Saturday Gardening Thread, Going Bold [KT]

Lurker anonymous sent in the fun photo above:

Living in San Diego I look forward to my display of aloes and succulents blooming. They bloom late fall and add so much color to the yard. Sometimes it takes a year or two for them to start producing and in some cases even longer. This one only took a year.
In front is an Aloe cameronii, which I believe is in the red aloe family, and the taller succulent in back is a Pedilanthus bracteatus.
Once you get hooked on aloes you just want more!
PS really look forward to the garden thread and the pet thread each Saturday. Thanks for doing this.

I love how the succulents, artwork and birdhouse go together, don't you? The fence serves as a fine backdrop. I wouldn't be surprised if the succulents attracted some hummingbirds, too. Bet they are easily visible.

We have been discussing hardscaping and garden ornamentation off and on lately. Below, some examples of hardscaping and garden ornamentation from the largest private home in the United States. And a little information about a couple of guys who did some bold designing.

Biltmore Estate

Completed in 1895, George Vanderbilt's 250-room chateau is as impressive today as it was more than a century ago.

My niece was there during the Chihuly exhibit during the summer. The Christmas displays are up now. I thought it might be fun to compare the seasonal displays.

Here are a couple of the outdoor Chihuly sculptures she saw this summer:

Here is an indoor one:

I think the "Indoor Winter Garden" may be in the same space now:

George Washington Vanderbilt was a grandson of Cornelius Vanderbilt. He was the youngest of eight children, and reportedly the favorite of his father. His two older brothers managed the family's financial businesses. He was quiet, interested in the arts, travel, books, horticulture and silviculture (forestry). He managed the family's northeastern farm holdings for a while.

He opened his "country home" to guests on Christmas Eve in 1895, with gifts for 300 to 500 guests, including estate workers and their families. He was still a bachelor at the time, and enlisted the help of the wife of a friend as hostess.

Today, they still hold a party for employees at Christmas. But the estate is open to the public (and kind of pricey). You may be greeted by a lion dressed up for Christmas:

Or a fireplace dressed with greenery and ornaments:

The estate includes a three-wing conservatory. Here is a view of one of them in the summer:

And another arrayed for Christmas:

They have a website featuring information to entice visitors. Here's a little piece on how one of their decorators brings the outdoors in at Christmas: with Hygrangea macrophylla.

Southern Living has a more helpful piece on drying hydrangeas.

The Biltmore also has recipes on its website. Here's one for roasted sweet potatoes with dried cranberries and toasted pumpkin seeds. Growing any of those ingredients next year?

They have a nice fall salad recipe, too. Salad greens from the garden, apples from your tree, bacon, blue cheese, caramelized walnuts.

They also hold rose trials at Biltmore Estate. Here are a couple of the 2017 winners. It will be bare root season before you know it:

Anastasia was judged Best Hybrid Tea.

Screaming Neon Red swept four categories: Best in Show, Best Shrub, Most Disease Resistant and Best Growth Habit.

The Father of American Landscape Architecture

The landscape and forest historian, at Biltmore, Bill Alexander, recently retired.

"As a child, I didn't know that Frederick Law Olmsted designed the landscape, but it had me from the start," Bill said. "I loved the wilder areas. It's where I developed my interest in trees and flowers."

Thinking of adding a water feature to your yard? Olmsted's design for the Bass Pond dam and spillway are still functional today.

"After completing a book on the story of George Vanderbilt's Pisgah Forest as the 'cradle of forestry' in this country," said Bill, "I'm focusing on another project regarding documented accounts of the early settlers, farmers, and landowners prior to Vanderbilt's purchase of the acreage that would become part of his private estate."
Through his research, Bill has learned that much of the land encompassed by Biltmore is strongly connected to the early history of Western North Carolina, including an ancient Native American trade route that came through what it is now Biltmore's Lodge Gate on its way to Tennessee and Ohio. In addition, a village existed 1500-1800 years ago adjacent to that long-ago highway.

The landscape design for Biltmore Estate was the last major project of Frederick Law Olmstead, sometimes called the Father of American Landscape Architecture. He is best known for designing Central Park in New York City, but he was involved in some 550 projects during his career, including the design of the landscape for the Capitol Building, Stanford University, UC Berkeley and regional parks.

George Vanderbilt had wanted to plan his entire land holding after the model of the typical English estate, but Olmstead discouraged him, because the ground was not good enough and timber had been over-cut. Olmstead planned much of the land to be managed forest, and Vanderbilt established the first American school of forestry. After his death, Vanderbilt's wife sold much of the land to the US Forest Service, and it became the basis for the Pisgah National Forest.

If you would like to send information and/or photos for the Saturday Gardening Thread, the address is:

ktinthegarden
at g mail dot com

Include your nic unless you just want to be a lurker.

Got any Christmas decorations up in your yard or garden?

Posted by: Open Blogger at 12:53 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Anyone done any vertical gardening? Like the urban pot factories?

Posted by: Anonymous White Male at December 08, 2018 12:55 PM (3sjI6)

2 This is the Mother of All Gardening Threads.

Well done!

Posted by: Sharkman at December 08, 2018 12:56 PM (2eKoI)

3 Wow. Great photos KT.

Posted by: HH at December 08, 2018 12:57 PM (mIJBI)

4 Good afternoon Greenthumbs and Snowmen

Posted by: Skip at December 08, 2018 12:58 PM (/rm4P)

5 Got some tomato seedlings growing so today The Small Person and I will build an indoor hot-house tower with a climbing cage inside and transplant the seedlings into that.

75 qt. potting soil, canvas planting bag, climbing cage, metal frame, saran wrap. Some assembly required.

Posted by: Sharkman at December 08, 2018 12:59 PM (2eKoI)

6 Posted by: Sharkman at December 08, 2018 12:59 PM (2eKoI)

Sounds like a lot of work.

Posted by: HH at December 08, 2018 01:04 PM (mIJBI)

7 Another good Christmas garden to visit is Longwood Gardens in Kennett Square Pa. Haven't been there in probably 20 years but there is a Tv special every year which I have seen often.

Posted by: Skip at December 08, 2018 01:05 PM (/rm4P)

8 Thanks, Sharkman and HH.

Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 01:06 PM (BVQ+1)

9 I'm not even into gardening, and while I'm really a lurker on the site, the information and pictures you post I find fascinating and enjoyable. thank you very much for your work! merry Christmas and cheers to you and yours,

Posted by: shadownoes at December 08, 2018 01:09 PM (2gUlo)

10 I have been putting up pictures that I took of the Robinwood Station community garden. They are on Instagram, under notsothoreau. There are so many good ideas for using a small space. I still have anither 10 or so to add.

Posted by: Notsothoreau at December 08, 2018 01:12 PM (Lqy/e)

11 Olmstead is a fascinating guy for other reasons, too. His father encouraged an interest in nature and he got Sumac poisoning that affected his eyesight so badly that he couldn't go to college. He spent time as a seaman and farmer. He traveled.

He had abolitionist leanings, and the New York Times sent him to the South before the Civil War to do Man on the Street interviews. He thought slavery was a dumb economic system.

Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 01:12 PM (BVQ+1)

12 What a beautiful collection of photographs! Thanks KT.

I love Chihuly's work but his writhing forms seem a bit outré in formal gardens. Or maybe it's that "Touch o' Cthulhu" that lends offbeat charm.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at December 08, 2018 01:13 PM (kQs4Y)

13 Olmstead also helped finance and wrote for The Nation. Of course, it was different then.

Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 01:13 PM (BVQ+1)

14 What varieties are you planting, Sharkman?

I'm a bit of a tomatohead.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at December 08, 2018 01:14 PM (kQs4Y)

15 Sounds like a lot of work.

Posted by: HH

Not too bad. Another opportunity to hang out with and teach my daughter (11) a new skill that will help her survive after The Burning Times.

Posted by: Sharkman at December 08, 2018 01:16 PM (FFJtw)

16 Lurker anonymous, the aloe was an ingredient my chiro put on me after cracking some of this old skeleton and startling some nerves yestermorn. When I got out of bed I couldn't move, hardly stand, and not even bend to put on boots. Same for Mrs. E who couldn't move neither. We are much better senior citizens today. Making gumbo now, hunting tomorrow through Tuesday morning.

Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 01:17 PM (zLDYs)

17 If you're inclined to visit Biltmore, and you like roses, plan your visit in June, when the rose gardens peak.....fantastic!

Posted by: BignJames at December 08, 2018 01:18 PM (cxHbL)

18 The Biltmore Estate looks like it would be enjoyable.

For my own gardening, I planted some micro greens the other day. The first crop looks huge.

Posted by: Evasiveboat42 at December 08, 2018 01:18 PM (Rz2Nc)

19 Beautiful, kt ... thanks.

Posted by: Adriane the Gardening Critic ... at December 08, 2018 01:18 PM (LPnfS)

20 Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at December 08, 2018 01:14 PM (kQs4Y)

So you're a ginger?

Posted by: HH at December 08, 2018 01:18 PM (mIJBI)

21 Beautiful photos of the estate. That room with the huge fireplace and decorations is beyond gorgeous. It's a good thing I'm not there. Given something to drink, my best pipe tobacco, and some books, They would have to use a hydralic lift to get my butt out of those chairs. (SIGH)

The conservatories just make me envious. I could easily feed Mrs. JTB and me what we could grow there. (ALSO SIGH)

Posted by: JTB at December 08, 2018 01:19 PM (bmdz3)

22 So you're a ginger?
Posted by: HH at December 08, 2018 01:18 PM (mIJBI)

Ha! No, evil brunette, not crazy ginger.

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at December 08, 2018 01:19 PM (kQs4Y)

23 thanks KT, more good stuff ... nice decorative gardens.

"Olmstead planned much of the land to be managed forest, and Vanderbilt established the first American school of forestry."

cool ... I've got about 50 acres of woods I'd like to get into "managed" state. Government actually can do some good things, if we could keep the commies from infiltrating and using AgencyAuthoritee for oppression.

County ag guys came out here a couple times (for "free", at my request) to offer suggestions and insights, erosion ideas, invasive species control, etc. -- very helpful. They can probably be called by homeowners as well, for various ideas on species suggestions, soil tests ... at least in the more rural areas where they maybe have a bit more time.

Posted by: illiniwek at December 08, 2018 01:20 PM (Cus5s)

24 Posted by: Sharkman at December 08, 2018 01:16 PM (FFJtw)

Sounds cool! Hope you have some fun and she gets to learn things.

Posted by: HH at December 08, 2018 01:23 PM (mIJBI)

25 On the gardening front, have bailed out gathering leaves, its freaking cold out. Besides had plumbing to do today.

Posted by: Skip at December 08, 2018 01:24 PM (/rm4P)

26 Time for the usual 11 foot Doug Fir in the family room. I just keep doing this because I have no common sense. At least I didn't kill myself putting the lights on the eaves and roof peaks that are covered in ice. Maybe a bit of roof top moss removal after Christmas.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 01:32 PM (CeJUf)

27 About 15 or so years ago my mother came up to visit. While she was here my wife took her for a two day tour of Biltmore. She loved it, but it was quite expensive even then.

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at December 08, 2018 01:32 PM (mpXpK)

28 Biltmore is well worth the trip to Asheville. The hippies are free.

Posted by: weirdflunky at December 08, 2018 01:33 PM (rWQDI)

29
Anyone done any vertical gardening? Like the urban pot factories?
There *was* a much heralded vertical gardening operation in South Philadelphia, supplied some of the restaurants, not open to the public. But it turns out the visionary behind the enterprise is a bit of a fraudster:

https://tinyurl.com/y7dshgfr

Posted by: kallisto at December 08, 2018 01:34 PM (DJFLF)

30 Anybody know anything or have experience with starting succulents from seed? I acquired a couple of envelopes of seeds through Amazon. They came from China with unintelligible customs declarations, so I might be growing opium poppies, poison ivy or whomping willows for all I know.

Started them in some succulent/cactus soil mix, but I'm seeing conflicting instructions when I research. Some stuff says bury the seeds in a few millimeters of soil, some stuff says the seeds need light to germinate, so leave them on the surface.

Posted by: Bilwis, Devourer of Low Glycemic Souls at December 08, 2018 01:34 PM (jp0Bv)

31 Fun fact about the hippies in Asheville.

For some reason they don't wear shoes. I mean none of them. No shoes. Be advised.

"Grocery store feet" doesn't begin to describe it.

Posted by: weirdflunky at December 08, 2018 01:39 PM (rWQDI)

32 Last Biltmore trip was over 40 years ago. I suppose in his favor, even if he got the land cheap he sure employed a bunch of former Confederates. Now do we need to take down that huge pile of stone?

Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 01:40 PM (zLDYs)

33 Marvelous photos all around. Biltmore is fabulous. Olmstead and his brothers did a lot of public parks. The chain of parks in Louisville, KY are a great example. All named for local Indian tribes.
There are a couple of good examples of their work even in Seattle. Lovely places to walk.

Posted by: Winston a dreg of society at December 08, 2018 01:40 PM (+TuXx)

34 It is indeed a beautiful pile of stone and flowers.

Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 01:41 PM (zLDYs)

35 Love the screaming neon! Nice throwback look.

Posted by: CN at December 08, 2018 01:43 PM (U7k5w)

36 Notsothoreau at December 08, 2018 01:12 PM

Thanks for the head up. You've been busy.

Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 01:43 PM (BVQ+1)

37 Bilwis, Devourer of Low Glycemic Souls at December 08, 2018 01:34 PM

Hard to say with so little information. You might try dividing the seeds and trying different methods. I think most seeds that require light for germination are small. Some seeds can be kick-started by soaking in weak peroxide solution for a little while.

Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 01:47 PM (BVQ+1)

38 Eris, they are "Sweet Cluster" tomatoes.

Posted by: Sharkman at December 08, 2018 01:47 PM (FFJtw)

39 Just put a brush guard on the front of the organic tree farming truck. Does "brush" count as a legitimate garden thread topic?

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 01:55 PM (MVjcR)

40 I saw Screaming Neon open for Captain Beefheart at the Pantages in '75.

Posted by: Captain Obvious at December 08, 2018 01:56 PM (tfbws)

41 Weasel at December 08, 2018 01:55 PM

Yes.

Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 01:58 PM (BVQ+1)

42 41 Weasel at December 08, 2018 01:55 PM

Yes.
Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 01:58 PM (BVQ+1
------
Schwoo!
The organic pine trees are going to get snowed on tomorrow. My babies!!

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 01:59 PM (MVjcR)

43 Weasel @ 39- I can watch shredder videos for over an hour sometimes. The big ones on the front of log skidders are my favorite after the ones on Bobcats.

Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 02:00 PM (zLDYs)

44 To our absolute amazement, the leaf lettuce and dill are still growing. The covers over the Earth Boxes, especially at night, are working. We have a shot at a small salad next week.

Also, our Christmas cactus are blooming. These are the ones we bought years ago for 25 cents each and they have deep, ruby red blossoms. I would love to brag about how my vast horticultual prowess has them blooming for the holidays but we just got lucky.

Posted by: JTB at December 08, 2018 02:02 PM (bmdz3)

45 43 Weasel @ 39- I can watch shredder videos for over an hour sometimes. The big ones on the front of log skidders are my favorite after the ones on Bobcats.
Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 02:00 PM (zLDYs)
------
I may have mentioned here before that I used to do a lot of volunteer trail maintenance work along the A.T., and had to periodically take a chainsaw course to maintain my certification as a logger on federal land. There are a lot of ways to kill yourself around logging equipment.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:03 PM (MVjcR)

46 And I actually have assless chaps!

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:06 PM (MVjcR)

47 Had a lucky and productive day with old Stihl Thursday. With of course the inability to to get out of bed and dressed yesterday morning, which the cowpractor fixed. I get a visit a day until end of the year. Geezers rulz!

Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 02:07 PM (zLDYs)

48 Weasel, Eromero - does tethered assist really work?

Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 02:09 PM (CeJUf)

49 "Once you get hooked on aloes you just want more!"

Once you plant an aloe, you automatically get more! I had one that started out in a half-gallon juice can, and when I finally dug it up it was so big I had to cover it with an 8' x '' tarp if it was going to freeze overnight here in Youstin. I was afraid it was going to watch Little Shop of Horrors and get ideas, IYKWIM.

Posted by: MathMom at December 08, 2018 02:10 PM (lGgl/)

50 Thursday we were at Orchestra Hall for the Concordia College Christmas Concert. Concordia is a pretty musical place. There are 4 choirs and the orchestra, and the stage is extended out and still very full. But oh, it is a spectacle. Beautiful music, carefully chosen and arranged, the choirs moving around the room, and it is actually a very intimate experience.

This years theme: For the Beauty of the Earth.

Posted by: Gordon Scott at December 08, 2018 02:11 PM (vd69n)

51 48 Weasel, Eromero - does tethered assist really work?
Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 02:09 PM (CeJUf)
-------
I think it's used a lot out west but I've never tried it. I'm way too big of a chicken!! I have used a grip hoist and rigging equipment a lot though, but mostly for moving big rocks.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:14 PM (MVjcR)

52 51 ... "I have used a grip hoist and rigging equipment a lot though, but mostly for moving big rocks."

Weasel, I thought that's what the dynamite was for.

Posted by: JTB at December 08, 2018 02:18 PM (bmdz3)

53 Olmstead also did alot of work in Central Park.Many similarities between Bethesda Terrace in Central Park and Biltmore.

Posted by: billygoatpuke at December 08, 2018 02:19 PM (OBY+r)

54 52 51 ... "I have used a grip hoist and rigging equipment a lot though, but mostly for moving big rocks."

Weasel, I thought that's what the dynamite was for.
Posted by: JTB at December 08, 2018 02:18 PM (bmdz3)
--------
Ha! Well only if you don't want the rock intact! I have used a system with a rock drill and giant shotgun shell type charges to split rock. It's pretty effective!

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:20 PM (MVjcR)

55 46 And I actually have assless chaps!
Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:06 PM (MVjcR)

What do the Forestry Service guys think of your chaps? I mean, from an OSHA perspective?

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at December 08, 2018 02:21 PM (kQs4Y)

56 Most I've done is tie a shop hammer and fling it up and around top of pine you've already cut a wedge out of on direction of fall, then run around base of another pine direction you want the one you're cutting to fall. Keep a steady pull on that line and your cut pine will fall where you want it. Mostly. Is this what you mean, Skook? Or are you talking about burying a fence post or landscape timber (or crosstie) with a chain on it to use as anchor to winch out your vehicle? Or hooking your saw to your climbing belt? Cause old Eromero ain't a-doing that there one. I is not a treetopper.

Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 02:22 PM (zLDYs)

57 Believe it or not, dynamite is used in the back country to, um, turn deceased pack animals into smaller bits. There is actually a Forest Service guide for how it's done.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:22 PM (MVjcR)

58 Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 01:17 PM (zLDYs)

Do how do you use aloe therapeutically?

Posted by: Lord Kelvin at December 08, 2018 02:23 PM (f3oO4)

59 The pictures aren't of anything I've done. It's an old fire station that was converted to a community center. I had a three day dulcimer workshop there this summer. I thought the garden was great. I'm not usually a fan of raised beds but these worked well. I think there may have been a patch of sweet corn that had been removed.

Posted by: Notsothoreau at December 08, 2018 02:23 PM (Lqy/e)

60
What do the Forestry Service guys think of your chaps? I mean, from an OSHA perspective?
Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at December 08, 2018 02:21 PM (kQs4Y)
-----
Weirdos, I tell you. It's the forest service guys who make you wear them!!

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:24 PM (MVjcR)

61 Weasel, 51. Yes, it's used here in the PNW. It looks pretty hairy. Some of this stuff - no thank you.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 02:24 PM (CeJUf)

62 55 What do the Forestry Service guys think of your chaps? I mean, from an OSHA perspective?

Posted by: All Hail Eris, She-Wolf of the 'Ettes 'Ettes at December 08, 2018 02:21 PM (kQs4Y)

Leather pants were not a requirement for OSHA when I was working at a power plant. Hardhats and safety glasses were the minimum requirement. Steel toed boots were required when lifting and carrying heavy equipment. Most of the OSHA requirements concentrated on equipment such as safety rails, stairs, etc.

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at December 08, 2018 02:25 PM (mpXpK)

63 Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 02:22 PM (zLDYs)
-------
Eventually I had a felling certification (rather then just bucking blow downs) and with practice you can get reasonably good at dropping a tree where you want it.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:26 PM (MVjcR)

64 Believe it or not, dynamite is used in the back country to, um, turn deceased pack animals into smaller bits. There is actually a Forest Service guide for how it's done.
------
Just don't try it with a whale...

Posted by: Captain Obvious at December 08, 2018 02:27 PM (tfbws)

65 61 Weasel, 51. Yes, it's used here in the PNW. It looks pretty hairy. Some of this stuff - no thank you.
Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 02:24 PM (CeJUf)
------
Skook, I'm always amazed at the slopes that are worked without tethering.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:27 PM (MVjcR)

66 Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:26 PM (MVjcR)

Found an artist tree guy that has removed several problematic trees for me. He is a climber and usually takes them down from the top doing minimal damage to the surroundings. The neatest thing I've seen him do is taking out a tree from the bottom up. The tree was located next to a shed in a stand of trees so he rigged lines to the top, and proceeded to take sections off the bottom, stopping every so often to release the lines and let the suspended tree drop 4-5 feet so he could saw off the next section.

Posted by: Comrade Hrothgar at December 08, 2018 02:33 PM (f3oO4)

67
I've seen Biltmore at Christmas and Biltmore in the Spring. Both awesome experiences. I would love it if I could take Her Majesty there.

Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at December 08, 2018 02:34 PM (LsBY9)

68 Come to think of it, we worked on a couple of stone projects and tethered ourselves due to the slope. We were moving some big stone for staircases and cribwalls.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:34 PM (MVjcR)

69 Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 01:17 PM (zLDYs)

Do how do you use aloe therapeutically?

Posted by: ~~Lord Kelvin~~ Hrothgar at December 08, 2018 02:23 PM (f3oO4)

Posted by: Comrade Hrothgar at December 08, 2018 02:35 PM (f3oO4)

70 Weasel, 65 - Yeah, I know. And the thing is, there seem to be relatively few accidents. At least on the big commercial properties. But like you say, you see these guys working and you think - no way.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 02:35 PM (CeJUf)

71 Posted by: Comrade Hrothgar at December 08, 2018 02:33 PM (f3oO4)
------
All of the felling I've done was in the backcountry, so I was mostly trying to avoid hanging up the tree I was dropping. That's always a pain in the ass.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:37 PM (MVjcR)

72
Hard to say with so little information. You might try dividing the seeds and trying different methods. I think most seeds that require light for germination are small. Some seeds can be kick-started by soaking in weak peroxide solution for a little while.
Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 01:47 PM (BVQ+1)

I have two sets of seeds, one about half the size of sesame seeds. With these, I did what you said, half a dozen barely covered, another half dozen exposed. I know this isn't the optimal time of year light/temperature wise, so I'm holding back most of the seeds trying to get a fix on what works.

The second envelope has seeds really small, like dot the "i" on a standard page of text small. I'm not even sure how I'm going to work with those. I expect to wrap a scarf around my mouth as breathing will certainly scatter them.

Ehh, both envelopes of seeds cost me $2.50 combined including shipping from China, so I'm not expecting much, just a chance to play in the dirt and keep off the streets. If I wind up producing nothing but small trays of mud, nothing much is lost but my time.

Posted by: Bilwis, Devourer of Low Glycemic Souls at December 08, 2018 02:37 PM (jp0Bv)

73 Gordon Scott at December 08, 2018 02:11 PM

Sounds wonderful.

Posted by: KTbarthedoor at December 08, 2018 02:37 PM (BVQ+1)

74 Is there such a thing as bush type pea plants? Long range forecasts, at least in the OFA, call for a cool spring. I wonder if bush style pea plants in covered Earth Boxes or some large container might work along with other cool weather crops like lettuce and radishes.

Posted by: JTB at December 08, 2018 02:38 PM (bmdz3)

75 74 Is there such a thing as bush type pea plants? Long range forecasts, at least in the OFA, call for a cool spring. I wonder if bush style pea plants in covered Earth Boxes or some large container might work along with other cool weather crops like lettuce and radishes.
Posted by: JTB at December 08, 2018 02:38 PM (bmdz3)

Tom Thumb from seedsavers dot org might fit your needs.

Posted by: Evasiveboat42 at December 08, 2018 02:43 PM (Rz2Nc)

76 It's hard to appreciate the amount of tension trees can be under once they're down. I remember working on a trail section in Shenandoah N.P. after a big nor'easter. We came across six BIG oaks in a pile, and I was standing on trees bucking other trees. With every cut you could hear them cracking and popping. I'm surprised I wasn't killed.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:44 PM (N1mF+)

77 Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:37 PM (MVjcR)

My felling experience is similar, usually plenty of space to drop the whole tree but getting it to fall between existing adjacent trees is still a trick. A tensioned line and a proper wedge cut will do wonders.

My "staff" logger took out a 65' tulip maple that was just starting to lean and touch a shed. I figured major collateral damage would result, but he (with a ground helper) managed to do it without damaging either the shed or an azalea near the base.

Posted by: Comrade Hrothgar at December 08, 2018 02:45 PM (f3oO4)

78 57 Believe it or not, dynamite is used in the back country to, um, turn deceased pack animals into smaller bits. There is actually a Forest Service guide for how it's done.
Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:22 PM (MVjcR)

Does it work out any better than that whale?

Posted by: Fox2! at December 08, 2018 02:46 PM (MwFQu)

79
Most people would laugh at getting weather forecasts from the OFA.

Her Majesty and I were show chairs for our National Specialty show, the centennial of our national club. We wanted to have the ring outdoors. Some months before, we glanced at the OFA while in line at the supermarket. It predicted rain for that week. "How quaint," we chuckled.

On Monday afternoon it started raining and didn't stop until Friday.

Posted by: Hadrian the Seventh at December 08, 2018 02:47 PM (LsBY9)

80 Man, I am enjoying the "PBS Eons" youtube channel. All chapters about ancient life on Earth.

Why do we have coal? Back when it was formed, decomposing bacteria hadn't happened yet, so all the plants and trees (pretending to be on-topic) just piled up, as did oxygen. O₂ was at 35% because little was taking advantage of it yet.

Anyways, just haven't been caring to see what our elites are up to on our behalf.

Posted by: t-bird at December 08, 2018 02:47 PM (lK7fO)

81 75 ... "Tom Thumb from seedsavers dot org might fit your needs."

Thanks, I'll check that out.

Posted by: JTB at December 08, 2018 02:47 PM (bmdz3)

82 Does it work out any better than that whale?
Posted by: Fox2! at December 08, 2018 02:46 PM (MwFQu)
------
The whole thing is pretty icky if you ask me.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:48 PM (N1mF+)

83 Think I'd better go out back and blow the leaves around. Y'all have fun. See you in a bit.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:49 PM (N1mF+)

84 The whole thing is pretty icky if you ask me.
Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 02:48 PM (N1mF+)

I guess you have to get them off of the trail.

Posted by: Fox2! at December 08, 2018 02:50 PM (MwFQu)

85 Lod Kelving @ 58-Therapeutically? Do you take off your pants? Or is this another one?

Posted by: Eromero at December 08, 2018 02:51 PM (zLDYs)

86 Weasel - here out West, they have gotten pretty sophisticated. I'm sure also in the rest of the country. All kinds of monitors for the guy in the cab. Heart rate, etc. Plus goggles that track their eye movements, the whole bit. The Canucks in BC have done quite a bit of work on this.

Still...

Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 02:57 PM (CeJUf)

87 OMG the invocation by the chaplain before Army-Navy is awesome.

Posted by: logprof at December 08, 2018 02:59 PM (e7oj4)

88 tethered assist ... yikes. My next brush/tree clearing purchase will be a nice three-point hitch chipper. The bush honeysuckle and honey locust can be knocked down or chainsawed, but there is still a big (thorny) mess for a long time, so the chipper should help.

you experienced guys know all the tips, but one I forgot to mention when we had the chainsaw discussion weeks back ... if it's a big tree on the ground, I cut off as much weight as possible before getting into the more gnarly parts. Some of the big limbs underneath are spring loaded from the fall, just lying in wait. So "bucking" (is what I call it) all the exterior stuff in easier reach seems to release most of that potential energy.

Posted by: illiniwek at December 08, 2018 03:00 PM (Cus5s)

89 Kallisto-

Great article !

Thanks !

Posted by: JT at December 08, 2018 03:01 PM (bbnDs)

90 There are Russian scientists who say oil and imagine coal is still being produced by the earth.
And those leaves are still laying out there and going no placed until I get to them, this month or spring.

Posted by: Skip at December 08, 2018 03:03 PM (/rm4P)

91 oh, now I see Weasel addressed my point exactly ... carry on.

Posted by: illiniwek at December 08, 2018 03:04 PM (Cus5s)

92 Biltmore is the one thing to do in North Carolina if you do nothing else.

I didn't see much of the gardens but they have a vineyard with free wine tasting. The house tour is self paced but restricts you to the public spaces but there are a couple of small group guided tours that will take you through the private spaces such as the back corridors used by staff and family that run throughout the building.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at December 08, 2018 03:08 PM (1g7ch)

93 88, illiniwek - "spring loaded" yeah, that's the deal. Gotta be careful.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 03:09 PM (CeJUf)

94 Skip, 90 - yes the "anabiotic" theory. Don't know nearly enough to say - bu tmay be true.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at December 08, 2018 03:12 PM (CeJUf)

95 Wow, Biltmore and Frederick Law Olmstead in one superb gardening thread--two of my favorites!

I very much enjoyed Witold Rybcyznski's "A Clearing in the Distance," which is largely a biography of Olmstead. A very complex character. What's interesting about his landscape designs is that he planned them based on how they would look in 50 or more years. Talk about a long time horizon.

I'm not much on "lifestyles of the rich and famous" stuff, so I was surprised at how much I enjoyed Biltmore. The place is gorgeous, but what I liked most was learning about the activites of all of the massive staff. My favorite photos from the trip are the ones taken at the Farm, not the actual house.

Posted by: Art Rondolet of Malmsey at December 08, 2018 03:14 PM (S+f+m)

96 Watts up with That had a good discussion yesterday poo-pooing the anabiotic theory. They insist it's possible, but not necessary.

Posted by: MarkY at December 08, 2018 03:15 PM (j0ppb)

97 89. You're welcome.

Posted by: kallisto at December 08, 2018 03:19 PM (CyCaV)

98 Love me some succulents......Bilt Hoose is indeed worth
the visit,relaxing sitting on the outer cloisters and viewing the unending scenery unfold,magnificent...I wish I had built more house ,my 1,000 sq ft domain seems claustrophobic now........well we all end up in a 4 sq foot coffin or an even smaller urn,and the wide outsides is there for all...I'm waxing poetic must be hungry or sober!

Posted by: saf at December 08, 2018 03:31 PM (5IHGB)

99 Posted by: illiniwek at December 08, 2018 03:00 PM (Cus5s)
------
I thought bout a 3point chipper for the tractor but decided on one that I could tow around for convenience.

Posted by: Weasel at December 08, 2018 03:53 PM (MVjcR)

100 First!

Posted by: Skip at December 08, 2018 04:13 PM (/rm4P)

101 Aloe Aloe wots goin' on 'ere, that woz a plant officer.....

Posted by: saf at December 08, 2018 04:16 PM (5IHGB)

102 She were a three point chippie, mate, but a good gel none the less.

Posted by: Gordon Scott at December 08, 2018 05:35 PM (vd69n)

103 I have leaf issues also, Skip. I'd like to say it was because they fell late, but I just didn't get 'er done.

Posted by: Gordon Scott at December 08, 2018 05:37 PM (vd69n)

104 Husband and I were in the Asheville area for his family reunion, this August. Most of the others had already toured The Biltmore, so we went by ourselves. The humid heat was rough on us "dry heat" Westerners, but we did do a tour of most of the gardens, and the whole house, all the way through master and guest bedrooms, kitchens, pantries, laundries, women servants' quarters (men had to bunk out by the stable!), gun room, swimming pool, basement and all. We also went to the winery and the creamery - the line about having "a millionaire as your dairyman" sticks with me. And the Chihuly glass was everywhere - we took photos of a few pieces. There are few estates where such large, flamboyant artworks wouldn't look out of place, but they do fit into the expansive size of The Biltmore nicely.

I looked up some info afterwards - interesting to note that Dale Chihuly has not been the one to physically make his designs since 1979 (due to physical disability). And sad to note that the only child of the Vanderbilts, Cornelia, was only married (to a British aristocrat/diplomat) for 10 years, before she went... eccentric - leaving their 2 sons with him, moving to Paris, divorcing him, and and marrying twice more.

Anyway, Idaho's Treasure Valley. We had our first snow on Sat. 1st, about 2 inches total between that day and the next. I did create a path to the back shed, the mailbox, and the place where I put the trash out by the street, plus cleared off the concrete area outside the garage. We're getting partial melting despite the cold... which means tomorrow we'll go out and rake leaves off any exposed areas out front. (We never had time to get rid of all the Annoying Sycamore leaves before the snow, despite the long dry autumn. The delay caused by me hurting my back, was probably the difference...)

I bought a quail seed block and put it out back. I haven't yet spotted quail nibbling at it, but when I checked on it, it had certainly been nibbled, so some birds of some sort have found it. The small birds are certainly mobbing my front window seed feeder!

I think the only other thing of interest around here was our brewing (no seed catalogs yet). We took our own apple cider and set it up as hard cider - we bottled four 6-packs this week. And we have some Coffee Oatmeal Stout in its secondary ferment right now.

The high for the week was about 37 F, the low about 8 F.

Posted by: Pat* at December 08, 2018 05:53 PM (2pX/F)

105 Highs in the 30s, lows in the teens-- we're quite a bit north of Pat* but in a low valley...

Haven't got ALL the leaves up (and likely won't until spring!) but that's okay. They're not so thick out back as to smother the grass.

The leaf sweeper did a fine job and we bagged about 3 dozen for pick-up last weekend. Whew! Thankful we had the elms removed, or it would've been much more.

Will attempt putting up Christmas lights tomorrow. Will write cards instead if it's too cold... Supposed to get snow later this week... we'll see what happens.

Love love love the garden thread, even if it's not really "gardening weather!"

Outstanding pics this week-- as always.

Posted by: JQ at December 08, 2018 09:29 PM (zMzA6)

106 Thanks for the interesting details on Biltmore, Dale Chihuly and the Vanderbilts, Pat*. I was interested to read that George and his wife had booked passage on the Titanic, but cancelled their reservation.

And nice to hear from you, too, JQ. Sounds pretty cold in Idaho.

Posted by: KT at December 08, 2018 10:39 PM (BVQ+1)

107 Evasiveboat42 at December 08, 2018 01:18 PM
Microgreens are a perfect winter crop! Huge!

Posted by: KT at December 08, 2018 11:25 PM (BVQ+1)

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