An Originalist Take on Movies and Memoirs [Lex]

Constitutional purists, in the main, adhere to the judicial philosophy of ‘originalism.’ That is, they do not believe the Constitution and its Amendments are evolving or subject to change in meaning based on the mood of the times. They try to understand the contemporaneous intent of the words by those who wrote them.

In the field of criticism, a close cousin to originalism is textualism or new criticism. The proponents of new criticism, when looking at literature or poetry or film, tend not to want to be distracted by anything but words on the page or images and dialogue on the screen. So it matters little to the textualist if a movie might seem racist by today’s standards or if it is a faithful adaptation of the source material. The new critic eschews these considerations to concentrate only on what he can see on the screen and judges the film by what it is trying to accomplish.

I kept coming back to these models of interpretation when reading Barry Diller’s recently published memoir Who Knew.

Even though I have devoted a large part of my life to cinema, I have never much liked behind the scenes stories or biographies of stars and studio moguls. I knew the name Barry Diller but almost nothing about what he accomplished. And that is because I see many memoirs and tell-alls as distractions. The play is the thing for me.

***
You can read the book to learn about Diller (in his own words) but, briefly, he was an aimless and troubled kid from Beverly Hills who grew up around Hollywood performers and executives. At 19, with no life direction, he called in a favor to get a job in the mail room at the William Morris talent agency. He worked his way up the ranks at William Morris but then leapt over to ABC where he impacted television in profound ways. Next it was on to Paramount where he resurrected that studio in the 1970s. After that, it was Fox, which he also revived. In his later years, he became a forerunner of internet commerce and content.

If you are a film and entertainment historian, you cannot ignore Diller’s legacy, though this begs the question: as one who leans towards textualism when watching movies, should I ignore him?

To give Diller the benefit of the doubt, I set aside the originalist lens to see what he had to say.

Right out of the gate, Diller disappoints. In the foreword, he declares he does not intend the book to be a teaching or business strategy guide (a la The Art of the Deal). The reason he states he wrote the memoir is, simply, because he thinks his life-story worth recounting. ‘Who Knew’ an angst-ridden kid with no education or prospects could succeed as he did.

The wayward-boy-makes-good story is interesting to a point, but what movies inspired him? What novels have moved him? Why did he want to become involved in storytelling--especially at such a grand scale?

Despite his disclaimers, I held out hope I could derive something inspirational from a man who helped shape studios and motion pictures for three decades.

And yet, after 320 pages, I was unsure what attracted him to fictional drama. He repeatedly affirms his love of problem solving, and in the film biz problems abound, but that tells me nothing about his process as a storyteller.

He also is not shy about sharing his distaste for MBA-style financial projections as an approach to crafting a successful film, and he is adamant in his disdain for the practice of packaging stars and material before ideas are hammered out.

I agree with those instincts, but Diller never digs deeper than that. Though he is responsible for some of the great movies in history, he has precious little to say about why they were special or what he understood their dramatic purpose to be.
Oftentimes, he will crow about a hit movie he produced but only to say it did well at the box office or won awards--not why it connected with audiences and what his hand was in setting the table for that connection to be made.

There are nuggets of wisdom in the book, but it is far too little, and as I read on, more and more, I was not only deprived of edification, but I also distrusted Diller.

***
I do not read many memoirs (movie ones or otherwise) because they are, ipso facto, self-serving. Diller confirms this instinct by painting himself in the best possible light. He feigns humility frequently, but like the screenwriting seminars teach us: to write a great villain you must make the bad guy believe he is the hero of the story. I am not saying Diller is a villain, but having dedicated his life to one of the most cutthroat businesses, too often he styles himself as merely an amiable –though driven — fixer.

These moments of doubt I had for his authenticity occurred not just with his professional life but also in the many personal things he reveals. He spends much of the first third of the book discussing his homosexuality, how he had to hide it, be ashamed of it, how it caused him panic and self-loathing. One sympathizes with him, but then, in his thirties he meets the fashion mogul and bon vivant Diane von Furstenburg, and it is a love affair for the ages.

He is smitten with her but clueless about how to be a heterosexual romantic. On her 29th birthday he gets her 29 diamonds; yet, he presents them to her in a Band-Aid box. It is supposed to be an adorable tidbit about his inartful amorousness, but any sympathy I had for him in the early going – as a closeted and confused youth — falls by the wayside as he never seems to mention this again, instead opting for tales of opulent jet setting with Furstenburg.

These personal notes about Diller are probably not germane to my pursuit of a better understanding of movies, but they did confirm my belief that too often Hollywood memoirs and histories are more of the TMZ, gossip-style flavor and thus not very useful to the serious cinephile.

And as for Diller himself, in the end, I concluded he was not really dedicated to telling great stories. TV and movies just happened to be the milieu into which he stumbled. He clearly had a knack for getting things done, and, though he tries to disguise it, there was great appeal in the flamboyant lifestyle his success afforded him.

***
For anyone who wants to be involved with or write about movies, basic cinema history is necessary to learn.

Of course it’s fun to know Kurt Russell was in the running to play Han Solo or to point out the cameos Hitchcock made in his movies, but, in the dark of the theater what good do these asides do for my relationship with and reaction to any given film?

Diller’s memoir and others like might fill in the blanks historically speaking, but they have no pedagogical or etiological value.

It will be a long time before I pick up another book like Who Knew. I would rather watch movies and absorb what I can in the moment.

I recognize it would be difficult for film reviewers and historians to write anything if they employed new criticism or textualism in its strictest sense.
But Constitutional originalism has taught us some of the most important lessons in American and world history. Applying some of its spirit to the study of film might not be that bad of an idea.

Posted by: Open Blogger at 07:30 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Of course it's fun to know Kurt Russell was in the running to play Han Solo

I did not know that.

I think he would have done well.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at November 29, 2025 07:36 PM (ULPxl)

2
Speaking of Kurt Russell...

It must have been some sort of agreement/deal or something, but Kurt did a real TV commercial for the owner of the used car lot, Darner Chrysler, the movie used for its main location.

https://is.gd/nrWEed

Posted by: Soothsayer at November 29, 2025 07:37 PM (1sPEU)

3 Good evening everyone

Posted by: Skip at November 29, 2025 07:39 PM (Ia/+0)

4 I think of him as TV not movies.

Posted by: San Franpsycho at November 29, 2025 07:41 PM (9ipOP)

5 Relation to Phyllis Diller?

Posted by: Eromero at November 29, 2025 07:41 PM (LHPAg)

6 Now I'm curious if there was a co-writer (uncredited) for this autobiography, and if there are others who might have done a better job of getting something interesting out of this Diller guy.

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at November 29, 2025 07:41 PM (ULPxl)

7 David Spade’s autobiography, Almost Interesting is a short and funny read. It’s the only ‘Hollywood’ book I’ve read.

Posted by: the way I see it at November 29, 2025 07:44 PM (KDPiq)

8 Hey everybody. Hey movie thread.

Re the message about originalism: I'm probably not understanding it correctly, but I will say that there are some films that have such an old, outdated POV, they're just not enjoyable today.

There's no way I could enjoy the film The Birth Of A Nation, from 1916, for instance. It is just way too steeped in the old, frankly racist attitudes of people like D.W. Griffith. I'm imagine most others here feel the same way.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 07:44 PM (uZFV0)

9 Except kurt as a teen actor would have been more like luke

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 07:45 PM (bXbFr)

10 Thats why plissken was a surprise from his earlier roles

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 07:45 PM (bXbFr)

11 "I knew the name Barry Diller but almost nothing about what he accomplished."

That's how I felt after reading the post. Went to IMDb but it was little help.

"impacted television in profound ways"
"responsible for some of the great movies in history"

I'll take your word for it. I'm not a movie geek. I'm even content watching lowbrow freebie films via YouToob. Lately watched… well, never mind. Don't want to sully the classy movies post with my indulgences.
😁

Posted by: mindful webworker - rotoscoping reality at November 29, 2025 07:47 PM (LaTF/)

12 It's hard to find an autobiography by anyone that IMHO is truly insightful. It takes another person's uncompromising perspective on your life, to tell the whole truth.

One bio I want to read is H.W. Brands' volume on the life of Andrew Jackson. I can't help but wonder: given how ornery and quick-tempered he was, was Mr. Jackson insightful at all about himself? Would he have admitted he could be a nasty old cuss a lot of the time?

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 07:47 PM (uZFV0)

13 Vale Tom Stoppard, who has died aged 88.

Did scripts for Empire of the Sun, Last Crusade and Brazil, all of which I liked.

Posted by: Bruce of Newcastle at November 29, 2025 07:47 PM (XBBgc)

14 Except kurt as a teen actor would have been more like luke
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 07:45 PM (bXbFr)

Kurt was mid-20s in 1977. He would have worked as Han.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Bonafide at November 29, 2025 07:47 PM (0aYVJ)

15 Maybe the only autobiography that is real is from someone who has died

Posted by: Skip at November 29, 2025 07:48 PM (Ia/+0)

16 Bruce: Mick Jagger actually wrote online today, in memoriam of Tom Stoppard.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 07:48 PM (uZFV0)

17 >>>On her 29th birthday he gets her 29 diamonds; yet, he presents them to her in a Band-Aid box.

IIRC, Dr. Szell in Marathon Man, had at least some of his diamonds in a Band-Aid tin.

I don't know how the timeline of the release of the movie (or the novel) lines up with Diller's gift or if he was in some way inspired by it. Since he was in the entertainment business, who knows.

Posted by: Anon Y. Mous at November 29, 2025 07:48 PM (syz1S)

18 >>> 9 Except kurt as a teen actor would have been more like luke
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 07:45 PM (bXbFr)

Both Russell and Hamill were born in 1951. Harrison Ford was born in 1942. (I had to look them up)

Posted by: Helena Handbasket at November 29, 2025 07:48 PM (ULPxl)

19 well, never mind. Don't want to sully the classy movies post with my indulgences
-----

Go ahead. I'm watching "Twisted Metal". Lowbrow post-apocalyptic road warrior comedy.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at November 29, 2025 07:49 PM (kpS4V)

20 My 2nd cousin works for the William Morris Agency. We call her "Hollywood." She has represented the likes of Jimmy Kimmel and Kelly Clarkson (who she just loves despite her politics) among many others. My cuz is a former Lib turned MAGA Republican who eventually had to leave Hollywood due to her rightie politics, tired of living in mortal fear of being "found out" and cancelled. She moved to outside of Nashville and now represents country artists, and is so much happier. Her parents are former long-time San Fran hippies (my Aunt, her mother, worked for The Jefferson Airplane and later Hot Tuna and is a close personal friend of Jorma Kaukonen) who turned MAGA circa 2016 and who also moved to Tennessee, and are born-again Christians.

My cuz was born deaf but regained most of her hearing thanks to the same cochlear implant that Rush Limbaugh had. We're so proud of her accomplishments and personally I'm so proud of how she's managed to get out of Cali and still do her job, which she loves, while getting to be her true self.

Posted by: Delurker at November 29, 2025 07:50 PM (NhiOW)

21 "It's hard to find an autobiography by anyone that IMHO is truly insightful. It takes another person's uncompromising perspective on your life, to tell the whole truth."

Grant wrote his with coaching from Samuel Clemens. I think most of it though was all Grant's writings.

Posted by: fd at November 29, 2025 07:50 PM (vFG9F)

22 Originalism, The Chosen.

Posted by: Ben Had at November 29, 2025 07:52 PM (sDNVV)

23 Delurker:
Jorma Kaukonen seems like a really good guy.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 07:52 PM (uZFV0)

24 I thought maybe Stoppard also wrote on of my favorite plays on tv, "The Norman Conquests", but that was Alan Ayckbourn. Very funny.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at November 29, 2025 07:52 PM (kpS4V)

25 Grant wrote his with coaching from Samuel Clemens. I think most of it though was all Grant's writings.
Posted by: fd at November 29, 2025
---

I'm reading the Chernow biography, and Twain said he did not, that Grant had a wonderfully lean and direct style that needed little editing.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at November 29, 2025 07:55 PM (kpS4V)

26 Im speaking of the type harrison had shown somr of the same attitude in graffitti

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 07:55 PM (bXbFr)

27 But I did actually go to a genuine popcorn-fumed theater last week.

Watched Sarah's Oil, about old Oklahoma that actually was filmed in Oklahoma and looks like it. No snow-capped mountains in the background. Pretty muich on-the-nose depictions of race relations, including AmerIndian tribes. And, yes, many bigoted, creepy, and criminal White guys, but lots of them were. Dramatized "true story," certainly, but moving.

IMDb: "The remarkable true story of eleven year old Sarah Rector, an African American girl born in Oklahoma Indian Territory in the early 1900s, who believes there is oil beneath the barren land she's allotted…"

Posted by: mindful webworker - white and black hats at November 29, 2025 07:57 PM (LaTF/)

28 Christmas with Prometheus.

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at November 29, 2025 07:57 PM (Kt19C)

29 23 Delurker:
Jorma Kaukonen seems like a really good guy.

That's what my aunt tells me. She really loves him him. She has some great living-room jams assembled onto tape that I have copies of. Must have been awesome to have been sitting there next to hm as they were recorded. She didn't like Grace Slick so much though LOL. Major alcohol issues.

Posted by: Delurker at November 29, 2025 07:58 PM (NhiOW)

30 Clemens acted as much more than an editor for Grant and that's kind of what I meant by coaching. If not for him Grant would have been really screwed by his publisher.

Posted by: fd at November 29, 2025 07:58 PM (vFG9F)

31 Russell in Soldier.

Posted by: Eromero at November 29, 2025 07:59 PM (LHPAg)

32 It was around the samr time of release as marathon man

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 07:59 PM (bXbFr)

33 My bedtime
Have a goof night everyone

Posted by: Skip at November 29, 2025 08:02 PM (Ia/+0)

34 I've got Twain's and Grant's biographies right here in front of me. It's been a long time since I read Twain's but it's pretty dark in places and I don't know that I need to read it again. The subject may be a good book thread topic.

Posted by: fd at November 29, 2025 08:02 PM (vFG9F)

35 Speaking of movies, Devil Doll is on Svengoolie. It's the one with the creepy dummy.

Posted by: fd at November 29, 2025 08:04 PM (vFG9F)

36 Russells role in soldier is as earnest as his pre plissken roles in a different context

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 08:06 PM (bXbFr)

37 I miss Saturday Night at the Movies.

Posted by: Ben Had at November 29, 2025 08:07 PM (sDNVV)

38 Ben Had @ 37 --

You're not the only one.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 08:08 PM (q3u5l)

39 Wish there was some legal way for all of us to watch a film together, here on the blog.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 08:09 PM (uZFV0)

40 I was going to go down to the DIA theater to see CatVideoFest 2025 tomorrow, but snowmageddon will probably put a stop to that.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at November 29, 2025 08:09 PM (kpS4V)

41 Have to check out Devil Doll. I know the name from the Italian-Slovenian weirdo-cult-rock band formed in 1987 by the mysterious "Mr. Doctor" and named after the movie.

Posted by: Delurker at November 29, 2025 08:10 PM (NhiOW)

42 I mix that one up with the trilogy of terror

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 08:14 PM (bXbFr)

43 Which really seems silly on repeated viewings

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 08:15 PM (bXbFr)

44 This sounds about as exciting as trying to read War and Peace with SCUDs inbound and you are at MOPP4.

Posted by: Anna Puma at November 29, 2025 08:15 PM (nhv81)

45 Speaking of movies, Devil Doll is on Svengoolie. It's the one with the creepy dummy.

They made a movie about Joey Bidet?

Posted by: Anna Puma at November 29, 2025 08:16 PM (nhv81)

46 qdpsteve --

Only way I can think of to do something like that would be to pick something that's out there for free viewing on a site like TubiTV and let the Hordelings start watching.

Lets out quite a few classics, but there's a decent amount of good stuff to be found there. And of course, if we're up for Terrifier 2, Tubi has us covered.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 08:16 PM (q3u5l)

47 Ovation had a classic bond series which they use to air on sundays on abc before cable was big

The man with the golden one was the firsr one i remember

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 08:17 PM (bXbFr)

48 First world problem. Arrrgh! Spectrum cable remote/setup is soooo complicated to me! No movies, whatever tonight, tech to arrive Monday to coach me. Grrrr!

Posted by: Commissar of plenty and festive little hats at November 29, 2025 08:17 PM (Kt19C)

49 Russell would have been a great Han.

Kelsey Grammer was up for the role.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory, red heifer owner at November 29, 2025 08:17 PM (LjSYW)

50 Gun (with christopher lee) and weirdly herve viliechaise

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 08:18 PM (bXbFr)

51 I found on YouTube a copy of 55 Days at Peiking. All the titles are cut and in a few spots the sound drops out.

"It doesn't take a military genius to crawl through the sewers."

Posted by: Anna Puma at November 29, 2025 08:18 PM (nhv81)

52 They aired thosr films this week

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 08:19 PM (bXbFr)

53 That was probably the first role i saw him in

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 08:19 PM (bXbFr)

54 Spectrum is like that rickety rope bridge in temple of doom

It will snap at any moment

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at November 29, 2025 08:20 PM (bXbFr)

55 Just Some Guy, thanks for the tip. :-)

Do they have Scarlet Street? Great 1949 noir flick directed by Fritz Lang.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 08:22 PM (uZFV0)

56 qdpsteve re Scarlet Street

Yes, they do. There'll be a few interruptions for ads during the flick, but it's there.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 08:25 PM (q3u5l)

57 Just Some Guy, also thanks.
Hmmm, let me speak to Ace. Maybe I/we can arrange a viewing party, and then we could all use the comment section here to make snarky asides on the flick. :-)

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 08:26 PM (uZFV0)

58 " I miss Saturday Night at the Movies"

You're right. I had forgotten what a delightful event everyone made of it.

Posted by: Fen at November 29, 2025 08:26 PM (ciYHQ)

59 Again, Scarlet Street is a fave of mine.

In fairness, I would describe it as kind of a proto-Incel movie. The message is "dames ain't woith it!!"

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 08:28 PM (uZFV0)

60 There is a Hollywood tell-all book that I would like to wholeheartedly recommend, and it's written by one of Barry Diller's contemporaries - Michael Ovitz.

'Who is Michael Ovitz?' is everything that the Diller book is not - and I have the Diller book as well. He discusses his love of movies, and the how-to of building CAA from the ground up. He's not shy about his failings (although he doesn't discuss in great detail his divorce from his first wife), and his stories are great. He doesn't much care about ticking off living people who wronged him, and he's got a great comeback story to boot. Andreessen Horowitz, the Silicon Valley VC firm, organized its management style around the principles outlined in his book.

Again, I'd recommend Ovitz' book in a second. Loved it.

Posted by: Darrell Harris at November 29, 2025 08:35 PM (0CU3H)

61 Okay, for example:

YooToob sidebar suggestion roped me in.

NEW SCI-FI SERIES - The Space Apart - Episode One

A couple of young brothers encounter an extraterrestrial. Rural setting. Alcoholic father, deceased mother, fat sheriff. Kids' acting wasn't great, kinda stiff, but I was intrigued about where it was going.

Turns out only Episode One (of Five) is done, and they link to a Kickstarter hoping to finance the rest of it. 🫤

We're torn between sending them a couple of bucks for something that may never happen, and feeling ripped off because of the tease.

https://youtu.be/kncQPjWLv68

Posted by: mindful webworker - they call it Bob but he looks like Paul at November 29, 2025 08:35 PM (LaTF/)

62 Re Saturday Night at the Movies --

And they ran a lot of good movies. Among the flicks I remember seeing on SNatM are Titanic, Day the Earth Stood Still, Five Fingers, Battleground, No Highway in the Sky, and Night and the City.

Do you find a lineup of movies like that anywhere except TCM or AMC these days (unless you're looking for certain titles on the streaming services)?

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 08:36 PM (q3u5l)

63 Speaking of movies, Devil Doll is on Svengoolie. It's the one with the creepy dummy.

They made a movie about Joey Bidet?
Posted by: Anna Puma at November 29, 2025 08:16 PM (nhv81)

The only way to watch such a cheesy flick is via MS3k. IMHO.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Bonafide at November 29, 2025 08:37 PM (0aYVJ)

64 13 Vale Tom Stoppard, who has died aged 88.

Did scripts for Empire of the Sun, Last Crusade and Brazil, all of which I liked.
Posted by: Bruce of Newcastle at November 29, 2025 07:47 PM (XBBgc)

'Rosencrantz And Guildenstern Are Dead' was my introduction to Stoppard in HS. Loved him, and it. Very interesting take on Shakespeare, from the point of view of two minor characters in Hamlet. It turns out that if he wasn't conservative when he started, he became one at the end. Very quiet about it - unlike David Mamet (who's great as well, of course).

Posted by: Darrell Harris at November 29, 2025 08:40 PM (0CU3H)

65 Just Some Guy, also thanks.
Hmmm, let me speak to Ace. Maybe I/we can arrange a viewing party, and then we could all use the comment section here to make snarky asides on the flick. :-)
Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 08:26 PM (uZFV0)

Don't Bogart the popcorn!

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at November 29, 2025 08:42 PM (npFr7)

66 Man, this movie thread is really plodding along. It's clear that Lex put a lot of time and effort into it; he deserves better.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at November 29, 2025 08:47 PM (npFr7)

67 AOP, agreed but what to do?

Posted by: Ben Had at November 29, 2025 08:48 PM (sDNVV)

68
It being a holiday weekend has something to do with the low comment number.

Hopefully this can be reposted next weekend. He did a great job.

Posted by: fourseasons at November 29, 2025 08:50 PM (3ek7K)

69 Hi all,
Sorry. I didn't know this was going up tonight. I just checked in to see what the post was going to be and lo and behold it was yours truly's. Let me get caught up on the comments and respond.
Thanks,
Lex

Posted by: Lex at November 29, 2025 08:50 PM (y4H1r)

70 Katherine Hepburn please.

She was legend in The Lion In Winter

"I'd hang you from the nipples, but you'd shock the children,"

Posted by: Fen at November 29, 2025 08:52 PM (ciYHQ)

71 Gotta wonder how much of the Horde is still doing battle with turkey/assorted beverages coma or hanging out with friends and relatives in physical space rather than loitering here the way God intended. I'm guessing the book thread tomorrow might be a tad slow as well.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 08:52 PM (q3u5l)

72 AOP, agreed but what to do?
Posted by: Ben Had at November 29, 2025 08:48 PM (sDNVV)

Well, my knowledge of, and interest in movies borders on nil, these days. I really have nothing to say on the subject matter.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at November 29, 2025 08:53 PM (npFr7)

73 A really good recent role for Kurt is Bone Tomahawk. He looks just like he does in Hateful 8. But Bone Tomahawk is *shudders* different. A cracker jack western for three quarters of the film, then torture porn horror.

*Shudders again*

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at November 29, 2025 08:53 PM (cxFcK)

74 I wonder what it would have been like to be in her orbit

Posted by: Fen at November 29, 2025 08:53 PM (ciYHQ)

75 I have heard Bone Tomahawk is good, but also sounded a bit... Cannibal Holocaust.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at November 29, 2025 08:55 PM (zZu0s)

76 I wonder what it would have been like to be in her orbit
Posted by: Fen

I wonder if there's beer on the sun?

Posted by: Zap Rowsdower at November 29, 2025 08:55 PM (cxFcK)

77 I’m watching KISSTORY . It’s very interesting and I think very fair to Criss and Ace.

Posted by: the way I see it at November 29, 2025 08:56 PM (KDPiq)

78 Russell is terrific in Bone Tomahawk, but it's a rough one to watch, and there's a torture scene in it that you really don't want to see on a full stomach. Trust me on this.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 08:58 PM (q3u5l)

79 "I wonder if there's beer on the sun?"

No, not on this one

Posted by: Fen at November 29, 2025 09:00 PM (ciYHQ)

80 I'm sure the holiday weekend has people in other places. It was a helluva an effort getting four people for a pickleball game today!

I think you can see Kurt Russell's Han Solo screen test on YouTube somewhere.

As for the comment about Birth of a Nation and a tight textual reading of movies. Of course, everyone has their limits, and some old movies certainly don't hold up for many reasons (but should we not read Huckleberry Finn because it seems racist by today's standards?).

The main idea is to try to watch movies more with an eye not on the cute, side stories and behind the scenes anecdotes, but to focus more on the material itself. Try to write a film review without saying "it reminded me of this movie..."

And when I concluded the memoir, I thought here's a man who was at the pinnacle of the system for 30 years and he had nothing insightful to say about filmmaking or storytelling. Almost nothing that was superficial fluff.

Posted by: Lex at November 29, 2025 09:00 PM (y4H1r)

81 No, not on this one
Posted by: Fen

Fen, that was me. I just watched the old MST3k episode. I promise I meant no disrespect. It was just something stupid to type. I excel at that. I apologize unreservedly.

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at November 29, 2025 09:03 PM (cxFcK)

82 have heard Bone Tomahawk is good, but also sounded a bit... Cannibal Holocaust.
Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at November 29, 2025 08:55 PM (zZu0s)

I preferred The Missing with Tommy Lee Jones better.

In regard to Zahler films, I think Brawl in Cell Block 99 is his best.

Posted by: the way I see it at November 29, 2025 09:07 PM (KDPiq)

83 I know zip about Barry Diller outside of recognizing the name from assorted bits of movie biz news. IMDB says he greenlit his share of decent flicks.

Was he drawn to storytelling on film, or was he somebody who found a niche that he seemed to be good at and flogged it for all it was worth? He arranged things so that the people who were drawn to storytelling on film could do that as long as they turned out a product the studio could earn dollars with and make it possible to keep getting dollars with more product. Right? Hey, it's a living...

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 09:07 PM (q3u5l)

84 Perhaps in other interesting news, I'm starting to get a lot of screeners for end of the year best of film voting (my film critics group puts out a list of best ofs every December). A few I saw the past week or so...

DEAD MAN'S WIRE. Interesting kidnapping story that was in the public eye in 1977. Good movie. Hard to know how much was actually true, but solid all around.

REBUILDING. Solid indy about rebuilding after a devastating wild fire wipes out a town. Probably won't win awards but it had heart.

WEAPONS. Mystery/thriller. Incredible first half but an absolutely ridiculous second half. Could have been great but was below average in the end.

TRAIN DREAMS. Will be in my top 10. On Netflix. Joel Edgerton is fast becoming one of my favorite actors/filmmakers.

THE SECRET AGENT. Brazilian movie. Quirky and meandering but will probably get attention for a top foreign film.

IT WAS JUST AN ACCIDENT. Will also get strong consideration for best foreign film. Iranian dissident film.

Posted by: Lex at November 29, 2025 09:08 PM (y4H1r)

85 83...yes, even he admits he stumbled into TV/movies because he had nothing else to do. Once there, he saw he had a knack for the business, but I never got the sense he revered filmmaking or storytelling. Really, a businessman who could have blundered into another industry and maybe succeeded there for the same reasons.

Posted by: Lex at November 29, 2025 09:10 PM (y4H1r)

86 Not gonna watch Bone Tomahawk, too brutal for me.

“Grant wrote his with coaching from Samuel Clemens. I think most of it though was all Grant's writings.
Posted by: fd at November 29, 2025 07:50 PM (vFG9F)”

The most remarkable thing about Grant’s memoirs is that in era of overblown and excessive verbiage, Grant came out sounding like a proto-Hemingway, 60 years ahead of his time. Quite remarkable, I think that’s what makes them quite readable today.
It’s been often said that Grant’s Memoirs were the best work of that kind since Caesar’s Gallic Wars.

Posted by: Tom Servo at November 29, 2025 09:10 PM (3U2FH)

87 I preferred The Missing with Tommy Lee Jones better.”

I agree, that was excellent. A very good retelling of “The Searchers”.

Posted by: Tom Servo at November 29, 2025 09:13 PM (3U2FH)

88 Perhaps "passion" for the movies is counterproductive if you want to be successful in the business of making them.

Was Lee Iacocca passionate about cars? He gave us the Mustang, then the K car. He was successful as a businessman, and made some good cars, but did he love making them?

Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at November 29, 2025 09:14 PM (8QVSJ)

89 The Searchers did not show the viewer the atrocity. They left it to the viewer to fill in the blanks which I think is more effective.

Posted by: Anna Puma at November 29, 2025 09:15 PM (nhv81)

90 A very good retelling of “The Searchers”.
Posted by: Tom Servo

There's a great book called Empire of the Summer Moon about the Comanches. The story of little Cynthia is told throughout. She was the mother of Quannah Parker, the last war chief before the Comanches accepted defeat and moved to Oklahoma.

Side note: Quannah was quite well known and once rode by my great grandfather's farm and made a handsome offer to buy my grandmother. Great grandad declined the offer.

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at November 29, 2025 09:17 PM (cxFcK)

91 The Searchers did not show the viewer the atrocity. They left it to the viewer to fill in the blanks which I think is more effective.
Posted by: Anna Puma at November 29, 2025 09:15 PM (nhv81)

In the remake, the atrocity will be a tranny gets misgendered.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at November 29, 2025 09:18 PM (npFr7)

92 preferred The Missing with Tommy Lee Jones better.”

I agree, that was excellent. A very good retelling of “The Searchers”.
Posted by: Tom Servo at November 29, 2025 09:13 PM (3U2FH)

The bad Indian guy should have won an Oscar. I’m convinced they cast an actual evil serial killer.

Posted by: the way I see it at November 29, 2025 09:19 PM (KDPiq)

93 88...a good point. I don't know much about Iacocca but I would think he had to at least like cars and car-making. I never got the sense Diller even had much fondness for the artistic side of fictional movie making or even literature. They say the movie business is the only art with "business" as an indelible descriptor but at least for me I found it hard to take seriously a studio mogul who couldn't even name a favorite film or a novel that moved in. You spend your life in movies and you can't tell us anything that deeply affected you as a viewer or consumer of fiction???

Posted by: Lex at November 29, 2025 09:20 PM (y4H1r)

94 Ah, okay, another YooToob sidebar suggestion we watched with almost no idea what it was about.

Bolt From The Blue
An overlooked engineer is sent to Alaska to scope out an eccentric scientist's claim that capturing lightning can be a new source of renewable energy. Kinda silly and unscientific, but some fun bits; goofy main guy and cute gal, does not actually become a love story.

https://youtu.be/-Korw8QfOPo

Posted by: mindful webworker - don't bring your high standards to this one at November 29, 2025 09:24 PM (LaTF/)

95 Are there any fans here of the 1980s teen flick, The Last American Virgin?

I was reading about it recently, and was intrigued. I like that (spoiler alert) it does NOT have a happy ending.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:27 PM (uZFV0)

96 I think that content can help appreciate a film. Knowing Jimmy Stewart was a broken spirit from losing so many pilots over Europe. The scene at the bridge and bar, where he is lost and broken was not entirely acting. The knowledge makes it a profound moment of heartache.
Edward G. Robinson knowing he is dying in real life during his role in Soylent Green adds poignancy. Not necessary for enjoying it, but added to the connection to the movie.
Maybe it's more like reading the Federalist and anti-Federalists, but not having to know what James Madison liked for breakfast or if it was real liquor in the bar scene in It's a Wonderful Life.

Posted by: LGBTQ+POC, ANTI RACIST HERO at November 29, 2025 09:27 PM (6mk7C)

97 Bolt From The Blue
An overlooked engineer is sent to Alaska to scope out an eccentric scientist's claim that capturing lightning can be a new source of renewable energy. Kinda silly and unscientific, but some fun bits; goofy main guy and cute gal, does not actually become a love story.

https://youtu.be/-Korw8QfOPo
Posted by: mindful webworker - don't bring your high standards to this one at November 29, 2025 09:24 PM (LaTF/)

The failure there is the unstated premise that "renewable" energy is somehow needed.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at November 29, 2025 09:28 PM (npFr7)

98 "Travesties" was another great Tom Stoppard play.
A lot of fun.

"Jumpers" too from the same period.

"The Real Inspector Hound" I saw in London.

I don't know how well those plays will stand up over time or even now.

But when he wrote them they were very clever fun

Posted by: naturalfake at November 29, 2025 09:28 PM (iJfKG)

99 Regarding Birth of a Nation, I don't know if it is a movie to be enjoyed. It's more of a visual artifact that helps us understand the past. For that, it is worthwhile.

Posted by: LGBTQ+POC, ANTI RACIST HERO at November 29, 2025 09:30 PM (6mk7C)

100 I see that Apple TV has abruptly yanked a new French movie from its schedule, just before its premier. Seems there was an accusation about plagiarism, with the movie looking much like a 1976 American one, based on a 1973 American novel.

From wherever he is, Harlan Ellison smiles.

Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at November 29, 2025 09:30 PM (8QVSJ)

101 Maybe Diller spent his life in movies, but he came up from the mail room, right? Without reading his book, to me that says he spent his time in offices talking to people who may or may not themselves ever shot a frame of film or performed in front of a camera. Deciding what was likely to bring in some $$$ for the company, while the people drawn to the art of it went ahead and produced the product; if the people on the artistic end were lucky, the higher-ups didn't try to meddle too much in the actual day-to-day work of shooting the movies, or worse, fiddling around with the scripts. Gotta wonder some time how close to truth William Holden's lines in Sunset Boulevard about the butchering of stories really were. From some of Harlan Ellison's comments on story conferences, probably pretty close.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 09:31 PM (q3u5l)

102 I’ve been to Old Fort Parker near Groesbeck, Texas. It’s a recreation of the original of course, but very well done. This is the spot where Cynthia Parker was captured; her story is very sad. They should never have tried to capture her back.

Posted by: Tom Servo at November 29, 2025 09:32 PM (3U2FH)

103 Can't say I want to know about the life of Barry Diller, apart from confirming my worst suspicions about Hollywood homos, sounds like it's light on behind the scenes info: the only reason to read about him.

I will read director biographies but even there I'm wary. Even the good ones have a thesis rather than making an attempt to examine the life and work of an artist impartially.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at November 29, 2025 09:33 PM (xcxpd)

104 96...You are right. It's not a one or the other situation, but think about it for a moment. I didn't know Edward G Robinson's real life condition informed his approach to that role. Now that I do, does that make me appreciate it more a less? How would that piece of information equip me to watch the film or reflect on it better? It might, but it might not matter at all and maybe he turns in a terrific performance being fully healthy off camera.

Posted by: Lex at November 29, 2025 09:34 PM (y4H1r)

105 95 Are there any fans here of the 1980s teen flick, The Last American Virgin?

I was reading about it recently, and was intrigued. I like that (spoiler alert) it does NOT have a happy ending.
Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:27 PM (uZFV0)

Ah, Lemon Popsicle. Yes, a good raunchy movie that will have you crying at the end.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at November 29, 2025 09:35 PM (xcxpd)

106 As noted, the only problem with Citizen Kane is that you can only ever see it once the first time and revel in it's exquisiteness for the first time.

It similar to when you hear JS Bach's Cello Suite when you are twelve years old and it blows your little mind right out of your head.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at November 29, 2025 09:35 PM (XV/Pl)

107 Mark, thanks!

Thomas, same can be said for The Sixth Sense.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:37 PM (uZFV0)

108 88 Perhaps "passion" for the movies is counterproductive if you want to be successful in the business of making them.

Was Lee Iacocca passionate about cars? He gave us the Mustang, then the K car. He was successful as a businessman, and made some good cars, but did he love making them?
Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at November 29, 2025 09:14 PM (8QVSJ)

Art vs commerce. If there is no commerce, there is no money for the art. If there is no art, then you are producing 'content' at best and audience will abandon you and you will have no commerce.

I would say businessmen should say 'yes' or 'no' to a movie package and then stay the fuck out. Businessmen who do not know or love movies being allowed to influence content ruins movies 90% of the time.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at November 29, 2025 09:37 PM (xcxpd)

109 These days, I respect a lot of films that don't have happy endings.

That's not to say everything should be sturm and drang, pessimistic, no-hope dirges. I just would like to see more films where the hero actually learns something, rather than ends up the 'winner' somehow.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:38 PM (uZFV0)

110 106 As noted, the only problem with Citizen Kane is that you can only ever see it once the first time and revel in it's exquisiteness for the first time.

It similar to when you hear JS Bach's Cello Suite when you are twelve years old and it blows your little mind right out of your head.
Posted by: Thomas Bender at November 29, 2025 09:35 PM (XV/Pl)

Well, yes...but you can watch it again, and get more details on the rewatch and it can help you appreciate it even more. And you can get a hint of that original feeling and that is a good sensation, worth pursuing. Its why I rewatch movies I love.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at November 29, 2025 09:39 PM (xcxpd)

111 For me, Citizen Kane works really well not just for the ending, but because there's so much good stuff to enjoy on the way there. Plus it's surpringly (darkly) funny in spots.

"Sure we're talking, Jed. You're fired."

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:41 PM (uZFV0)

112 96 I think that content can help appreciate a film. Knowing Jimmy Stewart was a broken spirit from losing so many pilots over Europe. The scene at the bridge and bar, where he is lost and broken was not entirely acting. The knowledge makes it a profound moment of heartache.”

I think it also comes through in “Flight of the Phoenix”, where Stewart plays a tough old pilot who doesn’t have any patience for some young pencil pusher trying to tell him what to do. As a pilot with 25 combat missions under his belt, i think that’s one of the most true to life parts he ever played.

Posted by: Tom Servo at November 29, 2025 09:41 PM (3U2FH)

113 Jimmy Stewart was absolutely unbelievably talented as an actor.

He makes Vertigo work really well, and although it's one of my all-time favorite movies, I also acknowledge it has one of the most outlandish plots of any film anywhere.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:43 PM (uZFV0)

114 They left it to the viewer to fill in the blanks which I think is more effective.
Posted by: Anna Puma at November 29, 2025 09:15 PM (nhv81)

This.

Posted by: Aetius451AD work phone at November 29, 2025 09:44 PM (zZu0s)

115 The failure there is the unstated premise that "renewable" energy is somehow needed.
Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon

Well, sure, and they do briefly even mention that the kid is persona non grata because so much of the local economy is oil-based. Don't want to overthink a goofy little flick like this, though. Big Energy Company trying to hijack the Solitary Scientist, both thinking renewables is a goal to chase is not an unlikely scenario.

Less plausible is trying to capture and store lightning in a bottle.

Posted by: mindful webworker - if I could keep time in a bottle at November 29, 2025 09:45 PM (LaTF/)

116 Stewart was also excellent in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance. Among lots of others.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 09:47 PM (q3u5l)

117 Another good film with an outlandish plot is Gone Girl.

IMHO, Ben Affleck was very Jimmy Stewart-like in that film. Plus it reminded me a little bit of Vertigo.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:48 PM (uZFV0)

118
Idiots & fraudsters tried to sell tom hanks as our generation's Jimmy Stewart.

Right? Didn't they? Or am I dreaming that?

Posted by: Soothsayer at November 29, 2025 09:48 PM (y8ZM0)

119
The days of "movie stars" are long gone.

IMDB tried to sell me "today's power couples!" bullshit, and I did not recognize any of them.

Posted by: Soothsayer at November 29, 2025 09:49 PM (y8ZM0)

120 Sooth, Hanks is IMHO too much of a comedian at heart to be an effective Stewart.

Can anyone imagine Jimmy Stewart playing Forrest Gump? I can't.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:49 PM (uZFV0)

121 The other thing about Wells is his acting, the dude could act, he was Brando before Brando, who is a touch overrated in my opinion.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at November 29, 2025 09:50 PM (XV/Pl)

122 Thomas, Brando had issues.
It seems like he was always looking for reasons to be unhappy and angry at his co-stars, directors, etc etc., instead of appreciating the success he had.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:51 PM (uZFV0)

123 I don't think you're dreaming that, Soothsayer.

Have no idea who would be our generation's Jimmy Stewart, but I don't think Hanks is it.

Re: art and commerce in the movie biz -- they're all just a bunch of people standing around until the writer gives them a script to tell them what to do. At which point too many of 'em think they know better than the writer.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 09:52 PM (q3u5l)

124 I didn't know Edward G Robinson's real life condition informed his approach to that role. Now that I do, does that make me appreciate it more a less? How would that piece of information equip me to watch the film or reflect on it better? It might, but it might not matter at all and maybe he turns in a terrific performance being fully healthy off camera.
Posted by: Lex at November 29, 2025 09:34 PM (y4H1r

For me, that’s the entire reason I’ll rewatch Soylent Green whenever I run across it. The movie itself is a rather typical representative of dystopian sci-fi, a popular genre in the 70’s. Dark and dreary - but Eddie G’s death scene transcends the rest of the movie not just thematically but visually - it’s beautiful and deeply touching.
And that’s because it’s not just the character dying; this is Eddie G. Robinson’s very personal Goodbye to his career, his audience, and his life, shared with the entire movie viewing world.
I can hardly think of another star of his stature who could make an exit that magnificently; although one could argue that Maggie Smith came close in her last “Downton Abbey” appearance.

Posted by: Tom Servo at November 29, 2025 09:52 PM (3U2FH)

125 Was Lee Iacocca passionate about cars? He gave us the Mustang, then the K car
—

And the mini van.

Posted by: Its Go Time Donald at November 29, 2025 09:53 PM (pW7uA)

126 108 88 Perhaps "passion" for the movies is counterproductive if you want to be successful in the business of making them.

Was Lee Iacocca passionate about cars? He gave us the Mustang, then the K car. He was successful as a businessman, and made some good cars, but did he love making them?
Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at November 29, 2025 09:14 PM (8QVSJ)

Art vs commerce. If there is no commerce, there is no money for the art. If there is no art, then you are producing 'content' at best and audience will abandon you and you will have no commerce.

I would say businessmen should say 'yes' or 'no' to a movie package and then stay the fuck out. Businessmen who do not know or love movies being allowed to influence content ruins movies 90% of the time.
Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards, Buy ammo at November 29, 2025 09:37 PM (xcxpd)

I'd put George Lucas in that 10% category. I'd argue that the constraints the suits put on George made Star Wars a better movie - it forced innovation. As Lucas became less dependent upon the suits to get his movies made, they became progressively worse.

Posted by: Darrell Harris at November 29, 2025 09:54 PM (FjUgp)

127 Well, outta here for the evening.

Thanks for the thread, Lex.

Have a good one, gang.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at November 29, 2025 09:55 PM (q3u5l)

128 From what I remember, Iacocca is the guy who actually managed to talk his *labor union* off the cliff at Chrysler. Told 'em he just couldn't keep them on the wages they requested in 1978.

When was the last time a labor union backed off a major CEO? I don't think it happens very often.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 09:55 PM (uZFV0)

129 the only problem with Citizen Kane is that you can only ever see it once the first time and revel in it's exquisiteness for the first time.

same can be said for The Sixth Sense.

Been decades since I watched Citizen Kane. Knowing the Big Reveal (Rosebud is Luke's father), which was no big deal, after all, I think the film has great merit anyway.

We saw Sixth Sense (where the Big Reveal is more integral to the whole telling) in the theater when it first came out, and have often thought it might be worth a re-watch just to pick up on all the clues we didn't get during first viewing. Maybe one of these days…
🙄

Posted by: mindful webworker - or not at November 29, 2025 09:58 PM (LaTF/)

130 Brandos best film might be The Freshman, I also liked him in Don Juan Demarco.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at November 29, 2025 09:59 PM (XV/Pl)

131 Thomas, I think The Freshman is the only time Brando made fun of himself in a film. Was interesting to see.

Posted by: qdpsteve at November 29, 2025 10:00 PM (uZFV0)

132
Goodbye to his career, his audience, and his life, shared with the entire movie viewing world.

The Shootist

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at November 29, 2025 10:00 PM (pkeXY)

133 Oh jeez.
Where's the whiskey?
They just turned on Sleepless in Seattle.
Ugh.

Posted by: Diogenes at November 29, 2025 10:00 PM (y3bZw)

134 @131

>>Was interesting to me.

Yes, it was as if Brando threw off all the bullshit and just let it go.

I kinda of wish DDL would do something like that, it would be fascinating.

Posted by: Thomas Bender at November 29, 2025 10:03 PM (XV/Pl)

135 The Saturday Night ONT bar is open.
https://acecomments.mu.nu/?post=417507

Posted by: mindful webworker - NOOOODliness at November 29, 2025 10:03 PM (LaTF/)

136 There is a movie coming out next year that seems to be based on the French web-series Le Visiteur du Futur, where a man comes back from an apocalyptic future to try to change the past. And mostly getting it wrong.

Have Fun, Be Safe, Don't Die

youtu.be/CaSxNAZUKsM

Posted by: Kindltot at November 29, 2025 10:06 PM (rbvCR)

137 I think you may really enjoy Val Kilmer’s autobiography. Tells about the art, the people, and how he was feeling. I finished it and he died the next day. I felt responsible.

Posted by: DuckButt at November 29, 2025 10:30 PM (FiT1h)

138 "Fen, that was me. I just watched the old MST3k episode. I promise I meant no disrespect. It was just something stupid to type. I excel at that. I apologize unreservedly."

Nah, no need for that. I figured you were just goofing and I enjoy being a bit whimsical (?) myself. But I do appreciate you taking the time to be considerate. It's a rare thing Hat tip.

Posted by: Fen at November 30, 2025 01:07 PM (ciYHQ)

139 watched "good boy" a few days ago. not very spooky, nothing is explained and it ends kind of flat.
the editing is remarkable, dog lovers should not miss it. knowing that it is not ai makes it all the moreso.

Posted by: cmeat at November 30, 2025 03:02 PM (R11M+)

140 i saw computer wore (wears?) tennis shoes as a pre- teen. maybe a double feature with cold turkey.

Posted by: cmeat at November 30, 2025 03:10 PM (R11M+)

141 Diller was CEO of QVC for a while. He was a real hothead and would explode in anger. They replaced his multi-line telephone quite a few times because he trashed it. There was a box in the telecom room labeled Dillers Leftovers which held parts from the very expensive phones and it was raised to fix phones for other less aggressive executives.

Posted by: Former Qer at November 30, 2025 06:16 PM (msB/9)

142 When he was just a Boy Kurt Russel was a Jungle Boy on a episode of Gilligan's Island

Posted by: Tamaa the Drongo Bird at December 01, 2025 04:48 PM (wGqjj)

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