Gun Thread: Finally Final End of March Edition!

Howdy, Y'all! Welcome to the wondrously fabulous Gun Thread! As always, I want to thank all of our regulars for being here week in and week out, and also offer a bigly Gun Thread welcome to any newcomers who may be joining us tonight. Howdy and thank you for stopping by! I hope you find our wacky conversation on the subject of guns 'n shooting both enjoyable and informative. You are always welcome to lurk in the shadows of shame, but I'd like to invite you to jump into the conversation, say howdy, and tell us what kind of shooting you like to do!

Holy Shitballs! How in the ever-loving Hell did it get to be the end of March Edition? Not the first, not the second, not the third, not the fourth, but rather the fifth edition of the Ol' Gun Thread this month! Next week, by the way, we will have the first edition of April. Don't worry. I'll remind you.

I did not make it to the farm-o as planned this weekend, dangit! Trying again this week!

With that, step into the dojo and let's get to the gun stuff below, shall we?

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FUNdamentals

If you have been here for any length of time, you know I have a thing for logical and methodical use of time spent at the range focusing on fundamentals. So what's the first thing you do at the range once you are all set up and the range is hot? What is your routine? Do you just start trying to make small groups of holes and hope things work out or do you have a specific plan? If so, what is it? Is there a drill you find particularly useful? Please let us know how you organize and spend your range time in the comments below.

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Guns of the Horde

You people turned Sharon (willow's apprentice) into a gun nut!

Skerry!

Last Sunday as a belated birthday present, Ed L brought his MP5 to the range. Four of us had a chance to shoot, Blaster, Hrothgar, Ed L and I was last in line. You can see by the target that a whole lot of rounds were fired (they are marked off with an orange pen)but after I shot, Ed L pulled the target in and made me take a picture. The target was covered with bullet holes but if you look at the bottom of the grip, there is a round hole through the target where most of my shots went. That gun is so easy to shoot, hardly any recoil and the adjustable stock made it fit perfectly to my shoulder so way easier than a handgun to hold steady.
Sharon(willow's apprentice)

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1861 Springfield!

Here is our pal Hickok45 with a real beauty!

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Browning M2!

Our pal Ian at Forgotten Weapons takes a look at the Ma Deuce

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Our Pal The Bearing

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Ax Weasel

Q: Weasel, why did birds lose their teeth?
A: Seriously? This is your question? You're supposed to be focusing on fundamentals!

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More Toys of Yesteryear!

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Highway Patrol!
This week's episode is Convict's Wife

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Battle of the Worlds

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Here are some different online cigar vendors. You will find they not only carry different brands and different lines from those brands, but also varying selections of vitolas (sizes/shapes) of given lines. It's good to have options, especially if you're looking for a specific cigar.

Cigarsinternational.com
Cigarpage.com
Famous-smoke.com
Cigarsdaily.com
Neptunecigar.com
Smallbatchcigar.com
Bobalu Cigar Company
Cigarbid.com
Nicks Cigar World New!

A note about sources. The brick & mortar/online divide exists with cigars, as with guns, and most consumer products, with respect to price. As with guns - since both are "persecuted industries", basically - I make a conscious effort to source at least some of my cigars from my local store(s). It's a small thing, but the brick & mortar segment for both guns and tobacco are precious, and worth supporting where you can. And if you're lucky enough to have a good cigar store/lounge available, they're often a good social event with many dangerous people of the sort who own scary gunz, or read smart military blogs like this one. -rhomboid

Anyone have others to include? Perhaps a small local roller who makes a cigar you like? Send me your recommendation and a link to the site!

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Ammo Link-O-Rama
I'm really very seriously not kidding around anymore. Buy Ammo
AmmoSeek - online ammo search tool
GunBot - online ammo search tool
SG Ammo
Palmetto State Armory
Georgia Arms
AmmoMan
Target Sports USA
Bud's Gun Shop
American Elite Ammo NEW!

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Please note the new and improved protonmail account gunthread at protonmail dot com. An informal Gun Thread archive can be found HERE. Future expansion plans are in the works for the site Weasel Gun Thread. If you have a question you would like to ask Gun Thread Staff offline, just send us a note and we'll do our best to answer. If you care to share the story of your favorite firearm, send a picture with your nic and tell us what you sadly lost in the tragic canoe accident. If you would like to remain completely anonymous, just say so. Lurkers are always welcome!

That's it for this week - have you been to the range?

Posted by: Weasel at 07:00 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Gubs!

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:00 PM (Wnv9h)

2 X-Ring >>> X-Men

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:00 PM (a3Q+t)

3 Bang

Posted by: Eromero at March 30, 2025 07:00 PM (FYKyG)

4 Good evening everyone

Posted by: Skip at March 30, 2025 07:00 PM (2ovuE)

5 The Others have been summoned.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:01 PM (Wnv9h)

6 I see Teh Horde has been a great influence on sharon. Looking forward to seeing the DMV Moron Gun Club soon!

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:03 PM (Wnv9h)

7 I did not make it to the farm-o as planned this weekend, dangit! Trying again this week!

Those organic, free-range trees can survive another week without Weaselerian attention.

The question is, can the guests of the WAHFUAUEVAs?

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:03 PM (a3Q+t)

8 The Ma Deuce is still in service. It's hardly forgotten.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:04 PM (a3Q+t)

9 Ribs are off the grill, corn in the oven and cauliflower on the range.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 07:05 PM (64TDs)

10 Ribs are off the grill, corn in the oven and cauliflower on the range.
Posted by: Grump928
old thread!

Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at March 30, 2025 07:06 PM (5ewfc)

11 Howdy

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 07:06 PM (Puxt7)

12 The target tonight is 218 Comments.

Posted by: Ciampino - bullets not oysters at March 30, 2025 07:06 PM (sPQoU)

13 9 Ribs are off the grill, corn in the oven and cauliflower on the range.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 07:05 PM
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Cauliflower on the range? What caliber do you use when shooting cauliflower?

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 07:06 PM (IQ6Gq)

14 Howdy, GWB.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:07 PM (Wnv9h)

15 Good evening Horde. Thanks Weasel!

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 07:07 PM (IQ6Gq)

16 Sharon performed a navelectomy on that zombie.

I didn't know that was the most efficient way to kill zombies, but I learn something new in the gub thread every week!

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:07 PM (Q4Dc6)

17 Cauliflower on the range? What caliber do you use when shooting cauliflower?
Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 07:06 PM

.380, with a PPK, as Albert R. Broccoli would have wanted it.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (Wnv9h)

18 On the fun front, picked up my Singapore (Sterling) Assault Rifle 80 at the FFL, checked it, slapped a 40rd Sterling mag of M193 in it, (which is correct) popped off 20 rounds with out any failures, and took it home.

Cleaned and oiled it and put it away as a minty unobtainium rifle.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (64TDs)

19 Hello, Weasel!

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (AiJK3)

20 Nice, Sharon! We heard how well you did last week, but that pic is fantastic!

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (Puxt7)

21 Been looking at some interesting new targets for the MoMe IDPA shoot.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (keLsF)

22 Hola Weasel! Thanks for the thread.

Range time yesterday,
Focused on one handed shooting, both left and right. Shot my little Ronin. Left tended to be more consistent than right, perhaps because I focus more on the tiny details shooting left and feel more relaxed with my right.

Finished up with some relaxed plinking with the Ruger Mark IV.

Good day at the range.

Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (mT+6a)

23 12 The target tonight is 218 Comments.

Posted by: Ciampino - bullets not oysters at March 30, 2025 07:06 PM (sPQoU)
----
Sorry, correction: 231 Comments.

Posted by: Ciampino - bullets not sneaky oysters at March 30, 2025 07:09 PM (sPQoU)

24 Sharon performed a navelectomy on that zombie.

I didn't know that was the most efficient way to kill zombies, but I learn something new in the gub thread every week!
Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:07 PM

Sadly, it can be NSFW, as it makes the zombies umbili cuss.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:09 PM (a3Q+t)

25 I hoped to do some target practice this weekend. Instead, Hubby and Friend's teenage son did some plinking with the .22 while Friend and I visited. My friend's teenage son so desperately needs "man time" and my Friend needs "Adult Time."

Posted by: ScaryMary at March 30, 2025 07:09 PM (ytIDq)

26 Been looking at some interesting new targets for the MoMe IDPA shoot.
Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM

The RMBS Mom will be ready.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:09 PM (Wnv9h)

27 Been looking at some interesting new targets for the MoMe IDPA shoot.
Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM

Realistic 3D ones of penguins could be good.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:10 PM (a3Q+t)

28 Weasel!
I hope your paycheck reflects the Five Weeks Of March.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:11 PM (WRdlW)

29 Realistic 3D ones of penguins could be good.
Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:10 PM

That ain't gonna fly!

Posted by: Skipper at March 30, 2025 07:11 PM (Wnv9h)

30 21 Been looking at some interesting new targets for the MoMe IDPA shoot.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM

I have heard that if you go out at dusk, you have some very realistic, hog-shaped moving targets for the IDPA shoot.

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:11 PM (Q4Dc6)

31 Sharon performed a navelectomy on that zombie.
Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:07 PM (Q4Dc6)

I don't think that target went low enough for where Sharon wanted to aim.

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 07:12 PM (Puxt7)

32 Congratulations Sharon! That's very impressive.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at March 30, 2025 07:12 PM (CHHv1)

33 I looked at the FCG of the SAR and compared it to an AR180 and they made a fair number of changes, which seems odd to me as Sterling had made AR18s under license so they had the data package which I don't think contained any patented stuff except the sheet metal hammer. The SAR has a solid hammer, probably for that reason.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 07:12 PM (64TDs)

34 Mmmm, Sharon, exactly what were you aiming at?!

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:13 PM (WRdlW)

35 I do hope to never meet Sharon in a dark alley.

Posted by: ScaryMary at March 30, 2025 07:14 PM (ytIDq)

36 30 21 Been looking at some interesting new targets for the MoMe IDPA shoot.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM

I have heard that if you go out at dusk, you have some very realistic, hog-shaped moving targets for the IDPA shoot.
Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:11 PM (Q4Dc6)

I hear that there are even helicopter tours for those targets.

Posted by: Hour of the Wolf at March 30, 2025 07:14 PM (VNX3d)

37 Low and right is not a bad target

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:14 PM (keLsF)

38 I have been trying to find 10 round magazines for my S&W bodyguard 2.0 with no luck. The usual cabelas, bass pro and mag warehouse online only have the 12 round ones. I don't care for those as they stick out too far when I use my IWB holster. The ten round ones fit flush and are more comfortable.

I finally found one on ebay. It is supposed to be here wednesday. The guy at the gun store I usually go to says they can't get any of them but they can get as many of the 12 round magazines as they want.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at March 30, 2025 07:15 PM (e5NfL)

39 Also, the upper handguards attachment and the receive latches are different from the AR where the guide rods hold both on. I think that was also patented.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 07:16 PM (64TDs)

40 Evening all. I was going for center mass but zombie is kind of bent over so ended up a little low.😉

Posted by: Sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:17 PM (t/2Uw)

41 For those who know of my travails with a beaver coming into my pond and killing my nearby oak trees one by one by girdling them, as of last night:

Me: 1
Beaver eating my trees: 0

Number of fatally damaged oaks: 14
Number of oaks protected with PITA chicken wire wrap: 40-45

Hopefully, that was the only beaver.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 30, 2025 07:18 PM (i41hz)

42 I have been trying to find 10 round magazines for my S&W bodyguard 2.0 with no luck.
Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at March 30, 2025 07:15 PM

Might be worth checking stores in the non-free States like CA, NY, etc.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:18 PM (a3Q+t)

43 Focused on one handed shooting, both left and right. Shot my little Ronin.
Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (mT+6a)

Not the middle? Insty posted something Friday or yesterday from Truthaboutguns about one-handed shooting "left, right, and middle." Several comments referencing "the gripping hand."

And I don't remember much of anything about what "the middle" was about

I had just noticed they seemed to think you needed a different grip so you wouldn't pull/push your shots. I kinda thought you weren't gripping it properly two-handed, if that were the case. But I'm a big believer in one-handed and point shooting.

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 07:18 PM (Puxt7)

44 Evening all. I was going for center mass but zombie is kind of bent over so ended up a little low.😉
Posted by: Sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:17 PM

Splitting the difference between center mass and center _ass

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:19 PM (a3Q+t)

45 Cataract surgery coming up on April 10th. A little nervous but excited to see if I'll be able,to shoot without a patch.

Posted by: Sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:20 PM (t/2Uw)

46 Thanks again Weasel!

Sorry the tyranny of the spreadsheets kept you from organic tree farming.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:21 PM (tT6L1)

47 I hear that there are even helicopter tours for those targets.
Posted by: Hour of the Wolf at March 30, 2025 07:14 PM (VNX3d)

One gun tuber featured a hog hunting tour which had a MD-500 helicopter equipped with a door gun mount for an M134D Minigun. To keep ammo expenditure down, this Minigun had its rate fire toned back to only 3,000 rounds per minute (50 per second).

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 07:22 PM (AiJK3)

48 Cataract surgery coming up on April 10th. A little nervous but excited to see if I'll be able,to shoot without a patch.
Posted by: Sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:20 PM (t/2Uw)

Prayers up for success and clearer vision!

Posted by: Hour of the Wolf at March 30, 2025 07:22 PM (VNX3d)

49 38 I have been trying to find 10 round magazines for my S&W bodyguard 2.0 with no luck.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at March 30, 2025 07:15 PM

Gun Mag Warehouse says they still have some 10-round mags in stock. I have bought magazines for other S&W pistols from them, and they seemed to perform fine. (However, I am a low-volume shooter compared to most of the Morons here.)

P.S. How do you like the trigger on your Bodyguard 2.0? I hate the trigger on most pocket pistols, but liked that trigger when I dry-fired one last week.

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:23 PM (Q4Dc6)

50 .380, with a PPK, as Albert R. Broccoli would have wanted it.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (Wnv9h)
----------

Why would one hunt the wily cauliflower with a mouse gun?

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:23 PM (tT6L1)

51 Sorry the tyranny of the spreadsheets kept you from organic tree farming.
Posted by: blake

I read that as “tranny” and was grossing out.

Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 07:24 PM (mT+6a)

52 I finally found one on ebay. It is supposed to be here wednesday. The guy at the gun store I usually go to says they can't get any of them but they can get as many of the 12 round magazines as they want.
Posted by: Mister Scott

Natchez Shooting Supply has 10 round OEM mags from Smith and Wesson for 36.49 ea. On sale. Good folks to deal with. Gunmagwarehouse also has them for about 5 bucks more.

I am assuming that you are referring to the .380 ACP Bodyguard 2.0

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:24 PM (ctrM5)

53 Nice shooting, Sharon. Umm, I mean, your highness.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:24 PM (tT6L1)

54 Range Report!
Our Long Range has been out of action for a few weeks because Reasons. After a hearing on Wednesday, it is back open. The next day I was surprised to see no tire tracks in the mud and decided to be First.
I took the 6.6 Creedmoor and the .308 AR-10. Gusty right to left at the firing line and gusty left to right at the targets.
The 6.5 hit everything out to 525 first shot, but at 750 I could hardly see any impacts in the wet berms and fields. 6.5 does not make a huge impact.
After wasting many rounds at 750 and 825, I gave up and shot the .308. I got my ballistics adjusted and finally rung steel at 750. Whew. I thought I’d lost it there.
Since then we’ve had 6 inches of new snow, so I deep cleaned the 6.5 with Wipeout. Thank you Weasel-San!

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:25 PM (WRdlW)

55
I read that as “tranny” and was grossing out.
Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 07:24 PM (mT+6a)
-----------

High, nurse!

Today's grotesque trends seem to create a lot of misreading.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:26 PM (tT6L1)

56 I have been trying to find 10 round magazines for my S&W bodyguard 2.0 with no luck.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at March 30, 2025 07:15 PM

Gun Mag Warehouse says they still have some 10-round mags in stock. I have bought magazines for other S&W pistols from them, and they seemed to perform fine. (However, I am a low-volume shooter compared to most of the Morons here.)

P.S. How do you like the trigger on your Bodyguard 2.0? I hate the trigger on most pocket pistols, but liked that trigger when I dry-fired one last week.

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:23 PM

When I looked the other day they only had the pro mag ones. I want factory S&W ones.

The trigger is fine on my pistol, just as good as any of my glocks.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at March 30, 2025 07:26 PM (e5NfL)

57 No range time for me this week. Spent this weekend cleaning up what got used last week.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 07:27 PM (AiJK3)

58 50 .380, with a PPK, as Albert R. Broccoli would have wanted it.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:08 PM (Wnv9h)
----------

Why would one hunt the wily cauliflower with a mouse gun?
Posted by: blake
------
Excellent concealability is about the only reason. They are extremely flat and the original PPK (not the PPK/s) has a shorter grip frame.

The GCA of 1968 more or less killed importation of that model to the US. So, they took the longer grip frame from the PP and kept the shorter barrel of the PPK to make the PPK/s.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:28 PM (ctrM5)

59 Thanks everyone. It is a real confidence booster to be able to shoot with such experienced gunslingers and be able to keep up.

Posted by: Sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:29 PM (t/2Uw)

60 Weasel's gonna make us do all the heavy lifting this week, isn't he?

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:29 PM (a3Q+t)

61 My sister and I both had the Mattel holster with the pop out derringer. I think I was 5 and Ann was 10 or 11. I remember that Christmas well.

Posted by: Puddinhead at March 30, 2025 07:30 PM (3bxAV)

62 41 Me: 1
Beaver eating my trees: 0

Hopefully, that was the only beaver.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 30, 2025 07:18

Congrats on your varmint elimination project!

I got rid of one last year, but have a new one this spring.

In my area, this is the time that the young males move out from the previous homes. How big was your beaver? (Cue Moron jokes here.)

If it was a big old male, there are probably more. If it was smaller, then perhaps the first one. (It is nearly impossible to tell youngish males from females.)

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:30 PM (Q4Dc6)

63 60 Weasel's gonna make us do all the heavy lifting this week, isn't he?
Posted by: Duncanthrax
========
Tax time is taxing enough to make one want to go out to the range.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:30 PM (ctrM5)

64 Interesting side note about the Ma Deuce: Around about the Vietnam War it was realized stocks of the venerable M2 were running low. Turns out, everything then in use had been built around WWII. Yeah, they used WWII stock all throughout the Korean war. Anyway, from what I understand, there was somewhat of a scramble to find someone who could build some new 50 cal machine guns for the military.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:30 PM (tT6L1)

65 59 Thanks everyone. It is a real confidence booster to be able to shoot with such experienced gunslingers and be able to keep up.
Posted by: Sharon
======
SWA, being able to shoot a full auto anything (including an MP5) with accuracy is something that a lot of people never learn. Good shooting.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:32 PM (ctrM5)

66 Had a truncated revolver and reloads weekend at the farm. Truncated because Bailey the Wonder dog injured her left front leg somehow while chasing critters through the woods. 3 hours and $700 at the emergency vet clinic and we decided to come back home.

Reloads functioned well, except for two .45 Colt rounds that jammed in the SAA. I think recoil caused the bullet to unseat slightly and catch in the chamber. Insufficient crimp, perhaps?

Posted by: That SOB Van Owen at March 30, 2025 07:32 PM (Hdixl)

67 Me: 1
Beaver eating my trees: 0

Hopefully, that was the only beaver.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 30, 2025 07:18

Congrats on your varmint elimination project!

I got rid of one last year, but have a new one this spring.

In my area, this is the time that the young males move out from the previous homes. How big was your beaver? (Cue Moron jokes here.)

If it was a big old male, there are probably more. If it was smaller, then perhaps the first one. (It is nearly impossible to tell youngish males from females.)
Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:30 PM

This is how you relocate beavers:

https://youtu.be/YcdvP8CYPB0

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:33 PM (Wnv9h)

68 I have one rule for learning quickly, and that is bring lots of ammo. I cheap out on buying targets though. I don't have groupings, I have craters.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at March 30, 2025 07:33 PM (lhenN)

69 Mister Scott - is that the 380ACP Bodyguard 2.0?

Ammoseek in a quick check shows at least two sources for 10-round mags ($20 and $32, respectively).

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 07:34 PM (1m82a)

70 Auburn going to the final four!
War Eagle!

Posted by: Quarter Twenty at March 30, 2025 07:35 PM (YFEhc)

71 The trigger is fine on my pistol, just as good as any of my glocks.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at March 30, 2025 07:26 PM

Thanks!

Any thoughts about using that pistol for an EDC?

I keep a .45 hidden in my truck, so I kind of like Solomon's idea on "splitting the baby" and having a small gun for carry.

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:35 PM (Q4Dc6)

72 I have one rule for learning quickly, and that is bring lots of ammo. I cheap out on buying targets though. I don't have groupings, I have craters.
Posted by: BourbonChicken at March 30, 2025 07:33 PM

My habit of using cheap paper plates for targets led to my local range banning the practice.

Now I use typing paper.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 07:35 PM (64TDs)

73 We are still living off the M-2 receivers built during WWII. Barrels are still in production. The amount of of .50 Cals built is stunning.

Posted by: Puddinhead at March 30, 2025 07:36 PM (3bxAV)

74 A couple of range reports: Friday, I hit the range to do some shooting at a plate rack. Sadly, the 500 meter range was in use. The county sheriffs were doing some practice. After they 'd done some qualifying, they decided to have a competition: Golf balls @ 400 meters. Finally, the 12th round, someone hit one and everyone cheered. They were nice enough to let me use one of their targets, which was a cone topped by a golf ball so I could take crack at the golf ball. By then the wind had come up so, I didn't have much success, though, as one guy pointed out, I did catch the cone a couple of times under the golf ball. But, as I said to the sheriff, "The wind was bad enough even if I hit one, it would be luck and not skill." Fun to try, though. Next time, darn it!

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:36 PM (tT6L1)

75 PI, you’re in TX and you have “a” gun in your truck?
I am disappoint.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:36 PM (WRdlW)

76 We are still living off the M-2 receivers built during WWII. Barrels are still in production. The amount of of .50 Cals built is stunning.
Posted by: Puddinhead at March 30, 2025 07:36 PM

I had read that most of the Army's current M2 started out as aircraft receivers, since we cranked those out like no one's business.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 07:37 PM (64TDs)

77 There was a full scale riot last night in Arlington VA at the Pentagon Mall. Multiple fights. Police had to close the entire mall down. I was really surprised no one got shot because VA, one can carry. In DC now there is practically a shooting every night in a city with some of the tightest gun laws in the country.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:38 PM (t/2Uw)

78 68 I don't have groupings, I have craters.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at March 30, 2025 07:33 PM

I don't have groupings either!

Unfortunately, it is probably for a different reason than yours.

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:38 PM (Q4Dc6)

79 The GCA of 1968 more or less killed importation of that model to the US. So, they took the longer grip frame from the PP and kept the shorter barrel of the PPK to make the PPK/s.
Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:28 PM (ctrM5)

Walther has reintroduced the PPK (now made in Ft. Smith, AR) and PPK/S in the original Bond caliber, .32 ACP. One variant of the PPK/S, the SD, comes w/ a threaded barrel from the factory. .32 ACP is a much more pleasant round to shoot from the PPK than .380 ACP. I have doubts about .32 ACP as a viable defensive round today. But a .32 ACP PPK/S equipped with a suppressor is a lot of fun at the range.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 07:39 PM (AiJK3)

80 Howdy!

Posted by: Puddleglum, drive by pew pew at March 30, 2025 07:39 PM (sAmhv)

81 PI, you’re in TX and you have “a” gun in your truck?
I am disappoint.
Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:36 PM (WRdlW)

It's Texas, so it might be a substantial one.

Posted by: Hour of the Wolf at March 30, 2025 07:40 PM (VNX3d)

82 Guns!

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, buy ammo, food, water at March 30, 2025 07:41 PM (xcxpd)

83 Big hug to all you gunthusiasts

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:41 PM (keLsF)

84 {{{Ben Had}}}

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:41 PM (Wnv9h)

85 Yep on the quantity of M2 in the Aviation during the war. Bombers would carry a shit ton of them.

Posted by: Puddinhead at March 30, 2025 07:41 PM (3bxAV)

86 Used to buy (not shop, I always went for specific things I knew I would find) at Pentagon City mall on Sunday afternoons during football season. Deserted. Easy parking. And back then .... no riots.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 07:42 PM (1m82a)

87 {{{Ben Had}}}
Hope byt he tiime Texas is here, I will be able to run up and give you a hug.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:42 PM (t/2Uw)

88 So, range report two: two gun. One of the ranges ran a two gun competition, one in which I expected to come in last, and succeeded. Let's face it, the Garand and the 1911 isn't really built for speed. But, the fun factor was all I cared about. Plus, I was never all that fast to begin with.

However, I did get a bit of a last laugh because I was able to hit 10" steel @ 300 yard with iron sights while a couple of people with optics couldn't hit it at all.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:42 PM (tT6L1)

89 Good evening all,
If Ben Had is here: missed your comment on the Food Thread. No worries, I have had frogs legs and quite enjoyed them.

Now, back to the regularly scheduled program.
Range report: Operation Build Muscle Memory (and lose the Flinch) progresses in the correct direction. Slowly. Baby steps. But each session the number of hits that miss the 3in circle shrink. I "patiently" await the day that all 75 hits are within the 3in circle. There will be celebrations that night!

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 07:42 PM (IQ6Gq)

90 Did go to the range, did some Dot Torture drills with a PPQ 45 and my church gun, a PSA MicroDagger.

The PPQ was just irons, good groupings. The red dot on the Micro Dagger made all the difference though. Assuming I don't force the break on the damn trigger. Still respectable groups, even rapid fire. Good gun with 147 gr loads, I'm now utterly sold on 147gr for 9mm.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, buy ammo, food, water at March 30, 2025 07:43 PM (xcxpd)

91 Sharon, I will take a hug from you no matter how it gets to me.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:43 PM (keLsF)

92 79 One of the local gun shops markets "blemish" Walthers from time to time (Walther being "just down the street a bit") About five years ago I bought a PPK/S .22 for under $200. I didn't much care for it and sold it a year later for a little profit. The only way you could tell it was a blemished gun was a "B" stamped on the right of the frame.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at March 30, 2025 07:43 PM (gm9Sb)

93 64 Interesting side note about the Ma Deuce: Around about the Vietnam War it was realized stocks of the venerable M2 were running low. Turns out, everything then in use had been built around WWII. Yeah, they used WWII stock all throughout the Korean war. Anyway, from what I understand, there was somewhat of a scramble to find someone who could build some new 50 cal machine guns for the military.
Posted by: blake
=====
FIL shot both the M2 and the M60 along with the SAW before he retired as a senior Army NCO. Father was an Ordnance officer so he shot most of them in his era (the M2 and M60) but he started with field artillery as a young lieutenant. Really big bores on those boomsticks.

Me, in comparison, am a candy ass with firing only a bog std. AR in full auto and the later annoying three shot burst model before I exited Uncle Sam's Air Force.

Have little or no interest for fire full autos myself after that. Expensive habit to feed them plus they ding up brass too much for my liking.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:44 PM (ctrM5)

94 Oh and I'm selling off most of my guns. I'm keeping my Glocks, the XD Springfields and the CZs but getting rid of anything that I don't shoot on the regular.

May keep the Makarov though.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, buy ammo, food, water at March 30, 2025 07:44 PM (xcxpd)

95 wow Blake, that's impressive.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:45 PM (t/2Uw)

96 75 PI, you’re in TX and you have “a” gun in your truck?
I am disappoint.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:36 PM

"a" gun that is ALWAYS part of the truck, like the battery!

The truck frequently chooses to load up with some extra guns - especially since I have started an outdoor gun range and Bride of PI and Daughter #3 both are starting to shoot!

P.S. I am a bit north of Texas.

P.P.S. I tried taping some aspirin to the heads of my pocket gophers as you recommended. However, it didn't work. The raccoons kept getting drunk on fermented sand plums and then stealing the aspirins off of the gophers to cure their hangovers!

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:45 PM (Q4Dc6)

97 Yep the M2 was (properly) mounted on almost everything during the war. From ships to half-tracks to tanks to trucks to some jeeps (Rat Patrol!), and most fighter aircraft had 6 each, bombers that number or more. It was probably not just the most numerous but the most effective heavy MG of the war in anyone's line-up.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 07:46 PM (1m82a)

98 100!

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 07:46 PM (IQ6Gq)

99 wow Blake, that's impressive.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:45 PM (t/2Uw)
-------------

Thanks, Sharon. I won't claim my hit count was great, because it wasn't but, I still put more rounds on target than a couple of guys with optics, which was a hoot.

Funny thing, I was missing vertically, not horizontally.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:48 PM (tT6L1)

100 If it was a big old male, there are probably more. If it was smaller, then perhaps the first one. (It is nearly impossible to tell youngish males from females.)

Posted by: Pillage Idiot

It wasn't all that large, but given it is Texas, maybe that isn't a good tell. All of the molars and chompers seemed in good shape, which tells me it was probably young.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 30, 2025 07:49 PM (i41hz)

101 By the way Blake. My library agreed wit my request to buy the new Galbraith book when it becomes available s I should be first in line.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:49 PM (t/2Uw)

102 Walther has reintroduced the PPK (now made in Ft. Smith, AR) and PPK/S in the original Bond caliber, .32 ACP. One variant of the PPK/S, the SD, comes w/ a threaded barrel from the factory. .32 ACP is a much more pleasant round to shoot from the PPK than .380 ACP. I have doubts about .32 ACP as a viable defensive round today. But a .32 ACP PPK/S equipped with a suppressor is a lot of fun at the range.
Posted by: Ed L
======
The original 1967 pre GCA Walther PPK that passed through my hands was the first semi auto handgun that I learned to shoot with. In 32 ACP it would have been decent. In its actual 380 ACP chambering, not so much due to its narrow grip. The short grip also meant you had to hold it high and the 14-15 lb double action trigger meant the you had to really concentrate to get that first shot in DA. I could do that starting first on double action revolvers but never was a fan of crunchntick of DA/SA after learning to shoot the Walther. I can do it but it takes more concentration that other pistolas.

Firearm was accurate as all get out despite tiny sights but easy to get slide bite and felt recoil was higher than 9mm because of that narrow grip.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:50 PM (ctrM5)

103 PI, the Aspirin Shoots start up again at the end of April. Mid winter it was just the Match Director and me standing out in the snow looking for the aspirin-headed snowshoe rabbits.
I think I’d best drag out the .22s again. Can’t wait!

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:50 PM (WRdlW)

104 By the way Blake. My library agreed wit my request to buy the new Galbraith book when it becomes available s I should be first in line.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:49 PM (t/2Uw)
--------------

We may be able to discuss the book in TX this year. Unless you're not going to make it due to the various issues we 29 year olds seem to encounter.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 07:51 PM (tT6L1)

105 100 100!
Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 07:46 PM

Bravo Zulu, Centurion.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:52 PM (a3Q+t)

106 M60, M2 Bradley 25mm chain gun are my top calibers fired, sadly not a lot of rounds. Actually the M60 wasn't bad. Was at a shooting event for civilians at Quantico, attendance was far below that expected, jarheads on the range encouraged us to shoot as much as we wanted so they wouldn't have to carry it back. Probably a few belts of M60. And lots and lots of mags through the M16.

And came *this* close to shooting the M61 20mm.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 07:52 PM (1m82a)

107 I had read that most of the Army's current M2 started out as aircraft receivers, since we cranked those out like no one's business.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 07:37 PM (64TDs)

A couple of years ago, some place in the South with an F6F Hellcat fighter on display had fuel drop on the ground beneath it. When the Navy sent someone to investigate, they discovered that this F6F still had all six M2s in its wings with a few rounds of ammo. The ammo was disposed of w/ the local sheriff. The M2's were removed and sent somewhere (Anniston?) for refurbishment and to be put back into the supply system.

The Army found serial number 6 in a batch of M2's coming back from Afghanistan about ten years ago. Delivered from Colt in the early 1930s, it was pulled for future display in an Army museum after over 80 years of continuous service.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 07:52 PM (AiJK3)

108 The 3D's will all be in Texas for MoMe X

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:53 PM (keLsF)

109 Walther has reintroduced the PPK (now made in Ft. Smith, AR) and PPK/S in the original Bond caliber, .32 ACP. One variant of the PPK/S, the SD, comes w/ a threaded barrel from the factory. .32 ACP is a much more pleasant round to shoot from the PPK than .380 ACP. I have doubts about .32 ACP as a viable defensive round today. But a .32 ACP PPK/S equipped with a suppressor is a lot of fun at the range.
Posted by: Ed L

Adequate for the wet-work a real 007 would be doing - behind the ear while the target is sleeping.

Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at March 30, 2025 07:53 PM (/lPRQ)

110 I don't remember seeing this posted, but evidently Henry Repeating Arms moved all of its operations from New Jersey to Northern Wisconsin.

https://tinyurl.com/4tm9hd8b

Blue to Purple.

Posted by: Hour of the Wolf at March 30, 2025 07:54 PM (VNX3d)

111 The Ma Deuce is but another reason JMB is so beloved by all right-thinking Morons.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:54 PM (a3Q+t)

112 Sargon got grits (and said they were great) ... I would have told him to instead get fried okra.

Mark what CZs do you have? I have a Scorpion 3 that I love.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at March 30, 2025 07:54 PM (lhenN)

113 95 Oh and I'm selling off most of my guns. I'm keeping my Glocks, the XD Springfields and the CZs but getting rid of anything that I don't shoot on the regular.

May keep the Makarov though.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards
=====
Makes sense. I have to cull my long rifle collection because of back and unresolved shoulder issues. They still have not after 8 months figured out my right shoulder problems whether it originates in the spine or the shoulder itself but one doc believes the inflammatory arthritis I have is attacking the shoulder joint itself and will require surgery. The rheumatologist disagrees.

Probably shotguns in 12 gauge that are not sentimental family hand me downs will have to go too.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:55 PM (ctrM5)

114 I will get to Texas.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 07:55 PM (t/2Uw)

115 Oh, forgot the sweetest platform that day at Quantico - the Mk-19 grenade launcher. THAT was pure giggles.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 07:55 PM (1m82a)

116 100 100!

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 07:46 PM

I am surprised you could reach your keyboard that quickly with your short little arms!

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:56 PM (Q4Dc6)

117 Ed L, great story!
Mr. Garand had a knack for certain things.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:56 PM (WRdlW)

118 The 3D's will all be in Texas for MoMe X
Posted by: Ben Had
**********
Does that mean MoMe X will host the Club ONT live?

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 07:56 PM (IQ6Gq)

119 Adequate for the wet-work a real 007 would be doing - behind the ear while the target is sleeping.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
========
If you are that close, use a knife. They come in with built in sound suppressors if you keep the victim's mouth shut when using them.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:56 PM (ctrM5)

120 Oooops! Browning!

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:57 PM (WRdlW)

121 Realistic 3D ones of penguins could be good.
Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:10 PM

The 3D's will all be in Texas for MoMe X
Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:53 PM

Hurrah!!

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 07:57 PM (a3Q+t)

122 Gub!

Posted by: Notorious BFD at March 30, 2025 07:57 PM (mH6SG)

123 Grateful. Wouldn't that be a kick !

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:58 PM (keLsF)

124 EdL, that's a great story about the Hellcat 50cals.

At a museum, now closed/relocated, where I volunteered for years, more than once active squadrons cannibalized parts off of display models for their helicopters. In a way, horrifying, but in another way, cool.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 07:58 PM (1m82a)

125 119 I am surprised you could reach your keyboard that quickly with your short little arms!

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 07:56 PM
***
This is why we practice fundamentals. When the time comes, we're ready.

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 07:59 PM (IQ6Gq)

126 Shot ~200 rds with my BRN-180 in 300 blk on frinday. Would have shot more, but the ammo is so expensive. But everything worked. I put the lower together myself. Only lost 3 detents and 1 spring.

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at March 30, 2025 07:59 PM (b4o9z)

127 Duncanthrax, move heaven and earth, my friend.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 07:59 PM (keLsF)

128 Firearm was accurate as all get out despite tiny sights but easy to get slide bite and felt recoil was higher than 9mm because of that narrow grip.
Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 07:50 PM (ctrM5)

Walther has redesigned the grip tang to help combat that. It may not fix slide bite for those with big hands, but I haven't had any problems w/ slide bite on my PPK/S SD. It does change the PPK's outline noticeably, though.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 07:59 PM (AiJK3)

129 Whig and MAE, perhaps you could bring your leftovers to TX this fall.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:00 PM (WRdlW)

130 That Feeling When: You regret bidding on an item on Gunbroker and someone finally outbids you with only 15 minutes left in the auction.

I'm sure the Germans have a word for it.

Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at March 30, 2025 08:01 PM (/MyY+)

131 Good Sunday evening, gub 'ettes and 'rons, and a special farm-visit-free salutation to our esteemed host Weasel.

Sharon, congrats on realizing your true nature as a gun nut! The MP5 does look like a fun shooter.

Posted by: Schnorflepuppy - OT but harmless at March 30, 2025 08:01 PM (v23vE)

132 The 3D's will all be in Texas for MoMe X
Posted by: Ben Had
*********
Does that mean MoMe X will host the Club ONT live?
********
Wouldn't that be a kick !
Posted by: Ben Had
********
MoMe X is going to be lit!

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:01 PM (IQ6Gq)

133 106 Mid winter it was just the Match Director and me standing out in the snow looking for the aspirin-headed snowshoe rabbits.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:50 PM

Sounds like excellent practice at the range!

Since you typically shoot with a need for high precision on your targets, does the cold (dense) air significantly lower your POI?

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:02 PM (Q4Dc6)

134 "I'm sure the Germans have a word for it."

Wehrkaufspatschade.

(not too far off, if there were such a word)

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 08:02 PM (1m82a)

135 RIRed, you said that like you were going to be here. Don't tease me.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:02 PM (keLsF)

136 129 Shot ~200 rds with my BRN-180 in 300 blk on frinday. Would have shot more, but the ammo is so expensive. But everything worked. I put the lower together myself. Only lost 3 detents and 1 spring.
Posted by: sniffybigtoe
========
Magnet pickup tool (the 2-3 inch disk ones) or assembling the lower in a box when doing those tricky things. I use a bit of tape on the AR safety spring to retain it during assembly. Doesn't work for the detents of course. There is a specialized tool to do that but unless you like taking them completely down for cleaning, little reason to get the tool for one assembly job.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:03 PM (ctrM5)

137 Ah S'puppy....good to see you!

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:03 PM (IQ6Gq)

138 Hello gun nuts. I'm late, but I do have a report from my range date with Catch Thirty-Thr33 last weekend. We went to PSA with 4 of my guns: P365, Rock Island 1911, SA-35, and S&W 1917 revolver. This was only my 2nd time at the range since Corsicana, so I've got a lot of rust to knock off. However, I did pay special attention to my breathing and focused hard on my trigger pull (and NOT flinching). It was a decent outing for me, but C33 shot my revolver like he'd been doing it all his life. We both enjoyed the SA-35 and it has quickly become one of my favorites.

Now that Mom has moved to assisted living I may be able to get to the range more often and get some of the red marks off my permanent record.

Posted by: screaming in digital at March 30, 2025 08:04 PM (Szews)

139 132 Whig and MAE, perhaps you could bring your leftovers to TX this fall.
Posted by: RI Red
=======
Depends on whether you like old milsurp bolt action rifles. But any transfers would have to go through an FFL.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:04 PM (ctrM5)

140 127 EdL, that's a great story about the Hellcat 50cals.

At a museum, now closed/relocated, where I volunteered for years, more than once active squadrons cannibalized parts off of display models for their helicopters. In a way, horrifying, but in another way, cool.
Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 07:58 PM (1m82a)
At the end of 1970, both F4J squadrons in our CAG had at least one hangar queen. The squadrons were slated to transition to F14 Tomcats anyway. But still sad.

Posted by: Eromero at March 30, 2025 08:04 PM (p4vtc)

141 6.6 Creedmoor

I know that's a minor typo, but it made me wonder...
Has anyone ever fashioned a 6.66 (or .666) round? With Beowulf, Grendel, and such, a "Satan" round seems inevitable.

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 08:05 PM (BFokP)

142 133 That Feeling When: You regret bidding on an item on Gunbroker and someone finally outbids you with only 15 minutes left in the auction.

I'm sure the Germans have a word for it.
Posted by: Idaho Spudboy
=======
It would be how I say relief!

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:05 PM (ctrM5)

143 I am in the market for a "long gun," so if anyone is downsizing I may be interested.

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:06 PM (IQ6Gq)

144 Since you typically shoot with a need for high precision on your targets, does the cold (dense) air significantly lower your POI?
Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:02 PM (Q4Dc6)

Absolutely. That’s why knowing your density altitude is critical. Thin dry hot air versus cold damp thick air makes a huge difference in muzzle velocity.
I keep records for every day I shoot.
Because I am a nerd.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:06 PM (WRdlW)

145 Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 07:46 PM (1m82a)

The B-25J strafer variants probably packed more MGs than anything else flying in WWII. Eight M2s in the nose, four in pods on each side firing forward (two per side) beneath the cockpit, two in a top turret, two waist guns (one per side), and two in the tail. That's a total of eighteen M2s, with twelve of them firing forward in a strafing attack on ground targets.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:07 PM (AiJK3)

146 Has anyone ever fashioned a 6.66 (or .666) round? With Beowulf, Grendel, and such, a "Satan" round seems inevitable.
Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 08:05 PM

You might find a ML that takes a ball miking that.

A centerfire would be classified as a destructive device, and subject to all kinds of proctology, assuming it could be legally used at all.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 08:08 PM (a3Q+t)

147 I know that's a minor typo, but it made me wonder...
Has anyone ever fashioned a 6.66 (or .666) round? With Beowulf, Grendel, and such, a "Satan" round seems inevitable.
Posted by: GWB
=======
I think the 20 gauge is the closet to that firing slugs. .615 more or less. 12 gauge is about .73,

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:08 PM (ctrM5)

148 RIRed, you said that like you were going to be here. Don't tease me.
Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:02 PM (keLsF)

BH, I ain’t promising anything! I do not want to get on your bad side. I know about that kitchen table.
But I’m sure going to try.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:08 PM (WRdlW)

149 Absolutely. That’s why knowing your density altitude is critical. Thin dry hot air versus cold damp thick air makes a huge difference in muzzle velocity.
I keep records for every day I shoot.
Because I am a nerd.
Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:06 PM (WRdlW)
------------

Yeah, the POI change here has been startling with things warming up. And it doesn't even get all that cold here.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 08:08 PM (tT6L1)

150 Contemplate sitting on 1,600 acres visiting with group of friends after a day of shooting and exceptional food.

MOME X

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:08 PM (keLsF)

151 At the end of 1970, both F4J squadrons in our CAG had at least one hangar queen. The squadrons were slated to transition to F14 Tomcats anyway. But still sad.
Posted by: Eromero
****************
I do have a soft spot for the F14 Tomcats....think of you often Mr E, and pray you are doing well.

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:09 PM (IQ6Gq)

152 146 I am in the market for a "long gun," so if anyone is downsizing I may be interested.
Posted by: Grateful
=======
Depends on what you want it for--home defense or hunting. Or both.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:09 PM (ctrM5)

153 133 That Feeling When: You regret bidding on an item on Gunbroker and someone finally outbids you with only 15 minutes left in the auction.

I'm sure the Germans have a word for it.

Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at March 30, 2025 08:01 PM

Keine meine backpfeifengesicht?

(My face is no longer the one that needs to be punched.)

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:09 PM (Q4Dc6)

154 I am in the market for a "long gun," so if anyone is downsizing I may be interested.
Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:06 PM

Some specific specificity could be helpful.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 08:09 PM (a3Q+t)

155 @SiD, I'm sorry to hear that about your mom. It's tough when a parent gets to the point they need that kind of care.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 08:10 PM (tT6L1)

156 This is how you relocate beavers:
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 07:33 PM (Wnv9h)

I would think divorce....

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 08:10 PM (y1xNk)

157 Grateful, I keep hearing ads for Henry rifles which are made in the US and have a lifetime warranty and many Hordians like them so i am tempted.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 08:10 PM (t/2Uw)

158 Grateful,
What do you want a long gun for? Plinking? Home defense? Long range target shooting? Hunting?

Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 08:11 PM (mT+6a)

159 EdL, this museum I spoke of had a PBJ, the Marine version of the strafing B-25. Literally bristling with gun barrels. This one had just one M2 in the tail, but otherwise IIRC was as you described. Apparently very effective against a major target set in the Pacific, which was barges (how the Japanese moved men and materiel around their island possessions).

I always wondered about trim/balance issues for those planes, as they shot up their ammo. I think they had ballast that could be tossed out the waist gun windows.

A fully restored flying PBJ is at the Camarillo museum near Santa Barbara, but I forget if they have if configured it with all the guns.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 08:11 PM (1m82a)

160 (My face is no longer the one that needs to be punched.)
Posted by: Pillage Idiot
=======
If I bid on another firearm right now, it would be "my butt is not longer the one that needs to be kicked by wife". When you get into auxiliary safes and lockups, then it is time to prune back.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:11 PM (ctrM5)

161 I want a long gun for home defense, no hunting, or long range target shooting at this point (apologies Weasel).

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:13 PM (IQ6Gq)

162 Grateful, I keep hearing ads for Henry rifles which are made in the US and have a lifetime warranty and many Hordians like them so i am tempted.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 08:10 PM

They make some nice rifles. I'd look at a .357 for general fun. They make a .41M, if you want the coolest of the cool. They have several in various calibers if you want to hunt.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 08:13 PM (a3Q+t)

163 Grateful obviously needs to get into long range target shooting. Mainly because RI Red and I need company with the obsession known as long range shooting.

Though, the PRS guys may even be a bit crazier than the long range guys.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 08:13 PM (tT6L1)

164 I want a long gun for home defense, no hunting, or long range target shooting at this point (apologies Weasel).
Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:13 PM

Those are at fairly opposite ends of a spectrum.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 08:14 PM (a3Q+t)

165 I have a Henry rifle that Dad gave me. He won it at a Jay-cee's raffle, or some such thing. He didn't need so gave it to me. It is nice to shoot.

Posted by: ScaryMary at March 30, 2025 08:14 PM (ytIDq)

166 Absolutely. That’s why knowing your density altitude is critical. Thin dry hot air versus cold damp thick air makes a huge difference in muzzle velocity.
I keep records for every day I shoot.
Because I am a nerd.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:06 PM

Thought so.

I do NOT do that enough. I shoot my deer rifle in the fall on nice days, and then avoid blasting gun shots out on our property when it is cold so as not to disturb the deer.

I think I need to go out immediately after the season ends and sight in my rifle on a cold day that matches our typical hunting conditions.

I wonder if I will draw a game warden over? Probably need to keep the paper target in the truck!

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:15 PM (Q4Dc6)

167 Makes a date to shoot some skeet with Grateful in October.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:15 PM (keLsF)

168 45 ... Sharon,
Good luck with your cataract surgery. Mine made a world of difference and even corrected heavy astigmatism. Still have to use cheaters for reading but so worth it. One thing, I had to get shooting glasses. My regular glasses had always served that need. It was weird being able to see all the rings on the target.

Posted by: JTB at March 30, 2025 08:15 PM (yTvNw)

169 Grateful,

I will give a stab at what you may or may not like. A 20 gauge, especially with a youth stock, is a handy all around firearm for self defense, hunting, clays/trap, etc. Got good reflexes, a pump shotgun is the most reliable. With buckshot or slugs, a potent self defense weapon equivalent to firing two 44 Magnum shells at the same time. Not bad recoil with buckshot in this caliber, some recoil in slugs.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:15 PM (ctrM5)

170 When you get into auxiliary safes and lockups, then it is time to prune back.
Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:11 PM

I understand each of those words, but not in that order.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 08:15 PM (a3Q+t)

171 Think someone told me that Henry has added the Kings Improvement (loading gate) to their lever actions, or some of them? I'd advise anyone getting a lever rifle to get one with the gate if available.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 30, 2025 08:16 PM (1m82a)

172 Absolutely. That’s why knowing your density altitude is critical. Thin dry hot air versus cold damp thick air makes a huge difference in muzzle velocity.
I keep records for every day I shoot.
Because I am a nerd.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:06 PM

A good baseball coach does the same when he considers who's pitching.

Posted by: Diogenes at March 30, 2025 08:17 PM (W/lyH)

173 164 I want a long gun for home defense, no hunting, or long range target shooting at this point (apologies Weasel).
Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:13 PM (IQ6Gq)

But long range shooting makes you better at everything!
Seriously, an M-4gery is a great home defense gun. And if you see burglars approaching at 4-500 yards, you’re also good to go.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:18 PM (WRdlW)

174 Well, time to wander.

Have a good one!

Later!

Weasel, take care and I look forward to TX this year.

Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing (tT6L1) at March 30, 2025 08:18 PM (tT6L1)

175 Grateful obviously needs to get into long range target shooting. Mainly because RI Red and I need company with the obsession known as long range shooting.

Though, the PRS guys may even be a bit crazier than the long range guys.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing
****************
I acknowledge that by making the comment I did it would be a slippery slope and not take any time at all before someone (Blake in this case) made the comment he did.
I may in fact at SOME point be interested in long range target shooting, but for now just interested in building muscle memory with my pistol and possibly getting a long gun if people are downsizing. Let's remember that I began shooting in April 2024!

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:18 PM (IQ6Gq)

176 whig, couldn't have said it better. I have a Remington 870 20 Guage to let Grateful have some fun with

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:19 PM (keLsF)

177 146 ... Grateful,
What are you looking for in a 'long gun'? Caliber? Bolt or semi? target or hunting? Likely distance to shoot?

Posted by: JTB at March 30, 2025 08:19 PM (yTvNw)

178 JTB, thanks for the encouragement. I am getting the astigmatism surgery(cost extra lol) both eyes and Surgeon says at the most Imight need drug store glasses for reading. I've worn glasses my whole life pretty much so this should be interesting. Can't wait to try long distance rifle shooting. My right eye is weakest and my dominent eye so looking through a sight with glasses was difficult.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 08:20 PM (t/2Uw)

179 and possibly getting a long gun if people are downsizing. Let's remember that I began shooting in April 2024!
Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:18 PM

Are you coming to the TX MoMe?

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 08:20 PM (a3Q+t)

180 Good evening all and a great big thank you to Weasel. No shooting, but the WifeUnit and I went out to pick up the stand for my last critter from Africa. Have a great week all…

Posted by: Coelacanth at March 30, 2025 08:21 PM (P9pDS)

181 @SiD, I'm sorry to hear that about your mom. It's tough when a parent gets to the point they need that kind of care.
Posted by: blake
---
It is. But she's doing fairly well - better than I expected.

Posted by: screaming in digital at March 30, 2025 08:21 PM (Szews)

182 Grateful, I would take a look at either the AR in .223/5.56 which is the cheapest option along with cheap ammo. Or the pistol cartridge carbines.

Hi Point, actually makes some very decent pistol cartridge carbines in fairly serious cartridges coming out of a long arm that are not expensive. Hi Point also has an excellent rep for customer service.

Then you have Ruger and Smith and Wesson--they make both Pistol cartridge carbines and basic .223-5.56 ARs.

In less gun friendly zones, consider going to the cowboy assault rifle--aka 357 Magnum lever action. Very mild recoil and the 357 is a different beast in a carbine and adequate to about 50-75 yards.

I would include M1 Carbine clones but self defense ammo is expensive as are the carbines. Good for self defense but at the top end of the price range even for clones.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:21 PM (ctrM5)

183 Makes a date to shoot some skeet with Grateful in October.
Posted by: Ben Had
***********
Well, that could be very interesting. We are driving down, so this may be the time....

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:22 PM (IQ6Gq)

184 Are you coming to the TX MoMe?
Posted by: Duncanthrax
************
Absolutely. I don't want to be on Ben Had's naughty list!

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:24 PM (IQ6Gq)

185 Howdy Jim!

I hope you are reading and smiling. God be with you.

Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 08:24 PM (mT+6a)

186 Grateful, the nice thing about TX is that you can wander over to the long range and someone there will have you hitting 300 steel in short order. With many rifles to choose from.
But expect to get hooked.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:24 PM (WRdlW)

187 172 Grateful,

I will give a stab at what you may or may not like. A 20 gauge, especially with a youth stock, is a handy all around firearm for self defense, hunting, clays/trap, etc. Got good reflexes, a pump shotgun is the most reliable. With buckshot or slugs, a potent self defense weapon equivalent to firing two 44 Magnum shells at the same time. Not bad recoil with buckshot in this caliber, some recoil in slugs.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:15 PM

I was going to type the same advice as whig. (But I trust him more!)

My wife has a pump 12 gauge as her home defense "carry". The only time it ever had too much kick was when she did not shoulder it properly. (Neither of us has ever shot slugs from that gun.)

I think a 20 gauge would be very good for your needs! I used to love shooting my Ithaca 20 gauge for quail before it ended up with my brother.

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:24 PM (Q4Dc6)

188 That Feeling When: You regret bidding on an item on Gunbroker and someone finally outbids you with only 15 minutes left in the auction.

I'm sure the Germans have a word for it.
Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at March 30, 2025 08:01 PM

I've gotten in pissing matches on GB where I was about to get a great deal and someone jumps in with 15 seconds to go. Once time when they did that I sat there bumping the price the minimum allowed with 10 seconds left on the clock, resetting the 15 minute timer. I did this until 3AM and finally let them have it.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 08:25 PM (64TDs)

189 Thanks Whig, you've given me alot to think about. I will research your suggestions this week.

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:25 PM (IQ6Gq)

190 I want a long gun for home defense, no hunting, or long range target shooting at this point (apologies Weasel).
Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:13 PM (IQ6Gq)

Grateful, before making a selection, I'd ask: How sensitive are you to:
- Muzzle blast?
- Recoil?
- Concerns about potential overpenetration of your home's walls (interior and exterior)?
- Weapon weight?
- Weapon reliability?
- Cost?

Also, would you need/want accessories (lights, optics, suppressors, etc.) to fit out your firearm? How you answer these questions will do a lot to direct you toward (or away from) a type of firearm. For example, both a Benelli M4 shotgun and HK Mark 23 with a suppressor would work for home defense. Both have their own sets of advantages and disadvantages. But only you can decide what things are "gotta haves" vs. "don't need it."

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:25 PM (AiJK3)

191 179 whig, couldn't have said it better. I have a Remington 870 20 Guage to let Grateful have some fun with
Posted by: Ben Had

I learned to really fire shotguns with a 20 gauge pump action. Have a few more shotguns now but still have the 20 gauge set up for home defense.

One thing that is not really mentioned is that you have to get a buttstock on a shotgun to fit your length of pull in order to reduce felt recoil and improve control. For small statured people, a youth size stock, adjusted in length with something like slip on recoil buttpads, can help. High end ones can have shims to adjust the length of pull. But cheaper or used ones can be adjusted permanently by a gunsmith doing the simple expedient of cutting the stock if too short or adding to the stock if too long.

There are a few adjustable AR style stocks out there but those require restocking the shotgun--some models of shotties are easier to do this than others.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:25 PM (ctrM5)

192 116 ... Whig,
If recoil is the problem, would reduced power cast bullet reloads be a possible solution? If it is the position, not recoil, that's another matter. Keep in mind that all my centerfire rifles are bolt action or lever action except for the Garand so I don't have to worry about enough oomph to recycle the action.

Posted by: JTB at March 30, 2025 08:26 PM (yTvNw)

193 Grateful, the nice thing about TX is that you can wander over to the long range and someone there will have you hitting 300 steel in short order. With many rifles to choose from.
But expect to get hooked.
Posted by: RI Red
---
Can confirm.

Posted by: screaming in digital at March 30, 2025 08:27 PM (Szews)

194 Grateful, the nice thing about TX is that you can wander over to the long range and someone there will have you hitting 300 steel in short order. With many rifles to choose from.
But expect to get hooked.
Posted by: RI Red
*****************
I so look forward to you teaching me in Oct!

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:27 PM (IQ6Gq)

195 whig, couldn't have said it better. I have a Remington 870 20 Guage to let Grateful have some fun with

I have one, as well. Perfect intro into the shotty world.

Posted by: Notorious BFD at March 30, 2025 08:27 PM (mH6SG)

196 I want a long gun for home defense, no hunting, or long range target shooting at this point (apologies Weasel).
Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:13 PM

It is a hassle but get a suppressor for your home gun, if you can. You aren't going to be donning ear pro when you hear a burglar and discharging a weapon in any confined space nekkid with leave your ears ringing for weeks.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 08:28 PM (64TDs)

197 200!

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 08:28 PM (IQ6Gq)

198 TRex nails it again.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:29 PM (WRdlW)

199 I did not get to the range. Again. But I *did* go to the gun store today.

They had sold the Beretta 30X with the threaded barrel.
I will have to go online to get it.

Or, maybe buy the Mossberg shortie-shottie. Or a lever gun.

Of course, then I will have to got to the range and shoot those....

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 08:30 PM (5AO2S)

200 My 20 ga is my go to home defense gun. I have fired it at thieves breaking in.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:30 PM (keLsF)

201 200 200!
Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 08:28 PM (IQ6Gq)

Fine shot, sir!

Posted by: Schnorflepuppy - OT but harmless at March 30, 2025 08:31 PM (v23vE)

202 200 200!
Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 08:28 PM

Not all targets are flesh, paper, or steel.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 08:31 PM (a3Q+t)

203 Got a couple boxes of cheap enough range ammo. Midsouthshooterssopply has MxxTech 9mm on sale w/ free shipping.
Interesting is that both the 115 and 124 grain have the same listed muzzle velocity of 1150 fps. That gives the 'manly' European 124 gr 364 ft-lbs of muzzle energy, while the efffete 115 has 323 ft.lbs.

Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at March 30, 2025 08:31 PM (/lPRQ)

204 195 116 ... Whig,
If recoil is the problem, would reduced power cast bullet reloads be a possible solution? If it is the position, not recoil, that's another matter. Keep in mind that all my centerfire rifles are bolt action or lever action except for the Garand so I don't have to worry about enough oomph to recycle the action.
Posted by: JTB

Right now shouldering to my right arm is an issue. Until I get a diagnosis whether it is my spine or my upper arm that is damaged, I am not taking the time to learn to shoulder and shoot with my left shoulder ( I am handy with a lot of actions with my left and actually shot pool that way despite being nominally right handed).

I am current about recovered from carpal tunnel and elbow (cubital release) surgery on my right in Nov. Had that done on my left (except trigger finger syndrome instead of carpal tunnel) and a transposition surgery of the nerve at the elbow.

So waiting to find out whether it is arthritis attacking the shoulder joint roughening the surface cause the shoulder pain/issues or whether it is nerve pain from the back. Basically diagnosis by subtraction despite multiple trips regarding imaging etc. Specialists disagree

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:31 PM (ctrM5)

205 .300aac in a suppressed 10.5" AR pistol with a red dot and "arm brace" is what we have in the house.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 08:32 PM (64TDs)

206 140 Ah S'puppy....good to see you!
Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:03 PM (IQ6Gq)

Likewise, ma'am!

Posted by: Schnorflepuppy - OT but harmless at March 30, 2025 08:34 PM (v23vE)

207 So what's the first thing you do at the range once you are all set up and the range is hot? What is your routine? Do you just start trying to make small groups of holes and hope things work out or do you have a specific plan?

Well that is a darned good question.

I always try to have a purpose for the day, but it's different almost every time, and sometimes an additional purpose suggests itself.

Yesterday my purpose was "let's compare these two ~4" barrel pistols," but I wound up focusing on this really annoying habit I've been trying to get rid of, where the barrel dips down just before the shot about 10-20% of the time, impairing my groups.

It turned out that after all the things I've tried, what gave the most improvement was a stupid trick: telling myself "you are forbidden to let the shot go below the bullseye. Above is OK." But I also found that, like so many other problems, this one requires yet another adjustment to my grip. In this case, rotating my right hand clockwise, just a bit, so that my trigger pulling motion goes straight back instead of back and down.

I guess I know my plan for the next few range trips.

Posted by: Splunge at March 30, 2025 08:36 PM (ju/6W)

208 I have a Remington 870 20 Gauge to let Grateful have some fun with
Posted by: Ben Had

Remington 870s seem to be like hen's teeth these days. Apparently production was moved and new guns still aren't getting to dealers. Been looking everywhere for a 12 gauge.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 30, 2025 08:36 PM (i41hz)

209 So Duncanthrax, will you be at Corsicana this year?

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:37 PM (IQ6Gq)

210 It is a hassle but get a suppressor for your home gun, if you can. You aren't going to be donning ear pro when you hear a burglar and discharging a weapon in any confined space nekkid with leave your ears ringing for weeks.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at March 30, 2025 08:28 PM (64TDs)

That's a big plus for most pistol caliber carbines. In general, they're really good when combined with subsonic ammo and a quality suppressor at reducing muzzle flash and blast to somewhat acceptable levels.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:38 PM (AiJK3)

211 Posted by: Splunge at March 30, 2025 08:36 PM (ju/6W)
-----
Excellent!

Posted by: Weasel at March 30, 2025 08:38 PM (VuvGL)

212 I think in some ways, rifles are easier than handguns. You are seated or stationary. Gun is propped and seated into your shoulder for stability so less worry about recoil(unless it is Blaster's shotgun)The sight magnifies the target and is precise. In a way almost feels like cheating. I have mostly shot 100 and 200 yards so wind etc is not as critical. Hit 300 once. Only once. Sad that the only opportunity to do this is pretty much in Texas. Wish there was more opportunity to shoot outdoors. Looked into it early on with jesse and the clubs in MD were really expensive and not well staffed.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 08:38 PM (t/2Uw)

213 Grateful,
Go to a range where you can rent out a few different long guns and shoot them. Shottys are prolly best for home defense. I have a couple. They make me smile when I shoot them.

Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 08:40 PM (mT+6a)

214 That's a big plus for most pistol caliber carbines. In general, they're really good when combined with subsonic ammo and a quality suppressor at reducing muzzle flash and blast to somewhat acceptable levels.
Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:38 PM (AiJK3)

Ed, I’m thinking of one for my S&W FPC shooting 147 g 9 mm. Any makes you really like?

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:40 PM (WRdlW)

215 Grateful,

Once again agree with whig about getting a shorter gun, but adding a pad (as needed) to get to the right length of pull.

Plus, the pad makes it much more enjoyable when you fire off a few in a row at the range or shooting skeet.

Here is a link to Brownells to show a generic slip-on pad.

https://tinyurl.com/5d6pzbfp

If you buy a common brand shotgun, you can usually get a pad that will have holes to fit the existing screws in the butt plate.

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:41 PM (Q4Dc6)

216 208 .300aac in a suppressed 10.5" AR pistol with a red dot and "arm brace" is what we have in the house.
Posted by: Grump928(C)
=====
I rate the 300 Blackout as a worthy short barrel replacement for the M1 Carbine with a bit more pep. Plus ammo is easier to get. Never did a Blackout build though despite being tempted. I have several different ARs builds around but none of them can chamber a 223 round and fire it and my 223/5.56 rifles cannot chamber the 6.8 Spc or 6.5 Grendel or even the 7.62 Russian builds.

I always avoided having rifles that can chamber a cartridge accidentally that might blow it up. At my peak, I reloaded for about 12-15 or so different rifle cartridges and 4 different handgun cartridges so for me it was a real fear.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:41 PM (ctrM5)

217 Weasel!
8:38? I hope you whipped those spreadsheets!

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:41 PM (WRdlW)

218 215/
Sharon, there are outdoor ranges in VA. Blaster and SRA found one to shoot her Christmas gift.

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:41 PM (IQ6Gq)

219 215 I think in some ways, rifles are easier than handguns. You are seated or stationary. Gun is propped and seated into your shoulder for stability so less worry about recoil(unless it is Blaster's shotgun)The sight magnifies the target and is precise. In a way almost feels like cheating. I have mostly shot 100 and 200 yards so wind etc is not as critical. Hit 300 once. Only once. Sad that the only opportunity to do this is pretty much in Texas. Wish there was more opportunity to shoot outdoors. Looked into it early on with jesse and the clubs in MD were really expensive and not well staffed.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice)
=======
You are absolutely correct. Long arms are easier to shoot than handguns for most people.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:42 PM (ctrM5)

220 For a while, I put a plastic dummy round in a random place in my magazines. Revealing all the anticipation-movements was 90% of the cure in my case.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at March 30, 2025 08:43 PM (lhenN)

221 OK, back to Weasel's original question

I don't have a drill. But I do have a mental checklist of the four main fundamentals, and the 15+ subsections that I walk thru before I fire. And depending where that went I either continue or stop and walk thru the list again to adjust.
But I'd be interested in any drills.

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:43 PM (IQ6Gq)

222 So Duncanthrax, will you be at Corsicana this year?
Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 08:37 PM

I'm hoping so. It may be Friday, rather than Saturday.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 08:44 PM (a3Q+t)

223 Fudd: Don't spin it! It wasn't meant for that!

Me: I'm sorry old man, but I have seen The Quick and the Dead 194 times, and the first thing I am going to do is spin this wheel like the price is right.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at March 30, 2025 08:45 PM (lhenN)

224 M2 guy said M2 was longest running firearm in US military, um, I think that prize goes to the 1911?

Posted by: Eromero at March 30, 2025 08:45 PM (p4vtc)

225 Surely something very old like the Martini rifle has been in service longer.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at March 30, 2025 08:46 PM (lhenN)

226 If you buy a common brand shotgun, you can usually get a pad that will have holes to fit the existing screws in the butt plate.

Posted by: Pillage Idiot

Being slightly above average in LOP, I have put Kick-Eez pads on all of my shotguns. I swear by them. They sell them in sizes to match various stock measurements. They also sell inserts to add more padding. These stretch over the stock, and have never moved around on me in over a hundred bird hunting trips.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 30, 2025 08:47 PM (i41hz)

227 Thomas Paine,

Glad to see you are still in the thread.

If the beaver was eating irreplaceable oak trees, will you easily recognize any NEW chewing?

If not, then you may need to mark the partially chewed ones with some orange marker paint. (It will wear off.) If you do have more than one culprit, I predict you will see new chewing long before you see that actual beaver.

Better to get the next one as early as possible ... and to send a message to the rest of them!

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:47 PM (Q4Dc6)

228 Grateful,
Go to a range where you can rent out a few different long guns and shoot them. Shottys are prolly best for home defense. I have a couple. They make me smile when I shoot them.
Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 08:40 PM (mT+6a)

+1 for Nurse's suggestion. Grateful, I have a Benelli M4 in USMC configuration with a collapsing stock and a (very) old school Winchester Model 12 trench gun if you care to try them. However, only the Mossberg 590A1 today has the bayonet lug to attach an M7 or M9 bayonet like the Model 12's M1917 sword style bayonet.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:48 PM (AiJK3)

229 Remington 870s seem to be like hen's teeth these days. Apparently production was moved and new guns still aren't getting to dealers. Been looking everywhere for a 12 gauge.
Posted by: Thomas Paine

Every now and again, Aim Surplus gets in some former police shotguns that go pretty fast when they get in. Almost all are twelve gauge but some have orange stocks, etc. or even no stocks.

Another online dealer sells police surplus shotties via Gun Broker auctions and has a website store (dunno whether they sell to individuals or not via the website). GT Distributors and they have in person stores in Chattanooga TN and Austin TX I think. Dealt with both for years--good folks.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:49 PM (ctrM5)

230 All this rifle talk is very motivating.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 08:49 PM (t/2Uw)

231 Dinner bell ringing.

Thanks Morons!

Thanks Weasel!

P.S. Youngest daughtering is fostering a chihuahua that was brought in as a stray with heartworms. She has survived her two-month treatment protocol and is a total sweetie!

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:51 PM (Q4Dc6)

232 Can confirm.
Posted by: screaming in digital at March 30, 2025 08:27 PM

*fistbump*

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 08:51 PM (Wnv9h)

233 223 For a while, I put a plastic dummy round in a random place in my magazines. Revealing all the anticipation-movements was 90% of the cure in my case.
Posted by: BourbonChicken

Very useful for that (and actually a good use for lasers attached to firearms). You can visually see the dip. The dummy rounds are also useful for failure drills that are so important for semi automatics even rifles.

Another hack,
Put a dime on top of a revolver and you can practice dry firing without causing the dime to fall off. This is cheap enough to do replicate in revolvers what a dummy round does for semi auto practice.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:52 PM (ctrM5)

234 If not, then you may need to mark the partially chewed ones with some orange marker paint. (It will wear off.) If you do have more than one culprit, I predict you will see new chewing long before you see that actual beaver.

Better to get the next one as early as possible ... and to send a message to the rest of them!

Posted by: Pillage Idiot

I have been taking pictures to document. On that day, I saw evidence of only a cedar sapling having been chewed on since my last outing, since the nearest unprotected oak was about 50 yards from the water.

I took the head for the skull as a souvenir, and left the rest of it as a warning to others.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 30, 2025 08:53 PM (i41hz)

235 Ed, I’m thinking of one for my S&W FPC shooting 147 g 9 mm. Any makes you really like?
Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 08:40 PM (WRdlW)

I have an Octane 9 from SilencerCo for my SP5 that works well w/ that platform. If you're willing to go high end, B&T makes some really good suppressors. That's what the company originally did before it got into making firearms. In general, the larger the internal volume of the suppressor, the more effective it is at quieting down the noise. I don't know how the FPC functions. But if it is gas operated, don't be surprised if throwing a suppressor on pushes gases back into your face while shooting.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:54 PM (AiJK3)

236 231 However, only the Mossberg 590A1 today has the bayonet lug to attach an M7 or M9 bayonet like the Model 12's M1917 sword style bayonet.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:48 PM
***
If we end up in a scenario where bayonets are needed, something has gone terribly wrong. My short arms may not be adequately suited to such combat.

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 08:54 PM (IQ6Gq)

237 Silver eagle Group has a couple dozen rifles available to rent in different calibers. The only Henry they hae is Henry Homesteader in 9mm. If you rent something and don;t like it , you can go back to the counter and get another. Rental only $15.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 08:54 PM (t/2Uw)

238 Oh, I also meant to mention that regarding 870's, you often see better Wingmasters used by police as well as the bog standard 870's. They will, however, have short barrels 18.5 or so or sometimes even no barrel (if the PD used short barrel shotties that would be NFA items in civilian hands).

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:54 PM (ctrM5)

239 If we end up in a scenario where bayonets are needed, something has gone terribly wrong. My short arms may not be adequately suited to such combat.
Posted by: TRex
===========
You have to train for bayonet use and it ain't for the squeamish. Their mounts and the bayonet itself is one place where you damn sure want mil spec or military surplus items. Lot of reproduction parts like bayonet mounts or brand new bayonets simply will not hold up to bayonet practice, let alone serious use.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 08:57 PM (ctrM5)

240 Yes, I want a long barrel Wingmaster, not a shorty, and wood not plastic. My shotguns are either hunting or clays guns.

Posted by: Thomas Paine at March 30, 2025 08:57 PM (i41hz)

241 If we end up in a scenario where bayonets are needed, something has gone terribly wrong. My short arms may not be adequately suited to such combat.
Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 08:54 PM (IQ6Gq)

Bayonets aren't useful for much, but they would discourage the other guy from trying to grab the muzzle end of your weapon in close quarters.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:57 PM (AiJK3)

242 98 75 PI, you’re in TX and you have “a” gun in your truck?
I am disappoint.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 07:36 PM

Speaking of gun trucks, GIs are an innovative bunch when their ass is on the line.

Gun Truck : https://tinyurl.com/ycxxssy7

Posted by: javems at March 30, 2025 08:58 PM (8I4hW)

243 For all of the shooters here, have you.ever fired a weapon at another person?

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:58 PM (keLsF)

244 Hmmm. That Henry Homesteader uses Glock 10 rd mags of which I have a few.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 08:58 PM (t/2Uw)

245 OK, Highway Patrol....
The lieutenant fires HOW MANY rounds from his snubby in the shot out?! Against a 1911, he should have been outshot in short order - 5 vs 8 rounds.

Then he makes the other cop deal with the dead guy while he gets the girl. Metoo? It IS Hollywood, after all.

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 08:59 PM (bCcSe)

246 246 For all of the shooters here, have you.ever fired a weapon at another person?

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:58 PM
***
No. God willing, I prefer never to be in that position.

(Presuming NERF doesn't count as a weapon. Different answer in that case.)

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 09:01 PM (IQ6Gq)

247 OK passed the # of comments on the food thread.

Next launch tomorrow in about 18 hours.Bad weather in the booster recovery zone.

Posted by: Ciampino - Norwehian fiasco today at March 30, 2025 09:01 PM (sPQoU)

248 Inspired by a recent visit to the range where I watched a guy take his first shot O’-the-day and get the X ring - at 500 yards. I’m loading up a few with some real good bullets to see if I can’t stretch my usable range out that far.
Also have to ladder up to speed before I can even think about shooting that far. My 50 year old powder is a bit soft.

Posted by: Ifotnothing at March 30, 2025 09:02 PM (LTRHw)

249 233 All this rifle talk is very motivating.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice)
----------
Sharon, the 300 Blackout (originally designed for US Spec Ops), is a nice well mannered cartridge without the blast of the 223/5.56, similar to an improved M1 Carbine in lethality at up to 100-150 yards or so. And cheap enough to buy ammo for (as it is used in a lot of places as a hunting cartridge). I have a lot of battle rifles and shot them along with shotguns--the AR has superior ergonomics (along with the easiest/cheaper customization) of any make of rifle today.

Most of its competitors have went to copying the AR lower as a model for a reason. AKs by contrast generally suck more than the SKS it replaced in ergonomics.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:02 PM (ctrM5)

250 Grateful,
Go to a range where you can rent out a few different long guns and shoot them. Shottys are prolly best for home defense. I have a couple. They make me smile when I shoot them.
Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 08:40 PM (mT+6a
This is good advice. But don’t buy until after MoMe X, take notes and pictures of what you like and post here. I virtually guarantee one of us morons can bring it for you to get some range time.

Posted by: Eromero at March 30, 2025 09:03 PM (p4vtc)

251 For all of the shooters here, have you.ever fired a weapon at another person?
Posted by: Ben Had

No. God willing, I prefer never to be in that position.
(Presuming NERF doesn't count as a weapon. Different answer in that case.)
Posted by: TRex

Same.

Plus paintballs. Those sting at close range.

Posted by: mikeski at March 30, 2025 09:04 PM (DgGvY)

252 For all of the shooters here, have you.ever fired a weapon at another person?
Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:58 PM (keLsF)

Yes. A pellet rifle. I won't say any more than that online.

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 09:04 PM (bCcSe)

253 GWB, understood

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 09:06 PM (keLsF)

254 Bayonets aren't useful for much, but they would discourage the other guy from trying to grab the muzzle end of your weapon in close quarters.
Posted by: Ed L

I am not clearing a house and have designed my security plans for that particular issue. House design also helps with that. I am holing up after calling 911 if at night. During the daytime, I have hardened entry points to the extent that it will take them a minute or so to break through a door or window.

I have a few bayonets around simply because they were available when I bought some of my old bolt actions over 15-20 years ago.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:06 PM (ctrM5)

255 254 For all of the shooters here, have you.ever fired a weapon at another person?
Posted by: Ben Had

Yes, with MILES gear for Uncle Sam. My unit was auxiliary to the SPs for base security so we had to do war games ever so often.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:07 PM (ctrM5)

256 @whig, the .300 Blackout is good subsonic, with a suppressor, isn't it? It's one I looked at for a suppressed SBR for home defense.

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 09:08 PM (5AO2S)

257 I don't know how the FPC functions. But if it is gas operated, don't be surprised if throwing a suppressor on pushes gases back into your face while shooting.
Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:54 PM (AiJK3)

Pure blowback, thank goodness.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 09:08 PM (WRdlW)

258 For all of the shooters here, have you.ever fired a weapon at another person?
Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 08:58 PM (keLsF)

Only w/ MILES gear on an M16 (blanks activating a laser), paintballs, and Sim-Munitions (wax/paint rounds). Sim-Munitions will tell you when you get hit; they HURT, even when you're wearing body armor. And with any luck, that's all it will ever be.

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 09:08 PM (AiJK3)

259 Still haven't shot my .308

It's going to turn into a cat lady if I don't get my ass in gear.

Posted by: jsg at March 30, 2025 09:09 PM (Bp6/d)

260 I need to rephrase that question to mean in a non military situation?

Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 09:10 PM (keLsF)

261 Oh, if we're counting MILES gear then yes. Aside from Air Base Ground Defense training, I got to play OpFor at McGuire AFB a bunch of years ago.

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 09:11 PM (5AO2S)

262 Gotta run. Thanks for hosting, Weasel!

Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 09:12 PM (AiJK3)

263 243 Yes, I want a long barrel Wingmaster, not a shorty, and wood not plastic. My shotguns are either hunting or clays guns.
Posted by: Thomas Paine
=========
Easy enough to change barrels and stocks for the 870 as they are around plus the pump mechanism will already be broken in for you.

But if you want a new one, my guess is a pretty good wait--I am not sure the rump Remington owners are going to make a go of that company before selling it to one of its competitors. Sad situation really all due to friggin hedge fund ownership.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:12 PM (ctrM5)

264 Elon just handed a million dollar check to someone in the crowd at his event in WI.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 09:12 PM (t/2Uw)

265 Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 08:51 PM (Q4Dc6)
----
Adopt! Adopt! Adopt!

Posted by: Weasel at March 30, 2025 09:13 PM (WfZMN)

266 Thanks for the Gun Thread Weasel! Hi Nurse, Hi Ben Had, i Jim, Hope you are reading.

Posted by: DCCooper at March 30, 2025 09:13 PM (y1Mvi)

267 263 I need to rephrase that question to mean in a non military situation?
Posted by: Ben Had at March 30, 2025 09:10 PM (keLsF

Negative.

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 09:13 PM (WRdlW)

268 Ok all y'all, 9:14 thank you time.

Thank you!

Sorry I wasn't around much tonight. Hope to see you all here next Sunday!

Posted by: Weasel at March 30, 2025 09:14 PM (WfZMN)

269 259 @whig, the .300 Blackout is good subsonic, with a suppressor, isn't it? It's one I looked at for a suppressed SBR for home defense.
Posted by: GWB
------------
Damned good and effective. It was designed for it and the right ammo is available for it which is not always the case. One of the most effective shorter distance anti personnel or hunting deer sized game that is out there right now.

A M1 Carbine comes close but spendy plus self defense ammo aka soft points have spotty availability.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:15 PM (ctrM5)

270 Happy trails Ed L. Thanks for plenty to think about.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:15 PM (ctrM5)

271 ' Night Weasel.
My favorite thread of the week.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at March 30, 2025 09:16 PM (t/2Uw)

272 263 I need to rephrase that question to mean in a non military situation?
Posted by: Ben Had
------
My self defense was I came very close to shooting a pit bull that was attacking my dog when walking her. Drove it off without shooting it. It was a drug dealer's who borrowed it whenever he had a fresh shipment come in to sell. When the pit was present, the guy was dealing.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:17 PM (ctrM5)

273 Thanks, Weasel!

Posted by: RI Red at March 30, 2025 09:17 PM (WRdlW)

274 DBCooper!

Howdy! How’s the desert?

Posted by: nurse ratched at March 30, 2025 09:18 PM (mT+6a)

275 Hot and cool. Been in NC flying fires, Just got back.

Posted by: DCCooper at March 30, 2025 09:19 PM (y1Mvi)

276 OT, slightly: is Maguire AFB still around? I've been there a couple of times for deployments overseas. Haven't thought about that base in years

Posted by: Puddleglum, drive by pew pew at March 30, 2025 09:20 PM (sAmhv)

277 Just went to the range today. Put a couple hundred reloads through my repaired LCP Max and 50 Ranger-Ts. Quite a difference between my reloads that were farting around at 750 fps or so and the Ranger-Ts that were closer to 900. Glad I didn’t bring too many of those, not fun to shoot out of such a little gun. Also put 75 gentle reloads through my CMP 1911 so no chance of damaging it.

Today was the first time I’ve tried shooting a Texas star. While it was fun, I was also awful at it.

Posted by: Arch Stanton at March 30, 2025 09:20 PM (0Hizz)

278 However, only the Mossberg 590A1 today has the bayonet lug to attach an M7 or M9 bayonet like the Model 12's M1917 sword style bayonet.
Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:48 PM

This is, of course, one of the many reasons to get a Mossy 590A1. The heavyweight barrel is another. The top mounted safety is yet another.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 09:21 PM (a3Q+t)

279 279 OT, slightly: is Maguire AFB still around? I've been there a couple of times for deployments overseas. Haven't thought about that base in years
Posted by: Puddleglum
-----
AFAIK.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:22 PM (ctrM5)

280 Weasel

Thanks for letting us camp out here this weekend.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:26 PM (ctrM5)

281 Hot and cool. Been in NC flying fires, Just got back.
Posted by: DCCooper
-------

Pretty smokey here yesterday. Helicopters toting buckets an occasional sight.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at March 30, 2025 09:29 PM (XeU6L)

282 Goodnight folks.

Posted by: whig at March 30, 2025 09:29 PM (ctrM5)

283 Mike Hammer.
I think everyone was weathered out today, We were flying out of Chattanoga but were flying fires on the border area of SC/NC

Posted by: DBCooper at March 30, 2025 09:32 PM (y1Mvi)

284 Thanks all, much to ponder and research. See you next week!

Posted by: Grateful - the range bag lady at March 30, 2025 09:33 PM (IQ6Gq)

285 is Maguire AFB still around?
Posted by: Puddleglum, drive by pew pew at March 30, 2025 09:20 PM (sAmhv)

It's a "joint base" with Fort Dix now. Of course it was always more "joint" tham many, as they shared some real estate.

Posted by: GWB at March 30, 2025 09:36 PM (MnPen)

286 Bayonets aren't useful for much, but they would discourage the other guy from trying to grab the muzzle end of your weapon in close quarters.
Posted by: Ed L

Individully. Not much.
But en masse better than CS for Crowd control.

Because when you mount bayonets your use them.

Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at March 30, 2025 09:36 PM (/lPRQ)

287 Because when you mount bayonets your use them.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
-----

Ah...the spirit of the bayonet.

Not taught by the Army anymore.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at March 30, 2025 09:39 PM (XeU6L)

288 Punching out. Thanks for another great Gun Thread, Weasel.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 30, 2025 09:47 PM (Wnv9h)

289 Good night Horde. Thank you Weasel!

Posted by: TRex at March 30, 2025 09:54 PM (IQ6Gq)

290 Watch a ewetube short and the thread dies.
---
Ah...the spirit of the bayonet.
Not taught by the Army anymore.
Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc.
===
Was told, ten? Fifteen years ago that they do not teach bayonet at all anymore, much less the spirit.

Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at March 30, 2025 09:54 PM (/lPRQ)

291 281 However, only the Mossberg 590A1 today has the bayonet lug to attach an M7 or M9 bayonet like the Model 12's M1917 sword style bayonet.
Posted by: Ed L at March 30, 2025 08:48 PM

This is, of course, one of the many reasons to get a Mossy 590A1. The heavyweight barrel is another. The top mounted safety is yet another.
Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 30, 2025 09:21 PM (a3Q+t)
Their is iron in the words of EdL and Duncanthrax for all men to see.
- Ten Bears

Posted by: Eromero at March 30, 2025 09:59 PM (p4vtc)

292 Sorry Weasel. I think you may have to do some clean-up on Aisle #295?

Posted by: Pillage Idiot at March 30, 2025 10:39 PM (Q4Dc6)

293 81 the pintle mount is a dead giveaway.

Posted by: Richard McEnroe at March 31, 2025 12:53 PM (M6cAG)

294 96 MICHIGAN?!

Posted by: Richard McEnroe at March 31, 2025 01:33 PM (M6cAG)

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