Update to Last Post

I think the real objection to my criticism of Gaetz is really, "C'mon dude, he offered a single-word sneer on Twitter at McCarthy, it's no big deal and you're acting like a spazz."

And I agree with the first part of that -- it is no big deal. The one thing is no big deal, and I understand why people would object to making a big deal about it.

But like I said in the thread, as I began to collect my thoughts better, I'm just tired of the whole idea that trolling is good politics. I think that Romney and other Establishment c***s***ers have dishonestly painted themselves as dignified, sober, and responsible, and have claimed that they should control the party due to their claimed dignity, sobriety, and responsibility.

And what has wound up happening is that these c***s***ers' false conflation of themselves with dignity, sobriety, and responsibility has made those virtues seem maybe a bit like false virtues that liars wear like costumes to many. And it's sullied those virtues, and has made their opposites seem, if not virtuous, at least more honest.

But the Romney wing's false pieties do not make piety wrong. The Romney wing's false nobility doesn't make nobility ignoble.

It just makes them ridiculous puffed up moralizing narcissist and liars.

I'm just pining for a return to a more traditional sense of what is considered good political behavior, without the bad example of Romney and Ryan poisoning the idea that dignified behavior is a good thing, and not necessarily what it has been in the recent past, which is a way to trick the rubes into voting against their own political aspirations and political interests.

These people have constantly made the pitch, "Vote for us, we're the people who act properly."

And many of us said to them in 2015-2016 -- explicitly; I know I said this myself, and some commenters HOWLED it -- "Okay, so you're the 'reputable' people, and that's good, we like voting for the 'reputable' people, but we're going to have to insist that the 'reputable' people actually agree to run on our agenda for once and implement it, otherwise you bet your sweet 'reputable' asses we're voting for the disreputable Trump who will execute our agenda."

And for years and years, the NeverTrumpers have continued to pretend that their agenda is only about "norms" and "standards of behavior."

And when we say to them, if it is only about "norms" and "standards of behavior" -- will you then act with good "norms" and "standards of behavior," but build a wall and begin ejecting illegal aliens, starting with the criminals but then moving through the rest of them?

They answer, "Good Heavens, no! That's racist, you bigot! Illegal aliens are the best of all Americans!"

Which then leads to a renewed understanding that no, this isn't just about "norms" and "standards of behavior" -- this is and always will be an ideological struggle against globalists and nationalists, but the globalists know they have the unpopular side of the issue, so they continue to lie (now there's some good norms right there) and claim it's just about civility and saying please and thank you.

So people have a general suspicion now of people who pretend at public virtue while playing at treason. And I think a lot of the embrace of troll culture is a repudiation of that deceitful mask-wearing by Bill Kristol and the rest of the pious Democrat Wing of the Republican Party.

And for a long time, I was actually all on board with that. I thought that was a necessary repudiation.

But I'm just tired of it now. Shouting "F*** you!" into the faces of the fake moralists was fun and also necessary.

But we need to do more than that. Oh, I know we're doing more than that already. But I mean, we have to move further away from the position of pure rebellion. We've won control of the party* -- to the extent you can control the party -- and yet we're mostly frozen in the posture of burn-it-down rebellion.

We need to start moving from rebellion to making a legacy.

And I sure wouldn't mind a return to public virtue, without the Romney wing attempting to manipulate people with a show of that virtue to con them into accepting the globalist WEF agenda.

I suppose that's why I'm very partial to Ron DeSantis, because he actually is a gentlemen, veteran, scholar, and incredibly effective executive who also is on the right side of the nationalist/globalist and populist/Establishment divides.

Anyway, yes, it was a very minor, stupid thing to give Gaetz grief about. All he said was "McLeavin'."

That is a minor thing I shouldn't have made a big deal about.

It's about this other, bigger thing. I would, yes, like to see a return to a more normal and more dignified level of political behavior, and without the taint of the David Frenches who use that notion as a way to Con the Rubes into voting for Open Borders Forever.

* I realize now that this will be a key point of disagreement. And yes, we don't really control the party. Though I would say we at least have the sort of loose control that causes most in the party to pretend to agree. Which is something.

Betcha no elected Republican calls us "Hobbits" again.

To get to further control, real control, we have to actually do stuff. We have to put forward an actual agenda. The constant teenage rebellion stuff is fun and energizing but it will not actually win over the people we need to win over to form a governing majority in the party.

So that's what my disagreement with Gaetz is about, I guess: Whether the tactics of juvenile rebellion and trolling are still effective, or are stuff you do at the beginning of a rebellion, but not in the middle of consolidation phase.

Posted by: Disinformation Expert Ace at 03:32 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 First

Posted by: BruceWayne at December 06, 2023 03:36 PM (CIS44)

2 I needed more time off to fluff Frank's merkins.

Posted by: Kevin McCarthy at December 06, 2023 03:36 PM (Geoni)

3 I would, yes, like to see a return to a more normal and more dignified level of political behavior, and without the taint of the David Frenches who use that notion as a way to Con the Rubes into voting for Open Borders Forever.

——————

I would like that too, but I don’t think it’s possible now.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at December 06, 2023 03:37 PM (u73oe)

4 The reason I didn't like the Gaetz tweet is that he ARRANGED the "quit" and now we have BARELY a majority because they get their panties in a bunch instead of working together to destroy the dem machine. Save your snark for the Left. And McCarthy should stick it out. And I have ZERO issues with snarking as long as it's to bring down the LEFT. Ridicule is necessary. The left includes Romney, Cheney and Ryan, btw.

Posted by: dagny, first of her name at December 06, 2023 03:38 PM (U8kCF)

5 Ace stomped his own thread

Posted by: It's me donna at December 06, 2023 03:38 PM (n2vyf)

6 "It's about this other, bigger thing. I would, yes, like to see a return to a more normal and more dignified level of political behavior, and without the taint of the David Frenches who use that notion as a way to Con the Rubes into voting for Open Borders Forever."

I agree. However, it's not going to happen unless there are real consequences for the globalists and their agenda. "Cvility" right now is just a ruse.

Posted by: Geoff Shotts at December 06, 2023 03:38 PM (13ivK)

7 But I'm just tired of it now.

I'm tired of just about everything. Sigh.

Posted by: Notorious BFD at December 06, 2023 03:39 PM (V8he0)

8 If we can’t get back to civilized politics, can we have senators beating each other with canes on the senate floor?

Posted by: Duke Lowell at December 06, 2023 03:39 PM (u73oe)

9 So, Ace, it sounds like you belong to the Mike Johnson fan club, b/c he is everything you want.

Now, we just need to elect more Mike Johnsons to the House and Senate...

Posted by: Nova Local at December 06, 2023 03:39 PM (exHjb)

10 Thanks Ace, for recentering the discussion.

Posted by: Moonbeam at December 06, 2023 03:40 PM (rbKZ6)

11 Another mass shooting at University of Nevada Las Vegas. Reports of 28 people shot, supposedly the gunman is dead.

Posted by: No Shirt Shylock at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (PWI4f)

12 Good Gaetz: "Oh Mr. McCarthy my good man and solid conservative, going back on all of your promises is quite alright. In fact it is preferred. Thank you for your honorable service."

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (17s+e)

13 Before 100, but I'm listening to UNLV cop scanner. Sounds like the firing is continuing, cops don't have key cards and are breaking down doors.

Posted by: Lincolntf at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (2cS/G)

14 It's about this other, bigger thing. I would, yes, like to see a return to a more normal and more dignified level of political behavior, and without the taint of the David Frenches who use that notion as a way to Con the Rubes into voting for Open Borders Forever.
---
I think most of us would like to see a return to politics of days gone by where politicians tried at some level to serve their constituents.

Unfortunately, that's no longer the case. They are--for the most part--only interested in self-gratification, paid for by people who do NOT have our best interests at heart.

We could perhaps return to that idyllic state in the future, but there's going to be a lot of pain and agony first.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (QxAkH)

15 We need gutter fighters who'll play dirty.

Dignity can return when there's a price for trying to fake it.

Posted by: XTC at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (sm6Pk)

16 I like Civility.

I like implementing conservative policies.

I'd like them both.

But I like implementing conservative policies more.

Posted by: Tex Lovera at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (wtvvX)

17 Good post, Ace. Thanks for clarifying.

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (JrojV)

18 Dignity? We were talking about congress, no?
Congress has some of the most undignified people I've ever wished I'd never heard of.
Mostly Dems, but not exclusively.

Posted by: gourmand du jour at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (MeG8a)

19 If we made a habit of hanging for treason, there would be less of it.

Posted by: torabora at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (OUiUM)

20 I too would like to see a return to normal in our political discourse. But that comes with assumptions. It assumes that we have two parties that act as a loyal opposition to one another. It assumes that one party wouldn't use law enforcement, or lack of it, as weapons against the other. It assumes that one party does not regularly refer to the other as a threat to democracy itself.

Posted by: Rusty Nail at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (J7t3H)

21 But I'm just tired of it now. Shouting "F*** you!" into the faces of the fake moralists was fun and also necessary.

-

?

We haven't addressed the 2020 steal. We're not even talking about it. We've got the U.S. military engaging citizens on U.S. soil at the direction of a british intelligence officer to censor and negate the 1st Amendment in political discussions.

We haven't reached the gentlemanly part yet. We haven't even reached the "shouting f*ck you" part yet.

2020 happened. Pretending it didn't won't change it. Allowing 2024 to reinforce it won't improve things.

We can't return to anything because that stuff was all pretend.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (sIl7T)

22 I would, yes, like to see a return to a more normal and more dignified level of political behavior

social media and the chase of going "viral" has forever ended those days -- politicians are now brands -- influencers looking for likes and retweets

Posted by: brak at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (AR07F)

23 11 Another mass shooting at University of Nevada Las Vegas. Reports of 28 people shot, supposedly the gunman is dead.
Posted by: No Shirt Shylock at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (PWI4f)

There was one in Austin yesterday with 6 dead and multiple injures... The FBI has been busy

Posted by: It's me donna at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (n2vyf)

24 Unfortunately the media and the left (birm) have made a return to normalcy impossible on any terms other than complete surrender to their ideology

Posted by: LASue at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (Ed8Zd)

25 Or maybe we could bring back dueling.

*Ted Cruz smacks Dick Durbin in the face with a glove*

I DEMAND SATISFACTION, SIR!

Posted by: Duke Lowell at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (u73oe)

26 I’m sure there were tons of Roman blogs with posts about how the next emperor was really going to turn things around because he’s “our guy”.

But it didn’t work out for them too well. At some point you have to realize that we are in the declining empire stage, and these people we talk about all the time aren’t going to be able to stop it. Hell, they aren’t even moderately talented people.

Nope, it’s time to start stealing and getting away with whatever you can.

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (uKeRS)

27 >>>I'm tired of just about everything. Sigh.

I'm zo tired az vell.

Posted by: Lily Von Shtup at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (KRtlO)

28 If we made a habit of hanging for treason, there would be less of it.
Posted by: torabora

Disagree. The traitors would just get better at concealing it.

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (JrojV)

29 We'll find out the shooter is an IC asset.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (R4t5M)

30 13 Before 100, but I'm listening to UNLV cop scanner. Sounds like the firing is continuing, cops don't have key cards and are breaking down doors.
Posted by: Lincolntf at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (2cS/G)

Surprised this is not yet getting east coast or national coverage...

Posted by: Nova Local at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (exHjb)

31 I suppose that's why I'm very partial to Ron DeSantis, because he actually is a gentlemen, veteran, scholar, and incredibly effective executive who also is on the right side of the nationalist/globalist and populist/Establishment divides.

++++

Yes. Exactly.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (t/2Uw)

32 I suppose that's why I'm very partial to Ron DeSantis, because he actually is a gentlemen, veteran, scholar, and incredibly effective executive who also is on the right side of the nationalist/globalist and populist/Establishment divides.

—

#MeToo

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (tJsiW)

33 Let's just be honest, voting on the right is exhausting.

For them, two steps forward, one step back. For us, one step forward, two steps back. Except it is probably more 5 and 1.

It is simply exhausting. That being said, the left does a great job tearing down our side to where we just lose the will to support someone. And that is on top of our side tearing our own side down.

I'm a supporter of Trump, but I have no desire to tear down all others just to show my support. I like DeSantis, but can acknowledge his elect-ability issues.

Again, it is exhausting, and whether we like it or not the battlefield is often prepped by the other side - to our detriment.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (sX1BW)

34 1 seat majority .... we will get nothing done. Except what the democrats want: including amnesty

Posted by: jb at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (uMKQo)

35 To me, this post and the last one sound like a variation on the theme "If we only had better candidates . . . ." Or "This isn't who we are."

I don't think that dignity, decorum, civility, or like virtues will achieve much of anything. None of our opponents respect those values. It's a street fight. I understand folks who don't want that (because no one rational does), but if someone else decides you're in a street fight you are, whether you want to be or not.

Posted by: You're not going back to "normal" at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (ttzpt)

36 >>> Unfortunately the media and the left (birm) have made a return to normalcy impossible on any terms other than complete surrender to their ideology

hm, well I agree. I guess I didn't really clarify anything, including my own thoughts.

Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM (KRtlO)

37 I'm just really getting tired of people we elect into positions of responsibility who just want to use their jobs as Congressmen as an entree to the job they really want, Social Media Influencer.

===
I had mistakenly presumed you were referencing Mrs. Luntz.

Posted by: San Franpsycho at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM (RIvkX)

38 Has there been ANY discussion of the 2020 steal or what would be done at the federal level if the (R) contestants were allowed to win in any of the (R) debates?

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM (sIl7T)

39 There was one in Austin yesterday with 6 dead and multiple injures... The FBI has been busy
==

There was? A black man did it so was there really a mass shooting? Not sure today but by tomorrow there will not have been a mass shooting by a career black male criminal.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM (17s+e)

40 The guy says the shooter is dead. Someone mistook the noise of breaking doors for more gunshots.

Posted by: Lincolntf at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM (2cS/G)

41 Once we let corporations and other non state (50) actors campaign contribute the citizens lost control of their politicians.

Plus 17th Amendment.

Posted by: torabora at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM (OUiUM)

42 So Ace, you're saying I have a chance?

Posted by: Liz Cheney at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM (7eFYL)

43 There was? A black man did it so was there really a mass shooting? Not sure today but by tomorrow there will not have been a mass shooting by a career black male criminal.
Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM (17s+e)

Didn't hear he was black... All I heard was ex-Military

Posted by: It's me donna at December 06, 2023 03:45 PM (n2vyf)

44 Surprised this is not yet getting east coast or national coverage...

The media has to know the shooter's race and politics before they can decide if it's newsworthy.

Posted by: Only Certain Crimes Are News at December 06, 2023 03:45 PM (ttzpt)

45 1 seat majority .... we will get nothing done. Except what the democrats want: including amnesty

Posted by: jb
===

And the difference since the beginning of the year would be what then exactly?

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at December 06, 2023 03:45 PM (17s+e)

46 I'm smart. I can do stuff.

Posted by: Fredo at December 06, 2023 03:45 PM (OUiUM)

47 42 So Ace, you're saying I have a chance?
Posted by: Liz Cheney at December 06, 2023 03:44 PM

Don't you have a hunt planned with your Dad this weekend?

Posted by: Scuba_Dude at December 06, 2023 03:46 PM (Oq/TM)

48 hm, well I agree. I guess I didn't really clarify anything, including my own thoughts.

------------------

Online content is about eyeballs - not clarification. So consider it a win!

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 03:46 PM (sX1BW)

49 I used to like politicians who had a modicum of class. But that's no who we are anymore.

I'll settle for competent. Trump was competent for my three political priorities:

1. Kill terrorists
2. Cut my taxes
3. Punch a hippy

Posted by: Field Marshal Zhukov at December 06, 2023 03:46 PM (nnp+f)

50 What i want is quiet brutality.

Show, don't tell.

Act like you've been there before. Act like no one should be surprised that you just ended seventy swamp creatures career with a ten word executive order. Act like shuttering an entire cabinet department is just something one does on a Tuesday. Act like the televised natterings of idiots with special little pins on their lapels is worth as much notice as the squeak of a mouse running from a lawnmower. Stop acting like the world owes you a three day Triumph because you made a sound come out of your face.

Quiet, steady, industrious brutality.

Posted by: Warai-otoko at December 06, 2023 03:46 PM (9UlRk)

51 28 victims? 😳

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:46 PM (tJsiW)

52 To get to further control, real control, we have to actually do stuff. We have to put forward an actual agenda. The constant teenage rebellion stuff is fun and energizing but it will not actually win over the people we need to win over to form a governing majority in the party.

So that's what my disagreement with Gaetz is about, I guess: Whether the tactics of juvenile rebellion and trolling are still effective, or are stuff you do at the beginning of a rebellion, but not in the middle of consolidation phase.
++++
To do that requires bringing the Party leadership to heel and making them deliver or purge them.

McCarthy got purged. Doing that requires some rebellion.

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at December 06, 2023 03:46 PM (kBSKe)

53 Guy in Texas was white 36 yr old who killed his parents first in a "gruesome" manner.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (t/2Uw)

54 hm, well I agree. I guess I didn't really clarify anything, including my own thoughts.

Posted by: ace

That's OK, Ace. You seemed to be in a really bad mood in your original post, so maybe you just had to get it off your chest. We all have to do that from time to time. You seem much mellower now.

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (JrojV)

55 FIRST!!!!!

Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (Zz0t1)

56 I don't think returning to normal order is possible. The Dems have reached a critical mass of crazy leftism from which there is no return. When Barky said on 10/30/08 that we are only days away from fundamentally changing this nation that was the signal to let the freak flags fly. The GOPe cannot cope with the fact that a civil war is occurring. It's gonna keep getting uglier .

Posted by: Smell the Glove at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (wukIh)

57 But the Romney wing's false pieties do not make piety wrong. The Romney wing's false nobility doesn't make nobility ignoble.
---
Right, you have to weigh facade nobility from the level of nobility you actually have.

Eric Swallwell goes around doing the Democrat's worst version of Joe McCarthy, accusing Tucker Carlson of being a mouthpiece for Putin.

When the Democrats whine so much about Joe McCarthy--that's "dignity".

Or Adam Schiff's bad impersonation of Edward G. Robinson in his reading of the Ukraine call transcript to try to make nothing into impeachable.

There's not a whole lot of dignity--other than pretend--in our Capitol. It's just that the DC party and the Demedia are 24/7 at work in presenting the case that things really run well with the Core Party in charge.

When it's a shitshow.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (krQz2)

58 >>>38 Has there been ANY discussion of the 2020 steal or what would be done at the federal level if the (R) contestants were allowed to win in any of the (R) debates?

I mean not really. Does Trump really talk about actual plans or actual agenda items? Pass this partcular reform? He doesn't. He just grumbles about having had the election stolen.

You need to make a specific ask, like "We need to limit absentee balloting" and "we need all signatures to be verified" and "we need voter rolls purged" etc.

This is why I can't take him. You have the stage, you've gotten the attention, now present your plan. Oh? You don't have one, you're just complaining.

Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (KRtlO)

59 We have to put forward an actual agenda.

-------------

Who is we?

The base has an agenda. The GOPe has a different one.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (sX1BW)

60 53 Guy in Texas was white 36 yr old who killed his parents first in a "gruesome" manner.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (t/2Uw)

I thought that was the case... By his name

Posted by: It's me donna at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (n2vyf)

61 That is a minor thing I shouldn't have made a big deal about.

===
Every thread eventually becomes a movie thread.

Posted by: San Franpsycho at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (RIvkX)

62 Democrats don't want amnesty any more than Republicans. It gives them both something to fight about and not solve.

It's like a football game without a clock. They just keep playing and we just keep paying.

Posted by: torabora at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (OUiUM)

63 “Didn't hear he was black”

You know the rule. If race isn’t mentioned he’s non-white.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (tJsiW)

64 Betcha no elected Republican calls us "Hobbits" again.

Why not? McCain earned a tongue bath from the MSM for it and unless I'm misremembering, got reelected afterwards.

Posted by: Oddbob at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (nfrXX)

65
As Andrew Breitbart used to say:

"Politics is downstream from culture".

Just where does western culture go to get downstream from the hellish place we are at? What politics fuction in a depraved society?

Yudhishthira's Dice had it right last thread about money and street gangs, problem is, then we're them.

Posted by: Auspex at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (j4U/Z)

66 Quiet, steady, industrious brutality.
Posted by: Warai-otoko

Dudicus!

Posted by: Vespasian at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (7eFYL)

67 ... Again, it is exhausting, and whether we like it or not the battlefield is often prepped by the other side - to our detriment.
Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 03:43 PM (sX1BW)
++++
Because the GOP never, ever, for any reason, wants to pick the battlefield. There are a lot of reasons for that, but it doesn't change the reality.

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (kBSKe)

68 My biggest beef with "McLeavin" is how lame and shitty it was. It doesn't rhyme, it doesn't riff on McCarthy's real name, it shows no wit or comedy at all. It's just a cheap shot by a dimwitted attention-whoring asshole with dogshit taste in women hoping to appease the McCarthy-hating clapping seals. Is that really the best that Gaetz and his army of consultants and assistants could come up with?

Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (iFTx/)

69 >>I don't think returning to normal order is possible. The Dems have reached a critical mass of crazy leftism from which there is no return. When Barky said on 10/30/08 that we are only days away from fundamentally changing this nation that was the signal to let the freak flags fly. The GOPe cannot cope with the fact that a civil war is occurring. It's gonna keep getting uglier .

I agree

Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (KRtlO)

70 I get that idea. We want folks to act like adults while doing the right thing. The problem was, we over-weighted the "act like adults" thing to overlook doing the wrong thing, constantly, to our own repeated detriment. And folks got sick of it.

Have things swung too far the other way? Maybe. That case can be made. But until those "sophisticates" stop voting against the needs of the people, well, expect things to get even uglier. I don't like it, but that's got nothing to do with it.

Posted by: Brother Tim sez at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (Px5D+)

71 Thanks for the re-thinking, Ace.
I don’t want to be the Debby-downer, but …
We have some mighty tough waters to navigate before anything like a normal, noble form of government might be obtained.
All the daily squabbles are ginned up to get us normies distracted from the fact we no longer have a representative government.
The Oligarchy is not leaving without a literal fight. Our little circular debating/ firing squads will not change that.

Posted by: RI Red at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (CTjQI)

72 50 Quiet, steady, industrious brutality.
Posted by: Warai-otoko at December 06, 2023 03:46 PM (9UlRk)

Frog March 2000 Federal Employees to prison, and when the media asks, answer "What employees? There were never any employees!"

Posted by: XTC at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (sm6Pk)

73 Ace,
What you suggest is impossible because simply put--the center cannot hold anymore. If you care to go back to previous times in US History or even elsewhere, big fundamental changes to the status quo are usually driven by the extremes in the debate. That is why Marquis de Lafayette ended up on the trash heap of politics after the ancien regime fell.

The sober administrator types that you yearn for generally occur after one side or the other wins emphatically and then that person begins to consolidate their victories. Aka realignment theory which also coincides with the idea that history has natural turning points.

And by the way, many Bushies felt the same way after the Reagans gave way to Bushism. GHWB fired virtually all Reaganauts in office in order to put his type of establishment GOP types in power. There were also snide remarks by GOPe types at the time that Reagan supporters were a cult both before and after his election and simply not realistic re the Soviet Union.

Posted by: Pete Townsend at December 06, 2023 03:49 PM (JAi95)

74 Good Gaetz: "Oh Mr. McCarthy my good man and solid conservative, going back on all of your promises is quite alright. In fact it is preferred. Thank you for your honorable service."
Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at December 06, 2023 03:41 PM (17s+e)

Actually just tweeting "Thank you for your service" would both be polite AND an epic troll.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 06, 2023 03:49 PM (eoQWY)

75 ace, are you hoping for altruism from politicians? prepare to be disappointed

disclaimer: I am a black-hearted cynic

Posted by: Don Black at December 06, 2023 03:49 PM (geLO8)

76 I think the memory of a polite and dignified US congress is false - given what we have learned in the past 3- 4 years about the existence and strength of the deep state and their globalist masters, we've no doubt had a deeply corrupt system of government for decades They just kept it hidden and the public in the dark.. Or maybe they didnt feel the need to flex until they saw disaster on the horizon when Trump was elected

Posted by: LASue at December 06, 2023 03:49 PM (Ed8Zd)

77 The GOPe cannot cope with the fact that a civil war is occurring. It's gonna keep getting uglier .

--------------

The war or the battle field contestants?

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 03:49 PM (sX1BW)

78 I'm just tired of the whole idea that trolling is good politics. I think that Romney and other Establishment c***s***ers have dishonestly painted themselves as dignified, sober, and responsible, and have claimed that they should control the party due to their claimed dignity, sobriety, and responsibility.

The GOPe (and their media gatekeepers) very much play the "respectable, civilized, socially acceptable" card to keep interlopers out. We're past the time of formal Lincoln-Douglas debates, I'm afraid. If you are a reasonable, well-spoken candidate, you're a boring bland Governor Burgum, who gets no media traction and his campaign withers.

You have to say outlandish things to get the mainstream attention as an outsider...and that's what got Trump's foot in the door over others like Herman Cain, Ben Carson, etc. Same, to a lesser extent, as DeSantis...he trolls and zings his opponents, and that gets him attention. It's the game you have to play to have a seat at the table as an outsider.

It's also how you get the attention of Zoomers and the youth. All they see is short clips on YouTube, TikTok, etc, so you need quippy clips of yourself burning your opponents.

Posted by: Moron Analyst at December 06, 2023 03:49 PM (k9qXe)

79 The federales are broke, busted and bankrupt; morally, spiritually and financially.

Abolish the federal government.

A Man Can Dream.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at December 06, 2023 03:49 PM (mQ8ar)

80 The Dems act like adults while turning us into a 3rd world dictatorship. But it’s a dictatorship with gravitas.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (tJsiW)

81 Illegal aliens are the best of all Americans!"
.......

That's good because we just got 49,000 more of them since Saturday.

Posted by: wth at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (v0R5T)

82 I don't think returning to normal order is possible. The Dems have reached a critical mass of crazy leftism from which there is no return.

Posted by: Smell the Glove at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (wukIh)
---
They just advance the Globalist causes and call it "normal order", because they've never seen a word they couldn't change to do more work for their causes.

We need a fighter. Trump was a fighter.

Ron, who looks like a great fighter in Florida, is looking more like Scott Walker on the national stage--and Walker was fire in Wisconsin.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (krQz2)

83 68 My biggest beef with "McLeavin" is how lame and shitty it was. It doesn't rhyme, it doesn't riff on McCarthy's real name, it shows no wit or comedy at all. It's just a cheap shot by a dimwitted attention-whoring asshole with dogshit taste in women hoping to appease the McCarthy-hating clapping seals. Is that really the best that Gaetz and his army of consultants and assistants could come up with?
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (iFTx/)

It's most likely a riff on Christopher Mintz-Plasse's character from Superbad, "McLovin".

Posted by: XTC at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (sm6Pk)

84 @77 yes

Posted by: Smell the Glove at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (wukIh)

85 Just to show how effective Alinsky’s focusing on your target is you know DeSantis was listed as 5’11 on the Yale baseball roster which means he’s probably 5’10. That’s not ‘short’ but I assume most people think he’s 5’8 or shorter.

Posted by: Drive by at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (MNhXM)

86 Ace it sounds as if you are ready to declare victory.

What victories have been won that we can now start to "consolidate?"

We debate regularly in the comments whether this is a nation of laws, a democracy, whether we still have rights, who may be listening?

Posted by: San Franpsycho at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (RIvkX)

87 We tried civility. The left took it as weakness.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (u73oe)

88 Quiet, steady, industrious brutality.

Read Kipling's poem "Et Dona Ferentis." It's about how the polite the English are until you pisss 'em off too much. Then:

"White and breathing through their nostrils,
Silent, systematic, swift,
They removed, effaced, abolished all that man could heave or lift."

That was the old England. And what they and we need to get back to.

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (JrojV)

89 To me it's Deep State and Marxist VS us

Posted by: Skip at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (fwDg9)

90 I think the memory of a polite and dignified US congress is false -

-------------

Wait until they see how the first Congress behaved.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (sX1BW)

91 >>>Why not? McCain earned a tongue bath from the MSM for it and unless I'm misremembering, got reelected afterwards.

because of the example of Liz Cheney. The base is much more willing to discipline elected officials that defy them.

I know, people like Romney get re-elected. But he's like a Mormon Saint in Utah and I'm starting to wonder how conservative Utah actually is. (It might also be that Utahns are especially keen on the point of public virtue.)

Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (KRtlO)

92 >As Andrew Breitbart used to say:

"Politics is downstream from culture".

what if culture is an open sewer

Posted by: Don Black at December 06, 2023 03:51 PM (geLO8)

93 They're stooping to democrat levels.

They're better than that.

That's not who they are.

Show some class.

Be better than they are.

You know what? That hasn't been working for the past, I don't know, few generations.

Wallow in the muck a bit. Americans really don't seem to care that much anymore. Democrats are dirty, evil, foul mouthed obnoxious pricks that have been handing us our ass for a while now.

Does it suck that they don't seem to ever infight? Yes. Because they don't care. The only time they care is when someone tells the actual truth. THEN they band together and destroy them. Look how they're treating RFK Jr.

Politics is a cesspool of diseases feces, so I don't see much wrong with acting like it sometimes.

Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 03:51 PM (Zz0t1)

94 "And, to conclude, Mr. Speaker, the nation can no more go ahead under such a state o'things, than a fried eel can swim upon the steam o' a tea kettle; if it can, then take these yar legs for yar hall pillars."

Posted by: Kindltot at December 06, 2023 03:51 PM (D7oie)

95 Until this is addressed none of it matters.

Again, this is Pearl Harbor level news (that no one will discuss)

---------

November 28

CTIL Files #1: US And UK Military Contractors Created Sweeping Plan For Global Censorship In 2018, New Documents Show
Whistleblower makes trove of new documents available to Public and Racket, showing the birth of the Censorship Industrial Complex in reaction to Brexit and Trump election in 2016

Another explains that while such activities overseas are "typically" done by "the CIA and NSA and the Department of Defense," censorship efforts "against Americans" have to be done using private partners because the government doesn't have the "legal authority."

https://tinyurl.com/ywry4xcl

--

But Trump is exhausting or something.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 03:51 PM (sIl7T)

96 Ace, are you really not going to vote for Trump if he's the nominee? I remember you were anti-Trump in the 2016 primaries before he became the de facto nominee. Then you switched to fully pro-Trump. I think you'll switch again.

Posted by: Nova Lassiter at December 06, 2023 03:51 PM (8A3Oh)

97 Oh and FUCK "Candidate Quality"!

I would push a dumpster fire to DC at this point.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 03:51 PM (krQz2)

98 Guy in Texas was white 36 yr old who killed his parents first in a "gruesome" manner.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice)
===

First articles I read was stated that he was black and career criminal. If so I'm wrong on this and admit to being duped.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at December 06, 2023 03:52 PM (17s+e)

99 We haven't even approached the levels of F*CK YOUs that are needed. Not even close.

Posted by: tsj017 at December 06, 2023 03:52 PM (nO4H1)

100 Posted by: SH (no more socks)
.......

You might get some for Christmas.

Posted by: wth at December 06, 2023 03:52 PM (v0R5T)

101 But Trump is exhausting or something.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 03:51 PM (sIl7T)
---
Exactly.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 03:52 PM (krQz2)

102 I don't think returning to normal order is possible. The Dems have reached a critical mass of crazy leftism from which there is no return. When Barky said on 10/30/08 that we are only days away from fundamentally changing this nation that was the signal to let the freak flags fly. The GOPe cannot cope with the fact that a civil war is occurring. It's gonna keep getting uglier .
Posted by: Smell the Glove at December 06, 2023 03:47 PM (wukIh)
++++
Which means the party will die, like the Whigs did before it.

That's disruptive. It's only happened once in our history and it was one of the immediate causes of the civil war. I don't look forward to that, but I increasingly think that it is inevitable, at least in some fashion.

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (kBSKe)

103 The vibe I am getting from people I talk with is they are exhausted from the drama and just don't want to go through this again for 4 more years.

I think they want Trump to succeed and wish things were different, but they realize that if Trump is elected he will be a lame duck president. He has made too many enemies and they are going to sabotage his whole presidency.

Trump will probably be the nominee and I will vote for him, but he's got to stop alienating people and give people a reason to vote for him other than the Democrats are corrupt.

Posted by: redridinghood at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (NpAcC)

104 This is why I can't take him. You have the stage, you've gotten the attention, now present your plan. Oh? You don't have one, you're just complaining.

Posted by: ace

This is why skipping the debates was unwise. He has made no attempt to convince anyone not already in his camp that he is the best choice. He wants to be anointed. if Biden is not the candidate, he has not convinced Independents ot disaffected Dems that he can do a better job of governing thant some generic Dem who will replace Biden.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (t/2Uw)

105 87 We tried civility. The left took it as weakness.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (u73oe)

As they should've because it was.

Civility is one thing. Civility mixed with an inclination to forever capitulate is another. The dems rightly guessed that the RINOs would dominate and bring the latter along with them.

Posted by: The Central Scrutinizer at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (KbCG3)

106 and I will finish up with:

"What in the nation have you done this year? why, waste paper enough to calculate all your political sins upon, and that would take a sheet for each one o' you as long as the Mississippi. and as broad as all Kentucky. You've gone ahead in doin' nothin' backwards, till the hull nation's done up. You've spouted out a Mount Etny o' gas, chawed a hull Allegheny o' tobacco, spit a Niagary o' juice, told a hail storm o' lies, drunk a Lake Superior o' liquor, and all, as you say, for the good o' the nation; but I say, I swar, for her etarnal bankruptification!"

Posted by: Kindltot at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (D7oie)

107 Good Post Ace, but I think the problem goes beyond politics. We've devolved into a culture that celebrates popularity... and the only way to get popular now, is to get attention.

And the only way to get the MSN's attention, is to either do something shitty, OR, OWN someone so they can, like a Twitter rant, talk about the ownage.

Probably half the anti Repub articles I now see are about 'someone owning someone'... ie about a good comeback. THAT is what the low Intelligence MSN is writing about now... because it's not only easy to write about, but Low Info people, will read it.

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (xaFKb)

108 >>>We tried civility. The left took it as weakness.

I'm not saying compromise. I'm also not saying "civility."

Maybe I'm saying that maybe we shouldn't have a candidate who, when deposed about his statement about grabbing women by the pussies, did not say, as we expected him to, "that was just locker room talk, I was exaggerating, you knuckleheads," but instead said he DID mean what he said, and women really did let powerful men grab them by the pussies, as hundreds of years of history had shown.

You didn't see that? Yeah it wasn't well publicized in conservative media. Believe me, you'll see it in campaign commercials in 2024.

Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (KRtlO)

109 The problem with Congress is that are not enough trials by combat and duels to the death.

These would weed out the riff raff.

Posted by: Archer at December 06, 2023 03:54 PM (gmo/4)

110
It's most likely a riff on Christopher Mintz-Plasse's character from Superbad, "McLovin".
Posted by: XTC at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (sm6Pk)

Back before he was MeToo'd off NCIS, DiNozzo constantly referred to McGee as Mc something, anything, depending on the circumstance.

I mean, it could be a shout out to the British and their Boaty McBoatface thing.

Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 03:54 PM (Zz0t1)

111 because of the example of Liz Cheney. The base is much more willing to discipline elected officials that defy them.

I hope you're right but it seems a little early to extrapolate from a sample size of one.

Posted by: Oddbob at December 06, 2023 03:54 PM (nfrXX)

112 I want to see flying metal chairs and baseball bats in Congress.

Posted by: wth at December 06, 2023 03:54 PM (v0R5T)

113 There was? A black man did it so was there really a mass shooting? Not sure today but by tomorrow there will not have been a mass shooting by a career black male criminal.
Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger

Looks like a cracker to me.

https://tinyurl.com/yc7tjdum

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter Here at December 06, 2023 03:54 PM (FVME7)

114 50 What i want is quiet brutality.

Show, don't tell.

Act like you've been there before. Act like no one should be surprised that you just ended seventy swamp creatures career with a ten word executive order. Act like shuttering an entire cabinet department is just something one does on a Tuesday. Act like the televised natterings of idiots with special little pins on their lapels is worth as much notice as the squeak of a mouse running from a lawnmower. Stop acting like the world owes you a three day Triumph because you made a sound come out of your face.

Quiet, steady, industrious brutality.
Posted by: Warai-otoko
--------
Hate to tell you but Lenin had to die so that Stalin could consolidate the regime and he did it by quietly taking over the thankless job of party administration. If reforms are to stick, you need someone with charisma to sell it first and then a details person to clean up the mess. Details people typically simply don't have much charisma perhaps because they focus less on big pictures to motivate the normies and more on how to achieve a result given certain constraints. Aka the difference between alphas and betas.

Posted by: Pete Townsend at December 06, 2023 03:54 PM (JAi95)

115 Trump did all the bad things. All. The. Bad. Things.

Remember that.

Posted by: Kindltot at December 06, 2023 03:54 PM (D7oie)

116 83 68 My biggest beef with "McLeavin" is how lame and shitty it was. It doesn't rhyme, it doesn't riff on McCarthy's real name, it shows no wit or comedy at all. It's just a cheap shot by a dimwitted attention-whoring asshole with dogshit taste in women hoping to appease the McCarthy-hating clapping seals. Is that really the best that Gaetz and his army of consultants and assistants could come up with?
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 03:48 PM (iFTx/)

It's most likely a riff on Christopher Mintz-Plasse's character from Superbad, "McLovin".
Posted by: XTC at December 06, 2023 03:50 PM (sm6Pk)
_______

Oh I got that. Not sure that's what he was going for, but maybe. But even so: riffing on McLovin is just not funny or clever, and has nothing to do with McCarthy or the overall situation. And if you look at Gaetz' post, he spelled it "McLeavin’" -- what's the apostrophe for?

Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 03:54 PM (iFTx/)

117 I'm starting to wonder how conservative Utah actually is. (It might also be that Utahns are especially keen on the point of public virtue.)
Posted by: ace

—

Utah of 2023 Is not the Utah you think of. That Utah died somewhere in the 2000s.

Two things happened

1. Massive amounts of illegals.
Salt Lake City is something like 25% Hispanic now.

2. A ton of migration from California. Part of that is a function of the tech boom in the SLC area, Silicon Slopes. And the other is just general California locusts who turned AZ blue.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:55 PM (tJsiW)

118 Well written.

The dignity in play is Senator Kennedy pantsing the CLOWNS Biden sends to be judges.

He does it politely, ruthlessly, and vindictively.

Posted by: sven at December 06, 2023 03:55 PM (X0I7i)

119 Until normal Americans finally accept that the RINOs are despicable political prostitutes whose only purpose is to PRETEND to believe in conservative principles while actually being cucks to the leftard tyrants, the necessary revolution to remove from office, convict and then execute for treason every stinking corrupt political slimeball who miraculously turns an annual salary of $175,000 into a multimillion dollar net worth after less than 10 years in DC (looking at YOU Liz Cheney).

The demomarxists are not even subtle about showing their devotion to the corrupt perversion and destruction of children, and the globalist cabal's goal of depopulation and enslavement of the survivors.

We ain't voting our way out of this evil.

Posted by: Pete at December 06, 2023 03:55 PM (9uoO8)

120 Russian disinformation!

Townhall.com
@townhallcom
REPORTER: "Can you explain...why you interacted with so many of your son and brother's foreign business associates?!"

BIDEN: "I did not. It's just a bunch of LIES. They're LIES! I did not. They're lies!"

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter Here at December 06, 2023 03:55 PM (FVME7)

121 We have some mighty tough waters to navigate before anything like a normal, noble form of government might be obtained.

THIS

salty language and sharp retorts are the least of our worries

our nation is bankrupt and on the verge of a currency collapse

Posted by: BlackOrchid at December 06, 2023 03:55 PM (AcWfM)

122 I want to see flying metal chairs

Miss me yet?
-- Zombie Bobby Knight

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 03:55 PM (JrojV)

123 I think the memory of a polite and dignified US congress is false - given what we have learned in the past 3- 4 years about the existence and strength of the deep state and their globalist masters, we've no doubt had a deeply corrupt system of government for decades They just kept it hidden and the public in the dark.. Or maybe they didnt feel the need to flex until they saw disaster on the horizon when Trump was elected
Posted by: LASue at December 06, 2023 03:49 PM (Ed8Zd)

Well there was the time a Congressman beat a Senator in the chamber with a cane so badly he had to spend some years recovering. Massachusetts kept him in office despite that.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 06, 2023 03:56 PM (eoQWY)

124 This is why I can't take him. You have the stage, you've gotten the attention, now present your plan. Oh? You don't have one, you're just complaining.
Posted by: ace

-

Not just Trump, though. I have no idea what legal issues and gag orders are involved there.

Outside of Trump no one has said a thing, even though everyone knows what happened and how. All of it is just pretend, and we voters who watched it happen are supposed to simply go along with it like we did in 2012.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 03:56 PM (sIl7T)

125 This is why Conservatism is a doomed ideology. Ladies and Gents, you are in a gutter fight. The stakes are your personal survival. One does not win a gutter fight with gravitas and decorum.

Posted by: The UniParty Is Real at December 06, 2023 03:56 PM (0tfeq)

126 hiya

Posted by: JT at December 06, 2023 03:56 PM (T4tVD)

127 REPORTER: "Can you explain...why you interacted with so many of your son and brother's foreign business associates?!"

BIDEN: "I did not. It's just a bunch of LIES. They're LIES! I did not. They're lies!"

Yikes.. Get us some shooters STAT

Posted by: The FBI at December 06, 2023 03:56 PM (n2vyf)

128 Gaetz is another attention whore. He had a personal beef with McCarthy and that's what drove his decision. It's hilarious anyone believes this was some big intellectual, principled move. It wasn't. I get that people don't like or trust the GOP. But spend a few minutes understanding how Congress works. When you have a small majority, which is even smaller now, you have to make certain decisions about how you're going to get things done. That's the goal, to get things done. I suppose you can sit around and wait for everyone to see it your way, but that's never how it works. Ever. Meanwhile not doing things means you become less popular with the people, and you lose the majority. But feel better, you were principled or something. The art of legislating is doing the possible. When people see your goal is just to run over tables and never compromise on anything they quit or they love to get you out. Frankly, I'd take 20 McCarthy's over one talentless jerk like Gaetz.

Posted by: Marcus T at December 06, 2023 03:56 PM (NBtzd)

129 Trump: It's been "largely true" "over the last million years" that stars can "grab women by the pussy"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0E4GnMcSycU

Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (KRtlO)

130 I'm not saying compromise. I'm also not saying "civility."

Maybe I'm saying that maybe we shouldn't have a candidate who, when deposed about his statement about grabbing women by the pussies, did not say, as we expected him to, "that was just locker room talk, I was exaggerating, you knuckleheads," but instead said he DID mean what he said, and women really did let powerful men grab them by the pussies, as hundreds of years of history had shown.

-----------------

I do think its possible - maybe unlikely - but possible for Trump to come out and spend next year back on Making America Great Again (or something similar).

Act more "Presidential" - act more serious. "These are serious times Bob ..." That sort of thing.

I guess I also don't know why he needs to attack DeSantis - then again, I don't know why DeSantis wants to attack him. Seems like old school tactics for a different time - for both of them. Serves neither well.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (sX1BW)

131
You didn't see that? Yeah it wasn't well publicized in conservative media. Believe me, you'll see it in campaign commercials in 2024.
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (KRtlO)

If they try to use the "but Trump said pussy" thing again in 24, they're only showing just how f*cked they are in November.

Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (Zz0t1)

132 Somewhat relevant, I'm reading Tom wolfes Radical Chic and the Mau-Maui of the Flak Catchers
The corruption and dirty deals and perverse community organizer/identity politics got a foothold in the US in the 60s and has been gaining strength ever since, with little changing except the names of the players

Posted by: LASue at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (Ed8Zd)

133 Whether the tactics of juvenile rebellion and trolling are still effective, or are stuff you do at the beginning of a rebellion, but not in the middle of consolidation phase.

Rebellion works great up until you're actually firmly in power. That's the problem the Democrats would be having if the media didn't whitewash everything they do; their establishment thinks it's always 1967 (and their up-and-comers think it's always a Spike Lee movie).

Republicans are nowhere near actually firmly in power.

Posted by: Ian S. at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (2ocoG)

134 We haven’t won the Party back, and there is a long and unsightly battle still ahead. Still not the time for gentlemen. I’m starting to think there never is. They just lose ground against the Leftists, who are always fighting.

Posted by: MostlyRight at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (fO3Io)

135 Well there was the time a Congressman beat a Senator in the chamber with a cane so badly he had to spend some years recovering. Massachusetts kept him in office despite that.
Posted by: Oldcat

Preston Brooks and Charles Sumner.
Sumner later became a big backer of Seward's plan to pruchase Alaska from Russia.

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (JrojV)

136 Ace, what part of everything is an Op, everything is fake and everything is gay did you not understand?

Posted by: Pudinhead at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (ntk8v)

137 Trump: It's been "largely true" "over the last million years" that stars can "grab women by the pussy"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0E4GnMcSycU
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (KRtlO)

He's. Not. Wrong.

Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 03:58 PM (Zz0t1)

138 117 I'm starting to wonder how conservative Utah actually is. (It might also be that Utahns are especially keen on the point of public virtue.)
Posted by: ace

—

Utah of 2023 Is not the Utah you think of. That Utah died somewhere in the 2000s.

Two things happened

1. Massive amounts of illegals.
Salt Lake City is something like 25% Hispanic now.

2. A ton of migration from California. Part of that is a function of the tech boom in the SLC area, Silicon Slopes. And the other is just general California locusts who turned AZ blue.
Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:55 PM (tJsiW)
________________

3. Utah colleges and college towns became very popular, attracting younger dipshitted fuckwads who still think Che is cool.

I'm going to Utah on Saturday for a ski trip. I'm there several times a year.

Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 03:58 PM (iFTx/)

139 The progs had a "generational strategy".

That is a strategy of what distortions they were going to push as the last one succeeded, and when they were going to try to get the kids to believe in the next generation.

Conservatives can't create such a strategy. We don't *want* to create such a strategy.

It is antithetical to our politics. However, largely we have not wanted to be embarrassed about staying too culturally the same as well.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 03:58 PM (krQz2)

140 >>> He's. Not. Wrong.

That doesn't mean that a presidential candidate who wants to win should say it. I mean, do you want him to win?

Posted by: Nova Lassiter at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (8A3Oh)

141 I'm also personally tired of grown-ass men having fake internet slap-fights like a bunch of faggots.

If Gaetz has a problem with McCarthy, he should go tell him to his face and they should fistfight each other on the East front of the Capitol building, not take bitch-ass potshots at each other on fucking Twitter.

It's soft-ass bitch behavior.

Posted by: ballistic at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (oqH4h)

142 Florida State is still out of the playoff.

Posted by: G'rump928(c) at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (aD39U)

143 BIDEN: "I did not. It's just a bunch of LIES. They're LIES! I did not. They're lies!"
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter Here
........

Lies, lies, lies, yeah
Lies, lies, lies, yeah
Lies, lies, lies, yeah
Lies, lies, lies, yeah

Posted by: wth at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (v0R5T)

144 Posted by: Pete Townsend at Dec

Let’s not rewrite history

Bush's first major appointment was that of James Baker as Secretary of State; Baker was Bush's closest friend and had served as Reagan's White House Chief of Staff.Bush's first pick for Defense Secretary, John Tower, was rejected by the Senate, becoming the first cabinet nominee of an incoming president to be rejected. Leadership of the Department of Defense instead went to Dick Cheney, who had previously served as Gerald Ford's Chief of Staff and would later serve as vice president under George W. Bush.Kemp joined the administration as Secretary of Housing and Urban Development, while Elizabeth Dole, the wife of Bob Dole and a former Secretary of Transportation, became the Secretary of Labor under Bush.Bush retained several Reagan officials, including Secretary of the Treasury Nicholas F. Brady, Attorney General Dick Thornburgh, and Secretary of Education Lauro Cavazos.

Posted by: Drive by at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (MNhXM)

145 They will do to DeSantis what they did to Trump.

Ditto, Nikki, Christie or anyone else who dares to cross them now.

The mass hysteria around Trump's inauguration was not because of mean tweets. It was because they were thwarted when they thought they had things in the bag.

They will do the same thing to whoever at this point.

They have the bureaucracy, the media, FBI, CIA, Justice Department, Homeland Security, etc.

The Republicans in Congress are compromised just as much as the Democrats. You don't get elected anymore if you aren't.

Trump was an anomaly and they don't mean for his kind to rise again.

Period.

So it doesn't even matter who wins the primary.

We should be nice to each other. We may need to have allies in the camps.

Posted by: Just Lily at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (tAZwP)

146
I'm going to Utah on Saturday for a ski trip. I'm there several times a year.
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 03:58 PM (iFTx/)

I go as well. Park City is obnoxiously leftists these days.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (tJsiW)

147 You didn't see that? Yeah it wasn't well publicized in conservative media. Believe me, you'll see it in campaign commercials in 2024.
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:53 PM (KRtlO)

——————

You can not possibly be serious. The Trump pussy comment wasn’t well publicized? His response wasn’t? Pull the other one, it plays jingle bells.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (u73oe)

148 This is why Conservatism is a doomed ideology. Ladies and Gents, you are in a gutter fight. The stakes are your personal survival. One does not win a gutter fight with gravitas and decorum.
Posted by: The UniParty Is Real at December 06, 2023 03:56 PM (0tfeq)

Correct.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (BdMk6)

149 1. Massive amounts of illegals.
Salt Lake City is something like 25% Hispanic now.

2. A ton of migration from California. Part of that is a function of the tech boom in the SLC area, Silicon Slopes. And the other is just general California locusts who turned AZ blue.
Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:55 PM (tJsiW)

The problem isn't red and blue states, its red and blue areas in each state. What we need is Federalism in the states, a way that the cities / burbs can't ride roughshod over the rest of the state. The Senate gives a counterbalance at the Federal level, this doesn't happen at the state level.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (eoQWY)

150 He's. Not. Wrong.
Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 03:58 PM (Zz0t1)

try saying it to your wife , make is sound like an achievement , then report back

Posted by: runner at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (V13WU)

151 Which means the party will die, like the Whigs did before it.

That's disruptive. It's only happened once in our history and it was one of the immediate causes of the civil war. I don't look forward to that, but I increasingly think that it is inevitable, at least in some fashion.
Posted by: Joe Mannix
--------
We dodged a nascent civil war in 1800 and again in 1814 (Hartford Convention). That resulted in the death of the Federalist party as they never regained the presidency after 1800 and the Battle of New Orleans and Peace undermined the secessionist Hartford Convention.

Simply put, there is a time for decentralization and a time for centralization and the thumb on the scale in the US has been on the national side since 1865 which has resulted in a national government with far more powers but far less competence over time but at the same time many states have developed more and more competence in governing.

Posted by: Pete Townsend at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (JAi95)

152 This is why skipping the debates was unwise. He has made no attempt to convince anyone not already in his camp that he is the best choice. He wants to be anointed.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice)

It's not the best approach from a fair, informed public discourse perspective, but it's absolutely the right call from a political "I need to win the primaries" perspective. Trump commands media attention. He's already WAY ahead of his primary opponents. Attending a debate and drawing attention to alternatives, while in Trump’s position, is stupid. There's no upside.

And, frankly, we've seen the media is not a fair host for debates, so why expose yourself to more leftwing ambushes and unfair moderators than required?

Posted by: Moron Analyst at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (JCZqz)

153 Trump: It's been "largely true" "over the last million years" that stars can "grab women by the pussy"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0E4GnMcSycU
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (KRtlO)

He's. Not. Wrong.
Posted by: Sponge

-

This was right around the time of MeToo and the Kavanaugh silliness, wasn't it?

Right before boys could be girls and shut up if you disagree.

Truth is bad in pretendland.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (sIl7T)

154 "We need to start moving from rebellion to making a legacy."

I agree, ace. Example: I look at twitter every day showing the same outrages as every previous day, like with the homeless. Hey, your leaders won't fix it; they like it.

Time to do the boring but necessary stuff: find good candidates, fund them, and elect them. Do not involve the state GOP if they are moribund. Make the parties fear you politically, not feel sorry for you.

Posted by: PJ at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (G1dq6)

155 *make it

Posted by: runner at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (V13WU)

156 You know what else is racist?

Did you know acne is racist now?

https://tinyurl.com/7rp6bsxx

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter Here at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (FVME7)

157 I think we are way, way, way past the point of giving a sh!t how anyone acts or what they say and only care what they do.

I have actually been encouraged that Gaetz and Tuberville have actually tried to make some of these suckers of other men's cocks live up to their promises and abide the law. I could not care less if their motivations are self-aggrandizing. Hell, it is better if they are because that means we have some control over what they do since no applause occurs for them otherwise.

The only people who have delivered us victories or fought for us have been coarse. So yeah, it would be nice if that were not necessary and we could get the same results otherwise --- but when has that ever happened since the time Reagan bestrode the land like a collosus?

Posted by: Thatch at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (bbi0+)

158 146
I'm going to Utah on Saturday for a ski trip. I'm there several times a year.
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 03:58 PM (iFTx/)

I go as well. Park City is obnoxiously leftists these days.
Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (tJsiW)
_________

Alta is your friend . . . .

Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (iFTx/)

159 Posted by: ballistic at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (oqH4h)

He did tell him to his face.

Posted by: Drive by at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (MNhXM)

160
I agree with you, Ace.

Who wouldn't like to see a return to civility and nobility and actual virtuous behavior?

Except, it's now Saul Alinsky's World and we just live in it.

There isn't a politician living who can survive a fully operational MSM Alinsky assault.

To use an example, DeSantis, your fave. I seriously doubt anyone could truly object to what he's trying to do on our side or even debate against it, but ewwww he's shorty-short-short. He wears high-heels!!! That trannie. Etc Etc.

And that's when they're not outright lying about Trump or DeSantis. It's just raw meat for the Alinsky Mobs.

So, Alinsky it is for the time being. If our side can start collecting some Alinsky scalps, maybe the other side will start to see the value of logical and rationa lpublic debate and dignity.

Don't hold your breath.

Posted by: naturalfake at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (QzZeQ)

161 Taylor Swift is the Time Person of the Year.

We are no longer a serious country.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (t/2Uw)

162 I think the memory of a polite and dignified US congress is false

The idea that any politics has been polite in my lifetime seems delusional to me. When GWB ran, the said he was going to put blacks in chains, invoked the murder of James Beard. They've been calling Republicans racists for virtually any policy difference since I the late 80s/early 90s.

People who hunger for a return to normalcy are really just saying things were better when we took those beatings like whipped dogs instead of responding with "Fuck you."

And of course taking all those beatings so meekly played a role in how things have escalated since.

So count me as a no on the "return to decency" proposition. You don't get to call me a white supremacist, harangue everyone about ending whiteness, vilify and abuse me at every turn, try to ensure there's no platform on which I can dissent or defend myself, try and take away my livelihood etc., and then get a Lincoln-Douglas debate and Robert's Rules of Order from me.

Posted by: Fuck That at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (ttzpt)

163 Maybe I'm saying that maybe we shouldn't have a candidate who, when deposed about his statement about grabbing women by the pussies, did not say, as we expected him to, "that was just locker room talk, I was exaggerating, you knuckleheads," but instead said he DID mean what he said, and women really did let powerful men grab them by the pussies, as hundreds of years of history had shown.

You didn't see that? Yeah it wasn't well publicized in conservative media. Believe me, you'll see it in campaign commercials in 2024.
Posted by: ace at December

He told the truth under oath Im good with that

Posted by: LASue at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (Ed8Zd)

164 >>>You can not possibly be serious. The Trump pussy comment wasn’t well publicized? His response wasn’t? Pull the other one, it plays jingle bells.

The original comment? Yes, it was well publicized. But his deposition comment this year was not well publicized by conservative media. It really wasn't.

Posted by: Nova Lassiter at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (8A3Oh)

165 The idea that women were surprised at golddiggers was maybe the most comical part of any of that.

They'll be the first to backtalk and gossip about it.

Oh, that's right. Men aren't supposed to say that sort of thing about women advancing in the workplace.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (sIl7T)

166 What we need is Federalism in the states, a way that the cities / burbs can't ride roughshod over the rest of the state.

----------

Make the cities smaller.

Red states should have state laws that say: No city can have a population greater than 10% of the state's population. Heck - make it even smaller.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (sX1BW)

167
Alta is your friend . . . .
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (iFTx/)

Oh I know. But I have troglodyte boarder friends who can’t go there so we have to go elsewhere. 😂

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (tJsiW)

168

try saying it to your wife , make is sound like an achievement , then report back
Posted by: runner at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (V13WU)

He said "well, he's not wrong" when it came out the FIRST time. You're thinking she's changed her mind this go around?

Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 04:02 PM (Zz0t1)

169 Give the left credit ... we are actually fighting a battle over whether men can compete in women's sports. I don't blame us on the right for being exhausted.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:03 PM (sX1BW)

170 >>Taylor Swift is the Time Person of the Year.

It's refreshing to have a POTY whose groceries you would eat.

Posted by: garrett at December 06, 2023 04:03 PM (/S2W0)

171 Moving from rebellion to legacy

-

I hate to be the one to break this to you, but we weren't the ones who pulled off a color revolution leading to a coup and then started looting the treasury and jailing political dissidents.

That was rebellion. That is legacy. Heck, look at us already discussing elections like they're normal things again. Didn't even take three years.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 04:03 PM (sIl7T)

172 Conservatives (not Republicans) want someone who plays to win.

Leftists want someone who plays to Kill.

Posted by: XTC at December 06, 2023 04:03 PM (sm6Pk)

173 4 Team College Playoff expands to 12 teams next year. Expect 3 times the amount of bitching next year.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at December 06, 2023 04:03 PM (R4t5M)

174 ou can not possibly be serious. The Trump pussy comment wasn’t well publicized? His response wasn’t? Pull the other one, it plays jingle bells.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at December 06, 2023 03:59 PM (u73oe)

Yeah that was the Dems intended big gotcha though it wasn’t as big as they thought it would be because everyone already knew Trump was a big player . He didn’t go to Studio 54 for the drugs.

Posted by: Drive by at December 06, 2023 04:04 PM (MNhXM)

175 Remember when “You” was times person of the year? So yeah chill out about Tay Tay being named this year. Lol.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:04 PM (tJsiW)

176 >> Maybe I'm saying that maybe we shouldn't have a candidate who, when deposed about his statement about grabbing women by the pussies, did not say, as we expected him to, "that was just locker room talk, I was exaggerating, you knuckleheads," but instead said he DID mean what he said, and women really did let powerful men grab them by the pussies, as hundreds of years of history had shown.

Why? He wasn't wrong.

Posted by: garrett at December 06, 2023 04:04 PM (/S2W0)

177 Trump: It's been "largely true" "over the last million years" that stars can "grab women by the pussy"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0E4GnMcSycU
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (KRtlO)

**

Ahhh the good old days

Posted by: Harvey Weinstein at December 06, 2023 04:04 PM (ZV+pB)

178 It's refreshing to have a POTY whose groceries you would eat.
Posted by: garrett

Um...is that a euphemism for something?

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 04:04 PM (JrojV)

179 The idea that women were surprised at golddiggers was maybe the most comical part of any of that.

Especially in an era where it's "empowering" for women who are a after-6-shots-of-Valu-Rite 4 to say on social media that they won't date a man who doesn't make at least $150,000 a year.

Posted by: Ian S. at December 06, 2023 04:04 PM (2ocoG)

180

4 Team College Playoff expands to 12 teams next year. Expect 3 times the amount of bitching next year.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory

-

Georgia got robbed falling behind #5 FSU without their starting QB.

Michigan
Washington
Georgia
Alabama

was the only realistic playoff for this year.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (sIl7T)

181 Did you know that in the kernel of today's politics on the other side, The Weather Underground, a female could not refuse any male in the club sex if he wanted her?

Who makes women 2nd class citizens? The left.

That sames side is scandalized that somebody said that star-fuckers fuck stars.

That's right Bill Ayers got it from any woman he wanted in the Weather Underground, and Bernadine Dorn was required to give it up to any male in the Weather Underground.

But somebody reminding people of star-fuckers--well that's just too much.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (krQz2)

182 Ace, I only have room for a comment which makes responding to such a fine commentary impossible at the level it demands.

Our public discourse has always been suspended between being a mud wrestling match and thoughtful reasoned discourse. At the risk of proving I know nothing I posit that our current public discourse has become a one sided muddy affair with a stripper pole added to the mix with the exclamation point a YouTube video proclaiming how x destroyed y. You could say I am tired too of this and be right.

The essence of everything it seems is a rush to be the first to seize exaggerated virtue and then use that as a club to break the jaws of the opponent. This is a direct consequence of the escalating cold war between the globalists and nationalists. Our public discourse reflects this state of war. Trump and DeSantis. I admire DeSantis greatly and think he would a fine president.

But Lincoln's thoughts about Grant come to mind: "This man fights." So does Trump better than anybody else imperfect though he maybe. Thank you much for this most thoughtful post, it is exactly why I admire all the good work that goes on here; Thomas Paine would be at home here.

Posted by: Lost in Space at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (P6RSK)

183 Team College Playoff expands to 12 teams next year. Expect 3 times the amount of bitching next year.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at December 06, 2023 04:03 PM (R4t5M)

Yeah but, the arguments between 12 and 13 are about participation trophies. No 2th seed is going to win the Natty.

Posted by: G'rump928(c) at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (aD39U)

184 167
Alta is your friend . . . .
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (iFTx/)

Oh I know. But I have troglodyte boarder friends who can’t go there so we have to go elsewhere. 😂
Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (tJsiW)
________

Snowbird? Park City is nice and I like the funky town. But it's crawling with douchey tourist-types (many from California) and people who aren't really there to ski or board. Snowbird has a better crowd, in my experience. Also better snow.

Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (iFTx/)

185 But his deposition comment this year was not well publicized by conservative media. It really wasn't.
Posted by: Nova Lassiter at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (8A3Oh)

——————

So the Democrats and the media are going to say that Trump is an egotistical blowhard? Oh my stars and garters, say it ain’t so.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (u73oe)

186 >>>Not just Trump, though. I have no idea what legal issues and gag orders are involved there.
Outside of Trump no one has said a thing, even though everyone knows what happened and how.

There are ZERO gag orders that can stop a political candidate from proposing changes in voting laws. This is grasping to make excuses.

As far as everyone else: No one else can talk about it because trump toxifies it and makes it all about him. Again, trump supporters refuse to admit this, but trump is unpopular, and people do not like associating themselves with him.

Yes the polls v. biden, the most unpopular president in history, show trump leading like 44 to 41. Even against biden he can only get 44.

Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (KRtlO)

187 >>Um...is that a euphemism for something?

Why yes. It is.

Posted by: garrett at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (/S2W0)

188 I know what you are talking about Ace. The feeling that you are having, is why I have basically stopped blogging. I just could not defend Trump and the clown show that followed him around.

The MAGA movement has lost it's luster for some now. It lost it's luster for me long ago. The whole "Owning the Libs" thing is tiring and the magic act has gotten stale. But, as long as it get ratings for "Fox News" crowd and others, it will continue.

Furthermore, the GOP house would rather cut it's nose off, in spite of it's face, for political purity. That will kill a majority in a minute.

To be clear, the Left is crazy as hell. But, it seems that the Right as about as crazy, if not worse. Conservatives were supposed to be the "Adults" in the room. Sadly, we have failed at that, badly.

Peace to you,

-Chuck

Posted by: Charles Patrick Adkins at December 06, 2023 04:06 PM (plNsB)

189 Yeah but, the arguments between 12 and 13 are about participation trophies. No 2th seed is going to win the Natty.
Posted by: G'rump928(c)

--

Liberty vs Georgia will be sold out, yo!

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 04:06 PM (sIl7T)

190 The ironic thing for FSU was that it was the ACC Commissioner that nixed the 12 team format starting this year, as the SEC wanted.

Posted by: G'rump928(c) at December 06, 2023 04:06 PM (aD39U)

191 Trump will lose because 15% of Republicans refused to vote for him, and because the Democrat party votes almost 100% against him. Save your prayers for Trump.
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 02:56 PM (KRtlO)

---------------

This is from the last thread and my comment is would these be Republicans that never vote Republican.

Posted by: Decaf at December 06, 2023 04:07 PM (3JfbU)

192
Red states should have state laws that say: No city can have a population greater than 10% of the state's population. Heck - make it even smaller.
Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (sX1BW)

What would that accomplish exactly? It’s not like people vote D because of their zip code.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:07 PM (tJsiW)

193 >>Taylor Swift is the Time Person of the Year.

-
Didja see Time's Twit of the Year's explanation of her success?

TIME
@TIME
Taylor Swift on re-recording her old albums: “I’m collecting horcruxes. I’m collecting infinity stones. Gandalf’s voice is in my head every time I put out a new one. For me, it is a movie now”

-
She didn't mention Yoda so I'm not buying it.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter Here at December 06, 2023 04:07 PM (FVME7)

194 He said "well, he's not wrong" when it came out the FIRST time. You're thinking she's changed her mind this go around?
Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 04:02 PM (Zz0t1)

I am not talking about Trump. you think she'll agree with you ?

Posted by: runner at December 06, 2023 04:07 PM (V13WU)

195 No 2th seed

No 12th seed I typoed.

Posted by: G'rump928(c) at December 06, 2023 04:07 PM (aD39U)

196 The dignity in play is Senator Kennedy pantsing the CLOWNS Biden sends to be judges.
He does it politely, ruthlessly, and vindictively.
Posted by: sven

Pantsing, huh? Awarding style points now? But in the end, each nominee leaves with their clothes on and gets confirmed. But pantsed. Oy

Posted by: SFGoth at December 06, 2023 04:07 PM (KAi1n)

197 Attending a debate and drawing attention to alternatives, while in Trump’s position, is stupid. There's no upside.

++++
yes, it is a typical political move. That's exactly my point. And when Biden is no longer the candidate, he is going to lose. He has no one but his base and Us because we will vote for the Republican but that didn;t put him over the top last time. Remember teh red wave in 2022? Polls sure looked like a red wave but when it came down to it, Dems voted D.
If he truly wanted to save the country and not feed his own ego, he would be competing for the nomination with his ideas and practical plans for getting the country back on track.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 04:08 PM (t/2Uw)

198 There are ZERO gag orders that can stop a political candidate from proposing changes in voting laws. This is grasping to make excuses.

As far as everyone else: No one else can talk about it because trump toxifies it and makes it all about him. Again, trump supporters refuse to admit this, but trump is unpopular, and people do not like associating themselves with him.

Yes the polls v. biden, the most unpopular president in history, show trump leading like 44 to 41. Even against biden he can only get 44.
Posted by: ace

--

I'm no lawyerologist and don't sleep at Holiday Inns, so I wasn't kidding when I said I don't know how discussing legal issues related to legal issues while involved in legal issues can influence someone discussing legal issues.

What I do know is everyone else is pretending everything is normal, even though voter fraud is probably the #1 campaign issue with (R) voters.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 04:08 PM (sIl7T)

199 There's an actual, well-known term for it: starfuckers.

Sometimes known as groupies in yesteryear.

None of this is controversial, not even a little, with normal, well-adjusted adults. It is known.

Trump's sin is that he's unwilling to pretend that the feminist bullshit peddled by the media is reality.

It's weird to see conservatives adopt the same posture.

Posted by: But conservatives aren't what they used to be at December 06, 2023 04:08 PM (ttzpt)

200 171 Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 04:03 PM (sIl7T)

We were color revolutioned by the people we empowered to learn the playbook in durka durka stan....

people still don't get it and I am tired of posting on it.

Night horde....see you whenever.

Posted by: sven at December 06, 2023 04:08 PM (X0I7i)

201 Anyways, I will be content to lose to Texas in the final if it comes to that. I will not be happy to lose to Michigan.

Posted by: G'rump928(c) at December 06, 2023 04:08 PM (aD39U)

202 This is from the last thread and my comment is would these be Republicans that never vote Republican.

-------------

There will be reliable GOP voters who will not vote for Trump.

There will be non-voters who will vote for Trump.

The trick is figuring out which group has more people and where are those people concentrated.

I simply don't know.

Of course, there will also be reliable GOP voters who will not vote if Trump is not the nominee ... and that group may end up very large.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:08 PM (sX1BW)

203 No 2th seed

I hate it when I get a seed in my 2th.

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 04:08 PM (JrojV)

204 trump is gettin the same % of vote as he did before, his numbers are not improving. biden's dropped significantly enough for dems to worry about the efficacy of the big cheat. that's why they want him out.

Posted by: runner at December 06, 2023 04:09 PM (V13WU)

205 Taylor Swift is the Time Person of the Year.

We are no longer a serious country.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (t/2Uw)
_______________

Coulda been worse. Coulda been Dylan Mulvaney.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at December 06, 2023 04:09 PM (MZImN)

206 I have a feeling Taylor's groceries are past the "use by" date.

Posted by: wth at December 06, 2023 04:09 PM (v0R5T)

207 ace you want civility and effectiveness, best of both worlds, and yet we can't even get one

Posted by: anon at December 06, 2023 04:09 PM (RqMDa)

208 I suppose that's why I'm very partial to Ron DeSantis, because he actually is a gentlemen, veteran, scholar, and incredibly effective executive who also is on the right side of the nationalist/globalist and populist/Establishment divides.

---------------

He is so gentlemanly that he wouldn't dream of declining the Establishment's funding. As we all know, Establishment don't want anything in return.

Posted by: Decaf at December 06, 2023 04:09 PM (3JfbU)

209 Sounds like somebody's got Georgia on their mind.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 04:09 PM (krQz2)

210
Snowbird? Park City is nice and I like the funky town. But it's crawling with douchey tourist-types (many from California) and people who aren't really there to ski or board. Snowbird has a better crowd, in my experience. Also better snow.
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (iFTx/)

Problem with both snowbird and Alta and the other canyon resorts is a lack of a town. There’s nothing to do there and very limited lodging options. And you have the horrendous traffic to get up and down.

Park city is an actual ski town, walkable, plenty of places to stay, restaurants, bars, etc.

Asking wise yeah Alta cans be beat. But for the group ski trip experience PC is better.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (tJsiW)

211 I don't understand these posts saying "Trump needs to stand for something."

Do you not recall the economic growth, low inflation, energy independence, rollback of insane regulations, dead Iranian terrorist leader, end of ISIS and the general embrace of Pax Americana during his administration?

The Dems have LIVs, but we have LIPs -- low information posters.

Posted by: Field Marshal Zhukov at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (nnp+f)

212 Shouldn’t college students be, you know, taking classes instead of playing 16 games a season?

I know, it’s driven by gambling.

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (YIxO9)

213 The economy.takes another hit.

The Washington Times
@WashTimes
Surge of detransition lawsuits pose threat to booming gender-transition business

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter Here at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (FVME7)

214 Skiing wise not asking wise.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (tJsiW)

215 >>> Pantsing, huh? Awarding style points now? But in the end, each nominee leaves with their clothes on and gets confirmed. But pantsed. Oy

But he said some cool, fun stuff that really gets under those nominees skin. And it's cool to watch the clips later. And those things are what's really important, right?

Posted by: Nova Lassiter at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (8A3Oh)

216 Let’s not rewrite history

Bush's first major appointment was that of James Baker as Secretary of State; Baker was Bush's closest friend and had served as Reagan's White House Chief of Staff.
-------
Baker was forced on the Reaganites and was actually a prolific leaker during the triumvirate days when he and his patron Bush did not get his way. Casper Weinberger was served by Bush in nearly being crucified over the Iran Contra investigation during the deraged Walsh investigation despite opposing the trade for hostages. Nicholas Brady was Bush's man and a traditional East Coast GOPeite, not Reaganite.

If you notice, each true blue Reaganite was maneuvered out of office and replaced by a GOPe establishmentarian and that is largely why the Reagan revolution died. This was especially true of other West Coast Reaganites in lower offices at the undersecretary level etc. Tower was not really a Reaganite and Cheney definitely was not.

Posted by: Pete Townsend at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (JAi95)

217 Red states should have state laws that say: No city can have a population greater than 10% of the state's population. Heck - make it even smaller.
Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (sX1BW)

What would that accomplish exactly? It’s not like people vote D because of their zip code.

-----------------

I think decentralizing city governance would accomplish a lot. Imagine if Chicago only had 5% of Illinois' total population and not over 20%.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (sX1BW)

218 Snowbird? Park City is nice and I like the funky town. But it's crawling with douchey tourist-types (many from California) and people who aren't really there to ski or board. Snowbird has a better crowd, in my experience. Also better snow.
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (iFTx/)

Yeah, but Park City is in the Epic Pass... which for us Retired Military folks is less than $150 a year.

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 06, 2023 04:11 PM (xaFKb)

219 196 Posted by: SFGoth at December 06, 2023 04:07 PM (KAi1n)

Pantsing, we lack the power to stop the fuckers so all we can do it highlight how literally retarded they are.

Ideally with a civically minded populace people contact their senators democrat and republican and say "what the fuck these clowns do not even know procedural matters a second year judge should know!" and Biden gets told to knock it the fuck off.

You got a classically educated on civics population in your back pocket Goth?

You have a spare 20 Senators in your wallet?

Night, have fun fixing it all by not voting.

Posted by: sven at December 06, 2023 04:11 PM (X0I7i)

220 212 Shouldn’t college students be, you know, taking classes instead of playing 16 games a season?

—

“Students” lol.
Come on man it’s minor league football, who are we kidding. There’s as much a student as Biden is senile.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:11 PM (tJsiW)

221 Ted Kennedy, a drunk who left a girl for dead (she duly died), and whoremonger, was "The Lion of the Senate" and a statesmen. Eulogized like a hero. But Trump? A monster. The Beast of Bergdorf's.

Tell me some more about this dignity.

Posted by: What a clownshow at December 06, 2023 04:11 PM (ttzpt)

222 As far as everyone else: No one else can talk about it because trump toxifies it and makes it all about him. Again, trump supporters refuse to admit this, but trump is unpopular, and people do not like associating themselves with him.

-

Addendum:

States are adding anti-fraud measures left and right when they get the opportunity.

https://tinyurl.com/2xge6af3

But the federal (R)s are remaining quiet.

It's not because Trump said pussy.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (sIl7T)

223 Here is how you take on the federal government:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqUEmn69lrc

Posted by: Archer at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (gmo/4)

224 What would that accomplish exactly? It’s not like people vote D because of their zip code.

They kinda' do.

Look at any map, in any state, as pertaining to party affiliation or voting by party. Compare that to any map of population density. The two track. Freakishly so.

People do, indeed, vote based upon their zip code.

Posted by: The UniParty Is Real at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (0tfeq)

225 TEX v MICH FTW

Posted by: Don Black at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (geLO8)

226 Gaetz got the speaker changed, and the new speaker is actually doing stuff old speaker did not.
That's doing stuff, regardless of tactics.

If I may venture, ace, politics is exhausting and demoralizing and degrading, and that is the nature of it.
I appreciate you and the cobs wading into the muck on our behalf.
I really think the cafe threads and weekend threads are so valuable as they remind us of what really matters, of why it is necessary to wade into muck to preserve what actually matters.

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (EGSGm)

227 205 Coulda been worse. Coulda been Dylan Mulvaney.
Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at December 06, 2023 04:09 PM (MZImN)

It's "Person of the Year", not "Hideous Misshapen Mutant of the Year".

Posted by: XTC at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (sm6Pk)

228 @WashTimes
Surge of detransition lawsuits pose threat to booming gender-transition business
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter Here at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (FVME7)
++++
Good.

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (kBSKe)

229
I think decentralizing city governance would accomplish a lot. Imagine if Chicago only had 5% of Illinois' total population and not over 20%.
Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (sX1BW)

Yeah but the other 15% would not just disappear. They’d still vote the same way just be residents of Chicago 2.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (tJsiW)

230 Of course, there will also be reliable GOP voters who will not vote if Trump is not the nominee ... and that group may end up very large.
Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:08 PM (sX1BW)
---
Unfortunately, this is probably also true.

I actually hope that I might be able to see how the backup quarterback--who's always better that the starter who's having trouble--will do as President.

But I doubt it.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (krQz2)

231 Surge of detransition lawsuits pose threat to booming gender-transition business

Huh. If only someone could have seen that coming.

Posted by: Oddbob at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (nfrXX)

232 Ace. DeSantis was bought off by the same people you're talking about. That's the ultimate problem. He ain't going to do anything other than business as usual republican politics. You know a book deal is a bribe and look at who bribed him. The usual "respectable" types. Watch how DeSantis will (I mean he won't get elected, so there's that) the same nothing at the national level that always happens.

Respect gets you nothing because respectable MEANS bought off. It means cowing to the money people who want progressive policies with a business veneer. You've been in this too long not to understand this.

Yes, Donald Trump is a cow, a loose cannon. Probably even insane. But here's the real problem. Ron DeSantis has already betrayed you to the same Mitt Romney types.

Posted by: Former Mass Resident at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (D+EK8)

233 Tell me some more about this dignity.

---------------

His brother lived in Camelot and was a drugged up sex addict.

But points for Marilyn Monroe.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (sX1BW)

234 I’m more concerned with Trump’s position on trannies. Though I think he has been told that he needs to at least take position that they shouldn’t be able to compete against women. I’m sure he was also told to say biological women .

Posted by: Drive by at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (MNhXM)

235 I STILL would not like to see Taylor Swift naked. Not even out of curiosity.

Posted by: Truck Monkey Report at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (ZV+pB)

236
I am not talking about Trump. you think she'll agree with you ?
Posted by: runner at December 06, 2023 04:07 PM (V13WU)

Well, if walk up and tell my wife that I could grab women by the pussy if I were a billionaire, she'd likely say "Yep. I bet you could."

Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (Zz0t1)

237 NOOD

Posted by: The FBI at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (n2vyf)

238 What would that accomplish exactly? It’s not like people vote D because of their zip code.
---
If that's where they died, they do.

Posted by: Axeman at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (krQz2)

239 Any place in Utah is better than where I learned to ski, Bear Valley. Ever heard the term "Sierra Cement"?

Posted by: wth at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (v0R5T)

240 TEX v MICH FTW

GO BLUE!!!!!

Posted by: Bulgaroctonus at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (JrojV)

241 The trolling schtick just didn’t play well except to people already firmly in Trumps camp.

Yes, I hate Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan, that doesn’t somehow give Trump a blank check

I really don’t think this is hard to understand, and I think the Trump people get it, they just would rather do the intellectually lazy thing and call any criticism of Trump a NeverTrump Liz Cheney lover

Posted by: Equate at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (YtuAA)

242 There was one in Austin yesterday with 6 dead and multiple injures... The FBI has been busy
Posted by: It's me donna at December 06, 2023 03:42 PM (n2vyf)

--------------

I see what you did there.

Posted by: Decaf at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (3JfbU)

243 This chilly blonde is finishing her coffee, so she's finally ready for the Continuation Thread:
https://is.gd/c4o7v5

Posted by: Joe Mannix (Not a cop!) at December 06, 2023 04:14 PM (kBSKe)

244 210
Snowbird? Park City is nice and I like the funky town. But it's crawling with douchey tourist-types (many from California) and people who aren't really there to ski or board. Snowbird has a better crowd, in my experience. Also better snow.
Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (iFTx/)

Problem with both snowbird and Alta and the other canyon resorts is a lack of a town. There’s nothing to do there and very limited lodging options. And you have the horrendous traffic to get up and down.

Park city is an actual ski town, walkable, plenty of places to stay, restaurants, bars, etc.

Asking wise yeah Alta cans be beat. But for the group ski trip experience PC is better.
Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (tJsiW)
________

You're not wrong. I go to Alta only to ski. If I'm taking a girl, and am thus looking for more to do than just ski, then I go to Jackson Hole. I wish it was as easy to get to from NYC as Utah ski resorts are . . . .

Posted by: Elric Blade at December 06, 2023 04:14 PM (iFTx/)

245 Make the cities smaller.

Red states should have state laws that say: No city can have a population greater than 10% of the state's population. Heck - make it even smaller.
Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:01 PM (sX1BW)

It would be interesting to require city governments to fission if they get too big, under the obvious observation that they are too unresponsive to the actual needs of the city's population. Some operations could be shared between them easily enough.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 06, 2023 04:14 PM (eoQWY)

246 Georgia got robbed falling behind #5 FSU without their starting QB.

Michigan
Washington
Georgia
Alabama

was the only realistic playoff for this year.
Posted by: Nikki Haley at December 06, 2023 04:05 PM (sIl7T)

Nah. They got it about right.

Texas > Alabama >Georgia.

Who you're victorious over counts.

Now, Florida State got screwed. Since their defense was mostly winning their games even with 3 different QBs.

It probably should've been:
Michigan
Washington
Florida State
Texas.

Posted by: naturalfake at December 06, 2023 04:14 PM (QzZeQ)

247 Yeah but the other 15% would not just disappear. They’d still vote the same way just be residents of Chicago 2.

--------------

But Chicago would not have the outsized influence it has in state matters. Plus cities would be forced to compete against one another more efficiently. We now have good parts of good cities. I'd rather simply have more good cities and contrast them with bad cities.

Decentralization is always a good thing.

Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:14 PM (sX1BW)

248
People do, indeed, vote based upon their zip code.
Posted by: The UniParty Is Real at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (0tfeq)

They live in certain places and those places are liberal. They don’t vote liberal because they live in certain places. It’s the exact opposite. If yiu took 1000 Democrats in Chicago and loved them outside the city limits you think they’d magically turn Republican? Yeah not happening.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:14 PM (tJsiW)

249 We are so fu&ked

Posted by: Gonzotx at December 06, 2023 04:14 PM (MwHgU)

250 “Students” lol.
Come on man it’s minor league football, who are we kidding.

Media studies.

Posted by: G'rump928(c) at December 06, 2023 04:15 PM (aD39U)

251 4 Team College Playoff expands to 12 teams next year. Expect 3 times the amount of bitching next year.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at December 06, 2023 04:03 PM (R4t5M

The gambling and the amount of money laid down will be off the hook, which is what the NCAA wanted.

Posted by: Rufus T. Firefly at December 06, 2023 04:15 PM (tDhJ5)

252 Posted by: Former Mass Resident at December 06, 2023 04:12 PM (D+EK

You know DeSantis biggest donor switched his support to Trump right? Is Trump potentially bought off now?

Posted by: Drive by at December 06, 2023 04:15 PM (MNhXM)

253 Tom Elliott
@tomselliott

Rep
@AyannaPressley
: We must "expand access to the ballot box, Including for incarcerated citizens" & teenagers as young as "16"

https://tinyurl.com/34v49dpd

Posted by: redridinghood at December 06, 2023 04:15 PM (NpAcC)

254 A-fucking-men, Ace. Wonderful post.

Posted by: Mr. Bingley at December 06, 2023 04:16 PM (FXT2u)

255 Yes, Donald Trump is a cow, a loose cannon. Probably even insane. But here's the real problem. Ron DeSantis has already betrayed you to the same Mitt Romney types.

Posted by: Former Mass Resident

HaHaHa. Didn't you get the new talking points? It is now Niki Haley who is the real threat. You are supposed to be calling her out for being the GOPe stooge.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 04:16 PM (t/2Uw)

256 How long before 12 expands to 24? I say by 2030.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:16 PM (tJsiW)

257 Giving personal anecdotes, Trump is the only Republican in my lifetime that I’ve seen reliable Republican voters do something out of character and not support

I have a relative that voted straight Republican on his ballot except for Trump

It’s out there and it’s real and it’s not over ideology

Posted by: Equate at December 06, 2023 04:17 PM (YtuAA)

258 I'm sorry, but having a majority is irrelevant when the scum RiNOs vote with the 'tards more often than they vote as if they were representing their constituents.
Best example is an ex-Repub that is now urging folks to vote Dem. When was she EVER a good conservative?

Posted by: Wingnutt at December 06, 2023 04:17 PM (qmlyn)

259 After ‘16 the Democrats said “ that’s enough of THAT shit” and got busy. They are not going to let another Presidential election get away from them… they OUTWORK the Republicans, all the time.

Posted by: tubal at December 06, 2023 04:18 PM (PCK5/)

260
I have a relative that voted straight Republican on his ballot except for Trump

—

I’ve got a couple of friends who were like that. Curiosity, both are open to Trump this time around. Not that they think he’s any better but because they’ve woken up to how bad the other option is.

Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:18 PM (tJsiW)

261 It is 2023. Most of us now understand there is no piety but false piety, and there is no dignity but false dignity. How many times, over and over, Bush, Cheney, Pence, Mueller, Comey, Barr, Durham, Ryan, McCarthy, Romney, McCain, McConnell, etc etc

The pious and dignified have been ineffective or worse - effective in working against us.

I wish it weren't so, but there's no going back. They have lost the mandate of heaven. The turbulence is just getting started, and won't stop until realignment is more fully complete and the people are more confident in their leaders. This isn't on us either - leadership broke the deal.

Posted by: Milquetoast Mortgage-Paying Neighbor in Flyover Country at December 06, 2023 04:18 PM (5C4od)

262 His brother lived in Camelot and was a drugged up sex addict.

But points for Marilyn Monroe.
Posted by: SH (no more socks) at December 06, 2023 04:13 PM (sX1BW)

I'm re-reading James Ellroy's American Tabloid because the Kennedy assassination talk around the anniversary reminded me that I had mostly forgotten what happened in the book.

In it, Ellroy has JFK banging everything all the high-end tail he can be set up with, and Monroe takes in everyone from the pizza delivery boy to "David Seville" of Chipmunks fame ... but the two never get together themselves.

Posted by: spindrift at December 06, 2023 04:19 PM (2qPXN)

263 The economy.takes another hit.

The Washington Times
@WashTimes
Surge of detransition lawsuits pose threat to booming gender-transition business
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, Abandon All Hope Ye Who Enter Here at December 06, 2023 04:10 PM (FVME7)

Well shit. There goes half of the economy.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at December 06, 2023 04:20 PM (BdMk6)

264 Looking at the RCP averages, both DeSantis and Nikki Haley poll just as well as Trumo within a point or two against Biden. Trump is polling no better than generic Republican. In fact, Nikki Haley polls the best against Biden(not my opinion by a long shot). trump still under 50% in most primary polling. More than 50% of Republicans not willing to say they will vote for him.

Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 04:21 PM (t/2Uw)

265 I spent most of my adult life among the airborne infantry where not picking your nose with the fingers your eating with counts as dignity. We need some time with Judge Roy Bean running things, once a few of the Romney types are up on gibbets we'll have the others attention and they'll be more receptive to our brand of comity.

Posted by: Fra Fillipo at December 06, 2023 04:22 PM (Nge8H)

266 They live in certain places and those places are liberal. They don’t vote liberal because they live in certain places. It’s the exact opposite. If yiu took 1000 Democrats in Chicago and loved them outside the city limits you think they’d magically turn Republican? Yeah not happening.
Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:14 PM (tJsiW)

Well if they no longer had that cushy city job and had to work at a local business then they might do just that.

And of course, when I lived in inner city Chicago I never had any Republicans to vote for short of US Senator.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 06, 2023 04:24 PM (eoQWY)

267 Too many--in fact, most--politicians believe their egos are the most important part of America. It would be nice to see a class of politicians who don't believe that their number one weapon is a snitfit.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at December 06, 2023 04:24 PM (CHHv1)

268 It will all boil down to what happens in 5 states next November, our discussions here notwithstanding.

Posted by: tubal at December 06, 2023 04:24 PM (PCK5/)

269 Las Vegas ... they found one shooter dead, probably the only one, but they have not said there is only one. No count on the victims, that I have heard.

Posted by: illiniwek at December 06, 2023 04:25 PM (Cus5s)

270 The culture has changed. Virtue is gone. People like Bob Dole are not coming back, possibly not this century.
I still like De Santis and wish him all the best (and same to Trump, who is not virtuous), but it doesn't seem that De Santis is gaining much traction just by being virtuous.

Posted by: PG at December 06, 2023 04:26 PM (gQbO4)

271 After ‘16 the Democrats said “ that’s enough of THAT shit” and got busy. They are not going to let another Presidential election get away from them… they OUTWORK the Republicans, all the time.
Posted by: tubal at December 06, 2023 04:18 PM (PCK5/)

Driving three or four trucks with printed fake ballots isn't what outworking in an election used to mean.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 06, 2023 04:26 PM (eoQWY)

272 Trump can only get 44% against Biden. The same poll shows Biden can only get 41% against Trump. I know we don't like math here, but 44 beats 41.

Posted by: Eskimo at December 06, 2023 04:26 PM (h39WR)

273 Ace, I don't disagree with the sentiment or the tactical suggestion. I just think your timing is off. I don't think we are in the consolidation phase yet - and I don't think we will be for quite awhile.

We've still got a lot of "Because Fuck You" before this settles down.

Having said that, I have said all along that I will likely vote for RDS in the primary and DJT in the general and I'm fine with that. I'm more annoyed I can't get the commies off my school board.

Posted by: Milquetoast Mortgage-Paying Neighbor in Flyover Country at December 06, 2023 04:27 PM (5C4od)

274 "So that's what my disagreement with Gaetz is about, I guess: Whether the tactics of juvenile rebellion and trolling are still effective, or are stuff you do at the beginning of a rebellion, but not in the middle of consolidation phase."

If by "juvenile rebellion" you mean "Bringing the Ukraine War to an end" then I agree with you.

(I know it's not over yet, but we all know it's basically done and why... thank you Matt Gaetz)

Posted by: Shoey77 at December 06, 2023 04:28 PM (//kQK)

275 And other states are cementing the vote fraud into place.

https://tinyurl.com/y39s46yd

Posted by: Professor Plum at December 06, 2023 04:30 PM (lmFwW)

276 Liar in Chief up.

Posted by: pawn at December 06, 2023 04:30 PM (QB+5g)

277 137 Trump: It's been "largely true" "over the last million years" that stars can "grab women by the pussy"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0E4GnMcSycU
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2023 03:57 PM (KRtlO)

He's. Not. Wrong.
Posted by: Sponge - F*ck Joe Biden at December 06, 2023 03:58 PM

Not to be flippant but he was under oath. As a woman, I agree with Sponge. Trump put it in an extremely crude way, and probably wouldn’t have perjured himself if he had admitted to at least a bit of exaggeration.

Posted by: Moonbeam at December 06, 2023 04:31 PM (rbKZ6)

278 How long before 12 expands to 24? I say by 2030.
Posted by: Montec at December 06, 2023 04:16 PM (tJsiW)

I don't think they have enough weeks for that. The problem with 12 is that it is still too many. It means that the conference championship game, say, means nothing since both teams get in with different seedings. It just means that you have even more blowout playoff games before it gets down to the 2 or 3 teams that have a shot.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 06, 2023 04:32 PM (eoQWY)

279 Just think. In exactly a year from now we still won't know for sure who the next president will be.

Posted by: Dr. Pork Chops & Bacons at December 06, 2023 04:35 PM (BdMk6)

280 269 Las Vegas ... they found one shooter dead, probably the only one, but they have not said there is only one. No count on the victims, that I have heard.
Posted by: illiniwek at December 06, 2023 04:25 PM

In the UNC shooting a couple of months ago, many of the students reported many, many gunshots and the shooter trying to break into multiple locked rooms where students were sheltering. In the end, the shooter fired only once or twice in a single classroom, killing his professor and then fleeing the campus. Initial “eyewitness” reports are routinely wrong.

Posted by: Moonbeam at December 06, 2023 04:37 PM (rbKZ6)

281 50 What i want is quiet brutality.

Show, don't tell.

Act like you've been there before. Act like no one should be surprised that you just ended seventy swamp creatures career with a ten word executive order. Act like shuttering an entire cabinet department is just something one does on a Tuesday. Act like the televised natterings of idiots with special little pins on their lapels is worth as much notice as the squeak of a mouse running from a lawnmower. Stop acting like the world owes you a three day Triumph because you made a sound come out of your face.

Quiet, steady, industrious brutality.
Posted by: Warai-otoko

Here, here.

Posted by: Close The Fed at December 06, 2023 04:38 PM (LeNk3)

282 @252... how does that make the book not a bribe? Millionaires overnight for a long time government employee and lawyer.

Reality is DeSantis is bought off and all his friends and allies are perfectly happy with GOPe solutions and programs.

Posted by: Former Mass Resident at December 06, 2023 04:39 PM (D+EK8)

283 "When all is said and done, more is said than done."

Attributed to Aesop, but applicable to governance and politics in general in the Internet era as well.

Posted by: Muldoon at December 06, 2023 04:42 PM (991eG)

284 255, I mean that is a statement of reality. She's bought off by the war faction. Just because she's in deeper than DeSantis doesn't make DeSantis not bought off. I mean if you want to go with retread loser ideology who will gleefully fuck you over, please by all means go for Nikki and Ron. I think Trump is a psycho but just like 2016 (though I was pulling for Ted Cruz) Trump is the only choice that might deliver. Ron Desantis and Nikki Hailey will fuck you over.

Look. Give me a viable replacement to trump. Please. Candidates should talk more like Vivek but they don't. Ron sure as hell isn't and the reason is he has his paymasters to benefit. Ron could have. Ron won't. Because he won't govern that way. You are already screwed. Nikki is just a worse version of that.

Look. If you want to repeat 2000 Bush era bullshit and keep losing and falling backwards in this country that's entirely up to you. I'm sick of this farce. I'm sick of collaborating with these people that will screw us on key issues of immigration and the economy to satisify the chamber of commerce. You want that, go vote for it. This is why I am sick of politeness.

Posted by: Former Mass Resident at December 06, 2023 04:45 PM (D+EK8)

285 "Leopard ate my face" squeals ace.
A moment of grace for Nancy Mace.
Trump embrace - a lost case.
Burma Shave

Posted by: You Know Who at December 06, 2023 04:50 PM (zkJ1A)

286 That's the ticket ace! When will these MAGA rubes understand that TRUE conservatives know the way back to civility is policing our own! DUH! But NOOOO the Orange Team wastes their time worrying about Washington Post articles making veiled assassination threats...Talk about misplaced priorities. But you really do need to get off this DeSantis kick, he's so 2020. Nikki is the thing now, all the cool donors tell me so...

Posted by: Jonah at December 06, 2023 04:56 PM (nfyTY)

287 I appreciate these refective comments, Ace. I'm putting down the gloves for a moment to find some middle ground with you.
I believe most of us here recognize that things have gotten ugly within Republican ranks. Really ugly. But as Ecclesiastes 3 states "there is a time for war and a time for peace." And now is the time for war, because there's a limit on how many times Republicans can look their voters in the face and lie to us, all while we know they are lying to us.
And they never fight. Ever. They mealy-mouth and talk around their countless sellouts with statements like "we have to be adults" or "we have to vote for something, we can't vote for nothing" and "I'm not going to be a hater." And they think saying "we'll get them next time" or the loathsome "we need to move on from this issue" excuses their horrendous betrayals. It doesn't. Not anymore.
You previous stated that 15% of Republicans won't vote for Trump. It's revealing. That 15% always said "hold your nose and vote" for their preferred candidates, the ones we knew would lie to us. So now, they find themselves on the other side of that equation and we see who they really are. We are done and this is war.

Posted by: Tracy at December 06, 2023 05:35 PM (IPU2B)

288 Taylor Swift is the Time Person of the Year.

We are no longer a serious country.
Posted by: sharon(willow's apprentice) at December 06, 2023 04:00 PM (t/2Uw)
_______________

Coulda been worse. Coulda been Dylan Mulvaney.
Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at December 06, 2023 04:09 PM (MZImN)

*takes notes**

Posted by: Time Magazine Chief Editor at December 06, 2023 05:38 PM (iODuv)

289 The GOP at the national level just has no vision/platform. They also lack unity and courage.

The GOP will NEVER be the alternative FIGHTIN PARTY against totalitarianism from the Oligarchy/WEF/Globalist/Dem/DeepState Axis.

Posted by: Sapwolf at December 06, 2023 05:42 PM (pQQ5j)

290 Excellent analysis, Ace. Gaetz should shut up and work for the party's agenda. There is one and Speaker Johnson is working on it.

Posted by: Roland F Hirsch at December 06, 2023 05:49 PM (oMkPq)

291 What a lot of Republicans don't get is that all that decorum is fine and dandy IF YOU'RE WINNING. Sadly, the left has been taking it to the GOP like a WWE heel since the 1990's. We've had a parade of "leaders" who have been content to lose, be the faithful opposition and pad their pockets. Say what you may about Trump... But he fights and he's willing to absorb damage to dish it back... And he's not in it for the money. So, he trash talks... Haven't you been married? Separate the grain from the chaff.

So far, PDJT has been to the left and the GOPe what Bill Clinton was to the '90's congressional Republicans. Im actually amused by his " hijinks"...

While I don't expect it, I hope Trump cuts back our contribution to the UN and cancels their building lease.
I would hope that we shrink our boots on the ground in NATO to maintenance personnel at forward positioned equipment and supplies "armories" and limit our personnel to air & naval patrol/blockade duties. Theirs are big economies. They don't need us to babysit them.

We have two sworn enemies. China, who is deadset on displacing us as "world leaders"... They can have that if they csn pick up the tab.
And radical Islam.

Posted by: Augusto Perez at December 06, 2023 05:59 PM (aYFpa)

292 Just want to pop in and say that Ace's post is pretty much where I'm at. Nearly exactly to the point, and with it I like both Trump and DeSantis for this very reason... different styles for sure and in both cases some good results and bad results no doubt... but my goodness the war ... both in front of us and from behind us must be won... one way or another.

Posted by: RealityMain at December 06, 2023 06:37 PM (EqABe)

293 “…and yet we're mostly frozen in the posture of burn-it-down rebellion..”

Ace, I hear you and your point is not invalid, but I’d feel a lot more like walking back to civility if, you know, something, anything was actually burned to the ground. In a sense, I think that we need to demonstrate that we’re serious.

And let’s be clear that MTG’s moral equivalence between removing McCarthy from the speakership and tossing Santos is just bullsh*t. Removing McCarthy was a principled move, handled within the rules. The fact that McCarthy wants to take his marbles and go home is on him, not those that removed him from the speakership. On the other hand, Santos leaving is all on the suicidal “MODERATES” that refuse to play hardball with Democrats. Gaetz actually spoke up for Santos saying that he has not been convicted of any crime.

Posted by: OnPoint at December 06, 2023 06:46 PM (cz2EI)

294 Ace, here's why we are at where we are at. Whatever one's opinion of Matt Gaetz, MTG or President Trump, at least they stand, fight and back up what they claim.
Speaker Johnson apparently just agreed to Including FISA spying reauthorization in the Defense Bill, after declaring the Republicans wouldn't include it. He's giving them the clean NDA they insisited upon. Breitbart is reporting it now.
Again I ask, what is the point of supporting such a party?

Posted by: Tracy at December 06, 2023 06:48 PM (IPU2B)

295 And here's a hilarious side note on my last post about House Republican leadership caving big time on the NDA. Just today, I've received 2 texts from the G.O.P. asking me for money. I can barely pay my bills and these lying scumbags can't even be bothered to do their cushy jobs the way they promised they would. This is exactly why I say it's a time for war. We get NOTHING from voting R.
Trump has my vote in 2024 but the rest of the G.O.P. can wither and die on the vine. To hell with them!

Posted by: Tracy at December 06, 2023 06:55 PM (IPU2B)

296 No, Ace. No. Only violence.

I have zero fucks to give unless we go house-to-house putting down radical Democrats and their moderate supporters.

Posted by: insurgens ad opus at December 06, 2023 07:14 PM (PchrF)

297 I'm okay with Magneto: dignified, erudite, polite, visionary, and utterly ruthless. I'm also okay with Wolverine: loudmouthed, cigar chomping, growling, and murderously dangerous.

As to being tired, well, you're tired because you're trusting in the wrong things and thinking the wrong thoughts, I think. America is dead, died on Jan 6, buried on Jan 20th when Biden was sworn in. DEAD.

God has a plan, and you just need to listen and follow Him. Other than that, fear not.

And quit watching the news, err state propaganda.

And now you're not tired.

Posted by: Eric2 at December 06, 2023 07:26 PM (t7mrP)

298 I beg of you, don't mention David French's taint ever again.

Posted by: Jim T at December 06, 2023 08:25 PM (O8ftN)

299 🙄

Posted by: Farm Gurl at December 06, 2023 09:07 PM (n0oRq)

300 Damn, Ace. You nailed it.

Posted by: GWB at December 06, 2023 09:16 PM (HMvgH)

301 It's not my first time tօ go to see thіs websitｅ, i am browsing this site
daiⅼly and take nice inf᧐rmation from here
eveгyday.

Posted by: been at December 06, 2023 10:17 PM (WvsiE)

302 Low T post, Ace.

We have people in our own party okay with the DOJ rounding up dissenters, believe that the 2020 election was fair and even spew the same propaganda/insults as the American commie.

These traitors recently all got together to oust Santos, then McCarthy quit, both reducing the majority.

They don't gaf about us and our well being.

Those who are still playing the Prisoner's dilemma fairly are essentially on the side of the commies they were hired to fight against.

You opened my eyes to that game theory years ago, perhaps you should revisit it.

https://tinyurl.com/37am6yhs

Posted by: VAR1ABLE at December 06, 2023 11:09 PM (cUZSd)

303 "We need to start moving from rebellion to making a legacy."

sorry, I don't think it works like that, Ace; gotta win the rebellion first, then we get to build a legacy

Posted by: sock_rat_eez - these lying bastardi e stronzi have been lying for decades at December 07, 2023 07:21 AM (zer5o)

304 Shorter Ace: "Yes, this has all been about my mancrush on DeSantis. I fell in love with his musky, Victor Mature-like scent and am heartbroken over that big meany Trump turning him into mulch."

I mean, Democrats have the White House and the Senate while the GOP controls the House by the skin of its teeth...and Ace wants to pretend we're in the middle of the Right's "consolidation phase" of political ascendency? They are actively trying to put the frontrunner for the GOP nomination in prison and Ace is all like "Well, it's time to move on from being so confrontational and disagreeable?"

Infatuation makes men do really stupid things.

Posted by: MBunge at December 07, 2023 08:31 AM (2tWdQ)

305 Great post. I agree with the sentiments.
We need to be happy warriors. Spewing juvenile vitriol may make angry people feel better, but it doesn't win arguments.
You run a real risk of alienating the persuadable few.

Posted by: kraki at December 07, 2023 09:41 AM (AQZte)

306 "I mean not really. Does Trump really talk about actual plans or actual agenda items? Pass this partcular reform? He doesn't. He just grumbles about having had the election stolen."

https://www.donaldjtrump.com/issues

JFC. It would be really nice if Ace at least PAID ATTENTION to the stuff he's supposed to be upset about.

Posted by: MBunge at December 07, 2023 11:00 AM (2tWdQ)

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