Bolton Departs Trump Administration; Trump and Bolton Spar Over Whether Bolton Offered to Resign, or Was Asked to Resign

Twitter spat below. If you care, I assume Bolton is closer to the truth (though conversations can be murky and vague -- everyone practices a bit of Japanese Executive-style obfuscation).

I've just seen Trump care too much about very small possible slights to his ego -- things like this. Things like whether it was Trump's idea that someone should go, or that person wanted to go of his own accord. "You're not breaking up with me, because I already secretly broke up with you last week!" That kind of childishness.

I hate this crap. Not only does it demonstrate that Trump lies easily and sometimes might not even know he's lying (or offering an alternative take on reality), but I do think this sort of infantile spat over nothing suggests an ego simultaneously overweening and fragile -- the worst sort of ego to have. A dangerous one.

And how this must impact the people who are willing to work for Trump. They go in knowing they'll be savaged by the press and the Republican Establishment. But to compound it with the knowledge that if they have any disagreement with the President, he'll feel it necessary to announce to the world "I fired him"?

Like I said, people are often not very clear when they speak in a situation of conflict. Maybe Trump does think he was indeed suggesting to Bolton that maybe it would be better if he resigned, and maybe he did suggest that. Maybe this is nothing more than a dispute over ambiguous language and obfuscated intentions.

Still, we see a lot of this.

Added:

I was just talking with a pro-Trump reporter this weekend, and we were discussing Trump's staffing problems. He pointed out that people just don't think of how tiny a number of people Trump had when he came into office, and most of those were supporters with no experience in any subject-matter area or government bureaucracy.

As opposed to the armies of longtime government workers that were loyal to the Bushes (out of ideological reasons or just because they know the Bushes are always good for a paycheck) or to Hillary, who used "charity" funds to keep her Government In Waiting paid and on the team.

Trump just doesn't have that many people to pick from.

This problem has plagued Trump since day one. Not having enough of a government-in-waiting to man so much as an FBI field office, he had to rely heavily on Establishment GOP and NeverTrumpers to serve as his top staffers, and those people then got to pick the next level of staffers and the levels after that.

These people made sure that their people -- GOPe people, NeverTrump people -- got in to the Trump Administration, and that the few conservatives with government experience or subject-matter expertise who were actually Trumpites were kept out.

I know a guy who had a great deal of experience in diplomacy and was a day one Trump supporter. And I mean a public supporter; he put his name to it.

He was literally told, "That's going to count against you" when he sought a State Department posting under Trump, the man he had publicly supported.

And in fact it did; he was given the runaround in his interview process until anti-Trump forces could fill the job that Trump wanted him to have with an anti-Trumper.

So Trump doesn't have a lot of people he can call upon to serve, and a lot of the people who he could call upon have already been frozen out by the anti-Trump political staffers he put in place because he had few other options.

That means that any time he treats a departing staffer poorly, he scares off some of the few people willing to work for him.

When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.

I informed John Bolton last night that his services are no longer needed at the White House. I disagreed strongly with many of his suggestions, as did others in the Administration, and therefore....
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) September 10, 2019

I offered to resign last night and President Trump said, "Let's talk about it tomorrow."
— John Bolton (@AmbJohnBolton) September 10, 2019

Bolton is texting members of the media right now to reiterate his tweet saying he resigned, and was not fired as Trump said in his tweet. https://t.co/ObbDMWUBVV
— Oliver Darcy (@oliverdarcy) September 10, 2019

I like this exchange.

Clearly year 19 of the war that you aren’t fighting will be the one that finally does it.

The inability to defend this war in anything other than vague abstractions like “soft” and “tough” gives away that there is no policy here worth the name, only a pose.
— The End Times (@TheAgeofShoddy) September 10, 2019

Sean Davis has had enough of the kneejerk gainsaying of the "Forever War" caucus:

I don’t think the Forever War caucus quite understands that its huffy disapprovals of foreign policy personnel changes are often taken as proof that the personnel changes were sorely needed. https://t.co/YeZZMq9nRK
— Sean Davis (@seanmdav) September 10, 2019

This guy offers this "top five" of people I think he's claiming are under active consideration as Bolton's replacement:

Fast developing, is going to change

But top five, in no order:

Grenell
Biegun
Macgregor
Keene
Hook
— Curt Mills (@CurtMills) September 10, 2019

Friends say this: Biegun is formerly an aide to Condi Rice, and would deliver, presumably, Condi-Rice-style advice.

Keane was a big proponent of the Iraq Surge, and they say he is generally aligned with neocon theorist Robert Kagan.

MacGregor urges the immediate evacuation from Afghanistan, come hell or high water, and was a chief planner for... General Wesley Clarke.

Brian Hook is, chatter says, a "disaster:"

Hook is the founder of Latitude, LLC, an international consulting firm based in Washington, DC. He serves on the advisory board of Beacon Global Strategies.[citation needed]
Hook worked on the 2012 Romney campaign staff as senior advisor on foreign policy. He chaired the foreign policy and national security task forces of the Romney Readiness Project. He was the foreign policy director of Governor Tim Pawlenty's presidential campaign from 2010-2011.[citation needed]
In 2013, he co-founded the John Hay Initiative,[2] an anti-isolationist group intended to inform political leaders about foreign policy.
In 2018 Pompeo set up the Iran Action Group to coordinate and run U.S. policy toward Iran with Hook as its head.
Hook serves on the board of trustees for St. John's Seminary in Boston and the board of directors for the National Civic Arts Society in Washington, DC.

Beacon Global Strategies is that very pro-Hillary firm where pro-Hillary government officials go to get paid for their service. Wikipedia describes them so:

A September 2013 article in Defense News, describes Beacon Global Strategies as unique for a Washington consulting firm because of its partners' intent to eventually return to government. The article noted that "Part of the confidence in future public service may stem from a combination of significant titles and relative youth, paired with the fact that most of the founders of the firm have ties to former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who may be a presidential favorite heading into the 2016 election if she decides to run."

One of the founders is Hillary Clinton's number one "Nasty Man," Phillipe Reines.

So the firm was really a Hillary-Clinton-Government-In-Waiting.

I don't know if I can say what I'm hearing, but I'll say that the claim being made (unverified) is that Hook has been a sneakily subversive presence in the administration.

Everyone knows Richard Grennell. While he might be sympatico with Trump's America First foreign policy agenda, he might not have the experience or clout for the job.

On the importance of parting ways amicably:

Posted by: Ace of Spades at 01:22 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Well... Bye.

Posted by: clutch cargo at September 10, 2019 01:21 PM (Z1ykJ)

2 Corgis called

Posted by: clutch cargo at September 10, 2019 01:22 PM (Z1ykJ)

3 You can't fire me, I quit!

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at September 10, 2019 01:22 PM (KUaJL)

4 Ace hitting the chicken button again. jesus, just stop commenting on stuff and concentrate on your daily colonic.

Posted by: Ched R Chze at September 10, 2019 01:22 PM (aVNi6)

5 Th

Posted by: Ha at September 10, 2019 01:23 PM (MAstk)

6 I do not care for this type of thing. You serve at the pleasure of POTUS, and when he lets you go, you go away silently. The whole "but I quit" garbage is weak.

Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 01:23 PM (wGbBR)

7

over nothing

That is truly Trump's Achilles heel. There's no reason to be so petty and thin-skinned about everything. That said, it's made him incredibly combative and hence effective in an age of political gladiator contests.

Posted by: imp at September 10, 2019 01:23 PM (w+Z9D)

8 Who gives a shit. PDT did not require Bolton's services any longer. Move on. This does not help my Yankees one bit

Posted by: Nevergiveup at September 10, 2019 01:24 PM (p0A33)

9 Breaking: The Patriots just signed Bolton to a one year deal.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at September 10, 2019 01:24 PM (kTF2Z)

10 Yeah. Like I said, they Donald has real issues with personnel.

Posted by: joncelli, who's totally not in the pay of Big Alien at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (RD7QR)

11 Bolton was there 17 months so he can't have been too much of a fuckup (compare: Scaramucci).

The way DJT handled this firing (or resignation) was clumsy, and it's giving more ammo to the "sharpiegate" twerps.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (ykYG2)

12 The whole "but I quit" garbage is weak.

Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 01:23 PM (wGbBR)
It does however help get you your permanent gig on MSNBC.

Posted by: clutch cargo at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (Z1ykJ)

13 As I said earlier, Romney loves Bolton so (obviously) Trump made the right move cleaning him out of the WH.

Having said that, these kinds of firings are a useful Rorschach test and lets follow closely who speaks out in favor of Bolton.

Posted by: Huck Follywood, a low grade social fever at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (LISuA)

14 I am not well-versed in the matters of war.

Posted by: Allie at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (sm6Pk)

15 9 Breaking: The Patriots just signed Bolton to a one year deal.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at September 10, 2019 01:24 PM (kTF2Z)

You're not allowed to win the thread so early!

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (KUaJL)

16 Grenell would be a good pick. He's definitely done a good job in Germany.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (oZ6kz)

17 If Donald Trump was hiring Bolton now instead of firing/him quitting then Mitt Romney would be opposed to it saying we need a more moderating voice.

Posted by: Buzzion at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (66KLX)

18 Bolton contacting the press to say "I quit! I wasn't fired" is weak to me. Everyone, let it go.

Mitt, STFU.

Posted by: Cheri at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (oiNtH)

19 We all do it. We are discussing the style of the departure and not the policy issues that caused it. Can we get out of Afghanistan?

I think it IS important that it was Trump's decision to ask Bolton to leave vs Bolton leaving. The difference is Trump executing his strategy vs not being able to keep advisors.

Posted by: Iris at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (lSFe/)

20 If you're in a position where you offer to resign, doesn't that mean you were made to resign?

Posted by: Moron Robbie is a Proud Black Woman - my word as a Biden at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (fsa/N)

21 A great, deeply ironical possibility is haunting my thoughts - and it's that Trump may in fact be the most reluctant President with regard to actual military force since Jimmy Carter. Of course after so many decades of overextension, it may be time for that.

Posted by: Tom Servo at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (Kpl3J)

22 MacGregor urges the immediate evacuation from Afghanistan, come hell or high water, and was a chief planner for... General Wesley Clarke.I

..

No. Unless you want more leaks.

Posted by: Ha at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (MAstk)

23 DJT does need to hear constructive criticism from his allies. He can blow off Kristol and McMullin and other cabin boys, and probably Shapiro as well, but he shouldn't blow off his base.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (ykYG2)

24 The way DJT handled this firing (or resignation) was clumsy, and it's giving more ammo to the "sharpiegate" twerps.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (ykYG2)

Trump's gonna Trump. I stopped caring or trying to defend him about a year ago.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (CQ3Qb)

25 Breaking: The Patriots just signed Bolton to a one year deal.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at September 10, 2019 01:24 PM (kTF2Z)

Perfect.

Posted by: DR.WTF at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (aS1PU)

26 17
Yep.

Posted by: Xipe Totec at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (Ol/Jg)

27 No truth to the rumors that Antonio Brown is on the shortlist?

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (oZ6kz)

28 I have no problem with Trump setting the record straight as he sees it. I also notice that a lot of people just off-handedly say "Trump lies all the time", yet I never hear any proof of that from those people......

Posted by: SSBN 656 (G) at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (jjaLl)

29 General Mike Flynn

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (BqBId)

30 Yeah. Like I said, they Donald has real issues with personnel.

Posted by: joncelli, who's totally not in the pay of Big Alien at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (RD7QR)

I've wondered about this a lot over the last 3 years. He didn't get where he is by not being able to read people. Are these beltway paramecium so very different? I can't believe these types of choices are part of his 4D chess.

Posted by: clutch cargo at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (Z1ykJ)

31 'You've got a big head!'

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 01:28 PM (0Uei+)

32 Sean Davis has had enough of the kneejerk gainsaying of the "Forever War" caucus:

-

"Forever War" was a really great book.

Posted by: Moron Robbie is a Proud Black Woman - my word as a Biden at September 10, 2019 01:28 PM (fsa/N)

33 This does not help my Yankees one bit

..

We don't need much help.

Posted by: Ha at September 10, 2019 01:28 PM (MAstk)

34 and Mitt can go suck a long dick. he can offer his opinion when he's shown he deserves others to hear it, which by my estimation will be "never".

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:28 PM (ykYG2)

35 Breaking: The Patriots just signed Bolton to a one year deal.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at September 10, 2019 01:24 PM (kTF2Z)
*******
At Least he is batshit Crazy like MEtonio Brown

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (BqBId)

36 "I asked you to resign."
'No I offered to resign and you accepted!"

Me: "Who gives a f*(k? You aren't there and that's the important takeaway."

Posted by: Mikey NTH -Support Your Sagging Self-Worth with Poses & Postures from The Outrage Outlet! at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (hLRSq)

37
Well..... Ben Fucking Shapiro has weighed in on the issue.

So its settled.

Ace..?... new thread please.

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (8XRCm)

38

As you can see, all the Wrong People supported Bolton.

Posted by: Soothsayer at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (kGJFi)

39 I don't like Trump's style sometimes either. But I also have to admit that almost any other Republican politician I can name, subjected to the astronomical level of shit that has been leveled at Trump for three solid years, would have been gently taken out of the White House on a stretcher, huddled in a fetal position.

That Trump is a bit crispy around the edges is understandable.

Posted by: MW at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (hNTtn)

40 How often does non-binary Ben Shapiro have to say Trump made a dumb move before he realizes he has no political instincts whatsoever?

Every time Trump does something here comes Ben to say it's dumb, it's tone-deaf, it's not a good look, whatever?

Ben may be smart, but that doesn't make him political savvy (just as someone like Pelosi can be dumb, but cunning and politically savvy).

Posted by: Lizzy at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (bDqIh)

41 Have no idea if Bolton was wanting to extend the current conflicts we are engaged in, or not.... his position on that is important to me....

Posted by: kraken at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (90T4r)

42 I was hoping Turd Ferguson would make the short-list.

Posted by: Scott at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (QvuuX)

43 Perhaps I am cracking up, but the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have done a number on my foreign policy views. Though not there yet, I find myself being drawn to the Glenn Greenwald/Tulsi Gabbard worldview more and more (i.e. stop meddling). Bolton represented a view I find less and less compelling in view of events over the last 18 years.

Posted by: Benji Carver at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (OD2ni)

44 ALL Slips are Pink in the dark.

Posted by: Ben Franklin at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (0Uei+)

45 That slapdown of Shapiro was great. I'm an admitted pussy and would never join the military. I also don't want never ending wars.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:30 PM (FiUMj)

46 17
If Donald Trump was hiring Bolton now instead of firing/him quitting
then Mitt Romney would be opposed to it saying we need a more moderating
voice.

Posted by: Buzzion at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (66KLX)

========

I see your point but, in this one case, I think you're off-base. Bolton worked for Romney and was his primary foreign policy advisor in the 2012 campaign. Sincere supporter of Bolton, I think.

Posted by: Huck Follywood, a low grade social fever at September 10, 2019 01:30 PM (LISuA)

47 We knew this about his personality before he became president. It's unfortunate that he can be quite petty and infantile, but it comes with the package. Sigh.

I don't remember his exact words, but Andrew Klavan says something like the personality required to do what Trump needs to do is not going to be a civilized, genteel personality.

Maybe his kids can talk to him about this, but I'm not hopeful. He's in his 70s, and clearly this behavior has worked for him throughout his life.

Posted by: chique d'afrique at September 10, 2019 01:30 PM (9hauA)

48 Donald Trump loves this country. That covers a lot of mistakes in my book. He loves the deplorable too, unlike the coastal elites who would marginalize us given a chance.

Posted by: Xipe Totec at September 10, 2019 01:30 PM (Ol/Jg)

49 *ISN'T* Instead of Is

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:30 PM (BqBId)

50 You're no good Hook, except to the Queen and Sergeant Maxfield.

Posted by: Sgt. Maxfield at September 10, 2019 01:30 PM (FTlwv)

51 what SSBN 656 said

its a throw away line that "Trump always lies" when we can see the results of being lied to by our political class in so many ways

budget and debt are major examples

Posted by: DanMan at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (XTiHL)

52 >>>4 Ace hitting the chicken button again. jesus, just stop commenting on stuff and concentrate on your daily colonic.
Posted by: Ched R Chze

Do you have actual information that would resolve the dispute, or are you just taking the position that everything Trump must be endlessly praised?

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (PbpT7)

53 Oh, and given that Trump has personal failings, he is not Hillary, or any of the Leftist alternatives... they are known to have a failing, or two.

Posted by: kraken at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (90T4r)

54 So Bolton is texting all his pals in the media, claiming he shot first... and Trump is the one being petty??

How?

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (cY3LT)

55 not first

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (iikV8)

56 So then what you're saying is we'll get Hook.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (YA914)

57 So will this be the new Alabama hurricane story, where it goes on for 10 days of he said, he said?

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (FiUMj)

58 I was surprised he got hired.
I was surprised he stayed more than 11 days.
I'm not surprised he's gone.

Too bad he can't stay in some secondary role but you can't have everything.

Posted by: torabora at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (BOrGu)

59 Hook?

F no.

Posted by: Ha at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (MAstk)

60 >>Ace hitting the chicken button again.

Ace is a gentleman.

The majority of chickens don't reach orgasm through penetrative sex.

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (0Uei+)

61 Briefing on now by Mnuchin and Pompeo

Posted by: Tami at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (cF8AT)

62 Trump definitely has isolationist leanings to which I can relate, but I'd rather kick ass and take names, laying enemies under tribute.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (yQpMk)

63 >>>I don't remember his exact words, but Andrew Klavan says something like the personality required to do what Trump needs to do is not going to be a civilized, genteel personality.

agreed

but this is a very unhelpful tic of his

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (PbpT7)

64 Further proof that Romney isn't representing Itah but rather just representing his presidential candidacy in 2024. Always there to stick his stupid voice into everything so he can get talked about because he knows he'll get his name in the news for trashing Trump. He has every intention of trying to be the "return to sanity" republican candidate.

Posted by: Buzzion at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (66KLX)

65 3 You can't fire me, I quit!

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at September 10, 2019 01:22 PM (KUaJL)

Whatever, either way your stuff's in a box and you're collecting your last paycheck.

Posted by: Mikey NTH -Support Your Sagging Self-Worth with Poses & Postures from The Outrage Outlet! at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (hLRSq)

66 I think it really is of little consequence weather Bolton offered to resign first, and while I uneasily agree with Ace's point that it reveals uncomfortable truths about Trump, the same can be said about Bolton running out to say "I wasn't fired! I quit."

No one would do this to Obama.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (NFEMn)

67 56 So then what you're saying is we'll get Hook.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (YA914)

============

If he doesn't currently hold the rank of Captain in some armed force, I'm going to oppose this until that happens.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (iikV8)

68

Listened to an old Rogan interview with Penn Gillette and they talked about Trump.

They used to have to sit in that "boardroom" for 3 hours to get 5 minutes of television. Couldn't move or put their hands on the table. Trump would grouse about critical (not even bad) press or even rando internet commenters. Something like some dork writing "Trump should have gotten $3 million for that!" when he got $2.5 or something. He would obsess over it.

Even so, he's the worst candidate except for all the others, just like representative republicanism.

Posted by: imp at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (w+Z9D)

69 Willard Romney is a sad, cruel joke. He's the lovable Golden Retriever who will chase the tennis ball until both of his hips are shot.

Posted by: Fritz at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (kLDv+)

70 "I have no problem with Trump setting the record straight as he sees it. I also notice that a lot of people just off-handedly say "Trump lies all the time", yet I never hear any proof of that from those people......"

Not really a big deal, but either Trump or Bolton is lying about when he resigned. I tend to believe Bolton.

Posted by: Benji Carver at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (OD2ni)

71 >>>56 So then what you're saying is we'll get Hook.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger

sigh. that does seem to be the rule.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (PbpT7)

72
I also notice that a lot of people just off-handedly say "Trump lies all the time", yet I never hear any proof of that from those people......
Posted by: SSBN 656 (G)

Oh, but there are 5,437 documented lies!!!!!

Posted by: MSNBS at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (aKsyK)

73 Breaking: The Patriots just signed Bolton to a one year deal.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at September 10, 2019 01:24 PM (kTF2Z)

LOL
Outstanding

Posted by: Nevergiveup at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (p0A33)

74
Please, Mr President, tweet this back to Bolton:

The important thing, John, is You're Gone.

Posted by: Soothsayer at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (kGJFi)

75 you're in a position where you offer to resign, doesn't that mean you were made to resign?
Posted by: Moron Robbie is a Proud Black Woman - my word as a Biden at September 10, 2019 01:26 PM (fsa/

They were in disagreement on a policy issue. Bolton offered to resign as people here have opined that is the correct thing to do. Trump allegedly did not accept at that time but tweeted subsequently that he fired Bolton, If accurate, that is pretty shitty.

Posted by: Pig to man dreaming of lions at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (2DOZq)

76 What they do at some levels of government, is simply that one pens their resignation letter upon taking a new position. The boss keeps it on file.

Posted by: Common Tater at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (ke5UQ)

77
agreed

but this is a very unhelpful tic of his
Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (PbpT7)

Yep.

Posted by: chique d'afrique at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (9hauA)

78 62 Trump definitely has isolationist leanings to which I can relate, but I'd rather kick ass and take names, laying enemies under tribute.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (yQpMk)

============

He seems more of a Jacksonian than anything.

Uninterested in foreign entanglements until it directly affects us, then it's full bore.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (iikV8)

79 Yeah, this shit bugs me about Trump, but it's part of the package - if he wasn't like this he might not be so good in some other areas.

There's no chicken button. There's a Whopper button, though.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (oZ6kz)

80 53 Oh, and given that Trump has personal failings, he is not Hillary, or any of the Leftist alternatives... they are known to have a failing, or two.
Posted by: kraken at September 10, 2019 01:31 PM (90T4r)

___

Can we stop this please? Any time there's the slightest criticism of Trump the reply is "yeah but he's not Hillary" or "would you prefer Jeb?". No he's not Hillary and he's 1000X better than Jeb would have been.

But he's also human and makes mistakes and should be called out when he does.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (FiUMj)

81 30 Yeah. Like I said, they Donald has real issues with personnel.

Posted by: joncelli, who's totally not in the pay of Big Alien at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (RD7QR)

I've wondered about this a lot over the last 3 years. He didn't get where he is by not being able to read people. Are these beltway paramecium so very different? I can't believe these types of choices are part of his 4D chess.

Posted by: clutch cargo at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (Z1ykJ)

The way I see it, he swaps people in and out as needed for specific things. He brought Bolton in because Bolton has a reputation as a hawk, to lend weight to his threats. He got rid of Bolton later because Bolton is a hawk.

Tillerson was for staff reduction but otherwise was too chummy, that was definitely a loss on that latter bit, but he would've been replaced eventually anyways.

Posted by: Someguy at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (Wj9tV)

82 Ok they're talking about some EO signed today re terrorists....

Posted by: Tami at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (cF8AT)

83 I liked Bolton when he was with Bush. But if he fought with Trump over foreign policy then he needed to go.

Posted by: Vic at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (mpXpK)

84 You can't quit me, I'm fired!

Posted by: Diesel Jones at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (0CeRG)

85 Really Ace? Trump's lying about how Bolton was fired and when?

Did it occur to you that Bolton is wanting to protect his precious ability to become a lobbyist after he sues the Trump administration for forcing him to sign a non lobbying for five years after serving agreement? Or that he wants to make sure he continues to get his big paychecks from Fox News and most assuredly now CNN and MSNBC to come on and give his expert opinons on why we should have invaded Venezuela and forcibly removed Maduro, right after we bombed Tehran?

Posted by: Jen the original at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (t0g7x)

86 I could see Romney being Kristol's wet dream come to life, and announce a third party run. He might just draw enough GOP support to cost Trump the election.

Posted by: Huck Follywood, a low grade social fever at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (LISuA)

87 Further proof that Romney isn't representing Itah but rather

------

Itah???

"I TINK ITAH A PUTTY CAT" ???

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (8XRCm)

88 I mean, literally no one cares besides Trump about whether a staffer decided to leave over a personality or policy conflict, or whether Trump decided to ask the staffer to leave over that personality or policy conflict.

So there's just no reason for this. It's the same story either way, and doesn't reflect on Trump in any way, negative or otherwise.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (PbpT7)

89 Really, I'm a little sick of hearing this shit from people who never fought for anything in their lives but a spot in the coffee line at Starbucks.

It's not about "year 19 of the war" or any of that other crap. It's about how you execute your next phase.

We are there guys and threat still exists. In fact it is now growing.

Clearly Trump's "why can't we all get a long and go to Camp David" was a fucking disaster. What asshole would do that? Bolton 1, Trump 0.

I support the president, and I support ending the war the right way, not be turning the place back over to the fucking Taliban who has been killing our guys all those years and supporting AQ.

I mean, WTF? This isn't like math or anything. You kill the enemy and put the fear of God in them.

And then Trump acts like he's a fucking five-year old with the whole firing drama? Who does that? It's like a sequel to Mean Girls.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (VpIIl)

90 Try as I might I just can't bring myself to give a damn.

Posted by: Guzalot at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (prSvo)

91 They were in disagreement on a policy issue. Bolton offered to resign as people here have opined that is the correct thing to do. Trump allegedly did not accept at that time but tweeted subsequently that he fired Bolton, If accurate, that is pretty shitty.
Posted by: Pig to man dreaming of lions at September 10, 2019 01:33 PM (2DOZq)

Trump did not tweet that he "fired" Bolton; he said that he "asked for his resignation."

There IS a difference.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (NFEMn)

92 So Ace wants to fuck John Bolton. Who knew.

Posted by: Bolton will never let you fuck him at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (3KJUr)

93 >>Yeah. Like I said, the Donald has real issues with personnel.

Is anyone surprised that the guy whose popular tv show catchphrase was "You're fired!" fires people?

The other thing I wonder is, how much of this is Trump's propensity to drop a poor performer and move on vs. typical WH admin staff churn? The MSM is obsessed with the 'palace intrigue' coverage of Trump that they haven't done in past presidencies. Yes, they always have made a bigger deal of GOP staff departures, but not like this. Also have to factor in that Trump is constantly having to weed out IC/Obama/Hillary/GOPe plants who are burrowed in like ticks to make sure he is thwarted at every turn.

Strange times.

Posted by: Lizzy at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (bDqIh)

94 But still. Bolton should not compromise the administration with that tweet.

Sure, Trump can be infantile, but in situations like this you eat shit and shut up for the good of the country. In 5 years (or even 14 months) you say what you want. So either he thinks Trump reelection is a bad thing, or he is a big baby too, or he let his emotions get away from him.

This is what bothered me about that scaramoucci guy

Posted by: Gentlemen, this is democracy manifest at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (LWu6U)

95 I have a lot of respect for both Pompeo and Bolton. My personal opinion is that Bolton has always been a thorn in the Establishment's hide and probably couldn't keep his opinions private enough.

If PDJT determined it was time to move on, so be it.

Start watching for conciliatory actions for muslims (see China camps nonsense) and who is pushing hardest for blowing up any negotiations worldwide in favor of US supporting muslim 'freedom from oppression' worldwide.

Posted by: mustbequantum at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (MIKMs)

96 43 Perhaps I am cracking up, but the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have done a number on my foreign policy views. Though not there yet, I find myself being drawn to the Glenn Greenwald/Tulsi Gabbard worldview more and more (i.e. stop meddling). Bolton represented a view I find less and less compelling in view of events over the last 18 years.
Posted by: Benji Carver at September 10, 2019 01:29 PM (OD2ni)

I don't in principle have a problem with an active foreign policy and military, but our actions have to be calculated in such a way that our victory condition is achievable on a timetable shorter than an election cycle. If there are adults in America who weren't alive when you started, then your goal was fanciful and not actually realistic, and it becomes difficult to argue that the action actually does more good than harm.

So you want to tell me that we need to engage military actions in some part of the world? Great. Which specific people over there are bad enough that we need to kill so we can then leave again. I'm not having any more of this "nation building" nonsense.

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (KUaJL)

97 Meh, Bolton was there for 17 months, which is longer than a lot of WH staff positions, IIRC (I think the average is something like just over a year, because people tend to burn out).

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (wCmLp)

98 Part of the issue is that in the business world, you are cut loose with a NDA and cash so you could not do what Bolton did when one is fired. In the business world, much of dispute firings generally come from secondary reports and not from the principals involved because of this.

In the political world, Bolton and others fired folks are going to bitch about it in public to preserve their viability for future positions and societal standing whether or not it was justified. NDA's and cash cannot be given in this context. The political press also will give outsized attention to any Republican appointee trashing the president while attacking any such Dem appointee doing the same to a Dem president. A Democratic appointee that wants to trash their commander in chief does it later in memoirs after no one cares. See Mattis as an example.

Posted by: whig at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (hqUZK)

99 63 >>>I don't remember his exact words, but Andrew Klavan says something like the personality required to do what Trump needs to do is not going to be a civilized, genteel personality.

agreed

but this is a very unhelpful tic of his
Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (PbpT7)

There's never been a perfect president...never will be.

I'll take his 'tics' over anyone else I can currently think of at the moment.

Posted by: Tami at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (cF8AT)

100 >>Ace hitting the chicken button again.

Ace is a gentleman.

The majority of chickens don't reach orgasm through penetrative sex.
Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM

Not funny, dude...Not. Funny.

Posted by: The Chicken at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (ejd/p)

101
My Theory on this taliban peace deal nonsense:

I think people at the Pentagon and/or State are trying to set
up the president for an embarrassing failure. Some jerkoffs are
obviously telling the president it's a great idea to make a peace deal with the taliban and he'll be able to brag about it on the campaign trail knowing the taliban will never honor any agreement.

Posted by: Soothsayer at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (kGJFi)

102 >>>0 Yeah. Like I said, they Donald has real issues with personnel.

Posted by: joncelli, who's totally not in the pay of Big Alien

I don't mind the revolving door of people coming and going. I think that's unavoidable when you're not getting the results you want, and a lot of personnel are actually not-so-secretly working to keep you from getting the results you want.

but this peevish stuff about who said I Break Up first. My GOODNESS!

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (PbpT7)

103 "I've wondered about this a lot over the last 3 years. He didn't get where he is by not being able to read people. Are these beltway paramecium so very different? I can't believe these types of choices are part of his 4D chess."

Posted by: clutch cargo

That's an easy answer. The Beltway Paramecium is very different. The universe of candidates in Washington for administration positions is almost exclusively composed of Washington Deep State types. Insiders. The Establishment.

If a Washington insider is president, choices are easy.

If you're an outsider, it's a lot more difficult. Not least because you have a good chance of picking someone who actually hates outsiders and will try to sabotage you.

Sometimes Trump tries to pick outsiders, but this gets a huge backlash from the insiders and the insider media.

I suspect Trump actually thinks he shouldn't need nearly as many people in the administration as has been traditional, and his "acting" picks are basically to fill a space that would aggravate everyone if he just left it empty.

Posted by: MW at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (hNTtn)

104 Trump hires people for a specific purpose. When that purpose is either done or not executed to Trump's satisfaction he gets rid of that person. Bolton has been working at cross purposes to Trump's agenda for a while now on AF, Venezula, NK. Of course Trump is going to get rid of him.

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert (Gringo fuertemente armado) at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (m4pA7)

105 I didn't like the idea of Trump inviting the Taliban to Camp David either, but it's clear that Trump wants to end this thing in A'Stan, and I agree.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (NFEMn)

106 99

There's never been a perfect president...never will be.

I'll take his 'tics' over anyone else I can currently think of at the moment.
Posted by: Tami at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (cF8AT)

==========

"Have you heard of a candidate named Hillary Clinton?"
-David French, conservative

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (iikV8)

107 I am saying that Trump has personal failings, but is immeasurably better than the alternatives. We are blessed to have him.
That said, I would also say I would get sick of him in about a half hour of being around his ego.

Posted by: kraken at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (90T4r)

108 Keep Kandahar so that we can reach out and touch those who need touching and let the rest of the hell-hole go back to the middle ages.

Posted by: motionview at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (pYQR/)

109 Press asking Pompeo about Bolton...

"President is entitled to the staff he wants. Well within his rights to replace him."

Posted by: Tami at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (cF8AT)

110 Trump should leave this alone. The MSM will find a new shiny object by tonight. But if he keeps tweeting about it (Ahem Alabama hurricane) the MSM will keep beating him over the head with it. And it's just stupid all around and not helpful to him. At worst it makes him look petty, at best it's just a colosal waster of time for him that could be spent on something else. There's no upside at all.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (FiUMj)

111 Romney ... has every intention of trying to be the "return to sanity" republican candidate.

If so, we should prepare a Perot for him.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (ykYG2)

112 We may have judged John Bolton a bit harshly. It's time to re-evaluate.

Posted by: The MSM at September 10, 2019 01:36 PM (hjaPQ)

113 If that indeed is the short list, MacGregor or Grenell would be the better choices. The others will *fight* the Forever War forever.

I'm really, really glad Bolton is gone. Yes, Trump has an oversized ego although it's a stretch to call it dangerous, but it also allows him to dispatch assholes quickly. It couldn't be missed yesterday that all the neocon and cuck sites crowed about Bolton's role in keeping us mucking around the Afghan charnel house. The real problem with Bolton is she shouldn't have been hired in the first place, and my biggest criticism of Trump is he listens repeatedly to people who tout such abysmal choices. But, unlike Bush, he kicks asses to the curb. Good.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at September 10, 2019 01:37 PM (iw59Q)

114 And by the way- what branch and on what battlefield did Worm Boy, Sean Davis serve in?

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:37 PM (VpIIl)

115 I'm sorry but where is the sparring? All I see from Trump is that tweet ace has in the headline and then one more about asking for his resignation, AND thanking him for his service. Sorry but the only one that seems to be sparring about this is Bolton and running to the press to make sure they all know "I quit" seems to me to be far more petty than what Trump had to say.

Posted by: Buzzion at September 10, 2019 01:37 PM (66KLX)

116 We don't know what led up to Bolton offering his resignation last night, and Trump saying "we'll talk in the morning". And maybe in the morning said, "you're fired, I want your resignation" ... so that happened before Bolton resigned, even though Bolton already offered?

I don't care, but yeah, it is awkward at best. They both want to be seen as the one initiating the action ... Bolton offering to resign was surely in response to Trump action of some sort, face to face with Trump, it would seem, last night.

Posted by: illiniwek at September 10, 2019 01:37 PM (Cus5s)

117 >>>There's never been a perfect president...never will be.

I'll take his 'tics' over anyone else I can currently think of at the moment.

...

i agree but crap like this has me saying, "Really dude? That's the level of your engagement here? Over a squabble about who was the Alpha in the breakup?"

The priorities are disordered.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:37 PM (PbpT7)

118

I imagine there is no more fire-able offense to Trump than someone saying to him: I told you so.

The 'Stache would not hesitate to say, "I told you so."

I like Bolton in general, but this was poorly handled all around, and Romney can go suck a short cock (not a long one, as then he would get to do it daintily)

Posted by: imp at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (w+Z9D)

119 There's never been a perfect president...never will be.

----

Ahem.

Posted by: Zaphod Beeblebrox at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (KUaJL)

120 I suspect Trump actually thinks he shouldn't need nearly as many people in the administration as has been traditional, and his "acting" picks are basically to fill a space that would aggravate everyone if he just left it empty.

That's how I'd fill posts like "department of energy", "department of education" and all the other silly-walks departments.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (ykYG2)

121 I didn't say Hello. I said to give my regards. Regards aren't as serious as Hello.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (oZ6kz)

122 Pompeo: "Yes, Bolton and I had our disagreements."

That Asshole Playboy reporter asking if Pompeo and Mnuchin were blindsided about Bolton not being there today.

Posted by: Tami at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (cF8AT)

123 >>So there's just no reason for this. It's the same story either way, and doesn't reflect on Trump in any way, negative or otherwise.

But his SHARPIE! 80

Posted by: Lizzy at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (bDqIh)

124 Not to blow my own horn, but man, have I got Romney NAILED, or what?

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (NFEMn)

125 "The priorities are disordered.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:37 PM (PbpT7)"

Fuckin A Bubba. Printed that on a goddamned lunchbox.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (VpIIl)

126 Trump did not tweet that he "fired" Bolton; he said that he "asked for his resignation."

There IS a difference.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (NFEMn)

It appears that Trump tweeted "I asked John for his resignation" after Bolton started calling his journalist friends with the truth and it was reported.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (CQ3Qb)

127 We can police Afghanistan from the air. They get out of hand - we bomb the shit out of them. Fairly simple. Bolton is merely the placeholder for occupation infinity that pleases all the connected money guys. The money saved will build a golden wall on our southern border with trebuchets to speed deportation at every 10 mile marker. It will be yuge, classy and delicious.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (2LelM)

128 Oh boy, another "White House in chaos" storyline.

When does Bolton get treated as the World's Greatest Expert?

I'm sure CNN will have him on to tell us all about how awesome a war with China and North Korea would be.

Posted by: Convalescing Author A.H. Lloyd at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (cfSRQ)

129 You are the center of my universe Zaphod.

Posted by: motionview at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (pYQR/)

130 >>>115 I'm sorry but where is the sparring? All I see from Trump is that tweet ace has in the headline and then one more about asking for his resignation, AND thanking him for his service. Sorry but the only one that seems to be sparring about this is Bolton and running to the press to make sure they all know "I quit" seems to me to be far more petty than what Trump had to say.

fair... I am assuming, as I said, that Bolton is closer to the truth, because Trump does squabble with a lot of people over crap like this.

I don't have proof for that assumption. Apart from the pattern I *believe* I see in these personnel squabbles.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (PbpT7)

131

And by the way- what branch and on what battlefield did Worm Boy, Sean Davis serve in?
Posted by: Marcus White-T

The branch of paying your salary, GI Joe.

LOL, just fucking with you. Couldn't resist.

Posted by: imp at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (w+Z9D)

132 Trump is combative on everything. It is his personality. It is better than the bush non-combative on everything stance. It is also a colossal waste of energy.

Fortunately most normal people don't pay attention to politics until they have to.

Posted by: Mikey NTH -Support Your Sagging Self-Worth with Poses & Postures from The Outrage Outlet! at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (hLRSq)

133 60 >>Ace hitting the chicken button again.

Ace is a gentleman.

The majority of chickens don't reach orgasm through penetrative sex.
Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 01:32 PM (0Uei+)

Dude, what an ewok and a domestic fowl do in the privacy of their own dugout is their business.

Posted by: joncelli, who's totally not in the pay of Big Alien at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (RD7QR)

134 We can bring the boys home so they can patrol Chicago, Baltimore, Memphis and Portland.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (2LelM)

135 I imagine there is no more fire-able offense to Trump than someone saying to him: I told you so.

The 'Stache would not hesitate to say, "I told you so."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Well I guess Rush wouldn't last working for Trump.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (NFEMn)

136 124 Not to blow my own horn, but man, have I got Romney NAILED, or what?
Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (NFEMn)

==========

Stop confusing me with your satire! It hurts my head when I desperately search through Twitter for confirmation of your obviously satirical takes on Romney!

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (iikV8)

137 >>>When does Bolton get treated as the World's Greatest Expert?

I actually don't. I wasn't keen on having him in in the first place. He is resolutely a neocon and an internationalist.

but yeah, I believe him about this one small thing.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (PbpT7)

138 It's critically important to a Washington operator who leaves a job not be seen as being fired.

Usually he is allowed the dignity of a "resignation" even when he was fired.

Why would Trump say he fired him unless he was pissed and had good reason to fire him and to make it known?

I'm giving Trump benefit of the doubt.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (H8QX8)

139 I agree with Ace's take. This is just not a good look for Trump.

Not every person here that criticizes Trump is some closet NeverTrump operative attempting to moby supporters.

Trump NEEDS a little pushback from his own instead of a cult of personality.

We're just incredibly lucky the Democrat bench is so awful.

Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (sjTfF)

140 Hey Ivanka.

Wanna tell daddy something? How about skipping the advice on war policy and telling him to GROW THE FUCK UP.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (VpIIl)

141 Just leave that Afghani hell-hole.

Posted by: zeera Moron Author Working on Book TWO at September 10, 2019 01:40 PM (T9rmq)

142 So Ace wants to fuck John Bolton. Who knew.

Yes .. err .. hmm .. quite..

*shiftyeyes*

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 01:40 PM (yQpMk)

143 PRESNINT TRUMP FIRES SINGER MICHAEL BOLTON? THAT MONSTER!!

Posted by: Al Sharptato at September 10, 2019 01:40 PM (0D+GD)

144 Trump gets into these slap fights because he does not, like Obama, Hillary, and almost everyone else in Washington, just quietly go about the serious business of destroying his opponents.

He doesn't actually "destroy" them at all, if you haven't noticed.

Those prone to imploding (Kathy Griffin et all) destroy themselves when Trump turns on them. And he turns on them quite openly, not surreptitiously and disingenuously like the DNC-Media-RNC Complex does it.

Rather refreshing actually. Refreshingly appalling rather than horrifyingly appalling, if you get what I'm trying to say.

Posted by: filbert at September 10, 2019 01:40 PM (NiXyF)

145 But his SHARPIE! 80
Posted by: Lizzy at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (bDqIh)

LOL. Whatever his failings are, the pathetic media are 1000x worse.

Posted by: chique d'afrique at September 10, 2019 01:40 PM (9hauA)

146 Hey, you know who HATED Bolton??

Tucker Carlson.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:40 PM (NFEMn)

147 Jonathan Karl
@jonkarl
John Bolton tells me it is "flatly wrong" to say the President asked him to resign. "I offered to resign last night," Bolton told me. "He never asked for me to resign directly or indirectly. I slept on it and resigned this morning."
*********
SOOOOOO Stache if you have all these Media friends why didn't you tell them 1st you were resigning ??

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:40 PM (BqBId)

148 So you want to tell me that we need to engage
military actions in some part of the world? Great. Which specific people
over there are bad enough that we need to kill so we can then leave
again. I'm not having any more of this "nation building" nonsense.

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at September 10, 2019 01:35 PM (KUaJL)

Better question: "Who are the good guys." If there aren't any then don't go. There will never be the political will to exterminate everyone.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (CQ3Qb)

149 This twitter spat is exactly why Bolton was fired.

He does not know when to shut up.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (hSSpd)

150 the "Forever War" caucus:

--

Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I'm always fascinated how this place works. We were JUST talking about space travel and relativity and time dilation and how so many movies and books just say "it's magic" and then continue with the story, and today Forever War comes up in a completely unrelated way.

Posted by: Moron Robbie- Criminal acts are not loopholes at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (dSvao)

151 141 Just leave that Afghani hell-hole.
-----------------
Yep. We are going to need to troops to invade California.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (2LelM)

152 46 "Romney... Sincere supporter of Bolton"

The first two words above are antithetical.

Posted by: Ray Van Dune at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (FA43N)

153 The left

Yesterday- Bolton is a bloodthirsty war criminal.

Today- believe Mr. Bolton he's well respected!

Posted by: Ha at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (MAstk)

154 >>Dude, what an ewok and a domestic fowl do in the privacy of their own dugout is their business.

I'm not impugning the little guy.

I'm just saying that if you are a chicken, and you are not averse to be rolled in Pork Rinds instead of the Traditional Bread Crumbs, Ace can (by all reports) be a thorough and sensitive lover.

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (0Uei+)

155 How about skipping the advice on war policy and telling him to GROW THE FUCK UP.
Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (VpIIl)

He's 72. He is who he is. Take it or leave it.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (H8QX8)

156 Why did all of this happen, anyway? What is the substance of their differences??

Posted by: kraken at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (90T4r)

157
I can certainly understand why backseat driving is unwanted from the people that have been prosecuting the war. They have invested time and blood into it.

But the endless war is untenable.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (YA914)

158 144 Trump gets into these slap fights because he does not, like Obama, Hillary, and almost everyone else in Washington, just quietly go about the serious business of destroying his opponents.

He doesn't actually "destroy" them at all, if you haven't noticed.

____

It's a badge of honor to be "destroyed" by Trump among leftists. Trump still doesn't get that.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (FiUMj)

159 "We can police Afghanistan from the air."

LOL.

You've never been there- have you.

We are on the ground now for a reason.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:42 PM (VpIIl)

160 150 the "Forever War" caucus:

--

Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I'm always fascinated how this place works. We were JUST talking about space travel and relativity and time dilation and how so many movies and books just say "it's magic" and then continue with the story, and today Forever War comes up in a completely unrelated way.
Posted by: Moron Robbie- Criminal acts are not loopholes at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (dSvao)

=========

At least Forever War dealt with gravity at high speeds.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 01:42 PM (iikV8)

161 If Baby Chickenhawk Shapiro is agin it, I'm probably fer it.

Posted by: Guy Smiley at September 10, 2019 01:42 PM (O8WFE)

162 This twitter spat is exactly why Bolton was fired.

He does not know when to shut up.
Posted by: Frosty

Yeah only Trump is allowed to drop tweets.

Posted by: Pig to man dreaming of lions at September 10, 2019 01:42 PM (2DOZq)

163
Stop confusing me with your satire! It hurts my head when I desperately search through Twitter for confirmation of your obviously satirical takes on Romney!
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 01:39 PM (iikV

One of these days I'm going to fake tweet Romney, and then an hour later he's going to tweet essentially the same thing.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:42 PM (NFEMn)

164

So Ace wants to fuck John Bolton. Who knew.

Yes .. err .. hmm .. quite..

*shiftyeyes*
Posted by: Grump928(C)

Who wants a mustache ride!!!?!?!?!

Posted by: imp at September 10, 2019 01:42 PM (w+Z9D)

165 I hate this crap. Not only does it demonstrate that Trump lies easily and sometimes might not even know he's lying (or offering an alternative take on reality), but I do think this sort of infantile spat over nothing suggests an ego simultaneously overweening and fragile -- the worst sort of ego to have. A dangerous one.

Meh.

Trump is combative. That means he might be combative over most things people would blow off.

Not as an ego thing as much as "This is my view of things and you are wrong."

That's what makes him Not-Jeb.

And Not-a-Passive-Agressive-Weasel-like-John-
"I'm still dead"-McCain.

You take the good
You take the bad
And there you have
Trump!!!!

That's wh

Posted by: naturalfake at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (SHtRW)

166 I have no idea about this one so I think I'll leave it alone.

Posted by: Insomniac at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (NWiLs)

167 It appears that Trump tweeted "I asked John for his resignation" after Bolton started calling his journalist friends with the truth and it was reported.
Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (CQ3Qb)
******
SOOOOOOOOO why didn't he tell his friends in media that he was resigning before resigning ??
******
Have a feeling I will get stunned Silence

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (BqBId)

168 89 Really, I'm a little sick of hearing this shit from people who never fought for anything in their lives but a spot in the coffee line at Starbucks.

It's not about "year 19 of the war" or any of that other crap. It's about how you execute your next phase.

We are there guys and threat still exists. In fact it is now growing.

Clearly Trump's "why can't we all get a long and go to Camp David" was a fucking disaster. What asshole would do that? Bolton 1, Trump 0.

I support the president, and I support ending the war the right way, not be turning the place back over to the fucking Taliban who has been killing our guys all those years and supporting AQ.

I mean, WTF? This isn't like math or anything. You kill the enemy and put the fear of God in them.

And then Trump acts like he's a fucking five-year old with the whole firing drama? Who does that? It's like a sequel to Mean Girls.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (VpIIl)

What exactly is the threat? The Taliban are not known for terrorist attacks outside of Afghanistan. We are fighting the approximate equivalent of local nobility. Outside of something more genocidal on our part they're never going to run out of local support. If they decide to get froggy after forming a new government, we can knock it over again. Repeat until they stop. We're much better at eliminating standing armies and governments than we are at occupation and fighting insurrection.

Posted by: Someguy at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (Wj9tV)

169 well, one of the problems being of and from the party led by and for losers over the last 20 years is that the well is pretty dry when it comes to new talent. We got, what? Papadapolous?

So, maybe hopefully having trump win a few rounds can get us a few experts on our side.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (thQkh)

170 I knew something newsworthy would happen today.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (NFEMn)

171 I can see how Trump would be intimidated by Bolton's womb broom.

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (0Uei+)

172 Trump was trying to give Bolton and out to collect unemployment.

Posted by: MAGA at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (9sEZ3)

173 9 Breaking: The Patriots just signed Bolton to a one year deal.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at September 10, 2019 01:24 PM (kTF2Z)

Just got here. Gonna wait for the next thread, since this one was over after #9.

Posted by: Roy at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (LXlPl)

174
But his SHARPIE! 80

Posted by: Lizzy at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (bDqIh)

Yes, Sharpiegate was getting boring. Turnberry wasn't getting any traction.

Maybe Firing-Gate will work?

Posted by: Mikey NTH -Support Your Sagging Self-Worth with Poses & Postures from The Outrage Outlet! at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (hLRSq)

175 Keep Kandahar so that we can reach out and touch those who need touching and let the rest of the hell-hole go back to the middle ages.

Isn't Bagram Air Base the size of Connecticut?

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (yQpMk)

176 I mean, literally no one cares besides Trump about whether a staffer decided to leave over a personality or policy conflict, or whether Trump decided to ask the staffer to leave over that personality or policy conflict.

So there's just no reason for this. It's the same story either way, and doesn't reflect on Trump in any way, negative or otherwise.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (PbpT7)

Am I missing something here? Other than one tweet this morning, which doesn't sound like anything other than a standard issue "he resigned" tweet, what the hell did Trump say that was so bad?

But we hear Bolton is texting people all over the media saying "I quit last night."

Again, who's being petty here?

I don't get how Trump is the one in the wrong, and I'm by no means a Trump cheerleader.

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (cY3LT)

177 "I was thinking of resigning and slept on it" sounds like bullshit to me.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (H8QX8)

178 That's wh

That's right. I ended my comment with a total non-sequitur.

It's my ninja way!

*vanishes in a puff of smoke*

Posted by: naturalfake at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (SHtRW)

179 I was just talking with a pro-Trump reporter this weekend, and we were discussing Trump's staffing problems. He pointed out that people just don't think of how tiny a number of people Trump had when he came into office, and most of those were supporters with no experience in any subject-matter area or government bureaucracy.

As opposed to the armies of longtime government workers that were loyal to the Bushes (out of ideological reasons or just because they know the Bushes are always good for a paycheck) or to Hillary, who used "charity" funds to keep her Government In Waiting paid and on the team.

Trump just doesn't have that many people to pick from.

That means that any time he treats a departing staffer poorly, he scares off some of the few people willing to work for him.

When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (PbpT7)

180 "He's 72. He is who he is. Take it or leave it."

Nothing will get Trump out of office faster then his constant Twitter Ego Wars.

Fucking poll after poll shows that his bombastic bullshit and petty outbursts, like this childish ego trash, are what people hate the most.

Fucking FOCUS.

I don't mind him taking it to the media or anyone else when it's warranted. But the Twitter Mean Girls shit is beneath him.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (VpIIl)

181 IDC who you are.

If you run to the msm you're not on our side.

Posted by: Ha at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (MAstk)

182 We are on the ground now for a reason.

Because we don't have the guts to leave them to their own devices, and we don't have the guts to turn the place to Corelle should that not work.

Posted by: JEM at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (8erNz)

183 Better question: "Who are the good guys." If there aren't any then don't go. There will never be the political will to exterminate everyone.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (CQ3Qb)

Whoever takes over after we create a vacuum does have an interest in not getting their shit kicked in. We can knock them over until someone smart enough to realize this gets in charge.

Posted by: Someguy at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (Wj9tV)

184 i agree but crap like this has me saying, "Really dude? That's the level of your engagement here? Over a squabble about who was the Alpha in the breakup?"

The priorities are disordered.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:37 PM (PbpT7)

Meh...it's his style. We may not like it at certain times but there are other times when we love that he pokes and trolls.

I tend to think Trump is right on this. Your boss asking for your resignation is the same as being fired. No discernible difference really.

Posted by: Tami at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (cF8AT)

185 I'd love to care about John Bolton's feels, or Trump's spin, but image and spin are everything these days. I don't care about the NSA position either, given that Trump clearly doesn't listen to them and the Deep State is actively against him.

Oh sorry. Walls closing in, Ben Shapiru is so offended, woe, etc.

Posted by: trev006 at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (Lvrv/)

186 SOOOOOOOOO why didn't he tell his friends in media that he was resigning before resigning ??

******

Have a feeling I will get stunned Silence

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (BqBId)

Maybe he offered his resignation last night and it wasn't accepted? Someone asked you in the last thread if you've heard any more from Hannity about the imminent indictments or whatever. I didn't see your reply.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (CQ3Qb)

187 I'm on ace with this...the trump need to one up is yet another 25th Amendment filler think-piece for the Tater's out in the media. This is mega major lie one millyun, right?

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (thQkh)

188 What's the tweet war? As far as I can see, Trump tweeted once, declaratively. Bolton is tweeting up a storm like a hurt 12-year-old girl.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (H8QX8)

189 I offer my immediate resignation.

Lets talk about it in the morning . . .

Seems like a pretty reasonable response. Not a knee jerk, don't let the doorknob hit you on the way out.

Anyway fired vs resigned can be pretty nebulous. He offered a resignation, so he didn't resign, offered to do so. Probably hoping he would be told no, I see how serious you are lets do it your way. Brinksmanship.

However, He was not told on the spot you're fired, but he probably was (in Trump's mind) except for tidying up some senior staff notifications before the stuff hit the fan.

So why does Trump have to be the one saying I told him last night services no longer needed. He knows the media is going to go crazy and he's trying to get ahead of it.

Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (C6xeQ)

190 Keep Kandahar so that we can reach out and touch those who need touching and let the rest of the hell-hole go back to the middle ages.
---------------------

Isn't Bagram Air Base the size of Connecticut?
Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (yQpMk)

Fine, let's give them Connecticut.

You drive a hard bargain, but honestly, I don't think we'll miss Connecticut all that much.

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (cY3LT)

191 Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (cY3LT)

Because if he's telling the truth that he resigned and not asked to resign it's a big deal.

Posted by: Pig to man dreaming of lions at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (2DOZq)

192 The "Trump lies" meme is a Nevertrump argument. It is stupid. Everyone in politics lies or obfuscates. To say DJT is maybe pathological completely disregards his fighting style.

Posted by: Balrog of Morgoth at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (b1l+6)

193 It's the Tuesday Morning Massacre!!!1!

The walls are closing in11!

Posted by: The MSM's Spin on the Story at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (l1sdS)

194 Pakistan owns Afghanistan. We own Pakistan. The end.

Posted by: China at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (hjaPQ)

195 I don't think President Trump taking 60 seconds to send a tweet about this qualifies as it being a "priority" for him...... why do people think sending a tweet is like a three-fucking-hour ordeal???

Posted by: SSBN 656 (G) at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (jjaLl)

196 It appears that Trump tweeted "I asked John for his resignation" after Bolton started calling his journalist friends with the truth and it was reported.
Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:38 PM (CQ3Qb)
******

Wait. If someone offers to resign and you say "we'll discuss it tomorrow" then that offer was rejected, wasn't it?

Now the next day Trump "asks" for Bolton's resignation, it's a new thing....

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (NFEMn)

197 Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (CQ3Qb)
********
Yep Nothing, that is what I thought............. Moving on

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (BqBId)

198 179 I was just talking with a pro-Trump reporter this weekend, and we were discussing Trump's staffing problems. He pointed out that people just don't think of how tiny a number of people Trump had when he came into office, and most of those were supporters with no experience in any subject-matter area or government bureaucracy.

As opposed to the armies of longtime government workers that were loyal to the Bushes (out of ideological reasons or just because they know the Bushes are always good for a paycheck) or to Hillary, who used "charity" funds to keep her Government In Waiting paid and on the team.

___

BINGO!!

I said the same thing in the previous thread and was attacked by some super duper real conservatives here who accused me of wanting Jeb as president. LOL

This is the downside of an inexperienced, outsider. Running the government is not the same as running a corporation with your name on it. I still don't think Trump has figured that out.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (FiUMj)

199 >> I don't think we'll miss Connecticut all that much.

Until Egg Nog Season gets here.

Then you'll be all like : "Where's the Fuckin' Nutmeg!?"

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 01:47 PM (0Uei+)

200 Endless war?

You can't be King of The Hill without putting your boot on some necks. You want Putin or Xi to be King?

The personnel that are over there knew they were going over there when they signed up. In another dimension it's referred to as advanced studies.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 01:47 PM (hSSpd)

201 This twitter spat is exactly why Bolton was fired.

He does not know when to shut up.
Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 01:41 PM (hSSpd)

This a thousand times.

Trump's announcement this morning was short , to the point, polite and that should have been the end of it. But Bolton now is going to run around, to everyone, as Fox WH reporter was saying he was told this past week that Bolton was doing to senior Trump officials who were tired of it, trying to demand his point of view be the only one considered, and demand all his news friends listen to his whiny I'm right, he's wrong, he's a liar' bitching.

For someone who claims to be such a staunch America first guy, he certainly isn't showing it.

Posted by: Jen the original at September 10, 2019 01:47 PM (t0g7x)

202 The "Trump lies" meme is a Nevertrump argument. It is stupid. Everyone in politics lies or obfuscates. To say DJT is maybe pathological completely disregards his fighting style.
Posted by: Balrog of Morgoth at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (b1l+6)

This.

Everyone lies, but only Trump is called on it. And most of his "lies" are of the "bluster" or "puffery" type.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (NFEMn)

203 it looks like they disagreed over the taliban/afghan talks thing, bolton said he'd resign and trump, seeing the writing on the wall, said he was fired.

our long stay in afghanistan is not from a flawed policy, it's from an impossible situation. imo, there was no alternative to going in and defeating the taliban. but it was apparent then that there was no easy "exit strategy". our purpose in staying was not so much to build a nation as to prevent it from being a base for jihadi terror groups.

Posted by: musical jolly chimp at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (Pg+x7)

204 Look, staying in Afghanistan is probably not smart. Leaving is probably less not smart. Either way, staying in a foreign country to kill people for 19 years straight is not really American.

At the end of the day, 9-11 was caused because America's Clinton era anti-terror efforts were shit and W's post 9-11 policies were fucking insane. Great, we got to invade Iraq and Afghanistan, meanwhile let's give millions of muslims free passes to America and pretend they deserve Affirmative Action.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (thQkh)

205
>>>When you barely have anyone loyal to you...

You believe Fake News bullshit, too much.

Posted by: Soothsayer at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (kGJFi)

206 Whoever takes over after we create a vacuum does
have an interest in not getting their shit kicked in. We can knock them
over until someone smart enough to realize this gets in charge.

Posted by: Someguy at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (Wj9tV)

The problem as I see it is that any reasonable opposition that could take over is always wiped out long before we think about going to war (see: Iran). In Iraq and Afghanistan we tried to appoint their future rulers and the locals saw right through that. Predictably.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (CQ3Qb)

207 168 89 Really, I'm a little sick of hearing this shit from people who never fought for anything in their lives but a spot in the coffee line at Starbucks.

It's not about "year 19 of the war" or any of that other crap. It's about how you execute your next phase.

We are there guys and threat still exists. In fact it is now growing.

Clearly Trump's "why can't we all get a long and go to Camp David" was a fucking disaster. What asshole would do that? Bolton 1, Trump 0.

I support the president, and I support ending the war the right way, not be turning the place back over to the fucking Taliban who has been killing our guys all those years and supporting AQ.

I mean, WTF? This isn't like math or anything. You kill the enemy and put the fear of God in them.

And then Trump acts like he's a fucking five-year old with the whole firing drama? Who does that? It's like a sequel to Mean Girls.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:34 PM (VpIIl)

Easy there, tough guy. I'm a vet who's been in theater, so that particular line of attack won't work on me.

How would you define "victory" in Afghanistan? What could we possibly accomplish there that we haven't been able to do in 18 years? The Taliban are assholes, sure, but they pose zero threat to anybody outside of Afghanistan or Pakistan (and Pakistan created and funds them).

Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 01:49 PM (N4xQB)

208 Nothing will get Trump out of office faster then his constant Twitter Ego Wars.

Fucking poll after poll shows that his bombastic bullshit and petty outbursts, like this childish ego trash, are what people hate the most.

Fucking FOCUS.

I don't mind him taking it to the media or anyone else when it's warranted. But the Twitter Mean Girls shit is beneath him.
Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (VpIIl)

94% approval with Republicans. Higher than Reagan. Sold out arenas everywhere he goes. His base LOVES his tweets. There is zero evidence his "twitter wars" are posing the slightest electoral problem.

But of course we'll know for sure in 2020.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 01:49 PM (H8QX8)

209 Second look at ace sliding down the slippery slope of Nevertrump?

I doubt it. Just healthy skepticism.

Right ace?

Posted by: Balrog of Morgoth at September 10, 2019 01:49 PM (b1l+6)

210 This is the downside of an inexperienced, outsider. Running the government is not the same as running a corporation with your name on it. I still don't think Trump has figured that out.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (FiUMj)

Let us pray he doesn't.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 01:49 PM (hSSpd)

211 You want Putin or Xi to be King?

Not even the Russians want Putin as their tsar anymore, and Xi's headed the way of the Ming Dynasty as soon as he can't paper over the collapsing Chinese economy anymore.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:49 PM (ykYG2)

212 When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.
Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (PbpT7)

Egotistical huffs... like whether we should bug the F out of Afghanistan after 18 years of failure?

That's sort of egotistical huff?

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (cY3LT)

213 I think Ben Shapiro 's sister's large pendulous Ashkenazi breasts would be the best replacement.

Maybe I'd start watching the news again.

Posted by: Regular joe at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (6/uwW)

214 So why does Trump have to be the one saying I told
him last night services no longer needed. He knows the media is going
to go crazy and he's trying to get ahead of it.

Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (C6xeQ)

Why did Trump have to say anything? Especially tweet some back-handed insult. Why not just have the White House issue a PR that Bolton was resigning, move on and leave it at that?

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (CQ3Qb)

215 >>>When you barely have anyone loyal to you...

You believe Fake News bullshit

++++

well, fake news bullshit is spinning the swamp as heroically opposing trumpf while the reality is that Trump is fighting battles against everyone because everyone...including the GOP...wanted Hillary to win, so we can end this silly American experiment once and for all and import a new pliable underclass...without so much clinging to guns and god.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (thQkh)

216 I think he "mean tweets" too often for sure. But I do not think this is one of them.

Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (wGbBR)

217 Was Bolton the one who wanted to negotiate peace with the Taliban at Camp David?

I am assuming that mess and Bolton are related. . . anyone know if they are?

Posted by: Lizzy at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (bDqIh)

218
*laser pointer ON*

*laser pointer OFF*

*laser pointer ON*

*laser pointer OFF*

*laser pointer ON*

*laser pointer OFF*

Posted by: Teh Donald at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (8XRCm)

219 Uhoh ace is concerned.

Trump and Bolton's accounts are not really at odds.

I think it is important for Bolton to say he resigned not fired too.

Posted by: blaster at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (F7lRL)

220 At the end of the day, 9-11 was caused because America's Clinton era anti-terror efforts were shit and W's post 9-11 policies were fucking insane. Great, we got to invade Iraq and Afghanistan, meanwhile let's give millions of muslims free passes to America and pretend they deserve Affirmative Action.
Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (thQkh)

__

Jib. Newsletter.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (FiUMj)

221 159 "We can police Afghanistan from the air."

We are on the ground now for a reason.
-------------------------
Not anymore. I think we will aid India, Pakistan to police the Afghan tribes. If they need big boom boom we can deliver if we want.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (2LelM)

222 That means that any time he treats a departing staffer poorly, he scares off some of the few people willing to work for him.

When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (PbpT7)

---
So wait, are you saying that if Trump was nicer, he wouldn't be surrounded by back-stabbing scum who happily leak lies?

Fascinating take.

Posted by: Convalescing Author A.H. Lloyd at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (cfSRQ)

223 Trump's tweets can be annoying and distracting, but I don't mind them for the most part--they get his message out.

Still, the tweets should be a supplement to actual speeches from the Oval Office and regular press conferences--he needs to do more of these.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (NFEMn)

224 Bolton looks like an ass here, which isn't super surprising.

He's really cut out more to be a CNN pundit/fake Con.

I like Flynn to replace him

Posted by: BlackOrchid at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (Rarvo)

225 See the Deep State wants perpetual war, it gives them the excuse for power over us. Now guys like Bolton recognize that there are actual threats out there and want to confront them. No one wants to actually do the work to finish the bastards off. So the Deep State gets its perpetual war. Just like Orwell predicted.

Posted by: Iblis at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (9221z)

226 Yep Nothing, that is what I thought............. Moving on

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:46 PM (BqBId)

Your schtick has grown tiresome.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (CQ3Qb)

227 You can't be King of The Hill without putting your boot on some necks. You want Putin or Xi to be King?

19 years isn't putting your boot on some necks.

It's jackin' your cock.

And its an expensive cock-jacking, a cock-jacking that numerous Senators, Congress members, and military contractors are all getting paid handsomely to keep the stroking going.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (YA914)

228 I guess I don't see the whole "I was fired/I resigned" distinction once you reach this level.

It's not like Bolton's going to be trying to line up job interviews...

"Uh, yes, Mr. Bolton, could you tell us the circumstances that led you leave your last job?"

Who cares?

Posted by: bicentennialguy at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (vg8iE)

229 "This guy offers this "top five" of people I think he's claiming are under active consideration as Bolton's replacement:"

I'd eliminate the position. Their job is to basically find boogeymen under the bed and tell the President we need to do SOMETHING!!

Posted by: lowandslow at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (Mr80f)

230 At the end of the day, 9-11 was caused because America's Clinton era anti-terror efforts were shit and W's post 9-11 policies were fucking insane. Great, we got to invade Iraq and Afghanistan, meanwhile let's give millions of muslims free passes to America and pretend they deserve Affirmative Action.
Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (thQkh)

Spot on. We cry "Fight them over there so we don't have to fight them here!" while simultaneously inviting them here.

Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (N4xQB)

231 Posted by: Jen the original at September 10, 2019 01:47 PM (t0g7x)

Because he resigned and wasn't fired. I've refrained from any negative talk about Trump but this is the straw that breaks the back for me on Trump. I will support him against any Democrat but he's the same douchebag I've hated since the 80's.

Posted by: Pig to man dreaming of lions at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (2DOZq)

232 >>>>"Nothing will get Trump out of office faster then his constant Twitter Ego Wars"

100% pure fucking horseshit.

Posted by: SSBN 656 (G) at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (jjaLl)

233 211 You want Putin or Xi to be King?

Not even the Russians want Putin as their tsar anymore, and Xi's headed the way of the Ming Dynasty as soon as he can't paper over the collapsing Chinese economy anymore.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:49 PM (ykYG2)

Since they are all going to fold we don't need and active military. Is that what you are saying?

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (hSSpd)

234 I read the ace addendum..."When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs."

++++

1. I guess Trump needed more daughters so he can have more advisors.

2. if this is a mere snit with Bolton, that's bad. But hopefully, there's more to it.

and more hopefully, maybe trump is building a bullpen.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (thQkh)

235 *laser pointer ON*

*laser pointer OFF*

*laser pointer ON*

*laser pointer OFF*
Posted by: Teh Donald at September 10, 2019 01:50 PM (8XRCm)

Trump causing seizures all across America.

Posted by: CNN at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (k76MH)

236 I can't get my knickers in a twist over Trump getting into unnecessary twitter fights. This is who he is, and he's not a-gonna change.

Yeah, I wish Trump wouldn't get into this stuff. But clearly Bolton's inability to keep his trap shut was an issue. So, he's gone.

Never understood why Trump wanted him at NSA in the first place. Hard to see how this could end any other way unless Bolton was willing to adjust his thinking to better align with his non-neocon non-ForeverWar boss; which he, evidently, was unwilling to do.

Posted by: DocJ at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (77WPm)

237 At the end of the day the buck stops with POTUS.
Advise all you want but at the end If you are not with him you are gone.

Posted by: The Man from Athens at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (8Ls/+)

238 Everyone lies, but only Trump is called on it. And most of his "lies" are of the "bluster" or "puffery" type.

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (NFEMn)

He's just really, really bad at it.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (CQ3Qb)

239 I don't mind him taking it to the media or anyone else when it's warranted. But the Twitter Mean Girls shit is beneath him.
Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 01:45 PM (VpIIl)

Marcus, the media effectively neutered GW Bush because he didn't push back and correct the record and the media propped up Obama , which he was happy to let them do.

Trump HAS to do this. He cannot allow the media to constantly frame and distort the record. He cannot allow a fired administration member to call him a liar.

Posted by: Jen the original at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (t0g7x)

240 Bolton is being a little bitch. But trump is president and sometimes you just have to ignore the little bitches and go about presidentin'.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (FiUMj)

241 The problem as I see it is that any reasonable opposition that could take over is always wiped out long before we think about going to war (see: Iran). In Iraq and Afghanistan we tried to appoint their future rulers and the locals saw right through that. Predictably.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (CQ3Qb)

If you appoint the future rulers of a nation, they are effectively your vassal state. And then every future revolt is your problem.

Let the locals figure out who will rule(as a bonus they'll usually fight about it), and then find out whether the new ruler needs to be killed. Much less effort.

Posted by: Someguy at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (Wj9tV)

242 Well, any move that pisses off Romney this much can't be all bad.

Posted by: Meade Lux Lewis at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (hjaPQ)

243 "Nothing will get Trump out of office faster then his constant Twitter Ego Wars"

So. This again.

*shrug*

Posted by: Pug Mahon, With a Broken Brain at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (xPJvm)

244 Spot on. We cry "Fight them over there so we don't have to fight them here!" while simultaneously inviting them here.

+++

also "...plus, we can't fight the teachers unions and other socialists teaching our kids to be amoral atheist gay trannies because that'd be too hard"

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (thQkh)

245 You can't fire me! I quit!

Posted by: andycanuck at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (Dh1wo)

246 Look, staying in Afghanistan is probably not smart. Leaving is probably less not smart. Either way, staying in a foreign country to kill people for 19 years straight is not really American.

At the end of the day, 9-11 was caused because America's Clinton era anti-terror efforts were shit and W's post 9-11 policies were fucking insane. Great, we got to invade Iraq and Afghanistan, meanwhile let's give millions of muslims free passes to America and pretend they deserve Affirmative Action.
Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (thQkh)

Yep. Simple question: Is the world a safer place than it was before 9/11?

If the answer is no, then maybe it's time to consider doing things differently. More of the same is just insanity.

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (cY3LT)

247 "230 At the end of the day, 9-11 was caused because America's Clinton era anti-terror efforts were shit and W's post 9-11 policies were fucking insane. Great, we got to invade Iraq and Afghanistan, meanwhile let's give millions of muslims free passes to America and pretend they deserve Affirmative Action.
Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:48 PM (thQkh)

Spot on. We cry "Fight them over there so we don't have to fight them here!" while simultaneously inviting them here."

Well, some do cross the border at will and become natural conservatives at some point. It was this very thing that caused me/causes me to loathe W with every fiber in my body.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (iw59Q)

248 Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (CQ3Qb)
*******
Good answer ! You were annoying from the beginning

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (BqBId)

249 Just saw a quote from a CAIR-type opposing 9/11 commemorations that "Muslims died on 9/11 too." Well yeah, at least 19 did.

Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (N4xQB)

250 Destroy the poppy fields so they can never grow anything again and leave. Forever.

Posted by: Ever at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (ZZDMQ)

251 For this high-level security stuff, the 48-hour rule is mandatory, especially when dealing with the DC press corps.

Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (Pqytn)

252 There's no reason to be so petty and thin-skinned about everything.

Yeah, he should be like Obama. Or Hillary.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (19g6/)

253 So the POTUS is not perfectly secure and wanted to avoid the perception that senior-level employees are not leaving, but rather he is in charge.

What is so surprising here? Seriously.

Posted by: DC at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (RZIhl)

254 Well, any move that pisses off Romney this much can't be all bad.

EXACTLY

the right people are getting skid marks over this

I also like the "don't replace him at all" concept!

Posted by: BlackOrchid at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (Rarvo)

255 I added this. It's more expansive than my previous comment.

I was just talking with a pro-Trump reporter this weekend, and we were discussing Trump's staffing problems. He pointed out that people just don't think of how tiny a number of people Trump had when he came into office, and most of those were supporters with no experience in any subject-matter area or government bureaucracy.

As opposed to the armies of longtime government workers that were loyal to the Bushes (out of ideological reasons or just because they know the Bushes are always good for a paycheck) or to Hillary, who used "charity" funds to keep her Government In Waiting paid and on the team.

Trump just doesn't have that many people to pick from.

This problem has plagued Trump since day one. Not having enough of a government-in-waiting to man so much as an FBI field office, he had to rely heavily on Establishment GOP and NeverTrumpers to serve as his top staffers, and those people then got to pick the next level of staffers and the levels after that.

These people made sure that their people -- GOPe people, NeverTrump people -- got in to the Trump Administration, and that the few conservatives with government experience or subject-matter expertise who were actually Trumpites were kept out.

I know a guy who had a great deal of experience in diplomacy and was a day one Trump supporter. And I mean a public supporter; he put his name to it.

He was literally told, "That's going to count against you" when he sought a State Department posting under Trump, the man he had publicly supported.

So Trump doesn't have a lot of people he can call upon to serve, and a lot of the people who he could call upon have already been frozen out by the anti-Trump political staffers he put in place because he had few other options.

That means that any time he treats a departing staffer poorly, he scares off some of the few people willing to work for him.

When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (PbpT7)

256 When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.
Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (PbpT7)

True but if what Trump has said is an egotistical huff in this case then I don't think anything could ever not be described as that.

Posted by: Buzzion at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (66KLX)

257 I think Trump's tweets are nothing but an asset.

He'll come out ahead of this one like he does all of them. Because he's honest.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (H8QX8)

258 So does this mean that Sharpigate is over ?

Posted by: Somewhere on Ventura Highway at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (M+Lyo)

259 Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 01:51 PM (CQ3Qb)
*******
Good answer ! You were annoying from the beginning

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (BqBId)

Get a room, you two.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (yQpMk)

260 I just have this bad feeling that just like the cult of personality around Dubya, we're going to look back at the cult of personality around Trump and cringe. Especially if he comes up short in 2020.

I support Trump's platform wholeheartedly, but I'm done pretending everything the guy does is genius.

Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.

Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (sjTfF)

261 Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (FiUMj)
******
UMMM NO sweetheart if he is the Boss & PDT is, You either get in line or you Leave ! no 3rd option

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (BqBId)

262 You could fire a lot of people in gubmint and eventually ditch somebody who did not deserve being ditched for something.
Beltway leeches.

Posted by: klaftern at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (RuIsu)

263 >>>258 So does this mean that Sharpigate is over ?
Posted by: Somewhere on Ventura Highway

that is an upside.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (PbpT7)

264 Nuke the poppy fields and Afghanistan will be turn into Whogivesafuckistan.

Posted by: Roland THTG at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (88+cf)

265 A lot of the Horde seem extra feisty today.

Just remember, today is yet another day Hillary isn't president.

Posted by: What's a Seawolf? at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (k76MH)

266 don't be a DOOP, ace

( Dudes Out Of Politics )

DOOPs, like the Weathermen, don't know which way the wind is blowing

---tried to make this as cryptic as possible; prognosis negative....

Posted by: the Man who Burps in French at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (8KSPd)

267 Julia Louis-Dreyfus in her Seinfeld days, from beginning to end, was one of the loveliest women on TV. Not many women can look that good while making funny faces -- but she could.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (ClOmq)

268 >>>why do people think sending a tweet is like a three-fucking-hour ordeal???<<<

I have a buddy who spent 4 hours making me a rare steak. zzzZZZzzz. In fairness, it was marinated and smoked to perfection.

Posted by: Fritz at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (kLDv+)

269 He was literally told, "That's going to count against you" when he sought a State Department posting under Trump, the man he had publicly supported.

+++

the guy should have married one of trump's daughters.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:56 PM (thQkh)

270 242 Well, any move that pisses off Romney this much can't be all bad.
Posted by: Meade Lux Lewis at September 10, 2019 01:53 PM (hjaPQ)

Exactly. The infallible metric for a good decision.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 01:56 PM (H8QX8)

271 You're no good Hook, except to the Queen and Sergeant Maxfield.

Posted by: Sgt. Maxfield at September 10, 2019 01:30 PM (FTlwv)

Trump as Chard kind of works "I came here to build a bridge"

But the deep state and Donks as the Zulus does a definite disservice. The Zulus were courageous and historically in the right.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at September 10, 2019 01:56 PM (TnoDk)

272 When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (PbpT7)

.....

ace, how much of it is about ego and how much of it is about trying to stay ahead of the media spin?

I truly don't know the answer.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (YA914)

273 >>>Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.

It's several years later. How long did we sign up to have our men die in a shithole country for?

If you had asked me in 2001, I would have said "Wrap it up in four years. No longer."

I really don't give a shit what kind of government Afghanistan has. It can always be bombed if it acts up.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (PbpT7)

274 When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (PbpT7)

---
Hasn't everyone who quit working for Trump loudly and publicly gotten free publicity + book tour?

Maybe there's another incentive structure at work.

Posted by: Convalescing Author A.H. Lloyd at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (cfSRQ)

275 NYT

@DLeonhardt

A year ago - in the midst of the midterm campaign - Americans viewed the Democratic Party more favorably than the Republican Party. No longer.

It's time for Democrats to stop messing around with unpopular technocratic ideas. Focus on beating Trump

Posted by: Ha at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (MAstk)

276 I don't remember his exact words, but Andrew Klavan says something like the personality required to do what Trump needs to do is not going to be a civilized, genteel personality.

I've heard something to the effect that people in job X (several different ones, actually) seem to be A-holes because you at least kinda have to *be* an A-hole to succeed.

There's also the Monty Python sketch about the accountant who wanted to be a lion tamer.

"No, don't you see? Accountancy does this to people!"

Posted by: Lance McCormick at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (l8gTz)

277 Destroy the poppy fields so they can never grow anything again and leave. Forever.

I have never understood why we don't just buy all the poppy crop from the farmers. Dump it in the ocean if we don't like it but don't take their livelihood away from the peasants.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (yQpMk)

278
When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.
Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (PbpT7)

-------

Oh now Ace. But you chew US out all the time!!

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (8XRCm)

279 Frosty : no, and please don't be a dick about it.

I was saying that our main geopolitical rivals are set to implode due to their own problems. Nothing more or less.

There's a third power we're not considering here: India. India is, under Modi, becoming a serious power (if a power with a bit too much poo on the streets... not like we can talk over here anymore).

So, we should concentrate on protecting America and not running around playing world-police. If India feels threatened by the Talibs, as I imagine they do, they can deal with it.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (ykYG2)

280 260 I just have this bad feeling that just like the cult of personality around Dubya, we're going to look back at the cult of personality around Trump and cringe. Especially if he comes up short in 2020.

I support Trump's platform wholeheartedly, but I'm done pretending everything the guy does is genius.

Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.
Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (sjTfF)

___

Everything you said....#MeToo

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (FiUMj)

281 Trump is sometimes his own worst enemy. Stuff like this should not be put out in a tweet.

Posted by: redridinghood at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (wiXsO)

282
Even if they say they resigned when in reality they were pushed out WHY it is important to pick a fight when the resignee/firee is not attacking you.....why pick fights with people who are leaving as long as they leave quietly??

Posted by: Voter theater. at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (r11vt)

283 My guess is that Bolton was leaking and Trump knew this and decided to let him go because of it. But, Trump respects Bolton's long service to the country enough not to humiliate him publicly over leaking.

Bolton is now texting every reporter he can think of putting his story out there, and you can already see people saying "Say, kinda odd that Bolton is text buddies with so many presstitutes, dontcha think?"

Trump is the least unhinged, emotional person in DC, and I am a firm believer in his G-d-like trolling abilities.

Cross him at your peril. Especially by leaking.

Posted by: Sharkman at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (Mo1SD)

284 Trump would get a lot more blow back from his supporters for some of his petty, unseemly public behavior if the nasty ass people arrayed against him weren't such...nasty ass people that do the same petty unseemly shit.

But that said, yeah, the public should not have to see this - just make the trains run on time without any public squabbling among the head engineers.

Posted by: Boswell at September 10, 2019 01:58 PM (32YRo)

285 260 I just have this bad feeling that just like the cult of personality around Dubya, we're going to look back at the cult of personality around Trump and cringe. Especially if he comes up short in 2020.

++++

yeah, I'm older and wiser now.

Trump fights except when he doesnt'. He arts the deal, except when he gets rolled for no fucking reason.

But Gorsuch, motherfuckers. At least we are building a bench and he's not hillary.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 01:58 PM (thQkh)

286 >>>the guy should have married one of trump's daughters.

well that's another thing. Because Trump had so few people he could appoint, another hiring pool was Jarvanka's liberal NY friends, who Trump thought might at least be loyal due to friend-of-a-friend connections.

Actual good conservatives were bumped to that Ivanka's sorority sisters could have gigs, and that's not an exaggeration. Or barely one. I think one was a sorority sister.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:58 PM (PbpT7)

287 Just saw a quote from a CAIR-type opposing 9/11 commemorations that "Muslims died on 9/11 too." Well yeah, at least 19 did.
Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (N4xQB)

Hamfisted.

Trump should tweet about Rashid complaining about 9-11 events. It will make people's blood boil and he can get away with it today and tomorrow

Posted by: JoeF. at September 10, 2019 01:58 PM (NFEMn)

288 How many muslims have moved here in the last 18 years?

Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (wGbBR)

289 Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.
========
and CNN would be lining up another peace prize. . .

Its all POLITICS now. Its about getting him out by any means necessary. It doesn't matter what he does, it'll be the wrong thing done in the wrong way. Things will be better when we get some young, sane people in charge, like Biden, Sanders or Warren.

Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (C6xeQ)

290 Yet look how much he has accomplished that other so called "inside Beltway professionals" did not - He is a force of nature and we are blessed to have VSGPDJT as our leader

Posted by: Bill at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (bJzfu)

291 @255:

That's perfectly reasonable and plausible, ace. The problem is Trump shouldn't have hired Bolton in the first place, but as that pointed out, it was a limited pool. Agreed that he doesn't need to scare off future hires. Then again, the second full sentence above.

The early supporter turned down at State because he was an early supporter happened quite a bit. That's partly because of what your friend described, and also due to some piss poor and treacherous people foisted on Trump as a modus vivendi for some to remain neutral in the coup d'état.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (iw59Q)

292 Almost every exchange here

Poster 1: Trump did something that I think could have been done better

Poster 2 Reply: You stupid NeverTrumper commie, I bet you think Jeb or Hillary would have been better right?

When the fuck did Trump become infallible?

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (FiUMj)

293 FIRST!!!!!

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (Zz0t1)

294 I have never understood why we don't just buy all
the poppy crop from the farmers. Dump it in the ocean if we don't like
it but don't take their livelihood away from the peasants.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019

Fuck that.
They can grow beans.
If they grow poppies, their dirt gets 100 year chemicals.

Posted by: Roland THTG at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (88+cf)

295 273 >>>Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.

It's several years later. How long did we sign up to have our men die in a shithole country for?

If you had asked me in 2001, I would have said "Wrap it up in four years. No longer."

I really don't give a shit what kind of government Afghanistan has. It can always be bombed if it acts up.

Posted by: ace at

=============

this is important.

1. of course we meet with our enemies.

2. 9-11 was 18 years ago, we killed OBL...we can figure out an end game, at least with respect to afghanistan.

3. most terror is now because of non-Afghan refugees being repopulated by treasonous cuck politicians to the West.

4. we can always start bombing again.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (thQkh)

296 267 Julia Louis-Dreyfus in her Seinfeld days, from beginning to end, was one of the loveliest women on TV. Not many women can look that good while making funny faces -- but she could.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (ClOmq)

__

Looked pretty good on Veep too, in her 50s.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (FiUMj)

297 Well, we MUST wait to hear what Trump Admin alum SCARMUCCI has to say about it......THEN we'll be in the KNOW, right?

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (Zz0t1)

298 Spot on. We cry "Fight them over there so we don't have to fight them here!" while simultaneously inviting them here.
Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 01:52 PM (N4xQB)

Yes!^^^

Perhaps the Single Greatest Act of Idiotic Horse-Fuckery in the History of the Republic.

Thanks, W! You did your part to help destroy America.

Go collect your check from whomever.

Posted by: naturalfake at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (SHtRW)

299 Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.

Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (sjTfF)

---
Of course we would because Obama ran for office on IRAQ WAR BAD, AFGHAN WAR GOOD.

So if he then turned around and said "Yeah, Afghan War also bad," people might be a little pissed.

To be fair, he did his best to lose both as well as Syria and the war he started in Libya.

Nobel Peace Prize winner, eh?

Posted by: Convalescing Author A.H. Lloyd at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (cfSRQ)

300 When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (PbpT7)

It's not an egotistical huff. Bolton was fouling up negotiations. Bolton's office has its place but after the President has engaged *you get with the program* and he couldn't/wouldn't do it.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (hSSpd)

301 Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.

In 2009... yeah, probably. As of 2012 I was already in here saying "no Romney no, stay out of Syria" and trying to tell my parents not to cheer the fall of Libya. So I'd not have cared if Obama was making a deal as long as the deal didn't involve the sort of bullshit Obama put into the Iran deal.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (ykYG2)

302 It appears that Trump tweeted "I asked John for his resignation" after Bolton started calling his journalist friends with the truth and it was reported.

"appears" to who?
"Calling his journalist friends" derp
"with the truth" whose truth
"it was reported" by who, the same CNN. MSNBC, ABC?

I missed sharpiegate...backing out of this one too

Posted by: DanMan at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (XTiHL)

303 How many muslims have moved here in the last 18 years?
Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (wGbBR)

All's I know is that 18 years ago there was no mosque in my city.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, With a Broken Brain at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (xPJvm)

304 > And he turns on them quite openly, not surreptitiously and disingenuously like the DNC-Media-RNC Complex does it.

Trump will knife you if you cross him, no question about it.

But he'll do it from in front, not in back.

Posted by: Rodrigo Borgia at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (cB5if)

305 How many muslims have moved here in the last 18 years?

....

Enough to where I can choose between shawarma and doner kebab in East Tennessee without leaving the office complex.

Camel jockeys are everywhere.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (YA914)

306 But that said, yeah, the public should not have to
see this - just make the trains run on time without any public
squabbling among the head engineers.

Posted by: Boswell at September 10, 2019 01:58 PM (32YRo)

============================
But we shall be made to see every wart and pimple. Because Republicans. The MSM will bury every Dem disaster and inflate every Trump administration brouhaha

Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (Pqytn)

307 "What exactly is the threat? The Taliban are not known for terrorist attacks outside of Afghanistan. We are fighting the approximate equivalent of local nobility. Outside of something more genocidal on our part they're never going to run out of local support. If they decide to get froggy after forming a new government, we can knock it over again. Repeat until they stop. We're much better at eliminating standing armies and governments than we are at occupation and fighting insurrection.
Posted by: Someguy at September 10, 2019 01:43 PM (Wj9tV)"

That's the same type of thinking that got us September 11th.

You have now idea what the threat profile is in AFG, nor do most people. But if you look at what is public, they are expanding their territory, reach and influence. They are actively working with AQ and other groups aspiring to attack the U.S. and U.S. citizens. This fucking fairytale that if we just withdraw the threat will be gone is just that, and I'm tired of hearing that lie. Likewise I am tired of hearing from the Kristol's and others of the world the answer is to execute a continuous war.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (VpIIl)

308 The whole stupid you were fired versus I quit argument is not very interesting.

What is more interesting is why was Bolton fired? I suspect that Trump has deferred to the military and foreign policy crowd on Afghanistan for the last three years and simply wants to walk away from it as a bad deal. Nixon did much the same thing in Vietnam and for much the same reasons. In that case it was the domino theory (Vietnam) instead of terrorism (A-stan) but far too many government policymaking officials reject policy change by slippery slope arguments and rock on with decade long policy failures as a result.

The traditional political way that policy disputes were handled is simply to give another official the task off the books and leave the other fixture in place to be a human mushroom appointee. Kept in the dark and fed manure.

Trump is a direct kinda guy and gets rid of them in an unpolitical fashion but generally is gracious unless you start trying to throw shade on him post hoc. He believes in massive retaliation for such. An ideologue like Bolton believes that their ideas are more important than comity and deference to the executive and they generally end up making a nuisance of themselves in any administration over time.

A-stan, unless you kill one third or more of military fit aged Pashtuns and can seal the border with Pakistan is never going to be a policy success as long as it exists because the tribes constituting the territory of Afghanistan are not a nation state.

We are not willing to do the killing and deprivation of logistical support that it took to win in Vietnam nor A-stan and we are too virtuous to do what the Brits normally did which was divide and conquer techniques where they strategically played each ethnic group against the other in their colonies or use proxies to fight for them.

It is far cheaper in blood and treasure in the long run and less disastrous to treat terrorists as pirates outside of the law's protections and use unconventional warfare to punish such as drones and special forces. See much terrorism toward the U.S. from Yemenese lately after Al Awlaki was droned despite no U.S. bases there.

Posted by: whig at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (hqUZK)

309 It's several years later. How long did we sign up to have our men die in a shithole country for?

If you had asked me in 2001, I would have said "Wrap it up in four years. No longer."

I really don't give a shit what kind of government Afghanistan has. It can always be bombed if it acts up.

Posted by: ace

___________

I'm all for leaving, but why not just leave?

why do in that manner? Optics matter.

I'm against Bolton's foreign policy vision (which is why he shouldn't have been hired) and on Trump's side in terms of policy, I just think there are better ways to leave. We don't really owe them a ceremony like that.

Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (sjTfF)

310 Trump's biggest mistake was not firing 2/3rd's of the Fed. Govt. on day 1.

No, make that 4/5ths.

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (1ISKN)

311 Destroy the poppy fields so they can never grow anything again and leave. Forever.
Posted by: Ever at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (ZZDMQ)

Oh, I'm reasonably certain preserving the poppy fields is one of the biggest reasons we're still there after 18 years.

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 02:02 PM (cY3LT)

312 Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.
Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (sjTfF)

That's not a good parallelism. Missing all context. Why would Obama call such a meeting and why would Trump? Totally different set-ups, motivations and probable outcomes.

And Obama would NEVER have scuttled it like Trump did.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 02:02 PM (H8QX8)

313 "Then you'll be all like : 'Where's the Fuckin' Nutmeg!?'"

I heard you can trip on that stuff if you eat enough of it.

Posted by: Chris M at September 10, 2019 02:02 PM (eAZVt)

314 303 How many muslims have moved here in the last 18 years?
Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (wGbBR)

All's I know is that 18 years ago there was no mosque in my city.
Posted by: Pug Mahon, With a Broken Brain at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (xPJvm)

___

18 years ago I could go a month without seeing a jihab. Today I can't go a day.

Thanks W.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:02 PM (FiUMj)

315 I'm not going to get all bothered about this.

Posted by: Cato, Collectivism Delenda Est at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (J+mig)

316 EXCELLENT post, whig.

An ideologue like Bolton believes that their ideas are more important than comity and deference to the executive and they generally end up making a nuisance of themselves in any administration over time.

Yes. I'm like this too, so I understand the foible very well.

Posted by: BlackOrchid at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (Rarvo)

317 249
Just saw a quote from a CAIR-type opposing 9/11 commemorations that "Muslims died on 9/11 too." Well yeah, at least 19 did.

Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 01:54 PM (N4xQB)

What a doofus. A few dozen or so Muslims killed due to the 9/11 aircraft attacks were merely acceptable collateral damage to bin Laden and Sheikh Muhammed. And that clown knows it. Does Hamas launch a rocket at Israel only after real-time intel proves no Palestinians or Muslims of any nationality are in the probable damage zone?

Posted by: Gref at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (AMIL/)

318 Almost every exchange here

Poster 1: Trump did something that I think could have been done better

Poster 2 Reply: You stupid NeverTrumper commie, I bet you think Jeb or Hillary would have been better right?

When the fuck did Trump become infallible?
Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (FiUMj)

This is liberal thought creep. Albeit in liberal neck break fashion.

"I really don't like that Sanchez guy....."

Liberal though creep: "YOU HATE ALL MEXICANS YOU RACIST!!!!!" "YOU WANT TO KILL ALL BROWN PEOPLE!!!!"

Sometimes, this place is a cesspool.

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (Zz0t1)

319 When you step back and look at the administration over all, there are a lot of great appointments who are doing great jobs. The problem is mainly with those who want to Show-boat and be Washington Big Men - that's where all the trouble is. Rick Perry, Ben Carson, Andrew Wheeler, I could go on with the others who are doing their jobs and don't run to the MSM every day to make sure their names are in the paper.

The people who think *their* ideas are more important than their bosses, and who want to tell everyone about it, are the ones who cause all the trouble.

Posted by: Tom Servo at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (Kpl3J)

320 Poster 2 Reply: You stupid NeverTrumper commie, I bet you think Jeb or Hillary would have been better right?

When the fuck did Trump become infallible?

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (FiUMj)

---
How about Poster 3: Who cares? This "White House chaos!" B.S. was old in the spring of 2017. Can we debate something useful, like crossbows vs longbows?

Posted by: Convalescing Author A.H. Lloyd at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (cfSRQ)

321 2. 9-11 was 18 years ago, we killed OBL...we can figure out an end game, at least with respect to afghanistan.

-----

We should have left after that. Pin a note to the Presidential Palace that reads "Do Not Make Me Come Back Here Again. Cordially, Uncle Sam."

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (8XRCm)

322 9 Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.

Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (sjTfF)

---
Of course we would because Obama ran for office on IRAQ WAR BAD, AFGHAN WAR GOOD.

So if he then turned around and said "Yeah, Afghan War also bad," people might be a little pissed.

To be fair, he did his best to lose both as well as Syria and the war he started in Libya.

Nobel Peace Prize winner, eh?
Posted by: Convalescing Author A.H. Ll

Also Trump negotiating with the Taliban he is going to be looking to get the best deal for America. Obama negotiating with the Taliban he is going to be looking to get the best deal for the Taliban.

Posted by: Buzzion at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (66KLX)

323 Gorka said he couldn't get his own people for his own cabinet position, AND that the people he named that he wanted, actually got punished/demoted, just for being named by Gorka. then Gorka was put out to pasture.

Yeah, the DeepState Mafia still runs the joint ...

Posted by: illiniwek at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (Cus5s)

324 267 Julia Louis-Dreyfus in her Seinfeld days, from beginning to end, was one of the loveliest women on TV. Not many women can look that good while making funny faces -- but she could.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (ClOmq)

I think she actually got more attractive post-Seinfeld. Maybe just because the 90's were a strange time for fashion.

Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (N4xQB)

325 Actual good conservatives were bumped to that Ivanka's sorority sisters could have gigs, and that's not an exaggeration. Or barely one. I think one was a sorority sister.

Posted by: ace

++++++

-trump fights except when he doesnt
-trump art of the deal it, except when he gets rolled
-trump knows personnel except when he accidentally wins the presidency and the swamp wants to take him and all his supporters out.

it's a problem. but gorsuch, fuckers.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (thQkh)

326 Julia Louis-Dreyfus in her Seinfeld days, from beginning to end, was one of the loveliest women on TV. Not many women can look that good while making funny faces -- but she could.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (ClOmq)

__

Looked pretty good on Veep too, in her 50s.
=========
She's an heiress to the guy who ran the Dreyfus investment funds. She can afford specialty 'cosemetics' and special surgery.

Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (CrYTe)

327 Ace, it is a repeated pattern. Trump will praise somebody in his camp until the moment they part ways and then they suddenly become a complete idiot or insane or duplicitous.

Posted by: goodluckduck at September 10, 2019 02:04 PM (rwaEp)

328 >>>The early supporter turned down at State because he was an early supporter happened quite a bit. That's partly because of what your friend described, and also due to some piss poor and treacherous people foisted on Trump as a modus vivendi for some to remain neutral in the coup d'etat.

Trump not only knew so few people in DC that he didn't just not know who to trust or not to trust, but he also didn't know the people who could be trusted
to tell him who to trust or not to trust.

He had a bunch of people in very senior positions who were shepherding in all the same people who would be in positions of policy-making under Jeb or Marco or even Obama.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 02:04 PM (PbpT7)

329 And how this must impact the people who are willing to work for Trump. They go in knowing they'll be savaged by the press and the Republican Establishment. But to compound it with the knowledge that if they have any disagreement with the President, he'll feel it necessary to announce to the world "I fired him"?

How many people have had these cantankerous exits, really? A handful? Maybe two handfuls?
Omarosa. Scaramucci comes to mind. Any I am missing?

Hope Hicks left on gossamer wings.

When you leave like this, it's more than just Trump HR management - it's a message that this wasn't the result of mere disagreement, but betrayal.

It's the bureaucratic version of, "...and stay out!"

It's an even more severe form of the firing scene from Casino. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcZHSGyos6g

Posted by: The Federal Reserve at September 10, 2019 02:04 PM (oX6KR)

330 Also, the Jvanka thing was due to a small pool of people who could be trusted not to facilitate an ongoing coup, which it obviously was. Trump is thin-skinned and has an overweening ego (we've seen that before), but his ability to have navigated through what was done to him is nothing short of amazing.

This will pass quickly and doesn't amount to squat. Hopefully Trump will get us out of Afghanistan sooner now.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at September 10, 2019 02:04 PM (iw59Q)

331 Why are we still in Afghanistan (and Korea and Germany and Japan for that matter)? Easy. As always follow the money which leads to Boeing, Lockheed, etc.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:04 PM (FiUMj)

332 To be fair, he did his best to lose both as well as Syria and the war he started in Libya.

Nobel Peace Prize winner, eh?

Posted by: Convalescing Author A.H. Lloyd at September 10, 2019 02:00 PM (cfSRQ)

Exactly. Obama didn't earn in eight years what Trump earned in two. No disastrous conflicts, no funding of terrorism. The man has the right to make some decisions. Personally I would love him paving over the worst parts of Afghanistan, but if we can't get that it is time to leave.

Posted by: trev006 at September 10, 2019 02:04 PM (Lvrv/)

333 George W. Bush was the worst POTUS since...Buchanan. Far worse than Carter.

Posted by: Balrog of Morgoth at September 10, 2019 02:05 PM (b1l+6)

334 >>>I think she actually got more attractive post-Seinfeld. Maybe just because the 90's were a strange time for fashion.

seinfeld avoided most 90s fashion mayhem.

There's actually a type of fashion which is largely defined by "The clothes they wore on Seinfeld." J. Crew, stuff like that.

It's called "normcore." For "Normie."

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 02:05 PM (PbpT7)

335 314 303 How many muslims have moved here in the last 18 years?
Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 01:59 PM (wGbBR)

All's I know is that 18 years ago there was no mosque in my city.
Posted by: Pug Mahon, With a Broken Brain at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (xPJvm)

___

18 years ago I could go a month without seeing a jihab. Today I can't go a day.

Thanks W.

+++++++++

I think SunTzu and Machiavelli and a few other great political minds from history didn't think it needed to be said "your nation is a nation of the people right there, right now, whose parents and grandparents built the place. People who say we're a nation of migrants are traitors and need to be hung and gutted like that guy in Outlaw King"

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 02:06 PM (thQkh)

336 Poppies. Poppies.

And your little dog, too!

Posted by: JackStraw at September 10, 2019 02:06 PM (ZLI7S)

337 If we are going to fight a war, then let's fight the fucker. Get the politicians and lawyers out of the military. Go in, bomb where we want, get out. If the country gets out of line, repeat bombing. Until they stop being bitches. No talking, no handholding. Just good and hard. A 20 year war is fucking retarded. Anyone who wants that should be front of the line and not thousands of miles away making any stupid ass decisions.

Posted by: NCKate at September 10, 2019 02:06 PM (lknvV)

338 How many muslims have moved here in the last 18 years?

....

Enough to where I can choose between shawarma and doner kebab in East Tennessee without leaving the office complex.

Camel jockeys are everywhere.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 02:01 PM (YA914)

How do you think Omar and Talib were elected?

They're taking over, much like how the Mexicans took Texas back.

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:06 PM (Zz0t1)

339 Damn whig, maybe YOU should be the national policy advisor. You make more sense than most.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 02:07 PM (ykYG2)

340 Trump not only knew so few people in DC that he didn't just not know who to trust or not to trust, but he also didn't know the people who could be trusted
to tell him who to trust or not to trust.

------------

To my point in the last thread. Trump has seen so much backstabbing that his instincts - probably true - are to not trust anyone.

Unfortunately, with the federal government the size it is, that makes it difficult to staff.

That is also an indictment on the size of the federal government.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:07 PM (sX1BW)

341 >> J. Crew, stuff like that.

Purveyors of Fine Messenger Bags and Matching Butt Plugs.

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 02:07 PM (0Uei+)

342 See, this is a fair analysis of Trump that isn't just REE REE HE TWEETS REE REE. Discussion of cost benefit analysis, the impact, etc. Not just REE REE REE IT'S SO GAUCHE REE REE REE.

Leave Afghanistan right the fuck now. Right now. Just load everyone up and *leave*.

Hell, even better, do it tomorrow (is it tomorrow there, time zones are hard).

Seriously, no one can give any kind of coherent explanation of what our goals are and, most importantly, what is the metric for leaving.

If it is worth spilling a drop of American blood, and I mean because someone got a paper cut, then it is worth total war. If not, then don't do it. That's where I am in foreign policy now and I drank vats of Flavor Aid about whiskey, democracy, sexy.

Either win a declared war or don't go at all.

Next up, anyone want to tell me why NATO still exists?

We mock the climate change cultists for thinking the the Earth's temperature should be static to what they were as kids. Far, far, far too many people, both Left and Right, seem to believe that everything should be how it was in the 1950's when it comes to foreign policy.

Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at September 10, 2019 02:07 PM (mf5HN)

343 Let's be honest, If Obama was meeting the Taliban at Camp David for a peace deal, we would be foaming at the mouth.
Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 01:55 PM (sjTfF)

___

Everything you said....#MeToo
Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (FiUMj)

Well...except Oblabla would be giving them $18T just to show up at Camp David.

And probably offering to bring the Taliban and their families over to live in the US.

And getting Epstein to give them all 8 year olds to fuck as a courtesy.

There's quite a bit of difference between treating an a-hole better than he deserves to get a deal you want,

and giving away the store.

Posted by: naturalfake at September 10, 2019 02:07 PM (SHtRW)

344 I really don't give a shit what kind of government Afghanistan has. It can always be bombed if it acts up.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:57 PM (PbpT7)

Which by the way, we are in Afghanistan , getting picked off a few at a time, as guests of the Afghan govt. All this bomb the country into oblivion crap is just that, crap. The Taliban is an insurgent force, scattered out in tribes throughout the hinterlands. The retreat into Pakistan, where they terrorize the locals into feeding, sheltering , etc. and then they come out like roaches again into Afghanistan. The Northern Alliance couldn't eliminate them, nor could the Afghan government. They hosted Osama Bin Ladin, who had his own warlord dreams of starting his own terrorist organization called Al Qaeda. We have been able to reduce Al Qaeda to a very small group, have reduced ISIS to a far less functional terrorist organization, but I do not see the wisdom in continuing to lose people to an insurgency war in a desolate piece of sand and rock that no one wants, except for it's actual ruling government , Afghanistan.

Posted by: Jen the original at September 10, 2019 02:08 PM (t0g7x)

345 >>seinfeld avoided most 90s fashion mayhem.

The Puffy Shirt

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 02:08 PM (0Uei+)

346 When you are talking about staffing, keep in mind that there haven't been any changes on the economics team. They are the rock stars.

Posted by: notsothoreau at September 10, 2019 02:08 PM (JKNZq)

347 Bolton worked for Romney.

Romney is playing "elder statesman" with the firing.

All I need to know when it comes to whether or not Bolton needed to be fired, resigned, whatever.

Posted by: blake - used salesman salesman
at September 10, 2019 02:08 PM (qC1Sy)

348 328
We've only been hammering that point for 2 years now

Posted by: Balrog of Morgoth at September 10, 2019 02:08 PM (b1l+6)

349 I FIRED JOHN BOLTON. I didnt want him to stick a medal in my eye.

Posted by: Joe Kookoo Biden at September 10, 2019 02:08 PM (M+Lyo)

350 Sometimes, this place is a cesspool.

Only the ONT. That dirty dirty night crew.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:08 PM (yQpMk)

351 Bolton might have better served himself by biting the bullet and letting the President have the last word. It takes two to make a spat, and if JB was shivved, then there will be plenty of time down the road for him to make his case. Getting in a tit-for-tat argument over nothing isn't very edifying.

Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:08 PM (Pqytn)

352 If we are going to fight a war, then let's fight the fucker. Get the politicians and lawyers out of the military. Go in, bomb where we want, get out. If the country gets out of line, repeat bombing. Until they stop being bitches. No talking, no handholding. Just good and hard. A 20 year war is fucking retarded. Anyone who wants that should be front of the line and not thousands of miles away making any stupid ass decisions.

-------------

My response would be that the next tower will be met with one or more nukes. Further escalation will be met with further nukes.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:09 PM (sX1BW)

353 This is off-topic, but it's interesting that Tulsi Gabbard is separating herself overtly from the rest of the nutty Dem field. She's in the news today supporting restrictions on third-trimester abortions, criticizing identity politics, and opposing open borders. If she continues with this, I'd expect her support to increase.

Posted by: Meade Lux Lewis at September 10, 2019 02:09 PM (hjaPQ)

354 you can't fire me! I quit!

Posted by: amy schumer at September 10, 2019 02:09 PM (Dh1wo)

355 Not dead, just router died Saturday just before ChessDress thread, have new one.

Posted by: Skip at September 10, 2019 02:09 PM (ZCEU2)

356 moslem is a religion of piece!

Posted by: Chris M at September 10, 2019 02:09 PM (eAZVt)

357 When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.
Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (PbpT7)

What if the person you are alienating isn't loyal to you?

Because I think a test of loyalty is 'how do you leave' and if how you leave is to get in a twitter spat with the boss over whether you offered to resign or were asked to resign, then you might not be so loyal.

Posted by: Mikey NTH -Support Your Sagging Self-Worth with Poses & Postures from The Outrage Outlet! at September 10, 2019 02:09 PM (hLRSq)

358 I just have this bad feeling that just like the cult of personality
around Dubya, we're going to look back at the cult of personality around
Trump and cringe. Especially if he comes up short in 2020.

I was born in '72. I remember Carter, but the first president as well as his supporters and detractors I really watched was Reagan.

There was a cult of personality around him, and there's been a cult of personality around every president ever since. Their supporters always see them as gods taking the field on the side of good. Their detractors see them as devils corrupting the Republic.

We don't elect citizens to govern by the consent of free men. We elect friggin' rock-stars and personally invest into them some kind of morality - either righteousness or villainy - that's more akin to democratic divine right than a simple leader of the executive branch.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby's Father at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (Yc046)

359 @328:

Yep. But don't sell short deals had to be cut to buy neutrality in an ongoing coup (McConnell's old lady among them). We cannot even wrap our heads around it.

Incidentally, and probably not a shocker, some of the Bushies in the grim, tiny pool had a history of doing the same crap to their previous boss and holding onto their jobs. I'll take Trump's approach to handling their exit vs. not having an exit.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (iw59Q)

360 I saw Bolton open for Kenny G at Merriweather in 98.

Posted by: The Walking Dude at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (cCxiu)

361 Bolton might have better served himself by biting the bullet and letting the President have the last word

no, because he fully intends to be the male version of Jennifer Rubin now.

what he's doing is exactly serving his own interests.

Posted by: BlackOrchid at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (Rarvo)

362 REEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!11!!!

Posted by: Reeeeeeeeeeeee!! at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (b1l+6)

363 321
2. 9-11 was 18 years ago, we killed OBL...we can figure out an end game, at least with respect to afghanistan.

-----

We should have left after that. Pin a note to the Presidential
Palace that reads "Do Not Make Me Come Back Here Again. Cordially,
Uncle Sam."

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 02:03 PM (8XRCm)

I think it all comes back to this: We, the USA, have forgotten how to fight a war. Or even lost the stomache for it. We have bought into the idea that our weapons systems will only kill bad guys and totally lose our collective minds when (supposed) civilians get caught up in it.Now, I never served in the military so pardon my ignorance or if I'm speaking out of turn.
But if we are going to commit to a war, then it should be "game on". We should have carpet bombed AFG from border to border. Circle back and do it again.
We also need to remember this: We, the USA, might declare the war over. But the enemy gets a vote in that declaration. I don't see them clamoring for peace.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (D3cJf)

364 337 If we are going to fight a war, then let's fight the fucker. Get the politicians and lawyers out of the military. Go in, bomb where we want, get out."

Whig had a very good point - the reason we can never do that in A-stan is that the tribe that causes all the trouble, the Pashtun, also runs the northern 1/3 of Pakistan or so. That's why we can never win, if we ever make it to hot for the Taliban, they just run to their brothers and cousins in Pakistan and sit it out til we quit. So, theoretically it would be nice if we could come up with some joint nuclear strike with India to totally vaporize Pakistan once and for all, but that isn't going to happen, and without that A-stan can never be "won".

For all his supposed brilliance, I never saw Bolton grapple with this problem once.

Posted by: Tom Servo at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (Kpl3J)

365 having one American soldier die for a bunch of goat humping 5th century inbreds is one soldier too much.

nothing ever good came from Dar al-Islam.

Posted by: Retard Strength Trumps Smart Power at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (RKQ/v)

366 Let's assume for the sake of argument that Bolton's version is correct.

Why exactly would he have been offering his resignation?

Posted by: Tami at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (cF8AT)

367 Seinfeld." J. Crew, stuff like that.

It's called "normcore." For "Normie."

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 02:05 PM (PbpT7)

___

heh. That was (and I guess still is now I guess) my uniform of the 90s. Jeans and a button down shirt (sans the running shoes though). J Crew, LL Bean, Eddie Bauer. Fashions change over time here and there, but put me in a JCrew shirt from 1995 and it wouldn't look that out of place today.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:10 PM (FiUMj)

368 It seems the circumstances of this Bolton firing have revealed a lot of pent-up frustration with Trump regarding other issues.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (H8QX8)

369 Unfortunately, with the federal government the size it is, that makes it difficult to staff.

That is also an indictment on the size of the federal government.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:07 PM (sX1BW)

============================
The problem ain't the size of the guvvimint, it's the people innit.

Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (Pqytn)

370 Tomorrow:

9:00 Trump pardons Flynn.

9:01 Trump hires Flynn as NSA.

9:02. Internet ends.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (kTF2Z)

371 HAHAHAHAHAHA
All the best people!!
HAHAHAHA

Posted by: Cement Truck at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (DRZpQ)

372 When you barely have anyone loyal to you, you can't afford to alienate people over egotistical huffs.
Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 01:44 PM (PbpT7)

Were any of these swamp critters ever loyal in the first place? And if they're not loyal, if they're playing for a different team, and undermined you the whole way, what difference does alienating them make?

Posted by: Cato, Collectivism Delenda Est at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (J+mig)

373 NATO had a reason up to about, oh, 9/11/2001 because we couldn't be sure that the Russkies wouldn't do a coup and bring some commie or imperialist back to the Kremlin.

After the Turks buttfucked us during the Iraq War (whatever the merits of said war) it should have been clear that Russia was less of a problem for the West than the whole ball of nasty that is the Near East.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (ykYG2)

374 "Get out of Afghanistan" is a fucking bumper sticker, not a policy.

Do we aspire to get out, yes, yes we do. But nobody wants to have to go back or build up again in five years.

A lot of people today are simply unrealistic about the contemporary threats to our safety and well being. This isn't the 60's and AFG isn't Vietnam. Today's threats will take constant vigilance and direct action to diminish them.

Get over the fact we are there. We are there for a very good reason.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (VpIIl)

375 Next up, anyone want to tell me why NATO still exists?
=======
I'll take a stab

Because even though Russia is pathetic militarily, they are still regionally aggressive and they far far exceed Europe in terms of on the ground capability.

Not that' I'm necessarily in favor of protecting Europe at this point. I'm just positing the answer as an exercise.

Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (MqvZw)

376 The big signing ceremonies like the Japanese on the USS Missouri ending WW2 are to make a public spectacle on their complete surrender.

Unless you have something like that with the Taliban, you just leave. You don't give them that platform with the President.

My take is we accomplished what we needed to in Afghanistan, but we're dealing with largely the same people. They aren't an ally and not some new nation state, but we need to get out of that business altogether.

Posted by: Blago at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (sjTfF)

377 That is also an indictment on the size of the federal government.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:07 PM (sX1BW)

============================
The problem ain't the size of the guvvimint, it's the people innit.
Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (Pqytn)

It's both.

Posted by: Cato, Collectivism Delenda Est at September 10, 2019 02:12 PM (J+mig)

378 Personally, I don't believe anything said on Twitter offers any insight on reality or current events.

I think it's just a big PsyOp scheme to steal my precious bodily fluids.

Posted by: sniffybigtoe at September 10, 2019 02:12 PM (1ISKN)

379 The Government is too damned Girthy!

Posted by: The Rent is Too High Guy at September 10, 2019 02:12 PM (0Uei+)

380 267. john o'hurly says louis-dreyfuss is the smartest actress in the biz.

he also said when he first read for peterman he thought it was terrible, that it wasn't funny. then he realized the humor was in the situations, not written jokes like most sitcoms.

Posted by: musical jolly chimp at September 10, 2019 02:13 PM (Pg+x7)

381 Guys, the Dems are going to impeach Trump. This will be like watching Wile E. Coyoto being hit with a Nuetron Acme Bomb. Fuck Bolton. He needs to trim his stache.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:13 PM (2LelM)

382 The problem ain't the size of the guvvimint, it's the people innit.
Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (Pqytn)

-----

It aint the people innit either. Its how much they control.

You want to get rid of corruption and graft in the government.???? Stop giving them them the power to pick winners and punish everybody else.

Problem.
Solved.

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 02:13 PM (8XRCm)

383 That is also an indictment on the size of the federal government.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:07 PM (sX1BW)

============================

The problem ain't the size of the guvvimint, it's the people innit.

Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (Pqytn)

It's both.

Posted by: Cato, Collectivism Delenda Est at September 10, 2019 02:12 PM (J+mig)

---
and thus, the power of "and" is embraced, if awkwardly.

Posted by: redc1c4 at September 10, 2019 02:13 PM (H/7NQ)

384 The big signing ceremonies like the Japanese on the USS Missouri ending WW2 are to make a public spectacle on their complete surrender.

---------------

A mushroom cloud at dawn is quite the public spectacle.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (sX1BW)

385 Yadda yadda yadaa Bolton is no longer in the administration

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (FiUMj)

386 What Chris Rock said about cheating applies to most things in life - people are as loyal as their options.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (oZ6kz)

387 The Constitution is being sharted upon from a very great height.

Posted by: Utility muffin at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (cykH2)

388 john o'hurly says louis-dreyfuss is the smartest actress in the biz.

he also said when he first read for peterman he thought it was terrible, that it wasn't funny. then he realized the humor was in the situations, not written jokes like most sitcoms.
Posted by: musical jolly chimp at September 10, 2019 02:13 PM (Pg+x7)

Crowder interviewed him last week. It was a pretty good interview. The dude gets it.

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (Zz0t1)

389 Next up, anyone want to tell me why NATO still exists?

Because too many people simply enjoy the idea of America projecting power. They're typically the same people that discuss the local college football team in terms of "we" and "us".

Posted by: Ricky Bobby's Father at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (Yc046)

390 A lot of people today are simply unrealistic about
the contemporary threats to our safety and well being. This isn't the
60's and AFG isn't Vietnam. Today's threats will take constant vigilance
and direct action to diminish them.

Get over the fact we are there. We are there for a very good reason.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (VpIIl)

What threat does Afghanistan pose to us?

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (CQ3Qb)

391 378 Personally, I don't believe anything said on Twitter offers any insight on reality or current events.

I think it's just a big PsyOp scheme to steal my precious bodily fluids.
------------------
Take lots of lithecin and protect yourself. You can also shoot pearl necklaces like a porn star.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (2LelM)

392 Wht NATO? Because even though Jug Ears thought Mittens wanted the 70s calling him, the Democrats are sure they hacked the Presidency into Trump's pocket.

Posted by: Skip at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (ZCEU2)

393 "Next up, anyone want to tell me why NATO still exists? "

Cuz.....uhm uhm, well....SHUT UP YOU COMMIE PIECE OF SHIT!!!!

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (FiUMj)

394 Guys, the Dems are going to impeach Trump. This will be like watching Wile E. Coyoto being hit with a Nuetron Acme Bomb. Fuck Bolton. He needs to trim his stache.
Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:13 PM (2LelM)

The coyote chasing the road runner was actually a Japanese protocol?

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (Zz0t1)

395 Gentlemen please, let's not dwell on Julia Dryfuss' attractiveness, without first exploring the lovely vale between Ben Shapiros sisters large pendulous Ashkenazi breasts.

Posted by: Regular joe at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (6/uwW)

396 Tulsi Gabbard is going the way of Daniel Patrick Moynihan. What did PJ O'Rourke say: a smart person "who went into politics anyway".

I notice she advertises on PJ Media heavily. She's looking for donations from us, not from the Dems . . .

Maybe her angle is to lose the primaries and then get into Trump's second-term cabinet as a "unity!" pick.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (ykYG2)

397 It's not size or control, the problem with the federal government is it's reach. There is no where to move to that you escape it's mandates.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (yQpMk)

398 So I found out why Trump always has bad breakups. He's a Mean Tweeter.

A Mean Tweeter?

Yeah, you know the mean things you say when you break up that you don't mean? Well he means them.

Ohhh

Well i can't work for him then. I need to be with someone who breaks up well.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (oZ6kz)

399 The issue is that everyone on the right is either for the status quo or, like Bolton, jonesin for intervention. There's no one on Trump's side because Trump actually sees soldiers as human beings.

Posted by: Mike Yerian at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (MOTel)

400 I'll take a stab

Because even though Russia is pathetic militarily, they are still regionally aggressive and they far far exceed Europe in terms of on the ground capability.

Not that' I'm necessarily in favor of protecting Europe at this point. I'm just positing the answer as an exercise.

Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (MqvZw)

The reason we oppose any regional aggression around the world is that so no one achieves parity with the US. Kind of a ridiculously overambitious goal imo, but that's what it is. If Russia annexes part of Europe it is not an immediate threat, but perhaps an eventual one. Much like China.

Posted by: Someguy at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (Wj9tV)

401 395 Gentlemen please, let's not dwell on Julia Dryfuss' attractiveness, without first exploring the lovely vale between Ben Shapiros sisters large pendulous Ashkenazi breasts.
Posted by: Regular joe at September 10, 2019 02:15 PM (6/uwW)

Can we do both?

At the same time, ideally. I have money saved.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (bcbK8)

402

King Ping?

Posted by: Soothsayer at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (kGJFi)

403 and truly, Abigail has G-d's Chosen Boobies.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (ykYG2)

404 Get over the fact we are there. We are there for a very good reason.
Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (VpIIl)

So it's Team America, World Police, forever? No choice, no end, no limits on our involvement?

Posted by: Tom Servo at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (Kpl3J)

405 The military is like all govt. It only grows.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (FiUMj)

406 374 "Get out of Afghanistan" is a fucking bumper sticker, not a policy.

Do we aspire to get out, yes, yes we do. But nobody wants to have to go back or build up again in five years.

A lot of people today are simply unrealistic about the contemporary threats to our safety and well being. This isn't the 60's and AFG isn't Vietnam. Today's threats will take constant vigilance and direct action to diminish them.

Get over the fact we are there. We are there for a very good reason.
Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (VpIIl)
-------------

No, but getting out of Afghanistan should be a goal, which government seems to have lost sight of.

We are in year 19 of this war with no end in sight.

Is there no one anywhere who can sit everyone down and ask, "What are our objectives in Afghanistan and are those objectives reason enough to stay?"

No?

Then either refocus or go home.

This never-ending blood and treasure drain on the US has to end.

And, guess what? Some endings are very unsatisfying.

Posted by: blake - used salesman salesman
at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (qC1Sy)

407 "That bird just flew right into your head!"

"...like he couldn't avoid it."

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM (0Uei+)

408 One thing to remember, you always want to be the last to join a war and never the first. Lets let things go sideways for awhile. We ain't 1 Adam 12. We got our own problems.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM (2LelM)

409 Oh and 'Gender Equality' is the latest dumb drum being beat at work. Apparently it will take 208 years to achieve it, according to the bullshit youtube video sent out to everyone.

I am biting my tongue.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM (bcbK8)

410 Denmark is in NATO. They'll probably give us the NATO discount when we buy Greenland.

Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM (Pqytn)

411 So best businessman ever makes shitty hiring decisions? Who coulda seen it? Besides every New Yorker?

Posted by: Cement Truck at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM (DRZpQ)

412 There's no one on Trump's side because Trump actually sees soldiers as human beings.

Yeah no. I'm not buying that generalization.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM (yQpMk)

413 Get over the fact we are there. We are there for a very good reason.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (VpIIl)

Nonsense.

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM (cY3LT)

414 Oh and I still don't care about Bolton's firing or Trump's thin skin.

I got bigger fish to fry.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM (bcbK8)

415 Ace gets it. I will vote for Trump because of his policies, and more so, because the policies of the Democratic nominee will be more than disastrous.

But I also think a lot of voters are put off by Trump's bluster, impulsiveness, and air of chaos in the way he runs the ship.

Posted by: mercenary13 at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (F1s01)

416 370 Tomorrow:

9:00 Trump pardons Flynn.

9:01 Trump hires Flynn as NSA.

9:02. Internet ends.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (kTF2Z)

I vote this.

Posted by: What's a Seawolf? at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (k76MH)

417 The fact that you automatically assume it is Trump, the guy who has been keeping his election promises, who is lying and not Bolton, the guy who helped lie us into Iraq and who continues to try to keep us in Afghanistan shows that for a smart guy, ace, you sure are dumb.

Specifically you point to Trump's ego --you seriously don't know what the fuck you are talking about. Trump is the man who won the national election and is the duly elected President of the United States of America. Not Bolton
That means TRUMP gets to decide whether Bolton quit or was fired. It is Bolton's ego who caused him to commit a HUGE breach of protocol and show a lack of respect for the office of the President and the will of the electorate by contradicting the POTUS publicly.

It also shows Trump was right to fire him.

Posted by: Venus at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (lZaEn)

418 409 Oh and 'Gender Equality' is the latest dumb drum being beat at work. Apparently it will take 208 years to achieve it, according to the bullshit youtube video sent out to everyone.

I am biting my tongue.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at

don't get fired, Mark.

Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (d7Ww2)

419 "Look, if you don't do what I say, Afghanistan will end up as a total shithole."

And if we do what you say?

"Man, why are you so obsessed with what happens in Afghanistan?"

Posted by: Ted K. at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (FJYfm)

420 llbean... hmmm.

llbean has great jeans, well made in a traditional cut at popular prices ($39 last time i looked). their other clothes are cheap as well as inexpensive, unfortunately.

jeans, though, highly recommended.

Posted by: musical jolly chimp at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (Pg+x7)

421 Denmark is in NATO. They'll probably give us the NATO discount when we buy Greenland.

------------

Can't we just seize it with a couple of Repo Men, "for payment past due."

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (sX1BW)

422
Next up, anyone want to tell me why NATO still exists?

Lockheed Martin Corporation
The Boeing Company
Raytheon Company
General Dynamics Corporation
Northrop Grumman Corporation
United Technologies Corporation
L-3 Communications
BAE Systems

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (aKsyK)

423 Never seen that before. Bird flyin into a woman's head.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (oZ6kz)

424 417 Yikes

Posted by: rammajamma at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (PQRcz)

425
Trump must draw, for the most part, from a sea of Bushites (and Romneyites, but what, really, is the difference?), so he is bound to have misfits, from his perspective, appointed to positions. Throw 'em out and try again when it doesn't work. Tigers' stripes is tigers' stripes -- Trump's job jsn't to change them.

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars (TM) at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (pNxlR)

426 The problem is Bolton nor Trump know when to STFU.

There is a time

Posted by: Somewhere on Ventura Highway at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (M+Lyo)

427 413. Shhhh. It's a secret reason. One that we need Tlaib and Omar in congress for, and all their chain migrated relatives.

Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (wGbBR)

428 Some comments here are a perfect illustration of why govt spending NEVER gets cut. At the slightest suggestion that maybe a 19 year war in Afghanistan has run its course, you get people screaming about how leaving that shithole will cause WW3 to happen to some such.

Everyone wants to cut spending until it's their pet project that's on the chopping block. Hence, there is no chopping block and never will be one.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (FiUMj)

429 Get out of Afghanistan" is a fucking bumper sticker, not a policy.

Do we aspire to get out, yes, yes we do. But nobody wants to have to go back or build up again in five years.

A lot of people today are simply unrealistic about the contemporary threats to our safety and well being. This isn't the 60's and AFG isn't Vietnam. Today's threats will take constant vigilance and direct action to diminish them.

Get over the fact we are there. We are there for a very good reason.
Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (VpIIl)

Okay. How long should we stay in Afghanistan?

At what troop level?

What is the rate of loss of limb and life that should be expected?

What will the costs be?

What are the very good reasons we are there?

Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (mf5HN)

430 Oh and 'Gender Equality' is the latest dumb drum being beat at work. Apparently it will take 208 years to achieve it, according to the bullshit youtube video sent out to everyone.

I am biting my tongue.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019

Share the link. Are comments open?

I don't have a YT account, nor will I ever get one, but SOMEONE might be able to have fun with it.

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (Zz0t1)

431 406 374 "Get out of Afghanistan" is a fucking bumper sticker, not a policy.
-------------------
A policy of not giving a shit about the ME is a policy. It is a very inexpensive and easily executeable policy as well. It also makes a great bumper sticker. Maybe if those profiting from this current policy were sending their sons to implement it I might believe it to be something of importance. But they aren't sending their sons so it must be a con that they profit from.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (2LelM)

432 Get over the fact we are there. We are there for a very good reason.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (VpIIl)

And can anybody articulate what that reason is, how we can achieve it, or how long that may take? I'll wait.

Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (N4xQB)

433
llbean has great jeans, well made in a
traditional cut at popular prices ($39 last time i looked). their other
clothes are cheap as well as inexpensive, unfortunately.

jeans, though, highly recommended.

Posted by: musical jolly chimp at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (Pg+x7)

===========================
The wrinkle-free Chinos are first-rate. And the Double-L Polo shirts are worth every penny.

Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (Pqytn)

434 Helloooooooo nurse!

Posted by: Insomniac at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (TOOqT)

435 "What threat does Afghanistan pose to us?
Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (CQ3Qb)"

It's not the country, it's the inhabitants. The government is not a threat, it is the Taliban, AQ and aligned groups who are using it as a staging ground for future attacks.

Look around you. New threats are building to us every day and they don't simply come from sovereign nations. We have more asymmetrical threats with the ability to do substantial damage then ever before.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (VpIIl)

436 Oh yeah, Mittens, STFU

Posted by: Somewhere on Ventura Highway at September 10, 2019 02:20 PM (M+Lyo)

437 Afghanistan reminds me of Iraq. We spent hundreds of lives defeating them. We spent thousands trying to rehabilitate them.

The ugly truth is - we don't have what it takes to bring stability to these regions. Because what it takes is a brutal dictator that will exercise that brutality in our best interests. If we don't have that will - and we don't - then it's best to just stay home.

The worst thing we're doing in these places is trying to bring them Democracy. It's a stupid goal, and we should know better.

Posted by: Ricky Bobby's Father at September 10, 2019 02:20 PM (Yc046)

438 john o'hurly says louis-dreyfuss is the smartest actress in the biz.
=====

She's also a billionaire via family money.

Posted by: Bicentennialguy at September 10, 2019 02:20 PM (GWQ+R)

439 337 If we are going to fight a war, then let's fight the fucker. Get the politicians and lawyers out of the military. Go in, bomb where we want, get out."

.....

This assumes that the point of the war is to accomplish a particular goal.

it isn't.

The point of this war is to be at war. War is good business for Republicans and Democrats alike.

Its a f*cking protection racket. You are being taxed to fund military action that enriches the US Congress under the guise that they are protecting you from radical goat herders from half-way around the globe that are after your American way of life.

Meanwhile, the literally ship in metric tons of heroin and Chinese made fentanyl from the region that actually will kill your kids or grandkids or great grandkids somewhere along the line.

Because the American government is f*cking twisted, demented and sick and doesn't care what little people get eaten by the machine to make themselves fatter and more bloated on our deaths, and the best thing that could ever happen to the American public would be if a giant meteor of death struck DC and wiped out every politician, judge and staffer in DC and parts of Maryland and Virginia.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 02:20 PM (YA914)

440 Eff Bolton and his whiny-fits.

PDZT has done an outstanding job, viewed in the light of the ongoing daily sabotage going on every day at every level.

Posted by: sock_rat_eez at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (pkvuH)

441 llbean has great jeans, well made in a traditional cut at popular prices ($39 last time i looked). their other clothes are cheap as well as inexpensive, unfortunately.

jeans, though, highly recommended.
Posted by: musical jolly chimp at September 10, 2019 02:18 PM (Pg+x7)

I was a Levi's guy for my entire life....then they announced their hatred of me, so never again.....that being said, they're horrible jeans now. I can't wear them without squatting and blowing the crotch out of them.

A Duluth Trading Co. was put in not too terribly far away. The ballroom jeans are the bomb.

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (Zz0t1)

442 Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 02:11 PM (MqvZw)

The reason we oppose any regional aggression around the world is that so no one achieves parity with the US. Kind of a ridiculously overambitious goal imo, but that's what it is. If Russia annexes part of Europe it is not an immediate threat, but perhaps an eventual one. Much like China.
Posted by: Someguy at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (Wj9tV)

An oversimplification, but not far off: The reason NATO exists is not to protect all of Europe, but to make sure the Soviets don't get their hands on places like Greece.

So we kinda won that one. So yay, us.

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (cY3LT)

443 That means TRUMP gets to decide whether Bolton quit or was fired. It is Bolton's ego who caused him to commit a HUGE breach of protocol and show a lack of respect for the office of the President and the will of the electorate by contradicting the POTUS publicly.

It also shows Trump was right to fire him.
======
Yeah. Bolton clearly is more interested in his own resume. Probably wants to make sure that CNN gig he may have been offered stays available.

Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (MqvZw)

444 Least believable thing on Seinfeld - Jerry and Elaine dated for 2(?) years and only had sex approximately 33 times.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (oZ6kz)

445 Hi Insom!

*wiggles*
*feints left*
*head bobs*

*POUNCE with a flip!*

Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (d7Ww2)

446 I find fault with Bolton in this situation, and I'm glad he's gone.
He's basically calling Trump a liar in public to preserve his ego, and all that does is serve the other side.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (adsVM)

447 I just guess I trust PDT who has dealt with everyone from the Mafia to Unions & Politicians all across the political spectrum to know more than Blog Members. Call my kooky

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (BqBId)

448 428 Some comments here are a perfect illustration of why govt spending NEVER gets cut. At the slightest suggestion that maybe a 19 year war in Afghanistan has run its course, you get people screaming about how leaving that shithole will cause WW3 to happen to some such.

Everyone wants to cut spending until it's their pet project that's on the chopping block. Hence, there is no chopping block and never will be one.
Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (FiUMj)

=========

Who wants to cut some social security?!

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (iikV8)

449 I think the media has done a helluva job propagating the caricature of Trump. Mean tweeter, petty, massive and fragile ego, etc. The fact is, no one here knows him or has worked for him and they cannot say for sure.

The alternative is that he is very accomplished, confident and idiosyncratic executive, and that while he can resemble qualities typical of these lazy caricatures, the real picture is quite different.

In the end, it will be about results. That is how Trump measures himself, and ultimately how he will be measured.

Posted by: Dan Smoot's Apprentice at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (H8QX8)

450 Hey kids - let me tell you a little secret.

War really is a racket.

Posted by: Smedley Butler at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (Yc046)

451 439 337 If we are going to fight a war, then let's fight the fucker. Get the politicians and lawyers out of the military. Go in, bomb where we want, get out."

++++

let's fix that to:

"if we are going to fight a war, we should have a country to fight for."

America 2019 is a far fucking cry from America 2001. We're now a evil, gay empire with nukes and way too many muslims.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (thQkh)

452 **cracks door and sticks his head in**

nope

**quietly closes door unnoticed**

Posted by: AlaBAMA at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (pRFRw)

453 444 Least believable thing on Seinfeld - Jerry and Elaine dated for 2(?) years and only had sex approximately 33 times.
Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic

that math only works if they were married for 10 years

Posted by: Rick in SK at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (FZYNt)

454 USSR imploded 30 years ago. We're still in Germany ready to fight WW3.

Oh bbbut bbbbut Putin!! Yeah cuz Putin, head of a barely functioning, broke near 3rd World status country is about to embark on capturing Europe. Or something.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (FiUMj)

455

Oh for fucks sake..... how many of you have actually fired any body.

The difference between firing and asking for a resignation is about --><-- THIS MUCH.

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (8XRCm)

456 Oh and for the record, I truly admire Tulsi's positions.

I do.

Both of them.

Deeply admire.

Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (mf5HN)

457 I need a vacation. Hell, just driving to the mountains and staying in a hotel would be a vacation. I would turn off all my devices and read that big book about the Thirty Years War that I never get around to. And I would nap. Maybe get some writing done.

Posted by: joncelli, who's totally not in the pay of Big Alien at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (RD7QR)

458 Afghanistan may be one of those places that even total war wouldn't sort out.

Posted by: rammajamma at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (PQRcz)

459 409 Oh and 'Gender Equality' is the latest dumb drum being beat at work. Apparently it will take 208 years to achieve it, according to the bullshit youtube video sent out to everyone.

I am biting my tongue.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:17 PM

That's the worst. Also, I got your email. I'll reply back a little later.

Posted by: Insomniac at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (TOOqT)

460 Perhaps Trump should just decide who is our SOB and give them full rein. Cash, weapons, bombardment when requested, few if any questions asked.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (yQpMk)

461 The Taliban provided aid, comfort and protection for Al-Queda.

We should pick some tribes in AF/PAK who are willing to kill the shit out of them, give them money, then leave.

We had a reason to go in. But once Bin Laden was dead, we have little reason to stay there. They are not us. They are not even European or Japanese. We cannot nation build there.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (bcbK8)

462 "What threat does Afghanistan pose to us?
Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (CQ3Qb)"

It's not the country, it's the inhabitants. The government is not a threat, it is the Taliban, AQ and aligned groups who are using it as a staging ground for future attacks.

Look around you. New threats are building to us every day and they don't simply come from sovereign nations. We have more asymmetrical threats with the ability to do substantial damage then ever before.

------------

We can go round and round on this.

Perhaps there are reasons for staying. There are certainly reasons for leaving. It would be nice if we actually had a Constitutional mechanism for this.

This forever war sort of reminds me of how we do entitlements. They are self-governing. There is no sunset. Appropriations should control this, but doesn't.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (sX1BW)

463 Posted by: on the other hand at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (MqvZw)
*******
Bolton was a Contributor to FUX News before becoming NSA

Posted by: Deep State is in Deep Shit at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (BqBId)

464 He had a bunch of people in very senior positions who were shepherding in all the same people who would be in positions of policy-making under Jeb or Marco or even Obama.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2019 02:04 PM (PbpT7)

Which means he has just about everyone in DC working against him. At that point the only way he gets anything done is pure force of will. That takes an ego the size of, well, Trump's.

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert (Gringo fuertemente armado) at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (m4pA7)

465 Then either refocus or go home.

This never-ending blood and treasure drain on the US has to end.

And, guess what? Some endings are very unsatisfying.
Posted by: blake - used salesman salesman
at September 10, 2019 02:16 PM (qC1Sy)

As best as I remember, we are still there because we were going to "nation build". Except that "nation building" amongst a pack of barbarian tribal religious fanatics who can't even grasp the fundamentals of personal hygiene is insanity, it can't possibly work, not ever.

as far as nuking something - what? who? Kabul is in fact the place that supports us most, it's the rest of the country that hates us. I'd suggest the real author of the chaos is in Islamabad, but then we're back to that nuclear war with Pakistan option and that just ain't gonna happen.

We gotta get outta that place.

Posted by: Tom Servo at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (Kpl3J)

466 on Julia Lousi Dreyfuss...

on Veep she was a fucking supermodel...er milf supermodel, at least the first few seasons. wow. Great bod.

Seinfeld was apparently a good show, you guys should check it out.

Posted by: mushroom maniac at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (thQkh)

467 I'm already at stage four of this Washington insiders career trajectory: Who was John Bolton?

Posted by: Regular joe at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (6/uwW)

468 456 Oh and for the record, I truly admire Tulsi's positions.

I do.

Both of them.

Deeply admire.
Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (mf5HN)

Workout videos. Sweaty, sweaty workout videos, with squats.

Posted by: joncelli, who's totally not in the pay of Big Alien at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (RD7QR)

469 456 Oh and for the record, I truly admire Tulsi's positions.

I do.

Both of them.

Deeply admire.
Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (mf5HN)

She only knows two?

Time to educate that girl!

I'm willing to stand as Tribune if you are.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (bcbK8)

470 Least believable thing on Seinfeld - Jerry and Elaine dated for 2(?) years and only had sex approximately 33 times.

In fairness, she never had an orgasm with Jerry.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (yQpMk)

471 Afghanistan may be one of those places that even total war wouldn't sort out.

Posted by: rammajamma at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (PQRcz)

================================
The key to retail diplomacy between the Great Powers is Location, Location, Location.

Posted by: mrp at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (Pqytn)

472 Stuff like this makes me cringe. It's so unnecessary. I overlook Trumps ego and pride, but sometimes he needs to reign it in.

Posted by: redridinghood at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (wiXsO)

473 445 Hi Insom!

*wiggles*
*feints left*
*head bobs*

*POUNCE with a flip!*
Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (d7Ww2)

Whoa...I'm a little dizzy...

Posted by: Insomniac at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (TOOqT)

474 " That means TRUMP gets to decide whether Bolton quit or was fired"

That's the problem. Trump shouldn't give a fuck. This is so high school.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (FiUMj)

475 It's not the country, it's the inhabitants. The
government is not a threat, it is the Taliban, AQ and aligned groups who
are using it as a staging ground for future attacks.

Look around you. New threats are building to us every day and they
don't simply come from sovereign nations. We have more asymmetrical
threats with the ability to do substantial damage then ever before.

Posted by: Marcus White-T at September 10, 2019 02:19 PM (VpIIl)

Has it occured to you that a 19-year war and occupation might turn a countries occupants against the occupying country? What are your victory conditions? Kill all the inhabitants? If so then just say it. You can't because the people will never support that "victory".

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (CQ3Qb)

476 *POUNCE with a flip!*
Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (d7Ww2)

3.7

Posted by: East German Judge at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (mf5HN)

477 469
I'm willing to stand as Tribune if you are.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (bcbK

=========

Like, with subscriptions?

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (iikV8)

478 Here's a deal - if we return to allowing our people to select their leaders without Deep State Meddling, then maybe, just maybe I will be interested in protecting someone elses border as a possibility. This assumes we protect our own border first. Until those markers are met I ain't got no love for any primitive territory in the world. This includes Baltimore, too.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (2LelM)

479 470 Least believable thing on Seinfeld - Jerry and Elaine dated for 2(?) years and only had sex approximately 33 times.

In fairness, she never had an orgasm with Jerry.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (yQpMk)

========

Well, until that one time.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (iikV8)

480 Looks like some of the best peeps were wetting their beeks in Horto Rico

Now tell me why I busted my ass for 45 yrs to make a few bucks

Posted by: REDACTED at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (AQBtr)

481 He wasnt a major figure in the riun up to the iraq war, he was in the arms comtrol section of state,

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (roeUx)

482 Grump, it wasn't Jerry's fault, she just didn't have them back then.

And she did give him one more chance.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (oZ6kz)

483
The ugly truth is - we don't have what it takes to bring stability to these regions. Because what it takes is a brutal dictator that will exercise that brutality in our best interests. If we don't have that will - and we don't - then it's best to just stay home.

The worst thing we're doing in these places is trying to bring them Democracy. It's a stupid goal, and we should know better.
Posted by: Ricky Bobby's Father at September 10, 2019 02:20 PM (Yc046)

The core of the neocon ideology is a complete misunderstanding of other parts of the world. The very concept of the nation-state is a Western construct. That model applied to tribal societies can only really work with an authoritarian central government. Trying to bring democracy there was retarded.

Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at September 10, 2019 02:25 PM (N4xQB)

484 460 Perhaps Trump should just decide who is our SOB and give them full rein. Cash, weapons, bombardment when requested, few if any questions asked.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (yQpMk)

Endorsed.

Pick a tribe. Let them control the Talibs

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:25 PM (bcbK8)

485 Afghanistan may be one of those places that even total war wouldn't sort out.
Posted by: rammajamma at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (PQRcz)

No, no, no! We're just like 2 or 3 bombings and a couple more surges away from making them Christian converts and Madisonian thinkers. Trust me on this! All we need is a little more time!

Posted by: Ted K. at September 10, 2019 02:25 PM (FJYfm)

486 >>>I think it's just a big PsyOp scheme to steal my precious bodily fluids.<<<

It's a vector for delivering propaganda and a medium for the lonely hearts club.

Posted by: Fritz at September 10, 2019 02:25 PM (kLDv+)

487 She only knows two?

Time to educate that girl!

I'm willing to stand as Tribune if you are.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (bcbK

Can't decide if you're punking me with this or not.

Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at September 10, 2019 02:25 PM (mf5HN)

488 476 *POUNCE with a flip!*
Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (d7Ww2)

3.7

Posted by: East German Judge

damn, I KNEW I should have secured my boobs.

Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:25 PM (d7Ww2)

489 433 mrp: yes, their chino's are pretty good. their shirts are not worth the low prices, though. go to brooks brothers, eg, and pay a bit more for the upgrade in quality.

Posted by: musical jolly chimp at September 10, 2019 02:25 PM (Pg+x7)

490 Keene should not be on any list. He is indeed tied to Robert Kagan who is married to Victoria Nuland.

Posted by: Ben Had at September 10, 2019 02:25 PM (R5GEP)

491 In fairness, she never had an orgasm with Jerry.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (yQpMk)

========

Well, until that one time.

-----------

But Puddy stole his move.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (sX1BW)

492 Lets get something out of the way also. 9-11 happened for two reasons:

1. Our foreign policy let Pakistan and certain gulf nations get away with too much for too long. We have a AQ and Taliban in the first place because of weapons and money those nations gave to them.

2. We have permissive and weak borders that allowed a group of foreign nationals to operate a massive terror plot inside the borders of our nation. They did not need Afghanistan to operate from, they could do it from New Jersey or California just as well.

We could fight in Afghanistan to the end of time and accomplish nothing unless those two problems are resolved. Problem one is somewhat resolved by just not helping Pakistan anymore and backing India, and putting the screws to the gulf nations to play ball. Both of which we have mostly been done since Trump took office. Pakistan is mostly in the cold and Saudi Arabia is taking orders now and not giving them.

Problem two is still hindered by some of the same "conservatives" who want us to keep troops in Afghanistan forever. So their complaints are rather hollow to me.

Posted by: William Eaton at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (MuTTO)

493 460 Perhaps Trump should just decide who is our SOB and give them full rein. Cash, weapons, bombardment when requested, few if any questions asked.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (yQpMk)

Yeah except that Hillary and John McCain already tried that one with the rebels in Syria, and look how that worked out. An Ambassador murdered, America humiliated, nothing accomplished at all.

Posted by: Tom Servo at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (Kpl3J)

494 476 *POUNCE with a flip!*
Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:21 PM (d7Ww2)

3.7
Posted by: East German Judge at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (mf5HN)

Point-chiseling commie bastard!

Posted by: Insomniac at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (TOOqT)

495 475 It's not the country, it's the inhabitants. The
government is not a threat, it is the Taliban, AQ and aligned groups who
are using it as a staging ground for future attacks.
---------------------
Don't let people from violent shitholes into the US. A defense policy that works to protect real Americans.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (2LelM)

496 Is that a plot hole? Elaine claims to have never had an orgasm with Jerry, but when Puddy uses Jerry's "move," she had one. Unless she was also faking then.

Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (oZ6kz)

497 Afghanistan may be one of those places that even total war wouldn't sort out.
Posted by: rammajamma at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (PQRcz)

To "solve it", we'd have to kill them all. We ain't - and we shouldn't be. So there really is no reason to stay.

Or, we can keep doing what we're doing. Which, apparently, is be everywhere at once to try and eliminate any and all future threats, real or potential.

Any other country that actually stated that as a foreign policy would be called megalomaniacal fools.

Posted by: Smedley Butler at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (Yc046)

498 A Duluth Trading Co. was put in not too terribly far away. The ballroom jeans are the bomb.
Posted by: Sponge

They definitely are the diggity bomb. Wearing a pair right now. Levi's blow Wrangler.

Blew out the same belt loop on five pair of jeans all in the same place. 7:30 - 8:00 position.

Posted by: rickb223 at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (dDUXP)

499 No, no, no! We're just like 2 or 3 bombings and a couple more surges away from making them Christian converts and Madisonian thinkers. Trust me on this! All we need is a little more time!

#twoweeks

Posted by: Bitter Clinger at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (YA914)

500 We've been fighting the war in Afghanistan for almost all of my life. Definitely all of my puberty.

How about we give it a rest? Unless we are going to colonize it, and we aren't we are importing people rather than exporting them, then let's pack shit up and go home.

And good riddance to that God forsaken part of the world.

Posted by: Shogun Pikachu - Keeping Japan SJW free at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (AtnLe)

501 Rein

Posted by: redridinghood at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (wiXsO)

502 Is this spat between Trump and Bolton, which will be here and gone within 2 days, just another laser pointer tactic by Trump to distract the media pussies from something else?

And yes, I hope more news trickles out about how Bolton's ouster ties with in the Taliban talks breaking down.

Posted by: LizLem at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (hvf9s)

503 "What threat does Afghanistan pose to us?
Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at September 10, 2019 02:14 PM (CQ3Qb)"

It's not the country, it's the inhabitants. The government is not a threat, it is the Taliban, AQ and aligned groups who are using it as a staging ground for future attacks.

So what do we do? Stay and bleed out our armed forces for a century? Sprinkle Plutonium dust throughout the country so nothing can live there? (I admit to favoring this from time to time.) We're not exactly geared up to fight tribal yahoos on the other side of the planet with nothing tangible to gain.

Posted by: Brother Cavil is bored, why do you ask? at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (AM1GF)

504 We gotta get outta that place.
Posted by: Tom Servo at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (Kpl3J)
---------------

Yes.

And I grieve at the thought of telling families who lost loved ones that it was all for naught.

I am firmly in the camp we have to leave because there's is no way our government will allow our soldiers to fully prosecute the war. And, I'm no longer believe it's a way that can be waged to a successful conclusion.

I don't like it, but, the pill doesn't become any less bitter the longer one puts off swallowing it.

Posted by: blake - used salesman salesman
at September 10, 2019 02:27 PM (qC1Sy)

505 496 Is that a plot hole? Elaine claims to have never had an orgasm with Jerry, but when Puddy uses Jerry's "move," she had one. Unless she was also faking then.
Posted by: Broseidon - New Work Computer, Same Work Ethic at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (oZ6kz)

========

Is it established when he invented the move?

I think that episode came much later in the series than the episode where Jerry gets Elaine to orgasm. Maybe that's when he invented the move.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, The Winter Soldier at September 10, 2019 02:27 PM (iikV8)

506 The answer about Ace's friend is the same answer that I use for not working in the Trump Adminstration myself: the Deep State is the enemy and has no desire to hire anyone who actually likes the President.

Frankly, I hope Donald Trump wins re-election, but the circumstances will be the same either way. Leftists seeking to ethnically cleanse the country, and a majority that would Pinochet them. Trump needs a new mandate to clean the garbage out of Washington, but that is a Herculean task. People who want to help shouldn't go to the State Department, which is useless and hates the President.

Just bide your time, and get ready. I doubt the true rulers of America will be decided with votes.

Posted by: trev006 at September 10, 2019 02:27 PM (Lvrv/)

507
wait .... wut????
*head bobs*
???

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (8XRCm)

508
She only knows two?

Time to educate that girl!

I'm willing to stand as Tribune if you are.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:23 PM (bcbK

---
Dude, she's an Army chick.

They know *all* the positions.

Posted by: Convalescing Author A.H. Lloyd at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (cfSRQ)

509
In fairness, she never had an orgasm with Jerry.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 02:24 PM (yQpMk)

She faked them, never letting him know that he wasn't giving her any, not giving him the opportunity to change things up and try harder.

Therefore, she's a bitch.

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (Zz0t1)

510 Julia Louis Dreyfus, 1995 Emmy Awards. Check her photo.

Posted by: WitchDoktor, as if anyone gives a shit at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (C+We0)

511 If national security were the REAL reason for being in Afghanistan we would have gone to S. Arabia and Pakistan instead. Instead we kissed Saudi ass, who financed 9/11 and bombed a bunch of villages in Afghanistan whose residents probably don't even know what New York City is.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (FiUMj)

512 In this thread: dumpster is/is not on fire, argue your position, GO!

Posted by: Cement Truck at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (DRZpQ)

513 Afghanistan may be one of those places that even total war wouldn't sort out.
Posted by: rammajamma at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (PQRcz)

Nobody has ever won in Afghanistan. Not even the Afghanis. It is, was, and will always be, a shithole.

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert (Gringo fuertemente armado) at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (m4pA7)

514 To be frank, the war in Afghanistan is more about our treasure than blood at this point. More military personnel die in training accidents now than in combat since probably 2010 .

Posted by: Pig to man dreaming of lions at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (Rzloy)

515 Not only do Duluth Jeans offer great Ballroom, but I can easily fit a man's hand in there

Posted by: Regular Don Lemon at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (6/uwW)

516 Blew out the same belt loop on five pair of jeans all in the same place. 7:30 - 8:00 position.
Posted by: rickb223 at September 10, 2019 02:26 PM (dDUXP)

----

Yup. The same belt loop 90% of guys use to hike their jeans up.

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (8XRCm)

517 nude Gloria allred

Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (d7Ww2)

518 502 Is this spat between Trump and Bolton, which will be here and gone within 2 days, just another laser pointer tactic by Trump to distract the media pussies from something else?

__

Ahh the old Trump is playing 13-D chess gambit.

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (FiUMj)

519 Afghanistan may be one of those places that even total war wouldn't sort out.
Posted by: rammajamma at September 10, 2019 02:22 PM (PQRcz)

Nobody has ever won in Afghanistan. Not even the Afghanis. It is, was, and will always be, a shithole.

-------------

Have we tried Total War?

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (sX1BW)

520 Hell, just driving to the mountains and staying in a hotel would be a vacation. I would turn off all my devices and read that big book about the Thirty Years War that I never get around to. And I would nap. Maybe get some writing done.

Good plan. I've been doing that a lot the last few weekends.

Just don't read a shit book like Violet Moller's "Map Of Knowledge", I've taken that for the team, and expect I will be reporting on it next Sunday.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (ykYG2)

521 The ugly truth is - we don't have what it takes to bring stability to these regions. Because what it takes is a brutal dictator that will exercise that brutality in our best interests. If we don't have that will - and we don't - then it's best to just stay home."

I agree - the only thing that could possibly "work" in a place like A-Stan is that the Roman Empire would do to subdue a restless province. Burn every village, poison every well, kill all the men between the age of 12 and 65, sell all the women and children into slavery in other parts of the empire, and then move in some of your own groups who are looking for some land. That's the only thing that can actually "work" for a place like that - but obviously, we don't have the nerve to do it.

Posted by: Tom Servo at September 10, 2019 02:30 PM (Kpl3J)

522 That's the problem. Trump shouldn't give a fuck. This is so high school.
---------------------
Bolton is a Neo Con. Any opportunity you have to squash these vermin should be welcomed and met with great gusto and large stompy boots.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:30 PM (2LelM)

523 In this thread: dumpster is/is not on fire, argue your position, GO!
========
That comment is about us, isn't it?

Posted by: The Cleveland Browns at September 10, 2019 02:30 PM (Uj8WH)

524 In this thread: dumpster is/is not on fire, argue your position, GO!
Posted by: Cement Truck at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (DRZpQ)

-----

Dumpsters are made of steel. Steel does not burn. Ergo.... we have a trash fire.... NOT a dumpster fire.

FIGHT ME!!!

Posted by: fixerupper at September 10, 2019 02:30 PM (8XRCm)

525 Nood

Posted by: rickb223 at September 10, 2019 02:30 PM (dDUXP)

526 Julia Louis Dreyfus, 1995 Emmy Awards

___

HEY NOW!!

Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:30 PM (FiUMj)

527 To be frank, the war in Afghanistan is more about our treasure than blood at this point. More military personnel die in training accidents now than in combat since probably 2010 .

-----------

This is akin to when the liberals argue more people are killed by cars than by illegal immigrants. Maybe true, but entirely beside the point.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:31 PM (sX1BW)

528 Trump gave up so much, does so much for all Americans and takes so much sh*t from mental midgets every day, if he wants to fire someone on Twitter, let him. He earned it!

Posted by: Page Turner at September 10, 2019 02:31 PM (+LYkk)

529 nude Gloria allred
Posted by: comrade nurse ratched at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (d7Ww2)

Dear God NO.

Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at September 10, 2019 02:31 PM (mf5HN)

530 Have we tried Total War?
------------------
Why bother? What do you win when you win Afghanistan? Bueller?

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:31 PM (2LelM)

531 Oh and 'Gender Equality' is the latest dumb drum being beat at work. Apparently it will take 208 years to achieve it, according to the bullshit youtube video sent out to everyone.

We had an All Hands meeting today. The big head honcho proudly talked about his work on his give deserving kids an opportunity to go to college. Of course after talking about how wonderful the program is, he pointed out he only gives scholarships to minority women.

I wanted so badly to point out Universities are already lopsided towards women, and that deserving kids come in all shapes, sizes, colors, and with at least a couple different types of genitalia and that excluding males is kind of, you know, sexist.

Of course the guy can do whatever he wants with his money, it's his money. But he's using company resources to support his charity.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 10, 2019 02:31 PM (9t0Zz)

532 We're still in Afghanistan for the simple reason that it's good for the military business, and it's good for the heroin business.

Oh, and there are lots of people in government who said 18 years ago that going into Afghanistan would work out fine. So they're still trying to do that.

Otherwise... yep. No, that's it. That's why we're in Afghanistan.

Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 02:31 PM (cY3LT)

533 I do not care for this type of thing. You serve at the pleasure of POTUS, and when he lets you go, you go away silently. The whole "but I quit" garbage is weak.
Posted by: Nick in Tallahassee at September 10, 2019 01:23 PM (wGbBR)

Agree completely. The whole point of taking the job is supposed to be service to country. When leaving such a position, regardless of circumstances, you shut up, suck it up, and drive on.

Posted by: troyriser at September 10, 2019 02:32 PM (mSO8Y)

534 Without practical application one lack's knowledge.
Our personnel must have practical application.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 02:32 PM (hSSpd)

535 Julia Louis Dreyfus, 1995 Emmy Awards. Check her photo.

Posted by: WitchDoktor, as if anyone gives a shit at September 10, 2019 02:28 PM (C+We0)

When you've got lots of money and a good plastic surgeon, anything's possible.

Posted by: Sponge at September 10, 2019 02:32 PM (Zz0t1)

536 Have we tried Total War?
Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (sX1BW)

There is no way to wage total conventional war in Afghanistan. Can't get enough supplies in theater to do it.

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert (Gringo fuertemente armado) at September 10, 2019 02:32 PM (m4pA7)

537 527 To be frank, the war in Afghanistan is more about our treasure than blood at this point. More military personnel die in training accidents now than in combat since probably 2010 .
------------------
If head counts counted we would be in Chicago and Baltimore with plans for Memphis on the drawing board.

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:32 PM (2LelM)

538 532 We're still in Afghanistan for the simple reason that it's good for the military business, and it's good for the heroin business.

Oh, and there are lots of people in government who said 18 years ago that going into Afghanistan would work out fine. So they're still trying to do that.

Otherwise... yep. No, that's it. That's why we're in Afghanistan.
Posted by: BurtTC at September 10, 2019 02:31 PM (cY3LT)
------------

In other words, a typical government program.

/disgusted look.

Posted by: blake - used salesman salesman
at September 10, 2019 02:33 PM (qC1Sy)

539 >>> 413. Shhhh. It's a secret reason. One that we need Tlaib and Omar in congress for, and all their chain migrated relatives.

Apparently one of Tlaib's missions in life is to cancel 9-11 tribute events because they are Islamaphobic, which she is accomplishing with gusto. Bravo congress critters, tackling the important things!

Posted by: LizLem at September 10, 2019 02:33 PM (hvf9s)

540 536 Have we tried Total War?
Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (sX1BW)

There is no way to wage total conventional war in Afghanistan. Can't get enough supplies in theater to do it.
--------------------
You would need at least three Army Groups. Again, what would you win?

Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:34 PM (2LelM)

541
Don't know why Bolton went away, and don't particularly care.

But in a general sense, I'm completely against American Army/Marine involvement anywhere outside the country, unless it's a war of national survival, where even Democrats are on board.

We know from many horrible experiences that unless Democrats support a war (rare), they view at as a cynical opportunity. They want the country to lose/stalemate, they make sure it happens, and they use it to great effect as a political cudgel.

It's a sad fact, but as long as Democrats are a thing, all an enemy has to do is hold out... and the Donkey Brigades will ride to their 11th-hour rescue with a 100% certainty.

This means that land invasions of foreign countries are lost at the outset, and we should avoid them at all costs.

And Republicans know this. They know we can't win wars, and they do it anyway. Any Republican adviser who supports continuation/initiation of foreign wars is a bad-faith player, IMO.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at September 10, 2019 02:34 PM (AzW6q)

542 Agree completely. The whole point of taking the job is supposed to be service to country. When leaving such a position, regardless of circumstances, you shut up, suck it up, and drive on.

Posted by: troyriser at September 10, 2019 02:32 PM (mSO8Y)

Yapping lack of character.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 02:34 PM (hSSpd)

543 A long while ago ( before the election) a reporter asked Trump about hiring people and his criteria for doing so. He said (paraphrasing) that hiring people was not as important as knowing who and when to fire people.

Posted by: Chillin the most at September 10, 2019 02:34 PM (lonOK)

544 Well the training camps were in afghanistan but the cadres came largely from europe, massouds killer was a moroccan living in brussels.

Posted by: Admiral marcus at September 10, 2019 02:34 PM (roeUx)

545 Sarah Palin and John Bolton both sign a deal with Dancing with the Stars....developing...**sigh**

Posted by: Paladin at September 10, 2019 02:34 PM (7qvpm)

546 The Stach is now a chihuahua.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 02:35 PM (hSSpd)

547 I liked Bolton in the administration because he is tough on Iran.

The fact that Romney is speaking up for him makes me question everything he has to say on Afghanistan.

People often bring up Germany and Japan of long term occupation successes. If we fought this war like we fought that one (bomb the countries flat arrest the leaders and execute them publicly) The comparison might make sense. Be we will not so the comparison is invalid.

Posted by: Nearsighted Cyclops at September 10, 2019 02:35 PM (B06Zw)

548 I'm only 68 years old, and an in country Vietnam USMC vet. We know how to fight wars so would someone please make a decision. Jeez. I don't want to croak with a bunch of kids stuck in a bad neighborhood.

Posted by: bill in arkansas at September 10, 2019 02:35 PM (C1Lsn)

549 531 Oh and 'Gender Equality' is the latest dumb drum being beat at work. Apparently it will take 208 years to achieve it, according to the bullshit youtube video sent out to everyone.

We had an All Hands meeting today. The big head honcho proudly talked about his work on his give deserving kids an opportunity to go to college. Of course after talking about how wonderful the program is, he pointed out he only gives scholarships to minority women.

I wanted so badly to point out Universities are already lopsided towards women, and that deserving kids come in all shapes, sizes, colors, and with at least a couple different types of genitalia and that excluding males is kind of, you know, sexist.

Of course the guy can do whatever he wants with his money, it's his money. But he's using company resources to support his charity.
Posted by: bonhomme at September 10, 2019 02:31 PM (9t0Zz)

Yup. Same here.

They have special programs for women, minorities.
I have zero problems with colorblind/genderblind hiring. I prefer it.

I don't like affirmative action, especially when its done for a fake crisis.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Relax, buy ammo and don't give one inch at September 10, 2019 02:36 PM (bcbK8)

550 Have we tried Total War?
Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (sX1BW)

There is no way to wage total conventional war in Afghanistan. Can't get enough supplies in theater to do it.

----------

Who said it had to be conventional?

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:36 PM (sX1BW)

551 The problem with Afghanistan is that it's full of Afghanis.

When we get the American birthrates back up, and for some reason having that particular landmass called Afghanistan populated by a civilzed people is of the utmost importance then maybe we go back and colonize it and completely displace the current inhabitants.

But for now and the near future - that ain't happening.

Even the full blown alt-right yards don't want Afghanistan for leibenstraum or whatever. Nobody but Ben Shapiru's mastabatory dreams wants us to be there.

So let's GTFO. Mistakes happen and there's no shame in it.

Time to go home.

Posted by: Shogun Pikachu - Keeping Japan SJW free at September 10, 2019 02:36 PM (AtnLe)

552 The one who bombed the al rashid was an algeriam living in soain.

Posted by: Admiral marcus at September 10, 2019 02:36 PM (roeUx)

553 >>> Sarah Palin and John Bolton both sign a deal with Dancing with the Stars....developing...**sigh**

I almost want that to happen just to see the left howl, ha!

Posted by: LizLem at September 10, 2019 02:36 PM (hvf9s)

554 You would need at least three Army Groups. Again, what would you win?
Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:34 PM (2LelM)

A very expensive trip and all access pass to a shithole. And, as a poster up above said, unless we went full Roman on the place and did a complete population replacement we would be in the same spot we are in now.

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert (Gringo fuertemente armado) at September 10, 2019 02:36 PM (m4pA7)

555 Here is another general rule: Don't trust anyone who says Afghanistan is just like Korea or Japan. If we just stay long enough we will one day be able to buy electric vehicles from the Flying Carpet Car Co. located in Kabul.

I suspect in fifty years Afghanistan will look the same...with or without American military power.

Posted by: William Eaton at September 10, 2019 02:36 PM (MuTTO)

556
A lot of the Horde seem extra feisty today.

Just remember, today is yet another day Hillary isn't president.
Posted by: What's a Seawolf?

=======

Sometimes it's hard to tell. How is her life any different? Breezing around, giving orders on how the country should be run (probably obeyed 50% of the time), making money and soaking up love she doesn't deserve, no need to run for a second term as she's the "incumbent," and setting up sweet book deals for Chelsea.

Posted by: Blonde Morticia at September 10, 2019 02:37 PM (13CQC)

557 Ace could not be more correct with regards to the trouble with staffing in Trump's WH. I know someone connected to the Judiciary and somehow Trump hired the right people and listened to guys like Leonard Leo and it's the one area where the Pres has excelled.

From what I've been told, it's no more complicated than Trump didn't think there was any way he could win and didn't bother to have people ready to take over from Day 1. So he was left with having establishment types or even Obama holdovers. It may not seem like a big deal to have people from the previous administration in low level jobs (secretarial, data, etc), but it matters.

Posted by: DahlandMeier at September 10, 2019 02:39 PM (1UtUR)

558 Here is another general rule: Don't trust anyone who says Afghanistan is just like Korea or Japan.

---------------

I'll be honest, I don't recall many people saying that about Afghanistan. Iraq yes. I made the point myself about Iraq.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:39 PM (sX1BW)

559 You know who is going to win big in Afghanistan? China.
Afghanistan has huge deposits of rare earth minerals and the Afghan government gave those mining concessions to China.

Posted by: Ben Had at September 10, 2019 02:40 PM (R5GEP)

560 head counts counted we would be in Chicago and Baltimore with plans for Memphis on the drawing board.
Posted by: Puddin Head at September 10, 2019 02:32 P

I don't understand your point.

Posted by: Pig to man dreaming of lions at September 10, 2019 02:40 PM (Rzloy)

561 Afghanistan has huge deposits of rare earth minerals and the Afghan government gave those mining concessions to China.

-------------

Sometimes America is too honorable. We don't want the spoils of war forgetting that taking the spoils can also be a deterrent - in addition to being your right.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:41 PM (sX1BW)

562 559 You know who is going to win big in Afghanistan? China.
Afghanistan has huge deposits of rare earth minerals and the Afghan government gave those mining concessions to China.

Posted by: Ben Had at September 10, 2019 02:40 PM (R5GEP)

That's two excellent reasons for our being there.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 02:42 PM (hSSpd)

563 People often bring up Germany and Japan of long term occupation successes. If we fought this war like we fought that one (bomb the countries flat arrest the leaders and execute them publicly) The comparison might make sense. Be we will not so the comparison is invalid.
Posted by: Nearsighted Cyclops at September 10, 2019 02:35 PM (B06Zw

-----------

Also both of those countries had engineers who could build airplanes, ships, etc. and they had people who could operate them. They also did not have multiple ethnic tribes who hated each other that we had to spend endless hours sorting out. Oh, yes...a certain religion which in itself they are divided on. So we cannot even get unity on that!

Posted by: William Eaton at September 10, 2019 02:42 PM (MuTTO)

564 Sometimes it's hard to tell. How is her life any different? Breezing around, giving orders on how the country should be run (probably obeyed 50% of the time), making money and soaking up love she doesn't deserve, no need to run for a second term as she's the "incumbent," and setting up sweet book deals for Chelsea.

Posted by: Blonde Morticia at September 10, 2019 02:37 PM (13CQC)

I'd say the intense shame is probably a factor. Along with the fact that, in many ways, she has failed to control all the levers of state. Deregulation continues, the economy expands, China is feeling the pain, etc. True, there are many criminals who need to be dealt with. But that will happen. Give it time. If not from Trump, then from us.

Posted by: trev006 at September 10, 2019 02:43 PM (Lvrv/)

565 Have we tried Total War?
Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (sX1BW)

I have. My favorite is probably Shogun 2, but Three Kingdoms was a pretty good ride.

Posted by: trev006 at September 10, 2019 02:44 PM (Lvrv/)

566 >>>536 Have we tried Total War?
Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (sX1BW)
_________

You cannot conquer a land without either the full consent of the pre-existing inhabitants or by colonization.

We can't even build a wall on our own border, so we do not have the Will to break the Afghanistan people and make them consent. Say what you will of the ills of Islam, and there's A LOt of them, but those guys truely believe in their false god. We fly sodomy pride flags outside our churches and can't even stop drag queen story time

And we do not have the native population to colonize it either. Melinials don't have the balls to homestead in Afghanistan and fight off the locals.

So let's go home. The fight is here.

Posted by: Shogun Pikachu - Keeping Japan SJW free at September 10, 2019 02:44 PM (AtnLe)

567 I don't want people to join the military who want a career pushing reports or practice drills. And I don't believe it is so.

Our military is a fighting military.
Our people don't join the military to wait.

Posted by: Frosty at September 10, 2019 02:45 PM (hSSpd)

568 So let's go home. The fight is here.

------------

I guess I wasn't clear. Have we tried nuclear war?

I sort of kid, but to ask the question does clarify things.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:46 PM (sX1BW)

569 so back to never-trumping ace ?

Posted by: chango butt at September 10, 2019 02:50 PM (B+t5k)

570 We can knock them over

The cyclical war theory failed tomorrow 18 years ago.

Posted by: DaveA at September 10, 2019 02:51 PM (FhXTo)

571 Ahh the old Trump is playing 13-D chess gambit.
Posted by: Lurking Lurker - Not In My Purview at September 10, 2019 02:29 PM (FiUMj)

-----------

Better than the 1-D chess the Bush administration played. Has Bolton ever stated his views on the Bush years considering he played the 1-D board during that time.

Good ole Paki-land is our loyal ally fighting the trio of doom. Good times...

Posted by: William Eaton at September 10, 2019 02:51 PM (MuTTO)

572 >>>568
I guess I wasn't clear. Have we tried nuclear war?

I sort of kid, but to ask the question does clarify things.

Posted by: SH at September 10, 2019 02:46 PM (sX1BW)
____________

No and we never will.

We don't have the force of Will to build a simple steel fence on *parts* of our southern border to stop poorly armed Mexicans and central Americans from colonizing our south west and taking over.

So we definitely do not have the Will to use nukes on Afghanistan.

Posted by: Shogun Pikachu - Keeping Japan SJW free at September 10, 2019 02:52 PM (AtnLe)

573 I don't give a shit who he fires as long as he doesn't fire himself.

Posted by: MAC SOG'''' at September 10, 2019 02:55 PM (P4Pk9)

574 what kind of government Afghanistan has. It can always be bombed if it acts up.

Barbarians come out of the wilderness and attack Civilization.
Technology makes us more vulnerable and increases the damage/cost of terror.

I've no idea if we're killing over there the ones we need to but waiting til another hole in our defense occurs to them might be a waste of our offense.

Posted by: DaveA at September 10, 2019 03:01 PM (FhXTo)

575 Nobody has ever won in Afghanistan.

Well really, everyone has won in Afghanistan, the Persians, the Greeks, the Moslems, the British, and the US. Literally everyone kicks the shit out of the Afghans. The problem is that in the end, what you have won is a pesthole. Afghanistan is less a country than a wilderness between countries. It's literally bandit country.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at September 10, 2019 03:04 PM (UpI0k)

576 21 Tom Servo: "a great, deeply ironical possibility is haunting my thoughts - and it's that Trump may in fact be the most reluctant President with regard to actual military force since Jimmy Carter. Of course after so many decades of overextension, it may be time for that."

It's a damn shame that the rules on a smart military blog prohibit winning a thread by speaking a profound truth, because you would have won it.

Posted by: Ray Van Dune at September 10, 2019 03:05 PM (FA43N)

577 A surprisingly poor commentary; odd to see Ace "playing checkers", vs the chess game POTUS is playing.

You can see it in this post, and you can probably see it in some comments too - there are plenty of people out there who actually care who initiated this. Petty people.

Trump understands this, and is ALWAYS protective of his brand. To call it "ego", and "an Achilles heel" is to have missed what's been going on with the Trump phenomenon all along. It's also to make camp with Those Who Never Tire of Being Wrong.

As to the message to Would-be employees, that ought to be obvious. "Don't put the POTUS in a position where his viscous opposition can say that he's ignoring his own 'expert' staff." In other words, if you don't undermine him, you'll be fine, even if you're not 100% on board with everything.

It's actually guys like Bolton with the huge egos, and think they can shoot their mouths off because THEY know best. Bolton ven seemed to consider seriously running for POTUS himself, at one point. Wow.

Posted by: Optimizer at September 10, 2019 03:15 PM (hOOi9)

578 If all the troops should be pulled out of Afghanistan then they should also come out of Iraq and Syria. Also, bring them home from all over the world including naval vessels. Just operate in and around U.S. territory. Remember how well it went when Obama pulled out of Iraq just as the majority of Americans wanted.

Posted by: YatYas at September 10, 2019 03:21 PM (xN9Un)

579 >>>Trump lies easily

Eh, that's sort of sweeping.

Posted by: m at September 10, 2019 03:30 PM (2VrwR)

580 Let's just re-elect The Donald and watch the heads explode. He is still our only shot.

Posted by: Cosda at September 10, 2019 03:31 PM (J3CC8)

581 I wish there were a middle ground between the GOP Establishment who never met a battle they wouldn't wave the White Flag over and Trump who never met a battle he wouldn't rip off your head and shit down your neck.

Posted by: Lamont Cranston at September 10, 2019 03:33 PM (3ufaJ)

582 I'm really tired of Ben Shapiro.

Posted by: m at September 10, 2019 03:36 PM (2VrwR)

583 yeah trump didn't have people but he hired NONE of those he did have, no sympathy

Posted by: dw at September 10, 2019 03:36 PM (stPAM)

584 Probably both are lying

Posted by: Kurt at September 10, 2019 04:29 PM (8bT92)

585 #149 Same for Gen. Mattis. As an exec, I'd bet PDJT welcomes others views. However, once he makes a decision, he brooks no further discussion with the media circus.

Posted by: notjjs at September 10, 2019 05:44 PM (VHcbd)

586 Yeah, I like the idea of pardoning Flynn then appointing him to the post. Announcing it only on Twitter would blow the place up.

Posted by: Kaner at September 10, 2019 05:53 PM (rR7m4)

587 I'm not sure why a person who has dual citizenship was in a position to make foreign policy decisions. We have collectively gone mad.

Posted by: DFCtomm at September 10, 2019 06:08 PM (50gG9)

588 30
Yeah. Like I said, they Donald has real issues with personnel.

Posted by: joncelli, who's totally not in the pay of Big Alien at September 10, 2019 01:25 PM (RD7QR)

I've
wondered about this a lot over the last 3 years. He didn't get where he
is by not being able to read people. Are these beltway paramecium so
very different? I can't believe these types of choices are part of his
4D chess.

Posted by: clutch cargo at September 10, 2019 01:27 PM (Z1ykJ)

Trump was always going to have problems with personnel. The establishment hates him, but the establishment knows how to run the giant machine known as government. It must be difficult trying to find out which cogs of the machine secretly hate the machine, and it's not like they won't lie about their loyalties to get inside the administration.

Posted by: DFCtomm at September 10, 2019 06:13 PM (50gG9)

589 Barbarians come out of the wilderness and attack Civilization.
Technology makes us more vulnerable and increases the damage/cost of terror.

I've
no idea if we're killing over there the ones we need to but waiting til
another hole in our defense occurs to them might be a waste of our
offense.

Posted by: DaveA at September 10, 2019 03:01 PM (FhXTo)

This is not true. It only appears true because we stick the barbarians on planes and boats and ship them to our cities and then put them on benefits. We then act surprised when the barbarians attack us from within. Don't forget that the GOPe supports this practice with all their hearts.

Posted by: DFCtomm at September 10, 2019 06:18 PM (50gG9)

590 Ace sez: "That means that any time he treats a departing staffer poorly, he scares off some of the few people willing to work for him."

I wonder how Trump has gotten as far as he has without the wise advice of the Ace-hole?

Posted by: Chocolate Starfish at September 10, 2019 07:47 PM (4ZuDM)

591 Jesus, Ace, how new was this news, and you were judging from what you saw on Twitter? Did this roll easily off your keyboard? Did you think the Covington Catholic kids were dangerous too? Then you're ready for Kristol's next cruise, matey.

I hate this crap. Not only does it demonstrate that Trump lies easily
and sometimes might not even know he's lying (or offering an alternative
take on reality), but I do think this sort of infantile spat over nothing suggests an ego simultaneously overweening and fragile -- the worst sort of ego to have. A dangerous one.

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Posted by: Sheri Chippindall at October 07, 2019 06:59 PM (dhIlW)

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