The Morning Rant: Minimalist Edition

In Vitro Fertilization (IVF) is an amazing technological feat, one that has brought the joy of parenthood to many people who could not otherwise become parents. IVF and the related techniques have revolutionized fertilization, and has driven basic and applied research to new heights.

It has also demanded an examination of the morality and philosophy of the storage of embryos, as well as less profound but still novel events like a newborn having a 30-year-old sister!

Baby born from 30-year-old frozen embryo in Ohio

A baby was born last week in Ohio from an embryo that was frozen for over 30 years, making it the oldest known embryo to result in a successful birth.
Thaddeus Daniel Pierce was born on July 26 in London, Ohio, to Lindsey and Tim Pierce, aged 34 and 35. The embryo from which he was conceived had been cryogenically frozen since May 1994.
“We had a rough birth but we are both doing well now,” said Lindsey to MIT Technology Review. “He is so chill. We are in awe that we have this precious baby!”
“The baby has a 30-year-old sister,” she added, referring to the sibling born from the same batch of embryos three decades ago. At the time the embryos were created, Tim Pierce was just a toddler.
“We thought it was wild,” Lindsey said. “We didn’t know they froze embryos that long ago.”
She continued, “We didn’t go into it thinking we would break any records. We just wanted to have a baby.”

Bringing a child into this world is the greatest and most important thing that we do as a species. ["We," being women. Biological women, who have the greatest job in the world. The lunacy of the transsexuals is specifically designed to blur the recognition that women are simply more important in the grand scheme of humanity. We must fight that to the very end!]

And if some women need a bit of help, it is wonderful that Western Culture has created the scientific framework that provides that assistance. Yet there are ethical considerations that are extraordinarily difficult. For instance, as the technology progressed, the number of viable embryos that could be produced from retrieved eggs has increased. But most people do not have the financial wherewithal to have many babies, thus the stored embryos available for adoption.

And that is the issue! Storing viable embryos after these couples are done having children seems like both an easy decision and a supremely difficult one. It's easy because the embryos are human, and destroying them is roughly akin to abortion. It's difficult, because the parents will grow old and die, leaving the embryos to the vagaries of the storage companies and fluctuating law, and the whims of their heirs.

What to do? I don't know. Technology has outpaced our understanding of the issue! Extrapolating generations of parents who have embryos in storage into the far future yields an impossible decision. Perhaps the embryos will naturally degrade over time, and the question will be less pressing, but with this technology available to most people, the question will not go away.

[Crossposted at CutJibNewsletter and X/Twitter] And the Apple and Spotify feeds for CJN's podcast should be working!

Posted by: CBD at 11:00 AM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Morning, CBD!

Posted by: Duke Lowell at August 05, 2025 11:01 AM (u73oe)

2 st?

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at August 05, 2025 11:01 AM (Wnv9h)

3 G'mornin all y'all

Posted by: OkJohn at August 05, 2025 11:01 AM (URhKg)

4 Captain America was frozen as an adult ... and he turned out fine.

(yes, it is Sci-fi)

Posted by: illiniwek at August 05, 2025 11:01 AM (vbXSk)

5 Damn.

*goes back to sleep*

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at August 05, 2025 11:02 AM (Wnv9h)

6 So does the kid get carded?

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at August 05, 2025 11:02 AM (gRvjD)

7 What to do?

Yeah, I'm stumped on this one also. I assume that, in the fullness of time, Democrats will return to power and declare that all stored embryos, and their descendants, shall be slaves and forced to clean homes and pick vegetables.

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:02 AM (ExV1e)

8 So this is boobs discussion? I am good with that.

Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions. at August 05, 2025 11:02 AM (9vYpt)

9 IVF, genetic selection, Sydney Sweeney, all come together in this tangentially-related meme.
https://tinyurl.com/3wxkhy5a

Posted by: Moron Analyst at August 05, 2025 11:03 AM (JCZqz)

10 will naturally degrade over time,

Is there ECC for DNA? IDK!

Posted by: DaveA at August 05, 2025 11:03 AM (FhXTo)

11 Vending machine that dispenses babies is on the horizon.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at August 05, 2025 11:04 AM (Q4IgG)

12 In the year 6565 ....
Ain't gonna need no husband, won't need no wife
You'll pick your son, pick your daughter, too
From the bottom of a long glass tube

Posted by: Elric "Literary Creation" Blade at August 05, 2025 11:04 AM (iFTx/)

13 I saw this last(?) week and it is pretty cool.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:04 AM (bss/y)

14 "He is so chill"?

.... phrasing?

Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:04 AM (rIQZh)

15 IVF, genetic selection, Sydney Sweeney, all come together in this tangentially-related meme.
https://tinyurl.com/3wxkhy5a
Posted by: Moron Analyst at August 05, 2025 11:03 AM (JCZqz)
______

HOW DARE YOU

Posted by: Elric "Literary Creation" Blade at August 05, 2025 11:05 AM (iFTx/)

16 14 "He is so chill"?

.... phrasing?
Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:04 AM (rIQZh)

Coolest MFer ever born. Literally.

Posted by: Reforger at August 05, 2025 11:06 AM (h5TUr)

17 First thought - stop conceiving so many embryos. If a couple is doing the IVF treatment, start with, say, (3) embryos, not however many they are currently doing (a dozen? 2 dozen? I have no idea).

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:06 AM (Mxf84)

18 Vending machine that dispenses babies is on the horizon.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at August 05, 2025 11:04 AM (Q4IgG)

There are people working on an artificial womb.

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:06 AM (ExV1e)

19 Wake me when they bring Walt Disney's frozen head back to life.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at August 05, 2025 11:06 AM (g8Ew8)

20 I believe Jack Nicholson was apparently raised believing his Mother was his sister.

That was supposed to be the inspiration for DisneyChannel's 'Andi Mack."

Posted by: Posted by: Stateless - VERY GRATEFUL, BLESSED, LOVED AND HAPPY! -- - New Life Creation - 17.2% at August 05, 2025 11:07 AM (jvJvP)

21 "He is so chill."

I would expect so, having been frozen for 30 years.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at August 05, 2025 11:07 AM (0sNs1)

22 Maybe they'll put a best used by date on them to avoid problems.

Posted by: OrangeEnt at August 05, 2025 11:07 AM (LpXkJ)

23 A part of the solution already in place: Couples adopt frozen embryos when they have fertility issues… the embryos are implanted in the wife and she gives birth. We know such a couple who have 3 kids by this method. It’s awesome because they’re wonderful parents but couldn’t have kids on their own… AND it was of course a very productive and ethical use of the frozen embryos

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at August 05, 2025 11:07 AM (nrfI8)

24 My oldest brother was 17 when I was born.

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:07 AM (77rzZ)

25 Yeah, I'm stumped on this one also. I assume that, in the fullness of time, Democrats will return to power and declare that all stored embryos, and their descendants, shall be slaves and forced to clean homes and pick vegetables.
Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:02 AM (ExV1e)

I saw something with this story (the article I read was differently.) Evidently a lot of countries have a time limit on how long embryos can be stored. The US however, embryos can be stored indefinitely.

There is something vaguely sinister about having a time limit.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:07 AM (bss/y)

26 Well, the news is EXCELLENT!!!!!

Saw the Oncological Surgeon yesterday, and he said everything looks great. So much so, that he thinks after I get my next CT scan (late October - early November) that we will be talking about surgery to remove my tumors!

One of the satellite tumors is no longer there, and all of the rest of the tumors continue to shrink. The largest tumor is showing signs of calcification, which means that it is dying.

He said if it wasn't for the fact that my most recent CT Scan showed a couple of blood clots in my lungs - which apparently is quite common in cancer patients - that he would have been inclined to do surgery now. I am on a blood thinner to dissolve the clots; by the time of my next CT Scan, they should be gone.

So, as I said to Paul as we were getting on the elevator, "It's a good day, Tater!"

Thank you all for continuing to pray for me - they are definitely working! 😊❤️

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, Texas - Ace of Spades Ladies Brigade, plucky comic relief at August 05, 2025 11:08 AM (NY4Yc)

27 Wake me when they bring Walt Disney's frozen head back to life.
Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at August 05, 2025 11:06 AM (g8Ew

I thought that was Ted Williams. Walt too?

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at August 05, 2025 11:08 AM (nrfI8)

28 First thought - stop conceiving so many embryos.

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:06 AM (Mxf84)

The process isn't perfect, and not all eggs are fertilized successfully and grow to embryos.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:08 AM (L5An7)

29 Excellent news, Teresa!

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:09 AM (77rzZ)

30 Wake me when they bring Walt Disney's frozen head back to life.
Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at August 05, 2025 11:06 AM (g8Ew

"AHHHHHHHHHHHH!"

"Oh my gosh, is he in that much pain?"

"No you miserable eighth-wits, I've been conscious this whole time and I've been watching what you've done to my company! AAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!!"

Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:09 AM (rIQZh)

31 I thought that was Ted Williams. Walt too?
Posted by: LinusVanPelt at August 05, 2025 11:08 AM (nrfI

IIRC, yeah.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:10 AM (bss/y)

32 So, as I said to Paul as we were getting on the elevator, "It's a good day, Tater!"

I say the same thing when I look in the bathroom mirror after crying.

Posted by: Brian Stelter at August 05, 2025 11:10 AM (JCZqz)

33 "No you miserable eighth-wits, I've been conscious this whole time and I've been watching what you've done to my company! AAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!!"
Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:09 AM (rIQZh)

$10 says he drops a 'filthy fucking hippies!' inside of 5 mins.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:10 AM (bss/y)

34 I still think that all babies should be produced the natural way.

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:12 AM (77rzZ)

35 Eugene Vodolazkin vibes, anyone?

Posted by: mea culpa at August 05, 2025 11:12 AM (fzEi9)

36 I still think that all babies should be produced the natural way.
Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:12 AM

by me.

Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:12 AM (jc0TO)

37 Sorry - I went OT waaaay before the 100 comment rule.....

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, Texas - Ace of Spades Ladies Brigade, plucky comic relief at August 05, 2025 11:12 AM (NY4Yc)

38 I still think that all babies should be produced the natural way.

Posted by: Bulg

Yeah. Can't help but get real queasy about this sort of issue.

Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:13 AM (OUMaO)

39 Sorry - I went OT waaaay before the 100 comment rule.....
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, Texas - Ace of Spades Ladies Brigade, plucky comic relief at August 05, 2025 11:12 AM

Good news is welcome anytime.

Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:13 AM (jc0TO)

40 Yes, as you said a technological marvel. My not-really-my-grandson grandson whom I cared for for three years is an IVF babies.

His brothers and sisters were destroyed after his birth. His mom and dad are great people but studiously avoid thinking about that portion of it as they are horrified of the moral implications.

Where to start and stop with this technology is a morass.

Posted by: Tonypete at August 05, 2025 11:13 AM (cYBz/)

41 Heh, Trump was on the roof of the WH surveying the work he's funding on the WH grounds. He then start's taking questions from the yelling press, yelling back his answers.

LOL. Once a developer, always a developer.

Posted by: WisRich at August 05, 2025 11:13 AM (G0vdT)

42 Paging Dr Ian Malcom. Dr Ian Malcom to the white courtesy phone.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at August 05, 2025 11:14 AM (u73oe)

43 I think the question we should be asking ourselves is not how long should we store frozen embryos is if we should even be doing it in the first place. Like it was said in the movie, just because we can do something doesn't mean we should do it.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at August 05, 2025 11:14 AM (0N4FZ)

44 24 My oldest brother was 17 when I was born.
Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:07 AM (77rzZ)

I was 16 when my youngest brother was born. My first driving hours towards my license were taking him for rides so he would sleep. He'd roll back and forth in the back seat and suddenly konk. He was out. Usually in the footwell.

Posted by: Reforger at August 05, 2025 11:14 AM (h5TUr)

45 > IVF, genetic selection, Sydney Sweeney, all come together in this tangentially-related meme.
----------
lol

Posted by: Martini Farmer at August 05, 2025 11:14 AM (Q4IgG)

46 Is an embryo of a human being a human being? Does life begin at conception?

Answer those question, and all the other related issues become clearer.

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at August 05, 2025 11:14 AM (PiwSw)

47 11 Vending machine that dispenses babies is on the horizon.

no doubt with an "extra tentacles" button

Posted by: anachronda at August 05, 2025 11:14 AM (sGtp+)

48 Willowed:
Guaranteed there's a table somewhere in that building shimmed up with a stack of the missing ones.
Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:02 AM (rIQZh)

That's why the sets that are like you can get allen wrenches (what do you call that?) Where it is like a swiss army knife arrangement. That is the best for both feeler gauges and allen wrenches.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:14 AM (bss/y)

49 First thought - stop conceiving so many embryos.

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:06 AM (Mxf84)

The process isn't perfect, and not all eggs are fertilized successfully and grow to embryos.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:08 AM (L5An7)

Maybe that's the solution. Perfect the process so there are only the same number of embryos as the number of children they want to raise. Husband and wife have to determine, realistically, how many kids they can support and they create that number of embryos.
Perfecting the process would be a good start. After that, any unused embryo could be adopted, as these folks did.

Posted by: Madamemayhem (uppity wench) at August 05, 2025 11:15 AM (2J/Lj)

50 Thank you all for continuing to pray for me - they are definitely working! 😊❤️
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, Texas - Ace of Spades Ladies Brigade, plucky comic relief at August 05, 2025 11:08 AM (NY4Yc)

Teresa -
What awesome news. God is good - all the time. Stay strong, you got this!!!

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (N39Ws)

51 LOL. Once a developer, always a developer.
Posted by: WisRich at August 05, 2025 11:13 AM (G0vdT)

"Give up! I have the high ground!"

Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (rIQZh)

52 Where to start and stop with this technology is a morass.

Posted by: Tonypete at August 05, 2025 11:13 AM (cYBz/)

I cringed at that one sentence.

Yes...as I said, technology has outpaced morality.

Judaism and Catholicism differ somewhat about IVF. And I appreciate both sides of the argument. But we need more of it...a lot more of it!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (L5An7)

53 It's a positive 'Christian' story but the science and pseudo science behind such things scary. (Like frozen embryo availability for crazies.)

To that end, (Yes, I know, I know but it's also a recent article) -

CNN, Lab-grown embryo models are getting more realistic. Scientists are getting more concerned
By Katie Hunt, Updated Jul 31, 2025

And, then an oldie -

Nature, NEWS FEATURE, 31 August 2021
What’s next for lab-grown human embryos?
Researchers are now permitted to grow human embryos in the lab for longer than 14 days. Here’s what they could learn.

Posted by: L - No nic, another fine day at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (NFX2v)

54 The process isn't perfect, and not all eggs are fertilized successfully and grow to embryos.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:08 AM (L5An7)

That’s true, but we’re talking about humans, and not manufactured items. The best approach (IMO) would be to fertilize one egg, implant the embryo, and then pray for a successful pregnancy.

“But what if the pregnancy doesn’t result in a live birth?” Then you do it all again. Again, humans.. people… not commodities.

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (Mxf84)

55 I was a viable embryo once, but don't recall much.

I saw the documentary "They Saved Hitler's Brain". That was mighty chilling.

Posted by: Daddy's Little Squirt at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (G5+As)

56 44 24 My oldest brother was 17 when I was born.
Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:07 AM (77rzZ)

I was 16 when my youngest brother was born.

i was 16 when my penultimate sister was born. another was born after i went to college. i am not the oldest in the family.

my mother was the oldest of 13 children.

Posted by: anachronda at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (sGtp+)

57 34 I still think that all babies should be produced the natural way.
Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:12 AM (77rzZ)

I think if people cannot have a baby any other way, this is fine. More than fine. This kid has a shot instead of the limbo he was in for 30 years.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (bss/y)

58 Perfecting the process would be a good start. After that, any unused embryo could be adopted, as these folks did.

Posted by: Madamemayhem (uppity wench)

Between miscarriages and birth defects, you'd be hard pressed to make the case that the standard, natural process is "perfected". Which isn't to say you should have quite so many embryos on stand-by, just noting there's a case for room for error.

Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:17 AM (OUMaO)

59 26. Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, Texas

Great news, Teresa!

Prayers continue.

Posted by: L - No nic, another fine day at August 05, 2025 11:18 AM (NFX2v)

60 hm, definitely a dilemma. perhaps if the embryos are to be used only by the couple that conceived them ? to avoid a strange possibility of having 100 yo embryos ? I don't know. Science got ahead here.

Posted by: runner at August 05, 2025 11:18 AM (g47mK)

61 Rep. James Comer@RepJamesComer
BREAKING
The House Oversight Committee is compelling the following individuals to appear for depositions through issued subpoenas:
Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton: October 9
Former President Bill Clinton: October 14
Former U.S. Attorney General Merrick Garland: October 2
Former FBI Director James Comey: October 7
Former U.S. Attorney General William Barr: August 18
Former U.S. Attorney General Alberto Gonzales: August 26
Former U.S. Attorney General Jeff Sessions: August 28
Former FBI Director Robert Mueller: September 2
Former U.S. Attorney General Loretta Lynch: September 9
Former U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder: September 30

-
Are you not entertained?

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Something Smells Funny In Here at August 05, 2025 11:18 AM (L/fGl)

62 A woman could give birth to her parents' child.

Posted by: Oglebay at August 05, 2025 11:18 AM (MMp6W)

63 i was 16 when my penultimate sister was born. another was born after i went to college. i am not the oldest in the family.

my mother was the oldest of 13 children.
Posted by: anachronda at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (sGtp+)

Anachondra's mom(and grandmom):
*takes drag off cigarette, looking at birth rates*

'Fuck you, I'll do it myself.'

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:18 AM (bss/y)

64 Posted by: anachronda at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (sGtp+)

I was in my mid-20s when my last sibling was born. Different mothers because my father couldn't keep it in his pants.

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:19 AM (ExV1e)

65 my mother was the oldest of 13 children.
Posted by: anachronda

There was a family in my hometown that had 13 kids.

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:19 AM (77rzZ)

66 Yesterday was the Duchess of Sussex's 44th birthday, any celebration of which seems curiously absent from the HQ.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at August 05, 2025 11:19 AM (0sNs1)

67 A woman could give birth to her parents' child.
Posted by: Oglebay at August 05, 2025 11:18 AM

I'm my own grandpa!

Posted by: Ray Stevens at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (jc0TO)

68 I don't know. Science got ahead here.
Posted by: runner at August 05, 2025 11:18 AM (g47mK)

No… the scientists intentionally ignored the moral considerations.

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (Mxf84)

69 26 One of the satellite tumors is no longer there

it reached escape velocity?

Posted by: anachronda at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (sGtp+)

70 Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, Texas

Excellent news! Down as I get at my own early phase of the process, your example gives me cause to bear it.

Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (OUMaO)

71 IVF is insanely expensive, though. I've had a few friends of the family go through it. Sometimes it takes 3-4 "runs" before the pregnancy holds. That could be $100k or more by that point.

I also think IVF is a bit of a racket in that too many couples give up on natural conception in favor of the quick and easy -- but expensive -- IVF. The first thing some fertility docs advise is IVF because it's big money.

Posted by: Elric at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (iFTx/)

72 66 Yesterday was the Duchess of Sussex's 44th birthday, any celebration of which seems curiously absent from the HQ.
Posted by: Duncanthrax at August 05, 2025 11:19 AM (0sNs1)

Guessed who it was before looking it up.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (bss/y)

73 Again, humans.. people… not commodities.

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (Mxf84)

Yes...that is a vital distinction. I used the technical terms for simplicity's sake.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (L5An7)

74 66 Yesterday was the Duchess of Sussex's 44th birthday, any celebration of which seems curiously absent from the HQ.
Posted by: Duncanthrax at August 05, 2025 11:19 AM (0sNs1)

Todger cream for everybody!!

Posted by: The Duke of Sussex at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (PiwSw)

75 No… the scientists intentionally ignored the moral considerations.
Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (Mxf84)

what have I done!

--Alfred Nobel

Posted by: runner at August 05, 2025 11:21 AM (g47mK)

76 Yesterday was the Duchess of Sussex's 44th birthday, any celebration of which seems curiously absent from the HQ.
Posted by: Duncanthrax at August 05, 2025 11:19 AM (0sNs1)

That explains the plethora of articles about the Yacht Girl Duchess in the Daily Mail.

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:21 AM (ExV1e)

77 My daughter just sterilized herself. Old enough to know better. Profoundly sad she is so lost. I have zero positive to say about the whole situation. Sigh. Double sigh.

Posted by: Mongo at August 05, 2025 11:22 AM (s9EN2)

78 51 LOL. Once a developer, always a developer.
Posted by: WisRich at August 05, 2025 11:13 AM (G0vdT)

"Give up! I have the high ground!"
Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (rIQZh)
--------

Some Presidents get a dog. Trump builds a 90,000 sqft ballroom.

Posted by: WisRich at August 05, 2025 11:22 AM (G0vdT)

79 "There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy." (Hamlet)

Posted by: L - No nic, another fine day at August 05, 2025 11:22 AM (NFX2v)

80 Friend has breast cancer and is convinced it was IVF that did it. I'm not - she also had multiple jabs plus there is pure bad fortune and uhhh "genes". Very sad about her she is going through hell.

Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:23 AM (jRYyy)

81 Sorry, but you cannot be pro IVF and pro Life. There is no shortage of children needing a home. Please consider adoption if you are truly pro life.

Posted by: Tropical Lutefisk at August 05, 2025 11:23 AM (6C8vh)

82 That's not funny!

https://is.gd/dXJ3gF

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Something Smells Funny In Here at August 05, 2025 11:23 AM (L/fGl)

83 Some Presidents get a dog. Trump builds a 90,000 sqft ballroom.
Posted by: WisRich at August 05, 2025 11:22 AM

Is it really that big? That would be larger than the Whitehouse, I would think.

Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:23 AM (jc0TO)

84 Yes...that is a vital distinction. I used the technical terms for simplicity's sake.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:20 AM (L5An7)

I don’t fault the technical language, just trying to emphasize the humanity of the embryos.

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:24 AM (Mxf84)

85 81 Sorry, but you cannot be pro IVF and pro Life. There is no shortage of children needing a home. Please consider adoption if you are truly pro life.
Posted by: Tropical Lutefisk at August 05, 2025 11:23 AM (6C8vh)

How about, like energy, I am all of the above.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:24 AM (bss/y)

86 Prayers up Tim.

Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:24 AM (jRYyy)

87 The Frozen Embryos would make an excellent name for a minor league hockey team.

Posted by: Icing The Puck at August 05, 2025 11:25 AM (G5+As)

88 Did we learn nothing from Frankenstein's monster? Just because we can, doesn't mean we should.

One obvious problem is, as stated, the "leftover" embryos. (I also wonder about the effects of freezing.) Another problem is what are unethical people doing with these embryos that is unknown to the public.

I am not unsympathetic to the heartbreak of couples unable to have children but I would look for other solutions.

Finally, cliches have become cliches for a reason and "waste not, want not" comes to mind. To be wasteful of human life is likely to bring extreme want because of the value of the wasted "product".

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:25 AM (PcTds)

89 Sorry, but you cannot be pro IVF and pro Life
------

Yes I can and you can't stop me.

Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:25 AM (jRYyy)

90 A woman could give birth to her parents' child.
Posted by: Oglebay

If my wife carries someone else's fetus, gives birth, and we adopt her, can I have sex with her when she reaches 18? Hypothetically.

Posted by: Woody Allen at August 05, 2025 11:25 AM (JCZqz)

91 There are probably other social considerations at play here also. The couple I was speaking about earlier didn't try to have children at all until they were in their forties. She had been on BC pills since a young teenager.

I'm guessing her fertility train had slowed way down due to age and BC (as I said, I'm guessing).

Imagine, one major social change has impacts no one foresaw.

Posted by: Tonypete at August 05, 2025 11:25 AM (cYBz/)

92 There is no shortage of children needing a home. Please consider adoption if you are truly pro life.

I assume that there are fewer hoops to jump through for IVF.

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:26 AM (ExV1e)

93 I don’t fault the technical language, just trying to emphasize the humanity of the embryos.

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:24 AM (Mxf84)

Absolutely. I am becoming more and more absolutist about conception, so it is easy for me to see that embryos are simply very small people.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:26 AM (L5An7)

94 89 Sorry, but you cannot be pro IVF and pro Life
------

Yes I can and you can't stop me.
Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:25 AM (jRYyy)

Then answer the questions I posed.

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at August 05, 2025 11:26 AM (PiwSw)

95 My daughter just sterilized herself. Old enough to know better. Profoundly sad she is so lost. I have zero positive to say about the whole situation. Sigh. Double sigh.
Posted by: Mongo

My sincere condolences 😞🙏

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:27 AM (PcTds)

96 61
‘ Are you not entertained?’

Not when it’s only theater I’m not.
For what do they need to go back to Alberto Gonzales and Bill Clinton?

Posted by: Dr. Claw at August 05, 2025 11:27 AM (jbnUc)

97 There is no shortage of children needing a home. Please consider adoption if you are truly pro life.

I assume that there are fewer hoops to jump through for IVF.
Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:26 AM

You don't have to sign a pledge to trans your child.

Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:27 AM (jc0TO)

98 I remember when my wife was pregnant, I dreaded going to the local IVF place for genetic testing of the fetus. I was terrified that they'd find some horrible genetic defect in the baby, and we'd be tempted to abort it.

Fortunately, that did not occur. He was a healthy kid.

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:27 AM (77rzZ)

99 Sorry, but you cannot be pro IVF and pro Life.

Posted by: Tropical Lutefisk at August 05, 2025 11:23 AM (6C8vh)

I am both, with the recognition that there are significant issues with IVF.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:27 AM (L5An7)

100 Which isn't to say you should have quite so many embryos on stand-by, just noting there's a case for room for error.
Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:17 AM (OUMaO)

True. But they can try again just like with natural conception. I had a miscarriage and we continued to try while starting the process to adopt our daughter from China. We weren't able to conceive again so adoption went forward.

Overhaul the process to adopt kids in the US and make it easier for good people to adopt babies. Right now it seems like the only people who can adopt a child who is younger than a year, are ultra wealthy, celebrities, or homosexual. Or all of the above.

Posted by: Madamemayhem (uppity wench) at August 05, 2025 11:28 AM (2J/Lj)

101 There are probably other social considerations at play here also. The couple I was speaking about earlier didn't try to have children at all until they were in their forties. She had been on BC pills since a young teenager.

My DIL doesn't want kids. Turning 30 this year. I pray that she'll change her mind before it's too late.

Daughter, OTOH, wants 2 - 3.

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:28 AM (ExV1e)

102 Vending machine that dispenses babies is on the horizon.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at August 05, 2025 11:04 AM (Q4IgG)

I want a Mongolian one, a Mexican one and a couple of Ugandans in the BOGO pack!

Posted by: Amy Conehead Barrett, Stunt Baby Collector at August 05, 2025 11:28 AM (ZU2mU)

103 Thank you all for continuing to pray for me - they are definitely working! 😊❤️
Posted by: Teresa in

Good news Teresa and love your positive outlook.

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:28 AM (PcTds)

104 81 Sorry, but you cannot be pro IVF and pro Life. There is no shortage of children needing a home. Please consider adoption if you are truly pro life.
Posted by: Tropical Lutefisk at August 05, 2025 11:23 AM (6C8vh)
============
Disagree. One of my daughters had a series of miscarriages, and finally was able to get pregnant via IVF. The process allowed her to deliver their only child, now aged three, and we are thankful every day.

Posted by: Huck Follywood at August 05, 2025 11:29 AM (lYZ0S)

105 Then answer the questions I posed.
Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at August 05, 2025 11:26 AM (PiwSw)

Sorry I'm not jumping through your special hoops just to find out what you want to arue about.

You want to pose your argument, do it. Then if I feel like it, I'll let you know if I agree. That's how this works.

Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:30 AM (jRYyy)

106 Is an embryo of a human being a human being? Does life begin at conception?

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at August 05, 2025 11:14 AM (PiwSw)

Yes and yes.

But the larger culture does not see it so clearly, and when the intent is to bring life into the world, is there any accommodation we can make for the unavoidable (for now) consequences?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:30 AM (L5An7)

107
Is it really that big? That would be larger than the Whitehouse, I would think.
Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:23 AM (jc0TO)
------------

That's what they're claiming. Have you seen the pictures. It's a whole new wing of the WH (possibly replacing a portion of the East Wing).

Posted by: WisRich at August 05, 2025 11:30 AM (G0vdT)

108 My TV gets IVF channels!

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at August 05, 2025 11:31 AM (sS8Hf)

109 Daughter, OTOH, wants 2 - 3.
Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 11:28 AM (ExV1e)

You should tell her, “those are rookie numbers. You need to pump those numbers up.” ;-)

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:31 AM (Mxf84)

110 Trump is feeding undocumented aliens to alligators!

A stressed Rachel Maddow, who has been whining about Trump for a decade now, declares that we are living under a "consolidating dictatorship."
Maddow accused the Trump administration of wanting to feed illegal immigrants to alligators.
"We do now live in a country that has an authoritarian leader in charge. We have a consolidating dictatorship in our country."
"They're trying to make it into a national entertainment to threaten to feed immigrants to alligators."

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Something Smells Funny In Here at August 05, 2025 11:32 AM (L/fGl)

111 "They're trying to make it into a national entertainment to threaten to feed immigrants to alligators."
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Something Smells Funny In Here at August 05, 2025 11:32 AM (L/fGl)

I disagree. The threat of it is not very entertaining.

Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:33 AM (jRYyy)

112 Daughter, OTOH, wants 2 - 3.
Posted by: I used to have a different nic

Good for her!

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:33 AM (77rzZ)

113 some horrible genetic defect

Two heads are better than one.

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at August 05, 2025 11:33 AM (sS8Hf)

114 Are you not entertained?
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Something Smells Funny In Here at August 05, 2025 11:18 AM (L/fGl)
------------

I will be when they refuse to appear and the US Marshal Service puts them in chains and handcuffs and hauls them in.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at August 05, 2025 11:33 AM (tT6L1)

115 Some Presidents get a dog. Trump builds a 90,000 sqft ballroom.
Posted by: WisRich

Well, he does have big balls.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Something Smells Funny In Here at August 05, 2025 11:34 AM (L/fGl)

116 Trump and DeSantis are feeding illegal immigrants to alligators in the Super Dome?

Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 11:34 AM (ASt0K)

117 Per the webz, the Whitehouse is 168x152 feet. 25,536 sqft.

90K will dwarf it.

Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:34 AM (jc0TO)

118 "Give up! I have the high ground!"
Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:16 AM (rIQZh)

There is a fine line between occupying the high ground and being treed.

Posted by: Kindltot at August 05, 2025 11:35 AM (rbvCR)

119 There's a house down the street that's got a big "It's a boy!" sign in the yard in blue letters. Makes me smile.

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:35 AM (77rzZ)

120 Thx CBD.
In law school Trust and Estates they discussed the "fertile octagenarian" and the "precious toddler". I'm sure the discussions have gotten stranger with issues like IVF

Posted by: Smell the Glove at August 05, 2025 11:35 AM (r/xMY)

121 Wow, how big is the lot on which the WH sits?

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:36 AM (77rzZ)

122 You want to pose your argument, do it. Then if I feel like it, I'll let you know if I agree. That's how this works.
Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:30 AM (jRYyy)

If you feel like reading this, then here you go:

If a fetus is not a human being, then there is no moral hazard attached to creating 10, 100, 1000, 10,000. Discard as needed.

If a fetus is a human being, then discarding it is killing an innocent human being.

Which is why I'm also anti-abortion.

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at August 05, 2025 11:36 AM (PiwSw)

123 My TV gets IVF channels!
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at August 05, 2025 11:31 AM

My TV's IVF channels are scrambled. 😔

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at August 05, 2025 11:36 AM (Wnv9h)

124 Is it abuse to create an embryo and leave it frozen, and eventually have it be destroyed? Has that person been truly hurt? Sure, they never got to develop and be a "person" in the normal sense, but part of the argument against abortion is that it doesn't matter how their life may or may not have turned out, they are a person all the same. So a person is created, and eventually dies without violence, and the Lord does whatever he sees fit to do with that person's soul. Butchering a fetus that is unwanted and discarding it like trash has got to be different from allowing an embryo that was cared for over years and years to naturally die.

I don't know. I feel like the two things are not exactly the same, even if they both involve unborn children. I'm not drawing any conclusions, just thinking out loud. Sloppily.

Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:36 AM (rIQZh)

125 Two heads are better than one.

Unless it is a two-headed Hillary

Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 11:36 AM (ASt0K)

126 In law school Trust and Estates they discussed the "fertile octagenarian"
Posted by: Smell the Glove

The Rule Against Perpetuities!

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (77rzZ)

127 121 Wow, how big is the lot on which the WH sits?
Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:36 AM (77rzZ)

18 acres according to the net.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (bss/y)

128 "And that is the issue! Storing viable embryos after these couples are done having children seems like both an easy decision and a supremely difficult one. It's easy because the embryos are human, and destroying them is roughly akin to abortion. It's difficult, because the parents will grow old and die, leaving the embryos to the vagaries of the storage companies and fluctuating law, and the whims of their heirs.

What to do? I don't know...Perhaps the embryos will naturally degrade over time, and the question will be less pressing, but with this technology available to most people, the question will not go away."

So, you've hit on the big Catholic issues without realizing it. The abortion issue is the obvious one. But the 2nd is taking God and even sometimes the married couple out of the calculus. Not to mention the degradation of human life now into "property" for use by the owner, with the hope to solving that issue having that "property" wither and die.

There's a reason a faith so into babies and innocent life is so against the practice. "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" is all over the IVF practice. We wanted all moms to have biological babies...

Posted by: Nova Local at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (tOcjL)

129 All this talk of children reminds me of a recent conversation I had with my youngest. Being as two of my grandsons are old enough to marry and have children, I've taken perverse pride asking my daughter if there are any future wives on the horizon with the possibility of great grand children.

When my daughter responded with the inevitable, "Dad, I'm too young to be a grandmother" I mentioned how old I was when she made me a grandfather.

Much merriment happened on my side of the conversation.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (tT6L1)

130 Yes and yes.

But the larger culture does not see it so clearly, and when the intent is to bring life into the world, is there any accommodation we can make for the unavoidable (for now) consequences?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:30 AM (L5An7)

IVF is a useful technology, and it should be strictly limited to enable married heterosexual couples to bear children if they are medically unable to do it in the normal fashion. No embryos for gay couples, no embryos for research, no embryos for tissue "donations". Unimplanted frozen embryos to be made available to qualified couples at "X" years after conception, and ethically destroyed at "2X" years, said destruction to be deemed a miscarriage in law.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (WGkKU)

131 “ They're trying to make it into a national entertainment to threaten to feed immigrants to alligators."

I can’t vote for Trump any harder than I already have.

Posted by: Dr. Claw at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (jbnUc)

132 Evidently, the original land reservation was about 4 times that size.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:38 AM (bss/y)

133 If a fetus is not a human being, then there is no moral hazard attached to creating 10, 100, 1000, 10,000. Discard as needed.

If a fetus is a human being, then discarding it is killing an innocent human being.

Which is why I'm also anti-abortion.
Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at August 05, 2025 11:36 AM (PiwSw)

Perfectly reasonable. I also don't like the long term IVF risks as noted above.

Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:38 AM (jRYyy)

134 He is so chill.
Really? You went there?

Posted by: GWB at August 05, 2025 11:38 AM (Mi0CH)

135 think IVF is a bit of a racket in that too many couples give up on natural conception in favor of the quick and easy -- but expensive -- IVF. The first thing some fertility docs advise is IVF because it's big money.
---
Another interesting point. Recently read Good Energy re American diet and health issues. IIRC there is an issue PCOS perhaps, that causes infertility.

We could examine infertility issues such as this, address underlying health concerns as an alternative to IVF.

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:39 AM (PcTds)

136 “ They're trying to make it into a national entertainment to threaten to feed immigrants to alligators."

I can’t vote for Trump any harder than I already have.
Posted by: Dr. Claw at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (jbnUc)
-----------
I'm of the opinion inmates should be given a knife and told they need to hunt alligators so they can eat.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at August 05, 2025 11:39 AM (tT6L1)

137 116 Trump and DeSantis are feeding illegal immigrants to alligators in the Super Dome?
Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 11:34 AM (ASt0K)

Hard Rock Stadium in Miami Gardens.

Posted by: The Miccosukee casino will be taking bets at August 05, 2025 11:39 AM (TbWk/)

138 61 Rep. James Comer@RepJamesComer
BREAKING
The House Oversight Committee is compelling the following individuals to appear for depositions through issued subpoenas:

These are for the Epstein investigation, which spanned four administrations

Posted by: SMOD at August 05, 2025 11:40 AM (RHGPo)

139 Which is why I'm also anti-abortion.
Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at August 05, 2025 11:36 AM (PiwSw)

Perfectly reasonable. I also don't like the long term IVF risks as noted above.
Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 11:38 AM (jRYyy)

Again. We are not talking about a reality where we are able to get rid of both abortion or IVF at the moment. These embryos will be in storage forever. These people wanted a child.

In that context, I am completely ok with all of this.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:40 AM (bss/y)

140 Love, peace, and understanding.

Crockett: “Not only are we gonna punch back, but we about to beat you down."
*applause*

-
Beat down like white jazz fans in Cincinnati!

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Something Smells Funny In Here at August 05, 2025 11:40 AM (L/fGl)

141 Per the webz, the Whitehouse is 168x152 feet. 25,536 sqft.

90K will dwarf it.
Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:34 AM (jc0TO)
=================
Your point still holds, but (fwiw), chatgpt claims the current Executive Residence (ie, the White House building itself, and not including the East or West wings) is 55,000 square feet. The West wing adds another 68,000 sq. ft. and the East Wing is 90,000 sq. ft., so the existing complex totals 168,000 sq ft.

Of course, chatgpt has been known to dream shit up....

Posted by: Huck Follywood at August 05, 2025 11:40 AM (YIGq2)

142 I find it funny that parts of the right and left both oppose IVF for different reasons.

Common ground finally.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (AiNp4)

143 9 IVF, genetic selection, Sydney Sweeney, all come together in this tangentially-related meme.
https://tinyurl.com/3wxkhy5a
Posted by: Moron Analyst at August 05, 2025 11:03 AM (JCZqz)

That elicited a spit take ...

Damnnn, that's harsh ... good, but harsh

Posted by: Jules Winfield at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (TTAGa)

144 Three of my grandchildren are adopted. My son and wife had two natural children, then started fostering. First two brothers, who were 1 and 3, living nearly ferally, born to drug addicts. Then they started fostering a newborn, as soon as he was out of the NICU. He's now 4 and adoption was recently finalized.

Every one is very blond and Nordic-looking, except the youngest who is very chocolate brown. He's a cool little guy, people do a double-take when they are out and about.

Posted by: Grandpa To Seven at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (G5+As)

145 is a consolidating dictatorship something like an oligarchy controlled by dominant news sources working hand in hand with entrenched political parties?

Posted by: Kindltot at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (rbvCR)

146 So, you've hit on the big Catholic issues without realizing it.

Posted by: Nova Local at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (tOcjL)

Right. I'm too stupid to know that sort of stuff.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (L5An7)

147 Overhaul the process to adopt kids in the US and make it easier for good people to adopt babies. Right now it seems like the only people who can adopt a child who is younger than a year, are ultra wealthy, celebrities, or homosexual. Or all of the above.

Posted by: Madamemayhem (uppity wench)

As an adoptee myself, this I can get 100% behind.

Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (OUMaO)

148 He is so chill.
Really? You went there?
Posted by: GWB at August 05, 2025 11:38 AM

Not to do so would cause a chilling effect on internet humor.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (Wnv9h)

149 chatgpt claims the current Executive Residence (ie, the White House building itself, and not including the East or West wings) is 55,000 square feet. The West wing adds another 68,000 sq. ft. and the East Wing is 90,000 sq. ft., so the existing complex totals 168,000 sq ft.

Of course, chatgpt has been known to dream shit up....
Posted by: Huck Follywood at August 05, 2025 11:40 AM

But that is over the three stories. The footprint is what I speak of. I'm not picturing a multistory ballroom.

Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:42 AM (jc0TO)

150 Trump and DeSantis are feeding illegal immigrants to alligators in the Super Dome

*Golf clap*

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:42 AM (PcTds)

151 IVF is a useful technology, and it should be strictly limited to enable married heterosexual couples to bear children if they are medically unable to do it in the normal fashion.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (WGkKU)
============
I could agree with that position.

Posted by: Huck Follywood at August 05, 2025 11:42 AM (YIGq2)

152 135 think IVF is a bit of a racket in that too many couples give up on natural conception in favor of the quick and easy -- but expensive -- IVF. The first thing some fertility docs advise is IVF because it's big money.
---
Another interesting point. Recently read Good Energy re American diet and health issues. IIRC there is an issue PCOS perhaps, that causes infertility.

We could examine infertility issues such as this, address underlying health concerns as an alternative to IVF.
Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:39 AM (PcTds)

Let's not forget endocrinology. Both men and women are getting hormones and other chemicals dumped into them both wittingly and unwittingly. Seems it would be worth investigating, as average testosterone levels among men in the US are at an historic low, and God only knows how bad women have screwed up their bodies with hormonal contraception.

Posted by: Are there microplastics in my balls? at August 05, 2025 11:43 AM (TbWk/)

153 Damnnn, that's harsh ... good, but harsh
Posted by: Jules Winfield at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM

That's some Chuy-level cruelty.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at August 05, 2025 11:43 AM (Wnv9h)

154 151 IVF is a useful technology, and it should be strictly limited to enable married heterosexual couples to bear children if they are medically unable to do it in the normal fashion.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (WGkKU)
============
I could agree with that position.
Posted by: Huck Follywood at August 05, 2025 11:42 AM (YIGq2)

“Won’t someone think of the gay men who yearn for children of their own?!”

/sarc

Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:43 AM (Mxf84)

155 There is a fine line between occupying the high ground and being treed.

Posted by: Kindltot

Largely depending on who has the chainsaw.

Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:44 AM (OUMaO)

156 Mortgage rates are at 10 month lows. The market is giving Powell a bigly big finger. And rightfully so.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at August 05, 2025 11:44 AM (AiNp4)

157 How does family linage work? Does the family name, the genes that go with it reside in the male? Or does it matter?

My wife and I disagree on this particular issue.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at August 05, 2025 11:45 AM (Q4IgG)

158 146 So, you've hit on the big Catholic issues without realizing it.

Posted by: Nova Local at August 05, 2025 11:37 AM (tOcjL)

Right. I'm too stupid to know that sort of stuff.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (L5An7)

It's never too late to develop some self-awareness.

Posted by: If he can do it anyone can at August 05, 2025 11:45 AM (TbWk/)

159 Let's not forget endocrinology. Both men and women are getting hormones and other chemicals dumped into them both wittingly and unwittingly. Seems it would be worth investigating, as average testosterone levels among men in the US are at an historic low, and God only knows how bad women have screwed up their bodies with hormonal contraception.

Posted by: Are there microplastics in my balls? at August 05, 2025 11:43 AM (TbWk/)

Which is why cancer happens...to the person whose friend suspects it, they are probably right. My spouse's workmate, who only saved eggs in her late 30s (and not embryos) is another cancer survivor (who got the cancer prior to Covid shots, so no correlation), who believes she got her cancer in her 40s the same way...if you flood hormones into a body, you get off-effects, just like any other medical procedure...but no one mentions to risks to the parents...

Posted by: Nova Local at August 05, 2025 11:45 AM (tOcjL)

160 Whoa, the Whitehouse has six floors. I guess one or two are underground.

Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 11:45 AM (jc0TO)

161 155 There is a fine line between occupying the high ground and being treed.

Posted by: Kindltot

Largely depending on who has the chainsaw.
Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:44 AM (OUMaO)

Also:
- whether you are armed
- how big the bear is

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:45 AM (bss/y)

162 What are they smoking over at air anerica tv

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at August 05, 2025 11:46 AM (WyoiG)

163 And back to Medicare we go -

WaPo, White House has no plan to mandate IVF care, despite campaign pledge
President Donald Trump has said he wants a “baby boom,” but critics say his administration has yet to make significant family policy changes — and that Medicaid cuts will hurt.
August 3, 2025

Posted by: L - No nic, another fine day at August 05, 2025 11:46 AM (NFX2v)

164 You saw salt (they might have added floors)

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at August 05, 2025 11:46 AM (WyoiG)

165 so no correlation), who believes she got her cancer in her 40s the same way...if you flood hormones into a body, you get off-effects, just like any other medical procedure...but no one mentions to risks to the parents...
Posted by: Nova Local at August 05, 2025 11:45 AM (tOcjL)

If you go that route, then birth control would also be a source of issue- and much larger than IVF. At least affecting a lot more women.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:47 AM (bss/y)

166 According to the left

Trump doing some renovations in the WH is fascist and dictatorial.

But the Fed building a $2B palace headquarters or the FBI building a $500 new building is saving democracy or some such.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at August 05, 2025 11:47 AM (AiNp4)

167 Some critics say.

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at August 05, 2025 11:47 AM (WyoiG)

168 Unless it is a two-headed Hillary

Her double headed man-o-war.

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at August 05, 2025 11:48 AM (DlF8b)

169 So far, they haven't described the proposed building addition dimensions, beyond saying it will be 90,000 sq ft., so we don't know the footprint they are proposing.

Posted by: Huck Follywood at August 05, 2025 11:48 AM (291Vr)

170 165 so no correlation), who believes she got her cancer in her 40s the same way...if you flood hormones into a body, you get off-effects, just like any other medical procedure...but no one mentions to risks to the parents...
Posted by: Nova Local at August 05, 2025 11:45 AM (tOcjL)

If you go that route, then birth control would also be a source of issue- and much larger than IVF. At least affecting a lot more women.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:47 AM (bss/y)

I don't disagree that oral contraception could be another cancer causer...although long term lower grade is easier for a body to handle than short term huge flood...the whole process is rough on a woman, just for the egg saving...not even getting to an implantation...

In fact, while it doesn't apply to me, I wouldn't doubt some of the 40s cancer is b/c of oral contraceptive use...

Posted by: Nova Local at August 05, 2025 11:50 AM (tOcjL)

171 Trump is paying for the renovations.

The FBI building, etc. - taxpayers paying, GSA "contractors" receiving.

Keeps the Congressional investments rolling positive.

Posted by: L - No nic, another fine day at August 05, 2025 11:50 AM (NFX2v)

172 Teresa,
Can you please send me an email? Thanks.

Posted by: The Grateful at August 05, 2025 11:50 AM (IQ6Gq)

173 some horrible genetic defect

Two heads are better than one.
Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats

Abby and Brittany Hensel have entered the chat.

Posted by: Tonypete at August 05, 2025 11:50 AM (cYBz/)

174 Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:41 AM (L5An7)

I didn't read it that way. It's an intense difficult topic for many. I try to, not always with success, read in a charitable light.

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:51 AM (PcTds)

175 Also:
- whether you are armed
- how big the bear is

Posted by: Aetius451AD

If the bear has a chainsaw, you're screwed regardless.

Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:51 AM (OUMaO)

176 Ipsos has Trump at -16 approval.
IBD has it at -1

Both polls taken during the same 3-4 day window.

Guess which poll the MSM breathlessly talked about?

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at August 05, 2025 11:52 AM (AiNp4)

177 If we’re to follow “the way the good Lord intended” then to be consistent we’d have to shun all technology.

It’s modern medical technology which is a good thing. Yes there are definitely ethical considerations, but there are fairly obvious solutions; namely, don’t destroy embryos

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at August 05, 2025 11:52 AM (WnEm5)

178 Would you like to try more than an average-sized dildo that replicates a stallion of mystical dreams? This ultra-thick Jumbo Jack Man O’ War Extra Thick Dildo would be the star of your sexual desires! A heavy-duty surreal dildo with a whopping 10 inches in length, and 8 inches of insertable thick girthy ultra-smooth yet daring shaft that finishes off a flared ballsy base.

But is it available at the drive thru?

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at August 05, 2025 11:52 AM (DlF8b)

179 Teresa, such great news! Congratulations and keep up the great healing!

Posted by: jen the original at August 05, 2025 11:52 AM (ajZxL)

180 If the bear has a chainsaw, you're screwed regardless.
Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:51 AM (OUMaO)

Oh, pish, like they can work that annoying little choke lever with those big clumsy paws.

Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 11:52 AM (rIQZh)

181 If you go that route, then birth control would also be a source of issue- and much larger than IVF. At least affecting a lot more women.

Posted by: Aetius451AD

Not just women. There's sufficient evidence the stuff winds up in the water supply that it's been a subject for discussion for decades.

Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (OUMaO)

182 If a couple can't conceive naturally then wouldn't that be an indication, from a strictly evolutionary/natural selection point of view, that their genes are of insufficient quality to replicate and pass on?

Posted by: As opposed to, say, Sydney Sweeney's at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (TbWk/)

183 When I did IVF 24 years ago, my fertility doctor was a Catholic man, with six children.

He only used fresh embryos and refused to store/save any.

I didn't really understand it at the time, but now I most definitely do!

SO glad there's no chance of any of my and my late husband's embryos being "out there".

Posted by: Doesn't Matter at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (JCLJi)

184 Thaddeus? Boy, that kid is going to have a rough time at school.

Posted by: Archer at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (IDphi)

185 Razorback ghidra a nameless horror

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (WyoiG)

186 Well first the bear has to fight the gas can without self igniting.

Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (ASt0K)

187 Thaddeus? Boy, that kid is going to have a rough time at school.
Posted by: Archer at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (IDphi)
-------------

His daddy's goin to depend on him, though.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at August 05, 2025 11:54 AM (tT6L1)

188 182 If a couple can't conceive naturally then wouldn't that be an indication, from a strictly evolutionary/natural selection point of view, that their genes are of insufficient quality to replicate and pass on?
Posted by: As opposed to, say, Sydney Sweeney's at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (TbWk/)

Then you start to bring into question tool usage as being evolutionarily important. If someone is smart enough to use technology to make up for genetic shortcomings in other areas... aren't they more evolutionarily competitive?

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:54 AM (bss/y)

189 I try to, not always with success, read in a charitable light.

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:51 AM (PcTds)

A laudable goal.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:55 AM (L5An7)

190 If anyone is going to build an addition to a government building, I hope its the experienced builder Trump and not some bureaucrat who does the job. We will get better quality at a lower price, and maybe even free (if Trump et al really end up paying for it).

Posted by: Huck Follywood at August 05, 2025 11:55 AM (291Vr)

191 OR: Dildos getting tossed on the floor at WNBA games is hilarious trolling

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at August 05, 2025 11:55 AM (ZtAny)

192 If a couple can't conceive naturally then wouldn't that be an indication, from a strictly evolutionary/natural selection point of view, that their genes are of insufficient quality to replicate and pass on?
Posted by: As opposed to, say, Sydney Sweeney's at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (TbWk/)

Or maybe they just had an infection and got damaged fallopian tubes.

Geeez... The things some people think it's okay to say out loud.

Bet you also think all people born with a nut allergy deserve to die right?

Posted by: Doesn't Matter at August 05, 2025 11:55 AM (JCLJi)

193
From my neck of the woods

https://tinyurl.com/thh4mrps

Not good

Posted by: Swamp Rabbit at August 05, 2025 11:55 AM (5hfjS)

194
Not just women. There's sufficient evidence the stuff winds up in the water supply that it's been a subject for discussion for decades.
Posted by: Brother Tim (102mm/W59), Keeper of the Tim Continuum at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (OUMaO)

We've been drinking and bathing in their estriadol-laden pisswater for decades.

Posted by: No wonder the frogs are hermaphrodites and sterile at August 05, 2025 11:56 AM (TbWk/)

195 How does family linage work? Does the family name, the genes that go with it reside in the male? Or does it matter?

My wife and I disagree on this particular issue.

----
The genes are blended in the child, so both parents are represented.

As far as family linage, I think that is cultural. Most cultures are patriarchal, but some are matriarchal.

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 11:56 AM (PcTds)

196 191 — OT… Off topic…. Sheesh

Posted by: LinusVanPelt at August 05, 2025 11:56 AM (ZtAny)

197 87 The Frozen Embryos would make an excellent name for a minor league hockey team.
Posted by: Icing The Puck at August 05, 2025 11:25 AM (G5+As)

The Brunsen Brothers

Posted by: Darrell Harris at August 05, 2025 11:57 AM (02Hk3)

198 187 Thaddeus? Boy, that kid is going to have a rough time at school.
Posted by: Archer at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (IDphi)
-------------

His daddy's goin to depend on him, though.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at August 05, 2025 11:54 AM (tT6L1)

Oh, Motherfucker. I just had Patches start up in my head. I hate all of you.

https://tinyurl.com/3hcpj8mh

This doesn't actually sound right to me. The tempo is way too quick.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:57 AM (bss/y)

199 If a couple can't conceive naturally then wouldn't that be an indication, from a strictly evolutionary/natural selection point of view, that their genes are of insufficient quality to replicate and pass on?

Posted by: As opposed to, say, Sydney Sweeney's at August 05, 2025 11:53 AM (TbWk/)

That applies to many more things than just conception. Modern technology/medicine saves millions of people each year who would have died because they are insufficiently robust.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises) at August 05, 2025 11:57 AM (L5An7)

200 87 The Frozen Embryos would make an excellent name for a minor league hockey team.
Posted by: Icing The Puck at August 05, 2025 11:25 AM (G5+As)

Ack! The Bunsen Brothers.

Posted by: Darrell Harris at August 05, 2025 11:57 AM (02Hk3)

201 Has Jim Acosta asked the AI Friedrich Nietzche about this subject yet?

Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 11:58 AM (ASt0K)

202 Then you start to bring into question tool usage as being evolutionarily important. If someone is smart enough to use technology to make up for genetic shortcomings in other areas... aren't they more evolutionarily competitive?
Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:54 AM (bss/y)

Exactly.

Posted by: Khan Noonien Singh at August 05, 2025 11:58 AM (PiwSw)

203 Thaddeus is a great name.

Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:59 AM (77rzZ)

204 I saw Insufficiently Robust open for JJ and the Seftones at Red Rocks in '04

Posted by: Life of Wryly at August 05, 2025 12:00 PM (ycs3a)

205 201 Has Jim Acosta asked the AI Friedrich Nietzche about this subject yet?
Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 11:58 AM (ASt0K)

I was thinking about the technology and wondering what else you could do with it if it actually worked (talk to dead people, like a D&D spell, not the retarded AI thing.)

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 12:00 PM (bss/y)

206 Maybe that's the solution. Perfect the process so there are only the same number of embryos as the number of children they want to raise.

I like the idea and I think that addresses most of the ethical concerns. The problem is that you have to perfect the process and is still going to cost lives.

Posted by: NR Pax at August 05, 2025 12:00 PM (99eI0)

207 I'm a grandfather due to IVF. Daughter and hubby tried many times naturally and even a failed IVF. Other wise I would have no grandkids to tell where the rifles fell out of the canoe.

Posted by: Beartooth at August 05, 2025 12:01 PM (8wKVG)

208
Then you start to bring into question tool usage as being evolutionarily important. If someone is smart enough to use technology to make up for genetic shortcomings in other areas... aren't they more evolutionarily competitive?
Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 11:54 AM (bss/y)

It's a good question. It's not that they developed those tools on their own though, they merely took advantage of them. I don't know that doing so would necessarily indicate evolutionary advantage, the way the monkey who figures out how to use a stick to dig food out of a recessed area would be. It just means that for whatever reason they had enough money to spend on the procedure. Were there hereditary characteristics that allowed them to have the money to spend on the procedure? I have no idea.

By the way before folks go all panty-bunching I am just putting this out here to evoke discussion from a particular aspect.

Posted by: Lots of facets to the whole thing at August 05, 2025 12:01 PM (TbWk/)

209 You should tell her, “those are rookie numbers. You need to pump those numbers up.” ;-)
Posted by: DoublySymmetric at August 05, 2025 11:31 AM (Mxf84)

Well, she's not married yet. The guy she thought she was gonna married noped out after 3+ years. And she's just about to start a career she finds interesting so there'll be a bit of a delay in getting started.

Posted by: I used to have a different nic at August 05, 2025 12:01 PM (ExV1e)

210 He only used fresh embryos and refused to store/save any.
---
This seems like a good middle ground. Still the technology will be abused by the unethical, but I could support a law like that.

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 12:01 PM (PcTds)

211 We need a solution to keep the human race strong like ox.

Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 12:02 PM (jRYyy)

212 BREAKING: Palestinian billionaire Bashar Masri has resigned from Harvard after being sued for allegedly aiding Hamas through Gaza development projects, that ended up just being terrorist tunnels.

Masri is now reportedly on the run.

yet another merchant of death

Posted by: SMOD at August 05, 2025 12:02 PM (RHGPo)

213 This seems like a good middle ground. Still the technology will be abused by the unethical, but I could support a law like that.
Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 12:01 PM

[ The Boys from Brazil have entered the chat ]

Posted by: toby928 at August 05, 2025 12:02 PM (jc0TO)

214 201 Has Jim Acosta asked the AI Friedrich Nietzche about this subject yet?
Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 11:58 AM (ASt0K)

Joe Rogan should interview AI Jim Acosta.

Posted by: I am the Shadout Mapes, the Housekeeper at August 05, 2025 12:02 PM (PiwSw)

215 Aetius

Necromancers?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMaQbae-quQ

Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 12:03 PM (ASt0K)

216 God is very pleased that one of his creations now has the breath of this earthly probation.

Posted by: Elrond Hubbard at August 05, 2025 12:03 PM (XkVSB)

217 Very interesting topic CBD, thank you!

Posted by: AmericanKestrel at August 05, 2025 12:03 PM (PcTds)

218 CBD,
I missed the art thread due to a doctor appointment and just saw today's selection. It is wonderful. Thanks for using it and for introducing me to a new to me artist.

Posted by: JTB at August 05, 2025 12:03 PM (yTvNw)

219 The Embryo Twins were an act on The Gong Show. They sang the Paul Anka tune (You're) Having My Baby. The didn't go full-term and were Gonged.

Posted by: Sivi Aberg at August 05, 2025 12:03 PM (G5+As)

220 We need a solution to keep the human race strong like ox.
Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 12:02 PM

Mortal Combat.

Posted by: The Viltrumites at August 05, 2025 12:03 PM (jc0TO)

221 That applies to many more things than just conception. Modern technology/medicine saves millions of people each year who would have died because they are insufficiently robust.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (with a beret and a Gauloises

Survival of the fittest is a great idea, until you get souls involved.

Posted by: RI Red at August 05, 2025 12:03 PM (tez/p)

222 Necromancers?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMaQbae-quQ
Posted by: Anna Puma at August 05, 2025 12:03 PM (ASt0K)

That's just wrong.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 12:04 PM (bss/y)

223 Too bad DINOs aren't as plentiful and active as RINOs

Posted by: Bearly at August 05, 2025 12:05 PM (GuA1Z)

224 "Palestinian Billionaire".

So much wrong with that phrase. Even before you open the "at Harvard" can of worms.

Posted by: Warai-otoko at August 05, 2025 12:05 PM (rIQZh)

225 Teresa. Prayers for continued healing

Posted by: Gonzotx at August 05, 2025 12:05 PM (njVrr)

226 Senator Warren "gushing over Mamdani" . Ewww

Posted by: Smell the Glove at August 05, 2025 12:06 PM (r/xMY)

227 Nood. Pam.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at August 05, 2025 12:06 PM (bss/y)

228 Thaddeus is a great name.
Posted by: Bulg at August 05, 2025 11:59 AM (77rzZ)
----------
I'm partial to "Elihu," myself.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea at August 05, 2025 12:06 PM (WvZaB)

229 Newsum says he's going to redistrict all Dems in California. Why haven't they done this already? Ethics isn't stopping them, they probably cant. Seems an empty threat.

Posted by: actually inside the beltway at August 05, 2025 12:06 PM (BW+Gb)

230 211 We need a solution to keep the human race strong like ox.
Posted by: ... at August 05, 2025 12:02 PM (jRYyy)

Like some kind of supplement?

One has to wonder why, at least in America, we are physically and mentally weaker and sicker (especially in the realm of chronic health conditions) across the board in modern times. Some of that is age-related but not all, such as obesity and various forms of mental illness. Is it genetic? Chemical? Environmental? Behavioral? Perhaps a combination of all of these things to one degree or another. It's perplexing to me.

Posted by: First world fragility? at August 05, 2025 12:07 PM (TbWk/)

231 66 Yesterday was the Duchess of Sussex's 44th birthday, any celebration of which seems curiously absent from the HQ.

She’s beautiful, despite her recent bout with cancer, she looks 32 tops

Posted by: Gonzotx at August 05, 2025 12:08 PM (njVrr)

232 CA already like 80% Democrat seats.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at August 05, 2025 12:09 PM (AiNp4)

233 You know what I like best about all these people Trump has fired that are "fighting back," is that they are going on the most far-left and radical news sites.

Proving exactly and loudly that they are every bit as partisan as feared.

It's good that the lie of "non-partisan" and "experts" is being dismantled by the very incompetents who occupied those roles.

Even better is the lefty news rags all cheering the "wins" in district court--while completely ignorant of all the recent Supreme Court ruling.

OTOH, reading the subtext of the lefty rags: They are very, very angry and are really, really pushing for violence.

Posted by: People's Hippo Voice at August 05, 2025 12:09 PM (NwfFc)

234 I'm partial to "Elihu," myself.
Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea at August 05, 2025 12:06 PM (WvZaB)
-----------

No love for Eli? There's even a song about Eli.

https://tinyurl.com/bdcxvx76

Why yes, I'm trying to torture Aetius451AD just a bit. Why do you ask?

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at August 05, 2025 12:10 PM (tT6L1)

235 Yet there are ethical considerations that are extraordinarily difficult.

Like when your wife gives birth to a cat. Celebrate, or sue "Joe's Egg Emporium and Novelty Shop"?

Posted by: t-bird at August 05, 2025 12:10 PM (J2Jn3)

236 #176
Americans have many varieties of media to choose from
"Mainstream media" is what Americans chose most often
Some Americans apparently disapprove of the choices others make. Very very few choose Breitbart while many others choose the NY Times

Posted by: Aliassmithsmith at August 05, 2025 12:11 PM (017kC)

237 CBD- What to do? I don't know. Technology has outpaced our understanding of the issue!

**********

In theory, a bioethicist should be the one to strive to answer this type of question. The key question is not CAN we do this, but SHOULD we be doing this. The bioethicist should act as a governor (in the sense of reining in) or conscience to the scientists.

In practice, ethicists too often end up being apologists for the scientist, as exemplified by Fauci's wife. They tend to become allies of the scientist, finding plausible justifications for pushing the limits of the SCIENCE!

Posted by: muldoon at August 05, 2025 12:14 PM (poXs5)

238 So, you've hit on the big Catholic issues without realizing it.

-
Is this about those funny pointy hats?

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Something Smells Funny In Here at August 05, 2025 12:14 PM (L/fGl)

239 Half of a ballrom's need is service area. It could be 45000 sq ft on each floor, (450 ft X 100 ft footprint) with basement service area for catering and other service support.

Posted by: actually inside the beltway at August 05, 2025 12:15 PM (ErLti)

240 I have a feeling President Trumpo is leading the dems into a Gerrymandering trap.

Posted by: Admiral Fishhead Star Trek at August 05, 2025 12:15 PM (ZU2mU)

241 One has to wonder why, at least in America, we are physically and mentally weaker and sicker

Food-borne illnesses, really, introduced and promoted knowingly since at least 1911 (Crisco). RFK, Jr. has one of the most important assignments there is.

Posted by: t-bird at August 05, 2025 12:16 PM (J2Jn3)

242 Tesresa in Fort Worth -

As I wrote the other day in a willowed post: this is great news! I will keep the men’s prayer group I attend praying for you! Prayer works!

Posted by: NemoMeImpuneLacessit at August 05, 2025 12:17 PM (cBEsk)

243 I dunno, 30 years of "freezer burn" is a long time. I have my doubts that this kid's DNA is going to be in tip-top condition. I hope I'm wrong.

Posted by: Grumpy and Recalcitrant at August 05, 2025 12:22 PM (O7YUW)

244 Judaism distinguishes between an implanted embryo and one created outside the mother's body... the fertilized egg is not viable unless implanted, and therefore not considered *fully* human while in vitro... this is deduced from Talmudic discussions around Exodus 21:22 and other sources.

Because of this religious opinion, Israeli scientists were able to pioneer much of the research that led to IVF, and other life-saving research that uses in vitro embryos.

Posted by: BenDavid at August 05, 2025 12:24 PM (Ozpkm)

245 It would really be remarkable if a fertilized 30 year old embryo, after 9 months gestation, sprang forth from the womb as a fully developed 30-year-old adult.

Posted by: muldoon at August 05, 2025 12:28 PM (poXs5)

246 No, CBD.

THE issue here is wrenching the unitive and procreative aspects of sexual relations apart. That is flat-out as much a slap at nature as is "trannydom."

Posted by: dad29 at August 05, 2025 12:44 PM (dKFe4)

247 I admit to not parsing the preceding [checks count] 246 comments before typing, but I see opportunity here in that we've fallen below the birthrate needed to maintain the species (and our great nation specifically), thus we can and should give these babies (and they are) a chance to be born. Heck, possibly one of these actually *is* the next Einstein or will cure cancer.

Posted by: DadVan at August 05, 2025 02:59 PM (+ruSa)

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