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Saturday Gardening Thread: Wild Things [KT]
Well, OK, it's not a tornado, a hurricane or blizzard, but I thought this photo was representative of damage from the recent Atmospheric River that hit the West Coast. I have been on this road in the summer. This is McKinley Grove Road, 7.5 miles above Dinky Creek Bridge. Excepting fire-related weather events, this is about the wildest kind of weather we have had in Central California lately. Has weather affected your gardening or other activities this week? Problems anticipated in the coming week?
Wild Birds and other critters
Have you ever wondered how little birds that don't migrate make it through brutal winter weather? Here are some insights.Oregon has a lot of lilies. They are very prolific and some of them were a staple food for the local Indians. A few of them are like the Tiger Lilly - which I can't find my pics of - and are the standard lily type flower, but the smaller ones that aren't the standard Easter Lilly shape are very pretty. The Lamb's tongue (fawn lily or Erythronium oregonum) has two mottled base leaves that are supposed to mimic a lamb's tongue (hey, I'm just passing on traditional lore here) and bobs around on it's stalk. It is found all through Western Oregon and Washington.
There is a variant called the Pink fawn lily which is found on the ocean side of the coast range. The next two pics are from the Rice Museum West of Hillsboro. The Rice family were amateur geologists and also liked to plant wildflowers. When they died they donated the house and the collection to be a museum. It is a gorgeous place. There appears to be some hybridization going on here.
Most of the lilies are spread by birds, and need to be either stratified or, apparently, passed through the alimentary canal of a bird to germinate.
My friend had a small section of brush that she wanted to be more of a lawn under some oaks where she had feeders. I mowed it the first year in late summer and to my surprise the next year the lamb's tongues came up even thicker without the competition. For the years I spent up there I was surprised that the property had so many wildflowers, and realized that the farmer who ran cattle on the property only ran them in the late summer when the ground was hard and their hooves wouldn't tear up the banks where he drove. I think that was the secret there, and I am looking for an excuse to not mow my yard until late July, but I doubt "wildflower cultivation" would be accepted as why my yard is 5 feet deep in grass.
My books tell me that the pink fawn lily was used as a sometimes food source for coastal Indians, but the real food source for the Indians in this area was the Camas lily, Camassia quamash . .Check back for the Camas lily in a future episode. Gardens of the Horde You probably don't remember when I reported on planting Baby Broccoli 'Artwork' in pots last spring. It was advertised as "bolt-resistant". That was an understatement, at least in terms of bolting in hot weather. I left one pot after buds had shriveled some, just to see when it would bolt. It did not bolt over summer! It started forming new buds and just recently started to bolt. Maybe this one is programmed to bolt in cold weather. Buds were tastier than in our hot spring weather, and very tender. Flowers taste pretty good raw, in moderation. You might try a few plants when they appear in stores if your spring weather is more moderate than ours. Anything going on in your garden? Repairs in the yard from weather damage? Hope your week goes well.
Comments
(Jump to bottom of comments)1
Was supposed to get a crop of snowtoday but nothing yet
Posted by: Skip at January 14, 2017 12:24 PM (yx0Ld)
2
To read the content or get the Corgis?......... hmmmmmmmmm.
Posted by: Skip at January 14, 2017 12:25 PM (yx0Ld)
3
I should go out and see about getting my bird feeder together
Posted by: Skip at January 14, 2017 12:28 PM (yx0Ld)
4
Hi, Skip! Enjoy your snow.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 12:28 PM (qahv/)
5
Has weather affected your gardening or other activities this week?
I took advantage of a couple unseasonably warm days to move the boston ferns and scented geraniums back onto the deck. They got to enjoy a little rainshower as well.
I'm going to give them a good trim now that they're back indoors as they patiently wait for spring and life in the great outdoors again.
I took advantage of a couple unseasonably warm days to move the boston ferns and scented geraniums back onto the deck. They got to enjoy a little rainshower as well.
I'm going to give them a good trim now that they're back indoors as they patiently wait for spring and life in the great outdoors again.
Posted by: kallisto at January 14, 2017 12:31 PM (kD8Fh)
6
Bird video lady talks funny.
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 12:37 PM (Sfs6o)
7
It was nowhere near as dramatic a location as pictured here, but heavy rains this fall in Delaware did a similar number at a waterway crossing for a Sussex County road we drive to and from our summer place all the time. Took four days to backfill, stabilize and repave.
It was nowhere near as dramatic a location as pictured here, but heavy rains this fall in Delaware did a similar number at a waterway crossing for a Sussex County road we drive to and from our summer place all the time. Took four days to backfill, stabilize and repave.
Posted by: Krebs v Carnot at January 14, 2017 12:38 PM (BK3ZS)
8
Funny-funny. Not ha-ha funny. Canadian.
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 12:38 PM (Sfs6o)
9
Got to run errands before the sloppy stuff gets here later this afternoon. With any luck I'll get a chance to remove dead growth in our garden beds tomorrow.
Got to run errands before the sloppy stuff gets here later this afternoon. With any luck I'll get a chance to remove dead growth in our garden beds tomorrow.
Posted by: Krebs v Carnot at January 14, 2017 12:40 PM (BK3ZS)
10
Did Canadian funny-talker lady say that sunflower seeds were the best for birds in winter?
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 12:41 PM (Sfs6o)
11
I don't know, nothing yet. I think its a bust.
Posted by: Skip at January 14, 2017 12:42 PM (yx0Ld)
12
I have multiple bird feeders out. And an entire fence of bird houses. Not much bird traffic these days but it snows until May here so it will be a while before there is too much action.
Meanwhile the hardy few we do have will find seeds, suet, and a place to hole up.
Meanwhile the hardy few we do have will find seeds, suet, and a place to hole up.
Posted by: Lily (formerly fom HotAir now from AoSHQ) at January 14, 2017 12:44 PM (vfC/C)
13
I solved the drought! How do you like me now? Talking to you Ah-nold!
Posted by: Bill in Chappaqua at January 14, 2017 12:45 PM (En33R)
14
I use to get sunflower seed for my feeders but haven't in years. After lunch I am going out to investigate the feeder situation. Squirrels have taken tolls on mine chewing holes into them. But I do say except for that my squirrels haven't done anything else.
Posted by: Skip at January 14, 2017 12:46 PM (yx0Ld)
15
Weasel at January 14, 2017 12:41 PM
Yes, she mentioned black oil sunflower seeds as especially good for birds in winter. Be careful what you plant under the feeders. The seeds inhibit growth of some other plants.
Yes, she mentioned black oil sunflower seeds as especially good for birds in winter. Be careful what you plant under the feeders. The seeds inhibit growth of some other plants.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 12:49 PM (qahv/)
16
Howdy Horde, just a drive-by comment as the Mrs and I head out the door to learn how to prune fruit trees properly. It's 22 degrees and she hates the cold. Me, I embrace it. I'm not sure what the trees think of it.
Posted by: Octiparan at January 14, 2017 12:51 PM (b9JGJ)
17
I can see from the close-up why the Fawn Lily is called a "Lily". Looks a lot more like a lily than a violet. Delicate and beautiful.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 12:52 PM (qahv/)
Posted by: garrett at January 14, 2017 12:53 PM (PPu+l)
19
Fortress VIA has the squirrel feeder full of peanut splits.
The fat and seed cakes are in the hanging holders.
And the sunflower chips are in the squirrel proof feeder.
On that first picture...
Why did they paint the yellow line so close to the right edge of the road?
The fat and seed cakes are in the hanging holders.
And the sunflower chips are in the squirrel proof feeder.
On that first picture...
Why did they paint the yellow line so close to the right edge of the road?
Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at January 14, 2017 12:55 PM (J+eG2)
20
Given the fact the weather has been stuck well below zero, yes, the weather has definitely affected our gardening. The tomatoes got off to a terrible start.
Posted by: Northernlurker at January 14, 2017 12:56 PM (hJrjt)
21
> I'm not sure what the trees think of it.
They are dormant. The pain won't hit until Spring.
That's what I thought until we learned to prune grapes last week and there was a lot of green wood already. Of course, this is Western Oregon.
They are dormant. The pain won't hit until Spring.
That's what I thought until we learned to prune grapes last week and there was a lot of green wood already. Of course, this is Western Oregon.
Posted by: Octiparan at January 14, 2017 12:56 PM (b9JGJ)
Posted by: garrett at January 14, 2017 12:57 PM (PPu+l)
23
Are the Steelhead in?
Not that I've heard. Didn't see any when I buzzed the grocers yesterday. They usually have a few fish early.
Not that I've heard. Didn't see any when I buzzed the grocers yesterday. They usually have a few fish early.
Posted by: Octiparan at January 14, 2017 12:59 PM (b9JGJ)
Posted by: garrett at January 14, 2017 01:02 PM (PPu+l)
25
Humming birds are passed at me because I forgot to bring their food in last night and it froze. Should be ready to put back out before we leave in a few minutes.
Posted by: Octiparan at January 14, 2017 01:03 PM (b9JGJ)
26
See.... Presdent Obona's Evironmembtal Plan is working with the result being more rane in Calfornica. Thank You Presdent Obama and Brattleboro loves you and will ass you. Bush lied and and Caliafornica was dry and brown because of his intentional Globull Warming plan and Presdent Onamama has reversed this trens and that Trump will destroy one in oriffice
Posted by: Mary Clogginstien from Brattleboro, VT (Soon to be Obamaboro, VT) at January 14, 2017 01:03 PM (Fbj4h)
27
Related to the photo at the top of the post:
If you are thinking about going to see the big Sequoias, spring is a good time to visit. Better than summer. Some of the wildflowers at lower elevations are also worthwhile. You are likely to see some big lupine plants by the side of the road, expanses of smaller wildflowers and some nice flowering shrubs.
The native milkweed, with silvery, short leaves, seems to like roadside conditions. I've never been around when the Monarch butterflies are visiting, but some other species of butterflies race up and down washes near the roads.
If you are thinking about going to see the big Sequoias, spring is a good time to visit. Better than summer. Some of the wildflowers at lower elevations are also worthwhile. You are likely to see some big lupine plants by the side of the road, expanses of smaller wildflowers and some nice flowering shrubs.
The native milkweed, with silvery, short leaves, seems to like roadside conditions. I've never been around when the Monarch butterflies are visiting, but some other species of butterflies race up and down washes near the roads.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 01:04 PM (qahv/)
28
Garrett, the Dungeness crab season is on, and the boats have concluded a short strike successfully setting a higher price on the catch.
Portland had 11 inches of snow, and here we had about 2 inches and we've been having night time temperatures down in the teens. So I've been reading a lot and waiting for nicer weather.
I am reminded that I need to prune back my grapes and my apple and plum tree.
Portland had 11 inches of snow, and here we had about 2 inches and we've been having night time temperatures down in the teens. So I've been reading a lot and waiting for nicer weather.
I am reminded that I need to prune back my grapes and my apple and plum tree.
Posted by: Kindltot at January 14, 2017 01:04 PM (WlUkp)
29
pissed at me.
Posted by: Octiparan at January 14, 2017 01:04 PM (b9JGJ)
30
We rarely see any wildlife in the yard except birds and squirrels. The squirrels are not invited but obviously feel at home. We want to encourage more song birds and have expanded the feeders to attract some besides the house sparrows.
We started putting out safflower seed in a feeder designed for it and sunflower. It has made a huge difference and it's attracting gold and purple finches, cardinals, titmice and chickadees. Apparently the safflower only appeals to certain species.
The other feeder is a cage that holds balls of ground nuts and meal worms. Another success. A number of wrens have discovered it and juncos and small woodpeckers. I'm also going to use it to hold pine cones smeared with peanut butter and rolled in typical bird seed.
I'm spending more time looking through binoculars, to my delight.
We started putting out safflower seed in a feeder designed for it and sunflower. It has made a huge difference and it's attracting gold and purple finches, cardinals, titmice and chickadees. Apparently the safflower only appeals to certain species.
The other feeder is a cage that holds balls of ground nuts and meal worms. Another success. A number of wrens have discovered it and juncos and small woodpeckers. I'm also going to use it to hold pine cones smeared with peanut butter and rolled in typical bird seed.
I'm spending more time looking through binoculars, to my delight.
Posted by: JTB at January 14, 2017 01:07 PM (V+03K)
31
I took the bold step of trimming my orchid today. I transplanted one clone growth (keiki), and trimmed the other spike. Hopefully it'll rebloom in a few months.
Posted by: josephistan at January 14, 2017 01:07 PM (7qAYi)
32
The native milkweed, with silvery, short leaves, seems to like roadside conditions. I've never been around when the Monarch butterflies are visiting,
In southeast PA, suburban development has obliterated much of the native milkweed habitat that monarchs need to survive. A grassroots effort is underway to plant more milkweed to attract and support the monarchs:
https://garden.org/learn/articles/view/3927/
The native milkweed, with silvery, short leaves, seems to like roadside conditions. I've never been around when the Monarch butterflies are visiting,
In southeast PA, suburban development has obliterated much of the native milkweed habitat that monarchs need to survive. A grassroots effort is underway to plant more milkweed to attract and support the monarchs:
https://garden.org/learn/articles/view/3927/
Posted by: kallisto at January 14, 2017 01:08 PM (kD8Fh)
33
Slope erosion and slides are a dime a dozen in Western Oregon and Washington. First job when I got the house in 93 was to reengineer all the runoff. Original builder was an idiot.
Somebody needs to train those birds on how to not spill half the food out of the feeders and attract squirrels and rats. I had to give up and let them fend for themselves.
Somebody needs to train those birds on how to not spill half the food out of the feeders and attract squirrels and rats. I had to give up and let them fend for themselves.
Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at January 14, 2017 01:08 PM (FtrY1)
34
Crab are tasty, but hard to catch on the fly!
Posted by: garrett at January 14, 2017 01:09 PM (PPu+l)
35
That second wildflower reminds me of a flower I see in the woods out here on the east coast occasionally. Sis called it a ladyslipper, I think.
I tried bringing some home once, but they didn't take.
She warned me that they wouldn't sutvive a transplant, but I'm hardheaded.
Really pretty, delicate little things.
I tried bringing some home once, but they didn't take.
She warned me that they wouldn't sutvive a transplant, but I'm hardheaded.
Really pretty, delicate little things.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:09 PM (zc45R)
36
Yes, she mentioned black oil sunflower seeds as especially good for birds in winter. Be careful what you plant under the feeders. The seeds inhibit growth of some other plants.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 12:49 PM (qahv/)
-------------
Thanks. I have a few Squirrel Buster brand feeders out that get a lot of traffic year round - and yes, some of the seed kills the "grass" that is supposed to be growing underneath. I have a hill covered in ivy in the back and I'd like to get a few more feeders and perhaps hang them from a line. Not sure if that would be too wobbly for the birds.
Yes, she mentioned black oil sunflower seeds as especially good for birds in winter. Be careful what you plant under the feeders. The seeds inhibit growth of some other plants.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 12:49 PM (qahv/)
-------------
Thanks. I have a few Squirrel Buster brand feeders out that get a lot of traffic year round - and yes, some of the seed kills the "grass" that is supposed to be growing underneath. I have a hill covered in ivy in the back and I'd like to get a few more feeders and perhaps hang them from a line. Not sure if that would be too wobbly for the birds.
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 01:09 PM (Sfs6o)
37
>>First job when I got the house in 93 was to reengineer all the runoff. Original builder was an idiot.
They don't understand curtain drains out West.
They just shrug and deal with the flooding...when I built my place, everyone thought I was nuts to do all the drain work I did.
They don't understand curtain drains out West.
They just shrug and deal with the flooding...when I built my place, everyone thought I was nuts to do all the drain work I did.
Posted by: garrett at January 14, 2017 01:11 PM (PPu+l)
38
Milkweed sap is good for treating Poison Ivy.
Funny how you find the Poison and the Cure right next to eachother, out there.
Funny how you find the Poison and the Cure right next to eachother, out there.
Posted by: garrett at January 14, 2017 01:12 PM (PPu+l)
39
Posted by: josephistan at January 14, 2017 01:07 PM (7qAYi)
I hope you are successful. Years ago I was a confirmed orchid hater until I took a botanical illustration class at Waterloo Gardens and they gave me an orchid to draw. I have been hooked since then.
Longwood Gardens' annual Orchid extravaganza starts next week. Have you been?
https://longwoodgardens.org/
Posted by: josephistan at January 14, 2017 01:07 PM (7qAYi)
I hope you are successful. Years ago I was a confirmed orchid hater until I took a botanical illustration class at Waterloo Gardens and they gave me an orchid to draw. I have been hooked since then.
Longwood Gardens' annual Orchid extravaganza starts next week. Have you been?
https://longwoodgardens.org/
Posted by: kallisto at January 14, 2017 01:12 PM (kD8Fh)
40
10 Did Canadian funny-talker lady say that sunflower seeds were the best for birds in winter?
Posted by: Weasel
-------------------
Didn't watch the video yet, but back when I fed the birds, safflower seed was the food of choice. Looks just like a sunflower seed, but all white & smaller.
I quit feeding because it got so expensive. And I was mostly feeding squirrels and racoons. The birds I did attract were being eaten by the neighborhood cats & hawks.
Posted by: Weasel
-------------------
Didn't watch the video yet, but back when I fed the birds, safflower seed was the food of choice. Looks just like a sunflower seed, but all white & smaller.
I quit feeding because it got so expensive. And I was mostly feeding squirrels and racoons. The birds I did attract were being eaten by the neighborhood cats & hawks.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:15 PM (zc45R)
41
BTW, I have found a good use for wisteria. I hang the bird feeders among the branches. The birds have a place to perch while waiting their turn at the feeders and the thick growth offers protection from predators, mostly cats and hawks.
Posted by: JTB at January 14, 2017 01:15 PM (V+03K)
42
And the snow just started falling here on the Delmarva Peninsula.
And the snow just started falling here on the Delmarva Peninsula.
Posted by: Krebs v Carnot at January 14, 2017 01:16 PM (BK3ZS)
43
Six feeders and two houses year round. We have a great variety of birds who stop by. The hawks and owls seem to appreciate my well fed birds too.
The kid is at Yosemite rock climbing for a month. All the weather news from out there makes me anxious. Yikes.
The kid is at Yosemite rock climbing for a month. All the weather news from out there makes me anxious. Yikes.
Posted by: NCKate at January 14, 2017 01:18 PM (oM8Np)
44
35 That second wildflower reminds me of a flower I see in the woods out here on the east coast occasionally. Sis called it a ladyslipper, I think.
I tried bringing some home once, but they didn't take.
She warned me that they wouldn't sutvive a transplant, but I'm hardheaded.
Really pretty, delicate little things.
Showy Ladyslipper in the wild may be protected (cannot confirm) and to dig them up may get you in trouble with the law. I do not think they transplant well, either.
They bloom in early May in SE PA. However, each flower yields a seed or two later in the summer, so if you know where there's a group of them in the wild, head back in June to see whether you can collect some seeds and try raising them.
35 That second wildflower reminds me of a flower I see in the woods out here on the east coast occasionally. Sis called it a ladyslipper, I think.
I tried bringing some home once, but they didn't take.
She warned me that they wouldn't sutvive a transplant, but I'm hardheaded.
Really pretty, delicate little things.
Showy Ladyslipper in the wild may be protected (cannot confirm) and to dig them up may get you in trouble with the law. I do not think they transplant well, either.
They bloom in early May in SE PA. However, each flower yields a seed or two later in the summer, so if you know where there's a group of them in the wild, head back in June to see whether you can collect some seeds and try raising them.
Posted by: Krebs v Carnot at January 14, 2017 01:21 PM (BK3ZS)
45
I didn't notice too much funny talk from the lady in the vid.
But I believe I offended AOP when I commented once aboot how funny Canadians talk.
But I believe I offended AOP when I commented once aboot how funny Canadians talk.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:22 PM (zc45R)
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 01:23 PM (qahv/)
47
We are lucking out with the weather today, just cold rain. Ten miles north it is icy. Only two days ago it hit 70 (didn't last) but it gave me a chance to try out a new muzzleloader. If we can get through the winter without a major snow storm or a lot of ice, that would suit me fine. Cold doesn't bother me; slipping on ice and snow does.
Posted by: JTB at January 14, 2017 01:23 PM (V+03K)
48
Weasel at January 14, 2017 01:09 PM
Careful about bird feeders over ivy (at least ivy on the ground). Rats love ivy.
Careful about bird feeders over ivy (at least ivy on the ground). Rats love ivy.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 01:25 PM (qahv/)
Posted by: Krebs v Carnot at January 14, 2017 01:26 PM (BK3ZS)
50
We put Abruzzi rye as a cover crop in the garden bed last fall. It came up but not as thick as expected. To my surprise, it has continued growing and covering more space as the weather has gotten colder. Don't know if this is typical but it is working.
Posted by: JTB at January 14, 2017 01:27 PM (V+03K)
51
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:15 PM (zc45R)
--------
I use Nyjer seed for finches in summer and a general mix for everything else and was thinking of adding a few feeders with black sunflower seed in winter. I was actually looking at the feeders this morning wondering why the birds didn't just head south for the winter (so get out of my head, KT!)
I have to say the Squirrel Buster brand feeders are excellent. The 1055 model is a good size to start - $27 on Amazon but they really work and we've had ours for years.
--------
I use Nyjer seed for finches in summer and a general mix for everything else and was thinking of adding a few feeders with black sunflower seed in winter. I was actually looking at the feeders this morning wondering why the birds didn't just head south for the winter (so get out of my head, KT!)
I have to say the Squirrel Buster brand feeders are excellent. The 1055 model is a good size to start - $27 on Amazon but they really work and we've had ours for years.
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 01:29 PM (Sfs6o)
52
Krebs, yeah - Sis told me they were protected and illegal to dig up, just like dogwood here in Va. but I'm a rebel.
(I wasn't worried about getting caught with them, because I usually drove the 3 hours home with gallons of moonshine, so a few wildflowers were the least of my concerns).
I think she even tried transplanting some of t h e wildflowers & told me they wouldn't take, but I'm hardheaded.
(I wasn't worried about getting caught with them, because I usually drove the 3 hours home with gallons of moonshine, so a few wildflowers were the least of my concerns).
I think she even tried transplanting some of t h e wildflowers & told me they wouldn't take, but I'm hardheaded.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:30 PM (zc45R)
53
The birds have a place to perch while waiting their turn at the feeders and the thick growth offers protection from predators, mostly cats and hawks.
I used to get irritated by the thorny bush that had been planted around the birdbath in BF's yard, until I realized it was there to protect the birdies as they frolicked. The previous owners of my house planted a huge pyracantha as a protective hedge for the back deck. It's a barrier to humans as well as bird predators. We just have to be very careful as we prune it.
I used to get irritated by the thorny bush that had been planted around the birdbath in BF's yard, until I realized it was there to protect the birdies as they frolicked. The previous owners of my house planted a huge pyracantha as a protective hedge for the back deck. It's a barrier to humans as well as bird predators. We just have to be very careful as we prune it.
Posted by: kallisto at January 14, 2017 01:31 PM (kD8Fh)
54
48 Weasel at January 14, 2017 01:09 PM
Careful about bird feeders over ivy (at least ivy on the ground). Rats love ivy.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 01:25 PM (qahv/)
-------
Well that makes sense. Thanks for the tip. Dispite having two lazy cats we periodically have mice, and I sure as hell don't want rats! Guess I will keep the feeders closer to the patio where we can enjoy them from the kitchen window.
Careful about bird feeders over ivy (at least ivy on the ground). Rats love ivy.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 01:25 PM (qahv/)
-------
Well that makes sense. Thanks for the tip. Dispite having two lazy cats we periodically have mice, and I sure as hell don't want rats! Guess I will keep the feeders closer to the patio where we can enjoy them from the kitchen window.
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 01:33 PM (Sfs6o)
55
Let's see what the official has to say:
"Upon further review, the ruling of a blocked culvert stands. Loss of ten yards of road due to erosion is confirmed."
"Upon further review, the ruling of a blocked culvert stands. Loss of ten yards of road due to erosion is confirmed."
Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at January 14, 2017 01:34 PM (FtrY1)
56
The kid is at Yosemite rock climbing for a month. All the weather news from out there makes me anxious. Yikes.
NCKate at January 14, 2017 01:18 PM
One of our friends got lost in Yosemite in the fall. They tracked him partly by triangulating on his cell phone, which was in his car. Even if your kid can't get reception, might be wise to carry a charged phone.
And to stay with a group.
NCKate at January 14, 2017 01:18 PM
One of our friends got lost in Yosemite in the fall. They tracked him partly by triangulating on his cell phone, which was in his car. Even if your kid can't get reception, might be wise to carry a charged phone.
And to stay with a group.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 01:35 PM (qahv/)
57
She answered the question I've always had about little birds feet...How do they keep from freezing their feet when its really cold...Interesting....
Posted by: Colin at January 14, 2017 01:35 PM (ogUTd)
58
45 I didn't notice too much funny talk from the lady in the vid.
But I believe I offended AOP when I commented once aboot how funny Canadians talk.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:22 PM (zc45R)
--------
I know. Just teasing. I have a lot of Canadian shooting buddies so I'm used to hearing 'aboot' and so forth. Plus, my general policy is to mock and ridicule anything that is different.
But I believe I offended AOP when I commented once aboot how funny Canadians talk.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:22 PM (zc45R)
--------
I know. Just teasing. I have a lot of Canadian shooting buddies so I'm used to hearing 'aboot' and so forth. Plus, my general policy is to mock and ridicule anything that is different.
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 01:37 PM (Sfs6o)
59
When you see this, Kindltot, thanks for the photos and text. Love the fawn lily. I'll try to put up the lamb's tongues if Pixie lets me.
Wow. Someone not familiar with AoSHQ would find this comment to be strange.
Wow. Someone not familiar with AoSHQ would find this comment to be strange.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 01:37 PM (qahv/)
60
So my sister just called and I am going halves on a bobcat. I have to call her back later and set up to have my bank transfer money to her account on Tuesday. She was on her cell at the implement dealer. They have been fighting blowing snow for over a month already. Sort of landscaping related as I will have them come to my raw land in WY this summer to make a level parking turn around spot and work on the track to top of the hill where I expect to eventually build.
Posted by: closeted skeptic at work at January 14, 2017 01:37 PM (Jen0I)
61
I don't have a bird feeder out this year...Last year a hawk (not sure what kind) took up resident during the day in a tree not far from the feeder...The hawk got several meals, before the birds just stayed away. Then I guess the hawk moved on to another feeder somewhere else. Interesting how the birds very quickly learned to not go near that feeder anymore.
Posted by: Colin at January 14, 2017 01:41 PM (ogUTd)
62
closeted skeptic at work at January 14, 2017 01:37 PM
When I began reading, I thought you meant like, bobcats, the animals. Had them on my mind. Heh.
When I began reading, I thought you meant like, bobcats, the animals. Had them on my mind. Heh.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 01:42 PM (qahv/)
63
Plus, my general policy is to mock and ridicule anything that is different.
Posted by: Weasel
---------------
I see that we were both raised to be mature and respectful - and that it was quite successful!
BTW, most of my feeders were ho-made, but my one "squirrel proof" feed was a metal barn looking thing. The weight og the squirrel would close off & hide the feeding trough.
The bastards learned to hang off of each other like little circus trapeze acrobats to bypass this mechanism. While impressive to watch, it was infuriating.
Posted by: Weasel
---------------
I see that we were both raised to be mature and respectful - and that it was quite successful!
BTW, most of my feeders were ho-made, but my one "squirrel proof" feed was a metal barn looking thing. The weight og the squirrel would close off & hide the feeding trough.
The bastards learned to hang off of each other like little circus trapeze acrobats to bypass this mechanism. While impressive to watch, it was infuriating.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:45 PM (zc45R)
64
Off stale stale sock.
Posted by: PaleRider at January 14, 2017 01:46 PM (Jen0I)
65
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 01:45 PM (zc45R)
---------
At that point you just have to figure they've earned it!
---------
At that point you just have to figure they've earned it!
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 01:57 PM (Sfs6o)
66
Whoa, how did I break the thread?
Posted by: PaleRider at January 14, 2017 01:58 PM (Jen0I)
67
The ground softened quite a bit a couple days ago. I took advantage and straightened (mostly) our leaning bird feeder pole.
Don't think it will deter the neighborhood peregrine falcon, though.
Don't think it will deter the neighborhood peregrine falcon, though.
Posted by: fluffy at January 14, 2017 02:04 PM (jw2Xw)
68
KT,
Thank you for the gardening thread.
We are just shy of 10 inches of rain since October at this ranch! The last storm systems we had 4 1/4 inches at this ranch. We had a small flooding problem Monday morning with mud running down from the grapes on my driveway and towards the barn door. No damage thankfully.
We put sand bags by the grapes and by my garden shed where the water/mud ran over my driveway.
There was 5 wheelbarrows of mud.
You have to have rain boots to walk out there.
Thank you for the gardening thread.
We are just shy of 10 inches of rain since October at this ranch! The last storm systems we had 4 1/4 inches at this ranch. We had a small flooding problem Monday morning with mud running down from the grapes on my driveway and towards the barn door. No damage thankfully.
We put sand bags by the grapes and by my garden shed where the water/mud ran over my driveway.
There was 5 wheelbarrows of mud.
You have to have rain boots to walk out there.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 02:05 PM (IgBFP)
69
CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 02:05 PM
Wow. You have gotten more rain than we have. The last storm has been the best for us.
I don't know of any substantial flooding in our little town, but there has been flooding not far away in the foothills.
Wow. You have gotten more rain than we have. The last storm has been the best for us.
I don't know of any substantial flooding in our little town, but there has been flooding not far away in the foothills.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 02:09 PM (qahv/)
70
I had more pics at one time KT, but various crashes and moves and such ate them. I am really miffed that I still can't find the tiger lily pics or the other rarities.
The Erythronium can be transplanted, and I am looking to plant them, or Camas lily, or both under my apple trees. They do well as an understory. The Camas does better in the open, but they will take some shading
The Erythronium can be transplanted, and I am looking to plant them, or Camas lily, or both under my apple trees. They do well as an understory. The Camas does better in the open, but they will take some shading
Posted by: Kindltot at January 14, 2017 02:11 PM (WlUkp)
71
wish i had a bobcat!
if i did, i'd be outside all day.
if i did, i'd be outside all day.
Posted by: concrete girl at January 14, 2017 02:11 PM (+jFQz)
72
Kindltot at January 14, 2017 02:11 PM
Sound like a great idea. Wonder if they would get along with hardy cyclamens?
Sorry about the technical glitch. Happened two weeks ago, too, but partially resolved. I was still unable to post one photo that is probably still stuck somewhere in the system.
Sound like a great idea. Wonder if they would get along with hardy cyclamens?
Sorry about the technical glitch. Happened two weeks ago, too, but partially resolved. I was still unable to post one photo that is probably still stuck somewhere in the system.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 02:18 PM (qahv/)
73
If I had a bobcat
I'd bobcat in the mor-nin'
I'd bobcat in the mor-nin'
Posted by: Weasel at January 14, 2017 02:20 PM (Sfs6o)
74
We have hummingbirds here. I have two feeders in the strawberry trees. They really go through the food.
I also have a bird feeder in the garden area. The sparrow hawk picks off a little bird a day.
We have woodpeckers and blue jays in the south yard, red tail hawks.
There are swarms of birds eating the seed we planted in the grapes. Some sort of cover crop.
I also have a bird feeder in the garden area. The sparrow hawk picks off a little bird a day.
We have woodpeckers and blue jays in the south yard, red tail hawks.
There are swarms of birds eating the seed we planted in the grapes. Some sort of cover crop.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 02:25 PM (IgBFP)
Posted by: fluffy at January 14, 2017 02:29 PM (jw2Xw)
76
Strawberry trees?
*off to Bingle that one...
*off to Bingle that one...
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 02:31 PM (zc45R)
77
Posted by: garrett at January 14, 2017 01:12 PM (PPu+l)
The guys are pulling out poison oak here and I just walked through it with shorts. It's dormant I hope. It looked like dead branches.
The guys are pulling out poison oak here and I just walked through it with shorts. It's dormant I hope. It looked like dead branches.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 02:33 PM (IgBFP)
78
We've got a bumper crop of snow this season, but I think it's done growing. Neighbor harvested a bunch of it off our cul-de-sac this week with his little tractor/loader.
Maybe next week will get warm enough to melt off some, before the next crop appears.
It's time to prune the apple and dogwood trees.
Probably should look into Dormant Spray for apple and cherry-- so, off to the feed store!
Maybe next week will get warm enough to melt off some, before the next crop appears.
It's time to prune the apple and dogwood trees.
Probably should look into Dormant Spray for apple and cherry-- so, off to the feed store!
Posted by: JQ Flyover at January 14, 2017 02:37 PM (044Fx)
79
The guys are pulling out poison oak here and I just walked through it with shorts. It's dormant I hope. It looked like dead branches.
Posted by: CaliGirl
-------------------
If it's anything like poison ivy, you should go shower NOW.
you can get the poison from any part of the plant - the oils are what get you.
Smoke from burning it can get into your lungs, even. I've read that ten year old, dead, frozen poison ivy is just as bad as new growth. You'll still get the rash.
Posted by: CaliGirl
-------------------
If it's anything like poison ivy, you should go shower NOW.
you can get the poison from any part of the plant - the oils are what get you.
Smoke from burning it can get into your lungs, even. I've read that ten year old, dead, frozen poison ivy is just as bad as new growth. You'll still get the rash.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 02:38 PM (zc45R)
80
Yeah caligirl I'd shower asap and then use rubbing alcohol or something to scrub off any oil residue. Horrible stuff.
Posted by: NCKate at January 14, 2017 02:40 PM (oM8Np)
81
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 02:38 PM (zc45R)
I've never had it and I've walked through it while wearing flip flops. I've only done it during winter because I know what poison oak is except when there's no leaves.
I'm going to go take a shower.
I've never had it and I've walked through it while wearing flip flops. I've only done it during winter because I know what poison oak is except when there's no leaves.
I'm going to go take a shower.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 02:43 PM (IgBFP)
82
CaliGirl, if you're not already in shower, do this ASAP:
Wash hands, soap and COLD water.
Place clothes in a place where any oil will not get on anything else (best, straight into washing machine).
Then shower, coolest water you can stand, lots of soap.
(I did volunteer trail work in the SF Bay Area, I am allergic, I avoided constant rashes this way.)
Wash hands, soap and COLD water.
Place clothes in a place where any oil will not get on anything else (best, straight into washing machine).
Then shower, coolest water you can stand, lots of soap.
(I did volunteer trail work in the SF Bay Area, I am allergic, I avoided constant rashes this way.)
Posted by: Pat* at January 14, 2017 02:49 PM (qC1ju)
83
You may not be susceptible to it?
I know people that can roll in poison ivy and laugh. Me? I break out when I look at it.
Heck, I'm feeling itchy just typing the words!
BTW, do you make jams or liqueur from the fruit of your strawberry trees, or are they strictly ornamental?
I know people that can roll in poison ivy and laugh. Me? I break out when I look at it.
Heck, I'm feeling itchy just typing the words!
BTW, do you make jams or liqueur from the fruit of your strawberry trees, or are they strictly ornamental?
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 02:52 PM (zc45R)
84
We're prepping for an ice storm here in KS. My plant shut down operations today--I've been here for 6 years and through blizzards, torrential rains, and Baghdadesque heat waves, we've never shut down for weather.
I've never been through an ice storm like they're predicting. I'm trimming horizontally oriented branches, filled up propane tanks, assembled candles, have a tub of water, etc.
I've never been through an ice storm like they're predicting. I'm trimming horizontally oriented branches, filled up propane tanks, assembled candles, have a tub of water, etc.
Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at January 14, 2017 02:53 PM (n3MnG)
85
Pet Thread up, but I'm keeping this tab open too.
I really like the Garden Thread.
Thanks for it, KT!
I really like the Garden Thread.
Thanks for it, KT!
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 02:58 PM (zc45R)
86
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 02:52 PM (zc45R)
This isn't the first time I've walked through the poison oak. I took a shower with cold water and I use fels naptha (sp?) soap. The branches only touched my calf and ankle.
I'm sure we could make something with the berries from the tree but I don't. We grow strawberries and I prefer the real thing. I've eaten them they have a lot of little seeds. I don't like them.
The birds like them.
This isn't the first time I've walked through the poison oak. I took a shower with cold water and I use fels naptha (sp?) soap. The branches only touched my calf and ankle.
I'm sure we could make something with the berries from the tree but I don't. We grow strawberries and I prefer the real thing. I've eaten them they have a lot of little seeds. I don't like them.
The birds like them.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 03:07 PM (IgBFP)
87
Thanks, Chi.
And you are right. Some people do not react to poison oak or ivy.
Way back when, poison ivy was imported to England as an ornamental. Took some time for people to start reacting to it.
And you are right. Some people do not react to poison oak or ivy.
Way back when, poison ivy was imported to England as an ornamental. Took some time for people to start reacting to it.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:09 PM (qahv/)
88
Chi,
The fruits of strawberry trees look kind of like strawberries, but seeds cover the outside and are kind of unpleasant to eat. The flesh is kind of bland. The fruits are edible, though. And pretty.
The fruits of strawberry trees look kind of like strawberries, but seeds cover the outside and are kind of unpleasant to eat. The flesh is kind of bland. The fruits are edible, though. And pretty.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:11 PM (qahv/)
89
Big Fat Meanie at January 14, 2017 02:53 PM
Wow. Sounds bad. Glad you are preparing for the storm.
Wow. Sounds bad. Glad you are preparing for the storm.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:13 PM (qahv/)
90
Lovely content, KT and Kindltot. I hope all the CA flooding means full reservoirs.
The only for of interesting bird Ive seen is the annual arrival of the neighborhood black vultures.
We always have turkey vultures flying way over head, but in the winter, black vultures come into the neighborhood and hang out in yards and on light poles. There are three street lights that they prefer to use every winter, and when I saw them the other day I was like, oh,hai guys, welcome back. Maybe they're the same birds, I don't know.
My dogs sure don't like them though. Big scaaary birds.
The only for of interesting bird Ive seen is the annual arrival of the neighborhood black vultures.
We always have turkey vultures flying way over head, but in the winter, black vultures come into the neighborhood and hang out in yards and on light poles. There are three street lights that they prefer to use every winter, and when I saw them the other day I was like, oh,hai guys, welcome back. Maybe they're the same birds, I don't know.
My dogs sure don't like them though. Big scaaary birds.
Posted by: stace, deplorable at last at January 14, 2017 03:17 PM (ozZau)
91
I Bingle searched the strawberry tree and read that that fruits aren't great, but make a lovely jam, and a liqueur called Madrono. It's a pretty tree - I'm sure the birds love them.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 03:20 PM (zc45R)
92
"only for" should be "sort of"
For Christmas a friend of mine gave me a hummingbird swing and a hummingbird house. Both are totes adorbs, it goes without saying. But, ok, I get the swing, it's a cute perch for the little guys, but I had no idea that hummingbirds would use a house, and I'm still skeptical. Need to look it up I guess.
For Christmas a friend of mine gave me a hummingbird swing and a hummingbird house. Both are totes adorbs, it goes without saying. But, ok, I get the swing, it's a cute perch for the little guys, but I had no idea that hummingbirds would use a house, and I'm still skeptical. Need to look it up I guess.
Posted by: stace, deplorable at last at January 14, 2017 03:20 PM (ozZau)
93
Thanks for the reminder to refill my bird feeder, KT. I need to do something more, perhaps a sunflower seed and lard cake.
Does anyone here have any experience with balcony gardening? Most everything is under cover from precipitation, and I worry about adequate moisture for my perennials.
Does anyone here have any experience with balcony gardening? Most everything is under cover from precipitation, and I worry about adequate moisture for my perennials.
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 03:30 PM (tHwdc)
94
I have bird seed but feeder is missing and don't know where I put it. On the other hand only light flurries.
Posted by: Skip at January 14, 2017 03:37 PM (yx0Ld)
95
stace, deplorable at last at January 14, 2017 03:17 PM
I can imagine that your dogs would be kinda creeped out by vultures.
I can imagine that your dogs would be kinda creeped out by vultures.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:42 PM (qahv/)
96
Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 03:30 PM
Good thing to check on. If your plants are in containers with good drainage, it's probably a good idea to give them some lukewarm water if snow is not melting.
Good thing to check on. If your plants are in containers with good drainage, it's probably a good idea to give them some lukewarm water if snow is not melting.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:44 PM (qahv/)
97
Having trouble posting again - I don't think I used any weird characters. Let me try posting one topic of my note at a time.
Strawberry tree (Arbutus unedo), called that due to its fruits, which are round, slightly knobby, soft, and red (with orange interior). Never plant one anywhere you plan to walk, particularly next to any cement - the fruits are squishy and messy. I once rented a house with one next to the driveway.... yuck.
Strawberry tree (Arbutus unedo), called that due to its fruits, which are round, slightly knobby, soft, and red (with orange interior). Never plant one anywhere you plan to walk, particularly next to any cement - the fruits are squishy and messy. I once rented a house with one next to the driveway.... yuck.
Posted by: Pat* at January 14, 2017 03:54 PM (qC1ju)
98
Skip, I just put seed in a plastic dish on the balcony. It's exposed to the weather, and I replace it as needed.
One of these days I'll get a proper feeder.
I saw a cute video on FB to make a bird seed "wreath" to hang with ribbon, using a bundt pan as a mold. Spray the pan with nonstick spray. In a bowl, mix 2 envelopes of Knox gelatin with 1 cup of warm water. Stir in 6 T of light corn syrup and 1 1/2 cups of flour and mix well. Add 8 cups of birdseed (they used a blend of smaller seeds with sunflower seeds) and mix well. Press firmly into the bundt pan and allow to dry for 24 hours. Turn over to release, then tie a wide ribbon around one side and hang in a tree.
One of these days I'll get a proper feeder.
I saw a cute video on FB to make a bird seed "wreath" to hang with ribbon, using a bundt pan as a mold. Spray the pan with nonstick spray. In a bowl, mix 2 envelopes of Knox gelatin with 1 cup of warm water. Stir in 6 T of light corn syrup and 1 1/2 cups of flour and mix well. Add 8 cups of birdseed (they used a blend of smaller seeds with sunflower seeds) and mix well. Press firmly into the bundt pan and allow to dry for 24 hours. Turn over to release, then tie a wide ribbon around one side and hang in a tree.
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 03:55 PM (tHwdc)
99
The Banana Belt of Idaho is quiet, except for continuing (bleep) weather. By my count, our snow total is 34 inches. A recent week of thaw and 2.3 inches of rain made for fears of flooding (fortunately not in my neighborhood), and additional ice when we dropped back to single digits F again. All the snow is hard as rocks now.
Because my husband doesn't want to use salt on the cement apron right outside the garage, we have a layer of ice 1-2 inches thick, which we will only be able to break up if there's another thaw period and the ice gets rotten enough to break up with a metal spade. We do have some cleared paths on the asphalt parts of the driveway.
We tried getting our truck out of the third garage bay yesterday. It got stuck on ice, right outside the garage. We put it back in. It probably won't come out until thaw, unless we can get some of that ice removed.
Because my husband doesn't want to use salt on the cement apron right outside the garage, we have a layer of ice 1-2 inches thick, which we will only be able to break up if there's another thaw period and the ice gets rotten enough to break up with a metal spade. We do have some cleared paths on the asphalt parts of the driveway.
We tried getting our truck out of the third garage bay yesterday. It got stuck on ice, right outside the garage. We put it back in. It probably won't come out until thaw, unless we can get some of that ice removed.
Posted by: Pat* at January 14, 2017 03:55 PM (qC1ju)
100
The first year I was in Idaho, I did try a black oilseed sunflower feeder at my rental house. No birds ate from it. Before I left, I just spread all the seed on the deck and let the squirrels have it. Now I live only a few miles from that rental.
I'm feeding the local birds this winter - I started last summer, actually, because it's entertaining to watch them as I sit at my computer by the window. My husband and I bought a bag of bird seed mix from a famous chain catering to birds (don't want to get in trouble so I'm not naming them here). I ended up analyzing their seed mix by weight (sorting a measured weight amount, with tweezers, because I am OCD)
and then realizing I could get the 3 ingredients in the bulk section of my local grocery. I now use raw sunflower seeds, hulled millet, and broken-up dry roast peanuts, in a weight ratio 8:1:1. The volume ratio is approx. 2 and 3/4 cup sunflower seeds, a short 1/4 cup of hulled millet, and 1/3 cup peanuts before crushing. (It would be better if I could break up the sunflower seeds - hmmm, I haven't tried the big mallet yet...) It attracts various small birds, like finches and sparrows (haven't ID'd all of them). Mourning doves, squirrels, and juncos clean up whatever falls down (and we saw California Quail once in the summer) - their teeny bird-footprints are cute in the snow.
I forgot that "gardening" can also refer to indoors. I have one houseplant, a Spathiphyllum that was a gift from a friend years ago (it made the move from CA to ID with us!), plus three basil plants in 1-gallon black nursery pots, which I'm keeping alive until we get around to roasting and processing the frozen tomatoes. I'm still peeling, chopping, and freezing butternut squash, and there are some pumpkins to follow those...
I'm feeding the local birds this winter - I started last summer, actually, because it's entertaining to watch them as I sit at my computer by the window. My husband and I bought a bag of bird seed mix from a famous chain catering to birds (don't want to get in trouble so I'm not naming them here). I ended up analyzing their seed mix by weight (sorting a measured weight amount, with tweezers, because I am OCD)
and then realizing I could get the 3 ingredients in the bulk section of my local grocery. I now use raw sunflower seeds, hulled millet, and broken-up dry roast peanuts, in a weight ratio 8:1:1. The volume ratio is approx. 2 and 3/4 cup sunflower seeds, a short 1/4 cup of hulled millet, and 1/3 cup peanuts before crushing. (It would be better if I could break up the sunflower seeds - hmmm, I haven't tried the big mallet yet...) It attracts various small birds, like finches and sparrows (haven't ID'd all of them). Mourning doves, squirrels, and juncos clean up whatever falls down (and we saw California Quail once in the summer) - their teeny bird-footprints are cute in the snow.
I forgot that "gardening" can also refer to indoors. I have one houseplant, a Spathiphyllum that was a gift from a friend years ago (it made the move from CA to ID with us!), plus three basil plants in 1-gallon black nursery pots, which I'm keeping alive until we get around to roasting and processing the frozen tomatoes. I'm still peeling, chopping, and freezing butternut squash, and there are some pumpkins to follow those...
Posted by: Pat* at January 14, 2017 03:55 PM (qC1ju)
101
We bottled our most recent beer last Monday - Smoked Scottish Ale, Take 2 - we departed from a kit for the first time. We added aromatic hops for the last 5 minutes of boiling the wort. We saved a few bottles of our first try at this ale, so we'll be able to see how the aromatic hops change the flavor. (It's been interesting to experiment with beer - we used to be such CA wine snobs, even had a cellar book, for all the wines on racks which we built into the basement, and we had a list of which wines we ought to drink during each half-year... Now we buy a few bottles a month at Trader Joe's and drink them up within that month. So I guess we need something new to experiment with the flavors of.)
Posted by: Pat* at January 14, 2017 03:56 PM (qC1ju)
102
About poison oak: my first encounter with it was nasty. Just moved to CA, no idea what it looked like, took a short walk in early spring before it leafed out, short-sleeved shirt, no reason to shower until next morning. A day later, I lost a patch of skin about half the size of an index card, on my left bicep (I'm talking a plasma-ooze type of wound!). Had to go to the doctor for it - got iodine/cortisone cream, which did heal it - then had to re-tan that part of my arm because the skin was near-white.
Later I became a trail work volunteer, so learned to recognize poison oak in all its seasons. (After that first exposure, which was nasty, I started getting allergic rashes all over the body, not just in places like my hands/wrists/face/ankles where I might have made actual contact with the plant.) Poison oak can take multiple forms, from vertical bush, to climbing vine, to crawling vine. Watch for broken branches with black ends - that's oxidized urushiol, the irritant chemical. Also, in the San Francisco Bay Area, the smaller branches tend to come from larger branches in a crook'd-finger-shape - think of how you'd beckon someone with your index finger to say "come here" - it's that sort of curve, rather than a V-fork.
You wash with cold water so your pores stay closed - you don't want it getting into your pores. Good luck, CaliGirl, hope you'll be OK and rash-free. (Note to everyone: NEVER BURN poison oak/ivy! The urushiol will get into the air, and anyone who's sensitive will get a reaction. If I had ever known I'd been exposed to burning poison oak, I would have had somebody drive me to an emergency room and start filling out papers before my airway swelled - it can be that serious, for those who are sensitive to it. Thank goodness that never happened to me.)
(Discovered while posting previous message that for some reason, quote marks were what triggered the error message. Weird, since I type these messages directly into this comments box.)
Later I became a trail work volunteer, so learned to recognize poison oak in all its seasons. (After that first exposure, which was nasty, I started getting allergic rashes all over the body, not just in places like my hands/wrists/face/ankles where I might have made actual contact with the plant.) Poison oak can take multiple forms, from vertical bush, to climbing vine, to crawling vine. Watch for broken branches with black ends - that's oxidized urushiol, the irritant chemical. Also, in the San Francisco Bay Area, the smaller branches tend to come from larger branches in a crook'd-finger-shape - think of how you'd beckon someone with your index finger to say "come here" - it's that sort of curve, rather than a V-fork.
You wash with cold water so your pores stay closed - you don't want it getting into your pores. Good luck, CaliGirl, hope you'll be OK and rash-free. (Note to everyone: NEVER BURN poison oak/ivy! The urushiol will get into the air, and anyone who's sensitive will get a reaction. If I had ever known I'd been exposed to burning poison oak, I would have had somebody drive me to an emergency room and start filling out papers before my airway swelled - it can be that serious, for those who are sensitive to it. Thank goodness that never happened to me.)
(Discovered while posting previous message that for some reason, quote marks were what triggered the error message. Weird, since I type these messages directly into this comments box.)
Posted by: Pat* at January 14, 2017 03:59 PM (qC1ju)
103
Good thing to check on. If your plants are in
containers with good drainage, it's probably a good idea to give them
some lukewarm water if snow is not melting.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:44 PM (qahv/)
Lukewarm water isn't a bad idea, thanks! I used large storage bins with lots of holes drilled into the bottoms, then placed them end to end on several 2" x 6" x 6" blocks in the lids for good drainage. It's a fair volume, but I filled at least 4" of the bins with chunks of styrofoam to lighten the load.
The one I'm most concerned about is a double azalea (pink and magenta which through an oversight were planted together and intertwined. I bought it for Mr. D as an anniversary present for outside his studio window. I rescued it from the garden when I had to leave the house. Maybe I should place it at the railing to give it more exposure to rain?
containers with good drainage, it's probably a good idea to give them
some lukewarm water if snow is not melting.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:44 PM (qahv/)
Lukewarm water isn't a bad idea, thanks! I used large storage bins with lots of holes drilled into the bottoms, then placed them end to end on several 2" x 6" x 6" blocks in the lids for good drainage. It's a fair volume, but I filled at least 4" of the bins with chunks of styrofoam to lighten the load.
The one I'm most concerned about is a double azalea (pink and magenta which through an oversight were planted together and intertwined. I bought it for Mr. D as an anniversary present for outside his studio window. I rescued it from the garden when I had to leave the house. Maybe I should place it at the railing to give it more exposure to rain?
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 04:01 PM (tHwdc)
104
we have a layer of ice 1-2 inches thick, which we will only be able to
break up if there's another thaw period and the ice gets rotten enough
to break up with a metal spade. - Pat
I like to keep an old crapped-up ax for chores like that (although you could do some damage to the asphalt below). I guess it's a matter of doing what's required.
break up if there's another thaw period and the ice gets rotten enough
to break up with a metal spade. - Pat
I like to keep an old crapped-up ax for chores like that (although you could do some damage to the asphalt below). I guess it's a matter of doing what's required.
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 04:05 PM (tHwdc)
105
CaliGirl, some people are really allergic to poison oak, and some people not so much. The worst time to be in it is from when the sap starts running to the time the leave die back. In the Winter if you get brush-whipped by a branch you can get a wheal from it too.
The best preventative I have found is wiping down regularly with babywipes to get the oil off your skin, and they also sell stuff called Technu which is mostly mineral spirits, and that does the same thing.
Wash with real soap, not a beauty bar, when you get done for the day and don't re-wear your pants the next day if you have been wading around in poison oak.
You will quickly identify which members of your household who are terribly allergic, and they will insist that you wash your clothes separately, or burn them out back.
Benedryl seems to be the best treatment, Calamine lotion, in my experience, mostly gives you something to do while you itch.
Poison oak makes these lovely clusters of white freshwater-pearl-like berries that hang of the vine over winter (actually they are "drupes" but that is not very important) that have lovely arabesque patterns on them that become more pronounced as the winter goes on.
The best preventative I have found is wiping down regularly with babywipes to get the oil off your skin, and they also sell stuff called Technu which is mostly mineral spirits, and that does the same thing.
Wash with real soap, not a beauty bar, when you get done for the day and don't re-wear your pants the next day if you have been wading around in poison oak.
You will quickly identify which members of your household who are terribly allergic, and they will insist that you wash your clothes separately, or burn them out back.
Benedryl seems to be the best treatment, Calamine lotion, in my experience, mostly gives you something to do while you itch.
Poison oak makes these lovely clusters of white freshwater-pearl-like berries that hang of the vine over winter (actually they are "drupes" but that is not very important) that have lovely arabesque patterns on them that become more pronounced as the winter goes on.
Posted by: Kindltot at January 14, 2017 04:08 PM (WlUkp)
106
I might inherit some poinsettia plants from work. Someone brought a couple and put on tables in the common area. I seem to be the one who is watering them Maybe whomever brought them originally has been sick and will take them over again.. My office has an Ivy that is crawling all over and some sort of potted bulbs that someone abandoned when they left so I'd probably have to take the poinsettias home if they get evicted from the common area tables. Whaterver species the potted bulbs are is tough, they were not watered or anything for a month before I took them; but after I cut off the dead leaves and got them rehydrated and then on regular watering and fertilizer they have flourished.
Posted by: PaleRider at January 14, 2017 04:08 PM (Jen0I)
107
what's the e-mail addy to send in photos, etc, for future threads?
Posted by: redc1c4 at January 14, 2017 04:17 PM (tGpeY)
108
Posted by: Kindltot at January 14, 2017 04:08 PM (WlUkp)
My brother gets poison oak bad. The fels naptha is laundry soap that dries out poison oak rashes.
I've accidentally traipsed through it multiple times, never had a rash.
This time the branch touched my bare leg.
My husband walked through a big plant with jeans on and I threw the jeans away. I was screaming at him get out of the poison oak. I know where it grows because I'm here more than he is. He didn't get a rash either.
It seems once someone gets the rash, each time you even get near it your eyes swell shut. I've been lucky, never had a rash I've walked through it in shorts and flip flops. Just like today.
My brother gets poison oak bad. The fels naptha is laundry soap that dries out poison oak rashes.
I've accidentally traipsed through it multiple times, never had a rash.
This time the branch touched my bare leg.
My husband walked through a big plant with jeans on and I threw the jeans away. I was screaming at him get out of the poison oak. I know where it grows because I'm here more than he is. He didn't get a rash either.
It seems once someone gets the rash, each time you even get near it your eyes swell shut. I've been lucky, never had a rash I've walked through it in shorts and flip flops. Just like today.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 04:32 PM (IgBFP)
109
Posted by: Pat* at January 14, 2017 03:59 PM (qC1ju)
Pat, all my life I'd walked without concern through all kinds of woods and scrub, until 2012 when I had a violent reaction to poison ivy. Since I misidentified the occasion of the exposure, I didn't address the shoes and clothing I was wearing that day (at the beginning of April, there hadn't been much leafing out and it didn't even register). So I continued to re-expose myself. Nor did I understand the persistence of the urushiol oil. My entire left thigh was inflamed to the point where I was at my wits end and prepared to seek out a dermatologist. Since I normally shun the medical profession, that will give you an idea of how desperate I was!
I found that scrubbing enthusiastically with detergent and a nubby facecloth took care of it. And when I was gardening in an area that had been "cleared" of PI vines and such, I always assumed it was still around and wore clothing that could be washed in hot water.
But I'll never be able to walk freely in nature again. I don't even recognize the others in the poison tree family.
This is the second time I've experience a shift in allergies/sensitivities in middle age. Overnight I developed an anaphylactic reaction to NSAIDs, and that's something I never want to experience again. I pretty much don't even take OTC meds anymore. All I can use is acetaminophen now, and I rarely even take that.
Pat, all my life I'd walked without concern through all kinds of woods and scrub, until 2012 when I had a violent reaction to poison ivy. Since I misidentified the occasion of the exposure, I didn't address the shoes and clothing I was wearing that day (at the beginning of April, there hadn't been much leafing out and it didn't even register). So I continued to re-expose myself. Nor did I understand the persistence of the urushiol oil. My entire left thigh was inflamed to the point where I was at my wits end and prepared to seek out a dermatologist. Since I normally shun the medical profession, that will give you an idea of how desperate I was!
I found that scrubbing enthusiastically with detergent and a nubby facecloth took care of it. And when I was gardening in an area that had been "cleared" of PI vines and such, I always assumed it was still around and wore clothing that could be washed in hot water.
But I'll never be able to walk freely in nature again. I don't even recognize the others in the poison tree family.
This is the second time I've experience a shift in allergies/sensitivities in middle age. Overnight I developed an anaphylactic reaction to NSAIDs, and that's something I never want to experience again. I pretty much don't even take OTC meds anymore. All I can use is acetaminophen now, and I rarely even take that.
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 04:33 PM (tHwdc)
110
I always wanted a Bobcat with all the attachments. I used to use one in a former job. I can operate one, but I don't have the really slick skills some operators have--the ones that can add and level just enough dirt to raise a section of the floor 1/4" with the bucket.
I noticed that there's kind of a junior baby backhoe advertised in the back of Popular Mechanics. Perhaps I should think small.
I noticed that there's kind of a junior baby backhoe advertised in the back of Popular Mechanics. Perhaps I should think small.
Posted by: Gordon at January 14, 2017 04:40 PM (GALxx)
111
KT,
We also have some flooded fields. Strawberries under water. We have pumps draining the water. If we didn't have the pumps we would lose the field.
We are happy for the rain though.
I'm predicting gaps in planting now so about 90 days from now fresh produce prices will be high. Or I hope they will.
Lettuce prices have been bad for a year.
We also have some flooded fields. Strawberries under water. We have pumps draining the water. If we didn't have the pumps we would lose the field.
We are happy for the rain though.
I'm predicting gaps in planting now so about 90 days from now fresh produce prices will be high. Or I hope they will.
Lettuce prices have been bad for a year.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 04:42 PM (IgBFP)
112
the more you drive it, the better you'll be Gordon!
i've seen the baby ones too.
i still think the one to get is the regular size.
i've seen the baby ones too.
i still think the one to get is the regular size.
Posted by: concrete girl at January 14, 2017 04:44 PM (+jFQz)
113
Pat, I noticed that Starbucks is advertising Smoked Butter Scotch. I was unaware they were licensed, but you learn things, eh?
A local concern sells a beginner's cheese making kit. I doubt I will approach the skills of the folks next door in Wisconsin, but it's one of the things I think I should know how to do.
A local concern sells a beginner's cheese making kit. I doubt I will approach the skills of the folks next door in Wisconsin, but it's one of the things I think I should know how to do.
Posted by: Gordon at January 14, 2017 04:45 PM (GALxx)
114
(Discovered while posting previous message that for some reason, quote marks were what triggered the error message. Weird, since I type these messages directly into this comments box.)
Posted by: Pat*
---------------
I'm not a computer whiz, but I think Pixy will trash any post with "curved" quotation marks. You have to use the "straight" ones if they are an option.
Posted by: Pat*
---------------
I'm not a computer whiz, but I think Pixy will trash any post with "curved" quotation marks. You have to use the "straight" ones if they are an option.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 04:52 PM (yuzpV)
115
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 04:33 PM (tHwdc)
How horrible to be allergic to NSAIDS. My husband just had an allergic reaction to something for the second time. Swollen tongue, bad. I think it's from Advil. The first time Benadryl made the swelling go down in an hour. The second time oral Benadryl, 2 shots of antihistamines and prednisone. It took a day for the swelling to go down.
Did you get an epipen?
Ive heard that you can become allergic to things at any point in your life.
How horrible to be allergic to NSAIDS. My husband just had an allergic reaction to something for the second time. Swollen tongue, bad. I think it's from Advil. The first time Benadryl made the swelling go down in an hour. The second time oral Benadryl, 2 shots of antihistamines and prednisone. It took a day for the swelling to go down.
Did you get an epipen?
Ive heard that you can become allergic to things at any point in your life.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 04:53 PM (IgBFP)
116
Posted by: Gordon at January 14, 2017 04:40 PM (GALxx)
We have a skip loader. I also have a smaller John Deere tractor with different implements. There's a bucket and a backhoe implement. They are really hard to attach.
I couldn't do it.
We have a skip loader. I also have a smaller John Deere tractor with different implements. There's a bucket and a backhoe implement. They are really hard to attach.
I couldn't do it.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 04:55 PM (IgBFP)
117
I cannot imagine becoming allergic to Advil. I live on the stuff.
It's one of my daily requirements in the 5 food groups.
And since cthulhu taught me the dangers, I refuse to allow acetaminophen into my house - that shit can kill you.
It's one of my daily requirements in the 5 food groups.
And since cthulhu taught me the dangers, I refuse to allow acetaminophen into my house - that shit can kill you.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 05:03 PM (yuzpV)
118
I can imagine that your dogs would be kinda creeped out by vultures.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:42 PM (qahv/)
Yes, mainly because our current house (we haven't moved yet) is on a slope, and when the vultures visit our trees they're at eye level to our big living room windows!
It causes quite the sensation.
Posted by: KT at January 14, 2017 03:42 PM (qahv/)
Yes, mainly because our current house (we haven't moved yet) is on a slope, and when the vultures visit our trees they're at eye level to our big living room windows!
It causes quite the sensation.
Posted by: stace, deplorable at last at January 14, 2017 05:09 PM (ozZau)
119
Benedryl seems to be the best treatment, Calamine lotion, in my experience, mostly gives you something to do while you itch.
...
I've had some luck with some other stuff for minor poison ivy rashes; I think it was called Ivy Dry but not sure if I remember right. I used to get poison ivy now and then doing volunteer work in the parks, and this stuff wasn't miraculous, but it made the lesions dry up and heal faster instead of oozing for what seemed like forever.
...
I've had some luck with some other stuff for minor poison ivy rashes; I think it was called Ivy Dry but not sure if I remember right. I used to get poison ivy now and then doing volunteer work in the parks, and this stuff wasn't miraculous, but it made the lesions dry up and heal faster instead of oozing for what seemed like forever.
Posted by: stace, deplorable at last at January 14, 2017 05:15 PM (ozZau)
120
How horrible to be allergic to NSAIDS. My husband
just had an allergic reaction to something for the second time. Swollen
tongue, bad. I think it's from Advil. The first time Benadryl made the
swelling go down in an hour. The second time oral Benadryl, 2 shots of
antihistamines and prednisone. It took a day for the swelling to go
down.
Did you get an epipen?
Ive heard that you can become allergic to things at any point in your life.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 04:53 PM (IgBFP)
I used to take ibuprofen once in awhile, mostly for cramps, not even every month. And suddenly one night, after I'd taken some, I was talking on the phone and noticed the back of my neck was itchy. I sort of ignored it, walking around the apartment and still talking. Then I felt something on my lip, and stepped into the bathroom to look at it, still talking. I was shocked to see my face and got off the phone pdq. Over the course of the next hour, I broke out in hives everywhere. My ears were burning and I became hoarse as my throat swelled. My bf ran to the drug store for benadryl. I felt like crap for hours even after taking that. If I didn't know that was me looking back in the mirror, I wouldn't have recognized myself.
Not knowing the cause, the next time I took ibuprofen, the same things happened. At least I had the benadryl on hand, but was still sick as a dog. Now at least I knew the cause.
Unfortunately, since I knew little nothing about the category of NSAIDs, I had to find out the hard way that naproxen sodium was the same deal. Apparently the progression is the same every time. Pebbly lizard skin everywhere except below my knees (funny, that) and it always starts itching at the back of my neck. I'm now alert to that symptom.
It took over two weeks for the swelling around my eyes to subside.
just had an allergic reaction to something for the second time. Swollen
tongue, bad. I think it's from Advil. The first time Benadryl made the
swelling go down in an hour. The second time oral Benadryl, 2 shots of
antihistamines and prednisone. It took a day for the swelling to go
down.
Did you get an epipen?
Ive heard that you can become allergic to things at any point in your life.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 04:53 PM (IgBFP)
I used to take ibuprofen once in awhile, mostly for cramps, not even every month. And suddenly one night, after I'd taken some, I was talking on the phone and noticed the back of my neck was itchy. I sort of ignored it, walking around the apartment and still talking. Then I felt something on my lip, and stepped into the bathroom to look at it, still talking. I was shocked to see my face and got off the phone pdq. Over the course of the next hour, I broke out in hives everywhere. My ears were burning and I became hoarse as my throat swelled. My bf ran to the drug store for benadryl. I felt like crap for hours even after taking that. If I didn't know that was me looking back in the mirror, I wouldn't have recognized myself.
Not knowing the cause, the next time I took ibuprofen, the same things happened. At least I had the benadryl on hand, but was still sick as a dog. Now at least I knew the cause.
Unfortunately, since I knew little nothing about the category of NSAIDs, I had to find out the hard way that naproxen sodium was the same deal. Apparently the progression is the same every time. Pebbly lizard skin everywhere except below my knees (funny, that) and it always starts itching at the back of my neck. I'm now alert to that symptom.
It took over two weeks for the swelling around my eyes to subside.
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 05:43 PM (tHwdc)
121
And no epipen. That's for rich folks ;-) I just avoid meds in general.
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 05:44 PM (tHwdc)
122
I cannot imagine becoming allergic to Advil. I live on the stuff.
It's one of my daily requirements in the 5 food groups.
And since cthulhu taught me the dangers, I refuse to allow acetaminophen into my house - that shit can kill you.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 05:03 PM (yuzpV)
As a non-medical person, my advice is worth little, but I don't think daily ingestion of any product is a good idea. Maybe you should consider some lifestyle changes to address your issues?
I don't even have any acetaminophen around right now, but I should for when it's absolutely necessary. Headaches are usually dehydration, so I medicate with water. I have a tendency to drink coffee without realizing that I haven't had enough water. It was the last thing Tim was talking about - the dangers of not drinking enough water.
It's one of my daily requirements in the 5 food groups.
And since cthulhu taught me the dangers, I refuse to allow acetaminophen into my house - that shit can kill you.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 05:03 PM (yuzpV)
As a non-medical person, my advice is worth little, but I don't think daily ingestion of any product is a good idea. Maybe you should consider some lifestyle changes to address your issues?
I don't even have any acetaminophen around right now, but I should for when it's absolutely necessary. Headaches are usually dehydration, so I medicate with water. I have a tendency to drink coffee without realizing that I haven't had enough water. It was the last thing Tim was talking about - the dangers of not drinking enough water.
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 05:49 PM (tHwdc)
123
Miley,
After years of construction work, my knees and hips are pretty much shot. Pain is pretty normal, but manageable.
I try to rotate dollar store ibuprofen & BC powders when needed.
And I won't stop drinking bourbon.
It is what it is.
After years of construction work, my knees and hips are pretty much shot. Pain is pretty normal, but manageable.
I try to rotate dollar store ibuprofen & BC powders when needed.
And I won't stop drinking bourbon.
It is what it is.
Posted by: Chi at January 14, 2017 06:09 PM (yuzpV)
124
all NSAIDs are from the same basic chemical chain: they are simply different salts of the same foundation, so yeah, you're likely allergic to them all. as a naprosyn addict, i fell yo' pain. not sure how i'd get around some days without it. ibuprofen, OTOH,
me, i'm allergic to all cephalosporin antibiotics, anaphylactic times 3, due to constant w*rkplace exposure from my time as an IV compounding technician.
i try to avoid getting infections.
me, i'm allergic to all cephalosporin antibiotics, anaphylactic times 3, due to constant w*rkplace exposure from my time as an IV compounding technician.
i try to avoid getting infections.
Posted by: redc1c4 at January 14, 2017 06:27 PM (ikWZG)
125
Posted by: Miley, the Duchess, 348 times at January 14, 2017 05:43 PM (tHwdc)
Miley, that is scary. My friend can't take NSAIDs because his tongue gets swollen. Your reaction is worse than what happened to my husband. Only his tongue was swollen.
They called it angioedema.
He's going to the Dr next week. I want him to get an epipen. You can only get one with a Rx. I worry about him being in the middle of a ranch by himself, miles from help and not being able to breathe. He carries Benadryl now.
Miley, that is scary. My friend can't take NSAIDs because his tongue gets swollen. Your reaction is worse than what happened to my husband. Only his tongue was swollen.
They called it angioedema.
He's going to the Dr next week. I want him to get an epipen. You can only get one with a Rx. I worry about him being in the middle of a ranch by himself, miles from help and not being able to breathe. He carries Benadryl now.
Posted by: CaliGirl at January 14, 2017 06:35 PM (IgBFP)
126
Huh. I had no idea folks were allergic to NSAIDS. I can`t take them because I'm on blood thinner. So it's acetominiphen for me. Or opiates, but I am paranoid about them.
Posted by: Gordon at January 14, 2017 08:56 PM (GALxx)
127
On wild birds, I feed year round sunflower seed, winter gets suet and February starts the Goldfinch thistle.
I have the year round crowd of Titmouse, Chickadee, Brown head nuthatch. As the season progresses the different birds come and go according to their schedule.
Hummers don't start here till April.
The Squirrel raiders are numerous in the day and there are some flying squirrels that sneak in at night.
I keep my feeders right outside my Computer room window and often with the window open and the hanging feeder right at the window I get a Chickadee or nuthatch often a Wren come in and sit or flutter around the room.
Once I had a squirrel leap on the window feeder and do a Tarzan right into the desk inside. The dogs went wild as did the squirrel.
I have the year round crowd of Titmouse, Chickadee, Brown head nuthatch. As the season progresses the different birds come and go according to their schedule.
Hummers don't start here till April.
The Squirrel raiders are numerous in the day and there are some flying squirrels that sneak in at night.
I keep my feeders right outside my Computer room window and often with the window open and the hanging feeder right at the window I get a Chickadee or nuthatch often a Wren come in and sit or flutter around the room.
Once I had a squirrel leap on the window feeder and do a Tarzan right into the desk inside. The dogs went wild as did the squirrel.
Posted by: obsidian at January 15, 2017 12:22 PM (ARK2U)
Posted by: KT at January 15, 2017 05:30 PM (qahv/)
Posted by: KT at January 15, 2017 06:43 PM (qahv/)
130
Nope. They're back again. Whew.
Posted by: KT at January 15, 2017 06:43 PM (qahv/)
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