The Art of Saying "Nice Doggie" Until You Find a Rock [Weirddave]

At the recommendation of Zakn, I've been listening to Dan Carlin's Hardcore History podcast on WWI. It's excellent, I highly recommend it ( if you have 20 hours to listen to an in depth examination of the war ). Anyhow, listening to the podcast, I was struck by an urge to play ( or in this case run ), another game of Diplomacy. Wiki has a full rundown of how the game works here, but these are the basics.

What is Diplomacy?

Diplomacy is a board game that dates back to the late 1950s. Even though it is nominally set in 1901, it depicts the seven great powers of Europe on the eve of WWI. Seven players represent England, France, Germany, Italy, Austria-Hungary, Turkey and Russia. What makes Diplomacy unique is that there is absolutely no element of chance. No dice are rolled, no cards are drawn. The players negotiate amongst themselves (by email) before each turn, and each player submits orders to the GM by a certain deadline. All of the unit moves are adjudicated simultaneously.

The Map

From Wiki:

The board is a map of 1914 Europe plus portions of the Middle East and North Africa. It is divided into fifty-six land regions and nineteen sea regions. Forty-two of the land regions are divided among the seven Great Powers of the game: Austria-Hungary, England, France, Germany, Italy, Russia, and Turkey.[9] The remaining fourteen land regions are neutral at the start of the game.
Thirty-four of the land regions contain "supply centers", corresponding to major centers of government, industry or commerce (e.g. Vienna and Rome); twenty-two of these are located within the Great Powers and are referred to as "home" supply centers. The remaining twelve are located in provinces which are neutral at the start of the game. The number of supply centers a player controls determines the total number of armies and fleets a player may have on the board, and as players gain and lose control of different centers, they may build (raise) or must remove (disband) units accordingly.

Units

There are only two units in the game, armies and fleets. Only armies can occupy land tiles, only fleets can occupy sea tiles. Coastal tiles can be occupied by either armies or fleets. Units have 3 possible moves each turn. They can move to an adjacent tile, they can hold in place, or they can support another unit moving or holding (as long as the supporting unit can legally move to the tile that is being supported. An army can't support a fleet moving into a sea tile, for example). A fourth move, "convoy" is available to Fleets in sea tiles, allowing them to transport an army from a coastal tile across the sea to another coastal tile. Convoys can also move across any number of sea tiles in one turn as long as there are fleets in all of the intervening tiles and they all order convoy that turn. (The most elegant endgame possible is convoying an army from Syria to St. Petersburg, capturing the 18th supply center needed for the win). "Combat" is decided in favor of the unit with the greatest numerical total of moves plus supports into a tile. Equal results "bounce" and all the units stay in their original place. A losing unit is "dislodged" and must retreat to an adjacent tile or disband. (Please note "MOVEMENT IN CERTAIN UNUSUAL POSITIONS ON THE BOARD" from the Diplomacy rules here for the very few special cases on the map)

Turns

There are 3 turns per game year, spring, fall and winter. Spring and fall turns have 2 phases, the movement phase and the resolution phase. All orders are adjudicated in the movement phase, and then players are notified if they have units that have been dislodged, they must retreat or disband in the resolution phase. In the winter turn, players may build new units on a home supply center if they have captured additional supply centers, they must disband units if they have lost supply centers. First player to control 18 SCs in a winter turn wins.

Negotiation

Obviously, no one player can decide on their own to fight everybody, the countries are too evenly matched. The game is played by email. Each player will give me an email to use that I will provide to all of the other players (privately, not here). The game would start, say, Sunday night. Monday and Tuesday the players can negotiate with each other, singly or in groups, it's quite up to the individuals involved (England “Hey France, why don't you support my fleet from Lon to Eng, and I'll support your army from Mar to Spa”, etc). All parties submit orders to me by Tuesday midnight, I'll adjudicate Wednesday morning. Retreats are due by Wed night, then negotiate again with Fall orders due Friday midnight. Saturday would be fall retreats and Sunday winter builds/disbands. After each round I'll mail results and updated maps to all players.

Movement

Lets look at the map again, this time with all of the starting units in place:

I'm not going to do moves for everybody, but this should illustrate the concept:

Russia
A War to Gal
F Sev to Bla
A Mos to War
F Stp to Bot

Turkey
F Ank to Bla
A Con to Bul
A Smy to Con

Austria-Hungary
A Vie to Gal
A Bud S A Vie to Gal
F Tri to Ser

Those orders resolve like this:
Austria:
A Budapest Supports A Vienna - Galicia
F Trieste - Serbia (*Fails*) - Because a fleet can't move to a land tile
A Vienna - Galicia

Russia:
A Moscow - Warsaw (*Fails*) - Because the Warsaw army was unsuccessful in moving to Galicia
F Sevastopol - Black Sea (*Bounce*)
F St Petersburg(sc) - Gulf of Bothnia
A Warsaw - Galicia (*Fails*) - Because Austria supported it's army from Vienna to Galicia

Turkey:
F Ankara - Black Sea (*Bounce*)
A Constantinople - Bulgaria
A Smyrna - Constantinople

And give the following result:

If this map held for the fall turn (assume nobody moved), then Turkey would be able to build an army or a fleet in Smyrna during the winter turn because it now occupies the supply center in Bulgaria, giving it a total of 4 SCs which would support 4 units.

Stabbing

The art of this game is to work with another player(s) until it becomes advantageous not to, at which point you stab them in the back. You don't have to stab, two or more players could play the whole game in concert, but everyone must be aware of the possibility. ANYTHING goes. France could swear on it's dead mother's grave to help Germany attack Italy and instead support Russia into German territory. Austria could work with Turkey for years and then slip in behind overextended Turkish units in concert with Russia. It doesn't matter, and “He lied to me!” is never a defense. Suck it up, this is the big leagues, European domination is at stake.

Those are the basics. So who wants to play? If you're interested, chime in here and send me an email to AceDiplomacy@gmail.com. When I have 7 players, I'll assign countries and set up a game schedule. A couple of things:

#1 You don't have to have experience to play
#2 Don't commit if you aren't willing to keep at it. I'm envisioning one game year per week, with delays, it'll take us a couple of months to finish the game.
#3 Don't expect to win. Most games end in a DIAS (deal involving all survivors), just like in real life. Germany didn't disappear when it lost WWI, after all.
#4 Don't get into this if you can't stand to lose. Players who you thought were allies will stab you to their advantage. You can't take it personally.
#5 You say you've played Risk? Diplomacy is to Risk as MLB is to T-ball

I've played in and GMed dozens of Diplomacy games in the past, and it's always been a ton of fun for those involved. Ace doesn't think a weekly thread would have a wide enough interest to be worth doing, but every once in a while I'll post a weekend thread updating the game. It's a tough game. I've only won a solo victory once (And that was in a Chaos variant.(What I've described above is the basic game. Variants take the basic game and change it. Different maps, different units, etc, there are thousands of them. Chaos involves the same map and rules, but 34 players each start with one home SC and 1 unit. I was Holland and I worked together with St. Petersburg the entire game until I pulled off a beautiful 4 SC stab to get me to 18. I'm kinda proud of that one.) ).

OK, that's it. It's 1914. The lamps are going out all across Europe. We shall not see them lit again in our lifetime, but if you're smart enough and ruthless enough, maybe it won't matter because they'll all belong to you. Who wants to play?

ETA: The maps aren't that clear when shrunk down to fit this screen. Here is a large map with all of the provinces clearly marked. Map

Posted by: Open Blogger at 04:00 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 We have got to do this again after tax season. No time now but would love to play. I've got 50+ games of Axis and Allies in the bank. Maybe start another 7 players in 2 weeks?

Posted by: pashmr at April 02, 2016 04:04 PM (3aNC4)

2 Can I just surrender to Syria?

Posted by: Angela Merkel at April 02, 2016 04:05 PM (vhTN7)

3 What's this thread all about?

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at April 02, 2016 04:08 PM (9ym/8)

4 WW1 was a pretty stupid war in all honesty. Nobody really wanted to fight it and it didn't solve a damn thing.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at April 02, 2016 04:11 PM (9ym/8)

5 @3 all the places randy ted cruz would like to find tranny hookers.

Posted by: randy teddy is perv at April 02, 2016 04:12 PM (MYVPj)

6 Well, in the spirit of diplomacy by other means, an unusual firearm.

http://tinyurl.com/hf7nsbo

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks at April 02, 2016 04:14 PM (Nwg0u)

7 Can the USA just sit this one out this time?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at April 02, 2016 04:15 PM (FkBIv)

8 Another game that doesn't involve dice or "chance" is Tammany Hall.

https://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/30645/tammany-hall

It's very enjoyable and realies on strategy and negotiation.

Posted by: The Gaming Hat at April 02, 2016 04:17 PM (vBeA5)

9 "http://tinyurl.com/hf7nsbo"

Wrong caliber clip for that revolver.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at April 02, 2016 04:18 PM (9ym/8)

10 You are too young. You refer to email. What is that?
I was introduced to this as part of a war game club at Purdue in 1973. It was played in person and took a few hours. It is an absolutely fascinating game, because of the personal dynamics involved. Especially, because it was up close and personal.
Are you still looking for victims?
I was always the victim at Purdue.

Posted by: kraki at April 02, 2016 04:19 PM (TNa9O)

11 WW1 was a pretty stupid war in all honesty. Nobody really wanted to fight it and it didn't solve a damn thing.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at April 02, 2016 04:11 PM (9ym/

And for what? Each country basically attacked each other in an act of self-defense.

It was the begining of the end of Western Civilization. The best of Europe and of America died. Afterwards, people went stupid with ideology, from communism to fascism. It also inspired the Frankfurt School.

Posted by: The Great Hat at April 02, 2016 04:20 PM (vBeA5)

12 The TV show Big Brother is the same thing.

Posted by: eman at April 02, 2016 04:20 PM (MQEz6)

13 "And for what? Each country basically attacked each other in an act of self-defense. "

Nothing. All the major players got dragged into it over treaties and such. They didn't want to be there. Had no real interests.

End result was a few million Euros killed and........the Fascists/Nazis arose.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at April 02, 2016 04:25 PM (9ym/8)

14 "The art of this game is to work with another player(s) until it becomes advantageous not to, at which point you stab them in the back."

How much money *did* you make as a GOP establishment consultant?

Posted by: Some guy on the Interwebs at April 02, 2016 04:25 PM (J3UIw)

15 I have been reading The Day We Won the War by Charles Messenger about the battle Ludendorff referred to as "the black day of the German army," August 8, 1918. Improved Allied tactics plus German low moral following a series of last gasp German offensives broke the back of the German army and began the hundred days Allied offensive that ended November 11, 1918.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks at April 02, 2016 04:25 PM (Nwg0u)

16 5 @3 all the places randy ted cruz would like to find tranny hookers.
Aw, c'mon man! LOOK at that face. Is that the face of a man who's had a lot of sex? Shouldn't he look, I dunno, HAPPIER?

Posted by: richard mcenroe at April 02, 2016 04:26 PM (Kucy5)

17 End result was a few million Euros killed and........the Fascists/Nazis arose.

-
Don't forget us!

- The Commies

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks at April 02, 2016 04:27 PM (Nwg0u)

18 "Don't forget us!

- The Commies"

My apologies.

And The Commies.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at April 02, 2016 04:28 PM (9ym/8)

19 Can the USA just sit this one out this time?
Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at April 02, 2016 04:15 PM (FkBIv)
----------------
Obviously not. That would be isolationist. Just look at the messes we got into in the past when we were until we weren't, or while we weren't, or while we were sort of, or something.

Posted by: RioBravo at April 02, 2016 04:29 PM (NUqwG)

20 Wrong caliber clip for that revolver.

-
Dude, it's a magazine.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks at April 02, 2016 04:29 PM (Nwg0u)

21 Diplomacy? It's what we're good at!!

Posted by: Stinky Cheese Eating Frogs at April 02, 2016 04:29 PM (SeD0w)

22 >>WW1 was a pretty stupid war in all honesty. Nobody really wanted to fight it and it didn't solve a damn thing.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill

War never solves anything.
Well, except when commies win.
Peace

Posted by: Bernie at April 02, 2016 04:30 PM (c7vUv)

23 Imagine a world where the Europeans can't fuck everything up anymore.

Posted by: eman at April 02, 2016 04:31 PM (MQEz6)

24 The new version is called Califate.

Posted by: eman at April 02, 2016 04:31 PM (MQEz6)

25 "Dude, it's a magazine."

They have a magazine? Well, if it ain't online I'm not reading it.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at April 02, 2016 04:33 PM (9ym/8)

26 I know this game! The only way to win is to surrender everything in your first move. That's who we are.

Posted by: Barak O at April 02, 2016 04:34 PM (kTF2Z)

27 I played Diplomacy back in the 70's. Still have my original copy, in the flat red box with the wooden counters, made by Games Research before Avalon Hill bought them. I moved on to multi-player computer-moderated wargames, most notably Battle Plan and Worldwide Battle Plan by Flying Buffalo, Inc. They are still in business, although hopefully they have upgraded from their original Raytheon 1000 computer to something a little more up-to-date.

Posted by: HTL at April 02, 2016 04:34 PM (NAWno)

28 >>Purdue in 1973

Really?
I was there.

Posted by: Aviator at April 02, 2016 04:35 PM (c7vUv)

29 The Obama Maneuver- Support the Russians, stab Europe in the back, stab the Jews in the back twice.

Posted by: Sophisticated and Nuanced at April 02, 2016 04:37 PM (GXIOg)

30 >>The Obama Maneuver- Support the Russians, stab Europe in the back, stab the Jews in the back twice.
Posted by: Sophisticated and Nuanced

You left out a couple of rounds of golf.

Posted by: Barry at April 02, 2016 04:38 PM (c7vUv)

31 WW1 was a pretty stupid war in all honesty. Nobody really wanted to fight it and it didn't solve a damn thing.

It solved this: Does it make sense to stand in trenches, fighting over square feet of cow-shit splattered ground and cobbled lanes in northern France? In the winter?

Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at April 02, 2016 04:38 PM (SeD0w)

32 Years ago I played a game called Supremacy. It was like Risk with nukes (it even had little mushroom cloud tokens to denote uninhabitable area).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supremacy_(board_game)

Posted by: Gran at April 02, 2016 04:39 PM (pZVlT)

33 The new version is called Califate.
Posted by: eman at April 02, 2016 04:31 PM (MQEz6)
----------
Comments like that result in more reverse un-backlash like this:
>>>>>

A 20 year old woman who claimed she was slashed and called a "f****ing terrorist" by an attacker in Lower Manhattan has owned up to carrying it out herself.

(Daily Mail dot co dot uk, April 1 fools)

Posted by: RioBravo at April 02, 2016 04:40 PM (NUqwG)

34 29 The Obama Maneuver- Support the Russians, stab Europe in the back, stab the Jews in the back twice.
Edit to add: Sign a BULL-shit "nuclear" deal with Iran, that pays off your mommy, Val Jar.

Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at April 02, 2016 04:41 PM (SeD0w)

35 "It solved this: Does it make sense to stand in trenches, fighting over square feet of cow-shit splattered ground and cobbled lanes in northern France? In the winter?"

You rang. Twenty years later.

Posted by: Maginot Line at April 02, 2016 04:42 PM (9ym/8)

36 Ahhhh...Avalon Hill, SPI and GDW used to put out "wargames" of all genre and periods in the 60's and 70s and early 80s.

Geeks, before computers, would sit around and squint at cardboard counters and order this or that division to their doom or eternal glory in all the epic campaigns and battles from Alexander to Giap overrunning the poor ARVN.

The real weirdos played TSR's D & D.

Virgins all I think.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at April 02, 2016 04:44 PM (ej1L0)

37 Damn, how long is the movie?

Posted by: nckate at April 02, 2016 04:45 PM (A/qli)

38 Speaking of war, I'm rewatching Band of Brothers, which is available in its entirety on Amazon Prime video. I'd almost forgotten just how good it is.

Posted by: Insomniac at April 02, 2016 04:47 PM (0mRoj)

39 As many problems as WWI caused, it was also a prime example of "things that can't go on forever, won't." It's hard to imagine how things would have gone worse, but the alternative wasn't business as usual.

Posted by: AD at April 02, 2016 04:47 PM (7mFGy)

40 You left out a couple of rounds of golf.
Posted by: Barry at April 02, 2016 04:38 PM (c7vUv)

Someday you will realize that playing golf was my way of getting my enemies to let their guards down. and by enemies, I mean you. 11-dimensional chess. Pay up, losers.

Posted by: Barack the Magnificent at April 02, 2016 04:55 PM (GXIOg)

41 Ahhhh...Avalon Hill, SPI and GDW used to put out "wargames" of all genre and periods in the 60's and 70s and early 80s.

Geeks, before computers, would sit around and squint at cardboard counters and order this or that division to their doom or eternal glory in all the epic campaigns and battles from Alexander to Giap overrunning the poor ARVN.

The real weirdos played TSR's D & D.

Posted by: Hairyback Guy at April 02, 2016 04:44 PM (ej1L0)

You left out Yaquinto, Simmons Games, Clash of Arms Games, and GMT Games. My account on Boardgamegeek.com says I have 255 games total, although it seems like more. I really don't play most of them, but have them shelved with my history books (organized chronologically) and periodically pull one out to set it up and compare to some book I am reading on the subject. Or at least look at the maps.

Posted by: HTL at April 02, 2016 04:55 PM (NAWno)

42 WWI started when Archie Duke shot an ostrich, because he was hungry.

Posted by: Baldrick at April 02, 2016 04:58 PM (vhTN7)

43 The art of this game is to work with another player(s) until it becomes advantageous not to, at which point you stab them in the back.

So, it's a French game. And still filled with French propaganda since, in real life, the French never bother waiting until it becomes advantageous to stab someone in the back, they like to do it when it will hurt you the most ... or just for kicks.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 02, 2016 05:01 PM (zc3Db)

44 We play at work in person, one lunch hour per week.. I love it.

We played the original, and now we are in a variant called Atlantic colonies.. there are only 4 of us and it works perfectly for that number.. England (me), France, Spain, Portugal..

Here's the map..

http://tinyurl.com/zll39z3

This is a fun one for convoys.. I currently control the entire north atlantic and I am convoying armies back and forth from Europe to North America in a single move.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at April 02, 2016 05:02 PM (UpGcq)

45 When people say "nice dog" to me, I know the shits are lying. I ain't fucking stupid.

Posted by: Hillary Clinton at April 02, 2016 05:03 PM (vhTN7)

46 RE 28 Aviator

Really.

The lion on the mall roared every time I walked by.
We probably conducted the last panty raid when I was there.
We were so un PC.

Posted by: kraki at April 02, 2016 05:04 PM (TNa9O)

47 As many problems as WWI caused, it was also a prime example of "things that can't go on forever, won't." It's hard to imagine how things would have gone worse, but the alternative wasn't business as usual.

Posted by: AD at April 02, 2016 04:47 PM (7mFGy)

I disagree with the notion that WWI (the resolution of) caused problems. It was the British and French pussying out afterwards that caused problems. Those same problems would have happened even without WWI. Britain and France were just so sick with delusions of "peace" that war was inevitable.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 02, 2016 05:05 PM (zc3Db)

48 They had email back then?

McGyver, out

Posted by: McGyver at April 02, 2016 05:05 PM (6hAG+)

49 They had email back then?

McGyver, out

Posted by: McGyver at April 02, 2016 05:05 PM (6hAG+)

The Egyptians invented email.

Posted by: Black Studies Major at April 02, 2016 05:06 PM (zc3Db)

50 Back in 74 I bought Kriegspiel because of an interest in WW2 history. Only started a game once, with a history teacher, and it was never finished. Oh well. A small school may mean a quality education but also mean few, if any. peers with similar interests. Oh, well.

Posted by: Bitcher and Moaner at April 02, 2016 05:08 PM (GXIOg)

51 I played this game dozens of times in my teens. The most popular person always wins, and that goes double if one of the players is a woman.

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 02, 2016 05:09 PM (+azJs)

52 [no John Kerry stuff]

Posted by: Sara Jessica Parker at April 02, 2016 05:11 PM (vhTN7)

53

I BUY CHESS SETS, SLATHER THE QUEENS IN BACON GREASE AND SIT ON THEM. THAT'LL TEACH 'EM!

PS: SCREW YOU MAGNET KID!

Posted by: MIRROR UNIVERSE MOMMY ISSUES at April 02, 2016 05:12 PM (qul7b)

54 Actually, this whole concept could make a great entry for the #200WordRPG Challenge!

Posted by: Joan of Argghh! at April 02, 2016 05:14 PM (BC6+0)

55 I back in the late 70's to early 80's loved board war games in the WWII era. This would be hard to do on this format.

Posted by: Skip at April 02, 2016 05:14 PM (1J6E6)

56 RE 50

Kriegspiel. You are killing me.
That was an a-historical very balanced Avalon Hill game. I played that too.
But I guess my favorites were Waterloo, Battle of the Bulge, and Stalingrad.
Istarted with Afrika Corps around 1968.

Posted by: kraki at April 02, 2016 05:15 PM (TNa9O)

57 Everybody stabs Moo Moo at once.

Posted by: DaveA at April 02, 2016 05:18 PM (DL2i+)

58 Ugh. Caitlyn Jenner now playing professional women's golf. Look at the pics of him, though. He looks like a dude in a skirt. Not even remotely passable. They must have used trick photography for the Vanity Fair/Glamor cover shoots. He truly looks grotesque.

Posted by: angela urkel at April 02, 2016 05:20 PM (vhTN7)

59 Squad Leader was my favorite.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks at April 02, 2016 05:21 PM (Nwg0u)

60 little mushroom cloud tokens to denote uninhabitable area

Translated into Arabic, Farsi and Urdu.

Posted by: DaveA at April 02, 2016 05:22 PM (DL2i+)

61 Ugh. Caitlyn Jenner now playing professional women's golf. Look at the pics of him, though. He looks like a dude in a skirt. Not even remotely passable.

Posted by: angela urkel at April 02, 2016 05:20 PM (vhTN7)

Not passable as an actual woman but he fits in pretty well in women's golf.

They probably only let him play because he sucks.

Posted by: ThePrimoridalOrderedPair at April 02, 2016 05:23 PM (zc3Db)

62 OK, I admit it. I started WWI. Whew, feels good to finally get that off my chest!

Posted by: Brian Williams at April 02, 2016 05:24 PM (kTF2Z)

63 I'll play.

Posted by: Farmer Joe at April 02, 2016 05:24 PM (Ztfnl)

64 Not passable as an actual woman but he fits in pretty well in women's golf.

Fits in with womens golf? Go google Lexi Thomas and Michele Wei. I'll wait.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at April 02, 2016 05:26 PM (kTF2Z)

65 Fits in with womens golf? Go google Lexi Thomas and Michele Wei. I'll wait.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at April 02, 2016 05:26 PM (kTF2Z)

Wait for what? There are a bunch of cute girls playing but women's golf has always been heavy with bull dykes.

Posted by: ThePrimoridalOrderedPair at April 02, 2016 05:29 PM (zc3Db)

66 [no John Kerry stuff]

Posted by: Sara Jessica Parker at April 02, 2016 05:11 PM (vhTN7)

No Sara Jessica Parker stuff

Posted by: John Kerry at April 02, 2016 05:31 PM (vBeA5)

67 I was thinking that if you wanted to make it more interesting for one's self here is what you do:

Create a roll you will play like pacifist, conqueror, cop, etc. and stick to it for the whole game.
You could always grab a six sided dice, assign a value to the various behaviors, and then roll it to see which one you would play for the game or even the turn.

Posted by: Tilikum Armored Killer Assault Whale at April 02, 2016 05:34 PM (hVdx9)

68 "WW1 was a pretty stupid war in all honesty. Nobody really wanted to fight it and it didn't solve a damn thing."

The British were worried in the years before the war that they had already reached their Imperial zenith and were going to decline. (Little could they imagine how far and how deeply.)

And they saw the rising Continental power that was Wilhelmine Germany.

Whitehall assumed that a major clash was inevitable at some point. And they further assumed they'd have the opportunity to select the most favorable timing and circumstances.

However, unpredictable external events forced everyone's hand, including of the British. They got their expected war, but nothing in it went the way they had planned for it to. Not least because of technological change.

The enormously expensive RN Grand Fleet fighting a total of one major engagement in the whole war? Inflicting only modest damage? With Jellicoe incessantly nervous about committing his force all-in due to fears of submarines and torpedo boats, and saying that he could "lose the war in one afternoon"?

Assumptions knocked into a cocked hat. It wasn't supposed to work that way. See also: trench warfare, machine guns, poison gas, airplanes.

Posted by: torquewrench at April 02, 2016 05:35 PM (noWW6)

69 I have a few military board games, most of which I haven't played because I never met anyone who was interested. Some are good for solitaire play, but others aren't.

"Across Five Aprils" is a very simplified Civil War game that is well-suited for solitaire play. It features a selection of battles including Gettysburg.

Avalon Hill has a few Civil War games that I never played, but the maps are gorgeous.

"Rebels and Redcoats" are a selection of American Revolution battles that are fairly easy to play. A couple of them occurred near where I live so that's an extra attraction.

I also have a set of Alexander the Great's battles.

Posted by: rickl at April 02, 2016 05:38 PM (sdi6R)

70 Wait for what? There are a bunch of cute girls playing but women's golf has always been heavy with bull dykes.
Posted by: ThePrimoridalOrderedPair at April 02, 2016 05:29 PM (zc3Db)

----------

Really? Huh. I watched it this morning and didn't notice that. Maybe I was just paying attention to the good looking ones. I watch the PGA every weekend, but rarely the LPGA. Not the first time I've been wrong.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at April 02, 2016 05:39 PM (kTF2Z)

71 Those who control the past control the future.
Those who control the present control the past.

Posted by: 1984 at April 02, 2016 05:43 PM (vhTN7)

72 http://www.cheapass.com/freegames/cagwaybay

lego pirates! arrr

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at April 02, 2016 05:45 PM (Cq0oW)

73 Yeah, WWI always bothered me.

Seemed so....I dunno, foolish.

But I suppose once the Russian Army started to mobilize, it was too late to stop or slow down. Given the size of the force, and the backwardness of the nation, it would have been impossible to call it back, in any case.

Still, the West gut-shot itself there, and we've never recovered.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine, Still Accepting Harem Applicants at April 02, 2016 05:47 PM (lutOX)

74 WW1 caused more problems than it solved, but there were things going on before the war that would have had huge implications for the future even if that stupid war was never fought.
Russia barely survived having a revolution in 1905, so I think the Bolsheviks were going to knock off the Czar either way. Of course, WW1 made it happen faster. The Ottomans were on life support too, as was Austria-Hungary. There was no way they were going to keep a lid on all those ethnic tensions once those two "empires" collapsed under their own weight.
I take the view that the things that happened because of the war were going to occur anyway, and as bloody and wasteful as that war was, it might have been even worse if it was fought a decade or three later. In fact that war did occur.
It was called WW2.
I believe that historians of the future are going to view the first half of the 20th Century as one single continuous war. And throw the Cold War in there too.
The Great War 1914--1989

Posted by: JoeF. at April 02, 2016 05:48 PM (lRJs+)

75 I believe that historians of the future are going to view the first half of the 20th Century as one single continuous war. And throw the Cold War in there too.
The Great War 1914--1989
Posted by: JoeF. at April 02, 2016 05:48 PM (lRJs+)
***
Yep, I could see that.

20th century was man's most blood-soaked yet.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine, Still Accepting Harem Applicants at April 02, 2016 05:50 PM (lutOX)

76 Paul Johnson is his epic Modern Times stated that Europe "tried to commit suicide" in WW1 and I believe they have still been trying ever since. This shit with the refugees is just the latest attempt. This time they have a gun pointed right at their head, but the damn thing keeps jamming.....

Posted by: JoeF. at April 02, 2016 05:52 PM (lRJs+)

77 Diplomacy is a great game. (I also have Machiavelli. Diplomacy set in Renaissance Italy, with extra rules for city walls, siege, civil unrest, plague, bribery, assassinations, and defecting generals amongst other things. Setting up the board took hours.)

You do know about the free adjucation program for Diplomacy, right? It makes running the game so much easier.

If you need another player, I'm game.

Posted by: Luke at April 02, 2016 05:55 PM (XU7n3)

78 Really? Huh. I watched it this morning and didn't notice that. Maybe I was just paying attention to the good looking ones. I watch the PGA every weekend, but rarely the LPGA. Not the first time I've been wrong.

Posted by: Duke Lowell
****

The second Austin Powers movie even had a spoof on it. A female character picked up her bull dyke lover who was competing in the LPGA.

Posted by: Tilikum Armored Killer Assault Whale at April 02, 2016 05:56 PM (hVdx9)

79 If you don't have 7 yet, I'm in.

Posted by: Impudent Warwick at April 02, 2016 06:03 PM (uEtcQ)

80 If Germany goes Muslim, I expect the MSM to report it as a positive thing.

Posted by: angela urkel at April 02, 2016 06:04 PM (vhTN7)

81 Wow, I haven't played in a really long time...maybe since DipCon 1997-ish, which happened to be held in Chapel Hill, where I was living at the time. Played in the email world's for a few years after that, but then didn't have the time.

How would you run it? Via a web page, or slack, or something? Using an on-line judge? I am interested...

Posted by: BetaPhi at April 02, 2016 06:07 PM (aoRok)

82 Women should not be allowed to vote, for their own safety. Else they will elect people like Merkel or Clinton who out of compassion will admit thousands of "refugees" to rape them.

Haha! Kidding! Well, kind of... Actually, this is a problem.

Posted by: angela urkel at April 02, 2016 06:12 PM (vhTN7)

83 If Germany goes Muslim, I expect the MSM to report it as a positive thing.

That's the thing. The West is divided, and the wrong side controls the media and education establishments. And this side views the Muslims through the prism of the history of the Civil Rights movement in the US. So the murderous Muslims are the good guys in their telling. It makes no sense, none at all, yet it will continue until it's too late.
Also, the Left sees EVERYTHING in terms of politics, while those on the "right" just want to go on living their lives and make a little scratch and are largely disengaged from current events.

Posted by: JoeF. at April 02, 2016 06:14 PM (lRJs+)

84 All I see are signs of surrender in Europe, from Merkel's stupidity to the Pope kissing the feet of Muslim refugees to Hollande's vow to accept more refugees. Are they really so stupid? Is it just that they have long memories of the World Wars and of Communism and all that destruction and have no will to fight? Do they think that they are avoiding future bloodshed?
What truly depresses me is that if it DOES come down to a war with Islam, Europe will lose--even if it "wins." It's going to take EVERYTHING they still have to defeat them that even if they do, they'll have nothing left but smoking ruins and a pile of corpses.

Posted by: JoeF. at April 02, 2016 06:21 PM (lRJs+)

85 Anyone who wants to play, email me at the address in the post above.

Posted by: Weirddave at April 02, 2016 06:28 PM (N8hFs)

86 I have a board game Aircobra, it is a massive undertaking to play. It is combat Nato vs Warsaw pact in Germany in the 80's

Posted by: Skip at April 02, 2016 06:30 PM (1J6E6)

87 In retrospect, most wars seem utterly pointless and opportunities missed to avert them seem so clear.

Posted by: Kahn at April 02, 2016 07:12 PM (WVvzl)

88 And we're off. I have 7 now, if anyone else is interested, send me an email to the AceDiplomacy at gmail address and I'll keep you as an alt for a future game or a late game replacement if someone drops.

Posted by: Weirddave at April 02, 2016 07:12 PM (N8hFs)

89 I used to play this in high school. We would print out the maps on 8.5 x 11 paper and tape them to a small cardboard pizza box. We then used stick pins with colored plastic tops to represent army and the same color pin with a similar colored sequin to represent fleet units. The box was small enough that you could take it home to plan strategy for the next day's move.

My physics teacher had a large map in his home room where we played during the lunch hour.

Great fun.

Posted by: qwerty at April 02, 2016 07:22 PM (bPZva)

90 This should be fun, please keep us updated on how the game goes Dave!

Posted by: Amichel at April 02, 2016 07:23 PM (6rBpp)

91 Hey, first time I got laid was after an afternoon spent around the game table.

Posted by: Trimegistus at April 02, 2016 07:53 PM (8kFoN)

92 WWI also had no actual villains. All the powers were operating from pretty sensible, honorable motives. That's what made it so psychologically devastating.

Plus the fighting was confined to fairly small zones. Civilian life went on much as it had before the war outside the actual battlefields. Which meant that when Germany lost the war, nobody in Germany felt it. They'd been winning the war right up until they lost. Obviously traitors at work!

Posted by: Trimegistus at April 02, 2016 07:56 PM (8kFoN)

93 Isn't this the game that features in the background of Sharyn McCrumbs' novel about a science fiction con - Zombies of the Death Sun? Some of the brighter and more intellectually oriented characters are involved in a multi-player game that sounds very line this...

Sorry to sound like such a numpty. I was overseas, and before the invention of the intarwebs when all of this was going on.

Posted by: Sgt. Mom at April 02, 2016 07:56 PM (oK6A/)

94 I'm surprised no one's mentioned HexWar (www.hexwar.net). You can play roughly 50 different SPI board games on-line for $9.99/month or $99.99/year. You can have multiple games going at a time (up to 100, I think) and you have 3 days (I think) to make your move. If you and your opponent are awake and at leisure at the same time, you can often get through half a dozen moves in a day, but it's usually one or two moves per day. Some of the games are simple, others very complex. Most are Napoleonic, U.S. Civil War, or WW2, but there are a few exceptions, though none (I think) from WW1.

I let my subscription lapse a couple of years ago because it was totally addictive, but have been tempted to rejoin. Not only is it easy to find opponents, the software does a lot of the work for you: when you click on a piece, all the hexes it can move to are highlighted, so you don't have to count hexes, it sets the pieces up for you (of course), rolls the dice for you, makes all the retreats (you can specify rules for retreat beforehand). Best of all, 'fog of war' is the default for most (all?) of the games: you march to the top of a hill and suddenly find a whole lot of enemy units on the other side you didn't know were there.

In the last few years, they've moved into making wargame apps for iPhones and other devices. That's at hexwar.com, and I haven't tried any of them. There's a free 14-day trial, too, at least for hexwar.net. If anyone joins, let me know, and I'll maybe join and send you a few challenges.

Just be sure to read the rules. The first time I played the Napoleon's Last Battles Campaign Game, combining the four 'quad games' Ligny, Quatre Bras, Wavre, and La Belle Alliance on one giant map, I decided to march the French Imperial Guard through some thick woods at night to catch the allies from the flank. Hadn't noticed that supply is checked at dawn and any unit more than 5 hexes from a road starves to death. There are very few hexes on the map more than 5 miles from a road, but the Imperial Guard was in them and disappeared from the board when the sun came up. I think I lost that game. If you can sneak enough cavalry through gaps in the Prussian lines and block 6-7 specific crossroads, you can eliminate the entire Prussian army before the other player knows what's going on. (That only works on noobs.)

Posted by: Dr Weevil at April 02, 2016 07:58 PM (WY7Zw)

95 Wait a minute, are we playing diplomacy?

Has no one mentioned backstabbr? It's the best online diplo version I've come across.

Weirddave i'll send you an email with some info

Posted by: Ghost of kari - certified inane at April 02, 2016 08:03 PM (ubByS)

96 Dan Carlin's "Hardcore History" -- excellent reference, thanks Dave.

Posted by: Kid Tyrone at April 02, 2016 08:36 PM (iVEKm)

97 Carlin is most engaging in his WW I series. The one on the Mongols is even better.

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 02, 2016 08:56 PM (+azJs)

98 We now have enough people for 2 games, plus a few alts. I'll set up the 2nd game after I get the 1st one up and running. If I replied saying you were on the alt list, be patient.

I used to have a Diplomacy page where I ran all my games, but it was on
a server maintained by a friend and I lost it when she died suddenly
(along with all of my wedding pictures). I would even took all of the maps and turned them into gifs so you could actually watch the game progress.

I mentioned variants above, one that I particularly like is "Aberration", with 9 players on a much bigger map. I like it because it imagines a world where history went differently, for example, with Poland ascendant over Germany and Russia, the Byzantine Empire successfully repelling the Turks and the Crusaders establishing a Kingdom of Jerusalem which plays as Israel. You can read about it at the following link:

http://www.diplom.org/Email/judge/info.aberration.html

Posted by: Weirddave at April 02, 2016 09:09 PM (N8hFs)

99 Hate diplomacy. Hate, hate, hate. Non-gamers think it is sophisticated because there aren't dice, as though there are not random events that affect diplomacy in real life. There is no better example of how a string of random events can cloud or drive diplomacy than the summer of 1914. Gavrilo Pincip ring a bell? Never liked simultaneous action selection games either, which introduces an entirely different type of luck for which the player cannot make contingency plans. For WWI I would recommend Paths of Glory from GMT Games. For multiplayer wargames there are a lot better then Diplomacy.

Posted by: Ted Torgerson at April 02, 2016 09:21 PM (LeofH)

100 Thanks Ted. OK, you're Italy.

Posted by: Weirddave at April 02, 2016 09:26 PM (N8hFs)

101 >There is no better example of how a string of random events can cloud or drive diplomacy than the summer of 1914. Gavrilo Pincip ring a bell?

That wasn't really a random event. Not only is there a lot of evidence to suggest Serbian intelligence was running the group attempting the assassination, but also the visit by Ferdinand was a terrible security blunder. The Serbs harbored quite a bit of bitterness toward the Austrians, and the visit seemed timed to humiliate them.

It was a little bit like a skinny white guy walking through Compton at midnight circa 1986.

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 02, 2016 09:29 PM (+azJs)

102 The initial bombing attempt was of course predictable, though not a certainty. The historical reference was that after the failed attempt Princip was sitting at a cafe on Leopold Street. The driver of the archduke's carriage made a wrong turn and drove directly in front of the cafe where Princip just happened to be sitting, in a mood of bitter disappointment after his assassination attempt had failed. Princip got a second chance and succeeded in killing the archduke with a pistol. The driver's wrong turn triggered the First World War. Random chances are a part of history that any good simulation has to account for.

Posted by: Ted Torgerson at April 02, 2016 10:11 PM (LeofH)

103 To play diplomacy and a bunch of other fun board games online including risk and Axis and Allies, check out www.gamesbyemail.com

Posted by: Pete at April 02, 2016 10:49 PM (nuuL1)

104 Well, sure, the attempt could have failed, and almost did. But it was a mistake for the archduke to be there at all.

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 02, 2016 11:38 PM (+azJs)

105 Spent many college weekends learning how to lie.

This game was the tutorial.

Best game...ever.

It has the OregonGuy Seal of Approval.

(Better than chess. Chess has rules.)
.

Posted by: OregonGuy at April 02, 2016 11:38 PM (xsPjt)

106 DUDE. I am completely in for Diplomacy.

Posted by: DRH at April 03, 2016 01:41 AM (iDO/4)

107 Tempted. Concerned about time commitment. Years since I played.

Posted by: gracepc at April 03, 2016 02:13 AM (OU4q6)

108 If there is still a seat I'm in. Delavalette@.... In the group.

Posted by: Jean at April 03, 2016 08:35 AM (w5jBN)

109 And I would be very interested in playing aberration

Posted by: Jean at April 03, 2016 08:38 AM (w5jBN)

110 75 I believe that historians of the future are going to view the first half of the 20th Century as one single continuous war. And throw the Cold War in there too.
The Great War 1914--1989
Posted by: JoeF. at April 02, 2016 05:48 PM (lRJs+)
***
Yep, I could see that.

20th century was man's most blood-soaked yet.
Posted

I think you have to draw a line at Nagasaki.

Posted by: Jean at April 03, 2016 08:46 AM (w5jBN)

111 Sign me up!

Posted by: Grendel at April 03, 2016 11:02 AM (UKHv9)

112 Dan Carlin`s Hardcore History podcasts are indeed da bomb. I am listening to the "Blueprint for Armageddon" series on WW I. I can re commend the Ostfront series on the eastern front in WWII, and the Kahn series also. I learned a lot and they have led me to further reading.

Posted by: Gordon at April 03, 2016 12:07 PM (R+3uy)

113 UPDATE:

I have now started 2 games. Once they get running, I may start a third. If you're still on the alt list, stay tuned

Posted by: Weirddave at April 03, 2016 12:51 PM (N8hFs)

114 I believe that historians of the future are going to view the first half of the 20th Century as one single continuous war. And throw the Cold War in there too.
The Great War 1914--1989

Posted by: JoeF. at April 02, 2016 05:48 PM (lRJs+)

[a href=http://tinyurl.com/z6lu8ph]I can think of one historian who wrote a book with just this premise. Niall Ferguson.[/a]

He also has a series on Youtube. "The War Of The World". Look for it.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at April 04, 2016 11:36 AM (ujg0T)

115 Oh, a word: It got kind of ugly in the mid-morning thread posted by Charlie Brown's Dildo. Tomahawk, a caution: You can say what you want about Trump, but do not insult other posters here by calling them "delusional fanbois" or the like.

*raises hand*

Can the kinder gentler HQ be less tolerant of open racism?

I don't mean safe space shit. Someone came back in the GAP thread up to his old tricks. I'm kind of hoping that's not tolerated any more.

Posted by: Bandersnatch at April 06, 2016 08:09 PM (1xUj/)

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