Desperate Timez Require Desperate GAINZZZZ

So last time I vowed I'd have some GAINZZZ to report or else I'd make them up. I'm too lazy to make them up, so I just kept away from a GAINZZZ thread.

I do have GAINZZZ-- continuing to exercise and such -- but not weight-LOZZ GAINZZZ. I've plateaued right under 170 and can't seem to budge it down further.

Not that I've been trying. Wednesday night I decided to be "Bad" and have a cheat meal. I had mac and cheese plus desert (damn fine strawberry pie, in honor of Dale Cooper's imminent return).

I was surprised to see I'd gained weight at the meal.

But then I thought about it: I'd also cheated without declaring it Sunday (Indian-- with naan) and Monday night too (chicken McNuggets after working out).

So basically I've been cheating like a bastard and then lying about it to myself.

After coming home from my acknowledge cheat meal (and realizing I'd had a couple of unacknowledged ones), I noticed my guru had a new video out, about the benefits of fasting.

The video notes that fasting is hard for the first two days, but then becomes fairly easy. So I figured, if you get through two days, you might as well extend that.

So this is what I'm doing: a five day fast. 120 hours without food. (Okay, a very small amount of food.) I'm in hour 46; my last chewed food was Wednesday at around 8:30.

I picked the number "five" at random -- it sounded just long enough, but not too long -- but it turns out that earlier this year the Five Day Fast became the new buzzy idea in weight loss. Most plans call it a "fasting-mimicking diet" for five days -- allowing you 1,100 calories on day one, then like 700 calories from days 2 through 5 -- and you can read about those if you like.

Personally, I'm not good with calorie counting. I either eat or I don't. The minute I start eating, I'm just going to eat, you know?

So I'm going without eating per se, but with some small amount of easily-measured calories. The only thing I'm eating is bulletproof style coffee in the morning (which has butter and MCT oil in it, so there's a little food there), athletic green powder for lunch (which has 50 calories in it, and a good dose of vitamins and antioxidants), and 20 grams of bone broth protein with tumeric for dinner.

I haven't done it yet, but I'm allowing myself some bulletproof green tea (with butter and MCT oil) if, mid-day, I need a boost in both caffeine and some amount of calories.

Adding in some of the supplements I'm adding -- BCAA's, glutamine, creatine (damnit, I want those GAINZZZ) -- I guess I'm maybe having 300 calories a day, or less. I also have two tablespoons or so of apple cider vinegar to help dull my appetite when it gets bad. (I'm drinking that now, mixed with ice water -- it's helping.)

The first day was pretty easy. Today was pretty easy until a couple of hours ago, when I got really hungry, and then my mind just kept perseverating about the fact that I was hungry.

Actually, it's not even that I feel hungry -- I'm just very aware that I haven't eaten.

I put off lunch so I have that delicious meal of athletic greens still coming up, and then later, that delicious cup of bone broth.

I'm actually a little spacey. I wasn't yesterday and wasn't earlier today, but right now, my brain is pretty foggy, if I'm being honest.

This is a dangerously stupid plan and I don't know why I let you guys bully me into it.

Tomorrow, Sunday, and Monday will be hard too, because I plan to work out on those days.

But hopefully, this guy is right, and the hunger-stimulating hormone ghrelin is at its peak right now and will get weaker, not stronger, starting tomorrow.

This other recent video he did recaps the new understanding of hormones' effects on weight loss and weight gain, again repudiating the idea that "A calorie is a calorie is a calorie."

That video makes a good point-- sure, calories in, calories out. But why don't overweight people just burn off the extra calories they eat, either in the form of jittery energy or just raising their internal metabolic heat a tenth of a degree? (Which, by the way, is how lean people's bodies tend to treat unexpected surplus calories.) Why does the calorie surplus go right into stored fat for some, but not for others?

Anyway, good vids.

I'll let you know how it goes, maybe with updates over the weekend. Hopefully I won't tap out -- I think that today is pretty much in the bag, even though it kind of sucks at the moment. I do have the athletic greens and protein powder still to drink. And hopefully tomorrow will be easier, though, again, after I work out, I'm going to be really hungry, and really wanting protein for my GAINZZZ, and I'm worried I'm going to be very sorely tempted to say "55 hours is plenty" and tap out.

By the way, I'm not a doctor, and I'm making this up as I go. I'm told this can be dangerous. This guy did a strict five day fast (water and vitamins only) and says that there's a danger not just in the fasting, but in the refeeding following the fast. Apparently if you spike your insulin too high post-fast, you can do real damage to yourself. I don't like the idea that after fasting, I have to slowly reintroduce food -- I want to just end the fast.

But apparently that's unwise.

So don't try this at home. To be honest, I haven't figured out yet how I'm going to refeed safely, but I figure I have a couple of days to draw up a plan.

Hopefully movieqique will check in and let me know how these more serious, three or four or five day fasts go.

By the way, this recent post on PJMedia is about exercising after 50. Which is obviously important stuff.

This is my rest day but I'm planning on getting in some light exercise via a three mile walk later.

So -- tell me about yo GAINZZZ. Are you on-plan, or have you gone off? Have the people who've already lost lots of weight lost more, or have you guys plateaued as well?

Hmmm: Jason Fung describes the problems with long fasts of five to ten days (or more) here, and it sounds like something I don't want to mess with.

I think I'll do four days, to keep away from all that business.

Posted by: Ace at 06:00 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 I'm getting Gainzz!! from Brie and crackers.

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 05:52 PM (jw2Xw)

2 Submit your recipes
Deadline is TONIGHT

Please see main page/sidebar in blue

Happy Gainzzzzz

Posted by: AoS Cookbook at June 30, 2017 05:52 PM (EqvVS)

3 >>> So basically I've been cheating like a bastard and then lying about it to myself.

I know that story.

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 05:53 PM (jw2Xw)

4 So here's the new twitter push: women, send bloody er, hygiene products to Trump because he fears blood!

I kid you not.

https://twitter.com/lea/status/880751032762085377

(related because; should help you diet)

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at June 30, 2017 05:54 PM (39g3+)

5 Ace, I'm wondering if there is a way for you or one of the co-bloggers to put all the GAINZZ threads in one place for easy reference. Just a thought.

Posted by: WinLinBSDAdmin at June 30, 2017 05:56 PM (B11vO)

6 Sometimes it's easier to just lower your goals and standards.

Posted by: Weasel at June 30, 2017 05:56 PM (Sfs6o)

7 I find turmeric to be really good for eliminating soreness I usually get from lifting. ZMA not so much.

Posted by: Regular joe at June 30, 2017 05:58 PM (7PllL)

8 Three hundred calories, ace? That's hardcore.

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 05:59 PM (jw2Xw)

9 SiL takes turmeric pills and swears by them.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at June 30, 2017 05:59 PM (89T5c)

10 sounds insane. eat and exercise.

Posted by: The Original REAL Galactic Lord Sir Covfefe at June 30, 2017 05:59 PM (nFwvY)

11 Ace, why don't you try The Master Cleanse as opposed to this seemingly risky "improvised" method? Lots of people have done it and lived to tell the tale. I do it twice a year and it's a great weight reset. 10 days of a lemonade mixture: Water, fresh squeezed lemon juice, maple syrup, cayenne pepper. Nothing else, 10 days. You get a little fuzzy headed in days 2-3 but after that it settles in. Even if you only do 7 days it makes a pretty serious impact.

Posted by: A Liberal AoS Reader, Really! at June 30, 2017 06:01 PM (hXY/x)

12 i take tumeric but can't say it's doing anything. I don't know if it helps or not.

Posted by: ace at June 30, 2017 06:02 PM (8rNrN)

13 Doing 10k tonight. But I need to switch up time and routines.

Posted by: Mr Aspirin Factory at June 30, 2017 06:02 PM (89T5c)

14
You've lost enough weight, bro.

Time to get Jacked & Tanned.

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:03 PM (hdoNb)

15 That fasting program is what Jimmy Kimmel did to lose his weight. Watch out because it seems one of the side effects is you turn into a crying whiny liberal.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:04 PM (IDPbH)

16 Damn, willowed again.

My GAINZZ have been totally off. After getting off the overnight shift, I have yet to restart anything. I hope to change that next week. I'm still fighting the "tired all the time" syndrome.

For now though, it's whiskey and Diet Coke.

Posted by: Country Boy at June 30, 2017 06:04 PM (Jcg9Q)

17 Turmeric is supposed to have anti-inflammatory properties. But like many supplements, the studies that show it doing anything usually are in doses higher than are commonly taken.

I just like dumping it in homemade curry.

Posted by: brak at June 30, 2017 06:04 PM (5iU/N)

18 Your cheat meal was mac and cheese? Boo. Should have been a juicy steak.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at June 30, 2017 06:04 PM (VdICR)

19 i've had three separate guests over the last three months who wanted to visit the local restaurants.

in between visits i was back to IF/1-6PM window.
now it's tons of roasted vegs, water and a tiny bit of maple yogurt full time.

thnx for the thread.

Posted by: concrete girl at June 30, 2017 06:06 PM (EqvVS)

20 >>>Your cheat meal was mac and cheese? Boo. Should have been a juicy steak.

steak isn't cheating, brah. I had a lot of meat with the meal, but i didn't mention it, because it's not a problem.

Posted by: ace at June 30, 2017 06:06 PM (8rNrN)

21 18 Your cheat meal was mac and cheese? Boo. Should have been a juicy steak.
Posted by: BourbonChicken at June 30, 2017 06:04 PM (VdICR)

I don't think steak is considered cheating . Bake potato with every thing on it with a blooming onion on the side would be cheating.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:06 PM (IDPbH)

22 >>.You've lost enough weight, bro.

nope.

Posted by: ace at June 30, 2017 06:06 PM (8rNrN)

23 That video makes a good point-- sure, calories in, calories out. But why don't overweight people just burn off the extra calories they eat, either in the form of jittery energy or just raising their internal metabolic heat a tenth of a degree? (Which, by the way, is how lean people's bodies tend to treat unexpected surplus calories.) Why does the calorie surplus go right into stored fat for some, but not for others?

Cause the body is a bioreactor not a burn barrel. You throw stuff in the burn barrel and its going to go up in flames, using that energy of what's in there. But humans are each unique bioreactors, and some process different fuels easier than others. And then you throw in all the hormones and stuff that can act as catalysts or slow the reaction or change the reaction into fat and store it away for later.

Posted by: buzzion at June 30, 2017 06:07 PM (z/Ubi)

24 I've plateaued right under 170 and can't seem to budge it down further.

170 is pretty small for a male who works out. What is your body fat getting down to? Are you all wire now?

Posted by: Grump928(C) at June 30, 2017 06:07 PM (LTHVh)

25 I once did the eliminate-things-gradually-and-add-them-back-in thing over a week. It was great. These days, I eat because I feel like it. Ugh. I'm 20# overweight.

Posted by: SFGoth at June 30, 2017 06:07 PM (dZ756)

26
nope.

Are you gonna wrestle Shute?

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:07 PM (hdoNb)

27 14
You've lost enough weight, bro.

Time to get Jacked & Tanned.
Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:03 PM (hdoNb)

You one of those Jersey Shore goombas?

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:08 PM (IDPbH)

28
btw, I'll bet my left nut NO ONE gets that Shute reference.

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:08 PM (hdoNb)

29 Not sure if its the best diet, but great job on getting there. I need to start.... I won't, but there you have it

Posted by: PicklePete at June 30, 2017 06:09 PM (DHqN0)

30 I was stuck just above my goal weight. I increased my weight workouts from an average of 9 a month to 14 a month for June. I had been resting extra due to being 68 and worrying about injury.

No injuries, and after one month I'm 2 pounds below my goal weight. I'm 5'8" and 155 now. 40 inch chest. 33 inch pants are a bit loose instead of tight. Lost a loop in my belt, which is about 1 inch. Any weight gain goes right to my gut, so very minor changes are visible and not nice looking.

My Italian father comes from a family nicknamed "big stomach" in Italian.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:09 PM (3myMJ)

31 I got distracted from my exercise routine when I tackled some long-overdue yard work. Now I have re-started my "Body by Science" regimen.

It's been fun using my new muscles. This week I was carrying an end table that needed to be supported from the bottom, so I squatted down and grabbed the base and stood back up without a second thought. Yay, leg presses!

On another front, I am making progress on getting my surroundings and life in general more organized and less cluttered. I love it when I dump a bunch of trash or deliver unneeded items to the thrift store.

Next: an actual budget, the first in quite awhile. Then, knock out the debts we've carried our entire married lives (husband's ex was exploitive and he borrowed an extreme amount of money to keep up with her demands).

To the Horde: you are awesome and you can't help getting more and more awesome all the time. Talk about gainzz!

Posted by: Emmie at June 30, 2017 06:11 PM (ZapPq)

32 I discovered the last 7 months of the one meal a day with no carbs, that when I plateau out that when I skip my scheduled cheat days my body will break through the plateau with strength and muscle mass GAINZZZ.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:11 PM (2qHjF)

33 Oh, I also been hiking more as summer has arrived and the snow has left the mountain trails.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:12 PM (3myMJ)

34 170 is pretty small for a male who works out. What is your body fat getting down to? Are you all wire now?
Posted by: Grump928(C) at June 30, 2017 06:07 PM (LTHVh)

No shit. Ace ... be careful.

I'd look like a skeleton at 170.

Posted by: ScoggDog at June 30, 2017 06:13 PM (tRLIC)

35 Still doing the cold showers?

Posted by: David Keener at June 30, 2017 06:13 PM (aYVqy)

36 >>> Oh, I also been hiking more as summer has arrived and the snow has left the mountain trails.

What, no snowshoes? ;--)

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 06:14 PM (jw2Xw)

37 Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:09 PM (3myMJ

That's pretty good. No need at this point to handle any heavy weight IMO and would limit workouts to higher reps to avoid injury. You are probably doing that already.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:14 PM (IDPbH)

38 Posted by: A Liberal AoS Reader, Really! at June 30, 2017 06:01 PM (hXY/x)

Hello! Long time, no see!

Posted by: Emmie at June 30, 2017 06:14 PM (ZapPq)

39 Stop dieting. Unless you have some allergy or blood disease, diets are mostly short term trash and don't last.

Try eating whatever the fuck you want and as much as you want WHEN you want. And the trade off for that is swimming (or some other aerobic exercise) nonstop for 1 hour, three times a week. No weights, no dieting, no bullshit.

It works.

Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:15 PM (khIpu)

40 Still doing the cold showers?

Is this the dating thread, then?

Posted by: Bandersnatch at June 30, 2017 06:15 PM (gIRsn)

41 The march to the Raw Natls continues:
Squat - 125kg x8 beltless
Bench - 82.5kg x8
Deadlift - 187.5 x5 beltless

Goal is a 500kg competition total...

Posted by: browndog at June 30, 2017 06:15 PM (bGMOs)

42 After I started doing nightly sit-ups, standing side crunches holding a heavy dumbbell, steep incline push-ups with my feet up at 3,4, and 5 feet at night, it pushed my GAINZZZ into extreme mode. I started getting visually vascular in my upper chest and shoulders and my lower abs. Getting my college washboard back!

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (2qHjF)

43 Friday Flash Email Traffic

Swiss RUAG 5.56x45 (.223) 62grn SS109 (M855) Ammo 1000rd can $299.95

http://bit.ly/2u8jLty

Posted by: Grump928(C) at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (LTHVh)

44 Anybody got a good lat workout for a guy with no gym, just free weights, a pulley and a chin bar in the garage?

Been doing a "pull across the the chest" thing with the pulley.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (3myMJ)

45 Get a rowing machine, if your your going to eat like a galley slave you might as well act like one!

Posted by: Killerdog at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (aqEgy)

46 I hear the meals you had right before starting a fast are also important and you don't want the wrong things sitting there.

One trick I found for quasi-fasting is to slice an apple in 8 and have one slice every 30 minutes. Typically gets me to a point the hunger goes away so I can go a few more hours or overnight before next meal.

Posted by: justaguy at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (UnMRd)

47 Started exercising again, specifically walking because it costs nothing. I do about 20 miles a week now. I'm not sure if I feel (or am) any better, but I don't feel worse.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at June 30, 2017 06:17 PM (MZcWR)

48 I've been doing 16 hour fasts (basically skipping breakfast and eating between 12 and

combined with a HFLC diet. Weight is going in the right direction but sloooow.

Posted by: Mike at June 30, 2017 06:17 PM (oGI1N)

49 Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (2qHjF)

Can you describe "standing side crunch"?

Thanks.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:17 PM (3myMJ)

50
I ride my bicycle to work these days. I pay to park, then I get on my stupid bike. It pisses me off.

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:17 PM (hdoNb)

51 The re-feeding is a real issue. I know some people who have an anorexic child. When they got her into treatment, they had to be very, very careful with re-introducing food. Someone can die if they start eating too much after a long period of starvation.

Posted by: Miss Sippi at June 30, 2017 06:18 PM (5fPhA)

52 Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:15 PM (khIpu)

Extreme diets yes but eating healthy and wisely is a benefit that will increase results.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:18 PM (IDPbH)

53 I'm back up to 240, but I've basically been off my my diet for the past four months. Stress eating sucks, and the annex where our classes are held has an office space that pushes out lots of sugary snacks. I'm trying to get back to eating one big meal a day, usually around 3-5pm, drinking chai with cream before then, and having a salmon packet or two in the evenings when I get home.

Right now I lift twice a week, as well as cardio twice a week to try and build back up my running ability.

Posted by: Colorado Alex in Exile at June 30, 2017 06:18 PM (fKWf6)

54 46 I hear the meals you had right before starting a fast are also important and you don't want the wrong things sitting there.

One trick I found for quasi-fasting is to slice an apple in 8 and have one slice every 30 minutes. Typically gets me to a point the hunger goes away so I can go a few more hours or overnight before next meal.
Posted by: justaguy at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (UnMRd)

And by the 2nd hour the apple is turning brown so you're not interested in eating anymore.

Posted by: buzzion at June 30, 2017 06:18 PM (z/Ubi)

55

I forgot I even owned a bike.

It beats walking, I guess.

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:18 PM (hdoNb)

56 >>> Try eating whatever the fuck you want and as much as you want WHEN you want.

Are you familiar with ice cream?

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 06:18 PM (jw2Xw)

57 170 ? how tall are you ? Sheesh I would happy if I could get to 170 !

Posted by: The Jackhole at June 30, 2017 06:18 PM (M+Lyo)

58 Still down 53. Just got all my clothes tailored, cost me a pretty penny, now it's all about keeping it off

Posted by: down 50 at June 30, 2017 06:19 PM (4+B1r)

59 Cardio can kill your muscle GAINZZZ. You have to be careful not to red line it for too long or you will lose muscle.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:19 PM (2qHjF)

60

Nobody remembers Vision Quest?
You losers.

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:19 PM (hdoNb)

61 Back when I was a young 'un, I unintentionally went on a week long fast.

When I re-introduced food, I ate EVERYTHING IN SIGHT - and the abdominal pain was excruciating for the next 12 hours.

I have never forgiven the f*****s who thought it was funny, and didn't warn me - PRICKS.

Posted by: browndog at June 30, 2017 06:20 PM (bGMOs)

62 @52
Healthy eating is about 80% mentality and 20% reality. Organics are nonsense. Hll you can fast food your way to glory if you like. The only balance that matters is fat/carbs/protein.

The rest is puffery.

Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:20 PM (khIpu)

63 44 Anybody got a good lat workout for a guy with no gym, just free weights, a pulley and a chin bar in the garage?

Been doing a "pull across the the chest" thing with the pulley.
Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (3myMJ)

If you have a chin bar you do wide grip pull ups for lat width and dumbbell rows for thickness.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:21 PM (IDPbH)

64 Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:14 PM (IDPbH)

Thanks. Yes, using fairly light weights, and the very slow negative movements seem to really help.

Discovered I could up my chinups if I used a closer grip.

Want to work on wide grip pullups for the lats but they are hard.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:21 PM (3myMJ)

65 >>>The re-feeding is a real issue. I know some people who have an anorexic child. When they got her into treatment, they had to be very, very careful with re-introducing food. Someone can die if they start eating too much after a long period of starvation.

yeah I added a link, I'm going to stop after four days, or at least start eating some food at the four day mark, even if I don't have a full meal.

To be honest, I didn't know this was all such a dangerous thing.

Posted by: ace at June 30, 2017 06:21 PM (8rNrN)

66
bent over rows with dumbbells

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:21 PM (hdoNb)

67 "But hopefully, this guy is right, and the hunger-stimulating hormone ghrelin is at its peak right now and will get weaker, not stronger, starting tomorrow."

The day may come, as it has for me, that you will need to force yourself to eat for one reason or another. Just to maintain some weight, I found that an ice cream shake with a raw egg, half a stick of butter, two instant breakfasts, and a full scoop of purest whey protein I could find - would provide about 1k calories. Two of these a day, and I stopped losing weight, but I still cant gain any. I want to get to 165, but stuck on 135.

Posted by: bergerbilder at June 30, 2017 06:22 PM (lIZQs)

68 Who doesn't skip leg day? Batman, that's who.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at June 30, 2017 06:22 PM (VdICR)

69 Posted by: Jack Sock

Dumbbell rows, great idea, thanks.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:22 PM (3myMJ)

70 Ace: I read that "danger" link and I have to say, I've never had that kind of reaction from doing the 10-day Master Cleanse, and I've done it over 10 times now. You can exercise while you do it. Just bring the lemonade with you to the gym, or along on a walk.

Emmie: Hey. Hope you're well. I still lurk regularly. Interesting times, so I pretty much leave it there. But I felt I could contribute here.

Posted by: A Liberal AoS Reader, Really! at June 30, 2017 06:22 PM (hXY/x)

71 >>>>>>>>>>>Are you familiar with ice cream?

Hell yes I have a banana split every Friday for dinner to reward myself for my weekly swimfest.

nutrition!!

Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:22 PM (khIpu)

72 >>> 170 is pretty small for a male who works out.

Not if you're only 3'6"

Posted by: wooga at June 30, 2017 06:22 PM (sQuad)

73 59 Cardio can kill your muscle GAINZZZ

It does me. If I do more than a little - I get weaker. By a fair bit.

Posted by: ScoggDog at June 30, 2017 06:23 PM (tRLIC)

74 Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:20 PM (khIpu)

Having a fats/carb/protein balance is different from eat anything you want which is what you said.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:24 PM (IDPbH)

75 bent over rows with dumbbells
Posted by: Soothsayer

Oops, that was you.

Thanks!

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:24 PM (3myMJ)

76 >>>Try eating whatever the fuck you want and as much as you want WHEN you want. And the trade off for that is swimming (or some other aerobic exercise) nonstop for 1 hour, three times a week. No weights, no dieting, no bullshit.

It works.
Posted by: ThomasR

...

oh? How much weight have you lost on this plan, or is it hypothetical?

PS, I work out hard 4-6 times a week. But thanks.

Posted by: ace at June 30, 2017 06:24 PM (8rNrN)

77 49 Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (2qHjF)

Can you describe "standing side crunch"?

Thanks.
Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:17 PM (3myMJ)

Grab a dumbbell and hold it in one hand and bend down to the side with the dumbbell as far as you can go and then crunch back to the side without the dumbbell. Then hold it in the other hand and do the other side. Make sure to keep your abs and core tight and flexed like you are doing crunches. Also try and get a good stretch on the way down with the dumbbell in your hand.

Does this make sense and help?

It attacks the love handle a

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:25 PM (2qHjF)

78 Someone mentioned numeric upthread...

What's it supposed to do?

And

Is there any science behind it?

Posted by: naturalfake at June 30, 2017 06:25 PM (NyJwR)

79 So this is what I'm doing: a five day fast. 120 hours without food. (Okay, a very small amount of food.) I'm in hour 46; my last chewed food was Wednesday at around 8:30.

That plan has generated huge weight-loss success in North Korea, but try extending the duration by a little bit to, say, your entire life.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at June 30, 2017 06:25 PM (Mouru)

80 @76 Ace

60 pounds in 12 months.

Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:25 PM (khIpu)

81 Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:21 PM (IDPbH)

Yes, looking for width.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:25 PM (3myMJ)

82 There's something screwy with modern society when we even overcomplicate starvation.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at June 30, 2017 06:26 PM (oVJmc)

83 Thanks autocorrect!

numeric = tumeric

Posted by: naturalfake at June 30, 2017 06:26 PM (NyJwR)

84 My wife had a rowing machine from when she used to race on Town Lake in Austin. The movers had backed into it on one of her moves before Buffalo Roam so I bought the stuff and fixed it. I got on it the first time and cranked the resistance thinking I would do 20 minutes. WRONG! If you do it right it is one hell of a workout and I'm pretty fit for being, uh, 29.

Posted by: Dave at Buffalo Roam at June 30, 2017 06:27 PM (U3hi9)

85 Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:25 PM (2qHjF)

Excellent, thanks. Will do.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:27 PM (3myMJ)

86 A great way to burn fat is to add a set of body squats every 100 yards on your walk. It will not red line you like cardio, melts fat, and builds strength in the legs and core. Mix in push-ups as well.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:28 PM (2qHjF)

87 *scribbles notes*

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:28 PM (3myMJ)

88 Having 60 pounds to lose is a pretty specific starting point. I don't think you can draw meaningful parallels from that, especially with just a monomaniacal choice of a single exercise.

Posted by: Bandersnatch at June 30, 2017 06:28 PM (gIRsn)

89
remember to inhale air in the stomach and bear down (keep a tight core) every time you do any lifting and bending over

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:28 PM (hdoNb)

90 >>> Anybody got a good lat workout for a guy with no gym, just free weights, a pulley and a chin bar in the garage?

Chins, rows, either pulley or band pulldowns for finishers. Do scapular rolls prior to chins to focus on how the chin starts.

Posted by: Banana Splits Guy at June 30, 2017 06:29 PM (RrhD2)

91 Cardio can kill your muscle GAINZZZ

It does me. If I do more than a little - I get weaker. By a fair bit.
Posted by: ScoggDog at June 30, 2017 06:23 PM (tRLIC)

Yep. If your goal is strength and muscle GAINZZZ, stay away from the Cardio that pushes your heart rate into your red zone.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:30 PM (2qHjF)

92 Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:21 PM (3myMJ)

With wide grip pull ups you can put a chair under you . Bend your knees and cross your legs . You can assist yourself as much as you need by pushing against the chair. Some people are using those large bands to self assist.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:30 PM (IDPbH)

93
My "goal" if I had a real goal, but it's more of a fantasy at this point would be weighing 200# with a 30" waist.

I'd be JACKED.

Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at June 30, 2017 06:30 PM (hdoNb)

94 >>>80 @76 Ace

60 pounds in 12 months.

...

well the trouble is I've lost my easy 40 pounds and am down to the 15 pounds I can never lose.

Posted by: ace at June 30, 2017 06:30 PM (8rNrN)

95 Another good back workout is deadlift then shrugs then cleans then rows then finish with chins.

Posted by: Banana Splits Guy at June 30, 2017 06:31 PM (RrhD2)

96 @76 Ace - I should clarify one thing. The methodology rewards itself. The freedom to eat what I want is my reward for my hard work. I don't have to be resentful because I want a snickers bar or feel guilty for eating that rack of spare ribs on Saturday night.

I LOVE my swimming because I know it means I can eat those five pieces of cheesecake and two Whoppers and that's going to be OK when I hit the scales.

I've leveled out at 190 but that's perfectly healthy at 6'2 and I don't expect to lose anymore at this point.

Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:32 PM (khIpu)

97 >>>Someone mentioned numeric upthread...

What's it supposed to do?

And

Is there any science behind it?

...

I thought it was for joint health, but someone in this thread said it was for muscle fatigue, so who knows?

I take glutamine for muscle recovery. Not sure if that does anything either.

Posted by: ace at June 30, 2017 06:32 PM (8rNrN)

98 Any body have a good workout with one of those rubber band contraptions that won't put your eye out?

Posted by: Pedo at June 30, 2017 06:32 PM (lIZQs)

99 Don't be a crazy-head, Ace. That would leave one less pro-liberty person in the World, who needs that? You don't want to stroke out, and have someone feeding you mush for 10 years. At a certain point, love handles are just that - parts of a person who is valued for more than their physical beauty.

Peace Out.

Posted by: BarcelonaCarmen at June 30, 2017 06:33 PM (RHjCR)

100 You'll never catch me running. I'm afraid I'd have a heart attack and over the long term it'll ruin your joints.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at June 30, 2017 06:33 PM (4ErVI)

101 Not so much GAINZZZ as RECOVEREEEEEZZZZ. I developed lower back pain on the day Steve Scalise was shot and I suspect it was merely my rage causing all my muscles to tense that did it. Regardless, after some days of pain I began doing some exercises recommended by WebMD and am as of yesterday pretty much back to normal.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, the Unwoking Dead at June 30, 2017 06:33 PM (Nwg0u)

102 My gainz plan was to lose 100 pounds in a year. I missed it by 2 weeks I am down 101 pounds as of this morning. So I celebrated by buying a new .357 for mah gun gainz.

Posted by: Big V at June 30, 2017 06:35 PM (qnAGA)

103 @94 Ace - What's your carb/protein/fat % balance look like?

Clarification #2 Eat what you want as long as you have this particular balance. Types of foods don't matter:

50-55% Carb/20-25% Protein/20-25% Fat

You burn off the carbs during the exercise, the protein is for recovery, the fat is for fun.

Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:36 PM (khIpu)

104 But won't all this fasting adversely impact cookbook sales?

Posted by: rickl at June 30, 2017 06:36 PM (sdi6R)

105 101 Not so much GAINZZZ as RECOVEREEEEEZZZZ. I developed lower back pain on the day Steve Scalise was shot and I suspect it was merely my rage causing all my muscles to tense that did it. Regardless, after some days of pain I began doing some exercises recommended by WebMD and am as of yesterday pretty much back to normal.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, the Unwoking Dead at June 30, 2017 06:33 PM (Nwg0u)

It's funny how vague pain can be worrying. I've had severe back pain, to the point where I started thinking it was something like bone cancer, only to discover it was my office chair and another time it was my mattress.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at June 30, 2017 06:37 PM (4ErVI)

106 101 Not so much GAINZZZ as RECOVEREEEEEZZZZ. I developed lower back pain on the day Steve Scalise was shot and I suspect it was merely my rage causing all my muscles to tense that did it. Regardless, after some days of pain I began doing some exercises recommended by WebMD and am as of yesterday pretty much back to normal.
Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, the Unwoking Dead at June 30, 2017 06:33 PM (Nwg0u)

Main concern as I get older. I can play/practice tennis hard
for hours but I have to stop myself way before I want to because I know that as soon as I stop that's when the recovery issues begin. I ice my self down after every session now to stop any cramping.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:37 PM (IDPbH)

107 >>> My gainz plan was to lose 100 pounds in a year. I missed it by 2 weeks I am down 101 pounds as of this morning.

Congratulations! Did you start out as Huge V?

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 06:37 PM (jw2Xw)

108 I wish I had access to one of those cryogenic therapy rooms. I'd like to know if they work as advertised.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:38 PM (IDPbH)

109 @102 Congrats man you probably saved years of your life

Posted by: ThomasR at June 30, 2017 06:38 PM (khIpu)

110 I was well over 3 bills last June

It was a diet or die time.

Posted by: Big V at June 30, 2017 06:39 PM (qnAGA)

111 When I get the urge to exercise I lie down quietly until it goes away.

--Mark Twain

Posted by: Dave at Buffalo Roam at June 30, 2017 06:39 PM (U3hi9)

112 44 Anybody got a good lat workout for a guy with no gym, just free weights, a pulley and a chin bar in the garage?

Been doing a "pull across the the chest" thing with the pulley.
Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (3myMJ)

Bent-over (shut up) barbell rows and dumbbell rows in addition to pull-ups.

Posted by: Insomniac at June 30, 2017 06:39 PM (0mRoj)

113 "Just to maintain some weight, I found that an ice cream shake with a raw
egg, half a stick of butter, two instant breakfasts, and a full scoop
of purest whey protein I could find - would provide about 1k calories."

Last time I looked at one of those instant breakfast packets, I noted that something like half of the powder contained inside was straight sugar.

Caveat emptor for those who must be, or choose to be, sugar-averse.

Posted by: torquewrench at June 30, 2017 06:39 PM (ujwCG)

114 Exercising after 50?

Personally, after about the 30th donut, getting out of the chair to brush the powdered sugar off my shirt is enough exercise.

Posted by: Gentlemen, this is democracy manifest at June 30, 2017 06:42 PM (LWu6U)

115 Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at June 30, 2017 06:37 PM (4ErVI)

Funny bit by some comedian who talked about how it's embarrassing transitioning to getting old . When you hurt your neck when you were younger it was because you were cliff diving or something cool like that. Now when someone asks ' hey how'd you hurt your neck?' You have to answer ' sleeping'.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:43 PM (IDPbH)

116 1. muscle weighs more then fat-170 is pretty light
2. put away the scale, enjoy life more
3 if you do want to stay in shape, go by how you feel and inchs not pounds.

Posted by: Rob at June 30, 2017 06:43 PM (h7FJA)

117 If you got a chin bar, you can also get some tow straps from the hardware store and do some inverted rows.

Posted by: Banana Splits Guy at June 30, 2017 06:43 PM (RrhD2)

118 4 day fast sounds Biblical! I'd have 8 scrambled eggs with cheese and bacon with a .5 pound juicy steak on the side ready for my meal coming out.

What is your meal doing to be Ace?

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:44 PM (2qHjF)

119 I FINALLY got under 170 and have held there for the past couple weeks, so am excited about that. Have not been at this weight for 30 years when I was in the military. Still exercising regularly except for when life gets in the way but oh well... still feel great. As far as coming off a longer fast, I wouldn't worry too much about breaking fast - just a small snack to get things moving then have a good meal. I wouldnt eat ALL carbs and sugars though.. that would be a spike and you would not feel good afterward.

Anyway - keep it up and keep the weight off. I again thank you ACE for this blog as it introduced me to intermittent fasting and got me off my T2 meds.

Posted by: sarge2909 at June 30, 2017 06:44 PM (ob9ea)

120 Ya know, Ace must be a pretty healthy guy because I have never heard of any body doing such radical changes to their own body on a regular basis.

Posted by: Ben Had at June 30, 2017 06:45 PM (PCxrC)

121 Refined Sugar should be killed with fire.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:47 PM (2qHjF)

122 I LOVE my swimming because I know it means I can eat those five pieces of cheesecake and two Whoppers and that's going to be OK when I hit the scales.

Out of curiosity on you eat what you want plan, how old are you?

Posted by: Grump928(C) at June 30, 2017 06:48 PM (LTHVh)

123 I'm of the opinion that fasting is never really a good idea.

You're a machine, machine's need fuel, no fuel, the machine stops running.

Better strategy is to eat cleaner and more frequently.

Also remember you're body is homeostatic, it wants to be the way it wants to be.

If you have a specific weight or fitness level that you're trying to reach you will have to make permanent changes to your life in order to achieve them and maintain them.

Posted by: Kreplach at June 30, 2017 06:49 PM (9A6UB)

124 What the hell are "athletic greens?"

I do 3 day fasts about 3 times a year, mostly after the feeding holidays, Thanksgiving, Christmas, 4th of July. 5 days is too much for me. This years after-holiday fast, I lost 10 lbs and after a month had only gained back 2 so I considered it a rousing success.
I drink coffee and tea but stay away from solid food cause, you know, fast. However, in the times when I just could not stand not eating something, I would take a couple of bites of watermelon which satisfies enough to get past the pain.
I would not work out too much - 3 days in a row during a fast might be dangerous. Break your fast slowly by only eating 1 meal the 1st day, and so on until you are return to your normal diet, or hopefully a little less than your normal diet if you are still about your goal.

Posted by: Hayao at June 30, 2017 06:49 PM (w/bVh)

125 I wish I had access to one of those cryogenic therapy rooms. I'd like to know if they work as advertised.

Are they just cold? If so, you could get a 2nd job at the icehouse.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at June 30, 2017 06:50 PM (LTHVh)

126 49 Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (2qHjF)

Can you describe "standing side crunch"?

Thanks.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:17 PM (3myMJ)

Grab a dumbbell and hold it in one hand and bend down to the side
with the dumbbell as far as you can go and then crunch back to the side
without the dumbbell. Then hold it in the other hand and do the other
side. Make sure to keep your abs and core tight and flexed like you are
doing crunches. Also try and get a good stretch on the way down with the
dumbbell in your hand.

Does this make sense and help?

No, no, no.

No.

Never do those again...unless growing your external obliques (love handles) sounds like a good idea to you.

Go to youtube and type 'Jeff Cavaliere' or 'Athlean-X' into the search box. He has some fantastic stuff there, including a couple of videos on how to get rid of your love handles. It works.

Posted by: Sixkiller at June 30, 2017 06:50 PM (FLU20)

127 I add 1 T of lemon juice to my ACV water. It ups the benefits and makes it taste better. I call it my pre-meal cocktail.

Posted by: Abby Normal at June 30, 2017 06:50 PM (cQO95)

128 So basically I've been cheating like a bastard and then lying about it to myself.
.........

Tee hee. Don't sweat it honeybuns.
Try lying to the whole country.

Posted by: hILLRY o O at June 30, 2017 06:51 PM (HgMAr)

129 Posted by: Sixkiller at June 30, 2017 06:50 PM (FLU20)

Yeah agree. I didn't want to contradict a poster. Workout opinions are like gun, music and movie opinions.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:52 PM (IDPbH)

130 Yeah, I'm under 100 lb this week, but that's because I have a nasty stomach bug. Once I recover, I'll be back to 102. (I'm 5' and have only as much muscle as is required to tote a 5yo and a 1yo.)

I need to flatten my stomach a bit before August bc we are going to Mexico for my sister's wedding, and I have set a goal of being the hottest middle-aged lady there who has had 2 9lb babies in the last 6 years.

Posted by: Mrs. Peel at June 30, 2017 06:53 PM (JPRju)

131 Who doesn't skip leg day? Batman, that's who.

Posted by: BourbonChicken at June 30, 2017 06:22 PM (VdICR)
.........

That's right, fried chicken legs are one of my favorites.

Posted by: Ben Affleck at June 30, 2017 06:53 PM (HgMAr)

132 FTSB - A man with a history of sex acts with vegetables has been sentenced to life in prison

How is this not Florida Man?

Posted by: Grump928(C) at June 30, 2017 06:53 PM (LTHVh)

133 Dr. Fung doesn't recommend doing longer fasts (7+ days) without a doctor's monitoring. Areas of greatest risk are blood pressure changes (especially if you're on medication for HBP), insulin levels (if you're taking insulin or metformin or similar), etc. intermittent fasts of 12-18 hours aren't as challenging, and for many people, 24 hours a few times a month is plenty.

I'm prediabetic, on blood pressure and beta blocker and blood thinning meds, but not blood sugar meds, and I'm able to do longer fasts. (I've got hundreds of pounds to lose.)

I've done water+salt+magnesium only fasts of 5-7 days, and water + fat fasts of 14 days. I monitored blood sugars and blood pressure several times each day, and kept taking my prescriptions and supplements. I started with shorter fasts and worked my way up.

Refeeding syndrome wasn't a problem - disaster pants, a time or two, but not every time - but every fast is different. On one fast, it took take five days just to burn through my last carb-heavy meal and for my blood sugar to dip below 100. On another, I felt ill on day three and ended "early."

Posted by: sulla at June 30, 2017 06:54 PM (xqnzX)

134 If I need something to put me off my feed I watch Nancy Pelosi videos. That does it.

I hate houses that need work and I have One. I can do some killer workouts and not get injured but hump buckets or landscape rock and did holes and I wound up wit F'ed up hip and shoulder tendinitis that kept me up at night for 4 months and required steroid shots. Still weak but I'm in the gym a few times a week now weights carefully, core and elliptical blah blah. I could be a gym rat. When I get going I dont want to leave.

Also just started L-algernine and still throw citrulline in my workout drink before and after. Weight is like a Yoyo. Can't figure it. I never binge, eat junk. Hell. I just want a pill that has a weight number on it.

"I think ill take the 165 one doc, thanks." And thats it 165, no matter what you eat. This in America amirite?! We should have that.

Posted by: Cannibal Bob at June 30, 2017 06:54 PM (31vnC)

135 126 49 Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:16 PM (2qHjF)

Can you describe "standing side crunch"?

Thanks.

Posted by: Meremortal, 23 at June 30, 2017 06:17 PM (3myMJ)

Grab a dumbbell and hold it in one hand and bend down to the side
with the dumbbell as far as you can go and then crunch back to the side
without the dumbbell. Then hold it in the other hand and do the other
side. Make sure to keep your abs and core tight and flexed like you are
doing crunches. Also try and get a good stretch on the way down with the
dumbbell in your hand.

Does this make sense and help?

No, no, no.

No.

Never do those again...unless growing your external obliques (love handles) sounds like a good idea to you.

Go to youtube and type 'Jeff Cavaliere' or 'Athlean-X' into the search box. He has some fantastic stuff there, including a couple of videos on how to get rid of your love handles. It works.
Posted by: Sixkiller at June 30, 2017 06:50 PM (FLU20)

Will do! Thanks!

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at June 30, 2017 06:54 PM (2qHjF)

136 Ace,

I started doing IF last July when you debuted your GAINZZZ thread. Have been at it ever since. Have been at 20/4 for past few months. That's just a way of life for me now. Always will be. The wife finally got used to it and realized it wasn't going to make me anorexic, so the 'push back' stopped.

I dropped 60 pounds with this stuff. The really cool thing for me: I'm now wearing size 34 jeans while maintaining my XXL shirts...and this at 5'11", 215. Still pounding the iron. Today was deadlift day.

I owe you a tremendous debt. It was a life-changer for me.

Posted by: Sixkiller at June 30, 2017 06:54 PM (FLU20)

137
Funny bit by some comedian who talked about how it's embarrassing transitioning to getting old . When you hurt your neck when you were younger it was because you were cliff diving or something cool like that. Now when someone asks ' hey how'd you hurt your neck?' You have to answer ' sleeping'.
Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 06:43 PM

Cliff diving in your sleep.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at June 30, 2017 06:55 PM (IqV8l)

138 I've been having health issues for the past 7 weeks. It's nothing severe, but I just feel "off." It started with mild headaches and spread to my neck, shoulders, and back, with the occasional twinges in my arms and hips. I know I grind my teeth at night so I bought an anti-grinding guard. That helped with the head and neck pain, but I still feel a little "off." I saw a photo of myself on facebook a few days ago and it was the first candid shot of myself I've seen in a long time that didn't make me think, 'Wow, the camera adds ten pounds.' I weighed myself and I've lost 6 or 7 pounds since...whenever I last weighed myself, maybe 2 or 3 weeks ago. I haven't been dieting and I don't have an exercise regime other than stretching every morning. My weight usually fluctuates just within 3 pounds or so.

I should probably see a doctor but I have crap insurance with a really high deductible and I'm afraid they'll want to run expensive tests.

TLDR: I wonder if I would benefit from a fast. Not to lose more weight, but to flush out whatever might be causing these symptoms. It would probably be a weekend-long fast since there ain't no way I'm working while I'm hangry.

Posted by: Aunt Luna at June 30, 2017 06:56 PM (Zd2ZF)

139 I'm at 23 hours fast right now.

I feel fine but whatever I eat better be good.

I want Chima.

Posted by: andrew jarbacka at June 30, 2017 06:57 PM (DLWum)

140 Sixkiller- Sounds like your doing well.

Posted by: Ben Had at June 30, 2017 06:58 PM (PCxrC)

141 Wanna get rid of love handles? Kick a heavy bag.

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at June 30, 2017 06:58 PM (OlNRF)

142 Posted by: Aunt Luna at June 30, 2017 06:56 PM (Zd2ZF)

You need to go to your doctor . At the minimum get an annual physical. Most policies cover that.

Posted by: Jack Sock at June 30, 2017 07:00 PM (IDPbH)

143 Turmeric is supposed to be an anti-inflammation medicine. I've been taking two horse pills in the am, and it seems to work for me. Also like Citrulline for pre workout. A little speedy, but works against soreness.

Posted by: Regular joe at June 30, 2017 07:00 PM (7PllL)

144 TLDR: I wonder if I would benefit from a fast. Not
to lose more weight, but to flush out whatever might be causing these
symptoms. It would probably be a weekend-long fast since there ain't no
way I'm working while I'm hangry.

Posted by: Aunt Luna at June 30, 2017 06:56 PM (Zd2ZF)

Fell your pain about not wanting to go to the doctor. As for your question, there's only one way to find out. Each person is different. My 83 yo mother used fasts to get off statin drugs and lower her blood sugar (no longer considered the dreaded "pre-diabetic")

Posted by: Hayao at June 30, 2017 07:00 PM (w/bVh)

145 >>> Wanna get rid of love handles? Kick a heavy bag.

That could lead to divorce or jail.

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 07:02 PM (jw2Xw)

146 Maybe not GAINZZZ per se, but I am enjoying some T&A* right now.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
*(turkey & avocado sandwich from Togo's.)

Posted by: qdpsteve at June 30, 2017 07:04 PM (eMKNe)

147 "It started with mild headaches and spread to my neck, shoulders, and back, with the occasional twinges in my arms and hips."

I sometimes have similar symptoms and after a course of slow careful upper body stretching and relaxing can get them to safely vamoose.

It pays to be attentive to what's going on all the way up to the very top of your spinal column. The Atlas bone. And how your head, which is amazingly heavy for its size, is being positioned atop the vertebral stack.

When things aren't quite right higher up, lower levels that are carrying and compensating for the misaligned loads will begin to send signals of complaint.

Posted by: torquewrench at June 30, 2017 07:06 PM (ujwCG)

148 Funny man

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at June 30, 2017 07:06 PM (OlNRF)

149 140
Sixkiller- Sounds like your doing well.

Hey Ben!

Doing fine...now.

Have bulging disks in my neck and they trapped the nerve that controls my left lat and left triceps -- traffic accident when I was 26...sitting at a stoplight, got rear-ended by a drunk, and now 35 years later those chickens are coming home to roost -- but I received neck injections (finally!) on 5 June and they've worked like a charm. I get a booster injection on 5 July.

Here was the impact in weightlifting terms: on 18 January, I benched 320 for my peak single; on 25 January I benched 105 for 3 reps. That was the best I could manage. So I've been putting up with that crap for 6 months. But I'm on the road to recovery. I hope.

Posted by: Sixkiller at June 30, 2017 07:06 PM (FLU20)

150 Now 23 months into high fat / low carb. Lost a total of 83 pounds (from 276 to 193). 205 was the goal, but was still too fat. Now it's 185. I have some old clothes I want to get into. BP is 120/85 and cholesterol is 180ish. Nearly 70 years old now.

Posted by: Agitator at June 30, 2017 07:08 PM (bcuVx)

151 Gainzzzzzz!

I've been doing 5x5s. Dieting sucks, best to gain muscle so I can actually eat real food.

Posted by: Robert at June 30, 2017 07:09 PM (mknWS)

152 Hey Ben,

Was thinking about you when I made this snake trap video a couple of days ago.

(Does this video make my ass look big? I hate that it makes me appear to have a gut with that loose shirt on. I assure you, I do not.)

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJkHSYrqZ4Hy5Sdil5taBqQ

Posted by: Sixkiller at June 30, 2017 07:09 PM (FLU20)

153 ace, try zero carb instead of fasting

Posted by: votermom pimping great books at June 30, 2017 07:09 PM (hMwEB)

154 Trying to restart the GAINZZZ. Im 5'9" and got down to the low 170s from about 215. Now Im back up to 185 ( I think I was couple of pounds heavier last week). All this was do to eating worse (although not as bad as I used to) and lack of exercise. My waist has started to grow back (My clothes are getting tighter). So this week I have been eating a modified Paleo (I dont really believe in a lot of the theory except that high fat low carb is good). Modified in the sense that I'm not eating purely grass fed meat and probably some other modifications, but Im basically eating meat, fish, salads with Dr. Bragg Vinegrette, cucumbers, Primal mayonnaise, and guacamole and fruit (Ive tried to not eat fruit but I feel realy bad when I do).. I also have eaten a few NuGo Slim bars (not the greatest but better than most protein bars in terms of low carbs), and I had a potato yesterday (got fish at a restaurant and it came with a potato).

I wrenched my back last week so I haven't been exercising but I hope to start up soon. I bought the Bowflex adjustable dumbells with stand and bench so we'll see how that goes.

Played ultimate Frisbee at Venice beach yesterday and two weeks ago. I AM OUT OF SHAPE. (PS Why do I live in the People's Soviet Socialist Happy Fun Camp of California. This is why. Perfect weather, no chance of rain).

My inspiration is my dad, who has always been in great shape anyway, who told me he went on Paleo and his stomach flattened out.

Hard to do low Carb on Saturday when I go for Chulent at the synagogue with scotch. We'll see how it goes. Hopefully Ill have some GAINZZ soon enough.

Posted by: Keyser at June 30, 2017 07:10 PM (v8/5X)

155 Actually, I wish I could hang a heavy bag. I know I could clear the space, but I would scare the crap out of the cats, especially if I got into a rage fueled groove.

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 07:10 PM (jw2Xw)

156 Just found out last night that my nearest Marie Callender's restaurant is closed forever.

Posted by: qdpsteve at June 30, 2017 07:10 PM (eMKNe)

157 lol, ok, those nerds on naked and afraid sure aint skeered to eat burgers after 21 days eating toe nails.

Posted by: andrew jarbacka at June 30, 2017 07:11 PM (DLWum)

158 I've been doing 5x5s. Dieting sucks, best to gain muscle so I can actually eat real food.

Yeah. Me too. Trying to rebuild my foundation. Pick up heavy stuff and put it down. Lather, rinse, repeat. Keeping it simple for now. Squats, bench, deadlifts.

Posted by: Sixkiller at June 30, 2017 07:11 PM (FLU20)

159 I GAINZZZed an intestinal virus yesterday. I think it's gone now.

Posted by: Blanco Basura at June 30, 2017 07:14 PM (IcT7t)

160 151 Gainzzzzzz!

I've been doing 5x5s. Dieting sucks, best to gain muscle so I can actually eat real food.

***

yeah, Rippetoe makes the same point.

You can't really put on muscle while not eating.

You can't really lose fat without losing some muscle.

You look better with muscle than without.

Put on the muscle and then do the diet, that's what I think.

Posted by: andrew jarbacka at June 30, 2017 07:14 PM (DLWum)

161 This is why I write down everything I eat when I'm dieting. It's a lot harder to cheat every other day and not think about it.

Posted by: Ace's liver at June 30, 2017 07:15 PM (Xuv2G)

162 155>> Hang it in the garage. Makes an excuse to clean it up. Just take it down when your done cause all the stuff settles and then it's like kicking a makiwara.

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at June 30, 2017 07:15 PM (OlNRF)

163 Actor James Cromwell - whose credits include "American Horror Story: Asylum" and "Babe," for which he was nominated for an Oscar - has been sentenced to a week in jail for refusing to pay fines stemming from the protest of a natural-gas power plant in Wawayanda, New York.

At trial, he argued that the danger of increased carbon dioxide justified whatever means necessary. I heard an interview with him several years ago in which he discussed saving his shit for fertilizer.

That'll do, Jim. That'll do.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks, the Unwoking Dead at June 30, 2017 07:16 PM (Nwg0u)

164 yeah, Rippetoe makes the same point.

You can't really put on muscle while not eating.

You can't really lose fat without losing some muscle.

You look better with muscle than without.

Put on the muscle and then do the diet, that's what I think.
Posted by: andrew jarbacka at June 30, 2017 07:14 PM (DLWum)

On the other hand, Rippetoe has been hammered by critics for his gut. There are lots of guys out there with big muscles and low fat percentages.

Posted by: Ace's liver at June 30, 2017 07:16 PM (Xuv2G)

165 I did yoga two days in a row and then my shoulder acted up. Been icing it and taking ibuprofen, but I guess not consistently enough because it's still not completely better after 4 days.

I stopped it before it got bad, but I was feeling so good about 2 days of exercise IN A ROW. Yeah, ain't much, but it took forever to get over the stoopid evil cold from hell in May. Was still weak for the first half of June! I'd been doing great in April...

I may be experiencing slight frustration.

Posted by: Mama AJ at June 30, 2017 07:17 PM (wwL6Q)

166 Lost 8 lbs in two weeks basically from cutting out booze during the week and Sundays. Not only does that cut calories but also maintains willpower.

Since it is Friday evening I am working on my second scotch, munching on pita and hummus, getting ready to cook a strip steak with fried potatoes and planning on popcorn later, after cookies of course.

Two lbs a week will work. Oh, I also work out, aerobic and anaerobic, 4-5 days a week for an hour or so. Seventy two years old, 5' 11" and 230 lbs currently.

Posted by: Javems at June 30, 2017 07:18 PM (yOqwj)

167 want muscles? check out @SBakerMD on twitter

50 year old orthopedic doctor who is zero carbing (no planrs all meat)

Posted by: votermom pimping great books at June 30, 2017 07:19 PM (hMwEB)

168 What the hell are "athletic greens?"

Soylant green

Posted by: Jean at June 30, 2017 07:19 PM (9TU00)

169 Only the first two days without food are difficult...EXACTLY what they said at SERE school!

Posted by: Jim at June 30, 2017 07:19 PM (rnwV8)

170 >>>On the other hand, Rippetoe has been hammered by critics for his gut. There are lots of guys out there with big muscles and low fat percentages.

Weak, get strong.
Fat, get lean.
Fat and weak needs to get fat and strong before going to lean and strong.

Posted by: Banana Splits Guy at June 30, 2017 07:20 PM (RrhD2)

171 Step 1: Build a garage...

Posted by: fluffy at June 30, 2017 07:21 PM (jw2Xw)

172 Yeah. Me too. Trying to rebuild my foundation. Pick up heavy stuff and put it down. Lather, rinse, repeat. Keeping it simple for now. Squats, bench, deadlifts.
Posted by: Sixkiller at June 30, 2017 07:11 PM (FLU20)

I discovered a website last year called Strong Lifts 5x5 that covers that and also overhead presses and barbell rows. I've discovered that, one, I got sissy girl arms but also I can squat a lot of fucking weight as long as
I keep good form. Seriously, I never appreciated how much power are in the legs and hips.

Well, I knew the power of a woman's hips, but that's neither hear nor there.

Posted by: Robert at June 30, 2017 07:23 PM (mknWS)

173 I'm currently plateaued at 175# at 5'7". Forty lbs. lost in 6 months. No weight loss in about a month due to a few extra cheat meals, but lower body fat (about 20%), thinner waist, and muscle gains in chest, back, arms, and quads.

I have a potential six-pack still hidden under 5-10 lbs. of love handles and tummy blubber yet to go. Time to cut back on the cheats and keep the lifting GAINZ going.

Posted by: SMOD Keeper at June 30, 2017 07:24 PM (onq2p)

174 So, I recently lost 14 lbs in a week and a half with a bad bout of food poisoning. Had Campylobacter from eating undercooked chicken -- if you haven't heard of it (I hadn't), look it up on WebMD, it's pretty nasty. On the plus side, I had no problem not eating (due to abdominal pain and diarrhea). Now, I'm focused on just keeping the weight off, and I've been more or less successful.
For workouts, I've reduced my weights and am going with higher rep, more volume. Also added swimming, since I've always felt great when I've been doing a lot of (long distance) swimming.

Posted by: TimInHawaii at June 30, 2017 07:26 PM (12QrE)

175 Ace, three points:

1 - there is a huge energy boost on the third day, and the hunger does subside each day after
2 - don't sweat the re-feeding; it is only a problem if you are malnourished to begin with. Just have a handful of nuts an hour before your first meal.
3 - The maple syrup (or honey) in the master clense is a horrid idea if you are insulin insensitive at all

Posted by: Muggs at June 30, 2017 07:26 PM (plmbZ)

176 169 Only the first two days without food are difficult...EXACTLY what they said at SERE school!
Posted by: Jim at June 30, 2017 07:19 PM (rnwV

I had to go without food for a couple days for medical reasons, and it wasn't a problem. Didn't really get hungry... just a bit weak by the end of the second day. I wouldn't have had any trouble going longer... just not sure it's a good idea, even for fat people.

Posted by: Ace's liver at June 30, 2017 07:27 PM (Xuv2G)

177 "You can't really put on muscle while not eating. You can't really lose fat without losing some muscle. You look better with muscle than without. Put on the muscle and then do the diet, that's what I think."

Yeah, this.

And: muscle burns fat. Even when not being actively exercised.

The more muscle you've put on, the higher your baseline metabolic load becomes.

Posted by: torquewrench at June 30, 2017 07:35 PM (ujwCG)

178 >>>Who doesn't skip leg day? Batman, that's who.
<<<

I just polished off a leftover grilled chicken leg because it was calling out to me all lonesome from its container. Probably 225 calories of pure deliciousness.

It's okay though, because I most likely walked 10 miles today.

Posted by: Fritz at June 30, 2017 07:36 PM (/HfBH)

179 qdpsteve...are you still here?

Posted by: concrete girl at June 30, 2017 07:48 PM (EqvVS)

180 Just looted the gun safe for the few items left to me after the cleaning lady stole everything to take shooting tomorrow, so I have questions for the Morons.

Does this Colt 44 Magnum make my ass look fat? If so, would the Colt 357 Python or the Colt 38 Diamondback be a better choice?

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, who is not a vinegar-c**ted hag, thank you very much. at June 30, 2017 08:06 PM (kXoT0)

181 On the other hand, Rippetoe has been hammered by critics for his gut. There are lots of guys out there with big muscles and low fat percentages

***

rip's answer is he's old and he drinks and he can deadlift 500.

Posted by: andrew jarbacka at June 30, 2017 08:06 PM (DLWum)

182 I'm actually a little spacey. I wasn't yesterday and wasn't earlier today, but right now, my brain is pretty foggy, if I'm being honest.

You may be dehydrated. Drink a couple glasses of water and your head may clear. Been there, done that.

Posted by: Delurk Ergo Sum at June 30, 2017 08:20 PM (95fg3)

183 I've heard of people breaking fasts with miso soup. Even four days seems extreme, be careful Ace.

Posted by: venus velvet at June 30, 2017 09:07 PM (g94P/)

184
You're down to 170? I haven't seen the scales hit 170 since I last saw my johnson.

Posted by: Levin at June 30, 2017 09:44 PM (PNwAd)

185 If you listen to the Fasting Talk podcast by Jimmy Moore they talk a lot about this. Dr. Fung is on a few of the episodes. One thing someone on that said is to take a tsp of salt on your tongue every 2 hrs during a fast and that will help curb the appetite. Also the re-feeding thing is just to eat something a couple of hours before a big meal like some nuts or berrys just to get your gut used to some food before you kill it with a 20 oz steak.

Posted by: Mike Hall at June 30, 2017 10:09 PM (yikhW)

186 Ace!

From the Fung article:

"So you can see that one of the key pre-requisites for refeeding syndrome is severe, prolonged malnutrition. How common is it? A study of over 10,000 hospitalized patients only found an incidence of 0.43%. These are the sickest of sick people, but still was found rarely. This is actually on overestimate since it also included diabetic ketoacidosis, which is a different mechanism entirely. The main groups that had this disease? Severe malnourishment and alcoholics."

A tee-totaler of nearly 29 such as yourself shouldn't have an issue.

Ray Cronise describes his 23 day fast here as "socially but not biologically radical", and I think that's right.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNzZod_d18A&feature=youtu.be

One thing I have noticed over the year is that throws one's crap eating habits into sharp relief. Even if you eat "good" by American standards, you're not getting anywhere near the minerals you need.

The smart thing to do--the easy way to play it--is to let the fasting guide you to better food.

Cronise is big on how the salt, fat, sugar diet we all eat shuts us out of the rich variety of flavors we can eat. I don't know if he's talking bark or buffalo hooves or what, but I suspect our calorie/nutrient ratio is WAY outta whack. That's why Fung's bone broth is so good. It's all kinds of nutrients with just a bit of fat.

Posted by: moviegique at June 30, 2017 10:17 PM (CcUfv)

187 Studies of hedonic overeating (PET scans, fMRI, etc.) have shown that there's a vicious cycle that sets in: as we overeat, our reward receptors get "downregulated" (desensitized), so we have to eat More to get the same reward (we see this in, e.g., alcoholism and heroin addiction as well). At the same time, those of us who have responded strongly to the pleasure of food in the past (neurologically sensitive to food-reward) are goaded by our own biochemistry to seek that reward all the more. In addition, if we have even a small amount of the "forbidden" food, that kicks off the strongest craving of all and often leads to a binge.

IOW, there are solid neuro-hormonal reasons for overweight people to have more trouble maintaining a lean weight than naturally lean folks. Among others, their brains don't light up like a Christmas tree in the reward circuits when they eat a piece of cake.

Posted by: Beverly at June 30, 2017 10:33 PM (JG8mh)

188 Beverly,

Just so, and one reason why fasting is so effective.

I think Ace is going to do well with this. Especially if he realizes that it's No Big Deal.

Posted by: moviegique at June 30, 2017 11:09 PM (CcUfv)

189 "You can't lose fat without also losing muscle" is the complement of "a calorie is a calorie". You're saying "My body doesn't distinguish between energy sources, therefore:"

1) If I get my 2,000 calories a day from 100% sugar or 100% protein or 100% fat, it doesn't mater

2) If I have a deficit, my body doesn't distinguish between the fat it has stored for this very purpose and the muscular tissue I need to survive.

Fung would disagree with both of those. Also, check out that Ray Cronise video. The guy hasn't exercised in five years. He's not buff or anything, but he puts a lie to the notion that "fat and weak" has to get "fat and strong" before getting "lean and strong," in the sense that he was fat and weak, and he got lean and strong(er).

No matter how strong Rip is, he's still fat, and probably the best evidence you could ask for that building muscle is almost orthogonal to losing fat.

Posted by: moviegique at July 01, 2017 02:02 AM (CcUfv)

190 But don't take my word for it, how about Terry Crews and Keith Harmon:

https://intensivedietarymanagement.com/keith-harmon/

I've seen repeated claims that fasting =grows= muscle. Whether this is supposed to be through stimulating GH or what, I don't know. Heat and cold may stimulate muscle growth as well.

Hormesis is an interesting thing.

Posted by: moviegique at July 01, 2017 02:12 AM (CcUfv)

191 5 days of starving yourself?

Someone is getting stupid.

Posted by: Mellow at July 01, 2017 09:47 AM (upiC5)

192 Trying to get the physique of a malnourished Hollywood starlet?

Workout more and eat more. More you starve yourself the more you hit your basil metabolism of min calories and unable to burn more extra off and the more your hormones change to burn even less. The more you eat, the higher the % of your basil metabolism you are able to burn off extra. Eat 1500 cal/d, burn 0 extra off. Eat 2000, burn 200. Eat 3000, 700 burn off. 3500 c/d, burn off extra 1000.

12 hours of workouts a week. 3,000-3,500+ calories. You'll be a lean, strong and deceptively light person.

Posted by: Mellow at July 01, 2017 10:11 AM (upiC5)

193 Cronise talks about basal metabolism in that video. In all his years of study, he never met anyone with a broken metabolism. It's pretty much: You weigh X, you burn Y (where Y is tightly correlated to X).

And yet everyone (himself included for years) is obsessed with trying to increase metabolism.

Posted by: moviegique at July 01, 2017 02:52 PM (CcUfv)

194 For what it's worth, I've found that a combination of fasted cardio (jogging and running [sometimes walking] ) in the morning, plus intermittent fasting (breakfast at noon, no food after six pm, plus low/no carbs, no sugar, and no dairy, works for me).

The meals are chili for breakfast (beef + chicken + jalapenos + black beans + chili powder) and bacon and eggs for dinner. All I drink anymore is water.

Plus push-ups and crunches before the cardio. I'm currently at 185.8# as of this morning, and as a 48 year old man with a desk job and no energetic hobbies, I think that's pretty good. Used to weigh in at around 235 and got down to the lower 180's through various meal plans which included way too much plant matter, then backslid up to 220 via carbs and sugar. Taubes' book was the eye-opener that got me onto my current routine.

So that's what worked for me. No problems with hunger, and a steady downward-trending weight with gradually-increasing muscular definition.

Posted by: jabrwok at July 01, 2017 03:34 PM (wKZS0)

195 There's something exceptionally fucked up about seeing a Ghirardelli ad at the beginning of the fasting-vs-eating video.

Posted by: Patton at July 01, 2017 06:36 PM (I4h14)

196 After watching those videos, I'm convinced I need to lower my protein intake and increase my fat intake. My carbs are below 25g per day, usually less than 10. I'm pretty sure my protein intake has crept up over the past 6 weeks or so, which, according to the videos, would explain my stall. I'm really happy where I am, but I can do better.

I added a video of Mrs Sixkiller knocking out inclined DB presses with 40 pounders. At 66 years old, she still hits the gym 4 times per week.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJkHSYrqZ4Hy5Sdil5taBqQ

Posted by: Sixkiller at July 01, 2017 07:26 PM (FLU20)

197 Sixkiller--

That's awesome! My mom recently had a mastectomy and the surgeon said he had never seen a woman her age with such good musculature--and she's not doing anything Mrs. Sixkiller's level, but she's been working out for ten years. (She started because she had broken her wrist, and was dismayed at how hard it had been to come back from that.)

Her recovery took just a few weeks, to boot.

So whatever you think about IF or lifting or whatever--do SOMETHING. It'll save your ass down the line.

Posted by: moviegique at July 01, 2017 09:57 PM (CcUfv)

198 Hey Ace - forget the gainzzzz. Back off a bit but generally keep with the low carb and progressive lifting program. Measure your gut with a tape once a week and plot it up on a piece of quadrille paper. Do this for five months. Knock off for Thanksgiving - New Year's. Be happy!

Posted by: KBK at July 02, 2017 01:56 PM (0HoGp)

199 Thanks moviegique! I'm very proud of her!

Posted by: Sixkiller at July 02, 2017 02:05 PM (FLU20)

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