Tweetstorm

I suppose it's time for a new post. The other day I finally had enough of some of the pre-X and Obamacare garbage that's been going around Twitter lately, so I decided to set the record straight. My tweetstorm was rather well received, and a bunch of people said I should post it here (Really. usually when I say that I'm kidding, but not this time). Since we're in the Sunday afternoon doldrums, I figure I'd go ahead and post it.

(cont below cut)

Please forgive the typos (and the fact that I spelled Medicaid wrong, which is...embarrassing), I wrote it at 2AM. I've blocked out the twitter handles of the other people in the conversation out of politeness, and Abigail was quite classy about being the target of my responses, so I am at least making a nod towards propriety in concealing her handle.

Also, to clarify, the figures I was using about the number of people in the individual market are from 2011(pre-Obamacare implementation), a fact that I somehow forgot to mention in the tweetstorm. And AHIP is the health insurance industry's lobbying group for those that don't know. (America's Health Insurance Plans)

Anyhoo, if you ever wanted to know what the actual effect of the ACA was in the real world, there you have it.

Open Thread

Posted by: WeirdDave at 03:27 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Whoo-hoo

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at July 16, 2017 03:30 PM (89T5c)

2

Where's the part when see Abigail's goods?

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at July 16, 2017 03:31 PM (8gTsX)

3 Well done, WD, well done.

Posted by: ibguy at July 16, 2017 03:32 PM (vUcdz)

4 Hume on Trump-Russia Investigation: 'There's No End in Sight for This Firestorm'

I thought this crusty cornhole retired years ago? Fuck you Brit.

Posted by: Clotty McCainus at July 16, 2017 03:32 PM (mcI77)

5 Frickin willowed... re-paste.

"Can't stay [long], but I want to chime in on this: "exposing yourself to the worst excesses of rot will change your ability to function in a moral and ethical manner"

This is nonsense. I've seen and heard some terrible things in my life; things that come with dealing with intelligence in the Middle East. Murder. Torture. People being ripped apart. Child pornography. Things I wish I'd never experienced and wish I could forget, but you never do... not really. Every so often, you get reminded. And more is likely coming in my future.

And not fake bullshit in a television series, either.

And yet, somehow, I manage to not be evil, because I'm not a fucking robot or animal who simply imitates whatever he sees. I'm a living human with a mind and a soul who is responsible for his own decisions and capable of discerning evil.

And I absolutely, completely reject any assertions to the contrary. I have moral agency. And seeing what evil can be doesn't make me more likely to do it. It makes the good stand out more strongly."

Posted by: Apostate at July 16, 2017 03:34 PM (TFnkQ)

6 Abigail looks like Velma from Scooby Doo.

Posted by: Clotty McCainus at July 16, 2017 03:35 PM (mcI77)

7 Did she ever run out of talking points? Would have been helpful if she had numbered them.

Posted by: Javems at July 16, 2017 03:36 PM (yOqwj)

8 kudos to Abigail for not being snotty. That's encouraging.

Posted by: Pug Mahon at July 16, 2017 03:36 PM (I8zsv)

9 Velma Dinkley.

Posted by: Clotty McCainus at July 16, 2017 03:36 PM (mcI77)

10 8 PM

Agreed. Nice to see actual, constructive discussion/debate.

Disagreeing without being disagreeable.

Posted by: ibguy at July 16, 2017 03:37 PM (vUcdz)

11 But she doesn't want "single payer", honest.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at July 16, 2017 03:39 PM (IqV8l)

12 *squirt*

Posted by: Anthony Weiner at July 16, 2017 03:39 PM (vjO8N)

13 WD, please correct me if I am wrong. My limited take on the insurance company's paranoia is due to them no longer receiving gov'mt subsidies if obomacare is nixed?

Posted by: Infidel at July 16, 2017 03:41 PM (gDoff)

14 Good "cheat sheet" of facts to use in Obamacare arguments with Leftists.

Posted by: @ThePoliticalHat at July 16, 2017 03:41 PM (vBeA5)

15 Dave, if I may ask, are you C. Steven Tucker, noted insurance expert and commenter at various sites?

Posted by: doomed at July 16, 2017 03:43 PM (UW4Uc)

16 13 pretty much

15 no

Posted by: Weirddave at July 16, 2017 03:45 PM (WLeoI)

17 I bet her response to all that ends up being really stupid and repeating a the "Cruz plan" is bad! line.

Posted by: buzzion at July 16, 2017 03:45 PM (cAnNx)

18 The thing that's so exasperating and infuriating is that Obamacare and the various Republican "fixes" are all about who pays for healthcare.

None of them address the ever-escalating cost of healthcare.

Posted by: rickl at July 16, 2017 03:46 PM (sdi6R)

19 Well, I was hoping for a gun thread but that was a pretty impressive line of fire being laid down.

Posted by: Bob the Bilderberg at July 16, 2017 03:47 PM (7oUUT)

20 Thanks, WD. Very insightful post. This shit isn't rocket science. I just want the gov't to leave me alone. Evidently, that is too much to ask.

Posted by: Infidel at July 16, 2017 03:48 PM (gDoff)

21 No wait, let me revise what my bet is. My bet is that she provides no response, and just the next time she reverts back to the "We must keep Obamacare because of pre-existing conditions!" line.

Posted by: buzzion at July 16, 2017 03:48 PM (cAnNx)

22 You want to "fix"health care, make health insurance illegal.

Pow, zing, free market baby.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at July 16, 2017 03:49 PM (5VlCp)

23 Some of us predicted long ago that the R's would never rid us of Obamacare. We were right. As that guy (not me) who used to post several years ago at Hotair always said, "The GOP will betray you."

Posted by: doomed at July 16, 2017 03:49 PM (UW4Uc)

24
I just want:
- Competition, nationwide groups
- Limited Tort Policy - I'm not looking for ghetto lottery w hosp. visit
- A high deductible/low cost catastrophic plan

Of course, what I want does not:
- Make the insurance companies wealthy
- Make the tort lawyers wealthy
- Make the Drs and Hospitals wealthy

So I can pretty much forget it.

Posted by: Slippery Slope Salesman at July 16, 2017 03:50 PM (EgwCt)

25 Wow. I always fall asleep while getting a rebuttal on my main argument too. I mean, who wouldn't when someone tears apart my basic beliefs. I always start yawning when I get an argument above "you are a poopy head and I bet you hate women and childrin of coler" response.

It shows I care and I am interested.

Posted by: Kindltot at July 16, 2017 03:50 PM (mkDpn)

26 Delaying the HC vote because McCain is ill makes people feel that violence may be their "only avenue".

https://tinyurl.com/y7hff5pb

Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 03:51 PM (Nwg0u)

27 That was funny, entertaining, and I learned some things. Great stuff.

I've done a lot of schooling like this in my own field (international trade.)

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? at July 16, 2017 03:51 PM (ul9CR)

28 Delaying the HC vote because McCain is ill makes people feel that violence may be their "only avenue".
https://tinyurl.com/y7hff5pb
Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 03:51 PM (Nwg0u)

Drudge has a picture of McStain either before or just after he sharted.

Nasty old bastard.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at July 16, 2017 03:52 PM (5VlCp)

29 26
*types*

*deletes*

Posted by: Infidel at July 16, 2017 03:53 PM (gDoff)

30 26 Delaying the HC vote because McCain is ill makes people feel that violence may be their "only avenue".

https://tinyurl.com/y7hff5pb

WTF? On what planet does that make any kind of sense? Threaten violence for everything the Rs do and for everything they don't do?

Posted by: Bob the Bilderberg at July 16, 2017 03:56 PM (7oUUT)

31 How refreshing to hear for a change from someone in the field who actually knows what he's talking about, as opposed to the Demedia screechings about the thousands of people the Republicans are planning to kill.

To their electoral peril the Dems continue to ignore or disparage the middle class people who lost their plans or saw their premiums and deductibles double.

Posted by: stace at July 16, 2017 03:56 PM (B7u3j)

32 I think all Americans should receive the care that the VA provides.

Posted by: SMFH at July 16, 2017 03:58 PM (s5Kql)

33 I just want:
- Competition, nationwide groups
- Limited Tort Policy - I'm not looking for ghetto lottery w hosp. visit
- A high deductible/low cost catastrophic plan

Of course, what I want does not:
- Make the insurance companies wealthy
- Make the tort lawyers wealthy
- Make the Drs and Hospitals wealthy

So I can pretty much forget it

-
I'll add a don't want. I don't want congress to exempt themse!ves from the medical utopia they legislate for the peasants.

Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 03:58 PM (Nwg0u)

34 We have our own health plans. Because we're special.

Posted by: Clotty McCainus at July 16, 2017 03:59 PM (mcI77)

35 Great exposition.....from someone who actually knows the market.

Wouldn't it be nice if we could actually have a serious public debate on this subject? But the media and ruling class (BIRM) won't allow it.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at July 16, 2017 04:00 PM (0jtPF)

36 Curiosity Stream has some pretty good documentaries.

Posted by: SMFH at July 16, 2017 04:01 PM (s5Kql)

37 Roll McStains in there on a f'n gurney to vote. It's what the Dems would do. Like they would have let a blood clot stop Obamacare.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? at July 16, 2017 04:02 PM (ul9CR)

38 Before zerocare, my (employer's) plan had a pre-existing condition clause that merely stated the condition wouldn't be covered for a number of months, and then coverage would be in force for said condition, assuming premiums were paid during those months. (3 months, I believe that plan stated...maybe it was 6.)

So, was it common for plans to state "no coverage, ever, for pre-existing conditions"? That seems to be the common assumption...

Posted by: JQ Flyover at July 16, 2017 04:02 PM (5muuD)

39 Now THAT's a Tweetstorm... as apposed to the times the President posts 3-4 tweets on a topic and the media brands it "BREAKING: TRUMP GOES ON ANOTHER TWEETSTORM"

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 16, 2017 04:03 PM (Hnqc1)

40 I think all Americans should receive the care that the VA provides.
Posted by: SMFH at July 16, 2017 03:58 PM (s5Kql)

---
i second this emotion...

last week they threatened to call the cops on me for "disruptive behavior"...

and then declined to give me the treatment i'd been waiting weeks for to schedule and 2 hours past my appointment time to get that day...

my sin?

pointing out to the attending doctor that he and his residents were not supposed to use PPE more than once...

the FOIA office is going to be busy next week, and then a couple agencies are going to get some rather pointed letters.

i hope the arrogant little prick enjoys the total body colonoscopy i'm going to unleash on his little kingdom.

Posted by: redc1c4 at July 16, 2017 04:04 PM (Nbzu/)

41 Well, I was hoping for a gun thread

-

I just finished the latest Bob Lee Swagger novel, G Man, about the hunt for Babyface Nelson. It discusses Babyface's modified Colt .45 1911"room broom". It was a real thing:

https://tinyurl.com/y83wudnz

Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 04:05 PM (Nwg0u)

42 That was absolutely fascinating. I saw the insurance companies were opposed to the Cruz amendment and assumed they were really opposed to ending the mandate to buy their products, but to see the numbers like that is mindblowing.

And completely frustrating to think we've only had this Obamacare monstrosity for a couple of years, but now it can never die.

Posted by: VKI at July 16, 2017 04:06 PM (qySNZ)

43 Thanks for explaining the nuts and bolts of it---the Ins gravy train. When AARP was getting 20+ million to promote ACA and the Pharm cos were all meeting at the WH to iron out their ?acceptable profit margins" it was clear that it would be a fascist takover rather than a socialist one. I remember when they forced Texas motorists to buy auto insurance because the pool would be so large that it would cost nothing. Of course now a $200/year policy costs $1800/year because the ins cos knew that with everyone forced to buy their product, well, with lobbying any high profit is negotiable. Esp when so many politicians have their hands out.
Which is why the GOPe won't get rid of the ACA now. IT IS DONOR DRIVEN. It is too late to get the ins companies to change their model and too late to get the GOPe to take their hands out of the cookie jar.
This year I had to change hospitals and doctors because my insurance was dropped by my previous hospital. I just got a note from the ins company saying that in October they would no longer cover my meds from the new doctor. I have this policy only because the ACA outlawed my previous, working perfectly policy.
Nothing is fixed by the ACA. it is much much worse and the GOPe will only enrich their donors at the expense of the citizens.
Burn it all down.

Posted by: Hopped Up On Something at July 16, 2017 04:08 PM (B9t7n)

44 We'll never be able to change the minds of people like "Abigail." She's got her narrative, and she stick to it, even when she's pwned. Also, I bet she owns a lot of cats.

Posted by: Barb the Evil Genius at July 16, 2017 04:09 PM (FQKBL)

45 We lost our insurance and got hit with the penalty. I don't know who I hate more...Obama or John Roberts.

Posted by: Jmel at July 16, 2017 04:09 PM (EDJZL)

46 I saw the insurance companies were opposed to the Cruz amendment and assumed they were really opposed to ending the mandate to buy their products

-
McDonalds would supporg Olunch if everyone were forced to buy a Big Mac.

Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 04:10 PM (Nwg0u)

47 WeirdDave or anyone else knowledgeable, would this idea help...?

I can't help keep thinking that we really need the Govt. to properly define what exactly is and is not "health insurance" and "health benefits". To my mind any amount of expenses beyond 15% of one's annual income is appropriate for health insurance. If a company wants to pay for routine, low cost, care.. great. But don't include it in their insurance plan and instead deem it a "health benefit". Just codifying those terms into law would be help to conservatives in the debate over "health care".

It doesn't make since economically, in my mind, to put in a claim for a $100 doctor's visit. And COBRA doesn't help people out much when they learn they'd have to pay $500+ a month to keep their employer's coverage going after being laid off.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 16, 2017 04:10 PM (Hnqc1)

48 We lost our insurance and got hit with the penalty. I don't know who I hate more...Obama or John Roberts.
Posted by: Jmel at July 16, 2017 04:09 PM (EDJZL)

What year? I lost mine last year, but I believe I skated because Trump ordered the IRS not to collect for 2016 penalties. Would have been in the range of $700.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 16, 2017 04:13 PM (Hnqc1)

49 Big Brother is looking out for you and your health.

"The National Institutes of Health is spending nearly $400,000 testing how to insert subliminal messages against cigarette smoking in video games played by teens."

Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 04:16 PM (Nwg0u)

50 46
McDonalds would supporg Olunch if everyone were forced to buy a Big Mac.
Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 04:10 PM (Nwg0u)

I think that's pretty much right.

Long Live Fascism!

Posted by: rickl at July 16, 2017 04:16 PM (sdi6R)

51 Serious Cat. I was laid off in Dec. Cobra was going to be $10 more a month than my mortgage. I declined. New job (half of what I was making) has catastrophic insurance after two months and they provide, at no cost to employees a policy that covers basics at a local clinic. Thankfully I am healthy at this time. If I go to the Dr. I will pay to see the one I like, not the cafeteria plan offered. It is all so fvcked up. I have no idea what the IRS hit will be next year for not having insurance for seven months.

Posted by: Infidel at July 16, 2017 04:18 PM (gDoff)

52 This is real simple: If you want to cover preexisting conditions, then you have to have mandatory total enrollment.
If you are against insurance enrollment at the point of a gun, then you cannot force insurance companies to cover preexisting conditions.
Otherwise, the economics just don't work.

Imagine if you didn't need car insurance until after you had an accident?
All car insurance companies would go bankrupt within a few months.
Its the same thing for healthcare.
People will always game the system for their own benefit.

For the record, I do not want to be forced to buy health insurance at gunpoint.
And, since I understand both economics and human nature, I am against forcing insurance companies to cover preexisting conditions.

Posted by: Dr. Dave at July 16, 2017 04:18 PM (ozGQ9)

53 Because a small fraction couldn't get access for various reasons, we had to destroy health insurance and healthcare for the other 300+ million Americans.

Of course, that was their retarded justification. Their ulterior motive was to get ultimate state control over our behavior via extortion.

Posted by: ShainS at July 16, 2017 04:19 PM (ZcAbN)

54 Fantastic download of insight, Mr WD. However, it illustrates all that's wrong with Twitter. You're forced to chunk up thoughts into these ridiculous 140-char text bites. It's no wonder most exchanges end with "bite me!"

The numbering of long strings of messages is almost biblical, though, so that's kinda cool

Posted by: Unsure if deplorable, covfefe moron at July 16, 2017 04:19 PM (Eynls)

55 Dems and LIV's think you can get something for nothing by passing the cost to somebody else. They can't grasp that somebody still pay and that cost will eventually still come around in one way o another, whether higher taxes, higher product costs, decreased quality and availability of services etc... Worse, they can't grasp that the greater the cost shift, the more it will increase prices. as there is no price point feedback.

The solution to this mess is a lot less insurance and a lot more more direct pay. Prices would plummet and insurance would be even less necessary except for truly catastrophic events.

Posted by: Ripley at July 16, 2017 04:21 PM (MxEKc)

56
Dems and LIV's think you can get something for nothing by passing the cost to somebody else.

If the rich would only pay their fair share...

Posted by: Uncle Bernie's Farm at July 16, 2017 04:24 PM (IqV8l)

57 The solution to this mess is a lot less insurance and a lot more more direct pay. Prices would plummet and insurance would be even less necessary except for truly catastrophic events.
Posted by: Ripley

THIS.
In my former job I paid 600% less for better coverage.
When I was a kid you paid the doctor and the lab and it was affordable. You had insurance in case you got cancer or something. Also affordable.
The government fucks up absolutely everything it touches.

Posted by: Hopped Up On Something at July 16, 2017 04:25 PM (B9t7n)

58 The solution to this mess is a lot less insurance and a lot more more direct pay. Prices would plummet and insurance would be even less necessary except for truly catastrophic events.

-
And what of the poor bureaucrats? They gotta eat, too, ya know.

Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 04:25 PM (Nwg0u)

59 None of them address the ever-escalating cost of healthcare.

Posted by: rickl at July 16, 2017 03:46 PM (sdi6R)

===============
The only way to mitigate the ever-escalating cost is with total free markets, and I can count on one hand the number of Congressmen who agree with this notion.

Posted by: ShainS at July 16, 2017 04:26 PM (ZcAbN)

60
And what of the poor bureaucrats? They gotta eat, too, ya know.

Let them eat shit.

Posted by: Marie Effin' Antoinette at July 16, 2017 04:27 PM (oVJmc)

61 As that guy (not me) who used to post several years ago at Hotair always said, "The GOP will betray you."

Posted by: doomed at July 16, 2017 03:49 PM (UW4Uc)

==========

Yep, his handle was True_King IIRC.

Posted by: ShainS at July 16, 2017 04:29 PM (ZcAbN)

62 Before Obamacare, $4,000 per year was deducted from my paycheck for my share of insurance premiums. Now it's almost $11,000 per year, while I still work for the same company. Not exactly the $2,500 decrease in premiums that Obama promised when he was lying out the ass to pass it.

Posted by: RobJ at July 16, 2017 04:29 PM (Sk+7V)

63 I just finished the latest Bob Lee Swagger novel, G Man, about the hunt for Babyface Nelson. It discusses Babyface's modified Colt .45 1911"room broom". It was a real thing:

https://tinyurl.com/y83wudnz

Thanks for that. I grew up near San Antonio but I didn't know about the Dillinger connection. Also, by coincidence, my current gun lust is for the new Colt Series 70 NM.

http://www.colt.com/Catalog/Pistols/Gold-Cup-Series

Posted by: Bob the Bilderberg at July 16, 2017 04:29 PM (7oUUT)

64 The only way to mitigate the ever-escalating cost is with total free markets, and I can count on one hand of a guy not good with a power saw[\b] the number of Congressmen who agree with this notion.

Posted by: I'm Anonosaurus Wrecks and I approved this message at July 16, 2017 04:30 PM (Nwg0u)

66 Several years back I trolled the Garden Web with a thread about the Tomato Belt. The major commercial tomatoes all seem to be within a couple degrees of 40� latitude (California, Indiana/Ohio, New Jersey, Spain, Italy, Turkey, China, Argentina, e.g.) So I called 40� latitude "The Tomato Belt" and said that this is the onlt area where you can successfully grow good tasting tomatoes with robust plants.

I went through a whole explation about day length vs. temperature and growing season, how this effects sugar content ( brix) and that anyone who lives outside this zone should stop griping about their tomatoes, and just be thankful for anything they get.

Well, it caused quite a stir, and about half the commenters bought into it. However, it does seem to be quite a coinidence, eh? (That's a salute to anyone in Canada who tries to grow tomatoes.)

Posted by: bergerbilder at July 16, 2017 04:30 PM (lIZQs)

67
The solution to this mess is a lot less insurance and a lot more more direct pay. Prices would plummet and insurance would be even less necessary except for truly catastrophic events.
Posted by: Ripley at July 16, 2017 04:21 PM (MxEKc)

Look at the growth in Healthcare that does nothing but add overhead

http://preview.tinyurl.com/ycw9dcxh

Posted by: Edd Zachary at July 16, 2017 04:32 PM (nQ7gs)

68 "The only way to mitigate the ever-escalating cost is
with total free markets, and I can count on one hand the number of
Congressmen who agree with this notion.

Posted by: ShainS"

Yep. Most parts of the economy have seen enormous improvements in productivity, pricing, efficiency from technology and we see this all around us .Heck, even going to the DMV for tags or license, which used to be nightmare has gotten to be relatively quick and painless. Yet health care has only seen prices soar as it has become ever more frustrating just trying to to see a doctor or figure out where you should go. Why is that? Insurance and govt. programs

Posted by: Ripley at July 16, 2017 04:35 PM (MxEKc)

69 Just curious as to what you think about the tomato varieties from Ukraine and Belarus. I would think they are outside of that zone.

Posted by: Notsothoreau at July 16, 2017 04:36 PM (Lqy/e)

70 I have no idea what the IRS hit will be next year for not having insurance for seven months.

Posted by: Infidel at July 16, 2017 04:18 PM (gDoff)

Nothing, nada, zilch. One of Trumps first actions on Day One. The IRS is abiding by his directive.

Breath easier, guy ( or girl ).

Posted by: Slippery Slope Salesman at July 16, 2017 04:38 PM (EgwCt)

71 That was a tweet-nami!

Posted by: t-bird at July 16, 2017 04:38 PM (Ef1FF)

72 Posted by: Ripley at July 16, 2017 04:21 PM (MxEKc)

That can't possibly work. If it really worked you'd have people going to Costa Rica for dental work or flying to Thailand for knee surgery or Eastern Europe for heart surgery and no one does that. Just like no one gets drugs from Canada or Mexico.
A few years ago when I was switching jobs I called a dermatologist and told her I had a huge mole on my shoulder I really wanted removed. Her receptionist told me they could not do it without insurance. They called me back an hour later and said they would do it for $200 cash.

Posted by: Hopped Up On Something at July 16, 2017 04:40 PM (B9t7n)

73 For the individual, it's always better if somebody pays for your stuff

Single-payer to the rescue!

Posted by: A Rabble of Abigails at July 16, 2017 04:42 PM (Ef1FF)

74 I am amazed at the difference between seeing my pulmonologist and my naturopath. After doing the yearly chest x-ray and CT scan, the pulmonologist wanted to do a bronoscopy. I stopped seeing him because he couldn't explain how that would change my treatment.

I asked the naturopath to treat the autoimmune part of the disease. I stopped being triggered. It has taken awhile but my lungs seem to be functioning close to normal. I still get breathless under heavy activity, but it's better than it was. I would have had to pay for the entire bronoscopy due to my deductibles on the insurance. Couldn't seem to get the pulmonologist to understand that.

Posted by: Notsothoreau at July 16, 2017 04:42 PM (Lqy/e)

75 Obama Mugabe lied and our wallets died.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at July 16, 2017 04:45 PM (5VlCp)

76 I think all Americans should receive the care that the VA provides.

Posted by: SMFH at July 16, 2017 03:58 PM (s5Kql)

Especially, Congress members and staffers!

Posted by: Hrothgar at July 16, 2017 04:49 PM (gwPgz)

77 I would have had to pay for the
entire bronoscopy due to my deductibles on the insurance. Couldn't seem
to get the pulmonologist to understand that.

Posted by: Notsothoreau

He understood. He just didn't give a shit.

Posted by: scrood at July 16, 2017 04:50 PM (ZMtTe)

78 It is impossible to get universal satisfaction over something that is rationed.
It is also impossible to satisfy entitlement minded people, there will always be the desire for something more and better at someone else's expense.
It is also impossible to get people who have a lifetime of never enjoying the full consequence of poor decisions to take on responsibility.
Everyone lies, and to far too many, fraud is a way of life. its even easier to swindle strangers.

It is for these reasons alone, it is impossible to create a nation-wide satisfactory health policy. There will always be those who don't take care of themselves but want free or heavily subsidized premium and unlimited care when the day of reckoning arrives and will sue when the results are not 100% restorative. There will always be greedy, self-serving cheats who will game the system in ways to plunder the system.

Any attempt to try to nullify these truths will result in failure, most likely making a bad situation worse.

OTOH, Tribalism works relatively well. If a group of like-minded, co�perative and flourishing individuals were to band together to form a health cost sharing alliance, then that group would achieve the greatest results.

I'm talking of these Christian based health cost sharing entities that are permitted by law. They take low-risk, health-minded, producing, clean-living, mentally balanced people and group them with a low overhead administration.

They make the sharing personal by members cutting checks to the receiving parties. They don't pay for abortions but will pay for births. They don't pay for drug counseling and psychotropics because the members have a spiritual life or a constructive hobby.
They don't pay for the outcome of gun-fights, drug abuse, alcoholism, obesity and Evel Knieval danger seekers. This system works because the participants voluntarily agree to a healthy and safe lifestyle so to not burden themselves and others.

You will NEVER get that sort of system to work in the mainstream.

I guess we are all screwed, but we wanted Diversity, open borders and freedom to destroy our lives and have others pick up the pieces.

Posted by: Blue Bird of F'ing Joy at July 16, 2017 04:56 PM (lD3vL)

79 Is a bronoscopy a test to see if Justin Trudeau is up your butt?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNmFFgIKLLY

That must be painful.

Posted by: andycanuck at July 16, 2017 04:57 PM (nlbfN)

80 Posted by: Blue Bird of F'ing Joy at July 16, 2017 04:56 PM (lD3vL)

To some extent, I think this is why corporate plans can function, because to get one you must be employed so a major criteria of "responsibility" has been met (not to say you can't be a drugged up alcoholic psychotic and still have a job, but it is substantially less likely than dealing with the general population)!

Posted by: Hrothgar at July 16, 2017 05:02 PM (gwPgz)

81 Ok, dental "insurance"--

When insurance pays for a checkup (no x-rays in this example, just cleaning and inspection), the statement says insurance co. pays $60.

If I go between-times, (not covered) and pay out of pocket-- I am charged $92 for the exact same services.

I call bullshit, but hey... that's life, right?

Posted by: JQ Flyover at July 16, 2017 05:05 PM (5muuD)

82 WD- No fair using certified true facts!

Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at July 16, 2017 05:09 PM (e1mEI)

83 That said, a very good argument.

Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at July 16, 2017 05:10 PM (e1mEI)

84 OT:

HORNSLETH HOMELESS TRACKER

"converting the homeless into a real-life Pokémon"

https://www.hornslethhomelesstracker.com/

Posted by: The Hobo Huntin' Hat at July 16, 2017 05:15 PM (vBeA5)

85 This whole discussion is bullcrap.

Right now, now matter how extensive you think your coverage is, if you got stage 4 cancer, your insurance company will try to avoid treating it.

I had prostrate cancer. I thought I had paid all this money for a good plan all these years and would be covered, but nooooo! I had to pay for the doctor, and they paid about one quarter of the rest of the costs.

Then I had two epidurals in my back. I was supposedly covered, but then Anthem Blue Cross sent me an $18,000 bill for two twenty minute operations.

Then I had a basel cell close to my eye. No doctor in my "network" would touch it. It wasn't until I was on Medicare that I could get it fixed.

They will avoid any coverage if they think they can get away with it. Obamacare did not fix these problems as one of the commenters said, it exacerbated them. Big time. Health Insurance has become an enormous government backed swindle.

Posted by: UNSK at July 16, 2017 05:28 PM (xJePZ)

86 I'm limping out right now to get a pair of those Reeboks shoes. They're the cats meow I hear. Hope they come with Velcro closures.

http://preview.tinyurl.com/y7j29ofj

Posted by: Clotty McCainus at July 16, 2017 05:45 PM (mcI77)

87 81 Ok, dental "insurance"--

When insurance pays for a checkup (no x-rays in this example, just cleaning and inspection), the statement says insurance co. pays $60.

If I go between-times, (not covered) and pay out of pocket-- I am charged $92 for the exact same services.
I call bullshit, but hey... that's life, right?
Posted by: JQ Flyover at July 16, 2017 05:05 PM
---------------------------
Yeah, you have to space these things to a strict schedule.
Our dental "insurance" is crap anyway because it covers regular check-ups well --- provided they are properly spaced --- but doesn't help much at all with big, unexpected things. IOW, it's the opposite of what insurance should be.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at July 16, 2017 05:55 PM (0jtPF)

88 Food nood.

Posted by: Bob the Bilderberg at July 16, 2017 06:05 PM (7oUUT)

89 I guess mI have accepted the fact that everyone is going to die. Even myself. Extending the life expectancy is one of the miracles of the modern ages. But that increase isn't all due to medcine or medical science.

I think what medical science has been very good at is increasing the the life expectancy toward the end of life. My impression is that the majority of the fifteen years or so of added llife expectancy experienced over the last several decades has been added to the end of life, not the middle of life where it would prbably do the human race the most good. (I know, 50 is the new 40, etc., but nutrition, public works, and general attitudes are big factors here, too.)

Btw, Infant is mortality not included in this thought process.

Posted by: bergerbilder at July 16, 2017 06:27 PM (lIZQs)

90 GREAT GREAT GREAT POST !!!
Thanks !
There should be a word to describe the "state of mind",
(Kerouac-like, Kerouac-ish ???)

where someone is so in the zone, content-wise, that a disregard for spelling, punctuation, etc. etc.

I definitely see this "state"as a feature not a bug.

Again, excellent work !

Posted by: rusty shacklefjord at July 16, 2017 07:06 PM (v8mM1)

91 Slippery Slope Salesman for President! He's is the man who the Plan!

No sarcasm. He's hit the nail on the head on how to reduce costs... And why none of it is being done.

Posted by: Lee at July 16, 2017 08:08 PM (DNg6O)

92 My paycheck deductions have stated roughly the same since Obummercare. But my annual deductable went up: from $1000 (which included all the co-pays), to $2500, to now, $4500 annually, after the co-pays. Thanks, jackass in DC. FU!

And I'm luckier than most.

Posted by: Lee at July 16, 2017 08:12 PM (DNg6O)

93 One other thing:

So many idiots thought that if you didn't have insurance through your employer, you couldn't BUY IT YOURSELF. Seriously! People really believed that! I remember telling incredulous idiots about going to a broker and sitting down and discussing various plans and the costs and picking one.

Of course, back then I argued with people until I was blue on the face that their employer factored in the costs of their insurance when deciding what to pay them. Hence the phrase, "total compensation package."

Posted by: Lee at July 16, 2017 08:17 PM (DNg6O)

94 Wow. This is great.

Posted by: bour3 at July 16, 2017 08:35 PM (KXQr+)

95 Posted by: Margarita DeVille at July 16, 2017 05:55 PM

Yeah, the total of premiums adds up to approx. cost of 2 cleanings per year. I like coffee and sometimes want my teeth cleaned before the specified time is up. I don't mind paying at those times, but....

My main complaint is that the insurance co. pays a *different* price than I do, for the *same* product.

Posted by: JQ Flyover at July 16, 2017 08:37 PM (5muuD)

96 When you revealed your credentials, like a magician asking "Is THIS your card?" I felt like Flounder in "Animal House" grabbing the popcorn, leaning forward and muttering "Ooh, this is gonna be good!"

I haven't seen a relentless fileting like that since Vinny called Lisa and Sheriff Farley to the witness stand. Abigail was left in a steaming pile.

Fortunately for her there's an emoji for that.

Posted by: Kate58 at July 16, 2017 08:58 PM (oLZsm)

97 Lots of people were swept into Medicaid by the ACA. And they have no idea what a "Medicaid Lien" is.

This wasn't a big deal before the ACA because if you had assets, you weren't eligible for Medicaid. The ACA changed that.

Posted by: itsacookbook at July 16, 2017 10:29 PM (yPxXc)

98 1. Repeal. 2. Let insurers offer products/plans people want. 3. Move on to lowering taxes.

Posted by: Mr. Khan at July 17, 2017 02:30 AM (Dl60Y)

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