instantly get access to $300 billion, plus $12 billion in frozen assets.
You know how much they've gotten?
$0.
They've gotten nothing. They complain about it. The US treasury has confirmed.
Why? Because Iran is not abiding by the MOU and is threatening the strait.
Remember, we were told that they would instantly get access to $300 billion, plus $12 billion in frozen assets.
You know how much they've gotten?
$0.
They've gotten nothing. They complain about it. The US treasury has confirmed.
Why? Because Iran is not abiding by the MOU and is threatening the strait.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
129
Does anyone believe Iran will abide by anything it agrees to on a piece of paper?"
Nope. So what?
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:32 AM (cGjQu)
So it’s all moot and theater.
Trump will hail incredibly terrific yuuuge agreement to end all nuclear programs in Iran. And the very next day all the nuclear engineers will go back to work at their nuclear program jobs.
And we’ll be right back where we started.
Nope. So what?
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:32 AM (cGjQu)
So it’s all moot and theater.
Trump will hail incredibly terrific yuuuge agreement to end all nuclear programs in Iran. And the very next day all the nuclear engineers will go back to work at their nuclear program jobs.
And we’ll be right back where we started.
Posted by: Heroq at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (JpaWp)
130
115 Look at what is happening in South America. Taking out Maduro paved the way for the election results that are being realized. That hurt China in a big way too.
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:31 AM (afJtY)
agreed, although I suspect that what really did it was eliminating USAID. Venezuela facilitating the hit on Nino Guerrero was a nice touch. Delcy Rodriguez realizes it's in her and her families best interest to gradually eliminate all rival bases of power inside Venezuela.
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:31 AM (afJtY)
agreed, although I suspect that what really did it was eliminating USAID. Venezuela facilitating the hit on Nino Guerrero was a nice touch. Delcy Rodriguez realizes it's in her and her families best interest to gradually eliminate all rival bases of power inside Venezuela.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (edUvp)
131
I believe very strongly that the ruling class should stop supporting the bad guys and resisting Trump.
Posted by: Emmie, celebrating 250 years of God's grace at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (VTKnR)
=====
Well!
How gauche!
*grasps pearl necklace *
Posted by: Emmie, celebrating 250 years of God's grace at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (VTKnR)
=====
Well!
How gauche!
*grasps pearl necklace *
Posted by: Maryjane Cuthbertson-Klein from Groton, CT at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (mWKAz)
132
The Reluctant Lunch - a new novel by Thomas Pynchon.
Posted by: Pendant Publishing Presents at June 22, 2026 11:07 AM (pBJ6M)
THE RELUCTANT LUNCH
Chapter One
A sandwich comes across your plate.
It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
It is too late. Your Luncheon still proceeds, but it's all theatre. There is no bacon inside the bread slices. No bacon anywhere. Above you drift dreams old as Quiznos, and Ranch Dressing somewhere far above that would let the teeth of your mouth bite. But it's Pastrami on White Bread with Mayo. You're afraid of the way the soft white bred will soon clump, stuck upon the roof of your mouth. It will be a spectacle: the failure of your lunch. But coming down in a brown paper bag, without one single Fritos Brand Corn Chip, only great invisible saddening hunger.
...
Posted by: Pendant Publishing Presents at June 22, 2026 11:07 AM (pBJ6M)
THE RELUCTANT LUNCH
Chapter One
A sandwich comes across your plate.
It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
It is too late. Your Luncheon still proceeds, but it's all theatre. There is no bacon inside the bread slices. No bacon anywhere. Above you drift dreams old as Quiznos, and Ranch Dressing somewhere far above that would let the teeth of your mouth bite. But it's Pastrami on White Bread with Mayo. You're afraid of the way the soft white bred will soon clump, stuck upon the roof of your mouth. It will be a spectacle: the failure of your lunch. But coming down in a brown paper bag, without one single Fritos Brand Corn Chip, only great invisible saddening hunger.
...
Posted by: naturalfake at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (iJfKG)
133
Remember, we were told that they would instantly get access to $300 billion, plus $12 billion in frozen assets.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
lol
So much BS.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
lol
So much BS.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (dK+Kv)
134
Who is going to be their ally? Russia and China are collapsing. Sunnis hate Shia.
But Trump's a blustering blowhard.
Posted by: Auspex
===============
By the way, I've often heard that this wasn't all about Iran; it was about China. I'm losing the narrative, so can anyone tell me what we're demonstrating to China -- or better still, doing to China?
Who is going to be their ally? Russia and China are collapsing. Sunnis hate Shia.
But Trump's a blustering blowhard.
Posted by: Auspex
===============
By the way, I've often heard that this wasn't all about Iran; it was about China. I'm losing the narrative, so can anyone tell me what we're demonstrating to China -- or better still, doing to China?
Posted by: Blonde Morticia at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (XJ22o)
135
Iran is not our only problem.
That is true.
Not of our foreign enemies like Iran, China, or the EU are the primary problem which is the enemy at home.
And the way you deal with that problem is focus everything on winning the midterms.
Imagine, for example, if there are 2 SC resignations/deaths in the next 2 years.
What we get will be very different if there are 55, 52, or 49 R Senators...
That is true.
Not of our foreign enemies like Iran, China, or the EU are the primary problem which is the enemy at home.
And the way you deal with that problem is focus everything on winning the midterms.
Imagine, for example, if there are 2 SC resignations/deaths in the next 2 years.
What we get will be very different if there are 55, 52, or 49 R Senators...
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (sKqQm)
136
Bessent is still.tying any release of funds to food aid that comes from the USA grown by American farmers.
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (afJtY)
137
133 Remember, we were told that they would instantly get access to $300 billion, plus $12 billion in frozen assets.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
lol
So much BS.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (dK+Kv)
=====
Well, it's what fed the narrative of the US defeat. So, it had to be true.
Otherwise, Trump would know what he's doing, and that's just not possible.
He's a dumb poopy head.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
lol
So much BS.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (dK+Kv)
=====
Well, it's what fed the narrative of the US defeat. So, it had to be true.
Otherwise, Trump would know what he's doing, and that's just not possible.
He's a dumb poopy head.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (Zn6QU)
138
Some of you seem to think Iran can live on air and the destruction of their economy is simply a mild inconvenience.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (viF8m)
I know, man.
We demonstrated, quite literally weeks ago, that devastating this country is a trivial matter for the United States, and can be done at will. They're powerless to prevent us from assraping them anytime we want.
There is always the problem of the will to rape that particular ass. But the ability to do it is no longer in question.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:33 AM (viF8m)
I know, man.
We demonstrated, quite literally weeks ago, that devastating this country is a trivial matter for the United States, and can be done at will. They're powerless to prevent us from assraping them anytime we want.
There is always the problem of the will to rape that particular ass. But the ability to do it is no longer in question.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (BI5O2)
139
>>>Gas prices affect other prices as well because goods have to be shipped to stores or delivered to your house
The left wants to use an inflation narrative against Trump so they'd love to have increased prices due to fuel costs
Posted by: 18-1
>This shouldn't even be an issue with the advent of EVs. I don't buy it.
The left wants to use an inflation narrative against Trump so they'd love to have increased prices due to fuel costs
Posted by: 18-1
>This shouldn't even be an issue with the advent of EVs. I don't buy it.
Posted by: Rev. Wishbone at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (fkjGs)
140
I know little - just enough to understand that we have to pay attention. Decided to drag this over from a prior thread commented upon -
>The National Council of Resistance of Iran (NCRI) has held its annual grand gathering and political events in France for over 20 years, traditionally hosting the massive summits since 2004.
French police just banned & dispensed a massive planned rally by the National Council of Resistance of Iran (NCRI) in Paris on June 20th, citing fears of clashes and a tense international context. Authorities also arrested approximately 20 demonstrators who defied the ban, with organizers reporting 12 injuries as police used pepper spray to break up the gathering.
---
31. I don't think the MOU has anything to do with the midterms, actually.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison
Agreed.
Also think the progressives are going for the economy and its effects on the "average working families" since C19 (2020), however they must twist to present it as real.
Also lots of drama about social security & Medicare, pushing deeper into universal healthcare, setting up for Presidential election campaign. Oh, and climate, the great jobs boondoggle.
>The National Council of Resistance of Iran (NCRI) has held its annual grand gathering and political events in France for over 20 years, traditionally hosting the massive summits since 2004.
French police just banned & dispensed a massive planned rally by the National Council of Resistance of Iran (NCRI) in Paris on June 20th, citing fears of clashes and a tense international context. Authorities also arrested approximately 20 demonstrators who defied the ban, with organizers reporting 12 injuries as police used pepper spray to break up the gathering.
---
31. I don't think the MOU has anything to do with the midterms, actually.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison
Agreed.
Also think the progressives are going for the economy and its effects on the "average working families" since C19 (2020), however they must twist to present it as real.
Also lots of drama about social security & Medicare, pushing deeper into universal healthcare, setting up for Presidential election campaign. Oh, and climate, the great jobs boondoggle.
Posted by: L - No nic, another fine day at June 22, 2026 11:37 AM (NFX2v)
141
One positive about all this every enemy world leader does have to worry if they screw with the US enough their might be a missile or a drone with their name on it.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:37 AM (sKqQm)
142
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
What are they getting from the Arab world?
What are they getting from the Arab world?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 22, 2026 11:37 AM (PLxDd)
143
Betcha can't wait for me.
Posted by: The Recalcitrant Dinner at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM (Ov6Yl)
144
At least so far, we have not seen a reference to the Straight of Hormuz.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM (1z8ji)
145
>>Trump will hail incredibly terrific yuuuge agreement to end all nuclear programs in Iran. And the very next day all the nuclear engineers will go back to work at their nuclear program jobs.
Yes, of course. It seems absolutely clear that Trump will allow Iran to restart their nuclear program.
Yes, of course. It seems absolutely clear that Trump will allow Iran to restart their nuclear program.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM (viF8m)
146
Imagine, for example, if there are 2 SC resignations/deaths in the next 2 years.
What we get will be very different if there are 55, 52, or 49 R Senators...
Yeah, but...I don't like Susan Collins, so we should get rid of her and let a Democrat take over!
What we get will be very different if there are 55, 52, or 49 R Senators...
Yeah, but...I don't like Susan Collins, so we should get rid of her and let a Democrat take over!
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM (Riz8t)
147
I agree gas price is way overblown as a political thing. People do love to complain about it. Even though in terms of actual costs gas going up $1 translates to $400-500 a year for the typical driver. It’s not nothing but it’s also not life altering money the way some people and especially the msm act.
Posted by: Heroq at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM (JpaWp)
148
remember when Goode and Pretti getting themselves killed was going to lead to Democrat wins in the midterms.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (Zn6QU)
Eggs
Epstein
Signal
Firing Bondi
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:25 AM (Zn6QU)
Eggs
Epstein
Signal
Firing Bondi
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 11:39 AM (22ggK)
149
Nope. So what? >>>
My point is that it's not worth debating individual parts of any agreement with them. I was just answering the "finish the job" question.
My point is that it's not worth debating individual parts of any agreement with them. I was just answering the "finish the job" question.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 11:39 AM (n5tGW)
150
Trump had no problem with Obama's Iran deal except the fact that Obama paid Iran all the money up front instead of piecemeal when they complied with the agreement. He ridiculed that harshly.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:39 AM (GP8V/)
151
142 Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
What are they getting from the Arab world?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 22, 2026 11:37 AM (PLxDd)
=====
Outside of some trade?
Nothing.
The $300 billion fund was outlined in the MOU as being available to Iran when the MOU was finished, not as a signing bonus. It's a carrot to actually finish negotiations (at which point they may get it, assuming all the other issues are sorted out) and follow through, not to just get them to talk.
They were already talking.
What are they getting from the Arab world?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 22, 2026 11:37 AM (PLxDd)
=====
Outside of some trade?
Nothing.
The $300 billion fund was outlined in the MOU as being available to Iran when the MOU was finished, not as a signing bonus. It's a carrot to actually finish negotiations (at which point they may get it, assuming all the other issues are sorted out) and follow through, not to just get them to talk.
They were already talking.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:39 AM (Zn6QU)
152
Well, it's what fed the narrative of the US defeat. So, it had to be true.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (Zn6QU)
We're far from victory, for sure. But I expect goalposts to be moving like a mofo as any progress is made.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (Zn6QU)
We're far from victory, for sure. But I expect goalposts to be moving like a mofo as any progress is made.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:39 AM (dK+Kv)
153
>>Trump had no problem with Obama's Iran deal except the fact that Obama paid Iran all the money up front instead of piecemeal when they complied with the agreement. He ridiculed that harshly.
Then why did he famously end it during his first term?
Then why did he famously end it during his first term?
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (viF8m)
154
They've gotten nothing. They complain about it. The US treasury has confirmed.
Why? Because Iran is not abiding by the MOU and is threatening the strait.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
You mean to say that they've gotten nothing from the US. Since US sanctions were lifted on Friday, money is already flowing in from China, Turkey, Russia, Qatar, and Pakistan. Cargo ships full of goods are entering Iranian ports freely; 36 million barrels of Iranian oil has already been shipped out.
For better or for worse, the plan of putting Iran under economic pressure completely collapsed this weekend.
Why? Because Iran is not abiding by the MOU and is threatening the strait.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (Zn6QU)
You mean to say that they've gotten nothing from the US. Since US sanctions were lifted on Friday, money is already flowing in from China, Turkey, Russia, Qatar, and Pakistan. Cargo ships full of goods are entering Iranian ports freely; 36 million barrels of Iranian oil has already been shipped out.
For better or for worse, the plan of putting Iran under economic pressure completely collapsed this weekend.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (edUvp)
155
Yes, of course. It seems absolutely clear that Trump will allow Iran to restart their nuclear program.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM (viF8m)
How’s he going to stop them?
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM (viF8m)
How’s he going to stop them?
Posted by: Heroq at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (JpaWp)
156
152 Well, it's what fed the narrative of the US defeat. So, it had to be true.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (Zn6QU)
We're far from victory, for sure. But I expect goalposts to be moving like a mofo as any progress is made.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:39 AM (dK+Kv)
======
You should see how many cargo vessels are coming into Iranian ports now that the blockade is over!
It's almost none.
Almost no one wants to actually trade with Iran now.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:36 AM (Zn6QU)
We're far from victory, for sure. But I expect goalposts to be moving like a mofo as any progress is made.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:39 AM (dK+Kv)
======
You should see how many cargo vessels are coming into Iranian ports now that the blockade is over!
It's almost none.
Almost no one wants to actually trade with Iran now.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (Zn6QU)
157
They won't be have until the last Imam is gone, Iran is a hopeless case
Posted by: Skip at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (sgkY8)
158
You can kill thousands of soldiers but the world damns you for targeting enemy leaders. Yes "the world" in this context are people that would kill Trump given a chance and well, us too, but for some reason the right also listens to these people.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:15 AM (sKqQm)
The movers and shakers on the right are members in good standing of the WEF Global Aristocracy also.
Common people are cattle, meat to be used for the amusement of their betters. Slaughter all you like but never touch a hair on the head of one of the anointed.
Same as it ever was.
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:15 AM (sKqQm)
The movers and shakers on the right are members in good standing of the WEF Global Aristocracy also.
Common people are cattle, meat to be used for the amusement of their betters. Slaughter all you like but never touch a hair on the head of one of the anointed.
Same as it ever was.
Posted by: I used to have a different nic at June 22, 2026 11:41 AM (ExV1e)
159
143 Betcha can't wait for me.
Posted by: The Recalcitrant Dinner at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM
++++
I'm sitting right here.
Posted by: The Recalcitrant Dinner at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM
++++
I'm sitting right here.
Posted by: The Bumptious Breakfast at June 22, 2026 11:42 AM (Ov6Yl)
160
Also lots of drama about social security & Medicare, pushing deeper into universal healthcare, setting up for Presidential election campaign. Oh, and climate, the great jobs boondoggle.
I occasionally read that OCare is failing, and yet enrollment is near record highs. I thought we were cutting off the subsidies.
ACA Marketplace (Obamacare) enrollment figures by year:
2026: 23.0 million
2025: 24.3 million (Record high)
2024: 21.3 million
2023: 15.6 million
2022: 13.8 million
2021: 11.2 million
2020: 10.7 million
2019: 10.6 million
2018: 10.6 million
2017: 10.3 million
2016: 11.1 million
2015: 10.2 million
2014: 6.3 million
I occasionally read that OCare is failing, and yet enrollment is near record highs. I thought we were cutting off the subsidies.
ACA Marketplace (Obamacare) enrollment figures by year:
2026: 23.0 million
2025: 24.3 million (Record high)
2024: 21.3 million
2023: 15.6 million
2022: 13.8 million
2021: 11.2 million
2020: 10.7 million
2019: 10.6 million
2018: 10.6 million
2017: 10.3 million
2016: 11.1 million
2015: 10.2 million
2014: 6.3 million
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:42 AM (Riz8t)
161
15 You mean to say that they've gotten nothing from the US. Since US sanctions were lifted on Friday, money is already flowing in from China, Turkey, Russia, Qatar, and Pakistan. Cargo ships full of goods are entering Iranian ports freely; 36 million barrels of Iranian oil has already been shipped out.
For better or for worse, the plan of putting Iran under economic pressure completely collapsed this weekend.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (edUvp)
=======
The barrels of oil they sold were already filled and in tankers. Yes, they've sold some oil, but they also have to worry about restarting their wells before they can do more.
And the cargo? It's minimal. They bought some grain from Brazil, but it's going to take 30+ days to get there.
And their GDP dropped by 50% in the past 3 months. That's what the economic damage was that they have to undo.
For better or for worse, the plan of putting Iran under economic pressure completely collapsed this weekend.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (edUvp)
=======
The barrels of oil they sold were already filled and in tankers. Yes, they've sold some oil, but they also have to worry about restarting their wells before they can do more.
And the cargo? It's minimal. They bought some grain from Brazil, but it's going to take 30+ days to get there.
And their GDP dropped by 50% in the past 3 months. That's what the economic damage was that they have to undo.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:42 AM (Zn6QU)
162
I'm losing the narrative, so can anyone tell me what we're demonstrating to China -- or better still, doing to China?"
Sure. Their vaunted techno might turned out to be... not so much. Their "support" of various governments turned out to be...useless. Most importantly, we have demonstrated that we control their cheaper energy supply, and there's not a damn thing they can do about it.
Therefore, it's in their best interest to get along. Or not. Their call.
Sure. Their vaunted techno might turned out to be... not so much. Their "support" of various governments turned out to be...useless. Most importantly, we have demonstrated that we control their cheaper energy supply, and there's not a damn thing they can do about it.
Therefore, it's in their best interest to get along. Or not. Their call.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:43 AM (cGjQu)
163
>>> Oh no! Now neither of their readers will vote for Vance. Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:30 AM (Riz8t)
Haha!
They are making a big deal on the 250th that they were the first publication to print the Battle Hymn of the Republic, and they proudly put a facsimile of the original song on their cover.
Ironic because they would never, ever publish it today. It's far too Jesus-y.
Haha!
They are making a big deal on the 250th that they were the first publication to print the Battle Hymn of the Republic, and they proudly put a facsimile of the original song on their cover.
Ironic because they would never, ever publish it today. It's far too Jesus-y.
Posted by: LizLem at June 22, 2026 11:43 AM (gWBY1)
164
>>How’s he going to stop them?
Did Trump agree to give up all of the exact same weapons he deployed to destroy their nuclear program 5 minutes ago in his negotiations with Iran?
Maybe Iran can buy more air defense systems that don't work from China.
Did Trump agree to give up all of the exact same weapons he deployed to destroy their nuclear program 5 minutes ago in his negotiations with Iran?
Maybe Iran can buy more air defense systems that don't work from China.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:43 AM (viF8m)
165
Speaking of egg prices, let's return to this talking point and the left:
2024 after Biden's flunky kills millions of chickens: Egg prices are normal only racists and science deniers claim otherwise.
Start of 2025: How dare Trump fire an expert and minority woman like that! And reverse her common sense policies! It had to be done!
Early 2025: See Trump has high egg prices he should be impeached!
Late 2025: Obviously the government has no impact on egg prices you idiots. It is all just random!
2024 after Biden's flunky kills millions of chickens: Egg prices are normal only racists and science deniers claim otherwise.
Start of 2025: How dare Trump fire an expert and minority woman like that! And reverse her common sense policies! It had to be done!
Early 2025: See Trump has high egg prices he should be impeached!
Late 2025: Obviously the government has no impact on egg prices you idiots. It is all just random!
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:43 AM (sKqQm)
166
Eesh, an Iran thread. I’m out. Please, Y’all, don’t start throwing the crockery at each other.
Posted by: Bulg at June 22, 2026 11:06 AM (77rzZ)
-
Crockery > China
Posted by: Bulg at June 22, 2026 11:06 AM (77rzZ)
-
Crockery > China
Posted by: Biden's Dog sniffs a whole lotta malarkey, at June 22, 2026 11:43 AM (V6d0j)
167
You should see how many cargo vessels are coming into Iranian ports now that the blockade is over!
It's almost none.
Almost no one wants to actually trade with Iran now.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (Zn6QU)
You and Tom Servo should confer.
It's almost none.
Almost no one wants to actually trade with Iran now.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (Zn6QU)
You and Tom Servo should confer.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:43 AM (dK+Kv)
168
My attitude right now? Wait and see. One of the aspects of this war is Iran found out their top o' the line military gear from Russia and China is worthless shit. China and Russia have to be a little weak in the knees about it too.
My main concern is if Iran secretly improves and starts large-scale manufacturing of their drones again.
My main concern is if Iran secretly improves and starts large-scale manufacturing of their drones again.
Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at June 22, 2026 11:44 AM (g8Ew8)
169
"Iran should never be able to trade again," is honestly an interesting take.
We've outright stolen $12 billion of their expatriot assets, which we're holding hostage.
Their trade can't rebound instantly, especially since we've taken or sunk most of their shadow fleet.
They have few dollars and worthless rials to trade with otherwise.
This doesn't bounce back in a weekend.
We've outright stolen $12 billion of their expatriot assets, which we're holding hostage.
Their trade can't rebound instantly, especially since we've taken or sunk most of their shadow fleet.
They have few dollars and worthless rials to trade with otherwise.
This doesn't bounce back in a weekend.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:44 AM (Zn6QU)
170
Then why did he famously end it during his first term?
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (viF8m)
You think any post that doesn't praise Trump is against Trump.
He ended it because Iran didn't comply because they didn't have to because they got paid up front. I assume his MOU won't do that .
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:40 AM (viF8m)
You think any post that doesn't praise Trump is against Trump.
He ended it because Iran didn't comply because they didn't have to because they got paid up front. I assume his MOU won't do that .
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (GP8V/)
171
I'd imagine the billions of dollars that theoretically would be released to Iran could be earmarked for certain, civilian things. That the IRGC would "steal" the money and redirect it elsewhere it pretty much a given, but if there were controls in place to prohibit that it might make a difference.
As in building schools instead of mosques. Repairing the country's infrastructure. And so on.
Shut the mullahs and the IRGC out completely... if possible. BAMN
As in building schools instead of mosques. Repairing the country's infrastructure. And so on.
Shut the mullahs and the IRGC out completely... if possible. BAMN
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (jehhT)
172
One positive about all this every enemy world leader does have to worry if they screw with the US enough their might be a missile or a drone with their name on it."
And that the Chinese defensive materials they purchased might not get the job done...
And that the Chinese defensive materials they purchased might not get the job done...
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (cGjQu)
173
You mean to say that they've gotten nothing from the US. Since US sanctions were lifted on Friday, money is already flowing in from China, Turkey, Russia, Qatar, and Pakistan. Cargo ships full of goods are entering Iranian ports freely; 36 million barrels of Iranian oil has already been shipped out.
For better or for worse, the plan of putting Iran under economic pressure completely collapsed this weekend.
You should see how many cargo vessels are coming into Iranian ports now that the blockade is over!
It's almost none.
Almost no one wants to actually trade with Iran now.
I think we need to resolve this dispute before we continue arguing.
For better or for worse, the plan of putting Iran under economic pressure completely collapsed this weekend.
You should see how many cargo vessels are coming into Iranian ports now that the blockade is over!
It's almost none.
Almost no one wants to actually trade with Iran now.
I think we need to resolve this dispute before we continue arguing.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (Riz8t)
174
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is King. The IRGC and the mullahs are still the one-eyed man in Iran. (shrugs)
Posted by: Ex Rex Reeder at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (QaH55)
175
If I had to guess, Trump probably knows that Iran will break the MOU.
Iran's whole history tells us that they will, and it tells them that we will bend and give them whatever they want.
Trump has said they will receive bombs on the tops of their heads for violating the agreement.
I suspect that will happen and then Trump can say "Welp, we gave them chance, but they want to be animals. So, bombs it is."
That part may not happen till after the election.
If I had to guess, Trump probably knows that Iran will break the MOU.
Iran's whole history tells us that they will, and it tells them that we will bend and give them whatever they want.
Trump has said they will receive bombs on the tops of their heads for violating the agreement.
I suspect that will happen and then Trump can say "Welp, we gave them chance, but they want to be animals. So, bombs it is."
That part may not happen till after the election.
Posted by: naturalfake at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (iJfKG)
176
Posted by: Maryjane Cuthbertson-Klein from Groton, CT at June 22, 2026 11:35 AM (mWKAz)
Torquewrench cries at what you did to his sock...
Torquewrench cries at what you did to his sock...
Posted by: Will Robinson at June 22, 2026 11:46 AM (zBgIx)
177
...I believe that a solid majority of Trump/MAGA voters are both America-first and solidly pro-Israel.
That's the rub, isn't it.
That's the rub, isn't it.
Posted by: "True Conservatives" Tucker Carlson, David French, Candace Owens, Jonah Goldberg, etc at June 22, 2026 11:46 AM (ycI94)
178
Another talking point I'm seeing: the new supreme leader is worse than the Ayatollah, so we killed off one baddie to replace him with a monster. So we failed at that too.
Because leaving the original Ayatollah in power was going to usher in kumbaya? Said no one.
Because leaving the original Ayatollah in power was going to usher in kumbaya? Said no one.
Posted by: LizLem at June 22, 2026 11:46 AM (gWBY1)
179
173
I think we need to resolve this dispute before we continue arguing.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (Riz8t)
=====
Money flowing in from the countries means that some of them are buying oil that Iran already had on tankers.
They're allowed to continue some trade.
But, outside of what's on those tankers, Iran is going to have to restart its wells to get more, and they don't trade much else.
These countries are not just giving Iran money, and there are very hard ceilings for what Iran can sell. Their manufacturing was destroyed at least 80% in the bombing.
I think we need to resolve this dispute before we continue arguing.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (Riz8t)
=====
Money flowing in from the countries means that some of them are buying oil that Iran already had on tankers.
They're allowed to continue some trade.
But, outside of what's on those tankers, Iran is going to have to restart its wells to get more, and they don't trade much else.
These countries are not just giving Iran money, and there are very hard ceilings for what Iran can sell. Their manufacturing was destroyed at least 80% in the bombing.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:47 AM (Zn6QU)
180
The framework signed by the U.S. and Iran involves at least $300 billion for Iranian postwar economic reconstruction.
U.S. officials explicitly state that "not a cent of American money goes to Iran."
The funding for the reconstruction is expected to come from investments by Persian Gulf states or other international entities, while the U.S. will grant the legal waivers to permit the transactions.
BBC, What's in the US-Iran agreement?
In part, "One official noted that the US is not required to pay "a cent of money" to Iran, or contribute to the fund.
As a hypothetical example, the official said that if Iran "behaves", Emirati authorities could build a power plant in Iran, with US blessing.
Trump and other officials have gone to great lengths to make clear to the US public that it will not be paying Iran directly, which the administration says stands in stark contrast to the 2015 nuclear agreement between Iran and the Obama administration."
U.S. officials explicitly state that "not a cent of American money goes to Iran."
The funding for the reconstruction is expected to come from investments by Persian Gulf states or other international entities, while the U.S. will grant the legal waivers to permit the transactions.
BBC, What's in the US-Iran agreement?
In part, "One official noted that the US is not required to pay "a cent of money" to Iran, or contribute to the fund.
As a hypothetical example, the official said that if Iran "behaves", Emirati authorities could build a power plant in Iran, with US blessing.
Trump and other officials have gone to great lengths to make clear to the US public that it will not be paying Iran directly, which the administration says stands in stark contrast to the 2015 nuclear agreement between Iran and the Obama administration."
Posted by: L - No nic, another fine day at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (NFX2v)
181
All good moslems follow the book. The book told them to kill Israeli athletes at the 72 Olympics. Nothing has changed since 72, moslems still go by the book.
Posted by: Eromero at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (LHPAg)
182
No matter what happens, this drone issue is gonna be a thing to deal with in the world. Other than the nukes, Russia turns out to be a somewhat paper tiger, but the Ukes brought them to their knees with $500 drones on infrastructure.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (n5tGW)
183
Every Picture Tells a Story.
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
184
>>You think any post that doesn't praise Trump is against Trump.
No, I simply asked you a question. You said Trump had no problem with Obama's JCPOA. Trump ended that deal his first term to much criticism from the usual spots. It was in all the papers.
Go back and look at old interviews with Trump from decades before he became president. He's been saying for decades that Iran can never have a nuclear weapon and Obama's deal did nothing to stop them from enriching. In fact, the sunset clause in the deal wouldve ended it by now.
The JCPOA was dogshit. It stopped nothing. The money was because Obama wanted to make Iran the center of power in the ME.
No, I simply asked you a question. You said Trump had no problem with Obama's JCPOA. Trump ended that deal his first term to much criticism from the usual spots. It was in all the papers.
Go back and look at old interviews with Trump from decades before he became president. He's been saying for decades that Iran can never have a nuclear weapon and Obama's deal did nothing to stop them from enriching. In fact, the sunset clause in the deal wouldve ended it by now.
The JCPOA was dogshit. It stopped nothing. The money was because Obama wanted to make Iran the center of power in the ME.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (viF8m)
185
Because leaving the original Ayatollah in power was going to usher in kumbaya?"
Shhhh. And of course the supreme leader is the moderate one. After all, assassinating Stalin would've made the USSR that much worse, dontchaknow?
Shhhh. And of course the supreme leader is the moderate one. After all, assassinating Stalin would've made the USSR that much worse, dontchaknow?
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:49 AM (cGjQu)
186
Their vaunted techno might turned out to be... not so much. Their "support" of various governments turned out to be...useless. Most importantly, we have demonstrated that we control their cheaper energy supply, and there's not a damn thing they can do about it.
It would amuse and delight me if all the money China spent on the BARI turned out to be the equivalent of sending money to a Nigerian prince.
It would amuse and delight me if all the money China spent on the BARI turned out to be the equivalent of sending money to a Nigerian prince.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:49 AM (Riz8t)
187
One positive about all this every enemy world leader does have to worry if they screw with the US enough their might be a missile or a drone with their name on it."
And that the Chinese defensive materials they purchased might not get the job done...
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (cGjQu)
That TdA leader getting a drone strike was the cherry on top of the Venzuela raid that got Maduro. I imagine that that provided a bit of clarity.
And that the Chinese defensive materials they purchased might not get the job done...
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (cGjQu)
That TdA leader getting a drone strike was the cherry on top of the Venzuela raid that got Maduro. I imagine that that provided a bit of clarity.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:49 AM (dK+Kv)
188
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
Another old fart that needs to pack it in and go away already.
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
Another old fart that needs to pack it in and go away already.
Posted by: Metamucil at June 22, 2026 11:50 AM (g7saB)
189
187
That TdA leader getting a drone strike was the cherry on top of the Venzuela raid that got Maduro. I imagine that that provided a bit of clarity.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:49 AM (dK+Kv)
=====
That was coordinated with the Venezuelan government, I believe.
That TdA leader getting a drone strike was the cherry on top of the Venzuela raid that got Maduro. I imagine that that provided a bit of clarity.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:49 AM (dK+Kv)
=====
That was coordinated with the Venezuelan government, I believe.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:50 AM (Zn6QU)
190
Because leaving the original Ayatollah in power was going to usher in kumbaya? Said no one.
Posted by: LizLem at June 22, 2026 11:46 AM (gWBY1)
I think the problem is the idea that changing leaders has any effect at all. Not in a fanatical religious system, it doesn't. Mohammed #1 is instantly replaced by Mohammed #2 is instantly replaced by Mohammed #3. It's a bug hunt that never ends.
Posted by: LizLem at June 22, 2026 11:46 AM (gWBY1)
I think the problem is the idea that changing leaders has any effect at all. Not in a fanatical religious system, it doesn't. Mohammed #1 is instantly replaced by Mohammed #2 is instantly replaced by Mohammed #3. It's a bug hunt that never ends.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:50 AM (edUvp)
191
Because leaving the original Ayatollah in power was going to usher in kumbaya?"
Shhhh. And of course the supreme leader is the moderate one. After all, assassinating Stalin would've made the USSR that much worse, dontchaknow?
And doing...something, would only create more terrorists.
Shhhh. And of course the supreme leader is the moderate one. After all, assassinating Stalin would've made the USSR that much worse, dontchaknow?
And doing...something, would only create more terrorists.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:51 AM (Riz8t)
192
>>Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Tonights the night
Gonna be ...... ahhhhhh
Tonights the night
Gonna be ...... ahhhhhh
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:51 AM (viF8m)
193
No matter what happens, this drone issue is gonna be a thing to deal with in the world"
You know, we might just have a handle on that.
Let's ask Maduro.
You know, we might just have a handle on that.
Let's ask Maduro.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 11:51 AM (cGjQu)
194
I suspect that will happen and then Trump can say "Welp, we gave them chance, but they want to be animals. So, bombs it is."
That part may not happen till after the election.
Posted by: naturalfake
Based on their history, and their obvious understanding of the US political environment, I'd expect them to clearly, publicly violate the MOU, treaty or negotiations in some way shortly before the midterms. Trump can do nothing substantial and look weak, hurting him and the GOP. He can bomb Iran again, spiking gas prices right before the midterms (and giving anti-interventionists more ammunition). Or they could offer Trump a political win with an actual peace deal, but demand very favorable terms. In many ways, I think Iran is relatively well situated, especially for a country that recently had its military smashed pretty badly, economy wrecked, and multiple top leaders killed.
That part may not happen till after the election.
Posted by: naturalfake
Based on their history, and their obvious understanding of the US political environment, I'd expect them to clearly, publicly violate the MOU, treaty or negotiations in some way shortly before the midterms. Trump can do nothing substantial and look weak, hurting him and the GOP. He can bomb Iran again, spiking gas prices right before the midterms (and giving anti-interventionists more ammunition). Or they could offer Trump a political win with an actual peace deal, but demand very favorable terms. In many ways, I think Iran is relatively well situated, especially for a country that recently had its military smashed pretty badly, economy wrecked, and multiple top leaders killed.
Posted by: Military Moron at June 22, 2026 11:51 AM (ycI94)
195
159 143 Betcha can't wait for me.
Posted by: The Recalcitrant Dinner at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM
++++
I'm sitting right here.
Posted by: The Bumptious Breakfast
right behind ya
Posted by: The Recalcitrant Dinner at June 22, 2026 11:38 AM
++++
I'm sitting right here.
Posted by: The Bumptious Breakfast
right behind ya
Posted by: enticing elevenses at June 22, 2026 11:52 AM (sGtp+)
196
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
Another old fart that needs to pack it in and go away already.
Maybe he and Springsteen can open a nice bed and breakfast somewhere.
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
Another old fart that needs to pack it in and go away already.
Maybe he and Springsteen can open a nice bed and breakfast somewhere.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:52 AM (Riz8t)
197
No matter what happens, this drone issue is gonna be a thing to deal with in the world. Other than the nukes, Russia turns out to be a somewhat paper tiger, but the Ukes brought them to their knees with $500 drones on infrastructure.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk
====
I can't help but wonder if Iran's ability to damage infrastructure in neighboring countries surprised our planners.
Its not quite MAD, but it's. . . something.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk
====
I can't help but wonder if Iran's ability to damage infrastructure in neighboring countries surprised our planners.
Its not quite MAD, but it's. . . something.
Posted by: 2009Refugee at June 22, 2026 11:52 AM (uH26z)
198
I think the problem is the idea that changing leaders has any effect at all. Not in a fanatical religious system, it doesn't. Mohammed #1 is instantly replaced by Mohammed #2 is instantly replaced by Mohammed #3. It's a bug hunt that never ends./i]
It depends on just how much of a true believer each is, and how much they fear the US versus their own underlings.
A successful change of leader from our perspective isn't going to be someone that goes from "Death to America" to "Buy a coke for everyone in America" but instead a leader that keeps saying Death to America but doesn't actually do anything about it...
It depends on just how much of a true believer each is, and how much they fear the US versus their own underlings.
A successful change of leader from our perspective isn't going to be someone that goes from "Death to America" to "Buy a coke for everyone in America" but instead a leader that keeps saying Death to America but doesn't actually do anything about it...
Posted by: 18-1 at June 22, 2026 11:52 AM (sKqQm)
199
ny ways, I think Iran is relatively well situated, especially for a country that recently had its military smashed pretty badly, economy wrecked, and multiple top leaders killed.
Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?
Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:53 AM (Riz8t)
200
Iran is desperately trying get tapped into the Qatari power grid because they cannot generate enough power to supply basic needs
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:53 AM (afJtY)
201
That was coordinated with the Venezuelan government, I believe.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:50 AM (Zn6QU)
Yep. And there is very likely similar efforts with assets in Iran to target recalcitrant IRGC leaders that are pitted against any elements that are MOU-favorable that we have been dealing with.
But to give credit to Trump/Hegseth and our Israeli allies for such consideration is probably just 4D chess mumbo jumbo or something.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:50 AM (Zn6QU)
Yep. And there is very likely similar efforts with assets in Iran to target recalcitrant IRGC leaders that are pitted against any elements that are MOU-favorable that we have been dealing with.
But to give credit to Trump/Hegseth and our Israeli allies for such consideration is probably just 4D chess mumbo jumbo or something.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:53 AM (dK+Kv)
202
The JCOPA required Iran to destroy 98% of their enriched uranium and their centrifuges. They didn't comply.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (GP8V/)
203
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Tonights the night
Gonna be ...... ahhhhhh
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:51 AM (viF8m)
Well, one thing in Rod's favor is that I haven't heard him flap his gums about politics. When not performing, he plays with his model railway outfit, which is quite spectacular.
Tonights the night
Gonna be ...... ahhhhhh
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:51 AM (viF8m)
Well, one thing in Rod's favor is that I haven't heard him flap his gums about politics. When not performing, he plays with his model railway outfit, which is quite spectacular.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (1z8ji)
204
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
That's a strange headline. I require oxygen pretty much all the time too.
That's a strange headline. I require oxygen pretty much all the time too.
Posted by: far cry at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (pBJ6M)
205
I was hoping to harm the heathen Chinese more than this.
That said, they had to sit in the cuck chair watching helplessly as the Yankees took their girlfriend by force, and wrecked up all their vaunted next-gen weapons systems with a shrug and a flick of the finger.
It hasn't gone great for these yellow devils.
That said, they had to sit in the cuck chair watching helplessly as the Yankees took their girlfriend by force, and wrecked up all their vaunted next-gen weapons systems with a shrug and a flick of the finger.
It hasn't gone great for these yellow devils.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (BI5O2)
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (ndZc7)
207
>>> I occasionally read that OCare is failing, and yet enrollment is near record highs. I thought we were cutting off the subsidies.
ACA Marketplace (Obamacare) enrollment figures by year:
2026: 23.0 million
2025: 24.3 million (Record high)
...
2014: 6.3 million
I thought it leaked out that the reason enrollment is so high is because they got illegals and refugees onto Obamacare? Something that was promised at the outset they would never, ever do?
There were rumbles on that, then nothing. Are they going to finally cut them all off? We have to stop these stupid money spigots from flowing.
Also, apparently there is new proof that money for Ukraine flowed directly into Biden reelection coffers. Not holding my breath he'll ever see justice for it or get arrested.
ACA Marketplace (Obamacare) enrollment figures by year:
2026: 23.0 million
2025: 24.3 million (Record high)
...
2014: 6.3 million
I thought it leaked out that the reason enrollment is so high is because they got illegals and refugees onto Obamacare? Something that was promised at the outset they would never, ever do?
There were rumbles on that, then nothing. Are they going to finally cut them all off? We have to stop these stupid money spigots from flowing.
Also, apparently there is new proof that money for Ukraine flowed directly into Biden reelection coffers. Not holding my breath he'll ever see justice for it or get arrested.
Posted by: LizLem at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (gWBY1)
208
ACA Marketplace (Obamacare) enrollment figures by year:
2026: 23.0 million
2025: 24.3 million (Record high)
2024: 21.3 million
2023: 15.6 million
2022: 13.8 million
2021: 11.2 million
2020: 10.7 million
2019: 10.6 million
2018: 10.6 million
2017: 10.3 million
2016: 11.1 million
2015: 10.2 million
2014: 6.3 million
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:42 AM (Riz8t)
I thought this was the payout schedule to Iran
2026: 23.0 million
2025: 24.3 million (Record high)
2024: 21.3 million
2023: 15.6 million
2022: 13.8 million
2021: 11.2 million
2020: 10.7 million
2019: 10.6 million
2018: 10.6 million
2017: 10.3 million
2016: 11.1 million
2015: 10.2 million
2014: 6.3 million
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 11:42 AM (Riz8t)
I thought this was the payout schedule to Iran
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 11:55 AM (22ggK)
209
I can't help but wonder if Iran's ability to damage infrastructure in neighboring countries surprised our planners.
Its not quite MAD, but it's. . . something.
Posted by: 2009Refugee at June 22, 2026 11:52 AM (uH26z)
It probably did, because it is more of a kamikaze move, cutting off potential allies in one swift stroke. I wouldn't have anticipated it.
Its not quite MAD, but it's. . . something.
Posted by: 2009Refugee at June 22, 2026 11:52 AM (uH26z)
It probably did, because it is more of a kamikaze move, cutting off potential allies in one swift stroke. I wouldn't have anticipated it.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:55 AM (dK+Kv)
210
I suspect that will happen and then Trump can say "Welp, we gave them chance, but they want to be animals. So, bombs it is."
That part may not happen till after the election.
Posted by: naturalfake at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (iJfKG)
I have seen many saying this, even Kurt Schlichter. Think about this for a second - it would mean that the plan was to allow Iran to rearm for 6 months, get rid of all remaining internal opposition for 6 months, use the money to build new ME alliances for 6 months, and build new impenetrable hiding spots for the leadership for 6 months - and only THEN restart the war?
That would be the most idiotic military plan in the history of idiotic military plans. Which is why I don't believe it could ever happen; it's just a massive cope to help people internalize what's been done.
That part may not happen till after the election.
Posted by: naturalfake at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (iJfKG)
I have seen many saying this, even Kurt Schlichter. Think about this for a second - it would mean that the plan was to allow Iran to rearm for 6 months, get rid of all remaining internal opposition for 6 months, use the money to build new ME alliances for 6 months, and build new impenetrable hiding spots for the leadership for 6 months - and only THEN restart the war?
That would be the most idiotic military plan in the history of idiotic military plans. Which is why I don't believe it could ever happen; it's just a massive cope to help people internalize what's been done.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (edUvp)
211
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
Ironically, Stewart was singing his big number one hit,
"Do Ya Think I'm Anoxic?"
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
Ironically, Stewart was singing his big number one hit,
"Do Ya Think I'm Anoxic?"
Posted by: naturalfake at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (iJfKG)
212
202 The JCOPA required Iran to destroy 98% of their enriched uranium and their centrifuges. They didn't comply.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (GP8V/)
The wait period on inspections existed to allow everyone to pretend that Iran had.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (GP8V/)
The wait period on inspections existed to allow everyone to pretend that Iran had.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (okun6)
213
206 Et tu, Ole Yeller?
Fox’s Mark Levin Is Now Lashing Out at Trump
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (ndZc7
As a man thinketh so is he.
Fox’s Mark Levin Is Now Lashing Out at Trump
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:54 AM (ndZc7
As a man thinketh so is he.
Posted by: Eromero at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (LHPAg)
214
Our " power competition" Russia and China aren't liking the war a bit.
Russia got a lot of weapons from Iran and used the Iranians as a proxy. No more
China is hurting for oil and is a chaotic mess otherwise. Their construction is awful at home and in the Belt and Road Initiative . Their population is cratering and unemployment is soaring. Their weaponry has been shown to be shit and they appear to be in a period of killing enemies inside the government. On the road to collapse
Russia got a lot of weapons from Iran and used the Iranians as a proxy. No more
China is hurting for oil and is a chaotic mess otherwise. Their construction is awful at home and in the Belt and Road Initiative . Their population is cratering and unemployment is soaring. Their weaponry has been shown to be shit and they appear to be in a period of killing enemies inside the government. On the road to collapse
Posted by: Smell the Glove at June 22, 2026 11:57 AM (Iurxt)
215
The only reason the mullahs are even being mentioned is that they are the front for any talks. The IRGC is a designated terrorist group
The mullahs have no power in Iran any more
The mullahs have no power in Iran any more
Posted by: Ben Had at June 22, 2026 11:57 AM (afJtY)
216
The wait period on inspections existed to allow everyone to pretend that Iran had.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (okun6)
Yeah they gave them a year and all the money .
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (okun6)
Yeah they gave them a year and all the money .
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 11:57 AM (GP8V/)
217
214 China is hurting for oil and is a chaotic mess otherwise. Their construction is awful at home and in the Belt and Road Initiative . Their population is cratering and unemployment is soaring. Their weaponry has been shown to be shit and they appear to be in a period of killing enemies inside the government. On the road to collapse
Posted by: Smell the Glove at June 22, 2026 11:57 AM (Iurxt)
=====
I remember a few months ago when they went to the IMF to ask for bailouts for the Belt and Road partners who weren't paying them back.
Posted by: Smell the Glove at June 22, 2026 11:57 AM (Iurxt)
=====
I remember a few months ago when they went to the IMF to ask for bailouts for the Belt and Road partners who weren't paying them back.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 11:57 AM (Zn6QU)
218
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
Another old fart that needs to pack it in and go away already.
Maybe he and Springsteen can open a nice bed and breakfast somewhere.
Posted by: Archimedes
At least he didn't need his stomach pumped.
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:48 AM (ndZc7)
Another old fart that needs to pack it in and go away already.
Maybe he and Springsteen can open a nice bed and breakfast somewhere.
Posted by: Archimedes
At least he didn't need his stomach pumped.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at June 22, 2026 11:58 AM (P7vXf)
219
It probably did, because it is more of a kamikaze move, cutting off potential allies in one swift stroke. I wouldn't have anticipated it.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:55 AM (dK+Kv)
I agree, none of us did. To give grudging respect to an enemy, Iran out thought us strategically in the same way that the Ukrainians have out thought Russia. They came up with ways to inflict pain that we are not, as a society, willing to bear.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 11:55 AM (dK+Kv)
I agree, none of us did. To give grudging respect to an enemy, Iran out thought us strategically in the same way that the Ukrainians have out thought Russia. They came up with ways to inflict pain that we are not, as a society, willing to bear.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:58 AM (edUvp)
220
“All white girls are slags. They don’t obey Allah, so they deserve to be punished. They should be raped as punishment for not obeying Allah.”
That was said to a Rotherham girl – now a doctor – by the men who raped her.
That was said to a Rotherham girl – now a doctor – by the men who raped her.
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks and His All White Jury! at June 22, 2026 11:58 AM (ndZc7)
221
I won't know what to think about Iran until I hear from raimondo
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 11:58 AM (22ggK)
222
I have seen many saying this, even Kurt Schlichter. Think about this for a second - it would mean that the plan was to allow Iran to rearm for 6 months, get rid of all remaining internal opposition for 6 months, use the money to build new ME alliances for 6 months, and build new impenetrable hiding spots for the leadership for 6 months - and only THEN restart the war?
That would be the most idiotic military plan in the history of idiotic military plans. Which is why I don't believe it could ever happen; it's just a massive cope to help people internalize what's been done.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (edUvp)
Hormuz gets more irrelevant the more time passes. Iran rebuilding to pre-war levels would several years, and even then we'd still have the option to go back and bomb them basically at leisure until their anti-air becomes sufficiently advanced.
That would be the most idiotic military plan in the history of idiotic military plans. Which is why I don't believe it could ever happen; it's just a massive cope to help people internalize what's been done.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (edUvp)
Hormuz gets more irrelevant the more time passes. Iran rebuilding to pre-war levels would several years, and even then we'd still have the option to go back and bomb them basically at leisure until their anti-air becomes sufficiently advanced.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (okun6)
Posted by: That Guy at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (OjdEO)
224
The MOU was forced on us (and Israel) by the Arab Gulf States.
What it does give us, is additional evidence that the Taqiya Republic cannot be trusted to honor a deal as long as it literally has a religion of deceit for a constitution. Sunni Arabs know this of course but they need to remind their people from time to time.
What it does give us, is additional evidence that the Taqiya Republic cannot be trusted to honor a deal as long as it literally has a religion of deceit for a constitution. Sunni Arabs know this of course but they need to remind their people from time to time.
Posted by: gKWVE at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (gKWVE)
225
Their weaponry has been shown to be shit "
Funny. We were assured repeatedly (even on smaht military blogs) that their techno power was dwarfing everything we could do, and we were this close to China demonstrating their awesome power over us.
Hmmm.
Funny. We were assured repeatedly (even on smaht military blogs) that their techno power was dwarfing everything we could do, and we were this close to China demonstrating their awesome power over us.
Hmmm.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:00 PM (cGjQu)
226
Rod Stewart Required Oxygen Mid-Concert After Nearly Collapsing Onstage
Tonights the night
Gonna be ...... ahhhhhh
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:51 AM (viF8m)
He was in Salt Lake City, which is 5000+ feet in elevation.
Tonights the night
Gonna be ...... ahhhhhh
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 11:51 AM (viF8m)
He was in Salt Lake City, which is 5000+ feet in elevation.
Posted by: Pug Mahon at June 22, 2026 12:00 PM (PSEDc)
227
222
Hormuz gets more irrelevant the more time passes. Iran rebuilding to pre-war levels would several years, and even then we'd still have the option to go back and bomb them basically at leisure until their anti-air becomes sufficiently advanced.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (okun6)
======
It took Iran literally decades to build up its ballistic missile manufacturing capabilities.
Can you imagine the corruption, inefficiencies, and graft associated with projects in the Middle East?
Once UAE finishes that pipeline they started in April, man, the strait is going to be so completely irrelevant that if you told someone from the oil shock of the 70s about it, they'd call it science fiction.
Hormuz gets more irrelevant the more time passes. Iran rebuilding to pre-war levels would several years, and even then we'd still have the option to go back and bomb them basically at leisure until their anti-air becomes sufficiently advanced.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (okun6)
======
It took Iran literally decades to build up its ballistic missile manufacturing capabilities.
Can you imagine the corruption, inefficiencies, and graft associated with projects in the Middle East?
Once UAE finishes that pipeline they started in April, man, the strait is going to be so completely irrelevant that if you told someone from the oil shock of the 70s about it, they'd call it science fiction.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:00 PM (Zn6QU)
228
As for Russia, I don't believe time is on their side.
Posted by: gKWVE at June 22, 2026 12:01 PM (gKWVE)
229
223 >> Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (edUvp)
What country are you from?
Posted by: That Guy at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (OjdEO)
Texas.
What country are you from?
Posted by: That Guy at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (OjdEO)
Texas.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:01 PM (edUvp)
230
To give grudging respect to an enemy, Iran out thought us strategically . . . .
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:58 AM (edUvp)
Ukraine is losing. Iran is . . . winning?
Iran cut its nose off to spite it's face. I don't see that as a winning strategy, currently, unless you want to give them credit for future outcomes, which are highly fluid and dependent on not only IRGC moves.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:58 AM (edUvp)
Ukraine is losing. Iran is . . . winning?
Iran cut its nose off to spite it's face. I don't see that as a winning strategy, currently, unless you want to give them credit for future outcomes, which are highly fluid and dependent on not only IRGC moves.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:01 PM (dK+Kv)
231
224 The MOU was forced on us (and Israel) by the Arab Gulf States.
What it does give us, is additional evidence that the Taqiya Republic cannot be trusted to honor a deal as long as it literally has a religion of deceit for a constitution. Sunni Arabs know this of course but they need to remind their people from time to time.
Posted by: gKWVE at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (gKWVE)
=====
It's funny the amount of fretting over the MOU and the little that actually changed because of it.
Iran still hasn't gotten a dime of the frozen funds, and Trump added new requirements for Iran to get them (related to nuclear inspections).
They can trade now, but trade is...limited. And they have to overpay for grain to get anyone to show up.
What it does give us, is additional evidence that the Taqiya Republic cannot be trusted to honor a deal as long as it literally has a religion of deceit for a constitution. Sunni Arabs know this of course but they need to remind their people from time to time.
Posted by: gKWVE at June 22, 2026 11:59 AM (gKWVE)
=====
It's funny the amount of fretting over the MOU and the little that actually changed because of it.
Iran still hasn't gotten a dime of the frozen funds, and Trump added new requirements for Iran to get them (related to nuclear inspections).
They can trade now, but trade is...limited. And they have to overpay for grain to get anyone to show up.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:02 PM (Zn6QU)
232
The estimate is that Iran killed 60k-100k of what they believed to be the opposition during the ceasefire. That's the part that gets me.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 12:02 PM (GP8V/)
233
but I want to believe both of those camps are at the two ends of a bell curve.
______
I believe so too. I hope we are right.
I'm a centrist on Israel - sell them all manner of military goods so they can survive in a harsh environment, and don't hesitate to take their side when in alignment with US interests (against Islamist aggression is nearly always in our interests). But they are a foreign country, not all of their interests, which they are in their right to pursue, align with the US.
______
I believe so too. I hope we are right.
I'm a centrist on Israel - sell them all manner of military goods so they can survive in a harsh environment, and don't hesitate to take their side when in alignment with US interests (against Islamist aggression is nearly always in our interests). But they are a foreign country, not all of their interests, which they are in their right to pursue, align with the US.
Posted by: Chuck Martel at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Dv3i1)
234
I suspect that will happen and then Trump can say "Welp, we gave them chance, but they want to be animals. So, bombs it is."
That part may not happen till after the election.
Posted by: naturalfake at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (iJfKG)
I have seen many saying this, even Kurt Schlichter. Think about this for a second - it would mean that the plan was to allow Iran to rearm for 6 months, get rid of all remaining internal opposition for 6 months, use the money to build new ME alliances for 6 months, and build new impenetrable hiding spots for the leadership for 6 months - and only THEN restart the war?
That would be the most idiotic military plan in the history of idiotic military plans. Which is why I don't believe it could ever happen; it's just a massive cope to help people internalize what's been done.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (edUvp)
You could be right, I may be crazy.
Anywho, we're running small sorties right now is my understanding. That may be enough to keep the Iranians from any major rearmament.
a massive campaign might trigger political difficulties for Trump and the Reps. A clear win in Nov, clears the deck for a lot of things to happen.
That part may not happen till after the election.
Posted by: naturalfake at June 22, 2026 11:45 AM (iJfKG)
I have seen many saying this, even Kurt Schlichter. Think about this for a second - it would mean that the plan was to allow Iran to rearm for 6 months, get rid of all remaining internal opposition for 6 months, use the money to build new ME alliances for 6 months, and build new impenetrable hiding spots for the leadership for 6 months - and only THEN restart the war?
That would be the most idiotic military plan in the history of idiotic military plans. Which is why I don't believe it could ever happen; it's just a massive cope to help people internalize what's been done.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 11:56 AM (edUvp)
You could be right, I may be crazy.
Anywho, we're running small sorties right now is my understanding. That may be enough to keep the Iranians from any major rearmament.
a massive campaign might trigger political difficulties for Trump and the Reps. A clear win in Nov, clears the deck for a lot of things to happen.
Posted by: naturalfake at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (iJfKG)
235
232 The estimate is that Iran killed 60k-100k of what they believed to be the opposition during the ceasefire. That's the part that gets me.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 12:02 PM (GP8V/)
=====
The Iranian people will never rise up. No democracy will ever take root.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 12:02 PM (GP8V/)
=====
The Iranian people will never rise up. No democracy will ever take root.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Zn6QU)
236
Pipelines can be bombed, ask Russia
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (n5tGW)
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (dK+Kv)
238
236 Pipelines can be bombed, ask Russia
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (n5tGW)
=====
And quickly and cheaply repaired, especially if buried in the sand.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (n5tGW)
=====
And quickly and cheaply repaired, especially if buried in the sand.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Zn6QU)
239
I remember a few months ago when they went to the IMF to ask for bailouts for the Belt and Road partners who weren't paying them back."
And the roads have turned to crap. It's fun to watch decade plus clips of top gear as the find nice, shiny, new tarmac in parts of the world - and then see clips lately of those roads looking like Michigan or California...
And the roads have turned to crap. It's fun to watch decade plus clips of top gear as the find nice, shiny, new tarmac in parts of the world - and then see clips lately of those roads looking like Michigan or California...
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (cGjQu)
240
Iran cut its nose off to spite it's face. I don't see that as a winning strategy, currently, unless you want to give them credit for future outcomes, which are highly fluid and dependent on not only IRGC moves.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:01 PM (dK+Kv)
First, everyone is surprised that Ukraine does in fact appear to be doing better than Russia is now - situations in Crimea are desperate for the Russian forces there, which no one saw coming.
And as to allies - Arabs are notorious for always switching allegiances to whoever appears to come out on top of any particular conflict. They've been doing it for centuries.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:01 PM (dK+Kv)
First, everyone is surprised that Ukraine does in fact appear to be doing better than Russia is now - situations in Crimea are desperate for the Russian forces there, which no one saw coming.
And as to allies - Arabs are notorious for always switching allegiances to whoever appears to come out on top of any particular conflict. They've been doing it for centuries.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (edUvp)
241
I remember a few months ago when they went to the IMF to ask for bailouts for the Belt and Road partners who weren't paying them back.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison
================
That's interesting. I thought their whole strategy was:
1- sell infrastructure to low-tech partners who in reality can't maintain it
2- low-tech partners can't generate the revenue that was supposed to pay China back
3- China puts a lien on the infrastructure, gets itself a port/road/bridge whatever
I remember a few months ago when they went to the IMF to ask for bailouts for the Belt and Road partners who weren't paying them back.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison
================
That's interesting. I thought their whole strategy was:
1- sell infrastructure to low-tech partners who in reality can't maintain it
2- low-tech partners can't generate the revenue that was supposed to pay China back
3- China puts a lien on the infrastructure, gets itself a port/road/bridge whatever
Posted by: Blonde Morticia at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (XJ22o)
242
TJM It's funny the amount of fretting over the MOU and the little that actually changed because of it.
Someone else above us on this thread noted that "MOU" sounds like a noise a cow makes, and has about as much binding energy.
I think people on X and PJMedia and other such sites needed something to bleat about or their readers would look up cat videos instead.
Someone else above us on this thread noted that "MOU" sounds like a noise a cow makes, and has about as much binding energy.
I think people on X and PJMedia and other such sites needed something to bleat about or their readers would look up cat videos instead.
Posted by: gKWVE at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (gKWVE)
243
I'm think Trump is currently working on getting the Ukraine/Russia war to end . My feeling is we're close.
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (GP8V/)
244
But they are a foreign country, not all of their interests, which they are in their right to pursue, align with the US.
Posted by: Chuck Martel at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Dv3i1)
That is a fair and reasonable position.
Posted by: Chuck Martel at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Dv3i1)
That is a fair and reasonable position.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (dK+Kv)
245
The Iranian people will never rise up. No democracy will ever take root."
Bbbut all cultures are just as gooder!
/wineboxers
Bbbut all cultures are just as gooder!
/wineboxers
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:05 PM (cGjQu)
246
242 TJM It's funny the amount of fretting over the MOU and the little that actually changed because of it.
Someone else above us on this thread noted that "MOU" sounds like a noise a cow makes, and has about as much binding energy.
I think people on X and PJMedia and other such sites needed something to bleat about or their readers would look up cat videos instead.
Posted by: gKWVE at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (gKWVE)
======
People talked about it like it was a peace treaty.
It's just a paper agreement about what will be talked about and conditions around it.
"But Iran gets $300 billion instantly!"
"Well, not instantly. Only if they follow through and behave. It's in the text of the agreement."
"US surrender!"
"What?"
Someone else above us on this thread noted that "MOU" sounds like a noise a cow makes, and has about as much binding energy.
I think people on X and PJMedia and other such sites needed something to bleat about or their readers would look up cat videos instead.
Posted by: gKWVE at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (gKWVE)
======
People talked about it like it was a peace treaty.
It's just a paper agreement about what will be talked about and conditions around it.
"But Iran gets $300 billion instantly!"
"Well, not instantly. Only if they follow through and behave. It's in the text of the agreement."
"US surrender!"
"What?"
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:05 PM (Zn6QU)
247
236 Pipelines can be bombed, ask Russia
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (n5tGW)
That invites further escalation however, which is why there are reports now of more bombing of civilian targets in Ukraine. Iran doesn't have the ability to defend itself at present and limited offensive capabilities compared to before the war.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (n5tGW)
That invites further escalation however, which is why there are reports now of more bombing of civilian targets in Ukraine. Iran doesn't have the ability to defend itself at present and limited offensive capabilities compared to before the war.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy at June 22, 2026 12:06 PM (okun6)
248
The Iranian people will never rise up. No democracy will ever take root.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Zn6QU)
That wasn't my point .
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Zn6QU)
That wasn't my point .
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 12:06 PM (GP8V/)
249
First, everyone is surprised that Ukraine does in fact appear to be doing better than Russia is now - situations in Crimea are desperate for the Russian forces there, which no one saw coming.
Not all of us.
Not all of us.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 12:06 PM (Riz8t)
250
Just listening to a major podcaster, and I had to turn it way down to not offend my wife because this guy says "FUCKING" every other word. That doesn't make him sound edgey or passionate. It makes him sound stupid.
Posted by: Don in SoCo at June 22, 2026 12:06 PM (iP/HW)
251
I do not sound like a cow when I am being violated.
Posted by: Maureen Ophelia Urquhart at June 22, 2026 12:07 PM (pBJ6M)
252
241,
That seems to have been their plan. Unfortunately, they forgot that it was Africa and the Middle East.
That seems to have been their plan. Unfortunately, they forgot that it was Africa and the Middle East.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:07 PM (cGjQu)
253
The Iranian people will never rise up. No democracy will ever take root.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Zn6QU)
Given that it hasn't happened in at least 1400 years, that's a safe bet.
It is not a western society. A small fraction may hold western values, but not enough to make a difference.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:03 PM (Zn6QU)
Given that it hasn't happened in at least 1400 years, that's a safe bet.
It is not a western society. A small fraction may hold western values, but not enough to make a difference.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:07 PM (edUvp)
254
I'm think Trump is currently working on getting the Ukraine/Russia war to end . My feeling is we're close.
Posted by: polynikes
=================
I'm hoping for Cuba Libre.
I'm think Trump is currently working on getting the Ukraine/Russia war to end . My feeling is we're close.
Posted by: polynikes
=================
I'm hoping for Cuba Libre.
Posted by: Blonde Morticia at June 22, 2026 12:07 PM (XJ22o)
255
245 The Iranian people will never rise up. No democracy will ever take root."
Bbbut all cultures are just as gooder!
/wineboxers
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:05 PM (cGjQu)
=====
Mowing down 60,000 people in January and then hunkering down because Daddy Trump is gonna come and take care of it are the actions of a people unwilling to take the sacrifice they've already made in blood and turn it into something themselves.
The US and Israel bombed the shit out of IRGC strongholds all the way down to Basij city stations and checkpoints. And still, almost nothing in response from the people themselves.
If Iran is to throw off the bonds of its own oppressors, they need a king in country to lead them. They're not going to do it themselves.
Bbbut all cultures are just as gooder!
/wineboxers
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:05 PM (cGjQu)
=====
Mowing down 60,000 people in January and then hunkering down because Daddy Trump is gonna come and take care of it are the actions of a people unwilling to take the sacrifice they've already made in blood and turn it into something themselves.
The US and Israel bombed the shit out of IRGC strongholds all the way down to Basij city stations and checkpoints. And still, almost nothing in response from the people themselves.
If Iran is to throw off the bonds of its own oppressors, they need a king in country to lead them. They're not going to do it themselves.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (Zn6QU)
256
I really don't understand the deal.
If we know they are lying, and they know we know they are lying, it's all just theater.
The reality of the situation is that we're going to keep having to shoot at them when they break the deal.
If we know they are lying, and they know we know they are lying, it's all just theater.
The reality of the situation is that we're going to keep having to shoot at them when they break the deal.
Posted by: MJ at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (XOmY9)
257
Just listening to a major podcaster, and I had to turn it way down to not offend my wife because this guy says "FUCKING" every other word. That doesn't make him sound edgey or passionate. It makes him sound stupid.
(Narrator: It doesn't "make him" sound stupid. He is stupid.)
I'll bet it's Rogan.
(Narrator: It doesn't "make him" sound stupid. He is stupid.)
I'll bet it's Rogan.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (Riz8t)
258
256 I really don't understand the deal.
If we know they are lying, and they know we know they are lying, it's all just theater.
The reality of the situation is that we're going to keep having to shoot at them when they break the deal.
Posted by: MJ at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (XOmY9)
=====
What if I told you that the closing of the strait was no more than theater as well?
If we know they are lying, and they know we know they are lying, it's all just theater.
The reality of the situation is that we're going to keep having to shoot at them when they break the deal.
Posted by: MJ at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (XOmY9)
=====
What if I told you that the closing of the strait was no more than theater as well?
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (Zn6QU)
259
First, everyone is surprised that Ukraine does in fact appear to be doing better than Russia is now - situations in Crimea are desperate for the Russian forces there, which no one saw coming.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (edUvp)
Better than expected, yes. Better than Russia? That's a proposition of dubious merit.
Ukraine is around the same size as Texas. It should be no surprise that Russia would need to add cannon fodder to the meat grinder there.
That SHOULD inform our decisions and goals in Iran, not coincidentally.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:04 PM (edUvp)
Better than expected, yes. Better than Russia? That's a proposition of dubious merit.
Ukraine is around the same size as Texas. It should be no surprise that Russia would need to add cannon fodder to the meat grinder there.
That SHOULD inform our decisions and goals in Iran, not coincidentally.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:09 PM (dK+Kv)
260
160. I occasionally read that OCare is failing, and yet enrollment is near record highs. I thought we were cutting off the subsidies.
Posted by: Archimedes
Several states operating their own marketplaces (such as California, Colorado, New Jersey, and New Mexico) have stepped in with state-funded premium subsidies and cost-sharing reductions.
States like North Carolina and South Dakota expanded their Medicaid programs under the ACA. This policy change continues to transition hundreds of thousands of low-income adults into newly available, highly subsidized health coverage.
Certain states have enacted rules to shield consumers from gaps in coverage.
---
Each state is different, and those that can keep spending may never be reigned by the feds. Will it lead to universal healthcare?
🤷🏼♀️
Posted by: Archimedes
Several states operating their own marketplaces (such as California, Colorado, New Jersey, and New Mexico) have stepped in with state-funded premium subsidies and cost-sharing reductions.
States like North Carolina and South Dakota expanded their Medicaid programs under the ACA. This policy change continues to transition hundreds of thousands of low-income adults into newly available, highly subsidized health coverage.
Certain states have enacted rules to shield consumers from gaps in coverage.
---
Each state is different, and those that can keep spending may never be reigned by the feds. Will it lead to universal healthcare?
🤷🏼♀️
Posted by: L -No nic, another fine day at June 22, 2026 12:09 PM (NFX2v)
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:09 PM (cGjQu)
262
If Iran is to throw off the bonds of its own oppressors, they need a king in country to lead them. They're not going to do it themselves.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (Zn6QU)
The only lesson the Iranian government took from the uprising is that "we killed 60,000 people and no one stopped us! Next time, we'll kill 100,000!"
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (Zn6QU)
The only lesson the Iranian government took from the uprising is that "we killed 60,000 people and no one stopped us! Next time, we'll kill 100,000!"
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:10 PM (edUvp)
263
I really don't understand the deal.
If we know they are lying, and they know we know they are lying, it's all just theater.
FDR *spit* knew that we'd be involved in WWII sooner or later, but he had to let the American people come to that conclusion. IMHO, Trump is doing the same. He won't send in ground troops, but he'll restart bombing and say "I gave them a chance, and they spurned it".
If we know they are lying, and they know we know they are lying, it's all just theater.
FDR *spit* knew that we'd be involved in WWII sooner or later, but he had to let the American people come to that conclusion. IMHO, Trump is doing the same. He won't send in ground troops, but he'll restart bombing and say "I gave them a chance, and they spurned it".
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 12:10 PM (Riz8t)
264
>>The reality of the situation is that we're going to keep having to shoot at them when they break the deal.
That's pretty much how the world works. Every country in the world makes a deal to act as a rational partner and not attack its neighbors or do things to hurt them. When they don't other countries strike back.
We didn't have formal deals with Venezuela or Cuba but they were attacking us. Now they aren't.
That's pretty much how the world works. Every country in the world makes a deal to act as a rational partner and not attack its neighbors or do things to hurt them. When they don't other countries strike back.
We didn't have formal deals with Venezuela or Cuba but they were attacking us. Now they aren't.
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (viF8m)
265
262 If Iran is to throw off the bonds of its own oppressors, they need a king in country to lead them. They're not going to do it themselves.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (Zn6QU)
The only lesson the Iranian government took from the uprising is that "we killed 60,000 people and no one stopped us! Next time, we'll kill 100,000!"
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:10 PM (edUvp)
=====
Get the shah's son into the country, a save haven. Rally the people around him. Raise an irregular army, and then call for the regular army to join him.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:08 PM (Zn6QU)
The only lesson the Iranian government took from the uprising is that "we killed 60,000 people and no one stopped us! Next time, we'll kill 100,000!"
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:10 PM (edUvp)
=====
Get the shah's son into the country, a save haven. Rally the people around him. Raise an irregular army, and then call for the regular army to join him.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Zn6QU)
266
If Iran is to throw off the bonds of its own oppressors, they need a king in country to lead them. They're not going to do it themselves."
I find myself in the unenviable position of agreeing with this person. Again.
Sigh.
I find myself in the unenviable position of agreeing with this person. Again.
Sigh.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (cGjQu)
267
Trump allowed Ukraine to have and use weapons to hit deep into Russia. If Biden and his idiots had done this early in war things would be very different. The Russians are winning on the ground because the Ukrainians are running out of men. Russia proper, especially Crimea, is suffering from shortages of oil because the Ukrainians are hitting refineries
Posted by: Smell the Glove at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Iurxt)
268
266 I find myself in the unenviable position of agreeing with this person. Again.
Sigh.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (cGjQu)
======
*considers mentioning Prometheus*
*thinks better of mentioning Prometheus and does not mention Prometheus*
*does own part to keep thread Prometheus free*
Sigh.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (cGjQu)
======
*considers mentioning Prometheus*
*thinks better of mentioning Prometheus and does not mention Prometheus*
*does own part to keep thread Prometheus free*
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:12 PM (Zn6QU)
269
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:09 PM (dK+Kv)
Between dubious and recalcitrant you have me wondering what you ate this morning.
Between dubious and recalcitrant you have me wondering what you ate this morning.
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 12:12 PM (22ggK)
270
Masoud Pezeshkian, President of Iran, is openly mocking Trump and saying that of course they will keep their nuclear enrichment program. And that there's nothing Trump can do about it.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:12 PM (edUvp)
271
The idea that an Iranian uprising would happen at all was highly doubtful. That it would prevail against entrenched radical Islam in any event was a pipe dream of delusional old neocon cementheads, sorry.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 12:12 PM (BI5O2)
272
Archimedes is perceptive and correct. Beginning to think Yon has the right take on that guy.
Posted by: Don in SoCo at June 22, 2026 12:13 PM (iP/HW)
273
267 Trump allowed Ukraine to have and use weapons to hit deep into Russia. If Biden and his idiots had done this early in war things would be very different. The Russians are winning on the ground because the Ukrainians are running out of men. Russia proper, especially Crimea, is suffering from shortages of oil because the Ukrainians are hitting refineries
Posted by: Smell the Glove at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Iurxt)
If it continues there's the risk that Russia starts taking out power plants.
Posted by: Smell the Glove at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Iurxt)
If it continues there's the risk that Russia starts taking out power plants.
Posted by: Red Turban Someguy at June 22, 2026 12:13 PM (okun6)
274
The Russians are winning on the ground because the Ukrainians are running out of men.
Oh, please. They're not winning. The Russians have won less and less ground every month, and are now losing net ground. Their troops are mutinying, because the Ukes aren't sending in assault meat waves, they're destroying the Russian's logistics well behind the front.
You aren't winning a war when your navy has to run away, your capitol is being bombed, and your economy is in shambles.
Oh, please. They're not winning. The Russians have won less and less ground every month, and are now losing net ground. Their troops are mutinying, because the Ukes aren't sending in assault meat waves, they're destroying the Russian's logistics well behind the front.
You aren't winning a war when your navy has to run away, your capitol is being bombed, and your economy is in shambles.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 12:14 PM (Riz8t)
275
Between dubious and recalcitrant you have me wondering what you ate this morning.
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 12:12 PM (22ggK)
Lack of sleep.
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 12:12 PM (22ggK)
Lack of sleep.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:14 PM (dK+Kv)
276
Y'all still on this
Posted by: Don Black at June 22, 2026 12:15 PM (UrW4A)
277
Get the shah's son into the country, a save haven. Rally the people around him. Raise an irregular army, and then call for the regular army to join him.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Zn6QU)
Anything is worth a try, I suppose. This almost definitely won't work, though, and we can under no circumstances agree or suggest to safeguard that guy's regime by force of our own arms.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Zn6QU)
Anything is worth a try, I suppose. This almost definitely won't work, though, and we can under no circumstances agree or suggest to safeguard that guy's regime by force of our own arms.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 12:15 PM (BI5O2)
278
Allegedly, many within the country's protest movements demand an end to all forms of dictatorship in favor of a secular, democratic republic.
No return of the Shah, either. No idea if that covers the son of Shah.
But they have to determine their form of government and get on with it.
No return of the Shah, either. No idea if that covers the son of Shah.
But they have to determine their form of government and get on with it.
Posted by: L -No nic, another fine day at June 22, 2026 12:15 PM (NFX2v)
279
Get the shah's son into the country, a save haven. Rally the people around him. Raise an irregular army, and then call for the regular army to join him.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Zn6QU)
This could have worked, and this is what bothers me about the claim that Kurdish arms dealers ran off with the weapons. I do not want to believe this is true, that it's just a psy-op to cover up something else - because if it IS true, it means that our plan to overthrow the Iranian Government was:
1) give some unnamed shady middle eastern arms dealers a bunch of weapons with no money down
2) hope that everything just works out.
3) if it doesn't work out, go with Plan B.
4) there is no plan B.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Zn6QU)
This could have worked, and this is what bothers me about the claim that Kurdish arms dealers ran off with the weapons. I do not want to believe this is true, that it's just a psy-op to cover up something else - because if it IS true, it means that our plan to overthrow the Iranian Government was:
1) give some unnamed shady middle eastern arms dealers a bunch of weapons with no money down
2) hope that everything just works out.
3) if it doesn't work out, go with Plan B.
4) there is no plan B.
Posted by: Tom Servo at June 22, 2026 12:16 PM (edUvp)
280
The Russians are winning on the ground because the Ukrainians are running out of men.
I highly recommend you read this piece.
https://www.battleswarmblog.com/?p=71985
I highly recommend you read this piece.
https://www.battleswarmblog.com/?p=71985
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 12:16 PM (Riz8t)
281
You know, I might have to take some time away and rest. Perhaps watch a movie?
Any recommendations?
*ducks*
Any recommendations?
*ducks*
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:16 PM (cGjQu)
282
277 Get the shah's son into the country, a save haven. Rally the people around him. Raise an irregular army, and then call for the regular army to join him.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Zn6QU)
Anything is worth a try, I suppose. This almost definitely won't work, though, and we can under no circumstances agree or suggest to safeguard that guy's regime by force of our own arms.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 12:15 PM (BI5O2)
======
He'd be risking his life. So, I doubt it would happen.
But I think it's the only thing that could lead to anything like a populist revolt in country.
I'm sure there's some medium-sized city that would offer him safety from which to start.
277 Get the shah's son into the country, a save haven. Rally the people around him. Raise an irregular army, and then call for the regular army to join him.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:11 PM (Zn6QU)
Anything is worth a try, I suppose. This almost definitely won't work, though, and we can under no circumstances agree or suggest to safeguard that guy's regime by force of our own arms.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 12:15 PM (BI5O2)
======
He'd be risking his life. So, I doubt it would happen.
But I think it's the only thing that could lead to anything like a populist revolt in country.
I'm sure there's some medium-sized city that would offer him safety from which to start.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, discovering British horror with Hammer Films at June 22, 2026 12:16 PM (Zn6QU)
283
Anything is worth a try, I suppose. This almost definitely won't work, though, and we can under no circumstances agree or suggest to safeguard that guy's regime by force of our own arms.
It has a whiff of Bay of Pigs about it.
It has a whiff of Bay of Pigs about it.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 12:17 PM (Riz8t)
284
>>You aren't winning a war when your navy has to run away, your capitol is being bombed, and your economy is in shambles.
How's the Ukrainian economy doing? How do you think it would be doing without hundreds of billions of dollars of NATO money flowing into it?
How's the Ukrainian economy doing? How do you think it would be doing without hundreds of billions of dollars of NATO money flowing into it?
Posted by: JackStraw at June 22, 2026 12:17 PM (viF8m)
285
Corrupt nood
Posted by: Clay at June 22, 2026 12:17 PM (5Rf2z)
286
Ukraine demonstrated to the world what could be accomplished with drones years ago. Yeah, Iran manufactured the original "suicide drone" but it's been copied and refined elsewhere... even by us.
Ukraine also claimed a drone kill first... using one with AI to hunt, and kill... a specific person. If reports about that incident are true.
We're lagging. Focusing on "big ticket" UAV's that can fly with fighter jets or bombers. We ought to be churning out millions of "toy" sized drones with AI and several ounces of C4 that can swarm enemy troops in the open.
Or people we don't like.
Ukraine also claimed a drone kill first... using one with AI to hunt, and kill... a specific person. If reports about that incident are true.
We're lagging. Focusing on "big ticket" UAV's that can fly with fighter jets or bombers. We ought to be churning out millions of "toy" sized drones with AI and several ounces of C4 that can swarm enemy troops in the open.
Or people we don't like.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at June 22, 2026 12:17 PM (jehhT)
287
"Finish him. Finish him *your* way!"
"Oh, good. My way. Thank you, Vizzini... which one's my way?"
"Pick up one of those rocks. Get behind the boulder. In a few minutes, the Man in Black will come running around the bend. The minute his *head* is in view, HIT IT WITH THE ROCK!"
"My way's not very sportsmanlike."
"Oh, good. My way. Thank you, Vizzini... which one's my way?"
"Pick up one of those rocks. Get behind the boulder. In a few minutes, the Man in Black will come running around the bend. The minute his *head* is in view, HIT IT WITH THE ROCK!"
"My way's not very sportsmanlike."
Posted by: pookysgirl with the applicable Princess Bride quote at June 22, 2026 12:17 PM (Wt5PA)
288
Y'all still on this"
Yeah. It's gone from horse, to glue, to horse feed, and back to horses.
Again. Do try to keep up.
Yeah. It's gone from horse, to glue, to horse feed, and back to horses.
Again. Do try to keep up.
Posted by: man at June 22, 2026 12:18 PM (cGjQu)
289
280 The Russians are winning on the ground because the Ukrainians are running out of men.
Posted by: Archimedes
Send them back from US home remodeling companies?
Posted by: Archimedes
Send them back from US home remodeling companies?
Posted by: L -No nic, another fine day at June 22, 2026 12:18 PM (NFX2v)
290
What if I told you that the closing of the strait was no more than theater as well?
----------------------------
How so? I'm legit confused, not trying to be obtuse
----------------------------
How so? I'm legit confused, not trying to be obtuse
Posted by: MJ at June 22, 2026 12:18 PM (XOmY9)
291
The idea that an Iranian uprising would happen at all was highly doubtful. That it would prevail against entrenched radical Islam in any event was a pipe dream of delusional old neocon cementheads, sorry.
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 12:12 PM (BI5O2)
When they attempted it during Obama administration and he did nothing to help ,the Right and commenters here let him have it. Prior to our operation there was a lot of hope it could happen again. And once we started there was more hope. Instead we stopped after only 39 days and allowed the IRG to regroup and massacre everyone they thought might be part of the opposition. Sorry but that doesn't sit well with me .
Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at June 22, 2026 12:12 PM (BI5O2)
When they attempted it during Obama administration and he did nothing to help ,the Right and commenters here let him have it. Prior to our operation there was a lot of hope it could happen again. And once we started there was more hope. Instead we stopped after only 39 days and allowed the IRG to regroup and massacre everyone they thought might be part of the opposition. Sorry but that doesn't sit well with me .
Posted by: polynikes at June 22, 2026 12:18 PM (GP8V/)
292
Allegedly, many within the country's protest movements demand an end to all forms of dictatorship in favor of a secular, democratic republic.
No return of the Shah, either. No idea if that covers the son of Shah.
Posted by: L -No nic
===============
Son of Shah said he would oversee a transition, not take over.
Allegedly, many within the country's protest movements demand an end to all forms of dictatorship in favor of a secular, democratic republic.
No return of the Shah, either. No idea if that covers the son of Shah.
Posted by: L -No nic
===============
Son of Shah said he would oversee a transition, not take over.
Posted by: Blonde Morticia at June 22, 2026 12:19 PM (XJ22o)
293
How's the Ukrainian economy doing? How do you think it would be doing without hundreds of billions of dollars of NATO money flowing into it?
Irrelevant. We ARE sending them money, and they ARE winning, or at the very least holding the Russians at bay. Russia is deteriorating fast, so it's a matter of Ukraine making them pay until they've had enough. I think that time is fast approaching.
Irrelevant. We ARE sending them money, and they ARE winning, or at the very least holding the Russians at bay. Russia is deteriorating fast, so it's a matter of Ukraine making them pay until they've had enough. I think that time is fast approaching.
Posted by: Archimedes at June 22, 2026 12:21 PM (Riz8t)
294
Lack of sleep.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:14 PM (dK+Kv)
😂 Me too
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:14 PM (dK+Kv)
😂 Me too
Posted by: ... at June 22, 2026 12:23 PM (22ggK)
295
Funny how Ukraine is winning and US should perpetrate regime change - which almost certainly would require ground invasion - can simultaneously be held in the same noggin.
Posted by: Comrade Flounder, Disinformation Demon at June 22, 2026 12:30 PM (dK+Kv)
296
Son of Shah said he would oversee a transition, not take over.
Posted by: Blonde Morticia at June 22, 2026 12:19 PM (XJ22o)
Except that no one thinks that he's just in it to oversee a transition. Nearly 50 years of "The Shah was de debil! SAVAK was the horde of Satan!" propaganda is tough to overcome, even if he's on the level about volunteering to be a transitional figure.
Son of Shah said he would oversee a transition, not take over.
Posted by: Blonde Morticia at June 22, 2026 12:19 PM (XJ22o)
Except that no one thinks that he's just in it to oversee a transition. Nearly 50 years of "The Shah was de debil! SAVAK was the horde of Satan!" propaganda is tough to overcome, even if he's on the level about volunteering to be a transitional figure.
Posted by: IllTemperedCur at June 22, 2026 12:31 PM (y9nCu)
297
It's insane that this is tolerated.
We should never stop saying this. So far not a single prosecution of anybody involved in the greatest, most concerted assault on human health and bodily sovereignty in our history.
We should never stop saying this. So far not a single prosecution of anybody involved in the greatest, most concerted assault on human health and bodily sovereignty in our history.
Posted by: Ordinary American at June 22, 2026 12:31 PM (fZiTB)
298
Thanks, Buck. One of Trump's problems is the inability to clearly communicate at certain important times. There are some basics that become lost over time: 1. When President Donald Trump ordered the start of Operation Epic Fury on February 28, like many people I assumed a brief air campaign to further degrade Iran's nuclear weapons program. The instigator was Iran's own negotiators, who boasted to Trump advisor Steve Witkoff that they had produced enough nuclear material for nearly a dozen weapons. All Tehran needed to do was make the final uranium enrichment step from 60% to 90%, then assemble the warheads.
Neither Trump nor Israeli Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahu — whose nation former Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad called a "two-bomb country" — had a choice in the matter. . .
Vodkapundit
Neither Trump nor Israeli Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahu — whose nation former Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad called a "two-bomb country" — had a choice in the matter. . .
Vodkapundit
Posted by: KT at June 22, 2026 12:39 PM (rdeQO)
299
2. Clayton Wood, June 18, 2026
As what we assume are accurate summaries of the MOU began to emerge, a brilliant friend told me he was looking forward to to reading my view.
I said, “If Iran is a very good boy, it gets a pony. I do not believe the IRGC knows how to be a very good boy for long, and everyone reading the MOU is furious about the idea that it might get the pony anyway.”
As what we assume are accurate summaries of the MOU began to emerge, a brilliant friend told me he was looking forward to to reading my view.
I said, “If Iran is a very good boy, it gets a pony. I do not believe the IRGC knows how to be a very good boy for long, and everyone reading the MOU is furious about the idea that it might get the pony anyway.”
Posted by: KT at June 22, 2026 12:45 PM (rdeQO)
300
What of all these reports about Trump restraining Israeli action against Hezbollah because those strikes jeopardize the MOU with Iran? Is Trump so enamored of attaining an impossible agreement that he is willing to expose Israel to the tender mercies of willy-nilly rocketry?
Blow up Iran's military & nuclear capability and walk away is great. For what does Trump actually need an agreement - especially one which everyone including himself has to know is worthless?
Blow up Iran's military & nuclear capability and walk away is great. For what does Trump actually need an agreement - especially one which everyone including himself has to know is worthless?
Posted by: LCMS Rulz! at June 22, 2026 01:08 PM (bufu1)
301
Clayton S. Wood (see 299) also had some history and commentary on incentives for several parties to this mess going forward.
https://claytonswood.substack.com/p/
the-boy-who-cried-wolf
And he has another Substack piece up on Letters of Marque as a way to open the strait, with some interesting thoughts about Lloyds of London's incentives to keep the strait somewhat dangerous.
https://claytonswood.substack.com/p/
the-boy-who-cried-wolf
And he has another Substack piece up on Letters of Marque as a way to open the strait, with some interesting thoughts about Lloyds of London's incentives to keep the strait somewhat dangerous.
Posted by: KT at June 22, 2026 01:20 PM (rdeQO)
302
Iran won that war.
Nick just to sent bring himself to say it
Iran still has all of its 60% enriched urainium . 60% enriched is 97% of the effort needed to get to 90%.
Bombing unifies a country as it did in Germany and Vietnam.
Trump is pissed at Bibi as he well should be.
Worldwide support for Israel is at an historical low.
Great job Buck!
Nick just to sent bring himself to say it
Iran still has all of its 60% enriched urainium . 60% enriched is 97% of the effort needed to get to 90%.
Bombing unifies a country as it did in Germany and Vietnam.
Trump is pissed at Bibi as he well should be.
Worldwide support for Israel is at an historical low.
Great job Buck!
Posted by: Paul at June 22, 2026 01:27 PM (DV8PA)
303
Open the damn Strait and keep it open using military force. Yes, you will be shot at, but everything people are saying about the huge weapons supply Iran still has is largely bluff. Look at what they've been attacking ships with recently. Hint: Not hypersonic missiles.
Any location that fires on us gets flattened. Keep doing this until they're launching rubber rafts full of dynamite. Sink those.
The key is to get the lily-livered insurance and shipping companies out of the picture somehow.
- After Iran commences hostilies, restart the blockade. If ships have any sense, they won't come back to the Gulf anyway after they escape.
- Let Israel be Israel. They do a damn good job of blasting our enemies for us.
- Wouldn't hurt to maybe knock off another layer of leaders.
Any location that fires on us gets flattened. Keep doing this until they're launching rubber rafts full of dynamite. Sink those.
The key is to get the lily-livered insurance and shipping companies out of the picture somehow.
- After Iran commences hostilies, restart the blockade. If ships have any sense, they won't come back to the Gulf anyway after they escape.
- Let Israel be Israel. They do a damn good job of blasting our enemies for us.
- Wouldn't hurt to maybe knock off another layer of leaders.
Posted by: MartynWW at June 22, 2026 02:00 PM (IUbKC)
304
100% agreement, Buckster.
Iran and Israel are proxies for Western nations used to control risk management which feeds The City of London which created our Fed. Trump is building a parallel system with Sovereign countries rather than globalism. This is just a step.
Iran and Israel are proxies for Western nations used to control risk management which feeds The City of London which created our Fed. Trump is building a parallel system with Sovereign countries rather than globalism. This is just a step.
Posted by: Danimal28 at June 22, 2026 02:33 PM (3peS3)
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