Saturday Politics Thread: What About Mike Pence? [Y-not]

This week we're going to catch up on Mike Pence, governor of Indiana. His name is starting to pop up as a 2016 prospect and he certainly seems to have some of what it would take to be a credible Presidential candidate. I thought about adding in some others, such as Tim Pawlenty, but I doubt Pawlenty would garner much support here. So I'll do both a backgrounder and a "fiscal report card" on Pence this week and then we'll pick up where we left off on the issues list next time.

Here's a brief backgrounder on Governor Mike Pence courtesy of Ballotpedia:

Michael Richard "Mike" Pence (b. June 7, 1959, in Columbus, Indiana) is the 50th and current Republican Governor of Indiana. He is serving his first term, having won the seat in 2012. He ran unopposed in the Republican primary, and defeated former House Speaker John Gregg (D), Rupert Boneham (L) and write-in candidate Donnie Harold Harris in the general election on November 6, 2012.
Pence was sworn into office on January 14, 2013, and his term will expire in January of 2017.
From 2001 to 2013, Pence served as a Republican member of the U.S. House of Representatives. As a congressman, he maintained a record of staunch opposition to tax hikes and federal health care reform as outlined under the Affordable Care Act. His final year in the U.S. House, Pence was rated a "far-right Republican leader" based on an analysis of bill sponsorship by GovTrack.
Before entering politics, Pence built a resume covering a wide array of professions. His background includes working as an admissions counselor at his alma mater, Hanover College, as well as an attorney and a talk show host.

If you'd like to read more about him, the Indianapolis Monthly did a biopic on Pence when he assumed office.

Via the New York Times, here's a listing of recent stories in which Pence's name appeared. This one (from last month) caught my eye (emphasis mine):

EVANSVILLE, Ind. - The tarmac greeting between the president and a governor is something of a throwback to a bygone era of polite politics. Protocol dictates that partisanship is put aside - temporarily - and talk of issues avoided, in favor of a handshake and an exchange of pleasantries.
So President Obama may have been caught off guard Friday when Gov. Mike Pence of Indiana took advantage of the president's visit to button-hole him on a Medicaid dispute between his state and the federal government.
In a letter to Mr. Obama on Thursday, Mr. Pence, a potential Republican presidential contender in 2016, requested a meeting on the issue. On Friday, he got a chance to plead his case in person when he greeted Mr. Obama at the bottom of the steps of Air Force One here, where the president was traveling to hold a told a town-hall-style meeting on the economy at a nearby steel supply company.
The greeting - normally a 5- to 10-second affair - turned into a more than five-minute policy session, as Mr. Pence and Mr. Obama stood close, each speaking and gesturing animatedly while the commerce secretary, Penny Pritzker, who was traveling with the president, and Representative Larry Bucshon, Republican of Indiana, looked on.

Cut. Jib. Newsletter.

A brief summary of Mike Pence "On the Issues":

Pence has a lifetime score of 89% from the Heritage Foundation. In his last year in office, he voted against Heritage's position on a few issues. For example, Pence voted to keep student loan rates at 3.4% instead of returning them to their 2007 rate of 6.8%, a measure which Heritage opposed.

CATO gave him an "A" on their fiscal policy report card (you'll recall the other governors we're evaluating in depth each received Bs). Here's part of their glowing report of Pence's first two years in office (emphasis mine):

Governor Pence has been a champion tax cutter and frugal on spending. In 2013 he proposed a 10 percent cut in individual income tax rates, and the legislature agreed to 5 percent. The income tax rate will be phased down from 3.4 to 3.23 percent by 2017. He also approved a repeal of Indiana's inheritance tax.
In 2014 he signed into law a corporate income tax rate cut, adding to the reductions made by the prior governor Mitch Daniels. The rate had been scheduled to fall to 6.5 percent in 2015. Pence approved a further reduction to 4.9 percent, to be phased in by 2021.
[snip]
He signed off on a plan to phase out property taxes on business equipment over time. It allows local governments to end property taxes on new business equipment, while also allowing them to exempt businesses that have less than $20,000 of equipment. For 2015 he says that he wants to make tax simplification a top priority.
He has restrained spending growth. The general fund budget increased an estimated 1.9 percent in 2014, and Pence proposed a 2.8 percent increase for 2015. However, his support for Medicaid expansion under the ACA will increase state spending down the road.

So he supports Medicaid expansion in a state with a Republican legislature. I am not sure how CATO still manages to cough up an "A" for him.

**Update: As of last month, Pence and the Feds had not reached an agreement on Medicaid expansion.

Where does he stand on immigration? Well, in 2006, Heritage was touting his immigration reform plan:

"The Border Integrity and Immigration Reform Act is a bill that is tough on border security and tough on employers who hire illegal aliens, but recognizes the need for a guest worker program that operates without amnesty and without growing into a huge new government bureaucracy."
-Rep. Mike Pence

This plan was greeted with some skepticism:

He teases conservatives with a "free market approach" that sets up private companies as "Ellis Island Centers" in foreign countries, where applications from aliens for temporary work cards to work legally in the U.S. can be processed. The bill requires all illegals who seek legalization to self-deport back to their home countries for papers, in an effort to avoid the strong objections to amnesty. There would be no limits (even the Bush-Kennedy-McCain Senate bill has limits) set on the number of "guest workers" during the first three years, so that the market could establish the demand for cheap labor. The open-border lobby calls it "labor market equilibrium." The Pence plan says that "a reasonable limit…will be determined by the Department of Labor." The plan would cede congressional constitutional authority over immigration to a presidential appointee who could expand the number of immigrants by millions. The power to transform America irrevocably would be granted to a bureaucrat to be named later by a president to be elected later. How many voting, legalized immigrants does Pence think would be too many for a President Hillary?

(By the way, this editorial was written in 2006, but it might as well have been written today.)

Here's an article from May of this year reviewing Pence's "middle ground" approach to issues while he was in Congress, including a hard look at his 2006 immigration bill: (LINK FIXED)

Those who have followed Pence since he was in Congress may remember a third instance where he tried to split the baby on a contentious issue. In May 2006, as House Republicans stood against an immigration plan hostaed by Bush, John McCain, and Ted Kennedy, Pence gave a speech to the Heritage Foundation in which he outlined "a rational middle ground" between "amnesty and mass deportation."
Pence's proposal was an ambitious guest-worker program that essentially privatized a large part of immigration enforcement. "Private worker placement agencies that we could call 'Ellis Island Centers' will be licensed by the federal government to match willing guest workers with jobs in America that employers cannot fill with American workers," he said.
Like credit card companies and temp agencies, these companies will do all the required screenings "in a matter of days." There was a flicker of interest before feasibility questions arose. Would illegal immigrants really return home to apply to Ellis Island Centers? Wouldn't these private companies have a conflict of interest when it came to keeping anyone out? Wasn't this really amnesty by another name?
The Pence immigration plan went nowhere. Neither will his presidential bid if he acquires a reputation as someone who opposes liberal initiatives only to refurbish them as "market-based" versions of the same.

More recently, Governor Pence joined other governors in complaining to the White House about its handling of illegal alien children, calling for their speedy return to their families (in their home countries).

This is what Governor Pence had to say in response to a question about amnestyposed to him in August:

"I just always believe that we should not reward people with citizenship whose first act in this country was a violation of the law, and I continue to hold that view. But there's plenty of room here for compassion and there's plenty of room here for crafting a solution that will deal with this in the long term."

Hmmm. I would like to hear some reference to how kookoobananas it would be to flood the U.S. labor market with cheap workers while Americans are suffering. My guess is Pence is in line with a lot of the GOPers who want a greatly expanded guest worker program. That, coupled with what seems to have been a Rubio approach to immigration while he was in Congress, makes me very uncomfortable.

Finally, here are a couple of videos of Governor Pence. I looked for a CPAC speech, but it looks like he hasn't been there for several years (the last video I could find was from 2010). Here he is speaking at the NRA-ILA Leadership Forum last April in Indianapolis:

And here's a link to his appearance on Fox Business in which he talks about how Washington can control spending.

I hope I covered Pence thoroughly enough for you to get a feel for what he might be like as a Presidential candidate (and President).

For laughs, how about a poll to see who your favorites as potential POTUS candidates are thus far:

I could vote for most of these people without much reservation. Even the ones about whom I have some concerns would be light years better than any Democrat that is likely to run. I think I could vote enthusiastically for four of these candidates. I'll let you guess which four.

Finally, some housekeeping. To keep my workload manageable, I am planning on dropping coverage of Gowdy, who I really doubt will run, and replacing him with Mike Pence, who seems to be considering it. Let me know if that's ok with you folks... I may or may not listen!

Here are links to the previous threads from this series:

Walker, Jindal, Perry (August 30th)
Kasich, Haley, Martinez (September 13th)
Rubio, Paul, Cruz (September 20th)
Christie, Bush, Huntsman (September 27th)
Gowdy, Carson, Sessions & Bonus "Issues" Poll (October 4th)
Romney, Ryan, Palin, Huckabee (October 11th)
How we assess candidates (October 18th)
Fiscal policy scorecards (November 1st)
Economic "messaging" and stump speeches (November 8th)

Posted by: Open Blogger at 09:11 AM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Wow, read it and still first?

Posted by: wooga at November 15, 2014 09:11 AM (XK0dn)

2 Where is his throne built from the skulls of his opponents!

Posted by: fluffy at November 15, 2014 09:12 AM (Ua6T/)

3 Dammitt... I screwed up a link.

Lemmee try to find the right one re his middle ground approach.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:15 AM (7HV1Y)

4 I got nothing. The comment about Pence "buttonholing" Obama has me very confused and aroused.

Posted by: wooga at November 15, 2014 09:15 AM (XK0dn)

5 Walker.

I know Perry. He'll make a decent VP candy.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 09:17 AM (NZ1iB)

6 That poll is bullshit as it won't let me vote for SMOD as all three choices

Posted by: The Dude at November 15, 2014 09:19 AM (SyKbw)

7 Link fixed to that article referring to his "middle ground" approach.

My take on Pence after my research is that he was Marco Rubio before Marco Rubio. That 1996 immigration episode bothers me a lot.

He's still better than a Democrat, but he seems to be a "we can manage our way out of problems" type.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:20 AM (7HV1Y)

8 Just skimming the "Issues Vote Quiz", what's not to like?
The weakest one I saw was the opposition to staying out of Iran - he may just mean with troops and not firepower.

Posted by: Golfman in NC at November 15, 2014 09:20 AM (4IzCi)

9 Barry is a classless bitch. He doesn't deserve any respect

Posted by: TheQuietMan at November 15, 2014 09:21 AM (3UGBQ)

10 What exactly is his stand on "the shirt" and the oppression of womyn?
Anal Sex?
Hollaback?
Kim K's a$$?

/important questions of the day

Posted by: anon a mouse at November 15, 2014 09:21 AM (gXRIG)

11 SMOD is performing surprisingly poorly in the Poll.

AtC must be asleep.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 09:21 AM (AGPMH)

12 Mike Pence has Very Presidential Hair.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:22 AM (rwI+c)

13 I can't figure out why CATO gave him an A given the Medicaid expansion thing.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:23 AM (7HV1Y)

14 Where's he stand on saving us from the scourge of tampons?

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 09:23 AM (MMC8r)

15 "SMOD is performing surprisingly poorly in the Poll.
"

Well, Hellary vs. SMOD?

I'll vote for the yellow dog on the Constitution Party ticket.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 09:23 AM (NZ1iB)

16 Mike Pence has Very Presidential Hair.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:22 AM (rwI+c)

But is he taller than Hillary/Fauxcahontas/anyone else the Dems are likely to run? Inquiring minds want to know.

Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 09:24 AM (ThxKk)

17 Anyone who is still dealing with Obama as if he is a rational person just with a difference of opinion is a fool in my book and I am unable to work up any respect for them.

And Pence has done some cringe worth stuff in the past (cringe worthy conservative wise) so let's not get all excited because comparatively he looks like a reasonable person.

Obama is a crypto Muslim infiltrator inflicted upon us by a cabal of terrorists both domestic and foreign for the purpose of the diminution of American influence in World Finance, World Commerce and Military power.

He has achieved his goal if he were to quit today. But he still has 2 more years to inflict more irreparable damage to the political infrastructure and the American psyche.

Anyone who thinks they can negotiate with this terrorist has a blurred view of reality.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 09:25 AM (KK+mC)

18 Last week Y-Not was speculating that someone like Evan Bayh may run as the sane democrat in 2016. After the past week I'd add another name to look for: Howard Dean.

I don't know that he has a prayer but he's been saying things since the election that make too much sense for a former DNC chair.

Posted by: Nigel West Dickens at November 15, 2014 09:27 AM (HstNY)

19 I don't care.
Vote all the democrats out, and vote in all republicans and see if that makes a difference.

Then vote all the republicans out and vote in all democrats.

Or just ignore the circus. Everyone says they are afraid of clowns anyway.

Posted by: Marvin the Mechanical at November 15, 2014 09:27 AM (7uJsG)

20 So much for he Republicans' "bench." I don't see ONE candidate who doesn't need a little nose-holding to support.

There's still time, fortunately, Some of these could man up over the next year or so and energize people like me who have simple criteria for a President.

Those in Congress will have lots of opportunity to show that they are qualified, the reelection of Bitch McConnell and Johnnie Boner to leadership positions notwithstanding. But anyone -- anyone -- who doesn't consistently stand up to Choom Boy on immigration, national defense and foreign policy will, AFAIC, be off the list. Forever.

Posted by: MrScribbler at November 15, 2014 09:27 AM (PoKIA)

21 "Anyone who thinks they can negotiate with this terrorist has a blurred view of reality."

Just quoting and repeating for effect.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 09:28 AM (NZ1iB)

22 I am planning on dropping coverage of Gowdy, who I really doubt will run, and replacing him with Mike Pence, who seems to be considering it. Let me know if that's ok with you folks... I may or may not listen!

We demand more coverage of Gowdy at the expense of all other candidates.

Posted by: The Rowdy Gowdy Party at November 15, 2014 09:28 AM (MMC8r)

23 But is he taller than Hillary/Fauxcahontas/anyone else the Dems are likely to run? Inquiring minds want to know.
---

So that's interesting. He *is* shorter than Obama. (Also, his wife is not hawt.) I wondered if he was shorter than the others so I looked for pix of each of them next to Obama. Turns out Walker, Perry, Jindal are all shorter than Obama. I assume Martinez and Haley are, too. Can't remember if I found Cruz next to O.

So O must be tall.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:28 AM (7HV1Y)

24 " After the past week I'd add another name to look for: Howard Dean."

I think you're right. Howie's been spouting off. Against Obamacare of all things.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 09:30 AM (NZ1iB)

25 I'm not sure we'll make it to an election. Not because the idiot in the White House will take over but because the whole thing is going to fall apart before that.

Posted by: oldgeezer at November 15, 2014 09:31 AM (Y6I8M)

26 So much for he Republicans' "bench." I don't see ONE candidate who doesn't need a little nose-holding to support.
--

So who are your top three from that list?

My top three might surprise you guys: Haley, Jindal, and Cruz. Perry is my fourth.

In terms of trust, Cruz is the guy for me. But I think he may not run and I know ppl have concerns about his experience.

I think Perry is a little damaged. I think Jindal or Haley would run better campaigns and give better interviews, speeches, and debate performances.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:31 AM (7HV1Y)

27 Didn't Pence quit the 2008 or 2012 race because his wife said no?

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 09:33 AM (KK+mC)

28 Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right? He might make a great President but he is unelectable.

Posted by: Anon at November 15, 2014 09:33 AM (Rp4lh)

29 Whoever we finally select, let's hire Jon Gruber to sell them to the electorate.

Dude has a proven track record.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 09:35 AM (AGPMH)

30 "
Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right?"

Fcuk.

He's got my vote already.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 09:35 AM (NZ1iB)

31 his freedom index congressional score card based on the constitution is 62%

http://www.thenewamerican.com/freedomindex/profile.php?id=P000587

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl 110 days until spring training at November 15, 2014 09:36 AM (u8GsB)

32 I think Jindal or Haley would run better campaigns and give better interviews, speeches, and debate performances. Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:31 AM

You might be right. But the reason they "would run better campaigns" is their relative invisibility beyond their fan base. That's especially true of Jindal, who is so low-key (and, realistically, an unknown quantity) that anything he says or does leaves little or no impression.

Posted by: MrScribbler at November 15, 2014 09:36 AM (PoKIA)

33 Against Obamacare of all things.
--------

And a few days before that he said that the democrats had lost the people because they had stopped focusing on "lunch bucket issues".

Posted by: Nigel West Dickens at November 15, 2014 09:36 AM (HstNY)

34 His net worth went from $15k at the age of 45 to $211K at the age of 53. The "Comparatively, the American citizen experienced a median yearly decline in net worth of -0.94%" disclaimer not withstanding, he's done normally well, and does not appear to be grafting excessively.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:36 AM (rwI+c)

35 You've been doing great wok re politics lately.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 09:37 AM (DmNpO)

36 Truman didn't have a degree.

But Obama did.

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 09:37 AM (MMC8r)

37 "You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right?"

I didn't know that prior to you mentioning it.
Thanks

*Moves Walker up two positions on list*

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 09:37 AM (AGPMH)

38 President Obama is 6'1" - so I guess that means all our candidates are midgets?

Posted by: TiminAL at November 15, 2014 09:37 AM (xD5h5)

39 Oh, and my top three, all of whom can easily excise themselves from the list if, in typical Republican fashion, they show signs of going Democrat-Lite or pushing for Good Optics when dealing with Choom Boy: Perry, Cruz, Haley.

Posted by: MrScribbler at November 15, 2014 09:38 AM (PoKIA)

40 Fuck the issues - does he wear a Gunner Girls T-shirt?

Posted by: Montezuma's Revenge at November 15, 2014 09:39 AM (hAdu/)

41 >>Didn't Pence quit the 2008 or 2012 race because his wife said no?

No, that was Mitch Daniels.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:40 AM (7HV1Y)

42 I'm Walker, Cruz, Gowdy. Gowdy is the question mark/dark horse. Will he sell to a mass audience? If he connects, the sky's the limit.

Posted by: Lincolntf at November 15, 2014 09:41 AM (2cS/G)

43 Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest
level of education is a high school degree, right? He might make a great
President but he is unelectable.

Posted by: Anon at November 15, 2014 09:33 AM (Rp4lh)

And that, kids, is why you should finish college- if you start it, anyway. Because, who knows, you might want to run for President someday, and somebody will come out of the woodwork saying a candidate isn't viable without a degree. Because the over-educated idiots currently in charge are doing such a good job.The LIVs have enough 'reasons' not to vote for Walker. Somehow, I don't think the lack of a degree is going to push many people over the edge. Most of them will do what the MSM tells them to do anyway.

Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 09:42 AM (ThxKk)

44 I don't see where a College Education is a qualifier. If the guy has been elected to public office and serves his constituents well, the College Degree, or lack thereof, makes no difference. I want a guy that governs best for the people.

Posted by: TiminAL at November 15, 2014 09:42 AM (xD5h5)

45 So that's interesting. He *is* shorter than Obama. (Also, his wife is not hawt.) I wondered if he was shorter than the others so I looked for pix of each of them next to Obama. Turns out Walker, Perry, Jindal are all shorter than Obama. I assume Martinez and Haley are, too. Can't remember if I found Cruz next to O.So O must be tall.
Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:28 AM (7HV1Y)

But I bet they can all beat him at basketball.

Posted by: buzzion at November 15, 2014 09:43 AM (zt+N6)

46 i don't care if my president doesn't have a college degree.....

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl 110 days until spring training at November 15, 2014 09:43 AM (u8GsB)

47 O/T

Someone was mentioning IDF shirts earlier?

http://tinyurl.com/kpea7c2

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 09:43 AM (AGPMH)

48 And the list of highly-successful businessmen without college degrees is a real corker.

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 09:43 AM (MMC8r)

49 That's especially true of Jindal, who is so low-key (and, realistically,
an unknown quantity) that anything he says or does leaves little or no
impression.
---

Did you watch the clips I posted of Jindal? Dude has a baritone voice and forceful delivery.

Jindal needs better suits, but he is very memorable when he speaks. Watch that clip of him after the governors met with Obama this year. Awesome.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:44 AM (7HV1Y)

50 Hopefully Gowdy won't run. We need him in the congresss.

Posted by: Soona at November 15, 2014 09:44 AM (0oHg9)

51 I'm holding out for the sweet sweet sleep of death from asphyxiation due to all the carbon dioxide being combined with all the oxygen from the flaming gigantic planetoid that is at this very moment aimed directly for the East Coast.

And if I were any of the leaders for any of the factions represented in Ferguson I would tell everyone to cool the fcuk out and surprise the pants off the whole nation.

You all in Ferguson understand that the rest of the country fully expects you to show your "ethnic roots" and "cultural mores" by rioting, looting and otherwise making worse your own homes? (yes I understand there are outside agent provocateurs there but the DOJ doesn't have that many people)

Surprise us all by showing how "civilized" and reasonable you can be; STAY HOME.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 09:44 AM (KK+mC)

52 Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 09:42 AM (ThxKk)

Well said - and much better than I did.

Posted by: TiminAL at November 15, 2014 09:44 AM (xD5h5)

53 Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:40 AM (7HV1Y)

Ah, thanks. I knew someone would know.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 09:45 AM (KK+mC)

54 Had dinner with Pence a few months ago. Nice enough guy. Not a lot of charisma but not a total wet blanket like that sweater vest wearing politician guy that pops up every now and again. Doesn't strike me as an alpha leader.

Posted by: NCKate at November 15, 2014 09:46 AM (U98jm)

55 I'm Walker, Cruz, Gowdy. Gowdy is the question mark/dark horse. Will he sell to a mass audience? If he connects, the sky's the limit.

****

We need him as Speaker or, perhaps better, as AG. That said, should he run, he's got that streak of Mr. Smith in him, the honesty, but without the naivety, that will sell with a lot of people.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 09:46 AM (DmNpO)

56 The guest worker program sticks in my craw. Paying people not to work and then importing people to work just pisses me off.

Posted by: no good deed at November 15, 2014 09:46 AM (w3a0Z)

57 28 Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right? He might make a great President but he is unelectable.

Posted by: Anon at November 15, 2014 09:33 AM (Rp4lh)
----------
Actually, he completed 3 years at Marquette then went on to the "School of Life" where he received a graduate degree in "Political Science, County Executive style" then got his doctorate in "Governorship, three times elected!".

By the way, have we seen Obama's transcripts? Oh that's right, we haven't because Obama didn't they were "material"

Posted by: WisRich at November 15, 2014 09:46 AM (xWQFH)

58 "http://tinyurl.com/kpea7c2"

That is a sweet site.......

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 09:47 AM (NZ1iB)

59 Pence looks like a real warm guy. A regular Putin.

Posted by: Mr. Practical at November 15, 2014 09:47 AM (lPdaT)

60 How thoroughly brilliant.

Let's raise the minimum wage and then talk about the demands for "cheap" labor!

That's not a market based approach! The entire system is corrupted by the borg-leviathan style distopian overcontrol that's been slowly leeching the life out of the supposedly free market for years by regulatory manipulations!

Posted by: emmy lou's shoes at November 15, 2014 09:47 AM (XAGDQ)

61 Mike Pence has been (for me anyway) one of those guys who seems to have been flying under the radar for a long time, but from what I've heard and seen AND from that handy-dandy chart up there, is looking pretty good as a possibility.

We could do a hell of a lot worse and maybe - maybe - not much better?

At least it's good to know we do have options within the conservative sphere.

Obviously Jebba the Huntsman, Schmuckabee and Krispy Kreosote are total non-starters

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2014 09:49 AM (CMkNk)

62 I think that so many are fed up with the elitists coming out of the Ivy League that they want to see someone with fire in their belly and their best interests at heart take a shot at it.

I would love to see him run.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 09:49 AM (DmNpO)

63 Walker, that is.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 09:49 AM (DmNpO)

64 The balanced ticket is Christie/Cruz, which reads to our roman catholic friends from the south, Christ Cross.

Posted by: Mr. Practical at November 15, 2014 09:49 AM (lPdaT)

65 No Ben Carson? Racist.

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 09:50 AM (MMC8r)

66 47 Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 09:43 AM (AGPMH)

I
like the one that says 'My job is so secret, I don't even know what I'm
doing'. Maybe that's Obama's problem! You'd think ValJar would have
clued him in sometime over the past six years.

*ponders sending a case of those t-shirts to the WH*

Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 09:50 AM (ThxKk)

67 College is quickly becoming a bust. It's not held in the high esteem that it once did.

Walker will do fine as far as that's concerned.

Posted by: Soona at November 15, 2014 09:50 AM (0oHg9)

68 That said, should he run, he's got that streak of
Mr. Smith in him, the honesty, but without the naivety, that will sell
with a lot of people.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 09:46 AM

I simply want to see Gowdy DO something before I'd consider him "Presidential."

It's all too easy for members of Congress to talk. Hell, Nanzi Pelosi does that. Put up an important piece of legislation, work to get it through, mobilize resources to pass it again with a 2/3rds majority when Choom Boy vetoes it. Then we'll talk about your aspirations.

Oh, and I'd like to see the prospective candidate from Congress stand up and publicly say "nossir. No Bitch McConnell or Johnny Boner for me!"

Posted by: MrScribbler at November 15, 2014 09:51 AM (PoKIA)

69 Having roomed with college students and over the years had to deal with many at many levels of business, I'm not so sure that a college degree is the recommendation it used to be.

HR's love to use it because they adore paper trails and paper qualifications (another reason why the US is falling behind the rest of the world imo.)

But colleges seem to bypass any instruction in reasoning and reality perception. They spend a lot of time arguing and positing hypothetical questions or for changes in institutions and policies with no track records or even studies to back up their claims.

And, of course, they are hotbeds of anti capitalist, anti americanist and anti masculinity.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 09:52 AM (KK+mC)

70 Pence sounds pretty decent, but SMOD is still my first choice.

Posted by: rickl at November 15, 2014 09:52 AM (sdi6R)

71 Humongus/Toady'16

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:53 AM (rwI+c)

72 Humongus/Toady'16: He'll grant you free passage through the wasteland.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:54 AM (rwI+c)

73 College is quickly becoming a bust. It's not held in the high esteem that it once did.

Walker will do fine as far as that's concerned.

****

With the job market for kids in the tank for years, they've made a career of out of a college education. Having a degree used to set one apart in a crowd. That's no longer the case.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 09:54 AM (DmNpO)

74 Oh, I thought you meant Curt Gowdy.

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 09:54 AM (MMC8r)

75
Unfortunately, Conservative Review only lists House and Senate members. Good site, but that is a flaw.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2014 09:54 AM (CMkNk)

76 69
I'm not so sure that a college degree is the recommendation it used to be.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 09:52 AM (KK+mC)

An Ivy League degree should be an automatic disqualification for elective office.

Apologies to Richard Fernandez, but they have done enough damage to the country.

Posted by: rickl at November 15, 2014 09:55 AM (sdi6R)

77 72 Humongus/Toady'16: He'll grant you free passage through the wasteland.
Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:54 AM (rwI+c)

Emil Minty/Boomerang '16

Grunts and Headaches for You, bad kid!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2014 09:55 AM (CMkNk)

78 SMOD not at 100%? I don't even know you people anymore.

Posted by: Anonymous Scandi Hobo who doesn't want to be turned into jerky at November 15, 2014 09:56 AM (lYMVn)

79 Humongus/Toady'16: He'll put an end to this horror.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:56 AM (rwI+c)

80 The first thing we should do is line them all up on a ball field and watch them throw a baseball. If any of them throw like a girl they should be immediately eliminated as unworthy to lead this country. Would have saved us some trouble the last 2 elections.

Posted by: dartist at November 15, 2014 09:56 AM (ahBY0)

81 78 SMOD not at 100%? I don't even know you people anymore.
Posted by: Anonymous Scandi Hobo who doesn't want to be turned into jerky at November 15, 2014 09:56 AM (lYMVn)

It got neutered by that ESA probe, so there.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2014 09:57 AM (CMkNk)

82 Wez/Golden Youth for teh ghey vote.

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 09:57 AM (MMC8r)

83 Late Breaking Slider'16

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:57 AM (rwI+c)

84 Dropping Gowdy and adding Pence? Huh?

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 09:57 AM (ZPrif)

85 "That is a sweet site......."

I say that. Tried to buy me a shirt. They're giving me shit about me card.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 09:58 AM (NZ1iB)

86
London Boy 1/London Boy 2 '16

Chicks dig the pants.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2014 09:58 AM (CMkNk)

87
Emil Minty = Feral Kid.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2014 09:59 AM (CMkNk)

88 "No Ben Carson? Racist."

Had that conversation with a very good friend who actually is a family and professional acquaintance of Dr Carson.

It all boiled down to "The" question.

If he were white, would we be giving him a second look?

My friends pained answer was "No" due to total lack of any governing experience.

And she recognized the racial component of looking at him twice due to the color of his skin.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 09:59 AM (AGPMH)

89 >>College is quickly becoming a bust. It's not held in the high esteem that it once did.

I disagree, gauging from all the parents who insist it is my problem that their kid has taken out student loans.

But more on point, look what the media did to Palin's college education story. Instead of it being about a person who worked her way through school, transferring but ultimately completing her degree, it was "look at this dumb yokel."

Look at Perry's story. "OMG he got a D in a course [Organic Chemistry] most people don't even take!!!"

Now you can say the Media hated them for other reasons, but they attacked him over their educations.

Do the media hate Walker? You bet your ass they do.

They will make an issue of his failure to complete his degree.

Does Walker have the charisma to overcome that on a national stage? I'm not convinced he does. It's not why he's down some on my list, but in terms of campaigning, I don't see what others see.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:59 AM (7HV1Y)

90 I can't say that I'm a committed fan of Scott Walker for President, but his lack of a college degree does not bother me in the least. In fact, it's probably a resume enhancer. Much like Palin, I'd like to see real people run for office for a change.

Posted by: Havedash at November 15, 2014 10:00 AM (G1XMn)

91 Would have saved us some trouble the last 2 elections. Posted by: dartist at November 15, 2014 09:56 AM

If Haley throws like a girl, I'm okay with that.

What would have really saved us a whole shit-ton of trouble during the last two elections would have been a solid dose of truth and transparency.

Posted by: MrScribbler at November 15, 2014 10:00 AM (PoKIA)

92 Listen, this whole college degree is a nothing burger, really. Once the liberal press finishes their collective gasp "No college degree!!" then try's to ask a "gotcha" question about it, the whole things falls apart. Walker would destroy this talking point in about 30 seconds.

Posted by: WisRich at November 15, 2014 10:01 AM (xWQFH)

93 >>Dropping Gowdy and adding Pence? Huh?

There's been no indication Gowdy is considering a run. I literally could not find a stump speech by Gowdy when I looked for one. He didn't even have to campaign this time his district is so safe.

A lot of people think Pence is running.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 10:01 AM (7HV1Y)

94 They're giving me shit about me card. "

Maybe they don't trust leprechauns?

Now give me your Luck Charms.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 10:02 AM (AGPMH)

95 "I say that. Tried to buy me a shirt. They're giving me shit about me card."

Got it figured out. Shirt on the way.

Shalom.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 10:03 AM (NZ1iB)

96
If he were white, would we be giving him a second look?

No, of course not. And we shouldn't, any more than we should consider a good singer or a brilliant sculptor or a gifted engineer or inventor.

What we really need is an efficient technocrat. What we wind up with is usually the best politician.

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 10:03 AM (MMC8r)

97 Look at Perry's story. "OMG he got a D in a course [Organic Chemistry] most people don't even take!!!"

Organic makes even the chemistry majors cry. It's hard as hell from what I've been told.

Posted by: Insomniac at November 15, 2014 10:03 AM (AVWYi)

98 Rand Paul? Marco Rubio?

Posted by: Motionview at November 15, 2014 10:04 AM (ePnKH)

99 The second crispy creme theory emerges as VP Cruz becomes president and Gowdy elected VP by the House. Happy now?

Christie's in play because you have to give NE conservatives and indys something.

Posted by: Mr. Practical at November 15, 2014 10:04 AM (lPdaT)

100 "Despite what some may think in Washington D.C., our state governments are not territorial outposts of the national government."

Good speech by Pence.

Posted by: All Hail Eris at November 15, 2014 10:04 AM (QBm1P)

101 And we're kind of forgetting about how "Mellow Yellow" and the "Turdle" will probably have destroyed any Republican chances by then with their brain dead telegraphing their moves. Moves which were lame to begin with but having revealed them to their (unacknowledged)enemy thus rendering their efficacy beyond moot.

Will their be anyone (especially conservatives) that will be willing to chance a vote for Republican President after seeing these two incredulous idiots surrender to The Occupant for two years?

It will take a miracle for me to vote GOP at this point and they're just TALKING about what they're going to do.

It's like watching a redneck standing on a river bank saying "hold my beer and watch this". You know it's not going to end well for anyone.

Blood will most likely be spilled and that the only good thing will be that we will be entertained by the depths of stupidity and cupidity shown by all the participants.

The country, of course, will continue it's slide to disaster and ruin. While these bitches argue over who's fault it is or voting on a "Cisnormative Patriarchy Dissolution Day" petition.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:04 AM (KK+mC)

102 "Got it figured out. Shirt on the way. "

Which one?

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 10:05 AM (AGPMH)

103 Marco Rubio?

His political death at such an early age was tragic.

He will be missed.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 10:05 AM (rwI+c)

104 the goal should be the reagan electoral map. nothing less.

Posted by: Mr. Practical at November 15, 2014 10:05 AM (lPdaT)

105 Please,
anything but Mexican Beer, Light Beer, or Potted Meat Product version of a Presidential candidate...

Posted by: Blannket Sales Skyrocket at November 15, 2014 10:06 AM (/WmRg)

106 Anybody got a bottle of water? I'm parched!

Posted by: Marco Rubio at November 15, 2014 10:06 AM (AVWYi)

107 If Haley throws like a girl, I'm okay with that.

I'd be willing to bet she could still beat out mom jeans in office. Some girls don't throw like girls.

Posted by: dartist at November 15, 2014 10:06 AM (ahBY0)

108 They will make an issue of his failure to complete his degree.

Does Walker have the charisma to overcome that on a national stage? I'm not convinced he does. It's not why he's down some on my list, but in terms of campaigning, I don't see what others see.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 09:59 AM (7HV1Y)

That would be easily remedied if one of the candidates whose college record is being challenged asks the question of what the record of our current Ivy League president contains.

Posted by: Jen at November 15, 2014 10:06 AM (hjTr7)

109 Motionview,
The ones I'm doing in-depth analyses of were ones who polled well here at HQ. Paul and Rubio did not make the cut. They were covered and discussed in earlier threads.
Links at the bottom of the post.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 10:06 AM (7HV1Y)

110 Great job Y-not.

Right now I'm all about the governor's. My candidate of choice has to have experience.

So for now its Walker, Perry and Hailey.

Posted by: tbodie at November 15, 2014 10:07 AM (8oSoU)

111 His political death at such an early age was tragic.

He will be missed.

--

heh

Yeah, it really looks like Pence did what Rubio did... in 1996.

He resuscitated himself, but it's taken a long time. And I still worry about him.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 10:08 AM (7HV1Y)

112 If for no other reason, college is a good place to stash a lot of kids until they are wise enough to stay out of prison.

Posted by: Mr. Practical at November 15, 2014 10:08 AM (lPdaT)

113 Rand Paul?

No thanks.

Posted by: Nigel West Dickens at November 15, 2014 10:08 AM (/nR7C)

114 "Which one?"

"IDF" Dark green.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 10:08 AM (NZ1iB)

115 Jeb Bush?
I forget why he fell off the list.

Posted by: m at November 15, 2014 10:09 AM (G891H)

116 I'm betting that shirt-seller is absolutely swamped.

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 10:09 AM (MMC8r)

117 >>Christie's in play because you have to give NE conservatives and indys something.

All three of them?

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 10:09 AM (7HV1Y)

118 If for no other reason, college is a good place to stash a lot of kids until they are wise enough to stay out of prison.

We're working on that. - feminist everywhere.

Posted by: tbodie at November 15, 2014 10:10 AM (8oSoU)

119 Rand Paul? Marco Rubio?

Posted by: Motionview at November 15, 2014 10:04 AM

No. And hell no.

Also: Ixnay. Nuh-uh. Nevah. No way.

Posted by: MrScribbler at November 15, 2014 10:10 AM (PoKIA)

120 OT, but whoa!

OT but whoa!

On Saturday, Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper rebuffed Vladmir Putin over the Russian leader's meddling in Ukraine. "I guess I'll shake your hand," Harper said, "but I have only one thing to say to you: You need to get out of Ukraine."

http://t.co/mfpUI5Ikjc

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 10:11 AM (DmNpO)

121 "IDF" Dark green.

Nice.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at November 15, 2014 10:11 AM (AGPMH)

122 I remember there was a lot of excitement about Pence on this site while he was in the House. I imagine the governor's mansion was a move to burnish his credentials. He's alright, but not the top of my list. He's kept such a low profile, it's easy to forget about him. But he looks and sounds presidential.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:11 AM (Y92Nd)

123 If Haley throws like a girl, I'm okay with that.

I'd be willing to bet she could still beat out mom jeans in office. Some girls don't throw like girls.
Posted by: dartist at November 15, 2014 10:06 AM (ahBY0)

Nikki Haley shoots like a girl. And I admire it.

http://tinyurl.com/kh4rh6p

Posted by: Jen at November 15, 2014 10:11 AM (hjTr7)

124 He got a D in organic chem? Damn, I better not use *him* to cook my meth. Now, can we move on to skills a President will actually use?

Posted by: hugh hewitt at November 15, 2014 10:11 AM (Yc4/E)

125 If we could get a candidate named "Free Taco Dinner!", we'd never lose..

Posted by: Montezuma's Revenge at November 15, 2014 10:12 AM (hAdu/)

126 Sock off. Anyway, hugh hewitt already has a meth connection

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at November 15, 2014 10:12 AM (Yc4/E)

127 Harper's the water boy for Team America. It's none of his business what happens in Ukraine.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:13 AM (Y92Nd)

128 Rand Paul would make a good Boardwalk Empire Senator. He of the ridiculous hair belongs in the 1920- 30's. Oh that's right, the right already had it's Rand Paul in Charles Lindberg.

Posted by: Mr. Practical at November 15, 2014 10:13 AM (lPdaT)

129 It's nice that Pence doesn't want to expand EbolaCare.

Does he want to get rid of it or "fix" it?

It's pass/fail, Mike.

Posted by: eman at November 15, 2014 10:14 AM (MQEz6)

130 At the height of its influence, the State with the highest number of KKK members was - Indiana. I always kinda scratched my head over that one.

Posted by: akula51 at November 15, 2014 10:15 AM (R5qgD)

131 Something to keep in mind; 16 Senators have made the leap to President and the majority of there time in office was MEH.

Some were notable disasters (Nixon and Johnson) and one PR President (Kennedy) so the facts about him are obscured by the rose colored glasses worn by all the historians who write about him.

So I'm inclined to go with someone who is a bit more partisan and has a bit more executive experience in re; running a Government from the top.

I'm open to total naifs but that depends on their charisma and with the MFM, we're not going to see these guys too clearly for a while.

If they were running today and were the nominee, I'd vote for Walker and maybe Cruz. No one else has done as much real damage to the establishment and/or the Unions and/or the Democrats.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:16 AM (KK+mC)

132
His net worth went from $15k at the age of 45 to $211K at the age of 53. The "Comparatively, the American citizen experienced a median yearly decline in net worth of -0.94%" disclaimer not withstanding, he's done normally well, and does not appear to be grafting excessively.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 09:36 AM (rwI+c)

So unlike the Donks, who have taken to heart the unofficial East India Company motto "If you're too stupid to steal FROM the company, you're too stupid to steal FOR the company."

/hat tip to one of you reprobates who I can't remember.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at November 15, 2014 10:17 AM (TIIx5)

133 Harper's the water boy for Team America. It's none of his business what happens in Ukraine.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:13 AM (Y92Nd)
I think a certain segment of Ukrainians would say it's the business of every decent person in the world. Harper may not be able to /do/ anything about Putin's presence in the country, but he's willing to stand up and verbally oppose Putin, which is more than Team America is doing right now.

Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 10:17 AM (ThxKk)

134 Well, Nixon was a VP as well...

Posted by: --- at November 15, 2014 10:18 AM (MMC8r)

135 Yeah those Bear bombers that keep buzzing Canadian airspace are none of Harper's concern either.

Posted by: Nigel West Dickens at November 15, 2014 10:18 AM (Ktnum)

136 Perry, Jindal, Martinez, Bush, Walker, Christie, Rubio, Paul, Kasich, Pence, Snyder, Haley, Sandoval... Does that sound about right? I don't know that Snyder or Haley have much of a national organization, or Martinez, who seems reluctant to run for national office, but she would make lib heads explode.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:18 AM (Y92Nd)

137 His net worth went from $15k at the age of 45 to $211K at the age of 53

If you are going to hide most of your money overseas it's not smart to over do it.

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at November 15, 2014 10:19 AM (zauWW)

138 Posted by: akula51 at November 15, 2014 10:15 AM (R5qgD)

Go visit Gary. (jk)

Indiana is a very schizo state. NW is Black, Democrat, Machine pols while the rest of the state (excepting Indianapolis and some college towns) is redneck farmers.

But mostly I'd guess it's proximity to Detroit and Chicago and not just because of Black migration. Remember that the KKK was an equal opportunity hate group. They didn't like Jews, Catholics or Revenooers.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:20 AM (KK+mC)

139 126 Sock off. Anyway, hugh hewitt already has a meth connection
Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at November 15, 2014 10:12 AM (Yc4/E)

You know who this benefits?

Posted by: Walter White at November 15, 2014 10:20 AM (AVWYi)

140 Eighteenth look at Jon Huntsman!

Posted by: Montezuma's Revenge at November 15, 2014 10:20 AM (hAdu/)

141 Does Pence make it 15 or 20 potential candidates now?

Posted by: Thin veneer of civility at November 15, 2014 10:20 AM (XzRw1)

142 Harper's the water boy for Team America. It's none of his business what happens in Ukraine.

****

Well having the balls to say something beats the fuck out of Obama's pleas on the part of "climate change".

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 10:20 AM (DmNpO)

143 It's very sad that we have Harper in Canada during the Obama era. Harper's political heroes are Reagan and Thatcher. Harper loves America.

This should be a golden age of American-Canadian relations and cooperation as we become energy superpowers together.

But we have an anti-American, fascistic prog in the White House. Obama treats Harper like dirt.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 10:21 AM (ZPrif)

144 130 At the height of its influence, the State with the highest number of KKK members was - Indiana. I always kinda scratched my head over that one.
Posted by: akula51 at November 15, 2014 10:15 AM (R5qgD)

Indiana is next to Illinois. Firebreak in the segregationist past.

Posted by: Mr. Practical at November 15, 2014 10:21 AM (lPdaT)

145 rational middle ground" between "amnesty and mass deportation."

There is no such thing.

The MexiCannon - fire it or ride it.

Posted by: DaveA at November 15, 2014 10:22 AM (DL2i+)

146 In office for all those years and only 211K at age 53?

He must have been snorting coke off of hooker's asses..

Posted by: Montezuma's Revenge at November 15, 2014 10:22 AM (hAdu/)

147 common core support? that craps important to a lot of people. you might want to include it in the future.

Posted by: Vote Lord Humungus 2016 at November 15, 2014 10:23 AM (xTO7r)

148 That Jeb fellow has some mighty fine creases in his trousers.

Posted by: D. Brooks at November 15, 2014 10:23 AM (XzRw1)

149 133 First, Ukraine's borders are always changing. They are having a civil war and dragging Russia into it. Second, playing poke the bear at the instigation of the west is a dumb idea. I have as much sympathy for the Ukes as any other winners of Darwin awards.

Our government needs to stop funding color revolutions and investing in Ukrainian gas companies and fund the Keystone pipeline instead. How about that, cowboy?

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:23 AM (Y92Nd)

150 Harper's the water boy for Team America. It's none of his business what happens in Ukraine.

--

Bullshit. He's the head of a G8 country and NATO member.

Russia has invaded Ukraine and threatening to invade NATO allies.

Anyone NATO head of state who doesn't care what Russia is doing would be an idiot.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 10:23 AM (ZPrif)

151 30. Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right?"
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2014 09:35 AM (NZ1iB)
*****************************
That brings a certain level of purity, don't it?

How about Walker/Pawlenty? Now there's a sleeper ticket for you.

Posted by: I lurk, therefore I amn't at November 15, 2014 10:24 AM (cr0Pu)

152 Pence might turn out to be the establishment's pick. They've been telling us for years that we need a governor as candidate. Pretty sure he planned this path with help from others.

Walker can use Mike Rowe's help on the trail that Romney refused and talk about teaching marketable skills in schools.

Posted by: OldDominionMom at November 15, 2014 10:24 AM (Vp1dQ)

153 There's going to be a 'z' in someone's name, somewhere on the ticket.

For the Hispanic children, of course.

Posted by: akula51 at November 15, 2014 10:24 AM (R5qgD)

154 They are having a civil war and dragging Russia into it.
--

More bullshit. Russian invade Ukraine.

That's not a civil war -- and everyone knows that.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 10:25 AM (ZPrif)

155 107
Some girls don't throw like girls.

Posted by: dartist at November 15, 2014 10:06 AM (ahBY0)

Elena Kagan.

*cough*

Posted by: rickl at November 15, 2014 10:26 AM (sdi6R)

156 I updated the Medicaid section of the post with a couple of links.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 10:26 AM (7HV1Y)

157 28 Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right? He might make a great President but he is unelectable.
Posted by: Anon at November 15, 2014 09:33 AM (Rp4lh)

Alternatively, Walker escaped the Soviet indoctrination gulag just in time.

These days getting a college degree proves how stupid you are.

Posted by: eman at November 15, 2014 10:27 AM (MQEz6)

158 Putin skips out of G20 early after "tense" meeting with David Cameron.

http://t.co/LZlNtqV4nj

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 10:27 AM (DmNpO)

159 No love for Paul Ryan here, I see.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:27 AM (Y92Nd)

160 Elena Kagan.

Posted by: rickl at November 15, 2014 10:26 AM (sdi6R)

And some girls LIKE girls who throw like girls.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:28 AM (KK+mC)

161 He might make a great President but he is unelectable.
--
Yet he keeps winning elections. Weird, huh?

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 10:28 AM (ZPrif)

162 Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:23 AM (Y92Nd)

Civil war? You have accepted the Russian propaganda.

And those straw men are teetering....better go prop them up with more data from Pravda.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2014 10:28 AM (Zu3d9)

163 159 No love for Paul Ryan here, I see.
Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:27 AM (Y92Nd)

Yes, no love for the squishy phony.

Posted by: eman at November 15, 2014 10:28 AM (MQEz6)

164 Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:27 AM (Y92Nd)

Eddie Munster shot himself in the foot last year with his "Budget" and his Amnesty Love.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:29 AM (KK+mC)

165 Pence might turn out to be the establishment's pick. They've been
telling us for years that we need a governor as candidate. Pretty sure
he planned this path with help from others.
---

Yeah, I kind of agree.

There is something to be said for going with someone who has NOT been the lightning rod for hate. So that gives Pence and edge over Walker.

But Haley has not been a lightning rod for hate except from the GOP old boys in her own state and she seems to be more of a conservative.

And, personally, I think Jindal is the smartest of the governors we're considering. He's come a long way from that disastrous SOTU rebuttal. I think he'd be a strong candidate.

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 10:29 AM (7HV1Y)

166 No college degree?
Years ago, hell - decades ago, we said "Don't confuse college with knowledge."

Still true.

Posted by: Purveyor of Ruin at November 15, 2014 10:29 AM (cr0Pu)

167 Hey! >>Over here<<

Posted by: Paul Ryan at November 15, 2014 10:29 AM (XzRw1)

168
That's not a civil war -- and everyone knows that.
------

If you want to really understand who you're talking to, ask her who really tried to kill Reagan.

Posted by: Nigel West Dickens at November 15, 2014 10:30 AM (Ktnum)

169 I'd vote for Pence if he survived to the preezy election.

He'd be lightyears better than any Dim/Prog/Com.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, International Double-Naught Cat Speculator at November 15, 2014 10:31 AM (0HooB)

170 One thing with Walker; they can't find any skeletons. They've tried and they've even tried to manufacture a few and failed.

Only HS Grad? That's half the country. And it's the working half.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:31 AM (KK+mC)

171 161 He might make a great President but he is unelectable.
--
Yet he keeps winning elections. Weird, huh?
Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 10:28 AM (ZPrif)

Yeah, and in Wisconsin, too.

It's like he can persuade people to have faith in him and grant him some power.

If a man like Walker isn't electable, then all of us are wasting our time here.

Posted by: eman at November 15, 2014 10:31 AM (MQEz6)

172 Personally I can't wait for the spectacle known as the Republican Presidential Debate. It will be quite a circus again I'm sure.

Posted by: Thin veneer of civility at November 15, 2014 10:32 AM (XzRw1)

173 Yeah, and in Wisconsin, too.

****

And with the power of the entire Dem/Union machine against him.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 10:32 AM (DmNpO)

174 149 Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:23 AM (Y92Nd)

Ukraine's borders keep changing because the USSR/Russia keeps taking bites out of it. And nothing says that Russia /has/ to intervene in whatever internal nonsense Ukraine is going through. Putin's doing because no one is stopping him.

I never got to see the first round of the Cold War. Looks like I'll be getting another chance.

Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 10:33 AM (ThxKk)

175 Really, the only thing with Walker is that I don't think he wants to run. For whatever reason.

Of course THAT'S a qualifier also.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:33 AM (KK+mC)

176 172 comments in and nobody has asked the most important question about Mike Pence:

Does he have daughters, and if so, are they hot?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2014 10:33 AM (Zu3d9)

177 149

We fought to keep western europe in our sphere of influence. With Russia hulking over them and the Turks to their east, the europeans need reassurance we are there for them. These folks have been playing the game of thrones for a longer time than we, and will make alliances to survive that might exclude the US. The Turks beating up our Navy was a big deal symbolically, another sign of our decline. There's a reason that piece of furniture you prop your feet on is called an Ottoman. Look up Sept 11 1683 or if you prefer 7-11.

Posted by: Mr. Practical at November 15, 2014 10:34 AM (lPdaT)

178 176 172 comments in and nobody has asked the most important question about Mike Pence:

Does he have daughters, and if so, are they hot?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2014 10:33 AM (Zu3d9)

*cowers in shame and skulks away into the shadows*

Posted by: eman at November 15, 2014 10:35 AM (MQEz6)

179 Walker not having a kollidge degree only enhances his resume for me. As someone mentioned upthread, we should have regular people in charge.

These Ivy Leaguers have done such a wonderful job...*eyeroll*

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, International Double-Naught Cat Speculator at November 15, 2014 10:35 AM (0HooB)

180 I'll say again; anyone allowing Democrat Operatives to be moderators at any debate they participate in will get and automatic pass from me.

It's just too stupid a move.

I may allow it if they vociferously protest and give the Dem Flack some extra shit during the debate.

I want a fighter for a President, who'll fight lies and liars and shines a light on those who are and those who support those who are.

Sure there needs to be some negotiation and that takes compromise but their are lines to be drawn and you don't show your cards until the deal is done.

Unlike the Yellow Boner and The Snapper.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:37 AM (KK+mC)

181 160
And some girls LIKE girls who throw like girls.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:28 AM (KK+mC)

And I like girls who like girls who throw like girls.

Seriously. I constantly keep falling for women who are playing for the other team. It's been a recurring theme in my life, to the point where I just have to laugh about it.

Posted by: rickl at November 15, 2014 10:38 AM (sdi6R)

182 I like Cruz. A lot.
Not sold on him as President; he could sure bring a lot to DoJ.

I don't like elected folks quitting partway through their term. I regard that as breaking a promise, and a demonstration of being attracted by the next 'shiny thing.' That does not speak well, to me, for their dedication and stick-to-it-tiveness. I question their dedication to what they've espoused when they decline to see it through.

Being requested by the President to fill a critical role is another matter...

Posted by: Unblinded by the Light at November 15, 2014 10:40 AM (cr0Pu)

183 154 "Ukraine"has only existed since 1991, and is intensely divided along lines of language, culture, historical identity, religious affiliation, attitudes toward Russia and real and perceived economic interests.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:41 AM (Y92Nd)

184 We could do a lot worse than Pence, but I think we could also do a lot better. Walker, Haley, and Perry are my picks, Jindal rounds out my top 4. Why yes, I do prefer my nation's government be led by people experienced at governing.

Posted by: mugiwara at November 15, 2014 10:41 AM (06U11)

185 >>> Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right?

Quick, get us another ivy leaguer.

Posted by: fluffy at November 15, 2014 10:41 AM (e99xS)

186 180 Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at November 15, 2014 10:37 AM (KK+mC)

Best debate ever would be one where there was an automatic timekeeper and the questions were simply flashed up on a tv screen for the candidates and the audience. Professional bouncers would be standing by to make sure no one goes over the time limit or gets too rowdy. No moderator needed.

(Actually, the best debate ever would be a round of boxing followed by a question and answer between candidates- no substitutes allowed. Sort of like chess boxing. Only, I don't think the rest of the country would go for it.)

Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 10:42 AM (ThxKk)

187 "the goal should be the reagan electoral map. nothing less."

Good grief, the next candidate will be lucky if they flip either Ohio or Florida.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 15, 2014 10:42 AM (BXkFh)

188 >>And, personally, I think Jindal is the smartest of the governors we're considering. He's come a long way from that disastrous SOTU rebuttal. I think he'd be a strong candidate.
Posted by: Y-not

At this point, I keep coming back to him as the best choice of the list. I've heard him speak in person and he is actually pretty impressive.

Posted by: Aviator at November 15, 2014 10:43 AM (3rrMW)

189 Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:41 AM (Y92Nd)

You are welcome to facts, but it is considered tacky around here to make them up as you go along.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2014 10:43 AM (Zu3d9)

190 Listen up whacko birds, it's going to be Jeb and you WILL vote for him.

Posted by: Karl Rove at November 15, 2014 10:44 AM (XzRw1)

191 (Actually, the best debate ever would be a round of boxing followed by a question and answer between candidates- no substitutes allowed. Sort of like chess boxing. Only, I don't think the rest of the country would go for it.)
Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 10:42 AM (ThxKk)
-----------
Rollerball primaries!

Posted by: All Hail Eris at November 15, 2014 10:44 AM (QBm1P)

192 I heard John McCain is planning another go at it...my friends...

Posted by: IC at November 15, 2014 10:45 AM (0gm5y)

193 Sure, the Russian invasion of Ukraine is just a civil war. Of course it is. It's the old One Country Sends Columns of Tanks Into Another Country type of civil war.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 10:45 AM (ZPrif)

194 168 Hinckley was a close personal friend of the Bush family, and Bush stood to gain the presidency. Motive. Did a madman believe Jodi Foster would give up carpet for him after he assassinated the president, or did powerful people want their guy who lost the nomination in the White House?

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:46 AM (Y92Nd)

195 Posted by: lowandslow at November 15, 2014 10:42 AM (BXkFh)

Both, or he will lose.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2014 10:46 AM (Zu3d9)

196 I don't like elected folks quitting partway through their term. I regard that as breaking a promise, and a demonstration of being attracted by the next 'shiny thing.' That does not speak well, to me, for their dedication and stick-to-it-tiveness. I question their dedication to what they've espoused when they decline to see it through.

That sounds like a dig against Sarah Palin, who was lawfared out of office by baseless and frivolous accusations of wrongdoing.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, International Double-Naught Cat Speculator at November 15, 2014 10:48 AM (0HooB)

197 "Ukraine"has only existed since 1991, and is
intensely divided along lines of language, culture, historical identity,
religious affiliation, attitudes toward Russia and real and perceived
economic interests.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:41 AM (Y92Nd)
Sounds kind of like the US, except for the '1991' part, and I don't see anyone here saying that we should allow Russia or any other country to wander across our borders with tanks, etc.

Posted by: right wing whippersnapper at November 15, 2014 10:48 AM (ThxKk)

198
I think the immigration issue is soon going to become a moot point for all the potential candidates, other then future border security.

Pence seems above average to me as far as the say 15 potentials, but his medicaid expansion and common core loving (unless he changed on that and haven't heard) would be a concern to me.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at November 15, 2014 10:49 AM (1nB6R)

199 "Ukraine"has only existed since 1991

Why there's no way it could have been invaded, then.

Posted by: derp at November 15, 2014 10:49 AM (AZkU/)

200 And, personally, I think Jindal is the smartest of the governors we're
considering. He's come a long way from that disastrous SOTU rebuttal. I
think he'd be a strong candidate

I love to listen to Jindal and Haley because they seem genuinely concerned about everyone in their state and in this country. Can't wait to have a potus that I can believe in again.

And Walker isn't an lawyer? Awesome! All 3 of these can run against Gruber; the personification of progressive government.

Posted by: OldDominionMom at November 15, 2014 10:49 AM (Vp1dQ)

201 Ukraine has been around since say 1649, the Russians annexed the Eastern portion after the Turkish wars

Posted by: admiral marcus at November 15, 2014 10:50 AM (0u/CC)

202 Technically, Yanukovich agreed to a 15 billion loan from Russia, Crimea voted to join Russia, and Putin does not seem interested in reassembling the old USSR, or he would already have Georgia. It has taken Russia this much time to climb out of the post-90s economic mire. There is no reason to take on an unruly, debt-ridden mess like Ukraine when he only needed Crimea to have his warm water port.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:50 AM (Y92Nd)

203 Ukraine is civil war!!
Also Georgia!
And Azerbaijan!

Estonia and Latvia at risk for civil war, too!
Also Finland maybe!!'

So many civil wars border Russia -- is uncanny!!

Posted by: Russia Strong!! at November 15, 2014 10:50 AM (ZPrif)

204 194 168 Hinckley was a close personal friend of the Bush family, and Bush stood to gain the presidency. Motive. Did a madman believe Jodi Foster would give up carpet for him after he assassinated the president, or did powerful people want their guy who lost the nomination in the White House?
Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:46 AM (Y92Nd)

Hail Hydra.

Posted by: eman at November 15, 2014 10:51 AM (MQEz6)

205 No ratings etc. on non person Sarah Palin?

Posted by: doowleb at November 15, 2014 10:51 AM (EoE58)

206 "Both, or he will lose."

Oh they're going to lose alright, I don't why people think the demographics have change enough to swing a Presidential election.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 15, 2014 10:51 AM (BXkFh)

207 Crimea voted to join Russia,

On a ballot with no "no" option.

Keep sucking Putin's dick, you clueless shill.

Posted by: derp at November 15, 2014 10:51 AM (AZkU/)

208 Remember that the KKK was an equal opportunity hate group. They didn't like Jews, Catholics or Revenooers.

Does anybody like revenuers?

Posted by: Grey Fox at November 15, 2014 10:52 AM (WriHG)

209 Crimea voted to join Russia
------

And what was even more incredible is that 125% of voters turned out to vote to join Russia.

Posted by: Nigel West Dickens at November 15, 2014 10:53 AM (81puj)

210

Why there's no way it could have been invaded, then.
Posted by: derp at November 15, 2014 10:49 AM (AZkU/)

And it's just plain crazy talk to suggest that a fledgling nation isn't going through some growing pains. The US had existed for a century before the North and South were at each others's throats.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:53 AM (Y92Nd)

211 Daggumit!

I want to see Rand run just so we can watch the debates.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 10:54 AM (DmNpO)

212 Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right?

College is overrated and his job performance proves that fact. Education =/= Intelligence and it sure as hell =/= wisdom.

Very obviously, it has nothing to do with guts.

Posted by: 98ZJUSMC Suntanning in Bizzaro World at November 15, 2014 10:54 AM (/3SFS)

213 No ratings etc. on non person Sarah Palin?
Posted by: doowleb at November 15, 2014 10:51 AM (EoE5

She's on the Oct. 11th thread.

Posted by: mugiwara at November 15, 2014 10:54 AM (06U11)

214 never voted for Bob Dole, John McCain or Barry Goldwater then,

Posted by: admiral marcus at November 15, 2014 10:55 AM (0u/CC)

215 Crimea voted to join Russia
------

And what was even more incredible is that 125% of voters turned out to vote to join Russia.

****

I bet I can get a majority of voters in my area to agree to join Texas as an independent nation.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 10:55 AM (DmNpO)

216 Crimea voted to join Russia,
-

And more bullshit. What is your malfunction dude? Nobody serious recognized that as a real election. Russia invaded, expelled a large % of the populace and had a vote at gunpoint.

You are spewing a constant stream of Kremlin propaganda, wtf?

I though you were just confused at first, but you clearly know you are spewing bullshit.

You can argue we shouldn't get involved without resorting to 2+2=5 nonsense.

You aren't arguing in good faith.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 10:55 AM (ZPrif)

217 207 Crimea voted to join Russia,

On a ballot with no "no" option.

Keep sucking Putin's dick, you clueless shill.
Posted by: derp at November 15, 2014 10:51 AM (AZkU/)

And you keep sucking Biden's dick. Isn't his coke-snorting son on the board of Ukraine's biggest gas company?

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 10:56 AM (Y92Nd)

218 Neither Steve Jobs nor Bill Gates finished college. The Bamster has degrees out the wazoo. QED.

Posted by: rfichoke at November 15, 2014 10:56 AM (vLCft)

219 The solution to all your midget commenter problems.

Posted by: DaveA at November 15, 2014 10:57 AM (DL2i+)

220 oops let's try to get out of the barrel

Posted by: DaveA at November 15, 2014 10:58 AM (DL2i+)

221 Ceasar's conquest of Gaul and Edward Longshank's attempt to conquer Scotland also involved intervening in civil wars.

Posted by: Grey Fox at November 15, 2014 10:58 AM (WriHG)

222 DaveA, what, jumping in the barrel?

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at November 15, 2014 10:59 AM (rLYQR)

223 Isn't his coke-snorting son on the board of Ukraine's biggest gas company?

I'm sure that has something to do with the integrity of the Crimean "independence" vote, somehow.

Keep flailing, you dumb fucking shill.

Posted by: derp at November 15, 2014 11:00 AM (AZkU/)

224 Scotland is pretty happy with the outcome these days.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 11:00 AM (Y92Nd)

225 ooh boy, that one might leave a mark

Posted by: J. Cheevers Loophole at November 15, 2014 11:00 AM (ahBY0)

226 You know who meddling in civil wars benefits?

Posted by: Henry II at November 15, 2014 11:00 AM (rLYQR)

227
"Ukraine"has only existed since 1991

Not for lack of trying. They attempted independence after the collapse of the Czarist Russian Empire, but the fucking Bolsheviks weren't having any of that (see Ukranian-Soviet War, 1918-19). Ever since, USSR/Russia has made it a preeminent national policy to keep Ukraine as their own personal breadbasket, never mind what the Ukranians want.

How dare the Ukranians be so aggressive and evil as to want to be left alone?

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at November 15, 2014 11:02 AM (TIIx5)

228 Scotland is pretty happy with the outcome these days.

Edward Longshanks died in 1307. The Act of Union was in 1707. There were a few significant changes in Anglo-Scottish relationships in the 400 interim.

Posted by: Grey Fox at November 15, 2014 11:02 AM (WriHG)

229 You people are why SMOD never visits US and always goes to IVAN!

Posted by: Sven S Blade a.k.a. El Assassin@sven10077 at November 15, 2014 11:03 AM (/4AZU)

230 400 *year* interim.

Posted by: Grey Fox at November 15, 2014 11:03 AM (WriHG)

231 Posted by: derp at November 15, 2014 11:00 AM (AZkU/)

Keep selling your new war with your histrionic comparisons of Putin to Hitler. "Rigged elections" and "tanks pouring over the border" when Nuland has admitted to propping up neo-fascists in the Maidan uprising.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 11:04 AM (Y92Nd)

232 170
One thing with Walker; they can't find any skeletons. They've tried and they've even tried to manufacture a few and failed.

Only HS Grad? That's half the country. And it's the working half.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That

Charles Murray may have something to say about that. While I agree that the Ivy Leaguers haven't covered themselves in glory, let's not overpraise the HS grad crowd either. There are good and bad in both segments.

Well, except for Gruber. That guy is awesome, and wicked smart.

Posted by: pep at November 15, 2014 11:05 AM (4nR9/)

233 Thank you Y-not, for the post. I guess it's time to go get something done around here. bleh

Posted by: OldDominionMom at November 15, 2014 11:05 AM (Vp1dQ)

234 232 Posted by: derp at November 15, 2014 11:00 AM (AZkU/)

Keep selling your new war with your histrionic comparisons of Putin to Hitler. "Rigged elections" and "tanks pouring over the border" when Nuland has admitted to propping up neo-fascists in the Maidan uprising.
Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 11:04 AM (Y92Nd)

Ozone leaking from the ears.

Posted by: eman at November 15, 2014 11:05 AM (MQEz6)

235 So the Russian invasion -- the one with all the tanks and special forces guys -- never occurred.

And the invasion that never occurred didn't occur in Ukraine -- a country that doesn't *really* exist despite the borders and flag and military and UN and NATO and, oh yes, Russian recognition.

But the Crimea referendum, held shortly after the invasion that didn't occur, in a country that doesn't exist, was free and fair.

You can argue that the risks of helping Ukraine fight off the Russian invasion are greater than the benefits and that we should stay out. Argue your case on the merits. Don't use these bullshit, double-speak, 2+2=potato! talking points.

It's insulting. And stupid. You sound like a Democrat selling Obamacare.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 11:07 AM (ZPrif)

236 Fucking with Russia under a crazy bastard like Putin is dangerous as hell

Posted by: Montezuma's Revenge at November 15, 2014 11:08 AM (hAdu/)

237 "tanks pouring over the border"
-

I like how you put it in sarcastic air quotes.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at November 15, 2014 11:08 AM (ZPrif)

238 24 -- RK -- IMO, Dean's return to the field of battle is the beginning of a power struggle between the East Coast 'rats (formerly the Kennedy Gang) and the Chicago Gang.

You'll know how serious he is if he takes on Cuomo (he who dreams of being the next East Coast boss)... and begins to diss the Hildabeast.

Posted by: CPT. Charles at November 15, 2014 11:08 AM (/mTq0)

239 It's insulting. And stupid. You sound like a Democrat selling Obamacare.

Posted by: Costanza Defense

He's trolling you. Ignore him.

Posted by: pep at November 15, 2014 11:09 AM (4nR9/)

240 A steel rod carefully drilled down through the rocks, strengthened with cement and concealed with painted, textured epoxy putty. That's my guess.

Posted by: Aves expoxy putty user at November 15, 2014 11:09 AM (bGLSw)

241 239
24 -- RK -- IMO, Dean's return to the field of battle is the beginning
of a power struggle between the East Coast 'rats (formerly the Kennedy
Gang) and the Chicago Gang.

Agreed, but which are the Clintons?

Posted by: pep at November 15, 2014 11:10 AM (4nR9/)

242 It never pays to kick a skunk

Posted by: Montezuma's Revenge at November 15, 2014 11:13 AM (hAdu/)

243 Tattoo's a 'ette.

Posted by: boulder terlit hobo at November 15, 2014 11:13 AM (rLYQR)

244
Agreed, but which are the Clintons?

Posted by: pep at November 15, 2014 11:10 AM (4nR9/)

Let's you and him fight.

Posted by: Queen Cankles at November 15, 2014 11:13 AM (TIIx5)

245 But Haley has not been a lightning rod for hate except from the GOP old boys in her own state and she seems to be more of a conservative.

It's kind of the opposite. She's pure establishment all the way. The grassroots here don't like her much. We could do worse, but she's a typical politician just playing the game.

Posted by: rfichoke at November 15, 2014 11:15 AM (vLCft)

246 236 You are the one making it up as you go along. I recognize Ukraine's sovereignty, but I don't dismiss the ongoing civil war because it is inconvenient to selling some story about Putin rolling in with tanks like Hitler in Czecholslavakia 76 years ago. Ukraine is still sovereign, and it's up to them to work out their differences.

I know neocons want to use this as a pretext to bring Ukraine into NATO and put bases on the Dussian border and maybe start WWIII in Europe again to get our economy going. Cuz God knows these motherfuckers can't stop spending money and living within our means. But I have nothing for or against Russia. I'm with those "pussies" in Europe who just want their gas and oil and to leave it alone.

Which is why Nuland said, "Fuck the EU." A strange attitude for a country across the Atlantic Ocean from Russia. There is no reason we should be investing 5 billion in a civil war that you claim doesn't exist.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 11:18 AM (Y92Nd)

247 Ukraine is still sovereign, and it's up to them to work out their differences.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 11:18 AM (Y92Nd)

Glad to see that you have come around to our way of thinking.

Just keep Russian arms and troops out of the equation and I am confident that most people around here would be content to observe.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2014 11:21 AM (Zu3d9)

248 Harper's the water boy for Team America. It's none of his business what happens in Ukraine.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane

WTF??

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 11:22 AM (rwI+c)

249 WTF??

****

Ohhh boy! And yu're just at the top of the Ukraine thread.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 11:25 AM (DmNpO)

250 Ohhh boy! And yu're just at the top of the Ukraine thread.

No shit, as I read further. I am gobsmacked.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 11:25 AM (rwI+c)

251 the corgis have abandoned us

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 11:27 AM (DmNpO)

252 Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 11:25 AM (rwI+c)

It's an....interesting take on Ukraine.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2014 11:27 AM (Zu3d9)

253 Eat me last, Mr. Crocodile.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 11:28 AM (rwI+c)

254 I'm kind of in the middle here

I agree with the Ukrainians but don't see what we can do that wouldn't increase hostilities with Russia.

We can hardly do shit with ISIS right now

This would be way scarier..

Posted by: US Chamber of Commerce at November 15, 2014 11:28 AM (hAdu/)

255 It's an....interesting take on Ukraine.

****

I giggled

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 15, 2014 11:28 AM (DmNpO)

256 In point of fact, the Europeans could settle this in six months if they just quit paying Russia for gas. Quietly, through back channels. Don't turn off the pipeline, just quit paying. They should have done it last summer.

Posted by: toby928(C) at November 15, 2014 11:30 AM (rwI+c)

257 245 She's pure establishment all the way.

IIRC she was one of the first Goobeners to jump on the Willard band wagon.

Posted by: Thin veneer of civility at November 15, 2014 11:31 AM (XzRw1)

258 Just keep Russian arms and troops out of the equation and I am confident that most people around here would be content to observe.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2014 11:21 AM (Zu3d9)

I would be more sympathetic to the Ukrainian plight if there weren't nasty thugs like Soros and Kolomoisky backing them.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2014 11:35 AM (Y92Nd)

259 242 -- pep -- Hmm... depending on who you talk to... bumpkin interlopers.

Technically, you could label Bubba Clinton as a Southern 'rat who won the Powerball... IOW, an 'outlier'.

Bubba is a left-leaning machine politician who embraces leftist models because they garner the most votes (a.k.a. LBJ); Hillary is a full-blown Leftist who's probably more alined with the commie faction of the Chicago Gang... but that's complicated by Bubba's antipathy towards Dear Leader, and the 'Battle Royale' mentality of Leftists when it comes to the 'who's the boss' arguments.

(The Trotsky ice axe solution was not a one-off, that's SOP...)

When all is said and done... Hillary is only on the national stage by virtue of marriage. I suspect it's a reality that she both curses, and embraces, simultaneously.

Posted by: CPT. Charles at November 15, 2014 11:37 AM (/mTq0)

260 And, in case you're wondering, I don't view Warren (MA) as a serious threat... yet.

What she appears to be (again, IMO) is an attempt by the Prog faction of the East Coast Gang to duplicate the 'Obama miracle'.

Given the potential state of the Republic two years hence, the 'rats will have only obvious options: (1) embrace the works of Dear Leader and proclaim 'the best is yet to come', or (2) run away from Prezy Obola at light-speed.

Warren's potential campaign 'I can do it smarter than Obama' may have the combined reality of 2014 + the carnage left behind by Prezy Obola to deal with.

Frankly, running a 'seemingly sane' candidate may be the only real option the 'rats have for 2016...

...then again, I could be totally wrong too.

Posted by: CPT. Charles at November 15, 2014 11:54 AM (/mTq0)

261 Oh! Do John Kasich next.

Posted by: Brass at November 15, 2014 12:04 PM (v/Ofr)

262 Why was Pence talking to Barack Obama about Medicaid? Shouldn't he have been talking to someone qualified?

Posted by: richard mcenroe at November 15, 2014 12:32 PM (XO6WW)

263 97
Look at 's story. "OMG he got a D in a course [Organic Chemistry] most people don't even take!!!"

Organic makes even the chemistry majors cry. It's hard as hell from what I've been told.

Posted by: Insomniac at November 15, 2014 10:03 AM (AVWYi)

Organic Chem is the med school hopefuls weeder class. If you can't hack it in Org Chem you probably won't survive med school. Most students take 2 attempts to pass that class.

Posted by: exsanguine at November 15, 2014 12:53 PM (V0oj4)

264 My understanding is that Walker is pro amnesty. That is a dis-qualifier for any voter that works for a living. So about 50% of the country might support him.

Posted by: Huggy at November 15, 2014 01:14 PM (PGh+Q)

265 Gowdy is one of my heroes, but I would take him off the list. Unlike the lightworker, I think Gowdy has the common sense and humility to realize that he does not have the background for the job (yet). Now I do think he'd make a great Veep candidate, Speaker of the House, or AG.

Posted by: Z as in Jersey (now in Virginia) at November 15, 2014 01:27 PM (RjkRJ)

266 260
Frankly, running a 'seemingly sane' candidate may be the only real option the 'rats have for 2016...

Posted by: CPT. Charles at November 15, 2014 11:54 AM (/mTq0)

You're discounting the American electorate.

They can be convinced of anything, apparently.

Posted by: rickl at November 15, 2014 01:45 PM (sdi6R)

267 196. That sounds like a dig against Sarah Palin, who was lawfared out of office by baseless and frivolous accusations of wrongdoing.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, International Double-Naught Cat Speculator at November 15, 2014 10:48 AM (0HooB)
************************
More like a relentless, screeching press promising to investigate her every breath forever and ever without end, amen. Which she got anyway, despite having resigned the Governorship.

I was not thrilled at her taking a prospective VP role when she still had a couple years of her term as Governor left. Things get so caught up in a current election cycle that it is forgotten that there are future election cycles. I cannot imagine the pressures that a political star receives with a cycling band of well-wishing associates relentlessly urging them to "run, run, run." Many a politically disastrous venture has been launched due to that pressure. I say to finish the job you were elected for before taking on a new one. Every one of those elected positions has an expiry date.

Even beyond that, though, is that to wrest power back to the States from an overburdening national power in DC is going to take strong people and strong leadership at the State level. Not only to actually reclaim their proper powers, but to judiciously employ those powers once they've been returned. The real political focus should have always been more at the State level than at the national level. I am heartened to see that that is being recognized this time around; how important it is to have the States displaying your political brand.

DC should be largely irrelevant to our lives (h/t Perry); why would we want our greatest stars there?

Posted by: Unblinded by the Light at November 15, 2014 01:48 PM (cr0Pu)

268 I love Cruz but I heard the nuclear meme already: "Not another Texan to run the country!"
Yes some people are that stupid (hat tip Gruber)

Posted by: NYC Parent at November 15, 2014 03:05 PM (LvuxG)

269 260 And, in case you're wondering, I don't view Warren (MA) as a serious threat... yet.

Frankly, running a 'seemingly sane' candidate may be the only real option the 'rats have for 2016...

...then again, I could be totally wrong too.
Posted by: CPT. Charles at November 15, 2014 11:54 AM (/mTq0)

Can you clarify: Are you saying that Warren IS a seemingly sane candidate? Because surely she isn't. Remember the tapes of her braying, "You didn't build that"?

Posted by: m at November 15, 2014 03:09 PM (G891H)

270 Thanks for your participation, hordelings. See you next week!

Posted by: Y-not at November 15, 2014 03:16 PM (9BRsg)

271 All these great current and former Governors, yet some half-wits are still touting first-term Senators without any administrative experience or significant record of accomplishments.

Posted by: Adjoran at November 15, 2014 04:02 PM (QIQ6j)

272 I would like to see Republican candidates come out for the legalization of marijuana. Supporting laws putting people in jail for it means few of the youths will ever vote R, IMO.

Posted by: waelse1 at November 15, 2014 04:30 PM (t6o/l)

273 " Scott Walker at 26%? You do realize his highest level of education is a high school degree, right? He might make a great President but he is unelectable."

Well over half of the country has no higher degree.

Walker would be classified as "some college," which is the most Republican-leaning education cohort.

Wisconsin is about as pretentious about education as states get this side of Massachusetts, and they didn't seem fazed.

Walker has 2 real problems. First is that upper Midwest/Great Plains dudes simply can't pull this off. Call it a personality/cultural thing. They're too nice, not to say too boring. There's a long string of high-profile flameouts (Humphrey, McCarthy, McGovern, Mondale, Dole, even Pawlenty) and no successes.

Second is that he has zero foreign policy chops, which is going to be a problem against Madame Secretary. My modest proposal to solve this: Walker/Ernst. Double down on the midwest (like Clinton/Gore for the mid-south), take a bit of the Herstory angle, militar experience.

(This proposal of course assumes the first problem is illusory or can be solved.)

Posted by: Knemon at November 15, 2014 04:32 PM (lkkJK)

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