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Trump TV! All Trump, All The Time! [Weirddave]
Say what you will about Donald John Trump, but how many of us wish that Romney had had the balls to run an ad like this 3 years ago?
I'm betting the number is as close to 100% as you can get. If Romney had done that, we'd be gearing up for his re-election campaign, not endlessly arguing about Donald Trump. I remain constantly amazed at how badly the Trump candidacy is being handled by the Republican Party as a whole. Frankly, if I were Reince Priebus, when Trump started to gain traction I would have gotten down on my knees and praised God with tears of joy pouring from the corners of my eyes. Donald Trump could be the greatest thing to happen to the Republican Party since Lincoln got a gleam in his eye about slavery, but they're too dumb to recognize it. Stupid party indeed. First of all, the Republican Party should recognize that we're fifteen months away from the election. I know that politics is their business, and it's human nature to elevate the importance of what one does to prominence over everything else, but one should also have a bit of historical knowledge as well. I don't believe there has been a candidate in the modern era who has lead in the polls fifteen months out from an election that has even won their party's nomination, much less the presidency. Say, does anyone remember Senator Ted Cruz's filibuster? The one that was supposed to doom Republican hopes in the next election? It took place 9/24/2013, just fourteen months before the Republicans crushed the Democrat party in 2014. Trump wants to put his bombastic ass out there? Fine. Excellent, even. The party should be paying him to do so. Why? Well, for one thing, Donald Trump is a gigantic target, the ultimate “kick me” sign. He's sucking all of the air from the room, and garnering all of the attention of everyone on the left. How great is that? The Republican Party should be content to let Trump suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous Democrats. It's a golden opportunity to get their own house in order while nobody is looking, you know, dig up a another candidate who was a governor before the lifetime of anyone alive today, replace the batteries in Jeb so that he's more dynamic, that kind of thing. Letting Trump go be The Donald is a good bet, no matter how you slice it. It’s more than likely that he'll crash and burn, just because of who he is, and in that case you've gained a respite. Afterward you can ask Trump to campaign for the eventual nominee. Plus he'll be a lot less likely to run third party and hand the election to the Democrats if he's treated with respect while he is running. Finally, on the off chance that he does maintain his momentum and gets the nomination, by not attacking him you'll be in a better position to co-opt him for the general. “Congratulations Donald, you're the Republican nominee, what can we do to help? Here are all the resources we have in place as a party. Let's talk about how they can best be used to your advantage.”. He's been a businessman all his life, making deals is his bread and butter, that's what he'll be looking to do. But making deals with people who've been personally attacking him for months? Yea, not gonna happen, and anyway the Republican party isn't having any of that, no siree Bob! The correct solution is obviously to attack the 25% of Republicans who are currently supporting Trump, thereby making it less likely that the base will vote for whoever the nominee winds up being. Jesus Hallmark Christ these people are stupid. Second, Trump is providing the invaluable service of testing the water. He's the ultimate marketing survey. Every other candidate should be making notes as to what Trump is saying that is resonating, and adjusting their candidacy accordingly. You couldn't pay for a poll that in depth and detailed, and Trump's serving it up on a platter. So far the only one doing this is Ted Cruz. As a Cruz guy, I think that's great. I freaking love Donald Trump because Cruz is using him just as I'm advocating in this article. The consultant class hate it, one of them was on CNN Friday lamenting :
You do not benefit by trying to draft behind Donald Trump and hope that he collapses and his low-information supporters run into your arms. This is a guy who is increasingly leading a fraction of the conservative base into a very dangerous cul-de-sac. He is promising things that he can never deliver. And it is time for Jeb Bush and other folks to start posting up and really comparing and contrasting Donald Trump’s rhetoric with the reality.Look, I'll make it even simpler than that. I've been in sales type jobs my entire life. I'm an insurance agent, and while I don't treat it as my place to “sell” my clients anything, it's more about simply matching their needs, I am aware of the techniques. One of the simplest is to simply listen, the client will tell you what they want. For example, suppose I'm meeting with someone who needs health insurance. In our conversation, he tells me that he's concerned about having insurance to cover his check ups. Now, buying health insurance to pay for preventive care is stupid. It's cataclysmicly dumb. Depending on how emphatically they emphasize the point, I may even think to myself “Good Lord you're an idiot”. Do I tell them that? NO! What I do do is emphasize how each policy handles well visits as I'm reviewing them. I mean, how hard is that? Trump is doing the Republican Party the invaluable service of showing them what to focus on, and they are too inbread to see it. The above quote from CNN comes from someone who thinks he can tell people what they should do instead of listening to what they want. That's someone who has forgotten that politicians work for the people, not the other way around. Trump mania is a crystal clear example of the people trying to make that point to the political class. Will they be smart enough to listen? So far, all signs point to no.
Comments
(Jump to bottom of comments)1
Trump trump trump trump Trump...
Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 16, 2015 01:27 PM (NaeCR)
2
Deck chairs. Titanic. Some rearrangement necessary.
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 01:27 PM (NeFrd)
3
freakin' Renfields hoping to transition into vampires themselves.
Posted by: Kindltot at August 16, 2015 01:27 PM (3pRHP)
4
Hello...?
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:27 PM (evvLu)
5
Ah, there we go.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:28 PM (evvLu)
6
Trumpety Trump Trump!
Posted by: ManWithNoParty, unperson from Free Market Jesus Paradise at August 16, 2015 01:28 PM (2z4UX)
7
Now, buying health insurance to pay for preventive care is stupid.
HEY!
Doesn't your auto insurance pay for tune-ups and oil/tire changes? Mine does.
HEY!
Doesn't your auto insurance pay for tune-ups and oil/tire changes? Mine does.
Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 16, 2015 01:29 PM (NaeCR)
Posted by: Kindltot at August 16, 2015 01:29 PM (3pRHP)
9
From henceforth all Ace of Spades shall invoke the name of Trump at least twenty times.
Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 16, 2015 01:31 PM (NaeCR)
Posted by: Louis Gutierrez at August 16, 2015 01:32 PM (bWZS9)
11
Geez.
Why don't y'all just change the name of the blog already? The Trump Show, or Ace of Trumps or something.
24 / 7 is really fucking tiring.
And don't worry - I know where the Hot Air button is. I never use. I'll never use it. The "internet off" button is much more inviting.
Why don't y'all just change the name of the blog already? The Trump Show, or Ace of Trumps or something.
24 / 7 is really fucking tiring.
And don't worry - I know where the Hot Air button is. I never use. I'll never use it. The "internet off" button is much more inviting.
Posted by: Chi at August 16, 2015 01:35 PM (jJx+x)
12
the GOP has much to learn, but I worry that they have been turned loose to early and the dark side will capture their attention.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:35 PM (TxJGV)
13
No one should be invoking the "Trump" name but he's the biggest thing to hit politics in a while. Wears you out, but, he's a thing.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:36 PM (evvLu)
14
Follow the young ones GOP! Do not listen to the wiley Donor Class! Do not let Darth McCain lead you astray, or Emperor Preibus! Feel the force!
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:36 PM (TxJGV)
15
I freaking love Donald Trump because Cruz is using him just as I'm
advocating in this article. The consultant class hate it....
I wouldn't want to place any bets involving Trump being "used" by anyone. That's definitely not his style. The best thing he can do for Cruz is encourage him to firm up his spine. The boy has a long way to go before I'm going to trust him.
If I had to point out one error in your opinions, weirddave, it's that you're falling for the temptation to over-analyze. Trump is, IMO, a bit simpler than the Expert Political Observers make him out to be. Yeah, he might flame out, but more and more I'm thinking he won't.
If he succeeds -- and I'm currently hoping he does -- there will be a shit-ton of atomized craniums among Democrats and the GOPe alike. A Very Good Thing.
advocating in this article. The consultant class hate it....
I wouldn't want to place any bets involving Trump being "used" by anyone. That's definitely not his style. The best thing he can do for Cruz is encourage him to firm up his spine. The boy has a long way to go before I'm going to trust him.
If I had to point out one error in your opinions, weirddave, it's that you're falling for the temptation to over-analyze. Trump is, IMO, a bit simpler than the Expert Political Observers make him out to be. Yeah, he might flame out, but more and more I'm thinking he won't.
If he succeeds -- and I'm currently hoping he does -- there will be a shit-ton of atomized craniums among Democrats and the GOPe alike. A Very Good Thing.
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 01:36 PM (0atQl)
16
It's all good from our perspective. The business climate is good. Sales are soaring.
Posted by: The Industrial-Strength Hairspray Industry at August 16, 2015 01:37 PM (NeFrd)
17
Rinsed Penis and the rest of the GOPe hackery have shown that they have no use for any kind of lessons from The Donald or any of us proles.
They have got this.
They have got this.
Posted by: ManWithNoParty, unperson from Free Market Jesus Paradise at August 16, 2015 01:37 PM (2z4UX)
18
This is like watching early 20th politicians with a Ciceronian style of speaking try to compete with Huey Long.
Yes, Trump is at best as much of a real conservative as Romney was and he'll burn us eventually and I'll go back to bashing him shortly...but there's no excuse for us not doing this sort of stuff since the McCain campaign.
That ad is why I'm still enjoying a bit of this.
Yes, Trump is at best as much of a real conservative as Romney was and he'll burn us eventually and I'll go back to bashing him shortly...but there's no excuse for us not doing this sort of stuff since the McCain campaign.
That ad is why I'm still enjoying a bit of this.
Posted by: AD at August 16, 2015 01:38 PM (s4wTA)
19
Trump is twice the lesbian Rosie O'Donnell could ever hope to be.
Trump is such a genius that if he had chosen a STEM career track, we'd have terraformed Jupiter by now.
Trump's tears can cure cancer. Too bad he doesn't cry.
Trump is such a genius that if he had chosen a STEM career track, we'd have terraformed Jupiter by now.
Trump's tears can cure cancer. Too bad he doesn't cry.
Posted by: Bruce Boehner at August 16, 2015 01:38 PM (qd6sQ)
20
I wrote this at the end of Weirddave's post yesterday morning on "Lost Opportunities", and because I too like to see my words on the screen and want to prod people to bleed/ respond, I thought this was the worst place possible to re-post my thoughtless comment. Because Weirddave. The discussion was about Trump and Perot, third parties and giving the election to Hillary.
Trump and Perot
Both men are actually pretty intelligent.
I
think both men sincerely care about America, which is more than I can
say about Obama and his crowd (and to a large degree, the whole Clinton
crowd).
All politicians have YUGE egos (not huge Yugos) that need
to be fed, as do people that have built up and run big corporations
(like Trump and Perot).
As conservative 'populists' they have
said (and did say) a lot of things that us everyday people long to hear.
They are flattering us to get votes, as ALL politicians do (except Jeb,
who seems to like to insult the base to get votes).
Whether
Perot could have done half the things he wanted to do will always be a
'might have been', but consider that towards the end of the 90's, we did
approach balance budgets and a slow down of government growth (with a
very fast growing GDP and a pretty high tax rate at the Fed level of
something like 22%, which is probably not sustainable).
Then it
all went to shit, for some obvious and not so obvious reasons. GW Bush
was not very successful at controlling budget growth, although he
started to get it pointed in the right direction in 2005-2006 fiscal
year.
Obama, Reid and Pelosi have successfully ruined the budget
process, so you can call that Mission Accomplished! Obama is by nature a
rabble-rouser and bringer of chaos. This is what he does. We can see
the results of his chaos.
Whether Trump can do half the things he
promises to do, he will actually have to get Congress to make the
budget process work again. Otherwise, he rules as a dictator like Obama,
and we all lose. More chaos.
So regardless of anyone's personal
loathing for the Republican Congress as it now exists, if you want Trump
to get elected and succeed, he will need that Republican Congress to
make the process work. Not a promise at all that he will succeed, but a
basic predicate to have a chance at success.
Trump and Perot
Both men are actually pretty intelligent.
I
think both men sincerely care about America, which is more than I can
say about Obama and his crowd (and to a large degree, the whole Clinton
crowd).
All politicians have YUGE egos (not huge Yugos) that need
to be fed, as do people that have built up and run big corporations
(like Trump and Perot).
As conservative 'populists' they have
said (and did say) a lot of things that us everyday people long to hear.
They are flattering us to get votes, as ALL politicians do (except Jeb,
who seems to like to insult the base to get votes).
Whether
Perot could have done half the things he wanted to do will always be a
'might have been', but consider that towards the end of the 90's, we did
approach balance budgets and a slow down of government growth (with a
very fast growing GDP and a pretty high tax rate at the Fed level of
something like 22%, which is probably not sustainable).
Then it
all went to shit, for some obvious and not so obvious reasons. GW Bush
was not very successful at controlling budget growth, although he
started to get it pointed in the right direction in 2005-2006 fiscal
year.
Obama, Reid and Pelosi have successfully ruined the budget
process, so you can call that Mission Accomplished! Obama is by nature a
rabble-rouser and bringer of chaos. This is what he does. We can see
the results of his chaos.
Whether Trump can do half the things he
promises to do, he will actually have to get Congress to make the
budget process work again. Otherwise, he rules as a dictator like Obama,
and we all lose. More chaos.
So regardless of anyone's personal
loathing for the Republican Congress as it now exists, if you want Trump
to get elected and succeed, he will need that Republican Congress to
make the process work. Not a promise at all that he will succeed, but a
basic predicate to have a chance at success.
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 01:39 PM (+1T7c)
21
Yes, Trump is at best as much of a real conservative as Romney was and he'll burn us eventually and I'll go back to bashing him shortly...but there's no excuse for us not doing this sort of stuff since the McCain campaign.
Hell, there's no excuse for us not doing this sort of stuff since the Bush years.
Hell, there's no excuse for us not doing this sort of stuff since the Bush years.
Posted by: AD at August 16, 2015 01:39 PM (s4wTA)
22
what a shock. Drudge says the authorities have found dozens more classified emails in Hillary's curated email collection.
Not only is she a crook but she's an incompetent crook. You would think she would have weeded out the classified material, but I guess there is just too much of it.
Not only is she a crook but she's an incompetent crook. You would think she would have weeded out the classified material, but I guess there is just too much of it.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:39 PM (TxJGV)
23
Not only are the political consultants missing the opportunities Dave notes above, their flailing about is revealing how OUT OF TOUCH they are with Americans
They think of the slogan 'Make America Great Again' as 'something that can't be delivered' like the guy Fave quoted above
They have apparently ought into the postAmerica world paradigm and think those of us who believe in America and its leadership are rubes
And they can't stop telling us what rubes we are
They think of the slogan 'Make America Great Again' as 'something that can't be delivered' like the guy Fave quoted above
They have apparently ought into the postAmerica world paradigm and think those of us who believe in America and its leadership are rubes
And they can't stop telling us what rubes we are
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 01:40 PM (qxNrP)
24
... let Trump suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous Democrats.
***
T'rump or not T'rump that is the question.
***
T'rump or not T'rump that is the question.
Posted by: The Lone Ranger at August 16, 2015 01:40 PM (NeFrd)
25
" what a shock. Drudge says the authorities have found dozens more classified emails in Hillary's curated email collection. "
Well, Ill be damned.
Well, Ill be damned.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:41 PM (evvLu)
26
Kemo sabe sock off! Ugh!
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 01:42 PM (NeFrd)
27
Not only is she a crook but she's an incompetent
crook. You would think she would have weeded out the classified
material, but I guess there is just too much of it.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:39 PM
And what's more, she'll get away with it. Always has, always will.
Getting someone in authority to go after her essentially means getting Choom Boy to go after her. And that treasonous rat-prick has way too many skeletons in his closet to encourage any investigators to look around at what another slimeball Democrat is doing.
crook. You would think she would have weeded out the classified
material, but I guess there is just too much of it.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:39 PM
And what's more, she'll get away with it. Always has, always will.
Getting someone in authority to go after her essentially means getting Choom Boy to go after her. And that treasonous rat-prick has way too many skeletons in his closet to encourage any investigators to look around at what another slimeball Democrat is doing.
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 01:43 PM (0atQl)
Posted by: Anna Puma at August 16, 2015 01:44 PM (hbrUV)
29
Everything you say is no less correct or important for being somewhat obvious, WD. And you and others have been saying it in the comments forever.
But behold the quality of the GOP political class and its contractors. And its mindless supporters within the politically-attuned masses.The disdain, the panic, the hilarious attempts to draw contrasts between "carnival barker" and the sub-mediocrities (for the most part) they seem to think offer much real hope to the serious among us.
In the end, though, I'mbetting$5 that Trump will not, substantively, have any impact.
The one yuuuuuge issue, one thatmay be unique in that it engages not just basic principles (rule of law) butalso national security and socio-economic interests - mass illegal immigration and the unraveling of the rule of law to accommodate it - will probably not even move out ofthe isolation in which the Beltway ruling clique have placed it.
In the end there will not beany candidate addressing this vital topic in a serious way. None. The particular dysfunction of current American politics defies analysis, but really there is no more spectacular example thereof than illegal immigration. An obviously disastrous situationtouching all sorts of key interests, that is politically one-sided (the electorate is 'agin it), yet which cannot be exploited by anyonein a nominally "representative" form of govt.
Everything you say is no less correct or important for being somewhat obvious, WD. And you and others have been saying it in the comments forever.
But behold the quality of the GOP political class and its contractors. And its mindless supporters within the politically-attuned masses.The disdain, the panic, the hilarious attempts to draw contrasts between "carnival barker" and the sub-mediocrities (for the most part) they seem to think offer much real hope to the serious among us.
In the end, though, I'mbetting$5 that Trump will not, substantively, have any impact.
The one yuuuuuge issue, one thatmay be unique in that it engages not just basic principles (rule of law) butalso national security and socio-economic interests - mass illegal immigration and the unraveling of the rule of law to accommodate it - will probably not even move out ofthe isolation in which the Beltway ruling clique have placed it.
In the end there will not beany candidate addressing this vital topic in a serious way. None. The particular dysfunction of current American politics defies analysis, but really there is no more spectacular example thereof than illegal immigration. An obviously disastrous situationtouching all sorts of key interests, that is politically one-sided (the electorate is 'agin it), yet which cannot be exploited by anyonein a nominally "representative" form of govt.
Posted by: rhomboid at August 16, 2015 01:44 PM (QDnY+)
Posted by: GBruno at August 16, 2015 01:45 PM (u49WF)
31
If Jeff Sessions is finally getting someone to listen to him, someone who has a bully pulpit and uses it, I don't care if it is Trump. Not one of the other candidates has ever voiced concern over working poor losing jobs because of the endless flow of illegal immigrants. I am beginning to agree that all the candidates except for, possibly, Cruz are just Team Chamber of Commerce. If they weren't, why wouldn't they voice the same concerns.
Posted by: Ever at August 16, 2015 01:45 PM (RqICA)
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 01:45 PM (xUkfn)
33
Well, Ill be damned.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:41 PM (evvLu)
===========================
I know, right? Its just so surprising.
What's even more amazing to me is the Democrats are so focused on this scandal they seem to forget these are the Clintons, and its only Act One. They need to remember the Bimbo Eruptions (plus Pedo Island), Clinton Money Laundering and Bribery, Huma to Moslem Brotherhood intelligence links, etc are still to come.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:41 PM (evvLu)
===========================
I know, right? Its just so surprising.
What's even more amazing to me is the Democrats are so focused on this scandal they seem to forget these are the Clintons, and its only Act One. They need to remember the Bimbo Eruptions (plus Pedo Island), Clinton Money Laundering and Bribery, Huma to Moslem Brotherhood intelligence links, etc are still to come.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:45 PM (TxJGV)
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:46 PM (evvLu)
35
And f**k this site's constant mucking up of my comments by omitting spaces, sorry about that. Other than double spacing between every word, dunno what to do.
And f**k this site's constant mucking up of my comments by omitting spaces, sorry about that. Other than double spacing between every word, dunno what to do.
Posted by: rhomboid at August 16, 2015 01:46 PM (QDnY+)
36
And they can't stop telling us what rubes we are
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 01:40 PM
Considering the level of mediocrity among the candidates the GOPe is pushing now, and looking back at who they've foisted on us since 1988 or so, I find that the idea of voting for someone with actual honest human qualities is quite appealing.
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 01:40 PM
Considering the level of mediocrity among the candidates the GOPe is pushing now, and looking back at who they've foisted on us since 1988 or so, I find that the idea of voting for someone with actual honest human qualities is quite appealing.
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 01:46 PM (0atQl)
37
It's not that they are stupid. They are just wrong and they refuse to learn from their mistakes...oh wait.
Rinse Penis is screwing the base over and making the base happy should be his main job. So F*CK HIM!
Speaking of promising things in the election and not just not delivering on them but not even trying to deliver on them...McConnell and Boehner have been outstanding. So yeah that's why a lot of us are behind Trump. A man that takes charge and gets things done. The fact he is crotch punching the GOPe, the donks, and the MSM (BIRM) is just icing.
Rinse Penis is screwing the base over and making the base happy should be his main job. So F*CK HIM!
Speaking of promising things in the election and not just not delivering on them but not even trying to deliver on them...McConnell and Boehner have been outstanding. So yeah that's why a lot of us are behind Trump. A man that takes charge and gets things done. The fact he is crotch punching the GOPe, the donks, and the MSM (BIRM) is just icing.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican at August 16, 2015 01:46 PM (f+6Pd)
38
What's even more amazing to me is the Democrats are
so focused on this scandal they seem to forget these are the Clintons,
and its only Act One. They need to remember the Bimbo Eruptions (plus
Pedo Island), Clinton Money Laundering and Bribery, Huma to Moslem
Brotherhood intelligence links, etc are still to come.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:45 PM
Why, they're as blind and oblivious to reality as the GOPe!
so focused on this scandal they seem to forget these are the Clintons,
and its only Act One. They need to remember the Bimbo Eruptions (plus
Pedo Island), Clinton Money Laundering and Bribery, Huma to Moslem
Brotherhood intelligence links, etc are still to come.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:45 PM
Why, they're as blind and oblivious to reality as the GOPe!
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 01:48 PM (0atQl)
39
Getting someone in authority to go after her essentially means getting Choom Boy to go after her. And that treasonous rat-prick has way too many skeletons in his closet to encourage any investigators to look around at what another slimeball Democrat is doing.
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 01:43 PM (0atQl)
***
TFG and Rat face are going after her. Not full bore enough for Graybar Hotel time, but enough to keep her out of the nomination.This is where the info coming out to sink her has been coming from.
Can't have Scankles fcuking up Jugears legacy.
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 01:43 PM (0atQl)
***
TFG and Rat face are going after her. Not full bore enough for Graybar Hotel time, but enough to keep her out of the nomination.This is where the info coming out to sink her has been coming from.
Can't have Scankles fcuking up Jugears legacy.
Posted by: ManWithNoParty, unperson from Free Market Jesus Paradise at August 16, 2015 01:48 PM (1eYr7)
40
I'm an insurance agent...One of the simplest is to simply listen, the client will tell you what they want
Dang, while mowing the
lawn, I'd developed a nice little mental essay with virtually identical
wording on this exact topic, except mine involved leather seats; seats
of real Corinthian leather.
Trump is not a real estate genius,
he's a genius at selling. Wonder why he's so rich? It isn't because he
sees opportunities that others don't, it's that he is so good at
convincing people to risk their own money on his projects. He doesn't
risk his own money, that's for the rubes. He gets a cut whether the
project succeeds or fails.
All he did here was listen to what
the base was saying, or rather screaming at the tops of their lungs, and
then tell them that, yes indeed, he could make that happen for you.
Did you want the undercoating and Scotch Guarding too?
Dang, while mowing the
lawn, I'd developed a nice little mental essay with virtually identical
wording on this exact topic, except mine involved leather seats; seats
of real Corinthian leather.
Trump is not a real estate genius,
he's a genius at selling. Wonder why he's so rich? It isn't because he
sees opportunities that others don't, it's that he is so good at
convincing people to risk their own money on his projects. He doesn't
risk his own money, that's for the rubes. He gets a cut whether the
project succeeds or fails.
All he did here was listen to what
the base was saying, or rather screaming at the tops of their lungs, and
then tell them that, yes indeed, he could make that happen for you.
Did you want the undercoating and Scotch Guarding too?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 01:49 PM (LAe3v)
41
The entire time President Historical First was running, I kept thinking that even the Dems were getting played. Turns out he played everyone.
I still can't shake that exact same feeling with the Donald.
Something doesn't pass the sniff test.
Something is rotten in Denmark.
The entire time President Historical First was running, I kept thinking that even the Dems were getting played. Turns out he played everyone.
I still can't shake that exact same feeling with the Donald.
Something doesn't pass the sniff test.
Something is rotten in Denmark.
Posted by: GBruno at August 16, 2015 01:49 PM (u49WF)
42
AD, and anyone else who missed it, here's Ace on why it's okay for Rick Perry to hire Steve schmidt, a campaign consultant who is not at all interested in victory for his Republican clients, and why it's stupid to criticize hiring him:
Ace: "...i think this is like disliking Perry because you heard his mechanic was a liberal.
Scmidt is a freaking employee. That's all. Further, Perry had few choices. There are only so many people who are qualified to run a national campaign, and Perry, being one of the more marginal candidates, would have no shot at recruiting the Big Names. He would be required to pick one of the, frankly, Scrubs.
This guilt by association nonsense is so dumb.
bear in mind SEVENTEEN people are running for president.
do you think there are seventeen experienced, top-level national campaign managers?
Campaign managers like working for winning candidates with lots of money (because lots money = big ad buys and they get a cut of the ad buys).
Perry, with little money and thusfar a low chance of getting big money and big support, is not a very attractive client.
You're ignorant if you think Perry had a free hand in choosing WHOEVER he liked for this position and decided "Steve Schmidt is my guy.""
Do you buy what Ace is selling? I give it 3 out of 5 Cockamamies.
AD, and anyone else who missed it, here's Ace on why it's okay for Rick Perry to hire Steve schmidt, a campaign consultant who is not at all interested in victory for his Republican clients, and why it's stupid to criticize hiring him:
Ace: "...i think this is like disliking Perry because you heard his mechanic was a liberal.
Scmidt is a freaking employee. That's all. Further, Perry had few choices. There are only so many people who are qualified to run a national campaign, and Perry, being one of the more marginal candidates, would have no shot at recruiting the Big Names. He would be required to pick one of the, frankly, Scrubs.
This guilt by association nonsense is so dumb.
bear in mind SEVENTEEN people are running for president.
do you think there are seventeen experienced, top-level national campaign managers?
Campaign managers like working for winning candidates with lots of money (because lots money = big ad buys and they get a cut of the ad buys).
Perry, with little money and thusfar a low chance of getting big money and big support, is not a very attractive client.
You're ignorant if you think Perry had a free hand in choosing WHOEVER he liked for this position and decided "Steve Schmidt is my guy.""
Do you buy what Ace is selling? I give it 3 out of 5 Cockamamies.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 01:49 PM (xUkfn)
Posted by: alec at August 16, 2015 01:50 PM (WD1+K)
44
"And f**k this site's constant mucking up of my comments by omitting spaces, sorry about that. Other than double spacing between every word, dunno what to do."
Settle down. I read your posts just fine.
Settle down. I read your posts just fine.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:50 PM (evvLu)
45
So that's what the "H" stands for.
Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at August 16, 2015 01:50 PM (W5DcG)
46
We Trumpkins are like cancer patients trapped in a carnival, and our only option for treatment has been a GOPe snake oil salesman. Yet they are too blind and arrogant to see our despair. They keep on talking as if they could convince us they are actual oncologists instead of snake oil salesman. Time to leave the fairgrounds.
Posted by: Bruce Boehner at August 16, 2015 01:51 PM (qd6sQ)
47
How many of these people enraged about Trump would instead be enraged about Cruz if Trump didn't exist? I'm guessing quite a lot of the same cast of characters. Not all, but a lot. So in that respect, assuming Trump burns out, Trump can be the best thing for Cruz. Cruz gets to light up McConnell to his face, and he mostly gets spared the spared the attacks from Team GOP talking heads, because to do so would make their Trump attacks weaker. I find THAT especially funny.
Drew M. pretty much went there in the podcast, and it was probably the best point I had heard made on this weeks show. Gabe tried to argue it for a second, then figured out it wasn't going to be a winner. That was a literal LOL moment.
Drew M. pretty much went there in the podcast, and it was probably the best point I had heard made on this weeks show. Gabe tried to argue it for a second, then figured out it wasn't going to be a winner. That was a literal LOL moment.
Posted by: Dave S. at August 16, 2015 01:51 PM (mhkbv)
48
"Do you buy what Ace is selling? I give it 3 out of 5 Cockamamies. "
Sooth', that's a big post. How many cockamamies in a bushel?
Sooth', that's a big post. How many cockamamies in a bushel?
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:51 PM (evvLu)
49
27 And what's more, she'll get away with it. Always has, always will.
=============================
Depends on what you mean by the phrase. Shes obviously not getting away with it right now; her poll number are dropping like a rock, shes behind in NH and close to it in Iowa, and the Dems are trying to get Joe Biden into the race. Today, Bill is meeting with TFG (well, playing golf but thats how you meet with the little shit), and guess what they need to talk about? Pardons anyone?
So, sure shes not indicted. The "Justice" Department wont take any action against her unless TFG tells them to, sure. If that's what you mean by "getting away with it", then (so far) you're right.
But her political aspirations are in intensive care and potentially dying. IF they go tits up, I'd say she has not gotten away with anything.
=============================
Depends on what you mean by the phrase. Shes obviously not getting away with it right now; her poll number are dropping like a rock, shes behind in NH and close to it in Iowa, and the Dems are trying to get Joe Biden into the race. Today, Bill is meeting with TFG (well, playing golf but thats how you meet with the little shit), and guess what they need to talk about? Pardons anyone?
So, sure shes not indicted. The "Justice" Department wont take any action against her unless TFG tells them to, sure. If that's what you mean by "getting away with it", then (so far) you're right.
But her political aspirations are in intensive care and potentially dying. IF they go tits up, I'd say she has not gotten away with anything.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:52 PM (TxJGV)
50
Can't watch the video. Could someone post a link to it? Thanks.
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 01:52 PM (oKE6c)
51
Trump = Camacho
Posted by: DriveBy at August 16, 2015 01:52 PM (C9Vc8)
52
Too many Cockamamies to count!
Too many Cockamamies to count!
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 01:52 PM (xUkfn)
53
Hmm. I don't think Ace has been very inclined to Trump.
Is it possible to separate the man from his message? Well, sure.... unless it's politics, in which case they are bound. Trump, the man, and Trump the politician are joined at the hip, and the two personalities can not be separated, or at least I wouldn't bet on it.
I've never cared for Trump the man.
By way of thought experiment, if you were compelled to forever place your children in one household or another, would you (for example) choose the Trump household, or the Cruz household?
Is it possible to separate the man from his message? Well, sure.... unless it's politics, in which case they are bound. Trump, the man, and Trump the politician are joined at the hip, and the two personalities can not be separated, or at least I wouldn't bet on it.
I've never cared for Trump the man.
By way of thought experiment, if you were compelled to forever place your children in one household or another, would you (for example) choose the Trump household, or the Cruz household?
Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 16, 2015 01:54 PM (9mTYi)
54
Perry hires Schmidt.
First thing Schmidt advises Perry to do is...? Crap on Trump and, by extension, his supporters, by calling Trump a "cancer" on the Republican party.
Now, tell me, who but a Democrat would advise a Republican to say such an idiotic thing?
Perry hires Schmidt.
First thing Schmidt advises Perry to do is...? Crap on Trump and, by extension, his supporters, by calling Trump a "cancer" on the Republican party.
Now, tell me, who but a Democrat would advise a Republican to say such an idiotic thing?
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 01:54 PM (xUkfn)
55
o in that respect, assuming Trump burns out, Trump can be the best thing
for Cruz. Cruz gets to light up McConnell to his face, and he mostly
gets spared the spared the attacks from Team GOP talking heads, because
to do so would make their Trump attacks weaker.
I like that point. Essentially, Trump is the suicide squad moving first through the mine field, and drawing enemy fire away from Cruz's flanking maneuver.
The only problem is what happens if Trump actually makes it through the mine field, because people who do that sort of thing tend not to be right in the head.
for Cruz. Cruz gets to light up McConnell to his face, and he mostly
gets spared the spared the attacks from Team GOP talking heads, because
to do so would make their Trump attacks weaker.
I like that point. Essentially, Trump is the suicide squad moving first through the mine field, and drawing enemy fire away from Cruz's flanking maneuver.
The only problem is what happens if Trump actually makes it through the mine field, because people who do that sort of thing tend not to be right in the head.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 01:55 PM (LAe3v)
56
Second, Trump is providing the invaluable service of testing the water. He's the ultimate marketing survey. Every other candidate should be making notes as to what Trump is saying that is resonating, and adjusting their candidacy accordingly. You couldn't pay for a poll that in depth and detailed, and Trump's serving it up on a platter.
The phrase "stalking horse" leaps to mind.
The phrase "stalking horse" leaps to mind.
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 01:55 PM (oKE6c)
57
Do you buy what Ace is selling? I give it 3 out of 5 Cockamamies.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 01:49 PM
I may buy it a little more than you do, but not by much.
What he says has some truth to it, in that there are only a few people who really know how to run political campaigns, and most of them don't have as much talent as they think they do.
And most wannabe candidates are taught to buy the proposition that their Message has to be Carefully Crafted. I'm sure Prince Reebus told Perry to get a Real Consultant stat. So he did.
But I also think Ace sometimes starts the Word Machine running and doesn't engage the editing filter before the result hits the page. And this seems to me to have been one of those times.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 01:49 PM
I may buy it a little more than you do, but not by much.
What he says has some truth to it, in that there are only a few people who really know how to run political campaigns, and most of them don't have as much talent as they think they do.
And most wannabe candidates are taught to buy the proposition that their Message has to be Carefully Crafted. I'm sure Prince Reebus told Perry to get a Real Consultant stat. So he did.
But I also think Ace sometimes starts the Word Machine running and doesn't engage the editing filter before the result hits the page. And this seems to me to have been one of those times.
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 01:56 PM (0atQl)
58
51 Trump = Camacho
Posted by: DriveBy at August 16, 2015 01:52 PM (C9Vc
___________
No. We've already got Camacho.
Posted by: DriveBy at August 16, 2015 01:52 PM (C9Vc
___________
No. We've already got Camacho.
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 01:56 PM (oKE6c)
Posted by: fairweatherbill at August 16, 2015 01:56 PM (oSsVL)
60
Always thought four cdockamamies to a bushel. refiguring.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 01:57 PM (evvLu)
61
The phrase "stalking horse" leaps to mind.
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 01:55 PM (oKE6c)
*****
Maybe more like "crash test dummy"
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 01:55 PM (oKE6c)
*****
Maybe more like "crash test dummy"
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 01:58 PM (NeFrd)
62
Is it valid to question Trump's past positions on the issues? Of course.
What many conservatives are taking issue with however is the GOP beltway establishment hacktariat acting as if the rest of field are comprised of solid conservatives. Clearly they are not, yet they reserve this questioning of conservative credentials exclusively for Trump. Ludicrous, and clearly done by beltway shills to defend the established order.
What many conservatives are taking issue with however is the GOP beltway establishment hacktariat acting as if the rest of field are comprised of solid conservatives. Clearly they are not, yet they reserve this questioning of conservative credentials exclusively for Trump. Ludicrous, and clearly done by beltway shills to defend the established order.
Posted by: Reggie1971 at August 16, 2015 01:58 PM (KVRil)
63
Who would fardels trump.
Posted by: zombie Shakespeare at August 16, 2015 01:58 PM (Q92B4)
64
"... He is promising things that he can never deliver. ..."
Never heard of THAT happening before. Nosiree! Nope!
Never heard of THAT happening before. Nosiree! Nope!
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 01:58 PM (M+9nV)
Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 16, 2015 01:59 PM (9mTYi)
66
Are those European or African cockamamies?
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 01:59 PM (NeFrd)
67
All he did here was listen to what
the base was saying, or rather screaming at the tops of their lungs, and then tell them that, yes indeed, he could make that happen for you.
Did you want the undercoating and Scotch Guarding too?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 01:49 PM (LAe3v)/i]
This raises an interesting philosophical question: should a politician in a republic do what the populace wants - i.e., respond to public pressure and sentiment - or just do what he thinks should be done? One canonical case leads to government by focus group, the other to dictatorship/monarchy.
the base was saying, or rather screaming at the tops of their lungs, and then tell them that, yes indeed, he could make that happen for you.
Did you want the undercoating and Scotch Guarding too?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 01:49 PM (LAe3v)/i]
This raises an interesting philosophical question: should a politician in a republic do what the populace wants - i.e., respond to public pressure and sentiment - or just do what he thinks should be done? One canonical case leads to government by focus group, the other to dictatorship/monarchy.
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 02:00 PM (oKE6c)
68
66 Are those European or African cockamamies?
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 01:59 PM (NeFrd)
__________
Metric.
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 01:59 PM (NeFrd)
__________
Metric.
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 02:00 PM (oKE6c)
69
If promising things you can't deliver is disqualifying then nobody is qualified. And what is possible is also beyond the imagination of the beltway crowd. American used to do big, hard things. We need to become that nation again or die trying.
Posted by: Chris Vaughn at August 16, 2015 02:00 PM (Bcqod)
70
Scmidt is a freaking employee. That's all. Further, Perry had few choices. There are only so many people who are qualified to run a national campaign, and Perry, being one of the more marginal candidates, would have no shot at recruiting the Big Names. He would be required to pick one of the, frankly, Scrubs.
....
Do you buy what Ace is selling?
Not that you had to ask, but: Nope. The guy backstabbed the person he was working for at a very crucial time for us and the most crucial time for that person. Given the success of the McCain campaign, I'm also skeptical of the skill he brings anything to the table that couldn't be found elsewhere (yeah, I know he also worked for Bush in '04).
It's a display of bad judgment to me to hire him. Loyalty is everything for a political staffer. Schmidt doesn't have it. Schmidt is dead to me and so is anyone who has him on a national campaign.
....
Do you buy what Ace is selling?
Not that you had to ask, but: Nope. The guy backstabbed the person he was working for at a very crucial time for us and the most crucial time for that person. Given the success of the McCain campaign, I'm also skeptical of the skill he brings anything to the table that couldn't be found elsewhere (yeah, I know he also worked for Bush in '04).
It's a display of bad judgment to me to hire him. Loyalty is everything for a political staffer. Schmidt doesn't have it. Schmidt is dead to me and so is anyone who has him on a national campaign.
Posted by: AD at August 16, 2015 02:01 PM (s4wTA)
71
Should have asked if we were calculating standard or metric cockamamies.
Posted by: fairweatherbill at August 16, 2015 02:01 PM (oSsVL)
72
By the way, I came across this at RCP and Hot Air.
http://tinyurl.com/odepx5w
Jeb's! polling is collapsing.
You can see a very nice graphic for all of the GOP candidates here. Unfortunately, it appears
that Walker's support is dropping sharply as well.
http://tinyurl.com/kvzkyg4
Carly is on the upswing.
http://tinyurl.com/odepx5w
Jeb's! polling is collapsing.
You can see a very nice graphic for all of the GOP candidates here. Unfortunately, it appears
that Walker's support is dropping sharply as well.
http://tinyurl.com/kvzkyg4
Carly is on the upswing.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:01 PM (LAe3v)
73
American used to do big, hard things.
Some American housewives still do big, hard things.
Just sayin'.
Some American housewives still do big, hard things.
Just sayin'.
Posted by: Paolo at August 16, 2015 02:02 PM (Q92B4)
74
Cruz is the one, iJeb! is the none.
Posted by: Grump928(C) notes at August 16, 2015 02:03 PM (rwI+c)
75
The only problem is what happens if Trump actually makes it through the mine field,
Posted by: pep
Then at least the burning times will be entertaining
Posted by: pep
Then at least the burning times will be entertaining
Posted by: traye at August 16, 2015 02:03 PM (N8WBd)
76
This raises an interesting philosophical question: should a politician in a republic do what the populace wants - i.e., respond to public pressure and sentiment - or just do what he thinks should be done?
-----------------------
The latter, but as expressed by responsible elected representatives... if you can keep it.
-----------------------
The latter, but as expressed by responsible elected representatives... if you can keep it.
Posted by: B. Franklin at August 16, 2015 02:04 PM (9mTYi)
77
Ludicrous, and clearly done by beltway shills to defend the established order.
Posted by: Reggie1971 at August 16, 2015 01:58 PM
If the same levels of scrutiny, animosity and plain ol' hatred were applied to the other candidates among the Unholy 17, you'd hear the wailing and gnashing of teeth at least 50 miles from the nearest candidate.
And if Megyn Kelly and the other newsparrots had asked the same questions of the others as they did Trump, the same voices who are now Standing With Megyn would be at her throat.
Posted by: Reggie1971 at August 16, 2015 01:58 PM
If the same levels of scrutiny, animosity and plain ol' hatred were applied to the other candidates among the Unholy 17, you'd hear the wailing and gnashing of teeth at least 50 miles from the nearest candidate.
And if Megyn Kelly and the other newsparrots had asked the same questions of the others as they did Trump, the same voices who are now Standing With Megyn would be at her throat.
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 02:04 PM (0atQl)
78
I can't vote for Trump, back in 2002 I took a vow to never vote for another Democrat.
Posted by: charris at August 16, 2015 02:04 PM (2hI19)
79
If Trump does manage to pull the nomination off, you can bet the GOPe is going to be in full attack mode. Just in the hopes of burning it down.
Say what you will about Trump, but his sack is bigger than anyone's right now. I'm predicting he wins the nomination and selects Fiorina as veep.
Say what you will about Trump, but his sack is bigger than anyone's right now. I'm predicting he wins the nomination and selects Fiorina as veep.
Posted by: IdahoMatt at August 16, 2015 02:05 PM (SgYQy)
80
This raises an interesting philosophical question: should a
politician in a republic do what the populace wants - i.e., respond to
public pressure and sentiment - or just do what he thinks should be
done? One canonical case leads to government by focus group, the other
to dictatorship/monarchy.
There is no perfect answer. Sometimes it's one, sometimes the other. A great politician/statesman (e.g. Churchill) does what he thinks best most of the time and on the really big issues, but also responds directly to his constituents as often as he can without being unprincipled.
politician in a republic do what the populace wants - i.e., respond to
public pressure and sentiment - or just do what he thinks should be
done? One canonical case leads to government by focus group, the other
to dictatorship/monarchy.
There is no perfect answer. Sometimes it's one, sometimes the other. A great politician/statesman (e.g. Churchill) does what he thinks best most of the time and on the really big issues, but also responds directly to his constituents as often as he can without being unprincipled.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:05 PM (LAe3v)
81
Hello, bill. Had a good response but then my internet took another dump.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 02:06 PM (evvLu)
82
78 I can't vote for Trump, back in 2002 I took a vow to never vote for another Democrat.
Posted by: charris at August 16, 2015 02:04 PM (2hI19)
__________
At one time Reagan was a Democrat.
Posted by: charris at August 16, 2015 02:04 PM (2hI19)
__________
At one time Reagan was a Democrat.
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 02:06 PM (oKE6c)
83
'cockamillemes' are the metric term. 1000 of them equal 1 cockakilomeme.
Posted by: chinga Jeb! at August 16, 2015 02:06 PM (JNnND)
84
Trump is like Republican spam
Posted by: But so what? at August 16, 2015 02:06 PM (7wyDO)
85
Jay, I think that formula critically over-simplifies things.
If doing something obviously beneficial from every practical point of view, and totally in alignment with general principles of fairness and ordered (lawful) liberty - like enforcing a normal, existing regime of immigration law - is *also* popular, then there is no dilemma.
If pandering to an electorate means doing the obvious sound thing, then it's the rarest of happy moments in a representative govt., not one full of contradictions and tensions.
Focus-group testing your August vacation destination - as the Clintons did at least once while in office - is nearly implausible satire of a serious political and civic culture, yet it happened. And the election/re-election/popularity of Clinton (even the respect given him as being "intelligent" in any meaningful way) pretty much stamped the grade on this country when Obama was still a sub-mediocre nobody in slimy stupid IL politix.
Jay, I think that formula critically over-simplifies things.
If doing something obviously beneficial from every practical point of view, and totally in alignment with general principles of fairness and ordered (lawful) liberty - like enforcing a normal, existing regime of immigration law - is *also* popular, then there is no dilemma.
If pandering to an electorate means doing the obvious sound thing, then it's the rarest of happy moments in a representative govt., not one full of contradictions and tensions.
Focus-group testing your August vacation destination - as the Clintons did at least once while in office - is nearly implausible satire of a serious political and civic culture, yet it happened. And the election/re-election/popularity of Clinton (even the respect given him as being "intelligent" in any meaningful way) pretty much stamped the grade on this country when Obama was still a sub-mediocre nobody in slimy stupid IL politix.
Posted by: rhomboid at August 16, 2015 02:07 PM (QDnY+)
86
There go the people. I must follow them, for I am their leader.
Posted by: Stuff Alexandre Auguste Ledru-Rollin might have said at August 16, 2015 02:07 PM (rwI+c)
87
I'm increasingly moving to the thought that the idea of Der Donald burning out is wishcasting.
The guy's got money to burn. He's not going anywhere unless he decides to.
The rapid back and forth between zomg did you see what he said and a smug he'll burn out just you wait and see is sounding increasingly shrill and panicky.
The guy's got money to burn. He's not going anywhere unless he decides to.
The rapid back and forth between zomg did you see what he said and a smug he'll burn out just you wait and see is sounding increasingly shrill and panicky.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 16, 2015 02:07 PM (oFCZn)
88
Weird Dave,
Thank you for writing this post. You have put into words what I have been inarticulately trying to get across myself. The closest I've seen is that he is the Fuck You!!! candidate. You have explained in layman's terms, without vulgarity, what that means.
Thank you for writing this post. You have put into words what I have been inarticulately trying to get across myself. The closest I've seen is that he is the Fuck You!!! candidate. You have explained in layman's terms, without vulgarity, what that means.
Posted by: lindafell de Spair @ San Jacinto at August 16, 2015 02:08 PM (xVgrA)
89
If Trump does manage to pull the nomination off, you
can bet the GOPe is going to be in full attack mode. Just in the hopes
of burning it down.
Posted by: IdahoMatt at August 16, 2015 02:05 PM
And if he wins -- something their opposition will make more, not less, likely -- the GOPe will making a lemming-like march to the nearest cliff.
One of the most entertaining thins about this is that their pathetic game is being exposed, and normal people aren't buyin' it.
can bet the GOPe is going to be in full attack mode. Just in the hopes
of burning it down.
Posted by: IdahoMatt at August 16, 2015 02:05 PM
And if he wins -- something their opposition will make more, not less, likely -- the GOPe will making a lemming-like march to the nearest cliff.
One of the most entertaining thins about this is that their pathetic game is being exposed, and normal people aren't buyin' it.
Posted by: MrScribbler at August 16, 2015 02:08 PM (0atQl)
90
I suspect the only reason joke biden is holding off on his announcement is because he and his people are afraid Trump will do something that all the other Republicans are afraid to do: publicly call Joe Biden an idiot and a loser.
I suspect the only reason joke biden is holding off on his announcement is because he and his people are afraid Trump will do something that all the other Republicans are afraid to do: publicly call Joe Biden an idiot and a loser.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:09 PM (xUkfn)
91
But her political aspirations are in intensive care and potentially dying. IF they go tits up, I'd say she has not gotten away with anything.
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:52 PM (TxJGV)
In what fucking universe should this woman be considered as a serious aspirant to the office of the presidency of the United States of America?
What has she done? What are her accomplishments, her achievements? Other than being the Tammy Wynette and standing by her man that she once claimed she wasn't, so she could carpetbag to NY and have a Senate seat handed to her, she hadn't done shit. It's easy to be a back-benching Senator and not fuck stuff up, it's not so easy when one is SOS. There, she fucked up plenty, because she was too busy with the number one job of enriching herself and her foundation to pay attention to her actual job.
All those crimes committed whilst SOS? They should be taken seriously, and prosecuted, as the Rule of Law demands, lest the rest of us start to think that there actually are two sets of rules in this country.
Rant off/
But, no this...If the idea that one can break laws and the only punishment is not achieving the next of your goals, that is 'getting away with it".
Posted by: MTF at August 16, 2015 01:52 PM (TxJGV)
In what fucking universe should this woman be considered as a serious aspirant to the office of the presidency of the United States of America?
What has she done? What are her accomplishments, her achievements? Other than being the Tammy Wynette and standing by her man that she once claimed she wasn't, so she could carpetbag to NY and have a Senate seat handed to her, she hadn't done shit. It's easy to be a back-benching Senator and not fuck stuff up, it's not so easy when one is SOS. There, she fucked up plenty, because she was too busy with the number one job of enriching herself and her foundation to pay attention to her actual job.
All those crimes committed whilst SOS? They should be taken seriously, and prosecuted, as the Rule of Law demands, lest the rest of us start to think that there actually are two sets of rules in this country.
Rant off/
But, no this...If the idea that one can break laws and the only punishment is not achieving the next of your goals, that is 'getting away with it".
Posted by: OneEyedJack at August 16, 2015 02:09 PM (XmOA9)
92
God Dman air card.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 16, 2015 02:10 PM (evvLu)
93
As a target and a whipping boy, not to mention as a voice for the rage of the people, this Donald is not too bad. The Democrat steamroller would have already flattened our other candidates without him running interference. He's like our very own "run it off-tackle" smash-mouth football play.
Posted by: goon at August 16, 2015 02:10 PM (gy5kE)
Posted by: lindafell de Spair @ San Jacinto at August 16, 2015 02:10 PM (xVgrA)
95
He is promising things that he can never deliver. And it is time for Jeb Bush and other folks to start posting up and really comparing and contrasting Donald Trump's rhetoric with reality
Yes, the establishment guys should totally spend all their resources trying to sell the case that it's impossible to accomplish anything once in office.
Run with that.
Please.
Yes, the establishment guys should totally spend all their resources trying to sell the case that it's impossible to accomplish anything once in office.
Run with that.
Please.
Posted by: Methos at August 16, 2015 02:10 PM (ZbV+0)
96
Trump is going all the way. Whether that is a good thing or a bad thing, time will tell. The truth is that he is articulating the frustrations of every voter who watches the news every night and shakes his or her fist at the tv set. He is brilliantly demonstrating the weakness of our political class, all of whom are a bunch of geldings. In addition to that, he actually loves this nation and does not want to see us swirling down the crapper, which makes him a distinct minority in today's environment.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:10 PM (JgC5a)
97
As long as we're going all Shakespeare here- The FBI found this e-mail on Hillary's server in reference to her preparations for the 2016 campaign:
Scale of dragon, tooth of wolf,
Witches' mummy, maw and gulf
Of the ravin'd salt-sea shark,
Root of hemlock digg'd i' the dark,
Liver of blaspheming Jew,
Gall of Goat, and slips of yew
Silvere'd in the moon's eclipse,
Nose of Turk and Tartar's lips,
Finger of birth-strangled babe
Ditch-deliver'd by a drab
Make the gruel thick and slab
Add thereto a tiger's chaudron,
For the ingtredients of our cauldron.
Double, double, toil and trouble,
Fire burn and cauldron bubble
Scale of dragon, tooth of wolf,
Witches' mummy, maw and gulf
Of the ravin'd salt-sea shark,
Root of hemlock digg'd i' the dark,
Liver of blaspheming Jew,
Gall of Goat, and slips of yew
Silvere'd in the moon's eclipse,
Nose of Turk and Tartar's lips,
Finger of birth-strangled babe
Ditch-deliver'd by a drab
Make the gruel thick and slab
Add thereto a tiger's chaudron,
For the ingtredients of our cauldron.
Double, double, toil and trouble,
Fire burn and cauldron bubble
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 02:11 PM (NeFrd)
98
What has she done? What are her accomplishments, her achievements?
Have you SEEN her frequent flyer miles?
Have you SEEN her frequent flyer miles?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:11 PM (LAe3v)
99
Over at Hot Gas they have an article saying Trump is silly for wanting a wall on the border because, well it already exists. No, really.
They really think you are THAT stupid.
They really think you are THAT stupid.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:11 PM (0LHZx)
100
Say what you will about Trump, but his sack is bigger than anyone's right now. I'm predicting he wins the nomination and selects Fiorina as veep.
Posted by: IdahoMatt at August 16, 2015 02:05 PM (SgYQy)
That would be nice.
Her big criticism of him is that he needs to be more elegant in his phrasing.
She's right, long term.
Posted by: IdahoMatt at August 16, 2015 02:05 PM (SgYQy)
That would be nice.
Her big criticism of him is that he needs to be more elegant in his phrasing.
She's right, long term.
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 02:12 PM (M+9nV)
101
I think that covers all the major donor groups.
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 02:12 PM (NeFrd)
102
Why are national campaign leaders so rare?
I could think of at least 10 people here at AoS who could be a better chief campaign adviser than Steve Shmit.
Why are national campaign leaders so rare?
I could think of at least 10 people here at AoS who could be a better chief campaign adviser than Steve Shmit.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:12 PM (xUkfn)
103
One thing I don't get is the theory that Trump is doing all of this in order to help Hillary. Like him or hate him, one thing you cay about Trump is he's his own man. The idea that he's going through all this as some super secret plan hatched up Bill and Hillary is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (0LHZx)
104
99
Over at Hot Gas they have an article saying Trump is silly for wanting a
wall on the border because, well it already exists. No, really.
They really think you are THAT stupid.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016
That articles is so astonishingly stupid, I'd almost think that Trump put them up to it to make the anti-wall side look bad.
Over at Hot Gas they have an article saying Trump is silly for wanting a
wall on the border because, well it already exists. No, really.
They really think you are THAT stupid.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016
That articles is so astonishingly stupid, I'd almost think that Trump put them up to it to make the anti-wall side look bad.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (LAe3v)
105
Gozer: Choose and Perish! Choose the form of the Destructor!
GPOe: Clear your minds, you effin' Conservitards! Clear your minds!
Gozer: The choice is made. The Traveler has come.
Giant Trump appears, wreaking havoc and destruction.
Disaffected voters nod heads appreciatively.
GPOe: Clear your minds, you effin' Conservitards! Clear your minds!
Gozer: The choice is made. The Traveler has come.
Giant Trump appears, wreaking havoc and destruction.
Disaffected voters nod heads appreciatively.
Posted by: Elinor, Who Usually Looks Lurkily at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (NqQAS)
106
Tonight on Fox one hour, The Trump Campaign (repeated through the evening). Prelude to new Fox Series -- The Cruz Campaign, The Gilmore Campaign, The Huckabee Campaign? Fair and Balanced?
Posted by: gracepc at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (DMQhB)
107
Go to Iowa and eat a corn dog! And don't tell them you'll shut down their ethanol scam.
How hard is that??
Go to Iowa and eat a corn dog! And don't tell them you'll shut down their ethanol scam.
How hard is that??
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (xUkfn)
108
Weirddave, again you write the truth. The GOPe strategy is to call 1/4 of their voters idiots, or worse, and then expect those people to vote for them next year. They're the Stupid Party for a reason.
Posted by: Agent J at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (ueOgE)
Posted by: Planned Parenthood at August 16, 2015 02:14 PM (Q92B4)
110
Gozer: Choose and Perish! Choose the form of the Destructor!
GPOe: Clear your minds, you effin' Conservitards! Clear your minds!
Gozer: The choice is made. The Traveler has come.
Giant Trump appears, wreaking havoc and destruction.
Disaffected voters nod heads appreciatively.
Posted by: Elinor, Who Usually Looks Lurkily
This would be the most awesome campaign ad in the history of man.
GPOe: Clear your minds, you effin' Conservitards! Clear your minds!
Gozer: The choice is made. The Traveler has come.
Giant Trump appears, wreaking havoc and destruction.
Disaffected voters nod heads appreciatively.
Posted by: Elinor, Who Usually Looks Lurkily
This would be the most awesome campaign ad in the history of man.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:14 PM (LAe3v)
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 02:15 PM (WvS3w)
112
Why are national campaign leaders so rare?
I could think of at least 10 people here at AoS who could be a better chief campaign adviser than Steve Shmit.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:12 PM (xUkfn)
In fact, I thought it was here I read the piece arguing that talent on the national scale is B level and that the best political managers work for state guys.
I could think of at least 10 people here at AoS who could be a better chief campaign adviser than Steve Shmit.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:12 PM (xUkfn)
In fact, I thought it was here I read the piece arguing that talent on the national scale is B level and that the best political managers work for state guys.
Posted by: AD at August 16, 2015 02:15 PM (s4wTA)
113
Here is the other thing. Trump would win in the general.
You think most Democrats are happy with their candidates?
I don't think so.
You think most Democrats are happy with their candidates?
I don't think so.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:18 PM (JgC5a)
114
Giant Trump appears, wreaking havoc and destruction.
Disaffected voters nod heads appreciatively.
Many Rooves and Priebi knew was it was to be roasted in the depths of Trumpkis that day I can tell you.
Disaffected voters nod heads appreciatively.
Many Rooves and Priebi knew was it was to be roasted in the depths of Trumpkis that day I can tell you.
Posted by: Stuff Alexandre Auguste Ledru-Rollin might have said at August 16, 2015 02:18 PM (rwI+c)
115
112 Why are national campaign leaders so rare?
I could think of at least 10 people here at AoS who could be a better chief campaign adviser than Steve Shmit.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:12 PM (xUkfn)
In fact, I thought it was here I read the piece arguing that talent on the national scale is B level and that the best political managers work for state guys.
Posted by: AD at August 16, 2015 02:15 PM (s4wTA)
________
Campaigns are no different than other organizations. The guy with the best qualifications is passed over for the guy who is friends with the CEO or who's brother in law is a business partner with the VP's sister.
It's how the world works everywhere.
I could think of at least 10 people here at AoS who could be a better chief campaign adviser than Steve Shmit.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:12 PM (xUkfn)
In fact, I thought it was here I read the piece arguing that talent on the national scale is B level and that the best political managers work for state guys.
Posted by: AD at August 16, 2015 02:15 PM (s4wTA)
________
Campaigns are no different than other organizations. The guy with the best qualifications is passed over for the guy who is friends with the CEO or who's brother in law is a business partner with the VP's sister.
It's how the world works everywhere.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:18 PM (0LHZx)
116
113 Here is the other thing. Trump would win in the general.
You think most Democrats are happy with their candidates?
I don't think so.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:18 PM (JgC5a)
________
Dems may not be happy, but they are loyal lemmings. They'll vote for whatever "D" is on the ballot.
You think most Democrats are happy with their candidates?
I don't think so.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:18 PM (JgC5a)
________
Dems may not be happy, but they are loyal lemmings. They'll vote for whatever "D" is on the ballot.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:19 PM (0LHZx)
117
Posted by: Elinor, Who Usually Looks Lurkily at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (NqQAS)
****
Who ya gonna call?
****
Who ya gonna call?
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 02:20 PM (NeFrd)
118
Trump=Perot. Same rich clown act, same going to elect a democrat because of their ego.
Really folks, the future of our nation is NOT a reality show.
Someone needs to get serious and tell Trump. YOU ARE FIRED.
Support the nominee with a promise, or no more debate invites.
You want to run as a third party, have at it.
Really folks, the future of our nation is NOT a reality show.
Someone needs to get serious and tell Trump. YOU ARE FIRED.
Support the nominee with a promise, or no more debate invites.
You want to run as a third party, have at it.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 02:20 PM (0FSuD)
119
But her political aspirations are in intensive care and potentially
dying. IF they go tits up, I'd say she has not gotten away with
anything.
I'd like to see her punished under the law to the fullest extent of the law appropriate for her actions.
If I can't get that, it makes me a little happy to think about what donations to the Clinton Enrichment Fund will look like if she is no longer the presumptive next president.
dying. IF they go tits up, I'd say she has not gotten away with
anything.
I'd like to see her punished under the law to the fullest extent of the law appropriate for her actions.
If I can't get that, it makes me a little happy to think about what donations to the Clinton Enrichment Fund will look like if she is no longer the presumptive next president.
Posted by: Methos at August 16, 2015 02:20 PM (ZbV+0)
120
President Trump.
Those two words act like a truth serum and get people to blurt out what is really going on in their skulls.
The gopes want to watch their Jeb sex tape and Trump is screwing it all up.
Those two words act like a truth serum and get people to blurt out what is really going on in their skulls.
The gopes want to watch their Jeb sex tape and Trump is screwing it all up.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 02:21 PM (MQEz6)
121
Moreover, political campaigns aren't really much different from product advertising campaigns.
It's all about selling Something to the Most People.
Moreover, political campaigns aren't really much different from product advertising campaigns.
It's all about selling Something to the Most People.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:21 PM (xUkfn)
122
Finger of birth-strangled babe
*perks up*
How many do you need?
****
I wondered if anyone would notice that line.
*perks up*
How many do you need?
****
I wondered if anyone would notice that line.
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 02:21 PM (NeFrd)
123
I'm going to leave this here:
Rahm: "Chik-fil-a values are not shitcago's values"
http://tinyurl.com/qfogd8b
Rahm: "Chik-fil-a values are not shitcago's values"
http://tinyurl.com/qfogd8b
Posted by: lindafell de Spair @ San Jacinto at August 16, 2015 02:21 PM (xVgrA)
124
"They'll vote for whatever "D" is on the ballot."
They will *claim* they voted D.
But not actually vote that way.
They will *claim* they voted D.
But not actually vote that way.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:21 PM (JgC5a)
125
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 02:20 PM (0FSuD)
_______
Dude, the GOP does not automatically get my vote. They have to earn it. And when they tell me Jeb is the perfect conservative candidate, they can go fuck themselves.
_______
Dude, the GOP does not automatically get my vote. They have to earn it. And when they tell me Jeb is the perfect conservative candidate, they can go fuck themselves.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:22 PM (0LHZx)
126
They're not only ignoring it, but most of them disagree with it. Especially on immigration. I'm a Cruz guy too, but so far all Cruz has offered is the "we need to secure the borders" with a side of "no sanctuary cities," the same platitudes as the others.
It doesn't matter if Trump is a "real" conservative or not, he's not going to get the nomination. But Trump dropped the mic today with his immigration policy, an issue that resonate with a lot of people, and an actionable plan. Let's see if the politicians are prepared to walk the walk or are just "selling us a dog" to get votes.
Trump called 'em out, now let's see who responds. For now he's delivering much-needed body blows to the establishment, forcing those weasels to take a stand when they'd rather not. For that alone I'll defend his run for as long as he can stand it.
It doesn't matter if Trump is a "real" conservative or not, he's not going to get the nomination. But Trump dropped the mic today with his immigration policy, an issue that resonate with a lot of people, and an actionable plan. Let's see if the politicians are prepared to walk the walk or are just "selling us a dog" to get votes.
Trump called 'em out, now let's see who responds. For now he's delivering much-needed body blows to the establishment, forcing those weasels to take a stand when they'd rather not. For that alone I'll defend his run for as long as he can stand it.
Posted by: Phil at August 16, 2015 02:22 PM (DjpfO)
Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at August 16, 2015 02:22 PM (W5DcG)
128
22
what a shock. Drudge says the authorities have found dozens more classified emails in Hillary's curated email collection.
Not to worry. Bill will pay a visit to the rat-eared Kenyan and they will work out a deal. The DOJ and FBI will disappear and all will be well.
The Hildebeest will survive. Again.
what a shock. Drudge says the authorities have found dozens more classified emails in Hillary's curated email collection.
Not to worry. Bill will pay a visit to the rat-eared Kenyan and they will work out a deal. The DOJ and FBI will disappear and all will be well.
The Hildebeest will survive. Again.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 02:24 PM (hRytD)
129
They will *claim* they voted D.
But not actually vote that way.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:21 PM (JgC5a)
_________
Like all those all those PUMAs that were the secret to McCain winning in 2008, right?
But not actually vote that way.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:21 PM (JgC5a)
_________
Like all those all those PUMAs that were the secret to McCain winning in 2008, right?
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:24 PM (0LHZx)
130
Trump released his policy paper on immigration.
Oh boy.
http://tinyurl.com/nmntuhy
Until Mexico builds the wall, impound all remittance payments derived from illegal wages.
GOPe monocles are dropping like rain.
Oh boy.
http://tinyurl.com/nmntuhy
Until Mexico builds the wall, impound all remittance payments derived from illegal wages.
GOPe monocles are dropping like rain.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 16, 2015 02:24 PM (oFCZn)
131
Really folks, the future of our nation is NOT a reality show.
Someone needs to get serious and tell Trump. YOU ARE FIRED.
Support the nominee with a promise, or no more debate invites
-------------
Yea, because that strategy has worked in the past.....
Really folks, the future of our nation is NOT a reality show.
Someone needs to get serious and tell Trump. YOU ARE FIRED.
Support the nominee with a promise, or no more debate invites
-------------
Yea, because that strategy has worked in the past.....
Posted by: lindafell de Spair @ San Jacinto at August 16, 2015 02:24 PM (xVgrA)
132
It was great seeing Juan Ellis Bush get heckled because of Iraq. They'll be heckling him as long as he's in the race.
It was great seeing Juan Ellis Bush get heckled because of Iraq. They'll be heckling him as long as he's in the race.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:25 PM (xUkfn)
133
Who ya gonna call?
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 02:20 PM (NeFrd)
******
GOPe Busters!
Who ya gonna call?
Posted by: The new thoughtful civil Muldoon at August 16, 2015 02:20 PM (NeFrd)
******
GOPe Busters!
Posted by: Elinor, Who Usually Looks Lurkily at August 16, 2015 02:25 PM (NqQAS)
134
Here is the other thing. Trump would win in the general.
Posted by: navybrat
--------------
As 3rd party? I am highly dubious.
Romney was right, I believe, in saying that 47% are going to pull the 'D' lever, even if Charlie Manson is at the top of the ticket.
Posted by: navybrat
--------------
As 3rd party? I am highly dubious.
Romney was right, I believe, in saying that 47% are going to pull the 'D' lever, even if Charlie Manson is at the top of the ticket.
Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 16, 2015 02:25 PM (9mTYi)
135
"Like all those all those PUMAs that were the secret to McCain winning in 2008, right?"
So, to you, McCain is just like Trump?
Right....
(Someone is drinking the bong water...)
So, to you, McCain is just like Trump?
Right....
(Someone is drinking the bong water...)
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:25 PM (JgC5a)
136
He'll get the support of upper management pretty soon. First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, and then you win.
Posted by: AC at August 16, 2015 02:26 PM (TzeLs)
137
HUCK/AKIN
Disagree, there are (anecdotally I admit) a LOT of Dem former base voters aka middle aged white women especially, who will not not not vote for Biden or Sanders or any other nonHRC nominee this time round
If The Teflon Don runs third party my guess is he picks up the disenfranchised former Dem base and the disenfranchised former GOP base (replaced by COC donors post '10)
IMO that's why the political handlers are shxtting themselves
Both sides have a 'Trump problem'
Disagree, there are (anecdotally I admit) a LOT of Dem former base voters aka middle aged white women especially, who will not not not vote for Biden or Sanders or any other nonHRC nominee this time round
If The Teflon Don runs third party my guess is he picks up the disenfranchised former Dem base and the disenfranchised former GOP base (replaced by COC donors post '10)
IMO that's why the political handlers are shxtting themselves
Both sides have a 'Trump problem'
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 02:26 PM (qxNrP)
138
One thing I don't get is the theory that Trump is doing all of this in
order to help Hillary. Like him or hate him, one thing you cay about
Trump is he's his own man. The idea that he's going through all this as
some super secret plan hatched up Bill and Hillary is the stupidest
thing I've ever heard.
Tinfoil gonna tinfoil
order to help Hillary. Like him or hate him, one thing you cay about
Trump is he's his own man. The idea that he's going through all this as
some super secret plan hatched up Bill and Hillary is the stupidest
thing I've ever heard.
Tinfoil gonna tinfoil
Posted by: Methos at August 16, 2015 02:26 PM (ZbV+0)
139
Support the nominee with a promise, or no more debate invites
-------------
Yea, because that strategy has worked in the past.....
Posted by: lindafell
--------------
I don't think the question has ever been asked.
-------------
Yea, because that strategy has worked in the past.....
Posted by: lindafell
--------------
I don't think the question has ever been asked.
Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 16, 2015 02:27 PM (9mTYi)
140
If Trump gets the nomination, will the GOPe go third party?
Posted by: Enquiring Minds Want to Know at August 16, 2015 02:28 PM (Uu9UT)
141
Triple number of ICE officers, immediate deportation, defund sanctuary cities, end birthright citizenship.
Oh boy. Jeb Bush is not going to like this at all.
Oh boy. Jeb Bush is not going to like this at all.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 16, 2015 02:28 PM (oFCZn)
Posted by: Methos at August 16, 2015 02:28 PM (ZbV+0)
143
the GOPe will go with the D's
the GOPe will go with the D's
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:28 PM (xUkfn)
144
Dude, the GOP does not automatically get my vote.
They have to earn it. And when they tell me Jeb is the perfect
conservative candidate, they can go fuck themselves.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:22 PM (0LHZx)
I agree. I won't vote for Jeb. No one I know has told me to.
They have to earn it. And when they tell me Jeb is the perfect
conservative candidate, they can go fuck themselves.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:22 PM (0LHZx)
I agree. I won't vote for Jeb. No one I know has told me to.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 02:29 PM (0FSuD)
145
Trump doesn't need to go 3rd party.
He doesn't need donors.
He hasn't spent a penny on ads.
He is getting all the PR he needs, free of charge.
Don't get me wrong, I like Cruz, Walker, even Rand a bit.
But, all of those candidates are going to have dance with ones that brung 'em to the party.
Not so, Trump.
He doesn't need donors.
He hasn't spent a penny on ads.
He is getting all the PR he needs, free of charge.
Don't get me wrong, I like Cruz, Walker, even Rand a bit.
But, all of those candidates are going to have dance with ones that brung 'em to the party.
Not so, Trump.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:30 PM (JgC5a)
146
You want to run as a third party, have at it.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 02:20 PM (0FSuD)
Please, not as a 3d party. That guarantees a democratic victory. Back in '92 Perot handed the victory to Clinton by taking away votes from Bush. Without that bat-eared little prick on the ballot, Bush would've won in a landslide.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 02:20 PM (0FSuD)
Please, not as a 3d party. That guarantees a democratic victory. Back in '92 Perot handed the victory to Clinton by taking away votes from Bush. Without that bat-eared little prick on the ballot, Bush would've won in a landslide.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 02:30 PM (hRytD)
147
Trump/Cruz 2016 - Fuck You, WAR!!
Posted by: Kreplach at August 16, 2015 02:30 PM (WVvzl)
148
Romney did not want to be president. There are conflicting conspiracies about why he did not, nefarious and mundane. None of these are important compared to the simple fact that the did not want to be president. Discussing it may make for some fun discussion, but that cannot change the fact.
Posted by: bergerbilder at August 16, 2015 02:31 PM (+jijM)
149
What's going on wiith Rubio? Is he also running for reelection?
What's going on wiith Rubio? Is he also running for reelection?
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:32 PM (xUkfn)
150
I just got back from Reno this morning and had the opportunity to go see Cruz, Fiorina, Walker, Ben Carson, Bolton at a Basque Fry in Gardnerville, NV. I went to high school with one of the event sponsors. As far as judging people by whom they hire to manage their campaigns is fair and was the one thing I had had an eye out for while I was there. I know who the scumbags (campaign staff) are in the Northern Nevada area. I was particularly interested in who was representing the Cruz campaign and was happy to see the same people/faces from Tea Party gatherings. Wish I wasn't so dead ass tired and I'm not worth a shit even when I'm not when it comes to typing and putting words to the screen. Cruz is who I think I could support at the moment(in spite of some missteps) and try to keep a healthy skepticism about him. Meeting the guy in person definitely changes your perspective of him. I viewed him as kind of a soft wimpy dude in videos, he came off as nothing of the sort in person.
Posted by: JROD at August 16, 2015 02:32 PM (wnwJC)
151
149
What's going on wiith Rubio? Is he also running for reelection?
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:32 PM (xUkfn)
No.
What's going on wiith Rubio? Is he also running for reelection?
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:32 PM (xUkfn)
No.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 16, 2015 02:33 PM (oFCZn)
152
In Case it was not up thread, here is Trump's immigration plan:
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/positions/immigration-reform
Name something you don't agree with.
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/positions/immigration-reform
Name something you don't agree with.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican at August 16, 2015 02:33 PM (f+6Pd)
153
I agree. I won't vote for Jeb. No one I know has told me to.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 02:29 PM (0FSuD)
I won't vote for Jeb...not even if the collective Horde demands that I do so.Not. A. Fucking. Chance.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 02:29 PM (0FSuD)
I won't vote for Jeb...not even if the collective Horde demands that I do so.Not. A. Fucking. Chance.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 02:33 PM (hRytD)
154
Wow, so I guess that'll be the end of Rubio's political career.
Wow, so I guess that'll be the end of Rubio's political career.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:34 PM (xUkfn)
155
Please, not as a 3d party. That guarantees a democratic victory. Back in '92 Perot handed the victory to Clinton by taking away votes from Bush. Without that bat-eared little prick on the ballot, Bush would've won in a landslide.
Posted by: Sixkiller
--------------------------
But, This Time Things Will Be Different!
And besides, as long as we slap the GOP, any sacrifice is worth it!
There's no difference between Hillary and any GOP candidate?!
LIB!
Posted by: Sixkiller
--------------------------
But, This Time Things Will Be Different!
And besides, as long as we slap the GOP, any sacrifice is worth it!
There's no difference between Hillary and any GOP candidate?!
LIB!
Posted by: The Self-Righteously Disaffected at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (9mTYi)
156
Trump threatens their double dealing and theft
Posted by: Mr Wizard at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (hCdMd)
157
Good God this Trump paper on immigration is a nuclear bomb.
If you thought people were freaking out before, it's going to ramp up by orders of magnitude very soon.
If you thought people were freaking out before, it's going to ramp up by orders of magnitude very soon.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (oFCZn)
158
Name something you don't agree with.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican
I agree with every bit of it. Note, however, that he doesn't say what he'll do with those already here, with the exception of the criminal element.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican
I agree with every bit of it. Note, however, that he doesn't say what he'll do with those already here, with the exception of the criminal element.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (LAe3v)
159
The GOP is done, they've literally have been shitting in our faces for at least the last 15 in the short term and since Reagan in the long term.
I am done, I want things for my support not empty promises lies and Trump is saying things we have all said we want someone on our side saying and taking it to the media with a cluexfour
Trumps the indespensible man, he's the man in the ring and he's got my support.
I am done, I want things for my support not empty promises lies and Trump is saying things we have all said we want someone on our side saying and taking it to the media with a cluexfour
Trumps the indespensible man, he's the man in the ring and he's got my support.
Posted by: Kreplach at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (WVvzl)
160
Trump released his policy paper on immigration.
Holy Shit.
*I* could have written that.
At this rate Trump is going to make me vote for him as a matter of endorsement rather than fucking with the uniparty.
Holy Shit.
*I* could have written that.
At this rate Trump is going to make me vote for him as a matter of endorsement rather than fucking with the uniparty.
Posted by: Methos at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (ZbV+0)
161
Alan Grayson, the wifebeater, plans on running for Senate. He'll probably win.
Alan Grayson, the wifebeater, plans on running for Senate. He'll probably win.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (xUkfn)
162
152 In Case it was not up thread, here is Trump's immigration plan:
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/positions/immigration-reform
Name something you don't agree with.
---
His hair! No really, enough with the hair envy people.
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/positions/immigration-reform
Name something you don't agree with.
---
His hair! No really, enough with the hair envy people.
Posted by: AC at August 16, 2015 02:37 PM (TzeLs)
163
"The Democrat MSM steamroller would have already flattened our other candidates without him running interference."
FIFY
FIFY
Posted by: Kindltot at August 16, 2015 02:37 PM (3pRHP)
164
what is the comparison of gwbush voter turnout with McCain voter turnout
people keep comparing Romney vs McCain turnout saying the base didn't stay home
but IIRC GWB turnout saw much greater numbrs than voters coming out for McCain or Romney
comp those election turnout stats
I believe if the disparaged bases of both parties are offered someone sayng what they want to hear they will come vote for them thirs party rather than sit home and await further enfxckening
people keep comparing Romney vs McCain turnout saying the base didn't stay home
but IIRC GWB turnout saw much greater numbrs than voters coming out for McCain or Romney
comp those election turnout stats
I believe if the disparaged bases of both parties are offered someone sayng what they want to hear they will come vote for them thirs party rather than sit home and await further enfxckening
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 02:37 PM (qxNrP)
165
So, to you, McCain is just like Trump?
Right....
(Someone is drinking the bong water...)
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:25 PM (JgC5a)
________
No. I'm saying Democrats will vote for the "D" no matter who the "R" is.
Right....
(Someone is drinking the bong water...)
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:25 PM (JgC5a)
________
No. I'm saying Democrats will vote for the "D" no matter who the "R" is.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:38 PM (0LHZx)
166
I like Cruz very much, but I think he injects religious aspects in to his speeches a little too much. I am a Christian, and it doesn't bother me, I even like it.
But, most don't. Most voters are Secular Humanists and they already suspect the GOP of being the voice of the Religious Right.
He should play that down. Just my $.02 worth.
But, most don't. Most voters are Secular Humanists and they already suspect the GOP of being the voice of the Religious Right.
He should play that down. Just my $.02 worth.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 02:38 PM (JgC5a)
167
Every time I see 'LIB' I think to myself, "MR Ducks 2."
You know, from the good ole boy conversation.
You know, from the good ole boy conversation.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 02:38 PM (hRytD)
Posted by: Susan Lee at August 16, 2015 02:38 PM (jtslA)
169
93 quote: As a target and a whipping boy, not to mention as a voice for the rage
of the people, this Donald is not too bad. The Democrat steamroller
would have already flattened our other candidates without him running
interference. He's like our very own "run it off-tackle" smash-mouth
football play.
Please note the highlighted red. My dearest poster 93 Common sense rules the day. Grates to and yours.
let me repeat myself one more time Independents when presidential elections!!! If i was a business man which i am, i would would play my cards of running 3rd party, which breeds fear of the unknown. But i also know not to look a gift horse in the mouth: or in other words, business men don't and wont bite the hand that feeds it. Throw rocks if you must, but lose you will.
To Quote Mel Brooks in space balls, damn you're helmet is big.
of the people, this Donald is not too bad. The Democrat steamroller
would have already flattened our other candidates without him running
interference. He's like our very own "run it off-tackle" smash-mouth
football play.
Please note the highlighted red. My dearest poster 93 Common sense rules the day. Grates to and yours.
let me repeat myself one more time Independents when presidential elections!!! If i was a business man which i am, i would would play my cards of running 3rd party, which breeds fear of the unknown. But i also know not to look a gift horse in the mouth: or in other words, business men don't and wont bite the hand that feeds it. Throw rocks if you must, but lose you will.
To Quote Mel Brooks in space balls, damn you're helmet is big.
Posted by: Frodus at August 16, 2015 02:39 PM (7OAjN)
170
Trumps the indespensible man, he's the man in the ring and he's got my support.
Posted by: Kreplach
Really? Because that wasn't at all clear.
Posted by: Kreplach
Really? Because that wasn't at all clear.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:39 PM (LAe3v)
171
No. I'm saying Democrats will vote for the "D" no matter who the "R" is.
Posted by: HUCK
-----------------
Or who the "I" is.
Posted by: HUCK
-----------------
Or who the "I" is.
Posted by: The Self-Righteously Disaffected at August 16, 2015 02:39 PM (9mTYi)
172
Grayson will the Senate seat because Boehner didn't demand he resign from the House when it was revealed that he abused his wife.
Boner also hasn't demanded Chaka Khan Fatter's resignation.
Chaka will beat the rap, and then win another term in 2016.
THIS (and a hundred other reasons) is why I'm done with the Republicans.
Grayson will the Senate seat because Boehner didn't demand he resign from the House when it was revealed that he abused his wife.
Boner also hasn't demanded Chaka Khan Fatter's resignation.
Chaka will beat the rap, and then win another term in 2016.
THIS (and a hundred other reasons) is why I'm done with the Republicans.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:40 PM (xUkfn)
173
The more time you spend around the "brain trust" that is the political operative and consultant class, the lower your opinion will get of their supposed "expert knowledge". They are all tactics and no strategy - and the tactics are nothing to write home about either.
I actually have some degree of empathy for them, in so far as they are just men and women trying to make it in their industry, just like any other industry.
What leads to "success" in that industry (more money and bigger titles) is often paradoxically, the exact opposite of what wins elections and more often than not, diametrically opposed to what advances the conservative agenda. Individually, this is not their fault. It is simply the "rules" of the industry as it is currently structured.
That is where my sympathy ends because the most frustrating aspect of it is that I can think of no other industry that so completely rewards repeated failure. The same failed consultants and operatives get hired over and over and over again. But don't worry, they'll be happy to blame their next loss on "lack of outreach", "demographics"or "lack of civility" - anything but their own lack of vision and botched execution.
If I had to choose between getting rid of the status quo politicians or the status quo consultant class ...it would be a tough choice but I'd go with the latter because it would actually make a bigger difference.
Happily, I need to make that choice. Two birds, one stone.
I actually have some degree of empathy for them, in so far as they are just men and women trying to make it in their industry, just like any other industry.
What leads to "success" in that industry (more money and bigger titles) is often paradoxically, the exact opposite of what wins elections and more often than not, diametrically opposed to what advances the conservative agenda. Individually, this is not their fault. It is simply the "rules" of the industry as it is currently structured.
That is where my sympathy ends because the most frustrating aspect of it is that I can think of no other industry that so completely rewards repeated failure. The same failed consultants and operatives get hired over and over and over again. But don't worry, they'll be happy to blame their next loss on "lack of outreach", "demographics"or "lack of civility" - anything but their own lack of vision and botched execution.
If I had to choose between getting rid of the status quo politicians or the status quo consultant class ...it would be a tough choice but I'd go with the latter because it would actually make a bigger difference.
Happily, I need to make that choice. Two birds, one stone.
Posted by: CastleP at August 16, 2015 02:40 PM (7+oeE)
174
Disagree, there are (anecdotally I admit) a LOT of Dem former base voters aka middle aged white women especially, who will not not not vote for Biden or Sanders or any other nonHRC nominee this time round
'
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 02:26 PM (qxNrP)
_________
I know a ton of these same women who in 2011 swore up and down they were done with Obama since he was such a fuck up. And by mid 2012 they were all posting on Facebook how dangerous a Romney win would be for womanhood and it was imperative that everyone go out and do everything they can to help Obama win a 2nd term.
'
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 02:26 PM (qxNrP)
_________
I know a ton of these same women who in 2011 swore up and down they were done with Obama since he was such a fuck up. And by mid 2012 they were all posting on Facebook how dangerous a Romney win would be for womanhood and it was imperative that everyone go out and do everything they can to help Obama win a 2nd term.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:41 PM (0LHZx)
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:41 PM (xUkfn)
176
No. I'm saying Democrats will vote for the "D" no matter who the "R" is.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:38 PM (0LHZx)
Too true.Too many people getting free shit from the Dems. Only 47 percent of you/us work/pay taxes. Folks getting freebies will not, under any circumstances, vote for someone who will take their free shit away.So while threads like these are fun, because we can vent just a tad, they are largely nothing more than intellectual masturbation.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:38 PM (0LHZx)
Too true.Too many people getting free shit from the Dems. Only 47 percent of you/us work/pay taxes. Folks getting freebies will not, under any circumstances, vote for someone who will take their free shit away.So while threads like these are fun, because we can vent just a tad, they are largely nothing more than intellectual masturbation.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 02:41 PM (hRytD)
177
No. I'm saying Democrats will vote for the "D" no matter who the "R" is.
--
That's 32% of voters. So that leaves R's and I's up for grabs,
--
That's 32% of voters. So that leaves R's and I's up for grabs,
Posted by: AC at August 16, 2015 02:42 PM (TzeLs)
Posted by: GOPe strategists arm in arm with Lisa Murkowski at August 16, 2015 02:42 PM (ZbV+0)
179
Tonight on Fox one hour, The Trump Campaign
(repeated through the evening). Prelude to new Fox Series -- The Cruz
Campaign, The Gilmore Campaign, The Huckabee Campaign? Fair and
Balanced?
Posted by: gracepc at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (DMQhB)
To be honest, really, do you think Hillary or Bernie or any of their minions will speak to anyone from Fox?
C'mon. Their gut reaction is to release the FBI and US Fish and Wildlife armed agents on them for violation of the ban on trafficking in ivory every time they think of that channel.
(repeated through the evening). Prelude to new Fox Series -- The Cruz
Campaign, The Gilmore Campaign, The Huckabee Campaign? Fair and
Balanced?
Posted by: gracepc at August 16, 2015 02:13 PM (DMQhB)
To be honest, really, do you think Hillary or Bernie or any of their minions will speak to anyone from Fox?
C'mon. Their gut reaction is to release the FBI and US Fish and Wildlife armed agents on them for violation of the ban on trafficking in ivory every time they think of that channel.
Posted by: Kindltot at August 16, 2015 02:43 PM (3pRHP)
180
Well, that policy statement is the reddest red meat I've seen in a while.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 02:43 PM (yTPDN)
181
Let's talk good touches and bad touches, here.
First, politics and beanbag, as they say. And no politician is obligated to fluff his opponents skirts. In a primary, everyone is theoretically on the same side, but no matter what, you want to be the first one past the post (or your candidate to be first past the post.)
In a primary, candidates of the same party are going to level criticisms at each other.
I think, however, is that Reagan's 11th Commandment gets misinterpreted - or maybe, dare I say the great man misspoke.
No Republican should be using Democrat talking points against another Republican. So, if you go up and say "my opponent is way too extreme for the American people who will reject his way of thinking," well, if your opponent wins the nomination, you can pretty much guarantee that quote will show up again, over and over.
But if you plan to win, you can't be too cautious about attending to what happens if you lose. So that doesn't mean that there can be no criticism that might then be used in the general by someone else. So, for example, playing the experience card in the primary is fair game - if you say your opponent doesn't have the foreign policy experience or whatever, well, that is fair game.
So, for example, if Walker were to say "compare pro-life records between myself and Trump" that's fair game. If Pataki were to say "here is my fiscal management record in New York vs. Trump's" that is fair game.
For anyone (running) to say "he is a wacko bird who disrespects the American people" well, that isn't fair game.
I am not saying that record is the only thing that can be used - but parroting Democrats should be right out.
First, politics and beanbag, as they say. And no politician is obligated to fluff his opponents skirts. In a primary, everyone is theoretically on the same side, but no matter what, you want to be the first one past the post (or your candidate to be first past the post.)
In a primary, candidates of the same party are going to level criticisms at each other.
I think, however, is that Reagan's 11th Commandment gets misinterpreted - or maybe, dare I say the great man misspoke.
No Republican should be using Democrat talking points against another Republican. So, if you go up and say "my opponent is way too extreme for the American people who will reject his way of thinking," well, if your opponent wins the nomination, you can pretty much guarantee that quote will show up again, over and over.
But if you plan to win, you can't be too cautious about attending to what happens if you lose. So that doesn't mean that there can be no criticism that might then be used in the general by someone else. So, for example, playing the experience card in the primary is fair game - if you say your opponent doesn't have the foreign policy experience or whatever, well, that is fair game.
So, for example, if Walker were to say "compare pro-life records between myself and Trump" that's fair game. If Pataki were to say "here is my fiscal management record in New York vs. Trump's" that is fair game.
For anyone (running) to say "he is a wacko bird who disrespects the American people" well, that isn't fair game.
I am not saying that record is the only thing that can be used - but parroting Democrats should be right out.
Posted by: blaster at August 16, 2015 02:43 PM (2Ocf1)
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:43 PM (xUkfn)
183
I'm telling you, Trump has crossover appeal.
Remember Reagan Democrats?
I bet Trump does.
And I think a little bit of what seems like non pure conservative rhetoric is a fair bit of triangulation on his part to get democrats.
So when he says fuck no the government shouldn't be funding abortion but we gotta take care of woman so we'll look at the positive aspects of PP, dude that's pure Clintonian triangulation.
That she plays well across a wide spectrum of voters.
Remember Reagan Democrats?
I bet Trump does.
And I think a little bit of what seems like non pure conservative rhetoric is a fair bit of triangulation on his part to get democrats.
So when he says fuck no the government shouldn't be funding abortion but we gotta take care of woman so we'll look at the positive aspects of PP, dude that's pure Clintonian triangulation.
That she plays well across a wide spectrum of voters.
Posted by: Kreplach at August 16, 2015 02:43 PM (WVvzl)
184
"I agree with every bit of it. Note, however, that he
doesn't say what he'll do with those already here, with the exception
of the criminal element.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (LAe3v)"-----------------------
Well I think if the goodies are gone, no EBT, medical care, free school, illegal tax refunds, no money sent back to mexico, no jobs,.... the illegals will REALLY self deport. Plus it will be OK for legal citizens to put social pressure on the illegals.
doesn't say what he'll do with those already here, with the exception
of the criminal element.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (LAe3v)"-----------------------
Well I think if the goodies are gone, no EBT, medical care, free school, illegal tax refunds, no money sent back to mexico, no jobs,.... the illegals will REALLY self deport. Plus it will be OK for legal citizens to put social pressure on the illegals.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican at August 16, 2015 02:45 PM (f+6Pd)
185
Here's what's gonna happen next week: They'll start calling Trump a "nationalist" and his supporters "nativists" and "xenospores" or whatever the word is.
Then they'll start mentioning Marine LaPen every time they mention Trump. and John Birch.
Trump needs to swith gears from immigration and show he's not one-dimensional, anyway.
Here's what's gonna happen next week: They'll start calling Trump a "nationalist" and his supporters "nativists" and "xenospores" or whatever the word is.
Then they'll start mentioning Marine LaPen every time they mention Trump. and John Birch.
Trump needs to swith gears from immigration and show he's not one-dimensional, anyway.
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:46 PM (xUkfn)
186
Well I think if the goodies are gone, no EBT,
medical care, free school, illegal tax refunds, no money sent back to
mexico, no jobs,.... the illegals will REALLY self deport. Plus it will
be OK for legal citizens to put social pressure on the illegals.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican
Then he should say so explicitly. "My goal, like that of Governor Romney, is self-deportation".
medical care, free school, illegal tax refunds, no money sent back to
mexico, no jobs,.... the illegals will REALLY self deport. Plus it will
be OK for legal citizens to put social pressure on the illegals.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican
Then he should say so explicitly. "My goal, like that of Governor Romney, is self-deportation".
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:47 PM (LAe3v)
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:47 PM (xUkfn)
188
183 I'm telling you, Trump has crossover appeal.
--
He's got leftist news pundits eating from the palm of his hand. Anderson Cooper has a permanent, uh, nevermind.
--
He's got leftist news pundits eating from the palm of his hand. Anderson Cooper has a permanent, uh, nevermind.
Posted by: AC at August 16, 2015 02:47 PM (TzeLs)
Posted by: Soothsayer rose above the noise and confusion just to get a glimpse beyond the illusion at August 16, 2015 02:47 PM (xUkfn)
190
remember XENAPHOME the Warrior Princess?
remember XENAPHOME the Warrior Princess?
Posted by: Soothsayerwing Plover at August 16, 2015 02:48 PM (xUkfn)
Posted by: CastleP at August 16, 2015 02:48 PM (7+oeE)
192
He's got leftist news pundits eating from the palm of his hand. Anderson Cooper has a permanent, uh, nevermind.
Posted by: AC
Do you think it's possible, just maybe, that they think he's a guaranteed loser for the GOP, so they'll encourage him until he gets the nom? Crazy, I know, but it might just work.
Posted by: AC
Do you think it's possible, just maybe, that they think he's a guaranteed loser for the GOP, so they'll encourage him until he gets the nom? Crazy, I know, but it might just work.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:49 PM (LAe3v)
193
TRUMP: First of all, I'd like to just go back to one. In July of 2004, I came out strongly against the war with Iraq, because it was going to destabilize the Middle East. And I'm the only one on this stage that knew that and had the vision to say it. And that's exactly what happened.
July of 2004 seems awfully late.
March 31: 31 March 2004 Fallujah ambush: Four Blackwater contractors ambushed and killed in Fallujah, causing a First Battle of Fallujah.
April: Beginning of the Iraq Spring.
April 4: Beginning of violent clashes between the coalition and followers of Shia cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, which will end at the end of August 2004.
April 18: Abu Ghraib torture and prisoner abuse; Beginning of the diffusion of images of humiliated Iraqi detainees by US soldiers in Abu Ghraib.
July of 2004 seems awfully late.
March 31: 31 March 2004 Fallujah ambush: Four Blackwater contractors ambushed and killed in Fallujah, causing a First Battle of Fallujah.
April: Beginning of the Iraq Spring.
April 4: Beginning of violent clashes between the coalition and followers of Shia cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, which will end at the end of August 2004.
April 18: Abu Ghraib torture and prisoner abuse; Beginning of the diffusion of images of humiliated Iraqi detainees by US soldiers in Abu Ghraib.
Posted by: Daesh at August 16, 2015 02:50 PM (e8kgV)
194
Jeb vs HIllary = 100% guaranteed Hillary win
Trump vs Hillary = who the fuck knows? Hillary still probably wins, but it's not a slam dunk.
Trump vs Hillary = who the fuck knows? Hillary still probably wins, but it's not a slam dunk.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 02:51 PM (0LHZx)
195
Trump is a disgusting, uncouth boor.
He doesn't understand theintimate and nuanced exchanges necessary to insure that the right people are in control and able to remain there.
Helicopter rides for children....Bah!
He doesn't understand theintimate and nuanced exchanges necessary to insure that the right people are in control and able to remain there.
Helicopter rides for children....Bah!
Posted by: Your Uniparty Oligarch Betters at August 16, 2015 02:51 PM (p23bX)
196
Homophones, or xeroscape.
Posted by: Kindltot at August 16, 2015 02:52 PM (3pRHP)
Posted by: Daesh at August 16, 2015 02:52 PM (e8kgV)
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 02:52 PM (rwI+c)
199
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:49 PM (LAe3v)
I share your suspicion but I'm not sure he is the "sure loser" in the general that they think he is: Hillary 47 Trump 42......just wait until he pulls into a tie. At that point heads will explode on both sides of the aisle and the media will train the fully operational SJW deathstar on him
I share your suspicion but I'm not sure he is the "sure loser" in the general that they think he is: Hillary 47 Trump 42......just wait until he pulls into a tie. At that point heads will explode on both sides of the aisle and the media will train the fully operational SJW deathstar on him
Posted by: CastleP at August 16, 2015 02:53 PM (7+oeE)
200
I believe a President Trump would have one dynamite A-List cabinet and administration.
And with Cruz as his VP and President of the Senate, I believe the federal empire would not know what hit it.
And with Cruz as his VP and President of the Senate, I believe the federal empire would not know what hit it.
Posted by: Kreplach at August 16, 2015 02:54 PM (WVvzl)
201
Posted by: rhomboid at August 16, 2015 02:07 PM (QDnY+)
I agree. I was just promulgating the two limiting cases, viz., making every policy decision through a show of hands (pure democracy) versus making every such decision unilaterally (dictatorship).
The trick is knowing when to follow the will of the people, and when to buck it (e.g., FDR and aiding Britain pre-Pearl Harbor, Reagan arming the contras).
I agree. I was just promulgating the two limiting cases, viz., making every policy decision through a show of hands (pure democracy) versus making every such decision unilaterally (dictatorship).
The trick is knowing when to follow the will of the people, and when to buck it (e.g., FDR and aiding Britain pre-Pearl Harbor, Reagan arming the contras).
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 02:55 PM (oKE6c)
202
Julian Bond, a former chairman of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, a charismatic figure of the 1960s civil rights movement, a lightning rod of the anti-Vietnam War campaign and a lifelong champion of equal rights for minorities, died on Saturday night, according to the Southern Poverty Law Center. He was 75.
Posted by: President Barack "Unexpectedly" Obama at August 16, 2015 02:56 PM (e8kgV)
203
>>He's got leftist news pundits eating from the palm of his hand. Anderson Cooper has a permanent, uh, nevermind.
While pep is right, saw Mika Brznskiwhatever recently admit that Trump is accessible unlike any other candidate - he will call them, they can call him (not one of his handlers), he will come on the show if invited without any of the numerous email exchanges w/handlers setting ground rules, requirements, etc.. Just imagine how this compares with, say, Hillary when attempting to schedule a media appearance.
They may despise him, but his non-politician behavior is an asset even w/the Lefty media.
Interesting.
While pep is right, saw Mika Brznskiwhatever recently admit that Trump is accessible unlike any other candidate - he will call them, they can call him (not one of his handlers), he will come on the show if invited without any of the numerous email exchanges w/handlers setting ground rules, requirements, etc.. Just imagine how this compares with, say, Hillary when attempting to schedule a media appearance.
They may despise him, but his non-politician behavior is an asset even w/the Lefty media.
Interesting.
Posted by: Lizzy at August 16, 2015 02:56 PM (NOIQH)
204
Just read Trump's first Policy Paper on his site, understandably addressing immigration. It's quite comprehensive and I agree with every part of it. I understand more positions will be fleshed out in the weeks ahead.
Those who still claim Trump has no specifics clearly aren't paying attention.
Those who still claim Trump has no specifics clearly aren't paying attention.
Posted by: Kate58 at August 16, 2015 02:56 PM (oLZsm)
205
I believe a President Trump would have one dynamite A-List cabinet and administration.
I believe our nuclear deterrence would be back on the table, too.
Iran, China, looking at you *squints*
I believe our nuclear deterrence would be back on the table, too.
Iran, China, looking at you *squints*
Posted by: Methos at August 16, 2015 02:56 PM (ZbV+0)
206
What we're seeing, is hubris smashing into nemesis.
The GOPe set up the primaries to favor squishy charlatans.
But when it comes to squishy charlatans, the outsider Trump is more entertaining then all their stooges put together.
The GOPe lined up over a hundred million dollars so Jeb could suck up oxygen and attack the conservative candidates. With the willing help of the mass media..
But Trump doesn't need to buy exposure. And the attacks they're launching against Trump actively undermine the attacks they want to launch at the conservative candidates.
Also, the conservative portion of the base wants the GOPe to die in a fire, and is quite entertained by GOPe-supporting mouthpieces denouncing Trump as "No True Conservative". If they do manage to successfully disqualify Trump on these grounds, we're going to have an awful lot of fun quoting them as an attack on their favored candidates, and heap public humiliations on their heads when they attempt to backtrack. Being able to destroy their credibility (and hopefully, livelihoods) is an opportunity we'll seize with all talons.
I'm now marking Perry off my list of acceptable candidates.
Hiring Schmidt is disqualifying, in that it shows extremely poor judgement. (And gives a paycheck to a parasite who needs to starve to death as an object lesson to others of his ilk.)
The GOPe set up the primaries to favor squishy charlatans.
But when it comes to squishy charlatans, the outsider Trump is more entertaining then all their stooges put together.
The GOPe lined up over a hundred million dollars so Jeb could suck up oxygen and attack the conservative candidates. With the willing help of the mass media..
But Trump doesn't need to buy exposure. And the attacks they're launching against Trump actively undermine the attacks they want to launch at the conservative candidates.
Also, the conservative portion of the base wants the GOPe to die in a fire, and is quite entertained by GOPe-supporting mouthpieces denouncing Trump as "No True Conservative". If they do manage to successfully disqualify Trump on these grounds, we're going to have an awful lot of fun quoting them as an attack on their favored candidates, and heap public humiliations on their heads when they attempt to backtrack. Being able to destroy their credibility (and hopefully, livelihoods) is an opportunity we'll seize with all talons.
I'm now marking Perry off my list of acceptable candidates.
Hiring Schmidt is disqualifying, in that it shows extremely poor judgement. (And gives a paycheck to a parasite who needs to starve to death as an object lesson to others of his ilk.)
Posted by: Luke at August 16, 2015 02:57 PM (pfTnm)
207
198 If Trump gets the nomination, will the GOPe go third party?
Thread Winner.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 02:52 PM (rwI+c)
That's crazy talk!
Thread Winner.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 02:52 PM (rwI+c)
That's crazy talk!
Posted by: Lisa Murkowski at August 16, 2015 02:57 PM (yTPDN)
208
The world is a better place without Julian Bond in it.
The world is a better place without Julian Bond in it.
Posted by: Soothsayer at August 16, 2015 02:57 PM (xUkfn)
209
To echo others on the thread...I am blown away by his immigration policy statement. The media and the Establishment will have to move quickly to smear it because it could easily push 60+% popular support.
Posted by: CastleP at August 16, 2015 02:58 PM (7+oeE)
210
There are people shitting their pants right this second reading that paper on immigration.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 16, 2015 02:58 PM (oFCZn)
211
Posted by: blaster at August 16, 2015 02:43 PM (2Ocf1)
Yep. In short, begin with the end in mind. "If I win ..." "If I lose ..."
Yep. In short, begin with the end in mind. "If I win ..." "If I lose ..."
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 16, 2015 02:58 PM (oKE6c)
212
I know a ton of these same women who in 2011 swore up and down they were done with Obama since he was such a fuck up. And by mid 2012 they were all posting on Facebook how dangerous a Romney win would be for womanhood and it was imperative that everyone go out and do everything they can to help Obama win a 2nd term.
So, you know a ton of idiots.
So, you know a ton of idiots.
Posted by: Infidel at August 16, 2015 02:59 PM (pVxmd)
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:00 PM (LAe3v)
214
There are people shitting their pants right this second reading that paper on immigration.
Well, I have to admit something happened in my pants.
Well, I have to admit something happened in my pants.
Posted by: Methos at August 16, 2015 03:00 PM (ZbV+0)
215
Posted by: Luke at August 16, 2015 02:57 PM (pfTnm)
Agreed on destroying their livelihoods. I want these losers parking cars at a Howard Johnson's in Bumfuck, Kansas.
Agreed on destroying their livelihoods. I want these losers parking cars at a Howard Johnson's in Bumfuck, Kansas.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 16, 2015 03:01 PM (oFCZn)
216
210
There are people shitting their pants right this second reading that paper on immigration.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis
Its the HQ. What does a paper have to do with it?
There are people shitting their pants right this second reading that paper on immigration.
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis
Its the HQ. What does a paper have to do with it?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:01 PM (LAe3v)
217
Where's the gum thread?
Posted by: Toothless Geezer at August 16, 2015 03:02 PM (/f6Nd)
218
158 Name something you don't agree with.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican
I agree with every bit of it. Note, however, that he doesn't say what he'll do with those already here, with the exception of the criminal element.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (LAe3v)
They are a separate issue. Do all this stuff first, then address that question.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican
I agree with every bit of it. Note, however, that he doesn't say what he'll do with those already here, with the exception of the criminal element.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 02:36 PM (LAe3v)
They are a separate issue. Do all this stuff first, then address that question.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 03:03 PM (yTPDN)
219
217
Where's the gum thread?
Posted by: Toothless Geezer
You have an onion on your belt, don't you.
Where's the gum thread?
Posted by: Toothless Geezer
You have an onion on your belt, don't you.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:03 PM (LAe3v)
220
I'd love to see Trump's ego go up against the entrenched bureaucracy. We would finally find out what happens when an irresistible force meets an immovable object.
Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at August 16, 2015 03:04 PM (ktt8p)
221
212 I know a ton of these same women who in 2011 swore up and down they were done with Obama since he was such a fuck up. And by mid 2012 they were all posting on Facebook how dangerous a Romney win would be for womanhood and it was imperative that everyone go out and do everything they can to help Obama win a 2nd term.
So, you know a ton of idiots.
Posted by: Infidel at August 16, 2015 02:59 PM (pVxmd)
_________
They're not idiots, they are LIVs who don't spend hours upon hours reading about every word uttered by a politician. They get their news from Yahoo and Jon Stewart.
You can dismiss them if you want, but they are the majority of voters in this country.
So, you know a ton of idiots.
Posted by: Infidel at August 16, 2015 02:59 PM (pVxmd)
_________
They're not idiots, they are LIVs who don't spend hours upon hours reading about every word uttered by a politician. They get their news from Yahoo and Jon Stewart.
You can dismiss them if you want, but they are the majority of voters in this country.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:04 PM (0LHZx)
222
They are a separate issue. Do all this stuff first, then address that question.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk
Hold on. I thought Trump's main virtue was his fearlessness in speaking to the issues that concern Americans. This is the obvious place to tell us his plans for this problem, and if he's not willing to, then he's just another politician.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk
Hold on. I thought Trump's main virtue was his fearlessness in speaking to the issues that concern Americans. This is the obvious place to tell us his plans for this problem, and if he's not willing to, then he's just another politician.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:06 PM (LAe3v)
223
You have an onion on your belt, don't you.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:03 PM (LAe3v)
Belt?
Who the hell is wearing pants?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:03 PM (LAe3v)
Belt?
Who the hell is wearing pants?
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 16, 2015 03:06 PM (oFCZn)
224
the Political Class tells me how stupid and out of touch I am
Trump tells me THEY'RE stupid and out of touch
Which one shall I choose? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Trump tells me THEY'RE stupid and out of touch
Which one shall I choose? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Posted by: Biggie Large at August 16, 2015 03:06 PM (8CdUx)
225
224 the Political Class tells me how stupid and out of touch I am
Trump tells me THEY'RE stupid and out of touch
Which one shall I choose? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Posted by: Biggie Large at August 16, 2015 03:06 PM (8CdUx)
___________
That is VERY WELL put.
Trump tells me THEY'RE stupid and out of touch
Which one shall I choose? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Posted by: Biggie Large at August 16, 2015 03:06 PM (8CdUx)
___________
That is VERY WELL put.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:07 PM (0LHZx)
226
This is the obvious place to tell us his plans for this problem, and if
he's not willing to, then he's just another politician.
I give that attempt at hackery half a star.
he's not willing to, then he's just another politician.
I give that attempt at hackery half a star.
Posted by: Methos at August 16, 2015 03:08 PM (ZbV+0)
227
128
22
Bill and Barry teed off together Saturday and then the Obamas and the Clintons attended big Dem shindig. Kiss, Kiss. Stab, Stab.
22
Bill and Barry teed off together Saturday and then the Obamas and the Clintons attended big Dem shindig. Kiss, Kiss. Stab, Stab.
Posted by: gracepmc at August 16, 2015 03:09 PM (DMQhB)
228
Morgan Freeman's step granddaughter was stabbed to death by her ex bf. Wasnt Freeman banging her, too?
Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at August 16, 2015 03:09 PM (iQIUe)
229
222 Pep, if they don't get welfare bennies; if they can't get hired; if they're not covered under Obamacare et al.; at that point who really cares if they stay or go? Other than clogging up the freeways, no harm no foul.
And obviously with nothing to keep them here they'd return to the Motherland anyway.
And obviously with nothing to keep them here they'd return to the Motherland anyway.
Posted by: Kate58 at August 16, 2015 03:11 PM (oLZsm)
230
So the consensus is:
Trump is a stalking horse.
Trump will implode
Trump will split the Republican Party
Trump will run third party and give the election to Hillary!
Nobody likes Jeb.
Hillary is a crook but nobody cares.
And now, the envelope please:
I don't think Trump is going to burn out, go away or fizzle. He may not win the nomination, but it's not because he won't be trying. To win the R - nomination, he has to become more focused in his messaging, more message discipline. He can't ramble extemporaneously like he sometime does while speaking. If you watched Ronald Reagan in 1980, he had very good message discipline, as to what he wanted to talk about, and what his key issues were. The people responded.
By bringing Jeff Sessions on board, he may or may alienate more of the R-Party, but more of the masks will drop. If he goes into the Republican Convention with enough votes/delegates to win the nomination, it will be one of the weirdest conventions ever. In Cleveland, no less.
Jeb is a terrible candidate. What kind of man turns on his own brother? A weasily, cowardly kind of man, that's who. He's where he is in the polls because of name recognition, that's all. His message-fu is weak.
Trump is a great candidate for the Democrats to campaign against, and the Media. They will call him all the names and more that the anti-Trump faction here does. George Will may go third party.
Hillary will burn out; the secret server scandal will torch her. Joe Biden will be the nominee with a promise of "one term". Watch who he picks as his running mate, because that will be the presumptive D- nominee in 2020.
My money is on Corey Booker.
Joe Biden is an idiot and will also energize the Republican base. Watching Biden and Trump flail at each other will be the greatest thing on TV for decades.
I predict a record voting turnout for the 2016 election.
Trump is a stalking horse.
Trump will implode
Trump will split the Republican Party
Trump will run third party and give the election to Hillary!
Nobody likes Jeb.
Hillary is a crook but nobody cares.
And now, the envelope please:
I don't think Trump is going to burn out, go away or fizzle. He may not win the nomination, but it's not because he won't be trying. To win the R - nomination, he has to become more focused in his messaging, more message discipline. He can't ramble extemporaneously like he sometime does while speaking. If you watched Ronald Reagan in 1980, he had very good message discipline, as to what he wanted to talk about, and what his key issues were. The people responded.
By bringing Jeff Sessions on board, he may or may alienate more of the R-Party, but more of the masks will drop. If he goes into the Republican Convention with enough votes/delegates to win the nomination, it will be one of the weirdest conventions ever. In Cleveland, no less.
Jeb is a terrible candidate. What kind of man turns on his own brother? A weasily, cowardly kind of man, that's who. He's where he is in the polls because of name recognition, that's all. His message-fu is weak.
Trump is a great candidate for the Democrats to campaign against, and the Media. They will call him all the names and more that the anti-Trump faction here does. George Will may go third party.
Hillary will burn out; the secret server scandal will torch her. Joe Biden will be the nominee with a promise of "one term". Watch who he picks as his running mate, because that will be the presumptive D- nominee in 2020.
My money is on Corey Booker.
Joe Biden is an idiot and will also energize the Republican base. Watching Biden and Trump flail at each other will be the greatest thing on TV for decades.
I predict a record voting turnout for the 2016 election.
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:13 PM (+1T7c)
231
Trump will not split the GOP.
The GOP already did that for him.
The GOP already did that for him.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 03:15 PM (JgC5a)
232
Where's the gum thread?
Posted by: Toothless Geezer
It lost its flavor on the bedpost overnight.
Posted by: Toothless Geezer
It lost its flavor on the bedpost overnight.
Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at August 16, 2015 03:15 PM (W5DcG)
233
Hold on. I thought Trump's main virtue was his fearlessness in speaking to the issues that concern Americans. This is the obvious place to tell us his plans for this problem, and if he's not willing to, then he's just another politician.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:06 PM (LAe3v)
Trump's main virtue remains how funny all this is. This is clearly exactly what we want to hear.
But he's right; we (or at least, I) don't want comprehensive plans anymore. Deal with border security and sovereignty. The 'those already here' question can be dealt with later.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:06 PM (LAe3v)
Trump's main virtue remains how funny all this is. This is clearly exactly what we want to hear.
But he's right; we (or at least, I) don't want comprehensive plans anymore. Deal with border security and sovereignty. The 'those already here' question can be dealt with later.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 03:16 PM (yTPDN)
234
An OT media frenzy is going on now on NFL Network. Tim Tebow is playing QB for the Eagles. The NFLe is suffering from the vapors.
Posted by: weirdflunkyonatablet at August 16, 2015 03:16 PM (MfLHV)
235
I'm a PUMA
I voted McCain
Had the candidate inspired the GOP base mebbe we woulda had a race
Dont compare McCain to romney turnout
Compare gwbush to McCain turnout
The issue is that with The Donsld, the shat upon former base of both parties has someone to vote for who is saying what they want to hear
They won't need to stay home this time
#JustSayin
I voted McCain
Had the candidate inspired the GOP base mebbe we woulda had a race
Dont compare McCain to romney turnout
Compare gwbush to McCain turnout
The issue is that with The Donsld, the shat upon former base of both parties has someone to vote for who is saying what they want to hear
They won't need to stay home this time
#JustSayin
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 03:17 PM (qxNrP)
236
"Hillary will burn out; the secret server scandal will torch her. "
_______
No it won't. Anyone who cares about the emails was already anti-Hillary to begin with. This is Benghazi Part Deux. It was in the news cycle for 12 hours and you will probably never hear about it again in the MSM.
_______
No it won't. Anyone who cares about the emails was already anti-Hillary to begin with. This is Benghazi Part Deux. It was in the news cycle for 12 hours and you will probably never hear about it again in the MSM.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:18 PM (0LHZx)
237
yes the GOP could use Trump as a coal mine canary, but here is the thing, I will not believe them on immigration. They have already kicked me in the nuts too many times. Now other people's mileage will vary and if the other candidates want to chant build the wall and talk about national (and citizen) security, I am all for moving the overton window way to the right.
PS - I don't believe Trump either.
yes the GOP could use Trump as a coal mine canary, but here is the thing, I will not believe them on immigration. They have already kicked me in the nuts too many times. Now other people's mileage will vary and if the other candidates want to chant build the wall and talk about national (and citizen) security, I am all for moving the overton window way to the right.
PS - I don't believe Trump either.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 03:19 PM (ODxAs)
238
They won't need to stay home this time
#JustSayin
Posted by: ginaswo
Indeed. I predict a record voter turnout for 2016.
Trump is the ''Reagan'' that people were looking for after Jimmy Carter Obama.
#JustSayin
Posted by: ginaswo
Indeed. I predict a record voter turnout for 2016.
Trump is the ''Reagan'' that people were looking for after Jimmy Carter Obama.
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:20 PM (+1T7c)
239
I bet trump wins Pennsylvania.
Posted by: Kreplach at August 16, 2015 03:21 PM (WVvzl)
240
The conversation always goes like this with the GOPe and the left.
Build a wall.
We don't need a wall we can do the same thing with drones and cameras and better technology.
What trump is adding is this:
OK we['ll do the drones and cameras and everything AND WE WILL ALSO BUILD A FUCKING WALL
It's like saying hey maybe we should get a home alarm and the response being, oh you don't need a home alarm, we can just get a better lock on the door. Yeah OK, let's get a better lock AND get an alarm system.
Build a wall.
We don't need a wall we can do the same thing with drones and cameras and better technology.
What trump is adding is this:
OK we['ll do the drones and cameras and everything AND WE WILL ALSO BUILD A FUCKING WALL
It's like saying hey maybe we should get a home alarm and the response being, oh you don't need a home alarm, we can just get a better lock on the door. Yeah OK, let's get a better lock AND get an alarm system.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:21 PM (0LHZx)
241
No it won't. Anyone who cares about the emails was
already anti-Hillary to begin with. This is Benghazi Part Deux. It was
in the news cycle for 12 hours and you will probably never hear about it
again in the MSM.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016
you're wrong, but frankly, only time will prove that.
A criminal indictment is coming, and she will crash and burn by December.
already anti-Hillary to begin with. This is Benghazi Part Deux. It was
in the news cycle for 12 hours and you will probably never hear about it
again in the MSM.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016
you're wrong, but frankly, only time will prove that.
A criminal indictment is coming, and she will crash and burn by December.
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:22 PM (+1T7c)
242
>>"Hillary will burn out; the secret server scandal will torch her. "
Yeah, not sure the current got. has the will to prosecute and throw her in jail, however....she's polling really poorly over this (which is the Clinton holy grail).
I think the drip, drip, drip of new info is devastating, especially when each ne revelations demonstrates an earlier lie. According to ABC's This Week today, Platte River told the FBI that t is "highly likely that a backup of the server was made."
I have little hope, but weirder things could happen, especially if this continuous flow of bad info is being orchestrated by Obama/Jarrett in order to get their guy/gal in as her replacement candidate.
Yeah, not sure the current got. has the will to prosecute and throw her in jail, however....she's polling really poorly over this (which is the Clinton holy grail).
I think the drip, drip, drip of new info is devastating, especially when each ne revelations demonstrates an earlier lie. According to ABC's This Week today, Platte River told the FBI that t is "highly likely that a backup of the server was made."
I have little hope, but weirder things could happen, especially if this continuous flow of bad info is being orchestrated by Obama/Jarrett in order to get their guy/gal in as her replacement candidate.
Posted by: Lizzy at August 16, 2015 03:23 PM (NOIQH)
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:23 PM (+1T7c)
244
you're wrong, but frankly, only time will prove that.
A criminal indictment is coming, and she will crash and burn by December.
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:22 PM (+1T7c)
__________
She may crash and burn. but if she does it will have nothing to do with the emails. Those are ancient memory and there is no way in hell she's getting indicted. Some low level staffer from the Cincinnati office will pay a $1000 fine and that will be that.
A criminal indictment is coming, and she will crash and burn by December.
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:22 PM (+1T7c)
__________
She may crash and burn. but if she does it will have nothing to do with the emails. Those are ancient memory and there is no way in hell she's getting indicted. Some low level staffer from the Cincinnati office will pay a $1000 fine and that will be that.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:24 PM (0LHZx)
245
The gope wants to discredit commonsense ideas like securing the border and tossing out illegals and the hope associating those ideas with Trump helps that happen.
The problem is the whole plan may backfire.
If that is their plan.
The problem is the whole plan may backfire.
If that is their plan.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:24 PM (MQEz6)
246
Name something you don't agree with.
How about the stupid suggestion that Mexico pay for the wall.
How about the stupid suggestion of building a 1989 mile wall. Think about this, Russia, and all it's resources could not stop people from coming over the Berlin Wall.
It was 69 miles long. Patrolling a 2,000 mile wall? Right, no problem
How about the stupid suggestion that Mexico pay for the wall.
How about the stupid suggestion of building a 1989 mile wall. Think about this, Russia, and all it's resources could not stop people from coming over the Berlin Wall.
It was 69 miles long. Patrolling a 2,000 mile wall? Right, no problem
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:24 PM (0FSuD)
247
I do agree with the rest of his immigration policy. The wall is the stupid.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:25 PM (0FSuD)
248
It was 69 miles long. Patrolling a 2,000 mile wall? Right, no problem
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:24 PM (0FSuD)
Nailed it. A wall is stupid beyond belief.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:24 PM (0FSuD)
Nailed it. A wall is stupid beyond belief.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 03:26 PM (hRytD)
249
Do you really think the typical Democrat voter
a) knows about the emails
b) cares?
They care about who will give them the most free shit and who will aid them the most in advancing the SJW agenda. It's the same with Obama. How many times did people say "oh man after he does this, he's finished"? Remember how Blagojevich scandal was going to taint his presidency? Remember how his pastor was going to be the end of his candidacy? Remember how the revelation that his dad was a communist was suppose to mean he was un-electable? It didn't matter. And it won't matter with Hillary.
a) knows about the emails
b) cares?
They care about who will give them the most free shit and who will aid them the most in advancing the SJW agenda. It's the same with Obama. How many times did people say "oh man after he does this, he's finished"? Remember how Blagojevich scandal was going to taint his presidency? Remember how his pastor was going to be the end of his candidacy? Remember how the revelation that his dad was a communist was suppose to mean he was un-electable? It didn't matter. And it won't matter with Hillary.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:27 PM (0LHZx)
250
current who cares doesn't matter too early fox poll but I will mention anyway:
trump currently gets beat by clinton. rubio and jeb beat her.
current who cares doesn't matter too early fox poll but I will mention anyway:
trump currently gets beat by clinton. rubio and jeb beat her.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 03:28 PM (ODxAs)
251
How about the stupid suggestion of building a 1989 mile wall. Think about this, Russia, and all it's resources could not stop people from coming over the Berlin Wall.
It was 69 miles long. Patrolling a 2,000 mile wall? Right, no problem
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:24 PM (0FSuD)
_____________
Well it only worked for 38 years. But yeah, walls never work.
It was 69 miles long. Patrolling a 2,000 mile wall? Right, no problem
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:24 PM (0FSuD)
_____________
Well it only worked for 38 years. But yeah, walls never work.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:28 PM (0LHZx)
252
So because the wall won't keep 100% of the people out, we shouldn't build it. OK, so from now on unless a solution solves 100% of the problem it should not be implemented.
Got it.
Got it.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:30 PM (0LHZx)
253
How about the stupid suggestion of building a 1989 mile wall. Think about this, Russia, and all it's resources could not stop people from coming over the Berlin Wall.
Oh yeah, there were ones, nay tens of people making the crossing.
Oh yeah, there were ones, nay tens of people making the crossing.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 03:30 PM (yTPDN)
254
I might also mention that part any wall will be on "Wilderness" land. NO VEHICLES ALLOWED.
How does he plan to patrol that area, you can not even camp in the area.
Most of the border is on private property, who's going to pay for the right to access that land? YOU?
How does he plan to patrol that area, you can not even camp in the area.
Most of the border is on private property, who's going to pay for the right to access that land? YOU?
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:30 PM (0FSuD)
255
CNN, CNN, CNN: Even an airplane crash can't take Trump of the CNN lead story...I guess whatever get the most clicks...
Posted by: Colin at August 16, 2015 03:31 PM (vIeIs)
256
How about the stupid suggestion of building a 1989 mile wall. Think
about this, Russia, and all it's resources could not stop people from
coming over the Berlin Wall.
You do realize that the number of people crossing from east to west after the Berlin wall was built dropped dramatically, right?
As in, estimated 3.5 million from 1950 or so until the wall was built in 1961, and then an estimated half million from 1961 until about 1988.
'Course, we can always avoid the need for that long wall by invading Mexico, and building the wall on its southern border.
about this, Russia, and all it's resources could not stop people from
coming over the Berlin Wall.
You do realize that the number of people crossing from east to west after the Berlin wall was built dropped dramatically, right?
As in, estimated 3.5 million from 1950 or so until the wall was built in 1961, and then an estimated half million from 1961 until about 1988.
'Course, we can always avoid the need for that long wall by invading Mexico, and building the wall on its southern border.
Posted by: Blanco Basura at August 16, 2015 03:31 PM (bZQB+)
257
229
222 Pep, if they don't get welfare bennies; if they can't get hired; if
they're not covered under Obamacare et al.; at that point who really
cares if they stay or go? Other than clogging up the freeways, no harm
no foul.
And obviously with nothing to keep them here they'd return to the Motherland anyway.
Posted by: Kate58
I care, because crime, and the rule of law, for starters.
Regardless, why didn't Trump include deportation in his position paper? If it's because he's worried about his electoral viability, how is he different than the others, i.e. trustworthy?
222 Pep, if they don't get welfare bennies; if they can't get hired; if
they're not covered under Obamacare et al.; at that point who really
cares if they stay or go? Other than clogging up the freeways, no harm
no foul.
And obviously with nothing to keep them here they'd return to the Motherland anyway.
Posted by: Kate58
I care, because crime, and the rule of law, for starters.
Regardless, why didn't Trump include deportation in his position paper? If it's because he's worried about his electoral viability, how is he different than the others, i.e. trustworthy?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:32 PM (LAe3v)
258
Nailed it. A wall is stupid beyond belief.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 03:26 PM (hRytD)
I liked the suggestion (and it may have been Trump, but I don't remember) of building more military 'training' bases along the border.
Bases with 1000 yard target ranges sound nice ...
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 03:26 PM (hRytD)
I liked the suggestion (and it may have been Trump, but I don't remember) of building more military 'training' bases along the border.
Bases with 1000 yard target ranges sound nice ...
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 03:32 PM (M+9nV)
259
Trump in his words and approach to problem-solving is a totally typical American achiever and executive. It is testimony to how business-illiterate and lost in their progressive delusions and illusions of how the world should work that journalists and the intelligentsia are so scandalized by him (and republicans so scared). Contrariwise, it is why average Americans trying to make their business works and watching in dismay and horror at the viciously misguided political class are so attracted to him.
Posted by: rrpjr at August 16, 2015 03:33 PM (s/yC1)
260
Is the Wall of China available?
Posted by: Colin at August 16, 2015 03:33 PM (vIeIs)
Posted by: Israel at August 16, 2015 03:33 PM (LAe3v)
262
Most of the border is on private property, who's going to pay for the right to access that land? YOU?
Posted by: Nip Sip
Happily.
Posted by: Nip Sip
Happily.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:35 PM (LAe3v)
263
Well it only worked for 38 years. But yeah, walls never work.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:28 PM (0LHZx)
Perhaps you should consider the difference between a wall in an urban area, very easy to watch and a wall which 90% will be in a rural area. You going to station guard posts every quarter of a mile for 2,000 miles? That's 8,000 border posts. Do the numbers on staffing them
That and the fact a Mexican wall would be 28 times longer than the Berlin wall was.
The wall is THE STUPID.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:28 PM (0LHZx)
Perhaps you should consider the difference between a wall in an urban area, very easy to watch and a wall which 90% will be in a rural area. You going to station guard posts every quarter of a mile for 2,000 miles? That's 8,000 border posts. Do the numbers on staffing them
That and the fact a Mexican wall would be 28 times longer than the Berlin wall was.
The wall is THE STUPID.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:35 PM (0FSuD)
264
Within 2 hours Trump gets 250 comments on a guest post on a conservative blog on a Sunday afternoon.
Every thread for two weeks has involved a Trump or Trump related discussion.
Yeah nothing to see here , move along .
Every thread for two weeks has involved a Trump or Trump related discussion.
Yeah nothing to see here , move along .
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:37 PM (HJqXj)
265
Trump is a populist bafoon. You dolts should vote for me! I will show you acts of love you never dreamered of.
Posted by: Jeb Bush at August 16, 2015 03:37 PM (Cq/Q3)
266
That and the fact a Mexican wall would be 28 times longer than the Berlin wall was.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:35 PM (0FSuD)
Okay. To paraphrase John F. Kennedy: "start today."
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:35 PM (0FSuD)
Okay. To paraphrase John F. Kennedy: "start today."
Posted by: rrpjr at August 16, 2015 03:37 PM (s/yC1)
267
Most of the border is on private property, who's going to pay for the right to access that land? YOU?
Posted by: Nip Sip
Somebody may have to put their money where their mouth is. What's your buddy Senator Thom think?
Posted by: Nip Sip
Somebody may have to put their money where their mouth is. What's your buddy Senator Thom think?
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:38 PM (+1T7c)
268
Building a wall is not about the wall in and of itself, it's the message that is sent that we are starting to get serious about our sovreignty.
The long term answer to illegal immigration is to make it impossible to operate in this country if your illegal.
And I particularly like the fact that Trump is alone in calling out Mexico directly.
It's as if millions upon millions of Spanish speaking peasants are beaming in from another dimesnion.
The long term answer to illegal immigration is to make it impossible to operate in this country if your illegal.
And I particularly like the fact that Trump is alone in calling out Mexico directly.
It's as if millions upon millions of Spanish speaking peasants are beaming in from another dimesnion.
Posted by: Kreplach at August 16, 2015 03:38 PM (WVvzl)
269
Let's see if the IRS stops going after tax cheats unless they can catch *all* of them.
No, they catch a few, publicize the hell out of those cases and the rest of us fall in to line.
No, they catch a few, publicize the hell out of those cases and the rest of us fall in to line.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 03:38 PM (JgC5a)
270
Watching Biden and Trump flail at each other will be the greatest thing on TV for decades.
Or, as I put it in my Townhall article last week, putting the Trump/ Biden debates on pay per view would earn enough money to retire the national debt.
Or, as I put it in my Townhall article last week, putting the Trump/ Biden debates on pay per view would earn enough money to retire the national debt.
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 03:39 PM (WvS3w)
271
You going to station guard posts every quarter of a mile for 2,000 miles? That's 8,000 border posts. Do the numbers on staffing them
No, every mile or so should do it, with rapid response forces to go deal with the truly persistent who make it across. That's 2,000, or probably about 8,000 to keep it fully staffed. How many BP agents are there now?
Perhaps you should consider the difference between a wall in an urban
area, very easy to watch and a wall which 90% will be in a rural area.
Perhaps you should. Which is more difficult to watch: a wall in an area surrounded by tall buildings and full of people, or a wall in a broad, flat, desolate prairie, with f***-all else to see? Yeah, that's a tough one.
No, every mile or so should do it, with rapid response forces to go deal with the truly persistent who make it across. That's 2,000, or probably about 8,000 to keep it fully staffed. How many BP agents are there now?
Perhaps you should consider the difference between a wall in an urban
area, very easy to watch and a wall which 90% will be in a rural area.
Perhaps you should. Which is more difficult to watch: a wall in an area surrounded by tall buildings and full of people, or a wall in a broad, flat, desolate prairie, with f***-all else to see? Yeah, that's a tough one.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:39 PM (LAe3v)
272
You don't have to patrol the whole wall. You only need to patrol where the wall is not.
The wall works best with gaps that act as funnels.
The wall works best with gaps that act as funnels.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:39 PM (MQEz6)
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:40 PM (HJqXj)
274
Oh, and about the Israeli fences?
I am all for it, but you think we would put land mines around our border?
Israel does.
I am all for it, but you think we would put land mines around our border?
Israel does.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:40 PM (0FSuD)
275
Most of the border is on private property, who's going to pay for the right to access that land? YOU?
Well, if it were me, I'd mucb rather have border patrol using my land than weird people from foreign countries that might be in criminal gangs.
They behead people on the Mexican side of the border.
Well, if it were me, I'd mucb rather have border patrol using my land than weird people from foreign countries that might be in criminal gangs.
They behead people on the Mexican side of the border.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 03:41 PM (j2FM9)
276
Most of the border is on private property, who's going to pay for the right to access that land? YOU?
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:30 PM (0FSuD)
Eminent Domain.
If Trump did it, the whole thing would, of course, eventually become shopping centers and resorts.
He would then sell the properties as immigration was no longer an issue. For perspective, see his casinos in New Jersey.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:30 PM (0FSuD)
Eminent Domain.
If Trump did it, the whole thing would, of course, eventually become shopping centers and resorts.
He would then sell the properties as immigration was no longer an issue. For perspective, see his casinos in New Jersey.
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 03:41 PM (M+9nV)
277
Finally got to read Trump's Immigration Plan as linked on Drudge..."Trump Will Build A Wall, Deport Them..."
Jebus, it's like I can't like the guy any more than I do and then I do.
Anchor babies...deport....keep families together...H1b jobs...over staying visas...black teen unemployment....haha....firing on all cylinders...love it...love it.... Go Trump!
Jebus, it's like I can't like the guy any more than I do and then I do.
Anchor babies...deport....keep families together...H1b jobs...over staying visas...black teen unemployment....haha....firing on all cylinders...love it...love it.... Go Trump!
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 03:41 PM (xupNw)
278
I am all for it, but you think we would put land mines around our border?
Israel does.
Posted by: Nip Sip
Dunno. Try the wall first, and if it isn't enough, put in whatever other measures are needed. Or we could, you know, say it might not work perfectly right off the bat, so let's not even try.
Israel does.
Posted by: Nip Sip
Dunno. Try the wall first, and if it isn't enough, put in whatever other measures are needed. Or we could, you know, say it might not work perfectly right off the bat, so let's not even try.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:42 PM (LAe3v)
279
A wall is a great idea.
It is not supposed to be 100% effective. Its job is to bring the flow down to a trickle.
To jump up and Stupid! is well, stupid.
It is not supposed to be 100% effective. Its job is to bring the flow down to a trickle.
To jump up and Stupid! is well, stupid.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:42 PM (MQEz6)
280
272
You don't have to patrol the whole wall. You only need to patrol where the wall is not.
The wall works best with gaps that act as funnels.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:39 PM (MQEz6)
I am reminded of a saying by Lincoln.
A man changed against his will is of the same opinion still.
What next, fake signs that say this way to the USA?
You don't have to patrol the whole wall. You only need to patrol where the wall is not.
The wall works best with gaps that act as funnels.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:39 PM (MQEz6)
I am reminded of a saying by Lincoln.
A man changed against his will is of the same opinion still.
What next, fake signs that say this way to the USA?
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:42 PM (0FSuD)
281
Maybe the country is too big, and needs to be broken into smaller chunks which can insure their sovereignty.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 03:42 PM (j2FM9)
282
Trump is doing the Republican Party the invaluable service of showing them what to focus on, and they are too inbread to see it
The GOP is just loafing.
The GOP is just loafing.
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:43 PM (HJqXj)
283
I'm fairly up on politics, but have to admit I missed the takeover of the GOP by the CoC. Even as a teenager/young adult, I knew the distinction between country club conservatives and social conservatives. There seemed to be a sort of agreement that the social conservatives would at least be heard in the party. They dominated much of the platform committee, for example. And the GOP never held supermajorities to actually challenge the Dems' programs, so there was frustration but not outright revolt in the GOP when those programs continued unabated.
But the situation seems to have changed. At some point, the balance swung to the CoC, to the point that many have quit the party (or are considering it) out of anger from being marginalized and lied too.
Does anybody know the "signal moment" of that transition? Was it Boehner and McConnell being elected to their leadership positions? Something made that happen, so did the swing happen before then? Was it one person dumping so much money into the GOP that he just took over? Very interested in the Horde's collective wisdom.
But the situation seems to have changed. At some point, the balance swung to the CoC, to the point that many have quit the party (or are considering it) out of anger from being marginalized and lied too.
Does anybody know the "signal moment" of that transition? Was it Boehner and McConnell being elected to their leadership positions? Something made that happen, so did the swing happen before then? Was it one person dumping so much money into the GOP that he just took over? Very interested in the Horde's collective wisdom.
Posted by: Agent J at August 16, 2015 03:43 PM (ueOgE)
284
James Bond is dead?
Posted by: antisocial justice beatnik at August 16, 2015 03:43 PM (EHU9F)
285
Patrolling the border fence.
Americans doing the job that Mexicans won't.
Well, there goes that next vacation in Cancun. They will be SO mad at us.
Oh well.
Good thing that Reagan didn't get elected because he called the Soviet Union an 'evil empire'.
Wait, wut?
Americans doing the job that Mexicans won't.
Well, there goes that next vacation in Cancun. They will be SO mad at us.
Oh well.
Good thing that Reagan didn't get elected because he called the Soviet Union an 'evil empire'.
Wait, wut?
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:43 PM (+1T7c)
286
Trump is the ''Reagan'' that people were looking for after Jimmy Carter Obama.
How low we have fallen.
How low we have fallen.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 03:44 PM (rwI+c)
287
Why do I need guard posts every quarter mile. Every mile would be effective.
These posts would have border patrol agents who would, uhm, patrol the wall. Put 100 border agents at every post. That's 200,000 people.
Excluding the military about 3M people work for the federal govt. Is it so outrageous that 6.5% of those employees are there to defend the border?
These posts would have border patrol agents who would, uhm, patrol the wall. Put 100 border agents at every post. That's 200,000 people.
Excluding the military about 3M people work for the federal govt. Is it so outrageous that 6.5% of those employees are there to defend the border?
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:44 PM (0LHZx)
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:44 PM (MQEz6)
289
Eminent Domain.
If Trump did it, the whole thing would, of course, eventually become shopping centers and resorts.
He would then sell the properties as immigration was no longer an issue. For perspective, see his casinos in New Jersey.
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 03:41 PM (M+9nV)
That's not the point. Takings have to be PAID for. You going to pay for access to 1500 miles of private border land?
OK? You going to stop the lawsuits when you try to build a wall in a "Wilderness" area?
The wall is NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. It is a straw man, move on.
Eminent Domain.
If Trump did it, the whole thing would, of course, eventually become shopping centers and resorts.
He would then sell the properties as immigration was no longer an issue. For perspective, see his casinos in New Jersey.
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 03:41 PM (M+9nV)
That's not the point. Takings have to be PAID for. You going to pay for access to 1500 miles of private border land?
OK? You going to stop the lawsuits when you try to build a wall in a "Wilderness" area?
The wall is NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. It is a straw man, move on.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:45 PM (0FSuD)
290
From Trump's Plan ..."We graduate two times more Americans with STEM degrees each year than find STEM jobs, yet as much as two-thirds of entry-level hiring for IT jobs is accomplished through the H-1B program. More than half of H-1B visas are issued for the program's lowest allowable wage level, and more than eighty percent for its bottom two."
Suck it Cruz and your wanting to increase H-1B visas.
Suck it Cruz and your wanting to increase H-1B visas.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 03:45 PM (xupNw)
291
I think this Trump thing has legs and has wide cross over appeal especially to Blacks who have been taking it in the shorts as a result of this invasion.
I'm telling you, now that he has Sessions on board if he could get Brat on board he will go a long way to demonstrating that he is capable of leveling up.
This is going to get interesting.
I'm telling you, now that he has Sessions on board if he could get Brat on board he will go a long way to demonstrating that he is capable of leveling up.
This is going to get interesting.
Posted by: Kreplach at August 16, 2015 03:45 PM (WVvzl)
292
g'afternoon, again, 'rons
Posted by: AltonJackson at August 16, 2015 03:45 PM (4gN5w)
293
Or, as I put it in my Townhall article last week, putting the Trump/ Biden debates on pay per view would earn enough money to retire the national debt.
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 03:39 PM (WvS3w)
---
Cage match.
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 03:39 PM (WvS3w)
---
Cage match.
Posted by: All Hail Eris, Literate Savage at August 16, 2015 03:46 PM (jR7Wy)
294
137
If The Teflon Don runs third party my guess is he picks up the disenfranchised former Dem base and the disenfranchised former GOP base (replaced by COC donors post '10)
IMO that's why the political handlers are shxtting themselves
Both sides have a 'Trump problem'
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 02:26 PM (qxNrP)
That's basically what I said in the book thread. This isn't 1992. Not nearly as many people were sick and tired of both parties as there are now. And Trump has much better name recognition than Perot did. That matters if you want to pick up votes from LIVs.
If The Teflon Don runs third party my guess is he picks up the disenfranchised former Dem base and the disenfranchised former GOP base (replaced by COC donors post '10)
IMO that's why the political handlers are shxtting themselves
Both sides have a 'Trump problem'
Posted by: ginaswo at August 16, 2015 02:26 PM (qxNrP)
That's basically what I said in the book thread. This isn't 1992. Not nearly as many people were sick and tired of both parties as there are now. And Trump has much better name recognition than Perot did. That matters if you want to pick up votes from LIVs.
Posted by: rickl at August 16, 2015 03:46 PM (sdi6R)
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:46 PM (HJqXj)
296
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:42 PM (0FSuD)
I suspect you do not want this issue fixed.
Your remarks are emotional reflexes.
I suspect you do not want this issue fixed.
Your remarks are emotional reflexes.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:47 PM (MQEz6)
297
A border fence isn't supposed to actually stop people. It's there so you don't accidentally cross over into the minefield.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 03:47 PM (rwI+c)
298
Haha. This immigration plan is just one bitch slap after another. Taking no prisoners. Love it.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 03:48 PM (xupNw)
299
It's not like this kind of thing hasn't happened recently (and frequently):
Goldwater put Johson in the WH
Wallace kept Humphrey out of the Wh
Perot kept '41 out of the WH twice
Nadir kept Gore out of the WH
3rd party candidates don't get elected, but they can sure influence elections.
(I know, Goldwater wasn't a third party candidate, but check the states he won versus Wallace.)
Goldwater put Johson in the WH
Wallace kept Humphrey out of the Wh
Perot kept '41 out of the WH twice
Nadir kept Gore out of the WH
3rd party candidates don't get elected, but they can sure influence elections.
(I know, Goldwater wasn't a third party candidate, but check the states he won versus Wallace.)
Posted by: bergerbilder at August 16, 2015 03:48 PM (+jijM)
300
That's basically what I said in the book thread. This isn't 1992. Not nearly as many people were sick and tired of both parties as there are now.
The 90s were the definition of the 'kick the can' decade.
Every problem we have now was smaller back then.
The 90s were the definition of the 'kick the can' decade.
Every problem we have now was smaller back then.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 03:49 PM (j2FM9)
301
I suspect you do not want this issue fixed.
Your remarks are emotional reflexes.
Posted by: chad
Don't mind Nip.
A rich guy with a hairpiece ran off with his girlfriend.
I suspect you do not want this issue fixed.
Your remarks are emotional reflexes.
Posted by: chad
Don't mind Nip.
A rich guy with a hairpiece ran off with his girlfriend.
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:49 PM (HJqXj)
302
@274 Nip Sip
"I am all for it, but you think we would put land mines around our border?"
If need be. High density mix minefield with a dead zone 2-3 miles deep (call it reprerations from Mexico for taking care of their citizens) and specific entry corridors into the US. Military support with drones could watch effectively enough.
This isn't rocket science, but there is no poltical will to do anything at this time. If ever.
"I am all for it, but you think we would put land mines around our border?"
If need be. High density mix minefield with a dead zone 2-3 miles deep (call it reprerations from Mexico for taking care of their citizens) and specific entry corridors into the US. Military support with drones could watch effectively enough.
This isn't rocket science, but there is no poltical will to do anything at this time. If ever.
Posted by: Buckeye Abroad at August 16, 2015 03:49 PM (Cq/Q3)
303
Does anybody know the "signal moment" of that
transition? Was it Boehner and McConnell being elected to their
leadership positions? Something made that happen, so did the swing
happen before then? Was it one person dumping so much money into the
GOP that he just took over? Very interested in the Horde's collective
wisdom.
Posted by: Agent J
I think you are right, it was incremental. And I think it is largely based on the sheer size of the Federal Government, and the impact it has on everybody.
Everyone wants a slice of the pie, or to control how it is apportioned.
Boehner was always in on getting PAC money. He got in trouble in the 90's for handing out Tobacco PAC checks on the floor of the House. Yes, he was that stupid.
This is the era of corporatism, Barry Soetoro Obama has signaled that, repeatedly. It will take a lot of strength of character and determination to reverse that.
transition? Was it Boehner and McConnell being elected to their
leadership positions? Something made that happen, so did the swing
happen before then? Was it one person dumping so much money into the
GOP that he just took over? Very interested in the Horde's collective
wisdom.
Posted by: Agent J
I think you are right, it was incremental. And I think it is largely based on the sheer size of the Federal Government, and the impact it has on everybody.
Everyone wants a slice of the pie, or to control how it is apportioned.
Boehner was always in on getting PAC money. He got in trouble in the 90's for handing out Tobacco PAC checks on the floor of the House. Yes, he was that stupid.
This is the era of corporatism, Barry Soetoro Obama has signaled that, repeatedly. It will take a lot of strength of character and determination to reverse that.
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:49 PM (+1T7c)
304
I suspect you do not want this issue fixed.
Your remarks are emotional reflexes.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:47 PM (MQEz6)
The issue will not be fixed with a wall. It will be fixed with stopping birth citizenship and deportation of arrivals.
Word gets out you are going back, why bother coming over.
My remarks are ECONOMIC realities. The wall cost too much and doesn't work. There are cheaper and more efficient ways to solve the problem.
Your remarks are emotional reflexes.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:47 PM (MQEz6)
The issue will not be fixed with a wall. It will be fixed with stopping birth citizenship and deportation of arrivals.
Word gets out you are going back, why bother coming over.
My remarks are ECONOMIC realities. The wall cost too much and doesn't work. There are cheaper and more efficient ways to solve the problem.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:50 PM (0FSuD)
305
Trump money + Cruz' conservatism = ticket.
He ain't going to pick Cruz. A VP has to be a natural born citizen. Cruz isn't one. Born in Canada. No way after all this immigration talk he'll pick someone who can't seem to find the natural born citizen's clause in the Constitution.
Plus, Cruz wants more foreigners here. Gee, wonder why? No thanks.
He ain't going to pick Cruz. A VP has to be a natural born citizen. Cruz isn't one. Born in Canada. No way after all this immigration talk he'll pick someone who can't seem to find the natural born citizen's clause in the Constitution.
Plus, Cruz wants more foreigners here. Gee, wonder why? No thanks.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 03:50 PM (xupNw)
306
297
A border fence isn't supposed to actually stop people. It's there so you don't accidentally cross over into the minefield.
Posted by: Grump928(C)
Point of order: where do you place the 2000 mile shark-filled moat? Before? After? Between?
A border fence isn't supposed to actually stop people. It's there so you don't accidentally cross over into the minefield.
Posted by: Grump928(C)
Point of order: where do you place the 2000 mile shark-filled moat? Before? After? Between?
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:51 PM (HJqXj)
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 03:51 PM (rwI+c)
308
Trump and Sanders are the ultimate barometer for our times...outright socialism and the right's version of Obama. Some wonder why watching it all burn or contemplating regional secession are somehow attractive. Fuck, isn't it obvious that folks have had enough?
Posted by: nosworthy at August 16, 2015 03:52 PM (lhnFV)
309
The 90s were the definition of the 'kick the can' decade.
Every problem we have now was smaller back then.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk
As the late George Will called that decade (under Clinton), "our holiday from history"
Every problem we have now was smaller back then.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk
As the late George Will called that decade (under Clinton), "our holiday from history"
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:53 PM (+1T7c)
310
Not the idiocy about Cruz and Canada again.
Posted by: HUCK / AKIN 2016 at August 16, 2015 03:53 PM (0LHZx)
311
Goldwater put Johson in the WH
Lee Harvey Oswald not only put LBJ in the White House, he made sure that he'd be re-elected. No Republican was going to win in 1964 after Dallas.
IMO Goldwater might have had a pretty good shot running against the actual JFK, not his mythos.
Lee Harvey Oswald not only put LBJ in the White House, he made sure that he'd be re-elected. No Republican was going to win in 1964 after Dallas.
IMO Goldwater might have had a pretty good shot running against the actual JFK, not his mythos.
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 03:54 PM (WvS3w)
312
304 I suspect you do not want this issue fixed.
Your remarks are emotional reflexes.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:47 PM (MQEz6)
The issue will not be fixed with a wall. It will be fixed with stopping birth citizenship and deportation of arrivals.
Word gets out you are going back, why bother coming over.
My remarks are ECONOMIC realities. The wall cost too much and doesn't work. There are cheaper and more efficient ways to solve the problem.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:50 PM (0FSuD)
So, send them back as soon as they get here? Cool.
You know if you build the wall, you can reduce the entry rate and that will automatically reduce the return rate.
A wal is cheap if you compare it to the real cost of this invasion.
Again, your logic is crippled by something.
Your remarks are emotional reflexes.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:47 PM (MQEz6)
The issue will not be fixed with a wall. It will be fixed with stopping birth citizenship and deportation of arrivals.
Word gets out you are going back, why bother coming over.
My remarks are ECONOMIC realities. The wall cost too much and doesn't work. There are cheaper and more efficient ways to solve the problem.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:50 PM (0FSuD)
So, send them back as soon as they get here? Cool.
You know if you build the wall, you can reduce the entry rate and that will automatically reduce the return rate.
A wal is cheap if you compare it to the real cost of this invasion.
Again, your logic is crippled by something.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:54 PM (MQEz6)
313
The wall cost too much and doesn't work. There are cheaper and more efficient ways to solve the problem.
I doubt it, but let's assume you're right. People want a wall not just because it will be effective, they want it because it isn't something subject to political whim. It's a big, solid object that must be gotten past in order enter the country illegally, no matter who holds the WH. If you're willing to expend the money to build it, they know you're serious. It's a marker that you aren't just another lying pol.
I doubt it, but let's assume you're right. People want a wall not just because it will be effective, they want it because it isn't something subject to political whim. It's a big, solid object that must be gotten past in order enter the country illegally, no matter who holds the WH. If you're willing to expend the money to build it, they know you're serious. It's a marker that you aren't just another lying pol.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:54 PM (LAe3v)
314
He ain't going to pick Cruz.
Right .
The secret meeting in New York between Trump and Cruz was about their mutual plan to open a chain of tropical yogurt places called 'Frozen Crumpeez'.
Right .
The secret meeting in New York between Trump and Cruz was about their mutual plan to open a chain of tropical yogurt places called 'Frozen Crumpeez'.
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:55 PM (HJqXj)
315
And as he progresses, he's showing some real political savvy.
Meetings with other like minded candidates; Ted Cruz
Conferring with proven trusted voices for ideas on policy: Jeff Sessions.
Taking shots at Hillary. At everyone really.
Maureen Dowd actually had a column that I read all the way through (a first) and she actually sounded sane and rational!!1!!!!!
I think it's on Hot Air and that link goes to the column but what's also on that page is a listing of comments Trump made about specific people and incidents. Very revealing as to his perceptions and spot on in so many cases.
Folks he may have voted and given money to Democrats but he talks the talk and some of this stuff, I don't believe he could manage to say so easily and glibly if he was faking it as a Trojan Horse.
He's now doing very well in Iowa and building a respectable organization to get people to vote for him.
He's doing the work and he's consulting with others who's expertise is better than his and who he agrees with.
He's actually looking like a candidate and not a gadfly.
Meetings with other like minded candidates; Ted Cruz
Conferring with proven trusted voices for ideas on policy: Jeff Sessions.
Taking shots at Hillary. At everyone really.
Maureen Dowd actually had a column that I read all the way through (a first) and she actually sounded sane and rational!!1!!!!!
I think it's on Hot Air and that link goes to the column but what's also on that page is a listing of comments Trump made about specific people and incidents. Very revealing as to his perceptions and spot on in so many cases.
Folks he may have voted and given money to Democrats but he talks the talk and some of this stuff, I don't believe he could manage to say so easily and glibly if he was faking it as a Trojan Horse.
He's now doing very well in Iowa and building a respectable organization to get people to vote for him.
He's doing the work and he's consulting with others who's expertise is better than his and who he agrees with.
He's actually looking like a candidate and not a gadfly.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 16, 2015 03:55 PM (x3GpS)
316
That and the fact a Mexican wall would be 28 times longer than the Berlin wall was.
The problem you're running up against is this: the Berlin Wall worked.
The problem you're running up against is this: the Berlin Wall worked.
Posted by: t-bird at August 16, 2015 03:55 PM (FcR7P)
317
Watched a little bit of the Eagles game today, Tebow does have a much better throwing motion, ran for his life behind the 3rd line on the depth chart. Not sure if he'll make the team or not.
Watched a little bit of the Eagles game today, Tebow does have a much better throwing motion, ran for his life behind the 3rd line on the depth chart. Not sure if he'll make the team or not.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 03:55 PM (ODxAs)
318
"I think this Trump thing has legs and has wide cross over appeal especially to Blacks who have been taking it in the shorts as a result of this invasion."
Yeah, he does. My apolitical sister who never votes said to me out of the blue, "I could vote for Trump." First time we have ever agreed on a candidate.
Yeah, he does. My apolitical sister who never votes said to me out of the blue, "I could vote for Trump." First time we have ever agreed on a candidate.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 03:55 PM (xupNw)
319
He ain't going to pick Cruz. A VP has to be a natural born citizen. Cruz isn't one.
Oh, shut the fuck up. That lunacy has been debunked a million times. Get over it.
He ain't going to pick Cruz. A VP has to be a natural born citizen. Cruz isn't one.
Oh, shut the fuck up. That lunacy has been debunked a million times. Get over it.
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 03:56 PM (WvS3w)
320
Someone (Monica Crowley, I think) summed our situation up thusly.
We have 2 lost wars, borders that we don't even pretend to enforce, innocent Americans killed by illegals just about every day, mayhem in our inner cities, inflation is "under control" even though everything costs more, healthcare has become needlessly complicated and scarcer, job creation is at a standstill, 92 million Americans out of the work force, and an administration who, in the midst of all this tells us that climate change is the real danger, and a completely supine "opposition party" that is too busy gargling the Presidents gentles to do anything about any of it.
It doesn't take a genius to go on the attack on these issues.
We have 2 lost wars, borders that we don't even pretend to enforce, innocent Americans killed by illegals just about every day, mayhem in our inner cities, inflation is "under control" even though everything costs more, healthcare has become needlessly complicated and scarcer, job creation is at a standstill, 92 million Americans out of the work force, and an administration who, in the midst of all this tells us that climate change is the real danger, and a completely supine "opposition party" that is too busy gargling the Presidents gentles to do anything about any of it.
It doesn't take a genius to go on the attack on these issues.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 03:56 PM (JgC5a)
321
A wal is cheap if you compare it to the real cost of this invasion.
Again, your logic is crippled by something.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:54 PM (MQEz6)
Tell you what Mr Logic. Figure out the cost of building and manning a wall 2,000 miles long and get back with me or YOUR logic.
The stupid is strong.
A wal is cheap if you compare it to the real cost of this invasion.
Again, your logic is crippled by something.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 03:54 PM (MQEz6)
Tell you what Mr Logic. Figure out the cost of building and manning a wall 2,000 miles long and get back with me or YOUR logic.
The stupid is strong.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:57 PM (0FSuD)
322
309 The 90s were the definition of the 'kick the can' decade.
Every problem we have now was smaller back then.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk
As the late George Will called that decade (under Clinton), "our holiday from history"
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:53 PM (+1T7c)
Sales of jeans exploded in that decade. He's never gotten over it.
Every problem we have now was smaller back then.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk
As the late George Will called that decade (under Clinton), "our holiday from history"
Posted by: Bossy Conservative....lost in America at August 16, 2015 03:53 PM (+1T7c)
Sales of jeans exploded in that decade. He's never gotten over it.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 03:57 PM (j2FM9)
323
Finally!
Jon Krakauer's Harsh Truths About Climbing Everest I Wish I'd Never Gone
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqDtltFLCFY
Finally!
Jon Krakauer's Harsh Truths About Climbing Everest I Wish I'd Never Gone
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqDtltFLCFY
Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at August 16, 2015 03:57 PM (iQIUe)
324
Haven't read Trump's position paper - is there anything about Mexican govt. incursions on US border territory? That's another issue that it appears Obama is doing nothing about.
Additional walls, where feasible, could not just reduce immigrants, but cut down on these Mexican military and police tri[s into the US.
Additional walls, where feasible, could not just reduce immigrants, but cut down on these Mexican military and police tri[s into the US.
Posted by: Lizzy at August 16, 2015 03:57 PM (NOIQH)
325
The problem you're running up against is this: the Berlin Wall worked.
Posted by: t-bird at August 16, 2015 03:55 PM (FcR7P)
And it was in a CITY. Our wall will NOT be in a city for about 1800 miles.
Apples=Oranges
Posted by: t-bird at August 16, 2015 03:55 PM (FcR7P)
And it was in a CITY. Our wall will NOT be in a city for about 1800 miles.
Apples=Oranges
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:58 PM (0FSuD)
326
>>As the late George Will called that decade (under Clinton), "our holiday from history"
Thought it was Charles Krauthammer who coined that phrase...
Thought it was Charles Krauthammer who coined that phrase...
Posted by: Lizzy at August 16, 2015 03:59 PM (NOIQH)
327
"The secret meeting in New York between Trump and Cruz was about their mutual plan to open a chain of tropical yogurt places called 'Frozen Crumpeez'."
Fantasy land. Cruz called a meeting. Trump was polite and met him.
He doesn't need Cruz. Cruz is from the red state of Texas. It would be pointless to pick him even if he was a natural born citizen. That would be a stupid strategy.
I doubt he'll even pick a dried up politician for VP. Probably somebody outside the political arena.
Fantasy land. Cruz called a meeting. Trump was polite and met him.
He doesn't need Cruz. Cruz is from the red state of Texas. It would be pointless to pick him even if he was a natural born citizen. That would be a stupid strategy.
I doubt he'll even pick a dried up politician for VP. Probably somebody outside the political arena.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 03:59 PM (xupNw)
328
Tell you what Mr Logic. Figure out the cost of building and manning a wall 2,000 miles long and get back with me or YOUR logic.
Back when a wall was first brought up as a possibility, just after W's abortive attempt at amnesty, the number I recall was about $4b. How much do you suppose we're paying a year for support to illegals?
More importantly, what is maintaining the US as the US worth to you?
Back when a wall was first brought up as a possibility, just after W's abortive attempt at amnesty, the number I recall was about $4b. How much do you suppose we're paying a year for support to illegals?
More importantly, what is maintaining the US as the US worth to you?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:59 PM (LAe3v)
329
Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:50 PM (0FSuD)
Ask Israel how much a wall doesn't work.
Cost? How about we fine those who hire illegal aliens and/or seize their assets and as punishment for being illegal, send them to help build the wall.
I'm sure a non anti-semitic President could persuade Israel to sell us their plans for their wall which seems to be working quite well against some well financed jihadists.
Ask Israel how much a wall doesn't work.
Cost? How about we fine those who hire illegal aliens and/or seize their assets and as punishment for being illegal, send them to help build the wall.
I'm sure a non anti-semitic President could persuade Israel to sell us their plans for their wall which seems to be working quite well against some well financed jihadists.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 16, 2015 03:59 PM (x3GpS)
330
Tell you what Mr Logic. Figure out the cost of building and manning a wall 2,000 miles long and get back with me or YOUR logic.
The police patrol probably an order of magnitude more highway in this country.
The police patrol probably an order of magnitude more highway in this country.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 03:59 PM (j2FM9)
331
Point of order: where do you place the 2000 mile shark-filled moat? Before? After? Between?
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:51 PM (HJqXj)
Exactly.
It's obvious that this is not well thought out. There are details!
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 03:51 PM (HJqXj)
Exactly.
It's obvious that this is not well thought out. There are details!
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 04:00 PM (M+9nV)
332
The F-35 is estimated to cost $1 trillion to deploy.
If we cancelled it and put $700 billion or so into the wall, I bet we'd have a pretty nice one.
If we cancelled it and put $700 billion or so into the wall, I bet we'd have a pretty nice one.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 04:01 PM (j2FM9)
333
I know people that own ranches along the border. They are now subject to nightly incursions by god only knows who.
They would welcome a wall. Any kind of wall. Maybe even just to slow them down a bit, or make them choose an easier place to cross.
They would welcome a wall. Any kind of wall. Maybe even just to slow them down a bit, or make them choose an easier place to cross.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 04:01 PM (JgC5a)
334
And it was in a CITY. Our wall will NOT be in a city for about 1800 miles.
Apples=Oranges
Posted by: Nip Sip
I notice that you never responded to my @271, so I'll repost it for you.
"Which is more difficult to watch: a wall in an area surrounded by tall
buildings and full of people, or a wall in a broad, flat, desolate
prairie, with f***-all else to see? Yeah, that's a tough one."
Apples=Oranges
Posted by: Nip Sip
I notice that you never responded to my @271, so I'll repost it for you.
"Which is more difficult to watch: a wall in an area surrounded by tall
buildings and full of people, or a wall in a broad, flat, desolate
prairie, with f***-all else to see? Yeah, that's a tough one."
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:01 PM (LAe3v)
335
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:57 PM (0FSuD)
Easily.
The cost is less than the cost of doing nothing and way less than doing what the other folks propose.
A wall that saves the USA from this invasion is worth plenty.
Again, you jerk from the stimulus. Tap, your knee jerks.
Easily.
The cost is less than the cost of doing nothing and way less than doing what the other folks propose.
A wall that saves the USA from this invasion is worth plenty.
Again, you jerk from the stimulus. Tap, your knee jerks.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:01 PM (MQEz6)
336
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:57 PM (0FSuD)
This is one of those off days when the world just doesn't grasp your genius, isn't it?
This is one of those off days when the world just doesn't grasp your genius, isn't it?
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 04:03 PM (M+9nV)
337
Why are people so against a wall?
It's like so many that were/are against an anti-missile defense.
They kept/keep saying that it can't work.
But it does NOW.
And we've never tried a real genuine keep 'em out wall before.
Why not give it a try? Surely it's cheaper than putting all these folks kids through school and giving them section 8 rent payments and food stamps. Along with stopping the exodus of jobs overseas, maybe we might even hire some of the 90 million folks who can't find a decent job.
Why not give it try?
It's like so many that were/are against an anti-missile defense.
They kept/keep saying that it can't work.
But it does NOW.
And we've never tried a real genuine keep 'em out wall before.
Why not give it a try? Surely it's cheaper than putting all these folks kids through school and giving them section 8 rent payments and food stamps. Along with stopping the exodus of jobs overseas, maybe we might even hire some of the 90 million folks who can't find a decent job.
Why not give it try?
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 16, 2015 04:03 PM (x3GpS)
338
"Haven't read Trump's position paper - is there anything about Mexican govt. incursions on US border territory?"
Not specifically. But there is section on Mexico. Read the paper. It's linked on Drudge.
He's serious about all aspects of this. He's not going to allow Mexican govt. incursions.
Not specifically. But there is section on Mexico. Read the paper. It's linked on Drudge.
He's serious about all aspects of this. He's not going to allow Mexican govt. incursions.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 04:03 PM (xupNw)
339
Back when a wall was first brought up as a
possibility, just after W's abortive attempt at amnesty, the number I
recall was about $4b. How much do you suppose we're paying a year for
support to illegals?
More importantly, what is maintaining the US as the US worth to you?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:59 PM (LAe3v)
That figure was for building it, not patrolling it.
That would be cheap, IF IT WORKED. The problem is you all assume it will work.
It won't. It would be cheaper to hire more border patrol officers AND enforce the current laws.
possibility, just after W's abortive attempt at amnesty, the number I
recall was about $4b. How much do you suppose we're paying a year for
support to illegals?
More importantly, what is maintaining the US as the US worth to you?
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:59 PM (LAe3v)
That figure was for building it, not patrolling it.
That would be cheap, IF IT WORKED. The problem is you all assume it will work.
It won't. It would be cheaper to hire more border patrol officers AND enforce the current laws.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:04 PM (0FSuD)
340
Haven't read Trump's position paper - is there anything about Mexican
govt. incursions on US border territory? That's another issue that it
appears Obama is doing nothing about.
The American people have NO idea the acts of war committed by Mexico against the U.S. - deploying troops across the U.S. border, shooting Border Patrol agents , assisting smugglers and cartels etc.
While at the same time since 'guns are illegal in Mexico' holding American citizens in PRISON who accidentally cross with a weapon.
During the Clinton administration, a van load of Border Patrol agents accidentally crossed the border (easy to do). The Mexican 'federales' did a felony stop on them and all were held in jail for almost TWO WEEKS . These were on-duty American law enforcement officers. Janet 'PC' Reno didn't do squat and would have left them there to rot if it hadnt been for Duncan Hunter putting pressure on them.
They never did get the pistols or ammo back.
govt. incursions on US border territory? That's another issue that it
appears Obama is doing nothing about.
The American people have NO idea the acts of war committed by Mexico against the U.S. - deploying troops across the U.S. border, shooting Border Patrol agents , assisting smugglers and cartels etc.
While at the same time since 'guns are illegal in Mexico' holding American citizens in PRISON who accidentally cross with a weapon.
During the Clinton administration, a van load of Border Patrol agents accidentally crossed the border (easy to do). The Mexican 'federales' did a felony stop on them and all were held in jail for almost TWO WEEKS . These were on-duty American law enforcement officers. Janet 'PC' Reno didn't do squat and would have left them there to rot if it hadnt been for Duncan Hunter putting pressure on them.
They never did get the pistols or ammo back.
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 04:05 PM (HJqXj)
341
336
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:57 PM (0FSuD)
This is one of those off days when the world just doesn't grasp your genius, isn't it?
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 04:03 PM (M+9nV)
It's a lonely world, but I enjoy the teaching opportunities.
Let's all think MONEY. Economics question, what is the cheapest and most efficient way to stop illegal immigrants.
Discuss
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:57 PM (0FSuD)
This is one of those off days when the world just doesn't grasp your genius, isn't it?
Posted by: jwb7605 at August 16, 2015 04:03 PM (M+9nV)
It's a lonely world, but I enjoy the teaching opportunities.
Let's all think MONEY. Economics question, what is the cheapest and most efficient way to stop illegal immigrants.
Discuss
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:06 PM (0FSuD)
342
That would be cheap, IF IT WORKED. The problem is you all assume it will work.
It won't. It would be cheaper to hire more border patrol officers AND enforce the current laws.
Ah, it won't work because you say so. Got it. By the way, we already tried the "hire more BP officers" thing. It hasn't really worked out that well, and it costs a lot of money, because we have to, you know, pay those people. Also, I don't remember anyone here arguing with the proposition that we should enforce the current laws.
It won't. It would be cheaper to hire more border patrol officers AND enforce the current laws.
Ah, it won't work because you say so. Got it. By the way, we already tried the "hire more BP officers" thing. It hasn't really worked out that well, and it costs a lot of money, because we have to, you know, pay those people. Also, I don't remember anyone here arguing with the proposition that we should enforce the current laws.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:07 PM (LAe3v)
343
Um actually about 750 million was allocated in the 2004 budget to build a wall which they neglected to do.
So money has been allocated for this purpose.
And again it's not about the wall per se, it's about the message sent.
So money has been allocated for this purpose.
And again it's not about the wall per se, it's about the message sent.
Posted by: Kreplach at August 16, 2015 04:07 PM (WVvzl)
344
"The secret meeting in New York between Trump and Cruz was about their mutual plan to open a chain of tropical yogurt places called 'Frozen Crumpeez'."
And it wasn't a secret meeting. Even photos taken. Sheesh. Cruz trying to get in on Trump's action. Nothing more.
Lots of wishful thinking by the Cruz supporters.
And it wasn't a secret meeting. Even photos taken. Sheesh. Cruz trying to get in on Trump's action. Nothing more.
Lots of wishful thinking by the Cruz supporters.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 04:08 PM (xupNw)
345
That would be cheap, IF IT WORKED. The problem is you all assume it will work.
It won't. It would be cheaper to hire more border patrol officers AND enforce the current laws.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:04 PM (0FSuD
Right. Walls don't work. (Rolls eyes)
That would be cheap, IF IT WORKED. The problem is you all assume it will work.
It won't. It would be cheaper to hire more border patrol officers AND enforce the current laws.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:04 PM (0FSuD
Right. Walls don't work. (Rolls eyes)
Posted by: North Korean at August 16, 2015 04:08 PM (OUAcK)
346
You couldn't pay for a poll that in depth and detailed, and Trump's serving it up on a platter. So far the only one doing this is Ted Cruz. As a Cruz guy, I think that's great. I freaking love Donald Trump because Cruz is using him just as I'm advocating in this article.
I love that about Cruz too. He's been very quietly trying to build a coalition of all the conservative branches.
I love that about Cruz too. He's been very quietly trying to build a coalition of all the conservative branches.
Posted by: Iblis at August 16, 2015 04:08 PM (xccyG)
347
And it was in a CITY. Our wall will NOT be in a city for about 1800 miles.
Apples=Oranges
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:58 PM (0FSuD)
Nip Sip: they don't get it. They'll never fucking get it. Could a wall work to lessen the flow? Sure. Go back to guard posts every 1/4 mile, manned with machine guns. Mine fields 100 yards out. Turn the area into a 'free fire' zone. Open season on border crossings.There's at least one key problem with that: the Center of Gravity called 'National Will.' It simply isn't there.And without that, the wall doesn't work. It's something else to spray paint with graffiti and handy to toss a grappling hook onto.The logistics of such an endeavor are staggering.The wall is a pipe dream.
Apples=Oranges
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 03:58 PM (0FSuD)
Nip Sip: they don't get it. They'll never fucking get it. Could a wall work to lessen the flow? Sure. Go back to guard posts every 1/4 mile, manned with machine guns. Mine fields 100 yards out. Turn the area into a 'free fire' zone. Open season on border crossings.There's at least one key problem with that: the Center of Gravity called 'National Will.' It simply isn't there.And without that, the wall doesn't work. It's something else to spray paint with graffiti and handy to toss a grappling hook onto.The logistics of such an endeavor are staggering.The wall is a pipe dream.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:08 PM (hRytD)
348
And it was in a CITY. Our wall will NOT be in a city for about 1800 miles.
Apples=Oranges
Actually, most of it wasn't, but no matter. What made the Wall the Wall? The willingness to shoot to kill. Heck, a piece of yarn will work if it's got that kind of backup.
Apples=Oranges
Actually, most of it wasn't, but no matter. What made the Wall the Wall? The willingness to shoot to kill. Heck, a piece of yarn will work if it's got that kind of backup.
Posted by: t-bird at August 16, 2015 04:08 PM (FcR7P)
349
A wall could work quite easily, and it could be simple and cheap.
2 chain link fences, 100 yards apart.
Every 1/2 mile a guard tower.
In each tower, two Ma Deuces, one pointed left, one pointed right.
Here's the tricky part: Someone with the balls to give the order: "Anyone in the dead zone between the fences will be shot"
QED
2 chain link fences, 100 yards apart.
Every 1/2 mile a guard tower.
In each tower, two Ma Deuces, one pointed left, one pointed right.
Here's the tricky part: Someone with the balls to give the order: "Anyone in the dead zone between the fences will be shot"
QED
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 04:09 PM (WvS3w)
350
The most effective and efficient way to deal with ilegal immigration is employer sanctions.
NO politician will tie that knot in his own feedbag.
NO politician will tie that knot in his own feedbag.
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 04:09 PM (HJqXj)
351
At some point it's smart politics to stop worrying about whether something is efficient or cheap or even effective. If the polity wants something badfly, you better give it to them.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 04:10 PM (rwI+c)
352
Walls don't work. That's why castles were based on deportation.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 16, 2015 04:10 PM (j2FM9)
353
Right. Walls don't work. (Rolls eyes)
Posted by: North Korean at August 16, 2015 04:08 PM (OUAcK)
Apples-Oranges.
Korean wall? 160 miles
Find a wall 2,000 miles long that works and get back with me.
Posted by: North Korean at August 16, 2015 04:08 PM (OUAcK)
Apples-Oranges.
Korean wall? 160 miles
Find a wall 2,000 miles long that works and get back with me.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:11 PM (0FSuD)
354
And here's the kicker about north Korea: when they find out you escaped successfully, they kill your family. And your extended family. Anyone and everyone even remotely related to you. They're simply shot in the back of the head.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:11 PM (hRytD)
355
350
The most effective and efficient way to deal with ilegal immigration is employer sanctions.
NO politician will tie that knot in his own feedbag.
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 04:09 PM (HJqXj)
This is true. Still leaves the cash economy on it's own.
The most effective and efficient way to deal with ilegal immigration is employer sanctions.
NO politician will tie that knot in his own feedbag.
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 04:09 PM (HJqXj)
This is true. Still leaves the cash economy on it's own.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:12 PM (0FSuD)
356
Mines have simple rules of engagement.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 04:12 PM (rwI+c)
357
"Oh, shut the fuck up. That lunacy has been debunked a million times. Get over it."
Born in Canada. Sorry. You get over it. Can't get over the fact that he's not eligible. Hasn't been debunked just a lot of people of the establishment trashing the Constitution.
He should run for Prime Minister of Canada.
See I, as a natural born citizen, would not be eligible but what do you know, Cruz is.
Born in Canada. Sorry. You get over it. Can't get over the fact that he's not eligible. Hasn't been debunked just a lot of people of the establishment trashing the Constitution.
He should run for Prime Minister of Canada.
See I, as a natural born citizen, would not be eligible but what do you know, Cruz is.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 04:12 PM (xupNw)
358
There's at least one key problem with that: the Center of Gravity called
'National Will.' It simply isn't there.And without that, the wall
doesn't work.
Sorry we're too slow to appreciate your genius. Here's a question. If there isn't the national will to build a wall, what makes you think there's enough will to deny them jobs and ship them back, particularly when one of the two major political parties stands to gain immense electoral benefit by letting them in to stay?
The only way to solve the problem is not to let them enter the country in the first place.
'National Will.' It simply isn't there.And without that, the wall
doesn't work.
Sorry we're too slow to appreciate your genius. Here's a question. If there isn't the national will to build a wall, what makes you think there's enough will to deny them jobs and ship them back, particularly when one of the two major political parties stands to gain immense electoral benefit by letting them in to stay?
The only way to solve the problem is not to let them enter the country in the first place.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:12 PM (LAe3v)
359
Let's all think MONEY. Economics question, what is the cheapest and most efficient way to stop illegal immigrants.
Discuss
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:06 PM (0FSuD)
****
You first, Professor. What are our total annual costs supporting illegals in this Country? Remember, total.
Discuss
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:06 PM (0FSuD)
****
You first, Professor. What are our total annual costs supporting illegals in this Country? Remember, total.
Posted by: ManWithNoParty, unperson from Free Market Jesus Paradise at August 16, 2015 04:13 PM (cygkw)
360
Find a wall 2,000 miles long that works and get back with me.<<<<
the great wall of china. worked for a long damn time. what did I win.
the great wall of china. worked for a long damn time. what did I win.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:13 PM (ODxAs)
361
Find a wall 2,000 miles long that works and get back with me.
Posted by: Nip Sip
Is that like the transmutative property of walls, or something. It works for 100 miles, but put a few of those segments together, and whoa, it's worthless.
Posted by: Nip Sip
Is that like the transmutative property of walls, or something. It works for 100 miles, but put a few of those segments together, and whoa, it's worthless.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:15 PM (LAe3v)
362
358
There's at least one key problem with that: the Center of Gravity called
'National Will.' It simply isn't there.And without that, the wall
doesn't work.
Sorry we're too slow to appreciate your
genius. Here's a question. If there isn't the national will to build a
wall, what makes you think there's enough will to deny them jobs and
ship them back, particularly when one of the two major political parties
stands to gain immense electoral benefit by letting them in to stay?
The only way to solve the problem is not to let them enter the country in the first place.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:12 PM (LAe3v)
I never claimed anything of the sort; I've simply pointed out the lunacy of a wall.
There's at least one key problem with that: the Center of Gravity called
'National Will.' It simply isn't there.And without that, the wall
doesn't work.
Sorry we're too slow to appreciate your
genius. Here's a question. If there isn't the national will to build a
wall, what makes you think there's enough will to deny them jobs and
ship them back, particularly when one of the two major political parties
stands to gain immense electoral benefit by letting them in to stay?
The only way to solve the problem is not to let them enter the country in the first place.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:12 PM (LAe3v)
I never claimed anything of the sort; I've simply pointed out the lunacy of a wall.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:15 PM (hRytD)
363
Building a wall is a statement. It says that this is important.
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 04:17 PM (rwI+c)
364
Indo-Bangladeshi wall.
Posted by: Cicero Kaboom! Kid at August 16, 2015 04:17 PM (OUAcK)
365
I never claimed anything of the sort
"Nip Sip: they don't get it. They'll never f***ing get it."
Dude, it's right there in black and white.
"Nip Sip: they don't get it. They'll never f***ing get it."
Dude, it's right there in black and white.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:18 PM (LAe3v)
366
@359
Some up there I think I stated a good start would be immediate deportation when caught and end of birth citizenship.
I am not sure employer sanctions work, they would just drive the workers to a cash economy.
They will stop coming if they know they are going back. Why waste the time.
Making Mexico's economy stronger has slowed their migration, most of it now is from Central America
Some up there I think I stated a good start would be immediate deportation when caught and end of birth citizenship.
I am not sure employer sanctions work, they would just drive the workers to a cash economy.
They will stop coming if they know they are going back. Why waste the time.
Making Mexico's economy stronger has slowed their migration, most of it now is from Central America
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:18 PM (0FSuD)
367
I am at a loss why people don't want fences or walls, I guess it is what is defined as work in the 'won't work'. If it stops 50% of illegal immigration, does it work? I say damn right. Now solve the other 50% by fining employers and cutting off entitlements.
I am at a loss why people don't want fences or walls, I guess it is what is defined as work in the 'won't work'. If it stops 50% of illegal immigration, does it work? I say damn right. Now solve the other 50% by fining employers and cutting off entitlements.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:19 PM (ODxAs)
368
Also, someone should quickly notify the Hungarians that walls don't work. Serbia will be very relieved.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:19 PM (LAe3v)
369
Is that like the transmutative property of walls, or
something. It works for 100 miles, but put a few of those segments
together, and whoa, it's worthless.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:15 PM (LAe3v)
Well, yes it is. Walls can not be protected unless you man them 24/7. The only wall that long that I can think of is the Great Wall of China. It was manned 24/7 and it still did not keep the Moguls from invading.
something. It works for 100 miles, but put a few of those segments
together, and whoa, it's worthless.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:15 PM (LAe3v)
Well, yes it is. Walls can not be protected unless you man them 24/7. The only wall that long that I can think of is the Great Wall of China. It was manned 24/7 and it still did not keep the Moguls from invading.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:20 PM (0FSuD)
370
Concerning these 'other walls' that are being touted as successful examples, the host countries all had something in common - a willingness to kill everyone violating the sanctity of the wall.
Does anyone think this country would do that?
We won't even kill tree frogs, much less people.
Sweet Jesus.
Does anyone think this country would do that?
We won't even kill tree frogs, much less people.
Sweet Jesus.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:20 PM (hRytD)
371
Nip Sip, there comes a point when you're just being silly to avoid having to admit you lost. We've reached that point. I won't participate anymore, because I'm bored, and frankly, you're embarrassing yourself.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:22 PM (LAe3v)
372
I am not sure employer sanctions work, they would just drive the workers to a cash economy.<<<<
I think its more that when the workers get caught working for someone is when the fines come in for the employer. It has to be significant enough to change the risk/reward ratio.
I am not sure employer sanctions work, they would just drive the workers to a cash economy.<<<<
I think its more that when the workers get caught working for someone is when the fines come in for the employer. It has to be significant enough to change the risk/reward ratio.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:22 PM (ODxAs)
373
Nice one, WierdDave. It makes me think of Trump as a trial balloon.
Posted by: m at August 16, 2015 04:24 PM (ELEPX)
374
365
I never claimed anything of the sort
"Nip Sip: they don't get it. They'll never f***ing get it."
Dude, it's right there in black and white.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:18 PM (LAe3v)
Clearly your reading comprehension skills require improvement.
The "Nip Sip: they don't get it. They'll never f***ing get it." refers to 'not getting' why the wall doesn't work. I never addressed the other areas.
I never claimed anything of the sort
"Nip Sip: they don't get it. They'll never f***ing get it."
Dude, it's right there in black and white.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:18 PM (LAe3v)
Clearly your reading comprehension skills require improvement.
The "Nip Sip: they don't get it. They'll never f***ing get it." refers to 'not getting' why the wall doesn't work. I never addressed the other areas.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:24 PM (hRytD)
375
There was only a wall in Berlin and then there was a Razor wire fence across the East/west German border otherwise. So we don't need to build a 2000 mile wall. Out in the open a double fence topped with razor wire and with visibility to see who is approaching is much better and what we would do if we wanted to secure the border. So don't be throwing "we can't build such a long wall" as an excuse. We could build a fence, we could authorize a border patrol to shoot anyone crossing as a suspected terrorist. We could say that if E-verify is not used before handing out welfare the gub'mint official who approved the claim loses their job and any accrued bennies.
We could do a lot of things and while the MFM has been saying we can't because that is too mean -- both the native members of the FSA and blue collar workers who struggle to find work or feel underpaid would be very happy to support any candidate or party that tells the MFM to STFU because they are looking out for Americans first.
We could do a lot of things and while the MFM has been saying we can't because that is too mean -- both the native members of the FSA and blue collar workers who struggle to find work or feel underpaid would be very happy to support any candidate or party that tells the MFM to STFU because they are looking out for Americans first.
Posted by: PaleRider at August 16, 2015 04:24 PM (iA/+T)
376
371
Nip Sip, there comes a point when you're just being silly to avoid
having to admit you lost. We've reached that point. I won't participate
anymore, because I'm bored, and frankly, you're embarrassing yourself.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:22 PM (LAe3v)
You must be kidding me? You think you have made a case for a wall?
You have not answered any of my objections with any clear logic, you simply want a wall.
I want that moon!!
Nip Sip, there comes a point when you're just being silly to avoid
having to admit you lost. We've reached that point. I won't participate
anymore, because I'm bored, and frankly, you're embarrassing yourself.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 04:22 PM (LAe3v)
You must be kidding me? You think you have made a case for a wall?
You have not answered any of my objections with any clear logic, you simply want a wall.
I want that moon!!
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:24 PM (0FSuD)
377
The only wall that long that I can think of is the Great Wall of China. It was manned 24/7 and it still did not keep the Moguls from invading.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:20 PM (0FSuD)
---
Some of that was just plain old bribery, which I'm sure we'd have too. There will always be corrupt officers.
It's still worth enforcing the border, whether with walls, or patrols, or drones, or MechaRaptors.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:20 PM (0FSuD)
---
Some of that was just plain old bribery, which I'm sure we'd have too. There will always be corrupt officers.
It's still worth enforcing the border, whether with walls, or patrols, or drones, or MechaRaptors.
Posted by: All Hail Eris, Literate Savage at August 16, 2015 04:24 PM (jR7Wy)
378
"The wall is NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. It is a straw man, move on."
Oh, I beg to disagree. If Trump is President it will happen.
The strawman is only in your mind. The wall really scares you right?
Oh, I beg to disagree. If Trump is President it will happen.
The strawman is only in your mind. The wall really scares you right?
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 04:25 PM (xupNw)
379
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:18 PM (0FSuD)
The wall is like a vaccine. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.
Your objection to the wall is emotional.
You declare it cannot work and offer alternatives that require at least the same effort of will to acheive.
The wall is like a vaccine. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.
Your objection to the wall is emotional.
You declare it cannot work and offer alternatives that require at least the same effort of will to acheive.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:25 PM (MQEz6)
380
Born in Canada. Sorry. You get over it. Can't get over the fact that
he's not eligible. Hasn't been debunked just a lot of people of the
establishment trashing the Constitution.
He should run for Prime Minister of Canada.
See I, as a natural born citizen, would not be eligible but what do you know, Cruz is.
First of all, Canada doesn't have such a requirement. You would be eligible to be PM. Please leave immediately and run against Harper.
Secondly, the term isn't defined in the Constitution and the SCOTUS hasn't ruled upon the issue. You are but stating your opinion as to what NBC means. What legal precedent does exist says that Cruz is eligible. McCain was eligible even though he was born in Panama, for example.
Look! A black helicopter! RUN, FOR GOD'S SAKE RUN MAN!
he's not eligible. Hasn't been debunked just a lot of people of the
establishment trashing the Constitution.
He should run for Prime Minister of Canada.
See I, as a natural born citizen, would not be eligible but what do you know, Cruz is.
First of all, Canada doesn't have such a requirement. You would be eligible to be PM. Please leave immediately and run against Harper.
Secondly, the term isn't defined in the Constitution and the SCOTUS hasn't ruled upon the issue. You are but stating your opinion as to what NBC means. What legal precedent does exist says that Cruz is eligible. McCain was eligible even though he was born in Panama, for example.
Look! A black helicopter! RUN, FOR GOD'S SAKE RUN MAN!
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 04:26 PM (WvS3w)
381
It's still worth enforcing the border, whether with walls, or patrols, or drones, or MechaRaptors.
Posted by: All Hail Eris, Literate Savage at August 16, 2015 04:24 PM (jR7Wy)
I agree totally, but until we get serious, it will never happen. As someone said earlier, we going to shot to kill people crossing over?
Land Mines?
Never happen.
It's still worth enforcing the border, whether with walls, or patrols, or drones, or MechaRaptors.
Posted by: All Hail Eris, Literate Savage at August 16, 2015 04:24 PM (jR7Wy)
I agree totally, but until we get serious, it will never happen. As someone said earlier, we going to shot to kill people crossing over?
Land Mines?
Never happen.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:26 PM (0FSuD)
382
Guess we got our flame war after all.
Posted by: All Hail Eris, Literate Savage at August 16, 2015 04:26 PM (jR7Wy)
383
Drones would be great.
Gotta be willing to kill people. Once you're willing to kill to protect borders, many different things will work.
Gotta be willing to kill people. Once you're willing to kill to protect borders, many different things will work.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:27 PM (hRytD)
384
If he means it.....his immigration plan he put out today looks pretty damn good. In fact, it looks like it was written by Jeff Sessions. Isn't this what we want? I hope he means it.
Posted by: Duncan MacLeod, the Highlander at August 16, 2015 04:28 PM (COpZ4)
385
Does anyone think this country would do that? <<<<
Its really what the debate over the wall is about.
Make me king and illegal immigrants will be deported to Africa. Unless they are African and then they get deported to Siberia.
of course there are many much easier things to do, to stop or stem the flow but neither party including trump would do them.
Does anyone think this country would do that? <<<<
Its really what the debate over the wall is about.
Make me king and illegal immigrants will be deported to Africa. Unless they are African and then they get deported to Siberia.
of course there are many much easier things to do, to stop or stem the flow but neither party including trump would do them.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:28 PM (ODxAs)
386
Your objection to the wall is emotional.
You declare it cannot work and offer alternatives that require at least the same effort of will to acheive.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:25 PM (MQEz6)
As stated above, they are ECONOMIC. I have no dog in this hunt emotionally, except to marvel at total lack of any cost/benefit analysis of you wall people.
The emotion is on you wall people. You seem to think this is some sort of magical cure.
It not, it's a stupid talking point for the naive.
You declare it cannot work and offer alternatives that require at least the same effort of will to acheive.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:25 PM (MQEz6)
As stated above, they are ECONOMIC. I have no dog in this hunt emotionally, except to marvel at total lack of any cost/benefit analysis of you wall people.
The emotion is on you wall people. You seem to think this is some sort of magical cure.
It not, it's a stupid talking point for the naive.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:29 PM (0FSuD)
387
Point of order: where do you place the 2000 mile shark-filled moat? Before? After? Between?
--
That's a ridiculous idea.
It's mostly desert.
We're gonna use rattlesnakes and scorpions.
Although I still favor landmines with little GPS trackers that can ve remotely enabled / disabled.
--
That's a ridiculous idea.
It's mostly desert.
We're gonna use rattlesnakes and scorpions.
Although I still favor landmines with little GPS trackers that can ve remotely enabled / disabled.
Posted by: @votermom at August 16, 2015 04:29 PM (cbfNE)
388
A wall means thise that want to enter have a much more difficult task in front of them.
Razor wire and mines only affect those who try to get past them.
No one need be shot.
Remember also this is an invasion.
Defense against it is open to our choosing.
Razor wire and mines only affect those who try to get past them.
No one need be shot.
Remember also this is an invasion.
Defense against it is open to our choosing.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:30 PM (MQEz6)
389
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:29 PM (0FSuD)
Let's say the wall costs $1 trillion.
I say go for it.
Let's say the wall costs $1 trillion.
I say go for it.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:32 PM (MQEz6)
390
I think Pep summed up my feeling with this:
People want a wall not just because it will be effective, they want it because it isn't something subject to political whim. It's a big, solid object that must be gotten past in order enter the country illegally, no matter who holds the WH. If you're willing to expend the money to build it, they know you're serious. It's a marker that you aren't just another lying pol.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:54 PM (LAe3v)
People want a wall not just because it will be effective, they want it because it isn't something subject to political whim. It's a big, solid object that must be gotten past in order enter the country illegally, no matter who holds the WH. If you're willing to expend the money to build it, they know you're serious. It's a marker that you aren't just another lying pol.
Posted by: pep at August 16, 2015 03:54 PM (LAe3v)
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 04:32 PM (rwI+c)
391
88
Weird Dave,
Thank you for writing this post. You have put into words what I have
been inarticulately trying to get across myself. The closest I've seen
is that he is the Fuck You!!! candidate. You have explained in layman's
terms, without vulgarity, what that means.
Posted by: lindafell de Spair @ San Jacinto at August 16, 2015 02:08 PM (xVgrA)
_________I like what is happening with Trump in the field. Even the FU part. But as President who will he be saying FU to? Will he still be listening to the people?
Weird Dave,
Thank you for writing this post. You have put into words what I have
been inarticulately trying to get across myself. The closest I've seen
is that he is the Fuck You!!! candidate. You have explained in layman's
terms, without vulgarity, what that means.
Posted by: lindafell de Spair @ San Jacinto at August 16, 2015 02:08 PM (xVgrA)
_________I like what is happening with Trump in the field. Even the FU part. But as President who will he be saying FU to? Will he still be listening to the people?
Posted by: gracepmc at August 16, 2015 04:34 PM (DMQhB)
392
"Razor wire and mines only affect those who try to get past them.
No one need be shot."
Now we're splitting hairs. Killing is killing, be it mines or shooting them with a .50 cal. When the media shows film of women and children blown apart by mines, what happens next? Or blown apart by a .50 cal. Dead is dead. And the shit hits the fan.
No one need be shot."
Now we're splitting hairs. Killing is killing, be it mines or shooting them with a .50 cal. When the media shows film of women and children blown apart by mines, what happens next? Or blown apart by a .50 cal. Dead is dead. And the shit hits the fan.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:35 PM (hRytD)
393
Geez Nip, you think the wall* won't stop one person?
Fine, lets call it a national art project, we waste money on all kinds of crap, lets see what it does.
*my definition of a wall includes fences and/or razor wire, cameras etc.
Geez Nip, you think the wall* won't stop one person?
Fine, lets call it a national art project, we waste money on all kinds of crap, lets see what it does.
*my definition of a wall includes fences and/or razor wire, cameras etc.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:36 PM (ODxAs)
394
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:04 PM (0FSuD)
You keep saying it won't work but have no proof of that.
You can point to other situations but they aren't here and the people involved weren't Americans.
It can work if people want it to work.
Why do you care about it so much? What does it matter to you?
It's also to be used as a final red line.
No Fence, No legalization of anyone here illegally.
You keep saying it won't work but have no proof of that.
You can point to other situations but they aren't here and the people involved weren't Americans.
It can work if people want it to work.
Why do you care about it so much? What does it matter to you?
It's also to be used as a final red line.
No Fence, No legalization of anyone here illegally.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 16, 2015 04:37 PM (x3GpS)
395
OK, you want a statement?
Why not just drive them back across the border immediately?
After a while the effort to cross will be too much.
This is not rocket science, it the will to act that is lacking, not a stupid wall.
Why not just drive them back across the border immediately?
After a while the effort to cross will be too much.
This is not rocket science, it the will to act that is lacking, not a stupid wall.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:37 PM (0FSuD)
396
392 "Razor wire and mines only affect those who try to get past them.
No one need be shot."
Now we're splitting hairs. Killing is killing, be it mines or shooting them with a .50 cal. When the media shows film of women and children blown apart by mines, what happens next? Or blown apart by a .50 cal. Dead is dead. And the shit hits the fan.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:35 PM (hRytD)
You know, signs are pretty cheap.
No one need be shot."
Now we're splitting hairs. Killing is killing, be it mines or shooting them with a .50 cal. When the media shows film of women and children blown apart by mines, what happens next? Or blown apart by a .50 cal. Dead is dead. And the shit hits the fan.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:35 PM (hRytD)
You know, signs are pretty cheap.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:37 PM (MQEz6)
397
Nip Sip,
It's on you brother, I've had enough.
Going outside to smoke a cigar and watch the ducks paddle on the pond.
Hasta luego,
Six out.
It's on you brother, I've had enough.
Going outside to smoke a cigar and watch the ducks paddle on the pond.
Hasta luego,
Six out.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:37 PM (hRytD)
398
Not only build the wall but make into something so monstrously horrific that if you do manage to make it over you honestly deserve to be here and have earned the right.
Posted by: Han Yolo at August 16, 2015 04:39 PM (+1gXS)
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:39 PM (0FSuD)
400
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:37 PM (0FSuD)
Why not do both?
Toss them all out asap and build structures to block their return.
Why are you so fixated against the wall?
Why not do both?
Toss them all out asap and build structures to block their return.
Why are you so fixated against the wall?
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:39 PM (MQEz6)
401
Questions to nip-sip.
We patrol a completely open border now right?
If a wall or layered fence would that not mean that the current enforcement would be two orders of magnitude more effective?
The answers are yes and yes.
I think you envision some 20 foot solid crete wall. It has never been that.
We patrol a completely open border now right?
If a wall or layered fence would that not mean that the current enforcement would be two orders of magnitude more effective?
The answers are yes and yes.
I think you envision some 20 foot solid crete wall. It has never been that.
Posted by: Jukin, Former Republican at August 16, 2015 04:40 PM (f+6Pd)
402
You know, signs are pretty cheap.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:37 PM (MQEz6)
Signs???? Are you fucking kidding me???That's like China killing a thousand people...and our diplomats issue a 'strongly worded statement.' Oooooooooh. Be still my heart! A 'strongly worded statement!' They sure showed us. We'll be better citizens of the world now!A sign.Fuck me to tears.
Nip Sip: I'm really gone now...no more peeking.
A fucking sign.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:37 PM (MQEz6)
Signs???? Are you fucking kidding me???That's like China killing a thousand people...and our diplomats issue a 'strongly worded statement.' Oooooooooh. Be still my heart! A 'strongly worded statement!' They sure showed us. We'll be better citizens of the world now!A sign.Fuck me to tears.
Nip Sip: I'm really gone now...no more peeking.
A fucking sign.
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:41 PM (hRytD)
403
Well to be fair, you wouldn't have to shoot too many people for the rest to know its not worth it.
Well to be fair, you wouldn't have to shoot too many people for the rest to know its not worth it.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:42 PM (ODxAs)
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 16, 2015 04:43 PM (x3GpS)
405
I'm think maybe 6 or 7 taxpayer relief shots should do it.
Hell maybe just aim for their toes. I think the message will get thru.
I'm think maybe 6 or 7 taxpayer relief shots should do it.
Hell maybe just aim for their toes. I think the message will get thru.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:44 PM (ODxAs)
406
Why are you so fixated against the wall?
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:39 PM (MQEz6)
I think I have made that pretty clear. Read my posts.
Too Expensive, won't work. It's called cost/benefit analysis
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 04:39 PM (MQEz6)
I think I have made that pretty clear. Read my posts.
Too Expensive, won't work. It's called cost/benefit analysis
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:46 PM (0FSuD)
407
"First of all, Canada doesn't have such a requirement. You would be eligible to be PM. Please leave immediately and run against Harper."
Well, that's nice to know. With me not being Canadian I didn't know that but I'm sure Canadian Cruz did know that.
"Secondly, the term isn't defined in the Constitution and the SCOTUS hasn't ruled upon the issue. You are but stating your opinion as to what NBC means. What legal precedent does exist says that Cruz is eligible. McCain was eligible even though he was born in Panama, for example."
It's not define because everyone knew what it meant at the time of it's writing. Jus soli & Jus Sanguini.
McCain and Obama are perversions. McCain didn't win so the point is mute. Only Obama and one other president (his name escapes me at the moment but he hide information) has successfully usurper the presidency. Obama even forged a Hawaiian birth certificate so as to be say he was birthed on American soil.
Don't bother trying to argue your stupid position. I've read more articles and citations on the subject in the last 7 years than you've have brain cells.
"Look! A black helicopter! RUN, FOR GOD'S SAKE RUN MAN!"
Screw you. I believe in a Constitutional Republic too bad Cruz and his anti-Constitutionalists don't. I refuse to vote for a non-natural born citizen and I'm not the only one. Don't insult our intelligence.
You sound like another establishment hack lying to get what you want. Too bad. He's not eligible.
Well, that's nice to know. With me not being Canadian I didn't know that but I'm sure Canadian Cruz did know that.
"Secondly, the term isn't defined in the Constitution and the SCOTUS hasn't ruled upon the issue. You are but stating your opinion as to what NBC means. What legal precedent does exist says that Cruz is eligible. McCain was eligible even though he was born in Panama, for example."
It's not define because everyone knew what it meant at the time of it's writing. Jus soli & Jus Sanguini.
McCain and Obama are perversions. McCain didn't win so the point is mute. Only Obama and one other president (his name escapes me at the moment but he hide information) has successfully usurper the presidency. Obama even forged a Hawaiian birth certificate so as to be say he was birthed on American soil.
Don't bother trying to argue your stupid position. I've read more articles and citations on the subject in the last 7 years than you've have brain cells.
"Look! A black helicopter! RUN, FOR GOD'S SAKE RUN MAN!"
Screw you. I believe in a Constitutional Republic too bad Cruz and his anti-Constitutionalists don't. I refuse to vote for a non-natural born citizen and I'm not the only one. Don't insult our intelligence.
You sound like another establishment hack lying to get what you want. Too bad. He's not eligible.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 04:47 PM (xupNw)
408
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:41 PM (hRytD)
You shouldn't smoke cigars that fast. You should take your time and enjoy them.
You shouldn't smoke cigars that fast. You should take your time and enjoy them.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 16, 2015 04:49 PM (x3GpS)
409
@401 We patrol a completely open border now right?
No, actually we don't so your premise is incorrect.
If you define patrolling flying over every week or so, then yes, but if you define it as actually having someone ride along the border, no.
Hell I don't think we patrol almost any of the Northern border.
No, actually we don't so your premise is incorrect.
If you define patrolling flying over every week or so, then yes, but if you define it as actually having someone ride along the border, no.
Hell I don't think we patrol almost any of the Northern border.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:49 PM (0FSuD)
410
Hell I don't think we patrol almost any of the Northern border.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:49 PM (0FSuD)
That's where the Scandi's sneak in!
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:49 PM (0FSuD)
That's where the Scandi's sneak in!
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:50 PM (0FSuD)
411
Again with the "won't work"? define that. You can't do a cost/benefit analysis unless you estimate the number that it will stop.
Walls have stopped invasions for millenia. Just saying it won't work is simplilstic.
Again with the "won't work"? define that. You can't do a cost/benefit analysis unless you estimate the number that it will stop.
Walls have stopped invasions for millenia. Just saying it won't work is simplilstic.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:51 PM (ODxAs)
412
Remember all the money to build a wall would be SPENT IN AMERICA ON AMERICANS AND AMERICAN THINGS.
Hell just call it "stimulus" ifit makes you feel better. Or would you rather the $$$ go to another of Obama's buddies instead???
Private landowners at the border would be given a choice: either let the fence be built on your property or let your land become the funnel as the only place on the border without a fence. They'll make the smart choice.
The REALITY of all this is that 95% of America has NO interest at all in deporting someone who's been here 20 years, been productive and has committed no crimes other than being here illegally. Be super-hardline on this and you're living in a fantasyland.
Remember all the money to build a wall would be SPENT IN AMERICA ON AMERICANS AND AMERICAN THINGS.
Hell just call it "stimulus" ifit makes you feel better. Or would you rather the $$$ go to another of Obama's buddies instead???
Private landowners at the border would be given a choice: either let the fence be built on your property or let your land become the funnel as the only place on the border without a fence. They'll make the smart choice.
The REALITY of all this is that 95% of America has NO interest at all in deporting someone who's been here 20 years, been productive and has committed no crimes other than being here illegally. Be super-hardline on this and you're living in a fantasyland.
Posted by: MAx at August 16, 2015 04:55 PM (LAliD)
413
Nood, Food
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 04:58 PM (0FSuD)
414
Obama has a fence around his home. Why can't I have one around mine???
Can't wait for someone here to claim that the fence around the White House shouldn't be there because it doesn't cut down on the number of people coming in. Pure idealogues.
Obama has a fence around his home. Why can't I have one around mine???
Can't wait for someone here to claim that the fence around the White House shouldn't be there because it doesn't cut down on the number of people coming in. Pure idealogues.
Posted by: MAx at August 16, 2015 04:59 PM (LAliD)
415
I think I have made that pretty clear. Read my posts.
Too Expensive, won't work. It's called cost/benefit analysis
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16,
****
I asked you way upthread what our total costs were to support illegals. Unless you havve that number, you are just making shit up and can not possibly have done a cost/benefit analysis.
Too Expensive, won't work. It's called cost/benefit analysis
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16,
****
I asked you way upthread what our total costs were to support illegals. Unless you havve that number, you are just making shit up and can not possibly have done a cost/benefit analysis.
Posted by: ManWithNoParty, unperson from Free Market Jesus Paradise at August 16, 2015 04:59 PM (1eYr7)
416
And Cruz doesn't even measure up to Obama's faux birth story.
Obama's faux birth story - born on American soil to an American mother and a foreign father.
Cruz - born in a foreign country with an American mother and foreign father.
Not Eligible.
Obama's faux birth story - born on American soil to an American mother and a foreign father.
Cruz - born in a foreign country with an American mother and foreign father.
Not Eligible.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:00 PM (xupNw)
417
Walls have stopped invasions for millenia. Just saying it won't work is simplilstic.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:51 PM (ODxAs)
I suggest you look at the number of people breaking over the fence in San Diego for good review of just how little fences work.
I could work up a formula, miles to break in using the data from the fences now in urban areas.
I am too lazy, but you can see from Brownsville, etc, they simple don't stop them.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 16, 2015 04:51 PM (ODxAs)
I suggest you look at the number of people breaking over the fence in San Diego for good review of just how little fences work.
I could work up a formula, miles to break in using the data from the fences now in urban areas.
I am too lazy, but you can see from Brownsville, etc, they simple don't stop them.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 05:01 PM (0FSuD)
418
Hey, I've got an idea.
Let's treat invaders in to our lands the way Mexico treats theirs.
They don't have much of a problem.
Let's treat invaders in to our lands the way Mexico treats theirs.
They don't have much of a problem.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 05:04 PM (JgC5a)
419
really like the bit in Trump's policy paper about ending J-1 visas and having companies hiring urban youth instead.
Posted by: @votermom at August 16, 2015 05:05 PM (cbfNE)
420
"What legal precedent does exist says that Cruz is eligible."
None. He doesn't even measure up to Obama's faux story.
Name another president born in a foreign country?
Note - The founding fathers don't count. Grandfather clause for them:
"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the
adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the
Office of President;"
None. He doesn't even measure up to Obama's faux story.
Name another president born in a foreign country?
Note - The founding fathers don't count. Grandfather clause for them:
"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the
adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the
Office of President;"
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:06 PM (xupNw)
421
It's not a wall, it's a fence. I'm sure that people who own the private property would allow a right of way strip and the fence. THEY WANT a fence more than anyone. They don't like their land being used and trashed by illegals while they just stand by because the JEF won't allow anything to be done. We need to build an Israeli style fence. Patrolled by humans, cameras, and drones. Electrifying it would work too since land mines probably won't go over well.
And F#ck the U(useless)N(nitwits) and their human rights division. It's only enforced by the U.S. anyways. Pull out of the UN and see how fast it collapses without US funding.
And F#ck the U(useless)N(nitwits) and their human rights division. It's only enforced by the U.S. anyways. Pull out of the UN and see how fast it collapses without US funding.
Posted by: lindafell de Spair @ San Jacinto at August 16, 2015 05:06 PM (xVgrA)
422
I asked you way upthread what our total costs were
to support illegals. Unless you havve that number, you are just making
shit up and can not possibly have done a cost/benefit analysis.
Posted by: ManWithNoParty, unperson from Free Market Jesus Paradise at August 16, 2015 04:59 PM (1eYr7)
That's a figure pretty much impossible to figure out. Think of all the variables? SS paid but not used, income taxes withheld but not used, the reduced cost of labor because of illegals willing to work for less.
Against that you have welfare and other assistance some take.
I don't have the time, but I would be willing to wager that their is literature figuring out the reduced cost of labor because of immigrants.
That reduced cost means your roof gets put on cheaper, etc.
It would be a good doctoral project, and I am sure someone has done it. I suggest checking AFL CIO literature. They probably have numbers.
to support illegals. Unless you havve that number, you are just making
shit up and can not possibly have done a cost/benefit analysis.
Posted by: ManWithNoParty, unperson from Free Market Jesus Paradise at August 16, 2015 04:59 PM (1eYr7)
That's a figure pretty much impossible to figure out. Think of all the variables? SS paid but not used, income taxes withheld but not used, the reduced cost of labor because of illegals willing to work for less.
Against that you have welfare and other assistance some take.
I don't have the time, but I would be willing to wager that their is literature figuring out the reduced cost of labor because of immigrants.
That reduced cost means your roof gets put on cheaper, etc.
It would be a good doctoral project, and I am sure someone has done it. I suggest checking AFL CIO literature. They probably have numbers.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 05:06 PM (0FSuD)
423
"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President;"
Actually, the very fact that there is a grandfather clause for the founding fathers is proof that just being a citizen is not enough. They had to grant themselves an exception as they were not natural born citizens themselves.
Actually, the very fact that there is a grandfather clause for the founding fathers is proof that just being a citizen is not enough. They had to grant themselves an exception as they were not natural born citizens themselves.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:09 PM (xupNw)
424
@420
I think Cruz's case will fly. His mother was a citizen, so he gets citizenship. I thought both parents had to be citizens, but someone bitch slapped me on that about a month ago.
I think Cruz's case will fly. His mother was a citizen, so he gets citizenship. I thought both parents had to be citizens, but someone bitch slapped me on that about a month ago.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 05:11 PM (0FSuD)
425
It would be a good doctoral project, and I am sure someone has done it. I suggest checking AFL CIO literature. They probably have numbers.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 05:06 PM (0FSuD)
******
So, your cost/benefit argument is made up shit. Got it.
Posted by: Nip Sip at August 16, 2015 05:06 PM (0FSuD)
******
So, your cost/benefit argument is made up shit. Got it.
Posted by: ManWithNoParty, unperson from Free Market Jesus Paradise at August 16, 2015 05:13 PM (2z4UX)
426
"His mother was a citizen, so he gets citizenship."
"Citizen" doesn't not equal "natural born citizen." Cruz is a citizen not natural born.
"I thought both parents had to be citizens"
That's true. Obama is a usurper. Fact. Justice Thomas said they were "evading" the issue. Evading his usurpation. Get it. Not avoiding it but evading it.
Avoiding and evading have different meanings. The justices are evading the Constitution. But that's not new. We are a lawless country now but I refuse to participate. Cruz is not eligible.
"Citizen" doesn't not equal "natural born citizen." Cruz is a citizen not natural born.
"I thought both parents had to be citizens"
That's true. Obama is a usurper. Fact. Justice Thomas said they were "evading" the issue. Evading his usurpation. Get it. Not avoiding it but evading it.
Avoiding and evading have different meanings. The justices are evading the Constitution. But that's not new. We are a lawless country now but I refuse to participate. Cruz is not eligible.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:17 PM (xupNw)
427
The Republicans, the Democrats and SCOTUS can't wait until little mohammad, anchor baby, born in Saudi Arabia to an American mother and a foreign father is over 35 years old so he can run for president.
F' that and screw Cruz and his destruction of the natural born citizen clause. Rubio and Jindal too.
F' that and screw Cruz and his destruction of the natural born citizen clause. Rubio and Jindal too.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:20 PM (xupNw)
428
Posted by: Sixkiller at August 16, 2015 04:41 PM (hRytD)
Sign: Mine Field. Do not enter.
See?
You enter you die.
You stay out you live.
Sign: Mine Field. Do not enter.
See?
You enter you die.
You stay out you live.
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 05:21 PM (MQEz6)
429
I think Cruz 's eligibility is sufficiently murky that it would go to SCOTUS if challenged.
His argument is that natural hirn cituzen means someone who was a citizen automatically at birth, iirc.
His argument is that natural hirn cituzen means someone who was a citizen automatically at birth, iirc.
Posted by: @votermom at August 16, 2015 05:21 PM (cbfNE)
430
I love how NS thinks that East Germans could just walk into West Germany.
Walls work. It's a historical fact. They work even better with moats, like the Rio Grande.
The issue would be treaties regarding wildlife. Not any inherent feasibility.
@283 Agent J, I'd put the moment at Bob Dole refusing to let most of the Contract with America come to a vote in the Senate. Cemented when Gingrich was forced out as Speaker.
With regards to Hillary serving time or not, iI'd say it comes down to one question:
How much do she and Bill hate each other? Her safety depends on his protection. A wink and a nudge is all it would take... It could easily happen during a game of golf. Like the one he's having today.
(I don't claim to know the answer, but it ought to be entertaining to find out!)
Walls work. It's a historical fact. They work even better with moats, like the Rio Grande.
The issue would be treaties regarding wildlife. Not any inherent feasibility.
@283 Agent J, I'd put the moment at Bob Dole refusing to let most of the Contract with America come to a vote in the Senate. Cemented when Gingrich was forced out as Speaker.
With regards to Hillary serving time or not, iI'd say it comes down to one question:
How much do she and Bill hate each other? Her safety depends on his protection. A wink and a nudge is all it would take... It could easily happen during a game of golf. Like the one he's having today.
(I don't claim to know the answer, but it ought to be entertaining to find out!)
Posted by: Luke at August 16, 2015 05:24 PM (pfTnm)
Posted by: chad at August 16, 2015 05:26 PM (MQEz6)
432
And since it is murky, as much as I love Cruz, I think him being on a ticket might make some ppl stay home for that reason.
I would vote for him, though.
I would vote for him, though.
Posted by: @votermom at August 16, 2015 05:26 PM (cbfNE)
433
425 Right on. 40% of kids in l.a. schools are illegal and/or their parents are. how much does THAT cost?
Way less than a fence...
425 Right on. 40% of kids in l.a. schools are illegal and/or their parents are. how much does THAT cost?
Way less than a fence...
Posted by: MAx at August 16, 2015 05:27 PM (LAliD)
434
"His argument is that natural hirn cituzen means someone who was a citizen automatically at birth, iirc."
Of course that's his argument. He has a vested interest in the outcome. That's like asking the thief his opinion on burglary laws.
Name another foreign born president? And Obama even with his fake story is not a precedent. He says he was born in Hawaii.
If being a citizen is enough they wouldn't have made a specific requirement in the Constitution to be a natural born citizen. The founding fathers were citizen but even they had to make an exemption for themselves. It's self-evident. Logic.
Only liars say differently.
Of course that's his argument. He has a vested interest in the outcome. That's like asking the thief his opinion on burglary laws.
Name another foreign born president? And Obama even with his fake story is not a precedent. He says he was born in Hawaii.
If being a citizen is enough they wouldn't have made a specific requirement in the Constitution to be a natural born citizen. The founding fathers were citizen but even they had to make an exemption for themselves. It's self-evident. Logic.
Only liars say differently.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:28 PM (xupNw)
435
A third of all felons in US prison systems are from places other than the USA.
And a lot of their victims are either dead or maimed for life.
And a lot of their victims are either dead or maimed for life.
Posted by: navybrat at August 16, 2015 05:28 PM (JgC5a)
Posted by: MAx at August 16, 2015 05:29 PM (LAliD)
437
Someone who received his citizenship as his birthright is a natural born citizen.
Full stop.
Although I await the entertaining moment when M&P declares candidates born via ceaserian section ineligible.
Full stop.
Although I await the entertaining moment when M&P declares candidates born via ceaserian section ineligible.
Posted by: Luke at August 16, 2015 05:29 PM (pfTnm)
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 05:29 PM (HJqXj)
Posted by: MAx at August 16, 2015 05:30 PM (LAliD)
440
"Born in or subject to the laws of the United States"
Cruz is as much natural born by law as McCain.
Cruz is as much natural born by law as McCain.
Posted by: some random meathead at August 16, 2015 05:31 PM (HJqXj)
441
M&P, the Founding Fathers could not be natural born citizens, because they founded the country significantly after being born.
For someone who invokes logic, you're kinda bad at it.
For someone who invokes logic, you're kinda bad at it.
Posted by: Luke at August 16, 2015 05:33 PM (pfTnm)
442
"And since it is murky, as much as I love Cruz, I think him being on a ticket might make some ppl stay home for that reason."
That is also a fact. The establishment loves that Cruz, Jindal, and Rubio are running. They want the final nail in the coffin for the natural born citizen clause.
They want those anchor babies running for president.
Everything out of Cruz's mouth is non-starter for me after his straight up lie about his citizenship status. He lies right to my face. I don't trust him with anything after that.
That is also a fact. The establishment loves that Cruz, Jindal, and Rubio are running. They want the final nail in the coffin for the natural born citizen clause.
They want those anchor babies running for president.
Everything out of Cruz's mouth is non-starter for me after his straight up lie about his citizenship status. He lies right to my face. I don't trust him with anything after that.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:33 PM (xupNw)
443
The country that pays $149/gal. for the fuel for the armed services can't afford to build a wall???
Pure ideology.
CA. will spend more on free medical care for illegals this year than a wall for the whole country would cost.
The country that pays $149/gal. for the fuel for the armed services can't afford to build a wall???
Pure ideology.
CA. will spend more on free medical care for illegals this year than a wall for the whole country would cost.
Posted by: MAx at August 16, 2015 05:38 PM (LAliD)
444
"For someone who invokes logic, you're kinda bad at it."
You're not too bright are you. Read it and weep:
"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President;"
"M&P, the Founding Fathers could not be natural born citizens, because they founded the country significantly after being born."
And yet they mentioned a class of citizenship that was required to be president and exempted themselves.
Read it again. Real slow. Move your lips if you have to.
"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President;"
You're not too bright are you. Read it and weep:
"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President;"
"M&P, the Founding Fathers could not be natural born citizens, because they founded the country significantly after being born."
And yet they mentioned a class of citizenship that was required to be president and exempted themselves.
Read it again. Real slow. Move your lips if you have to.
"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President;"
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:38 PM (xupNw)
445
Let the GOP/RNC burn.Then letCruz rise from the ashes. But if that isn't possible, then I'll be pretty well satisfiedjust watching Trump twist RINO noses.
Posted by: Born Free at August 16, 2015 05:40 PM (qWY9T)
446
I notice that you utterly fail to address the LEGAL issue at the heart of the question: the term "natural born citizen" is never defined in the Constitution.
Now, your contention is that the phrase was generally understood at the time to mean "born in the US to parents who were US citizens". Guess what? I fucking agree with you asshole.
I also think that anchor babies are bullshit because the 14th CLEARLY states "subject to the jurisdiction thereof", and the the Commerce Clause has sweet fuck all to do with a farmer growing wheat for his own use.
The law on all three of these subject is a different matter. Would the US be a better place if my interpretation of the above had held? Undoubtedly. But that's not the world we live in.
But hey, don't let reality stop you. Babble on screaming USURPER, that's bound to convince people.
Now, your contention is that the phrase was generally understood at the time to mean "born in the US to parents who were US citizens". Guess what? I fucking agree with you asshole.
I also think that anchor babies are bullshit because the 14th CLEARLY states "subject to the jurisdiction thereof", and the the Commerce Clause has sweet fuck all to do with a farmer growing wheat for his own use.
The law on all three of these subject is a different matter. Would the US be a better place if my interpretation of the above had held? Undoubtedly. But that's not the world we live in.
But hey, don't let reality stop you. Babble on screaming USURPER, that's bound to convince people.
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 05:40 PM (WvS3w)
Posted by: Weirddave at August 16, 2015 05:41 PM (WvS3w)
448
Cruz is as much natural born by law as McCain."
We are not discussing McCain. He didn't win. Don't want to waste time on him other than to say that that stupid decree/bill they passed for McCain in congress (while ignoring the elephant Obama) does not supersede the Constitutional requirement. It was a ruse to fool the rubes.
We are not discussing McCain. He didn't win. Don't want to waste time on him other than to say that that stupid decree/bill they passed for McCain in congress (while ignoring the elephant Obama) does not supersede the Constitutional requirement. It was a ruse to fool the rubes.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:42 PM (xupNw)
449
Thank you Weirddave. You have explained Trump better than any I've read so far.
I don't really like Trump, but the professional politics crowd hates me and keeps trying to throw me into his arms.
I don't really like Trump, but the professional politics crowd hates me and keeps trying to throw me into his arms.
Posted by: Old Hob at August 16, 2015 05:43 PM (FFIoe)
450
Let's say nominee Trump picks Cruz to be his VP.
Dems then file suit saying Cruz us not eligible.
Goes to SCOTUS.
What would the decision be, given that Robert's is in O's pocket?
Dems then file suit saying Cruz us not eligible.
Goes to SCOTUS.
What would the decision be, given that Robert's is in O's pocket?
Posted by: @votermom at August 16, 2015 05:45 PM (cbfNE)
451
Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America, in Congress assembled, That any Alien being a free white person, who shall have resided within the limits and under the jurisdiction of the United States for the term of two years, may be admitted to become a citizen thereof on application to any common law Court of record in any one of the States wherein he shall have resided for the term of one year at least, and making proof to the satisfaction of such Court that he is a person of good character, and taking the oath or affirmation prescribed by law to support the Constitution of the United States, which Oath or Affirmation such Court shall administer, and the Clerk of such Court shall record such Application, and the proceedings thereon; and thereupon such person shall be considered as a Citizen of the United States. And the children of such person so naturalized, dwelling within the United States, being under the age of twenty one years at the time of such naturalization, shall also be considered as citizens of the United States. And the children of citizens of the United States that may be born beyond Sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born Citizens: Provided, that the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States: Provided also, that no person heretofore proscribed by any States, shall be admitted a citizen as aforesaid, except by an Act of the Legislature of the State in which such person was proscribed.
Posted by: Naturalization Act of 1790 at August 16, 2015 05:45 PM (FohCt)
452
We have redefined "natural born."
Posted by: Victor Frankenstein at August 16, 2015 05:45 PM (W5DcG)
453
" I notice that you utterly fail to address the LEGAL issue at the heart of the question: the term "natural born citizen" is never defined in the Constitution."
That's like saying the word "president" was not defined. The Constitution is not a dictionary. They used words that people understood the meaning of. They didn't define the word "age" either and yet it is understood.
"Now, your contention is that the phrase was generally understood at the time to mean "born in the US to parents who were US citizens". Guess what? I fucking agree with you asshole."
Great. So I'm an asshole for being correct. Got it. Though it is nice to finally have someone actually tell the truth once in awhile.
"The law on all three of these subject is a different matter. Would the US be a better place if my interpretation of the above had held? Undoubtedly. But that's not the world we live in."
None of these laws supersede the natural born citizen clause. Only Obama has succeed with usurping the presidency. Technically, It's still an open question because of his birth certificate fraud. It's not settled at all.
Just because he got away with murder does not mean murder is now legal.
"But hey, don't let reality stop you. Babble on screaming USURPER, that's bound to convince people."
I'm not going to lie. Obama is factually a usurper and a fraud. I want the crimes of the last seven years to be accounted for. It's not over yet and so I'll keep speaking out. Cuz, ya know, I actually respect the rule of law.
And the fact that Cruz seems to think it's ok to continue with the destruction of the Constitution for his own benefit doesn't fly with me. He, as a non-natural born citizen should have been upholding his oath and speaking about it but rather he's taking what he can take for his own benefit. And they talk about Trump's ego. Sheesh.
That's like saying the word "president" was not defined. The Constitution is not a dictionary. They used words that people understood the meaning of. They didn't define the word "age" either and yet it is understood.
"Now, your contention is that the phrase was generally understood at the time to mean "born in the US to parents who were US citizens". Guess what? I fucking agree with you asshole."
Great. So I'm an asshole for being correct. Got it. Though it is nice to finally have someone actually tell the truth once in awhile.
"The law on all three of these subject is a different matter. Would the US be a better place if my interpretation of the above had held? Undoubtedly. But that's not the world we live in."
None of these laws supersede the natural born citizen clause. Only Obama has succeed with usurping the presidency. Technically, It's still an open question because of his birth certificate fraud. It's not settled at all.
Just because he got away with murder does not mean murder is now legal.
"But hey, don't let reality stop you. Babble on screaming USURPER, that's bound to convince people."
I'm not going to lie. Obama is factually a usurper and a fraud. I want the crimes of the last seven years to be accounted for. It's not over yet and so I'll keep speaking out. Cuz, ya know, I actually respect the rule of law.
And the fact that Cruz seems to think it's ok to continue with the destruction of the Constitution for his own benefit doesn't fly with me. He, as a non-natural born citizen should have been upholding his oath and speaking about it but rather he's taking what he can take for his own benefit. And they talk about Trump's ego. Sheesh.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 05:55 PM (xupNw)
454
@316 t-bird
"The problem you're running up against is this: the Berlin Wall worked."
At keeping people in. You want to scare yourself--- ask random people "who built the Berlin Wall and why."
I can only shake my head.
"The problem you're running up against is this: the Berlin Wall worked."
At keeping people in. You want to scare yourself--- ask random people "who built the Berlin Wall and why."
I can only shake my head.
Posted by: Buckeye Abroad at August 16, 2015 06:00 PM (oyMca)
455
M&P, I'm a little confused by your comments.
Someone above quoted the 1790 law that stated children born of US citizens, as long as their father had also been a resident of the states, were natural born citizens. Cruz's and Obama's dads both lived in the US prior to their births. Both came from citizen moms. Am I wrong or missing something?
Someone above quoted the 1790 law that stated children born of US citizens, as long as their father had also been a resident of the states, were natural born citizens. Cruz's and Obama's dads both lived in the US prior to their births. Both came from citizen moms. Am I wrong or missing something?
Posted by: Old Hob at August 16, 2015 06:05 PM (FFIoe)
456
"Let's say nominee Trump picks Cruz to be his VP.
Dems then file suit saying Cruz us not eligible.
Goes to SCOTUS.
What would the decision be, given that Robert's is in O's pocket?"
Well, they'd definitely WANT to say he's eligible because they want the final nail in the natural born citizen clause. But they'd think that Cruz (according to his positions) is way too conservative. So they'd say Obama is eligible but not Cruz because Hawaii/not Canada. They won't let Cruz be president.
So they would try to legitimize Obama, and rule out Cruz.
They'd get the two American parents voided and will wait for another foreign commie/muslim democrat to kill the born on US soil requirement.
Why doesn't anybody get it? The ratchet only works one way.
Dems then file suit saying Cruz us not eligible.
Goes to SCOTUS.
What would the decision be, given that Robert's is in O's pocket?"
Well, they'd definitely WANT to say he's eligible because they want the final nail in the natural born citizen clause. But they'd think that Cruz (according to his positions) is way too conservative. So they'd say Obama is eligible but not Cruz because Hawaii/not Canada. They won't let Cruz be president.
So they would try to legitimize Obama, and rule out Cruz.
They'd get the two American parents voided and will wait for another foreign commie/muslim democrat to kill the born on US soil requirement.
Why doesn't anybody get it? The ratchet only works one way.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 06:09 PM (xupNw)
Posted by: Buckeye Abroad at August 16, 2015 06:19 PM (oyMca)
Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 16, 2015 06:20 PM (rwI+c)
459
"Someone above quoted the 1790 law that stated children born of US citizens, as long as their father had also been a resident of the states, were natural born citizens. Cruz's and Obama's dads both lived in the US prior to their births. Both came from citizen moms. Am I wrong or missing something?"
Well, first of all, it's pretty stupid to cite a "Naturalization" act, in support of "natural born." Again self-evident.
Naturalization Act of 1790:
"the children of citizens of the United States that may be born beyond Sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born Citizens: provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States".
The "citizens" involved are two American citizen parents. Not non-citizens like fathers of Obama and Cruz. ALL children born of one US citizen parent are ALWAYS US citizens. Some are just no natural born.
Secondly, That act specifically excludes the children of foreign fathers from acquiring citizenship. So there's that. Again. Self-evident.
Well, first of all, it's pretty stupid to cite a "Naturalization" act, in support of "natural born." Again self-evident.
Naturalization Act of 1790:
"the children of citizens of the United States that may be born beyond Sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born Citizens: provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States".
The "citizens" involved are two American citizen parents. Not non-citizens like fathers of Obama and Cruz. ALL children born of one US citizen parent are ALWAYS US citizens. Some are just no natural born.
Secondly, That act specifically excludes the children of foreign fathers from acquiring citizenship. So there's that. Again. Self-evident.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 06:26 PM (xupNw)
460
Naturalization Act of 1790
The act was meant to interdict the Children of Citizens who had American citizenship but never lived in the country from passing on citizenship.
The act was meant to interdict the Children of Citizens who had American citizenship but never lived in the country from passing on citizenship.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 06:30 PM (xupNw)
461
"President Cruz. Get used too it cupcake."
Mister 5-7 percenter in the polls? I'm not worried. He's not going anywhere anyway.
Mister 5-7 percenter in the polls? I'm not worried. He's not going anywhere anyway.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 06:32 PM (xupNw)
462
I keep seeing a lot of misconception about the Perot vote here, most likely from people on the East Coast. This is the election where the MSM called it for Clinton BEFORE polls closed on the West Coast. Those West Coast Perot votes were a protest vote. Since our votes didn't count, why not vote Perot?
Trump is not Perot and he will pull votes from the Dems too. He's against Citizens United. Do you think a disaffected Bernie supporter wouldn't go to that, if Hilary gets the nod?
Trump is not Perot and he will pull votes from the Dems too. He's against Citizens United. Do you think a disaffected Bernie supporter wouldn't go to that, if Hilary gets the nod?
Posted by: Notsothoreau at August 16, 2015 06:38 PM (jI1b1)
463
You go ahead and be a Ted Cruz guy, his politics and positions are great. Only one little problem......He can't f'ing be President under our Constitution. He is flaunting the basic law of our country everyday by running for President and you think he's going to swear to uphold and defend that same Constitution?
Sorry, even though he's the closest thing to my positions, I will never in a thousand years vote for someone to be President who is ineligible by our own Constitution.
Sorry, even though he's the closest thing to my positions, I will never in a thousand years vote for someone to be President who is ineligible by our own Constitution.
Posted by: doug at August 16, 2015 06:51 PM (IYEs/)
464
Weirddave:Secondly, the term isn't defined in the Constitution and the SCOTUS hasn't ruled upon the issue. You are but stating your opinion as to what NBC means. What legal precedent does exist says that Cruz is eligible. McCain was eligible even though he was born in Panama, for example.
Your example stinks. McCain had a father and mother who were American Citizens. Cruz does not.
As for the rest the Supreme Court has ruled: They have numerous times ruled that if a term in the Constitution is not defined in that document, then Congress defines it.
"natural born citizen" has only been defined by Congress ONE TIME. It has not been otherly defined since, the Supremes if they weren't such a bunch of ninnies technically would have to go by that archaic definition.
Simply put, if you were born outside of the U.S. and both your parents were citizens, then you are considered a natural born citizen. Hence the democrats trying desparately to show Obama being born in Hawaii and not Kenya.
Your example stinks. McCain had a father and mother who were American Citizens. Cruz does not.
As for the rest the Supreme Court has ruled: They have numerous times ruled that if a term in the Constitution is not defined in that document, then Congress defines it.
"natural born citizen" has only been defined by Congress ONE TIME. It has not been otherly defined since, the Supremes if they weren't such a bunch of ninnies technically would have to go by that archaic definition.
Simply put, if you were born outside of the U.S. and both your parents were citizens, then you are considered a natural born citizen. Hence the democrats trying desparately to show Obama being born in Hawaii and not Kenya.
Posted by: doug at August 16, 2015 06:59 PM (IYEs/)
465
Thank you! I have been saying everything in this post for the past few weeks and shaking my head about how dumb the establishment is. Attack the base is all they seem to know how to do.
Posted by: Bella at August 16, 2015 07:01 PM (Ka2Ku)
466
"He is flaunting the basic law of our country everyday by running for President and you think he's going to swear to uphold and defend that same Constitution?"
Exactly. He wants to kill the clause. What a selfish creep.
Without the two American parents with birth on American soil all bets are off. Anchor babies are a nightmare. More Obamas.
Chinese mother flies to America births a baby. As long as at some point the kid lives in America for 14 years and is over the age of 35 he will be allowed to be president.
Child born to an naturalized American muslim mother in Saudi Arabia gives birth in Saudi Arabia. As long as the kid spend 14 years here he would be eligible.
We NEED the natural born citizen clause. The world government goons want to do away with it for a reason. Wake up.
Exactly. He wants to kill the clause. What a selfish creep.
Without the two American parents with birth on American soil all bets are off. Anchor babies are a nightmare. More Obamas.
Chinese mother flies to America births a baby. As long as at some point the kid lives in America for 14 years and is over the age of 35 he will be allowed to be president.
Child born to an naturalized American muslim mother in Saudi Arabia gives birth in Saudi Arabia. As long as the kid spend 14 years here he would be eligible.
We NEED the natural born citizen clause. The world government goons want to do away with it for a reason. Wake up.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 07:06 PM (xupNw)
467
Jeb Bush is less of a politician than W or even H W. How did he become Governor of Florida? Buy off the press? Marco gang-of-eight Rubio at least seems to be learning. Glen Beck loves him some Rubio. Beck confirmed to me that he is a huckster as I thought. He loves Rubio why? Because he bought from Gold Line? :-)
Posted by: Kidding me? at August 16, 2015 07:20 PM (PGh+Q)
468
I read it, and your tinfoil hat is on too tight.
Cruz gained his citizenship as his birthright. That makes him a natural born citizen. Full stop.
It's right there in the meanings of the words, and is further bolstered by Congress actually making it explicit shortly after the Constitution was enacted.
You have not a leg to stand on.
Cruz gained his citizenship as his birthright. That makes him a natural born citizen. Full stop.
It's right there in the meanings of the words, and is further bolstered by Congress actually making it explicit shortly after the Constitution was enacted.
You have not a leg to stand on.
Posted by: Luke at August 16, 2015 07:20 PM (pfTnm)
469
Simply put, if you were born outside of the U.S. and
both your parents were citizens, then you are considered a natural born
citizen.
Posted by: doug at August 16, 2015 06:59 PM (IYEs/)
Not necessarily - INS has long had a series of regs on how to determine citizenship of a child born outside of the US (and territories) with at least one parent a US citizen. Generally, terms used are "Citizen at Birth" and "Citizen after Birth". One of my kids was born abroad when the regs flipped (yet again) and was deemed "Citizen at Birth" and we went direct to getting a passport, born a few months earlier and we have had to got State Dept paperwork to show the kid was deemed a "Citizen after Birth" before we coud get a passport. (there are also some regs on how US citizens serving the Gov abroad are considered as being in the US...)With the parentage and birth of Obama and Cruz and question of their citizenship, not 'Natural Born', just plain od citienship, how did they get it?
The key is the 19th Amendment
both your parents were citizens, then you are considered a natural born
citizen.
Posted by: doug at August 16, 2015 06:59 PM (IYEs/)
Not necessarily - INS has long had a series of regs on how to determine citizenship of a child born outside of the US (and territories) with at least one parent a US citizen. Generally, terms used are "Citizen at Birth" and "Citizen after Birth". One of my kids was born abroad when the regs flipped (yet again) and was deemed "Citizen at Birth" and we went direct to getting a passport, born a few months earlier and we have had to got State Dept paperwork to show the kid was deemed a "Citizen after Birth" before we coud get a passport. (there are also some regs on how US citizens serving the Gov abroad are considered as being in the US...)With the parentage and birth of Obama and Cruz and question of their citizenship, not 'Natural Born', just plain od citienship, how did they get it?
The key is the 19th Amendment
Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 16, 2015 07:21 PM (NaeCR)
470
"Cruz gained his citizenship as his birthright. That makes him a natural born citizen. Full stop."
Yeah he gained American citizenship not natural born citizenship. Even the founding fathers had to write themselves an exemption from the requirement of natural born citizenship.
Cruz is a citizen by statute. Meaning they had to write a law for people like him. Without that law he is just a plain old Canadian and Cuban.
There are no laws written for natural born citizens, like myself. We are natural born no statutes or laws needed.
Name another foreign born president? Go ahead. Even Obama says he was born here.
Yeah he gained American citizenship not natural born citizenship. Even the founding fathers had to write themselves an exemption from the requirement of natural born citizenship.
Cruz is a citizen by statute. Meaning they had to write a law for people like him. Without that law he is just a plain old Canadian and Cuban.
There are no laws written for natural born citizens, like myself. We are natural born no statutes or laws needed.
Name another foreign born president? Go ahead. Even Obama says he was born here.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 07:33 PM (xupNw)
471
"Naturalization Act of 1790. In English and everything."
Yeah. What part of the word "Naturalization" escapes you? It's in English and everything.
Yeah. What part of the word "Naturalization" escapes you? It's in English and everything.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 07:55 PM (xupNw)
472
Trump= Leo Gets from Lethal Weapon. Ok ok ok
Posted by: ok ok ok at August 16, 2015 09:50 PM (R+xSR)
473
There is this actress. She married a dude that is a citizen of Monaco, here on some sort of visa. She is a US citizen, he was never a US citizen. Both of their children were born here - on US soil to one parent who was a straight up US citizen. The children do not even have dual citizenship. They are straight US citizens. The parents divorced after the father had his visa expire. Monaco gave the father custody. Monaco did.
The US won't allow the US citizen mother (actress) to fight it in the US court. They just forced the transport of the children to Monaco.
Tell me what a natural born citizen is?
Again?
The US won't allow the US citizen mother (actress) to fight it in the US court. They just forced the transport of the children to Monaco.
Tell me what a natural born citizen is?
Again?
Posted by: GrandeMe at August 16, 2015 10:07 PM (xhawg)
474
"The US won't allow the US citizen mother (actress) to fight it in the US court. They just forced the transport of the children to Monaco. Tell me what a natural born citizen is?"
Not sure what you are getting at. Custody issues between parents have nothing to do with being or not being a natural born citizen.
For example, two American citizens can give birth to children born on American soil. They are natural born citizens. If one of the parents moves to France and is able to get custody of those children they are still natural born citizens and can run for president. Even is French citizenship is later bestowed upon them without as long as they don't renounce their American citizenship.
As it stand in your example (and I am familiar with the actress's story): One American citizen and one foreign citizen parents giving birth on American soil makes the children citizens not natural born citizens.
Natural born citizenship is about running for president. It's a requirement. It's not about custody issues.
Obama is a usurper. Plain and simple. That's why the supreme court is 'evading' the issue. They know the answer but hell it's not like the follow the Constitution anyway. They love that they don't have to tackle the issue head on. I actually don't want them to rule on the issue until Trump has won election for reasons too long to go into here.
At a minimum 5 or 6 of the justices want the natural born citizen clause to be obliterated so I don't want them ruling on it yet.
After Robert's it's a tax-it's a fee-it's a penalty and Kennedy's made up out of thin air - anal sex rights, I've no doubt that they would make every person on the face of the planet eligible.
Not sure what you are getting at. Custody issues between parents have nothing to do with being or not being a natural born citizen.
For example, two American citizens can give birth to children born on American soil. They are natural born citizens. If one of the parents moves to France and is able to get custody of those children they are still natural born citizens and can run for president. Even is French citizenship is later bestowed upon them without as long as they don't renounce their American citizenship.
As it stand in your example (and I am familiar with the actress's story): One American citizen and one foreign citizen parents giving birth on American soil makes the children citizens not natural born citizens.
Natural born citizenship is about running for president. It's a requirement. It's not about custody issues.
Obama is a usurper. Plain and simple. That's why the supreme court is 'evading' the issue. They know the answer but hell it's not like the follow the Constitution anyway. They love that they don't have to tackle the issue head on. I actually don't want them to rule on the issue until Trump has won election for reasons too long to go into here.
At a minimum 5 or 6 of the justices want the natural born citizen clause to be obliterated so I don't want them ruling on it yet.
After Robert's it's a tax-it's a fee-it's a penalty and Kennedy's made up out of thin air - anal sex rights, I've no doubt that they would make every person on the face of the planet eligible.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 10:30 PM (xupNw)
475
"They love that they don't have to tackle the issue head on."
They love the erosion. This inch by inch. The dumbing down of the electorate. Saves them having to do the dirty work out in the open.
They love the erosion. This inch by inch. The dumbing down of the electorate. Saves them having to do the dirty work out in the open.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 16, 2015 10:34 PM (xupNw)
476
Old Hob: "Someone above quoted the 1790 law that stated children born of US citizens, as long as their father had also been a resident of the states, were natural born citizens. Cruz's and Obama's dads both lived in the US prior to their births. Both came from citizen moms. Am I wrong or missing something? "
The issue is that neither fathers were American Citizens.
Obama's claim that he was born in Hawaii makes him a 'natural born citizen' despite his dad being a non-citizen. The Dems desparate attempt to show he was born in Hawaii and not Canada/Kenya is because he wouldn't be a 'natural born citizen' if he was born in Kenya.
Same thing with Cruz, only he isn't trying to show he was born in the U.S. He is saying he was born in Kenya (Canada) and he doesn't care about the silly constitution when it comes to his greed.
The issue is that neither fathers were American Citizens.
Obama's claim that he was born in Hawaii makes him a 'natural born citizen' despite his dad being a non-citizen. The Dems desparate attempt to show he was born in Hawaii and not Canada/Kenya is because he wouldn't be a 'natural born citizen' if he was born in Kenya.
Same thing with Cruz, only he isn't trying to show he was born in the U.S. He is saying he was born in Kenya (Canada) and he doesn't care about the silly constitution when it comes to his greed.
Posted by: doug at August 17, 2015 11:02 AM (IYEs/)
477
"Obama's claim that he was born in Hawaii makes him a 'natural born citizen' despite his dad being a non-citizen."
This is wrong. Jus Solis Jus Sanguinis. The foreign fathers do disqualify them.
By the way the Naturalization Act of 1790 was repealed with the Naturalization Act of 1795 and by the Naturalization Act of 1798. Then came the Naturalization law of 1802. Then the 14th Amendment that "anchor babies" that the Supreme Court never explicitly ruled on.
No act of congress can override the Constitution. They need a Constitutional Amendment.
Different congresses tried at least 8 times to overthrow the natural born citizen clause but failed every time. EVERY SINGLE TIME THEY FAILED.
A natural born citizen has no need for any 'naturalization' act.
This is wrong. Jus Solis Jus Sanguinis. The foreign fathers do disqualify them.
By the way the Naturalization Act of 1790 was repealed with the Naturalization Act of 1795 and by the Naturalization Act of 1798. Then came the Naturalization law of 1802. Then the 14th Amendment that "anchor babies" that the Supreme Court never explicitly ruled on.
No act of congress can override the Constitution. They need a Constitutional Amendment.
Different congresses tried at least 8 times to overthrow the natural born citizen clause but failed every time. EVERY SINGLE TIME THEY FAILED.
A natural born citizen has no need for any 'naturalization' act.
Posted by: Misfortune & Pestilence at August 17, 2015 11:41 AM (jSTDs)
478
"Frankly, if I were Reince Priebus, when Trump started to gain traction I
would have gotten down on my knees and praised God with tears of joy
pouring from the corners of my eyes. Donald Trump could be the greatest
thing to happen to the Republican Party since Lincoln got a gleam in his
eye about slavery, but they're too dumb to recognize it. Stupid party
indeed."
Not stupid... Corrupt. To the bone and then some.
would have gotten down on my knees and praised God with tears of joy
pouring from the corners of my eyes. Donald Trump could be the greatest
thing to happen to the Republican Party since Lincoln got a gleam in his
eye about slavery, but they're too dumb to recognize it. Stupid party
indeed."
Not stupid... Corrupt. To the bone and then some.
Posted by: Dean Strong at August 17, 2015 07:42 PM (x18S2)
479
"Trump is doing the Republican Party the invaluable service of showing them what to focus on, and they are too inbread to see it."
Again, the GOPe is not inbred or stupid. They are corrupt and anti-middle-class (their not Marxists per se, but they share his hatred of the middle-class).
Again, the GOPe is not inbred or stupid. They are corrupt and anti-middle-class (their not Marxists per se, but they share his hatred of the middle-class).
Posted by: Dean Strong at August 17, 2015 07:47 PM (x18S2)
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