Trump Says Something New, Both Political Establishments Heavily Invested in Legacy Failure Freak Out, Again

Laura Ingraham: GOP will rip itself apart at convention to avoid nominating Trump.

Krauthammer: Trump's proposal is "deeply bigoted," "indefensible."

Josh Earnest: Trump's proposal consigns him for the new and improved "Wrong side of history," which is now "the dustbin of history." (I guess our vain president read some of the articles noting how frequently he resorted to the same cliched claims, and so he really "spiced it up" with this new, ancient cliche.)

Taranto: Did Trump just win the election?

Trump's proposal for a pause in Muslim immigration "until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on" strikes this columnist as entirely reasonable. That's not to say it's necessarily a good idea. There are potential costs in American-Muslim relations both internationally and domestically, and humanitarian costs as well. There are practical questions about how it would be implemented. The religious-freedom argument, although legally empty, is not without moral force.
Instead of debating the proposal in a reasoned way, the political class--both parties--and many in the media are treating it as a thoughtcrime. Yet the PRRI poll suggests a large majority of Americans are thinking along similar lines.

Ingraham points out that Trump's proposal comes in a particular context: When the establishments of both parties already want to take him out, and are willing to seize on whatever cudgel is at hand to do so.

They're not going to beat him this way.

The establishment's yelling about everything has gone from tedious to exhausting to infuriating.

I'm very amused by the many, many things people "know," without actually knowing, like reducing immigration levels for a specific group must be "unconstitutional," or that this goes against our "values."

It doesn't surprise me that dumb people know so damn much without knowing much at all; that's what marks them as dumb.

But it amuses me that so many smart people know even more things that aren't true.

I guess that's what really separates the dumb from the smart: The dumb only know a few stupid things that aren't true, while the intelligent and imaginative know a great many stupid things that aren't true.

Posted by: Ace at 07:53 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Everyday with this guy

Posted by: Skip at December 08, 2015 07:55 PM (k0xxN)

2 Taranto made an excellent point that provides him with another situation where all of his GOP rivals are forced to say the same things as Hillary, O and co. Things like "this is goes against what we stand for" which just drives his support up because it paints all of them as the same while he is different

Posted by: the real ch3 at December 08, 2015 07:55 PM (NyVz8)

3 Trump makes me laugh at the whole damn thing

Posted by: Bruce at December 08, 2015 07:56 PM (8ikIW)

4 4th?

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 07:57 PM (AkOaV)

5 also, yeah. Yawn.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 07:57 PM (AkOaV)

6 Krauthammer has lost it.
Trump had driven the pundits at NatRev over the cliff.

After seven years of letting Obama have everything he wants, no one in the GOP has any credibility left. Not the pundits, not the news media, not the republican sellouts.

Posted by: Grifden Miles-Howard at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (XDBQx)

7 Wrong side of history ...

So the right side of history is the US becoming a backwater of the Caliphate, I take it?

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (0NdlF)

8 Sorry to keep repeating this, but before the Trump brouhaha Rand Paul introduced an amendment that would have stopped any immigration from, basically, the middle east. 89 senators voted against it.

Of the presidential candidates, only Cruz and Paul voted for it.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (Z/8dZ)

9 I'm not a Trump guy, but if it's him or Hildabeast I wouldn't miss out voting for him.

Posted by: Skip at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (k0xxN)

10 Even BOR is slamming him. He normally takes up for him.

Posted by: Doubting Thomasina at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (Kh7vK)

11 It's awesome, it's further exposing and pissing off all the right people in all the right ways.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (MbrzC)

12 "Deeply bigoted." Gawd.

Sign me up. I'm pissed.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (8ZskC)

13 i see, he wants a pause, and everyone else wants the indefensible status quo

noted

Posted by: Feh at December 08, 2015 07:59 PM (Uk9e2)

14 Does this post make my butt look bigger?

Posted by: Meggie Mac at December 08, 2015 07:59 PM (Dwehj)

15 Why is this trailer so wide?

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 07:59 PM (dFi94)

16
this idea is so big, so huuuugggeeee, it blew the margins

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 07:59 PM (zOTsN)

17 That's a really long linky in the post.

REALLY long.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 08, 2015 07:59 PM (8ZskC)

18 Emwideninged right off the bat.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at December 08, 2015 08:00 PM (rwI+c)

19 "We found out in San Bernardino that authorities missed a lot of obvious signs, terror red flags"

"The Authorities" didn't miss the signs, they buried them because Obama will not prosecute violence committed by either Muslims or African-Americans.

Posted by: Grifden Miles-Howard at December 08, 2015 08:00 PM (XDBQx)

20 Scott "Dilbert" Adams has the most insightful commentary on Trump these days, at least in how Trump thinks.

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at December 08, 2015 08:00 PM (6FqZa)

21 Those clowns have no clue why Trump is so popular.

Burn. It. Down.

Posted by: fluffy at December 08, 2015 08:00 PM (AfsKp)

22 I can get behind the GOP tearing itself apart. It's long overdue, IMO.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 08, 2015 08:00 PM (8ZskC)

23 A long URL embiggens the smallest post.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at December 08, 2015 08:00 PM (rwI+c)

24 I blame Ace and his linky ways.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:00 PM (dFi94)

25 6 Krauthammer has lost it.
-----

Occassionally he says something that makes sense but even a broken clock is right twice a day, truth is he never "had it", and should go back to psychiatry, perhaps starting with himself as his first patient.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 08:00 PM (MbrzC)

26 wacth him climb 15 point over this. He isnt going to win NH, IA and SC. He is going to obliterate them

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (zOTsN)

27 16 Why is this trailer so wide?

It's not wide. It's YUUUUUUUUUUUUGE.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (0NdlF)

28 I like big blogs and I cannot lie...

Posted by: Sir Minx-a-Lot at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (H9MG5)

29 Ace, are you and the margns 'an item' now?

Posted by: fluffy at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (AfsKp)

30 Laura Ingraham is hot.

That is all.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (8ZskC)

31 Of the presidential candidates, only Cruz and Paul voted for it.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (Z/8dZ)
---

Can bet your ass that will come up in the next debate against Rubio.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (MbrzC)

32 Grammie, if you make it to this post, congrats on the upcoming wedding.

Got any cute, single, available friends, cousins, etc. our age running around?

Asking for a fri...oh hell, me.

Posted by: Blano at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (heN73)

33 Begun the wide stance has.

Posted by: A Whole Lotta Yoda at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (Jdgwe)

34 Cruz is also pushing a similar bill temporarily ending immigration/ visas from ISIS nations.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (Z/8dZ)

35 trump is also exposing their complete lack of creativity, ideas, and resolve

Posted by: Feh at December 08, 2015 08:02 PM (Uk9e2)

36 One thing about our "leaders", they aren't big on the idea of self-government.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at December 08, 2015 08:02 PM (rwI+c)

37 Ryan just proved himself a GOPe toady with his mouth-off about "who we are."

Who's this "we" of whom you speak, douchebag?

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 08, 2015 08:02 PM (8ZskC)

38 I once caught a fish thiiiiiisss big.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 08, 2015 08:02 PM (9YDUz)

39 After all the flack my little notice non selling self published work of fiction got for proofreading failures, I feel compelled to point out this blog could use a little proofreading before these things are publish.

Once in awhile is humorous, but a steady diet is just sloppy workmanship.

Posted by: Grifden Miles-Howard at December 08, 2015 08:02 PM (XDBQx)

40 Since I got the 'willow' a couple of posts down:

+++++++++++++++++++

I will just drop this turd right here:

(f) Suspension of entry or imposition of restrictions by President

Whenever the President finds that the entry

of any aliens or of any class of aliens into the United States would be

detrimental to the interests of the United States, he may by

proclamation, and for such period as he shall deem necessary, suspend

the entry of all aliens or any class of aliens as immigrants or

nonimmigrants, or impose on the entry of aliens any restrictions he may

deem to be appropriate....
8 USC 1182

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 06:25 PM (T78UI)

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 08:03 PM (T78UI)

41 I just had a contraction. Call the meat doctor.

Posted by: Meggie Mac at December 08, 2015 08:03 PM (Dwehj)

42 I, also, didn't think what Trump said was all that different that what many people are saying, a moratorium on immigration from some countries until we figure out a better vetting system.
That is what I hear when he says it.

Maybe because he calls them "Muslims" and not by the country... makes people crazy.

Posted by: petunia at December 08, 2015 08:03 PM (VoCyE)

43 Grammie, if you make it to this post, congrats on the upcoming wedding.

Got any cute, single, available friends, cousins, etc. our age running around?

Asking for a fri...oh hell, me.

Posted by: Blano at December 08, 2015 08:01 PM (heN73)
===============================================

Thank you. All of my cute single friends and relatives our age are dead. Or in Alzheimer's units. Are you picky?

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:03 PM (dFi94)

44 how dare he, where did he go to school, catch us flat-footed

Posted by: Feh at December 08, 2015 08:03 PM (Uk9e2)

45 right now Trump is Sherman and the rest of the field is Atlanta

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:03 PM (zOTsN)

46 The masks are getting torn off.

Posted by: eman at December 08, 2015 08:04 PM (mR7Es)

47 The correct response to a politician saying "this is not who we are" is "then revoke MY citizenship, bitch"

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at December 08, 2015 08:04 PM (6FqZa)

48 I am not a Trump fan, but both sides are seriously misunderestimating him. He is not making this up as he goes along. He has a plan, and thus far it is working.

Posted by: Flaccid Member at December 08, 2015 08:04 PM (5fSr7)

49 Who's this "we" of whom you speak, douchebag?

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 08, 2015 08:02 PM (8ZskC)
---

Ryan thinks he speaks for you, and the rest of the party. ha ha.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 08:04 PM (MbrzC)

50 Fixed it, the margins have been.

Posted by: Yoder, the green Amish Midget Jedi at December 08, 2015 08:04 PM (Jdgwe)

51 And didn't Jimmmah Carter halt immigration from Iran during the hostage crisis?

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:05 PM (Kqit+)

52 The masks are getting torn off.

Posted by: eman at December 08, 2015 08:04 PM (mR7Es)

And there are some really ugly, repulsive mugs under them.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at December 08, 2015 08:05 PM (zc3Db)

53 The uber retarded phrase "wrong side of history" commits the is-ought fallacy.

Posted by: Emmanuelle Cunt at December 08, 2015 08:05 PM (iVV84)

54
I had lunch with 5 nice Jewish ladies today. And they are all voting for Trump

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:05 PM (zOTsN)

55 Trump! He's a bad mother-

*Shut yo mouth!*

Posted by: Count de Monet at December 08, 2015 08:05 PM (JO9+V)

56 We are not going to survive another year of this crap. Chaos at the republican convention is the least of our worries.

Posted by: Grifden Miles-Howard at December 08, 2015 08:06 PM (XDBQx)

57 I love how Trump is making the global citizen RINOs all reveal themselves.
Ryan.
Cheney.

Posted by: votermom at December 08, 2015 08:06 PM (cbfNE)

58 >>> Once in awhile is humorous, but a steady diet is just sloppy workmanship.

Ace puts out a shit load of content, every day, on the fly.

People pull in nice salaries at the NewYorker to publish less in a month than he does in a day.

Posted by: fluffy at December 08, 2015 08:06 PM (AfsKp)

59 yep, all the silly ninnies getting the vapors and yelling unconstitutional ....it's really not

of course, this supreme court just makes it up as they go so who knows

Posted by: brak at December 08, 2015 08:07 PM (mnjX+)

60 This entire thread is not who we are as Americans.

Posted by: The People Who Are Who We Are at December 08, 2015 08:07 PM (8ZskC)

61 7 Wrong side of history ...

So the right side of history is the US becoming a backwater of the Caliphate, I take it?
Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (0NdlF)

That would seem to be the case.

Posted by: Insomniac - Pale Horse/Death 2016 at December 08, 2015 08:07 PM (kpqmD)

62

the rest of the field spends most their time talking about what they CANT do

he talks about what he will do

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:07 PM (zOTsN)

63 The American People now know they are on their own with few friends.

Posted by: eman at December 08, 2015 08:07 PM (mR7Es)

64 wrong side of history

Also known as, the Whig Theory of historiography.

Absolute monarchy was on the wrong side of Roman history for some centuries until it wasn't.

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at December 08, 2015 08:08 PM (6FqZa)

65 "So the right side of history is the US becoming a backwater of the Caliphate, I take it?"

Well Obama did say he'd stand with islam if the winds turned against it.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:08 PM (Kqit+)

66 I'm to the point of voting for The Donald just to say F*ck You to the bozos in D. C.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:08 PM (gmP76)

67 Krauthammer has made a lot of money as a hired speaker in these days, being somewhat contrary to Obama. The Age of Obama has been hard on a lot of people because of the anemic economy that he has overseen, but has been pretty good for Dr. Krauthammer.

The son of a friend of mine is part of the John Locke Foundation in N. Carolina, and relayed some of the ways of Krauthammer. He is very particular about a lot of things, and has a lot of demands to accomodate him, when he visits and speaks. Plus, of course, his speakers' fee. And part of this is his declining health - part of being paralyzed and in a wheelchair.

Something can go out of a man, when he is handicapped and declines physically. Kinda sad. And I don't put much stock in what he says anymore, either.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative...a rube in America at December 08, 2015 08:08 PM (+1T7c)

68 Go Trump go!!!!!

Posted by: logprof at December 08, 2015 08:08 PM (vsbNu)

69 They're all so used to doing the same old dance: Terror attack in Western nation, initial denial it was a Muslim, then the endless handwriting over "whywhywhy does he hate us enough to kill strangers?", then going overboard to make other Muslims not feel bad about it ("I'll ride with you!"), and then back to life as usual.

Trump jumped into the dance right in the middle of the "whywhywhy?" and "Don't be a Muslim h8r!" moves led by Obama and cranked Twisted Sister up to 11. And all these people who have been doing the dance for 15 + years have no idea what to do next - they have their familiar dance moves, they don't want to learn a new step or two.

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 08:08 PM (NOIQH)

70 GOP will rip itself apart at convention to avoid nominating Trump.

And then all of us who voted for him in the primaries will vote for him again in the general anyway.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:08 PM (ZbV+0)

71

they arent who we are

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:08 PM (zOTsN)

72 My step-dad loves Trump. He (my step-dad) is a self-made millionaire who admires Trump as a businessman and thinks he is the one man who can "set things straight". Step-dad was also a Marine. He's a tough old bird and he loves Trump. My mother on the other hand loves Rubio because he's cute. Okay.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:09 PM (dFi94)

73 Ugh, "hand-wringing" not handwriting.

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 08:09 PM (NOIQH)

74 the "right side of history" thing is silly. That will be sorted out later by biased hack historians. Lots of "wrong" things were on the "right side of history" and vice versa.

It's a meaningless platitude.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:09 PM (AkOaV)

75 He can switch parties and then everything will be hunky-dorey and totally Contstitutional.

He can lock them into camps, ala FDR. Hell, he can even blow them into atomic smithereens, ala Truman. Even a smart Latina would say that's OK for a Dem.

Posted by: Roy at December 08, 2015 08:09 PM (fWLrt)

76 Whatever will freak out my 'betters', D or R.

Posted by: dogfish at December 08, 2015 08:10 PM (0O2Lr)

77 History is hard.

Posted by: Miss Teen U.S. America at December 08, 2015 08:10 PM (Dwehj)

78 Let the enfuckening of the GOP begin!

Posted by: Cloyd Freud, Unemployed at December 08, 2015 08:10 PM (u5gzz)

79 Also, I won't be voting for Trump in the primaries. But if the GOPe pulls a switcheroo at the convention, I may well vote for 3rd party Trump in the general just to say 'fuck you' to the GOPe.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (AkOaV)

80 Obama has fayrooked up a lot of people. They bend over backwards to avoid the obvious. They just can't bring themselves to believe voters reelected Robert Mugabe Jr. They just flat out reject the idea.

Posted by: Grifden Miles-Howard at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (XDBQx)

81 49 I am not a Trump fan, but both sides are seriously misunderestimating him. He is not making this up as he goes along. He has a plan, and thus far it is working.

Posted by: Flaccid Member at December 08, 2015 08:04 PM (5fSr7)

Not a particular fan, as in he's not my first choice (Cruz for me), but by God he is turning a lot of heads, teeing off the right people, and exposing others for the posers they are.

Loving it.

Invest in popcorn and other munchies. The entertainment has only just begun.

Only wish my dad were alive to talk to about this. He always loved a good political brawl.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (7egrg)

82 The "right side of history" is the side that wins and writes nasty shit about the losers who are no longer around.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (zc3Db)

83 If "our betters" have their way there won't be a history to be on the right side of.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (Kqit+)

84 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gz3Stx1N14Y

Posted by: Dennis Greene at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (AfsKp)

85 The cad! *swoon*

Posted by: GOP punditry at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (WTbmS)

86 I'm not convinced that anyone saying "this goes against our values" actual has any values -- at least, any they share with me.

They value not looking in public like they aren't inclusive. They value political expediency.

I value not getting blown up.

Posted by: Qoheleth at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (iIzG7)

87 Josh Earnest is on the wrong side of the dustbin.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 08:12 PM (FkBIv)

88 16 Why is this trailer so wide?

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 07:59 PM (dFi94)

It's a double-wide?

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 08:12 PM (EzgxV)

89 g'early evenin', 'rons

Posted by: AltonJackson at December 08, 2015 08:12 PM (KCxzN)

90 83 The "right side of history" is the side that wins and writes nasty shit about the losers who are no longer around.
-----------------

How are the Redskins doing this year, Kemosabe?

Posted by: Roy at December 08, 2015 08:12 PM (fWLrt)

91 Can anyone see PJMedia.com ?

Insty's up, but the PJMedia site looks to be down.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (9YDUz)

92 Well Grammie, I prefer my dates be alive and remember what they had for breakfast this morning.

Beyond that, I'm flexible.

Posted by: Blano at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (heN73)

93 87 I'm not convinced that anyone saying "this goes against our values" actual has any values -- at least, any they share with me.

They value not looking in public like they aren't inclusive. They value political expediency.

I value not getting blown up.
Posted by: Qoheleth at December 08, 2015 08:11 PM (iIzG7)

Wait, what? Oh, getting blown UP. I thought you'd taken leave of your senses for a moment there.

Posted by: Insomniac - Pale Horse/Death 2016 at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (kpqmD)

94 GOPe. Burn it the kcuf down.

As someone posted earlier said, the dems are our opponents, the GOPe is our enemy.

Posted by: Count de Monet at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (JO9+V)

95 I'm not convinced that anyone saying "this goes against our values" actual has any values -- at least, any they share with me.
I value not getting blown up.
Posted by: Qoheleth

Bingo.

Posted by: dogfish at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (0O2Lr)

96 SCOAMF is the cumdumpster of history.

Posted by: that's right, I said it! at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (H9MG5)

97 I need a cookie. BRB

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (dFi94)

98 Every Muslim attack between now and the election makes Trump look better and better. Unless of course, there aren't any Muslim attacks.....

And it's not like he called for internment camps...

Or whatever brutality Europe is going to dish out to their muslim hordes in the next few years....

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (AC0lD)

99 Insty's up, but the PJMedia site looks to be down.
Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (9YDU

worked for me.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (AkOaV)

100 This whole thing is positively inspired, from a campaign standpoint.
People are totally fed up with radical Islam, and ISIS, and al qaida, and the Washington Establishment's total unwillingness to actually address it as what it is. Terrorism. Trump, for all his big-mouthed, vague, blowhard theatrics, is simply saying what the average Joe On The Street is thinking. Only he's saying it out loud, on stage, in front of cameras and microphones.
It's a win/win.
His fanboys and fangirls are ecstatic. So his poll numbers go up.
Washington is appalled, and says so. Repeatedly, on camera and in front of microphones. Giving The Donald gazillions of dollars of FREE FREE FREE campaign advertising. Once again, his poll numbers go up.
It's brilliant.

Posted by: The Original antisocialist-Accept No Substitutes! at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (cDs+4)

101 93 Well Grammie, I prefer my dates be alive and remember what they had for breakfast this morning.

Beyond that, I'm flexible.
Posted by: Blano at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (heN73)

Damn, and I thought I had low standards...

Posted by: Insomniac - Pale Horse/Death 2016 at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (kpqmD)

102 Insty's up, but the PJMedia site looks to be down.
Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 08, 2015 08:13 PM (9YDUz)

It's up here.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 08:14 PM (FkBIv)

103 So progressive heroes Woodrow Wilson and FDR institute internment camps by Executive fiat against Congresses (and the R parties) wishes but they're okay.

But Trump says "we should not let more Muslims in to the country" and he's the worst thing ever.

Makes sense I guess.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:14 PM (AkOaV)

104 Josh earnest is on the wrong side of the lawn

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (MwNIp)

105 My mother on the other hand loves Rubio because he's cute.

Ah, the women's vote.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (0NdlF)

106 54 The uber retarded phrase "wrong side of history" commits the is-ought fallacy.

Posted by: Emmanuelle Cunt at December 08, 2015 08:05 PM (iVV84)

It's a direct lift from Marxism.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (EzgxV)

107 Reading Facebook today I noticed fuck tons of liberals calling him a racist.

MUSLIM ISNT A RACE YOU FUCK TARDS ITS A RELIGION.

Posted by: SomeSay the Strawmarian at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (yoy3R)

108 i will say this about Trump -- my LIV friends all seem to love him.

Well, some hate him (the liberal'ish ones). But many of them seem to love him.

I don't know if they'll actually go vote on election day, but...

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (AkOaV)

109 Trump tweeted out a poll today showing that 68% of his supporters would still vote for him as a third party candidate.

I think that was intended as a shot across the bow of the GOPe to chill out on their criticism of him......or else.

Posted by: Stay out da Bushes at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (yioUz)

110
Stopping British "immigrants" in 1812 from coming to America? Totes unconstitutional.

Posted by: 18-1 at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (5LOno)

111 the "right side of history" thing is silly.

You want to know who the 'right side of history' is?

It's not the people patting themselves on the back for being the right side of history.

It's the people winning the actual battles.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (ZbV+0)

112 67: Me too. Trump all the way. Yuck the Jeb. By the way, I guess I have the job if I want it. Next week meet with the union. The benefits are too good to walk away from.

Posted by: chavez the hugo at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (ucDmr)

113 >>I'm not convinced that anyone saying "this goes against our values" actual has any values -- at least, any they share with me.

They're the same people who have been telling us America sucks, is the most racist nation, is full of greedy 1%'ers, is using up all the world's resources, blah blah blah. Funny, huh?

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 08:16 PM (NOIQH)

114 I like that Trump's great big wall is now nicely decorated with muslim terrorist heads on spikes....

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:16 PM (AC0lD)

115 Trump! He's a bad mother-

*Shut yo mouth!*

Posted by: Count de Monet
---
My children all tell me what a great Mom I've been. *hugs*

Maybe I should run. These times call for courageous leadership. Plus, we've never had a female President.

Posted by: Caitlyn Jenner at December 08, 2015 08:16 PM (iVV84)

116 MUSLIM ISNT A RACE YOU FUCK TARDS ITS A RELIGION.
***
Well, liberals are also the geniuses that will tell you opposition to gay marriage is also racist.

Posted by: 18-1 at December 08, 2015 08:16 PM (5LOno)

117 Hindsight is 20/20 (let the butt jokes begin)...

Back around 9-12-2001 a proposal was to limit visas (i.e.: zero) from the ME and other islamic countries, another was to make glass, 'we' chose to know Mullah Omar off his throne and open the gates.

Which would have been most humane for all is rather obvious.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 08:16 PM (T78UI)

118

Robert Spencer at Jihad Watch has a very good pice on how BuzzFeed tried to slander Trump, Spencer and Pamela Geller by not reporting their answers given and actually describing them as "leading White Nationalists"

its very good. Shows the media in action

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:16 PM (zOTsN)

119 106 My mother on the other hand loves Rubio because he's cute.

Ah, the women's vote.
Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (0NdlF)

Look, I'm really sorry. It's not like I asked to be ratified!

Posted by: 19th Amendment at December 08, 2015 08:16 PM (kpqmD)

120 Considering Earnest's floundering failure of a boss is responsible for letting these terrorists in past a completely useless 'vetting' process, even as he pushes for tens and tens of thousands more that will be equally uncheckable, he's got nothing to be throwing daggers at Trump over.

If Obama was doing his job, we wouldn't have a flood of unknown aliens pouring in to start killing us.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 08:17 PM (oVJmc)

121 Ah, the women's vote.
Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (0NdlF)

Well, yeah. I concede that there's a certain "eye candy quotient" involved...

Posted by: The Original antisocialist-Accept No Substitutes! at December 08, 2015 08:17 PM (cDs+4)

122 They're the same people who have been telling us America sucks, is the most racist nation, is full of greedy 1%'ers, is using up all the world's resources, blah blah blah. Funny, huh?

Search and replace "our" with "my" and you get their real idea.

Totalitarianism.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:17 PM (0NdlF)

123 assuming trump is nominated, would the election itself turn violent? if the gop is wrenching itself apart I can only imagine what the dems might do.

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 08, 2015 08:17 PM (Cq0oW)

124 Krauthammer 10/10/2008:

Obama is a man of first-class intellect and first-class temperament. But his character remains highly suspect.

Krauthammer voted for McCain.

Posted by: boniface ballers at December 08, 2015 08:17 PM (m/Gc2)

125 I like that Burnt Toast. Trump's first day in office makes it so, and legally.

The GOPe is completely losing it. Has KDW written a piece on Trump lately? I don't go to NRO anymore because the site is lucky to load half the time.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (LTDSy)

126 All of my friends are Concerned Christians who think Trump is mean.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (Kqit+)

127
Genghis Khan circa 1200 AD? Right side of history.

People that didn't want to be raped, murdered, and pillaged circa 1200 AD? Wrong side of history.

Posted by: 18-1 at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (5LOno)

128 Paul Ryan is a big fat liar. Out of one side of his mouth he says we have to cut entitlements. Out of the other side of his mouth we have to import illiterate, non-English speaking, unemployable migrants

Screw him

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (Oy0zJ)

129 I'm very amused by the many, many things people "know," without actually
knowing, like reducing immigration levels for a specific group must be
"unconstitutional," or that this goes against our "values."

If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?

And no no I am not claiming immigrants have any constitutional First Amendment rights. They don't. It is a rhetorical question.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (+4mdw)

130 Look, I'm really sorry. It's not like I asked to be ratified!
Posted by: 19th Amendment

I know what you mean.

Posted by: 17th Amendment at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (FkBIv)

131
Krauthammer over analyzes everything. I saw him on O'Reilly last night just sputtering away about Obama.
There's no need to go so in depth, the president is a divisive fuckup.

Posted by: wth at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (HgMAr)

132 Christian Spaniards are on the wrong side of history.

Posted by: caliph 'abd al-rahman iii al-umawi at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (6FqZa)

133 Wait, what? I have been out shopping for a new winter coat. yck. Grammie winger is getting married?

Posted by: Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:19 PM (Zvmcz)

134 I have a very humble suggestion for members of our political class (on
both sides of the aisle). If you support any of the following: bans
against offensive speech, forcing nuns to buy health insurance covering
contraception; searches of emails and phone records without a warrant,
torture of prisoners, civil forfeiture without trial or repeal of the
second amendment -- just maybe you should shut your pie-hole and not
lecture the American people on what the country does and doesn't stand
for. Just saying ....

Posted by: Hullabaloser at December 08, 2015 08:19 PM (wub/+)

135

you feel that?

thats Trump pulling the Overton window with a Semi

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:19 PM (zOTsN)

136 First class temperament? President Bitchy Girl?

Ha ha Chuck,

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:20 PM (8PcKC)

137 Reading Facebook today I noticed fuck tons of liberals calling him a racist.

MUSLIM ISNT A RACE YOU FUCK TARDS ITS A RELIGION.

Posted by: SomeSay the Strawmarian at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (yoy3R)

Not according to Huma.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 08:20 PM (T78UI)

138 Thomas Jefferson... wrong side of history.

Posted by: the Barbary Pirates at December 08, 2015 08:20 PM (H9MG5)

139
Propagandists Conservative Doug Heye on with O'Butthead explaining why Trump's comments will hurt him in the general election. Another guy pumping for Jeb or Mario and he looks foolish.

Posted by: Doctor Fish at December 08, 2015 08:20 PM (OiFtZ)

140 By the way, I guess I have the job if I want it. Next week meet with the union. The benefits are too good to walk away from.

Posted by: chavez the hugo at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (ucDmr)
=================================================

That is so awesome ! I hope it's a good fit for you - it sounds like a great opportunity.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:21 PM (dFi94)

141 If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (+4mdw)

Putting aside the fact taht islam is not a religion but a political ideology ...

Because this nation was blessed with having about ZERO muslims for nearly the first two centuries of our existence. ZERO

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at December 08, 2015 08:21 PM (zc3Db)

142 Jonah Goldberg did a short video on Obama's use of "wrong side of history" and paraphrasing, it is:

When applied to domestic issue (SSM): What I want is inevitable, so anyone who disagrees is "on the wrong side of history"; give up!

When applied to foreign issue (telling Russia action in Ukraine "on the wrong side of history): I'm not going to do anything, but I'm going to try to make you feel bad by lecturing you that down the road you'll be judged as wrong.

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 08:21 PM (NOIQH)

143 People are totally fed up with radical Islam, and ISIS, and al qaida,
and the Washington Establishment's total unwillingness to actually
address it as what it is. Terrorism. Trump, for all his big-mouthed,
vague, blowhard theatrics, is simply saying what the average Joe On The
Street is thinking. Only he's saying it out loud, on stage, in front of
cameras and microphones.

It's a win/win.

His fanboys and fangirls are ecstatic. So his poll numbers go up.

Washington is appalled, and says so. Repeatedly, on camera and in
front of microphones. Giving The Donald gazillions of dollars of FREE
FREE FREE campaign advertising. Once again, his poll numbers go up.

It's brilliant.
---

THIS.

/also, if you had told me a year ago, that Trump would be a serious candidate that I was actually supporting, I'd say you were insane...

Posted by: shibumi who is awaiting SMOD at December 08, 2015 08:21 PM (9JJgN)

144 SCOAMF is the cumdumpster of history.
Posted by: that's right, I said it!

---

My cheeks beg to differ.

Posted by: Charlie Sheen at December 08, 2015 08:21 PM (iVV84)

145 Every time I hear the JEF or one of his spokes idiots tell me who "we are" or what "our values" are I throw up a little in my mouth.

Posted by: Sanfranpsycho at December 08, 2015 08:22 PM (afaIk)

146
Josh earnest is on the wrong side of the lawn
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car
.......................

How did he get his Big Wheel all the way over there that little rascal!

Posted by: wth at December 08, 2015 08:22 PM (HgMAr)

147 I wonder what this will do.

I *think* this should get Trump the nomination - it's him, the status quo, or gun control.

But the message is so heavily negative I wonder if the herd of republicans will stampede away.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 08, 2015 08:22 PM (WTbmS)

148 Wait, grammie, you are getting married?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:22 PM (+4mdw)

149 Trump's view is actually nicer than Cruz and Paul. They want to ban all immigration from mulsim countries. Trump will let in people who don't follow a pedophilic warlord who built a totalitarian system and called it a religion.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:22 PM (Z/8dZ)

150 I can't agree with Scott Adams on this.

'Personally, I would accept up to 1,000 dead Americans, over a ten-year period, to allow Muslim non-citizens to enter this country'

Posted by: freaked at December 08, 2015 08:22 PM (BO/km)

151 "There are potential costs in American-Muslim relations both internationally and domestically, and humanitarian costs as well."

But the continual wars, spurious intifadas, and constant drip of terrorist actions is designed to bring us together and have us sing Kumbayah right?

Posted by: Ken in NH at December 08, 2015 08:23 PM (qFlZT)

152 Because this nation was blessed with having about ZERO muslims for nearly the first two centuries of our existence. ZERO

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at December 08, 2015 08:21 PM (zc3Db)
So it is your belief that "freedom of religion" should only be applied selectively for certain religions? Which ones should be on the list? And who decides?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:23 PM (+4mdw)

153 Wait, grammie, you are getting married?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:22 PM (+4mdw)
=============================================

Sshhhh ..... my kids don't know. Ring gets sprung on Christmas Day.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:23 PM (dFi94)

154 CJ I heard on Rush, don't know how to true it is. But. Immigration was very curtailed 1924-1965

Thank you Killer Kennedy for changing that

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:24 PM (gmP76)

155 I need a cookie. BRB

Posted by:�grammie winger
---
I need some coke. And a ... nevermind.

Posted by: Charlie Sheen at December 08, 2015 08:24 PM (iVV84)

156 Ah Hell, here we go again, being lectured on our Christian values, and being told we have to open our arms and our daughter's bedroom door to every serial rapist in the country so our love of God, and our Christian values can touch the man's heart and rehabilitate him before he rapes our daughters and kills us in our sleep.

That is not piety, that is insanity.

Posted by: Grifden Miles-Howard at December 08, 2015 08:24 PM (XDBQx)

157 If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?

Please.

A. AMERICANS have freedom of religion. That has nothing to do with aliens who want to enter the country. As to THEM, we can constitutionally decide whether to admit them on whatever grounds we choose, including a religion/ideology that's completely incompatible with native Western culture.

B. Islam is an ideology first, religion second. We would not hesitate to impose an immigration ban on known Nazis, even if they seemed superficially to be nice people on a case-by-case basis. Subscribing to an abhorrent destructive ideology should be enough to keep them out. It should be no different for islam.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 08, 2015 08:24 PM (8ZskC)

158 Wait, grammie, you are getting married?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:22 PM (+4mdw)
=============================================

Sshhhh ..... my kids don't know. Ring gets sprung on Christmas Day.
Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:23 PM (dFi94)

Awwww...that's so cool!!! Congratulations!

Posted by: The Original antisocialist-Accept No Substitutes! at December 08, 2015 08:24 PM (cDs+4)

159 We have freedom of religion in this country so no one can force us to follow their religion...which is exactly what muslims aim to do.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (Z/8dZ)

160 Krauthammer 10/10/2008:

Obama is a man of first-class intellect

Based on what, exactly, Chuck? Pedigree? The right certificates from the right institutions?

Their value would seem to be belied by the fact that the man never comes up with an original thought or policy, and stammers like an imbecile if the words aren't pre-written for him.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (oVJmc)

161 Congratulations grammie!!!!!!
That is awesome

*slides a 1-lb Snickers bar through the USB port*

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (+4mdw)

162 then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?

So Christians and Jews can get along, because we agreed to.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (ZbV+0)

163 So it is your belief that "freedom of religion" should only be applied selectively for certain religions? Which ones should be on the list? And who decides?

When do American rights apply to non-Americans? Do you want to invade Saudi Arabia to make them treat Christians like Humans?

I'm not going to die for your principles. That's all there is to it.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (WTbmS)

164 Fuck it.
I'm outa here.

You talk stupid, you get stupid.

Posted by: Grifden Miles-Howard at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (XDBQx)

165 Did any other of you lurkers say to yourself---

"Oh shiiiii....."

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (mcm0N)

166 Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 08:21 PM (NOIQH)

I loved when Kerry said something along the lines of, "Russia can't look to 19th century solutions to 21st century problems" in regards to Putin invading Crimea.

What, is he fucking retarded? "Military solutions" is a 19th century concept? What a dunce. That was, continues to be, and will be, a "solution" for as long as man exists on this planet.

I hate this progressive / Marxist idea of an evolving/progressing "society" and a Nazi-like idea that "man can be changed and perfected."

No, dunce, human nature does not change. technology may change. Language may change. Institutions may change.

Human nature? Come on!

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:26 PM (AkOaV)

167 freaked : Scott Adams was being honest.

Obama's deep-down answer is, "as long as they're all white conservatives, I can live with a lot more mangled corpses". He just won't say it.

The Republicans' deep-down answer is... well, about the same.

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at December 08, 2015 08:27 PM (6FqZa)

168 Congrats grammie!!!

Posted by: Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:27 PM (Zvmcz)

169 *slides a 1-lb Snickers bar through the USB port*

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (+4mdw)
====================================================

How did you know I had those on my wedding registry?

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:27 PM (dFi94)

170
Arnie says we must go vegan to save the planet from AGW. The guy has really lost his freakin mind!

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 08:28 PM (iQIUe)

171 The establishment, both left and right, have a far more serious problem then just losing power if a guy like Trump actually wins. Trump is the type of guy that will be snooping around under the rug and in the closet the minute the camera`s are off after his inauguration!

Posted by: Rino sanctuary at December 08, 2015 08:28 PM (Pyr1a)

172 I don't care if you're a Muslim, Methodist, Hindu or atheist.,if you don't have a skill, don't read, write, speak English, we shouldn't let you in. If you are a Muslim you should be vetted so you aren't a terrorist risk. If we let you in, you don't get any welfare. I think that should help answer your question CJ on who gets in.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:28 PM (QdyoO)

173 He seems to have all the right enemies.

Posted by: Jean at December 08, 2015 08:28 PM (fBkaR)

174 36
trump is also exposing their complete lack of creativity, ideas, and resolve

Posted by: Feh at December 08, 2015 08:02 PM (Uk9e2)

THIS OH GOD THIS!!
I just keep coming back to this in my own mind again and again and again. They're simply so locked into the way things are that they cannot change. Obviously, these are not the sort of people who should be leading anything.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 08, 2015 08:28 PM (4ErVI)

175 chemjeff-I don't know if you saw my last post to you way below on the thread we were all screeching at you, but to sum it up-I appreciate you challenging me to think about my stance, and determine if it is or isn't correct. That's what a good professor does. I may not end up agreeing with you, but I respect the heck out of you for graciously coming to the table with your arguments. That is how we should debate things. I don't want to be like the proglodytes I abhor, who hear something not in agreement with whatever they believe at the moment, and then shriek the person down. (And I'm not saying any of yall good folks are doing that-this is about my behavior only!!)

I think too highly of you for that. I'm sorry if I was overbearing. Hugs, my friend.

Posted by: Moki at December 08, 2015 08:28 PM (7q2ch)

176 I forgot where I read it today, but Sweden, as a nation, is going down the tubes. The immigrant "enclaves" are surrounding the old central city of Stockholm, and the actual citizens (ethnic white Scandinavian) are afraid to be out alone.
The country is on a death spiral. Well, they were certainly kind and generous to their needy immigrants. And their generosity was returned how?

The population of Sweden is what 11-12 million people? About the same as the state of Ohio. America is 310-320 million? So it will take a lot longer, unless they get a lot of people ready to convert to Islam. So I figure I can live out my life (25-30 years) , and the country probably, maybe, might not, be totally down the crapper when I pass away.

But that is what the ratfink Obama and his fellow travelers want; to fundamentally change America. And some people still think that was just a turn of a phrase.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative...a rube in America at December 08, 2015 08:29 PM (+1T7c)

177 >>Sshhhh ..... my kids don't know. Ring gets sprung on Christmas Day.

*stage whispers* Congratulations!!!!!

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 08:29 PM (NOIQH)

178 Thank you Infidel. Thanks to you all.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:29 PM (dFi94)

179 chemjeff,
As far as I am aware, we still ask the "are you a nazi or a communist?" question of immigrants. So at one point, we felt it a good idea to filter "those types" out. Probably due to the "anarchist" (communist) bombings in this country in the '30s.

Would you be against us asking something along the lines of "do you believe in Sharia law?" or "Do you believe in political Islam?"

Because I think that's the real crux. I agree, I'm uncomfortable with "religious purity" tests. But we're trying to find a way to lessen the chance of us letting in people who are going to go splodey or shooty on US citizens.

How do you think it should be handled?

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:29 PM (AkOaV)

180
The 4th Estate, Ladies and Gents:

BuzzFeed Editor In Chief Ben Smith wrote in an email to his editorial staff Tuesday that calling Republican frontrunner Donald Trump a racist on social media does not violate the companys ethics guidelines. BuzzFeeds ethics guide states that "reporters and editors should refrain from commenting in a partisan way about candidates or policy issues."

In the memo, obtained by TheBlaze, Smith said "It is, for instance, entirely fair to call him a mendacious racist, as the politics team and others here have reported clearly and aggressively: Hes out there saying things that are false, and running an overtly anti-Muslim campaign," he continued. "BuzzFeed Newss reporting is rooted in facts, not opinion; these are facts."

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 08, 2015 08:29 PM (kdS6q)

181
'Personally, I would accept up to 1,000 dead Americans, over a
ten-year period, to allow Muslim non-citizens to enter this country'

You, Scott, your mom, your wife, your kids.

Or will you visit the relatives of whatever people might be killed by someone you're so magnanimous about?

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 08:30 PM (oVJmc)

182 and chemjeff -- I did defend you in this mornings thread, because I think you have a valid point. I may disagree, but I don't think it's right that others were attacking you for it.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:30 PM (AkOaV)

183 106 My mother on the other hand loves Rubio because he's cute.

Ah, the women's vote.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (0NdlF)

And speaking as a woman, THIS is so embarrassing.

It's disgraceful when people don't vote with their brains.

My VERY conservative city elected its first democrap woman mayor a couple of years ago. She shamelessly whored herself out as the first woman mayor but covered up her political affiliation (we have nonpartisan municipal elections here). What was the first thing this scrunt did? Added a new city tax, disguised as a "firefighters' assessment." That's to pay for their brand-new buildings all over the city. And it will never go away.

And even more shamelessly women I know - and formerly respected - were pandering for her, because lady parts doncha know.

Needless to say, many of those friendships are now down the tubes.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 08:30 PM (7egrg)

184 Congrats grammie!!!!!

Posted by: Lea at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (vmMMi)

185 Putting aside the fact taht islam is not a religion but a political ideology ...

Because this nation was blessed with having about ZERO muslims for nearly the first two centuries of our existence. ZERO

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at December 08, 2015 08:21 PM (zc3Db)

To muslims islam is a 'religion' like your bathroom is your house

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (T78UI)

186 Somewhat OT, but on the subject of immigration & terrorism: Is there a good book on the anarchist terrorism wave in America from the late 19th/early 20th-Centuries? And by good, I mean one that doesn't sympathize with the terrorists?

Posted by: Josephistan at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (7qAYi)

187 I think they are all in on the One World Government. Anything that gets in the way is the wrong side of history. Goes for demonrats and gope. And the entire world for that matter. Look how the UN wants to but in on our 2nd amendment and the JEF is more than happy to go along.

Posted by: Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (Zvmcz)

188 The last time we were confronted with a religion that had military supremacy as a core belief and resulted in suicidal religious fanatics flying airplanes into large structures, we dropped nukes on their cities, occupied their country, and CHANGED THEIR FREAKIN' RELIGION to suit our needs. That program work very well, and our Shinto friends are now very well behaved.

Shinto Directive

http://tinyurl.com/nz7l8g8

Posted by: tommylotto at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (A3a8d)

189 When do American rights apply to non-Americans? Do you want to invade Saudi Arabia to make them treat Christians like Humans?

I'm not going to die for your principles. That's all there is to it.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 08, 2015 08:25 PM (WTbmS)
Well, I believe "freedom of religion" is a subset of a larger natural right, freedom of conscience, that every human being on the planet has just by virtue of existing. Broadly, this is the freedom to believe whatever you want to believe, even including believing in "wrong" ideas. You shouldn't have to justify to anyone why you believe what you believe. It is "self-evident" why this is true, as some people once said. I think the government of Saudi Arabia is a grossly unjust government which deprives its citizens protection of its natural rights routinely and should be condemned for that. As to whether they ought to be invaded - no, the ends don't necessarily justify the means.
I don't view natural rights as "my" ideas.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (+4mdw)

190 Honest in what way?

Why 1000? Why not 10?

Would he take those 1000 all at one time or maybe just a few here and there?

If one or more of those 1000 were in his family would he feel different? How about if his ticket is delivered by some fanatic?

Posted by: freaked at December 08, 2015 08:32 PM (BO/km)

191 Congrats Grammie.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:32 PM (pahrJ)

192 I rest my case; and my case is really tired!

Posted by: Cousin Vinny at December 08, 2015 08:32 PM (o9lmn)

193 We've got a government policy that just got a bunch of people killed, with no reason to believe that it won't happen again. But somehow it is out of the bounds of human decency to suggest that the government stop what it is doing until it can be fixed.

I could just as easily say that those who've got their panties in a bunch over Trump's proposal are accessories to murder.

Posted by: Emmett Milbarge at December 08, 2015 08:33 PM (nFdGS)

194 So it is your belief that "freedom of religion" should only be applied selectively for certain religions? Which ones should be on the list? And who decides?
Posted by: chemjeff
---
No one is denying citizens freedom of religion. We are merely noting that Islam is a political philosophy as well as religion, and one incompatible with ours, so we are perfectly justified in deciding not to allow any to emigrate here.

Are you gullible enough to let anyone into your home, even if you have misgivings about them, as long as they accuse you of "bigotry" if you don't?

Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 08:33 PM (iVV84)

195 183
and chemjeff -- I did defend you in this mornings thread, because I
think you have a valid point. I may disagree, but I don't think it's
right that others were attacking you for it.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:30 PM (AkOaV)
Well thank you, I did see that later, I had to run off and teach my class this morning so I couldn't respond to everything. I do hope that we return to talking about conservative values instead of this Trumpian nonsense.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:33 PM (+4mdw)

196
'Personally, I would accept up to 1,000 dead Americans, over a

ten-year period, to allow Muslim non-citizens to enter this country'

You, Scott, your mom, your wife, your kids.

*******

And Scott wouldn't have any problem with the family survivors of the next attack visiting him to 'discuss' his propensity for allowing Muslims to kill their relatives. Or would he?

Posted by: Doctor Fish at December 08, 2015 08:34 PM (OiFtZ)

197 Well, I believe "freedom of religion" is a subset of a larger natural right, freedom of conscience, that every human being on the planet has just by virtue of existing.

Nobody is stopping them from exercising that natural right in their home country (except maybe their own shitbag government, but that's their problem). The point is they have no natural right to come here to do it.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 08, 2015 08:34 PM (8ZskC)

198 Putting aside the fact taht islam is not a religion but a political ideology ...

Because this nation was blessed with having about ZERO muslims for nearly the first two centuries of our existence. ZERO

And it's not like they have nowhere to go. The ME is full of islamic countries where Christians aren't welcome or even allowed. They don't have to live here. And I certainly don't want them here if they want to overthrow our government as they constantly say they do.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy at December 08, 2015 08:34 PM (LUgeY)

199 The more the GOPe hate Trump, the more I like him.

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 08:35 PM (u9UgT)

200 163

Nope, it was so Christians and Christians could get along.

Posted by: Sanfranpsycho at December 08, 2015 08:35 PM (afaIk)

201 Posted by: Lea at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (vmMMi)
==========================================

Thank you Lea. I confess I am starting to get excited about things like flowers and music. Haven't thought about that type of thing since the 70's.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:35 PM (dFi94)

202 "Broadly, this is the freedom to believe whatever you want to believe, even including believing in "wrong" ideas"

But muslims do not accept this. They do not believe it. They believe that you should be converted or killed. There is no "freedom of religion" in islam. Freedom of religion means that you can not be forced to accept islam. Halting islamic immigration protects the freedom of religion of every other citizen.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:36 PM (Z/8dZ)

203 So, Cult of Kali. Would they be okay?

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 08:36 PM (oVJmc)

204 So i guess 14 killed here 10 killed there is a reasonable price to pay so that we can claim to have those values..... But what if the price goes up 10, 100, 1000, 10000 times ( that day is coming ) will you still feel that way?

Posted by: E.T. at December 08, 2015 08:36 PM (yq4gk)

205 then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?

Because Christians got sick of killing each other.

Muslims are not sick of killing unbelievers.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:36 PM (0NdlF)

206 The establishment's yelling about everything has gone from tedious to exhausting to infuriating.

This is sooooooo true. When will they shut the fuck up down in D.C. and mind their pensions, or whatever the hell they do there.

Posted by: MTF at December 08, 2015 08:36 PM (TxJGV)

207
Charles Johnson*

If you search Google Images for Donald Trump's book Crippled America, you'll also find Hitler's Mein Kampf http://lgf.bz/1OP0ljy

*"Life would be oh so sweet. If I were a bicycle seat."

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 08, 2015 08:36 PM (kdS6q)

208 If Trump could provoke one of these ISIS turds to actually take a shot at him the election would be in the bag. Look for his next campaign event to feature Mohammed cartoons and Jewish go-go dancers.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 08, 2015 08:37 PM (1RNgT)

209 "Russia can't look to 19th century solutions to 21st century problems" i

What's the alternative? A mid-20th century solution to a 6th century problem? That's Trump talk!

Posted by: wooga at December 08, 2015 08:38 PM (ar20M)

210 "After seven years of letting Obama have everything he wants, no one in the GOP has any credibility left."

This, with the heat of ten thousand exploding suns.

Also:

After 2008, when the party establishment said that the certain and only path to victory lay with nominating Old Man Yells At Clouds, and after 2012, when the party establishment said that the certain and only path to victory lay with nominating the Mittbot 3000, the party establishment cannot be said to have ANY EARTHLY IDEA what will result in a Presidential win.

They think Trump is a guaranteed loser? Well, they thought that McInsane and Hymie the Robot were guaranteed winners, and look how that turned out.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 08:38 PM (noWW6)

211

excuse me

who would sacrifice a 1000 citizens on the alter of political correctness? did they volunteer as tribute?

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:38 PM (zOTsN)

212 This may rub you the wrong way, but what the hell.

Trump is an alpha male, surrounded by beta cucks, wannabees, and women. He's tough. He's bold. He knows how to lead. He knows how to negotiate. He knows how to get things done.

Remember Reagan, paying for his own debate in 1980, and the moderator tried to cut his microphone? "I PAID for this microphone, Mr. Green!" Trump is this X 100.

You don't think he'll get the nomination? Which of the 3%-ers do you think will take his positions, which the people love, out-alpha him, and seize the crown from him? Because that's what it's about now. I'll wait.

Some of you still think he's a clown, a joke, not serious, not "presidential". You aren't listening. Am I the only one who sees nothing wrong with changing your position when new, pertinent information becomes available, or circumstances change? You military folks would do that on the battle field, no? Am I the only one who sees he is putting forth the common-sense positions we have been *begging* for for more than a decade?

What the hell do you want, anyway? You Biblical types remember the parable of the talents? Trump took his talent and multiplied it 10,000X. Not good enough for you? Then you take a $1 million loan and let's see how well you do.

Yeah, his speech is a bit meandering, and sometimes needs to be clarified. William F. Buckley didn't win any elections.

If Trump doesn't get the nomination, I'm staying home, or voting third party, or writing him in. I know a LOT of you were planning to stay home, or even "let it burn" by voting Hillary, because you are as fucking fed up as I am with the GOPe cucks and traitors. This is our last, best hope to save the country before the shooting starts, or we decline into tyranny and darkness. None of the other candidates is anything but weak sauce, compromise and compromised, tools of the Chamber of Commerce/Amnesty Lobby. Why do you piss on our last chance?

Posted by: despair at December 08, 2015 08:38 PM (VrdxH)

213 Geez chemjeff was around in the am? I missed that. On the road down in Milwaukee tonite. Yuck

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:38 PM (Oy0zJ)

214 I don't care if you're a Muslim, Methodist, Hindu or
atheist.,if you don't have a skill, don't read, write, speak English,
we shouldn't let you in. If you are a Muslim you should be vetted so you
aren't a terrorist risk. If we let you in, you don't get any welfare. I
think that should help answer your question CJ on who gets in.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian

I was down at the county courthouse in Columbus the other day (don't ask why) outside of the courtroom waiting around, and there was this Somali guy, that a Public Defender was trying to help. Not only could he not understand English, he looked .....stupid. I mean really, the guy had the blank, vacant look of an imbecile (different than the mouthy Mexican kid that was trying to act tough, being all of 5 ft, 1). There is a large Somali community in Columbus ( > 30,000 at last count), and they are , by and large, pretty ridiculous, and not really assimilating. The city government insists that they are, but frankly, that is just BS.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative...a rube in America at December 08, 2015 08:38 PM (+1T7c)

215 No one is denying citizens freedom of religion. We
are merely noting that Islam is a political philosophy as well as
religion, and one incompatible with ours, so we are perfectly justified
in deciding not to allow any to emigrate here.

Quite frankly I think this is a figleaf rationalization for wanting to turn away people just because they have the "wrong" religion. Is it legal and constitutional? Yes. It is right and proper? IMO, no.

Are you gullible enough to let anyone into your home, even if you
have misgivings about them, as long as they accuse you of "bigotry" if
you don't?

Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 08:33 PM (iVV84)
If I have enough information and time to evaluate each individual wishing to enter my house on his/her own merits or demerits without having to resort to group judgments, then I won't.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:39 PM (+4mdw)

216 Trump is grabbing publicity. that's what he is doing. It's an election, and candidates need publicity.

After he gets elected he will hire a lot of very smart people, the smartest people, the bet looking very smart people, and they will give him advice on the best, most spectacular policies (and this won't be one of them), and the GOPe can just stop twirling around in circles.

Posted by: MTF at December 08, 2015 08:39 PM (TxJGV)

217 So i guess 14 killed here 10 killed there is a reasonable price to pay so that we can claim to have those values..... But what if the price goes up 10, 100, 1000, 10000 times ( that day is coming ) will you still feel that way?

Posted by: E.T. at December 08, 2015 08:36 PM (yq4gk)

Perfectly put.

Posted by: eleven at December 08, 2015 08:40 PM (qUNWi)

218 The only answer to islam is conversion. A muslim who has converted to Christianity, a true heart-felt repentance and turning away from sin, and walking towards Jesus Christ - that is the answer. If you want to help in that effort, you can click my nic, or pray, or get behind a missionary to the muslim world.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:40 PM (dFi94)

219 >> When will they shut the fuck up down in D.C. and mind their pensions, or whatever the hell they do there.

Because he's ruining their sweet gigs. They've all staked out their views, and have gotten comfy working within the area of power/expertise without being challenged. Sure, the people in flyover get feisty now and again, hold some rallies or call Congress, but they don't really ever have to pay attention, just pretend to agree to get re-elected then back to business as usual.

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 08:40 PM (NOIQH)

220 How about Aum Shinrikyo?

That one we designated a terrorist organization, but how do we square that with religious freedom, then?

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 08:40 PM (oVJmc)

221 Nice post Despair
Interesting points.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:41 PM (+oRxW)

222 The GOP could self destruct over Trump. Most of the establishment GOP has made attacks on Trump that can never be credibly walked back.

Meaning that if Trump is the nominee Democrats can run endless ads of the GOP saying their own nominee is unacceptable.

Posted by: cm9000 at December 08, 2015 08:41 PM (2TUVm)

223 Those with their heads in the sand and allowing this invasion are gladly sacrificing us by not taking serious the threat we face....

Posted by: E.T. at December 08, 2015 08:41 PM (yq4gk)

224 The ME is full of islamic countries where Christians aren't welcome or even allowed.

And what better way to show them how wrong that is than by not allowing muslims here.

Posted by: All Teh Meh at December 08, 2015 08:41 PM (VviqM)

225 'Personally, I would accept up to 1,000 dead Americans, over a ten-year period, to allow Muslim non-citizens to enter this country'
Posted by: freaked
---
Oh fuck you, Scott Adams. Fuck you.

I couldn't accept even one, unless it was you, asshole. Rageo-meter is spiking.

Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 08:41 PM (iVV84)

226 So, Cult of Kali. Would they be okay?
Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel

When did the Cult of Kali flower?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 08:42 PM (FkBIv)

227 Nope, it was so Christians and Christians could get along.
---
Well, sure. WASPs and Catholics, specifically. But once that agreement was made, there's no reason to exclude any other form of Christianity. That follows because we all worship the same God, which makes it nonsensical for us to exclude Jews (and it's not like they're opposed to getting along given the option).

But again, the point is that this is an arrangement that happened in Western civilization and non-Westerners (mohammadans, specifically) aren't party to it.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:42 PM (ZbV+0)

228 what's the average IQ in Somalia

Posted by: Feh at December 08, 2015 08:42 PM (Uk9e2)

229 I do hope that we return to talking about conservative values instead of this Trumpian nonsense.
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:33 PM (+4mdw)

Hopefully.

I mean, I get a kick out the guy, but I'm more of an ideological person than a "political" one if that makes sense.

In other words, I don't look at politics like a football game where I'm pulling for "my team" no matter what.

I think ideas matter.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:42 PM (AkOaV)

230 Different cultures are... different.
That means they are not equal.

Most have no problems 'celebrating' the positive or better aspects of different cultures.

Same people who have no problem recognizing and praising positize aspects of different cultures have a serious mental block in recognizing the negative aspects of different cultures.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (T78UI)

231 so the head of my kids school is super prog. He had a refugee from Etheopia come address the student body about the refugee experience

i was pissed at this obvious attempt to brain wash

but then my daughter said they guys english was so bad no one could understand a thing he said!!

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (zOTsN)

232 Can someone point to me where not wanting to import a bunch of people that hate us and want the US to be more like the third world shit holes they come and some actually actively want to kill us is Trumpian nonsense and not conservative?

Posted by: Buzzion at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (z/Ubi)

233 who would sacrifice a 1000 citizens on the alter of political correctness? did they volunteer as tribute?

Scott Adams at least put a number on it. That puts him above most commentators on this one.

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (6FqZa)

234 220 Sure, the people in flyover get feisty now and again, hold some rallies or call Congress, but they don't really ever have to pay attention, just pretend to agree to get re-elected then back to business as usual.
-----------------------------------------------------------

Heheh. This ^^^^.

The GOPe is in for a big surprise. They may even have to work for a change. Even the fat-assed Senate may actually have to carry a little load, Heaven forfend.

Posted by: MTF at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (TxJGV)

235 203
"Broadly, this is the freedom to believe whatever you want to believe, even including believing in "wrong" ideas"

But muslims do not accept this. They do not believe it.

But we do, ostensibly. Should we act according to our values, or to theirs?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (+4mdw)

236 Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (+4mdw)

Freedom of Association is also a Natural Right, and one in the Constitution.

Why should I be forced to associate with those who espouse a Philosophy, Legal System, or Religion, that wants to make me submit to THEIR ideas?

If you are going to take Freedom of Religion and use it to allow those who want to destroy our society into it.... why can't I use my Freedom NOT to associate to stop it?

Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 08:44 PM (qh617)

237 1k is acceptable, eh? ok, let's start with your family

Posted by: Feh at December 08, 2015 08:44 PM (Uk9e2)

238 I do hope that we return to talking about conservative values instead of this Trumpian nonsense.
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:33 PM (+4mdw)

Because nothing says conservative values like ignoring a belief system that is inimical to our own. Just crying that they have to let them in and it doesn't matter unless they act on it is willful myopia.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 08:44 PM (LTDSy)

239 Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:42 PM (ZbV+0)

well, Muslims also worship the god of Abraham.

Isaac and Ishmael and all of that, but just as related to Christianity as Judaism is.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:44 PM (AkOaV)

240 who would sacrifice a 1000 citizens on the alter of political correctness? did they volunteer as tribute?

Don't agree with Scott's general politics, but this is a negotiating tactic.

"1000 is too much? What is the correct value?"

It's a shock value statement that either wakes someone up, or encourages them to destroy their own credibility on the topic.

Leftist: "All of them!"

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:44 PM (0NdlF)

241 Is he earnest or is he just joshin' us?

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 08:45 PM (1ijHg)

242 233
Can someone point to me where not wanting to import a bunch of people
that hate us and want the US to be more like the third world shit holes
they come and some actually actively want to kill us is Trumpian
nonsense and not conservative?

Posted by: Buzzion at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (z/Ubi)
This is a strawman, I don't know anyone on the right who actually advocates this. I don't. I don't advocate deliberately letting Muslims in just for the sake of letting in Muslims. I think we should let in the best and brightest regardless of what faith they happen to belong to.

I don't think it is conservative to engage in group judgments and engage in punishment of thoughtcrime.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:45 PM (+4mdw)

243 Donchajustluvvit when a shady politician (I repeat myself) attempts to tell the American people "that's not who we are?"

Posted by: Loup Garou at December 08, 2015 08:45 PM (FkgZk)

244 Someone who says to let in Muslims just because This Is Who We Are is telling me they don't have a limit.

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at December 08, 2015 08:46 PM (6FqZa)

245 130 omg, not this again:
If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country? Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's

Let me guess, to preserve the right of all faiths to cut the heads off infidels?

What chems you into tonight?

Posted by: Cousin Vinny at December 08, 2015 08:46 PM (o9lmn)

246 Because nothing says conservative values like ignoring a belief system that is inimical to our own. Just crying that they have to let them in and it doesn't matter unless they act on it is willful myopia.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 08:44 PM (LTDSy)

Preventing more Muslims from entering the country is objectively more conservative than allowing more Muslims to enter the country.

One is the status quo. The other is changing the country by adding to its people.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:46 PM (0NdlF)

247 which conservative values? open borders? the primary obligation of government is to provide fro the common defense. They arent doing that

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:46 PM (zOTsN)

248 Trump's going to get every federal contract once Hillary is elected.

Posted by: Beef Supreme at December 08, 2015 08:46 PM (c8V4N)

249 Meaning that if Trump is the nominee Democrats can run endless ads of the GOP saying their own nominee is unacceptable.

---
GOPe has no problem with this. Hillary... Jeb..not much difference.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 08:46 PM (MbrzC)

250 "I was down at the county courthouse in Columbus the other day (don't ask
why) outside of the courtroom waiting around, and there was this Somali
guy, that a Public Defender was trying to help. Not only could he not
understand English, he looked .....stupid. I mean really, the guy had
the blank, vacant look of an imbecile"

Repeating an earlier observation:

During the age of mass immigration that was celebrated by Emma Lazarus, there actually really were tight strictures about letting in people with communicable diseases, or criminal records, or political radicals, or who would become "a public charge".

We've thrown all of those sensible rules down the crapper, and as a result, what we are getting now _really is_ the "wretched refuse".

Millions of people who can't function productively and peacefully in this society, or for that matter, in any other modern society. Yeah, that will end well.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 08:47 PM (noWW6)

251 >>I don't view natural rights as "my" ideas.
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (+4mdw)

My natural rights to Life and liberty are directly threatened by Islam as a system of govt and many of its followers. There is nothing wrong with evaluating ways to protect that for the average citizen.

How to do that is an open question but we should at least be able to talk about it even if some of the solutions we wouldn't ordinarily like.

Posted by: Lea at December 08, 2015 08:47 PM (vmMMi)

252 WHY WON'T YOU PEOPLE JUST GO ALONG WITH THE PROGRAM?

And take a shower , plebes. How can we do the business of the people when you STINK?

Posted by: Your Betters at December 08, 2015 08:47 PM (hudka)

253
I didn't allow fleeing European joos into the country.
Muahahaha

Posted by: Franklin Delano Roosevelt at December 08, 2015 08:47 PM (yfObW)

254 Let in all the goat-fucking Mohammedans who want to come over, on one condition: they have to live like they force the Copts to live in Egypt.

Posted by: Insomniac - Pale Horse/Death 2016 at December 08, 2015 08:47 PM (kpqmD)

255 I think we should let in the best and brightest regardless of what faith they happen to belong to.

Screw that. No one has a right to be a part of the US without the consent of the existing US nation.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:47 PM (0NdlF)

256 130 I'm very amused by the many, many things people "know," without actually
knowing, like reducing immigration levels for a specific group must be
"unconstitutional," or that this goes against our "values."

If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?

And no no I am not claiming immigrants have any constitutional First Amendment rights. They don't. It is a rhetorical question.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (+4mdw)

Anyone that we legally let into this country should have freedom of religion while they're here. And we should be very, very, very choosy (i.e. default = "NO") about who we let into this country and with what status -- and that includes tourists.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 08:47 PM (EzgxV)

257
the rest of the field spends most their time talking about what they CANT do

he talks about what he will do

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:07 PM (zOTsN)

Basically, Trump is demanding the rest of the field answer the question "are you an AmeriCAN or an AmeriCAN'T?"

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 08, 2015 08:48 PM (o98Jz)

258 I'm not understanding the rebuttals to Trump's plan from Paul Ryan, et al that basically boil down to "we have to be nice to moderate Muslims or they might kill us." Um, if having to be "nice or be killed" is the plan of action here, I'd rather admit none.

Also, where the eff did the idea that we *have* to take immigrants *at all* come from? We don't. We have, in fact, frozen all immigration and all visits from foreign nationals (see: Carter, ban on visas to Iranian nationals; FDR, ban on visas to Japanese, German and Italian nationals) before.

People respond "We were at war then!" Well, bub, we're at war now.

Posted by: Dancing Queen at December 08, 2015 08:48 PM (KgGd7)

259 So i guess 14 killed here 10 killed there is a reasonable price to pay
so that we can claim to have those values..... But what if the price
goes up 10, 100, 1000, 10000 times ( that day is coming ) will you still
feel that way?

If we lose enough cities to mushroom clouds the people that impose the values of political correctness on us today simply won't be here to do it.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:48 PM (ZbV+0)

260 Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:40 PM (dFi94)

Thanks; I had not heard of that particular organization.

We pray every week in church and FenelonSpouse and I pray everyday for the conversion of Muslims to a sincere, and Holy Spirited Directed love for and acceptance of Jesus as Lord.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at December 08, 2015 08:48 PM (No/ki)

261 213 If Trump doesn't get the nomination, I'm staying home, or voting third party, or writing him in.
---------------------------------------------------------

I guess I'm pretty much the opposite, because I don't want to elect a guy who is in favor of pretty much everything Obama favors except immigration.

Single payer health? Check
Censor the internet? Check

Not interested.

Posted by: MTF at December 08, 2015 08:48 PM (TxJGV)

262 >>> well, Muslims also worship the god of Abraham.
>>> Isaac and Ishmael and all of that, but just as related to Christianity as Judaism is.

No and no.

As Jesus said, you shall know them by their fruit.

Posted by: fluffy at December 08, 2015 08:48 PM (AfsKp)

263 Wonder what would happen if the Uniparty folks were sprayed with an aerosol version of the drug that shrunk Carter's tumors?

Posted by: Mortimer at December 08, 2015 08:49 PM (hudka)

264 Why should I be forced to associate with those who espouse a Philosophy,
Legal System, or Religion, that wants to make me submit to THEIR ideas?

Who said I want to force you to associate with anyone?

Feel free to live and assemble with whomever you wish. If you want to not associate with Muslims, go right ahead.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:49 PM (+4mdw)

265 I guess I'm pretty much the opposite, because I don't want to elect a guy who is in favor of pretty much everything Obama favors except immigration.

Immigration matters more than any other issue you can think of.

If you're replaced, you lose your say in the future.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (0NdlF)

266 There is a large Somali community in Columbus ( > 30,000 at last count), and they are , by and large, pretty ridiculous, and not really assimilating. The city government insists that they are, but frankly, that is just BS.
Posted by: Bossy Conservative...a rube in America at December 08, 2015 08:38 PM (+1T7c)

Oh yes, the joys of the Somali community that the police avoid whenever possible. Another great gift from Clinton and Bush the First. Plus why we have Somali on ATMs.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (LTDSy)

267 "If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just
because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have
freedom of religion in this country?"

Except that we DO NOT ACTUALLY HAVE notionally pure "freedom of religion" in America, and thank goodness for that.

If we did actually have bona fide, full bore "freedom of religion", you'd be seeing Satanists routinely tearing out the hearts of little children on sacrificial altars.

Ask the old school Mormons about "freedom of religion" in America as it applies to plural marriage, by the way.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (noWW6)

268 The only answer to islam is conversion. A muslim who has converted to Christianity, a true heart-felt repentance and turning away from sin, and walking towards Jesus Christ - that is the answer. If you want to help in that effort, you can click my nic, or pray, or get behind a missionary to the muslim world.

Posted by:�grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6�at December 08, 2015 08:40 PM (dFi94)
---
Not the only answer. Keep them out.

Not a Christian myself, but I've read the NT through a few times (not just for quote mining or prooftexting).

Christians have a right to self defense, a duty to love family and neighbor as well as enemies, both which justify defending ourselves against the Muslim invasion. There is nothing that obligates Christians to limit themselves to proselytization as the only means to combat Islam.

Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (iVV84)

269 Can't properly vet them, top leaders have said it and California proved it, but we have to let them keep coming. Because that's who we are.

Posted by: Mr. Healthy Penis at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (LYCUN)

270 Feel free to live and assemble with whomever you wish. If you want to not associate with Muslims, go right ahead.

So we don't let them in. Problem solved.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (0NdlF)

271 I do not believe we have a moral obligation to admit non-citizens into this country, period. If they come from a predictably high-risk group, we have an even less obligation. If this particular high-risk group has a history of trying to murder those who are not in their tribe, I think we have no obligation to take them in, anymore than we would take in avowed Nazis during WW2. The risk outweighs the reward. First and foremost, it is the responsibility of the government to physically protect its citizens. If we err, let us err on the side of caution.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (dFi94)

272 Sshhhh ..... my kids don't know. Ring gets sprung on Christmas Day.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:23 PM (dFi94)

Congratulations grammie! May you and your husband have long lives filled with happiness and love.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (AC0lD)

273 But we do, ostensibly. Should we act according to our values, or to theirs?

Their values want us dead or under sharia law. Fvck them. I'm not ready to die yet at the hand of muzzie.

Let's stop any immigration for at least 10 years.

Posted by: Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (Zvmcz)

274 Anyone that we legally let into this country should
have freedom of religion while they're here. And we should be very,
very, very choosy (i.e. default = "NO") about who we let into this
country and with what status -- and that includes tourists.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 08:47 PM (EzgxV)
See I completely agree with that. Being choosy is fine. Being choosy based on lazy group judgments of a particular person's religion, that is different and wrong.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (+4mdw)

275 If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?

And no no I am not claiming immigrants have any constitutional First Amendment rights. They don't. It is a rhetorical question.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:18 PM (+4mdw)

So letting in people who kill us *because* of our freedoms (including our freedom of religion -- e.g. Sharia law) supports our freedom of religion how, exactly?

Posted by: Dancing Queen at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (KgGd7)

276 Block Donald Trump from UK campaign gets huge support as storm rages over Muslim ban call

========

Why? He's not calling for the UK to ban them. They can have all the terrorists they want.

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (iQIUe)

277 Posted by: Dancing Queen at December 08, 2015 08:48 PM (KgGd7)

---
There have been no real rebuttals just a bunch of name calling.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (MbrzC)

278 Well, yeah. I concede that there's a certain "eye candy quotient" involved...

Posted by: The Original antisocialist-Accept No Substitutes! at December 08, 2015 08:17 PM (cDs+4)
If someone want's eye candy, it's available 24/7 and just a mouse click away.

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (u9UgT)

279 We have not yet begun to doh!

Posted by: Progressives and GOPers everywhere at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (gyKtp)

280 Gonna join the bandwagon - congrats grammie!

All the Morons/Ettes congratulating you over the next week are going to a put a real damper on keeping it sekrit.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (0NdlF)

281 236 203
"Broadly, this is the freedom to believe whatever you want to believe, even including believing in "wrong" ideas"

But muslims do not accept this. They do not believe it.

But we do, ostensibly. Should we act according to our values, or to theirs?
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (+4mdw)

*********

Right now there is a case in court where female soldiers are not allowed to perform their duties at Guantanamo because the Muslim male prisoners believe they should not be touched by female non-relatives.

The burqa is used to oppress a whole group of persons that should have the natural rights that you speak about.

What is your position on the burqa, and what is your position on women soldiers being allowed to do their jobs at Guantanamo?

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (mcm0N)

282 But we do, ostensibly. Should we act according to our values, or to theirs?

We should act, as ruthlessly as they do and more, to defend ourselves and our people from their values.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (ZbV+0)

283 My favorite new media talking point is how Trump is now playing right into ISIS' hands, doing exactly what they want.

It's hard to win a fight when any sort of resistance is met with that very same freaking cry. Bastards....

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (AC0lD)

284 130 If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?
--------------------------------------------------------

ChemJeff, I think you are worried about literally nothing. First off, Trump will never actually do this-- too rage stroke for most Americans on the coasts. Secondly, I think he is really aiming at political Islam, at Sharia (as someone wrote today over at NR). He isn't going to bar Muslims for religious reasons, he's going to bar Islamists for political reasons.

Which may in fact be an helluva idea. You never know. In any event, seriously, don't sweat this-- he's looking for publicity.

Posted by: MTF at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (TxJGV)

285 So we don't let them in. Problem solved.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (0NdlF)
Even the non-terrorist Muslims?
This is starting to sound a lot like the pro-abortion argument of "it's okay to kill the babies from poor moms, they would have just ended up violent criminals anyway, better to kill them before they commit murder when they grow up".

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (+4mdw)

286 I don't think it is conservative to engage in group judgments and engage in punishment of thoughtcrime.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:45 PM (+4mdw)

Collective guilt and crime think are totes not conservative. Any other deep thoughts you care to share?

Posted by: cm9000 at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (2TUVm)

287 If I have enough information and time to evaluate each individual wishing to enter my house on his/her own merits or demerits without to resort to group judgments, then I won't.
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:39 PM (+4mdw)

Thanks for proving our point. We can't possibly vet these people. Maybe if we were letting in a couple thousand a year. But we are letting in 100's of thousands. The latest killer was vetted.

Anyways, with Muslims it seems the second generation typically kicks into sudden jihadi syndrome.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (LTDSy)

288 I hope that Afghan interpreter guy and his family gets in before any ban.

Posted by: Max Rockatansky at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (iRZl4)

289 "If I have enough information and time to evaluate each individual wishing to enter my house on his/her own merits or demerit"

But you don't. The people in San Bernardino earnestly thought that their co-worker was a good guy. They threw him a baby shower. One of the guys who he murdered had even told him previously "if anyone gives you any crap about your religion, I've got your back"

And he went to their party. Sat with them. Joked with them. And then he left and gathered his guns and bombs and killed them.

You don't know. I know that you don't want to think that your students are terrorists. I get that. But the fact is that we just don't know. Markers of moderation don't do much good. The female jihadi in london was known to wear short skirts and be a bit of a slut. The 9/11 guys went to strip clubs and drank.

And every single muslim I've ever known, every single one, has said disparaging things about Israel.

You don't know who will become a terrorist. You don't know whose child will become a terrorist. If someone willingly chooses to follow an ideology that tells them to kill me, I'll take them at their word on that point, despite how nice they may seem.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (Z/8dZ)

290
I don't view natural rights as "my" ideas.
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (+4mdw)

The idea that we need to protect and guarantee all mankind's rights is your idea. I'm done sacrificing my own safety for principles my enemies do not share. I will protect my own freedom, because in the end, I'm the only one who will.

Should we grant the whole world American citizenship? Why not? Aren't they all such lovely people?

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (WTbmS)

291 We don't -- or did not for a long time (under Clinton) -- all Haitian nationals to visit or immigrate due to their high HIV rate.
Not all Haitians have HIV, you know. But eff them -- the safety of American citizens are supposed to come first in our immigration policies.

Posted by: Dancing Queen at December 08, 2015 08:54 PM (KgGd7)

292 Should we act according to our values, or to theirs?

Our values are not suicidal death cult. So of course we act according to our values. Keep 'em out.

It's more humane than importing them and killing them. Or importing them and submitting to their religion.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:54 PM (0NdlF)

293 UK bans or wants to ban anyone who stands up to terrorism but they welcome terrorists with open arms and freebies.

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 08:54 PM (iQIUe)

294 So chemjeff how do we be choosy without being lazy about it your #276?

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:54 PM (VROg+)

295 No and no.

As Jesus said, you shall know them by their fruit.
Posted by: fluffy at December 08, 2015 08:48 PM (AfsKp)

no and no to what?

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:54 PM (AkOaV)

296 And what better way to show them how wrong that is than by not allowing muslims here.
Posted by: All Teh Meh at December 08, 2015 08:41 PM (VviqM)

What better way to show we aren't patsies and actually believe in our cultures.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 08:54 PM (LTDSy)

297

Oh yeah Trump and obama are practically twins!

Oh no , no , no.

Trump is Hitler and will be placing Mexicans in boxcars.

Nip Sip ,Susan Cuthbertson-Klein and Shaun King have assured me that this is so.

Posted by: Mortimer at December 08, 2015 08:54 PM (hudka)

298 Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (iVV84)
=================================================

I'm in agreement with you. I guess I was talking in the overall macro-picture of the "Problem with Islam". In my opinion, the only hope for those caught in the web of islam is the freedom that comes from a relationship with Christ. I should have framed that better, rather than putting it within the bounds of immigration.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (dFi94)

299 If the UK bans Trump and he is elected POTUS, that would be hilarious.

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (iQIUe)

300 173 I don't care if you're a Muslim, Methodist, Hindu or atheist.,if you don't have a skill, don't read, write, speak English, we shouldn't let you in. If you are a Muslim you should be vetted so you aren't a terrorist risk. If we let you in, you don't get any welfare. I think that should help answer your question CJ on who gets in.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:28 PM (QdyoO)

Under normal circumstances, I might agree with you, but there are about 330 million people lawfully in the US, and roughly 7.6 Billion people outside who want our stuff -- and we should keep the door barred shut so long as there is a squad of idiots in Washington DC that care more about the latter than the former.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (EzgxV)

301 Immigration matters more than any other issue you can think of.�If you're replaced, you lose your say in the future.Posted by: ReactionaryMonster
---
As they say, ^^^^^^THIS TIMES A THOUSAND^^^^^^

This is the most pressing issue, the existential issue. We don't solve this next cycle, we won't be able to solve anything ever again. Why can't people see this?

If Trump fixes this, we can elect someone else next cycle to fix eminent domain, for instance.

Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (iVV84)

302 well, Muslims also worship the god of Abraham.

No, they worship Satan, name him allah, and pretend that he was the God of Abraham by virtue of being the only god.

No honest Christian considers mohammadans as part of the family, since they specifically deny Christ.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (ZbV+0)

303 The founders were not keen on other cultures immigrating, iirc. Krauthammer labels them bigger bigots I suppose, since they kept their WASPy traditions.
humanevents.com/2007/07/20/founding-fathers-were-immigration-skeptics/

It only makes sense to keep a culture ... a culture. Organic change may occur from within, but only our commie enemies pushed the multi-culti diversity thingy, and it was done to divide us, weaken us. Currently Dems divide us on everything, to win elections by promising to provide for the oppressed "minorities" ... which is everyone but white Christian males, who must be neutered at an early age, if they can't be turned gay or trans.

Posted by: Illiniwek at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (26Yu7)

304 Even the non-terrorist Muslims?
This is starting to sound a lot like the pro-abortion argument of "it's okay to kill the babies from poor moms, they would have just ended up violent criminals anyway, better to kill them before they commit murder when they grow up".

Letting Muslims stay in their own country is a far cry from murdering them while they're helpless.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (0NdlF)

305 Congratulations grammie winger!!

Drink!

Posted by: MTF at December 08, 2015 08:56 PM (TxJGV)

306 "Feel free to live and assemble with whomever you wish. If you want to not associate with Muslims, go right ahead."

Oh. Sure. Right. Got it. No problem.

Except that freedom of association rights got themselves completely incinerated by the black-robed radicals fifty years ago.

::: facepalm :::

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 08:56 PM (noWW6)

307 What better way to show we aren't patsies and actually believe in our cultures.

Looks like you believe in their culture of banning people based on their religion.

Posted by: All Teh Meh at December 08, 2015 08:56 PM (VviqM)

308 Look at the thousands of kiddie rapes that occur in the UK and that the powers that be turned a blind eye to. How effin sick can you get???

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (iQIUe)

309 All the Morons/Ettes congratulating you over the next week are going to a put a real damper on keeping it sekrit.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (0NdlF)
===================================================

Well, today's the 8th - we only have to make it till the 25th

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (dFi94)

310 Re. smart people getting su much so wrong, maybe they're not smart. Maybe it's the Dunning-Krueger effect.

Posted by: The Inexplicable Dr. Julius Strangepork at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (G6lch)

311 "Feel free to live and assemble with whomever you wish. If you want to not associate with Muslims, go right ahead."

GLWT

Posted by: Christian Cake Bakers at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (hudka)

312 "Letting Muslims stay in their own country is a far cry from murdering them while they're helpless."

THIS

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (Z/8dZ)

313 299 - Yet the left wants Israel to physically relocate everyone in the west bank, and also change their current borders.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (MbrzC)

314 There are potential costs in American-Muslim relations both internationally and domestically, says Taranto

Yeah, if so fu@k the internationally and fu@k them particularly domestically. I've had enough.

Posted by: free tibet, as if! at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (lAXNl)

315
Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (mcm0N)
I think we should be respectful of other people's faiths to the largest extent possible. I don't know enough about that particular case, but if the prisoner's demands are unreasonable, then no, don't accommodate them, but if the prisoner's demands are reasonable and don't require so much expense and trouble on our part, then I think we should accommodate them.
I don't think any free person should be forced to wear any article of clothing that they haven't freely chosen to wear themselves. I can't control what Saudi Arabia's government does but I would not want our government forcing adults to wear burqas, of course

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (+4mdw)

316 287 So we don't let them in. Problem solved.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (0NdlF)
Even the non-terrorist Muslims?
This is starting to sound a lot like the pro-abortion argument of "it's okay to kill the babies from poor moms, they would have just ended up violent criminals anyway, better to kill them before they commit murder when they grow up".

*********

Flag on the play. These are not morally equivalent.

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (mcm0N)

317 Looks like you believe in their culture of banning people based on their religion.

Where "banning people" means letting people continue to live in their home country.

The horror, the horror.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (0NdlF)

318 Block Donald Trump from UK campaign gets huge support as storm rages over Muslim ban call
========
Why? He's not calling for the UK to ban them. They can have all the terrorists they want.
Posted by: Bruce With a Wang!

The UK banned Michael Savage but they don't seem to have a problem with Anjem Choudary.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (FkBIv)

319 Drink!

Posted by: MTF at December 08, 2015 08:56 PM (TxJGV)
==========================================

That's my plan !!

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (dFi94)

320 So chemjeff - how about this. I dump a bagful of snakes in your bed every night. Some of the snakes are lethal, some of them aren't, but they all look the same. You'd be just fine and dandy with climbing into bed under this arrangement, would you not, based on your previous arguments? Don't the snakes have a natural right to a nice place to live, right next to you, even though a significant number of them can and will kill you? Wouldn't keeping the snakes out of your bed entirely be a "lazy group judgment"?

Posted by: Insomniac - Pale Horse/Death 2016 at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (kpqmD)

321 Congratulations, grammie winger.

Posted by: SMFH at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (zyIlW)

322 "GOP will rip itself apart at convention to avoid nominating Trump."

sounds like a plan to me... no downside that i can see.

Posted by: redc1c4 at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (7+yyM)

323 Could you imagine if Obama proposed a new anti-terror policy of having customs agents "ask everyone if they are Muslim and if they say yes, turn them away"? Conservatives would brand him an imbecile, an unserious joke.

Apparently, if a drooling retard was taught to mouth the words "no Muslims" or "dirty Mexicans", he'd be leading the GOP polls.

Posted by: Beef Supreme at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (c8V4N)

324 313
"Feel free to live and assemble with whomever you wish. If you want to not associate with Muslims, go right ahead."

GLWT

Posted by: Christian Cake Bakers at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (hudka)
So what is your point with this?
Because the Left oppresses Christian cake bakers, that gives the Right free license to oppress non-terrorist Muslims?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (+4mdw)

325 One of my dad's favorite jokes:

The family was gathered at Thanksgiving. Everyone was at the table. Immediately after grace was said, the patriarch of the family stands up and says:

"I have something to say that will probably shock and disappoint you. Grandma and I were never legally married."

Total silence.

Until a small voice at the end of the table asks:

"Will one of you bastards please pass the salt?"

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (1ijHg)

326 I've written this before but needs to be done so again.

My father, god rest his patriotic soul, was for a good portion of his life a used salesman and therefore a student of human behavior. Among the may pearls of wisdom he imparted to me was this:

"The easiest people to fool are the people that think they are smart."

This explains the left and it's minions of low IQers. They got them to think they are smart.

Posted by: John McCain, Card Carin Maverick at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (AhyHb)

327 And what better way to show them how wrong that is than by not allowing muslims here.

So it's OK for them to prohibit Christians in their country, but we should allow people who openly admit that they have no allegiance to America and actively want sharia law here in defiance of our own laws and traditions?

I'm sorry, but that just doesn't make sense in any way.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (LUgeY)

328 Well, today's the 8th - we only have to make it till the 25th

You're going to have to tell us if you successfully kept it secret, and how well your children acted surprised.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (0NdlF)

329 301 If the UK bans Trump and he is elected POTUS, that would be hilarious.

That would be something wouldn't it? He could then take a poke back at them and ask for the bust of Churchill back.

Posted by: freaked at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (BO/km)

330 @213

"Trump is an alpha male"

Alpha males don't whine like babies on Twitter after being asked difficult questions.

"He's tough. He's bold."

In a constantly whining kind of way, sure.

"He knows how to lead."

In an Obama kind of way. Every time he's criticized, Trump just whines to his supporters and asks them to shout down dissenters.

"He knows how to negotiate. He knows how to get things done."

Unfortunately, those "things" only entail going bankrupt and forcing people out of their homes.

"Remember Reagan, paying for his own debate in 1980, and the moderator tried to cut his microphone? "I PAID for this microphone, Mr. Green!" Trump is this X 100."

Reagan was respectable; Trump is a buffoon.

"You don't think he'll get the nomination?"

Not based on the fact that, as Carson's numbers fade, Cruz and Rubio pick up his supporters. Odds are if Jeb and the others bail out, their support would go to either Cruz or Rubio, but not Trump. When the race is eventually narrowed down to Cruz and Rubio, Trump will find his vaunted poll numbers paling in comparison.

"out-alpha him"

At this point, even Caitlyn Jenner out-alphas Trump.

"Some of you still think he's a clown, a joke, not serious, not "presidential"."

Exactly. Glad you've been paying attention.

"You aren't listening."

No, I've been paying attention to the fact that Trump has no coherent policy, that he gets by on platitudes, that he walks back his loopier comments, and that he blames everyone else for his idiocy. He's Obama 2.0.

"Am I the only one who sees nothing wrong with changing your position when new, pertinent information becomes available, or circumstances change?"

It is so hilarious that you are saying this in defense of Trump, a lifelong liberal with a history of backing Democratic positions and candidates. And let's not forget that time that Trump expressed support for bringing Syrian refugees to America before someone told him how his base would react. And oh yeah, there's how he criticized Romney's position on immigration as being too severe.

"Am I the only one who sees he is putting forth the common-sense positions we have been *begging* for for more than a decade? "

So, in other words, Trump (a lifelong Democrat) is telling you want you want to hear, and you're supporting him because of that? Good argument.

"What the hell do you want, anyway?"

A quality, intelligent candidate with a grasp of policy and who doesn't support liberal positions like single payer or preventing people on the no-fly list from getting guns. Hence, why I don't support Trump.

"You Biblical types remember the parable of the talents?"

Ooh, is this rhetoric along the lines of Trump bashing Iowa voters for not supporting him?

"Trump took his talent and multiplied it 10,000X."

Well, he inherited his money and went bankrupt more times than he's been married.

"Not good enough for you? Then you take a $1 million loan and let's see how well you do."

Ah, the traditional "You do better" argument that Obama and his supporters often invoke. I knew Trump supporters had a lot in common with them.

"Yeah, his speech is a bit meandering, and sometimes needs to be clarified."

Trump is totes intelligent, you guys; he's just not good at expressing himself or his policies. But hey, everyone takes months to reveal policy details and everyone brazenly contradicts themselves.

"If Trump doesn't get the nomination, I'm staying home, or voting third party, or writing him in."

I'm sure you'll be one of the people that Hillary thanks next year, then.

"This is our last, best hope to save the country"

Yes, which is why you shouldn't waste any time or energy supporting someone as brazenly unqualified and incompetent as Trump.

Thanks a lot, despair! You make it so easy to highlight the failings of Trump.

Posted by: tops116 at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (Wn+fE)

331
The UK banned Michael Savage but they don't seem to have a problem with Anjem Choudary.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 08:58 PM (FkBIv)
---

THIS

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (MbrzC)

332 "wrong side of history"

like the Left in Latin America

Posted by: Feh at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (Uk9e2)

333 No honest Christian considers mohammadans as part of the family, since they specifically deny Christ.
Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (ZbV+0)

not to defend Muslims here, but Jesus is a prophet in Islam. In fact, when he returns after the battle at Dabiq, he will fight arm in arm with Muhammed against the Army of Rome to give the follows of Muhammed Al Quds (Jerusalem)

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (AkOaV)

334 Americans are good and generous people. That's why commies and terrorists can take advantage by being wolves in sheep's clothing.

So listen to me: There is a reason there is the "East" and the "West." The values of the East are NOT compatible with the West. They just aren't.

IOW, you can't let the wolf in and hope he will not eat you because you want to show how good you are. You need to keep the wolf at the door.

Posted by: Dancing Queen at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (KgGd7)

335 "So it is your belief that "freedom of religion" should only be applied selectively for certain religions? Which ones should be on the list? And who decides?"

The American people. Ask the Mormons. They had to change some of their practices to be let in. I just want the muslims to change their holy book so that it doesn't say they must kill me. Also they should not try to kill me because I dfidn't capitalize muslim.

Posted by: history, repeat at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (PGh+Q)

336 I don't understand what Trump is freaking out about?

We can totally absorb another 9/11.

Posted by: Barackhenaten I at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (YUJCJ)

337 "If you don't think it is against our values to turn away Muslims just because they are Muslim, then I have to ask, why do you think we have freedom of religion in this country?"

Because the rule was written when the country consisted of white Christians and a handful of Jews. They never imagined anyone would be stupid enough to allow immigration of Muslims whose religion is totally inimical to the Republic they were setting up. They were brilliant, but they couldn't account for the unthinkable.

Posted by: despair at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (VrdxH)

338 Ah yes, the unalienable rights..... Life? What right to life has a man who is drowning in the Pacific? The ocean will not hearken to his cries. What right to life has a man who must die if he is to save his children? If he chooses to save his own life, does he do so as a matter of 'right'? If two men are starving and cannibalism is the only alternative to death, which man's right is "unalienable"? And is it a right?
As to liberty, the heroes who signed that great document pledged to themselves to buy liberty with their lives. Liberty is never unalienable; it must be redeemed regularly with the blood of patriots, or it always vanishes. Of all the so-called natural human rights that have ever been invented, liberty is least likely to be cheap, and is never free of cost.
....But for every juvenile criminal, there are always one or more adult delinquents - people of mature years who either do not know their duty, or who, knowing it, fail.
And that was the soft spot that destroyed which destroyed what was in many ways an admirable culture.......their citizens glorified their mythology of rights, and lost track of their duties. No nation, so constituted, can endure.

monologue by Jean V. DuBois, Colonel, retired, Mobile Infantry, sometime in the late 23rd Century.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative...a rube in America at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (+1T7c)

339 I think the point Scott Adams is trying to make is a clarifying one.

He is saying:

The argument of the left is that "our values" are going to cost Americans in blood.

The actual number of deaths is entirely irrelevant to them. He himself is OK with 1K. Others have a different threshold. But they all are OK with it.

Posted by: Sanfranpsycho at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (afaIk)

340 287 So we don't let them in. Problem solved.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 08:50 PM (0NdlF)
Even the non-terrorist Muslims?
This is starting to sound a lot like the pro-abortion argument of "it's okay to kill the babies from poor moms, they would have just ended up violent criminals anyway, better to kill them before they commit murder when they grow up".
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015
08:53 PM (+4mdw)

Oh horseshit, and you know it.

Posted by: Insomniac - Pale Horse/Death 2016 at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (kpqmD)

341 At one time - decades ago, I wanted to do refugee work. I read a lot about it and the different philosophies. The best way is to allow temporary refuge and then send them back. If you dont, they just get use to living in refugee camps and having others provide for them. Now, they live in refugee camps in other countries that give them all sorts of freebies and they dont provide for themselves. Worse, they import all their third world shit.

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (iQIUe)

342 Isaac and Ishmael and all of that, but just as related to Christianity as Judaism is.
Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:44 PM (AkOaV)

Not really. Ole' Mo messed up all sorts of Old Testament stories. I don't know of any serious disagreement between Jews and Christians on the actual texts of the Torah. Mo was just trying to convince Jews and Christians to join. When they didn't the rape, murders, and terrorism began.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 09:00 PM (LTDSy)

343 So now a simple halting to immigration from countries with terrorist problems is oppressing people?

Posted by: Mr. Healthy Penis at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (LYCUN)

344 Yet the left wants Israel to physically relocate everyone in the west bank, and also change their current borders.
Posted by: ThisBeingMilt

I think they'd like them all to go back to 1947 borders.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (FkBIv)

345 I m so glad I don't have a working TV and don't read leftists blogs so I don't have to hear the 24/7 freak out about Trump, except for what's reported here or on some other conservative blogs.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (No/ki)

346 189 The last time we were confronted with a religion that had military supremacy as a core belief and resulted in suicidal religious fanatics flying airplanes into large structures, we dropped nukes on their cities, occupied their country, and CHANGED THEIR FREAKIN' RELIGION to suit our needs. That program work very well, and our Shinto friends are now very well behaved.

Shinto Directive

http://tinyurl.com/nz7l8g8

Posted by: tommylotto at December 08, 2015 08:31 PM (A3a8d)

Very good link.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (EzgxV)

347 "If we prevent Muslims from entering America, the terrorists win."

Posted by: Illogical statements, vol iii at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (WTbmS)

348 Posted by: tops116 at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (Wn+fE)

TLDR

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (0NdlF)

349 "If the UK bans Trump and he is elected POTUS, that would be hilarious."

Oh yes.

The two incredibly expensive new aircraft carriers the UK are building which are by design compatible *only* with one type of jet fighter, the Lockheed Martin F-35B model?

Oops! President Trump wouldn't sign the export authorization. Enjoy those two incredibly expensive paperweights. Maybe they can be made into cruise ships.

Also, those Trident submarine-launched ballistic missiles previously issued by the US to the UK? Contract not renewed. Perhaps the UK can turn them into dock pilings. Or mounting shafts for wind turbines.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (noWW6)

350 Posted by: Stateless Infidel at December 08, 2015 08:51 PM (AC0lD)
=================================================

Thank you Stateless. And thank you to whoever I might have inadvertently missed. You are all so kind.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (dFi94)

351 Where "banning people" means letting people continue to live in their home country.

Yes, exactly like them.

Posted by: All Teh Meh at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (VviqM)

352 Because the Left oppresses Christian cake bakers, that gives the Right free license to oppress non-terrorist Muslims?

Am I at DU or KOS?

Musta took a wrong turn at Albuquerque.

Posted by: Mortimer at December 08, 2015 09:02 PM (hudka)

353 I think we should be respectful of other people's faiths to the largest extent possible. I don't know enough about that particular case, but if the prisoner's demands are unreasonable, then no, don't accommodate them, but if the prisoner's demands are reasonable and don't require so much expense and trouble on our part, then I think we should accommodate them.
I don't think any free person should be forced to wear any article of clothing that they haven't freely chosen to wear themselves. I can't control what Saudi Arabia's government does but I would not want our government forcing adults to wear burqas, of course.

************

ChemJeff

Let's change it up--what if the prisoners did not want African Americans to touch them?

What if Muslims believed African Americans should wear burqas?

Any difference in how you respond or would feel about that?

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:02 PM (mcm0N)

354 "but Jesus is a prophet in Islam."

In a way completely heretical to Christians and only because Mohammad was gobbling up and spitting out every religion he encountered to create his frankenreligion.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:02 PM (Z/8dZ)

355 353 Where "banning people" means letting people continue to live in their home country.

Yes, exactly like them.
Posted by: All Teh Meh at December 08, 2015 09:01 PM (VviqM)

And makes you worse than Margaret Sanger, apparently.

Posted by: Insomniac - Pale Horse/Death 2016 at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (kpqmD)

356 You are all so kind.

Well, thanks, but you're the one who's kind; That's why were all so happy for you! :^)

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (No/ki)

357 "The terrorists want us to fight them. Slavishly declaring their religion awesome and refusing to offend them makes them furious."

Posted by: Illogical statements, vol iii at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (WTbmS)

358 296
So chemjeff how do we be choosy without being lazy about it your #276?

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who
drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:54 PM (VROg+)
The same way you choose people to work for you in a job application process.
You pick people who will be the right fit based on specific criteria for the job. You don't turn away otherwise qualified people just because they "look funny" or some other irrelevant group characteristic. That would be foolish.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (+4mdw)

359 That would be something wouldn't it? He could then take a poke back at them and ask for the bust of Churchill back.
Posted by: freaked at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (BO/km)

========
For state visits in the US, they can keep Cameron and Chuck and send Kate!

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (iQIUe)

360 232 so the head of my kids school is super prog. He had a refugee from Etheopia come address the student body about the refugee experience

i was pissed at this obvious attempt to brain wash

but then my daughter said they guys english was so bad no one could understand a thing he said!!

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 08:43 PM (zOTsN)

ThunderB, similar experience with one of my employees' children today.

This 10-year-old child had to participate in a - for lack of a better description - "class play" about an imaginary immigration family from Ireland who just 'came here for a better life".

The principal played the immigration officer. One of the questions he asked the imaginary father of this family was "do you have money? A job?" The father hung his head in shame and say "No." And the immigration officer said they had to go back home.

The imaginary mother started crying and asking the officer how they were supposed to feed their children?

My employee's daughter had to play one of the children.

This poor little girl was so upset, she ran out of the room crying.

When her teacher caught up with her, she said (paraphrased), "This is all a lie. Marybeth told me about the Mayflower people coming here. No one turned them away. Why are you all lying?"

She proceeded to tell the teacher the entire Mayflower story, and she just happened to include what I told her about how some of the Pilgrims starved due to lack of food because of all of the crops raised were divided equally among everyone, regardless of how much or little they worked. And how the next year all the families had their own plots and got to keep what they grew, resulting in an abundant harvest.

The teacher called my employee to find out who "Marybeth" was, to tell her that's not what they teach about the Pilgrims in their school, and that the principal wanted a meeting with her first thing in the morning.

My employee asked what she should do and say.

My response? Tell the principal he's disgraceful for brainwashing children with one side of the immigration story, he and his teachers should read the children first-hand accounts like William Bradford's diary instead of their claptrap revisionist history, and that I'll be happy to come introduce myself to the principal and teacher and educate them.

Disgraceful.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (7egrg)

361 "not to defend Muslims here, but Jesus is a prophet in Islam. In fact, when he returns after the battle at Dabiq, he will fight arm in arm with Muhammed against the Army of Rome to give the follows of Muhammed Al Quds (Jerusalem)"

You are defending muslims. Jesus and his fellow Jews own Jerusalem. Note that Jesus is a Greek spelling of the English Joshua. I don't do Hebrew but I hope you get the gist.

Posted by: history, repeat at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (PGh+Q)

362 Whenever I am seeking insightful, objective commentary, I go to Josh Ernest.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at December 08, 2015 09:04 PM (9mTYi)

363 Because the Left oppresses Christian cake bakers, that gives the Right free license to oppress non-terrorist Muslims?

Help , Help I'm being oppressed!

Posted by: All Four 'Non-Terrorist' Muslims at December 08, 2015 09:04 PM (hudka)

364 chemjeff,

If I understand you correctly, you fail to see that mainstream Islam IS incompatible with Western Culture. These are NOT civilized people. We do not have to let them in.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:04 PM (1ijHg)

365 Technically Jesus is supposed to be fighting alongside the Mahdi. Muhammad's not coming back, same way Moses is not coming back and Salih is not coming back

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at December 08, 2015 09:04 PM (6FqZa)

366 So it's OK for them to prohibit Christians in their country, but we should allow people who openly admit that they have no allegiance to America and actively want sharia law here in defiance of our own laws and traditions?

I'm sorry, but that just doesn't make sense in any way.

Saying that what they do is wrong and then emulating it exactly makes even less sense.

Posted by: All Teh Meh at December 08, 2015 09:04 PM (VviqM)

367
Reluctant to join this long-running sloppy mess, but jeez, chemjeff, talk about "lazy" and "nonsense".

There is not a tiny element of any of our "values" involved in making immigration policy decisions. Judgements and preferences, which can change, and have, over time. Immigration pause for three generations (20s to the 60s), and then the strong slant in which immigrants to favor when the pause ended ('65 act) - both far more dramatic changes (both directions) then any sort of pause on select nationalities at this time. Yet, incredibly, the US survived those things (well, the '65 act started becoming a disaster in the 80s and then mass illegal migration ....), including our "values".

Exclusion or delay/deep vetting of Muslim tourists or intending immigrants based on SECURITY ISSUES is as practical, unimpeachable, sensible, and value-irrelevant as any policy could be.

Understood your experience or background in this area is nil, but FYI "group judgements" are the basis of all past and current immigration vetting, one way or another. Try to get a K-1 or CR-1 visa for a Japanese national - nearly automatic (same for Swiss, or Singaporeans, or New Zealanders, etc.).

Try to do the same thing out of Manila, or Lagos. Good luck. Why? Group judgements, based on reality - (countries/cultures with extremely high adherence to rule of law, good records, and lack of incentive for fraudulent applications/fake marriages, etc. - vs., well, the opposite).

No need for years of consular work to know this. Common sense, some exposure to the actual immigration process.

But "group judgements" based on SECURITY - immeasurably more important than preventing fake marriage immigration - are somehow a "values" question?

Now THERE is some "nonsense" (not lazy neccessarily, but deeply ignorant about the relevant topic).

Posted by: rhomboid at December 08, 2015 09:05 PM (QDnY+)

368 Where my EBT card at, kuffir ?

And cover those legs, American whore.

Posted by: 'Non-Terrorist' Muslims at December 08, 2015 09:05 PM (hudka)

369 What if Muslims believed African Americans should wear burqas?

Any difference in how you respond or would feel about that?
Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:02 PM (mcm0N)

Arabs are incredibly racist. They enslave(d) Africans, were an intricate part of the slave trade, and IIRC, the Arabic word for "black African" and "slave" are the same word.

Not sure what that has to do with anything, but...

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 09:05 PM (AkOaV)

370 I left for a few hours. But I do get WSJ & I have Taranto open in Safari app. I'm using Mercury browser here.

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:05 PM (sj3Ax)

371 According to the Koran, Jesus was a prophet but NOT the Son of God.

So they pay lip-service to him and ignore all of His teachings.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:05 PM (1ijHg)

372 Back to the desert.

Posted by: Onlooker at December 08, 2015 09:05 PM (+f7nz)

373 TRUMP: I'm calling very simply for a shutdown of Muslims entering the
United States -- and here's a key -- until our country's representatives
can figure out what is going on.

A relevant detail you all might want to actually keep in mind amongst the hyperbole.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (oVJmc)

374 "All humans have an inalienable right to live in the United States."

Posted by: Illogical statements, vol iii at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (WTbmS)

375 ChemJeff

Let's change it up--what if the prisoners did not want African Americans to touch them?

I think that's rather silly. I think that would be an unreasonable demand.

What if Muslims believed African Americans should wear burqas?

They are free to BELIEVE whatever they wish. I really don't care what they BELIEVE.

Now if they wanted to FORCE blacks to wear burqas, that would be wrong.

But if they simply wished and wished for blacks or anyone else to wear burqas, then who cares?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (+4mdw)

376 Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (7egrg)
----

Oh please get this on video.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (MbrzC)

377 @ grammie:

If the ring goes missing, don't forget to check the hands of your grubby toddler grandchildren.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (0NdlF)

378 . You don't turn away otherwise qualified people just because they "look funny" or some other irrelevant group characteristic. That would be foolish.
Posted by: chemjeff
---------------

What if they smell bad?

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (9mTYi)

379 "Right now there is a case in court where female soldiers are not allowed
to perform their duties at Guantanamo because the Muslim male prisoners
believe they should not be touched by female non-relatives."

Are you serious? They're prisoners for chrissakes.

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (u9UgT)

380 Trump would have avoided controversy if he just imposed a bacon-eating test on prospective immigrants.

After all, what is more American than loving bacon???

Video related:
https://www.rt.com/news/324823-truck-driver-pork-migrants/

Posted by: Stirner at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (znBLo)

381 I think we should let in the best and brightest regardless of what faith they happen to belong to.

I don't think it is conservative to engage in group judgments and engage in punishment of thoughtcrime.
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:45 PM (+4mdw)

You just engaged in a group judgment based on intelligence. The best and brightest should be let in. Who cares if they have the beliefs of Mengele as long as they don't act on them.

You keep ignoring the point that Islam has serious belief problems that do not work in this country. Just saying they have to act on them is a dodge that means nothing. History is replete with examples of a critical mass of a minority culture causing changes in the majority culture.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (LTDSy)

382 So it's OK for them to prohibit Christians in their country, but we
should allow people who openly admit that they have no allegiance to
America and actively want sharia law here in defiance of our own laws
and traditions?

I'm sorry, but that just doesn't make sense in any way.

I never said it was "okay" for them to prohibit Christians.

Although, if we prohibited Muslims, what would be our argument against them prohibiting Christians? Tit for tat, no?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (+4mdw)

383 362...
I'd go downtown an collect Hobo scat off the sidewalk and put it in their car trunk....

Posted by: Judas Washington at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (hCdMd)

384 Because the Left oppresses Christian cake bakers, that gives the Right free license to oppress non-terrorist Muslims?

Not letting people into our country = oppression

Yeah, I think this conversation has run its course.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (ZbV+0)

385 "Saying that what they do is wrong and then emulating it exactly makes even less sense."

Emulating it? No emulating it would be taking over their countries, slaughtering half their people, and forcing them to convert or die.

Telling them to stay in their own damn hell hole is self preservation, and something we've done several times before when a group of people have gotten frisky.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (Kqit+)

386 You don't turn away otherwise qualified people just because they "look
funny" or some other irrelevant group characteristic. That would be
foolish.

America here we come!

Posted by: Non -Terrorist Nazis - 1941 at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (hudka)

387 I am wholeheartedly opposed to the proposed moratorium on all immigration.

My compromise? Single females, ages 18 - 35, with preference granted East Asian and Indian applicants.

I'll vet them, personally.....

:-)

Posted by: Kaspar Gutman at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (lutOX)

388 >>TRUMP: I'm calling very simply for a shutdown of Muslims entering the
United States -- and here's a key -- until our country's representatives
can figure out what is going on.

>>A relevant detail you all might want to actually keep in mind amongst the hyperbole.

Not that I disagree with Trump on this one, but exactly what have our country's representatives figured out about anything lately?

Posted by: JackStraw at December 08, 2015 09:09 PM (/tuJf)

389

So many opportunities for the GOP, so many lost...

We know the left are constantly looking for squirrels and distractions and aggrieved and horrified!

And the GOP, in what they perceived as their chance to "get him!" have tossed more logs on the bonfire.

Dumb and dumber.

When the WH says some gibberish about "the president takes an oath to follow the Constitution" where were the GOP pointing out time and again where the JEF hasn't?

When this current administration, including Hillary have failed to protect Americans, where were the GOP pointing out how, reminding Americans of Benghazi, Bergdahl, and the latest terror attack and all of the facts so far pointing to absolute incompetence?

hoo-boy

The GOPe, as usual, making themselves look like asses. Including Paul Ryan's ridiculous sorta beard, which made him look like a funny man coming out to address the nation.

What can the GOP get right? Nothing.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 08, 2015 09:09 PM (qCMvj)

390 Dumb bint AB Stoddard mumbled "unconstitutional" a few times in her long rant during Fox News' Special Report panel, with the usually-bright Shannon Bream letting it go unchallenged.

Ace proven right, twice.

Posted by: the littl shyning man at December 08, 2015 09:09 PM (u6BGz)

391 Ummm,

We had to do the credit card swipe with male detainees whenever we picked them up or dropped them off.

Ugh.

Wish I could have gotten away with the whole "can't search them cause I'm a chick" gambit.

Posted by: SMFH at December 08, 2015 09:09 PM (zyIlW)

392 Not letting people into our country = oppression

That is why in the next World War, the US should lend the enemy transports to move their soldiers into our country.

Wouldn't want to oppress any enemy soldiers, now.

Better give them citizenship and welfare while we're at it.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:10 PM (0NdlF)

393 Look at the thousands of kiddie rapes that occur in
the UK and that the powers that be turned a blind eye to. How effin sick
can you get???

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (iQIUe)

The had a few years running in Sweden where 100% all rapes were by ME immigrants.... Just proving Swedish women are racists.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 09:10 PM (T78UI)

394 "You don't turn away otherwise qualified people just because they "look funny""

If someone stated in his application that he believed I should be killed, you're damn right I'd throw that application into the trash can. Not dying is not arbitrary.

I would like my 5 children to live in Mad Max world, thank you very much.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:10 PM (Kqit+)

395
If the ring goes missing, don't forget to check the hands of your grubby toddler grandchildren.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (0NdlF)
===================================================

Would not surprise me one bit if they fed it to the Great Dane.

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 09:10 PM (dFi94)

396 Chemjeff

It's not as if we're demanding they change their beliefs and get baptized a Christian to be allowed in. "We've" determined that the risk to us by those believers is sufficiently high that we won't allow them into the country. They're free to go elsewhere and believe as they wish.

Posted by: J. Random Dude at December 08, 2015 09:11 PM (C9lNt)

397 If the UK bans president Trump from entering, we shd ban all brits AND go to war with them. They have no navy, no nukes, few war planes -- we could cream them!

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:11 PM (iQIUe)

398 Now if they wanted to FORCE blacks to wear burqas, that would be wrong.

Yes .

THAT. would BE .

Sort. of.

Oppressive.

Posted by: Christian Cake Bakers at December 08, 2015 09:11 PM (hudka)

399
Richard Engel*

Almost 100% of intel gathered about ISIS similar groups comes from Muslim sources. Trump is offending our allies

*NBCNews Chief Foreign Correspondent

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 08, 2015 09:11 PM (kdS6q)

400 155 CJ I heard on Rush, don't know how to true it is. But. Immigration was very curtailed 1924-1965

Thank you Killer Kennedy for changing that.

-------------------------

Immigration was halted in 1924 because the overwhelming number of immigrants (peanuts compared to today) was changing the character of the country for the worse - and these were Europeans. Constant agitation by certain groups eventually resulted in a resumption of immigration in 1965 by passage of the Hart-Cellar Act. Kennedy was just the front man. They claimed it would not change the demographics of the country. They lied.

Posted by: despair at December 08, 2015 09:11 PM (VrdxH)

401 A complete stop of immigration of Muslims after 9/11 with only the most rare and stringently screened exceptions would have been the rational policy. Trump is 14 years after the horse left the barn.

Posted by: cm9000 at December 08, 2015 09:11 PM (2TUVm)

402 The "myth" of the moderate Muslims -- you mean, the ones who do the "Islam is the religion of peace" PR while their brethren blow the infidels up.

It's a one-two sucker-punch -- lie to the infidels and then kill them.

Posted by: Dancing Queen at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (KgGd7)

403 388
You don't turn away otherwise qualified people just because they "look

funny" or some other irrelevant group characteristic. That would be

foolish.

America here we come!

Posted by: Non -Terrorist Nazis - 1941 at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (hudka)
And in point of fact we did accept quite a few German scientists in the 1940's who weren't exactly free-market capitalists.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (+4mdw)

404 Even the non-terrorist Muslims?
This is starting
to sound a lot like the pro-abortion argument of "it's okay to kill the
babies from poor moms, they would have just ended up violent criminals
anyway, better to kill them before they commit murder when they grow
up".

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (+4mdw)
A sovereign nation exists for the benefit of her citizens. Is this really hard to understand? Why are we obligated to let in foreign nationals, particularly those from a group who want to wage jihad against us?

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (u9UgT)

405 I'm in agreement with you. I guess I was talking in the overall macro-picture of the "Problem with Islam". In my opinion, the only hope for those caught in the web of islam is the freedom that comes from a relationship with Christ. I should have framed that better, rather than putting it within the bounds of immigration.
Posted by:�grammie winger
---
You didn't frame it in the bounds of immigration. I read that in gratuitously, because I've been freaking out lately in disbelief at what is going on. I apologize.

I agree with what you said 100%. The only way for Muslims to escape the toxic ideology and culture they are enslaved to would be to embrace an ethical religion like Christianity, that gives you an impossibly high standard as the ideal (and still offering hope when you fall short) rather than Islam, or Marxism, both of which elevate evil human impulses and desires into virtues. Yes, that would be their only way out.

Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (iVV84)

406 "The teacher called my employee to find out who 'Marybeth' was, to tell
her that's not what they teach about the Pilgrims in their school, and
that the principal wanted a meeting with her first thing in the morning."

In modern America, education has become indistinguishable from child abuse.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (noWW6)

407 "Almost 100% of intel gathered about ISIS similar groups comes from Muslim sources."

And 100% of it is ignored, so IDGAF.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (Kqit+)

408 Even the non-terrorist Muslims?
This is starting to sound a lot like the pro-abortion argument of "it's okay to kill the babies from poor moms, they would have just ended up violent criminals anyway, better to kill them before they commit murder when they grow up".
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:53 PM (+4mdw)

You can't tell them apart. Not when 25-33% of Muslims already in the country want Sharia law. Tell me how to reliably tell them apart? And that the government can do it competently.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (LTDSy)

409 The had a few years running in Sweden where 100% all rapes were by ME immigrants.... Just proving Swedish women are racists.

Sweden could eliminate rape overnight by passing a law stating that Swedish women always consent to sex with ME immigrants.

Imagine a country without rape ...

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (0NdlF)

410 DRUDGE HEADLINE.

RNC BREAKS PROMISE: ADDS ANOTHER DEBATE TO THWART TRUMP

NOW 2 CNN DEBATES IN 3 WEEKS!

Boom.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (oVJmc)

411

latest stats, ISIS has doubled?

pre-trump statement

who will they blame?

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (qCMvj)

412 401,

They can stop helping us anytime they want.

Fuck them.

Posted by: eman at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (MQEz6)

413
I think that's rather silly. I think that would be an unreasonable demand.

*********
Okay so when thr group is women soldiers you think we should accommodate them if it's relatively easy to do and cheap, if it's African Americans--it's silly.

Back to the burqa--it's starting to effect our screening processes I believe--it slso is a historical tool of oppression.

At some point our belief system should supersede theirs, and our freedoms and expectations of safety from the government that we pay taxes to should be paramount. Right now we have a system that didn't bother to verify the imported mass murderer's address in Pakistan.

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (mcm0N)

414 A complete stop of immigration of Muslims after 9/11 with only the most rare and stringently screened exceptions would have been the rational policy. Trump is 14 years after the horse left the barn.
Posted by: cm9000 at December 08, 2015 09:11 PM (2TUVm)

**************************

Uh, San Bernadido just happened last week, pal -- with a "lady" who was alleged vetted by our "best and brightest" for her K-1 visa.

Posted by: Dancing Queen at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (KgGd7)

415 not to defend Muslims here, but Jesus is a prophet in Islam. In fact,
when he returns after the battle at Dabiq, he will fight arm in arm with
Muhammed against the Army of Rome to give the follows of Muhammed Al
Quds (Jerusalem)

Jesus wouldn't claim any place in islam. They may lie that He's one of their prophets, but they don't acknowledge His sacrifice on behalf of our sins which makes their claim worthless in addition to baseless.

In any case it doesn't matter. Christians agree to get along with each other because we are all some manner of Christian. mohammadans have no such agreement with us and would never sincerely make one as to do so violates their core beliefs. Thus the Western (Judeo-Christian) idea of religious liberty has no application to them.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (ZbV+0)

416 Emulating it? No emulating it would be taking over their countries, slaughtering half their people, and forcing them to convert or die.

Pretty sure we've been over there doin' some killin' a couple times over the past decade or two, and now we're banning people because of the god they choose just like them, so yeah, emulating exactly.

Posted by: All Teh Meh at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (VviqM)

417 And in point of fact we did accept quite a few German scientists in the 1940's who weren't exactly free-market capitalists.
Posted by: chemjeff

Who were more than likely under surveillance at all times.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (FkBIv)

418 chemjeff,

Are you going to respond to my point that these folks are not civilized?

C'mon. They kill civilians!

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (1ijHg)

419 Right now there is a case in court where female soldiers are not allowed to perform their duties at Guantanamo because the Muslim male prisoners believe they should not be touched by female non-relatives.

What is your position on the burqa, and what is your position on women soldiers being allowed to do their jobs at Guantanamo?

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (mcm0N)

See, this is typical of the ridiculousness this country has come to. These terrorists have no standing, why do we have to put up with this shit?

You don't want women touching you, don't become a terrorist. In the meantime, you'll do as we say otherwise we'll cut your nuts off.

Posted by: Blano at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (heN73)

420 I did not know history had sides. I stand corrected.

Posted by: The Poster Formerly Known as Mr. Barky at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (4KoRb)

421 > intelligent and imaginative know a great many stupid things that aren't true.

Well, yes. It takes a lot education and a powerful imagination to become truly stupid. My best quality is that I'm not smart enough to be an idiot.

Posted by: charris at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (2hI19)

422 "335 No honest Christian considers mohammadans as part of the family, since they specifically deny Christ.
Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (ZbV+0)

not to defend Muslims here, but Jesus is a prophet in Islam. In fact, when he returns after the battle at Dabiq, he will fight arm in arm with Muhammed against the Army of Rome to give the follows of Muhammed Al Quds (Jerusalem)
Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (AkOaV)"

OK, since you don't know this, I'll explain. Christians don't regard Jesus as a prophet. Jesus is God. It's not hard, Methos was right, you're wrong.

Posted by: The Inexplicable Dr. Julius Strangepork at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (G6lch)

423 If someone stated in his application that he believed I should be
killed, you're damn right I'd throw that application into the trash can.
Not dying is not arbitrary.

Yes, if an INDIVIDUAL explicitly SAYS or affirms that he/she wants to kill Americans, then no, don't let that person is.

But that isn't the argument. The argument apparently is a *PRESUMPTION* that every Muslim is a terrorist who wants to kill Americans.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (+4mdw)

424 Let them all in. They're turning their lives around.

Posted by: U of Missou Snowflake at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (Dwehj)

425 Can I say, btw, how incredibly offensive This comparison I keep seeing between Jewish refugees in WWII and Muslim immigrants now is? I mean, just insanely so.

The proper comparison is not with taking in Jews but Germans. How many Germans were we taking in WWII?

Maybe you could make the comparison with Christians and Jews in the me, but not Muslims.

Posted by: Lea at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (vmMMi)

426 "They're free to go elsewhere and believe as they wish."

Interestingly, these Muslims are NOT free to go elsewhere if "going elsewhere" means going to an Islamospheric country. The vast majority of those countries are not accepting even a single one of their purported co-religionists as immigrants.

What do they know that we don't?

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (noWW6)

427 Imagine if the GOPe cared as much about American Citizens as they do Muslim immigrants.

That would be amazing, huh?

Posted by: Duncan MacLeod, The Highlander at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (COpZ4)

428

Not that I disagree with Trump on this one, but exactly what have
our country's representatives figured out about anything lately?

Not a damn thing.

Hence the relevance of Trump's position-- it's the policy of the current government (all the parties) that is the horrendous failure we're dealing with.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 09:16 PM (oVJmc)

429 421
chemjeff,

Are you going to respond to my point that these folks are not civilized?

C'mon. They kill civilians!

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (1ijHg)
Who are "they"? Terrorist scum? Yes. All Muslims? No.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:16 PM (+4mdw)

430 "Pretty sure we've been over there doin' some killin' a couple times over the past decade or two, and now we're banning people because of the god they choose just like them, so yeah, emulating exactly."

Oh please. We weren't killing them because they were muslims, we were killing them because they were trying to kill us. I really must have stumbled into Daily Kos. Jesus.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:16 PM (Kqit+)

431 1. hundreds of young girls groomed and abused by Muslim rape gangs

2. all Swedish rapes committed by Muslims.

Two excellent examples of what happens when you embrace another culture no matter how vile.

/let's not forget, Mohammad said it's totes cool to lie to the infidel as much as you want.

Posted by: shibumi who is awaiting SMOD at December 08, 2015 09:16 PM (9JJgN)

432 Can I say, btw, how incredibly offensive This comparison I keep seeing between Jewish refugees in WWII and Muslim immigrants now is? I mean, just insanely so.

The proper comparison is not with taking in Jews but Germans. How many Germans were we taking in WWII?

Maybe you could make the comparison with Christians and Jews in the me, but not Muslims.
Posted by: Lea at De

this

its a disgusting moral equivalence

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:16 PM (zOTsN)

433 Thanks for the answer CJ I think there is more to it than that tho.
We agree to some extent. But not completely

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 09:16 PM (QdyoO)

434 "But that isn't the argument. The argument apparently is a *PRESUMPTION*
that every Muslim is a terrorist who wants to kill Americans."

I love the smell of burning straw man in the evening. Smells like sanctimony.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:16 PM (noWW6)

435 Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:06 PM (+4mdw)

simple question...

Have you read the Koran?

Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (qh617)

436 Who you gonna believe?

Me, or your lying eyes?

Posted by: President Barack Hussein Obama at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (1ijHg)

437 What do they know that we don't?
----

Word is that they don't accept immigrants because they might be terrorists.

/i am shocked, shocked i tell you!

Posted by: shibumi who is awaiting SMOD at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (9JJgN)

438 371 What if Muslims believed African Americans should wear burqas?

Any difference in how you respond or would feel about that?
Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:02 PM (mcm0N)

Arabs are incredibly racist. They enslave(d) Africans, were an intricate part of the slave trade, and IIRC, the Arabic word for "black African" and "slave" are the same word.

********

It's interesting--didn't know that.

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (mcm0N)

439 I don't know if this was linked from somewhere here on AoS or where, but I just watched it, and if you haven't seen it, I recommend you set aside 20min to watch this deeply disturbing video:

https://youtu.be/OoZwIDlIL5Q

-- and remember that this is what Obama, all the "open borders" and "unlimited immigration" folks -- in fact, almost every one of the Dems and Repubs want to bring here. Except that "clown with the weird hair."

Nothing that I didn't already know by reading about it... but I hadn't really seen it before.

Arm yourselves. And pray for our country.

Posted by: mindful webworker - whew! at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (ACs58)

440 Who was the settler lady who was attacked by indians with a bunch of other settlers. They killed most and took away others including this woman and her child who died as a result. One night as the indians slept, she grabbed one of their hatchets and started whacking them. I think she killed at least 12. Anyone remember her name?

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (iQIUe)

441 Imagine a country without rape ...
Posted by: ReactionaryMonster

I'll add that to the remastered version.

Posted by: Zombie John Lennon at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (FkBIv)

442 Instead of walking around covered in body armor to protect me from terrorism I am looking into wearing some sort of exploding suicide belt don't hatbox I am shot I will blow up and kill the terrorist
Would that be covered by the 2nd?

Posted by: Righter at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (Y6XuZ)

443 Trump's proposal for a pause in Muslim immigration "until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on"

It's the part in quotes that isn't getting reported. It's practically being reported as if he said, kick them out or throw them in camps. Of course the GOPe headed for the fainting couches first

Posted by: TheQuietMan at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (45oDG)

444 I guess that's what really separates the dumb from the smart: The dumb only know a few stupid things that aren't true, while the intelligent and imaginative know a great many stupid things that aren't true.

what's the word for agenda IQ?
smart relative to agenda goal...

AQ?

That's what your gauging.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (qCMvj)

445 Infidels Unite!!!

Posted by: scrood at December 08, 2015 09:18 PM (3b9U4)

446 The argument apparently is a *PRESUMPTION* that every Muslim is a terrorist who wants to kill Americans.

We'll drop the presumption when they stop killing us.

Until their actions speak louder than words, no dice. Our lives > their feelings.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:18 PM (0NdlF)

447 Looks like you believe in their culture of banning people based on their religion.
Posted by: All Teh Meh at December 08, 2015 08:56 PM (VviqM)

With Islam, yes I do. Sorry that you refuse to see why.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 09:18 PM (LTDSy)

448 One night as the indians slept, she grabbed one of their hatchets and started whacking them. I think she killed at least 12. Anyone remember her name?
Posted by: Bruce With a Wang!

Lizzie Borden?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 09:19 PM (FkBIv)

449 A sovereign nation exists for the benefit of her citizens. Is this really hard to understand? Why are we obligated to let in foreign nationals, particularly those from a group who want to wage jihad against us?

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (u9UgT)

Bingo.

And I say this as someone married to a permanent resident.

Who, by the way, came in legally on a K-1 visa in 2003 thoroughly vetted, face-to-face interviewed, medically examined (like they used to), is hardworking, loves this country, and despises Obama and his cronies, including the GOPe.

He'd fit right in with the Horde.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:19 PM (7egrg)

450 Trump's proposal for a pause in Muslim immigration "until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on"

It's the part in quotes that isn't getting reported. It's practically being reported as if he said, kick them out or throw them in camps. Of course the GOPe headed for the fainting couches first
Posted by: TheQuietMan at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (45oDG)

the same with the fdr quote
he ends with "and that was worse!"
but, not mentioned
even The Five got that wrong.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 08, 2015 09:19 PM (qCMvj)

451 "The argument apparently is a *PRESUMPTION* that every Muslim is a terrorist who wants to kill Americans."

Because, get this, they freely choose a religion that states that they are under obligation to kill americans.

If someone comes up to me and says "Hi, I'm Bob and I believe that you should be murdered for wearing pants, but otherwise I'm a cool dude who likes to smoke a pipe and write poetry,"I'm going to have to focus on that "I believe you should be murdered" part.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:19 PM (Kqit+)

452 >>And in point of fact we did accept quite a few German scientists in the 1940's who weren't exactly free-market capitalists.
Posted by: chemjeff

Could you point out the muslim rocket scientists that want to come here? I mean other than the Iranians who would like to send a few missiles this way.

Posted by: Aviator at December 08, 2015 09:19 PM (c7vUv)

453 Let them all in. They're turning their lives around.

Posted by: U of Missou Snowflake at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (Dwehj)
==================================================

Okay that made me laugh

Posted by: grammie winger, Isaiah 9:6 at December 08, 2015 09:19 PM (dFi94)

454 And Righter drive by poo slings another incomprehensible comment! Congrats!

Posted by: Mr. Healthy Penis at December 08, 2015 09:19 PM (LYCUN)

455 The same way you choose people to work for you in a job application process.
You
pick people who will be the right fit based on specific criteria for
the job. You don't turn away otherwise qualified people just because
they "look funny" or some other irrelevant group characteristic. That
would be foolish.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (+4mdw)

What if you are bringing them in by the wholesale lot - 10,000s at a shot, no time for a real interview.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 09:20 PM (T78UI)

456 �If the UK bans president Trump from entering, we shd ban all brits AND go to war with them. They have no navy, no nukes, few war planes -- we could cream them!
Posted by: Bruce With a Wang!
---
No. They are victims of their political class like us. We should firebomb their political centers and no go zones, and liberate Britain proper.

Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 09:20 PM (iVV84)

457 302 173 I don't care if you're a Muslim, Methodist, Hindu or atheist.,if you don't have a skill, don't read, write, speak English, we shouldn't let you in. If you are a Muslim you should be vetted so you aren't a terrorist risk. If we let you in, you don't get any welfare. I think that should help answer your question CJ on who gets in.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:28 PM (QdyoO)

Under normal circumstances, I might agree with you, but there are about 330 million people lawfully in the US, and roughly 7.6 Billion people outside who want our stuff -- and we should keep the door barred shut so long as there is a squad of idiots in Washington DC that care more about the latter than the former.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 08:55 PM (EzgxV)

Thinking further on this -- if/when we cure the "squad of idiots" problem, we should go on the warpath and RECRUIT Americans. Win a Swedish Nobel Prize, and you can be an American if you want to be.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 09:20 PM (EzgxV)

458 399
If the UK bans president Trump from entering, we shd ban all brits AND
go to war with them. They have no navy, no nukes, few war planes -- we
could cream them!

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:11 PM (iQIUe)

Instead, put up some satellites and beam Prophet Mohammad cartoons and television shows into all of their homes.

I've been working on an epileptic Prophet Mohammad routine having sex with a goat that will leave the UK's muslim population rolling in the streets....or something in the streets....

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at December 08, 2015 09:20 PM (AC0lD)

459 A sovereign nation exists for the benefit of her
citizens. Is this really hard to understand? Why are we obligated to let
in foreign nationals, particularly those from a group who want to wage
jihad against us?

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (u9UgT)
I never said we were OBLIGATED to accept Muslims just for the sake of accepting Muslims. I don't agree with that.

But I do think we are obligated to live up to our own principles. If we truly sincerely believe in a natural right of freedom of conscience, then we shouldn't be turning people away for *NO OTHER REASON* than they belong to the "wrong" religion.
If they're terrorists? Yes turn them away.
If they're shady and otherwise unverifiable? Yes turn them away out of an abundance of caution.
If they are deadbeat losers who wouldn't add anything of value to America anyway? Then yes turn them away.

But if we can verify that they are normal people with no terrorist sympathies, that we can reliably verified are not associated with terrorists in any way, who want to come here, who would be of value to America, but who just so happen to be Muslim? Then WHY NOT let them in?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (+4mdw)

460 Yo!

Posted by: Yo! at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (pX+pT)

461 You have the perps and you have the support networks.

I am just calling for a moratorium of Muslim immigration. The system is broken.

Take a pause. fix it.

btw, we don't really need immigration of low-skilled ignorant taxi drivers, do we?

chemjeff, if you are not a troll, you are doing a great job of emulating one.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (1ijHg)

462 USA Today headline: Anti-Muslim attacks on the rise

The actual story:

U.S. Muslims report more bias cases across the nation

Big difference between attacks and bias just like a big difference between perceived bias and 14 murdered people.

Posted by: TheQuietMan at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (45oDG)

463 I'm Canadian, so I won't get into fights with Americans over this - it's your country, your constitution, after all. But when I see bloggers I respect (not you, Ace, I just mean bloggers I like and have on my own little private blogroll) saying "Trump is impossible! This is unspeakable! It's unconstitutional! etc." I immediately think of something Mark Steyn wrote in August:

"Trump is saying, We're tired of being told reasons why you can't do things. His immigration plan -- people keep coming up with this thing, Sean, Oh, no, it would require constitutional amendments, it's pie in the sky, it can't be done, nothing can be done, nothing can ever be done."

And I think that's why this sort of indignant out-of-hand rejection is just falling on deaf ears. It's what people have heard from the establishment. It's ALL people ever hear from the establishment. They're tired of being told what can't be done, yet Trump's opponents never seem to be tired of listing the things they can't do.

Posted by: Dr. Mabuse at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (gjLib)

464 The argument apparently is a *PRESUMPTION* that every Muslim is a terrorist who wants to kill Americans.

In a word, "Yes."

Survival does not require idealistic, idiotic compassion for the creature trying to eat you.

Posted by: Mortimer at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (hudka)

465 1) The authorities are completely incapable of vetting people effectively.

2) Say only 1% of Muslims are 'radicalized.'

Given #1, how do you detect the percentage in #2?

You can't.

So you either consider a certain number of your fellows expendable, a la Scott Adams, or you have a moratorium until you can make #1 reasonably effective.

You certainly don't compound the problem by a factor of four, five, or ten.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (oVJmc)

466 The 9/11 terrorist came here on visas.

But let them all in -- don't want to be called racist -- to hell with national security.

Posted by: Dancing Queen at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (KgGd7)

467 >> think she killed at least 12. Anyone remember her name?

Hannah Dustin.
(I'm a distant relative)

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (NOIQH)

468
What if you are bringing them in by the wholesale lot - 10,000s at a shot, no time for a real interview.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 09:20 PM (T78UI)
Well that is stupid. Don't do that.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (+4mdw)

469 The GOPe field is so hapless and opportunistic and desperate save Cruz. Disappointed to see Carly join in the pile on. Every time the MFM and Dims declare that Trump said something outrageous that disqualifies him, the GOPe all run to the microphones hoping this will their moment to shine and knock him out of the race. It's stupid and reflexive and unthinking, and all they do is help Trump with their idiot parade.

Posted by: L, Elle at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (2x3L+)

470 We definitely should not increase immigration from majority Muslim countries and even greatly reduce the number now allowed but a total ban is counter productive in the global war we are fighting. Both in perception and practicality.

Posted by: Max Rockatansky at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (iRZl4)

471 "but who just so happen to be Muslim? Then WHY NOT let them in?"

Because being muslim is not an immutable quality. It is a chosen identity.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (Kqit+)

472 They did a great job finding out about sugar tits Malik.

Posted by: Mr. Healthy Penis at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (LYCUN)

473 But if we can verify that they are normal people with no terrorist
sympathies, that we can reliably verified are not associated with
terrorists in any way

We got this.

Posted by: TSA at December 08, 2015 09:23 PM (hudka)

474 The same way you choose people to work for you in a job application process.
You
pick people who will be the right fit based on specific criteria for
the job. You don't turn away otherwise qualified people just because
they "look funny" or some other irrelevant group characteristic. That
would be foolish.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:03 PM (+4mdw)

Actually.... totally untrue.

for any job that interacts with the public, you always have appearance and mannerisms taken into account when hiring... because they are the 'face' of your company.

Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:23 PM (qh617)

475 With regard to Arab Muslims and the black African slave trade, let's remember here that Saudi Arabia -- the tap-root Islamic country where the House of Saud bill themselves as the "guardians of the two holy places" of Mecca and Medina -- quite openly and unapologetically practiced slavery of black Africans until the _nineteen-sixties_.

That wasn't Jim Crow. That was outright chattel slavery wherein black Africans were casually bought, sold, and treated like farm animals.

By the way, where *are* the descendants of the enormous numbers of black Africans who were brought as slaves into the Arab states? There don't seem to be any noticeable numbers of African blacks there these days. Quite the three-pipe problem, Watson.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:23 PM (noWW6)

476
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannah_Duston

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:23 PM (iQIUe)

477 But if we can verify that they are normal people with no terrorist sympathies, that we can reliably verified are not associated with terrorists in any way, who want to come here, who would be of value to America, but who just so happen to be Muslim? Then WHY NOT let them in?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (+4mdw)

suspend immigration not based on religion but on country of origin, just like Carter did with Iran

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:24 PM (zOTsN)

478 Mindful Webworker,
Thank you for link. I have it open in a new tab.

Horde,
Behave tonight or Maetenloch might shut down ONT again.

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:24 PM (sj3Ax)

479 "They're not going to beat him this way."

But they can't stop themselves. They don't know another way. That's why this is like watching a cat play with a wind-up toy.

Posted by: rrpjr at December 08, 2015 09:24 PM (s/yC1)

480 These political and media types are literally more upset about Trump's comments than they were with the dead bodies in San Bernadino.

Posted by: Duncan MacLeod, The Highlander at December 08, 2015 09:24 PM (COpZ4)

481 The Saudi s have imported black Africans for centuries, yet all the Saudis today are white.......

Hmmm, where did the Africans go?

Posted by: Yo! at December 08, 2015 09:24 PM (pX+pT)

482 I think we should be respectful of other people's faiths to the largest extent possible. I don't know enough about that particular case, but if the prisoner's demands are unreasonable, then no, don't accommodate them, but if the prisoner's demands are reasonable and don't require so much expense and trouble on our part, then I think we should accommodate them.
I don't think any free person should be forced to wear any article of clothing that they haven't freely chosen to wear themselves. I can't control what Saudi Arabia's government does but I would not want our government forcing adults to wear burqas, of course

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:57 PM (+4mdw)

Fuck the prisoners. They should have no rights to anything. That includes their piece of shit religion.

Do what we say motherfuckers or we cut your nuts off and let you die a painful, horrible death.

You don't want to be touched by foreign women, don't become a terrorist.

Posted by: Blano at December 08, 2015 09:24 PM (heN73)

483 If we hurt their feelings they will be mean to us. And stuff.

Posted by: U of Missou Snowflake at December 08, 2015 09:25 PM (Dwehj)

484 But that isn't the argument. The argument apparently
is a *PRESUMPTION* that every Muslim is a terrorist who wants to kill
Americans.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (+4mdw)

How do you tell the difference between those who will one day jihad you and those who won't?

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:25 PM (u9UgT)

485 "The GOPe field is so hapless and opportunistic and desperate save Cruz. Disappointed to see Carly join in the pile on."

The fawning speech which Fiascorina delivered while she was running HP into the ground, the one in which she praised to the high heavens the many civilizational virtues of Islam, makes for interesting reading.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (noWW6)

486 " The 9/11 terrorist came here on visas. "

And the Boston Bomber family were asylum seekers.

And Nidal Hasan's parents were immigrants.

And the Jihadi Wife was a visa holder.

And that really highlights part of the problem. Even if the first generation doesn't go splodey, the second still might.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (Kqit+)

487 >>But that isn't the argument. The argument apparently is a *PRESUMPTION* that every Muslim is a terrorist who wants to kill Americans.

C'mon, I'm somewhat sympathetic to your argument although I mostly disagree but that's not the argument of people who disagree with you. The fact is that Islam is a much more than a religion, it is religion, politics, family, it is an entire way of life. Go to any Muslim country and I guarantee you will feel as if you stick out because you are western, because you do.

What it is is not presumption but the unknown. We simply do not know what is causing an increasing number of Muslim to go full jihadi, and that includes Farook who apparently was very westernized and at some point while he was here want mass murderer.

If you can tell me which Muslims will go hardcore and which won't then I would buy your argument because then banning a whole class would be discrimination. But you can't. Nobody seems to be able to and we aren't getting the kind of help from the Muslim community we need.

At this point, while we are fighting Islamic nuts who are trying to infiltrate this country posed as Muslim refugees at absolutely makes sense to pause Muslim immigration to the US.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (/tuJf)

488 Exactly torquewrench
Let Iran take them. They are one of the players to blame in Syria

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (gmP76)

489 Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (+4mdw)

So... should we let people in who have publically supported the violent overthrow of the US Government???

Would that be grounds for not letting them emigrate to this country???

Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (qh617)

490 chemjeff has set his heart. Words will not change his mind.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (0NdlF)

491 suspend immigration not based on religion but on country of origin, just like Carter did with Iran

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:24 PM (zOTsN)
I would have much less of a problem with that.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (+4mdw)

492 470 >> think she killed at least 12. Anyone remember her name?

Hannah Dustin.
(I'm a distant relative)

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (NOIQH)

That's her. My ex-husband is directly descended from her.

She was one brave lady.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (7egrg)

493
Ha. Hamas bashes Trump saying that islam is a religion of peace and opposes bloodshed.

They actually said that.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 08, 2015 09:27 PM (ODxAs)

494
Next debate. Trump calls Obama a "pussy". Gets suspended by the RNC for two weeks.

Posted by: Raspail at December 08, 2015 09:27 PM (QolCq)

495
So... should we let people in who have publically supported the violent overthrow of the US Government???

Would that be grounds for not letting them emigrate to this country???

Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (qh617)
Of course. Because that *individual* has publicly stated his/her clear intentions.

But that is not what is being discussed.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:27 PM (+4mdw)

496 But if we can verify that they are normal people
with no terrorist sympathies, that we can reliably verified are not
associated with terrorists in any way, who want to come here, who would
be of value to America, but who just so happen to be Muslim? Then WHY
NOT let them in?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (+4mdw)

We cant verify it. When Muslim nations start practicing religious tolerance and pluralism I will be open to reciprocal immigration.

Posted by: cm9000 at December 08, 2015 09:27 PM (2TUVm)

497 422 Right now there is a case in court where female soldiers are not allowed to perform their duties at Guantanamo because the Muslim male prisoners believe they should not be touched by female non-relatives.

What is your position on the burqa, and what is your position on women soldiers being allowed to do their jobs at Guantanamo?

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 08:52 PM (mcm0N)

See, this is typical of the ridiculousness this country has come to. These terrorists have no standing, why do we have to put up with this shit?

You don't want women touching you, don't become a terrorist. In the meantime, you'll do as we say otherwise we'll cut your nuts off.
Posted by: Blano at December 08, 2015 09:14 PM (heN73)

**************

See this could ts to the chase--so to speak. Oh, yeah.

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (mcm0N)

498 The GOPe field is so hapless and opportunistic and desperate save Cruz. Disappointed to see Carly join in the pile on. Every time the MFM and Dims declare that Trump said something outrageous that disqualifies him, the GOPe all run to the microphones hoping this will their moment to shine and knock him out of the race. It's stupid and reflexive and unthinking, and all they do is help Trump with their idiot parade.
Posted by: L, Elle at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (2x3L+)

yep, Cruz refused to comment on it

love him

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (qCMvj)

499 462,

Because, chemjeff, they carry the Islam virus.

Posted by: eman at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (MQEz6)

500 A related and-to me-and interesting article:

"Do Muslims and Christians worship the same God.? " by Douglas Groothius. For those that don't want to read the entire article, I would direct you to the final couple of paragraphs or so-Thy have a completely different understanding of who God is, who Jesus is and the meaning of worship and mission. So although both religions are monotheistic, no they don't worship the same God,

http://preview.tinyurl.com/p5x3y6t

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (No/ki)

501 not to defend Muslims here, but Jesus is a prophet in Islam. In fact, when he returns after the battle at Dabiq, he will fight arm in arm with Muhammed against the Army of Rome to give the follows of Muhammed Al Quds (Jerusalem)

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (AkOaV)

Muslims deny Christ is the Son of God. He's just another decent guy to them. That's why they're not part of the Christian "family."

Posted by: Blano at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (heN73)

502 You know where this leads, after they get themselves all in a lather about racism ... Trump checkmating them saying: Why do we have ANY immigration with 93M Americans out of the workforce?

He's tying Immigration (Republican Base) to Terrorism (National Security, a Hilary weakness) to Black and Blue Collar Unemployment (a Democratic Base). That formula equals a landslide.

Posted by: Jean at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (fBkaR)

503 Of course. Because that *individual* has publicly stated his/her clear intentions.

Muslims by their choice of religion have stated their clear intentions.

Islam is not compatible with America.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (0NdlF)

504 I posted this earlier but some people would rather be dead than be rude

Posted by: Yo! at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (pX+pT)

505 The entire media establishment (including Fox news) has now decided (wrongly) that Trump's proposal, if enacted, would be unconstitutional.

WTF is wrong with these people.

Posted by: Stay out da bushes at December 08, 2015 09:29 PM (yioUz)

506 *cuts* to the chase. Damn autocorrect.

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:29 PM (mcm0N)

507 I've been thinking about this from a different angle: usually, when there's a terrorist attack, it's *us* who get the lectures on tolerance, the insistence that we change our ways to prove we're not bigots, and have new burdens such as tightened TSA checks/additional carry-on prohibitions or pressure for more gun control, etc.. For extra fun, CAIR and the usual suspects take the opportunity to tell us how we're bad (like critique of ME policies).

With Trump's suggestion, regardless of what you think of it, it puts the burden back on the community in which the terrorists came from --- instead of us. So it puts pressure on *them* to do something about the worst elements withing their religion/culture, instead of os us/the victim's religion/culture.
It makes sense in that it punishes (for lack of a better word) the source of the attack instead of the victims.

Posted by: Lizzy at December 08, 2015 09:29 PM (NOIQH)

508 Ha. Hamas bashes Trump saying that islam is a religion of peace and opposes bloodshed.

Hamas agrees with Hillary, the Democratic party, George W Bush, and the GoPe.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:29 PM (0NdlF)

509
I think we should let in the best and brightest regardless of what faith they happen to belong to.

Except that we AREN'T importing the best and brightest from ANY nation or region. Almost everyone we're importing are cab drivers, janitors, strawberry pickers, dishwashers, auto detailers etc. The fact that mohammedans also adhere to a disproportionately dangerous ideology is just the icing on the cake.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (o98Jz)

510 "How do you tell the difference between those who will one day jihad you and those who won't?"

Sometimes there are obvious warning signs.

It's a permanent blot on the honor of the U.S. Army that an obvious jihadi time bomb like Nidal Hasan wasn't dealt with before his mass-murdering terror rampage. He had a long list of obvious tells.

But in the majority of cases of Sudden Jihadi Syndrome, there are no obvious symptoms before the screamed "Allah akbar" and the murderous attack.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (noWW6)

511 Buck Sexton is saying how wrong Trump is, because this singles out all Muslims, while some are good. How this plays into the other side's narrative ...

But Trump states he has Muslim friends that are fine friends. All Muslim citizens are still treated as citizens, except for more scrutiny on some mosques. Trump specifically states the issue is inability to discern which foreigners are abusing our very weak vetting system.

Buck worked in the CIA I guess, counter terror stuff, so is claiming higher ground it seems. He gets that Islam is distinct in its problems for US ... yet he stands with some ideal, that we can't insult them by blocking all new Muslim immigrants ... just because we KNOW a certain percentage will kill a lot of us.

We get it Buck ... bigotry offends them, but sneaking bombers in KILLS US. And it is NOT bigotry, it is a pause till we get accurate ways to vet them, and even then it may be a overall pause for all immigration. But for the moment the main profile we have is that the are Muslim.

The idea of why we need to diversify the country is valid but separate from this terror issue. But the idea we have to let some terrorists in to prove we would rather let Americans die than offend a few wannabe refugees, or Islamic states that offer us no equal treatment, is crazy. "Open Immigration to all cultures" is not who we are.

Posted by: Illiniwek at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (26Yu7)

512 for any job that interacts with the public, you always have appearance and mannerisms taken into account when hiring... because they are the 'face' of your company.
Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:23 PM (qh617)

------------------
Not anymore. Woman hair salon owner was fined big time in the UK bc she told iterviewee she cd not wear that hijab or what ever bc it was important to demo new styles.

In the US abercromie and finch got sued for not hiring a burka bag.

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (iQIUe)

513 472 The GOPe field is so hapless and opportunistic and desperate save Cruz. Disappointed to see Carly join in the pile on.

Posted by: L, Elle at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (2x3L+)

After her attack on Trump's statements last night, she's a complete deal breaker.

had to turn the TV off, we were getting so angry at her.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (7egrg)

514 Trump tweeted out a poll today showing that 68% of his supporters would still vote for him as a third party candidate.

I think that was intended as a shot across the bow of the GOPe to chill out on their criticism of him......or else.

Posted by: Stay out da Bushes at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (yioUz)

I've seen this movie before. Irascible, outspoken billionaire goes third party, bleeds just enough votes to swing the election to a Clinton, claims there are Vietnamese black ops commandos prowling around his front porch...

Spoiler alert: It ended with a chubby intern on her knees in the Oval Office, servicing the newly elected President, so we've got that to look forward to.

Posted by: troyriser at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (Au69S)

515

so

suspend immigration from Syria, Libya, Jordan, Tunisia, Morrocco, Egypt, Turkey, Iraq, Iran, Afghanastan, Pakistan, Indonesia, Malaysia, Nigeria, Sudan, Somalia, Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Kuwait, Chechnia, Bosnia and North Korea

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (zOTsN)

516 The entire media establishment (including Fox news) has now decided (wrongly) that Trump's proposal, if enacted, would be unconstitutional.

WTF is wrong with these people.
Posted by: Stay out da bushes at December 08, 2015 09:29 PM (yioUz)

and they can't find it in the Constitution

it's in some stupid UN international "humane" bs treaty we signed according to some who shall not be named, but I call *cough*BS*cough* on the UN in general.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 08, 2015 09:31 PM (qCMvj)

517 Carly said Mittens urged her to run, which means she's GOPe.

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:31 PM (sj3Ax)

518
Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (qh617)
Of course. Because that *individual* has publicly stated his/her clear intentions.

But that is not what is being discussed.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:27 PM (+4mdw)

No, that is EXACTLY what is being discussed.

When they self identify as Moslem, they self identify as believing that the US Governments Constitution should be replaced by Sharia Law.

Its a BASE belief of Islam... its the GOAL of Islam.

Ergo, they are, by identifying as part of that religion, saying they support the overthrow of the US system of Government...

Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:31 PM (qh617)

519 Trump is the new hire on the Washington Generals. He just came out and slam dunked on the Globetrotters, and everyone on the court is all like "we don't do that here". Well guess what, we do now. A lot of fans are starved for an actual game, and it looks like the starting whistle just blew.

/"Trump for President: Because what could he do, fuck it up?"

Posted by: SaltyDonnie at December 08, 2015 09:31 PM (zBwYh)

520 "I would have much less of a problem with that."

So we should damn Christians and Yazidis so that we don't feel mean? No, sorry, that isn't better at all.

I will support it because I value my children's safety above any other group (although I volunteer with a Yazidi organization) but it is a worse option that simply banning those who are actually threatening us.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:31 PM (Kqit+)

521 Maybe because he calls them "Muslims" and not by the country... makes people crazy.

Posted by: petunia at December 08, 2015 08:03 PM (VoCyE)

Well, there are crazy jihadi/supremacist muslims in any country that has muslims. More prevalent in the middle east perhaps, but present any place islam has a presence. Malaysia, check; Indonesia, check; Phillipines, check; France, check; Canada, check; England, check, and on ad infinitum.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 08, 2015 09:32 PM (+y3Tj)

522 Remember when the Left was frothing at the mouth over poor Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson, calling them "theocrats"? But Islam which is actually and definitively theocratic in theory and practice doesn't seem to bother them at all.

Posted by: rrpjr at December 08, 2015 09:32 PM (s/yC1)

523 ChemJeff, what is your point? Do you have one?
What would you do about an existential threat to our freedoms and our lives?

You're coming off badly tonight, like a drunken gadfly. We've (I've) been there before, but in my defense, I actually was drunk. What's your excuse?

Like I said before, lay out your plan. Enough with just asking questions and poking holes.

Posted by: OneEyedJack at December 08, 2015 09:32 PM (kKHcp)

524 If you can tell me which Muslims will go hardcore and which won't then I
would buy your argument because then banning a whole class would be
discrimination. But you can't. Nobody seems to be able to and we aren't
getting the kind of help from the Muslim community we need.

Nobody can make this claim with 100% certainty, that is an absurd burden of proof.

Nobody can claim with absolute certainty that the next devout Lutheran immigrant won't go shooting up an abortion clinic or a synagogue (for "killing Christ"). Of course the odds are very very very low. But no one can claim with 100% perfect certainty that it won't ever ever ever happen.

All we can do is evaluate people based on their prior actions and statements. The key point is to evaluate individuals based on their own merits and demerits and not engage in group judgments.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:32 PM (+4mdw)

525 We shouldn't be taking anyone in unless they have something to contribute to our country. We cannot take in every runaway from a third world country because they are poor and seeking a generous welfare state. This is not sustainable.

There is no vetting process. Until we have a thorough vetting process in place, suspend all immigration. Trump is exactly right on this.

Posted by: L, Elle at December 08, 2015 09:32 PM (2x3L+)

526 I've seen this movie before. Irascible, outspoken billionaire goes third party, bleeds just enough votes to swing the election to a Clinton, claims there are Vietnamese black ops commandos prowling around his front porch...

I'd do it in a heartbeat. The GOPe must die.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:32 PM (0NdlF)

527 But that is not what is being discussed.

In fairness, there's not a lot of discussion going on. You keep asserting something, others counter assert, and Bob's your uncle.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at December 08, 2015 09:32 PM (rwI+c)

528 Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (zOTsN)

Well done.

Send it to the Trump campaign; he needs to tighten up his position on this

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at December 08, 2015 09:32 PM (No/ki)

529 The entire media establishment (including Fox news) has now decided (wrongly) that Trump's proposal, if enacted, would be unconstitutional.

WTF is wrong with these people.
Posted by: Stay out da bushes at December 08, 2015 09:29 PM (yioUz)

and they can't find it in the Constitution

it's in some stupid UN international "humane" bs treaty we signed according to some who shall not be named, but I call *cough*BS*cough* on the UN in general.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette

So, thats like a parking ticket from a shopping mall, not even from the town.

Posted by: Jean at December 08, 2015 09:33 PM (fBkaR)

530 You're coming off badly tonight, like a drunken gadfly. We've (I've) been there before, but in my defense, I actually was drunk. What's your excuse?

The topic is triggering.

Give him time.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:33 PM (0NdlF)

531 When they self identify as Moslem, they self identify as believing that
the US Governments Constitution should be replaced by Sharia Law.

No they don't, no more so than a person who identifies as Jewish self-identifies as wanting to stone gays to death.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:33 PM (+4mdw)

532 I never said it was "okay" for them to prohibit Christians.

Although, if we prohibited Muslims, what would be our argument against them prohibiting Christians? Tit for tat, no?
Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:08 PM (+4mdw)

That's the stupid "they want us to do it" argument. Not letting in people who will want to eventually implement the same sort of society they came from is not denying our principles. It is facing the reality of the situation.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 09:33 PM (LTDSy)

533 I hate to admit this, but I have an NBC show on in Boston immediate area & I heard commercial bad mouthing Trump, Cruz, Rubio & PauL. Looked up & there was Yeb!

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:33 PM (sj3Ax)

534 "I think we should let in the best and brightest regardless of what faith they happen to belong to."

In the world shaped by the _Griggs v. Duke Power_ decision, this country is no longer applying standards for brightness.

If we were actually applying rigorous standards for brightness as part of the immigration system, there would be an incredibly long queue of Chinese to be processed before we got anywhere near any Syrians.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:34 PM (noWW6)

535 In the US abercromie and finch got sued for not hiring a burka bag.

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (iQIUe)

No, they got sued for telling the idiots WHY they didn't hire them...

It happens all the time....

Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:34 PM (qh617)

536 I live in SC and plan to vote for Cruz. but Damn! He fights!

If the GOPe keeps this up, I will vote for Trump. I disagree with him on many issues (eminent domain, Joan Rivers beating Annie Duke) but dang!

I will let Mick Mulvaney know what I think. Miss Lindsay is "dead to me." I asked him to oppose Loretta Lynch and the fucker (perhaps that should be buttfucker?) ignored my request. Well, a staffer sent me an email saying that he would consider it carefully.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:34 PM (1ijHg)

537 Well, I am a little drunk. :/ and I still have an exam to write.....

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:34 PM (+4mdw)

538 Spoiler alert: It ended with a chubby intern on her knees in the Oval
Office, servicing the newly elected President, so we've got that to look
forward to.
---
Sure it does.

If people in that circumstance waste their votes on the republican.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 09:35 PM (ZbV+0)

539 Anyone who is saying "Secure The Border" is saying the same thing Trump just said, but they're using different words.

The entire population of the world isn't 'Entitled' to the protection of the US government. Club services are for club members ONLY! The charge of racism is absurd because the US government is under no obligation to hold the 'right of access to US services' of non-Americans as equal with Americans.

They might have the same rights to 'Liberty' as Americans, but non-Americans have no right to our social welfare.

Posted by: gastorgrab at December 08, 2015 09:35 PM (u6OFe)

540 >>>>> I posted this earlier but some people would rather be dead than be rude
Posted by: Yo! at December 08, 2015 09:28 PM (pX+pT)
------
Glad you reposted it. A very succinct, solid comment.

Posted by: L, Elle at December 08, 2015 09:36 PM (2x3L+)

541 But that isn't the argument. The argument apparently
is a *PRESUMPTION* that every Muslim is a terrorist who wants to kill
Americans.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (+4mdw)

I would argue that as a whole muslims have nothing positive to contribute.
Can anyone present a positive contribution?

I will startH1-B undercutting American salaries.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 09:36 PM (T78UI)

542
OK, since you don't know this, I'll explain.
Christians don't regard Jesus as a prophet. Jesus is God. It's not
hard, Methos was right, you're wrong.

Posted by: The Inexplicable Dr. Julius Strangepork

The believing Christian (and not the cultural Christian) takes Jesus as the Son of God, Incarnate as man. He lived among us, was a teacher (called rabbi by his followers) and then was crucified by the Romans, and on the third day, resurrected, to form the New Covenant between God and Man.
By the Grace of God and the New Covenant through Jesus Christ, we are saved.

And while Jesus lived, said that there would be no prophets to follow Him (after His death). He was the final word on the New Testament (Covenant) between God and Man.
To the believing Christian, Islam is an apostasy (and to a degree, so is Mormonism, but they aren't causing that much trouble these days). Most Mormons that I have ever known were very nice people, and profess belief in Jesus as the Son of God (but also believe some other odd stuff).

Posted by: Bossy Conservative...a rube in America at December 08, 2015 09:36 PM (+1T7c)

543 I'm pretty sure that when the Founders said we should have freedom of conscience and religion, they meant any christian sect should be allowed. The idea that this meant not merely tolerating the occasional Mohammedan but using money from the public fisc to import them would have appalled them.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at December 08, 2015 09:36 PM (rwI+c)

544 Thunder B,
9:30 pm comment is perfect!

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:36 PM (sj3Ax)

545 They may not be practicing Moslems, but culturally they are moslems

Posted by: Yo! at December 08, 2015 09:37 PM (pX+pT)

546 The idea of why we need to diversify the country is valid

Just how much of the so-called "diversity" would you consider sufficient?

Posted by: Soap MacTavish at December 08, 2015 09:37 PM (Dwehj)

547 torquewrench,

By November 2009, the brass knew what kind of CiC they had on their hands, and concern over pensions took precedence over the safety of the troops. The Army did what it does best, pass the buck.

In this case, make Hasan's Ft Hood's problem instead of Walter Reed.

Can't get much more obvious than jihadi 'r us business cards and PP presentations on how to wage jihad on US Forces. But just like the neighbor that was afraid to be thought racist, thus kept silent, there's a lot of brass in DC that are infected with the "see something, say nothing" PC bug.

Yeah, a very dark splotch indeed.

Posted by: SMFH at December 08, 2015 09:37 PM (zyIlW)

548 So you remember when Trump first announced, and everybody said his kick 'em all out and make Mexico pay for it thing was spur of the moment, off the cuff, thoughtless stream of consciousness babble from a know-nothing loser?

Give or take six weeks beforehand, he said exactly the same thing in the auditorium at the Woodlands High School in the Woodlands, TX. And at the dinner at the Carlton Woods Resort immediately before his talk at the high school.

On that night, he also said the things about this admin being the worst deal makers ever. The Iran deal being the worst he'd ever seen; the releasing 5 terrorists to get back one traitor being the worst deal ever, too.

And the stuff about making China start acting right, stop undervaluing their currency, etc. also.

My point is, despite what everydamnbody said and still says, Trump was not shooting from the hip at his official announcement. He had tested his pathway at least once, in front of better than 600 people, and at least a month and a half earlier.

The people who brush him off as a clown, or lazy, or undisciplined are vastly underestimating him.

Posted by: Troll Feeder at December 08, 2015 09:37 PM (3TSlh)

549 541
Just saw Juan Ellis Bush's new ad...on NBC.

It starts with the oval office with no one behind the desk. And then it superimposes ,one by one, Trump, Cruz, and Rubio (why no Carson?) and says why each cant fill the seat.

Weak.

Posted by: Soothsayer at December 08, 2015 09:34 PM (6DKwb)

Sounds like a snoozefest.

Trump has Yeb! exactly pegged - low energy.

Apparently his advisors are too.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (7egrg)

550 "Nobody can claim with absolute certainty that the next devout Lutheran immigrant won't go shooting up an abortion clinic or a synagogue (for "killing Christ"). Of course the odds are very very very low. But no one can claim with 100% perfect certainty that it won't ever ever ever happen."

Oh my god, Jeff, stop with the moral equivalencies. It's ridiculous and below you. The Jihadi bride and groom killed more people (their coworkers who thought they were just groovy) in one day than any abortion related incident since Roe. Of those instances all but 1 have been performed by someone with documented mental health issues without any ties to the pro-life movement.

One guy, the Army of God dude, was a committed Christian who did it because he felt a moral obligation. So, yeah, if you say you belong to the Army of God THEN you may have a point.

Do you know how many people belong to the Army of God? About 7.

So stop. Just stop.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (Kqit+)

551

Trump's going to get another Free Campaign Blitz opportunity when Christmas arrives, and CAIR & CO try to take out any traces of Christmas. Nativity scenes, trees, crosses, ...

Trump will be all over this. The crowd will roar.

We're back in Rome.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (qCMvj)

552 I we going to restrict visas to people from Indonesia, Singapore and India also?

Posted by: Max Rockatansky at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (iRZl4)

553 The idea of why we need to diversify the country is valid

No it isn't.

Posted by: Grump928(C) can also assert at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (rwI+c)

554 It's a direct lift from Marxism.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (EzgxV)

It's only stolen from Marx if the speakers using aren't Marxists themselves, a fact not in evidence.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (+y3Tj)

555 429
"They're free to go elsewhere and believe as they wish."

Interestingly,
these Muslims are NOT free to go elsewhere if "going elsewhere" means
going to an Islamospheric country. The vast majority of those countries
are not accepting even a single one of their purported co-religionists
as immigrants.

What do they know that we don't?

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:15 PM (noWW6)

They could stay right where they are and fight for their country and extended families... unless they do not believe such is worth fighting for, then why would we want them

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (T78UI)

556 it's in some stupid UN international "humane" bs treaty we signed according to some who shall not be named, but I call *cough*BS*cough* on the UN in general.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 08, 2015 09:31 PM (qCMvj)
--------------------
Hmm, I wasn't aware of any treaty that would cause a problem. But, yes I agree - I couldn't give a crap about any UN treaty at this point. We're entitled to protect ourselves.

Posted by: Stay out da bushes at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (yioUz)

557 452 A sovereign nation exists for the benefit of her citizens. Is this really hard to understand? Why are we obligated to let in foreign nationals, particularly those from a group who want to wage jihad against us?

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (u9UgT)

Bingo.

And I say this as someone married to a permanent resident.

Who, by the way, came in legally on a K-1 visa in 2003 thoroughly vetted, face-to-face interviewed, medically examined (like they used to), is hardworking, loves this country, and despises Obama and his cronies, including the GOPe.

He'd fit right in with the Horde.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:19 PM (7egrg)

And we'd be totes ok with him. Maybe we should look into what we were doing right in 2003 that we aren't doing so well now.....

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (EzgxV)

558
chemjeff you are resolute in your conflation of completely different things - immigration policy and "values",security concerns and "religious liberty"(that one's a doozy).

"Religious liberty" in the US is already a hugely eroded principle and right, forreasons having nothing to do with immigrationor Islam. As you are probably aware. One might argue it's merely one toxic aspect of the destruction of the freedom of association that started (as foreseen by a few at the time) with the Civil Rights Act and its spawn. Whatever.

"Religious liberty" and our "values" aren't engaged in the tiniest way by a hypothetical pause in immigration ortourist admission based on security concerns (which would, BTW, be implemented on a country-by-country basis, not a religious one, in the very unlikely event of any such action). Yet you're upset about this non-issue.

Meanwhile, the courts and the dying civic culture are dealing hammer blows to actual values and actual religious liberty.

Posted by: rhomboid at December 08, 2015 09:39 PM (QDnY+)

559 I we going to restrict visas to people from Indonesia, Singapore and India also?

I would like to see a bidding war on this issue.

Posted by: Grump928(C) can also assert at December 08, 2015 09:39 PM (rwI+c)

560 534 When they self identify as Moslem, they self identify as believing that
the US Governments Constitution should be replaced by Sharia Law.

No they don't, no more so than a person who identifies as Jewish self-identifies as wanting to stone gays to death.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:33 PM (+4mdw)

Have you read the Koran? I have...

Have you been paying any attention at all to recent world wide events?

I don't hear Jewish Rabies preaching killing Gays...

I do hear the constant call to Jihad... and the all the deaths worldwide perpetrated by that movement.

Posted by: BB Wolf at December 08, 2015 09:39 PM (qh617)

561 It's like watching a bugs bunny cartoon.

Bugs hands Daffy a pie. Daffy thinks "great I'll hit bugs with this pie".

Except the audience can clearly see the burning fuse sticking out of the whipped cream. An just as Daffy rears back to launch the pie, it blows sky high all over Daffy.

And here I thought I wasn't going to be interested in politics any more.

Posted by: simplemind at December 08, 2015 09:39 PM (BTnAK)

562 I guess I'm pretty much the opposite, because I don't want to elect a guy who is in favor of pretty much everything Obama favors except immigration.

Single payer health? Check
Censor the internet? Check

-----------------------

Except you have no evidence of that. None.

Posted by: despair at December 08, 2015 09:39 PM (VrdxH)

563 All these public throat slittings and burnings and tossing off bldgs have to be a continuation of Islam human sacrifices. They are so retarded.

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at December 08, 2015 09:39 PM (iQIUe)

564 If people in that circumstance waste their votes on the republican

Then they deserve the next 100 years of slavery to Submission.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:39 PM (0NdlF)

565 Although, if we prohibited Muslims, what would be our argument against them prohibiting Christians?

Non-muzzies can't go alot of places in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, etc. And the other places you might get raped or killed.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 08, 2015 09:39 PM (ODxAs)

566 Trump is not a conservative. He's a venal, opportunistic rat bastard who gamed eminent domain in order to kick people out of their homes so he could build a limousine garage. He makes remarks about his own daughter laced with innuendo that would, in most social circles outside the Kardashian family, shut him out of the company of decent people. And some of you want to make him President.

Geez Louise.

Posted by: troyriser at December 08, 2015 09:40 PM (Au69S)

567 But in the majority of cases of Sudden Jihadi
Syndrome, there are no obvious symptoms before the screamed "Allah
akbar" and the murderous attack.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (noWW6)

Exactly. The false negative will kill you (quite literally).

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:40 PM (u9UgT)

568
It occurs to me that there's even a leftist justification for Trump's latest.

*puts on Che black beret*

America has angered all of the Muslim world with it's warmongering and slaughter of Muslims in Bush's War for Oil! Bad Americans!

We've made them so mad that the only way to keep the country safe is to deny ourselves the wonderful diversity of Muslim immigration because it's understandable that they'd be easy to radicalize. Just another crime that Bush's cabal committed!

*takes off Che black beret*

Now, I never said it was a GOOD or moral justification, just that one could make that case using leftist arguments.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 08, 2015 09:40 PM (o98Jz)

569 That should be *all* abortion related incidents. ALL.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:40 PM (Kqit+)

570 I don't hear Jewish Rabies preaching killing Gays...

You can tell them by their foam at the mouth.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:41 PM (0NdlF)

571 why not. to be fair, plus there are alot of muslims in india

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:41 PM (zOTsN)

572 The more Muslims are together, the more violent they become.

Really, it's for the good of the Muslims already here that we should stop importing any more. Keeps them out of trouble.

Posted by: votermom at December 08, 2015 09:41 PM (cbfNE)

573 >>All we can do is evaluate people based on their prior actions and statements. The key point is to evaluate individuals based on their own merits and demerits and not engage in group judgments.

No, that's actually not true. We can and do from time to time make very harsh judgements on whole groups of people. We call this war. And we try to kill them to our way of thinking.

If that sounds harsh it is but it's also true. And we are at war with radical Islam right now even if our president won't admit it. And we aren't calling these people Islamic, they are. It's right there in the freaking name, Islamic State. We could also toss in Muslim Brotherhood and about a gazillion splinter Islamic terror groups. Point is, Islam. And one of the tenants of Islamic fighters is to lie about being Islamic fighters. First rule of fight club and all that.

Nope, we can and should call for a temporary ban on immigration and visitation until we as a country agree that we understand and can protect our people from the threat.

Please stop making me agree with Trump.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 08, 2015 09:41 PM (/tuJf)

574 "I think we should let in the best and brightest regardless of what faith they happen to belong to."

There was a telling interview with a woman who was on a local school board up in the Northeast. Almost certainly a liberal simply due to her geographic locale and affiliation.

She was in a state of total despair over what the latest wave of mass immigration was doing to the schools which she and her fellow board members were trying to keep functional.

"Illiterate in ANY language," was the pull quote.

Remember those words the next time you hear some immigration shill start bloviating about "the best and the brightest". What we are actually getting are the worst and the stupidest.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:42 PM (noWW6)

575 And we'd be totes ok with him. Maybe we should look into what we were doing right in 2003 that we aren't doing so well now.....

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (EzgxV)

Electing a halfway decent president would be a good start.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:43 PM (7egrg)

576 We already have boundaries on our 'freedom of religion'. For instance if you decide to 'pray away the illness' rather than seek qualified medical attention for your sick child, the child may be taken away. If you keep it hidden and the child dies, you will be charged with a crime. So you have the freedom to choose this for yourself as an adult, but not for your children.

As another example, parents may not deny their child a life saving transfusion because of their belief. Conscientious objectors to killing can still be required to do a stint in public service during a draft. And as someone above noted, the cutting out of hearts during a human sacrifice ritual is greatly frowned on here.

These are restrictions and obligations we put on our own citizens. I fail to see how restricting inimical beliefs to our way of life on non-citizens wanting to come here goes against our freedom of religion.

Posted by: GnuBreed at December 08, 2015 09:43 PM (gyKtp)

577 not engage in group judgments.

Exactly.

Posted by: Nazis, Imperial Japan, Mongols, Vikings at December 08, 2015 09:43 PM (hudka)

578 To the pro-Muzz crowd here, why shouldn't we give absolute priority to evacuating Christians from the ME and Africa? If you are serious about being fair minded and compassionate, shouldn't that be your first priority?

I get how you think. You see Islamic Rage Boy, and you shudder with revulsion, as you ought. Then you think, "Oh no! I might be a bigot! We must admit unlimited numbers of them, so I can prove to myself that I'm not a bigot, even if that means endangering the lives of my fellow citizens."

Yeah, no thanks.

Posted by: Bruce Boehner at December 08, 2015 09:43 PM (iVV84)

579 Jewish rabies? It's a Zionist plot.

Posted by: Prez'nit O'Dhimmi at December 08, 2015 09:43 PM (Dwehj)

580 Jeb! is so low T. The man has to add an exclamation point to his name to excite people and generate any enthusiasm for his dull campaign. Trump had him pegged from the start and pigeonholed him and turned him into a caricature of himself. He has done that successfully with every competitor of his except Cruz. He is already setting up the same attack line with Hilary as no stamina and no strength.

Posted by: L, Elle at December 08, 2015 09:43 PM (2x3L+)

581 Remember those words the next time you hear some immigration shill start bloviating about "the best and the brightest". What we are actually getting are the worst and the stupidest.

Those could actually be their best and brightest ...

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:43 PM (0NdlF)

582 oh

and the Palestinian Authority and Gaza

no more

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:44 PM (zOTsN)

583 Cthulhu!!
Hello!!

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:44 PM (sj3Ax)

584 It's interesting--didn't know that.
Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (mcm0N)

Back in the 90's, black Muslims in the US were complaining about Arab Muslims moving in and taking over the mosques. Yeah, ignore the Islam is for everyone propaganda, and realize that Arabs are running the show.

Posted by: WOPR at December 08, 2015 09:44 PM (LTDSy)

585 "Just saw Juan Ellis Bush's new ad...on NBC. It starts with the oval office with no one behind the desk."

Just as did Obama's official address earlier this week. Hmmmmmm.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 08, 2015 09:44 PM (noWW6)

586 I we going to restrict visas to people from Indonesia, Singapore and India also?

I would like to see a bidding war on this issue.
---
If we're restricting immigration to countries without out of control mohammadan problems, I think we're pretty much going to be down to Israel, Poland, and Russia.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 09:44 PM (ZbV+0)

587 To the pro-Muzz crowd here

chemjeff by his lonesome is not a crowd.

Kudos for sticking to your guns, but it doesn't matter.

Keeping out Muslims is the most peaceful solution. Bringing them here and then killing them is the most bloody one.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:45 PM (0NdlF)

588 Stop all this talk about terrorism it is making me poop in my pants
Stop it

Posted by: Righter at December 08, 2015 09:45 PM (Y6XuZ)

589
Wouldn't vote for Trump, but I am glad he brings up issues that most people in America identify with, despite what the politicians and the media tell us should be our values or thoughts. Its why he is popular right now.

That said, I think hillary will win going away if he is the nominee.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 08, 2015 09:45 PM (ODxAs)

590 576 The more Muslims are together, the more violent they become.

Really, it's for the good of the Muslims already here that we should stop importing any more. Keeps them out of trouble.

Posted by: votermom at December 08, 2015 09:41 PM (cbfNE)

Okay, that made me laugh

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:45 PM (7egrg)

591 A quick and dirty precis of Professor Carlo Cipolla's Theory on Stupidity (with a link at the end - Warning, Math and charts may be present)

When most of a society is stupid, then the prevalence of idiots becomes dominant and incurable

Facts:

1. the stupid harm society as a whole;

2. stupid people in power do more damage than others;

3. the stupid uses democratic elections to maintain the high percentage of stupid people in power;

4. fools are more dangerous than bandits because reasonable people can understand the logic of bandits;

5. reasonable people are vulnerable by the fools because:

* Are usually surprised by the attack;

* Can not organize a rational defense because the attack has no rational structure.

First Law

Always and inevitably everyone underestimates the number of stupid individuals in circulation:

a) people that we believe are rational and intelligent suddenly appear to be stupid beyond doubt;

b) day after day, we are affected in everything we do by stupid people who invariably appear in the most inconvenient places.

Second Law

The probability that a certain person be stupid is independent of any other characteristic of that person, as he often looks innocuous / naive, and makes you lower the guard.

Third Law

A stupid person is one who causes harm to another person or group of persons while deriving no gain himself and even possibly incurring a loss.

Fourth Law

Non-stupid people always underestimate the damaging power of stupid people. Constantly forget that at any time and under any circumstances, treat and / or associate with stupid people infallibly proves to be a costly mistake.

Fifth Law

The stupid person is the most dangerous type of person that exists.

Livraghi Corollary to the First Law of Cipolla

In each of us there is a factor of stupidity, which is always bigger than we suppose.

http://preview.tinyurl.com/cipolla-stupidity

Posted by: Kindltot at December 08, 2015 09:46 PM (q2o38)

592 chemjeff,

who are you and what did you do with chemjeff?

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:46 PM (1ijHg)

593 If we're restricting immigration to countries without out of control mohammadan problems, I think we're pretty much going to be down to Israel, Poland, and Russia.
Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 09:44 PM (ZbV+0)

Didn't China apply flamethrowers to domestic Islamic terrorists?

Harder for most 'Rons to fit in. But hey, they might luv you looooong time.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:47 PM (0NdlF)

594 Megyn has Huma on to get the benefit of her deep thoughts on Trump

isnt that an in kind contribution

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:47 PM (zOTsN)

595 There are no above ground churches in Saudi

None

Posted by: Yo! at December 08, 2015 09:47 PM (pX+pT)

596 I would prefer Cruz, not Trump. The man is brilliant.
My roommate ( after fear of being homeless when he'd tell me Clinton is next president) loves Trump. This afternoon he came home pissed off at Trump's latest screaming.

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:48 PM (sj3Ax)

597 who are you and what did you do with chemjeff?

Check the basement for pods.

Posted by: Grump928(C) can also assert at December 08, 2015 09:48 PM (rwI+c)

598 No they don't, no more so than a person who identifies as Jewish self-identifies as wanting to stone gays to death.

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:33 PM (+4mdw)

My son married into a Jewish family. Son and daughter gay.
WTF?

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:48 PM (1ijHg)

599 If people in that circumstance waste their votes on the republican.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 09:35 PM (ZbV+0)

Your response makes no sense at all but I guess you felt driven to respond somehow, some way. I saw the same thing every election cycle when Ron Paul was running. Credit where it's due, that old man is sincere in his screwed-up beliefs. Ron Paul is a crank, sure, but he's a principled crank. Can't say the same for Trump.

Posted by: troyriser at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (Au69S)

600 Those could actually be their best and brightest ...

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:43 PM (0NdlF)
Heh heh.

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (u9UgT)

601 Why is it always all or nothing at this joint ? No one wants to admit there is a place for nuance anymore since the ridicule given to that meme a few years ago.

Posted by: Max Rockatansky at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (iRZl4)

602 ONT up. Have fun, Horde.

Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (0NdlF)

603 496
Ha. Hamas bashes Trump saying that islam is a religion of peace and opposes bloodshed.
They actually said that.

GOPe and Hamas, a match made in heaven.

Posted by: Cousin Vinny at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (o9lmn)

604 not my son. not the daughter he married. Her brother and sister.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (1ijHg)

605 Grammie,

Congrats and you will have great fun! I had the world's cheapest wedding this summer (seriously, I bought some stuff out of the Dollar Store and got a sheet cake for the wedding cake). It was a blast.

Still haven't done the name changie thing, so got to get that taken care of. You forget about details like that.

Posted by: notsothoreau at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (5HBd1)

606 Back in the 90's, black Muslims in the US were complaining about Arab Muslims moving in and taking over the mosques.

Don't the Arab Muslims believe the blacks to not be "real" Muslims?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (FkBIv)

607 598 Megyn has Huma on to get the benefit of her deep thoughts on Trump

isnt that an in kind contribution

Posted by: ThunderB at December 08, 2015 09:47 PM (zOTsN)

HUMA WEINER? You're not kidding, are you?

OK, THAT'S IT!

No more Megyn Kelley on our TVs.

She's gone over to the dark side for sure.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:50 PM (7egrg)

608 I'd settle for banning muslims from the white house.
That ship has, unfortunately, sailed.

Posted by: navybrat at December 08, 2015 09:50 PM (Xodlv)

609 It certainly doesn't seem unreasonable to me to put a moratorium on Muslim immigration until our INS can tell us to our satisfaction how the vetting of Bonnie and Clyde Farook went so cosmically wrong, and what they're going to do to fix it.

Posted by: Socratease at December 08, 2015 09:50 PM (2GbWn)

610
I feel confident in stating that another muslim terror attack will happen here and once again the same people will say the same thing with their apologetics to muslims.

Never ever are the muslims told to go to a synogauge and/or a church and apologize for the terror in their name. It is here, it is in Europe and around the world where the politicians and leftists do this. F that, its time to start calling a spade a spade and a terrorist a terrorist.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 08, 2015 09:51 PM (ODxAs)

611 Trump is Edison and the GOP is Topsy
http://tinyurl.com/hp4qfxe
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topsy_%28elephant%29

Posted by: Judas Washington at December 08, 2015 09:52 PM (hCdMd)

612 There's also this about burqas not only do they put them on gals at a relatively young age but now there is anall girls school associated with the Red Mosque in Pakistan that has produced a video allegiance to ISIS.

In the current war ISIS has strapped suicide vests on mentally disabled young girls wearing burqas and sent them into police stations in Iraq to blow up.

It is hard to identify women in burqas and then on top of all that--as a point of interest--during the Pakistani army raid on the Red Mosque this happened:

Following the fourth deadline, Abdul Aziz was captured trying to escape disguised as a woman wearing a burqa.
Following the capture of this leader, about 800 male students and 400 female students of Jamia Hafsa surrendered to the authorities.

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:52 PM (mcm0N)

613 474
"but who just so happen to be Muslim? Then WHY NOT let them in?"

Because being muslim is not an immutable quality. It is a chosen identity.

Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (Kqit+)

Not Immutable. An identity. That is where it is at.
Religion? Maybe. But it is not American to recognize an establishment of religion.
An ideology.
The culture adds nothing and as a whole should not be admitted.
It is this political correctness of referring to culture as 'religion' that is causing self-harm.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2015 09:52 PM (T78UI)

614 Ok, to stop accusations of bigotry, how about we just put a moratorium on ALL immigration?
Problem solved.

Posted by: votermom at December 08, 2015 09:53 PM (cbfNE)

615 They hate Trump because he told them there was catshit on the linoleum. Of course they already knew that, but were not brave enough to say themselves. They think the mohamadans will kill them last. Silly bastards.

Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2015 09:53 PM (b+df9)

616 I wonder how close we are to the Cruz/Trump alliance? A 3rd party tidal wave? Both are the smartest guys in the room...somethings up.

Posted by: IdahoMatt at December 08, 2015 09:53 PM (SgYQy)

617 462 A sovereign nation exists for the benefit of her
citizens. Is this really hard to understand? Why are we obligated to let
in foreign nationals, particularly those from a group who want to wage
jihad against us?

Posted by: Titanium at December 08, 2015 09:12 PM (u9UgT)
I never said we were OBLIGATED to accept Muslims just for the sake of accepting Muslims. I don't agree with that.

But I do think we are obligated to live up to our own principles. If we truly sincerely believe in a natural right of freedom of conscience, then we shouldn't be turning people away for *NO OTHER REASON* than they belong to the "wrong" religion.
If they're terrorists? Yes turn them away.
If they're shady and otherwise unverifiable? Yes turn them away out of an abundance of caution.
If they are deadbeat losers who wouldn't add anything of value to America anyway? Then yes turn them away.

But if we can verify that they are normal people with no terrorist sympathies, that we can reliably verified are not associated with terrorists in any way, who want to come here, who would be of value to America, but who just so happen to be Muslim? Then WHY NOT let them in?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 09:21 PM (+4mdw)

Because there is a religious Islam that thoughtfully contemplates the relationship of God and Man (somewhat like Sufism); and there is a political Islam which vigorously enforces a code of conduct for purportedly religious reasons (shariah) -- and, further, rejects other forms of law (shariah) and morality (taqiyya).

The last is what is seriously objected to by people tired of immigrants blowing-up people or stuff here, in this country.

The problem is that our authorities and experts have been doing an absolutely shitty job at discerning the difference -- if they've even been trying at all. So, Trump is saying, "immigration is optional in the first place, throwing the baby out with the bathwater shouldn't be an issue -- keep all Islam out until the so-called experts can get their shit together." Either he phrased it inartfully or the MSM managed to cut it to look as bad as it could.....but I can't help but agree. There are Billions of lions and lambs out there -- and as long as our institutions can't tell the beige ones apart, keep out everything beige.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 09:53 PM (EzgxV)

618 Don't the Arab Muslims believe the blacks to not be "real" Muslims?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 08, 2015 09:49 PM (FkBIv)

Calypso Louie: Whatchu talkin' about Willis?

Posted by: TheQuietMan at December 08, 2015 09:53 PM (45oDG)

619 Oh gawd--an all girls school. Bad typo there.

Gotta go to dinner.

Posted by: Danube River Guide at December 08, 2015 09:54 PM (mcm0N)

620 I feel confident in stating that another muslim terror attack will happen here and once again the same people will say the same thing with their apologetics to muslims.

--

Probably on one of the Fridays left in the year.

Posted by: votermom at December 08, 2015 09:54 PM (cbfNE)

621 Trump is not a conservative. He's a venal, opportunistic rat bastard
who gamed eminent domain in order to kick people out of their homes so
he could build a limousine garage. He makes remarks about his own
daughter laced with innuendo that would, in most social circles outside
the Kardashian family, shut him out of the company of decent people.
And some of you want to make him President.

And this is worse than the clown show in progress? At least Trump acts like he wants to protect Americans.

Posted by: free tibet, as if! at December 08, 2015 09:54 PM (lAXNl)

622 Your response makes no sense at all

If you've lived in this country for a reasonable length of time, you may have heard about people 'wasting their votes' on third party candidates that have no chance of winning, rather than one of the two viable candidates. I've reversed the idea as a commentary on the utter uselessness of the republican party.

In some quarters that sort of idea shuffling might be considered humor.

I don't see what Ron Paul has to do with any of this as his followers, I presume, have been inherited by his son.

Posted by: Methos at December 08, 2015 09:56 PM (ZbV+0)

623 Stupid dumb: "There is a right to immigrate to the United States."

Intelligent dumb: "A ban on Muslim immigration violates the Constitution."

It's a distinction without a difference.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at December 08, 2015 10:00 PM (pq97T)

624 How about Trump and Cruz run as third party?

Posted by: Infidel at December 08, 2015 10:00 PM (7tCdZ)

625
from my admittedly small study, it appears the muslims will not separate political islam from religious islam.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 08, 2015 10:01 PM (ODxAs)

626 493 chemjeff has set his heart. Words will not change his mind.
Posted by: ReactionaryMonster at December 08, 2015 09:26 PM (0NdlF)

And quite sadly has set his heart with those who seek to subjugate us on pain of death.

Posted by: Insomniac - Pale Horse/Death 2016 at December 08, 2015 10:02 PM (kpqmD)

627 "Illiterate in ANY language," was the pull quote.

Remember
those words the next time you hear some immigration shill start
bloviating about "the best and the brightest". What we are actually
getting are the worst and the stupidest.

Posted by: torquewrench

A nice lady down the street (we know her well, as her son and mine were in HS together, sports, etc) is an English teacher in the local school system. She teaches immersion English, specializing in teaching kids who know little to no English.
Several years ago, she had a class of kids from Ghana. Nice kids, well behaved, eager to learn. Their families were committed to becoming Americans.
The next semester, she had a class of Somalis. Nasty, vulgar, "you're a white Christian and going to Hell!" Ha-ha.

That's the difference, in a nutshell.

Fun times in the future; they're a comin'.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative...a rube in America at December 08, 2015 10:03 PM (+1T7c)

628 Addendum.

The Idiocracy has arrived and Its messenger is Rubio.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at December 08, 2015 10:03 PM (pq97T)

629 Okay back from Fapplebee's.
My last word before I have to finish writing my exam.

Nobody here is actually "pro-Muzzie". I never said I liked the religion and I've said several times that I don't favor importing more Muslims just for the sake of importing Muslims. That is the leftist multi-culti bullshit, not what I believe. Muslims I think are backwards at best, and violent at worst.

THAT SAID, I still think we ought to be faithful to our OWN principles. If we really believe that every individual ought to be judged by his/her own merits, than we ought to live up to that. So blanket bans on everyone based on a religion is just wrong in my view. Not every Muslim is a terrorist, not everyone who calls him/herself a Muslim is interested in destroying the USA.

If a person DOES want to come here and is interested in destroying the USA then that person shouldn't be let in regardless of whatever religion that person believes in.

Posted by: chemjeff at December 08, 2015 10:05 PM (uZNvH)

630 Buck Sexton keeps flashing his CIA experience badge, but then he says "expel them all? we can't do that , we need nuance". Sheesh Buck ... Trump is not calling for expelling anyone.

But Buck does understand our government is lying to us and downplaying the threat. I don't think his "nuance" is really far from what Trump is actually proposing ... a pause and then a more intense verification, and a big reduction overall.

But Buck keeps flipping into "expulsion" and "Muslim ban IN this country". NO ... bad Buck. He can't even get the basics right, I think because he really hates Trump.

Even then general UN rule for refugees is about placing them close to their origin.

Posted by: Illiniwek at December 08, 2015 10:07 PM (26Yu7)

631 633:

"If a person DOES want to come here and is interested in destroying the USA then that person shouldn't be let in regardless of whatever religion that person believes in."

Well, that solves it.

Posted by: Trump poisoned my cat at December 08, 2015 10:08 PM (pq97T)

632 So it is your belief that "freedom of religion" should only be applied selectively for certain religions? Which ones should be on the list? And who decides?

Posted by: chemjeff @ Fapplebee's at December 08, 2015 08:23 PM (+4mdw)

How about starting with reciprocity for people who allow full religious freedom for Christians and Jews in those countries where they form the majority? How many Christian churches in Saudi Arabia? How many synagogues?

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 08, 2015 10:11 PM (+y3Tj)

633 558 It's a direct lift from Marxism.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 08:15 PM (EzgxV)

It's only stolen from Marx if the speakers using aren't Marxists themselves, a fact not in evidence.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 08, 2015 09:38 PM (+y3Tj)

A point I'd gladly concede. It can't be lifted from Marxism by someone who is below the surface.

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 10:11 PM (EzgxV)

634 [bSaying that what they do is wrong and then emulating it exactly makes even less sense.

It makes perfect sense under the commonsense doctrine of "Don't reward bad behavior."

Continuing to lavish favors & privileges - and uncontested migration is a privilege - upon those who have sworn not to reciprocate isn't principled, it's insane.

We must stop enabling militant Islam.

Posted by: ChicagoRefugee at December 08, 2015 10:11 PM (b/PFG)

635 587 Cthulhu!!
Hello!!

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:44 PM (sj3Ax)

Howdy, Carol!!! -- all the roses put to bed for the winter?

Posted by: cthulhu at December 08, 2015 10:15 PM (EzgxV)

636 Well, I suppose that is a point of view. But it comes back to how do you tell the sheep from the goats? Without a body count?

Is our duty to protecting the living before the acts of terrorism, or afterwards?

Are you willing to move them into your neighborhood and hope they are the good ones, or are you compassionate only with risk to other peoples' children, parents, brothers and church members?

Remember also, they get free money to live here also, and are not tracked "unless they can be proved to be criminals" because profiling is one of the cardinal sins of the progs, so if it turns out they are the regrettable minority bent on destruction and murder, good luck doing anything but sweeping up dead Americans and hiring people to take the rubble of what used to be buildings away.

Our nation does not have to be a suicide pact. To insist that your ideals are the only solution, and be willing to take casualties, large, civilian casualties to prove your philosophy makes me reconsider your philosophy as a viable option.

Posted by: Kindltot at December 08, 2015 10:19 PM (q2o38)

637 Bigoted? If that means keeping people who don't subscribe to Western values out in order to prevent a Sharia nightmare of the sort that Europe is suffering, then so be it.

Posted by: Reggie1971 at December 08, 2015 10:23 PM (jEIZo)

638 well, Muslims also worship the god of Abraham.

Isaac and Ishmael and all of that, but just as related to Christianity as Judaism is.

Posted by: Harry Paratestes at December 08, 2015 08:44 PM (AkOaV)

Ahem! muslims claim that their moon-god allah is the God of Abraham, but any reasonable reading of their texts leads to the inescapable conclusion that allah is just another of the many names of Satan. Same M.O.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 08, 2015 10:30 PM (+y3Tj)

639 Some think it a challenge to identify what religious background a young Middle Eastern man might really have when asked at a border.....you shows these guys a video of a goat in heat and their hard, erect 'third leg' will dime them out every time.

Posted by: Lower Class person whose opinions need to be guided at December 08, 2015 10:39 PM (3ZttN)

640 Thanks a lot, despair! You make it so easy to highlight the failings of Trump.

Posted by: tops116 at December 08, 2015 08:59 PM (Wn+fE)

A Trumpetdaddy wall of text. Woo-Hoo!

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 08, 2015 10:46 PM (+y3Tj)

641 "THAT SAID, I still think we ought to be faithful to
our OWN principles. If we really believe that every individual ought to
be judged by his/her own merits, than we ought to live up to that. So
blanket bans on everyone based on a religion is just wrong in my view.
Not every Muslim is a terrorist, not everyone who calls him/herself a
Muslim is interested in destroying the USA.

If a person DOES want
to come here and is interested in destroying the USA then that person
shouldn't be let in regardless of whatever religion that person believes
in.

Posted by: chemjeff at December 08, 2015 10:05 PM (uZNvH)"
Your principles. You are suffering from cognizant dissonance. And you are very ignorant. Read. Read "The Clash of Civilizations" Samuel P. Huntington. We are not at war with Islam. But Islam is at war with us. You are not a Christian, so you fail to understand the cultural and civilizational issues.Sorry chemjeff, you are a lightweight on this issue. I will not waste my time arguing with you anymore.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 10:50 PM (1ijHg)

642 Allah is the Devil.

Allah is a god of carnal pleasures. Paradise is 72 virgins (perhaps every bit as beautiful as the SB bitch).

Nuff said.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at December 08, 2015 10:53 PM (1ijHg)

643 Technically Jesus is supposed to be fighting alongside the Mahdi. Muhammad's not coming back, same way Moses is not coming back and Salih is not coming back

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at December 08, 2015 09:04 PM (6FqZa)

(sings) "I ain't got no Mahdi, and no Mahdi cares for me.

A bop, bop, boopity, boopity bop."

(Tap dances away.)

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 08, 2015 10:54 PM (+y3Tj)

644 8 Posted by: Lauren at December 08, 2015 07:58 PM (Z/8dZ)
***********
Where to go to see vote by names?

Posted by: gracepc at December 08, 2015 11:06 PM (OU4q6)

645 Instead of walking around covered in body armor to protect me from terrorism I am looking into wearing some sort of exploding suicide belt don't hatbox I am shot I will blow up and kill the terrorist
Would that be covered by the 2nd?

Posted by: Righter at December 08, 2015 09:17 PM (Y6XuZ)

Sounds like a plan to me. But you should test it extensively first. Hire someone to shoot at you while you are wearing it. What if you were wearing it, and some muzzie shot you, and you died of the gunshot wound, but the bomb failed to detonate? Now you've just gifted the muzzie a pile of C4. Epic fail.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 08, 2015 11:10 PM (+y3Tj)

646 155 CJ I heard on Rush, don't know how to true it is. But. Immigration was very curtailed 1924-1965

Thank you Killer Kennedy for changing that
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian, he's just a crazy Italian who drove a red sports car at December 08, 2015 08:24 PM (gmP76)

Wrote about it this morning. Link in nick.

Posted by: baldilocks at December 08, 2015 11:27 PM (ys2UW)

647 Aaaaand . . . I think this does it for me.

I'm in the Trump camp. Have been a Rand hold-out, and, I guess if I had my druthers, Rand would be president. But that's not happening.

Trump's about as anti-libertarian as you can get without being John Kasich or Rick Santorum, but I can't take this anymore. Tired of the media and the political establishment telling us all who is and isn't "on the wrong side of history," and who is and isn't acceptable, and what value system is "who we are" and "not who we are." Also, can we get right of the phrase "on the wrong side of history"? It ain't predetermined, and I'm a little annoyed that all the people who think it is also believe, totally by coincidence I'm sure, that it's predetermined in exactly the way they'd like it to be.

Yeah, I think I'm done with all that noise. Trump is less than ideal as a leader of the pushback that has to come, but he seems to be the only one who really wants the job. Count me in, I guess.

Posted by: Mr. Estrada at December 09, 2015 12:03 AM (RPsRI)

648 Trump just won the black vote in America with the "keep the muslims out" statement.... no way the blacks want to share and compete for their free handouts with yet another minority group.

Trump is genius.

Posted by: roger martin at December 09, 2015 12:38 AM (NqWkj)

649 It's fucking outstanding how low IQ teabaggers like Ace are handing the presidency to Hillary.

Posted by: A walk over at December 09, 2015 01:21 AM (yj5ev)

650 The Republican Party tore itself apart long ago. Trump is a sign of that, not the problem.

Posted by: Vic-we have no party at December 09, 2015 04:21 AM (t2KH5)

651 Maybe it would be legal to ask people about their religion before letting them in, but wouldn't it be better (and less Archie Bunker-like) to vet people from certain parts of the world more carefully? When it comes to people from countries like Syria, with no government to check with, we simply deny entry.

At this point, I would just as soon have Hillary in the White House as Donald Trump. He's a stupid, ignorant, narcissistic demagogue and clown who makes Obama look respectable.

What's more, I wouldn't want to win with votes from his supporters, either.

I have held my nose and voted for some crappy candidates in the past (Dole, McCain, Romney, both Bushes), but Trump is a bridge too far. I refuse to support him - ever.

Give me someone like Cruz I can actually vote for without sacrificing my self-respect, or I'm staying home on election day.

Except for one thing: if Trump wins the nomination, I'll be on sites like this the day after the election to rub the noses of his charming supporters in the dog shit of Hillary's victory.

Posted by: DRayRaven at December 09, 2015 05:49 AM (Qc2Pk)

652 Boom.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at December 08, 2015 09:13 PM (oVJmc)

---
re:gope

It's open war they clearly want, so it's open war they shall get.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 09, 2015 07:05 AM (MbrzC)

653 505
...
WTF is wrong with these people.

Posted by: Stay out da bushes at December 08, 2015 09:29 PM (yioUz)
----

Decades of believing their own bullshit.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 09, 2015 07:28 AM (MbrzC)

654 513 472 The GOPe field is so hapless and opportunistic and desperate save Cruz. Disappointed to see Carly join in the pile on.

Posted by: L, Elle at December 08, 2015 09:22 PM (2x3L+)

After her attack on Trump's statements last night, she's a complete deal breaker.

had to turn the TV off, we were getting so angry at her.

Posted by: Marybeth in Florida at December 08, 2015 09:30 PM (7egrg)

---

Not just pile on, but show clear ignorance of the Constitution while doing so. Yup, she's dead to me for elective office, but then again she more or less already was.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 09, 2015 07:32 AM (MbrzC)

655 517 Carly said Mittens urged her to run, which means she's GOPe.

Posted by: Carol at December 08, 2015 09:31 PM (sj3Ax)
---
You needed that information to figure out she was GOPe???

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 09, 2015 07:34 AM (MbrzC)

656 624 How about Trump and Cruz run as third party?

Posted by: Infidel at December 08, 2015 10:00 PM (7tCdZ)

---
I'm fine with it... the only problem, and it's a real one, is ballot access, seems way to late to get access on all 50 state's ballots (party wise), I suppose one could try to overcome\side step that with write-in's AK style but I don't see that working out well.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 09, 2015 07:44 AM (MbrzC)

657 Posted by: DRayRaven at December 09, 2015 05:49 AM (Qc2Pk)
---
And the rest will rub it right back in your own face, enjoy Hillary.

Posted by: ThisBeingMilt at December 09, 2015 07:49 AM (MbrzC)

658 In the old days (WWII and before)the people might not have been well-informed but, thank goodness, they had common sense. Today's people just don't make any sense at all.

Posted by: Judith at December 09, 2015 08:38 AM (MLPPX)

659 In one move Trump has proven for everyone to see that most of the GOP political class is no different from Obama. Look how they rush to defend a position that is Obama's position. Remember what Trump is pushing is not even permanent, just temporary. A time of war thing.

The GOPe is always getting on FOX news and saying this is a time of war right? Well lets fight it like a war...that is all Trump is really saying. Even that is too much for them, because why....it comes back to their PC and their love of immigration and cheap labor.

Just look at Ryan and Rubio throw themselves on that grenade. All at once they have found a hill to die on...keeping Muslim immigration going no matter what. Even in a war in which the people we are fighting are Muslims!

Posted by: William Eaton at December 09, 2015 09:10 AM (q52Ma)

660
Ingraham points out that Trump's proposal comes in a particular context: When the establishments of both parties already want to take him out, and are willing to seize on whatever cudgel is at hand to do so.

They're not going to beat him this way.
-------------------
The only force that is going to take Trump out are the voters during the primary process. Under our political process it is the proper way to accomplish it if at all. Should the GOPe attempt to forestall Trump winning the nomination when he might have a plurality of the delegates, they do so by becoming the Whigs they replaced.

Posted by: JohnMc at December 09, 2015 10:46 AM (5eRpg)

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