Thoughts On Netanyahu's Speech: Much Ado About Nothing

My overwhelming reaction to yesterday’s speech by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is, “that’s it?” Maybe part of my reaction is based on having seen only part of the speech on TV but having read the transcript. Delivery and the setting can give an average speech a much bigger feel, which was the whole point of inviting him to address Congress. But mostly, aside from a few up to date reference to the current negotiations, I’d heard it all before from him. Go back and watch or read any of Netanyahu’s speeches to the UN or AIPAC over the last few years and it’s basically there.

The problem is that while Netanyahu is right, it doesn’t matter.

Obama has proven to be impervious to outside pressure when he’s committed to doing something stupid and or dangerous, which is to say most of the time. If anything Netanyahu’s high profile challenge to him will probably make it more likely that Obama will see himself as doing the right thing.

But remember this isn’t just Obama. Sure the US is the big player here but which of the other members of the P5+1 group (the 5 permanent members of the UN Security Council plus Germany) is going to be any harder on Iran than Obama? The UK maybe. But France and Germany? And you can forget about Russia and China.

Netanyahu’s speech amounted to “get a better deal”. Well that’s not on the table. Not only will the Iranians not agree to a deal which in anyway makes it harder for them to get nukes, no one on the other side will force the issue. They are all looking for an off-ramp so they can say, “I hold in my hand a piece of paper….” And by God they’ll get that.

Unfortunately for Netanyahu, he isn’t dealing with Churchill/FDR, Reagan/Thostaer or Bush/Blair but Obama/Cameron/Merkel/ Hollande

And if Bibi is successful in killing the deal being worked out in its current form, then what? Do you really think we’ll return to the status quo ante sanctions regime? Let’s say I have…doubts.

Sean Davis of The Federalist posited on Twitter the idea that the real aim of the speech, or at least one of them, was to stiffen Democrats for a veto override vote for a tough US sanctions bill. Again, I have doubts about how effective that will be. The Democrats have been steadfast in their support for Obama. The idea that enough of them will undercut the President on such a major issue seems unlikely. In the House it would take about 45 Democrats to override. Nancy Pelosi seems to have her finger on the pulse of her caucus. If her contemptuous response to Netanyahu is any indication getting that many Democrats (in what’s essentially a liberal rump caucus) is going to be a very steep climb.

The only way I could see getting enough Democrats to throw Obama under the bus would be if Hillary Clinton strongly and loudly opposed the deal. That’s the only cover that would suffice. And she won’t. Why would she? Better to have it off the table and deal with it when she’s President that to pick this fight now. Remember, any opposition to a deal will be spun as “supporting war with Iran” by the left. Hillary is at best on thin ice with that crowd. There’s no reason to stir them up for no real gain. She’ll say weak sauce stuff about it, promise to be tough in monitoring it and promise to be Israel’s BFF and move on.

As shopworn as Netanyahu’s speech was he has the better of the argument. What he doesn’t have is anything resembling enough pull to implement them. His only real course of action is a unilateral attack by Israel. I honestly doubt that will be a real option should the P5+1 talks produce a deal.

The response by all parties, including the US, would be so costly to Israel. It would probably lead to the start of full recognition of “Palestine” by all parties, including the US. And then things will get really bad. At least for the rest of Obama’s term.

If the deal falls through Israel might be able to go it alone and not pay that high of a price or they may just wait him out and hope a Republican wins. But even if the next President is someone like GOP super-hawk Marco Rubio, it’s not like he’s going to launch an attack at 12:01pm on January 20th, 2017. He’ll have other things he’ll want to do first domestically (like amnesty!), and will have to at least try diplomacy. So you’re looking at another year or so beyond that.

We need to face a rather obvious fact…Iran wants a nuke and they won’t stop until they have one. We can’t negotiate them out of that because we simply don’t have anything they want more to offer them in exchange. They’ll bet, correctly, that once they have it they are safe and we’ll do business with them because reality will force us to.

Netanyahu was right and has been for a while but the last best chance to stop Iran from going nuclear died with the fraudulent NIE in 2007. Once Bush’s hands were tied and Obama was elected, the die was cast. The rest is just killing time until the inevitable.

Posted by: DrewM. at 12:06 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 I will get the others

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:08 PM (l1zOH)

2 Agreed. Wasted breath.

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at March 04, 2015 12:08 PM (VcOqI)

3 And, I'm still pushing for "Hillary's Morning Dump"

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at March 04, 2015 12:09 PM (VcOqI)

4 The last refuge of chickenshit dictators.

Posted by: Boss Moss at March 04, 2015 12:09 PM (UZBFV)

5 Well it was worth it to see the Dems heads exploding yesterday...

Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:09 PM (Bn6aD)

6 He should have given the speech at a three ring circus...and he did.

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at March 04, 2015 12:10 PM (VcOqI)

7 I'll eat some Black Diamond almonds along with my super beets.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at March 04, 2015 12:10 PM (W5DcG)

8 Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:09 PM (Bn6aD)

Yep.

Posted by: thathalfrican at March 04, 2015 12:11 PM (0uVPd)

9 I think Richard Fernandez's take is spot on (read the whole thing):

"Netanyahu didn't come there to get something from Obama because he knows
the president will give him nothing. And besides the cupboard, truth
be told, is probably bare. He came for old time's sake; with a sadness
in his heart that Nancy Pelosi couldn't even begin to imagine; with the
kind of grief that comes from seeing something once beautiful and
powerful now broken down and grubbing at the level of the petty,
malicious, lying politicians who dominate it. He came to warn anyone who
would listen to wake up, though his words were doubtless wasted on the
sleeping."

The world has already figured out that they need not involve America in their foreign policy decision or count on their assistance.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:11 PM (lHHyw)

10 And, I'm still pushing for "Hillary's Morning Dump"
Posted by: Fourth Virginia

So am I. Care to contribute?

Posted by: Hilary at March 04, 2015 12:11 PM (b7GF2)

11 Expecting Iran to honor an agreement on a piece of paper is like expecting criminals to honor a sign that says "Gun Free Zone." In both cases, if you plan to come out of it alive, you'd best be packing.

Posted by: Keith Arnold at March 04, 2015 12:11 PM (iIzG7)

12
There's no way to delay
That trouble coming every day
No way to delay
More trouble coming every day

-Frank Zappa

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:11 PM (1Y+hH)

13 "Israel can defend itself." Sadly, it will have to.

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at March 04, 2015 12:12 PM (VcOqI)

14 Superhawk Marco Rubio.

Bwahahahahahahahaha

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:12 PM (rIQuo)

15 What we need is a President with the willingness to doom a region and bluff UN while nuking Iran.

Since we only have weak sisters who will doom us for the possibility of someone saying something nice over dinner, we're going to die in thermonuclear fire. All of us.

Because somehow pussies get votes.

Posted by: Inspector Cussword at March 04, 2015 12:12 PM (scgac)

16 >>Well it was worth it to see the Dems heads exploding yesterday...

Heh, YES.

"But, but, but what do you mean the emperor has no clothes? HATER!!!"

Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:13 PM (lHHyw)

17 I'm afraid I have to agree. The Democrats in Congress and in the White House are a bunch of anti-Semitic, petulant, cowardly little cocksuckers, and I fully expect them to act in a manner consistent with their demonstrated character.

Posted by: Insomniac at March 04, 2015 12:13 PM (2Ojst)

18 The important thing is that the speech and Boehner's "heroic standing up to Obama" over the speech provided political cover for the cave-in on amnesty.

Would not be terribly surprised to find that the whole charade was orchestrated by both sides.

Also, the Republican obsession with Israel and Jews in general is as weird, unhealthy, and as big as a distraction from actual pressing domestic issues as any fetish of the Left's--including climate change.

Posted by: slacks so dressy at March 04, 2015 12:13 PM (cdUfw)

19 Islamic nuclear arms race starts in 3...2...1...

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:13 PM (C278+)

20 But even if the next President is someone like GOP super-hawk Marco Rubio, it's not like he's going to launch an attack at 12:01pm on January 20th, 2017. He'll have other things he'll want to do first domestically (like amnesty!), and will have to at least try diplomacy.

Posted by: DrewM. at 12:06 PM
---
In current politics there is nothing more stunning to me than the number of people who are willing to forgive that treacherous, sleazy liar.

Should Teh JEB implode, because the weight of his name and love handles proved too much, the GOPe will move heaven and hell to make Rubio president.

Posted by: Elize Nayden at March 04, 2015 12:14 PM (YTmae)

21 With TFG it's all about effort and his name being placed on the product. It doesn't matter if the product is a shit sandwich. Ala ObamaCare.

He has to have a foreign policy achievement. A peace plan with Iran is his goal. Doesn't matter that this is another shit sandwich.

The democrats in congress are so predictable. If the speech differs than their president the messenger must be crucified.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:14 PM (l1zOH)

22 Aw, man, I love it when we get a bonus guest-DOOM post.

Seriously, though, I wonder how far along the Iranians are. I've been reading that they're pretty close for a long time. Maybe they're further away or slower than expected, maybe they've almost got it. I don't think that we have any kind of certainty.

Posted by: Lance McCormick at March 04, 2015 12:14 PM (vRPjT)

23 Also, the Republican obsession with Israel and Jews in general is as weird, unhealthy, and as big as a distraction from actual pressing domestic issues as any fetish of the Left's--including climate change.
Posted by: slacks so dressy

Oh great, Stormfront in the house?

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (1Y+hH)

24 Gee that was a lot of words used to say"it's hopeless and futile, there's nothing to be done".

Posted by: Kraken at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (5+mPY)

25 23 Also, the Republican obsession with Israel and Jews in general is as weird, unhealthy, and as big as a distraction from actual pressing domestic issues as any fetish of the Left's--including climate change.
Posted by: slacks so dressy

WTF?

Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (Bn6aD)

26 Oh great, Stormfront in the house?
Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (1Y+hH)

Could be a Ronulan.

Posted by: Insomniac at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (2Ojst)

27 22
I've hear estimates as early as the end of the year.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (C278+)

28 You give Pelosi too much credit.

She hasn't even got a finger on the pulse of reality, let alone her caucus.

Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (FGkrV)

29 Interesting how I think that supporting our only remaining ally in the ME is an "obsession". Using such a word might be seen as part of an orchestrated effort.

Posted by: bullshit so dressy at March 04, 2015 12:16 PM (b7GF2)

30
Shopworn?

Drew, this was one of the most impressive speeches I've heard.

That aside, we all know Obama will not be moved. The speech was to put SCOAMF and Iran on record that come what may, they will not be allowed to get the bomb, even if Israel must act alone.

Give it a listen, dude.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:16 PM (CMkNk)

31 And, I'm still pushing for "Hillary's Morning Dump"
Posted by: Fourth Virginia

I thought Hildabeast was supposed to push.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:16 PM (rIQuo)

32 "the last best chance to stop Iran from going nuclear died with the fraudulent NIE in 2007."

Yep. I read they were really congratulating themselves over that one - even had coins minted: No Core - No War.

Posted by: JPS at March 04, 2015 12:16 PM (5/9ON)

33 She hasn't even got a finger on the pulse of reality, let alone her caucus.

Ewww...

Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:16 PM (Bn6aD)

34 Posted by: slacks so dressy at March 04, 2015 12:13 PM (cdUfw) --- Yep. In the end, this really won't help Israel or the US, except in an "I told you so," argument. I don't really get what the point of the speech was, besides theater.

Posted by: Baldy at March 04, 2015 12:16 PM (+35FH)

35 #31 I thought I'd lead by example.

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at March 04, 2015 12:16 PM (VcOqI)

36 Doesn't a deal require ratification by the Senate? And if so, isn't that at whom the speech was aimed?

Posted by: bkeyser at March 04, 2015 12:17 PM (dG7DS)

37 I think the Iranians are close to the bomb than we know or expect.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:17 PM (l1zOH)

38 And, I'm still pushing for "Hillary's Morning Dump"
Posted by: Fourth Virginia

I'm pushin' for Barry's.

Posted by: Reggie Love at March 04, 2015 12:17 PM (h4vJk)

39 Oh great, Stormfront in the house?
Posted by: Meremortal

Could be a Ronulan.
Posted by: Insomniac

Hector's mom.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:17 PM (rIQuo)

40 36 Doesn't a deal require ratification by the Senate? And if so, isn't that at whom the speech was aimed?
Posted by: bkeyser at March 04, 2015 12:17 PM (dG7DS)

Executive order. It will be called "an agreement" and not a treaty.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (CMkNk)

41 Actually it was a fantastic speech and it made obama look small and petty as We all know He is.... That's enough for me...

Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (Bn6aD)

42 Gotta agree with you, Drew.

They are hell-bent on getting nukes, and they will do it one way or another.

But.. I disagree with the response should Israel go it alone. Surgical strikes with conventional weapons on nuclear facilities will be rebuked, but no long-lasting effects would come of it.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (4+IgA)

43 Bibi knows there won't be a better deal. He's preparing the ground for what Israel's going to do about Iran.

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (SCcgT)

44 30
"if Israel has to stand alone it will stand"

love that line.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (C278+)

45 Anyone who believes that Israel will stand passively while Iran goes nuclear is just as deluded as the current policy.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (659DL)

46 Could be a Ronulan. Posted by: Insomniac Hector's mom.
Posted by: rickb223

How dare you take notice of my heros' clapping.

Posted by: bullshit so dressy at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (b7GF2)

47 37 I think the Iranians are close to the bomb than we know or expect.
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:17 PM (l1zOH)

Hopefully they get too close and it goes kaboom.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (CMkNk)

48 Also, the Republican obsession with Israel and Jews in general is as weird, unhealthy, and as big as a distraction ...

Go fuck yourself with a copy of Mein Kampf you goosestepping little prick.

Israel is the ONLY free nation in the Middle East - all the rest are slaver states in which every slope-browed neo-Hitlerite could feel just fine, since they are based on the consumption and sale of humanity.

Did I recommend you fucking yourself with a dagger? Because you should do that too.

Posted by: Inspector Cussword at March 04, 2015 12:19 PM (scgac)

49 I just sent John Kerry a black umbrella.

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at March 04, 2015 12:19 PM (VcOqI)

50 They're showing up early this campaign season.

Terrific.

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:19 PM (1Y+hH)

51 In tens of thousands, the victims of the Italian mustard gas fell. It is in
order to denounce to the civilized world the tortures inflicted upon the Ethiopian people
that I resolved to come to Geneva. None other than myself and my brave companions in arms
could bring the League of Nations the undeniable proof. The appeals of my delegates
addressed to the League of Nations had remained without any answer; my delegates had not
been witnesses. That is why I decided to come myself to bear witness against the crime
perpetrated against my people and give Europe a warning of the doom that awaits it, if it
should bow before the accomplished fact.-

Posted by: Late Great League of Nations at March 04, 2015 12:19 PM (Yuxip)

52 please someone stomp this post.

Posted by: BlackOrchidPhotobomb at March 04, 2015 12:19 PM (mJUSR)

53 please someone stomp this post.

Too much doom?

Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM (Bn6aD)

54 The fact that the pesky Jooooooooooooooos are getting some positive press in arab countires is more than theater. We may see gulf states working with Israel.

And JEF will then lie and take credit for it.

Posted by: Blue Hen at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM (b7GF2)

55 First, I think you should view the speech - Bibi's passion and delivery are so great.

Second, it didn't have to be anything new, the impact was in the way he put all of what is known together, laying out exactly what road Obama is taking us down in very simple language.

No nuance, no massaging facts to imply things that are not true, just a coherent, effective truth bomb that Obama and the Dems have refused to acknowledge.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM (lHHyw)

56 26 Oh great, Stormfront in the house?
Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (1Y+hH)

Could be a Ronulan.
Posted by: Insomniac at March 04, 2015 12:15 PM (2Ojst)

The Venn Diagram for those two categories would look like my squeekhole.

The smell would be similar as well.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM (cSU3r)

57 51 Posted by: Late Great League of Nations at March 04, 2015 12:19 PM (Yuxip)

That's highly Selassie of you.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM (CMkNk)

58 36 Doesn't a deal require ratification by the Senate? And if so, isn't that at whom the speech was aimed?
Posted by: bkeyser at March 04, 2015 12:17 PM (dG7D

I do not recall specifically, but I did hear and read something to the effect that the JEF doesn't believe he needs congressional approval. Jeez, what a freaking surprise.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:21 PM (l1zOH)

59 43 Bibi knows there won't be a better deal. He's preparing the ground for what Israel's going to do about Iran.
Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (SCcgT)

THIS. Tragically, this.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:21 PM (CMkNk)

60 Damn, Drew, you are the most negative person I've come across in a while. You know, they have medications that can help with your feelings of hopelessness.

Posted by: adolfo_velasquez at March 04, 2015 12:21 PM (DkXQB)

61 That's highly Selassie of you.
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM

Well played.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at March 04, 2015 12:21 PM (h4vJk)

62 53 please someone stomp this post.

Too much doom?
Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM (Bn6aD)

Yes, the use of a lot of space by someone who is overthinking the subject, with a bias towards negativity.

Posted by: Kraken at March 04, 2015 12:22 PM (5+mPY)

63 54 The fact that the pesky Jooooooooooooooos are getting some positive press in arab countires is more than theater. We may see gulf states working with Israel---------

And I will win the lottery and my shit will smell like lilacs.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:22 PM (l1zOH)

64 Executive order. It will be called "an agreement" and not a treaty.

EO "Exploration Of Agreement"

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:22 PM (rIQuo)

65
Really?

Netanyahu is the only leader so far to publicly condemn obama's stupid Iran nuclear amnesty for what it is: a pathway for Iranian nukes.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:22 PM (omuEe)

66 DrewM,

I am unsure that Israel is willing to tolerate an Iranian bomb.

Yes, the fallout will be devastating to Israel if she attacks Iran. Hezbollah and the psychos in Gaza will launch simultaneous attacks on Israel's borders, complete with missile and rocket fire on her cities. Iran will also launch its own missiles (thankfully not nuclear tipped), and the people of Israel will suffer significant casualties. The army too will suffer under its rules of engagement.

But the alternative is unspeakable. Iron Dome is not perfect, and Israel requires perfection in any defense against a nuclear attack.

Israel must attack before Iran has a functioning nuclear device. The speech was simply a notification to the world that Israel will go it alone if necessary.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:23 PM (Zu3d9)

67 60 Damn, Drew, you are the most negative person I've come across in a while-------

I prefer the term, Realist.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:23 PM (l1zOH)

68 54 The fact that the pesky Jooooooooooooooos are getting some positive press in arab countires is more than theater. We may see gulf states working with Israel.

And JEF will then lie and take credit for it.
Posted by: Blue Hen at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM (b7GF2)

I would not doubt that the Saudi Air Force and perhaps Jordan might clandestinely fly missions or at least fly some sort of support. It's a short hop across the Persian Gulf and it would have been a short hop from Azerbaijan had not the State Dept. spilled the beans on that.

Question: Will SCOAMF suddenly join in with USAF air strikes on Iran if they are seen to be working?

Doubt it.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:24 PM (CMkNk)

69 You know, this is the one thing I will never forgive Bush for. A) for attacking Iraq instead of Iran (immediately after 9/11 either country could have been attacked) and B) for sitting passively while made-in-Iran IEDs were taking out American troops. Seriously. The moment the Pentagon confirmed their origin, we should have lobbed cruise missiles at Revolutionary Guard bases all over the fucking country. That we didn't was inexcusable

Posted by: Danny Donkey at March 04, 2015 12:24 PM (l0rQA)

70
We need to face a rather obvious fact: Iran wants a nuke and they won't stop until they have one.

--

And once they have one they will use it.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at March 04, 2015 12:24 PM (20Zla)

71 54
Israel and KSA have been having below radar meetings for years about Iran. Rumor is over flight of KSA territory has been talked about and possible refueling.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:24 PM (C278+)

72 Barack Obama is a SCOAMT.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - TrueCon at March 04, 2015 12:25 PM (kff5f)

73 Mohammedanism is an evil death cult.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - TrueCon at March 04, 2015 12:25 PM (kff5f)

74 "Also, the Republican obsession with American founding principles and freedom in general is as weird, unhealthy, and as big as a distraction ..."

I may have added something there...

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:25 PM (1Y+hH)

75 Excerpt from Pres. WeirdDave's Feb. 2017 first foreign policy speech.

"Since the previous administration tragically allowed the terrorist nation of Iraen to acquire nuclear weapons, my first act as President has been to order the USS Maryland to put to sea with all 24 of her Trident II missiles targeted on (list of Iranian targets). Maryland will be a relieved on patrol by other Ohio class vessels so that such targeting always remains available at a moments notice. Should any US, Israeli, or Allied nation be attacked with nuclear weapons, all 24 Trident IIs will be launched immediately."

Posted by: Weirddave at March 04, 2015 12:25 PM (WvS3w)

76 57 51 Posted by: Late Great League of Nations at March 04, 2015 12:19 PM (Yuxip)

That's highly Selassie of you.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:20 PM (CMkNk)

Oh, there's Sefton. Haile, Haile, the gang's all here.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at March 04, 2015 12:25 PM (cSU3r)

77 Oh... I get it...

When the deck is stacked against you, do nothing.

Good strategy.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at March 04, 2015 12:25 PM (BZAd3)

78 But his speech was very well delivered.

I've said it before and I'll say it again -- Netanyahu gets a lot of points for style. He's a great orator.

But yes, he's pissing in to the wind right now.

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (AkOaV)

79 The Jews pretty much despise Christian Cons. They only use us when it is time to agitate for action against their enemies. In reality Bibi and Obama are not that far apart ideologically. The Jews in the US are rabid left-wingers who don't seem to care one whit what happens to their homeland.

Given I have no representation in government and our own nation is being destroyed from within, I am wondering why I should fret about Israel. I would be more than happy to have Israelis come here for safety but down the road it's hard to imagine Israel itself surviving. Particularly if this nation keeps electing Democrap presidents..

Posted by: Chris Vaughn at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (Bcqod)

80 Isn't this usually where Hector reminds us that the real enemy is Iran and not ISIS or something?

Wonder why he's gone silent on that?

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (659DL)

81 We need to face a rather obvious fact: Iran wants a nuke and they won't stop until they have one.

--

And once they have one they will use it

Glass their ass.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (rIQuo)

82 Posted by: slacks so dressy at March 04, 2015 12:13 PM (cdUfw)

Damned straight!

Those pesky Jews should line up for the gas chambers next time, and stop this senseless warmongering.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo...Anti-Semite at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (Zu3d9)

83
EMP airbursts over Iranian targets?

That would take the country down, let alone the nuke program.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (CMkNk)

84 I think the speech was very good, but toned down not to offend The One's cult following. The democrats obviously thought it was good, they went ballistic after the speech.

I agree the speech was to firm up democrat support AND remember, he made a subtle threat that Israel would act if the US didn't.

That was not missed by those paying attention.

Posted by: Nip Sip at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (0FSuD)

85 Israel and KSA have been having below radar meetings for years about Iran. Rumor is over flight of KSA territory has been talked about and possible refueling.
Posted by: wrg500

Does the IDF have air-to-air refueling capability? I suppose that they never really had a need for it.

Posted by: Blue Hen at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (b7GF2)

86 Iran is to Honesty as The GOP is to fighting Obama.

Posted by: buzzion at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (zt+N6)

87 36 Doesn't a deal require ratification by the Senate?

Posted by: bkeyser at March 04, 2015 12:17 PM (dG7DS)

Bwahahahahahahahahahaha

Posted by: B. Obama at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (fO0en)

88 I loved the part where Bibi evoked Moses and the fcuking Libs went all stabby and shit.

Posted by: Fritz at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (UzPAd)

89
Drew, pretty much, yes.

Except I doubt your stark depiction of Israel's lack of choices here is correct. Bibi's point about existential threat is real. If Bibi's re-elected, there's every chance Israel will risk all you talk about to take action. And the existence ofa toothless P-5 deal is not material to Israeli calculations on THIS one.

Besides which, I don't think the reaction to an Israeli strike would be as you describe. The Arab world this time will barely conceal its relief and joy (and perhaps barely conceal its cooperation in the operation).

The idiot regime in the US might try something spectacular, but that will be limited by Congress and the time they have left.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (afQnV)

90
The Republicans' position on Israel is the ONLY foreign policy issue on which I agree with them.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (omuEe)

91 Someone needed to say this - and no one in the GOPe has the nads to be this, er--impolite and offensive to the sensibilities of the Obama fluffers in the MSM:

"Today the Jewish people face another attempt
by yet another Persian potentate to destroy us. Iran's Supreme Leader
Ayatollah Khamenei spews the oldest hatred, the oldest hatred of
anti-Semitism with the newest technology. He tweets that Israel must be
annihilated --- he tweets. You know, in Iran, there isn't exactly free
Internet. But he tweets in English that Israel must be destroyed.
For those who believe that Iran threatens the
Jewish state, but not the Jewish people, listen to Hassan Nasrallah, the
leader of Hezbollah, Iran's chief terrorist proxy. He said: If all the
Jews gather in Israel, it will save us the trouble of chasing them down
around the world."
Gosh, that sounds --- extreme. Didn't we just have several days of Obama lecturing us about how Muslims are peaceful and earlier, that we Christians need to get off our high horse because Crusades?How dare Netanyahu question the narrative. Especially when the GOPe won't.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (lHHyw)

92 Obama doesn't need congressional approval.

...Because he's half black.

Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (FGkrV)

93 I don't know if Israel can clean out that nest in Iran alone.

As Mark Levin said Bibi is now the leader of the free world. I tend to agree, leading from his behind shows Obama isn't that leader.

Posted by: Bob from table9 at March 04, 2015 12:28 PM (WNERA)

94 That would take the country down, let alone the nuke program.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (CMkNk)

Oh, we don't want to be the ones starting the EMP game. We, as a society, are probably least equipped to handle a power outage of anyone else on earth.

Could you imagine the rioting when the EBT cards and iPhones stop working?

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:28 PM (AkOaV)

95 Finally, we've located Iraqs's WMD's: They've been in Iran the whole f-ing time!

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at March 04, 2015 12:28 PM (VcOqI)

96 If I were Israel, and I seriously believed that the US (and other allies) were going to let Iran go nuke, I'd strike Iran tomorrow, damn the consequences.

MAD works when all the actors are rational. Thus far, everyone in the nuke club (except for the Norks, who can't even successfully hit the ocean with a missile) have proven rational.

Iran would expressly *not* be rational. They subscribe to the same apocalyptic vision ISIS does, so they would be *glad* to get into a nuclear exchange.

As such, it is paramount to Israel's safety (and the rest of the world's, too) that Iran never acquire nuclear weapons.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - TrueCon at March 04, 2015 12:28 PM (kff5f)

97 79 Posted by: Chris Vaughn at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (Bcqod)

Please refrain from lumping every American Jew into the leftist category. When you do that, you can rethink your post.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:28 PM (CMkNk)

98
In fact, Israel is the only issue that the Republicans and I share.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:28 PM (omuEe)

99 In Iran if the power goes out for a week... that's not that abnormal, people are used to it.

Like when we hacked the Norks internet connections. 90% of the country probably didn't even notice. "Oh shit, we had internet? I wouldn't know since I only get electricity for 4 hours a week"

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:29 PM (AkOaV)

100 Does the IDF have air-to-air refueling capability?

Yes.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 04, 2015 12:29 PM (659DL)

101 Folks, please listen. Do not worry about the destruction of Israel; it will not happen. It cannot happen. The Lord has said so, and He does not lie. If this be the Apocalypse, that is a very good thing.

Israel will never be destroyed or scattered again. It will endure until the End Times, when all the world will turn against her and her back will be to a rapidly-crumbling wall. That is when the Lord will return.

This is not a cause for worry. This is a cause for reflection and thankfulness. Israel fears for her safety because she does not, on the whole, believe the Scripture that says she won't be destroyed again, but Scripture can and must be trusted. If this really is "the end" for Israel, that means that it is actually The End for all others who hate her. o.0 Do not be alarmed or distraught; trust in the Lord.

And on a very bright and sunny note, if this is the Apocalypse, then we don't have to worry about unfunded debt any longer. o.0

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at March 04, 2015 12:29 PM (9LuAk)

102 #92 Then, at least half of Congress?

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at March 04, 2015 12:29 PM (VcOqI)

103 I think that joooooooooos hate us and ar eno different than JEF. That's why JEF turned on the hate and why dems boycotted the speech....Because they are no different.
God this straightjacket makes it hard to type.

Posted by: Chris the christ con at March 04, 2015 12:29 PM (b7GF2)

104 Does the IDF have air-to-air refueling capability? I suppose that they never really had a need for it.

Posted by: Blue Hen at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (b7GF2)

Yes.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:30 PM (Zu3d9)

105 Gosh, that sounds --- extreme. Didn't we just have several days of Obama lecturing us about how Muslims are peaceful and earlier, that we Christians need to get off our high horse because Crusades?

Someone to be fetching my trusty steed, Quantrill, please.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:30 PM (rIQuo)

106
Given I have no representation in government and our own nation is being destroyed from within, I am wondering why I should fret about Israel.
Posted by: Chris Vaughn

Don't fret. Kill yourself now. It's easier.

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:30 PM (1Y+hH)

107 Does the IDF have air-to-air refueling capability? I suppose that they never really had a need for it

I believe the do to a limited extent, but it would have to be augmented for a flight of this length. Down the Red Sea, across KSA, deep into Iran and back? Long mission for the IDF.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:30 PM (C278+)

108 Why didn't he mention his Patriarch Cain?

Posted by: Boss Moss at March 04, 2015 12:30 PM (UZBFV)

109 82 Posted by: slacks so dressy at March 04, 2015 12:13 PM (cdUfw)

Damned straight!

Those pesky Jews should line up for the gas chambers next time, and stop this senseless warmongering.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo...Anti-Semite at March 04, 2015

Leave the Joos alone, just take the JINOs

I keed, I keed.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:31 PM (l1zOH)

110 Iran would expressly *not* be rational. They subscribe to the same apocalyptic vision ISIS does, so they would be *glad* to get into a nuclear exchange.

As such, it is paramount to Israel's safety (and the rest of the world's, too) that Iran never acquire nuclear weapons.
Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - TrueCon at March 04, 2015 12:28 PM (kff5f)

Not to be nitpicky, but it's a different apocalyptic vision. The Sunnis think the Shias are nuts to believe that the hidden imam is living in a well in Iran.

Their shit is just as nuts, but in a different way. They foresee a battle starting in the Levant and ending at Al Quds in which Jesus comes to save them from the devil (who comes from Iran, actually) and, you know, utopia.

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:31 PM (AkOaV)

111
The constitutional question about treaty vs. other form of agreement, and the Senate's role, is not a new one. Not one of the many outrageous arrogant bits of lawlessness the regime has attacked our system with.

And - surprise! - there's no reason to think that the regime can't just sign it as a Memo of Understanding or some such and get away with it. It won't be outside the mainstream of executive/congressional tug of war over foreign policy powers since the founding.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 12:31 PM (afQnV)

112 I expect to see something of a coalition between Egypt,Jordan and Israel. The gulf states and the KSA don't want Iran or IS in their backyard.

Posted by: Ben Had at March 04, 2015 12:31 PM (P/jRF)

113 Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:30 PM (C278+)

They'd have to pass over a lot of ... unfriendly territory for that one. Easiest path by far is across iraq.

Think we'd really shoot them down? Do we even still have the ability to defend the airspace about Iraq?

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (AkOaV)

114 When the deck is stacked against you, do nothing.

Good strategy.

---

You've got to know when to--oh, I give up.

Posted by: Kenny Rogers at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (VAsIq)

115 You forgot

Israel is working very closely with their arab neighbors who would love them to take care of this for them

France is only concerned about French oil concerns. They are not ideologues. If their oil interests are safe they will follow.

The real threat to Israel is to its economy through divestment

Posted by: ThunderB, Shapeshifter at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (zOTsN)

116 my trusty steed, Quantrill, please.

Posted by: rickb223

Nice name for a high horse.

Plannin' some rampagin', friend?

Posted by: Moderate Salami at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (/Ho8c)

117 >>Posted by: Chris Vaughn at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (Bcqod)

Damn, the Paulians and Stormfrontera are out in full force this afternoon.

Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (FGkrV)

118 88
I loved the part where Bibi evoked Moses and the fcuking Libs went all stabby and shit.

Posted by: Fritz at March 04, 2015 12:27 PM (UzPAd)

Yeah, what's a Jew's painting doing in Congress?

Posted by: Free Palistine at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (0FSuD)

119 Iran is just another bunch of barbary pirates. We've been fighting these fcuking ragheads for centuries. Until someone lays a complete and final smackdown on them up to and including a total destruction/discounting of mohammedism, we'll have to keep fighting them around the edges for centuries more.

Posted by: Retard Strength Trumps Smart Power at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (27KAF)

120 Given I have no representation in government and our own nation is being destroyed from within, I am wondering why I should fret about Israel.
Posted by: Chris Vaughn

Don't fret. Kill yourself now. It's easier.
Posted by: Meremortal

Seconded. Can we get a voice vote? All in favor say "aye".

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (rIQuo)

121 Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:31 PM (AkOaV)

Fair enough. Consider my post amended to "Iran is just as apocalyptic in vision as ISIS."

Better?

The rest of the point stands.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - TrueCon at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (kff5f)

122 They will get the bomb, soon.

Can we just make sure they don't use it?

I'm way less worried about them using it then say NK.

Posted by: HoboJerk, The State Loves You at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (FA3Z7)

123 He had to try and I think it helps him domestically for his upcoming election in 2 weeks.

I'm glad he did it, it really shines a light on the anti-Israel sentiment that is obvious among the modern Democrat Party.

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (LXs8j)

124 96...... Iran would expressly *not* be rational. They subscribe to the same apocalyptic vision ISIS does, so they would be *glad* to get into a nuclear exchange----------

The old enemy of my enemy trick.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (l1zOH)

125 "
MAD works when all the actors are rational. Thus far, everyone in the nuke club (except for the Norks, who can't even successfully hit the ocean with a missile) have proven rational.
"

Yes, and some idiot lefty made the stupid "point" yesterday that Iran wouldn't dare nuke Israel because the know doing so would invite massive retaliation.

I wanted to yell at my computer "NO SHIT IDIOT. THAT'S WHAT THEY FUCKING WANT."

But I didn't. Because that would be crazy.

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (MYCIw)

126 112
None of the Arab state want Iran to have the bomb. Everyone of them are in danger from a nuclear Iran.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (C278+)

127 Khamenei said, and he is right, that Israel is a one bomb country.

That should say everything there is about Iran's intentions.

For Israel, Iran with the bomb is unacceptable. It should be unacceptable for the rest of the world, just like it should have been unacceptable for Russia to annex Crimea or for Russia to carve off more of Ukraine, or for Assad to destroy his entire country to keep it. But right now, what should be unacceptable to the world, isn't. And that is why the light at the end of the tunnel keeps looking more and more ominous.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (BZAd3)

128 115 The real threat to Israel is to its economy through divestment
Posted by: ThunderB, Shapeshifter at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (zOTsN)

The natural gas field in the Mediterranean now looms very large. If Israel can undercut Putin, we'll see if Joo hatred trumps cheap and available energy.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (CMkNk)

129 Don't forget, Israel has discovered a shit load of oil and gas in the Med Sea.

That's got to help them

Posted by: Nip Sip at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (0FSuD)

130 Posted by: Kinley Ardal at March 04, 2015 12:29 PM (9LuAk)

Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side

Posted by: han solo at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (AkOaV)

131 What does Israel have to lose ? Everything. Would you rather die standing and fighting or cowering and waiting ?

I also wonder how Israel's modern military would do against the countries it would face ?

Posted by: The Jackhole somewhere on Ventura Highway at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (dULJN)

132 >>Given I have no representation in government and our own nation is being
destroyed from within, I am wondering why I should fret about Israel.

I know you're a troll, but I don't mind repeating what Bibi said because I'm sure it annoys you:

"But Iran's regime is not merely a Jewish problem, any more than the Nazi
regime was merely a Jewish problem. The 6 million Jews murdered by the
Nazis were but a fraction of the 60 million people killed in World War
II. So, too, Iran's regime poses a grave threat, not only to Israel, but
also the peace of the entire world."

If you think they'll stop after destroying Israel you're a bigger idiot thatn you've already demonstrated, and you haven't been paying attention to ALL of the terrorism they've been sponsoring around the world.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (lHHyw)

133 Given I have no representation in government and our own nation is being destroyed from within, I am wondering why I should fret about Israel. Posted by: Chris Vaughn Don't fret. Kill yourself now. It's easier. Posted by: Meremortal Seconded. Can we get a voice vote? All in favor say "aye".
Posted by: rickb223

Aye! With a pineapple!

Posted by: AoSHQ Welcome committee at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (b7GF2)

134 >>> I tend to agree, leading from his behind shows Obama isn't that leader.
<<<

Barry missed Bibi's speech because he was busy doing research on his March Madness Brackets. You know, the important shit.

Posted by: Fritz at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (UzPAd)

135 Nice name for a high horse.

Plannin' some rampagin', friend?

If need be.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (rIQuo)

136 The speech was as much for internal Israeli public consumption as a warning that Israel is prepared to act alone.

Bibi is facing a tough re-election and this is what Statesmen do, they operate on the world stage.

Hope he is re-elected but that's not a certainty.

Posted by: Kreplach at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (IlUbl)

137 The Jews pretty much despise Christian Cons. They
only use us when it is time to agitate for action against their enemies.

Posted by: Chris Vaughn at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (Bcqod)

Based on your vast knowledge of and experience with Jews?

Which Jews? American? European? Israelis? Modern Orthodox? Assimilated?

Your blather is embarrassing. Learn something, before you spout gibberish again.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (Zu3d9)

138 Iran like to farm out their destruction.

Will they use the bomb? Or will they give suitcase nukes to terrorists in their employ?

More worried about the latter

Posted by: ThunderB, Shapeshifter at March 04, 2015 12:35 PM (zOTsN)

139 Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - TrueCon at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (kff5f)

Perfect!

And yes, your point does stand. Iran is clearly not a "rational actor" to our way of thinking.

To 7th century death cult way of thinking, they definitely have their heads on straight though!

Posted by: han solo at March 04, 2015 12:35 PM (AkOaV)

140 131 What does Israel have to lose ? Everything. Would you rather die standing and fighting or cowering and waiting ?

I also wonder how Israel's modern military would do against the countries it would face ?
Posted by: The Jackhole somewhere on Ventura Highway at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (dULJN)

Considering its small size, I imagine that Israel is a master of asymmetrical warfare.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:35 PM (CMkNk)

141 Think we'd really shoot them down? Do we even still have the ability to defend the airspace about Iraq?
Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:32 PM (AkOaV)

1) Yes
2) Yes

If The O wants something bad enough he goes all out. How dare this Joo screw with his vision. Sadly my Yes answers are my convictions.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (l1zOH)

142
The whole idea of allowing Iran nukes for 'peaceful purposes' is so patently absurd it should insult everyone.

What's more, the idea that obama is some naive peacenik who wants to believe Iran deserves a chance is an even bigger insult.

obama knows exactly who Iran is, just like he knows who Cuba is. obama hatched this evil plan for all the wrong reasons.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (omuEe)

143 Posted by: han solo at March 04, 2015 12:35 PM (AkOaV)
oops, ahem, please excuse the sock

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (AkOaV)

144 Barry missed Bibi's speech because he was busy doing research on his March Madness Brackets. You know, the important shit.

But He couldn't pass up the opportunity to make some snide remarks about it...

Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (Bn6aD)

145 123 He had to try and I think it helps him domestically for his upcoming election in 2 weeks.

I'm glad he did it, it really shines a light on the anti-Israel sentiment that is obvious among the modern Democrat Party.

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (LXs8j)

My view, the speech was just crossing t's and dotting i's, being totally upfront with a former ally on a big stage. We have been informed, and our inactivity in the future now has no cover.

Posted by: Kraken at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (5+mPY)

146 TheBlazeNOW @TheBlazeNOW
WASHINGTON (@AP) -- Justice Dept won't charge former Ferguson, Mo., policeman Darren Wilson in Michael Brown death.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (ZPrif)

147 137 Your blather is embarrassing. Learn something, before you spout gibberish again.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (Zu3d9)

Forget it. His arm band is too tightly wrapped around his head.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (CMkNk)

148 79
The Jews pretty much despise Christian Cons.

Posted by: Chris Vaughn

I actually think this statement is pretty accurate as to why Jews vote Democrat despite the fact the Left basically wants to see Israel wiped off the map.

The GOP is seen as the "Christian" Party.

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (LXs8j)

149 And, I'm still pushing for "Hillary's Morning Dump"

That was done on a private toilet and is not for public viewing.

Posted by: ghost of hallelujah at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (7RXcs)

150 Yes, and some idiot lefty made the stupid "point" yesterday that Iran wouldn't dare nuke Israel because the know doing so would invite massive retaliation.

I wanted to yell at my computer "NO SHIT IDIOT. THAT'S WHAT THEY FUCKING WANT."

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:33 PM (MYCIw)

Yeah, but really? Who would retaliate? Obama? Hillary? Liz Warren? Jeb Bush?

I'm not convinced they'd do much more than send sternly worded letters and impose some nominal economic sanctions, should Iran successfully flatten Israel.

Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (vgIRn)

151 146 TheBlazeNOW @TheBlazeNOW
WASHINGTON (@AP) -- Justice Dept won't charge former Ferguson, Mo., policeman Darren Wilson in Michael Brown death.

But the're charging the whole force with racism...

Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (Bn6aD)

152 >>But He couldn't pass up the opportunity to make some snide remarks about it...

Yep. Bibi really got under his skin, eh? Obama looked pissed.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (lHHyw)

153 Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (l1zOH)

I would call that bluff if I were Bibi.

I don't think O would have the balls to shoot an Israeli F15 out of the air.

And if he does... well, that shows the world all it needs to know about Obama.

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (AkOaV)

154 Whole point of Ferguson was to boost the black vote in 2014. Now they can admit was all a fraud and walk away.

Guarantee the Progs will find another Trayvon or Ferguson situation in time for 2016.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (ZPrif)

155 Well, I was impressed with Mr. Netandyoyo's speech. He seemed quite neighborly, for a joo.

Posted by: Miss Teen America at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (Dwehj)

156 If Bibi's re-elected, there's every chance Israel will risk all you talk about to take action.

-----

if Bibi's re-elected, it will show that the people of Israel understand the threat they are under and they will certainly strike Iran.

Odds are 50/50, I hear.

Posted by: Turd Ferguson at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (VAsIq)

157 Buzzkill.

I think that was a great speech, and Israel will strike Iran, consequences be damned.

*buzz restored*

Posted by: Hawkins1701 at March 04, 2015 12:38 PM (j5smH)

158 141 If The O wants something bad enough he goes all out. How dare this Joo screw with his vision. Sadly my Yes answers are my convictions.
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:36 PM (l1zOH)

I would expect and hope every US triple A battery to commit mutiny.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:38 PM (CMkNk)

159 Who here trusts that iran won't hand out suitcase nukes for use by terrorists

Buenos Aires

Lebanon

They are working with Al Qaeda

Suitcase nukes. It isn't just an israeli problem

Posted by: ThunderB, Shapeshifter at March 04, 2015 12:38 PM (zOTsN)

160 Drew wrote, in the event Israel strikes Iran, "The response by all parties, including the US, would be so costly to Israel would be devastating."

Clunky syntax aside, there's devastating and then there's devastating. Tel Aviv reduced to radioactive ash would be devastating. The disapproval of cowardly and anti-SemiticEurope--and now the evidently equally cowardly and anti-Semitic United States--not so much,insignificant by comparison. One is a bad day at Turtle Bay. The other is an existential, genocidal threat.

I'd bet money Israel goes for another Osirak-like strike on Iran in a few weeks or a month, a series of pinpoint attacks confined to Iran's known nuclear development facilities. If one truly believes the Iranians are sincere in their threats to destroy Israel--and I think Netanyahu does believe that--then he really has no other choice.

Fun times.

Posted by: Barrel Pirates at March 04, 2015 12:38 PM (7F9i5)

161 I was hoping Bibi would screen the Obama / Kahlidi Sextape in front of both chambers of Congress.

Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (FGkrV)

162 but down the road it's hard to imagine Israel itself surviving. Particularly if this nation keeps electing Democrap presidents..

Posted by: Chris Vaughn at March 04, 2015 12:26 PM (Bcqod)

I would not worry about Israel's survival, but Iran on the other hand.

Posted by: Velvet Ambition at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (R8hU8)

163 "Yeah, but really? Who would retaliate? Obama? Hillary? Liz Warren? Jeb Bush? "

Israel. Unless they actually, literally, completely annihilated every last Jew in Israel, there would be a response.

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (MYCIw)

164 I call bullshit on this. I don't need Drew to tell me if the speech was good or not.

I watched the whole thing and was moved, impressed, inspired and hopeful.

That alone makes it better than anything I've heard since Reagan.

It's a speech, speech by definition is not action. If nothing else, I hope it made a few people understand that we don't have a leader, we have an unserious clown for President.

Posted by: Boehner *hic* at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (A98Xu)

165 More worried about the latter

Posted by: ThunderB, Shapeshifter at March 04, 2015 12:35 PM (zOTsN)

I think the science and technology for suitcase nukes is significantly more difficult than for the garden variety nuclear bomb.

Anyone in the know?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (Zu3d9)

166 Off pirate sock.

Posted by: troyriser at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (7F9i5)

167 They'd have to pass over a lot of ... unfriendly territory for that one. Easiest path by far is across iraq.

Think we'd really shoot them down? Do we even still have the ability to defend the airspace about Iraq?

Agreed across Iraq is easiest. BUT not the safest you would have to cross Syrian and it are defenses many now manned by Iranians. Then across Iraq with from what I heard this morning a military basically under the control of Iran's top General. Then through Iran's air defense praying that Syria or Iraq didn't tip them off.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:40 PM (C278+)

168
this is a jerkoff post

where's Ace?

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:40 PM (omuEe)

169 Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (lHHyw

Well said Lizzy @132.

The naivety of the left boggles my mind. They are more concerned about death and famine caused by global warming than having the world altered by an atomic bomb.

What evidence since 1979 has shown that Iran/Palestinians/Islamic extremists will not harm the Great Satan or the Little Satan? We aren't talking hockey stick curves here. If Iran has nuclear capability it will be in the hands of Hamas and other proxies.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:41 PM (l1zOH)

170 I also wonder how Israel's modern military would do against the countries it would face ?

Posted by: The Jackhole somewhere on Ventura Highway at March 04, 2015 12:34 PM (dULJN)

Don't ask.

Posted by: Egyptian tank commanders at March 04, 2015 12:41 PM (0FSuD)

171
I'd be willing to go out on a short stout limb enough to say the key Arab regimes won't do a thing to block an Israeli pre-emptive strike, and in fact will help as needed. Most of that "help" is passive - i.e. simply not doing anything to interfere.

Active cooperation may not be needed, or if so, only from the likes of Kurdistan, and Azerbaijan (Georgia's generally available for the right price, and wouldn't anger Turkey much, in this case,by helping out, too). Actually Azerbaijan's helping would be fairly balls-out, as they have a long Iranian border (though it's not the regime-friendly part of Iran, or very populous). Long, muddy, flat border - I don't recommend visiting.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 12:41 PM (afQnV)

172 The Jews pretty much despise Christian Cons.

Posted by: Chris Vaughn

I actually think this statement is pretty accurate as to why Jews vote Democrat despite the fact the Left basically wants to see Israel wiped off the map.

The GOP is seen as the "Christian" Party.
Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (LXs8j)

Yeah no and that is wrong. Don't smear all Jews with a statement like that. There are plenty of moderate and certainly conservative Jews who greatly appreciate Christians and their support.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:41 PM (nzKvP)

173 Some interesting yet sad shit from the trial:

http://goo.gl/p7nqi0

Wish someone wd throw an M80 in his lap, blowing off his dick, and causing him to bleed to death in excruciating pain.

Posted by: Bruce J. at March 04, 2015 12:41 PM (iQIUe)

174 Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (FGkrV)

Trust the Horde to put a perverted spin on it!

Alas, the tape has been shredded, along with obama's school records, including the admissions records and notes showing who pressured Columbia and Harvard to let him in.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:41 PM (Zu3d9)

175 164 It's a speech, speech by definition is not action. If nothing else, I hope it made a few people understand that we don't have a leader, we have an unserious clown for President.
Posted by: Boehner *hic* at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (A98Xu)

In all fairness, we've had a rambling, shambling Marxist douchebag as president so a fifth grader reciting the Pledge of Allegiance would sound like Winston Churchill in comparison.

But it was a great speech. Made greater by the measure of the man, it's purpose, content and the times we live in.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:41 PM (CMkNk)

176 "Now they can admit was all a fraud and walk away. "

Oh, you didn't hear? Someone in the dpt made a racist joke about Obama, so it's obviously the Most Racist Police Dpt EVER.

Joke?

After Obama was elected...

"He won't last, when have you known a black guy to keep a job for 4 years?"

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:41 PM (MYCIw)

177
The Left is not naive. They are anything but.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:42 PM (omuEe)

178 The purpose of Netanyahu's speech was many things. The effect of the speech was a strike at the king.

When Netanyahu opened with those gracious remarks of respect for Obama it was one of the most insulting thing one politician can say about his hated enemy, and to say those things with such sincerity made the insult all the greater. This is why Obama is so angry. It was widely reported that the two don't like each other very much, and for Netanyahu to profess his boundless respect for Obama was a knife into the heart of the king.

There is no way Obama can publicly reply except in kind; how much he respects the people of Israel and how much he respects their Prime Minister. That is the very last thing Obama wants to say in public. There are two billion Muslims Obama is trying to befriend and the very last thing Obama wants is to profess his support for the hated Jew. Forced to do exactly that in public is making Obama crazy.

This is why Pelosi saw the speech as an insult, because in their world view, it was a grievous insult. First to challenge and confront the king, and have a Jew doing it compounded the insult.

If Obama goes ahead with an agreement with Iran, presuming Iran even bothers, they are already carving up Iraq, which Obama was gracious enough to give to them, there is nothing for Iran to gain by agreeing to anything. It is Obama who is desperate to win his place in the history texts by restoring normal diplomatic relations with Iran while ignoring all the US Military Iran has killed, or helped kill

Posted by: Ralph Quickly at March 04, 2015 12:42 PM (jedsF)

179 Anyone in the know?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (Zu3d9)

Dirty bombs are the bigger fear.

Some low grade explosives coated in spent fuel in a suitcase bomb going off in a subway or major inhabited area would be a real pain in the ass for the people who live there.

Obviously not anywhere near as damaging as full on nuke.

But as others have mentioned... What about a ship pulling in to a harbor? Use that as your delivery device. No need to try to miniaturize the bomb and get it on a warhead and design a missile that can go to FUCKING SPACE then come back and kick some ass.

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:42 PM (AkOaV)

180 I honestly don't know why Israel tries anymore to garner international support.

A nuclear attack from Iran on Israel will come within moments of them getting the bomb. I'd rather have UN bureaucrats denouncing me than my nation wiped out forever.

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:42 PM (LXs8j)

181 Posted by: Boehner *hic* at March 04, 2015 12:39 PM (A98Xu)

Oh good, you got teh feels from it.

I'm sure that's an important factor in how the reality of this grave situation will play out.

Posted by: DrewM. at March 04, 2015 12:42 PM (64tBw)

182 These haters 'discuss' things like a dog with separation aniety.

Drop a turd, run. Drop a turd, run.

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:43 PM (1Y+hH)

183 The madness of king Barack

Posted by: ThunderB, Shapeshifter at March 04, 2015 12:43 PM (zOTsN)

184 So we're all just sitting around waiting for Godot then?

Waiting for Iran to get their nuke, and as soon as they do, they WILL use it.

Posted by: Boots at March 04, 2015 12:43 PM (l9mF2)

185 I think the science and technology for suitcase nukes is significantly more difficult than for the garden variety nuclear bomb.

Anyone in the know?

We do know they can be small enough to shoot out of a cannon (8"?). Hydrogen enhancements would be larger.

Posted by: Bob from table9 at March 04, 2015 12:43 PM (WNERA)

186
Check out a column at algemeiner-dot-com re Arab press commentary on this matter, quite interesting (somebody posted link last night in ONT). Saudi pundits making calm, rational, positive points supporting Bibi, by name and in detail, on this issue.

(Dr Evil voice) "Breath-taking, actually" - to see Arab pundits openly supporting Israel on a matter where the rest of the world (mostly pretends) to be all wee-wee'd up.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 12:44 PM (afQnV)

187 Barry admitted he was a Muslim when he ran against McCain. He had to be reminded with you mean you Christian faith. OH Yea my Christian faith. (may pig excrement be upon him)
He wants a nuclear. He has promoted Muslim take over the middle east every chance he can. When questioned pull out the race card which never seems to wear out.
Anybody who checks into the Muslim faith knows it says kill the Jew first, Christian second and infidel next.
It doesn't get more simple then that. Rationalize and make excuses, whatever.
End times. Today is the day of salvation, tomorrow may be to late.

Posted by: OSTB at March 04, 2015 12:44 PM (ShdUd)

188 Baring US intervention, Israel would have no trouble getting to Iran by air. Difficult -sure. But for a modern Air Force like Israel- very doable. The problem comes in re-fueling and the Fact that Israel's Air Force is really not big enough nor does it have the heavy Bombers to deliver a strong enough punch in one Attack. And then the second attack becomes more and more dangerous.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:44 PM (nzKvP)

189 "Oh good, you got teh feels from it.

I'm sure that's an important factor in how the reality of this grave situation will play out."

Wow. What a dick response.

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:44 PM (MYCIw)

190 >>The naivety of the left boggles my mind. They are more concerned about
death and famine caused by global warming than having the world altered
by an atomic bomb.

They mock Christians and conservatives for being "anti-science" and yet believe that a government run by people hell-bent on hastening the return of the 12th Imam are totes trustworthy with nukes.

What color is the sky in *your* world, progressives?

Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:44 PM (lHHyw)

191
It was a depressing speech. Not that it wasn't compelling, lucid, and forceful. It was a great speech speech.

The depressing bit is the reaction. Everybody just splits into teams and takes whatever side they're supposed to be on. I would like to see one thoughtful liberal discuss it on the merits.

But we don't live in that world anymore.

Posted by: Bandersnatch at March 04, 2015 12:45 PM (JtwS4)

192 >>Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:37 PM (LXs8j)

Really, enough with this shit.

I get enough reactionary Jew hate in the meat world. Usually from dicks like you who have no idea what the fuck they are talking about.

Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:45 PM (FGkrV)

193 Iran wants the bomb, and Obama won't stop until they get it.

Fixed for accuracy.

Posted by: tsj017 at March 04, 2015 12:45 PM (ithBb)

194 "I think the science and technology for suitcase nukes is significantly more difficult than for the garden variety nuclear bomb."

Yes. And they require a lot of detailed maintenance to retain their lethality.

Hey I made up a word.

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:45 PM (1Y+hH)

195 The problem isn't bombing. It's what happens after bombing

Posted by: ThunderB, Shapeshifter at March 04, 2015 12:45 PM (zOTsN)

196
If we were clever like the Left, we'd 'raise awareness' for Israel's dilemma by wearing little star ribbons.

That stupid shit works.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:45 PM (omuEe)

197 It was a depressing speech. Not that it wasn't compelling, lucid, and forceful. It was a great speech speech.

The depressing bit is the reaction. Everybody just splits into teams and takes whatever side they're supposed to be on. I would like to see one thoughtful liberal discuss it on the merits.

But we don't live in that world anymore.
Posted by: Bandersnatch at March 04, 2015 12:45 PM (JtwS4)

Yup and much of the democratic response was disgusting especially the stuff from that House Heeb Yarmuth

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:46 PM (nzKvP)

198 Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:40 PM (C278+)

That's all true, but looking at a map, I don't really see a better move. It's either out and up through Turkey or out and down through Egypt and Saudi Arabia. While I imagine they could get the leadership in any of those countries to look the other way ... I don't see how they do that unnoticed.

Plus, theyd have to deal with refueling either in the air over a country or on the ground.

I don't know. It'd be much easier with an aircraft carrier

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:46 PM (AkOaV)

199 Well Hell Drew, I guess we should all just give up and wait for Iran to start Armageddon. Did you honestly expect him to show up with a magical 9-point plan to resolve a millennia-old conflict? One that Obama and the left would gladly embrace? Perhaps you missed where he said that Israel will stand alone if need be; or that never again will Jews let other Jews be exterminated. Those were action words with meaning behind them. If the agreement to let Iran have nukes is approved, Israel will act. That was his message.

Posted by: BBReggie at March 04, 2015 12:46 PM (K1RXR)

200 Pres Warren will show those Islamofascists. VP Guitierrez will make epic speeches (translated to Ingles, for the losers)

Posted by: ghost of hallelujah at March 04, 2015 12:46 PM (7RXcs)

201 If we were clever like the Left, we'd 'raise awareness' for Israel's dilemma by wearing little star ribbons.

---

Good idea!

*ValJar, we've spotted another one*

Posted by: Nazi Left at March 04, 2015 12:47 PM (VAsIq)

202 Wow. What a dick response.

That comes free with the AoS Platinum membership.

Posted by: Miss Teen America at March 04, 2015 12:47 PM (Dwehj)

203 Posted by: Bob from table9 at March 04, 2015 12:43 PM (WNERA)

I know that we and the Russians can build them.

But what about second and third tier countries?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:47 PM (Zu3d9)

204 In what fcuking world is it sane to let ANY Middle Eastern shithole have the bomb? Even if it was a relatively stable country now, no stability lasts long in the ME.

Who would've thought, when we were younger, that we very well may be the last inhabitants of this mortal coil?

Posted by: Citizen X at March 04, 2015 12:47 PM (7ObY1)

205 I echo Donna. WTF?

Also, the Republican obsession with Israel and Jews in general .

What's with all the trolls?

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 04, 2015 12:47 PM (DXzRD)

206 I don't know. It'd be much easier with an aircraft carrier
Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:46 PM (AkOaV)

yeah but no- that is not magical answer either. they don't have heavy bombers on Aircraft Carriers either

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (nzKvP)

207 Yeah no and that is wrong. Don't smear all Jews with
a statement like that. There are plenty of moderate and certainly
conservative Jews who greatly appreciate Christians and their support.

Posted by: Nevergiveup

Of course I don't mean ALL Jews, is there ever a statement that means "every single person" when it comes to talking about any group?

Some Christians have had a history of anti-semitism and also many Jews dislike Christianity. I do think there is far more harmony between these two groups now than in the past.

But most Jews I know are militant secularists and that tends to mean they vote for ACLU-type Democrats.

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (LXs8j)

208
(Dr Evil voice) "Breath-taking, actually" - to see Arab pundits openly supporting Israel on a matter where the rest of the world (mostly pretends) to be all wee-wee'd up.
Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 12:44

We will see if the Wasabi courts convict them of Joo loving and sentence them to 1,000 lashes and time in prison?

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (l1zOH)

209 Fuck it, i'd go through Jordan than swing north and go through ISIS territory before veering in to Iran. Enough American and Gulf jets operating in that area that they wouldn't raise too much of an alarm with the locals on the ground, and should be out of the range of the Iraqi military.

And I doubt ISIS has much in the ways of anti-air weaponry and if they do it's probably at the front.

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (AkOaV)

210
I expect a ramping up of asymmetric warfare either as a prelude to a strike or to slow the bomb development.

We should have crushed these fucks years ago. And SCOAMF keeping them in power in 2009 was a crime.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (CMkNk)

211 I believe Bibi's speech fulfilled three things. First, as people have pointed out, it's election season in Israel and seeing their prime minister addressing congress leaves a good image.

Second, Bibi did want to humiliate the little pussified shitweasel that's in the WH. There was nothing more stark yesterday than the difference between a leader who loves his country and a tyrant who loves only himself.

Third, this was a warning. I think the Israeli Mossad has a much better grip on what's happening in this part of the world than all the western countries combined. He was telling us that if Iran isn't stopped, there will be nuclear war.

Posted by: Soona at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (/HX7u)

212
Yeah, Bibi's rather more-than-average a**-kissing in the preamble to his speech yesterday was striking, and amusing. The Harry Reid thing was probably off the cuff but actually stepped over the "cringe-worthy" line.

But I think all of that was mostly to assuage the major Jewish organizational types and machers, who surely have been troubled by the open nastiness betw. a US president and an Israeli PM. These people are "successful" but, obviously, not particularly smart of sophisticated about the US or the world. And surely the unprecedented level of animosity between the two govts. shook their rather naive little sensibilities. Bibi was pouring (cheap, cloying) honey all over those widdle ouchies.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 12:49 PM (afQnV)

213 Netanyahu: "No plan is better than this plan!"

Idiots: "Well, Bibi didn't offer a cogent plan (which would be disregarded by Obama anyway), so the speech was teh stoopid and pointless."

Posted by: Turd Ferguson at March 04, 2015 12:49 PM (VAsIq)

214 "What's with all the trolls?"

Some people really, really hate Jooooos.

I mean, it's pathological.

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:49 PM (MYCIw)

215 yeah but no- that is not magical answer either. they don't have heavy bombers on Aircraft Carriers either
Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (nzKvP)

True. Israel is just surrounded by assholes.

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:49 PM (AkOaV)

216 Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:47 PM (Zu3d9)

Take what I say with a grain of salt as I have no direct knowledge. I think the technology to make it is well known in physics class, it is getting the stuff that is difficult. Short answer from me would be yes they can.

Posted by: Bob from table9 at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (WNERA)

217
This idea of Iran with a nuke has got Jew abolitionists wetting their pants in excitement.

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (1Y+hH)

218 I think the science and technology for suitcase nukes is significantly more difficult than for the garden variety nuclear bomb.

Iran has been working with the NK on missile tech. The already have a ballistic missile able to reach Israel and are working on an inter-continental missile. If they get the bomb by the end of the year like some predict (the easy part) all the have to do is make it small enough to fit on a rocket (the hard part). Anyone believe that WHEN this happens the won't use it. I don't.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (C278+)

219 Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:45 PM (FGkrV)

Reason #21,092 why I love the 2nd Amendment and push every Jew I know to buy guns.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (Zu3d9)

220 The quickest and easiest ways for Israel to get to Iran is either

Jordan- Iraq- Iran
or
Over Saudi Arabia to Iran

or

a combination of the 2 above
Both are doable

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (nzKvP)

221 Here's the way I heard Nanzi Piglosi's spew after the speech:

"How DARE this dirty Joo insult my Obamessiah?"

Posted by: Citizen X at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (7ObY1)

222 It was a goof, see, on Hillary using a private e-mail account (toilet) for her dump

*shrugs, kicks dirt*

Posted by: ghost of hallelujah at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (7RXcs)

223 yeah but no- that is not magical answer either. they don't have heavy bombers on Aircraft Carriers either

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM
=====
they kick BLU-82's out of C130s don't they? Haven't C130's been launched off of carriers with the rocket assist? Time for a modern day Doolittle.

Posted by: fastfreefall at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (aCl9c)

224
Someone here quipped yesterday that it was like Netanyahu was spraying holy water on the left.

Apt comparison. Each word uttered by Netanyahu was like a drop of Holy Water being flicked at obama and his devotees and all the enemies of Western Judeo-Christian Capitalist Democracy.

How do you know the speech was effective? By all the gnashing of teeth and clothes-ripping by the usual suspects in response to it.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:51 PM (omuEe)

225 214 Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:49 PM (MYCIw)

You should read the comments on Breitbart. Flattered that they come here for their whipping.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:51 PM (CMkNk)

226 Posted by: BBReggie at March 04, 2015 12:46 PM (K1RXR)

I agree.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 04, 2015 12:51 PM (DXzRD)

227 uncommonly negative, even by DrewM's standards.

Posted by: General Mitch McTurtle at March 04, 2015 12:51 PM (hKyl0)

228 It was a spectacle by Boehner to distract from passing Obama's amnesty.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at March 04, 2015 12:51 PM (GrgPg)

229
Nope, not a chance, MH. Saudi pundits reflect elite thinking in Riyadh, they don't affect or contradict it.

That's my point. Check it out. Since 1948 I don't think there is any precedent for the level of open, even casual support for what would amount to one of Israel's most audacious military actions among any Arab states.

This is most definitely indicative of regime temperature in those states.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 12:51 PM (afQnV)

230 But most Jews I know are militant secularists and that tends to mean they vote for ACLU-type Democrats.
Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (LXs8j)

Yeah no and gross generalizations like that only contribute to anti-semitism

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (nzKvP)

231 yeah but no- that is not magical answer either. they don't have heavy bombers on Aircraft Carriers either
Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (nzKvP)

No.

But they do have dial-a-yield cruise missile nukes that fit in their submarine torpedo tubes. Submarines that Egypt let transit the Suez.

Just sayin'.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (659DL)

232 O/T

ATL black cop shot and killed in ambush last night. We have nothing to fear from these people coming over the border, nothing.

http://tinyurl.com/md8yzxo

Posted by: Nip Sip at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (0FSuD)

233 @219

I'm curious, what's their reaction?

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (LA7Cm)

234 Not agreeing with Drew on this one....Netanayhu(Israel) WILL destroy Iran's nuclear capability by what ever means necessary. You can count on it the way you could count on America back in the day.....

Posted by: at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (7GI9v)

235 "Someone here quipped yesterday that it was like Netanyahu was spraying holy water on the left. "

Haha, perfect analogy. And it nearly melted Nancy!

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (MYCIw)

236 We need to face a rather obvious fact: Iran wants a nuke and they won't stop until they have one.

--

And once they have one they will use it.

Unless they are on the receiving end ... if yo get my meaning?

Posted by: Paladin at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (QGbEp)

237 220 Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (nzKvP)

Over the Caspian Sea from Azerbaijan. Which was planned until the State Dept. leaked it.

Scum.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (CMkNk)

238 Somebody just noted something. Iran is sitting in Syria and parts of Iraq. overflying iraq now won't be an IDF vs JEF bit, but Iran dragging iraq into it. Iraq is becoming a buffer state for Iran, thanks to King Putt.

Posted by: AoSHQ Welcome committee at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (b7GF2)

239 Suppose, just for a moment that the Iranians are being honest, and they just want nukes for generating electricity.

Why aren't the environmentalist "no nukes" crowd going berserk?

I mean, I know the answer, but it's still amazing to see such hypocrisy from left-wing groups.

Posted by: Null at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (xjpRj)

240 they kick BLU-82's out of C130s don't they? Haven't C130's been launched off of carriers with the rocket assist? Time for a modern day Doolittle.
Posted by: fastfreefall at March 04, 2015 12:50 PM (aCl9c)

Why?

IF the US is on it, just fly our Heavy Bombers from CONUS or Diego Garcia

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (nzKvP)

241
What's with all the trolls?
Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 04, 2015 12:47 PM (DXzRD)

Some wag posted that we were doing neck tats for free today.

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (1Y+hH)

242
Second some of the others. This is a post in need of stomping. Israel will look after itself, and a nuclear Iran is much worse for it than the disapproval of the fcukheads of theworld and stepped-up terrorist attacks.

Posted by: lurkingestlurker at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (k8xvx)

243 one thoughtful liberal discuss it on the merits.

I think I see the problem. "Thoughtful liberal".

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (rIQuo)

244 The Left is not naive. They are anything but.
Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:42 PM (omuEe)

----

Thats true on a leadership level.

The garden variety useful idiots we encounter every day are not only naive, but stupid, easily lead, vicious and vindictive.

Bad mix.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (NaV4z)

245 227 uncommonly negative, even by DrewM's standards.
Posted by: General Mitch McTurtle at March 04, 2015 12:51 PM (hKyl0)

Yes. The post seems at pains to drag out a negative. I wonder why it was even done.

Posted by: Kraken at March 04, 2015 12:54 PM (5+mPY)

246
And of course any thread about Israel or Ron/Rand Paul will get infected with paulestinians, to use a common pejorative.

Posted by: lurkingestlurker at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (k8xvx)

247 mynewhandle

Israel and KSA have been working this deal for years for over flight and possible support. Check some of my posts up thread. Both countries have real fears of a nuclear Iran. KSA would be number 3 on Iran's target list. It's in both's interest to work together and have been for several years.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (C278+)

248 Over the Caspian Sea from Azerbaijan. Which was planned until the State Dept. leaked it.

Scum.
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (CMkNk)

well yeah but that was with pre-positioning

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (nzKvP)

249 This is preparation for the legal battlefield...

Obama is negotiating with a foreign nation, but says its not a treaty, and thus he will not send it to the Senate for ratification.

Question is... what is the legal definition of a treaty.... so when does he HAVE to send it to the Senate?

Bibi.... sadly... still believes our Constitution is in effect... so is trying to sway the Senate....

Not knowing that Obama will just ignore the clear intent of the Constitution, and use legal sophistry to bypass it.

Posted by: BB Wolf, retired Sailor at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (qh617)

250 And once they have one they will use it.

Unless they are on the receiving end ... if yo get my meaning?

By all means, give them 3 or 4 then. (wink)

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (rIQuo)

251 240 IF the US is on it, just fly our Heavy Bombers from CONUS or Diego Garcia
Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (nzKvP)

We need a General Jack D. Ripper.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (CMkNk)

252 >>It was a spectacle by Boehner to distract from passing Obama's amnesty.

No. It was Boenher saying,'you can have your cake, but you'll have to eat around my dick if you want to consume it.'.

Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (FGkrV)

253 >>How do you know the speech was effective? By all the gnashing of teeth
and clothes-ripping by the usual suspects in response to it.

And this reaction for what Drew has pointed out is nothing new?

Yeah, they're freakin' scared of obvious truths about Iran's intentions and TFG's fecklessness (or mendacity, to be more honest) in working with them.

Must be hard convincing yourself that your president's actions aren't ensuring the death of millions. Maybe someone like Pelosi is comforted by the fact that she may not live to see the real cost of Obama's foreign policy, but her children and grandchildren surely will. Gotta strike out at the guy who dares to remind her of that.

Posted by: Lizzy at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (lHHyw)

254 But most Jews I know are militant secularists and that tends to mean they vote for ACLU-type Democrats.
Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (LXs8j)

You left out the "The only good Jew..." part.

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 12:56 PM (1Y+hH)

255 Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 12:52 PM (CMkNk)

Well how did they plan to get to Azerbaijan unnoticed? Through our unreliable friends the Turks?

Granted, the sunni Turks have no love for the shia Persians, but surely Iran has some intelligence assets on the ground in Turkey that could be bought off to give them a heads up like "hey a bunch of j00s flew threw here recently..."

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:56 PM (AkOaV)

256
Yeah no and gross generalizations like that only contribute to anti-semitism

Posted by: Nevergiveup

That sounds like PC Police nonsense to me.

I guess I can't criticize Trayvon Martin because that might lead to more racism towards blacks.

I'm glad there's Jews that have finally begun to see the light and aren't reflexively supporting the Democrat Party, but it is a real phenomenon that many Jews do not feel comfortable with elements of the Religious Right that has traditionally been associated with the Republican Party.

Pointing that out does not make me a Jew hater.

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:56 PM (LXs8j)

257 I've got this one handled.

Posted by: Curtis LeMay at March 04, 2015 12:57 PM (WNERA)

258
i thought it was a great and historic speech,and the world is on notice israel will not allow a nuclear armed iran.

Posted by: kj at March 04, 2015 12:57 PM (lKyWE)

259
Thats true on a leadership level.

The garden variety useful idiots we encounter every day are not only naive, but stupid, easily lead, vicious and vindictive.

Bad mix.
Posted by: fixerupper at March 04, 2015 12:53 PM (NaV4z

Usually UGLY as well. If you need examples, Roseann, Rachel Madow, and others.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:57 PM (l1zOH)

260 Nothing Iran might or might not put into Syria or Iraq would prevent an Israeli overflight.

A) It never helped Syria before

B) And you honestly don't think Israel has been overflying Iran all this time? Please

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:57 PM (nzKvP)

261 "What's with all the trolls?" Some people really, really hate Jooooos. I mean, it's pathological.
Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 12:49 PM (MYCIw)

------------------------------------

It is scary, isn't it.

Posted by: Soona at March 04, 2015 12:57 PM (/HX7u)

262 yeah but no- that is not magical answer either. they don't have heavy bombers on Aircraft Carriers either

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM
====
you're right. I was responding from a purely, "doing badass sounding nonstandard shit, answer question in a vacuum" point of view.

Posted by: fastfreefall at March 04, 2015 12:58 PM (aCl9c)

263 Doesn't Israel have nuke subs? Why would the assualt have to come from the air? If Isreal doesn't have all the bunkers busters wouln't they have to go big?

Posted by: Ben Had at March 04, 2015 12:58 PM (P/jRF)

264
Lizzy, their 'reaction to these truths,' as you say, reminds me of their reaction to Guilliani's bold revelation of obama's hate for America and Americans.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 12:59 PM (omuEe)

265 Pointing that out does not make me a Jew hater.
Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:56 PM (LXs8j)

No, just ignorant

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 12:59 PM (nzKvP)

266 So is Ace down at the registrars office?

Posted by: hello, it's Me Donna ....again at March 04, 2015 12:59 PM (Bn6aD)

267
The United States, a nuclear power, was brought low by subterfuge, subversion and misdirection. Maybe a nuclear Iran can be brought low the same way. Except, these desert people are so much better at that kind of thing.

Posted by: Edgar Allan Schmoe at March 04, 2015 12:59 PM (w41GQ)

268 The only Jews I have problems with are those damn Lobster eating Jews.

(Ha Ha, Never, Oh and happy Purim, drink one for me)

Posted by: Nip Sip at March 04, 2015 12:59 PM (0FSuD)

269
No. It was Boenher saying,'you can have your cake, but you'll have to eat around my dick if you want to consume it.'.
Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM

I told my congress critter to keep the magnifying glass out of his office.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at March 04, 2015 12:59 PM (l1zOH)

270 Doesn't Israel have nuke subs?

See my note at 231 above.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 04, 2015 12:59 PM (659DL)

271 255 Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:56 PM (AkOaV)

Obviously they DID have a plan. And how they were going to execute it is anyone's guess. But the point is moot.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (CMkNk)

272 Nood Hildabeast

Posted by: rickb223 at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (rIQuo)

273 I support Israel because they are on the side of all that is good.
I have many other reasons, but I don't need other reasons.

Posted by: JohnnyBoy at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (TPjwz)

274 But most Jews I know are militant secularists and that tends to mean they vote for ACLU-type Democrats.

----

Most of my coworkers a reflexive democrat-voting mouth breeders, ergo most Americans are Democrats.

Most of my family members are conservatives, ergo most Americans are conservative.

Most of the Lutherans I've met have wanted to punch me, ergo most Lutherans are violent psychopaths.

Posted by: Turd Ferguson at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (VAsIq)

275 Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 12:55 PM (C278+)

Yeah, I know... that info came out with the bradley manning wikileaks shit. But while the government of Saudi Arabia is presumably to be trusted, how much do they trust their people on the ground?

But yes, the gulf states are more afraid of a nuclear Iran than the Israelis are. Because at least Israel has their own nukes to respond with. The Saudi royal family is scared shitless of being overthrown by their nutjob jihadist citizens... and wouldnt really be able to react to an Iranian nuke going off in Riyadh.

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (AkOaV)

276 "Netanayhu(Israel) WILL destroy Iran's nuclear capability..."

THAT probability is what has the roaches slamming their heads into the corners of the blog like demented robot vacuum cleaners today.

Posted by: Meremortal at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (1Y+hH)

277 Doesn't Israel have nuke subs? Why would the assualt have to come from the air? If Isreal doesn't have all the bunkers busters wouln't they have to go big?
Posted by: Ben Had at March 04, 2015 12:58 PM (P/jRF)

You want Israel to launch a preemptive NUCLEAR Strike? Now?

I mean eventually it might come to that, but that will be bend over and kiss your ass good bye time.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (nzKvP)

278 263
Just fast attack subs I believe. I know they scared the hell of the Egyptian Navy.

Posted by: wrg500 at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (C278+)

279 No, just ignorant

Posted by: Nevergiveup

Why do you think Jews have been such a steadfast part of the liberal coalition?

Is it their ignorance?

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (LXs8j)

280 And I doubt ISIS has much in the ways of anti-air weaponry and if they do it's probably at the front.
Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (AkOaV)

If Obama keeps kissing Iran's ass, they'll be able to take off from Riyadh.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at March 04, 2015 01:00 PM (BZAd3)

281 Sorry, Chelsea Manning ***********

Posted by: mynewhandle at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (AkOaV)

282 Israel has ships in the Mediterranean Sea, right?

I could see Oman allowing Israel to use its airspace for an attack on Iran.

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (MYCIw)

283 267
The United States, a nuclear power, was brought low by subterfuge, subversion and misdirection. Maybe a nuclear Iran can be brought low the same way. Except, these desert people are so much better at that kind of thing.
Posted by: Edgar Allan Schmoe at March 04, 2015 12:59 PM (w41GQ)

It's easy to bring down a free society from within. From a totalitarian regime? Not so much.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (CMkNk)

284
Suitcase nukes - engineering problem (big one), almost surely well beyond the capabilities of Iran's weapons complex.

Israeli strike options - NGU is right about air corridors (and it will NOT be a problem over-flying Saudi Arabia - Israel will not be the only state going "all in" on a Persian nuke pre-emption).

Israel also has cruise missiles, subs, and of course human operators.

I'd expect more than just some centrifuge-busting bombing strikes. Dead scientists, dead Pasdaran biggies. Killing the people in Iran would be as or more valuable than breaking just stuff (as the Mossad ops against Iranian nuke scientists the last few years have shown).

Beyond that? Of course the best, lowest-cost course for Israel would go far beyond just hitting Iran's nuke program. Iran's main proxy (Assad) is severely crippled already. But Iran's second proxy (Hezbollah) needs to be shattered. And split - and I think they could be, as some in H'allah are not so keen on doing the kamikaze thing on Iran's behalf (material support and training are one thing, kamikaze raids are another, and not many in H'allah actually have the doomsday Iranian fundamentalist thing going on).

The new green line will be northeast of Quneitra (beyond Golan, a new buffer zone/bargaining chip against Damascus), and up to the Litani river in Lebanon (and this time, no pulling back).

The much less important Iranian proxy (Hamas) will be decapitated in Gaza, with Egyptian cooperation.

"By the end of the day, all Corleone family business will be taken care of".

This is the best, lowest-cost solution. Whether today's Israel has the seriousness and smarts to do this, another question.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (afQnV)

285 You know, Iran is not a passive actor in this case, responding only to what others do.

Iran is the aggressor here.

Basically every analysis I see talks as if Iran is just this inert lump, sitting there and waiting to be acted upon. That is hardly the case.

Iran wants a nuclear warhead so that it can use it against Israel. When Iran gets such a weapon, which will be sooner rather than later, such a weapon will be used. I don't mean as a deterrent. I mean as a weapon.

Why was Netanyahu's speech important? Because it sets out why Israel must strike first to prevent that occurrence.

You know what? This isn't about the US or the UN or US politics. This is about the survival of Israel. There are not nearly enough people (by which I mean hardly any) discussing the situation from that perspective.

Posted by: alexthechick - LIV ahoy! at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (mf5HN)

286 But most Jews I know are militant secularists and that tends to mean they vote for ACLU-type Democrats.

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 12:48 PM (LXs8j)

You don't know enough Jews to make that generalization. And you clearly don't know enough about Jewish culture.

Which Jews?

American? European? Israelis? Modern Orthodox? Assimilated? Russian? Sephardic? Askenazic?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (Zu3d9)

287 What's the Yiddish word for Kamikazee?

Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (FGkrV)

288
The Left are masters of planting the seed of a bad idea into people's head. The Left, for lack of a better phrase, are brainwashers.

When someone comes along and casts doubt on those ideas or reveals a Truth, the Left reacts viciously because it un-does their efforts.

Posted by: Soothsayer, Lambda Lambda Lambda at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (omuEe)

289 "I think the technology to make it is well known in physics class, it is getting the stuff that is difficult."

Any bright physics undergrad will rapidly grasp or infer the principles.

There is a whole lot of difficult engineering work that's not really physics per se, and that has to draw on other disciplines such as metallurgy. Ultraprecise machining of beryllium (nasty stuff) comes to mind.

Posted by: torquewrench at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (noWW6)

290 First of all, Bibi didn't invite himself. He was invited. Second, the speech has had the salubrious effect of forcing the media to cast light on Obama's efforts to appease Iran. Kerry's negotiations aren't a hazy thing in the background anymore. Everyone knows exactly what's at stake. And the pro-Islam, anti-Israel proclivities of our faculty-lounge President become a little clearer.

Posted by: Caliban at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (DrC22)

291 Doesn't Israel have nuke subs?

They conventional powered Subs that "reportedly" have the capability to launch Nuclear Capable Missiles

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (nzKvP)

292 They can always build Jerhico's faster than Iran can build reactors. I used to have a link handy to a CSIS report on the potential for Israel to go "ballistic".

Posted by: Jean at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (ztOda)

293 The God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob will look after Israel. Revelation informs us that after the Rapture of the church God will bring the whole world against Jerusalem and deal with them their. Sort of calling for delivery if you well.
Iran doesn't need ballistic missiles to reach Israel. Wonder if they might make a Freudian slip and say who they are trying to reach. The Great Satan would be too much to hope for as it would leave little doubt as who they thought of as more evil then than Israel. We have to be able to find a clue or maybe by a vowel for a few billion dollars...

Posted by: OSTB at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (ShdUd)

294 This is about the survival of Israel.

Posted by: alexthechick - LIV ahoy! at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (mf5HN)

Bingo.

And if we can fix your abhorrent taste in shoes you will be 100% correct.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (Zu3d9)

295 I thought it was a great speech-well written and well delivered and yes, I think l;listening to it does make a difference; I think Bibi actually gave some Congress members some history that, no Nancy P-sorry-the Democrats didn't know-and it might have rallied some Dems to vote against a deal. Obama will do what Obama will do but it was a speech that had to be made and he made the case well.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (DXzRD)

296 I thought it was a great speech-well written and well delivered and yes, I think l;listening to it does make a difference; I think Bibi actually gave some Congress members some history that, no Nancy P-sorry-the Democrats didn't know-and it might have rallied some Dems to vote against a deal. Obama will do what Obama will do but it was a speech that had to be made and he made the case well.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 04, 2015 01:03 PM (DXzRD)

297 Meremortal, wow! That's some cool, wacky imagery! (cockroaches like robot vaccuum cleaners)

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 01:03 PM (afQnV)

298 I used to have a link handy to a CSIS report on the potential for Israel to go "ballistic".
Posted by: Jean at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (ztOda)

There is no "potential" to it. they have ICBMs

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 01:04 PM (nzKvP)

299
Why do you think Jews have been such a steadfast part of the liberal coalition?Is it their ignorance?
because the jews that came here in the early part of the 20th century escaping therussianpogroms were good actuallycommunist.

Posted by: kj at March 04, 2015 01:04 PM (lKyWE)

300 Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (nzKvP)

Dolphin II subs. Launching Harpoons and an Israeli cruise missile called the Popeye Turbo, which is rumored to be nuclear capable.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 01:04 PM (Zu3d9)

301 You don't know enough Jews to make that generalization. And you clearly don't know enough about Jewish culture.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo

So I'm not allowed to relay anecdotes or lesson from personal experience?

Yes, I'm making a generalization, if you have a different experience, great, but it's also well established that Jews have historically supported Democrat and there's all sorts of fact based polling to back that up.

What is your theory? Tax policy?

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 01:04 PM (LXs8j)

302 "Suitcase nukes - engineering problem (big one), almost surely well beyond the capabilities of Iran's weapons complex."

A low yield suitcase nuke that uses its fuel inefficiently could actually be thrown together without too much trouble.

It wouldn't be a huge bang by nuclear weapons standards, and it wouldn't cause enormous damage, but it would cause panic.

Posted by: torquewrench at March 04, 2015 01:05 PM (noWW6)

303 Well said, Caliban.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 04, 2015 01:06 PM (DXzRD)

304 This thread is very doom-y. Kind of on par with what we're living every day now. Carter set up the chess pieces. Obama is going to light the fire. Democrats are the most ignorant fools imaginable. The world will rue the day when Iran gets its nukes.

Posted by: Lady in Black at March 04, 2015 01:06 PM (ACPYI)

305 160 Tel Aviv reduced to radioactive ash would be devastating. The disapproval of cowardly and anti-SemiticEurope--and now the evidently equally cowardly and anti-Semitic United States--not so much,insignificant by comparison. One is a bad day at Turtle Bay. The other is an existential, genocidal threat.
what he said.

Posted by: General Mitch McTurtle at March 04, 2015 01:06 PM (hKyl0)

306 A nuclear weapon is like a suicide vest. I don't mind Iran having either one, so long as it goes off while the instructor is trying to teach his students how to use one.

Posted by: Keith Arnold at March 04, 2015 01:07 PM (iIzG7)

307 Posted by: Garrett at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (FGkrV)

Schmuck.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 01:07 PM (Zu3d9)

308 "Dolphin II subs. Launching Harpoons and an Israeli cruise missile called the Popeye Turbo, which is rumored to be nuclear capable."

Yes. People tend to not realize how capable cruise missiles can be.

And, the boffins at Dimona long ago mastered thermonuclear miniaturization principles, which are key to putting a big yield in a small package, such as would fit in a cruise missile payload.

Posted by: torquewrench at March 04, 2015 01:08 PM (noWW6)

309 What is your theory? Tax policy?

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 01:04 PM (LXs8j)

I don't have a theory. I have facts. Something that is missing from your comments.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 04, 2015 01:09 PM (Zu3d9)

310 It was reported that Israel had been told their planes may be shot down if they attempted to protect Jews from evil in Iran. We here believe the speech was a loud and clear warning to those who would choose unwisely. It was an fyi to those given an order and to Goose and Iceman.

Secondly, the speech was to the antisemitic in Europe depending on oil. Putin be doing happy dance with his desires for Russian OPEC. To us it was a heads up to you Jew hating Europeans.

Thirdly, in many ways it was also a speech about why Poookistan is a clusterfarking clusterfark when it comes to Muslims of periodic random radicalism possessing nuclear anything. Multiplied Muslim possession of nukes is doom unlike the world has ever seen.

Lastly, while same old speech, those in power aren't. For that matter the GOP isn't the same. Many in Congress have rote history memory issues. Speech was a great reminder of what most of flyover country have always known but our intellectual betters usually forget.

Part of me wonders if there is also underlying inferences that Israel has support of places like Egypt and Jordan and the Saudis? We have heard the Saudis are not Obamabots and some in Europe find him sophomoric and a egotistical gasbag. Perhaps the speech was along the lines of that great orator Inigo Montoya. "These words you speak, I do not think they mean what you think they mean, and no one here is buying them!"

Posted by: freeus at March 04, 2015 01:10 PM (caDgg)

311 I don't have a theory. I have facts. Something that is missing from your comments.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo

All you have is name calling

Posted by: McAdams at March 04, 2015 01:11 PM (LXs8j)

312
Jewish American lib tendencies often discussed here. I have no grand theory.

Can only observe that the 99% of Jews I know who are libs are like every other lib I know: tribal Dem ID, high-disinformation types marinating in NPR and the rest of the pervasive distortion that passes for media and info in today's America. That's it. No more flourishes or insights required. Nothing special or different.

Only different thing about them is their one strong point: oftennot completely idiotic about Israel and related issues. Chuck Schumer. A more vile, destructive, alien lib Dem is impossible to imagine. But when it comes to Israel? Solid.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 01:11 PM (afQnV)

313 Posted by: alexthechick - LIV ahoy! at March 04, 2015 01:01 PM (mf5HN)

The problem is Iran's nuke program is much more diversified than Iraq's was. It's not going to be as simple (relatively) as a single strike on a single target.

The Israeli's are going to get one shot at this. Maybe there's a single node that is critical enough that they can at least put a major delay in the program by striking but from what I've read, there's really not. I think if there were, they would have done it already.

Only the US has the ability to launch and sustain the kind of effort it will take to do real damage to Iran's program and we ain't doing it.

Maybe there's another cyber attack in the offing that will work.

Or maybe the Israeli's will go nuclear preemptively. I really, really doubt they will. But if they did...yikes.

Posted by: DrewM. at March 04, 2015 01:12 PM (64tBw)

314 Nood up. Release your chackras!

Posted by: Lauren at March 04, 2015 01:13 PM (MYCIw)

315 And another thing I appreciated was the fact that Pres. Obama and his acolytes got so pissy about it that more people tuned in than would otherwise do so.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at March 04, 2015 01:13 PM (DXzRD)

316 On the bottom are the links to the various doj reports:

http://goo.gl/qqIoZr

Posted by: Bruce J. at March 04, 2015 01:14 PM (iQIUe)

317
Oh, to amend my last comment. Almost all of the lib Jews I know in fact don't even have the one bright spot of realism on the MidEast. Nope, not even that. One astonishing recent anecdote. At a football-watching gathering last fall, one guy (Jewish) was bizarrely, ineptly attempting to make some ludicrous anti-Israeli point about IDF tactics in the last Gaza op. I was easily knocking him down, casually and in a friendly way. He became increasingly earnest - and silly - and started implying one had to be Jewish to understand, etc. So, sad to say, not even all the lib Jewish folks I know even have the one bright spot of MidEast realism. Perhaps just the moonbat segment, nothing more to it.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 01:17 PM (afQnV)

318
No Drew, wrong about the strike stuff. ANY Israeli strike, absent regime change in Tehran, obviously is a delaying action, most likely. Plenty of serious delay can be imposed. No "knockout blow" possible, but none needed or assumed. But nood.

Posted by: rhomboid at March 04, 2015 01:18 PM (afQnV)

319 Even if giving Iran is given the bomb in A TREATY, the republicans in the senate will vote for it because Obama is black. I think it will go to the senate. The Turtle will whip up enough votes to get it past the line with all of the fascist democrats voting for it.

Posted by: Jukin at March 04, 2015 01:20 PM (WGm5T)

320 His speech achieved several important, I would say crucial things (and it's been commented on by serious analysts already):

Forcing the debate about Iran into he light, into the public domain; obama likes to operate in the dark, this way it is easirer to lie about what transpired, and saying that "lets wait and see after we sign the agreement what's in" is not acceptable and will not be accepted

That current capitulation about to be signed and legitimized is not the only alternative (as obama is trying to make everyone believe), and he gave a few ideas what the alternatives are

That if obama doubles down on stupid, as he always does, israel will act no nulify it in its own special way

So, he put administration is on the defensive - go ahead with the agreement that will not meet certain key demands and start a war, or step away and rethink the terms

Posted by: runner at March 04, 2015 01:21 PM (yrk2K)

321 317: You don't have to go any farther than Ed Koch and Alan Dershowitz. Dersh still proudly notes he campaigned twice for Obama while puzzling over his contempt for Jews. Koch admitted he knew Obama had a problem with Jews but still reassured Jewish voters that he would be good for them.

Posted by: ejo at March 04, 2015 01:22 PM (rsGj7)

322 What's more, the idea that obama is some naive peacenik who wants to believe Iran deserves a chance is an even bigger insult.

obama knows exactly who Iran is, just like he knows who Cuba is. obama hatched this evil plan for all the wrong reasons.

^^^^^

Soothie,

Honestly, I really don't know if that's the case. All the lefties I am acquainted with genuinely believe the whole schtick about these bad regimes really just being victims of oppression. The crap the State dept spewed about ISIS really just needing jobs is what these idiots actually think. Everything bad in the world (excepting all the "bad" things that are explicitly right-wing or Christian) is seen as a result if some kind of power imbalance and oppression of minorities and the lower classes and rooted in all sorts of cultural misunderstanding. The idea that the regimes in Cuba or Iran are just plain evil is anathema to the left.

I honestly don't know if Obama and company are capable of thinking past that lefty claptrap and seeing the reality for what it is.

Posted by: Mandy P., lurking lurker who lurks at March 04, 2015 01:22 PM (KkVB6)

323 Well hell, at least we got to see Pelosi cry. And he properly pinned the tail of this disaster on the Obama donkey.

Posted by: Comanche Voter at March 04, 2015 01:23 PM (wdHk6)

324 319: Whatever do you mean. Our Republicans will fight like tigers on this issue.

Posted by: ejo at March 04, 2015 01:23 PM (rsGj7)

325 Sort of quietly, during the speech the Israelis did do something, they asked for more ABMs and more F-35s.

The F-35 request is some subtle judo with DoD. Those airframe won't be built for years, so they aren't part of the Iran fight. The building needs the Aardvark II to be winner, so this was an olive branch.

Let's see what Obama does with those requests

Posted by: Jean at March 04, 2015 01:30 PM (F7lRL)

326 Posted by: OSTB at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (ShdUd)

Shit like that makes my head hurt. A Christian myself, it seems to me the faith would be a lot better off if people quit poring over the Book of Revelations like a pack of gypsy fortune tellers playing with Tarot cards.

Christ returns when Christ returns. No one knows the hour but the Father so live your life as if He's returning that day--today--and you can't go wrong.

Posted by: troyriser at March 04, 2015 01:32 PM (7F9i5)

327 Israel needs to step up their assassination campaign against Iranian scientists to at least a couple a week.

Posted by: toby928(C) at March 04, 2015 01:35 PM (rwI+c)

328 298 I used to have a link handy to a CSIS report on the potential for Israel to go "ballistic".
Posted by: Jean at March 04, 2015 01:02 PM (ztOda)

There is no "potential" to it. they have ICBMs
Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 04, 2015 01:04 PM (nzKvP)

The report details the accuracy requirements for the conventional Jehrico's vice Iran's distributed facilities. I would guess IDF paid for it, as a message.

Posted by: Jean at March 04, 2015 01:38 PM (F7lRL)

329 I am compelled to note on every Iran thread that this pissant country that has bedeviled us for more than 30 years has the GDP of Dallas-Fortworth. Almost all from a commodity that has to be shipped by tanker or exposed pipeline. It's just ridiculous.

Posted by: toby928(C) at March 04, 2015 01:39 PM (rwI+c)

330 What's the inevitable?

Mushroom clouds over Jerusalem.

Posted by: Jack at March 04, 2015 01:40 PM (53CCM)

331 Toby, I've been advocating for a Kharg Is BBQ for decades.

Posted by: Jean at March 04, 2015 02:20 PM (F7lRL)

332 @42
Surgical strikes with conventional weapons on nuclear facilities will be rebuked, but no long-lasting effects would come of it.
Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at March 04, 2015 12:18 PM (4+IgA)
* * * * * * * * *

Actually, no. There would be HUGE effects. Iran has said that if ANYONE strikes them -- whether Israel or the U.S. -- they will "activate" the dozens of Hezbollah cells currently in the U.S.
Get ready to see U.S. cities go up in smoke and blood.

Mind you, I'm not saying Israel shouldn't act in its own defense. I'm just saying that if you have the option of moving OUT of a big city, you might want to consider doing that.

Think I'm nuts? Check out this hearing that the House Committee on Homeland Security held three years ago. It's long -- hour and a half if I remember right -- but the experts who testified are wonderful, worth every minute. But be warned: You probably won't sleep tonight.

http://tinyurl.com/7khlxct

Posted by: Kathy from Kansas at March 04, 2015 02:58 PM (AcTdG)

333 I'm just happy Bibi didn't get "breitbarted" the night before the speech.

Pretty pitiful when your country's run so completely by the Chicago Mafia that you're just grateful when someone DOESN'T get assassinated.

Posted by: Kathy from Kansas at March 04, 2015 03:11 PM (AcTdG)

334
This business will get out of control It will get out of control, and we'll be lucky to live through it.

I wonder how people will feel when the Arab Gulf states start purchasing nukes from Pakistan as a counter to the shadow looming from Iran? or worse, start up their own facilities to match the Iranians?

This isn't going to end well. Not in the least.

Posted by: I R A Darth Aggie at March 04, 2015 04:10 PM (1hM1d)

335 THINK AGAIN DREW!
Bibi's speech was not about changing the First Turd's mind or actions on anything except:
(1) to get the world used to the idea that something must be done about the Mad Mullah's Manhattan Project, and
(2) to make it harder to shoot down Israel's planes when Israel launches airstrikes on Iran when they happen.

And P.S. - They're gonna happen, and probably within a year too.

Posted by: PLINY THE ELDER at March 04, 2015 07:27 PM (i5wUE)

336 I think I've sussed the official theme song of AOSHQ: Dylan's Black Diamond Bay.

Posted by: waelse1 at March 04, 2015 08:34 PM (rkCLP)

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