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Gun Thread: More Re-Runs Edition!
Is Your S#!t Lubed?
We've recently been talking about gun maintenance, so let's see if I can get some more mileage from these November 19, 2019 and September 23, 2018 editions of the Gun Thread.
Digging waaay back into the Gun Thread Archives, we find this fabulous article on cleaning. Remember, don't comment in old threads lest you get yo'self banned. Anyhoo, my attitude on cleaning and so forth hasn't changed since I wrote that, but there are a few things you may want to think about before shooting a weapon that's been unused for some time. I like to run a wet patch through the barrel to make sure everything is still groovy, and if so, then a dry patch and call it good. I also oil or grease the action, depending on the weapon. Generally speaking, if it turns I oil it and if it slides I grease it. Finally, I do a brief function check and for rifles I like to check the zero of the sights or optics before doing any shooting that really counts. If it was cleaned before it was put away, it should only require a cursory inspection and lubrication before it's ready to shoot again. Do any of you live or shoot in winter climates where you need to consider air temperature in your lubrication choices? Do you make different choices in summer and winter? What is your process? Rifle Barrel Break-In
A question I get asked a lot has to do with breaking-in new barrels and what steps in particular I take to accomplish this vital and critically important procedure, and the answer is, not much. Yep, that's right. Not much at all. Oh, I know this will likely spark outrage and perhaps even violent public demonstrations, but I have never bought in to all the break-in hype and my suspicions have been confirmed by real live knowledgeable barrel manufacturers. I shoot an overbore caliber and realistically speaking get something around 800 rounds from a new barrel before its match accuracy is degraded, so I cannot afford a lengthy break-in process. Having said that, even with barrels that will last many thousands of rounds I don't do a whole lot; shoot 2 or 3 rounds then a brush & patch out, 3 or 4 more rounds, quick brush & patches, a few more rounds with a brush, patches and some bore paste and that's it. Done. All I'm trying to do is initially foul the barrel and smooth any leftover machining marks from the chambering and rifling processes. But, but, but....! I read on the internet a lengthy and meticulous process must be followed that takes hours and hours and hundreds of rounds and cleaning at the molecular level and if you don't do it your barrel will be ruint! Weasel is full of shit!! Well, maybe so, but that's what I do, and my rifles all shoot just fine and do not suffer from excessive copper fouling, which is what a super-specific break-in process is supposed to prevent. I have also been told by barrel manufacturers to just shoot the damn things and not to overthink it. I suspect most of the elaborate procedures you read on many manufacturer's websites are there simply because the shooting world expects there to be some complicated and lengthy process required, and by golly there better be one or it's not a classy barrel maker! Are you going to really hurt a barrel by cleaning and brushing and flossing it for days? Probably not, but is it really necessary? I don't think that it is. At worst you'll probably over clean the steel each time which will just start the copper fouling and break-in process all over again. In the end, do whatever makes you happy and helps you sleep at night! Disagree and want to fight about it? Please email CBD at the Food Thread.
AR-15 Cleaning Since we're talking about gun cleaning, let's see how our pal hickok45 cleans the AR-15.
Gun Range Etiquette
Tritium Sights
How do they work?
The M1 Garand in Battle!
Dealing with Pesky Nuclear Fallout
Musical Interlude
When I hear this I know it's Christmas. And tell me the drummer isn't a cool cat!
Gun Basics 101
New video from the She Equips Herself gal! This week's video is a Q & A with the SEH gal.
I have reviewed a few cigars from Foundation, a company started by Nick Mellilo almost 10 years ago (all in the Charter Oak line). This time, the cigar that started it all for Foundation, 'El Gueguense', or 'the wise man'. It's a nice looking stick with flawless outer construction and a nice medium brown color with a hint of red. I burned the corona gorda vitola, 5.6 X 46. This cigar is a Nicaraguan puro, with a Corojo '99 wrapper and binder, and more Corojo '99 plus Criollo '98 inside. The draw was a nice medium, but the burn line did wander quite a bit, requiring several touch-ups. As to flavor notes, what I typically call "sweet wood" - and what most reviews call "cedar" - predominated. A flavorful cigar showcasing what I think are the classic Nicaraguan corojo and criollo notes. Smoke volume was adequate. Strength - medium/full. El Gueguense can be found online for around $9 and up.Excellent, rhomboid! Thank you!
Cigarpage.com
Famous-smoke.com
Cigarsdaily.com
Neptunecigar.com
Smallbatchcigar.com
Bobalu Cigar Company
Cigarbid.com A note about sources. The brick & mortar/online divide exists with cigars, as with guns, and most consumer products, with respect to price. As with guns - since both are "persecuted industries", basically - I make a conscious effort to source at least some of my cigars from my local store(s). It's a small thing, but the brick & mortar segment for both guns and tobacco are precious, and worth supporting where you can. And if you're lucky enough to have a good cigar store/lounge available, they're often a good social event with many dangerous people of the sort who own scary gunz, or read smart military blogs like this one. -rhomboid Anyone have others to include? Perhaps a small local roller who makes a cigar you like? Send me your recommendation and a link to the site! Ammo Link-O-Rama
I'm really very seriously not kidding around anymore. Buy Ammo
AmmoSeek - online ammo search tool
GunBot - online ammo search tool
SG Ammo
Palmetto State Armory
Georgia Arms
AmmoMan
Target Sports USA
Bud's Gun Shop
American Elite Ammo NEW!
During the early days of aerial combat, it wasn't uncommon for pilots to exchange small arms fire with enemy combatants. One problem encountered with this was that the expended brass casings could/would become jammed in cockpit controls. One of several solutions designed for Air Service pilots was the 1911 brass cage and extended magazines to reduce reloading times at those critical moments. Source: Wacky Weapons / Quora
Comments
(Jump to bottom of comments)1
Gun Thread!
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at December 10, 2023 07:00 PM (eh/tP)
2
Gub Thread, Yay!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar (hOUT3) ~ Next year in Corsicana - again! ~ at December 10, 2023 07:00 PM (hOUT3)
3
I'll go fetch the foodies...
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at December 10, 2023 07:00 PM (eh/tP)
4
Great thread as usual!
Posted by: Rancherbob at December 10, 2023 07:01 PM (21WHr)
5
Well done AZ!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar (hOUT3) ~ Next year in Corsicana - again! ~ at December 10, 2023 07:01 PM (hOUT3)
6
Good evening everyone
Posted by: Skip at December 10, 2023 07:01 PM (fwDg9)
7
Not first!!! Reading content
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:01 PM (fe7in)
8
hiya
Posted by: JT at December 10, 2023 07:01 PM (T4tVD)
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at December 10, 2023 07:01 PM (eh/tP)
10
Good evening horde. In the midst of a thorough soaking from the skies here...
Posted by: TRex at December 10, 2023 07:03 PM (IQ6Gq)
11
Hello, Weasel!
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 07:03 PM (yRXSd)
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:04 PM (HCxzI)
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing(tT6L1) at December 10, 2023 07:04 PM (tT6L1)
14
Breaking in new barrels...Just shoot the damn things and not over think it.
Absolutely correct Sir!
Absolutely correct Sir!
Posted by: Hairyback Guy at December 10, 2023 07:05 PM (R/m4+)
15
It was the 4 extra characters!
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron
I felt lucky, but that was obviously an ill-founded feeling!
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron
I felt lucky, but that was obviously an ill-founded feeling!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar (hOUT3) ~ Next year in Corsicana - again! ~ at December 10, 2023 07:06 PM (hOUT3)
16
Good evening gubthreaders and all the ships at sea.
And speaking of ships at sea, the Army Team delivered a drubbing to the squids yesterday in Foxborough, MA.
And speaking of ships at sea, the Army Team delivered a drubbing to the squids yesterday in Foxborough, MA.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:06 PM (IFNME)
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:06 PM (aQy7p)
18
And speaking of ships at sea, the Army Team delivered a drubbing to the squids yesterday in Foxborough, MA.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:06 PM
Why, yes. Yes, they did.
*Hudson High fistbump*
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:06 PM
Why, yes. Yes, they did.
*Hudson High fistbump*
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:07 PM (aQy7p)
19
Last Sunday I bemoaned my dearth of 45 acp.
So I ordered some and they arrived on Wednesday! I now have a plethora of 45 acp!
So I ordered some and they arrived on Wednesday! I now have a plethora of 45 acp!
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:07 PM (IFNME)
20
Why, yes. Yes, they did.
*Hudson High fistbump*
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:07 PM (aQy7p)
Didja go? Your neck of the woods.
*Hudson High fistbump*
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:07 PM (aQy7p)
Didja go? Your neck of the woods.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:08 PM (IFNME)
Posted by: Godzilla at December 10, 2023 07:09 PM (vFG9F)
22
Didja go? Your neck of the woods.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:08 PM
Sadly, no. Tix sold out way early. Watched from Ft. Living Room with better booze and food.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:08 PM
Sadly, no. Tix sold out way early. Watched from Ft. Living Room with better booze and food.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:09 PM (aQy7p)
23
Dearth. Plethora.
What has become of our lowbrow Gub thread?
What has become of our lowbrow Gub thread?
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:10 PM (HCxzI)
24
So I ordered some and they arrived on Wednesday! I now have a plethora of 45 acp!
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:07 PM
Si, Senor blaster, a plethora!
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:07 PM
Si, Senor blaster, a plethora!
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:10 PM (aQy7p)
25
Earlier this week, I went to a classroom to help out a professor with end-of-course evaluations. Imagine my surprise when I walk into the classroom and see antique firearms scattered on and around the desk at the front of the room.
He's a history professor wrapping up his course on the Revolutionary War, so he brought in several replica pistols from that era. He also had a pair of authentic long guns. It was very cool.
Naturally, they were all rendered non-functional and he'd been granted permission from the university police chief to carry them into the classroom.
He's a history professor wrapping up his course on the Revolutionary War, so he brought in several replica pistols from that era. He also had a pair of authentic long guns. It was very cool.
Naturally, they were all rendered non-functional and he'd been granted permission from the university police chief to carry them into the classroom.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at December 10, 2023 07:11 PM (BpYfr)
26
Weasel, great musical interlude choice. My favorite Peanuts song. Would love to be able to play this on the piano. And yes, the drummer is a cool cat, great brushwork by him. IIRC he is the drummer from the Vince Guaraldi Trio who wrote the song.
As to cleaning.....I have not even uncased my rifle and pistol from the Pelican case since I closed the lid back on a Saturday afternoon in Corsicana, Texas. Should I be worried?
Maybe in the next couple of weekends I will do that and clean the toys.
As to cleaning.....I have not even uncased my rifle and pistol from the Pelican case since I closed the lid back on a Saturday afternoon in Corsicana, Texas. Should I be worried?
Maybe in the next couple of weekends I will do that and clean the toys.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:13 PM (fe7in)
27
I hear that the tobacco industry in the Canary Islands is moribund, but when I started smoking cigars, lo, these 45 years ago, one of the best best brands outside of Cuba and Honduras was, in my opinion, the Flamenco Las Palmas. The cigars had an exceptionally rich flavor.
I quit smoking cigars years ago, when cigar-smoking became a "thing", and the prices went through the roof, but I still remember the aroma and the taste of those Flamencos.
I quit smoking cigars years ago, when cigar-smoking became a "thing", and the prices went through the roof, but I still remember the aroma and the taste of those Flamencos.
Posted by: Paco at December 10, 2023 07:14 PM (njExo)
28
Dearth Plethora.
That’s either a pr0n or a pr0n name.
That’s either a pr0n or a pr0n name.
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:14 PM (HCxzI)
29
Buds Guns have Tisa M1911 Tanker 45's for under $400. A very good deal.
Posted by: Diogenes at December 10, 2023 07:14 PM (W/lyH)
30
Times a million on the barrel break-in! I clean all new rifle barrels before shooting for obvious reasons. But as far as the: fire two shots clean, then two more clean…I never do it.
Posted by: Nevada Dave at December 10, 2023 07:14 PM (JNp5p)
31
Many thanks as always, Weasel
Posted by: 496 at December 10, 2023 07:16 PM (Hhq/o)
32
23 Dearth. Plethora.
What has become of our lowbrow Gub thread?
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:10 PM
We has been invaded by members of the book thread. Next thing you know we will be shooting with our pinkies extended!!
What has become of our lowbrow Gub thread?
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:10 PM
We has been invaded by members of the book thread. Next thing you know we will be shooting with our pinkies extended!!
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:16 PM (fe7in)
33
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:13 PM (fe7in)
If you used corrosive ammo (or black powder), I'd say yes. If not, I think it'll require more elbow grease, but otherwise you should be OK.
If you used corrosive ammo (or black powder), I'd say yes. If not, I think it'll require more elbow grease, but otherwise you should be OK.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 07:16 PM (yRXSd)
34
Another enjoyable thread. Thank you Weasel.
Posted by: Diogenes at December 10, 2023 07:17 PM (W/lyH)
35
Actually went to a range yesterday. It was, and was not, fun. I'll conjure up a post about it in a bit.
Posted by: javems at December 10, 2023 07:17 PM (8I4hW)
36
Ever notice the sh*t-eating grin on SEH’s hubby?
I wonder why that is.
I wonder why that is.
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:17 PM (HCxzI)
37
True to get my 1866 carbine functioning again- the lifter and lever springs had broken the tips off. Gunsmith TIG welded them back together and partially modded the carrier for a short stroke kit. Cartridges are still popping out the back of the carrier and into the mechanism. Gotta talk to a different gunsmith about it. The first guy did a fantastic job on a couple of my side by sides though
Have a great week folks!
Have a great week folks!
Posted by: Coelacanth at December 10, 2023 07:19 PM (0A/JS)
38
36 Ever notice the sh*t-eating grin on SEH’s hubby?
I wonder why that is.
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:17 PM (HCxzI)
I hope its not because he is eating sh*t.
I wonder why that is.
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:17 PM (HCxzI)
I hope its not because he is eating sh*t.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:19 PM (IFNME)
39
>>> During the early days of aerial combat, it wasn't uncommon for pilots to exchange small arms fire with enemy combatants.
Must have been VERY early days.
When they first got these 'aeroplanes' they didn't know what to do with them. Some were Signal Corps for use as a mechanical homing pigeon. Pope AFB was originally named for an Amry Signal Corps officer who died in a crash near the base. Guess they would exchange pot shots with enemy troops on the ground. For S&G they'd drop small mortor shells or hand grenades on them...
Eventially we ended up with specialized cargo, fighter, and bomber planes.
Must have been VERY early days.
When they first got these 'aeroplanes' they didn't know what to do with them. Some were Signal Corps for use as a mechanical homing pigeon. Pope AFB was originally named for an Amry Signal Corps officer who died in a crash near the base. Guess they would exchange pot shots with enemy troops on the ground. For S&G they'd drop small mortor shells or hand grenades on them...
Eventially we ended up with specialized cargo, fighter, and bomber planes.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 07:19 PM (cOq4q)
40
Howdy all y'all! Just a quick howdy and break for a piece of pizza.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:20 PM (JwHpX)
41
Due to security concerns and the fact that I live with 2 females who are gullible enough to open the front door to any jackass with a lanyard and a clipboard, I now carry indoors, inside my own house. There have been 3 home invasions within 5 miles of me. It's going well. I bought a sticky holster. The 2 females haven't noticed a thing. I've admonished the 2 females accordingly but they've both got memory issues. I also put in motion sensor security cams which give me a buzzer alert on my phone if anyone approaches my front door. What a pain in the a**. I'm very happy with the sticky, tho'.
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 07:21 PM (MeG8a)
42
Dearth Plethora.
That’s either a pr0n or a pr0n name.
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:14 PM
I laughed way too hard at that.
That’s either a pr0n or a pr0n name.
Posted by: RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:14 PM
I laughed way too hard at that.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:21 PM (aQy7p)
43
33 Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 07:16 PM
I have been keeping with using good ammo. Federal for the rifle and Sig Sauer, Fiocchi and occasionaly Blazer for the handgun.
So I guess I will be good. But a nice cleaning and lubing can't hurt.
Would really like to take apart the bolt on the rifle for a cleaning. Maybe even invest in an ultrasonic cleaner.
And I would LOVE to take apart the Sig and clean everything. But I know my limits.
I have been keeping with using good ammo. Federal for the rifle and Sig Sauer, Fiocchi and occasionaly Blazer for the handgun.
So I guess I will be good. But a nice cleaning and lubing can't hurt.
Would really like to take apart the bolt on the rifle for a cleaning. Maybe even invest in an ultrasonic cleaner.
And I would LOVE to take apart the Sig and clean everything. But I know my limits.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:22 PM (fe7in)
44
Range report:
Went to our usual indoor range, me, Mark Andrew Edwards, LazyMessenger and my #1 son!
I shared a lane with my son and he was shooting his M&P Shield in .40. He's really improved a lot. I loaded snap caps alternating with live loads and handed him the mixed mags. He really got to see and feel the flinch. And he improved so much with that easy drill! MAE was so very helpful with addition pointers for him. Because sometimes your mom isn't the easiest teacher to learn from.
I shot 50 rounds with my EMP Ronin. It's such a great pistol for me.
We finished with some fun little plinking with the Ruger Mark IV.
Great day at the range.
Went to our usual indoor range, me, Mark Andrew Edwards, LazyMessenger and my #1 son!
I shared a lane with my son and he was shooting his M&P Shield in .40. He's really improved a lot. I loaded snap caps alternating with live loads and handed him the mixed mags. He really got to see and feel the flinch. And he improved so much with that easy drill! MAE was so very helpful with addition pointers for him. Because sometimes your mom isn't the easiest teacher to learn from.
I shot 50 rounds with my EMP Ronin. It's such a great pistol for me.
We finished with some fun little plinking with the Ruger Mark IV.
Great day at the range.
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 07:22 PM (GMlj0)
45
EvtFS is great. Ray Harryhausen for the win.
Posted by: BeckoningChasm at December 10, 2023 07:22 PM (CHHv1)
46
As to cleaning.....I have not even uncased my rifle and pistol from the Pelican case since I closed the lid back on a Saturday afternoon in Corsicana, Texas. Should I be worried?
Maybe in the next couple of weekends I will do that and clean the toys.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:13 PM
Ditto. Still haven't cleaned the pistols, but I've been shooting them.
Should have new optics for the rifle tomorrow.
Maybe in the next couple of weekends I will do that and clean the toys.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:13 PM
Ditto. Still haven't cleaned the pistols, but I've been shooting them.
Should have new optics for the rifle tomorrow.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:23 PM (aQy7p)
47
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 07:19 PM (cOq4q)
The era of handguns as the primary armament of combat aircraft was confined only to the opening months of WWI in 1914. By early 1915, both sides had figured out how to mount machineguns on their planes to create the first true air to air fighters.
The era of handguns as the primary armament of combat aircraft was confined only to the opening months of WWI in 1914. By early 1915, both sides had figured out how to mount machineguns on their planes to create the first true air to air fighters.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 07:25 PM (yRXSd)
48
Cleaned our 1911s last week during the thread, but pretty much everything laying at the bottom of the creek needs to lubed. Except the EP-9s. The manufacturer recommends never lubing them.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:25 PM (IFNME)
49
AR-15 Cleaning.
Had a high-speed low-drag guy in the Army take scotch bright pads to his M-16 barrel until it SHINED. As with most thing military his perseverance and drive outshined his stupid so while everyone laughed about high rating in the stupid category, higher-ups respected his dedication. Fastest career track promotion ever.
That's soldire is now know as GEN Milley.*
*I may have made up that last part.
Had a high-speed low-drag guy in the Army take scotch bright pads to his M-16 barrel until it SHINED. As with most thing military his perseverance and drive outshined his stupid so while everyone laughed about high rating in the stupid category, higher-ups respected his dedication. Fastest career track promotion ever.
That's soldire is now know as GEN Milley.*
*I may have made up that last part.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 07:25 PM (cOq4q)
50
46 Should have new optics for the rifle tomorrow.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:23 PM
Annnnnnd what did you get? Or do you want to wait until mounted and zeroed?
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:23 PM
Annnnnnd what did you get? Or do you want to wait until mounted and zeroed?
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:26 PM (fe7in)
51
We've now got a range marshal at our firing range, and he decided that approximately 2/3 of the covered gun bays can't be used for high velocity ammo. This particular section is for shooting at 25 yards, and is used for handguns and rifles, but the space now available for high-velocity ammo now amounts to only four or five firing positions at the far end. He claims that the berm - which has been there for thirty years - might collapse if people keep shooting high-powered bullets into it. Is there any science behind this? The berm, as far as I know, has never been cleaned out or "mined" for old projectiles.
Posted by: Paco at December 10, 2023 07:26 PM (njExo)
52
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 07:21 PM (MeG8a
What area do you live where that environment unfortunately exists?
What area do you live where that environment unfortunately exists?
Posted by: Drive By at December 10, 2023 07:27 PM (MNhXM)
53
Naturally, they were all rendered non-functional and he'd been granted permission from the university police chief to carry them into the classroom.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at December 10, 2023 07:11 PM (BpYfr)
Back in the late 80s I did a lot of Civil War Living History talks at middle and high schools in the Northern VA area. I would do a first-person presentation with authentic gear and weapons, including Enfield and Springfield rifled muskets. Never asked permission to bring them on campus, and never so much as a raised eyebrow from faculty or administration. Nowadays the SWAT team would probably be called before I got in the schoolhouse door. The times have really changed.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at December 10, 2023 07:11 PM (BpYfr)
Back in the late 80s I did a lot of Civil War Living History talks at middle and high schools in the Northern VA area. I would do a first-person presentation with authentic gear and weapons, including Enfield and Springfield rifled muskets. Never asked permission to bring them on campus, and never so much as a raised eyebrow from faculty or administration. Nowadays the SWAT team would probably be called before I got in the schoolhouse door. The times have really changed.
Posted by: That SOB Van Owen at December 10, 2023 07:27 PM (PWe8a)
54
Range report: Limited round count edition.
I headed to the range to put a few more rounds through the Noreen and also check zero on the Axis II Precision, as I'd changed out the muzzle brake and bipod on the Savage.
The Noreen needed to be zeroed, which didn't take long. After that I moved to the Savage, lined up on the target at 100 yards, pulled the trigger and...missed. Say what?
Yeah, I'd forgotten to zero the elevation turret on my rifle scope and it was still set for targets at 500 meters The scope was only 12MOA, or so, high at 100 yards.
I headed to the range to put a few more rounds through the Noreen and also check zero on the Axis II Precision, as I'd changed out the muzzle brake and bipod on the Savage.
The Noreen needed to be zeroed, which didn't take long. After that I moved to the Savage, lined up on the target at 100 yards, pulled the trigger and...missed. Say what?
Yeah, I'd forgotten to zero the elevation turret on my rifle scope and it was still set for targets at 500 meters The scope was only 12MOA, or so, high at 100 yards.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing(tT6L1) at December 10, 2023 07:27 PM (tT6L1)
55
When I was in Jungle School, we took our M16s into the showers with us when we came back from the jungle, and then would pull the handguards off and put the uppers in a half cut barrel of kerosene.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:28 PM (IFNME)
56
That cage seems cumbersome. Why didn't pilots just carry a pair of revolvers?
Posted by: Godzilla at December 10, 2023 07:28 PM (vFG9F)
57
So here's a question - anyone tried to mount a GI sling on a Magpul ACS-L stock on an AR-15? I liked the standard sling I used on my 10/22 at appleseed, and want to get the right attachments on the AR. I put an MLOK QD stud swivel for the front attachment point, but can't figure out how to get something mounted on the stock for the metal clip on the sling. The hole on the side of the stock is too small for a QD post by itself. Any good way to make use of the slot (looks like a strap could go in there)? My GI sling has one free end, the other (nearest the metal clip) is stiched closed (if that makes sense). Any ideas? I feel like I'm making this too hard. I could go with the type 1 adapter by MAGPUL, then a QD loop snaps in that I think, but looks like it'll stick out the side a bit. Looking for other options.
Posted by: MD_Mike at December 10, 2023 07:30 PM (BouEL)
58
Looking at the S&W FCP to go with my collection of other PCCs . $700 that I really should use to buy a new washer though.
Posted by: Drive By at December 10, 2023 07:30 PM (MNhXM)
59
Weasel, you rock!
Thanks for Linus & Lucy! You're absolutely right, it would not be Christmas without it!
And yeah, cool cat indeed! can do it with his eyes closed!
pro tip: I use Linus&Lucy all year 'round as a Pesky Earworm Remover! (mostly the original Vince Guaraldi version)
(never even imagined there were any others, learn something every day around here!)
Thanks for Linus & Lucy! You're absolutely right, it would not be Christmas without it!
And yeah, cool cat indeed! can do it with his eyes closed!
pro tip: I use Linus&Lucy all year 'round as a Pesky Earworm Remover! (mostly the original Vince Guaraldi version)
(never even imagined there were any others, learn something every day around here!)
Posted by: sock_rat_eez - these lying bastardi e stronzi have been lying for decades at December 10, 2023 07:31 PM (zer5o)
60
Seems like manufacturers and vendors are taking advantage of the intermission in the brace ban and selling braced pistols again.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:31 PM (IFNME)
61
I'm looking for some gun related legal advice. Yeah, I know about the wisdom of asking for legal advice from random strangers on the internet, so let's call it "opinion" instead of "advice".
A while back at a local gun show a guy was selling miniature muzzle loading black powder cannons. By "miniature" I mean the barrel is roughly an inch and a half long, 3/4 inch outside diameter, with maybe a 3/16 inch bore. It shoots an appropriate sized ball bearing, propelled by a pinch of black powder. I bought one, with no paperwork or ID, I don't know if the guy selling them was a licensed dealer or not.
My question is, "Is this thing a firearm or not, legally speaking, and if not, why not?". I bought it planning to give it to a friend for Christmas, but I don't want to run afoul of laws regarding buying a firearm for someone else.
Thoughts? Legal references?
Thanks.
A while back at a local gun show a guy was selling miniature muzzle loading black powder cannons. By "miniature" I mean the barrel is roughly an inch and a half long, 3/4 inch outside diameter, with maybe a 3/16 inch bore. It shoots an appropriate sized ball bearing, propelled by a pinch of black powder. I bought one, with no paperwork or ID, I don't know if the guy selling them was a licensed dealer or not.
My question is, "Is this thing a firearm or not, legally speaking, and if not, why not?". I bought it planning to give it to a friend for Christmas, but I don't want to run afoul of laws regarding buying a firearm for someone else.
Thoughts? Legal references?
Thanks.
Posted by: BillyD at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (F6Xpw)
62
I'm with Weasel on minimal barrel breakin for rifles--for pistols it is pretty much a waste of time instead of shooting them.
Ironically, the cheaper the barrel, the more it might actually benefit from a break in period. Handlapped and air gauged from a premium barrel maker is simply follow their instructions or call them. Barrel Lapping removes almost all the sharp edges on the rifling and usually the barrel lappers at the different companies are pretty much masters at the craft and tbarrel lapping is one of the things that is pretty much non-DIY as it requires a touch developed by a lot of experience.
On older milsurp types, at times, they can benefit from fire lapping depending on the condition of the throat and whether pitting is on the lands instead of the grooves. Uneven or rough throats can often affect accuracy and pitting on the lands will tear up and foul from bullet material. Pitting in the grooves rarely affects accuracy as much as a rough throat and pitting on the barrel lands.
Before firelapping, always be realistic about your accuracy expectations for an old worn bore and whether you have addressed other sources of inaccuracy such as the barrel crown, etc
Ironically, the cheaper the barrel, the more it might actually benefit from a break in period. Handlapped and air gauged from a premium barrel maker is simply follow their instructions or call them. Barrel Lapping removes almost all the sharp edges on the rifling and usually the barrel lappers at the different companies are pretty much masters at the craft and tbarrel lapping is one of the things that is pretty much non-DIY as it requires a touch developed by a lot of experience.
On older milsurp types, at times, they can benefit from fire lapping depending on the condition of the throat and whether pitting is on the lands instead of the grooves. Uneven or rough throats can often affect accuracy and pitting on the lands will tear up and foul from bullet material. Pitting in the grooves rarely affects accuracy as much as a rough throat and pitting on the barrel lands.
Before firelapping, always be realistic about your accuracy expectations for an old worn bore and whether you have addressed other sources of inaccuracy such as the barrel crown, etc
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (JAi95)
63
Annnnnnd what did you get? Or do you want to wait until mounted and zeroed?
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:26 PM
After consulting closely with Weasel San, and acknowledging that I wasn't going to take out a home equity loan, I went with something from the Vortex Viper family. Baby's first good glass, if you will.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:26 PM
After consulting closely with Weasel San, and acknowledging that I wasn't going to take out a home equity loan, I went with something from the Vortex Viper family. Baby's first good glass, if you will.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:34 PM (aQy7p)
64
In other news, when you clean your shotgun barrel make sure you tighten the choke tube before blasting away at Wood ducks. My buddy shot the choke out into the decoys this morning & it took the barrel threads with it. Never liked those things.
Posted by: Bob at December 10, 2023 07:36 PM (YiqZD)
65
Posted by: Paco at December 10, 2023 07:26 PM (njExo)
Two questions: How thick is the berm, and has the berm itself shown signs of structural failure, such as the front slope slumping down due to prolonged bullet impacts? Also, what are you shooting into the berm? If you're firing something like .50 BMG M8 API ammo, this could be a potential problem. 5.56mm NATO M193? Probably not. If the berm slopes above points of impact are sliding down due to repeated impacts, this might be a concern. Otherwise, I doubt it.
Two questions: How thick is the berm, and has the berm itself shown signs of structural failure, such as the front slope slumping down due to prolonged bullet impacts? Also, what are you shooting into the berm? If you're firing something like .50 BMG M8 API ammo, this could be a potential problem. 5.56mm NATO M193? Probably not. If the berm slopes above points of impact are sliding down due to repeated impacts, this might be a concern. Otherwise, I doubt it.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (yRXSd)
66
686 cleaning does a nice job.
Posted by: AZ deplorable moron at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (eh/tP)
67
I'm in the 'burbs but fairly close to a major US city.
We get the occasional cat converter theft and such, but the home invasion stuff is new, because they don't come alone, they are coming in trios and up to 6 or so.
We get the occasional cat converter theft and such, but the home invasion stuff is new, because they don't come alone, they are coming in trios and up to 6 or so.
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (MeG8a)
68
Will shoot next weekend. Promise.
Posted by: Eromero at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (NxC5+)
69
Posted by: BillyD at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (F6Xpw)
Far as I know muzzle loading guns don’t require any federal background check and not considered a firearm under the regulations.
Far as I know muzzle loading guns don’t require any federal background check and not considered a firearm under the regulations.
Posted by: Drive By at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (MNhXM)
70
Disagree and want to fight about it? Please email CBD at the Food Thread.
----
Wait .... does CBD clean his sous vide using pull-throughs and gun oil? Is this a factory recommendation? Doesn't the beef get fowled (sic) with cuprous quantities of metal (sic)?
----
Wait .... does CBD clean his sous vide using pull-throughs and gun oil? Is this a factory recommendation? Doesn't the beef get fowled (sic) with cuprous quantities of metal (sic)?
Posted by: Ciampino - Did you hear a gunshot or did you fart? at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (qfLjt)
71
Coelacanth said at 37 "True to get my 1866 carbine functioning again- the lifter and lever springs had broken the tips off. Gunsmith TIG welded them back together and partially modded the carrier for a short stroke kit. Cartridges are still popping out the back of the carrier and into the mechanism."
======
I would go back to the gunsmith that fixed your gun and demonstrate the problem with dummy rounds. He should fix it for free but might have a nominal cost. Essentially where he welded problem needs a bit of dressing with a file or stone as it might be a tad out of spec. This type of handwork was common with antique firearms because tolerances in the 1860's were pretty broad and labor to hand fit parts was cheap.
That is why often you cannot take parts from a very old firearm and have them work in another without modifying and handfitting the parts which is both tedious and expensive nowadays.
======
I would go back to the gunsmith that fixed your gun and demonstrate the problem with dummy rounds. He should fix it for free but might have a nominal cost. Essentially where he welded problem needs a bit of dressing with a file or stone as it might be a tad out of spec. This type of handwork was common with antique firearms because tolerances in the 1860's were pretty broad and labor to hand fit parts was cheap.
That is why often you cannot take parts from a very old firearm and have them work in another without modifying and handfitting the parts which is both tedious and expensive nowadays.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (JAi95)
72
My question is, "Is this thing a firearm or not, legally speaking, and if not, why not?"
As far as federal law goes, black powder muzzle-loading guns are not "firearms." Your state may have other more restrictive laws.
As far as federal law goes, black powder muzzle-loading guns are not "firearms." Your state may have other more restrictive laws.
Posted by: Oddbob at December 10, 2023 07:38 PM (nfrXX)
73
I like taking the Kid to the range, we have a great time. He's got a little pop gun, though it's got a big recoil. Whether he's standing or kneeling, whenever he lets off a round, he's rolling head over heels backward like a tumbleweed. So he likes taking a prone position, though he'll still slide back 3 feet after each shot. Now, this gets me in trouble with the Wife. She'll rail at me (while the Kid stands there with a stupid happy grin on his face) about how the whole front of him is covered in dirt and the back of him is as clean as can be. But hey, that's fine with me, as it keeps the seats of my truck clean... ;-)
Posted by: May Be True or Not Range Stories at December 10, 2023 07:38 PM (dYW4w)
74
Wow, I almost missed it. Been one of those weeks.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 07:38 PM (HMvgH)
75
I’ve got a lot of Vortex glass, RMBS. No complaints here.
I’m not quite a Night Force budget. Unlike our proprietor.
I’m not quite a Night Force budget. Unlike our proprietor.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:38 PM (HCxzI)
76
63 Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:34 PM
Can't go wrong with Vortex. That is what is on my rifle. It is the second scope I purchased. My first was a Nikon Prostaff 5.
I wound up selling that scope to a COB.
Good luck with it!! Hopefully your rifle will shine up in NH next year.
Can't go wrong with Vortex. That is what is on my rifle. It is the second scope I purchased. My first was a Nikon Prostaff 5.
I wound up selling that scope to a COB.
Good luck with it!! Hopefully your rifle will shine up in NH next year.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:39 PM (fe7in)
77
61 Thoughts? Legal references?
Thanks.
Posted by: BillyD at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM
Best check with your local or State laws. Things like that vary from State to State
Thanks.
Posted by: BillyD at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM
Best check with your local or State laws. Things like that vary from State to State
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:40 PM (fe7in)
78
If anyone is interested, there is a company out there called Precision Armament which sells timing shims for things like muzzle brakes. The idea is: put on the reference shim, hand tighten the muzzle device, estimate the number of degrees of rotation needed to get the brake lined up properly, select appropriate shim based on supplied chart, tighten to 25 ft lbs or so.
After using their product, I've no time for crush washers. Especially because over torquing is a real problem with a crush washer. Though, I may report back the method doesn't work. So far though, seems quite solid.
After using their product, I've no time for crush washers. Especially because over torquing is a real problem with a crush washer. Though, I may report back the method doesn't work. So far though, seems quite solid.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing(tT6L1) at December 10, 2023 07:40 PM (tT6L1)
79
I’m not quite a Night Force budget. Unlike our proprietor.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:38 PM (HCxzI)
--------
NF was nice enough to be a sponsor which helped a lot.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:38 PM (HCxzI)
--------
NF was nice enough to be a sponsor which helped a lot.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:41 PM (JwHpX)
80
That drummer was Vince Granelli, the last surviving member of the Vince Guaraldi Trio ! No wonder he had it down pat!
Posted by: sock_rat_eez - these lying bastardi e stronzi have been lying for decades at December 10, 2023 07:41 PM (zer5o)
81
Had a high-speed low-drag guy in the Army take scotch bright pads to his M-16 barrel until it SHINED.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 07:25 PM (cOq4q)
Had a boot take out his front sight post to clean it day prior to qualification. Couldn't get it back in as it front sight post jammed up. Front post way too high. Didn't say anything. Rifle shot high, Maggie's Drawers all around. Good plan, bad execution.
He got a range rifle and became a Marksman.
No Unq's allowed.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 07:25 PM (cOq4q)
Had a boot take out his front sight post to clean it day prior to qualification. Couldn't get it back in as it front sight post jammed up. Front post way too high. Didn't say anything. Rifle shot high, Maggie's Drawers all around. Good plan, bad execution.
He got a range rifle and became a Marksman.
No Unq's allowed.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy at December 10, 2023 07:42 PM (R/m4+)
82
lest you get yo'self banned
Shouldn't that be "yo'se'f". Or don't you mark it when the 'l' comes out? "Yo'sef"? That looks like you're talkin' 'bout Jesus' daddy, though.
We have to communicate properly if we're gonna continue to 'njoy this fabulous Gun Thread. Right?
(Weasel, I just liked that formulation and it made my brain go goofy. Not really critiquin' 't'all.)
Shouldn't that be "yo'se'f". Or don't you mark it when the 'l' comes out? "Yo'sef"? That looks like you're talkin' 'bout Jesus' daddy, though.
We have to communicate properly if we're gonna continue to 'njoy this fabulous Gun Thread. Right?
(Weasel, I just liked that formulation and it made my brain go goofy. Not really critiquin' 't'all.)
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 07:42 PM (HMvgH)
83
"Posted by: MD_Mike at December 10, 2023 07:30 PM (BouEL)"
KAC End Plate Sling Mount.
Noveske QD end Plate
KAC End Plate Sling Mount.
Noveske QD end Plate
Posted by: Marcus T at December 10, 2023 07:43 PM (/i32d)
84
Can't go wrong with Vortex. That is what is on my rifle. It is the second scope I purchased. My first was a Nikon Prostaff 5.
I wound up selling that scope to a COB.
Good luck with it!! Hopefully your rifle will shine up in NH next year.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:39 PM
My biggest problem in Corsicana was running out of elevation. With a good angled base (thanks again, Weasel for recommendations), NH should be better next year. Now I just have to pester Weasel after the busy season for scope mounting tips. 😄
I wound up selling that scope to a COB.
Good luck with it!! Hopefully your rifle will shine up in NH next year.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:39 PM
My biggest problem in Corsicana was running out of elevation. With a good angled base (thanks again, Weasel for recommendations), NH should be better next year. Now I just have to pester Weasel after the busy season for scope mounting tips. 😄
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:43 PM (aQy7p)
85
One down side to the shim from Precision Armament: It's obvious what they are and they don't match the barrel. But, as of right now, I think it's a better solution than the crush washer.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing(tT6L1) at December 10, 2023 07:43 PM (tT6L1)
86
Now I just have to pester Weasel after the busy season for scope mounting tips. 😄
Posted by: RedMindBlueState
-----------
Jim is also someone to consult but it isn't rocket science unless you are shooting way out yonder.
Brownells (and Midway) have scope mounting tips on video that work for most individuals and of course highlight their particular tools to make it easier.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState
-----------
Jim is also someone to consult but it isn't rocket science unless you are shooting way out yonder.
Brownells (and Midway) have scope mounting tips on video that work for most individuals and of course highlight their particular tools to make it easier.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:46 PM (JAi95)
87
65. Two questions: How thick is the berm, and has the berm itself shown signs of structural failure, such as the front slope slumping down due to prolonged bullet impacts? Also, what are you shooting into the berm?
Good questions, Ed. I'll have to take a closer look the next time I'm out there. I don't think there were, in the past, any restrictions on the calibers used, so I suppose it's possible somebody may have been firing .50; mostly, as far as I ever noticed, it's mostly been 5.56. .308 and a lot of .22 and 9mm.
Good questions, Ed. I'll have to take a closer look the next time I'm out there. I don't think there were, in the past, any restrictions on the calibers used, so I suppose it's possible somebody may have been firing .50; mostly, as far as I ever noticed, it's mostly been 5.56. .308 and a lot of .22 and 9mm.
Posted by: Paco at December 10, 2023 07:46 PM (njExo)
88
If by visit the range, you mean the back 40, then yes.
Posted by: Thomas Paine at December 10, 2023 07:46 PM (l460k)
89
Can see loose brass in a cockpit could be trouble but a Maxim MG is dumping lots more.
Posted by: Skip at December 10, 2023 07:46 PM (fwDg9)
90
Pretty sure Only the Vortex Razors are Made in the USA
Posted by: Marcus T at December 10, 2023 07:46 PM (/i32d)
91
Posted by: Godzilla at December 10, 2023 07:28 PM (vFG9F)
Take a look at C&Rsenal and the weapons each nation had to choose from at the start of the war. If you were a German, you had the Gassner, a monstrosity of a revolver that's difficult to grip, operate, and shoot. For the French, you had the 1892 Lebel, which was handy, but fired an underpowered 8mm cartridge. A Brit had either the Webley Fosbery or Webley Mark VI, which fired the .455 round, but were large and difficult to draw in the confines of a cockpit. A Colt 1911, P08 Luger, or Mauser C96 are more handy, have more rounds, and are easier to use in the confines of an aircraft cockpit.
Take a look at C&Rsenal and the weapons each nation had to choose from at the start of the war. If you were a German, you had the Gassner, a monstrosity of a revolver that's difficult to grip, operate, and shoot. For the French, you had the 1892 Lebel, which was handy, but fired an underpowered 8mm cartridge. A Brit had either the Webley Fosbery or Webley Mark VI, which fired the .455 round, but were large and difficult to draw in the confines of a cockpit. A Colt 1911, P08 Luger, or Mauser C96 are more handy, have more rounds, and are easier to use in the confines of an aircraft cockpit.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 07:47 PM (yRXSd)
92
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:43 PM (aQy7p)
----
Happy to help anytime! I have a big toolbox of rifle-smithing tools, if we can get together sometime.
----
Happy to help anytime! I have a big toolbox of rifle-smithing tools, if we can get together sometime.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:47 PM (JwHpX)
93
Before firelapping, always be realistic about your accuracy expectations for an old worn bore and whether you have addressed other sources of inaccuracy such as the barrel crown, etc
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (JAi95)
Lots of MilSurps will be counterbored too. Shoot fine, but some folks poo poo them.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (JAi95)
Lots of MilSurps will be counterbored too. Shoot fine, but some folks poo poo them.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy at December 10, 2023 07:49 PM (R/m4+)
94
85 One down side to the shim from Precision Armament: It's obvious what they are and they don't match the barrel. But, as of right now, I think it's a better solution than the crush washer.
Posted by: blake
--------
There are several techniques to fixing brakes and they vary mainly in how easy they are to remove the brake. If you don't care about removing the brake, blind pinning and spot welding pretty much permanently attaches the brake (can be useful if the barrel is below ATF minimum length and you want to make it legal). ATF considers blind pinning and spot welding as permanent. Then you have crush washers, shims as you note, rockset (hi temp adhesive), silver solder, and so on.
Posted by: blake
--------
There are several techniques to fixing brakes and they vary mainly in how easy they are to remove the brake. If you don't care about removing the brake, blind pinning and spot welding pretty much permanently attaches the brake (can be useful if the barrel is below ATF minimum length and you want to make it legal). ATF considers blind pinning and spot welding as permanent. Then you have crush washers, shims as you note, rockset (hi temp adhesive), silver solder, and so on.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:50 PM (JAi95)
95
84 Now I just have to pester Weasel after the busy season for scope mounting tips. 😄
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:43 PM
I mounted the scope currently on my rifle. It really is not hard.
I did purchase rings from a company that Weasel recommended. Also purchased levels. And most important which I did that the gunsmith did not do with my first rifle was to put Lock-Tite on the screws for the base.
I had asked him to use it but he said it was unnecessary. So when I went to Corsicana for the first time with it back in 2020 my scope went out of zero because the base came loose.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:43 PM
I mounted the scope currently on my rifle. It really is not hard.
I did purchase rings from a company that Weasel recommended. Also purchased levels. And most important which I did that the gunsmith did not do with my first rifle was to put Lock-Tite on the screws for the base.
I had asked him to use it but he said it was unnecessary. So when I went to Corsicana for the first time with it back in 2020 my scope went out of zero because the base came loose.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:50 PM (fe7in)
96
Wait .... does CBD clean his sous vide using pull-throughs and gun oil? Is this a factory recommendation? Doesn't the beef get fowled (sic) with cuprous quantities of metal (sic)?
Posted by: Ciampino - Did you hear a gunshot or did you fart? at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (qfLjt)
---
Now fortified with extra iron!
Posted by: Ciampino - Did you hear a gunshot or did you fart? at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (qfLjt)
---
Now fortified with extra iron!
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at December 10, 2023 07:51 PM (BpYfr)
97
Happy to help anytime! I have a big toolbox of rifle-smithing tools, if we can get together sometime.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:47 PM
Appreciate it!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:47 PM
Appreciate it!
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:51 PM (aQy7p)
98
A few quick bits from looking at some of the content:
Do they actually sell gun lube with that name? Because I want.
The M-1 didn't fare too well against that alien electron screen. Disappointed. Still gonna get one.
That weird cage thingy on the 1911? I want one of those too.
Do they actually sell gun lube with that name? Because I want.
The M-1 didn't fare too well against that alien electron screen. Disappointed. Still gonna get one.
That weird cage thingy on the 1911? I want one of those too.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 07:52 PM (HMvgH)
99
Weasel, I think you should get NF to sponsor the TXMOME!
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM (HCxzI)
100
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:51 PM (aQy7p)
---
Another item I'd recommend is a torque wrench calibrated in inch pounds.
---
Another item I'd recommend is a torque wrench calibrated in inch pounds.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM (JwHpX)
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM (fe7in)
102
Lots of MilSurps will be counterbored too. Shoot fine, but some folks poo poo them.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy
--------
Russians loved them some counterboring. Counterboring is a way to restore accuracy to a rifle with a badly damaged crown while leaving barrel lugs, front sights, etc. as original. Shortening a barrel fixes the crown but causes all sorts of problems remounting the front sight, adjusting the stock and handguards, etc.
Nowadays,usually easier to just recrown it and it is a diy job unless you are dealing with a very expensive rifle.
Posted by: Hairyback Guy
--------
Russians loved them some counterboring. Counterboring is a way to restore accuracy to a rifle with a badly damaged crown while leaving barrel lugs, front sights, etc. as original. Shortening a barrel fixes the crown but causes all sorts of problems remounting the front sight, adjusting the stock and handguards, etc.
Nowadays,usually easier to just recrown it and it is a diy job unless you are dealing with a very expensive rifle.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:54 PM (JAi95)
103
I mounted the scope currently on my rifle. It really is not hard.
I did purchase rings from a company that Weasel recommended. Also purchased levels. And most important which I did that the gunsmith did not do with my first rifle was to put Lock-Tite on the screws for the base.
I had asked him to use it but he said it was unnecessary. So when I went to Corsicana for the first time with it back in 2020 my scope went out of zero because the base came loose.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:50 PM
Doesn't seem like rocket surgery, if done carefully. I do need a good vise, though. I saw a product recommended over Loc Tite. Can't recall the nane off the top of my head. It isn't supposed to harden.
I did purchase rings from a company that Weasel recommended. Also purchased levels. And most important which I did that the gunsmith did not do with my first rifle was to put Lock-Tite on the screws for the base.
I had asked him to use it but he said it was unnecessary. So when I went to Corsicana for the first time with it back in 2020 my scope went out of zero because the base came loose.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:50 PM
Doesn't seem like rocket surgery, if done carefully. I do need a good vise, though. I saw a product recommended over Loc Tite. Can't recall the nane off the top of my head. It isn't supposed to harden.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:55 PM (aQy7p)
104
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 07:52 PM (HMvgH)
----
Earth v. the Flying Saucers is one of my faves!
----
Earth v. the Flying Saucers is one of my faves!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:55 PM (JwHpX)
105
Another item I'd recommend is a torque wrench calibrated in inch pounds.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM (JwHpX)
Yes I got this one from the big river:
https://a.co/d/fbZPA9a
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM (JwHpX)
Yes I got this one from the big river:
https://a.co/d/fbZPA9a
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:56 PM (IFNME)
106
RMBS here is one of many videos showing you how to mount a scope.
https://tinyurl.com/yhvfxcxw
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM
👍 Been trying to get smart on it.
https://tinyurl.com/yhvfxcxw
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM
👍 Been trying to get smart on it.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:56 PM (aQy7p)
107
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:55 PM (aQy7p)
----
Just get in touch when you're ready.
----
Just get in touch when you're ready.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:57 PM (JwHpX)
108
Billy D my dad had one when I was a very young kid, wonder what happened to it.
Anyway In Pa you should be fine.
Anyway In Pa you should be fine.
Posted by: Skip at December 10, 2023 07:57 PM (fwDg9)
109
61 By "miniature" I mean the barrel is roughly an inch and a half long, 3/4 inch outside diameter, with maybe a 3/16 inch bore. It shoots an appropriate sized ball bearing, propelled by a pinch of black powder.
Posted by: BillyD at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (F6Xpw)
----
Damn that brings back memories. High school memories. I got one of the friends who did metal class to take a solid steel rod, 2" diameter, & bore a much smaller hole (I think 3/8" or similar, I can't remember after exactly 60 years) not quite all the way. Then a thin hole about 1/16" meeting the long bore at the closed end at right angles (for the fuse). We made lots of gunpowder from potassium chlorate and charcoal, no sulfur.
Use a flat teaspoon of powder and Jetex fuse to fire it. Projectiles were either wadded up foil/paper from cigarette packs or recovered .22 bullets from the armory shooting range (we had one at school in Nairobi). Amazing - the wadded up aluminum/paper combo would penetrate 3-5 stacked plywood desktops and the lead pellets went through tree trunks up to 2+" in diameter. (desktops were discarded parts from broken desks). All in the woods on the school grounds. I got caught & much trouble.
Posted by: BillyD at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (F6Xpw)
----
Damn that brings back memories. High school memories. I got one of the friends who did metal class to take a solid steel rod, 2" diameter, & bore a much smaller hole (I think 3/8" or similar, I can't remember after exactly 60 years) not quite all the way. Then a thin hole about 1/16" meeting the long bore at the closed end at right angles (for the fuse). We made lots of gunpowder from potassium chlorate and charcoal, no sulfur.
Use a flat teaspoon of powder and Jetex fuse to fire it. Projectiles were either wadded up foil/paper from cigarette packs or recovered .22 bullets from the armory shooting range (we had one at school in Nairobi). Amazing - the wadded up aluminum/paper combo would penetrate 3-5 stacked plywood desktops and the lead pellets went through tree trunks up to 2+" in diameter. (desktops were discarded parts from broken desks). All in the woods on the school grounds. I got caught & much trouble.
Posted by: Ciampino - Did you hear a gunshot or a cannon? at December 10, 2023 07:58 PM (qfLjt)
110
And speaking of ships at sea, the Army Team delivered a drubbing to the squids yesterday in Foxborough, MA.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:06 PM (IFNME)
That's because the Navy guys were all trying to impress the goat.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:06 PM (IFNME)
That's because the Navy guys were all trying to impress the goat.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 07:58 PM (HMvgH)
111
>>>> During the early days of aerial combat, it wasn't uncommon for pilots to exchange small arms fire with enemy combatants.
---
Baron von Richtofen was killed by ground fire- he was wounded by a rifle or MG round, fired by ground troops, and crashed
---
Baron von Richtofen was killed by ground fire- he was wounded by a rifle or MG round, fired by ground troops, and crashed
Posted by: Don Black at December 10, 2023 07:58 PM (geLO8)
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 07:58 PM (aQy7p)
113
I now have a plethora of 45 acp!
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:07 PM (IFNME)
But do you have a veritable cornucopia of ammo?
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:07 PM (IFNME)
But do you have a veritable cornucopia of ammo?
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 07:59 PM (HMvgH)
114
109
I forgot to say the cannon barrel was 6-7".
I forgot to say the cannon barrel was 6-7".
Posted by: Ciampino - Did I hear a gunshot or a cannon? at December 10, 2023 07:59 PM (qfLjt)
115
@ 110-
How did the cheerleaders look?
How did the cheerleaders look?
Posted by: Eromero at December 10, 2023 08:00 PM (NxC5+)
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 08:00 PM (fe7in)
117
Buds Guns have Tisa M1911 Tanker 45's for under $400. A very good deal.
Posted by: Diogenes at December 10, 2023 07:14 PM (W/lyH)
So do Classic Firearms and PSA. They're almost trying to give them away. Almost enough to make me get another 1911 so I can learn to shoot with both hands.
Posted by: Diogenes at December 10, 2023 07:14 PM (W/lyH)
So do Classic Firearms and PSA. They're almost trying to give them away. Almost enough to make me get another 1911 so I can learn to shoot with both hands.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:02 PM (HMvgH)
118
Good luck with the scope mount, RMBS. I look forward to your report.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing(tT6L1) at December 10, 2023 08:02 PM (tT6L1)
119
Posted by: Don Black at December 10, 2023 07:58 PM (geLO
So was Frank Luke - #2 US ace in WWI behind only Eddie Rickenbacker.
So was Frank Luke - #2 US ace in WWI behind only Eddie Rickenbacker.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 08:03 PM (yRXSd)
Posted by: sock_rat_eez - these lying bastardi e stronzi have been lying for decades at December 10, 2023 08:03 PM (zer5o)
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 08:03 PM (HCxzI)
122
I stupidly let my carry permit expire, beyond the renew date. As a result I had to attend a 9 hour class instead of a 4 hour one to renew. After sitting for 8 hours in class I was exhausted. Also had to pass a shooting test, 32 rounds at a human sized silhouette at varying distances. One miss and you flunked. I passed. Wasn't that difficult. Might send Weasel a pic of my target and the pistol I used. It's an oldie but a goodie.
When our two instructors talked about legal use of firearms we listened. Both had been involved in a shooting at the range once. A customer had entered the store with a loaded firearm and was told to unload it. An argument ensued and the guy ended up shooting two other customers dead. Our two instructors then proceeded to pumped 8 rounds into the perp killing him. One instructor was wounded in the arm. He managed to switch hands. Good thing to practice.
Link to shooting > https://tinyurl.com/3b7hk9jd
When our two instructors talked about legal use of firearms we listened. Both had been involved in a shooting at the range once. A customer had entered the store with a loaded firearm and was told to unload it. An argument ensued and the guy ended up shooting two other customers dead. Our two instructors then proceeded to pumped 8 rounds into the perp killing him. One instructor was wounded in the arm. He managed to switch hands. Good thing to practice.
Link to shooting > https://tinyurl.com/3b7hk9jd
Posted by: javems at December 10, 2023 08:05 PM (8I4hW)
123
RMBS, I used a Tipton gun vise. All that was needed.
And for the rings check out kenfarrell.com
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 08:00 PM
Was looking at one of those. Good to hear a trusted endorsement.
And for the rings check out kenfarrell.com
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 08:00 PM
Was looking at one of those. Good to hear a trusted endorsement.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:05 PM (aQy7p)
124
The Red Baron had the most badass ID photo ever
https://tinyurl.com/ye6drf28
sorry if OT- I had TWO Diet Cokes today
https://tinyurl.com/ye6drf28
sorry if OT- I had TWO Diet Cokes today
Posted by: Don Black at December 10, 2023 08:06 PM (geLO8)
125
Because sometimes your mom isn't the easiest teacher to learn from.
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 07:22 PM (GMlj0)
I figured you just rapped his knuckles when he did that.
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 07:22 PM (GMlj0)
I figured you just rapped his knuckles when he did that.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:06 PM (HMvgH)
126
Dearth Plethora or Veritable Cornucopia?
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 08:03 PM (HCxzI)
------------
Dearth Plethora,
Lack of Plenty has a better ring to it than actually a lot.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 08:03 PM (HCxzI)
------------
Dearth Plethora,
Lack of Plenty has a better ring to it than actually a lot.
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing(tT6L1) at December 10, 2023 08:06 PM (tT6L1)
127
RMBS, what kind of base are you using? Can you put on another that has 30MOA? Gives you that much more elevation. Something to think about.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 08:07 PM (fe7in)
128
Thanks to all for the mini black powder cannon info.
Posted by: BillyD at December 10, 2023 08:08 PM (F6Xpw)
129
By early 1915, both sides had figured out how to mount machineguns on their planes to create the first true air to air fighters.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 07:25 PM (yRXSd)
With one method being to actually just put metal deflectors on the spot where the propellers crossed the path of fixed machine guns. Those were ... interesting times, until someone invented the interruptor.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 07:25 PM (yRXSd)
With one method being to actually just put metal deflectors on the spot where the propellers crossed the path of fixed machine guns. Those were ... interesting times, until someone invented the interruptor.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:08 PM (HMvgH)
Posted by: blake - semi lurker in marginal standing(tT6L1) at December 10, 2023 08:09 PM (tT6L1)
131
>Those were ... interesting times, until someone invented the interruptor.
Posted by: GWB
---
I think that was Fokker
unless I'm wrong™
Posted by: GWB
---
I think that was Fokker
unless I'm wrong™
Posted by: Don Black at December 10, 2023 08:10 PM (geLO8)
132
Thanks to all for the mini black powder cannon info.
Hang around. We've got great medical and personal relations advice too.
Hang around. We've got great medical and personal relations advice too.
Posted by: Oddbob at December 10, 2023 08:10 PM (nfrXX)
133
Is there any science behind this? The berm, as far as I know, has never been cleaned out or "mined" for old projectiles.
Posted by: Paco at December 10, 2023 07:26 PM (njExo)
I would think anything too energetic would disturb the solidity of the dirt. That's how you start landslides.
BUT, I would think it would take a lot over a short time period.
Rebuild the berm with some items to keep it "structural" - burlap or "weed fabric" in layers, maybe.
I am also not a civil engineer, nor extremely knowledgeable about the rules concerning building a rifle range berm.
Posted by: Paco at December 10, 2023 07:26 PM (njExo)
I would think anything too energetic would disturb the solidity of the dirt. That's how you start landslides.
BUT, I would think it would take a lot over a short time period.
Rebuild the berm with some items to keep it "structural" - burlap or "weed fabric" in layers, maybe.
I am also not a civil engineer, nor extremely knowledgeable about the rules concerning building a rifle range berm.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:13 PM (HMvgH)
134
*squees!*
Okay Gojira Minus One absolutely rocked. It is a very good human drama that also happens to be a good kaiju film. Imagine that.
Love the nods to the Gojira mythos. Odo Island, check. Dinosaur on the war path, check though in previous one the big lizard saved the Japanese from the Americans. The name Tachibana checks a multi-genre checkbox, even in the anime Super Atragon. And can't forget the Shinden, for the Japanese that pusher fighter is serious airplane pr0n; heck that plane even made it into Ah! Megami-sama! With the Kagero class destroyer Yukikaze as one of the stars, yeah just love it.
Okay Gojira Minus One absolutely rocked. It is a very good human drama that also happens to be a good kaiju film. Imagine that.
Love the nods to the Gojira mythos. Odo Island, check. Dinosaur on the war path, check though in previous one the big lizard saved the Japanese from the Americans. The name Tachibana checks a multi-genre checkbox, even in the anime Super Atragon. And can't forget the Shinden, for the Japanese that pusher fighter is serious airplane pr0n; heck that plane even made it into Ah! Megami-sama! With the Kagero class destroyer Yukikaze as one of the stars, yeah just love it.
Posted by: Anna Puma at December 10, 2023 08:15 PM (pREsH)
135
Why didn't pilots just carry a pair of revolvers?
Posted by: Godzilla at December 10, 2023 07:28 PM (vFG9F)
Because of the ominous clicks after 12 rounds.
I have seen pics of all sorts of arms ported skyward in early aeroplanes. None of those punt guns, though - you'd probably stall the airplane when firing one of those.
Posted by: Godzilla at December 10, 2023 07:28 PM (vFG9F)
Because of the ominous clicks after 12 rounds.
I have seen pics of all sorts of arms ported skyward in early aeroplanes. None of those punt guns, though - you'd probably stall the airplane when firing one of those.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:16 PM (HMvgH)
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 08:16 PM (yRXSd)
Posted by: Puddleglum, cheer up for the worst is yet to come at December 10, 2023 08:16 PM (sAmhv)
138
Time to call it a night. Busy two weeks at work for me. Supervisor is on vacation and I have to do his work along with mine. It is not fun.
Thanks as always Weasel!!
Have a good week everyone!!
Thanks as always Weasel!!
Have a good week everyone!!
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 08:18 PM (fe7in)
139
selling braced pistols again.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:31 PM (IFNME)
Oodles of them, it seems. Like they had loads of them stashed somewhere.
Posted by: blaster at December 10, 2023 07:31 PM (IFNME)
Oodles of them, it seems. Like they had loads of them stashed somewhere.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:18 PM (HMvgH)
140
RMBS, what kind of base are you using? Can you put on another that has 30MOA? Gives you that much more elevation. Something to think about.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 08:07 PM
Weasel recommended Ken Farrell. I was thinking 30 MOA to get as much elevation out of it as possible.
Posted by: Scuba Dude at December 10, 2023 08:07 PM
Weasel recommended Ken Farrell. I was thinking 30 MOA to get as much elevation out of it as possible.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:19 PM (aQy7p)
141
A customer had entered the store with a loaded firearm and was told to unload it. An argument ensued and the guy ended up shooting two other customers dead. Our two instructors then proceeded to pumped 8 rounds into the perp killing him. One instructor was wounded in the arm. He managed to switch hands. Good thing to practice.
Link to shooting > https://tinyurl.com/3b7hk9jd
--------
Horrible situation. Always wise to de escalate in arguments when others are armed if possible.
Link to shooting > https://tinyurl.com/3b7hk9jd
--------
Horrible situation. Always wise to de escalate in arguments when others are armed if possible.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:19 PM (JAi95)
142
Hello Horde, and thanks for the thread Weasel. Just to let everyone know, this will be the last thread we can comment on this year, as we will be traveling - departing this week. So happy whatever holiday you celebrate. We celebrate Christmas, and will be doing so where it all originated. And Happy New Year, be back here in 2024.
Posted by: Grateful at December 10, 2023 08:20 PM (IQ6Gq)
143
I read that as Darth Pleathora.
Posted by: Eromero at December 10, 2023 08:21 PM (NxC5+)
144
whether you have addressed other sources of inaccuracy
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (JAi95)
Like you - your eyes, your grip, your ammo, your wobbly sh*t....
Seriously, even a worn out barrel, at this point, outshoots me, myself. I hope to get good enough some day to make it worthwhile to consider things like the quality of my barrel.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 07:32 PM (JAi95)
Like you - your eyes, your grip, your ammo, your wobbly sh*t....
Seriously, even a worn out barrel, at this point, outshoots me, myself. I hope to get good enough some day to make it worthwhile to consider things like the quality of my barrel.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:21 PM (HMvgH)
145
they are coming in trios and up to 6 or so.
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (MeG8a)
And you'll get a stop shot with every single round, right? Because no one will ever need more than 6-10 rounds.
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 07:37 PM (MeG8a)
And you'll get a stop shot with every single round, right? Because no one will ever need more than 6-10 rounds.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:23 PM (HMvgH)
146
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:19 PM (aQy7p)
-----
What is the total mechanical elevation adjustment for the scope? The mechanical zero is almost always not going to be the optical zero. Unless the mechanical travel is >60 MOA you may not need a 30 MOA rail. Might save you a few bucks.
-----
What is the total mechanical elevation adjustment for the scope? The mechanical zero is almost always not going to be the optical zero. Unless the mechanical travel is >60 MOA you may not need a 30 MOA rail. Might save you a few bucks.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:24 PM (JwHpX)
147
In extremely cold or wet and muddy shooting conditions prior to going out I thoroughly clean my weapon of all grease or oil.
Then the sliding/rotating surfaces get covered in silicon spray, available at any auto parts store. This gives a nice slick surface that doesn't attract dirt (silicon is a "dry"lube) plus I've never had a freeze up from water.
Then the sliding/rotating surfaces get covered in silicon spray, available at any auto parts store. This gives a nice slick surface that doesn't attract dirt (silicon is a "dry"lube) plus I've never had a freeze up from water.
Posted by: irongrampa at December 10, 2023 08:24 PM (KATBx)
148
Late to the Gub Thread (and thanks Weasel!) because of a church Christmas thing. Good evening, gub 'ettes and 'rons!
Posted by: Schnorflepuppy at December 10, 2023 08:25 PM (v23vE)
149
Another item I'd recommend is a torque wrench calibrated in inch pounds.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM (JwHpX)
Yes I got this one from the big river:
https://a.co/d/fbZPA9a
Posted by: blaster
I will have to check that out and maybe put it on my 'buy' list.
The only torque wrench I have is a 1/2" one for head bolts. That may not be suitable for anything on a firearm.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 07:53 PM (JwHpX)
Yes I got this one from the big river:
https://a.co/d/fbZPA9a
Posted by: blaster
I will have to check that out and maybe put it on my 'buy' list.
The only torque wrench I have is a 1/2" one for head bolts. That may not be suitable for anything on a firearm.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 08:25 PM (cOq4q)
150
What is the total mechanical elevation adjustment for the scope? The mechanical zero is almost always not going to be the optical zero. Unless the mechanical travel is >60 MOA you may not need a 30 MOA rail. Might save you a few bucks.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:24 PM
70 MOA. For a 7.62, you think 20 MOA will work?
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:24 PM
70 MOA. For a 7.62, you think 20 MOA will work?
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:27 PM (aQy7p)
151
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:23 PM (HMvgH)
If you're looking at six or more bad guys coming your way, it seems to me that you need to add something like a PCC or serious tactical shotgun to your sidearm.
"I need something for the end of the night. Something big, bold."
"May I suggest the Benelli M4?"
If you're looking at six or more bad guys coming your way, it seems to me that you need to add something like a PCC or serious tactical shotgun to your sidearm.
If you're looking at six or more bad guys coming your way, it seems to me that you need to add something like a PCC or serious tactical shotgun to your sidearm.
"I need something for the end of the night. Something big, bold."
"May I suggest the Benelli M4?"
If you're looking at six or more bad guys coming your way, it seems to me that you need to add something like a PCC or serious tactical shotgun to your sidearm.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 08:32 PM (yRXSd)
152
Like you - your eyes, your grip, your ammo, your wobbly sh*t....
Seriously, even a worn out barrel, at this point, outshoots me, myself. I hope to get good enough some day to make it worthwhile to consider things like the quality of my barrel.
Posted by: GWB
--------
Fit of the firearm to the person is usually a key factor in shooting well and shooting from a benchrest sometimes creates unrealistic expectations in comparison than if you are firing from field positions.
When I take an extended holiday from shooting like now, I always begin back with 22 LR rifles and pistols. As RI Red can tell you, rimfire competitions like aspirin shoots can often give quite a challenge at relatively near distances with relatively inexpensive rifles.
For a lot of folks interested in hunting type accuracy from field positions, red dots make sense at close range up to 100-200 yards or the various military derived (ACOGS) brought about similar civilian optics using prismatic illuminated low power scopes.
I prefer iron sights myself but I am used to them and have grudgingly adopted red dots for self defense long arms and low power scopes for range guns.
Seriously, even a worn out barrel, at this point, outshoots me, myself. I hope to get good enough some day to make it worthwhile to consider things like the quality of my barrel.
Posted by: GWB
--------
Fit of the firearm to the person is usually a key factor in shooting well and shooting from a benchrest sometimes creates unrealistic expectations in comparison than if you are firing from field positions.
When I take an extended holiday from shooting like now, I always begin back with 22 LR rifles and pistols. As RI Red can tell you, rimfire competitions like aspirin shoots can often give quite a challenge at relatively near distances with relatively inexpensive rifles.
For a lot of folks interested in hunting type accuracy from field positions, red dots make sense at close range up to 100-200 yards or the various military derived (ACOGS) brought about similar civilian optics using prismatic illuminated low power scopes.
I prefer iron sights myself but I am used to them and have grudgingly adopted red dots for self defense long arms and low power scopes for range guns.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:33 PM (JAi95)
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 08:34 PM (lytXf)
154
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:27 PM (aQy7p)
---
For that I'd go 30MOA, unless you're contemplating a shot requiring more than 100 MOA of elevation.
---
For that I'd go 30MOA, unless you're contemplating a shot requiring more than 100 MOA of elevation.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:34 PM (JwHpX)
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:35 PM (JwHpX)
156
All this radiation stuff.
Does Weasel know something that we don't???
Does Weasel know something that we don't???
Posted by: Diogenes at December 10, 2023 08:35 PM (W/lyH)
157
The only torque wrench I have is a 1/2" one for head bolts. That may not be suitable for anything on a firearm.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
-------
Only for torquing barrels. Something like Wheeler's FAT wrench, Fix It Sticks calibrated for a certain inch pound limit, or some of the newer competitors of the FAT wrench are quite useful for a lot of gun tasks such as tightening receiver screws to spec as well as scope mounting.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
-------
Only for torquing barrels. Something like Wheeler's FAT wrench, Fix It Sticks calibrated for a certain inch pound limit, or some of the newer competitors of the FAT wrench are quite useful for a lot of gun tasks such as tightening receiver screws to spec as well as scope mounting.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:36 PM (JAi95)
158
Silicone lube may decompose with moisture over time, producing very fine SiO2 'sand' that is very abrasive. Just wanted to mention that.
Posted by: Ciampino - Gun gabber tears eh! at December 10, 2023 08:36 PM (qfLjt)
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 08:37 PM (yRXSd)
160
70 MOA. For a 7.62, you think 20 MOA will work?
Just spitballin' but I put a 175 Sierra Matchking at 2700 into Ballistics AE and it shows a 36+ MOA drop at 1000. Those are just some common default values I chose.
YMMV.
Just spitballin' but I put a 175 Sierra Matchking at 2700 into Ballistics AE and it shows a 36+ MOA drop at 1000. Those are just some common default values I chose.
YMMV.
Posted by: Oddbob at December 10, 2023 08:37 PM (nfrXX)
161
Posted by: Oddbob at December 10, 2023 08:37 PM (nfrXX)
-----
36+ sounds like the right neighborhood for that shot.
-----
36+ sounds like the right neighborhood for that shot.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:38 PM (JwHpX)
162
>>> If you're looking at six or more bad guys coming your way, it seems to me that you need to add something like a PCC or serious tactical shotgun to your sidearm.
Posted by: Ed L
The best part is that in virtually every jurisdiction you have to wait for them to breach your abode. Before then you can use anything more than polite speech.
Posted by: Ed L
The best part is that in virtually every jurisdiction you have to wait for them to breach your abode. Before then you can use anything more than polite speech.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 08:39 PM (cOq4q)
163
I'm in a forgiving mood - let buy guns be buy guns.
Posted by: Commissar of Plenty and Lysenkoism in solidarity with the struggle to maintain Moron standards at December 10, 2023 08:39 PM (f1uyw)
164
As Weasel says, compete in something. Since taking that advice I’ve done IDPA with pistols and PCC, and .22 precision.
Only way you can truly improve.
Only way you can truly improve.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 08:40 PM (HCxzI)
165
If you're looking at six or more bad guys coming your way, it seems to me that you need to add something like a PCC or serious tactical shotgun to your sidearm.
Posted by: Ed L
------------
For six or more at very close range, you really need a rifle and that is where it shines. Recovery time between shots is superior using something like autoloading, ARs, AK,s, M1 Carbine, or even an SKS and you probably will not have to reload a 20-30 round magazine under stress conditions.
Posted by: Ed L
------------
For six or more at very close range, you really need a rifle and that is where it shines. Recovery time between shots is superior using something like autoloading, ARs, AK,s, M1 Carbine, or even an SKS and you probably will not have to reload a 20-30 round magazine under stress conditions.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:40 PM (JAi95)
166
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 08:40 PM (HCxzI)
---
Thank you, grasshopper! I freely admit to being full of shit, but not when it comes to this!
---
Thank you, grasshopper! I freely admit to being full of shit, but not when it comes to this!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:41 PM (JwHpX)
167
BTW it's silicone with an ending E.
Found in lubes, bewbs, lips, butt cheeks, ..... okay enough, get your mind back to pew-pews and out of the gutter.
Silicon is the element Si
Just saying ....
Found in lubes, bewbs, lips, butt cheeks, ..... okay enough, get your mind back to pew-pews and out of the gutter.
Silicon is the element Si
Just saying ....
Posted by: Ciampino - Tetramethysilane at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (qfLjt)
168
We've got great medical and personal relations advice too.
Posted by: Oddbob at December 10, 2023 08:10 PM (nfrXX)
Both are pretty much "slap a hot iron on it."
Posted by: Oddbob at December 10, 2023 08:10 PM (nfrXX)
Both are pretty much "slap a hot iron on it."
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (HMvgH)
169
O/T Just found out, David Drake, SF author has passed away. Figured some of the people here may have read him. RIP.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (JAi95)
170
Always wise to de escalate in arguments when others are armed if possible.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:19 PM (JAi95)
Or to flank him with another person.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:19 PM (JAi95)
Or to flank him with another person.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:44 PM (HMvgH)
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 08:45 PM (cOq4q)
172
166 Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 08:40 PM (HCxzI)
---
Thank you, grasshopper! I freely admit to being full of shit, but not when it comes to this!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:41 PM (JwHpX)
----
Weasel, we had a shortish crapper thread going in the FWP blog earlier today.
---
Thank you, grasshopper! I freely admit to being full of shit, but not when it comes to this!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:41 PM (JwHpX)
----
Weasel, we had a shortish crapper thread going in the FWP blog earlier today.
Posted by: Ciampino - Tetramethysilane for NMR at December 10, 2023 08:45 PM (qfLjt)
173
And Happy New Year, be back here in 2024.
Posted by: Grateful at December 10, 2023 08:20 PM (IQ6Gq)
Stay safe, and see you on the other side of December!
Posted by: Grateful at December 10, 2023 08:20 PM (IQ6Gq)
Stay safe, and see you on the other side of December!
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:45 PM (HMvgH)
174
I prefer iron sights myself but I am used to them and have grudgingly adopted red dots for self defense long arms and low power scopes for range guns.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:33 PM (JAi95)
I have one scope. I can mount it on the 1917 and have done so once. I still prefer iron sights, blades over peep. Scopes obscure you peripheral vision. I used to have superior eyesight. Still corrected to better than 20/20. As it fails I might consider switching, if I live that long.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:33 PM (JAi95)
I have one scope. I can mount it on the 1917 and have done so once. I still prefer iron sights, blades over peep. Scopes obscure you peripheral vision. I used to have superior eyesight. Still corrected to better than 20/20. As it fails I might consider switching, if I live that long.
Posted by: javems at December 10, 2023 08:45 PM (8I4hW)
175
162 >>> If you're looking at six or more bad guys coming your way, it seems to me that you need to add something like a PCC or serious tactical shotgun to your sidearm.
Posted by: Ed L
The best part is that in virtually every jurisdiction you have to wait for them to breach your abode. Before then you can use anything more than polite speech.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
I'm a single female living alone in Seattle. I was afraid for my life, officer.
I may be ok.
Posted by: Ed L
The best part is that in virtually every jurisdiction you have to wait for them to breach your abode. Before then you can use anything more than polite speech.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
I'm a single female living alone in Seattle. I was afraid for my life, officer.
I may be ok.
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 08:46 PM (Y/u0P)
176
For that I'd go 30MOA, unless you're contemplating a shot requiring more than 100 MOA of elevation.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:34 PM
Not likely to be shooting more than 1100 yds anytime soon. 30 MOA sounds like all I'm likely to need.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:34 PM
Not likely to be shooting more than 1100 yds anytime soon. 30 MOA sounds like all I'm likely to need.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:46 PM (aQy7p)
177
Seriously people - look at the accomplished shooters we have like blake and RI Red. Nothing will focus your skills like keeping score. Just ask them. I'm not even a particularly competitive person, but I knew that shooting in matches was how I was going to bring together everything I was learning. Club matches are inexpensive and fun, plus you can pick the brains of the guys winning the matches for tips on what they are doing.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:46 PM (JwHpX)
178
If you're looking at six or more bad guys coming your way, it seems to me that you need to add something like a PCC or serious tactical shotgun to your sidearm.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 08:32 PM (yRXSd)
So important you said it twice! And I agree.
And, of course, one of the reasons for the PCC is... larger magazines.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 08:32 PM (yRXSd)
So important you said it twice! And I agree.
And, of course, one of the reasons for the PCC is... larger magazines.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:47 PM (HMvgH)
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM (JwHpX)
180
The best part is that in virtually every jurisdiction you have to wait for them to breach your abode. Before then you can use anything more than polite speech.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
Not quite accurate---like most things, it is a combination of factors including threats, whether they are armed or not, disparate force on their side, and so on.
Pretty much, a lot of the caselaw and statutes are trying to thread the needle between denial of self defense and allowing idiots to fire shots through the door at unarmed Girl Scouts wanting to sell you cookies.
Best thing is to harden your periphery and there are passive defenses such as Full view ballistic glass screen doors with multiple locking surfaces that can delay the kick in the door type assault. Same for hardening your inner door as well. Fairly cheap to do and highly recommended.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
Not quite accurate---like most things, it is a combination of factors including threats, whether they are armed or not, disparate force on their side, and so on.
Pretty much, a lot of the caselaw and statutes are trying to thread the needle between denial of self defense and allowing idiots to fire shots through the door at unarmed Girl Scouts wanting to sell you cookies.
Best thing is to harden your periphery and there are passive defenses such as Full view ballistic glass screen doors with multiple locking surfaces that can delay the kick in the door type assault. Same for hardening your inner door as well. Fairly cheap to do and highly recommended.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM (JAi95)
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM (aQy7p)
182
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:46 PM (aQy7p)
----
Agreed!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM
30 MOA base it is, then. 👍
----
Agreed!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM
30 MOA base it is, then. 👍
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:49 PM (aQy7p)
183
Figured some of the people here may have read him. RIP.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (JAi95)
Yep. He was a master at emotionally hurt people taking it to the enemy.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (JAi95)
Yep. He was a master at emotionally hurt people taking it to the enemy.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:50 PM (HMvgH)
184
I have one scope. I can mount it on the 1917 and have done so once. I still prefer iron sights, blades over peep. Scopes obscure you peripheral vision. I used to have superior eyesight. Still corrected to better than 20/20. As it fails I might consider switching, if I live that long.
Posted by: javems
-------------
On my milsurps, I have no scopes except for an Enfield (someone else tapped the receiver and I have just now tracked down the Parker Hale scope mounts, rings, etc. for it), but I do have excellent peep sights such as Tech Sights for the Ruski SKS and I do use cheap colorful nail polish on front sights nowadays in deep orange or yellow.
Posted by: javems
-------------
On my milsurps, I have no scopes except for an Enfield (someone else tapped the receiver and I have just now tracked down the Parker Hale scope mounts, rings, etc. for it), but I do have excellent peep sights such as Tech Sights for the Ruski SKS and I do use cheap colorful nail polish on front sights nowadays in deep orange or yellow.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:51 PM (JAi95)
185
169 O/T Just found out, David Drake, SF author has passed away. Figured some of the people here may have read him. RIP.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (JAi95)
----
Never read any of his books. I'm not into fantasy though.
RIP.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (JAi95)
----
Never read any of his books. I'm not into fantasy though.
RIP.
Posted by: Ciampino - To Time Travel at December 10, 2023 08:52 PM (qfLjt)
186
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM (aQy7p)
----
Thanks, but it's really just human nature. Keeping score incentivizes you to do your best. I really wish more people would believe me on this. Are you going to suck at first? Probably. Just get over the stage fright and performance anxiety and go shoot a match. Everyone there had a first match day too, and will stop what they're doing to help you out.
----
Thanks, but it's really just human nature. Keeping score incentivizes you to do your best. I really wish more people would believe me on this. Are you going to suck at first? Probably. Just get over the stage fright and performance anxiety and go shoot a match. Everyone there had a first match day too, and will stop what they're doing to help you out.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:53 PM (JwHpX)
187
183 Figured some of the people here may have read him. RIP.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (JAi95)
Yep. He was a master at emotionally hurt people taking it to the enemy.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:50 PM (HMvgH)
----
Any non-fantasy book that you would recommend to try him out?
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:42 PM (JAi95)
Yep. He was a master at emotionally hurt people taking it to the enemy.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 08:50 PM (HMvgH)
----
Any non-fantasy book that you would recommend to try him out?
Posted by: Ciampino - To Time travel at December 10, 2023 08:54 PM (qfLjt)
188
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:40 PM (JAi95)
Whig, I think the only downside of rifle caliber rounds is the potential for over-penetration or sending stray rounds around the neighborhood. PCCs don't give you the stopping power of a rifle round, but they are easier to suppress (if you can do so), especially if you're indoors.
Whig, I think the only downside of rifle caliber rounds is the potential for over-penetration or sending stray rounds around the neighborhood. PCCs don't give you the stopping power of a rifle round, but they are easier to suppress (if you can do so), especially if you're indoors.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 08:54 PM (yRXSd)
189
Last weekend I tried out some 3n38 loads for 9mm. The manual had some great velocities out of that powder. All worked well in the Ruger P95 and no danger signs of overpressure...
So a couple of days ago I figured I'd try tthe same loadings again and put more effort into testing accuracy.
After loading them up I decide to 'plunk' test them into the other 9mm pistol barrel. No plunky?!
Tried them in the P95 barrel and nice clear plunk.
OK, try both barrels with other factory ammo and got good plunks with all.
This loading from the manual has long over all length (COAL, for a 9mm), still below the max but here's the thing -
It was a load for Hornady XTP which has a long body and short truncated cone (vs more graceful round nose). The powder charge is large relative to the 9mm casing, so the bullet sticks way out there compared to most XTP loads where the truncated cone is all that is exposed.
Checking other loads in the manual with a shorter COAL basically have uninspiring velocities. I don't want reloads that I can only use in one of 9mm pistols that I have and may very weell go Kaboom in the others... so, scrap that idea.
So a couple of days ago I figured I'd try tthe same loadings again and put more effort into testing accuracy.
After loading them up I decide to 'plunk' test them into the other 9mm pistol barrel. No plunky?!
Tried them in the P95 barrel and nice clear plunk.
OK, try both barrels with other factory ammo and got good plunks with all.
This loading from the manual has long over all length (COAL, for a 9mm), still below the max but here's the thing -
It was a load for Hornady XTP which has a long body and short truncated cone (vs more graceful round nose). The powder charge is large relative to the 9mm casing, so the bullet sticks way out there compared to most XTP loads where the truncated cone is all that is exposed.
Checking other loads in the manual with a shorter COAL basically have uninspiring velocities. I don't want reloads that I can only use in one of 9mm pistols that I have and may very weell go Kaboom in the others... so, scrap that idea.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 08:58 PM (cOq4q)
190
180 The best part is that in virtually every jurisdiction you have to wait for them to breach your abode. Before then you can't use anything more than polite speech.
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
----
Not quite accurate---like most things, it is a combination of factors including threats, whether they are armed or not, disparate force on their side, and so on.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM (JAi95)
----
Attack lions?
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher
----
Not quite accurate---like most things, it is a combination of factors including threats, whether they are armed or not, disparate force on their side, and so on.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM (JAi95)
----
Attack lions?
Posted by: Ciampino - To Time travel ... hmm at December 10, 2023 08:58 PM (qfLjt)
191
RMBS, I have all the stuff to level and mount a scope. If you want to head north some weekend, just let me know.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:00 PM (HCxzI)
192
Weasel @ 186-
Weasel, and others on this site, speak true. So many have learned so much here. Wisdom just laying around, and free. More or less.
Weasel, and others on this site, speak true. So many have learned so much here. Wisdom just laying around, and free. More or less.
Posted by: Eromero at December 10, 2023 09:00 PM (NxC5+)
193
Shooting matches is also about getting you out of your comfort zone. You draw and shoot on command rather than when you are ready. You have to move. You can't just take your time. When you make a mistake you have to shake it off immediately and keep thinking. And people are watching. And you are being judged.
It makes standing at 7 yards in a protected, controlled atmosphere very comfortable. And that's ok too. If shooting is a hobby, or a social club, that's fine. If you're serious about protecting yourself in a situation where a person is threatening you, well, you need to get out of your comfort zone. Be timed. And judged. And move.
It makes standing at 7 yards in a protected, controlled atmosphere very comfortable. And that's ok too. If shooting is a hobby, or a social club, that's fine. If you're serious about protecting yourself in a situation where a person is threatening you, well, you need to get out of your comfort zone. Be timed. And judged. And move.
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM (Y/u0P)
194
191 RMBS, I have all the stuff to level and mount a scope. If you want to head north some weekend, just let me know.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:00 PM (HCxzI)
----
I'd trust RI Red to do it correctly.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:00 PM (HCxzI)
----
I'd trust RI Red to do it correctly.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM (JwHpX)
195
I'd trust RI Red to do it correctly.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM (JwHpX)
Absolutely!
But this "Dearth Plethora" fellow is suspect...
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM (JwHpX)
Absolutely!
But this "Dearth Plethora" fellow is suspect...
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2023 09:02 PM (sM1IA)
196
Whig, I think the only downside of rifle caliber rounds is the potential for over-penetration or sending stray rounds around the neighborhood. PCCs don't give you the stopping power of a rifle round, but they are easier to suppress (if you can do so), especially if you're indoors.
Posted by: Ed L
--------
Ed L, You use appropriate ammo for it. Repeated tests have shown that 5.56/.223 in its 55 gr boat tail variety actually tumbles and keyholes--makes a mess of soft targets, not so much hard surfaces or even dry wall. If you add soft point, etc. to the mix for items like the M1 Carbine or open tip match rounds expand violently but at minimal risk.
Most pistol cartridges, on the other hand, are quite bad about over penetrating and you have to watch expanding rounds as some of those are tailored for pistols, not PCC's and in a PCC actually expand LESS than from a pistol (depends on the particular powder burn speed for that).
Simply put, with six in firing range, you will run out of time with a shotgun, a PCC will possibly work, but a rifle has a greater surety in ending the fight with one shot per customer. Rifles give you less of a chance of playing a harp is all.
Posted by: Ed L
--------
Ed L, You use appropriate ammo for it. Repeated tests have shown that 5.56/.223 in its 55 gr boat tail variety actually tumbles and keyholes--makes a mess of soft targets, not so much hard surfaces or even dry wall. If you add soft point, etc. to the mix for items like the M1 Carbine or open tip match rounds expand violently but at minimal risk.
Most pistol cartridges, on the other hand, are quite bad about over penetrating and you have to watch expanding rounds as some of those are tailored for pistols, not PCC's and in a PCC actually expand LESS than from a pistol (depends on the particular powder burn speed for that).
Simply put, with six in firing range, you will run out of time with a shotgun, a PCC will possibly work, but a rifle has a greater surety in ending the fight with one shot per customer. Rifles give you less of a chance of playing a harp is all.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:03 PM (JAi95)
197
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM (Y/u0P)
----
Will you just look at all that smartness!
----
Will you just look at all that smartness!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:03 PM (JwHpX)
198
Be timed. And judged. And move.
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM (Y/u0P)
That hairstyle is, frankly, not attractive.
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM (Y/u0P)
That hairstyle is, frankly, not attractive.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2023 09:03 PM (sM1IA)
199
Thanks, but it's really just human nature. Keeping score incentivizes you to do your best. I really wish more people would believe me on this. Are you going to suck at first? Probably. Just get over the stage fright and performance anxiety and go shoot a match. Everyone there had a first match day too, and will stop what they're doing to help you out.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:53 PM
Definitely. I owe a lot to a few people who looked at a 12 yr old RMBS's targets and pushed me to enter my first 3-position match. It got interesting from there.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 08:53 PM
Definitely. I owe a lot to a few people who looked at a 12 yr old RMBS's targets and pushed me to enter my first 3-position match. It got interesting from there.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 09:04 PM (aQy7p)
200
What's a FCP and a PCC?
(apologies for ignorance)
(apologies for ignorance)
Posted by: Ciampino - TMS for NMR at December 10, 2023 09:06 PM (qfLjt)
201
Itinerant Alley Butcher, I had the same problem loading 147 g truncated cones in my S&W FPC.
I did a chamber casting and found that the rifling came almost right up to the chamber. Not so with my S&W M&P. The rifling pushed the round into the case. Also kept it from ejecting an unfired round.
I had to reduce powder amount to keep from overpressure.
I did a chamber casting and found that the rifling came almost right up to the chamber. Not so with my S&W M&P. The rifling pushed the round into the case. Also kept it from ejecting an unfired round.
I had to reduce powder amount to keep from overpressure.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:06 PM (HCxzI)
202
RMBS, I have all the stuff to level and mount a scope. If you want to head north some weekend, just let me know.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:00 PM (HCxzI)
----
I'd trust RI Red to do it correctly.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM
I'm game. Never a bad thing to hang in Free America for a day.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:00 PM (HCxzI)
----
I'd trust RI Red to do it correctly.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:01 PM
I'm game. Never a bad thing to hang in Free America for a day.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 09:06 PM (aQy7p)
203
Repeated tests have shown that 5.56/.223 in its 55 gr boat tail variety actually tumbles and keyholes--makes a mess of soft targets, not so much hard surfaces or even dry wall.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:03 PM (JAi95)
Yup. Facts are nasty little buggers!
My ultimate home defense weapon is going to be a suppressed Tavor X95.
Once I leave the People's Republic of New Jersey and move to America.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:03 PM (JAi95)
Yup. Facts are nasty little buggers!
My ultimate home defense weapon is going to be a suppressed Tavor X95.
Once I leave the People's Republic of New Jersey and move to America.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2023 09:06 PM (sM1IA)
204
re Scope Leveling (i.e. Alignment)
Probably to the horror of Weasel, resulting in my permanent banning, lately I've been using this doo-dad to level my scopes:
https://arisakadefense.com/optic-leveler-small/
I'm using it with NightForce scopes - the manuals state you can use the bottom of the turret-mount housing for leveling.
Accuracy? I'm not sure but it's been working within MOA of Gref. (That's not saying much!) But how accurately can you 'read' a bubble level?
It's simple and fast to use, making it very useful to me. YMMV.
Probably to the horror of Weasel, resulting in my permanent banning, lately I've been using this doo-dad to level my scopes:
https://arisakadefense.com/optic-leveler-small/
I'm using it with NightForce scopes - the manuals state you can use the bottom of the turret-mount housing for leveling.
Accuracy? I'm not sure but it's been working within MOA of Gref. (That's not saying much!) But how accurately can you 'read' a bubble level?
It's simple and fast to use, making it very useful to me. YMMV.
Posted by: Gref at December 10, 2023 09:06 PM (5fDan)
205
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 09:04 PM (aQy7p)
---
I can sit next to someone and coach them and usually get them to hit something, but having to put it together in a complete package by yourself is when you start to get it.
---
I can sit next to someone and coach them and usually get them to hit something, but having to put it together in a complete package by yourself is when you start to get it.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:07 PM (JwHpX)
206
Repeated tests have shown that 5.56/.223 in its 55 gr boat tail variety actually tumbles and keyholes
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:03 PM (JAi95)
With sufficient velocity. Those 10.5" barrels are problematic.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:03 PM (JAi95)
With sufficient velocity. Those 10.5" barrels are problematic.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2023 09:07 PM (sM1IA)
207
Not quite accurate---like most things, it is a combination of factors including threats, whether they are armed or not, disparate force on their side, and so on.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM (JAi95)
----
Attack lions?
Posted by: Ciampino
I don't really joke about self defense law. Simply put, for lethal self defense to be on the table, your adversaries must demonstrate objectively to the reasonable person (objective in most states, subjective in a few) that the criminals have the intent, opportunity, and ability to cause you severe harm or death. Even if six grown men are unarmed, it is possible that they constitute a deadly threat because one person against six is likely to end up badly for the one. Aka Disparate force analysis.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 08:48 PM (JAi95)
----
Attack lions?
Posted by: Ciampino
I don't really joke about self defense law. Simply put, for lethal self defense to be on the table, your adversaries must demonstrate objectively to the reasonable person (objective in most states, subjective in a few) that the criminals have the intent, opportunity, and ability to cause you severe harm or death. Even if six grown men are unarmed, it is possible that they constitute a deadly threat because one person against six is likely to end up badly for the one. Aka Disparate force analysis.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:08 PM (JAi95)
208
Lights out time at Kaserne Van Owen. Thank you, Weasel, once again for the thread, and see you next time!
Posted by: That SOB Van Owen at December 10, 2023 09:08 PM (PWe8a)
209
Just wanted to say hi. No range activity - too much holiday activity.
Posted by: Iris at December 10, 2023 09:09 PM (n3DL0)
210
My apology for fat fingering the silicon/silicone post, my full attention wasn't present. However, the procedure WORKS.
I've used this method for years with no adverse effects. Y'all may use it or not, as you choose.
I've used this method for years with no adverse effects. Y'all may use it or not, as you choose.
Posted by: irongrampa at December 10, 2023 09:09 PM (KATBx)
211
If you have 70 MOA total elevation in your scope, you have 35 up and 35 down. If you put a 30 MOA rail on it, then dial your elevation down 30 to zero your rifle at 100 yards, you're looking thru the bottom 5 MOA of your lens. A lot of scopes aren't nearly as good when you're looking thru the edges of the lens.
Posted by: ck at December 10, 2023 09:09 PM (ljHmZ)
212
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:03 PM (JAi95)
You're right. I was thinking mostly about 7.62mm NATO/.308 or .30-06. 5.56mm won't cut through cover or home walls like battle rifle/deer rifle rounds will.
You're right. I was thinking mostly about 7.62mm NATO/.308 or .30-06. 5.56mm won't cut through cover or home walls like battle rifle/deer rifle rounds will.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 09:09 PM (yRXSd)
213
I can sit next to someone and coach them and usually get them to hit something, but having to put it together in a complete package by yourself is when you start to get it.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:07 PM
*nods sagely*
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:07 PM
*nods sagely*
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 09:10 PM (aQy7p)
214
Any non-fantasy book that you would recommend to try him out?
Posted by: Ciampino - To Time travel at December 10, 2023 08:54 PM (qfLjt)
Well, if you're not including science fiction in "fantasy", then his Hammer's Slammers series is a great one. The Lt. Leary series is good scifi, too.
Hammer's Slammers, first three:
Hammer's Slammers (1979)
At Any Price (1985)
Counting the Cost (1987)
Lt. Leary/RCN first three:
With the Lightnings (199
Lt. Leary, Commanding (2000)
The Far Side of the Stars (2003)
His single non-fiction work:
Window of Opportunity: A Blueprint For The Future (1984)
w/ Newt and Marianne Gingrich?!
Posted by: Ciampino - To Time travel at December 10, 2023 08:54 PM (qfLjt)
Well, if you're not including science fiction in "fantasy", then his Hammer's Slammers series is a great one. The Lt. Leary series is good scifi, too.
Hammer's Slammers, first three:
Hammer's Slammers (1979)
At Any Price (1985)
Counting the Cost (1987)
Lt. Leary/RCN first three:
With the Lightnings (199
Lt. Leary, Commanding (2000)
The Far Side of the Stars (2003)
His single non-fiction work:
Window of Opportunity: A Blueprint For The Future (1984)
w/ Newt and Marianne Gingrich?!
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 09:10 PM (HMvgH)
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 09:12 PM (aQy7p)
216
Greg, I use that arisaka leveler in conjunction with bubble levels.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:13 PM (HCxzI)
217
With sufficient velocity. Those 10.5" barrels are problematic.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo
--------
CBD,
You need about 3000 fps for upset along with the bullet being boat tailed but that is quite reachable with average 55 gr and a 16 inch barrel. XM193 runs about 3300 fps and even .223 loads commonly are about 3100 fps or so nowadays. Tweren't always true in the past. And that is for FMJ. Open tip varmint or marksman competition rounds at PBR typically cause horrific surface injuries due to fragmentation with less penetration. Soft points, a bit more penetration and less fragmentation.
Pretty much most bullets at approximately 2300-2400 fps and above will also create a horrific sized temporary wound cavity that can have an outsized effect relatively to the size of the wound.
Shotgun slugs can do the same but the penetration risk is horrible as is recovery time in shooting them in a six person attack squad scenario. Time is of the essence under such circumstances and you need to be the fastest with the mostest.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo
--------
CBD,
You need about 3000 fps for upset along with the bullet being boat tailed but that is quite reachable with average 55 gr and a 16 inch barrel. XM193 runs about 3300 fps and even .223 loads commonly are about 3100 fps or so nowadays. Tweren't always true in the past. And that is for FMJ. Open tip varmint or marksman competition rounds at PBR typically cause horrific surface injuries due to fragmentation with less penetration. Soft points, a bit more penetration and less fragmentation.
Pretty much most bullets at approximately 2300-2400 fps and above will also create a horrific sized temporary wound cavity that can have an outsized effect relatively to the size of the wound.
Shotgun slugs can do the same but the penetration risk is horrible as is recovery time in shooting them in a six person attack squad scenario. Time is of the essence under such circumstances and you need to be the fastest with the mostest.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:13 PM (JAi95)
218
CBD @ 203- Tavor!
I had the good luck and timing to fire our buddy’s Tavor this summer. Not suppressed, but good optic. Which he failed to turn on before he hand it off to me. I still hit the bull. I want one.
I had the good luck and timing to fire our buddy’s Tavor this summer. Not suppressed, but good optic. Which he failed to turn on before he hand it off to me. I still hit the bull. I want one.
Posted by: Eromero at December 10, 2023 09:14 PM (NxC5+)
219
Just one dude approaching me, screaming, threatening and causing me worry is enough for me to deserve the benefit of the doubt about defending myself. I always have my pepper spray in my pocket. And it's my call whether I cross the street, spray them in the face or draw and shoot.
I will not be a victim.
I will not be a victim.
Posted by: nurse ratched at December 10, 2023 09:14 PM (0XtpM)
220
Posted by: Ciampino - TMS for NMR at December 10, 2023 09:06 PM (qfLjt)
PCC: Pistol Caliber Carbine. Examples: CZ Scorpion, SiG Sauer MCX, H&K SP5, Extar EP9.
FPC: Folding Pistol caliber Carbine. A new 9mm carbine from S&W that can literally fold in half in order to become more compact.
PCC: Pistol Caliber Carbine. Examples: CZ Scorpion, SiG Sauer MCX, H&K SP5, Extar EP9.
FPC: Folding Pistol caliber Carbine. A new 9mm carbine from S&W that can literally fold in half in order to become more compact.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 09:15 PM (yRXSd)
221
Well said, Nurse. I use to tell my young associates that, until you’ve argued in court in front of a judge and a bunch of your peers, you ain’t a lawyer.
You have to put the stress on yourself and see how you perform.
You have to put the stress on yourself and see how you perform.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:15 PM (HCxzI)
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 09:15 PM (MeG8a)
223
207
Even if six grown men are unarmed, it is possible that they constitute a deadly threat because one person against six is likely to end up badly for the one. Aka Disparate force analysis.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:08 PM (JAi95)
----
Very true. Look at that teen student in Las Vegas, getting kicked in the head until he was a goner.
*we can do without the rest of the analysis, thank you. - Weasel*
Even if six grown men are unarmed, it is possible that they constitute a deadly threat because one person against six is likely to end up badly for the one. Aka Disparate force analysis.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:08 PM (JAi95)
----
Very true. Look at that teen student in Las Vegas, getting kicked in the head until he was a goner.
*we can do without the rest of the analysis, thank you. - Weasel*
Posted by: Ciampino - Backhoe ...... at December 10, 2023 09:16 PM (qfLjt)
224
>>> I did a chamber casting and found that the rifling came almost right up to the chamber. Not so with my S&W M&P. The rifling pushed the round into the case. Also kept it from ejecting an unfired round.
I had to reduce powder amount to keep from overpressure.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red
I recall that, what in the last two months here?
It's why I decided to do plunk tests to make sure it would be compatable with all my 9mm pistols. It is not.
Now if I had a 9mm PCC or SMG I'd go for it and have the freebore extended if need be. Just be very careful to keep the ammo segregated and clearly labeled "For PCC and Ruger Use Only"
I had to reduce powder amount to keep from overpressure.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red
I recall that, what in the last two months here?
It's why I decided to do plunk tests to make sure it would be compatable with all my 9mm pistols. It is not.
Now if I had a 9mm PCC or SMG I'd go for it and have the freebore extended if need be. Just be very careful to keep the ammo segregated and clearly labeled "For PCC and Ruger Use Only"
Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at December 10, 2023 09:16 PM (cOq4q)
225
it is possible that they constitute a deadly threat because one person against six is likely to end up badly for the one. Aka Disparate force analysis.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:08 PM (JAi95)
And this is where the jury comes in. If they've all seen Bruce Lee take on 12 guys and beat them to a pulp and believe that stuff, you will have a harder time reaching them than if they've all been there with someone threatening them and realize even fighting one person can be iffy. Prosecutors are always looking for dumb jurors when trying to railroad someone, for that very reason. (Smart jurors do things like freak out when the prosecutor aims a gun around the courtroom, including at the jury.)
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:08 PM (JAi95)
And this is where the jury comes in. If they've all seen Bruce Lee take on 12 guys and beat them to a pulp and believe that stuff, you will have a harder time reaching them than if they've all been there with someone threatening them and realize even fighting one person can be iffy. Prosecutors are always looking for dumb jurors when trying to railroad someone, for that very reason. (Smart jurors do things like freak out when the prosecutor aims a gun around the courtroom, including at the jury.)
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 09:18 PM (HMvgH)
226
Well, my new Beretta Tomcat which failed on its virgin outing at the Texas MoMe has now been shipped to the Beretta factory where it continues to baffle the big guys.
Apparently we won't hear anything about the progress; they will just notify our gunsmith when a gun (whether it is the original or a brand spanking new replacement) is being shipped back....
I don't think that's any way to run a railroad, but I am just a mere Moronette....
Apparently we won't hear anything about the progress; they will just notify our gunsmith when a gun (whether it is the original or a brand spanking new replacement) is being shipped back....
I don't think that's any way to run a railroad, but I am just a mere Moronette....
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, Texas - Ace of Spades Ladies Brigade, plucky comic relief at December 10, 2023 09:18 PM (SRRAx)
227
You're right. I was thinking mostly about 7.62mm NATO/.308 or .30-06. 5.56mm won't cut through cover or home walls like battle rifle/deer rifle rounds will.
Posted by: Ed L
------
Yowza, you roll heavy Ed L..
I like shotguns too but under the scenario of six guys, you need the speed and putdown power of a rifle bullet to have a chance. The M1 Carbine is also of great comfort here as the NYPD Stakeout Squad and other Special Tactical teams in the day found out if you loaded them with soft or hollowpoints (most M1 Carbines will feed softpoint bullets, hollow points may not shoot reliably without gunsmithing work and that is what the Stakeout squad did with theirs.)
Posted by: Ed L
------
Yowza, you roll heavy Ed L..
I like shotguns too but under the scenario of six guys, you need the speed and putdown power of a rifle bullet to have a chance. The M1 Carbine is also of great comfort here as the NYPD Stakeout Squad and other Special Tactical teams in the day found out if you loaded them with soft or hollowpoints (most M1 Carbines will feed softpoint bullets, hollow points may not shoot reliably without gunsmithing work and that is what the Stakeout squad did with theirs.)
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:19 PM (JAi95)
228
FPC: Folding Pistol caliber Carbine. A new 9mm carbine from S&W that can literally fold in half in order to become more compact.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 09:15 PM
Brandon Herrera's thoughts on a certain S&W FPC.
https://youtu.be/eiicOIp9xu4?si=rwmD-1quLgy3ILuX
Worth watching the whole thing, though.
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 09:15 PM
Brandon Herrera's thoughts on a certain S&W FPC.
https://youtu.be/eiicOIp9xu4?si=rwmD-1quLgy3ILuX
Worth watching the whole thing, though.
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 09:19 PM (aQy7p)
229
I've used this method for years with no adverse effects.
Posted by: irongrampa at December 10, 2023 09:09 PM (KATBx)
Most likely because you're cleaning the weapon, too. You're not spraying the silicone and just expecting ti to do its job forever.
Posted by: irongrampa at December 10, 2023 09:09 PM (KATBx)
Most likely because you're cleaning the weapon, too. You're not spraying the silicone and just expecting ti to do its job forever.
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 09:19 PM (HMvgH)
230
216 Greg, I use that arisaka leveler in conjunction with bubble levels.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:13 PM (HCxzI)
Hmm. I should double-check the Arisaka result using a different method, but if I do and get a different solution, which is correct? I should shoot more test rounds to check the the accuracy using the Arisaka doo-dad. That may or may not happen.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:13 PM (HCxzI)
Hmm. I should double-check the Arisaka result using a different method, but if I do and get a different solution, which is correct? I should shoot more test rounds to check the the accuracy using the Arisaka doo-dad. That may or may not happen.
Posted by: Gref at December 10, 2023 09:20 PM (5fDan)
231
And this is where the jury comes in. If they've all seen Bruce Lee take on 12 guys and beat them to a pulp and believe that stuff, you will have a harder time reaching them than if they've all been there with someone threatening them and realize even fighting one person can be iffy. Prosecutors are always looking for dumb jurors when trying to railroad someone, for that very reason. (Smart jurors do things like freak out when the prosecutor aims a gun around the courtroom, including at the jury.)
Posted by: GWB
---------
Harder to do where I live and I live where I do for a reason. That is also where you as a defendant must have access to expert witnesses. That is where firearm training that you have taken under reliable instructors shines. Sometimes, you can hire your trainer as an expert witness and the Air Marshal that trained George Zimmerman effectively did that on the stand for Zimmerman to his benefit. That way, Zimmerman did not have to take the stand and the video he shot with cops going over the scene could be commented on by the defense's expert witness.
Posted by: GWB
---------
Harder to do where I live and I live where I do for a reason. That is also where you as a defendant must have access to expert witnesses. That is where firearm training that you have taken under reliable instructors shines. Sometimes, you can hire your trainer as an expert witness and the Air Marshal that trained George Zimmerman effectively did that on the stand for Zimmerman to his benefit. That way, Zimmerman did not have to take the stand and the video he shot with cops going over the scene could be commented on by the defense's expert witness.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:22 PM (JAi95)
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:22 PM (JwHpX)
233
I worry about going deaf.
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 09:15 PM (MeG8a)
Gives you a good excuse to not talk to the cops. "What?! I can't hear you! I probably should text my lawyer and go to the hospital! Maybe we can talk after that!"
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 09:15 PM (MeG8a)
Gives you a good excuse to not talk to the cops. "What?! I can't hear you! I probably should text my lawyer and go to the hospital! Maybe we can talk after that!"
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 09:23 PM (HMvgH)
234
Apparently we won't hear anything about the progress; they will just notify our gunsmith when a gun (whether it is the original or a brand spanking new replacement) is being shipped back....
I don't think that's any way to run a railroad, but I am just a mere Moronette....
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth
---------
Sorry it happened to you.
I don't think that's any way to run a railroad, but I am just a mere Moronette....
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth
---------
Sorry it happened to you.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:23 PM (JAi95)
235
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:19 PM (JAi95)
One of the guys I buy collectable firearms from is putting his FN SCAR 17S on the block to pay his hospital bills. It includes a ELCAN scope, six magazines, a Surefire light, and a Giessle trigger for $5,500. Supposedly, it's never been shot (by him, at least). Thoughts?
One of the guys I buy collectable firearms from is putting his FN SCAR 17S on the block to pay his hospital bills. It includes a ELCAN scope, six magazines, a Surefire light, and a Giessle trigger for $5,500. Supposedly, it's never been shot (by him, at least). Thoughts?
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 09:25 PM (yRXSd)
236
Thx, Weasel for the thread and for the weekly commenters.
On a separate note,
Lurkers, if you want to delurk and ask firearms related questions, there is no better thread to do so.
On a separate note,
Lurkers, if you want to delurk and ask firearms related questions, there is no better thread to do so.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:26 PM (JAi95)
237
Greg, the arisaka will level the scope with respect to the rifle. Then you can use a level to see if the rifle is level with respect to your local world.
Of course, shooting it is the real test.
Of course, shooting it is the real test.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:26 PM (HCxzI)
238
Thanks for hosting, Weasel!
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 09:26 PM (yRXSd)
239
Lurker tonight, but thank you Weasel-San for pulling this together and thanks to all the commenters for their insights and wisdom!
Posted by: Commissar Hrothgar (hOUT3) ~ Next year in Corsicana - again! ~ at December 10, 2023 09:27 PM (hOUT3)
240
Thanks for being here whig and EdL!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:27 PM (JwHpX)
241
And Hrothgar, too!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:28 PM (JwHpX)
242
One of the guys I buy collectable firearms from is putting his FN SCAR 17S on the block to pay his hospital bills. It includes a ELCAN scope, six magazines, a Surefire light, and a Giessle trigger for $5,500. Supposedly, it's never been shot (by him, at least). Thoughts?
Posted by: Ed L
-----
It should hold its value as SCARs are scarce on the ground, let alone one that is fully setup and scarcely used.
Meant to tell you that AIM Surplus has a few of the rare aluminum alloy frame High Powers made I think for Austrian police in the day. Dunno about condition but they want about 800 or so for it and it takes regular High Power mags and is full size except quite a bit lighter.
Posted by: Ed L
-----
It should hold its value as SCARs are scarce on the ground, let alone one that is fully setup and scarcely used.
Meant to tell you that AIM Surplus has a few of the rare aluminum alloy frame High Powers made I think for Austrian police in the day. Dunno about condition but they want about 800 or so for it and it takes regular High Power mags and is full size except quite a bit lighter.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:29 PM (JAi95)
243
In case you missed the Food thread and won't be at the ONT:
SpaceX launch set for tonight has been postponed to tomorrow.
https://is.gd/GKbaqx
Actually TWO launches tomorrow (Monday).
Two launches are scheduled for Monday. First is Falcon Heavy at 8:14pm est. Second is a Falcon 9 at 11:00pm est.
I'll try and update with links tomorrow.
SpaceX launch set for tonight has been postponed to tomorrow.
https://is.gd/GKbaqx
Actually TWO launches tomorrow (Monday).
Two launches are scheduled for Monday. First is Falcon Heavy at 8:14pm est. Second is a Falcon 9 at 11:00pm est.
I'll try and update with links tomorrow.
Posted by: Ciampino - Have Backhoe, will travel at December 10, 2023 09:31 PM (qfLjt)
244
Thanks for the thread and all the good advice, Weasel!
Posted by: RedMindBlueState at December 10, 2023 09:31 PM (aQy7p)
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:32 PM (JwHpX)
246
Thanks Weasel. Keep the utoob vids coming. You are doing good on the selections. Always informative or entertaining.
Posted by: Gref at December 10, 2023 09:34 PM (5fDan)
247
Howdy Horde, Weasel! Getting in under the wire this week. No shewtin this week again unfortunately but I have some PTO coming up and I look forward to making best use of my time. Thanks for your efforts Weasel! Great reading as usual, and thanks to all the morons who make this a great source of knowledge and entertainment.
Posted by: Dag Nabbits, formerly 10 Gallon Hat at December 10, 2023 09:34 PM (p4R6i)
248
Thanks, as always, Weasel.
I figured out decades ago that I could learn a lot by keeping my mouth shut and listening to people with more experience than I.
There isn’t a week that goes by here where I don’t learn something new.
I figured out decades ago that I could learn a lot by keeping my mouth shut and listening to people with more experience than I.
There isn’t a week that goes by here where I don’t learn something new.
Posted by: Dearth Plethora, f/k/a RI Red at December 10, 2023 09:35 PM (HCxzI)
249
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:29 PM (JAi95)
Thanks, Whig. Now I have to see if my checkbook can take the hit. See you next week!
Thanks, Whig. Now I have to see if my checkbook can take the hit. See you next week!
Posted by: Ed L at December 10, 2023 09:37 PM (yRXSd)
250
Thanks, Whig. Now I have to see if my checkbook can take the hit. See you next week!
Posted by: Ed L
See ya. Take pix if you get it for the gun thread. I have only seen a SCAR in person once at the range and the same for a Tavor.
Posted by: Ed L
See ya. Take pix if you get it for the gun thread. I have only seen a SCAR in person once at the range and the same for a Tavor.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:38 PM (JAi95)
Posted by: The Fourth Shot at December 10, 2023 09:38 PM (a3Q+t)
252
Thanks, weasel!
Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 10, 2023 09:39 PM (MeG8a)
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:41 PM (JwHpX)
254
Gah. Just in from work, a far TOO long day, at work.
As in +400 miles of driving kind of day. Happy that I'm off, tomorrow.
Great Gun Thread, what'd I miss? I'm going to Tritrium School, t'nite! Grateful, too. Something I can geek out over.
And, I'll pile on in the Pro-Vortex sweepstakes, here. The Viper PST line is amazing, and the Razor series of glass will, I think, rival Nightforce in all but physical durability. But the glass itself is phenomenal.
Frankly, I don't know how Nightforce fits all that fine glass into a truck axle, but that's about how their stuff holds up. I've got one on my Ruger M-77 African, and it's understandable why they dominate their market segment(s).
Bravo Zulo, Weasel. And I'm happy to be here late, vs. not at all!
Jim
Sunk New Dawn
Galveston, TX
As in +400 miles of driving kind of day. Happy that I'm off, tomorrow.
Great Gun Thread, what'd I miss? I'm going to Tritrium School, t'nite! Grateful, too. Something I can geek out over.
And, I'll pile on in the Pro-Vortex sweepstakes, here. The Viper PST line is amazing, and the Razor series of glass will, I think, rival Nightforce in all but physical durability. But the glass itself is phenomenal.
Frankly, I don't know how Nightforce fits all that fine glass into a truck axle, but that's about how their stuff holds up. I've got one on my Ruger M-77 African, and it's understandable why they dominate their market segment(s).
Bravo Zulo, Weasel. And I'm happy to be here late, vs. not at all!
Jim
Sunk New Dawn
Galveston, TX
Posted by: Jim at December 10, 2023 09:43 PM (e6UQI)
255
10 Print "Weasel's "Do you have too much ammo?" Determination Protocol"
20 Print
30 Print "Are you on fire? (Y/N)"
40 Input Ans1
50 Print "Are you drowning? (Y/N)"
60 Input Ans2
70 Print
80 If Ans1 OR Ans2 = "Y" Then Print "Yes." Else Print "No."
10 Print "Weasel's "Do you have too much ammo?" Determination Protocol"
20 Print
30 Print "Are you on fire? (Y/N)"
40 Input Ans1
50 Print "Are you drowning? (Y/N)"
60 Input Ans2
70 Print
80 If Ans1 OR Ans2 = "Y" Then Print "Yes." Else Print "No."
Posted by: Duncanthrax at December 10, 2023 09:48 PM (a3Q+t)
256
Posted by: Jim at December 10, 2023 09:43 PM (e6UQI)
-----
Thanks, Jim. And glad to hear that Vortex is holding up. I've shot with some of their senior management and engineers and they're a great bunch of guys very committed to the shooting sports.
-----
Thanks, Jim. And glad to hear that Vortex is holding up. I've shot with some of their senior management and engineers and they're a great bunch of guys very committed to the shooting sports.
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:48 PM (JwHpX)
257
Thanks Weasel and gub horde. I learned stuff. See you after the holidays. Be good(ish).
Posted by: TRex at December 10, 2023 09:50 PM (IQ6Gq)
258
Thanks, again, Weasel, for the weekly goodness!
Give all the critters a scritch for us! (Except maybe the goat.)
Give all the critters a scritch for us! (Except maybe the goat.)
Posted by: GWB at December 10, 2023 09:52 PM (HMvgH)
259
Posted by: TRex at December 10, 2023 09:50 PM (IQ6Gq)
----
Enjoy the holidays TRex and Grateful!
----
Enjoy the holidays TRex and Grateful!
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:53 PM (JwHpX)
260
Is BASIC even still a thing?
Posted by: Spc Agt Hammon Eggar at December 10, 2023 09:54 PM (nfrXX)
261
DuncanAnthrax,
I actually do have too much ammo due to circumstances of inheriting it. Problem is that the person loading it was not that careful nor did he document his loads very accurately so I have to pull bullets and remove the powder to be on the safe side.
If you have ammo that you feel is not that safe to shoot, you can have too much ammo too!!!.
I actually do have too much ammo due to circumstances of inheriting it. Problem is that the person loading it was not that careful nor did he document his loads very accurately so I have to pull bullets and remove the powder to be on the safe side.
If you have ammo that you feel is not that safe to shoot, you can have too much ammo too!!!.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:54 PM (JAi95)
262
/feeb sock
Posted by: Oddbob at December 10, 2023 09:55 PM (nfrXX)
263
260 Is BASIC even still a thing?
Posted by: Spc Agt Hammon Eggar
Yep if you don't mind running Linux. Dunno about any windows based compilers for it anymore.
Even Cobol is still around.
Posted by: Spc Agt Hammon Eggar
Yep if you don't mind running Linux. Dunno about any windows based compilers for it anymore.
Even Cobol is still around.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:56 PM (JAi95)
Posted by: Weasel at December 10, 2023 09:58 PM (JwHpX)
265
I have some Vortex stuff, and I think their higher end stuff is excellent. Their low-end stuff? Well, they guarantee it for life, so when it stops working (two of my red dots) they repair or replace without question.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2023 09:58 PM (sM1IA)
266
263 260 Is BASIC even still a thing?
Posted by: Spc Agt Hammon Eggar
Yep if you don't mind running Linux. Dunno about any windows based compilers for it anymore.
Even Cobol is still around.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:56 PM (JAi95)
All humans were killed by the COBOL Y2K bug before they were killed by Global Warming, Net Non-Neutrality, Donald Trump, COVID-19, and Zionism.
Posted by: Spc Agt Hammon Eggar
Yep if you don't mind running Linux. Dunno about any windows based compilers for it anymore.
Even Cobol is still around.
Posted by: whig at December 10, 2023 09:56 PM (JAi95)
All humans were killed by the COBOL Y2K bug before they were killed by Global Warming, Net Non-Neutrality, Donald Trump, COVID-19, and Zionism.
Posted by: Gref at December 10, 2023 10:03 PM (5fDan)
267
Late but range report for the record:
I had a great day at the range with the Nurse, her oldest boy, Lazy Messenger and a bunch of handguns.
I was shooting my CZ P07 and I was feeling mighty fancy. I shot 5 rounds at 7 yrds and got a 1" group. Then I pushed back to 10 yards, fired 10 yards...and got another 1" group. At this point, put the gun down and switched to something else. Can't beat that with my eyes. And this was the CA P07 without a red dot. Damn fine platform.
Another reason the CZ P07 is great is that they make (made?) an OEP Kadet slide for the pistol, so I can use the same frame and trigger and shoot .22s out of it. The problem is that I was getting failures to feed with the first two rounds of the 10 round mag. It was oddly inconsistent though. Sometimes it worked fine, other times I had the same failures to feed. More research is needed but I'm thinking it's a spring that's failing.
Anyway, great day at the range.
I had a great day at the range with the Nurse, her oldest boy, Lazy Messenger and a bunch of handguns.
I was shooting my CZ P07 and I was feeling mighty fancy. I shot 5 rounds at 7 yrds and got a 1" group. Then I pushed back to 10 yards, fired 10 yards...and got another 1" group. At this point, put the gun down and switched to something else. Can't beat that with my eyes. And this was the CA P07 without a red dot. Damn fine platform.
Another reason the CZ P07 is great is that they make (made?) an OEP Kadet slide for the pistol, so I can use the same frame and trigger and shoot .22s out of it. The problem is that I was getting failures to feed with the first two rounds of the 10 round mag. It was oddly inconsistent though. Sometimes it worked fine, other times I had the same failures to feed. More research is needed but I'm thinking it's a spring that's failing.
Anyway, great day at the range.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at December 10, 2023 11:34 PM (xcxpd)
268
260 Is BASIC even still a thing?
Posted by: Spc Agt Hammon Eggar at December 10, 2023 09:54 PM (nfrXX)
----
Pixy had a link to one that runs on several platforms. The server was too busy at the time and I don't remember the link.
Posted by: Spc Agt Hammon Eggar at December 10, 2023 09:54 PM (nfrXX)
----
Pixy had a link to one that runs on several platforms. The server was too busy at the time and I don't remember the link.
Posted by: Ciampino - GOTO Tech thread. at December 11, 2023 12:13 AM (qfLjt)
269
Valuable inf᧐. Lucky me I discovered your websіte accidentally, and I am surprised why this accident didn't came about earlier!
I bookmarқed it.
I bookmarқed it.
Posted by: definable at December 14, 2023 02:42 PM (6NoHn)
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