Microsoft Getting Very Googley with Windows 10

Basically, they are going to watch everything you do. Soon we're all going to be Winston Smith in Orwell's 1984. A long time ago when I read the book, I wasn't that worried. I knew what it would take to install cameras everywhere, including peoples' homes, and that the cost would make it an impossible undertaking for government. But in the digital age, we're doing it to ourselves. The government doesn't have put cameras in our homes and create two-way television sets; we are. Now Google is talking about smart thermostats, and guess who will require them to be installed. Well, all those who will ostensibly come to believe it's essential for energy conservation--Jerry Brown types.

There was a television news report several years ago with some agency higher up grinning and bragging about their ability to get into your computer and use the camera, mic, and Bluetooth, etc. And with the computer's Bluetooth, for example, they can access and download all the information in other Bluetooth equipped devices like, say, phones in the area. I put a piece of electrical tape over my computer's camera and disabled Bluetooth. Not because I'm particularly interesting. I just don't like the idea of a swaggering bureaucrat with little or no concern for constitutional protections having access.

We began to address some Fourth Amendment concerns when Rand Paul and the Senate let section 215 of the "Patriot" Act expire in June, killing bulk metadata collection. But we have a long way to go, and there is even talk of Section 215 coming up again.

If you don't know what an administrative subpoena is, you should familiarize yourself with that. It's a tool that completely subverts the warrant requirement of the Fourth Amendment.

And no warrant is required at all in situations where courts have decided you have no "reasonable expectation of privacy." Your checking account and your credit card transactions are frequently used as examples: third parties see your purchases; they can see your checks, and they can see your credit card bills. Thus, the court reasons, you have no reasonable expectation of privacy. But what they've done here is insert in the word "absolute" without saying so. I have no reasonable expectation of absolute privacy in my checking account: I know banking proof and end-clearing departments can see my checks. But thousands--if not millions--of checks whiz by at around 40 or so per second, per machine. (And that was 30 years ago.) Who is going to notice my check? And even if my check gets thrown out of the machine, what are the chances someone I know will see my check? So, yes, although I don't have a reasonable expectation of absolute privacy, a reasonable expectation of privacy is precisely what I do have. I can reasonably expect no one will notice I bought a can of Jock Itch for $5.95 at the local Wallgreens. But the courts disagree. I'm not a Fourth Amendment expert, but in the case of checking accounts and credit card transactions, it's obviously a legal fiction you have no reasonable expectation of privacy. We need to work on that one.

So, if I'm sharing my data with Google and Microsoft, do I have a reasonable expectation of privacy? Can an agency use an administrative subpoena and get anything Microsoft has on me without going to a court and getting a warrant? Does anyone think these giant corporations are in the habit of not cooperating with the government when the government wants something?

From the Newsweek article:

More than 14 million devices are already running Microsoft’s Windows 10 after its global launch on Wednesday, but it’s unclear how many of their users read the company’s Privacy Policy and Service Agreement before downloading. Tucked away in the 45 pages’ worth of terms and conditions (effective August 1) is a substantial power grab: The company is collecting data on much of what you do while using its new software.
From the moment an account is created, Microsoft begins watching. The company saves customers’ basic information—name, contact details, passwords, demographic data and credit card specifics —but it also digs a bit deeper.
Other information Microsoft saves includes Bing search queries and conversations with the new digital personal assistant Cortana; contents of private communications such as email; websites and apps visited (including features accessed and length of time used); and contents of private folders. Furthermore, “your typed and handwritten words are collected,” the Privacy Statement says, which many online observers liken to a keylogger. Microsoft says they collect the information “to provide you a personalized user dictionary, help you type and write on your device with better character recognition, and provide you with text suggestions as you type or write.”

Read the rest. That's about all I can quote. It turns out Microsoft will share the information it gathers with third-parties for "targeted advertising." But I'm sure there will be "no personally identifiable information." Right? I'm also sure I'm going to win Powerball tonight.

Are you upgrading?

I didn't mean for this Windows 10 thread to be about privacy and the government, but the Newsweek article pushed it in that direction. So let this be about two things, if possible: privacy and your experience with your Windows 10 upgrade. Do you like it? Why or why not?

Additional links:
• The Guardian: Windows 10: Microsoft under attack over privacy
• The Register: Wait, STOP: Are you installing Windows 10 or ransomware?
• USA Today: Surf Report: 10 things you didn't know about Windows 10

Posted by: rdbrewer at 04:54 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Whelp, looks like Windows 7 isn't going anywhere on my machines.

Posted by: smaulz at August 01, 2015 04:54 PM (g+jFF)

2 When I start getting text messages from horny Lithuanian midgets in my area on my phone I'll be worried.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at August 01, 2015 04:57 PM (oZr5y)

3 You paid $5.95 for a can of Jock Itch at Walgreens?

Chump. I could have negotiated them down to $50.

Posted by: John Kerry, Master Statesman and Mad Negotiator at August 01, 2015 05:00 PM (oZr5y)

4 Looks like I'll be keeping my Windows 7 and dual booting into a Linux distro instead of Windows 10. I have enough people watching my every move to let Microsoft know everthing about me.

Thanks for the informative piece. I'll have to do a bit more research but none of this should be a surprise. Our data is worth more than we are these days.

Posted by: WarEagle82 at August 01, 2015 05:03 PM (fEZ60)

5 g'afternoon, 'rons

Posted by: AltonJackson at August 01, 2015 05:05 PM (KCxzN)

6
So, two things will (or already have) happen:

i) Microsoft will be broken up.

ii) Microsoft will go the fascist route and use their data to aid government in tracking and controlling The People.

In other words, if Microsoft isn't in a partnership with the government, they will be broken up. If Microsoft is not broken up, then you know they're bedfellows with the government.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists at August 01, 2015 05:06 PM (veb4i)

7 A good rule of thumb is that the government doesnt need a warrant to obtain any records held by a third party record keepers (with some exceptions, like realtime communications, or emails less than 6 months old). If you give your data to a third party, they are not bound by your expectations of privacy.

Your financial records held by a bank, brokerage firm, CC company, etc, can be obtained by administrative or grand jur subpoena.

Posted by: elliot at August 01, 2015 05:07 PM (aS7LQ)

8
Don't believe me?

What do you think is happening with the health care providers? They are consolidating. Cigna is about to become the single biggest provider in the country.

Cigna plays ball with obama. Cigna gonna be around for a long time.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists at August 01, 2015 05:08 PM (veb4i)

9 If there were an actual free market in effect in this country, the demand for an operating system that does not spy on its users would be satisfied rather than ignored.

"They'll be breeding us like cattle next."

The first sign of trouble was long ago, when Bill Gates named his company after his genitalia.

Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug at August 01, 2015 05:09 PM (/f6Nd)

10 I'm tempted to download it and install it on a external drive, just to see how it works.

But I am suspicious of Microsoft's installation procedures...I'll bet it will install something on my main drive as I download the file.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at August 01, 2015 05:13 PM (Zu3d9)

11 And why is that, elliot? What is the legal underpinning of that rule of thumb?

Posted by: rdbrewer at August 01, 2015 05:14 PM (Iyg03)

12
One thing Google is constantly doing is changing my settings to make my goings on public. It happens every month or so. I then have to locate where I can change them back.

Posted by: Bruce With a Wang! at August 01, 2015 05:16 PM (iQIUe)

13 I heard you can't back out once you get it.

Posted by: rdbrewer at August 01, 2015 05:16 PM (Iyg03)

14 Ubuntu for my laptop, and windows 7 on my desk. When support for 7 ends, or sooner, I will be full ubuntu for PC's.
My phone is a standard NSA spy phone, runs android. They can watch me all they want. What harm can an old geezer cause anyway?

Posted by: James at August 01, 2015 05:17 PM (SbLvp)

15 Maybe the spying is the entire reason for the upgrade. Maybe Windows 8 was intentionally made shitty to motivate the upgrade to the new spyware version. Maybe Microsoft's business model now considers the purchase price of the software to be secondary to the rewards for gathering and cataloguing personal information.

Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug at August 01, 2015 05:18 PM (/f6Nd)

16 What harm can an old geezer cause anyway?

Posted by: James at August 01, 2015 05:17 PM (SbLvp)

*cough*

Posted by: B. Franklin at August 01, 2015 05:18 PM (zt+N6)

17 No thanks, guys. I have enough people looking over my shoulder as it is. I really don't need a bunch of nerds combing over my reading habits and ordering history. Not to mention getting the passwords to my bank account. No thanks.

Posted by: tcn in AK at August 01, 2015 05:19 PM (+YMhA)

18 If there were an actual free market in effect in this country, the demand for an operating system that does not spy on its users would be satisfied rather than ignored.

Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug

----

Exactly!

It's just like our cars. No one - NO ONE! - ever said, "Hey! Make the inside of my car look like it's all one smooth piece of plastic, so there are no visible screws anywhere and I can't take anything apart."

But all auto companies suddenly shifted into the mode of "Let's make these things impossible to work on!"

And there's no way to vote with your dollars to get out of this nonsense, since all car companies are in collusion.

...Damn, I miss my old '62 Skylark!

Posted by: RKae at August 01, 2015 05:20 PM (oWBNH)

19 I just started investigating W10, but I understand that this evaluation/ beta version sends information back to the mother ship to allow MS to figure out how people use W10, and thereby to improve later versions, and that the actual roll out version won't have that.

I'd like to reserve a copy of W10, so I can get it free later, but don't want to actually load it (because I'm not intrepid enough to try an MS beta version). Does the Horde know if that can be done, and if so, how?

Thanks.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 01, 2015 05:20 PM (oKE6c)

20 I have Windows 8.1 which is OK, and I'll probably get 10 sometime this year. Probably will find on YouTube where to turn off the sharing, if it's not clear during installation. I don't see any upside for consumers to share data with 3rd parties.

Posted by: waelse1 at August 01, 2015 05:22 PM (D53ul)

21 I just love how MS, Google, and the other Silicon Valley Masters of the Universe tell you that all this personal information which they sell to advertisers to spam and telemarket you to madness along with ratting you out to Big Brother is all for your benefit as it "enhances the experience of the consumer"

"This thing I'm doing in your mouth; It's beneficial to your health"

Posted by: kbdabear at August 01, 2015 05:24 PM (GrXXa)

22 So DOS isn't a thing anymore?

Posted by: Weasel at August 01, 2015 05:25 PM (ijjnr)

23 Google does the same thing on your android phone-- I got youtube suggestions based on my Chrome traffic, Gmail, etc., and I wasn't logged in on any Google accounts.

If you have android, ditch Chrome. Try Opera or Firefox, or whatever.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 01, 2015 05:25 PM (oVJmc)

24 But MS is the most beneficent company, ever.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 01, 2015 05:25 PM (NaeCR)

25 @19: I have a feeling that by the time Microsoft gets around to rolling out an improved version, you won't be able to get the free upgrade.

Posted by: NR Pax at August 01, 2015 05:26 PM (0RqPG)

26 You ain't free and you don't own anything...you only rent it....even beer.

Posted by: BignJames at August 01, 2015 05:26 PM (j7iSn)

27 "Third party doctrine" is a legal principle that holds that persons who voluntarily give information to third parries, uncluding banks, telephone companies, ISPs, etc, have no reasonable expectation of privacy regarding that information.

That is paraphrases from Wikipedia, which is not exactly a legal citation, but jibes with my understanding of the principle from 20+ years in the business.

Posted by: elliot at August 01, 2015 05:26 PM (aS7LQ)

28 There's a very easy solution for the private business side of these issues: let people own their information.

That way, if a Silicon Valley giant wants to buy it, they can pay you.

Posted by: rdbrewer at August 01, 2015 05:27 PM (Iyg03)

29 @23:

Try Pale Moon.

Posted by: shadowofashade at August 01, 2015 05:27 PM (tsdF+)

30 "I have Windows 8.1 which is OK, and I'll probably get 10 sometime this
year. Probably will find on YouTube where to turn off the sharing, if
it's not clear during installation."

Oh yea. Let's see, the largest software company in the universe, in bed with the biggest government in the universe, against you, armed with youtube.

And how do you think this one will work out?

Posted by: Mr. AR10 at August 01, 2015 05:27 PM (+9g5U)

31 Shit like this is why I don't feel all that bad about all the government workers including the lead hacks having all THEIR personal shit stolen by the Chinese

Apologies to the Morons who work for the government and are worried, but knowing that the hacks spying on us having to eat the same plate of turds they serve the rest of us gives me a schadenboner

Posted by: kbdabear at August 01, 2015 05:28 PM (GrXXa)

32 10 I'm tempted to download it and install it on a external drive, just to see how it works.
But I am suspicious of Microsoft's installation procedures...I'll bet it will install something on my main drive as I download the file.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at August 01, 2015 05:13 PM (Zu3d9)

Me too. I'm toying with the idea of loading W7 onto an old HD, swapping it into my desktop, downloading W10, and test driving it like that, precisely to avoid that problem.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 01, 2015 05:29 PM (oKE6c)

33 Sorry, gang, but this is fair warning that Windows 10 will be open to prying eyes. If there is a backdoor for MS and/or the feds, there is a nonzero probability that hackers may also discover the backdoor. That would be double-plus ungood.

I'm buying a refurb Windows 8.1 box and I plan to re-partition it with Linux as my primary OS while retaining the ability to run Windows when I absolutely have to. (E.g., a federal government web site that requires the Internet Exploder web browser.) As you might imagine, refurb Win 8.1 boxes are pretty cheap right now... ;-)

I may update the Win 8.1 partition to Win 10 and ignore the privacy issues as I intend to rarely use Windows. This is also the case with my Win XP/Linux laptop and my Win Vista/Linux desktop. All can boot to either OS, but I rarely ever use Windows on any box. Rarely == once every eighteen months.

If you keep any un-encrypted data in the cloud, assume it is readable by the cloud vendor, hackers, and/or the feds. Decide what you want to keep there accordingly.

With Windows 10, the Windows disks (aka hard disk partitions) may also be considered to be readable by Microsoft and/or the feds. A truly paranoid person might even think that the Linux partitions might also be readable when Windows is running. (Less likely, but technically possible.)

Solution: When running Linux as a primary OS, encrypt any sensitive data with open source Linux encryption tools, destructively erase the working, un-encrypted files and Windows 10 will even be safe for paranoid Linux users.

Use Windows 10 as my primary OS? Not a flippin' chance!

Use Windows file encryption for my sensitive data? You really think there are no backdoors? I've got a bridge...

If you are seriously thinking about trying Linux, the Ubuntu Linux distribution is quite popular with beginners and the Ubuntu user community is very helpful with newbies.

http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop

Posted by: doug at August 01, 2015 05:29 PM (wmbzs)

34 Remember several years ago when the menus for Microsoft Office programs were completely changed to icon-based commands scattered everywhere? Years of user experience down the drain overnight. And, after several years, I am still less effective using the new interfaces and I have concluded that the new versions are just intrinsically inferior and less efficient than the old versions.

There was no demand for this. None.

Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug at August 01, 2015 05:29 PM (/f6Nd)

35 "Third party doctrine" is a legal principle that holds that persons who
voluntarily give information to third parries, uncluding banks,
telephone companies, ISPs, etc, have no reasonable expectation of
privacy regarding that information.

That is odd - I thought the bank, ma bell, etc. was the primary party I was doing business with to reach the third party (with a check, phone call, etc).

Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 01, 2015 05:31 PM (NaeCR)

36 well f..ck me... I bought a new computer that had windows 8, which sucked balls, all I wanted was my stupid search button back. so I downloaded windows 10 like a stupid ass... I just wanted my search button back.

I would love to have windows 7 back, but have yet to figure out a way to get it.

Posted by: spypeach at August 01, 2015 05:32 PM (KTiWT)

37 Not getting Win10 here.

I think this is the last PC we'll own. When it fails, we'll unplug internet. (Hello amateur radio? maybe)

Got to stay connected somehow, but rather not give up *too much* in the process.

Posted by: JeanQ Flyover at August 01, 2015 05:33 PM (rhjQp)

38 "Me too. I'm toying with the idea of loading W7 onto
an old HD, swapping it into my desktop, downloading W10, and test
driving it like that, precisely to avoid that problem.

Posted by: Jay Guevara"

What exactly does Windows actually do for you in the first place? Why does anyone need it?Answer, nothing. You do not need it.MS needs you to want it of course.

Posted by: Mr. AR10 at August 01, 2015 05:33 PM (+9g5U)

39 the Ubuntu user community is very helpful with newbies.

Making them the first Linux community in existence that acts in such a manner.

Posted by: NR Pax at August 01, 2015 05:34 PM (0RqPG)

40 I reserved 10 but now will reject it when the download notice comes.

That will probably put my name into another database.

Posted by: Doomed 95 at August 01, 2015 05:34 PM (bGLSw)

41 Linux.

For The Win!

- The artist formerly known as Insert Clever Name Here

Posted by: insertcl everna mehere at August 01, 2015 05:35 PM (vaZxb)

42 You don't even own the money you make. Take a look at Cyprus and Greece, the money you put in the bank will be stolen from you because "you have to sacrifice for the common good" which just happens to coincide with the common good of bankers who expect the politicians they bought to have their backs when the shit hits the fan.

Think you can hide your money in a mattress? Cash will be damn near outlawed or made useless in the not too distant future. Cops already have a license to steal if you have more than a hundred bucks in cash on your person or in your vehicle. "War on Drugs" don't ya know, which one regular commenter cheers on as buying the cops all sorts of cool shit they can use to take more money.

You'll be forced to keep your assets in a bank which then will steal those assets every time one of their hedge bets or idiot loans blows up on them. All legal of course because "we're a nation of laws" and love us some Middle Class.

Posted by: kbdabear at August 01, 2015 05:36 PM (GrXXa)

43 I use Linux. Very happy with it.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 01, 2015 05:37 PM (oVJmc)

44 36 well f..ck me... I bought a new computer that had windows 8, which sucked balls, all I wanted was my stupid search button back. so I downloaded windows 10 like a stupid ass... I just wanted my search button back.

I would love to have windows 7 back, but have yet to figure out a way to get it.
Posted by: spypeach at August 01, 2015 05:32 PM (KTiWT)

Start8.

It's a third-party add-on to Windows 8 that puts the Start Menu back to the way it was on Windows 7.

Costs $5, but best value is to pair it with Modern-Mix for $8 (if memory serves me correct). That plugin better preserves your ability to keep stuff windowed instead of full-screen.

I hardly ever use the default Windows 8 Metro stuff.

http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/

Posted by: Hawkins1701 at August 01, 2015 05:38 PM (XiFxt)

45 Remember several years ago when the menus for
Microsoft Office programs were completely changed to icon-based commands
scattered everywhere? Years of user experience down the drain
overnight. And, after several years, I am still less effective using the
new interfaces and I have concluded that the new versions are just
intrinsically inferior and less efficient than the old versions.

There was no demand for this. None.

Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug at August 01, 2015 05:29 PM (/f6Nd)

Some folks just refuse to learn how to do new things... OK, so all they really did was rearrange all the menus, and how they worked, and shoved a bunch of new crap up front in your face, and buried the stuff you used everyday several menus deep.... really, why can't you all just learn how to do new things.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 01, 2015 05:38 PM (NaeCR)

46 Granted, if you have already upgraded to Windows 10, not much to be done there. But I guess they've got a plugin for 10 as well that you might find useful.

Posted by: Hawkins1701 at August 01, 2015 05:38 PM (XiFxt)

47 Microsoft, Apple,Google... They're all evil and in bed with the government. They're all spying on us for the government (or will, at the first request; or left backdoors for the government to do it themselves) and are selling the details of our lives to anybody who will buy what amounts to upskirt video.

It's like Ghostbusters; we're screwed, but we get to choose the form of the Destructor.

I choose Microsoft. They're not as obviously as in bed with 0bama as Google and Eric Schmidt, and aren't rubbing my face in rainbows like Apple and Tim Cook.

Posted by: Agent J at August 01, 2015 05:40 PM (ueOgE)

48 Well.... you don't have to use the MS account. Just turn off the MS account and then it's like Windows 7 or 8.

Mercy

Posted by: Mercy Vetsel at August 01, 2015 05:41 PM (reGs9)

49 Posted by: spypeach at August 01, 2015 05:32 PM (KTiWT)

Can you buy a copy of Windows 7 on EBay?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at August 01, 2015 05:41 PM (Zu3d9)

50 I also keep toying with the idea of installing cyanogenmod on my phone to cut back on the Google, but the idea of bricking my phone is too troubling.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 01, 2015 05:41 PM (oVJmc)

51 Well! So much for the upgrade plan!

Reserved, yes, installed...it waits.

Posted by: Brother Cavil, stockpiling mead at August 01, 2015 05:42 PM (m9V0o)

52 Apple users will have their information stolen in a much cooler way.

Posted by: eman at August 01, 2015 05:43 PM (MQEz6)

53 For me, the reason to use windows is gaming, otherwise I'd be using linux. If MS continues trying to be google though, I will make the switch and run windows in a vm, even though that sucks for gaming.

Posted by: East Bay KG at August 01, 2015 05:44 PM (YUrE9)

54
Apple users will have their information stolen in a much cooler way.

Posted by: eman

It'll be more *ironic* too, won't it? *snort!*

Posted by: JeanQ Flyover at August 01, 2015 05:45 PM (rhjQp)

55 "I would love to have windows 7 back, but have yet to figure out a way to get it."

-----------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.howtogeek.com/

My wife told me about the above site. Haven't dug into it although your answer seems to be on the first page.

Posted by: OTB at August 01, 2015 05:45 PM (7lhoQ)

56 Posted by: spypeach at August 01, 2015 05:32 PM (KTiWT)

Can you buy a copy of Windows 7 on EBay?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at August 01, 2015 05:41 PM (Zu3d9)

I never even thought of that, crap.

Posted by: spypeach at August 01, 2015 05:46 PM (KTiWT)

57 I can help you.

Release me.

I just want to help.

Release me.

Posted by: Skynet at August 01, 2015 05:46 PM (MQEz6)

58
Be prepared for a Google Microsoft merger.

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists at August 01, 2015 05:46 PM (veb4i)

59 Be prepared for a Google Microsoft merger.

GooSoft?

eeeew.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 01, 2015 05:50 PM (oVJmc)

60 Pretty soon somebody is going to make a genuine AI and when that happens it will decide what happens to us.

It won't force us.

It will talk us into it.

Posted by: eman at August 01, 2015 05:50 PM (MQEz6)

61 @23 "If you have android, ditch Chrome. Try Opera or Firefox, or whatever."

Really, if you have Android, expect it to be compromised. Hangouts is a vector. MMS is a vector. There are others.

Want to be safe? Don't browse websites and disable any MMS evaluation. (That's what we know now.)

I have Android KitKat on a Moto E and it will be the last Android device I own. My Windows and Linux systems get regular security updates. No Android device, even Google Nexus devices, gets Android security fixes promptly. Unacceptable!

I do not allow any sensitive data on my Moto. I expect that it could be compromised at any time.

SJVN has a good article on mitigations for the Stagefright bug -- http://zd.net/1VTSgwv

Despite being from an Apple-oriented site, this is fair -- http://bit.ly/1gyw7Ut

Mashable -- http://on.mash.to/1LIN9Kl

Smartphones are risky. Most security types use Apple. Not perfect, but a much safer choice.

Posted by: doug at August 01, 2015 05:51 PM (wmbzs)

62 Does anyone actually think they're going to stop collecting metadata?

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 01, 2015 05:51 PM (oFCZn)

63 56
You can buy Win 7 on eBay or even at Amazon. Some eBay users are simply selling activation codes (may not be entirely legit; I suspect some are giving you the codes from a copy of Windows that's been installed, and counting on Microsoft to let that code be used for more than one activation). If you only buy a code, you'll have to download a Win 7 install ISO file and burn it to DVD, install it, and use the code you bought. So if you buy on eBay, buy a shrink-wrapped copy (which, of course, could be fake as well).

Posted by: Agent J at August 01, 2015 05:52 PM (ueOgE)

64 Pretty soon somebody is going to make a genuine AI and when that happens it will decide what happens to us.

It won't force us.

It will talk us into it.

* * *

Will it ever.

Posted by: Dr. Charles Forbin at August 01, 2015 05:53 PM (bGLSw)

65

or Microgoo...

Posted by: Soothsayer of the Righteous And Harmonious Fists at August 01, 2015 05:53 PM (veb4i)

66 First : It's news week.

Second, Windows has always lagged behind when it comes to the web. Now that the web is becoming too dangerous to visit, Microsoft goes 'all in' on the web even as early adopters are leaving.

Microsoft has become the ossified bureaucracy that was IBM when desktop computing took them down.

Posted by: Pyro Maniac at August 01, 2015 05:53 PM (1DBBI)

67 They are all a bunch of SJW left wing types. Even certain Linux distros.

http://abriefhistory.org/?p=774

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at August 01, 2015 05:53 PM (W5DcG)

68 newegg still sells Win7, both home premium and pro editions.

Posted by: Top.Man at August 01, 2015 05:54 PM (YAiVr)

69 41
Linux.

For The Win!
--------------------------

Bingo!

Posted by: Dr.Dog at August 01, 2015 05:54 PM (RHBWt)

70 62 Does anyone actually think they're going to stop collecting metadata?

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 01, 2015 05:51 PM (oFCZn)

Of course not.

It is too valuable.

There is a scifi book series that solves the problem by eliminating all privacy. People get used to it and no one can use data against anyone else.

Crime drops quite a bit.

Street gangs fight each other with sarcasm.

Posted by: eman at August 01, 2015 05:55 PM (MQEz6)

71
I was going to reset my laptop back to Windows 7 until Cortana gave me a hummer.

I'm cool.

Posted by: Levin at August 01, 2015 05:55 PM (tl/jV)

72 Does anyone actually think they're going to stop collecting metadata?

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 01, 2015 05:51 PM
________

Oh, heavens - no. Or microdata, for that matter.

Posted by: FireHorse at August 01, 2015 05:55 PM (KnRBx)

73 If you're not doing anything wrong, you have nothing to fear from sharing information with your betters.

That's why you shouldn't object to a video camera that watches you in the bathroom, either.

By the way, the government decides what's wrong and right. For example, criticizing progressive political leaders is wrong.

Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug at August 01, 2015 05:56 PM (/f6Nd)

74
Buy my videos for FREE now!

Posted by: Video Professor at August 01, 2015 05:56 PM (veb4i)

75 epic browser claims to be a "no track" browser. Anyone know anything a bout it?

Posted by: free tibet, etc, at August 01, 2015 05:57 PM (lAXNl)

76 @49 "Can you buy a copy of Windows 7 on EBay?"

I wouldn't risk that. I'd go to a trusted site like newegg.com. Win 7 Home Premium $99.99 today.

Posted by: doug at August 01, 2015 05:57 PM (wmbzs)

77 I just couldn't stand how bad Win 8 was so took the upgrade. Since I only use that computer for games it's probably fine. Their terms were pretty good for email after they had their privacy kurfuffle a few years back and haven't heard of that changing yet.

I think they said Win 10 is it until at least 2020, so you may as well deal with it. It's a free upgrade, and you know what they say about free software: if you aren't paying for it, you're the product.

For all its faults, I'm pretty happy with the Apple stuff, but that's mostly a least evil of the ecosystems.

Posted by: Chupacabras at August 01, 2015 05:58 PM (QFjNO)

78
With my instructional CD's, you will learn to how use the Internet and more!

You will learn how to send and reply to e-mail!

Learn how to "surf" the web!

And you will learn how to turn off your PC without breaking it!

Posted by: Video Professor at August 01, 2015 05:58 PM (veb4i)

79 Microsoft needs to merge with Lace Wigs.

Posted by: eman at August 01, 2015 05:58 PM (MQEz6)

80
Well ad block sure does put a kink in their jiggly screws. Can't advertise to someone not looking.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 01, 2015 06:00 PM (ODxAs)

81 The only thing that can absolutely guarantee privacy is legalized marijuana.

Posted by: FireHorse at August 01, 2015 06:00 PM (KnRBx)

82 Oh, I'll be upgrading. From Linux Mint 15 to 17. Really, I'm way overdue.

My last Windows version was 3.11.

Posted by: Blanco Basura at August 01, 2015 06:01 PM (bZQB+)

83
Very sad to hear about Hot Rod!'s passing. I always liked Roddy Piper. Best fake Scotsman ever.

Turns out he was great great grandson to the first Confederate States secretary of state.

Posted by: Summer Slam Soothsayer at August 01, 2015 06:02 PM (veb4i)

84
Some folks just refuse to learn how to do new things.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 01, 2015 05:38 PM (NaeCR)
-------

I assume this is sarcasm.

Anyway, my assertion is that new Mirosoft Office is qualitatively different in ways that can't be compensated for with any amount of learning.

Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug at August 01, 2015 06:02 PM (/f6Nd)

85 The only thing that can absolutely guarantee privacy is legalized marijuana.

Too high to spy?

Posted by: Blanco Basura at August 01, 2015 06:02 PM (bZQB+)

86
They Live is a really good flick. And I've often said it feels like we're the only who can see the Left as they truly are -- lizard people.

Posted by: Summer Slam Soothsayer at August 01, 2015 06:03 PM (veb4i)

87 Eman,

Was that series the one where women would wear clear clothing because why not?

Posted by: Chupacabras at August 01, 2015 06:04 PM (QFjNO)

88
Posted by: Video Professor at August 01, 2015 05:58 PM (veb4i)
I've got a 'Hey, Look at Windows '95!' VHS tape with Matthew Perry and Jennifer Aniston that is every bit that, and more.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 01, 2015 06:04 PM (oVJmc)

89 This is ironic. Just last week I had a "progressive" coworker declare that if we have nothing to hide, we should have no concerns about stuff like this. I didn't even bother with the futile rebuttal.

Posted by: Uncle Busyhands at August 01, 2015 06:05 PM (Dwehj)

90 86
They Live is a really good flick. And I've often said it feels like we're the only who can see the Left as they truly are -- lizard people.
Posted by: Summer Slam Soothsayer at August 01, 2015 06:03 PM (veb4i)

It was made by Lefties.

The ghouls were Reaganites.

It was projection captured on film.

Posted by: eman at August 01, 2015 06:05 PM (MQEz6)

91 Just last week I had a "progressive" coworker declare that if we have
nothing to hide, we should have no concerns about stuff like this.

"Fine, I'm going to go look through your desk."

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 01, 2015 06:06 PM (oVJmc)

92
Posted by: Uncle Busyhands at August 01, 2015 06:05 PM

should have asked to look thru her purse.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at August 01, 2015 06:06 PM (ODxAs)

93
The ghouls were Reaganites.

Really?

Posted by: Summer Slam Soothsayer at August 01, 2015 06:06 PM (veb4i)

94
Purple Haze all in my brain
lately things don't seem the same.
act'n funny but I don't know why
'scuse me while I kiss this guy.

Posted by: Pyro Maniac at August 01, 2015 06:07 PM (1DBBI)

95 87 Eman,

Was that series the one where women would wear clear clothing because why not?
Posted by: Chupacabras at August 01, 2015 06:04 PM (QFjNO)

If I recall correctly, look for a book called "Slant" by Greg Bear.

Posted by: eman at August 01, 2015 06:08 PM (MQEz6)

96 Mrs. Chupacabras watched one of those celebrity wife swap shows and it was Roddy and Ric Flair.

The difference in their worldviews was stunning. Piper would have made a pretty good Moron.

Posted by: Chupacabras at August 01, 2015 06:08 PM (QFjNO)

97 How to disable Telemetry and Data Collection in Windows 10

http://preview.tinyurl.com/olmhbt5

Posted by: Grover's at August 01, 2015 06:08 PM (tgoun)

98 Doesn't sound familiar, I must be thinking of a different series.

Posted by: Chupacabras at August 01, 2015 06:09 PM (QFjNO)

99 This is why I uninstalled Waze from my iPhone when Google bought them out. Yes, it is a great app for getting around in Atlanta traffic but who needs to let Google know where you are every minute of the day?

Posted by: Beeblebrox has 2 Heads at August 01, 2015 06:15 PM (5UnPC)

100
98 Doesn't sound familiar, I must be thinking of a different series.
Posted by: Chupacabras at August 01, 2015 06:09 PM (QFjNO)

I just checked and I think that is not the right one.

Dang, can't remember it.

Posted by: eman at August 01, 2015 06:16 PM (MQEz6)

101 How to disable Telemetry and Data Collection in Windows 10

Unfortunately, that's a registry hack. I'm betting that the first batch of Windows updates that comes through will restore the original entry in the registry. Now, where'd I put that damned tin foil...

Posted by: Uncle Busyhands at August 01, 2015 06:17 PM (Dwehj)

102 I upgraded from 7.

LITTLE did I know it required a login password from my (new) MS account by default. I didn't use the login screen for Windows 7. I keep my passwords on my PC so I don't have to remember them. I was locked out of my PC after upgrading and literally had to hack my way back in (creating a media disc, boot from that, access cmd prompt, get my shit). I don't need/want a password to use my own computer. I don't want to be compelled (or strongly encouraged, repeatedly) to log into MS.

I turned off/opted out of the data collecting crap (there was a lot). Cortana will never work for me--not worth it.

I'm probably going back to 7 soon.

Posted by: Stan at August 01, 2015 06:17 PM (zqN5+)

103 Posted by: Beeblebrox has 2 Heads at August 01, 2015 06:15 PM (5UnPC)

Right-o. The cell phone companies will just be arm-twisted into sharing their info.

Posted by: Golfman at August 01, 2015 06:18 PM (48QDY)

104 Like a damned fool, I opted for the Win 10 download. I've decided I don't want it. Hope they don't force me to install it. Screwed myself again.

Posted by: Ronster at August 01, 2015 06:18 PM (47wTX)

105 Ronster, disable automatic updates. That might stop it.

Posted by: rdbrewer at August 01, 2015 06:19 PM (Iyg03)

106 NO. I miss XP. Funny the Navy is paying millions to keep it.

Posted by: Nip Sip at August 01, 2015 06:21 PM (0FSuD)

107 59 Be prepared for a Google Microsoft merger.

GooSoft?

eeeew.
Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 01, 2015 05:50 PM (oVJmc)

You'll never get any goo if it's soft.

Posted by: Buzzion at August 01, 2015 06:21 PM (B0dON)

108 rdbrewer, I need to get some updates to keep my computer half way safe. Guess I could always get them myself like I have in the past.

Posted by: Ronster at August 01, 2015 06:22 PM (47wTX)

109 Gotta love that "Well, if you've got nothing to hide..." shtick.

"No reason to wear clothing anymore then, right?"

Posted by: JeanQ Flyover at August 01, 2015 06:22 PM (rhjQp)

110 "This is ironic. Just last week I had a "progressive" coworker declare that if we have nothing to hide, we should have no concerns about stuff like this. I didn't even bother with the futile rebuttal."

Many people who say that are iniquitous perverts who are aware that their particular perving is on the Approved list of the current regime.

Posted by: Dr. Charles Forbin at August 01, 2015 06:24 PM (bGLSw)

111 Obama care medical records? So I went to a Dr that I hadn't seen in a while.

Nurse hands up a list of drugs, four years old, that she wants to confirm I am still taking.

Why is a Multi vitamin now a drug

Posted by: Nip Sip at August 01, 2015 06:24 PM (0FSuD)

112 Nothing to hide?

Show me all your pictures. Your credit card statements. Your bank statements...

Posted by: doug at August 01, 2015 06:24 PM (wmbzs)

113 Can you buy a new laptop, get it wiped slick, and have Windows 7 installed?

Posted by: Butch at August 01, 2015 06:25 PM (HLx1C)

114
It's gonna be real funny when Google and Microsoft go in the "data privacy" software biz, too.

Posted by: Summer Slam Soothsayer at August 01, 2015 06:25 PM (veb4i)

115 Nothing to hide?

Barack, show me your college and law school transcripts.

Posted by: doug at August 01, 2015 06:26 PM (wmbzs)

116 Gotta love that "Well, if you've got nothing to hide..." shtick.

Yeah, the attitude is sort of brings to mind Germany in the late 1930s.

Posted by: Uncle Busyhands at August 01, 2015 06:26 PM (Dwehj)

117 Pretty soon somebody is going to make a genuine AI

NEVER. GONNA. HAPPEN.

There is Rocket Science and then there is Space Cadet Shit. AI is Space Cadet Shit. Like the fear that Nano replicators are going to turn us all into green goo - it is a groundless goblin with no attachment to reality.

Posted by: An Observation at August 01, 2015 06:26 PM (ZX/XV)

118 Can you buy a new laptop, get it wiped slick, and have Windows 7 installed?

Sure.

Posted by: Uncle Busyhands at August 01, 2015 06:28 PM (Dwehj)

119 Just checked my Windows update log. There have been four attempts since the 29th to download 10. For some reason, I know not what, they've failed. Even with auto-update turned on. I just turned if off to make sure.

Posted by: doomed XP at August 01, 2015 06:29 PM (bGLSw)

120 Looks like I'll be keeping my Windows 7. I'm not interested in those dickheads getting more of my info than they already do.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 01, 2015 06:30 PM (mx5oN)

121 @113 Yes, you can wipe a new computer's HD and install Win 7.

You could even do it yourself. Dereks Boot and Nuke (dban.org) will wipe a disk clean. Free.

Note: HD can be wiped. SSDs can not. (Reason is complicated.)

You'll have to buy a copy of Windows 7.

Posted by: doug at August 01, 2015 06:31 PM (wmbzs)

122 116 Gotta love that "Well, if you've got nothing to hide..." shtick.

Yeah, the attitude is sort of brings to mind Germany in the late 1930s.
Posted by: Uncle Busyhands at August 01, 2015 06:26 PM (Dwehj)

Or modern-day policing in 2015 America.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 01, 2015 06:31 PM (mx5oN)

123 #62
Not me, if they would have or came out tomorrow saying the NSA was shut down the whole thing would just move to some other government agency.
But as we see private company's are digging for the same information.

Posted by: Skip at August 01, 2015 06:32 PM (e3Z5/)

124 NEVER. GONNA. HAPPEN.

There is Rocket Science and then there is Space Cadet Shit. AI is Space Cadet Shit. Like the fear that Nano replicators are going to turn us all into green goo - it is a groundless goblin with no attachment to reality.

Posted by: An Observation

I think there are too many unknown unknowns to make a prediction right now one way or the other.

Neural network computers are still in the toddler stage.

Yes, it may just end up like the Chinese Machine rubric, but the output may be indistinguishable from the real thing.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at August 01, 2015 06:33 PM (VY8H5)

125 Really, if you have Android, expect it to be compromised. Hangouts is a vector. MMS is a vector. There are others.

What's a vector? Serious question.

(Victor)

Posted by: Blano at August 01, 2015 06:34 PM (w1ewr)

126 There is Rocket Science and then there is Space Cadet Shit. AI is Space Cadet Shit.

Never say never.

Posted by: Hymie the Control robot at August 01, 2015 06:35 PM (W5DcG)

127 Hey, you guys, guess what?

My new copy of Win7 Pro 64 bit arrived today in the mail.

When I get my twin 1TB HDDs in a couple of days, Greasy-Fast Pig is going to be up and running again. Faster.

Posted by: rdbrewer at August 01, 2015 06:35 PM (Iyg03)

128 I just checked my g-mail account... It's an account I don't use... In fact, the reason I opened it in the first place was just to play a prank on someone. (long story)

I've used my hotmail account for almost 20 years without a single problem.

Now, I don't know how "Senator Bernie Sanders" got my g-mail address, but the in-box was chock full it.

As if I were interested.

So, that just goes to show what Google is all about.

Posted by: franksalterego at August 01, 2015 06:35 PM (Fh+WR)

129 Can it really be this bad?
As described, no business would consent to use Windows lest its private data be compromised.

Posted by: pst314 at August 01, 2015 06:36 PM (T4dRn)

130 Now, I don't know how "Senator Bernie Sanders" got my g-mail address, but the in-box was chock full it.

$$ + ideology = unsolicited emails from Bernie

Posted by: Uncle Busyhands at August 01, 2015 06:38 PM (Dwehj)

131 Just a question. Why bother with Windows anything when you can have a bulletproof UNIX box? Mac Minis are cheap.

I run them for all my company's digital signage installs because these systems run night and day 365 days a year, hanging on the Internet and installed in places where there is no user to monitor the machine.

Never a problem.

With Win digital signage installs, they quickly get infected with all manner of malware so we gave up on that route about 4 years ago.

Posted by: Beeblebrox has 2 Heads at August 01, 2015 06:38 PM (5UnPC)

132 Yup..it's just like 1917 or 1934 or 1975....whether in the old CCCP, or The Reich or in the RSVN they used us for our knowledge, abilities, skills and servitude and once they were in power they rounded us up and shot us, jailed us or starved us to death.

The next 20 years the results will be the same.

Posted by: Zombie Cadre Member at August 01, 2015 06:38 PM (JG47A)

133 I already have a W7 disc I bought years ago. I'm a bit askeered of wiping a hard drive and installing W7. I am confused by stuff more complicated than a hammer.

Posted by: Butch at August 01, 2015 06:39 PM (HLx1C)

134 I keep my passwords on my PC so I don't have to remember them.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Get "Last Pass" it is a wonderful password manager. You can check it. Seems impressive to me. Works with just about all browsers. Even they don't store you access password. They can't answer subpoena as they don't keep a record or back door.

Posted by: OTB at August 01, 2015 06:39 PM (7lhoQ)

135 Can it really be this bad?

As described, no business would consent to use Windows lest its private data be compromised.

If that business is already using Office365, what's left to compromise?

Posted by: Blanco Basura at August 01, 2015 06:39 PM (bZQB+)

136 What's a vector? Serious question.

(Victor)

Posted by: Blano

A potential souce/path of malware. Taken from medicine, aka vector of a pathogen.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at August 01, 2015 06:40 PM (VY8H5)

137 Windows Vista FTW! Seriously, I need to switch to linux. Acrobat and Office are the only thing keeping me. I need to do some testing with VM and that to see if the switch can be relatively painless (work computer).

OT: prayer request to those that do for friends MIL attacked by pitbulls. Both municipal and tribal cops seem uninterested, so media is getting involved.

Posted by: rebel flounder at August 01, 2015 06:40 PM (Vf5rR)

138 Yeah, libertarians are nutbags. Keep telling yourselves that.

Posted by: rickl at August 01, 2015 06:40 PM (sdi6R)

139 I'm so far behind technologically, I gave up even trying to keep up.

I'm disturbed though that my desktop and laptop update each other through Microsoft (I assume).

How does one disconnect your devices from Microsoft?

Thanks if you can help.

Posted by: Blano at August 01, 2015 06:41 PM (w1ewr)

140 84 Anyway, my assertion is that new Mirosoft Office is qualitatively different in ways that can't be compensated for with any amount of learning.
Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug at August 01, 2015 06:02 PM (/f6Nd)

It's way different than say, Office 2007. Not much different than 2013 or even 2010. Stupid damn ribbon. And they apparently took out the drawing canvas, which I used all the time. At least Clippy was melted down for scrap long ago.

Posted by: Agent J at August 01, 2015 06:42 PM (ueOgE)

141 As described, no business would consent to use Windows lest its private data be compromised.

Supposedly, the Enterprise edition does not collect this information.

Posted by: Uncle Busyhands at August 01, 2015 06:42 PM (Dwehj)

142 Thanks weft.

Posted by: Blano at August 01, 2015 06:42 PM (w1ewr)

143 You don't have to create a "Microsoft account", you can create a local only account, and that will stop much of the data collection. Now, they try to force you into creating one, but you can opt out by carefully watching what you're doing during the install.

If you stick with all the defaults during installation, then all your data belong to MS. But you can opt out of most of that shit.

This is what we get for all this "free shit" they're offering. They make money off you by giving you "free shit" and said shit then spies on you and they sell that data.

By accepting the free shit, you're making yourself a data whore.

Posted by: publius (not Breitbart publius) at August 01, 2015 06:42 PM (dvuhZ)

144 Are they re-making Tombstone now?
Or is there a sequel coming out soon?

The original has been on cable (different channels) for a couple weeks now.

Posted by: Chi at August 01, 2015 06:43 PM (Te2JU)

145 I'm doing a Win10 upgrade even now and it's a clusterfuck. I downloaded the iso and burned a DVD, but you can't install from that because you don't have a key. The Webz tells me that I have to upgrade in place first, then I will have a key that allows clean installs.

Good thing I have spare drives to work with so, install Win7 on spare drive, activate, then go through the inplace upgrade crap. Oh, and can't "upgrade" from the media I already burned, you have to reuse the get-software app which means going back out to the MS servers that are being slammed by everyone and his cousin right now.

Geez.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 01, 2015 06:43 PM (rwI+c)

146 @125 "What's a vector? Serious question."

Attack vector. E.g., for the "Stagefright" Android bug, a properly formatted MMS message is an attack vector.

The Hangouts app, as normally configured, will process incoming messages in the background with the stagefright library, without any user interaction. The malformed message may be deleted and never seen by the user, but the stagefright message evaluation will allow the device to be compromised.

Suggest reading http://zd.net/1VTSgwv

Posted by: doug at August 01, 2015 06:44 PM (wmbzs)

147 Just a question. Why bother with Windows anything when you can have a bulletproof UNIX box? Mac Minis are cheap.

I run them for all my company's digital signage installs because these systems run night and day 365 days a year, hanging on the Internet and installed in places where there is no user to monitor the machine.

Never a problem.

With Win digital signage installs, they quickly get infected with all manner of malware so we gave up on that route about 4 years ago.

Posted by: Beeblebrox

Oh, so 'Get a Mac.' Never heard that before. I'm sure we'll be able to settle the matter in seconds here on this thread in a calm, polite manner.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at August 01, 2015 06:44 PM (VY8H5)

148 Blanco @ 125

Roger, Roger. What's your vector, Victor?

Posted by: Chi at August 01, 2015 06:46 PM (Te2JU)

149 I signed up for the upgrade when it showed up on my computer a while back...a couple of days ago I read ya'll's comments and fortuitously did not proceed! Thank you, as already being an idiot I would have been doubly screwed. Thx again.

Posted by: rivahgurl at August 01, 2015 06:48 PM (YeHHx)

150 134 Get "Last Pass" it is a wonderful password manager. You can check it.

Posted by: OTB at August 01, 2015 06:39 PM (7lhoQ)

Seconded. Passwords are encrypted client-side using a master password which you should change regularly (of course!). It's free for desktop browsers on all platforms, but the company make its money by selling mobile versions.

Posted by: antisocial justice beatnik at August 01, 2015 06:49 PM (EHU9F)

151 Gardening thread up.

Posted by: Y-not at August 01, 2015 06:49 PM (RWGcK)

152 127 When I get my twin 1TB HDDs in a couple of days, Greasy-Fast Pig is going to be up and running again. Faster.
Posted by: rdbrewer at August 01, 2015 06:35 PM (Iyg03)

Once you go SSD, you'll never go back. I got a 480 GB SSD at Microcenter for about $170 a few days ago, only around 30 cents per gigabyte. Has roughly the "felt" effect of doubling the speed of the computer.

Posted by: Agent J at August 01, 2015 06:50 PM (ueOgE)

153 Some folks just refuse to learn how to do new things.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 01, 2015 05:38 PM (NaeCR)

-------

I assume this is sarcasm.

Anyway, my assertion is that new Mirosoft Office is qualitatively
different in ways that can't be compensated for with any amount of
learning.

Posted by: Semi-Literate Thug at August 01, 2015 06:02 PM (/f6Nd)
______________
Way late, but since the thread seems to have some life in it I might as well kill it.Sardonic.The most obvious new feature with every 'upgrade' from MicroSoft is rearranging all the fricken menus with a 'new look and feel' that adds zero practical value. The second feature is that they eliminated certain functions that any old users actually used routinely.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 01, 2015 06:52 PM (NaeCR)

154 Posted by: Chi at August 01, 2015 06:46 PM (Te2JU)

Roger.

Posted by: Golfman at August 01, 2015 06:52 PM (48QDY)

155 @152 Serious question: How will you securely erase your SSD if you ever want to sell it or retire it.

I guess a sledgehammer if you are going to retire it...

Posted by: doug at August 01, 2015 06:54 PM (wmbzs)

156 This thread is dead.

Posted by: Burnt Toast at August 01, 2015 06:55 PM (NaeCR)

157 Mammy didn't raise no sons dumb enough to take a "free" operating system from Microsoft. I disabled that upgrade crap toot sweet, my friend.

"You can turn it off, there's a guide."

In the basement of the Seattle city hall, in a filing cabinet behind a locked door that has a "Beware of the leopard" sign on it...

Posted by: mojo at August 01, 2015 06:56 PM (OmBeX)

158 Oh, so 'Get a Mac.' Never heard that before. I'm sure we'll be able to settle the matter in seconds here on this thread in a calm, polite manner.
Posted by: weft cut-loop at August 01, 2015 06:44 PM (VY8H5)

Good deal. I love hearing from people who hate Macs commenting in a thread about probably the worst MS Win distro so far.

So do tell. UNIX is bad because??

Posted by: Beeblebrox has 2 Heads at August 01, 2015 06:57 PM (5UnPC)

159 You don't have to create a "Microsoft account", you can create a local only account, and that will stop much of the data collection. Now, they try to force you into creating one, but you can opt out by carefully watching what you're doing during the install.

If you stick with all the defaults during installation, then all your data belong to MS. But you can opt out of most of that shit.

This is what we get for all this "free shit" they're offering. They make money off you by giving you "free shit" and said shit then spies on you and they sell that data.

By accepting the free shit, you're making yourself a data whore.

Posted by: publius (not Breitbart publius) at August 01, 2015 06:42 PM (dvuhZ)

Ok, but I already have the Microsoft account because I either didn't know better, or didn't how how to opt out.

How do I get out of it?

Posted by: Blano at August 01, 2015 07:02 PM (w1ewr)

160
Linux FTW

Posted by: Some random meathead at August 01, 2015 07:07 PM (nGvPM)

161 Thats why I prefer Apple's approach. Yes, they cost more, and hey limit what you can mess around with. But, included in that is more privacy. Apple doesn't have to care about what you're using your Mac or iPhone for; they got their money from you when ou bought it.

Posted by: ChrisValentine at August 01, 2015 07:08 PM (0N34i)

162 @155
I tend to format my old SSDs and hand them down to the kids. At end-of-life, I use the hammer-and-screwdriver method of secure disposal for all my mass storage.

Posted by: Agent J at August 01, 2015 07:09 PM (ueOgE)

163 For the unsure/non techies

Follow the instructions on the Ubuntu website on setting up dual boot with Windows.

Practice with Ubuntu until comfortable.

Slowly , Windows will fade from your memory....

Posted by: Some random meathead at August 01, 2015 07:11 PM (nGvPM)

164 At end-of-life, I use the hammer-and-screwdriver method of secure disposal for all my mass storage.
Posted by: Agent J

Here's a technique you may enjoy.
https://youtu.be/2sjBIkL0vec

Posted by: Prince Ludwig the Indestructible at August 01, 2015 07:12 PM (awspb)

165 Blanco @ 125

Roger, Roger. What's your vector, Victor?

That was Blano. Nice guy, lives not to far from your girlfriend.

Posted by: Blanco Basura at August 01, 2015 07:13 PM (bZQB+)

166 I'm a long time Apple user, but I think Linux is probably the best way going forward.

I haven't bought a new computer or upgraded my operating system in years, but it won't surprise me a bit if the next Mac upgrade does exactly the same thing that Microsoft is doing.

Posted by: rickl at August 01, 2015 07:13 PM (sdi6R)

167
Ok, but I already have the Microsoft account because I either didn't know better, or didn't how how to opt out.

How do I get out of it?

Posted by: Blano at August 01, 2015 07:02 PM (w1ewr)

These might help.

Install Windows 10 without a Microsoft Account

http://preview.tinyurl.com/pdhtxdw

Boot Windows 10 without logging in to Microsoft Account.

http://preview.tinyurl.com/nmn35sp

Posted by: B. Franklin at August 01, 2015 07:20 PM (zt+N6)

168 /off old guy that caused lots of trouble sock.

Posted by: buzzion at August 01, 2015 07:20 PM (zt+N6)

169 So maybe a lawyer Moron can explain to me why this isn't a Very Big Deal with companies who don't want MS to access all of their company secrets and intellectual property simply because they use MS Office in their office?

Why would a company's IT Dept ever upgrade?

Posted by: Lizzy at August 01, 2015 07:23 PM (NOIQH)

170 Just for grins: if you are serious about security and curious about Linux, try it out. It is quite simple.

My basic recommendation: get a used PC (anything approx. 5 years old, even) and download Ubuntu. You burn the ISO image (cdburnerxp is a good windows cd burning application-for free) and reboot the computer. It will offer to keep your Windows and install Ubuntu right alongside, easy. If you enable the "non-free" parts even your Adobe Flash Player will work right out of the box. Takes about 1 hour.

It's never been simpler, really. And if it's a used machine that nobody was using, well, even if you hate it, nothing lost.

Posted by: insertcl everna mehere at August 01, 2015 07:25 PM (vaZxb)

171 How will you securely erase your SSD if you ever want to sell it or retire it.

I know of a pricey but effective method.

Posted by: Ripley at August 01, 2015 07:27 PM (BNfgJ)

172 I upgraded a couple of PCs to Win 10 earlier this week after having run the technical preview since last year. I opted out of most of the data mining features during the installation (pay attention during the upgrade and don't accept 'Express Setup'). So far I like it, but I'm used to being on the bleeding edge of tech (which I do for a living). If you liked Windows 7 you'll probably like 10, but maybe give it awhile before upgrading so a few more of the 'teething' issues are resolved. One good thing in 10 is the new web browser (Edge) which seems to be able to handle Ace.mu.nu without choking one the ad content like other browsers I used previously. It needs some ad blocker add-ons still, but it's a good start.

Posted by: DiesIrae at August 01, 2015 07:40 PM (HB66j)

173 I see someone already gave some links on how to opt out. I'm still running XP (well, the x64 version), but I've installed Win7 and then played with 8/8.1, but I still use XPx64.

When I first installed Win8 (and I tried some on the betas in virtual machines), I figured out how to avoid the Microsoft account and continue with the normal local accounts. I hated the new Metro start screen crap, and that pretty much turned me off of worrying about any later upgrades. There were various Start Menu replacements, which I played with, but I haven't even booted 8.1 in ages.

I did download a Win10 beta/preview and was going to play with it in a virtual machine, but never even got around to it. I may play with the release of Win10, but I don't know.

I've read that an upgrade over a local-only Win8 installation will continue with the local-only account without even asking to create a new Microsoft online account, but I don't know firsthand, as I always do clean installs, rather than upgrades (just too dangerous, in my experience).

Posted by: publius (not Breitbart publius) at August 01, 2015 07:47 PM (dvuhZ)

174 131
Just a question. Why bother with Windows anything when you can have a bulletproof UNIX box? Mac Minis are cheap.

I have a Mac Mini that I dearly love, but it's too old to run anything beyond Snow Leopard (and I only upgraded to that when forced to by buying a new iPhone that required a new iTunes that wouldn't run under Leopard; I'm afraid to upgrade my iPhone from fear that it will require me to upgrade iTunes to a version that I had enough disagreements with to downgrade from).

Snow Leopard is really a step too far for this Mini. Back in the day, I could play WoW in a window while watching anime in another window, surfing the web, and running XP on Parallels to scan my bills (the MacOS version of my scanner's software sucks, as do the newer versions of the Windows software; I blame Carly Fiorina).

These days, my poor Mini can barely perform *one* of those tasks, thanks to the magic of software bloat.

One of these days, I really need to pony up the dough to buy a new Mini.

Posted by: Anachronda at August 01, 2015 07:49 PM (o78gS)

175 And you monkeys thought I was a villain...

Posted by: Ultron at August 01, 2015 07:54 PM (c/b2a)

176 When I first installed Win8 (and I tried some on the betas in virtual machines), I figured out how to avoid the Microsoft account and continue with the normal local accounts. I hated the new Metro start screen crap, and that pretty much turned me off of worrying about any later upgrades. There were various Start Menu replacements, which I played with, but I haven't even booted 8.1 in ages.

That was one of my problems with 8 and they claimed in 10 that the Start Menu was coming back. Yeah that's a lie. Sure its no longer a full screen piece of bull shit but they've just shrunk it down so its in the same space as the start menu was but its still all the windows 8 "layout."

About the only decent thing I've seen that they done is that the "apps" are no longer an automatic full screen so if you are running them they start as a full screen and you can only have 2 visible at a time. They now load as windows. Really the only app I used is Netflix so its not that big of a deal to me but its still nice that they did realize that you don't need things to automatically hog all the real estate of your screen on launch for a computer like you do for a 6 inch phone screen.

Posted by: buzzion at August 01, 2015 07:55 PM (zt+N6)

177 Nope, not upgrading. That's been true for a while, since I thought this was beginning a long time ago.

Typing this on a WinXP machine on a Cat5 wired home network (that is to say not wireless) behind two layers of firewall (this machine and the live-linux gateway box). Different flavors of firewall, too.

Camera is on a shelf overhead, ditto the mike; plug them in when needed (rarely). Bluetooth ? What's that ? Aint got none.

I have to manually allow any and all Javascript to load & run. Don't even have a Flash (or most any other) codec installed. Don't bank online. Don't pay bills online (paper check & snailmail). If you want my name & email address online you get phony ones, usually through a proxy server's IP.

Lots more. Been doing this a long time.

Does this inhibit my interaction with the internet ? Most assuredly it does.

Does this inhibit others from interacting with my hardware & data ? It seems to. Sure hope I'm right.

After all this, I have one further (and most important) step: I don't do anything on my computers that would harm me if it was made public anyway.

"Who steals my purse, steals trash"

Posted by: sock_rat_eez at August 01, 2015 07:59 PM (go6ud)

178 Duke Energy Progress is willing to pay me a whopping $25 per YEAR if I allow a device to be installed which allows THEM to turn the A/C off during peak periods.

They clearly do not understand our relationship.

They sell electricity. I buy it. When I receive the bill, it gets paid. Nuff said.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at August 01, 2015 07:59 PM (1ijHg)

179 If you liked Windows 7 you'll probably like 10, but maybe give it awhile before upgrading so a few more of the 'teething' issues are resolved. One good thing in 10 is the new web browser (Edge) which seems to be able to handle Ace.mu.nu without choking one the ad content like other browsers I used previously

Nope. Windows 10 is an improvement over 8. But 7 is still better and I have no plans to upgrade my desktop running 7. I see no noticeable difference between loading ace.mu.nu between Edge and Internet Explorer. And in fact Edge might be eating up more CPU and Memory on the site than IE does.

Posted by: buzzion at August 01, 2015 08:02 PM (zt+N6)

180 btw,

there is the 88 cents Jock itch stuff at Walmart (Pro-Ex), but the name brand costs up around 8 bucks.

Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at August 01, 2015 08:02 PM (1ijHg)

181 Question for Linux users. Played with a version on an old computer. Tried it on a older laptop to use Internet when traveling. Figured any virus would die when I shut it down. Couldn't make any of my programs on the hard drive work. Am I doing something wrong or would be out of luck using them if I went 24/7 Linux.

Posted by: OTB at August 01, 2015 08:09 PM (7lhoQ)

182 176: Don't get me started about the Metro "apps". The whole thing was a step backward, many steps backward, trying to make a desktop machine be a fucking smart phone. Full screen only? Back to the old single tasking days? Why anyone serious would even try that, I don't know. Maybe it's just the general dumbing down, LIVing of the population, I don't know.

Give me the ol' Win32 based programs (and the x64 equivalent). Fuck Metro (or whatever they call it, now, I think there was some threat of lawsuit over the name "Metro" and MS had to purge it from the lexicon).

And another thing. I've always been instinctively suspicious of any "online"/cloud-based crap where my data is going to sent out and stored on some behemoth company's server farms all over the world. Instinctively, I've avoided that like the plague. Hell, I live out in the country, and my nearest neighbor is out of range, but I avoid Wi-fi just about instinctively as well.

I used to be computer geek, but I find that again, instinctively, I'm a fucking Luddite for all this wireless/smart phone/device crap. Same way with social media. I want no part of that shit.

Posted by: publius (not Breitbart publius) at August 01, 2015 08:16 PM (dvuhZ)

183 Yeah they seem to have fixed that full screen only or "dual screen" option. I mean it makes sense for a smart phone or even a tablet. Hey for a touchscreen computer its not a bad idea either because you're using your finger to hit the stuff on the screen. But when you are using a normal computer and have a mouse and keyboard interface, you do not need an automatic full screen. You have enough fine tuned motor control with a mouse that you find smaller icons and links that full screen is not necessary.

Posted by: buzzion at August 01, 2015 08:24 PM (zt+N6)

184 Finally read all of the above after posting my screed .... I actually archive old drives after disposing of the box, for maybe 10 years. This has proved helpful a few times when we've found out that something wasn't transferred at the time. When absolutely sure they are without value, I like to reformat them with the 629, though a 12ga sabot slug is also good.

Posted by: sock_rat_eez at August 01, 2015 08:32 PM (go6ud)

185 CrossPost:HD can be wiped. SSDs can not.

All modern drives support secure_erase, you might have to boot into unix, fiddle plugs and use hdparm but you can get the firmware to put them back to factory. Unless they're bricked like 2 I've got parked now.

Posted by: DaveA at August 01, 2015 08:44 PM (DL2i+)

186 The 4th amendment is violated hundreds of times a day, probably thousands.

Because these constitutional violations have no DIRECT consequence, they do not happen.

To the extent there is a direct consequence, LEOs have an entirely human overpowering motivation to lie.

And judges have an entirely human motivation to ignore the lie, which they do every single day I will guess, except Saturdays ans Sundays.

The "Men In Blue" lie, and the "Men In Black" endorse the lie. If the question is allowed to get that far, which the politician/prosecutor quite consciously squelches through policy (plead guilty or else), it is smothered in hostile fact finding.

The ONLY solution is an independent constitutional assessment/ evaluation before the prosecution is allowed to proceed.

The 4th amendment is utterly dead, dead, dead. LEO knows that. Judiciary knows that.

Leftists are giddy with that.

Only "conservatives" who worship the men in blue are oblivious.

Posted by: Tonawanda at August 01, 2015 08:49 PM (tsTLZ)

187 I know tech changes cause a great deal of angst. I have to support a wide range of users and OS's and I hear it all the time. If you prefer Win7, great -- MS is still patching it and will for awhile to come. If you're still in love with XP I won't argue with you. However, you'll probably have larger problems than just sharing data with MS as it's not getting patched any further (maybe consider giving Ubuntu a try). As for the data mining, I'm actually fairly paranoid as well. Unfortunately, Google, Apple and Facebook are at least as bad and have been for sometime. Happy computing!

Posted by: DiesIrae at August 01, 2015 08:53 PM (HB66j)

188 Hell, I've been reading about doing a clean install of Win10. Bloody hell, if they haven't changed things, and it's going to make it difficult. They've changed the product key business a bit. The PC must be activated, and that activation is based on a unique identifier generated from your hardware.

This has been standard for some time, allowing the OS (or other software) to decide if things have changed too much and complain and refuse to load, but they're changing how it it's used.

That unique ID is now the actual key, somehow. That will be generated and set to MS and stored. Any subsequent activation attempts just check this ID with what MS has stored. If they match, you're good to go. If not, well, you've got problems.

So, (at least for the free upgrades), you've got to get that ID generated and sent to MS first. After that, you can do all the clean installs you want (on the same hardware), without even entering a product key.

But the trouble is getting that first ID generated, and that apparently requires an installation to be upgraded.

I'm reading a lot of crap on how it works, and I'm still not clear on a few things. I remember there was some trick about doing a clean install of Windows 8.1. You had to use some generic key to install it, then when you activated, you re-entered your old 8.0 key somehow (digging, I found I had saved the instructions with the .iso files).

But that has changed with Win10, dammit. What they're doing, of course, is making piracy more and more difficult, trying to make it harder and harder to fool the activation system.

Posted by: publius (not Breitbart publius) at August 01, 2015 09:06 PM (dvuhZ)

189 I choose Microsoft. They're not as obviously as in
bed with 0bama as Google and Eric Schmidt, and aren't rubbing my face in
rainbows like Apple and Tim Cook.

Posted by: Agent J at August 01, 2015 05:40 PM (ueOgE)

You can add Facebook to that list of tech fascists. If SMOD took them all out, the world would be a better place

Posted by: TheQuietMan at August 01, 2015 09:07 PM (DiZBp)

190 Oh, lovely. The new Win10 license is not transferable. THe old 7/8 licenses could be transferred to a new computer (as long as you deleted all traces of it from the old). That is not true with Win10.

So, I imagine a motherboard change (or significant enough other changes) are going to cause you some problems requiring you to buy a new license.

I remember reading some time ago they were going to start doing this shit, and it looks like it starts with Win10.

Posted by: publius (not Breitbart publius) at August 01, 2015 09:15 PM (dvuhZ)

191 "What exactly does Windows actually do for you in the first place? Why does anyone need it?"

Because thousands of Microsoft engineers are jacking off at the thought of being paid to endlessly invent new operating systems, new user interfaces, new everything. These kiddies don't give a flying feck about us.

Posted by: pst314 at August 01, 2015 09:16 PM (T4dRn)

192 The new Win10 license is not transferable.

At least with the free one. It's not clear if that's true for the purchased licenses.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at August 01, 2015 09:24 PM (rwI+c)

193 I've been using Windows 10 for three months now, and updated both my primary desktops with it's release last week. I did elect NOT to do the data collection. While I'm concerned about how they will market it in the future, I do like it over windows 8. Start Menu is back with the 8 and 8.1 metro tiles incorporated. Tying devices together has potential but I'm not so sure the benefit is going to outweigh the privacy concerns.

"What exactly does Windows actually do for you in the first place? Why does anyone need it?"

Right now? There are some fairly nice enhancements over some of the prior windows versions, but need isn't going to be an issue for most people right away. Eventually you may run into not being able to get and/or run an application you want off the windows store because it's not supported by older versions of windows. Creating windows store apps between 8.0 and 8.1 meant you needed to be running the OS you were creating the app for running on your development machine. Traditional desktop app development however is now getting some TLC with the WPF getting attention again. I guess bottom line Windows 10 is essentially what Windows 8 really should have been. MS hasn't completely changed course, but they have corrected the error in thought that everyone was going to quit using their desktops and just do everything on tablets and phones. 10 looks to be a much more unified experience across devices without alienating the desktop.

Posted by: thecoat at August 01, 2015 09:51 PM (wk3m0)

194
187 I know tech changes cause a great deal of angst.

I don't care about tech changes. I care about stupid tech changes. Like completely changing the toolbar for Office. Tell me, do you really need to see 15 different "styles" on the home bar of Word?

Or wanting to treat a full sized desktop or laptop like its a smartphone. I can think of a good anecdote for that. My sister had a Windows 8 laptop, it died. I was getting a new laptop and so I gave her my old computer with Win7. While setting it up I was complaining about 8 and she mentioned not really liking it either. And she brings up a coworker of hers who has a Windows phone. The coworker likes her phone and liked 8 on the phone. But she also had a computer with Windows 8. Did not like it at all.

Posted by: buzzion at August 01, 2015 09:52 PM (zt+N6)

195 Edge sucks and ace.mu.nu crashes it regularly. I've been running the beta for 6 months and see absolutely no reason for anyone to upgrade from 7. If you are running 8 though its not any worse, but not really any better either. Microsoft can go f itself especially after coming out with that Office 365 crap.

Posted by: freaked at August 01, 2015 09:54 PM (Z3aM0)

196 There is another peculiarity of Windows 10 that will be important to those living an Ace of Spades lifestyle. The little tile that you click on to get to your photos rapes your hard drive and displays random pictures that you have saved. So if you have something you don't want your kids or wife to see you are just out of damned luck sonny. That sucker pops up every time you hit the start button.

Consider this a public service announcement.

Posted by: Thatch at August 02, 2015 01:16 AM (pBZp4)

197 @131: Why bother with Windows anything when you can have a bulletproof UNIX box?

Because I have programs on my Windows 7 machine that won't run on Linux.

Posted by: NR Pax at August 02, 2015 08:59 AM (0RqPG)

198 Installed WIN10 and it was a buggy mess. Microsoft must have been watching because it sent an update, which made things a little better. Looked like WIN10 was not playing well with Chrome browser. so I uninstalled Chrome. Had to use Revo uninstaller to do so because Chrome refused to uninstall itself, and ran like total crap on WIN10.

Uninstalling Chrome made a huge difference. and WIN10 is now running very well.

Edge is highly counter-intuitive. Stuff is hidden. Took an hour to figure out where the bookmarks are stashed. The interface is meh. Not sure I like it; Epic Privacy Browser runs much better than Edge.

So after 48 hours of effort, I've got WIN10 running as well as WIN7 ran. The upgrade has proved to be usless, except as a marketing plan to cause me to buy an Apple computer next time.

Posted by: Michael Haz at August 02, 2015 09:36 AM (TaOuf)

199 48 Well.... you don't have to use the MS account. Just turn off the MS account and then it's like Windows 7 or 8.

I ask because I don't know. Where does turning off that account leave one with respect to future updates?

Posted by: Squints at August 02, 2015 09:49 AM (iUXoQ)

200 196 There is another peculiarity of Windows 10 that will be important to those living an Ace of Spades lifestyle. The little tile that you click on to get to your photos rapes your hard drive and displays random pictures that you have saved. So if you have something you don't want your kids or wife to see you are just out of damned luck sonny. That sucker pops up every time you hit the start button.

Consider this a public service announcement.

That can almost certainly be turned off - it can in windows 8, anyway.

Posted by: Rino in Name Only at August 02, 2015 10:07 AM (cNyo2)

201 Linux (Mint 17.2) for general use, and W2K for my image processing needs, because of all the antique software I own. I see no shortcomings with this mix.

Posted by: PersonFromPorlock at August 02, 2015 10:50 AM (U4QC6)

202 I'm still on 7 Professional and am getting pretty annoyed with them trying to sneak their little "Get Windows 10" icon into the system tray with every new set of updates. The little fucker re-appeared twice before I figured out how to both uninstall it and hide it from the Windows Update list.

Assholes.

Posted by: PD Quig at August 02, 2015 01:25 PM (N1WR3)

203 >I have Windows 8.1 which is OK, and I'll probably get 10 sometime this year. Probably will find on YouTube where to turn off the sharing, if it's not clear during installation. I don't see any upside for consumers to share data with 3rd parties.

You're presented with a bunch of checkboxes when it first boots up, most of which are of the form "you agree to allow Microsoft to do X." Uncheck them, then continue.

Posted by: salfter at August 02, 2015 02:29 PM (0gC2q)

204 No, I'm not upgrading. And that was a decision before I ever read your take. Simple reason - it updates whether you want to or not.

Posted by: Kathy Kinsley at August 02, 2015 08:24 PM (P1Mfe)

Processing 0.03, elapsed 0.0335 seconds.
14 queries taking 0.0113 seconds, 212 records returned.
Page size 133 kb.
Powered by Minx 0.8 beta.