Aetna CEO: Obamacare is in a "Death Spiral"

That's how you got Trump.

The CEO of Aetna, Mark Bertolini, says Obamacare is in a "death spiral." Bertolini was speaking at an event hosted by the Wall Street Journal Wednesday. Asked about the future of Obamacare, Bertolini replied, "I think you will see a lot more withdrawals this year of plans." Humana announced yesterday, shortly after its proposed merger with Aetna collapsed, that it was pulling out from its remaining Obamacare business in 2018.

But don't go popping the corks yet.

Obamacare needs a miracle -- and I give you the G.
O.
P.

Consider Paul Ryan's feel-good meeting with Senate Republicans on Tuesday. The House speaker trekked across the Capitol to reassure senators that lawmakers are making more progress toward repealing the health care law than the media are reporting.
But not everyone was buying it. Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) left before it was over, having heard enough of a conversation that he says centers around keeping Obamacare's Medicaid expansion intact and creating tax credits that he called a "new entitlement program," though a Republican in the room rebutted the notion that the topic of Medicaid expansion came up in the Tuesday meeting with Ryan.
"I hear things that are unacceptable to me," Paul said in an interview afterward. "If they don't seem to care what conservatives think about complete repeal of Obamacare, they’re going to be shocked when they count the votes."

Lamarr Alexander says it will take Trump's personal intervention -- just declaring "We're doing this" -- to get any kind of movement on the issue.

Um, yeah, that's true, and Trump is derelict about being specific on this front, but Republicans have been vowing to repeal this for seven years now and it's kind of insane that they themselves aren't committed to doing just that, no?

Ann Coulter points out that the GOP, when Obama was president and could veto the repeals, passed six Obamacare repeals. But now that Trump is president and (presumably) wouldn't veto a repeal, they sit on their thumbs.

Ever get the feeling you're being played?

Posted by: Ace at 11:38 AM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 1st?

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:35 AM (Enq6K)

2 Ryan talking about medicaid expansion right now...

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:37 AM (Enq6K)

3 good morning Shelvey!

Posted by: @votermom @vm at February 16, 2017 11:37 AM (Om16U)

4 the corgi whistle has been sounded

Posted by: AltonJackson at February 16, 2017 11:37 AM (ZQfW9)

5 I'll take "Things that were said by everybody in 2009/2010 but embargoed by the fake news media" for $1,200, Alex.

Oh shit, it's the Daily Double?? I'll bet everything.

Posted by: broseidon being a capitalist pigdog (yknow, working) at February 16, 2017 11:37 AM (oZ6kz)

6 Trump v. The Uniparty

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks. Laugh at a joke, get another joke free! at February 16, 2017 11:37 AM (Nwg0u)

7 OT But:

https://tinyurl.com/h355zng

College students are so cute. "Berkeley Protesters Exercising, Not Curtailing, Free Speech". LOL

Posted by: Alcoholic Asshole Shut In at February 16, 2017 11:38 AM (CPk08)

8
Ever get the feeling you're being played?
Posted by: Ace

Every day.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at February 16, 2017 11:39 AM (IqV8l)

9 Ann Coulter points out that the GOP, when Obama was president and could veto the repeals, passed six Obamacare repeals. But now that Trump is president and (presumably) wouldn't veto a repeal, they sit on their thumbs.

--

Look, legislation is written by lobbyists. Congress basically sells space on the paper. That's why Pelosi had to pass it to find out what's in it.

Ain't no lobbyist wanting to repeal/replace it so Congress has nothing ready to go.

We should crowd source the replace legislation.

Posted by: @votermom @vm at February 16, 2017 11:39 AM (Om16U)

10 Fuck the Fucking GOPe.

Time to send in Major:

http://tinyurl.com/New-Ghost-in-the-Shell-Trailer

Posted by: Sharkman at February 16, 2017 11:39 AM (zKIA2)

11 Obviously we are being played... The ass hole senators can't even vote for Trumps cabinet picks.... Way to go you spineless group of Dicks/Dickettes....

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:39 AM (O2RFr)

12 Medicaid needs to be abolished too. if the state's want to find this crap then put it on them.

all this Free Shit!! from DC is what has distorted the health market in the first place.

Posted by: Boulder terlit hobo at February 16, 2017 11:39 AM (MOwG6)

13 Ace,

If Trump goes to war with his own party, the consequences will be ugly.

He will have to drive Ryan from the speakership, and really crack the whip in the senate.

I'm game. And I think America will understand.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at February 16, 2017 11:39 AM (rF0hx)

14 Obamacare will die. I mean, the USSR lasted only 70 years.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks. Laugh at a joke, get another joke free! at February 16, 2017 11:39 AM (Nwg0u)

15 Slow Dowwwn.... We can't make political hay by rushing things.

Posted by: Les Kinetic at February 16, 2017 11:39 AM (t6wDl)

16 It takes a while for politicians to catch up to culture, the ones who do so quickly are the ones that are quick stars. The rest drag behind because they resist and fear change, and work.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 11:40 AM (39g3+)

17 Ann Coulter points out that the GOP, when Obama was president and could veto the repeals, passed six Obamacare repeals. But now that Trump is president and (presumably) wouldn't veto a repeal, they sit on their thumbs.

Ever get the feeling you're being played?
Posted by Ace at 11:38 AM Comments

So the repeal resolutions passed under Obama were just Failure Theater?

That's just crazy talk.

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 11:41 AM (/9ppM)

18 We'll get to repealing this boondoggle once we see if it helps our individual re-election chances.

Posted by: Les Kinetic at February 16, 2017 11:41 AM (t6wDl)

19 16 It takes a while for politicians to catch up to culture, the ones who do so quickly are the ones that are quick stars. The rest drag behind because they resist and fear change, and work.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 11:40 AM (39g3+)

====================

I think that I will go to that Sanford townhall on Saturday and try to ask his opinion of Paul's take on the matter.

Sanford is in the Freedom Caucus, so he's probably going to be on board with Paul's assessment though.

Disadvantage of having a, all things considered, really good congress critter representing me.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (vur0q)

20 A pox upon them. May the fleas of a thousands camels infest Paul Ryan's crotch.

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (0mRoj)

21 Anyone familiar with Jim Jordan, Rep. from Ohio? He's been on Lou Dobbs a couple times, and last night he was very optimistic about pushing the repeal of Obamacare through and I was heartened. Am I being played?

Posted by: washrivergal at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (Ivjge)

22 19 We'll get to repealing this boondoggle once we see if it helps our individual re-election chances.
Posted by: Les Kinetic at

I couldn't have said it better Myself...

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (O2RFr)

23 16 It takes a while for politicians to catch up to culture, the ones who do so quickly are the ones that are quick stars. The rest drag behind because they resist and fear change, and work.

IOW, the inverse of leadership.

Posted by: pep at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (NrQPT)

24 For horde peeps as what wake up at the crack of noon like the head ewok, don't miss the free (today only) SF novella on my blog today.

Link in nic (scroll down past the #DeleteNano post)

Posted by: @votermom @vm at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (Om16U)

25
But if obamacare is repealed there will be rioters in the streets breaking windows, setting fires, beating people with shovels...

In other words, just another day.

Posted by: E Depluribus Unum at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (ZFUt7)

26 He will have to drive Ryan from the speakership, and really crack the whip in the senate.

-

Crack that whip
Give the past the slip
Step on a crack
Break your momma's back
When a problem comes along you must whip it
Before the cream sits out too long you must whip it
When something's going wrong you must whip it
Now whip it into shape
Shape it up
Get straight
Go forward
Move ahead
Try to detect it
It's not too late to whip it
Whip it good

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks. Laugh at a joke, get another joke free! at February 16, 2017 11:43 AM (Nwg0u)

27 24 16 It takes a while for politicians to catch up to culture, the ones who do so quickly are the ones that are quick stars. The rest drag behind because they resist and fear change, and work.

IOW, the inverse of leadership.
Posted by: pep at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (NrQPT)

====================

Are you looking to politicians for leadership?

By definition they shouldn't be. They are representatives of the popular will of the people who elect them. By design, they are followers.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 11:43 AM (vur0q)

28 If Trump goes to war with his own party, the consequences will be ugly.

Dude, are you trying to make me climax?

Posted by: sunny-dee at February 16, 2017 11:43 AM (QAOZh)

29 The House Freedom Caucus has endorsed Rand Paul's plan. It's the lying-ass GOPe that won't do anything.

Posted by: Cloyd Freud, Unemployed at February 16, 2017 11:43 AM (97XyN)

30 Rand Paul storms out like a democrat. Stay and present your position dickwad.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at February 16, 2017 11:43 AM (Q3fP7)

31 McCain & Graham seem to be the faces of GOP treason.

Posted by: @votermom @vm at February 16, 2017 11:43 AM (Om16U)

32 That Coulter article is right on the money......

Posted by: Sterling Archer at February 16, 2017 11:43 AM (jjaLl)

33 failure theatre forever

Posted by: brak at February 16, 2017 11:43 AM (WekB6)

34 Read a story this morning about a family paying $1200+ a month w/a $12000 deductible....I'll pay the fine and bank that money, thank you very much.

Posted by: BignJames at February 16, 2017 11:44 AM (x9c8r)

35 Ever get the feeling you're being played?

amateurs

Posted by: 3 card monte at February 16, 2017 11:44 AM (FZYNt)

36 If Trump goes to war with his own party, the consequences will be ugly.

Why ? They're at war with Him...

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:44 AM (O2RFr)

37 Obamacare puts power and money in the hands of Washington DC. Of course the GOP doesn't want to repeal it. The idea that the Republicans are more "principled" than the Democrats is silly. THe GOP likes power and money just as much as the Dems, they just feel slightly ashamed about it.

But money and power go a long way toward abating that shame.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at February 16, 2017 11:44 AM (MZcWR)

38 >>Lamarr Alexander says it will take Trump's personal intervention -- just declaring "We're doing this" -- to get any kind of movement on the issue.

Unambiguous confirmation (as if one was needed) that elected representatives feel no obligation to actually represent and act on their constituents' democratically expressed wishes.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 11:44 AM (Bdeb0)

39 So, how is the "day without immigrants" going?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at February 16, 2017 11:44 AM (IqV8l)

40 I'd love to get Weirddave's take on this....since he's in the biz.

I don't want them to put something out that is rushed (I know, by now they should have had something ready...) and it have all sorts of problems that truly affect people. The media hysterics would be epic.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (Enq6K)

41 What Trump needs to do is invite the leadership to the White House and talk this over with them. The logner they wait, the harder it gets to repeal, and while I think polls are crap, they are all on one side of the issue: the majority hates the ACA and wants it gone.

They have to stop dragging their heels on this, and I don't want to hear any RINO excuses about "we need time because private insurers are so damaged and the entire structure needs rebuilding yadda yadda" yes, it took 4 years to implement. Pass the law now and implement it over time, but DO IT NOW.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (39g3+)

42 @34, that's about what my brother was paying for his plan off the exchange and (at the time) it was just him and his wife, no pre-existing conditions.

Posted by: sunny-dee at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (QAOZh)

43 "Sanford is in the Freedom Caucus, so he's probably going to be on board with Paul's assessment though."

Yes, Sanford has been a leader on this.

Posted by: Cloyd Freud, Unemployed at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (97XyN)

44 So, how is the "day without immigrants" going?

Quiet... Didn't hear any leaf blowers...

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (O2RFr)

45 39 So, how is the "day without immigrants" going?
Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr.

those toilets aren't going to clean themselves

Posted by: "The View" Scrunt at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (FZYNt)

46 Which is why, as I said yesterday, to say this "revolution" in Washington is somehow all about immigration is silly.

This, as much as anything, is why the Democrats don't run everything today.

So... Gope, whatcha gonna do. We gave you the ball, the bat, the glove, the bases, the popcorn and the peanuts.

You gonna play ball or what?

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (TOk1P)

47 But if obamacare is repealed there will be rioters in the streets breaking windows, setting fires, beating people with shovels...

Posted by: E Depluribus Unum at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (ZFUt7)

Tell me about it.

Posted by: Milo Y. at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (/9ppM)

48 Forget repealing the ACA, it ain'tgoing to happen. Let's focus on this dreamy border tax thing.

Posted by: McMorris-Rogers at February 16, 2017 11:46 AM (nN3W/)

49 Well, Trump can use his rally on Saturday to push this message to his supporters and maybe a barrage of angry phone calls to the legislators when they are on recess next week might do the trick.

Posted by: IC at February 16, 2017 11:46 AM (a0IVu)

50 Its not even the repeal part that is insane. They've been running on this for 6 years now and they dont even have a clue on how to 'replace' it or just get out of it all together. This shouldve been ready to go on day 1 of the Trump admin. Period. I've thought for awhile now that the GOP is worse than the Dems. At least with the Dems, you know what youre getting. Its all out there. The GOP has continually lied to its voters for years now about who and what they stand for. Just like Obama did in '08.

Posted by: johny boy at February 16, 2017 11:46 AM (UNXWZ)

51 I haven't heard any renovation noises this morning. I guess the immigrants are all drinking cervesa elsewhere.

Posted by: Miley, the Duchess at February 16, 2017 11:46 AM (tHwdc)

52 Lamarr Alexander apparently never listened to one of Trump's rally speeches.
Trump's been very clear about wanting to get rid of Obamacare - why should he have to reiterate this to get them moving????

Posted by: Lizzy at February 16, 2017 11:46 AM (NOIQH)

53 It takes a while for politicians to catch up to culture, the ones who do so quickly are the ones that are quick stars. The rest drag behind because they resist and fear change, and work.

IOW, the inverse of leadership.
Posted by: pep

--

If they weren't careerists, they would know the will of the people. Hiding in an ivory tower is no way to understand what is going on in the country, and hiring consultants to tell you what the people want is the road to failure.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 16, 2017 11:47 AM (7ZVPa)

54 Let me be the first to congratulate Ace on his selection to head up Trump's Department of Labor.

Going forward from his confirmation, workers will be required to start their work day at noon.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at February 16, 2017 11:47 AM (4ErVI)

55 Keep the 8.4 million (of 12 million total signups) medicaid recipients. Require them to go to urgent cares first and be referred to emergency rooms. Merry Christmas. You get to keep your free sh*t.

Then:

- Tort reform.
- Purchase insurance across state lines.
- Let insurers sell what the customers want, be it $50/month catastrophic plans that have huge deductibles, or $2000/month plans that pay for almost everything.
- price list for cash payers and insured
- introduce medical billers to car and mortgage companies so they can learn how to magically set up monthly billing the same way everything else is paid for by most people.

Posted by: Moron Robbie at February 16, 2017 11:47 AM (/f1mm)

56 I'm hoping that ICE is taking notes. The whole day without "immigrants" thing clearly states this is ILLEGAL immigrants taking the day off. So every business that keeps these workers on after the day is knowingly violating federal law

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 11:47 AM (39g3+)

57 But if obamacare is repealed there will be rioters in the streets breaking windows, setting fires, beating people with shovels...

-
You know, Friday night.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks. Laugh at a joke, get another joke free! at February 16, 2017 11:47 AM (Nwg0u)

58 Going forward from his confirmation, workers will be required to start their work day at noon.

Like Obamas' schedule...

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:47 AM (O2RFr)

59 Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (Enq6K)

Ask Muldoon...he's in the trenches, and also understands the long-term implications for the health-care industry and our health!

Plus, he might answer in limerick form, which would be awesome.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (rF0hx)

60 It sure has been a pain in the ass telling my tax clients they owe a penalty. Most my people are so broke all the time they just blow it off. They get the kids on CHIPS (Medicaid) and go without insurance themselves. Last year I'd show them the penalty and they'd say it's still cheaper than getting the insurance.

The health do-gooders shouldn't have pushed CHIPS so early on because that's undercutting the need for insurance for most people. Bwaha ha! Stepped on their own dicks they did.

Posted by: Jeanne del norte blanco grande at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (B9dAp)

61 Its not even the repeal part that is insane. They've
been running on this for 6 years now and they dont even have a clue on
how to 'replace' it or just get out of it all together. This shouldve
been ready to go on day 1 of the Trump admin. Period. I've thought for
awhile now that the GOP is worse than the Dems. At least with the Dems,
you know what youre getting. Its all out there. The GOP has continually
lied to its voters for years now about who and what they stand for. Just
like Obama did in '08.

Posted by: johny boy at February 16, 2017 11:46 AM (UNXWZ)

The RNC hasn't gotten a dime from me since 2010. Never will again.
Republicans are such a disappointment.

Posted by: Miley, the Duchess at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (tHwdc)

62 A pox upon them. May the fleas of a thousands camels infest Paul Ryan's crotch.

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 11:42 AM (0mRoj)

Ahh, the Olde Curses are the best curses.

Posted by: Sharkman at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (zKIA2)

63 So... Gope, whatcha gonna do. We gave you the ball, the bat, the glove, the bases, the popcorn and the peanuts.

You gonna play ball or what?
Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (TOk1P)

But the still don't have the clay. Or the turf. Or the beer concession. Or a memorandum of understanding with the city on issuing bonds to find the new sports venue. Or new uniforms. Or clean socks. Or...

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (0mRoj)

64 I've read somewhere that President Trump will be holding a rally somewhere.

If he wants to "crack the whip", he doesn't have to "declare war" on the GOPe. All he has to do is hold rallies in their districts with "repeal and replace Obamacare" as the central them. Take it to the people.

Posted by: mrp at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (JBggj)

65 The GOP was glad to vote for repeal when they only controlled one half of one third of the federal government. Now that they have free rein, not so much.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (7ZVPa)

66 If the republicans repeal obamacare ISIS will use that as a recruiting tool!

Lefty Logic

Posted by: E Depluribus Unum at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (ZFUt7)

67 Wasn't there an Obamacare Repeal that they pushed through the House and Senate last year that they forced Obama to veto? Why not just rerun that? I mean if all those repeals that the House had previously pushed were actually serious attempts that were just stopped because the senate was controlled by the Democrats and then it was Obama's ability to veto stopping them, then it should be a piece of cake.

Well you know unless it was all just bull shit theater like the House passing that pro-life bill and then when trying to pass it again because the Senate was controlled by the GOP that cunt Rennee Ellmers (who is totally pro-life) blocked it.

Posted by: buzzion at February 16, 2017 11:49 AM (z/Ubi)

68 Coulter had some nice barbs in that article.

Maybe Milo and Coulter?

Posted by: Infidel at February 16, 2017 11:49 AM (ByNzS)

69 66 If the republicans repeal obamacare ISIS will use that as a recruiting tool!

Lefty Logic

And Russia! Don't forget Russia!

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:49 AM (O2RFr)

70 Has Trump sat down with Ryan one-on-one to hash this thing out?

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 11:49 AM (bpfzP)

71
Who's taking Rances job at the RNC????

Cuz some people need a primarying.

Posted by: Soledad O'Brians Earpiece at February 16, 2017 11:49 AM (8XRCm)

72
crap

Posted by: fixerupper at February 16, 2017 11:49 AM (8XRCm)

73 Well, the immigrants are just hurting themselves with this protest. Wait, almost forgot, I'm an immigrant too. Now, what was I supposed to do today..........

Posted by: lindafell little rally hitler's schadenbutton! at February 16, 2017 11:49 AM (JNDQi)

74 Unfortunately the reality is they need to have a "replacement" because of the free loaders that have insurance through it.

Completely de-regulate the insurance companies. Let them sell across state lines with no mandates on what needs to be included in plans. Let them tailor plans to satisfy the individual consumers. This should bring prices down a lot.

After that, see who is not covered by insurance but more importantly find out why. If there are young people who find no value in insurance because they are single and healthy, you could incentivize them to buy very basic insurance that would include a catastrophic coverage (which is where their ultimate burden comes from). They go from "I'm young and healthy and don't need insurance" to "shit, I'm 26 and have cancer and am now uninsurable" pretty quickly.

The last group is the uninsurable because of pre-existing conditions group. Covering these people is not about insurance, its about paying their fucking bills because they're already sick. This responsibility (which is a public/government benefit) should not be pushed onto insurance company and by extension their customers in the form of higher premiums. If the government wants to pay the health bills of sick people that don't have insurance it should pay for that out of the general fund using tax payer money so that we as tax payers can see the true cost of providing this government benefit.

The biggest bull shit of Obamacare was the idea that the government was going to be the white knight and make sure that sick people had their bills paid but Obama and Democrats didn't want to show what the cost of this "benefit" was so they hid the cost by making the insurance companies on the hook for pre-existing conditions. So their customers paid for this government benefit rather than the government with tax payer money.

Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 11:50 AM (y9ZJX)

75 Who's taking Rances job at the RNC????

Isn't it some Relative of Romney's?

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:50 AM (O2RFr)

76 Three-minute warning. Get those TV's warmed up.
Trump resigns at noon. It's all over.

Posted by: Stringer Davis at February 16, 2017 11:50 AM (H5rtT)

77 Coulter did a podcast with Milo some months ago and it was hilarious. It's on YouTube somewhere. I'm sure it's on Milo's channel. Worth the listen. Ann does say"riiiight" way too much though.

Posted by: Fauxcahontas at February 16, 2017 11:50 AM (ul9CR)

78 OT:

#WeWillReplaceYou

OMG...it's happening. Liberals are actually going to try to primary vulnerable red state Democratic senators.

I'm squeeing like a little girl.

This will probably push the Democrats further left through their primary campaigns, making it harder for them to recenter for the general election making the seats easier to flip.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (vur0q)

79 What some here don't understand is that it is all about power.

Obamacare took over 1/6th of the Economy... do you really think Congress will give it back? or will the 'two parties' just argue over minor issues of how to use said power.

A Power they never should have been able to use in the first place.

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (qf6WZ)

80 If the republicans repeal obamacare ISIS will use that as a recruiting tool!

Lefty Logic

-
Didja see that Kalifornia's failure to maintain their dams is global warming's fault.

Posted by: Anonosaurus Wrecks. Laugh at a joke, get another joke free! at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (Nwg0u)

81 Ask Muldoon...he's in the trenches, and also understands the long-term implications for the health-care industry and our health!

Plus, he might answer in limerick form, which would be awesome.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (rF0hx)

Yeah, Muldoon could give us his take from the doctor's perspective.
Weirddave could give us his take from an administrative perspective. Insurance providers can't just turn on a dime with insurance plans. They need time to modify.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (Enq6K)

82 Any repeal now will have only GOP fingerprints on it. When they sent it to Obama that wouldn't have been the case if he had signed. It was a definitely a show move then but shit is real now and they have to present a successful plan.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (Q3fP7)

83 >>>Ever get the feeling you're being played?<<<

Complete the danged fence. You wacko birds.

Posted by: Johnny McMaverick at February 16, 2017 11:52 AM (2Mnv1)

84 64 I've read somewhere that President Trump will be holding a rally somewhere.

If he wants to "crack the whip", he doesn't have to "declare war" on the GOPe. All he has to do is hold rallies in their districts with "repeal and replace Obamacare" as the central them. Take it to the people.
Posted by: mrp at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (JBggj)

======================

Florida today. SC tomorrow.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 11:52 AM (vur0q)

85 >>The biggest bull shit of Obamacare was the idea that the government was going to be the white knight and make sure that sick people had their bills paid

Obama didn't care a fucking wink about sick people.

It was always about buying votes.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 11:52 AM (oXKWd)

86 we can pay 750 more for me to be covered, (no preexisting conditions!)quoted, Or we can pay the penalty. I like being punished financially for Their wrecking the economy, job losses and finacial ruin all why the govt thinks I need to be again punished for their dirty deeds.

Posted by: willow at February 16, 2017 11:52 AM (R7cwD)

87 Ever get the feeling you're being played?

Weren't those Johnny Rotten's last words as a Sex Pistol?

Posted by: Fauxcahontas at February 16, 2017 11:52 AM (ul9CR)

88 84 64 I've read somewhere that President Trump will be holding a rally somewhere.

If he wants to "crack the whip", he doesn't have to "declare war" on the GOPe. All he has to do is hold rallies in their districts with "repeal and replace Obamacare" as the central them. Take it to the people.
Posted by: mrp at February 16, 2017 11:48 AM (JBggj)

======================

Florida today. SC tomorrow.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 11:52 AM (vur0q)

And Saturday, THE WORLD!!!!!

Sorry. Got carried away.

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 11:53 AM (0mRoj)

89 I'm self-employed, and I've taken a huge hit due to Obamacare. Not as much as others, but my perfectly good policy I loved was cancelled, and now I hate the one I have that costs much too much.

The GOP has betrayed me time and time again over Obamacare. During the election they say "we'll get rid of it" and after the election, they wring their hands, make excuses and do nothing.

I will probably never vote for a Democrat for president, and I could not vote for an establishment Republican, since they have proven over and over again they'll lie about this to get my vote.

So it was either Trump or Carson. Carson was just too nice, and Trump was Rich Honey Badger.

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 11:53 AM (J5mC3)

90 Who's taking Rances job at the RNC????

Isn't it some Relative of Romney's?

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:50 AM (O2RFr)
============

Ronna Romney McDaniel

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 11:53 AM (bpfzP)

91
Somebody needs to do a Sandra Bullock meme.

"BUILD THE DANG WALL!!!!"

Posted by: fixerupper at February 16, 2017 11:53 AM (8XRCm)

92 Until we get the illegals out of here and put a stop to price fixing in the health care industry, repealing and replacing Obamacare will be like putting a bandaid over the breaches of that dam in California.

We have to get serious about some things in this country. And yes I believe the GOP wants to destroy America like the Dims do.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 11:54 AM (H8Bf9)

93 Also there was an article yesterday that the IRS is no longer going to reject tax filings that don't comply with the requirement to prove you have health insurance. If you leave line 61 blank on the 1040 they will still process your return. That means the only people that can be hit with the penalty for not having health insurance are those that self-report they are not in compliance. Another fatal blow. Don't want health insurance because its too expensive, fine. And now you don't have to pay a penalty for that decision unless you are stupid enough to fill out line 61.

Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 11:54 AM (y9ZJX)

94 Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 11:50 AM (y9ZJX)

Under what authority within the Constitution, is its Congress's power to ensure that people have insurance? ie... buy a product?

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 11:54 AM (qf6WZ)

95 Obamacare will be like putting a bandaid over the breaches of that dam in California.

I've already tried that

Gov. Moonbeam...

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 11:54 AM (O2RFr)

96 Willo'd;

629 Brave Paymets? Is this new as of the latest update?

Looks like you can set up regular donations to sites you support, as an offset to having ads blocked through the Brave browser.

Is Ace aware of this? Does he have to get set up to receive these payments?

I'd be interested in a thread on this subject and how we could all find an appropriate level of support for this site while blocking ads.

Posted by: TexasDan at February 16, 2017 11:54 AM (yL25O)

97 They need time to modify.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (Enq6K)

True...

But they have the actuarial data already, so it is probably on the order of a few months.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at February 16, 2017 11:55 AM (rF0hx)

98 >>I'm self-employed, and I've taken a huge hit due to Obamacare.

Welcome to the Party.

I haven't had insurance since this shit passed.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 11:55 AM (oXKWd)

99 Wasn't Aetna one of the health insurance companies that *wanted* Obamacare, since it meant more customers (because of the mandate) for them?

Whatever follows/replaces/fixes/etc. Obamacare better not be a (taxpayer-funded) bailout.

Posted by: Lance McCormick at February 16, 2017 11:55 AM (u0s1P)

100 Starting with the liberal premise "no man is an island."
The current system offers incentives for govt and the medical establishment to hurry old people into death.

Government taking over the bills of the chronically ill "uninsurables" will give everyone an incentive to kill off just about everyone else, including of course "those who should never have been born." And, those who are conservative about govt spending are always the first to yell, so, I can hardly wait. It's the ultimate socialism, and, some of us will vote for it.

Posted by: Stringer Davis at February 16, 2017 11:55 AM (H5rtT)

101 and This is why they got Trump!
They lied to get us to give them more seats in congress, they lied some more to get the senate.
and they think we have't yet caught on.

Posted by: willow at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (R7cwD)

102 You know how we laughed at Lena Dunham for that quote about her boyfriend who wouldn't get married because gay marriage isn't legal, except it is now and she's still not married?

Yeah, we're Lena Dunham right now.

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (KUaJL)

103 If Trump gets rid of the mandate, he will be a great President. He could then just slobber and crap his pants for 4 years and be a success in my book.

Posted by: dfbaskwill at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (zllbf)

104 McConnell just before Trump was sworn in:

(paraphrased from memory) "We will have an Obamacare repeal bill ready for President Trump during his first week in office."

Posted by: Mathers at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (3myMJ)

105 The thimble is out!

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (IqV8l)

106 Here's the problem.. there is "replacing" Obamacare.. all the GOP has up its sleeve is tax cuts. Nice for me.. but a person making $30k a year doesn't have $5,000 to put into a nice tax-protected HSA. They don't have $1000.

And a person making $30k pays almost no income taxes anyway.. the idea of tax protected income is a joke to most people making under $50k... a sad fucking joke.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (so+oy)

107 Don't want health insurance because its too expensive, fine. And now you don't have to pay a penalty for that decision unless you are stupid enough to fill out line 61
---

I know a LOT of people who don't have health insurance.

Yesterday, I thought of letting a few know about this.

And then I remembered. Oh yeah, they're frothing SJW Trump hating liberals.

Never mind.

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (J5mC3)

108 Fuck. Those. Guys.

Posted by: dc at February 16, 2017 11:57 AM (oY/R7)

109 should have been:

there is NO "replacing" Obamacare..

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 11:57 AM (so+oy)

110 neither have I garret, but with ins cost quote i'd rather pay cash and if I can't afford it smoke the tail pipe, otherwise I keep my spouse in poverty.
no way.

Posted by: willow at February 16, 2017 11:57 AM (R7cwD)

111 Yeah, Muldoon could give us his take from the doctor's perspective.
Weirddave could give us his take from an administrative perspective. Insurance providers can't just turn on a dime with insurance plans. They need time to modify.
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (Enq6K)

I retired from the 4th largest health insurance company in America--HCSC, the holding company for 5 Blues--Illinois, Texas, Oklahoma, New Mexico, and Montana. Since I left, it's been nothing but terrible there--layoffs, losses in the hundreds of millions, and general assorted misery. I went to a retirement party and I was simply astonished at how bad everyone looked--their complexions were gray, they were either too fat or too thin, and just haggard in general.

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, who is now luxuriating in vast pools of winning! at February 16, 2017 11:57 AM (kXoT0)

112 Yeah, we're Lena Dunham right now.
Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (KUaJL)

*strips nekkid*
*gets cake*

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 11:57 AM (0mRoj)

113 Sigh

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 11:57 AM (KlI/a)

114 They need time to modify.
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (Enq6K)

But you can't even start to modify, until they tell us what is going to happen...

Which, the GOPe in Congress won't...

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (qf6WZ)

115 The Repubs in Congress remind me of so many people I met in business (and, I confess, being one on occasion.) There's a type of person who can talk really well, sit it meetings and discuss options, discuss strategy or whatever but is simply incapable of taking any specific action. If they were the contractors you hired to renovate your bathroom they'd be very capable of discussing your new toilet, sink, and mirrors but would have no idea how to hold a screwdriver let alone sweat solder copper pipe or run soil drains.

Posted by: George V at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (LUHWu)

116
G-d Damn the GOP to Hell. I'm now paying just over $700 a month.

Repeal this fucking evil edict or repeal yourselves!

Sick to death of this Quisling big government phony sellout party.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (UBQ2A)

117 Throw them all out.

Posted by: thathalfrican at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (ooKNM)

118 Alexander Acosta to be nominated for Labor department.

Anybody got the lowdown on this guy? (Hopefully not the brother of CNN's Jim Acosta).

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (hdpay)

119 BTW, my insurance agent from Blue Cross told me that management told them that if Trump doesn't get in, the firm would be bankrupt in a few years at most.

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (J5mC3)

120 Ever get the feeling you're being played?
Posted by: Ace at 11:38 AM

Every time the republicans in the Senate do something, or don't do something.

You get your hopes up, you're like "Maybe they're on something that looks like a team," then they go and Pudzer one of a pretty short list of things you cared about.

Posted by: Ever more cynical at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (wx6iv)

121 111 I retired from the 4th largest health insurance company in America--HCSC, the holding company for 5 Blues--Illinois, Texas, Oklahoma, New Mexico, and Montana. Since I left, it's been nothing but terrible there--layoffs, losses in the hundreds of millions, and general assorted misery. I went to a retirement party and I was simply astonished at how bad everyone looked--their complexions were gray, they were either too fat or too thin, and just haggard in general.
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, who is now luxuriating in vast pools of winning! at February 16, 2017 11:57 AM (kXoT0)

====================

I work with them. 834 file stuff.

It's, well, it's work.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 11:59 AM (vur0q)

122 This shows the utter mendacity of the GOPe. They need to be primaried. If I were a Democrat I would run against a Republican on the platform of repealing Ocare and point out their duplicitousness.

Posted by: Minuteman at February 16, 2017 11:59 AM (AjjIl)

123 >>*strips nekkid*
*gets cake*

You know, now that you are naked and have a cake, all the stalls in the bathroom will be occupied.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 11:59 AM (oXKWd)

124 Why are we being forced to purchase an inferior product by the federal government? Oh wait, it's a tax.

Posted by: Fritz at February 16, 2017 11:59 AM (2Mnv1)

125 JJ they want 750 more to be on my spouses plan.. what asses srsly who can afford insurance these days?

Posted by: willow at February 16, 2017 11:59 AM (R7cwD)

126 #74

If the government wants to pay the health bills of sick people that
don't have insurance it should pay for that out of the general fund
using tax payer money so that we as tax payers can see the true cost of
providing this government benefit.
===================

Or a generous tax deduction for contributing to charities that provide health care to the indigent.

In any case, Obamacare is a classic leftist program designed to fail so that single-payer becomes the only alternative. If you want state-operated single-payer health insurance, keep as much of Obamacare as possible. If you want a vibrant, job-creating economy, eliminate Obamacare and replace it with a private market-driven health insurance system with enhanced charitable tax deductions to help those with per-exisisting conditions

Posted by: mrp at February 16, 2017 11:59 AM (JBggj)

127 Speaking of the GOP, funny how they're lining up with the Deep State to attack Trump and Flynn.

Funny. As in NOT.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:00 PM (UBQ2A)

128 And a person making $30k pays almost no income taxes anyway.. the idea of tax protected income is a joke to most people making under $50k... a sad fucking joke.
Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 11:56 AM (so+oy)

It won't be a Tax 'cut'... it will be a Credit.... or in other words, another wealth transfer brought to you this time by the GOP...

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 12:00 PM (qf6WZ)

129 Here's what I'd like to see happen. No insurance. Pay as you go. Directly to your doctor or hospital. Watch the prices drop dramatically. Maybe some type of super-catastrophic insurance. That's it. No paperwork, no middle man.

Ever wonder why your dog's medications are so much cheaper than yours, even when they are the same exact ones that you yourself takes? It's because you pay the vet directly, and you only pay when you actually need the service. Don't need it? Why pay for it?

Splenectomy on a dog - maybe $1800 depending on your area. Abdominal surgery on you? Maybe $20,000. And it's pretty much the same thing. A spleen is a spleen.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:00 PM (bpfzP)

130 Insurance providers can't just turn on a dime with insurance plans. They need time to modify.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 11:51 AM (Enq6K)

I'm fine with giving them three to six months or so, but I bet someone at every company has a copy of the plans they offered in '08. Start there, then continue.

Posted by: Moron Robbie at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (/f1mm)

131 Walks into old warehouse. Finds box marked "Catastrophic Policies from 1985." Blows off dust. Hear ya go, Congress.

Now, get on with tax reform.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (kTF2Z)

132 Deep State wants Obamacare.

Posted by: blaster at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (tewYv)

133 Trump could meet with potential primary challengers who are more committed to repeal.

That would get the attention of Congress.

Posted by: davidt at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (XoldI)

134 Fawn Liebowitz was unavailable for comment

Posted by: undocumented illegal SMOD at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (e8kgV)

135 43 "Sanford is in the Freedom Caucus, so he's probably going to be on board with Paul's assessment though."

Yes, Sanford has been a leader on this.
Posted by: Cloyd Freud, Unemployed at February 16, 2017 11:45 AM (97XyN

Sadly, Rand Paul is a price fixing advocate for the health care industry. Price fixing is against the law btw..... Big time.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (H8Bf9)

136 I think the GOPe would be perfectly fine with Trump gone and Pence as president. He's too conservative for them, but not the strong leader Trump is, and would be easier to control and manipulate. And if Pence is gone, hey: Ryan!

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (39g3+)

137 Splenectomy on a dog - maybe $1800 depending on your area. Abdominal surgery on you? Maybe $20,000. And it's pretty much the same thing. A spleen is a spleen.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:00 PM (bpfzP)

aha that's what i'm doing wrong. I need a good vet.

Posted by: willow at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (R7cwD)

138 In other news the Washinton Generals in a quandary on how to lose the game when the Harlem Globetrotters are no-shows.

Posted by: Minuteman at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (AjjIl)

139 Who is that Moron that goes on a rant now and then about Republicans being just as big a bunch of fans of Big Government as Democrats ?

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (qVyOY)

140 Alexander Acosta to be nominated for Labor department.

Anybody got the lowdown on this guy? (Hopefully not the brother of CNN's Jim Acosta).

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (hdpay)

Appears to be OK. I don't think the Left likes him, and that is always a good sign

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (KlI/a)

141 I retired from the 4th largest health insurance
company in America--HCSC, the holding company for 5 Blues--Illinois,
Texas, Oklahoma, New Mexico, and Montana. Since I left, it's been
nothing but terrible there--layoffs, losses in the hundreds of millions,
and general assorted misery. I went to a retirement party and I was
simply astonished at how bad everyone looked--their complexions were
gray, they were either too fat or too thin, and just haggard in general.

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, who is now luxuriating in
vast pools of winning! at February 16, 2017 11:57 AM (kXoT0)

Well, I feel for the employees but the companies as a whole were all in on Obamacare as I recall....maybe I'm misremembering.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (Enq6K)

142 You know, if Trump won't get Congress moving on rolling back Obamacare, what say we go down to Trump Tower and moon the place.

That should work.

Posted by: blaster at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (tewYv)

143 HAs anyone see any credible numbers on how much of healthcare is actually covered by ACA Marketplace plans? Is it 10% of healthcare coverage?, 5%? Excluding Medicaid expansion how much of healthcare billing are we even talking about? (I am ignoring the issue of mandated birth control, etc., etc. and how that may have expanded healthcare billing amounts.)

For example, the only number (from 2014 data I assumed) was that government via sate/federal Medcaid, Medicare, Tricare was paying 46% (no idea how valid the number may be) of healthcare billed.

Posted by: RioBravo at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (SsblQ)

144 Before we automatically put this into a Trump versus the GOPe framework, we might ask what Trump wants to do with Obamacare.

If the choice is between a wishy-washy GOPe "reform" and a more libertarian "replace by freeing up the market," which side would Trump be on?
His campaign rhetoric makes me think it would be the first. OTOH, putting Tom Price at HHS makes me think it's the latter.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (Nox3c)

145 >>Splenectomy on a dog - maybe $1800 depending on your area. Abdominal surgery on you? Maybe $20,000. And it's pretty much the same thing. A spleen is a spleen.

Plasma!

Dog - Plasma!

*Mixes them up*

Posted by: Best Cartoon Ever at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (oXKWd)

146 Here's what I'd like to see happen. No insurance. Pay as you go.
Directly to your doctor or hospital. Watch the prices drop dramatically.
Maybe some type of super-catastrophic insurance. That's it. No
paperwork, no middle man.
---
Let market forces work directly on medical costs rather than hiding everything behind 'insurance'?

That's just crazy talk.

Posted by: Methos at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (3Liv/)

147 You know, now that you are naked and have a cake, all the stalls in the bathroom will be occupied.
Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 11:59 AM (oXKWd)

Heh. Yeah, that's pretty much my luck.

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (0mRoj)

148 144 Before we automatically put this into a Trump versus the GOPe framework, we might ask what Trump wants to do with Obamacare.

If the choice is between a wishy-washy GOPe "reform" and a more libertarian "replace by freeing up the market," which side would Trump be on?
His campaign rhetoric makes me think it would be the first. OTOH, putting Tom Price at HHS makes me think it's the latter.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (Nox3c)

=====================

Personnel IS policy.

Fingers crossed.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (vur0q)

149 v

So? That doesn't mean the bill can't be passed to eliminate Obamacare, and then take a few years to implement the new plan. It can be done IMMEDIATELY. No stupid excuses.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (39g3+)

150 Well, I feel for the employees but the companies as a whole were all in on Obamacare as I recall....maybe I'm misremembering.
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (Enq6K)

They were all in when they thought the GOV and the US Taxpayer was going to pick up ALL thier loses. When that went bye bye so did their support.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (KlI/a)

151 I'll use my influence to turn some of the recalcitrant Republican's. Let me leak something.

Posted by: Fence Priebus Sitting At The Right Hand of the Father at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (nN3W/)

152 we've been played since oh, let me guess, before i was born. and, that's a long fuckin time ago. same shit, different stirrers.

Posted by: chavez the hugo at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (KP5rU)

153 Fucking fucking fuck Roberts.

Posted by: Eli Cash at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (7y4lI)

154 When did this marvelous thing called "health insurance" come into being anyway? Rev has a copy of the bill from Swedish Covenant Hospital from when he was born nearly 65 years ago. His parents didn't have insurance. I don't even think health insurance was something people had back then. Bill was $28.00.

Health insurance is not a sacred cow. It needs to go. IMO

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (bpfzP)

155 Deep state
Chaos
Exremely offensive remarks
Russians

Posted by: RioBravo at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (SsblQ)

156 146 Here's what I'd like to see happen. No insurance. Pay as you go.
Directly to your doctor or hospital. Watch the prices drop dramatically.
Maybe some type of super-catastrophic insurance. That's it. No
paperwork, no middle man.
---
Let market forces work directly on medical costs rather than hiding everything behind 'insurance'?

That's just crazy talk.
Posted by: Methos at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (3Liv/)

===================

"We seem to be seeing some success here."
-Oklahoma Doctor's association that only takes cash and is driving down costs in the areas that it operates

"Fascists!"
-Antifa

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (vur0q)

157 137 Splenectomy on a dog - maybe $1800 depending on your area. Abdominal surgery on you? Maybe $20,000. And it's pretty much the same thing. A spleen is a spleen.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:00 PM (bpfzP)

aha that's what i'm doing wrong. I need a good vet.
Posted by: willow at February 16, 2017 12:01 PM (R7cwD)

You can avoid it altogether if you vent your spleen regularly.

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (0mRoj)

158 That doesn't mean the bill can't be passed to eliminate Obamacare, and then take a few years to implement the new plan. It can be done IMMEDIATELY. No stupid excuses.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (39g3+)

Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million on Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (KlI/a)

159 And this is why I hate meaningless actions like repeal votes when you know that they won't be signed, it makes people think "Gee, all it takes is a simple repeal vote and everything will be fine!"

Not true.They actually have to design a plan that will 1) work so we don't go down this road again 2) takes into account where we are now including the 30+ states that took Medicaid expansion as part of Obamacare 3) gets buy in from all the Republicans in Congress 4) includes the Obamacare provisions that Trump insisted he wants and 5) is affordable.

It was never going to be a quick or easy process. It took years to fully design and implement Obamacare and it is going to take more than a couple weeks to undo it.

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (/tuJf)

160 A spleen is a spleen.

Readers Digest went into extensive detail about why you're wrong in its groundbreaking article, 'I Am Jack's Spleen'

Posted by: E Depluribus Unum at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (ZFUt7)

161 I work with them. 834 file stuff.

It's, well, it's work.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 11:59 AM (vur0q)

I left because I was programming in the Medicare space. We had acquired a Pennsylvania company to do our Medicare processing, which required me to send a file (non-standard, their specs) of our providers. The file would take an hour and a half to create on our mainframes. It would take 10.5 or more hours to load on their servers, if they remembered to run the job. It was a nightmare and it showed me that I could leave...

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, who is now luxuriating in vast pools of winning! at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (kXoT0)

162 Splenectomy on a dog - maybe $1800 depending on your area. Abdominal surgery on you? Maybe $20,000. And it's pretty much the same thing. A spleen is a spleen.

How much is the worst case malpractice payout if your dog dies in surgery versus if you die during surgery?

Posted by: V the K at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (O7MnT)

163 Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million on Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster
---

Medicaid.

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (J5mC3)

164 Plasma!

Dog - Plasma!

*Mixes them up*

Posted by: Best Cartoon Ever at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (oXKWd)
=======================

My dog was the blood donor dog for the Vet I worked for. No cost, no compensation.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (bpfzP)

165
Deep State wants ~~Obamacare~~ Single Payer.
Posted by: blaster

Posted by: Bertram Cabot, Jr. at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (IqV8l)

166 If Obamacare is in a death spiral, the problem is going to take care of itself.

Given the state of today's Media, I'm sure Republicans can avoid blame when it collapses, right?

Posted by: Mathers at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (3myMJ)

167 >>Bill was $28.00.

Breach-Births : $37.50.

C-Section : $45.00.

Coffee : .05

Posted by: Swedish Hospital Signage at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (oXKWd)

168 154 When did this marvelous thing called "health insurance" come into being anyway? Rev has a copy of the bill from Swedish Covenant Hospital from when he was born nearly 65 years ago. His parents didn't have insurance. I don't even think health insurance was something people had back then. Bill was $28.00.

Health insurance is not a sacred cow. It needs to go. IMO
Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (bpfzP)

Like many of the horrible problems facing our society today, it basically started with FDR.

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (KUaJL)

169 It was never going to be a quick or easy process. It took years to fully design and implement Obamacare and it is going to take more than a couple weeks to undo it.
Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (/tuJf)

Yup better to do it right than fast

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (KlI/a)

170 J.J. - Why do you think Obamacare is at fault for your $700 premium? You actually think it would be cheaper if O'Care was repealed and replaced with nothing?

My premium, for myself alone, costs my employer about $1000 a month.. a high-deductible plan where i pay the first $3500 in claims.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (so+oy)

171 is this a bad idea? why not have insurance with a specific hospital nad doctor in your area? you insure yoru family With that hosprital cut out the middle man , insurance?

could something similar work?

Posted by: willow at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (R7cwD)

172 Remembering how the health insurance companies helped kill Hillarycare so Obama got them on board for his "mess o' pottage" by appealing to their absolute avarice, their downfall just gives me the sads so bads.

Posted by: geoffb5 at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (d3wbb)

173 In order to truly level the playing field, and make things work for those who do not receive insurance through an employer, we need to outlaw employer-provided healthcare plans.

Only then will those who do not fall neatly into some large, pre-set pool be able to be treated fairly in the marketplace. And only then will there be a return to a consumer-provider relationship between the insured and the insurance agencies.

Also, I care nothing about providing a transition period. Make it sudden. Make it jarring. Insurance companies will be bending over backward to make the transition smooth and retain some sort of business model. They can pay the costs of transitioning to a truly free market system that they connived and schemed for so long to destroy. Or they can go away.

Hospitals can deal with free market forces suddenly, too. They will have to instantly deal with an entirely uninsured market place. And they can wait it out with people dying at their locked doors, or they can find a way to provide services at prices people can afford.

Posted by: TexasDan at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (yL25O)

174 Readers Digest went into extensive detail about why you're wrong in its groundbreaking article, 'I Am Jack's Spleen'

Fake News. Spleen's don't have opposable thumbs. Can't write.

Look it up.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (qVyOY)

175 163 Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million on Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster
---

Medicaid.
Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (J5mC3)

12 of those 20 million were put on Medicaid as a result of the expansion, IIRC

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (0mRoj)

176 I know everyone wants things done yesterday but I'm confident that Obamacare will be repealed sooner rather than later . Unfortunately I also believe it will be replaced with some of thing same provisions based on what Trump had indicated he wanted to stay in any replacement plan. It will be better but it will be far from perfect.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (Q3fP7)

177 159 It was never going to be a quick or easy process. It took years to fully design and implement Obamacare and it is going to take more than a couple weeks to undo it.
Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (/tuJf)

====================

Especially if you consider Romneycare as the ground work for the ACA, then yes it does extend into years.

The ACA also took about a year to pass, and it was an early priority.

Also, you cannot fully uproot the law with 51 votes. You can uproot the sidecar that was passed after Scott Brown was elected, but not the bill that the Senate sent to the House before Ted Kennedy's death which the House also passed.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (vur0q)

178 How much is the worst case malpractice payout if your dog dies in surgery versus if you die during surgery?

Posted by: V the K at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (O7MnT)
==========================

There is no malpractice payout if your dog dies. Owner is compensated for the costs of surgery and medications.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (bpfzP)

179 140 Alexander Acosta to be nominated for Labor department.

Anybody got the lowdown on this guy? (Hopefully not the brother of CNN's Jim Acosta).

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 11:58 AM (hdpay)

Appears to be OK. I don't think the Left likes him, and that is always a good sign
Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (KlI/a)

Clerked for Samuel Alito. That alone is a positive. 12:30 news conference with Le Grande Orange to announce this.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (UBQ2A)

180 Alexander Acosta is New Labor Secretary Pick

Posted by: EVLINC! at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (y3aQB)

181 Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million on
Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster
---
That's why ICE is ramping up the deportations.

Posted by: Methos at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (3Liv/)

182 Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million on Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster
---

Medicaid.
Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (J5mC3)

OK, that's a possibility but it still has to be funded and that there is the problem

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (KlI/a)

183 Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (/tuJf)

Would you mind manslpaining the Medicaid expansion to me? And also why it's an issue in repealing OCare?

I've never quite understood all the implications.

Posted by: Tammy al-Thor at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (gR+Ht)

184 GOPe is Bill Lumberg:

"Repeal? Yeah, that's great. Great stuff, but I'm gonna have to go ahead and ask you to...hold off on whole repeal thingy because we're playing catchup on a few other things and that is just not gonna be a priority for us in the near future."

"Wait."

"You do know that we are putting cover sheets on all the TPS reports now , right? "

"Did you get the memo?"

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (toH8T)

185 I am Fido's nuts.

Posted by: Fido's nuts at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (IqV8l)

186 The whole employer-provided health insurance thing is a scam that needs to end.

Employers don't provide car insurance, or property insurance. It's a holdover from WW2 wage controls.

This is separate from the "what is insurance for" argument, which we should also have some time. (I.e. not routine, predictable things-- auto insurance doesn't cover gas or oil changes.)

So, yeah. Let insurance companies sell across state lines, eliminate the mandates, et cetera, et cetera.

The other other argument/debate we need to have is getting health*care* (i.e. doctor visits, hospital stays, drug costs) costs down. My guess is that, like the colleges and universities, there's vast amounts of administrative bloat.

(And and and Social Security and waste, fraud and abuse and and and and and Lance smash)

Anyway, as Insty says, things that can't go on forever, won't.

Posted by: Lance McCormick at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (u0s1P)

187 What's going on now?
GOP eats bags of dicks
Obamacare Lives.

Posted by: Deep Thoughts.... at February 16, 2017 12:08 PM (jjaLl)

188 --
How much is the worst case malpractice payout if your dog dies in surgery versus if you die during surgery?

Posted by: V the K at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM
-------------

Exactly. As with most things, I blame the lawyers.

Posted by: irright at February 16, 2017 12:08 PM (pMGkg)

189 Repealing ObamaCare without a plan for a replacement is bad politics.

Tom Price is the right guy to be point on this and is now finally in place.

This presents an opportunity to do things to address the cost side. Medical expenses is a Big Fucking Deal, which if not fixed, will break the bank. We now have an opening.

Posted by: Ignoramus at February 16, 2017 12:08 PM (SIY7D)

190 161 I left because I was programming in the Medicare space. We had acquired a Pennsylvania company to do our Medicare processing, which required me to send a file (non-standard, their specs) of our providers. The file would take an hour and a half to create on our mainframes. It would take 10.5 or more hours to load on their servers, if they remembered to run the job. It was a nightmare and it showed me that I could leave...
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, who is now luxuriating in vast pools of winning! at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (kXoT0)

===================

That sounds familiar. Not the specifics (my company only sends files to HCSC and we don't receive anything from them), but large files for large groups and bad file design poorly implemented. Sounds like the insurance world to me!

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:08 PM (vur0q)

191 Swedish Covenant Hospital

Bork bork bork!

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:08 PM (0mRoj)

192 Well, I feel for the employees but the companies as a whole were all in on Obamacare as I recall....maybe I'm misremembering.
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:02 PM (Enq6K)

Our management was very reserved about it. They did not want to say anything that could come back to bite them in the ass. They are headquartered in Chicago, so they knew the minute they said anything, it went straight to the DNC.

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, who is now luxuriating in vast pools of winning! at February 16, 2017 12:08 PM (kXoT0)

193 Breach-Births : $37.50.

C-Section : $45.00.

Coffee : .05

Posted by: Swedish Hospital Signage at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (oXKWd)
=====================

Swedish pancakes with lingonberries - 15 cents

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:08 PM (bpfzP)

194 158
That doesn't mean the bill can't be passed to eliminate Obamacare, and
then take a few years to implement the new plan. It can be done
IMMEDIATELY. No stupid excuses.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (39g3+)

Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million
on Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (KlI/a)

See, that's what I'm talking about. You can't just announce 'Obamacare is gone tomorrow at noon. Your current policies are null and void. Best of luck...suckers."
That would be a political nightmare.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (Enq6K)

195 159 And this is why I hate meaningless actions like repeal votes when you know that they won't be signed, it makes people think "Gee, all it takes is a simple repeal vote and everything will be fine!"

Not true.They actually have to design a plan that will 1) work so we don't go down this road again 2) takes into account where we are now including the 30+ states that took Medicaid expansion as part of Obamacare 3) gets buy in from all the Republicans in Congress 4) includes the Obamacare provisions that Trump insisted he wants and 5) is affordable.

It was never going to be a quick or easy process. It took years to fully design and implement Obamacare and it is going to take more than a couple weeks to undo it.
Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (/tuJf)

If you hate it so much then why did you constantly defend those meaningless repeal votes when everyone else was calling them on that bull shit as not doing anything?

Posted by: buzzion at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (z/Ubi)

196 Crazy Mixed Up Pup (1954) is the name of the cartoon...I don't think I saw it more than once as a kid and never forgot it.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (oXKWd)

197 ok I guess it's a bad idea.

Posted by: willow at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (R7cwD)

198 Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million on Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster

What part of "implement over time" did you not read? You pass the law yanking the ACA INSTANTLY, with a proviso in the law that it takes x amount of time to sunset, and then you start working on the replacement, which uses that time to implement.

This is not exactly a challenging concept. We have precedent, because that's exactly how the ACA was implemented to begin with. Seriously, this is stupidly obvious.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (39g3+)

199 health insurance should cost no more than car insurance. should be based on frequency anyway. but, wtf do i know. keep treating them illegals assholes. just like fuckin that chicken.

Posted by: chavez the hugo at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (KP5rU)

200 Breach-Births : $37.50.

C-Section : $45.00.

Coffee : .05

Posted by: Swedish Hospital Signage

how much to chop off the feet of healthy patients?

Posted by: Rick in SK at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (FZYNt)

201 169
It was never going to be a quick or easy process. It took years to fully
design and implement Obamacare and it is going to take more than a
couple weeks to undo it.

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (/tuJf)

Yup better to do it right than fast

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (KlI/a)

Thing is, the GOP has had 6+ years to work on this - while they were in the minority. They knew their repeal legislation that they repeatedly proposed -in a lame attempt at throwing red meat to their constituents - was going nowhere. Which is fine. But while they were doing this grandstanding, why didn't they fashion a working group to fashion together a repeal/replacement?

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (jxbfJ)

202 >>Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million on Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster
---

>>Medicaid.

And who pays for any additional 20 million people in a program that is well beyond broke and fewer and fewer doctors take? We will, that's who.

Yea!

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (/tuJf)

203 People equate health insurance with health care. They have zero relationship to one another.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (bpfzP)

204 The whole employer-provided health insurance thing is a scam that needs to end.

Employers don't provide car insurance, or property insurance. It's a holdover from WW2 wage controls.
------------------------------------------
It is a benefit. Don't know if it is still common but back in the early 90's in the UK many companies provided leased cars for employees.

Posted by: RioBravo at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (SsblQ)

205 Would you mind manslpaining the Medicaid expansion to me? And also why it's an issue in repealing OCare?

I've never quite understood all the implications.
Posted by: Tammy al-Thor at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (gR+Ht)

The ONLY way Fredocare could cover all the "Uninsured" The Left wanted to cover and who could not afford to pay anything was to throw them on Medicaid and I am not sure I am correct, but I think I am, more people ended up on Medicaid than on the Fredocare plans. And of course we foot the bill

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (KlI/a)

206 There is nothing complicated about this at all. Forget about all the failures and contradictions and promises.

Let's look at the one thing Obamacare accomplished: It was the largest tax increase in history (primarily on the middle class), transitioned a vast swath of the economy into a Federal agency and gave both parties something to campaign on (yet never actually do anything about).

Oh, shorter: It's a tax.

And gee golly, the federal government just reported a record tax haul! The system worked!

Someone has to pay for their phones balanoey jobs, peon. Now get to buying shit at 500% markup or we will punish you with a shared responsibility payment.

Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (71OEY)

207 189 Repealing ObamaCare without a plan for a replacement is bad politics.

Tom Price is the right guy to be point on this and is now finally in place.

This presents an opportunity to do things to address the cost side. Medical expenses is a Big Fucking Deal, which if not fixed, will break the bank. We now have an opening.
Posted by: Ignoramus at February 16, 2017 12:08 PM (SIY7D)

Sunset the friggin thing in 12 months. In the meantime, allow insurance companies to dust off their policies and sell them as they did pre March 2010. AND allow sales across state lines.

Is it really difficult to do this?

C'mon now.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (UBQ2A)

208 My meds are paid for by BCBS at the great price of $12,213.32 a month. That's thirty days. I hope whatever they do doesn't change this. Cuz, I not have those life sustaining meds at that price.

Posted by: CSMBigBird at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (jsWA8)

209 Paul Ryan was just on explaining to reporters how tax credits put the patient and individual freedom first, while Obamacare and the Dems desire for a public option put government first. There is some truth to that.

A tax credit system is a lesser of two evils. But it is not free market. It is not small government conservatism. It is what the Ryan's of the world see as a more Republican, better welfare state.

It will be "vouchers" for education, tax credits for health care, tax incentives for retirement planning and housing, etc. Simply, give the government money via taxation for things society (government) decides everyone needs but many aren't responsible enough to save for. Then you are "free" to spend the returned money in the form of a tax credit, benefit, or voucher but only in a specific industry. Big corporation lobbyists love this system. But it is no different from a welfare state the democrats do through various taxation for programs. The debate is then whether highly red-taped, regulated and targeted welfare programs of the Democrats are a better welfare state than pseudo-free market taxation tied to returned money for controlled economic activity of the Republicans. Either way, your money is taken by government and diverted to the "general welfare".

Neither systems result in a safety net for the truly needy. Both result in less true individual freedom for those who achieve and huge portions of the economy in the iron grip of large government and industry.

Posted by: MostlyRight at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (T4UDj)

210 See, that's what I'm talking about. You can't just announce 'Obamacare is gone tomorrow at noon. Your current policies are null and void. Best of luck...suckers."
That would be a political nightmare.

And yet, who is calling for that?

Oh yeah, nobody.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (39g3+)

211
How much is the worst case malpractice payout if your dog dies in surgery versus if you die during surgery?
Posted by: V the K at February 16, 2017 12:05 PM (O7MnT)

This is something that should be agreed upon between the individual and the service provider before service is rendered.

Remember when you could buy per-trip life insurance right in the airport?

Could easily have the same thing before surgery. Or you could have that as an optional add-on for the service. The hospital will provide $XX life insurance policy for your treatment, and the user can see the cost of it--which, of course, they are really paying.

Everyone needs to be involved, skin-in-the game involved, in deciding what their own life is worth. This whole issue of settling it in the courts later and trying to win the lottery in the process is madness.

Posted by: TexasDan at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (yL25O)

212 The GOPe makes me look bad with their effortlessly fucknuttery.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (sh70B)

213 Thing is, the GOP has had 6+ years to work on this - while they were in the minority. They knew their repeal legislation that they repeatedly proposed -in a lame attempt at throwing red meat to their constituents - was going nowhere. Which is fine. But while they were doing this grandstanding, why didn't they fashion a working group to fashion together a repeal/replacement?
Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (jxbfJ)

Because they are fuckin incompetent?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (KlI/a)

214 Hing borng hoong de pancakes, ing heeng borng hoongy doong de lingonberries!

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (0mRoj)

215 The insurance industry and its campaign contributions are giving us the finger.

If you have to even think about it above that level, you're doing it wrong.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (B+qrE)

216 how much to chop off the feet of healthy patients?

Posted by: Rick in SK at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (FZYNt)
=====================

We used to throw that in for free, providing the owner let us rip the dog's tonsils out.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (bpfzP)

217 The high rate of inflation (7%-9% a year the past 8 years ), thanks to the Fed to prop up the phoney stick market keeping people's investments and pensions golden is a huge tax on people making under 50k a year, the people who don't own and can't afford pensions and investments in the market.

So slow down there a bit. Not everyone is sucking on the tit of our broke country. Some of us live with less and Make conscious decisions to do so.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (H8Bf9)

218 With no disrespect intended to the moron doctors here, the medical profession needs reform. Of course I'm in a profession where I see all the bad and greedy doctors.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (Q3fP7)

219 >>If you hate it so much then why did you constantly defend those meaningless repeal votes when everyone else was calling them on that bull shit as not doing anything?

Because I took them for what they were, virtue signaling not an indication that it was ever that easy.

Why did you support Cruz's government shutdown when you knew it was bullshit?

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (/tuJf)

220 201 Thing is, the GOP has had 6+ years to work on this - while they were in the minority. They knew their repeal legislation that they repeatedly proposed -in a lame attempt at throwing red meat to their constituents - was going nowhere. Which is fine. But while they were doing this grandstanding, why didn't they fashion a working group to fashion together a repeal/replacement?
Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (jxbfJ)

==================

You have to write stuff that will pass in a certain Congress, though, and be signed by a certain president. That fact seems to imply that some care is definitely necessary and you can't just throw a repeal bill written in 2011 to the floor expecting it to pass or be signed.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (vur0q)

221 Also... there is another huge downside to Obamacare for many.

Let's say you're at poverty level. Which is now something like $12,000 a year for a single person. Working poor.

You need a policy. Even with subsidies, you're going to end up paying.

Most can't afford more than $100 a month out of pocket.

So, you get a bronze policy, and pay your $100 plus subsidies. Your deductible is $6,000 plus.

Then you have surgery.

Bang! You're now in debt for $6000 before your Bronze Obamacare policy kicks in. You also need to keep paying your monthly premiums.

And who does this benefit? The insurance companies.

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (J5mC3)

222 Hing borng hoong de pancakes, ing heeng borng hoongy doong de lingonberries!

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (0mRoj)
===================

Don't laugh. That's how Rev talks in his sleep.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (bpfzP)

223 209 Posted by: MostlyRight at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (T4UDj)

Anything that leaves any vestige of this "law" in place means the bureaucracy stays in place. That is what's known as a "tell."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (UBQ2A)

224 >>See, that's what I'm talking about. You can't just announce 'Obamacare is gone tomorrow at noon. Your current policies are null and void. Best of luck...suckers."
That would be a political nightmare.

That's what Obamacare did to me and countless Millions of Americans.

I don't think it's the death knell people beoieve it to be.

My guess is less than 40% of those 20 Million are registered to vote and, likely 20+% are illegals.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (oXKWd)

225 >>>There is no malpractice payout if your dog dies. Owner is compensated for the costs of surgery and medications.

Also market price of dog.
Dog is property like a farm animal, not people. Of course dog is not income generating property, so the law treats dogs somewhat worse than cows.

Posted by: wooga at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (3I7wr)

226 When the Ocare clusterfark originally passed, I said that Repubs would want to keep it around FOREVER in order to run against it every 2 years.

"Elect me to ________, and I will fight to repeal/replace/fix this monstrosity!"

As long as ObamaCare exists, Repubs can use it as an electoral whipping post, which is why they've been making noises about waiting till after the next election.
It'll ALWAYS be "after the next election".

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (adsVM)

227 And yet, who is calling for that?

Oh yeah, nobody.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (39g3+)

Me, but I may be in a mood today.

What insurance carrier will suddenly get rid of all their clients?

They're going to rapidly, like in days, decide to keep all their current clients at their current levels, and then will direct a transition to new plans and price points as the market directs. I guarantee the insurance companies will blink and absorb the costs of that transition rather than fire their entire customer base.

Posted by: TexasDan at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (yL25O)

228 And who pays for any additional 20 million people in a program that is
well beyond broke and fewer and fewer doctors take? We will, that's
who.
---
End medicaid and that problem solves itself.

Posted by: Methos at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (3Liv/)

229 Alexander Acosta to be nominated for Labor department.

My Facebook Feed already knows they hate this fascist, but they haven't figured out why yet.

(Actually they haven't noticed the news yet. But I'm sure they do already hate him in advance.)

Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (10LGw)

230 Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (KlI/a)

Thanks!

Did they do it by raising the income requirement?

Posted by: Tammy al-Thor at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (gR+Ht)

231 With no disrespect intended to the moron doctors here, the medical profession needs reform. Of course I'm in a profession where I see all the bad and greedy doctors.

Posted by: Sebastian Melmoth at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (Q3fP7)
-----------------------------
Perhaps we can import better and cheaper medical personnel. Ah...never mind.

Posted by: RioBravo at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (SsblQ)

232 When the Ocare clusterfark originally passed, I said that Repubs would want to keep it around FOREVER in order to run against it every 2 years.

"Elect me to ________, and I will fight to repeal/replace/fix this monstrosity!"
---

And This is How We Got Trump.

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (J5mC3)

233 Thing is, the GOP has had 6+ years to work on this - while they were in the minority.

Exactly. Even if they didn't do it then, they had months after the election to put a crack team of staffers working on the pull and replace. It should have been ready on day 1 to immediately get going.

The fact that they apparently did none of this is proof that they don't want to do anything.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (39g3+)

234 Thing is, the GOP has had 6+ years to work on this - while they were in
the minority. They knew their repeal legislation that they repeatedly
proposed -in a lame attempt at throwing red meat to their constituents -
was going nowhere. Which is fine. But while they were doing this
grandstanding, why didn't they fashion a working group to fashion
together a repeal/replacement?
===

Not the hill to die on.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (toH8T)

235 Cut everything except Obama's "the head of Health and Human Services will do what's best and needed with no oversight from anyone anywhere on this matter" bit, send it through, sign it, and smile.

Posted by: Moron Robbie at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (/f1mm)

236 224
That's what Obamacare did to me and countless Millions of Americans.

I don't think it's the death knell people beoieve it to be.

My guess is less than 40% of those 20 Million are registered to vote and, likely 20+% are illegals.
Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (oXKWd)

=====================

Well...look at what it did to those who passed it that way and caused that disruption. Democrats did that, and they've been paying for it ever since.

If Republicans turned around and did the same thing, there's the possibility of heavy loses because of it.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (vur0q)

237 Scary clowns need to make a comeback..and stalk Ryan
and McConnell.

Posted by: Under Fire at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (nN3W/)

238 The ONLY way Fredocare could cover all the
"Uninsured" The Left wanted to cover and who could not afford to pay
anything was to throw them on Medicaid and I am not sure I am correct,
but I think I am, more people ended up on Medicaid than on the Fredocare
plans. And of course we foot the bill

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (KlI/a)

And they stole $700 billion from Medicare.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (Enq6K)

239 Anecdotally, Drudge is saying that Trump's approval is at 55%.

And that's with 24/7 SJW screaming, MSM lies and Deep State treason.

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (J5mC3)

240 Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:00 PM (bpfzP)

1,800$ is still a lot of money, not saying I don't disagree with you just pointing out a lot of families don't have that kind of dough just lying around.

Posted by: thathalfrican at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (ooKNM)

241 /94 Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 11:50 AM (y9ZJX)

Under what authority within the Constitution, is its Congress's power to ensure that people have insurance? ie... buy a product?
Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 11:54 AM (qf6WZ)
-------

It's right by the section that says they should provide Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security etc. etc. But please, you think that constitutional purist approach could ever get you elected now? Cruz was the closest thing to that and he couldn't even come close to winning the Republican primary. So you want to run on the "buy your own fucking health insurance" and "pre-existing conditions... not our fucking problem as per our 1789 agreement" good luck. That approach would have HRC in the white house right now.

Trump's "I'm not going to touch your Medicare or Social Security" approach was the only way for him to get elected.

Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 12:15 PM (y9ZJX)

242 239 Anecdotally, Drudge is saying that Trump's approval is at 55%.

And that's with 24/7 SJW screaming, MSM lies and Deep State treason.

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (J5mC3)

=====================

"Scream louder. It'll work this time."
-The DNC to Antifa

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:15 PM (vur0q)

243 See, that's what I'm talking about. You can't just announce 'Obamacare is gone tomorrow at noon. Your current policies are null and void. Best of luck...suckers."
That would be a political nightmare.
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (Enq6K)

And so, they will use Fear as a reason, to do nothing.

GOP1: OH.... look.... the Dems cut his arm off! He's bleeding to death!

Patient: Well, cauterize the dam wound you idiot!

GOP1: Cauterize? We can't do that, you might end up with burns! Let us study the situation for a few years...

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 12:15 PM (qf6WZ)

244 Great post, but +10 for a fantastically relevant Die Hard reference.

Posted by: AJsDaddie at February 16, 2017 12:16 PM (377ql)

245 Designed to fail ... and working as designed.

Couldn't have done it without enough stupid people out there.

Idiots Of America, Unite! You have nothing to lose but your gainzzzz ...

Posted by: Jonathan Gruber at February 16, 2017 12:16 PM (mt8X9)

246 Did they do it by raising the income requirement?
Posted by: Tammy al-Thor at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (gR+Ht)

Not sure exactly but yeah I think so. If you applied for Fredocare and earned below a threshold, you were automatically shunted to Medicaid, no questions asked

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:16 PM (KlI/a)

247 Also Obseity and bad health caused by poor and selfish personal choices are taxing the health care system.

But people don't want to hear or talk about that.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:16 PM (H8Bf9)

248 "Scream louder. It'll work this time."

-The DNC to Antifa
--
I think you meant "The DNC/MSM"

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:16 PM (J5mC3)

249 ocare will never go away. this is both parties' sacred cow. they all love it. what politician doesn't love another tax? some asshole judge told me, it's a tax.

Posted by: chavez the hugo at February 16, 2017 12:17 PM (KP5rU)

250 248 I think you meant "The DNC/MSM"
Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:16 PM (J5mC3)

===================

I didn't feel like repeating myself.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:17 PM (vur0q)

251 That doesn't mean the bill can't be passed to eliminate Obamacare, and
then take a few years to implement the new plan. It can be done
IMMEDIATELY. No stupid excuses.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:03 PM (39g3+)

Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million
on Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:04 PM (KlI/a)

See, that's what I'm talking about. You can't just announce 'Obamacare is gone tomorrow at noon. Your current policies are null and void. Best of luck...suckers."
That would be a political nightmare.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (Enq6K)

Hold on a second, what am I missing? Is anybody talking about shutting off policies the day the law is passed?

Christopher very specifically is talking about a plan that allowed the easing out of the programs people jumped into.

Why do people talk like that's some sort of political nightmare? Where's the freakin' nightmare, folks? Repeal the damned thing! Letting this drag on and on and on IS the nightmare!

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:17 PM (TOk1P)

252 >>If Republicans turned around and did the same thing, there's the possibility of heavy loses because of it.

I don't give a fuck about the Republicans.

They can all burn.

No Politician is more important than me.

When my Rights are co-opted for the benefit of the Party, the Party is now my enemy.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 12:17 PM (oXKWd)

253 Designed to fail ... and working as designed.
---

"The Only Answer is Free Single Payer"
- all of Shibumi's idiot liberal co-workers

Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:17 PM (J5mC3)

254 Kidd Rock or Joy Villa for Speaker Of The House!!!

Posted by: ShainS at February 16, 2017 12:18 PM (mt8X9)

255 When the Ocare clusterfark originally passed, I said that Repubs would want to keep it around FOREVER in order to run against it every 2 years.

Sure, all that money, all that power, and a perpetual fundraising plug. Its pathetic, and the men who in congress keeping this going need to be beaten, tarred, feathered, and ridden out of the country on a rail. A floating one, so they can be shoved toward Europe and waved goodbye to.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:18 PM (39g3+)

256 Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 12:15 PM (y9ZJX)

So.... I see you don't believe we are a Republic anymore... but a Democracy...

Do I believe people can get elected on that argument? Of course not...

But then, I'm not trying to get elected, am I?

I'm simply pointing out that is happening NOW, because this will be debated on in the future, when the system does fail.

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 12:18 PM (qf6WZ)

257 The PROBLEM with saying the private health care industry will pick up the slack is that there is NO MORE Private health care plans....very very very few. Most have already gotten the fuck out of the field as fast as their feet could carry them

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:18 PM (KlI/a)

258 252 I don't give a fuck about the Republicans.

They can all burn.

No Politician is more important than me.

When my Rights are co-opted for the benefit of the Party, the Party is now my enemy.
Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 12:17 PM (oXKWd)

====================

And yet, you're demanding specific activities from them.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:18 PM (vur0q)

259
If the GOP is so set on a replacement then it should be their responsibility to do it after the repeal of obamacare. Nothing will get done, if they really want it too, without a ticking clock. Which is why they won't repeal it, they don't want any responsibility because they are cowards.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (ODxAs)

260 ryan is gopE

don't trust him

Posted by: concrete girl at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (itHFV)

261 222 Hing borng hoong de pancakes, ing heeng borng hoongy doong de lingonberries!

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:10 PM (0mRoj)
===================

Don't laugh. That's how Rev talks in his sleep.
Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (bpfzP)

You marry the Swedish Chef and ask me not to laugh? That's just not fair!

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (0mRoj)

262 198
Not really. Some provisions have to be made for the 20 odd million on
Fredocare plans or it could turn into a political disaaster

What part of "implement over time" did you not read? You pass the
law yanking the ACA INSTANTLY, with a proviso in the law that it takes x
amount of time to sunset, and then you start working on the
replacement, which uses that time to implement.

This is not exactly a challenging concept. We have precedent, because that's exactly how the ACA was implemented to begin with. Seriously, this is stupidly obvious.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (39g3+)

Right on. But then again we are blessed with the GOP-elite -- of which Chelsea Manning has more testicular fortitude then they do.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (jxbfJ)

263 Ever get the feeling you're being played?

Yep. That's why we've been trying to primary every RINO loser, from Ryan on down.

Posted by: Iblis at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (9221z)

264 1,800$ is still a lot of money, not saying I don't
disagree with you just pointing out a lot of families don't have that
kind of dough just lying around.

Posted by: thathalfrican at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (ooKNM)
========================

I get that. But what if you added up all the monthly premiums you now pay - and didn't have to pay them? What if you only had to pay if you actually needed the service?

Say you pay $500 per month in insurance - that's $6000 per year. What if you never need medical care that year? The money goes down the toilet. What if you could put that $500 per month into a health savings account and only use it if you needed it, but kept it if you didn't?

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (bpfzP)

265 It's pretty fascinating that the (D)s clearly never expected to lose, and the (R)s felt the same way.

Posted by: Moron Robbie at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (/f1mm)

266 So what about the plan Thomas Price had. Is it crap? Already rejected by GOP? Not actually a real plan?

Posted by: RioBravo at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (SsblQ)

267 >>Why do people talk like that's some sort of political nightmare? Where's the freakin' nightmare, folks? Repeal the damned thing! Letting this drag on and on and on IS the nightmare!

And why are some demanding that it happen yesterday since it won't make a damn bit of difference?

Anybody bother to listen to Ryan's daily presser today? Unless everyone in the House and Senate and Tom Price and Trump himself are lying through their teeth they are working on the plan that Price laid out years ago as their blueprint and plan to present it to the CBO after their constituent work period.

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:20 PM (/tuJf)

268 And This is How We Got Trump.
Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (J5mC3)
--------------------
Bingo.
Which is why I loved it every time the media breathlessly reported a GOPer dissing Trump during the campaign: all it did was make him MORE popular with regular people.

If the political elite/media universally hate you, regardless of party, you've got my vote.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:20 PM (adsVM)

269 Part of the gold-plated lining of Trump is to suss out the weasels given cover by Obama's veto power. They could scoop up votes as home, and take insurance lucre on the side, courting influence purchasers with ease.

Anyone even remotely hedging on this issue now needs a big boot.

Posted by: SarahW at February 16, 2017 12:20 PM (Sp1NT)

270 Notice that what Ryan is NOT talking about is free-market reforms.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at February 16, 2017 12:20 PM (oVJmc)

271 #251

Christopher very specifically is talking about a plan that allowed the easing out of the programs people jumped into.
===========

For tens of millions of American taxpayers, I would repeal the word "jumped" and replace it with the word "dumped".

Posted by: mrp at February 16, 2017 12:20 PM (JBggj)

272 Eliminate the individual mandate. That power lies at the State level ... not the Federal.

Eliminate the employer mandate. That is a State power as well.

Mandate any employee can take pre-tax cash instead of the employer provided insurance premium.

Eliminate the subsidy for ObamaCare policies. Eat the admin costs for now.

Done.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:20 PM (qVyOY)

273 93 million people sitting on the sidelines with nothing to do but milk entitlements and figure how to game the system. The taxpayer funded system.

We need jobs.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:21 PM (toH8T)

274 >>And yet, you're demanding specific activities from them.

No.

I am hoping, beyond reason, that they will complete the transaction we entered into:

They get my Vote, and they Represent My insterests in the ways They promised.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 12:21 PM (oXKWd)

275 The whole employer-provided health insurance thing is a scam that needs to end.

Employers don't provide car insurance, or property insurance. It's a holdover from WW2 wage controls.
------------------------------------------
It is a benefit. Don't know if it is still common but back in the early 90's in the UK many companies provided leased cars for employees.
***********

"Benefit" is the closest description.

It's tax free compensation. If your employer pays you a dollar, they have to match your deduction for SS and Medicare up to the cap, so each dollar costs $1.12ish.

Technically, win win... except government loathes any penny it hasn't taxed several times over.

As I mentioned above, it is naive the debate Obamacare as a benefit or a healthcare plan. The ONLY thing it did was create the largest tax in history with a vast tax base (all not forming the regular base get sucked up in the "shared responsibility payment"). Ta da! New "revenue" under the control of DHS (no more pesky voting to raise taxes) and everyone has political cover because they keep pretending that repeal involved "taking popular things away from people".

What did you give anyone? $9 birth control to one person that costs 10 other people $10 each now? Giant premium increases? Giant deductables?

No one got a damn thing except a giant, mandatory bill... except the government who got giant, mandatory "income".

Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 12:21 PM (71OEY)

276 Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:19 PM (bpfzP)

Thanks for expanding, that makes sense to me.

I still think the idea of no insurance scares the shit out of people if not explained clearly to them.

Posted by: thathalfrican at February 16, 2017 12:21 PM (ooKNM)

277 Sunset the friggin thing in 12 months. In the meantime, allow insurance companies to dust off their policies and sell them as they did pre March 2010. AND allow sales across state lines.

Is it really difficult to do this?

C'mon now.
..........
J.J. - not as easy as it sounds.. How do Flo or the Gecko companies put together nationwide networks of doctors and hospitals - and negotiate rates?

The idea of health insurance across state lines feels like it would bring costs down.. but health care is regional.. and there is just as much chance that you would be creating monopolies that could drive the prices even higher.

Nope.. I think at some point we need to take the bull by the horns and implement a gigantic pool of every citizen.. a small 1.5% payroll tax to fund it so everyone has skin in the game. It would cover expenses, say, over $10k. Insurance premiums would drop because insurers would have no high-end risk. That would be my solution.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 12:21 PM (so+oy)

278 What part of "implement over time" did you not read? You pass the
law yanking the ACA INSTANTLY, with a proviso in the law that it takes x
amount of time to sunset, and then you start working on the
replacement, which uses that time to implement.

The part where you did not talk about sunsetting it. I read perfectly well. BUT even then you better have an outline of plan of where you want or expect to go or it will still be a political disaster and how are you going to force the "Carriers" to stay in?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:21 PM (KlI/a)

279
Fuck, repealing obamacare doesn't mean the plans go away. They are still in effect.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 16, 2017 12:22 PM (ODxAs)

280 Hold on a second, what am I missing? Is anybody talking about shutting off policies the day the law is passed?

Christopher very specifically is talking about a plan that allowed the easing out of the programs people jumped into.

Why do people talk like that's some sort of political nightmare?
Where's the freakin' nightmare, folks? Repeal the damned thing!
Letting this drag on and on and on IS the nightmare!

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:17 PM (TOk1P)

I'm not exactly sure what Christopher means when he says 'pass a bill to eliminate Obamacare IMMEDIATELY....then take a few years to roll out a new plan.'
A few YEARS? Then really what is the difference between that and what's going on right now?

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:22 PM (Enq6K)

281 The high rate of inflation (7%-9% a year the past 8 years ), thanks to
the Fed to prop up the phoney stick market keeping people's investments
and pensions golden is a huge tax on people making under 50k a year, the
people who don't own and can't afford pensions and investments in the
market.

Arguably that's not why the Fed did it. In another view, they did it so that Obongo didn't have to face the consequences of his lousy economic policies, viz., a prolonged recession or even a depression. The quantitative easing kept the economy liquid and afloat, albeit on life support.

Posted by: Deplorable Jay Guevara at February 16, 2017 12:22 PM (SRKgf)

282 Exactly. Even if they didn't do it then, they had months after the election to put a crack team of staffers working on the pull and replace. It should have been ready on day 1 to immediately get going.

The fact that they apparently did none of this is proof that they don't want to do anything.

Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (39g3+)

I'm going to keep saying, until there's evidence to the contrary: The number 1 enemy right now is the Republican Party in Washington.

All this nonsense about the Deep Shadow Government, all the ninnies of the Democrat Party, all of twitterverse, the blms in the street, laraza, Isis, media industrial complex... all of it, all of them could be defeated, if... we had a committed Republican Party in Washington who wanted to do so.

We don't.

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:22 PM (TOk1P)

283 The GOP, though not all Republicans, are committed to a government health care payer/insurance scheme. They might as well just change the name of Obamacare to take the Obama part out - which would be similar to the functional changes they are pursuing (read: superficial). I am working on coming to terms with this reality, convincing myself that while this is significantly less than ideal, it is infinitely better than what the socialists desire: single payer.

Posted by: steve walsh at February 16, 2017 12:22 PM (7C7xp)

284 SUNSET Obamacare. Let people buy it and continue the same subsidies (without increasing them) for, say, three years.

Meanwhile....Open up the market across state lines.
Open up policies to what the customer wants --- making sure to say that you CAN insure your kids to age 26 if you like.
Tort reform.
Sever medical insurance from employment.
Create high-risk pools.

And limit Medicaid to citizens or at least LEGAL residents.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at February 16, 2017 12:22 PM (Nox3c)

285 Because they are fuckin incompetent?
Posted by: Nevergiveup

The federal leviathan have been inflated to the point where competence is irrelevant. It's too big to manage, and there are too many invested in keeping it growing.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at February 16, 2017 12:23 PM (4YGWz)

286 The health system has been weaponized against citizens. You have a major medical incident and you are destroyed for life in today's America. 90grand for open heart surgery here. 1800 in India cash. Both with exact same level of care and recovery.

See the problem.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:23 PM (H8Bf9)

287 "There's a whole area of climate so-called science that is really more like a cult," [frontrunner for the role of science adviser to Donald Trump, William] Happer told the Guardian.
"It's like Hare Krishna or something like that. They're glassy-eyed and they chant. It will potentially harm the image of all science."

Posted by: undocumented illegal SMOD at February 16, 2017 12:23 PM (e8kgV)

288 255 When the Ocare clusterfark originally passed, I said that Repubs would want to keep it around FOREVER in order to run against it every 2 years.

Sure, all that money, all that power, and a perpetual fundraising plug. Its pathetic, and the men who in congress keeping this going need to be beaten, tarred, feathered, and ridden out of the country on a rail. A floating one, so they can be shoved toward Europe and waved goodbye to.
Posted by: Christopher R Taylor at February 16, 2017 12:18 PM (39g3+)
----------------------
I like the way you think.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:23 PM (adsVM)

289 Rush asks why Obama was investigating Trump as far back as last Sept/Oct when the conventional wisdom was that Cankles was a lock to win?

That's easy, they not only wanted him to lose, but they needed to destroy him and his supporters to make sure we never had another "outsider" as a choice ever again..... same reason they now need to destroy his Presidency....

The Deep State needs to be thrown into a Deep Pit of Dicks.

Posted by: Dirty Randy at February 16, 2017 12:23 PM (jjaLl)

290 Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:17 PM (TOk1P)

I'm not exactly sure what Christopher means when he says 'pass a bill to eliminate Obamacare IMMEDIATELY....then take a few years to roll out a new plan.'
A few YEARS? Then really what is the difference between that and what's going on right now?

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:22 PM (Enq6K)

You really don't?

I'm not sure how that's possible.

What is happening right now, is nothing. What would happen if they passed a bill, is something.

Which is different from nothing.

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:23 PM (TOk1P)

291 The only thing worse than rhe GOP is the alternatives.

Posted by: rd at February 16, 2017 12:24 PM (iT57s)

292
I am Fido's nuts.
Posted by: Fido's nuts at February 16, 2017 12:07 PM (IqV8l)

Phone home Michelle has been looking for you

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at February 16, 2017 12:25 PM (lKyWE)

293 Remember how the ACA mentioned the secretary of the DHHS like 20 billion times or whatever in things it left up to them to decide?

Well now that guy is Tom Price. Can't we be putting pressure on him to do stuff if congress isn't?

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 12:25 PM (KUaJL)

294 Leave current policies in place until 2018. Subsidies for both individual plans as well as Medicaid expansion will be phased out over 4 years.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (kTF2Z)

295 You have a major medical incident and you are
destroyed for life in today's America. 90grand for open heart surgery
here. 1800 in India cash. Both with exact same level of care and
recovery.

See the problem.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:23 PM (H8Bf9)
=======================

Yup. They don't call it the Health Care "Industry" for nothing.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (bpfzP)

296 That would be my solution.

And that would be Single Payer High Deductible Insurance. No. Thanks.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (qVyOY)

297 Also Obseity and bad health caused by poor and selfish personal choices are taxing the health care system. --Pepe

There you have it. The ultimate Socialism. Pepe's gonna tell you what's good for you, and what he don't like will be illegal.

Because, "no man is an island."

Posted by: Stringer Davis at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (H5rtT)

298 All of these mf-ers were all in on obamacare. They stood hand in hand even as everyone knew they were going to take it up the ass. How about this for a law: If you lobbied for it, you can't withdraw.

Posted by: ejo at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (il4FI)

299 219 >>If you hate it so much then why did you constantly defend those meaningless repeal votes when everyone else was calling them on that bull shit as not doing anything?

Because I took them for what they were, virtue signaling not an indication that it was ever that easy.

Why did you support Cruz's government shutdown when you knew it was bullshit?
Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:11 PM (/tuJf)

So virtue signaling in a way that you like, that no one ever hears about = good.

Virtue signaling in a manner that might actually get coverage of the problem of Obamacare with the government shut down = bad.

Got it.

Posted by: buzzion at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (z/Ubi)

300 How about no vote to repeal - but continue to waive regulatory requirements that continue to underpin and accelerate its own collapse; like the IRS no longer requiring you to show you have insurance and therefore no longer being able to impose a penalty - but offer a replacement that is based on free market principles. Let insurance companies tailor plans to fit consumers and let consumers themselves bail on Obamacare and those exchanges. And then when insurance companies continue to bail on the exchanges for more profitable business selling cheaper plans that customers actually get value from Obamacare will be gone because of its own economic fucktardery.

The only people not covered at that point are the same people that were not covered before Obamacare. No vote to repeal means what plays out is the result of Democrats and Obamacare. With most consumers (voters) off the Obamacare plans and back into private plans they want, what is the issue that Democrats run on? It won't be "they voted to repeal Obamacare and this is what happened!" it will be "they let customers opt out of Obamacare and this is what happened!" Not that compelling a campaign premise.

I get the sense the "Vote to Repeal" is more about vindication and sticking it to Obama than anything else. With the shit collapsing, you don't need to repeal it, you just need to let insurance companies start offering plans people want and customers will bail in droves.

Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (y9ZJX)

301 #277

The idea of health insurance across state lines feels like it would
bring costs down.. but health care is regional.. and there is just as
much chance that you would be creating monopolies that could drive the
prices even higher.
============

We don't have monopolies NOW?

Blue Cross? Every state has its fiefdom.

With every insurance company leaving the Obamacare system, the subsidy pool gets smaller and smaller.

Posted by: mrp at February 16, 2017 12:27 PM (JBggj)

302 Long time reader, first post.

It's now clear to me the GOPe needs to be dispatched. We need to hold those voters of Ryan, McConnell, McCain, Graham, Flake, Sasse et al., accountable. The House and Senate are once again self bogged down in DC quicksand. I AM DONE!

Posted by: Tina Ferrer at February 16, 2017 12:27 PM (+qnL1)

303 Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 12:21 PM (so+oy)

So your solution to the Government taking over 1/6th of the economy, and screwing it up...

Is MORE Government? More TAXES?

/facepalm

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 12:27 PM (qf6WZ)

304 >>Well now that guy is Tom Price. Can't we be putting pressure on him to do stuff if congress isn't?

Again, did anybody bother to listen to Ryan's presser today?

According to Ryan, they are using Price's plan, a guy who has now been in office for a week, as the blueprint of a new plan and work with daily to include Trump's new demands and have a plan ready to go, a plan that the insurance companies can build new plans around which takes months, in a few weeks.

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:27 PM (/tuJf)

305 Leave current policies in place until 2018. Subsidies for both individual plans as well as Medicaid expansion will be phased out over 4 years.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (kTF2Z)

Now THAT would be a fun election, the 2020 cycle.

Hey folks, we did nothing. And now you'll have nothing. And like it.

So... how's about you let us keep running Congress for you, mkay?

Thnx, bi.

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:28 PM (TOk1P)

306 Here's what I'd like to see happen. No insurance. Pay as you go. Directly to your doctor or hospital. Watch the prices drop dramatically. Maybe some type of super-catastrophic insurance. That's it. No paperwork, no middle man.

==

i like it

and some medical practices might offer subscription deals or something if they want

Posted by: @votermom @vm at February 16, 2017 12:28 PM (Om16U)

307 Ann Coulter points out that the GOP, when Obama was president and could veto the repeals, passed six Obamacare repeals.

She stole my comments!

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at February 16, 2017 12:28 PM (zc3Db)

308 So your solution to the Government taking over 1/6th of the economy, and screwing it up...

Is MORE Government? More TAXES?

/facepalm
====

Dude. It's Jerry.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:29 PM (toH8T)

309 On the bright side, you can always go with the Russian plan, once they hack the system.

Posted by: Fritz at February 16, 2017 12:29 PM (2Mnv1)

310 Why worry.
Either the Medical business or the USG and probably both are going down anyway because Math.

Here's Karl

https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?singlepost=3416126

Rand Paul is going to legalize the problem. $%^*(-tard

Posted by: DaveA at February 16, 2017 12:29 PM (8J/Te)

311 "Scream louder. It'll work this time."

-The DNC to Antifa
--
I think you meant "The DNC/MSM"
Posted by: shibumi, a rational single white female and kitteh servant

Please Clap. Please?

Posted by: Bossy Conservative....outlaw in America at February 16, 2017 12:29 PM (RFeQD)

312 Are we sure it is Obamacare that is dying. Sounds like it is insurance companies going broke. I wonder how that happened.

Posted by: Wendel Willard at February 16, 2017 12:29 PM (DjoL4)

313 We need to hold those voters of Ryan, McConnell, McCain, Graham, Flake, Sasse et al., accountable.
==========================

I voted for Ryan. I sure as heck wasn't going to vote for the demented dingbat donkey who ran against him.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:29 PM (bpfzP)

314 "Is it really difficult to do this?
C'mon now."

Yes it is.

Many people get insurance through their employer and don't see the cost. Big point: they also get put into more favorable risk pools.

Some people get put into bad risk pools solely because they're self-employed, etc.

And then there are people who have expensive pre-conditions. Obamacare said they'd get covered -- hard to go back on this.

And then there are people who can't or won't pay for coverage they can't afford, who will bank on getting charity coverage.

Posted by: Ignoramus at February 16, 2017 12:29 PM (SIY7D)

315 Obamacare was designed to fail. Had Hillary been elected (shudder) they would have gone single payer. Now, they're all stuck with their thumbs in their asses because the plan failed----------I include the republican deep staters in this, obviously.

Posted by: dagny at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (nnAfn)

316 Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (y9ZJX)

You have to repeal it, because ITS A LAW...

And it was written with a non severability clause... ie you are not supposed to be able to just repeal a piece of it...

Or is it your position that Trump can do it through Executive Actions... ie NOT enforce a law because he doesn't like it??? Which is EXACTLY what we complained about Obama doing?

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (qf6WZ)

317 Repeal and replace all the DC baby boomers and DC parasites in DC immediately. Literally quarantine that depraved and degenerate place filled with the worst kinds of criminals.

Country would heal itself in a few years. Pain yes. But there is pain with all healing after injury.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (H8Bf9)

318 What is happening right now, is nothing. What would happen if they passed a bill, is something.

Which is different from nothing.

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:23 PM (TOk1P)

You really think that Trump will allow 'nothing' to be happening on Obamacare repeal? One of his biggest, if not the biggest, thing he ran on.

Maybe I'm being too Pollyanna but I gotta think they're working on SOMETHING to repeal it. I just don't want them to rush it and have chaos ensue.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (Enq6K)

319 So ... am I the only one that keeps a mental list of which posters will always defend the actions of the GOP ?

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (qVyOY)

320 Why are the Native Americans NOT building Hospitals?

They already have the Hotels and Casinos.

Just throw a Hospital Wing on them and start shoveling money into their tee-pees and round-houses.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (oXKWd)

321 173
Hospitals can deal with free market forces suddenly, too. They will have to instantly deal with an entirely uninsured market place. And they can wait it out with people dying at their locked doors, or they can find a way to provide services at prices people can afford.
Posted by: TexasDan at February 16, 2017 12:06 PM (yL25O)

^^This.

Posted by: rickl at February 16, 2017 12:31 PM (zoehZ)

322 Leave current policies in place until 2018. Subsidies for both individual plans as well as Medicaid expansion will be phased out over 4 years.

If I am not mistaken, COngress has already put a halt to many of the subsidies which is also why many of the Companies are dropping out.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:31 PM (KlI/a)

323 234

Not the hill to die on.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:13 PM (toH8T)

I don't think the GOP-elite have yet seen a hill they would consider dying on.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:31 PM (jxbfJ)

324 And that would be Single Payer High Deductible Insurance. No. Thanks.
Posted by: ScoggDog
.............
It is not. It is catastrophic insurance for all. A safety net. Only those who have a catastrophic illness would dip into that pool. No one loses their house over an illness.

You can either buy insurance on the free market to cover the gap, or not.. your choice.. buy cheap insurance.. cadillac.. or none.

The most important part, however, is that you can demand insurers take all comers with no deference to pre-existing conditions. And it would bring down premiums drastically.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 12:31 PM (so+oy)

325 >>See, that's what I'm talking about. You can't just announce 'Obamacare is gone tomorrow at noon. Your current policies are null and void. Best of luck...suckers."
That would be a political nightmare.
.....

Yes, a POLITICAL nightmare because everyone is babbling about made up shit.

Who loses anything? The "20 million now insured"? How many of them paid their first premium payment and how many signed up, went to the ER, got their fix and never paid a dime? How many of them would have simply shown up and not paid under indigent care, etc.?

Now, on the other hand, people who actually want and pay for insurance would immediately go back to the far cheaper, far better, pre-Obamacare policies, the numerous insurance companies that opted out would have incentive to offer policies again, and we wouldn't be supporting thousands of federal employees who do nothing but #Resistance.

The only downside is we'd be stuck with the losses from a several billion dollar website that doesn't work.

Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (71OEY)

326 >>I don't think the GOP-elite have yet seen a hill they would consider dying on.

They'll die on a hill of our Money.

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (oXKWd)

327 236
Well...look at what it did to those who passed it
that way and caused that disruption. Democrats did that, and they've
been paying for it ever since.

If Republicans turned around and did the same thing, there's the possibility of heavy loses because of it.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (vur0q)

There also is the possibility of heavy losses IF THEY DON'T repeal it.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (jxbfJ)

328 Long time reader, first post.

It's now clear to me the GOPe needs to be dispatched. We need to hold those voters of Ryan, McConnell, McCain, Graham, Flake, Sasse et al., accountable. The House and Senate are once again self bogged down in DC quicksand. I AM DONE!

Posted by: Tina Ferrer at February 16, 2017 12:27 PM (+qnL1)

I'll be the one to welcome the new poster.

Hey baby!!

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (Jcg9Q)

329
Posted by: Fritz
===

In Soviet Union , healthcare hacks you!

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (toH8T)

330 talk, talk, talk...that's what ryan does.

i want action.

follow your president's lead mr. speaker.

Posted by: concrete girl at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (itHFV)

331 So your solution to the Government taking over 1/6th of the economy, and screwing it up...

Is MORE Government? More TAXES?

/facepalm
====

Dude. It's Jerry.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:29 PM (toH8T)

Forget it, he's rolling.

Posted by: Jerry Bombed Pearl Harbor at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (TOk1P)

332 306 Here's what I'd like to see happen. No insurance. Pay as you go. Directly to your doctor or hospital. Watch the prices drop dramatically. Maybe some type of super-catastrophic insurance. That's it. No paperwork, no middle man.

==

i like it

and some medical practices might offer subscription deals or something if they want
Posted by: @votermom @vm at February 16, 2017 12:28 PM (Om16U)
---------------------
I'm for this, too. They'd be forced to be up-front about costs, which would be HUGE. Right now, you walk in the door with a problem and NO ONE can/will tell you what the bill is going to be till afterward.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (adsVM)

333 We pay over 2000 a month for limited coverage with high cost share, impressive deductibles, limited coverage of things we need (vs things we have no utter freaking use for) no protection from wildly out of control balance bill practices that hospitals permit and actually encourage in "contract" practice groups that aren't employed directly by the hospital.

If I get really sick, I can still expect to owe at least many tens of thousands, on top of the 30,000 or so I have to pay out of pocket if that happens.

The anaesthesiologist balance bills. He belongs to no network outside of medicare. The radiology group has it's own bill, and balance bills. The pathologist working in the hospital - balance bills. The PT people balance bill. The respiratory therapist, the consult cardiologist, and on and on and on and on.

I need some imaging, and I have to pay a large amount out of pocket and then pay the balance bill on top of that. So I don't get it. I badly hurt my wrist 2 years ago and could benefit from treatment. I just live with it.
I need two other recommended surgeries that I have put off indefinitely because the financial risk it too high. My insurance is a regular old silver-level plan, it costs a fortune and offers protection only in utter freaking absolute catastrophe, and even then incomplete protection. Balance bills are not subject to stop-loss provisions.

The the odd drop in to the regular doc for minor illness or accident is covered - I pay 25 for regular, 70 for specialist. but I would be much better off just paying that sort of bill full-freight, directly with an HSA. Plus I think the doc would rather have the cash and would charge me less.

Posted by: SarahW at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (Sp1NT)

334 It's clownish and buffoonish to believe they will eliminate Medicaid. That won't happen under any administration or Congress. They will also somehow need to cover people currently covered under Obamacare. There are not a lot of good choices here.

Rand Paul is just being unrealistic. He knows current law provides for every person being able to obtain car not matter what their socioeconomic status is.

This is about getting the government out of the insurance business. But it's also about how you best cover and pay for people who are going to fall into Medicaid once this thing collapses.

Posted by: Marcus T at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (JO0a2)

335 Ever get the feeling you're being played?

Since February 17, 1963.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (X6fMO)

336 My initial, half-joking support of Trump was based on the hope the GOPe would burn.

I must say, I'm a bit disappointed right now.

Posted by: Brother Cavil, keeper of the Deplorable Unicode Character at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (9krrF)

337 Yo!

Posted by: Yo! at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (j9LD5)

338 Rush asks why Obama was investigating Trump as far back as last Sept/Oct when the conventional wisdom was that Cankles was a lock to win?

I don't think Hillary was ever a lock. I never thought she was. They were skewing the polls on purpose for the "inevitability" theme, someone had to remember that they were. Obama came out to campaign for her which I don't think he would have done unless she was in trouble.

Posted by: dagny at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (nnAfn)

339 So ... am I the only one that keeps a mental list of which posters will always defend the actions of the GOP ?

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (qVyOY)

No.

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (Jcg9Q)

340 I AM DONE!

Posted by: Tina Ferrer

===

pics?

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (toH8T)

341 Obamacare was designed to fail. Had Hillary been
elected (shudder) they would have gone single payer. Now, they're all
stuck with their thumbs in their asses because the plan
failed----------I include the republican deep staters in this,
obviously.

Posted by: dagny at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (nnAfn)
=========================

Bingo. This was all supposed to lead to single payer. Then Oops we got Trump.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:34 PM (bpfzP)

342 Posted by: Tina Ferrer at February 16, 2017 12:27 PM (+qnL1)

I'll be the one to welcome the new poster.

Hey baby!!

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (Jcg9Q)

Just cuz you called first doesn't mean you automatically get to take her to the AoSHQ junior prom.

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:34 PM (TOk1P)

343 Re: Doctors

They must be in bigger practices, controlled by hospitals/networks/insurance Companies if they expect to prosper. Its a dishartening fact I know. Also Drs. are forced to see x number of patients per day/hour if they expect to get paid by those that control the groups. Drs. are fodder in this war. The insurers have every reason to reduce care and increase pricing. Insurers are the middlemen stealing all the cream. There is no answer to the problem of high costs except to empower the consumers with freedom. Most consumers just have health care, pay no attention, then only complain when the costs hit them. Individual consumers have no real voice until they are educated and freed (and that's not happening anytime soon).

So .... slowdown, this ain't going anywhere fast or particularly good for a long long time.

Posted by: Les Kinetic at February 16, 2017 12:34 PM (t6wDl)

344 >>So virtue signaling in a way that you like, that no one ever hears about = good.

>>Virtue signaling in a manner that might actually get coverage of the problem of Obamacare with the government shut down = bad.

>>Got it.

No, apparently you don't. Not surprising.

The numerous Obamacare repeals had no practical effect other than to keep people focused on the end game. There was zero negative repercussions other than making some of you think this was going to be an overnight process.

Shutting down the government was overwhelmingly negative for Republicans. I know some of you believe it was actually a positive but poll after poll showed exactly the opposite. The only thing that ameliorated the negative coverage was the rollout of Obamacare which happened at the exact same time and was an unmitigated disaster, the kind of thing I would like the Republicans to avoid with their plan.

Their is a less than zero chance Trump is not going to have a replacement plan as part of of his agenda. He ran on it and as was obvious long before the Aetna CEO made his announcement Obamacare is going to implode anyway.

Congress is working on and Obamacare replacement, tax reform and a number of other issues as part of a huge legislative plan. They are also dealing with the fact that not only has Democrats dragging out the consent and advise process for cabinet secretaries kept the Sec of HHS, the point guy for the administration on healthcare reform, out of office, it has consumed the Senate schedule.

I could give a shit if it takes a few weeks or months to come up with a plan that works. It won't change anything until next year anyway. I'd rather have them get it right.

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (/tuJf)

345 Ever get the feeling you're being played?

Since February 17, 1963.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (X6fMO)
=====================

When the Beatles first went on Ed Sullivan?

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (bpfzP)

346 I read somewhere (a comment section on fakebook I imagine) that the reason all our premiums are high is because of employer provided insurance policies, because they supposedly get a special rate paid for the government, so in essence people who get insurance from their employer are getting free shit from the government. Is this true?

Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (9U1OG)

347 327 There also is the possibility of heavy losses IF THEY DON'T repeal it.
Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (jxbfJ)

==================

Go to your congress critter's townhall and make that known.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (vur0q)

348 So ... am I the only one that keeps a mental list of which posters will always defend the actions of the GOP ?

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (qVyOY)

Hmmmm.... tell me more.

Posted by: Guy Making a List of Posters Keeping Lists at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (jjaLl)

349 It is not. It is catastrophic insurance for all. A safety net. Only those who have a catastrophic illness would dip into that pool. No one loses their house over an illness.

Jerry ... ever considered registering Democrat ?

I'm entirely serious. You want to tax everyone ANOTHER 1.5% to start ANOTHER fucking entitlement ? Because ... hey ... no way in the world that would turn out badly.

No ... I take it back. You're definitely a Republican. No doubt about it.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:36 PM (qVyOY)

350 Only an idiot or left winger did not understand that Fredocare was doomed to failure from day 1. And a great and mighty failure it has been

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:36 PM (KlI/a)

351 I AM DONE!

Posted by: Tina Ferrer

===

pics?

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (toH8T)

Damn, forgot that part.

*hangs head*

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 12:36 PM (Jcg9Q)

352 Ever get the feeling you're being played?
----------------------------------
Since February 17, 1963.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (X6fMO)

Ho! The day Kennedy was shot... what do you know, and when did you know it??

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:36 PM (TOk1P)

353 >>Just cuz you called first doesn't mean you automatically get to take her to the AoSHQ junior prom.

The Webelos took our dates.

Posted by: AoSHQ Scout at February 16, 2017 12:36 PM (oXKWd)

354 BCBS is the ONLY insurance company that offers plans in the state of Georgia. And government employees and teachers have not seen their insurance rates skyrocket like employed people paying out of pocket.

Yeah. Fucking awesome. Paying the insurance for givernement workers and teachers and illegals. And stuck with 9%inflation yearly.

The state is killing the citizens of this country. The state needs the citizens more than we need the state. People need to start acting like it.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:36 PM (H8Bf9)

355 Congress: Where the women are dicks, and the republicans are pussies.

Posted by: jwpaine at February 16, 2017 12:36 PM (hoJm7)

356 302 Long time reader, first post.

It's now clear to me the GOPe needs to be dispatched. We need to hold those voters of Ryan, McConnell, McCain, Graham, Flake, Sasse et al., accountable. The House and Senate are once again self bogged down in DC quicksand. I AM DONE!
Posted by: Tina Ferrer at February 16, 2017 12:27 PM (+qnL1)

====================

And how, exactly, do you plan on doing that?

What do you mean by holding the voters who keep Paul Ryan in Congress accountable?

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:36 PM (vur0q)

357 It is not. It is catastrophic insurance for all. A safety net. Only
those who have a catastrophic illness would dip into that pool. No one
loses their house over an illness.

Which, economically makes more sense than a system where 1/2 the country thinks it needs insurance to pay for $12 birth control pills.

Posted by: dagny at February 16, 2017 12:37 PM (nnAfn)

358 Since February 17, 1963.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (X6fMO)
=====================

When the Beatles first went on Ed Sullivan?

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (bpfzP)

The day the Russians sent that dog, Spotnik, into space.

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:37 PM (TOk1P)

359 Which, economically makes more sense than a system where 1/2 the country thinks it needs insurance to pay for $12 birth control pills.
-----------------

Surprisingly, those same people will pay 60-90 bucks a month for unlimited internet access.

Posted by: Wendel Willard at February 16, 2017 12:38 PM (DjoL4)

360 /256 Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 12:15 PM (y9ZJX)

So.... I see you don't believe we are a Republic anymore... but a Democracy...

Do I believe people can get elected on that argument? Of course not...

But then, I'm not trying to get elected, am I?

I'm simply pointing out that is happening NOW, because this will be debated on in the future, when the system does fail.
Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 12:18 PM (qf6WZ)
------
No. I believe we are a Republic and you can't get elected in our Republic today by running on a platform scrapping every government program that isn't explicitly enumerated in the Constitution. You agree with this. So, I'm not sure what the debate is.

Responding to a proposal to replace Obamacare with "where is that called for in the Constitution?" accomplishes what? I guess I missed the point of your response. Obamacare needs to be replaced. I agree providing healthcare is not an enumerated power of the Federal government. You agree that you can't get elected without now indulging the expectations of voters from an overly-expansionistic government providing unconstitutional services. So what are we debating?

Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 12:38 PM (y9ZJX)

361 So ... am I the only one that keeps a mental list of which posters will always defend the actions of the GOP ?

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (qVyOY)

Hmmmm.... tell me more.

Posted by: Guy Making a List of Posters Keeping Lists at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (jjaLl)
what's this, what's this ?

Posted by: Franz Liszt at February 16, 2017 12:38 PM (U2JkK)

362 Since February 17, 1963.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:33 PM (X6fMO)
=====================

When the Beatles first went on Ed Sullivan?
Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (bpfzP)

Did you just whip out that date from memory? I'm impressed.

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 12:38 PM (/9ppM)

363 346 I read somewhere (a comment section on fakebook I imagine) that the reason all our premiums are high is because of employer provided insurance policies, because they supposedly get a special rate paid for the government, so in essence people who get insurance from their employer are getting free shit from the government. Is this true?
Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (9U1OG)

====================

Money paid for insurance through an employer is tax free.

Money paid for insurance outside of an employer is not.

That could be what they were talking about.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:38 PM (vur0q)

364 Compare and contrast:

PDT is ready on Day 1 to begin fulfilling his campaign promises.

GOPe is still talking about how to manage expectations from 2014 campaign promises.

Posted by: tbodie at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (1YQBD)

365 Hey Dagny, Why do I have to pay for someone else's house? Isn't that their family's, neighbors,, churches' responsibility? (Not trying to pick a fight.)

Posted by: Les Kinetic at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (t6wDl)

366 Catastrophic Insurance does not reduce Actual ( meaning subsidy Free) premiums as much as many may think. The Insurance COmpanies are not really guarding against that $200 officer visit as much as they are guarding against those million dollar illnesses and treatments.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (KlI/a)

367 There's one part of the healthcare industry that's basically never covered by insurance, and thus always subject to market forces: elective/cosmetic surgery.

Isn't it strange those procedures have consistently gone down in price (as well as increasing in quality) over the last 15 or so years, while the cost of everything else shot up?

Weird, I know.

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (KUaJL)

368 363
Money paid for insurance through an employer is tax free.

Money paid for insurance outside of an employer is not.

That could be what they were talking about.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:38 PM (vur0q)

======================

I wrote that unclearly.

Money paid for insurance through an employer is tax exempt for income purposes.

Not for insurance outside of an employer.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (vur0q)

369 The day the Russians sent that dog, Spotnik, into space.

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:37 PM (TOk1P)
=======================

Oh. That was my second guess.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (bpfzP)

370 Thank you JamesMadison. I was wondering if they were full of shit.

Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (9U1OG)

371 347 327 There also is the possibility of heavy losses IF THEY DON'T repeal it.
Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (jxbfJ)

==================

Go to your congress critter's townhall and make that known.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (vur0q)
--------------------
Yeah, if you're dressed in body armor and carrying a sock-ful of quarters. That'll get you swarmed and beaten by a crowd of mostly peaceful protesters against All The Bigotry and Fascism.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (adsVM)

372 Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:28 PM (TOk1P)

-------------

Sorry, left out the repeal the ACA part. I'm just talking about ramping down the subsidies. Oh, and here's a crazy idea. How about the insurance companies offer different policies and consumers can chose the one that works for them.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at February 16, 2017 12:40 PM (kTF2Z)

373 >>Hmmmm.... tell me more. Posted by: Guy Making a List of Posters Keeping Lists at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (jjaLl)

I'm watching you watch him watch us.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 12:40 PM (Bdeb0)

374 Which, economically makes more sense than a system where 1/2 the country thinks it needs insurance to pay for $12 birth control pills.
Posted by: dagny at February 16, 2017 12:37 PM (nnAfn)

Which, ironically enough, are generally used to disrupt normal, healthy biological function.

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 12:40 PM (0mRoj)

375 367 There's one part of the healthcare industry that's basically never covered by insurance, and thus always subject to market forces: elective/cosmetic surgery.

Isn't it strange those procedures have consistently gone down in price (as well as increasing in quality) over the last 15 or so years, while the cost of everything else shot up?

Weird, I know.
Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (KUaJL)

====================

That experiment by a group of doctors who will do any medicine they have training for, but won't accept insurance, is driving down medical costs in the area, even at hospitals, who are finding a need to compete.

Weird, that...

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:41 PM (vur0q)

376 "Here's what I'd like to see happen. No insurance. Pay as you go. Directly to your doctor or hospital. Watch the prices drop dramatically. Maybe some type of super-catastrophic insurance. That's it. No paperwork, no middle man. "

That's crazy talk.

No self-disrespecting FSA drone would ever want to give up the heady feeling of getting his doctoring for free while screwing over The Rich.

Posted by: Jaws at February 16, 2017 12:41 PM (oOw3I)

377 Uh oh....Trump late for his news conference.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:41 PM (Enq6K)

378 I'm watching you watch him watch us.

Anybody got their eyes on Zod ?

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (qVyOY)

379 >>Yeah, if you're dressed in body armor and carrying a sock-ful of quarters. That'll get you swarmed and beaten by a crowd of mostly peaceful protesters against All The Bigotry and Fascism. Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (adsVM)

Or it'll get you crowned king of your local SCA kingdom by those nerds who are impressed with your homemade sock-mace.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (Bdeb0)

380 372, I think that is a good idea, why does the government have to mandate certain coverages to cater to the special snowflakes who don't want to go to CVS to get their rubbers. You should be able to buy a plan that suits your situation. Catastrophic plans should be the perfect plan for the younger crowd and I thought that they were allowed up until the age of 30. So 4 years after getting off Mommy and Daddy's plan at 26 you buy a catastrophic plan or get a god damned job that provides you health insurance like most everyone else in the country.

Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (9U1OG)

381 Trump still not on yet. It's been twenty minutes! And that was after an official 30-minute delay.

Why does it seem like Trump's not getting anything done today?

Posted by: Jim Geraghty at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (10LGw)

382 371 Yeah, if you're dressed in body armor and carrying a sock-ful of quarters. That'll get you swarmed and beaten by a crowd of mostly peaceful protesters against All The Bigotry and Fascism.
Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (adsVM)

=====================

I thought this was important. I thought the future of the country was on the line.

I'm going on Saturday to a townhall.

When are you?

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (vur0q)

383 Which, economically makes more sense than a system where 1/2 the country thinks it needs insurance to pay for $12 birth control pills.

Contraceptives are a recreational expense, not a medical expense.

I'll pay for your birth control pills if you pay for my race car parts.

Posted by: JEM at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (TppKb)

384 Uh oh....Trump late for his news conference.
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:41 PM (Enq6K)

yeah I'd like to see him correct that. If I remember President Bush was never late

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (KlI/a)

385 Not the Beatles, not in 1963, It was a year later...

On February 9th, 1964, The Beatles, with their Edwardian suits and mop top haircuts, made their first American television appearance

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 12:43 PM (/9ppM)

386 News conference may start soon.

The WH cameras went live.

No sign of the President yet.

Posted by: rd at February 16, 2017 12:43 PM (iT57s)

387 JEM - race car parts????????? Do tell.

Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 12:43 PM (9U1OG)

388 Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:28 PM (TOk1P)

-------------

Sorry, left out the repeal the ACA part. I'm just talking about ramping down the subsidies. Oh, and here's a crazy idea. How about the insurance companies offer different policies and consumers can chose the one that works for them.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at February 16, 2017 12:40 PM (kTF2Z)

I know there are people a LOT smarter than me who can work out the details on this.

If there's a plan that minimizes the damage done to the nincompoops who signed on (including sonofa milkman Governors) to the rainbows and unicorns version of what they thought this could be, then fine. I'm down with that.

But if there's a hard bounce for some?

So be it. I want it started. Now.

Posted by: BurtTC at February 16, 2017 12:43 PM (TOk1P)

389 Did you just whip out that date from memory? I'm impressed.

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 12:38 PM (/9ppM)
===========================

Actually, now that I think about it, I believe it was Feb 1964 that the Beatles first appeared on Ed Sullivan. Feb 1963 was when they cut their first album. I think. I'll have to look it up on my Pinterest Beatle page. Yes, I have a Beatle page. Why do you ask?

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:43 PM (bpfzP)

390 Which, economically makes more sense than a system where 1/2 the country thinks it needs insurance to pay for $12 birth control pills.

----Surprisingly, many of those same people will pay $10 or more a day for starbucks coffee.

Posted by: Wendel Willard at February 16, 2017 12:44 PM (DjoL4)

391 324 And that would be Single Payer High Deductible Insurance. No. Thanks.
Posted by: ScoggDog
.............
It is not. It is catastrophic insurance for all. A safety net. Only those who have a catastrophic illness would dip into that pool. No one loses their house over an illness.

You can either buy insurance on the free market to cover the gap, or not.. your choice.. buy cheap insurance.. cadillac.. or none.

The most important part, however, is that you can demand insurers take all comers with no deference to pre-existing conditions. And it would bring down premiums drastically.
Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 12:31 PM (so+

Eliminate the price fixing in the health industry, which is highly illegal by everybody participating, and there would be no need for catastrophic life insurance because prices would fall by over 90% so nobody would be losing their houses.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:44 PM (H8Bf9)

392 347
327 There also is the possibility of heavy losses IF THEY DON'T repeal it.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (jxbfJ)

==================

Go to your congress critter's townhall and make that known.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (vur0q)

My congress critter is Carol Shea Porter (D) who will never ever ever hold a townhall meeting.
Then we have Sen. Jeanne Shaheen (D) and Sen. Maggie Hassan (D)Jeanne Shaheen will hold an occasional townhall (1/term?). Hassan -who knows. Nothing yet.

NH went solid blue.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:44 PM (jxbfJ)

393 367 There's one part of the healthcare industry that's basically never covered by insurance, and thus always subject to market forces: elective/cosmetic surgery.

Isn't it strange those procedures have consistently gone down in price (as well as increasing in quality) over the last 15 or so years, while the cost of everything else shot up?

Weird, I know.
Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (KUaJL)

HEY WINGNUT, CORRELATION IS NOT CAUSATION YOU KNOW.

Posted by: Leftist Tryhard at February 16, 2017 12:44 PM (yL25O)

394 Not the Beatles, not in 1963, It was a year later...

On
February 9th, 1964, The Beatles, with their Edwardian suits and mop top
haircuts, made their first American television appearance

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 12:43 PM (/9ppM)
==============

Ah, see? Now I don't have to switch tabs. Thank you.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:44 PM (bpfzP)

395
If Republicans turned around and did the same thing, there's the possibility of heavy loses because of it. Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:14 PM (vur0q)

That's the problem with the GOP.They're always so paralyzed by the thought of losing they never take the inititive

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at February 16, 2017 12:44 PM (lKyWE)

396 >>>>And then there are people who have expensive pre-conditions. Obamacare said they'd get covered -- hard to go back on this.
.......

If you have a pre-existing condition, there is no such thing as insurance. Ex: Dear insurance company, I know I never paid you a dime, but just totalled my car and can't afford another one. How about you buy me a new car, cover every that might happen point forward, and I will start paying you $50 a month... until I have the keys to the new car, then will stop paying you.

>>> And then there are people who can't or won't pay for coverage they can't afford, who will bank on getting charity coverage.
.....

What about them? There always have been and always will be people who can't afford things they need or want. Insurance never was and never will be a solution to poverty.

You know what does reduce poverty? Government getting the fuck out of the way, not picking winners and losers, and not giving away other people's money.

It's simple: If a evil rich investor has an extra dollar, he invests in in something that produces $2. Several people generally get paid in the course of that change, and end up a few cents better off than they were.

If you give e government a dollar, the borrow $5 on it and pay $10 in interest on every dollar borrowed over 10 years, produce nothing, then give away $20 dollars to climate change research.

Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 12:44 PM (71OEY)

397 An extra $200 a month this year on the wife's good insurance. Just turn the free market loose and stop the shit.

I'd like Sherry McEvil to sound off. I remember her comments when this unconstitutional grab was being brewed.

Posted by: Dave at Buffalo Roam at February 16, 2017 12:45 PM (zJths)

398 I thought this was important. I thought the future of the country was on the line. I'm going on Saturday to a townhall. When are you?

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (vur0q)

No time, dude. Saturday is Range Day. This new scope and cheek riser on the M1A ain't gonna' zero themselves.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:45 PM (qVyOY)

399 There's one part of the healthcare industry that's basically never covered by insurance, and thus always subject to market forces: elective/cosmetic surgery.

Glasses are kind of the same. Visioncare is not universal, and usually pretty limited. So you get a wide variety of options.

Lasik is another example - not covered by insurance in most cases, so pricing kept going down.

Posted by: blaster at February 16, 2017 12:45 PM (tewYv)

400 392 My congress critter is Carol Shea Porter (D) who will never ever ever hold a townhall meeting.
Then we have Sen. Jeanne Shaheen (D) and Sen. Maggie Hassan (D)Jeanne Shaheen will hold an occasional townhall (1/term?). Hassan -who knows. Nothing yet.

NH went solid blue.
Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:44 PM (jxbfJ)

=====================

I thought NH was within the margin of fraud for electing Donald Trump?

Sounds like there's a desire in the state for some kind of change.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (vur0q)

401 213 Thing is, the GOP has had 6+ years to work on this - while they were in the minority. They knew their repeal legislation that they repeatedly proposed -in a lame attempt at throwing red meat to their constituents - was going nowhere. Which is fine. But while they were doing this grandstanding, why didn't they fashion a working group to fashion together a repeal/replacement?
Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:09 PM (jxbfJ)

-------------

You have to realize that everyone of these shitweasels thought the Hildebeast was going to be the next prez.....even up to around 9pm on election night.

Posted by: Soona at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (Fmupd)

402 382 371 Yeah, if you're dressed in body armor and carrying a sock-ful of quarters. That'll get you swarmed and beaten by a crowd of mostly peaceful protesters against All The Bigotry and Fascism.
Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (adsVM)

=====================

I thought this was important. I thought the future of the country was on the line.

I'm going on Saturday to a townhall.

When are you?
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (vur0q)
-------------------
I've got 5 young children to take care of, and I don't have health insurance to pay for getting beaten up by a hundred screaming Democrats.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (adsVM)

403
Meanwhile, Rasmussen has Trump approval at 55%. But he should resign in disgrace now!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (UBQ2A)

404 Yup better to do it right than fast

There is no right because Socialism + Math = Fail.
So they're just trying to maximize GOPe congressperson-years.

Posted by: DaveA at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (8J/Te)

405 Hey Widespread, Why do I have to pay for someone else's house? Isn't that
their family's, neighbors,, churches' responsibility? (Not trying to
pick a fight.)

Posted by: Les Kinetic at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (t6wDl)

406 But if there's a hard bounce for some?

So be it. I want it started. Now.

Posted by: BurtTC

===

Oh we don't do restraint or budgeting or saving or paying our debts anymore. In it's in the Constitution. Right there in the Entitlement Clause.

Did ya get the memo?

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (toH8T)

407 398 No time, dude. Saturday is Range Day. This new scope and cheek riser on the M1A ain't gonna' zero themselves.
Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:45 PM (qVyOY)

==================

Range Day IS important.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (vur0q)

408 The Beatles first went on the Sullivan show on February 9, 1964.

Laika the space dog was shot into the atmosphere on November 3, 1957.

I was born on February 17, 1963.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (X6fMO)

409 Ever get the feeling you're being played?

Yes, but why at this point? The main proponents of this were the healthcare lobby.

But if even they admit it's a shitshow, such as Aetna, what force is motivating the GOP to drag their feet? Is it the fear of the vicious media backlash? "Think of the CHILDREN!" They should know better by now.

Posted by: Steve and Cold Bear at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (uyrlv)

410 395 posts in, and not one person has suggested considering Scientology's "touch assist" technique as an adjunct to conventional health insurance. This place needs to seriously re-groove.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (Bdeb0)

411 Video is up on Trump press conference. No President yet.
https://youtu.be/uVVTb3nZssQ

Posted by: Western Slope Mope at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (WrMht)

412 Am I horrible for wanting to keep my employer paid insurance that covers everything with co-pays that are like $25 and prescription drugs that are cheap? Can we keep that please?

Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (9U1OG)

413 Was it over when the mother fucking Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

??

Posted by: Yo! at February 16, 2017 12:48 PM (j9LD5)

414 402 I've got 5 young children to take care of, and I don't have health insurance to pay for getting beaten up by a hundred screaming Democrats.
Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (adsVM)

-------------------------

226 When the Ocare clusterfark originally passed, I said that Repubs would want to keep it around FOREVER in order to run against it every 2 years.

"Elect me to ________, and I will fight to repeal/replace/fix this monstrosity!"

As long as ObamaCare exists, Repubs can use it as an electoral whipping post, which is why they've been making noises about waiting till after the next election.
It'll ALWAYS be "after the next election".
Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (adsVM)

===================

How will Republicans know if you don't tell them?

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:48 PM (vur0q)

415 The numerous Obamacare repeals had no practical effect other than to keep people focused on the end game. There was zero negative repercussions other than making some of you think this was going to be an overnight process.

Bull shit.

BTW if I hated something I wouldn't constantly post that it was actually a positive. Which you did all the time with your "The House voted over 40 times to repeal Obamacare!" But now suddenly you hate that they did it.

Posted by: buzzion at February 16, 2017 12:48 PM (z/Ubi)

416 408 The Beatles first went on the Sullivan show on February 9, 1964.

Laika the space dog was shot into the atmosphere on November 3, 1957.

I was born on February 17, 1963.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (X6fMO)

Born in '60. I don't remember the first Sullivan appearance but I have a vague memory of the second one. '65?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:48 PM (UBQ2A)

417 I was born on February 17, 1963.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (X6fMO)
=====================

Happy tomorrow's Birthday !! Go buy yourself flowers. I always do. Perks me right up.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:48 PM (bpfzP)

418 yeah I'd like to see him correct that. If I remember President Bush was never late

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:42 PM (KlI/a)

I'm actually surprised he's late. If it's someone else making him late....hooboy.
Ok, Pence just came in to the news conference.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (Enq6K)

419 95 posts in, and not one person has suggested considering Scientology's "touch assist" technique as an adjunct to conventional health insurance. This place needs to seriously re-groove.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (Bdeb0)

Does this involve Kate Upton in the touch assisting? I could warm to that.

Posted by: blaster at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (tewYv)

420 Oh, and I live in one of the most heavily gerrymandered blue districts in the entire country.

I'd be wasting my damn breath, right up until the Tolerant Left sent me to the hospital.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (adsVM)

421 /316 Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 12:26 PM (y9ZJX)

You have to repeal it, because ITS A LAW...

And it was written with a non severability clause... ie you are not supposed to be able to just repeal a piece of it...

Or is it your position that Trump can do it through Executive Actions... ie NOT enforce a law because he doesn't like it??? Which is EXACTLY what we complained about Obama doing?

Posted by: Don Q. at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (qf6WZ)
------

No law trumps economics. Why not pass a law that everyone must be wealthy by year-end? Trump can undo Obama's EOs. And Price has the same discretion that Sebelius had as HHS.

The IRS, just yesterday, completely consistent with the ACA law said they would no longer reject 1040s that did not have line 61 completed. Line 61 certifies you have health insurance and the ACA does not tell the IRS not to process returns if that information is left out. If you don't have health insurance, and you leave Line 61 blank, the IRS will process your return and won't levy the penalty which further undermines the economics of ACA. And again, entirely within the law. Bad economics will will-out over the good intentions of a fucking law. Always.

This is not hard. Simply expose and accelerate the bad economics of the ACA and it will collapse with no repeal.

Posted by: scofflaw_x at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (y9ZJX)

422 371
347 327 There also is the possibility of heavy losses IF THEY DON'T repeal it.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:32 PM (jxbfJ)

==================

Go to your congress critter's townhall and make that known.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:35 PM (vur0q)

--------------------

Yeah, if you're dressed in body armor and carrying a sock-ful of
quarters. That'll get you swarmed and beaten by a crowd of mostly
peaceful protesters against All The Bigotry and Fascism.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:39 PM (adsVM)

When (if) my critters ever hold a townhall meeting, I will be there. Since they are all Dems, it'll be invite only to keep a friendly crowd.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (jxbfJ)

423 And here. We. Go.

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (/9ppM)

424 I'm having trouble understanding why "stabilizing health care markets" is a priority. They should be ground into dust and fail fail fail if they signed on for this business and got the sucker end of the deal.

All the sapsucking electronic records and information grubbing companies (see Inovalon) should perish. Insurers should be state controlled, and states should revamp their rescission laws to make reasonable pre-existing condition exclusions (a standard two year period) that do not operate against occult illness with vague onset and prevent rescission when an unreported problem is irrelevant to present illness prompting review - policies should otherwise be shall issue.

Private families and individuals should be able to join groups unrelated to employment and have every tax advantage that currently exists for employer provided coverage that employers get or employees benefit from.

So everyone should have an HSA that shields income from taxation, and catastrophic policy that kicks in for serious illness or injury.

The government should not be able to put its thumb on the scale regarding negotiated pricing - they should have to negotiate fees that cannot affect pricing offered to others. Right now that process is a shell game. It's transparency and self-pay that will bend the cost curve down.

Posted by: SarahW at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (Sp1NT)

425 Trump's on - announces Acosta as expected.

Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (10LGw)

426 Crap I have a meeting to go to in 5 minutes.

I will have to find out what Trump said later.

Posted by: blaster at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (tewYv)

427 418
I'm actually surprised he's late. If it's someone else making him late....hooboy.
Ok, Pence just came in to the news conference.
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (Enq6K)

It takes time to sign all those arrest warrants at CIA/NSA/DoD.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (UBQ2A)

428 >>BTW if I hated something I wouldn't constantly post that it was actually a positive. Which you did all the time with your "The House voted over 40 times to repeal Obamacare!" But now suddenly you hate that they did it.

I hate them some people, like you apparently, actually thought it was anything more than politics and keeping the base focused. Because that's all it was.

Shocking, I know, politicians practicing politics.

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (/tuJf)

429
As long as ObamaCare exists, Repubs can use it as an electoral whipping post, which is why they've been making noises about waiting till after the next election.
It'll ALWAYS be "after the next election".
Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:12 PM (adsVM)

===================

How will Republicans know if you don't tell them?
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:48 PM (vur0q)
---------------
I wouldn't be speaking a Repub at my district's town hall.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (adsVM)

430 to a*

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (adsVM)

431 Go buy yourself flowers. I always do. Perks me right up.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:48 PM (bpfzP)

**smiles**

I actually don't like flowers. And I'm trying to stop drinking, so that's out as well. I just bought a (fairly) new book, The Story of Egypt by Joann Fletcher, so that's my gift to myself.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (X6fMO)

432 Born in '60. I don't remember the first Sullivan appearance but I have a vague memory of the second one. '65?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:48 PM (UBQ2A)
========================

Ya they did one in '65 too. Scandalous. Long hair. Suits. Ties. Bowed at the end. It was like the end of civilization as we know it.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (bpfzP)

433 Am I horrible for wanting to keep my employer paid insurance that covers everything with co-pays that are like $25 and prescription drugs that are cheap? Can we keep that please?
Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 12:47 PM (9U1OG)

If you allowed cross State line Groups and other Groups and Asociations to offer Insurance Plans and to negotiate with for the best plans and have tort reform and also throw in some other goodies and everyone could have at least a "decent" plan

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (KlI/a)

434
It takes time to sign all those arrest warrants at CIA/NSA/DoD.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (UBQ2A)

Haha! I was actually thinking that's what was keeping him.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (Enq6K)

435 Please forgive me if this has already been said, but Rush mentioned the other day that the GOPe expected Hillary Clinton to win the election, hence not having a plan ready to go. I know, I know...still no excuse for the ball less wonders to not have a plan.

Posted by: I Be That Chick on her iPhone at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (S/qwI)

436 A lefty relative had sent me "reassuring" emails that OCare was created to "help people like" me and that I shouldn't believe anyone who said my premiums would go up.

I often wonder if she really believed those ridiculous statements, or she thinks believing something makes it so, or if she thinks I am really stupid.

Posted by: Emmie at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (xVuS6)

437 Range Day IS important.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (vur0q)

Range Days are the best days.

I have thought about going to one of the local Tea Party meetings. I've talked to a few of them. They seem OK.

I also know that ... if I go to something and protesters show up screaming in my face ... I'm going to jail.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (qVyOY)

438 PDT speaking now. Announced Sec of Labor.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (8iiMU)

439 I was born on February 17, 1963.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing

Oh, Happy Almost-Birthday, MP^4!

Posted by: Bandersnatch, gentleman cad at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (mgbwf)

440 420 Oh, and I live in one of the most heavily gerrymandered blue districts in the entire country.

I'd be wasting my damn breath, right up until the Tolerant Left sent me to the hospital.
Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:49 PM (adsVM)

=====================

Then might I suggest focusing your efforts at the state level. Knock out centrist Dems, replace them with centrist Republicans. Knock out centrist Republicans and replace them with conservative Republicans.

Volunteering for upstart local races would be a great education on civics for you kids, at least. They don't generally generate the same level of obvious vitriol that we're seeing now at the federal level. If you help target some backbencher that doesn't do anything with a prominent local leader who wants to replace him, it could be fun.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:52 PM (vur0q)

441 I just bought a (fairly) new book, The Story of Egypt by Joann Fletcher, so that's my gift to myself.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (X6fMO)
=========================

That sounds like a good start. In lieu of flowers, you could buy us all a round.

Posted by: grammie winger at February 16, 2017 12:52 PM (bpfzP)

442 Main Street patriot rallies in support of Donald Trump and his policies-Saturday, March 4th.

http://tinyurl.com/jyatfuf

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at February 16, 2017 12:52 PM (fDdVG)

443 >>>>>Ever get the feeling you're being played?
.
.
.
.That's how we got Trump.

Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 12:52 PM (le7jz)

444 >>everyone could have at least a "decent" plan
Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:51 PM (KlI/a)

Zod prefers the frisson of superiority that comes with knowing that his plan is slightly better than the plan of his neighbor.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 12:52 PM (Bdeb0)

445 Ha! Now Trump is cramming the 55% approval rating and the DJIA down the media's throats.

Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 12:53 PM (10LGw)

446 PDT talked about a "NeverTrumper" becoming a 'strong ally'.

And he slammed Congress for approving his OMB Director "weeks, weeks late".

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:53 PM (8iiMU)

447 429 I wouldn't be speaking a Repub at my district's town hall.
Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (adsVM)

===================

Then who can you talk to? What kind of general election opponent is your Congress-critter going to be facing next cycle?

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:53 PM (vur0q)

448 In defense of my lefty relative, she did help us pay our insurance premiums after they hit the stratosphere up until we just gave up and dropped our insurance. But I wonder if she ever reflected that the reality didn't match what she told us to believe.

Posted by: Emmie at February 16, 2017 12:53 PM (xVuS6)

449 Trump up. Took a swipe at press.

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 12:53 PM (hdpay)

450 trump has just declared war on the media.

Posted by: chavez the hugo at February 16, 2017 12:53 PM (KP5rU)

451 Going after the media right off the bat!!

Atta boy!!

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (Jcg9Q)

452 I hate them some people, like you apparently, actually thought it was anything more than politics and keeping the base focused. Because that's all it was.

Shocking, I know, politicians practicing politics.
Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (/tuJf)

Oh like the base is focused on abortion. So that the politicians can just keep using that as a political tool to get re-elected but never actually do anything about.

Posted by: buzzion at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (z/Ubi)

453 Trump: "Honestly, the press is outta control..."

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (Enq6K)

454 Trump has to find out who all the poison pills and nevertrumpers there are in intelligence and the FBI before he does anything else, or they will simply selectively leak every conversation he has with congress, including the Chinese food bill. All of which will be painted as a Hitler takeover.

They will have to go back to handwritten letters, coded just to talk to congress, and that is assuming congress does not simply selectively leak it themselves.

Posted by: William Eaton at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (MuTTO)

455 Zod prefers the frisson of superiority that comes with knowing that his plan is slightly better than the plan of his neighbor.
Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 12:52 PM (Bdeb0)

Well deep down we all do. LOL

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (KlI/a)

456 Oh my god - now he's just straightforwardly clobbering the media... keeps going on and on. "We have to talk about this. The press is honestly out of control."

Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (10LGw)

457 PDT: "The press has become *so* dishonest...The level of dishonesty is out of control."

"entrenched power structure"

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (8iiMU)

458 My bag of dicks is half full.

Posted by: Bill Wynn at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (Sz/dS)

459 400
Sounds like there's a desire in the state for some kind of change.

Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (vur0q)

The issue in NH voting is around same-day registration. College students, even though they are not technically residents of NH, can vote here. Political wonks who come in to NH to run a candidate's office for a couple weeks can claim their office as their residence and vote here. Been documented.
Desire for change? With the influx of Mass. residents we are changing - to all blue.

I'm behind enemy lines now.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (jxbfJ)

460 TRUMP SPANKING MEDIA RIGHT TO THEIR FACES

Posted by: @votermom @vm at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (Om16U)

461 Trump is schlonging the MSM.

Posted by: Ripley at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (1BQGO)

462 Update. Trump taking press to the woodshed.

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (hdpay)

463 Rep. Mick Mulvaney confirmed by Senate to be OMB director, 51-49

Posted by: EVLINC! at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (y3aQB)

464 "Media Schooled by President"

Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (10LGw)

465 317 Repeal and replace all the DC baby boomers.....

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:30 PM (H8Bf9)
---------------------------
Yeah!!!! Impeach Trump!!!!!!

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (Nox3c)

466 "Taking the message straight to the people"

"I INHERITED A MESS. A MESS. AT HOME AND ABROAD, A MESS."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (8iiMU)

467 Trump: "To be honest....I inherited a mess. Here and abroad...A mess!"

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (Enq6K)

468 444. Zod Johnson is right!

The joy of a yurt is incomplete without the certain knowledge that it is better than the neighbors'.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine. Glory to Kekistan! No Longer Accepting Harem Applicants at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (jNzM7)

469 Can't wait to see who DJT calls on for questions.

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (/9ppM)

470 Posted by: Bill Wynn at February 16, 2017 12:54 PM (Sz/dS)

Well you would definitely know about SUCKING !

Posted by: EVLINC! at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (y3aQB)

471 Wow. This is refreshing. Actual straight fucking talk.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:56 PM (8iiMU)

472 SUCK IT BARRY. SUCK IT DEEP

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 12:56 PM (toH8T)

473 Trump: "To be honest....I inherited a mess. Here and abroad...A mess!"

unsaid but heard "...left by Obama"

Posted by: Ripley at February 16, 2017 12:56 PM (1BQGO)

474 GOPe loves Obamacare. I'm thinking Trump is letting them stew and will pop their cherry (grab their pussy?) at the appropriate time. Oligarchs have latched onto medical care and medical Insurance as a tool to extract money and power from middle America. Another reason Trump was elected. Large parts of the medical profession could be automated. Major effort of the FDA is to replace effective drugs with less effective drugs that cost more.

Posted by: Ok at February 16, 2017 12:56 PM (K2SnJ)

475 The other nugget of wisdom on Obamacare from Lamar Alexander was to the effect that "we can do it rapidly, but not a quick fix".

That's up there with the various famous Quayleisms. "Gentlemen, if we do not succeed, we run the risk of failure."

Posted by: torquewrench at February 16, 2017 12:56 PM (noWW6)

476
Trump is 100% wrong about the press.

They haven't BECOME so dishonest. They've always been so dishonest.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (UBQ2A)

477 "ISIS has spread like cancer. Another mess I inherited."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (8iiMU)

478 "ISIS has spread like cancer. Another mess I inherited."

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (Enq6K)

479 *preconfettis MP4*

I'll mention again that I want the GOP to have the Presidency, the House and 60 votes in the Senate after the 2018 midterms in no small part to hear what the excuses will be then.

Posted by: alexthechick - all your caps are belong to me at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (mf5HN)

480 Rep. Mick Mulvaney confirmed by Senate to be OMB director, 51-49
Posted by: EVLINC! at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (y3aQB)

So I guess Senator McFuckstick of AZ defected.

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (/9ppM)

481 I'm glad Trump is maintaining focus on media lies. Now I hope the saboteurs can be outed.

Posted by: Emmie at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (xVuS6)

482 this is what i voted for. suck it commies.

Posted by: chavez the hugo at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (KP5rU)

483 "The press is honestly out of control...I'm here to take my message straight to the people."

Yes, he is giving them a b*tch slapping.

Posted by: Western Slope Mope at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (WrMht)

484 PDT: "It's one of the worst agreements I've seen planned by anybody."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (8iiMU)

485 I thought he might go full Cobretti there. "ISIS is a cancer and I'm the cure."

Posted by: Bilwis, Devourer of Gluten Free Souls at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (a3sfz)

486 475 The other nugget of wisdom on Obamacare from Lamar Alexander was to the effect that "we can do it rapidly, but not a quick fix".

That's up there with the various famous Quayleisms. "Gentlemen, if we do not succeed, we run the risk of failure."
Posted by: torquewrench at February 16, 2017 12:56 PM (noWW6)

Another old coot who exists to take graft and screw the citizenry. Tennessee, I'm in New York, but you can do better than that asshole.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (UBQ2A)

487 "Our country will never have had a military like the military we're going to build."

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (Enq6K)

488 PDT praising the military and lamenting their equipment.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (8iiMU)

489 "Iran took advantage of the previous administration.... It's one of the worst agreements ever."

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (KUaJL)

490 Re: People losing their house because of illness.

Too bad.

People lose their houses for lots of things: job loss, etc. Hell, I am losing my home and I'm selling everything I own to turn it into cash. Why? Because I haven't been able to find any work and buying food is more important than paying rent or having a bed to sleep in. Bad shit happens and you make choices to do what's necessary to try to get through it. It sucks. That's life.

Someone gets sick and has to sell their house to pay for it? Before we get to, "OMG, someone must do something!" we need to get through, "Thank goodness they had the asset to sell to pay for a chance to live a little longer!". Then we get to "so, they put all their money into a house rather than savings, insurance, etc. to prepare for a rainy day... well, time to cash out on that choice".

At no point does bad stuff happen to anyone and the answer is, "well, if only there were a government program...". If it weren't for government programs, I would be employed, losing nothing, and have a substantial amount of money saved and invested into things that produce value. Instead, I have nothing but th peace of mind knowing that I have worked for decades to pay for someone else's snot nosed brat's K- PhD in Wimmez Studies education and who is now actively trying to destroy me on false allegations of privilege and racism.

Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (71OEY)

491 405 Hey Widespread, Why do I have to pay for someone else's house? Isn't that
their family's, neighbors,, churches' responsibility? (Not trying to
pick a fight.)
Posted by: Les Kinetic at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (t6wDl

You shouldn't. I completely agree with you.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (H8Bf9)

492 Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (/9ppM)

YEP ! Shitstain said because he was part of Conservatives in the house who wanted less money for Military? HUH?

Posted by: EVLINC! at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (y3aQB)

493 477 "ISIS has spread like cancer. Another mess I inherited."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (8iiMU)

478 "ISIS has spread like cancer. Another mess I inherited."
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (Enq6K)

Amy Schumer said the same thing.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (UBQ2A)

494 PDT: "Monumental task of returning the government to the people."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (8iiMU)

495 I'll mention again that I want the GOP to have the Presidency, the House and 60 votes in the Senate after the 2018 midterms in no small part to hear what the excuses will be then.
Posted by: alexthechick - all your caps are belong to me at February 16, 2017 12:57 PM (mf5HN)

I'd take some more of that stick-play from yesterday, if you wouldn't mind.

I dunno' ... I just kinda' liked it. Is that wrong ?

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (qVyOY)

496 458. Sigh....

Bill - do you have no other joy in this life than LARP'ing the role of DeCaprio with the Horde playing the bear?

I mean, you seem obsessive - you've got nothing for art or movie or sports or food or booze talk?

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine. Glory to Kekistan! No Longer Accepting Harem Applicants at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (jNzM7)

497 We are searching for peace. But it's peace through strength.

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (KUaJL)

498 ...Trump: "To be honest....I inherited a mess. Here and abroad...A mess!"...

I think Trump inherited a free fire zone. So many fat and juicy targets. His favorables are 55% and climbing. He will top out at about 75% if they keep attacking him.

Posted by: Ok at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (K2SnJ)

499 "I'm here doing what I pledged to do."

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (Enq6K)

500 494 PDT: "Monumental task of returning the government to the people."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (8iiMU)

Let the indictments run down like a righteous flood.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:00 PM (UBQ2A)

501 DJT (paraphrased) - everybody's so surprised that I'm doing the stuff I campaigned on. Of course, that's because most politicians do nothing but lie.

Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 01:00 PM (10LGw)

502 Oh like the base is focused on abortion. So that the politicians can just keep using that as a political tool to get re-elected but never actually do anything about.

I guess you missed the part where Ryan has pledged to defund PP as part of the Obamacare repeal.

http://tinyurl.com/z3fpcux

Yea, that's part of the plan. And it makes it more complicated because not all of the base wants it as opposed to all of the base that wants an Obamacare repeal.

But keep insisting that they can do all of this overnight.

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 01:00 PM (/tuJf)

503 "All I'm doing is keeping my promises I made."

Now he is bragging about the electoral vote. LOL!
Rub their noses in it, PDT!!

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:00 PM (8iiMU)

504 I hope PT handles the questions well. They're gonna try and hammer him.

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 01:00 PM (Jcg9Q)

505 500
494 PDT: "Monumental task of returning the government to the people."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 12:59 PM (8iiMU)

Let the indictments run down like a righteous flood.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:00 PM (UBQ2A)

From your keyboard to God's ear. Amen.

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 01:00 PM (jxbfJ)

506 Hahahaha going after the media again.

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (Jcg9Q)

507
Bill - do you have no other joy in this life than LARP'ing the role of DeCaprio with the Horde playing the bear?

===

Lightning Bolt! Lightning Bolt!

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (toH8T)

508
Then might I suggest focusing your efforts at the state level. Knock out centrist Dems, replace them with centrist Republicans. Knock out centrist Republicans and replace them with conservative Republicans.

Volunteering for upstart local races would be a great education on civics for you kids, at least. They don't generally generate the same level of obvious vitriol that we're seeing now at the federal level. If you help target some backbencher that doesn't do anything with a prominent local leader who wants to replace him, it could be fun.
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:52 PM (vur0q)
-----------------------
Oh, I've thought about it. A friend of mine is heavily involved in that sort of thing: the establishment GOP has a stranglehold on my state. I keep voting for real conservatives, and they keep getting stomped by milksops.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (adsVM)

509 "I turn on the Tv or open the newspapers I see stories of chaos...chaos. It's quite the opposite. It's running like a well oiled machine....even though I can't get all my appointees confirmed."

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (Enq6K)

510 "I see stories of chaos, chaos! Yet is it the exact opposite. It is running like a well-oiled machine. In spite of my Cabinet not getting approved."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (8iiMU)

511 490 Re: People losing their house because of illness.

Too bad.

People lose their houses for lots of things: job loss, etc. Hell, I am losing my home and I'm selling everything I own to turn it into cash. Why? Because I haven't been able to find any work and buying food is more important than paying rent or having a bed to sleep in. Bad shit happens and you make choices to do what's necessary to try to get through it. It sucks. That's life.

Someone gets sick and has to sell their house to pay for it? Before we get to, "OMG, someone must do something!" we need to get through, "Thank goodness they had the asset to sell to pay for a chance to live a little longer!". Then we get to "so, they put all their money into a house rather than savings, insurance, etc. to prepare for a rainy day... well, time to cash out on that choice".

At no point does bad stuff happen to anyone and the answer is, "well, if only there were a government program...". If it weren't for government programs, I would be employed, losing nothing, and have a substantial amount of money saved and invested into things that produce value. Instead, I have nothing but th peace of mind knowing that I have worked for decades to pay for someone else's snot nosed brat's K- PhD in Wimmez Studies education and who is now actively trying to destroy me on false allegations of privilege and racism.
Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (71OEY)

Get rid of price fixing in the health care industry by enforcing the laws. Prices will drop by over 90%. People will not lose their homes and be destroyed for life.

90grand for open heart surgery in the USA. 1,800 in cash in India for the exact same precedure with the exact same quality.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (H8Bf9)

512 PDT: "The only thing they can do is delay, because they screwed things up royally."

LMFAO!!

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (8iiMU)

513 Bill - do you have no other joy in this life than LARP'ing the role of DeCaprio with the Horde playing the bear?

===

Lightning Bolt! Lightning Bolt!
Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (toH8T)

Wisdom is Bill's dump stat.
Wisdom and intelligence.
And charisma.
And probably strength, constitution and dexterity.

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (KUaJL)

514 Now schlonging the Dems and their policies.

Posted by: Ripley at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (1BQGO)

515 "We need jobs."

Trump ran his entire campaign around jerbs, and the establishment Republicans in Clowngress constantly pay lip service to jerbs, and the ordinary working-class voting public GODDAMNED WELL WANT SOME DECENT NEW JERBS RIGHT NOW THANKYOUVERYMUCH.

You know what would be a big jerb creator?

Maybe, possibly, there's the remote ghost of a statistical chance that repealing the biggest single piece of jerb-destroying legislation in the last quarter century could pull that off.

Nah. Too complicated. Let's talk Russia some more!

Posted by: torquewrench at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (noWW6)

516 Happy early birthday MP4!

Posted by: Insomniac at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (0mRoj)

517 Bill Wynn isn't here for the hunting.

Posted by: The Bear in the Joke at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (RD7QR)

518 "The Democrats can only delay, because they've screwed things up royally."

I love this guy.

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (Jcg9Q)

519 Tami, we are sharing the same mind.

Scary, isn't it?

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (8iiMU)

520
Mary Poppins:

Enjoy a wonderful day, my friend. Treat yourself to something nice.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (UBQ2A)

521 Crush, Drive, Hear.

Posted by: Conan at February 16, 2017 01:03 PM (XoldI)

522 467 Trump: "To be honest....I inherited a mess. Here and abroad...A mess!"
Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 12:55 PM (Enq6K)

Media will shout "Trump blames Obama!"

Ignoring that Obama was blaming Bush for everything for his entire time in office.

Posted by: buzzion at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (z/Ubi)

523 So the Golden scalp weasel is taking them to the woodshed....

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (O2RFr)

524 PDT: Speaking of eliminating regulations that are redundant.

And listing things they have done so far.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (8iiMU)

525 He's knocking it out of the park.

Posted by: Strelnikov at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (fi5nC)

526 I wish he'd stop talking about the electoral college win he had. It's childish.

Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (9U1OG)

527 I want car insurance that pays for oil changes.Oh, and gas fill ups too. Windshield washer fluid would be nice.

I'll settle for a hummer. Eye contact is optional.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (qVyOY)

528 Maybe, possibly, there's the remote ghost of a statistical chance that
repealing the biggest single piece of jerb-destroying legislation in the
last quarter century could pull that off.

===

Exactly.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (toH8T)

529 Wish I could listen, but hubby just called and he was screaming and jumping around with glee so he must be doing good!

Posted by: deplorable Jewells45 at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (zRZaJ)

530 526 I wish he'd stop talking about the electoral college win he had. It's childish.
Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (9U1OG)

Relax. Enjoy.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (UBQ2A)

531 517. Heh....somebody gets it.

It's sad, though. Yeah, it's easy to get overly enthused about political stuff, but it's not all there is, except in totalitarian regimes.

Be a full human being, Bill - right now, you're a caricature of yourself.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine. Glory to Kekistan! No Longer Accepting Harem Applicants at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (jNzM7)

532 "The press is honestly out of control...I'm here to take my message straight to the people."

Somewhere, I hope D-Lamp is smiling.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (X6fMO)

533 PDT: "An end to the policy of catch and release."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (8iiMU)

534 "Let me rundown all that we've accomplished...."

Now he's listing them...

TPP
Elimination of regulations
Hiring freeze on non essential on federal workers
Moratorium on regulations
Stood up for LE
Creation of a task force for reducing violent crime
Order DOH and DOJ to deport foreign drug cartels
Border security measures...in process of building wall. "It will be a great wall...negotiated by me."
Order crack down on sanctuary cities and no more catch and release

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (Enq6K)

535 "Drugs are becoming cheaper than candy bars"

Politifact rates this: mostly false

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 01:05 PM (KUaJL)

536 Trump: "We're going to build the wall and its going to be a great wall"

Luv it.

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (hdpay)

537 Trump has moved up another 2 points in the Rasmussen poll, best poll out there for assessing momentum. He's at plus 2%. Obama spent most of his eight years at negative 20% or below.

Posted by: Ignoramus at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (SIY7D)

538 Get rid of price fixing in the health care industry by enforcing the laws. Prices will drop by over 90%. People will not lose their homes and be destroyed for life.

So here's the thing: should an anesthesiologist expect an income that can pay for three homes and a gaggle of Ferraris?

That's the question we have to ask when it comes to healthcare costs.

If you want healthcare costs to come down to the point that Joe Sixpack can afford to pay his bills in cash, you've got to bring the overhead down. That means cheaper medical school, cheaper insurance, price transparency, and making it clear to the gas-passers and other fairly routine specialties that they're not gonna get corporate CEO paychecks.

Posted by: JEM at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (TppKb)

539 Press Conference Schedule:

12:51 - Announce Acosta nomination
12:52 - Unscheduled twenty-five-minute schlonging
13:18 - Takes questions from Breitbart and Townhall

Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (10LGw)

540
He's rocking and rolling.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (UBQ2A)

541 519
Tami, we are sharing the same mind.

Scary, isn't it?

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:02 PM (8iiMU)

For you....yes.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (Enq6K)

542 "We are done with 'catch-and-release."

Border violators will be unhooked, gutted, boned, pan-fried, and eaten. With butter and almonds.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (Bdeb0)

543 I think I am going to send Pres. Trump another letter saying how much I liked this pressed! Now if only he would announce that he is releasing the papers about the Iran deal.

Posted by: Chilling the most at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (Cl52v)

544 526 I wish he'd stop talking about the electoral college win he had. It's childish.

So is toilet humor ... but damned if I don't laugh every time. What can I say ? I am what I am.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (qVyOY)

545 539 Press Conference Schedule:

12:51 - Announce Acosta nomination
12:52 - Unscheduled twenty-five-minute schlonging
13:18 - Takes questions from Breitbart and Townhall
Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (10LGw)

13:19 Gives Sefton the Congressional Medal of Schlonging. And Press Credentials.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (UBQ2A)

546
A GREAT Wall!!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (UBQ2A)

547 PDT slams the 9th Circus: "That Circuit is in chaos, and is frankly in turmoil."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (8iiMU)

548 We will keep the American people safe.

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (hdpay)

549 "INCLUDING REPORTERS"

bwahahahahahahahaha

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (toH8T)

550 But keep insisting that they can do all of this overnight.
Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 01:00 PM (/tuJf)

Where have I claimed any such thing? Go on tell me. I don't expect an overnight solution unlike your little fantasy version of me. But I also have no faith in the GOP.

Posted by: buzzion at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (z/Ubi)

551
Re-LEASSSSE!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:08 PM (UBQ2A)

552 Damn! This is really good. Very different style - sounds like a CEO reporting, albeit informally, to the board.

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine. Glory to Kekistan! No Longer Accepting Harem Applicants at February 16, 2017 01:08 PM (jNzM7)

553 Gutted, boned border violators will be eaten. Candy bars for dessert, because they're more expensive (read: classy) than drugs.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 01:08 PM (Bdeb0)

554 Just compare Trumps straightforward, tell it like it is, we can do this to whiny bitch voice of somebody like, say, Schumer. Or half the Republican leadership for that matter.

Damn, been waiting for this from a president for years.

Posted by: Ripley at February 16, 2017 01:08 PM (1BQGO)

555
For you....yes.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (Enq6K)

Oh, I beg to differ.

For both of us.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:08 PM (8iiMU)

556 Trump: New immigration EO next week but will still pursue original EO in the courts.

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 01:08 PM (hdpay)

557 90grand for open heart surgery in the USA. 1,800 in cash in India for the exact same precedure with the exact same quality.
Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (H8Bf9)

----------------

About $3500 in Thailand and their bigger hospitals are cleaner and state-of-the-art. Plus, for a few dollars more, they'll put you up in a nice hotel until they're sure you can fly home.

Posted by: Soona at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (Fmupd)

558 Where is everyone watching the Teh Enschlonening?

Posted by: Lady in Black - LONG LIVE THE SCALP WEASEL at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (+FSld)

559 491 405 Hey Widespread, Why do I have to pay for someone else's house? Isn't that
their family's, neighbors,, churches' responsibility? (Not trying to
pick a fight.)
Posted by: Les Kinetic at February 16, 2017 12:46 PM (t6wDl

You shouldn't. I completely agree with you.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (H8Bf9

I'll elaberate. Enforce the laws by eliminating price fixing in the health industry. 90% drop in prices or more would occur.Enforce the laws by deporting all illegals, another huge tax on the system and people. And move to a gold backed currency again to put the breaks on inflation in the long run (7%-9% a year is killing people in the 99.9% brackets).

Will there be immediate pain and sacrifice? Yes. Will our country heal? Yes of course. But if we don't do those three things we are fucked in the next decade.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (H8Bf9)

560 I wish he'd stop talking about the electoral college win he had. It's childish.
Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (9U1OG)

**********

They need to be hit with that. That's part of how they are trying to delegitimize him.

In fact--I wish Sean Spicer--when they talk about winning the popular vote would mention that--

California had TWO DEMOCRAT Senators on the general election ballot. You could not even write in a Republican.

So--there was no statewide Republican running for office in California during a very important Presidential election and therefore no statewide ad being run by a California Republican.

Posted by: Strelnikov at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (fi5nC)

561 PDT slams the 9th Circus: "That Circuit is in chaos, and is frankly in turmoil."

"He hit Buddy. Get him, girls!"

- The Legacy Media

Posted by: JEM at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (TppKb)

562 >>Where have I claimed any such thing? Go on tell me. I don't expect an overnight solution unlike your little fantasy version of me. But I also have no faith in the GOP.

So you're just bitching at me when you really have no idea what has been going on.

Ok.

Oh look, Trump is talking about repealing and replacing Obamacare. Think he's doing that by himself?

Posted by: JackStraw at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (/tuJf)

563 I'm watching on Fox Business.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (8iiMU)

564 PDT slams the 9th Circus: "That Circuit is in chaos, and is frankly in turmoil."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:07 PM (8iiMU)

That's been true for years and has nothing to do with this ruling or even the massive 80% (dear God) overturn rate before SCOTUS.

The Ninth is way too big. It needs chopped up into at least two, if not three, circuits.

Posted by: alexthechick - all your caps are belong to me at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (mf5HN)

565 Ho Li Phuc!

American steel for American pipelines!

Posted by: Your Decidedly Devious Uncle Palpatine. Glory to Kekistan! No Longer Accepting Harem Applicants at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (jNzM7)

566 Preparing to repeal and replace obamacare

He said BIGLY but I missed on what...

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (Enq6K)

567 BIGLY!!!;

Omg I love Trump in Daddy mode.

Posted by: @votermom @vm at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (Om16U)

568 http://tinyurl.com/zw93q5q

Live stream

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (toH8T)

569 Did he just say bigly? lol

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (Jcg9Q)

570 The Obamacare fix is simple. EO that the US to be an Obamacare-free sanctuary zone. Then add an EO that the Federal government will not enforce any rules prohibiting healthcare plans being sold across state lines...

Then let the market sort things out while Congress has a tizzy and can't agree on doing anything... Toss in a request to all all health care coverage and expenses for essential care and financing to pay for such care to be tax deductible...

Of all the 'fixes' that could perhaps go the furthest to fixing the health care financing industry, it's to allow all essential care to be tax deductible -- not just the insurance, but also the copays for those with insurance, and direct payments for essential care whether one does or doesn't have insurance.

If one has to take out a loan to pay for care, fine, payments of the principle and interest for loans of essential care would also be deductible.

Basically level the playfield for paying for healthcare expenses. If folks want to prepay carriers for their regular checkups and other care, fine... If folks want to pay directly and perhaps save some money for checkups and get a tax deduction for that expense, fine... If folks want to save for future expense, make that tax deductible. Etc. etc.

Basically, get the government out of the business of making crony deals with carriers to carve out exemptions for carrier funded care, leaving all other forms of care subject to taxation... Ideally, any Congresscritter getting money from carriers ought to recuse themselves from voting on health care issues that include extending preferences for carriers over other forms of payment for essential health care services.

Posted by: Seipherd at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (BTHwH)

571 558
Where is everyone watching the Teh Enschlonening?

Posted by: Lady in Black - LONG LIVE THE SCALP WEASEL at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (+FSld)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVVTb3nZssQ

Posted by: davidt at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (XoldI)

572 560 I wish he'd stop talking about the electoral college win he had. It's childish.
Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (9U1OG)

It's psychological warfare. It demoralizes the enemy.

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (hdpay)

573 Are there 2 General Kelly's?

Posted by: garrett at February 16, 2017 01:10 PM (oXKWd)

574 Where is everyone watching the Teh Enschlonening?
Posted by: Lady in Black - LONG LIVE THE SCALP WEASEL at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (+FSld)

***********

ABC has broken into regular programming.

The Dems have pissed him off---and it's weird but it has focused him.

Posted by: Strelnikov at February 16, 2017 01:11 PM (fi5nC)

575 "Fair trade, not free, fair. Every country takes advantage of us."

Posted by: joe, living dangerously at February 16, 2017 01:11 PM (KUaJL)

576 We need medical spending accounts that have no limits on how much you put in and no stipulations about spending it all every year. The only requirement should be that these funds can only be spent on approved medical/therapy expenses.

Posted by: Lemmiwinks at February 16, 2017 01:11 PM (5phSm)

577 PDT: "If I were not elected, believe me, they [jobs] would have left."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:11 PM (8iiMU)

578 537 Trump has moved up another 2 points in the Rasmussen poll, best poll out there for assessing momentum. He's at plus 2%. Obama spent most of his eight years at negative 20% or below.

Posted by: Ignoramus at February 16, 2017 01:06 PM (SIY7D)

*scratches head*

That has to be false:

1) I was assured for the last eight frickin years that everyone universally loved our incandescently brilliant- and handsome- supre... president. Except for one or two complete and utter racists who somehow managed to exert massive influence and keep him from getting anything done- except for all the great and wonderful and popular things he did.

2) I have also been repeatedly assured over the last- geez- 25 days or so that EVERYONE hates Donald Trump. I mean, if 55% approve of the job he is doing, then how did Hillary! win the popular vote by such a landslide, huh?

Right? Right?!

Posted by: Aetius451AD at February 16, 2017 01:11 PM (92kX2)

579 447 429 I wouldn't be speaking a Repub at my district's town hall.
Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 12:50 PM (adsVM)

===================

Then who can you talk to? What kind of general election opponent is your Congress-critter going to be facing next cycle?
Posted by: TheJamesMadison at February 16, 2017 12:53 PM (vur0q)
-----------------
I haven't heard anything about the proposed GOP sacrificial goat for '18, but the Dem wins this district by 65+% every election.

Posted by: Brunette the 'Ette at February 16, 2017 01:11 PM (adsVM)

580 490---Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 12:58 PM (71OEY)
----------------------
Nice rant. Hard sayings but well said.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at February 16, 2017 01:11 PM (Nox3c)

581
Big LEAGUE. And going after Democrats.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:12 PM (UBQ2A)

582 Hit 'em with THE GORSUCH!!

Posted by: Strelnikov at February 16, 2017 01:12 PM (fi5nC)

583 557 90grand for open heart surgery in the USA. 1,800 in cash in India for the exact same precedure with the exact same quality.
Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 01:01 PM (H8Bf9)

----------------

About $3500 in Thailand and their bigger hospitals are cleaner and state-of-the-art. Plus, for a few dollars more, they'll put you up in a nice hotel until they're sure you can fly home.
Posted by: Soona at February 16, 2017 01:09 PM (Fmupd

Amazing. Our health care industry is literally criminal.

Posted by: Widespread Pepe at February 16, 2017 01:12 PM (H8Bf9)

584

The Dems have pissed him off---and it's weird but it has focused him.

I'm sure one thing he's taken from the business world is, when you find you're in a fight, you get serious.

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at February 16, 2017 01:12 PM (oVJmc)

585 "Again, I say it...there has never been a presidency that has done so much in a short amount of time and...we have some big announcements coming next week."

Taking questions....Mara Liason first.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:13 PM (Enq6K)

586 Mara Liasson is first.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:13 PM (8iiMU)

587 Trump: "Is the Kraken ready 'cause I'm getting ready to release it"

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 01:13 PM (hdpay)

588 Apparently she was cut off before.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:13 PM (8iiMU)

589 Did he just say bigly? lol

No, he's taking more care to enunciate 'big league'.

Posted by: Bandersnatch, gentleman cad at February 16, 2017 01:13 PM (mgbwf)

590 Get rid of price fixing in the health care industry by enforcing the laws. Prices will drop by over 90%. People will not lose their homes and be destroyed for life.

90grand for open heart surgery in the USA. 1,800 in cash in India for the exact same precedure with the exact same quality.
Posted by: Widespread Pepe
............
90%? You are fucking delusional.

Do you know what the cost of living is in India?
Are you going to tell a doctor who doesn't even start making money until they are 30 and owes a couple hundred thousand in student loans that you want him to live the lifestyle of an Indian doc?

There is no price fixing. Hospitals and doctors will charge whatever they like whether the numbers are published or not. Do you think people are going to shop around for the cheapest stent surgery when they've had a heart attack?

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 16, 2017 01:13 PM (so+oy)

591 I wish he'd stop talking about the electoral college win he had. It's childish.
Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (9U1OG)

Kick 'em when they're up, kick 'em when they're down.

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (Jcg9Q)

592 I'm sure one thing he's taken from the business world is, when you find you're in a fight, you get serious.
Posted by: Mr. Peebles at February 16, 2017 01:12 PM (oVJmc)

******************

It's just the best that I've ever heard him.

Posted by: Strelnikov at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (fi5nC)

593 Mara Liasson is first.

Let Me guess... RUSSIA!!!

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (O2RFr)

594 Ok, uncle! Let him talk about his electoral college win. You win. LOL

Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (9U1OG)

595 We've temporarily limited some of your account features.

EVLINC
@EVLINC1
What's going on?
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FREE SPEECH !! unless they disagree with it

Posted by: EVLINC! at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (y3aQB)

596 587 Trump: "Is the Kraken ready 'cause I'm getting ready to release it"
Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 01:13 PM (hdpay)

Not at the table, please.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (92kX2)

597 >>>>>Wow. This is refreshing. Actual straight fucking talk.

It's about friggin time it happened. For way too long the media and the PC Patrol has gotten away with anything they want to, Bush refused to defend himself and the media tore him up constantly. That ain't gonna happen with Trump.

Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (le7jz)

598 PDT: "What was wrong was the way the information was given." About Flynn. "It's all fake news about Russia." Stressing the illegal disclosure of classified information.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (8iiMU)

599 "It's all fake news." Trump you magnificent bastard!

Posted by: Ripley at February 16, 2017 01:14 PM (1BQGO)

600 Trump: Russia meme is fake news.

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (hdpay)

601 THIS

IS

AWESOME

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (toH8T)

602 Talking about Flynn but mostly about the leaking of classified information.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (Enq6K)

603 The Ninth is way too big. It needs chopped up into at least two, if not three, circuits.>>>

So it would become a Three Ring Circus?

Posted by: Buzzsaw at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (WYwks)

604 Fake news!!

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (Jcg9Q)

605 >>No, he's taking more care to enunciate 'big league'. Posted by: Bandersnatch, gentleman cad at February 16, 2017 01:13 PM (mgbwf)

Heresy. It has been bigly, it is bigly, it will remain bigly. Stop scaring the children.

Posted by: General Zod at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (Bdeb0)

606 Mr. Trump, why are you Hitler?

Posted by: Unbiased Journalist at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (oVJmc)

607 "It's an illegal process, and the press should be ashamed of themselves."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (8iiMU)

608 President Trump is WAY better at dealing with the Fake News than Sean Spicer.

Trump is an all-time great at PR, though... you can't expect Spicer to do as well.

Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (10LGw)

609 Nood.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (92kX2)

610 That's what I want: A yuge wall. A classy, luxurious wall. And on that wall, heads! We'll stack it with the heads of leakers, bigly! And they will be classy heads on luxurious spikes!

Posted by: joncelli, Gobsmacked Rage Monkey and Crossbowman at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (RD7QR)

611 Fake news!

Posted by: Mr. Peebles at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (oVJmc)

612 603 The Ninth is way too big. It needs chopped up into at least two, if not three, circuits.>>>

They've tried before to split it into 2... They have a real shot at doing that this time...

Posted by: deplorable donna at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (O2RFr)

613 Pres Trump has got these fake news Shits stymied right now. You can hear a pin drop in the WH press room right now.

Posted by: Soothsayer 45
===

Oh shit

Daddy just pulled the car over.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (toH8T)

614 we probably need at least a couple tiers ... which we sorta have.

Medicaid might keep people from dying in the streets (as Trump promised to prevent), but can't fund million dollar cancer treatments. Sorry Charlie, you guys get the minimum ... lose weight, get a job, stay off the crack.

And no psychologist charging $150 hour to hold your hand. Go to church, join AA. small copay was helpful in Australia's two-tier thingy, or people just go in cuz they are bored. My Mom (Medicare level) and her roommate (Medicaid) both had knee replacements, but the other person was young/obese on second knee surgery. Some level of individual responsibility has to return.

And basically no lawsuits for Medicaid patients, by lawyers looking for bucks, just cuz doctor didn't do 23 expensive tests. Free care, we'll do our best.

Posted by: illiniwek at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (RWmbm)

615 Happy birthday MP4!!

Posted by: Our Country is Screwed at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (jxbfJ)

616
I wish he'd stop talking about the electoral college win he had. It's childish.
Posted by: Jaimo at February 16, 2017 01:04 PM (9U1OG)

I know it's like Cubs fans talking about their World Series win for the next year.

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (lKyWE)

617 "The press should be ashamed of themselves."

Atta boy.

Posted by: Country Boy - just a humble, occasionally hotheaded poster at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (Jcg9Q)

618
Rush just came in his mouth when PDT called Russia Fake News!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 16, 2017 01:16 PM (UBQ2A)

619 PDT explaining that Flynn's info sharing/etc were 'not satisfactory to me".

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:17 PM (8iiMU)

620 So it would become a Three Ring Circus?
Posted by: Buzzsaw at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (WYwks)

Well, yes. Now I want that.

Posted by: alexthechick - all your caps are belong to me at February 16, 2017 01:17 PM (mf5HN)

621 "The failing NY Times wrote a big story...." LOL!

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:17 PM (Enq6K)

622 >>> 90grand for open heart surgery in the USA. 1,800 in cash in India for the exact same precedure with the exact same quality.
......

It's beyond price fixing.

When you detach the person receiving a service, the provider or the service, and the person paying for the service, cost go out of control. Want to make costs worse? Subsidize things.

I get your point with the India example but I think it's more complex than that. You have to take into account the impact of subsidies, etc. over decades.

You also have to consider the cost of developing healthcare advances over decades or longer. To make a pill cost hundredths of a cent. To invent a medication costs decades and millions. After that, it's just sell as many pills as possible as quickly as possible before your patent expires. In subsidized markets, the pill will be outrageously expensive. In over markets, it will be dirt cheap.

The problem of cost is a consequence of governments/ people trying to artificially manipulate costs over centuries.

One could argue, correctly, that without the subsidies, we would not have the level of advancement in healthcare that we do. Some might justify the subsidies in this way. Others (including me) would argue that the cost outweighs the benefit and has created the no win scenario we have now.

It is a shame to know that people lack things they need because they can't afford them. There are two options to deal with this: A- Charity. I mean, real voluntary charity not government imposed charity. B- Communism. The catch with Communism is everything gets reduced to the lowest, common denominator, advances end, and regression begins.

Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 01:17 PM (71OEY)

623 The failing NYT!!!

Posted by: davidt at February 16, 2017 01:18 PM (XoldI)

624 He is not calling the leaks "illegal" anymore.

I think he is pulling back from saying anything.

Sessions is gonna prosecute.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:18 PM (toH8T)

625 PDT schooling the press on their fakiness. Rebutting their sorry asses.
Slammed a NYT page one article.

"Most of the papers don't print it because of their stories."

LOL

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:18 PM (8iiMU)

626 624
He is not calling the leaks "illegal" anymore.

I think he is pulling back from saying anything.

Sessions is gonna prosecute.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:18 PM (toH8T)

No, he did say it earlier.

Posted by: Tami at February 16, 2017 01:19 PM (Enq6K)

627
Trump is an all-time great at PR, though... you can't expect Spicer to do as well.
Posted by: Geronimo Stilton at February 16, 2017 01:15 PM (10LGw)

Spicer would be much better if PT would hire a damn communications director.Spicer is trying to handle two full time jobs and it shows.

Posted by: Deplorable Male Logic at February 16, 2017 01:19 PM (lKyWE)

628 Trump taking shot at Obama Admin regarding leaks.

Posted by: WisRich at February 16, 2017 01:20 PM (hdpay)

629 "...failing NY Times"

Posted by: OregonMuse, deplorable since 2004 at February 16, 2017 01:20 PM (/9ppM)

630 Press dweeb is asking something about electoral votes.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:21 PM (8iiMU)

631 It is a shame to know that people lack things they need because they can't afford them. There are two options to deal with this: A- Charity. I mean, real voluntary charity not government imposed charity. B- Communism. The catch with Communism is everything gets reduced to the lowest, common denominator, advances end, and regression begins.
Posted by: Damiano at February 16, 2017 01:17 PM (71OEY)

Also the health insurance = health care view has got to die in the largest possible fire. By the insanity of cthulhu, people seem to believe that if only people have health insurance, they'll never get sick and everyone will be cured of everything and look at all the unicorns!

Posted by: alexthechick - all your caps are belong to me at February 16, 2017 01:22 PM (mf5HN)

632 LOL - "It was a very substantial victory, do you agree with that?"

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:22 PM (8iiMU)

633 He is taking questions now, something obama did only extremely reluctantly.

Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 01:22 PM (le7jz)

634 when doctors take only cash:

http://ti.me/2jUSKFr

I have my fourth new insurance in as many years since companies keep bailing on the Oregon market. It's through my employer. Thanks to a trip to the ER, I've already maxed out my $5k deductible! And I'll be paying on this forever. Still waiting to see if Medicare will pick up any of it.

Posted by: Notsothoreau at February 16, 2017 01:22 PM (uyrlv)

635 Time for the enchantment question.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:23 PM (toH8T)

636 Ok thanks Tami.

Maybe they will still go after them Hope so.

Posted by: Mortimer - FINISH HER ! at February 16, 2017 01:24 PM (toH8T)

637 I wish I could hear the actual questions......

Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 01:24 PM (le7jz)

638 PDT: "Those are criminal leaks. I think you will see them stop once we get out people in. It's a criminal act."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:25 PM (8iiMU)

639 Uh oh......he is now calling them Criminal Leaks........

Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 01:25 PM (le7jz)

640 "Are you folks going to be reporting about that too? I don't want classified information getting out."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:26 PM (8iiMU)

641 PDT: "What's happens when I am dealing with North Korea?"

Jesus, they are still focusing on Russia. What idiots.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:27 PM (8iiMU)

642 LOL.....fake news I bet the media hates that he took their meme and turn it around on them.

Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 01:28 PM (le7jz)

643 LOL. PDT: "I don't mind with bad stories, I can handle that, as long as it's true."

Then he slams CNN: "The hate...I don't watch it anymore."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:28 PM (8iiMU)

644 They've tried before to split it into 2... They have a real shot at doing that this time...

Turn it into three. The existing Ninth handles a fifty-mile-wide strip from the Canadian border to Salinas, plus Guam and Hawaii.

The Tenth gets Santa Barbara south to Mexico and east.

The Eleventh everyone else.

Posted by: JEM at February 16, 2017 01:29 PM (TppKb)

645 PDT: "This is pure delay tactics."

"I have nothing to do with Russia."

LOL, talking about Hillary cheating on the debates!

"Can you imagine if I got the questions? It would be the electric chair!"

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:30 PM (8iiMU)

646 Oh smack.....he is all over CNN giving hillary the debate questions ahead of time.

Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 01:31 PM (le7jz)

647 Jim Acosta is up. He sounds fucking obsequious! LOLOL....

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:31 PM (8iiMU)

648 The GOP has been talking about Obamacare repeal since it was signed. How, at this point, do they not have a plan? And if the answer is, "well, it's complicated, and we can't disrupt people's care because of poor planning, look what happened with the rollout of Obamacare. ". YOU HAVE HAD NO LESS THAN 5 YEARS TO COME UP WITH A PLAN! F'N DO IT ALREADY!

Posted by: Penny at February 16, 2017 01:32 PM (moZVm)

649 "I don't want to be hacked. They tried it, and they failed."

Responding to Acosta re; hacks and Hillary.

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:34 PM (8iiMU)

650 PDT: "Jim, you know what it is? Here's the thing....The tone is such hatred. I watched this morning...FF...they have the most honest morning show. ;;; Look at your show that comes on at 10pm in teh evening...the panels is almost constant anti- Trump...."

Posted by: Deplorable Ian Galt at February 16, 2017 01:35 PM (8iiMU)

651 One thing I notice on this press conference is the alleged reporters are constantly trying to talk over Trump and he is refusing to let them do it.

They never would have even thought of doing that with obama.

Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 01:35 PM (le7jz)

652 651 One thing I notice on this press conference is the alleged reporters are constantly trying to talk over Trump and he is refusing to let them do it.

They never would have even thought of doing that with obama.
Posted by: The Great White Scotsman at February 16, 2017 01:35 PM (le7jz)

Because that would have been disrespectful. We would have had an entire cycle talking about how that was disrespectful and other reporters would have been calling him out saying he 'went over the line.' See Major Garrett, I think.

Posted by: Aetius451AD at February 16, 2017 01:38 PM (92kX2)

653 That at was a dumb question. It is the MSM that has undermined the public faith in the press and it started long before Trump.

Posted by: Ripley at February 16, 2017 01:38 PM (1BQGO)

654 Reset!

Posted by: davidt at February 16, 2017 01:43 PM (XoldI)

655 "Obamacare is in a Death Spiral"

See; not only did it have Death Panels, it has Death Panel for Death Panels.

Sincerely,

Posted by: Sarah Palin, "I can see Russia From Hillary's Bank Account" at February 16, 2017 04:24 PM (0IaIs)

656 Simple solution for trump - enforce Obama care good and hard. Maximum fines and prosecutions. No exceptions!

You'll have a repeal bill on your desk within the week.

Posted by: George Orwell's Ghost at February 16, 2017 08:08 PM (UgF8H)

657 "Ever get the feeling you're being played?"

Continuously, since about 1990.

Posted by: iowaan at February 17, 2017 08:39 AM (6QxYD)

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