Sunday Morning Book Thread 06-15-2014: All Hail The Collective! [OregonMuse]

In America, Party Finds YOU

Good morning morons and moronettes and welcome to AoSHQ's stately and prestigious Sunday Morning Book Thread.

Forget It Jake, It's The Guardian

That's what one you morons told me last week in response to my pointing out the sheer lunacy of a Guardian article, but I have to admit, that newspaper is very good at providing me a lot good material for ridicule and abuse. Alan Skinner, one of the Guardian's literary commies in residence, thinks that self-publishing is "reactionary". Which means, basically, he doesn't like it. Skinner claims that self-publishing results in a narrowing of the field, not an expansion.

The crux of his argument appears to be this:

By definition, self-publishing is an individualistic pursuit in which each writer is both publisher and market adventurer, with every other writer a potential competitor and the reader reduced to the status of consumer. Publishing then becomes timid, fearing to be adventurous and revolutionary lest it betray the expectations of its market. This is a natural tendency in traditional publishing but it is one restrained by the voices of its authors who are free to put their work first and entrepreneurship a distant second. With authorship and entrepreneurship now equal partners, the new authorpreneurs have thrown off the dictatorship of the editor to replace it with the tyranny of the market.

As a matter of fact, I actually prefer the tyranny of the market to the dictatorship of the (ideologically-driven commie) editor, but that's beside the point. The point is, Skinner is absolutely terrified of what all of this individualism and entrepreneurship will lead to:

The individualism of the self-publishing authorpreneurs, is disturbingly close to Ayn Rand's Objectivism, in which the greatest goal is individual fulfillment.

Naturally, literary commies always have to throw in some Ayn Rand-bashing in order to establish their own virtue. But it does make Skinner sound like someone who could read Anthem and not understand why the future social order described in that book was not a good thing.

It's not that Skinner opposes independent writers operating outside of the major publishing houses. He prefers, instead, writers' groups ('collectives', if you will), but it seems obvious to me that these introverted, homogenous organizations are precisely where groupthink is enforced and independence driven out. He mentions this group and that group as examples of the type of writers' consortia he likes. I poked around the first site a bit, and was greatly put off it, particularly their so-called manifesto that reads like it was written by an over-heated high school student. For example:

YEAR ZERŲ is not an industry. YEAR ZERŲ is not a group of writers. YEAR ZERŲ is not a set of beliefs. YEAR ZERŲ is an approach to culture.

Good heavens, what a bunch of gassy, self-important windbags. It's not enough to be simply a group of writers. No, they have to be agents of social transformation because they write stuff. Back in the old days, they called this "putting on airs." I call it "being a pretentious jackass". I confess I don't know anything about this group, and after reading that, I'm not interested in finding out.

But keep in mind, this gasbaggery is what impresses the Guardian's Alan Skinner.

What we have here is a conflict of visions, (a) Writing As High Art vs. (b) Writing As Making A Living. If you like (a), you're going to find (b) aesthetically distasteful, like doing work that involves getting your hands dirty. And if you're a (b) type of person, you're going to think (a) is nothing but a bunch of pompous blowhards.

I reminded of a (perhaps apocryphal) story of a TV talk show that once had a group of authors on to talk about their craft, and one of them was Mickey Spillane. So they were asked the question 'what inspires you to write?' and they all talked about their various muses and sources of inspiration and it was all very artsy-fartsy and perhaps even quasi-religious, until it got to Spillane, who said something like "What inspires me to write? I just look at my checking account where I keep all my money and when it gets low, I think, 'well, it looks like it's time for me to write another book.'"

Lastly, I get the sneaking suspicious that what this boils down to is that self-publishing has opened the doors for a lot of conservative writers, and this annoys commie Skinner to no end. If the situation was reversed, and the self-published authors were fellow commies like Howard Zinn or Noam Chomsky, I'd bet Skinner's attitude would be more like "by Jove, this self-publishing phenomenon is really the best thing ever!"

Imagine Having To Deal With This All The Time. I Almost Feel Sorry For The Guy

Famous Opening Lines

How many opening lines from famous novels do you know? Take this quiz and find out. I scored 77%, but only because I guessed like crazy and, for whatever reason, a lot of my guesses turned out to be right.

Another Sci-Fi Book List

A couple of weeks ago, I linked to a list purporting to be 'classic' science fiction books, but most of which were of questionable relevance. This week, I found a better list here. Some of these actually deserve to be called classic. I'm very much interested in the dystopian novel WE, by Yevgeny Zamyatin, the very first book banned by the Soviet government, back in the 1920s.

I bought WE in a used bookstore many years ago, but never got around to reading it. It's now available on Kindle for $0.99.

Interesting story about this novel in the Amazon blurb:

At some point, it was an origin of a controversy between authors George Orwell (Nineteen Eighty Four), and Aldous Huxley (Brave New World). Orwell insinuated Brave New World was partly derived from We, charges that Huxley vehemently denied ( Orwell thought Huxley "was lying").

Kurt Vonnegut said that in writing Player Piano (1952), he "cheerfully ripped off the plot of Brave New World, whose plot had been cheerfully ripped off from Yevgeny Zamyatin's We."

So, if you're an author and other (more famous) authors are fighting over your book and using stuff from your book to write their books, that probably qualifies your book as a classic.

Bad Writing? You're Soaking In It

All the leading experts agree that the worst SF-F story ever written is the short novel Eye of Argon, authored by James F. Theis. Jim was only 16 years old when he wrote it, but that's no excuse. It appeared in the Ozark SF Society journal OSFAN in 1970.

I am reminded of this because last week, moronette Anna Puma described some of her sword-and-sorcery writing (which you can read here) as "purple prose". While this self-deprecation shows an admirable humility on her part, her writing would have to decrease in quality by several orders of magnitude in order to equal the wretched scribblings that constitute the Eye of Argon

How bad is it? They used to make a game of it at sci-fi conventions, to wit: the players take turns reading from EoA until they either burst out laughing, or fall over, choking and gagging.

Reportedly, the grandmaster challenge, which consists of reading EoA aloud while huffing helium from a balloon, has never been successfully accomplished.

As Andy Kaufman would say, Eye of Argon is so bad, it is terrible.

But don't take my word for it.

You can behold EoA in all it's ghastly glory at this link, and this includes the legendary lost ending. Also, the original fanzine has been scanned into a pdf document, so you can see exactly how it looked, crappy typesetting and all, when it first appeared in 1970.

Books To TV

23 Books Coming to TV This Year is quite a deceptive title, as a number of entries on this list have actually been showing on TV for years. But there are some of them that are, in fact, new this season, and might be of interest.

2014 Hugo Award Nominees For Best Novel

Might as well give you the list:

1. The Wheel of Time (series) by Robert Jordan, Brandon Sanderson
2. Neptune's Brood by Charles Stross
3. Parasite by Seanan McGuire
4. Warbound by Larry Correia
5. Ancillary Justice by Ann Leckie

The presence of #4 is the reason why the progressives are soiling themselves. Outspoken conservative? Burn the heretic!

Books By Morons

Infrequent moron commenter 'Stewed Hamm' tells me that his sister has become a new author, and hew novel The Achilles Heel, has just been published on Kindle and in paperback.

Annie Whitman's ordinary Midwest life is shattered with the sudden death of her husband Jack. Thirty-five and failing at life as a widow, she turns to the comforts of vodka in an attempt to camouflage the cold sheets of an empty bed. The necessary inebriation helps her to cope with Jack's death, but proves to be a deterrent in recovering any sense of normalcy. After spending several months at the bottom of a bottle, Annie stumbles upon a lockbox in the crawl space of her basement. Opening this box also opens her eyes to the likelihood that Jack Whitman might not have been the honest and doting man she married.

___________

So that's all for this week. As always, book thread tips, suggestions, rumors, threats, and insults may be sent to OregonMuse, Proprietor, AoSHQ Book Thread, at aoshqbookthread, followed by the 'at' sign, and then 'G' mail, and then dot cee oh emm.

What have you all been reading this week? Hopefully something good, because, as I keep saying, life is too short to be reading lousy books.

Posted by: Open Blogger at 10:03 AM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Year zero by definition does not exist.

I hate this and other perversions of identity and definition.

It's vanity posing as novelty,

Posted by: eman at June 15, 2014 10:06 AM (DxPVw)

2 Thanks to those who recommended This Kind of War: The Classic Military History of the Korean War. Finished it this week and was amazed at the concept of "limited war". Also, just ordered "Ship of Ghosts" for my Dad today. Thanks all.

Posted by: auscolpyr at June 15, 2014 10:08 AM (4cm9b)

3 I completed re-reading the WEB Griffin series about the Marine Corps. Have now started on Atlas Shrugged on my Samsung Tablet. What was a warning novel in 1957 when it was written has become a road map for the Democrats.

There is one thing that I found completely amazing in the section where Dagny and Reardon travel to WI to the shutdown auto factory is the description of the town they drove through near the factory. Ayn Rand was certainly prescient on this score. Her description of the town exactly matched the pictures of Detroit you see today.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 10:11 AM (T2V/1)

4 Everyone is pretentious. Everyone inflates their own importance to the world but, as the sayings goes, the graveyards of the world are filled with 'Indispensable Men' and yet, the world struggles on.

Posted by: toby928(C) at June 15, 2014 10:13 AM (QupBk)

5 Reading "An Army At Dawn: The War in North Africa 1942-1943" by Rick Atkinson and "Mr. Mercedes" by Stephen King.

Posted by: DangerGirl, who is tired at June 15, 2014 10:13 AM (GrtrJ)

6 Wasn't Year Zero the theme of the Khmer Rouge?

Posted by: toby928(C) at June 15, 2014 10:13 AM (QupBk)

7 Uhm Oregon Muse, I am not sure if you have complimented me or insulted me. Since it is Sunday I will take the position that thou hast complimented me. So thank you.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 10:14 AM (2BJZ7)

8 The individualism of the self-publishing authorpreneurs, is disturbingly
close to Ayn Rand's Objectivism, in which the greatest goal is
individual fulfillment.

LOL, ironic that they said this while I am actually re-reading Atlas Shrugged, Another thing that was prescient n the book was how the press went completely left wing and kissed the ass of the commie government.

Yes, the Democrats use that book as a road map and Obama has doubled down on it.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 10:15 AM (T2V/1)

9 Imagine Having To Deal With This All The Time. I Almost Feel Sorry For The Guy

She is tired of him giving all his love to Reggie.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 10:17 AM (T2V/1)

10 For Father's Day I've more or less got the kids to read and write/discuss a book together with our parents. We've scattered across the country and a family bible study isn't really possible anymore.

I haven't picked the book yet. Any suggestions? I'd like something not overly long, or too difficult for this. Something a bit more involved than The Holiness of God perhaps, but less than Knowing God. My parents just read Blackaby's Experiencing God and loved it, so maybe something at that level.

Posted by: .87c at June 15, 2014 10:20 AM (5wC6a)

11 I'd wager that none of the Year Zero members would last ten minutes in a regime that followed the original Year Zero model. Imagine the confusion on the poor dears' faces as they were lined up and clubbed to death with shovels for being able to read or wearing hipster glasses.

Posted by: PabloD at June 15, 2014 10:21 AM (XqA9z)

12 Good heavens, what a bunch of gassy, self-important windbags. It's not enough to be simply a group of writers.

You're speaking about the New York Times comments sections, right?

Posted by: Hurricane LaFawnduh at June 15, 2014 10:21 AM (Yh5Sg)

13 I did like how you placed Obama "progress" behind Communism poster behind the arrow, not in front. Regress, perhaps?

Posted by: Frank Ferrari at June 15, 2014 10:22 AM (LJMoI)

14 I'm thinking of starting college from scratch ( at fifty-three). It's not that I don't have a smattering of college credits but that I've found a good program in Applied Economics offered as an online program through Oregon State University. The only problem is that they have gone to a core requirements heavy on all the current prog priorities. So I was looking into Kindle titles relating to agriculture and I can't believe the asinine prices for any education related tomes. We're talking about two and three hundred dollars in some cases for essays on sustainability, women in agriculture, simply mind boggling, especially since almost all the authors are NGO or public university professors.

Posted by: whatmeworry? at June 15, 2014 10:24 AM (dZGNV)

15 This Alan Skinner. He is a bit of a collectivist ass, it seems.

Interesting that he denounces 'Samizdat', which was a physical literary practice in the old USSR, to get things written and handed about to read. To keep some ideas alive.

What Comrade Skinner wants to do is thought control. He really should put more effort into support Jerry Springer's talk show. That makes people stupid, which is probably the long term goal.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative riding the comfy chair at June 15, 2014 10:26 AM (+1T7c)

16 Reading "The Target" by David Baldacci. Goodreads gives 4/5 stars. I say that Baldacci has lost his mojo and is phoning it in. There's potential there, but he did n't pull it off.

I'm really looking forward to starting Steve Pressfield's new "The Lion's Gate." He has never disappointed.

Posted by: doug at June 15, 2014 10:29 AM (pC4eb)

17 Book Quiz: I got an amazing 40% considering there were only two books on the list that I had read.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 10:30 AM (T2V/1)

18 wall street loves socialism ?

Posted by: righter at June 15, 2014 10:30 AM (7IHSe)

19 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product?ASIN=B00A8SLOLI&force-full-site=1&ref_=kin_tos_o2_appm_bk_sf_dp

Posted by: whatmeworry? at June 15, 2014 10:31 AM (dZGNV)

20 Oops forgot need to format links.

Posted by: whatmeworry? at June 15, 2014 10:32 AM (dZGNV)

21 23 Books Coming to TV This Year

TV is usually even worse than Whoreywood in adapting movies.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 10:35 AM (T2V/1)

22 Am about halfway throuth "An Artist of the Floating World" by Kazuo Ishiguro with my book group. This wasn't my choice but it reads pretty well. It's about a fairly well known artist in post WW2 Japan who is being shunned by most people around him. The book is narrated from his perspective so you don't know why the others are reacting this way; whether it's self interest in how they're perceived or if he really did some horrible things that anybody would want to distance themself from.

In the books on the Crusades by Oldernbourg and Asbridge (his specifically the first Crusade) I've reached the point where the differences in attitudes between the traveling Western Europeans and the Byzantines (or "Greeks" as many call them but I've always been uncomfortable with that appellation, rightly or wrongly, because of modern geographical differences). The western Europeans were very gung ho on kicking ass themselves (by which they'd achieve salvation in their minds) whereas the Byzantines preferred to farm these things out to mercenaries. The Byzantines considered themselves better educated than the Euros, which surely they were but to what end? Also the Byzantines figured they could co-opt the Crusaders to reclaim some of the territory they'd recently lost and the Crusaders said "Fuck that shit; we're going to liberate Jerusalem". Also I hadn't known how bad things were for the Jews when some of the Crusaders were travelling through Germany, specifically Emicho of Leiningen, a huge cocksucker who plundered so much that he turned around before ever making it to Byzantium.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 15, 2014 10:35 AM (BSdf1)

23 Some opening sentences. Can anyone guess where they come from?

I was bathing in a lake when I saw the unicorn.

The Deliverator belongs to an elite order, a hallowed sub-category.

Lessa woke, cold.

The hills rolled up to the moon on slopes of wind-bent grass, crested, swept down into tangled brier shadows.

The personnel carrier lurches through the ruins under a wounded sky.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 10:35 AM (2BJZ7)

24 I got mugged by a used book store again yesterday, and when I finally got out I'd ended up with Walter Miller, "Canticle for Leibowitz".

In this world, there was a nuclear war and then, an orgy of destruction against nuclear physicists - and then against scientists - and then against everyone who could read, except to a VERY limited extent the Church. The Church as in, the Catholics; they're the only ones left.

The (Isaac Edward) Leibowitz of the title is the founder of one of these monastic communities; he had insisted on keeping knowledge alive and was murdered / martyred as a result. He was almost certainly a Jew but the Church anyway adopted him to the point of beatification. It was a further controversy on whether to call him "Isaac" or "Edward". The book is full of little ironies like this.

It's in three parts; I've only read the first so far. The plot revolves around a somewhat neurotic novice, Francis, who stumbles into (literally) a fallout shelter which had entombed Leibowitz's family and friends. Among the finds is a circuit diagram, which Francis - not understanding it - then copies into an illuminated manuscript. Meanwhile other finds stand to answer questions concerning whether Leibowitz deserves to be made a Saint in the Church (none of which involve whether he was or was not in the Church in the first place - the people in this time can barely conceive the question).

This book is a classic and deserves to be. If you've seen "The Book of Eli", the parallels are obvious to the point that the movie might even be a response or rebuttal to the book.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 10:36 AM (3kZUM)

25 "Imagine Having To Deal With This All The Time. I Almost Feel Sorry For The Guy"

The things I could tell you.

Posted by: Bo, the dog at June 15, 2014 10:36 AM (fcWGP)

26 O/T & sorry!
Cantor was on ABC Sunday show. Now Laura is on, probably going to take all the credit.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 10:36 AM (gjOCp)

27 Skinner types:

"With authorship and entrepreneurship now equal partners, the new
authorpreneurs have thrown off the dictatorship of the editor to replace
it with the tyranny of the market."

I'm pretty sure Skinner's writing about us. Forget the 'collective' thing; what Skinner really wants is a National Socialist Writers Union, through which only 'approved' writers can get published. For more info on that issue, see "Solzhenitsyn, Alexsandr" and "Samizdat".

Posted by: The Readers Who Buy Stuff at June 15, 2014 10:37 AM (JBggj)

28 About 3/4 through VDH's "The End of Sparta", a fictionalized account of the battle of Leuktra. It's pretty good.

Posted by: fastfreefall at June 15, 2014 10:37 AM (W+5GL)

29 RE: WOT and Hugo Awards

The first 3 books should have got an award. After that it split off into too many subplots and characters and stretched out too long.

I am becoming very disgusted with authors who do this. The books in the middle became boring.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 10:37 AM (T2V/1)

30 Silly me. I thought the goal of these self-important blow hards was to get more people to read. Seems self publishing is doing that. Congrats to all who have a book published, traditional or non-traditional

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at June 15, 2014 10:37 AM (HVff2)

31 Many thanks for the reccomendations fellow Morons!
I thoroughly enjoyed The Martian, and am now slowly working my way through The Coldest Winter.

What stands out to me are how may lives were lost simply due to the ego and hubris of our military and political leadership and the parallels with today's geopolitical climate.

It's a tedious read, but well worth the effort!

Posted by: Yep, I'm a nerd... at June 15, 2014 10:39 AM (FCgaq)

32 I should add that in the course of his plundering, Emichio brutally slaughtered a large number of Jews and caused a holocaust all on his own.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 15, 2014 10:39 AM (BSdf1)

33
It's amazing how many revolutionary groups in the 70s - 90s, still held Pol Pot as a hero. I'm sure some still do.

Posted by: Pug Jihad at June 15, 2014 10:40 AM (lJm99)

34
Heh. Kanye West thinks he's better than Shakespeare. He's got to be mentally ill.

Posted by: Pug Jihad at June 15, 2014 10:41 AM (lJm99)

35 I am not sure if you have complimented me or insulted me. Since it is Sunday I will take the position that thou hast complimented me. So thank you.

Sorry Anna, the formatting of that paragraph garbled the meaning.

I fixed it so now it should be obvious that I didn't mean it to be an insult.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 10:42 AM (fTJ5O)

36
I'm still freaked out about so many writers of fantasy fiction are perverts.

Posted by: Pug Jihad at June 15, 2014 10:43 AM (lJm99)

37 My favorite line from Eye of Argon so far:
"Your decision is a wise one, yet perhaps you would have been better off had you forced death," the soldier's mouth wrinkled to a sadistic grin of knowing mirth as he prodded his prisoner on with his sword point.

But the preceeding sentence is also good...as is the one following. Basically, every sentence is garbage. It's astounding.

Posted by: .87c at June 15, 2014 10:43 AM (5wC6a)

38 Kanye West thinks he's better than Shakespeare.

That's because the third act of the play I'ma Let You Finish hasn't started yet.

Spoiler: Nemesis wins.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 10:44 AM (3kZUM)

39 Of COURSE self-publishing routes around what I used to call the establishment literary-industrial complex and the gatekeepers ... and a lot of twaddle about PC and the current popular memes. But to do it right involves some considerable work and some specialized knowledge that traditionally published writers didn't have to worry about; cover design, layout and formatting, marketing. Personally, I like the control. I've been publishing independently since my first book - which I raised funds for through appealing to readers of my original blog - in (gulp) 2004. (Ten years? My, how time flies when you are having fun.) Now I actually own a Tiny Publishing Bidness with a niche clientele here in San Antonio and work with other independent authors in editing, formatting, designing and generally polishing their works to a high professional shine.

I also like to give certain PC understandings a metaphorical kick in the nuts as I pass. Can I beg for 'rons and 'ronettes to check out my own novels, all of which are historical fiction of the old-fashioned sort; nothing racier than Forever Amber or Gone With the Wind. I've hit a kind of summer slump here, until my next book comes out hopefully in November. All of them are available through Amazon and BN, in print and e-book versions.

To Truckee's Trail - about the 1844 wagon train party, which was the first to find a pass over the Sierra Nevada and take their wagons over it. They got caught in the snow and had some narrow escapes - two years before the Donner Party. They did everything right, and hardly anyone has ever heard of them.

Daughter of Texas and Deep in the Heart are about a woman's life in early Texas, during the war for independence and the Republic of Texas years. Margaret comes to Texas with her parents and brothers in 1825, when her father takes up a land grant. She grows up, marries, experiences the horrific 'runaway scrape', and eventually keeps a boarding house in Austin, where she knows everyone who is anyone.

The Adelsverein Trilogy is three books - The Gathering, The Sowing and The Harvesting - is about the German settlements in the Texas Hill country. 7000 German farmers, intellectuals and skilled craftsmen were recruited to come and settle on a land grant on the then-frontier, where they became Unionists during the Civil War, but eventually wove themselves into the local fabric. I have a great many fans for this series in Texas as it teaches local history in a painless and interesting way.

The Quivera Trail is kind of a follow-on to the Trilogy; two young Englishwomen come to Texas when one of them marries a Texas cattleman. I call it "Mrs. Gaskell meets Zane Grey." One of the 'rons read it some months ago and was kind enough to say nice things about it and to post an Amazon review.

The next book will be a kind of reworking of The Lone Ranger - a YA western called Lone Star Sons. Young Texas Ranger and his buddy the Delaware Indian scout have all kinds of interesting adventures in 1840s Texas. I'm posting the chapters as I write them on my book blog, www.celiahayes.com. Check them out - and I am looking for feedback and suggestions on it. This is the book that I hope to have out in November this year.

Thanks. We now return you to your regularly scheduled Sunday Morning Book Thread.

Posted by: Sgt. Mom at June 15, 2014 10:44 AM (Asjr7)

40 Her description of the town exactly matched the pictures of Detroit you see today.

I noticed that when i reread AS a couple of years ago. Rand gets trashed a lot (and I agree hers is not the best writing), but she's turning out to be quite a prophet.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 10:45 AM (fTJ5O)

41 Imagine Having To Deal With This All The Time. I Almost Feel Sorry For The Guy

I don't . I hope it's a living fuckin hell.

Posted by: tu3031 at June 15, 2014 10:45 AM (yagOO)

42 Oh thank you Oregon Muse. Thou art such a gentlebeing. I shall not then have to retire unto yon fainting couch with a case of the vapours whilst moaning sadly that no one likes my furtive scribblings.

Oh when I consider how my light is spent, 'ere in this dark world and wide...

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 10:45 AM (2BJZ7)

43 Okay, last one:
Can't you just see some absolute monarch yelling this when angry?

"Explain the purpose of this intrusion upon my chateau!"

Rolls off the angry tongue

Posted by: .87c at June 15, 2014 10:45 AM (5wC6a)

44 Well, thank Allah that Stewed Hamm didn't publish his new book on is home computer! That would be terrible!

Posted by: Barry Obama, Incompetent "John the Baptist" to the Mahdi at June 15, 2014 10:47 AM (XEaAj)

45 Not book related, but Happy Fathers Day to all Moron dads, and congrats to the Crank family!

Posted by: Insomniac at June 15, 2014 10:48 AM (mx5oN)

46 Last one for real. This immediately follows the chateau line:

"Your sirenity, resplendent in noble grandeur, we have brought this yokel before you (the soldier gestured toward Grignr) for the redress or your all knowing wisdon in judgement regarding his fate."

"Down on your knees, lout, and pay proper homage to your sovereign!" commanded the pudgy noble of Grignr.

"By the surly beard of Mrifk, Grignr kneels to no man!" scowled the massive barbarian.

"You dare to deal this blasphemous act to me! You are indeed brave stranger, yet your valor smacks of foolishness."

I assume the mispellings are because the transcriber was laughing too hard to type accurately. Maybe the tears were too thick to see the keys clearly.

Posted by: .87c at June 15, 2014 10:48 AM (5wC6a)

47 40 I noticed that when i reread AS a couple of years
ago. Rand gets trashed a lot (and I agree hers is not the best writing),
but she's turning out to be quite a prophet.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 10:45 AM (fTJ5O)

My biggest grip with her is too much verbiage. She needed a better editor. I also didn't like the fact that she was an atheist, but that can be blamed on where she grew up.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 10:49 AM (T2V/1)

48 Sacred writer's honor compels me to state for the record that Eye of Argon, the gold standard of wretched writing ("green ruby", forsooth!) does *not* commit the most common bad writing sin -- point of view violation. I find this fascinating.

It does not surprise me in the least that the Grauniad has indie publishing bass-akward. One reason indies are cleaning legacy publishing's clock is we can publish whatever we want, not what legacy thinks is appropriate. (To which the Grauniad sez "dino porn!" and to which I reply "Snooki!")

It isn't just the groupthink they want to enforce. It's that the market rudely points out that nobody WANTS their silly anguished literary navel-gazing novel. They want a world where people like and buy the "right things" and they won't do that if they actually have a choice. Just like certain busybodies are just sure if they outlaw potato chips everyone will finally discover they love celery sticks.

Posted by: Sabrina Chase at June 15, 2014 10:49 AM (2buaQ)

49 I'm still freaked out about so many writers of fantasy fiction are perverts.

Tell me about it. I've read stuff about Marion Zimmer Bradley this week that made my blood run cold.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 10:50 AM (fTJ5O)

50 Can't you just see some absolute monarch yelling this when angry? "Explain the purpose of this intrusion upon my chateau!"

Well, there was that time Reggie got his jacket stuck in the window, and Michelle got there first . . .

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 10:50 AM (3kZUM)

51 Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 10:36 AM (3kZUM)

Walter Miller was a US Army Air Corps WWII vet who witnessed the bombing of Monte Casino. Some have speculated that this had a substantial influence on Canticle for Leibowitz, including one of his children iirc. The guy had PTSD something fierce and ultimately would up eating a bullet in the 90s.

I read the book many years ago and enjoyed it.

Posted by: kilo6 at June 15, 2014 10:50 AM (QCWkv)

52 On the topic of authors: l just finished reading the dead tree edition of the local Sunday paper in which Kathleen Parker's column is reprinted. Her perfundity over the Cantor/Brat election has me contemplating putting my finger down my throat, which is my natural response to her writings. Hopefully I've remembered to trim my fingernails.

Posted by: fairweatherbill at June 15, 2014 10:52 AM (pMplU)

53 Did anyone buy Max Allan Collins' "Supreme Justice" for $1.99? It was mentioned in a "Kindle First June Books" email and has 4/5 stars from 278 reviewers.

Sounds like a good beach/plane book.

Posted by: doug at June 15, 2014 10:53 AM (pC4eb)

54 Green rubies are possible: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corundum

The blue ruby is better known as a "sapphire".

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 10:53 AM (3kZUM)

55 Sacred writer's honor compels me to state for the record that Eye of Argon, the gold standard of wretched writing ("green ruby", forsooth!) does *not* commit the most common bad writing sin -- point of view violation. I find this fascinating.

If you have a minute, you can you explain what 'point of view violation' is and perhaps point to an example? Thanks.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 10:54 AM (fTJ5O)

56 All the leading experts agree that the worst SF-F story ever written is the short novel Eye of Argon, authored by James F. Theis.

---------

James F. Theis was born August 9, 1953 and died March 26, 2002. He published The Eye of Argon in a fanzine in 1970 at age 16 (it did not appear until three months after his 17th birthday, but Theis himself claimed to have been 16 at the time of its writing). He did not write any more fiction, but did later pursue and earn a degree in journalism.

Ah.

Posted by: 98ZJUSMC Waiting for the Sun at June 15, 2014 10:54 AM (7HynG)

57 like I really needed to start my day with a pic of that clown.

Posted by: goatexchange at June 15, 2014 10:55 AM (sYUHT)

58
Year Zero

Those are really two very nasty evil two words- remember the Pol Pot regime in Cambodia ?

We're planning a quick trip to Cambodia in November to see the Ankgor Wat temples and we will see one of the killing fields near Phnom Phen I'm sure on a tour of that city

I'm sure those very smart intellectuals who think resetting time to Year Zero like Pol Pot did, would be ignoring the fact the intellectuals were the first to be murdered - teachers, authors, poets, scientists...gone to the killing fields

Anyway, my contribution to the book thread - The Past Times Book of Military Blunders which I picked up at a charity book sale

It's an old book (1991) so no new disastrous campaigns...

Not a bad read and covers battles from ancient times such as the Teutoberg Forest disaster to Operation Eagle Claw in 1980 (Iran)

Posted by: aussie at June 15, 2014 10:57 AM (EGwwB)

59 Happy Father's Day to President Obama. Don't work to hard today. We all love you here in Vermont!!!

Posted by: Dorcus Blimline at June 15, 2014 10:58 AM (hP/Mt)

60 "The flickering torches cast weird shafts of luminescence dancing over the half naked harlot of his choice, her stringy orchid twines of hair swaying gracefully over the lithe opaque nose, as she raised a half drained mug to her pale red lips."

I always think opaque noses are totally hot.

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 11:00 AM (N6DNt)

61 49 Tell me about it. I've read stuff about Marion Zimmer Bradley this week that made my blood run cold.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 10:50 AM (fTJ5O)

I have read a few of her books and I generally liked them. I had thought about getting her opus, Avalon, for the Kindle but when I checked it they want way too much money for it. Especially since it has been out for a long time.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 11:00 AM (T2V/1)

62 I got 18 right and 12 wrong on the quiz, and I practically never read fiction.

Posted by: rickl at June 15, 2014 11:03 AM (sdi6R)

63 Huh. Apparently Zombie Walter Miller wrote a sequel to "Canticle". This has a spoiler to the first book in its title, thus starting off with one strike against it. The book reviewers at Barnes Ampersand Noble, and Amazon, are giving it a "meh".

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 11:04 AM (3kZUM)

64 By the way, thanks dad for letting me steal your books.

Posted by: whatmeworry? at June 15, 2014 11:06 AM (dZGNV)

65 Ah! OregonMuse lit the Pedant-signal.

Point of view violation occurs where the narrative is third person, e.g. "The ewok wandered through the blasted landscape, looking for a wounded hobo. He wondered when he would see a bottle of Val-u-Rite again." and information is presented that the viewpoint character *cannot know* unless they are psychic, reading the cue cards, etc. "The hobo watched him pass by, oblivious and completely unaware of his hobo stench." The ewok is the POV character, and yet we are being told things the ewok can't know (because he is described as being "unaware" of the hobo.) That help?

Posted by: Sabrina Chase at June 15, 2014 11:06 AM (2buaQ)

66 "Imagine Having To Deal With This All The Time. I Almost Feel Sorry For The Guy"

This is what the media calls a "Marilyn Monroe moment."
Now that's world class purple prose, right there.

Posted by: Fritz at June 15, 2014 11:08 AM (3wLHY)

67 "Imagine Having To Deal With This All The Time. I Almost Feel Sorry For The Guy"

From a woman's POV, she is mostly angry at herself about the choice she made, but not self-aware enough to recognize it. I almost feel sorry for her because she actually has real emotions. Him, not so much.

I've been divorced a long time and the only regret I have is marrying the guy in the first place.

Not long ago, I was going to get married again. That relationship was chock full of drama and lies and nonsense. I was relieved to be free.

Which brought me to the Proverb (a paraphrase): it's better to live alone than with an asshole who makes you contemplate murder. Better for your soul.

Posted by: baldilocks at June 15, 2014 11:08 AM (36Rjy)

68
1 - I was bathing in a lake when I saw the unicorn.

2 - The Deliverator belongs to an elite order, a hallowed sub-category.

3 - Lessa woke, cold.

4 - The hills rolled up to the moon on slopes of wind-bent grass, crested, swept down into tangled brier shadows.

5 - The personnel carrier lurches through the ruins under a wounded sky.

1 The Last Unicorn?
2 Snowcrash
3 Dragon..flight? The first Pern novel anyway.
4 No idea.
5 I feel like I should know this (the wounded sky line feels familiar) but I can't place it.

Posted by: J. Random Dude at June 15, 2014 11:09 AM (8OfdL)

69 Purple Prose? I saw them open for Hendrix.

Posted by: whatmeworry? at June 15, 2014 11:09 AM (dZGNV)

70 On the Wheel of Time thing: Yes, in the middle of the series Jordan did start to proliferate plot lines and characters like he was going for a record, but overall, the series was one of the all time greats. I picked up the first book in paperback in high school, when the third book was out in hardcover, quickly picked up all three in hardcover and bought them as they came out in hardback since. To this day, the thing I most miss from when my apartment burned down was the 9-10 first edition hardcovers of that series.

Corriea is a fun author. Not profound, except in the still-stark contrast between good and evil. His are the types of books that kids should pick up, because they are fun. Guns, explosions, beautiful women, good guys and bad guys.

We often lament peoples lack of reading, and the fact that schools push dry, laborious texts at our kids is why. If you only could read Great Expectations or the Good Earth, wouldn't you be a bit gun-shy of reading, especially if you were a boy?

Not to mention authors like Robert Jordan, Jim Butcher, Larry Corriea, and Brandon Sanderson are an alternative to the style of George R.R. Martin, which seems to be growing in popularity these days.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at June 15, 2014 11:09 AM (TGgNi)

71 Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 10:50 AM (fTJ5O)

Happy I missed all that, but based on her books (which I generally liked) I'm not particularly surprised.

Posted by: Polliwog the 'Ette at June 15, 2014 11:09 AM (GDulk)

72 Lessa woke, cold.

First line in Weyr Search, the short story that began the Dragonriders of Pern series.

I hope Larry Correia's book wins. It's really great fun - he takes a normal "dour magick with 1930's setting" and turns it up to 11- it becomes a superhero story, not a wizard "lets all stare at navels" "oh woes is us" story.

Posted by: Inspector Cussword at June 15, 2014 11:10 AM (2mOaf)

73 57 like I really needed to start my day with a pic of that clown.

Posted by: goatexchange at June 15, 2014 10:55 AM (sYUHT)

Here watch this, it's therapeutic...

http://www.crazygames.com/game/falling-obama

Posted by: kilo6 at June 15, 2014 11:10 AM (QCWkv)

74
and information is presented that the viewpoint character *cannot know* unless they are psychic, reading the cue cards, etc. "The hobo watched him pass by, oblivious and completely unaware of his hobo stench." The ewok is the POV character, and yet we are being told things the ewok can't know (because he is described as being "unaware" of the hobo.) That help?

Posted by: Sabrina Chase at June 15, 2014 11:06 AM (2buaQ)

The ewok had previously lost his nose and sense of smell in a tragic sexual encounter with a womp rat.

See, there's an explanation for everything.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at June 15, 2014 11:11 AM (AHzA7)

75 Point of View violation is very simple.

The writer has forgotten who is telling the story. First person, think Gaylord Focker writing about his favorite subject - himself. So would be full of "I."

Second person is very rarely used. It is an odd way of writing.

Third person is split in two.
Limited - the writer is in a character's head exposing thoughts but descriptions are the author's. Can still tell the story from several characters, but only one at a time.
Omnipotent - think God is watching a soap opera and is each person's head hearing their thoughts and feeling their emotions. All at the same time.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 11:11 AM (2BJZ7)

76 67 Which brought me to the Proverb (a paraphrase): it's
better to live alone than with an asshole who makes you contemplate
murder. Better for your soul.

Posted by: baldilocks at June 15, 2014 11:08 AM (36Rjy)

I will have to remember that one.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 11:11 AM (T2V/1)

77 I've been reading more nonfiction, as usual. _A History of Future Cities_ by Daniel Brook, is a very interesting book. It's a history of purpose-built "cities of tomorrow" like St. Petersburg, Shanghai, and Bombay, all used as a lens to study the rise of Dubai.

He's a lefty, I think, but an honest one: full of lo the poor victims of imperialism when he's describing the slums and sweatshops of old Bombay and Shanghai, but he doesn't whitewash either the murderous Communists or the corrupt and idiotic post-British governments of India.

His thesis is an interesting one: that the three older cities were all built as showplaces of modernity and cosmopolitan gateways to isolated, backward countries. All three became hotbeds of revolution, both against cosmopolitanism and the norms of the old country as well. All three suffered from the consequences of the revolutions they bred, but eventually resumed their rightful place as centers of trade and intellectual life.

If he's right, Dubai will be the home of the next Arab nationalist movement, one which may well succeed in overthrowing the Gulf monarchies, but almost certainly will descend into bloodshed and tyranny.

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 11:12 AM (N6DNt)

78 The Eye of Argon is horrifically bad, and I wouldn't want to be forced to read all it, but I think that 16 year-old kid had an astounding vocabulary. Some of his descriptions were inventive-- lots of "swirls" and "crescents of crimson blood" -and his dialogue , if you cut the number of words on half, is no worse than what's in a lot of best-selling pulp. And he was certainly ambitious. Again, it's a 16 year old kid. I couldn't even nail down Raymond Carver's tone and timbre when I was his age....

Posted by: JoeyBagels at June 15, 2014 11:12 AM (HSwz6)

79 I noticed that when i reread AS a couple of years ago. Rand gets trashed a lot (and I agree hers is not the best writing), but she's turning out to be quite a prophet.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 10:45 AM (fTJ5O)

To me, Atlas Shrugged is simply too long. Over 1000 pages to tell a story that could be told in some 350. The ideas explored are actually very important and we are currently living out about the middle of the book. Whether the lights go out as the book ends is still in doubt.

Posted by: Retired Buckeye Cop who no longer considers himself a Republican at June 15, 2014 11:14 AM (1htQa)

80 I read "We" back in high school so it's been awhile. It was just something I stumbled across. And I've always liked "A Canticle for Lebowitz". I used to go through a lot of sci-fi but it stopped being interesting. I'll have to try a few things from some of the conservative writers.

Posted by: Notsothoreau at June 15, 2014 11:14 AM (Lqy/e)

81 Posted by: whatmeworry? at June 15, 2014 11:06 AM (dZGNV)

My dad did that too. Probably why I read so many Louis L'Amour, Allister McClean (sp?), and a wide variety of sci-fi and fantasy.

Posted by: Polliwog the 'Ette at June 15, 2014 11:14 AM (GDulk)

82 Last week I finished

"Slapstick or Lonesome No More" by Kurt Vonnegut.

Slapstick is generally recognized as Vonnegut's worst novel, and in fact, Vonnegut himself later said it was his worst.

But, I was curious after reading "Breakfast of Champions", his broad FU to his loyal readership and to America, to see if he followed the new principles that he himself set down for his future writing within that novel.

And-mirabile dictu!

He did!

***Vonnegut's Principles for Writing a Novel Post-BoC***

1) No characters from any of his previous novels were to be used. That whole world, those interesting characters...gone.

2) There would be no plot. Plot was an artificial construction that only stupid people needed. Instead, he would write of random events with no deeper meaning - like life itself.

3) Not a stated goal by KV but- I assumed after his thoroughly hate-filled trashing of the ideals, concept, history, and meaning of America at the beginning of BoC that any future books would be thematically anti-American.

Spoilers ahead because, really, you're never going to read this book unless you just want to prove to yourself that Vonnegut was a talentless hack and nothing more.

"Slapstick" is just that awful and that awfulness is the result of an experienced, successful author throwing away his hard-earned knowledge for a progressive's self-destructive didactic frolic (you may see parallels between this and the election of Barack Hussein Obama).

Yes, no characters or even hints of characters from other books.

Yes, no plot. That's right, no plot at all. Things just happen-

Twins looking like neanderthals are born. They're super-geniuses when together. One becomes president of the United States of America. The Chinese shrink themselves to ever smaller size. Gravity is wildly fluctuating maybe do to the Chinese. Maybe not. Heaven is a boring place where the dead complain all the time. The President twin destroys America by creating artificial families/groups and society falls apart. A plague that is killing everyone worldwide is actually caused by people breathing in the shrunken Chinese as they float like dust around the world.

If that sounds interesting at all. It's not.

Even Vonnegut seems to have gotten bored with the book as the main character suddenly dies for no reason(it's random! like life!).

And the last twenty or so pages read like an outline that KV didn't want to bother fleshing out. So..he didn't.

Anti-Americanism? You're soaking in it. The main character's daughter's highest dream is to become a slave of another character. And the main character is fine with that. People simply abandon America as a country to be with their artificial group/family- the progressive dream of atomizing American society completed. And so. Hi ho.

Even the jokes fall flat because there is no context for them. (Well, alright the new family/group names sometimes make you smile a bit.)

It's hard to explain just how awful this book is.

But, let me leave it at this- it's so bad that I went back and started reading the book that got me interested in Vonnegut in the first place, "Cat's Cradle" to see if I was wrong about his talent.

I assume after "Slapstick" Vonnegut threw away his new principles and went back to writing plotted books for "stupid" people.

Hi ho.

Posted by: naturalfake at June 15, 2014 11:15 AM (KBvAm)

83 One of the amusing things about Skinner's whinging is the fact that self-publishing is immensely popular with young leftie writers who see people like Skinner as "conservatives" when it comes to the writing industry. (One of my favourite authors, Larry Correia, has talked about this, I believe) Elitism doesn't always mean "higher quality", and even some young leftie writers view old school publishing as an "old boy's network".

Skinner's a commie, to be sure, but when it comes to protecting his own institutions, people like him turn downright hidebound. So it's great fun for me to watch Millennial writers acting on what the Geezer Left has been encouraging them to do all their lives: tear down institutions. They just never expected theirs would be under attack, as well. It's amusing enough to invest in popcorn futures.

Posted by: Saber Alter at June 15, 2014 11:15 AM (SJWEU)

84 "We" is not a fun or easy read. It's Russian, and the author was trying to convey a very alien and unpleasant mind-set. I slogged through it a couple of decades ago but didn't enjoy the experience.

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 11:16 AM (N6DNt)

85
I'm sure those very smart intellectuals who think resetting time to Year Zero like Pol Pot did, would be ignoring the fact the intellectuals were the first to be murdered - teachers, authors, poets, scientists...gone to the killing fields

Russian commies did it, nazis did it, too. You kill anyone who may have leadership potential.

Posted by: Pug Jihad at June 15, 2014 11:16 AM (lJm99)

86 Wow, that Eye of Argon...

How did I not know about that?

It's like an entire Bulwer-Lytton Contest short story. You'd think there was no way he could keep that up - and he does!

F*ing Brilliant!

Posted by: Clutch Cargo at June 15, 2014 11:17 AM (7HjKx)

87 Posted by: Aetius451AD at June 15, 2014 11:09 AM (TGgNi)

Son (14), and Eldest Kidlet (16), both really like the Monster Hunters International series (and so do I for that matter).

Posted by: Polliwog the 'Ette at June 15, 2014 11:18 AM (GDulk)

88 Since some have taken stabs at those opening lines I posted. Time to match sentence with book and author.

1. Ariel by Steven R. Boyett
2. Snow Crash by Neal Stephenson
3. Dragonflight or Weyr Search is acceptable. Anne McCaffrey
4. God Stalk by P.C. Hodgell.
5. Passage at Arms by Glen Cook.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 11:19 AM (2BJZ7)

89 Oh gawd, some goofball adapted "Slapstick" as a film in 1984.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 11:19 AM (3kZUM)

90 By definition, self-publishing is an individualistic pursuit in which each writer is both publisher and market adventurer, with every other writer a potential competitor and the reader reduced to the status of consumer.

What? In traditional publishing the reader is a consumer.

With self-publishing, a reader can publish himself if he has something to say.

Same thing with music. Nowadays musicians and bands can record their own CDs at home and sell them at their gigs. Or just sell downloads of their songs online.

No need to be signed to a record label. This is incredibly empowering for the individual.

Posted by: rickl at June 15, 2014 11:20 AM (sdi6R)

91 Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 11:04 AM (3kZUM)
Yes, Saint Leibowitz and the Wild Horse Woman was teh suck IMHO but I'm no literary expert.

I forgot to mention, A Canticle for Leibowitz is available as free audio on archive.org if you're interested.

https://archive.org/details/ACanticleForLiebowitz

Posted by: kilo6 at June 15, 2014 11:20 AM (QCWkv)

92 Someone mentioned that they had read some stuff on M.Z Bradley and it had kind of freaked them out.

One thing that has always fascinated me about reading, especially series reading, is how much you can get a feel for the author by reading their books.

I remember a series I was reading in high school, where by book three I realized that every single female character in the series (it was a sword and sorcery series that I cannot remember the author for) was raped at some point in the book. Once I realized that, I immediately stopped reading. Creepy.

If anyone has read Stephen R. Donaldson's stuff, you know the feeling. When I was younger, I loved the verbal imagery of the first Thomas Covenant series. As I got older and reread the books, I started to realize that he has some serious issues.

Laurel K. Hamilton was another I read for a little while, until I realized she was using the books to work out her own relationship/fantasy issues.

George R.R. Martin turned me off fairly early because it is pretty evident how he sees the world. It is not pretty.

I am not saying you cannot see and get a feel for the personal issues of authors like Butcher, Jordan, or Corriea, but you do not get the feeling that you would be terrified for your children to be in a room alone with them either.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at June 15, 2014 11:20 AM (TGgNi)

93 TV shows:
BBC is filming Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrel. Awesome!
I wish I had Starz - wanna watch Outlander.

I'm going to give The Strain and Dominion a try.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 11:22 AM (GSIDW)

94
My biggest grip with her is too much verbiage. She needed a better editor. I also didn't like the fact that she was an atheist, but that can be blamed on where she grew up.

I think the verbiage is a relic of where she grew up also.
IIRC she is originally from Russia, have you ever read where a Russian uses just a few words when many will do?

Posted by: PMRich at June 15, 2014 11:22 AM (eEBON)

95 Ugh. 53% on the first-line quiz. We need a library in the barrel.

Posted by: creeper at June 15, 2014 11:22 AM (DsZ4U)

96 To me, Atlas Shrugged is simply too long. Over 1000 pages to tell a story that could be told in some 350.

Definitely, yes. As Vic said, she badly needed an editor. In fact, I'm surprised they let her get away with all that endless monologing without a single excision.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 11:24 AM (fTJ5O)

97 92 turns out MZB had not only covered up for her pedophile husband, she herself had raped her own daughter and other minors.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 11:24 AM (GSIDW)

98 Currently reading The Little World of Don Camillo-- flawed Italian priest butts heads with new communist mayor in small rural Italian village. Wonderful small stories.

Posted by: --- at June 15, 2014 11:25 AM (MMC8r)

99 In a way it's a shame that "Argon" got as notorious as it did, because Jim Theis never wrote anything else. That's too bad because under the godawful prose he does show some talent. The plot makes sense -- it's the kind of thing Robert E. Howard might have banged out in a week if he needed money in a hurry. If Theis had kept writing and improved his craft, he might have become a success.

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 11:26 AM (N6DNt)

100 97 Wow, that's... horrible.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at June 15, 2014 11:26 AM (TGgNi)

101 Clutch Cargo then you should definitely invest in my book that Oregon Muse links to. Read about poor Sluggor and the Courtesan Trials...

I should one day return and see if I can actually craft a whole book from his impulses, yes he is a bit self centered in his reasons. But he is not evil or anything. Just a wharf rat for want of a better term who wants a better life and is willing to work at it.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 11:26 AM (2BJZ7)

102 And commies are always upset when their centralized power is jeopardized. Self-publishing is the ultimate egalitarian ideal-- every person can put forward their ideas without censorious gatekeepers. Of course they're threatened.

Posted by: --- at June 15, 2014 11:28 AM (MMC8r)

103 Someone mentioned that they had read some stuff on M.Z Bradley and it had kind of freaked them out.
One thing that has always fascinated me about reading, especially series reading, is how much you can get a feel for the author by reading their books.

Bradley married a child molester, whom she aided and abetted enthusiastically. She brutalized her own daughter for years. I don't think you can get that from her books.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 11:29 AM (fTJ5O)

104 Backstrom trailers remind me of House, except crime instead of medical forensics. Could be brilliant, but also could be way over the top. Here's to hoping it's the former.

Posted by: CaptSlaq at June 15, 2014 11:29 AM (5N1/Y)

105 I have read a few of her books and I generally liked
them. I had thought about getting her opus, Avalon, for the Kindle but
when I checked it they want way too much money for it. Especially since
it has been out for a long time.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 11:00 AM (T2V/1)

Check your email. Happy Father's Day

Posted by: Tunafish at June 15, 2014 11:30 AM (Ac5N/)

106 I have mentioned a few times a loose group of authors who had rebelled against the politically-correct and "literary elite" takeover of organizations such as SFFA. These are not necessarily conservatives but tend to be individualists, and Correia is probably the most obvious member, but one of the key hangouts seems to be Sarah Hoyt's blog "According to Hoyt."

For those who are interested in the shenanigans and finding links to that sort of writer.

I'm on my netbook and can't find my links to their old apellation, but they are now referring to themselves ironically as "The Evil League of Evil" because of the angry reactions and over-amped rhetoric of those who would shun them.

I have little spare time now, but this "carpet-bombing of the conversation" to try to isolate voices against The Collective is pretty much what the left does when they get power (or what any absolutist does when they get power, i.e. Islamists, Utopianists of every stripe - on average we would call these groups "left" with one or two notable exceptions).

I haven't read it yet but Sarah has an article up referring to El Niel (L. Niel Smith), a Libertarian author of some long standing, regarding societal collapses.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at June 15, 2014 11:31 AM (qyfb5)

107 The thing about writers and contributors to the Manchester Guardian is that you can't write there unless you are at or above the90th percentile on the CRI standard.

What I'm saying there is that if your cranium isn't inserted up your rectum more frequently than 90% of the population, you are too smart to be published in the Guardian.

Posted by: Comanche Voter at June 15, 2014 11:32 AM (wdHk6)

108 Second the endorsement of Hoyt and her 'blog. Her "Hoyt's Huns" are pretty much all honorary Morons.

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 11:33 AM (flppM)

109 What I did get from Bradley's books is an animus against "traditional religion", that is Christianity. Because judgey.

Oh yeah, and the incest pr0n between Arthur and Morgana in "Mists of Avalon". Apparently it's okay if it's done for a pagan god but not okay if just for fun. (Don't ask me to explain this.)

First and last Bradley book I read.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 11:33 AM (3kZUM)

110
Thanks Oregon Muse for this thread - it really is a great source of book info

Good night all from Down Here, bed time as it's Monday and back to work time soon- hope you all have a wonderful yesterday and I'll see you all tomorrow !

Posted by: aussie at June 15, 2014 11:34 AM (EGwwB)

111 Apparently MZB was a lesbian who married a pedophile.

These are the people who lecture us?

Posted by: --- at June 15, 2014 11:35 AM (MMC8r)

112 In preparation for my trip next week to England I am re-reading "History of the World in 100 Objects" the biggest problem with the book is it is obvious the director of the British Museum is a hard core leftist thinker and it comes through in some of the descriptions of the objects. But overall it is a fascinating book of essays about 100 objects in the British Museum that trace the course of history around the world.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlinSeattle at June 15, 2014 11:35 AM (+0txR)

113 101
Just a wharf rat
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 11:26 AM (2BJZ7)

You mentioned "Wharf Rat".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmT_4RQ0ANU

One of the best Dead songs ever.

Posted by: rickl at June 15, 2014 11:36 AM (sdi6R)

114 Good night aussie!

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 11:36 AM (fTJ5O)

115 Anne McCaffrey, by contrast, was also a feminist in her books, and put sex scenes in them, but didn't go full pervert afaik.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 11:36 AM (3kZUM)

116 "turns out MZB had not only covered up for her pedophile husband, she herself had raped her own daughter and other minors."

Ouch. Never heard about that.

"What I did get from Bradley's books is an animus against "traditional religion", that is Christianity. Because judgey."

And she didn't even get THAT right. I wouldn't mind Anachronism Stew (which the entire King Arthur mythos is in the first place) but modern goddess worship does not belong. (Wicca was invented in the early 1900s at the very earliest) So the "paganism" in her books isn't even real paganism, it's New Age-flavored monotheism. (Not that real paganism would fly when you're trying to market a book to Moonflower; real paganism was patriarchal liek whoa)

I'd say anyone who wants a "Arthurian myth with a feminist twist is better off watching Fate/Zero. (Skip the visual novel and wait until the reboot of the anime is out if you want to check out Fate/stay night)

Posted by: Saber Alter at June 15, 2014 11:37 AM (SJWEU)

117 94 I think the verbiage is a relic of where she grew up also.
IIRC she is originally from Russia, have you ever read where a Russian uses just a few words when many will do?

Posted by: PMRich at June 15, 2014 11:22 AM (eEBON)

Yeah, I thought of that too. Perhaps she was trying to emulate Tolstoy. But you have to admit there are some who are from other places who suffer from the same disease. J.R.R, Tolkien was one and he was from Great Britain.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 11:38 AM (T2V/1)

118 The nice thing about all the self published books now is that there is more diversity of choice, not less. So if I don't want to read the zillionth dystopian YA trilogy about some girl who is supposed to be strong and kickass yet gets rescued by the put upon hero in the end I don't have to.

Though I still think Dino romance is a bridge too far....

Posted by: ParanoidGirlinSeattle at June 15, 2014 11:38 AM (+0txR)

119 Just read "A Cast of Stones" by Patrick Carr and enjoyed it. It's the first in a series and is free on Kindle.

I liked it enough to pay for the other two books in the trilogy.

Anna, the only one I recognized was the "Lessa woke, cold." line because I had that whole freakin' series memorized by high school. ...Then her son took over.

Posted by: nnptcgrad at June 15, 2014 11:39 AM (Opyrm)

120 Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 11:29 AM (fTJ5O)

Wow...Yeah. I knew she was *probably* a little "off" from her Darkover novels, but had no clue it was *anything* like that bad.

Posted by: Polliwog the 'Ette at June 15, 2014 11:39 AM (GDulk)

121 Dino romance?

T. Rex and S.Saurus living together in sin?

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 11:39 AM (2BJZ7)

122 One book that freaked me out was Dancers of Arun by Elizabeth A. Lynn.
I read the 1st book (Watchtower) as a teen and it was fantasy, cool. So as an adult I stumbled on the 2nd book.
In it the main character, a teen boy, goes to search for his idolized older brother. Near the end older bro rapes him and he is cool with it.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 11:39 AM (GSIDW)

123 Poliwog L'AMOUR is one of my favorite writers. He loved books and kept a list of every one he read.

Posted by: whatmeworry? at June 15, 2014 11:40 AM (dZGNV)

124 97
92 turns out MZB had not only covered up for her pedophile husband, she herself had raped her own daughter and other minors.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 11:24 AM (GSIDW)

I will refrain from buying Myst of Avalon for kindle even if they get around to reducing the price to reasonable.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 11:41 AM (T2V/1)

125 Posted by: nnptcgrad at June 15, 2014 11:39 AM (Opyrm)

That was the only one I recognized as well.

Posted by: Polliwog the 'Ette at June 15, 2014 11:42 AM (GDulk)

126 Posted by: .87c at June 15, 2014 10:20 AM (5wC6a)

Family Book Study suggestion

"Renovation of the Heart" by Dallas Willard.
It also has questions after each chapter which are a good focus for discussion.

I'd recommend "The Divine Conspiracy" which is my favorite of his books but it is really long. A great book but loooong.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at June 15, 2014 11:43 AM (lLdbc)

127 nnptcgrad, I do like that series. But Anne, bless her soul, by Masterharper of Pern had thoroughly sold out and was merely milking it for as much money as possible. Then she set about joining her universes together. Dinosaur Planet and The Coelura became part of the same grand universe as Pern.

So I walked away and have never read any of the books that followed where her son co-authored and then wrote on his own.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 11:45 AM (2BJZ7)

128 Second person is very rarely used. It is an odd way of writing.

It is, however one of my favorite soldier's memoirs of WWII, the "Guns" trilogy by George Blackburn, is told in the second person. Somehow it works.

Posted by: Waterhouse at June 15, 2014 11:45 AM (VJq4l)

129 Yikes and away!

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 11:45 AM (2BJZ7)

130 Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 11:39 AM (GSIDW)

Yikes! Will stay away from that author I think. Looking back, I think I read *a lot* of nastiness that just didn't "take" because I was generally very innocent. I'm grateful to have only the vaguest memories of that stuff (and no those weren't the books my dad lent me, those were probably library books).

Posted by: Polliwog the 'Ette at June 15, 2014 11:45 AM (GDulk)

131 T. Rex and S.Saurus living together in sin?

No, we're talking dinosaur pr0n. It's pretty silly:
http://nymag.com/thecut/2013/10/qa-the-women-who-write-dinosaur-erotica.html

Warning mildly NSFW for bikini pics

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 11:46 AM (fTJ5O)

132 I am also re-reading a bunch of romance novels this week. But no dinos, werewolves, vampires, shape shifters, ghosts, or tragically scarred heros in them. I am weirdly picky about romance when I read that genre and it really narrows my book choices these days.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlinSeattle at June 15, 2014 11:47 AM (+0txR)

133 Maybe someone can help me find a short story or book that I have been looking for for a while.

When I was a kid (maybe 12-13) my Dad told me a story about something he had read when he was in high school. I will try to relate it to the best of my ability (this was over 20 years ago.)

Humans had gone out among the stars. There they found a group of species working together. Somehow, they had gone to war with this group. It was a terrible war. The group could not completely defeat the humans, but they managed to somehow seal us off in our solar system.

Many years pass. The group does not look in or hear a peep from our solar system.

In the fullness of time, they encounter a new race that immediately declares war on them with a savagery they have not seen since they encountered humans.

The politicians of the collective argue and debate as the war with this new aggressive species turns more and more against them. As they grow closer and closer to defeat they begin to think that maybe they could fight one threat with another. If they could somehow convince the humans to aid them in exchange for lifting the lock on our solar system, maybe they could stave off their own annihilation.

A ship is sent to our solar system to open up a dialogue. The aliens enter our solar system for the first time in centuries.

They fly over the Earth and cannot find any large settlements, only rural farm communities. Finally, needing to do something, they land outside of one farmer's house.

They enter the farmhouse to find a very simply dressed farmer and his wife. He welcomes them and tells them when they ask how to reach the leaders of the humans to sit down at the table and tell them their trouble.

The aliens are a bit off put by this, but they are desperate to get help for their people. So they sit at the table and tell the farmer and his wife what is going on in the larger galaxy. They list the dire straits the people of the galaxy are under from this new threat. How close to defeat they are and the deal they wish to make with the humans for help.

The farmer listens in silence until they finish their tale.

"That is one big mess you have there," the Farmer says.
"Will you ask your leaders for their help?" The Aliens beg.
"Don't have to. We never liked bullies much in these parts. We'll help you." The Farmer says simply.

The aliens are a bitt befuddled. Here is this simple man telling them that the dreaded humans will aid them against this new threat.

The aliens ask how long it will take for the humans to come help them.

The farmer says, "Oh, don't worry, we will be right behind you."

The captain realizes pretty quickly that he will not get anything further, and as he returns to his ship he is already trying to figure out how to explain to his superiors what happened when he landed on Earth. He doesn't think that the humans from what he has seen can be of much aid, but at least he can tell them they have made contact with SOMEONE willing to help.

As their ship is leaving the solar system, his science officer tells him to look through his scanner. The Captain is astounded to see the ENTIRE PLANET EARTH following their ship majestically out of the solar system.

This sound familiar to anyone? It has always stayed with me.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at June 15, 2014 11:50 AM (TGgNi)

134 From main post to barrel; that's gotta be a first.

Posted by: Fritz at June 15, 2014 11:50 AM (3wLHY)

135 Fritz, you have no idea...

Some classic Saturday morning cartoon Cadillacs and Dinosaurs.
http://youtu.be/HZ_shWT3Kc8

As an antidote to the dino pr0n.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 11:53 AM (2BJZ7)

136 Not about a book, but I thought the morons might enjoy this followup to a DIT post from yesterday:

http://t.co/ffjK1nEyme

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 11:54 AM (DmNpO)

137 Speaking of the pretentious Google, I am reading "The Circle" by Dave Eggers, the story of a young woman who goes to work for The Circle, an outfit obviously modeled on Google. So far so good! Their culture is pretty creepy and is about to get creepier I would bet.

Posted by: PJ at June 15, 2014 11:55 AM (cHuNI)

138
Literary Trivia

What is the origin of "click," the unit of measurement?

a) World War I
b) World War II
c) Vietnam war
d) Peloponnesian War
e) Civil War

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 11:58 AM (A6JmE)

139 I'm a Kurt Vonnegut fan from way back. I discovered his books when I was in college.

Yeah, nothing especially original about that.

Anyway, he was an admitted socialist, and while his later work was increasingly crotchety and mean-spirited, his early books were often hilarious.

"Player Piano" was his first novel, and was written while he worked in the public relations department at General Electric. It explored a future in which robots and computers did most of the drudge work, and people sat around with nothing much to do. It was kind of prescient, as we are struggling with that problem today. Half of the people born are on the left side of the intelligence bell curve, while more and more jobs being created are better suited for people on the right side. What are we going to do about that?

Also, "Cat's Cradle" is one of the funniest novels ever written, in the same sense that "Dr. Strangelove" is one of the funniest movies ever made. Both deal with the end of the world.

Posted by: rickl at June 15, 2014 11:59 AM (sdi6R)

140 The link for Parasite goes to a different author's book. Somebody at the top of this chain said he had just read Griffin's Men at War series. I wonder if he found book 9 rather stupid with all of the randy men who were jumping from woman to woman and screw the Corps? Not a great plot, either.

Posted by: TimothyJ at June 15, 2014 11:59 AM (ep2io)

141 Casey Kasem has died.

Geez....what a horrible father's day for his kids.

Posted by: Tami at June 15, 2014 12:00 PM (v0/PR)

142 Sooth dinky dau

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/theorderlyroom/f/faqklickdef.htm

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 12:00 PM (2BJZ7)

143 105 OK

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:01 PM (T2V/1)

144 Geez....what a horrible father's day for his kids.

***

Thank God he was senile his last few months because they seem hellacious.

Now the family is fee to REALLY get ugly.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:02 PM (DmNpO)

145 free to

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:02 PM (DmNpO)

146
Shaggy's dead?

rut
ro

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:02 PM (A6JmE)

147 WW I is my guess. Click=kilometer, wasn't adopted as a unit of measurement until 1872.

Posted by: fairweatherbill at June 15, 2014 12:03 PM (pMplU)

148 Geez....what a horrible father's day for his kids.

Weren't the kids the ones that wanted to remove his feeding tube?

Posted by: --- at June 15, 2014 12:03 PM (MMC8r)

149
Vulgar Rants

Casey Kasem's vs Paul Anka's?

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:04 PM (A6JmE)

150 109 Oh yeah, and the incest pr0n between Arthur and
Morgana in "Mists of Avalon". Apparently it's okay if it's done for a
pagan god but not okay if just for fun. (Don't ask me to explain this.)

First and last Bradley book I read.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 11:33 AM (3kZUM)

That particular scene comes from the original Le morte d'arthur

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:04 PM (T2V/1)

151 Say a prayer of thanks, Casey is now freed from this mortal coil that was more a chain upon his soul. He is free of infirmity.

As for his surviving family, well George R.R. Martin is probably taking notes for his next GoT novel.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 12:04 PM (2BJZ7)

152 I got a 60% on the quiz. I have never read anything by some of this writers.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at June 15, 2014 12:05 PM (lLdbc)

153 Thank God he was senile his last few months because they seem hellacious.

Now the family is fee to REALLY get ugly.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:02 PM (DmNpO)

I could never get a read on who the bad guys were in that story....the kids or the step mother. Could be both I guess. But the daughter didn't seem batshitcrazy....the wife on the other hand......

Posted by: Tami at June 15, 2014 12:05 PM (v0/PR)

154 109 additional reply

You are right about her dislike for religion. That particular disease infects a LOT of writers though.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:06 PM (T2V/1)

155 Re: 137 -- Agree. I recommend "The Circle"

Posted by: doug at June 15, 2014 12:06 PM (pC4eb)

156 The Vulgar Rants opened for the Sex Pistols CBGB's in 1978. I was the bouncer.

Posted by: fairweatherbill at June 15, 2014 12:06 PM (pMplU)

157

Zoiks!

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:06 PM (A6JmE)

158
I'll bet Casey Kasem invented "zoiks!"

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:07 PM (A6JmE)

159 Sorry; Typo-"those" writers

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at June 15, 2014 12:07 PM (lLdbc)

160 Weren't the kids the ones that wanted to remove his feeding tube?

Posted by: --- at June 15, 2014 12:03 PM (MMC8r)

Yeah but I'm not in a position to judge if that was a bad thing. Could have been the right thing to do...dunno.

Posted by: Tami at June 15, 2014 12:08 PM (v0/PR)

161 Casey's trophy wife did seem a real piece of work in how she kept trying to hide him from his own children. Where there is a will, there is a motive.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 12:09 PM (2BJZ7)

162 Speaking of being freaked out: I finished Blood Meridian by Cormac McCarthy. Toward the end he reached for a transcendental style similar to Gabriel Garcia Marquez and largely succeeded and when I finished I felt revolted, spiritually unclean and a little amazed. I've never had such a reaction to a novel before.

Searching for something as good as Ender's Game I finally realized that there is an entire series following Speaker for the Dead and I am happily almost through Xenicide and there have actually been moments where I got chills when urgent events are slyly tied back to merely interesting plot devices from Ender's life 3,000 years before. As a biologist I appreciate the care taken with the science; that aspect is far better than in Speaker.

Posted by: Daybrother at June 15, 2014 12:09 PM (isAKo)

163 I love how Skinner finds it horrifying that people can empower themselves through self publishing. He seems to forget that in the field of writing, you are competing against other writers. And the internet has done more for leveling the playing field for people than any collective ever could.

Those facts grate on his nerves and I find it satisfying to read his anguish.

Posted by: NR Pax at June 15, 2014 12:10 PM (ODsL5)

164 I could never get a read on who the bad guys were in that story....the kids or the step mother. Could be both I guess. But the daughter didn't seem batshitcrazy....the wife on the other hand......

***

In the end, the daughter ended up being right. When he was removed from where the wife had hidden him, he had deeply infected bed sores and spent his remaining days in intensive care.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:10 PM (DmNpO)

165
I'm still upset about Gary Coleman's death. His stupid wife killed him and got away with it.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:10 PM (A6JmE)

166 In the end, the daughter ended up being right. When he was removed from where the wife had hidden him, he had deeply infected bed sores and spent his remaining days in intensive care.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:10 PM (DmNpO)

Oh wow! Didn't know that. Horrible...

Posted by: Tami at June 15, 2014 12:13 PM (v0/PR)

167 Holy crap, I had not heard about any of this drama re: the end of Casey Kasem's life.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 12:14 PM (fTJ5O)

168 Vic,
I bought Atlas Shrugged shortly after SCOAMT was elected, but never read it. I used to read one to two books a week.
I can't hold books in my hands anymore because effed up neck affects hands & they get numb if I hold things.
I have to read with book on kitchen table.

I'll have to read it in the fall, after rose season.

I can't hold iPad either, I keep on a stand.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:15 PM (gjOCp)

169 Isn't the Internets wonderful. We can now learn that there are a lot more scummy people out there than we ever knew about. They had been protected by the MFM.

If you really want to get sick go to the site "Find A Death" and look up how Bob Crane died.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:16 PM (T2V/1)

170 I think the throwing of a pound of hamburger meat and paraphrasing the Bible as she did it firmly moved me to "the wife is batshit crazy" camp and onto the side of his poor kids who seemed like they were just trying to keep him comfortable in his last days.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlinSeattle at June 15, 2014 12:17 PM (+0txR)

171 168 I can't hold iPad either, I keep on a stand.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:15 PM (gjOCp)

Have you tried the paperback?

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:17 PM (T2V/1)

172 Holy crap, I had not heard about any of this drama re: the end of Casey Kasem's life.

****

He has an estate worth, IIRC, something like $80M.

The daughter pleaded with the step-mom, told her she'd not take a dime fro the estate, if she would just let the kids spend his remaining time with him. Still the wife kept hiding him.

I'd bet that all bets are off now.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:18 PM (DmNpO)

173 150 109 Oh yeah, and the incest pr0n between Arthur and
Morgana in "Mists of Avalon". Apparently it's okay if it's done for a
pagan god but not okay if just for fun. (Don't ask me to explain this.)

First and last Bradley book I read.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 11:33 AM (3kZUM)

That particular scene comes from the original Le morte d'arthur
Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:04 PM (T2V/1)

Julianna Margulies is so fucking hot that I would hit that no matter how she was related to me. Sister, mother, daughter, I don't care.

Posted by: rickl at June 15, 2014 12:18 PM (sdi6R)

174
NH has outlawed driving and holding a cellphone...I assume hands-free devices are still okay.

MA outlaws only teen cellphone use on the road.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:20 PM (A6JmE)

175 I guess everyone in NH will have to have blue tooth installed.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:21 PM (T2V/1)

176 Julianna Margulies is so fucking hot that I would hit that no matter how she was related to me. Sister, mother, daughter, I don't care.

***

Another woman who became more beautiful with age.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:21 PM (DmNpO)

177 173 Julianna Margulies is so fucking hot that I would
hit that no matter how she was related to me. Sister, mother, daughter,
I don't care.

Posted by: rickl at June 15, 2014 12:18 PM (sdi6R)

AoS rule #2; if no pic it didn't happen.
http://tinyurl.com/mpwtwhl (SFW)

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:23 PM (T2V/1)

178 There's actually a second Hugo Novel controversy. Note that the list includes "The Wheel of Time (series)". This is a set of FOURTEEN novels published over a period of twenty plus years, with the "twelfth" volume being turned into three books of over a million words by Brandon Sanderson after Jordan's death.

The Hugo rules allow for a serialized work to be counted for the year when the last part appeared, so if a novel appears in a magazine over the November 2012 to February 2013 period, it would be eligible for the awards given for 2013. The committee decided that The Wheel of Time was a single work.

Some people (including me) feel this is a load of dingo kidneys, meant to give Robert Jordan a posthumous award.

Oddly enough, Tor gave out the whole series (as a single 4.5 MILLION WORD e-book) with the Hugo package. Master of Evil Correia/Baen Publishing also gave out his complete novel War Bound (as well as the previous two books in the series.) The other three authors (or possibly their publishers) decided to only distribute excerpts of their novels.

So you can see how selfish the cismale heteronormative gun nut from Utah truly is...

Posted by: Captain Comic at June 15, 2014 12:23 PM (AzVtE)

179 If you really want to get sick go to the site "Find A Death" and look up how Bob Crane died.

Yeah, beaten to death in a motel room surrounded by piles of hardcore pr0n.

They made a movie 'Autofocus' about Crane and his sleazy lifestyle.

I don't know if they ever solved his murder.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 12:23 PM (fTJ5O)

180 Julianna Margulies

I'm guessing that she's a blonde as I don't recognize the name.

Posted by: garrett at June 15, 2014 12:25 PM (z1+Qu)

181 Vic,
I have the paperback, but thank you for suggestion.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:25 PM (gjOCp)

182 179 I don't know if they ever solved his murder.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 12:23 PM (fTJ5O)

They probably did according to the accounts I read but they didn't have enough proof to take it to court. He and his male partner were into making videos. And they found that at the hotel.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:25 PM (T2V/1)

183 181
Vic,

I have the paperback, but thank you for suggestion.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:25 PM (gjOCp)

If you can't hold the paperback or the ipad then how do you read?

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:28 PM (T2V/1)

184 In honour of Casey 'Shaggy' Kasem today's lunch is

Angus roast beef piled high on white bread. With tomato and Swiss cheese. Mayo. And for the Shaggy vibe and to spice it up - some Wasabi dressing.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 12:28 PM (2BJZ7)

185

speaking of blonds...

Are there any Blond-Polish jokes?

If not, why not?

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:28 PM (A6JmE)

186 Soothsayer,
Come on, you know it will be on the agenda here once all the dems are reelected. They probably hadn't thought of banning handheld cell phones on their own.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:29 PM (gjOCp)

187 BTW Carol, I have the paperback as well but I can no longer read the paperbacks very well. Even with bifocals my eyes can not read the tiny print. That is why I am gradually putting everything on the android and using the Kindle app.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:29 PM (T2V/1)

188 I'm guessing that she's a blonde as I don't recognize the name.

***

Nope. A brunette. She started out on one of those medical dramas with George Clooney and is now the star of The Good Wife, which is, BTW, one of the best tv dramas in a decade. http://bit.ly/1iz6Zad

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:32 PM (DmNpO)

189 I made myself a promise not to go online or read email when it's nice out. I was looking in book about roses & had to look something up & found emails from people at work asking me things they could have Friday.

I had to get into work computer & came here.

Now I'm going outside.
I hope everyone has a wonderful afternoon!

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:32 PM (gjOCp)

190
Carol and others, MA is eliminating the toll-takers on the Tobin Bridge. They're going to, get this, send people a bill for using the bridge.

Those who have EZPass transponders will pay as usual.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:33 PM (A6JmE)

191 In honour of Casey 'Shaggy' Kasem today's lunch is

Angus roast beef piled high on white bread. With tomato and Swiss cheese. Mayo. And for the Shaggy vibe and to spice it up - some Wasabi dressing.

***

Scooby Snacks!

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:34 PM (DmNpO)

192 @150 That particular scene comes from the original Le morte d'arthur
---------------------------

Sort of. Mallory's version uses another of Arthur's half-sisters, Morgawse (sp?), the mother of Gawain and his brothers, instead of Morgan le Fey. And iirc neither she nor Arthur are aware that they're siblings.

Posted by: junior at June 15, 2014 12:34 PM (Zwpqx)

193 Soothsayer,
I haven't used the Tobin bridge since they ruined it during Big Dig. Way back then our office was on Long Wharf. Most days I could leave my house & be in office parking lot in ten minutes.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:36 PM (gjOCp)

194
Half the people who cross the Tobin Bridge are illegals. So sending them a bill based on their license plates (via photo) is pointless.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:36 PM (A6JmE)

195 I don't know if they ever solved his murder.

-
They charged his porn buddy but he was acquitted. Shortly after, he died.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at June 15, 2014 12:36 PM (Mogjf)

196 @178 The Hugo rules allow for a serialized work to be counted for the year when the last part appeared, so if a novel appears in a magazine over the November 2012 to February 2013 period, it would be eligible for the awards given for 2013. The committee decided that The Wheel of Time was a single work.
-------------------------

There's one other item to note regarding this. The entirety of a series can only qualify if none of the individual parts of the series have been nominated. i.e. if any of the previous WoT books had been nominated for the Hugo, then they wouldn't be able to do this.

Posted by: junior at June 15, 2014 12:37 PM (Zwpqx)

197 "Arrogance is a weak mans imitation of strength."

Not sure who said it, but I've seen it time and time again.

Posted by: Guido 'snarly, on Ms. G's juice diet' at June 15, 2014 12:39 PM (BaT2K)

198 speaking of blonds...

Are there any Blond-Polish jokes?

If not, why not?
-----

Two blonds and a brunette are out on the blond's boat when they run aground on a beach. The boat is ruined. The blond owner walks up and down the beach and reports, "We're trapped on an island" and sits down and cries. The second blond takes off her bikini and says, "I'm going to find some sticks to wave it at passing boats" and wanders off. The brunette gets up, says, "You two stay here, I'll get help" and walks across the causeway to the mainland.

Posted by: Daybrother at June 15, 2014 12:40 PM (k8tBK)

199 Meanwhile, here's a historically accurate picture of Reagan:

http://sharpwriter.deviantart.com/art/Ronald-Reagan-The-Liberator-459588484

Posted by: SGT. York at June 15, 2014 12:41 PM (M6FRH)

200 180 Julianna Margulies

I'm guessing that she's a blonde as I don't recognize the name.
Posted by: garrett at June 15, 2014 12:25 PM (z1+Qu)

Wrong. Very wrong. See Vic's link at #177.

Posted by: rickl at June 15, 2014 12:41 PM (sdi6R)

201 Year Zero was the opening act for the Killing Fields...

Khmer Genocide-never forget

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at June 15, 2014 12:41 PM (+O/9F)

202 162 Speaking of being freaked out: I finished Blood Meridian by Cormac McCarthy. Toward the end he reached for a transcendental style similar to Gabriel Garcia Marquez and largely succeeded and when I finished I felt revolted, spiritually unclean and a little amazed. I've never had such a reaction to a novel before.

-
Some people love that book (and I think they are making a movie. I agree. Unclean.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at June 15, 2014 12:42 PM (Mogjf)

203 Vic,
I'm going to have to get reading glasses. Ophthalmologist told me five years ago I need bifocals & gave me a pair to walk around in to test & said some people can't get used to them. I felt high wearing them & said I would rather drive safely & look over glasses to read small letters.

I have Nook app & iBooks installed on iPad.

I'm sure there is Kindle app for iPad.

I've worn glasses since third or fourth grade.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:43 PM (gjOCp)

204 There's a link?

Posted by: garrett at June 15, 2014 12:43 PM (z1+Qu)

205 1 Posted by: eman at June 15, 2014 10:06 AM (DxPVw)

Year Zero exists wherever the left has total unrestrained power.

It's real and they really want to do it.

Sorry to be semi-political in the book thread...

on a more literary note I am on book three of Parker's Cole and Hitch Series...

he passed on around the time Book 4 was done and the series continues post-mortem.

Happy reading.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at June 15, 2014 12:43 PM (+O/9F)

206 Holy crap!

This was in Rio Grande yesterday. Coming into Texas

http://tinyurl.com/ktgbwy5

Twit pic.

Posted by: Tami at June 15, 2014 12:43 PM (v0/PR)

207 Self publishing is the logical extension of a trend that started with the death of the copy editor. It used to be that books were read and checked by an editor and/or subject matter expert before they went to print, and any errors were corrected with the help of the writer. On the evidence, that doesn't happen now. I don't know how many times I've paid $59.95 for a programming book only to find a grammatical error in the very first sentence. Later on there may be chapters where entire sections are cut and pasted in the wrong order, or where exercises are truncated, garbled, or simply wrong. If there is online errata, the list of errors is long. So if the publishing house adds no value, might as well cut them out and cut the price in half. The output is just as illiterate either way, but at least the self published books are cheaper.

Posted by: despair at June 15, 2014 12:44 PM (c/UgA)

208 authorpreneurs?

Hmmm...

Okay, using that! Well, trying it out.

Every free agent musician with an open guitar case. Some find the good corner, some move up to good-paying gigs, others wonder why they're starving.

The web has been a Godsend for us sufferers of EMTS, Eclectic Multimedia Tourette's-ish Syndrome. Rather than annoying our publisher-superiors for endless rejection slips, or at best being ripped off by Hollywood accounting, we go directly to blegging to and being ignored by the market. Everybody saves!

Web authorpreneurs (using it in a sentence!) don't need a publisher so much as some marketing. Webvertising, funding drives, FaceTwitLink Like +1 embed buy the plushie... it requires work if you want it to pay.

And, Oh! Wow! There're millions of creative bleggers all doing the same thing.

Oh the unleashed humanity!

Save us, mighty editors. Tell us what's good.

Posted by: mindful webauthorpreneur at June 15, 2014 12:45 PM (L1w1w)

209 The acme of prose style is exemplified by that simple, graceful clause: "Pay to the order of. . . ."
-Robert A. Heinlein

Posted by: TANSTAAFL at June 15, 2014 12:46 PM (LLhuj)

210 "Arrogance is a weak mans imitation of strength."

Not sure who said it, but I've seen it time and time again.

***

Speaking of, this is one of the funniest things I've seen/heard in quite a while.

Read the blurb before watching the vid in case you, like me, don't know the back-story.

http://t.co/gSunBxJ2J8

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at June 15, 2014 12:46 PM (DmNpO)

211 Also, "Cat's Cradle" is one of the funniest novels ever written, in the same sense that "Dr. Strangelove" is one of the funniest movies ever made. Both deal with the end of the world

-
I don't need to read them. I'm living it.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at June 15, 2014 12:47 PM (Mogjf)

212 79 Posted by: Retired Buckeye Cop who no longer considers himself a Republican at June 15, 2014 11:14 AM (1htQa)

It's w/out a doubt Objectivism's Bible if Objectivism is used as a replacement for faith.

I cherish Rand but Objectivism doesn't trump His Magnum Opus.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at June 15, 2014 12:48 PM (+O/9F)

213 OK I have gone out and done some research on this MZB pedo thing. I found that yes, her husband milested several underage boys. I also found out she new it and covered it up. That actually came out in his trial.

I found very little about her molesting children except for this one site. They said that was based on statements from her daughter who said she molested her and other children. But the author of this site says he doubts the veracity of those statements.

One of the statements made at the trial was she told her husband that she didn't care what he did with other children but he better leave her children alone.

http://tinyurl.com/ppvmel8

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:49 PM (T2V/1)

214 203
Vic,

I'm going to have to get reading glasses. Ophthalmologist told me
five years ago I need bifocals gave me a pair to walk around in to
test said some people can't get used to them. I felt high wearing
them said I would rather drive safely look over glasses to
read small letters.

I have Nook app iBooks installed on iPad.

I'm sure there is Kindle app for iPad.

I've worn glasses since third or fourth grade.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:43 PM (gjOCp)

I have two pair of glasses, one normal pair with bifocals and one sun glass pair with no bifocal. That is what I use for driving.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:50 PM (T2V/1)

215 I am reading, "Mind Hunter: Inside the FBI's Elite Serial Crime Unit," by John Douglas and Mark Olshaker. First person narrative of the "special agent who pioneered criminal profiling." I am 75 pages in. What fascinates me is that John Douglas has to be a (near-) genius, but got relative poor grades in high school and the first year(s) of college. He trained himself to deeply read people and crime scenes. then he could step out of what he was doing enough to understand what he was doing and be able to teach others how to profile.

Posted by: Room 207 at June 15, 2014 12:51 PM (FtwuW)

216 Thanks to all who provide suggestions for good reads (and warnings for bad ones). I always have tabs open for my library and use the Amazon link, and you mugs haven't steered me wrong yet. It also reminds me to dust off copies of classics on my own shelves.

Wow, did not know that about MZ Bradley. I was the same age as their victims when I began reading her short stories and novels. How innocent we were in the pre-internet era! I sometimes long for the blissful ignorance of youth.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at June 15, 2014 12:52 PM (QBm1P)

217 -209

My favorite RAH quote on writing:

There is nothing inherently wrong about writing. Just do it in private and wash your hands afterwards.

Posted by: Captain Comic at June 15, 2014 12:52 PM (AzVtE)

218 I don't know how many times I've paid $59.95 for a programming book only to find a grammatical error in the very first sentence. Later on there may be chapters where entire sections are cut and pasted in the wrong order, or where exercises are truncated, garbled, or simply wrong.

Saw exactly this in Microsoft's training kit for Microsoft's own exam on Microsoft's own .NET framework. The ninth chapter was entirely incoherent - had to do with installer-packages.

Here's the errata... "part 1"
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/923018

It was about the most incompetent hack rush-job I've ever seen. (I did pass the exam but only because I'd been forewarned to avoid the ninth chapter and to read further afield.)

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 12:55 PM (3kZUM)

219
Just so we're all clear, Bob Crane was not a homo.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:56 PM (A6JmE)

220 Daybrother,
I'm blonde & Polish!

If it was really funny I'd laugh. It was an okay joke.

I'm the one that told CAC that Cantor was likely to lose his election.

I'm really going outside to garden now. I had to answer one more work question.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 12:56 PM (gjOCp)

221 SKINNER!

-Supernintendo Chalmers

Posted by: model_1066 at June 15, 2014 12:56 PM (fcAGu)

222 Supernintendo?

Posted by: nnptcgrad at June 15, 2014 12:58 PM (Opyrm)

223 219

Just so we're all clear, Bob Crane was not a homo.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 12:56 PM (A6JmE)

OK, I was working from memory there from several years ago. Didn't want to go back to that gruesome site. But the chief suspect was a guy in the motel room, most probably the one who provided the video equipment.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:00 PM (T2V/1)

224 One of only two good things my father ever did was to bring home a couple years out of date set of the World Book encyclopedia. I used to just pull a volume and randomly read, sometimes for hours.

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at June 15, 2014 01:02 PM (W7zKe)

225 Vic, that link also reports that Edmund Spenser wanted to exterminate the Irish. Because progress.

Link - http://www.ucc.ie/celt/published/E500000-001/text001.html

Probably shouldn't eat anything first. What a bastard

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 01:02 PM (3kZUM)

226 With the MZB revelations are coming to light cough Piers Anthony cough

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at June 15, 2014 01:03 PM (W7zKe)

227 222 Supernintendo?
Posted by: nnptcgrad at June 15, 2014 12:58 PM (Opyrm)

It's a Ralph Wiggum-ism

Posted by: model_1066 at June 15, 2014 01:03 PM (fcAGu)

228 I'm thinking of starting college from scratch ( at fifty-three). It's not that I don't have a smattering of college credits but that I've found a good program in Applied Economics offered as an online program through Oregon State University. The only problem is that they have gone to a core requirements heavy on all the current prog priorities. So I was looking into Kindle titles relating to agriculture and I can't believe the asinine prices for any education related tomes. We're talking about two and three hundred dollars in some cases for essays on sustainability, women in agriculture, simply mind boggling, especially since almost all the authors are NGO or public university professors.

Posted by: whatmeworry? at June 15, 2014 10:24 AM (dZGNV)

Am I wrong in thinking that a degree predicated upon reading essays about "sustainability" and "women in agriculture" just might be all about the Leftist agenda? Oregon is Moonbat Central, you know. Maybe if you are just taking it for interest's sake, it doesn't matter, but if you expect the degree to land you a better job in industry, proceed with the utmost caution.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 15, 2014 01:04 PM (yDmQD)

229 133

.....As their ship is leaving the solar system, his science officer tells him to look through his scanner. The Captain is astounded to see the ENTIRE PLANET EARTH following their ship majestically out of the solar system.

This sound familiar to anyone? It has always stayed with me.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at June 15, 2014 11:50 AM

I know two things:
1. I read it in Analog magazine (late 60's early 70's?)
2. The bad guy aliens were called the Yop

Guessing the author was Christopher Anvil

Posted by: The Truth, the whole Truth, and nothing but the Truth at June 15, 2014 01:06 PM (6jKOp)

230 225 Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 01:02 PM (3kZUM)

Which post are you responding to?

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:06 PM (T2V/1)

231 226 Piers Anthony cough

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at June 15, 2014 01:03 PM (W7zKe)

OK, what is the story on him? I like a lot of his stuff.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:07 PM (T2V/1)

232 Neptune's Brood by Charles Stross?

Its not that its a bad book, its actually pretty good, if it were a standalone.

The problem I have with it. Stross, more or less (more) rewrote his other book, Saturn's Children when he wrote Neptune's Brood. the plot is literally the same, and there are even repeated, or slightly updated scenes from Saturn's Children in it.

Neptune's Brood is a paint by numbers version of Saturn's Children. I guess you get rewarded for ripping yourself off?

Posted by: Rodney C. Johnson at June 15, 2014 01:07 PM (n9h5d)

233
I always thought it was a motel room too but according to Wiki he was killed and found in his apartment.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 01:08 PM (A6JmE)

234
Bob Crane was married to Hilda at the time..so evidently he had an apartment on the side.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 01:09 PM (A6JmE)

235 Speaking of first lines of novels, that is a plot device in The Map of Time, which I thought was a good pseudo-steampunk with twist novel. HG Wells is the protagonist.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (Mogjf)

236 Vic - your http://tinyurl.com/ppvmel8 made an offhand comment about Spenser's views generally, which led me to Wikipedia, which led me to the Spenser "dialogue" I cited here.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (3kZUM)

237 Vic go to litreactor.com, columns, although a search will turn up a lot of speculation. The litreactor.com piece is blowing out my margins so I cant seem to tinyurl it...

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (W7zKe)

238 "224 One of only two good things my father ever did was to bring home a couple years out of date set of the World Book encyclopedia. I used to just pull a volume and randomly read, sometimes for hours."

Yes! My mom used to bring home encyclopedias sold at the supermarket, one book a week for like $1 each. Sometimes the info was dated, but most of it was extremely informative. I spent one summer before college reading through a science encyclopedia. It hadn't been updated with plate tectonics so it postulated huge land bridges between continents.

Posted by: despair at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (c/UgA)

239
FindADeath is pretty amusing:

Beethoven's "Eroica" was filling the ground floor apartment, as Scott ate a Hershey Bar and made notes in his just arrived Princeton Alumni Weekly: Sheilah saw Scott jump from his armchair, grab the mantelpiece, gasp and fall to the floor. Sheilah, not knowing what to do, tried to revive him with pouring brandy into his clinched teeth. (atta girl.) She ran to the manager of the building, Harry Culver, founder of Culver City (small world) who said when he saw Fitzgerald, "I'm afraid he's dead."

Posted by: Pug Jihad at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (lJm99)

240 233

I always thought it was a motel room too but according to Wiki he was killed and found in his apartment.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 01:08 PM (A6JmE)

OK had to check another site. It was his apartment.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (T2V/1)

241 234
Bob Crane was married to Hilda at the time..so evidently he had an apartment on the side.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 01:09 PM (A6JmE)

According to Wiki, they were separated in 1977 but had 'reportedly' reconciled shortly before his death.

Posted by: Tami at June 15, 2014 01:11 PM (v0/PR)

242 Count me as one of the 'ronettes who was totally icked at finding out about Marion Zimmer Bradley - which I only did at this very late date through a recent thread at According to Hoyt. I was a fan of the Darkover series early on - but I was overseas for most of those years and never got to attend any of the cons, where the intelligence about her pedophile husband was something of an open secret.

She was pretty snide about Christianity in Mists of Avalon - but it was never a deal-breaker for me at the time.

I was much more irked when I came back to the States, and thought about writing seriously. I had put together a story for one of her Darkover anthologies - which she used to solicit contributions for in every one. And then when I finally did polish it and send it in (and it was pretty good, too, if I say so myself) all I got was a nasty-gram saying she was no longer accepting Darkover stories AND threatening legal prosecution for copyright violation if I persisted.

Posted by: Sgt. Mom at June 15, 2014 01:13 PM (Asjr7)

243 Bob Crane was married to Hilda at the time..so evidently he had an apartment on the side.

Wait, everybody doesn't have a Porn Apartment?

Posted by: garrett at June 15, 2014 01:14 PM (2IW0t)

244 236
Vic - your http://tinyurl.com/ppvmel8 made an offhand comment about
Spenser's views generally, which led me to Wikipedia, which led me to
the Spenser "dialogue" I cited here.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (3kZUM)

OK, didn't see that. Was searching stuff on MZB.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:14 PM (T2V/1)

245 93
I wish I had Starz - wanna watch Outlander.

It's been showing up on SyFy lately. Haven't watched it myself.

Posted by: Anachronda at June 15, 2014 01:14 PM (o78gS)

246
Hilda loved him enough to make sure they were buried together. Either that or she wanted him close so she could nag him for eternity.

But from what I gathered, Crane was a lovable guy who developed long lasting friendships.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists (-469 days left) at June 15, 2014 01:15 PM (A6JmE)

247 Hey morons and ettes! Happy Father's Day to all the dads out there.

Oh and....

http://youtu.be/lQlIhraqL7o

Posted by: EC at June 15, 2014 01:18 PM (doBIb)

248 Dang Sgt Mom, threatened you with legal action?

Wow, what an ogre.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 01:19 PM (2BJZ7)

249 OT:

Had a blast at the CO Moron Meetup yesterday. Met a group of intelligent, nice people in person instead of online.

Safe travels to piercello who drove the most miles and is headed home to Missouri now.

Posted by: Meremortal at June 15, 2014 01:22 PM (1Y+hH)

250 238 "224 One of only two good things my father ever did was to bring home a couple years out of date set of the World Book encyclopedia. I used to just pull a volume and randomly read, sometimes for hours."

Yes! My mom used to bring home encyclopedias sold at the supermarket, one book a week for like $1 each. Sometimes the info was dated, but most of it was extremely informative. I spent one summer before college reading through a science encyclopedia. It hadn't been updated with plate tectonics so it postulated huge land bridges between continents.
Posted by: despair at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (c/UgA)

Yeah, I was a hard core encyclopedia freak, too. We had 3 different sets. I remember land bridges! lol Would love to have them now ans see how the knowledge of the world has changed.

Posted by: Pug Jihad at June 15, 2014 01:23 PM (lJm99)

251 237 Posted by: OG Celtic-American at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (W7zKe)

I could not find anything there related MZB? Right now I am leaning in the direction that yes her husband was a pedo and she covered it up because he was convicted and that came out in trial testimony. Given that, she should have been charged with misprision of a felony.

As to she herself being a pedo I am leaning to doubtful, but possible.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:25 PM (T2V/1)

252 I have two pair of glasses, one normal pair with bifocals and one sun glass pair with no bifocal. That is what I use for driving.
Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 12:50 PM (T2V/1) Vic,I will keep that in mind next time I get new glasses. I got new ones last year and can't afford new ones this year.I had to turn on Windows computer to log into work computer. I'm testing now if copying pasting works on IE10. I used the ampersand and I know it doesn't show up with IE. I hate Windows after having Mac for 2.5 years.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 01:25 PM (gjOCp)

253 50 percent on the quiz. It was an amusing challenge to match each first line's impression with scant memories and assumptions about the recognized titles.

Posted by: On the fence at June 15, 2014 01:25 PM (wu/TK)

254 245 I mean Outlander the series based on Diana Gabaldon's books.
The one on Syfy is a pretty cool movie, Vikings vs alien monster.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 01:26 PM (GSIDW)

255 What publishing companies have done to literature is unforgivable.

The amount of fraud is completely sky-high at this point. Authors are not writing their own books, packaging agencies are putting them together with desperate hack writers, and publishers will tell you "This is how the industry works; don't be naive!"

All publishers need to be put out of work. The entire system needs to be torn down.

Posted by: RKae at June 15, 2014 01:27 PM (rTdEd)

256
I didn't get Error 500 using IE10.
Strange. I guess blog works except for Mac users.
I know I used ampersand it showed up on screen as I typed.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 01:28 PM (gjOCp)

257 250 238 "224 One of only two good things my father ever did was to bring home a couple years out of date set of the World Book encyclopedia. I used to just pull a volume and randomly read, sometimes for hours."

Yes! My mom used to bring home encyclopedias sold at the supermarket, one book a week for like $1 each. Sometimes the info was dated, but most of it was extremely informative. I spent one summer before college reading through a science encyclopedia. It hadn't been updated with plate tectonics so it postulated huge land bridges between continents.
Posted by: despair at June 15, 2014 01:10 PM (c/UgA)

Yeah, I was a hard core encyclopedia freak, too. We had 3 different sets. I remember land bridges! lol Would love to have them now ans see how the knowledge of the world has changed.
---------------
Me too! If you're interested in history then the out-of-date scientific theories don't really matter. In fact I even enjoy reading old scientific textbooks because they are refreshingly free of politics, which must be injected into everything these days.

I was (am) also an atlas fiend.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at June 15, 2014 01:28 PM (QBm1P)

258 251 we only have her daughter's accusation, but seeing as they were made after MZB died, I tend to believe it.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 01:29 PM (GSIDW)

259 229 Posted by: The Truth, the whole Truth, and nothing but the Truth at June 15, 2014 01:06 PM (6jKOp)

Thank you very much! I appreciate it. I will try to find it.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at June 15, 2014 01:30 PM (TGgNi)

260 258
251 we only have her daughter's accusation, but seeing as they were made after MZB died, I tend to believe it.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 01:29 PM (GSIDW)

Based on what that one site said about actual trial testimony and the fact that the accusation was made after she was dead and can not defend herself I tend to give it little credence. As I said, doubtful but possible.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:32 PM (T2V/1)

261 They made a movie 'Autofocus' about Crane and his sleazy lifestyle.

The documentary included on the DVD was more interesting than the kitschy feature.

Posted by: The kink stays in the picture at June 15, 2014 01:32 PM (wu/TK)

262 Sounds like Skinner's butt hurts. If you want to see what he wants to preserve, go to Barnes and Noble and try to find a book that you actually want to buy: a book not written by a left-winger for a left-wing cause, a book that is not postmodern and anti-American.

The poverty of the editor-tyrants can be seen in so-called "literary fiction." They and people like Skinner are the only ones propping up this pseudo art-form in which the adamantine rules are that your "novel" can have no plot and no characters.

Posted by: Caliban at June 15, 2014 01:34 PM (2ArJQ)

263 261 Posted by: The kink stays in the picture at June 15, 2014 01:32 PM (wu/TK)

One wonders how many times the police have watched the Hogan videos in the evidence room.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:34 PM (T2V/1)

264 All publishers need to be put out of work. The entire system needs to be torn down.

AllenG to the white courtesy phone, please.

Posted by: Methos at June 15, 2014 01:35 PM (hO9ad)

265 260 my pov is why bother to slander your mother if she's dead?
I dunno. It seems undeniable that the family led a very weird lifestyle at any rate, seems like a terrible environment for any kid.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 01:35 PM (GSIDW)

266 The one book you must read. No, really.

http://tinyurl.com/ony2u2w

Posted by: The Great White Snark at June 15, 2014 01:35 PM (Mogjf)

267 Had a blast at the CO Moron Meetup yesterday. Met a group of intelligent, nice people in person instead of online.

Were you able to get away and meet the Morons later?

Posted by: Daybrother at June 15, 2014 01:36 PM (/LixN)

268 265
260 my pov is why bother to slander your mother if she's dead?

I dunno. It seems undeniable that the family led a very weird
lifestyle at any rate, seems like a terrible environment for any kid.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 01:35 PM (GSIDW)

There are very many of those accusations made that turn out to be totally bogus.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:36 PM (T2V/1)

269 TGWS too bad ISIS can't administer that quiz to Boko Haram...

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 01:37 PM (2BJZ7)

270 Never liked Bradley's stuff. Too womany.

Know what I mean? There are certain women writers who have to constantly wave their vaginas at the reader, not unlike the way Robert Sawyer throws out random Canadian stuff in everything he writes (in his case, presumably to qualify for Canadian content requirements).

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 01:37 PM (q0soQ)

271 Waaay late to this thread and I didn't read through it all, but this NRO writer that I don't recognize wrote a piece about Camp Of The Saints and its applicability to current events...

And I believe that book was mentioned last week on this regular Moron Sunday feature.

Posted by: GnuBreed at June 15, 2014 01:38 PM (cHZB7)

272 Good lord, the lefties just can't stand when people just do something they want the way they want to do it. They have to control everything. Sure, there is a lot of crappy writing out there to wade through, but at least there are some gems that would have never made it past the gatekeepers. This dude is just a smug intellectual gatekeeper that doesn't like the fact that the flood gates are open and something he doesn't approve of just might find an audience. F*** this arrogant schmuck. He probably went to an ivy league school, so he thinks he "knows best" being one of the "elites." Schmuck!

Posted by: MistressOverdone at June 15, 2014 01:39 PM (2/oBD)

273 271 crud, forgot linky --

http://tinyurl.com/mzkx2pr

Posted by: GnuBreed at June 15, 2014 01:40 PM (cHZB7)

274 270
Never liked Bradley's stuff. Too womany.

Know what I mean? There are certain women writers who have to
constantly wave their vaginas at the reader, not unlike the way Robert
Sawyer throws out random Canadian stuff in everything he writes (in his
case, presumably to qualify for Canadian content requirements).

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 01:37 PM (q0soQ)

Since 80% of the book buyers in this country are women, most of the authors cater to women. I have learned to put up with it.

There are a few though that I can not take. Those Snookie Stackhouse books are an example. I was desperate for a new read one day and felt like trying something new so went down to the library and checked out the first one in that series. Could not make it past the first chapter.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:40 PM (T2V/1)

275 That could be a new game show Al-Jazeera... "You bet your life!"

Where Hassan 'Wink' Chop quizzes contestants on their knowledge of the Qu'ran. Losers, well we got to have ratings. And the Districts demand some death.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 01:41 PM (2BJZ7)

276
I always felt bad about Margot Hemingway. She either started drinking again or had the booze to wash down the pills. Obviously, she was into crazy new age shit but was up with the salt?

http://www.findadeath.com/Deceased/h/Margaux%20Hemingway/margot.htm

Posted by: Pug Jihad at June 15, 2014 01:44 PM (lJm99)

277
Plus, I don't think you can evict someone for "bad vibes." I don't think you can evict anyone in Santa Monica, period.

Posted by: Pug Jihad at June 15, 2014 01:45 PM (lJm99)

278 re (a) Writing As High Art vs. (b) Writing As Making A Living.

Ian Fleming had a great anecdote about this:

I have a charming relative who is an angry young litterateur of renown. He is maddened by the fact that more people read my books than his... I asked him how he described himself of his passport.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at June 15, 2014 01:47 PM (Y92Nd)

279 "I bet you call yourself an Author. Just so, I call myself a Writer. There are Authors and Artists, and there are Writers and Painters."

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at June 15, 2014 01:49 PM (Y92Nd)

280 Well, good morning there buddy

http://tinyurl.com/l9y2q3k

Posted by: RWC at June 15, 2014 01:50 PM (Wsm7h)

281 I've read 13 of the 15 'Classic' sci-fi novels on the csm list; I own most of them too.

Posted by: GnuBreed at June 15, 2014 01:52 PM (cHZB7)

282 Know what I mean? There are certain women writers who have to constantly wave their vaginas at the reader, not unlike the way Robert Sawyer throws out random Canadian stuff in everything he writes (in his case, presumably to qualify for Canadian content requirements).

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 01:37 PM (q0soQ)

A Canadian author qualifies as "Canadian Content" under the stupid "Canadian Content" law simply by being Canadian, same as a rock band is Canadian Content simply if they are Canadian. The purpose of the law ostensibly is to ensure that Canadian "artists" are not swamped out of Canadian broadcast media by the much larger pool of content from south of the border. Not that I ever agreed with it. It's anti-choice, and anti-free market, and entirely obsolete in the Internet age, anyway.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at June 15, 2014 01:54 PM (yDmQD)

283 Well, good morning there buddy

http://tinyurl.com/l9y2q3k

First link I see and you're giving everyone the bird.

Posted by: Blanco Basura at June 15, 2014 01:55 PM (0AKks)

284 #232

John Brunner rewrote the same book about two dozen times. These are lesser works, often forgotten compared to his landmarks, such as 'Stand on Zanzibar.' What I've been told by those who knew him was that his wife was severely ill and he was hard up for money, so he kept recycling the same plot for the genre paperback market.

The setup is always the same: Some new phenomenon, a drug, a bit of technology, a pop psychology movement, etc., appears and people begin disappearing without a trace. After investigating the lead character disappears himself and wake to discover he has been transported to a different world, better than the dingy, worn out Earth he left behind.

I found a bunch of these in used bookstores over the years. Despite the repetition they were all worth reading because Brunner couldn't help but be entertaining and bring in something clever to each rendition of the recycled story.

Posted by: Epobirs at June 15, 2014 01:55 PM (Icq+V)

285 And if there are any birdwatchers in the horde please put me some knowledge.

Posted by: RWC at June 15, 2014 01:55 PM (Wsm7h)

286 251 we only have her daughter's accusation, but seeing as they were made after MZB died, I tend to believe it.

Posted by: Votermom at June 15, 2014 01:29 PM (GSIDW)

Based
on what that one site said about actual trial testimony and the fact
that the accusation was made after she was dead and can not defend
herself I tend to give it little credence. As I said, doubtful but
possible.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 01:32 PM (T2V/1)

Don't get carried away on believing something whether or not a court admitted it. In the Amireault case, the dipshit judge admitted tons of "recovered memory" dogshit which is the most bogus fabricated crap which ever emerged in copious amounts from somebody's asshole. If what the daughter is saying is based on that then I give it zero credibility; otherwise it might be true. But judges are just as fucking dumb as any other occupation.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 15, 2014 01:57 PM (BSdf1)

287 Finished The O'Reilly Factor this week... it was written before the show had been in the number one spot for a decade, so O'RLY's ego isn't as overbearing as it is today. More of an autobiography and young person's guide than a political tome, but it's depressing to see how far the country has sunk in just 14 years as some of the things he rails against (tattoos, unwed mothers) have been completely normalized if not celebrated by the culture.

Posted by: Blackford Oakes at June 15, 2014 01:59 PM (KVnkf)

288 Interesting that you mentioned Anthem. I'm on my last 100 pages of the book and I'm still not sure how I feel about it. Anyone have any opinions on it?

Posted by: njrob at June 15, 2014 02:00 PM (U9o8f)

289 Very OT but last night something occurred to me that I'm sure has probably popped up in others' thoughts: Since it is human nature to try to create order out of chaos and further, the more aggressive seem compelled to reach for social power so they can tell everyone what to do it would seem that the construction of the American republic would be ideal; it forces separate branches of power hungry people to fight each other and leave the rest of the People alone and yet we have devolved into a ruling elite versus the peons model so much more quickly than we should have. What is the thumb on the scale? The NSA? Too many lawyers? The position as the World's only superpower? Is it Human Nature to destroy your own?

Posted by: Daybrother at June 15, 2014 02:01 PM (xe926)

290 #133

That is an Alan Dean Forster short story, 'With Friends Like These...' which can be found in the anthology of the same title.
http://www.amazon.com/With-Friends-Like-These-Foster/dp/0345323904

Posted by: Epobirs at June 15, 2014 02:02 PM (Icq+V)

291 I went to Catholic school for my middleschool years and was not allowed to ride the bus. This meant about 3 hours every weekday after school in the public library waiting for one of my parents to pick me up. One of my most cherished reads there were the old Nat Geo mags from the 60's. I remember one issue had a Green Beret on the cover and I got to meet that same gentleman in 2000 at Camp Mackall. It was amazing. But the book that totally blew my 6th grade mind was The Graduate. Yeah, it was like gas to the "I really dig older ladies" fire. Books and dogs, such great friends.

Posted by: fastfreefall at June 15, 2014 02:02 PM (Lm8zi)

292
2014 Hugo Award Nominees For Best Novel

Ancillary Justice by Ann Leckie gets the rocket in a walk. The book's central theme is gender fluidity, as they say, and has been picking up other awards from the cultural distaffs comprising the con-crowds and oh so enlightened review boards. Expect tranny and lefty block voting to easily carry it to the top.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at June 15, 2014 02:02 PM (kdS6q)

293 284 Epobirs,
Thank you for link at end of Friday ONT.
I'm outside & have it open on Mac!

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 02:03 PM (gjOCp)

294 284 Epobirs,
Thank you for link at end of Friday ONT.
I'm outside & have it open on Mac!

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 02:03 PM (gjOCp)

295

23 Anna P.

The lines are from the NYT.

The first 2 concern the initial campaign of Teh Won for Prezeey...

Posted by: Arbalest at June 15, 2014 02:05 PM (FlRtG)

296 285
And if there are any birdwatchers in the horde please put me some knowledge.

Posted by: RWC at June 15, 2014 01:55 PM (Wsm7h)

First get a good book for the area you will be doing most of your stuff in. Make sure it has the basics up front and then cross indexed pics and descriptions of the birds. I have "Birds of the Carolinas" by Stan Tekiolo. The credits in the back says he has many books for other areas.

Next once get a good pair of binoculars, but in the case of bird watching it is more important to have a larger set of main lenses than high power.
Then if you plan of going into the woods get a book on how to avoid snakes, bears, big cats and other hazardous wildlife.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 02:05 PM (T2V/1)

297 Sorry double post! Pixy used to say you've already said that, or if you didn't type anything, it would say you really should type something.

Posted by: Carol at June 15, 2014 02:06 PM (gjOCp)

298 286 Don't get carried away on believing something
whether or not a court admitted it. In the Amireault case, the dipshit
judge admitted tons of "recovered memory" dogshit which is the most
bogus fabricated crap which ever emerged in copious amounts from
somebody's asshole. If what the daughter is saying is based on that then
I give it zero credibility; otherwise it might be true. But judges are
just as fucking dumb as any other occupation.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 15, 2014 01:57 PM (BSdf1)

That is exactly why I tend to believe she did not molest her daughter. Besides, this daughter statement wasn't made at the trial.

Posted by: Vic at June 15, 2014 02:06 PM (T2V/1)

299 Posted by: Epobirs

--------

I read them all too and agree they were all the same. Didn't care, I figured he needed the money and loved his stuff anyway.
Nice to read that someone else misses him.

Posted by: Daybrother at June 15, 2014 02:08 PM (WVwyq)

300 Damn it Epobirs, you beat me to it.

I loved the last few lines of 'With Friends Like These...'.

Posted by: J. Random Dude at June 15, 2014 02:11 PM (8OfdL)

301 Anna Puma @248 - it wasn't personal, it was more of a routine form letter/rejection slip, but the tone was rather nasty, and I thought it was quite uncalled for, after having sounded so cordial in the anthologies when asking for submissions. Left a bad taste in my mouth, anyway.

Posted by: Sgt. Mom at June 15, 2014 02:11 PM (Asjr7)

302 Nood

Posted by: Y-not at June 15, 2014 02:13 PM (zDsvJ)

303 285
And if there are any birdwatchers in the horde please put me some knowledge.

Posted by: RWC at June 15, 2014 01:55 PM (Wsm7h)

Ms. G is a birder and she has enriched my life greatly with it. I got her the Audobon Society (I think) IBird 2.21 for her kindle Fire. Unbelievable photos (young and adult), range,. Also you can listen to their calls, because you usually hear before you se and its a great identifier. Amazing info. to learn about birds. A book is nice also so you can record a 'life list' of birds you saw in the back. it really makes backyard and walks/hikes more enjoyable. Also nice to be able to identify the bodies that the cat drags in. Just sayin'

Posted by: Guido 'snarly, on Ms. G's juice diet' at June 15, 2014 02:14 PM (BaT2K)

304 Anna Puma,

I haven't read #5 (at least not that I recall but I've read so many I'm no longer half the time anymore) but it made me think of Zelazny's 'Damnation Alley,' which, as you likely know, is hugely different from the movie.

Posted by: Epobirs at June 15, 2014 02:17 PM (Icq+V)

305 Heh. Reading the wiki page for Eye of Argon and came across the name of a friend of mine.

Posted by: --- at June 15, 2014 02:20 PM (MMC8r)

306 Posted by: Epobirs at June 15, 2014 01:55 PM (Icq+V)

Yeah, John Brunner's a fun writer.

"Stand on Zanzibar" and "The Sheep Look Up" are interesting and well-written SF works. "TSLU" is spectacularly wrongheaded but still a good read.

For those who like books in actual book-form-

Brunner has been dead long enough that you can find really nice special/collector's editions of his major works for el cheapo on Amazon or elsewhere.

Posted by: naturalfake at June 15, 2014 02:23 PM (KBvAm)

307 RWC: I'm a birdwatcher and I'm gonna put you some fuckin' knowledge.

You gotta watch them birds every second. Fuckin' birds'll mess you up and take your shit. I seen 'em. Don't trust them birds. Evil, conniving avians, every last one of 'em.

Don't leave a bird alone with your woman. Don't matter how sweet and faithful she is, them birds'll wave some plumage, sing a song, and bang! Like they're Cesar Romero or something. The women just go crazy for 'em. I was going out with this girl, definitely an HB9. We went back to my place one afternoon and I had to go out to pick up some extra piano strings (long story), and like an idiot I left my fuckin' window open.

Come back, there's feathers all over the place and no sign of her. Saw her a week or so later in the park with a whole goddamned flock of birds. I acted like I didn't even see her.

There. Now you know what you need: watch those fuckin' birds, man. Watch 'em.

Posted by: John James Audubon at June 15, 2014 02:26 PM (q0soQ)

308 Christ, what an imagination I've got.

Posted by: Epobirs at June 15, 2014 02:28 PM (Icq+V)

309 One thing that's amusing about Edmund Spenser - looks like the year after he wrote that screed against the Irish, Hugh O'Neill led a band of paddies to burn down down his castle. Before or after the Battle of the Yellow Ford, Wiki won't tell me . . .

Gee, Ed, maybe if you hadn't been such a dick to the locals you'd have got to stay like the thousands of other anglo-normans who stayed.

Posted by: boulder t'hobo at June 15, 2014 02:29 PM (3kZUM)

310 Skinner should be put into a "Skinner Box."

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at June 15, 2014 02:33 PM (V70Uh)

311 For a long time I've been hearing people (like Sarah Hoyt) talking about how indy publishing will undermine the cultural gatekeepers and such. That Guardian piece is the first indication I've ever seen that the gatekeepers have noticed and are worried.

Posted by: Trimegistus at June 15, 2014 02:35 PM (q0soQ)

312 I've just rediscovered John Farris who wrote most of his good stuff in the 80's-- writes horror, thriller stuff tinged with fantasy... just finished "Son of Endless Night"-- wow-- Stephen King used to rave about him back then before he started cranking out the crap he does nowadays-- highly recommended-- working on "Wildwood" now

Posted by: tomc at June 15, 2014 02:35 PM (avEuh)

313 I finished "The Judgment of Paris," about the art world in France between 1860 - 1870 or so (when Impressionism came into being). Very interesting.

Now reading a biography W.C. Fields.

Posted by: Null at June 15, 2014 02:44 PM (xjpRj)

314 Well the first with the unicorn I can see lol

That kind of letter would indeed leave a bad impression Sgt Mom. Merovign and I were one time tossing at each other 'imaginatively rude rejection letters' as written by someone condemned to read an agent's slush pile of manuscripts. Even we never stooped that low as to invoke the dreaded god of litigation. - "I apologize for the tardiness of my reply. But the dog absconded with your manuscript. After retrieving it from the kennel, your story was vastly improved."

Passage at Arms is Cook's stand alone story that predates the Starfisher trilogy. Think Das Boot in space and you start to get the feel of the story.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 15, 2014 02:45 PM (2BJZ7)

315 I am reading "The Killer in the Wind" by Andrew Klavan.

Holy moley. I swear he makes up words.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at June 15, 2014 02:48 PM (V70Uh)

316 Thanks Vic and Guido.

Not planning on birdwatching myself. Just wanted to know if anyone can identify my houseguest at #283.

Posted by: John James Audubon at June 15, 2014 02:26 PM (q0soQ)

I'll steer clear then

Posted by: RWC at June 15, 2014 03:00 PM (Wsm7h)

317 The rumor about Bob Crane that I liked the most was:

He was banging and filming the Sheriff's daughter. Sheriff aced him. Case closed.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at June 15, 2014 03:14 PM (V70Uh)

318 284 306 Brunner is a lot of fun. I like the Sheep Look Up and Stand on Zanzibar, but I really liked his The Shockwave Rider. IN aditioon, his Squares of the City is a good chess game as novel book.

Posted by: NaCly Dog at June 15, 2014 03:36 PM (u82oZ)

319 Avoided the barrel, but fat-fingered the keyboard. Sigh. Wish pixy has a preview button.

One more Brunner book for a deaf thread. Traveler in Black was a very influential book back in the day.

It would make a good RPG today.

Posted by: NaCly Dog at June 15, 2014 03:45 PM (u82oZ)

320 Posted by: RWC at June 15, 2014 03:00 PM (Wsm7h)

It's a robin. Had one nesting in a small tree next to our front porch in our old house.

Posted by: Polliwog the 'Ette at June 15, 2014 03:49 PM (GDulk)

321 YEAR ZERŲ is not an industry. YEAR ZERŲ is not a group of writers. YEAR ZERŲ is not a set of beliefs. YEAR ZERŲ is an approach to culture.

The fact that they call themselves "YEAR ZERŲ" tells you everything you need to know about them.

Posted by: The Literary Hat at June 15, 2014 04:00 PM (K1sEu)

322 "Lastly, I get the sneaking suspicious that what this boils down to is
that self-publishing has opened the doors for a lot of conservative
writers, and this annoys commie Skinner to no end."

SF writer Sarah Hoyt writes about this. In one blog post she related how she overheard several SF editors talking about a new writer whom they all rejected for ideological reasons: They all agreed that he was very talented, but they also agreed that they did not want to allow conservative opinions to be published.

Posted by: pst314 at June 15, 2014 04:02 PM (T4dRn)

323 SF writer Sarah Hoyt writes about this. In one blog post she related how she overheard several SF editors talking about a new writer whom they all rejected for ideological reasons: They all agreed that he was very talented, but they also agreed that they did not want to allow conservative opinions to be published.

Yeah, and I'll bet you anything that Skinner, or any of his other fellow travelers at the Guardian, doesn't see anything wrong with this.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 04:36 PM (fTJ5O)

324 323 So bizarre that SF editors are not aware that they are re-enacing a dystopian novel

Posted by: votermom at June 15, 2014 04:47 PM (GSIDW)

325 "re-enacting" , not "re-enacing"

Posted by: votermom at June 15, 2014 05:05 PM (GSIDW)

326 Thanks doug for the word on The Circle.

And speaking of Cormac McCarthy, don't read "The Road "without steeling yourself for the most hopeless, nihilistic novel ever.

Posted by: PJ at June 15, 2014 06:47 PM (cHuNI)

327 So, how do you get on the "books by Morons" list? Is there a "books by lurkers"? I'm a right lurker.

Posted by: Sally June at June 15, 2014 07:19 PM (L3IiB)

328 So, how do you get on the "books by Morons" list? Is there a "books by lurkers"? I'm a right lurker.

Just send me an e-mail describing your book and I'll mention it in next week's thread. As I say at the end of the book thread each week:

As always, book thread tips, suggestions, rumors, threats, and insults may be sent to OregonMuse, Proprietor, AoSHQ Book Thread, at my e-mail address: aoshqbookthread, followed by the 'at' sign, and then 'G' mail, and then dot cee oh emm.

Posted by: OregonMuse at June 15, 2014 08:07 PM (fTJ5O)

329 Now I feel like a REAL moron...

Posted by: Sally June at June 15, 2014 08:17 PM (L3IiB)

330 >>207
Self publishing is the logical extension of a trend that started with the death of the copy editor.

(In Monty Python old-man voice

I'm not dead! I'm getting better ...

(THUD)

Posted by: RovingCopyEditor at June 15, 2014 08:34 PM (cbmm3)

331 Sgt. Mom: I hold no brief for Marion Zimmer Bradley, but her catastrophic encounter with fan fiction was a big deal back in the day. She was probably scared shitless, after one of the participants in those Darkover anthologies threatened to sue her over alleged theft of ideas. Thus the sudden swing from "yay, Soviet of fiction!" to "IP legalistic hardass". For a while there (and I drifted through literary SF fandom at the tail end of this particular social phenomenon) writers shirtily insisted that they could not listen to writers of fan-fiction or accept "ideas" from eager fans as a fall-out from the MZB blowout.

(BTW, apparently the lawsuit never actually happened, but like a lot of events in SF fandom, threats and drama produce "facts" more imposing and memorable than the mere mundane truth of the matter.)

Posted by: Mitch H. at June 15, 2014 11:31 PM (MazCW)

332 Am I a moron? (Are there specific criteria? I've been reading this blog for what seems like forever. Does that qualify me as such?) If I'm a moron, does my wife get moron status by association? She reads, too... but not nearly as obsessively as I. (We're professional comedians, writers and authors.)

Anyway... she wrote a Kindle single called "Sometimes Ask A Man." It's a fisking of the obscure 1965 book "Always Ask A Man," by Arlene Dahl. It's hysterical. (I actually laughed so hard when I was editing it that I cried a few times.) Hope some of you pick it up. It's $1.99!

http://www.amazon.com/Sometimes-Ask-Man-Traci-Skene-ebook/dp/B0094A2XFC

Posted by: Brian McKim at June 16, 2014 01:23 AM (NHK1D)

333 http://www.bjsfkw.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=939789&fromuid=131452
Birkenstock Outlet http://www.design.karimnassar.com

Posted by: Birkenstock Outlet at June 18, 2014 07:04 PM (E95W4)

334 http://liuxueyuyan.org/plus/view.php?aid=172190
Jordan pas cher http://www.actiprot.at

Posted by: Jordan pas cher at June 19, 2014 12:59 AM (E95W4)

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