Doomed: Even The Vaunted Boehner Plan Cuts Only One <i>Billion</i> in 2012

Doomed: Even The Vaunted Boehner Plan Cuts Only One Billion in 2012

Charles Krauthammer just called this a "great achievement."

Over 10 years, it cuts, it is supposed, $1.1 trillion dollars.

But almost all of those cuts come in the tenth year.

See page 9 for the overall effect on the deficit, year by year.

The line of year-by-year "total effect on the deficit" reads:

-1 -16 -57 -73 -85 -96 -109 -123 -138 -153

The CBO scores the ten year deficit reduction as $851 billion, not $1.1 trillion.

They're rewriting their proposal in light of the CBO's scoring of the plan.

And probably, as Gabe writes in an email, due to mass hysteria.

Thanks to DrewM for spotting that.

Isn't that less than the $2 billion in 2012 that Biden and the Democrats proposed?

Posted by: Ace at 06:46 PM

Comments

(Jump to bottom of comments)

1 Oh hell no

Posted by: mugiwara at July 26, 2011 06:47 PM (KI/Ch)

2 And here I was kind of thinking the Boehner plan was actually not that bad.

Fuck these assholes.

Posted by: mugiwara at July 26, 2011 06:48 PM (KI/Ch)

3 Ooops

Looks like the plan is already being rewritten.

RT @ChadPergram: House GOP staff "looking at options to re-write" the Boehner bill. CBO score came in low. They want to amp up the number.

Posted by: JAFKIAC at July 26, 2011 06:48 PM (SjD8y)

4 Does anything mean anything anymore?

Posted by: right at July 26, 2011 06:49 PM (RzLbD)

5 Boehner's a fucking joke, but he's a Republican "leader" so that goes without saying.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 26, 2011 06:49 PM (IMglX)

6 I spent an hour on Twitter arguing for this thing as the best we could do. Then the CBO score comes out.

Fuck it.

Didn't we get like 30 billion (when we were supposed to get 100 billion) this year?

So we're going from 30 to 1?

Wrong way guys.

Posted by: DrewM. at July 26, 2011 06:50 PM (WNzUA)

7 Maybe if we cut zero dollars in 2012 Krauthammer will call it a "really great achievement."

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 06:50 PM (AZGON)

8 As I said on the previous thread; CK has gone total beltway. He does not see that we are beyond politics now.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 06:51 PM (M9Ie6)

9 How can we not have our credit rating dropped if this is the kind of bullshit that's under serious consideration? And Paul Ryan is on board with this? WTF?

Posted by: Xander Crews at July 26, 2011 06:51 PM (UNJrC)

10 Anything that's not done right now, never happens.

Posted by: right at July 26, 2011 06:51 PM (RzLbD)

11 Someone just linked on the other thread that CBO scored it as cutting $850B, not $1T.

Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 06:51 PM (5H6zj)

12 Didn't we get like 30 billion (when we were supposed to get 100 billion) this year?

Posted by: DrewM. at July 26, 2011 06:50 PM (WNzUA)
I believe that 30B was later re-scored to about 1/3B, and I'm sure we'll just end up spending more when they re-re-score it.

Posted by: mugiwara at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (KI/Ch)

13 I think it's time to call in the Arme and start kicking ass.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (IMglX)

14 Fox just said the House ConCons have effected a re-write. Boehner doesn't have the conservatives on board and he has a choice: re-write to get them or re-write to get Dems. If he chooses #2, he won't be speaker in 2013.

He (and McConnell) tried to get this shit thru and it failed. God for the ConCons we sent to PlanetDC. I suspect Boehner will re-write to satisfy the conservatives and throw it out there.

And all the RINOs who gnashed teeth here and everywhere because we were all going to die on Aug. 4th, were wrong. Remind you of TARP terror?

Posted by: Sukie Tawdry at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (MPtFW)

15 fresh Doom... yum

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (jdOk/)

16 Fuck Obama. Fuck his traitorous, soulless ass sideways.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (QcFbt)

17 Gosh.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 06:53 PM (ECjvn)

18 I haven't read all the comments yet but has anyone mention that all of DC is a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure?

Posted by: Tami at July 26, 2011 06:53 PM (ULMuv)

19 It was Shoey:

323

OT:
"POLITICO Breaking News

-------------------------------------------------

Speaker John Boehner's deficit reduction plan has come up $150 billion short of
his proposed $1 trillion in savings, according to the official estimates by the
Congressional Budget Office, causing even more potential trouble with an
already divided conservative caucus as Republicans push a Wednesday vote on the
package aimed at raising the debt limit. The CBO estimates the first portion of
Boehner's plan would create $850 billion in savings over the next decade."

not good enough, not near good enough, not even close.

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 06:43 PM (jdOk/)

Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 06:53 PM (5H6zj)

20 The GOP can only come up with 1 billion in cuts this year?

Obama's call to "close the corporate jet loophole" is starting to look positively scrooge like!

Posted by: wooga at July 26, 2011 06:53 PM (2p0e3)

21 What year do they plan to lower the debt ceiling?

Posted by: fluffy at July 26, 2011 06:54 PM (SwkdU)

22 Sigh. Voting Democrat in order to bring on the collapse faster is looking more and morelike the right play as time goes on. There will be little entrpenurial opportunity until after the collapse (when there will be a LOT). This Republican slow-walk to doom is disgusting.
Voting for Obama is going to be very hard though. And I don't allow myself to jsut stay home. Duty to country and all that.

Posted by: Meremortal at July 26, 2011 06:54 PM (7FgWm)

23 Like I said...

Posted by: Winston Wolf at July 26, 2011 06:54 PM (uIz80)

24
Will the Speaker ever figure it out that "out years" do not help in the least? Jim Jordan was not "whistling Dixie"...

Posted by: Tony253 at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (L3Dh5)

25 The Reid plan with all its bullshit gimmicks is the better plan?

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (IMglX)

26 Be realistic. Our tax and spend ultra hard left president isn't going to sign anything that isn't a fraud. The only way Obama signs something is if the cuts are few and fake.
At best we canhope to get Obozo out in 2012, regain control of things and repeal all his shit at that point.

Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (0fzsA)

27 But Gabe told us this morning that anyone who doesn't support this is a enemy to progress or some shit- I'm totally paraphrasing but the condescention toward anyone who didn't support it was Obamaesque.

Posted by: Ms Choksondik at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (sVk8z)

28 We will call America "Dole."

Posted by: The United Banana Republic at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (r4t7/)

29 Like I said. All of this is nothing but grand theater.

Posted by: Soona at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (58b7y)

30 I will gladly cut the budget 10 years from now for a trillion-dollar debt increase today.

Posted by: J. Wellington Obama at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (QKKT0)

31 16
Fuck Obama. Fuck his traitorous, soulless ass sideways.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (QcFbt)

With a pineapple.

Posted by: NC Ref at July 26, 2011 06:56 PM (/izg2)

32 We will call America "Dole."
Posted by: The United Banana Republic at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (r4t7/)
Bob Dole has a registered trademark on that name.

Posted by: Bob Dole at July 26, 2011 06:56 PM (QKKT0)

33 Seriously, W. T. F.?!!!

Posted by: Jayne Cobb at July 26, 2011 06:56 PM (oapYF)

34 Forget the whole thing then. There can be no deal.

Refer the Dems back to CCB for a legislative proposal that's in their hands, wish 'em good luck, and see what happens.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 06:56 PM (BUX9N)

35 It reduces the deficit by $1B and cuts $13B from outlays. Doesn't matter now, though. I'm also going to assume everyone who endorsed it hadn't seen the scores, since they were just released. Oh, and another thing-- get lawmakers and staffers not on Boehner's staff to write the bill, for Heaven's sake. These people don't know what they're doing.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 06:57 PM (o2lIv)

36 *plouffe* - the government just spent 350 billion of your money.

Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 06:57 PM (0fzsA)

37 change the debate, start talking in percentage points cut.

blah blah blah, outrage, fume, etc.

Posted by: joeindc44 at July 26, 2011 06:57 PM (QxSug)

38 If the repubs don't hold the line, meaning real significant current cuts, they will face a 3rd party in the elections and get slaughtered. They are better off letting the chips fall after Aug 2 with no deal.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 06:57 PM (mf8Ua)

39 Meanwhile, our national debt is over 14 trillion, with the unfunded liabilities amounting to, what, 100 trillion? And still no budget.

Primary EVERYONE.

Posted by: not the droid you seek at July 26, 2011 06:57 PM (xc/va)

40 31
16
Fuck Obama. Fuck his traitorous, soulless ass sideways.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (QcFbt)

With a pineapple.

Posted by: NC Ref at July 26, 2011 06:56 PM (/izg2)

So what's in it for me?

Posted by: The Pineapple at July 26, 2011 06:57 PM (BUX9N)

41 Be realistic. Our tax and spend ultra hard left president isn't going to sign anything that isn't a fraud. The only way Obama signs something is if the cuts are few and fake.
At best we canhope to get Obozo out in 2012, regain control of things and repeal all his shit at that point.
Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (0fzsA)

I think there's another option. Let Aug 2 roll by and see what happens. I'm betting, not much.

Posted by: Soona at July 26, 2011 06:58 PM (58b7y)

42 All of this is nothing but grand theater.

It's smelling more and more like off-off-Broadway. Or summer stock performed by the Shady Glen Retirement Home Amateur Thespians.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 06:58 PM (AZGON)

43 3116Fuck Obama. Fuck his traitorous, soulless ass sideways.
Posted by: Clubber Lang at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (QcFbt)

With a FLAMING pineapple.
Posted by: NC Ref at July 26, 2011 06:56 PM (/izg2) Fixed.

Posted by: Sharkman at July 26, 2011 06:58 PM (wMsKw)

44 Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

That was my theme after the election. Sucks to be correct. Again.

Posted by: fr8dog at July 26, 2011 06:58 PM (NmSwV)

45 And all the RINOs who gnashed teeth here and everywhere because we were all going to die on Aug. 4th, were wrong. Remind you of TARP terror?

Posted by: Sukie Tawdry at July 26, 2011 06:52 PM (MPtFW) it's exactly like TARP terror... on purpose.Q: how do you get people to accept something they know is wrong?A: you scare the holy crap out of them.works everytime...

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 06:58 PM (jdOk/)

46 Be realistic. Our tax and spend ultra hard left president isn't going to sign anything that isn't a fraud. The only way Obama signs something is if the cuts are few and fake.
At best we canhope to get Obozo out in 2012, regain control of things and repeal all his shit at that point.
Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (0fzsA)
You're crediting Obama with two more testicles than he actually possesses.
He'll sign whatever's put in front of him. He hasn't got the guts to face a shutdown, much less a default.

Posted by: stuiec at July 26, 2011 06:59 PM (Di3Im)

47 The Josef K. plan:

1.) Raise the debt ceiling $250 Billion; tell Obama to make it last and start with the budget cuts, because;
2.) Starting with 2012, the Debt Ceiling goes up as much as the budget was cut the previous year. No more. No promises. For example, under the Boner Plan, in 2013, the Debt Ceiling would go up $1 Billion because that's how much his plan would cut in 2012. The next year, it would increase $16 Billion. The only way to get greater increases in the DC would be to make greater budget cuts.

Yes, I know this will never happen, because GOP and conservative voters have elected a collection of stuttering clusterfucks more concerned with their careers than the future of this country. Still, a guy can dream, can't he?

Posted by: Josef K. at July 26, 2011 06:59 PM (7+pP9)

48 So what's in it for me?

You get to go where no very few a long line of distinguished pineapples have gone before.

Posted by: fluffy at July 26, 2011 06:59 PM (SwkdU)

49 Anyone ready to stop calling people who doubt these "plans" stupid and ignorant?

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 06:59 PM (ECjvn)

50 all this is terribly interesting. wake me when the Senate gets to look at it.

Posted by: TheGreatSatan'sGhost at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (UrPTC)

51 again, I ask, why are we doing something that means nothing just so we can talk about how fucked up Obama is (which it seems most people now realize) while we sink further into economic morass?

Posted by: x11b1p at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (nVLlM)

52 I'm so far past giving a shit about any of this. Nothing substantive is ever going to happen until there is an epic crash. The rest is masturbation; and not the good kind.

Posted by: D. Hopper at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (kBWjM)

53 As I told 80s baby on the other thread I no longer see a success path for this. The only way to succeed is to cut now and cut big. The commies are not going to allow that to happen no matter what.

Even if the House refuses to raise the debt limt to force no spending and no new borrowing Otrama will ignore it because he knows he will not be impeached.

We will get QE-III and QE-IV anyway. After that hyper inflation and collapse.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (M9Ie6)

54 Q: how do you get people to accept something they know is wrong?
A: you scare the holy crap out of them.
works everytime...
Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 06:58 PM (jdOk/)
The correct phrasing is, "Come with me if you want to live!"
I loved that line in FEAST.

Posted by: stuiec at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (Di3Im)

55 Cut Cap and Balance - or no deal. Sounds good to me.The problem is the democrats will never vote to cut cap and balance any budget - ever. They live to tax, spend and incubate the middle class welfare state (all while screwing the poor)

Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (0fzsA)

56 He'll sign whatever's put in front of him. He hasn't got the guts to face a shutdown, much less a default.It's never make it to him. Reid's running interference for him to maximize his re-election chances.

Posted by: Meiczyslaw at July 26, 2011 07:01 PM (bjRNS)

57 Oh yeah, this is a huge surprise.

Posted by: Papa Editor at July 26, 2011 07:01 PM (Zs83Q)

58 6
I spent an hour on Twitter arguing for this thing as the best we could
do. Then the CBO score comes out.Fuck it.Didn't we get
like 30 billion (when we were supposed to get 100 billion) this year?So
we're going from 30 to 1?Wrong way guys.

This isn't even a matter of outlays and spending authority. They tried sticking the cuts on out-years and it's also obvious they missed some cuts entirely. Though CBO also scored from several different baselines, so everyone involved screwed-up here. Who's doing the math for this?

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (o2lIv)

59 Perhaps they could listen to us and STOP WASTING OUR MONEY!
Ahhhh, that feels better...

Posted by: MrTea at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (XWMLc)

60 GOP should be working over ben nelson now and a few others. Why are they against a balanced budget? Dont the people of Nebraska want a balanced budget? I bet the polls say they do!

Posted by: Dan at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (mXBxH)

61 Krauthammer was certainly right that "you can't govern from one house of Congress".

People seem to be under the impression Boehner somehow can.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (BUX9N)

62 its ridiculous, any of us could cut $2B this year and nobody would notice.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (mf8Ua)

63 The rest is masturbation; and not the good kind.
Posted by: D. Hopper at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (kBWjM)

There's a bad kind?

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (i6RpT)

64 One wonders about some of these people and their motives and/or intelligence. I know that some people like Obama want to change us to a total communist dictatorship. Others just appear to be clueless about the real world. And some are just bu-fk crazy.

Ace you need to look at getting out of NYC.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (M9Ie6)

65 I prefer The Chiquita States of America, has a better ring.

Posted by: dananjcon at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (FzVlt)

66 A pineapple's too good for him. I recommend a chainsaw.

Posted by: blue star at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (lofS9)

67 Ya know if we don't raise the debt limit, the first people I'd stiff for their paychecks are the IRS

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 07:03 PM (i6RpT)

68 Hey, here's a plan: Do nothing. Not a damn thing. Let the ceiling get hit.

Does DC and the punditocracy really think a snow job of a bill is going to help? At all? Reform and savings at point X in the future is reform and savings unrealized. We know this game. It's why we're here and why Monty has his Cup of Doom waiting for us every morning.

For a bunch of smart people, The Kraut included, they embrace the monumentally stupid. That is not the sign of high IQs. It's like delusion is the aphrodisiac of choice.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at July 26, 2011 07:03 PM (r4t7/)

69 Doomed: Even The Vaunted Boehner Plan Cuts Only One Billion in 2012

Is anyone surprised? Really?

After this fiasco, the Weeping Boner definitely has to go. He sucks donkey dick as Weeper of the House.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 07:03 PM (G/MYk)

70 Obama wants to sign a bill forced on him by Boehner so he can be your President again in 2012.

Hope you enjoy the next 5 years.

Posted by: cherry π at July 26, 2011 07:03 PM (OhYCU)

71 When the last straw is finally piled on and the tar is heated, I want the mob to hang Boehner right next to Obama.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 07:03 PM (jeLTI)

72 Still, a guy can dream, can't he?

Posted by: Josef K. at July 26, 2011 06:59 PM (7+pP9)
Still, yes. But we're working on legislation that will require you to obtain permits and inspections to operate for a small annual fee, dreams like yours can be dangerous.

Posted by: Barry O at July 26, 2011 07:03 PM (KI/Ch)

73 fuck, why not just score a plan that goes
-1 -1 -1 ... (year 10) -192billion.
Just as honest.

Posted by: joeindc44 at July 26, 2011 07:03 PM (QxSug)

74
There's a bad kind?

Yeah, there's blood involved.

Posted by: Meiczyslaw at July 26, 2011 07:03 PM (bjRNS)

75 ah, hahahahahaha!!
Gabe M hardest hit.
As predicted by everyone but Gabe, Boehner, negotiating against himself, is being fleeced by himself.

He is horrible. He has to be replaced as Speaker, or we're fucked.

Posted by: some dope at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (+kznc)

76

Hmm I have a hard time dismissing Krauthammer out of hand.

What was his argument?

Posted by: dan-O at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (bRLuD)

77 Are these actual cuts or just cuts in expected increases in spending?

Posted by: LIguy at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (c/M8t)

78 I think I'm just settling in to accept the *fact* that millions of people are going to be fighting over scraps from dumpsters because the politicians are simply not going to deal with the fact that we're broke.

We need to cut 1 TRILLION *THIS YEAR*, not 1 billion.

Thick heads, boned, doom, end of all things, yadda yadda.

I think the political class has no idea how painful it's going to be when they have to go cold turkey on their drug of choice - OPM (other people's money).

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (bxiXv)

79 Default already for God's sake...then we will start anew

Posted by: NfromNC at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (kR57Q)

80 I cut the annual cost of policing by 2%, thereby saving every family a quarter!

Posted by: Congressman Alex Shrub at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (xy9wk)

81 So what does this mysterious committee have to do this year? Do they have to cut in 2012?

Is the committee binding?

Posted by: MJ at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (BKOsZ)

82
Anyone know why specifically Lindy Graham was opposed to the Speaker's latest plan?

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (dL71y)

83 24 Will the Speaker ever figure it out that "out years" do not help in
the least? Jim Jordan was not "whistling Dixie"...

This wasn't his complaint, though. The conference didn't know about this.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:04 PM (o2lIv)

84 Look, I think the question is, the only chance for economic survival that most of have is to figure out how to get on the money gravy train that DC is doling out without any consideration. Seriously, should I start my own kill whitey political group that can compete for the dough ear marked for LaRaza?

Posted by: joeindc44 at July 26, 2011 07:05 PM (QxSug)

85 Boehner sees joining the Dems as his fallback position. What a turd.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 07:05 PM (jeLTI)

86 Fail.

Posted by: DocJ at July 26, 2011 07:06 PM (7J/G/)

87 Forget Alan West. Jim Jordan is my new hero in the House.

Posted by: RushBabe at July 26, 2011 07:06 PM (Ew27I)

88 Anyone know why specifically Lindy Graham was opposed to the Speaker's latest plan?

He's the one with a clue?

Oh. My. Gawd.

Lindsey Graham is the one with a clue, here.

Posted by: Meiczyslaw at July 26, 2011 07:06 PM (bjRNS)

89 The problem is us manly tough guys that actually thought the GOP was with us in trying to save the country.

Obviously we should have just gone along with these lily livered, corrupt traitors driving the car out of the ditch and straight of off the cliff.

Rush went easy on Boehner on air, but debunked this "deal" immediately afterward.

Krauthammer?

Please

Posted by: ontherocks at July 26, 2011 07:06 PM (HBqDo)

90 Wow. These guys have a serious problem.

Posted by: Zombie Amy Winehouse at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (Zs83Q)

91 As I see it, we are losing $4B/day, and $1B/year is all they could do to start?

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (mf8Ua)

92 He'll sign whatever's put in front of him. He hasn't got the guts to face a shutdown, much less a default.
Posted by: stuiec at July 26, 2011 06:59 PM (Di3Im)

In the short-term, there will be no shut down and there will be no default even if nothing is passed. This is all a bilateral posturing exercise. It's all show for the2012 election.

Posted by: Soona at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (58b7y)

93 Boehner sees joining the Dems as his fallback position. What a turd.

Do you want Obama to blame the economy on the GOP?

Posted by: cherry π at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (OhYCU)

94 Why are we reminded of the paltry CR deal made earlier this year? Remember the "pledge" about $100 billion in cuts? Then it was parsed into "Oh, that was only for 2012, not 2011." Then "Oh, $100 billlion really means only $60 billion, or maybe $35 B or maybe $20 B or less..."

Plus �a change.

NYT back in January 4, 2011:

...Now aides say that the $100 billion figure was hypothetical, and that the objective is to get annual spending for programs other than those for the military, veterans and domestic security back to the levels of 2008, before Democrats approved stimulus spending to end the recession.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (AZGON)

95 never, i was speaking metaphorically. Wouldn't want to impugn the fine art of masturbation with the "people" in dc.

anyone seen masturbatin' pete lately?

Posted by: D. Hopper at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (kBWjM)

96 This is also stupid:

"This [CBO] report is likely to create much confusion and debate, because
the
office compares Boehner's proposal to multiple baselines. CBO issued one
baseline in January, revised it in March, and made further revisions
when Congress struck a deal to avert a government shutdown, which
lowered the 2011 number. Also, the caps exclude spending in Iraq and
Afghanistan."

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (o2lIv)

97
As I mentioned in a previous thread on this topic...
Both parties are talking about a reduction in *future deficit spending,* not a return to budgets from 2007, let alone 2001 or earlier. In order to have a chance at stopping this run-away freight train, federal spending needs to be cut by at least 700 billion per year, and then cut again, every year thereafter. Yes, it'll hurt, but anything less leads to disaster. (sic: If we don't come together, as a nation, and embrace the pain, we *will* embrace the chaos.)
The Democrat proposal is ridiculous on its face. The Republican proposal is deceptive in that it only promises a 200 billion dollar cut in borrowing money to spend on things we don't need and can't afford. iow, instead of borrowing, say,1.2 trillion per year,the Republican proposal is toonly borrow 1 trillion.

Posted by: Warren Bonesteel at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (E7Z1r)

98 And look, if they can't figure out what to cut, and if they don't have the balls to CUT EVERYTHING by 25%, then I nominate them to cut the jobs and programs of the bunny regulators and to cut the jobs and programs of the Dept. Ed. SWAT team. And ACORN and LaRaza.

Posted by: joeindc44 at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (QxSug)

99 Remind you of TARP terror?

Lots of folks who support the-deal-of-the-day love to remind us of the day the Dow dropped 700. And it made most of that up the next day (ostensibly out of belief that they had done their job and scared Congress into "doing something").

The more important question: Does anyone remember what happened after TARP passed? Does the phrase "greatest wealth destruction by a President" ring any bells?

Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (sOXQX)

100 Do you want Obama to blame the economy on the GOP?

He's gonna blame the GOP anyway.

Posted by: Meiczyslaw at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (bjRNS)

101 What was his argument?

That the Tea Party faction in the House could, through intransigence, end up creating a situation in which the GOP shares (at best) blame for the economy going into 2012. He was correct.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (BUX9N)

102 manly tough guys

shhh. Dude.

First rule of Manly Tough Guy Club.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (ECjvn)

103 how about we just refuse to send out all 80million checks next month? will that get people paying attention? pay off the bondholders and the military.

Posted by: TheGreatSatan'sGhost at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (UrPTC)

104 What was his argument?

It was a political argument. If they did not approve the Boner plan they would lose the PR war with the press.

He is insane. Yes, dismiss him out of hand.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (M9Ie6)

105 The GOP should DEMAND a vote on CCB in the senate and say they will not do one more thing until that happens. No more table BS. Lets get the "moderate" dems like Nelson on the record voting against the balanced budget! I am sure that will play real well in missouri for mcaskil etc.

Posted by: Dan at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (mXBxH)

106 Too little, too late. We're on the Titanic, after the iceberg, with a fire raging, and a German submarine sneaking up on us. Meanwhile the crew is fighting over how the deck chairs get re-arranged.

Posted by: Marvin the Depressed Robot at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (1+CnU)

107 @26: "At best we canhope to get Obozo out in 2012, regain control of things and repeal all his shit at that point."
Based on what? Obizzle out is possible, regaining control of things is pointless as neither side is remotely serious about fixing problems, and repeal? Please -the GOP isn't exacly the party of small government. Nibble at the edges would be the absolute best that they might do.
2012 campaign is basically just arguing over who gets to be pilot as the plane hits the mountain.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (xy9wk)

108 Do you want Obama to blame the economy on the GOP?

You know what I want?

I'd really like my family to keep eating and living indoors.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:09 PM (ECjvn)

109 If we can't get real cuts, I saw we go with the original McConnell plan. Better to punt and let Obama own this in total than to get a 90% shitty bipartisan plan and have Moodys downgrade us anyway.

Posted by: Rich C at July 26, 2011 07:09 PM (JM7NV)

110
91
As I see it, we are losing $4B/day, and $1B/year is all they could do to start?

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (mf8Ua)
Yeah those extremist Republicans are gonna send the Asian markets into a tailspin during those 6 hours less of spending. How irresponsible.

Posted by: The MFM at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (KI/Ch)

111 well, there are three sides, each with veto power, what can you do? Boehner may be right, but fuck-ears and Dingy are determined to spend everything.

Posted by: joeindc44 at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (QxSug)

112 I loved how the Obozo'spress sec.Carney whined about the Tea Party. Waaaaa and eeeek! That was hilarious. More please.

Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (0fzsA)

113 SO, what happens now? If they re-write it, it still probably won't go anywhere, right?

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (Z71Vg)

114 The more important question: Does anyone remember
what happened after TARP passed? Does the phrase "greatest wealth
destruction by a President" ring any bells?

Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (sOXQX)
Yeah, we funded European banks. Bernie Freaking Sanders might even have a problem with this.

Posted by: not the droid you seek at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (xc/va)

115 Why is it that we can never get a "good"number from the fiscal researcher staff on the Hill? It seems like their fiscal notes are always being revised, or found out to be wrong after releasing the information. I am tired of all of this B+ performance - lets get some fucking number crunchers who are part of the unemployed in this country to put out a good number the first time on major pieces of legislation.

Posted by: x11b1p at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (nVLlM)

116 If Obama gets reelected I'll blame the GOP... and I will nether forgive nor forget.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (jeLTI)

117 2012 campaign is basically just arguing over who gets to be pilot as the plane hits the mountain.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (xy9wk)
Your application into Club DOOM! has been accepted. Welcome. *extends hand*

Posted by: Papa Editor at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (Zs83Q)

118 Can we get some new leadership now. Preferably a guy with testicles and math skills.

Posted by: crom at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (d1xde)

119 Wow. These guys have a serious problem.
Posted by: Zombie Amy Winehouse at July 26, 2011 07:07 PM (Zs83Q)
You ain't shitting!

Posted by: Zombie Kurt Cobain at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (Xcug1)

120 This is a great achievement!! This is a

what?

never mind... damn wingnuts...

Posted by: Charles Hammerkruat at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (+kznc)

121 Ya know if we don't raise the debt limit, the first people I'd stiff for their paychecks are the IRS

Make them second, Congress should be first. Or even make them third, with Congress and Barky being first and second.

Posted by: Retread at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (OLzPL)

122 Both Reid's plan and (eventually) Boehner's plan will probably pass in their body. I would bet more that a handful of Republicans join with Dems to send Reid's bill to Obama than vice versa.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (boO9r)

123 Don't worry guys, the 2013 budget is where the 'real battle' is. Then the 2014 real battle.

In accordance with the wishes of my RINO betters, I will now shut up.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (uhAkr)

124 #118

WINNER.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (jeLTI)

125 A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon it's still chickenshit.

Posted by: nickless at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (MMC8r)

126 WH guy on CNN is saying Boehner's plan won't pass the Senate anyway

Posted by: cherry π at July 26, 2011 07:12 PM (OhYCU)

127
If Boehner's plan gets rejected by his own party, how does that help us?
A eunuch for a Speaker doesn't help the GOP's image of leadership. Might make us feel better, but Boehner looking the fool diminishes the party brand.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:12 PM (KNDOU)

128 >I'd really like my family to keep eating and living indoors.

Ah yes, the good old days.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 26, 2011 07:12 PM (IMglX)

129 WH guy on CNN is saying Boehner's plan won't pass the Senate anyway

Posted by: cherry π at July 26, 2011 07:12 PM (OhYCU)
Psssh. It's gonna have a hell of a time trying to get through the House, even with Ryan capitulating... for political reasons.

Posted by: Papa Editor at July 26, 2011 07:13 PM (Zs83Q)

130
We need to thank these patriots who are standing up to Obama (and the GOP leadership) and trying to save the country...Balanced budget amendment or bust...

Posted by: Tony253 at July 26, 2011 07:13 PM (L3Dh5)

131 127...

Perhaps Boehner resigns in discrace? Yeah, I know.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 07:13 PM (jeLTI)

132 Might make us feel better, but Boehner looking the fool diminishes the party brand.

"Look"?

Posted by: Meiczyslaw at July 26, 2011 07:13 PM (bjRNS)

133 I'd really like my family to keep eating and living indoors.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:09 PM (ECjvn)

Cue the theme song from "Lowered Expectations."

Posted by: SNL at July 26, 2011 07:13 PM (/izg2)

134 If Boehner's plan gets rejected by his own party, how does that help us?A
eunuch for a Speaker doesn't help the GOP's image of leadership. Might
make us feel better, but Boehner looking the fool diminishes the party
brand.

Boehner should not be the Speaker of the House. That is where the problem begins and ends.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (uhAkr)

135 If Boehner's plan gets rejected by his own party, how does that help us?A eunuch for a Speaker doesn't help the GOP's image of leadership. Might make us feel better, but Boehner looking the fool diminishes the party brand.
Exactly what I was thinking. The GOP just looks stupid now. Geez.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (Z71Vg)

136 118
Can we get some new leadership now.

No, because the people complaining that Boehner can't run the entire United States government from the House of Representatives would just turn on the new guy with !BIG BALLS! when he found out he couldn't do it either.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (BUX9N)

137 I'd really like my family to keep eating and living indoors.
Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:09 PM (ECjvn)

99% of human history just called and asked about your newsletter.

We had a nice run away from the trend for a while, looks like we're figuring out averages always catch up with you.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (bxiXv)

138 WH guy on CNN is saying Boehner's plan won't pass the Senate anyway
Posted by: cherry π at July 26, 2011 07:12 PM (OhYCU)

Which begs the question: Why are you watching the WH spokesman or CNN?

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (i6RpT)

139 Wow. They had better be rewriting this bill ASAP.
I'd like to see a 10-year plan that simply reverts the total federal budget back to what it was in 2005.

Posted by: rockmom at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (lSyyU)

140
Boehner isn't like that fool Steele. He's our man in DC; the 3rd man in line for the presidency.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (gb1X2)

141 Can we just default already.. I'm trying to get on with my life. This shit is seriously holding my plans up.

Posted by: UGrev at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (862vz)

142 Wants to start a company with me selling pitchforks and torches?

Posted by: x11b1p at July 26, 2011 07:15 PM (nVLlM)

143 Don't worry. It'll all be rewritten by the Democrats, and the cutting won't start until the twentieth year.

We are so doomed, and our kids even more.

Posted by: I'm in a New York state of mind at July 26, 2011 07:15 PM (4sQwu)

144 113
SO, what happens now? If they re-write it, it still probably won't go
anywhere, right?

Depends who rewrites it and how they rewrite it. It better not be the same staffers who were $150B short (besides the other things, obviously).

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:15 PM (o2lIv)

145 Back off wingnuts. We're talking about an actual 0.02% cut in federal spending, just in year one! Huzzah, the government is shrinking!

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at July 26, 2011 07:16 PM (+lsX1)

146 Was I expecting too much?
Or are they playing eleven-dimensional chess and I can't keep up?
Or is the Speaker really nothing but a weeping orange boner who was mutated into an alienBeltway insider at the molecular level decades ago?

Posted by: Wm T Sherman at July 26, 2011 07:16 PM (w41GQ)

147
We're stuck with him. And that ninny McConnell.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:16 PM (t9/kd)

148 The unspoken meme from the likes of Rush and Levin seems to be if the dems get their way, Cloward and Piven is inevitable.
Boehner called in to Rush today; Rush sounded amiable enough. I wasn't listening too closely. By 2:30, Rush was beyond bitter: They think we're rubes. We've all been duped. What happened in between that? The Bernie Goldberg call saying that the Aug. 2 drop-dead date was a scam?

Posted by: RushBabe at July 26, 2011 07:16 PM (Ew27I)

149

iowahawkblog
David Burge

I've got it! Let's cut spending by $1 a year for the next 14.5 trillion years. Starting in 2058. #yourewelcome

Posted by: Tami at July 26, 2011 07:16 PM (ULMuv)

150 WTF!!
CCB.
It has passed the House.
You dumbass Senators need to pass THAT!!

Posted by: TypicalWhitey at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (xeVap)

151 BTW I got "unfriended" today on facebook, by my freaking nephew! He apparently doesn't agree with my political views. Little shit.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (Z71Vg)

152 @144 Exactly, I think its time for several staffers in DC to join the ranks of the unemployed.

Posted by: x11b1p at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (nVLlM)

153 108
Do you want Obama to blame the economy on the GOP?

You know what I want?

I'd really like my family to keep eating and living indoors.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:09 PM (ECjvn)
How really real this is. And how lopsided our nation has become. Just a few short years ago, I tore myself up over shades of wall paint. Now, I can't seem to figure out how to pay next month's rent.

Posted by: express at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (TN7KL)

154 --If Boehner's plan gets rejected by his own party, how does that help us?
A
eunuch for a Speaker doesn't help the GOP's image of leadership. Might
make us feel better, but Boehner looking the fool diminishes the party
brand.

If it stops him from negotiating away everything for nothing (as he's done with 3 or 4 MUST-PASS pieces of House legislation - budget stuff - already) then it helps the GOP and America. Better to have a eunich than an ass who gives away the store.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (G/MYk)

155 There are still more 'establishment' Republicans than conservatives in positions of power in the party, and nearly every one of them believes default to be worse than any other alternative.

Business interests aren't exactly in the conservatives' corner on default wither. The Republicans are more convinced that a default hurts them (politically and with donors) than the Dems.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (boO9r)

156 I'm not impressed by Boehner's ties or tan. I want a big-balled, mean, dirty-fighting, street politician leading the house. Someone who knows how to benefit from a crisis.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (jeLTI)

157 hahaha

@iowahawkblog
David Burge

I've got it! Let's cut spending by $1 a year for the next 14.5 trillion years. Starting in 2058.

Posted by: TheGreatSatan'sGhost at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (UrPTC)

158 yeah Gabe bitching abouta useless -1 trillion in cuts is mass hesteria

Posted by: YRM at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (HhCkU)

159 Congrats Boehner, you've just shaved two hours and twenty minutes of federal spending. Woohoo!

Posted by: rockhead at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (ZMHGo)

160 Exactly what I was thinking. The GOP Boehner just looks stupid now. Geez.

Corrected for accuracy.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (uhAkr)

161 nickless: "A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon it's still chickenshit."

Brevity is the soul of wit. And The Funny its heart.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at July 26, 2011 07:18 PM (r4t7/)

162 Lots of folks who support the-deal-of-the-day love to remind us of the day the Dow dropped 700. And it made most of that up the next day (ostensibly out of belief that they had done their job and scared Congress into "doing something").

Bush signs the frightfully urgent and utterly indispensable TARP into law October 3, 2008. How did the market like this? The S&P 500 never regained its October 2008 high levels until January 2010. After all the porkulus and QE I and II, no less.

Real fine work.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:18 PM (AZGON)

163
Stop cowering wussies, and let the boning begin.

Posted by: Official Government Boner at July 26, 2011 07:18 PM (Lt/Za)

164 BTW I got "unfriended" today on facebook, by my
freaking nephew! He apparently doesn't agree with my political views.
Little shit.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (Z71Vg)
I think mike and fluffy just "unfriended" me on the other thread ...

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 07:18 PM (G/MYk)

165 @127: "A eunuch for a Speaker doesn't help the GOP's image of leadership. Might make us feel better, but Boehner looking the fool diminishes the party brand."
The party of "We suck ever-so-slightly less than the other guys" really isn't much of a brand.
Don't want a eunuch as Speaker? Don't install a eunuch as Speaker.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at July 26, 2011 07:18 PM (xy9wk)

166 Its like they think we've never heard of math and can't add and subtract. Ok given our education system, that's a fair assumption, but come on alot of us went to parochial school. Especially those kids of public school teachers.

Posted by: Iblis at July 26, 2011 07:18 PM (9221z)

167 If Obama gets reelected I'll blame the GOP... and I will nether forgive nor forget.
Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 07:10 PM (jeLTI)

If Dick gets re-elected then I'm selling everything and moving to my alternate refuge.

Posted by: Soona at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (58b7y)

168
Wait a minute...

Ace lives in NYC?

That explains a lot.

Posted by: Warren Bonesteel at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (E7Z1r)

169 151 BTW I got "unfriended" today on facebook, by my freaking nephew! He apparently doesn't agree with my political views. Little shit.
Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (Z71Vg)
_______________________________________________________
I can top that. My sister did the same to me over a crack about the country suffering from jungle fever just before the election. Haven't heard from her since.

Posted by: fr8dog at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (NmSwV)

170 136
118
Can we get some new leadership now.

No, because the people
complaining that Boehner can't run the entire United States government
from the House of Representatives would just turn on the new guy with
!BIG BALLS! when he found out he couldn't do it either.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States

Nice straw man argument. Apparently having a plan with real cuts is "running the entire United States government".

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (IMglX)

171 But almost all of those cuts come in the tenth year.

Like this "deal" won't be ancient, forgotten history by 2021.

Gimme a break. We are truly boned. Ask Not for Whom the Doom Bones. It Bones for YOU.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (kUaEF)

172 And all the RINOs who gnashed teeth here and everywhere because we were
all going to die on Aug. 4th, were wrong. Remind you of TARP terror?Posted by: Sukie Tawdry

That's a BS characterization of the thoughts of those hoping for a deal. No one, not one person here was claiming that the 8/2 date would matter. What matters is whether or not Obaka and Co. will start with the government shutdown in retaliation.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (DEcmU)

173

Over 10 years, it cuts, it is supposed, $1.1 trillion dollars.
But almost all of those cuts come in the tenth year.
Why do they do this? Why do Republicans continue to play these tired old games?

I'm afraid that 2012 may become a big disappointment for Republicans if they keep this shit up.

Posted by: KG at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (LD21B)

174 129 Psssh. It's gonna have a hell of a time trying to get
through the House, even with Ryan capitulating... for political reasons.

He didn't sound so thrilled this afternoon and I'm sure he's even less-so no. Same with every other Republican lawmaker who thought they were getting what was offered upfront. I don't see how this is their fault.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (o2lIv)

175 Personally, I will not enjoy our descent into a third world nation.

However, I have a family history of scary illness, and with Obamacare coming in, I'm pretty sure I'll be left to die.

Or put in a FEMA camp.

Either way, the whole "mayan end of the world" thing is looking pretty good if you know what I mean and I think you do.

Posted by: shibumi at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (z63Tr)

176 Yeah, we funded European banks. Bernie Freaking Sanders might even have a problem with this.

That's certainly a good answer, but I was going for "The Dow went down every day for like four or five months." It seems it went down during that period more than the one day after TARP wasn't passed, but my knowledge of history has always been a little fuzzy.

Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (sOXQX)

177
ahhh, TARP

remember the day John McCain turned into a zombie mime?

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (qsz6h)

178 Personally, I will not enjoy our descent into a third world nation.

However, I have a family history of scary illnesses, and with Obamacare coming in, I'm pretty sure I'll be left to die.

Or put in a FEMA camp.

Either way, the whole "mayan end of the world" thing is looking pretty good if you know what I mean and I think you do.

Posted by: shibumi at July 26, 2011 07:20 PM (z63Tr)

179 Only Leeza Marcokesy Huntsman can save us now

Posted by: dananjcon at July 26, 2011 07:20 PM (vXr7p)

180 151
BTW I got "unfriended" today on facebook, by my freaking nephew! He
apparently doesn't agree with my political views. Little shit

Give him a library card for his next birthday and tell him to call you when he's broadened his horizons enough to be able to cope with having an aunt who holds different views than his circle of hipster dufus friends.

Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 07:20 PM (5H6zj)

181 169 151 BTW I got "unfriended" today on facebook, by my freaking nephew! He apparently doesn't agree with my political views. Little shit.
Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (Z71Vg)

You should be grateful that at least he's not having MILF fantasies about you.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:20 PM (kUaEF)

182 How about: We will cut spending to 2007 levels and wait for the budget to balance itself? Somehow life went on at that level of spending. I don't recall the streets being full of emaciated corpses being eaten by rats and dogs back then.
With two wars winding down that's actually an effective increase in funds for everything else.

Posted by: Wm T Sherman at July 26, 2011 07:21 PM (w41GQ)

183
hahaha
Okay, what marketing genius decided to put a Barbara Streisand ad-link on AOSHQ?

Posted by: davisbr at July 26, 2011 07:21 PM (uCShA)

184 Shit, this little snafu is nothing. All of the so-called plans are predicated on a baseline that sees spending increases of 7% a year. They are cutting nothing more than a small percentage of expected spending.
I could smack the shit out of someone right now.

Posted by: Steph at July 26, 2011 07:22 PM (iSd1q)

185 Does anyone think that will ultimately happen is a very small cuts/very small debt ceiling increase deal at the last minute will pass both houses, and then in a few months we will just do this all over again? Obama won't veto something that passed the dem senate even if he says he would.

Posted by: Dan at July 26, 2011 07:22 PM (mXBxH)

186 Stop it! Just fucking stop it! No more Bullshit! No more sell outs! No more spending!

NOT ANOTHER DIME!

Posted by: Brainpimp at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (z3UT7)

187 Nice straw man argument. Apparently having a plan with real cuts is "running the entire United States government".

No, dipshit, having the power to pass and sign legislation into law all by himself, as some people seem to believe he can, is "running the entire United States government".

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (BUX9N)

188 iowahawkblog David Burge I've got it! Let's cut spending by $1 a year for the next 14.5 trillion years. Starting in 2058.

How extremist. A balanced proposal would include $14.5 trillion in new taxes, with one dollar raised in the first year. Until 2013, then all $13.499999999999999 trillion at one time.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (AZGON)

189 28 We will call America "Dole."
Posted by: The United Banana Republic at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (r4t7/)
That works on so many levels, unfortunately.

Posted by: ExExZonie at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (0xROk)

190 61
Krauthammer was certainly right that "you can't govern from one house of Congress".

People seem to be under the impression Boehner somehow can.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:02 PM (BUX9N)
No, the point is that he is continually making unforced errors.

Posted by: KG at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (LD21B)

191 A TEN YEAR PLAN, for Pete's Sake!!

Can anyone REMEMBER what the burning "Plan" from 2001 was?? Me neither.

A billion this year, with an IOU for trillions more that comes due in 2021, when nearly all present members of Congress are out of office and their replacements will be just burning with desire to sacrifice THEIR political careers to keep the late Harry Reid's 10 year old promises?

What an insult.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (kUaEF)

192
Really, though, is every single former employee of Enron's accounting department working in DC?

Does anyone in that city know how to add 2 + 2 and get 4?

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (z96ra)

193 He didn't sound so thrilled this afternoon and I'm
sure he's even less-so no. Same with every other Republican lawmaker who
thought they were getting what was offered upfront. I don't see how
this is their fault.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (o2lIv)
I agree with everything you said. I wasn't assigning blame to anyone. Just stating it the way it is. It's very clear he was less than thrilled. It's understandable why he reluctantly endorsed it. This is now a blame game. Only thing left is politics because not real solution is coming. We are on the way to fun time.

Posted by: Papa Editor at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (Zs83Q)

194 I welcome your comments, not that they matter -Bitches!!!

http://www.speaker.gov/Contact/

Posted by: Speaker Boehner at July 26, 2011 07:24 PM (nVLlM)

195 2012 campaign is basically just arguing over who gets to be pilot as the plane hits the mountain.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at July 26, 2011 07:08 PM (xy9wk)
That's some weapons-grade quality awesome, right there.

Posted by: DocJ at July 26, 2011 07:24 PM (7J/G/)

196 189 28 We will call America "Dole."
Posted by: The United Banana Republic at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (r4t7/)

Bob Dole supports that idea. Bob Dole needs his Dole pill now.

Posted by: Bob Dole at July 26, 2011 07:24 PM (kUaEF)

197 I really want to like John Boehner and I really want to trust him. Stop fucking making me rethink my decision to like and trust you!

Posted by: Travis at July 26, 2011 07:25 PM (9WkMB)

198 Dems will pretend to hate this plan, but it basically establishes Obama's spending levels as the "new norm". Dems figure that long before any significant cuts will go into effect, they'll either gain control of the purse strings again, or the economy will (miraculously?) rebound enough to increase revenues, making the cuts less palatable.

In the meantime, they get to act tough now, but will still eventually endorse this sweetheart deal to show how "serious" they are about cutting the deficit, and how willing they are to "compromise" with Republicans. They'll get all the good press, Republicans will look intransigent (even though they are the only party even creating real plans), and Obama gets to continue to socialize the economy with wild abandon.

"Doomed" doesn't begin to cover it.

Posted by: Rod Rescueman at July 26, 2011 07:25 PM (HwE/1)

199 -1 -16 -57 -73 -85 -96 -109 -123 -138 -153

Y'know, I just realized. This looks like one of those cap-circumventing NHL contracts, only flipped.

Like y'all needed another description of its ridiculousness ...

Posted by: Meiczyslaw at July 26, 2011 07:25 PM (bjRNS)

200 **I'm not impressed by Boehner's ties or tan. I want a big-balled, mean, dirty-fighting, street politician leading the house. Someone who knows how to benefit from a crisis.**

well, somehow, the GOP let the DNC whack Tom Delay. Sort of a problem that we let our effective leaders get capped.

Posted by: joeindc44 at July 26, 2011 07:25 PM (QxSug)

201
$1.4 Trillion incuts for 2012. Same level of reduced spending in 2013.
$600 Billion Debt ceiling increaseto get you into 2013.
See easy.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 07:25 PM (GKQDR)

202 @197

SUCKER!

Posted by: Speaker Boehner at July 26, 2011 07:26 PM (nVLlM)

203 I think the evil Tea Party needs to start throwing Washington politicians into the Potomac.

Posted by: hous bin pharteen at July 26, 2011 07:26 PM (M+RZq)

204 Revolution, not whining on web sites.

Posted by: Paine at July 26, 2011 07:26 PM (jeLTI)

205 Zogby says Uh-Oh.

Posted by: Sukie Tawdry at July 26, 2011 07:26 PM (MPtFW)

206 2012 campaign is basically just arguing over who gets to be pilot as the plane hits the mountain.

Hey, if my brains go through the cockpit windows 5 milliseconds later than yours, it's worth a fight to the death.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:26 PM (AZGON)

207
BTW I got "unfriended" today on facebook, by my
freaking nephew! He apparently doesn't agree with my political views.
Little shit.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 07:17 PM (Z71Vg)
Oh Jewells, he will be back in time to ask for money to attend a great liberal college so he can join the workforce as a social worker, Haight Ashbury record store manager, or towel boy in a mid-town brothel.

Posted by: Fish the Impaler at July 26, 2011 07:26 PM (Lt/Za)

208 I think the time is rapidly approaching when I'll need to simply stop watching TV and paying attention to politics, period.

It will be the only way to preserve my sanity. Hopefully, I'll expire about the time the Chinese People's Revolutionary Army arrives in town.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:27 PM (kUaEF)

209 Rule of thumb: a Republican bill/deal/proposal that seems questionable but is strongly endorsed by the establishment Republican media under the "It's The Best Deal We Can Get" theory must be rejected.

Posted by: Ghost of Lee Atwater at July 26, 2011 07:27 PM (ye+Aj)

210 The Republicans still don't get it.

They have historically campaigned in a 'sweet spot'. They got to be the party of fiscal conservatism by campaigning for lower taxes without ever being held to the standard of being the party of lower spending.

It is remarkably clear that they will do anything to not cut spending. Their best argument for their own survival is there steadfast opposition to tax increases.

Post-Obama budgets though, that just isn't good enough anymore.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (boO9r)

211 No deal.Take the pain.Needs to be done.

Posted by: steevy at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (5mTHV)

212 When Boner said he was just putting the tip in I wasn't sure whether to be relieved or go play with the hawks.

Posted by: The Chicken at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (zsvKP)

213 War, you're a dick and always have been. Go watch some kiddie porn which is right up your alley. Oh and Fuck You.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (IMglX)

214
hahaha, Newt is polling even with Fred "Mr Rainbow" Karger

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (KpRxj)

215 Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:18 PM (AZGON)

Ah, this is going to be one of those threads I am always hopelessly behind on. You win a cupie doll. Just as soon as I get someone to lone me the money for it.

Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (sOXQX)

216 But it's the best offer we can get from the Politburo.

Posted by: Paine at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (jeLTI)

217 156 I'm not impressed by Boehner's ties or tan. I want a big-balled, mean, dirty-fighting, street politician leading the house. Someone who knows how to benefit from a crisis.

You want Rahm Emanuel.

Posted by: Mindy at July 26, 2011 07:29 PM (wPiI0)

218 @174: "He didn't sound so thrilled this afternoon and I'm sure he's even less-so no. Same with every other Republican lawmaker who thought they were getting what was offered upfront. I don't see how this is their fault."
Wilhelm Mohnke just phoned from the basement of the Reichstag. It was a little hard to hear him over the grenade bursts and Russian submachinegun fire, but I think he was calling to congratulate you on your unwavering devotionto a doomed cause.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at July 26, 2011 07:29 PM (xy9wk)

219 Boehner looking the fool diminishes the party brand.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:12 PM (KNDOU)
Boner is already the fool. Let me ask you this, how does his incompetent leadership help us?

Posted by: KG at July 26, 2011 07:29 PM (LD21B)

220 @202 - Get back to the work of the people, you fucker!

Posted by: Travis at July 26, 2011 07:29 PM (9WkMB)

221 Voting Democrat in order to bring on the collapse faster is looking more and more like the right play as time goes on.
Nah. We're past that. If you think you have to vote, do it based on whose cronies you want running US 2. Because if the Great Boning comes when Obama's president, we might get to enjoy the fifty-year reign of Queen Valerie Jarrett. But if the GOP is runnin' shit, she'll only be queen for 49.9999999675 years.

Posted by: oblig. at July 26, 2011 07:30 PM (xvZW9)

222 Remember when Bush was the big spending war-mongerer...good times.

Posted by: dananjcon at July 26, 2011 07:30 PM (vXr7p)

223 It is funny, Boehner should know that even if he implements the extremist Dave Burge cut $1 a year for 14trillion years plan, the left will still demagog it.

I think he needs to play his part better, if he is one of three vetoes, how about being the extreme right wing budget cutter, at least as a bargaining chip.

The Senate hasn't passed dick anyway, so who cares.

Posted by: joeindc44 at July 26, 2011 07:30 PM (QxSug)

224 MOAHR!
Feed me fresh tasty budget projections!

Posted by: MATH, now fully erect at July 26, 2011 07:30 PM (q177U)

225 213
War, you're a dick and always have been. Go watch some kiddie porn which is right up your alley. Oh and Fuck You.Posted by: Dr Spank at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (IMglX)

Go dream up some more Trig Palin jokes, asswipe. You're better at that.

Come to think of it, it's funny you mention kiddie porn since you always did seem to be all about the little kids.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:30 PM (BUX9N)

226 "Isn't that less than the $2 billion in 2012 that Biden and the Democrats proposed?"

Why yes, yes it is.

Gee, maybe I should vote Democrat.

Posted by: someguy at July 26, 2011 07:30 PM (iIQ0a)

227 No, because the people complaining that Boehner
can't run the entire United States government from the House of
Representatives would just turn on the new guy with !BIG BALLS! when he
found out he couldn't do it either.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:14 PM (BUX9N)
Huh, way to twist things around buddy.
Boner is screwing up, period. He needs to go.

Posted by: KG at July 26, 2011 07:30 PM (LD21B)

228 as someone who hates the Boehner plan, War has some good points

Posted by: YRM at July 26, 2011 07:31 PM (HhCkU)

229 BTW I got "unfriended" today on facebook, by my freaking nephew! He
apparently doesn't agree with my political views. Little shit.

You should remind him that "diversity" and "tolerance" of people's differences are cornerstones of liberal political thought. (We know they're not, of course, but all liberals say they are, so it's good to hold some feet to the fire now and again).

Posted by: Rod Rescueman at July 26, 2011 07:31 PM (HwE/1)

230 August 2nd baby, LETS GO!
Granted, my tune hasn't changed at all, because realizing the Boehner plan was a joke was pretty easy. Anytime they do these 10 year cuts, all of the cuts are on the back end. Every time. Every, single time. Yet, people still get snookered into thinking it might actually be different this time.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 07:31 PM (OX4OZ)

231
I think the time is rapidly approaching when I'll need to simply stop watching TV and paying attention to politics, period.

The biggest mistake I ever made is becoming a political junkie. Started slowly through the years and really picked up in '96. I couldn't help it because my hatred for Democrats grew and grew.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:31 PM (GKYRR)

232 Bob Dole supports that idea. Bob Dole needs his Dole pill now.

thehill.com

...Sen. Pat Roberts (R-Kan.) took time out Friday to tweet a birthday song to former Sen. Bob Dole (R).

"Happy birthday to Kansas' favorite son, Bob Dole!" Roberts tweeted.

Roberts and his staff made a special effort for Dole's 88th birthday by taping a rendition of "Happy Birthday" in Roberts's D.C. office.

No word on whether Dole remained erect for the occasion.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:31 PM (AZGON)

233 Since The Tea Party Midterms of 2010 the GOP has done the football equivalent of intercepting a pass on their opponents 20 yard line, dropping it before establishing possession, and then kicking the ball out of bounds.

.....with not just the game, but he season on the line.

If only their ineptitude were that minor.

Posted by: ontherocks at July 26, 2011 07:32 PM (HBqDo)

234 When it comes to kid porn I'll have to defer to your expertise and considered "research". Oh and you're a cunt. Clear enough?

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 26, 2011 07:32 PM (IMglX)

235 Give him a library card for his next birthday and tell him to call you when he's broadened his horizons enough to be able to cope with having an aunt who holds different views than his circle of hipster dufus friends. LOL- good idea. And Fish- he's a college grad from MU, so that explains alot. Plus his dad is a big union guy. His brother is still my friend, at least last time I checked. My daughter was kind of upset about it, but I said eh... I ain't gonna lose sleep over it. I had my friends rolling last night, with comments I shamelessly stole from my fellow morons.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 07:33 PM (Z71Vg)

236 Here's my problem with Boehner: He still doesn't realize he's fighting against a hardcore socialist. He thinks he can just compromise his way to a deal. He can't. His only option to pass a deal is to go full on socialist, and he keeps slowly inching in that direction with every new deal.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 07:33 PM (OX4OZ)

237 No, dipshit, having the power to pass and sign
legislation into law all by himself, as some people seem to believe he
can, is "running the entire United States government".

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (BUX9N)
No, dipshit, that's a straw man because noone is arguing that.

Posted by: KG at July 26, 2011 07:34 PM (LD21B)

238 Boehner should announce his vacation. Watch fucking heads start popping all over DC.

I hope the Republicans are at least letting Wall Street know who the new fucking sheriff in town is and that they better not give one fucking red cent to Barack Obama's re-election campaign.

Posted by: someguy at July 26, 2011 07:34 PM (iIQ0a)

239 I can top that. My sister did the
same to me over a crack about the country suffering from jungle fever
just before the election. Haven't heard from her since.

Posted by: fr8dog at July 26, 2011 07:19 PM (NmSwV)

If you ever talk to her again, you can tell her that a black chick lol'd.Most of my "unfriendings" for my conservative posts come from old military acquaintances and it's always the white liberal ones. Imagine that.

Posted by: baldilocks at July 26, 2011 07:34 PM (T2/zQ)

240 Republicans refuse to cut spending before the election because they don't want to create any potential ads in 2012.

By just committing to 'baseline changes', they get to fill in the blanks later after the election. This way they don't piss anyone off and keep the electoral coalition as broad as possible. They 'learned' this from the 'mistake' of passing the Ryan budget. The problem is that they have no electoral coalition without doing something first.

They lose more by hiding and obscuring, and they still don't get that. This is the party they have now. They have to either play to the overwhelming demands of the base, or have 0% chance of winning in 2012.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 07:34 PM (boO9r)

241 CCB IS Bi-Partisan, has passed with bi-partisan support. CCB IS the vehicle to satisfy the rating agencies and stop deficit spending,

Why are these fools not cramming this down the socialists pie hole .
If it got a vote in the Senate it might just pass.

Someone should be SHOUTING THIS!
Boehner should be asking Americans to call Harry and Barry with this!

Posted by: Concealed Kerry or Submit at July 26, 2011 07:34 PM (tHnoW)

242 I think the time is rapidly approaching when I'll need to simply stop watching TV and paying attention to politics, period. It will be the only way to preserve my sanity.
I'm reaching burn out too. It happens every few months or so.

Posted by: ErikW at July 26, 2011 07:34 PM (Xcug1)

243 I've spent the day arguing with my so called fellow Conservatives over Boehner's lousy plan and was repeatedly told how I was being foolish and this was the best the Republican's can do.

The sad thing is that after seeing the 1 billion number I'm afraid that probably is the best those complete losers can do.

Gah! The Republican Party is a Party for masochists.

Posted by: GhostShip at July 26, 2011 07:34 PM (sbaXF)

244 193
I agree with everything you said. I wasn't assigning
blame to anyone. Just stating it the way it is. It's very clear he was
less than thrilled. It's understandable why he reluctantly endorsed
it. This is now a blame game. Only thing left is politics because not
real solution is coming. We are on the way to fun time.

In his case and the case of Rep. West and some others, I think they were both trying to do the right thing. From previous interviews, they believe that this is a matter of (1) not making the debt situation worse while Obama is in office and (2) buying time until there is a conservative administration. Both sides of the conservative debate have legitimate arguments as to why their solution would help prevent both.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:34 PM (o2lIv)

245 How does Mr. Obama's political veto posturing help my kids?

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (ECjvn)

246
how does his incompetent leadership help us?

It doesn't, of course. But just remember this: anything that Boehner does or agrees to will automatically be hated by the Left. In other words, what seems unacceptable to our standards, is ultra-conservative to the Left.

Boehner, to others, doesn't look like a moderate sell-out, is what I'm saying. That's our perception.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (qPhRX)

247 It's going to "cut" $1.1 trillion in a ten-year period that will probably see total deficits in the $12-16 trillion range?

Posted by: Ken at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (fFh95)

248 Score another one for the extremists.

Posted by: MlR at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (Qsfvj)

249 231
I think the time is rapidly approaching when I'll need to simply stop watching TV and paying attention to politics, period.
I arrived in South Korea in December, 2008 missing JEF's inaugaration, and his entire first7 months in office before I finally started to follow politics again. The first few months with no internet were heaven.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (GKQDR)

250 Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:23 PM (AZGON)

haha Iowahawk RINO

Posted by: TheGreatSatan'sGhost at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (UrPTC)

251 Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 07:28 PM (sOXQX)

Hey, Methos, I am agreeing with you, in fact. If people want to measure TARP by claiming it saved the market, they will have a helluva time explaining how even after it passed the market sank and sank and sank, hitting rock bottom in spring 2009, and never recovered to early October 2008 levels until last year. If this debt crisis is a real crisis, no "promises" of "plans" to avoid legalisms (default) will halt a decline. Look at the EU. Despite all the tinkering over there, the PIIGS are still falling.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (AZGON)

252 --Since The Tea Party Midterms of 2010 the GOP has done the football
equivalent of intercepting a pass on their opponents 20 yard line,
dropping it before establishing possession, and then kicking the ball
out of bounds.

I liked how the GOP initially scored a touchdown for the Dems, running the wrong way with the interception, when they colluded with those America-haters with that insane and criminal lame-duck session. That was kinda cool. No one with a brain would have predicted that happening ... But, now we know. We really know.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 07:36 PM (G/MYk)

253

iowahawkblog
David Burge

In the last 2 years, the Democrats have produced 1 Massa, 1 Weiner, 1 Wu, and 0 budgets.

Might as well laugh.....

Posted by: Tami at July 26, 2011 07:36 PM (ULMuv)

254
Most of my "unfriendings" for my conservative posts come from old military acquaintances and it's always the white liberal ones. Imagine that.

Kinda like you're not useful to them, anymore? Sickening.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:36 PM (yFHtF)

255 It is not the fact that Boehner can't run the whole gvmt from a 2-1 disadvantage. It is the fact that he continually caves. Where is the LEADERSHIP. We needed 3-4 senators to pass the CCB last week. Did we even try to get the weak dems ? ( I am looking at you McConnel)

And by the way, Mr Reagan managed to LEAD with both houses against him.

Posted by: crom at July 26, 2011 07:36 PM (d1xde)

256 as someone who hates the Boehner plan, War has some good points

Posted by: YRM at July 26, 2011 07:31 PM (HhCkU)
No he doesn't. His response to pointing out that Boehner is an ineffective Speaker is to call everybody stupid and imply that nobody could do better than Boehner is.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 07:37 PM (uhAkr)

257 @235 - I like to think of it as teaching you plebes a lesson (I wish I could see some of your head explode when you get my fundraising letter in a couple of days)

Posted by: Speaker Boehner at July 26, 2011 07:37 PM (nVLlM)

258 247 It's going to "cut" $1.1 trillion in a ten-year period that will probably see total deficits in the $12-16 trillion range?
Posted by: Ken at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (fFh95)

No.

It will "cut" $1 billion, maybe, this year.
It will be forgotten completely by next year.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:37 PM (kUaEF)

259 "Boehner thinks he can just compromise his way to a deal. He can't."

Sure he can. They've all already agreed to what the end deal will be. All the rest of this is just the sales job, bullshit theatre so both sides can claim a victory. The debt ceiling is going up. There will be hundreds of billions in new taxes. Republicans and Democrats are really on the same team (they all went to Harvard).

This is just the game baby.

Don't hate the players, hate the game.

Posted by: someguy at July 26, 2011 07:38 PM (iIQ0a)

260
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 07:37 PM (uhAkr)
I said he had a good point, had nothing to say on how he said it

Posted by: YRM at July 26, 2011 07:38 PM (HhCkU)

261 Boehner, to others, doesn't look like a moderate sell-out, is what I'm saying. That's our perception.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:35 PM (qPhRX)
Yea, but how does his actual performance help us when he's pulling shit like backloading cuts? He's not serious about this. He doesn't get it, he thinks he's got time to fiddle.

Posted by: KG at July 26, 2011 07:38 PM (LD21B)

262 I'm not a one plan only guy, either. There are multiple ways to get me to agree with raising the ceiling. Let me list some:
1. Repeal O-care
2. Real entitlement reform
3. Cut HUNDREDS of billions of dollars from this year's budget
4. Pass CCB
5. Impeach O
I'm good with any of those 5 options to go along with an increase in the ceiling.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 07:38 PM (OX4OZ)

263 I seem to remember the phrase "our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor" from somewhere. It sure didn't come from any Washington politician within the past 100 years.
I was coming around to supporting the Boehner plan this AM, (as being probably the best outcome achievable for a divided government) but now I feel like the helmsman on the Titanic being told to alter course by 0.1 degrees. I know we are still going to hit the iceberg at full speed ahead, but we will just hit it in a different place due to the fantastic course correction.

Posted by: Hrothgar at July 26, 2011 07:39 PM (3Go8z)

264 Bob Dole supports that idea. Bob Dole needs his Dole pill now.
Posted by: Bob Dole at July 26, 2011 07:24 PM (kUaEF)
Bob, dear, I have an hour till my next appointment, if you know what I mean.

Posted by: Liddy Dole at July 26, 2011 07:39 PM (Ew27I)

265 6. Revert to 2008 funding levels as the baseline.

Posted by: ManeiNeko at July 26, 2011 07:40 PM (TiE76)

266 I really want to have Faith in the reps, but they make it hard.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 07:40 PM (h+qn8)

267 "It will be forgotten completely by next year."

This point cannot be stressed enough. This Congress does not have the power to limit the spending of the next Congress.

If you are even discussing a 10-year-plan you have already swallowed the kook-aide handed to you by your Jim Jones political party.

That's why this series of posts by Ace are so riotously funny.

Ace himself thinks there is such a thing as a 10-year plan.

Posted by: someguy at July 26, 2011 07:40 PM (iIQ0a)

268 There will be no escape.

Find a place that will be relatively self-sufficient after the collapse of the republic and hunker down. Texas is looking pretty good to me, but I am sure there are other options.

Posted by: mongo78 at July 26, 2011 07:40 PM (2b46R)

269 If we REALLY want change - then we need to elect a conservative House and Senate next year, AND someone like Bachmann president.

What REALLY pisses me off about all this is, we saw many, many liberal Democrats willingly commit political suicide voting for Obamacare. They knew it would cost them, yet they did what they did because of their political beliefs.

How come Republicans never seem willing to make that sort of principles sacrifice on behalf of conservatism and the American nation?

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:40 PM (kUaEF)

270 Everyone, the standard answer to all questioning, doubting, complaining, griping, etc is now "You are too stupid to understand."

"You are too stupid to understand", it's the new "despicable" "Hello"

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:40 PM (ECjvn)

271
First we had the CCB. That was rejected.

Now we're getting just the CC. And it seems that will also be rejected.

How about just C? Can we do that?

Posted by: speak into my boner at July 26, 2011 07:41 PM (b8X5C)

272 6. Revert to 2008 2006 funding levels as the baseline.

FIFY (All of Pelosi-Reid must be undone!)

Posted by: Rod Rescueman at July 26, 2011 07:41 PM (HwE/1)

273 I said he had a good point, had nothing to say on how he said it

Posted by: YRM at July 26, 2011 07:38 PM (HhCkU)
I don't think his point is good either. I think we could do better than Boehner. That doesn't mean Sarah Palin ropes in brandishing a sword and decapitating Democrats, it means we have somebody who knows how to negotiate.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 07:41 PM (uhAkr)

274 Can't we do better than these hamsters for representation?!? Clearly, this system is not working in the best interests of the citizenry of the USA.

Perhaps this is the plan- knocking out the big dog will be a feather in someone's cap.

Posted by: museisluse at July 26, 2011 07:42 PM (qQQV2)

275 269 This.All they care about is getting reelected it seems.

Posted by: steevy at July 26, 2011 07:42 PM (5mTHV)

276 "I'm not a one plan only guy, either."

Lay off all Democrats.

Deficit problem solved.

Posted by: someguy at July 26, 2011 07:42 PM (iIQ0a)

277 Give me liberty, or give me free s**t.

Posted by: ArmageddonBaby at July 26, 2011 07:42 PM (UW4ln)

278 Futurecuts, even fake cuts that really just diminishfuture increases,will never happen. Never.

Posted by: Wm T Sherman at July 26, 2011 07:42 PM (w41GQ)

279 There aren't even 'cuts' backloaded. Just numbers to be filled in with appropriations. That was just wonderful in the last budget. Even those 'cuts' weren't 'cuts'.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 07:42 PM (boO9r)

280
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 07:41 PM (uhAkr)
I'm not happy with Boehner either

Posted by: YRM at July 26, 2011 07:43 PM (D6IZ4)

281 We need better bloggers.

Ace talking about 10 year plans is moronic. He should be exposing this for what it is.

Bullshit.

Posted by: someguy at July 26, 2011 07:43 PM (iIQ0a)

282 Bob, dear, I have an hour till my next appointment, if you know what I mean.
Posted by: Liddy Dole at July 26, 2011 07:39 PM (Ew27I)
Quick, where can we find two bathtubs?

Posted by: Bob Dole at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (QKKT0)

283 Iowahawk:
"Jobs Bill" helps jobs like Buffalo Bill helped buffaloes

Posted by: Concealed Kerry or Submit at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (tHnoW)

284 ok, i'm over my moment of let down.
Now a question, what would be the chance of Obama signing anything from us that looks like anything we would want?
If Obama doesn't do anything at all towards the deficit can we survive through 2012, how bad might it look, and can we pull the money reigns in then, when we have more power (we hope)?

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (h+qn8)

285 We are saving $2trillion by not going to Mars.

$7trillion if you count not going to Uranus.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (ECjvn)

286 If there is any further melodrama coming out of DC on this debt dumbshow, they're going to need footlights, a trunk of costumes and a couple of snappy dance numbers to break up the stale dialogue.

I think Boehner would look dandy in a pinafore and a wig. Dick Soetero could use some greasepaint, though. He looked awfully orange during last night's monologue.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (AZGON)

287 267
This point cannot be stressed enough. This Congress does not have the
power to limit the spending of the next Congress.

If you are even discussing a 10-year-plan you have already swallowed the
kook-aide handed to you by your Jim Jones political party.

That's why this series of posts by Ace are so riotously funny.

Ace himself thinks there is such a thing as a 10-year plan.

In order to change that, you need to rewrite the law to move the budget window. 2-5yrs would be a good start.

Trivia: Some in Congress were once considering a 35-yr window.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:45 PM (o2lIv)

288 Meh...seems like Cuba could be an option...
HAVANA (AP) - Each morning before the sun rises too high, Cubans gather at a shaded corner in central Havana, mingling as though at a cocktail party. The icebreaker is always the same: "What are you offering?"This is Cuba's informal real-estate bazaar, where a chronic housing shortage brings everyone from newlyweds to retirees together to strike deals that often involve thousands of dollars in under-the-table payments. They're breaking not just the law but communist doctrine by trading and profiting in property, and now their government is about to get in on the action.President Raul Castro has pledged to legalize the purchase and sale of homes by the end of the year, bringing this informal market out of the shadows as part of an economic reform package under which Cuba is already letting islanders go into business for themselves in 178 designated activities, as restaurateurs, wedding planners, plumbers, carpenters.An aboveboard housing market promises multiple benefits for the cash-strapped island: It would help ease a housing crunch, stimulate construction employment and generate badly needed tax revenue. It would attack corruption by officials who accept bribes to sign off on illicit deals, and give people options to seek peaceful resolutions to black-market disputes that occasionally erupt into violence.

Posted by: dananjcon at July 26, 2011 07:45 PM (roFKc)

289 $7 trillion if you count not going to Uranus.

You will not cut my favorite space program.

Posted by: Barney Frank at July 26, 2011 07:46 PM (AZGON)

290 Sure wasted a lot of time at Tea Party protests and getting freakin' Brown elected. Could haveshould havebeen drunk.

Posted by: Panther at July 26, 2011 07:46 PM (GxleY)

291 Totally agree with this. I was thinking about it today. It pisses me off, too. I have more admiration for those libs than I do for weak Republicans.

"What REALLY pisses me off about all this is, we saw many, many liberal Democrats willingly commit political suicide voting for Obamacare. They knew it would cost them, yet they did what they did because of their political beliefs. How come Republicans never seem willing to make that sort of principles sacrifice on behalf of conservatism and the American nation?"

Posted by: Travis at July 26, 2011 07:46 PM (9WkMB)

292 Maybe the President has some sort of colossal personal failure hidden up his sleeve. Let's not underestimate his ability to fuck up and score an own goal -- I believe in that respect he's growing into the job right before our eyes.

Posted by: Wm T Sherman at July 26, 2011 07:46 PM (w41GQ)

293
Dear Lord,

Bless this bill I submit today. Bless the spending cuts and bless the new commission for debt reduction. And thank you for my speakership. And thank you for my smokin' hot wife.

In Jesus' name,

booogity! booogity! booogity!

Amen!

Posted by: Pastor Boner at July 26, 2011 07:46 PM (qMihc)

294 121
"Ya know if we don't raise the debt limit, the first people I'd stiff for their paychecks are the IRS"

Make them second, Congress should be first. Or even make them third, with Congress and Barky being first and second.

Posted by: Retread at July 26, 2011 07:11 PM (OLzPL)
TSA first.

Posted by: schizoid at July 26, 2011 07:46 PM (fZLO3)

295 Quick, where can we find two bathtubs?

Posted by: Bob Dole at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (QKKT0)

But if the two of you are naked in separate bathtubs, side by side watching the sun go down in your backyard, how can you... you know...

And besides: won't it freak out the neighbors?

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:47 PM (kUaEF)

296 Good lord. Leave Boehner alone. You guys sound like whiny bitches.

Posted by: cherry π at July 26, 2011 07:47 PM (OhYCU)

297 If there is any further melodrama coming out of DC on this debt
dumbshow, they're going to need footlights, a trunk of costumes and a
couple of snappy dance numbers to break up the stale dialogue.

"The French Mistake" seems appropriate. Although, if it were adapted to be "The Greek Mistake", that would be better.

Posted by: Rod Rescueman at July 26, 2011 07:47 PM (HwE/1)

298 269
...

What REALLY pisses me off about all this is, we saw many, many liberal
Democrats willingly commit political suicide voting for Obamacare. They
knew it would cost them, yet they did what they did because of their
political beliefs....

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:40 PM (kUaEF)
Those that were voted out landed some sweet jobs- Stupak is a lobbyist for the Venable law firm. So the pay-offs for their votes was just compensation.

Posted by: museisluse at July 26, 2011 07:48 PM (qQQV2)

299 Hey, Methos, I am agreeing with you, in fact.

Huh? Is there a connotation of cupie dolls I don't understand? Your answer was closer to what I had in mind (and even longer term). I was just trying to make a joke about pointlessly borrowing money.

Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 07:48 PM (sOXQX)

300 Raise the debt ceiling $500B and adjourn, Boner.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 07:48 PM (GTbGH)

301 >>We need better bloggers. Ace talking about 10 year plans is moronic. He should be exposing this for what it is. Bullshit.

Good idea. You go scout out a new place and report back. Take your time.

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 07:49 PM (TMB3S)

302 In Jesus' name,

booogity! booogity! booogity!

Amen!

Yet another blow to organized religion.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:49 PM (kUaEF)

303 Obama's portion of government: No plan

The Senate's portion of government: Let's stay Progressive

The House's portion of government: Let's try conservatism

Now, neither Obama nor the Senate have the potential or desire to relieve the nation. The House does offer a plan and it could relieve the nation. Somehow the ones who insist that the House hold to form -- you know, the ones with a plan -- need to water down the solution to a non-solution and are derelict? That's idiotic.

The House need not acquiesce whether Boehner's leading or not. The House had a solution. Not enough of one, really, but at least it was debatably productive. What's getting rewritten now is pathetic compromise. It's tying conservatives to the albatross of failed economics due to political expediency which the nation cannot afford.

Why punish the Tea Party-led House? Why demand that they embrace the suck when we know it's the suck? IOW, rally around the Tea and let the stalemate simmer. We won the argument that this spending is catastrophic and we're winning the BBA debate. This is more than just principles; it's reality. We fix this or the nation collapses. Stalemate is our best option now. The Cap is the current law and it works to conservatism's (and sober people's) favor.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at July 26, 2011 07:49 PM (r4t7/)

304 Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 07:48 PM (sOXQX)

Sorry, Meth... I think I misread your comment.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:49 PM (AZGON)

305 so next year we will spend $3,892 BILLION
WE will spend $3,891 BILLION
fracking sooper genuis

Posted by: jake in ID at July 26, 2011 07:49 PM (7EolK)

306 $7trillion if you count not going to Uranus.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (ECjvn)
I'm pretty sure they're coming to our anuses.

Posted by: Papa Editor at July 26, 2011 07:49 PM (Zs83Q)

307 Bigger cuts earlier is bigger savings long term. We peons who have had a mortgage realize that, but I guess it's not nuanced enough for our elites.

Posted by: nickless at July 26, 2011 07:49 PM (MMC8r)

308 We're going to need a new national serious switch. The old one is busted all to hell.

I suppose that makes me an unreasonable demagogue.

I denounce my purist tendencies.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at July 26, 2011 07:49 PM (7utQ2)

309 In Jesus' name,

booogity! booogity! booogity!

Amen!

I think that is the pro forma benediction from the chaplain in Empire of Jeff's imperial legions.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 07:50 PM (AZGON)

310

Yet another blow to organized religion.

Was he a real pastor? I hope not.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:50 PM (oVvUa)

311 Good lord. Leave Boehner alone. You guys sound like whiny bitches.
---------
Yes, we shouldn't say anything at all about this grand deal that is going to get us a sexy 1 billion in cuts.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 07:50 PM (OX4OZ)

312
14 Fox just said the House ConCons have effected a re-write. Boehner doesn't have the conservatives on board and he has a choice: re-write to get them or re-write to get Dems. If he chooses #2, he won't be speaker in 2013 September.
... Posted by: Sukie Tawdry

FTFY

Posted by: Comrade Arthur at July 26, 2011 07:50 PM (/62i9)

313 53As I told 80s baby on the other thread I no longer see a success path for this. The only way to succeed is to cut now and cut big. The commies are not going to allow that to happen no matter what.

Even if the House refuses to raise the debt limt to force no spending and no new borrowing Otrama will ignore it because he knows he will not be impeached.

We will get QE-III and QE-IV anyway. After that hyper inflation and collapse.
Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (M9Ie6) unfortunately this seems the most likely outcome.

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 07:50 PM (m6OUa)

314 Those that were voted out landed some sweet jobs- Stupak is a lobbyist for the Venable law firm. So the pay-offs for their votes was just compensation.

Posted by: museisluse at July 26, 2011 07:48 PM (qQQV2)

Well, damn it, can't we arrange for some sweet, sweet payoffs for conservative Republicans in the guise of lucrative no-show jobs and sushi served on the bare asses of buxom young whores?

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:51 PM (kUaEF)

315 @298... so what you're saying is, conservatives in the House are so weak-kneed that they won't stand up for their principles even KNOWING they could get cushy jobs on the outside if they are ousted from office. That's even more depressing.

"Those that were voted out landed some sweet jobs- Stupak is a lobbyist for the Venable law firm. So the pay-offs for their votes was just compensation."

(And how do I do the fancy italics comment thingy you guys do when referencing a prior comment?)

Posted by: Travis at July 26, 2011 07:51 PM (9WkMB)

316

In Jesus' name,

booogity! booogity! booogity!

Amen!

You gotta read this in Darrell Waltrip's voice. I can't stop laughing.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:51 PM (fWEL6)

317 284
ok, i'm over my moment of let down.Now a question, what would be
the chance of Obama signing anything from us that looks like anything we
would want?

It depends on what is most important to him.

If Obama doesn't do anything at all towards the deficit
can we survive through 2012, how bad might it look, and can we pull the
money reigns in then, when we have more power (we hope)?

Do you mean if he willingly allows an eventual default or if he just continues on his present course but makes some sacrifices for the sake of preserving power?

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:52 PM (o2lIv)

318 310
Yet another blow to organized religion.

Was he a real pastor? I hope not.
Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:50 PM (oVvUa)

Alas, I believe he WAS, boogity, boogity, boogity!

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 07:52 PM (kUaEF)

319 Yep.Hyperinflation and collapse.Coming soon.

Posted by: steevy at July 26, 2011 07:52 PM (5mTHV)

320 i just want to thank all the rinos in the gop.....you are all a bunch of libs in sheeps clothing.....i'm tired of this "let's all get along" crap.......and the "this is the best we could do" crap....it's all bullshit......

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 07:53 PM (eOXTH)

321
We will get QE-III and QE-IV anyway. After that hyper inflation and collapse. Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 07:00 PM (M9Ie6) unfortunately this seems the most likely outcome.

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 07:50 PM (m6OUa)

I'm more and more convinced that it's the intended outcome.

Posted by: nickless at July 26, 2011 07:53 PM (MMC8r)

322 Good lord. Leave Boehner alone. You guys sound like whiny bitches.

Yeah. Because hey, what's so great about America anyway? Let's just sit on our hands and let 220+ years of history go up in smoke. Better than being "whiny bitches", right?

Cherry π, I usually don't have a problem with your posts. But that one makes me want to buy you a nice steaming cup of STFU with a side of FOAD.

Posted by: Rod Rescueman at July 26, 2011 07:53 PM (HwE/1)

323 I'm more and more convinced that it's the intended outcome.
Posted by: nickless at July 26, 2011 07:53 PM (MMC8r)
Are you unbanned?

Posted by: robtr chemjeff and nickless Liberation Front at July 26, 2011 07:54 PM (MtwBb)

324 I can see clearly now...

The Doom Has Come!

It's a Fright, Fright, Fright...

Apocalypse Day!!

Posted by: Steevie Wonder at July 26, 2011 07:54 PM (kUaEF)

325 I dont know what Boehner can do.

Senate wont vote with him.. Pres pissypants will veto.

Get what we can and wait for 2012? Sounds like all we can do.

Posted by: Jumbo Jogging Shrimp at July 26, 2011 07:54 PM (qjUnn)

326 >>But, now we know. We really know.Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 07:36 PM (G/MYk) True, so now you better be the one to break it to Kraut, cuz I don't trust myself. Especially if there's a staircase nearby.

Posted by: ontherocks at July 26, 2011 07:54 PM (HBqDo)

327 Well I can at least take some solace in the fact that there are those in the House who smelled this out from the get-go (despite being called demagogues by certain people) and said no immediately. I'm thinking there will be enough to make it so Dems have to vote it, which will be interesting seeing as how their President and the Senate majority leader are on record saying a big-fat no to it.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 07:55 PM (OX4OZ)

328 Boy with all this late night negotiating I bet the DC Hookers are busy

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 07:56 PM (i6RpT)

329 "Even if the House refuses to raise the debt limt to force no spending
and no new borrowing Otrama will ignore it because he knows he will not
be impeached."

Illegally issued bonds should be rated junk.

Posted by: schizoid at July 26, 2011 07:56 PM (fZLO3)

330 You know, it's almost like you spent last night and all of this morning pointing out the uselessness of Boehner's plan, only to be condescended to and dismissed as a political naif, and then getting to watch in fucking wonderment as the lightbulb sputters to life above the heads of the AoS blogging crew.

Welcome to the EXXXTREME party, pal. All the beer's gone.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff, EXXXTREME KKKONSERVATIVE at July 26, 2011 07:56 PM (lGFXF)

331 You know what sounds like whiny bitches?
Hungry kids during a Depression.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:56 PM (ECjvn)

332 What electoral coalition exactly are we going to get in 2012 that would help us?

We aren't going to get to 60 senators, at least not without keeping the Maine sisters, Murkowski, etc.

We can get a larger House majority, but that is not exactly relevant right now. It would be better to continue to move conservatives up to leadership positions.

The path for a strong conservative for President in 2012 is difficult. Not impossible, but certainly not a lock.

It is now or never. We just have to sit on one of these critical junctures and refuse to move until we control the legislation. There is no other option.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 07:56 PM (boO9r)

333

try this again

so THIS year we will spend $3,892 BILLION
and NEXT year we will spend $3,891 BILLION
fracking sooper genuis

Posted by: jake in ID at July 26, 2011 07:57 PM (7EolK)

334 Are you unbanned?

Posted by: robtr chemjeff and nickless Liberation Front at July 26, 2011 07:54 PM (MtwBb)

Yeah. Mr. Ace let me comeback to the Big House.

Posted by: nickless at July 26, 2011 07:57 PM (MMC8r)

335
Dear Ohio please primary this prick.
sincerely,
the rest of the fucking country.

Posted by: Bannor at July 26, 2011 07:57 PM (l8Ytm)

336 328 Boy with all this late night negotiating I bet the DC Hookers are busy
Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 07:56 PM (i6RpT)

Care for a California Roll?

*Hey! Watch where you put your chopstick!*

Posted by: DC Hooker at July 26, 2011 07:57 PM (kUaEF)

337 208
I think the time is rapidly approaching when I'll need to simply stop watching TV and paying attention to politics, period.

Let me know when you start the sports-n-cooking blog and I'll see you there, CoolCzech!

Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 07:57 PM (5H6zj)

338 I dont know what Boehner can do.Senate wont vote with him.. Pres pissypants will veto.Get what we can and wait for 2012? Sounds like all we can do
---------
There is nothing to get. I mean should Boehner cave on every single issue in order to just "get something?" This terrible plan has been declared dead by both the PRes and the Senate. And it cuts NOTHING and it still isn't good enough.
This stupid President is going to veto unless the bill raises taxes AND gets this thing pushed beyond 2012. Now if Boehner goes along with that, I'll move my ass two hours north and lead the fucking charge to primary him.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 07:57 PM (OX4OZ)

339
Illegally issued bonds should be rated junk.

Whoa! I think you mean "will."

Riiiiiiight?
/nods head up and down

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:58 PM (KpRxj)

340 No he doesn't. His response to pointing out that Boehner is an
ineffective Speaker is to call everybody stupid and imply that nobody
could do better than Boehner is.
Yeah, because there's a post somewhere up there in which I called everyone stupid. Yeah, good eye.

What I really get a kick out of is watching some of the same people who lectured us over and over last year about how we didn't need the Senate now finding out that, gosh, we really did need the Senate after all, but since it's easier to piss in the wind than admit they were wrong they'll just blame John Boehner for not wielding some kind of mythical absolute power.

We don't have very many actual solutions, but we're really good at finding scapegoats, eh?

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:58 PM (BUX9N)

341
Sometimes, the best thing to do is NOTHING.
Wonder if Boehner has the cajones to tell Barky to twist....
Better yet, tell the Senate that there isn't going to BE any more legislation coming from the House until a budget is passed.
Then adjourn the House. The Senate has a bill that hasn't been voted on yet - it was just tabled.
Put it on Barky's shoulders, and let the chips fall where they may. If that August 2nd deadline is so all-fired important, then the Senate will pass the House bill and Obama will sign it.

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX at July 26, 2011 07:58 PM (/kd4o)

342 I'm drinking. It seems the only prudent course.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 07:58 PM (GTbGH)

343 327
Well I can at least take some solace in the fact that there are those in
the House who smelled this out from the get-go (despite being called
demagogues by certain people) and said no immediately. I'm thinking
there will be enough to make it so Dems have to vote it, which will be
interesting seeing as how their President and the Senate majority leader
are on record saying a big-fat no to it.

Potential backdating and math mistakes made by staffers weren't among their complaints, though. They wanted CCB and they're still standing for that.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:58 PM (o2lIv)

344 Oh, shit, we're screwed. Let's take the bajillion dollars in deficit spending Obama wants and buy lottery tickets, or hit the tables in Vegas. That's a more responsible monetary policy than what the Petulant Prince is pursuing.

Posted by: Republican Primary Voter at July 26, 2011 07:59 PM (/0tpc)

345 So what would happen if everyone changes their withholding status to 15 dependents so NO income tax was withheld??

hmm

Posted by: jake in ID at July 26, 2011 07:59 PM (7EolK)

346 Fight the democrats in 2012? Hell, seems like ever time we turn around we have to fight the RINOs. Immigration, TARP, Debt Ceiling...don't have time to fight the dems.

Posted by: Panther at July 26, 2011 07:59 PM (GxleY)

347 Someday never comes.

Posted by: Creedence Clearwater Revival at July 26, 2011 07:59 PM (LK0O9)

348 And a lot of the talk shows were decrying Bachmann, et al, for opposing Boehner's plan. Seems like they were right to do so.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:00 PM (zgZzy)

349 Come on, folks.

It's over.

Forget this horseshit about 'saving America'.

We can get rich from collapse, somehow. Right?

Plenty of Russians did it.

So...we need the cookbook.

What's valuable? How do you get your hands on government assets? Who are the right people to bribe?

I mean, when I auction off Yellowstone on eBay and I get a Paypal from Ted Turner for half a billion, I need to know I've got the right palms greased to transfer ownership.

Or at least that no one who contests the transfer is going to have a larger-caliber weapon than I do.

So, let's figure it out. What's going to be worth taking when the federal government packs up and goes home?

I'd like to think there's a /sarc tag on this, but we don't have much longer.

Posted by: JEM at July 26, 2011 08:00 PM (o+SC1)

350 Every retired and current pol receiving a federal paycheck should be the ones who get stiffed.

Then every fed employee above an E13 pay rating.

Posted by: Jack at July 26, 2011 08:00 PM (8IAHO)

351 CC Sabathia perfect thru 4!
(Baseball always calms me)

Posted by: dananjcon at July 26, 2011 08:01 PM (FzVlt)

352 You know, it's almost like you spent last night and all of this
morning pointing out the uselessness of Boehner's plan, only to be
condescended to and dismissed as a political naif, and then getting to
watch in fucking wonderment as the lightbulb sputters to life above the
heads of the AoS blogging crew.

Welcome to the EXXXTREME party, pal. All the beer's gone.

Don't forget us fat virgins sitting in basements living off Gramma's Social Security and eating cheetos.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 08:01 PM (ECjvn)

353 349
And a lot of the talk shows were decrying Bachmann, et al, for opposing Boehner's plan. Seems like they were right to do so.

Which one, this one? 'Cause Bachmann even voted against CCB.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 08:01 PM (BUX9N)

354 It's over, Johnny. IT'S OVER!!!

Posted by: Colonel Trautman at July 26, 2011 08:01 PM (zgZzy)

355 340

Illegally issued bonds should be rated junk.

Whoa! I think you mean "will."

Riiiiiiight?
/nods head up and down

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 07:58 PM (KpRxj)
Depends on whether Boehner comes out and says "of course we'll honor the bonds!"

Posted by: schizoid at July 26, 2011 08:01 PM (fZLO3)

356 Bannor just asked Ohio to primary Boehner. What do you all think of that idea? Honestly, I think it would send a strong message to him and others.

Posted by: Travis at July 26, 2011 08:01 PM (9WkMB)

357 127....if Boehner is this incompetent or this shady, he doesn't deserve to be speaker.

Alan West needs to issue a statement saying he was wrong, immediately. And apologize for being duped. His cred will take a hit too.

Gabe should write a post explaining why he's a douche, based on his post and thread comments this morning.

Posted by: The Hammer at July 26, 2011 08:02 PM (0d8Fy)

358 It isn't just that Republicans are being obtuse, they fucking campaigned on this. They campaigned on the country falling into fiscal collapse, debt rating being lowered, all of it.

The leadership just doesn't believe it. They don't see a fiscal crisis, just some buzzwords for the next election cycle and votes for 2012.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 08:02 PM (boO9r)

359 I got all of my urine in the bowl this morning!

It's a great achievement!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at July 26, 2011 08:02 PM (LH6ir)

360
Speaker Boehner can eat things that make a billy goat puke.

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 08:02 PM (o46tc)

361 CC Sabathia perfect thru 4!
(Baseball always calms me)
Posted by: dananjcon at July 26, 2011 08:01 PM (FzVlt)

Calms you? What are you a commie? Get outta my face

Posted by: Billy Martin at July 26, 2011 08:02 PM (i6RpT)

362 Where the hell is all this money going? It's not like he's spending it on Iraq, the Space Program, the F-22, TARP, Stimulus, etc.

WHERE THE FUCK IS ALL THIS MONEY GOING?!

Posted by: Cooter at July 26, 2011 08:02 PM (C06Qq)

363 Senator Graham doesn't like it, so it's probably good for the country

Posted by: richard mcenroe at July 26, 2011 08:02 PM (n0+D8)

364 And P.S. - Where the fuck is the fiery Boehner who decried the health care bill so passionately last year? Stand up, John!

Posted by: Travis at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (9WkMB)

365 Obama has you guys thinking the Apocalypse is coming on 8/2. Wait for 2012.

Boehner is not a miracle worker.

Posted by: cherry π at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (OhYCU)

366 Barry wont veto if the senate dems blink and pass whatever the GOP house gives them. I can live with 1 trillion in cuts that is only 100 billion each year but they better find 100 billion to cut from the 2012 budget and then perhaps the tea party can ramp up pressure to get them to find at least another 100 billion from that baseline for the 2013 budget that they should pass in 2012.

Posted by: palerider - at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (dkExz)

367 What I really get a kick out of is watching some of the same people who lectured us over and over last year about how we didn't need the Senate now finding out that, gosh, we really did need the Senate after all, but since it's easier to piss in the wind than admit they were wrong they'll just blame John Boehner for not wielding some kind of mythical absolute power.
---------
I don't want to get into this one again, but exactly how were we ever going to take the Senate? Even if the horrible Christine O and Sharon Angle don't run, and even if the two people you preferred managed to win (big if), that still doesn't get the majority. It was an impossible feat in 2010.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (OX4OZ)

368 334 Wow this is soo helpful I have been trying to figure this out on my own for a long time now.

Well, you've come to the right place.

You're pretty cute for a spam.

Posted by: Mindy at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (wPiI0)

369 WHERE THE FUCK IS ALL THIS MONEY GOING?!
Posted by: Cooter at July 26, 2011 08:02 PM (C06Qq)

Look for the Union label

Posted by: Union thug at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (i6RpT)

370
schizoid, you must've missed Ace's post yesterday on the difference between saying "should" and "will."

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (yFHtF)

371 Can someone explain why the GOP doesn't clawback the $187B in unspent TARP funds? That's easy money. They can claim $187B in savings from *this year's* budget. They can take a huge slush fund out of the hands of the Dems and the unions. They can roll back a mistake, at least in part.

The best they can come up with is $1B out of FY 2012? Seriously? $3.5 trillion dollars, and that's it?

Top men.Top. Men.

Posted by: blaster at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (Fw2Gg)

372 Which one, this one? 'Cause Bachmann even voted against CCB.

The one I was listening to was Medved. My point is that maybe she saw Boehner's garbage for what it was. Blind squirrel, nut . . .

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:04 PM (zgZzy)

373 hmmm...seems like some of us knew we would get boned in the end just the other day when we were encouraged it was the best deal we could get.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 08:04 PM (mf8Ua)

374 You know, it's almost like you spent last night and all of this
morning pointing out the uselessness of Boehner's plan, only to be
condescended to and dismissed as a political naif, and then getting to
watch in fucking wonderment as the lightbulb sputters to life above the
heads of the AoS blogging crew.

Shut up yoo. Yoo just don't understand why we're all smrter than yoo/

Posted by: pragmatic republican at July 26, 2011 08:04 PM (sOXQX)

375 So we are serfs. Just. Fucking. Spiffy.

Posted by: alexthechick at July 26, 2011 08:04 PM (sf+iw)

376 Mr President, I'll give you your debt ceiling increase for...........$1 BILLION DOLLARS!!!!1!!!111111Eleventy!!!11

Posted by: Dr Boehner Evil at July 26, 2011 08:06 PM (0d8Fy)

377 253

iowahawkblog>>
David Burge

In the last 2 years, the Democrats have produced 1 Massa, 1 Weiner, 1 Wu, and 0 budgets.Might as well laugh.....Posted by: Tami at July 26, 2011 07:36 PM (ULMuv)
Glad you and M'80s made it back.
If I got banned it would get all the notice of a deer fart in the deep woods.

Posted by: ontherocks at July 26, 2011 08:06 PM (HBqDo)

378 We really need to vote these fuckers out. Every sitting GOP congressman and senator. Extreme measures for extreme circumstances.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:06 PM (zgZzy)

379

To hell with gold I�m investing in Vaseline cause i think we're going to need it.

Posted by: Bannor at July 26, 2011 08:06 PM (l8Ytm)

380 357
Bannor just asked Ohio to primary Boehner. What do you all think of that
idea? Honestly, I think it would send a strong message to him and
others

He gets primaried almost every single year and hasn't lost. It's incredibly difficult to oust a sitting Speaker via the electoral process. Impeachment or resignation, somewhat better chance; successful primary, no.

Have you ever tried sending him a letter or email? How about calling him?

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:06 PM (o2lIv)

381 He gets primaried almost every single year and
hasn't lost. It's incredibly difficult to oust a sitting Speaker via the
electoral process. Impeachment or resignation, somewhat better chance;
successful primary, no.

Have you ever tried sending him a letter or email? How about calling him?

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:06 PM (o2lIv)
Most voters simply don't pay enough attention, and that's killing us.

Posted by: KG at July 26, 2011 08:07 PM (LD21B)

382
that's a great tweet but...

David Burge

In the last 2 years, the Democrats have produced 1 Massa, 1 Weiner, 1 Wu, and 0 budgets and 0 private sector jobs

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 08:07 PM (NdWo2)

383 try this again

so THIS year we will spend $3,892 BILLION
and NEXT year we will spend $3,891 BILLION
fracking sooper genuis

hey I'm repeating myself
Kinda like TOTUS, it only holds 6 speaches.

Posted by: jake in ID at July 26, 2011 08:07 PM (7EolK)

384 >>I'm drinking. It seems the only prudent course.

I concur.

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 08:07 PM (TMB3S)

385 Look, Boehner is just a poor leader, but I don't think he should be primaried. Or at least he shouldn't be option 1 on the list.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 08:07 PM (OX4OZ)

386 We really need to vote these fuckers out. Every sitting GOP congressman
and senator. Extreme measures for extreme circumstances.

Now, now, Wyatt. I know you like to shoot from the hip

Boehner isn't king of the world. Hold your powder.

Posted by: cherry π at July 26, 2011 08:08 PM (OhYCU)

387 I'm just sitting wondering what the left hand is doing due to the fact everyone is watching the right hand debt talk, what are they planning to hit us with next?

Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at July 26, 2011 08:08 PM (/4Rf0)

388 John has hocked his mustache.

John has hocked his mustache.

Posted by: Creedence Clearwater Resistance at July 26, 2011 08:08 PM (LK0O9)

389 357 Bannor just asked Ohio to primary Boehner. What do you all think of that idea? Honestly, I think it would send a strong message to him and others.
Posted by: Travis at July 26, 2011 08:01 PM (9WkMB)
Yeah sure go ahead and run primary challengers to him. Maybe he'll only win with 74% of the primary vote instead of the 84% he got last year. The guy is not Mike Castle. He'd probably be getting Tea Party support if he were running as a first time candidate.

Posted by: buzzion at July 26, 2011 08:08 PM (oVQFe)

390 362 put a pipe in it ya dead sod!

Posted by: dananjcon at July 26, 2011 08:09 PM (uIz80)

391 Do you mean if he willingly allows an eventual default or if he just continues on his present course but makes some sacrifices for the sake of preserving power?

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 07:52 PM (o2lIv)
He has indicated by calling banks etc He won't default, (there is no need to anyway)the funds are there if He chooses.
as far as sacrifices I know there is talk of closing Gitmo again, Which would assist in His regaining some of the hard Left, as it would be a move in the left direction in time for the elections.maybe another reduction in military budgets, using drones % intelligence as He has said?
Idon't think He'd do any REAL sacrifice for us, But He might jerk everyone around with Medias' help.But can we financially hang on, we know how bad it is for appx 10% plus of the population I am speaking of His doubling down between now and then on regualtions winniners and losers, stealing from some americans to give to His cronies.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:09 PM (h+qn8)

392 371

schizoid, you must've missed Ace's post yesterday on the difference between saying "should" and "will."

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 08:03 PM (yFHtF)
No, I didn't, and I meant "should." I sure as hell wouldn't buy Obamabonds.

Posted by: schizoid at July 26, 2011 08:09 PM (fZLO3)

393 379
We really need to vote these fuckers out. Every sitting GOP congressman
and senator. Extreme measures for extreme circumstances.

Even the ones trying their best to do the right thing, be they fresmen, RSC members, or others? What purpose would it serve? You cannot blame everyone in the House for something they did not know.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:09 PM (o2lIv)

394 The one I was listening to was Medved. My point
is that maybe she saw Boehner's garbage for what it was. Blind
squirrel, nut . . .

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:04 PM (zgZzy)
Bachmann understood, from the very beginning, that this should have been all about repealing ObamaCare. This is the last MUST-PASS piece of lgislation that has to come out of the GOP-controlled House (though it should not be and something should have been gotten from previous MUST-PASS House pieces).Bachmann was on top of the essence of this issue from Day One.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 08:10 PM (G/MYk)

395 Glad you and M'80s made it back.If I got banned it would get all the notice of a deer fart in the deep woods.

Posted by: ontherocks at July 26, 2011 08:06 PM (HBqDo)
Nooooo, not true!
I do think people need an e-mail contact (or two) of others here. It helps when the unbanned can comment on the banned.If it ever happens to you, e-mail me at moronettetami at gmail dot com.

Posted by: Tami at July 26, 2011 08:10 PM (ULMuv)

396 Maybe that hill over there ...

Posted by: Republican Motto at July 26, 2011 08:11 PM (SQP5L)

397 #366

We don't give a damn what Obama thinks. Most of us think that the fiscal situation is unsustainable for more than a couple years without drastic tax hikes or fiscal catastrophe.

Putting all of our hopes in waiting for 2012 doesn't make sense when we would probably have to do the same damn thing many of us want to do now given the Senate rules. Unless you expect 60 Senate votes that includes Snowe, Collins, Murkowski and half a dozen other 'moderate' Republican Senators, the hurdles don't get any smaller.

Enacting a CCB bill would be our version of 'Obamacare', and we would need all three branches with the same majorities Dems had. You can't just cross your fingers and hope for that. This is the time.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 08:11 PM (boO9r)

398 and scaring/threatening corporations more than He already has.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:11 PM (h+qn8)

399 Obama has you guys thinking the Apocalypse is coming on 8/2. Wait for 2012.Boehner is not a miracle worker.

I don't give a shit about August 2 or September 2 or December 2.
I don't want a deal made until after the checks go out as normal, which they will.
Once Obama's empty threat is proven he will be forced to make real cuts.

We want a good deal or no deal. Not a shitty deal full of more unicorn Skittle shit and double rainbows.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 08:11 PM (ECjvn)

400
note to self: my jedi humor tricks do not work on schizoid

Posted by: soothsayer at July 26, 2011 08:11 PM (uHw7p)

401 Yeah sure go ahead and run primary challengers to him. Maybe he'll only win with 74% of the primary vote instead of the 84% he got last year. The guy is not Mike Castle. He'd probably be getting Tea Party support if he were running as a first time candidate.
-------
Pretty much agree. He isn't a sell-out like Scott Brown or something. He's just not a strong leader.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 08:11 PM (OX4OZ)

402 Yeah, because there's a post somewhere up there in which I called everyone stupid. Yeah, good eye.

So are you saying that people who want to replace Boehner for his gross incompetence >aren't< dipshits, or are we going to split hairs on the difference between being stupid and a dipshit?

What I really get a kick out of is watching some of the same people who lectured us over and over last year about how we didn't need the Senate now finding out that, gosh, we really did
need the Senate after all, but since it's easier to piss in the wind
than admit they were wrong they'll just blame John Boehner for not
wielding some kind of mythical absolute power.

The Senate is immaterial to a question of Boehner's competence as a Speaker. What would be grounds for you to say Boehner should be replaced, if not this completely shitty deal? Are you really going to sit here and say this is the best he could do, that this isn't a colossal fuck-up and a meaningless deal?

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 08:12 PM (uhAkr)

403 Oh by the way, how much is that non-war in Libya costing us?

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 08:12 PM (mf8Ua)

404 I guess we might as well nominate Huntsman.

Posted by: blaster at July 26, 2011 08:12 PM (Fw2Gg)

405 341No he doesn't. His response to pointing out that Boehner is an ineffective Speaker is to call everybody stupid and imply that nobody could do better than Boehner is.
Yeah, because there's a post somewhere up there in which I called everyone stupid. Yeah, good eye.

What I really get a kick out of is watching some of the same people who lectured us over and over last year about how we didn't need the Senate now finding out that, gosh, we really did need the Senate after all, but since it's easier to piss in the wind than admit they were wrong they'll just blame John Boehner for not wielding some kind of mythical absolute power.

We don't have very many actual solutions, but we're really good at finding scapegoats, eh?
Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 07:58 PM (BUX9N) the solution is playing out, Vic alreadysaid it, congressional deadlock, presidential shennigans, QE3 4, hyper-inflation, collapse, and then finally, re-build.i just hope they don't drag it all out over 20 years, if we can kick enough backbone in the GOP we can collapse it sooner which will lead to less suffering and misery.

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 08:12 PM (m6OUa)

406 So we are serfs. Just. Fucking. Spiffy.

Posted by: alexthechick at July 26, 2011 08:04 PM (sf+iw)
It reminds me of the Republican party in my native Philadelphia. They're not interested in, you know, actually winning elections-- their goal is to negotiate with the Dem machine to maximize the patronage positions they control. Sickening. It's like Shaw's "we've already established what you are; we're just haggling over price"

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 08:13 PM (/0tpc)

407 Boehner is weak. Obama knows it feels it and Boehner shows it with these plans. Each plan is weaker and weaker. Need a change in power at the House. Reboot time.

Posted by: lions at July 26, 2011 08:13 PM (Mp19R)

408 Even the ones trying their best to do the right thing, be they fresmen, RSC members, or others? What purpose would it serve? You cannot blame everyone in the House for something they did not know.

Every time I trust these assholes to do the right thing, they cave. Why should I trust Ryan, et al? Seriously. And further, why should I get excited about our chances in 2012? We can't get this thing right, but we're supposed to take back the presidency? Not bloody likely.
Forgive me Eeyore-itude, but fuck these people. They don't have our best interests at heart.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:13 PM (zgZzy)

409 382
Most voters simply don't pay enough attention, and that's
killing us.

That's beginning to change. How many people now read political blogs, CBO reports, and other political websites? People are also now being given information that would have never made it into the public eye.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:13 PM (o2lIv)

410 Yeah this is ridiculous. The GOP had the upper hand in the PR wars after the last few days but now putting out a crappy plan will split them. Still think the most likely outcome is House doesn't pass the Boner plan, Senate passes the sham Reid plan, O/Senate/MSM push the Reid plan, and the GOP House caves after they are relentlessly labelled obstructionists. So O gets his 2.5B debt increase with no strings.
Boner had better be moving to the conservative side to get his bill passed, not to the Dem side,
And it is still unbelievable that these geniuses can't find at least 1% (39B) to cut as a starting point - hell just going back to 2007 levels knocks 1T off annually.

Posted by: notfeelinggoodabout12 at July 26, 2011 08:14 PM (1kwr2)

411 I say we take off and nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

Posted by: Ripley Warthog at July 26, 2011 08:15 PM (tEARG)

412 OK CC perfect thru 5 and just struck out the side for the second time. Something special may be happening at Yankee Stadium. For the record, there has never been a perfect game at the New Yankee Stadium

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 08:15 PM (i6RpT)

413
so THIS year we will spend $3,892 BILLION
and NEXT year we will spend $3,891 BILLION
fracking sooper genuis
I put that in Excel and reducing 3.8T by 1B = 0%
[.00026 actually]
bitchinn'

Posted by: jake in ID at July 26, 2011 08:15 PM (7EolK)

414 Stossel on O'really just showed a man on the street thing, half the people couldn't even describe what a debt limit was?

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 08:15 PM (mf8Ua)

415 or are we going to split hairs on the difference between being stupid and a dipshit?

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 08:12 PM (uhAkr)
The stupid person pushes the button on the crane holding up a safe that says "Warning! Do NOT Push!" to find out why he's not supposed to push it. The dipshit is the guy standing under the safe.
(Poor variation on the old shlemiel/shlemazel Yiddish joke)

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 08:15 PM (G/MYk)

416 OK, so the prevailing thought is that Boehner is a good representative, just a weak leader. How does that help us?

Posted by: Travis at July 26, 2011 08:16 PM (9WkMB)

417 Think Alan West, Paul Ryan, Fred Thompson, Yuval Levin, James Pethokoukis, Eric Cantor and Gabriel Malor feel like tards right now?

And, to the Ryan worshipers, I just don't get it, really. He's supposedly the smartest, most serious financial mind we have and he's made multiple LARGE mistakes on bills and decisions in his supposed area of expertise.

No thanks to a Ryan presidential run, now or any time in the future.

Posted by: The Hammer at July 26, 2011 08:16 PM (0d8Fy)

418 409 Boehner is weak. Obama knows it feels it and Boehner shows it with these plans. Each plan is weaker and weaker. Need a change in power at the House. Reboot time.
Posted by: lions at July 26, 2011 08:13 PM (Mp19R)
Yes because when you are negotiating with a guy that wants something at 50 and you want it at 150, when he rejects the 150 you make it 200. Oh and the other guy has made it clear that he's the one willing to walk away and put all the blame on you for everything.

Posted by: buzzion at July 26, 2011 08:16 PM (oVQFe)

419 Re 412 - forgot to note - has the CBO scored the sham Reid plan yet? I remember the CBO has come up with some screwy scores in the past so I wouldn't be suprised if they scored it better than the Boner plan

Posted by: notfeelinggoodabout12 at July 26, 2011 08:16 PM (1kwr2)

420 I like the strategy I used with my kids and curfew- every comeback, I moved the time:

me: 11:00
kid: Mom! 11:30
me: OK, 1045
kid: Aw, geez, Mom!!
me: OK, OK. 10:30

Every time there is a nasty comeback from BO or his minions, add another $500 billion to be slashed from the BASELINE budget- forget about future not funding endeavors 10 years out.

Sigh, like that is ever going to happen

Posted by: museisluse at July 26, 2011 08:17 PM (qQQV2)

421 ok if Obama and some Reps or Dems will not let this bill,( nor cap, cut and whaever) pass the house.
Why not go further at this point. say alright then, We will make cuts deeper be more specific even and let them say NO again. AT the least when we collapse We have it down that the Bill that might have saved us was turned down by the Presiodent,so people might know who to blame
( yeah I know I'm a dreamer)

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:18 PM (h+qn8)

422 We needed at least $4 trillion in "real" cuts to prevent a downgrade. That'll never happen with the MFM providing air cover. Same if we hit the ceiling w/ anything currently on any table, and Oblunder decides to withhold grandma's checks. It's the GOP fault. Just Shut. It. Down. No matter what we do, we get downgraded, and Oblather gets a twofer - 1) blame it on the GOP, and he sails to re-election, and 2) one more foundation laid toward the culmanation of their ultimate plan - Cloward-Piven.

At least Boner wasn't as far off with his math this time.

Posted by: reality bites at July 26, 2011 08:18 PM (ucq49)

423 >>the solution is playing out, Vic already said it, congressional deadlock, presidential shennigans, QE3 & 4, hyper-inflation, collapse, and then finally, re-build.

I don't understand why so many think that if there is a collapse we will automatically be put in charge and usher in a period of conservative utopia.

The last time we had a real economic collapse in this country we got the New Deal and 40 plus of years of liberal policies culminating with the Great Society, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and the reason we are where we are.

Be careful what you wish for.

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 08:19 PM (TMB3S)

424 It is too bad. Boehner gave a good firm speech last night, thought he had seen the light, but then delivers this stinker.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 08:19 PM (mf8Ua)

425 #425

There won't be a conservative utopia. That is why we can't let it get to a collapse.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (boO9r)

426 OK Baseball question. Yankees up 1-0 thru 5. CC pitching a perfect game. Lightning and storms on the horizon. if the game is called, it�s an official game, is it a perfect game?

Now 2-0

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (i6RpT)

427 Check my math:
Doesn't the federal government basically spend about 10 billion a day while taking in approximately 6 billion in revenue?
So basically, cutting 1 billion is like six hours - out of a year.

Posted by: stickety at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (FUDwf)

428 Yes because when you are negotiating with a guy that wants something at 50 and you want it at 150, when he rejects the 150 you make it 200. Oh and the other guy has made it clear that he's the one willing to walk away and put all the blame on you for everything.
------------
Not sure what you're talking about here. When did Boehner up the stakes? They started with CCB, and since then we've got this plan, which CLEARLY moves towards Obama. Now your second point is interesting because it's true. I just don't understand why we aren't ok with playing the same game. If they are willing to walk away, we should be too.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (OX4OZ)

429 I guess we might as well nominate Huntsman.

I agree it is the only way. We can only ever win by getting more blue voters than the democrat does. Which means we need to make more handouts. I know-free ipads to all schoolchildren!

Posted by: pragmatic republican at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (sOXQX)

430 So are you saying that people who want to replace Boehner for his gross
incompetence >aren't< dipshits, or are we going to split hairs on
the difference between being stupid and a dipshit?

We're not going to split any hairs over things I didn't say at all.

The Senate
is immaterial to a question of Boehner's competence as a Speaker. What
would be grounds for you to say Boehner should be replaced, if not this
completely shitty deal?

None. I don't advocate replacing Boehner.

Are you really going to sit here and say this
is the best he could do, that this isn't a colossal fuck-up and a
meaningless deal?

I believe I already did infer that this was a meaningless deal at the beginning of the thread. But we're talking about a Speaker who has already shepherded CCB, a very good deal, through the House and who has answered Obama's lies twice in prime-time this week, so far.

What I'm not hearing from the Keyboard Warriors is what they think they would be able to accomplish in the position he is in.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (BUX9N)

431 410 Every time I trust these assholes to do the right thing, they cave.
Why should I trust Ryan, et al? Seriously. And further, why should I
get excited about our chances in 2012? We can't get this thing right,
but we're supposed to take back the presidency? Not bloody likely.
Forgive me Eeyore-itude, but fuck these people. They don't have our
best interests at heart.

You don't think the Tea Party influence and lawmakers have changed anything? They're passing better bills, reinforcing the veteran conservatives, and doing their best to hold-back Obama. Events such as this don't change that. If the conference hadn't been so adamant about withholding judgment until they read the bill, we might not have known about this until after-the-fact. Moreover, we probably would have had worse than this enacted by now.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:21 PM (o2lIv)

432 The GOP had the upper
hand in the PR wars after the last few days but now putting out a crappy
plan will split them. Posted by: notfeelinggoodabout12
They didn't really. As Jonah Goldberg pointed out, much of the game was lost when the GOP allowed the debate to be over the debt limit the credit rating and not about the size of government spending.

The GOP typically loses the game before they waddle onto the field by allowing the Left to pick the rulebook, the scoreboard, and the goal lines.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at July 26, 2011 08:21 PM (DEcmU)

433 Guy Fawkes,re( Boehner) I had felt hope for the first time since Obamascare passed or/ in over a year.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:21 PM (h+qn8)

434 Oh and the other guy has made it clear that he's the one willing to walk away and put all the blame on you for everything.

He's going to put all the blame on us anyway. You're not getting anything out of the deal, so why change your negotiating position? For us to give, so must he, and he's not.

Posted by: Meiczyslaw at July 26, 2011 08:22 PM (bjRNS)

435 like i said before, the republicans need to be willing to let the alleged debt limit day of reckoning come and go or they have no standing in the negotiation, and obama knows this.

and don't we have to be willing to cut at least $10 trillion from future spending just to keep us on par with today's ridiculous level of debt? and i believe that is based on rather optimistic growth scenarios.

Posted by: matt foley at July 26, 2011 08:22 PM (R0Uy5)

436 @420- Heh- clearly I was the undisputed ruler with my kids- my son referred to me as arbitrary and dictatorial. Obviously, I did not negotiate, but it gave my husband a chance to be the good guy who was willing to negotiate.

I need to type faster.

Posted by: museisluse at July 26, 2011 08:23 PM (qQQV2)

437 Ok, that's it. SHUT HER DOWN.

We needs cuts on the order of $1T+ per year starting no later then 2012.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:23 PM (FBr/C)

438 Be careful what you wish for.

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 08:19 PM (TMB3S)
Very true. In the event of actual collapse, the only hope that conservatives would have would exist with some states. The feral government reverted to wild a few years ago and will not be any help in a major disaster ... as we've been treated to seeing small-scale examples of with the insane way the feral government went about fucking up the gulf oil spill (contributing to its cause and actively prohibiting its containment and cleanup). When TSHTF, it's going to be just plain ugly.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 08:23 PM (G/MYk)

439 Here's an idea John.Just pass a plan to make Obama king so that all of us,including you, can be his serfs.That way he can take all of the money in one foul swoop and you, you don't have to worry about doing hard things.

Welcome back to the establishment boys and girls, you didn't thnk we really left!

Posted by: Drider at July 26, 2011 08:23 PM (uJSfP)

440 I agree it is the only way. We can only ever win by getting more blue voters than the democrat does. Which means we need to make more handouts. I know-free ipads to all schoolchildren!

I just got an ipad. The accessory economy related to ipads is astonishing. That might actually work as trickle down.

Posted by: blaster at July 26, 2011 08:23 PM (Fw2Gg)

441 Stossel on O'really just showed a man on the street thing, half the people couldn't even describe what a debt limit was?
Don't forget his man-on-the-street interviews are in NYC which is 90% liberal.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 08:24 PM (M9Ie6)

442 The Great Depression will be a fond memory if we collapse.

Who throws a more violent tantrum?

The poor kid who is used to doing without?

or

The spoiled little bastard who is used to getting everything on a silver platter?

When the four generations of useless leeches we have raised and coddled with cradle to grave entitlements can't buy food adn their cell phones start getting turned off by the millions.... heh.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 08:24 PM (ECjvn)

443 close it down.....

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 08:24 PM (eOXTH)

444 So basically, cutting 1 billion is like six hours - out of a year.

Posted by: stickety at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (FUDwf)
But it's the RIGHT six hours. You'll see ...

Posted by: John Boner, Weeper of the House at July 26, 2011 08:24 PM (G/MYk)

445 #432

There is no compromise possible. Sit with the CCB passed and wait for the Senate Dems to pass it. At that point, Obama will have no choice. Pass the bill or close the government.

If we truly believe that we are only a few years away from a fiscal crisis and we know that no election cycle victories are guaranteed, when are we ever going to get a better chance to change the direction of the country?

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 08:25 PM (boO9r)

446 OK Baseball question. Yankees up 1-0 thru 5. CC
pitching a perfect game. Lightning and storms on the horizon. if the
game is called, it�s an official game, is it a perfect game?

Now 2-0

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (i6RpT)

Yes, albeit with an asterisk. But it's a moot point - the Evil Empire would never allow mere lightning to interfere.

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 08:26 PM (/0tpc)

447 Kraut is making a fool of himself ... again ... on O'Reilly. He's whining about who will "get the blame". What an idiot.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 08:26 PM (G/MYk)

448 I believe I already did infer that this was a meaningless deal at the
beginning of the thread. -ass covered -check

But we're talking about a Speaker who has
already shepherded CCB, a very good deal, through the House and who has
answered Obama's lies twice in prime-time this week, so far. --he spoke some words. WOW
What I'm not hearing from the Keyboard Warriors is what they think they would be able to accomplish in the position he is in. --obligatory insult and demeaning dismissal -check check

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 08:27 PM (ECjvn)

449 The last time we had a real economic collapse in this country we got the
New Deal and 40 plus of years of liberal policies culminating with the
Great Society, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and the reason we are where we
are.

What makes you think any of us are going to be subjects of the "government" in DC post collapse? Reset ultimately means reset everything.

Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 08:27 PM (sOXQX)

450 >>Posted by: Tami at July 26, 2011 08:10 PM (ULMuv)
Thanks.

Actually it happened to me @ LukewarmAir, aka PalinvsRomneyanonymous a couple of years ago and I haven't looked back.

I was very fortunate to get excised from that squishy time warp before I wasted any more time.

Posted by: ontherocks at July 26, 2011 08:27 PM (HBqDo)

451 Until Obozo is tossed out on his ear - we as as nation will be eating a lot of shit.

Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 08:28 PM (0fzsA)

452 Do not condemn RINOs. They do the best they can. They try in secret, in the dead of night, to reduce the deficit. They try to stop Obama in the ways they know best.

Its their intentions that matter. That's why politicians caught commiting crimes go to jail. Like Charlie Rangel or Barney Frank. Thats why politicians manage to incrase their personnal wealth tenfold while in office.

So do not hasten to condemn RINOs. For they forge alliances with the Democrats that allow government to flourish and grow. So this expanded government can protect us against baseball players taking steroids, or take steps to put the government in the pornography business by X-raying all airline travellers (the govt. will safeguard those images, we swear it) or advance science by dictating the type of toilet you can use.

Yes RINOs are essential in making government grow and taking more money out of your pockets so your superiors can mandate what you can and cannot do.

So do not be extreme. Do not hunt RINOs. Washington couldn't be DC without RINOs. Cherish them, embrace them, protect them.

They cheat, lie, and mislead you for the benefit of the people!

Posted by: Molon Labe at July 26, 2011 08:28 PM (g5MrG)

453 430
Yes because when you are negotiating with a guy that wants something at 50 and you want it at 150, when he rejects the 150 you make it 200. Oh and the other guy has made it clear that he's the one willing to walk away and put all the blame on you for everything.
------------
Not sure what you're talking about here. When did Boehner up the stakes? They started with CCB, and since then we've got this plan, which CLEARLY moves towards Obama. Now your second point is interesting because it's true. I just don't understand why we aren't ok with playing the same game. If they are willing to walk away, we should be too.
Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 08:20 PM (OX4OZ)
Boehner is the one offering 150, Obama is saying 50. So what good does it do for Boehner to increase to 200?
As for why we aren't ok with playing the same game? Because they feel like it will be a loss for the Republicans. They are the ones that will be blamed for default no matter the truth of the matter. As for why we're not willing to walk away, well if walking away is seen as damaging to the country, why would you want them to?

Posted by: buzzion at July 26, 2011 08:28 PM (oVQFe)

454 Don't forget his man-on-the-street interviews are in NYC which is 90% liberal.

And 20% cats.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 08:28 PM (ECjvn)

455 >>There won't be a conservative utopia. That is why we can't let it get to a collapse.

That horse may have already left the barn.

Bond experts are already speculating that a downgrade on our debt could cost the US up to $100 billion per year in extra interest costs and a downgrade is pretty much baked into the mix.

As Toby said earlier, at this point drinking may be the prudent thing to do.

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 08:28 PM (TMB3S)

456 449
Kraut is making a fool of himself ... again ... on O'Reilly. He's whining about who will "get the blame". What an idiot.
It is rather foolish of him to ask that. Everyone knows John Boehner is to blame for everything.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 08:28 PM (BUX9N)

457 425
I don't understand why so many think that if there is a collapse we will
automatically be put in charge and usher in a period of conservative
utopia.

The last time we had a real economic collapse in this country we got the
New Deal and 40 plus of years of liberal policies culminating with the
Great Society, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and the reason we are where we
are.

Be careful what you wish for.

I don't understand that either. History is replete with examples of people who chose brief periods of anarchy and chaos [as a way to user in a better age] only to receive dictatorships. We have also seen the same result (albeit in a smaller way) with the '06 and '08 elections. Another Reagan has yet to emerge.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:29 PM (o2lIv)

458 Doomed = the new Fucked

Posted by: Jane D'oh at July 26, 2011 08:29 PM (UOM48)

459 Just to be clear, that's Vic's post QE4 collapse I'm referring to. There's still some chance that immediately balancing the budget might salvage the country.

Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 08:30 PM (sOXQX)

460 Well, I'm going to enjoy the Age of Doom by sitting on the screened porch with my husband and reading a novel.

Have fun, fellow Doomsdayers.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at July 26, 2011 08:31 PM (UOM48)

461 Boehner is the one offering 150, Obama is saying 50. So what good does it do for Boehner to increase to 200?
As for why we aren't ok with playing the same game? Because they feel like it will be a loss for the Republicans. They are the ones that will be blamed for default no matter the truth of the matter. As for why we're not willing to walk away, well if walking away is seen as damaging to the country, why would you want them to?
----------
1. So you think Boehner should honestly go ahead and compromise even more from THIS plan? This plan that cuts 1 billion next year..he should just scrap that and get even close to Obama? By doing what..raising taxes?
2. It will always be a loss for Republicans. I don't get you people who sit and ponder over who will "get the blame." The mediea ALWAYS, NO MATTER WHAT will put the blame on the Rs. Stop fretting. It's the way it is and always will be. There is no way of changing it.
3. I don't think walking away is going to damage the country more than raising the ceiling w/o serious spending cuts.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 08:31 PM (OX4OZ)

462 Ryan's budget was a joke as well, and no one wanted to admit it.

His plan relied on passing strict entitlement reform for Medicare where the savings would be seen decades from now, but not make difficult choices on entitlement spending and discretionary spending in the meantime.

It made the same ridiculous assumption as Boehner's plan that Republicans would always control something and be able to block changes to the 2011 projections and plan.

How can Ryan not support Boehner when Ryan's 'plan' did the same thing?

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 08:32 PM (boO9r)

463 You don't think the Tea Party influence and lawmakers have changed anything? They're passing better bills, reinforcing the veteran conservatives, and doing their best to hold-back Obama. Events such as this don't change that. If the conference hadn't been so adamant about withholding judgment until they read the bill, we might not have known about this until after-the-fact. Moreover, we probably would have had worse than this enacted by now.

I think they're doing just okay. To quote Biden, this is a big fucking deal . . . and the GOP is fucking it up! And that - to me - is unforgivable. By time the Tea Party gets enough power to stop this crap, we won't have an economy left to save. And it infuriates me that Boehner and these a-holes don't take this seriously.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:32 PM (zgZzy)

464
425 >>the solution is playing out, Vic already said it, congressional deadlock, presidential shennigans, QE3 & 4, hyper-inflation, collapse, and then finally, re-build.

I don't understand why so many think that if there is a collapse we will automatically be put in charge and usher in a period of conservative utopia.

The last time we had a real economic collapse in this country we got the New Deal and 40 plus of years of liberal policies culminating with the Great Society, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and the reason we are where we are.

Be careful what you wish for.

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 08:19 PM (TMB3S)

i'm not at all convinced of that, we could end up in something like a modern Dark Age, all totalitarian and grotty, kinda like China, or we could end up full bore commie or any of a number of possiblities, but i think there are still enough good people left to turn things right again, we still have the Constitution, it doesn't have to be the battered, ass-wiped document it has become, it could become the Law of the Land again, i believe that could happen, if i didn't why would i do anything?

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 08:32 PM (m6OUa)

465 It is rather foolish of him to ask that. Everyone knows John Boehner is to blame for everything.

You are incorrect.

Every political problem or issue that ever existed since time immemorial is to be blamed on G.W. Bush.

/did you not get the memo?

Posted by: shibumi at July 26, 2011 08:32 PM (z63Tr)

466 wtf is up with the formatting issues? damn it

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 08:33 PM (m6OUa)

467 I don't understand why so many think that if there is a collapse we will
automatically be put in charge and usher in a period of conservative
utopia.

The last time we had a real economic collapse in this country we got the
New Deal and 40 plus of years of liberal policies culminating with the
Great Society, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and the reason we are where we
are.

jackstraw issues a strawman

I never said that. Besides that what we have coming makes great depression 1.0 look like child's play. We already have great depression 2.0 going on now. What I said was we were going to have hyper inflation followed by people moving to a barter economy. A barter economy can not support 300 million people and it will not support the 50% of the population who are drones living off the tax payers at all.

When that happens those drones will start getting hungry and the collapse will fast and furious. We will have a total collapse of law and order and we will have anarchy.

The smart people will have seen the signs and moved into the mountains and walled compounds. When the drones have finished cannibalizing each other and anyone else caught in their wake and have died off, then it may be possible to start over.

Provided we still have a country not controlled by a leader for life.

In any case we will have a massive dies off on the order of 100 million people. It will not be the same government on restart under any conditions.

And lastly nobody sane is really wishing for this, but 53% of the country voted for it whether they know it or not.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 08:33 PM (M9Ie6)

468 This is getting ridiculous! I am so sick of these idiots trying to out propaganda each other! I had very high hopes for Boehner; I really wanted to like him but I am terribly disappointed. I wish Charles Krauthammer was the president; he's delicious!!!

Posted by: Nora at July 26, 2011 08:33 PM (Fm9Lk)

469 I can't wait to see Obama, Biden, Reid, Pelosi, Boehner, Cantorand McConnell up on a stage somewhere on August 1st at 11:00 EDT for the signing, all backslaps and gladhands.
I will not call for violence, and I will feel good about my restraint.

Posted by: Truman North at July 26, 2011 08:33 PM (K2wpv)

470 428 OK Baseball question. Yankees up 1-0 thru 5. CC pitching a perfect game. Lightning and storms on the horizon. if the game is called, it�s an official game, is it a perfect game?

Figures. I have tickets to tomorrow afternoon's game.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:34 PM (zgZzy)

471 Ryan's budget was a joke as well, and no one wanted to admit it. His plan relied on passing strict entitlement reform for Medicare where the savings would be seen decades from now, but not make difficult choices on entitlement spending and discretionary spending in the meantime. It made the same ridiculous assumption as Boehner's plan that Republicans would always control something and be able to block changes to the 2011 projections and plan. How can Ryan not support Boehner when Ryan's 'plan' did the same thing?
-------
I'll continue to give a pass to a plan that touches a major entitlement. It's an extremely risky political move for someone to do that, and because he's the only one I've seen offer a plan that does it, I'm not sure why I should criticize his plan.

Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 08:34 PM (OX4OZ)

472 It is rather foolish of him to ask that. Everyone knows John Boehner is to blame for everything.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 08:28 PM (BUX9N)
The GOP - and conservatives, especially - are going to be blamed for whatever happens, no matter what. There's nothing to ever be surprised about on that account. The question is whether the right thing will be done for America, or something not terribly wrong, at least. It looks like something pretty wrong is where we're headed ... and many of us said would happen from the start.I like Boehner as a person, but he sucks as Speaker and is especially bad there at this particular time. Something like 3 MUST-PASS CRs, a budget, and a debt limit bill - all that have to come out of the GOP-controlled House - and we've gotten jack shit. Make of it what you will.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 08:34 PM (G/MYk)

473 This should be lesson number 159,902,854 on why the R's should stop trying to game the politics and do the right friking thing.

If the cuts you were making were real cuts, with real $$$, from real government spending in this or next budget years, you wouldn't have to keep apologizing for stepping on your johnson.

We're past the point where politics should matter, IMO. Make real cuts, real immediate or nothing...that should be the House offer.

Posted by: The Hammer at July 26, 2011 08:34 PM (0d8Fy)

474 Figures. I have tickets to tomorrow afternoon's game.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:34 PM (zgZzy)
Tarp's on the field, Yanks up 3-0 and CC is still perfect having struck out the last 7 men in a row

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 08:34 PM (i6RpT)

475 They're not rushing this, good:

Debt vote delayed

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:35 PM (o2lIv)

476 What I'm not hearing from the Keyboard Warriors is what they think they would be able to accomplish in the position he is in.

A man could recognize that McClellan was a terrible Union general and that he needed to be replaced without being a better one himself. Similarly, although my boss isn't a C# programmer, he judges me by my results, and if my code sucks he will replace me with a competent programmer.

Boehner's results as Speaker are not too good so far. The 2011 budget was a flop, and this plan -even altered- will most probably be one as well. Why should any of us continue to have confidence in him?

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 08:35 PM (uhAkr)

477 I wish Charles Krauthammer was the president; he's delicious!!!
I could act like a wheelchair gimp if that's what you like. I'm already a gimp. I'll just put wheels on my couch.

Posted by: Truman North at July 26, 2011 08:35 PM (K2wpv)

478
The drinking thing didn't help me much.
I don't know if there's going to be an actual collapse or whether it's just going to be decades of stagnation like Japan. Most times I think like Vic, and see collapse. But the entire world's economy is tied to the health of the US. That leaves the United States plenty of wiggle room to cook the numbers, devalue the dollar, plunder the productive for a few decades until collapse does come.
I miss drinking....

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 08:35 PM (GKQDR)

479 What I'm not hearing from the Keyboard Warriors is what they think they would be able to accomplish in the position he is in.--
Oh, thank you for asking.
Don't raise the debt ceiling.
That is all.

Posted by: Truman North at July 26, 2011 08:37 PM (K2wpv)

480 #473

The problem is that this seems to be the Republican history on spending. Talk a good game and vote the right way on any bill with no chance of becoming law when they are out of power/divided government, yet never do anything to control spending while in power.

The spending part of the Republican fiscal platform is all rhetoric. They hold the line on taxes and that alone is enough to secure my vote. It isn't enough, however, to secure the long-term viability of the country.

Posted by: Paper at July 26, 2011 08:37 PM (boO9r)

481 What I'm not hearing from the Keyboard Warriors is what they think they would be able to accomplish in the position he is in.

Oooo! Jockeying for a co-blogger position?

No one expects him to "accomplish" a deal by himself. If the only way to get a "deal" passed is to knuckle under and give Otard and Co everything they want, we expect him to stand firm.

On a fiscally conservative bill THAT ACTUALLY CUTS SPENDING.

I don't expect a deal to pass. If it doesn't involve slashing spending, I don't want it to pass.

And in that case, his job is to present to the voters the alternative to the path of destruction we're on: the principles of conservative stewardship of public funds, not to present the most pussy deal he can think of - that still won't pass.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff, EXXXTREME KKKONSERVATIVE at July 26, 2011 08:38 PM (lbo6/)

482 Why should any of us continue to have confidence in him?

Because War said so, idiot.

/

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 08:38 PM (ECjvn)

483 Tarp's on the field, Yanks up 3-0 and CC is still perfect having struck out the last 7 men in a row

And tomorrow, the Yankees will get their clocks cleaned with my luck. Holy shit, the Eeyore is strong in me today.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:38 PM (zgZzy)

484 And lastly nobody sane is really wishing for this, but 53% of the country voted for it whether they know it or not.

Thunderous applause, and so forth

Posted by: Padme Amidala at July 26, 2011 08:39 PM (sOXQX)

485 And tomorrow, the Yankees will get their clocks cleaned with my luck. Holy shit, the Eeyore is strong in me today.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:38 PM (zgZzy)

Probably not. I mean Seattle is in town after all

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 08:39 PM (i6RpT)

486 Don't raise the debt ceiling.
That is all.

Posted by: Truman North at July 26, 2011 08:37 PM (K2wpv)
YES YES YES.Not raising the debt ceiling is basically an instant balanced budget amendment.Pass a law instructing that the interest on the debt, SS (but not SSDI), and military pay MUST be paid for before the government pays out any other money.Force Obama to screw his constituency or set himself up for impeachment.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:39 PM (FBr/C)

487 OK Baseball question. Yankees up 1-0 thru 5. CC pitching a perfect game. Lightning and storms on the horizon. if the game is called, it�s an official game, is it a perfect game? Now 2-0
It has to go 7 innings to be a game.

Posted by: robtr chemjeff and nickless Liberation Front at July 26, 2011 08:40 PM (MtwBb)

488
Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 08:28 PM (BUX9N)

Is your name being a link to nowhere symbolic of something?

Posted by: Heorot at July 26, 2011 08:40 PM (zDX3x)

489
Be realistic. Our tax and spend ultra hard left president isn't going to sign anything that isn't a fraud. The only way Obama signs something is if the cuts are few and fake.
At best we can hope to get Obozo out in 2012, regain control of things and repeal all his shit at that point. Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 06:55 PM (0fzsA) Be realistic - that is never going to happen even if they control the Legislature and the Presidency with filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. The Republicans had plenty of time to rollback YEARS of big government after W was elected and didn't even TRY. They could have solved the border and illegal immigrant issue, but instead chose to pander, hoping to win more voters - just like the Democrats. They could have done away with the Dept. of Education - they expanded it. They gave us Medicare Part D and the TSA for fucks sake. They expanded government. Then expanded it some more. They LIKE spending and they LIKE big government as long as they have say in it.

Posted by: blindside at July 26, 2011 08:40 PM (X1Y8q)

490 @291: "What REALLY pisses me off about all this is, we saw many, many liberal Democrats willingly commit political suicide voting for Obamacare. They knew it would cost them, yet they did what they did because of their political beliefs. How come Republicans never seem willing to make that sort of principles sacrifice on behalf of conservatism and the American nation?"
Democrats believe in the Glorious Socialist Utopia. Republicans use conservatism and America as marketing slogans. In the main, they do not believe in either - they believe in a Glorious Socialist Utopia with them in charge.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at July 26, 2011 08:40 PM (xy9wk)

491 i don't know how you guys keep your nerve, I'm a damnd wreck.

we must be able to somehow prop things up somehow, just say no to collapse, imagine the suffering, desperate people , children. Not worth it! might be the way to get to the other side of things, But damn it bullshit, we have smart people in finance why aren't there more in gvt , what can we do to strengthen the support of those we do have?

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:40 PM (h+qn8)

492 After skimming through the comments, a few random thoughts triggered by goodmorons.
Neither side will allow a shut down of more than a few days. Doing so would expose the fraudulent scare tactics and lead to a general unraveling of the power structure.So forget about that.
Not that it's a reason to feel better, but we passed the tipping point about3 years ago on default. That's why we don't have a budget.The nextreal one will triggerone of thosecredit downgrades everyone keeps talking about.
The answer? The alternatives are the crash or the slow death of currency dilution. I prefer the crash, and the sooner the better asI'm getting old.
Vote Democrat from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.

Posted by: Meremortal at July 26, 2011 08:40 PM (7FgWm)

493 I'm not sure a pitcher can come back and pitch as well after a long rain delay.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 08:41 PM (mf8Ua)

494 Just to put it in perspective, peanut butter sales in one year in the U.S. is 2 billion dollars.

Posted by: lowandslow at July 26, 2011 08:41 PM (GZitp)

495 On a fiscally conservative bill THAT ACTUALLY CUTS SPENDING.

Yes, in the T range...not the B range.

Spending $1.69T more then we take in a year isn't really any better then $1.7T.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:41 PM (FBr/C)

496 Is your name being a link to nowhere symbolic of something?

Nope. Your clicking a link to nowhere might be, though.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (BUX9N)

497 hell maybe i will start to drink, might make the nights pass at the least.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (h+qn8)

498 Be realistic - that is never going to happen even if
they control the Legislature and the Presidency with filibuster-proof
majority in the Senate. The Republicans had plenty of time to rollback
YEARS of big government after W was elected and didn't even TRY. They
could have solved the border and illegal immigrant issue, but instead
chose to pander, hoping to win more voters - just like the Democrats.
They could have done away with the Dept. of Education - they expanded
it. They gave us Medicare Part D and the TSA for fucks sake. They expanded government. Then expanded it some more. They LIKE spending and they LIKE big government as long as they have say in it.

Fuckin A Right.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (ECjvn)

499 It has to go 7 innings to be a game.

Posted by: robtr chemjeff and nickless Liberation Front at July 26, 2011 08:40 PM (MtwBb)

well no- 51/2 is an official game if the home team is ahead. It's in the 6th now so it is official. But they just said on TV that they changed the rule a while back and a no hitter or perfect game has to go 9 to be recorded as such.

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (i6RpT)

500 Weil vs, Guilfoyle. Discuss.

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (/0tpc)

501 Probably not. I mean Seattle is in town after all

"I didn't know they still had a team." - Major League

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (zgZzy)

502 Are there any other morons out there who fantasize about a motorcade of Dem bigwigs traveling up Pennsylvania Avenue from the Capitol to confront the Blue-Lipped Boy King with three choices?

Resignation, Impeachment or Defenestration

Posted by: Jim Sonweed at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (a7CD9)

503 1. So you think Boehner should honestly go ahead and compromise even more from THIS plan? This plan that cuts 1 billion next year..he should just scrap that and get even close to Obama? By doing what..raising taxes?
2. It will always be a loss for Republicans. I don't get you people who sit and ponder over who will "get the blame." The mediea ALWAYS, NO MATTER WHAT will put the blame on the Rs. Stop fretting. It's the way it is and always will be. There is no way of changing it.
3. I don't think walking away is going to damage the country more than raising the ceiling w/o serious spending cuts.
Posted by: Rich at July 26, 2011 08:31 PM (OX4OZ)
1. You mean the plan that is already being rewritten? And I'm talking about just from a negotiation standpoint that when you are doing it you don't jump to a position even farther away from the counter offer. If you are trying to buy a used car that is listed at $5,000 and you only want to pay $4,000 so you say you will buy it for $3,000 are you going to think the salesman is serious when he tells you $6,000?
2. And of course we're going to get the blame. I'd rather take the blame with a solution though than to take the blame while sitting around with our thumbs up our ass. You know its nice to be able to throw it in their faces that you are not to blame, rather than having to admit "yeah we didn't do a damn thing"
3. You mean the spending cuts that the House has been trying to make a part of this, even if sometimes poorly?

Posted by: buzzion at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (oVQFe)

504 Don't raise the debt ceiling.
That is all.

Posted by: Truman North at July 26, 2011 08:37 PM (K2wpv)
YES YES YES.Not raising the debt ceiling is basically an instant balanced budget amendment.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:39 PM (FBr/C)
Yep. And this control is exactly one of the main responsibilities of the House, itself. This IS the House's job to manage. Not the White House's and not the Senate's - though they both have input after the House intiates the process with its bill. Too many are downplaying this specific power of the House.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (G/MYk)

505 Pass a law instructing that the interest on the debt, SS (but not SSDI), and military pay MUST be paid for before the government pays out any other money.

Unnecessary. Let Obama tell us where his priorities lie.

Posted by: Truman North at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (K2wpv)

506 464
Ryan's budget was a joke as well, and no one wanted to admit it. His
plan relied on passing strict entitlement reform for Medicare where the
savings would be seen decades from now, but not make difficult choices
on entitlement spending and discretionary spending in the meantime....

(1) You need to go-back and read the sections about mandatory spending, including Medicaid reform and cuts to food stamps and subsidies, among other things. Also see the parts dealing with ObamaCare.

(2) Under current budgetary law, the budget window is 10yrs. So all plans contain that framework; the issue is more what you do with said framework.

(3) He sould have cut more from discretionary because it would have helped. It wouldn't have solved the problem, but it would have helped.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:43 PM (o2lIv)

507 "...only to receive dictatorships..."
That's what I'm talkin' 'bout

Posted by: El Presidente Obama at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (ucq49)

508 I'm not sure a pitcher can come back and pitch as well after a long rain delay.
Posted by: Guy Fawkes at July 26, 2011 08:41 PM (mf8Ua)

David Cone had a 30 minute rain delay in his perfect game. He came back to finish it off. It's up to the manger and the player. Truth is CC is so important to the Yankees, I doubt they would let him come back to pitch if it goes much past 30 minutes

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (i6RpT)

509 Nope. Your clicking a link to nowhere might be, though.

Gee whillikers you're clever Mr. Undead.

Posted by: Heorot at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (zDX3x)

510
I will repeat what I wrote this morning for the evening morons...
Any politician selling big savings over numbers of years, especially when they span several election cycles, is full of shit. THIS. GETS. US. NOWHERE.

Sorry Lucy, I'm not kicking the ball this time.

Posted by: dogfish at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (N2yhW)

511 Third party anyone????

Posted by: Big T Party at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (FfyYt)

512 >>Jackstraw issues a strawman

>>I never said that. Besides that what we have coming makes great depression 1.0 look like child's play. We already have great depression 2.0 going on now. What I said was we were going to have hyper inflation followed by people moving to a barter economy. A barter economy can not support 300 million people and it will not support the 50% of the population who are drones living off the tax payers at all.

>>When that happens those drones will start getting hungry and the collapse will fast and furious. We will have a total collapse of law and order and we will have anarchy.

>>The smart people will have seen the signs and moved into the mountains and walled compounds. When the drones have finished cannibalizing each other and anyone else caught in their wake and have died off, then it may be possible to start over.

>>Provided we still have a country not controlled by a leader for life.

In any case we will have a massive dies off on the order of 100 million people. It will not be the same government on restart under any conditions.

Oh I see. You've just assumed that the country will skip right through hundreds of years of cultural, political and economic growth and go straight road warrior. My bad.

So we can cut Social Security payments now, right?

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 08:45 PM (TMB3S)

513 How come Republicans never seem willing to make that sort of
principles sacrifice on behalf of conservatism and the American nation?"

The political class of both the Republicans and the Democrats are to the left of their base. This is a large part of the reason we continue to slide left, just slightly slower at times, under both Democrats and Republicans.

The problem is that we conservatives expect someone to want to fight hard to get a position to thereby weaken its power. Yes there are a few that can avoid the corruption, but most people willing to enter the political arena see growing government as a good thing unfortunately.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:45 PM (FBr/C)

514 Well, look, if the CBO thinks we'll even survive ten more years, that's great.

Posted by: t-bird at July 26, 2011 08:46 PM (FcR7P)

515 sniff-sniff? this old thang still here?

Posted by: TheGreatSatan'sGhost at July 26, 2011 08:46 PM (UrPTC)

516 I have written this many times, this is what I think the House can achieve.

Pass a bill that adds $300-500B to the debt limit. Include also deauthorizing the $187B from TARP. Find another $30B or so to stop spending on and call it done, adjourn the House.

Let the Senate refuse to consider it. Let the President veto it. If they do, budget for August and September is balanced. No need for abalanvced budget amendment.

Then take up the FY 2012 appropriations. Make it really 10% less year over year from FY 2011. If the Dems don't go along, do a CR month by month. 10% less first month, 11% the second....

Simple. None of this clever stuff that is bs in the first place.

Posted by: blaster at July 26, 2011 08:47 PM (Fw2Gg)

517 OK, over 500 posts about DOOM. I'd say that's enough.

Can we talk about Christina Hendricks now? That gal is udderly endearing!

Posted by: DC Hooker at July 26, 2011 08:47 PM (kUaEF)

518 I wonder why I feel so cynical and despondent these days.

Oh yeah... it's because we are DOOMED.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 08:48 PM (kUaEF)

519 Unnecessary. Let Obama tell us where his priorities lie.

Posted by: Truman North at July 26, 2011 08:42 PM (K2wpv)
I think there is a fair chance he could refuse to pay the interest on the debt or SS and blame the Republicans for it.On military pay, well, this is one area he could, and would, screw conservatives.
Why give him the opportunity?
One of the big problems we have is that special interests can always collude for more funds from Uncle Sugar. Force a situation where they have to spend their energies fighting each other and the leftwing coalition falls apart - unions vs enviros, feminists vs Islamists, big business corporatists vs trial lawyers, etc...

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:49 PM (FBr/C)

520 Czech, just think of breasts, I'll think of shoes i guess.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:50 PM (h+qn8)

521 David Cone had a 30 minute rain delay in his perfect
game. He came back to finish it off. It's up to the manger and the
player. Truth is CC is so important to the Yankees, I doubt they would
let him come back to pitch if it goes much past 30 minutes

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (i6RpT)
Once a fully-stretched out arm starts to cool, It's dangerous to bring it back when the body is starting its recovery process. (Remember, pitching is as much of an unnatural act as when my mom caught me in the bathroom when I was 12.)

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 08:50 PM (/0tpc)

522 513Third party anyone????Posted by: Big T Party at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (FfyYt) Third parties don't help. The only third party that could help the US is far to the right of republicans. As it is now, there are debates over word choice to avoid scaring the middle.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 08:50 PM (GKQDR)

523 "feminists vs Islamists"

Yeah, well unfortunately American feminists show a unique talent for simultaneously taking offense if a man holds a door for the and turning an absolute blind eye to the plight of little muslim girls forced to dress and act like they are living in the 6th century instead of 21st century America.

Go figure.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 08:52 PM (kUaEF)

524 Bob, dear, I have an hour till my next appointment, if you know what I mean.
Posted by: Liddy Dole at July 26, 2011 07:39 PM (Ew27I)
Quick, where can we find two bathtubs?
Posted by: Bob Dole at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (QKKT0)
Don't get Bob Dole wrong, hon. You're still Bob Dole'sbest girl, but Bob Dole doesn't think the hoochykoo is worthrisking a broken hip with those gottdamned tubs,

Posted by: Bob Dole at July 26, 2011 08:52 PM (Ew27I)

525 Oh I see. You've just assumed that the country will skip right through
hundreds of years of cultural, political and economic growth and go
straight road warrior. My bad.

No I don't "assume" shit. All you have to do is look at what has happened elsewhere. The difference with them was that other countries remained stable and the people had someplace to flee to.

I just can not for the life of me understand why you people still think we are talking fking politics here.

Nobofy is buying our debt anymore...can't you get that through your head and what that means?

Don't you know WTF QE-I QE-II really were or do you believe that horseshit that this set of lying jackles put out?

The time for arguing politics on this ended with QE-I.

And as I told miss 80s, thanks to communists and people like you I know longer see a solution. We are headed for Armageddon.

Thanks

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 08:52 PM (M9Ie6)

526 I don't think Boehner is at fault here. He is cobbling together votes, and obviously the majority of theRepublican caucasconsists of big-spending idiots. If Boehner gets out in front of them he loses votes. I get the sense he can only buy a few in a case like this.
Boehner is justthe canary telling us the Republican mine is posioned.
I'm open to abuse on this idea, go for it.

Posted by: Meremortal at July 26, 2011 08:53 PM (7FgWm)

527 524 513Third party anyone????
Posted by: Big T Party at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (FfyYt)

Having lived through John Anderson and Ross Perot, I don't understand why people continue to be fascinated by the idea of a Third Party. It's a con.

There are only TWO real ideologies out there: statist vs. classical liberal (i.e., conservative). Parties can come and go, but they can only be one or the other.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 08:53 PM (kUaEF)

528 465 I think they're doing just okay. To quote Biden, this is a big
fucking deal . . . and the GOP is fucking it up! And that - to me - is
unforgivable. By time the Tea Party gets enough power to stop this
crap, we won't have an economy left to save. And it infuriates me that
Boehner and these a-holes don't take this seriously.

All they can do is the best they can do with what they have. Have some people within the conference made some incredibly bad and near-fatal mistakes? Most definitely, and I hope they get this right the second time. But this is more than just 10yrs of bad decisions. What we have here is decades of mistakes made by both our government and our fellow people. We have little infrastructure, we allowed the entitlement crisis to get out-of-hand, we let the politicians entrench themselves, we lack morals and ethics in all aspects of life, we ceded control of academia and culture to liberals, etc. For many years, we were able to float when we should have been sinking. Now the bill is due, and we are not ready.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:54 PM (o2lIv)

529 If the Democrats have been holding on to hope that the Republicans we're going to bust out the big guns in negotiating with themselves to come up wit a plan that would finally start turning away voters in groves then they better ring the bell as fast as possible, JB has outdone himself here.

I betcha a dollar (make that a dime, things are tough) to doughnuts that King Obama will also get a consolation tax increase to boot, nothing big, just enough to smack any sass that may be left in JB's insolent mouth.

Posted by: Drider at July 26, 2011 08:55 PM (uJSfP)

530 Czech, just think of breasts, I'll think of shoes i guess.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:50 PM (h+qn

willow, please explain the age-old affection of women for shoes. I pray you. We straight men sincerely, honestly, do not understand. G spot? I understand. Shoes? I got nothing

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 08:55 PM (/0tpc)

531 I know!

Let's let someone else fix it.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 08:55 PM (ECjvn)

532 530
465 "Fellow citizens", not "fellow people".

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:55 PM (o2lIv)

533 I'm feeling satisfied but guilty. The RNC just called me for money and I gave the poor girl on the phone down the road.

Q. Oh, don't I agree that defeating Obama is the most important thing for the country? A. Sorry lady, I just read where Boehner's negotiating position is to cut the 1.7T deficit by 1B this year. Oh, and 16B next year. Somehow, I don't feel we are on the same side.

Good day, madam.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 08:56 PM (GTbGH)

534 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:54
that's as glum as I've seen you type.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 08:56 PM (h+qn8)

535
Can we talk about Christina Hendricks now? That gal is udderly endearing!

Or how about this?

Adriana Lima

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 08:57 PM (c0A3e)

536 Oh I see. You've just assumed that the country will skip right through
hundreds of years of cultural, political and economic growth and go
straight road warrior. My bad.

Actually, what the left is doing now isn't unprecedented, and it hasn't really worked out all that well for them either.

The left provoked just the sort of societal collapse they are threatening now in Argentina and Spain - and in both cases lost.

The frog slow boil method they usually use is much more effective, but Barack Obama is not a particularly skilled strategist.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:57 PM (FBr/C)

537 515How come Republicans never seem willing to make that sort of principles sacrifice on behalf of conservatism and the American nation?"

The political class of both the Republicans and the Democrats are to the left of their base. This is a large part of the reason we continue to slide left, just slightly slower at times, under both Democrats and Republicans.

The problem is that we conservatives expect someone to want to fight hard to get a position to thereby weaken its power. Yes there are a few that can avoid the corruption, but most people willing to enter the political arena see growing government as a good thing unfortunately.
Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:45 PM (FBr/C) this is why 10 year budgets don't matter, BBA's don't matter, spending caps don't matter, term limits don't matter.they do whatever they want because we keep sending them back, what incentive do they have to stop?that new guy\gal you like, the one you think is so great. after 2 or 3 terms they will be as corrupt as the rest of them.Congress is like a toilet, it has to be flushed regularly.

Posted by: Shoey at July 26, 2011 08:58 PM (m6OUa)

538 The RNC should not call during drinking hours.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 08:58 PM (GTbGH)

539 Why do we do all the budget projections in ten year plans? Because they're twice as effective as five year plans!!!

Posted by: Comrade O at July 26, 2011 08:58 PM (KI/Ch)

540 Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 08:52 PM (M9Ie6) And the reason most of the time I think you're right, is because, like Monty's pointed out plenty of times on the DOOM thread, there's no political will to do what's needed. Any cuts are met with sob stories in the media and circuses like in Wisconsin - and that's for the minor cuts.I expected the Republicans to collapse earlier in the year. I'm still hoping for a long term holdout and no raiseon the debt ceiling. Mentally, I see this as the last hill before DOOM world.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 08:58 PM (GKQDR)

541 WH guy on CNN is saying Boehner's plan won't pass the Senate anyway
Plan is dead. Even the Speakers Office is acknowledging this (per Fox). Senate wasn't going to pass it, White House wasn't going to sign it. Wasted time...and yea, any plan with a commission, committee, etc. is not a good plan anyway.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 08:59 PM (OWjjx)

542 We are so boned.

Posted by: DelD at July 26, 2011 08:59 PM (Q8tTc)

543 it may be more than 10yrs of bad decisions but today is the day we SHOULD be cleaning it up.....not gently nudging ourselves into the right direction.....FUCKING SLAMMING ALL THE CABINET DOORS....KICKING THE DOG AND BREAKING ALL THE GOD DAMNED DISHES!

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 08:59 PM (eOXTH)

544 The left provoked just the sort of societal collapse they are threatening now in Argentina and Spain - and in both cases lost.

The big difference there was there was a Western World still available to help them past the collapse. When we go, there will no help and if it hasn't already gone most of the rest of the world will go with us.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 09:00 PM (M9Ie6)

545 I expected the Republicans to collapse earlier in the year. I'm still
hoping for a long term holdout and no raiseon the debt ceiling.

This seems to me better for the country, AND for the Republican politically then any other plan they've floated.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 09:00 PM (FBr/C)

546 Well CC is back on the mound and the game is about to start

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 09:00 PM (i6RpT)

547 @422: "I like the strategy I used with my kids and curfew- every comeback, I moved the time:me: 11:00kid: Mom! 11:30me: OK, 1045kid: Aw, geez, Mom!!me: OK, OK. 10:30"
Don't think we won't remember that when the time comes to put you in a Rest Home.

Posted by: Museisluse's kids at July 26, 2011 09:01 PM (xy9wk)

548 And the reason most of the time I think you're right, is because, like
Monty's pointed out plenty of times on the DOOM thread, there's no
political will to do what's needed.

Bingo - and we even have fellow Morons who don't see it.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 09:01 PM (M9Ie6)

549 Ombudsman,
shoes: well they are delightful, we can feel decadent, we can make ourselves taller or shorter, we can shop until we find a match of almost anything that can be worn.

maybe it's more about the hunt for me than actual shoes, heck many times I say oooh there they are, but don't buy them.
lately i could care less about shoes, I havent bought any in more than two years. hard to advocate for the expense

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:01 PM (h+qn8)

550 Posted by: dɥoǝu�xƃ�ɹl

that's cute!

Posted by: Truman North at July 26, 2011 09:01 PM (K2wpv)

551 (GTbGH)

The Republicans sure do have some poor timing.

My spam folder and home voice mail has at least two pitiful cries for my money every day.

Maybe I'll negotiate for a penny this year and three pennies every year for ten years.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:01 PM (ECjvn)

552 willow, please explain the age-old affection of women for shoes. I pray you. We straight men sincerely, honestly, do not understand. G spot? I understand. Shoes? I got nothing

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 08:55 PM (/0tpc)

I once read - in my wife's Cosmo, I think - that women like wearing high heels not only because it makes their legs look longer and ergo sexier, BUT also because having their heels elevated so much higher than their toes creates a certain pleasurable tautness in their pudendal regions when they walk...

Feel free to discuss.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 09:01 PM (kUaEF)

553 The big difference there was there was a Western World still available to help them past the collapse.
I was referring to Pinochet and Franco.

Essentially, the left believes if they cause a catastrophe, they'll get to pick up the pieces and put society back together how they want. History says that is in no way assured.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 09:02 PM (FBr/C)

554 Clearly, neither party is taking this seriously. It's like when DeLay said there was no fat in the budget in 2006.

Posted by: steve poling at July 26, 2011 09:02 PM (db5YN)

555 also Ombudsman,
think about how men feel about cars or sports maybe similar

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:02 PM (h+qn8)

556 513Third party anyone???? Posted by: Big T Party at July 26, 2011 08:44 PM (FfyYt) Having lived through John Anderson and Ross Perot, I don't understand why people continue to be fascinated by the idea of a Third Party. It's a con.
Because issues like ballot access, organization, money, and actually deciding on a candidate (Perot and Anderson basically created parties for themselves) are easily resolved in the internets�..reality��eh, not so much.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:02 PM (OWjjx)

557 Shut it down. We've made offers, let "The One" figure it out.

Shit I won't miss my SS check, but it does pay my club bill.

Posted by: Billy Bob, the guy who drinks in SC at July 26, 2011 09:02 PM (hXJOG)

558 I'm gonna try and stop following politics and be as happy as I can until the SHTF.Why worry about things you can't change anyway?

Posted by: steevy at July 26, 2011 09:02 PM (5mTHV)

559 When I was a kid in britches, 22% of the employed worked at actually making stuff and 10% worked in government. Now, here we are, all those years later, and 10% work at making stuff and 22% work in government.

The issue of the day seems to be whether we should raise the debt limit to permit more people to suck at the government teat work in government. I don't think my 'line in the sand' type of thinking about this issue is the least tiny bit extremist. They've robbed so many of us of our future, our children of their future, and now they want to rob our grandchildren of their future with another debt limit increase.

If the (R)'s don't want to stand for something, then they stand for nothing.

Posted by: Downscaled Upscale at July 26, 2011 09:03 PM (IhHdM)

560 toby928�@535,

I think I'll borrow that except with a tweak: "I promise to give the RNC a kajillion dollars in a decade for conservative votes today." Think they'll fall for it?

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at July 26, 2011 09:03 PM (r4t7/)

561 Perfect thru 6

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 26, 2011 09:04 PM (i6RpT)

562 CC's still got it going through 6...

Posted by: mugiwara at July 26, 2011 09:04 PM (KI/Ch)

563
I say grab Harry's plan, add the Balanced Budget Amendment to it and call it a win.
Because: we are going to get down graded regardless, the cuts are not deep enough and don't fix anything long term.
Therefore, Obama has set up Boehner to take the fall when we are downgraded and interest rates go up. That is what that speech was about. Now Obama can say he warned the country that Republicans were going to cause a downgrade.
This is about 2012, not the debt ceiling anymore.
There is almost nothing left to win but the PR game! The cuts are meaningless. At least taxes are off the table.
But a Balanced Buget Agreement would be pretty big. Especially if it was worded so that the buget had to be balanced with cuts, not tax increases. It would be nothing now, but long term it could change history. Take it to the states.
Since Republicans were so accomodating on Reid's plan, they can't be blamed for the down grade. That would keep Obama from making his planned "I told you so speech."
I do not believe there is anything to keep the down grade from happening at this point. It is all PR now.

Posted by: petunia at July 26, 2011 09:04 PM (hgrmi)

564 The problem is that we conservatives expect someone
to want to fight hard to get a position to thereby weaken its power. Yes
there are a few that can avoid the corruption, but most people willing
to enter the political arena see growing government as a good thing
unfortunately.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 08:45 PM (FBr/C)
We conservatives have never had anybody really represent us; even under Reagan the government still grew and despite that the libs screamed like the world was about to end. That's why I'm skeptical about how much cutting can really be done; the pols of both parties are so conditioned to growing government that it's codified in their DNA. The Tea Party should have a target on the forehead of every fuckhead that Rove helped elect as a starting point.

Posted by: Captain Hate at July 26, 2011 09:04 PM (zsvKP)

565 >>No I don't "assume" shit. All you have to do is look at what has happened elsewhere. The difference with them was that other countries remained stable and the people had someplace to flee to.

>>I just can not for the life of me understand why you people still think we are talking fking politics here.

>>Nobofy is buying our debt anymore...can't you get that through your head and what that means?

>>Don't you know WTF QE-I & QE-II really were or do you believe that horseshit that this set of lying jackles put out?

>>The time for arguing politics on this ended with QE-I.

>>And as I told miss 80s, thanks to communists and people like you I know longer see a solution. We are headed for Armageddon.

>>Thanks

Oh blow it out your ass you cranky old fuck. Everyone of your comments should come with "Get off my lawn".

People like me? I've been harping on this shit since before you graced this blog and started being Mr. Hard Core Conservative (just don't touch my SS).

I'm well aware of the precarious state we are in. Maybe more than you. But I don't agree with all your solutions so I am a communist or "people like me" you can't see a way out? Well suck it up, buttercup.

It took almost a century of bad political decisions to put us into this welfare state nightmare but if I don't agree with you, that the only solution is to take the country over the cliff or that that is the only pre-ordained destination I'm a traitor? Blow me. We have to start actually winning political battles if we hope to keep this system and turn things around. I'm sorry if that doesn't meet your timetable of doing everything tomorrow but that isn't reality.

We have one third of the necessary branches of gov't. We are trying to change a political, economic and societal culture which has been breed into this country for a century and it's only going to happen in incremental steps. If you don't approve of that and want to flee to your walled compound in the mountains have at it. Just leave the SS check behind.

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (TMB3S)

566
The only way is to start cutting entire departments. Dept. of Energy gone.
Dept of Education gone. Just go right down the list of shit that is not enumerated in the Constitution. I want to see mid level Washington wennies out in the street.

Posted by: Paladin at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (pYXRq)

567 I once read - in my wife's Cosmo,
The last time I got slapped by my wife was last week. We are in the checkout line at the local grocery, and there is Cosmo. Its article �50 Sex Moves that Drive Men Crazy�.

Told the wife no reason to read the article, I knew what number 1 was. When she asked, I simply quoted Mel Gibson, �First, you will��..�.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (OWjjx)

568 Czech, hmm, well i agree with shoes helping legs and being taller part. the rest. just go look at breasts ok

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (h+qn8)

569
Maybe I'll negotiate for a penny this year and three pennies every year for ten years.

That is so good, sifty, I'm going to use it next time.

I'll offer a 1 dollar donation this year, plus 16 next year, 57 the year after that and so on.

That's as good as when I sent them a contribution in pesos.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (GTbGH)

570 540
The RNC should not call during drinking hours.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 08:58 PM (GTbGH)

What other hours are there?

Posted by: The RNC at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (/izg2)

571 Essentially, the left believes if they cause a
catastrophe, they'll get to pick up the pieces and put society back
together how they want. History says that is in no way assured.

Posted by: 18-1 at July 26, 2011 09:02 PM (FBr/C)
No one can predict what emerges on the other side of monetary/societal collapse, and the US is in a particularly unique position, historically, which doesn't allow us any of the outs that other nations have had. We're just far too big, far too powerful, and the dollar far too integral to world trade and world currencies. A US monetary collapse would make the Weimar Republic look like child's play. And we'd certainly take the rest of them down with us, since they all lived by leeching off the US, for the most part.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 09:06 PM (G/MYk)

572 420
Problem is our guys are not gutter fighters, and do not play the pr game or cannot play it. The point I'm getting from you is that Obama won't accept anything unless it's his way and well he doesn't have a plan but he expects the Repubs to write it for him and Boehner is sure heading in the direction. My point is I don't want the Republican House majority to write a Obama plan, that is not why he was given the majority. The majority was voted in to be a firewall to protect this Great Country from Obama, not help him.

So how do you "negotiate" with someone who wants to send the country into default? By the way this is what happens in South America all the time, silent coups for power(Obama, Hilary's and Zelaya people). Boehner must not cave, if he caves it splits the Repubs party which is the Lefts plan. Look Obama's people have all sorts of regulatory agencies that circumvent Congress and they will circumvent if they need to and raise the ceiling, but they don't want to do it that way because it would be a shock to the electorate. So they are trying to get Boehner to cave. Also this fast and furious stuff I would definitely use it as pressure it is dirty dirty stuff and it needs to come out faster. You gotta fight like them only worse because this guy is an out and out commie. When you have the President of the United States saying he wish he had more power.....hello Just think Zelaya only not as blunt, just a little more silent.
Boehner do NOT cave.

Posted by: lions at July 26, 2011 09:06 PM (Mp19R)

573 How come Republicans never seem willing to make that sort of principles sacrifice on behalf of conservatism and the American nation?"
Because very few of them are conservatives.

Posted by: Meremortal at July 26, 2011 09:06 PM (7FgWm)

574 536
80sBaby at July 26, 2011 08:54that's as glum as I've seen you type.

My high school history teacher was talking about the doom back in '02, and my dad and granddad before that. We've been pretending we can keep repeating mistakes without consequences. This whole set-to with Obama is a time where we have to make a choice, and we cannot make it lightly-- in either direction. So we will either start this entire process anew or start managing our decline.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:06 PM (o2lIv)

575 Well enough gloom and doom for me today.

Maybe tomorrow will be a new day. Maybe I'll wake tomorrow and go walking down a red clay road with James Baskett while he sings about the blue bird on his shoulder.

........but I don't think so.

Tomorrow folks.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 09:07 PM (M9Ie6)

576 night vic

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 09:07 PM (eOXTH)

577 Oh blow it out your ass you cranky old fuck. Everyone of your comments should come with "Get off my lawn".

People like me? I've been harping on this shit since before you graced
this blog and started being Mr. Hard Core Conservative (just don't touch
my SS).

I'm well aware of the precarious state we are in. Maybe more than you.
But I don't agree with all your solutions so I am a communist or
"people like me" you can't see a way out? Well suck it up, buttercup.

It took almost a century of bad political decisions to put us into this
welfare state nightmare but if I don't agree with you, that the only
solution is to take the country over the cliff or that that is the only
pre-ordained destination I'm a traitor? Blow me. We have to start
actually winning political battles if we hope to keep this system and
turn things around. I'm sorry if that doesn't meet your timetable of
doing everything tomorrow but that isn't reality.

We have one third of the necessary branches of gov't. We are trying to
change a political, economic and societal culture which has been breed
into this country for a century and it's only going to happen in
incremental steps. If you don't approve of that and want to flee to
your walled compound in the mountains have at it. Just leave the SS
check behind.

Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (TMB3S)

This, all of this.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 09:08 PM (BUX9N)

578 Bring us some good news in the morning, Vic.

I'll take anything.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 09:08 PM (GTbGH)

579 The only way is to start cutting entire departments. Dept. of Energy gone.
Dept of Education gone. Just go right down the list of shit that is not enumerated in the Constitution. I want to see mid level Washington wennies out in the street
Yea, that is fine and all��..but it doesn�t solve your problem. Department of Education�s budget for 2010 was 47 billion. Energy --- less. PBS, budget was in the millions��millions.

So, let me play CBO. You got 47 billion for Education and, hell, I am too lazy to look it back up again, but I will give you 47 billion for Energy. That is 94 billion. I�ll even throw in 1 billion for PBS. That is 95 billion. Deficiet this year is 1.4 trillion. You still got another 1.305 Trillion to go.

Which is why the grand bargain made some sense, because it at least addressed entitlement reform, which is where the big outlays are and are going to be.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:08 PM (OWjjx)

580 569
I once read - in my wife's Cosmo,
The last time I got slapped by my wife was last week. We are in the checkout line at the local grocery, and there is Cosmo. Its article �50 Sex Moves that Drive Men Crazy�.

Told the wife no reason to read the article, I knew what number 1 was. When she asked, I simply quoted Mel Gibson, �First, you will��..�.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (OWjjx)
Quote Ron White. "Touch his Pleasure Zone. Touch it 50 times"

Posted by: buzzion at July 26, 2011 09:09 PM (oVQFe)

581 "WH guy on CNN is saying Boehner's plan won't pass the Senate anyway"
You know what that's like?

Posted by: push poll at July 26, 2011 09:09 PM (ucq49)

582 President Barack Obama threatened on Tuesday to veto Republican emergency legislation to avert an unprecedented default as the clash over the U.S. debt deepened with a deadline only a week away.
This from MSNBC. Of course this means the Republicans are being intransigent. How can they publish this shit?

Posted by: kansas at July 26, 2011 09:09 PM (A+g5T)

583
At this point I actually think I will become a liberal. At the very least I agree with the proposition that we might as well keep Obama in, let himscrew up the whole works by borrowing another $6 trillion over four more years, abort more babies, abolish marriage between a man and a woman, approve sexual orientation between a human and any other creature after which MAYBE Americans will wake up.
At least until that happens I will not have to defend any more RINOS, will not have to walk away from inane northeast vacous liberals and their empty headed foolish conversations. Might even teach my children Chinese and move to prosperous Mexico.
$1 billion indeed !

Posted by: joe at July 26, 2011 09:09 PM (GgSSJ)

584 That is so good, sifty, I'm going to use it next time.

See, any "keyboard warrior" can negotiate a meaningless deal that helps nobody put gas in the car. Even me.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:09 PM (ECjvn)

585 570 Czech, hmm, well i agree with shoes helping legs and being taller part. the rest. just go look at breasts ok
Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (h+qn

You mean Cosmo ain't a reliable authority on female sexuality??

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 26, 2011 09:09 PM (kUaEF)

586 .

Posted by: Go Braves at July 26, 2011 09:10 PM (HLxYu)

587 wow, this chart looks like bush's chart towards the end of his presidency....

Boehner is delaying the vote until thursday or friday (per twitter breaking news and batchelor)

Posted by: curious the confused at July 26, 2011 09:10 PM (k1rwm)

588 Just leave the SS check behind.
Posted by: JackStraw at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (TMB3S)
I have yet to draw a nickle of SS or any other government money so kiss my ass you shit. The only thing you have harped on is politics of the elect another fucking squish. 'last post ever to you I'm tired of assholes in our own Party who give up for fucking electability.
So yeah, get the fuck OFF my lawn.

Posted by: Vic at July 26, 2011 09:10 PM (M9Ie6)

589 oh dear GOD

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 09:10 PM (eOXTH)

590 The last time I got
slapped by my wife was last week. We are in the checkout line at the
local grocery, and there is Cosmo. Its article �50 Sex Moves that Drive
Men Crazy�.Ironing shirts?

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 09:12 PM (c0A3e)

591 Czech, hmm, well i agree with shoes helping legs and being taller part. the rest. just go look at breasts ok

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:05 PM (h+qn

To quote Seinfeld: "legs? I got legs"

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 09:12 PM (/0tpc)

592 Department of Education�s budget for 2010 was 47 billion.

That's fucking criminal! 47 BILLION dollars ... for an un-Constitutional federal edumacation department that hasn't produced anything. That is a HUGE amount of money. Gigantic. Our "intelligence" budget is about that much. Heh. The whole Israeli military can be funded for two years on that. Their whole military.

How can one not cut all that total waste, especially as it's un-Constitutional to start with.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 09:12 PM (G/MYk)

593 80s, perhaps we cannot make choices until after the fall. g-d forbid.
I think we've are trapped into this fall. I see 1/3 of the country committed until the very end to getting everything they can, and those willing to support them until we are done. and maybe we are.
I keep hoping we have time. 2012 who knows.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:13 PM (h+qn8)

594 543 Plan is dead. Even the Speakers Office is acknowledging this (per
Fox). Senate wasn't going to pass it, White House wasn't going to sign
it. Wasted time...and yea, any plan with a commission, committee, etc.
is not a good plan anyway.

Boehner was the only rep. who really seemed gung-ho about the plan in its entirety. Everyone else disliked it to some degree but made their decision based on what poison they've decided to drink (metaphorically speaking).

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:13 PM (o2lIv)

595 RCP Average Direction of the Country 6/24 - 7/17

Right Track 26.3% Wrong Track 66.0%

Spread -39.7

The Obergeruppenfuher has it 21/71 for a 50 pt spread.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 09:13 PM (GTbGH)

596 fun thread

Posted by: laceyunderalls at July 26, 2011 09:14 PM (EScnL)

597 Get off my lawn...

Posted by: Go Vic at July 26, 2011 09:15 PM (IhHdM)

598 Spread -39.7

And yet we're folding to business as usual.

I despair.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 09:15 PM (GTbGH)

599 Ironing shirts?
O.k��I will admit, I am slow on the intake tonight. Took me a minute. But that was funny.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:16 PM (OWjjx)

600 Well, OT and in the sidebar

WaPo today

HANOVER, N.H. � Jon M. Huntsman Jr. struck a sharper tone here against President Obama in a slightly recast stump speech Tuesday, an effort aimed at energizing his flagging bid for the GOP presidential nomination, which is centered on a strong primary showing in this state.

...

�So the president�s a good man, he�s got a good family, he�s earnest, but he�s fundamentally failed us on the most important issue of our time, which is job creation and the economy,� Huntsman said to an audience at Dartmouth College.

Eh? Dartmouth? Seriously? An earnest man? SRSLY?

The yawns alone from the audience contributed mightily to increased New Hampshire CO2 emissions.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:16 PM (AZGON)

601 Good night Vic.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 09:16 PM (GKQDR)

602 I advocate the return of hemlock to the political process.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:16 PM (ECjvn)

603 Kudlow had his entire panel for tonight's show in studio. If ron Insana is there tomorrow I'm going to panic.

Posted by: curious the confused at July 26, 2011 09:16 PM (k1rwm)

604 oh dear GOD!

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 09:17 PM (eOXTH)

605 Banishment for failed leaders.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 09:17 PM (GTbGH)

606 abolish marriage between a man and a woman
Don't forget polygamy. Looking forward to marrying all of the trees on the property and claiming them as dependents.

Posted by: Bob Saget has not been banned yet at July 26, 2011 09:17 PM (NLWij)

607 Cowboys and Aliens opens this weekend.

So there's that.

Posted by: blaster at July 26, 2011 09:17 PM (Fw2Gg)

608 fun thread
Oh, Lacey, all we need is a Sarah Palin/COD mention, couple of commentors debating longbow vs. cross bow and maybe someone to diss someone else choice of best pistol and we be in business.

Oh, and yea, I forgot��COMPLETELY RANDOM BIG BOLD FONTS!

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:17 PM (OWjjx)

609 Bust a deal, face the wheel!

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:18 PM (ECjvn)

610 609

yee haw! take me to your leader......

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 09:18 PM (eOXTH)

611 Yep, The Democrats will stab each other in the back for power, but Republicans stab each other in the back for nothing!

That's why we'll... oh, shit. I knew there had to be a flaw in that plan.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 26, 2011 09:19 PM (bxiXv)

612 598
fun thread

Fun is for squishes.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 09:19 PM (BUX9N)

613 abolish marriage between a man and a woman

Now you're on to something.

Posted by: Liz Taylor at July 26, 2011 09:19 PM (AZGON)

614
Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:16 PM (OWjjx)
Here's the joke from which I derived that from: A passenger plane runs into a terrible storm. The plane gets pounded on
by rain, hail, wind, and lightning. The passengers are screaming. They
are certain the plane is going to crash and they are all going to die.
At the height of the storm, a young woman jumps up and exclaims, 'I
can't take this anymore! I can't just sit here and die like an animal,
strapped into a chair! If I am going to die, let me die feeling like a
woman! Is there anyone here who is man enough to make me feel like a
woman?' She sees a hand raise in the back and a handsome, tall and
muscular man smiles and starts to walk up to her seat. As he approaches
her, he takes off his shirt. She sees his huge muscles even in the poor
lightning of the plane. He stands in front of her, shirt in hand, and
says to her, 'I can make you feel like a woman before you die. Are you
interested?' She eagerly nods her head. 'Yes!' And the man hands her his
shirt and says, 'Here. Iron my shirt.'

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 09:19 PM (c0A3e)

615 Boehner was the only rep. who really seemed gung-ho about the plan in its entirety
I rarely listen to Limbaugh, unless I am in need of a new computer back-up system, but I had it on in the car when Boehner was on. Not a good sales job.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:19 PM (OWjjx)

616 Fun thread...
Not until I can get 'sʃʃɐɹǝpunʎǝɔɐʃ' undies dancing upside down across the screen.

Posted by: sʃʃɐɹǝpunʎǝɔɐʃ at July 26, 2011 09:19 PM (IhHdM)

617 So Boehner is delaying the vote til after Wesnesday?
Is there any guarantee it will pass the senate?
Way to fuck this up Boehner. Did you think the CBO wouldn't notice it had just 1 billion in cuts in the first year?

Posted by: Ben at July 26, 2011 09:20 PM (DKV43)

618 If Sarah Palin and Christine O'Donnell got married and legalized marijuana we wouldn't need a majority in the House and Senate to pass longbow/crossbow control.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:20 PM (ECjvn)

619 595
80s, perhaps we cannot make choices until after the fall. g-d forbid.I
think we've are trapped into this fall. I see 1/3 of the country
committed until the very end to getting everything they can, and those
willing to support them until we are done. and maybe we are.I keep
hoping we have time. 2012 who knows.

One thing we should have done is focused more time and energy on taking the Senate, and I'm not talking about a few contested races. We cannot truly turn-back the tide until conservatives control the legislative and executive. What we need to do in the interim is focus on what we can do and do it to the best of our abilities.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:20 PM (o2lIv)

620 How can one not cut all that total waste, especially as it's un-Constitutional to start with.
Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 09:12 PM (G/MYk) That's why I'm hoping for no debt ceiling increase for a LONG while. Let government cannibalise itself. I've been hoping the Tea Partiers were enough to stall a debt ceiling increase since theoretically, they just want things fixed. Cutting off the spigots does that. Finding enough conservatives with the political will to ignore the wailing.......

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 09:20 PM (GKQDR)

621 Sarah, Sarah, She's my gal, If she can't do it no one can Go Sarah! Go Sarah!

just helping

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:21 PM (h+qn8)

622 They're spending like there's no tomorrow. I'm beginning to think they're right.

Posted by: The World Tomorrow at July 26, 2011 09:21 PM (jEEpE)

623 Is it too soon to pass out the grenades?

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 26, 2011 09:22 PM (bxiXv)

624 We have one third of the necessary branches of gov't. We are trying to change a political, economic and societal culture which has been breed into this country for a century and it's only going to happen in incremental steps. If you don't approve of that and want to flee to your walled compound in the mountains have at it. Just leave the SS check behind.
I can tell you what my side would do if we held one branch, but then, I think you already know.

Posted by: Nancy Pelosi at July 26, 2011 09:22 PM (Ew27I)

625 If Sarah Palin and Christine O'Donnell got married and legalized marijuana we wouldn't need a majority in the House and Senate to pass longbow/crossbow control.

Don't make me come down there with a pointy stick and a hammer that slices like fuck-you-all. I'll make you read a 30,000 word review of "Captain America" trailers.

Posted by: an angry, hungover Ewok at July 26, 2011 09:23 PM (AZGON)

626 When my son throws a temper tantrum and embarrasses me in Target, thinking about all the debt Obama is giving him makes me feel better.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:23 PM (ECjvn)

627 568... Fuck you

Posted by: Wennie at July 26, 2011 09:24 PM (jeLTI)

628 Sifty, you still need

BIGGER, BOLDER FONTS!

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:24 PM (OWjjx)

629 At this point about the only thing that I'm sure Boehner can cut is a fart.

His plan would have the impact of gas passed in a hurricane.

......epic whimper

hey, isn't that the majority leader

Posted by: ontherocks at July 26, 2011 09:24 PM (HBqDo)

630 Obama/GE's idea of creating jobs in America.

Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 09:24 PM (0fzsA)

631 The Republicans will break your heart every time.
I'm done.
Let it all collapse.

Posted by: Warden at July 26, 2011 09:25 PM (bkkYX)

632 Me thinks Boner is a closet alcoholic due to the fact he was raised in a family that owned a bar . He even mentioned he used to be a small businessman before he entered politics. So he is fundamentally a squish around cocktail hour untill he gets his 'mind right',that is if he even makes it till 5:00 without his daily booze.

Posted by: some guy with an asshole and an opinion at July 26, 2011 09:25 PM (A23u6)

633 I don't see no shirts on this thread. Who is the only important guy out here? WHO?

Posted by: Paul Anka at July 26, 2011 09:25 PM (AZGON)

634 Bigger, bolder fonts are for closers.

I've had my nose smacked with the newspaper by the superior beings too much lately to push my luck.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:25 PM (ECjvn)

635 GE can pollute all it wants! China and leftwing biz go hand in hand.

Posted by: Lemon Kitten at July 26, 2011 09:25 PM (0fzsA)

636 sifty

now that was funny....i'm going to borrow that

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 09:25 PM (eOXTH)

637 617 I rarely listen to
Limbaugh, unless I am in need of a new computer back-up system, but I
had it on in the car when Boehner was on. Not a good sales job

It wasn't, especially when he tried to sound like an expert on federal budgeting. That's one of the things I don't understand, is why he isn't allowing more of the financial minds to draft this legislation. They would've done it right.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:25 PM (o2lIv)

638

We have one third of the necessary branches of gov't.

In the Constitution, which arm of the federal government has the responsibility to stop the federal government from spending too much?
The House.
Not the Senate. Not the White House. Not the Judiciary. The House. Only the House.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 09:26 PM (G/MYk)

639 Great movie on MPLEX. The Odessa File with John voight

Posted by: Ben at July 26, 2011 09:26 PM (DKV43)

640
Don't make me come down there with a pointy stick and a hammer that
slices like fuck-you-all. I'll make you read a 30,000 word review of
"Captain America" trailers.

btw, where is Ace's missive on Captain America?

The guys at RedLetterMedia on their "Half in the bag" review show had a pretty interesting conversation about the new Captain America movie.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 09:27 PM (c0A3e)

641 Sarah, Sarah, She's my gal, If she can't do it no one can Go Sarah! Go Sarah!

just helping

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:21 PM (h+qn

That doesn't rhyme

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 09:27 PM (/0tpc)

642 We could argue about the appropriate music to accompany the nation's fiscal downfall. 80s? 70s? Hobo chanties? The "Rhine Journey" from "Die G�tterd�mmerung?"

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:28 PM (AZGON)

643 That doesn't rhyme

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 09:27 PM (/0tpc)
Fuggin Rhymo.

Posted by: Papa Editor at July 26, 2011 09:28 PM (FZZ94)

644 The guys at RedLetterMedia on their "Half in the bag" review show had a
pretty interesting conversation about the new Captain America movie.

Oh, thanks for reminding me! I wanted to watch that.

I thought the movie was very good. I'm not sure what they think of it though.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 09:28 PM (uhAkr)

645 The guys at RedLetterMedia on their "Half in the bag" review show had a
pretty interesting conversation about the new Captain America movie.

They were pretty much spot-on with my opinion on it, but they obviously didn't know who the Howling Commandos were.

Posted by: nickless at July 26, 2011 09:28 PM (MMC8r)

646 McDonalds caves to pressure, Happy Meals to become Better Than Nothing Meals.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 26, 2011 09:28 PM (bxiXv)

647 When my son throws a temper tantrum and embarrasses
me in Target, thinking about all the debt Obama is giving him makes me
feel better.

Posted by: sifty

LOL!! You rock!

Posted by: Hobbitopoly at July 26, 2011 09:29 PM (958TG)

648 We could argue about the appropriate music to
accompany the nation's fiscal downfall. 80s? 70s? Hobo chanties? The
"Rhine Journey" from "Die G�tterd�mmerung?"

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:28 PM (AZGON)
Milli Vanilli?

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 09:29 PM (G/MYk)

649 After the first few reviews I kind of lost interest in Red Letter Media. When I compared what they said to what I saw, it just seemed like they were only half-watching the movies.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 26, 2011 09:30 PM (bxiXv)

650
Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:28 PM (AZGON)
"Brother, can you spare a dime?" is too obvious.
"Life is a Lemon and I want my money back" by Meatloaf is pretty spot on...

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 09:30 PM (GKQDR)

651 The MFM is starting to beat the 'Third Party' drum. FUCK THE MFM!!!!!!

Posted by: some guy with an asshole and an opinion at July 26, 2011 09:30 PM (A23u6)

652 I want to give up, but I won't. I can't. I'm afraid of what happens when Tooces finally closes the curtain on this glorious experiment.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 09:30 PM (jeLTI)

653 fuck.............. i can only take so much of the shit going on in the world in a 24 hourtime span.

Posted by: you guys need cowbell at July 26, 2011 09:30 PM (HLxYu)

654 >>Posted by: Ben at July 26, 2011 09:26 PM (DKV43)
WW2 classic on TCM, Five Graves to Cairo.
If you haven't seen it, rent it, it's rarely on.

Posted by: ontherocks at July 26, 2011 09:31 PM (HBqDo)

655 GOP House conference meeting set for tonight

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:31 PM (o2lIv)

656 rhyme?

i can barely write and you want me to rhyme also? bah!

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:31 PM (h+qn8)

657 That's fucking criminal! 47 BILLION dollars ... for
an un-Constitutional federal edumacation department that hasn't
produced anything. That is a HUGE amount of money. Gigantic. Our
"intelligence" budget is about that much. Heh. The whole Israeli
military can be funded for two years on that. Their whole military.How can one not cut all that total waste, especially as it's un-Constitutional to start with.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 09:12 PM (G/MYk)
Their budget costs are just the tip of the iceberg compared to the costs of complying with their dumbfuck mandates and initiatives which hinder the paltry number of non-drones in the public education system who are there for the right reasons. The economic costs of the jizzmops in the EPA completely dwarf it's direct budget as befits the legacy of a Repuke like Nixon who instituted wage and price controls, something even Carter was smart enough to avoid (but probably only because Nixon had recently tried them). Defund all those worthless fucks.

Posted by: Captain Hate at July 26, 2011 09:31 PM (zsvKP)

658 It wasn't, especially when he tried to sound like an expert on federal budgeting. That's one of the things I don't understand, is why he isn't allowing more of the financial minds to draft this legislation. They would've done it right.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:25 PM (o2lIv)

The easily arrived at answer is that he doesn't give a crap about the financial aspects, he just wants a deal. Remember, he was willing to sign onto $800B in "new revenues" and claim it wasn't a tax increase.

Posted by: blaster at July 26, 2011 09:32 PM (Fw2Gg)

659 653
The MFM is starting to beat the 'Third Party' drum. FUCK THE MFM!!!!!!
Posted by: some guy with an asshole and an opinion at July 26, 2011 09:30 PM (A23u6)
I saw that too, that water must be getting heavy by now

Posted by: Red Shirt at July 26, 2011 09:32 PM (FIDMq)

660 GOVERNMENT OUT OF MY MOUTH!

Posted by: Kid at McDonalds holding Plastic-Wrapped Apple Slice at July 26, 2011 09:32 PM (bxiXv)

661 GOP House conference meeting set for tonight

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:31 PM (o2lIv)
Are they finally gonna talk about shutting the government down?

Posted by: Papa Editor at July 26, 2011 09:32 PM (FZZ94)

662 McDonalds caves to pressure, Happy Meals to become Better Than Nothing Meals.

Okay, that was worth the mess you made on my keyboard.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:33 PM (AZGON)

663 657 GOP House conference meeting set for tonight
Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:31 PM (o2lIv)
I'd like to be a fly on that wall

Posted by: Red Shirt at July 26, 2011 09:33 PM (FIDMq)

664 The guys at RedLetterMedia on their "Half in the bag" review show had a
pretty interesting conversation about the new Captain America movie.

What those two guys don't know about what they are talking about could fill a lot of comic books.

Is the whole point of that for them to show off how little they know about Captain America?

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:34 PM (ECjvn)

665 I have been watering my gardens since 6:30 and I'm not done. I hate to see my water bill next month.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 09:35 PM (Z71Vg)

666 GOP House conference meeting set for tonight
Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:31 PM (o2lIv)

I'd like to be a fly on that wall

Given it is DC and the people involved, you are more likely to find a blood-sucking tick.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:35 PM (AZGON)

667 Okay, that was worth the mess you made on my keyboard.
Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:33 PM (AZGON)

Heh. Sorry.

McDonalds says they were trying, essentially, to placate the regulation freaks.

When in the history of ever has success ever discouraged someone?

"I know how we can discourage them, we can let them win!"

Seriously, these people handle billions of dollars a year and they don't know rule effing one of human behavior - you want more of a behavior, you reward it.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 26, 2011 09:35 PM (bxiXv)

668 Deninger's a real fluffy bundle of joy this evening.

Posted by: cthulhu at July 26, 2011 09:36 PM (kaalw)

669 650 We could argue about the appropriate music to accompany the nation's fiscal downfall. 80s? 70s? Hobo chanties? The "Rhine Journey" from "Die G�tterd�mmerung?"
Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:28 PM (AZGON)
I think this is oh so apropos don't you. Jimmeh cracked corn and I don't care!!!! http://tinyurl.com/42v58or

Posted by: some guy with an asshole and an opinion at July 26, 2011 09:36 PM (A23u6)

670 McDonalds caves to pressure, Happy Meals to become Better Than Nothing Meals.

You mean the apple and half an order of fries thing? Michelle got to 'em.

Posted by: Retread at July 26, 2011 09:37 PM (OLzPL)

671 O/T, but watching a DVR'd copy of Risoli and Isles- Angie Harmon is my age - in fact she's 10 days older. She's STILL scalding hot. Why then do I look like my grandfather?

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 09:37 PM (/0tpc)

672 As a resident of the Wonder State, I am perplexed by the photos of Charlie 'Tangerine' Crist on the Huntsman stories.

I also don't understand why the Shriners wear funny hats

Posted by: Poker Man at July 26, 2011 09:37 PM (cIkEL)

673 rhee rhee rhee....kick 'em in the knee!

harass harass harass.... kick 'em in the other knee!

Posted by: dɥoǝuıxƃıɹl at July 26, 2011 09:37 PM (eOXTH)

674 @567: "We are trying to change a political, economic and societal culture which has been breed into this country for a century and it's only going to happen in incremental steps."
Not necessarily so.

Posted by: Zombie Mao, Zombie Pol Pot, Zombie Lenin, Zombie FDR at July 26, 2011 09:37 PM (xy9wk)

675 WW2 classic on TCM, Five Graves to Cairo.If you haven't seen it, rent it, it's rarely on.

When I saw from the description that Anne Baxter played a French maid, I admit I expected something different.

Posted by: Waterhouse at July 26, 2011 09:38 PM (SQP5L)

676 Hasselbeck is out!
http://tinyurl.com/3tj2n2n

Posted by: robtr chemjeff and nickless Liberation Front at July 26, 2011 09:38 PM (MtwBb)

677 If anyone's bored, Instapundit presidential poll here.

Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 09:38 PM (5H6zj)

678 McDonalds apple dippers are good! *ducks and runs*

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 09:38 PM (Z71Vg)

679 I have been watering my gardens since 6:30 and I'm not done. I hate to see my water bill next month.
We have had 2 straight weeks of plus 90 degree weather. I hate to see what my electric bill is going to be.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:39 PM (OWjjx)

680 663
GOP House conference meeting set for tonight

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:31 PM (o2lIv)

I'm starting a rumor that Boehner is about to be replaced by McClintock. Let the backstabbing and recrimination begin.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 09:39 PM (jeLTI)

681 What those two guys don't know about what they are talking about could fill a lot of comic books.

Alright. I was interested in what they had to say because they, like me, didn't know much about Captain America. I didn't agree with their synposis and I was perfectly fine with the anachronistic weapons Hydra used because the movie started off with Red Skull finding the blue glowing cubie thingy (in fact, I felt a weird synergy watching the typical WWII-era weapons being used in concert with the "plasma" guns and tanks). But I thought some of their criticisms would have merit with people unfamiliar with Captain America.

Is the whole point of that for them to show off how little they know about Captain America?

I guess; I didn't mind their review at all, and I'm interested now in seeing The Rocketeer all the way through sometime in the near-future. The super NES game sucked though,

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 09:39 PM (c0A3e)

682
Deninger's a real fluffy bundle of joy this evening.

I can not be denied.

Posted by: The Math at July 26, 2011 09:39 PM (GTbGH)

683 Great public service announcement from the late 1950s I would say.

Posted by: WalrusRex at July 26, 2011 09:39 PM (TVvXc)

684 I
The real number the budget should be cut by is14 trillion, since everything is multiplied by ten these days.

Or 1.4 Tril this year. Wouldn't that be just sane and dandy?

Posted by: Buck O. Phive at July 26, 2011 09:40 PM (wwylx)

685 I can not be denied.

Posted by: The Math at July 26, 2011 09:39 PM (GTbGH)
Fuck you!

Posted by: Democrats at July 26, 2011 09:40 PM (FZZ94)

686 Deninger's a real fluffy bundle of joy this evening.

He may be a smart guy, but that screed looks like it was formatted by an excitable chimp.

Posted by: Waterhouse at July 26, 2011 09:40 PM (SQP5L)

687 McDonalds caves to pressure, Happy Meals to become Better Than Nothing Meals.

Denny's redesigns their "Rooty-Tooty-Fresh-and-Fruity Breakfast" to the "Medicinally Acceptable Caloric Stipend, AM model"

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:41 PM (AZGON)

688 We have had 2 straight weeks of plus 90 degree weather. I hate to see what my electric bill is going to be.
Same here, hence the watering of the gardens. My poor plants are looking so pathetic I finally took mercy on them and watered them. I'm sick of this heat wave.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 09:41 PM (Z71Vg)

689 In the Constitution, which arm of the federal government has the responsibility to stop the federal government from spending too much?
The House.
Not the Senate. Not the White House. Not the Judiciary. The House. Only the House.
Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 26, 2011 09:26 PM (G/MYk)
*winks cadaverous eye*
Now you're catchin' on, kid.

Posted by: Nancy Pelosi at July 26, 2011 09:41 PM (Ew27I)

690 We could argue about the appropriate music to accompany the nation's fiscal downfall.

My Heart Will Go On?

Posted by: WalrusRex at July 26, 2011 09:42 PM (TVvXc)

691 cthulhu link
Carl Denninger; It is, in fact, precisely this inescapable mathematical reality that means that we must deal with this now rather than attempting to kick the can and have the market make these choices for us. The outcome of taking our medicine will be bad. Very bad. But if we don't do it - and do it now - it's going to be worse. Much worse.

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:42 PM (h+qn8)

692 Just got finished watching the RedLetterMedia review of Captain America. I gotta disagree with their take. It was a comic book World War II film and it did a pretty solid job. I didn't get a feeling of any missing scenes from the film.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 09:42 PM (uhAkr)

693 Republican leaders said they would probably rework the bill reflecting the decreased savings by only raising the debt limit by less than $850 billion; the change would mean that the Obama administration would need to make another request for an increase in a matter of months, making the deal even less palatable to Democrats.

NYT

So, still no cuts as such, but they'll reduce the increase in new spending?

Nice of them.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at July 26, 2011 09:43 PM (EeYDk)

694 Yep, I'm now certain the only solution is a crash. The DC establishment is incapable of making the tough choices. The only think will be a major crisis. As Churchill said, we Americans will always do the right thing after all other options are exhausted. The only thing that will allow us to save ourselves is crisis, and unfortunately, we may not survive it. Van Jones and the FSA (free shit army) may well win in some Cloward-Piven wet dream, which is what is coming. Or we may win.
The establishment cannot act, and so a collapse must force them out. The death spiral is already starting on interest. Interest rates, 0 at the short term now, have nowhere to go but up. CBO says we'll have $25T by 2020. Interest expense, even at a low rate of 4% (compared to an average of 6% from 1970 - 2010) will blow us up with that. We need to cut $4T from the baseline over 10 years to avoid the death spiral. And that's real cuts from the baseline, not reductions in increase over that baseline. Anything less and we get the compounding death spiral. We will not make in to 2020.
Once a downgrade happens, the spiral starts immediately. And I'm not even considering what that little interest rate shock will do on the monetary side. The Fed is essentially in the coffin corner of monetary policy. I've seen calculations that show a 40% jump in the price level, near instantaneous, if the Fed can't suck about $1T or better out of the monetary base quickly.
I say this with all seriousness. It's GGG time, God, Guns, and Gold. I am not joking. Gird your loins. This is the last chance we have to save ourselves, and the political class can't muster the balls to do it.

Posted by: publius(NotBreitbartPublius) at July 26, 2011 09:43 PM (VVB18)

695 zerohedge approves

In the meantime keep an eye on the dollar and gold. Both are likely, as
soon as the market realizes what just happened, to move very fast in
opposite directions.

Or at least they usually like anything that makes gold rise. I may not have read the whole article.

Posted by: Methos at July 26, 2011 09:43 PM (sOXQX)

696 692
We could argue about the appropriate music to accompany the nation's fiscal downfall.

My Heart Will Go On?

Down with the Sickness?

When the Man Comes Around?

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 09:43 PM (c0A3e)

697 Denny's redesigns their "Rooty-Tooty-Fresh-and-Fruity Breakfast" to the "Medicinally Acceptable Caloric Stipend, AM model"
LOL! That's funny. I'm gonna steal that.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 09:44 PM (Z71Vg)

698 McDonalds says they were trying, essentially, to placate the regulation freaks. When in the history of ever has success ever discouraged someone? "I know how we can discourage them, we can let them win!" You know, one of these days I'm going to cut back on the hundreds of thousands of dollars I give to the democrats.

Posted by: Mrs. Ray Crock, Lefty Moonbat at July 26, 2011 09:44 PM (Ew27I)

699 663
Are they finally gonna talk about shutting the government
down?

I expect it will be tense and angry, especially from the people who went-out on a limb to support it. What they ultimately do depends on how Boehner's staffers rewrite the bill. If he gets it wrong twice, it will get ugly.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 09:44 PM (o2lIv)

700 I guess; I didn't mind their review at all, and I'm interested now in
seeing The Rocketeer all the way through sometime in the near-future.
The super NES game sucked though, .

No stress, Kratos. I just suffered reading through Kurt Loder's review yesterday where he made it obvious that he hadn't even seen the movie. That guy sucks donkey dicks.

You don't have to be a comic book geek to do 15 minutes of research on Wiki about the subject of the movie.

We should get us some kind of online presence, Kratos.

With our animal sex appeal and our incredible mind-power...

we'd be pretty much doomed.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:44 PM (ECjvn)

701 Republicans have not been very good at picking our generals. Just look at the first two years of the American Civil War. We will find our Grant and Sherman soon hopefully....

Posted by: William Eaton at July 26, 2011 09:45 PM (rwioF)

702 I didn't mind their review at all, and I'm interested now in seeing The
Rocketeer all the way through sometime in the near-future.

The Rocketeer was a great '30s period adventure with one major problem: Precious little actual rocketeering took place.

Literally, the hero straps the rocket on and flies around for only about five minutes of the movie, total.

The '30s atmosphere is great though.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 09:46 PM (BUX9N)

703 Went and moved the sprinkler, still have 3 more sections to go. I'm running out of daylight.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 09:47 PM (Z71Vg)

704 If it's gonna be Johnny Cash, then his rendition of Hurt.

Posted by: blaster at July 26, 2011 09:47 PM (Fw2Gg)

705 O/T, but watching a DVR'd copy of Risoli and Isles-
Angie Harmon is my age - in fact she's 10 days older. She's STILL
scalding hot. Why then do I look like my grandfather?

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 09:37 PM (/0tpc)
As a product of the American school system I can easily give you the litany of aggrieved minorities, but I can't fucking do math. she's 10 years and 10 days younger than me.But I still look like my grandfather

Posted by: Ombudsman at July 26, 2011 09:47 PM (/0tpc)

706 696 I say this with all seriousness. It's GGG time, God, Guns, and Gold. I
am not joking. Gird your loins. This is the last chance we have to save
ourselves, and the political class can't muster the balls to do it.

I sold my gold to buy more ammunition. It's coming.

Posted by: Nickie Goomba at July 26, 2011 09:47 PM (jeLTI)

707 A slight edit:

Denny's redesigns their "Rooty-Tooty-Fresh-and-Fruity Breakfast" to the "Medicinally Government Acceptable Caloric Stipend, AM model"

Posted by: Retread at July 26, 2011 09:47 PM (OLzPL)

708 The '30s atmosphere is great though.

Was it like you remember?

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:48 PM (ECjvn)

709 I'm gonna have to go with C-Lo's Forget You!

Posted by: Papa Editor at July 26, 2011 09:48 PM (FZZ94)

710
Posted by: publius(NotBreitbartPublius) at July 26, 2011 09:43 PM (VVB1

Since they keep talking 10 year windows, any talk of less than $12 Trillion isn't worth talking about. And that's with $1.2 Trillion cut now. That's the only way I see of avoiding the boning.
I still think the world has so much invested in the US and so much to lose that creative accounting might keep everything afloat for awhile with accompanying high inflation and the boning of the productive.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at July 26, 2011 09:48 PM (GKQDR)

711 Music for our downfall: Roger Miller's "King of the Road"

Trailers for sale or rent
Rooms to let...fifty cents.
No phone, no pool, no pets
I ain't got no cigarettes
Ah, but..two hours of pushin' broom
Buys an eight by twelve four-bit room
I'm a man of means by no means
King of the road.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 09:49 PM (AZGON)

712 Shit, I had 5,000 bucks saved up. In a year, that will only buy one POS sky blue F150. Used to buy four.

Posted by: Buck O. Phive at July 26, 2011 09:50 PM (wwylx)

713 "We could argue about the appropriate music to accompany the nation's fiscal downfall."
One meatball. And no spaghetti?

Posted by: why? at July 26, 2011 09:50 PM (ucq49)

714 I expect it will be tense and angry, especially from the people who went-out on a limb to support it. What they ultimately do depends on how Boehner's staffers rewrite the bill. If he gets it wrong twice, it will get ugly.
Boehner has one chance��.one��.to come up with something that will sell. And his big push��pass this, it increases our leverage, went over like a lead balloon.

On the one hand, the Reid plan did not include any tax increases. Which pisses the White House off. How bad��..Jay Carney 1) had to go on Fox News today (he said he was glad to be there�..so that is your winner for lie of the day) and 2) basically beg Boehner to come back to the almost done �grand bargain� and do something about that little matter of 400 billion more in tax increases Obama wanted at the last minute.

On the other hand, Boehner kicked the cut par badly. Here is a suggestion, Speaker. Try something small, like maybe some real cuts for 1 year. I know, Obama says he wants it past 2012. Too bad. 1 year, some real cuts and move on to something else.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at July 26, 2011 09:51 PM (OWjjx)

715 http://pointsandfigures.com/2011/07/26/frustration/

Posted by: jeff at July 26, 2011 09:51 PM (jYVZ4)

716 The '30s atmosphere is great though.

Also Jennifer Connelly's bosoms.

Posted by: Waterhouse at July 26, 2011 09:52 PM (SQP5L)

717 Buys an eight by twelve four-bit room
LOL- when I was a kid I thought he was singing eight by twelve four BEDROOM. Since we actually lived in a trailer at the time I asked my mom why we didn't have a 4 bedroom trailer since that bum on the radio was able to get one just by pushing a broom.

Posted by: jewells45 at July 26, 2011 09:52 PM (Z71Vg)

718 Here's some DOOM music:

http://tinyurl.com/3uyudl3

Obama Prison Blues by Johnny Cashless.

Posted by: Retread at July 26, 2011 09:53 PM (OLzPL)

719 Looks a lot like the last Boner "spending cut" This is the same leadership who overlorded massive spending run-ups under Chimpy McHitler.

Have to primary these assholes too. At least Rush schooled him today.

Posted by: Valiant at July 26, 2011 09:54 PM (9/lhd)

720 Screw it

The edge of the radar is two steps away

As an independent contractor not getting 1099'd...I am checking out...going underground...

Good luck morons

The system is not only rigged...it is about to implode

Hunker down and keep your powder dry

Out

Oneway

Posted by: Oneway at July 26, 2011 09:54 PM (cu2EA)

721 Lotta survivalist talk tonight.

Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 09:55 PM (5H6zj)

722 We should get us some kind of online presence, Kratos.With our animal sex appeal and our incredible mind-power...we'd be pretty much doomed.
LOL. We could find some sub-population of people interested in whatever movie/game nonsense we wish to talk about over bottles of Val-U-Rite - there is a niche out there we can possibly fill, even amongst all the other reviewer-style shows out there (and their number is indeed Legion).

The Rocketeer was a great '30s period adventure with one major problem: Precious little actual rocketeering took place.

That's probably why I stopped watching it. IIRC, my friend and I in middle school (? I think) watched about 20 or 30 minutes of it before we stopped because we were bored from the lack of action. I caught the tail-end of The Rocketeer on TBS a few years ago, and that's all I remember of the movie.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 09:56 PM (c0A3e)

723 Ha ha ha. You can't catch me!

(Also the link in the name is a damn fine apocalypse theme song)

Posted by: Debtus Ad infintum at July 26, 2011 09:56 PM (LK0O9)

724 Gutierrez Arrested During Immigration Protest

Posted by: curious the confused at July 26, 2011 09:56 PM (k1rwm)

725 Also Jennifer Connelly's bosoms.

And this.

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at July 26, 2011 09:56 PM (BUX9N)

726 fuck. here it comes.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:57 PM (ECjvn)

727 doom music, Don't Fear the Reaper

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 09:57 PM (h+qn8)

728 706
If it's gonna be Johnny Cash, then his rendition of Hurt.

"Everyone I know... goes away, in the end..."

I *may* have had a few tears in my eyes when I found that song on YouTube a few years ago while looking for GoW clips. *May*, mind you...

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 09:57 PM (c0A3e)

729 I smell a total revolt by the Repub. Freshmen in the house coming in 2-3 days. Mr. Speaker, better start wearing a football helmet to the next meetings with your " U COCK...US??????

Posted by: Richard at July 26, 2011 09:57 PM (BNnU3)

730 @728
One trick link pony.

Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 09:58 PM (5H6zj)

731 The song of Threadwar I

http://tinyurl.com/25c8p63

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 09:58 PM (ECjvn)

732 I'm cleaning my 700. It doesn't need it, but it calms me.

Posted by: toby928� at July 26, 2011 09:59 PM (GTbGH)

733 I didn't agree with their synposis and I was perfectly fine with the anachronistic weapons Hydra used because the movie started off with Red Skull finding the blue glowing cubie thingy.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 26, 2011 09:39 PM (c0A3e)

The blue glowing cubie thingy was an Asgardian (Thor) power device.

Also, WTF are people complaining about? Did they think this was going to be a documentary about WWII? It's from freaking comic books, it had a super serum and vita-ray machine that turned a little guy into a huge bodybuilder and they're having conniptions about rayguns?

Did they bitch about the vaporizing robot in Thor?

Now you see why I ignore movie reviews. Gadzooks.

Also, nobody does research, *nobody*. People would rather wait a year for someone to tell them something than spend 30 seconds looking it up. It freaking drives me freaking crazy.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 26, 2011 09:59 PM (bxiXv)

734 And this.

I did not know "Jan" was in that movie.

Posted by: Waterhouse at July 26, 2011 10:00 PM (SQP5L)

735 If you want some good DOOM music/footage, I like this from Dr. Strangelove:
http://tinyurl.com/ygholw2

Posted by: publius(NotBreitbartPublius) at July 26, 2011 10:00 PM (VVB18)

736 It freaking drives me freaking crazy.

A shorter trip for some than for others.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 10:00 PM (ECjvn)

737 Hobo jerky

2 to 3 Pounds fresh Hobo
1 ts Onion Salt
1/2 ts Salt
1/2 ts Garlic Salt
1/2 ts Lemon Pepper
1/2 ts Sausage Seasoning
1/2 ts Thyme
1/2 ts Oregano
1/2 ts Marjoram
1/2 ts Basil
1 cup Val-U-Rite vodka

Combine the spices in a dish. Cut the hobo into strips less than 1/4 of an inch thick. Remove ALL clothes. Drink vodka. Sprinkle one side with the combined seasonings and beat with a demolition hammer. Turn and repeat the seasoning and beating. Place the strips on a stainless steel gurney or other flat pan. Place in a 120 degree F. oven for 4 hours. Turn and put back for another 4 hours. Keep the oven door propped open for the entire time to allow the hobo smell to escape. Store in a plastic body bag.

Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 10:01 PM (AZGON)

738 Good song to admire the four horseman by.

Posted by: WalrusRex at July 26, 2011 10:01 PM (TVvXc)

739 Lotta survivalist talk tonight. Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 09:55 PM (5H6zj)

Yeah, it's a bit overblown. Our situation is nowhere near as bad as the Soviets' situation in the 1980's, and they didn't fall into the bloody Armageddon which many are predicting. I think we're looking at some very tough and austere days ahead, but we aren't looking at the Road Warrior.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 10:02 PM (uhAkr)

740 730
That song was tied into tape of the Beslin mas. Very apropo and totally soul wrenching...solid black block of evil that was.

Posted by: Richard at July 26, 2011 10:03 PM (BNnU3)

741 7. Skeletons Of Society

[Kerry King]

Minutes seem like days
Since fire ruled the sky
The rich became the beggars
And the fools became the wise
Memories linger in my brain
Of burning from the acid rain
A pain I never have won

Nothing here remains
No future and no past
No one could foresee
The end that came so fast
Hear the prophet make his guess
That paradise lies to the west
So join his quest for the sun

Shades of death are all I see
Fragments of what used to be

The world slowly decays
Destruction fills my eyes
Harboring the image
Of a spiraling demise
Burning winds release they fury
Simulating judge and jury
Drifting flurries of pain

Deafening silence reigns
As twilight fills the sky
Eventual supremacy
Daylight waits to die
Darkness always calls my name
A pawn in this recurring game
Humanity going insane

Shades of death are all I see
Skeletons of Society
Shades of death are all I see
Fragments of what used to be [x2]
Skeletons of Society

Minutes seem like days
Corrosion fills the sky
Morbid dreams of anarchy
Brought judgement in disguise
Memories linger in my brain
Life with nothing more to gain
Perpetual madness remains

Shades of death are all I see
Skeletons of society
Fragments of what used to be
Skeletons of society

Posted by: steevy at July 26, 2011 10:03 PM (5mTHV)

742 And of course thinking of Jan and singing just reminds me of this.

Posted by: Waterhouse at July 26, 2011 10:04 PM (SQP5L)

743 Are we so bad off that we can't afford an ONT?

Posted by: RushBabe at July 26, 2011 10:04 PM (Ew27I)

744
DOOM, but damn pretty.

http://tinyurl.com/3wfgtsa

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 10:04 PM (ECjvn)

745 Are we so bad off that we can't afford an ONT?

That's the only thing that HAS been cut.

Posted by: Retread at July 26, 2011 10:06 PM (OLzPL)

746 ont is up

Posted by: willow at July 26, 2011 10:07 PM (h+qn8)

747 Yeah, it's a bit overblown. Our situation is nowhere near as bad as the
Soviets' situation in the 1980's, and they didn't fall into the bloody
Armageddon which many are predicting. I think we're looking at some
very tough and austere days ahead, but we aren't looking at the Road
Warrior.

It's just blowing off steam. We just sometimes feel like we'd actually have more control over our lives in a Road Warrior situation.
At least then we could fight back instead of sitting here waiting for some assholes in suits to decide our fate.

Most of us are well aware that we are pissing in the wind.

Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 10:08 PM (ECjvn)

748 Should I stay or should go.Da DA DA DANT DANT DANT.....
IF I STAY THERE WILL BE TROUBLE.DA DA DA DANT.DANT DANT....

And If I GO It WILL BE DOUBLE.Da.DA.DA DANT.DANT!

SO comeON AND let ME KNOWWWWW.DA.DA.DA DANT DANT DANT!!!!

Should I STAY or should I Go..DA,DA,DA,DANT.DANT.DANT!

Posted by: Richard at July 26, 2011 10:16 PM (BNnU3)

749 Deninger's a real fluffy bundle of joy this evening. Posted by: cthulhu
That's because Deninger is a sociopathic asshole.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at July 26, 2011 10:17 PM (DEcmU)

750 We are not going down yet, although the left wants to you to feel that way to apply pressure to get anything they want. Look Obama wants chaos but not chaos chaos, controlled chaos. They thought they had their way cleared out but didn't count on the Tea Party. The Tea Party was chaos that they could not control hence they lost 2010. Rush employed chaos in operation chaos, it was brilliant he didn't hide it everybody knew it could be employed and it didn't put anyone at risk. We need a operation chaos to smoke out those dems in the senate any ideas? I just don't think the Repubs will be able to hold the line without us providing a little help.

Posted by: lions at July 26, 2011 10:17 PM (Mp19R)

751 752 ...I just don't
think the Repubs will be able to hold the line without us providing a
little help.

The ones trying to do the right thing-- regardless of their side here-- could all use some encouragement and best wishes and/or prayers for good judgment and wisdom.

Posted by: 80sBaby at July 26, 2011 10:31 PM (o2lIv)

752 wow, steve moore and larry kudlow were asked by batchelor "has the US ever been downgraded?" Moore said he was trying to "get to the bottom of this". Kudlow said "not in the last 60 years, we've had a couple of late payments". Moore then said that BO instead of being the president who got o sa ma...will be the first president to preside over the downgrading of the US credit rating.

Now that is historic.

Posted by: curious the confused at July 26, 2011 10:33 PM (k1rwm)

753 1Tdci-? 10 years hence= SOS

Posted by: rightlysouthern at July 26, 2011 10:36 PM (Fr18g)

754 So, I have been following this as closely as a dumbass like me can, so can someone answer me this... Why can't the House say 'we passed CCB, that's it, no more, good night'? I listened to W tell me that without TARP, we get a depression. Today, we hear, without more spending, we get a depression. Yet, 47% pay no federal taxes. If President Brilliant wants more f'ing revenue, then let the 47% of my fellow Americans who (by and large probably support this idiot) get a welcome-to-the-misery tax bill. If the Republicans don't stand up now, they won't get my stupid single vote. Anyone that goes along with more bullsh*t spending, can go to hell. You know what, I spent money, time, energy, campaigning for the Tea Party candidates in Congress. If they don't show a backbone now, then we get what we deserve.

Posted by: Rightwingva at July 26, 2011 10:37 PM (btDMH)

755 285We are saving $2trillion by not going to Mars.

$7trillion if you count not going to Uranus.
Posted by: sifty at July 26, 2011 07:44 PM (ECjvn) Oh. We are SOOOOOOOOO going to Yuranus.

Posted by: Obamacare, pg 762, paragraph 3 at July 26, 2011 10:39 PM (GG/3x)

756 "Deal or no deal? US downgrade looking likely"

Posted by: curious the confused at July 26, 2011 10:41 PM (k1rwm)

757 @739Remove ALL clothes.

Mine or the hobo's?

Posted by: Y-not at July 26, 2011 10:41 PM (5H6zj)

758 so just happened to catch laura ingraham who is touting boehner as the second coming for being able to get this deal. meanwhile, powerline has another pretty good post on why this deal is such a joke.

Posted by: matt foley at July 26, 2011 10:47 PM (R0Uy5)

759 "Pelosi to Union Workers: GOP Wants Americans to �Sacrifice,� While They �Get the Wealth�"

Posted by: curious the confused at July 26, 2011 10:50 PM (k1rwm)

760 @739
Posted by: George Orwell at July 26, 2011 10:01 PM (AZGON)

Damn, man. Thanks for the laugh. I really needed that.

I can't get past "2 to 3 Pounds fresh Hobo" without cracking up.

Bravo.

Posted by: DocJ at July 26, 2011 10:50 PM (7J/G/)

761 It has to go 7 innings to be a game.

Posted by: robtr chemjeff and nickless Liberation Front at July 26, 2011 08:40 PM (MtwBb)

No, sir... 5 for completeness and a W for the pitcher.

Posted by: GW McLintock at July 26, 2011 10:50 PM (j2W3S)

762
This is just sad.
We have 18 year old kids signing up to get shot at in A stan out of a sense of duty. And our congress people sense of duty is merely to get keep playing the game so they can get re elected.
Either they don't get it, or they are just pulling our legs again. Neither option is good.
They don't cut 4 trillion, they are gonna get downgraded. They should be negotiating with moody's not each other. Stupid idjits.

Posted by: simplemind at July 26, 2011 10:55 PM (za3QZ)

763 There's plenty of time for the Reps to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Don't get your panties in a wad here folks. It's just a bit of stagecraft going on.

Posted by: torabora at July 26, 2011 11:11 PM (eJ9DC)

764 We need to listen to Ace and his cohorts! After all isn't the Congressional Budget Office the same people who forecast Medicare as costing only 10% of its actual cost in 1994 when it passed.

Ergo using the logic presented to us that we must accept any compromise with Obama, we can rest secure in the knowledge that the CBO estimate of Boehner's *65 billion in savings represents only 10% of the actual probable savings.

So don't be stupid. Listen to your betters. Listen to the people who brought you Dole, McCain and Bush.

Compromise now, you can't do anything with one branch of the government. Just remember how the GOP ran wild while Clinton was in office.

Even if they could cut a trillion dollars over ten years it would take over 130 years to eliminate the debt.

If you believe our politicians.

Posted by: Molon Labe at July 26, 2011 11:15 PM (g5MrG)

765 That doesn't mean Sarah Palin ropes in brandishing a sword and decapitating Democrats

Whoah, son. Let's not be so hasty.

Posted by: VRWC Agent at July 26, 2011 11:38 PM (JXaAZ)

766 741 Yeah, it's a bit overblown. Our situation is nowhere near as bad as the Soviets' situation in the 1980's, and they didn't fall into the bloody Armageddon which many are predicting. I think we're looking at some very tough and austere days ahead, but we aren't looking at the Road Warrior.Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at July 26, 2011 10:02 PM (uhAkr)

Speak for yourself champ. I got my rocket car all built and ready to go. Hockey mask, collar, and leather hot pants are laid out and ready to be strapped on. Take whatever chances you want, I am all ready.

Posted by: Lord Humungus at July 27, 2011 12:03 AM (Yv6gq)

767 Around the country, millions of libertarians roll their eyes and mutter "Told you."

Posted by: Evil Red Scandi at July 27, 2011 12:17 AM (M+Vm5)

768 Man I hate this shit. Does anybody believe this fucking kabuki circle-jerk any more?

CUT - them off at the knees
CAP - their terms
BALANCE - this shit ourselves

Posted by: Terry at July 27, 2011 12:20 AM (Vui52)

769 "Pelosi to Union Workers: GOP Wants Americans to �Sacrifice,� While They �Get the Wealth�"

Fucking leftists are the lowest form of life on the planet.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at July 27, 2011 12:51 AM (UF15p)

770 You�re a very skilled blogger. I have joined your rss feed and look forward to seeking more of your magnificent post. Also, I�ve shared your site in my social networks!

Posted by: SuperFreakonomics Audiobook at July 27, 2011 01:00 AM (Y2XdG)

771 Did Sifty get on TV?

Posted by: rdbrewer at July 27, 2011 01:39 AM (2t789)

772 I've said it before I'll say it again, Boehner isn't on our side.

Posted by: Texan Economist at July 27, 2011 02:09 AM (TC/9F)

773 Frankly, I don't care about the "deficit" they keep talking about. If it doesn't reduce the nominal (and real) debt, its not good enough for me.

Posted by: Texan Economist at July 27, 2011 02:11 AM (TC/9F)

774 "I've said it before I'll say it again, Boehner isn't on our side.
Posted by: Texan Economist at July 27, 2011 02:09 AM (TC/9F) "

I am also wondering what side he might be on. I want a plan where we cut, cut, cut now instead of this bs ten year nonsense. Otherwise let the date pass and if the world doesn't come to an end, they look like the total lying pos they all are!

Posted by: Africanus at July 27, 2011 02:54 AM (vKPHJ)

775 The committee idea just blows, hard. 17 of the damn things in the last 30 years to cut spending, deficits, and/or debt. Not one resulting in spending being cut. Oh but of course "This time will be different." Back in the straitjacket, Maurice.

There's not much time left in the current budget year, but we can still cut more than $1 billion. And without some form of caps, future Congresses may yet restore the cuts.

Not acceptable - and that's from someone who's been generally supportive of Boehner's efforts. He screwed the pooch with this one. It seems like he was thinking of something that might pass the Senate and forgot it has to get through the House first.

Posted by: Adjoran at July 27, 2011 03:13 AM (VfmLu)

776 Is it such a bad thing if a crappy bill - something that will do nothing to revive the markets, or jobs - passes now? We are not going to be able to get anything good past this Oval Office, so why not let the full laden of Doom (TM) descend on The One in 2012, and make 2010 look like a squeaker?

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Posted by: rennee at July 27, 2011 04:25 AM (YyInD)

778 John boehner hates Jews and babies.

Posted by: Erick Egomaniac Erickson at July 27, 2011 05:37 AM (fGAK5)

779 Not to worry folks. The United States is not Greece. The United States is too big to fail. It must be true, I heard some dumbass on tv say so.

Posted by: Case at July 27, 2011 06:33 AM (0K+Kw)

780 goooooood vire nayes

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