Saturday Evening Movie Thread 05/04/2024 [TheJamesMadison]

Robert E. Howard

Six films have the credit of some variation of "Based on the works of Robert E. Howard," and I watched all of them a few weeks back. It all started when I got the 4K collector's set of the first two Conan the Barbarian films starring Arnold Schwarzenegger from Arrow Video (they're very nice). I expanded it to include the other four, and as I was going through them, I had the recurring thought that I would write a post about them. However, the only thing that kept attracting my attention was the idea of the films as adaptations of Howard's writing. The problem was that I hadn't read a Conan story in about a decade, and I'd never read any of the Kull the Atlantean or Solomon Kane stories.

So, I read all of them. Well, all of the stories that Howard published in his lifetime. I wasn't going to go down the rabbit hole of the fragments, recreations, and adaptations in other mediums (mostly the Marvel comic books). This also meant that I could thoroughly ignore Red Sonja since the character as presented in the film is actually a creation of Roy Thomas and Barry Windsor-Smith in a Marvel comic, sort of inspired by a character named Red Sonya by Howard who didn't appear in the Hyborian Age.

The question then becomes, which is the most accurate? Is accuracy the real goal of this kind of exercise? Is Howard the kind of writer to be slavishly accurate to when adapting to a vastly different medium from short stories and novellas into feature film?

And, just to be clear, the five films discussed will be: Conan the Barbarian from 1982, directed by John Milius, Conan the Destroyer from 1984, directed by Richard Fleischer, Kull the Conqueror from 1997, directed by John Nicolella, Solomon Kane from 2009, directed by M.J. Bassett, and Conan the Barbarian from 2011, directed by Marcus Nispel.

The Source

First of all, out of the adaptations in question, only one of them actually makes any attempt to adapt an actual story that Howard wrote. There are plenty of little scenes and even bits of dialogue that get peppered throughout, but only one, Kull the Conqueror has even the shell of one of the original stories. And it really is just a shell. Kull was originally a Conan story that got rewritten to include Kull when Kevin Sorbo signed on, not wanting to play the same character as Arnold. It stemmed from Conan the Conqueror, previously titled The Hour of the Dragon, and only the most simplistic recitation of events from a 30,000 foot view would tell you that they have anything in common.

Outside of that, though, none of them make that attempt. So, what's being adapted. I think it comes down to three main elements. The first, and probably the most important for most people, is the characters. This is almost entirely about the three title characters. Almost none of the other characters in the films come from the books with the sole exception of Valeria in Milius' film, but she's so far removed from the Valeria presented in "Red Nails" where she's a pirate, not some kind of Viking, Valkyrie, thief. So, she's kind of close, but not that close. The second major element being adapted is the setting: They Hyborian Age. To be honest, though, the Hyborian Age in Howard's writing is some kind of hodgepodge of really ancient and Medieval, but that's part of the appeal. It's sort of timeless that way, so the world on film can be a hodgepodge and a bit timeless. The third is what I personally consider to be the most important: the magic.

Having read all of these stories (not his westerns or boxing stuff, mind you), it's obvious that Howard was deeply influenced by H.P. Lovecraft. I don't even need to know that Howard and Lovecraft had a correspondence based relationship to see the influence. He uses phrases like "cosmic horror" and "the Old Ones." The evil of the world is almost always magicians or sorcerers who are usually not powerful on their own, but at least implied to be intermediaries for larger forces. This is honestly the stuff that appeals to me most in these stories, so while I recognize that not everyone has that same preference, it's what I look for most in these adaptations.

So, I think that's the three major things: character, setting, and the unique approach to magic and evil. Which held up best?

The Films
Kull the Atlantean

Let's just get Kull the Conqueror out of the way: It's surprisingly not a very good adaptation. Kull is simply wrong for the Atlantean that Howard wrote. As played by Sorbo, he's a proto-Tony Stark, quippy and loose while the written Kull is serious and contemplative. Well, he's mostly Conan but talks a bit less. The setting is wrong because they filmed on old English ruins meant to portray a heightened current state (though it's supposed to also pale in comparison to the ancient Acheron). The magic is never taken very seriously, but at least there's an effort to get the witch played by Tia Carrere to be some kind of vessel for a larger evil. It's not only a bad film, but it gets the appeal of the source material wrong. Howard isn't heavy metal. He may be in the adaptations in comic form, but the credits aren't that the film was adapted from the Marvel comics but from Howard.

Well, with the worst one out of the way, what about the other four? Let's tackle Conan first, since he's the biggest target.

Conan the Cimmerian

In terms of character, we have essentially three takes: Arnold's efforts under Milius, Arnold's efforts under Fleischer, and Jason Momoa. The core problem with Arnold in Milius' film is that he simply doesn't talk that much. Howard's Conan is surprisingly loquacious, explaining himself at times with eloquence. Arnold has only eighteen lines of dialogue in the entirety of the first film. What he says is in alignment with Howard's writing, especially the famous line about what is best in life, but Milius consciously pulled dialogue from Arnold because his English just wasn't very good at the time. The second effort, directed by Fleischer, has a different problem: silliness. In order to make the franchise more kid-friendly, they lightened the tone a good bit (while leaving in a surprising amount of blood, to be honest), and it nadirs with a scene of drunk Conan in the middle of the film trying to explain love. It's very not Conan. Throw in the fact that the innocent waif of a leading lady was Olivia d'Abo, who was fourteen at the time, the lustful Conan was made extremely restrained and chaste, which is weird. Also, Conan doesn't build teams. Conan commands by his sword and his wit. Conan builds a team in Conan the Destroyer. It just feels wrong.

What might be the most accurate version of Conan is Jason Momoa. Arnold's physique is more in line with Howard's descriptions, though Momoa isn't exactly small (it's not like Tom Cruise playing Reacher), but he has more dialogue direct from Howard ("I live, I love, I slay," is a direct quote), is more passionate with his leading lady, and has a certain pantherish quality that Howard always harped on. I think he works.

I should also note that both modern and older versions invent a backstory for Conan that Howard never had: the burning of the Cimmerian village which Milius takes even further by having Conan become a slave. Conan was never a slave in the books, but Kull was. Conan was a wanderer and then a pirate after leaving Cimmeria. So, points off.

The second element is the setting, and the fullest of the three seems to be Milius' take. Old, but not ruined. Large but not packed with people. The Hyborian Age that Milius presents feels real and appropriate. Fleischer's vision is not something I dislike, but it feels a bit off. It's a bit too stagey with large, good-looking sets that are dressed too cleanly, especially the castle that begins and ends the film. The more natural settings, the places outdoors filmed in Eastern Europe and sets designed like caves feel more right. There's also a wizard's lair that's right out of a Kull story that feels really good. So, Destroyer is okay, but something of a mixed bag. The newer Conan the Barbarian actually gets it the most right, I think. The ancient temple in the middle of a forest feels right in line with Howard's take on the Hyborian Age. Dragging a ship across the land by elephants is something Howard never described but would have probably loved. There's a variety of settings from jungles to desert to the sea that never feels terribly small (this was a problem in Red Sonja, but we're not talking about it), and travel seems to take time.

Now, the magic is where I was focusing mainly as I watched. Out of the three, I think Milius' Conan is actually the furthest from Howard. That's not to say that it's terribly far, though. All three are reasonably close, I think. My only issue with Thulsa Doom, as an adaptation of how Howard would write an evil wizard, is that he doesn't seem to have a connection with a larger force. That could be taken in implication when he turns into a serpent for no real reason, especially since the Cult of Set is so prominent in so many Conan (and Kull) stories. So, pretty close. I hold up Destroyer as closer, though, because the wizard is almost directly from a Kull story, and the monster at the end is really awesome, representing the kind of nightmarish vision that Howard liked to imply rather than describe directly. The more recent film is the one that implied the connection with a larger, unseen evil most fully, manifested through the pursuit of an Acheron crown, powered by blood and in pursuit by a king and his witch daughter. This is exactly the sort of thing that Howard wrote about.

So, while I haven't talked about the actual quality of these films, it really does feel like the Marcus Nispel, Jason Momoa adaptation is actually the closest overall to Howard's original source material. It's the least of the three in terms of quality, but I think it captures a lot of what Howard had written in a new medium accurately.

However, that being said, there's also a structural issue to talk about. The newest Conan film has this terrible, and very modern, sensibility that it needs to have an action beat every ten minutes. It's literally every ten minutes. The prologue, which lasts for 30 minutes, has three action beats (one to start, one in the middle, and one to end). The Howard stories don't operate like that at all. They're generally more sedate and ominous rather than moving from action beat to action beat ("Beyond the Black River" is something of an exception and does have a similar feel, to be fair). There is action, of course, but it's not so constantly repetitive. A forty page story may have two serious bits of action in it. So, while I feel like the world and characters are captured decently well, the actual structure is off. It's more of a metal action movie than a replication of Howard's work.

Solomon Kane

There is, of course, only one cinematic adaptation of Howard's character Solomon Kane, and it makes no effort to adapt any of the actual stories, most of which take place in Africa. It is, instead, an effort at an origin story, effectively treating the character like a comic book superhero whereas Howard had brought Kane into the literary world fully formed as the zealot for justice cloaked in language of the language of God while wearing the outfit of a Puritan. So, much like Milius creating the backstory of Conan, M.J. Bassett (writer and director) created a backstory from some individual lines that Howard had sprinkled through a couple of the stories as guidance. There is a mention of fighting the Turks, for instance, that becomes the basis for the entire prologue of the film where a viciously evil and younger Kane kills everyone in his way before he's confronted with the agent of the devil trying to take his soul to Hell. This sends him to a monastery back in England where he decides to seclude himself before the abbot sends him out in the world to seek his destiny: fighting evil.

The whole "soul is in danger" thing is a complete creation by Bassett without any textual backup from Howard's writing, but the portrait of a man trying to be good, seeing the evil in the world, and deciding to fight against evil in the service of good over the course of the rest of the film feels like the kind of backstory that Howard could have had in mind. The story that Kane goes through contains the exact kind of balance between real-world and otherworldly threats, manifested through a weird-looking guy with connections to a greater evil that we never quite see. It goes a bit overboard with the giant metal beast in the end, but Howard did have Kane fight harpies in the African mountains at one point. So...I don't think it's terribly off.

I suppose the biggest hit against it from an adaptation point of view is the effort to create a backstory at all which all of the others are guilty of as well, except for Kull which is terrible and was also meant to be a Conan movie anyway, implying that the previous films were the same character's previous history, including the original backstory in the first film. In addition, it doesn't feel the need to go breakneck action all the time, allowing for longer stretches without the swinging of swords, which helps it feel right from a structural point of view.

So, essentially, I think Solomon Kane is the closest to Howard's work out of the five films in question.

Order

If forced to order them by faithful adaptations, I'd go: Solomon Kane, Conan the Barbarian by Milius, Conan the Barbarian by Nispel, Conan the Destroyer, and then Kull the Conqueror. Honestly, though, there's no great answer. Only one of them actually tries to adapt a story, and that one does it badly. Most of them try to come up with backstories that Howard never wrote. The actual capture of the central characters is, on the whole, halfway decent. The sense of magic that Howard put in his work is also pretty good, though there's a range. So, this is something that I would never call an objective list, mostly just how I prioritize what I see in Kane and how much of it I find in the adaptations.

That should also not be taken as a ranking on their quality (that's stupid stuff...see mine here), just how I think the different filmmakers reflected the source writings. And, it's something of a mixed bag, but it presents a question: how important is accuracy to the source material? Personally, I'm not against taking a source, hollowing it out, and using it for something else. Generally. Sometimes sources are not very good but have potential for other things. However, we're usually talking about adaptations of things people actually like. Is it that all that's required for faithfulness to be important? There being an existing audience for it? Take some spy series no one really cares about like, say, The Bourne Identity, completely gut it, and then make a movie that people like. Is it bad because it's not accurate to the source?

Anyway

Which do you think is the most accurate adaptation? Is it also your favorite?

Movies of Today

Opening in Theaters:

The Fall Guy
Movies I Saw This Fortnight:

Godzilla (Rating 1.5/4) Full Review "I really don't think this works, but Godzilla does stomp real good." [The Criterion Channel]

Rodan (Rating 2.5/4) Full Review "So, it doesn't quite work as an overall package, hindered massively by its dull as dishwater middle, but the opening and close are surprisingly strong. I'd throw it on again for a light entertainment now and again." [The Criterion Channel]

Be Happy, These Two Lovers (Rating 3.5/4) Full Review "A clear-eyed melodrama with restrained, Japanese form, Be Happy, These Two Lovers was a very good little discovery in the middle of a career that pushed in a very different direction. Honda was much more than monster mayhem." [Library]

The Mysterians (Rating 3/4) Full Review "However, in terms of his science-fiction work, it's a bit more thoughtfully crafted and comes together decently well." [The Criterion Channel]

The Human Vapor (Rating 3.5/4) Full Review "It's an homage to classic Universal monster movies, film noir, and Howard Hawks that manages to feel alive on its own. This is, I think, deeply underappreciated. It's really good. I'm a fan." [Library]

Mothra (Rating 2.5/4) Full Review "It looks good, moves quickly, and has some nice sights along the way. It's decently entertaining as it plays out, but it really could have used a rewrite." [The Criterion Channel]

Matango (Rating 3.5/4) Full Review "I get into the weird atmosphere of it all as the characters go steadily insane while bizarre things unfold around them and engulf them. It's well filmed, well directed, well performed, and well put together. It's a good time at the movies." [The Criterion Channel]

Atragon (Rating 2/4) Full Review "Anyway, it's...okay. It has some interesting ideas that it doesn't explore in any serious way, but the ideas are there. The action is silly. The character-based storytelling is thin and unpursued. It's pretty typical fare, but it's not the worst thing. Spectacle has some benefits." [The Criterion Channel]

Contact

Email any suggestions or questions to thejamesmadison.aos at symbol gmail dot com.
I've also archived all the old posts here, by request. I'll add new posts a week after they originally post at the HQ.

My next post will be on 5/25, and it will talk about the films directed by Ishiro Honda.

Posted by: Open Blogger at 07:45 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Foist.

Posted by: weft Carnac at May 04, 2024 07:43 PM (IG4Id)

2 only one of them actually makes any attempt to adapt an actual story that Howard wrote.

Wait, which one?

Posted by: weft Carnac at May 04, 2024 07:44 PM (IG4Id)

3 That Conan movie is the one where James Earl Jones turns into a snake right?

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at May 04, 2024 07:45 PM (QNSds)

4 I enjoyed the Solomon Kane movie despite never reading the source material

Posted by: vmom stabby stabby stabby stabby stabamillion at May 04, 2024 07:51 PM (n/1xr)

5 hay

Posted by: Ciampino - Duct-tape for the win at May 04, 2024 07:53 PM (qfLjt)

6 Dapper looking gent

no idea who he is

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 07:53 PM (/7KEl)

7 Never seen any of these films.

Posted by: Ciampino - Ducky at May 04, 2024 07:53 PM (qfLjt)

8 yes thats the one, the other was about the Dyonisian demon god,

Posted by: no 6 at May 04, 2024 07:54 PM (PXvVL)

9 Sock change.

That's all I got.

Posted by: Red at May 04, 2024 07:54 PM (Wnv9h)

10 I'm too tired to change socks, apparently.

Posted by: RedMindBlueState at May 04, 2024 07:55 PM (Wnv9h)

11 The Human Vapor

-

It would be great if that Lume undertit and vagina deodorant was a primary corporate sponsor.

Posted by: Moron Robbie - Little girls dreamt of being moms, women told them not to follow their dreams at May 04, 2024 07:55 PM (YsjiM)

12 Good evening everyone
Finished watching Downfall within the last hour on YouTube
It is very good.
Now onto content

Posted by: Skip at May 04, 2024 07:56 PM (fwDg9)

13 Love this topic! My favorite, by far, is the Milius version, although for a reason that has little to do with faithfulness to Howard's story; rather for me it is that magnificent cinematic score by Basil Poledouris, which I consider one of the overall best musical scores ever written. It plays like a symphony to listen to on its own, and if I ever catch that movie playing I have to watch, because it's like listening to one of my favorite albums.
That's a movie where the music tells the story better and more completely than the dialogue does.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 07:57 PM (R4z5M)

14 I watched "Conan the Barbarian" last night as TJM mentioned he'd be doing a post on Howard's works.

It still holds up as a fairly entertaining film, despite the flaws and lack of consistency with Howard's world.

The lack of long passages of dialog means you have to really watch the film to know what's going on. It's a feast for the eyes.

The world that is crafted is believable, but indeterminate in the past, melding together numerous cultures and societies across time and space.

Does it capture the *spirit* of Howard's world? Yeah, I think so, to some extent, even if it's not a direct adaptation of Howard's stories.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 07:58 PM (BpYfr)

15 I choose "Conan the Barbarian" because of Milius and Basil Polydouris. It has the atmosphere of a good fantasy story.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 07:59 PM (FkUwd)

16 Huh. The Solomon Kane thing reminds me of the show, Brimstone. Essentially the main character was a policeman. Guy rapes his wife. He hunts the guy down and murders him in cold blood. Dies by chance shortly thereafter. Goes straight to Hell. Wackiness ensues and he is given a deal by Lucifer: recapture 100 escaped souls, and he will have a chance at Salvation.

Teri Polo as a policewoman and John Glover as Lucifer (and also the Archangel Michael in one episode.)

It was a short lived show and also: I cannot believe it ever got made in the first place. Dear Lord. In Hollywood.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:01 PM (di6C2)

17 Robert E. Howard kind of looks like Al Capone.

Posted by: Tuna at May 04, 2024 08:02 PM (oaGWv)

18 2 only one of them actually makes any attempt to adapt an actual story that Howard wrote.

Wait, which one?
Posted by: weft Carnac at May 04, 2024 07:44 PM (IG4Id)

=======

Kull the Conqueror has the vague shape of Conan the Conqueror or, under its original title, The Hour of the Dragon.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:02 PM (GBKbO)

19 I watched "Star Wars" for the dozenth time and loved it. I choose to not let the actors, directors, prequels and sequels taint my enjoyment of the original trilogy.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:02 PM (FkUwd)

20 One of my favorite scenes is one with no dialogue known as "The Atlantean Tomb", where Conan discovers the ancient sword. It's like a scene out of Tolkien that's even better than things Tolkien wrote.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 08:03 PM (R4z5M)

21 13 Love this topic! My favorite, by far, is the Milius version, although for a reason that has little to do with faithfulness to Howard's story; rather for me it is that magnificent cinematic score by Basil Poledouris, which I consider one of the overall best musical scores ever written. It plays like a symphony to listen to on its own, and if I ever catch that movie playing I have to watch, because it's like listening to one of my favorite albums.
That's a movie where the music tells the story better and more completely than the dialogue does.
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 07:57 PM (R4z5M)

========

The movie soars when the score is front and center.

It's only not around the film's middle when they meet Osric and Conan sneaks into Thulsa Doom's cult (it's also where Arnold has most of his dialogue). That's when it suddenly feels kinda clunky.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:03 PM (GBKbO)

22 19 I watched "Star Wars" for the dozenth time and loved it. I choose to not let the actors, directors, prequels and sequels taint my enjoyment of the original trilogy.
Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:02 PM (FkUwd)

They keep making it harder though.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:03 PM (di6C2)

23 Spirit Valeria showing up in Barbarian is the best Conan moment.

Posted by: davidt at May 04, 2024 08:04 PM (SYTee)

24 This Australian site has a lot of the Robert E Howard works for free.

freeread.com.au/@RGLibrary/RobertEHoward/RobertEHoward.html

Posted by: Mark1971 at May 04, 2024 08:05 PM (xPl2J)

25 >>Throw in the fact that the innocent waif of a leading lady was Olivia d'Abo, who was fourteen at the time,

Ersatz Roman Polanski: I don't really see what the problem is?

Posted by: Thomas Bender at May 04, 2024 08:06 PM (XV/Pl)

26 Sisu 2022 is on and this old guy is a badass Finn.

Posted by: Eromero at May 04, 2024 08:07 PM (NxC5+)

27
So if Ace won't let you do a Russ Meyer retrospective will he settle for an Andy Sidaris one?

Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at May 04, 2024 08:07 PM (MoZTd)

28 Long time since I've watched it, but find an episode of the Boris Karloff-hosted series THRILLER. "Pigeons from Hell" from Robert E. Howard's short story. Creepy as blazes, if memory serves.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 08:07 PM (q3u5l)

29 Sisu might be the best movie of the 2020's so far.

Posted by: Mark1971 at May 04, 2024 08:08 PM (xPl2J)

30 27
So if Ace won't let you do a Russ Meyer retrospective will he settle for an Andy Sidaris one?
Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at May 04, 2024 08:07 PM (MoZTd)

=======

I suspect that I mostly just need to not piss off CBD.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:09 PM (GBKbO)

31 So if Ace won't let you do a Russ Meyer retrospective will he settle for an Andy Sidaris one?
Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at May 04, 2024 08:07 PM (MoZTd)

*shakes head sadly*

We always knew ace was gay. garret and shiny faces should have been a warning.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:09 PM (di6C2)

32 I hated that Milius made Conan raised a slave.Ruins it for me. Conan left his tribe at about 15 because he killed the son of a chief in a fight over a woman iirc

Posted by: steevy at May 04, 2024 08:10 PM (FQmDC)

33 Spirit Valeria showing up in Barbarian is the best Conan moment.
Posted by: davidt at May 04, 2024 08:04 PM (SYTee)
---
As soon as she re-appeared, my mind immediately said, "Valkyrie"

Which kind of makes sense because there's definitely a Norse/Scandinavian vibe to the culture...

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:10 PM (BpYfr)

34 So if Ace won't let you do a Russ Meyer retrospective will he settle for an Andy Sidaris one?
Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at May 04, 2024 08:07 PM (MoZTd)

Tinto Brass?

Posted by: davidt at May 04, 2024 08:10 PM (SYTee)

35 Sort of related:

If anyone enjoys Futurama, someone made... I'm not sure how to describe it. A real-life (AI I guess) 1950s trailer for the movie/series?

Futurama - 1950's Super Panavision 70

youtube.com/watch?v=eSq26Owny68

Posted by: Moron Robbie - Little girls dreamt of being moms, women told them not to follow their dreams at May 04, 2024 08:11 PM (YsjiM)

36 I'm a fan of the genre but I really did not like the Conan movies except for the music. The acting was terrible and not just Arnold.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:11 PM (inGXk)

37 33 As soon as she re-appeared, my mind immediately said, "Valkyrie"

Which kind of makes sense because there's definitely a Norse/Scandinavian vibe to the culture...
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:10 PM (BpYfr)

=======

Milius essentially would just shrug when asked about it and say, "I like vikings and viking culture."

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:11 PM (GBKbO)

38 Yes polidaris score was tremendous even in destroyer which i saw first i only saw the original a year or two ago

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:12 PM (PXvVL)

39 Roger Corman was usually always good for some epic big boobage. Not as much as Meyer or Sidaris, but then again most Corman movies had that troublesome plot thing they had to do.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:12 PM (di6C2)

40 36 I'm a fan of the genre but I really did not like the Conan movies except for the music. The acting was terrible and not just Arnold.
Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:11 PM (inGXk)

========

Mako is great! James Earl Jones is really good! Max Von Sydow is great in everything!

The rest aren't asked to actually act all that much.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:12 PM (GBKbO)

41 The Solomon Kane movie didn't appeal to me, despite James Purefoy (aka Marc Antony) playing the lead role. For me, it didn't help that Elizabethan England seemed strangely depopulated.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:12 PM (Be/+i)

42 He thoughr he was a reincarnated warrior if his bio by his daughter is to go by

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:13 PM (PXvVL)

43 And yes Red Sonja is a Marvel comics character, the one Howard story she appears in is very different set at the Seige of Vienna . Now she is just another girl boss.

Posted by: steevy at May 04, 2024 08:13 PM (FQmDC)

44 best part about Valeria was her 80s California surfer girl haircut

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 08:13 PM (/7KEl)

45 36 I'm a fan of the genre but I really did not like the Conan movies except for the music. The acting was terrible and not just Arnold.
Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:11 PM (inGXk)

Wilt Chamberlain is not exactly the quintessential thespian.

He was straight, for one.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:13 PM (di6C2)

46 38 Yes polidaris score was tremendous even in destroyer which i saw first i only saw the original a year or two ago
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:12 PM (PXvVL)

========

I really got the sense that de Laurentiis essentially just bought the rights to the music from Poledoris and had someone else do a bit of rearranging. I don't think there's an original note in the Destroyer soundtrack that isn't from Barbarian.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:14 PM (GBKbO)

47 Posted by: Moron Robbie - Little girls dreamt of being moms, women told them not to follow their dreams at May 04, 2024 08:11 PM (YsjiM)

I liked it. But my mind went straight to making it Porn as the actual Futurama has porn scenarios they never show.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:15 PM (inGXk)

48 Russ Meyer brought us the Dirty Dozen. It was his anecdote that led the author of that story to first research if it was true and eventual decision to write a novel

Posted by: steevy at May 04, 2024 08:15 PM (FQmDC)

49 Mako is great! James Earl Jones is really good! Max Von Sydow is great in everything!

The rest aren't asked to actually act all that much.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:12 PM (GBKbO)
------------
Thulsa Doom: Thorgrim is beside himself with grief!

Thorgrim: *looks mildly pouty*

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:15 PM (Be/+i)

50 Conan:

The Barbarian - ⭐⭐⭐⭐
The Destroyer - 🦨🦨🦨🦨

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 08:15 PM (/7KEl)

51 Yes polidaris score was tremendous even in destroyer which i saw first i only saw the original a year or two ago

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:12 PM

Basil Poledouris knocked it out of the park with his musical score for Quigley Down Under. It was his best work on any film score IMO.

Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at May 04, 2024 08:15 PM (QNSds)

52 Evening.

I think Olivia d'Abo was 15 at the time Conan The Destroyer was made.

I don't care. I'd hit that shit harder than Jeffrey Epstein with the FBI beating down his door.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:16 PM (1Yy3c)

53 Futurama - 1950's Super Panavision 70

youtube.com/watch?v=eSq26Owny68
Posted by: Moron Robbie - Little girls dreamt of being moms, women told them not to follow their dreams at May 04, 2024 08:11 PM (YsjiM)
----
That's creepy, weird, and awesome at the same time. Leela looks bizarre. Zoidberg is hideous. Amy is suitably hot.

ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD!

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:16 PM (BpYfr)

54 Basil Poledouris knocked it out of the park with his musical score for Quigley Down Under. It was his best work on any film score IMO.
Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at May 04, 2024 08:15 PM (QNSds)

And an underrated movie imo.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:16 PM (di6C2)

55 Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:16 PM (1Yy3c)

*cough* 15, dude.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:17 PM (di6C2)

56 Basil Poledouris knocked it out of the park with his musical score for Quigley Down Under. It was his best work on any film score IMO.
Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at May 04, 2024 08:15 PM (QNSds)
---------
Also scored "The Hunt for Red October."

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:17 PM (Be/+i)

57 Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:12 PM (GBKbO)

JEJ was ridiculous in that role imo. I kept picturing him wearing glasses .

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:18 PM (inGXk)

58 56 Also scored "The Hunt for Red October."
Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:17 PM (Be/+i)

======

Tangentially, John McTiernan has been recently saying that he's still got some movies left to make in him. He also says that he gets offered directorial jobs for crap (I'm assuming stuff like Marvel movies).

I doubt it'll happen, but he did apparently get close to putting together a film right before covid happened.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:18 PM (GBKbO)

59 I'm not much for analyzing movies except in rare cases, so thanks for the illumination, TJM. Will say I like most of the Conans mentioned and Solomon Kane, mostly cause they're my thing. Don't recall seeing the Sorbo Kulls, so may have to at least check so I can say I did.

Posted by: She Hobbit at May 04, 2024 08:19 PM (ftFVW)

60 Sisu spoke nary a word thus far, actions speak volumes.

Posted by: Eromero at May 04, 2024 08:19 PM (NxC5+)

61 59 Don't recall seeing the Sorbo Kulls, so may have to at least check so I can say I did.
Posted by: She Hobbit at May 04, 2024 08:19 PM (ftFVW)

======

Don't say I didn't warn you!

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:19 PM (GBKbO)

62 Well robocop a few years later

Yes that live action futurama was strange

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:19 PM (PXvVL)

63 Re: Matango.

I couldn't get passed the part that this group of assholes and idiots decided to stay on that fucking island. You got some canned goods, your boat can still sail, but you're choosing to stay because...???????

Atragon has some worthwhile commentary on Japanese imperialism but overall it ends in an unexciting and anticlimactic fashion.

Mothra was awesome. Mothra was ridiculously fun and I loved it.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:19 PM (1Yy3c)

64 . I don't think there's an original note in the Destroyer soundtrack that isn't from Barbarian.
---

To be fair, Polidouris ripped off Prokofiev.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:20 PM (FkUwd)

65 Red October theme
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVBCxnKudhs

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 08:20 PM (/7KEl)

66 Basil Poledouris knocked it out of the park with his musical score for Quigley Down Under. It was his best work on any film score IMO.
Posted by: Mister Scott (Formerly GWS) at May 04, 2024 08:15 PM (QNSds)
---------

Now that you say that I agree. I probably didn't notice as much because it fit so well with thee we movie which is one of my favorites.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:20 PM (inGXk)

67 63 Re: Matango.

I couldn't get passed the part that this group of assholes and idiots decided to stay on that fucking island. You got some canned goods, your boat can still sail, but you're choosing to stay because...???????

Atragon has some worthwhile commentary on Japanese imperialism but overall it ends in an unexciting and anticlimactic fashion.

Mothra was awesome. Mothra was ridiculously fun and I loved it.
Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:19 PM (1Yy3c)

========

In Matango, the sailing vessel wasn't sea worthy. They spend time trying to fix it up. The cargo-sized tanker was, of course, just not workable at all. They were trapped there.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:21 PM (GBKbO)

68 McTiernan

Epic level
Predator
Die Hard
13th Warrior
The Hunt for Red October

What the F level
Last Action Hero
Medicine Man(?!)

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:21 PM (di6C2)

69 Toronto - Boston, Game 7

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 08:21 PM (/7KEl)

70 I saw Solomon Kane ... a free watch on You Tube.

I found it enjoyable once it got going.

Posted by: browndog had time on his hands at May 04, 2024 08:22 PM (TTAGa)

71 When it comes to movie adaptations that people get mad about, the two that come to mind are Dune and Starship Troopers.

I haven't read either, and don't really care, generally agree with everyone's perspective on Lynch's Dune. It's weird, and since the book adherents hate it, I don't really know why he even made it.

As for Troopers, I come at it from the same perspective as those who say the filmmaker deliberately made a choice NOT to adapt the book faithfully. So... how's it stack up, as a standalone story, and frankly I liked it. I like the third film too, which I understand was somewhat more faithful, the second feels more like a made-for-tv knock-off.

As for the stuff talked about here? Never saw a Conan movie, generally dislike the genre. If it's even a genre.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:22 PM (cw9vy)

72 Didn't McTiernan go to prison?

Posted by: Mark1971 at May 04, 2024 08:22 PM (xPl2J)

73 71 I haven't read either, and don't really care, generally agree with everyone's perspective on Lynch's Dune. It's weird, and since the book adherents hate it, I don't really know why he even made it.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:22 PM (cw9vy)

========

Mark Andrew Edwards loves Lynch's Dune, finds it to be very faithful, and thinks that it's more comprehensible than Villeneuve's version for those who haven't read the books.

I don't agree, but it definitely has its fans.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:23 PM (GBKbO)

74 Last Action Hero...didn't like it much when I was a kid, love it now.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:23 PM (1Yy3c)

75 72 Didn't McTiernan go to prison?
Posted by: Mark1971 at May 04, 2024 08:22 PM (xPl2J)

======

He did. Federal prison. Wiretapping charges.

Because he wiretapped his Rollerball producer.

He went to prison for Rollerball.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:24 PM (GBKbO)

76 Oh, and it’s
🍁vs🐻
On now … for the right to move into the next round of the Stanley Cup

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 08:24 PM (TTAGa)

77 Don't say I didn't warn you!
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda

I'll hold you blameless.

Surely they can't be worse than Waxwork which I loved as a kid and found terrible in the extreme upon rewatching last year.

Posted by: She Hobbit at May 04, 2024 08:24 PM (ftFVW)

78 I will agree that Mako was the best of the bunch in Conan.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:25 PM (inGXk)

79 Sandahl Bergman in The first Conan for the win

Posted by: Pete Bog at May 04, 2024 08:25 PM (wxwMJ)

80 I've got a couple of the Conan soundtrack tunes on playlist.

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 04, 2024 08:25 PM (Cp1vk)

81 Yes the third one which is often dubbed in soanish shows the federation more on its knees plus the blanc mange sky marshal

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:25 PM (PXvVL)

82 Oh that rollerball was a crime

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:26 PM (PXvVL)

83 This might be a bit of a hot take: I watched about half of Treasure Island (before being interrupted): the version with Orsen Welles as Long John Silver. The movie seemed pretty book-accurate. But....Welles sucked as Long John Silver. Not charismatic at all. He just mumbled inaudibly. No idea how any pirate could have followed that version of him..

Give me Tim Curry as LJS in Muppet Treasure Island any day of the week!

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 08:26 PM (Lhaco)

84 What the F level
Last Action Hero
Medicine Man(?!)
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:21 PM (di6C2)

I don't really get the hate Last Action Hero gets. I mean, it's not cinematic masterpiece, but it's kind of fun.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:27 PM (cw9vy)

85 Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:23 PM (GBKbO)

I really like Lynch's Dune but I didn't read the book.

I liked the first new Dune movie. Haven't watched the second part yet but I read they did stray from the book at the end.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:27 PM (inGXk)

86 This might be a bit of a hot take: I watched about half of Treasure Island (before being interrupted): the version with Orsen Welles as Long John Silver. The movie seemed pretty book-accurate. But....Welles sucked as Long John Silver. Not charismatic at all. He just mumbled inaudibly. No idea how any pirate could have followed that version of him..

Give me Tim Curry as LJS in Muppet Treasure Island any day of the week!
Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 08:26 PM (Lhaco)
-----------
The Disney version with Robert Newton (the definitive Long John) is quite faithful to the book. Bobby Driscoll is a bit jarring at first, but they surrounded him with first-rate character actors.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:28 PM (Be/+i)

87 Give me Tim Curry as LJS in Muppet Treasure Island any day of the week!
Posted by: Castle Guy

Heck ya! By far my favorite Silver of the versions I've seen.

Posted by: She Hobbit at May 04, 2024 08:28 PM (ftFVW)

88 It was quite a let down from the other schwartzenegger films but it isnt terrible

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:28 PM (PXvVL)

89 I think my favorite Conan adaptation is "Conehead the Barbituate" (sic) in Mad Magazine.

Don Martin does all the artwork, so it's hilarious from start to finish.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:29 PM (BpYfr)

90 83 This might be a bit of a hot take: I watched about half of Treasure Island (before being interrupted): the version with Orsen Welles as Long John Silver. The movie seemed pretty book-accurate. But....Welles sucked as Long John Silver. Not charismatic at all. He just mumbled inaudibly. No idea how any pirate could have followed that version of him..

Give me Tim Curry as LJS in Muppet Treasure Island any day of the week!
Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 08:26 PM (Lhaco)

Watch the one with Christian Bale and Charleton Heston, it's really good (imho).

Posted by: browndog had time on his hands at May 04, 2024 08:29 PM (TTAGa)

91 Give me Tim Curry as LJS in Muppet Treasure Island any day of the week!
Posted by: Castle Guy
------------
He's fantastic, and the opening number is just awesome!

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:29 PM (Be/+i)

92 Back to Conan...

Okay, so we all know the "what is best in life" speech, right?

The dude that speaks just before Conan says, "The open steppe, a fleet horse, falcons at your wrist and the wind in your hair."

And honestly that sounds great to me.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:29 PM (1Yy3c)

93 85 I really like Lynch's Dune but I didn't read the book.

I liked the first new Dune movie. Haven't watched the second part yet but I read they did stray from the book at the end.
Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:27 PM (inGXk)

=========

It strays in a literal sense, but I think it's in an effort to keep to a thematic interpretation that is in line with the original work. It's not like they went way off course overall. They changed some characters in a way to push the central idea further.

And then there's Chani whom they changed for dumb purposes and doesn't work.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:30 PM (GBKbO)

94 Sisu spoke nary a word thus far, actions speak volumes.
Posted by: Eromero

The actor playing his Nazi tormentor is Aksel Henne, a Norwegian actor who's been in some really good stuff. He's in a film on Netflix right now called The Trip that is wild. I recommend it.

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 04, 2024 08:30 PM (Cp1vk)

95 Give me Tim Curry as LJS in Muppet Treasure Island any day of the week!
Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 08:26 PM (Lhaco)
---
Tim Curry will chew the scenery given half a chance and it's glorious every time!

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:30 PM (BpYfr)

96 I don't really get the hate Last Action Hero gets. I mean, it's not cinematic masterpiece, but it's kind of fun.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:27 PM (cw9vy)

When I saw it as a kid, it seemed... well completely fake at even what it was trying to do. It was not out to entertain me whatsoever and succeeded admirably.

Pick a lane. Try to say something or parody action movie tropes.

I paid to see this btw.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:30 PM (di6C2)

97 Speaking of adaptations, finished watching Langoliers yesterday. It looks like a made for tv movie. Cuz it is!

I've only read a few King books, and the ones I have read, I'm of the view Kubrick's The Shining is stupid garbage, even though I know that's not a poopular view (King hates it). The Stand? Eh, it's faithful, but still has that made for tv look about it.

This Langoliers thing is just dumb and pointless, and the best part of the whole 3 hour film is the very last shot. It's funny, whether it was intentional or not.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:31 PM (cw9vy)

98 I liked the first new Dune movie. Haven't watched the second part yet but I read they did stray from the book at the end.
Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:27 PM (inGXk)

I just purchased Dune 2 ...

I'll get around to it later tonight after the Leafs vs Bruins game.

Posted by: browndog had time on his hands at May 04, 2024 08:31 PM (TTAGa)

99 Give me Tim Curry as LJS in Muppet Treasure Island any day of the week!
Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 08:26 PM (Lhaco)

Muppets make everything better.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:31 PM (1Yy3c)

100 98 I just purchased Dune 2 ...

I'll get around to it later tonight after the Leafs vs Bruins game.
Posted by: browndog had time on his hands at May 04, 2024 08:31 PM (TTAGa)

=======

I get my 4K disc in 10 days.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (GBKbO)

101 John Carter by Disney. Could have been very successful, but it wasn't nearly woke enough for them to promote.

Posted by: goofy at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (Z7BHa)

102 Watch the one with Christian Bale and Charleton Heston, it's really good (imho).
Posted by: browndog had time on his hands at May 04, 2024 08:29 PM (TTAGa)

I liked that one.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (inGXk)

103 Give me Tim Curry as LJS in Muppet Treasure Island any day of the week!
Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 08:26 PM (Lhaco)
----

Who wants Muppet Conan? I do.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (FkUwd)

104 And then there's Chani whom they changed for dumb purposes and doesn't work.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda

Yeah, the changes of Chani kind of bothered me since I reread the books leading up to the release of part 2. Not sure how he's going to square that with where things go in Messiah.

Posted by: She Hobbit at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (ftFVW)

105 Well that film was kermingled in more than a few ways including two intros

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:33 PM (PXvVL)

106 John Carter by Disney. Could have been very successful, but it wasn't nearly woke enough for them to promote.
Posted by: goofy at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (Z7BHa)
----------
Who here would rather have seen James Purefoy as Captain Carter rather than Kantos Kan?

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:33 PM (Be/+i)

107 101 John Carter by Disney. Could have been very successful, but it wasn't nearly woke enough for them to promote.
Posted by: goofy at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (Z7BHa)

And fairly faithful to the book.

Plus, the Dejah Thoris they got was hot as hell.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:33 PM (di6C2)

108 101 John Carter by Disney. Could have been very successful, but it wasn't nearly woke enough for them to promote.
Posted by: goofy at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (Z7BHa)

========

The problem with that marketing campaign was that they gave control of it to the director, Andrew Stanton.

The trailers were generally terrible and gave no idea as to what the film was about while assuming some kind of deep appreciation of a public domain property that hadn't been directly in the cultural limelight for decades.

It might have had a better shot if Disney's actual marketing team had been in control.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:33 PM (GBKbO)

109 The dude that speaks just before Conan says, "The open steppe, a fleet horse, falcons at your wrist and the wind in your hair."

And honestly that sounds great to me.
Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:29 PM (1Yy3c)

Meh, if there aren't lamentations of the women, I don't see the point of living.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:34 PM (cw9vy)

110 Never saw Last Action Hero all the way through. But the sequence near the beginning where the kid imagines Arnie doing Hamlet is a delight. I can't imagine how many takes must have been required to get that on film, because seems to me half the crew would have been rolling on the floor during the shoot.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 08:34 PM (q3u5l)

111 And then there's Chani whom they changed for dumb purposes and doesn't work.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:30 PM (GBKbO)

That's the character played by Zendaya, right?

Zendaya sucks.

Fuck Zendaya.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:34 PM (1Yy3c)

112 John Carter by Disney. Could have been very successful, but it wasn't nearly woke enough for them to promote.
Posted by: goofy

I liked John Carter when I found out it was a a current film based on what people thought science fiction was a hundred years ago. Plus I like the actor, Taylor or Tyler Kitsch I think?

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 04, 2024 08:34 PM (Cp1vk)

113 And it is so obvious that the movie was made in another time. They give Thoris a bit more agency than the books, but they also play on the fact that she is hot enough to want to fight a World for.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:34 PM (di6C2)

114 Who wants Muppet Conan? I do.
Posted by: All Hail Eris

*raises hand vigorously*

I also want to see the full puppet Dracula from the end of Forgetting Sarah Marshall.

Posted by: She Hobbit at May 04, 2024 08:35 PM (ftFVW)

115 I'll get around to it later tonight after the Leafs vs Bruins game.
Posted by: browndog had time on his hands at May 04, 2024 08:31 PM (TTAGa)

Spoiler alert:

Bruins lose 3-2

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:35 PM (cw9vy)

116 >>>>Watch the one with Christian Bale and Charleton Heston, it's really good

Turner Classic Movies showed this last year. It's was OK. A little long, over two hours.

Posted by: Mark1971 at May 04, 2024 08:35 PM (xPl2J)

117 Yeah, the changes of Chani kind of bothered me since I reread the books leading up to the release of part 2. Not sure how he's going to square that with where things go in Messiah.
Posted by: She Hobbit at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (ftFVW)
------------
They certainly time-compressed the events in Dune 2. Alia is still in utero at the end of the movie, when in the book, several years have passed, Paul and Chani had already had a son who was killed in the Harkonnen attack on Sietch Tabr, and Alia's already got a rep as an abomination.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:35 PM (Be/+i)

118 Yes leaving out the whole mars component in the marketing

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:36 PM (PXvVL)

119 112 I liked John Carter when I found out it was a a current film based on what people thought science fiction was a hundred years ago. Plus I like the actor, Taylor or Tyler Kitsch I think?
Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 04, 2024 08:34 PM (Cp1vk)

=======

There was some crackpot astronomer who thought he saw running rivers of water on Mars in the early 20th century. Edgar Rice Burroughs read this theory, latched onto it, and ran with it. I don't think he considered what he was writing to be anything other than crazy fantasy stuff, but there was, sort of, a scientific basis for it. But not really.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:36 PM (GBKbO)

120 "John Carter" is not a very faithful adaption as regards the character of Carter himself, but I still found it very enjoyable and loved the Amazing Stories aesthetic.

It was just horribly expensive and poorly marketed.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:36 PM (FkUwd)

121 107 101 John Carter by Disney. Could have been very successful, but it wasn't nearly woke enough for them to promote.
Posted by: goofy at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (Z7BHa)

And fairly faithful to the book.

Plus, the Dejah Thoris they got was hot as hell.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:33 PM (di6C2)

This opinion is factual and correct.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:37 PM (1Yy3c)

122 Plus, the Dejah Thoris they got was hot as hell.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:33 PM (di6C2)

That she was.

Producers and directors, please to notice that she was not a waif ... she was round in all the right places.

Posted by: browndog remembers ... ahhooo hubba hubba at May 04, 2024 08:37 PM (TTAGa)

123 Percival lowell who inspired wells and burroughs

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:37 PM (PXvVL)

124
The dude that speaks just before Conan says, "The open steppe, a fleet horse, falcons at your wrist and the wind in your hair."

And honestly that sounds great to me.
Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:29 PM (1Yy3c)

Dat ist because you are a Little Girly Man, Schweinhund!!!

Posted by: Ah-nold the Destroyer at May 04, 2024 08:37 PM (S6gqv)

125 Never saw Last Action Hero all the way through. But the sequence near the beginning where the kid imagines Arnie doing Hamlet is a delight. I can't imagine how many takes must have been required to get that on film, because seems to me half the crew would have been rolling on the floor during the shoot.
Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 08:34 PM (q3u5l)

The whole thing sorta reminds me of Hudson Hawk in that way.

Is the movie schock? Sure it is, but they obviously had fun making it, and I get some enjoyment from that fact alone.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:38 PM (cw9vy)

126 Who here would rather have seen James Purefoy as Captain Carter rather than Kantos Kan?
Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:33 PM (Be/+i)

I liked Kan enough in the role that I don't know if Purefoy would had made a difference. That said some people who have read the book a movie is based on ,including me , have a picture in their head of what the character should look like.

I've never watched American Assassin because I didn't like anyone they cast in that movie.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:38 PM (inGXk)

127 They went more steampunk western until the first hour

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:38 PM (PXvVL)

128 Muppetized Angel the Vampire was one of the funniest "Angel" episodes ever.

"You're a wee little puppet man!"

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:38 PM (FkUwd)

129 127 They went more steampunk western until the first hour
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:38 PM (PXvVL)

That was that abomination with Daniel Craig and Harrison Ford: Cowboys and Aliens

Posted by: browndog remembers ... ahhooo hubba hubba at May 04, 2024 08:40 PM (TTAGa)

130 I am watching Plan 9 From Outer Space via Rifftrax. *chef's kiss*

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Live from Missoula at May 04, 2024 08:40 PM (gPzkP)

131 There was some crackpot astronomer who thought he saw running rivers of water on Mars in the early 20th century. Edgar Rice Burroughs read this theory, latched onto it, and ran with it. I don't think he considered what he was writing to be anything other than crazy fantasy stuff, but there was, sort of, a scientific basis for it. But not really.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:36 PM (GBKbO)
------------
The "crackpot astronomer" was Schiaparelli, who contributed mightily to the naming of features of Mars and the Moon. He observed what he thought to be linear features and called them "canali," "channels." This was mistranslated into English as "canals," which caused much hilarity.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:41 PM (Be/+i)

132 120 "John Carter" is not a very faithful adaption as regards the character of Carter himself, but I still found it very enjoyable and loved the Amazing Stories aesthetic.

It was just horribly expensive and poorly marketed.
Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:36 PM (FkUwd)

The character of John Carter is kind of blank in the books. He is resolute Hero Man. This is not unusual for the time period- especially for books of this type. Does Aragorn in the books really agonize over his destiny? NO. He does not. It is a much more fleshed out character in the those movies and works well (fairly.)

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:41 PM (di6C2)

133 Muppetized Angel the Vampire was one of the funniest "Angel" episodes ever.

"You're a wee little puppet man!"
Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:38 PM (FkUwd)
---
Yes it was.

Though the puppet sticking his hand in the back of the human to control him was a bit disturbing and weird.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:41 PM (BpYfr)

134 Producers and directors, please to notice that she was not a waif ... she was round in all the right places.
Posted by: browndog remembers ... ahhooo hubba hubba at May 04, 2024 08:37 PM (TTAGa)

Good voice too.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:42 PM (di6C2)

135 131 The "crackpot astronomer" was Schiaparelli, who contributed mightily to the naming of features of Mars and the Moon. He observed what he thought to be linear features and called them "canali," "channels." This was mistranslated into English as "canals," which caused much hilarity.
Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:41 PM (Be/+i)

========

You know, I remember reading the thing about the mistranslation being the source of the error. And yet, it didn't come to mind when I tried to recall my Burroughs apocrypha.

Thanks for the correction. I feel silly.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:42 PM (GBKbO)

136 Pug, I saw that in the theater some years ago. Rifftrax in a crowded theater with other Misties is the way to go.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:42 PM (FkUwd)

137 I also want to see the full puppet Dracula from the end of Forgetting Sarah Marshall.
Posted by: She Hobbit at May 04, 2024 08:35 PM (ftFVW)

Hah I thought the same thing . Muppet tech also help make Farscape a fan favorite.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:43 PM (inGXk)

138 Using DDG to see if I could download Be Happy, These Two Lovers the very first choice presented was ----- >

Be Happy, These Two Lovers - David Vining, Author
Apr 18, 2024

Posted by: Braenyard at May 04, 2024 08:43 PM (lCWOD)

139 Does Aragorn in the books really agonize over his destiny? NO. He does not. It is a much more fleshed out character in the those movies and works well (fairly.)
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:41 PM (di6C2)

I think that's what bothers me most about Jax's films. Everyone agonizes.

Oh just shut up and do your thing. The world is at stake.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:43 PM (cw9vy)

140 138 Using DDG to see if I could download Be Happy, These Two Lovers the very first choice presented was ----- >

Be Happy, These Two Lovers - David Vining, Author
Apr 18, 2024
Posted by: Braenyard at May 04, 2024 08:43 PM (lCWOD)

=======

Sounds like an ass! Don't click!

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:43 PM (GBKbO)

141 138 Using DDG to see if I could download Be Happy, These Two Lovers the very first choice presented was ----- >

Be Happy, These Two Lovers - David Vining, Author
Apr 18, 2024
Posted by: Braenyard at May 04, 2024 08:43 PM (lCWOD)

Obligatory:

I don't get it ...

Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:44 PM (TTAGa)

142 Though the puppet sticking his hand in the back of the human to control him was a bit disturbing and weird.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:41 PM (BpYfr)

But enough about Joe Biden...

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:44 PM (cw9vy)

143 David Vining, Author
Apr 18, 2024
Posted by: Braenyard at May 04, 2024 08:43 PM (lCWOD)

Hack, just ignore him. Better to focus on the righteous and true opinions of the collected Moron Horde.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:45 PM (1Yy3c)

144 And c &a was a john favreau film

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:45 PM (PXvVL)

145 Re: John Carter

I still wonder if Disney could have recovered from their blunder if they'd just named the movie "John Carter of Mars."

Those last two words give you a proper sense that this movie is out of this world.

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:45 PM (BpYfr)

146 Decided to go with the CBC feed for tonight's game.

There's no Bob Cole, but it's still a damn sight better then ABC.

Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:46 PM (TTAGa)

147 I think that's what bothers me most about Jax's films. Everyone agonizes.

Oh just shut up and do your thing. The world is at stake.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:43 PM (cw9vy)

Aragorn in the books is not king- and that's ok. It is not his time yet. When it is time, that is what he does- because it is his duty. He does not agonize over his fate or whether he is a good enough man. He is what he is.

Modern characterization has the same cast iron tropes, they are just different from what they used to be.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:46 PM (di6C2)

148 I still wonder if Disney could have recovered from their blunder if they'd just named the movie "John Carter of Mars."

Those last two words give you a proper sense that this movie is out of this world.
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:45 PM (BpYfr)
-----------
They didn't do it until the end title of the movie. Sad.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:46 PM (Be/+i)

149 144 And c &a was a john favreau film
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:45 PM (PXvVL)

Was it really ???

Well, he redeemed himself with the Iron Man series.

Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:47 PM (TTAGa)

150 Another week without mention of the greatness that is Summer School starring Mark Harmon. Sad.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at May 04, 2024 08:47 PM (u73oe)

151 Aragorn in the books is not king- and that's ok. It is not his time yet. When it is time, that is what he does- because it is his duty. He does not agonize over his fate or whether he is a good enough man. He is what he is.
---------
He also had been working toward that goal for sixty-eight frickin' *years*. That's single-mindedness.

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:47 PM (Be/+i)

152 He was also working from the graphic novel

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:48 PM (PXvVL)

153 Okay, I'm out.

I'm going to watch Lethal Weapon which is a movie I haven't seen since...shiiiiiiiiit...I don't think I've seen it once in this century.

*Pours himself a drink*

I'm gettin' too old for dis shit.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:48 PM (1Yy3c)

154 150 Another week without mention of the greatness that is Summer School starring Mark Harmon. Sad.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at May 04, 2024 08:47 PM (u73oe)

I'd rather think about his sister, the one who did the Tic Tac ads.

She was cute ...

Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:48 PM (TTAGa)

155 One thing I notice about Plan 9 is that one of the cops looks a lot like Joe lo Truglio from Brooklyn 99.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Live from Missoula at May 04, 2024 08:48 PM (gPzkP)

156 Okay I just watched that puppet Dracula musical and yes it needs to be a full length movie.

Plus Bill Hader!

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:48 PM (FkUwd)

157 To be fair, Polidouris ripped off Prokofiev.
Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:20 PM (FkUwd)'

Polidouris said openly that he spent years studying the great composers to get a feel for their work. In the pieces with a vocal chorus (such as "Riders of Doom") he said he was directly inspired by Karl Orff, most well known for "Carmina Burana".

this clip has a GOT battle scene set to "Riders of Doom", it works great for any battle.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wYikkFnbQ8

Posted by: Ah-nold the Destroyer at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (S6gqv)

158 I'm naming my next cat Sisu.

Posted by: Eromero at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (NxC5+)

159 Another week without mention of the greatness that is Summer School starring Mark Harmon. Sad.
Posted by: Duke Lowell at May 04, 2024 08:47 PM (u73oe)

Mom waiting for someone to do an in depth review of the complete Emmanuel series of films.

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (1Yy3c)

160 Modern characterization has the same cast iron tropes, they are just different from what they used to be.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:46 PM (di6C2)

I would go so far as to suggest this is a fundamental difference in meat space, as much as it is in fiction.

Considering Tolkien's time, men did what men are supposed to do, and so did the women.

These days, everyone has to let the world know how much of a struggle it is for them, and you should give them all sorts of space to emote, because you hater you.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (cw9vy)

161 152 He was also working from the graphic novel
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:48 PM (PXvVL)

Shoulda got the guy who did "Sin City" then ...

Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (TTAGa)

162 *Pours himself a drink*

I'm gettin' too old for dis shit.
Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:48 PM (1Yy3c)

The sad thing: When you realize that Murtagh might be younger than you are now.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (di6C2)

163 Okay, now I'm out.

Night!

Posted by: Robert at May 04, 2024 08:50 PM (1Yy3c)

164 Shoulda got the guy who did "Sin City" then ...
Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (TTAGa)

Sin City and 300 were lightning in a bottle. The right time, the right directors and good stuff (although some of the themes in Sin are... odd and 300 has the whole raping of Leonidas' wife which kind of pisses me off, but anyway.)

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:51 PM (di6C2)

165 Ah, Robert E Howard movies! I also own all 6. ....And 8 Del Rey collections of his original short stories. And the entire 10 omnibus run of the Marvel Conan the Barbarian comics, all 8 of the (published thus far) Savage Sword of Conan omnibuses, the 3 Kull Omnibuses, the singular Solomon Kane Omnibus... (deep breath) ...And the Red Sonja Mavel years omnibus, the 5 Red Sonja: She-Devil with a Sword omnibuses from Dynamite, assorted other Red Sonja comics, about 6 omnibuses of the Dark Horse Conan run. The first tpb of the current Conan comics from Titan, and the first issue of the revived Savage Sword of Conan magazine.

...I'm a little bit obsessive on the topic.

I really wish the movies were better. Only the first Conan and the Solomon Kane movies are truly good, but neither really catch the feel of REH.

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 08:51 PM (Lhaco)

166 Night Robert.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:51 PM (di6C2)

167 When you don't have the lighting?

You get The Spirit.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:51 PM (di6C2)

168 The sad thing: When you realize that Murtagh might be younger than you are now.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (di6C2)

———————

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuck

Posted by: Duke Lowell at May 04, 2024 08:51 PM (u73oe)

169 Weird. Just got an automated message from an agency in Colorado that my son last used almost 2 years ago, reminding me they will be closed for the Labor Day holiday.

There's a glitch in the matrix.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:52 PM (cw9vy)

170 I really wish the movies were better. Only the first Conan and the Solomon Kane movies are truly good, but neither really catch the feel of REH.
Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 08:51 PM (Lhaco)

Might have to check out the Solomon Kane movies...

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:52 PM (di6C2)

171 The sad thing: When you realize that Murtagh might be younger than you are now.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (di6C2)

Murtagh ... Danny Murtaugh ???

My Grampa's favorite baseball manager. Go Bucco's ...

Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:52 PM (TTAGa)

172 Omg that was terrible and samuel jackson and scarlet johansen yikes

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:52 PM (PXvVL)

173 Might have to check out the Solomon Kane movies...
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:52 PM (di6C2)

Give the 1st one time to get going ...

Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:52 PM (TTAGa)

174 Arnold's best acting movie probably True Lies. Also probably his best movie also.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:53 PM (inGXk)

175 Whew. Murtagh is 50 in the first Lethal Weapon.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:53 PM (di6C2)

176 I see that

Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:53 PM (PXvVL)

177 Dinner's up! Ta!

Posted by: Captain Obvious, Laird o' the Sea, Radioactive Knight at May 04, 2024 08:54 PM (Be/+i)

178 The sad thing: When you realize that Murtagh might be younger than you are now.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:49 PM (di6C2)

You...monster!

Posted by: Robert really is out...movie's on! at May 04, 2024 08:54 PM (1Yy3c)

179 I only vaguely recall Solomon Kane and my recollection was that it was *terrible*

Posted by: 18-1 at May 04, 2024 08:54 PM (ibTVg)

180 The character of John Carter is kind of blank in the books.

For a reason.

Posted by: isekai at May 04, 2024 08:54 PM (gKWVE)

181 Murtagh ... Danny Murtaugh ???

My Grampa's favorite baseball manager. Go Bucco's ...
Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:52 PM (TTAGa)

I bet your grampy would have a thing or two to say about how and why some managers end up in the Hall of Fame, and some don't.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:54 PM (cw9vy)

182 "True Lies" seemed mean spirited to me. Never saw it a second time.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:55 PM (FkUwd)

183 I bet your grampy would have a thing or two to say about how and why some managers end up in the Hall of Fame, and some don't.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:54 PM (cw9vy)

That old boy scared the hell out of me.

I was an Indians fan, and he had no linking for the junior circuit.

But yes, yes he would ...

Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:56 PM (TTAGa)

184 "True Lies" seemed mean spirited to me. Never saw it a second time.
Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 08:55 PM (FkUwd)

I can see that. I don't like it, but didn't really know exactly why, until you put it that way.

Him and his wife are playing games with their marriage.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:57 PM (cw9vy)

185 If you're digging the Rifftrax, YouTube has several channels that run MST3K episodes and Rifftrax, sans commercials.

Currently up: Starfighters starring B-1 Bob Dornan.

Laaaaa la la laaaaa

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 04, 2024 08:57 PM (Cp1vk)

186 174 Arnold's best acting movie probably True Lies. Also probably his best movie also.
Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:53 PM (inGXk)

I think it is one of the best put together movies. Everyone does a great job.

'You're new on Harry's team, aren't you?' 'Uh, yeah.' 'Then what makes you think the slack I cut him in any way extends to you?'

'The guy is a G**ddammned used car salesman!'

'I have to lie to women to get them to sleep with me! I got a little dick- it's pathetic!'

'They call him the Sandspider.' 'Why?' 'Probably because it sounds scary.'

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:57 PM (di6C2)

187 53 Futurama - 1950's Super Panavision 70

youtube.com/watch?v=eSq26Owny68
Posted by: Moron Robbie - Little girls dreamt of being moms, women told them not to follow their dreams at May 04, 2024 08:11 PM (YsjiM)
----
That's creepy, weird, and awesome at the same time. Leela looks bizarre. Zoidberg is hideous. Amy is suitably hot.

ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD!
Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:16 PM (BpYfr)

LOL I love that take on it too!!!

Posted by: Ah-nold the Destroyer at May 04, 2024 08:57 PM (S6gqv)

188 Off Ah-nold sock!

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 08:59 PM (S6gqv)

189 Whew. Murtagh is 50 in the first Lethal Weapon.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:53 PM (di6C2)
----
Uh, somehow that doesn't make me feel better...(that's what I'll be turning later this year)

Posted by: "Perfessor" Squirrel at May 04, 2024 08:59 PM (BpYfr)

190 For a reason.
Posted by: isekai at May 04, 2024 08:54 PM (gKWVE)

Valid, but that is kind of pre-genre. Well, it is completely pre-genre. Sort of.

The tropes people accuse Tolkien of indulging in HE created, so are they really tropes?

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:59 PM (di6C2)

191 Plan 9: The pilot's wife looks like Jim Parsons.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Live from Missoula at May 04, 2024 08:59 PM (gPzkP)

192 I was an Indians fan, and he had no linking for the junior circuit.

But yes, yes he would ...
Posted by: browndog stealing lines like Carlos Mencia at May 04, 2024 08:56 PM (TTAGa)

Ah! Then here's two for that subject: Sam McDowell and Albert Belle.

Both should be enshrined. The interesting question worth asking, considering the period of greatness by Koufax in that era: How much better was Koufax, than McDowell.

I would argue, not much at all. If any.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:59 PM (cw9vy)

193 Sin City and 300 were lightning in a bottle. The right time, the right directors and good stuff (although some of the themes in Sin are... odd and 300 has the whole raping of Leonidas' wife which kind of pisses me off, but anyway.)

The second 300 movie was terrible. And its odd because you could make a ton of interesting movies about the various Greek on Greek wars between the Persian war and the Romans coming in...

And then another "interesting" Snyder film like Sin City was Sucker Punch but the underlying story is so damn dark (and prior to Epstein just too unbelievable right?). He basically made an anime movie in live action that didn't seem ridiculous...

Posted by: 18-1 at May 04, 2024 09:00 PM (ibTVg)

194 the unique approach to magic and evil.

The magic is people don't know we're evil.

Posted by: Big Penguin at May 04, 2024 09:00 PM (a3Q+t)

195 Milius's Conan captures the spirit of the Conan stories. That's enough.

Destroyer is just awful. Robert Jordan 's novelization is actually much better, gives it that Conan feel.

I haven't even bothered with the Mamoa one. Faithful adaptation or note, he's only in shit films in general (when he's the lead anyway), and I'm not wasting more time on him.

I've read a fair amount of Howard (all Conan, some horror, some pulp), but no Kull or Kane. So I have no frame of reference. I've seen neither movie. Won't bother. Sorbo wears an even bigger "kick me" sign than Mamoa. And Kane more or less doesn't appeal.

Posted by: What Is Best at May 04, 2024 09:00 PM (B2Hcq)

196 Other than switching the places of the Milius and Nispel "Barbarians", I agree with everything you said.
I would say Nispel is more faithful, but Milius is more enjoyable anyway.

Posted by: Sam at May 04, 2024 09:00 PM (7jMef)

197 In defense of some of the lesser REH movies:

Conan the Destroyer actually works if you view it as a Dungeons and Dragons movie. A party goes on a quest to raid a dungeon and steal a treasure to secure the fate of the world. And the party is full of standard fantasy-fiction archetypes: The Barbarian, the Thief, the Wizard, the Cleric/Priestess, the Ranger/Barbarian, and the Paladan/Knight/Barbarian.

The Kull movie just feels like a side project from Hercules: The Legendary Journeys. Replace the Greek backdrop with non-descriptly medeval setting, throw in a few guitar riffs...I kinda wish they had gone harder with the guitar, though.

I don't have much good to say about the most recent Conan movie. There are a handful of decent moments, but it's suffused with modern-movie tropes and attitudes which just kills any interest I try to muster.

The Red Sonja movie doesn't have much going for it, either. Which is a pity, because I wish it did. I'm almost tempted to re-watch the Red Sonja episode of the Conan TV show, because they at least tried (red-head, in a red-leather bikini) and showed some enthusiasm for the project.

Such a pity. The REH character deserve so much better..

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 09:01 PM (Lhaco)

198 Milius is one of those directors that churned out hit after hit but since his politics wasn't left I suspect this legacy isn't as mentioned as it would have been otherwise...

Posted by: 18-1 at May 04, 2024 09:01 PM (ibTVg)

199 True Lies kinda lost me at Arnie's treatment of Jamie Lee Curtis.

Think he was at his best in the first Terminator and in Predator. (And of course in the Hamlet sequence of Last Action Hero)

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 09:02 PM (q3u5l)

200 Seems the the CBC feed is about 10-15 seconds ahead of ABCs

1:00 to go in the 1st

0-0

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:02 PM (TTAGa)

201 199 True Lies kinda lost me at Arnie's treatment of Jamie Lee Curtis.

Think he was at his best in the first Terminator and in Predator. (And of course in the Hamlet sequence of Last Action Hero)

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 09:02 PM (q3u5l)

Hmmm, I think it is all right until he has her brought in and interrogated. That bridging section between the two parts of the movie is over the top (even if it includes the strip tease*.) But the second half of the movie is just cheesy bananas.

*think of Jamie Lee Curtis now.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:05 PM (di6C2)

202 123 Percival lowell who inspired wells and burroughs
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:37 PM (PXvVL)

If you're in Flagstaff, Az, there's a wonderful observatory in the mountains outside of town which was built by Percival Lowell and is still operating; it's where he made all of his observations and one could say it's almost kind of a shrine to him now.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:05 PM (S6gqv)

203 Regarding the soundtracks: I bought the score of both Barbarian and Destroyer off iTunes, and I use them as a (randomized) soundtrack for whenever I'm reading a high-fantasy comic or novel. Great work, on each of the movies.

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 09:06 PM (Lhaco)

204 Coming soon: Britney Griner, in "Nocans, the Dribbler."

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at May 04, 2024 09:07 PM (8zz6B)

205 111 And then there's Chani whom they changed for dumb purposes and doesn't work.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:30 PM (GBKbO)

That's the character played by Zendaya, right?

Zendaya sucks.

Fuck Zendaya.
Posted by: Robert

Yep. Haven't seen the latest Dune attempt. I'll get around to it. They keep trying to make Zendaya a thing. She's not. Can't act. A modern version of Jessica Alba except Alba is an absolute smokeshow of a woman. Zendaya is cute but Alba, damn, she was something. She can't act either.

Posted by: Puddleglum at work at May 04, 2024 09:08 PM (+J/Au)

206 Hmmm, I think it is all right until he has her brought in and interrogated. That bridging section between the two parts of the movie is over the top (even if it includes the strip tease*.) But the second half of the movie is just cheesy bananas.

*think of Jamie Lee Curtis now.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:05 PM (di6C2)

Curtis has a prominent role in the teevee show, Scream Queens, which was a real hoot (first season, at least). She's terrific in it, but yeah, no. Not sexy.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:08 PM (cw9vy)

207 198 Milius is one of those directors that churned out hit after hit but since his politics wasn't left I suspect this legacy isn't as mentioned as it would have been otherwise...
Posted by: 18-1 at May 04, 2024 09:01 PM (ibTVg)

Obligatory - watch the Big Lebowski. The Coen bros were good friends with Milius, and everyone in Hollywood who knew him agreed that Walter Sobchak IS John Milius. Brilliant, insightful, vast amounts of knowledge, and also impossible to work with and completely out of his fucking gourd most of the time. That's why he didn't do any more work than he did.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:08 PM (S6gqv)

208 78 I will agree that Mako was the best of the bunch in Conan.
Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 08:25 PM (inGXk)

It blew my mind when I re-watched Conan the Barbarian after Avatar: The Last Airbender (animated) debuted. It took me a moment to actually make the connection, but once I figured out that the opening narration was being done by Uncle Iroh.... Well, lets just say that both properties became a whole lot more epic.

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 09:10 PM (Lhaco)

209 I shall sprechen blasphemous in saying that I care not a sheisse about the source material with re: the original Conan the barbarian movie.

It was absolutely bonkers to see it in the theater as a lad, and will always be one of my favorite So Bad It's Classic Movies of AllTime. Just nuts from beginning to end and I loved it.

So there ya go.

Posted by: Sharkman at May 04, 2024 09:10 PM (/RHNq)

210 Been watching a few videos from the Critical Drinker lately. Very entertaining.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at May 04, 2024 09:10 PM (u73oe)

211 207 Obligatory - watch the Big Lebowski. The Coen bros were good friends with Milius, and everyone in Hollywood who knew him agreed that Walter Sobchak IS John Milius. Brilliant, insightful, vast amounts of knowledge, and also impossible to work with and completely out of his fucking gourd most of the time. That's why he didn't do any more work than he did.
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:08 PM (S6gqv)

========

And then he got very sick.

I'm actually surprised the 4K discs of Conan the Barbarian came out while he was alive. The Directors Guild requires that directors approve new scans of films for home video, and 4K requires new scans (first for the scan itself and then for any sort of extra pass like HDR, which Conan does have). I was surprised that they were able to find time with him for it.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:11 PM (GBKbO)

212 A bio-pic of the life of Robert E. Howard would make for an interesting psychological drama. He lived in a small Texas town all his life, couldn't hold down a steady job, eaked out a living compulsively hammering out short stories for shady pulp publications, and committed suicide at 34 due to the death of his mother.

Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at May 04, 2024 09:11 PM (Js20g)

213 One day Hollywood will make the Kane series by Karl Edward Wagner.

And they will screw it up too.

Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 09:11 PM (D7oie)

214 How much better was Koufax, than McDowell.

I would argue, not much at all. If any.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 08:59 PM (cw9vy)

The Sudden One was every bit the equal of Sandy. The two problems were:
1) Sam played in Cleveland, on a pedestrian team
2) He had a problem with booze

Annnnd, he had a propensity to want to throw a curve ball at the wrong damn time,

As to Albert Belle … my man! There was no scarier batter to have to face for that brief period of time in the mid 90s. My favorite moment of his was when he came out of the dugout, after hitting a home run, and flexing one bicep - as if to say o don’t need to cork my bat to beat your ass.

I contend that had the season not been cancelled in ‘94, the Tribe would have gone to the playoffs, and had every reason to be considered favorites to win it all.

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:13 PM (TTAGa)

215 Can't recall seeing Mako in anything where he wasn't fun to watch. If you haven't caught them before, check out The Sand Pebbles, a Chuck Norris flick called An Eye for an Eye, and a made-for-tv movie with Darren McGavin called The Challenge. Mako was terrific in all three.

And I think he did a guest shot in an episode of MASH where he put Alda and Farrell in their places quite nicely. Could be remembering wrong on that one though.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 09:15 PM (q3u5l)

216 I think all the Asian actors working at the time did guest shots on M*A*S*H

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 09:16 PM (/7KEl)

217 The Sudden One was every bit the equal of Sandy. The two problems were:
1) Sam played in Cleveland, on a pedestrian team
2) He had a problem with booze

Annnnd, he had a propensity to want to throw a curve ball at the wrong damn time,

As to Albert Belle … my man! There was no scarier batter to have to face for that brief period of time in the mid 90s. My favorite moment of his was when he came out of the dugout, after hitting a home run, and flexing one bicep - as if to say o don’t need to cork my bat to beat your ass.

I contend that had the season not been cancelled in ‘94, the Tribe would have gone to the playoffs, and had every reason to be considered favorites to win it all.
Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:13 PM (TTAGa)

I'm not sure where the fences were when McDowell was pitching, but considering park differences, I think a lot of what Koufax is credited for is at least in part skewed by Dodger Stadium.

As for Belle, he was a jerk. No other way to describe it, but even with the abbreviated career, there's no damn reason for him not to be in Cooperstown.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:16 PM (cw9vy)

218 Jack Soo

and he was in Barney Miller too

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 09:17 PM (/7KEl)

219 101 John Carter by Disney. Could have been very successful, but it wasn't nearly woke enough for them to promote.
Posted by: goofy at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (Z7BHa)

I had just read Princess of Mars for the first time when that movie became a thing. Its failure angered me to no end. First and foremost, the marketing: I understand changing the name from 'Princess of Mars' to 'John Carter of Mars.' But to call it simply 'John Carter'? That just missed the whole point of the movie! They even had a big JCM (the acronym of John Carter of Mars) in the logo! But for some inexplicable reason they dropped the 'of Mars'....

One very interesting aspect of that book/film: there is only one Green Martian who is a genuinely good person. And the difference between her and everyone else? She knew her father. All the other Green Martians are raised collectively, but she was raised knowing who her father was. He wasn't even particularly kind or gentle: he was just there, and generally looked out for her. And that was all the difference between bloodthirsty beasts and a person of compassion.

That could have been such a 'subversive' message had the movie chosen to focus on it...

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 09:18 PM (Lhaco)

220 A bio-pic of the life of Robert E. Howard would make for an interesting psychological drama

I doubt they could do that for HPL. As soon as he calls his cat over for mealtimes, the theatre will get bomb threats . . .

Posted by: gKWVE at May 04, 2024 09:18 PM (gKWVE)

221 I was surprised that they were able to find time with him for it.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:11 PM (GBKbO)

I want to add - was it you who said you met John Goodman in NYC years ago as a bartender, or was that JJ Sefton? Anyway I think Goodman's portrayal of Sobchak is the best performance he did in any of his movies. He's perfect in the role.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:21 PM (S6gqv)

222 A bio-pic of the life of Robert E. Howard would make for an interesting psychological drama.
Posted by: Idaho Spudboy

Do you trust anything connected to H-wood at this point in time to do anything like that?

Posted by: weft Carnac at May 04, 2024 09:21 PM (IG4Id)

223 107 101 John Carter by Disney. Could have been very successful, but it wasn't nearly woke enough for them to promote.
Posted by: goofy at May 04, 2024 08:32 PM (Z7BHa)

And fairly faithful to the book.

Plus, the Dejah Thoris they got was hot as hell.
Posted by: Aetius451AD

Lynn Collins

Posted by: Puddleglum at work at May 04, 2024 09:22 PM (+J/Au)

224 130 I am watching Plan 9 From Outer Space via Rifftrax. *chef's kiss*
Posted by: Pug Mahon, Live from Missoula at May 04, 2024 08:40 PM (gPzkP)

Best way to watch a lot of movies! It's not one of their breakout hits, but I love their presentation of Sunset Strip. It comes with a new way to be silly (but still engaging) every 10 minutes or so.

Personally, I put it right up there with Miami Connection....

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 09:24 PM (Lhaco)

225 "John Carter" held some kind of record for being a Disney corporate train wreck. It should have been titled "John Carter of Mars" but the Disney suits had just had a minor flop with the juvenile fantasy "Mars Needs Moms" and decided the word "Mars" must be box office poison.
Supposedly, when the movie was released, searching for "John Carter" would only bring up references to one of the characters on the hit TV show "E.R."

Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at May 04, 2024 09:27 PM (Js20g)

226 "... and a made-for-tv movie with Darren McGavin called The Challenge..."
----

I've been watching those old made-for-tv movies on YouTube. They're usually only an hour and fifteen minutes and a good way to unwind before bed. "The Challenge" was a pretty decent Cold War tale of two men selected to fight as proxies for their nations on a tiny island.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 09:27 PM (FkUwd)

227 I know nothing about the Conan films but the pic of Mr. Howard's mug could kick off a decade's worth of film noir treatments.

Posted by: Tonypete at May 04, 2024 09:29 PM (WXNFJ)

228 And re: The Challenge

When I watched it again a few years ago, I just about didn't recognize Sam Elliott without the mustache.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 09:29 PM (q3u5l)

229 I'm not sure where the fences were when McDowell was pitching, but considering park differences, I think a lot of what Koufax is credited for is at least in part skewed by Dodger Stadium.

As for Belle, he was a jerk. No other way to describe it, but even with the abbreviated career, there's no damn reason for him not to be in Cooperstown.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:16 PM (cw9vy)

Fences were 385 / 400 / 385 … with the foul poles being 325.

Albert was not fan friendly to be sure, but I sure loved him in a Tribe uni …

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:31 PM (TTAGa)

230 I always pictured Robert E. Howard looking like Dan Harmon at the end of the third season of Community.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Live from Missoula at May 04, 2024 09:32 PM (gPzkP)

231 And it is so obvious that the movie was made in another time. They give Thoris a bit more agency than the books, but they also play on the fact that she is hot enough to want to fight a World for.
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 08:34 PM (di6C2)

The mix of practical effects and CGI was excellent, and the whole concept of the Lightflyers was fantastic. Technically it was a wonderful movie, and some of the actors were inspired choices for the roles.

Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 09:32 PM (D7oie)

232 Hiya James Monroe !

Posted by: JT at May 04, 2024 09:33 PM (T4tVD)

233 The second 300 movie was terrible. And its odd because you could make a ton of interesting movies about the various Greek on Greek wars between the Persian war and the Romans coming in...

Posted by: 18-1 at May 04, 2024 09:00 PM (ibTVg)

I second the disappointment in the 300 sequel. Especially when there were such obvious options for paralleling the first movie. Imagine the Athenian Admiral yelling at the assembly: You will fight with us at Salamis, or we will not fight at all! (In real life, the Athenian navy issued an ultimatum that the allied fleet would fight at Salamis, or the Athenian fleet would bail, and relocate their entire population to Italy...

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 09:33 PM (Lhaco)

234 A bio-pic of the life of Robert E. Howard would make for an interesting psychological drama.
Posted by: Idaho Spudboy

Do you trust anything connected to H-wood at this point in time to do anything like that?
Posted by: weft Carnac at May 04, 2024 09:21 PM (IG4Id)

I bet they would portray him as a deeply closeted homosexual, with mommy issues, whose only outlet was creating fantasy worlds. If you read between the lines of Howard's biography...

Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at May 04, 2024 09:33 PM (Js20g)

235 I want to add - was it you who said you met John Goodman in NYC years ago as a bartender, or was that JJ Sefton? Anyway I think Goodman's portrayal of Sobchak is the best performance he did in any of his movies. He's perfect in the role.
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:21 PM (S6gqv) John Goodman was good in The Big Easy, as was the whole cast.

Posted by: Eromero at May 04, 2024 09:33 PM (NxC5+)

236 232 Hiya James Monroe !
Posted by: JT at May 04, 2024 09:33 PM (T4tVD)

========

*waves enthusiastically*

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:33 PM (GBKbO)

237 Eris,

When you're checking out the made-for-tv movies, catch one called See the Man Run, with Robert Culp and Angie Dickinson. A little of the dialog and delivery struck me as a tad like fingernails on a blackboard, but it was a nice little kidnap caper story with some good twists to it.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 09:34 PM (q3u5l)

238 There's a surprising number of well made tv movies from the 70's. They really put some effort into them. "Duel", Spielberg's first film that put him on the path, was an ABC movie of the week in 1971.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:34 PM (S6gqv)

239 169 Weird. Just got an automated message from an agency in Colorado that my son last used almost 2 years ago, reminding me they will be closed for the Labor Day holiday.

There's a glitch in the matrix.
Posted by: BurtTC a
----------------------------

I keep getting texts saying I haven't registered to vote and they will help me register. ***I VOTED***

Posted by: Braenyard at May 04, 2024 09:35 PM (lCWOD)

240 I just got the Arrow 4K "Conan the Barbarian" by John Milius.
But I haven't watched it yet.

It's got practically no sorcery, but I think it's the best possible Robert E. Howard adaptation there could be. The performances (by a bunch of athletes and James Earl Jones) are wonderful, the soundtrack is awesome, and it has the epic scope the Conan stories need.

The thing I remember most from the stories is that whenever Conan met a woman, he "bruised her lips" with his kisses. Pretty great kisser I guess.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at May 04, 2024 09:35 PM (CHHv1)

241 238 There's a surprising number of well made tv movies from the 70's. They really put some effort into them. "Duel", Spielberg's first film that put him on the path, was an ABC movie of the week in 1971.
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:34 PM (S6gqv)

=======

When Spielberg passes his mortal coil, I'm going to include his TV movies in the inevitable run.

I'm prepping a run of Friedkin right now, and he had 4 made for TV movies. I almost completely missed them until I noticed his adaptation of 12 Angry Men. Gotta find time for the other 3!

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:35 PM (GBKbO)

242 There was some crackpot astronomer who thought he saw running rivers of water on Mars in the early 20th century. Edgar Rice Burroughs read this theory, latched onto it, and ran with it. I don't think he considered what he was writing to be anything other than crazy fantasy stuff, but there was, sort of, a scientific basis for it. But not really.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:36 PM (GBKbO)

It was Percival Lowell, who was THE specialist in optical astronomy, and he thought he saw "canals"

Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 09:36 PM (D7oie)

243 I like Taylor Kitsch, but I do not think he was quite the right choice for John Carter. He is not horrible, just not quite right. Too dirty ranger.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:36 PM (di6C2)

244 There's a surprising number of well made tv movies from the 70's. They really put some effort into them. "Duel", Spielberg's first film that put him on the path, was an ABC movie of the week in 1971.
Posted by: Tom Servo

On YouTube, I came across a sequel to Darrin McGavin's Night Stalker called the Night Strangler. I was surprised how much I enjoyed it.

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 04, 2024 09:36 PM (Cp1vk)

245 215 Can't recall seeing Mako in anything where he wasn't fun to watch. If you haven't caught them before, check out The Sand Pebbles, a Chuck Norris flick called An Eye for an Eye, and a made-for-tv movie with Darren McGavin called The Challenge. Mako was terrific in all three.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 09:15 PM (q3u5l)

I saw Sand Pebbles once, long ago. Very downer of an ending. But the premise really stuck with me.

Posted by: Castle Guy at May 04, 2024 09:37 PM (Lhaco)

246 In 300, I just couldn't get past the way that Xerxes moving throne looked like a winning float entry from a San Francisco Gay Pride parade. I mean really that entire movie was one of the gayest things I have ever watched.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:37 PM (S6gqv)

247 I'm not sure where the fences were when McDowell was pitching, but considering park differences, I think a lot of what Koufax is credited for is at least in part skewed by Dodger Stadium.

As for Belle, he was a jerk. No other way to describe it, but even with the abbreviated career, there's no damn reason for him not to be in Cooperstown.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:16 PM (cw9vy)

Fences were 385 / 400 / 385 … with the foul poles being 325.

Albert was not fan friendly to be sure, but I sure loved him in a Tribe uni …

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:31 PM (TTAGa)

Those are hitter friendly dimensions. I went to a game there in the 80s, fascinating to see all the real estate beyond the fences as they were placed then. Must have made hitting home runs before they put in the fences, damn close to impossible.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:38 PM (jUq8k)

248 246 In 300, I just couldn't get past the way that Xerxes moving throne looked like a winning float entry from a San Francisco Gay Pride parade. I mean really that entire movie was one of the gayest things I have ever watched.
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:37 PM (S6gqv)

======

I've honestly never liked the movie. I think it's dumb.

It's weird how I can get fans to turn on a full quarter of the film: everything with Queen Gorgo.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:38 PM (GBKbO)

249 When Spielberg passes his mortal coil, I'm going to include his TV movies in the inevitable run.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda

Spielberg also directed a segment of the Night Gallery pilot episode. I don't remember it being very good, but he did it.

Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 04, 2024 09:38 PM (Cp1vk)

250 It was Percival Lowell, who was THE specialist in optical astronomy, and he thought he saw "canals"
Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 09:36 PM (D7oie)

Well, Schiaparelli had noted "channels", so the idea was out there. And if you see a bunch of dots, and your mind is looking for channels, the dots get connected.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at May 04, 2024 09:39 PM (8zz6B)

251 And there really are some huge erosional channels on Mars.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at May 04, 2024 09:40 PM (8zz6B)

252 Xerxes sat on a hill overlooking the battle of Salamis. On google maps you can go to that same hill and get basically the same view he had. The site of the battle looks to be some kind of port facility now.

Posted by: 18-1 at May 04, 2024 09:41 PM (ibTVg)

253 He was also working from the graphic novel
Posted by: Miguel cervantes at May 04, 2024 08:48 PM (PXvVL)

He stated in an interview that he had first found the story reading the graphic novel, and he thought more people had read that than the books.

Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 09:41 PM (D7oie)

254 249 Spielberg also directed a segment of the Night Gallery pilot episode. I don't remember it being very good, but he did it.
Posted by: Blutarski, Gradually then Suddenly at May 04, 2024 09:38 PM (Cp1vk)

=======

The only episodes of television I do are those who dis Masters of Horror episodes, which was honestly a mistake. I shouldn't be doing those. They're director for hire jobs.

That being said, I will do Honda's work on the first episode of Mirrorman mostly because he gave up on feature films for the last decade of his career until Toho brought him back for the last Godzilla film of the Showa era.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:41 PM (GBKbO)

255 I have read some of Howard's sports and western stories, and he was a good writer, even in those genre

Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 09:42 PM (D7oie)

256 I keep getting texts saying I haven't registered to vote and they will help me register. ***I VOTED***
Posted by: Braenyard at May 04, 2024 09:35 PM (lCWOD)

Pretty sure those are just straight up scams.

Saw the video of the guy who had an uber driver show up at his house, right after he was told on the phone he needed to pay some outrageous money to for some reason or another... and the uber driver was told to show up at his house to receive a package.

So he shot and killed her. Somebody did that, on purpose.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:42 PM (jUq8k)

257 It was Percival Lowell, who was THE specialist in optical astronomy, and he thought he saw "canals"
Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 09:36 PM (D7oie)
In other words, early Carl Sagan?

Posted by: Eromero at May 04, 2024 09:42 PM (NxC5+)

258 If memory serves, Spielberg directed the pilot film for Rod Serling's Night Gallery (or maybe it was only one segment of it).

There were a bunch of those 70s Movie of the Week flicks that I'd like to have on disc. One written by Howard Rodman felt like a pilot that didn't make it, about a pair of ex-cops turned bounty hunters called Two for the Money was pretty good as I recall it. The first pilot for David Janssen's Harry O series was one of these as well, I think. Robert Culp did several. One that did come out on disc was from an early Michael Crichton novel called Binary (movie was called Pursuit); Ben Gazzara and E. G. Marshall were in it and it was a nice little suspense flick.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 09:43 PM (q3u5l)

259 I was surprised that they were able to find time with him for it.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:11 PM (GBKbO)

Yeah it's one of those Big Historical Epics with a talented cast that just kind of fizzles out with a "Meh" ending. I think that's why it's really not all that well known, it's one of those movies that is *almost* good and which tried really hard, but just really never quite gets there.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:44 PM (S6gqv)

260 In 300, I just couldn't get past the way that Xerxes moving throne looked like a winning float entry from a San Francisco Gay Pride parade. I mean really that entire movie was one of the gayest things I have ever watched.
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:37 PM (S6gqv)

Check out the deleted scenes of the movie. In one shot, they had Xerxes riding on an armored rhinoceros.

Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at May 04, 2024 09:44 PM (Js20g)

261 258 If memory serves, Spielberg directed the pilot film for Rod Serling's Night Gallery (or maybe it was only one segment of it).

There were a bunch of those 70s Movie of the Week flicks that I'd like to have on disc. One written by Howard Rodman felt like a pilot that didn't make it, about a pair of ex-cops turned bounty hunters called Two for the Money was pretty good as I recall it. The first pilot for David Janssen's Harry O series was one of these as well, I think. Robert Culp did several. One that did come out on disc was from an early Michael Crichton novel called Binary (movie was called Pursuit); Ben Gazzara and E. G. Marshall were in it and it was a nice little suspense flick.
Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 09:43 PM (q3u5l)

=========

Kino did release the three seasons of Night Gallery, at least. Here's the first:
https://amzn.to/4dp1j5A

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:45 PM (GBKbO)

262 I've honestly never liked the movie. I think it's dumb.

It's weird how I can get fans to turn on a full quarter of the film: everything with Queen Gorgo.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:38 PM (GBKbO)

There are several huge downsides.

-Leonidas seems to be a noble dude and wise ruler. Why rebuke and insult the hunchback (because the plot needs to happen.)

-Xerxes comes off... odd. I get what they are trying to do, contrast the nobility and cleanliness of the Spartans with the base corruption and decadence of the Persians. Ok. But the Persians come off more as BDSM freaks than an actually threat.

-The Gorgo stuff is mostly all bad.

What the movie has going for it is it has great scenes (as if from a comic!) But here is a lot of drek in there too. Same with Sin City (which also has a lot of the sexual oddity in there too- I wonder why?!)

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:45 PM (di6C2)

263 In 300, I just couldn't get past the way that Xerxes moving throne looked like a winning float entry from a San Francisco Gay Pride parade. I mean really that entire movie was one of the gayest things I have ever watched.
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:37 PM (S6gqv)

I resist talking about that film, when it comes up here because the whole damn thing is so gay, it makes San Franny gay pride parades seem butch.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:46 PM (jUq8k)

264 yikes I was talking about the Sand Pebbles.

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:46 PM (S6gqv)

265 armored rhinoceros.
Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at May 04, 2024 09:44 PM (Js20g)

I saw Armored Rhinoceros open for Mastodon at the Fillmore in Denver.

Or...did I? Might have been a Ny-quil dream.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Live from Missoula at May 04, 2024 09:47 PM (gPzkP)

266 262 What the movie has going for it is it has great scenes (as if from a comic!) But here is a lot of drek in there too. Same with Sin City (which also has a lot of the sexual oddity in there too- I wonder why?!)
Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:45 PM (di6C2)

========

I still genuinely love Sin City. It's something of a mess, but I'm good with it.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:47 PM (GBKbO)

267 I did buy the Snyder cut Justice League recently.

I'll watch it when I have more hours than I do tonight. Not expecting much, other than given all the fuss, I figure I should.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:47 PM (jUq8k)

268 Saw the video of the guy who had an uber driver show up at his house, right after he was told on the phone he needed to pay some outrageous money to for some reason or another... and the uber driver was told to show up at his house to receive a package.

So he shot and killed her. Somebody did that, on purpose.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:42 PM (jUq8k)

The Uber driver was an innocent patsy, but the extortionists had been hounding the shooter for a long time, so I really don't blame him for disbelieving her claims of innocence.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at May 04, 2024 09:48 PM (8zz6B)

269 267 I did buy the Snyder cut Justice League recently.

I'll watch it when I have more hours than I do tonight. Not expecting much, other than given all the fuss, I figure I should.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:47 PM (jUq8k)

======

I think it's pretty good. I sort of like Snyder. Sort of.

Sucker Punch, 300, Army of the Dead, and Rebel Moon are dumb. I have some affection for the rest of his work, though.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:48 PM (GBKbO)

270 It counts as a goal when your player goes through the net, crossing the goal-line, right??

Posted by: andycanuck (UfUdn) at May 04, 2024 09:48 PM (UfUdn)

271 yikes I was talking about the Sand Pebbles.
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:46 PM (S6gqv)

I don't recall the gay Xerxes scene in that one.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:48 PM (jUq8k)

272 Saw a cheeztastic TV movie yesterday: "Fer-de-lance", about snakes loose on a submarine.

Snakes on a muthaf****** sub!

David Janssen and Ivan Dixon.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 09:50 PM (FkUwd)

273 men stem shtop walwe?

men stem shtop walwe!

men stem shtop walwe!!

Posted by: andycanuck (UfUdn) at May 04, 2024 09:50 PM (UfUdn)

274 Must have made hitting home runs before they put in the fences, damn close to impossible.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:38 PM (jUq8k)

Heh, yeah the dimensions to dead centerfield were 463 if I’m not mistaken, and the power alleys were 423.

Albert could have handled those … but not Big Daddy Wagner 🤣

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:50 PM (TTAGa)

275 rue Lies mean spirited?

That's a new one for me.

I have to put that on my list of things I just don't see.

John Wayne being screwed by Stewart in The Man who Shot Liberty Vance

Jenny being an evil bitch in Forest Gump

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 09:50 PM (MNhXM)

276 Made for TV movie: Sole Survivor... Shatner, Baseheart, Evans.

Posted by: davidt at May 04, 2024 09:51 PM (SYTee)

277 I think it's pretty good. I sort of like Snyder. Sort of.

Sucker Punch, 300, Army of the Dead, and Rebel Moon are dumb. I have some affection for the rest of his work, though.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:48 PM (GBKbO)

I don't hate his version of Watchmen. Not sure why the "big threat" toward the end needed to be changed, but honestly, that's not that big a deal.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:51 PM (jUq8k)

278 and a made-for-tv movie with Darren McGavin called The Challenge. Mako was terrific in all three.

Posted by: Just Some Guy

Even back then, I remember noticing McGavin's character sneaking around the island hoping to sneak up on Mako while puffing away on a presumably stinky cigar.

Posted by: Tonypete at May 04, 2024 09:51 PM (WXNFJ)

279 I still genuinely love Sin City. It's something of a mess, but I'm good with it.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:47 PM (GBKbO)

I do too, but I have the almost exact same feeling for it that I do 300 in a lot of ways.

For every kicking the emissary down the well (don't spoil water, this is the ancient world!) you have Queen Grogu.

For every shot of Clive Owen jumping into a car, you have the weird shit with Willis and puffy lipped Jessica Alba confessing their love for each other.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:51 PM (di6C2)

280 277 I don't hate his version of Watchmen. Not sure why the "big threat" toward the end needed to be changed, but honestly, that's not that big a deal.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:51 PM (jUq8k)

========

Because giant space octopus is dumb. Alan Moore isn't some sort of master genius god. He can have dumb ideas, too.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:52 PM (GBKbO)

281 I'll cop to liking "Sucker Punch" and "Army of the Dead", and wish he'd have spend his time on the sequel to"Army" rather than the awful "Rebel Moon".

Posted by: All Hail Eris at May 04, 2024 09:52 PM (FkUwd)

282 I resist talking about that film, when it comes up here because the whole damn thing is so gay, it makes San Franny gay pride parades seem butch.

Remember when we all got covered in oil and had to scrape it off?

Posted by: gKWVE at May 04, 2024 09:52 PM (gKWVE)

283 the immortals (2011)

Posted by: gKWVE at May 04, 2024 09:52 PM (gKWVE)

284 -Leonidas seems to be a noble dude and wise ruler. Why rebuke and insult the hunchback (because the plot needs to happen.)
-----
hubris

Posted by: andycanuck (UfUdn) at May 04, 2024 09:53 PM (UfUdn)

285 I still genuinely love Sin City. It's something of a mess, but I'm good with it.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:47 PM (GBKbO)

Same. I ended up buying the graphic novel, but haven't gotten around to reading it.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:53 PM (jUq8k)

286 Love that pic of Ahnuld and Grace Jones. They were obviously having way too much fun.

Posted by: Pat*'s Hubbie at May 04, 2024 09:53 PM (6afOC)

287 The Gorgo stuff is mostly all bad.

When I hear the name Gorgo, I think of that bad Brit monster movie GORGO

It was no Godzilla that’s for sure …

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:53 PM (TTAGa)

288 Sin City had Carla Gugino's gazangas.

Posted by: davidt at May 04, 2024 09:53 PM (SYTee)

289 hubris
Posted by: andycanuck (UfUdn) at May 04, 2024 09:53 PM (UfUdn)

Nemesis.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:54 PM (di6C2)

290 So, I read all of them.
In FOUR WEEKS?! Wow. Because that's a LOT of writing.

Posted by: GWB at May 04, 2024 09:54 PM (1zxQh)

291 John Wayne being screwed by Stewart in The Man who Shot Liberty Vance

Posted by: polynikes

Once again, some punk ass politician making hay out of a tall tale. Just like today.

Posted by: Tonypete at May 04, 2024 09:54 PM (WXNFJ)

292 288 Sin City had Carla Gugino's gazangas.
Posted by: davidt at May 04, 2024 09:53 PM (SYTee)

Also one of it's strong points. Damn.

Almost Amanda Peet Whole Nine Yards level of surprise nudity.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:55 PM (di6C2)

293 I don't hate his version of Watchmen. Not sure why the "big threat" toward the end needed to be changed, but honestly, that's not that big a deal.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:51 PM (jUq8k)

========

Because giant space octopus is dumb. Alan Moore isn't some sort of master genius god. He can have dumb ideas, too.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 09:52 PM (GBKbO)

Absolutely! I thought it was sorta meant to be a dumb idea, and would have been very hard to film, so I think changing it was fine, I'm just not sure why he did.

Snyder being Snyder, he probably had some reasons that sounded very smart in his own head.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:55 PM (jUq8k)

294 8 Sin City had Carla Gugino's gazangas.
Posted by: davidt at May 04, 2024 09:53 PM (SYTee)

Yes it did , and I had no idea they were that wonderful …

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:55 PM (TTAGa)

295 Once again, some punk ass politician making hay out of a tall tale. Just like today.
Posted by: Tonypete at May 04, 2024 09:54 PM (WXNFJ)

Eyepatch McCain shot Liberty Valence?!

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:56 PM (di6C2)

296 I like Sin City. A really weird, trippy movie, but one I do not watch very often.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Live from Missoula at May 04, 2024 09:56 PM (gPzkP)

297 > I mean really that entire movie was one of the gayest things I have ever watched.

Horseshoe theory for heterosexuality. The straightest thing you can watch is at least a 6/10 on the gaydar. EG Commando.

Solomon Kane was always a zealot, and that is what we love him for.

Pirate: So you'll just shoot me down, in cold blood?
Kane: With a joyous heart.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at May 04, 2024 09:56 PM (lhenN)

298 This is a wide open hockey game at the moment

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:56 PM (TTAGa)

299 hubris
Posted by: andycanuck (

Nemesis.
Posted by: Aetius451AD
-----
Harrigan, that's me!

Posted by: andycanuck (UfUdn) at May 04, 2024 09:56 PM (UfUdn)

300 I don't recall the gay Xerxes scene in that one.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:48 PM (jUq8k)

... when you need a new thread just to get away from your posting mistakes...

Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:58 PM (S6gqv)

301 And speaking of Alan Moore, I've mentioned it here before, some guy wrote a comic a few years back, about how the writer took in a homeless guy, and had sex with him. Even if you're into gay sex, the book (and illustrations) are the most disgusting things ever inked.

Moore wrote a long, glowing preface to the book.

The homeless guy... looks exactly like Alan Moore.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:58 PM (jUq8k)

302 🎶H-A -double R - I - GAN spells Harrigan 🎶

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 09:58 PM (TTAGa)

303 both goalies playing shutdown hockey

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 09:59 PM (/7KEl)

304 Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:45 PM (di6C2)

I think the hunchback part is actually part of the Thermopylae story.

Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 09:59 PM (MNhXM)

305 The homeless guy... looks exactly like Alan Moore.
Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:58 PM (jUq8k)

This too is the story of Obama.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 09:59 PM (di6C2)

306 ... when you need a new thread just to get away from your posting mistakes...
Posted by: Tom Servo at May 04, 2024 09:58 PM (S6gqv)

Ask and ye shall receive.....

Posted by: BurtTC at May 04, 2024 09:59 PM (jUq8k)

307 I finally bought and watched 'The Black Phone.' I've been watching horror movies lately. This one could have been scarier but was fantastic. Set in the 1970's, a guy is grabbing young boys off the street and putting them in his dungeon.

He grabs Finney and has him in the dungeon. A black phone keeps ringing. The dead victims keep calling Finney to help him escape. Meanwhile, his sister that has 'dreams', is trying to find him.

Madeleine McGraw won a chainsaw award for her performance. She was amazing. Stole the movie. Alcoholic father that beats her, tough, swears like a sailor. I'm not a fan of kids cursing in movies but with her character Gwen, it worked.

Madeleine's little sister, Violet, was the star of M3GAN, another not too scary horror film. When I had Instagram, I followed Maddy because she didn't tick me off. Very sweet family for two horror stars.

Here's Gwen telling off some cops....
https://tinyurl.com/yvey75se

Posted by: Stateless at May 04, 2024 10:00 PM (jvJvP)

308 The homeless guy... looks exactly like Alan Moore.
Posted by: BurtTC

Except for the fact that Moore is a multi-millionaire crank who thinks he's a celtic wizard.

Posted by: weft Carnac at May 04, 2024 10:00 PM (IG4Id)

309 Neither of these teams can beat the Rangers, or the Panthers …

Posted by: browndog is a reluctant Bruins fan at May 04, 2024 10:00 PM (TTAGa)

310 yeah, [300 definitely had homoerotic undertones

Posted by: Don Black at May 04, 2024 10:01 PM (/7KEl)

311 ONT is nood.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at May 04, 2024 10:02 PM (di6C2)

312 Shtand up! Shutdown!
Fight! Fight! Fight!

Posted by: lateral lisp cheerleading squad at May 04, 2024 10:02 PM (UfUdn)

313 If anyone's interested in a list of those ABC made for TV flicks, Wikipedia has a list of 'em in order of broadcast. Search for ABC movie of the week there and you should find it.

Posted by: Just Some Guy at May 04, 2024 10:06 PM (q3u5l)

314 I see ESPN/ABC intermission hosts are as dumb as CBC's.

Turns back to CBC; adjusts sound level to 0.

Posted by: andycanuck (UfUdn) at May 04, 2024 10:06 PM (UfUdn)

315 A bio-pic of the life of Robert E. Howard would make for an interesting psychological drama. [ . . . ]
Posted by: Idaho Spudboy at May 04, 2024 09:11 PM (Js20g)

There was something of a biopic, it is called The Whole Wide World, and I never saw it.

Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 10:07 PM (D7oie)

316 I think the hunchback part is actually part of the Thermopylae story.
Posted by: polynikes at May 04, 2024 09:59 PM (MNhXM)

It is, it is in Herodotus, though I think he wasn't actually a hunchback, or at least that was not his main characteristics.
Also there was a decided lack of drug fueled orgies in Herodotus' version of the Peloponnesian war

Posted by: Kindltot at May 04, 2024 10:21 PM (D7oie)

317 Just wanted to say I always liked the Solomon Kane movie. I wish they had made more of them. That character just seemed unique and intriguing.

A movie I watched recently that was better than I thought it would be is Knox Goes Away. It is not a perfect movie, but it does something which movies rarely do anymore --- it pays off in the end.

Whereas the movie we watched tonight, Late Night with the Devil, absolutely does not pay off. It has a good premise, and it has stuff I am primed to like such as a James Randi like skeptic. But it just doesn't work. It is slow taking off and when it gets going it doesn't really go anywhere that is worth the time you put in.

Posted by: Thatch at May 04, 2024 11:18 PM (rgb6F)

318 The problem with that marketing campaign was that they gave control of it to the director, Andrew Stanton.
The trailers were generally terrible and gave no idea as to what the film was about while assuming some kind of deep appreciation of a public domain property that hadn't been directly in the cultural limelight for decades.

It might have had a better shot if Disney's actual marketing team had been in control.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison, fighting kaiju with Ishiro Honda at May 04, 2024 08:33 PM (GBKbO)
---------------------------------
When it comes to woke, never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by malice.

Posted by: goofy at May 04, 2024 11:24 PM (Z7BHa)

319 Matango also holds the distinction of being the only film based on the works of William Hope Hodgson.

Posted by: My Ridiculously Circuitous Plan at May 04, 2024 11:50 PM (N0oGS)

320 Milius erred in providing a backstory for Conan --- one fundamentally at odds with his character --- but once the film moves past that it's tonally consistent with the REH Conan stories and even borrows specific elements from some of the better ones ("The Tower of the Elephant", "Queen of the Black Coast", "A Witch Shall Be Born", and "Red Nails").

Posted by: My Ridiculously Circuitous Plan at May 04, 2024 11:54 PM (N0oGS)

321 I hate Kull and the Jason Moama Conan. I did like Solomon Kane, but i misplaced my bootleg version. I have the other 2 Conan movies on blu ray but not 4k. One of my favorite comic books is Marvel Treasury Edition #4. It reprints Conan the Barbarian #11 and Savage Tales #2–3 in 10"x14". A Barry Windsor coffee table art book for $10 at the con? YES, PLEASE!

Posted by: hurricane567 at May 05, 2024 02:07 AM (1x1bw)

322 Every single thing in here is wrong.

Every single thing. I'm amazed. I've never seen a combination of reviews miss every possible point so completely.

Posted by: tevildo at May 05, 2024 01:54 PM (UGjoX)

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