Saturday Politics Thread: Scott Walker, Bobby Jindal, and Rick Perry [Y-not]

College football season is fully underway this week. (Yes, there were some games last week, but this is the weekend the Big Dogs started playing.)

Tonight, the Wisconsin Badgers (14) will be meeting the LSU Tigers (13) at Reliant Stadium in Houston, Texas. (I have no idea why they're playing in Houston.)

Coincidentally enough, this game involves three states whose Republican Governors should be considered amongst the top contenders for 2016. So let's use that as an excuse to talk about them.

Wisconsin's governor, Scott Walker, is a favorite amongst many here, including the traitorous Meatball, I believe. Here's a short biosketch for those of you unfamiliar with his background:

Born in Colorado Springs, Colorado, Walker attended Marquette University in Milwaukee. He started his career working for IBM before gaining a marketing job with the American Red Cross. At age 22, Walker lost a run for the Wisconsin State Assembly in a Milwaukee district in 1990, though he won later, after moving to a more Conservative district in Wauwatosa, Wisconsin. He served five more terms in the Wisconsin Assembly from 1993 to 2002. In 2002, after the resignation of Tom Ament as Executive of Milwaukee County, Walker won in a special election to fill the seat, winning the first of three terms serving as County Executive in Milwaukee County from 2002 to 2010.
In his first run for Governor in 2006 he dropped out before the Republican primaries. Walker again ran for the governorship in 2010 winning in a three person race in the Republican primary. He faced Democratic nominee, Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett, in the general election, where Walker won with 52% of the vote. After being sworn into office in 2011, Walker introduced a controversial budget repair plan which eliminated many collective bargaining rights for most public employees and made over $1 billion in cuts to the state's biennial education budget and $500 million in cuts from the state's biennial Medicaid budget. The budget cuts led to significant protests at the Wisconsin State Capitol and sparked an effort to recall Walker.
In a special election in June 2012, Walker again faced Barrett in Wisconsin's first and only Gubernatorial recall election and defeated him for a second time, obtaining more than 53% of the vote. Walker is the first and only governor in the U.S. to date to win a gubernatorial recall election.

Many reject the idea that a prospective candidate's resume matters. I am not in that camp. It does matter to me and I confess I am not particularly impressed by Walker's credentials.

That said, he is credited with accomplishing a lot of great things in Wisconsin, most notably getting the state's fiscal house in order and defeating the unions.

Louisiana's governor, Bobby Jindal, was high on many peoples' lists until that semi-disastrous SOTU rebuttal speech he gave in 2009. After that it seemed as though the popular opinion was that Jindal was too "odd" to be a serious contender. I don't know if that's true for most people, but in my case it does not matter as I vote in the primaries based on what I want, not based on what I think others want. Based on the past two election cycles, I remain unconvinced that the Smart Set who insist we factor "electability" into our primary process know their asses from their elbows.

In any event, here's a quick summary of Bobby Jindal's resume:

Jindal was born in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, to immigrants from India. Prior to entering politics, Jindal studied for a Bachelor of Science in biology and public policy at Brown University from 1988 to 1991 and then a Master of Letters in political science from New College, Oxford, as a Rhodes Scholar. He worked for McKinsey & Company and interned for Representative Jim McCrery of Louisiana. In 1996, Governor Murphy Foster appointed Jindal Secretary of the Louisiana Department of Health and Hospitals, and in 1999 he was appointed President of the University of Louisiana System. In 2001, Jindal was appointed as the principal adviser to Tommy Thompson, the United States Secretary of Health and Human Services by President George W. Bush.
He first ran for governor in 2003 and won a plurality in the nonpartisan blanket primary but lost in the general election to Democrat Kathleen Blanco. He then won a seat in the United States House of Representatives in the 2004 elections. The second Indian American in Congress, he was re-elected in 2006. He ran for Governor again in 2007 and secured an outright majority in the first round of balloting. He was re-elected in a landslide in 2011.

I don't know a lot about Jindal's record in Louisiana, except I remember being fairly impressed by him during the oil spill, when he called out Obama for the administration's inaction. What I saw of that Jindal suggested to me that he has matured past the 2009 Jindal. IOW, I think a large part of Bobby Jindal's poor performance in the SOTU rebuttal was owing to being overly-managed by some bad advisors. I doubt that would happen again.

I confess, what has put Jindal back on my radar was his rapid (August 16th) and strong response to the malicious prosecution (and indictment) of Governor Rick Perry. In case you missed it, here it is:

"I stand behind Governor Perry in his fight for honest government and I am certain he will prevail in this partisan suit," Mr. Jindal tweeted, adding in separate dispatches, "Governor Perry exercised his constitutional authority and this circus is simply a political witch-hunt." and "The lawsuit against Governor Perry is a blatant misuse of the judicial system by liberal activists who couldn’t defeat him at the polls."

Here's Scott Walker's response to the indictment:

Walker urged his counterpart to remain "bold and aggressive" and that he can understand the pressure.
"The bottom line is I can completely understand being under attack from outside sources for political purposes and it appears that's what we're seeing in Texas," Walker said. "I'd encourage him to stick with the truth and point out where politics are being played."

(BTW, I watched the clip of Walker and was not impressed by his delivery. It struck me as rather weak support of an extremely successful Republican governor coming from another Republican governor. YMMV.)

Finally, there's the Governor of Texas. I've been told for years now that I cannot vote for the Governor of Texas in the GOP primary because being the Governor of Texas is disqualifying.

Bullshit.

He's the best-known of these three 2016 prospects, having served as governor since 2000. Here's a quick summary of his resume:

James Richard "Rick" Perry (born March 4, 1950) is an American politician who is the 47th and current governor of Texas. A Republican, he was elected lieutenant governor of Texas in 1998 and assumed the governorship in December 2000 when then-governor George W. Bush resigned to become president of the United States. Perry is the longest serving governor in Texas state history. As a result, he is the only governor in modern Texas history to have appointed at least one person to every eligible state office, board, or commission position (as well as to several elected offices to which the governor can appoint someone to fill an unexpired term, such as six of the nine current members of the Texas Supreme Court).
Perry was elected to full gubernatorial terms in 2002, 2006 and 2010 and is the fourth Texas governor (after Allan Shivers, Price Daniel, and John Connally) to serve three terms. With a tenure in office to date of 13 years, 252 days, Perry is the second longest serving current U.S. governor – after Terry Branstad of Iowa. Perry served as chairman of the Republican Governors Association in 2008 (succeeding Sonny Perdue of Georgia) and again in 2011.
Perry won the Texas 2010 Republican gubernatorial primary election, defeating U.S. Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison and former Wharton County Republican Party Chairwoman and businesswoman Debra Medina. In the 2010 Texas gubernatorial election, Perry won a third term by defeating former Houston mayor Bill White and Kathie Glass.
On August 13, 2011, Perry announced in South Carolina that he was running for the Republican nomination for President of the United States in the 2012 presidential election. Perry suspended his campaign in January 2012 and eventually endorsed Republican nominee Mitt Romney.
On July 8, 2013, Perry announced that he would not seek re-election to his fourth term in the 2014 election, planning to retire instead. Unnamed sources said to be close to Perry told the National Review that Perry may focus on another White House bid for 2016.

There's a lot more given that he's had a very lengthy public record even before his terms as governor.

Of course, if that doesn't matter to you and you care about results, then I direct you to the Texas economy.

Everyone here knows I am a huge admirer of Perry. I also like him. I think he's charming and strong-willed and telegenic.

That said, I have not yet decided on a top guy (or gal) for 2016 and that includes Perry. I hope he runs and runs well. I hope Republicans give him a serious look. I hope the primary tests him - and all of the candidates - and that he (and the others) are all on their game. But, mostly, I hope there's none of that bullshit we saw last time of Republicans misrepresenting each others' records or digging through each others' garbage.

I am confident that each of these three men have "skeletons" in their closet -- racist rocks or exorcisms or academic hiccups. I am also confident that none of those are disqualifying. So if they come out, let's not overplay them. OK?

Of the three prospective candidates, I think Jindal is the smartest, Perry has the strongest record, and Walker may have the fewest negatives. YMMV. As of this moment, my top pick from these three is Perry, but that's largely because I've followed him the most closely.

How about a quick poll to see where you all stand?

To wrap things up, here are some Badger elbows:

Posted by: Open Blogger at 03:14 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 108 Moment of uplift of the day

There are some kids in our synagogue who were orphaned in a terrible car accident. They survived but are paralyzed. Terrible. Mr Watt, without cameras or publicity of any kind, has befriended them. He talks to them all the time. Visits. Calls. For years now. Not for show. Because he is a decent human being

That is your moment of uplift

That is JJ Watt. Who is from Wisconsin. And plays professional football in Houston.

Posted by: ThunderB at August 30, 2014 03:14 PM (zOTsN)

2 mmmmm...elbows

And FIRST?

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at August 30, 2014 03:14 PM (60Vyp)

3 And I heart Perry

Posted by: ThunderB at August 30, 2014 03:15 PM (zOTsN)

4 Elbow pic is a tad tasteless.

YMMV

Posted by: eman at August 30, 2014 03:16 PM (MQEz6)

5 I'd like to see Joe Scarborough run for President, with a mini-clad Mika working on his staff.

Hard.

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 03:17 PM (+jY4+)

6 I'm good with Perry or Cruz or Palin...ANYONE who is gonna get in the face of these asshat liberals and call a spade a spade. I really wish someone could campaign on the idea of one people, ONE law. And then start taking heads. Figuratively, except in the case of terrorists.

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at August 30, 2014 03:19 PM (60Vyp)

7 Nice post, Y-not! I would crawl across cut glass for a chance to vote Rick Perry into the White House.

Posted by: Peaches at August 30, 2014 03:19 PM (8lmkt)

8 Elbow pic is cheerleader standard formation #27 and perfectly fine.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at August 30, 2014 03:19 PM (ZPrif)

9 Badger or beaver?

Posted by: Insomniac at August 30, 2014 03:21 PM (mx5oN)

10 I dunno.

The cheerleaders have just way too much Thigh Gap.

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 03:22 PM (+jY4+)

11 with a mini-clad Mika working on his staff

That's pretty graphic. So glad "on" was included

Posted by: dudenolongerinsantacruz at August 30, 2014 03:23 PM (PGXA8)

12 4 Elbow pic is a tad tasteless.

YMMV
Posted by: eman at August 30, 2014 03:16 PM (MQEz6)

You know how I know you're ghey?

Posted by: Insomniac at August 30, 2014 03:23 PM (mx5oN)

13 I had not realized Jindal did a stint as President of the University of Louisiana until I read his wiki bio. That's an interesting addition to his resume. Might help counter the inevitable - he's a kooky knuckle-dragging fundie! - bombs that are likely to be hurled at him.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:23 PM (zDsvJ)

14 116
Obame the Clueless college lecturer will not be Prezzident forever.

That's like saying after a badly refereed football game that you

don't care about the rules anymore. The next game will be gang fight,

not a game, with that outlook.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative riding the comfy chair at August 30, 2014 03:07 PM (+1T7c)

You are suggesting that the damage done from a coup will be worse than the damage done from an Obama.

I
don't know at this point which would be worse. If we break the existing
system, well i'm kinda thinking it wasn't working properly anyway, or
else we wouldn't have ended up with this piece of shit we have right
now.

Posted by: D-Lamp at August 30, 2014 03:21 PM (txvbW)

Posted by: D-Lamp at August 30, 2014 03:24 PM (txvbW)

15 Palin/West 2016

Posted by: teej at August 30, 2014 03:24 PM (JLRz+)

16 College girls wear bikinis at the beach, too, sometimes! Gasp!

It's a standard move where the cheerleaders are held up on one foot and balance on one leg while holding the other. It's a test of balance and flexibility.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at August 30, 2014 03:25 PM (ZPrif)

17 Finally, there's the Governor of Texas. I've been told for years now
that I cannot vote for the Governor of Texas in the GOP primary because
being the Governor of Texas is disqualifying.

I have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not being argmentative, I have just never heard that from anyone.

But, mostly, I hope there's none of that bulls*** we saw last time of
Republicans misrepresenting each others' records or digging through each
others' garbage.

Again, I find this comment a bit baffling. Perry lost due to self-inflicted wounds, if that's who you're discussing.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 03:25 PM (4nR9/)

18 I believe the girls are attempting to form a "forward motion" W. I could be wrong, though.

Posted by: Mr. Natural at August 30, 2014 03:26 PM (/pOl7)

19 13 I had not realized Jindal did a stint as President of the University of Louisiana until I read his wiki bio. That's an interesting addition to his resume. Might help counter the inevitable - he's a kooky knuckle-dragging fundie! - bombs that are likely to be hurled at him.
Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:23 PM (zDsvJ)

And the inevitable racist epithets from the left.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 30, 2014 03:27 PM (mx5oN)

20 inally, there's the Governor of Texas. I've been told for years now

that I cannot vote for the Governor of Texas in the GOP primary because

being the Governor of Texas is disqualifying.

I have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not being argmentative, I have just never heard that from anyone.

Because Bush was Gov of Texas and it is an oft-repeated canard from the left

Posted by: Peaches at August 30, 2014 03:27 PM (8lmkt)

21 North Dakota State, FCS champs, delivered another beatdown on a FBS team, Iowa State. I love a good football game.

Posted by: Fritz at August 30, 2014 03:28 PM (C0dQz)

22 @20
The context of the comment (the primary) suggested that it was Republicans saying it. Thanks for the clarification.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 03:28 PM (4nR9/)

23 University of Virginia lost to UCLA, but not by much. Nice effort.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:28 PM (zDsvJ)

24 23
University of Virginia lost to UCLA, but not by much. Nice effort.

Posted by: Y-not

Dang. It was my daughter's first game there. I guess she should probably get used to it.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 03:29 PM (4nR9/)

25 them, too, pep. please note that I said from the left, not "from the Ds"

Posted by: Peaches at August 30, 2014 03:30 PM (8lmkt)

26 The deceased F-15C pilot of the 104th FW, MA ANG has been indentified as Lt. Col. Morris Fontenot. He had just joined the unit six months ago and was the unit's IG

http://tinyurl.com/kwqpndv

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at August 30, 2014 03:31 PM (whKdw)

27 And there's probably a dude cheerleader holding her up and looking straight up her skirt!

Of course, he's doing that to maintain proper form and balance so she doesn't fall. Shortly after this pic he probably throws her up in the air a bit and does a basket catch.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at August 30, 2014 03:31 PM (ZPrif)

28 I think you're reading more into what I said than I intended, pep, given that you think that the second statement (re garbage digging) was something to do with Perry. I think there was a lot of mud slung by a lot of folks in the primary last time and a lot of records misrepresented.

And there are many Republicans, including here, who have said for quite some time that we can't have another Texan because of Bush. I'm surprised you claim that you haven't seen that.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:32 PM (zDsvJ)

29 @17

Honestly, Texas seems much more cosmopolitan than Louisiana.

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 03:32 PM (+jY4+)

30 Only thing wrong with the pic is teh thighs are a Tad bit beefy.

Well that and it's Wisconsin, who some years back sued little Washburn Univ because "OMGZ they're using a "W" the same shape as ours".

Posted by: teej at August 30, 2014 03:32 PM (JLRz+)

31 Rice up against Notre Dame.

I have to root for the Irish b/c of Papa Y-not, but my heart's not in it.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:34 PM (zDsvJ)

32 If I'd known you were going to be here, CC, I'd have put Kasich on that poll! ;-)

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:35 PM (zDsvJ)

33 So, when does the bullshit indictment/criminal investigation begin against me?

Posted by: Bobby Jindal, POTUS threat at August 30, 2014 03:36 PM (ekHTY)

34 In order of preference: Walker, then Jindal.

I do indeed like both guys, but that ordering is because:

(a) Walker realizes that slashing the financial sinews of the institutional left is necessary, and has actually DONE that. Name another Republican with better credentials in that regard.

(b) Jindal may be a bit too "exotic" for some, and I'm not talking about his ethnicity. Obama could skate casually away from the nutty racist church he attended for years in Shitcargo, because the media were intent on allowing him to do so, but the media surely will not give Jindal a pass on exorcism. Walker is safely boring by comparison.

Perry isn't even on the table any more. Not an option. There's the old saying that "personnel are policy", and Perry just hired two absolutely horrible political hacks who exemplify the GOP establishment at its worst, Steve Schmidt and Henry Barbour. Tells you everything you need to know about where Perry really stands.

Posted by: torquewrench at August 30, 2014 03:36 PM (noWW6)

35 Of the three I like Perry the best, but when I vote for someone from Texas, it's going to be Ted Cruz (and you can stow any birther crap. He's eligible).

Posted by: Weirddave at August 30, 2014 03:37 PM (9422s)

36 @32

Yeah I noticed the omission but decided to ignore it for the sake of our friendship...

;-P

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 03:38 PM (+jY4+)

37 Gaylord Focker finds another way to waste money and add power to the Executive branch. An Intellectual Property Czar?

First Gaylord, prove you have intellect.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at August 30, 2014 03:40 PM (whKdw)

38 I wouldn't blame the native English if they engaged in some vigilante justice. If the govt won't protect your daughters there's no other choice.

The muzzies do it cause there's no serious penalty. If the ones who did it started showing up dead, the others would stop.

They raped, what?, 1400 underage girls? It's kind of sad indictment of British men that some of these Pakis haven't turned up dead already.

The Telegraph @Telegraph 3h
Drugged and targeted for sex. They were the lucky ones http://fw.to/c2eg4yi (Pic: L Campbell/Guzelian) #Rotherham pic.twitter.com/Ni4dp74fNl

Posted by: Costanza Defense at August 30, 2014 03:41 PM (ZPrif)

39 @32

I'm trying to charm Peaches into coming over to Twitter...

I figure either I'll end up getting her to tweet, or at least get a nudie selfies out if her :-D

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 03:41 PM (+jY4+)

40 All three are good candidates and bring something different to the table. The GOP bench is deep. The dems have the evitable HRC. I'd be happy with any of these band agree completely on the electability argument. If you win the nomination you are electable.

Posted by: SH at August 30, 2014 03:42 PM (3AWaG)

41 Just because it can't be said enough "Fuck Google". They just used the update service to instal a new app on my phone and it decided to delete an existing widget from the main screen in order to use that space.

*Goes looking for non-android ROMs*

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at August 30, 2014 03:43 PM (jtgkZ)

42 Torque,

I share your assessment of that snake Schmidt, but Perry hired him to work on his defense team against the bullshit DA charges, not his campaign staff. There is a difference.

Posted by: Weirddave(chopped liver) at August 30, 2014 03:44 PM (ofGFY)

43 Happy birthday, Y-not!

I like all three of these guys a lot, but I've decided I can't care about the primary race, because there's nothing I can do to affect it. My vote doesn't count, and my donations have gone for naught. It's kind of freeing. I can sit back and relax, then later go all out to support the one who gets the nomination, whoever it is.

Posted by: stace at August 30, 2014 03:44 PM (9PXzx)

44 >>All three are good candidates and bring something different to the table.

I basically agree.

There's something about Walker that makes me nervous, but I can't quite put my finger on it. So I'd rank them Perry > Jindal > Walker -- out of just those three. Like WeirdDave, I also really like Cruz.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:44 PM (zDsvJ)

45 @34
Based ONLY on his record of taking on Leviathan and beating it like a rented, redheaded stepmule, I'd agree that Walker is the best choice. However, his amnesty stand, or lack thereof, is a big, big problem for me. Beyond that, we all know that a lot of the Dem campaign will be a not-so-subtle sneering contrast between the Ivy League Dems, and the non-college grad, unibrowed Walker. I'm not saying I agree, just that it will impress a small segment of the population, and a small segment is probably what will decide this election.

I agree with you that if Perry chooses people like that for his staff, that tells me what I need to know about him.

I guess that leaves me with Jindal > Walker > Perry.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 03:45 PM (4nR9/)

46 I take it as a given the Democrats end up running Liz Warren.

Sadly, the GOP will somehow muck things up...

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 03:45 PM (+jY4+)

47 Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:32 PM (zDsvJ

I'm one of the people who has said that.

Frankly, I don't trust the media to portray Perry as just another Bush.

Which couldn't be farther from the truth, and yet, the LIVs will eat it up.

Shillary would love to get to run against Bush again, spares here from having to malign Barky.

I'm not sure this is "disqualifying" but if I'm choosing candidates I need to consider it.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) And father to be in 5 months! at August 30, 2014 03:46 PM (HDwDg)

48 I hate you all **runs off crying**

Posted by: Jeb Bush at August 30, 2014 03:47 PM (ekHTY)

49 Perry is the least ideologically pure. But he's been in politics the longest. And, of course, he switched parties. Personally, I don't see that as disqualifying.

I also think that given the length of time he's been around, Perry seems pretty skeleton-free. I am looking for someone who is predictable, either because of their ideological POV (like Cruz) or because their long public record means they've tackled many different situations. So that's why a guy like Rand doesn't make my list at all.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:48 PM (zDsvJ)

50 @45

Chris Christie strikes me as a guy that would go for the Democrats' jugular.

The others will be too polite to point out what a total disaster a second affirmative action Presidency would be.

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 03:48 PM (+jY4+)

51 Y - I prefer Cruz to stay in the senate. We need more like him in there not less. My preference is walker - jindal - perry. But I need to learn more about walker. But love the fact that walker didn't graduate college.

Posted by: SH at August 30, 2014 03:48 PM (H8COV)

52 "If you win the nomination you are electable."

Bob Dole agrees. Bob Dole would like you to know that he was a much stronger contender than everyone thinks.

Why, with four or five lucky breaks, like Bill Clinton breaking his neck falling from the top steps of Air Force One, and with Hurricane Camille as a tailwind, and without Ross Perot, Bob Dole coulda been President. It was that close for Bob Dole and don't you forget that.

I'm Bob Dole and I approve this message.

Posted by: Bob Dole at August 30, 2014 03:48 PM (noWW6)

53 Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:44 PM (zDsvJ

Walker's lack of a college degree hurts him.

It shouldn't but this country has gone full bore into the "Cult of credentials" whereby if you don't have an ivy league degree, they seem to assume you aren't qualified.

It's how we end up with Harvard educated lawyers making healthcare policy over people who actually know what the fuck they're talking about (as an example from my own personal hobby horse.)

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) And father to be in 5 months! at August 30, 2014 03:49 PM (HDwDg)

54 I am looking for someone who is predictable, either because of their
ideological POV (like Cruz) or because their long public record means
they've tackled many different situations.

I know, right? Take me, and my principled, consistent stance against that Senate amnesty bill, for example.

Posted by: Marco Rubio at August 30, 2014 03:49 PM (4nR9/)

55 The others will be too polite to point out what a total disaster a second affirmative action Presidency would be.

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 03:48 PM (+jY4+)
Whoever runs better get right the fuck over that. Of course, then we have the whole, nobody better at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory thing. sigh

Posted by: Peaches at August 30, 2014 03:50 PM (8lmkt)

56 Chris Christie strikes me as a guy that would go for the Democrats' jugular.

Yea like he went for TFG's guys ass to kiss.

Posted by: Velvet Ambition at August 30, 2014 03:51 PM (R8hU8)

57 Second look at Bob McDonnell?

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 03:51 PM (4nR9/)

58 >>Walker's lack of a college degree hurts him.

Yeah, I wonder if there's a story there.

I also wonder about those first couple of jobs he had for short times before he jumped into politics.

And, as someone said above, I am not confident about him on immigration.

There's just something about him that makes me nervous.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:52 PM (zDsvJ)

59 It's just a much better bench. If only the GOP could limit it to those three and other more serious candidates. No fringe candidates like Bachman.

Posted by: SH at August 30, 2014 03:52 PM (H8COV)

60 **walks into thread whistling**

Oh, hai! Whatcha all talkin' about?

Posted by: Mitt Romney at August 30, 2014 03:52 PM (ekHTY)

61 Regards to the Rotherham mass rapes in UK, I guarantee that if the Pakis had just learned that the native Brit men had raped 1,400 Paki girls, there would have already been some serious violence.

Of course, the police and authorities would never have look the other way and ignored mass rapes of Pakistan girls the way they ignored the mass rapes of white English girls.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at August 30, 2014 03:53 PM (ZPrif)

62 The only people I know who care about credentials all vote dem anyway. I don't see it as a liability for walker. But a benefit.

Posted by: SH at August 30, 2014 03:54 PM (H8COV)

63 *bangs head*

Secretariat calls for more Visas to help all the Afghans that this administration has betrayed. Jon Francois, why don't you use your yacht to transport them to Mexico and they can become Dreamers...

http://tinyurl.com/ogyll4r

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at August 30, 2014 03:55 PM (whKdw)

64 Marginally OT. An interview recorded Thursday with recently-red North Carolina Governor Pat McCrory(R). It is a good, entertaining interview, and worth the listen. He makes some very candid remarks about the media. At the top of the screen there is a Play button, and to the right of that a very narrow slider (under the 'Share' button) that will allow you to FF to 76:00 where the interview starts. There is one station break in there, so just FF through it. Good interview. The Left HATE him.

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 30, 2014 03:56 PM (/GgDU)

65 Imagine...

Rick Perry vs Suckagawea Warren...

Cowboy vs Indian.

Posted by: so, this just popped into my head at August 30, 2014 03:58 PM (ekHTY)

66 So what about Nikki Haley? Should she be on our radar?

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:58 PM (zDsvJ)

67 64 - Well, duh..., here's the link:

http://tinyurl.com/pgoc3o2

You'll have to select "Bus Stop Safety, Hypocrisy...."

Posted by: Mike Hammer, etc., etc. at August 30, 2014 03:58 PM (/GgDU)

68 Perry isn't even on the table any more. Not an option. There's the old saying that "personnel are policy", and Perry just hired two absolutely horrible political hacks who exemplify the GOP establishment at its worst, Steve Schmidt and Henry Barbour. Tells you everything you need to know about where Perry really stands.

Posted by: torquewrench at August 30, 2014 03:36 PM

This and his "heartless" statement eliminated him from consideration for me. The former tells me he is establishment and anti-Tea Party and the latter told me that he is pro-Amnesty and has no intention of taking seriously those of us who want to eliminate illegal "immigration" and seal our border.

Walker is my #1. But I will vote for Perry in the general if he is the nominee. But, I will do it knowing full well that he'll go full Amnesty once he's in office. He'll basically be a moderate Democrat, which is better than full-on socialist/communist/marxist Democrat. But I don't see Perry going 2 terms after he grants Amnesty in his 1st term and legalizes millions of Democrat voters...

when I vote for someone from Texas, it's going to be Ted Cruz (and you can stow any birther crap. He's eligible).

Posted by: Weirddave at August 30, 2014 03:37 PM

Could not care less about any "birther crap" regarding Cruz. My issue with him is he is not qualified for the Presidency. He's a 1st term Senator with no executive experience. The Presidency of the United States of America is not a position where you learn on the job. As such, I have no idea why people support Senators/Congressmen for the Presidency. No executive experience? Then not qualified. Period. Besides, we need good Senators like Cruz in the Senate to support a good Republican President.

Now, if the GOP nominee were to take Cruz as a running mate, good deal. I'd support that. Then Cruz could run for President with qualifying experience in 2024.

Posted by: Clyde Shelton at August 30, 2014 03:59 PM (7A4qQ)

69 Nobody in their right mind will vote for Elizabeth Warren in troubled times like these.

52%?

We're f****d.

Posted by: Jinx the Cat at August 30, 2014 03:59 PM (l3vZN)

70 Michael Sam is out?

Michael Sam is out?

(of the Rams roster that is)

Posted by: CNN at August 30, 2014 03:59 PM (ekHTY)

71 The only people I know who care about credentials all vote dem anyway.

There is nothing wrong with credentials, in fact they're a good thing, provided they are actually relevant. Thus, Walker's success as a governor is an outstanding credential. While a Harvard degree suggests intelligence (yes, it does), that is a far cry from a sufficient credential for the presidency and certainly does not indicate wisdom or a firm grasp of reality.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 03:59 PM (4nR9/)

72 Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 03:52 PM (zDsvJ

IIRC there is a story there, and I'm sure we'd find it fairly convincing.

All the LIVs will hear is "college drop out."

Case in point: I just found out a couple of extended family members are on the NYT website (unclear if in the print NYT) for their work on the voter rolls in Ferguson.

Having dealt with said family for years now I know their major intention in getting people to vote is to get people to vote democrat.

I've made all the points possible to them, up to and including pointing out Illya Somin's work "Democracy and Political Ignorance."

I've hit them with emotion, and rationality.

What I get back is "White privileged racist." (More or less, they package it nicer because...family. But that's the general tone. I'd note it's my father's white privilege that kept my said family member's siblings employed for a while.)

In any case, my point simply is: LIV gonna LIV. They'll believe what they want regardless of the facts at hand, doubly so if the media is pushing the narrative directly (and they will.)

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) And father to be in 5 months! at August 30, 2014 03:59 PM (HDwDg)

73 If the Republicans don't have any skeletons the Democrats will create some.

Houstons papers even saying OMG! Perry ate an ice cream after his mug shot!! OMG!

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 04:00 PM (0uI4m)

74 Second look at Bob McDonnell?
Posted by: pep

Oh, yes! He's been getting a lot of 'earned media' this past week.

Posted by: Jinx the Cat at August 30, 2014 04:01 PM (l3vZN)

75 Why would you want to waste Cruz in a vp slot. I don't think he would ever be considered and I trust he would be smart enough to not accept. Perry would make a good vp though.

Posted by: SH at August 30, 2014 04:02 PM (H8COV)

76 @66

Haley would of course defuse the whole "vote for a woman!" thing.

Of course, she's also a REAL Indian (the Slurped tribe), which would always be fun to point out if Liz is the Democrats nominee.

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 04:03 PM (+jY4+)

77 Posted by: CNN at August 30, 2014 03:59 PM (ekHTY

Daily reminder: Local media always considered him a "good but not great" player at Mizzou.

That doesn't get you into the NFL.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) And father to be in 5 months! at August 30, 2014 04:03 PM (HDwDg)

78 Speaking of "white, privileged, racist, yada, yada, racism"

DRUDGE REPORT @DRUDGE_REPORT
DEMS HOPE TO MOBILIZE BLACKS FOR MIDTERMS USING FERGUSON OUTRAGE... http://drudge.tw/1vy4mQe

Posted by: Costanza Defense at August 30, 2014 04:03 PM (ZPrif)

79 Slurpee tribe, damnit.

Posted by: CoolCzech at August 30, 2014 04:03 PM (+jY4+)

80 All the LIVs will hear is "college drop out."

...
In any case, my point simply is: LIV gonna LIV. They'll believe what
they want regardless of the facts at hand, doubly so if the media is
pushing the narrative directly (and they will.)

My point exactly. For some people, the only way to get something into their thick skulls is with a punch and a mallet. Ironically, they're the same ones who will sneer at Walker for his lack of a degree and assume that means he's stupid.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 04:04 PM (4nR9/)

81 Peaches, I would crawl across broken glass to vote for ANY of those candidates. We will probably get a run off between Marco Rubio and Mike Huckabee instead, since Hillary! can possibly beat them.

Posted by: kindltot at August 30, 2014 04:04 PM (t//F+)

82 Michael Sam released.

Posted by: NFL HATES GAYS! at August 30, 2014 04:04 PM (ZPrif)

83 michael sam released from rams...wow...just wow...definitely "flaming skull" worthy...

Posted by: sound awake at August 30, 2014 04:04 PM (FVfLE)

84 Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 04:00 PM (0uI4m

They'll beat the HPV vaccine mess over and over.

Hoping to convince independents he's corrupt and trying to push the anti-vaxxers against him.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) And father to be in 5 months! at August 30, 2014 04:04 PM (HDwDg)

85 In a way, I'd like to see Walker win as it would help underline the unimportance of a sheepskin. The 'everyone has to go to college' mentality is a not a good thing.

Walker has done a good job as governor, and certainly stood strong. Perry has also done an awesome job cutting spending, even in education (often a third rail) to keep his state budget balanced for so long.

Jindal's great too. He comes across as very sincere to me. Some politicians wouldn't have the back of a fellow conservative under attack when they are a potential rival. Walker's statement about Perry's indictment is kinda guarded... you can feel that whiff of advantage there, but it's just a whiff.

I would be happy with any of these three as the nominee. Unfortunately, I can already see the divide and conquer problem emerging.

In 2012, conservatives would find stupid things to bash other conservatives about, and then we wound up with Romney for our troubles.

They will do that again. It is all to easy to pick on whichever conservative is leading the moment. The media will help, but some 'conservative' commentators will help as well. Then we'll be left with one of these Republicans who offers no sincere threat of real reform.

Posted by: dustin at August 30, 2014 04:06 PM (N6hW5)

86 >>>Daily reminder: Local media always considered him a "good but not great" player at Mizzou.

That doesn't get you into the NFL.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) And father to be in 5 months! at August 30, 2014 04:03 PM (HDwDg)<<<

OK, so you're saying he could have made the team.

Posted by: CNN at August 30, 2014 04:07 PM (ekHTY)

87 No doubt Pravda Press American Style already has stories lined up for every single possible Republican candidate for Pres and even some who aren't on the radar.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 04:07 PM (0uI4m)

88 The Dems could run Michael Sam for president.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at August 30, 2014 04:07 PM (W5DcG)

89 What are the features of an executive position that are important?

Because Cruz has been more than a legislator. He was Solicitor General for five years. That's very much a "buck stops here" type of role. (Link to duties of the office in my nick.)

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 04:08 PM (zDsvJ)

90 Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 04:08 PM (zDsvJ)

I personally like to see some executive experience from my presidential candidates. Whether it's running a state or a business, it at least shows you can manage people, meet deadlines, etc.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) And father to be in 5 months! at August 30, 2014 04:09 PM (HDwDg)

91 buncha racist bigoted people over there at the rams i guess...who going to be the first race-baiter-whore-monger to take a swing at this...sharpton, jackson?

Posted by: sound awake at August 30, 2014 04:09 PM (FVfLE)

92 I really don't think anyone "took out" Rick Perry, he did it to himself.

The nomination was on a silver platter for him wrapped in a bow, but he shot himself in the foot multiple times.

Find me a single Republican that didn't vote for Rick Perry because of the vacation spot he rented having racist grafitti. It was a non-issue.

I know I dismissed him over his open border policies like discounted college tuition for illegals and being against a border fence. No excuse for that.

Somehow McCain gets hated raked over the coals for this kind of nonsense but Perry gets a complete pass.

Posted by: Uniden at August 30, 2014 04:10 PM (13G+x)

93 how long until the mainstream media asks the following probing question: "what does this mean for our country going forward?"

Posted by: sound awake at August 30, 2014 04:11 PM (FVfLE)

94 I nominate Nikki Haley......

Shouldn't the 1st woman prez be you know a owman?

Posted by: sven10077 at August 30, 2014 04:12 PM (/4AZU)

95 Sandra Fluke is a proud member of the Slurped Tribe.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at August 30, 2014 04:13 PM (whKdw)

96 92
I really don't think anyone "took out" Rick Perry, he did it to himself.

The nomination was on a silver platter for him wrapped in a bow, but he shot himself in the foot multiple times.

Agree. When you defeat yourself, it doesn't give me confidence you can win the primaries, much less a general election. If he was on painkillers at the time and still ran, I question his judgement.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 04:13 PM (4nR9/)

97 I wish Walker would just take the time to get his degree. He probably only needs a couple of courses. Marquette's a good school so I bet the credits would transfer to UW or wherever it would be easiest for Walker to wrap up his degree.

I think it makes a good a story for him to wrap it up, especially if he does it at a state school, as a non-traditional student when so many people DO make that effort to do that. I always thought Palin's persistence in getting her undergrad degree thru multiple transfers was a good story.

And it defangs an obvious area of criticism to just get the damned thing finished.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 04:13 PM (zDsvJ)

98 82,83 Has espn shut down yet? I don't have cable, but I would bet there are tears in heaven right now.

Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at August 30, 2014 04:14 PM (ucDmr)

99 I wish Walker would just take the time to get his degree. He probably
only needs a couple of courses. Marquette's a good school so I bet the
credits would transfer to UW or wherever it would be easiest for Walker
to wrap up his degree.

I think it's usually the case that you have to finish a degree within a certain period of time, typically 6 or 7 years. After that, I believe you have to start over. I hope I'm wrong.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 04:15 PM (4nR9/)

100 Pres. Perry, Pres. Haley, or their SS detail.

Who would be packing more heat on them?

Posted by: so, this just popped into my head too at August 30, 2014 04:15 PM (ekHTY)

101 Michael Sam is out?

Michael Sam is out?

-
OMG OMG!!!!!!

It's gonna be another Ferguson except this time they'll loot trendy little antique stores.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 30, 2014 04:15 PM (8MlTP)

102 Bwahaha The Rams make th smart move

Posted by: sven10077 at August 30, 2014 04:15 PM (/4AZU)

103 It's gonna be another Ferguson except this time they'll loot trendy little antique stores.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 30, 2014 04:15 PM (8MlTP)
LOL!

Posted by: Peaches at August 30, 2014 04:16 PM (8lmkt)

104 Michael Sam Gobble Head sales hardest hit.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at August 30, 2014 04:16 PM (whKdw)

105 Awesome, Great White Snark!

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 04:18 PM (zDsvJ)

106 Gobble Heads, too funny. What could have ben.

Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at August 30, 2014 04:18 PM (ucDmr)

107 Rick Perry was on the "Dead to Conservatives!" list a few short days ago. He got better!

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:18 PM (2cS/G)

108 107
Rick Perry was on the "Dead to Conservatives!" list a few short days ago. He got better!

Posted by: Lincolntf

Next up, Newt Gingrich.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 04:19 PM (4nR9/)

109 "Chris Christie strikes me as a guy that would go for the Democrats' jugular."

I have a handy-dandy pocket detector unit for GOP candidates who are going to turn out to be useless accommodationist squishes.

That unit relies on one issue: gun control.

Christie makes it flash a big bright Mitt Romney level warning signal.

Posted by: torquewrench at August 30, 2014 04:19 PM (noWW6)

110 I think it's usually the case that you have to finish a degree within a
certain period of time, typically 6 or 7 years. After that, I believe
you have to start over.
---

You may be right, although I know a lot of non-traditional (older) students at our local uni and I think they're still able to use their credits. It may depend on the institution.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 04:19 PM (zDsvJ)

111 Sam didn't make the cut, that's sports. I'm waiting for the cries of "homophobia!" to start any minute now. Fortunately, I'm listening to the radio, not watching ESPN, so I won't have to see the wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:21 PM (2cS/G)

112 >>>michael sam released from rams...wow...just wow...definitely "flaming skull" worthy...<<<

This just in: Celebrated cocksucker butthurt because being known as a cocksucker is more important than showcasing skills adequate to secure a future career in gay sports league.

Posted by: Fritz at August 30, 2014 04:21 PM (C0dQz)

113 Our nominee will be picked by voters in a handful of small, often blue states, and by a small donor class. I really can't get worked about who's running, because I have no input.

I would like to see a change in our stupid primary system though, like rotating the order of states.

Posted by: stace at August 30, 2014 04:22 PM (9PXzx)

114 F'em Up Buck!

The Incredible Buck!

Sieve!

Number nn!

Now if the band could only lose the blechweiser head-ache beer song.

Posted by: Fewenuff at August 30, 2014 04:24 PM (zPNX5)

115 Happy birthday Y-not!

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 04:25 PM (8FyP4)

116 My favorite Rammer, er Ram is out???

Posted by: Barry Soetoro at August 30, 2014 04:25 PM (xKIE3)

117 I don't know at this point which would be worse. If we break the existing system, well i'm kinda thinking it wasn't working properly anyway, or else we wouldn't have ended up with this piece of shit we have right
now.

Posted by: D-Lamp

Sorry I missed your comment, I was outside washing my dog.

Breaking the system is part of the goal of the Progressives and Obama. They do want to invalidate the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, and create something profoundly ......Progressive.

Yes, Obama is bad. Yes, he and his Regime have greatly damaged the Rule of Law and Constitutional process. I would be against a coup under the present situation because it opens the door to a lot of other things, and many of them bad. There is no guarantee that this would fix things in the long run.

The massive problem in the country today is the entitlement mentality that has overtaken a large plurality of the population. Be it government employees, people on welfare, old folks expecting Social Security and Medicare, etc.

The Progressive Democrats play to faction and entitlement, warning how bad things will get if some icky Republican Reich - winger gets elected, and our mouthbreather friends in the Media are only too happy to help them, along with all the corporatist Vichy Rethuglicans help.

A coup will not change peoples minds, but harden their resolve to fight for the Left. It still amazes me the Katrina van den Heuvel, Trust fund communist of "The Nation" gets as much public acknowledgement on the networks as she does. That's what we have to fight, the idiotic aquiesence to destructive ideas. The Republican Party is leaderless and thoughtless., with no real intellectual response to what the Left is doing.

Walker, Perry and Jindal are all good guys, but really, what do they STAND for, and how will they respond to the shovel fulls of Leftist-collectivist drivel that is spewed out on a daily basis.

We have to run on IDEAS, and not just anger about how things are screwed up. Anger should motivate us to work harder for what we value, but it is not a response in and of itself. That is, of course, how the Media want to always characterize the Conservative Right.
Back in the early '60's, Leftist news talker Daniel Schorr came up with "Thunder on the Right" to scare people off of Barry Goldwater.
After the 1994 turnover of the House and Senate, the idiotic Cokie Roberts (arch Democrat Media schill) talked about how the "angry white men" were on the rampage.

It's all happened before and is happening again.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative riding the comfy chair at August 30, 2014 04:25 PM (+1T7c)

118 62 The only people I know who care about credentials all vote dem anyway. I don't see it as a liability for walker. But a benefit.

Posted by: SH at August 30, 2014 03:54 PM

I dunno about that. There were plenty of conservatives/GOP-voters who held Sarah Palin's credentials against her. She is college-educated, but apparently not the "right" college(s).

Posted by: Clyde Shelton at August 30, 2014 04:26 PM (7A4qQ)

119 Happy Birthday Y-Not. Have a great day.

Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at August 30, 2014 04:27 PM (ucDmr)

120 We'll see if he ends up on some other team's practice squad. If he doesn't, he's done. Of course, he has probably already secured his seat on The View, so we might not have heard the last from him. Or maybe ESPN will just hire him as "Gay Sports Analyst" and give him his own show.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:27 PM (2cS/G)

121 Sandra Fluke is a proud member of the Slurped Tribe.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD)

I LOL'd

Posted by: olddog in mo at August 30, 2014 04:28 PM (wSqp9)

122 "It's a test of balance and flexibility" and quite distracting. I'll brb...

Posted by: Fewenuff at August 30, 2014 04:28 PM (zPNX5)

123 "I know I dismissed him over his open border policies like discounted
college tuition for illegals and being against a border fence. No excuse
for that."

Valid early warning signs.

Also, the fact that Perry went ahead in debates when he was having severe back trouble and was stoned on pain pills, and turned in an incoherent performance.

I'm not so down on him personally because of that -- part of being impaired is an impaired ability to judge whether you're impaired -- but rather it shows poor staff selection abilities.

Staffers have to be smart enough, and no-nonsense enough, and trusted enough, to sanity check plans, and to say to the big boss, "Boss, no. You're not in condition for this. Give it a pass."

Posted by: torquewrench at August 30, 2014 04:28 PM (noWW6)

124 Sam will probably make the Ram's practice squad. That's likely his only hope. Nobody else wants to deal with the sideshow.

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 04:29 PM (8FyP4)

125 I share your assessment of that snake Schmidt, but Perry hired him to work on his defense team against the bullshit DA charges, not his campaign staff. There is a difference.
Posted by: Weirddave(chopped liver) at August 30, 2014 03:44 PM (ofGFY)

----

Okay, one last try, Is Schmidt the only lawyer that Perry could have hired? Are you saying there were no other excellent attorneys from Texas (who've had excellent tort reform)?

Posted by: Seems legit at August 30, 2014 04:29 PM (A98Xu)

126 Sam is definitely espn spongevworthy.

Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at August 30, 2014 04:29 PM (ucDmr)

127 News flash. A lot of 7th rounders you never heard of and never will were also cut today.

Posted by: Duke Lowell at August 30, 2014 04:31 PM (3W1WP)

128 There isn't any way a complete border fence on the Rio Grande would be practical. When Mitt and Newt told you in the primary that they would build a complete border fence, they were LYING. At least Perry was honest, and far more knowledgable on the subject.

Posted by: stace at August 30, 2014 04:31 PM (9PXzx)

129 Okay, one last try, Is Schmidt the only lawyer that Perry could have hired? Are you saying there were no other excellent attorneys from Texas (who've had excellent tort reform)?
Posted by: Seems legit

_______________________________________

The lead attorney that Perry hired is the sleaziest slip and fall lawyer in Houston.

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 04:31 PM (8FyP4)

130 But, but, but.... none of those 3 guys have foreign policy experience. Isn't that why Barky got Uncle Joe?

Posted by: olddog in mo at August 30, 2014 04:31 PM (wSqp9)

131 Walker.

Later.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at August 30, 2014 04:31 PM (r9P/g)

132 I would vote for any of the Y-not Three if they come up on the ballot.

Supporting them is different. Okay for Perry, who not only got shat on by teh media -- and, let us not forget, Ace -- in '12 but has some solid experience. But Walker has too much of that Local Boy taint to him, and I'm not sure he would play in Mentor, Ohio or Oxford, Mississippi. Or Los Angeles, but no Republican can crack that nut.

Something about Jindal simply makes me want to turn away. It's not that Southern Boy thing (well, not exactly) and it isn't his background. I simply see him as a guy who has worked his way to the top of his personal ladder and shouldn't/can't go any higher.

Most of the rest aren't up to it IMO, including a few HQ Fan Faves. Not mentioning names, 'cause I don't want to start a ruckus.

I think we can push Perry across the line, at least as long as someone wraps Prince Reebus's mouth in duct tape. The alternative -- another friggin' Democrat -- is simply to awful to contemplate.

Posted by: MrScribbler at August 30, 2014 04:32 PM (dDzOj)

133 11 tackles and three sacks in pre season, against second-third stringers. Not insignificant, and the report I saw said they'd "like" to put him on the practice squad. Let's see if they do. As of 39 minutes ago, he's a free agent.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:33 PM (2cS/G)

134 this is slightly OT, it is a lecture about the loss of character in the Roman republic and the loss of freedom. It is also a discussion on Cicero's attempt to hold back the tide through eloquence.

http://tinyurl.com/qxn897y

Posted by: kindltot at August 30, 2014 04:34 PM (t//F+)

135 Sadly, Michael Sam only made one Rams roster this year.

The one he was most qualified to make.

Posted by: Sharkman at August 30, 2014 04:34 PM (Q0a7l)

136 Well, so far (no I don't expect it to last) WV who has to this point been in the bottom three or four in that other conference, is staying with bama.
10 - 10 with 11:15 to go in the half.

Posted by: teej at August 30, 2014 04:36 PM (JLRz+)

137 Scott Walker is the reincarnation of Ronald Reagan ... in the sense that he actually believes in Conservative principals and has been effective in a very liberal state of actually doing real harm to the Democrat industrial complex.

He will be president one day, I predict. He won't be president in 2016. There needs to be one more Democrat president before the country is ready to do the Democrat Party.

Scott Walker will wield the instrument.

Posted by: someguy at August 30, 2014 04:36 PM (3z91g)

138
82 Michael Sam released.
Posted by: NFL HATES GAYS! at August 30, 2014 04:04 PM (ZPrif)

First the slobbering kiss at the NFL draft and now this?

Do we have to know every detail of Sam's ghey life?

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars(TM) at August 30, 2014 04:36 PM (vSDwv)

139 Feel free to go O/T. I forgot to say open thread.

Posted by: Y-not on the phone at August 30, 2014 04:36 PM (zDsvJ)

140 What is impossible about a fence? For crying out loud, it doesn't have to be right ON the border, in the middle of a river, this isn't a cartoon. Fences, walls, towers, you know the things nations have defined their boundaries with for millennia, not hard to do. A fucking six-foot chain link would prevent 100% of "accidental" incursions by Mexican military, etc. There is nothing that will secure the border but securing it.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:37 PM (2cS/G)

141 OldThread:
Why doesn't he just lean out and take a dump on me personally. I can't get away from this asshole.

Posted by: JackStraw

I may have flipped the bird a few times when I lived in Germantown MD

Posted by: DaveA at August 30, 2014 04:37 PM (DL2i+)

142 I'm not sure if WV is looking good or Alabama is looking bad.

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 04:37 PM (8FyP4)

143 "There were plenty of conservatives/GOP-voters who held Sarah Palin's
credentials against her. She is college-educated, but apparently not
the 'right' college(s)."

Where "not the 'right' college(s)" == not Ivy League.

Hence sniffish disdain.

America's Presidents have been an exclusive Ivy League club since Reagan (Eureka College) left office. Bush the Lesser, Billy Jeff Blowjob, Bush the Lesser Still, and King Putt.

It sure doesn't feel like the Ivy-alumni post-Reagan presidents have been an improvement on him in any way. I would trade any of them for Zombie Reagan, including either of the Bushes, in half a heartbeat.

As for Palin's long grind through backwater colleges, America is an inherently aspirational country. It still has pulling yourself up by your bootstraps as a philosophy for many. There are a SHIT TON of voters who worked days to put themselves through night classes at a no-name university, or know a friend or family member who did so.

That could have been cleverly spun as a campaign outreach asset by a campaign who knew what they were doing (i.e. _not_ the utterly incompetent McCain '08 staff who were baffled by Palin).

Posted by: torquewrench at August 30, 2014 04:37 PM (noWW6)

144 OH NOES. SAMS. TEH HORRORS.

Posted by: the littl shyning man at August 30, 2014 04:37 PM (tmFlQ)

145 Has anyone checked the fainting couch to see if ESPN is still passed out? Or should we call the Whambulance for them?

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at August 30, 2014 04:39 PM (whKdw)

146 I'm listening to ACC football radio, still not a mention of Sam, but a news break is coming up.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:39 PM (2cS/G)

147 But, but, but.... none of those 3 guys have foreign policy experience. Isn't that why Barky got Uncle Joe?

-
Perry can see Mexico from his house, or if not there at least at the Home Depot parking lot.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 30, 2014 04:39 PM (8MlTP)

148 You know. No one knew who Bill Clinton was in September of 1990.

We pray for Reagan.
We'll take Perry.
We'll get Jeb Bush.

Posted by: Golfman in NC at August 30, 2014 04:39 PM (kivdt)

149 You say ISIL, I say ISIS.

Wanna bet no one, absolutely no one, speaking for the Obama admin, EVER uses anything but initials?

Whatever the initials, they will NEVER say the first word.

The word-that-is-never-to-be-spoken.

Posted by: the littl shyning man at August 30, 2014 04:40 PM (tmFlQ)

150 Walker is my Governor. I love him as my Governor and would like him to stay. I have a Scott Walker is my Hero T shirt and wear it proudly. After Act 10 and the crazy (and I mean crazy) behavior from unions, teachers and liberals including the recall, Walker showed that he has courage and steadfastness. After the John Doe investigations (which were a sham) Walker continued to behave with resolve. Unfortunately all of these distractions have shut the forward momentum of conservative legislation and we are at a standstill. I have yet to hear Walker discuss any global issues and these are important to me. I don't think lack of college degree hurts him.

Jindal seems like he has the cred but too soft spoken for these tumultuous times. I cannot connect with him. Maybe he is just not been given enough face time to show what he has.

Perry is a goof. All bravado and too much finger to the wind to check what is popular. Yes he is on a good track financially in TX but I don't like his cozy behavior with Muslims ( I believe we are at the beginning of a modern day crusade)

I still love Sarah. I don't care what anyone says. Sarah has the guts and the smarts to work with smart people. Faced against Hillary she would be a delight to watch. Someone posted Palin/Bolton... that's a great ticket.

Posted by: bossy barbara at August 30, 2014 04:40 PM (lchei)

151 Academic discussion.

Doesn't matter who the nominee is, Hillary wins in a landslide. Wish it weren't so, but it is what its.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at August 30, 2014 04:41 PM (0LHZx)

152 That QB for Alabama is having a suck fest.

Also, Lane Kiffen? LANE KIFFEN??

Posted by: Seems legit at August 30, 2014 04:41 PM (A98Xu)

153 You know. No one knew who Bill Clinton was in September of 1990.

+++++++++++++++++

We did.

Posted by: Various Arkansas Bar flies and trailer queens at August 30, 2014 04:42 PM (8FyP4)

154 I share your assessment of that snake Schmidt, but
Perry hired him to work on his defense team against the bullshit DA
charges, not his campaign staff. There is a difference.

Posted by: Weirddave(chopped liver) at August 30, 2014 03:44 PM (ofGFY)

If you are fighting snakes, it helps to have a snake on your team so you can have insight into how a snake thinks.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at August 30, 2014 04:42 PM (2w1g0)

155 "Back in the early '60's, Leftist news talker Daniel Schorr came up with 'Thunder on the Right' to scare people off of Barry Goldwater."

Schorr basically drew explicit parallels to Nazi Germany with the Goldwater campaign, in a country that had been fighting real live Nazis less than two decades beforehand.

Utterly disreputable bullshit. One of the worst episodes in American media history, which is saying a LOT.

I laughed and laughed when, forty years later, Schorr was a syndicated columnist out of L.A., and even the utterly loopy leftist _San Francisco Chronicle_ declined to pick him up again at syndication contract renewal, because not even their readership were interested in his sad schtick any longer, and Schorr was incredibly butthurt over the rejection.

Posted by: torquewrench at August 30, 2014 04:42 PM (noWW6)

156 Travelling Vietnam Memorial is in Topeka this weekend.
At the half I'm gonna shower then head in to pay my respects.
A trip to Lowe's for some pine bark mulch for my blueberries then of to a benefit where a band I used to be in is playing.

Love each other fellow babies.

Posted by: teej at August 30, 2014 04:43 PM (JLRz+)

157 Too many God Damned credentialed fools in government. It would be refreshing to have a "Truman" type in there at the helm. I look to what Walker has done while on the job. Those are the credentials i need.

Posted by: Truck Monkey, as Voiced by Brian Dennehy at August 30, 2014 04:43 PM (jucos)

158 128
There isn't any way a complete border fence on the Rio Grande would be
practical.

Why?

I get very nervous when Perry starts babbling about "boots on the ground", drones, and strategic fencing in urban areas. You know what that means? An open border, especially when the Dems regain office and decide that the boots, drones and light fences can be dispensed with.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 04:43 PM (4nR9/)

159 Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:37 PM (2cS/G)

True, the fence along the Rio Grande has to be built well north of the actual border.

Most of that is private land. Walling off that land and water would be a huge condemnation. It already has been. The government had to make lots of condemnations for the fence it's already built. Some fought it, some didn't, and the ones who didn't fight for more money got screwed, but some of the folks didn't have the money to even file a suit.

Posted by: stace at August 30, 2014 04:44 PM (9PXzx)

160 150 Walker is my Governor. I love him as my Governor and would like him to stay.

___________

I never get this attitude. I hear it all the time especially about Senators. Like Senator X is needed in the senate, so he shouldn't run.

WHAT?

You're saying Walker can do more good as a governor of a state than as POTUS? Come on. Suppose someone came to you and proposed a deal....Walker becomes POTUS and the most liberal human being in the country becomes governor of WI. Would you take the deal?

Same with senators. No 1 senator can do more good as a senator than he/she could as POTUS. I don't care if it's the best senator in the history of senators. It's still 1 out of 100.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at August 30, 2014 04:44 PM (0LHZx)

161 I think if America is to be saved, it will be by a Cuban by way of Canada.

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 04:45 PM (8FyP4)

162 You pray for zombie Reagan.
You'll settle for Rino(r)
You'll get Lieawatha, and like it, h8ers

Posted by: OneEyedJack at August 30, 2014 04:46 PM (agLwc)

163 I, for one, grandly hope that or historic first glorious black president will issue an axacutive order forcing the St Loose Rams to sign Michael Sam to a $100 trillion contract which he so richly deserves for being a historic first black gay soccer player.

Posted by: Mary Cloggenstein, Brattleboro Vermont at August 30, 2014 04:46 PM (HstNY)

164 Champ Bailey cut today. 12 Pro Bowls. Actually newsworthy.

Posted by: akula51 at August 30, 2014 04:47 PM (X6zQy)

165 No, because it's been done stupidly in the past doesn't mean we have to continue to do it stupidly in the future. If we're not going to build a fence/wall/barrier, then let's not spend another thin dime on border "security". It's all a fucking black hole until you close the two thousand miles of free-for-all zones.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:47 PM (2cS/G)

166 Sad, but Mr Moo Moo is right. Gonna be Hillary in a landslide.

The MFM will ensure it.

There will be photos of election night voter lines, women lined up as far as you can see.

Posted by: the littl shyning man at August 30, 2014 04:49 PM (tmFlQ)

167 128
There isn't any way a complete border fence on the Rio Grande would be practical.

There's a big difference between difficult and litigious, and impossible.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 04:50 PM (4nR9/)

168 Champ Bailey can still play. Someone will pick him up. Are the reality cameras going to show Sam getting a BJ from his twink BF to console him for not making the team?

Posted by: Truck Monkey, as Voiced by Brian Dennehy at August 30, 2014 04:50 PM (jucos)

169 So let's all roll over, play dead and stay home because Hillary's gonna win it./sarc.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 04:51 PM (0uI4m)

170 If the GOP tosses up another RINO I will stay home and watch the continuing destruction of the country

Posted by: Truck Monkey, as Voiced by Brian Dennehy at August 30, 2014 04:52 PM (jucos)

171 Champ Bailey is gay too?

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at August 30, 2014 04:52 PM (0LHZx)

172 Okay Mr. Moo Moo. I concede that if Walker gets the nomination I will work as hard as possible to elect him. I am just sick and tired of liberals running Wisconsin and when we finally get a good conservative, he may run for president.

Posted by: bossy barbara at August 30, 2014 04:53 PM (lchei)

173 Those girls' thighs look as if they could crush coconuts or bend steel.

no, thanks.

Posted by: TangoNine (Who the Hell is Mushy Snugglepants?) at August 30, 2014 04:53 PM (ejb/Q)

174 Bloody hell, what a great run for Alabama.

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 04:53 PM (8FyP4)

175 >>>Champ Bailey can still play. Someone will pick him
up.
Posted by: Truck Monkey, as Voiced by Brian Dennehy at August 30, 2014 04:50 PM (jucos)<<<

How sad is it that picking up Champ might actually help up... a lot.

Posted by: the Dallas defense at August 30, 2014 04:55 PM (ekHTY)

176 Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 04:47 PM (2cS/G)

It hasn't been done stupidly. It's been done the only possible way, which is to condemn lot so private land.

After what iv'e seen, my advice to these landowners is to hire a lawyer and fight for every penny, but that will of course make the fencing even more expense. Uncle Sam doesn't pay for the real value of the taking.

It's not possible to seal it. Gaps have to be left so that emergency equipment can get to houses, and so that people can go to town and to school etc. The fence is being built through the middle of towns and college campuses, because in some cases that the only way the fence can be built. It has to have gaps in it.

We should build more fence in areas where it makes sense, but more boots on the ground and more interior enforcement (remove incentive) are key.

As I said, anyone who tells you it's doable is lying to you, or doesn't know the situation.

Posted by: stace at August 30, 2014 04:55 PM (9PXzx)

177 Sad, but Mr Moo Moo is right. Gonna be Hillary in a landslide.

The MFM will ensure it.

Uh... incorrect. Take a lap, Netterman.

Posted by: TangoNine (Who the Hell is Mushy Snugglepants?) at August 30, 2014 04:55 PM (ejb/Q)

178 Too many God Damned credentialed fools in government. It would be refreshing to have a "Truman" type in there at the helm. I look to what Walker has done while on the job. Those are the credentials i need.
Posted by: Truck Monkey

Walker does seem like a "Truman" Republican. He has been steadfast under pretty tough conditions. The Democrats in Wisconsin have battled him almost every step of the way, including the illegal "DA" anonymous attacks on conservatives.
At least, if he were elected, we would know we would not have chosen a coward.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative riding the comfy chair at August 30, 2014 04:56 PM (+1T7c)

179 Sure, Hillary! is a lock to win.

Just like she was in 2008.

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 04:57 PM (8FyP4)

180 After what iv'e seen, my advice to these landowners is to hire a lawyer
and fight for every penny, but that will of course make the fencing even
more expense. Uncle Sam doesn't pay for the real value of the taking.

As opposed to, say, 30 million new permanent welfare cases?

It's not possible to seal it. Gaps have to be left so that emergency
equipment can get to houses, and so that people can go to town and to
school etc. The fence is being built through the middle of towns and
college campuses, because in some cases that the only way the fence can
be built. It has to have gaps in it.

Of course, but it's a lot easier to guard a 50' gap than a 500 mile one.

We should build more fence in areas where it makes sense, but more boots
on the ground and more interior enforcement (remove incentive) are key.

One is not the enemy of the other. Do both.

As I said, anyone who tells you it's doable is lying to you, or doesn't know the situation.

Okay, no need to prove your point, just dismiss those with whom you disagree. Much easier that way.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 04:59 PM (4nR9/)

181 You're talking about "gaps" big enough for a truck to drive through, I'm talking about the vast frontier that serves as a highway for illegals. Yes, there will be gates, and roads, and all the other things that accompany borders worldwide. At the very least create a bottleneck easier to observe/control. The "border check" stations are a joke. They are for smugglers who prefer the comfort of a car over a couple days hiking. Will people lose land to eminent domain? Sadly, probably so. But if done rationally, the compensation, water rights, etc. can be dealt with fairly. If a rancher would prefer to let a column of MS-13 rapists traipse over his land rather than have a fence, the whole nation suffers.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:00 PM (2cS/G)

182 WVa came to play. Wow.

Posted by: weirdflunkyonatablet at August 30, 2014 05:00 PM (DdzLC)

183 WV ties it up on kick-off return.

Posted by: olddog in mo at August 30, 2014 05:00 PM (wSqp9)

184 It would be refreshing to have a "Truman" type in there at the helm.

Does that mean you want someone who wants to nationalize the health care system?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at August 30, 2014 05:01 PM (W5DcG)

185 Just like she was in 2008.
Posted by: Countrysquire

Her health is so poor she may be incapacitated or dead by 2016.

Nothing is inevitable. Nothing is written until we, the people, write it.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative riding the comfy chair at August 30, 2014 05:02 PM (+1T7c)

186 Instead of a fence, how about a 50' wide strip with randomly placed landmines?

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 05:02 PM (8FyP4)

187 It's really hard to predict how will win in 2016.
We don't know what will happen in the next two years. If Barack Hussein Obama continues on his disastrous course (and why would he veer away from that?) people might just sour on Democrat politicians no matter who the nominee is.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 05:03 PM (0uI4m)

188 Hah! I'm feet dry.

no one here speaks english and I'm 3 feet taller than all of them.

I'm going to declare msyelf king...brb.

Posted by: TangoNine (Who the Hell is Mushy Snugglepants?) at August 30, 2014 05:03 PM (ejb/Q)

189 Just getting here. But i just need to mention that those calves on the far right are almost heifers. Impressive.

Posted by: bergerbilder at August 30, 2014 05:07 PM (8MjqI)

190 Sam? Ok... we all know that Kordell Stewart was so gay that Elton John called him after he cried on the sidelines and said"oh... yer gay."

Nothing to see here.

Posted by: TangoNine (Who the Hell is Mushy Snugglepants?) at August 30, 2014 05:08 PM (ejb/Q)

191 .....people might just sour on Democrat politicians no matter who the nominee is.
Posted by: FenelonSpoke

You have to beat "something" with "something better". The Media will help the Democrats with political narrative and drivel. More people are becoming impervious to that, but they still have influence.
The Republicans have to stand for something substantive.
What set Ronald Reagan apart as a candidate and President as a Republican, was that he knew what he stood for, knew what he was about and knew what he wanted to accomplish. The last generation of Republicans since GHWB in 1988 may have had "conservative" ideas, but were always too willing to accommodate every corrupt premise the Democrats propose.
Tip O'Neill and the Media never missed a chance to badmouth Reagan when he was President, but he knew it was political theater and kept on going.

Posted by: Bossy Conservative riding the comfy chair at August 30, 2014 05:08 PM (+1T7c)

192 The girls are heifers and all the male posters here look like Arnold Schwarznegger in his prime, and have lines of 25 year old women waiting to date them.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 05:10 PM (0uI4m)

193 Jindal has been in my top three for several years but I would rather he be Secretary of Shutting Down Agencies than President.

Either Perry or Walker are fine by me.

Posted by: alexthechick - Oh save us mighty SMOD at August 30, 2014 05:10 PM (IrByp)

194 Pep, Mitt and Newt were lying to you. Perry was honest. Do you prefer to be lied to? I don't.

You can't put a real border check at each of the thousands of gaps that are needed, in towns and on farms.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 05:11 PM (9PXzx)

195 Wonderful, TangoNine is now in the Land of the Robert Reich clones.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at August 30, 2014 05:12 PM (whKdw)

196 The girls are heifers and all the male posters here
look like Arnold Schwarznegger in his prime, and have lines of 25 year
old women waiting to date them.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 05:10 PM (0uI4m)

Glad to see you've arrived at The Truth!

Posted by: TangoNine (Who the Hell is Mushy Snugglepants?) at August 30, 2014 05:12 PM (ejb/Q)

197 Because nobody, no company, no Government, no known entity in the University can construct and manage a two-thousand mile border. It's science!

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:12 PM (2cS/G)

198 Wow, I just noticed the picture of the Wisconsin Beavers. Nice.

Posted by: Countrysquire, feeling reasonably fresh down there at August 30, 2014 05:13 PM (8FyP4)

199 I think Lieawatha is probably a more attractive candidate to the Power brokers in the Dem Party (not because of her pulchritude but because she's "new") than Hillary is.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 05:13 PM (0uI4m)

200 Universe

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:13 PM (2cS/G)

201 190 Kordell had about the same skill level as Sam. In other words he was mediocore.

Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at August 30, 2014 05:13 PM (ucDmr)

202 The Corner just posted a nice Ted Cruz item. Linked at Drudge. What I really like about Cruz is that he does not mince words and he appears more than willing to put some blood in the water regarding that clown in the wh.

Posted by: Peaches at August 30, 2014 05:13 PM (8lmkt)

203 Wonderful, TangoNine is now in the Land of the Robert Reich clones.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at August 30, 2014 05:12 PM (whKdw)

you don't know the half of it.

I'm going to start a religion!

Posted by: TangoNine (Who the Hell is Mushy Snugglepants?) at August 30, 2014 05:14 PM (ejb/Q)

204 Of the three mentioned, Walker is the most electable.

Jindal has ZERO chance, especially considering he has the bat shit crazy position of "no rape" exception for abortion. That's the equivalent on the Left for being against the death penalty. It's too fringe of a position.

Also, Louisiana is a red state and jindal is incredibly unpopular. That's not a good sign when a republican can't win over his home state that easily goes republican every presidential election.

Posted by: Uniden at August 30, 2014 05:14 PM (13G+x)

205 Jindal is known in Louisiana best for his successful reform of Louisiana's medical system. I didn't care for his and Perry's post 2012 election comments which I felt were directly related to still being pissed about the failed primary run. If I had to rank based on who best could be President I would go Walker, Jindal , Perry but my ranking would be different on who best could be elected.

Posted by: Bob Belcher at August 30, 2014 05:14 PM (suNSo)

206 This was predestined. The second Sam was drafted, many of us knew that this would be the moment that a million liberals would need to be educated, in embarrassing fashion, on the oh-so-complicated intricacies of the practice squad.

Sam was drafted by a team with an elite defensive line. Either someone else will take him on their 53 man roster, or the Rams will get him on their practice squad and ensure they maintain great depth (at this position at least) for a few years to come.

Posted by: Dave S. at August 30, 2014 05:16 PM (UvR6d)

207
Speaking for all members of the EPA, and I mean every last one of our employees, we are in full support of Hillary Rodham Clinton for president, and we will do anything and everything to guarantee her election. Are there any questions?

Posted by: Gina McCarthy, EPA Administrator at August 30, 2014 05:16 PM (3/wAJ)

208 Yeah Gina, why don't you go fuck yourself? And die.

Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at August 30, 2014 05:17 PM (ucDmr)

209 San Fran just lost a starting linebacker for the first half of the season, maybe they'll be looking for depth.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:17 PM (2cS/G)

210 Speaking for all members of the EPA, and I mean
every last one of our employees, we are in full support of Hillary
Rodham Clinton for president, and we will do anything and everything to
guarantee her election. Are there any questions?

Posted by: Gina McCarthy, EPA Administrator at August 30, 2014 05:16 PM (3/wAJ)

no questions, just... you have a thing in your teeth... it's right... Oh... shit... that's just the way your face looks! My bad! sorry!

Posted by: TangoNine (Who the Hell is Mushy Snugglepants?) at August 30, 2014 05:19 PM (ejb/Q)

211 209 Sam would be a perfect fit in San Fran. Much more lifestyle opportunities. And culture and shit.

Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at August 30, 2014 05:20 PM (ucDmr)

212
You can't put a real border check at each of the thousands of gaps that are needed, in towns and on farms.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 05:11 PM (9PXzx)
Thousands, huh. And just how many "boots on the ground" are we talking about?

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:20 PM (4nR9/)

213 If a rancher would prefer to let a column of MS-13 rapists traipse over his land rather than have a fence, the whole nation suffers.
Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:00 PM (2cS/G)

You talk to people who live on the border or are affected by the crime directly, as my family is, and most of them will tell you a complete fence is a silly notion and not doable.

Pur ranch os north of the border, but next to one of the interior highway checkpoints, so guess how the smugglers avoid the checkpoint? they go through our ranch. We find backpacks, our neighbors have been tied up and robbed, millions of dollars of drugs have been caught on our land, we don't leave the house without guns anymore, and my uncle had two Ukrainians that came up to the house arrested. Even so, we and most everyone in the area know that a complete fence is absurd. We even kicked the BP off our land because with all the new hires they cause more trouble than they prevent. We call the sheriff when we see someone.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 05:20 PM (9PXzx)

214 Posted by: Bossy Conservative riding the comfy chair at August 30, 2014 05:08 PM (+1T7c)

Reagan compromised with Oneil more than some would like to acknowledge. I'm just glad the Internet as we now know it wasn't around and allowed Reagan to do his job without hearing it from his own side.

Posted by: Bob Belcher at August 30, 2014 05:20 PM (suNSo)

215 >>>Are there any questions?

Posted by: Gina McCarthy, EPA Administrator at August 30, 2014 05:16 PM (3/wAJ)<<<

Yeah. Was that you who shit in the hall?

Posted by: random EPA employee at August 30, 2014 05:20 PM (ekHTY)

216 Jindal has ZERO chance, especially considering he has the bat shit crazy
position of "no rape" exception for abortion. That's the equivalent on
the Left for being against the death penalty. It's too fringe of a
position.

I did not know he held that position. It has the virtue of intellectual and moral consistency, but I believe it would be fatal to any candidate.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:21 PM (4nR9/)

217 Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 05:20 PM (9PXzx)

Let's try and when it doesn't work I'll let you tell us I told you so.

Posted by: Bob Belcher at August 30, 2014 05:23 PM (suNSo)

218 What is absurd is allowing your property to be used by criminals and most likely terrorists to invade your own country. But hey, if you love life without a fence, what do you care if a Guatemalan gangbanger rapes a few kids in Sheboygan, not your problem.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:23 PM (2cS/G)

219 Scott Walker just to make the hyper-libs in Madison go into cardiac arrest

Posted by: MikeH at August 30, 2014 05:23 PM (leMF2)

220 Kill the EPA. Didn't Nixon spawn that clusterfuck?

Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at August 30, 2014 05:24 PM (ucDmr)

221 Jindal has ZERO chance, especially considering he has the bat shit crazy

position of "no rape" exception for abortion. That's the equivalent on

the Left for being against the death penalty. It's too fringe of a

position.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:21 PM (4nR9/)

jindall looks like someone held him captive in a tanning booth for about 10 weeks. Are we shallow? Yes.

Can you recover from looking like someone tried to drown you in tanning lotion? No.

it is what it is.

Posted by: TangoNine (Who the Hell is Mushy Snugglepants?) at August 30, 2014 05:25 PM (ejb/Q)

222 Nood open thread that involves less scrolling.

Posted by: Y-not at August 30, 2014 05:25 PM (zDsvJ)

223 most of them will tell you a complete fence is a silly notion and not doable.

You keep saying things like that, but offer no evidence as to why it is impossible, as per your initial claim. I feel for you and your family's situation, but I have yet to see any convincing evidence that it can't be done. I've seen lots of people who don't want it to be done, but that's a very different proposition.

Build the damn wall and make it 50' high. With moats, alligators, and watchtowers.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:25 PM (4nR9/)

224 Nobody wants gangbangers to rape their families and not supporting one long fence on the border doesn't mean that you do. It seems to me that no matter who gets in as President or in Congress one border fence will never be made. Border security is a complex problem; It probably demands a variety of responses.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 30, 2014 05:27 PM (0uI4m)

225 Thousands, huh. And just how many "boots on the ground" are we talking about?
Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:20 PM (4nR9/)

I have no idea. One farmer I know was given keys when the CBP closed his gap with a gate. The caretaker quit because his house was on the wrong side of the fence, and he didn't want to have keys that the illegals might go after him for. He also didn't trust that fire or law enforcement would be able to get to him in time in case of emergency. The fence goes through towns, so there's a gap at every street.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 05:27 PM (9PXzx)

226 I completely agree with this post and am in the same boat as Y-Not. I'm not officially backing any one person yet, but Perry's my #1/#2 (with Cruz) in hopes for a successful run.

And, yes, please no "Tardisil" crap this time!! Or "racist rocks". If we could keep stupid people from running (looking at you Bachmann and Cain) it would be wonderful. I can't believe what happened last time, it still mind-boggling.

Of the three choices here, it's Perry, Jindal, and Walker.

In case you haven't seen it, there was a lengthy and charming article on Perry in the National Journal yesterday:

http://tinyurl.com/k2ryyym

Posted by: Aslan's Girl, Team Perry too! at August 30, 2014 05:29 PM (KL49F)

227 The anti-border control people used to claim that it was only the "image" of being a walled country that deterred them from building one. Now they claim it's a technical impossibility. Next up, a fence will kill the lizards!

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:29 PM (2cS/G)

228 Oh please, the cattle ranchers can fuck off. Are we really going to flush a whole nation down the shitter over some cows getting cheap water?

Buy them out or they can leave, but we're not going to NOT build a fence over some ranchers.

Obviously, the "virtual fence" doesn't work, and it leaves it up to Democrat administrations to enforce.

Whatever a fence costs, it's worth it. If some people have to move their cattle elsewhere, I think that's a pretty menial sacrifice for the good of the nation.

Posted by: Uniden at August 30, 2014 05:29 PM (13G+x)

229 It doesn't matter what they "want" vis a vis rapists, terrorists, thugs, etc, what matters is what they, and the current open border policy, enable.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:31 PM (2cS/G)

230 The caretaker quit because his house was on the wrong side of the fence,
and he didn't want to have keys that the illegals might go after him
for. He also didn't trust that fire or law enforcement would be able to
get to him in time in case of emergency. The fence goes through towns,
so there's a gap at every street.

Really? I should rank this person's admittedly bad situation above national security and the probability of terrorists coming across the border?

If I had any faith at all in other methods of securing the border, I'd say fine. I don't, and the record supports my skepticism. I look at the big picture and consider the tradeoffs. The convenience of border ranchers comes in second, I'm sorry.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:31 PM (4nR9/)

231 Nobody's talking about "one long fence". Again, this isn't a cartoon, or the Brady boys' bedroom, with an inviolate chalk line. It's about the basic responsibility of every nation, to mark and monitor their own borders. Fences, walls, ditches, towers, whatever works.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:35 PM (2cS/G)

232 Buy them out or they can leave, but we're not going to NOT build a fence over some ranchers.

I wish I shared your optimism.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:35 PM (4nR9/)

233 Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:25 PM (4nR9/)

Anything is possible if you throw enough money at it, but it's laughable to think of a wall that cuts off everyone from the farmland, towns, river and reservoirs. It's like destroying a town to save it. Even with a complete wall, you still have to man all of the wall everyday, and then there will be tunnels anyway. You still need boots on the ground.

Seminole and the Pecos river canyons have chunks of highway bridges in their stool. A fence wouldn't last the next tropical storm that goes inland. It really is funny to even think about if you've been there and know the flooding history. The Pecos river area is the second worst in the world for flash floods.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 05:37 PM (9PXzx)

234 Gee, stace, if only there was a profession and a multi gazillion dollar industry geared exactly toward solving such engineering problems. Alas, no. Fencing is a skill lost to history.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:38 PM (2cS/G)

235 Even with a complete wall, you still have to man all of the wall
everyday, and then there will be tunnels anyway.

I hadn't heard that the Israelis had given up their wall due to the tunnels.

You still need boots on
the ground.

Yes. Yes you do.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:39 PM (4nR9/)

236 Yeah, aqueducts and Hadrian's Wall were a real pain.

I'm sure you could never build a fence with today's technology.

Posted by: ancient Romans at August 30, 2014 05:42 PM (ekHTY)

237 bat shit crazy

position of "no rape" exception for abortion.

Because it's sane to murder the baby over the fathers crime.

jindal looks like someone held him captive in a tanning booth

Dood, he's Indian.

Annex the river and build the fence on the Mexican side. Hell, pay them to build it. I forget which Mexican comic I stole that joke from.

Posted by: DaveA at August 30, 2014 05:42 PM (DL2i+)

238 >>>Yeah, aqueducts and Hadrian's Wall were a real pain.

I'm sure you could never build a fence with today's technology.

Posted by: ancient Romans at August 30, 2014 05:42 PM (ekHTY)<<<

Word.

Posted by: ancient Chinese at August 30, 2014 05:44 PM (ekHTY)

239 Rick Perry is NOT against a border fence -- he just wants it built of flesh-and-blood (more patrol agents) and drones, and physical fencing in the areas where it works.

That's being FOR a fence and also accommodating the ranchers who've been there for generations.

Why would we want to give up the Rio Grande to crappy Mexico? We have water rights that we shouldn't give away to those thieves and in a dry state like TX water is gold. The Rio Grande moves quite a bit during the year which is also why a brick-and-mortar fence is silly there. A flesh-and-blood fence is just as good.

AND remember during Eisenhower's era, we didn't need no stinking fence! We had a tough immigration policy, that get this, we actually enforced!! It's Ted Kennedy's 1964 immigration bill that started the craziness.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl, Team Perry too! at August 30, 2014 05:45 PM (KL49F)

240 http://tinyurl.com/k2ryyym

Posted by: Aslan's Girl, Team Perry too! at August 30, 2014 05:29 PM (KL49F)
Great article, Aslan's Girl. Reading it now. Thanks for the link!

Posted by: Peaches at August 30, 2014 05:47 PM (8lmkt)

241 AND remember during Eisenhower's era, we didn't need no stinking fence! We had a tough immigration policy, that get this, we actually enforced!!

Irrelevant. The country that enforced the Eisenhower exodus no longer exists.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:48 PM (4nR9/)

242 to mark and monitor their own borders

The markers in upstate MN are 1 foot concrete cubes with a little silver painted post on the side of the creek. Some fall in every spring.

Posted by: DaveA at August 30, 2014 05:48 PM (DL2i+)

243 242
to mark and monitor their own borders

The markers in
upstate MN are 1 foot concrete cubes with a little silver painted post
on the side of the creek. Some fall in every spring.

Posted by: DaveA

Canada. A dagger pointed at the heart of the Boundary Waters Canoe Area.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:49 PM (4nR9/)

244 239
Rick Perry is NOT against a border fence -- he just wants it built of
flesh-and-blood (more patrol agents) and drones, and physical fencing in
the areas where it works.

You know who else was in favor of those things? George Bush and John McCain. How'd that work out?

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:50 PM (4nR9/)

245 Israel's wall doesn't go over water, not like it would in TX with the **entire** border being the Rio Grande.. Israel would never give up water rights as water there is gold, too.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl, Team Perry too! at August 30, 2014 05:51 PM (KL49F)

246 245
Israel's wall doesn't go over water, not like it would in TX with the
**entire** border being the Rio Grande.. Israel would never give up
water rights as water there is gold, too.

Okay, you build parts of the wall of 50' chain link and a set of border guards to watch it rust. Wow, difficult.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:52 PM (4nR9/)

247 Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:50 PM (4nR9/)

After your hypocrisy last week, I have you on "ignore", but I'll break it to say this: GWB and McCain lied. They neither one wanted border security. Gee, maybe that's why they were for amnesty. Perry, otoh, is on record as having spent $4 MILLION TX dollars to secure the border as much as a governor is allowed (he doesn't have the power of the Feds). He is on record as desperately fighting Bush AND Obama for more border security. He's wanted this for YEARS. In fact, I think that's the main reason he wants to be potus -- HE would be the one in authority to actually secure the damn border instead of begging past potuses who ignore him.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl, Team Perry too! at August 30, 2014 05:54 PM (KL49F)

248 Irrelevant. The country that enforced the Eisenhower exodus no longer exists.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:48 PM (4nR9/)

Not true. Every poll shows Americans who want border enforcement are in the vast majority. They'd be for it because they are desperate.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl, Team Perry too! at August 30, 2014 05:57 PM (KL49F)

249 231 Nobody's talking about "one long fence". Again, this isn't a cartoon, or the Brady boys' bedroom, with an inviolate chalk line. It's about the basic responsibility of every nation, to mark and monitor their own borders. Fences, walls, ditches, towers, whatever works.
Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:35 PM (2cS/G)

No actually people are talking about one long double fence, and that's what Perry was criticized for when he poopooed that. Mitt and Newt promised to build a solid, complete fence, and they were lying. Perry said to build fencing where possible, and he was eviscerated for being realistic and knowledgable.

I want some fencing, lots of boots and sensors, but also get rid of the incentives. One big problem is that while Mexico no longer sends its people in large numbers to work here, the Mexican cartels are entrenched, and they are making tons of money smuggling drugs and OTMs into the US. If we could send in Delta and SEAL team 6 against them that would help--I know that's not happening anytime soon, but it needs to. Another thing not happening soon is for President Ebola to stop inviting people here. That's what caused the recent surge of Central Americans. That flow has decreased, but the number is still unacceptable. Ranchers in Brooks county are on track this year to find more dead bodies than ever on their properties.

I know one friend's ranch right on the river that now uses Blackwater--type security. My friend has a machine gun and so do her cousins. They hate what's happening, but think the idea of a solid fence is ludicrous. Some ranchers are taking about jointly building with the CBP border control/tick control/wildlife corridors that CBP can patrol. This would use the tick fences that are already in place (tick fences don't stop people, but they slow them a little), and the senderos could be widened and used for patrols. Most of the big ranches already do brush sculpting for their most lucrative crops, which are quail and big deer.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 05:58 PM (9PXzx)

250 He is on record as desperately fighting Bush AND Obama for more border security.

And yet, if you want to get serious about border security, you don't have a heart.

Also, I have no regrets about last week's exchange, but I agree that the snark in my last post was unnecessary. For that, I apologize.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:59 PM (4nR9/)

251 Not true. Every poll shows Americans who want border enforcement are in
the vast majority. They'd be for it because they are desperate.

Look again at how many of them would be in favor of rounding up the illegals and putting them on buses to the border. Not going to happen. Once they're past the border, they're in.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 06:00 PM (4nR9/)

252 I want some fencing, lots of boots and sensors, but also get rid of the incentives.

Again, why not all of the above? At least with the wall, you have a physical asset in place that the Dems can't simply ignore.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 06:02 PM (4nR9/)

253 @249
You paint a grim picture. We get that the situation is bad. Yet, when confronted with the only option that has been shown to work, you balk. I don't.

Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 06:03 PM (4nR9/)

254 So a fence/wall wouldn't help your armed neighbors? As long as the open border is contributing crime, terrorism and human trafficking, no excuse is good enough for me. If you're unwilling to have a fence, and willing to allow terrorists and criminals to roam freely as long as you don't see them, then you'll continue to aid and abet the destruction of the country.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:13 PM (2cS/G)

255 234 Gee, stace, if only there was a profession and a multi gazillion dollar industry geared exactly toward solving such engineering problems. Alas, no. Fencing is a skill lost to history.
Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 05:38 PM (2cS/G)

It's not just engineering problems. I said it could be done if you want to throw billions of dollars at it. Then you've got people fenced off from their livelihoods, but who cares about that?

It's not going to ever happen, no matter who becomes president, and anyone who promises it is lying. That's why it shouldn't be a GOP primary issue. Everyone except Perry is either going to lie about it or make up shit because they don't know what they're talking about.

Ask the people who live there and who are most affected by the violence, know the situation best, and have the most need to stop it. They are not the ones calling for a complete solid fence.

I already told you the situation on our ranch and my friends' ranches and farms. Or look at one of the better border guard groups like Texas Border Volunteers. They see dead aliens everyday--the guy I know was a brought a human head by his dog--and have to carry guns everywhere, but they aren't calling for a solid fence. They know it's stupid.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 06:14 PM (9PXzx)

256 53 You know. No one knew who Bill Clinton was in September of 1990.

+++++++++++++++++

We did.
Posted by: Various Arkansas Bar flies and trailer queens at August 30, 2014 04:42 PM (8FyP4)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Thanks for keeping Bill distracted, girls. Huma and I owe you, big time.

Posted by: HRC at August 30, 2014 06:14 PM (G9Ked)

257 Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 05:59 PM (4nR9/)

You are completely misrepresenting Perry's "don't have a heart". It was NOT in regards to border security or a fence which is what we're discussing here. It was solely about minors who've been in TX for x-number years, graduated from TX HS, and merely letting them have the discount on in-state tuition for little in-state TX colleges. It was to keep them off welfare -- Perry's own words. Actually, that should paint Perry as a mean ol' racist because he's assuming that illegals are on welfare. He said he'd rather let them have the discount and get them jobs than have them on the doll at TX taxpayer expense. He knows it ain't a perfect solution, but he is barred from actually deporting them (that's Fed territory) and he's making lemonade outta lemons. And the bill was passed by the TX leg. in overwhelming numbers.

As for our "exchange" last week, the snark was no big deal. It was the pot-meet-kettle of you jumping on me because I didn't like one post of someone's when you were doing the exact same thing with me. You didn't like one post of mine so you called me names.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl, Team Perry too! at August 30, 2014 06:15 PM (KL49F)

258 Plus, free backpacks!

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:15 PM (2cS/G)

259 Why is a fence made of brick-and-mortar better than one made of flesh-and-blood? Especially taking into consideration the uniqueness of TX's border being 100% water?

All other walls mentioned here (Great Wall of China, Hadrian's Wall, Israel's) are not built on water.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl, Team Perry too! at August 30, 2014 06:19 PM (KL49F)

260 Are you kidding? Nobody is talking about fencing in the river. You've heard the term "set back"? No, you must be kidding.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:20 PM (2cS/G)

261 Honey Badger may not give a shit... but, he sure does love Badger cheerleaders...!

Posted by: The Honey Badger at August 30, 2014 06:24 PM (FYvb/)

262 If the people who live there, and know the situation best, think a wall/fence would make things worse, they're nuts. Plain and simple. Fences and walls work. It's not complicated. Even if they don't cotton to the notion, the rest of the country pays dearly for their anti-fencism.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:25 PM (2cS/G)

263 You paint a grim picture. We get that the situation is bad. Yet, when confronted with the only option that has been shown to work, you balk. I don't.
Posted by: pep at August 30, 2014 06:03 PM (4nR9/)

A solid wall like you want would wall everyone off from their livelihoods, including the water that forms the basis for that. It would bisect towns and universities, parts of which would have to be relocated. Might as well cede millions of acres to Mexico if you're going to do that. It' still worth a lot now. With that 50' wall, it's worthless. It would be destroying it to save it. It's not going to ever happen anyway, so this discussion only has value as entertainment. I've been rattling on since I enjoy talking about it and I'm avoiding household tasks, but I've been too talky.

Old reminiscences: I used to hide behind the door with mom's shotgun when she would go out to hand food and water to the illegal Mexican men. We felt sorry for them and sometimes hired them, but I didn't like it when we had no men around, so I would get the gun.

Now when we see anyone, we call the sheriff. The modern crossers are too dangerous. it's not like the old days. I mentioned above how my uncle and aunt recently had two Ukrainian men come up to the house to ask to use the phone! My uncle said "give me the number, and I'll call your friend", but he called the sheriff while the Ukrainians sat outside in the porch swing. This is ten miles from the nearest public road. If there are Ukrainians going through our place now, God knows what other nationalities are there.

Gotta go see about dinner. Thanks guys.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 06:33 PM (9PXzx)

264 Plumbing, another lost science.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:34 PM (2cS/G)

265 262 If the people who live there, and know the situation best, think a wall/fence would make things worse, they're nuts.

Not nuts if your house is stuck on the wrong side of the fence or you can no longer raise cattle, get to your house on Amistad Lake, or farm your land. It would be nuts to want that.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 06:36 PM (9PXzx)

266 Move the fence. Is that so hard? Allowing the infiltration of our nation is neither honorable nor rational.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:37 PM (2cS/G)

267 Sorry, I said I was going to go, but one more thing. You say we're all nuts, but you might consider the idea that the thousands of us who actually live in the area might know more about it than people who don't. it's a simpler explanation than the one in which we are all nuts.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 06:42 PM (9PXzx)

268 The Federal government is actually aiding and abetting the invasion of the United States.

If you think a problem like that can be solved with voting, you're just not getting it.

Posted by: eman at August 30, 2014 06:42 PM (MQEz6)

269 You might consider that those of us who live in cities populated by the evil you allow in, might think differently.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:43 PM (2cS/G)

270 You call the Sheriff and he arrests the illegals and then hands them over to the Feds who then ship them to Massachusetts.

If I lived in MA, I'd say don't call the Sheriff.

Posted by: eman at August 30, 2014 06:46 PM (MQEz6)

271 Perry wants gun boats, all along the Rio Grande.
He's invested TX dollars in some that are patrolling the river now...but there needs to be more.

Perry's solution for securing the border would be...turn the Navy lose, in gun boats on the Rio Grande.
+ Put a fence where it makes sense to have a fence.
+ Keep a sizable presence of boots on the ground, patrolling the entire border.
+ Use drones and motion sensors, to aid andfacilitate the patrols.

In other words, Perry's approach to securing the border is basically a'Do it All' scenario.

Those of you who seem to think that A Fence is the complete solution need to look at a map of the Rio Grande.
Zoom down on the satellite pictures and really look at it.

Posted by: wheatie at August 30, 2014 06:48 PM (zUXZx)

272 I like newts insight, and that is lacking across the fucking globe, case you aint noticed

Posted by: stephen livingston seagull at August 30, 2014 06:52 PM (MNj9H)

273 Fences work, ask China and Israel.

Why we don't simply adopt the exact same immigration policies as Mexico I do not know.

Posted by: Seems legit at August 30, 2014 06:53 PM (A98Xu)

274 What about the Rio Grande? It's impossible to have a tower/fence/wall within a million miles of it? Somehow civilizations have been able to manage the feat of building walls and fences pretty much everywhere, including near rivers.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:57 PM (2cS/G)

275 266 Move the fence. Is that so hard? Allowing the infiltration of our nation is neither honorable nor rational.
Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 06:37 PM (2cS/G)

It can't be built in the floodplain, by international treaty, and of course because it would wash away. You might be able to change the treaty with Mexico, but you can't stop hurricanes from going up that river and flooding it. It has to be built well north of the river, out of Rio Grande floodplain, across farms, reservoirs, towns, universities, etc. No matter where you build it, it's on someone's property, although some of the land is federally owned wildlife refuges, national recreational areas, and national parks. Most is privately owned though.

One fun thing you can do to get an idea is go on google earth or similar, and zoom way in on the Rio Grande. Start at it's mouth at the Gulf, and go inland. Follow it closely. You wouldn't want a fence to follow the river even if you could put it there, because it would double the length. There are numerous parts where Mexico is actually north of Texas. That's how windy it is in the southern part. As you go far inland, it's deserts, canyons, and two huge reservoirs. The fencing is being built well north of the river, the actual border, because it has to be. The fence at Del Rio at the border crossing--the legal one--is hilarious. I have a picture. It's a huge tall fence above the river plain that suddenly turns into a little livestock fence that even I could get over or through easily. They could probably extend that fence there a ways without causing too much trouble. Every area is different though.

Posted by: stace , Queen of Typos at August 30, 2014 06:58 PM (9PXzx)

276 A fence that might require maintenance and repairs? Impossible!

Without at least the will to secure the border, we are sentencing ourselves to misery. We might soon find out how much, if ISIS decides to take a hike through open border land.

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2014 07:03 PM (2cS/G)

277 I still think it's hilarious that Romney was promising this fence while he had illegals mowing his lawn.

A fence where feasible is necessary. Where it isn't, it really isn't. The idea of completely securing our borders is hilarious. This country has enormous coasts near Mexico. We have enormous transit from Mexico.

The problem is the douchebags with illegal alien lawn care or dishwashers or housekeepers and the douchebags giving them benefits (which simply lower the amount the douchebags have to pay their workers).

Perry's view on giving education to those whose parents brought them here is both wise and unwise in the long term. These kids growing up to be taxpayers with normal jobs instead of the welfare recipient lawn care worker or drug dealer is, I guess, better. Yet it's another benefit, when the more I think about it, should be refused. Good arguments on both sides, but ultimately, they aren't going to stop coming because politicians have been promising a fence for decades that they know is largely BS.

It's funny. Perry has largely been A+ on border security, but his stupid comment on the dream act has given a lot of people some reasonable fears he'll be an amnesty type. He'll have to work hard to overcome that one. I think that is probably his biggest issue to work on.

Posted by: dustin at August 30, 2014 07:12 PM (N6hW5)

278 may I just say... if the Repubs ran Moses and the Dems ran Hitler, many inthe MSM would tell us that Hitler had executive experience and turned the Germaneconomy around, while Moses was just following orders and from someone no one could actually see.

And I expect the Repub establishment will try their collective damnest to give us another can't-lose loser.

Posted by: mallfly at August 30, 2014 07:20 PM (zjcTL)

279 mallfly, that's very very true.

this focus on electability is always based on the primary media bias for RINOs, who always wind up unable to close the deal

Posted by: dustin at August 30, 2014 07:29 PM (N6hW5)

280 #194 border check, sniper hide, whatever...

Posted by: Richard McEnroe at August 30, 2014 07:53 PM (r1eQf)

281 I live in Louisiana. Jindal is ideologically great but cannot manage. His administration is full of people who make Jen Psaki look like an elder stateswoman. He is sort of the right-wing version of Obama in his failure to work with legislators. So although I like him as a person and I like his ideology, I do not want him as President.

Posted by: Marta Richards at August 30, 2014 07:59 PM (GVA22)

282 Queen,

I do listen to people like you who live on the borders and we need people who will use local experts to help solve problems. When government gets so BIG and from a Washington DC perspective only, they solve problems the BIG government way and this means any local input is dismissed.

Posted by: bossy barbara at August 30, 2014 08:56 PM (lchei)

283 I like Jindal as a veep and Perry as a contender.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at August 30, 2014 09:50 PM (Y92Nd)

284 lincolntf, a fence will do ABSOLUTELY NO GOOD unless you are prepared to back it up with deadly force and say "So What" to the pictures of dead women and children killed horribly as a result.

That is precisely what Mexico does at its' southern border, but no one is taking pictures there. Are you really naive enough to think there won't be pictures at the US border?

Posted by: SDN at August 30, 2014 10:25 PM (1KXKX)

285 " if the Repubs ran Moses and the Dems ran Hitler, many inthe MSM would tell us that Hitler had executive experience and turned the Germaneconomy around"

You left out pro-Palestinian!

Posted by: Rashid Khalidi at August 31, 2014 03:09 AM (eVemY)

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