Saturday Evening Movie Thread

Saturday Evening Movie Thread - 5/9/2026

Worldbuilding

When an author decides to tell a story in a world not our own, he or she has two main paths to choose from. The first is the path of Tolkien.

Build an intricate mythology, legendarium, and multiple languages to create a backstory for a world (that includes the transformation of the geology from a flat world to a globe), all that spans thousands of years, includes a creation myth, all of which is the author's real passion which he is then able to include in a sequel to a silly children's book he wrote to entertain his children. Heck, Tolkien directly references the central gems of what his son would put together as The Silmarillion, the Silmarils, in The Lord of the Rings.

Or, you can have a central conceit and create a very vague world around it with generic pieces that don't always really come together. This is how Suzanne Collins wrote The Hunger Games. I really don't think the world she created is any good at all. It's outright bad. And yet, I mostly don't think it matters.

Panem

So, I had The Hunger Games on the brain because my wife decided that our eldest son was old enough to watch it. Watched the original four movies over the course of a few days. It's a series I've seen multiple times, it being a standard bit of entertainment in the house since we first dated (seeing the four in theaters together as dates). So, watching them again, my mind drifted to the worldbuilding and how meager it all is.

It's a country set in a dystopian future that's supposedly built from the ashes of America. Collins does not provide real clues beyond generalized geographic descriptions for where any of the twelve districts that make up the majority of the country's area are or where the capitol is other than being in the mountains. This has led fans to come up with maps that all disagree with each other except on some basic points like District 12 being West Virginia or Pennsylvania and the Capitol being in the Colorado Rockies.

There seems to be little thought into why these places exist, especially when you get to the point later in the series when District 12, presumably their only source of coal, a major source of energy, gets bombed to the stone age, and...no one talks about how the Capitol could be facing an energy crisis. Does that mean that District 12's work was...unimportant? It's very possible. We see a major dam in the third film that gets blown up that seems to have more of an effect on energy than destroying all the coal miners in the country. Does this narrative hole matter?

Within the context of the story, which is laser-focused on the main character of Katniss Everdean, I don't think so. The purpose of the original trilogy of books and quadrilogy of movies is the main character's journey. The world is incidental to that, so a certain vagueness about how things worked on a grander political level is understandable. The point isn't the world, the point is Katniss's journey from no-one to symbol of a resistance. It makes sense.

It doesn't sweep away the fact that the world is kind of...generic and doesn't make the most sense. Couldn't Collins have named the districts? Oh well.

Problems Arising

I think this is only noteworthy because the story did continue beyond the original three books and four movies (don't split the final entry into two, Hollywood, Mockingjay Part 1 is boring). Collins, becoming one of the richest fiction authors in the world, has written nothing but Hunger Games prequels since 2013. The first, The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes, was published in 2020 and the movie version came out in 2023. The second, Sunrise of the Reaping, was published in 2025 and the movie version is coming out this year.

So, she has this generic world she's barely explored and has the opportunity for a guaranteed paycheck to expand it with prequels. What does she do?

She repeats herself...hard.

Our main character in the first prequel is a character from the original books, President Snow (but this time only as a poor student) while the action is only in the Capitol and...District 12, while a girl from District 12 becomes the Victor of the Tenth Annual Hunger Games. No scenes exploring any other district. Just the Capitol, District 12, and the arena for the Hunger Games. What about the second prequel? Well, it's centered around a character from the original books (Haymitch, Katniss' mentor) and how he won the Hunger Games. So...District 12 to Capitol to Hunger Games arena...again.

Is The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes bad for that? Well, I think the book is terrible and the lack of exploration of the rest of the world is part of that. I think the movie version is okay because it deals with some of my other issues around point of view and pacing while providing spectacle that the books couldn't really deliver. But the frustration with the myopic view of the world continues.

Should there be more? Can Collins write stories with the same motifs, settings, and character traits and still create good things? Of course, but I don't see any kind of poetic repetition here, I just see imagination-deficient repetition. I think that has a lot to do with the fact that she obviously doesn't care about the world she built.

World Building or Story or Both?

It's not an either/or proposition. You can have both world building and story, but it's obvious that Collins much prefers her story over her world building (her story is...pretty good overall). And I end up creating a comparison in my head.

Collins is writing for teens. Effectively children. What else is for children? Fables. Fables like Hansel & Gretel. Do we need a deep construction of the particulars of geography and history of the Old Forest in the story? Or can "dark, creepy, ancient forest" be enough for the purposes of the story?

That's the proper way to think of Panem, I think. The equivalent wouldn't be Middle Earth, a fairy setting for adults (as Tolkien put it), but the Old Forest and the witch's hut. It's a generalized setting in which to place an easily digested moral that the younger than adult mind can grasp easily.

So when she decides to try and create something a bit more adult, like the creation of YA Dystopian Hitler in the backstory of President Snow, the lack of worldbuilding ends up working against the sudden move into something requiring more nuance since she wants to create a real journey from sympathetic young man to literal Hitler. We're still in fable territory with the world, and I think it clashes with the attempt at a more serious story (which I don't think she really pulls off because she's not really that great of a writer, but much wealthier and more successful than I ever will be, so what do I know?).

A newer approach that actually expanded the story in serious ways, giving us new looks at new districts we've never seen and introducing more complex politics beyond "crazy powermad person at the top" would have helped, and in order to do that you have to be invested in making the world itself feel real.

Conclusion

It's just a thought brought on by recent viewing. How important is world building? Well, I guess it depends on what kind of story you're telling. Would a geneology of the mayors of District 12 have improved the story itself? No. What about a detailed description of how the economies of each district contributed to the Capitol's GDP? Also, no.

But I do think the lack of anything makes the films and books feel a bit emptier than they are and harder to expand when, ironically, that should make it easier. Collins hadn't written herself into a box. She could expand in a whole host of ways, and yet...she just keeps going back to District 12.

Oh, well. She's making bank doing it.

Movies of Today

Opening in Theaters:

Mortal Kombat II

The Sheep Detectives

Movies I Saw This Fortnight:

The Men of Sherwood Forest (Rating 3/4) Full Review "It's a modest entertainment that understands the assignment and reaches no further beyond that." [Library]

Third Party Risk (or, The Deadly Game) (Rating 2/4) Full Review "It's an unremarkable, thin wrong man adventure that flitters from little sequence to the next, its central star doing what he can to elevate things, and largely disappearing from mind before it's even over." [YouTube]

The Lyons in Paris (Rating 2/4) Full Review "Still, it's really just silly antics with performers doing their utmost to get some laughs. I almost chuckled a few times." [Library]

The Quatermass Xperiment (Rating 2.5/4) Full Review "Still, the horror is halfway decent and there's surprising emotionality hidden in the middle there, all while it looks pretty decent and has solid supporting performances." [Prime]

X the Unknown (Rating 2/4) Full Review "It's still largely an kind of dull monster flick with a disappointing monster in the end. But the use of music and the implication of the danger for a good stretch are nice." [Archive.org]

The Curse of Frankenstein (Rating 2.5/4) Full Review "And yet, while it plays out, I may not feel much, but I do end up with a modestly good time watching this vibrantly colored take on a well-worn story." [Max]

Quatermass II (Rating 3/4) Full Review "I was fully on board, and it's just a disappointment that it doesn't end at the same level as most of the film operates." [Plex]

The Camp on Blood Island (Rating 3/4) Full Review "A pleasant little surprise, even if it really does only exist because of David Lean's other movie." [YouTube]

Contact

Email any suggestions or questions to thejamesmadison.aos at symbol gmail dot com.
I've also archived all the old posts here, by request. I'll add new posts a week after they originally post at the HQ.
My next thread will be on 5/30.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at 07:45 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Movie Sign!

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 09, 2026 07:44 PM (l26NL)

2 Wolfus nooded. No one here yet?

Posted by: Nazdar at May 09, 2026 07:44 PM (NcvvS)

3 Bronze

Posted by: Cow Demon at May 09, 2026 07:45 PM (T6aVk)

4 Huh

Posted by: Sharkman at May 09, 2026 07:46 PM (/RHNq)

5 Never have read or seen any of the Hunger Games properties.

Heinlein had a balkanized North America in his Friday from '82, and more generally in its prequel novella, "Gulf." The sections are named, and we know some of the borders, but the story is mostly about Friday the combat courier herself and how she moves -- and stays alive! -- in her technological society. RAH was incapable of writing dull, though, so details of the background beyond a certain point are not absolutely essential to enjoying either story.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 07:47 PM (wzUl9)

6 I have to say I have never done a deep dive into the world Suzanne Collins "built". I have always been less than impressed.

The world building is a critical thing. Fantasy is not my thing, so I have never gotten int LotR, but the world building I will acknowledge is utterly insane and very admirable.

"Dune" is another such example. The world building is top notch, and that is what sucked me in straightaway.

Posted by: Cow Demon at May 09, 2026 07:47 PM (T6aVk)

7 I never watched the Hunger Games movies or read the books, partly because I thought the world building was pretty weak.

JK Rowling's Harry Potter series also has very weak worldbuilding, in my opinion, for largely the same reasons.

It's fine to focus on characters, but I do like to have some logical consistency within the world so that it makes a certain amount of sense.

Hunger Games makes no sense whatsoever.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 09, 2026 07:48 PM (gnNyN)

8 Maybe the Collins universe is the novel/movie version of GURPS?

Posted by: Cow Demon at May 09, 2026 07:48 PM (T6aVk)

9 There's not much on TV as far as movies tonight. Movies! has the wonder that is Jerry Lewis in The Nutty Professor, and Svengoolie is showing 1964's The First Men in the Moon. I outgrew JL about the same time I outgrew the Three Stooges, and while the latter movie is based on an H.G. Wells story with a script by Nigel Kneale, I don't hold out much hope for it.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 07:49 PM (wzUl9)

10 Thx TJM. It's unfortunate that some of Donald Sutherland's last work was in those movies. I realize they weren't aimed at me but I watched them and in comparison to say the Harry Potter movies , which theoretically was young adult ,they weren't good.

Posted by: Smell the Glove at May 09, 2026 07:50 PM (gu0hJ)

11 >>RAH was incapable of writing dull, though, so details of the background beyond a certain point are not absolutely essential to enjoying either story.

Wolfus, outside of the Future History stuff, Heinlein didn't really do world-building - just enough detail to make the story work.

Posted by: Nazdar at May 09, 2026 07:51 PM (NcvvS)

12 The Absent-Minded Professor > The Nutty Professor

Posted by: Mark1971 at May 09, 2026 07:52 PM (CNl8/)

13 You know who doesn’t need world building? Chuck Norris, that’s who. Texas, Chicago, Vietnam. Doesn’t matter. It’s his world, we’re just in it.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at May 09, 2026 07:53 PM (u73oe)

14 Holy crap. Ace in the sidebar noted that he posted my comment about Lucas calling Warner and Kaine "cucks" on X. It's been viewed 103k times. Thx Ace

Posted by: Smell the Glove at May 09, 2026 07:55 PM (gu0hJ)

15 As far as worldbuilding, in fiction anyway, there are the techniques of Tell the Reader What He Needs to Know (Sometimes Too Much), or Reveal the Elements of the World As We Pursue the Story.

I'm funny; I don't mind being lectured about something if I find it interesting. Michael Crichton lectures us in his fiction, all the way back to Andromeda Strain, but I love it since he does it so well. The history of a *created* world, however, is hard to put across in an entertaining way. The usual technique, if you do it like that, is to include a paragraph or two from an "authority" who has written about the world at the start of each chapter or section, so the reader can gather info as he goes.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 07:55 PM (wzUl9)

16 Aargh - gotta call it a night - my day is almost 17 hours old (don't ask - just, don't). TJM has brought up a very interesting distinction, especially for an illiterate :-) and am looking forward to reading the comments in about 7 hours.

Posted by: Nazdar at May 09, 2026 07:56 PM (NcvvS)

17 Liked the Quatermass movies, especially the first one. Surprised no remake has been done

Posted by: Smell the Glove at May 09, 2026 07:57 PM (gu0hJ)

18 RAH was incapable of writing dull, though, so details of the background beyond a certain point are not absolutely essential to enjoying either story.

Wolfus, outside of the Future History stuff, Heinlein didn't really do world-building - just enough detail to make the story work.
Posted by: Nazdar at May 09, 2026

***
Friday's balkanized North America is drawn more than just generally, but with never a focus on hard detail that would slow the story down. You're right, Heinlein knew something a lot of authors today need to learn: Just put in enough, not too much.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 07:57 PM (wzUl9)

19 Liked the Quatermass movies, especially the first one. Surprised no remake has been done
Posted by: Smell the Glove at May 09, 2026

***
Yes; when I see the name "Nigel Kneale" I pay attention, just as I do with William Goldman.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 07:58 PM (wzUl9)

20 One of the challenges for worldbuilding in movies is that you only have so much time to establish the rules of the world in a single movie.

What helps movies like Hunger Games, Harry Potter, and Lord of the Rings is that much of the audience is already aware of the details of the world, so minimal detail is needed for the unaware folks.

Sometimes the worldbuilding gets stupid over time, like in the John Wick movies. The first one was great. The sequels became increasingly more over-the-top ridiculous to the point of unbelievability. Like the Fast and Furious movies.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 09, 2026 08:00 PM (gnNyN)

21 The Hunger Games has a very interesting premise, and an initially promising main character. I lost interest towards the end of the first book when it was clear the author had no interest in making her world *consistent*. Either food is scarce or it isn't. Either technology is limited or it isn't. Worldbuilding can be sketchy and the book works fine! (I am myself guilty of some handwaving at points, especially regarding travel times. They get there, whaddyawannaknow?) BUT. The rules I establish in Chapter 1 remain in effect in Chapter 30, by gum. It's like Collins just threw tropes at the wall ... at different times... and forgot to go back and clean up. Oh well, as others have remarked she's rolling in dough and I'm not

Posted by: Sabrina Chase at May 09, 2026 08:03 PM (Y9Vvl)

22 I would prefer watching the Harry Potter movies to the Hunger Games.

My boys have those books and movies memorized.

But they have an almost reverence for the Lord of the Rings books and movies.

Posted by: nurse ratched at May 09, 2026 08:04 PM (A5RD0)

23 You're right, Heinlein knew something a lot of authors today need to learn: Just put in enough, not too much.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 07:57 PM (wzUl9)

Very well said.

Too much bogs down. (Hear that, Stephen King?) Too little isn't enough to latch on to.

Posted by: Cow Demon at May 09, 2026 08:04 PM (T6aVk)

24 What about Narnia?

Posted by: nurse ratched at May 09, 2026 08:05 PM (A5RD0)

25 The world building is over the top and contradictory the names are out of roman lore corolianus sejanus et al but the concept is from minoan crete

The premise from battle royale but collins says she was inspired by reality footage and war footage (right)

The map suggests global warming catastrophe like something out of paradise but its not evenly distributed was it economic crisis was it social strife

Why is the capitol in the rockies

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:06 PM (bXbFr)

26 Once upon a time, to introduce the audience to the created world (even if it was similar to ours), the script would introduce an innocent who knows nothing of the situation and has to be shown around. The first episode of Hogan's Heroes did that. U.N.C.L.E. did not, but then its first five or six episodes had a little prologue where Solo, Illya, and Waverly all address the viewer, tell their names, and what they and the organization all do.

Before I got to see the earliest Trek episodes, I imagined they would have had a Federation ambassador or somebody being shown around the ship and told about it ("We have 430 men and women as our crew," etc.). Egad, that would have been slow and horrible.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:07 PM (wzUl9)

27 Eriksonz malazan is a more complete world building so is modesitts recent steam punk trilogy

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:08 PM (bXbFr)

28 Sutherland bring an old time letty son of the founder of the ndp

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:10 PM (bXbFr)

29 Hunger Games . The beginning of Girl Power movies?

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:10 PM (52qkP)

30 Herbert did a good job of world building in Dune. A sci-fi series that did a great job of it was Babylon 5.

Posted by: Smell the Glove at May 09, 2026 08:11 PM (gu0hJ)

31 Right now watching Farscape -Peace Keeper Wars.

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:12 PM (52qkP)

32 So he was a villain in that series as well as the outbreak film back when ww reviewed petersen oevre

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:12 PM (bXbFr)

33 Yeah scifi channel really dropped the ball there

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:13 PM (bXbFr)

34
Too much bogs down. (Hear that, Stephen King?) Too little isn't enough to latch on to.
Posted by: Cow Demon at May 09, 2026

***
King did very well at that detail thing during his early years. Salem's Lot, The Shining, Dead Zone, Pet Sematary, Firestarter are all excellent. The Stand in its edited form pushed the envelope, but such were his storytelling skills that we didn't mind. Some of his later things I've never gone back to reread (The Regulators, The Tommyknockers, The Dark Half, Gerald's Game) and don't even have a copy of.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:13 PM (wzUl9)

35 Is that on pluto or tubi

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:14 PM (bXbFr)

36 I like worldbuilding but I'm actually partial to just being psradropped into a new world/time and figuring it out from the clues dropped in conversation, with characters making oblique references because everyone understands without elaboration.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes. at May 09, 2026 08:15 PM (kpS4V)

37 A couple things to remember:

1) Tolkien a dude.

2) he wrote it almost as a hobby to escape some pretty nasty shit. He had time to elaborate on it, map it out in his mind.

He probably would be considered autistic today (fucking please, overuse) but he had that kind of laser focus you see in real dude enthusiasts. Train guys, plane guys, car guys. Video game guys (especially the one game guys.) Now women 'can' be like this (see Puma, Anna) but it is even less common than among dudes.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 08:16 PM (zZu0s)

38 Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:13 PM (wzUl9)

Steven King is definitely the author with the most movies made from his books.

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:17 PM (52qkP)

39 I really enjoyed The Hunger Games books. For Christmas, I got jr. an audio book - not interested. Back then, we had a 4 hour run back to RI. When we left, I popped the tape in. Within minutes, Mrs. Red and Jr. were listening intently. When we got back to RI, we stayed in the garage listening till the end of the tape.

Posted by: RI Red at May 09, 2026 08:17 PM (jkyX4)

40 I gathered from the stories that there was some sort of major war and even a nuclear exchange, which is why Capital City is in the Rockies.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes. at May 09, 2026 08:18 PM (kpS4V)

41 Frascape is a good example on character building rather than world building (although the world building IS good, it is just enough.) Tolkien's characters can be flat, but he makes it up with world building.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 08:18 PM (zZu0s)

42 Steven King is definitely the author with the most movies made from his books.
Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:17 PM (52qkP)
----

*ahem!*

Posted by: God at May 09, 2026 08:19 PM (kpS4V)

43 He waa also a medieval scholar at university

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:19 PM (bXbFr)

44 Steven King is definitely the author with the most movies made from his books.
Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026

***
His imagination was definitely a visual one, which translated well to film. He grew up watching horror films, after all, and absorbed that kind of storytelling early on.

I've never seen the (only?) film he directed, Maximum Overdrive, having heard it's horrible. The original short story, "Trucks," is a little masterpiece, though.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:19 PM (wzUl9)

45 I know people crap on The Postman but I kind of liked it.

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:20 PM (52qkP)

46 162 Ringing Rocks seem like an excellent way to summon rattlesnakes. Or demons.
Posted by: Eromero at May 09, 2026 07:56 PM (LHPAg)
Willowed from Hobby Thread.

Posted by: Eromero at May 09, 2026 08:20 PM (LHPAg)

47 I know people crap on The Postman but I kind of liked it.
Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:20 PM (52qkP)

I liked it a lot better than Dances With Wolves. But it is not near as good as The Patriot.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 08:21 PM (zZu0s)

48 Waterworld is right out.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 08:21 PM (zZu0s)

49 I know people crap on The Postman but I kind of liked it.
Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026

***
I read the novel and it was pretty well done. I suspect the reason people crap on the movie is at least in part because we think poorly of USPS employees as they are today. If it had been called The Courier, I think it might have done better.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:21 PM (wzUl9)

50
The Absent-Minded Professor > The Nutty Professor
Posted by: Mark1971

Fred flubbed it.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at May 09, 2026 08:24 PM (Cqx++)

51 I gathered from the stories that there was some sort of major war and even a nuclear exchange, which is why Capital City is in the Rockies.
Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes. at May 09, 2026

***
Heinlein's Door Into Summer opens with a reference to something called the Six Weeks War -- so in the very first sentence we know we are not in "our" world. He expands on it later, mentioning the U.S. capital in his 1999 is Denver (when he wrote that in the late Fifties, he lived in Colo. Springs!).

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:24 PM (wzUl9)

52 If you're in the mood for weird whimsy, "Dust Bunny" is a visually arresting oddity. A little girl is terrorized by an ever more menacing dust bunny growing under her bed and seeks help from a warrior assassin (Mads Mikelson) living down the hallway from her family. She saw him take on a Chinese dragon (actually the gang members hiding underneath) and hires him to be her monster slayer.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at May 09, 2026 08:25 PM (kpS4V)

53 There was a more recent (195

installment in the Quatermass series: Quartermass and the Pit.
I saw it as a teen and it stayed with me for a long time.
It involved an alien craft found during excavation of The Tube and the awakening of the alien intelligence.
A great combo of Sci-Fi and horror, IMO.

Posted by: proudvastrightwingguy at May 09, 2026 08:25 PM (MNCvZ)

54 Tolkien's world building is one of the reasons his mythology is so addictive. He puts you in that world so well that you can see it, and hear it, and even smell it.

Posted by: davidt at May 09, 2026 08:25 PM (Q+gd/)

55 And I liked the Book of Eli but the movie's twist was not done realistically as they basically had the protagonist act just like a sighted person but wanted you to believe he was blind all this time.

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:26 PM (52qkP)

56 Waterworld was crazy implausible

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:26 PM (bXbFr)

57 There was a more recent (1958 ) installment in the Quatermass series: Quartermass and the Pit.
I saw it as a teen and it stayed with me for a long time.
It involved an alien craft found during excavation of The Tube and the awakening of the alien intelligence.
A great combo of Sci-Fi and horror, IMO.
Posted by: proudvastrightwingguy at May 09, 2026

***
That's the one I remember, and first noted Kneale's name on.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:26 PM (wzUl9)

58 The three Mad Max movies with Mel Gibson presented a very dystopian wasteland. It was possible, though Bartertown was a little weird. The subsequent movies added little

Posted by: Smell the Glove at May 09, 2026 08:30 PM (gu0hJ)

59 48 Waterworld is right out.
Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 08:21 PM (zZu0s)

Road Warrior With Boats

Posted by: Cow Demon at May 09, 2026 08:30 PM (T6aVk)

60 Waterworld would have been much better if Jean Trippelhorn was naked

Posted by: Smell the Glove at May 09, 2026 08:31 PM (gu0hJ)

61 This announcer chick commenting on the hockey game is annoying.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at May 09, 2026 08:32 PM (nwbXw)

62 King did very well at that detail thing during his early years. Salem's Lot, The Shining, Dead Zone, Pet Sematary, Firestarter are all excellent. The Stand in its edited form pushed the envelope, but such were his storytelling skills that we didn't mind. Some of his later things I've never gone back to reread (The Regulators, The Tommyknockers, The Dark Half, Gerald's Game) and don't even have a copy of.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:13 PM (wzUl9)

The Stand is one of my favorite novels. I enjoyed The Dead Zone and a handful of others. But I must take King’s work in moderation. Great imagination, but he lacks artistic restraint.

Posted by: Cow Demon at May 09, 2026 08:33 PM (T6aVk)

63 A Boy and His Dog was weird but fun movie.

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:33 PM (52qkP)

64 Yes mad max doesnt make sense and riad warrier doesnt clarify aa australia dabbles with the present reality

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:33 PM (bXbFr)

65 She saw him take on a Chinese dragon (actually the gang members hiding underneath) and hires him to be her monster slayer.
Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at May 09, 2026 08:25 PM (kpS4V)

That actually sounds kind of cool. Ill have to try to find it.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 08:34 PM (zZu0s)

66 Yes thats a weird one with the telepathic dog

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:34 PM (bXbFr)

67 To me, King can not properly finish a story. The beginning catches your attention, then it fizzles out.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at May 09, 2026 08:35 PM (nwbXw)

68 The Dead Zone was my favorite of all the King book movies .

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:35 PM (52qkP)

69 I prefer Sutter Kane.

Posted by: TJM's phone at May 09, 2026 08:36 PM (tXqCv)

70 Dead Zone series was good, too.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at May 09, 2026 08:37 PM (nwbXw)

71 Theatrical version of Quatermass & the Pit was released as Five Million Years to Earth, and it is delightful.

IIRC, Nigel Kneale was on board for Halloween III, but didn't care much for the direction the filmmakers wanted to go, so he bailed. No idea how much of the finished flick came from Kneale's work (not a lot, I suspect).

Quite a range of credits in his IMDb listing. And if you've never seen First Men in the Moon, co-written by Kneale from the Wells novel, check it out. It's a lot of fun.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 09, 2026 08:37 PM (q3u5l)

72 Now that I think about it, Stephen King's "worldbuilding" in his early great novels was pretty much "use our world" with one essential supernatural/SF element added. The town of Salem's Lot is based on any number of Maine towns, I expect, and the hotel in The Shining is based on the Stanley in Estes Park. Not until The Talisman did he create an alternate world, and that was in collaboration with Peter Straub.

His vision of the post-superflu world in Colorado and Las Vegas with only about .6% of the world's population still alive was nicely imagined, though.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:38 PM (wzUl9)

73 I'm about to watch "Varsity Blues". Hope the worldbuilding is good.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at May 09, 2026 08:38 PM (kpS4V)

74 M-O--O-N spells AoSHQ.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at May 09, 2026 08:38 PM (nwbXw)

75 To me, King can not properly finish a story. The beginning catches your attention, then it fizzles out.
Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at May 09, 2026 08:35 PM (nwbXw)

Agree but he has a few with a proper endings.

The Dead Zone was one.

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:38 PM (52qkP)

76 I heard about hunger games. That was that pudgy blue chick from the X-Persons?

Posted by: Rev. Wishbone at May 09, 2026 08:39 PM (D1E+2)

77 Quite a range of credits in his IMDb listing. And if you've never seen First Men in the Moon, co-written by Kneale from the Wells novel, check it out. It's a lot of fun.
Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 09, 2026

***
It's on Svengoolie right now! I was afraid it was going to be a humorless thudding tract kind of film, but it seems charming.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:39 PM (wzUl9)

78 Now playing on svengoolie

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:40 PM (bXbFr)

79 Now playing on svengoolie

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:40 PM (bXbFr)

80 Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:38 PM (wzUl9)

Running Man

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:40 PM (52qkP)

81
If you're in the mood for weird whimsy, "Dust Bunny" is a visually arresting oddity.

That reminded me of "It Crawled Out of the Woodwork"

www.imdb.com/title/tt0667817

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at May 09, 2026 08:40 PM (Cqx++)

82 Commenter Miklos could explain Hungarian Games to us.

Posted by: davidt at May 09, 2026 08:42 PM (Q+gd/)

83 Running man was kind of a drudge the latesr revamp sort of followed the scheme but made it longer

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:42 PM (bXbFr)

84 Denver isn't terrible as a new capitol, it is more or less central in terms of travel times, since the Rockies and Sierra would be difficult depending on what transport structure is left. Having a single product (I've hear people describe districts by one thing they make) is really dumb, every district would have to produce food for most local uses. Not sure why district areas would remain localized once the destruction was over, you'd think in the midwest they'd spread and farm anywhere they could.

Posted by: Oldcat at May 09, 2026 08:44 PM (Ai6WH)

85 To me, King can not properly finish a story. The beginning catches your attention, then it fizzles out.
Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at May 09, 2026 08:35 PM (nwbXw)

Agree but he has a few with a proper endings.

The Dead Zone was one.
Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026

***
Ian, I'll admit his later work is like that. The ending of Salem's Lot may seem like a fizzle, but it's rather literary -- he was not long out of college at that point and still used literary quotes as epigrams instead of lyrics from songs like "Boogie Fever."

The Shining and The Stand have solid endings, and if you believe as he did that Rolling Stone is the one honest incorruptible magazine in America [muffled snort], then the ending of Firestarter is too. His endings for the four novelettes in Different Seasons are very very good, as is his ending for The Green Mile.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:44 PM (wzUl9)

86 Running man was kind of a drudge the latesr revamp sort of followed the scheme but made it longer
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026

***
The original novel is a fast read and lots of fun.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:45 PM (wzUl9)

87 But he has long since eschewed an editor

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:46 PM (bXbFr)

88 Maybe i have to pick it up again

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:46 PM (bXbFr)

89 But yes if its supposed to be a fable then little world building is needed

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:49 PM (bXbFr)

90 But certainly by. Mockingjay the innards of panem are made clear

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:49 PM (bXbFr)

91 The Dead Zone was my favorite of all the King book movies .
Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026

***
Greek tragedy.

The TV series that picked up on the adventures of Johnny Smith after awakening with his psi power, played by Anthony Michael Hall, was well done too. Hall had come a long way since his John Hughes movies days.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:50 PM (wzUl9)

92 Commentary without comparisons to 60's films, The Most Dangerous Game book about hunting humans, and the Japanese series of Battle Royale is lacking. Also, if you like Battle Royale, you enjoy evil. It is evil filmed.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at May 09, 2026 08:51 PM (diia5)

93 There's a mini-series King did called Storm of the Century with Tim Daly, Colm Feore, and a cast of several that ultimately boils down to a grim variation on The Lottery.

I thought it was nicely done, though nothing to write home about -- until it got to the ending. The last act of it shows what happened to the town and its people after the decision they made on lottery night, and it made the show. YMMV.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 09, 2026 08:53 PM (q3u5l)

94 Maximum Overdrive was the last straw. Never again.

Posted by: Rev. Wishbone at May 09, 2026 08:53 PM (D1E+2)

95 Was that a mick farren script he did the best adaptations

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:55 PM (bXbFr)

96 Good evening everyone

My pick of the week movie was a French film,
Le Grand Homme or in English The Good Man from 2014 .
Follows 2 Legionares but isn't a war movie.
Was subtitles which turns off some but it eas a very good movie I thought, for anyone, maybe not kids.

Posted by: Skip at May 09, 2026 08:55 PM (Ia/+0)

97 The world of The Silent Plaet was pretty bizarre.

Posted by: nurse ratched at May 09, 2026 08:55 PM (A5RD0)

98 The reinvention of the stand waa unnecessary

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:55 PM (bXbFr)

99 Was that showtime or netflix

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 08:57 PM (bXbFr)

100 97 The world of The Silent Plaet was pretty bizarre.
Posted by: nurse ratched at May 09, 2026 08:55 PM (A5RD0)
----

Love that movie. So weird.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at May 09, 2026 08:57 PM (kpS4V)

101 The world of The Silent Plaet was pretty bizarre.
Posted by: nurse ratched

Is this now a dress thread?

Posted by: weft cut-loop at May 09, 2026 08:57 PM (diia5)

102 No, wait, I'm thinking of Fantastic Planet.

Never mind.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at May 09, 2026 08:58 PM (kpS4V)

103 Maximum Overdrive was the last straw. Never again.
Posted by: Rev. Wishbone at May 09, 2026

***
Resulting, no doubt, from trying to turn a short story of less than 5K words into an entire movie. The story would have made a wonderful Twilight Zone or even an Outer Limits had it appeared in 1960 instead of 1970-something.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 08:59 PM (wzUl9)

104 Forbidden world (the one with leslie nielsen)

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:00 PM (bXbFr)

105 Forbidden world (the one with leslie nielsen)
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:00 PM (bXbFr)

Forbidden Planet?

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 09:01 PM (zZu0s)

106 The reinvention of the stand waa unnecessary
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026

***
If you mean the issue of the "unedited" version? Yes. There were some interesting scenes in there, but King's original editor was wise to cut them out of the 1978 edition.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:02 PM (wzUl9)

107 >> Collins is writing for teens. Effectively children. What else is for children? Fables. Fables like Hansel & Gretel. Do we need a deep construction of the particulars of geography and history of the Old Forest in the story? Or can "dark, creepy, ancient forest" be enough for the purposes of the story?

That's the proper way to think of Panem, I think. The equivalent wouldn't be Middle Earth, a fairy setting for adults (as Tolkien put it), but the Old Forest and the witch's hut. It's a generalized setting in which to place an easily digested moral that the younger than adult mind can grasp easily.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at 07:45 PM

There is that, and also the difference between the Hero's Journey and the Heroine's Journey, where the latter is more.. internal. The external world literally doesn't matter as much in the feminine version, being mainly a backdrop and stage for the FMC's* psychodrama, where the real action happens. Combined with the fable-like nature of stories for youth, it's a one-two punch against world-building.

* Female Main Character

Posted by: SciVo at May 09, 2026 09:02 PM (Sy6m/)

108 Forbidden world (the one with leslie nielsen)
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026
*
Forbidden Planet?
Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026

***
Forbidden Planet, yes. I'm sure Gene Roddenberry denied it to his dying day, but it was clearly a strong inspiration for the Kirk & Co. saga.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:03 PM (wzUl9)

109 No the cast one (i dont remember the cast)

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:04 PM (bXbFr)

110 Then again many of these dystopic takes maze tunner divergent are underwritten

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:05 PM (bXbFr)

111 I also watched the 3 hours and 15 minutes of Apocalypse Now Redux, no idea why

Posted by: Skip at May 09, 2026 09:05 PM (Ia/+0)

112 Forbidden Planet?

Posted by: Texican ette at May 09, 2026 09:06 PM (SNf74)

113 No the cast one (i dont remember the cast)
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026

***
There was a well-cast miniseries of The Stand in '94, with Molly Ringwald, Gary Sinise, and Matt Frewer as the definitive Trashcan Man.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:06 PM (wzUl9)

114 There are some interesting elements like the plantation interlude but they dont add much to the film

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:08 PM (bXbFr)

115 Never saw a minute of Hunger Games

Posted by: Skip at May 09, 2026 09:08 PM (Ia/+0)

116 Sometimes world building is too much. I know it's blasphemous to say but I felt that way about Tolkien. It got really, really hard to slog through LotR when every time a character appeared he had to tell the entire history of his land from when the first unicellular lifeforms appeared.

I know that the world building was Tolkien's main interest and that's great. Not every story needs to be told.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at May 09, 2026 09:09 PM (CHHv1)

117 Forbidden Planet?
Posted by: Texican ette at May 09, 2026

***
There was a tradition at the local Trek/SF conventions, Vul-Cons, they were called. Sunday evening, the last film shown in the movie room was always Forbidden Planet.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:11 PM (wzUl9)

118 "Resulting, no doubt, from trying to turn a short story of less than 5K words into an entire movie."

Yep. This probably happens more often than not when somebody tries to make a movie based on a short story. Predestination, from Heinlein's "All You Zombies," suffers from this I think. The Masters of Horror segment "Dance of the Dead" from Richard Matheson's short story of the same name ditto; in DVD extras on that one screenwriter Richard Christian Matheson, RM's son, said the piece suffered from having 30 minutes worth of story but an hour's worth of time to fill. Rod Serling's Twilight Zone adaptation of John Collier's "The Chaser" is a prime example; story proper ends at the halfway mark and the last half of the episode is really filler.

That said, if you're in the mood for an absurd goofy turn-your-brain-off I-can't-believe-they-actually-did-this 90 minutes, it's kinda hard to do better than Maximum Overdrive, which King holds us as his answer when asked why he never directed another movie.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 09, 2026 09:12 PM (q3u5l)

119 Sometimes world building is too much. I know it's blasphemous to say but I felt that way about Tolkien. It got really, really hard to slog through LotR when every time a character appeared he had to tell the entire history of his land from when the first unicellular lifeforms appeared.

I know that the world building was Tolkien's main interest and that's great. Not every story needs to be told.
Posted by: BeckoningChasm at May 09, 2026

***
That is probably why I have never reread the trilogy. I have a feeling I would be skimming a lot of such passages. The parts I remember best are the big action pieces, the climax at Mount Doom, and the scene with Gandalf riding on Shadowfax the swift horse and carrying one of the hobbits

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:13 PM (wzUl9)

120 JSG, "All You Zombies" is one Heinlein story I have never been able to follow. I have a feeling any movie made from it would confuse my "simple, childlike mind" even further.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:15 PM (wzUl9)

121 This "First Men In The Moon" movie is not quite accurate. For one thing, I don't think that blond is a man.

Posted by: fd at May 09, 2026 09:15 PM (vFG9F)

122 This "First Men In The Moon" movie is not quite accurate. For one thing, I don't think that blond is a man.
Posted by: fd at May 09, 2026

***
No one would ever confuse Martha Hyer in her prime with a male. Even a blind man would whiff her perfume and hear her voice, and know right away.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:17 PM (wzUl9)

123 Oh brother. I can see the string.

Posted by: fd at May 09, 2026 09:17 PM (vFG9F)

124 I didnt remember that matheson story

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:17 PM (bXbFr)

125 That just took me right out of it.

Posted by: fd at May 09, 2026 09:18 PM (vFG9F)

126 There was a well-cast miniseries of The Stand in '94, with Molly Ringwald, Gary Sinise, and Matt Frewer as the definitive Trashcan Man.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:06 PM (wzUl9)

The first half is extremely good and creepy. Post apocalypse porn. Then it gets weird, like many Steven King novels.

Its interesting, few her besides perfessor have probably played division 1 & 2, but the first game with the dollar plague was very Standish. The second one went weird with brightly colored environments which did not match the tone of the first game at all. It is a similar transition shock.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 09:18 PM (zZu0s)

127 63 A Boy and His Dog was weird but fun movie.
Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:33 PM (52qkP)

I did not know that anyone else had seen that! (I will awkwardly refrain from saying you have good taste.)

Posted by: SciVo at May 09, 2026 09:20 PM (Sy6m/)

128 Never saw a minute of Hunger Games
Posted by: Skip at May 09, 2026 09:08 PM (Ia/+0)

Me either.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 09:21 PM (zZu0s)

129 Yes i remember that one, with sinise and i forget who plsys flagg jamey sheridan

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:21 PM (bXbFr)

130 "All You Zombies" turns me around six different ways too and I'd hate to have to diagram the ins and outs of that story, but it still works for me.

Nice example of a short story successfully adapted to a 2-hour movie? John Huston's film of Kipling's The Man Who Would Be King. Maybe there's something wrong with that movie, but I've never cared to pick at it to find out.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 09, 2026 09:21 PM (q3u5l)

131 The first half [of The Stand) is extremely good and creepy. Post apocalypse porn. Then it gets weird, like many Steven King novels. . . .

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026

***
The first half of the miniseries, and the novel, is science fiction. The second half is fantasy -- instead of relying on rationality (saying "That's what gave us the superflu in the first place"), the main characters are asked to rely on faith and what amounts to magic. It is a startling transition, but in the novel anyway, King makes it work. The characters believe it, and we can too.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:23 PM (wzUl9)

132 If you want great world building, nothing beats The Bible, or Homer's, The Odyssey, which I fear is going to be a disaster.

I think it will be his first real bomb.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at May 09, 2026 09:23 PM (XV/Pl)

133 Yes i remember that one, with sinise and i forget who plsys flagg jamey sheridan
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:21 PM (bXbFr)

Also Laura San Giacomo.

Also that character actor who was in everything... dammit.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 09:24 PM (zZu0s)

134 Zounds that looks like it will stink to high heaven

What was nolan thinking

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:24 PM (bXbFr)

135
120 JSG, "All You Zombies" is one Heinlein story I have never been able to follow. I have a feeling any movie made from it would confuse my "simple, childlike mind" even further.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:15 PM (wzUl9)

“All you zombies” and “up by his bootstraps” are two Time Travel stories Heinlein wrote. I enjoyed them both, but I think Heinlein is having quite a bit of fun, and the real point of both stories is to show that if you allow time travel, then you inevitably come face to face with unresolvable paradoxes. (Such as I’m my own grandpa!)

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 09, 2026 09:26 PM (25Mwa)

136 Yes i remember that one, with sinise and i forget who plsys flagg jamey sheridan
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026

***
For some reason I always pictured Edward Winter as Flagg. Probably because he played demented spy Col. Flagg on M*A*S*H, and that was on TV when I first read the book.

The miniseries was full of other great casting, like Miguel Ferrer and Adam Storke.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:26 PM (wzUl9)

137 Ray Walston was who I was thinking of.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026 09:26 PM (zZu0s)

138 I was always amused that from supposedly enlightened Hollywood one of the districts had two black characters. Their race is never mentioned I don't believe, so what is the point of doing this? Having a so called "black district." Seems racist to me for a film that never mentions race.

I also didn't quite understand why the other districts even went along with it. The central district really never seems that strong. There's a riot when one of the kids in one of the districts dies.

The movie presents itself as Rome at the height of its powers but it's more like 476 AD. Just didn't add up.

I never read the books or watched another in the series, though I did watch that Japanese movie everyone said Hunger Games ripped off.

Posted by: Lex at May 09, 2026 09:27 PM (y4H1r)

139 “All you zombies” and “up by his bootstraps” are two Time Travel stories Heinlein wrote. I enjoyed them both, but I think Heinlein is having quite a bit of fun, and the real point of both stories is to show that if you allow time travel, then you inevitably come face to face with unresolvable paradoxes. (Such as I’m my own grandpa!)
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 09, 2026

***
I understood "By His Bootstraps," a much earlier work, but "Zombies" with its time travel and gender switching (I think?) has always defeated me. The kind of SF that, when I ran across it in my pre-Heinlein "Future History" days, always made me go, "Whaaaa?"

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:28 PM (wzUl9)

140 There was a tradition at the local Trek/SF conventions, Vul-Cons, they were called. Sunday evening, the last film shown in the movie room was always Forbidden Planet.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:11 PM (wzUl9)

I always got the feeling that The Black Hole was supposed to be the next Forbidden Planet

Posted by: Kindltot at May 09, 2026 09:30 PM (rbvCR)

141 Ray Walston was who I was thinking of.
Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at May 09, 2026

***
He was cast as the gentleman with the Irish setter dog who was also immune to the superflu. We were told that 99.4% of humans died, that monkeys caught it and died, and apparently most dogs did too, but cats seemed to be immune.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:30 PM (wzUl9)

142 Well he tipped prettu close to our own crazy years

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 09, 2026 09:31 PM (bXbFr)

143 Nice example of a short story successfully adapted to a 2-hour movie? John Huston's film of Kipling's The Man Who Would Be King. Maybe there's something wrong with that movie, but I've never cared to pick at it to find out.
Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 09, 2026 09:21 PM (q3u5l)

One of my favorites ! Found out recently that for the great fall off the bridge at the end, Connery insisted on doing his own stunt! He landed in a huge pile of foam rubber, but it was still a hundred foot fall.

Star that no one realizes is in that movie - Christopher Plummer plays the reporter, Rudyard Kipling.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 09, 2026 09:31 PM (25Mwa)

144 Nolan is chasing Oscar gold.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at May 09, 2026 09:32 PM (kpS4V)

145 If you can, watch The Good Man, I think you won't be disappointed.
Have a good night everyone

Posted by: Skip at May 09, 2026 09:33 PM (Ia/+0)

146 I'm firmly in the worldbuilding = important camp.

You don't have to USE all the world building, but you need to know the earth on which your characters stand.

When an author doesn't 'know' their world, I can tell.

Now...writing sub-par books is actually a path to success. See also Stephanie Meyer.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:33 PM (xcxpd)

147 Heinlein gave us selected headlines from the Crazy Years, the latter part of the 20th century, in at least the 1958 novel version of Methuselah's Children. I don't know if those items appeared in the original magazine version ca. 1941. If they did, Heinlein was being even more prophetic than usual.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:33 PM (wzUl9)

148 I understood "By His Bootstraps," a much earlier work, but "Zombies" with its time travel and gender switching (I think?) has always defeated me. The kind of SF that, when I ran across it in my pre-Heinlein "Future History" days, always made me go, "Whaaaa?"
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:28 PM (wzUl9)

The narrative of All You Zombies had to seal itself off in a loop to be consistent to itself, and having one life be both father and mother of the child made the storytelling much simpler.
The problem with "go back in time to change the present" is that if you go back in time to change the present, it destroys the reason to go back in time in the first place and you wind up with two loops for two realities, which shouldn't happen unless you are willing to go into paratime or alternate realities. Having the protagonist be a mobius strip of a character solves that problem.

Posted by: Kindltot at May 09, 2026 09:35 PM (rbvCR)

149 The narrative of All You Zombies had to seal itself off in a loop to be consistent to itself, and having one life be both father and mother of the child made the storytelling much simpler.
The problem with "go back in time to change the present" is that if you go back in time to change the present, it destroys the reason to go back in time in the first place and you wind up with two loops for two realities, which shouldn't happen unless you are willing to go into paratime or alternate realities. Having the protagonist be a mobius strip of a character solves that problem.
Posted by: Kindltot at May 09, 2026

***
You are probably right. (I say this partly because I'm still confused by the story, and it's a simple reply!)

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:37 PM (wzUl9)

150
Some of the best world building I ever saw was in Minority Report (the futuristic one with Tom Cruise). Unpopulated factories, cars that announce they're re-routing you to the police station, scanners that read your iris print and show you holographic ads (with audio!) based on "your preferences," and penetrative brain study.

Posted by: Blonde Morticia at May 09, 2026 09:38 PM (XJ22o)

151 Movie Smackdown: Roger Corman's Attack of the Crab Monsters vs. Ridley Scott's Prometheus. Which is the greater work of cinema art?

The use of authentic sounding statistics get an automatic 10% bonus as do queso stains on your shirt.

Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions at May 09, 2026 09:40 PM (glnUu)

152 I've watched some TV and movies in which the world was more interesting than the show that was in it. There was a TV show based on some comic: Into The Badlands. About halfway through the series I knew it was going to get cancelled. Too odd for mainstream TV. It was ok, but a bit convoluted. I did love the world created in it. A medevial, gothic dystopia, with some odd futurism mixed in. It was interesting. The red head gal and whoever that blue eyed brunette gal was were nice eye candy.

Posted by: Puddleglum at work at May 09, 2026 09:40 PM (NkASH)

153 There was a well-cast miniseries of The Stand in '94, with Molly Ringwald, Gary Sinise, and Matt Frewer as the definitive Trashcan Man.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:06 PM (wzUl9)

ABC had a winning streak of King adaptations for awhile. The Stand among them. May 1994. 32 years ago tonight it was a Monday and they were showing the second installment.

Posted by: Cow Demon at May 09, 2026 09:40 PM (T6aVk)

154 148 I understood "By His Bootstraps," a much earlier work, but "Zombies" with its time travel and gender switching (I think?) has always defeated me. The kind of SF that, when I ran across it in my pre-Heinlein "Future History" days, always made me go, "Whaaaa?"
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:28 PM (wzUl9)

The narrative of All You Zombies had to seal itself off in a loop to be consistent to itself, and having one life be both father and mother of the child made the storytelling much simpler.
The problem with "go back in time to change the present" is that if you go back in time to change the present, it destroys the reason to go back in time in the first place and you wind up with two loops for two realities, which shouldn't happen unless you are willing to go into paratime or alternate realities. Having the protagonist be a mobius strip of a character solves that problem.
Posted by: Kindltot at May 09, 2026 09:35 PM (rbvCR)

Except it doesn't work logically either. You can't be biologically male AND female and be able to father and bear a child. It's dumb and it has a dumb butt.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:41 PM (xcxpd)

155 My contribution is about one of the pics: fucking stop with the fucking face diapers! I know, I know; this was a pic from some years ago, but...jeezly crow!!

Immona go watch Rifftrax now.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, pronounced Muh-Hone at May 09, 2026 09:41 PM (0aYVJ)

156 Some of the best world building I ever saw was in Minority Report (the futuristic one with Tom Cruise). Unpopulated factories, cars that announce they're re-routing you to the police station, scanners that read your iris print and show you holographic ads (with audio!) based on "your preferences," and penetrative brain study.
Posted by: Blonde Morticia at May 09, 2026

***
I wish I liked Philip K. Dick's written work better. The films that have been "inspired" by his writing, like this one and Blade Runner, have generally been quite good.

There is a 1960s short story by David McDaniel, written and published around the time he was writing the U.N.C.L.E. novels, that pretty much predicted the cell phone as we know it now -- not only its portability, but other features.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:41 PM (wzUl9)

157 The Stand (1994)
Complete Mini Series
https://youtu.be/Gqfp0i--2gU

Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions at May 09, 2026 09:42 PM (glnUu)

158 92 Commentary without comparisons to 60's films, The Most Dangerous Game book about hunting humans, and the Japanese series of Battle Royale is lacking. Also, if you like Battle Royale, you enjoy evil. It is evil filmed.
Posted by: weft cut-loop at May 09, 2026 08:51 PM (diia5)

It has Takashi Kitano and is therefore good.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:44 PM (xcxpd)

159 Except it doesn't work logically either. You can't be biologically male AND female and be able to father and bear a child. It's dumb and it has a dumb butt.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:41 PM (xcxpd)
----
Jack L. Chalker has a particularly weird form of this in his time travel novel Downtiming the Night Side.

The main character goes back in time as a male, finds a mate, and they have a child. Later, the same character goes back in time again, and becomes the FEMALE in that pairing, so he essentially has sex with himself to produce a child. Very strange.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 09, 2026 09:44 PM (gnNyN)

160 Except it doesn't work logically either. You can't be biologically male AND female and be able to father and bear a child. It's dumb and it has a dumb butt.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:41 PM (xcxpd)

time travel is also impossible, logically so. So he cuts corners and makes a story that is slightly better than the ones about the magical iron horse devised by the Persian artificer which flies due to a magical pendulum counterweight empowered by a trapped Djinn.
The story has to be internally cohesive in technology and the explanation to not be jarring.

Posted by: Kindltot at May 09, 2026 09:45 PM (rbvCR)

161 Except it doesn't work logically either. You can't be biologically male AND female and be able to father and bear a child. It's dumb and it has a dumb butt.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:41 PM (xcxpd)

Heinlein is a bit notorious for displaying some sexual weirdness at times, and it obviously makes an appearance here.

I’m surprised that the pro-trans types didn’t jump to make this when they had the chance; but none of them are very literate.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 09, 2026 09:45 PM (25Mwa)

162 All you Zombies was written under the name Anson McDonald because Heinlein had a bigger story in the same edition.
Methusala's children came out the prior three editions and they are not available that I can find. Probably because RAH kept the copyrights.

Posted by: Kindltot at May 09, 2026 09:46 PM (rbvCR)

163 Well, in a moment.

I love world building in fantasy. Robert Silverberg's Majipoor is wonderful. GRR Martin's world was richly made as well, at the cost that it became too big and distracting. Weiss and Hickman with the Dragonlace world was brilliant.

Middle-earth will always be the pinnacle.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, pronounced Muh-Hone at May 09, 2026 09:46 PM (0aYVJ)

164 26 -- Wolf -- The Star Trek writers' guide specified that writers were not to describe an object; simply show it in action.

Posted by: Captain Josepha Sabin at May 09, 2026 09:48 PM (DK5Sh)

165 The Avatar movies do a bang up job at world building. After that they are pretty crappy sci-fi versions of Dances with Wolves which is a pretty crappy version of Richard Harris being suspended by eagle talons embedded in his chest in a Man Called Horse.

Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions at May 09, 2026 09:48 PM (glnUu)

166 Jack L. Chalker has a particularly weird form of this in his time travel novel Downtiming the Night Side.

The main character goes back in time as a male, finds a mate, and they have a child. Later, the same character goes back in time again, and becomes the FEMALE in that pairing, so he essentially has sex with himself to produce a child. Very strange.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 09, 2026

***
If you presume technology that can *actually* remove and install new working parts on and in a human body, and suppress any bodily reactions without harm, then switching sex would not be impossible. John Varley's Steel Beach and The Golden Globe both, I think, have a male lead character who decides to "go female" for a while, just to experience what a woman does. In the future world, it's an established service and industry. Nobody "believes he was born the wrong sex," it's merely a game, merely temporary, and the hero goes back to male later in the story without difficulty.

In one of my own tales, set in the 29th century, it's a fun tradition to do a GenSwitch -- like a Sweet Sixteen party!

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:51 PM (wzUl9)

167 Avatar got its world from a Yes album cover.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 09, 2026 09:52 PM (25Mwa)

168 26 -- Wolf -- The Star Trek writers' guide specified that writers were not to describe an object; simply show it in action.
Posted by: Captain Josepha Sabin at May 09, 2026

***
Exactly. They bent that rule sometimes, but generally they did not stand around talking about how a phaser worked, any more than Joe Friday talked about how a .38 revolver functioned.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:52 PM (wzUl9)

169 163 Well, in a moment.

I love world building in fantasy. Robert Silverberg's Majipoor is wonderful. GRR Martin's world was richly made as well, at the cost that it became too big and distracting. Weiss and Hickman with the Dragonlace world was brilliant.

Middle-earth will always be the pinnacle.
Posted by: Pug Mahon, pronounced Muh-Hone at May 09, 2026 09:46 PM (0aYVJ)

Pug be preachin'!

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:54 PM (xcxpd)

170 time travel is also impossible, logically so. So he cuts corners and makes a story that is slightly better than the ones about the magical iron horse devised by the Persian artificer which flies due to a magical pendulum counterweight empowered by a trapped Djinn.
The story has to be internally cohesive in technology and the explanation to not be jarring.
Posted by: Kindltot at May 09, 2026 09:45 PM (rbvCR)

I think Heinlein was trying to be jarring. I'm still not convinced the story works, logically or emotionally. I mean, why would you RAPE yourself?

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:56 PM (xcxpd)

171 Weis and Hickman with the Dragonlace world was brilliant.

Middle-earth will always be the pinnacle.
Posted by: Pug Mahon, pronounced Muh-Hone at May 09, 2026 09:46 PM (0aYVJ)
----
Weis and Hickman did a lot of worldbuilding in their various series, much of it far better than Dragonlance.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 09, 2026 09:56 PM (gnNyN)

172 I think Heinlein was trying to be jarring. I'm still not convinced the story works, logically or emotionally. I mean, why would you RAPE yourself?
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo

With lube?

Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions at May 09, 2026 09:57 PM (glnUu)

173 Jack L. Chalker has a particularly weird form of this in his time travel novel Downtiming the Night Side.

The main character goes back in time as a male, finds a mate, and they have a child. Later, the same character goes back in time again, and becomes the FEMALE in that pairing, so he essentially has sex with himself to produce a child. Very strange.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 09, 2026 09:44 PM (gnNyN)

Another guy who puts his sex fetishes into his novels...which is too bad because Chalker is a pretty good writer, feishes aside.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:57 PM (xcxpd)

174 172 I think Heinlein was trying to be jarring. I'm still not convinced the story works, logically or emotionally. I mean, why would you RAPE yourself?
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo

With lube?
Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions at May 09, 2026 09:57 PM (glnUu)

You know, I don't think that was specified.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at May 09, 2026 09:59 PM (xcxpd)

175 Another guy who puts his sex fetishes into his novels...which is too bad because Chalker is a pretty good writer, feishes aside.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo

That is what I took away from Ridley Scott's Napoleon movie.

Posted by: Alteria Pilgram - My President has convictions at May 09, 2026 09:59 PM (glnUu)

176 I think RAH published "By His Bootstraps," a 1940s story, as "Anson MacDonald," and "Zombies" in the '50s under his own name. But I'm not sure.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 09:59 PM (wzUl9)

177 Time for an ONT!

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius, Dreaming of Elsewhere at May 09, 2026 10:01 PM (wzUl9)

178 Time travel is fraught with problems.

What if Hitler became a Jew hater because so many Jewish soldiers time traveled to kill him in the 1930s?

Of all the sci-fi tools out there, time travel is my least favorite.

Although, the Omega 13 in Galaxy Quest was pretty friggin' awesome.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, pronounced Muh-Hone at May 09, 2026 10:01 PM (0aYVJ)

179 67 To me, King can not properly finish a story. The beginning catches your attention, then it fizzles out.
Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at May 09, 2026 08:35 PM (nwbXw)

I hated the ending of about 90% of Michael Crichton's novels. The Andromeda Strain was particularly egregious (potentially apocalypse level space disease mutated itself into something harmless, making all preceding action pointless.)

Posted by: tankdemon at May 09, 2026 10:03 PM (lbImv)

180 Weis and Hickman did a lot of worldbuilding in their various series, much of it far better than Dragonlance.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 09, 2026 09:56 PM (gnNyN)

Agree. I used to have their other series' but they got lost in the shuffle that is life.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, pronounced Muh-Hone at May 09, 2026 10:03 PM (0aYVJ)

181 Couple of nice PKD adaptations that don't get that much press. Impostor, with Gary Sinise and Vincent D'onofrio, and Screamers, with Peter Weller. They take some liberties with Dick's stories, but on the whole not too shabby.

Thanks for the thread, and have a good one, gang.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 09, 2026 10:04 PM (q3u5l)

182
This is how Suzanne Collins wrote The Hunger Games. I really don't think the world she created is any good at all. It's outright bad. And yet, I mostly don't think it matters.

Dull and pointless is my own summary for this dreck. Watched the first three films once and that was more than enough.

Posted by: Krebs 'v' Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars (TM) Imprison! Imprison! Imprison! at May 09, 2026 10:06 PM (xG4kz)

183 I have never seen the Hunger Games.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, he said, snootily at May 09, 2026 10:07 PM (0aYVJ)

184 Disco & Dino ONT is up!

Posted by: SciVo at May 09, 2026 10:08 PM (Sy6m/)

185
Ray Walston was who I was thinking of.
Posted by: Aetius451AD /i]

Martian from the South Pacific

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at May 09, 2026 10:08 PM (Cqx++)

186 Forbidden Planet?

Good film, and the 50s scifi aesthetic is great, but it takes a while to not expect Leslie Nielsen to say something ludricrous at any moment

Posted by: Azjaeger at May 09, 2026 11:04 PM (3/XaG)

187 I read Suzanne Collins's Hunger Games before the movie came out. To me it seemed written for a teenager audience and their pre-adult perspective. After all, the original Star Wars movie was pretty much the same perspective.
I found both movies to remind me of my own teenage feelings such that I could relate to the characters and embrace their journeys.
To complain that Hunger Games, and Star Wars to inadequately define a world/galaxy in which to inject the story is "...not what you are looking for.". Nor was it meant to be.
In other words, criticism for not world building is unwarranted. This critique totally misread the author's intent. Teenagers inherently do not have a full understanding of the history of the world in which they live.

Posted by: John at May 09, 2026 11:05 PM (0DsdP)

188 A Boy and His Dog was weird but fun movie.

Posted by: Harry Vandenburg at May 09, 2026 08:33 PM (52qkP)
******************************

The film adaptation improved on the original Harlan Ellison story in certain respects but made the inexplicable decision to change the final lines.

Posted by: My Ridiculously Circuitous Plan at May 09, 2026 11:07 PM (/j1eF)

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