Glenn Reynolds: It's Little Reported in the US, But Liberal Enlightened Europe Is Talking About Walls and Immigrant Crackdowns, Too

The US media doesn't want to talk about any of this though, both because it is in ideological solidarity with the open borders movement, and is embarrassingly parochial anyway.

Europe's immigration drama has nothing to do with Donald Trump: Glenn Reynolds

Hundreds of thousands of migrants challenge EU's liberal stance on open borders.
From following the news, you'd think that immigration was strictly a U.S. problem, one brought to the fore by Donald Trump. But although Trump has certainly moved the debate to a new level here at home, other parts of the world are facing an immigration crisis that is, if anything, worse. And there are lessons in that.
...
Meanwhile, as Americans talk of a border fence, Bulgaria is building one, with razor wire and steel 12 feet high. And Slovakia is flat-out refusing to accept Muslim migrants, viewing them as dangerous and destabilizing. Migrants have massed at the Macedonian border and are creating tensions between Serbia and Hungary. Hungary is building a fence too. Norwegian politicians are suggesting that Norway should do something similar to Australia, which is sending unwelcome refugees to New Guinea or to prison....
So it's not just Trump. America, like the rest of the world, will have to decide what it wants to do about the fact that more people want to live here than we can accept. It is simple political reality that the problem can’t be ignored forever.

In Clueless, Alicia Silverstone fakes her way through a debate assignment on immigration by just making up some happy-sounding nonsense about there not being any RSVP required at Party USA.

That's pretty much exactly what the political and economic masters of this country are doing -- burbling Alicia Silverstone's happy-talk nonsense, hoping no one notices it doesn't make sense.

Posted by: Ace at 11:37 AM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Ola.....

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 27, 2015 11:39 AM (LA7Cm)

2 You must really hate Mexican food or something.

Posted by: Slappy McLibtard at August 27, 2015 11:40 AM (2oWD2)

3 For every force there is an equal and opposite counter force.

Sometimes it takes time, but the counter force will emerge. It's a law of the Universe and Human nature. Count on it

Posted by: Nevergiveup at August 27, 2015 11:41 AM (gf8BH)

4 Tres! That DNC platform form 1996 regarding immigration is a dooooozy. I'm surprised that document didn't end up getting thrown into the bin with Obama's college transcripts.

Posted by: Eli Cash at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM (a+WIL)

5 >>In Clueless, Alicia Silverstone fakes her way through a debate assignment on immigration by just making up some happy-sounding nonsense about there not being any RSVP required at Party USA.

Heh, forgot about that.
Totes nails it.

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM (NOIQH)

6 I'd mock Ace for being that familiar with Clueless, but, *BANNED*

Posted by: Turd Ferguson at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM (VAsIq)

7 There's something... beyond immigration happening here.

In every 1st world country.

Our "leaders" are, well, trying to dissolve the peoples and elect a new one, as the old east german joke goes.

At least, that's how it appears to me.

Also, I think welfare and social security are a part of it. Elected officials across the western world are freaking the fuck out looking at our demographic death spirals and wondering "uh oh, how are we going to pay for all of these retirees when our replacement rate has been below 2.0 for decades? BRING IN THE IMMIGRANTS!"

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM (AkOaV)

8 Build a wall and start tossing tresspassers out.

Posted by: Positive Waves at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM (MQEz6)

9 A lot of those countries aren't full of guns. If they don't have fences, they end up with no-go zones.

Posted by: Roy at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM (VndSC)

10 good morning ace.
Hope you are a happy shiny person today

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM (QyBQv)

11 3 For every force there is an equal and opposite counter force.

Sometimes it takes time, but the counter force will emerge. It's a law of the Universe and Human nature. Count on it
Posted by: Nevergiveup at August 27, 2015 11:41 AM (gf8BH

nature hates a vacuum as well.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 11:43 AM (QyBQv)

12 Hungaria said they wouldn't accept Muslims because they have no mosques, so they wouldn't feel welcome. Interesting approach...

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 11:43 AM (NOIQH)

13 Everyone is for the open party until the dark complexioned guy with the scowl shows up.

Posted by: BurtTC at August 27, 2015 11:43 AM (TOk1P)

14 That's what Jorge just did.
"There's no such thing as an illegal human."

Posted by: tom_06060 at August 27, 2015 11:43 AM (z04hE)

15 Posted by: Ace

Threadwinner! by the bestest, fairest, coolest blog owner on the planet!

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 11:44 AM (O+0DS)

16 everyone knows walls are racist.....did you hear about the 50 dead illegal immigrant bodies found in a truck in austria? they have coyotes in austria!!!! walls are racist though.....

Posted by: phoenixgirl, i was born a rebel at August 27, 2015 11:44 AM (0O7c5)

17 Oh, and ace -- I just googled "Clueless."

I shall not comment any further, for it would possibly be my last comment what with the new banning policy and all. But suffice to say -- Really, sir? Really?

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 11:44 AM (AkOaV)

18 Here at Club America you don't need an RSVP and we make the guy at the OTHER table pay the check....

//Open Borders Inc

Posted by: sven10077-callsign Charon at August 27, 2015 11:44 AM (BXOyX)

19 I always wondered if I should bother to read The Camp of the Saints (book, not blog). Turns out I can skip it, I'm already living in it.

Posted by: Brother Cavil, down with Eph 6:12-13 at August 27, 2015 11:44 AM (9krrF)

20 As if...

Posted by: tom_06060 at August 27, 2015 11:45 AM (z04hE)

21 nature hates a vacuum as well.

Because Dyson sucks!
/s

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 11:45 AM (O+0DS)

22 Ace, might I take this opportunity to thank you for enduring Clueless so we don't have to...

we need to pass the wooden leg around to get you some couch time to decompress from your cinematic battle stress...

Posted by: sven10077-callsign Charon at August 27, 2015 11:45 AM (BXOyX)

23 Because Dyson sucks!
/s
Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 11:45 AM (O+0DS)

I've been very happy with my Shark vacuum though.

Does a great job with pet hair.

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 11:46 AM (AkOaV)

24 15 Posted by: Ace

Threadwinner! by the bestest, fairest, coolest blog owner on the planet!
Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 11:44 AM (O+0DS)

So if I called you a scuzzy bootlicking brown noser would I get banned? Just asking for a friend. As I am not calling you a scuzzy bootlicking brown noser.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 11:46 AM (QyBQv)

25 >>In Clueless...

At the risk of a banning -

Do you know how I know you are gay, Ace?

Posted by: Garrett at August 27, 2015 11:46 AM (/WEWH)

26 " It is simple political reality that the problem can't be ignored forever."
------------
But it *can* be ignored until it is too late to do anything about it.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 27, 2015 11:46 AM (9mTYi)

27 "Sometimes it takes time, but the counter force will emerge."

True. You can only take the strain on public services, state budgets, school systems, and, the economy before "Snap!"

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 27, 2015 11:46 AM (LA7Cm)

28 Migrants have massed at the Macedonian border and are creating tensions between Serbia and Hungary.

--? This does not make geographical sense. Macedonia is on the opposite side of Serbia as Hungary. Maybe a comma needed before the "and"?

Posted by: logprof, now available on Kindle! at August 27, 2015 11:46 AM (vsbNu)

29 Clueless isn't a bad movie... what wrong with you people, are you clueless?

However, I don't have the damn thing memorized, so.....

Posted by: BurtTC at August 27, 2015 11:46 AM (TOk1P)

30
Venezuela has a big problem with Colombian invaders right now. Venezuela is cracking down on border-crossers because the invaders are bringing viloence and crime to many areas in Venezuela.

Their words, not mine.

Posted by: Acme Soothsayer at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (FUQ2t)

31 Let's party with the Haitians!.... As if!

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (hUdMz)

32 Yep, the Empire needs new subjects.

The Federal Combine is a vote-buying machine.

EBT, SS, Medicare, Medicaide, etc. are all there to buy votes.

The politicians are trapped in their own snare. They have no choice but to keep things going as they are.

Not forever, they know that is impossible, but at least until they are safely in their graves.

Posted by: Positive Waves at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (MQEz6)

33 --? This does not make geographical sense. Macedonia is on the opposite side of Serbia as Hungary. Maybe a comma needed before the "and"?
Posted by: logprof, now available on Kindle! at August 27, 2015 11:46 AM (vsbNu)

That sounds like an ad hominem attack to me!!

Judges?

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (AkOaV)

34 I am not calling you a scuzzy bootlicking brown noser.

But, is it working?

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (O+0DS)

35 Careful Ace - if you mention Silverstone too much Obama will make her Ambassador to the UN.

She can't be any dumber than Caroline Kennedy.

Posted by: Murph at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (xp4/g)

36 Clueless was based on Jane Austen's Emma, and it was silly and enjoyable.

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 11:48 AM (NOIQH)

37

It's OKAY to be anti-foreign invader.

Posted by: Acme Soothsayer at August 27, 2015 11:48 AM (FUQ2t)

38 31 Let's party with the Haitians!.... As if!
Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (hUdM

I hear the Clintons have this party cornered.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 11:48 AM (QyBQv)

39
So the crazily cosmopolitan Europeans are banning Undocumented Eurofriends now?

My, how their standards have crashed to earth!

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars (TM) at August 27, 2015 11:48 AM (BK3ZS)

40 She can't be any dumber than Caroline Kennedy.
Posted by: Murph at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (xp4/g)

Um... like... whaaaaattt?

hahahah. Like, yeah. I'm totes not dumb, guys! I'm an ambassador!

Posted by: Caroline Kennedy at August 27, 2015 11:48 AM (AkOaV)

41 >>She can't be any dumber than Caroline Kennedy.

Uh, you don't want to Bing anything about her mothering techniques...

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 11:48 AM (NOIQH)

42 Theory on the 'Rentboy' raids: Obama regime raiding the files to see which politicians they can leverage; as well as donors and media figures.

Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 11:49 AM (O7MnT)

43
A far left lifelong friend of mine has swore up and down he would never ever vote for a republican, he hates them with so much passion it is disgusting to talk politics with him. Well guess what...he called me last week and said he's voting for Trump because of immigration.

You could have knocked me over with a feather.

Posted by: booter at August 27, 2015 11:49 AM (Lg1F3)

44 Walls are useless and racist. Just like a house.

Reasonable people will turn nomadic and sleep under the stars. It's only fair.

Posted by: Jorge Ramos at August 27, 2015 11:49 AM (1CroS)

45 It's a helluva lot easier to migrate than revolt. Safer for the kids too.

Posted by: MTF at August 27, 2015 11:49 AM (TxJGV)

46
Again, as Rush aptly put it yesterday: what's happening on our Southern IS NOT immgration, it's an invasion.

That'not how you 'immigrate.' Come on, now.

Posted by: Acme Soothsayer at August 27, 2015 11:50 AM (FUQ2t)

47 It's a helluva lot easier to migrate than revolt. Safer for the kids too.

The Natives are revolting! They certainly are...

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 11:50 AM (hUdMz)

48 Does this mean Ace is going to do a movie review of Clueless?

Posted by: Turd Ferguson at August 27, 2015 11:50 AM (VAsIq)

49 "Venezuela is cracking down on border-crossers because the invaders are bringing viloence and crime to many areas in Venezuela.

Their words, not mine."

Racist bastards.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 27, 2015 11:50 AM (LA7Cm)

50 I'm trying to come up with a historical parallel to our current "immigration" situation and I can't.

But that could be because I'm a moron and don't know a whole lot about that whole 'history' thing.

But has a civilization ever voluntarily decided to, well, Harakiri itself before?

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (AkOaV)

51 42 Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 11:49 AM (O7MnT)

You'll recall back during the era when I gave a f*ck and I thought the GOP was in the "saving America" biz at all I suggested setting loose neo-plumbers for Operation Pipewrench and finding out the media and left's pushers, pimps, and network webs?

Ogabe is a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable traitor BUT he knows how the game is played....

we suck.

Posted by: sven10077-callsign Charon at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (BXOyX)

52 Honestly, at this point, I'm hoping for a President Trump...solely to see him weasel his way out of the fence promise.

That, and not Trump's elevation to the presidency, is what will kill the GOP for good.

Posted by: Oschisms at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (Y9sqm)

53 Like the man said, good walls make good neighbors and copious razorwire makes even better neighbors. Although I might be misremembering that.

Posted by: joncelli, getting it out of his system at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (RD7QR)

54 Delurking for this one....spent some time following a link from another website I visited this morning and nearly all the posts were from facebook posters who were leftists and they were doing a job of badmouthing Trump, America and American Conservatives. After reading nearly 100 posts I can conclude that Leftists are the most intolerant people I know as they would all love nothing more than to dispose of anyone who is a conservative, who doesn't follow the Leftist group think. And second that Leftists do understand the differences between a LEGAL immigrant coming to the USA and an ILLEGAL immigrant who sneaks across our borders but Leftists just don't give a flying flaming fuck about it at all. I find Leftists to be disgusting human beings as they would joyfully murder us all in our sleep if they could and it may just come to that if they keep getting all their demands while conservatives remain cowed. I read those Leftists comments and all I could day is sadly shake my head and wonder what has happened to the United States of America where it has come to this point in our history where it seems we are about to be torn apart as a once powerful and rich nation. The Romans must be pointing at us from the afterlife and saying, we told you! You didn't pay attention to FACTUAL History.

Now back to lurking.

Posted by: Cycomiko66 at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (O45yk)

55 Saint Vladimir the Divine was against immigration.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (DsveK)

56 European countries generally have more restrictive abortion laws as well, but you won't hear the prog-left talking about adopting those either.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (2Ojst)

57 There really has been a blackout on this until recently.

I didn't even know there was a problem until I saw a Drudge link a few weeks ago about the Chunnel and the problems going on there.

Of course neither France nor Britain seems to be willing to deploy troops.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (oFCZn)

58

Alicia Silverstone?

Yeah,, I'd hit it...

Posted by: Hillary Clinton at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (HSmrB)

59 My sister is married to a German and she told me that they play PSAs on the radio throughout Germany right now, asking people to volunteer to host refugees. They are building tent cities on public spaces, quarter them in school gyms, but it doesnt seem to be enough. There is already talk about the state governments just forcing people to take in the refugees.

Posted by: The Nayden Broad at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (7+xXC)

60 That's pretty much exactly what the political and economic masters of this country are doing -- burbling Alicia Silverstone's happy-talk nonsense, hoping no one notices it doesn't make sense

Bingo bango. Mind you, I love Clueless but maybe, just maybe, those espousing such views should consider that they have the same position as a character who is being portrayed as an utter brain dead twit (at least at the beginning).

Oh one other thing. Clueless has the single best portrayal of what high powered litigation actually entails. Hours and hours and hours of going line by line through documents highlighting stuff.

Posted by: alexthechick - Yeah I give up at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (mf5HN)

61 @5 - but when the party-crashers get there they piss on the front door, clean out the booze, and start groping the women. Not all of them, mind, just enough. And when you throw them out they come back.

"America: where the invited guests get jail time, but the party crashers get sanctuary"

Posted by: JEM at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (o+SC1)

62 Labour wanted mass immigration to make UK more multicultural, says former adviser.

The huge increases in migrants over the last decade were partly due to a politically motivated attempt by ministers to radically change the country and "rub the Right's nose in diversity", according to Andrew Neather, a former adviser to Tony Blair, Jack Straw and David Blunkett.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/6418456/
Labour-wanted-mass-immigration-to-make-UK-more-multicultural-says-former-adviser.html

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (NOIQH)

63 Those countries are responding to a set of recent developments, mostly the results of the on-going collapse of Iraq, Syria, and the Arab Spring.

The US has a +30 year problem with illegal immigration that neither party saw fit to address. We're so far fucked a wall, while part of a solution, isn't going to change much.

We live with the fact that illegals aren't held to the same laws citizens are, to say nothing of the welfare expenses.

Third, those counties understand that culture while seemingly strong, is really a fragile thing.

It's another issue on the increasing long list of issues the GOP has failed to address not just politically but philosophically. IF not a single candidate cannot articulate the moral reasons for enforcing a requirement of citizenship, one might draw the conclusion that the GOP isn't interested in altering course.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (Ck8hC)

64 Carly's answer on the podcast about immigration was probably the biggest issue I had with any of her answers.

Posted by: buzzion at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (zt+N6)

65 "The Natives are revolting! They certainly are..."

No place left for the Natives to immigrate to.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (LA7Cm)

66 This is a pretty good schematic of the refugee flow routes from MEA to Europe:

http://bit.ly/1MQymOI

Posted by: Bandersnatch at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (JtwS4)

67 Reposted from last thread because I think it's important for people to understand how we got here and why.

Our current immigraton system and its priorities were shaped by LBJ and Ted Kennedy in the '65 immigraton reform and over haul.

Here is an extract of an article on the subject.

"In 1965, Kennedy led the drive for immigration reform in the Senate. Although some Irish groups lobbied against the bill, Kennedy said the current system of national quotas that favored northern Europe violated the American values.

"This bill goes to the very central ideals of our country," he said during floor debate. "Our streets may not be paved with gold, but they are paved with the promise that men and women who live here - even strangers and new newcomers - can rise as fast, as far as their skills will allow, no matter what their color is, no matter what the place of their birth."

In response to critics, he also famously claimed that the change to a system opening immigration to all nations and favoring family unification would not change the mix of the country.

"The bill will not flood our cities with immigrants. It will not upset the ethnic mix of our society. It will not relax the standards of admission. It will not cause American workers to lose their jobs," he said during the Senate debate.

In retrospect, the mix of immigrants, legal and illegal, shifted dramatically in favor of Latin America and Asia - a fact that Kennedy, in later years, would attribute to illegal immigration"

He was also responsible for legislation that has been flooding our country with refugees.

He's also responsible for all of the amnesty legislation passed over the years.

In short, Ted Kennedy is largely responsible for our current immigration system.

And as you can see, it's was intentionally changed to dilute the White population of the U.S. which it has.

White population was 78pct in in '65 it's now 62pct so it's been successful in its intended effect.

Posted by: Kreplach at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (eDW1j)

68 Yo!

Posted by: Yo! at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (q+zA9)

69 They don't want to live in the sh!tholes they've helped create. (some of them)

I sympathize but unless a country has been taken over by a military junta that has complete control of all weaponry and has constant patrols, then anyone leaving to somewhere that has avoided such a condition should be returned to do something about their country first before deciding they can just move to where the conditions are better.

Unless, of course, they're capable of paying a huge fee or have some marketable skill in short supply. (unlikely)

I say we designate all blue states and open borders states and send all illegals to them to do with as they will.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 11:53 AM (x3GpS)

70 Of course neither France nor Britain seems to be willing to deploy troops.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis

Release the hounds.

Posted by: C. Montgomery Burns at August 27, 2015 11:53 AM (VAsIq)

71 Um... like... whaaaaattt?

hahahah. Like, yeah. I'm totes not dumb, guys! I'm an ambassador!

Posted by: Caroline Kennedy at August 27, 2015 11:48 AM (AkOaV)

Percentage use of "like" is way too low to be, like, Caroline Kennedy. Obviously a sock...

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 27, 2015 11:53 AM (oKE6c)

72 Caroline Kennedy is a piece of work. She isn't really capable of taking care of herself so she brought along her adult baby sitter to Japan to watch over her press relations and herself generally. The embassy apparently doesn't know what to make of this babe, calling herself "Chief Of Staff", like what her job is, and clearances and daily functions.

Posted by: MTF at August 27, 2015 11:53 AM (TxJGV)

73 Venezuela is cracking down on border-crossers because the invaders are bringing viloence and crime to many areas in Venezuela.

You can't just deport all those people! 11 million undocumented immigrants you cannot just deport! You can't you can't you can't!

Posted by: Jorge Ramos, Superjournalist at August 27, 2015 11:53 AM (2Ojst)

74 Nations can not have both porous borders and welfare more generous than that of the neighboring countries. Certainly both are bad in their own rights but the combination is catastrophic.

But our government and voter rolls are infected with people who want to harm us because " its Not Fair that we were more prosperous than other countries" aided by many many idiots who cannot grasp this basic principle.

Posted by: PaleRider at August 27, 2015 11:54 AM (iA/+T)

75 >>There is already talk about the state governments just forcing people to take in the refugees.

Some European country - maybe it was Germany? - is now taking over empty houses and apartments and placing immigrants in them. Sorry, property owners!!

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 11:54 AM (NOIQH)

76 7 There's something... beyond immigration happening here.

In every 1st world country.

Our "leaders" are, well, trying to dissolve the peoples and elect a new one, as the old east german joke goes.

At least, that's how it appears to me.

Also, I think welfare and social security are a part of it. Elected officials across the western world are freaking the fuck out looking at our demographic death spirals and wondering "uh oh, how are we going to pay for all of these retirees when our replacement rate has been below 2.0 for decades? BRING IN THE IMMIGRANTS!"

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM (AkOaV)

Definitely seems coordinated.

Then again maybe not. This stuff happened to the Roman Empire at various points and I don't think that was a coordinated effort. It was a population explosion outside the Empire coupled with other things that drove mass migration.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 11:54 AM (oFCZn)

77 I say we designate all blue states as open borders states and send all illegals to them to do with as they will.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 11:53 AM (x3GpS)

I'm way ahead of you, yo!

Posted by: Jerry Brown at August 27, 2015 11:54 AM (oKE6c)

78 Wow, Ace has gone full tilt nationalistic and nativistic. And to think, it took a clown like Trump to birth this new Ace. Irony is a meal best served with tater tots.

Posted by: No Ways Tard at August 27, 2015 11:54 AM (oDCMR)

79 Oh one other thing. Clueless has the single best portrayal of what high powered litigation actually entails. Hours and hours and hours of going line by line through documents highlighting stuff.
Posted by: alexthechick - Yeah I give up at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (mf5HN)

Truth. This is but one of the reasons why I don't litigate anymore. The other is dealing with raging assholes all the time.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 27, 2015 11:54 AM (2Ojst)

80 @73 - You don't need to deport them. All you need to do is clamp down on the under-the-table employment and the free shit.

Yeah, I know, good luck with THAT one.

Posted by: JEM at August 27, 2015 11:55 AM (o+SC1)

81 Ahhh.. so Europe has just as many racists as America does, huh?

Well.. Once Bernie Sanders straightens out this country, I'm sure he'll head over and help the Euro's over come their racist tendencies as well!

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at August 27, 2015 11:55 AM (so+oy)

82 Sounds like Alicia Silverstone's character should date Mark "There should be any borders" Zuckerburg.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 27, 2015 11:55 AM (OSs/l)

83 Just as in their plan which leaked out over one hundred years ago.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 11:55 AM (DsveK)

84 Not sure if mentioned in another thread but there is an active shooter at Mississippi State U as of now.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at August 27, 2015 11:55 AM (MOr4F)

85 12 Hungaria said they wouldn't accept Muslims because they have no mosques, so they wouldn't feel welcome. Interesting approach...
Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 11:43 AM (NOIQH)

That can be fixed.

Posted by: Mosque-builders R Us at August 27, 2015 11:56 AM (27veP)

86 80 @73 - You don't need to deport them. All you need to do is clamp down on the under-the-table employment and the free shit.

Yeah, I know, good luck with THAT one.
Posted by: JEM at August 27, 2015 11:55 AM (o+SC1)

What we need is sensible table control. If there are no tables, one cannot be paid under them.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 27, 2015 11:56 AM (2Ojst)

87 54 Delurking for this one....spent some time following a link from another website I visited this morning and nearly all the posts were from facebook posters who were leftists and they were doing a job of badmouthing Trump, America and American Conservatives. After reading nearly 100 posts I can conclude that Leftists are the most intolerant people I know as they would all love nothing more than to dispose of anyone who is a conservative, who doesn't follow the Leftist group think. And second that Leftists do understand the differences between a LEGAL immigrant coming to the USA and an ILLEGAL immigrant who sneaks across our borders but Leftists just don't give a flying flaming fuck about it at all. I find Leftists to be disgusting human beings as they would joyfully murder us all in our sleep if they could and it may just come to that if they keep getting all their demands while conservatives remain cowed. I read those Leftists comments and all I could day is sadly shake my head and wonder what has happened to the United States of America where it has come to this point in our history where it seems we are about to be torn apart as a once powerful and rich nation. The Romans must be pointing at us from the afterlife and saying, we told you! You didn't pay attention to FACTUAL History.

Now back to lurking.
Posted by: Cycomiko66 at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (O45yk)

Cut, Jib, Newsletter? J.J looks like you might have another contributing writer to your website.

Posted by: Make America Great Again at August 27, 2015 11:56 AM (LXJ1e)

88 But Liberal Enlightened Europe Is Talking About Walls and Immigrant Crackdowns, Too

They won't be talking about it on Facebook much longer.
http://is.gd/HTb7KK

dw.de has opened up Disqus comments on some of their articles; kind of interesting sometimes.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 27, 2015 11:56 AM (/kI1Q)

89 The US has a +30 year problem with illegal immigration that ~~neither party saw fit to address~~ both parties promoted and accelerated.

FIFY

Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 11:56 AM (O7MnT)

90 I'd have to say that Barry Obama does a pretty good imitation of Alicia Silverstone, except for the T and A.

Posted by: Fritz at August 27, 2015 11:56 AM (UzPAd)

91 There is already talk about the state governments just forcing people to take in the refugees.
Posted by: The Nayden Broad
----------------------

Well, they're already taking care of Greece.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 27, 2015 11:56 AM (9mTYi)

92 Then again maybe not. This stuff happened to the
Roman Empire at various points and I don't think that was a coordinated
effort. It was a population explosion outside the Empire coupled with
other things that drove mass migration.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 11:54 AM (oFCZn)

The big driver was tribes from the east who drove Goths before them. That, coupled with Roman perfidy towards the Goths (promising to protect them, then hosing them when the time came - sound familiar?) caused the Goths to migrate toward Rome for both safety and retribution.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 27, 2015 11:57 AM (oKE6c)

93 "Like the man said, good walls make good neighbors and copious razorwire makes even better neighbors. Although I might be misremembering that."

Minefields....third time you forgot about them.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 11:57 AM (VPLuQ)

94 New Guinea? Can we send them all to Old Dago?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 27, 2015 11:57 AM (uhkms)

95
The morons in charge in this country seem to believe that these immigrants will keep social security from crashing.

They don't look at the numbers that show that medicaid and EITC costs are skyrocketing. Somehow, we lose money on every single immigrant, but are supposed to make it up on volume.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at August 27, 2015 11:57 AM (HJ9LB)

96 90 I'd have to say that Barry Obama does a pretty good imitation of Alicia Silverstone, except for the T and A.

Yeh, He's a disco dancing, Oscar Wilde reading, Barbara Streisand ticket holding , Friend of Dorthy...

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 11:58 AM (hUdMz)

97 Until you have a secure border,

you can't have a coherent policy to deal with illegal aliens.

First, the wall.

First and a half, laws that punish employers for hiring illegals.

Second, instant deportation of all illegal aliens abusing/using US safety net programs.

All anchor babies under 18 return to their country of origin with their parents-

they may apply for citizenship at 18 - if their parents aren't criminals and haven't accessed any US safety net programs.

But, yeah, wall and laws against hiring first.

Posted by: naturalfake at August 27, 2015 11:58 AM (0cMkb)

98 69 The Blue state open border policy sounds great in theory, but then the Red states pay for it with places like Austin, TX.

Posted by: Wendy at August 27, 2015 11:58 AM (bpemY)

99 Oh one other thing. Clueless has the single best portrayal of what high powered litigation actually entails. Hours and hours and hours of going line by line through documents highlighting stuff.

Posted by: alexthechick - Yeah I give up at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (mf5HN)

Years ago when I was at the university I went to my sister's workplace and helped make copies of documents needed for a lawsuit. It was a way to make a few bucks.

By the time I was done there were piles that went almost to the ceiling. Apparently their lawyer about shit his pants when he saw them.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 11:58 AM (oFCZn)

100 The Germans showed great skill at removing pesky unwanted immigrants once.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 11:58 AM (DsveK)

101 We have reached the point that adopting some European policies might actually make us more conservative.

Posted by: Grump928(c) at August 27, 2015 11:59 AM (evdj2)

102 It's infuriating when politicians say, "Well, these folks came here because we didn't enforce our border laws. We can't send 'em back because it's our fault they're here. So, let 'em stay and we'll pass some new border laws."

IOW: "We f--ked up, but let us keep the fruits of our f--k up while we lay the groundwork for the next generation of f--k ups."

Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 11:59 AM (O7MnT)

103 @mynewhandle....Look at what happened to the Roman Empire when they allowed the Goths to pour across their borders as they Huns pressed them from the East. The Goths let in soon started to make problems for the Romans. And soon the Roman Empire was using more and more Goths and other foreign tribes in their military as native Romans became lazy and complacent. And then had the nerve to be shocked when the Goths slowly took over the Roman Empire causing it to eventually collapse and start the Dark Ages and the splitting of the Roman Empire in East and West. Is that what will happen to the USA? Sure looks like it if we cant get a handle on the ILLEGAL immigration policy and Obama's policy of sneaking in muslims and transplanting them all across the nation without permission from the states he has them sent to.

Posted by: Cycomiko66 at August 27, 2015 11:59 AM (O45yk)

104 Our current immigraton system and its priorities were shaped by LBJ and Ted Kennedy in the '65 immigraton reform and over haul.

Posted by: Kreplach at August 27, 2015 11:52 AM (eDW1j)

Just another reason to state that the GOP of 2015 are LBJ Democrats.

Posted by: Make America Great Again at August 27, 2015 11:59 AM (LXJ1e)

105 @70 - the UK is almost perfectly suited, geographically, to deterring immigration. Not that it stopped the Vikings or the Normans, and given the current state of the Scots they might want to start looking up that guy Hadrian again, but...

First, though, you've got to WANT to deter it, and even the Tories aren't quite bloody-minded enough at this point.

Posted by: JEM at August 27, 2015 11:59 AM (o+SC1)

106 That was when Alicia Silverstone was at her hottest...

Posted by: Oedipus at August 27, 2015 11:59 AM (CXLVd)

107 And as you can see, it's was intentionally changed to dilute the White population of the U.S. which it has.

I thought that that was what the Irish were for. /kidding, channeling Blazing Saddles

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 27, 2015 12:00 PM (oKE6c)

108 mynewhandle, someone on a thread yesterday (?) drew the analogy to later Imperial Rome, when, in addition to all the general social decay, they no longer had the military strength (or will?) to repel the "barbarians" from the North.

I'm still thinking about the fit of the analogy, but haven't found any glaring holes so far, fwiw.

Posted by: sock_rat_eez at August 27, 2015 12:00 PM (go6ud)

109 Norwegian politicians are suggesting that Norway should do something
similar to Australia, which is sending unwelcome refugees to New Guinea
or to prison....

Read about that a few months ago in an Aussie magazine I think. The locals like to congregate outside the fence and make eating motions at the internees. Suddenly everyone in the camps has an airline tickets paid for from home to get out of there. The New Guineans are getting paid!

Posted by: Lester at August 27, 2015 12:00 PM (2UPXV)

110 101 We have reached the point that adopting some European policies might actually make us more conservative.
Posted by: Grump928(c) at August 27, 2015 11:59 AM (evdj2)

Except the Swedes don't seem to have caught on to the fact that if you import hordes of North African rapists, you get more rape.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 27, 2015 12:00 PM (2Ojst)

111 The Germans showed great skill at removing pesky unwanted immigrants once.
Posted by: Boss Moss

Meaning?

Posted by: Bandersnatch at August 27, 2015 12:00 PM (JtwS4)

112
Never saw Clueless.

But BLAST FROM THE PAST is in my top 50 Movies.

Posted by: Acme Soothsayer at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (FUQ2t)

113 They are burning "refugee" buses in Germany.

Sweden, per capita, is number 2 in rape rates.

SWEDEN. What in the actual fuck is going on??!!

As the economy continues to sour, they will start to sink the boats soon. Then comes mass deportations.

Because, whilst they are socialist, they do not hate their own countries and their own people. Unlike our left.

Posted by: prescient11 at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (q5APL)

114 >>IOW: "We f--ked up, but let us keep the fruits of our f--k up while we lay the groundwork for the next generation of f--k ups."

Yep - "We INTENTIONALLY f--ked up by refusing to follow the immigration laws in place and then declared 'The System Is Broken!!'..."

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (NOIQH)

115 1996 DNC Document a joke or does it really exist?

Posted by: Carol at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (sj3Ax)

116 At the risk of a banning -

Do you know how I know you are gay, Ace?

Posted by: Garrett

------------------------------------------------------

You know in the savoir sense. I know in the connaitre sense.

Posted by: cheese eating Quokka on the sidebar at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (E5UB0)

117 I travel pretty extensively for my job. I've been lucky enough to travel to many countries on every continent with the exception of Antarctica (but I'm working on it).

I will say again there isn't a western style democracy anywhere in the world that isn't being invaded with illegal immigration. As was mentioned above, there are many places in Europe where you will see actual tent cities of immigrants from Eastern Europe and now from Africa.

If political leadership in all these places allows this to happen regardless of party affiliation there has to be a reason. Look for the commonality.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (OGm46)

118 43

A far left lifelong friend of mine has swore up and down he would
never ever vote for a republican, he hates them with so much passion it
is disgusting to talk politics with him. Well guess what...he called me
last week and said he's voting for Trump because of immigration.

Pretty sure he still won't be voting for a Republican in this case.

Posted by: Risking the banhammer? at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (9pK6I)

119 112
Never saw Clueless.

But BLAST FROM THE PAST is in my top 50 Movies.
Posted by: Acme Soothsayer at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (FUQ2t)

That's a really good movie.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 27, 2015 12:01 PM (2Ojst)

120 Labour wanted mass immigration to make UK more multicultural, says former adviser.

Why? They did everything they could to keep the Germans out.

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:02 PM (O+0DS)

121 both parties promoted and accelerated.

FIFY

Posted by: V the K

Benefit of the doubt for any LoFo's reading.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at August 27, 2015 12:02 PM (Ck8hC)

122 59: "There is already talk about the state governments just forcing people to take in the refugees.'

At which point there will be another beerhall putsch.

Posted by: Azenogoth (Freedom or Fire) at August 27, 2015 12:02 PM (UPYPp)

123 Good fences make good neighbors.

Says the guy with 3 dogs.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 12:02 PM (QyBQv)

124 I always wondered if I should bother to read The Camp of the Saints (book, not blog)"

You should. Especially the "speech" by the "young man". It's a rather good summary of the chattering class and their approach to you, the serfs.

Of course, downloading TCotS will probably get you banned. Or something.

Posted by: anon a mouse at August 27, 2015 12:02 PM (C9pBZ)

125 My sister is married to a German and she told me that they play PSAs on
the radio throughout Germany right now, asking people to volunteer to
host refugees.

Everything I've read about that indicates the most enthusiastic supporters of this idea are the people who live in one-room flats so they can't.

Til Schweiger is building them a dorm with his movie money--eh, it's his money--but you'll notice he's not letting them stay in his house with his daughters.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 27, 2015 12:02 PM (/kI1Q)

126
I think if you make a "threadwinner" comment, you earn Immunity from banning for a day.

Posted by: Acme Soothsayer at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (FUQ2t)

127 the Swedes don't seem to have caught on to the fact that if you import hordes of North African rapists, you get more rape.

Much as Americans can't grasp that if you import overwhelming numbers of people from corrupt, third-world sh-tholes, your country becomes a corrupt, third-world sh-thole.

Was reading the earlier thread about all the former Californicans lamenting what has been done to their state. We're not too far from lamenting that on a national scale.

Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (O7MnT)

128 MSU situation over. Apparently "some asshole with a gun who hasn't fired it" = "active shooter" to the reporters who passed it along.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (MOr4F)

129 Rational societies don't take kindly to invaders who, like locusts, swarm, overrun and consume all the resources the citizens worked so hard to cultivate.

Posted by: DangerGirl and her 1.21 Gigawatt SanityProd (tm) at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (TtorR)

130 It seems all pro illegal immigration idiots in this country eventually trot out Native Americans like show ponies to guilt us into accepting their stupid policies. You know the arguements; "your ancestors were illegal too!" When I point out Native Americans failed to control their borders and ended up with new diseases and poverty stricken marginalization I'm met with silence or name calling.

Posted by: Serena at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (78Ppj)

131 It's infuriating when politicians say, "Well, these folks came here because we didn't enforce our border laws. We can't send 'em back because it's our fault they're here. So, let 'em stay and we'll pass some new border laws."

IOW: "We f--ked up, but let us keep the fruits of our f--k up while we lay the groundwork for the next generation of f--k ups."
Posted by: V the K
-------------------

Yup. Same thing that I think.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (9mTYi)

132 Clueless was pretty good. The nerd girl was Brittany Murphy.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (DsveK)

133 I'm pretty sure the ruling junta in Sweden hates its own people.

The stuff that goes on over there is just insane.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (oFCZn)

134 Dack and mynewhandle:

Yep. I see this as well. I would say the people have had ENOUGH.

Which explains UKIP's rise.

Posted by: prescient11 at August 27, 2015 12:03 PM (q5APL)

135 V the K: "It's infuriating when politicians say, 'Well, these folks came here because we didn't enforce our border laws. We can't send 'em back because it's our fault they're here. So, let 'em stay and we'll pass some new border laws.'"

There is no answer too absurd for charlatans. If they can say it and get away with it, then it will be bullet-pointed for the rest of time. Deception is part of their job description.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at August 27, 2015 12:04 PM (1CroS)

136 10 posts late & several paragraphs short .... oh well, gotta go water the garden.

Posted by: sock_rat_eez at August 27, 2015 12:04 PM (go6ud)

137 Stop adopting them.
Stop feeding them.
Stop caring for them.
Put a bounty on them.

Problem will solve itself.

Posted by: Roland THTG at August 27, 2015 12:04 PM (QM5S2)

138 IOW: "We f--ked up, but let us keep the fruits of our f--k up

If I can't use that excuse for robbibg a bank, they can't use it for robbing the country.

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:04 PM (O+0DS)

139 >>But BLAST FROM THE PAST is in my top 50 Movies.

DItto.

Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 12:04 PM (O7MnT)

140 That was when Alicia Silverstone was at her hottest...

She has Keira Knightley boobs.

Posted by: wrg500 at August 27, 2015 12:04 PM (C278+)

141
Sweden, per capita, is number 2 in rape rates.

---

Millions of 'asian' immigrants.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at August 27, 2015 12:04 PM (HJ9LB)

142 MSU suspected active shooter in custody.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:05 PM (VPLuQ)

143 When I point out Native Americans failed to control their borders and ended up with new diseases and poverty stricken marginalization

Very good answer though.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 27, 2015 12:05 PM (OSs/l)

144 Stop me if you've heard this one:

Big Strong Capitalist USA can survive constant unending illegal immigration and constant erosion of its culture, trust, and quality of life. Because Ireland, and because Emma Lazarus wrote a poem.

Posted by: Leftist Comedian at August 27, 2015 12:05 PM (wjd4o)

145 By the time I was done there were piles that went almost to the ceiling. Apparently their lawyer about shit his pants when he saw them.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 11:58 AM (oFCZn)

If you can't dazzle them with BULLSHIT, bury them with PAPER

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 12:05 PM (QyBQv)

146 Unrestricted immigration? #ActOfLove

Posted by: Jeb! at August 27, 2015 12:05 PM (laMCB)

147 Illegal immigrant is a huge issue around the world and it is not racist to say so. All the Republican candidates should follow Trump's lead on this and communicate their outrage articulately to the media ever chance they get.

Starting with pointing out this was the Democrats position only two decades ago, until they decided they could mine this issue for short term vote getting.

Posted by: Evi. L. Bloggerlady at August 27, 2015 12:05 PM (4kTo2)

148 125,

Probably won't stop the single bedroom people from taking them in if they get money out of it.

Lots of places around here will fit 20 immigrants into a room if you can get enough cash.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at August 27, 2015 12:05 PM (MOr4F)

149 "Labour wanted mass immigration to make UK more multicultural, says former adviser."

And it really helped Labour out, didn't it.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 27, 2015 12:05 PM (LA7Cm)

150 Emma Lazarus wrote a poem.

Yes because it doesn't say RSVP on the Statue Of Liberty!

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 12:06 PM (hUdMz)

151 But BLAST FROM THE PAST is in my top 50 Movies.

"I'm gay."

"Good. For. You."

Posted by: Risking the banhammer? at August 27, 2015 12:06 PM (9pK6I)

152 . . . There is already talk about the state governments just forcing people to take in the refugees.
Posted by: The Nayden Broad at August 27, 2015 11:51 AM (7+xXC)
_____________

Gee, I seem to remember something about DHS mandating 'diversity' in various communities.

Posted by: mustbequantum at August 27, 2015 12:06 PM (MIKMs)

153 Stop adopting them.
Stop feeding them.
Stop caring for them.
Put a bounty on them.

Problem will solve itself.

Yep, I hate cats also.

Posted by: wrg500 at August 27, 2015 12:07 PM (C278+)

154 Til Schweiger is building them a dorm with his movie money--eh, it's his money--but you'll notice he's not letting them stay in his house with his daughters.
Posted by: HR braucht
-------------------

Which reminds me. Whenever one of my liberal acquaintances start whining about 'homelessness', I ask if they have a spare bedroom, or sofa. If so, why aren't they offering it to one of the homeless?

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 27, 2015 12:07 PM (9mTYi)

155 Anyone know what happened to the munuvian blogroll? Just curious.

Posted by: kinlaw at August 27, 2015 12:07 PM (3Jb5s)

156 With regard to Europe, I'd say the shooting starts in two years.

It will be a small country first. Like Denmark or perhaps Norway.

Those who worry that Trump is a demagogue, please, Europe is going to show you the way.

Posted by: prescient11 at August 27, 2015 12:07 PM (q5APL)

157 153 Spaying and neutering would help.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 12:07 PM (DsveK)

158 If you believe that we are all citizens of the world and people should be free to live wherever they want, then this all makes sense. No borders, no nations, no war...utopia! THAT is the ideology.

Posted by: IdahoMatt at August 27, 2015 12:08 PM (SgYQy)

159 high powered litigation actually entails. Hours and hours and hours of going line by line through documents highlighting stuff.

With lives, nations and billions on the line over inanity.

Posted by: DaveA at August 27, 2015 12:08 PM (DL2i+)

160
Let me get this right.

The political class in not enforcing current immigration law.
(not deporting captured criminals, not building all the fence that has been authorized/passed, et.)

So they want new legislation that is supposed to do what?
Make it easier to not enforce current law?

this boggles the mind

Posted by: Yo! at August 27, 2015 12:08 PM (q+zA9)

161 Lots of places around here will fit 20 immigrants into a room if you can get enough cash.

In My neck of the woods, NorCal, the "immigrant" laborers get as many in one house as they can.... Then they get their freebies and wire most of their money " home." if you know what i mean... Talk about ruining neighborhoods...

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 12:08 PM (hUdMz)

162 Spay and neuter your ~~pets~~ border crossers.

Either that or start serving Kitty burgers or Hot Puppydogs.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (x3GpS)

163 Trump should focus strictly on non-Mexican Illegals in his comments, and then when it's time to actually execute the legislation....the Mexicans will automatically be enveloped in.

If you take the word "Mexican" or "Hispanic" out of the conversation.....getting this done should be a cake walk.

He should focus on the northern Border in his comments, and then the legislation can envelop in the Southern border. How many people want any Dirty Snake-ish Sissy French Canadians here anyway?

Posted by: Covert Revolutionary at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (SJi0a)

164 'Member all those fuckers who think they're so damned clever with their burn "If you build a 10-foot fence, they'll just show up with an 11-foot ladder?"

Oh, so fucking clever.

And oh so fucking stupid.

Neither the East Germans nor the Palestinians climb over the fences--you don't do it 'cause you get SHOT!

Then there are the shitbags who lurve to claim "you can't just fence the whole border--what about the mountains and rivers and such?"

Um, dumbass? Those are what we in the real world call "natural barriers." If that's too damned hard for you to understand--and clearly it is--that means the illegals are crossing where there are not any "barriers." Get it?

You know, like fences?

President RoyalOil will issue an executive order to the IRS that they must consider any and all money orders over $25 to any foreign country to be unreported income and subject to an estimated tax at the highest tax bracket. Legal citizens can receive a credit for that tax on their next income tax return. That tax will pay for the fence.

Posted by: RoyalOil at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (ZvKdv)

165 Lots of places around here will fit 20 immigrants into a room if you can get enough cash.

Rental properties, sure; their own living space, not so much. That's to be forced on other people.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (/kI1Q)

166 "Sustainable" immigration is the daily hand-wring on SVT.se news.

Posted by: SarahW at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (3fTXW)

167 I'll know things are back to where they oughta be, when instead of illegal Mexicans and Guatemalans in front of Home Depot, that we see a crowd of day-job seeking drunks and hobos there, instead.

Jim
Sunk New Dawn
Galveston, TX

Posted by: Jim at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (7x4lH)

168 158 Posted by: IdahoMatt at August 27, 2015 12:08 PM (SgYQy)

Yeah the problem is I don't have bodyguards armed with Uzis to protect me from our "newer better Jihadist Americans"...

ah well fu*k it if the leftoids think violence will be lower with AMIGO GRANDE! who am I to argue?

I'll just go as far north as it takes to let the idiots kill each other and come back.

Posted by: sven10077-callsign Charon at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (BXOyX)

169 Imagine there's no countries.

Posted by: John Lennon at August 27, 2015 12:10 PM (laMCB)

170 >>> Just as in their plan which leaked out over one hundred years ago.

Elders of Zion? Freemasons?

Posted by: Bigby's Shaky Hands at August 27, 2015 12:10 PM (3ZtZW)

171 Imagine there's no countries.
Posted by: John Lennon at August 27, 2015 12:10 PM

Imagine being married to Yoko Ono.... OMFG...

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 12:11 PM (hUdMz)

172 Imagine there is no Yoko's bitch boy.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 12:11 PM (DsveK)

173 Yep, I hate cats also.

Yeah, it's all purpose.

Posted by: Roland THTG at August 27, 2015 12:11 PM (QM5S2)

174 President RoyalOil will issue an executive order to the IRS that they must consider any and all money orders over $25 to any foreign country to be unreported income and subject to an estimated tax at the highest tax bracket. Legal citizens can receive a credit for that tax on their next income tax return. That tax will pay for the fence.

Posted by: RoyalOil

Same position that I've heard Trump outline.

Posted by: wrg500 at August 27, 2015 12:11 PM (C278+)

175 Emma Lazarus wrote a poem.

When the requirements for immigrants were quite stringent and when the immigrants actually learned English, got jobs and became Americans

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 27, 2015 12:11 PM (OSs/l)

176
I'll just go as far north as it takes to let the idiots kill each other and come back.
Posted by: sven10077-callsign Charon at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (BXOyX)

Watch out where the huskies go Sven, don't eat that yellow snow

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 12:11 PM (QyBQv)

177 156 With regard to Europe, I'd say the shooting starts in two years.

It will be a small country first. Like Denmark or perhaps Norway.

Those who worry that Trump is a demagogue, please, Europe is going to show you the way.

Posted by: prescient11 at August 27, 2015 12:07 PM (q5APL)

It might be Germany. They've been having huge protests for some time now and there's been violence.

I think it's mostly in the former East Germany where things still aren't as good as they could be.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (oFCZn)

178 171 Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 12:11 PM (hUdMz)

John Lenin's last words?

"Thanks Mark..."

Posted by: sven10077-callsign Charon at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (BXOyX)

179 Ten years ago, I was a guest at an academic conference on immigration. The keynote speaker made this the focal point of his presentation: immigration is as old as mankind, but for the first time in history, governments are now expected to 'give' something to these immigrants and provide for them physically. This is unprecedented and unsustainable and it is something we have to face or else there will be dire consequences.

While he spoke, no one, not one of the academics paid him any attention. They were to busy eating their dinner and guzzling their wine. I was shocked at how his words passed completely over their heads.

Posted by: RondinellaMamma at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (oQQwD)

180 Posted by: John Lennon at August 27, 2015 12:10 PM (laMCB)

Probably one of your worst sings ever, John

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (OSs/l)

181 Lots of places around here will fit 20 immigrants into a room if you can get enough cash.

And if you Nativists could just accept those living conditions as normal, we wouldn't need to import people to replace you.

Posted by: US Chamber of Commerce at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (O7MnT)

182 @160

The reason they want new law is to create an appearance of doing something all the while creating an enabling act to cause new mischief and enrich themselves and their cronies.

It'll be a 10000 page bill nobody would have read and will of course be passed at the last possible hour.

We do need an immigration reform and over haul but I do not trust the current junta in office or the current political class to do it.

Posted by: Kreplach at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (eDW1j)

183 John Lenin's last words?

"Thanks Mark..."

I shouldn't have laughed but I did...

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (hUdMz)

184 >>In My neck of the woods, NorCal, the "immigrant" laborers get as many in one house as they can.... Then they get their freebies and wire most of their money " home." if you know what i mean... Talk about ruining neighborhoods...

Happening in N. VA, too. Some cities wanted to pass regulations limiting the # of a home's occupants based on the # of bedrooms. Racists, right?

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (NOIQH)

185 Good afternoon horde. Hoping The Prophet Ace, blessed be his hairy back, is in a better mood today.

OK, I agree we have an immigration problem all over the world. Anyone remember the Irish potato famine? Same story. !,000's migrated to the USA and made a life.

The difference between then and now? Then you got here you were on your own, except for the Catholic church, there was NO government assistance.

Sink or swim. A hell of a motivator and many industries took advantage of these people with basically slave wages, BUT any wage was better than no wage and starving.

Today immigrants immediately can become welfare takers. This is the REAL problem, the drain on our resources.

If we told immigrants they would get nothing, NOTHING, starve, etc if they show up, many would think twice.

NOT MANY. So an alternative that no one is discussing in immigration naked so to speak.

Think the SJW's will go for that?

Basally, my point is the immigration is not the problem, it is the welfare state that is the problem and causes the problem.

Why do all these European immigrants want to go to England and Germany? They have the best welfare for them.

Posted by: Nip Sip at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (0FSuD)

186 Sorry, should have written, "too busy,"

Posted by: RondinellaMamma at August 27, 2015 12:13 PM (oQQwD)

187 172 Imagine there is no Yoko's bitch boy.
Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 12:11 PM (DsveK

There hasn't been, for a number of years. 1980 IIRC

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 12:13 PM (QyBQv)

188 All anchor babies under 18

If their mother was "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" she'd have been teleported to a Maternity ward in her home country by the metal detector at the ER door.

Posted by: DaveA at August 27, 2015 12:13 PM (DL2i+)

189 John Lenin's last words?

"Thanks Mark..."

Posted by: sven10077-callsign Charon at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (BXOyX)

And Paul said: "Now that Bitch'll have something to screech about".

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:13 PM (x3GpS)

190 If you build it, a welfare state they will come like locusts

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at August 27, 2015 12:14 PM (HJ9LB)

191 117:"If political leadership in all these places allows this to happen regardless of party affiliation there has to be a reason. Look for the commonality."

I believe this old guy that is often called John the Revelator was given a clue.

Posted by: Azenogoth (Freedom or Fire) at August 27, 2015 12:15 PM (UPYPp)

192 It might be Germany. They've been having huge protests for some time now and there's been violence.

Yeah. The Germans know how to get froggy.

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:15 PM (O+0DS)

193 >>I think it's mostly in the former East Germany where things still aren't as good as they could be.

The former East German areas are dying. Kids are flocking to western Germany looking for jobs. I've heard a lot of western Germans speak resentfully of their own countrymen coming to take their jobs.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 27, 2015 12:15 PM (OGm46)

194 The 10 hour Hillary laughing? This is the new water boarding right?

Posted by: bananaDream at August 27, 2015 12:16 PM (vLk7c)

195 Posted by: Nip Sip at August 27, 2015 12:12 PM (0FSuD)

Immigrants formed their own support networks with various "societies" that helped newcomers get into the community.

Still wasn't without its problems. Machine politics and the Italian mafia were long term problems associated with these waves of immigration.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 12:16 PM (oFCZn)

196
did the lying boy-geniuses at Reason credit Trump for the market rebound or retract their bullshit piece blaming Trump for the sharp decline?

Posted by: Acme Soothsayer at August 27, 2015 12:16 PM (FUQ2t)

197 Soon they will putsch them over the edge.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 12:16 PM (DsveK)

198 Prescienti11

I speak Swedish so I haven't been following their news, aside the level of violence by Muslims, but what does the Government plan to do?. Haven't they just elected a rightist government?. If the population goes over a certain percentage of Muslims things go downhill quite fast. I think they're way beyond whatever that number is.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 27, 2015 12:17 PM (OSs/l)

199 "The bill will not flood our cities with immigrants. It will not upset
the ethnic mix of our society. It will not relax the standards of
admission. It will not cause American workers to lose their jobs," he
said during the Senate debate.

Wow, Ted Kennedy was a lying scumbag. Can ya beat that...

Posted by: tu3031 at August 27, 2015 12:17 PM (YFFpo)

200 Notice they're not trying to get into Russia?

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:17 PM (x3GpS)

201 193 Posted by: JackStraw at August 27, 2015 12:15 PM (OGm46)

One of Western Civ's failures and this failure happened b/c of the Western Socialist Left was not in launching Marshall Plan 2 and re-educating the eastern EUtopians in place about the failures of their belief system while rebuilding the dead zones....

the left went into "nuh-uh it did NOT fail!" mode right out of the gate and we are living the results of the Western Right "getting compassionate" instead of finishing the ideological fight.

I blame George Bush

Posted by: sven10077-callsign Charon at August 27, 2015 12:18 PM (BXOyX)

202 OK, I agree we have an immigration problem all over the world. Anyone remember the Irish potato famine? Same story. !,000's migrated to the USA and made a life.

And even then it was a MAJOR problem. People have this rose colored view of that time in American history but it was actually overflowing slums of poverty.

It's more than just the drain on resources, when you have literally millions and millions pouring in from absolute poverty, it's a shock to the culture.

It's not about race, if millions of whites were pouring in from Poland, I'd have the same issue.

Posted by: Coolio at August 27, 2015 12:18 PM (LOPDw)

203 165,

They try to force it on people and I guarantee you we will see "population control" one way or another.

"I'm not sure what happened to Mohammed but Abdullah, Yasser, and everyone else just left after that!"

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at August 27, 2015 12:18 PM (MOr4F)

204 Sweden has internal tens ons over the question of " refugee" immigration continuing mostly unabated.

But there is a real culture there of "we must do this" and it is propped up as the usual rule, but some whining that other nation states don't do their bit.

Today on SVT the lament is the deadly results of Austria tightening border control. Translated link here: http://bit.ly/1JyuE6N

Posted by: SarahW at August 27, 2015 12:18 PM (3fTXW)

205 Imagine if a race-killer had worn a sticker for a Republican candidate during a TV segment in 2012. The media would be trumpeting this fact to the skies, smearing everybody to the right of Trotsky as a racist murderer.

But, no, he (Vester Flanagan) wore an Obama sticker.

Even the crickets are silent.

Posted by: zombie at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (jBuUi)

206 200 Notice they're not trying to get into Russia?
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:17 PM (x3GpS

Cuba also doesn't seem to have a big following on Zillow.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (QyBQv)

207 200,

I think the kind of treatment Chechnyans get was an object lesson to them.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (MOr4F)

208 They found 20 dead in a truck in Austria.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (DsveK)

209 1. Open Borders

2. Welfare State

Pick one, can't have both.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (VPLuQ)

210 It's not about race, if millions of whites were pouring in from Poland, I'd have the same issue.

Just no Irish.

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (O+0DS)

211 Diversity!!11!!

Posted by: Ready For Jeb!!11!! at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (Dwehj)

212 Prescienti11

Meant I DON"T speak Swedish.

I also don't write English very well. ;^)

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 27, 2015 12:20 PM (OSs/l)

213 "In short, Ted Kennedy is largely responsible for our current immigration system. "

Yet another reason to curse the memory of that turd. He basically did to America what he did to Mary Jo - except it took longer to kill the country.

Posted by: Donna and V. (sans ampersands) at August 27, 2015 12:20 PM (u0lmX)

214 It's not about race, if millions of whites were pouring in from Poland, I'd have the same issue.
Posted by: Coolio at August 27, 2015 12:18 PM (LOPDw

^^This^^

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at August 27, 2015 12:20 PM (QyBQv)

215 Immigrants formed their own support networks with various "societies" that helped newcomers get into the community.

Still wasn't without its problems. Machine politics and the Italian
mafia were long term problems associated with these waves of
immigration.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 27, 2015 12:16 PM (oFCZn)

Yes, this. They still do, why do you think so many Somalian go to Min-St Paul. And Arabs go to Dearborn.

Self help be good.

Posted by: Nip Sip at August 27, 2015 12:21 PM (0FSuD)

216
Hammer: "But it *can* be ignored until it is too late to do anything about it."

Exactly. Are we there yet? Might be. One example: "you can't deport a zillion people!! eleventy!!!" Of course even small changes to restore rule of law would result in a substantial immediate, and massive eventual, correction of the problem my the illegal migrants themselves. Duh.

But we see the exact same lack of common sense and ability to reason about simple dynamics in this area - even among many "conservatives" - that we see in thecountry on other key matters.

Of course barriers work. They stop, they channel, they change costs, they reduce and they ...... thereby work.

But we have people even around here who cannot accept that actual barrier test cases, like the San Diego sector, have occurred and are there for all to see. Barriers completely changed the game (ended it, in terms of casual/easy crossing). Of course. And led to exactly the work-arounds and responses (flooding of the El Centro sector - where there's no barrier) one would expect.

Posted by: rhomboid at August 27, 2015 12:21 PM (QDnY+)

217 #25, dude, if you wouldn't have boned Alicia Silverstone back before she turned into a hard leftie, we know who the gay one is.

Posted by: Colonel Kurtz at August 27, 2015 12:21 PM (yfUzb)

218 Posted by: Donna and V. (sans ampersands) at August 27, 2015 12:20 PM (u0lmX)

And the GOPe knew what his laws would do.

And they went along with it for 50 years.

The GOPe didn't just spring up since McCain got whipped.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:22 PM (x3GpS)

219 Wow, Ted Kennedy was a lying scumbag. Can ya beat that...

The Lyin' of the Senate. *spit*

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 27, 2015 12:22 PM (/kI1Q)

220 They found 20 dead in a truck in Austria

Did they revise? It was 50.

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:22 PM (O+0DS)

221 Coolio: "It's not about race, if millions of whites were pouring in from Poland, I'd have the same issue."

Of course it's not about race. But the Race Card is their only refuge. Most scoundrels know this.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at August 27, 2015 12:22 PM (1CroS)

222 209
1. Open Borders

2. Welfare State

Pick one, can't have both.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (VPLuQ

BINGO!

Posted by: Nip Sip at August 27, 2015 12:22 PM (0FSuD)

223 Tear down that wall, Mr. Nieto!!11!!

Posted by: Ready For Jeb!!11!! at August 27, 2015 12:22 PM (Dwehj)

224 Well, Here's an idea, We could let the Border patrol and ICE do their jobs as in the LAW...

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 12:23 PM (hUdMz)

225 The immigration problem in Europe is huge. Mainly Muslims and it is getting worse and worse. They are in actuallity taking over countries through cultural demands. These immigrants have a culture; they are happy with it and they have no interest in assimilating into the new country's culture. That's why effing nazi parties like Golden Dawn in Greece are sprouting up -- their main selling point is "kick all foreigners out; Greece for Greeks!"
And it'd not just Greece (although I only have access to the Greek news channels, they report on the EU much more than the US channels do; plus I actually travel/have family there). People don't want to talk about it because A LOT of real racism and xenophobia is in the mix (which is a reason Germany is loudly PRO immigration; the shadow of the Third Reich is long). But without a practical/rstuonale way of dealing with the true assimilation of immigrants into a country you open the door for racism/xenophobia as people get angry that they have to change their culture to accommodate immigrants.
It's crazy how people never learn from history.

Posted by: Dancing Queen at August 27, 2015 12:23 PM (/B6Iw)

226 There are already 42 million immigrants living in the USA, minimum. And every year another 1.5 - 2 million are showing up. We're basically adding a city the size of Philadelphia to the American landscape every year, just from immigration.

Think about the strain that puts on infrastructure, schools, hospitals, welfare agencies, police.

We really need a breather. Our quality of life will not survive this onslaught.

Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 12:24 PM (O7MnT)

227 220 They found 20 dead in a truck in Austria

Did they revise? It was 50.
Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:22 PM (O+0DS)

30 of them were only mostly dead.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 27, 2015 12:24 PM (2Ojst)

228 All social welfare systems - Social Security, welfare, AFDC, et cetera - are institutionalized pyramid scheme. Once they're in place, they're dependent on an ever-increasing throng of new supporters to supply the cash to pay off the previous customers.

End them all, and the cycle stops. Until then, the statists and the CoC party know they need warm bodies to keep them in power and keep feeding a very hungry Leviathan.

I'm not an immigration extremist - I've got no beef with people who come here to work, not be traitors, and enjoy the fruits of their efforts, like my grandparents did when they came here. Wait your turn, fill out the right forms, show up with no criminal record, no malaria or tuberculosis, and some indication that you're willing to support yourself and learn the language, and I'm fine with that. Is that too much to ask?

Posted by: Qoheleth at August 27, 2015 12:24 PM (iIzG7)

229 @217 - "If you can't eat their food, drink their booze, screw their women, take their money and then vote against them you've got no business being up here." - Jess Unruh

Posted by: JEM at August 27, 2015 12:24 PM (o+SC1)

230 116 At the risk of a banning -

Do you know how I know you are gay, Ace?

Posted by: Garrett

*********

He can quote "Easter Parade" while baking an exquisite pistachio-lemon dacquoise, all the while being snarky about celebrity relationships?

*ducks*

Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at August 27, 2015 12:24 PM (vgIRn)

231 >>1. Open Borders

>>2. Welfare State

>>Pick one, can't have both.

See I think this is just the calculation that a lot of pols have made and come to the exact opposite conclusion. Welfare states only work when you have enough reproduction to build a big enough base of contributors to cover those taking benefits.

The real calculation becomes how many people must contribute to sustain the growing benefits? If that number is not going to be covered through internal growth you either have to cut benefits or figure out a way to get more people into the contributing column.

Benefits never get cut. Not here, not anywhere. And its not just the politicians who are to blame for that, it's the population getting those benefits.

Western democracies are not reproducing at high enough rates to self-sustain. There is only one other answer unless we start forcing people to have babies.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 27, 2015 12:24 PM (OGm46)

232 I'm doing the butt stuff that most Americans won't do.

Posted by: Senorita Megan at August 27, 2015 12:25 PM (Dwehj)

233 Here's something I don't understand: when did it become the position of the GOPe and Dem party that "you can't deport 11 million people"? or "you can't possibly build any kind of wall on the southern border! That's nuts!"

I mean, why do they say things like that? Clearly, we can lock up millions of people in prisons every year. Clearly, we can monitor everyones internet activity.

I mean, we spend $4 trillion a year. You'd think for $4 Trillion, we'd be able to do some of the basics -- like protecting our national sovereignty.

I just don't understand why these things that seem fairly simple to me are UNPOSSIBLE YOU GUYS!!! now and why everyone just accepts that.

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 12:25 PM (AkOaV)

234 No worries Fenelon!

Posted by: prescient11 at August 27, 2015 12:26 PM (q5APL)

235 Hey, as long as the chicken and cheese Taquito supply dosn't dwindle and the extraordinary actor/director/comedian Danny Trejo is allowed to continue his work here...then mass deportation is fine with me.

Posted by: dananjcon at August 27, 2015 12:26 PM (NpXoL)

236 >>>The 10 hour Hillary laughing? This is the new water boarding right?<<<

It's clear to me now why Bubba would seek female attention from street walkers and other ladies of easy virtue. Hillary is like some stygian abomination from the bowels of hell.

Posted by: Fritz at August 27, 2015 12:26 PM (UzPAd)

237 Bork bork bork!

Posted by: Swedish Chef at August 27, 2015 12:26 PM (2Ojst)

238 >>They are in actuallity taking over countries through cultural demands. These immigrants have a culture; they are happy with it and they have no interest in assimilating into the new country's culture.

Muslim gangs patrolling London and accosting women for not being covered, and others setting up "Sharia Zones":

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2019547/
Anjem-Choudary-Islamic-extremists-set-Sharia-law-zones-UK-cities.html

The UK finally kicked Choudary out, right?

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 12:26 PM (NOIQH)

239 They wrongly assume that the invaders will be as productive as the current population.

And they will but the government hasn't been able to capture that revenue. It's all going to Mexico.

Just slapping a tax on the remittances to Mexico would slow and perhaps stop the entire scam.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:26 PM (x3GpS)

240 Posted by: JackStraw at August 27, 2015 12:24 PM (OGm46)

...and look, if we did not have a welfare state, I'd be much more open to a more "free flow of labor" libertarian position. I sympathize with the Koch's of the world who have that policy position.

But you can't say "let's let market laws dictate our immigration policy" while at the same time saying, "well, except for all of this massive government interference everywhere that discourages native born americans from working and gives everyone checks every month".

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 12:27 PM (AkOaV)

241 50 in the NY Times. 20 in other places. It's not even a big truck.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 12:27 PM (DsveK)

242 No incentive catering to a demographic when the are led by thought police media who will never paint you as anything other than a dyed in the wool superracist.

Posted by: Rick Tingles at August 27, 2015 12:27 PM (PVcF3)

243
See I think this is just the calculation that a lot of pols have made and come to the exact opposite conclusion. Welfare states only work when you have enough reproduction to build a big enough base of contributors to cover those taking benefits.

--

It works just like the derivative market. You keep inflating the bubble so that it looks sustainable, until it isn't.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at August 27, 2015 12:27 PM (HJ9LB)

244 Just slapping a tax on the remittances to Mexico would slow and perhaps stop the entire scam

Couldn't hurt...

Posted by: donna at August 27, 2015 12:27 PM (hUdMz)

245
Western democracies are not reproducing at high enough rates to self-sustain. There is only one other answer unless we start forcing people to have babies.

...........
annnnnd importing a bunch of 3rd world poorly educated immigrants who mostly live off the welfare state is not a solution. Regardless of the immigrants reproduction rate

Posted by: Yo! at August 27, 2015 12:27 PM (q+zA9)

246 Sink or swim. A hell of a motivator and many industries took advantage of these people with basically slave wages, BUT any wage was better than no wage and starving.

Posted by: Nip Sip

Wrong on one account.

The unemployment rate in MX is lower than that of the US.

They come for higher wages *and* benefits.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at August 27, 2015 12:28 PM (Ck8hC)

247
the german govt is definitely surprising also with all their troubles, they are arresting the protesters instead of the immigrants.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 27, 2015 12:28 PM (ODxAs)

248 "1. Open Borders
/ 2. Welfare State
/ Pick one, can't have both."

Can I pick "none of the above"? Is that on the ballot, 'cause I'd vote for that option.

Posted by: Qoheleth at August 27, 2015 12:30 PM (iIzG7)

249 "63 Those countries are responding to a set of recent developments, mostly the results of the on-going collapse of Iraq, Syria, and the Arab Spring."

Most of which Western nations directly caused by blowing up their stable Arab dictators without replacements and trying to use jihadists as proxies.

Posted by: Not Mitt Romney at August 27, 2015 12:30 PM (TULs6)

250 Posted by: Dancing Queen at August 27, 2015 12:23 PM (/B6Iw)

well, as mark steyn pointed out, with current birth rates and immigration rates, Greece will be majority Muslim within 2 generations, with most of Europe following quickly behind them.

So all of those centuries of trying to conquer Europe militarily were for naught. All they had to do was to just, you know, show up. No need to fire any weapons to conquer Europe.

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 12:30 PM (AkOaV)

251 >.Here's something I don't understand: when did it become the position of the GOPe and Dem party that "you can't deport 11 million people"?

It's a strawman meant to end the debate.
We can't deport them, so we must provide a path to citizenship blah blah blah.
Classic Lefty move of likening any opposition to the most extreme opposing position ("we can't let people die on the streets, so we must instead pay for all of their healthcare").

Funny thing is, though, that with the money we're spending on settling and sustaining (and jailing) illegal immigrants we probably *could* afford to deport most of them as a one-time fee vs. decades of support.
And there's 30+ million, not 11 million.

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 12:30 PM (NOIQH)

252 Here's something I don't understand: when did it become the position of the GOPe and Dem party that "you can't deport 11 million people"? or "you can't possibly build any kind of wall on the southern border! That's nuts!"

"You can't" just means "we don't want to."

They want any possibility other than "Comprehensive Immigration Reform" off the table. And "Comprehensive Immigration Reform" means, "Amnesty Now, and maybe some border security a few years down the road perhaps."

Everything the GOP says is in code.

Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 12:31 PM (O7MnT)

253 The European immigration situation got worse for years now, but especially since we bombed Libya into a failed state. Say what you will about Gaddafi, but he reliably controled the coast lines of his country, so that people wouldnt just get onto boates in the hope that they will make it to Italy.

One of the most ardent supporters of this foreign policy disaster was Marco Rubio. One could rightfully say that he isnt only trying to flood our country with more and more immigrants, but is co-responsible for the European immigration crisis as well.

Posted by: The Nayden Broad at August 27, 2015 12:31 PM (7+xXC)

254 232 I'm doing the butt stuff that most Americans won't do.
Posted by: Senorita Megan at August 27, 2015 12:25 PM (Dwehj)
*********

I'm sure your butt stuff will be tremendous. Simply tremendous. Listen, I'm gonna do great things for your tremendous butt stuff. Great things. Amazing things. Thousands of people will love you for your butt stuff, and love me for providing your tremendous, amazing butt stuff. Tremendously.

Posted by: Donald T. (anon for this) at August 27, 2015 12:31 PM (vgIRn)

255 Welfare states only work when you have enough reproduction to build a
big enough base of contributors to cover those taking benefits.

Huh.

Posted by: 50 million babies aborted since 1973 at August 27, 2015 12:32 PM (/kI1Q)

256 Everything the GOP says is

Bullshit.

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:32 PM (O+0DS)

257 mynewhandle: "Here's something I don't understand..."

Yes you do. We all do.

The Parties are not interested in you. They are bought or are skimming. They want what they want. Maintaining lies and policies against your interest is their expertise. They're hoping either by ignoring or silencing you that you will not resist.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at August 27, 2015 12:32 PM (1CroS)

258 JackStraw I have no idea myself, but recently two visiting Germans (military, one was the NCO in charge at the Bundeswehr infantry school), when asked, said the same thing about the "Ostzone" areas of Germany. To my surprise, they also said that Berlin is now getting sort of run-down. They advised sticking to southern Germany or Hamburg. Interesting.

Posted by: rhomboid at August 27, 2015 12:33 PM (QDnY+)

259 1. Open Borders

2. Welfare State

Pick one, can't have both.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:19 PM (VPLuQ)
---
How bout: "3. None of the above"?

Posted by: The Nayden Broad at August 27, 2015 12:34 PM (7+xXC)

260
The Parties are not interested in you. They are bought or are skimming. They want what they want. Maintaining lies and policies against your interest is their expertise. They're hoping either by ignoring or silencing you that you will not resist.

--

This. As I pointed out yesterday, politics is about giving your constituents the worst best option possible. They don't want to give you what you want,, they don't want to give you what they promised, they want to give you as little as possible while still retaining their seat of power.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at August 27, 2015 12:34 PM (HJ9LB)

261 Funny thing is, though, that with the money we're spending on settling and sustaining (and jailing) illegal immigrants we probably *could* afford to deport most of them as a one-time fee vs. decades of support.
And there's 30+ million, not 11 million.
Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 12:30 PM (NOIQH)

Yeah, I know the numbers are all lies, but using their numbers, here...

Its undoubtedly cheaper to pay $200 to fly someone back to their home country than to support them and their kids for decades on end.

I mean, i don't even know how anyone could make the argument that deportation is more expensive then keeping people here, sending their kids to $10,000 a year per pupil public schools.

Or using emergency services or health care or whatever else, all of which is very expensive for taxpayers.

And the whole IDEA is that if you deport, say, 500,000 people -- that'll light a fire under the asses of the other 30 million, who will either decide to file the paperwork to try to become legal, or who will jump on a greyhound bus and leave on their schedule instead of being picked up at home depot and thrown out.

It's all about incentives and disincentives. Right now, every illegal knows their chances of being deported are slim to none. If you change that calculus, that will change their behavior.

Liberals seem to know this basic concept when it comes to taxing cigarettes or regulating everything to death.

but when you use it in the context of illegal immigration they act like you have a ballsack growing out of your forehead.

Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 12:35 PM (AkOaV)

262 When the whole world turns 3rd world, that's when the dictators show up.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:35 PM (x3GpS)

263

Yet ONE more time--if you want to make an appreciable difference in the current immigration problem you do 2 things--SECURE the border, and enforce existing immigration law RIGOROUSLY.

Then after say, 2 years, revisit and tweak whatever needs attention.

Posted by: irongrampa at August 27, 2015 12:36 PM (jeCnD)

264 >>It works just like the derivative market. You keep inflating the bubble so that it looks sustainable, until it isn't.

Yep. I'm not saying it's a good plan, it's a terrible plan. But it is one way that pols have for kicking the ticking time bomb of unfunded benefits down the road a little bit instead of doing the hard work of telling people the truth and taking tough and unpopular action.

That's our current political class. Constant kick the can down the road by layering one bad policy on top of another instead of ever actually fixing anything.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 27, 2015 12:36 PM (OGm46)

265 I'm thinking of a new nic:

Richard Tater

Whadaya think?

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:36 PM (x3GpS)

266 Ace ghey? No chance, I've never seen him on Rentboy, they even have an ewok section.

http://tinyurl.com/pxbxt3d

Posted by: Barney at August 27, 2015 12:37 PM (0FSuD)

267 As I have had to change nicks, email addresses, hashes, and so on, I am afraid to comment in depth. Posts I made disappeared within thirty seconds. I think I am on a shit list and one of Pixy's hamsters hates me.

Posted by: Colonel Kurtz at August 27, 2015 12:37 PM (yfUzb)

268 Everyone in the west gives Japan a hard time for being xenophobic. Perhaps many are beginning to understand why it is important.

Posted by: Ryome Sakamoto at August 27, 2015 12:37 PM (w/bVh)

269 "Just slapping a tax on the remittances to Mexico would slow and perhaps stop the entire scam"

Until they start mailing cash.

Posted by: Azenogoth (Freedom or Fire) at August 27, 2015 12:38 PM (UPYPp)

270 Pixy's hamsters hate all of us, Colonel. I'm sure it's nothing personal.

Posted by: Qoheleth at August 27, 2015 12:38 PM (iIzG7)

271 >>Posted by: mynewhandle at August 27, 2015 12:35

Exactly!!

ICE is actually paying bus and/or airfare to settle "unaccompanied minors" in their American city of choice, and I've read they're also now flying in their parents to join them.
So...lectures about not being able to afford flying them *out* are insulting.

Posted by: Lizzy at August 27, 2015 12:38 PM (NOIQH)

272
There are so many easy things govt could do that could cut illegal immigration in half in one day.

No benefits, fine employers, pay finder fees to citizens, cut off govt funds to schools that don't comply (from grade school thru college). We all have many solutions, but the US govt won't do it. Period. (I don't believe a Trump would either.)

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 27, 2015 12:38 PM (ODxAs)

273 Colonel: read the banning thread from yesterday. Search for comments by ace. He mentions how some folks get banned like that and what to do and how to do it to get unbanned.

Maybe.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:38 PM (x3GpS)

274 "How bout: "3. None of the above"?"

I'm fine with adding it, and would prefer that choice myself.

But, I only use the two to drive home the point that each choice is mutually exclusive.

Open borders, and a government giving away free shit at the same time is an unsustainable combination over time..

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:38 PM (VPLuQ)

275
Open borders + Welfare state = Anarchy

Yet when someone hops the fence at the Whitehouse, they are not invited to dinner.

Same with President 14 Year Old Girl and gun control. If the guns are sooo evil, then give up your armed guards and quit being a hypocrite.

Posted by: GBruno at August 27, 2015 12:39 PM (u49WF)

276 I've been posting about Calais on Facebook. The situation in Europe is deliberately not covered by the media here. Wouldn't want to mention that Hungary is building one of those useless walls to divert immigrants around their border.

Yes, I do feel sorry for these people. But I don't think Germany or any other country can accept everyone that wants to come in. It will get ugly.

Posted by: notsothoreau at August 27, 2015 12:39 PM (5HBd1)

277 The politicians are trapped in their own snare. They have no choice but to keep things going as they are. Not forever, they know that is impossible, but at least until they are safely in their graves.

Posted by: Positive Waves at August 27, 2015 11:47 AM (MQEz6)

Never underestimate a politician's willingness to pass his problems on to your grandchildren.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at August 27, 2015 12:39 PM (zF6Iw)

278 @261

Well said. NY Slime has a long story about Syrians trying to make it to Hungary before the fence.

One woman, who's husband is a doctor, that left them for Yemen, has a two year child that needs heart surgery and she want to get somewhere it can be done.

She has no money, but expects some country to come forward and operate on her child.

Amazing.

Posted by: Nip Sip at August 27, 2015 12:40 PM (0FSuD)

279 it will get uglier.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:40 PM (x3GpS)

280
249 - nonsense. Dictatorships are not stable. Duh. Iraq hadn't collapsed and wouldn't absent a complete *reversal* in US policy. Syria's dissolution came 10 years after most who knew the country expected it. Not even sure what the "Arab Spring" was ever supposed to denote. Previous versions resulted in tiny "reforms" in less-unstable places like Jordan and the Gulf states.

Oh - and sometimes one's hand is forced, by risk evaluation and sound thinking, into taking action, even against unstable "stable" dictatorships. But that simple common sense is intolerable to many, many otherwise sensible people.

Posted by: rhomboid at August 27, 2015 12:40 PM (QDnY+)

281 Everyone in the west gives Japan a hard time for being xenophobic. Perhaps many are beginning to understand why it is important.

Posted by: Ryome Sakamoto

No. Japan's in a bad spot because they are the photo-negative of the open borders crowd. Both untenable and destructive in the long run.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (Ck8hC)

282 -
"Until they start mailing cash.

Posted by: Azenogoth (Freedom or Fire) at August 27, 2015 12:38 PM"
--------------------

Yes, please do!

Posted by: Mexican Postal Workers at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (zxnPQ)

283 "262 When the whole world turns 3rd world, that's when the dictators show up."

Can anybody identify a single Dictator in the history of the world who allowed their subjects to maintain arms consistent with period armies?

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (VPLuQ)

284
Just tripling or quadrupling the fines and increasing prosecution of employers who hire illegals would be a massive improvement.

Odds of that happening: below zero, because the GOP gets $100 in contrbutions from those who hire illegals for every $1 that is given by individuals who obey the law.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (HJ9LB)

285 Yes, I do feel sorry for these people. But I don't think Germany or any other country can accept everyone that wants to come in. It will get ugly.

And you don't want Germany getting ugly.

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (O+0DS)

286 Great post Ace exposing the Cosmopolitan cultural Marxist war on Europeans and Euro-Americans. The mass invasion by 3rd worlders is designed by the elites to destroy the majority populations.

Trump is waking up the silent majority to the slow genocide of Euro- Americans. The goal is to create a complaint population that will enable the Cosmopolitans to maintain power.

I am glad Ace you are waking up from Cuckservative lives.

Posted by: The silent majority awakes at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (eAEhi)

287
And in fear of being called "teachers pet" yet again, I will not compliment or strongly agree with Ace.

Posted by: GBruno at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (u49WF)

288 That was when Alicia Silverstone was at her hottest...

She has Keira Knightley boobs.

Posted by: wrg500 at August 27, 2015 12:04 PM (C278+)

*sings*

And she'll tease you
She'll unease you
All the better just to please you
She's precocious and she knows just
What it takes to make a pro blush
Still you'd rather squeeze Chris Christie's moobs
She's got Keira Knightley boobs

Posted by: naturalfake sings the Hits! at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (KUa85)

289 the japanese are having their problems because of pron.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 27, 2015 12:41 PM (x3GpS)

290 The West is the Wizard of Oz.

Posted by: Boss Moss at August 27, 2015 12:42 PM (DsveK)

291 289 the japanese are having their problems because of pron.

Porn is a symptom, not a cause.

Posted by: ConservativeMonster at August 27, 2015 12:42 PM (0NdlF)

292 If the Feds don't build a wall and secure the birder the citizens will do it.

Can someone game out how these problems get solved peacefully?

I can't.

The Empire will fight. It will fight with engineered riots and incidents.

Posted by: Positive Waves at August 27, 2015 12:42 PM (MQEz6)

293 Long time reader, first time commenter. Limey.

I just wanted to point out that immigrants and asylum seekers (refugees) are entirely distinct in legal terms and the two types should not be conflated. The latter are covered by the
1951 Geneva Convention on Refugees and the 1967 Protocol Relating to
the Status of Refugees (aka the New York Protocol). Signatory countries have legal and binding obligations, i.e. to accept, register and process refugees, assessing cases on an individual basis and only deporting those who don't qualify.

These obligations will only change if and when those treaties are amended. Morality doesn't come into it, and emotive tirades (like Glenn Reynolds') in which terms are misused and/or slung around as if interchangeable do nothing to advance understanding or work towards a solution.

Sorry if that sounds ranty, but it's a vital distinction and one that never seems to be made. Labelling asylum seekers 'migrants' is not going to get anyone anywhere.

Posted by: Argh at August 27, 2015 12:42 PM (lTils)

294 "... cut off govt funds to schools that don't comply..."

Deport the illegals, and to Los Angeles USD will implode (yes, I know I'm saying that as though they haven't already), leaving a whole lot of unionized teachers and other hangers-on out of work. Seems like everyone capable of benefitting from an education is now either being homeschooled, sent to Catholic school, or the whole fam damily has up and relocated to Texas.

Posted by: Qoheleth at August 27, 2015 12:42 PM (iIzG7)

295 I don't want to single anyone out, but...

When you go to the bathroom, wash your hands.

We'll be watching those who habitually sniff their fingers.

Posted by: jwest at August 27, 2015 12:43 PM (Zs4uk)

296 I'm fine with adding it, and would prefer that choice myself.

But, I only use the two to drive home the point that each choice is mutually exclusive.

Open borders, and a government giving away free shit at the same time is an unsustainable combination over time..

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:38 PM (VPLuQ)
---
Yeah I understand that and used this argument myself in the past. But then I came across the libertarian crowd and these people are only too glad to get rid of the welfare state so that they can have open borders.

Posted by: The Nayden Broad at August 27, 2015 12:43 PM (7+xXC)

297 Asimov calculated that the carrying capacity of Earth is from 35,000,000,000,000 to 40,000,000,000,000. Yes the number of zeroes is correct -- between thirty-five and forty TRILLION.

If'n white folk won't fill up the planet, then people-of-pigment will.

In other terms -- if the white population remains stable, then eventually it will be outnumbered by about ten-thousand to one. Try having a conversation about race at that point.

Posted by: Marooned Maroon at August 27, 2015 12:43 PM (hTHAs)

298 Japan's in a bad spot because they are the photo-negative of the open borders crowd. Both untenable and destructive in the long run.

Japan is building robots to do its scut work. The rest of the industrialized world is importing third world labor. We'll see how this works out.

So far, the main impact of Japan's closed border policy is higher living standards for the Japanese.

Posted by: V the K at August 27, 2015 12:43 PM (O7MnT)

299 I could see conservatives forging a new coalition almost like in Europe where it's "if you want to keep your government goodies and generous benefits, better keep the illegals out". And maybe just putting the entitlement debate on hold until this problem has been fixed.

I'm amazed that Republicans will stick their neck out for something like MediCare or Social Security reform but not something universally popular across all demographics like building a border wall.

I honestly believe if you solved the illegal immigration problem it would save far more dollars (to say nothing of our culture) than any medicare/social security voucher proposal.

Posted by: Coolio at August 27, 2015 12:44 PM (LOPDw)

300 Let me just do a little stretching first...

Posted by: Banhammer at August 27, 2015 12:44 PM (zxnPQ)

301 She has no money, but expects some country to come forward and operate on her child.

Amazing.

To be fair, any decent mother will value her child over the cost to others.

But us "others" have a right to value *our* children and societies more than the cost to her.

Posted by: ConservativeMonster at August 27, 2015 12:44 PM (0NdlF)

302 >>JackStraw I have no idea myself, but recently two visiting Germans (military, one was the NCO in charge at the Bundeswehr infantry school), when asked, said the same thing about the "Ostzone" areas of Germany. To my surprise, they also said that Berlin is now getting sort of run-down. They advised sticking to southern Germany or Hamburg. Interesting.

I've been to Germany about a dozen times over the last few years. Various spots such as Berlin, Hamburg, Leipzig, Hannover, etc.. I was in Hannover this past June right during the elections in Turkey. We were having dinner at an outdoor cafe on the night of the vote and it turned out that the Kurdish party one enough votes for representation in parliament for the first time ever.

Our care was right on a city square and out of nowhere hundreds of Turkish Kurds spontaneously showed up in the square to celebrate. Loudly. Fireworks, bands, dancing and singing. The locals, including the cops, just stood around stunned.

There is going to be a meltdown at some point. A lot of anger building.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (OGm46)

303 "So far, the main impact of Japan's closed border policy is higher living standards for the Japanese."

Well, and some potentially really cool sexbots .

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (VPLuQ)

304 Oh, and ace -- I just googled "Clueless."

I shall not comment any further, for it would possibly be my last
comment what with the new banning policy and all. But suffice to say -- Really, sir? Really?

Posted by: mynewhandle

Actually, "Clueless" is a funny little movie. Probably rather dated now, but a good watch. Plus, it has one of my all-time favorite movie lines ever:

I've got a .45 and a shovel. I don't think anyone will miss you.

Posted by: Moderate Salami, weeping for our dead Republic at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (/Ho8c)

305 Just tripling or quadrupling the fines and increasing prosecution of employers who hire illegals would be a massive improvement

As I have said before, asset forfiture. If the cops can take your car for picking up a hooker, the fedgov can take your business for hiring illegals.

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (O+0DS)

306 Europe, of course, could solve its problem by setting up some administrative zones right there in Africa, and saving the refugees that risky Med trip. Belgium, Britain, Germany, France and Italy used to be really good at this.

The problem for the US is that all our former "colonies" are pretty well populated.
IIRC the Democrat solution to this was called "Fifty-four forty."

Posted by: Stringer Davis at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (xq1UY)

307 Nood ISIS.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - Fire-hooks and Rock Salt for sale at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (kff5f)

308 America is the only country for whom sovereignty is racist.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (fJ5wU)

309 It is great to see conservative wake up and realize the slow genocide against Euro- Americans. White Nationalism is a valid ideology and it brings me joy to see many here embrace it and reject Cuckservatism.

Posted by: The silent majority awakes at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (eAEhi)

310
I highly doubt that the Clovis people invited huge numbers of armed strangers into there camps to share the wooly mammoth meals. Then again, maybe that's why they're gone.

Posted by: GBruno at August 27, 2015 12:45 PM (u49WF)

311 And, I'd also like to take this opportunity to thank Ace for his benevolence, fairness, and mercy.

Please don't ban me. I like it here.

Posted by: Moderate Salami, weeping for our dead Republic at August 27, 2015 12:46 PM (/Ho8c)

312
So. When is Buzzions' funeral?

Posted by: Hillary Clinton at August 27, 2015 12:47 PM (HSmrB)

313 "But then I came across the libertarian crowd and these people are only too glad to get rid of the welfare state so that they can have open borders."

And they intend to wean a fair portion of our population off the government welfare tit how?

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:47 PM (VPLuQ)

314 Japan's in a bad spot because they are the photo-negative of the open borders crowd. Both untenable and destructive in the long run.
Posted by: weft cut-loop
-----------------------------------------------------
meh. It's only destructive because changing attitudes are causing the demographic death spiral.

There is no reason to believe that that's an inevitability. If attitudes can change in the first place, they can be changed again.

We've got to get the liberal cancer out of our educational system.

I suspect Darwinism may also fix the problem. Ie. people who don't want kids will naturally select themselves out, and those who like large families will replace them.

Kind of like those bacterial experiments where a poison chemical is introduced into a colony that only a few bacteria have the ability to deal with.

The population plunges drastically, but then rebuilds itself.

Posted by: cheese eating Quokka on the sidebar at August 27, 2015 12:47 PM (E5UB0)

315 Marooned Maroon: "Asimov calculated that the carrying capacity of Earth is from 35,000,000,000,000 to 40,000,000,000,000."

He has no idea what the carrying capacity of the Earth is. As a textbook exercise, he can postulate anything. Reality has a way of throwing in lots of wrenches. There's no way he's accounted for them.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at August 27, 2015 12:47 PM (1CroS)

316 Sorry if that sounds ranty, but it's a vital distinction and one that never seems to be made. Labelling asylum seekers 'migrants' is not going to get anyone anywhere.

Posted by: Argh at August 27, 2015 12:42 PM (lTils)
---
I dont think that citizens, who have the impression that their country is flooded with foreigners, care about these finer judicial distinctions.

Posted by: The Nayden Broad at August 27, 2015 12:48 PM (7+xXC)

317 But then I came across the libertarian crowd and these people are only too glad to get rid of the welfare state so that they can have open borders.

How will they pay for THEIR choom & cheetos then?

Posted by: rickb223 at August 27, 2015 12:48 PM (O+0DS)

318 299
Government programs should be only for Euro Americans. We deserve to be taken care since we built this nation. Trump understands we need a welfare state that benefits real Americans.

Posted by: The silent majority awakes at August 27, 2015 12:49 PM (eAEhi)

319
Irongrampa, yes.

I rant (well, actually explain) on the physical barrier issue mostly because I am flabbergasted at seeing so many people who (apparently sincerely) believe that water runs uphill - i.e., that physical barriers don't work. Of course they do. And of course each situation is different.

But the US southern border is easily (*easily*) "defensible" - that is, made hard vs. soft. Combo of conventional barriers (deeper and more robust than currently used - years of experience with the few barriered areas of course has yielded lots of wisdom about making things more effective), patrolled/monitored stretches of impassable terrain, etc. Girls' gym, as we used to say.

And the costs are laughable - in comparison to, say, the monthly welfare tab in just one state (CA) for illegals. The idea that a barrier would be too costly is, sorry, ludicrous and unserious. It wouldn't even be one of the larger projects of recent times.

But none of this means you don't ALSO enforce laws on this side of the barrier. Of course. That enforcement is already paid for - it just isn't done. Basic enforcement of the law plus a serious barrier on the southern border would change things dramatically, and very very quickly.

Posted by: rhomboid at August 27, 2015 12:49 PM (QDnY+)

320 Aisle 309 could stand a quick clean-up.

Posted by: irongrampa at August 27, 2015 12:50 PM (jeCnD)

321 Remember all the tin foil hat people warning about the coming North American Union? How we laughed until low and behold there turned out to be a sample coin and a "speculative" NGO/government policy group actually working on that.
Remember the TPP? Secret cross border agreements and reciprocity only to be revealed years after "we have to pass it to find out what's in it"?

Who draws borders? The elite do. Churchill, Roosevelt and Stalin after the war but sometimes things are just split up like the remains of a garage sale. The PRC central committee and Tibet. The EPA and the States sometimes.
There is a bigger game being played here.

Posted by: Daybrother at August 27, 2015 12:50 PM (gVHY/)

322 Signatory countries have legal and binding obligations, i.e. to accept,
register and process refugees, assessing cases on an individual basis
and only deporting those who don't qualify.

"Refugees" have the obligation to register and stay in the
first signatory country where they land, but they're migrating to
countries that offer better free shit. After awhile it's hard to
believe "escaping to safety" was their only goal.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 27, 2015 12:51 PM (/kI1Q)

323 313 "But then I came across the libertarian crowd and these people are only too glad to get rid of the welfare state so that they can have open borders."

Libertarians really are stupid, they have this idea that none of their actions have any political consequences that could in turn lead to far more government control and statism.

If the US truly had a 1920's type immigration policy that was anything goes, we would have the same form of government as Venezuela in a single election cycle.

But yea, on that one issue of allowing people who want to come can work, that would be a miniscule curb of government power.

Posted by: Coolio at August 27, 2015 12:51 PM (LOPDw)

324 Venezuela has a big problem with Colombian invaders right now. Venezuela is cracking down on border-crossers because the invaders are bringing viloence and crime to many areas in Venezuela.
_________________

Ah, so sad too bad for them.

Aren't we lucky that all our illegal aliens are budding valedictorians and tech geniuses in the making!

And psssst, just ignore all those crime stats that prove otherwise. Like the stat showing that 40% of Florida's murders are committed by illegal aliens, even though illegal aliens are less than 10% of the population. Or all those federal crimes of which illegal aliens are convicted at wildly disproportionate rates. Or all those state prisons in AZ, TX, CA, etc., that are busting at the seams with violent "immigrant" inmates.

No, all our illegal alien invaders are just good, decent, hard-working folks who just want to be together with their families in an "act of love" and make a better life for themselves here. They aren't here to prey upon us like locusts. And the millions of illegals on our welfare rolls, or in our prisons, well that's just an urban myth or right-wing propaganda or some such . . . .

Posted by: TrivialPursuer at August 27, 2015 12:51 PM (a31sM)

325 "249 - nonsense. Dictatorships are not stable. "

Come off your ideological crusade. Of course dictatorships are stable. Democracy is historically weird and has no history in most places.

"Iraq hadn't collapsed and wouldn't absent a complete *reversal* in US policy."

Iraq has completely collapsed and it no longer exists. Saddam kept the place from turning into a giant genocidal civil war, which it now is with half of it under the control of ISIS.

"Syria's dissolution came 10 years after most who knew the country expected it."

Syria's dissolution wouldn't have happened at all if NATO countries weren't trying to dissolve it and supporting rebels.

Don't forget Yemen and Libya, where the West supported rebels who overthrew the dictator and launched both countries into ongoing civil war. Extra crispy ISIS controls a growing portion of Libya and original recipe Al Qaeda now has control of about 1/3 of Yemen.

Not that they didn't try to do the same thing in Egypt too but thank god for the Egyptian military junta. General Al-Sisi is the Moderate Muslim.

Posted by: Not Mitt Romney at August 27, 2015 12:51 PM (TULs6)

326 So, AnonymousDrivel, what is the correct number for the carrying capacity of Earth? Never mind you are obviously here for the reason that Ace has updated the Banning Policy.

Posted by: Marooned Maroon at August 27, 2015 12:52 PM (hTHAs)

327 We, in the West, are going through an identity crises.

Progressive forces within the West, believed that Nationalism is the root of War. If you could all just be 'citizens of the world' there would be no war, as there would be no one willing to fight.

But they failed to take into account culture.

The culture of France, is different than the culture of England... or America for that matter... and in Democracies, our Governments reflect the culture of the electorate.

So now we see our cultures, our values... heck our very way of life being changed by those from outside our culture.... and the GOOD things we and our forefathers built, being taken from our children, and given to those not of our culture.

Thus you see people looking to change their governments policies to protect THEIR culture.... their way of life... and they will do it by redefining Citizenship, so that it actually MEANS something more than Free Stuff from said government...

Next up will be the debate about Dual Citizenship.... bank on it.

Posted by: BB Wolf at August 27, 2015 12:52 PM (qh617)

328 And they intend to wean a fair portion of our population off the government welfare tit how?

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 27, 2015 12:47 PM (VPLuQ)
---
Well, thats my problem with libertarians: they are always eager to advance the liberal parts of their agenda (weed! WEEEED!) and turn into underpants gnomes when it comes to the conservative parts (I still have to pay for pothead unemployment/healthcare, right?).

Posted by: The Nayden Broad at August 27, 2015 12:53 PM (7+xXC)

329 I'd mock Ace for being that familiar with Clueless, but, *BANNED*

Posted by: Turd Ferguson at August 27, 2015 11:42 AM

Clueless?!

The movie that gave us the line "Hey...you! If anything happens to my daughter, I have a .45 and a shovel. I doubt anyone would miss you."?!

Come on, Moron dads...back me up here.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at August 27, 2015 12:53 PM (AqaiB)

330 People have noticed. This is why Trump is winning now and may take the whole thing.

Posted by: The Era of Big Immigration Is Over at August 27, 2015 12:54 PM (6gR7l)

331 Aisle 309 could stand a quick clean-up.

Posted by: irongrampa at August 27, 2015 12:50 PM (jeCnD)

It's Hector. Who sucks cock by choice.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at August 27, 2015 12:54 PM (aRgrb)

332 To me the wall issue is one of those litmus tests where I just can't trust you unless you want a physical barrier.

I understand the weak arguments against it, some are even a tiny bit valid, but 99.9% of the time, it's a pol that wants open borders that has a problem with a fence or wall.

Posted by: Coolio at August 27, 2015 12:54 PM (LOPDw)

333 One solution against 3rd world invasion is to nuke Mexico and the Carribean islands. This will create a radioactive buffer between the US and the Latin nations.

Posted by: The silent majority awakes at August 27, 2015 12:54 PM (eAEhi)

334 Marooned Maroon: "So, AnonymousDrivel, what is the correct number for the carrying capacity of Earth? Never mind you are obviously here for the reason that Ace has updated the Banning Policy."

I have no idea what the carrying capacity of Earth is. And neither does Asimov.

As to the rest, you have no idea what you're talking about.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at August 27, 2015 12:55 PM (1CroS)

335 330
Trump is putting fear in the hearts of Cosmopolitan cultural Marxist and Cuckservatives. Euro Americans are awake and we want our nation back.

Posted by: The silent majority awakes at August 27, 2015 12:56 PM (eAEhi)

336 By way of review, Ace:

1) Had a post on Luntz, and said,

'I'll give Trump this much: He is right to call them "morons." '

(Trump, BTW, had very unflattering things to say about Luntz.)

2) Had a post on Jorge, where he referred to Trump's treatment of a certain faux-reporter activist as "Glorious" (in itallics).

3) This one basically says 'Trump "gets it" on immigration, in certain ways, and some countries in Europe are buying a clue too.'

So, is Ace warming up to Trump? Trump has the unusual characteristic that you can find yourself saying "Hell, yeah!" when he speaks, even though he's not really "your guy" on policy issues.

My own theory is that he's the ONLY ONE on-target with what I call the "meta-issues." Why support the guy you would normally support - whose positions you like the most - when you know they're NEVER going to make those things happen, anyway? If you can't push back against the PC Inquisition, how can you EVER do ANYTHING meaningful?

Posted by: Optimizer at August 27, 2015 01:03 PM (/q6+P)

337
Trump is the clear LEADER on the crucial fight against Illegal Immigration in America.

No other GOP candidate is as strong.
No other GOP candidate is providing LEADERSHIP on the issue.

Posted by: Trump Super-Fan at August 27, 2015 01:04 PM (l2dSQ)

338 The last thing European countries have ever been is "enlightened" on immigration. Nativism and ethnic hatred aren't just theoretical there, as evidenced by the Yugoslav wars just 20 years ago. My grandfather's ancestral village in northeast Croatia was literally (not Biden "literally," but actually literally) eliminated from the face of the earth.

I wouldn't necessarily look to those impulses as models for Americans to emulate. It's exactly the fear of bringing Euro-style strongman nativist fascism to our country that motivates many of those opposed to Trump, myself included.

What really brings these fears to the fore for me is the constant focus on the USA southern border with Mexico. Only about half the estimated total of illegal immigrants in this country are Mexican citizens. 40 % are visa overstays from other countries, not Mexicans at all. Yet all the rhetoric is about people from Latin America, specifically Mexico.

That sounds to those of us with familiarity with the effects of ethnic hatred ginned up by demagogues to be not a reasoned attempt to solve a problem, but rather a way to gain power by stirring up divisions and antagonism against the foreign "other.".

We've had quite enough of that under the current narcissist with daddy issues in the White House. We don't need to continue it with a different party label for the next 4 years.

Posted by: trumpetdaddy at August 27, 2015 01:06 PM (ljZD2)

339 @250 mynewhandle
Well, Mark Steyn is exactly right. That is what is going on -- Muslims are taking over just by showing up and having 3 kids to every European's one.

Same is happening to America with the Hispanics.

Anyone who cries about how they are just poor immigrants trying to make a better life for themselves is arguing in favor of national suicide/no sovereign countries. It wouldnt piss me off so much if they were HONEST about it. But like all lefty positions they can't argue honestly for it because they know the majority wouldn't buy it.

Posted by: Dancing Queen at August 27, 2015 01:11 PM (/B6Iw)

340 163 Trump should focus strictly on non-Mexican Illegals in his comments, and then when it's time to actually execute the legislation....the Mexicans will automatically be enveloped in.

If you take the word "Mexican" or "Hispanic" out of the conversation.....getting this done should be a cake walk.

Posted by: Covert Revolutionary at August 27, 2015 12:09 PM (SJi0a)
-----------------------
I don't agree that it would be a cake walk, but you are right about keeping the anti-Mexican stuff out of the conversation.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at August 27, 2015 01:13 PM (cN9Sk)

341
Fiddling while Rome burns.

"We can't deport them!"

Why not?
Here's A Hypothetical:

The ISS was launched (as a project) in 1998. We have spent somewhere in the neighborhood of $200 Billion, for a return of...., well, nothing.

If we assume that there are 30 Million ( I can't wrap my head around that..) illegals here, then were the same resources applied, we would have ~$7000 per head to deport them.

I dunno..., that sounds pretty easy to me.

Establish small detention centers in each state, small enough to just hold a single bus load of detainees (for a very short time). One per state (at $1 million each) would cost $50 Million. That leaves PLENTY of working capital.

Once 40 are rounded up (hell, offer a $500 bounty), the bus rolls for the border while the next 50 are being rounded up.

I'm thinking that the border crossing rate would drop pretty quickly.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 27, 2015 01:13 PM (9mTYi)

342 "Previous versions resulted in tiny "reforms" in less-unstable places like Jordan and the Gulf states."

Note that these less unstable places such as Jordan and the Gulf states are all dictatorial monarchies....

Posted by: Not Mitt Romney at August 27, 2015 01:14 PM (TULs6)

343 Another thing I want to say about todays immigration....when my fathers parents came over here just after the end of WWI (they had fled from Italy after the Fascists led by Mussolini came into power) they arrived with just their clothes on their backs and some suitcases, came through Ellis Island, had to go through the entire long process. They lived in Newark NJ at a time when Newark was actually a nice city, all the rich had gorgeous homes there. But anyways his parents IMMEDIATELY did all they could to learn the ENGLISH language, his father got a job actually building the streets, the sewers, the ditches. They didn't ask for help as their wasn't any of these bullshit immigrant organizations we have to deal with now, they helped themselves by becoming Americans and they were PROUD to be productive citizens and even prouder once they became American Citizens. When my father and his older brother and sister were born they were taught NO Italian at all, English only, as their parents told them they were Americans first. Yes, they picked up some Italian from some of the other Italians in the neighborhood but their parents learned and spoke English as soon as possible, learned on their own! Todays immigrants....well ive known personally or know others who do, that TOO many immigrants that have been here for YEARS still refuse to learn to speak and right the English language as they are here strictly to make the money to send home so they can have more of their family or friends smuggled across The USA's borders. Its a HUGE difference from yesterdays and todays immigration, whether it be legal or illegal and its all thanks to the arrogant and ignorant Leftists in the USA. These people are willingly and knowingly doing all they can to "murder" anyone of White European ancestry to replace us with more supplicant peoples. Just look around you and its more than obvious. Where I live here in Northern NJ, it was once pretty much all white with a smattering of blacks. Now I see tons of Hispanics, ghetto blacks, many Russian and Eastern Europeans and to my shock and dismay I am now seeing muslims popping up here and there. The Russians and eastern Europeans all seem to be hard working and they at least try to speak English. The ghetto blacks, well I'm from Newark, NJ originally, so I see problems brewing already as crime and drug problems have been increasing steadily, the Hispanics all refuse to speak English and have been also stars of more crime statistics in the county. The muslims I have been watching to see if they increase their numbers and when they will start up with their bullshit when they have sufficient numbers to agitate. And no I am not a bigot, I give everyone a chance to like or not like them, I'm just watching/observing the facts and truth as they happen about me.

Posted by: Cycomiko66 at August 27, 2015 01:16 PM (O45yk)

344
Pinging out to comment # 340.

Margarrita, I agree the more that Trump (or Cruz or anyone) manages to emphasize non-hispanic Illegal Immigration the easier it is to get the message past those stricken with white guilt.

While it's not currently a logistical problem, our immigration laws should apply as much to white Canadians as anyone else.
If they come (or stay) here illegally, we should find them and ship them home. If a white Canadian illegal alien comes back give him a year in jail. If he comes back again, give him 5 years.

Posted by: Trump Super-Fan at August 27, 2015 01:20 PM (l2dSQ)

345 Glenn Reynolds is not quite correct here. I don't think there is a "liberal enlightened Europe". Europe is much further down the road to socialism (they say, the "democraticd kind") than the U.S. Their very survival is at stake. We all are being invaded at the pleasure of the CofC, globalist, elitist corporatists and financiers.

Posted by: pyromancer76 at August 27, 2015 01:23 PM (sPfLU)

346 @338

Well, it's tricky, isn't it?

On the one hand, you don't want "ethnic hatred", but on the other hand, if you allow people with ethnic hatred in, they present a security risk, and might burn down your village.

The thing is, it's a TWO-WAY STREET.

Proper immigration policy is a simple and obvious thing:
(1) Let people in who can be an asset to the country - which is to say, no country can endure if it makes itself the World's welfare colony.
(2) Let a SMALL enough number in from every given ethnicity that they will assimilate over time. If you don't do that, you're simply inviting COLONISTS, not immigrants, and they're going to burn down your village.
(3) If you don't control the border, you can accomplish neither of the above. It's common sense, and the way Trump puts it, "If you don't, you don't have a country."

When Trump says "Mexico is not sending it's best", he is saying nothing that's even remarkable. Doctors are not standing in unemployment lines because they've been displaced by illegal aliens. What Trump is implicitly pointing out is that there are OTHER countries that ARE sending their best, who are following the rules, and they're facing HUGE obstacles to get in.

That's HARDLY pointing the finger at foreigners as the evil "other" people. It's so DISHONEST to conflate the illegal invasion of our country by parasites from south of the border with LEGAL immigration, which practically everybody - including Trump - consider to be VALUABLE.

Posted by: Optimizer at August 27, 2015 01:32 PM (/q6+P)

347
@ 343

Paragraph breaks are your friend.

But what you said is spot on.

Posted by: irongrampa at August 27, 2015 01:39 PM (jeCnD)

348 @339 "...It wouldnt piss me off so much if they were HONEST about it. But like all lefty positions they can't argue honestly for it because they know the majority wouldn't buy it."

Indeed! Apparently they see that they're losing ground in huge chunks on this (thanks to Trump, BTW), because the PC Inquisition tried to "outlaw" the term "anchor baby" recently. They try to make sure you can't use any terms that aren't absurdly contorted euphemisms (otherwise you're HATEFUL!!), to obfuscate what's even being talking about. Only Trump is pushing back against this stuff, BTW.

Posted by: Optimizer at August 27, 2015 01:40 PM (/q6+P)

349 This is the bottom line for Europe:
http://tinyurl.com/pe8jalg

Posted by: Randy M at August 27, 2015 01:49 PM (iwy8d)

350 @337

That sounds like such a gratuitous campaign ad, which I generally find out-of-place and offensive.

But the thing is ... it's just TRUE!

And that's more of a knock on the non-Trump Republican party, than it is a "cheering section" for Trump. Imagine if a Republican who was better on policy was HALF the strong leader Trump is. It'd be a goddamn miracle...

Posted by: Optimizer at August 27, 2015 01:50 PM (/q6+P)

351 Breaking: Resources are finite, cost other resources.

[...]

Correction Headline: Republicans, UKIP, Nazis, similar groups believing in existence of "law" outed as more xenophobic, racist than ever.

Posted by: The World's Most Trusted News Source at August 27, 2015 01:52 PM (N6eLE)

352 @irongrampa...sorry about that, I'm not used to leaving posts and my spelling, grammar and ways of writing are not the best but I do try to get my point across as best I can. I humbly apologize.

I may be an ignorant "teabagger" to the Leftists but I consider myself more wise and intelligent due to the fact that I observe, I watch and learn as much as possible about the FACTS of whatever situation I am interested in. I'm not all touchy feely like the Leftists are. I use my brain and free will that was God given to use. The Leftists brains are so open that they have fallen completely out and gone splat! on the ground!

Posted by: Cycomiko66 at August 27, 2015 02:57 PM (O45yk)

353 ...Europe is talking about walls and immigrant crackdowns, too.

Talking. Hell, they are doing it. We are the saps still talking.

Posted by: Case, Mors Semper Tyrannis at August 28, 2015 01:18 AM (j2xmV)

354 Well it's certainly been a major issue here in Australia since the 90s when we were being invaded by Iraqi 'refugees' on boats fro Indonesia. And that's one reason why we supported and participated in the invasion of Iraq to eliminate Saddam, which worked for us - no more Iraqi boatpeople.

But the only ones we put in prison are the smugglers profiting from risk and death by loading people on unsafe boats and trying to deliberately sink them so they'll be rescued. We treat the innocent humanely but try to prevent them setting foot on the mainland. So far it's worked, when liberal progressive types don't 'lure refugees to their deaths' on unsafe boats.

Who knows what the future holds? But I support national boundaries and control of flows of people. To abandon control is to invite disaster, just like allowing free crowd movement in a sport stadium - many will die in the crush.

Posted by: bruce at August 28, 2015 07:47 AM (CDJHJ)

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