Support




Contact
Ace:
aceofspadeshq at gee mail.com
CBD:
cbd.aoshq at gee mail.com
Buck:
buck.throckmorton at protonmail.com
joe mannix:
mannix2024 at proton.me
MisHum:
petmorons at gee mail.com
Powered by
Movable Type





Saturday Gardening Thread: Preserving Autumn [KT]

preserving-harvest.gif

Casual tips for preserving fruits, veggies and herbs

Happy First Saturday of Autumn, 2016. Today, most of our content has been provided by two of the most enthusiastic gardeners in The Horde. Both of them, with their respective spouses, have been "putting things by" from the garden for winter enjoyment.

Gordon lives in Minnesota, where the summer growing season is not particularly long. He has written a book review and recounted his experiences using automated devices for making jams and jellies and also sauces. With photos.

I also decided to highlight the latest Idaho Banana Belt report by Pat* because Pixie led to delays in its posting and I think a lot of people missed it. I really enjoyed it.

First up is Gordon. I added some heading so we could keep our places. Take it away, Gordon!

Book Review, Foolproof Preserving

So I bought Foolproof Preserving: A Guide to Small Batch Jams, Jellies, Pickles, Condiments, and More by the folks at America's Test Kitchen. Like America's Team, they all wear royal blue stars on their silver aprons. Or maybe not; I doubt Christopher and his bow tie spend much time watching the NFL. As with any recipes from the Cook's Illustrated folks, they can be very fussy about ingredients and steps. But the ones I have tried out do work.

jam.jpg

The nice thing for me is that everything in the book is small batch. Some yield only a cup. But most yield a couple of pints, to four quarts. They can be very specific about doubling; many of the recipes should not be, as they won't set properly. I found that the jam recipes tended to yield an extra pint or two, so have a couple of extra jars ready.

Being who they are, many of the recipes have been arranged to minimize the calories, or to require little or no added ingredients. The jam recipes use quite a bit less sugar than other recipes, and include a shredded tart apple. No pectin is needed, and the apple adds some structure and tartness.

There are lots of interesting pickle recipes also. Some are quick to make, and cannot be preserved. One, for pickled radish, takes only a few minutes--and has to be used within an hour. As is their way, there are lots of pictures and explanatory sections. I like this book quite a bit, and plan to keep trying some of their interesting ideas, such as Strawberry Basil Jam. It works nicely and can be served at dinnertime with beef.

We put up some Colorado peaches using their recipe. The yield on that was a little over half what we expected, but they are delicious. We have about a quart of heavy syrup left over, infused with amazing fresh peach flavor. It will not go to waste! Some has already been used to make a peach topping for ice cream.

Making jam with an automatic jam and jelly maker

Making jelly and jam can be painful. Constant stirring of a boiling, foaming mixture of fruit and sugar will get one splashed, and that does sting. Standing over the mixture while it cooks down is boring. But homemade jams and jellies, with fruit chosen for flavor and ripeness, well, it is so much better than even the expensive artisan stuff.

Comes the Ball FreshTECH Jam and Jelly maker, about $85 from Amazon. You can also order from the company store and pay more for it. This device sits 12 inches high and about 18 inches wide on the counter. It's simple and made for producing small batches. Best of all, add the pectin, the fruit, and (four minutes later) the sugar, and in 21 minutes your jam is ready to go into the jars.

cookjam.jpg

The start of the jam making cycle.
Note the dab of butter.

Does it work? Yes, and quite well, actually. It really is that simple. The recipes in the manual are easy and produce good jam and jelly. The cleanup is quick and easy. Best of all, it does all of the stirring, and no burns are inflicted.

Of course, I have to try different things, so I used a recipe out of the Foolproof Preserving book. The volume of fruit was about 1/3 larger than the machine recipe, and I didn't use pectin because the recipe didn't.

I added five minutes to the cooking time for the extra fruit. After about ten minutes, everyone in the house will know you're making something fruity, because the machine has vents all around the lid edge. Inside, the paddle turns constantly and the mixture heats up quickly. A pat of butter, recommended, keeps it from foaming. And after 26 minutes, I had delicious peach jam. After processing, it didn't set up. It wasn't runny, just more spreadable than one expects jam to be. No one is complaining and it sticks to the biscuit just fine, thanks. But if the machine calls for added pectin, pectin it will get.

jamjars.jpg

Peach jam after processing.
The recipe called for the skins to be left on.

The device has two settings; Jam and Jelly. Touch the button and the time pops up. More time can be added before starting. But one cannot add time at the end. The machine goes into a cool down mode, and will not restart for 30 minutes. Everything but the base unit can go in the dishwasher.

Yes, it's one more appliance, though most of the year it can sit quietly in storage. But I have my Jam Maker badge already, and don't need any more burns. I love this thing and it's going to get a lot of use.

And there is a sauce maker, too.

Like many gardeners, I am well-served in the tomato department at this time of year. Thankfully, Ball also has a tomato processor. (They also have an electric canner, and a more complex automatic canner that takes out any guesswork. I have not tested these, but they are rated highly.) The Harvest Pro Sauce Maker can crank through 15 quarts of tomatoes in 20 minutes, removing skins and seeds, and has a coarse screen also. It sells for about $135 on Amazon.

The company says to use it for strawberry jam, applesauce, ketchup, and butternut squash soup, and pico de gallo. So far I've only used it for sauce, and it does that very well. Tomatoes go in up top, and down below you get sauce, with the skins and seeds diverted, as well as the thinner juice. With the coarse screen in place, nearly all skins are removed, but a few bits may get through, and seeds do pass through. This does not bother me, but I know some folks are pretty fussy about the skins and seeds, so if you're one of these, don't use the coarse screen.

So the machine can eliminate much of the tomato labor. There's no need to blanch to get skins off, one can dispense with the seeding and even other ingredients like onions and garlic get processed down. The process is a bit messy; stuff will get onto the counter. But not much, and less than if I were working by hand.

There are recipes included for soups, tomato sauce, paste and marinara, baby food, jams and even barbecue sauce. The Harvest Pro configures differently to produce smoother and coarser results.

Making Hearty Pasta Sauce

I used the recipe for Hearty Pasta Sauce from the manual. It called for 12 pounds of Roma tomatoes, so naturally I used some Amish paste and some heirlooms and some of the dark cherries I have so much of. I quartered them (halved the cherries) and threw them in a roasting pan with onion, salt, garlic, and a solitary minced habanero pepper, because I have a bunch of those sitting around and I couldn't find any red pepper flakes. This roasted for an hour. I could have pulled the skins off the tomatoes by hand at this point, but I have a machine for that, right?

tom ready.jpg

Tomatoes ready for roasting

I used a slotted spoon to transfer the cooled mix into the hopper. It took less than five minutes through the coarse setting to produce nice sauce. The cook time was 15 minutes, adding oregano and then basil just before jarring it. Processing took about 55 minutes. We had seven pints (and a cup more) of very good sauce with a background of heat--just enough that you notice, but not enough to identify the source.

roast.jpg

Roasted tomatoes go in the hopper
Coarse screen in use

What was left in the roasting pan was some liquid with bits of stuff. I ran that through the fine strainer. The result was (remember that habanero?) two quarts of deliciously spicy tomato juice. I can't drink, but even I wanted a bloody mary made with that stuff. It's very good on it's own. Since there's no preservatives, one has to drink it within about 3 days, or freeze it. We did both.

juice.jpg

Bonus! Spicy tomato juice. Mmmm.

I admit I was skeptical about these machines. But the folks at Ball know home canning, and they have produced some good equipment. Making canning easier can only sell more jars and lids for them. They also have an introductory canning kit in stores, which includes a few jars, and a simple jar lifter one can use in a regular pot.

One thing about canning for those who have not tried it. It requires a lot of dish washing. Sometimes the same bowl or spoon gets washed several times. Plan ahead for this: if a grandchild is not available for free labor, then consider a visit to the Home Depot parking lot for a temporary worker. I've heard one can pay such folks with jars of salsa, but that may be just a rumor.

Another Bonus! Salsa Recipe

Gordon's wife kindly sent us her recipe for cherry tomato salsa, too. Looks yummy as cooking starts.

salsa.jpg

Vonnie's Three Chip Cherry Tomato Salsa

It's called three chip because those of tender tongue have to take three bites before they realize it's not going to kill them.

Yield is 6 to 8 pints

12 cups cherry tomatoes any variety or mixed
Halve or quarter the tomatoes and remove stems and seeds. Pack them tightly in the measuring cup.
3 cups red onion, chopped
18 cloves garlic, minced
3-4 poblano peppers
8 large or 10 small to medium jalapeno peppers
2-3 habanaro peppers
All peppers should be seeded and chopped. One might want gloves for this step.
1 cup cilantro leaves, packed
2 tablespoons salt
The juice from 2 limes
1 cup cider vinegar

Put all ingredients in a large heavy pot and cook on medium heat for 20 minutes, stirring occasionally, tomatoes should be tender. Take off heat and run immersion blender through until tomatoes are mostly broken up, or process in food processor in batches. Put back on medium heat for 20 minutes stirring occasionally. Put in prepared pint jars and process in canner for 15 minutes.

Thanks, Vonnie.

This calls for salsa music! And dancing!

>

Those who are into improvisation should be careful about improvising with Vonnie's salsa recipe, particularly by omitting the vinegar. I don't think this would be safe without a pressure canner.

Last Week's Idaho Banana Belt Report

Gardening Morons and Moronettes who don't check back for late comments on Sunday (or even Monday) may be missing something. For example, many of you may not have seen the Idaho Banana Belt Report that Pat* posted quite late, after running into some difficulty with Pixie. Having once been banned myself, I was afraid that the Banning Times would fall upon the thread before I could respond

I always appreciate her reports, but I was especially jazzed about her report last week because of what she was doing when the thread went up:

Husband and I ran a rifle marksmanship training/American history event for the group we volunteer for, "Revere's Riders" (TM or copyright or something). Taught some 15-year-olds 3-position shooting, and about the history of April 19, 1775.

Those of you who don't come back to read late comments may wonder how Pat* could live in a banana belt in Idaho. This rather droll term does not mean she can grow bananas outdoors. But the weather is milder and the growing season is longer in low-elevation areas near the Snake River than in other parts of Idaho. She could probably grow some Giant Banana Squash or Banana Melons there, but those are topics for another day. Even those in shorter-season climates can grow a banana plant in an aquarium.

Pat* mentioned that her irrigation water will be turned off not too long from now. Many cities in the reservoir-studded Intermountain West have dual water systems: one for potable household water and one for irrigating yards and gardens. "Don't drink out of the hose" may mean more in these cities than elsewhere. I was wondering if cities in other regions have similar dual water systems.

I grew up in the Intermountain West where Pat* now lives, and my Dad gave us "scientific tour guide" commentary on geological features of the areas we were passing through on family vacations. I learned quite a bit about the Colorado and Snake rivers. They allow farming and gardening in much of the West.

There is a lot to see along the Snake River, from the Grand Canyon of the Snake in Wyoming to Hell's Canyon on the Idaho-Oregon border. The Snake and Yakima rivers merge with the Columbia in the Tri-Cities area of southeastern Washington State. Shoshone Falls, near Twin Falls Idaho, is higher than Niagra Falls. It once marked the end of the line for ocean-going fish like salmon and sturgeon swimming up the Snake River. I think this unusual photo is of the Snake winding its way through the Snake River Plain in Idaho. If there is another location on the Snake that looks like this, let me know.

Snake-River.jpg

Satellite image of the Snake River.

Dad also taught us about some dramatic events caused by Climate Change in the prehistoric past. The most striking one involving the Snake River was the Lake Bonneville Flood. This sudden, cataclysmic flood left huge boulders strewn along the Snake River, among other topographical changes. Does your yard or garden feature boulders?

Lake-Bonneville-Flood.jpg

Jammin' in the Banana Belt

Weiser, Idaho is a small farming community in Idaho's Banana Belt, near the confluence of the Weiser and Snake rivers on the Idaho-Oregon border. It is the home of the National Oldtime Fiddlers Contest and Festival. This style of music was a precursor to Bluegrass. There is now some crossover with Bluegrass and Jazz Fiddling, but contest rules, last I heard, still specify that contest tunes must be "danceable". No "fancy tunes" like Orange Blossom Special are allowed.

I saw my sister compete in the Junior Division one year. Those who go expecting stagecraft at the contest will be disappointed, but there are events meant for an audience, too.

Many musicians attend primarily for the jam sessions around campers and in taverns between and after contest sessions. There are a lot of farmers and gardeners among them. A memorable respite from technology and glitz, with genuine people.

I am not sure that a blues song is supposed to be this happy. But I like it.

Reminder

Pat* mentioned planting Lily of the Valley under a linden tree. I think caution is warranted when putting concrete rings around some trees, but it is time for people in some climates to plant fall bulbs and such.

Anything new going on in your garden? Are you harvesting? Preserving any produce for winter?

Hope some nice things happen for you this week. Stay cozy.

Posted by: Open Blogger at 12:30 PM




Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Alas no canning anymore

Posted by: Skip at September 24, 2016 12:29 PM (JfUI4)

2 I want the Petrified Watermelons.

Posted by: HH at September 24, 2016 12:30 PM (DrCtv)

3 Good afternoon greenthmbs

Posted by: Skip at September 24, 2016 12:30 PM (JfUI4)

4 Hi, Skip.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 12:30 PM (qahv/)

5 Comcast seems to be slow today. If I am not around part of the time, don't be surprised.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 12:35 PM (qahv/)

6 I have the America's Test Kitchen book on jams and jellies too - unfortunately got it too late in the season to really try it out. The only thing left in our garden are some Concord grapes, so I am making jam out of what's left (just using the standard Sure-Jell pectin recipe, which works well enough).

Posted by: Annalucia at September 24, 2016 12:36 PM (a5bF3)

7 Forgot to mention - how do you manage to successfully preserve green beans and broccoli? I've had no luck at all - they just come out looking and tasting like shards of green wood.

Posted by: Annalucia at September 24, 2016 12:37 PM (a5bF3)

8 I am Linus and I believe in the Great Trumpkin!

No, really.. I made Spaghetti sauce to store (and we still have some) with banana peppers from the farmer's market. Some of the peppers were mild.. some, let us say, were not! We now have Roulette Spaghetti Sauce now, some spicy, some hotter than a 'Messican Saturday Night!

Posted by: Catman at September 24, 2016 12:37 PM (RI/nF)

9 I will have to try the America's Test Kitchen canning book. I use the Ball Blue Book of Canning and it tends to be straight forward for preserving, but some of the stuff is sort of bland.

The older versions have more options and recipes.

My one thing I would insist if you are going to make a batch of stove-top jam is to use a deep stock pot. If at all possible use a 10 Quart. It is ridiculously over-sized for doing a single batch of jam, but I used a dutch oven for years and had to just get the heat right to not get it to boil over and still keep it hard enough for the pectin to set.

With the stock pot I don't have to worry about the jam boiling over. Ever.

Posted by: Kindltot at September 24, 2016 12:38 PM (KOBAq)

10 Spike got a comment onto last week's thread early Monday afternoon without getting banned.

Sungold tomatoes seem popular around here.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 12:38 PM (qahv/)

11 The idea of a canning "machine" makes me sad.

It's canning. Part of the enjoyment comes from putting the work into it and doping it the way our ancestors did. And c'mon, it's not that hard. We all have canning machines-at the ends of our arms.





Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? - I speak of the Pompatous of Love at September 24, 2016 12:40 PM (WlGX+)

12 Well speaking of "climate" I would think gardeners and farmers would go more by meteorological dating for Autumn that Solar dating. According to met dating (agreed to in the 1800s) Autumn begins on September 1.


Now way down in the extreme South it is still almost like summer now, but in the North it is closer to Winter. But the temps here in northern SC stared dropping in the second week of September.

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at September 24, 2016 12:40 PM (mpXpK)

13 "doing it"

Not "doping it."

Though I suppose you could put dope in your cans.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? - I speak of the Pompatous of Love at September 24, 2016 12:41 PM (WlGX+)

14 Annalucia at September 24, 2016 12:37 PM

Have you tried blanching and freezing broccoli and green beans?

Some types of green beans turn out pretty well when dried, too. And then there are dilly green bean pickles.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 12:41 PM (qahv/)

15 Oh, and if you are going to make pear jam, don't boil the pears down and run them through the food mill to get the lumps out before adding the pectin and sugar.

Core and skin your pears and then run them through the shredder and use the shreds and juice to make your pear jam. It will have a lighter flavor, lighter texture, and just be all over brighter. It will look more like a conserve, but it will gel like a regular jam.

Posted by: Kindltot at September 24, 2016 12:42 PM (KOBAq)

16 Last weekend I turned 4 gallons of tomatoes and a couple of eggplants and a head of garlic and a couple of red jalapenos and onions into 5 pints of tomato sauce for pasta and pizza.

Migawd it turned out good.

It took forever to cook down though.

Posted by: Kindltot at September 24, 2016 12:45 PM (KOBAq)

17 My brown crowder peas experiment is going great. I'll start picking them next week.

Posted by: Dave at Buffalo Roam at September 24, 2016 12:46 PM (vU+tB)

18 "Have you tried blanching and freezing broccoli and green beans?"

Yes, I have, and that's how I ended up with little green shards of wood. Was using the old "Stocking Up" book (from 1980) and followed their directions; no luck.

As for pear jam - no need to turn it into applesauce; just chop them fine. Deee-licious :-)

Posted by: Annalucia at September 24, 2016 12:49 PM (a5bF3)

19 6 I have the America's Test Kitchen book on jams and jellies too - unfortunately got it too late in the season to really try it out.

====

Same here. I had already put up most of my peppers, some processed in the hot bath, and some as refrigerator pickles. I think I used a Ball bread n butter pickle recipe for the sweet peppers, and I haven't even tasted them yet to see how I did.

The first thing I'm gonna try from that ATK book is the kimchi, whenever I finish what I have. I made a bunch a while back but cheated by using a commercial kimchi paste.

I finally got access to my new house today, so this morning I've been trying to size up where to put what, food wise. We're going to redo some of the kitchen anyway, mainly the cooking appliances and counter tops.

Also finally had a little time to look at the baby fruit trees the former owners planted: Mexican lime, satsuma, navel orange, some weird lemon (i'll have to look again--thank goodness the tags are on them) some kind of apple (which may be dead), and avocado. I think some of those are not completely cold hardy here.

Posted by: stace...TEXIT at September 24, 2016 12:53 PM (ozZau)

20 FWIW, my bread machine has a "jam" setting and it works pretty well. Foam over is a problem, but I mitigate that buy making smaller batches.
It does tend to cook the jam quite a bit, meaning if you like really chunky jam you don't get that (at least for strawberries which is what I primarily use) because no matter how you slice them they cook down.

Posted by: tsrlbke PhD(c), rogue bioethicist at September 24, 2016 12:53 PM (dzmBR)

21 WhatWhatWhat? - I speak of the Pompatous of Love at September 24, 2016 12:40 PM

You have a point. But some people love gizmos, and reproducible results. And not getting burned. Anything that gives them an alternative to store-bought jam and jelly is OK by me.

The sauce maker appeals to me more, though. I am thinking "pozole', which Mr. Bar-the-Door loves.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 12:55 PM (qahv/)

22 Kindltot at September 24, 2016 12:42 PM

I like that idea. I would put a little lemon juice, vitamin C powder, citric acid or Fruit-Fresh in the bowl receiving the shredded peares, too.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 12:58 PM (qahv/)

23 stace...TEXIT at September 24, 2016 12:53 PM

Congratulations on the new house. And thank goodness for tags on fruit trees!

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:01 PM (qahv/)

24 Temps are getting lower here. Hasn't froze yet, but I expect those temps are not far away.

Posted by: Ronster at September 24, 2016 01:03 PM (516lt)

25 Congratulations on the new house. And thank goodness for tags on fruit trees!
Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:01 PM (qahv/)

Thank you!

The house has a gun locker in the guest bedroom and a wine locker in the garage. Our realtor is my brother in law, and he told his daughter about that. My precious niece said "Storage for guns and booze. That house is perfect for Aunt stace!"

Posted by: stace...TEXIT at September 24, 2016 01:06 PM (ozZau)

26 Still harvesting green beans here, second planting is almost ready to sart harvesting, first is almost done.
Tried your advice on one of the red cabbages KT. It did spout several new growths, I picked all off but 2. They are in the Vegtrug, which I have a cover for so they may produce something before it gets really cold.

Posted by: Farmer at September 24, 2016 01:06 PM (3hlFs)

27 My Santa Fe peppers went gangbusters this year. Planning more plants next season. Dame with the Thai hots, the same.

Posted by: The Deplorable Mr Aspirin Factory at September 24, 2016 01:06 PM (ytIUA)

28 I have this volunteer vine. Don't know for sure, but the fruit looks like watermelon. The fruits are about the size of a small egg. Chance that they will mature: absolutely zero.

Posted by: Ronster at September 24, 2016 01:08 PM (516lt)

29 Dame=Same. Damn phone.

Posted by: The Deplorable Mr Aspirin Factory at September 24, 2016 01:08 PM (ytIUA)

30 Farmer at September 24, 2016 01:06 PM

Great news on the green beans and cabbage.

Some kinds of green beans get tough around here when nights get cold in the fall. You might not want to let your second crop get too big before picking. Or at least check to make sure your variety is not too reactive to cold.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:10 PM (qahv/)

31 I like canned anything....whither from Del Monte or the Green Giant or Libby's.

Used to home can but too much work and clean up.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at September 24, 2016 01:10 PM (ej1L0)

32 Harvest this year, maybe half a dozen medium sized tomatoes and 3 cucumbers. Pathetic.

Posted by: Ronster at September 24, 2016 01:11 PM (516lt)

33 Ronster at September 24, 2016 01:08 PM

Volunteer melons can be weird. Have you considered making pickles with the green fruit? Might want to taste it.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:12 PM (qahv/)

34 Had a bumper crop of tomatoes years ago in the big garden. Canned over 100 qts of tomato juice. Good to the last drop.

Posted by: Ronster at September 24, 2016 01:13 PM (516lt)

35 Ronster at September 24, 2016 01:13 PM

Hope your garden turns out well next year.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:16 PM (qahv/)

36
I like that idea. I would put a little lemon
juice, vitamin C powder, citric acid or Fruit-Fresh in the bowl
receiving the shredded peares, too.
Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 12:58 PM (qahv/)


When making jam always follow the recipe on the pectin box, it saves heartache.

I used to think I knew better, but I also used to can a lot of fruit syrup.

Posted by: Kindltot at September 24, 2016 01:17 PM (KOBAq)

37 KT, there are only 2 fruits big enough to bother with. I may taste one of those to help identify the plant and throw the rest of the vine in the compost pile.

Posted by: Ronster at September 24, 2016 01:17 PM (516lt)

38 Url link - how to make a small batch of sauerkraut in a 1-quart canning jar that will be ready to eat in just a week.

Posted by: Homemade Kimchi Lover at September 24, 2016 01:24 PM (g6yUI)

39 Labels. Labels are important. You can write brief notes on the lid with a sharpie, but it is at times hard to tell the 14 APLSC from the 14 SQSH when the lid was wet when you wrote it.

I print out labels on typing paper in columns, cut them out, and use paste to stick them on. I can put ingredients in too, if I am feeling ambitious

I used to use a boiled flour paste that I used for pasting paper together, but I was getting at times a 25% failure rate where the labels just fell off when they got too dry

Now I mix dry milk and water in a saucer, so it is as thick as condensed milk, run the paper label across the milk and up the edge of the saucer to try to squeegee the extra milk off, and then place where I want it on the jar, and use a 2" paint brush to tap the air bubbles out with the bristle ends.
It sticks immediately.

As long as the milk is not too weak it is very good stickum. It is essentially casein glue without having to faff around with acid and whole milk. So far it hasn't made the pantry smell like spoiled milk either

Posted by: Kindltot at September 24, 2016 01:26 PM (KOBAq)

40 Posted by: Kindltot at September 24, 2016 01:26 PM (KOBAq)

Clear lacquer brushed across the label might work to keep it legible....

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at September 24, 2016 01:31 PM (Zu3d9)

41 Ronster, that's why God made Farmers' Markets. In other years we have gotten stuff to round out the larder there. Vonnie is very good at approaching the merchants at the end of things when they're looking at baskets full of things that won't be good to sell the next day. She gets some good deals, and the stuff is very cannable.

@20 tsrblke: It's pretty difficult to get strawberries to stay a little chunky. They just seem to collapse. The ATK recipe for strawberry jam calls for minimal cooking to retain texture and fresh flavor.

And everyone: the older recipes in the Ball books and others had a lot of forgiveness built in to ensure that the results were safe. KT is right about the cherry tomato salsa recipe: that vinegar gives some flavor, but it also lowers the pH to a safe level for storage. The ATK recipes often call for bottled lemon juice, because that is consistent in its acidity. Fresh lemon juice is tastier, but the acidity can vary a lot.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 01:34 PM (5fJpW)

42 My favorite river. That photo has a weird optical illusion effect for me. It looks as if the river is a pathway that is elevated above ground level.

Posted by: Snake Plisskin at September 24, 2016 01:38 PM (dtWKK)

43 Gardening. Okay. Well, Rev has a geranium that he's kept alive for about three years now I think. It was in a pot on his dad's porch, then his dad died. Rev is extremely sentimental so he took the geranium and has been nursing it along. I looked at the geranium yesterday and it looks like crap. Dad or no dad, it's got to go. This is going to lead to an hour and a half discussion. Bank on it.


Posted by: grammie winger's deplorable basket at September 24, 2016 01:39 PM (bpfzP)

44 @42 Snake: I see the same thing. Looks like the river is above the terrain.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 01:43 PM (5fJpW)

45 FWIW to any of you who grow Fuyu Persimmons. Every couple of years we have a bumper crop of persimmons. We eat what we can, give some away, make jam, and still, somehow, there's some left over. Not wanting to waste them or throw them away, we tried slicing and drying them, only to discover the dried slices immediately started soaking up moisture from the air and went gooey even if we put them in jars.
Whereupon I tried freezing the dried slices. Since we had space in our chest freezer, I made up a dozen big "freezer bags" full of dried persimmon slices. We save them for summer.
Enjoy!

Posted by: Another Bob at September 24, 2016 01:46 PM (oBKSz)

46 After a slow start due to extreme heat throughout July, I've finally started to get some tomatoes (celebrity and tangerine hybrid). I'm roasting a casserole dish of the smaller ones and the ones with blemishes and the overripe ones in the oven right now for making salsa. I use raw onion and garlic and roasted green chiles in the salsa and freeze it. I add the salt when I thaw it for use. The acid in the tomatoes cooks the onions and the garlic before I freeze it. It tastes like fresh salsa when it's thawed. The orange tomatoes make the salsa look a little funny, but work just fine.

Posted by: huerfano at September 24, 2016 01:47 PM (jkkMG)

47 What can you can make with persimmons?

Posted by: Kindltot at September 24, 2016 01:47 PM (KOBAq)

48 Seems like this is a good time of year to start growing veggies in your home from scraps. Most of them can be planted in soil after holding them in water a few days or weeks like celery, romaine, green onions, etc.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at September 24, 2016 01:47 PM (39g3+)

49 Kindltot at September 24, 2016 01:26 PM

Great tip on the labels.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:48 PM (qahv/)

50 grammie, geraniums are pretty easy to grow. Even my wife is successful doing it. Maybe it just needs a bigger pot or more sun. I vote to let it live.

Posted by: Ronster at September 24, 2016 01:48 PM (516lt)

51 Last year I told myself I'd do canning this year ... and I have all the tools ... but next year for sure. Salsa especially. I do still have tomatoes coming on, and a few jalepenos, pumpkins I don't know what to do with ... I just like to watch them grow.

A Facebook friend was pushing the "Seed: The Untold Story" movie. Another "sustainability, commie" philosophical attack on GMOs, predicting the end of the world soon, so save your seed or die.

There is still as much variety as before, and it is probably getting better every year. So here is the food science link that debunks their baloney. Of course buying or growing "organic" is all well and good ... but the "sustainability" hippies have become more commie front groups than horticulturalists, imo.

http://tinyurl.com/z47gjzp

Posted by: illiniwek at September 24, 2016 01:50 PM (n6rAX)

52 As far as labeling is concerned two suggestions:

Duct tape and bold sharpie.

Put it on the lids. Jars and old duct tape can be hard to separate.

Query: Anybody tried reusable lids? Seems useful for preserving after the collapse.

Query: Grandma (waves to heaven) used to use wax to seal jam. Is that old timey way safe? As an aside, she used to cook sausage and seal it in fat renderings for later use.

Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at September 24, 2016 01:50 PM (FtrY1)

53 Snake Plisskin at September 24, 2016 01:38 PM

I thought the photo was weird, too.

Dad also used to tell a story about earlly settlers in Idaho pulling a sturgeon out of the river that was so big it took several men to load it into a wagon. They hauled it into town, where it fed everybody.

Seems strange today to think of big sturgeons in the Snake River in Idaho. But there are dams in the way now.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:51 PM (qahv/)

54 Gordon at September 24, 2016 01:34 PM

Thanks for all the info today.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:54 PM (qahv/)

55 Dad or no dad, it's got to go. This is going to lead to an hour and a half discussion. Bank on it.

Posted by: grammie winger
------------------
Can you get a cutting to root?
Maybe some seeds from it to start new plants?
You can unbox and set-up a Mr. Coffee - surely you can grow a geranium.

Posted by: Tucker at September 24, 2016 01:55 PM (WutqB)

56 Can you get a cutting to root?

Maybe some seeds from it to start new plants?

You can unbox and set-up a Mr. Coffee - surely you can grow a geranium.

Posted by: Tucker at September 24, 2016 01:55 PM (WutqB)
===========================================

Let me ponder that. Sounds like work. Hmm. Probably not.

Posted by: grammie winger's deplorable basket at September 24, 2016 01:57 PM (bpfzP)

57 huerfano at September 24, 2016 01:47 PM

Sounds totally wonderful.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 01:57 PM (qahv/)

58 Added another cherry tomato to this years yield, bringing the total now to six I believe. The cucumber plant seems to be awake now and we have two medium sized cucumbers on the vine and a bunch of gherkin sized little fellers struggling along too. The cucumber plant may actually eclipse the cherry tomato plant production, which seems to be in decline.

Posted by: Weasel at September 24, 2016 01:58 PM (Sfs6o)

59 Sturgeon are fished out of the Columbia as a game fish. Lots of catch and release times. They exist behind all dams up to McNary. Don't know about above that point.

Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at September 24, 2016 01:59 PM (FtrY1)

60 Got mesmerized at the hugefloods dot com link. (Recognized a whole lot of those places in the Bonneville Flood video!)

Garden is just about done. We'll be having a few batches of fried green tomatoes.

Today-- cut sunflowers down for drying, harvest the last tomatoes and zukes. Then pull *all* the plants up for composting.

I got lazy and let the zukes go too long a while back (yeah, hard to miss when they're bright yellow--IF you go look, that is.) So, peeled, scooped out seeds and shredded for zucchini bread. Froze a few batch-sized bags for later use.

Should probably also put away patio stuff before The Rains begin, lol. *sigh* I love the patio on cool evenings.........

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 02:04 PM (044Fx)

61 Grammie,

I would vote for making some cuttings, if possible. Don't know if it is the right time of year where you are.

Also, people in cold climates sometimes hang geranium plants upside down in the basement in winter, where they look pretty bad until revived. You might want to look into various methods for over-wintering geraniums indoors.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:04 PM (qahv/)

62 @51 Illiniwek: I used to cater some events that ran heavy on the "natural" foods crowd. As a joke, I'd hang a sign that read, "Quinoa free: because we care."

I would get people coming up to ask if there was some new leftist campaign to boycott quinoa that they hadn't heard of. I would tell them that I was just protecting them from trendy carbohydrates.

Enviros lie, always, constantly, endlessly. I'd say it started with Rachel Carson, but Malthus probably faked his numbers.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 02:05 PM (5fJpW)

63 Kindltot at September 24, 2016 01:47 PM

Persimmon cookies made with pureed fruit are classic. You can use American persimmons for this, too. Cakes also.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:06 PM (qahv/)

64 I can't drink, but even I wanted a bloody mary made with that stuff. It's very good on it's own.

Exactly. All the stuff that makes Bloody Marys tasty is the parts without the alcohol. Just make Virgin Marys and drink them instead. Easy to do with V8 or Snappy Tom.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at September 24, 2016 02:08 PM (39g3+)

65 Weasel at September 24, 2016 01:58 PM

Great news on your new tomato!

You might want to eat your medium-sized cuke now to give the little ones a better chance of getting bigger, since you are gardening in containers.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:09 PM (qahv/)

66 JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 02:04 PM

Great idea for over-grown cukes.

Did you grow sunflowers for seeds? Sounds industrious.

Remember that sunflower seeds can inhibit the growth of other plants.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:11 PM (qahv/)

67 I like quinoa with grilled chicken breasts and a curry sauce such as rogan jhosh.

Having several gastric disorders, I eat a kind of weird diet recommended to me by my doc, who's a GP but has a personal interest in diet and nutrition. His advice has worked absolute wonders for me, so I keep doing it. Quinoa is high on his list of recommended foods for me. But I like it, so no problems there.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? - I speak of the Pompatous of Love at September 24, 2016 02:11 PM (WlGX+)

68 Thanks KT! If this keeps up I'm pretty much going to be a cherry tomato tycoon.

Also good tip on the cucumbers - thanks. We probably have a few more weeks of warmish weather here in NoVA, but I suspect yesterday was the last one above 90F.

Posted by: Weasel at September 24, 2016 02:12 PM (Sfs6o)

69 This week was a first. Finally came across and ate my first wild pawpaw!! They are INCREDIBLE. I'm going to try to start them and persimmons over winter.

Posted by: Clarney at September 24, 2016 02:12 PM (dgO4h)

70 Query: Grandma (waves to heaven) used to use wax to seal jam. Is that old timey way safe?

According to today's literature, no.

But as a kid, I ate a *lot* of jelly/jam what was sealed that way. Sometimes it was a heck of a fight to get the darned paraffin-puck outta the jar!

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 02:13 PM (044Fx)

71 I mentioned a several weeks ago about a giant red onion I had forgotten about hidden in the back of my fridge which had giant green sprouts shooting from one side. I've *finally* gotten around to getting a pot and some soil to plant the sucker. I *think* it may be about to blossom as two of the sprouts have structures resembling large droplets at their ends.

Posted by: antisocial justice beatnik at September 24, 2016 02:13 PM (jV8Mq)

72 Also, people in cold climates sometimes hang
geranium plants upside down in the basement in winter, where they look
pretty bad until revived. You might want to look into various methods
for over-wintering geraniums indoors.


Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:04 PM (qahv/)
============================================

I might be able to do that. Then if it continues to look like crapola, I could chuck it in the spring and put a new geranium in the pot. He wouldn't know the difference as long as the pot was the same.

Posted by: grammie winger's deplorable basket at September 24, 2016 02:14 PM (bpfzP)

73 47 What can you can make with persimmons?
Posted by: Kindltot

We've tried using persimmons to make almost everything that we've seen peaches used for (no ice cream yet). Let's see... pie, cookies, bread, cake, jello, pudding, jam, popsicles.

Posted by: Another Bob at September 24, 2016 02:15 PM (oBKSz)

74 Clarney at September 24, 2016 02:12 PM

Are you taking cuttings of your favorite wild pawpaws and persimmons? Seedlings may not yield the same quality of fruit.

You might also try some of the named cultivars. I think they are usually grafted onto seedlings.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:17 PM (qahv/)

75 Did you grow sunflowers for seeds? Sounds industrious.

Remember that sunflower seeds can inhibit the growth of other plants.


Posted by: KT


For seeds? Yes, but we don't brine/roast them for snacking anymore-- it's now bird food for winter.

Inhibit other plants? Did not know that! Thanks!

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 02:17 PM (044Fx)

76 I could have pulled the skins off the tomatoes by hand at this point, but I have a machine for that, right?

They make a machine that is entirely dedicated to removing tomato skins?

Posted by: weft cut-loop at September 24, 2016 02:17 PM (V3IFq)

77 Paw Paws are on of the best wild fruits. They're actually a tropical fruit of the custard-apple family that's hardy enough to grow far more northward than most.

Unfortunately, I'm just out of range of the noble persimmon.

Noticed the grapevines along my favorite hiking trails are going nuts. Man, they just take over entire trees. The wild grapes around here are too sour to eat off the vine, but like any wild grapes they make great jelly and juice. There's spots where they're fruiting low enough you can fill an entire large pail in minutes without even moving.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? - I speak of the Pompatous of Love at September 24, 2016 02:18 PM (WlGX+)

78 JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 02:13 PM

I would not use paraffin for low-sugar jam recipes. Probably fine for a couple of extra jars of jelly that don't fit in the water bath. Don't keep them too long, though.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:19 PM (qahv/)

79 I'm going to see what I get out of these wild ones. I was sooooo happy with the flavor of the pawpaw. I have been waiting, literally, my whole life to taste one. What if it was shtitty!!??

Posted by: Clarney at September 24, 2016 02:20 PM (dgO4h)

80 52 Query: Grandma (waves to heaven) used to use wax to
seal jam. Is that old timey way safe? As an aside, she used to cook
sausage and seal it in fat renderings for later use.

Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at September 24, 2016 01:50 PM (FtrY1)

Yes, if you do it right. My great grandma used to do that.

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at September 24, 2016 02:23 PM (mpXpK)

81 antisocial justice beatnik at September 24, 2016 02:13 PM

Sound like your onion is blossoming, alright. You can eat the flowers and tender leaves. Flowers can be pretty spicy. Bulb might not be so great now.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:23 PM (qahv/)

82 When I was little I would take a small chumk of the jam paraffin...with some jam left on it, and chew it.

Posted by: Clarney at September 24, 2016 02:24 PM (dgO4h)

83 Posted by: Clarney at September 24, 2016 02:20 PM (dgO4h)

I had the same quest, I know exactly what you mean! My new quest is for the elusive ground nuts - apios americana (actually a string of tubers).

All the books say they grow wild everywhere east of the Mississippi and even into the Plains but I can never find any here in western NY. I know they're more common in New England.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? - I speak of the Pompatous of Love at September 24, 2016 02:24 PM (WlGX+)

84 ""Quinoa free: because we care." Gordon

ha ... yes, well my garden is very diversified by end of season ... , weed seeds will keep sprouting up out of nowhere, border control and fences are ignored. My public executions and weedophobic rants are fully overwhelmed. But I will go chemical weapon more fully next year ... Treflan to the rescue!

Posted by: illiniwek at September 24, 2016 02:26 PM (n6rAX)

85 Mom's generation was the last of our family to seal jelly w/paraffin, trust me!

Every now and then, we'd find a jar with mold on the 'puck' and mom would say "throw it away!"

Cringe.

Plus, the mess of melting the stuff, needing a dedicated double-boiler to melt it in, and the space to store it ...eh... no thanks.

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 02:26 PM (044Fx)

86 Just watched some 6-man highlights on MaxPreps. Crowell, TX 2014 Season Highlights, to be precise. I like it. The first thing I noticed was that they play on a smaller field, that's huge. I was expecting long slogs getting up and down, but they seem to move pretty quick.

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 24, 2016 02:27 PM (2cS/G)

87 Vic We Have No Party at September 24, 2016 02:23 PM

An older friend used to store giant meatballs in rendered beef fat on her very cold back porch in winter. They called it "hand meat" when she was growing up on a ranch.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:28 PM (qahv/)

88 Shit, wrong thread. Redact!

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 24, 2016 02:28 PM (2cS/G)

89 Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 02:26 PM (044Fx)

I hear that. I finally stopped using paraffin a few years back. Just too much trouble and mess. I like to be a purist but only up to a point. Still have a few blocks of it. I figure I'll hold onto them to make candles during The Burning Times.

Posted by: WhatWhatWhat? - I speak of the Pompatous of Love at September 24, 2016 02:28 PM (WlGX+)

90 52 Query: Grandma (waves to heaven) used to use wax to
seal jam. Is that old timey way safe?
--------------
Sure.
I just watched Jaques Pepin do it on TV yesterday.
The probably don't recommend it anymore, but last time Mom made jam, she did it.

Posted by: Tucker at September 24, 2016 02:28 PM (8FCOT)

91 81 Sound like your onion is blossoming, alright. You can eat the flowers and tender leaves. Flowers can be pretty spicy. Bulb might not be so great now.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:23 PM (qahv/)

Spicy is good! But, yeah, the onion itself is quickly turning to mush, so I've procrastinated long enough in getting it planted.

Posted by: antisocial justice beatnik at September 24, 2016 02:29 PM (jV8Mq)

92 Clarney at September 24, 2016 02:12 PM

Hope you can get some cuttings started from your favorite wild tree(s). If not, remember where it is so you can graft it onto seedlings if their quality is poor.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:30 PM (qahv/)

93 In southeast Michigan the fall raspberries have been producing. We generally eat ours pretty fast as they come in as a topping for ice cream or in the morning = as in a bowl of raspberries topped with some cereal. But we have neighbor who also has a berry patch who goes out of town frequently and we get to pick those berries also at such times. So there's a raspberry pie in the kitchen this afternoon (that will be cut in a few minutes) and another quart in the freezer for another pie later in the year or maybe homemade jam.

Posted by: George V. at September 24, 2016 02:31 PM (LUHWu)

94 No veggies here, getting ready to transplant flowers.

We've had over 15" of rain so far in September. Unbelievably green here for this time of year.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at September 24, 2016 02:32 PM (voOPb)

95 Oh, and we won't mention that mom and grandma also used to *gasp!* re-use their (glass) mayo jars for jelly!

NOT a good idea, although it seemed to work for them.

I understand that the good old 'screw-top jar' threads were changed some decades ago, to prevent this. Yes, canning rings Used To Fit.

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 02:32 PM (044Fx)

96 82 When I was little I would take a small chumk of the jam paraffin...with some jam left on it, and chew it.
Posted by: Clarney
-------------
A REAL treat is getting fresh local honey with a chunk of honeycomb in it.
As a kid, I preferred chewing on that to bubble gum.

Posted by: Tucker at September 24, 2016 02:32 PM (8FCOT)

97 "They make a machine that is entirely dedicated to removing tomato skins?"

My old salsa making friend showed my how they do it ... so I bought this ... $110 with motor, about 45 with the crank.

Victorio VKP250 Food Strainer and Sauce Maker, Electric Motor, and Accessories 4-Pack

From her video another variation seems to work well. Comments at Amazon are helpful, they say to run it through twice to get extra juice. Oh ... yeah, it removes skins, but also smashes the tomato ...

Posted by: illiniwek at September 24, 2016 02:33 PM (n6rAX)

98 87 An older friend used to store giant meatballs in
rendered beef fat on her very cold back porch in winter. They called it
"hand meat" when she was growing up on a ranch.


Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:28 PM (qahv/)

When I was in MMA School in North Chicago we used to put beer out on the window ledges of the barracks. If you left it out longer than 30 min it would freeze.

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at September 24, 2016 02:33 PM (mpXpK)

99 George V. at September 24, 2016 02:31 PM

Between you and Pat*, I'm going to be dreaming about fall raspberries.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:36 PM (qahv/)

100 Misanthropic Humanitarian at September 24, 2016 02:32 PM

Wish you could ship a couple inches of rain to our valley.

What kind of flowers are you transplanting?

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 02:37 PM (qahv/)

101 "grapevines along my favorite hiking trails are going nuts"

they should probably be cut at the base, or it will damage or kill the tree. Concentrated round up (glyphosate) on the cut will keep them from growing back. Now is a good time.

Posted by: illiniwek at September 24, 2016 02:37 PM (n6rAX)

102 Pet thread up

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at September 24, 2016 02:39 PM (mpXpK)

103 >>They make a machine that is entirely dedicated to removing tomato skins?


It's called a Food Mill and it has other uses, too.

Posted by: garrett at September 24, 2016 03:03 PM (cF2Eu)

104 @76: Probably, there is such a machine. No doubt there is a tomato processing plant in the central valley with one.

My mom put up jams and jellys in baby food jars, using paraffin. But it is not recommended these days, though people still do it. I wasn't paying enough attention when my mom did it for me to be comfortable with that process.

Canning lids are inexpensive. But were I more of a prepper, I could see learning the wax method.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 03:03 PM (5fJpW)

105 I have a ton of Pears to can this weekend.

Posted by: garrett at September 24, 2016 03:04 PM (cF2Eu)

106 Okay, no wax sealing. Until we run out of lids.

Posted by: Headless Body of Agnew at September 24, 2016 03:07 PM (FtrY1)

107 @103 Garrett: I stumbled across the hand crank versions of the Harvest Pro last night. They are less expensive than the Ball machine but by the time one adds the needed accessories, the price difference gets smaller. The Victorio version even has an electric motor available.

Considering that the parts look remarkably similar, I'd say they work well. They seem to be well rated. Certainly a hand-cranked model would be more useful after the ferriners cyber-destroy our electric grid.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 03:15 PM (5fJpW)

108 I've always used a hand mill.

I don't even begin to know how to use a food processor...or a microwave for that matter.

I tend towards making things difficult for myself.

Posted by: garrett at September 24, 2016 03:22 PM (cF2Eu)

109 A good-ol' Foley Food Mill will last a lifetime-- darn good investment.

Last time I used it: pressing juice and pulp from blackberries for (nearly!) seedless jam. Love bberries, hate the seeds.

Easier to clean than a food processor, imo.

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 03:35 PM (044Fx)

110 Sorry, I'm late to the thread. I'll go catch up on comments.

Posted by: L, Elle at September 24, 2016 03:35 PM (6IPEM)

111 Okay, sorry again. Posted on the wrong thread. Didn't mean to intrude.

Posted by: L, Elle at September 24, 2016 03:41 PM (6IPEM)

112 Stuff to do....

Thanks, as always, KT!

bbl


Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 03:43 PM (044Fx)

113 "They seem to be well rated. Certainly a hand-cranked model would be more
useful after the ferriners cyber-destroy our electric grid."

I bought the "electric model" but it was (fortuitously) the hand crank model with a motor attachment in another box.

I'm a semi-prepper ... out on a small farm where my grandparents birthed and raised their kids. But I didn't grow up here full time, so having all the tools to survive, making everything work is another thing. I'd probably need community support, which is maybe true for most of the prepper eotwawki scenario. Hopefully we never lose "the grid" for very long.

Posted by: illiniwek at September 24, 2016 03:50 PM (n6rAX)

114
I got two pressure cookers this week; one new, one old.

The new; an Instant Pot electric cooker. Gonna try a tough cut of beef in it tomorrow.

The old; a NATIONAL ALUMINUM MFG. CO. PEORIA, ILL,

HEALTH Steam Pressure Cooker 12.

I think it was my grandmother's and estimate it to be 70 to 80 years old.

But, unless I can find new gauges/pressure relief thingies, I doubt it'll be more than an antique or conversation piece...

Posted by: Spun and Murky at September 24, 2016 04:10 PM (4DCSq)

115 Getting lots of tomatoes and some peppers, just camefrom family reunion and distant cousin did well with watermelon (it was good) and gooseneck pumpkins. Told him I was jealous as didn't get 1 pumpkin. But his tomatoes were not well this year.

Posted by: Skip at September 24, 2016 04:10 PM (JfUI4)

116 garrett at September 24, 2016 03:04 PM

You have your work cut out for you. Do you put a slice of lemon over the top of the pears in the bottle?

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 04:13 PM (qahv/)

117 Are the Foxfire books worth getting? The magazine was oh so trendy back when amongst a certain group of folks...most of whom wouldn't know how to use a shovel.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 04:18 PM (5fJpW)

118 What I don't get about preserving is, why do you have to preserve a jelly if you're going to eat in in the next week or so? Can you follow a canning recipe and not can it and just eat it, or will you die an ugly death?

Posted by: PJ at September 24, 2016 04:27 PM (cHuNI)

119
117 Are the Foxfire books worth getting? The magazine was oh so trendy back when amongst a certain group of folks...most of whom wouldn't know how to use a shovel.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 04:18 PM (5fJpW)



Yes, they are! Lots and lots of old folk lore and knowledge in those books.

That kinda stuff is destined to be lost forever, otherwise.

If I remember correctly, moon shining is in one of them...

Posted by: Spun and Murky at September 24, 2016 04:27 PM (4DCSq)

120 @118 PJ: No, you don't have to do the processing for longer storage if you plan to eat it soon. The "Foolproof Preserving" book is good about that; they tell you how long something will keep, and then whether or not it can be processed for storage.

We had a bunch of "special" jars that did not seal properly. We just put the jam in the fridge and it will get eaten before the "best by" date.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 04:34 PM (5fJpW)

121 Wife isn't preserving anything this year, but in past I know there can be two levels of preserving short and long term.

Posted by: Skip at September 24, 2016 04:36 PM (JfUI4)

122 @52- I've been reading tons on how overland trekkers and mountain men preserved meat (e.g. "We stopped for 3 days and made meat"). Mostly drying and smoking... weighed less.
British Navy salted pork and beef. Most the fresh water a ship carried was used to de-salinate the meat.
French Navy used the fat method. Sealed it nicely, and was probably good for a year or more (if it didn't get so hot they fat rendered.
@79- Good thing you DO like pawpaws, eh?
KT makes a good point about grafting good plants. I learned grafting in school, and have never done it since. No excuse.

Posted by: MarkY at September 24, 2016 05:51 PM (ya48c)

123 The planted onion is apparently enjoying its freedom from the confines of the fridge. Mere hours following its planting and placement on the patio, the stalks are already changing their angles of ascent. Wish I had set up a time lapse camera, now...

Posted by: antisocial justice beatnik at September 24, 2016 05:52 PM (jV8Mq)

124 I'm honored (and thrilled!) that my contributions from Idaho's Banana Belt are worthy to be "front page news"!

Since you were jazzed about my Revere's Riders rifle marksmanship/American history instruction Saturday last week, I'll add that husband and I teach a beginners class 3 Mondays a month, current ages 7 to 16. If you know anyone in the Boise vicinity who might be interested in beginners instruction, intermediate instruction, or guest speakers giving an interesting talk about Paul Revere and the first day of the American Revolution, let's figure out a way to get in contact. Note: Husband and I make absolutely zero money doing this (in fact we incur gasoline and other expenses). This is volunteer work. We do it because it's important - and because we love doing it.

Since we're talking about preserving: so far this summer/fall, husband and I have water-bath canned blueberry jam (U-pick farm not too far away) - red raspberry jam (our patch) - and peach jam (I traded my zucchini for her peaches with a clerk at my grocery).

We are now working through tomato sauce, using a recipe from Backwoods Home Magazine. We'll probably keep making batches, storing it in the refrigerator until we have a decent quantity, then canning it, multiple times this fall. We do use a food mill to squeeze the skins and seeds from the pulp. (Tomatoes now suffering from aphids, but it's too late in the year to buy ladybugs. The Sungolds are looking a bit ragged, despite having the fewest aphids.)

A lot of people I talk to, say their tomatoes are only just coming ripe now. We've had ripe ones for weeks. I think what made the difference for us was a home built row cover. When we built the raised beds, we installed on their interior walls, some vertical 3/4 inch PVC tubes. Before we planted, we made tall arcs out of 1/2 inch PVC. We built our own covers, including end caps, for a pair of 4 by 8 foot beds, out of clear plastic, grommets we installed in the edges, and ball-bungees. (If you know what a parabola is, think of several upside down parabolas made of skinny PVC tubes, covered in clear plastic - if you don't, think of a covered wagon made of clear plastic.) The extra heat that this rig created, early in the season, is probably what let our tomatoes get a head start on everyone else's.

I know everyone here is dreaming of my red raspberry patch - but it's fading away for this year, so you can stop drooling. Production is down by half from its peak. We have a lot of fruit in the chest freezer, enough to make lots more jam (though we already made one batch), or to save for next spring to have another go at the raspberry wheat beer recipe that we weren't quite satisfied with the results of. (Wheat beer's better in summer; that's our vote. Porters and stouts are for winter.)

I now have *63* bags of grated zucchini in my freezer. Enough is enough. If we get any more zukes, I either grill them, fry them, turn them into "zatkes", or throw them into the compost and bring out the machete. (Machete is good for those that get too big to process. And it's fun to whack 'em up.) The powdery mildew is going to take over the zucchini patch anyway...

I believe it was last Sunday that I tried knocking on our first cantaloupe to see if it was ready. It fell off the vine. So we ate it, and it was delicious. Today I looked at the other 3 fruits - they all fell off their vines. So we'll eat them this coming week. This was lousy production for 4 vines - 2 vines never produced a thing. We probably planted too late. Oh well - next time we're out there, we can tear out the vines.

The fall crop of radishes is going strong. The snow peas are starting to produce nicely too - if the frost stays away, we'll get a good quantity. We're trying fall Bibb lettuce, and got a few to sprout - more like an additive to salads, than the entire thing. Carrots are still quite the unknown.

I already mentioned that I found 3 baby English thyme plants, and potted the largest and smallest to bring indoors. The smallest died last week. The largest died this week. I think I will leave the medium one alone in the outdoor bed! I'll mulch it, along with the chives, and hope it makes it through the winter.

We visited the World Center for Birds of Prey, which we are very fortunate to have here in the Boise area. I saw one display about local birds of all sorts - it implied the American Goldfinches migrate away in fall, which explains why I don't see them any more. All I see these days are various streaked sparrows (unidentified species).

The concrete ring around the linden has not gone in yet - it's more a series of trapezoidal blocks than a solid ring; and the soil only needs to be about 2 inches deep for the lilies of the valley. (We can use our cut grass to mulch over it during the winter.)

I also dug up part of our white hyacinth patch, and will get the rest out of the ground tomorrow - they're so crowded, they may have been there since this house was built, over 17 years ago. What absolutely blows my mind is that I bought packages of "mixed blues" from Home Depot - those bulbs *are* in fact blue - and the white hyacinth bulbs *are* in fact white! (The plan is to replace this patch and create more patches of hyacinths, mixing blues and white.)

We do have some tulip bulbs I need to figure out where to plant. In an emergency, we buy a pot at Home Depot and I stuff them in it.

Fall is coming quickly. The last 2 days of August had highs of 90 F. Now we have leaves blowing around, all over downtown. Our own trees have only just started - the linden has turned gold and half the leaves are down (following heavy wind and some rain we had this week), and the crabapple is starting to drop leaves as well.

(Someone mentioned sunflowers - we grew the 12-foot type in the garden of the rental where we spent our first year up here. We pulled the seeds out of a dried head, put them in a nice feeder - no birds ate them. I ended up leaving the heads on the patio for the squirrels to rip up. I don't think there are any birds locally who can rip open the shells on that type of sunflower seed. I even tried buying the weak-shelled black kind, but nothing ate those either. My current feeder has unsalted raw sunflower seeds, hulled millet, and dry roasted unsalted peanuts (smacked around with a mallet) in an 8:1:1 weight ratio, and all the birds seem happy. There were times this summer I had to refill it every 2nd day.)

I still haven't inspected the butternut squash fruits, but the sugar pumpkins have stiff brown stems and are pretty close to harvest.

And I thank everyone once again who takes the time to read my reports!

Posted by: Pat* at September 24, 2016 06:21 PM (qC1ju)

125
Posted by: Pat* at September 24, 2016 06:21 PM (qC1ju)


Great report, Pat*!

But, in Idaho and no 'taters?

How about hops? I am way too far south for those. They would probably rival the sunflowers for tallest of the patch...

Posted by: Spun and Murky at September 24, 2016 06:37 PM (4DCSq)

126 Pat*,

Pat*,

What I like best about your Revere's Riders is combining history with shooting skills. Great idea.

Great report this week, as always. You might want to keep the extra soil under the linden tree away from the trunk, just in case. If it was planted in the lawn and you are removing the grass, I don't think a couple of inches of soil (not too heavy) will hurt it. Hope those surface roots don't grow upward and strangle your lilies of the valley. Some plant professionals call those small rings people put around young trees "rings of death". They may be riskier for young trees than older trees. Some species are more sensitive than others to having their soil level raised around the trunk.

I have never heard of knocking on cantaloupes to see if they are ripe. Watermelons, yes. Honeydews, maybe. Some cultivars of cantaloupe are best when the stem slips off, others before. Don't keep the ones that slipped too long before you eat them.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 06:46 PM (qahv/)

127 antisocial justice beatnik at September 24, 2016 05:52 PM

That's cool.

Posted by: KT at September 24, 2016 06:47 PM (qahv/)

128 Gordon, thank you! I guess preserving came in handy in olden times when you had to make the preserves during harvest to last until the next one.

Posted by: PJ at September 24, 2016 08:00 PM (cHuNI)

129 Oh, forgot to mention J made some kickazz Butternut Squash soup. We ate the big squash, she made the small ones into soup. It has potatoes in in it and I don't know what else, just heavenly.

And went to pick the beans, so many I think we'll have to freeze some, cool.

Posted by: Farmer at September 24, 2016 08:12 PM (o/90i)

130 Pat, what zone are you living in? I like your reports. They give me ideas.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 08:45 PM (5fJpW)

131 I want to make butternut squash soup. My potato leek is pretty good, probably because I use homemade turkey broth which is intensely flavorful. But I wanna do the squash.

KT, I love that fiddle video. I grew up in eastern New Mexico, the buckle on the Bible belt. There was a very small town nearby called Floyd, population about 160. You would not hear instrumental music in many churches around there, only vocal. And of course the Baptists, who disapprove of premarital sex--because IT MIGHT LEAD TO DANCING. Yet Floyd hosted an old fiddlers event every year, and it drew in folks from some ways away. Still does, apparently.

Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 09:24 PM (5fJpW)

132 Glad your posts are showing up now, Pat*!

Count me in as one of your followers. (Fellow Idahoan, ya know... we're a bit north, but in a similar 'banana belt' valley)

Biggest problem for us here is: Time.

Not retired yet, so must put in the hours away from home.

Every year is practice for the next year, and some years are better for one thing than another.... and: It's All Good!

Take care, all. See ya next week!

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 10:45 PM (044Fx)

133 Enviros lie, always, constantly, endlessly. I'd say it started with Rachel Carson, but Malthus probably faked his numbers.
Posted by: Gordon at September 24, 2016 02:05 PM (5fJpW)


Actually they lie about Malthus, Malthus did not lie.

Read him yourself, you will be surprised

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/4239

(one of my finest hobbyhorses in my stable)

Posted by: Kindltot at September 24, 2016 10:53 PM (KOBAq)

134 Posted by: Spun and Murky at September 24, 2016 06:37 PM (4DCSq)


I bought hops from Thymegarden in Oregon.


They're closed for the season, but are now taking pre-orders for some varieties. Check them out at:

Thymegarden.com/Rhizomes

The rhizomes arrived early March, labeled and with complete instructions.

You can always *try* right?

We ended up with 7oz of dried hops from our 3 plants-- first year, each grown in a 4 cu. ft. container.

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 24, 2016 10:54 PM (044Fx)

135 Farmer at September 24, 2016 08:12 PM

I have a friend who has a good butternut squash soup recipe that includes bacon. Don't remember if it includes potatoes.

Posted by: KT at September 25, 2016 12:37 AM (qahv/)

136 Gordon at September 24, 2016 09:24 PM

Great history. I have heard some really interesting vocal-only church music. I didn't learn about that kind of tradition until I was in my twenties, I think.

The American kind is not like Gregorian chant or ancient orthodix music which is also unaccompanied, but sometimes has a similar haunting quality.

Glad you liked the video.

Posted by: KT at September 25, 2016 12:42 AM (qahv/)

137 JQ, what metro area are you in? (Yes, husband and I are retired. We have always wanted this much room to mess with a huge vegetable garden, and despite all the work, we are very happy here. Now we wish we had an extra kitchen, just for food processing.)

In all that length of report, I forgot to say that we tried making cider today. Husband built a cider press. Every press's weak point is where the gigantic screw meets the pressing-plate. Our screw nearly went right through the plate... Cider will go on hold for now. Plus, our Probably-Jonathans are very stiff apples, meaning we might also have to build a shredder to make these apples work, rather than chopping them, in which case cider goes completely on hold for this year, and we make juice in the steam-juicer instead.

We then decided to try cooking up part of our chopped apples to make applesauce, despite that they still had skins on. Husband says the mush still needs more cooking (as well as more sugar - these are tarter than Golden Delicious), despite all my mashing, so we'll try that again soon. If nothing else, we'll make lots of jars of apple pie filling - but not tomorrow. Tomorrow is for digging up the rest of the white hyacinth bulbs, and building the stone circle around the linden. (We will do our best to keep the dirt away from the trunk. We have no idea if tree roots will migrate upwards.)

We already harvested lots of "taters". Yukon Golds (hit by bacterial soft rot, low yield), Purple Majesty (good yield - these 2 were from store-bought boxes of "potato seeds"), and Russets (from some store-bought taters that were looking shaky). We do still have some to harvest, but no reason to do that yet, when we still have so many (at least 30 lbs., not really sure of exact quantity). The remaining ones in the garden are in 20 gal. cloth-like black bags. When it's frost time, we just dump the bags out onto a tarp and pull out the taters. Next year, I think we plan to put all our taters in these bags.

There are hops growing in a field a few miles from us, so I'm sure they'd grow here. But we need to learn more about beer and hops before we'd have any idea what type to plant or how to process it.

I thought you were supposed to knock on any type of melon, and if it sounded hollow, it was ripe. (In the store, I also check that the color is good, and that the stem end smells fruity.)

Revere's Riders is a 501(c)3 nonprofit, which is dedicated to teaching safe, accurate rifle marksmanship to as many people as possible - to telling the story of Paul Revere's ride, the Battles of Lexington & Concord (and since we are a nonprofit, we can only vaguely suggest comparing the ills the colonists suffered, with what we see around us today) - and to persuading as many people as possible to become civically active (whether that's becoming politically active, or active in some other way in their community). (We recommend reading "Paul Revere's Ride" by David Hackett Fisher (sp??), as he tells the story in a very approachable, not at all dry, way.) If we hold a 2-day event, we tell that story on Saturday, and some short stories about individuals who made a difference during the Revolution, on Sunday. (So many people say, "I'm only one person, how could *I* make any difference?", so we tell these stories to remind people that individuals' actions *do* matter.)

Our Monday night class is not currently directly associated with Revere's Riders (except inasmuch as we are volunteer instructors for both) - though we are in discussion with our home range about creating such an association.

I'll try to remember to look up what zone we live in, by next week - according to both the Sunset Western Garden Guide's definition, and by USDA zone.

Posted by: Pat* at September 25, 2016 02:02 AM (qC1ju)

138 Hi, Pat*!

We are in the middle of ID, lol.... near the confluence of snake and clearwater.

Retirement is a few years away (NOT close enough, lol... *sigh*)

We have about 1/2 acre, with about 1k sq.ft of "garden" space, which isn't fully utilized. USDA zone 6b/7a. Sunset zone 3. (I think?)

I try different things: some of them work and some don't.

Lived in ID most of my life, with long-ago excursions overseas and to other states. Hubby-- mostly this region.

---

Former m-i-l had extra cooktop/oven on back patio (fully screened, btw) to can *outside* during summer hi-temps. Awesome!

Glad you're enjoying the Great Gem State!

Potatoes? Lol, we see more wheat + barley up here... but our Yukon Gold and some Red (don't recall variety name) did well a couple of years ago.

Love that you make so much at home. We hope to do the same in coming years!

Posted by: JQ Flyover at September 25, 2016 02:40 AM (044Fx)

(Jump to top of page)






Processing 0.02, elapsed 0.0272 seconds.
15 queries taking 0.0117 seconds, 147 records returned.
Page size 118 kb.
Powered by Minx 0.8 beta.



MuNuvians
MeeNuvians
Polls! Polls! Polls!

Real Clear Politics
Gallup
Frequently Asked Questions
The (Almost) Complete Paul Anka Integrity Kick
Top Top Tens
Greatest Hitjobs

The Ace of Spades HQ Sex-for-Money Skankathon
A D&D Guide to the Democratic Candidates
Margaret Cho: Just Not Funny
More Margaret Cho Abuse
Margaret Cho: Still Not Funny
Iraqi Prisoner Claims He Was Raped... By Woman
Wonkette Announces "Morning Zoo" Format
John Kerry's "Plan" Causes Surrender of Moqtada al-Sadr's Militia
World Muslim Leaders Apologize for Nick Berg's Beheading
Michael Moore Goes on Lunchtime Manhattan Death-Spree
Milestone: Oliver Willis Posts 400th "Fake News Article" Referencing Britney Spears
Liberal Economists Rue a "New Decade of Greed"
Artificial Insouciance: Maureen Dowd's Word Processor Revolts Against Her Numbing Imbecility
Intelligence Officials Eye Blogs for Tips
They Done Found Us Out, Cletus: Intrepid Internet Detective Figures Out Our Master Plan
Shock: Josh Marshall Almost Mentions Sarin Discovery in Iraq
Leather-Clad Biker Freaks Terrorize Australian Town
When Clinton Was President, Torture Was Cool
What Wonkette Means When She Explains What Tina Brown Means
Wonkette's Stand-Up Act
Wankette HQ Gay-Rumors Du Jour
Here's What's Bugging Me: Goose and Slider
My Own Micah Wright Style Confession of Dishonesty
Outraged "Conservatives" React to the FMA
An On-Line Impression of Dennis Miller Having Sex with a Kodiak Bear
The Story the Rightwing Media Refuses to Report!
Our Lunch with David "Glengarry Glen Ross" Mamet
The House of Love: Paul Krugman
A Michael Moore Mystery (TM)
The Dowd-O-Matic!
Liberal Consistency and Other Myths
Kepler's Laws of Liberal Media Bias
John Kerry-- The Splunge! Candidate
"Divisive" Politics & "Attacks on Patriotism" (very long)
The Donkey ("The Raven" parody)
News/Chat