The Nordstream Explosions: Sabotage, Or General Incompetence?

In the rush to blame someone for the twin explosions in The Baltic Sea, the question of "cui bono" remains to be answered. Ignoring the Polish EU Parliament representative's silly comment and the usual suspects spouting nonsense without one bit of data to bolster their points, a sober look at the issue yields...nothing.

Why would Russia blow up its own pipelines, when they could simply close the valves (they weren't pumping gas anyway) and make up any number of stories without having to repair any damage? And if they are seeking a casus belli, why would they damage one of their sources of foreign currency? There are many ways to start a war with America, assuming they want one (they don't) that would work much better!

And if they want to expand the war in Ukraine, they could easily create another flash point that is easily blamed on the Ukrainian government, rather than explosions far from Ukraine with multiple possible explanations.

Why would The United States blow up the pipelines? The loss of natural gas supply in Europe will simply make this winter even more miserable than expected, and if anything that will pressure the European countries that depend on Russian gas to be more flexible and accomodationist with Russia. They want the gas to flow so they can be warm and criticize Russia in comfort. And the Biden junta is clearly on the side of Ukraine, at least judging by the amount of ~~graft~~ military aid flowing to them and the chaotic rhetoric emerging from the White House, so why create conditions that would support a peaceful and quick resolution to the war, with terms advantageous to Russia?

Or we can respect Occam's Razor, which suggests that the simplest explanation is often the best one. And in the cold light of day, who would bet against crappy Russian maintenance and top-down management of a problem that causes a much, much bigger problem?

Nordstream

In my experience when anything involving energy-industry hydrocarbons explodes … well, sabotage isn’t the first thing that comes to mind. And honestly, when it comes to a pipeline running natural gas under Russian (non)maintenance, an explosion means that it’s Tuesday. Or Friday. Or another day of the week ending in “y”.
“But, LawDog,” I hear you say, “It was multiple explosions!”
Yes, 17 hours apart. No military is going to arrange for two pipes in the same general area to be destroyed 17 hours apart. Not without some Spec Ops guy having a fit of apoplexy. One pipe goes up in a busy shipping lane, in a busy sea, and everyone takes notice. Then you wait 17 hours to do the second — with 17 hours for people to show up and catch you running dirty? Nah, not buying it.
The Nord pipelines weren’t in use. To me, that means it’s time for maintenance! Hard to maintain pipes when product is flowing.
Pipelines running methane, under saltwater, require PMCS* quicker than you’d think, and more often than you’d believe.
I would bet a cup of coffee that any of the required weekly and monthly checks and services since the Russians took over have been pencil-whipped. (See Andreev Bay 1982.)

I have no expertise in these matters, but LawDog makes a good case for an accident. There are holes in his theory, but without much data, it's better than most! But would I be surprised if we discover that it was indeed sabotage? Nope! The stupidity that would have driven the accidents would also do admirably well with sabotage, and that includes American involvement. Underestimating the stupidity of the Biden junta or the Kalorama Klowns who are controlling them is not productive.

[Hat Tip: dhmosquito]

Posted by: CBD at 12:00 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 I'll just go get em

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 12:00 PM (xhxe8)

2 Incompetent is my thinking as of late

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 12:01 PM (xhxe8)

3 I have no fuckin idea
Beats the shit out of me

All things being equal, I go with shitty russian technology

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 02, 2022 12:04 PM (Irn0L)

4 Cui bono? Sebastian Gorka threw out Putin's name, if not an accident. Things are going poorly for him at home and he could use this incident to gain some support with the restless natives by blaming on the evil West.

Posted by: olddog in mo at October 02, 2022 12:07 PM (ju2Fy)

5 A further complication is the 300' of concealing water. I can't think of anyone I'd trust to bring out an objective, unaltered picture.

Did it explode outward? Did it get crushed by a shock wave? Who knows.

Posted by: 2009Refugee at October 02, 2022 12:07 PM (8AONa)

6 The lack of vigorous denials on our part makes me wonder.

Posted by: Anthony Chadwick at October 02, 2022 12:07 PM (Ofhdv)

7 The Nord Stream explosions have a "Gulf of Tonkin"/ "Sinking of the Maine" feel. We may end up in a history-changing trans- oceanic war over an act of physics rather than an act of war.

Posted by: Buck Throckmorton at October 02, 2022 12:07 PM (d9Cw3)

8 Shitty Russian technology, shitty Russian attitude, Shitty Russian motivation, Shitty Russian accountability, Shitty Russian part of town.*

*South Park reference

Posted by: SFGoth at October 02, 2022 12:08 PM (KAi1n)

9 I just don't buy the accident from poor maintenance argument. Blinken' s remarks about the great opportunity this provides came too soon and seemed prepared ahead of the event. Like the election fraud, there was little surprise evinced, too pat, too calm. The presentation was all wrong.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 12:08 PM (Zzbjj)

10 Maybe it would be a good time to ramp up energy production in the US of A and take off all the handcuffs?

Just spitballing here

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 02, 2022 12:09 PM (Irn0L)

11 It was aliens!

Posted by: Giorgio A. Tsoukalos at October 02, 2022 12:09 PM (63Dwl)

12 10 that would not advance the chaos needed for the nwo.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 12:10 PM (Zzbjj)

13 I know our present junta is stupid/incompetent, bot are they that stupid/incompetent?

Posted by: BignJames at October 02, 2022 12:10 PM (AwYPR)

14 In his latest crime against humanity, Donald Trump was seen swimming in the Baltic Sea when the NorthStar Pipeline connecting Uzbekistan and South Detroit mysteriously blew up resulting in widespread deaths from Cuba to Naples, Florida.

This is CNN...

Posted by: CNN at October 02, 2022 12:10 PM (R/m4+)

15 When this first broke we had a lot of speculation. I even added a few thoughts. But I also had in the back of my mind the old adage, the first report is always wrong.
But either way, trust government to spin this out of control.

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 12:12 PM (anj39)

16 7 The Nord Stream explosions have a "Gulf of Tonkin"/ "Sinking of the Maine" feel. We may end up in a history-changing trans- oceanic war over an act of physics rather than an act of war.
Posted by: Buck Throckmorton at October 02, 2022 12:07 PM (d9Cw3)

It's occurred to me that regardless of the actual cause, this can now be used as the perfect excuse for same nation taking some action they ordinarily couldn't get away with. On either side.

Also, as mentioned in the post, we've been speculating about the hard, cold winter Germany is facing. Making a deal with Russia to restart pipeline deliveries was their escape hatch; that option is now closed for good. This is going to be a hell of a winter.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:12 PM (r46W7)

17 hiya

Posted by: JT at October 02, 2022 12:12 PM (T4tVD)

18 Greenies have sabotaged many projects, only getting their might keep them out of the suspect line

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 12:13 PM (xhxe8)

19 At the Asia Times an interesting overview of the history of the Baltic Sea's role as a munitions dumping grounds, as well as recent activities there by US, NATO partners and the Russians. The author's premise is if the known activities were accelerated this much, God knows what else was possibly going on. Nothing dispositive, just illustrates what a hot mess we seem to be sleepwalking into.

https://tinyurl.com/mrxt9zvk

Posted by: Leon Sphinx at October 02, 2022 12:15 PM (UIngH)

20 'Maybe it would be a good time to ramp up energy production in the US of A and take off all the handcuffs?'

I see you as a glass is half full kind of guy.

Posted by: Dr. Claw at October 02, 2022 12:15 PM (roH4R)

21 I am making $50 an hour working from home.

It waz you who blew the pipeline, wasn't it? Fess up.

Posted by: Notorious BFD at October 02, 2022 12:15 PM (Xrfse)

22 Someone else who would have had motive and ability - the Poles. For Poland, screwing over both Russia and Germany at the same time would be cause for creating a new national holiday. But Poland could only have done it with the US watching them, and snickering.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:15 PM (r46W7)

23 Blinken' s remarks about the great opportunity this provides came too soon and seemed prepared ahead of the event.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 12:08 PM (Zzbjj)

No argument from me. I have no data-based ideas.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 02, 2022 12:15 PM (XIJ/X)

24 Seems like someone should be taking pictures by now, or are all the suspects having too good a time blaming each other.

Posted by: Javems at October 02, 2022 12:16 PM (9kmCi)

25 Arguments against LawDog's theory:

1) There would have to have been some common mode failure that blew up four separate pipelines within a 48-hour period, which would be simply unprecedented. The pipelines were merely pressurized, but they weren't transporting gas, so it's not as if gas was moving through the pipe at the time of the explosions.

2) The Swedes and the Danes seem certain that it was sabotage. The size of the explosions would seem to confirm this.

3) When Secretary of State Blinken talks about the destruction of the pipelines "offer[ing] tremendous strategic opportunity for the years to come", because it keeps the Germans from taking Russian gas, after both President Biden and Victoria Nuland said that the pipelines would not operate, it is sure a funny "coincidence" that an "accident" occurred that was so favorable to American interests.

4) No senior American official has stated on the record that the United States did not blow up the pipelines. We have an anonymous "senior defense official" claiming that, and Joe Biden announced that it was sabotage, and then denounced "Russian disinformation", which is not the same thing as a denial.

Cui bono?

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:16 PM (I2/tG)

26 Too many other countries were involved in the design and construction of NS2 for it to be chalked up to shitty Russian anything.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 12:16 PM (Zzbjj)

27 For $45 an hour I can suck a medicine ball through a coffee straw.

Posted by: Sarah, Horde blog skank at October 02, 2022 12:17 PM (N30d6)

28 27. Yep. Biden and Nuland don't know when to STFU.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 12:18 PM (Zzbjj)

29 Secretary of State's Blinken's statement rejoicing that the pipelines blew up, for those who haven't seen it:

https://twitter.com/aaronjmate/status/1576326018893492225

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:18 PM (I2/tG)

30 21 At the Asia Times an interesting overview of the history of the Baltic Sea's role as a munitions dumping grounds, as well as recent activities there by US, NATO partners and the Russians. The author's premise is if the known activities were accelerated this much, God knows what else was possibly going on."

This reminds me how the Russians preferred method of dealing with nasty nuclear waste, like worn out and contaminated sub reactors, it to just dump them in the ocean somewhere and forget about them.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:19 PM (r46W7)

31 Damn, just damn. The 1982 Andreev Bay incident displays the same characteristic Soviet/Russian inability to properly handle nuclear technology as Chernobyl and Kyshtym.

Posted by: Additional Blond Agent, STEM Guy at October 02, 2022 12:19 PM (ZSK0i)

32 so... lawdog is part of the coverup for the sabotage?

Posted by: kulak anachronda needs a bigger tinfoil hat at October 02, 2022 12:20 PM (edU/H)

33 /shambles in, still disheveled

OK, it couldn't have been Epstein, we can eliminate him 100%. OK, 99.9%, it wasn't Epstein.

Unless...

ahh, crap

/shambles out

Posted by: Bilwis Devourer of Innocent Souls, I'm starvin' over here at October 02, 2022 12:22 PM (cupoy)

34 Someone---if the break is not due to poor maintenance and incompetence---is risking a nuclear conflagration.
Whatever the cause of the pipeline break we know that Jello Brain and Kalorama Kontrol will be working diligently against the interests of the USA.

Posted by: Voter theater. at October 02, 2022 12:22 PM (/5Who)

35
I'm not so sure of the 300' depth. I'd have to see nautical charts of the area. If the area was much shallower than that I could perhaps see some explainable reason. With an island not so far away it could be much, much shallower. A pressurized 'bubble' of gas under high pressure.

My 2 cents and worth every penny.

Posted by: Divide by Zero at October 02, 2022 12:24 PM (y3pKJ)

36 10 Maybe it would be a good time to ramp up energy production in the US of A and take off all the handcuffs?

good idea. we have plenty of land that has not yet been covered with windmills and/or solar panels.

hey! that gives me an idea! solar panels lining the props of the windmills! why let all that sunlight go to waste? can i get a grant?

Posted by: kulak anachronda at October 02, 2022 12:24 PM (edU/H)

37 Secretary of State's Blinken's statement rejoicing that the pipelines blew up

BTW, we now officially have the stupidest foreign policy establishment in American history.

Even if we had nothing to do with the explosions, it is beyond idiotic that Blinken would publicly announce how wonderful the explosions were. Anti-American sentiment in Germany is already accelerating like a forest fire, and Blinken is happily dumping gasoline on the flames.

It would be a good idea for Americans to stay out of Germany this winter - I don't think that we're going to be very popular.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:25 PM (I2/tG)

38 If we're voting, I'm casting my vote for accident because of shoddy build and maintenance.

Posted by: polynikes at October 02, 2022 12:25 PM (9MoRr)

39 ARC's 1) and 2), fer sure. Additionally the Swedes found an explosives-laded UUV near the line years ago, no further info was provided. Details of incident seem inconsistent with the non-deliberate process described by lawdog. And generic (and correct) sweeping generalizations about Russian maintenance culture don't necessarily apply to joint ventures that bring in vast amounts of $$$ to the Russian oligarchs and economy.

Ukraine, Poland, Baltics. Ranking of those who "benefit", by level of motivation. US and UK.

In any case Germany wasn't in a position to affect the battlefield realities. Those remain much the same. A very unimpressive Russian military, with the resources and geography to, nonetheless, pretty much achieve their objectives over time.

Posted by: rhomboid at October 02, 2022 12:25 PM (OTzUX)

40 One cost estimate (the only one I heard, no idea on its accuracy) was $150M or $250M. Which would be rather cheap if it gave Putin some advantage at home and globally. Cheap, considering the US has already tossed in some $60B (to the wind, who knows where it all goes, except direct to our defense industry).

Monkey Werx is ex military and follows flights to see what is going on. Apparently they tracked a military flight over the are at the time of the incident, possible an aircraft for communicating with subs (from 10k feet, he wasn't sure about that tech).

But why would they allow it to be tracked? idk.

Biden had made the statement the we would shut down Nord Stream, but while that is ominous, they did shut it down via agreement with Germany. So it was not necessarily a military threat. But given that was on video, another reason the Russians could do the false flag.

"Experts" have supposedly determined it was sabotage, and Biden said that as well. The other possibility is China, also playing art of war games, get your enemies to fight each other. This helps secure energy for China from Russia ... idk.

Posted by: illiniwek at October 02, 2022 12:25 PM (Cus5s)

41 22 How could the Poles do it? Stupid Polacks. Only cracked the Enigma code. Big Deal. And that Polish girl who married the French guy, fooling around with radium.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at October 02, 2022 12:27 PM (lz5hY)

42 >>It would be a good idea for Americans to stay out of Germany this winter - I don't think that we're going to be very popular.

Not for nothing but I put a good amount of blame for what's going wrong in this country right in the lap of the EU greens and socialists. They aren't blowing my skirt up either.

Posted by: JackStraw at October 02, 2022 12:27 PM (ZLI7S)

43 The Chinese have an angle here, too. Eliminating those pipelines means Russia needs to sell a crap ton of product somewhere else. China would be happy to buy it all, at a bit of a discount, of course.

Posted by: Bilwis Devourer of Innocent Souls, I'm starvin' over here at October 02, 2022 12:27 PM (cupoy)

44 The more Russia hate that spews from all sides, the more I don't hate Putin. Yes, he's a bad guy. But, from the beginning, he's stated he wanted the reunification of the old Soviet Republic. The time to put him back in the box was when he took over Crimea during the Olympics almost a decade ago. The world could have claimed the "international call for peace" during the Games as a reason to pound him back. But, why didn't the world react? Everyone just sat back.
Now that Germany, and a lot of Europeans are taking it in the pocketbook, NOW? NOW, it's a crime? NOW we are all supposed to be up in arms?

Let Europeans figure it out. Already, trees are being chopped down but the millions for burning in home fireplaces to keep folks warm for the winter. I wonder what happens when the lights go out for half the day for the rolling brown outs sure to come.

Posted by: nurse ratched at October 02, 2022 12:27 PM (U2p+3)

45 Someone else who would have had motive and ability - the Poles.

One would think that the Poles know that this will be the end of NATO if they did it.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:28 PM (I2/tG)

46 I was starting to believe the incompetent accident theory. Then Anthony Blinken opened his yap.

https://twitter.com/ThePollLady/status/1576410259824201728

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 12:28 PM (Z32m1)

47 I wonder what happens when the lights go out for half the day for the rolling brown outs sure to come.

Posted by: nurse ratched at October 02, 2022 12:27 PM (U2p+3)

You would need a heart of stone not to laugh!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 02, 2022 12:29 PM (XIJ/X)

48 The Chinese have an angle here, too. Eliminating those pipelines means Russia needs to sell a crap ton of product somewhere else.

Several Chinese government officials are on Twitter blaming us for the explosions.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:29 PM (I2/tG)

49 Has this energy crisis changed the Germans position on Nuclear power?

Posted by: polynikes at October 02, 2022 12:30 PM (9MoRr)

50 At first I thought the Russians did it to give the Europeans something to be mad at the US about.
Then I thought about the assholes running the show. It would make perfect sense to them to remove any Russian influence over Germany...
Not by convincing the Germans against that strategy but by blowing the pipeline and making it impossible.

Posted by: Dr. Claw at October 02, 2022 12:30 PM (roH4R)

51 32 so... lawdog is part of the coverup for the sabotage?
Posted by: kulak anachronda needs a bigger tinfoil hat at October 02, 2022 12:20 PM (edU/H)

I appreciate his speculations, even if they turn out to be wrong. Better than our MSM working as hard as they can to kill the story.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:31 PM (r46W7)

52 This reminds me how the Russians preferred method of dealing with nasty nuclear waste, like worn out and contaminated sub reactors, it to just dump them in the ocean somewhere and forget about them.

The Navy wanted to do that with the old Polaris subs, until it was told that that would be unacceptable.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:32 PM (I2/tG)

53 Sorry, Occam is looking at this going... whut?

Two explosions in two different pipes, in the same geographic area, within 17 hours? When one pipe had been shut down for months, and the other had never run product? Two MASSIVE explosions?

Oh, and the Nord 1 pipeline is run by a company out of Switzerland, owned 51% by the Russians, but not really a Russian company. It was built by Western Companies, and run by Western Companies... this Russians are crappy at maintenance meme so blame that?

As to the 17 hours... sub drops divers, they plant charges, then have to leave the area so as not to get damaged.... boom 1, then they come back, set more charges... leave the area... boom 2... could easily take 17 hours when you also factor in decompression time for your dive teams.

Posted by: Romeo13 at October 02, 2022 12:32 PM (oHd/0)

54 from wikipedia re: the andreev bay incident: "An attempt to eliminate the leak was made by pouring in 20 sacks of flour, thus filling the cracks with dough. However, the leak continued, and the service personnel discovered icing on the right side of the building. "

clearly, they were making yellowcake.

Posted by: kulak anachronda at October 02, 2022 12:32 PM (edU/H)

55
g'early afternoon, 'rons

the counter argument: if the biden junta was to blow up a pipeline, they'd blow up Line Five out of canadia to freeze out the upper midwest

Posted by: AltonJackson at October 02, 2022 12:33 PM (ENBF0)

56 I exclude the Chinese because they're not going to have naval assets in the Baltic; too far from home for them, especially for a sub. Same goes for Ukraine, they'd have loved to do it, but they don't have the naval assets to pull it off.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:33 PM (r46W7)

57 But miraculously, Norway has a pipeline ready to go (and they were involved in NS2). Does Biden/Nuland mean the US did it, nope, but it gives some cover to other actors. And, it doesn't mean we don't know or didn't help the culprits.

In many cases, an event of this nature and environmental impact would elicit an offer of assistance to help "plug the hole" as Obama put it. We haven't, have we?

As for China, has there been Chinese naval traffic in that area? I dismiss the greeenies, as it seems much too big a deal and Greenpeace couldn't just toss a grenade and cause this.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 12:33 PM (Zzbjj)

58 Also suspicious is the lack of environmentalists, you know, commies, screaming about this ecological disaster. Where are the videos of smelly hippies bathing wildlife life with Dawn dish washing soap. Yes, I know these weren't oil spills but that doesn't stop commies from creating fake videos for propaganda purposes.

Posted by: Beartooth at October 02, 2022 12:33 PM (3p4cr)

59 To answer the question of "cui bono": The Biden regime appears hellbent on getting us into a war with Russia, so they're the obvious suspect. They have means and opportunity, and, I believe, motive. Of course, that begs the question of why Bid (or his handlers) lifted the sanctions on Nordstream II as one of his first acts in office. Of course, expecting logical consistency from this bunch is a fool's errand.

Posted by: Nemo at October 02, 2022 12:33 PM (S6ArX)

60 the counter argument: if the biden junta was to blow up a pipeline, they'd blow up Line Five out of canadia to freeze out the upper midwest
Posted by: AltonJackson at October 02, 2022 12:33 PM (ENBF0)

justin castreau will take care of that part for them.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:34 PM (r46W7)

61 49 Has this energy crisis changed the Germans position on Nuclear power?

Posted by: polynikes

=======

That would require introspection and taking ownership of the very real situation in which they find themselves.

Easier to accuse us off profiteering, and abandoning our sacred (in a non religious sense) duty to protect them from reality.

Posted by: 2009Refugee at October 02, 2022 12:34 PM (8AONa)

62 56. MacGregor says Poland and Norway, the UK, or us.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 12:34 PM (Zzbjj)

63 Maybe it was the Finns. They have some coastal subs. Why would they do it? Vodka and hating Russians.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at October 02, 2022 12:35 PM (lz5hY)

64 Imma blame Soros....for everything.

Posted by: BignJames at October 02, 2022 12:35 PM (AwYPR)

65 46 I was starting to believe the incompetent accident theory. Then Anthony Blinken opened his yap.

never let a crisis go to waste

Posted by: kulak anachronda at October 02, 2022 12:35 PM (edU/H)

66 Yeah, it was an accident...

And Epstein really did commit suicide!

Posted by: Romeo13 at October 02, 2022 12:36 PM (oHd/0)

67 54 from wikipedia re: the andreev bay incident: "An attempt to eliminate the leak was made by pouring in 20 sacks of flour, thus filling the cracks with dough. However, the leak continued, and the service personnel discovered icing on the right side of the building. "

clearly, they were making yellowcake.
Posted by: kulak anachronda at October 02, 2022 12:32 PM (edU/H)

that's gotta be the most Russian emergency repair I've ever heard of. Even the French have more respect for their pastries than that.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:36 PM (r46W7)

68 It doesn't require subs or any substantial naval presence to do something like this.

Posted by: rhomboid at October 02, 2022 12:36 PM (OTzUX)

69 I think Epstein is still alive. And living in luxury somewhere and laughing.

Posted by: nurse ratched at October 02, 2022 12:37 PM (U2p+3)

70 I go with shitty russian technology --NGU

I'll give you shitty simultaneous timed fuses, at least!

Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at October 02, 2022 12:37 PM (x61Im)

71 65. Too much, too soon

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 12:37 PM (Zzbjj)

72 At this point I'm leaning towards "all of the above".

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 12:39 PM (llON8)

73 >>Oh, and the Nord 1 pipeline is run by a company out of Switzerland, owned 51% by the Russians, but not really a Russian company.

This Russians just happen to be Gazprom, the Russian national oil company. Nord Stream 2 AG is 51% owned by Gazprom and the remainder is owned by western energy companies including companies in both France and Germany.

There were reports earlier this year after the war started that Nord Stream 2 AG was going to file for bankruptcy because of the oil embargo and sanctions and the European partners were looking to dump their stake. There could be reasons beyond the obvious for someone to damage the pipeline, lots of moving parts and big money involved.

Posted by: JackStraw at October 02, 2022 12:39 PM (ZLI7S)

74 "Why would The United States blow up the pipelines? "

Why? As an insurance policy that Germany and the rest of Europe never again will receive evil fossil fuels from Russia. I might--probably not, but might--buy LawDog's claims if this had been limited to one pipeline. The odds are the United States did this and it amounts to a near-act of war against its own allies as well as Russia.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at October 02, 2022 12:39 PM (nMx88)

75
Also suspicious is the lack of environmentalists, you know, commies, screaming about this ecological disaster. Where are the videos of smelly hippies bathing wildlife life with Dawn dish washing soap. Yes, I know these weren't oil spills but that doesn't stop commies from creating fake videos for propaganda purposes.

Posted by: Beartooth at October 02, 2022 12:33 PM

Interesting. There's some controversy here at home about some pipeline that runs through one of the Great Lakes and efforts from the left to shut it down for some reason.

Posted by: Divide by Zero at October 02, 2022 12:41 PM (y3pKJ)

76 Biden had made the statement the we would shut down Nord Stream, but while that is ominous, they did shut it down via agreement with Germany. So it was not necessarily a military threat. But given that was on video, another reason the Russians could do the false flag.

Nordstream 2 never was an in service pipeline. Even though Joe Biden removed the Trump era sanctions allowing Gazprom to physically complete the pipeline, Germany never signed off on approving and operating Nordstream 2.

Nordstream 1 was the only operating Russia to Germany Baltic Sea pipeline.

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 12:41 PM (Z32m1)

77 I'm going with Russian technology. The replacement pipeline parts from J. C. Whitney were held up due to the supply line crisis. The Wolf Whistle horn for Vlad's Zil showed up.

Posted by: bill in arkansas, not gonna comply with nuttin, waiting for the 0300 knock on the door at October 02, 2022 12:42 PM (lz5hY)

78 Putin has got new problems today, and his annexation attempt looks like it's blowing up in his face. Yesterday, Russia had to admit that it's garrison was abandoning Lyman, an important transportation hub in Donetsk that opens the door to Luhansk. Anywhere from 2500 to 4500 Russian soldiers are abandoning all of their heavy gear as they attempt to escape the city, which is now completely surrounded.

This city was in the area that was just supposedly Annexed, and now the Ukrainians are posting videos and laughing openly about it. Russian milbloggers are furious, demanding that Putin do something extreme to counter this outrage. His army, however, is clearly not capable of doing it.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:42 PM (r46W7)

79
Who is responsible for maintaining the pipelines? If it's the Russians, there's a non-zero chance that failure to operate properly, maintain, or just poor design or construction is the cause.

Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at October 02, 2022 12:44 PM (1Nxff)

80 Interesting. There's some controversy here at home about some pipeline that runs through one of the Great Lakes and efforts from the left to shut it down for some reason.
Posted by: Divide by Zero at October 02, 2022 12:41 PM (y3pKJ)

Enbridge Line 5 where it crosses the Mackinaw Straits in Michigan. If they actually shut it down? Detroit MI has some trouble, but Ontario Canaduh is screwed.

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 12:44 PM (Z32m1)

81 I was starting to believe the incompetent accident theory. Then Anthony Blinken opened his yap.

https://twitter.com/ThePollLady/status/1576410259824201728

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 12:28 PM

Pretty sure we did it. First boom was to give the Russkies a chance to back off and they didn't take it. Then the second boom to finish the pipeline off for good.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at October 02, 2022 12:44 PM (bVYXr)

82 It was osama bin ladens body, packed with explosives , it finally sunk and amazingly, was able to blow up 2 pipelines 17 hours apart!

Posted by: Gonzotx at October 02, 2022 12:44 PM (t4poC)

83 Winkey Blinken opening his pie hole does make one wonder, they love to pat themselves on the back

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 12:44 PM (VKqcx)

84 A fair question...what will be the next target?

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 12:45 PM (anj39)

85 Re Blinken:

The Left's inability not to gloat about evil things it does really is a thing. Blinken's celebration of the pipeline sabotage reminded me of leftwing triumphalism about "fortifying" the election. Eventually they will admit to outright theft. If these assclowns don't get us all incinerated in a nuclear war it will be nothing less than a miracle.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at October 02, 2022 12:45 PM (nMx88)

86 BTW, because I'm like that, I watched the video of the triumphal concert in Red Square celebrating the annexations, and watched Putin's speech there with English translations.

There was also a concert back in February celebrating the start of the Special Military Operation. It was held in a sports stadium with tens of thousands of people, with a speech by a jovial Putin, and performances by most of the major Russian pop stars.

This concert was a lot more somber - it only lasted an hour, had many fewer pop stars, and a much smaller crowd. Putin was very subdued, spoke briefly, and interestingly appeared to lose his train of thought when trying to remember the names of the four provinces that were annexed. Creeping Bidenism.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:47 PM (I2/tG)

87 >>> 32 so... lawdog is part of the coverup for the sabotage?
Posted by: kulak anachronda needs a bigger tinfoil hat at October 02, 2022 12:20 PM (edU/H)

Um.... no.

His explanation seems plausible. However, given the yapping and leading actions and benefits to our imbecile bureaucracy, it seems likely they were involved somehow. Maybe the first explosion was the sabotage and the second was the consequence of poor recovery attempts and/or some revealed weakness at that spot.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 12:49 PM (llON8)

88 Nord Stream 2 AG was going to file for bankruptcy

OMG yes, has no one said it yet? "Jewish Lightning."

I know 300 feet seems awfully deep when you're paddling a canoe with unregistered rifles in it, but unless you had a Bond-movie grade minisub to work from, it would take some brass ballast to do demolition work at that depth in a submarine. US and Russian subs are longer than that.

Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at October 02, 2022 12:49 PM (x61Im)

89 " boom 1, then they come back, set more charges... leave the area... boom 2... could easily take 17 hours when you also factor in decompression time for your dive teams."

or they set the timers a days in advance, since boom one would bring too much attention to still be in the area.

China would make sure to NOT be in the area, if they had hired the job done. Securing cheap energy from Russia, and maybe food as well, would give them motive.

Kash Patel spoke of how they (Trump's admin) stopped Nordstream, at leas for a little while. As Blinken said, they definitely don't like the idea of Germany enriching Russia and getting their cheap energy.

I guess that makes sense.

Posted by: illiniwek at October 02, 2022 12:49 PM (Cus5s)

90 Russian milbloggers are furious, demanding that Putin do something extreme to counter this outrage. His army, however, is clearly not capable of doing it.

Ramzan Kadyrov, the guy who rules Chechnya with an iron fist, is openly calling for the use of tactical nuclear weapons in Ukraine, to offset the deficiencies in the Russian army.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:50 PM (I2/tG)

91 >>> 16 7 The Nord Stream explosions have a "Gulf of Tonkin"/ "Sinking of the Maine" feel. We may end up in a history-changing trans- oceanic war over an act of physics rather than an act of war.
Posted by: Buck Throckmorton at October 02, 2022 12:07 PM (d9Cw3)

It's occurred to me that regardless of the actual cause, this can now be used as the perfect excuse for same nation taking some action they ordinarily couldn't get away with. On either side.

Also, as mentioned in the post, we've been speculating about the hard, cold winter Germany is facing. Making a deal with Russia to restart pipeline deliveries was their escape hatch; that option is now closed for good. This is going to be a hell of a winter.
Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 12:12 PM (r46W7)

Who benefits, indeed? Not only the corrupt idiots laundering money through KEEEV but the greentard wannabe genociders.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 12:50 PM (llON8)

92 very good postulate
very, very good postulate

Posted by: uhhhhhhh.clem at October 02, 2022 12:51 PM (C1SB0)

93 President Prune-head said he was going to do it. We're not exactly on the side-lines with this war. We've shoveled billions and billions to Ukraine with no end in sight. We're heavily invested in this war, we threatened to blow up both pipe-lines. I think we did it.

Posted by: washrivergal at October 02, 2022 12:51 PM (JxDRp)

94 My bet is the US had it destroyed. Especially since Biden did a speech and promised to get rid of Nordstream if Russia invaded Ukraine. The US has the least to lose domestically from Nordstream being destroyed (and a lot to gain) The Europeans had the most to lose.

The NeoCon idiots blaming Russia is beyond stupid, they simply would stop pumping gas if they wanted to no longer use it.

Funny how we can't drill for gas or oil over silly environmental concerns, but Biden and the Dems have no problem blowing up a gas pipeline in the middle of the ocean.

Posted by: Blago at October 02, 2022 12:51 PM (r97zv)

95 Posted by: JackStraw at October 02, 2022 12:39 PM (ZLI7S)

That comment was primarily an attempt to show some, that the 'Russian lack of maintenance' argument is much flimsier than they think.

Western Companies built it. Western Companies ran it.

Posted by: Romeo13 at October 02, 2022 12:53 PM (oHd/0)

96 At the ripe old age of 29 I remember that before 9/11 terrorist groups were always crowing that they had caused most tragic incidents. I would put the Biden junta on that same level. They might well imply they did this w/o having had any real involvement because they think they can advance their evil goals if the world suspects they did it.

Regardless of whether they actually stupidly but boldly carried out an act of sabotage or are just stupidly trying to imply "it might have been us" they are putting my country at risk and I despise them for it.

Posted by: PaleRider is simply irredeemable at October 02, 2022 12:53 PM (3cGpq)

97 As Blinken said, they definitely don't like the idea of Germany enriching Russia and getting their cheap energy.

I guess that makes sense.

Posted by: illiniwek at October 02, 2022 12:49 PM

I think everyone is missing the point of blinken's comments about the pipeline. The left wants ZERO energy to come form "fossil" fuels. They want everything to be renewable and they look at this as a necessary first step to wean Germany off of non renewable energy.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at October 02, 2022 12:53 PM (bVYXr)

98 Based on the performance of the Roooooshenz and their equipment in Z's land, I'm gonna go with crappy maintenance and operating procedures being the likely cause. That said, Biden and Blinken are probably just running their mouths trying to bigass everyone.

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at October 02, 2022 12:53 PM (tBR6g)

99 @77 I have a Warshawsky wolf whistle on my 66 Chev. It's totally reliable, and little children love it to death. It's possible that you're being unfair to JC Whitney.

Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at October 02, 2022 12:54 PM (x61Im)

100 At first I thought the Russians did it to give the Europeans something to be mad at the US about.
Then I thought about the assholes running the show. It would make perfect sense to them to remove any Russian influence over Germany...
Not by convincing the Germans against that strategy but by blowing the pipeline and making it impossible.
Posted by: Dr. Claw at October 02, 2022 12:30 PM (roH4R)

Is this Blinken bragging about doing it?

https://twitter.com/ThePollLady/status/1576410259824201728

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 12:54 PM (Z32m1)

101 Remember when JRB outed our involvement in the Bin Laden raid including the unit involved? These guys can't keep their mouths shut. Give it time and someone will spill the info.

Posted by: hubcap at October 02, 2022 12:54 PM (TuT+P)

102 I think everyone is missing the point of blinken's comments about the pipeline. The left wants ZERO energy to come form "fossil" fuels. They want everything to be renewable and they look at this as a necessary first step to wean Germany off of non renewable energy.
Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at October 02, 2022 12:53 PM (bVYXr)

It is even worse. The Left wants to deindustrialize Germany, just as it wants to destroy Dutch agriculture. The people of Europe either will rise up or become peasants. I'm betting on the latter.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at October 02, 2022 12:56 PM (nMx88)

103 In a weird way, I can sort of support Nordstream being destroyed.

We've shoveled how many trillions at NATO "protecting them" from Russia while Europe sends Russia billions for Russia's fossil fuels? Trump was absolutely right about this dynamic.

The environmental arguments were always bullshit, the greens think if the fossil fuels come from "somewhere else" it doesn't count against their social credit score.

Posted by: Blago at October 02, 2022 12:57 PM (r97zv)

104 "Nordstream 1 was the only operating Russia to Germany Baltic Sea pipeline." Posted by: rd

but Nordstream1 was shut down after Russia entered Ukraine, as Biden had promised? (not sure on the timing)

Posted by: illiniwek at October 02, 2022 12:57 PM (Cus5s)

105 These guys can't keep their mouths shut. Give it time and someone will spill the info.

Only a short distance from senior officials saying how wonderful the explosions were to admitting that we did it.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:57 PM (I2/tG)

106 >>> 55
g'early afternoon, 'rons

the counter argument: if the biden junta was to blow up a pipeline, they'd blow up Line Five out of canadia to freeze out the upper midwest
Posted by: AltonJackson at October 02, 2022 12:33 PM (ENBF0)

There's still time before winter.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 12:58 PM (llON8)

107 Whatever happened, this pipeline has been taken off the table as a possible avenue for a more peaceful solution to the war.

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 12:58 PM (BdMk6)

108 >>> 64 Imma blame Soros....for everything.
Posted by: BignJames at October 02, 2022 12:35 PM (AwYPR)

Nein!

Posted by: Klaus Schwab at October 02, 2022 12:59 PM (llON8)

109 but Nordstream1 was shut down after Russia entered Ukraine, as Biden had promised? (not sure on the timing)

Nordstream One operated for a number of months after the invasion - the Russians shut it down a couple of months ago, claiming "operational problems", to keep the Germans from building gas reserves for winter.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 01:00 PM (I2/tG)

110 When on safari in Africa, never goose a rouge elephant or for that matter, a nervous gunbearer

Posted by: MAC V SOG at October 02, 2022 01:01 PM (P4Pk9)

111 Germany is fucked.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at October 02, 2022 01:01 PM (u73oe)

112 >>That comment was primarily an attempt to show some, that the 'Russian lack of maintenance' argument is much flimsier than they think.

>>Western Companies built it. Western Companies ran it.

Yea, I get what you're saying but the ultimate owner of the pipeline and the maintenance company is the Russia government. Much of the Swiss based staff that was running the place has been let go because of financial problems related to the war and sanctions.

I have no idea who damaged the pipeline or if it was an accident or sabotage. I can see arguments for a lot of different scenarios but need a few more shoes to drop.

Posted by: JackStraw at October 02, 2022 01:01 PM (ZLI7S)

113 What the hell is a red elephant??

Posted by: Admirale's Mate at October 02, 2022 01:02 PM (9mxKg)

114 Who has a history of shutting down pipelines in order to "save the world" from climate change?

Posted by: CTim Bo at October 02, 2022 01:02 PM (GXrTQ)

115 These guys can't keep their mouths shut. Give it time and someone will spill the info.

Only a short distance from senior officials saying how wonderful the explosions were to admitting that we did it.
Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:57 PM (I2/tG)
***

You see, they have to brag eventually, because their application of statesmanship and international relations is so subtle, so nuanced, that we rubes just don't get it.

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 01:02 PM (anj39)

116 Ramzan Kadyrov, the guy who rules Chechnya with an iron fist, is openly calling for the use of tactical nuclear weapons in Ukraine, to offset the deficiencies in the Russian army.
Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 12:50 PM (I2/tG)

This reminds me of how Fidel Castro was openly lobbying the Russians to use nuclear weapons during the missile crisis. Guys like that know that they can hide out in their carefully prepared bunker and then come out stronger than ever once the missiles stop flying. But I think Putin and the people around him are having to face the fact that even if they use nukes, they still can't win. They can drag everyone else into hell with them, but they can't win.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:03 PM (r46W7)

117 Who has a history of shutting down pipelines in order to "save the world" from climate change?
Posted by: CTim Bo

The greenies in CO some years ago.

Posted by: Infidel at October 02, 2022 01:03 PM (Ur3ox)

118 You see, they have to brag eventually, because their application of statesmanship and international relations is so subtle, so nuanced, that we rubes just don't get it.

I'm sure Biden will blurt it out eventually, in part because he views himself as a "tough guy", and is proud that he did it.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 01:04 PM (I2/tG)

119 Who has a history of shutting down pipelines in order to "save the world" from climate change?
Posted by: CTim Bo at October 02, 2022 01:02 PM (GXrTQ)

This should always be remembered.

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:05 PM (BdMk6)

120 BTW, Biden's 80th birthday is November 20th.

I hope you're all considering what presents to get him.

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 01:06 PM (I2/tG)

121 I'm sure Biden will blurt it out eventually, in part because he views himself as a "tough guy", and is proud that he did it.
Posted by: The ARC of History!
__

Yep, eventually he'll brag about it. And the greens that are so concerned about fish migration patterns will say nothing that a gas pipeline was destroyed in the ocean.

Posted by: Blago at October 02, 2022 01:06 PM (r97zv)

122 103 In a weird way, I can sort of support Nordstream being destroyed."

I do too, in the sense that I think central Europe needs to be sent back to a 16th century standard of living for a few decades until they appreciate everything we've been doing for them.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:06 PM (r46W7)

123 118: But Biden blurts out so many lies. He could say Seal Team 6 did this and I'd think if he was confusing the Bin Laden takedown and his fantasies about being a tough guy ordering special ops missions. And I suspect I'd have a whole lot of company in that line of thinking.

Posted by: PaleRider is simply irredeemable at October 02, 2022 01:07 PM (3cGpq)

124 Post needs pic of smirking Germans. The one at the UN when Trump them that putting all their eggs in one basket wasn't prudent.

Accident, sabotage, act of war?
Who cares. Stupid and reckless on the Germans behalf.

Posted by: Itinerant Alley Butcher at October 02, 2022 01:07 PM (DVSzO)

125 95. And I assume the same western companies built the Norwegian pipeline. If you build it, have replaced it, you can probably take it out. I suspect DC understands this, too.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 01:07 PM (Zzbjj)

126 Don't know the answer to this question. But after the past several years, no matter the combined level of incompetence and incredulity, I have learned to become surprised by nothing.

Posted by: Colonel Travis at October 02, 2022 01:08 PM (RG7Wy)

127 To compensate for the mysterious destruction of the NordStream pipelines, I am ordering an acceleration in the shipment of wind turbines to Germany.

Posted by: Droolin' Joe Biden! at October 02, 2022 01:08 PM (I2/tG)

128 "Nordstream 1 was the only operating Russia to Germany Baltic Sea pipeline." Posted by: rd

but Nordstream1 was shut down after Russia entered Ukraine, as Biden had promised? (not sure on the timing)
Posted by: illiniwek at October 02, 2022 12:57 PM (Cus5s)

Nordstream 1 was running just fine after the February 24 Russian Invasion. Russia shut it down claiming Maintenace Issues. Remember the Siemens Compressor Turbines stuck in Canada due to sanctions? Then Russia was not running it or running it at reduced capacity for the last months.

Not running/ Running at reduced capacity would lend credence to the Lawdog Hydrate theory.

Blinken's running his mouth lends credence to Tapioca Joe wants WW3 theory.

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 01:08 PM (Z32m1)

129 So whatever happened to the big assassination scandal? The fellow who's daughter was killed instead of him? Haven't heard much about that after the first couple of days ...

Posted by: Lurk at October 02, 2022 01:09 PM (MIODZ)

130 If the Ukraine invasion and now the pipeline blowing up teaches us anything, it's get the US out of NATO.

These unwashed Euros are going to get us in another shooting war.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at October 02, 2022 01:09 PM (R/m4+)

131

King Charles III has decided not to attend the international climate change summit in Egypt next month, fueling speculation that the new monarch will have to rein in his environmental activism now that he has ascended the throne.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at October 02, 2022 01:10 PM (63Dwl)

132 Sabotage

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at October 02, 2022 01:10 PM (aJ/fS)

133 131. UK papers say Truss said "stay home"

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 01:10 PM (Zzbjj)

134 The "who benefits" question also looms large in my mind. No one really has a reason to blow these up, and as chaotic as the situation is around them, poor or no maintenance seems a likely cause.

Posted by: Jeff Weimer at October 02, 2022 01:11 PM (x2ve+)

135 Another factor starting to dawn on me is I think a large part of the central plains here in the US is heading into another multi-year, 1930's type drought.

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:12 PM (BdMk6)

136 132. I think so, due to the lack of horror at the environmental impact, and the lack of calls to assist.

Posted by: CN at October 02, 2022 01:12 PM (Zzbjj)

137 The s.o.b. stated specifically that he was going to take out Norstream 1 and Norstream 2. "Poor maintenance" rings hollow in the face of this threat.

Posted by: washrivergal at October 02, 2022 01:12 PM (JxDRp)

138 Mentioned this before; if the US sabotaged the Nord Stream pipelines I would expect the Russians to act in kind and sabotage/attack a piece of our infrastructure of similar importance. Might not be here in the states, but there are plenty of fiberoptic cables, pipelines and whatnot that crisscross oceans that we rely on.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at October 02, 2022 01:12 PM (BFigT)

139 I wish I knew more about how these undersea pipelines are constructed. Do they put open sections in one at a time and then the sea water is just flushed out when the pipeline is completed? Or is the influx of salt water from this rupture a problem for other lengths of the pipeline? If the 250 million to repair is accurate that suggests that only the bits that exploded are a problem.

Posted by: PaleRider is simply irredeemable at October 02, 2022 01:13 PM (3cGpq)

140 I mean following the trend of all conspiracy theories being proven fact within 6 months, it's gotta be sabotage.
The perpetrators ate probably WEF hired.

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at October 02, 2022 01:13 PM (aJ/fS)

141 Coldest I have ever been in my life was in Grafenwoehr Germany. At the Army training center. Up on the OP.
Damn!!!

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 01:14 PM (anj39)

142 129 So whatever happened to the big assassination scandal? The fellow who's daughter was killed instead of him? Haven't heard much about that after the first couple of days ...
Posted by: Lurk at October 02, 2022 01:09 PM (MIODZ)

That guy had made way too many enemies - he not only had ties to a lot of Russian organized crime figures (guys who will kill you for missing a 20 ruble payment on the money they loaned you) but he also had started criticizing Putin himself for handling the war badly. I suspect he's decided it's time to get real quiet and go hide out somewhere.

from the style of the crime, it sure looked like some mobster action.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:14 PM (r46W7)

143 King Charles III has decided not to attend the international climate change summit in Egypt next month, fueling speculation that the new monarch will have to rein in his environmental activism now that he has ascended the throne.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at October 02, 2022 01:10 PM (63Dwl)

It's more suitable for a Senior Royal, not the King himself. There were very few things his mother attended because that would signal more national commitment than maybe it warrants.

Posted by: Jeff Weimer at October 02, 2022 01:14 PM (x2ve+)

144 The "who benefits" question also looms large in my mind. No one really has a reason to blow these up, and as chaotic as the situation is around them, poor or no maintenance seems a likely cause.
Posted by: Jeff Weimer at October 02, 2022 01:11 PM (x2ve+)

The multiple FOUR! 4!!! not quite simultaneous EXPLOSIONS is my big stumbling block. Maybe if it was only two explosions on the two (yes two pipes on each) Nordstream 1 -or- Nordstream 2 pipelines? Then I would definitely be on board the Russian Fuck-Up /accident scenario.

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 01:16 PM (Z32m1)

145 Late to this and may have been said already but with regards to bad maintenance done by commies (or in this case former commies) I present as evidence Chernobyl and the explosion and sinking of the Kursk, the Russian fleet's flagship (back in 2000). Bad maintenance by a system where workers 'pretend' to work and the government 'pretends' to pay.

Posted by: Chairborne!...Desk From Above! at October 02, 2022 01:16 PM (prmS3)

146 The US has loads of incentive to screw over the Euroweenies. If Germany was to go all jello-legged in the midst of a cold hard winter and lift sanctions for their own survival, it undercuts the "coalition" and might stop the sacrifice of all the Ukrainians.

The US does NOT want that at all. They already sabotaged peace talks once. This is just more insurance that peace cannot break out.

This is totally in the US interests. Don't be such a gullible sap.

Posted by: ruralcounsel at October 02, 2022 01:17 PM (96wFa)

147 ...I'm sure Biden will blurt it out eventually, in part because he views himself as a "tough guy", and is proud that he did it.
Posted by: The ARC of History!

Or Time magazine will run a story, bragging about it.

Posted by: Chairborne!...Desk From Above! at October 02, 2022 01:18 PM (prmS3)

148 129 So whatever happened to the big assassination scandal? The fellow who's daughter was killed instead of him? Haven't heard much about that after the first couple of days ...
Posted by: Lurk at October 02, 2022 01:09 PM (MIODZ)
------------

Russia said they "solved" it after two days, you'll never hear anything about it ever again.

Posted by: Colonel Travis at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (RG7Wy)

149 I firmly believe that the US Americans and such should help the South Americans and the Iraq and such to blow up more of that pipe.

Posted by: Miss Teen USA 2007 at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (Xrfse)

150 . I wish I knew more about how these undersea pipelines are constructed. Do they put open sections in one at a time and then the sea water is just flushed out when the pipeline is completed?
____________

I read that these particular pipelines are steel pipe, forget the thickness but they're beefy and then they are encased in concrete. Each section weighs several tons. Damaged sections can be repaired/replaced. It would take a while, probably months, but it's doable.

Posted by: Martini Farmer at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (BFigT)

151 my indifference to this is so total and complete, and categorical that it's a little surprising, even to me.

well, mostly indifferent; parts of it all I do find funny, like all the euros getting what they voted for, good and hard.

Posted by: sock_rat_eez - we are being gaslighted 24/365 at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (8oyo2)

152 If only someone could ask Sundowner about it

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (VKqcx)

153 141 Coldest I have ever been in my life was in Grafenwoehr Germany. At the Army training center. Up on the OP.
Damn!!!
Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 01:14 PM (anj39)

But Graf was the only place we got to fire all types of live rounds and munitions. My erections kept me warm.

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (BdMk6)

154 Bad maintenance by a system where workers 'pretend' to work and the government 'pretends' to pay.

Posted by: Chairborne!...Desk From Above! at October 02, 2022 01:16 PM (prmS3)

The same kind of work ethic our government 'workers' have, IMO.

Posted by: Chairborne!...Desk From Above! at October 02, 2022 01:21 PM (prmS3)

155 That guy had made way too many enemies - he not only had ties to a lot of Russian organized crime figures (guys who will kill you for missing a 20 ruble payment on the money they loaned you) but he also had started criticizing Putin himself for handling the war badly. I suspect he's decided it's time to get real quiet and go hide out somewhere.

from the style of the crime, it sure looked like some mobster action.
Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:14 PM (r46W7)

He is "in mourning." Back in the good old (Ivan the Terrible) days of Russia, he probably would have announced he was going to be a monk.

Entering a monastery or nunnery in old 1600 AD Russia was an irreversible step, signaling you are out of politics permanently.

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 01:21 PM (Z32m1)

156 Although our government pays our 'workers' very handsomely.

Posted by: Chairborne!...Desk From Above! at October 02, 2022 01:22 PM (prmS3)

157 German government in December:

We know you’re all freezing to death and we’d like to import gas from Russia, really we would, but the pipeline got blowed up real good. Sorry.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at October 02, 2022 01:22 PM (u73oe)

158 151 my indifference to this is so total and complete, and categorical that it's a little surprising, even to me.

well, mostly indifferent; parts of it all I do find funny, like all the euros getting what they voted for, good and hard.
Posted by: sock_rat_eez

Agree 100%.

Posted by: nurse ratched at October 02, 2022 01:22 PM (U2p+3)

159 I firmly believe that the US Americans and such should help the South Americans and the Iraq and such to blow up more of that pipe.
Posted by: Miss Teen USA 2007 at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (Xrfse)

Snort!

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 01:23 PM (anj39)

160 "If the 250 million to repair is accurate that suggests that only the bits that exploded are a problem."

the one bit I read said it was designed so it could be repaired ... could raise it back up, or build a chamber around it underwater.

The pic of them putting it had it offloading from a big ship, I assume it was being assembled on the ship. There are probably YouTube videos.

Posted by: illiniwek at October 02, 2022 01:23 PM (Cus5s)

161 1944 the US ran a gas line under the English channel to Normandy

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 01:23 PM (VKqcx)

162 Coldest I have ever been in my life was in Grafenwoehr Germany. At the Army training center. Up on the OP.
Damn!!!
Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 01:14 PM (anj39)

My coldest was at Hohenfels. Brrrrrr!!!!

Posted by: Chairborne!...Desk From Above! at October 02, 2022 01:23 PM (prmS3)

163 151 my indifference to this is so total and complete, and categorical that it's a little surprising, even to me."

the reason it's significant is that, *if* it was a military attack, then this was the most destructive international attack in dollar terms since the Twin Towers were bombed. Things like that have world changing consequences.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:24 PM (r46W7)

164 Ridiculous. First apply Gell-Mann Effect then Occam's Razor: The general consensus here that Russian technology sucks and its people are fools is hilarious. Have you ever visited Russia? Have you ever even met a Russian? What utter stupidity. No doubt these same idiots state everything manufactured in China is crap. The level of ignorance by our conservative Biden-tool-Uke-lovers is stunning. Covid revealed the vast majority of conservatives are frightened hypochondriacs. This war revealed a large percentage of those are brainwashed jingo followers still living in a cold war "duck-and-cover" fantasy.

Posted by: Trolling Jingos at October 02, 2022 01:24 PM (drkrm)

165 *fistbump!*

Posted by: sock_rat_eez - we are being gaslighted 24/365 at October 02, 2022 01:25 PM (8oyo2)

166 . I wish I knew more about how these undersea pipelines are constructed. Do they put open sections in one at a time and then the sea water is just flushed out when the pipeline is completed?
____________

I read that these particular pipelines are steel pipe, forget the thickness but they're beefy and then they are encased in concrete. Each section weighs several tons. Damaged sections can be repaired/replaced. It would take a while, probably months, but it's doable.
Posted by: Martini Farmer at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (BFigT)

I think the pipelines are laid as a long continuous pipe from ships. Trying to weld, then test the welds underwater would be a HUGE PITA. Much harder than putting a bomb next to a pipeline.

Repairs? Saltwater is nasty sh!t. It would corrode the interior of the pipelines AND remove any interior coatings.

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 01:26 PM (Z32m1)

167 But Graf was the only place we got to fire all types of live rounds and munitions. My erections kept me warm.
Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (BdMk6)

I was up on the OP (Tac 5) doing a doing firepower demo with the Germans and they had two F-4s roll in. The pilots buzzed the OP. As they came across the impact area I was looking down at the pilots. Pretty cool.

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 01:27 PM (anj39)

168 if the US sabotaged the Nord Stream pipelines I would expect the Russians to act in kind and sabotage/attack a piece of our infrastructure of similar importance

If I were the Russians, I'd hold back.

NATO is going to tear itself to pieces over this - why interfere with that process?

Posted by: Droolin' Joe Biden! at October 02, 2022 01:27 PM (I2/tG)

169 Is not the NS1 &2 owned by Germany too. IIRC Germans are a bit anal about their maintenance. So The first false assumption is Russia is sole owner, sole maintainer, and therefore put that to them.

I find no reason to put down to Russian-German incompetence that is not more to the Biden junta evilness.

Until hard evidence comes, not from US government and media sources. I still think the odds on favorite is the rogue nation, the USA that did the sabotage.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:28 PM (u4CEu)

170 This is totally in the US interests. Don't be such a gullible sap.

Posted by: ruralcounsel at October 02, 2022 01:17 PM (96wFa)

Don't be a douchebag, and try to read more carefully.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 02, 2022 01:28 PM (XIJ/X)

171 My coldest was at Hohenfels. Brrrrrr!!!!
Posted by: Chairborne!...Desk From Above! at October 02, 2022 01:23 PM (prmS3

Winter Hawk.

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:28 PM (BdMk6)

172 When John Brennan said the Russians did it, I knew the US was responsible.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 01:30 PM (uWxoj)

173 Shortly after Russia invaded Ukraine, Claudio DDescazi, CEO of Energy Major Eni (Italy), made official visits to Africa to secure extra gas supply for Italy.

Apparently they were listening when Donald Trump was talking to Germany. He successfully obtained contracts with four countries.
[\Italy says, let the krauts freeze in the dark/]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7cyYxgzIKQ

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 01:30 PM (D5Ffb)

174 "the reason it's significant is that, *if* it was a military attack, then this was the most destructive international attack in dollar terms since the Twin Towers were bombed. Things like that have world changing consequences.
Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:24 PM (r46W7) "

yeah, but so what?
nothing I can do to alter any aspect of the situation.
what will happen? anybody's guess; something between zip and apocalypse. my prep is either: a) good enough or b) inadequate.

Alfred E. Neumann had it right: "What, me worry?"

Posted by: sock_rat_eez - we are being gaslighted 24/365 at October 02, 2022 01:30 PM (8oyo2)

175 Posted by: Trolling Jingos

Raimondo took his lithium this morning.

Posted by: SFGoth at October 02, 2022 01:31 PM (KAi1n)

176 Two pipelines one old one new blowing in different parts at about the same time bc random accident due to poor maintenance? What are the chances? That's not occam's razor. It's bs.

Not sure why the 17 hours difference is a big thing that needs explanations. The bombs may have been placed there in June, just in case, and to avoid detection.

Posted by: azoo at October 02, 2022 01:31 PM (vew3n)

177 If only someone could ask Sundowner about it
Posted by: Skip's phone

Ask Tapioca Joe three different times on three different days. I bet you get four different answers.

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 01:32 PM (Z32m1)

178 129 So whatever happened to the big assassination scandal? The fellow who's daughter was killed instead of him? Haven't heard much about that after the first couple of days ...
Posted by: Lurk at October 02, 2022 01:09 PM (MIODZ)
------------

Russia said they "solved" it after two days, you'll never hear anything about it ever again.

Posted by: Colonel Travis at October 02, 2022 01:19 PM (RG7Wy)

So just like our USSA government.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:32 PM (u4CEu)

179 the Great Reseters are in a panic

and they will do anything to regain control and get the Great Reset back on track

and anything means ANYTHING

Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:32 PM (us2H3)

180 Raimondo took his lithium this morning.

I firmly believe that whatever it is, it's much stronger than that. He seems nice.

Posted by: Miss Teen USA 2007 at October 02, 2022 01:33 PM (Xrfse)

181 "Repairs? Saltwater is nasty sh!t. It would corrode the interior of the pipelines AND remove any interior coatings." Posted by: rd

yes, that was the first report I heard, that if salt water was in there for very long, damage may be permanent. Russia seems pretty busy at the moment, and the other owners may not be interested in going to the danger zone, idk.

Posted by: illiniwek at October 02, 2022 01:34 PM (Cus5s)

182 It was eco-terrorists taking advantage of the crisis to attack fossil fuel supplies, knowing that blame would likely fall on the US or Russia. Radical greens have made no secret of their intentions. No reason to think they're not capable of such an act, and they have plenty of funding to hire the job out if necessary.

There are more dogs in this fight than most people realize.

Posted by: The Fool at October 02, 2022 01:34 PM (1dzqn)

183 The perpetrators ate probably WEF hired.
Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at October 02, 2022

Well, since the USG is run by WEF trained globalists, there you go.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 01:35 PM (uWxoj)

184 Don't be a douchebag, and try to read more carefully.

He's trying but reading is hard. Trust me.

Posted by: Miss Teen USA 2007 at October 02, 2022 01:35 PM (Xrfse)

185 169 Is not the NS1 &2 owned by Germany too.
------------------------

To date, no one knows exactly who supervised construction, who did the construction or who was responsible for maintenance.

My vote at the moment is on the probability of crappy metal. Who manufactured the pipes? Who were the welders? Who certified them? Who supervised them?

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 01:35 PM (D5Ffb)

186 Lazy and Stupid are often a reasons bad things happen. Not doing maintenance? Stupid and lazy, especially if the risk for disaster is high. Doing unapproved testing? Just plain Stupid; you get a Chernobyl.

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:36 PM (ynpvh)

187 185 169 Is not the NS1 &2 owned by Germany too.
------------------------

To date, no one knows exactly who supervised construction, who did the construction or who was responsible for maintenance.

My vote at the moment is on the probability of crappy metal. Who manufactured the pipes? Who were the welders? Who certified them? Who supervised them?

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 01:35 PM (D5Ffb)

China is great at building things that fail...

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:36 PM (ynpvh)

188 Didn't all the German and other European workers and advisors for Nordstream have to leave Russia in March 2022, after the sanctions were put into place?

Maybe it just took six months for the normal Russian Incompetence to manifest itself?

If it was one single pipeline? I would absolutely believe this theory.

Posted by: rd at October 02, 2022 01:37 PM (Z32m1)

189
"Why would The United States blow up the pipelines?"

Why would the U.S. be drawing down their strategic reserves to zero and hobbling their own energy industry?
Why did the U.S. fuck up their withdrawl from Afghanistan and instead quit and run like a bunch of pants shitting Frenchmen?

Biden Administration, that's why.
What did Barky the Dogeater say? Something like:
"Never underestimated Biden's ability to fuck things up."

Posted by: Speller at October 02, 2022 01:38 PM (pSotA)

190 pics of Russian nuke capable bombers in position near Ukraine released by the US gub

where they weren't before

however these Hypersonic bombers also carry conventional payloads

something Putin has yet to depoy

Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:39 PM (us2H3)

191 Yo, most stuff manufactured in China IS crap. I've been to China. I've visited factories. I've dealt with the incompentance of following rules to a T, even if they don't make sense. If you don't believe me, I've got some baby formula and cat food filled with melamine and some radioactive sheet rock I'd like to sell you.

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:39 PM (ynpvh)

192 173 Shortly after Russia invaded Ukraine, Claudio DDescazi, CEO of Energy Major Eni (Italy), made official visits to Africa to secure extra gas supply for Italy.

Apparently they were listening when Donald Trump was talking to Germany. He successfully obtained contracts with four countries.
[\Italy says, let the krauts freeze in the dark/]

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022

That African country was Libya, where Italy normally got their gas before the WEF globalists blew up that country.

Look for Libya to be blown up again.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 01:40 PM (uWxoj)

193 One more point. After all the lies, bullshit, and evil that has happened just under covid (not to mention the coup of DJT presidency and stolen election), why would you give any benefit of the doubt that it was not the deep state US government and the democrat party, BIRM?

Enlighten me as to the wisdom of that because I just don't understand.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:40 PM (u4CEu)

194 Alfred E. Neumann had it right: "What, me worry?"

Posted by: sock_rat_eez - we are being gaslighted 24/365 at October 02, 2022 01:30 PM (8oyo2)

+++
Maybe something. Maybe nothing. I have just enough curiosity to want the facts. If the skies up above burst into fire, I'd really like to know how this went down.

Posted by: washrivergal at October 02, 2022 01:41 PM (JxDRp)

195 OK, now I'm confused, noting new actually, but how many pipe lines were blown up how many times?

Posted by: Javems at October 02, 2022 01:41 PM (9kmCi)

196 194 Alfred E. Neumann had it right: "What, me worry?"

Posted by: sock_rat_eez - we are being gaslighted 24/365 at October 02, 2022 01:30 PM (8oyo2)

+++
Maybe something. Maybe nothing. I have just enough curiosity to want the facts. If the skies up above burst into fire, I'd really like to know how this went down.

Posted by: washrivergal at October 02, 2022 01:41 PM (JxDRp)

Mr. Bean was monitoring the pipeline readouts and accidentally hit the wrong buttons...

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:42 PM (ynpvh)

197 I saw Radioactive Sheet Rock open for Van Halen at Reunion Arena in ‘84.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at October 02, 2022 01:42 PM (u73oe)

198 To date, no one knows exactly who supervised construction, who did the construction or who was responsible for maintenance.

My vote at the moment is on the probability of crappy metal. Who manufactured the pipes? Who were the welders? Who certified them? Who supervised them?

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 01:35 PM (D5Ffb)

Even when they're supposed to follow guidelines... people get greedy. There have been issues in the US with regards to the origins of steel. The US refused a Coast Guard cutter that was newly constructed a few years ago, because the shipyard's steel supplier switched US steel for cheaper Chinese steel.

Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at October 02, 2022 01:42 PM (wmDcS)

199 90 pics of Russian nuke capable bombers in position near Ukraine released by the US gub

where they weren't before

however these Hypersonic bombers also carry conventional payloads

something Putin has yet to depoy
Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:39

A. The bombers are not hyper-sonic. The missiles may be....or not.

B. The USG (WEF) is setting up a false flag, in order to bring the US into the war.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 01:42 PM (uWxoj)

200 After all the lies, bullshit, and evil that has happened just under covid (not to mention the coup of DJT presidency and stolen election), why would you give any benefit of the doubt that it was not the deep state US government and the democrat party, BIRM?

In the dysphoria that is life in 2022, nothing can be discounted.

Posted by: Notorious BFD at October 02, 2022 01:42 PM (Xrfse)

201 195 OK, now I'm confused, noting new actually, but how many pipe lines were blown up how many times?

Posted by: Javems at October 02, 2022 01:41 PM (9kmCi)

one in the front, two in the back?

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:42 PM (ynpvh)

202 And if they want to expand the war in Ukraine, they could easily create another flash point that is easily blamed on the Ukrainian government, rather than explosions far from Ukraine with multiple possible explanations.

Like the pipeline *in Ukraine* that they pay fees to the Ukrainians on, and the Ukrainians are known to be stealing from.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:43 PM (kOpft)

203 Only reason the US would have a hand is the Gaia Religion giving the order.

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 01:43 PM (xhxe8)

204 The 17-hour interval suggests sabotage to me. Blowing both at the same time is clearly sabotage. Having an interval creates doubt.

Posted by: JackWayne at October 02, 2022 01:43 PM (Bn+RF)

205 A resource I know in the gas pipeline industry says the "offshore pipelines are normally designed with at least a 0.5 design factor, which is a large margin of safety for overpressure. They will have to take a look at the pipeline damage"

Posted by: JM in Florida at October 02, 2022 01:43 PM (eJAK0)

206 "Or we can respect Occam's Razor, which suggests that the simplest explanation is often the best one"

In that case it would be global warming and/or racism that caused it.

Posted by: Ripley at October 02, 2022 01:44 PM (MxEKc)

207 202 And if they want to expand the war in Ukraine, they could easily create another flash point that is easily blamed on the Ukrainian government, rather than explosions far from Ukraine with multiple possible explanations.

Like the pipeline *in Ukraine* that they pay fees to the Ukrainians on, and the Ukrainians are known to be stealing from.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:43 PM (kOpft)

Which is why the Ukes don't blow it up.

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:44 PM (ynpvh)

208 The loss of natural gas supply in Europe will simply make this winter even more miserable than expected, and if anything that will pressure the European countries that depend on Russian gas to be more flexible and accomodationist with Russia.

This is completely wrong. There is no mechanism for the Europeans to get an adequate supply of gas this winter without the Nordstream pipelines. So there's nowhere for the pressure you imagine to go.

What there will be is a whole lot of cold, unemployed Germans looking to blame someone.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:45 PM (kOpft)

209 I find it curious that just days after massive German protests of freezing to death and going broke during winter, the pipelines get splodey. The USA wants to keep everyone in line... as do the EU bureaucrats and the WEF.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:45 PM (u4CEu)

210 208 The loss of natural gas supply in Europe will simply make this winter even more miserable than expected, and if anything that will pressure the European countries that depend on Russian gas to be more flexible and accomodationist with Russia.

This is completely wrong. There is no mechanism for the Europeans to get an adequate supply of gas this winter without the Nordstream pipelines. So there's nowhere for the pressure you imagine to go.

What there will be is a whole lot of cold, unemployed Germans looking to blame someone.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:45 PM (kOpft)

Green Energy is People!

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:46 PM (ynpvh)

211 Deep State-controlled US assets did this. No other country has the reason to do so. Russia doesn't want to do it because it's a freakin' $$$$$$$ asset, and Germany/Eurostan doesn't want to be out of control of energy. Ukraine doesn't have the infrastructure to do it.
The only true winner is the Deep State. It allows them to push Greta Thunberg's "How dare you!" rhetoric and push the Green New Deal faster.

Posted by: Jonah Kyle at October 02, 2022 01:46 PM (R4j1g)

212 Those of us who've made things go boom for a living can picture what happened. Not everything goes off when it's supposed to..

Posted by: Michael Christian at October 02, 2022 01:46 PM (/LbTY)

213 190 pics of Russian nuke capable bombers in position near Ukraine released by the US gub

where they weren't before

however these Hypersonic bombers also carry conventional payloads

something Putin has yet to depoy
Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:39 PM (us2H3)

a stupid move by Putin; he's still thinking he can bluff his way out of his, even though his bluff has been called. The only reason to park bombers near Ukraine is to make sure people *see* them, and will be scared. But that trick isn't working now. As far as actually using them; Russia has missiles that could have hit all of Ukraine right from the start of this, there's no need for a replay of some 1962 Dr. Strangelove scenario.

Putin should take Tuco's advice - if you're gonna shoot, shoot! Don't talk. And don't make grandiose threats when nobody believes you're gonna follow up on them.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:46 PM (r46W7)

214 It doesn't matter what happened in the Baltic. The pipelines have been effectively taken out of the equation as an olive branch.

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:46 PM (BdMk6)

215 27 For $45 an hour I can suck a medicine ball through a coffee straw.
Posted by: Sarah, Horde blog skank at October 02, 2022 12:17 PM (N30d6)

*******

Rookie.

Posted by: Kamala H. at October 02, 2022 01:47 PM (xxG/v)

216 "The Chinese have an angle here, too. Eliminating those pipelines means Russia needs to sell a crap ton of product somewhere else. China would be happy to buy it all, at a bit of a discount, of course."

Chi-Coms are my pick. They bebeifit most. If they didn't do it directly they got Joe & Co to do it.

Posted by: Ignoramus at October 02, 2022 01:48 PM (jwTnm)

217 This is completely wrong. There is no mechanism for the Europeans to get an adequate supply of gas this winter without the Nordstream pipelines. So there's nowhere for the pressure you imagine to go.

What there will be is a whole lot of cold, unemployed Germans looking to blame someone.

Posted by: Methos
==
That is my take. The Germans were already pissed of looking at the future bleak, grey, and cold winter. The lack of the TWO pipelines means they have no choice anymore.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:48 PM (u4CEu)

218 I don't care if we did it, the Russians did it, or the Martians did it.

It was an act of unparalleled stupidity for Blinken to gloat about how good it was that Germany has been prevented from buying natural gas from Russia.

Just amazingly, amazingly stupid. Did anyone in the State Department note what the reaction of German voters would be to this statement?

Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (I2/tG)

219 Europeans blew it up. No better way to kick off the depopulation program than a good winter without heat.

I'm not being completely serious. Though if nothing else, the past few years have taught me to doubt almost nothing.

Posted by: Fool Otto at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (DB16e)

220 217 This is completely wrong. There is no mechanism for the Europeans to get an adequate supply of gas this winter without the Nordstream pipelines. So there's nowhere for the pressure you imagine to go.

What there will be is a whole lot of cold, unemployed Germans looking to blame someone.

Posted by: Methos
==
That is my take. The Germans were already pissed of looking at the future bleak, grey, and cold winter. The lack of the TWO pipelines means they have no choice anymore.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:48 PM (u4CEu)

They may have to keep warm giving handies to the Ruskies...

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (ynpvh)

221 LawDog makes a good case for an accident. There are holes in his theory, but without much data, it's better than most! But would I be surprised if we discover that it was indeed sabotage?

And the problem here is that we're all going to see the lack of good information through our particular worldviews.

I'm going to say 'Obviously Biden promised to eliminate the pipeline and now he's done it, consequences be damned.' Some people who insist that Russia is the problem here will find a way to blame them. Some people who don't want the obvious geopolitical consequences are going to jump at the option to pretend it was an accident.

And no one with a lick of sense is going to believe the results of an 'official' investigation, particular after two years of covid hysteria.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (kOpft)

222 however these Hypersonic bombers also carry conventional payloads

something Putin has yet to depoy
Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:39 PM (us2H3)

There's no such thing as a "hypersonic bomber".

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (BdMk6)

223 That is my take. The Germans were already pissed of looking at the future bleak, grey, and cold winter. The lack of the TWO pipelines means they have no choice anymore.
Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:48 PM (u4CEu)

(Jump to top of page)

on the upside, it's always gives one a warm feeling to see people get what they voted for.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (r46W7)

224 Didn't Germany, just recently, shut down a reactor?

How long would it take to bring it back on line?

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 01:50 PM (D5Ffb)

225 219 Europeans blew it up. No better way to kick off the depopulation program than a good winter without heat.

I'm not being completely serious. Though if nothing else, the past few years have taught me to doubt almost nothing.

Posted by: Fool Otto at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (DB16e)

500 million, baby! That's the goal!

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:50 PM (ynpvh)

226 There's no such thing as a "hypersonic bomber".
Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (BdMk6)

next you'll tell me that the Germans didn't attack Pearl Harbor.

Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:50 PM (r46W7)

227 >How long would it take to bring it back on line?

Two weeks./

Posted by: Fool Otto at October 02, 2022 01:50 PM (DB16e)

228 Maybe it would be a good time to ramp up energy production in the US of A and take off all the handcuffs?

Just spitballing here
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 02, 2022 12:09 PM (Irn0L)

You're making Gaia cry.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:51 PM (kOpft)

229 222 however these Hypersonic bombers also carry conventional payloads

something Putin has yet to depoy
Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:39 PM (us2H3)

There's no such thing as a "hypersonic bomber".

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (BdMk6)

I disagree

Posted by: SMOD at October 02, 2022 01:51 PM (ynpvh)

230 Kamala you tell them, it's what the outcome is that counts

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 01:51 PM (xhxe8)

231 228 Maybe it would be a good time to ramp up energy production in the US of A and take off all the handcuffs?

Just spitballing here
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 02, 2022 12:09 PM (Irn0L)

You're making Gaia cry.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:51 PM (kOpft)

One of my favorite Santana guitar pieces.

Posted by: SMOD at October 02, 2022 01:52 PM (ynpvh)

232 There is no mechanism for the Europeans to get an adequate supply of gas this winter without the Nordstream pipelines. So there's nowhere for the pressure you imagine to go.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:45 PM (kOpft)

Of course there are. There are alternate pipelines and LNG carriers, but it will be hugely expensive and require concessions on the part of Europe.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 02, 2022 01:52 PM (XIJ/X)

233 I did it.

Posted by: German green party activist working the control room for the pipeline company at October 02, 2022 01:52 PM (ZC8hN)

234 off, sweet meteor

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:52 PM (ynpvh)

235 We didn’t do it. JFC the stoopid it takes to believe we did. Remember how certain proglodytes purport to believe that W was simultaneously dumber than a box of rocks, but his administration was so maliciously omnicompetent that it pulled off 9/11 as a black op? You’re doing pretty much the same thing if you think that Biden has scrambled eggs in that withered old man skull of his, but then believe his administration is still competent enough to black op an act of war against a NATO ally.

Posted by: Sarge6 at October 02, 2022 01:52 PM (hwRlm)

236 Of course it was the US.

Posted by: Wade Hampton at October 02, 2022 01:52 PM (Su9Le)

237 Maybe it would be a good time to ramp up energy production in the US of A and take off all the handcuffs?

Just spitballing here
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 02, 2022 12:09 PM (Irn0L)
===

You made me laugh so hard that a little bit of pee came out. That' comedy gold, GOLD JERRY!

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:52 PM (u4CEu)

238 Some people who don't want the obvious geopolitical consequences are going to jump at the option to pretend it was an accident.
___

Accident, sabotage, make no difference any more.
It's not like we'll ever know the truth.

But the repercussions of this will be felt soon, and hard by everyone.

Posted by: SMH at October 02, 2022 01:52 PM (+my1P)

239 105
'Only a short distance from senior officials saying how wonderful the explosions were to admitting that we did it.'

An even shorter distance is from Biden saying in advance that we could and would do it to us admitting that we did it.
Even if we didn't, FJB got us the blame.

Posted by: Dr. Claw at October 02, 2022 01:53 PM (roH4R)

240 however these Hypersonic bombers also carry conventional payloads

something Putin has yet to depoy
Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:39 PM (us2H3)

There's no such thing as a "hypersonic bomber".
Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (BdMk6)
***

I also laugh at the phrase "Nuclear Capable bombers." If it can drop a bomb, it's a nuclear capable aircraft. It is a term used to sound ominous but is essentially meaningless.

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 01:54 PM (anj39)

241 The Army missed its recruiting goal by 25% this year. The other services made their goals, but they had to dig into their delayed entry pools to make their numbers. The Army National Guard and the Army Reserve may pick up some of the Army’s requirements for the Army to meet its part of America’s national objectives. Despite the military’s efforts to lure individuals in with bigger bonuses and programs, military leaders point to a tight labor market and a private industry that is providing stiff competition for the applicant pool.

https://valorguardians.com/blog/?p=131634

Posted by: SMH at October 02, 2022 01:54 PM (+my1P)

242 219 Europeans blew it up. No better way to kick off the depopulation program than a good winter without heat.
------------------

Don't understand your usage of 'kick off', but if you meant population boom you are probably correct.

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 01:54 PM (D5Ffb)

243 CIA says it was the Ukrainians. So that probably rules out the Ukrainians. Who does Biden say DIDN'T do it?

Posted by: Jimco Industries at October 02, 2022 01:54 PM (buTO7)

244 My two favorite conspiracy theories are that

1. Germany was being forced to pay for gas deliveries from Russia under the Nordstream agreement, whether or not they got a bubble of gas, and imposing embargoes on Russian natural gas without declaring war is not considered a valid reason for not paying. If the pipeline were blown up then it would be a force majeur situation.

b: Nordstream2 was already moving natural gas illegally into Germany and the current coalition wanted to cover it up, and give no basis for backing out of its stance supporting Ukraine.

However, as far as I can tell the only people who didn't figure they could profit from blowing those pipelines are the people who get to chose between eating and not freezing this winter, and some of them are willing to risk the possibility

Posted by: Kindltot at October 02, 2022 01:54 PM (xhaym)

245 Posted by: Tom Servo at October 02, 2022 01:46 PM (r46W7)

Putin aint bluffing

he has already done what he set out to do

he has annexed what he wants and left the other part in shambles, for the US to rebuild

which will become a huge political football next year

all for a country that had the GDP of Arkansas

Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:55 PM (us2H3)

246 13 I know our present junta is stupid/incompetent, bot are they that stupid/incompetent?

Posted by: BignJames at October 02, 2022 12:10 PM (AwYPR)
----
Yes. Anyone who pushes AGW and believes a man can become a woman is stupid. Stupid people are usually incompetent.
Scenario: first pipeline is setup with bang-bang. The second one? The sabotage team has problems hence the delay. Remember the DC Junta stated that #2 would never go on-stream. LawDog is wrong. #1 has been running for a long while and no explosions before the Uke war! There were 2 explosions in each pipeline, am I correct? The US Navy was around there at the time or not long before the explosions. There has to be seismic evidence of explosions versus rupture.

Posted by: Ciampino - it was sabotage at October 02, 2022 01:55 PM (qfLjt)

247 217 This is completely wrong. There is no mechanism for the Europeans to get an adequate supply of gas this winter without the Nordstream pipelines. So there's nowhere for the pressure you imagine to go.

What there will be is a whole lot of cold, unemployed Germans looking to blame someone.

Posted by: Methos

The good news is that Germany does not have a military so those cold, unemployed German idiots are just gonna have to live with it.

There is a mechanism for Germany to get LNG, The US has two big LNG export facilities (that I know of), Savannah and Corpus Christie. So guess who benefits also, US LNG exporters.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 01:55 PM (uWxoj)

248 We didn’t do it. JFC the stoopid it takes to believe we did. Remember how certain proglodytes purport to believe that W was simultaneously dumber than a box of rocks, but his administration was so maliciously omnicompetent that it pulled off 9/11 as a black op?
==
Only one problem with that Sarge, I don't beleive the Biden junta is stupid nor incompetent. I think they are highly intelligent ruthless zealots. So no I'm not stupid. I've been right on everything that big leftist gov has done since 2016.

I think you are a bit naive to believe what you posted.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:57 PM (u4CEu)

249 227 >How long would it take to bring it back on line?

Two weeks./
Posted by: Fool Otto at October 02, 2022 01:50 PM (DB16e)

The storm season has started for the northern seas. Repairs, if attempted, will take a long long time.

Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons at October 02, 2022 01:57 PM (BdMk6)

250 Not once in the article is it mentioned that wokeness is playing a YUGE part of eligible recruits passing on serving this junta.

Posted by: SMH at October 02, 2022 01:57 PM (+my1P)

251 I still think it was sabotage

Posted by: It's me donna at October 02, 2022 01:58 PM (bs+z0)

252 Despite the military’s efforts to lure individuals in with bigger bonuses and programs, military leaders point to a tight labor market and a private industry that is providing stiff competition for the applicant pool.

https://valorguardians.com/blog/?p=131634
Posted by: SMH
------------------------

They don't want to talk about the historic turn about losing recruits from legacy military families or potential quality recruits looking at leadership saying, ya, no.

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 01:58 PM (D5Ffb)

253 251 I still think it was sabotage

Posted by: It's me donna at October 02, 2022 01:58 PM (bs+z0)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5rRZdiu1UE

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 01:58 PM (ynpvh)

254 I also laugh at the phrase "Nuclear Capable bombers."

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 01:54 PM (anj39)

Just wait until you see our vast fleets of nuclear-capable trucks!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 02, 2022 01:59 PM (XIJ/X)

255 There is a mechanism for Germany to get LNG, The US has two big LNG export facilities (that I know of), Savannah and Corpus Christie. So guess who benefits also, US LNG exporters.
Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 01:55 PM (uWxoj)

If it were my decision, i would triple security at those places.

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 02:00 PM (anj39)

256 250 Not once in the article is it mentioned that wokeness is playing a YUGE part of eligible recruits passing on serving this junta.

Posted by: SMH at October 02, 2022 01:57 PM (+my1P)

I read that as "edible recruits" with respect to Germany...Soylent green, y'all.

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 02:00 PM (ynpvh)

257 250 Not once in the article is it mentioned that wokeness is playing a YUGE part of eligible recruits passing on serving this junta.
Posted by: SMH
-=--------------

Yeah, women enjoying showering with trannies isn't even a porn myth.

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 02:00 PM (D5Ffb)

258 257 250 Not once in the article is it mentioned that wokeness is playing a YUGE part of eligible recruits passing on serving this junta.
Posted by: SMH
-=--------------

Yeah, women enjoying showering with trannies isn't even a porn myth.

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 02:00 PM (D5Ffb)

"That's HER penis!"

Posted by: jim (in Kalifornia) at October 02, 2022 02:00 PM (ynpvh)

259
"Not once in the article is it mentioned that wokeness is playing a YUGE part of eligible recruits passing on serving this junta."

I think the pool of recruits are likely to be the same kind of people who are "vaxx reluctant".

Posted by: Speller at October 02, 2022 02:00 PM (pSotA)

260 >>> 182 It was eco-terrorists taking advantage of the crisis to attack fossil fuel supplies, knowing that blame would likely fall on the US or Russia. Radical greens have made no secret of their intentions. No reason to think they're not capable of such an act, and they have plenty of funding to hire the job out if necessary.

There are more dogs in this fight than most people realize.
Posted by: The Fool at October 02, 2022 01:34 PM (1dzqn)

>>> 183 The perpetrators ate probably WEF hired.
Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at October 02, 2022

Well, since the USG is run by WEF trained globalists, there you go.
Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 01:35 PM (uWxoj)

The WEF are eco-terrorists.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 02:01 PM (llON8)

261 1st Nood

Posted by: Skip's phone at October 02, 2022 02:01 PM (xhxe8)

262 There has to be seismic evidence of explosions versus rupture.
Posted by: Ciampino - it was sabotage at October 02, 2022 01:55 PM (qfLjt)

There was, the Swedes put that out day one from Swedish and Danish seismological stations.
(Sweden and Denmark are very careful about monitoring the Baltic)

Here is the report, it is in Swedish

https://tinyurl.com/swedeseismic

Posted by: Kindltot at October 02, 2022 02:01 PM (xhaym)

263 They don't want to talk about the historic turn about losing recruits from legacy military families or potential quality recruits looking at leadership saying, ya, no.
___

Not to mention the areas that most recruits are pulled from, the Midwest and Southeast, just happen to be chock full of deplorable domestic terrorists, according to TPTB.

Bit of a dilemma there.

Posted by: SMH at October 02, 2022 02:01 PM (+my1P)

264 Despite the military’s efforts to lure individuals in with bigger bonuses and programs, military leaders point to a tight labor market and a private industry that is providing stiff competition for the applicant pool.

https://valorguardians.com/blog/?p=131634
Posted by: SMH

I'm hearing its more like 40%.

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 02:01 PM (anj39)

265 Putin aint bluffing

all for a country that had the GDP of Arkansas
Posted by: REDACTED at October 02, 2022 01:55

23 years of "Putinism" means only bootlickers are in decision making positions in Russia. You can see the effects of Putinism in Ukraine where Russia just lost Lyman yesterday.

Prior to the war, 85% of Russian foreign revenues came from hydrocarbon exports. 40% of that was from NS 1.

No way Putin blew up that pipeline. The US did it, just like Biden and Nulland promised.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:01 PM (uWxoj)

266 "Stable pressure has been achieved in the damaged Nord Stream 1 pipeline, authorities in Denmark say, indicating the outflow of natural gas from the last leaks has now halted."

https://tinyurl.com/3wdhj9zr

?

Posted by: Javems at October 02, 2022 02:02 PM (9kmCi)

267

Y'all full of shit.

I'm full of shit.

Every post is full of shit.

Whatever the truth is, it's not to be found on this blog.

Posted by: Quantum Manhole at October 02, 2022 02:02 PM (59T1G)

268 >>> 218 I don't care if we did it, the Russians did it, or the Martians did it.

It was an act of unparalleled stupidity for Blinken to gloat about how good it was that Germany has been prevented from buying natural gas from Russia.

Just amazingly, amazingly stupid. Did anyone in the State Department note what the reaction of German voters would be to this statement?
Posted by: The ARC of History! at October 02, 2022 01:49 PM (I2/tG)

Some *German* politician just told her supposed constituents she doesn't GAF if they want to quit KEEEV; why would *our* politicians care about anything they think?

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 02:02 PM (llON8)

269 227 >How long would it take to bring it back on line?

Two weeks./

Posted by: Fool Otto at October 02, 2022 01:50 PM (DB16e)
----
Yes, if Japanese contractors do it. Remember how quickly they repaired the freeway(s) in Japan after the natural disaster?

Posted by: Ciampino - yes, it was sabotage at October 02, 2022 02:02 PM (qfLjt)

270 Are we producing enough LNG to export to them?

I thought LNG was a by product of oil production.

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 02:02 PM (D5Ffb)

271 235
'Biden has scrambled eggs in that withered old man skull'

Biden himself is dumber than a bag of shit.
But that doesn't mean the people he is fronting for are.
They are ruthless, demand control and seem to have no idea of the risks they are taking.

Posted by: Dr. Claw at October 02, 2022 02:02 PM (roH4R)

272 When it comes down to it I believe that we did it. Our leaders are monumentally stupid, sand-poundingly illiterate from a historical viewpoint, and profoundly un-wise. Mix this with an un-paralled sense of self-esteem and you have an extremely dangerous and volatile combination.

Posted by: Chairborne!...Desk From Above! at October 02, 2022 02:02 PM (prmS3)

273 Just pressure equalizing with water pressure at depth I assume.

Posted by: Javems at October 02, 2022 02:03 PM (9kmCi)

274 Rods from God, of course.

Posted by: Caesar North of the Rubicon at October 02, 2022 02:03 PM (7B5FA)

275 245 Putin aint bluffing

he has already done what he set out to do

he has annexed what he wants and left the other part in shambles, for the US to rebuild

ah. the next dimension in the n-dimensional chess game being plaid by putin, protector of the faith, makes an appearance.

Posted by: kulak anachronda at October 02, 2022 02:04 PM (edU/H)

276 >>> Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable a Clear and Present Danger at October 02, 2022 01:57 PM (u4CEu)

Pssst... it's a troll.

Notice how many nics have popped up in this thread that have never been seen before, nor will again?

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 02:06 PM (llON8)

277 @Braenyard, yes and no. Associated gas is a junior partner to gas produced on purpose, but it still is part of the mix.

Posted by: Caesar North of the Rubicon at October 02, 2022 02:06 PM (7B5FA)

278 >>Western Companies built it. Western Companies ran it.

Yea, I get what you're saying but the ultimate owner of the pipeline and the maintenance company is the Russia government.

Have the other stakeholders had anything to say to suggest maintenance wasn't up to snuff?

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 02:07 PM (kOpft)

279 There's no such thing as a "hypersonic bomber".
Posted by: Pork Chops & Bacons

The only manned hypersonic (Mach 5+) plane I know of is the X-15: max speed Mach 6.7, and current world record holder.

And it's more of a B-52-launched manned cruise missile than a "plane".

Posted by: mikeski at October 02, 2022 02:07 PM (P1f+c)

280 You may want to take a look at to what the Party Military's 6th Fleet was doing in the Baltic Sea in July.

https://tinyurl.com/mueuckfn

"In support of BALTOPS, U.S. Navy 6th Fleet partnered with U.S. Navy research and warfare centers to bring the latest advancements in unmanned underwater vehicle mine hunting technology to the Baltic Sea to demonstrate the vehicle’s effectiveness in operational scenarios."

If you can get them, you can lay them. That is how you can set heavy explosives on two pipes and not have satellites pick up the activity.

Posted by: Reuben Hick at October 02, 2022 02:08 PM (3hSHB)

281 266 "Stable pressure has been achieved in the damaged Nord Stream 1 pipeline, authorities in Denmark say, indicating the outflow of natural gas from the last leaks has now halted."
https://tinyurl.com/3wdhj9zr

?
Posted by: Javems a
-------------------------------

Another win for Flex Seal

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 02:08 PM (D5Ffb)

282 1) There would have to have been some common mode failure that blew up four separate pipelines within a 48-hour period, which would be simply unprecedented. The pipelines were merely pressurized, but they weren't transporting gas, so it's not as if gas was moving through the pipe at the time of the explosions.

Posted by: The ARC of History!
-----------------------------------
Might want to read the the addendum to lawdog's original post. https://thelawdogfiles.com/

Apparently, one of the four pipelines, Nordstream, Nordstream II B is still operational as far as Reuters is concerned. https://tinyurl.com/2p94m8wh

Posted by: whig at October 02, 2022 02:08 PM (CXr4y)

283 Did anyone in the State Department note what the reaction of German voters would be to this statement?

Of course not. This is so far over their heads and out of their control that it's just dog wagging at this point.

Posted by: Notorious BFD at October 02, 2022 02:10 PM (Xrfse)

284 Whatever the truth is, it's not to be found on this blog.

Posted by: Quantum Manhole
-------------------------
Not true, you are basically throwing away any information that might point to truth or falsity. In most situations, you have to approach 'truth' probabilistically.

Posted by: whig at October 02, 2022 02:11 PM (CXr4y)

285 195 OK, now I'm confused, noting new actually, but how many pipe lines were blown up how many times?

Posted by: Javems

ALL the pipelines. Forever.

Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at October 02, 2022 02:11 PM (x61Im)

286 266 "Stable pressure has been achieved in the damaged Nord Stream 1 pipeline, authorities in Denmark say, indicating the outflow of natural gas from the last leaks has now halted."

https://tinyurl.com/3wdhj9zr

?

the gas got out and the pipes are now at the ambient pressure

Posted by: kulak anachronda at October 02, 2022 02:11 PM (edU/H)

287 Whoever is in charge of the corrupt Spongebrain Shitpants junta ordered this. NATO wants this war. UK wants this war. Weapons mfrs REALLY want this war. Some of our supposed "allies" were possibly showing some cold feet with the coming winter, and might have been amenable to some peace negotiations in exchange for turning NS1 back on. This action renders that moot.

If both pipes went simultaneously, then that would absolutely prove deliberate sabotage, but with the spacing apart that puts some ambiguity and "plausible denial" in play.

Posted by: No Shirt Shylock at October 02, 2022 02:11 PM (cDITE)

288 Seems to me that if the explosion was caused by NG it is missing a key ingredient to make it explody. Oxygen.

Posted by: Jimco Industries at October 02, 2022 02:12 PM (buTO7)

289 Apparently, one of the four pipelines, Nordstream, Nordstream II B is still operational as far as Reuters is concerned. https://tinyurl.com/2p94m8wh
===
1. Reuters
2. Analists say

That means that NSIIB is non functional in real terms.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable and Totally Unserious at October 02, 2022 02:12 PM (u4CEu)

290 Pppssstttt!
Nood!
And check out the shelfwork!

Posted by: Diogenes at October 02, 2022 02:12 PM (anj39)

291 Notice how many nics have popped up in this thread that have never been seen before, nor will again?

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 02:06 PM

If you are referring to me, I have been posting here since 2006. Just not very often.

So your troll detector don't cut it.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:12 PM (uWxoj)

292 281 266 "Stable pressure has been achieved in the damaged Nord Stream 1 pipeline, authorities in Denmark say, indicating the outflow of natural gas from the last leaks has now halted."
https://tinyurl.com/3wdhj9zr

?
Posted by: Javems a
-------------------------------

Another win for Flex Seal

"to prove the power of flex seal, we blew holes in these pipelines..."

hmm. i could see it.

Posted by: kulak anachronda at October 02, 2022 02:12 PM (edU/H)

293 BRB, going to make sure my morning stable pressure has been achieved. Which is just slightly more than in the NS pipeline but not by much.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable and Totally Unserious at October 02, 2022 02:15 PM (u4CEu)

294 If the pipelines were still operable then there would be pressure to make a deal with the Russians this winter when western Europeans are freezing to death in the dark.

Now there is a plausible reason the politicians can give them as to why that is not possible and they can continue with the war.

The other benefit to western regimes is that they can now use the crisis to push their green agenda because no one is going to say no to more power, even if it is expensive and unreliable.

So it very much benefits the globalists to blow the pipelines for the very reason that it screws the people and gives them fewer options. It does not benefit the Russians at all.

Posted by: Thatch at October 02, 2022 02:15 PM (K8Q4r)

295 I thought LNG was a by product of oil production.

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022

NG is a by-product of oil production. LNG is the cryogenic cooling of NG, for transport, usually by ship.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:15 PM (uWxoj)

296 So your troll detector don't cut it.
Posted by: Muthaucker at Octo
====================

You come around on Sunday's to avoid Fenelon nailing you down.

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022 02:17 PM (D5Ffb)

297 288 Seems to me that if the explosion was caused by NG it is missing a key ingredient to make it explody. Oxygen.
Posted by: Jimco Industries at October 02, 2022 02:12 PM

H2O makes things go boom, too. Thats why you don't spray water on a Class D fire.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:18 PM (uWxoj)

298 54 from wikipedia re: the andreev bay incident: "An attempt to eliminate the leak was made by pouring in 20 sacks of flour, thus filling the cracks with dough. However, the leak continued, and the service personnel discovered icing on the right side of the building. "

clearly, they were making yellowcake.

Posted by: kulak anachronda at October 02, 2022 12:32 PM (edU/H)
----
Was it yellow sponge-cake?

Posted by: Sponge Bob Triangular Shorts at October 02, 2022 02:19 PM (qfLjt)

299
What there will be is a whole lot of cold, unemployed Germans looking to blame someone.

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 01:45 PM

Uh-oh.

Posted by: Austria at October 02, 2022 02:19 PM (y3pKJ)

300 Was it the DARK BRANDON?
Remember he sent his Gangster Pelosi on a fly in tweaking the Chinese. And the biggest +40%) developed expressly for land attack missions to the South China Sea. Might even do the Taiwan Straits.
China is sort of a Paper Dragon . For the last 35 years it's 1 child policy has cut in halp that population under 35yo.75% of it's oil is imported from the MidEast whose water routes are kept open only by the US Navy. Lol Somali pirates could close them if we weren't stopping them

Posted by: Paul at October 02, 2022 02:19 PM (qY/59)

301 but Nordstream1 was shut down after Russia entered Ukraine, as Biden had promised? (not sure on the timing)

Posted by: illiniwek
-------------------
Putin shut Nordstream 1 A and B down on July 11th for 'maintenance'.

Posted by: whig at October 02, 2022 02:19 PM (CXr4y)

302 296 So your troll detector don't cut it.
Posted by: Muthaucker at Octo

You come around on Sunday's to avoid Fenelon nailing you down.

Posted by: Braenyard, _ want nuremberg trials? badger your congressman at October 02, 2022

I came back out for Ian. Don't know who Fenelon is, but I am sure they are very pleasant.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:19 PM (uWxoj)

303 Did someone say they got a pipe?

Crack ain't gonna smoke itself!

Posted by: Hunter Biden, The Bad Guy at October 02, 2022 02:19 PM (R/m4+)

304 294 If the pipelines were still operable then there would be pressure to make a deal with the Russians this winter when western Europeans are freezing to death in the dark.

Now there is a plausible reason the politicians can give them as to why that is not possible and they can continue with the war.

The other benefit to western regimes is that they can now use the crisis to push their green agenda because no one is going to say no to more power, even if it is expensive and unreliable.

So it very much benefits the globalists to blow the pipelines for the very reason that it screws the people and gives them fewer options. It does not benefit the Russians at all.

Posted by: Thatch
-----------------
Nordstream IIB is still operational per Reuters Sept. 28.

Posted by: whig at October 02, 2022 02:20 PM (CXr4y)

305 >>> 291 Notice how many nics have popped up in this thread that have never been seen before, nor will again?

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 02:06 PM

If you are referring to me, I have been posting here since 2006. Just not very often.

So your troll detector don't cut it.
Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:12 PM (uWxoj)

Oh ffs. I don't recognize your nic either, although maybe this post was of more interest than others to you. But maybe go back and pay attention to the timestamp on *Jukin's* comment that I quoted. Are you also sarge6, and/or any/all the other "new" nics that appeared once and only once in this thread?

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 02:20 PM (llON8)

306 If it were my decision, i would triple security at those places.

It is never a bad time to buy more corvettes.

Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at October 02, 2022 02:22 PM (x61Im)

307 That means that NSIIB is non functional in real terms.

Posted by: Jukin
--------------------
There are other sources if you would care to google it. Basically, Nordstream II was never certified by the Germans for operation but apparently was capable of holding pressure and operating. Ukraine invasion upset the actual certification.

Posted by: whig at October 02, 2022 02:22 PM (CXr4y)

308 "In support of BALTOPS, U.S. Navy 6th Fleet partnered with U.S. Navy research and warfare centers to bring the latest advancements in unmanned underwater vehicle mine hunting technology to the Baltic Sea to demonstrate the vehicle’s effectiveness in operational scenarios."

If you can get them, you can lay them. That is how you can set heavy explosives on two pipes and not have satellites pick up the activity.
Posted by: Reuben Hick at October 02, 2022 02:08 PM

"Exercises" have long been used by the CIA to run covert ops. I would give great credence to the explosives being placed during BALTOPS. BALTOPS was in June 2022 also...tells you how long the planning for this BS has been going on.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:24 PM (uWxoj)

309 Of course there are. There are alternate pipelines and LNG carriers, but it will be hugely expensive and require concessions on the part of Europe.

Are you sure? I meant the emphasis in my previous comment to be on "adequate" supply. I feel pretty safe assuming LNG transports can't carry as much as a pipeline, safely, or there'd be no reason to build pipelines. And also, with our just in time everything everywhere supply system, how many 'spare' LNG carriers are their to assign to the task?

Is the pipeline to Poland that just got opened going to have the capacity to replace what NS 1 and 2 supplied if they were on? I have no idea, but it doesn't seem likely (and that's before considering that said pipeline is the prime target for Russian reprisal).

Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 02:25 PM (kOpft)

310 Don't know who Fenelon is

OK. We're done here.

Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at October 02, 2022 02:25 PM (x61Im)

311 Oh ffs. I don't recognize your nic either, although maybe this post was of more interest than others to you. But maybe go back and pay attention to the timestamp on *Jukin's* comment that I quoted. Are you also sarge6, and/or any/all the other "new" nics that appeared once and only once in this thread?
Posted by: Helena Handbasket at October 02, 2022 02:20 PM

No, I am none of those. I was "sailor dude" back in day.

Who are you? Some self-appointed schoolmarm?

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:26 PM (uWxoj)

312 310 Don't know who Fenelon is

OK. We're done here.
Posted by: Way, Way Downriver at October 02, 2022 02:25 PM

I don't spend my life on blogs.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:27 PM (uWxoj)

313 221 LawDog makes a good case for an accident. There are holes in his theory, but without much data, it's better than most! But would I be surprised if we discover that it was indeed sabotage?

And the problem here is that we're all going to see the lack of good information through our particular worldviews.
Posted by: Methos
----------------------
This is the best post by far on the thread. Simply put, all of us are viewing through a glass darkly until more facts come about. So, the prudent thing is to wait until we get those facts before stating with authority that this or that is the 'true story' of what happened. FWIW, lawdog has some additional thoughts on the matter and he states that either the sabotage or accident could explain it. Apparently under either hypothesis, incompetence exists as one of the four pipelines (Nordstream IIB) is apparently still functional as per news reports.

Posted by: whig at October 02, 2022 02:28 PM (CXr4y)

314 Just wait until you see our vast fleets of nuclear-capable trucks!

On it.

Posted by: Wayne Enterprises at October 02, 2022 02:29 PM (kOpft)

315 309 Of course there are. There are alternate pipelines and LNG carriers, but it will be hugely expensive and require concessions on the part of Europe.

Are you sure? I meant the emphasis in my previous comment to be on "adequate" supply. I feel pretty safe assuming LNG transports can't carry as much as a pipeline, safely, or there'd be no reason to build pipelines. And also, with our just in time everything everywhere supply system, how many 'spare' LNG carriers are their to assign to the task?

Is the pipeline to Poland that just got opened going to have the capacity to replace what NS 1 and 2 supplied if they were on? I have no idea, but it doesn't seem likely (and that's before considering that said pipeline is the prime target for Russian reprisal).
Posted by: Methos at October 02, 2022 02:25 PM

You are right. US LNG exports will not be
adequate, but the price will be.

Posted by: Muthaucker at October 02, 2022 02:29 PM (uWxoj)

316 cenario: first pipeline is setup with bang-bang. The second one? The sabotage team has problems hence the delay. Remember the DC Junta stated that #2 would never go on-stream. LawDog is wrong. #1 has been running for a long while and no explosions before the Uke war! There were 2 explosions in each pipeline, am I correct? The US Navy was around there at the time or not long before the explosions. There has to be seismic evidence of explosions versus rupture.

Posted by: Ciampino
---------------
FWIW, there are four pipelines--A and B for each of the Nordstreams. Three out of four were ruptured.

Posted by: whig at October 02, 2022 02:33 PM (CXr4y)

317 110 When on safari in Africa, never goose a rouge elephant or for that matter, a nervous gunbearer

Posted by: MAC V SOG at October 02, 2022 01:01 PM (P4Pk9)
----
In 40+ years of living in African I have never seen a red elephant. Are these the ones that paint their toenails red and then hide in cherry trees? Or was it blueberry bushes (they were colorblind)?

Posted by: Ciampino - watch out for that crow with a machine-gun at October 02, 2022 02:33 PM (qfLjt)

318 This city was in the area that was just supposedly Annexed, and now the Ukrainians are posting videos and laughing openly about it. Russian milbloggers are furious, demanding that Putin do something extreme to counter this outrage. His army, however, is clearly not capable of doing it. Posted by: Tom Servo
----------------------------
Right now, I don't think a number of people are rational about what is going on. That is the cost of lie after lie from the media and the governments worldwide.

Posted by: whig at October 02, 2022 02:36 PM (CXr4y)

319 Cui bono? Team NATO/Ukraine.

Posted by: Miley, okravangelist at October 02, 2022 02:40 PM (Mzdiz)

320 So we're in agreement, then. It was the Methodists. Some splitter group on a Jello mold Jihad against the filthy Lutherens.

Posted by: Bilwis Devourer of Innocent Souls, I'm starvin' over here at October 02, 2022 02:43 PM (cupoy)

321 "Why would Russia blow up its own pipelines, when they could simply close the valves (they weren't pumping gas anyway) and make up any number of stories without having to repair any damage?"

Let's be fair here, the Russians have been pretty fucking retarded lately. Normally they're on point in pursuing their own interests in a sort of creeping, single-minded way, taking into account their ham-fistedness. In this case they've pretty clearly been conned by both the West and the Chinese into shooting themselves in the dick re: Ukraine. So the pipeline is not out of the realm of possibility.

Pretty much the ONLY faction that doesn't, or couldn't, benefit from this is Germany. And I have to admit I am out of fucks regarding what does or doesn't benefit Germany; their former DDR leadership played a huge role in making this all happen.

Posted by: somedood at October 02, 2022 03:06 PM (ns4uC)

322 "No military is going to arrange for two pipes in the same general area to be destroyed 17 hours apart."

Statement status: pulled from ass. Why would any actor not stage the explosions a few hours apart? Having them all at the same instant would pretty much guarantee it was sabotage. Having them occur spaced in time leaves room for doubt to creep in.

And if the line is shut down, you cannot run a pig through it to clean it. Pigs are driven by the pressure of the gas on the upstream side. As far as methane clathrates go, they need water (and the right P-T conditions) to form. Whence came the water? A small leak in the line would leak gas out, not water in.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at October 02, 2022 03:16 PM (UgX/g)

323 When Hunter goes commando, it's a 911 situation because some bitches are going to be compromised.

Posted by: Dr. Bone at October 02, 2022 03:18 PM (z+OQR)

324 "If these assclowns don't get us all incinerated in a nuclear war it will be nothing less than a miracle."

I'm thinking our betters underestimate Putin, his anger at some Alzheimer-ed diapered, hair plugged sock puppet who yells randomly, 'My butt's been wiped!!' making a fool out of him on the world stage.

We won't be able to respond, what with a gutted military and fuel reserves sold off, manufacturing gone, paper money worthless and politicians beholden to China.

That's all a part of 'Fundamental Transformation' and 'Change We Can Believe In' brought to you by 'The Ones We Have Been Waiting For.' Who, by the way, are busy digging bomb shelters to hide in until whatever hits the fan eventually dies down.

Posted by: Ju at October 02, 2022 03:42 PM (aTmM/)

325 Tyler Durden at ZH makes a pretty good case for the EU itself having done it.

https://tinyurl.com/4xea4j8t

Whoever did it, I don't believe the accident theory, or that Russia did it.

Posted by: Taqiyyologist, Rickrolled by Jesus at October 02, 2022 03:52 PM (YJwUM)

326 Or we can respect Occam's Razor, which suggests that the simplest explanation is often the best one. And in the cold light of day, who would bet against crappy Russian maintenance and top-down management of a problem that causes a much, much bigger problem?
____________

You mean the folks that brought us Chernobyl have struck again? Unpossible.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara - Semi-Fascist at October 02, 2022 03:53 PM (YqDXo)

327 So I read through lawdogs theory. It requires a lot more rare coincidences than explosives. Here’s the weakest parts of his theory.

Gravity. Water collecting in a pipeline likes to collect in low areas. The pipeline where the failure took place is at one of the highest elevation points of the pipeline run. Why would ALL these incidents occur there?

Distance. This is really far from the compressor station. Why would the clathrates form at the highest point and farthest from the compressors? I would have expected this sort of incident to occur closer to the compressor.

“Synchronicity”. All the excursions occur in the same area? So all the water collected at the highest point of the pipeline, farthest from the compressor, and caused failures in approximately the same area? Instead of randomly dispersed?

I have a few others but I also have to say if a lawyer is aware of clathrate dangers, the Russian engineers were also aware. I won’t dismiss them being incompetent. But they aren’t Soviet era. These guys were working with the Germans and I expect they are somewhat competent.

I dismiss lawdogs explanation.

Posted by: Justin Castreau at October 02, 2022 04:10 PM (ai2Yq)

328 As far as methane clathrates go, they need water (and the right P-T conditions) to form. Whence came the water? A small leak in the line would leak gas out, not water in.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon

Most of the incidents I know of with clathrates are on the upstream side. My knowledge of downstream is not as good, but I expect the systems were professionally designed with the Germans to remove water (as I know certain large utilities that I have worked with do). But I agree with this and the timing. If I was doing it I would also try to make it look like a random explosion.

I think the Ukrainians and poles are the most likely culprits. And maybe the psycho environmentalists of the eu.

Posted by: Justin Castreau at October 02, 2022 04:17 PM (ai2Yq)

329 H2O makes things go boom, too. Thats why you don't spray water on a Class D fire.
Posted by: Muthaucker

That’s a metal reaction fire. Steel isn’t among those thing that react poorly to water.

Posted by: Justin Castreau at October 02, 2022 04:24 PM (ai2Yq)

330 last!!

Posted by: Jimco Industries at October 02, 2022 04:55 PM (buTO7)

331 Means, motive opportunity-China.
They benefit no matter what.

Posted by: Craig Austin at October 02, 2022 05:05 PM (ZtllJ)

332 Lawdog has HUGE holes in his theory ...
1) corrosion leaks (thats what he is claiming) simply do not EXPLODE ... period full stop ... they leak ... (on land they can THEN lead to an explosion but underwater ???? no)
2) they certainly don't leak with enough force to create seismic events that are recorded miles away ...

Posted by: The Dark Lord at October 02, 2022 05:19 PM (5cMUX)

333 I think the Ukrainians and poles are the most likely culprits. And maybe the psycho environmentalists of the eu.
Posted by: Justin Castreau at October 02, 2022 04:17 PM (ai2Yq)

This is a lot more complicated than you are suggesting. Cold metal, even steel, or in my estimation "carbon steel"(ie cheap ass steel) causes hydroxides to form - CH4 and H2O under certain temperature and pressure conditions do form these hydroxides. The suggestion that hydrate crystals may have formed on non-maintainable sections of cold metal pipe has merit - along with the complete silence about the incident from the Russians.

But mostly because of the complete silence of the Russians on this incident.

Posted by: Boswell at October 02, 2022 05:24 PM (+Cgut)

334 good lord ... a non pressurized pipe WILL NOT EXPLODE underwater if there is a leak ... they were not under pressure ... (even under pressure they don't explode underwater ... but that meaningless in this case AS THEY WERE BOTH SHUT DOWN)

Lawdog is talking out the wrong end ...

Posted by: The Dark Lord at October 02, 2022 05:26 PM (5cMUX)

335 and the Russians have not been silent on this ...

Posted by: The Dark Lord at October 02, 2022 05:28 PM (5cMUX)

336 Why does one need a "massive" explosion to destroy a pipeline. Couple of shaped charges--if not available at Home Depot, maybe some mining firm, or a Combat Engineers supply room.

Don't know much about free diving. Read Cousteau's first book when I was maybe seven and not much more since then. But I did read about efforts to get into a German sub off our coast in just about 300'. Apparently, this is a "technical dive" and fairly dangerous if you aren't very well-trained and in very good shape. More details but I guess this is about as deep as you go in free diving.

From which it occurs to me that you wouldn't be schlepping hundreds of pounds of C4 or something on your back. Either take the aforementioned shaped charges or have a submersible construction vehicle.

And would there not be traces of the latter--intel and logistics, not necessarily tracks on the bottom? Submarine whereabouts known?

While our POTUS might be dumb enough to order it done, the guys doing is probably are pretty competent. So the seventeen hours might be a tell. Shouldn't happen, as Lawdog says.

Posted by: Richard Aubrey at October 02, 2022 06:29 PM (dSnnl)

337 263 They don't want to talk about the historic turn about losing recruits from legacy military families or potential quality recruits looking at leadership saying, ya, no.
___

Not to mention the areas that most recruits are pulled from, the Midwest and Southeast, just happen to be chock full of deplorable domestic terrorists, according to TPTB.

Bit of a dilemma there
***
Bit of a dilemma??? That's the last class of recruits they want - traditional normal Americans. WTF do you think they want? Hello hello. As gone in there?

Posted by: MikeN at October 02, 2022 06:36 PM (nPZeZ)

338 all of a sudden the russians,whose entire economy is energy driven are morons regarding how to keep said pi[pelines from self immolation.....

oh please...

Posted by: uncouth jay marks at October 02, 2022 06:40 PM (GT8Ln)

339 uncouth. They seem to have trouble with some of their other infrastructure, even without some vile, disgusting foreign software creeping in.

Posted by: Richard Aubrey at October 02, 2022 07:24 PM (dSnnl)

340 The obvious “cui bono” is a NATO member, probably the US. Germany and the rest of Europe are going to have a cold, miserable winter, and as the pain ramps up so would domestic pressure to make a deal with Russia to turn the tap on again.

So someone decides to pull a “smash the pots, burn the boats” manoeuvre and destroy the pipes, so Russia can never turn the pipes back on and there can be no possibility of negotiations or retreat from the Europeans.

On top of that, the US has a lot of LNG to sell Europe via boat.

Posted by: Zem at October 02, 2022 07:41 PM (87/Ni)

341 Putin accused the US of blowing up the pipeline. Biden promised Nordstream would not go forward if Russia invaded Ukraine. Multiple people accused Biden of sabotaging the pipeline, but I haven't heard a single denial. Wouldn't it make sense that Biden would vociferously deny involvement, if her weren't behind an attack? Instead, our State Dept is warning American citizens to vacate Russian post haste.

Fishy shit going down.

Posted by: red speck at October 02, 2022 07:47 PM (gS3OW)

342 Thanks, autocucumber, for all your help with my last post. You made it so much butter.

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Posted by: www.Profit97.Com at October 02, 2022 07:53 PM (7Rcvu)

344 Cui bono are the WEF brainwashed globalists that use every opportunity to force a 'transition to renewables'. They have shown zero concern for the lives of people, the Build Back Better agenda is world priority #1. Absolutely no way Russia would destroy one of their few levers of power. And the timing of the blasts does not support the idea it was accidental. More that the special team to do the job required travel time.

Posted by: Jacques Endabocks at October 02, 2022 07:57 PM (JcnFx)

345 . The suggestion that hydrate crystals may have formed on non-maintainable sections of cold metal pipe has merit
Posted by: Boswell

Sure. But you need water. A lot of it to form the sort of plugs he’s discussing And water at depth is 4 C. Constant. I discussed this a few days ago.
These are shallow waters at higher elevations than most of the rest of the pipeline. This sort of incident would b3 more likely at the lowest elevations closer to Russia. And it all coincidentally happened there?

His comments about angles assumes that the maps are accurate and the pipeline is built like it is on land. It is not. It is welded on ship and extruded like a giant cable with a rapidly setting concrete casing like a sausage skin. The ship will make turns but the will be wide from a radius point of view. So there won’t be a direct impact at a corner like he hypothesized.

And there was battle space prep already for this.
https://tinyurl.com/bdewbbja
Explosive-Laden Drone Found Near Nord Stream Pipeline Fri, 11/13/2015 - 11:41

Posted by: Justin Castreau at October 02, 2022 08:02 PM (ai2Yq)

346 I would differ. 220 feet is not very deep for modern equipment, and there are parties with motive, means and opportunity to grease the skids of a war that would engulf the EU and the US and substantially cheapen its assets. I would look at the privileged caste of the ultrawealthy who make money speculating on National and regional miseries.

Posted by: Carlos Rodriguez at October 02, 2022 09:46 PM (I+sb2)

347 US Energy Information Administration said the
US sent nearly three quarters of all its liquefied natural gas to Europe in the first four months of 2022, with daily shipments to the region more than tripling from last year’s average.

Increased production in TX & LA = potential for more profits, especially where there's flexibility in supply contracts, ie. Routing to Europe v. Asia.

In the meantime, awaiting solid investigative/ fact finding reports for conclusive reasons for the NORD pipeline explosions.

Posted by: Lola at October 03, 2022 02:20 AM (NIYa7)

348
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Posted by: Katie Garrison at October 03, 2022 03:21 AM (6sUY/)

349 Here's my take:

(1) No western powers did this. If they got caught the consequences would be dire politically. Germany would be incensed with the US, Russia would argue it a causus belli. US statements about stopping Nordstream 2 were in the context of "since you invaded Ukraine we're going to ensure you're not allowed to use your pipeline", it was a political statement, not a physical threat.

(2) If anyone did this intentionally it would be the Russians. Its the sort of "I'm burning the ships" kind of move. It says "Europe can freeze before we ever give them gas again". It also matches with the Russian mentality. There's an old joke: A frenchman, an englishman and russian all learn they have 1 day left to live. The frenchman says, only one day to live, I shall make love to three beautiful women and eat a gourmet meal, and then I shall die happy. The englishman says, I shall take my favourite wolfhound for a walk along the moor, and stop at the pub for a beer, and then I shall die happy. The Russian thinks for a moment and say "I shall burn down my neighbour's house". That's the sort of punitive mentality that inhabits the Russian nationalist.

Posted by: P.Mo. at October 03, 2022 10:01 AM (6Cx+M)

350 BUT... my money is on neglect. The pipeline is shut off, no maintenance, its cold under the water, ice crystals form, then boom. Since both pipelines are shut at roughly the same time, they both go boom at close to the same time.

Posted by: P.Mo. at October 03, 2022 10:03 AM (6Cx+M)

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