Pro-Iran-Deal Tillerson Fired; Iran Hardliner Mike Pompeo to Lead State; CIA Careerist Gina Haspel Promoted to Head of CIA
Tillerson Aide Who Contradicted WH Timeline on Firing, Fired

Pompeo has already been approved for a Cabinet-level job (head of the CIA) by the Senate so he needs no additional confirmation to take over as Secretary of State.

As to his replacement: The left doesn't like her because she ran "black site" prisons. On the other hand, the right might not like her because John Brennan does:



People I know are very skeptical of her because they believe she's "swampy" and will put the status quo of the CIA over the urgent need for its reform. In fact, they're hoping the left succeeds in blocking her confirmation over the black-sites matter so we get someone better.

The White House put out a timeline of the firing, stating that John Kelly had informed Tillerson of his firing on Friday. But a Tillerson aide disputed that account, saying today's firing came as a surprise and that Tillerson expected to continue on as SecState.

That aide has now been fired. What's going on there, I couldn't tell you, as I have no endlessly-mutable conspiracy theory by which to explain all happenings.

The NeverTrumpers and their leftist allies in the media, who previously claimed that Tillerson's appointment as Secretary of State was a favor to Putin (because he had contacts with Russia due to his running a major oil producer, Exxon), are now claiming, without any acknowledgment of their previous conspiracy theories, that the firing of Tillerson is a favor to Putin.

Because, you see, the other day, Tillerson said that Russia had "likely" attempted an assassination-by-poison of a Soviet defector in London.



The conspiracy theorists just keep insinuating without laying out what they actually believe about this conspiracy theory. No acknowledgement that the previous conspiracy theory, that Tillerson was actually selected to please Putin, was in error and is no longer in operation.

All this occurs after the House Intelligence Committee announced it had found no evidence of collusion. So the NeverTrumpers just start dreaming up new evidence:



By the way, let's be clear about this: If the NeverTrumper conspiracy theorists are still claiming (or insinuating -- they're too cowardly to flat-out state their beliefs, choosing to mask them as "interesting" questions) that there was collusion with Russia, they are also necessarily saying that the House Intelligence Committee Republicans (and, by extension, all House Republicans) are in on the conspiracy and part of the cover-up.

This is of course the mark of a conspiracy theory: When one proffer of evidence is disproven, you simply invent a new proffer of evidence to replace it. The evidence shifts day-to-day and moment-to-moment, but the conclusion remains ever fixed and immutable like Magnetic North.

And of course: Anyone who investigates the conspiracy and finds that there is no evidence of a conspiracy, is of course therefore now branded a member of the conspiracy.

Happened with the JFK assassination too, of course: When the FBI and Warren Commission both announced they'd found no conspiracy, the FBI and Warren Commission were almost immediately named as members of the conspiracy.

Oh: Bill trolling us with threats that he will amuse us all with the hilarious comic cavalcade of running for president:



Posted by: Ace at 12:43 PM




Comments

(Jump to bottom of page)

1 St

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at March 13, 2018 12:44 PM (gQmKR)

2 "Sod off, swampy!"

Posted by: antisocial justice beatnik at March 13, 2018 12:45 PM (NL6wI)

3 Top ten?

Posted by: Surfperch at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (xPTqL)

4 th

Posted by: Surfperch at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (xPTqL)

5 Fuck Kristol

Posted by: CN at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (5gaNQ)

6 Gina Haspel Promoted to Head of CIA

Media: But Trump's still a racist.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (fceHP)

7 Hey Bill,
Sod off, swampy.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (xJa6I)

8 This is just too easy!

Posted by: Surfperch at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (xPTqL)

9 Morning Cult leader! What are our orders for today ?

Posted by: It's me donna at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (O2RFr)

10 The people responsible for the aide's sacking have been sacked...

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (Tnhbr)

11 I thought Haspel sounded good, but if Brennan (PBUH) approves of her, I have second thoughts.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at March 13, 2018 12:47 PM (ptqGC)

12 >>Pompeo has already been approved for a Cabinet-level job (head of the CIA) by the Senate so he needs no additional confirmation to take over as Secretary of State.

There seems to be some debate about this. Still, I have a hard time seeing the Senate turning down Pompeo after they approved him a year ago for CIA and have praised the job he's done there.

Posted by: JackStraw at March 13, 2018 12:47 PM (/tuJf)

13 11 I thought Haspel sounded good, but if Brennan (PBUH) approves of her, I have second thoughts.

Me too...

Posted by: It's me donna at March 13, 2018 12:47 PM (O2RFr)

14 5 Fuck Kristol
Posted by: CN at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (5gaNQ)

Oh, you have to pay for the Admiral's Suite package cruise for that!

Posted by: Billy Kristol at March 13, 2018 12:47 PM (7HtZB)

15 I blame DST for these firings.
Obviously made PDT cranky.

Posted by: @votermom @vm pimping great books usually free or sale at March 13, 2018 12:47 PM (hMwEB)

16 Serious inside baseball here.

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 12:47 PM (NWiLs)

17 Also, Gina Haspel is proving we do have a sexy spy gap with Russia.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:47 PM (xJa6I)

18 We are seeking Legal Counsel into the possibility of Charging President Trump with Conspiracy to Obstruct Foreign Policy...

Clearly an Impeachable offense.

Posted by: Mueller and Rosenstein... at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (NgKpN)

19 8 This is just too easy!
Posted by: Surfperch at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (xPTqL)

Yes, when they rip off the masks, they're much easier to identify.

Posted by: WisRich at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (G0vdT)

20 Tillerson is a Putin Crony!!!1!

Putin made Trump fire Putin Crony Tillerson!!!1!

Posted by: The MSM at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (xPTqL)

21 10 The people responsible for the aide's sacking have been sacked...
Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (Tnhbr)

*cues up the mariachi music*

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (xJa6I)

22 Drive by troll late in the last thread says Tillerson fired by Putin because he blamed the Russins for the attempted assassination in the UK.This might be the left wing line on the firing.

Posted by: steevy at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (LiyEm)

23 This deserves to be brought forward.


750 Also, I have this mental image of Alex sitting on a bathroom counter, holding up score cards when the two ladies in question walked out...

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 12:43 PM (Tnhbr)


This is fairly accurate. Except, how would she get up on the counter without her Stepstool? And like she would wait for them to come out of that stall on their own.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:45 PM (9CkBG)



Now back to the regular shenanigans.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (9CkBG)

24 In one year, all of these fucking people will have "Kamala for Commander in Chief!" bumper stickers on their Volvos.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (8rNrN)

25 I won't make a decision pro/con Haspel until Joe and Mika tell me what to think.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (ptqGC)

26 Anybody else think that picture of Bill Kristol fits him perfectly? A pompous ass looking down his nose at us "deplorables". I'm sure he chose it himself.

Posted by: Pete Seria at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (2WfB0)

27
As the 2nd in command of the CIA, Gina Haspel is the actual person in charge of day to day operations at the agency.

She's solid from all that I can see.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (fTKv+)

28 Fuck Kristol again. Jeebus, what a douche.

Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (2LelM)

29 24 In one year, all of these fucking people will have "Kamala for Commander in Chief!" bumper stickers on their Volvos.
Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (8rNrN)

And Priuses. Priusi?

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (NWiLs)

30 27
As the 2nd in command of the CIA, Gina Haspel is the actual person in charge of day to day operations at the agency.

She's solid from all that I can see.
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (fTKv+)

Solid as a rock?

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (xJa6I)

31 How did Kristol type that will eating a giant bag of dicks? Now that's talent!

By the way- when did mental health treatment centers get the internet?

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (VpIIl)

32 I commented without reading,of course but I was correct.

Posted by: steevy at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM (LiyEm)

33
Tillerson was pro Iran sell-out and believes in "climate change."

And with the potential for a NorK summit, I am very glad he's gone and that Pompeo will take his place.

Good moves by PDT.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (fTKv+)

34 Billy Boy taking another steaming dump on the pile that was once what little gravitas he had.

Posted by: Hikaru at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (XMDuf)

35 Kristol Meth shoots off his pie hole again and the collective IQ again lowers.

Posted by: Cheri at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (oiNtH)

36
In one year, all of these fucking people will have "Kamala for Commander in Chief!" bumper stickers on their Volvos.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (8rNrN)


Sadly, this is true.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (ptqGC)

37 24 In one year, all of these fucking people will have "Kamala for Commander in Chief!" bumper stickers on their Volvos.
-----------------
Do Volvos still exist? I thought Subaru's killed them.

Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (2LelM)

38 Is anyone even attempting to claim that Kristol is a Conservative?

Republican? Sure. Whatever.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (9CkBG)

39 And of course: Anyone who investigates the conspiracy and finds that there is no evidence of a conspiracy, is of course therefore now branded a member of the conspiracy.


Yup.

I've mentioned here and on the podcast that I find conspiracy theories fascinating (also Nessie is real) because of what it says about neurobiology and the brain's attempt to find patterns in everything, all the time.

What's also interesting is the brain's defenses against admitting error. Here, there is an obvious pattern to Hillary's loss, namely, being an unlikeable harridan who forgot where Michigan and Wisconsin were. But that pattern requires that the brain accept that its neural pathways created to enforce the notion that Hillary = Smart Good and Trump = Stupid Bad were in error and NOPE NOPE NOPE. Russia it is!

Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (mf5HN)

40 Willowed:

---

Just yesterday Katy Tur said Hillary "has a much deeper relationship with faith than PDT."



---

I can't think of a better way to self-identify
that you or your chosen representative has zero relationship with God
than to say something like that.

I have no relationship with
faith either, btw. None. Zero. No more than the relationship I have with
high blood pressure or that missing fingertip from the saw when I was a
younger man.

I *have* faith because of a relationship with someone else.

Posted by: Moron Robbie - Those deputies listened to the kids screaming as they were shot at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (JTMqu)

41 Gina Haspel is good to go. I don't know who is saying they don't want her.

Sounds like the usual garment rending when people in Washington don't get their way.

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (VpIIl)

42 37 24 In one year, all of these fucking people will have "Kamala for Commander in Chief!" bumper stickers on their Volvos.
-----------------
Do Volvos still exist? I thought Subaru's killed them.
Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (2LelM)

The XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (xJa6I)

43 The NeverTrumpers and their leftist allies in the media, who previously claimed that Tillerson's appointment as Secretary of State was a favor to Putin (because he had contacts with Russia due to his running a major oil producer, Exxon), are now claiming, without any acknowledgment of their previous conspiracy theories, that the firing of Tillerson is a favor to Putin.


good point

I forgot how much they disliked him at first.

geesh. It never ends, the up and down reverse psychosis of the left

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (fceHP)

44 >>>And Priuses. Priusi?

I tried to think of a 2nd car but couldn't. Priuses (Prisii?) would have fit the bill.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (8rNrN)

45 42
The XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (xJa6I)

I like the XC-90 cargo variant of the B-36, myself.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (fTKv+)

46 33 Amazing how Exxon ads cover everything they do EXCEPT pump dirty oil.LOL

Posted by: steevy at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (LiyEm)

47
Morning Cult leader! What are our orders for today ?
Posted by: It's me donna


Assemble for worship in the Sonic Temple.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (IqV8l)

48 we can always count on N Trumpers to back up the all the things they purported to stand aganst once upon a time.

Of Course we're With Iran!

Of course we're with Africas killing the others!

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (/ikqi)

49 Did Tillerson's aide have an aide? 'Cause I wouldn't want to be that guy.

Posted by: Cloyd Freud, Unemployed at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (398bZ)

50 If Trump is as Machiavellian as it appears, putting in a flawed nominee for CIA chief might just serve as chum bait as an easier target for grandstanding senators and allow Pompeo to get confirmed.

Course, either nominee could have embarrassing information about senators as well as the CIA folks tend to be collectors of all information.

Moving now by Trump also sets up a crisis where the Sec. of State office has to be filled with upcoming talks with NK. Trying to block Pompeo's nomination might cause heartburn in some Senate races because of that.

Posted by: whig at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (acrHV)

51 47
Morning Cult leader! What are our orders for today ?
Posted by: It's me donna

Assemble for worship in the Sonic Temple.
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (IqV8l)

ISWYDT

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (xJa6I)

52 Fuck Kristol

Posted by: CN at March 13, 2018 12:46 PM (5gaNQ)
...........

OMG OK!

Posted by: Judith Miller at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (HgMAr)

53 Do Volvos still exist? I thought Subaru's killed them.

Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (2LelM)


---

Saab is dead. Volvo is back. China made them great again, too.

Seriously, they just wrote the checks and let the Swedes do their interesting thing. Thank goodness.

Posted by: Moron Robbie - Those deputies listened to the kids screaming as they were shot at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (JTMqu)

54 47: golf clap

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (gQmKR)

55 The XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW
---------------------
Pacific Northwest or Penis Needs Washing?

Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (2LelM)

56 i'm feeling a little cultish this morning is Ace making pancakes?

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (/ikqi)

57 Has anyone looked for Kristol's brain tumor yet?

Seems contagious

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (CAKgV)

58 44 >>>And Priuses. Priusi?

I tried to think of a 2nd car but couldn't. Priuses (Prisii?) would have fit the bill.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (8rNrN)

Smart Fortwo?

Posted by: Hikaru at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (XMDuf)

59 Trump said earlier that Haspel has worked closely with Pompeo for a year and is the same mindset as he.

Posted by: Jen the original at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (m0lmR)

60 55 The XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW
---------------------
Pacific Northwest or Penis Needs Washing?
Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (2LelM)


Call Hobson.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (fTKv+)

61 "Priusi?"

Sounds Russian

/s

Posted by: Buzzsaw at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (aVYsC)

62 This deserves to be brought forward.


750 Also, I have this mental image of Alex sitting on a bathroom counter, holding up score cards when the two ladies in question walked out...

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 12:43 PM (Tnhbr)


This is fairly accurate. Except, how would she get up on the counter without her Stepstool? And like she would wait for them to come out of that stall on their own.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:45 PM (9CkBG)


Now back to the regular shenanigans.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (9CkBG)


She'd offer running commentary?

"No, you're obviously doing that wrong! Hook your pinky finger and swirl your tongue counter-clockwise! The Russian Judge will gig you heavily if you don't!"

Or would she try and do her best Howard Cosell impression?

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (Tnhbr)

63 47 Morning Cult leader! What are our orders for today ?

Posted by: It's me donna

---------------

Assemble for worship in the Sonic Temple.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (IqV8l)



If he shows up with his doctor, I'm getting the hell out.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (9CkBG)

64 No acknowledgement that the previous conspiracy theory, that Tillerson was actually selected to please Putin, was in error and is no longer in operation.

It would be hilarious to watch if Trump re-hired Tillerson. What on earth could the say then? But, it doesn't matter to them. They have no shame. Each day is like the day they were born. No history of partisan hackery. FRESH IDEAS!

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (fceHP)

65 Looks like Trump chose Putin over Stormy Daniels too.

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (mk7Bj)

66 it should be pretty easy to make a moral stand when millions of lives are at stake. Really i don't care how it is finessed.

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (/ikqi)

67 If you're going to fire the top guy in the department, makes sense to fire his top aide. Pompeo sure wouldn't have any use for him.

Posted by: Tom Servo at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (k1TUh)

68 I'm a September 11th survivor. Any person in the CIA who ran or operated those Black Sites is a fucking hero to me. They are also the prime reason we didn't have anymore similar attacks.

By the way, Gina will be the first female director of the CIA. So I am guessing those who oppose her are women haters trying to disguise their misogyny?

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (VpIIl)

69
Clearly the FBI wasn't part of the CIA conspiracy to kill JFK.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (r+sAi)

70 45 42
The XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (xJa6I)

I like the XC-90 cargo variant of the B-36, myself.
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (fTKv+)

Now that was a variant I was unaware of.
Did it keep the remote-controlled 20mm turrets?

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (xJa6I)

71 The correct plural of Prius is Prii. The -us becomes -i just like how the plural of ficus is fici.

Posted by: Surfperch at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (xPTqL)

72 So, Trump is playing withe his Barbie and Ken dolls again?

Posted by: zombie at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (42M22)

73 If Trump did it, it's bad, the worst!!


*Did I get the talking point right?

Posted by: Lizzy at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (W+vEI)

74 She'd offer running commentary?

"No, you're obviously doing that wrong! Hook your pinky finger and swirl your tongue counter-clockwise! The Russian Judge will gig you heavily if you don't!"

Or would she try and do her best Howard Cosell impression?

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (Tnhbr)



Yes.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (9CkBG)

75 Gina Haspel, hired in '85. That would be Reagan and his patriotic rebuilding of our military/intelligence complex. Survived Clinton, survived Obama. Did covert stuff which would make her a certified bad ass.

Liberals tend to administrative, non life threatening assignments while mingling with VIPs and high level bureaucrats. She's a keeper, and knows who needs to be replaced and is in the position to do it.





Posted by: Skandia Recluse at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (roQNm)

76 The aide was fired probably for being a lying little bitch. And insubordinate. But mainly being a little lying bitch, I suspect.

Posted by: Inspector Cussword at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (c1VpD)

77 "the mark of a conspiracy theory:... the conclusion remains ever fixed like magnetic north."

really nice turn of phrase.

Posted by: musical jolly chimp at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (Pg+x7)

78 FIRST OF ALL I could totally get on the bathroom counter if needs must.

*shinkicks BC*

She'd offer running commentary?

"No, you're obviously doing that wrong! Hook your pinky finger and swirl your tongue counter-clockwise! The Russian Judge will gig you heavily if you don't!"

Or would she try and do her best Howard Cosell impression?
Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (Tnhbr)



I'm certain I have no idea what you could mean.

*bounds off innocently*

Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (mf5HN)

79 Is anyone even attempting to claim that Kristol is a Conservative?

Republican? Sure. Whatever.

--

You might say he's a neo-conservative.

Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (ismre)

80 Prii

Posted by: JackStraw at March 13, 2018 12:55 PM (/tuJf)

81 Did everyone see the clip of Hillary drunk/neurological disorder fall down the stairs in India?


Darwin is doing his best.

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 12:55 PM (CAKgV)

82 55 The XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW
---------------------
Pacific Northwest or Penis Needs Washing?
Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 12:52 PM (2LelM)

The former, I'm fresh out of the shower

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:55 PM (xJa6I)

83 I think we all know that Trump was desperate to stop CNN from uncovering the true scandal of this administration: Stormy Daniels!

Posted by: Lizzy at March 13, 2018 12:55 PM (W+vEI)

84 Glad to see the State apparatchik canned so quickly, for disputing the WH line and (presumably) whining to MSDNC. Moar please.

Posted by: Huck Follywood, anti-weather at March 13, 2018 12:55 PM (rBnYq)

85
If he shows up with his doctor, I'm getting the hell out.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:53 PM (9CkBG)
paranoid are we? snaps glove

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 12:55 PM (/ikqi)

86 71 The correct plural of Prius is Prii. The -us becomes -i just like how the plural of ficus is fici.
Posted by: Surfperch


Actually, Prius is Fourth Declension, so the unusual plural of Prius is still, simply, Prius.

One Prius arrived, driven by a moonbat.

Three Prius arrived, driven by moonbats.

Posted by: zombie at March 13, 2018 12:56 PM (42M22)

87 Can we get Gina Haspel to waterboard Kristol at a Black Site?

Asking for a friend.

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 12:56 PM (VpIIl)

88 Tillerson was a terrible pick, I just think Trump could have gone over his vision and figured this out before hiring him. Not only were the optics bad for a former Exxon CEO to be in that position, the guy was a swamp creature. I mean he publicly celebrated transgender day?

Also, hiring "ultra wealthy" people to work for you is usually a very bad idea. These people are never going to fall in line and are just going to be there to feed their ego. Same can be said with Scaramucci.

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 12:56 PM (lKmt3)

89 But a Tillerson aide disputed that account, saying today's firing came as a surprise and that Tillerson expected to continue on as SecState.

That aide has now been fired. What's going on there, I couldn't tell you, as I have no endlessly-mutable conspiracy theory by which to explain all happenings.




Simple. The aide wasn't included in the info loop on this, and he thought what he said was possibly true, and shot off his mouth about it thinking it would be great to use this to make Trump look bad.

Should'a thought before he stunk up the room.

Now it isn't an issue. He's fired. QED.

Posted by: tcn in AK at March 13, 2018 12:56 PM (7UW64)

90 Never before have I seen something explained so completely and succinctly in a headline.

Posted by: flounderbot, rebel, vulgarian, deplorabot, winner at March 13, 2018 12:56 PM (Dp6qK)

91 Trump should find a Black man, a Japanese man, and a Native American man that he can pay to all have their names legally changed to "Vladimir Putin", and then hire all 3 of them.

Posted by: Hikaru at March 13, 2018 12:56 PM (XMDuf)

92 Dammit, she shinkicked me.

She DOES have her Stepstool with her.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 12:56 PM (9CkBG)

93 Stormy Daniels sounds like a mixed drink. Ginger beer and Jack.

Posted by: Quint at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (n13/j)

94 I honestly don't get the freakout over the firing of Tillerson's "top aide". Like with a coach in the NFL getting fired, I would think the loyalists would go too.

Posted by: Benji Carver at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (OD2ni)

95 So I'm to believe Trump didn't know about Tillerson's positions before he nominated him to be SOS? I don't have a problem with Trump's firings. I have a problem with his hirings. You can't wing those .

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (A4DFu)

96 If you knew what a neo-con was, then you'd get "Kristol." Hat tip, "neo-cons" were just pro-war leftists. He hasn't changed, he just ran out of war and wanted Hillary to make more.

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (CAKgV)

97 "Help my Stormy Daniels, you're our only hope!"

-CNN, probably

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (mk7Bj)

98 79 Is anyone even attempting to claim that Kristol is a Conservative?

Republican? Sure. Whatever.

--

You might say he's a neo-conservative.
Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (ismre)


Abandon Thread, Stormfront Alert.

Posted by: Hikaru at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (XMDuf)

99 I never understood the Tillerson pick to begin with.

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (VpIIl)

100 I would be perfectly happy and contented to never, ever again read another vapid piece of nonsensical twaddle to come out of the mushy brain of Bill "I'm famous because I'm a famous person's spawn" Kristol.

Posted by: DocJ at March 13, 2018 12:58 PM (7bkOX)

101 >>Actually, Prius is Fourth Declension, so the unusual plural of Prius is still, simply, Prius.

Toyota disagrees.

https://tinyurl.com/ncuqajq

Posted by: JackStraw at March 13, 2018 12:58 PM (/tuJf)

102 Gina Haspel can kill you 100 different ways.

Posted by: Under Fire at March 13, 2018 12:58 PM (r9UYA)

103

The White House has fired Steve Goldstein, the Under Secretary of State for Public Diplomacy and Public Affairs, after contradicting the account of Secretary of State Rex Tillerson's dismissal.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:58 PM (fTKv+)

104 Uh-oh. If Brennan likes her, I sense trouble.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? at March 13, 2018 12:58 PM (Dn4Uq)

105 "I guess you could say Trump chose Putin over Tillerson."
--------------------------------
I guess you could say Trump and Tillerson fell out because both were having a torrid affair with Maxine Waters.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (0jtPF)

106 so anyone gathered a list of who Obama fired?

because why bother. we already know it's a media game, just laugh and point.

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (/ikqi)

107 Trump picked a controversial woman on purpose. If she gets approved, he gets credit for putting the first woman in that position. If not, he gets to claim the Dems blocked a woman, plus he gets to nominate someone else he may prefer.

It's the same rake he laid down in the grass with his DACA deal and the Dems are going to step on it all over again.

Posted by: not the mama at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (mx7rN)

108 Pompeo coming out of the CIA knows all the secrets, including State Department secrets, and knows who the players are. Inspector General report coming out and naming names all across the federal bureaucracy.

Sounds like a reckoning to me.

Posted by: Skandia Recluse at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (roQNm)

109 So Kristol is the Male Version of Hillary?

Even SNL doesn't believe the bullshit he is spouting.

Does he? Or is he trolling for Clinton money.

Embarrassing himself now. Not even trying to make sense.

Posted by: professor disarray, gumdrop gorilla channel at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (7T5tR)

110 "neo-cons" were just pro-war leftists

The shortest, and yet most accurate, definition of "neo-con" I've ever seen.

( golf clap )

Posted by: DocJ at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (7bkOX)

111 Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (A4DFu)


First, he didn't have a closet full of loyalists for cabinet positions like life-long swamp creatures and second, he thought his appointees would be marginally loyal, like corporate hires. Democrats manage this, the oppositional piece to those on the right often makes the "collective" unmanageable.

It's not necessarily a bad thing, except it gets used by the media because they can't comprehend anything outside of a borg-like narrative.

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (CAKgV)

112 93 would take a lot of Jack to touch that

Posted by: rammajamma at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (AjNMO)

113 "The White House has fired Steve Goldstein, the
Under Secretary of State for Public Diplomacy and Public Affairs, after
contradicting the account of Secretary of State Rex Tillerson's
dismissal.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:58 PM (fTKv+)
"

Hey Steve, Arny's is hiring. Either that or Kamala needs another boot licker.

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (VpIIl)

114 81
Did everyone see the clip of Hillary drunk/neurological disorder fall down the stairs in India?
.............

Fox website has a still on it's front page of her gracefully splayed out in that flattering outfit she was wearing.

Posted by: wth at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (HgMAr)

115 Toyota disagrees.

https://tinyurl.com/ncuqajq
Posted by: JackStraw


The Japanese are terrible at Latin. It's famous.

Posted by: zombie at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (42M22)

116 There are people who believe airplanes fly using compressed air and secret levitation technology. All of the airplane designers, mechanics, refueled, and pilots are a part of a conspiracy to make people think we use more oil than we do in order to drive oil company profits.

Posted by: Cat Ass Trophy at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (4ZQMe)

117 So I'm to believe Trump didn't know about Tillerson's positions before he nominated him to be SOS? I don't have a problem with Trump's firings. I have a problem with his hirings
==========
In the real world its very hard to find good candidates for a job. Let alone sec of state, let alone when the entire world is out to get you.
He found Pompeo to be effective. He probably wanted to move Rex sooner but he needed Pompeo to do some CIA fixing and ID a potential replacement that was somewhat competent and trustworthy ish.

Trump has plans for Iran. He wants it all wrapped up by early November. it'll be like NK.

HE DID WHAT???!! UNPOSSIBLE HOW DID THAT HAPPEN!!??!

Posted by: simplemind at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (C6xeQ)

118 "99 I never understood the Tillerson pick to begin with.
Posted by: Marcus T"


Same. I guess the thinking was that he wanted someone outside the government and figured the CEO of a company like Exxon would have experience negotiating with foreign governments.

Posted by: Benji Carver at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (OD2ni)

119 If Pompeo cut the State Dept in half, would anyone notice? Care?

Posted by: Under Fire at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (r9UYA)

120 IMPEE FOTIE FIE!

Posted by: Maxine Waters at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (398bZ)

121 >>I honestly don't get the freakout over the firing of Tillerson's "top aide". Like with a coach in the NFL getting fired, I would think the loyalists would go too.


It's the MSM, and people like that aide are their source.
How many sources are still at State (and other agencies) doing their part for the #Resistance by leaking little bits like that, which CNN.NMC/MSNBC/ABC/CBS can then turn into another 24 hour "Trumps sucks!!!" story?
They have to protect their sources in fedgov.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (W+vEI)

122 I would be perfectly happy and contented to never, ever again read another vapid piece of nonsensical twaddle to come out of the mushy brain of Bill "I'm famous because I'm a famous person's spawn" Kristol.
Posted by: DocJ at March 13, 2018 12:58 PM (7bkOX)

#metoo

He's insufferable.

Posted by: professor disarray, gumdrop gorilla channel at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (7T5tR)

123 So I'm to believe Trump didn't know about Tillerson's positions before he nominated him to be SOS? I don't have a problem with Trump's firings. I have a problem with his hirings. You can't wing those .
Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth

__________

I feel the same way.

You can't really blame the "swamp" when these are the people he hired.

You would think after that crazy primary, Trump would have figured out that he has a whole lot of enemies in Republican ranks that he needed to weed out. Tillerson was very plugged into the Establishment, close with the Bushes, etc.

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (lKmt3)

124 So I'm to believe Trump didn't know about
Tillerson's positions before he nominated him to be SOS? I don't have a
problem with Trump's firings. I have a problem with his hirings. You
can't wing those .

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (A4DFu)


Obviously. This is the thing though, when you aren't a nevertrumper, you can look at Trump with a critical eye, and say "well you know, all those happy days when he was nominating people, and they seemed like odd choices, but we were willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, turns out they were bad choices!"

Which is very different from saying Trump is always right or Trump is always wrong. Seems to me if someone is in either of those camps, they're not to be trusted. For now though, I'm willing to accept that when Trump corrects a mistake, that's a sign of good leadership.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (9chmE)

125 >>>Morning Cult leader! What are our orders for today ?
Posted by: It's me donna

Assemble for worship in the Sonic Temple.

...

what's this a reference to?

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (8rNrN)

126 "neo-cons" were just pro-war leftists

b.s, i was for Iraq because. Is that Pro war or Pro get the fkrs that murdered 3 k of us?

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (/ikqi)

127
btw, has hillary been arrested yet?

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 13, 2018 01:02 PM (r+sAi)

128 "People I know are very skeptical of her because they believe she's "swampy" and will put the status quo of the CIA over the urgent need for its reform."


If she is smart she will notice that one person sets policy and other people enact that policy. She is not the person who sets policy. A lot more of the merry-go-round of deputy secretaries, under-secretaries, bureau chiefs, deputy chief of bureau - you know, the actual Deep State swamp dwellers who go from administration to think-tank, Wall Street, academia, and back - need to learn this also.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Protect Your Despair with Gloom Guard Polish & Sealer! Only at The Outrage Outlet! at March 13, 2018 01:02 PM (hLRSq)

129 There are people who believe airplanes fly using compressed air and secret levitation technology. All of the airplane designers, mechanics, refueled, and pilots are a part of a conspiracy to make people think we use more oil than we do in order to drive oil company profits.
=======
Wait. What? You're saying it isn't done with compressed air and a magic carpet in the cargo hold? That tears it! I'll never fly again!

Posted by: simplemind at March 13, 2018 01:02 PM (C6xeQ)

130 I'm waiting for that IG report. Oh, how I'm waiting. Like a kid for Christmas when he knows he's getting his first real rifle and a hundred bucks from his grandparents, I'm waiting.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine, 501st Kremlin Jewbot Gvardii at March 13, 2018 01:02 PM (Vg0Lf)

131
Trump is getting much better at politics

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (lKyWE)

132 ace, we were told to not criticize trump was being a cult.

my reaction was Who hasn't criticized Trump and why do we have to help them?

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (/ikqi)

133 126 "neo-cons" were just pro-war leftists


b.s, i was for Iraq because. Is that Pro war or Pro get the fkrs that murdered 3 k of us?


Were you a leftist before Iraq?

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (CAKgV)

134 Do Volvos still exist?

Volvos used to be solid because the designers didn't worry about changing their basic look all the time. They were able to spend that time they saved doing good solid engineering on everything else.

Then Ford bought them in 1999 and decided they needed a look refresh and didn't continue the tradition of simple, solid design. They focused more on aesthetics.

Then Geely (Chinese company) bought them in 2010 and I don't know what the hell Geely is doing with it. Probably what Chinese companies do with name brands with a good history. They cheap out on everything and drive the product into the ground while hoping you buy the name because of brand loyalty.

Posted by: bonhomme at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (iv0p7)

135 Did Tillerson's aide have an aide?

Everyone's got aides!

Posted by: Gary: Team America at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (XkVXQ)

136 I remember when Neo-Cons were Catholic and were serious about Soviet Globalism. Now they all seem to be Jews serious about Globalism.

Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (2LelM)

137 neo-cons" were just pro-war leftists

The shortest, and yet most accurate, definition of "neo-con" I've ever seen.

( golf clap )
Posted by: DocJ at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (7bkOX)


That's what I thought...except on the right. I never ever heard the Jew slam until today.

Posted by: professor disarray, gumdrop gorilla channel at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (7T5tR)

138 so i am a cult of one.

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (/ikqi)

139 Kristol's ass sucks putty balls.

Posted by: Berserker-Dragonheads Divison at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (aMlLZ)

140 "Pompeo has already been approved for a Cabinet-level job (head of the CIA) by the Senate so he needs no additional confirmation to take over as Secretary of State."

This is a pretty powerful tool, and not one I was aware of before. I suspect it's easier to get some candidates passed for some cabinet positions and then reassign them than it would be to get them passed for a position directly...

Posted by: not the mama at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (mx7rN)

141 I tried to think of a 2nd car but couldn't. Priuses (Prisii?) would have fit the bill.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (8rNrN)


meh. Tesla.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (fceHP)

142
what's this a reference to?
Posted by: ace



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonic_Temple

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (IqV8l)

143 125. Maybe he's testing us. He thinks we been slacking. We ain't! It's all here, all wrote down. We kept it straight, captain.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine, 501st Kremlin Jewbot Gvardii at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (Vg0Lf)

144 Gina Haspel ... I have no idea about her ... only that anyone inside the IC on some level has been involved in Hillary having a secret server, aware of the pay to play schemes, aware of the spying on all civilians, FISC abuses ... and so on.

There are probably some (relatively) white hats, and intel is supposedly "compartmentalized" so individuals work in only their little realm, not necessarily hands on aware of criminal actions.

Hiring from within the swamp is always risky, but here we are, with most of the swamp still operational. Calling all patriots to rise up ...

Posted by: illiniwek at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (bT8Z4)

145 What is a "Black site".?

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (8+Ozj)

146 Join Bill Krystol and Mr Wednesday Night tonight discussing why Trump is a Putin stooge no matter what he does or says.

Posted by: This is CNN at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (pw+jk)

147 dagny i was a lemming, i believed in peace and love and talk, lots of talk until i watched our people jumping out of buildings.

so yeah i was For , at least i thought so before that time.

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (/ikqi)

148 125 >>>Morning Cult leader! What are our orders for today ?
Posted by: It's me donna

Assemble for worship in the Sonic Temple.

...

what's this a reference to?

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (8rNrN)



Someone socking in the previous thread.

611 He's not been perfect, but I try not to criticize Mr. Trump because he's a patriot. The man gave up his amazing life to dive headfirst into a swamp at age 70.

Unfortunately, this place has a tendency to become a neocon echo chamber, so I feel it's my duty to share truth and common sense in the pursuit of peace.

Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 12:30 PM (ismre)

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (9CkBG)

149 Kristol would do less well than his Renfield McMuffin.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (oVJmc)

150 Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (CAKgV

I agree that he probably relied on others to help him fill positions but how about choosing someone who at least agreed with you on one of the most important foreign affairs issues on the table. At least I think that is why he chose Sessions ( immigration) so I can't really blame him for that choice.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (A4DFu)

151 Actually, Prius is Fourth Declension, so the unusual plural of Prius is still, simply, Prius.

I prefer Prion because it's the cause of mad cow disease and many female Prius drivers are mad cows.

Posted by: bonhomme at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (iv0p7)

152 Well, this clears the deck for Trump to be cucked by Russia using Novichok on UK soil.

Posted by: Some Dumbass at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (X0n+F)

153 Morning Cult leader! What are our orders for today ?
Posted by: It's me donna

Assemble for worship in the Sonic Temple.

...

what's this a reference to?

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (8rNrN)


Last thread.

Posted by: professor disarray, gumdrop gorilla channel at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (7T5tR)

154 138. I saw Cult of One open for Cannibal Corpse at Mudclub.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine, 501st Kremlin Jewbot Gvardii at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (Vg0Lf)

155
You would think after that crazy primary, Trump would have figured out that he has a whole lot of enemies in Republican ranks that he needed to weed out. Tillerson was very plugged into the Establishment, close with the Bushes, etc.

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (lKmt3)


In the context of the time he didn't have a lot of people to choose from

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (lKyWE)

156 The LEFT uses "neocon" to mean dirty joo. Doesn't mean it's accurate. That's what it means from a leftist (incl media.)

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (CAKgV)

157 Happened with the JFK assassination too, of course: When the FBI and
Warren Commission both announced they'd found no conspiracy, the FBI and
Warren Commission were almost immediately named as members of the
conspiracy.
---
Hiding a bunch of the information until *this* (maybe it was late last?) year didn't help much with that impression.


Posted by: Methos at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (XQvuQ)

158 not left, just liv. typical Clinton voter.

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (/ikqi)

159 >>>b.s, i was for Iraq because. Is that Pro war or Pro get the fkrs that murdered 3 k of us?


I would guess he's not saying being pro-war makes you neo-con. It's just that neo-cons were largely in agreement with the left, BUT were also pro-war.

Really pro-war. They seem to think war can achieve nearly anything and at nearly zero cost to boot.

It's unforgiveably naive.

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (8rNrN)

160 This is of course the mark of a conspiracy theory: When one proffer of evidence is disproven, you simply invent a new proffer of evidence to replace it. The evidence shifts day-to-day and moment-to-moment, but the conclusion remains ever fixed and immutable like Magnetic North.

And of course: Anyone who investigates the conspiracy and finds that there is no evidence of a conspiracy, is of course therefore now branded a member of the conspiracy.

Happened with the JFK assassination too, of course: When the FBI and Warren Commission both announced they'd found no conspiracy, the FBI and Warren Commission were almost immediately named as members of the conspiracy.



This all reminds me of batshit Leftist Mae Brussell back in the day, who would ramble from one disproven assertion to another.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (ujg0T)

161 he XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (xJa6I)

I like the XC-90 cargo variant of the B-36, myself.
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (fTKv+)


has a nice interior
I never liked the exterior looks of the Volvo line

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (fceHP)

162 138 so i am a cult of one.
Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (/ikqi)

So am I.

Posted by: Narcissus at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (xPTqL)

163 "What is a "Black site".?"

The Apollo Theater.

Posted by: Buzzsaw at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (aVYsC)

164 102 Gina Haspel can kill you 100 different ways.
Posted by: Under Fire at March 13, 2018 12:58 PM (r9UYA)

101 ways when she is wearing heels.

Posted by: LShouldn't Post at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (PQD/T)

165 119 If Pompeo cut the State Dept in half, would anyone notice? Care?
Posted by: Under Fire at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (r9UYA)


When I joined State, there were 2,500 Foreign Service officers working in 197 embassies and consulates. There were an additional 2000 civil service employees working at the Department, FSI and a few other US based branch offices. There are now 13,000 State employees making sure that foreign nationals have Obama's books. I think it's past time for a reduction in force. I've done several, I would be willing to take care of this pro bono.

Posted by: moki at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (V+V48)

166 Haspel = Smiley. Well played PDT, getting real now.

Posted by: rammajamma at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (AjNMO)

167
I thought Haspel sounded good, but if Brennan (PBUH) approves of her, I have second thoughts.


Posted by: Jane D'oh at March 13, 2018 12:47 PM (ptqGC)

Could be that's just his way of sabotaging her.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (Dbv1R)

168
What is a "Black site".?
Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (8+Ozj)


A CIA operated prison in a foreign country

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (lKyWE)

169 Trump has plans for Iran. He wants it all wrapped up by early November. it'll be like NK.

HE DID WHAT???!! UNPOSSIBLE HOW DID THAT HAPPEN!!??!

Posted by: simplemind at March 13, 2018 01:00 PM (C6xeQ)

I've heard some things about this as well, but it's initially probably going to cause some rage on the right. Expect a meeting between Trump and the head turban in charge to get floated about.

Don't know how it will shake out, but I trust Trump. It may be a situation where he has better luck with the Norks than the Iranians. Trump's definitely going to try and tamp down on the trouble with these places.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (4ErVI)

170 145. A black site is an extraterritorial detention and interrogation center. On foreign soil, amd with friendly locals officially in charge, you have a bit more flexibility in dealing with terrorists.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine, 501st Kremlin Jewbot Gvardii at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (Vg0Lf)

171 >>>145 What is a "Black site".?

a secret prison for terrorists where "extraordinary interrogation techniques" might be employed.

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (8rNrN)

172 "neo-cons" were just pro-war leftists

b.s, i was for Iraq because. Is that Pro war or Pro get the fkrs that murdered 3 k of us?

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (/ikqi)

--

Iraq (and the Illegal Imperialist Iraq invasion) had nothing to do with 9/11. We were deceived and plunged into a disastrous war.

Also Saddam had really cool facial hair and that should've counted for something.

Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (ismre)

173
This am reading Powerline, they had a link to a James Rosen article (puffing his new book) about the 'Deep State' and how it was used to take down Nixon. I enjoyed it very much. Don't know how much I agree yet, but it did bring up the Strozk-Page rudeness and how even on totally government memos, the nastiness was endemic even 50 years ago.

Posted by: mustbequantum at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (MIKMs)

174 or "enhanced." That was the word they used, not "extraordinary."

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:08 PM (8rNrN)

175 "In the context of the time he didn't have a lot of people to choose from
Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic a"


Right. That is why I don't give Trump too much crap over hiring clowns like Manafort and Lewandowski. Looks bad now, but he had a campaign to run and pickings were slim.

Posted by: Benji Carver at March 13, 2018 01:08 PM (OD2ni)

176 Bill Kristol is known to scarf down two boxes of Frosted Flakes every morning.

He steals them from the recycling bin so they're usually empty but the dumb mother fucker eats them anyways. He's like a goat.

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:08 PM (UDDXv)

177 What is a "Black site"?

A secret off the books location outside of US borders that exists for extra-legal activities. Think enhanced interrogation and such things.

Posted by: bonhomme at March 13, 2018 01:08 PM (iv0p7)

178 What is a "Black site".?

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (8+Ozj)


Racist.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:08 PM (UBzPO)

179 I actually think its healthy for the Right to criticize a Republican President when they fuck up.

I remember everybody just lining and saluting Dubya Bush and it was an epic disaster.

Trump needs to know from his supporters when he's making a mistake. Its clear he was ready to make some big gun control concessions and clearly the NRA got to him. A good thing I would say, unless you want federal gun control laws written by Diane Feinstein.

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (lKmt3)

180 159 I would guess he's not saying being pro-war makes you neo-con. It's just that neo-cons were largely in agreement with the left, BUT were also pro-war.

Really pro-war. They seem to think war can achieve nearly anything and at nearly zero cost to boot.

It's unforgiveably naive.

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:06 PM (8rNrN)

"Never Let a Crisis Go to Waste" writ large.

Posted by: Hikaru at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (XMDuf)

181 Was she running all of those black sites with her fit bit gps enabled so it would upload her location to a publicly available map?

Posted by: Cat Ass Trophy at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (4ZQMe)

182 I can only speak for myself, but I want someone as head of the CIA who's overseen the interrogation of some murderous jihadi on a slab.

I alienated several liberal, center-left friends when I told them I had no problems with enhanced interrogation of terrorists--and also because I didn't think interrogators were going nearly far enough.

The truth is physical torture (or the threat of it) does get results. I know this because I went through SERE School in the Army (now three decades ago) and saw fellow students crack and quit the course at just the thought of a few hours in the shed with the interrogators. Nobody touched them.

If I know with certainty a terrorist in custody has concrete information on an impending attack, then I'm up for whatever it takes to extract that information even if 'whatever it takes' would make me a horrible person for advocating it or even doing it. I sound like a monster but I frankly have no qualms about genuinely hurting these people.

Posted by: troyriser at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (K8f5g)

183 ace, i probably jumped this conversation was hit on in last thread with jews pointed out as .. (not by this person)
so anyway, the pejorative was already hanging out. so i was shortening the text.

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (/ikqi)

184 At least I didn't make the obvious Wakanda joke.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (UBzPO)

185 Anonymous sources tell CNN that Trump plans to cut the State Department in half. Our experts predict this plays right into Putin's dreams of world domination.

Posted by: This is CNN at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (pw+jk)

186 Some guy who looks like Morocco Mole is on Bloomberg TV saying that Tillerson leaving will hurt the Iran deal. Cry me a river. He also said that Pompeo is a hard liner on Russia. So Putin puppet Trump put a hard liner on Russia in at CIA and now is moving him to State. I'm sure the left will try to square that circle

Posted by: TheQuietMan at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (OLCnA)

187 Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 01:05 PM (A4DFu)

I'm guessing that Trump looked at names of those who already had some international experience and who would benefit us while we cranked up oil production. I'm betting he thought that Tillerson was mouthing platitudes re the global warming scam (i did) and he probably gave the right interview answers esp compared to Mitt, on Iran. Then Tillerson went all soft at State and I'm betting there are people at state still working for Kerry/Hillary and Tillerson hasn't done anything about it.

State has been a cesspoll since the 30s.

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (CAKgV)

188 Kristol claimed Tillerson was a Putin stooge chosen to serve Russia, so...

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (39g3+)

189 >>>Bill Kristol is known to scarf down two boxes of Frosted Flakes every morning.

He steals them from the recycling bin so they're usually empty but the dumb mother fucker eats them anyways. He's like a goat.

...

LOL

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (8rNrN)

190 145 What is a "Black site".?
---
Raysis.

Posted by: Cloyd Freud, Unemployed at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (398bZ)

191 As a recovering 21B (Combat Engineer Officer) with a modest explosives/demo background I joke (a lot) about how there are very few problems in this world that cannot be solved by the judicious use of C4.

The problem with Neocons is that they seem to honestly believe that, only on a global scale. It is ludicrously expensive (in terms of money and, more importantly, lives) and, as ace said above, almost criminally naive.

Posted by: DocJ at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (7bkOX)

192

Gina. Short for Vagina?

Posted by: Soothie at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (0LDLp)

193 Mattis is a huge supporter of Haspel.

Posted by: Jen the original at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (m0lmR)

194 Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (ismre)

Holy shit, I thought we were gonna cycle back to homosexual rape or even pot legalization, didn't foresee us dying on this hill in this thread.

*grabs popcorn*

Posted by: The Deplorable Mr. Trumpkin at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (wwd4n)

195 70
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:54 PM (xJa6I)

Nope. Wings, engines and big fuselage.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (fTKv+)

196
Iraq (and the Illegal Imperialist Iraq invasion) had nothing to do with 9/11. We were deceived and plunged into a disastrous war.

Also Saddam had really cool facial hair and that should've counted for something.
Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM (ismre)
---
srsly? is this person for real?

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (/ikqi)

197 What is a "Black site".?

A site that isn't acknowledged as belonging to and/or being operated by the US Gov.

Posted by: Blanco Basura - It's OK, I'm with the banned at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (IZPn8)

198 Kristol's pupils look dilated.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (UBzPO)

199 "145 What is a "Black site".?"

It's a sort of "liberation" center where we have a nice conversation with terrorists, out of the public eye, and "liberate" answers they really want to tell us, but otherwise can't.

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (VpIIl)

200 I thought neocon was a term of derision reserved for W and Karl Rove.

Posted by: Cat Ass Trophy at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (4ZQMe)

201 I can only speak for myself, but I want someone as head of the CIA who's overseen the interrogation of some murderous jihadi on a slab.

Seconded.

Posted by: DocJ at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (7bkOX)

202 I guess you could say Trump chose Putin over a fig newton.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (0jtPF)

203 198 Kristol's pupils look dilated.
Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM (UBzPO)


What about his students?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (fTKv+)

204 The guy behind the Twitter account RB Pundit is a rabid anti-Trumper (but does not give Dems a pass). His response to Ben Rhodes whining about Tillerson was pretty good:


"Remember when your boss mocked Mitt Romney for taking a tough stand on Russia?

Sit the fuck down, Ben."

Posted by: Benji Carver at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (OD2ni)

205 Do Volvos still exist?

------------------------------

I think so, but teh ladies won't let me get close enough to find out for sure.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (9chmE)

206 willow,

apologies if I stepped out of line -- I had no idea of the context carried over from a previous thread.

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (8rNrN)

207 Re Volvos.

We have an 06, and an 09.

Both at or above 120,000 miles.

Just did the timing belt on one, and next month the second one gets it done.

We love them.

Build quality is incredible, and once you crack the secret code to make repairs, they are incredibly straightforward.

Most parts are overbuilt, compared to other vehicles, and I have found that using exclusively OEM replacement parts pays off in the long run.

Electrical is rather complex, and borders on the vehicle having an onboard LAN, which I suck balls at working on.

But overall, we love 'em.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (EyPfd)

208
As suspected, the gun control stories went out the window with time, at least until tmrw when the hooligans come out for some extra school credit. But then it will go away again with the next mfm freakout over a Trump tweet.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (r+sAi)

209 202 I guess you could say Trump chose Putin over a fig newton.
Posted by: Margarita DeVille at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (0jtPF)

Fig Putins? Call Nabisco.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (fTKv+)

210 What's also interesting is the brain's defenses against admitting error. Here, there is an obvious pattern to Hillary's loss, namely, being an unlikeable harridan who forgot where Michigan and Wisconsin were. But that pattern requires that the brain accept that its neural pathways created to enforce the notion that Hillary = Smart Good and Trump = Stupid Bad were in error and NOPE NOPE NOPE. Russia it is!
Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (mf5HN)


Yep. But don't overlook the power of social conformity. I suspect that many of those originally promulgating this type of propaganda know perfectly well that it is nonsense, but do so merely to get the faithful a fig leaf to keep their faith strong.

And the latter cling to it to avoid the cognitive dissonance that would result from reconsidering their views, which were as pre-packaged as Velveeta.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (vP84t)

211 Thank God. I was wondering about Bill Kristol's take on this.

Posted by: rickl at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (xjiRE)

212 Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:09 PM (lKmt3)

What bizarro world were you in. The Right did anything but stand up and salute Bush. Especially here.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM (A4DFu)

213 It's a sort of "liberation" center where we have a nice conversation with terrorists, out of the public eye, and "liberate" answers they really want to tell us, but otherwise can't.

Forget I said anything, I like Marcus T's answer much better than my own.

Posted by: Blanco Basura - It's OK, I'm with the banned at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM (IZPn8)

214 Thanks for the details on State, moki. I nominate you for going back cleaning house!!
- - - -
>>The LEFT uses "neocon" to mean dirty joo. Doesn't mean it's accurate. That's what it means from a leftist (incl media.)


Yes, that was my interpretation of the term when it's used as a slur.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM (W+vEI)

215 ok so i put several on my ignore list .

nevermind, i'm going to clean house.
peace

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM (/ikqi)

216 'A site that isn't acknowledged as belonging to and/or being operated by the US Gov.'

Example: California

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM (EyPfd)

217 >>>175 "In the context of the time he didn't have a lot of people to choose from
Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic a"


Right. That is why I don't give Trump too much crap over hiring clowns like Manafort and Lewandowski. Looks bad now, but he had a campaign to run and pickings were slim.
Posted by: Benji Carver at March 13, 2018 01:08 PM (OD2ni)

__________

You don't give him too much crap for it?

I LOST AN ARM TO THOSE BASTERDS!

And lil' Ben Shapiro lost his job at Breitbart trying to get in my pants for it!

There have been casualties!

Posted by: Michelle Fields at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM (UDDXv)

218 The XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (xJa6I)

Volvo more or less jumped the shark when the 240 series ran its course. Simple, rugged, and well-made was succeeded by complicated, fussy, and more or less well made.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (Dbv1R)

219 A black site is where you can see a lot of pictures of black holes.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable and Profoundly Unserious at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (pw+jk)

220 State has been a cesspoll since the 30s.

The problem is that there are two kinds of people who want to go into diplomacy and foreign relations:

1) Hardcore cold bastards who are better in intelligence
2) soft-hearted mushy globalist types who are lefties

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (39g3+)

221 If I know with certainty a terrorist in custody has concrete information
on an impending attack, then I'm up for whatever it takes to extract
that information even if 'whatever it takes' would make me a horrible
person for advocating it or even doing it. I sound like a monster but I
frankly have no qualms about genuinely hurting these people.
---
You aren't nearly as alone in that as the anti-American media wants you to believe.

Posted by: Methos at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (XQvuQ)

222 As suspected, the gun control stories went out the
window with time, at least until tmrw when the hooligans come out for
some extra school credit. But then it will go away again with the next
mfm freakout over a Trump tweet.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (r+sAi)

Have you also noticed how all the cops suddenly stopped murdering innocent black men? Trump apparently solved that problem.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (UBzPO)

223
So I was right, as usual, about Tillerson finding out via the tweet he was fired was Fake News. AND a lie directly from the Deep State shits.

Posted by: Soothie at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (0LDLp)

224 The Russia collusion narrative is just like the global warming narrative.

There's no proof but it is the cause of everything. It's simply the latest religious fantasy consuming the Only The Facts! crowd.

As opposed of course to our Christian belief in the fairy Godfather in the sky.

Posted by: Sharkman at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (FypLm)

225 That is just so insulting. Our worship of Dennis Hopper is a religion. Not a cult.

Posted by: buzzion at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (lKs2v)

226 Example: California

That's more of a black hole than a black site.

Posted by: Blanco Basura - It's OK, I'm with the banned at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (IZPn8)

227 willow,

apologies if I stepped out of line -- I had no idea of the context carried over from a previous thread.

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (8rNrN)


smiles, So that is a 1st! i'll savor that and maybe use it one day.

kidding. yeah it's a weird conversation and hard to figure out what is satire and what is shit.

anyway out to clean.

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (/ikqi)

228 Here's what I don't get about the whole Neocon/NeverTrumper thing. Back during the Iraq War many used "Necon" when the really meant "Jew" because it was said that all the Neocons really cared about was Israel. Well now, most of these Neocons are now NeverTrumpers. But if they really cared about Israel First, why don't they love Trump? He has their back, gets along swimmingly with Bibi and has moved the US Embassy to Jerusalem. Israel would likely have no better friend EVER in the WH than Trump.
So why do they hate Trump?

I am no being a wise ass. This is a serious question.

Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (7uYFy)

229 107
Trump picked a controversial woman on purpose. If she gets approved, he gets credit for putting the first woman in that position. If not, he gets to claim the Dems blocked a woman, plus he gets to nominate someone else he may prefer.



It's the same rake he laid down in the grass with his DACA deal and the Dems are going to step on it all over again.

Posted by: not the mama at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (mx7rN)


Pretty much. As predictable as the sun rising in the east.

Posted by: flounderbot, rebel, vulgarian, deplorabot, winner at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (Dp6qK)

230 Black sites are more slimming.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (oVJmc)

231 215 ok so i put several on my ignore list .

nevermind, i'm going to clean house.
peace
Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM (/ikqi)



Uh...what? Wait a second. What just happened here?

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (9CkBG)

232 >>>
Yep. But don't overlook the power of social conformity. I suspect that many of those originally promulgating this type of propaganda know perfectly well that it is nonsense, but do so merely to get the faithful a fig leaf to keep their faith strong.

disagree about the "they know it's nonsense" part.

Most people in a cult do not know it's "nonsense" (though they might frequently wonder about that). But your point about social conformity explains why they continue to believe in the face of facts to the contrary. Humans "know" things primarily through SOCIAL means, not by reasoned inquiry.

if all your cuck buddies in the listserv are howling and hooting like monkeys about a conspiracy, you're going to take courage from their aggression displays.

Posted by: ace who doesn't get out as much as he used to at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (8rNrN)

233 Bill Kristol has never won a game of Tic-tac-toe. Managed a draw only once.

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (UDDXv)

234 >I like the XC-90 cargo variant of the B-36, myself.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (fTKv+)<

There was a B-36 on static display at Chanute Air Force Base in the 80's. They actually let folks up into it. That plane was an absolute monster. I even had picnics in that airplane. "Hey baby, wanna have a picnic with me in a nuclear bomber?"

Posted by: Muad'dib at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (sjdRT)

235 What bizarro world were you in. The Right did anything but stand up and salute Bush. Especially here.
Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth

__________

Not until it was too late

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (lKmt3)

236 Bill Kristol first learned how to ride a bike at age 37

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (UDDXv)

237 Trump is getting much better at politics
Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 01:03 PM (lKyWE)


yep

sad, but true

hard to get things done in DC

he's navigating better

Wait until the next term!

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (fceHP)

238 234 >I like the XC-90 cargo variant of the B-36, myself.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (fTKv+)

There was a B-36 on static display at Chanute Air Force Base in the 80's. They actually let folks up into it. That plane was an absolute monster. I even had picnics in that airplane. "Hey baby, wanna have a picnic with me in a nuclear bomber?"

Posted by: Muad'dib at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (sjdRT)


If you thought that that one was big, Bing the cargo ship. It's vast.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (fTKv+)

239 A black site is where you can see a lot of pictures of black holes.
Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable and Profoundly Unserious at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (pw+jk)

You mean like Hope Solo's?

Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (7uYFy)

240 Also Saddam had really cool facial hair and that should've counted for something.
Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM


What was I, chopped liver?

Posted by: zombie Fidel Castro at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (ctuyM)

241 "I would guess he's not saying being pro-war makes you neo-con. It's just that neo-cons were largely in agreement with the left, BUT were also pro-war.

Really pro-war. They seem to think war can achieve nearly anything and at nearly zero cost to boot.

It's unforgiveably naive.

Posted by: ace"


Yes. Think David Frum, Andrew Sullivan, Max Boot and Jen Rubin. Once their favorite prospect of sending more Americans to die in the Middle East became unlikely, they retreated to their liberal natures.

Posted by: Benji Carver at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (OD2ni)

242 145 What is a "Black site".?
Posted by: FenelonSpoke

worldstar

Posted by: x at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (nFwvY)

243 Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (7uYFy)

My candidate for tread-winner right there.

Posted by: DocJ at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (7bkOX)

244 Bill Kristol is an asshole. Not a special kind of asshole, just a run of the mill, indistinguishable from any other faceless asshole. And nothing comes out of an asshole save for shit.

Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (o2MD2)

245
brb, nevertrumpin

Posted by: Bill Kristol at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (0LDLp)

246 240 Also Saddam had really cool facial hair and that should've counted for something.
Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM

What was I, chopped liver?

Posted by: zombie Fidel Castro at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (ctuyM)

Pffff.

Posted by: Ayatollah Kohomeini at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (oVJmc)

247 did someone say black holes

Posted by: Don Lemon, Scientific Prodigy and Master of Aviation at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (8rNrN)

248 I am no being a wise ass. This is a serious question.
Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (7uYFy)

Neocon used to mean projecting America's greatness as a model to be emulated through the use of military force and a couple decades ago might have seemed plausible. The problem is we have plenty of history now showing how that not only doesn't work but will backfire spectacularly. Some people refuse to learn by history and continue doubling-down on failed policy.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (UBzPO)

249 You mean like Hope Solo's?

Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (7uYFy)

===========

That's black and blue.

Posted by: Jukin the Deplorable and Profoundly Unserious at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (pw+jk)

250 218
The XC90 is keeping the brand alive, at least out here in the PNW



Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 13, 2018 12:50 PM (xJa6I)

Volvo
more or less jumped the shark when the 240 series ran its course.
Simple, rugged, and well-made was succeeded by complicated, fussy, and
more or less well made.


Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (Dbv1R)

***
Volvos - they're boxy, but they're good!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTJZEK4JP0k

Posted by: Publius Redux at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (Fb9aZ)

251
brb, opposin my boss

Posted by: Rex Tillerson at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (0LDLp)

252 225 That is just so insulting. Our worship of Dennis Hopper is a religion. Not a cult.
Posted by: buzzion at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (lKs2v)


You left out Brian Dennehy.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (vP84t)

253 "We were deceived and plunged into a disastrous war."

If you think you were "deceived", you were and are an ignoramous.

As for the purpose of the war... well, we've given Arabs a chance to form a real nation. They failed.

Posted by: Rob Crawford at March 13, 2018 01:18 PM (lhV5b)

254

brb, gettin fired

Posted by: Rex Tillerson at March 13, 2018 01:18 PM (0LDLp)

255 Bill Kristol pees sitting down.

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:18 PM (UDDXv)

256 228 Here's what I don't get about the whole Neocon/NeverTrumper thing. Back during the Iraq War many used "Necon" when the really meant "Jew" because it was said that all the Neocons really cared about was Israel. Well now, most of these Neocons are now NeverTrumpers. But if they really cared about Israel First, why don't they love Trump? He has their back, gets along swimmingly with Bibi and has moved the US Embassy to Jerusalem. Israel would likely have no better friend EVER in the WH than Trump.
So why do they hate Trump?


I am no being a wise ass. This is a serious question.
Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (7uYFy)
I think it's because they had high hopes for the bellicosity of Hillary and they love love love illegal immigration.

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 01:18 PM (CAKgV)

257 What bizarro world were you in. The Right did anything but stand up and salute Bush.
Especially here.
Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM


Miss me yet?

Posted by: Jeb! at March 13, 2018 01:18 PM (ctuyM)

258
brb, lyin

Posted by: CNN at March 13, 2018 01:18 PM (0LDLp)

259 252 225 That is just so insulting. Our worship of Dennis Hopper is a religion. Not a cult.
Posted by: buzzion at March 13, 2018 01:14 PM (lKs2v)

You left out Brian Dennehy.
Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:17 PM (vP84t)



A lesser deity.

Posted by: buzzion at March 13, 2018 01:18 PM (lKs2v)

260 Pennsylvania holds a referendum on Trump

And...

HE'S REJECTED!!!

Posted by: Poll Daddy at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (EfigE)

261 235 What bizarro world were you in. The Right did anything but stand up and salute Bush. Especially here.
Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth

__________

Not until it was too late

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (lKmt3)

Yeah I saw people screamed down because they dared to ask questions about how long the wars were going to last.

I don't think I saw that here, though.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (4ErVI)

262
brb, leakin

Posted by: Adam Schiff at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (0LDLp)

263 240 Also Saddam had really cool facial hair and that should've counted for something.
Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 01:07 PM

What was I, chopped liver?
Posted by: zombie Fidel Castro at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (ctuyM)


Pfft. - my namesake Ernest "Murderin' Che" Guevara

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (vP84t)

264 Hmmmm....do I step into this fight or not?



Not.

Posted by: professor disarray, gumdrop gorilla channel at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (7T5tR)

265 Bill Krystol's favorite book is Green Eggs and Ham, because it helps him increase his vocabulary.

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (mk7Bj)

266 "Bill Kristol is an asshole. Not a special kind of asshole, just a run of the mill, indistinguishable from any other faceless asshole. And nothing comes out of an asshole save for shit.
Posted by: maddogg"


That asshole gave me the spelling for potato!!!!

Posted by: Dan Quayle at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (OD2ni)

267 brb, invading Syria.

Posted by: Nikki Haley at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (ismre)

268 "We were deceived and plunged into a disastrous war."



They're letting 3rd graders use the internet at school? Is no one watching these kids?

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (CAKgV)

269 Bwahaha! Bill Kristol is an ass.

Posted by: Fritz at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (bJ0w+)

270 >>> Anybody else think that picture of Bill Kristol fits him perfectly? A pompous ass looking down his nose at us "deplorables". I'm sure he chose it himself.

The word for Bill Kristol (and his photo) is: OLEAGINOUS.

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (AzW6q)

271
brb, indictin'

Posted by: Bob Mueler at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (0LDLp)

272 A lesser deity.
Posted by: buzzion at March 13, 2018 01:18 PM (lKs2v)


Heresy!

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (vP84t)

273 The truth is physical torture (or the threat of it) does get results. I know this because I went through SERE School in the Army (now three decades ago) and saw fellow students crack and quit the course at just the thought of a few hours in the shed with the interrogators. Nobody touched them.

The entire left takes it as gospel that torture doesn't work. Their "proof" is simple. Torture is so bad, you'll say anything for it to stop.

This is a stupid argument because you don't just take their word for it and let them go. You tell them, "I'm going to go verify this information, and if you're lying to me, we're going to do this again."

One fatal flaw is the possibility you have the wrong guy. In that case, you're torturing someone who literally can't give you the information you want, and you might think this is because they're holding out on you. Not good.

Personally, seeing how bad the gov't is at what it does, I've gone from thinking torture is a necessary evil to be used in very limited circumstances to not being sure we should ever use it.

I worry we'll use it on some totally innocent guy.

Posted by: bonhomme at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (iv0p7)

274 260 Pennsylvania holds a referendum on Trump

And...

HE'S REJECTED!!!
Posted by: Poll Daddy at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (EfigE)


"Really!"

- - Jon Ossoff

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (fTKv+)

275
Were he to run, Kristol Meth would have a difficult time 'splaining away his harem of soy boys.

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars (TM) at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (pNxlR)

276 Obama was terrible for Israel and Hillary would be more of the same.Why it's almost as if those neocons really don't care about Israel either.

Posted by: steevy at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (LiyEm)

277 268 "We were deceived and plunged into a disastrous war."



They're letting 3rd graders use the internet at school? Is no one watching these kids?
Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 01:19 PM (CAKgV)

They're feeding these lines to the 3rd graders.

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (NWiLs)

278 Bill Kristol bought two of Jeb!s guac bowls.

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (UDDXv)

279 >>>
If you think you were "deceived", you were and are an ignoramous.

The evidence for Saddam's WMD program turned out to be paper-thin and indeed flat-wrong.

I think a case could be made for "deception" as far as how strong the case was and therefore how urgent the threat.

Did the "lie" us into war? Well, no, they believed their case. But they certainly told us the case was air-tight (a slam-dunk, Tenet told Bush) and in fact it was... shit.

I think a less costly campaign of "maintenance bombing," just occasionally blowing up Saddam's shit, as Bill Clinton's bombings were derided in the era, would have been a prudent and effective method to deal with him.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (8rNrN)

280 I am no being a wise ass. This is a serious question.
--------------------
All Jews are not Zionists. Zionists care about Israel. Most Jews, like everyone else, cares about getting by and doing well and seeing their kids are launched properly. Then there are Manhattan and Malibu Jews. Don't get me started.

Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (2LelM)

281 >
If you thought that that one was big, Bing the cargo ship. It's vast.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (fTKv+)<

Holy crap! I've never heard of it, much less seen a pic of it. Did they add an entire second deck??

Posted by: Muad'dib at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (sjdRT)

282 207
Re Volvos.



. . .

Electrical is rather complex, and borders on the vehicle having an onboard LAN, which I suck balls at working on.



But overall, we love 'em.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 13, 2018 01:11 PM (EyPfd)



Do they go well with your crocs?

Posted by: flounderbot, rebel, vulgarian, deplorabot, winner at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (Dp6qK)

283 Ah,Pole Smoker is here.My day is complete.

Posted by: steevy at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (LiyEm)

284 "Posted by: Poll Daddy"


Hey, Bill Wynn''s dumbass little brother is back.

Posted by: Benji Carver at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (OD2ni)

285 Here's what I don't get about the whole Neocon/NeverTrumper thing. Back during the Iraq War many used "Necon" when the really meant "Jew" because it was said that all the Neocons really cared about was Israel. Well now, most of these Neocons are now NeverTrumpers. But if they really cared about Israel First, why don't they love Trump? He has their back, gets along swimmingly with Bibi and has moved the US Embassy to Jerusalem. Israel would likely have no better friend EVER in the WH than Trump.
So why do they hate Trump?

I am no being a wise ass. This is a serious question.
Posted by: JoeF.

______________


It's a lot of things, some of it is Trump is much less of an interventionist than previous Republicans. When he points out the trillions we have spent in the Middle East, he's basically slamming the entire NeoCon philosophy of nation building.

Jewish Americans seem to really hate Trump, including Jewish Republicans for some strange reason. I don't think it has much of anything to do with the state of Israel.

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (lKmt3)

286 Bill needs to stop drinking his own Kool-Aid.

Posted by: Sharkman at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (FypLm)

287 Kristol reminds me of the soyboys that were the center of conversion meetings that were held behind Ken's Kitchen in Dallas.

Posted by: REDACTED at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (VWsDy)

288 Obama was terrible for Israel and Hillary would be more of the same.Why
it's almost as if those neocons really don't care about Israel either.



Gee, it's almost like the leftists who were pro-war were really globalists or something.

Posted by: dagny at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (CAKgV)

289 At this point Bill Kristol is just the shoe stomping the shit to see what kind of shapes he can make with it.

We need an island for him and Egg McMuffin and Jeff Fake to sip drinks together and muse on the past. I propose St Helena.

Posted by: JEM at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (qFQBL)

290 I originally believed that the The MSM and the Democrats waned to keep the Mueller Investigation going because it explained Hillary's loss.
Then I started to believe that, no, it was all about protecting Obama and his Legacy.
Now I believe that the only reason they want to keep Mueller's sham going because if Trump is cleared of Collusion, his position becomes twice as strong, his poll numbers will shoot up 10 points, the GOP will increase seats in both Houses and trump will win re-election.
The cherry on top is that Trump will also wear a cloak of Teflon---nothing will stick to him because no one will believe the Democrats.

Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (7uYFy)

291 By the bye, Bil Kristol running for preezy would really bury the needle on the Stupid-Miscaculating-Sh*thead-o-Meter and, as a happy by-product, raise the level of the, currently at an all time high, "politcal insder *sswipe comedy quotient"

Posted by: Publius Redux at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (Fb9aZ)

292 This is of course the mark of a conspiracy theory: When one proffer of evidence is disproven, you simply invent a new proffer of evidence to replace it
***
Wait, I thought that was global warming

Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (Z8FFX)

293 270 >>> Anybody else think that picture of Bill Kristol fits him perfectly? A pompous ass looking down his nose at us "deplorables". I'm sure he chose it himself.

The word for Bill Kristol (and his photo) is: OLEAGINOUS.
----------------------
Oleaginous Obsequiousness.

Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (2LelM)

294 We need an island for him and Egg McMuffin and Jeff Fake to sip drinks penis together and muse on the past. I propose St Helena.

FTFY

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (NWiLs)

295 The entire left takes it as gospel that torture
doesn't work. Their "proof" is simple. Torture is so bad, you'll say
anything for it to stop.



This is a stupid argument because you don't just take their word for
it and let them go. You tell them, "I'm going to go verify this
information, and if you're lying to me, we're going to do this again."



One fatal flaw is the possibility you have the wrong guy. In that
case, you're torturing someone who literally can't give you the
information you want, and you might think this is because they're
holding out on you. Not good.



Personally, seeing how bad the gov't is at what it does, I've gone
from thinking torture is a necessary evil to be used in very limited
circumstances to not being sure we should ever use it.



I worry we'll use it on some totally innocent guy.

Posted by: bonhomme at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (iv0p7)


I think it's also from the old lefty trope.. about cops finding the first black dude they could and beating a confession out of him. So the prisons are full of innocent black men.


In other words, if daddy does it, it's badwrong. Why? Because!

Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (9chmE)

296 281 >
If you thought that that one was big, Bing the cargo ship. It's vast.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:16 PM (fTKv+)

Holy crap! I've never heard of it, much less seen a pic of it. Did they add an entire second deck??
Posted by: Muad'dib at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (sjdRT)


Yup. Double decker. It could carry like an entire company of troops. Only one example was converted from a B-36. It still exists in Dallas, but it's in rough shape. Some folks are trying to raise cash to restore it.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (fTKv+)

297 >>.1 235 What bizarro world were you in. The Right did anything but stand up and salute Bush. Especially here.
Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth

__________

Not until it was too late

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (lKmt3)

Yeah I saw people screamed down because they dared to ask questions about how long the wars were going to last.

I don't think I saw that here, though.

...

i think I did some of that. I am chastened.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (8rNrN)

298 Bill Kristol is known to scarf down two boxes of Frosted Flakes every morning.
---------------
Before or after his Protein Slurpees?

Posted by: DeploraBOT at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (y3aQB)

299 And Priuses. Priusi?
Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 12:49 PM


As was reported in this space a few days ago by your erstwhile reporter, the official plural of Prius is Prii.

In a comment, Alberta Oil Peon exhibited the usual bigotry toward Prii that Prii World has become accustomed to from the denizens of Alberta.

Posted by: Moron News YOU can use! at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (ctuyM)

300 1. PDT is the chief executive

2. An important part of being the chief executive is having a team you can work with

3. Tillerson was getting harder to work with so he should go

4. I have no idea whether Tillerson found out by tweet that he was fired. I doubt it, but I don't know.

5. In the end, it doesn't matter.

6. New person at CIA has to be better than what we had before Pompeo.

Posted by: joncelli, because somebody had to at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (RD7QR)

301 289
At this point Bill Kristol is just the shoe stomping the shit to see what kind of shapes he can make with it.



We need an island for him and Egg McMuffin and Jeff Fake to sip drinks together and muse on the past. I propose St Helena.





Posted by: JEM at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (qFQBL)

****
Ahem. Am I not invited?

Posted by: John Son of a Mailman Kasich at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (Fb9aZ)

302 Bill Krystal is like that friend from High School that got really into a Multi-level-marketing scheme that he keeps plastering all over Facebook.

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (mk7Bj)

303
20 Tillerson is a Putin Crony!!!1!

Putin made Trump fire Putin Crony Tillerson!!!1!
Posted by: The MSM at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (xPTqL)

All conspiracies are Playdoh conspiracies. They can be molded to meet any inconvenient change. The MSM must use one of the Playdoh extruder kits with all the attachments since they flip flop on an hourly basis.

Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (e1mEI)

304 New Hampshire should get a restraining order. He sounds obsessed, will probably resort to stalking.

Posted by: JuJuBee, just generally being shamey at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (2NqXo)

305 Charles Krauthammer and Bill Kristol should be lovers. Both cut from the same roll of asswipe.

Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (o2MD2)

306 Excellent choice of soundtrack for Bill "Little Man in my Head" Kristol.

Posted by: Inspector Cussword at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (c1VpD)

307 As a hire, Tillerson was too clever by half. You can't be pro-growth and pro-AGW at the same time. Did Trump even ask him, or did he just assume?

Posted by: Caliban at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (QE8X6)

308 Bill Kristol was first in line to the premiere of Female Ghostbusters. He sobbed during the credits.

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (UDDXv)

309 I think it's also from the old lefty trope.. about cops finding the first black dude they could and beating a confession out of him. So the prisons are full of innocent black men.

In a certain time in Chicago they wouldn't have been too far off the mark.

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (NWiLs)

310 Actually the Iraq War went just great, as advertised. It was the Occupation and Reconstruction (supposed) that turned to shit.

Posted by: Tom Servo at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (k1TUh)

311 All Jews are not Zionists. Zionists care about Israel. Most Jews, like everyone else, cares about getting by and doing well and seeing their kids are launched properly. Then there are Manhattan and Malibu Jews. Don't get me started.
Posted by: Gumby at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (2LelM)

I wasn't asking about all Jews. Just the Neocon/NeverTrumpers who are Jewish.

Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (7uYFy)

312 ok so i put several on my ignore list .

nevermind, i'm going to clean house.
peace
Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:12 PM (/ikqi)


oy, never take attacks here personally
and yeah, just ignore them

have a good one



Posted by: artisanal 'ette at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (fceHP)

313 So the deadline that Stormy and her lawyers concocted for Trump to respond passed at 12 Noon. So what happens now? The world ends? Oh and saw a clip last night of Stormy dancing inside a strip club. She can't dance worth a damn but I figured no one there cared.

Posted by: Cheri at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (oiNtH)

314 Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (8rNrN)


So glad you stepped into that. I echo most of your post. But I would have gotten pummeled.

Posted by: professor disarray, gumdrop gorilla channel at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (7T5tR)

315 305 Charles Krauthammer and Bill Kristol should be lovers. Both cut from the same roll of asswipe.
Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (o2MD2)


Not how Charles rolls...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (fTKv+)

316 The evidence for Saddam's WMD program turned out to be paper-thin and indeed flat-wrong.

I think a case could be made for "deception" as far as how strong the case was and therefore how urgent the threat.

Did the "lie" us into war? Well, no, they believed their case. But they certainly told us the case was air-tight (a slam-dunk, Tenet told Bush) and in fact it was... shit.

I think a less costly campaign of "maintenance bombing," just occasionally blowing up Saddam's shit, as Bill Clinton's bombings were derided in the era, would have been a prudent and effective method to deal with him.


The sanctions weren't going to last. In 2000 the French and Germans were pushing to end them. I don't think that you could maintain them along with occasional bombings for another decade or two, or more if one of Saddam's sons had achieved power. Plus, it required a large U.S. presence in Saudi Arabia which created its own problems.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (Tnhbr)

317 Bill Kristol, that is.

Posted by: JuJuBee, just generally being shamey at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (2NqXo)

318 In a comment, Alberta Oil Peon exhibited the usual bigotry toward Prii that Prii World has become accustomed to from the denizens of Alberta.

Prii World?

It's Priitopia.

Posted by: JEM at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (qFQBL)

319 There were 17 reasons that we went into Iraq. Leaving Saddam in power was unacceptable and dangerous.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (A4DFu)

320
We need an island for him and Egg McMuffin and Jeff Fake to sip drinks together and muse on the past. I propose St Helena.

They can take a cruise ship there.

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (lKyWE)

321 I've noticed that I don't see the Kraut around much anymore. Good riddance. Past his sell-by date.

Posted by: Tom Servo at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (k1TUh)

322 Just the Neocon/NeverTrumpers who are Jewish.
Posted by: JoeF. at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (7uYFy)

Why are you subdividing the "Jews" out?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (5y11N)

323 280: At the anti-Iran rally where Eli Weisel spoke, there were dozens of Hassidim holding anti-Israel signs decrying the Jewish State and in favor of a "permanent diaspora". It was unexpected, but should not have been. Their reasons for being anti-Israel are different from those of leftist Jews, but are just as maddening

Posted by: CN at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (5gaNQ)

324 315 305 Charles Krauthammer and Bill Kristol should be lovers. Both cut from the same roll of asswipe.
Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (o2MD2)


Not how Charles rolls...
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (fTKv+)

The very thought leaves me breathless.

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (NWiLs)

325 Bill Krystol's favorite flavor of paste is Elmer's.

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (mk7Bj)

326 I've noticed that I don't see the Kraut around much anymore. Good riddance. Past his sell-by date.
Posted by: Tom Servo at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (k1TUh)

He had medical issues and will back

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (5y11N)

327 What is a "Black site".?

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 13, 2018 01:04 PM (8+Ozj)

My understanding of it: an officially non-existent property where the agency that owns it does stuff they won't admit to doing.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (Dbv1R)

328 Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (fTKv+)
-----------
That was NOT nice, He is in a wheelchair/Sarc

Posted by: DeploraBOT at March 13, 2018 01:25 PM (y3aQB)

329 321: He's seriously ill

Posted by: CN at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (5gaNQ)

330 >>>298 Bill Kristol is known to scarf down two boxes of Frosted Flakes every morning.
---------------
Before or after his Protein Slurpees?
Posted by: DeploraBOT at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (y3aQB)
__________
Same time. I always frost his flakes *wink*

Posted by: Anthony Weiner gyrating in a thong! at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (UDDXv)

331 295 The entire left takes it as gospel that torture
doesn't work. Their "proof" is simple. Torture is so bad, you'll say
anything for it to stop.



This is a stupid argument because you don't just take their word for
it and let them go. You tell them, "I'm going to go verify this
information, and if you're lying to me, we're going to do this again."



One fatal flaw is the possibility you have the wrong guy. In that
case, you're torturing someone who literally can't give you the
information you want, and you might think this is because they're
holding out on you. Not good.



Personally, seeing how bad the gov't is at what it does, I've gone
from thinking torture is a necessary evil to be used in very limited
circumstances to not being sure we should ever use it.



I worry we'll use it on some totally innocent guy.

Posted by: bonhomme at March 13, 2018 01:20 PM (iv0p7)


I think it's also from the old lefty trope.. about cops finding the first black dude they could and beating a confession out of him. So the prisons are full of innocent black men.


In other words, if daddy does it, it's badwrong. Why? Because!
Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (9chmE)



It's that torture doesn't work for getting a confession for a crime. So using it to get a guy to admit he's the one that robbed the bank is shit. And so the Left has run with that as "Torture never works!" But if you're doing it for the purposes of intelligence gathering and to find out what is being plotted and perhaps who is connected to the terror cells, that is a bit different.

Posted by: buzzion at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (lKs2v)

332 235 What bizarro world were you in. The Right did anything but stand up and salute Bush. Especially here.
Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth
_________
Not until it was too late

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (lKmt3)



A little memory refresher for all here: What turned all of us off about Bush was his support for "Comprehensive Immigration Reform" (amnesty).

Not the Iraq War--even if in retrospect nation-building was decidedly NOT the cakewalk the neo-cons promised it would be, and Saddam in fact could have been left contained indefinitely, putting Saddam into the ground was approved by all.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (ujg0T)

333 CNN still pushing the bullshit that tillerson was fired with the tweet....what a bunch of cock suckers

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (5y11N)

334 I think a less costly campaign of "maintenance
bombing," just occasionally blowing up Saddam's shit, as Bill Clinton's
bombings were derided in the era, would have been a prudent and
effective method to deal with him.
Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:21 PM (8rNrN)

Remember Iraq's first free election when we were all shown images of the proud Iraqis with their blue thumbs? I often wonder how different history would be if we'd have just packed up that day and left. Why did we need to stay another day?

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (UBzPO)

335 >>>
The sanctions weren't going to last. In 2000 the French and Germans were pushing to end them. I don't think that you could maintain them along with occasional bombings for another decade or two, or more if one of Saddam's sons had achieved power. Plus, it required a large U.S. presence in Saudi Arabia which created its own problems.

you have to look at the problems of the war, too, and balance them against that.

Bear in mind, while we were quagmired in Iraq (which we definitely were), iran had a free hand, and they knew it. They murdered American soldiers with impunity because they knew Bush could not launch a second war (or even a big punitive missile strike) while he was in such a perilous political place with the Iraq war.

Iran won the Iraq War and it didn't cost them but a few million dollars and some IEDs.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (8rNrN)

336 We need an island for him and Egg McMuffin and Jeff Fake to sip drinks together and muse on the past. I propose St Helena.
----------
Isn't that what Pedo Island is for?

Posted by: DeploraBOT at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (y3aQB)

337 I haven't trusted Tillerson since he was instrumental in turning the BSA gay. Good riddance.

Posted by: freaked at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (j1hJz)

338 The big mistake was not taking Saddam out in '91, when we easily could have, but the Saudi's said "Oh no we promise he'll be nice! Don't bother him!" and so of course Bush Senior always did what the Saudi's told him to do.

Posted by: Tom Servo at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (k1TUh)

339 The idea that torture that doesn't work is designed by soyboys who have watch too many movies. It works, especially when a woman applies it . Hello, Gina

Posted by: REDACTED at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (VWsDy)

340 "Do they go well with your crocs?"

Our little area of Baltimore probably has the highest concentration of Volvos in the state.


And it's always fun to pull up in the wagon.

With the NRA sticker in the tailgate window.

The idiots simply can not process that image, and their brains lock-up.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (EyPfd)

341 i think I did some of that. I am chastened.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (8rNrN)

I don't think I saw it. Maybe I wasn't here then. Back then I was at LGF where probably everyone else was as well.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (4ErVI)

342 This is of course the mark of a conspiracy theory: When one proffer of evidence is disproven, you simply invent a new proffer of evidence to replace it.

I'm going to have to call a foul, here. A conspiracy theory, by itself, is neither good nor bad. There are conspiracy theories that have been proven true. Obviously. Because people conspire to do things all the time. There have also been conspiracy theories that have been proven false and that those claiming them have accepted as false. Many of them, too.

What you are talking about is not just a "conspiracy theory" but an "unfalsifiable conspiracy defense mechanism". There's no reason to throw away the valid concept of conspiracy theories just because some nutcases and assholes abuse them.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (8gDQu)

343 I refuse to use "prii" as the plural of "prius."
In English the best plural would be "priuses."

I guess you could say that I choose Putin over Toyota's lingo-cops.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (0jtPF)

344
It turns out the late great mayor of Toronto Rob Ford has a brother kinda just like him.

Rob Ford and Doug Ford are kinda like Rex and Rob Ryan.

Posted by: Bob Mueler at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (0LDLp)

345 So, what you're saying is that by firing Rex Tillerson, Donald Trump is virtually admitting that the Steele Dossier is accurate and that Hillary Clinton is technically our president today.

Posted by: MFM at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (ATVNj)

346 What do you think of this as a campaign slogan?:

"Cruising with Bill Kristol."

Posted by: Caliban at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (QE8X6)

347 The entire left takes it as gospel that torture
doesn't work. Their "proof" is simple. Torture is so bad, you'll say
anything for it to stop.
***
Actually they don't believer any of that. In fact they KNOW torture works. That's why they don't want it used on Islamists.

Every single communist state made heavy use of torture, with the approval from the left. Hell, it is a center piece in 1984.

Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (Z8FFX)

348 So, where was Billy boy when the government under Owebama was ACTUALLY colluding with Russia?

Posted by: Sponge at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (xttKs)

349 "235 What bizarro world were you in. The Right did anything but stand up and salute Bush. Especially here.
Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth
"

Bush did what he thought was right after September 11th. Could he have done some things differently- of course. Hindsight is always 20/20.

As a Sept.11th survivor I have zero qualms about how he executed the wars in both Iraq/AFG. Zero. Were we naive and execute some things in haste or incorrectly? Of course, but we now have the specter of history as a guidepost.

And I say that as someone who lost family and friends in the wars.

His social policies, I never really cared for, nor did I eveer hold back on that opinion.

That being said, I still owe Bush a lot for what he did after Sept.11th. It brought me a lot of peace and some closure

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (VpIIl)

350 >>>Remember Iraq's first free election when we were all shown images of the proud Iraqis with their blue thumbs? I often wonder how different history would be if we'd have just packed up that day and left. Why did we need to stay another day?

unfortunately, when we failed to find the WMDs, Bush changed the whole point of the mission from "disarm Saddam" to "bring democracy to Iraq," and that latter mission would take 30 years and hundreds of thousands of US troops.

If we had found the WMDs, we could have taken them and just left the country.

But without that, Bush was left scrambling for a post-hoc new justification. The one he came up with required a much, much longer commitment to policing Iraq than any war supporters contemplated before the war.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (8rNrN)

351 Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:15 PM (lKmt3)



Yeah I saw people screamed down because they dared to ask questions about how long the wars were going to last.



I don't think I saw that here, though.



...



i think I did some of that. I am chastened.





Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (8rNrN)


I think people around here, and elsewhere, decided to trust the Republican Party leadership. And then once the decision to go to war was made by them, to align ourselves behind the cause. Regardless of whatever qualms we may have had going into it.

We know now what a shitty entity the Republican Party is. I didn't know that then. I'm not going to apologize for not knowing it.

If I continued to trust them though, that would be my mistake.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (9chmE)

352 Lamb +6 over Saccone.

That's gonna leave a mark.

Posted by: Poll Daddy at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (EfigE)

353 "Back during the Iraq War many used "Necon" when the really meant "Jew"
because it was said that all the Neocons really cared about was Israel."

My recollection is that "Neocon = Jew" became a thing to discredit Pat Buchanan. He was the first person I'd heard using the term neocon in a negative way and by gosh we all know Pat Buchanan is an anti-semite (so must be dismissed).

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (UBzPO)

354 345 So, what you're saying is that by firing Rex Tillerson, Donald Trump is virtually admitting that the Steele Dossier is accurate and that Hillary Clinton is technically our president today.
Posted by: MFM at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (ATVNj)

*Peterson Death Stare*

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (NWiLs)

355 Back then I was at LGF where probably everyone else was as well.

I bidded you adieu!

Posted by: Cahrles Jhonsen at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (vtcmf)

356 Volvo more or less jumped the shark when the 240 series ran its course. Simple, rugged, and well-made was succeeded by complicated, fussy, and more or less well made.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 13, 2018 01:13 PM (Dbv1R)

240's were under powered because they were heavy as hell, but good lord they were tanks. My parents had a 240 wagon that I drove to high school and I got rear ended one day by a Saab. Saab = totaled and towed. Volvo= A little strip of chrome came off the not-even-dented bumper.

Posted by: Mainah at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (gCJeK)

357 "298 Bill Kristol is known to scarf down two boxes of Frosted Flakes every morning."


He also stiffs me on those crappy cruises. Cheap MF'er.

Posted by: Ted Lange as Isaac Your Bartender at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (OD2ni)

358 a five month long bombing campaign in which every one of Saddam's palaces, Republican Guards barracks, tanks, aa batteries, and even transport trucks were demolished might well have delivered "closure" and also so weakened Saddam that an internal uprising might have toppled him.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (8rNrN)

359 Anybody else think that picture of Bill Kristol fits him perfectly? A pompous ass looking down his nose at us "deplorables". I'm sure he chose it himself.

I think his face really did freeze that way, like his mother warned him.

Posted by: rickl at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (xjiRE)

360 Bill Krystol thinks that that champagne that famous people sing about was named after him.

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (mk7Bj)

361 As a recovering 21B (Combat Engineer Officer) with a
modest explosives/demo background I joke (a lot) about how there are
very few problems in this world that cannot be solved by the judicious
use of C4.
Posted by: DocJ at March 13, 2018 01:10 PM


True dat, including the problem of cold C-Rats.

Posted by: Duncanthrax at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (ctuyM)

362 Why did we need to stay another day?
Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (UBzPO)


We were al-Ameriki, the guys who had no long history in the area, which meant that all side could trust us.
If Obama had kept two brigades in Iraq for training and to arbitrate disputes we wouldn't have seen the rise of the Islamic State. And as "advisors" we could help keep in check the tribalist tendencies of all sides until stronger institutions developed.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (Tnhbr)

363 If Kristol actually runs for POTUS I shall go long on tomato futures.

Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (o2MD2)

364 Not how Charles rolls...
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:24 PM (fTKv+)


Didn't have to dive very deep for that one, huh ??

Posted by: REDACTED at March 13, 2018 01:31 PM (VWsDy)

365
brb, extortin

Posted by: Stormy Daniels at March 13, 2018 01:31 PM (0LDLp)

366 Something else weird. Trump assistant removed from WH then goes to campaign

WTF

Posted by: George at March 13, 2018 01:31 PM (ECcl5)

367 >>I think a less costly campaign of "maintenance bombing," just occasionally blowing up Saddam's shit, as Bill Clinton's bombings were derided in the era, would have been a prudent and effective method to deal with him.


Eh, I doubt it. There is a lot of revisionist history about why we went to Iraq. WMD were only one of the reasons, clearly the one that got the most play particularly after 9/11. And there is still debate as to just how much WMD material was found in Iraq and in Syria.

There was also the little details of Saddam already cheating on sanctions, firing on our troops, paying and harboring terrorists that were attacking Israel and beyond and the fact that he was violating the terms of the cease fire we generously granted him after the first Gulf War instead of taking him out then.

It should also not be forgotten that the Iraq War was won until Obama gave it away. We had established the largest embassy in the world right smack in the middle of the Middle East which would have been an excellent forward outpost for watching and conducting operations in the rest of the Middle East.

It was hard to forsee in the early 2000s that we would have an American hating president in 2008 who would give away all the gains we had made in Iraq.

Posted by: JackStraw at March 13, 2018 01:31 PM (/tuJf)

368 >>>345 So, what you're saying is that by firing Rex Tillerson, Donald Trump is virtually admitting that the Steele Dossier is accurate and that Hillary Clinton is technically our president today.
Posted by: MFM at March 13, 2018 01:28 PM (ATVNj)

_____

Oooooo!

Oooooo!

Interview me! I have comments!

Posted by: Jeff Flake at March 13, 2018 01:31 PM (UDDXv)

369 http://bit.ly/2GmVrKV
-----------
Former CIA Officer Exposes Clinton Charity Fraud As Biggest Scandal In US History
---
Zero Hedge

Posted by: DeploraBOT at March 13, 2018 01:31 PM (y3aQB)

370 The evidence for Saddam's WMD program turned out to be paper-thin and indeed flat-wrong.

---

Most of that intelligence was gathered by the Clinton administration.

Posted by: Skandia Recluse at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (roQNm)

371 Bill Krystol still pays for porn.

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (mk7Bj)

372 Lamb +6 over Saccone.

That's gonna leave a mark.

Posted by: Poll Daddy at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (EfigE)


Polls are for strippers.

Posted by: Sponge at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (xttKs)

373 unfortunately, when we failed to find the WMDs, Bush changed the whole point of the mission from "disarm Saddam" to "bring democracy to Iraq," and that latter mission would take 30 years and hundreds of thousands of US troops.

If we had found the WMDs, we could have taken them and just left the country.

But without that, Bush was left scrambling for a post-hoc new justification. The one he came up with required a much, much longer commitment to policing Iraq than any war supporters contemplated before the war.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (8rNrN)



Did chemical weapons not count?

Whenever leftists shrieked that "Bush LIED!" about chemical weapons, I always replied, "Thousands of gassed Kurds could not be reached for comment..."

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (ujg0T)

374 A little memory refresher for all here: What turned all of us off about Bush was his support for "Comprehensive Immigration Reform" (amnesty).

Not the Iraq War--even if in retrospect nation-building was decidedly NOT the cakewalk the neo-cons promised it would be, and Saddam in fact could have been left contained indefinitely, putting Saddam into the ground was approved by all.
Posted by: Curmudgeon

__________

I would say it was all of the above.

I was turned off from Iraq because it didn't look like we were really willing to win it. Also, it was definitely sold in a deceptive way, I think early estimates from the architects was it was going to cost like a $100 billion total. Instead it will be trillions.

And then there was the fact that Bush couldn't even get Bin Laden, the person actually responsible for 9/11. EVERY single person knew he was hiding out in Pakistan.

It was just an all around shit show.

I'm completely soured on interventionism. Unless the homeland is in immediate danger, stay the hell out.

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (lKmt3)

375 Trump is a short fingered vulgarian and to a lot of people that's a problem. Personally I don't so much care about that.

My sense of "class" is not so much "class signals" as it is effectiveness. If my toilet is clogged and my plumber has a british accent and drives a lorry but can't unclog the toilet - he's fired. A first class plumber unclogs the toilet, nothing else matters. Our national toilet needs a serious plunging.

Posted by: simplemind at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (WHUjX)

376 It sounds like Gina is a real operative with actual leadership creds within the CIA. Not the Valerie Plame super-dee-duper made up operative.

Posted by: Cheri at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (oiNtH)

377 Can't we all just get along!?!?

Posted by: Rodney King, Beating A Korean Shopkeeper Half To Death at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (FypLm)

378 the left calls conspiracy on the right, when it is the left's conspiracy (Hillary/uranium/Russia)

But the left/Dems always manage to investigate their own ... so we get Mueller investigating Trump, but really covering up for his buddy Comey.

Or we get Gorelick investigating her own failings on the wall in the intelligence agencies and 9/11.

So the left indeed knows all about the conspiracy and the coverup. Clinton and Chinagate covered up with Monica gate. The swamp/guild protects its own. Same with the too big to fail/jail frauds, Holder/DoJ on fast and furious ...

But the swamp is 97% on board with Dems, so to accuse outsider Trump of cover-up is beyond the pail.

Posted by: illiniwek at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (bT8Z4)

379 353 "Back during the Iraq War many used "Necon" when the really meant "Jew"
because it was said that all the Neocons really cared about was Israel."

My recollection is that "Neocon = Jew" became a thing to discredit Pat Buchanan. He was the first person I'd heard using the term neocon in a negative way and by gosh we all know Pat Buchanan is an anti-semite (so must be dismissed).
Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (UBzPO)


Neo-con as used by the likes of Buchanan is akin to diamond-merchants and East Coast bankers, that is an anti-semitic slur.

Taken literally, neo-conservative is the definition of one who perhaps has liberal (not Leftist) views on certain things but is a hawk on national defense and a supporter of Israel.

The latter could describe me, but as the years have passed I am even less liberal on social issues than I ever have been.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (fTKv+)

380 24 In one year, all of these fucking people will have "Kamala for Commander in Chief!" bumper stickers on their Volvos.

And China owns Volvo now!!

Posted by: free tibet at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (Grak2)

381 "And so the Left has run with that as "Torture never works!" But if you're doing it for the purposes of intelligence gathering and to find out what is being plotted and perhaps who is connected to the terror cells, that is a bit different."

And because it is so repellent to everyday people in today's media society, you can't let these guys walk free when you're done, and it's stupid to try to hang onto them forever. When all information is gained, the subjects need to be killed and the bodies dumped. That's what should have happened to everyone in Guantanamo.

If this is really a war we're in, that's the wartime solution.

Posted by: Tom Servo at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (k1TUh)

382

brb, duplicitousin

Posted by: Jake Tapper at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (0LDLp)

383 Well, it's good that Tillerson can get back to murdering people, like Teh Arnold sez. Play to your strengths, that's what I always say.

Exxon and death camps, here he comes!

Posted by: GnuBreed at March 13, 2018 01:33 PM (0ogQG)

384 337 I haven't trusted Tillerson since he was instrumental in turning the BSA gay. Good riddance.

Posted by: freaked at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (j1hJz)


Yeah, who said out loud that what the BOY Scouts needed was a good reaming out of their backsides?

What the actual f?

Posted by: tcn in AK at March 13, 2018 01:33 PM (7UW64)

385 unfortunately, when we failed to find the WMDs, Bush changed the whole point of the mission from "disarm Saddam" to "bring democracy to Iraq," and that latter mission would take 30 years and hundreds of thousands of US troops.

If we had found the WMDs, we could have taken them and just left the country.

But without that, Bush was left scrambling for a post-hoc new justification. The one he came up with required a much, much longer commitment to policing Iraq than any war supporters contemplated before the war.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (8rNrN)

I think that is a misreading of what happened and also a misreading of the need to stop Saddam from getting more WMD.

In all likely hood some WMDs were secretly removed from Iraq to Lebanon and then to Russia.

Also after the Israelis ( Thank You Israel) took out Saddam's Nuke program, he was left with mostly chemical and biological weapons. And while many fo them were destroyed, burned, or dumped in the rivers, they could have been reconstituted almost over night if Saddam and his crew had not been taken out. They had already shown a willingness to use them

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:33 PM (5y11N)

386 >>>357 "298 Bill Kristol is known to scarf down two boxes of Frosted Flakes every morning."


He also stiffs me on those crappy cruises. Cheap MF'er.
Posted by: Ted Lange as Isaac Your Bartender at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (OD2ni)
________

There are cruises that need stiffings? Where do I sign up?

Posted by: Anthony Weiner gyrating in a thong! at March 13, 2018 01:33 PM (UDDXv)

387 >>>
I think people around here, and elsewhere, decided to trust the Republican Party leadership. And then once the decision to go to war was made by them, to align ourselves behind the cause. Regardless of whatever qualms we may have had going into it.

I was super-pro-war myself and had always hated that the elder bush stopped short of evicting Saddam Hussein.

I also bought into the bad assumption that foreign policy and wars were about SOLVING problems once and for all, rather than just dealing with them on a temporary basis and kicking the can down the road.

We spend too much time looking at the truly decisive military conflicts -- Civil War, WWII defeats of Germany and Japan. Most wars are short of "total war" with unconditional surrender and do not "solve" things the way those wars did.

Imposing a true and lasting SOLUTION via war is a very costly and lengthy endeavor, as we have learned at such a cost in blood and treasure (and Iran's rise to become a power, with us unable even to THREATEN them credibly).

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:33 PM (8rNrN)

388 Posted by: George at March 13, 2018 01:31 PM (ECcl5)
---------
Didn't have full security clearence

Posted by: DeploraBOT at March 13, 2018 01:34 PM (y3aQB)

389 384 337 I haven't trusted Tillerson since he was instrumental in turning the BSA gay. Good riddance.

Posted by: freaked at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (j1hJz)


Yeah, who said out loud that what the BOY Scouts needed was a good reaming out of their backsides?

What the actual f?
Posted by: tcn in AK at March 13, 2018 01:33 PM (7UW64)

Boy Shtuppers of America

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:34 PM (NWiLs)

390 Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:22 PM (9chmE)





It's that torture doesn't work for getting a confession for a crime.
So using it to get a guy to admit he's the one that robbed the bank is
shit. And so the Left has run with that as "Torture never works!" But
if you're doing it for the purposes of intelligence gathering and to
find out what is being plotted and perhaps who is connected to the
terror cells, that is a bit different.

Posted by: buzzion at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (lKs2v)


Oh, I'm pretty sure it absolutely works for getting people to confess to crimes. Even ones they didn't commit! So from a cop's perspective, if you already "know" the perp did it, beating the hell out of him (if you can get away with it, which you could, for centuries) was effective.

Are there too many innocents jailed? Sure. Probably. For some values of "too many."

But the part that doesn't get into the discussion, what the left leaves out, is to ask the question, what incentive do cops have to be wrong? Just to get a conviction? And let the real perp go free? Why would they do that?

Answer, mostly, they wouldn't.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:34 PM (9chmE)

391 "Iran won the Iraq War and it didn't cost them but a few million dollars and some IEDs.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (8rNrN)
"

Really? How so?

Their is no doubt they were involved. They still are and trying to increase their influence in the Shiite population. But I would never say they "won". We "won", or were "winning" until Obama prematurely pulled down or forces who were helping to setup the countries infrastructure. We are now reengaged after Trump took office and beating back the Iranian influence.

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 01:34 PM (VpIIl)

392 359 Anybody else think that picture of Bill Kristol fits him perfectly? A pompous ass looking down his nose at us "deplorables". I'm sure he chose it himself.


They should make a toilet lid with his face on it

Posted by: REDACTED at March 13, 2018 01:34 PM (VWsDy)

393 I guess you could say Trump chose hamburgers over kale salad for lunch.

Posted by: JuJuBee, just generally being shamey at March 13, 2018 01:34 PM (2NqXo)

394 The idea that torture that doesn't work is designed by soyboys who have watch too many movies. It works, especially when a woman applies it . Hello, Gina

Posted by: REDACTED at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (VWsDy)


The funniest thing about the arguments the idiots make that "torture doesn't work" is that they say "the person will tell you whatever you want to hear" to stop the pain, which is true. And when you want to hear the truth (and can test it and come back to the person with the result) that is what they will tell.

At the same time, these idiots claim that having tea and crumpets during an interview will get you information that is solid, which is beyond laughable.

Torture works. It works so well that it scares the living shit out lefty douchebags who want to be able to make some sort of argument against it that doesn't rely on "so more of us will have to die for our leftist political insanity". ANd so the leftist like to intentionally conflate torture to extract confessions (that no one cares whether they are true or not) with torture to extract true information. Of course, this is the same sort of thing they do when comparing a wall to keep aliens out and something like the Berlin wall, to keep the populace in. Almost every lefty argument is based on this same sort of inverted bullshit.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (8gDQu)

395 But without that, Bush was left scrambling for a
post-hoc new justification. The one he came up with required a much,
much longer commitment to policing Iraq than any war supporters
contemplated before the war.
Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (8rNrN)

That first free election though, with all the happy Iraqis and their blue thumbs showing they had voted... That WAS bringing Democracy to Iraq. Mission Accomplished. Why are we still there today?

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (UBzPO)

396

Lamb is running as anti gun control. And pro tariffs.

How did this fraud get the D nomination??

Posted by: Soothie -- black diamond crew at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (0LDLp)

397 396 Lamb is running as anti gun control. And pro tariffs.

How did this fraud get the D nomination??
Posted by: Soothie -- black diamond crew at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (0LDLp)


Key word = "Fraud"

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (fTKv+)

398 >>>Also after the Israelis ( Thank You Israel) took out Saddam's Nuke program, he was left with mostly chemical and biological weapons. And while many fo them were destroyed, burned, or dumped in the rivers, they could have been reconstituted almost over night if Saddam and his crew had not been taken out. They had already shown a willingness to use them

Chemical weapons are a battlefield weapon of middling utility. Biologicals can be deployed as terrorist weapons, but they have a pretty small kill radius. See the anthrax attacks.

I personally would not go to full, total war over chemical and biological weapons. Strategic bombing operations can kill those weeds as they emerge.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (8rNrN)

399 "I haven't trusted Tillerson since he was instrumental in turning the BSA gay. Good riddance. "

Shit...I had forgotten about that.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (EyPfd)

400 I often wonder how different history would be if we'd have just packed up that day and left. Why did we need to stay another day?


Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:26 PM (UBzPO)


ISIS earlier?

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Protect Your Despair with Gloom Guard Polish & Sealer! Only at The Outrage Outlet! at March 13, 2018 01:36 PM (hLRSq)

401 a five month long bombing campaign in which every one of Saddam's palaces, Republican Guards barracks, tanks, aa batteries, and even transport trucks were demolished might well have delivered "closure" and also so weakened Saddam that an internal uprising might have toppled him.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (8rNrN)


What internal uprising? After the Kurds were gassed in the 90s, Saddam made a point of always keeping open the possibility that he had more WMDs stockpiled (that was part of the reason that our intel was so screwed up) and ensuring that no serious opposition could form to challenge him. Any uprising would need external support, either the US, Iran, or Turkey. But the US already had a bad reputation (from our abandonment of the Kurds), and letting Iran and Turkey carve up Iraq would have created more problems in the region.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 01:36 PM (Tnhbr)

402 Did Tillerson go to Penn State?

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:36 PM (NWiLs)

403 unfortunately, when we failed to find the WMDs
***
We found 100s of WMDs. Hussein didn't destroy his chemicals weapons like he had claimed.

This is all meticulously recorded in the various reports that came out in that era - this isn't controversial in the least its simple facts.

The left changed its tune in the same time frame from "Saddam doesn't have any WMDs" to "Saddam didn't have an active WMD program on the day we invaded". The latter is probably true but besides the point.

Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 01:36 PM (Z8FFX)

404 Did chemical weapons not count?

Whenever leftists shrieked that "Bush LIED!" about chemical weapons, I always replied, "Thousands of gassed Kurds could not be reached for comment..."
Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (ujg0T)

'Chemical Ali's' primary facility contained two tons of Sarin nerve agent. Two tons. A single particle of that stuff can kill a human being.

Posted by: troyriser at March 13, 2018 01:36 PM (K8f5g)

405 The same people who mock Christians for having faith in a God and many things that cannot be empirically proven, have total faith that RUSSIA AND TRUMP COLLUDED TO STEAL THE ELECTION FROM HILLARY, with no facts to support their beliefs. Go figure...

Religion exists in many different flavors.

Posted by: Gref at March 13, 2018 01:36 PM (AMIL/)

406 Bill Krystol gets excited when his wife leaves him at the house with his dog because he becomes the second smartest one in the house during that time.

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 01:36 PM (mk7Bj)

407 But without that, Bush was left scrambling for a post-hoc new justification. The one he came up with required a much, much longer commitment to policing Iraq than any war supporters contemplated before the war.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (8rNrN)

That's not exactly true, Ace. I remember in the lead up to war, planting seeds of democracy in the ME was a big part of the pre-war justification. I think it's even mentioned in the congressional resolution that started the Iraq war.

Posted by: Obama waving from Martha's Vineyard at March 13, 2018 01:36 PM (IAF9Q)

408 "Iran won the Iraq War and it didn't cost them but a few million dollars and some IEDs.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:27 PM (8rNrN)
"

Really? How so?

Their is no doubt they were involved. They still are and trying to increase their influence in the Shiite population. But I would never say they "won". We "won", or were "winning" until Obama prematurely pulled down or forces who were helping to setup the countries infrastructure. We are now reengaged after Trump took office and beating back the Iranian influence.
Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 01:34 PM (VpIIl)

I "Think" Ace means ( and I am not trying to talk for him) that Iraq was locked in a War for Influence ( and an actually war) with Iran thru-out the region for hegomony and "we" essentially handed that victory to them. As to who is to blame for that is another story

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:37 PM (5y11N)

409 unfortunately, when we failed to find the WMDs, Bush changed the whole point of the mission from "disarm Saddam" to "bring democracy to Iraq," and that latter mission would take 30 years and hundreds of thousands of US troops

Sigh. It was never just about WMD, it was about a long list of stuff, carefully and repeatedly told to the American people and UN for month after month. And yet, the press focused on WMD and convinced everyone -- even people who really damned well ought to know better -- that it was just that. All the myth making the left engaged in was so repeated, insistent, and effective now even the right is repeating it.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:37 PM (39g3+)

410 We won the Iraq war. Iran won the Iraq peace.

Bush didn't have a Marshall to sack shitloads of generals, and FDR didn't have a Rumsfeld to blow smoke up his ass about the troop requirements for an occupation.

Posted by: JEM at March 13, 2018 01:37 PM (qFQBL)

411 47
Morning Cult leader! What are our orders for today ?
Posted by: It's me donna

Assemble for worship in the Sonic Temple.
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr



https://youtu.be/x_3fCFLKiEM

Need a hymn?

Posted by: Puddleglum at March 13, 2018 01:37 PM (+Oyph)

412 358 a five month long bombing campaign in which every one of Saddam's palaces, Republican Guards barracks, tanks, aa batteries, and even transport trucks were demolished might well have delivered "closure" and also so weakened Saddam that an internal uprising might have toppled him.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (8rNrN)

On that I'd have to say unlikely. The guy was like a tick. Remember Bush the First didn't give the Kurds any help whatsoever and Saddam used his helicopters to wipe them out.

Maybe all of that plus a robust no fly zone plus arming the Kurds with heavy weapons might have done the trick. Maybe. But of course we couldn't do that because Turkey.

It would've taken a lot more effort to get an internal revolution going. Likely the need for "advisors" and we all know where that leads.

Even there if you're relying upon the Kurds, that still leaves the majority Shi'a population as a wild card. I doubt they'd just sit there while the Kurds take over the northern part of the country. And then you've got Iran getting involved again.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at March 13, 2018 01:37 PM (4ErVI)

413 352
Lamb +6 over Saccone.



That's gonna leave a mark.

Posted by: Poll Daddy at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (EfigE)

***
Wyll Binn - is that you?
Look - Lamb may win - but can we please not even look at exit polls? The most unreliable indicator of all.

Posted by: John Son of a Mailman Kasich at March 13, 2018 01:38 PM (Fb9aZ)

414 New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo's right hand man, Joseph Percocco has been convicted of wire fraud and soliciting a bribe.

Cuomo's presidential bid just went bye-bye.

Chris Cuomo is inconsolable.

Posted by: Adirondack Patriot at March 13, 2018 01:38 PM (ATVNj)

415 I recall before the WMD thing came up they wanted regime change.

Posted by: steevy at March 13, 2018 01:38 PM (LiyEm)

416 Tillerson went to U of Texas-Austin, I believe.

Posted by: Gref at March 13, 2018 01:39 PM (AMIL/)

417 Did chemical weapons not count?

Whenever leftists shrieked that "Bush LIED!" about chemical weapons, I always replied, "Thousands of gassed Kurds could not be reached for comment..."
Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:32 PM (ujg0T)


This.

Chemical weapons most certainly count, and Saddam most certainly had them.

Finding them could be tough. I read somewhere that he was estimated to have X tons (I've forgotten how many) of mustard gas (with which I am sadly very familiar, for reasons I won't go into). A quick calculation from the density of mustard gas (as a liquid) indicated that that quantity could easily be housed in a typical American bedroom.

Now all you have to do is find ONE bedroom in area the size of California.

And to realize that mustard gas is effective - and generally dispersed - as a vapor (VP at RT is ca. 1 mm Hg, more than enough to burn the crap out of you, as I can testify) or fine mist, not as bulk liquid.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:39 PM (vP84t)

418 124 So I'm to believe Trump didn't know about
Tillerson's positions before he nominated him to be SOS? I don't have a
problem with Trump's firings. I have a problem with his hirings. You
can't wing those .

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 12:57 PM (A4DFu)


Obviously. This is the thing though, when you aren't a nevertrumper, you can look at Trump with a critical eye, and say "well you know, all those happy days when he was nominating people, and they seemed like odd choices, but we were willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, turns out they were bad choices!"

Which is very different from saying Trump is always right or Trump is always wrong. Seems to me if someone is in either of those camps, they're not to be trusted. For now though, I'm willing to accept that when Trump corrects a mistake, that's a sign of good leadership.
Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:01 PM (9chmE)


I am seeing this a PDT task organizing his key players. I think Tillerson was a good choice to have on board for dealing with the Saudis, especially given his plan to recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital and move the embassy there.

I also see him staffing those positions not as rewards or to keep the next candidate in the wings and in the public eye. Looks to me that he wants his SoS to be the Head Ambassador.

A change of mission drives a change in personnel.

Posted by: Iron Mike Golf at March 13, 2018 01:39 PM (di1hb)

419 Strategic bombing operations can kill those weeds as they emerge.
Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM


Amen! Preach it, Brother!

Posted by: zombie Curtis LeMay at March 13, 2018 01:40 PM (ctuyM)

420 Kristol would look much improved with a judicious coating of hot tar embellished with some colorful plumage. He is a classy guy after all, just ask him.

Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:40 PM (o2MD2)

421 >>Torture works.


IIRC, waterboarding was used on only 2 or 3 enemy combatants, which is why critics always say how many times it was done. KSM was giving classes on AQ after being waterboarded. It sure worked on him.

The other funny thing is that Hollywood has depicted waterboarding a lot more times than it was used by Bush admin, and has almost certainly waterboarded more people since some of the actors who were in waterboarding scenes wanted to experience it to know what it really feels like (and have bragged about this in interviews).

Posted by: Lizzy at March 13, 2018 01:40 PM (W+vEI)

422 Chemical weapons are a battlefield weapon of middling utility. Biologicals can be deployed as terrorist weapons, but they have a pretty small kill radius. See the anthrax attacks.

I personally would not go to full, total war over chemical and biological weapons. Strategic bombing operations can kill those weeds as they emerge.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (8rNrN)



That's not true. Used properly they can cause massive civilian casualties. Putting them in a Cities Water Reservoir or dust cropper. Just because that has not been done YET, does not mean it can't or will not be. And that is why, for one, the US and the South Koreans are so worried about North Korea's WMD capabilities OUTSIDE of their nuclear threat

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:40 PM (5y11N)

423 >>>What internal uprising? After the Kurds were gassed in the 90s, Saddam made a point of always keeping open the possibility that he had more WMDs stockpiled (that was part of the reason that our intel was so screwed up) and ensuring that no serious opposition could form to challenge him. Any uprising would need external support, either the US, Iran, or Turkey.

To deploy WMDs you need planes or artillery. What I'm suggesting is denuding Saddam of all of that.

I read something about a Soviet export tank. Maybe the T-72. The article said the tank was pretty shit as a battle tank, BUT was a menacing and useful weapon to park in city square to quell an uprising.

Most of Saddam's tanks were of that type -- the type to intimidate barely-armed civilians, but would do jackshit against a bona fide mainline battle tank.

Stripped of all that, what's he got?

Even absent an internal uprising, regime survival would be his main concern.

The benefits of a cheap-hawk option (as Newt Gingrinch calls it) is that you keep other options open, other possible threats to other countries.

If we weren't tied down in Iraq -- if we were just bombing and cruise-missiling them at our convenience -- we could have said to Iran: The same is coming to you, if you don't stop.

We could not say that with 150,000 soldiers on the ground in Iraq and a daily bodycount report.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:40 PM (8rNrN)

424 Rex Tillerson had to be fired.

The Russian television network "RT" uses his initials. How did you dumb Trumpers miss that.

Ipso, facto, ergo sum.

Duh.

Posted by: Wolfe Blitzer at March 13, 2018 01:40 PM (ATVNj)

425 Bill Kristol watches the weather channel with closed captions

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:40 PM (UDDXv)

426 As was reported in this space a few days ago by your erstwhile reporter, the official plural of Prius is Prii.

In
a comment, Alberta Oil Peon exhibited the usual bigotry toward Prii
that Prii World has become accustomed to from the denizens of Alberta.


Posted by: Moron News YOU can use! at March 13, 2018 01:23 PM (ctuyM)

The plural of Prius is "shitboxes". There ya go. Enjoy.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (Dbv1R)

427 108 Pompeo coming out of the CIA knows all the secrets, including State Department secrets, and knows who the players are. Inspector General report coming out and naming names all across the federal bureaucracy.

Sounds like a reckoning to me.

Posted by: Skandia Recluse at March 13, 2018 12:59 PM (roQNm)

And Gina is re-opening the black site in Thailand. coincidence? Maybe. Maybe not...*





*Yes, I made that up. Let a guy dream, okay?

Posted by: joncelli, because somebody had to at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (RD7QR)

428 +6. From the Pole Smoker. Try to close to call numbnuts.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (gQmKR)

429 Nice song choice, I forgot about that song.

Posted by: CaliGirl at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (Ri/rl)

430 All the other screwups not withstanding, the world is a better place with Saddam, Usay, Cusay (Pig Latin names) and most of the rest of his crew burning in hell. Just as the world is a better place for getting rid of most of the worst of Hitler*s regime.

Posted by: Archer at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (gbWkA)

431 Let me take this opportunity to reiterate my fervent and undying commitment to hallucinogenic mushrooms.

Posted by: Bill Kristol at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (O5Q3r)

432 A change of mission drives a change in personnel.

Posted by: Iron Mike Golf at March 13, 2018 01:39 PM (di1hb)

>>>
Personnel is policy. Can't recall who first said that big gold nugget of wisdom.

Posted by: Gref at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (AMIL/)

433 What is a "Black site".?

It's where all the eggplants come from!

Posted by: Dennis Hopper at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (XkVXQ)

434 Bob Gates recommended Tillerson to the Trump team after Trump had beat the bushes (well, the Bushes too) looking for a SecState. Apparently he interviewed well.

As I think I said at the top of this thread, if you're going to be at odds with an underling, you either coerce/coopt them to conform (the Obama way) or sack them (the Trump way) but you do not keep them around to undermine you through malevolance or incompetence (the Bush 43 way).

Posted by: JEM at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (qFQBL)

435 Lamb is nothing more than the lefty bait and switch. All bullshit.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (gQmKR)

436 Volvo has a lot going for it with the new models, except a very fatal flaw, the center glass touch interface window. it is awkward, slow, dangerously distracting, and there aren't buttons or knobs for analog override of key user functions.

The interior is all the quiet, elegant, understated luxe I could hope for. That touch console puts it all the way out of the running, though.

The downscale xc for next year is a decent magic car for your daughter. Magic, in that maintenance and insurance are built into the subscription price, it's got ample safety features, a darling exterior, an acceptable interior, economy and practicality for a young single person. It's a little feminine, and I've taken to calling the new xc the "extra cute." ITs a nice little grocery shopper.


Posted by: SarahW, at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (Sp1NT)

437 unfortunately, when we failed to find the WMDs,

Actually, the Iraq War turned up more WMDs (and more important and strategic WMDs) than anyone had ever imagined. It's just that they weren't in Iraq. But it was the Iraq War, specifically, that caused Q'Daffy to shit his pants and puke up his entire nuke program, which then included our first good look into the vast AQ Khan network, which was the REAL WMDs (and far worse, globally, than anything that had even been alleged to possibly be in Iraq). And then Q'Daffy was neutralized (which was the only reason Barky was even able to un-Constitutionally launch his little personal war (on behlaf of the French fvcks) to topple Q'Daffy.

Bush changed the whole point of the mission from "disarm Saddam" to "bring democracy to Iraq," and that latter mission would take 30 years and hundreds of thousands of US troops.

If we had found the WMDs, we could have taken them and just left the country.

But without that, Bush was left scrambling for a post-hoc new justification. The one he came up with required a much, much longer commitment to policing Iraq than any war supporters contemplated before the war.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:29 PM (8rNrN)


I'm not so sure. Bush was always a globalist and always had an irrational desire to democratize the world. This started long before the search for WMDs in Iraq was under way. This started with Bush's methods of prosecuting the war after the absolute and historical trouncing we gave Iraq in the first couple of days.

I do agree that Bush was held off of doing anything with Iran (which was half the point of going into Iraq) because of the press and the left's screaming about absolutely anything ... but Bush was intent on globalization from the start and he was going to be the great Iraq Democratizer, no matter what. That's how I've always seen it.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (8gDQu)

438 Not sure what will happen in PA and Lamb may be a standup guy (doubtful) but voting for any Dem is just stupid in a reddish to red district. You are voting for Schiff and Pelosi in the end.

Posted by: rammajamma at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (AjNMO)

439 428 +6. From the Pole Smoker. Try to close to call numbnuts.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (gQmKR)



Sadly, if it is too close to call, the Demunists will have their illegal alien and dead people ballots on standby.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (ujg0T)

440 Imposing a true and lasting SOLUTION via war is a
very costly and lengthy endeavor, as we have learned at such a cost in
blood and treasure (and Iran's rise to become a power, with us unable
even to THREATEN them credibly).





Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:33 PM (8rNrN)


I don't think it was inevitable that Iraq would have turned out to be a bad decision. I think it was made into one after the fact, even if the reasons for going in the first place were less than ideal.

We only knew at the time what we did, so I'm not going to be too hard on myself for what I didn't know, which mostly has to do with the pitiful Republican Party.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (9chmE)

441 Refighting the Iraq War?

Let me know when we get back to refighting Vietnam like we were 14 years ago.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Protect Your Despair with Gloom Guard Polish & Sealer! Only at The Outrage Outlet! at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (hLRSq)

442 433 What is a "Black site".?
______________________________

Don't know. Never had it.

Posted by: Stevie Wonder at March 13, 2018 01:43 PM (MnkFD)

443 "Bill Kristol watches the weather channel with closed captions"

That explains why his lips move when he's watching TV.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 13, 2018 01:43 PM (EyPfd)

444 441 Refighting the Iraq War?

Let me know when we get back to refighting Vietnam like we were 14 years ago.
Posted by: Mikey NTH - Protect Your Despair with Gloom Guard Polish & Sealer! Only at The Outrage Outlet! at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (hLRSq)


We've been refighting the Civil War now for a few years.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:43 PM (fTKv+)

445 I've just totally lost my shit! Lost it, I tells ya!

Posted by: Billy Bob Kristol at March 13, 2018 01:43 PM (vtcmf)

446 "If we weren't tied down in Iraq -- if we were just bombing and cruise-missiling them at our convenience -- we could have said to Iran: The same is coming to you, if you don't stop.

Posted by: ace"


Worked in Libya. Until Obama, Hillary and Rhodes fucked it up.

Posted by: Benji Carver at March 13, 2018 01:43 PM (OD2ni)

447 In any case, State is a festering sore that needs cutting back desperately, along with intelligence. They've grown like cancers and are practically mini governments. State was running black ops under Hillary at least, independent of other departments in violation of the law. They went very badly because Hillary but they were still ongoing. Where do you think that whole "Arab Spring" crap came from? Almost no revolution succeeds without external help.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:43 PM (39g3+)

448 Blech - off GOPe Mailman sock

so - just read that the Rexxon firing was clearly NOT accomplished in a tweet - but was known by Rexxon in advance of the announcement

Who on earth at State would actually go out and say that the firing was done via tweet? What were they thinking? Fired . . . and deservedly so.

Posted by: Publius Redux at March 13, 2018 01:43 PM (Fb9aZ)

449 352 Lamb +6 over Saccone.

That's gonna leave a mark.
Posted by: Poll Daddy



Meh. The msm narrative is already been written. If Lamb wins it will be proof that Trump is in trouble and impeachment is coming!! If Saccone wins, you'll never hear about this again. It will be a un-story.

Posted by: Puddleglum at March 13, 2018 01:43 PM (+Oyph)

450 439 428 +6. From the Pole Smoker. Try to close to call numbnuts.
Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (gQmKR)


Sadly, if it is too close to call, the Demunists will have their illegal alien and dead people ballots on standby.
Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (ujg0T)


The PA supreme court's illegal jiggering of the election districts will also leave a mark.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (fTKv+)

451 All the other screwups not withstanding, the world is a better place with Saddam, Usay, Cusay (Pig Latin names) and most of the rest of his crew burning in hell. Just as the world is a better place for getting rid of most of the worst of Hitler*s regime.
Posted by: Archer

_________

Problem is, you could say that about most leaders and nations around the world.

We simply don't have the manpower or money to go around trying to make countries in our image. And the entire concept of doing much beyond our borders was pretty antithetical to everything our Founders were trying to create in our Republic.

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (lKmt3)

452 I tried to think of a 2nd car but couldn't. Priuses (Prisii?) would have fit the bill.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 12:51 PM (8rNrN)

The drivers of said car are Priusissies.

Posted by: clutch at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (ju1KL)

453 >>>Did chemical weapons not count?

I would say no, they do not count, not as far as justifying the costs we would have to bear for such a total war effort.

Would you launch a total war to get rid of a country's supply of ricin?

Look at the anthrax attacks. A very sophisticated advanced kind of anthrax, but they killed like three people and hospitalized ten.

I'm not saying you wouldn't have the moral justification to do it. I'm saying you don't have the justification as far as the costs you will incur vs the benefits you will reap.

When the number of soldiers who will die in a war exceeds by several orders of magnitude the number of civilians who MIGHT be killed by a chemical weapon -- is it really worth it, on a cost/benefit basis?

I mean, Syria obviously has chemical weapons and is using them periodically. Anyone game to send our troops into that pit of vipers and "patrol" it for ten or twelve or twenty years?


Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (8rNrN)

454 449: "The msm narrative has already been written".

Engrish Gramer are hard.

Posted by: Puddleglum at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (+Oyph)

455 Worked in Libya. Until Obama, Hillary and Rhodes fucked it up.

It worked in Libya until the left treacherously stabbed the military and US people in the back over and over with barbed poisoned blades destroying morale and building confidence and morale in our enemies, undermining our efforts and aiding the evil terrorist Muslim radical scum we were trying to fight. The Obama administration just made that official US policy, but it was going on since 2004.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (39g3+)

456 Dead-yes. Hardly any illegals in the district- yet.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (gQmKR)

457 My guess is Pompeo will be Prezzy one day, if not emperor

Posted by: REDACTED at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (VWsDy)

458 The PA supreme court's illegal jiggering of the election districts will also leave a mark.
Posted by: J.J. Sefton

________

Not sure if you mean in the future, but this election is the same district lines, it hasn't been changed yet.

Posted by: Maritime at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (lKmt3)

459 ...a five month long bombing campaign in which every one of Saddam's palaces, Republican Guards barracks, tanks, aa batteries, and even transport trucks were demolished might well have delivered "closure" and also so weakened Saddam that an internal uprising might have toppled him.



Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:30 PM (8rNrN)


---

brb listening to One Tin Soldier and sobbing

Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (ismre)

460 Walks back in, huffing , re Iraq: remember the Iraq liberation document Re 1998?

what precept after 9-11 was used?

Bush when did he know and when did he know it " trotted out.
Bush was in the position He allowed 9-11 he was imho going after any of those involved There was PLENTY of infor all gleaned from Clintons administration ( remember that) might have been all lies, ) still he had how many of Those left overs.

we can state Afghanistan was righteous Iraq maybe not so much.

But ALL intelligence at the time stated Iraq was funding terrorists.. Did that change?

only because the LEFT needed to find a Point to undermine Bush. They ( progressives/left/dems) had already had it in Print, they had to oust Saddam.

look we KNow NOW how corrupt everything is. But then was a different story.

I don't feel a bit of shame for supporting Bush over Gore or Kerry. I feel shame Bush has decided to undermine our chance Now at looking Through the looking glass.

and yeah neocon is a pejorative. You don't have to be only on Team Israel or a Jew to see our Ally. Or you don't have to be a jew to Be despicable or stupid. That moniker can be set on many americans as we see everyday!

it's really like setting one person up to be a scapegoat.

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (/ikqi)

461 >>We've been refighting the Civil War now for a few years.

Not so much refighting is listening to the occasional outbursts of the southern secessionists.

We should have dealt with them more harshly the first time so we wouldn't have to endure this traitorous blabbering.

Posted by: JackStraw at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (/tuJf)

462 Shouldn't forget that Saddam tried to assassinate a former President. That's a casus belli all by its lonesome.

Posted by: troyriser at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (K8f5g)

463 It was the war for states rights sir!
Old confederate

Posted by: Archer at March 13, 2018 01:46 PM (gbWkA)

464 Bill Kristol reads the instructions to his toaster. Every time.

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:46 PM (UDDXv)

465 WMDs?

You know what really scares me?





Stairs.

*hic*

Posted by: Hillary at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (MnkFD)

466 all of the terrorist attacks conducted with simple weapons -- pressure cooker bombs, knives, guns, bombs-- have killed far, FAR more people than the anthrax attacks, and more than the ebola outrbeak (which was not an attack, I know, but demonstrates that these bioweapons are not some kind of game-changer).

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (8rNrN)

467 Tillerson bothered me pretty early on, it was clear the guy had connections to Trump and two scoops apparently figured he'd be good on oil and had international ties, but the man's entire policy outlook was completely wrong. He was constantly at odds with what Trump was trying to do, and was pretty obviously a globalist right from the start. I'm glad to see him gone.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (39g3+)

468 Bloomberg TV has some lefty tool from the Brookings Institute giving dire warnings about Gina She-Wolf of the CIA

Posted by: TheQuietMan at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (OLCnA)

469 464 Bill Kristol reads the instructions to his toaster. Every time.
Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:46 PM (UDDXv)

He has enough bread to hire someone to do that for him.

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (NWiLs)

470 It worked in Libya until the left treacherously stabbed the military and US people in the back over and over with barbed poisoned blades destroying morale and building confidence and morale in our enemies, undermining our efforts and aiding the evil terrorist Muslim radical scum we were trying to fight. The Obama administration just made that official US policy, but it was going on since 2004.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:45 PM (39g3+)




As much of a shit as Quadaffy was, he had said "Uncle" after Saddam was toppled, had turned over his chemical weapons, and opened his country to Western Oil Companies again. We probably should have left him to his harem of female bodyguards.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (ujg0T)

471
Would you launch a total war to get rid of a country's supply of ricin?
***
If the country in question tried to assassinate our president? Was sheltering Al Qaeda leadership? Funding an Al Qaeda ally? Shooting at our planes? Attacking our religion allies?

Hell yeah.

President 18-1 would have leveled every major Iraqi city by B-52 after he found out Saddam had tried to assassinate his predecessor AFTER the end of Gulf War I.

Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (Z8FFX)

472 The War of 1812 was a just and proper war.

Posted by: John Adams at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (MnkFD)

473 I mean, Syria obviously has chemical weapons and is using them periodically. Anyone game to send our troops into that pit of vipers and "patrol" it for ten or twelve or twenty years?


Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (8rNrN)

The great thing about this situation is that because Barry was in charge, it suddenly became no big deal at all that someone was using chemical and biological weapons.

Remember in the 1990s it was the absolute end of the world if anyone even thought about using these types of weapons, anywhere in the world.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (4ErVI)

474 When the number of soldiers who will die in a war exceeds by several orders of magnitude the number of civilians who MIGHT be killed by a chemical weapon -- is it really worth it, on a cost/benefit basis?

???

I think you that is a misrepresentation of the potential threat to all, especially civilians, from the use of chemical and biological weapons.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:48 PM (5y11N)

475 Oh I forgot-- the damn TRUCK ATTACKS killed hundreds of people.

Just Trucks!!!!

Now, given that trucks are demonstrably a more deadly terrorist weapon than most chemical or biological agents -- does it really make sense to commit 150,000 troops and 15 years of loss of life of American sons to rid the world of meh weapons?

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:48 PM (8rNrN)

476 I might be mistaken but that Kristol fellow seems a pompous dick.

Posted by: Northernlurker but call me Teem. at March 13, 2018 01:48 PM (nBr1j)

477
Iraqi WMD?

Member of Washington National Guard 81st Brigade told me they guarded a yellowcake dump that contained material suitable for a dirty bomb.

Might be stuff left over from the reactor program the Israelis blew up. So precursor material, like swimming pool chlorine. All you need is the will ...

Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at March 13, 2018 01:48 PM (e1mEI)

478 Chemical weapons are a battlefield weapon of middling utility. Biologicals can be deployed as terrorist weapons, but they have a pretty small kill radius. See the anthrax attacks.

I personally would not go to full, total war over chemical and biological weapons. Strategic bombing operations can kill those weeds as they emerge.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:35 PM (8rNrN)


I would.

I think you underestimate the power of chemical and biological weapons. It's not a matter of casualties induced; it's the effect on contemporary society.

One vial of mustard gas - which can be made in a garage, easily - dropped into a passageway at the Super Bowl would make the entire country absolutely fucking freak out. Mustard gas causes horrific burns - unbelievable in appearance - with huge blisters that break and reform.

That one attack, with at most a few dozen casualties -
would be the staple of news coverage for WEEKS. We'd have TSA-type security for every public venue in America, guaranteed, with inestimable damage to the body politic.

THAT was the concern, the nightmare scenario. No need for the sophistication of nukes or biological weapons, the latter posing a huge threat to the maker as well. Nineteenth century chemistry would do very nicely.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:48 PM (vP84t)

479 Bill Kristol still collects POGs

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (UDDXv)

480 "To deploy WMDs you need planes or artillery. What I'm suggesting is denuding Saddam of all of that.



I read something about a Soviet export tank. Maybe the T-72. The
article said the tank was pretty shit as a battle tank, BUT was a
menacing and useful weapon to park in city square to quell an uprising.



Most of Saddam's tanks were of that type -- the type to intimidate
barely-armed civilians, but would do jackshit against a bona fide
mainline battle tank.



Stripped of all that, what's he got?



Even absent an internal uprising, regime survival would be his main concern.



The benefits of a cheap-hawk option (as Newt Gingrinch calls it) is
that you keep other options open, other possible threats to other
countries.



If we weren't tied down in Iraq -- if we were just bombing and
cruise-missiling them at our convenience -- we could have said to Iran:
The same is coming to you, if you don't stop.



We could not say that with 150,000 soldiers on the ground in Iraq and a daily bodycount report.





Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:40 PM (8rNrN)"Yes, because that strategy worked so well after the First Gulf War.Air power alone was never going to win in Iraq. Never.It's easy to sit back now and say ' yeah we should have just blown up all their shit and went to McDonald's afterward for a Big Mac.That completely avoids the reality and situational assessment at the time.The battle plan was crafted in a very specific way for a reason. It considered various types of direct action.We chose an invasion force because it would be most effective and enduring.



Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (VpIIl)

481 I think i'm finished. bl

Posted by: willow at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (/ikqi)

482 As much of a shit as Quadaffy was, he had said "Uncle" after Saddam was toppled, had turned over his chemical weapons, and opened his country to Western Oil Companies again. We probably should have left him to his harem of female bodyguards.

Lets put it this way: by toppling him, we give other dictators in the same situation zero reason to play along, and every reason to retain their awful weapons. Obama handled that as wrong as humanly possible.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (39g3+)

483 >>As much of a shit as Quadaffy was, he had said "Uncle" after Saddam was toppled, had turned over his chemical weapons, and opened his country to Western Oil Companies again. We probably should have left him to his harem of female bodyguards.

Another little detail that gets lost by those who said no good came from the Iraq War. I think trusting terrorists who have shown that they will use whatever means available to them with even the chance of a WMD is a big mistake.

Posted by: JackStraw at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (/tuJf)

484 what incentive do cops have to be wrong? Just to get a conviction? And let the real perp go free? Why would they do that?

Answer, mostly, they wouldn't.


This sounds right, but I think there are SOME situations where cops have a strong incentive to make something just go away.

1. Very small town, something bad happens, everyone in town knows everyone else and their dad and their grand-dad. A one-off situation happens (first murder in 30 years for example). There's a strong incentive to believe this was a drifter and not someone you've known since birth.

2. Something bad happens and you investigate to the best of your ability for ages. Everything points to one or two guys, but you just can't find the direct link you need. The case goes cold but the people involved and other concerned citizens are keeping political pressure on you to solve it. It's been months since you found even the tiniest scrap of evidence that moved the case forward. So finally, you fudge the last bit of info to arrest and convict the one or two guys you know are involved.

Not to say that I would, just that I get the mentality.

Posted by: bonhomme at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (iv0p7)

485 Bio weapons could be a game changer. If used by someone who understands their limitations and the specific environment they require. Remember that plague wiped out half of the world a couple of times when conditions were right.

Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (o2MD2)

486 "I mean, Syria obviously has chemical weapons and is using them periodically. Anyone game to send our troops into that pit of vipers and "patrol" it for ten or twelve or twenty years?


Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (8rNrN)"


[Raises Hand]. I get hard just thinking about it.

Posted by: Max Boot at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (OD2ni)

487 Holy shit?

Have I travelled back to 2008?

Posted by: Adirondack Patriot at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (MnkFD)

488
The PA supreme court's illegal jiggering of the election districts will also leave a mark.
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (fTKv+)


The PA Supremes redrew Lamb out of the district he's hoping to win today.

There is no possible way that's an accident.

It seems that not everyone in the PA Dem party is happy with little Mr. Up And Comer.

Posted by: alexthechick - Ragebunny. Hopping all around. at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (mf5HN)

489 468 Bloomberg TV has some lefty tool from the Brookings Institute giving dire warnings about Gina She-Wolf of the CIA
Posted by: TheQuietMan



So she's alright then. Good to know.

Posted by: Puddleglum at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (+Oyph)

490 I just can't figure out Kristol's game. Is he just playing to his lefty friends in hopes of getting that decrepit hippie poontang? What's his purpose here? I get that he despises President Trump, is a globalist, and hates Joos but what motivates him to be such an awkward c*nt all the time lately?

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (39g3+)

491 Member of Washington National Guard 81st Brigade told me they guarded a yellowcake dump that contained material suitable for a dirty bomb.
***
Yeah, that's also public knowledge that Saddam had a bunch of uranium sitting around.

The left argument that he hadn't used it to build a bomb yet (dirty or otherwise) so...it didn't matter apparently?

Also, Saddam had tried to get more uranium in the late 90s. This is what Joe Wilson IV was sent to investigate...and he found they had tried to buuy uranium from Niger. Niger asked France if they could sell it and France said no. So Iraq failed to get it...but not for lack of trying...

Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (Z8FFX)

492 472 The War of 1812 was a just and proper war.
Posted by: John Adams at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (MnkFD)
---------------------------------------
*sigh*
I guess you could say that James Madison chose Putin over the Brits.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (0jtPF)

493 I hear Putin is moving into the West Wing and bringing hookers and Russian blow which is like the caviar of blow. Or so I hear.

Posted by: Cannibal Bob at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (70cRb)

494 >>>
I think you underestimate the power of chemical and biological weapons. It's not a matter of casualties induced; it's the effect on contemporary society.

We're all livng with the very real threat of another rented/stolen truck attack that will kill dozens or even 100+ at any moment.

You're saying the prospect of a chemical weapon attack with a 300 foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow through the Festival of San Genero?

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (8rNrN)

495 by toppling him, we give other dictators in the same situation zero reason to play along, and every reason to retain their awful weapons. Obama handled that as wrong as humanly possible.
=========
So intentional or just incompetent?

Posted by: simplemind at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (jXdXg)

496 As much of a shit as Quadaffy was, he had said
"Uncle" after Saddam was toppled, had turned over his chemical weapons,
and opened his country to Western Oil Companies again. We probably
should have left him to his harem of female bodyguards.
Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (ujg0T)

IIRC Qaddafi cried uncle after we blew his fucking family up.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (UBzPO)

497 We probably should have left him to his harem of female bodyguards.
Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (ujg0T)


Hillary wanted Q-daffy dead so that she could have her "Saddam swinging from a rope" moment. When the Libyan uprising occurred we should have told him, "Get on your private jet and leave, and we'll allow you to take enough money to live comfortably on a private island for the rest of your life. As long as you stay out of Libyan politics."

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (Tnhbr)

498 An Iraqi cheesemaker one day
Made a most unusual play
Short on dairy he heard
Of a place filled with Kurds
And said where there's a will there's a whey!

Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (NWiLs)

499 Not for the squeamish: search for mustard gas burns.

https://tinyurl.com/yd27m3y7

Think the MSM would fart off those sorts of images?

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:52 PM (vP84t)

500 469 464 Bill Kristol reads the instructions to his toaster. Every time.
Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:46 PM (UDDXv)

He has enough bread to hire someone to do that for him.
Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (NWiLs)

He's been wondering why his coffee make produces only hot water.

Posted by: Northernlurker but call me Teem. at March 13, 2018 01:52 PM (nBr1j)

501 If Bill Krystal runs for president I may actually volunteer at one of his campaign offices for the lulz.

And to ask him one or two fun questions.

Posted by: What's a Seawolf? at March 13, 2018 01:52 PM (WuRdh)

502 Bill Kristol reads the instructions to his toaster. Every time.

He thinks that at some point the toaster will understand and comply.

Posted by: Blanco Basura - It's OK, I'm with the banned at March 13, 2018 01:52 PM (IZPn8)

503 Marcus T,

And Iran's free hand in the meantime?

While we were grappling with Iraq on the floor, we could not also cock back our fist and threaten Iran, let alone actually hit it.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:53 PM (8rNrN)

504 ""I mean, Syria obviously has chemical weapons and is using them
periodically. Anyone game to send our troops into that pit of vipers and
"patrol" it for ten or twelve or twenty years?


Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (8rNrN)"
"

Do you actually believe that Iraq circa the beginning of the Second Gulf War and Syria today are analogous?

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 01:53 PM (VpIIl)

505 Bob Gates recommended Tillerson to the Trump team after Trump had beat the bushes (well, the Bushes too) looking for a SecState. Apparently he interviewed well.

---

That sounds a bit like Reagan's ultimate selection of George H.W. Bush as VP, which seemed politically acceptable at the time. It was only years later that the error became apparent. It made me a little squeamish, but I was/am a nobody. I had the same problem with George W. but the alternative was worse, and you have to make things work. They don't just work out by themselves.

Posted by: Skandia Recluse at March 13, 2018 01:53 PM (roQNm)

506 Bill Kristol thinks Chip-Oh-Latte is a burrito restaurant

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:53 PM (UDDXv)

507 As much of a shit as Quadaffy was, he had said "Uncle" after Saddam was toppled, had turned over his chemical weapons, and opened his country to Western Oil Companies again. We probably should have left him to his harem of female bodyguards.

Lets put it this way: by toppling him, we give other dictators in the same situation zero reason to play along, and every reason to retain their awful weapons. Obama handled that as wrong as humanly possible.
-------------------------------

Which is of course the story of Obama's entire political career as regards the USA. He hates us, he really hates us. However, given that Ghadiffay was behind the bombing of the Pan Am Flight that crashed into Lockerbie, Scotland, killing all on board and about a dozen people on the ground, double dealing on him in particular didn't bother me.

Posted by: Boots at March 13, 2018 01:53 PM (EBwPV)

508 85 Bio weapons could be a game changer. If used by someone who understands their limitations and the specific environment they require. Remember that plague wiped out half of the world a couple of times when conditions were right.
Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (o2MD2)

Tell me about it!

Posted by: Col. Robert Neville at March 13, 2018 01:53 PM (gbWkA)

509 494
You're saying the prospect of a chemical weapon attack with a 300 foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow through the Festival of San Genero?

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (8rNrN)


I will not discuss them here, but I can think of several things that can be done without WMD that could kill dozens if not hundreds of people.

WMD should never be poo-poo'd but things need to be put into perspective. Just like shootings, it's not the weapon; it's the mindset and what motivated the killer.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (fTKv+)

510 It is hard to believe how badly the Obama administration handled foreign policy. I get that he had zero interest in it or understanding of the world. I get that he hired incompetents for every damned position because they were loyal leftist zealots. I get that he picked leadership for every agency that was an academic twit.

But its like they worked as hard as possible gaming out the worst possible choices for not just the USA but the world at large and tried to implement them instead. Its impossible this was by accident, you don't choose wrong every damned time as wrong as can be, by mistake.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (39g3+)

511 485 Bio weapons could be a game changer. If used by someone who understands their limitations and the specific environment they require. Remember that plague wiped out half of the world a couple of times when conditions were right.
Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM (o2MD2)


The problem is controlling them, as biological weapons can generally propagate, so once released, God knows where they go. Think "kudzu."

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (vP84t)

512 493 I hear Putin is moving into the West Wing and bringing hookers and Russian blow which is like the caviar of blow. Or so I hear.
Posted by: Cannibal Bob



And small Giraffes? Don't forget those.

Posted by: Puddleglum at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (+Oyph)

513 "Bill Kristol reads the instructions to his toaster. Every time."


The Paolo is, how you say, very fond of Mrs. Kristol.

Posted by: Paolo at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (OD2ni)

514 492 472 The War of 1812 was a just and proper war.
Posted by: John Adams at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (MnkFD)
---------------------------------------
*sigh*
I guess you could say that James Madison chose Putin over the Brits.
_____________________________________

I have lithographs of my relationship with Mr. Adams has a perverse habit of pouring tea all over my ladies in waiting.

I have forwarded these lithographs to my brother Jack in Lynchburg, Tennessee.

Posted by: Dutchess Stormy of the House of Daniels at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (MnkFD)

515 486 "I mean, Syria obviously has chemical weapons and is using them periodically. Anyone game to send our troops into that pit of vipers and "patrol" it for ten or twelve or twenty years?

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (8rNrN)"




Even if he has turned out to be an Affirmative Action shill, Colin Powell did have a good quip about wars like this: "You break it, you buy it..."

The sad truth is that in most of these countries, the best we can do is topple the anti-American son of a bitch and put in a pro-American son of a bitch.

"nation-building", i.e., making the place a representative government and an outpost of Americana, is a long and difficult task, and we Americans like our wars like we like our food: fast, tasty, but not too spicy.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (ujg0T)

516 476 I might be mistaken but that Kristol fellow seems a pompous dick.
Posted by: Northernlurker but call me Teem. at March 13, 2018 01:48 PM (nBr1j)


He's creeping into kookoo bananaland.

Posted by: eleven at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (+lOpA)

517
The plural of Prius is "shitboxes". There ya go. Enjoy.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 13, 2018 01:41 PM (Dbv1R)







I thought it was "smugmobiles".

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (eXA4G)

518 Would the universe implode if Kristol and other neverTrumpers wrote about something other than Trump bad.

Posted by: Northernlurker but call me Teem. at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (nBr1j)

519 Bill Krystol's favorite tv channel used to be Nickelodeon. It still is, actually, but it used to be also.

Posted by: Joe, living mobile at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (mk7Bj)

520 Mustard gas is no more devastating than a couple pressure cooker bomb loaded with shrapnel.

The truck attack in german killed more people than any plausible mustard gas attack could have.

I'm not saying these are not dangerous weapons. I'm saying that when you look at the constellation of threats and put them into context... they're just not of such ferocious threat that we should launch total wars.

Bombing campaigns? Sure.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (8rNrN)

521 You're saying the prospect of a chemical weapon attack with a 300 foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow through the Festival of San Genero?

Yes, because chemical weapons are terror weapons, they are not so much about their combat effectiveness as their impact on morale and how they unnerve people.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (39g3+)

522 Let me take this opportunity to reiterate my fervent and undying commitment that Billy Kristol Meth suck this bag of dicks.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (Dn4Uq)

523 "I mean, Syria obviously has chemical weapons and is using them
periodically. Anyone game to send our troops into that pit of vipers and
"patrol" it for ten or twelve or twenty years?
***
Syria isn't Iraq.

And we already entered Syria...McCain and Obama created ISIS remember?

I probably would have traded funding and weapons to Assad for freeing his political prisoners and his WMDs...but the US government at the time thought working with ISIS was a better idea...

Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (Z8FFX)

524 You're saying the prospect of a chemical weapon attack with a 300 foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow through the Festival of San Genero?

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (8rNrN)

???
300 foot harm radius?

Ever wonder what a biological agent dumped in the NYC Water Supply would do? It's a hell of a lot larger than a 300 foot kill radius?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (5y11N)

525 You're saying the prospect of a chemical weapon
attack with a 300 foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological
impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow
through the Festival of San Genero?
Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (8rNrN)

The idea of a chemical weapons attack was more plausible back then than a jihadi just driving a truck through a crowd. Times have changed.

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (UBzPO)

526 Bill Kristol still collects POGs
Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:49 PM


Is that wrong? Should I not do that? If I knew that that sort of thing was frowned upon ...

Posted by: George C. at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (ctuyM)

527 While we were grappling with Iraq on the floor, we could not also cock back our fist and threaten Iran, let alone actually hit it.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:53 PM (8rNrN)


We couldn't do that anyways. Every time Saddam fired up his tanks for an exercise we had to focus on him. And extended bombing campaigns require a heck of a lot of equipment and personnel, which means we can't use them elsewhere. Removing Saddam actually helped our position with Iran, because we could always threaten to turn those 100,000 troops west towards Tehran. At worst, it means clearing out a few Iraqi cities of insurgents later.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (Tnhbr)

528
Not sure what will happen in PA and Lamb may be a standup guy (doubtful) but voting for any Dem is just stupid in a reddish to red district. You are voting for Schiff and Pelosi in the end.


Posted by: rammajamma at March 13, 2018 01:42 PM (AjNMO)


He may well be a stand up guy but he'll have no allies in the democratic congress and he'll be forced to toe the line with Pelosi if he wants a few of her crumbs

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (lKyWE)

529 I gotta get back to work. Later guys!

Posted by: Nationalist Pikachu at March 13, 2018 01:56 PM (UDDXv)

530 Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:47 PM (39g3+)

Marching Orders in any Hierarchical Organization

(I) One person sets policy.
(II)) That person is not you.
(III) If there is any confusion, see (I), supra.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Protect Your Despair with Gloom Guard Polish & Sealer! Only at The Outrage Outlet! at March 13, 2018 01:56 PM (hLRSq)

531 >>You're saying the prospect of a chemical weapon attack with a 300 foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow through the Festival of San Genero?

I'm old enough to remember when a bunch of envelopes containing anthrax had this country on edge for months.

We now see jihadis running down people in NYC and then check the scores of the latest sports ball game.

Posted by: JackStraw at March 13, 2018 01:56 PM (/tuJf)

532
Yes, because chemical weapons are terror weapons, they are not so much about their combat effectiveness as their impact on morale and how they unnerve people.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (39g3+)







This.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at March 13, 2018 01:56 PM (eXA4G)

533 Posted by: Insomniac - Nowhere Man at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (NWiLs)



Nice!

Posted by: SSBN 656 (G) at March 13, 2018 01:56 PM (jjaLl)

534 Dana Perino looks Concerned. Fox really needs to find someone else.

Posted by: Huck Follywood, anti-weather at March 13, 2018 01:57 PM (rBnYq)

535 I still say we should at least try the Roman approach on annoying enemies: show up, pound them into the stone age without regard to life or property, then leave while the dust is still clearing with a warning: don't piss us off or we'll be back.

Let them rebuild their own damned wasteland.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:57 PM (39g3+)

536 "Neocon" was the Bush era equivalent of "alt-right" a catch-all term used as a dismissive insult by people who aren't really sure what it means

Posted by: Biggs Darklighter at March 13, 2018 01:57 PM (h/dV9)

537 529 I gotta get back to work. Later guys!

You're welcome.

Posted by: The Trump Economy at March 13, 2018 01:57 PM (MnkFD)

538
Saddam Hussein was akin to Moammar Qaddafi in that Qaddafi saw what we did to Hussein and so gave up his WMD so we would let him alone. Then again, that was after we destroyed Iraq.

Iran was the regime that should've been dealt with. And we could have done a lot to topple it without even invading the country. And we still can.

Anyway, other fish to fry.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:57 PM (fTKv+)

539 What movie was the line "people scare a lot easier when they're dying" from?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (fTKv+)

540 "Marcus T,


And Iran's free hand in the meantime?


While we were grappling with Iraq on the floor, we could not also
cock back our fist and threaten Iran, let alone actually hit it.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:53 PM (8rNrN)
"

After some time we were flaming the Iranians who were crossing into Iraq to train and support the shitheads. Some deliberately, some not so because they just happened to be with the OPFOR. Nobody cared about that until Obama came along.

State's main concern was to try and contain the Iranian nuclear program. They were comfortable leaving that to the international community. Not that I supported that.

I don't know what else we could have done, or accomplished for that matter by expanding the war into Iran. But I would disagree we gave them a "free hand".

Posted by: Marcus T at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (VpIIl)

541 CNN and MSNBC are hysterical over the tillerson firing LOL

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (5y11N)

542 You know who else was a gas casualty during war?

Posted by: Archer at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (gbWkA)

543
Bill Kristol still collects POGs


He has an impressive Barbie Doll collection too.

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (lKyWE)

544 I still say we should at least try the Roman approach on annoying enemies: show up, pound them into the stone age without regard to life or property,
***
The Romans would usually find a friendly local leader, leave his troops/holdings alone - but kill everyone else they could.

The local guy would have a big advantage at that point...and would have on his mind what the legions had done to the people Rome didn't like...

Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (Z8FFX)

545 494 >>>
I think you underestimate the power of chemical and biological weapons. It's not a matter of casualties induced; it's the effect on contemporary society.

We're all livng with the very real threat of another rented/stolen truck attack that will kill dozens or even 100+ at any moment.

You're saying the prospect of a chemical weapon attack with a 300 foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow through the Festival of San Genero?

Posted by: ace


Has anyone else noticed that the frewuency and intensity of jihadist attacks has dropped of significantly sicne Trump was elected?

I don't have a link to any stats to back this up, just an impression, but I can't really think of ANY major jihad terror attacks in the Trump era, as opposed to dozens of them during Obama's reign and dozens during the Bush/Iraq War era.

Short version: They're afraid of Trump.

Posted by: zombie at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (42M22)

546 That sounds a bit like Reagan's ultimate selection of George H.W. Bush as VP, which seemed politically acceptable at the time. It was only years later that the error became apparent.

------------

I'm not sure how you can label it an error. What we know is this. The wall came down during Bush's tenure. Obviously, Reagan should get the credit on that. But the great enemy of our time - for those born before 1980 was defeated by Reagan / Bush. How this would have played out with someone else, we simply cannot know.

Posted by: SH at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (sX1BW)

547 541
CNN and MSNBC are hysterical over the tillerson firing LOL
Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (5y11N)

So just an average Tuesday?

Posted by: Brian in New Orleans at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (UBzPO)

548 Nood Hillary.

Posted by: The Trump Economy at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (MnkFD)

549 "541 CNN and MSNBC are hysterical over the tillerson firing LOL"

Confirms it was the right thing to do.

Posted by: maddogg at March 13, 2018 02:00 PM (o2MD2)

550 Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:44 PM (8rNrN)

Would it have been a good idea for Clinton to have invaded Afghanistan prior to 9/11 to get Osama since the Taliban refused to give him up?

No one can say what Saddam would have done if we had not invaded. Everyone can say what Saddam can do now.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 02:00 PM (A4DFu)

551 nood hillary !

Posted by: sock_rat_eez - help us, pixy misa, you're our only hope! at March 13, 2018 02:00 PM (e11dj)

552
548 Nood Hillary.
Posted by: The Trump Economy at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (MnkFD)


P H R A S I N G !!!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 13, 2018 02:00 PM (fTKv+)

553 [i 494
You're saying the prospect of a chemical weapon attack with a 300 foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow through the Festival of San Genero?

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 01:51 PM (8rNrN)

No. I'm saying that a chemical weapon attack with a THREE foot harm radius has a more devastating psychological impact than the prospect that a jihadi will just rent a truck and plow through the Festival of San Genero.

Why? Because laymen understand trucks. They don't understand anything - anything at all - about chemistry (or physics, for that matter). It's magic. It's bad juju. It's spooky, possums. So they're terrified about these things, because they don't understand them.

Cases in point: how many idiots think magnets have magical properties in healing disease? Or copper bracelets do jack shit? Or freak when they hear about "radiation," not realizing that includes visible light? Or worry about "toxins" that they cannot name? Or freak out generally about the toxicity of unnamed "chemicals" to such an extent that they need to have a smoke just to calm down?

People are terrified by things that they think pose a threat and that they do not understand. Ban dihydrogen monoxide!

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 02:00 PM (vP84t)

554 Bill Kristol still collects POGs



He has an impressive Barbie Doll collection too.


Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM
----------------

You say that like it's a bad thing...

Posted by: Bill Kristol at March 13, 2018 02:01 PM (t41dG)

555 Hamas! Hezbollah! Saddam! Iran! ISIS! Electric Light Orchestra!

Always some villain on the verge of world domination for us to endlessly fight.

Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 02:01 PM (ismre)

556
Yes, because chemical weapons are terror weapons, they are not so much about their combat effectiveness as their impact on morale and how they unnerve people.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (39g3+)


They are really an area denial weapon meant to be used on a large scale

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 02:01 PM (lKyWE)

557 Posted by: zombie at March 13, 2018 01:59 PM (42M22)

Attacks where?

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 02:01 PM (A4DFu)

558 Let's look at a major chemical attack -- the Sarin Subway attack in Japan 1995 carried out by a cult.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokyo_subway_sarin_attack

The attack was deployed in the perfect location -- a subway system with limited airflow interchange with the outside.

The results of this major attack? 12 dead, 50 hospitalized, 5000 people with *temporary* vision problems.

And by temporary I assume this means serious irritation from which they later recovered from fully. "Temporary" doesn't usually mean "with permanent damage."

Now, was that something someone should just blow off?

No of course not. But compare that to the carnage of just one of the truck attacks that KILLED one hundred plus in germany.

and that didn't cost anything -- the guy didn't even rent the truck. He just shot the truck's owner and took it.

Yes these attacks are bad. But when you compare them to a pressure cooker bomb (total cost: let's say $200) or a truck attack (total cost: $50 for the rental, or $0 for the theft), I just don't see how these are in the same category as nuclear weapons.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 02:01 PM (8rNrN)

559 Rome also turned a lot of territories into Roman provinces, so they were hardly isolationist.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 13, 2018 02:02 PM (Tnhbr)

560 Still fighting the devolutionary war, boss.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at March 13, 2018 02:02 PM (IqV8l)

561 Nood.

Old drunk can't walk steps...

Posted by: Yudhishthira's Dice at March 13, 2018 02:02 PM (AzW6q)

562 520 - After Iraq and Afghanistan I decided we should have a "King of the Hill" type of doctrine. That is my term but basically means if your the government of a country that screws with us, you will no longer be the government of said country. We wont rebuild, we wont stabilize or train troops that might shoot us in the back, we won't even occupy you. The next guy that runs your country has his chance and he will get the same if it happens again.

Of course this philosophy is full of holes, but not one is likely to come up with a plan that "fixes" this screwed up world. At least this way, if you mess with us, we fight back. And people we try to give a better life wont back shoot us.

Posted by: Quint at March 13, 2018 02:02 PM (n13/j)

563 They are really an area denial weapon meant to be used on a large scale
Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at March 13, 2018 02:01 PM (lKyWE)


That's in combat. In terrorism, they're intended to ... strike terror into the population. And they'd do so very effectively.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 02:02 PM (vP84t)

564 Fuck it. We've had this argument before.

I say we take off and nuke'm from orbit. It's the only way to be sure they don't follow us.

Posted by: Skandia Recluse at March 13, 2018 02:03 PM (roQNm)

565 Would it have been a good idea for Clinton to have invaded Afghanistan prior to 9/11 to get Osama since the Taliban refused to give him up?
***
The Sudan offered him Osama for some petty cash. Clinton refused because he didn't know what to do with Osama had the CIA formally taken him from the Sudan.

Had he done so and had Osama black sited somewhere there would have been no 9/11...

Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 02:03 PM (Z8FFX)

566 >>>539 What movie was the line "people scare a lot easier when they're dying" from?


I don't know, but what movie was this from: Hero says about a villain, to his ally, "Don't worry, I'll just scare him."

He then throws him off a building.

The ally said "I thought you said you were gonna scare him."

Hero says: "Didn't he look scared to you?"

I know I saw that. Schwarzenegger? I don't think so.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 02:04 PM (8rNrN)

567 yeah, we had sorta won Iraq, though not sure what the peace would have looked like if we didn't get Obama surrendering everything.

Libya was OK with Gadhafi, so Hillary/Cameron/Soros did regime change. Egypt maybe needed some change, but not Muslim Brotherhood Morsi ...

Hard to say what Bush had in mind at first, some say making up for his Daddy not finishing the job (whether staying out of Baghdad first time was right idk).

But Trump got the Saudis to maybe decide to get rid of their own terror elements, and there seems some degree of unity with them and Israel, Egypt, Jordan. ...

The green revolution ... still alive I guess, maybe that is after North/South Korea declare peace. Maybe Iran stands down after the Norks ... their society might be easier to work with than Iraq or Syria, if we can get madman Khomeini neutralized.

Peace in our Time ... hurray. Trump for Emperor ... heh.

Posted by: illiniwek at March 13, 2018 02:04 PM (bT8Z4)

568 I don't have time to go into the whole thing but I think there are some issues that need straightening out, here.

It isn't about particular weapons. It's about enemies and threats. The Iraq War had to happen because it was the easiest and cleanest of the three types of threats the Arab/Persian/Muslim world posed against us. The three were the Sunni, the Shiite, and the Secular threat. Iraq was the leader of the secular threat from the APM world, and, as such, was the easiest to deal with - not to mention one of the most important and the one that was technically at war with us at that very moment (having broken all of the cease-fire restrictions from the first Iraq War).

Further, their hussein had already proven that he was far too dangerous to something that we, and the rest of the civilized world, depended on - which was oil. Oil is the lifeblood of the modern world. It is that important. It's not so important for the APM world, since they don't really make or do anything but war, but for the rest of us life depends on it. ANd back in the First Gulf War, when Saddam was being allowed to actually retreat, in the most humiliating loss in military history, he lit just about every oil well in Kuwait on fire and intentionally dumped tens of millions of BARRELS of oil into the gulf. At that point, any reasonable person would have understood that such a nihilistic asshole could not be allowed to remain in control of one of the world's most strategically important areas and resources. He would be very happy to destroy all the oil (so much as he was able) to "win" against us. He had to be taken out. HAD TO. And after 9/11 it was clear to everyone that that hussein was well above our threat threshold.

Where Bush screwed up was in not prosecuting the war as a war. That's why it took so long. We had no interest in anything in Iraq beyond making sure they were neutered of all serious weaponry and taking the oil fields, because they couldn't be trusted with them. As to the Iraqis, fvck them. We bore no responsibility for anything with regards to them. We were not responsible for them making such threats of themselves. We needed to destroy that hussein and his military (which we did in the first couple of days) and then take the oil fields, call it a day, and work on neutering Iran. That was the mission, not the bullshit Bush was into that took years and years at a huge cost and delivered pretty much nothing.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 13, 2018 02:04 PM (8gDQu)

569 The problem is controlling them, as biological
weapons can generally propagate, so once released, God knows where they
go. Think "kudzu."

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 01:54 PM (vP84t)

Of course, that's a feature, not a bug, to those who would release such agents.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 13, 2018 02:05 PM (Dbv1R)

570 555 Hamas! Hezbollah! Saddam! Iran! ISIS! Electric Light Orchestra!

Always some villain on the verge of world domination for us to endlessly fight.
Posted by: Mr. Wednesday Night at March 13, 2018 02:01 PM (ismre)



That's because in truth, there always is.

Killing Hitler with Soviets meant....Soviets to fight.

Playing "The China Card" against the Soviets meant....a future adversary in China.

Using mujahadeen against Soviets also meant....those people getting more powerful.

History does not end. Nor will it ever.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 13, 2018 02:05 PM (ujg0T)

571 Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 02:03 PM (Z8FFX)

That's my point. You have to take preemptive actions sometimes. Unfortunately you can't prove to critics that your successful preemptive actions worked and were necessary.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at March 13, 2018 02:05 PM (A4DFu)

572 I just can't figure out Kristol's game. Is he just
playing to his lefty friends in hopes of getting that decrepit hippie
poontang? What's his purpose here? I get that he despises President
Trump, is a globalist, and hates Joos but what motivates him to be such
an awkward c*nt all the time lately?

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 01:50 PM (39g3+)

He's from the elitist wing of the GOP, I'm from the Attila wing. Thats how I always saw those types. We are a threat to the decorum of their little bubble of elitism.

Posted by: Berserker-Dragonheads Divison at March 13, 2018 02:06 PM (aMlLZ)

573 Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 02:01 PM (8rNrN)

That was Japan. I expect that the Japanese media were probably responsible in their reporting. (Notice how little coverage was given to the hanging of those responsible for the attack.)

Here the MSM would go batshit crazy over any such attack.

I say again: look at the photos of just simple mustard gas burns to which I linked above.

Think those might have made their way into news coverage here following a mustard gas attack? Never mind nerve gas, or biological weapons.

PEOPLE. WOULD. FREAK.

It's not the number of casualties. We're not that rational. One glance at those photos and soccer moms in particular would lead the charge to hysteria. You know this is true. And then the terrorists would have achieved their purpose.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 02:06 PM (vP84t)

574 Dana Perino looks Concerned.

In the past, an unstable administration with lots of firing was cause for concern: chaos at the top, the oval office out of control!!!

But I completely expected this. Trump is not a man with a lot of patience with incompetence or inability to do what they're told (another reason to watch Sessions and not mock him). I also remember the turmoil in the Trump campaign as he kept hiring and firing people, and look how that turned out. This isn't any cause for concern, its a good thing. He isn't stupidly over loyal to people like Bush or stupidly overconfident in his perfection of choices like Obama. If you will not or cannot do the job, then out the door you go.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 02:06 PM (39g3+)

575 Tillerson presser....

Posted by: SSBN 656 (G) at March 13, 2018 02:07 PM (jjaLl)

576 Not sure what will happen in PA and Lamb may be a standup guy (doubtful) but voting for any Dem is just stupid in a reddish to red district. You are voting for Schiff and Pelosi in the end.
-----
It is a Majority DUMocRAT dist. I am in that Dist. it voted for Trump by 20 Points but they are Reagan Rep.

Posted by: DeploraBOT at March 13, 2018 02:07 PM (y3aQB)

577 George Patton gave a speech after WWII, maybe in St Louis, to schoolchildren.

He said: "You will be the soldiers and nurses of the next war. Because there will be a next war. There always is."

He got grief for that and people were pissed at him for saying that. We had just finished WWII, and wanted peace, and now this guy is telling schoolchildren they will be the infantry and nurses in the next war.

But... he was right.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 02:08 PM (8rNrN)

578 aren't MSNBC and CNN always hysterical?

Posted by: Quint at March 13, 2018 02:08 PM (n13/j)

579 578 aren't MSNBC and CNN always hysterical?
Posted by: Quint at March 13, 2018 02:08 PM (n13/j)


Absolutely.

But they generally are not in resonance with the populace at large.

After a chemical or biological attack, they would be.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 02:09 PM (vP84t)

580 It's not the number of casualties. We're not that rational. One glance at those photos and soccer moms in particular would lead the charge to hysteria.

Well you can put up bollards to stop a truck or dodge the giant speeding vehicle. But you cannot sense or do anything about chemical attacks until its too late. And its like the difference between dying from a flamethrower or a rifle bullet. Both are equally dead, and nobody wants to get shot, but some deaths are more awful to contemplate than others.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 02:10 PM (39g3+)

581 or wait: Was that Churchill?

Either Patton or Churchill.

Posted by: ace at March 13, 2018 02:11 PM (8rNrN)

582 18
We are seeking Legal Counsel into the possibility of Charging President Trump with Conspiracy to Obstruct Foreign Policy...



Clearly an Impeachable offense.

Posted by: Mueller and Rosenstein... at March 13, 2018 12:48 PM (NgKpN)


comments like THIS are why I come back here again and again.
It would take a week for anyone at CNN to grasp the levels of humor and irony here. Intelligent humor like this is repeated dozens of times with each new topic.

What a great time to be alive!

Posted by: LeftCoast Dawg at March 13, 2018 02:11 PM (UsCnO)

583 Well you can put up bollards to stop a truck or dodge the giant speeding vehicle.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 02:10 PM (39g3+)


You can't put them up along all the sidewalks in every single major city. That would be totally unlivable. To be free we have to live with certain risks. That is the price and that is why defense against these types of attacks can only be affectuated by attacking the people, countries and leadership of those arrayed against us and their supporters - and by not importing muzzies, of course.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 13, 2018 02:14 PM (8gDQu)

584 but the conclusion remains ever fixed and immutable like Magnetic North.

----


Uh...

Posted by: Periodic Geomagnetic Pole Reversal at March 13, 2018 02:14 PM (eqQL8)

585 you keep comparing real conspiracies to fake ones bro

Posted by: dw at March 13, 2018 02:14 PM (X8FSN)

586 But you cannot sense or do anything about chemical attacks until its too late. And its like the difference between dying from a flamethrower or a rifle bullet. Both are equally dead, and nobody wants to get shot, but some deaths are more awful to contemplate than others.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 13, 2018 02:10 PM (39g3+)


Yep. There's that, but also the spooky factor. We understand trucks, flamethrowers, rifle bullets, and accept their consequences. That's not true of chemical weapons. Just the threat of exposure to a chemical compound makes people don hazmat suits regardless of how innocuous the compound may be. Why? Because people don't know whether it's hazardous or not.

A friend in grad school placed a radiation trefoil on the door of van (probably illegally) as a semi-jocular way of discouraging traffic cops / thieves from approaching his van.

It worked. (Kinda kidding here, but kinda not. How many people would walk right up to a van with a radiation trefoil on the door?)

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 13, 2018 02:15 PM (vP84t)

587 506 Bill Kristol thinks Chip-Oh-Latte is a burrito restaurant

Buddy of mine works at a mainframe installation on a machine built using chip-on-latte technology.

Posted by: Anachronda at March 13, 2018 02:16 PM (v3pYe)

588 aside from the clinton crime family's unofficial body count, don't forget bubba executed that mentally deficient kid to be tough on crime, so why would hillary put quadafy on the firing line for her ambitions

Posted by: Clarence at March 13, 2018 02:19 PM (V3U1L)

589 > black-sites matter

ALL SITES MATTER!

Posted by: Guy who didn't really bother reading the post at March 13, 2018 02:30 PM (x/4YR)

590 FWIW, QAnon said there were 3 cabinet members that were not on our side. Cohn Tillerson ???

Posted by: oddnot likes No Deals at March 13, 2018 02:33 PM (g1MTt)

591 The ONLY way to experience Trump is to just 'let it be'. Or in another way of saying it. 'Don't Worry ; Be happy'.
If you support Trump, you're just all in because he clearly is. So far he's aces.
If he wants this woman as CIA Director, OK by me. And if he doesn't OK by me.
Just enjoy the show or do the #NeverTrumper bit. There honestly isn't much of a middle ground, here. As someone said in another thread, Trump has arrived as essentially one basic thing. He SORTS things and people. Just that. We've needed a 'sorting' for decades now.

Posted by: dougf at March 13, 2018 02:41 PM (le5Px)

592
I probably would have traded funding and weapons
to Assad for freeing his political prisoners and his WMDs...but the US
government at the time thought working with ISIS was a better idea... Posted by: 18-1 at March 13, 2018 01:55 PM (Z8FFX)
=====

There are no 'good guys' in the area at all. The best we can hope for is diplomatic relations. McCain was out playing SoS and Hillary was playing ultimate warfare.

You can't pick a side there. An awful confession is that I think Assad is less awful than the alternative. Think of Libya.

Posted by: mustbequantum at March 13, 2018 02:44 PM (MIKMs)

593 380
24 In one year, all of these fucking people will have "Kamala for Commander in Chief!" bumper stickers on their Volvos.



And China owns Volvo now!!
=============


Maybe Volvo can put the bumpersticker on it as an optional accessory, directly from the factory.


Posted by: LeftCoast Dawg at March 13, 2018 02:47 PM (UsCnO)

594 Okay, I see how this is going. Gonna' hate on Gina. Gonna look for a better option. Sure, that makes sense. Let's find someone stupid, but malleable to our desires, rather than taking what Satan has given us and use it against our enemies. The time for timid is over.

Posted by: goon at March 13, 2018 03:04 PM (EaQ6/)

595 "People scare better when they're dying."
DemocRats stil adhere to this today

Posted by: Frank / Henry Fonda - - - Once Apon A Time In The West at March 13, 2018 03:05 PM (EATOD)

596 The solution is to incinerate the entire region. Does no one see that? It's a cancer. It needs to be nuked before it has a chance to spread. And, I don't mean any of this in a mean way ... got nothin' but love for the brother's and sister's there, but they are all so well and truly fucked that maybe sending them on up the pipe would be the best deal. For them, and for everyone else.

Posted by: goon at March 13, 2018 03:10 PM (EaQ6/)

597 Not sure where you got that thing about Pompeo's not needing a confirmation hearing.

Posted by: J. Moses Browning at March 13, 2018 03:54 PM (nBwez)

598 Let's see.. "Calling your boss a Moron when the press can hear it and expect not to be fired." Does not equal "Great Dark Deep Conspiracy Theory!"

Was Tillerson thinking he was going to get away with it because he WAS the CEO of a wealthier company? Hah! Sucker..!!

Posted by: catman at March 13, 2018 03:58 PM (KzK8d)

599 "Threats?" Why, those are veritable love letters!
Cats could sharpen their claws on my Bill Kristol Presidential Run-Boner.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at March 13, 2018 04:18 PM (6gR7l)

600 " Is he just
playing to his lefty friends in hopes of getting that decrepit hippie
poontang?"

My Gaydar says: no.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at March 13, 2018 04:22 PM (6gR7l)

601 "224 The Russia collusion narrative is just like the global warming narrative.

There's no proof but it is the cause of everything. It's simply the latest religious fantasy consuming the Only The Facts! crowd.

As opposed of course to our Christian belief in the fairy Godfather in the sky."

Thread winner. Pretty well sums it up, too.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at March 13, 2018 04:28 PM (6gR7l)

602 Hiring Tillerson was proof of Russian collusion, and firing Tillerson is proof of Russian collusion. See how that works?

Posted by: Bob at March 13, 2018 04:57 PM (fVGlW)

(Jump to top of page)






Processing 0.07, elapsed 0.0794 seconds.
15 queries taking 0.0146 seconds, 611 records returned.
Page size 338 kb.
Powered by Minx 0.7 alpha.



MuNuvians
MeeNuvians
Polls! Polls! Polls!
Frequently Asked Questions
The (Almost) Complete Paul Anka Integrity Kick
Top Top Tens
Greatest Hitjobs

The Ace of Spades HQ Sex-for-Money Skankathon
A D&D Guide to the Democratic Candidates
Margaret Cho: Just Not Funny
More Margaret Cho Abuse
Margaret Cho: Still Not Funny
Iraqi Prisoner Claims He Was Raped... By Woman
Wonkette Announces "Morning Zoo" Format
John Kerry's "Plan" Causes Surrender of Moqtada al-Sadr's Militia
World Muslim Leaders Apologize for Nick Berg's Beheading
Michael Moore Goes on Lunchtime Manhattan Death-Spree
Milestone: Oliver Willis Posts 400th "Fake News Article" Referencing Britney Spears
Liberal Economists Rue a "New Decade of Greed"
Artificial Insouciance: Maureen Dowd's Word Processor Revolts Against Her Numbing Imbecility
Intelligence Officials Eye Blogs for Tips
They Done Found Us Out, Cletus: Intrepid Internet Detective Figures Out Our Master Plan
Shock: Josh Marshall Almost Mentions Sarin Discovery in Iraq
Leather-Clad Biker Freaks Terrorize Australian Town
When Clinton Was President, Torture Was Cool
What Wonkette Means When She Explains What Tina Brown Means
Wonkette's Stand-Up Act
Wankette HQ Gay-Rumors Du Jour
Here's What's Bugging Me: Goose and Slider
My Own Micah Wright Style Confession of Dishonesty
Outraged "Conservatives" React to the FMA
An On-Line Impression of Dennis Miller Having Sex with a Kodiak Bear
The Story the Rightwing Media Refuses to Report!
Our Lunch with David "Glengarry Glen Ross" Mamet
The House of Love: Paul Krugman
A Michael Moore Mystery (TM)
The Dowd-O-Matic!
Liberal Consistency and Other Myths
Kepler's Laws of Liberal Media Bias
John Kerry-- The Splunge! Candidate
"Divisive" Politics & "Attacks on Patriotism" (very long)
The Donkey ("The Raven" parody)
News/Chat