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Glenn Reynolds: If Expertise Is Dead, It's Death By Suicide

In response to this twatty twaddle from Foreign Policy...


And Tom Nichols' desperation to have people take him seriously again even though no one's ever taken him seriously before...

Glenn Reynolds explains to the self-declared "expert" caste why no one listens to them: because they are constantly wrong, and rather than correcting themselves, they shriek that The Common People should overlook their errors because experting is hard and stuff.

Posted by: Ace at 01:00 PM




Comments

(Jump to bottom of page)

1 but...

10,000 Hours!

Posted by: garrett at March 20, 2017 01:01 PM (NJrRe)

2 Oh, and Good "Morning", Ace.

Posted by: garrett at March 20, 2017 01:01 PM (NJrRe)

3 I'm an expert, just ask!

Posted by: Killerdog at March 20, 2017 01:01 PM (7q/fS)

4 87% of all experts use statistics.
26% do not.

Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 01:02 PM (0tfLf)

5 Paul Krugman - expert, say no more

Posted by: GregV61 at March 20, 2017 01:03 PM (+5nuR)

6 87% of all experts use statistics.

26% do not.

Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 01:02 PM (0tfLf)


ugh... there's math..

And good morning HQ!

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:04 PM (4geGT)

7 I'd be more comfortable with the advice and rule of experts if they were actually expert at something.

As far as I can tell, their main strengths are sentence structure.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 20, 2017 01:04 PM (zsHGH)

8 Glenn Reynolds explains to the self-declared "expert" caste why no one listens to them: because they are constantly wrong, and rather than correcting themselves, they shriek that The Common People should overlook their errors because experting is hard and stuff.

Posted by: Ace at 01:00 PM

===================

Not only are the elites seemingly bad at what they say, they also explicitly do not have the interests of most people at heart.

It's become very obvious that they deem themselves another, superior class. So, combine staggering incompetence with a superiority complex, and you get our current "elite".

Of course, none of this is news to anyone. Ace has said it much better in the past.

Ace > Instapundit

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:04 PM (mC1ZI)

9 If experts were right, wouldn't we listen more often?

Posted by: Draki at March 20, 2017 01:04 PM (PFIe+)

10 The experts in the 70's assured me that the earth would be destroyed by global cooling.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (fgzLM)

11 What complete and utter nonsense.

The Foreign Policy Industrial Complex consists mostly of fellas who were schooled by the swooning sycophants who preached détente, concession, and defeat for decades.

These people STILL think they were right and Reagan was wrong, and they were helped to insinuate themselves into the Bush White House by the likes of James Baker.

As long as they are kept in the wilderness, the U.S. might... just MIGHT be able to establish a foreign policy strategy that considers the needs of Americans first.

And this is just another example of them boo-hooing over their loss of power. Screw 'em all.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (TOk1P)

12 More and more often these experts only remind me of Joe Isuzu.

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (4geGT)

13 Or that their overall thesis is correct, just the component bits are wrong.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (R7+kO)

14 9 If experts were right, wouldn't we listen more often?
Posted by: Draki at March 20, 2017 01:04 PM (PFIe+)

=====================

We'd probably need less lying and coercion to listen to them.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (mC1ZI)

15 More recently the experts told us that embryonic stem cell research would be the cure all for mankind's ills.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:06 PM (fgzLM)

16 From reading Tom Nichols' articles, I've always found him to be unimpressive and largely wrong in his "expert recommendations." He's good at collecting data. He would make an excellent librarian.

Posted by: Draki at March 20, 2017 01:06 PM (PFIe+)

17 They're not experts. More expertish.

Posted by: son of hercules at March 20, 2017 01:06 PM (mVj2p)

18 10 The experts in the 70's assured me that the earth would be destroyed by global cooling.
Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (fgzLM)


Don't forget shortages of everything, and famine brought on by overpopulation.

Posted by: rickl at March 20, 2017 01:06 PM (zoehZ)

19 Related:

Scott Adams, over the weekend, had a blogpost about how climate change is sold in the same way that known scams are sold.

They're packaged the same way. Multiple models, none are right, and they're constantly tweaking them? Sounds like a scam, even if you don't know the subject.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (mC1ZI)

20 "Nuke power will be so cheap and plentiful and safe we'll be taking the meters off your houses."



Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (4geGT)

21 they shriek that The Common People should overlook their errors because experting is hard and stuff.

You also find that attitude among defenders of the GOPe and their failure theater.

How many times, even on this blog, has the dismissive, "you just don't understand how government works" been sniffed at the grubby proles?

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (X6fMO)

22 Economics and Foreign Policy is anything but an exact science.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (fgzLM)

23 Foreign Affairs (@ForeignAffairs) March 9, 2017


LOL, Foreign Affairs on my birthday. My wife got me a subscription to that magazine once. It was a pretentious POS. Didn't take me long to drop it.

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (mpXpK)

24 15 More recently the experts told us that embryonic stem cell research would be the cure all for mankind's ills.
Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:06 PM (fgzLM)

Have to create a market. I mean, they had all these dead 'embryos' just lying around.

Or, you have to create a moral imperative for the act of abortion.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (R7+kO)

25 15 More recently the experts told us that embryonic stem cell research would be the cure all for mankind's ills.
Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:06 PM (fgzLM)

===================

Hey, remember that Family Guy episode where Peter, who's be hurt very badly for some reason, walks into a stem cell clinic and then walks out ten minutes later in perfect health? He says, "Why is this illegal?" or something.

Yeah....

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:08 PM (mC1ZI)

26 Experts "baffled" by people's rejection of experts. Film at eleven...

Posted by: tu3031 at March 20, 2017 01:08 PM (qJhUV)

27 They're not experts. More expertish.

Posted by: son of hercules at March 20, 2017 01:06 PM (mVj2p)

Formerly pert, now droopy.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 20, 2017 01:08 PM (WDdjT)

28
So.... what have the experts been right about???

But its more than that.

Its their arrogant, self congratulatory condescension that makes them insufferable pricks.

Hell.... the weatherman's batting average is south of .275. But I dont hate her.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:08 PM (8XRCm)

29 Ed Wood never penned truer words than - "All you Earth people are stupid!"

Ein Experten gets all butthurt like Amy Bishop because people reject the BS being spewed.

Posted by: Anna Puma at March 20, 2017 01:08 PM (ZNTrW)

30 21 they shriek that The Common People should overlook their errors because experting is hard and stuff.

You also find that attitude among defenders of the GOPe and their failure theater.

How many times, even on this blog, has the dismissive, "you just don't understand how government works" been sniffed at the grubby proles?
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (X6fMO)


Not any more than blaming the GOP for every failure.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:08 PM (fgzLM)

31 I hear that Apple is working on "augmented reality". That will prove to be a dismal failure for liberals. Can't augment somethin' that's not there, right?

Posted by: Notorious BFD at March 20, 2017 01:08 PM (vtcmf)

32 Liberals make assertions. They never argue for their positions. They are lying, dishonest POS. They are scum.

Posted by: Steve and Cold Bear at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (vRcUp)

33 "Experts"

In my business, the experts called in by our management are usually some cronies of theirs from a previous job. Their job isn't necessarily to fix the problem, but to make management look good.

Posted by: rd at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (iT57s)

34 20 "Nuke power will be so cheap and plentiful and safe we'll be taking the meters off your houses."

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (4geGT)

That actually sounds sane to me. Except for the part of taking meters off our houses.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (R7+kO)

35 Skepticism is good.

Posted by: @votermom @vm at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (Om16U)

36 No 'fragile egos' on the professional intellectual side.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (oVJmc)

37 Jesus Christ on a pogo stick, where do they get the insufferable arrogance? Foreign policy types are consistently wrong, ill-informed, and pointlessly smug.

Posted by: joncelli, Gobsmacked Rage Monkey and Crossbowman at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (RD7QR)

38 And Tom Nichols' desperation to have people take him seriously again even though no one's ever taken him seriously before...

Is he the movie guy? I can't remember any of his movies, offhand, but he did a whole slew of them.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (zc3Db)

39 Yup, America doesn't trust experts at all. I know that whenever I need to remove an organ, I just use a rusty flensing knife and sew myself back up with a staple gun because I don't trust those "fancy" "doctors" with their "so-called" "degrees" and their "years" of "schooling."

Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (oZ6kz)

40 Experts keep telling us that they can fund programs by raising taxes on tobacco. And then they are left making excuses for why its underfunded when most people that haven't even taken a basic econ class could tell them why.

Posted by: buzzion at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (z/Ubi)

41 "Shut Up," he polysyllabically explained.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (oVJmc)

42 Suicide, indeed. The global warming fraud has helped to create a healthy distrust of scientists among the pragmatics here and abroad. You wanna impress me, NASA, quit dicking around with "climate science" and put a man on Mars.

Posted by: cornbred at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (r9PPr)

43 The only way to be recognized as an expert or an elite is to demonstrate competence in a certain area. Being consistently wrong in your area of focus tends to work against that designation.

If you want me to take you seriously as an elite, be wrong less often.

Posted by: JackStraw at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (/tuJf)

44 I heard it's going to be an early night.

Posted by: Moron Robbie at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (/f1mm)

45 And Tom Nichols' desperation to have people take him seriously again even though no one's ever taken him seriously before...

------

But he *was* a helluva professional golfer.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (8XRCm)

46 And if it must be said, when people talk about the so-called "deep state," it's not just Obama loyalists.

It's Eastern Republican Liberal Establishment Surrender Monkeys as well.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (TOk1P)

47 I feel like you're looking at me. Why are you looking at me?

Posted by: Paul Krugman at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (Wp2lA)

48 The problem isn't expertise, it's experts. Whatever the discipline - science, medicine, law, economics, etc. - the people with expertise are still people. Being an expert doesn't make you an automaton.. you still have human motivations and human flaws, you simply have more information/tools at your disposal to get what you want.

Posted by: not the mama at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (EpAnP)

49 Ed Wood never penned truer words than - "All you Earth people are stupid!"

My favorite Wood line is "I woke up early the day I died."

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (X6fMO)

50 20
"Nuke power will be so cheap and plentiful and safe we'll be taking the meters off your houses."





Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (4geGT)

Actually it would have been really cheap if we had not turned it over to the government bureaucrats to regulate.

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (mpXpK)

51 40 Experts keep telling us that they can fund programs by raising taxes on tobacco. And then they are left making excuses for why its underfunded when most people that haven't even taken a basic econ class could tell them why.
Posted by: buzzion at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (z/Ubi)

My personal local fave was where they built two new bridges- which they placed tolls on. There were two existing bridges that they left 'free.' Let's guess what happens next!

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (R7+kO)

52 Taking a small sliver of "experts": The political pundits, especially on the left.

It's obvious that they're probably never studied a whole lot of American history pre-Civil Rights movement. It's also pretty obvious that they have, at best, a tangential knowledge of the constitution itself, much less its practice through history.

So, these "experts" of politics actually don't know much of American political history or American political thought. This situation leads to guffaws about how such and such action is unprecedented, when people like Jackson, Lincoln, or even Polk did similar things.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (mC1ZI)

53 The experts gave Villanova a pretty good chance of repeating.

Posted by: MacGruber at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (sgrzZ)

54 Just watched some of Comey questioning. I just do not trust anything coming from any "Intelligence Source" any more. And that is a shame.

Posted by: lynndh at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (DaWUf)

55 43 The only way to be recognized as an expert or an elite is to demonstrate competence in a certain area. Being consistently wrong in your area of focus tends to work against that designation.

If you want me to take you seriously as an elite, be wrong less often.
Posted by: JackStraw at March 20, 2017 01:10 PM (/tuJf)

This.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (R7+kO)

56 What is the saying?

We are being pandered to by our inferiors.

Posted by: rd at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (iT57s)

57 >>>Ein Experten gets all butthurt like Amy Bishop because people reject the BS being spewed.

That's DOCTOR Amy Bishop, meatsack!!

PEWPEWPEW

Posted by: Banana Splits Guy at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (h1x9+)

58 Hey, remember that Family Guy episode where Peter, who's be hurt very badly for some reason, walks into a stem cell clinic and then walks out ten minutes later in perfect health? He says, "Why is this illegal?" or something.

Yeah....
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:08 PM (mC1ZI)


Family Guy can be funny, but they like to go hard left a lot. There was an episode where Stewie and Brian travel into an alternate dimension where Christianity never existed and it's portrayed as a futuristic paradise. Never mind that the pagan religions were often bloodthirsty or brutal and repressive.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (Tnhbr)

59 50 20
"Nuke power will be so cheap and plentiful and safe we'll be taking the meters off your houses."





Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (4geGT)

Actually it would have been really cheap if we had not turned it over to the government bureaucrats to regulate.
Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (mpXpK)

Listen to Vic. He's our nuke expert. Wait.. What?

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (fgzLM)

60 The experts in the 70's assured me that the earth would be destroyed by global cooling.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (fgzLM)


Man-made, even. Interestingly, caused by burning fossil fuels - the same exact cause that those same experts are now trying to tell us is causing catastrophic global warming. Pretty nifty trick, there. If one weren't an "expert" one might arrive at the conclusion that the leftists just hate fossil fuels and the advancements burning them brings ...

"It's the oil cans! He HATES the oil cans!!!" -- Expert

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (zc3Db)

61 The experts gave Villanova a pretty good chance of repeating.
Posted by: MacGruber at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (sgrzZ)

-----

Yeah... well my brackets a wreck.

I picked Duke to beat Villanova.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (8XRCm)

62 My personal local fave was where they built two new bridges- which they placed tolls on. There were two existing bridges that they left 'free.' Let's guess what happens next!


Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (R7+kO)


Now they're all toll bridges?

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (X6fMO)

63 My favorite quote from Krugman:

"The growth of the Internet will slow drastically, as the flaw in 'Metcalfe's law'-which states that the number of potential connections in a network is proportional to the square of the number of participants-becomes apparent: most people have nothing to say to each other! By 2005 or so, it will become clear that the Internet's impact on the economy has been no greater than the fax machine's."

Printed in 1998 in Time Magazine.

Posted by: Martbell at March 20, 2017 01:13 PM (OxL9z)

64 Everyone is retarded. I would rather listen to people who at least admit they are uninformed, than listen to retards who insist they are SMRT.

Posted by: wooga at March 20, 2017 01:13 PM (3I7wr)

65 More and more often these experts only remind me of Joe Isuzu.




I'd trust Alf before I'd trust Joe.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 20, 2017 01:13 PM (Uohrc)

66 58
Family Guy can be funny, but they like to go hard left a lot. There was an episode where Stewie and Brian travel into an alternate dimension where Christianity never existed and it's portrayed as a futuristic paradise. Never mind that the pagan religions were often bloodthirsty or brutal and repressive.
Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (Tnhbr)

===================

Shhh....Athiests aren't supposed to acknowledge such factors.

Christianity has brought 0 good things to the world.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:13 PM (mC1ZI)

67 More recently the experts told us that embryonic stem cell research would be the cure all for mankind's ills.
Posted by: Jack Sock
________


Supposedly that's been one of the biggest "duds" in medical science that have done almost nothing. We were told over and over Bush was keeping us from living forever if he would just let us start harvesting babies.

Whenever something in "science" gets really political, that's when you know it's bullshit.

Posted by: Maritime at March 20, 2017 01:13 PM (9cYRJ)

68 56 What is the saying?

We are being pandered to by our inferiors.
Posted by: rd at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (iT57s)

We are being lectured to by them. That's more infuriating.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:13 PM (R7+kO)

69 Experts keep telling us that they can fund programs by raising taxes on tobacco.

Well, at some point soon, only Warren Buffett will be able to afford a pack of smokes.

Posted by: Notorious BFD at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (vtcmf)

70 >>Yeah... well my brackets a wreck.



I picked Duke to beat Villanova.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (8XRCm)<<
Ouch.

Posted by: MacGruber at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (sgrzZ)

71 Skepticism is good.
Posted by: @votermom @vm at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (Om16U)


Prove it.

Posted by: hogmartin at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (8nWyX)

72 Family Guy can be funny, but they like to go hard left a lot. There was an episode where Stewie and Brian travel into an alternate dimension where Christianity never existed and it's portrayed as a futuristic paradise. Never mind that the pagan religions were often bloodthirsty or brutal and repressive.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (Tnhbr)


They lost me when Stewie time-traveled back to Nazi Germany and showed up in an SS uniform wearing a "McCain-Palin" button.

Get cancer and die, McFarlane.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (X6fMO)

73 O/T (kinda) - The Iowa State SJW Battalions have succeeded in running off the current president to Auburn University.
Yes, he was a scandalous jackwagon, for sure, they just haven't given any thought to the devil that they don't know that will replace him. It could be that he/she is not so PC friendly.
Times are changing my friends, and the sea, she is an angry one.

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (4geGT)

74 My daughter is an expert.

Posted by: Brian Williams at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (7q/fS)

75 The experts say that Hillary is up by 8 in Wisconsin.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (8ZskC)

76 "Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts."

-Richard Feynman

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (Yi9Gb)

77 Listen to Vic. He's our nuke expert.

He used to put the moves on Marie Curie.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (X6fMO)

78 My favorite quote from Krugman:

-----

That's ENRON FINANCIAL ADVISER Krugman to you pal.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (8XRCm)

79 Experts declare Amy Schumer greatest comedian who ever lived. And we should know because we're...The Experts!

Posted by: The Experts at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (qJhUV)

80 Whenever something in "science" gets really political, that's when you know it's in search of dollars it can't get anywhere else."

FIFY.

Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (MINbv)

81 Is that supposed to be an article or an op-ed?

If that's supposed to be straight journalism, then congratulations, you've just demonstrated exactly why "experts" are rejected. And - spoiler alert! - it's because you rejected us first, jerks.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (NOIQH)

82 Consensus told me that Tom's explanation came up short, however when I called him to corroborate, I couldn't reach anyone.

Posted by: David Rappaport at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (0VJL6)

83 Another problem with our modern conception of experts:

Neil DeGrasse Tyson

If the guy wants to talk about astrophysics, I'd bet that he's probably a good authority to speak on the subject. But how does that qualify him to talk about public policy in terms of almost anything else? And yet, if you disagree with his pronouncements on political economy, you're classified as an anti-intellectual.

Makes me love experts as a class more and more every time it's trotted out, it does.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (mC1ZI)

84 Now they're all toll bridges?
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (X6fMO)

Not yet. Heh. I actually took a ride on one of them at the beginning of Feb to see what it looked like. They did not install toll booths, but have cameras to snap pics of cars. Still have not gotten a bill. Government at work.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (R7+kO)

85 We ignore the self-titled "experts" because they're typically political hacks who are full of shit. They've demonstrated this over and over again.

Posted by: Insomniac - sin valor at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (0mRoj)

86 More and more often these experts only remind me of Joe Isuzu.

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM


PERFECT!!!!
For those of us who remember Joe Isuzu.

Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (0tfLf)

87 Skepticism is good.
Posted by: @votermom @vm at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (Om16U)



Remember when QUESTION AUTHORITY was the bumper sticker that all the cool kids had? It sorta died out about 8 years ago but I predict a big comeback.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (8ZskC)

88 It was aliens.

Posted by: Expert on Aliens at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (7HtZB)

89 Trust me, boys. This movie's gonna be a hit! Trust me, I'm an expert.

Posted by: Producer of Ishtar at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (Wp2lA)

90 The Experts tell us "It will be so cheap the meters we will soon take the meters off your houses."

Rube McVoter knows the meters will NEVER come off your houses but that new meters will be needed in perpetuity.

See also: Doctors not kept and Favorite Plans not allowed.

Posted by: Lily Formerly of HotAir (Now from AoSHQ)assassin in the night at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (vivhj)

91 "A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week."

- especially in foreign affairs, no one likes to admit that you will always be wrong - thinking that the heathens that cover 75% of the planet will make deciscions in a civilized manner is a piss-poor base assumption

- because today's liberal arts education now longer has a strong core in calculus, science and western civ... modern academics below the age of 45 will always be wrong because they no longer have the intellectual depth, context and humility to understand there is always someone smarter than they are.

Posted by: George S Patton at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (DpOmP)

92 Pfft.

Richard Feynman. What does he know?

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (8ZskC)

93 83 Another problem with our modern conception of experts:

Neil DeGrasse Tyson

--------------

Even worse- Stephen Hawking

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (Yi9Gb)

94 No one should be deemed an expert in a field that relys on a great deal of subjectivity as evidence.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (fgzLM)

95 89 Trust me, boys. This movie's gonna be a hit! Trust me, I'm an expert.
Posted by: Producer of Ishtar at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (Wp2lA)

Exactly.

Posted by: Waterworld at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (R7+kO)

96 My grandfather's defintion:

"Ex-" someone who used to be something.
"Spurt" a drip under pressure.

Posted by: Martbell at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (OxL9z)

97 I would've voted for Hillary but I couldn't fit through the door after going on the Food Pyramid diet.
BTW does anyone want to buy a windmill? It costs a fortune to have someone sweep up all the dead birds.

Posted by: Hyronomus Borscht at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (OhTOr)

98 Which is more likely:

1 - Americans became stupid and stubborn
2 - Americans gained access to the world's biggest and most complete database of knowledge and information in history and began to fact check experts, finding they are often mistaken, biased, politically motivated, and just plain wrong

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (39g3+)

99 Yeah... well my brackets a wreck.



I picked Duke to beat Villanova.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (8XRCm)
Ouch.
Posted by: MacGruber at March 20, 2017 01:14 PM (sgrzZ)

------

With FLORIDA FUCKING STATE to go the Final Four.

Half of my bracket is annhilated.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (8XRCm)

100 Experts agree, 98% of statistics are made up on the spot.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (kTF2Z)

101 "Cultural misunderstanding:"
http://tinyurl.com/jqnehpn

Is expert speak for not kissing your betters ass quickly enough in the exact way they demand it be kissed. Another commonality between Islam and our Progressive "elites" is the demand for submission to their fantasy worldview --- or else.

Posted by: geoffb5 at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (d3wbb)

102 Oh fuck you. Just fuck you all!

Posted by: The Scarecrow at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (OhTOr)

103 Of course there's also another option:

3 - Experts have become less impressive, knowledgeable, informed, and capable over the years, due to increasingly substandard education.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (39g3+)

104 The problem resides in what denotes expertise?

How do you get to be acknowledged as an Expert?

Today? It College degrees... which means you learned at the feet of someone else.. someone who probably NEVER DID THE DAMN JOB...

A degree where a lot of your classes are taught by Graduate Students... who just learned at the feet of someone else, who had never done the job... who had learned from someone else, who had never....

Well... I think you get the idea...

Posted by: Don Q. at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (NgKpN)

105 The problem with experts is that so many of them in the government have no experience with what they are experts in.

Posted by: Jen at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (E3QyW)

106 98 Which is more likely:

1 - Americans became stupid and stubborn
2 - Americans gained access to the world's biggest and most complete database of knowledge and information in history and began to fact check experts, finding they are often mistaken, biased, politically motivated, and just plain wrong
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (39g3+)

=====================

"Well, we've taught our students to be illiterate, so I'm gonna go with #1."
-NYC Schools Superintendent

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (mC1ZI)

107 93 83 Another problem with our modern conception of experts:

Neil DeGrasse Tyson

--------------

Even worse- Stephen Hawking
Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (Yi9Gb)

Or Bill the Science guy. Who is not a science guy. And I am open to skepticism on him being a guy.

He may actually be named 'Bill.'

Posted by: Waterworld at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (R7+kO)

108 World should be run by experts, say experts

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (Yi9Gb)

109 61 The experts gave Villanova a pretty good chance of repeating.
Posted by: MacGruber at March 20, 2017 01:11 PM (sgrzZ)

-----
Yeah... well my brackets a wreck.

I picked Duke to beat Villanova.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM


Let go ZAGS!!!

Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (0tfLf)

110 My sense is that we don't think enough about how much we collectively, yet unwittingly, force experts to talk down to us.

Posted by: Banana Splits Guy at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (h1x9+)

111 Even worse- Stephen Hawking

You'll take that back when I'm the first to set foot on Mars! Wait, what?

Posted by: Stephen Hawking at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (vtcmf)

112 Even worse- Stephen Hawking
Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (Yi9Gb)



He's not always wrong. One of his most famous quotes is, "The cow says moooo."

He was right on that one.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (8ZskC)

113
Speaking of experts Jim Comey says that Russia is trying to undermine our democracy and will be back again in 2020!

Posted by: TheQuietMan at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (493sH)

114 Posted by: Expert on Aliens at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (7HtZB)

-----

Yeah.... we'd all sock that goofy Greek guy more... but it takes too long to spelled his name correctly.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (8XRCm)

115 95 89 Trust me, boys. This movie's gonna be a hit! Trust me, I'm an expert.
Posted by: Producer of Ishtar at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (Wp2lA)

Exactly.
Posted by: Waterworld at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (R7+kO)

I like the cut of your jib and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

Posted by: Producer of Lady Ghostbusters at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (7HtZB)

116 I was just thinking about this issue.

There seems to be some sort of unspoken assumption to the how dare the plebes not listen to us that being an expert means you are never wrong. Thus, when people say but you were wrong, like, all of the wrong, it's seen as an attack on expertise itself, not pointing out that, here's a shock, human beings got something wrong. There's nothing expert about refusing to learn from failure.

Take Nate Silver's see, see how I was actually right in my polling, I wasn't wrong post after the 2016 Presidential election. Underneath the ego protection, it was an interesting discussion of confidence levels and margins of error and how the "experts" all read the results to lead to one conclusion and then utterly failed to tell the audience that, hey, these polls fall within this margin which also means it can go the other way.

I'm far more terrified about the revelations that hard science studies are turning out to be non-replicable. I mean, look, I'm shocked that any sociological study would ever replicate. But drug trials only reproducing 1/3 of the time? The hell.

By the by, the Nassim Taleb article linked in the Insty piece is very very well put indeed.

Posted by: alexthechick - rrraaawwwrrr at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (mf5HN)

117 If the guy wants to talk about astrophysics, I'd bet that he's probably a good authority to speak on the subject.

He has very shaky claims to competence even there...nothing you couldn't hear from, say, a grad student.

On the other hand, how to run a planetarium gift shop....he's probably a good authority.

Posted by: VA GOP Sucks at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (tVWQB)

118 107 Or Bill the Science guy. Who is not a science guy. And I am open to skepticism on him being a guy.

He may actually be named 'Bill.'

Posted by: Waterworld at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (R7+kO)

===================

He's a mechanical engineer and a comedian.

You know, a guy who knows everything about global warming, the economy, and politics.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (mC1ZI)

119 79 Experts declare Amy Schumer greatest comedian who ever lived. And we should know because we're...The Experts!
Posted by: The Experts at March 20, 2017 01:15 PM (qJhUV)
===

If you haven't already check out Milo's interview on Night Line last summer. When Terry Moran told Milo he thought Amy Schumer was funny, Milo laughed at him and said he must have a very low standard when it comes to comedy. Moran's face afterward was priceless. So much butthurt.

Posted by: Independent George at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (BDZWU)

120 Most of all a college degree doesn't make one an expert in anything other than going to college.

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (mpXpK)

121 Hawking is capable enough but he started to believe his own hype. If he wasn't in the wheelchair, he'd have been a nobody writing technically detailed papers in some university somewhere.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (39g3+)

122 103 Of course there's also another option:

3 - Experts have become less impressive, knowledgeable, informed, and capable over the years, due to increasingly substandard education.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:18 PM (39g3+)

I love the business shows that have REPORTERS talking about business and the stock market...

If they were such experts, why the hell would they be working for a TV station? If they knew SOOOOO much, wouldn't they be RICH?

Posted by: Don Q. at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (NgKpN)

123 111 Even worse- Stephen Hawking

You'll take that back when I'm the first to set foot on Mars! Wait, what?
Posted by: Stephen Hawking at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (vtcmf)

Forget it, he's rolling

Posted by: josephistan at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (7HtZB)

124 Off, odd watery dystopian global warming sock.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (R7+kO)

125 >>>>The experts in the 70's assured me that the earth would be destroyed by global cooling.
.
.
.Don't forget the African Killer Bee invasion circa 1970 and some of these other favorites that the "experts" have said were going to kill us all:

Acid Rain destroying the World's forests

Peak Oil (my personal favorite as it keeps coming back)

World Wide Famine in conjunction with:

Over Population

Honey Bee collapse


Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (le7jz)

126 OT - that picture of Comey on Drudge - he looks like a ferret with rabies.

Posted by: IC at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (a0IVu)

127 Experts tend to evaluate things within a self-imposed mindset established by the members of their caste. After all, they are only "experts" because others say they are experts. The group think is strong.

So, when confronted by a reality that doesn't fit in their mindset, experts are frequently out of their depth. The thing is, "normal" people, who don't have those blinders on, are more accurate in those situations.

Experts say that the US can't deport all the illegals. They live in a world where such a thing is unthinkable. But it's not, and the normals know it.

Posted by: Revenant at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (NUNXH)

128 Tall men are stupid. Now go to the Prom with me.

Posted by: Bobby Reich at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (OhTOr)

129 Trust me, boys. This movie's gonna be a hit! Trust me, I'm an expert.
Posted by: Producer of Ishtar at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (Wp2lA)
__________________________________

Gigli.....

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (4geGT)

130 today's liberal arts education now longer has a strong core in calculus, science and western civ."

Heck, today's "science" grads can't solve for "x".

I know a "meteorology" degree holder from a State School who never took an advanced mathematics course, nor any chem or bio beyond "introduction to" levels.
It's gotten pretty bad out there in spots...

Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (MINbv)

131 Gentlemen, the world is getting tired of our product. Now is the time to embrace the future.

*lifts sheet covering a 2 liter bottle*

I give you.....NEW COKE!

Posted by: Conversation in Coca-Cola boardroom in 1985 at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (Wp2lA)

132

What the US needs is better accreditation of certification. With a national standard for areas of expertise, applicants could be tested, using standardized tests. Once certified in an area of acknowledged expertise, we could then be certain that the well tested and certified expert could be trusted.

Clearly, this is a failure of government standards.

Posted by: Committee for the Protection of Expertise at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (Updw+)

133 Even worse- Stephen Hawking

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (Yi9Gb)


Let's not go crazy. Hawkings is a serious genius. His problem with embracing leftism is that he's an emotional wreck, which isn't hard to understand. Sadly, his emotional damage infects his thinking on subjects that are outside of his real interest, but there is no question that he is one of the smartest people on Earth. That doesn't mean that he's correct on everything.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (zc3Db)

134 He's a mechanical engineer and a comedian.

He's a mechanical engineer in the way you are a linguist because you took some Spanish classes in college. I don't think he's ever held a single job in the field or studied since his 20s

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (39g3+)

135 Yes, as Thomas Sowell has pointed out (though he has sometimes violated his own proscription), the problem is one of attribution and attempted cross-pollination of 'expertise.' Just because you are an expert in, say, fluid mechanics, doesn't mean you know anything about domestic oil and gas policy.

We're expected to treat people with credentials as if their credentials spill over into other fields. Nowhere else is this the case. If an MD wants to represent you in court and shows his med school diploma as proof that he knows the inner workings of the law, you'd laugh at him.

Sometimes this manifests in an absolutely ridiculous manner. Who was the theater critic who tries to opine on matters of political policy, Frank Rich? Go write about Wicked, you mediocre lackwit.

Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (oZ6kz)

136 40 Experts keep telling us that they can fund programs by raising taxes on tobacco. And then they are left making excuses for why its underfunded when most people that haven't even taken a basic econ class could tell them why.
Posted by: buzzion at March 20, 2017 01:09 PM (z/Ubi)



Here's a gem for you. The PRC - People's Republic of California - proposes to fund construction of HIGH. SPEED. RAIL. through the proceeds of their crap and trade auctions.

Except nobody is bidding on, much less buying, their eco-indulgences. So their plans have a small but noticeable $64 billion shortfall. And that's just the money that goes to Dianne Feinstein's hubby.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (SRKgf)

137 The larger discussions, from what constitutes a
nutritious diet to what actions will best further U.S. interests,
require conversations between ordinary citizens and experts. But
increasingly, citizens don't want to have those conversations
...



Oh, we were "having a conversation" when they banned our lightbulbs based on tweaked climate change data and rigged models?

We were *having a conversation* when they told us eggs would kill us, then no, they won't, now it's butter - no wait! - it's carbs and red meat, so we must all become vegans blah blah blah?



Alrighty!

Posted by: Lizzy at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (NOIQH)

138 >>experting is hard and stuff.


Serious, you guys!

Posted by: garrett at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (NJrRe)

139 130 today's liberal arts education now longer has a strong core in calculus, science and western civ."

Heck, today's "science" grads can't solve for "x".

I know a "meteorology" degree holder from a State School who never took an advanced mathematics course, nor any chem or bio beyond "introduction to" levels.
It's gotten pretty bad out there in spots...
Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (MINbv)

===================

Liberal Arts educations, at least historically, included learning either Greek or Latin and translating a work of Homer or the Aeneid into English.

The fact that I have a "liberal arts" degree and did not do that makes me think of my own achievements in college.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:23 PM (mC1ZI)

140 1. Peak oil.
2. High carb diets.
3. THE NUCLEAR FREEZE (still my favorite despite being #3 here).

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 20, 2017 01:23 PM (B+qrE)

141 Remember when the "experts" said the atom was the smallest unit of matter, until someone invented an atom smasher and a whole bunch of crap started flying out of it?

Before then, the experts were unassailable.

What else are they objectively wrong about, and how much of that will we find out about?

Posted by: VA GOP Sucks at March 20, 2017 01:23 PM (tVWQB)

142 Hold my beer and watch this...

Posted by: A expert at March 20, 2017 01:24 PM (OhTOr)

143 People is Academia and people who work in government type positions are unfortunately what society deems as "experts", and these same people are usually hard left and they have decided to exploit their position of power to shape American culture as well.

It's not much different than Hollywood celebrities. Them being actors has nothing to do with public policy, but they will do every thing they can to try and shape it.

Posted by: Maritime at March 20, 2017 01:24 PM (9cYRJ)

144 Does anyone have any recent pictures of Presdent Obama? Brattleboro misses him and would like to post any pictures on the city website. We still all love are Presdent of Color and wish he woulds return and get rid of that idiot TRUMP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: Mary Clogginstien from Brattleboro, VT at March 20, 2017 01:24 PM (WmgTn)

145 131 Gentlemen, the world is getting tired of our product. Now is the time to embrace the future.

*lifts sheet covering a 2 liter bottle*

I give you.....NEW COKE!
Posted by: Conversation in Coca-Cola boardroom in 1985 at March 20, 2017 01:21 PM (Wp2lA)

===================

Read up on that.

They did a lot of market research that all point to: We'll lose about 10% of our customers if we do this.

They thought it would be reasonable because they could make it up with new customers.

The single largest problem? That 10% They were Coke's most loyal customers.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:24 PM (mC1ZI)

146 >>We're expected to treat people with credentials as if their credentials spill over into other fields.



We're supposed to listen to America Ferrara's lectures on trangenders, and Katy Perry on feminism, and George Clooney on refugees because....they made a lot of money acting and singing?!?

Posted by: Lizzy at March 20, 2017 01:24 PM (NOIQH)

147 Acid Rain destroying the World's forests

Peak Oil (my personal favorite as it keeps coming back)

World Wide Famine in conjunction with:

Over Population

Honey Bee collapse


ALAR
Hole in the Ozone Layer
Jungle deforestation
on and on it goes...

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (39g3+)

148 Well, I don't think a classic Liberal Arts education included calculus. Mostly because it hadn't been invented yet. But it did include mathematics, natural science and rhetoric.

Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (oZ6kz)

149
"Well, we've taught our students to be illiterate, so I'm gonna go with #1."
-NYC Schools Superintendent

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (mC1ZI)

Students? Hell, they have illiterate teachers now.

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (2x9LM)

150 They're packaged the same way. Multiple models, none are right, and they're constantly tweaking them? Sounds like a scam, even if you don't know the subject.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:07 PM (mC1ZI)
---------

I had never thought of it that way but once he said it, I realized why I so reflexively reject the arguments made by climate scientists. It's because my general bullshit detector was going off.

Posted by: Moron Pundit at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (xeeHA)

151 Speaking of so called experts, I still remember The Young Turks on election night telling us 'Donald Trump has lost his home state of New York', 'folks, its all over for him'...heh.

Posted by: IC at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (a0IVu)

152 Just reading Frank Rich's latest hate screed, posted over at Insty.

"Die White Working Class Scum!" has become a whole genre of political writing now. And of course we have our "own" in Kevin D. Williamson as well.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (ul9CR)

153 Why would you think Trump knows how to make money and create jobs when all he's done is build hundreds of projects employing thousands of people.

Posted by: Intersectional Raceology N'Shit Major at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (OhTOr)

154 Posted by: Producer of Ishtar at March 20, 2017 01:16 PM (Wp2lA)

The funny thing is, Ishtar was not actually that bad of a movie and some judicious cutting might have saved it.

But nothing could have saved Heaven's Gate.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (X6fMO)

155 Many "experts' are simply people who are good at "knowing" facts. They are almost always wrong when it comes to putting those facts together and drawing HONEST conclusions from them.
And from there it's a small step to actually making up facts and shit to make them fit your pre-conceived conclusions.

Posted by: JoeF. at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (7uYFy)

156 Remember when the "experts" said the atom was the smallest unit of matter, until someone invented an atom smasher and a whole bunch of crap started flying out of it?


To be fair, that was Democritus and he lived about 2400 years ago. Give the guy a break. Atom smashers were hard to come by in 400 B.C.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (8ZskC)

157 Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (zc3Db)

Well that's exactly what I meant. Just saying too many people consider him an "authority" on any- and everything.

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (Yi9Gb)

158 When stating your hypothesis, it's very important to have come to your conclusion first.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (kTF2Z)

159 Norway is the happiest country.

Posted by: Steve and Cold Bear at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (vRcUp)

160 The modern college degree is now easier to obtain than getting toilet paper in Venezuela... Academic rigor is passe

Posted by: Kingman Brewster at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (DpOmP)

161 "Listen to your friend, Billy Zane. He's a cool dude."

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (zsHGH)

162 "That's why, next year, every car built in America will have holes in its sides."---- Buick Engineer, 1948

Posted by: Jinx the Cat at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (TnUKj)

163 117 If the guy wants to talk about astrophysics, I'd bet that he's probably a good authority to speak on the subject.
He has very shaky claims to competence even there...nothing you couldn't hear from, say, a grad student.
On the other hand, how to run a planetarium gift shop....he's probably a good authority.
Posted by: VA GOP Sucks at March 20, 2017 01:20 PM (tVWQB)



This. As I've previously "opined," as the lawyers say, Tyson's resume screams "fail to launch grad student given his Ph.D. with the tacit understanding that he would not be supported should he apply for a position in the field of his Ph.D."

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (SRKgf)

164 Comey is put forward as some sort of expert on law enforcement. I listen to him for ten minutes and don't develop any impression of great knowledge or aptitude.

Posted by: ejo at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (il4FI)

165 If you can fill an auditorium with 'experts' who are split down the middle with opposite views, then you can bet that subject is not conducive to having an expert opinion attached to it.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (fgzLM)

166 Liberal Arts educations, at least historically, included learning either Greek or Latin"

Dead (semi) White Men, so no go on that today.

Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (MINbv)

167 Eggs are good for you!
Eggs are bad for you!
Eggs are good for you!
Eggs are bad for you!
Eggs are good for you!
Eggs are bad for you!

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (4geGT)

168 141 Remember when the "experts" said the atom was the smallest unit of matter, until someone invented an atom smasher and a whole bunch of crap started flying out of it?

Before then, the experts were unassailable.

What else are they objectively wrong about, and how much of that will we find out about?
Posted by: VA GOP Sucks at March 20, 2017 01:23 PM (tVWQB)

====================

That's different.

That's a science that continually advances with evidence based hypothesis testing.

If that's what we had in terms of experts, the War on Poverty would have been 100% scrapped after a decade.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (mC1ZI)

169 Does anyone have any recent pictures of Presdent Obama? Brattleboro misses him and would like to post any pictures on the city website. We still all love are Presdent of Color and wish he woulds return and get rid of that idiot TRUMP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: Mary Clogginstien from Brattleboro, VT at March 20, 2017 01:24 PM (WmgTn)




Trying doing a search for hardcore gay pron in Tahiti

Posted by: TheQuietMan at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (493sH)

170 Hillary Clinton will be America's first female president!

Posted by: The Experts at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (qJhUV)

171 151 Speaking of so called experts, I still remember The Young Turks on election night telling us 'Donald Trump has lost his home state of New York', 'folks, its all over for him'...heh.


Best part for me was when Ana Gasbagian had to leave the studio and get buzzed, she was so upset. Then she came back and did her White Women are EVIL routine.

She should have hit the bong a few more times.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (ul9CR)

172 The "experts" believe the rest of us are stupid. Not think, believe. It makes them intellectually lazy.

Especially when they're in he love science sexually echo chamber where they don't have to defend their beliefs.

Posted by: Chupacabra at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (Smm/k)

173 You stupid hicks are too stupid to see how smart your betters are because you are stupid. And we are smart.

Stupid.

Posted by: Mortimer, FINISH HER! at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (jvwxX)

174 103,
"3 - Experts have become less impressive, knowledgeable, informed, and
capable over the years, due to increasingly substandard education."


It might not be so much that the education is "substandard" as it is that those selected to get that higher degree credential are selected by ideology and not so much by evidence of scholarship and intelligence.

Posted by: geoffb5 at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (d3wbb)

175 @Steve and Cold Bear

I'm not sure we're wired for happiness. The best we manage is a certain contentment in front of a warm fire.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (zsHGH)

176 Read up on that.

They did a lot of market research that all point to: We'll lose about 10% of our customers if we do this.

They thought it would be reasonable because they could make it up with new customers.

The single largest problem? That 10% They were Coke's most loyal customers.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:24 PM (mC1ZI)

The conspiracy theory I like most there is that they wanted to be able to change the formula of old coke to use HFCS instead of sugar and this was all an elaborate plan to get that done with less people squawking.

May be a bit too generous to the coke execs, but it makes more sense.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (R7+kO)

177 Even worse- Stephen Hawking
Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (Yi9Gb)

The Discovery Channel? is advertising some new show called Curiosity. The show looks interesting but in the ad, they have a brief clip of Stephen Hawking looking at the camera.

I'm sorry, but he is just the most frightening looking person who is actual alive.

And it's amazing how someone who is supposedly so brilliant can be so dumb about things. He is quoted as saying that since Trump was elected, he's afraid he's not welcome in the USA.

And Climate Change is real and Scott Pruitt should be removed from the EPA.

Posted by: Jen at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (E3QyW)

178 That took me like half an hour to read the article and Glenn Reynold's rebuttal.

Yeesh, what a cock (the original article, not Reynolds)

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (wmaTe)

179 159 Norway is the happiest country.
Posted by: Steve and Cold Bear at March 20, 2017 01:26 PM (vRcUp)


Lay back and think of Norway when you're getting raped.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (fgzLM)

180 In the past, the "experts" were generally in the hard sciences. It was hard to fake an engineering solution or a vaccine.

Fast forward, now many of the "experts" come from the social sciences and claim to apply hard science methodology. Except they do it in non-replicable ways that do nothing more than leave avenues open for "additional study." And by additional study, I mean "grant money."

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (B+qrE)

181 ace, no idea if this is true or not but it is trueish and sums up an American attitude that still baffles these of so educated 'experts'. Back in the early 1800s when Kentucky was the frontier, there was an English nobleman riding through the Kentucky backwoods. It was getting late in the day and the Englishman was beginning to look for a place to stay for the evening. Used to the English way of being able to look for shelter in other noble houses, this good Englishman spotted a hillbilly tending to his farm. He rode up to the farmer and inquired 'where his master's house was'. The farmer looked at the Englishman and replied 'reckon that son of bitch ain't been born yet'.

We do listen to what 'experts' say, we do not reflexively do what they say because we are free born men with the ultimate gift, free will. What 'experts' truly want is for us to regard them as masters and sovereigns. Which is the most un-American attitude one can have.

Posted by: joe, no that other one at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (7pOq5)

182 IT is a truth universally acknowledged, that the more truly expert someone is, the less likely he is to consider himself one.

Posted by: George LeS at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (+TcCF)

183 Some idiot Governor in New York said it's ok to have illiterates teaching in our schools... He's almost as stupid as his idiot little brother

Posted by: Mario Cuomo at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (DpOmP)

184 You know who didn't listen to experts don't you?
HITLER.

Posted by: Intersectional Raceology N'Shit Major at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (OhTOr)

185 141
Remember when the "experts" said the atom was the smallest unit of
matter, until someone invented an atom smasher and a whole bunch of crap
started flying out of it?



Before then, the experts were unassailable.



What else are they objectively wrong about, and how much of that will we find out about?

Posted by: VA GOP Sucks at March 20, 2017 01:23 PM (tVWQB)

For the longest time it was believed the Earth was flat, and the sun oribited the Earth. To believe otherwise was heresy.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (jxbfJ)

186
Econ Major.


I took a class called Math of Finance. I thought "easy peezy"...... time value of money, simple and compound interst, present value interest factors. Piece of Cake.

Holy shit. Most was calculus calculating rates of change on curved graph plots...on things like money supply, changes in interest rates on employment curves, effects of taxation on velocity of money..... some of the hardest math I ever did.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (8XRCm)

187 It's not that they're stupid.
Doing what is best for America and Americans is not their goal.
No national soveriegnty and a one world govt is their goal.
Bleeding the country's wealth through endless, stupid wars, a welfare system that destroys families and an educational (including all forms of media) system that seeks to destroy both families are just part of achieving that goal.

Posted by: teej at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (6CZio)

188 Read up on that.

They did a lot of market research that all point to: We'll lose about 10% of our customers if we do this.

They thought it would be reasonable because they could make it up with new customers.

The single largest problem? That 10% They were Coke's most loyal customers.


There's actually a more business-based reason.

At that time, the use of cane sugar was getting expensive, and Coca Cola stood to save a lot of cash by switching to high fructose corn syrup. Problem was, the Coke formula needed quite a bit of tweaking to even come close to the original taste. What to do?

Coke elected to do a switcheroo...they came out with New Coke as a way to start the switchover, and when Coke Classic was released (with the fanfare of "hey, we listen to our customers!") it was with the tweaked HFCS formula. It wasn't the same as the original Coke, but by then it didn't matter. Coca Cola weathered the storm and successfully switched out a key ingredient in its product.

Posted by: VA GOP Sucks at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (tVWQB)

189
First!

Posted by: Super Smart Elitist Foreign Policy Asshole at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (jvwxX)

190 150 I had never thought of it that way but once he said it, I realized why I so reflexively reject the arguments made by climate scientists. It's because my general bullshit detector was going off.
Posted by: Moron Pundit at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (xeeHA)

===================

He refuses to say which way he thinks on the subject itself, constantly saying that he'll never know the science enough to make an informed opinion.

He's just concerned with the persuasion of it. And he constantly finds it lacking even though the sources themselves (scientists) should be more persuasive than the critics.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (mC1ZI)

191 Yes, as Thomas Sowell has pointed out (though he has sometimes violated his own proscription), the problem is one of attribution and attempted cross-pollination of 'expertise.' Just because you are an expert in, say, fluid mechanics, doesn't mean you know anything about domestic oil and gas policy.

Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (oZ6kz)


I'm going to have to split with Sowell, here. The point is that someone who is an expert in fluid dynamics - or, let's just say a mathematician, more generally - is smarter than your average bear and is able to analyze many, many other fields better than even many of the "experts" in those particular fields.

The problem comes in when people who are experts in fields that don't really require they be that smart use their credentials to move their mediocre minds over to the analyses of other fields. But a genius is a genius and the chances are that a real genius (which is more than an expert, BTW) will be able to make more sense out of field X than a guy who has been working in that field for decades.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (zc3Db)

192 What if the experts view an outcome in different terms than average person? Obamacare being one good example.

'Experts' look at a balance sheet, see a number of enrollees, and trumpet 'success,' and ignore skyrocketing premiums for people who actually do the paying, huge deductables making the insurance useless, supply drying up.

Too many 'experts' view 'I Got Mine' as a success.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (oVJmc)

193 But nothing could have saved Heaven's Gate.


Was Heaven's Gate that bad?

I had heard the horror stories. I know Cimino was expected to follow up Deer Hunter and he went way over time and over budget and everybody lost their shit.

But I saw some of it on teevee once and it seemed like a competent horse opera. I believe that Cimino and Kris Kristofferson and others involved in it still stand behind it.

Posted by: Bandersnatch, gentleman cad at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (gIRsn)

194 ALAR "

That's a good one. Wasn't that when Ms Streep (she of the overacting credentials) testified before Congress (or some other hearing) since she had played a farm person of some sort?

Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (MINbv)

195
Lay back and think of Norway when you're getting raped.
Posted by: Jack Sock

It only helps a little.

Posted by: Sweden at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (TnUKj)

196 Oh! No shit. Just googled the guy -- 5 time jeopardy! champion (right on), writer at the federalist (interesting...), and a prominent nevertrumper who urged conservatives to vote for hillary! (sounds about right.)

Yeah, I can see why he's butthurt.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (wmaTe)

197 @joe, no that other one

+1

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (zsHGH)

198 "Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (R7+kO) "

I thought the conspiracy was that they floated New Coke to fail purposely so that people would be begging for the return of Coke Classic, which would increase sales when it was reintroduced.

Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (oZ6kz)

199 For the longest time it was believed the Earth was flat, and the sun oribited the Earth.


I never believed that shit.

Posted by: Eratosthenes at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (8ZskC)

200 Can't get much more Globalist and One World Government then the CFR and their rag Foreign Affairs.

How should I say this?...Fuck them.

Posted by: nip at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (L5nkE)

201 Even worse- Stephen Hawking

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 20, 2017 01:17 PM (Yi9Gb)

Let's not go crazy. Hawkings is a serious genius. His problem with embracing leftism is that he's an emotional wreck, which isn't hard to understand. Sadly, his emotional damage infects his thinking on subjects that are outside of his real interest, but there is no question that he is one of the smartest people on Earth. That doesn't mean that he's correct on everything.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (zc3Db)


What's a genius? Somebody who does really well on tests? In school? With math?

Funny thing about genius, what good is it? What has the man done? Seriously, everybody says he's a genius, because of some book he "wrote" 40 years ago, that nobody really understood.

Is he still working? What are his discoveries? What practical benefit has he been to mankind?

Seriously. If he just drones out a bunch of calculations on his computer screen, I don't see how he's any more a genius that my grandpa, dribbling in his fruit cup in the nursing home.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (TOk1P)

202 Glass Houses isn't just Billy Joel's Best album, people.


...there are a lot of Egg Boiling Experts around these parts.

Posted by: garrett at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (NJrRe)

203 176 The conspiracy theory I like most there is that they wanted to be able to change the formula of old coke to use HFCS instead of sugar and this was all an elaborate plan to get that done with less people squawking.

May be a bit too generous to the coke execs, but it makes more sense.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:27 PM (R7+kO)

=================

I refuse to believe that they're that smart.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:30 PM (mC1ZI)

204 I don't see anything in his article about how public schools and college have for all intents and purposes abandoned debate. They have become indoctrination centers, so why would you expect these good lil' progressive soldiers to discuss anything? They've been programmed without the reason/debate feature. Deal with it.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 20, 2017 01:30 PM (NOIQH)

205 194 ALAR "

That's a good one. Wasn't that when Ms Streep (she of the overacting credentials) testified before Congress (or some other hearing) since she had played a farm person of some sort?
Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (MINbv)

Won't someone think of the children?!?!

Posted by: Meryl Screech at March 20, 2017 01:30 PM (7HtZB)

206 Just reading Frank Rich's latest hate screed, posted over at Insty.

"Die White Working Class Scum!" has become a whole genre of political writing now. And of course we have our "own" in Kevin D. Williamson as well.
Posted by: WhatWhatWhat?

______

The South used to be beloved by Democrats, it was the backbone of their party. Solid South. Now it's enemy #1 for progressives.

The Rust Belt/Midwest is hopefully doing the same thing.

It's amazing how all of a sudden Liberals are REALLY into free trade agreements and NAFTA as soon as those states like Michigan, WI, and PA flipped on them. They view it as punitive now

I bet nearly every Democrat would vote against renegotiating NAFTA if Trump led an effort.


Posted by: Maritime at March 20, 2017 01:30 PM (9cYRJ)

207 Meh, most experts are as clueless on everything outside their narrow area of expertise as anyone else, in my experience.But university culture is relentlessly politically progressive, and hence people whose expertise abuts on political issues are encouraged to act as though they are experts in those areas as well. There's no cultural disincentive to shut up and talk only about what you know, so long as you keep within the progressive narrative.

Posted by: Alcoholic Asshole Shut In at March 20, 2017 01:31 PM (CPk08)

208 There is no doubt that Mr. Nichols is knowledgeable with respect to his area of expertise. As was pointed out upthread, he is good at collecting data. I'm sure he knows more than most.

That has never been the issue.

The issue was, is, and always will be what they do with their data, and the total beclowning of most experts for decades has soured me on anyone who resorts to credentialism in an argument.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 20, 2017 01:31 PM (rF0hx)

209 We're expected to treat people with credentials as if their credentials spill over into other fields.

Right, someone is introduced as an expert in genetics, telling us about global warming, or an expert in chemistry telling us about economics. Maybe they know what they are talking about, but that is not their training. The classic example is the celebrity talking about politics or a product. You know I'm great at basketball so listen to me on investments....

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:31 PM (39g3+)

210 >>> My personal local fave was where they built two new bridges- which they placed tolls on. There were two existing bridges that they left 'free.' Let's guess what happens next!
......

I'll see your toll bridges and raise you HOV lanes. I-10 between Katy and Houston is a perfect example. You see, the experts explained, HOV lanes will reduce traffic and save the environment! Result: empty lane. Ok, you can use the HOV lane if you pay a toll (do tolls reduce traffic and save the environment too?). Result: traffic is 1000x worse because now all the idiots enter the highway, cut across 5 lanes of traffic on a sharp diagonal to get on the HOV/ toll lane, then do the same 5 miles down the road to get off so nothing moves.

I want a line item tax deduction where I can deduct tolls directly from gas and related road taxes. We all already paid taxes for road construction. If they charge us again, I want my money back.

Posted by: Damiano at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (n3oGs)

211 ----- ------ -------- ------Idea --------- Data -------Conclusion

Physical scientist------X--------------X-------------- X

Analytical chemist ------ ------- -----X------- -------

Social scientist------- ------- -------- --------- -------X

Philosopher------- -----X


(I hope this half-assed formatting works!)

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (SRKgf)

212 To be kind, not all experts understand the Law of Unintended Consequences...

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (4geGT)

213 >>>For the longest time it was believed the Earth was flat, and the sun oribited the Earth. To believe otherwise was heresy.

Have you talked to Shaq lately?

Posted by: Banana Splits Guy at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (h1x9+)

214 I've been an expert for 50 years. I've earned your respect.

Posted by: Paul Ehrlich at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (bc2Lc)

215 201 - What if there really is no Stephen Hawking? What if he's just a performance artist "mouthing" off smart-sounding computer generated lines?

Posted by: josephistan at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (7HtZB)

216
Or Bill the Science guy. Who is not a science guy. And I am open to skepticism on him being a guy.

He may actually be named 'Bill.'

Posted by: Waterworld at March 20, 2017 01:19 PM (R7+kO)

He got his start on a sketch-comedy show. He wanted to be a *comedian*.

Posted by: Hugh Jorgen at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (6GTWP)

217 193 But nothing could have saved Heaven's Gate.


Was Heaven's Gate that bad?

I had heard the horror stories. I know Cimino was expected to follow up Deer Hunter and he went way over time and over budget and everybody lost their shit.

But I saw some of it on teevee once and it seemed like a competent horse opera. I believe that Cimino and Kris Kristofferson and others involved in it still stand behind it.
Posted by: Bandersnatch, gentleman cad at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (gIRsn)

=====================

It's a very long and boring mess.

Some great visuals, though.

There's a shot of a fiddler riding skates through a rink while playing.

It's fantastic.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (mC1ZI)

218 The problem comes in when people who are experts in fields that don't really require they be that smart use their credentials to move their mediocre minds over to the analyses of other fields. But a genius is a genius and the chances are that a real genius (which is more than an expert, BTW) will be able to make more sense out of field X than a guy who has been working in that field for decades.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (zc3Db)

Well... if we're talking about quantum physics, maybe. But if we're talking about policy and politics (and, lets be honest, that encompasses a LOT of things) then we're just hearing some dudes political opinions.

Yeah, he might have a lot of diplomas and he may have scored well above average on the SAT, but I don't see how either of those make his opinions more valid then, say, mine.

Since the internet (and really, arguable, since public libraries) has been around, learning facts is easy. You can google the federal debt and get an answer in .31 seconds. We no longer need "experts" for that.

The implementation or policy part is where "experts" supposedly shine -- but they demonstrably don't. They're just egg headed versions of the drunk at the end of the bar ratting on about their opinions and preferred policies.

So why would I give them any more credence then the drunk at the end of the bar?

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (wmaTe)

219 Just don't believe all the "corporations": vaccines cause autism.

Posted by: Holywood at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (OhTOr)

220 Whenever I hear 'Foreign Affairs' I reach for my revolver.

God, they suck. We're talking outer space vacuum levels of suck these days.

Posted by: JEM at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (TppKb)

221 Those who can't do, teach. Those who can't teach are experts.

Posted by: Damiano at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (n3oGs)

222 I had never thought of it that way but once he said it, I realized why I so reflexively reject the arguments made by climate scientists. It's because my general bullshit detector was going off.
Posted by: Moron Pundit at March 20, 2017 01:25 PM (xeeHA)

===================

He refuses to say which way he thinks on the subject itself, constantly saying that he'll never know the science enough to make an informed opinion.

He's just concerned with the persuasion of it. And he constantly finds it lacking even though the sources themselves (scientists) should be more persuasive than the critics.





The fact that the "experts" change their minds every few years is quite disconcerting.
Ice Age. Globull warmening. Ice Age.
Use your expert brains and pick one.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (Uohrc)

223 He got his start on a sketch-comedy show. He wanted to be a *comedian*.
Posted by: Hugh Jorgen at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (6GTWP)

-----

Well .... that;s good.

Because I laugh at him... alot.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (8XRCm)

224 We're expected to treat people with credentials as if their credentials spill over into other fields. Nowhere else is this the case. If an MD wants to represent you in court and shows his med school diploma as proof that he knows the inner workings of the law, you'd laugh at him.

Sometimes this manifests in an absolutely ridiculous manner. Who was the theater critic who tries to opine on matters of political policy, Frank Rich? Go write about Wicked, you mediocre lackwit.
Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (oZ6kz)



*sets up chairs*

Alrighty ditey this is where all of the Horde who made the terrible life choices that led to them getting a Juris Doctorate degree (which is not a real doctorate and I can say that what with having a JD) sit down to discuss how lawyers believe that reading expert reports in an area makes them absolutely and utterly stone cold experts.

Neurosurgery? Neuropsychology? Fluid dynamics? Engineering? Orthopedic surgery? They've. Got. That. Shit.


It's hilarious, completely and utterly hilarious.

See, here's the thing, whenever I would begin to believe that I was Oh So Very Very Smart, I would read an expert report in some field about which I knew little and then I would feel the shame for thinking I was Teh Smarty.

Are there areas in which I can, rightly, claim expertise? Yes, because I studied those areas a lot. You know what else the study revealed to me? No matter how much I study, all the reveals is how little I know.

When *I* am the voice of intellectual humility, we're all screwed in the non-life affirming way.

Posted by: alexthechick - rrraaawwwrrr at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (mf5HN)

225 >>Posted by: joe, no that other one at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM


Cut.Jib.Newsletter.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (NOIQH)

226 Hey, let's not waste any time or money campaigning in WI or MI.

Posted by: Hillary's! expert campaign team at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (Wp2lA)

227 Here we go with that Heliocentric bullshit.

My Model Works!

Posted by: Zombie Ptolemy at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (NJrRe)

228 202 Glass Houses isn't just Billy Joel's Best album, people.
...there are a lot of Egg Boiling Experts around these parts.
Posted by: garrett
====

Well I hope that they open their boiled eggs from the little end like civilized people.

Posted by: Mortimer, FINISH HER! at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (jvwxX)

229 I imagine that a liberal's inner voice is saying this:

I can't be wrong. I can't be wrong. I can't be wrong. I can't be wrong. I can't be wrong. I can't be wrong.

Over and over and over again, trying to drown out the mounting evidence.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at March 20, 2017 01:34 PM (MZcWR)

230 Is he still working? What are his discoveries? What practical benefit has he been to mankind?


Calculating the existence of Hawking radiation is his claim to fame. Since it predicts what will be left of the universe in a state of total entropy it's a pretty big deal.

But yeah, on non-physics topics Hawking is as much of a dope as Barbra Streisand. And not nearly as good a singer.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:34 PM (8ZskC)

231 Also, nowadays, having credentials from e.g. Harvard doesn't automatically include competence or merit.

Posted by: andycanuck at March 20, 2017 01:34 PM (nlbfN)

232 there is no question that he is one of the smartest people on Earth. That doesn't mean that he's correct on everything.


Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:22 PM (zc3Db)

I have heard that Hawking's work isn't quite as impressive as he would like us to think. He has an overwhelming advantage with the popular press: his ALS and his "Brave" fight against it.

He is, apparently, quite the self promoter.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 20, 2017 01:34 PM (rF0hx)

233 error - both families and culture


fixerupper, three of my final four are still alive.
K-State went down but KU, Baylor and WVU still kickin'.

Posted by: teej at March 20, 2017 01:34 PM (6CZio)

234 Meh, most experts are as clueless on everything outside their narrow area of expertise as anyone else, in my experience


Piffle.

Expertise is widespread. Each and every Moron, for example, is expert on every opinion posted here.

Posted by: Bandersnatch, gentleman cad at March 20, 2017 01:34 PM (gIRsn)

235 224
When *I* am the voice of intellectual humility, we're all screwed in the non-life affirming way.
Posted by: alexthechick - rrraaawwwrrr at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (mf5HN)

==================

Don't let that humility go to your head.

We don't want you to change.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (mC1ZI)

236 I pay experts to tell me what the problem is, but I rely upon myself to come up with the solution.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (7ZVPa)

237 Posted by: Bandersnatch, gentleman cad at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (gIRsn)

Speaking only broadly, since I don't have a lot of time to expound, Heaven's Gate was very much like Erich von Stroheim's Greed in that Cimino was given his head and a nearly unlimited budget and was absolutely determined to fit in everything he knew about the Johnson County War, much like Stroheim wanted to put every page of McTeague on the screen.

Much of the movie, IMO, lumbers where it should glide and it could have used some serious trimming.

TheJamesMadison seems to be graduating to our in-house movie expert, though, so I'd be interested in reading his thoughts.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (X6fMO)

238
Throw one more tidbit on the fire.

Google has everybody a genius on everything.



Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (8XRCm)

239
I'm not finding anything humorous in this material, and if there is something I do know, it's comedy.

Posted by: Amy Shoemer at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (Updw+)

240 Oh and the verdict is in on Common Core. The overemphasis on "informational texts" as opposed to reading actual literature (as almost all schools have done for 100 years) is making our kids even less prepared for college level work.
Not that anyone needed to tell any, literate person that.
And considering what "college level work" is these days, that's a pretty damning indictment.
But yeah. Experts reassured us that taking control away from your school board would be compensated by superior curriculum.

Posted by: xnycpeasant at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (OhTOr)

241 Hey, let's not waste any time or money campaigning in WI or MI.
Posted by: Hillary's! expert campaign team at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM (Wp2lA)

We can use that money to buy a giant fireworks show for New York City harbor on election night.

Posted by: Jen at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (E3QyW)

242 "Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (zc3Db) "

I'm not sure if I believe that. I think it's incredibly difficult to be an expert in most fields, and the idea that a genius polymath can just plug and play and do better than people with years of experience...I'm not sure it bears out in practice. Sure, you get a few people every generation like this - people whose intellects are so dazzling that they pretty much can do anything. But I think even most geniuses have narrow ranges of competency.

Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (oZ6kz)

243 238
Throw one more tidbit on the fire.

Google has everybody a genius on everything.



Posted by: fixerupper

I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night

Posted by: Rick in SK at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (FZYNt)

244 I thought the conspiracy was that they floated New Coke to fail purposely so that people would be begging for the return of Coke Classic, which would increase sales when it was reintroduced.

Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (oZ6kz)


Someone once brought that up to a Coke executive, who responded, "We're not that smart and we're not that stupid."

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (X6fMO)

245 >>Don't let that humility go to your head.


Experts say rigorous bouncing on a trampoline will help th keep the humility from rising to your head.

Posted by: garrett at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (NJrRe)

246 We'd probably need less lying and coercion to listen to them.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (mC1ZI)

Agreed, they need to stop manipulating data.

Posted by: Draki at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (PFIe+)

247 238
Throw one more tidbit on the fire.

Google has everybody a genius on everything.



Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (8XRCm)

We're loaded with geniuses.

Posted by: Apple Store at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (7HtZB)

248 He got his start on a sketch-comedy show. He wanted to be a *comedian*.

He was great on Almost Live. Hilarious show. Should hvae stuck to that.

there is no question that he is one of the smartest people on Earth.

I think there's quite a bit of question of that, since his theory of origins is that everything came from nothing.... slowly.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (39g3+)

249 For the longest time it was believed the Earth was flat, and the sun oribited the Earth. To believe otherwise was heresy.
Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (jxbfJ)


Actually, a spherical Earth was known since the ancient Greeks, and the question of heliocentrism versus geocentrism was fundamentally unanswerable until about the 1800s. Before that, both models had flaws and there was a vigorous scientific debate on the subject.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (Tnhbr)

250 What's a genius? Somebody who does really well on tests? In school? With math?

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (TOk1P)


Math is the ultimate exercise in human thought and reasoning, almost by definition. Those who are good at math are good at thinking. Sorry, but that's how it is.

A genius is a person who can see patterns that 99.999% of the population cannot see or can create tools that 99.999% of the population could never even imagine. Pattern recognition and tool creation are the bases of intelligence and what propels man forward. Mathematicians deal with abstract tools - i.e. tools of thought.

There are such things as geniuses and they are what drives our civilization. Von Neumann, all by himself, propelled us decades ahead. He was a true genius. I would trust Von Neumann's analysis of pretty much anything over anyone else's ... and he pretty much revolutionaized every field he touched (and he touched a lot of them).

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:37 PM (zc3Db)

251 error - both families and culture


fixerupper, three of my final four are still alive.
K-State went down but KU, Baylor and WVU still kickin'.
Posted by: teej at March 20, 2017 01:34 PM (6CZio)

-----

Im counting on the Jayhawks and Kentucky to make up a shit ton of points off me.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:37 PM (8XRCm)

252 Have you talked to Shaq lately?

Better pay attention to him. He played in the NBA. That makes him an expert.

Posted by: tu3031 at March 20, 2017 01:37 PM (qJhUV)

253 230 Is he still working? What are his discoveries? What practical benefit has he been to mankind?


Calculating the existence of Hawking radiation is his claim to fame. Since it predicts what will be left of the universe in a state of total entropy it's a pretty big deal.

But yeah, on non-physics topics Hawking is as much of a dope as Barbra Streisand. And not nearly as good a singer.
Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:34 PM (8ZskC)

===================

"When I was young, and my mind was sharp, I studied math. When I grew older and my mind slowed, I studied engineering. When I was old and my mind was even slower, I studied politics."
-Paraphrase of something my Dad quoted to my 10 years ago

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:37 PM (mC1ZI)

254 The Arab Spring is unquestionably going to be extremely beneficial to the Middle East and the world in general!

Posted by: Experts Everywhere at March 20, 2017 01:37 PM (FqgrG)

255 Cimino was given his head and a nearly unlimited budget and was absolutely determined to fit in everything he knew about the Johnson County War

Which, judging from what the movie turned out like, was virtually nothing.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:38 PM (39g3+)

256 Look, I was wildly successful with the original Star Wars, so any ideas I throw in to the Special Editions can only improve the experience.

Posted by: George Lucas at March 20, 2017 01:38 PM (Wp2lA)

257 Here is another point I will make: Differences in expertise.

If a chemist studies he will be able to accurately explain what Boron does when exposed to another compound. There is really no debate because there are actual fundamental principles that HAVE to be followed if Boron interacts with another compound in a certain environment. Another scientist can replicate his research and confirm his results, and they will be the same- if he did his work and detailed his experiment correctly.

Experts in anything involving people are idiotic. People do not behave the same way as elements. You can spend all the time you want predicting how people will respond to things and often, you will be wrong. You can try replicating results, but it is often a fool's game. Why? Because people are individuals. In science terms- they are one gigantic and open system that you have a hard time quantifying and knowing how they got to where they are at.

Just like say, the climate.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:38 PM (R7+kO)

258 >>He is, apparently, quite the self promoter.

And he's so good at it that he's just announced that Branson is going to shoot him into space. Seriously.

Have you noticed that despite him being British his computer speaks with an American accent? Sketchy.

Posted by: JackStraw at March 20, 2017 01:38 PM (/tuJf)

259 I can't be wrong"

Here is the key in far too much of "higher learning"

They're never "wrong". Straight A's (or better) since childhood, based on location and social status, nothing more, yields a "class" or group of entitled believers in themselves over anything and anyone imaginable.

That they are "wrong" simply doesn't exist. Any result not expected is the fault of "others" or the "system", or "republicans"...

Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:38 PM (MINbv)

260 Hawking is largely a 'sci-lebrity' at this point. Hence him constantly being asked about shit outside his particular, narrow expertise.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at March 20, 2017 01:38 PM (oVJmc)

261 I thought the conspiracy was that they floated New Coke to fail purposely so that people would be begging for the return of Coke Classic, which would increase sales when it was reintroduced.

Posted by: broseidon

--

The real scoop is that, based on blind consumer tests, Coke decided to make their product taste more like Pepsi, which was winning in the blind tests.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (7ZVPa)

262 Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:37 PM (zc3Db)

well, I'm pretty shitty at teh maths, so I guess I'm an idiot and my opinions should be discounted.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (wmaTe)

263 >>> Since the internet (and really, arguable, since public libraries) has been around, learning facts is easy. You can google the federal debt and get an answer in .31 seconds. We no longer need "experts" for that.
......

I see your larger point but completely disagree with this.

Googling data does not make anyone informed or an expert at anything (contrary to the belief of virtually everyone with internet access). Data and easy access to information does not convey the ability to reason or think.

The internet is the equivalent of giving someone who believes that they need to look down the barrel of a gun and pull the trigger to check to make sure the bullet isn't stuck a machine gun... and their death spasm keeps their finger locked on the trigger so they continue shooting everyone else post mortum.

Posted by: Damiano at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (n3oGs)

264 I took a class called Math of Finance. I thought "easy peezy"...... time value of money, simple and compound interst, present value interest factors. Piece of Cake.

Holy shit. Most was calculus calculating rates of change on curved graph plots...on things like money supply, changes in interest rates on employment curves, effects of taxation on velocity of money..... some of the hardest math I ever did.
Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:28 PM (8XRCm)


Econ grad student here. The program that I'm in has a significant finance component and holy shit is correct. I'm still not sure hedging doesn't involve demonic summoning of some sort.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (Tnhbr)

265 Didn't Stephen Colbert testify in front of Congress?

Posted by: Rick in SK at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (FZYNt)

266 But I think even most geniuses have narrow ranges of competency.
Posted by: broseidon
______

Ain't that the truth.

I don't know if it's Divine, but usually one ability accompanies a real handicap.

My father worked for NASA and could rattle off calculus equations like it was second nature. But has to call me and have me walk through something like downloading an App on his phone.

Posted by: Maritime at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (9cYRJ)

267 well, I'm pretty shitty at teh maths, so I guess I'm an idiot and my opinions should be discounted.
Posted by: Harry Paratestes at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (wmaTe)


Finally, something we can all agree on.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (8ZskC)

268 Math is the ultimate exercise in human thought and reasoning, almost by definition.

Er... no. It tests one realm of human thought, but not the meaning and importance of the facts gathered. Its great at determining how well your brain does math, not how well your brain does understanding. Its a very important part of life, but only in its realm and boundaries. You cannot math love, you cannot use engineering to understand the purpose of life or how we know things. Your very argument is using non-mathematical structures of logic and epistemology.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (39g3+)

269 I'd take experts a lot more seriously if their advice didn't inevitably require unaccountable bureaucrats and a command-and-control economy to force citizens to obey their proclamations at the point of a gun.

Joseph Gruber was an expert in healthcare. He also is an expert in fascist governance that 'sold' the ACA to dumb americans.

What a coinky-dink.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (4YGWz)

270 248 He got his start on a sketch-comedy show. He wanted to be a *comedian*.

He was great on Almost Live. Hilarious show. Should hvae stuck to that.

there is no question that he is one of the smartest people on Earth.

I think there's quite a bit of question of that, since his theory of origins is that everything came from nothing.... slowly.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM


yes...he peaked with the High Fivin' White Guys.

Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (0tfLf)

271 201 - What if there really is no Stephen Hawking? What if he's just a performance artist "mouthing" off smart-sounding computer generated lines?

Posted by: josephistan at March 20, 2017 01:32 PM (7HtZB)


I have often wondered the same thing. But we are assured by experts on his expertise that he really is quite the expert.

Still, if the man can't wipe his own arse by now, I continue to wonder just how smart he really is.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (TOk1P)

272 194 ALAR "
That's a good one. Wasn't that when Ms Streep (she of the overacting credentials) testified before Congress (or some other hearing) since she had played a farm person of some sort?
Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (MINbv)



It's worse than that. She took the morbidity rate of Alar, multiplied by the population of the U.S. (or more likely, had some grownup do it for her), and proudly announced that Alar would be causing 5000 cancer deaths per year.

Unfortunately, she never wondered what those numbers in parentheses after the morbidity rate, which were much larger than the quoted morbidity rate, meant. (The data were something like 2 (+- 10) per 100,000. In short, no statistically meaningful effect.)

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (SRKgf)

273 "The Guide is definitive. Reality is frequently inaccurate."

Douglas Adams

Posted by: Mortimer, FINISH HER! at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (jvwxX)

274 >>Calculating the existence of Hawking radiation is his claim to fame.
Since it predicts what will be left of the universe in a state of total
entropy it's a pretty big deal.
But yeah, on non-physics topics Hawking is as much of a dope as Barbra Streisand. And not nearly as good a singer.


Read "A Beautiful Mind" (way more troubled life than depicted in the movie) - he may have been brilliant but the guy was a total paranoid, virulently anti-American nutter, who burned more friends and opportunities than most people could ever dream of having. Being wicked smaht does not make one a good or stable person, which is another reason why we don't worship expertise.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (NOIQH)

275 Useless Trivia: Stephen Hawking has made two guest appearances on Pink Floyd albums.

"Keep Talking" from The Division Bell and "Talkin Hawkin" from The Endless River.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? at March 20, 2017 01:41 PM (ul9CR)

276 Joseph Gruber was an expert in healthcare. He also is an expert in fascist governance that 'sold' the ACA to dumb americans.

What a coinky-dink.
Posted by: weft cut-loop

His cousin Hans wasn't so great on Urban terrorism.

Posted by: Rick in SK at March 20, 2017 01:41 PM (FZYNt)

277



Brian Johnson - I'm a fucking idiot because I can't make a lamp?
John Bender - No. You're a genius because you can't make a lamp.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:42 PM (8XRCm)

278 His cousin Hans wasn't so great on Urban terrorism.
Posted by: Rick in SK at March 20, 2017 01:41 PM (FZYNt)




Well, he was okay except for the whole gravity thing.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 20, 2017 01:42 PM (8ZskC)

279 >>"The Guide is definitive. Reality is frequently inaccurate."



That book is essential.

Posted by: garrett at March 20, 2017 01:42 PM (NJrRe)

280 Stephen Hawking has made two guest appearances on Pink Floyd albums.

Appropriately enough, pontificating on areas that have nothing to do with his area of study and understanding.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:43 PM (39g3+)

281 "The Guide is definitive. Reality is frequently inaccurate."


Maybe even nonexistent.

Posted by: Rene Descartes at March 20, 2017 01:43 PM (8ZskC)

282 Googling data does not make anyone informed or an expert at anything (contrary to the belief of virtually everyone with internet access). Data and easy access to information does not convey the ability to reason or think.

Posted by: Damiano at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (n3oGs)

I'm saying that at one point in human history, "experts" had a near-monopoly on "facts." That has gradually eroded thanks to universal(ish) literacy, the printing press, and now the internet.

So whereas in 1327 an "expert" was someone who knew a shit ton of data points by heart, in 2017 an "expert" is someone who has an opinion on how to apply the data that we can all easily access to whatever issue is at hand.

Which is much more subjective. Especially in the realm of politics, where it's really just all one big political game.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at March 20, 2017 01:43 PM (wmaTe)

283 Experts say rigorous bouncing on a trampoline will help th keep the humility from rising to your head.
Unless you end up with your head up your ass doing it.

Posted by: andycanuck at March 20, 2017 01:43 PM (nlbfN)

284 Don't let that humility go to your head.

We don't want you to change.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:35 PM (mC1ZI)



Oh don't you worry, I'll go back to thinking I'm ever so smart.

I mean, someone has to.

Posted by: alexthechick - rrraaawwwrrr at March 20, 2017 01:43 PM (mf5HN)

285 What's a genius? Somebody who does really well on tests? In school? With math?

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:29 PM (TOk1P)

Math is the ultimate exercise in human thought and reasoning, almost by definition. Those who are good at math are good at thinking. Sorry, but that's how it is.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:37 PM (zc3Db)


Nonsense. Complete nonsense, and the fact that you don't know how nonsensical this statement is, is an indication of just how limited your so-called genius is.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:44 PM (TOk1P)

286 Look at countries ruled by "scientific" political philosophies and experts thereof. What's the death toll? 100 million?

Posted by: Kodos the Executioner at March 20, 2017 01:44 PM (k5x+a)

287 283 Experts say rigorous bouncing on a trampoline will help th keep the humility from rising to your head.
Unless you end up with your head up your ass doing it.
Posted by: andycanuck at March 20, 2017 01:43 PM (nlbfN)

I agree. Kate Upton on a trampoline does wonders for my humility.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:44 PM (R7+kO)

288 DDT will reduce malaria and increase crop yields.
DDT will kill all the birds forever.
Ignore that I made up that last part, but DDT is really, really bad for you so stop using DDT.
Everyone in the Third World is starving and dying of malaria.
And its all your fault.

Posted by: xnycpeasant at March 20, 2017 01:44 PM (OhTOr)

289 Just read the foreign affairs piece. He actually said 'I'm a professir'

Other supposedly civilized cultures have guillotined people for less.

Fuck him.

Posted by: JEM at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (TppKb)

290 Ya' know, Bob, this seems like an asinine idea. But if you, a military expert, think a charge is in order, a charge you'll get.

Posted by: Gen. Pickett to Robert Lee at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (Wp2lA)

291 Show me an expert who isn't and dyed-in-the-wool Marxist, and I might listen.

Posted by: Fritz at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (ATR4h)

292 I have often wondered the same thing. But we are assured by experts on his expertise that he really is quite the expert.



Still, if the man can't wipe his own arse by now, I continue to wonder just how smart he really is.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (TOk1P)

I don't know his field, or anything about his work, but he is head of department (which in Europe means something; here it means you moved too slowly to avoid the job). Having said that, merely being head of department, without more, doesn't mean one is an incredible genius. Pretty much any real scientist is going to be pretty bright, and I have no doubt that that includes Hawking, but incredible genius? I dunno.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (SRKgf)

293 Er... no. It tests one realm of human thought, but not the meaning and importance of the facts gathered. Its great at determining how well your brain does math, not how well your brain does understanding. Its a very important part of life, but only in its realm and boundaries. You cannot math love, you cannot use engineering to understand the purpose of life or how we know things. Your very argument is using non-mathematical structures of logic and epistemology.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (39g3+)


Math is the science of thought. You might not like that but that's how it is.

As Gauss said, "Math is the Queen of the Sciences." ("And Number Theory is the Queen of Mathematics.")

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (zc3Db)

294 Lobotomy anyone?

Posted by: Herr Doktor of Psychology Expert at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (OhTOr)

295 Fuck. You.
I'. M. Better. Than. All. Of. You.
Com. Bined.

Posted by: DOCTOR stephen hawking at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (nlbfN)

296 288 DDT will reduce malaria and increase crop yields.
DDT will kill all the birds forever.
Ignore that I made up that last part, but DDT is really, really bad for you so stop using DDT.
Everyone in the Third World is starving and dying of malaria.
And its all your fault.
Posted by: xnycpeasant at March 20, 2017 01:44 PM (OhTOr)

How one woman was personally responsible for the deaths of millions.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (R7+kO)

297 Radon will kill us all. That and acid rain.

Posted by: tu3031 at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (qJhUV)

298 Appropriately enough, pontificating on areas that have nothing to do with his area of study and understanding.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor
_____________


That's the real annoying thing, someone being an expert on one area does no mean it extends to everything. But liberals love pushing this concept because all of Academia is behind them politically.


A brilliant mathematician has no additional brilliant insights into public policy or the meaning of life.

Posted by: Maritime at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (9cYRJ)

299 Stuck up aspies are the worst.

Posted by: Nigel West Dickens at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (FqgrG)

300 Just got here and i see that after 8 years of dissapointing TFG we are now dissapointing The Experts.

Maybe they should teach us a lesson and STFU. Really, without The Experts what would we do?

Posted by: tbodie at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (f9ze2)

301 I would've voted for Hillary but I couldn't fit through the door after going on the Food Pyramid diet.
BTW does anyone want to buy a windmill? It costs a fortune to have someone sweep up all the dead birds.

Posted by: Hyronomus Borscht
****

Buy a deep fryer and sell bird on a stick.

Posted by: Tilikum KAW at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (uhftQ)

302 I think we confuse genius with just being first.
Were Oppenheimer and Fermi geniuses when they developed the first Nuke? Maybe...in math and physics, but what they were was first. I built my first nuke at the age of 22 and my degree was in political science. (Army assembler's course) They are incredible simple.
Was Turing a genius in early computer design...probably but high school kids can build their own now.
Could Orville Wright fly an F-16?

You get the idea.
Being first may require genius...or maybe just some great insights into solving a problem.
I think real genius comes from those who finish one thing and then keep going.

Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (0tfLf)

303 How one woman was personally responsible for the deaths of millions.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (R7+kO)

-------

600,000 malaria deaths per year. Every year.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (8XRCm)

304 Political "experts" are hired to be just smart enough to fool 50% of the population. And more important than real expertise, is the willingness to demand that THEY are THE authority, because they are PC, all else is wrong.

These false gods may be smarter than your average high school grad on their particular subject, but they run into trouble when the real experts expose their duplicity. That is why they need fake news and a lot of hate ... to overcome rational argument. The real experts are not interested in the job of scam artist, but they must avoid the SJWs that can destroy their careers.

Posted by: illiniwek at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (BrMft)

305 Kate Upton on a trampoline does wonders for my humility. "

So we're calling it "my humility" now?

Okay...

Posted by: Anon a mouse... at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (MINbv)

306 RE: Heaven's Gate and The Deer Hunter

I've said my sliver of peace on Heaven's Gate, but I wanted to talk about The Deer Hunter real quick:

It's good but a healthy few steps from great. It's overlong, incredibly sentimental, and Walken's death is kind of just funny. I mean, Ebert had it right when he just threw out the odds of surviving literally hundreds of games of Russian Roulette. The fact that Walken finally fails when de Niro just happens to be there makes the movie end on a cartoony note instead of a serious war movie note.

It would have been better had he found Walken's body instead of watching him die because the set up to that death is so bad.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (mC1ZI)

307 So, you see, Iraq is essentially crippled and there is no need to pursue this Saddam guy any longer, he's no longer a threat. - US Command, 1991

Posted by: IP at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (4geGT)

308 The problem is that "experts" are nothing of the sort. They are mostly products of a particular worldview and personal liberal orthodoxy. Decisions are not made based on facts. They are made based on someone's personal predictions and aspirations.

On the other hand, people are largely under informed and ignorant. They are too tribal in their assessments or too willing to let's their own politics dictate reactions.

By the tribalism is also a euphemism for worldview. So people who are aggressive by nature will act accordingly. Even in ignorance.

Posted by: Marcus T at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (OFxPz)

309 #269

The problem with Gruber is he's an expert on healthcare within the context of government meddling in the business of healthcare. A world in which government plays a minimal role in the running of that business simply isn't allowed for in his version of reality. He cannot the idea that the role of government, at most, should be in the form of the FDA, an agency concerned solely efficacy of treatments and not how they are sold tot he consumer.

Posted by: Epobirs at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (AK5Ni)

310 Too many of these "experts" think they're on par with the Founding Fathers --- want to rearrange society to fix the problems their ancestors created. They aren't on par --- more like a six-putt. And we're playing hockey.

Posted by: jd at March 20, 2017 01:48 PM (JX1fv)

311 Radon will kill us all. That and acid rain.
Posted by: tu3031 at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (qJhUV)

Acid Radon Rain is the worst.

Posted by: tbodie at March 20, 2017 01:48 PM (f9ze2)

312 Math is the science of thought.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (zc3Db)


No it's not.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:48 PM (TOk1P)

313 Alrighty ditey this is where all of the Horde who
made the terrible life choices that led to them getting a Juris
Doctorate degree (which is not a real doctorate and I can say that what
with having a JD) sit down to discuss how lawyers believe that reading
expert reports in an area makes them absolutely and utterly stone cold
experts.



Neurosurgery? Neuropsychology? Fluid dynamics? Engineering? Orthopedic surgery? They've. Got. That. Shit.





It's hilarious, completely and utterly hilarious.



See, here's the thing, whenever I would begin to believe that I was
Oh So Very Very Smart, I would read an expert report in some field about
which I knew little and then I would feel the shame for thinking I was
Teh Smarty.



Are there areas in which I can, rightly, claim expertise? Yes,
because I studied those areas a lot. You know what else the study
revealed to me? No matter how much I study, all the reveals is how
little I know.



When *I* am the voice of intellectual humility, we're all screwed in the non-life affirming way.

Posted by: alexthechick - rrraaawwwrrr at March 20, 2017 01:33 PM


Preach it, sister!

a Juris
Doctorate degree (which is not a real doctorate and I can say that what
with having a JD)


Shut your whore mouth!!!
-Every German with a law degree

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 20, 2017 01:48 PM (p+Wdc)

314 Didn't Stephen Colbert testify in front of Congress?
Posted by: Rick in SK at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (FZYNt)

Yes, as have quite a few celebs, who expertise in the subject at hand consists of a month of spending time at a refugee center, or watching starving children in Africa get vaccinated, or a movie set about Antartica, etc. They in turn are educated the currently uneducated political class in Congress who in turn, pass laws and regulations that rule the rest of us based on such "expertise".

The other night on David Webb's show, a guest bluntly commented that it was time for news shows to interview actual experts , and those with experience in different subjects(this one was an working expert in cyber security) instead of constantly interviewing congress critters on "security" committees, etc. Because politics is their focus, and they are NOT experts.

Posted by: Jen at March 20, 2017 01:48 PM (E3QyW)

315 Ya nailed it nip.
And that organization was formed a long time ago for the purpose of bringing about one world socialism. Global aristocracy.
So many key positions in govt, both political and bureaucratic, for most if not all of my life.
I know, don't tell me, crazy conspiracy talk.
I should just pretend the deep state is a recent occurance and let it go.

Posted by: teej at March 20, 2017 01:48 PM (6CZio)

316 well, I'm pretty shitty at teh maths, so I guess I'm an idiot and my opinions should be discounted.
Posted by: Harry Paratestes at March 20, 2017 01:39 PM (wmaTe)

Finally, something we can all agree on.
Posted by: Cicero




Math is my worst subject, but I have no problem with simple math and my "nose" can smell bullshit from a long ways off.

Don't tell me Texas will be a frozen wasteland in the next 5 years due to global cooling when ice core samples suggest 5,000 to 10,000 years to change.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 20, 2017 01:48 PM (Uohrc)

317 I feel like I am out of my depth, here.

Posted by: Curley Howard at March 20, 2017 01:49 PM (Updw+)

318 Math is the science of thought. You might not like that but that's how it is.

Nothing you said countered my points. In fact, you proved it by continuing to use non-mathematical arguments and thought structures.

Math is the science of numbers. Its excellent with that, but not so good at anything else. Just like philosophy is lousy at art, and painting is lousy at fixing cars.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:49 PM (39g3+)

319 Math is the ultimate exercise in human thought and reasoning, almost by
definition. Those who are good at math are good at thinking. Sorry, but
that's how it is.



Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:37 PM (zc3Db)



Too narrow. I think abstract reasoning is the measure of intelligence. Some can reason abstractly and express themselves in a symbolic fashion, others in a verbal fashion. Commonly those who are particularly good at one are appallingly bad at the other.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:49 PM (SRKgf)

320 Ladies and gentlemen, the Nobel Prize for Peace goes to...

Posted by: The Academy at March 20, 2017 01:49 PM (OhTOr)

321 Politely take all your Maths outside.

Posted by: AoSHQ Style Guide at March 20, 2017 01:49 PM (NJrRe)

322 I was told there would be no math...

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:50 PM (mC1ZI)

323 Nood.

Posted by: IC at March 20, 2017 01:50 PM (a0IVu)

324 No, Billy! Limper! I want your arms flailing back and forth like you were a rag doll!

Posted by: Director of Billy Squier's 'Rock Me Tonite' video at March 20, 2017 01:50 PM (Wp2lA)

325 The problem with Gruber is he's an expert on healthcare within the context of government meddling in the business of healthcare. A world in which government plays a minimal role in the running of that business simply isn't allowed for in his version of reality. He cannot the idea that the role of government, at most, should be in the form of the FDA, an agency concerned solely efficacy of treatments and not how they are sold tot he consumer.
Posted by: Epobirs at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (AK5Ni)


What makes him an expert on anything other than his ability to fool CBO scores, since he expertly was hired by the CBO to expertly help come up with the expertly proprietary expert formulas that are expertly fooled by an entire industry of experts?

I guess this is what I'm getting at more than anything. For me to consider someone an expert, I expect them to
a) be right in what they say
b) have some kind of special skill beyond rent seeking and having the good fortune of knowing a secret formula that's apparently fairly easy to fool
c) talk about something a little more substantative than their fucking political policy preferences

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at March 20, 2017 01:50 PM (wmaTe)

326 I'll fight any one of you faggots in The Octagon!

Posted by: Paul Ehrlich at March 20, 2017 01:50 PM (qJhUV)

327 311 Radon will kill us all. That and acid rain.
Posted by: tu3031 at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (qJhUV)

Acid Radon Rain is the worst.
Posted by: tbodie at March 20, 2017 01:48 PM (f9ze2)

I have seen more Radon removal systems in Lexington than I have ever seen in my life. Is Lexington, Ky sitting on a vast deposit of Uranium?

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:50 PM (R7+kO)

328 I know many experts whose opinions I take very seriously whenever I have a question relating to their field. These people deal in very solid testable areas such as how to implement the electrical systems for a Rose Parade float. Their work is readily available to examine and there were very real consequences for failure.

Guys who've made careers of discussing the same stuff they wrangled over in bars as PoliSci majors, not so much.

Posted by: Epobirs at March 20, 2017 01:51 PM (AK5Ni)

329 I've always defined smart people as those that know what they don't know. I've held that opinion even before Rumsfeld made it famous.

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:51 PM (fgzLM)

330 >>Buy a deep fryer and sell bird on a stick. Posted by: Tilikum KAW at March 20, 2017 01:46 PM (uhftQ)

Join the carnival and sell pizza in a cup.

Posted by: Navin Zod Johnson at March 20, 2017 01:51 PM (Bdeb0)

331 Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (TOk1P)
I don't know his field, or anything about his work, but he is head of department (which in Europe means something; here it means you moved too slowly to avoid the job). Having said that, merely being head of department, without more, doesn't mean one is an incredible genius. Pretty much any real scientist is going to be pretty bright, and I have no doubt that that includes Hawking, but incredible genius? I dunno.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (SRKgf)


I'm an expert on Oxford and such places, because I've watched every episode of Morse.

Therefore, I can assure you, the most prestigious Euro schools are all about political backbiting and a relentless, greedy push for who can fund their respective departments the most, as the sole criteria for department chairs.

Also, university dons kill their rivals and exes quite often.

Posted by: BurtTC at March 20, 2017 01:51 PM (TOk1P)

332 >>> Math is the ultimate exercise in human thought and reasoning, almost by definition. Those who are good at math are good at thinking. Sorry, but that's how it is.
.......

Disagree.

Example A: I know lots of people who are ridiculously good at math who can't reason through changing a light bulb (others try to drill studs with the drill spinning in reverse).

Example B: Creative people. Entrepreneurs and the like. (Real entrepreneurs, not the billion bimbos on Facebook that think posting crap on YouTube and having 100 followers that don't pay to stare at their tits make them entrepreneurs). Generally bad at math but responsible for virtually everything that makes the world go around.

Math leaves the mistaken idea that everything must be binary, true or false. As a person who tends to fall into that camp, I can attest that you can account for or control all the variables and there are plenty of things that fall outside of a true/ false scenario.

Compiling data demonstrates the ability to apply formulas and basic logic and requires mathematical ability. The ability to make decisions when and reason out course of action in the face of conflicting but accurate data demonstrates thinking but does not necessarily require mathematical ability.

Posted by: Damiano at March 20, 2017 01:51 PM (n3oGs)

333 The Old Testament punishment for false prophets was death. Harsh penalty but I'm guessing it kept the number of false prophets to a minimum.

But that's just it, isn't it? These self-styled expert elites pay no penalties for getting it wrong again and again.

Posted by: troyriser at March 20, 2017 01:52 PM (Fw5cQ)

334 329 I've always defined smart people as those that know what they don't know. I've held that opinion even before Rumsfeld made it famous.
Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:51 PM (fgzLM)

==================

Isn't that a cornerstone of the Socratic method?

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:52 PM (mC1ZI)

335 Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:36 PM (39g3+)

for a second there I thought you were talking about Bill Nye as "one of the smartest people on earth" and I went LOLWUT?

Posted by: Hugh Jorgen at March 20, 2017 01:52 PM (6GTWP)

336 willowtime: Sefton's link, "Sudden Departure of Key EPA Manager Signals War Between Agency Lifers and PDT", had a well developed theme however, the poor character development made it difficult for a novice to know who was killing who.
IOW - they muddied a good story.

Posted by: gNewt at March 20, 2017 01:53 PM (kvPML)

337 Tom Nichols. Heh. He shows up again. And with the same circular unwitting self-parody. And despite the circumstantial connection to him, which must remain secret, I never did actually ever get any impression of him nor even meet him way back when. Looks like he has a Beltway mindset even though his Beltway time was brief.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 20, 2017 01:53 PM (QDnY+)

338 Experts once thought that blowing nicotine smoke up the ass of a drowned person would revive them.

Hence the origination of the phrase, 'Don't blow smoke up my ass'. Given that nicotine is extremely painful to cells, one can imagine the reanimated recently drowned would be somewhat outspoken about the matter.

[ ] That's bullshit
[X] Completely true

If you count the lumps on my skull you can tell that I would not lie to you.

Posted by: E Depluribus Unum at March 20, 2017 01:53 PM (ZFUt7)

339 Isn't that a cornerstone of the Socratic method?
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:52 PM (mC1ZI)

One of my favorites:
http://tinyurl.com/yfs292w

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:53 PM (R7+kO)

340
Climate change denial is a “crime against humanity” which should be punishable by trial in a world court.

Posted by: Climate expert Eric Idle at March 20, 2017 01:54 PM (IqV8l)

341 Part of the problem is that we think that the existence of experts means that there is no more debate on a subject. For thousands of years there were experts on the motion of the heavens. We still couldn't conclude whether the Sun orbited the Earth, or vice versa.

Posted by: Colorado Alex In Exile at March 20, 2017 01:54 PM (Tnhbr)

342 As Gauss said, "Math is the Queen of the Sciences." ("And Number Theory is the Queen of Mathematics.")

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (zc3Db)

No. That would be chemistry!
Srsly, though, I read a history of mathematics and was shocked to learn that Gauss failed to grasp that some simple infinite series (something like sum over n of (-1)^n that would obviously bounce between +1 and -1) would diverge.
I was astonished.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:55 PM (SRKgf)

343 One of the chief examples of "just because you know X it doesn't mean you know everything else:" Noam Chomsky.

Posted by: joncelli, Gobsmacked Rage Monkey and Crossbowman at March 20, 2017 01:55 PM (RD7QR)

344 So why would I give them any more credence then the drunk at the end of the bar?

It ain't the way I wanted it! I can handle things! I'm smart! Not like everybody says... like dumb... I'm smart and I want respect!

*hic*

*shart*

Posted by: Hillary Corleone at March 20, 2017 01:55 PM (XkVXQ)

345 340
Climate change denial is a 'crime against humanity' which should be punishable by trial in a world court.
Posted by: Climate expert Eric Idle at March 20, 2017 01:54 PM (IqV8l)

Shut up, Eric. I want to be able to watch my Monty Python DVDs without wanting to punch the TV.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at March 20, 2017 01:55 PM (R7+kO)

346 "Hillary committed treason but I could find no intent. I have no evidence, but have determined that Russia intended to influence the election on Trump's behalf."

James Comey, noted Expert and #NeverWronger

Posted by: ShainS at March 20, 2017 01:55 PM (XabRM)

347 336 willowtime: Sefton's link, "Sudden Departure of Key EPA Manager Signals War Between Agency Lifers and PDT", had a well developed theme however, the poor character development made it difficult for a novice to know who was killing who.
IOW - they muddied a good story.
Posted by: gNewt at March 20, 2017 01:53 PM (kvPML)



I had the same reaction: "Huh?"

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 01:56 PM (SRKgf)

348 I think we confuse genius with just being first.
Were Oppenheimer and Fermi geniuses when they developed the first Nuke? Maybe...in math and physics, but what they were was first. I built my first nuke at the age of 22 and my degree was in political science. (Army assembler's course) They are incredible simple.
Was Turing a genius in early computer design...probably but high school kids can build their own now.
Could Orville Wright fly an F-16?

You get the idea.
Being first may require genius...or maybe just some great insights into solving a problem.
I think real genius comes from those who finish one thing and then keep going.
Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 01:47 PM (0tfLf)


Whoa there... you assembled a nuke, but presumably because someone else did the math and physics and geometry work. Kids can build a computer by plugging boards and drives together like Legos, very few can actually do the design to actually etch the chips. Maybe some can write in high-level languages, few could read the opcode manual and write a program for an Altair 8800 with the toggle switches.

The nuke, the computer, and the F-16 are evolutionary, thousands of people coming up with a way to do something a little better than the previous one. Building something that exists only in your mind, even if it's primitive, is a different story.

Posted by: hogmartin at March 20, 2017 01:56 PM (8nWyX)

349 The experts in the 70's assured me that the earth would be destroyed by global cooling.



Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:05 PM (fgzLM)



Man-made, even. Interestingly, caused by burning fossil fuels - the
same exact cause that those same experts are now trying to tell us is
causing catastrophic global warming. Pretty nifty trick, there. If one
weren't an "expert" one might arrive at the conclusion that the
leftists just hate fossil fuels and the advancements burning them brings
...



"It's the oil cans! He HATES the oil cans!!!" -- Expert

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:12 PM (zc3Db)


That is why they are attempting to switch the narrative to "climate change".


Sure you can disprove them when they say that the planet will be catastrophically cooler every year and you can disprove them when they say that the warmening will drown us all, but we cannot deny that the climate is changing.


Interestingly they have not bothered to explain why we should care when the climate does change (I mean other than caring to know whether we need an umbrella or a coat on any given day).

Posted by: redbanzai at March 20, 2017 01:57 PM (f5uaD)

350 The science is settled!

Posted by: "Scientists" at March 20, 2017 01:57 PM (FqgrG)

351 Er... no. It tests one realm of human thought,
but not the meaning and importance of the facts gathered. Its great at
determining how well your brain does math, not how well your brain does
understanding. Its a very important part of life, but only in its realm
and boundaries. You cannot math love, you cannot use engineering to
understand the purpose of life or how we know things. Your very argument
is using non-mathematical structures of logic and epistemology.



Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:40 PM (39g3+)



Math is the science of thought. You might not like that but that's how it is.



As Gauss said, "Math is the Queen of the Sciences." ("And Number Theory is the Queen of Mathematics.")

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:45 PM (zc3Db)

All is number.

Posted by: redbanzai at March 20, 2017 01:58 PM (f5uaD)

352 Hey. Fuck all four of you!

Posted by: The Fifth Dentist at March 20, 2017 01:59 PM (OhTOr)

353 Math is the science of numbers.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at March 20, 2017 01:49 PM (39g3+)


Numbers are but one part of mathematics - a major part, but only a part. Math is, as I said, the science of thought. You know ... there's a reason why math is the best description and method of analysis we have found for pretty much every field. Because it is the science of thought.

I'm amazed that so many here seem to be offended by this fact. Well ... maybe not "amazed". It is what it is, your protestations notwithstanding.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:59 PM (zc3Db)

354 Hogmartin @348

I think that's what I was trying to say.
Somebody somewhere had the first idea but once it was done, it's common knowledge.

Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 02:00 PM (0tfLf)

355 In-laws often make good experts.

Posted by: General Zod at March 20, 2017 02:01 PM (Bdeb0)

356
I love how I was asked to accept something or another to read more past this point in the Nichols article and I chose not to:

This isn't the same thing as the traditional American distaste for intellectuals and know-it-alls. I'm a professor, and I...


Sorry, Perfesser, I don't need neither your credential nor your credentialed opinion. (h/t: The Music Man).



Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars (TM) at March 20, 2017 02:01 PM (1F6Sr)

357 Math is the ultimate exercise in human thought and reasoning, almost by
definition. Those who are good at math are good at thinking. Sorry, but
that's how it is.



Have you ever the biographies of famous mathematicians? Outside of math, many if not most of them were not so good at thinking.

My favorite in this respect is Evariste Galois.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 02:01 PM (SRKgf)

358 My favorite in this respect is Evariste Galois.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 02:01 PM (SRKgf)


Galois' failing was being awful at dueling. A real shame. He was something else.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 02:04 PM (zc3Db)

359 Gauss said, "Math is the Queen of the Sciences." ("And Number Theory is the Queen of Mathematics.

*****

So does that make mechanical and civil engineering, and all those mighty erections, the King?

Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 02:04 PM (0tfLf)

360 334 329 I've always defined smart people as those that know what they don't know. I've held that opinion even before Rumsfeld made it famous.
Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:51 PM (fgzLM)

==================

Isn't that a cornerstone of the Socratic method?
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at March 20, 2017 01:52 PM (mC1ZI)

Are you trying to trigger cognitive thinking?

Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 02:05 PM (fgzLM)

361 Your MINDS! Your STUPID MINDS!

Posted by: Plan Nine from Outer Space at March 20, 2017 02:05 PM (97XyN)

362 360 334 329 I've always defined smart people as those that know what they don't know. I've held that opinion even before Rumsfeld made it famous. Posted by: Jack Sock at March 20, 2017 01:51 PM (fgzLM)

Oh, I don't know about that...

Posted by: Cloyd Freud, Unemployed at March 20, 2017 02:06 PM (97XyN)

363 It's funny how the university philosopher kings seldom ever saddle up and ride into the battles that they insist the rest of us fight.

Posted by: Wendy at March 20, 2017 02:07 PM (bpemY)

364 Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 01:59 PM (zc3Db)


I would dispute the characterization of mathematics as a "science," except in the sense of, e.g., "library science," namely, an area of endeavor.

To me, "science" refers to a body of knowledge obtained through use of the scientific method, viz., an iterative formulation of hypotheses, experimentation, and modification of hypotheses, as necessary.

Interestingly, the US Patent Office does not recognize courses in mathematics as a qualification to practice patent law, but requires coursework in science or engineering.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 02:08 PM (SRKgf)

365 I've known quite a few people (typically Baby Boomers) responsible for caring for a parent or spouse in need of extended medical care. Many have had a very similar experience.

They have encountered medical doctors essentially acting on auto-pilot. Once the doctor has determined a diagnosis, the script is set. They know little about the patient's specific symptoms or about the ailment affecting the patient. These caretakers learn two things: 1) They have to become aggressive advocates for their loved one by double checking the prescribed treatments and insisting that doctors explain why a change in symptoms might not justify a change in treatment. 2) They have have to become experts on the malady because the doctors often only have a superficial knowledge of it.

I tried sharing this with Tom Nichols one day on twitter. He blocked me. It was proof to him that I was a self-appointed WebMD internet doctor, that I probably didn't believe in vaccines, and more than likely got all my information from facebook posts.

Posted by: Piraeus at March 20, 2017 02:08 PM (IGWlV)

366 355 In-laws often make good experts.
Posted by: General Zod at March 20, 2017 02:01 PM (Bdeb0)

On one's flaws, yes.

Posted by: joncelli, Gobsmacked Rage Monkey and Crossbowman at March 20, 2017 02:08 PM (RD7QR)

367 Galois' failing was being awful at dueling. A real shame. He was something else.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 02:04 PM (zc3Db)

He was, indeed.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 02:08 PM (SRKgf)

368 I think that's what I was trying to say.
Somebody somewhere had the first idea but once it was done, it's common knowledge.
Posted by: Diogenes at March 20, 2017 02:00 PM (0tfLf)


I might've misread your intent then. It sounded like a dismissive "yes, they could build a simple working prototype, but let's see Mr. Smarty Inventor try using the current model".

Posted by: hogmartin at March 20, 2017 02:10 PM (8nWyX)

369 Galois' failing was being awful at dueling. A real shame. He was something else.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 02:04 PM (zc3Db)

Yep, but realistically, but based on mathematicians' track records, it's likely that even had he lived, he may not have done much more.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 02:10 PM (SRKgf)

370 To me, "science" refers to a body of knowledge obtained through use of the scientific method, viz., an iterative formulation of hypotheses, experimentation, and modification of hypotheses, as necessary.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 02:08 PM (SRKgf)


The Axiomatic Method (Proof Thoery, in general) represents the ultimate in this. And with applied mathematics you have more of the base experimentation that other sciences practice. You could call math a meta-science if you want but it does have all the qualities of a normal science. The scientific method is really just the proof method reduced to physical phenomena. It was Euclid's formulation of axiomatic geometry that got all this rolling with the idea of formulating hypotheses, testing them, proving them based on previously established theorems ...

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 02:17 PM (zc3Db)

371 Yep, but realistically, but based on mathematicians' track records, it's likely that even had he lived, he may not have done much more.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at March 20, 2017 02:10 PM (SRKgf)


He might not have done much in a vastly different area (of mathematics) but he would almost certainly have done much more to expand on his basic idea - and there was a lot more to do. Galois would have driven Group Theory (and Number Theory) forward though he might have stayed with his original insight.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at March 20, 2017 02:20 PM (zc3Db)

372 Brawndo has got electrolytes.

Posted by: Scientific Expert at March 20, 2017 02:21 PM (1CtvB)

373 #348

I've assembled dozens of computers over the years but that is small potatoes compared to somebody who designs one really good case or other major component. They in turn have to acknowledge the work of somebody like Alan Turing is of vastly greater importance, exerting huge influence over the field that didn't exist before they came along and continuing to do so many decades after that work first appeared.


Posted by: Epobirs at March 20, 2017 02:21 PM (AK5Ni)

374 We rely on experts to learn about the present and past.

Anyone who claims to predict the future is just a charlatan.

Posted by: Scientific Expert at March 20, 2017 02:22 PM (1CtvB)

375 How about being the person with the JD questioning the alleged expert in neurosurgery, whatever and realizing about a half hour in that a lot of what they do is on faith. Ask a neurosurgeon why this person is doing well post-surgery v. why this person isn't. How often do you get an "Uh, I don't know". Ask an engineer why you though it had this kind of foundation, not the one that actually collapsed, and get an "I eyeballed it". If you are a JD, you learn to cast a jaundiced eye on any expert. Practice in the field of med mal, and it's worse.

Posted by: ejo at March 20, 2017 02:23 PM (il4FI)

376 A term I really hate is, "guru." It just means that person has declared themselves to be full of knowledge on a subject when they are typically just full of crap and are a con artist.

Posted by: Dang at March 20, 2017 02:28 PM (8HxlB)

377 Why does Foreign Affairs consider itself important enough for me to register to read the remainder of that condescending twaddle?

Posted by: irongrampa at March 20, 2017 02:31 PM (X35Yt)

378
375 ... Ask a neurosurgeon why this person is doing well post-surgery v. why this person isn't. How often do you get an "Uh, I don't know". . . .
Posted by: ejo at March 20, 2017 02:23 PM (il4FI)
************

Well said.

Posted by: Piraeus at March 20, 2017 02:46 PM (IGWlV)

379 If you think building a nuke makes you as smart as Oppenheimer, then I say copying out Hamlet makes me as smart as Shakespeare.

Posted by: Martbell at March 20, 2017 03:25 PM (OxL9z)

380 Yet another reminder of why academia loved TFG so much. He was the most experty expert of all other experts, yet in his wake is ruin. It must all be our fault somehow.

Posted by: sans_sheriff at March 20, 2017 04:31 PM (I6SOt)

381 I never had any faith in "experts" so there was none to lose. I have faith in people who say and do things which work out well and I ignore those who don't. Period.

Posted by: Lou Gubrious at March 20, 2017 04:32 PM (zfqfK)

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