Confederate Yankee
May 08, 2006
A Stringer of Large-Mouthed Asses
Several of my distant brethren on the far left of blogosphere this morning have gone out of their way to prove that the “reality-based community” is leaking reality at an every increasing rate, as they went postal over a flippant comment President Bush made about—wait for it—
fishing.
Yes, while being interviewed for the German magazine
Bild, the interviewer asked about his best and worst moments as President.
Bush gave the rather obvious answer that the 9/11/01 terrorist attack was his worst, while his best moment
was:
"I would say the best moment was when I caught a 7 1/2-pound largemouth bass on my lake," Bush said, laughing.
Believe it or not, the Party of the Perpetually Peeved found a way to have a complete hissy fit over this, as well.
Firedoglake:
So, let me get this straight. The man has been President for five freaking years. And the thing that he thinks is his best moment in office as President of the US of A is catching a big fish in his lake.
Americablog
Most Americans couldn't name a best moment for Bush either. But he's been President for over five years and his best moment was catching a fish? That says a lot. He really is the WORST PRESIDENT EVER…
And the geniuses over at Hullabaloo, well, they
smell conspiracy:
With all the daily opportunities available to do such good for your fellow country-folk, and the world, the only thing Bush specifically mentioned that made him happy is catching a big fish. In his own lake. Which could very well be deliberately stocked with big fish.
Mercy (or as they say
mercí).
I'm certain they'll soon be petitioning Russ Feingold to try to impeach Bush, claiming no doubt, that using a
Tiny Torpedo without Congressional authorization is an illegal act of war.
As nutty as these folks get over a joke Bush made about fishing, it's no wonder the American voter won't trust them with
football.
(h/t :
Memeorandum)
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
08:34 AM
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I'd find it memorable to latch onto a 7 1/2 pounder myself. It would be a good day.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 08, 2006 08:58 AM (IrbU4)
2
"most wonderful moment" questions are fatuous and undeserving of respectful reply. It is to Bush's credit that he came up with a non-answer which was humorous without being overtly insulting.
Posted by: pst314 at May 08, 2006 01:20 PM (OA547)
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Dang right, fishing beats the crap out of anything and everything one can do in a paid job.
Being president ain't what people think. The President is really the "head butler". Good or bad, Bush at least knows the greatest pleasure in life, fishing, regardles of whether he stocks his lake with big fish.
Been a successful business man, and a professor and director at a University. I'll take fishing any day.
Posted by: Bill at May 09, 2006 12:32 PM (3SCoU)
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May 06, 2006
Praying for a Cinderella Man
So let me see if I understand the defense here.
Patrick Kennedy, son of famed Oldsmobile yachtsman Ted, and grandson of Prohibition bootlegger Joe, used the alibi that it wasn't alcohol that caused him to crash his car at 2:45 AM Thursday morning,
it was drugs.
That's a pathetic excuse, even by Kennedy family standards.
But it turns out that even that ignoble defense fell apart, as a D.C-area bar employee reports that she saw him drinking in the bar shortly before the crash, and the Capitol Police listed him as being
under the influence of alcohol in their traffic report.
While some disingenuously try to play it off as just an accidental drug interaction issue—oh, he was just
sleep-driving, explains away Talk Left—as if that is a normal, everyday occurrence like sneezing—the very real fact is that Kennedy was a threat to others when he is behind the wheel. This was his second suspicious wreck in just two weeks. Kennedy's penmanship in the
earlier accident report was so discombobulated that it is very hard to believe that he wasn't under the influence then, as well.
Patrick Kennedy now states will be entering a rehabilitation program at the Mayo Clinic for an addiction to prescription drugs. He states that he has "
no recollection" of the events of Late Wednesday night and early Thursday morning, and yet, he provided a full explanation of the wreck and
a denial that he was drinking,
despite eyewitness testimony to the contrary, and then
provides a description of the police's treatment of him.
Now I see via
Michelle Malkin that some posters at the Daily Kos want him gone, tossed out of Congress—though not because they
care about Kennedy :
Here's the problem folks: most Americans who aren't partisans truly believe the democrats and The Republicans are "all the same" and that the power-elite takes care of its own.
Democrats can talk about Abramoff and Cunningham and the Republicans' toothless ethics bill, but so long as the People see us as just the "other side of the coin", they have little reason to go to the polls to vote for Dems.
Now we've got Congressman William Jefferson who despite allegations of bribery won't resign, and Patrick Kennedy who announces he's "going to vote" and so dodges a Breathalyzer test, and now will go into rehab rather than resign.
This gives all the justification in the world to independents who will say that the Dems are "just as bad" and that "all of them are corrupt."
It isn't Kennedy they care about, but how he might affect upcoming elections. Nice.
My personal feeling on the subject (speaking as someone who drank like Hemingway while in college) was that Kennedy should keep his job while he gets some help... idle hands being the devil's playthings and all that. My thought that was that once he got out of Mayo, he could immerse himself in his work, which could keep him too busy to get bogged down thinking about his addictions.
At least, that is what my position
was.
Dan Riehl, recovering himself, had different thoughts on Kennedy's best way back to sobriety, and he's
none to happy with the way things are progressing thus far:
Unfortunately, it looks as though the same enablers, including the media, will likely prop him up once again, perhaps long enough to at least survive until some day when he really falls down. Let's hope he doesn't kill someone else in the process. I came too close to doing that myself while behind the wheel of a car more times than I'd care to share.
Certainly, anyone who can take advantage of a good hospital, especially with Kennedy's additional mental illness, should do so. But the notion that he will be anything like fit to perform in government for at least a couple of years is simply a myth.
[snip]
If Rep. Patrick Kennedy gave a damn about addiction recovery as a whole and knew anything about how to bring it about, he'd quit the House, admit what an abject failure he's been, then get some genuine humility and real help and not look back.
That he likely won't do so tells you how ready to simply go on lying and using he is, as opposed to taking a break so he can come back re-invigorated and continue the good fight as regards addiction recovery, or anything else. Hell, Oprah will probably have the still sick man on as cured within 3-6 months. What a pathetic joke and complete insult to addiction recovery that will be.
When looking at it from Dan's perspective (and I do encourage you to
read the whole thing), I can see his point as well. It isn't "just an addiction"—as if that wasn't bad enough—but a serious mental illness (bi-polar disorder) and a family history of addiction that are compounding the issue.
I think Dan is right. Patrick Kennedy should make facing down his demons his full-time job for now. He can always return to Congress once he's clean and sober. Americans love an underdog fighting back from adversity, and he'd certainly be a far better Congressman with a clearer head. Let's pray he can get there.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
09:17 AM
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I am a big fan of the "sleep driving" scenario. If it works for him, I'm going to do some harmless "sleep bank robbing" tonight, 'cause I'm broke

Posted by: Kevin at May 06, 2006 02:24 PM (F6rb1)
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You gotta remember that he was driving without lights...guess he did not want to wake himself up.
Bottom line is that he needs help. Good that he is going after it. We should not be making a saint of him for doing so. And there should be no double standard that applies here. The man was DUI - the law is not just for alcohol and illegal drugs - Kennedy was impaired enough that he almost hit a police car and then crashed into a barrier.
Posted by: Specter at May 06, 2006 08:17 PM (ybfXM)
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The royal family never admits mistakes.
Posted by: Ken Hahn at May 06, 2006 09:16 PM (mcFf8)
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It almost seems that being a Kennedy should in and of itself be a criminal act. Is there any intergrity left in that family or are they all just glorified mobsters?
Posted by: Shoprat at May 06, 2006 09:54 PM (Nq8s6)
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So, the good Representative was sleep-driving on his way to vote on a bill, even though he was hours late? I have enough trouble influencing my elected officials as it is, now I have to know what drugs they are under the influence of, and when they take them!
Posted by: Tom TB at May 07, 2006 03:15 AM (Ffvoi)
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"Prescription addiction" .. sorry, I ain't buying. It sounds better to the buying throngs. Rehab .. sorry, I ain't buying. It's just a "get out of jail" free card.
Joan Kennedy, mother, a drunk.
Ted Kennedy, father, a drunk.
Step ONE: ADMIT you have a PROBLEM.
Step TWO: VOTERS IN RI, get real!
Posted by: Maggie at May 07, 2006 02:45 PM (lC4Ui)
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We'll never know. The speculation will never end. Politicians, atheletes, and celebrities get different treatment than the rest of us...
Posted by: muckdog at May 07, 2006 05:51 PM (IO909)
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I'm impressed! No further comments except for two things....goodluck and congratulations!travel direction luxury portugal costa india taiwan trailer south ontario timebuenos sta las services argentina hong china travel nurse job aaa mapasia sears agency travel reward credit card zealandnudist cruise site travel map konggreece nudist switzerland agency sears destination australia costa rica travel uslas vegas travel hong minute honeymoon reward air florida
Posted by: travel canada at June 29, 2006 04:39 PM (UR96+)
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Feed the Filthy Zionist
It's pledge week at Protein Wisdom.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
12:20 AM
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May 05, 2006
Recalling the Twelfth Imam
Unless you have been under a rock or in New York City public schools, you are probably aware that Iran has engaged in the development of a nuclear program.
Iran has publicly stated that this is so that Iran can create nuclear power plants, a claim viewed with great suspicion by most of the world, as Iran sits upon vast petroleum reserves that will meets the nation's energy needs far into the future. Iran's parallel development of indigenous long-range intercontinental ballistic missiles and purchase of similar systems, as well as their claims of developing multiple independently targetable re-entry vehicles (MIRVs) that are used only to deliver nuclear warheads, show that Iran's uranium enrichment program has the ultimate goal of obtaining multiple nuclear weapons.
Why do we care?
Consider that Iran is a major state-sponsor of Islamic terrorism, and successive Iranian leaders have repeatedly threatened to exterminate Israel. Recently, Iranian government officials went far enough to state that they could destroy Israel with nuclear weapons and absorb an expected Israeli nuclear counterstrike.
Tens of millions of people throughout southwest Asia would be likely to die in such an exchange.
No, why do WE care?
Other than being philosophically opposed to genocide and nuclear war on a scale never before imagined?
Try:
- years of nuclear fallout carried around the world on prevailing winds;
- a nearly complete an long-term disruption in international oil supplies, resulting in major economic upheaval;
- increasing the possibility of international conflicts over reduced oil supplies;
- the dehumanization of all Muslims as a result of this mass genocide, perhaps leading to retaliatory strikes, mass internment, and deportation campaigns to eradicate the religion, particularly in western Europe and China.
There is also the possibility that Iran may even provide nuclear weapons to a terrorist group, such as the Iranian-funded Hezbollah.
Don't they know if they use nukes, they might get nuked back?
"Might" doesn't come into the picture. They
will be nuked back if they launch a first strike. Iran's population is concentrated very heavily (60%) in urban areas (Tehran: 7.1 M, Mashad: 2.8M, Tabriz: 1.5 M, Karaj: 1.4 M, Shiraz: 1.3, etc), and even a partial nuclear response by either Israel or the United States would cause Iran to cease to exist.
It would be incredibly stupid for them to launch a nuclear attack, then.
You're thinking like a westerner. In many Islamic countries, there is no separation of church and state. Church
is state to varying degrees, with Islamic theology making laws and defining policy, again, to varying degrees. A sub-sect of Shia Islam rules the Islamic Republic of Iran, and this sect's eschatology believes that the near-term messianic return of the 12th Imam can be brought about by an apocalyptic event.
What is more apocalyptic than a nuclear war?
So they think that by getting nuked, they'll go to heaven?
You might call it nuts, and I might agree, but good prosecutor would call it "motive."
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
11:39 AM
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Better yet, read the Book of Revelations.
When you get to the part where one third of the earth is consumed by fire, see if you can figure out which third it might be.
Posted by: Steve O at May 05, 2006 09:17 PM (R0Csm)
2
I believe in a glorious hereafter for the believers too, but I don't think I need to kill anyone to obtain it, indeed I could lose it that way. But if they are so anxious to go is a little push in the right direction such a bad thing?
Posted by: Shoprat at May 06, 2006 09:56 PM (Nq8s6)
3
I've always thought that some of the bizarre horrors in Revelations that are supposed to befall the Earth sound eerily like they could be a consequence of nuclear or biological war.
More alarming, though, is guess where modern-day Babylon is?
Posted by: Amber at May 06, 2006 10:01 PM (WYkdt)
4
Very well done Q & A. This about sums it up for those too absorbed in reality shows and the lives of Britney, Jessica, and Tom Cruise to have time to pay attention to what is going on in the Real World.
(yeah, that is a bit of a pun ;-) )
Posted by: Phil at May 15, 2006 12:27 PM (DRXSB)
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Friendly Fire
While looking for more out-take video to analyze of Musab al-Zarqawi's shooting session for my Blooper Troopers post, I ran across a video report on the new Zarqawi footage by CNN's Jamie McIntyre.

It runs 3:07, and Ian has made it available as either a .WMV or .MP4 at
Expose the Left.
As stated in my previous post, Zarqawi is shown to be less than impressive with the
M249 Squad Automatic Weapon (SAW) he is shown firing in this video. He is unfamiliar with the weapon's operation, bracing for heavy recoil before firing, and then...
Pop... pop... pop.

Zarqawi can't get the machine gun to fire as
a machine gun, in fully-automatic mode. It then seems to seize completely, and Zarqawi looks befuddled. While the footage is too grainy to tell for certain, it appears that the gun suffers a probable "stovepipe" malfunction, where a cartridge casing fails to eject completely and is caught by the bolt, resulting in a weapon stoppage. An associate happens to be nearby who has at least rudimentary experience with firearms, and he grabs the bolt handle and cycles the action to release the stovepiped round.
And as you watch the terrorist and his henchmen wrestle with the malfunctioning M249, the damnedest thing happens: CNN's Senior Pentagon Correspondent Jamie McIntyre
starts making excuses for al-Zarqawi's performance.
From 0:48-1:07 to on the clip:
"This weapon is an American weapon. It's called a SAW, or Squad Automatic Weapon, a very heavy machine gun which has a very heavy trigger; it's not easy to fire, and in fact it might be quite understandable that anyone--even somebody with weapon's experience, wasn't familiar with this particular weapon might have trouble firing off more than a single shot at a time...
It is bad enough that a U.S. journalist is seemingly making excuses for an al Qaeda terrorist, but not only is McIntyre making excuses, he is making demonstrably
false excuses.
The M249 is light machine gun,
the lightest dedicated machine gun in the U.S. Military. It fires the lightweight 5.56 NATO round, a cartridge developed from the .223 Remington,
a cartridge designed to kill woodchucks and other small game. Most states will not allow hunters to use such a lightweight cartridge for medium and large game because it is so underpowered.
Nor is the M249 plausibly a "heavy" machine gun as far as weight goes. The M249 in the configuration shown weighs approximately 15 lbs, with the 200-round box magazine adding another 7 lbs when full. By way of comparison, the
M2 .50 Caliber Browning, a real heavy machine gun, weighs 84 lbs without its 44 lbs tripod and ammunition.
McIntyre also claims that Zarqawi was having problems because of the M249's trigger. It would be interesting for Mr. McIntyre to reveal his source for his claim that the M249 "has a very heavy trigger." I have been unable to find so much as a single source that describes the standard trigger pull of the M249 as being "heavy." It is such a minor factor in the weapon's operation that I cannot find it mentioned at all.
Even the fact that the M249 is a
fully-automatic weapon doesn't keep McIntyre from trying to float the excuse that some who, "wasn't familiar with this particular weapon might have trouble firing off more than a single shot at a time." Even General Lynch notes at 2:06 that "it's supposed to be automatic fire, he's shooting single shots, one at a time...something's wrong with his machine gun."
But it isn't just that Jamie McIntyre floated one lame excuse for the ineptitude of a terrorist that was so astounding, it is that he did so more than once.
After General Lynch makes his comments on Zarqawi's problems with his machine gun, McIntyre states from 2:50-3:50 into the clip:
...it's not clear at all that it really shows much about Zarqawi's military abilities with the weapon, because as I said, the Squad Automatic Weapon, a very heavy trigger, hard to fire unless you've had specific training on it, and one would imagine he hasn't had a lot of specific training on American weapons."
I can understand that as CNN's senior Pentagon correspondent for well over a decade McIntyre might have developed a certain degree of respect for this nation's enemies, but that doesn't mean he should go out of his way to fabricate excuses for them.
Update: I've now talked to several SAW gunners, including one who was a trainer, and the consensus viewpoint among them is that the terrorists have not cleaned this particular weapon, which caused cycling problems leading to the embarrassing jam. Jason at milblog
Countercolumn has a post that compliments this one any goes into further details about the M249.
Sadly,as pathetic as McIntyre's video segment was, that bastion of liberalism, the
NY Times is always ready to
go that extra mile:
An effort by the American military to discredit the terrorist leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi by showing video outtakes of him fumbling with a machine gun — suggesting that he lacks real fighting skill — was questioned yesterday by retired and active American military officers.
The video clips, released on Thursday to news organizations in Baghdad, show the terrorist leader confused about how to handle an M-249 squad automatic weapon, known as an S.A.W., which is part of the American inventory of infantry weapons.
[snip]
The weapon in question is complicated to master, and American soldiers and marines undergo many days of training to achieve the most basic competence with it. Moreover, the weapon in Mr. Zarqawi's hands was an older variant, which makes its malfunctioning unsurprising. The veterans said Mr. Zarqawi, who had spent his years as a terrorist surrounded by simpler weapons of Soviet design, could hardly have been expected to know how to handle it.
Now, who do you chose to believe?
In one corner, we have the
New York Times, who cites two officers and a couple of professors (one of whom is a veteran) in their article, without stating if any of these four men have any knowledge of the M249. They do not profess any specific knowledge of the weapon in question at all, and the
Times does not provide
one fact in this story. It's all opinion. Also in this corner, CNN's Jamie McIntyre who cites completely erroneous information to make excuses for a terrorist.
In the other corner, you have a couple of bloggers who did what the professionals should have, and "Googled" facts about the M249 and similar weapons. The bloggers were in contact with and verified facts through current and former SAW gunners from two countries (United States and Canada).
One side has facts, the other opinion. You choose who you want to believe.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
12:05 AM
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Doesn't making excuses for a terrorist failure to properly fire a simple weapon shoot down the left wings description of our soldiers as uneducated red necks. If an uneducated red neck can use a weapon then shouldn't anyone with an IQ larger than their shoe size should be able to operate it. Actually all any of the left wing news (sic) reporters ever prove is that they are the most stupid group of anti-americans in the country, and that's saying a lot when you look at the left wing politicians. It's hard to be more stupid than a left wing politician but the reporters have reached the pinacle of stupidity.
Posted by: Scrapiron at May 05, 2006 12:23 AM (y6n8O)
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Wow. These news people have lost their minds. I like how they all mention that the release of this tape is American propaganda. I hope these folks pay dearly for rooting so hard for our enemies.
Posted by: Stankleberry at May 05, 2006 05:33 AM (rKx58)
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I guess we should have provided at least rudimentary training to al-Zarqawi. Poor terrorist can't even handle an automatic weapon. Wonder what he would do with a short fused grenade? I'd like to watch.
Posted by: Old Soldier at May 05, 2006 06:43 AM (A6aj8)
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More sympathy for Zarqawi and none for Cheney. Cheney must have used the "light" trigger.
The obsequiousness of the Clinton News Network is astonishing.
Posted by: drjohn at May 05, 2006 07:09 AM (Bglwi)
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What a pantload!
Heavy trigger pull? Once you've pulled the trigger far enough to fire the first round, you just have to hold it where it is to fire multiple rounds. That's the whole point of an AUTOMATIC weapon, isn't it?
I suppose that if you are a nimrod terrorist who does his best work sending other people to die while you run away like a p***y, then you might be surprised when the weapon made the big boom sound and you might have released the trigger prematurely.
Posted by: Steve L. at May 05, 2006 07:12 AM (hpZf2)
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Sorry, but how is suggesting his unfamiliarity with the weapon is the reason why he is having trouble operating it worse than suggesting the weapon itself was the problem ?
Did I miss the point of this blog post or was the idea to come up with more people to come up with more excuses for Zarqawi instead of less ?
Posted by: Tank at May 05, 2006 08:17 AM (aOeXm)
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Yes, Tank, you did miss the point of the post.
Zarqawi is a poser. CNN made baseless apologies for Zarqawi's feckless attempts to appear tough.
Posted by: Yojimbo at May 05, 2006 09:18 AM (APTyk)
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Did I miss the point of this blog post...
Apparently so, Tank. CNN's McIntyre is caught on tape making excuses - FALSE excuses - for Zarqawi's poor performance. I called him on his excuses, and pointed out they were bogus.
Zarqawi has fewer excuses than CNN was trying to give him credit for. Somehow, you seem to have the intent of this post almost 180-degrees backward.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 05, 2006 09:21 AM (g5Nba)
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Asking journalists to be anything other than clueless in matters weapon-related is optimistic to say the least, but this takes the cake. Years ago I saw shots of a very attractive, but petite Asian woman (Singapore Defence Forces Sgt, if I recall) firing an M249, from the hip, slung, going rock and roll, with her left hand. Yeah, heavy machine gun, all right.
Posted by: David Gillies at May 05, 2006 10:18 AM (RC1AQ)
10
Yes, Tank, you did miss the point of the post.
Zarqawi is a poser. CNN made baseless apologies for Zarqawi's feckless attempts to appear tough.
Posted by: Yojimbo at May 5, 2006 09:18 AM
Apart from the "tough on sand" crowd you can assume everyone else on the planet didn't need the poser angle explained to them kid.
The point you've missed is when it comes to terrorists those making baseless apologies for them and those making other apologies for them are sharing the same stage.
Posted by: Tank at May 05, 2006 10:27 AM (aOeXm)
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I swear sometimes that CNN must have a policy of not allowing reporters to check stories with anyone who has had even one minute of actual military experience.
Posted by: ArrMatey at May 05, 2006 10:45 AM (WfwK9)
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Apparently so, Tank. CNN's McIntyre is caught on tape making excuses - FALSE excuses - for Zarqawi's poor performance. I called him on his excuses, and pointed out they were bogus.
Yeah I spotted that. You made an excellent case for broadcasters covering a war that's not going anywhere getting a military consultant on staff.
Problem started when you decided to assign motive.
Zarqawi has fewer excuses than CNN was trying to give him credit for. Somehow, you seem to have the intent of this post almost 180-degrees backward.Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 5, 2006 09:21 AM
That's not my take on it, that's just the way it is. You called CNN out for making poor excuses for Zarqawi and offered a better excuse instead.
Seriously, it's propaganda, it's not supposed to be taken this seriously. The only substance of the content for each tape was to cause embaressment to the other side.
By involving yourself and by deciding to call someone a terrorist apologist you embaressed yourself by doing the same thing.
Not to stick the boots in too hard here, but is it still technically "friendly fire" when you shoot yourself in the foot ?
Posted by: Tank at May 05, 2006 10:54 AM (aOeXm)
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So in your world, you are a terrorist apologist for catching someone in the act of apologizing for terrorists?
whatever.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 05, 2006 11:10 AM (g5Nba)
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Tank... What color is the sky in your world?
Posted by: Sanjuro at May 05, 2006 11:17 AM (p4++J)
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My favorite part of the tape is when he turns with the weapon and points it in the face of the guy next to him.
Wouldn't inspire confidence considering he apparently has no clue how to operate the thing.
They also dropped the part of the tape where the other AQ boob grabs it by the barrel and jerks his burned hand back.
Posted by: Dwilkers at May 05, 2006 11:26 AM (/9Qop)
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Dwilkers, you would be talking about this scene?
Eddie Eagle would not be happy.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 05, 2006 12:10 PM (g5Nba)
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This tape is "American Propoganda?"
It was filmed by al-Qaeda!
Let's see if I can find that film clip where CNN said the account of Cheney mishandling a gun was "Democratic Propoganda."
Posted by: Steve O at May 05, 2006 08:55 PM (R0Csm)
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So in your world, you are a terrorist apologist for catching someone in the act of apologizing for terrorists?
Confederate Yankee at May 5, 2006 11:10 AM
We aren't talking about my definition of a terrorist apologist, we are talking about yours. You've said that's someone who makes excuses for them shortly before you did the same thing.
In my world this ridiculously simple concept doesn't need explaining 4 times. Keep playing dumb though, we both know it's not like your readers aren't smart enough to join those two dots themselves.
Posted by: Tank at May 06, 2006 06:32 AM (aOeXm)
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you've go to be kidding me, unbelievable
Posted by: ray robison at May 06, 2006 07:41 AM (4joLu)
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Tank, it is quite apparent from the other comments on this thread that you're to one with... issues.
I analyzed the film clip and McIntyre's performance, explaining how Zarqawi couldn't clear one of the most common of failures, and that McIntyre bent over backwards to make the problem seem far more complex than it was--even to the point he was making things up.
Somehow, in your tortured logic, it is wrong to explain why something is false by showing what the truth is. That's just sad.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 06, 2006 08:10 AM (0fZB6)
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Tank, bro...quit while youre behind.
this CNN segment is nothing more or less than Jamie McInQaeda failing to do the most basic fundamental research and fact checking...
M249 NOT a heavy weapon
M249 trigger NOT hard to operate
...because to do so would have wiped out the entire premise of his story, which is that we should not be so hard on Zarqawi if somehow he doesnt know how to fire a machine gun.
Posted by: CWB at May 06, 2006 01:06 PM (Ug3ki)
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I can't believe that this is even a debatable issue - I learned to fire that gun (actually its Canadian brother, the C-9) as a skinny 18 year old punk, and spent a good part of the next 10 years teaching others. Sure, doing a detail-strip is somewhat complicated, but just firing? Come on - I had 98lb female recruits on basic courses who could handle this thing better than Zarko. And how is racking the bolt on a SAW any different from doing the same thing on an RPK or whatever Sovietesque gun the Muj normally use?
Last year I went to the Gun Store in Vegas with some friends - it was the first time they'sd fired ANY guns and we had them checked out on multiple weapons in just a morning - including IAs on the SAW. Zarko is just an ass-clown and Jamie McIntyre is his butt-plug.
Posted by: holdfast at May 06, 2006 03:21 PM (Gzb30)
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Tank, you included a phrase about 'a war going nowhere' in your comments. As that phrase has nothing to do with the video and Mr. McIntyre's reporting, it seems to be an editorial comment on your part about the war. Of course you have every right to hold perspectives disparaging the US war in Iraq, but they do indicate your bias.
Zarqawi clearly demonstrated on that tape that he is inept in handling of firearms. Experienced eyes watching that tape see the issues brought out in this aritcle and the ensuing comments, but also see body language that screams inexperience with firearms.
Mr. McIntyre is either a tacit supporter of Zarqawi; someone who wants to denigrate the US in time of war; a woefully incompetent reporter; or all of the above. An unbiased journalist watching that tape with little or no knowledge or experience in the proper handling of firearms would have either sought out experts to provide their opinion and reported it as such, or just commented solely on what was visible in the tape without resorting to biased conjecture clearly designed to invoke his desired political interpretation of what was shown in the video.
BTW I wrote CNN a polite nasty-gram about Mr. McIntyre and how he was able to miss the obvious news in the story: Zarqawi is a political leader who can't even really handle a firearm properly. He was too busy giving Zarqawi a journalistic blowjob.
Posted by: F15C at May 06, 2006 06:46 PM (MatoY)
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I find it very funny that the SAW is regarded as a "heavy" weapon at 15 lbs. The SAW replaced the M60 machine gun, which weighed about 33 lbs. Having fired the M60 in Basic Training (I loved firing it), I don't remember the trigger on that as being "heavy," and I imagine that the SAW is as easy to fire as the M60 was.
As for the "barrel grabbing" scene, it is fairly obvious that these guys have been watching way too many reruns of "Rat Patrol."
Posted by: RLD at May 06, 2006 08:08 PM (sHvfj)
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Actually, RLD, the SAW did not replace the M60 so much as fill a gap left by the old BAR. The M60 successor is the M240, another 7.62mm weapon.
When the M14 replaced the M1 Garand, a select fire version was produced as a squad automatic weapon, but it was unsatisfactory - too difficult to control in full auto. The M60 was assigned to squads to fill that gap, but was always acknowledged to be too heavy. Eventually the Belgian MiniMi was adopted as the M249 SAW.
And the rest of you guys, quit picking on tank just because he can't tell the difference between being a terrorist apologist and criticizing one.
Posted by: Steve Skubinna at May 06, 2006 08:34 PM (j4Cpd)
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Just poking my nose in from LGF...
"Update: I've now talked to several SAW gunners, including one who was a trainer, and the consensus viewpoint among them is that the terrorists have not cleaned this particular weapon, which caused cycling problems leading to the embarrassing jam.
Probably a mechanical malfunction - broken extractor spring to be precise.
I had a lot of dirt and shit in my SAW, never a problem, except for that time I had the feed tray open and and an empty casing from the guy next to me landed inside the receiver - it would still rattle of several rounds before getting jammed.
see linky for partially disassembled SAW going full auto without trigger assembly http://www.sptimes.com/2003/04/07/Worldandnation/In_machine_gun_accide.shtml
Posted by: PETN Sandwich at May 06, 2006 09:10 PM (WWLgC)
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It really doesn't matter whether the CNN reporter was accurate, or even nominally responsible in doing fact-checking. The fundamental problem is that his orientation is sympathetic to the stinking terrorist, regardless of whether he follows the journalists' standard manual of tidiness.
CNN's Eason Jordan made it clear after the U.S. military entered Iraq that CNN had for most of the preceding decade deliberately suppressed its reporting on the barbarities Saddam was daily inflicting on his own people, rather than risk losing their privileged front row seat for the spectacle of American cruise missiles that from time to time detonated in Downtown Baghdad.
It really is sickening to see how the NYTimes, the Washington Post, Time, CNN, all dance around the truth like a bunch of stockbrokers trying not to step in dog poop on the sidewalk, then proceed to tell us how ethical they are. What a bunch of fatuous quarterwits.
Posted by: David March at May 07, 2006 02:28 AM (a/QW9)
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The fundamental problem is that his orientation is sympathetic to the stinking terrorist...
Yep.
Posted by: Dwilkers at May 07, 2006 07:03 AM (/9Qop)
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Zarkhawi is alive & free & using captured American weapons. As long as he's alive & free & using captured American weapons, he's winning & we're losing. Any other way you tell it is just spin until you actually capture him.
Posted by: Tom at May 07, 2006 01:40 PM (tQB/0)
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That's brilliant, Tom.
By your logic, we we'ren't winning World War II until Hitler shot himself as we were closing in on Berlin.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 07, 2006 02:06 PM (0fZB6)
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Does anyone here care to make a monetary wager on whether this POS will live out his days in freedom, dying eventually of old age? Bear in mind that he has Seal Team 6 and the Delta boys closing in on his ass....
C'mon, Tom....any takers?
Posted by: freddfish at May 08, 2006 10:16 AM (Gj8yw)
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I totally agree with everything you're saying -- the SAW isn't really that hard to fire, it doesn't require "days of training" to "master", and it's not heavy.
Zarqawi might now know how to handle a SAW (and has very poor range safety - did you see him flag that guy??), but he's shown time and time again that he can lead, organize, and carry out acts of of the most vicious terrorism around. Opening up a debate about his "weapons prowess" seems childish, and no better than showing clips of George Bush falling off his bike. Why Paint Zarqawi as some sort of an inept buffoon or write him off as some kinda pussy? His track record speaks for itself. He shouldn't be underestimated by anyone in the American public. Why even open the door for trivilizing how influential/dangerous he is?
Posted by: paully at May 09, 2006 08:00 PM (yJuX3)
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Paul, because laughing at the enemy when they trip and fall is fun. The reason of the post was to point out that CNN considers Zarky more of a friend than an enemy.
The edited tape is pure propaganda.
The captured tape isn't American propaganda, it's simply unedited.
Posted by: brando at May 09, 2006 09:57 PM (GTNT6)
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Tank, you need to explain things four times, because you are so verbally challenged. I had to READ several of your posts several times, and still could find no discernable meaning.
----------
My read on the original article was that our hero had the thing set on semi-auto. It did, after all, say that he was only able to fire single shots. That's not jammed; that's having semi-auto selected. An experienced fighter would know this. Maybe not how to select Auto on this particular weapon, but ANYone who has ever fired a selectable fire weapon knows the difference.
There are some mistakes you only make once. These two each made one. NO ONE would ever point a loaded weapon in someone's face twice. At least not until after his broken jaw had healed.
The second one is, no one would ever grab the barrel of a just fired weapon a second time. Which means that this scum is anything but experienced.
Let's get real here. If a CAR starts going backward instead of forward, anyone who has ever merely RIDDEN in a car knows what is wrong. It doesn't take days of training.
Paully, we are not fighting this war on mountain bikes. If you need help figuring that out.....well... I can't help you.
Yes, we all know that he's roach turd who's good at leading, and organizing, but it's the carrying out part that's being called into question.
The intent of our display of the whole video is to let it speak for itself, to take him down off his high horse, and there's nothing petty, or childish about that.
You don't seem to grasp that this is a war of PERCEPTION as well as hot lead.
Any time we can pull back the curtain and show Oz as he is is a good thing.
Posted by: Bill at May 10, 2006 06:08 PM (S8QPo)
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May 04, 2006
At Least The Car Stayed Dry
Drudge is running a flash that Rep. Patrick Kennedy (D-R.I.), son of Sen. Ted Kennedy, make be part of a suspected drunk-driving crash and cover-up involving the Capital Police:
Police labor union officials asked acting Chief Christopher McGaffin this afternoon to allow a Capitol Police officer to complete his investigation into an early-morning car crash involving Rep. Patrick Kennedy (D-R.I.), son of Sen. Ted Kennedy.
ROLL CALL [note: my link-ed.] reports: According to a letter sent by Officer Greg Baird, acting chairman of the USCP FOP, the wreck took place at approximately 2:45 a.m. Thursday when Kennedy's car, operating with its running lights turned off, narrowly missed colliding with a Capitol Police cruiser and smashed into a security barricade at First and C streets Southeast.
“The driver exited the vehicle and he was observed to be staggering,” Baird's letter states. Officers approached the driver, who “declared to them he was a Congressman and was late to a vote. The House had adjourned nearly three hours before this incident. It was Congressman Patrick J. Kennedy from Rhode Island.”
Baird wrote that Capitol Police Patrol Division units, who are trained in driving under the influence cases, were not allowed to perform basic field sobriety tests on the Congressman. Instead, two sergeants, who also responded to the accident, proceeded to confer with the Capitol Police watch commander on duty and then “ordered all of the Patrol Division Units to leave the scene and that they were taking over.”
A source tells the DRUDGE REPORT: It was apparent that the driver was intoxicated (stumbling) and claimed he was in a hurry to make a vote. When it became apparent who it was instead of processing a normal DWI the watch commander had the Patrol units clear the scene and allowed the other building officials drive Kennedy home.
This morning's incident comes just over two weeks after Kennedy was involved in a car accident in Rhode Island.
Developing...
Unlike some Drudge stories, this might have some meat to it, as MSM sources are corroborating that Kennedy was involved in a 3:00 am wreck, and that the responding officers were not allowed to perform field sobriety tests. WUSA9.com has
more details:
9 News has learned U.S. Capitol police officers are concerned about the handling of an accident involving Congressman Patrick Kennedy (D-Rhode Island) about 3 a.m. this morning.
Rep. Kennedy was reportedly behind the wheel of a green Ford Mustang when it crashed into a security barrier at 1st and "C" streets Southeast.
No one was hurt, but there are reports that the car nearly struck a Capitol police cruiser and that it had been swerving, as if trying to make a U-turn.
So far, Kennedy HAS NOT been charged. The congressman released a statement Thursday night saying alcohol was NOT involved.
"I was involved in a traffic accident last night at ... the U.S. Capitol. I consumed no alcohol prior to the incident and I will fully cooperate with Capitol Police in whatever investigation they choose to undertake," he said.
The Capitol Hill Fraternal Order of Police is calling for higher-ups in the department to allow patrol officers to complete their investigation.
The head of the Fraternal Order of Police Lodge 1, Lou Cannon, told 9 News that he's concerned that Kennedy may have received special treatment and this could be a case where “rank has its privilege.”
Capitol police Officer Greg Baird wrote a letter to acting Chief Christopher McGaffin saying how the investigation was handled calls the department's integrity into question.
According to Rollcall.com, Baird -- acting chairman of the Capitol Police Fraternal Order of Police –- said Kennedy's Mustang had its lights off when it narrowly missed crashing into a police cruiser and smashed into a security barrier at 1st and C streets Southeast about 2:45 a.m.
According to sources, Kennedy told police that he was late for a Congressional vote. But the House had adjourned more than three hours earlier, sources said.
According to Roll Call, Baird wrote in his letter that the driver got out and “was observed to be staggering.” He told officers he was a congressman late for a vote. Baird wrote that patrol officers at the scene were prohibited from performing field sobriety tests. Then two sergeants arrived, conferred with a watch commander and “ordered all of the patrol division units to leave the scene … that they were taking over.”
Congressman Patrick Kennedy is Ted Kennedy's son. He is currently serving his sixth term as the Democratic Congressman from Rhode Island. He sits on the powerful House Appropriations Committee.
First off, and very seriously, I'm glad no one was hurt. A late model (2005) Ford Mustang weighs 3,351 lbs, and traveling through the dark with its lights off in the dark is a recipe for disaster. My second thought was, of course, thankfulness that Kennedy wasn't near the Inlet Bridge over the
Tidal Basin, or things could have ended far more tragically.
This case could bode very poorly for the Kennedy clan and the Capital Police as well if there is any evidence at all of a cover-up. Odds are than any questionable involvement by either Patrick Kennedy or his father Ted—if indeed there was any—can and probably would disappear faster than a bottle of Maker's Mark down Ted's fleshy gullet. The Capitol Police watch commander and other senior officers seem somewhat more likely to take any fall here.
Capitol Police Officer Greg Baird seems to be a good cop trying to shine light on a shady situation. He felt strongly enough about the interference in his investigation that he went against his superiors when he felt they were wrong. That takes guts, and integrity.
It will be very interesting to see how—and if—this case proceeds.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Sounds like Chappaquiddick without anybody hurt...
Posted by: ElJefeMaximo at May 04, 2006 06:49 PM (ED0kL)
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Let's see if this brave officer who came forward is shielded as a 'whistleblower' and 'patriotic American' by the Left.
Posted by: KMan at May 04, 2006 07:07 PM (MBkPJ)
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It may be hard to pin down exactly where Kennedy had been prior to the car crash. (there is no such thing as a car accident) The left wing is so filled with liars, what, when and where will be difficult to determine, but someone should give it a good old boy try. Sick Rush Limbaugh on him since the left tried to crucify him over prescription drugs, and Kennedy tried to blame the crash on 'prescription' drugs. Rush was neither an elected official nor endangering the lives of the public when he was charged. What a tangled web the left has spun for themselves. Everything the do comes back and bites them on the A**.
Posted by: Scrapiron at May 05, 2006 12:32 AM (y6n8O)
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The more I see of that family, the less I like. And I didn't like much from the start.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 05, 2006 05:12 AM (nFSnk)
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http://news.bostonherald.com/localRegional/view.bg?articleid=137995
WASHINGTON -U.S. Rep. Patrick Kennedy insisted yesterday that he had consumed “no alcohol” before he slammed his Mustang convertible into a concrete barrier near his office, but a hostess at a popular Capitol Hill watering hole told the Herald she saw him drinking in the hours before the crash.
“He was drinking a little bit,” said the woman, who works at the Hawk & Dove and would not give her name.
Posted by: Buddy at May 05, 2006 07:44 AM (qgd3A)
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I don't blame her for not giving her name, Teddy would probably offer her a ride.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 05, 2006 09:08 AM (Mv/2X)
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The "late for a vote" routine is why they didn't give him a sobriety test. Article I Section 6 of the US Constitution says "Representatives shall ...be privileged from Arrest during their Attendence at the Session ... and in going to and returning from the same". We have the same provision in the Georgia Constitution (it is supposed to prevent arrest by opposing political hacks influencing votes), and recently had a case where a state judge threw that defense out because of what time it was.
I think Kennedy had heard about that and used the "late for a vote" for the reason that (if he actually has read the Constitution instead of just watching it burn at Kennedy Coven Meetings) the "returning from" part might not be as familiar to junior officers and getting it on the record that he was impaired might be embarrassing to the boy.
BTW, doesn't DC have a "under the influence" statute? Here, prescriptions are included under the heading of influence.
Posted by: Richard at May 05, 2006 09:10 AM (WCcZ3)
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Blooper Troopers
It appears the video released of al Qaeda action hero Musab al-Zarqawi left quite a bit on the cutting room floor, including footage edited out from his "Rambo" scene, where Zarqawi is seen in firing long bursts from a 5.56mm light machine gun used by the U.S. military.

What the version of the video posted to the internet does not show says quite a lot. The unedited footage was captured near Youssifiyah, presumably by
Task Force 145, shows that al Zarqawi is unable to clear a simple "stovepipe" jam from the M249 squad automatic weapon he uses. He requires the assistance of a follower, who with one deft motion of his hand, racked the bolt to clear the malfunction.
Just seconds after Zarqawi fired dozens of rounds through the gun, he puts one of his men at extreme risk as he sweeps the machine gun's barrel around, momentarily pointing at the terrorist's chest without apparently activating the weapon's safety, or even taking his finger off the trigger. Shortly after that display of stupidity, another terrorist is shown grabbing the machine gun by the still-smoking barrel, burning his hand.
The unintentionally comic elements of this footage does not, of course, minimize the lethal threat Zarqawi and his minions pose to the Iraqi people, but it does humanize him and diffuse a bit of the mythology surrounding him. He is not invincible, and at moments, he is all but helpless.
Update: As I noted in a comment at
Hot Air:
If he [Zarqawi] is that unfamiliar with a common weapons malfunction, I wonder just how many combat actions he has actually participated in.
Is Musab al-Zarqawi a paper tiger? We don't have enough data to answer that question, but with this film, we now have enough to bring it up.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Prayer for our Troops:
God bless our troops and give them the courage, wit, and power to destroy all the terrorists, especially Zarqawi and Bin Laden.
Richard Davis
Phila, PA
USN Ret
Posted by: Richard Davis at May 04, 2006 03:23 PM (1gtZh)
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My view is simple: whenever possible, make the terrorists look like fools. It's hard to generate martyrs for your cause when the enemy is laughing at your leader. Forget the "lethal threat" stuff...point out how his American-made tennis shoes are made for running and how he will need them when TF145 catches up to him. "Run like the wind, Musab!"
Posted by: Chris At Home at May 04, 2006 04:16 PM (5ve1C)
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"Is Musab al-Zarqawi a paper tiger? We don’t have enough data to answer that question, but with this film, we now have enough to bring it up."
Seems to me that someone whose idea of waging war means blowing up school busses and such is no soldier. Why would he need to be proficient to shoot unarmed non-combatants, and give orders from the rear?
Posted by: BobG at May 04, 2006 05:48 PM (VzJj3)
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Now I understand why Zarqawi never uses a gun in his execution videos! It's because he doesn't know how to use one!
Posted by: Jimmy Wu at May 04, 2006 06:05 PM (AfORa)
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This is sort of like seeing Hitler pick his nose and eat it.
Posted by: TallDave at May 04, 2006 10:41 PM (H8Wgl)
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Al-Zarqawi is not a Soldier. He is a terrorist. His job as the leader of Terrorists it to cause as much fear as possible. For this he does not need a gun. yes, he may be a buffoon with a weapon, but he does not need to be competant with one to be the most feared terrorist leader in the region. Al-Zarqawi is good at inciting fear and hate, creating suicide bombers, planning destruction, and not getting caught. Aparently the Terrorist movement is having a little "PR" problem over there and somebody advised him to do a film showing him as a great fighter. Maybe not the best idea but reality is not important in PR. This video increased his recruitment i am sure, thus it was effective. Let us hope that we were able to learn something usefull in taking him down from this video, other than barrels are indeed very hot after extended fire.
Posted by: Web at May 05, 2006 06:53 AM (Wb2if)
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I don't see Zarkman wearing a bomb vest. Wassup wid dat?
Posted by: Jabba the Tutt at May 06, 2006 07:08 AM (DuLrj)
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Here is a reference to an article by an American of Arab origin, with a few pertinent quotes. It has struck me repeatedly that the terrorists don't seem capable of creating anything new or original, except in degree of depravity and vicioiusness. I don't by any means think tha's true of all Arabs, but certainly true of the terrorists. Farouk El-Baz points out some factors we need to note in an article found at the URL: http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/2004/710/feature.htm
.........
Farouk El-Baz, member of the US National Academy of Engineering, is director of the Boston University Center for Remote Sensing. A veteran of the Apollo Program, he served as Science Adviser to Anwar El-Sadat, late president of Egypt.
Although the Arab region is considered oil-rich and wealthy, all indications point to its knowledge deficit. This fact is clearly conveyed in the Arab Human Development Report: Building a Knowledge Society that was issued in 2003 by the United Nations Development Programme (UNDP). The report, which I helped to review prior to its publication, pointed out that the Arab region trails behind all other regions in knowledge indicators, except sub-Saharan Africa. These indicators included the number of books, newspapers, radio stations, television channels, telephone lines, personal computers and Internet access.
• The number of patents produced by Arabs is meager; during the past two decades, South Korea registered in the US over 44 times the number of patents from all Arab countries combined.
• ... the number of books translated in all 22 Arab countries is equal to one-fifth of those translated into Greek.
• Although Arabs constitute five per cent of the world population, they produce only 0.8 per cent of the literary and artistic literature.
Posted by: david march at May 07, 2006 02:48 AM (a/QW9)
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Howard Dean Screws Gay Outreach Coordinator, Advocate at DNC
Via Drudge:
Democratic Party Chair Howard Dean on May 2 fired the party's gay outreach advisor Donald Hitchcock less than a week after Hitchcock's domestic partner, Paul Yandura, a longtime party activist, accused Dean of failing to take stronger action to defend gays.
Dean immediately hired gay former Democratic Party operative Brian Bond to replace Hitchcock, according to DNC spokesperson Karen Finney, who called Bond a "proven leader."
Bond served from 1996 to 2003 as executive director of the Gay and Lesbian Victory Fund, a bipartisan national group that raises money and provides training to help elect openly gay candidates to public office.
"It was not retaliation," Finney said of Hitchcock's dismissal. "It was decided we needed a change. We decided to hire a proven leader."
Hitchcock declined comment Tuesday night except to confirm that Dean informed him May 2 through a surrogate that he had been terminated. He said he was considering consulting an attorney to decide whether to contest the firing.
Regardless of how you feel about gay couples, this stinks to high heaven for the DNC. If a female activist had made charges that Dean wasn't doing enough for rape victims and Dean fired her husband, who was in charge of a related outreach effort, it would almost certainly and immediate be condemned as a retaliatory act that was certainly tasteless, unethical, and depending on the jurisdiction, may be legally actionable as well.
The Democratic Party claims to have big tent, but Howard Dean seems to take a dim view of the rights of those who enter through the back door.
We can only hope that if they do decide to follow with legal action for this apparently retaliatory firing by Screamin' Howard, that Hitchcock and Yandura get justice in the end.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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"The Democratic Party claims to have a big tent, but Howard Dean seems to take a dim view of the rights of those who enter through the back door".
I am sure that the paragraph quoted was not meant humorously...
I have a problem with the flaming bigotry that the Democrat's regularly display. They routinely use epithets and lowbrow racist/sexist descriptions when slamming any opponents. Not to mention sensitivity to any criticism.
Posted by: dc at May 04, 2006 10:30 AM (e2269)
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"The Democratic Party claims to have a big tent, but Howard Dean seems to take a dim view of the rights of those who enter through the back door".
da,da, bing! but seriously folks, don't forget to tip your waitress!
Posted by: Ray Robison at May 04, 2006 11:33 AM (CdK5b)
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Where you say, "If a female..."
That would only apply if it were the Republicans. Otherwise you'd hear even less of it than this. Of course, if it were the Republicans, it would be Dean who would be fired...
Posted by: Steve O at May 05, 2006 09:20 PM (R0Csm)
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May 03, 2006
Bird Flu Review: Nix this Sick Chick Schtick
Major Chaz is not impressed with what he sees coming from ABC's pending made-for-television bird flu movie:
How many people will now base their knowledge on the Bird Flu from a television movie written by a guy who also wrote the previous TV blockbusters as "Atomic Twister", "Meat Loaf: To Hell and Back", and "Daydream Believers: The Monkees Story".
Hey, it has to be more realistic than
Commander in Cheif.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Savage Realizations
You've got to hand it to the Boston Globe's Charlie Savage; if he doesn't like how the facts are arranged, he's more than willing to arrange them on his own. Such was the case in his article Hearing vowed on Bush's powers.
The main focus of the article was President Bush's decision to use Presidential signing statements to bypass provisions of 750 bills that the President thinks may conflict with the Constitution. According to the definition provided by Savage in his article, signing statements are:
…official documents in which a president lays out his interpretation of a bill for the executive branch, creating guidelines to follow when it implements the law. The statements are filed without fanfare in the federal record, often following ceremonies in which the president made no mention of the objections he was about to raise in the bill, even as he signed it into law.
That's what Charlie wants you to see. How about another perspective?
Walter Dellinger, Assistant Attorney General under President Clinton, wrote to Bernard Nussbaum, Counsel to President Clinton, in 1993,
The Legal Significance of Signing Statements:
To begin with, it appears to be an uncontroversial use of signing statements to explain to the public, and more particularly to interested constituencies, what the President understands to be the likely effects of the bill, and how it coheres or fails to cohere with the Administration's views or programs.
A second, and also generally uncontroversial, function of Presidential signing statements is to guide and direct Executive officials in interpreting or administering a statute. The President has the constitutional authority to supervise and control the activity of subordinate officials within the Executive Branch…
[snip]
A third function, more controversial than either of the two considered above, is the use of signing statements to announce the President's view of the constitutionality of the legislation he is signing. This category embraces at least three species: statements that declare that the legislation (or relevant provisions) would be unconstitutional in certain applications; statements that purport to construe the legislation in a manner that would "save" it from unconstitutionality; and statements that state flatly that the legislation is unconstitutional on its face. Each of these species of statement may include a declaration as to how -- or whether -- the legislation will be enforced.
Thus, the President may use a signing statement to announce that, although the legislation is constitutional on its face, it would be unconstitutional in various applications, and that in such applications he will refuse to execute it. Such a Presidential statement could be analogized to a Supreme Court opinion that upheld legislation against a facial constitutional challenge, but warned at the same time that certain applications of the act would be unconstitutional.
[snip]
In each of the last three Administrations, the Department of Justice has advised the President that the Constitution provides him with the authority to decline to enforce a clearly unconstitutional law. This advice is, we believe, consistent with the views of the Framers. Moreover, four sitting Justices of the Supreme Court have joined in the opinion that the President may resist laws that encroach upon his powers by "disregard[ing] them when they are unconstitutional."
(note: footnote numbers stripped for readability)
The four justices? Scalia, O'Connor, Kennedy and Souter. One might have reason to believe that Justice Alito and/or Chief Justice Roberts would make a similar judgment, rendering a majority decision of 5-4 or 6-3 in the President's favor on the modern Court, though Savage couldn't be troubled to go through the "extensive research" once could do in several minutes on Google that led to this potentially important information.
In other words, despite Specter's incessant grandstanding, John Dean's
whining and Savage's perhaps intentionally leading framing, it appears that while Bush's frequency in using signing statements is unusual, it does have both precedent and the apparent support of the Supreme Court.
Of course, Charlie Savage isn't quite done there. Why stop with a little misdirection, when you can try adding to The Big Lie?
Speaking of the President executive order authorizing the National Security Agency to conduct targeted intercepts of suspected terrorist communications where at least one end was on foreign soil,
Savage wrote:
Feingold is an outspoken critic of Bush's assertion that his wartime powers give him the authority to set aside laws. The senator has proposed censuring Bush over his domestic spying program, in which the president secretly authorized the military to wiretap Americans' phones without a warrant, bypassing a 1978 surveillance law.
But Savage's assertion as to the nature of the program is is false, and demonstrably so. Not one single claim has ever been made that shows this was a domestic spying program. In all instances, from the
original article written in the
NY Times, to
specific comments made about the program by former NSA director General Michael V. Hayden, to comments made by the White House itself, it has been emphatically stated that the program is not domestic, but international in nature. International means more than one country, which was a primary criteria for all of these intercepts. My six-year-old can understand that oft-repeated concept, so why is it so difficult for Savage to understand? The intercepts were also not a wiretapping of Americans' phones, another "fact" Mr. Savage conveniently cannot support.
Once you have the real facts and misrepresentations of this
Globe article laid out in front of you, it is hardly surprising that a recent Reuters poll found that
69% of Americans don't trust the media. With reporters like Charlie Savage more interested in manufacturing news than reporting it, why should they?
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Why would any one read the globe? Especially after Mike Barnacle? I think the National Enquirer would be somewhat more factual.
Posted by: lip at May 04, 2006 06:13 AM (EJHD4)
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I don't get it. Is Bush breaking the law or not? Is this a major concern, or a batch of intellectual strawmen that only affects the journalists and college nerds?
Posted by: Rachel at May 04, 2006 09:28 AM (y6n8O)
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Moussaoui Gets Life... Or Does He?
Part of me thinks Rusty is probably right: if Zacarias Moussaoui gets life in prison for his part in the 9/11 terrorist attacks, how can we really justify putting to death any other terrorists we may capture? That is a rather disturbing question.
At the same time, life is prison, even in what is likely to be solitary confinement, is perhaps more likely to result in his dying within this next decade.
Jeffrey Dahmer, a cannibalistic serial killer of 17 men, was sentenced to 15 consecutive life sentences in February of 2002, but was murdered by another inmate in 2004. Child molester
John Geoghan was also sentenced to life in 2002 and murdered by another inmate two years later.
It is quite possible that Moussaoui will create enough hatred among the inmate population that his life sentence will end up being a very short stay.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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John Walker Lindh is doing quite well in prison. He has become a sort of prison "imam" and is apparently well respected by the other inmates - even non-Muslim inmates. They consider him, unbelievably , "a role model."
If Moussaoui winds up like that, I think we will be very sorry as a nation.
Posted by: tommy at May 03, 2006 05:30 PM (hMLSq)
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I think that he should be placed in the general prison population. With luck, he will be beaten up every day by the other inmates for the rest of his pathetic life.
When Moussaoui dies, may he be greeted by 72 old whores who all look like Yasser Arafat.
chsw10605
Posted by: chsw10605 at May 03, 2006 06:42 PM (WdHqZ)
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There is now no chance of him being raped or murdered in prison. The media is stating he is almost certainly going to ADX Florence, the Alcatraz of the Rockies. In this supermax prison, where Timothy McVeigh went, he will write books, engage in frivolous lawsuits, and garner media attention for decades to come.
All at an annual cost to the taxpayers of something like $100K a year.
Wonderful, huh?
Posted by: MLC at May 03, 2006 07:19 PM (hMLSq)
4
AMERICA, YOU LOST!
Once again Alberto (our seemingly incompetent but PC AG) has his lunch eaten With Alberto’s abysmal lack of success in cases relating to the War on Terror you have to question my liberal President’s commitment . It seems more and more to have all been a disingenuous political flim flam; all be it a successful flim flam. Only batting is baseball is a success rate less than 500 considered good. In fielding a good rate is 999 and in the technical side of business (Accounting, IS…) you need 99999 or better to be a success. With Alberto’s string of losses the last 12 month he is just under 500.
My liberal President obviously put quotas ahead of the War on Terror. With the Dubai cases (plural as in more than one) it seems Bush does not even have the War on Terror in his to ten list of priorities! As the Scotch have been saying for over 1500 years ”actions speak louder than words”. Bush’s liberal actions the last 16 months are shouting over his conservative words of 24 months ago!
Posted by: Rodney A Stanton at May 04, 2006 07:16 AM (GtFIY)
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What Amnesty Brings
Welcome to the new look of illegal immigration.
Via the
L.A. Times:
Mexican President Vicente Fox will sign a bill that would legalize the use of nearly every drug and narcotic sold by the same Mexican cartels he's vowed to fight during his five years in office, a spokesman said Tuesday.
The list of illegal drugs approved for personal consumption by Mexico's Congress last week is enough to make one dizzy — or worse.
Cocaine. Heroin. LSD. Marijuana. PCP. Opium. Synthetic opiates. Mescaline. Peyote. Psilocybin mushrooms. Amphetamines. Methamphetamines.
And the per-person amounts approved for possession by anyone 18 or older could easily turn any college party into an all-nighter: half a gram of coke, a couple of Ecstasy pills, several doses of LSD, a few marijuana joints, a spoonful of heroin, 5 grams of opium and more than 2 pounds of peyote, the hallucinogenic cactus.
The law would be among the most permissive in the world, putting Mexico in the company of the Netherlands. Critics, including U.S. drug policy officials, already are worrying that it will spur a domestic addiction problem and make Mexico a narco-tourism destination.
So not only are we facing an ever-increasing number of illegal aliens
leaching funds and services that were created to help America's legal residents, we're now facing the distinct possibility that these illegals will be junkies and addicts desperate for a fix as well.
Remember to "thank" your Republican senators pushing for the amnesty bill by voting them out of office in November.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Perhaps after enough of our dopers head south of the border, the Mexicans will re-think this policy; I'm a native New Yorker and have visited Amsterdam often, and I've decided that druggies are a detriment to any society they temporarily call home, but we could have a reverse migration that benefits us!
Posted by: Tom TB at May 03, 2006 06:03 PM (wZLWV)
2
How can voting for people who will do the very same thing (Democrats) change anything?
Posted by: Rachel at May 04, 2006 09:30 AM (y6n8O)
3
A more palatable action is just to stay home in November...
Posted by: _Jon at May 04, 2006 02:39 PM (ewFgD)
4
CY -
I share your frustration with the Republican Party. To me, it seems such a simple thing to vote to create a Great Wall of America along the Mexican-US border, and I too loathe the ball-less hand-wringing of our senators and congressional reps.
Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water, though. Surely, the Democratic replacements will only be worse.
Perhaps a few more "This was our homeland" posters will convince the lawmakers that the immigrants actually see themselves as "re-conquistadores" that need a physical barrier to make the point: this is our land; it will forever be our land so long as we stand to protect it; and fences make good neighbors.
Posted by: Atticus_NC at May 06, 2006 05:49 PM (3lxJi)
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McCain's Missing Merchandise
David Ignatius has a WaPo Op-ed up to day called, A Man who won't Sell his Soul.
Interestingly enough, it is about John McCain, one of the most calculating, cynical, triangulating Senators in office, and one who made the frightening admission just last week that he won't let a little thing like the Constitution
get in his way:
"He [Michael Graham] also mentioned my abridgement of First Amendment rights, i.e. talking about campaign finance reform... I know that money corrupts... I would rather have a clean government than one where quote First Amendment rights are being respected, that has become corrupt. If I had my choice, I'd rather have the clean government."
McCain sold out the most important part of the First Amendment by heavily infringing on the right to free political speech with McCain-Feingold, and now he appears ready to dump the Amendment altogether. John McCain can't sell his political soul.
You can't sell what you don't possess.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
10:41 AM
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May 02, 2006
Cato the Blunder?
I've just completed the 22.5-page Power Surge: The Constitutional Record of George W. Bush (31-page PDF), authored by Gene Healy and Timothy Lynch of the libertarian CATO Institute.
The executive summary should be compelling to everyone, regardless of political orientation.
It
begins:
In recent judicial confirmation battles, President Bush has repeatedly—and correctly—stressed fidelity to the Constitution as the key qualification for service as a judge. It is also the key qualification for service as the nation's chief executive. On January 20, 2005, for the second time, Mr. Bush took the presidential oath of office set out in the Constitution, swearing to "preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States." With five years of the Bush administration behind us, we have more than enough evidence to make an assessment about the president's commitment to our fundamental legal charter
Unfortunately, far from defending the Constitution, President Bush has repeatedly sought to strip out the limits the document places on federal power. In its official legal briefs and public actions, the Bush administration has advanced a view of federal power that is astonishingly broad, a view that includes- a federal government empowered to regulate core political speech—and restrict it greatly when it counts the most: in the days before a federal election;
- a president who cannot be restrained, through validly enacted statutes, from pursuing any tactic he believes to be effective in the war on terror;
- a president who has the inherent constitutional authority to designate American citizens suspected of terrorist activity as "enemy combatants," strip them of any constitutional protection, and lock them up without charges for the duration of the war on terror— in other words, perhaps forever; and
- a federal government with the power to supervise virtually every aspect of American life, from kindergarten, to marriage, to the grave.
President Bush's constitutional vision is, in short, sharply at odds with the text, history, and structure of our Constitution, which authorizes a government of limited powers.
The CATO authors make the charge that a sitting president is violating his oath of office and the Constitution he has sworn to protect on multiple occasions, and these are charges not to be dismissed lightly. I had to read this document.
After reading it all and taking it in, I sit here with mixed emotions.
The authors make a strong case in each instance, and the way they frame the issues, there seems little practical doubt as to whether or not the President is guilty of some of the things that Healy and Lynch charge. But is
little doubt the same as
no doubt, and how do we judge?
Example #1 was the infamous McCain-Feingold bill (Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act, or BCRA).
Bush did sign McCain-Feingold into law after objecting to it on Constitutional grounds. It which seems to be a direct assault upon the most important core principle of the First Amendment, free
political speech. But Healy and Lynch then make this comment on page 5 (as the page is numbered, may vary in your PDF viewer):
…when the president abdicates his constitutional responsibility, as President Bush did when he signed a bill he knew to be unconstitutional, there is no guarantee that the courts will act to uphold theirs.
In fact, the Supreme Court did not accept President Bush's invitation to strike down the offending portions of the BCRA. In 2003, in McConnell v. Federal Election Commission, the court upheld all the major provisions of the BCRA.
To me, this seems perplexing. If the President thinks a congressional bill is unconstitutional and signs it into law thinking it is unconstitutional, should he face impeachment when the Supreme Court upholds all the major provisions of the law?
If he should then be impeached, what of the members of Congress who voted to pass the bill in the first place? Do they not violate their oaths as well? And what do we do with a Supreme Court that upholds what many lay people consider a clear violation of the very essence of the First Amendment? Should we toss them all, executive, legislative, and judicial, and appoint President Antonin Scalia for filing a dissent that upheld the Constitution?
From McCain-Feingold, to "free speech" zones, the so-called "torture memos," and questions about apparently expanding powers to arrest and seize property, Healy and Lynch take aim at the President but find themselves hitting other targets with virtually every shot.
For example:
- The "free speech" zones are enforced by the Secret Service or local police at Secret Service behest, and the authors cannot even provide evidence that Bush ha any part in these decisions;
- the "torture memos" debate is carried forward upon opinions put forth by the Justice Department and the Department of Defense, as well as the White House;
- the "war powers" argument put forth by the authors would seem to implicate almost every president back to Truman (with the apparent exception of Bush 41) for using police actions instead of congressional declarations as their method to go to war, while at the same time noting the current President Bush seized upon Congressional use of force still in effect from the 1991 Persian Gulf war, and got a congressional use of force authorization of his own as well;
- The FBI and other federal law enforcement agencies are indicted along with the President under a charge of overly expanded arrest and seizure powers;
- an alleged expansion of surveillance powers would condemn the NSA as well (note: I think the authors are fundamentally wrong in their assertions made in this section, and they should admit this is blind speculation on their part based upon unsupportable assumptions, which they don't);
- and on and on…
It would appear at the end of the article that all branches of the federal government, and indeed most individual departments of these branches, must bear at least some responsibility for the current wretched state of affairs the authors state this nation is currently in, or may find itself in at some point in the future.
The often compelling—and occasionally self-defeating—arguments made by Healy and Lynch would seem to indicate an entire federal system that has become corrupted to the point that we as a nation should consider a wholesale scrapping of all three branches of government and start them afresh—OR—it suggest that the authors may over-reaching to support a hypothesis that may have been pre-determined, and in doing so, tarred everyone with the same brush.
I'll be very interested to see other impressions of this document.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
02:25 PM
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CATO does some good work....this unfortunately doesn't qualify. But you can see the basic libertarian arguement throughout...no government is better than any government... and they will use the Constitution to attempt to win both sides of the argument.
Posted by: Sluggo_f16 at May 02, 2006 04:50 PM (VE5vJ)
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Typepad is down so I'm not blogging tonight, but at the heart of the matter is a sort of ideological puritanism which ultimately trips up all ideologues - from Conservative, to liberal to Libertarian. Should a man with a banner be allowed close to the President as a right if it means the Secret Service might miss a man with a pistol. It was hard to kill someone at 15 feet with a pistol in Jefferson's day, not so much today.
If every branch of government were the final arbiter of the Constution, we'd need three of them. You can't address the power of any one without addressing in some manner the power of the others - hence you have a balance of power. Like it or not, McCain Feingold is just and accepted law as it stands today and 2 of three branches agreed. They may well be wrong and it can be changed in the future, even through a new court challenge. But it became and was tested in law in concert, so short of addressing it Constituionally or legislatively, it would be foolish to impeach one branch of government. BUsh could easily claim his view changed after exercising an obligation to the principle of advise and consent.
You could strike down most every amendment with an ideologicaly pure argument, but it wouldn't hold up in Court. And no one on the CATO paper authored the constituion, has ever governed, or sat on the Supreme Court, so far as I know.
Posted by: Dan at May 02, 2006 09:09 PM (7e1m4)
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Exactly how many americans are being held at Gitmo or elsewhere with no legal representation? I have heard of one incident, but do they cite others? Here is an interesting quote about holding enemy combatants
"GERMAN PRISONERS OF WAR. When the United States went to war in 1941, what to do with enemy prisoners of war was among the last considerations of a country reeling from a Japanese attack and preparing for war in Europe. The nation had never held large numbers of foreign prisoners and was unprepared for the many tasks involved, which included registration, food, clothing, housing, entertainment, and even reeducation. But prepared or not, the country suddenly found itself on the receiving end of massive waves of German and Italian prisoners of war. More than 150,000 men arrived after the surrender of Gen. Erwin Rommel's Afrika Korps in April 1943, followed by an average of 20,000 new POWs a month. From the Normandy invasion in June 1944 through December 30,000 prisoners a month arrived; for the last few months of the war 60,000 were arriving each month. When the war was over, there were 425,000 enemy prisoners in 511 main and branch camps throughout the United States."
http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/online/articles/GG/qug1.html
Nearly half a million POW some held for years. Do you think they all had lawyers?
Posted by: Ray Robison at May 02, 2006 10:09 PM (4joLu)
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This is the one, out of 750 laws, they pick?
Posted by: Fred at May 03, 2006 03:52 AM (xX+1y)
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Let me say from the beginning that I voted for Bush and with the choices we are presented with would likely vote for him again. Until recently I strongly supported the Republican party. Yet as I read this blog I ask myself if I personally feel free. I have to say no. I can't get on an airplane without surrendering my rights. Of course the argument is that you do not need to fly but in this world you do. The same actions are pervasive all through our culture so this theme is picked up on subways, buses, trains, malls and entering any building. Try going to Washington and seeing your representative or watching a bill debated. Impossible. As a physician I am constantly every minute hasseled by the government. In fact a new industry has been developed to cope with this. Under Bush the government has grown. Taxes have not really come down. So though he and the Republicans do not preach socialism like the Democrats, they are just better at inacting it. Something has to change. We need to quit being so warm and cozy with the Muslims and the illegal immigrants and begin racial profiling and all the other things that would truly help with security and leave the average citizen alone. This can be done. Take airport security, it is a joke. So quit bothering me and take the war to the religion of peace until they change their doctrine. Understand that if you are not a citizen in this country, you do not have the constitutional rights we do. I am sure the lawyers here will argue that fact but if it is not the law of the land it should be. Understand that tortue does work. It should be used in the situations in which people do bad, horrible things and are not under the control of a legitimate government. To sum it up I do not feel free in this country. And no I will not move. Hopefully when everything begins to fall apart, my country (Dixie) will reemerge.
Posted by: David Caskey at May 03, 2006 10:23 AM (6wTpy)
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I agree with David C. What we need to realize is we live in an Oligarchy.
Posted by: Realist at May 03, 2006 12:03 PM (mQauu)
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Maybe it is just coincidence but I have seen a lot of people lately making comments who claim to be republicans but their comments don't sound like what I am used to hearing from republicans. Did I miss the "pretend you are a republican to trick them into hating Bush" seminar?
Posted by: Ray Robison at May 03, 2006 01:19 PM (CdK5b)
8
Ray,
If you do not think I am a card carrying Republican then see if Jim McCrery's office can vouch for me. What is the deal? Our party has completely turned its back on the people that support it and hoped for significant change in 1994. It took me awhile, but I have finally gotten to the point that I agree with the liberals that Bush is an idiot. But that aside, my own representatives do not listen. Even when you give them money!! I recently sent a letter of concern to McCrery and Vitter. I received the same form letter as an answer. The people in Washington have completely lost respect for us and the answer may lie in your statement. We will go along with anything they want and not allow any critical analysis of Bush or the other leaders. My point is we are being treated like the enemy and our rights stomped on a regular basis. Lets tell them to stop and get on with the business of reducing the size of our government and taxes and regulation. Look a Makin's blog and see how disgusted she is becoming.
Posted by: David Caskey at May 03, 2006 02:01 PM (6wTpy)
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Wind
I don't much care for the over-saturated Plame case and have refused to cover it for the most part, but the latest round of over-the-top assertions are really too much.
Over at
Donkelephant, Justin Gardener is in over his head regarding a
Raw Story claim that Valerie Plame was working on Iran when she was exposed. Setting aside for now the fact that whoever leaked to MSNBC correspondent David Shuster is also a leaker worth firing and perhaps prosecuting, we catch Gardener
hyperventilating:
To all of those who said she wasn't really a covert agent, that she wasn't really doing anything of importance…well, you're wrong.
She was working on Iran. In fact, she was tracking the ins and outs of their attempts to acquire WMDs. And the Bush administration's actions most likely harmed that intelligence gathering.
[snip]
Should Rove go to jail for leaking her name to Novak? Who friggin knows at this point. But should he be ashamed because his brand of dirty politics could have cost us something in the Iran intelligence shell game? You're damn right he should.
Back up a second, Justin.
Plame was a WMD analyst, based out of CIA headquarters since 1997 because her cover was likely exposed in the
Adlrich Ames affair. Others sources say her cover was blown as far back as the mid-1990s in separate events by a spy in Russia and diplomatic incompetence in Cuba.
Her exact
position was classified, but to argue that anyone who drove through the main gates of the CIA in Langley every day for work is somehow covert is asinine. Joe Wilson himself said she wasn't covert (his exact word was "clandestine") in a July 14, 2005 interview with Wolf Blitzer of CNN. As her husband, he just
might know a bit more about that than does Justin and his compatriots.
As for Rove, it remains to be seen if he will even be charged. Shouldn't we wait to have a trial and then see if he is convicted before he is sent to jail, or is that whole "due process thing" superfluous?
As for what revealing Plame's name did or didn't do to her section in the CIA, I think Gardener and his friends at Raw Story are making assumptions they cannot possibly support without a much higher security clearance than they presently have at CIA HQ (which I think is "none," but feel free to correct me). Plame is hardly the only WMD analyst in the CIA, and is quite likely to be one of many working on Iran. I find it highly unlikely that an intelligence agency infamous for so many layers of bureaucracy would have just one analyst working on a country that most have targeted as one of our main proliferation threats since before President Clinton was in office.
Did the disclosure of Plame's identity have an impact on investigating Iran's WMDs? I'm sure it could have, but to what degree we may not know for some time (if ever), as that information is almost certainly classified. It would stand to reason that anytime you lose a person with experience it decreases the overall knowledge base to a certain degree. But Plame was not the only CIA analyst working on Iranian WMD programs, and I've seen no one able to cite evidence she was even one of the more important analysts in this area.
Her exposure was certainly unfortunate, but I don't think anyone can make the statement that it was highly detrimental to the overall work, and it certainly wasn't terminal to the Agency at large.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
10:15 AM
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How could anyone have outed Plame when she wasn't and had not been under cover for years. Working at the CIA and driving in and out daily is not the procedure for an undercover agent. This is all just a political game that suckered a lot of people and now Fitzgearld is involved in a game of gotya for biased political purposes. Time to close him down and admit that the whole mess was a made up mess, kind of like the Limbaugh slander by a government hack. Ain't nothing there for anyone with an IQ above room tempature.
Posted by: Scrapiron at May 03, 2006 12:14 AM (wZLWV)
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According to current and former intelligence officials, Plame Wilson, who worked on the clandestine side of the CIA in the Directorate of Operations as a non-official cover (NOC) officer….
Oh good…we’ve come full-circle again, landing precisely at what keeps appearing to be the central point of intersection of at least 2 controversies with only one organization/agency involved, the CIA.
For some strange reason Occam’s Razor keeps popping into my mind, Tenet.
However, Larisa Alexandrovna’s story revealed, at least, 2 new ’unnamed’ CIA sources whose clearance’s and positions are, or were, high enough to know the operational scope of Plame’s portfolio while she was at the Agency. If Fitzgerald doesn’t have a subpoena with Larisa in front of a grand jury very shortly and these 2 new ‘unnamed sources’ under investigation and indictment, he’s either stupid or another partisan hack - both of which I doubt.
Given the overall acceleration of events surrounding Iran and the crisis brewing in the Middle-East, we’re certainly looking at the justification for a general cleaning-out of everyone hired or put on the fast-track during, at least, the Clinton admin or maybe a case for the creation of a new agency. At minimum, I’d expect to see the militaries scope and involvement in the intelligence arena, if only temporarily, greatly expanded.
Posted by: Eg at May 03, 2006 04:09 AM (KMJ0B)
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Jeep Jihadi Charged
Mohammed Taheri-Azar, the Iranian-American jihadi wannabe that tried to run down UNC-Chapel Hill students, was charged with nine counts of attempted murder. In addition:
Mohammed Taheri-Azar, a UNC-Chapel Hill graduate, also was indicted on four counts of assault with a deadly weapon with intent to kill and five counts of assault with a deadly weapon with intent to kill inflicting serious injury.
Taheri-Azar is accused of driving through the gathering spot, known as the Pit, on March 3, hitting nine people. He has said his actions were in retaliation for the deaths of Muslims throughout the world caused by the United States.
I can only wonder if Chapel Hill (
motto: "Left of Center, Right at Home") will raise monies for his defense fund. Some people have already thought about doing just that.
Other Iranian-Americans (or more accurately, Iranian-North Americans)
aren't among them.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
07:44 AM
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So, no terrorism-related charges?
Posted by: sandspur at May 02, 2006 11:19 AM (+/kur)
2
Wrong venue for terrorism charges, I think. That would be in Federal court.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 02, 2006 11:29 AM (g5Nba)
3
Who are these people you mention that have "thought about" raising money for his defense? Saying that the people of Chapel Hill will try to defend this monster just because they are liberal is an insult to the town, which has been outraged at this incident ever since it occurred. If anyone does raise money for him, I will be the first to condemn them. But please don't smear an entire town preemptively.
-Jordan Miller, Chapel Hill, NC
Posted by: J. Miller at May 03, 2006 02:17 AM (sR60A)
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May 01, 2006
A Day Without A Difference
Today was the much-touted Day Without Immigrants, code for a day where illegal aliens and their supporters across the United States weren't supposed to work, or shop, or do much of anything other than protest. In short, they were supposed to act French.
Even though North Carolina has a substantial Hispanic population (45% of which are illegal. Thank
you, Mike Easley), I must confess I didn't notice any significant difference in my daily routine.
Traffic flowed (or didn't) about the same. Taco Bell, staffed by Pakistanis, was still open, and Wendy's, staffed by Mexicans, was as well.
It might have been a Day Without Immigrants in
some parts of the country, but here in Raleigh, North Carolina, as I experienced it. this seemed to be just another Monday.
It was a Day Without a Difference.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
08:36 PM
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Aside from a little traffic in the loop and a few street closures, Chicago was pretty much normal. Even a Home Depot (with signs in Spanish in addition to English) in a hispanic neighborhood was busy and fully staffed.
Posted by: Nick at May 01, 2006 08:51 PM (nww0N)
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HUGE and very well-behaved crowds in San Francisco. Lots of families. A few International Answer folks mixed in the crowd, but they didn't set the tone.
Posted by: Telstar Logistics at May 01, 2006 09:15 PM (2k4uh)
3
HUGE and very well-behaved crowds in San Francisco. Lots of families. A few International Answer folks mixed in the crowd, but they didn't set the tone. Photos:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/telstar/tags/daywithoutimmigrants/
Posted by: Telstar Logistics at May 01, 2006 09:17 PM (2k4uh)
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It was hard not to notice in NYC. And it was glorious. I could actually sit on the subway at rush hour.
Posted by: jpe at May 01, 2006 10:04 PM (OUh4I)
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All TV stations on the Satelite were up and running. I managed to buy a couple of things on EBay so the Internet was up and running. Walmart was as crowded as usual. I never shopped there until i found out the lefties hated the place. Now i stay out of the Union grocery stores and shop at WalMart for the savings. Spent a couple hundred on Lawn supplies and groceries. Did a lot of landscaping work without the aid of the criminal aliens, got most of the 2.5 acres mowed and whacked some brush and got it piled. See everything can be done without hiring a criminal. At 65 i can still do a hard days work, it's just that now it takes me 5-6 days to do it. LMAO at those too lazy to do their own work and have to use the criminals as slaves to do it.
Posted by: Scrapiron at May 01, 2006 11:19 PM (wZLWV)
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Also stopped by the Fire Department and no one has stolen all of our trucks. We're still open for business...
Posted by: Scrapiron at May 01, 2006 11:21 PM (wZLWV)
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Our mail was late...wonder if that meant anything.
Posted by: Nettie at May 01, 2006 11:57 PM (K4sWw)
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jpe, I don't know what part of NYC you were in, or what time you take the train, but at 5pm on the east side in Midtown, the subways were as packed as ever going into Queens. I had hoped that I would get a little extra space, but there was more of a volume reduction during Passover than yesterday.
Also, all the lunch places around Grand Central were still open. The only closed shop I could find was a Hallmark store -- that had been closed due to tax non-payment. Hmmm.
Posted by: meep at May 02, 2006 05:02 AM (GqHvA)
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I wonder if America now realizes that it can get along without the Illegal Aliens just fine? Yesterday proved it without question.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 02, 2006 05:16 AM (elhVA)
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What I can't understand is what all the kids skipping school that day were supposed to prove. If I were a school teacher, I'd count it as any other unexcused absence: no making up tests, detention for playing hooky, and oh, wouldn't you know it, I had had a pop quiz scheduled for that day.
Posted by: Amber at May 02, 2006 07:16 AM (YUrMR)
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Makes you wonder why it was not called "A Day Without an Illegal Alien". People this is not about Immigrants. If you listen to or read some of the verbage that is comming from the Latino community they are advocating taking over the American southwest.
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at May 02, 2006 07:39 AM (elhVA)
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"They (Illegal immigrants) do work that Americans won't do", oh yeah? Yesterday I mowed my own lawn, cleaned my own toilets, cut down my own trees, and even did some work that illegals won't, or can't do; things that require fluency in the English language!
Posted by: Tom T Bosee at May 02, 2006 07:46 AM (y6n8O)
13
Take a look at teenage unemployment numbers and you will see who was doing these jobs before the under the table illegals took them. It provided some cheap labor for the business owner, some pocket cash for the teenager and some well needed JOB EXPERIENCE and GROWTH.
There is no such thing as a job an a US citizen wouldn't do. I picked produce in the summer at the neighborhood farm, dilivered newspapers, washed dishes at a restaraunt so who are these people saying we wouldn't do them?
I did and I think I turned out better for it. That train of thought is rediculous and it annoy's me.
Give the jobs to the U.S. teens who could use the money/self esteem/experience and let them grow.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 02, 2006 08:57 AM (elhVA)
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These guys can't afford to take too many protest days off of work -- illegals don't get paid time off! Their power is virtually nil. They hurt us more when they go about their daily business of drawing benefits and consuming more of the GDP than they produce.
Worse for them, they seem to have alienated some of their support, and galvinized opposition.
And folks who sympathize must realize that a nation has the right to secure its own borders, and that's deadly serious business in the post 9-11 world. FInally, when i do go to Mexico, I have to obey the laws there. If I went to El Salvador, I'd be expected to obey the law there. No matter where, I'm always expected to obey the law. Why should it be different here in the USA?
Now, when's the counter rally?
Marsh
Posted by: Marshall Neal at May 02, 2006 09:42 AM (aE9Lg)
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Marsh, read the Mexican Constitution. If you as a legal visitor in Mexico criticize any government policy, you will be immediately deported! Some reciprocity in civil rights!
Posted by: Tom TB at May 02, 2006 10:08 AM (y6n8O)
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Did the antique MSM miss the two demonstrations involving around 750,000 people (marching through the streets) demanding that the country get rid of the criminal aliens? No Mexical flags there.
Posted by: Scrapiron at May 03, 2006 12:17 AM (wZLWV)
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I'd like to encourage everyone to boycott everything Mexican on May 5 (Cinco de Mayo). Don't buy anything made in Mexico; don't buy anything from hispanic-owned businesses;don't eat in Mexican restaurants (unless owned by an American corporation or citizen). In short, let's do our own "Day Without Immigrants."
Posted by: Old-dawg at May 04, 2006 08:21 AM (7nc0l)
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"The Dumbest Man in the U.S. Senate"
When I lived in New York, I used to drive home from my job in Westchester listening to Mark Levin, who often referred to Democratic Senator Joe Biden (Del.) as "the dumbest man in the U.S. Senate."
It appears now that Biden's intelligence was
overestimated:
The senior Democrat on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee proposed Monday that Iraq be divided into three separate regions — Kurdish, Shiite and Sunni — with a central government in Baghdad.
In an op-ed essay in Monday's edition of The New York Times, Sen. Joseph Biden D-Del., wrote that the idea "is to maintain a united Iraq by decentralizing it, giving each ethno-religious group ... room to run its own affairs, while leaving the central government in charge of common interests."
The new Iraqi constitution allows for establishment of self-governing regions. But that was one of the reasons the Sunnis opposed the constitution and why they demanded and won an agreement to review it this year.
Biden and co-writer Leslie H. Gelb, former president of the Council on Foreign Relations, acknowledged the opposition, and said the Sunnis "have to be given money to make their oil-poor region viable. The Constitution must be amended to guarantee Sunni areas 20 percent (approximately their proportion of the population) of all revenues."
Biden and Gelb also wrote that President Bush "must direct the military to design a plan for withdrawing and redeploying our troops from Iraq by 2008 (while providing for a small but effective residual force to combat terrorists and keep the neighbors honest)."
How are Biden and Gelb, two reputed political experts, so blatantly incompetent that they don't realize that a divided Iraq would create far more problems than what we see in the current situation?
At the very least, partitioning off the nation along ethnic lines would encourage even more balkanization, and the attendant Sunni vs. Shia fighting would almost certainly intensify instead of abating. This of course would trigger an almost certain exodus of refugees of minority populations from one region into another. Choas is the best result we could hope for in such a fouled design.
In addition, neither Biden nor Gelb touch upon the fact that such a division is likely to inflame an
already tense situation between Turkey and the Kurdish-controlled areas in the west, and Iran and the Kurdish region in the east. Both nations fear that a partitioned Kurdish region would be the trigger for Turkish and Iranian Kurds to fight to bring their regions in to a larger Kurdistan based in Iraq. Turkey has already made clear that they view an independent Kurdistan as a threat, and they have already made
cross-border attacks, as have the
Iranians.
Joseph Biden's idiotic attempt at ethnic segregation would expand Iraq's current sectarian violence into an almost certain regional conflict, encouraging both Turkey and Iran to invade. An invasion by either of these countries would almost certainly create situations where American military forces in the area might be forced into tense situations and possible open combat, either against our NATO ally which s bad enough, or potentially more seriously, a conflict that could easily flash into an ever-expanding, full-on conventional war with Iran.
Such a conflict could see thousands of U.S casualties and perhaps hundreds of U.S dead, but that isn't the worst of it. Coalition forces, with unquestionable air superiority, would send tens of thousands of Iranian conscripts to their graves in such a conflict as well. Through sheer stupidity, Joe Biden would create a situation potentially more deadly than all of the battles of the Iraq and Afghan wars so far,
combined.
Is Joe Biden the dumbest man in the United States Senate as Levin contends?
I'd hate to see who could top him.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
03:47 PM
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"Suppose you were an idiot and suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself."
- Mark Twain
“Washington is a stud farm for every jackass in the country.”
- Mark Twain
Pretty well sums it up...
Posted by: BobG at May 01, 2006 05:14 PM (tmbdH)
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As long as he is proposing what Bush is refusing to do it will be viewed as ingenious by certain elements of our society. Undermining Bush is all that matters to these people.
Posted by: Shoprat at May 01, 2006 05:51 PM (Nq8s6)
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I am not so sure it is quite that dumb (the idea, not Biden or Gelb), but it needs to be handled carefully and subtlely--not strong points with the current administration--I voted for Bush in 2000& 2004, donated the maximum to his campaign, and would do it again enthusiastically.
One of the problems of Seventeenth to early Twentith Century colonialism, as seen in Africa too, is the arbitrarily grouping of people who never got along to begin with into the same political entity. A Federal Iraq has a certain attractiveness. The Germans and Italians did it, after a bit of conflict, in the late Nineteenth Century, and in the case of the Germans they fought among Protestants and Catholics for a couple of hundred years, so different sects of the same religion who hated each other have done it before.
Heck, I live in Alabama, and we get more Federal funds than we pay in taxes, and, after 1865, neither we nor New York (a net loser) in the tax game have gone to war against each other, at least not physically.
I am sorry "Shoprat" but I have no desire to undermine Bush with these comments, but these guys have less imagination and flexibility than the engineering sophomores that I teach.
Posted by: Perfesser at May 01, 2006 06:29 PM (0Wzo3)
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Yes, actually Biden is the dumbest man in the Senate, but ol' Ricky Santorum is giving him a hell of a run for his money...
Posted by: Fred at May 01, 2006 06:30 PM (xX+1y)
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There would be a problem with who gets what area, There is already a problem with that and the country doesn't have actual division lines on a map. Control of the oil fields is controlling the wealth of the country and the different factions over ther don't exactly trust each other. In my opinion it would be close to segregation and unless there were a VERY good congress with strict oversight from all sects, it won't fly because of PERCEIVED injustices.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 02, 2006 05:12 AM (Mv/2X)
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Biden may indeed be the dumbest member of the US Senate, but he knows only from experience.
He's figuring that Iraq can't get any worse than another balkanized country - the former Yugoslavia, which split up into tiny little enclaves and engaged in sectarian violence because they couldn't get along under a central government. So, he's probably figuring that since we made things work out in the Balkans, why not Balkanize Iraq.
Posted by: lawhawk at May 02, 2006 02:36 PM (eppTH)
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Day of the Lamprey
In the United States today, organizers are touting what they call a "Day Without Immigrants." I'm sure real Americans such as Squanto, Manteo, Crazy Horse and Geronimo would support such a cause if they alive, but that is not what today is really about. No, this May Day—a communist/socialist holiday—is about something completely different.
This May Day protest is a celebration of the illegal importation of poverty, and an attempt to legitimize the violation of this nation's sovereignty. It is a blight on this nation's long history of accepting immigrants
legally from other nations with open arms, by those who seek to latch onto this nation's economy like a
lamprey, sucking dry social services meant for this nation's legitimate unfortunates, and artificially lowering wages so that legal Americans on the lower end of the economic scale cannot afford to live on what they bring home from work.
I spoke to a homebuilder yesterday who told me that without illegal labor, his cost per square foot for framing a home would nearly double. In other words, that means that because of an artificial depression of labor costs, legal Americans in this trade are getting far less in wages than they should. Want to take a guess who hurts the most in this arrangement?
Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton were busy this past weekend protesting the War in Iraq, but where have they been for poor blacks and other minorities that are seeing their wages undercut by illegal labor? For that matter, how many poor blacks and other minorities, including legal immigrants, would stay poor if entry level and trade-skill labor rates were what they should be?
So have a soft spot in your heart if you must for those illegals who overcrowd our schools, close our hospitals and fill our prisons. If you can read this, they are probably just a sympathetic cause you can choose to agree or disagree with without much of an impact to your daily life, and you can hardly blame them for wanting something better than they have in their own countries.
But that is not a legitimate excuse for the poverty they bring to this nation and perpetuate, adding 12 million poor and destitute to an overtaxed social support system, making it impossible for the system to raise up those who are here legitimately.
Chris Muir's
Day-by-Day said of the illegals protesting “We demand the American Dream!! Without the American part” and he was mostly right:
What Muir can't address in two panels is what these illegals are doing to the American Dream for hard-working
legal residents of this nation. Who cares about their needs and dreams? Apparently, they'll just fall through the cracks in Hell's Kitchen and Davenport and Bethlehem and Princeville, remaining at the bottom, never allowed a leg up, as we allow the poor of other nations to bury them alive.
* * *
I've often heard Republicans using analogy of fishing to describe the difference between them and Democrats.
Democrats, it is said, will give a hungry man a fish. That is great for today, but tomorrow, than man will be hungry again, and no closer to providing a meal for himself. Democrats will give him another fish, courtesy of the government, who took that fish from someone else. It is a vicious, unending cycle.
Republicans, instead, say they want to teach the man to fish, to be self-sufficient so that he can feed himself and his family not just that day, but in days to come.
But something falls apart when the lake or river all these people depend on is overrun with parasites that suck the life out of the fish...
Eventually, everybody starves.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
09:56 AM
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This was very well expressed. I have never seen the crazy nature of the arguments and politics of this situation. I you make these 12 million legal then they will have to be paid a normal wage. Which means they will be fired and another 12 million imported. The argument is that we can't criminalize 12 million people. Yet if 12 million people stopped paying taxes I would bet they could criminalize that action.
Posted by: David Caskey, MD at May 01, 2006 10:21 AM (6wTpy)
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What I am most curious about is the fact that the legal immigrants are protesting with the illegal aliens. So this is not about immigration this is about nationalism. This is not "A Day without Immigrants". When is the MSM going to stop calling ILLEGAL ALIENS Immigrants? An Immigrant is a person who immigrated to this country after they have applied, interviewed and had a physical screening and was granted a resident alien card "green card". Most of us welcome Immigrants everyday in this country. As I have posted at several different times that my spouse is an immigrant now U.S. Citizen. Currently has two sisters and a brother who are waiting for Visa's to immigrate. What gives an illegal alien the right to jump ahead of those who have complied with all the requirements and are patiently waiting for their turn. This is mostly Mexicans looking out for Mexicans. Its about assimilating America to become a Latin country. And our Government is helping them do it. I am Pissed off at our elected officials that are more worried about the Hispanic vote than about doing whats right. The hyperbol about "They do the jobs that others won't do" is total B.S. did anyone offer a legal immigrant or American citizen those jobs and pay them an honest wage? I think not.
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at May 01, 2006 12:24 PM (JSetw)
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FP I agree with you. The jobs that Americans will not accept are those that are offered at below minimum wage as it is illegal to work in that situation. Otherwise, I think the jobs would readily be taken. If I remember, it is our elected officials that established the minimum wage. I voted for Bush and have voted steadily Republican, yet this and similar activity recently are making me hopping mad. The only thing is the alternative vote is immediate socialism. At least with the Republicans it is taking longer.
Posted by: David Caskey, MD at May 01, 2006 01:24 PM (6wTpy)
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"It is a blight on this nation’s long history of accepting immigrants legally from other nations with open arms," apparently you've read nothing of the trials, tribulations, and discrimination almost every minority immigrant, from the Irish, and the Chinese, and Italian, to the story my own Grandfather told me of having rocks thrown at him and other newly arrived immigrants simply for being German.
Every time I read one of these dogmatic diatribes railing against the Hibernian hoards (beyond Gangs of New York references) I am stunned at the open ignorance and prejudice on display. There is no doubt these groups have an obligation to assimilate just as all our forefathers have. There is no doubt that the boarders should be more secure, and that we should know exactly who is coming in and out of our own country. But put blame where blame is due.
The reason these people are here is because our businesses and corporations want them here. It is the nature of the capitalist system to have to stay ahead of ever thinning profit margins buy trimming labor costs. If you can go lower than the other guy, lower than even minimum wage, you have a step ahead on the competition in the battle against economic natural selection.
Ask your homebuilder friend if the market would bare a house that cost twice as much as what it would with the use of immigrant labor. Sure, if you threw all the dirty foreigners out, there would be more jobs for the “Natives.” That is, until the market adjusted for increased manufacturing prices. Then the cycle starts. Increased prices, a downward trend in overall purchases. Less work, less overall pay, and less production. All that in a housing vacuum created by the deportation (or whatever craziness it is you guys are advocating this week) of 12 million immigrants. Go ahead throw them out. I for one will be amused to see the results.
P.S. Although co-opted by many different groups over the years, May Day is just another holiday, like Christmas, based on a Gaelic/Celtic astronomically based celebration.
Posted by: Fred at May 01, 2006 01:44 PM (dbo1X)
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Because the immigrants like to say this land is theirs anyway I would like to point out, Geronimo was at War with the Mexicans. Fighting the Mexican is where Geronimo became the great war Chief to his people. It was the Mexicans that were first to offer a bounty for scalps of Apache people. I can't speak for Geronimo but for all of the violence that the Mexicans inflicted on the Apache people I really can not see how he would be for any thing the Mexicans wanted.
Posted by: James R. Barnes at May 01, 2006 01:50 PM (bwVKf)
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Fred.
Many people have posted their disapproval about Illegal immigration. Part of the overall picture that has been mentioned time and time again was to place and enforce stiff fines against those who employ them. Allowing someone to break the law to get here and then protest loudly with walkouts, pickets, signs protesting the very country they are coming to for a better life is a huge slap in the face of those of us that live here and abide by the rules. It is also a slap in the face of those who have immigrated here the proper way, Legal way, with papers and everything. My grandparents did it the legal way, you know, the way the rules say you should. It took a little longer and they had to work a little harder but they got here LEGALLY.
I have no problems with those that come here the proper way. To allow those that broke the law to continue to cheat the system demeans us all.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 01, 2006 02:00 PM (elhVA)
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Fred, do you think for one second that the price for a house will increase when the illegal worker is forced to leave. What, are you out of your mind?
I have never heard of a builder lowering his price because he is saving on labor. That is total Liberal B.S. Not one builder is going to tell you to your face that he pocketed 60k on your 250k house. Get real. Illegals are a blight on our society. They take the jobs that Vocational Trade School graduates can't get because, why you ask? Because some illegal who lives 10 to 15 to a one room shack will do it for $5.00/hr. So save the whole immigrant can't get a job, my Grandad got rocks thrown at him. Probably because we were in the middle of WWI or II. They are not Immigrants they are Illegal aliens. They need to leave. If they want to come back apply and get in line with all the other folks that are doing it the right way. This whole let them stay flies in the face of all the non-bordering visa applicants that cant just walk across the border. Amnesty begets another hoard of illegals running for the border draining our social system.
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at May 01, 2006 02:16 PM (elhVA)
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Fred perhaps the problem is the welfare state we have. If the Mexicans wanted to come here illegally I could care less. The problem lies in the fact that I have to pay taxes to support them. When they are legalized they will have to be employed at normal wage. At that point they will be fired. Those companies that were hiring them at below normal wage witll then import another 12 million workeres. In the mean time I am stuck paying the welfare tab for the original 12 million. You do not have to pick up each of the illegals to get them out of here. Start enforcing the law on the employers and convict a handful of the illegals as felons. In short order we will have movement back across the border.
Posted by: David Caskey, MD at May 01, 2006 02:17 PM (6wTpy)
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With a builder like Toll Brothers running a P/E between 6 and 7, there's a LOT of room for them to "give a little" and still hold their prices.
Posted by: Purple Avenger at May 01, 2006 05:12 PM (qti15)
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Faithful Patriot,
Fred, do you think for one second that the price for a house will increase when the illegal worker is forced to leave.
Well, when I see, “I spoke to a homebuilder yesterday who told me that without illegal labor, his cost per square foot for framing a home would nearly double.” If you think hiring a crew being paid 100% of what they should be paid, instead of half working under the table at half rate wont effect the end cost, you don’t know much about business.
I have never heard of a builder lowering his price because he is saving on labor.
Me neither, nor did I suggest it.
Doc,
Fred perhaps the problem is the welfare state we have.
Perhaps it is.
Start enforcing the law on the employers and convict a handful of the illegals as felons. In short order we will have movement back across the border.
I agree 100%, still the problem lies with the corporations, not the illegals.
Posted by: Fred at May 01, 2006 07:32 PM (xX+1y)
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I gott a stick up for Fred on this one (Fred, get up. Fred?!?).
I've done my share of hammer swinging and wire-pulling personally (and badly) and know contractors and builders, and the price of labor increases, will necesarily be passed along to the consumer. That said, it won't double the cost of the home, either, becuase illegals don't do all the building, and in some places heavily represented by union labor, they might not do any at all.
I also agree with Fred if he is indeed suggesting that if folks wouldn't hire illegals, then they wouldn't be here. Make it financially unattractive for both employers of illegals and the illegals themselves, and they'll deport themselves back to Mexico if they find coming through legal channels is more attractive.
I'm not against immigration from Central and South America at all and respect their work eithic. I'd like to have them here working and contributing, but I demand that if you are going to come to my country, you must play by our rules, not those you decide to pick and choose from.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 01, 2006 07:58 PM (0fZB6)
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Re: picture.
Eeeeeeeuuuuuuwwwwwwghhhahhh!
Posted by: Amber at May 01, 2006 10:26 PM (5ruWe)
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Some of the work is attrocious. The illegals doing the sheetrock at the school I"m working on think nothing of ripping electrical boxes off the studs and/or shooting self-tappers into the mud rings (which penetrate the box, a distinct no-no) to hide their "modifications".
I've spent many hours repairing their damage.
Posted by: Purple Avenger at May 02, 2006 04:56 AM (qti15)
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I spoke to a homebuilder yesterday who told me that without illegal labor, his cost per square foot for framing a home would nearly double. In other words, that means that because of an artificial depression of labor costs, legal Americans in this trade are getting far less in wages than they should. Want to take a guess who hurts the most in this arrangement?
Of the things that the situation may be, I don't think it can be called "artificial"--indeed, it seems to me that it a very natural result of a pool of cheap labor coupled with the demand for them.
And certainly it is a mixed result: it also leads to cheaper houses, which is a benefit millions of Americans.
Posted by: Steven Taylor at May 02, 2006 08:50 AM (ghvaM)
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I spoke to a homebuilder yesterday who told me that without illegal labor, his cost per square foot for framing a home would nearly double. In other words, that means that because of an artificial depression of labor costs, legal Americans in this trade are getting far less in wages than they should. Want to take a guess who hurts the most in this arrangement?
Yes, it is a very natural result of a pool of cheap labour ... but at the same time it also is very much is artificial, in the sense that it feeds on the concepts of monetary wealth and (living) value having been disconnected. For this is a much broader issue than only that of which parts of a local economy are driven by immigrants, illegal or otherwise (and how to deal with a hidden reality). Underlying the whole thing is the concept that above all else a business should be competitive: but defining "competitive" increasingly and even only in the sense of producing high dividends ... regardless of whether those dividends happen to connect with anything of substance (aka Enron).
Ironically, simply by introducing shorter paths between supply-demand, whether or not those paths involved (illegal) immigrant labour: net costs to both supplier and customer would actually be lower, and it is not impossible that labour wages might rise as a side-consequence. (Check out the in-post link to the article on Katrina contracts: and note that it was neither labour nor the suppliers/contractors who most benefited.)
Posted by: Tenebris at May 04, 2006 11:48 AM (IJY2j)
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Do you think every builder hires illegal laborors?
So the premise of cheap labor cost = lower home prices does not equate. What you are saying is that a builder who uses skilled U.S. labor can't stay in business. I said it once I will say it again, "Not one single builder gives you an estimate on the cost of building a home based on a $5.00/hr. labor rate. The consumer is paying full skilled labor prices. What is happening is you would be cutting down on his profit margin.
That breeds competition! That would put them on an equal playing field.
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at May 05, 2006 06:25 AM (elhVA)
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G.K.Chesterton noted that in capitalism there is a logical contradiction. It subsists in the concept of an employer seeking to increase profits by paying as little for labor as possible.
The eventual result of this system is a populace that cannot afford to pay for the products its companies produce.
When this happens, the employers must seek cheaper labor markets (and cheaper materials) elsewhere.
In America's recent past (post WWII) that has meant seeking foreign sources for both.
With illegal aliens American businesses have not only imported the cheap materials, but the cheap labor.
Ergo, America is faced with the sorry fruit of the contradiction when you have most of the power (in a capitalist society read: monetary wealth) in the hands of the few.
The only way this can be changed is a redistribution of wealth, but not as a government mandate, but as a process of consumer action.
The solution:
Buy LOCAL and support the small owner as opposed to the Mega corporations.
It is local action of local peoples to support their neighbors, not governmen action or legislation t, that is needed to make the needed change.
Do it and see America transformed from within.
Posted by: Tom Ridenour at May 11, 2006 02:32 AM (OvTsl)
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April 29, 2006
Show Me How
It's everywhere you turn this evening on the mainstream new sites. Fox. CBS. CNN:
Tens of thousands of anti-war protesters marched Saturday through Manhattan to demand an immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq just hours after an American soldier died in a roadside explosion in Baghdad -- the 70th U.S. fighter killed in that country this month.
"End this war, bring the troops home," read one of the many signs lifted by marchers on a sunny afternoon three years after the war in Iraq began. The mother of a Marine killed two years ago in Iraq held a picture of her son, born in 1984 and killed 20 years later.
Cindy Sheehan, a vociferous critic of the war whose 24-year-old soldier son also died in Iraq, joined in the march, as did actress Susan Sarandon and the Rev. Jesse Jackson. One group marched under the banner "Veterans for Peace," while other marchers came from as far off as Maryland and Vermont.
You know what? I want this war over, too.
I want all the fighting to stop, for our troops to come home. I want to never again fear the sound of jet engines carried upon the wind under bright blue skies. I want to never again turn on the news to see that a suicide bomber in an Tel Aviv or Bali or London or Poughkeepsie made widows and widowers and orphans for his bloodthirsty god. I want to be able to do without these concerns.
Show me how.

Show me how to stop bin Laden's planes and Zarqawi's swords with Peace and Love and warm squishy visions of Equality and Justice. Show me how a hug can stop an IED. Explain how constantly apologizing for simply being
who I am will stop their lust for killing me for simply wanting to
exist.
Please do that. Find a solution. Go beyond your recycled rhetoric and show me how to co-exist with those who will murder the whole world for their thuggish god.
But that would be too hard, and it isn't really your goal, is it? You exist to complain, not resolve. Resolving is so...
messy.
You can't bring your cute
three year-old daughter to solve the real problems of the world. You can't even acknowledge the world is not a Benneton ad. There are people who want to murder that cute little girl simply because she is an American. Simply because she is a Christian, or a Jew, or a Wiccan. Simply because she wants to go to school, or chose her own fate, or grow up to think for herself, and not bend to their god's rigid dictums of what he says she must
do and
be and
say.
So please, show me how wandering down well-guarded streets on a nice spring day wearing
cake make-up, chanting and waving a fan, will keep planes from shattering glass and steel and bodies. Show me how your leisurely stroll stops Next Time from happening. Do that, and I'll be found waving the largest "Bush=Hitler" sign at the very next rally.
But that isn't how the world works is it?
Predator and prey relationships, the most basic of interactions in nature, are something that the followers of the Church of Darwin refuse to acknowledge could apply to themselves.
Show me how to reason with a zealot. In the split-second as his thumb drops on the plunger to detonate the bomb on his belt packed with hundreds of ball bearings, negotiate with him,
infidel.
I'm waiting.
Show me how to stop Darwin. Show me how to stop their bloodlust.
Show me that your "peace and justice" aren't empty words muttered by empty heads. Show me how capitulation to their plans for world domination will stop the killing instead of intensify it.
Please.
I'm waiting.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
10:24 PM
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Quite possibly your best post yet...
Posted by: WB at April 29, 2006 11:35 PM (q0RxQ)
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I agree. Excellent post.
Posted by: Atticus_NC at April 30, 2006 04:11 AM (3lxJi)
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Please close the italics.
And I'm really ticked off that people in NYC do not get that "Peace, Love, and Understanding" only works with some people, and it generally doesn't work with people trying to kill you. The other option they seem to be going for is appeasement, which has =always= worked out so well in history. You don't even have to go that far back in history to check out the track record of appeasement.
I thought these were supposed to be the "educated" people, better than we hoi polloi who want to kill others before they kill us.
Posted by: meep at April 30, 2006 05:50 AM (GqHvA)
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Excellent post. I could not agree more.
Posted by: Pete at April 30, 2006 07:09 AM (1aBIT)
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CY, you're asking too much of the mindless followers.
That said, this is one great post! Thanks for articulating so well the thoughts and feelings of so many of us. Keep up the great work!
Posted by: Old Soldier at April 30, 2006 08:06 AM (owAN1)
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Bravo, Bob, Bravo!!!!!
But you wil NEVER, EVER, recieve and actual answer from the Defeatocrats. And they will never like any answer from the GOP.
Posted by: William Teach at April 30, 2006 09:16 AM (doAuV)
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Good article, but I'm not sure I get the Church of Darwin thing. I accept evolution on the (overwhelming) evidence, I don't believe it on faith. Meanwhile, there are lots of left-wing New Age moonbats who don't accept evolution. And there are Evangelical Christians who do.
So saying that the whole "antiwar" movement is made up of "Darwin followers" who are denying that evolutionary principles can still apply to relations between different groups of human beings doesn't make much sense.
I don't "follow" Darwin, any more than I "follow" the originator of any proven scientific theory. In the end, WHO originated a scientific hypothesis is meaningless ... all that matters is, is the hypothesis supported by the evidence? The evolutionary hypothesis IS overwhelmingly supported by hard scientific evidence ... therefore, it is now a scientific THEORY, like the THEORY of Relativity, or the THEORY of gravity. (Theory, in scientific parlance, is not a "guess.")
Now, I will admit that quite a few folks in the "antiwar" camp appear to be secularists, atheists, Darwinists, what have you. I can't really explain this because I haven't done any research on it. It doesn't make much sense to me, since while quite a few Christians are hostile to atheists and "evolutionists," the overwhelming majority of Christians accept that atheists and evolutionists are equal under the law, have the same rights to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" as all Americans, and are free to believe or not believe as they wish. Whereas the Muslim aggressors who seek to bring the entire world under the control of a global Caliphate will kill atheists and evolutionists given half a chance, and will certainly not consider them "equal under Shari'a law."
On the other hand, some of the loudest and bravest voices speaking out on the "Cartoon Jihad" have been the Objectivists, students of Ayn Rand, who was an atheist and an evolutionist.
Bottom line ... it just doesn't make much sense to characterize the Moonbat Masses as "followers of Darwin" or assume that characterizing them as such makes much sense even to THEM. I doubt many of them really think that much about atheism, or evolution, or its implications for their antiwar philosophy.
Posted by: Gregg at April 30, 2006 09:28 AM (W6cG4)
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I grew up on the streets of Bensonhurst and was inculcated with the belief that street smarts were the best smarts and that they made New Yorkers the most reality aware people in the world. I haven't lived in New York for fifty years but held strong to this belief until New York City went for Hilary. What's happened to the acceptance of "no crap" from the City? Why those people who wouldn't stand for the BS now thrown at them have left in droves, just because they wouldn't stand for it. And so the likes of the media whores, Jackson, Sharpton, and the despicable Sindy (dancer on her sons grave for the MSM)get away with prancing and preening before the cameras, whereas many years ago they woud have been laughed off the streets.
Posted by: stats at April 30, 2006 09:44 AM (yVFmT)
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Greg, with all due respect, you have missed the entire point of Bob's post, while focussing strictly on minutia. Plus, you didn't show that you understood the actual reference.
Posted by: William Teach at April 30, 2006 09:45 AM (doAuV)
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Found this post via a link from Michelle Malkin...really very thought-provoking and actually puts into words what my mind screams every time I see this people. Until now, though, I had only been able to sense a howling inside my mind, or a loud buzzing noise, no words & certainly no words as perfect as these.

Thanks for putting this into words so I can watch the news without all the buzzing.

Posted by: Melinda at April 30, 2006 10:25 AM (mMRvT)
11
I also found this post via Michelle Malkin. Very very moving, like a poem. The protesters are a useless worthless pack of fools being led by a den of snakes.
Posted by: Len at April 30, 2006 11:21 AM (VrQh7)
12
I think that sign says it all. They are so deranged that they side with OBL. In New York, no less! Protesting is just the fashion trend du jour. They don't care about the troops at all. Please - look at the punks who vandalize the recruitment offices around the country and the UC Santa Cruz punks that violently threatened the recruiters off of their campus. I have no doubt that they clap and cheer every time a soldier gets killed. This is strictly about their trying to feel relevant or important in their otherwise meaningless and contribution-less lives. What does marching around holding a sign do? Who does that help? Do these people ever volunteer where it really counts? Think of what they could do if they each gave just $10 to a homeless shelter or soup kitchen or if they all got together and volunteered their time... clearly it's not about helping people - it's about getting their picture seen somewhere so they can clip it out, put it into their scrapbooks and say, "Look kids! See? Wasn't I cool? I marched against the Iraq war!"
Whenever some old 60's ex-hippie ever bragged to me about their "protests" of Viet Nam, I practically threw up in their face.
Posted by: RR at April 30, 2006 11:54 AM (4nexs)
13
Couldn't have made the point/asked the question in a better way.
The fatuousness of all this protesting makes sense only when you realize it's not about the war and it's not about the Iraqis, it's about the protesters feeling good about themselves.
Dissent for it's own sake is a way of making it look like you're a caring, selfless individual without doing a damn thing. Being against something means nothing unless you're for something else, meaning a viable alternative.
The sad fact is these people aren't interested in answering your questions, and have no intention of making a serious attempt. They're far too caught up in their own moral preening to get their hands dirty, or even support those who really are.
Posted by: MSD at April 30, 2006 02:29 PM (tHqp5)
14
So... to this blog, the cries of the protestors are hollow, and to them, the cries of certain right-wingers are hollow (that includes this post). Some dilemma... considering how many books have been published in their favor, as opposed to those that favor this blog's point of view.
It is quite amazing to see how reactionary the right is about one day of protesting out of a year. FYI, most of the liberals mentioned, do donate and volunteer.
Posted by: D at April 30, 2006 02:45 PM (WmvJl)
15
Mother Betty Mazur must be so proud of her daughter carrying a Bin Laden image to catch the eye of roaming photographers. This Fonda-esque vision, carried sweet Betty back to her younger days when sideburns were long, long dirty hair was the rage and Dan Rather did his prevarication from Viet Nam. During the days of flower power Betty turned many a head with her snappy beret and clenched fist above her head. Aaaah, such sweet memories of tear gas in the air.......
I wonder how both mother and daughter will react to wearing a burqua once their dream of idyllic Dhimmitude is realized. The very thought of a Taliban Panther aiming an AK-47 at the head of an outspoken woman must make this mother daughter duo smile!
Posted by: Duxx at April 30, 2006 02:58 PM (g3r7a)
16
The left wing idiots try to destroy every institution and idea that this country was founded and flourished on for over 200 years. They give no thought to the future, and what they are letting their own children/grandchildren in for. They are as filled with hate as any of the so called members of the religion of peace (actually a group of murderer's worse than Hitler). Eventually their hate will destroy them and their families if it hasn't already. I don't see a happy person on the left. What a shame they have reduced themselves to the level of slime.
Posted by: Scrapiron at April 30, 2006 03:50 PM (wZLWV)
17
Your rhetoric is unimpressive. The entire post presupposes the burden of proof is on the pacifists and that war will actually accomplish the goals you deride pacifism as being unable to achieve.
In the history of man, war begets war. Maybe a hug will not stop a suicide bomber, but a warhead may create ten more.
The history of Christian pacifism shows actual results, in contrast to the history of just war. The Roman Empire became Christian not through a battle, but by the blood of the martyrs. During the Protestant Reformation, Catholics killed Protestants and Protestants killed Catholics as countries and regions warred against one another. But one thing they held in common, they both killed the anabaptists... who were pacifists and did not kill any one. Today, evangelical churches most closely resemble the anabaptists. There was something compelling about their nonviolent faith. Today, they would be derided for not fighting back, as would the martyrs of the early church.
So you want to be shown how pacifism can stop the horrors of terrorism and strife in the middle east? Why don't you show how the war in Iraq has accomplished any of those things? Why don't you show how the U.S. military involvement has changed the bloody landscape of our day?
While I cannot prove that pacifism can always achieve the toppling of an empire, neither can you prove that it will not do so again. What can be proved? It can be effectively shown that war begets war and new soldiers are created from the battles waged, whether the cause be noble or not.
Posted by: Alan Hartung at April 30, 2006 04:17 PM (D/im4)
18
Alan, I believe there is a Protest Warrior shirt that addresses your particular question.
It begins "War never solved anything. . . ."
Posted by: Kustie the Klown at April 30, 2006 04:51 PM (pUZ4U)
19
Wow. Alan's drunk a LOT of Kook-Aid.
Alan, First, you must PROVE that we are creating many more terrorists than we are killing. You provide no proof, and without it most of your argument falls apart.
In any case, pacifism only works when the enemy one is, well, not fighting actually cares if you live. The opponent must have at least some standards of decency or morals. Failing that, the pacifists end up in a mass grave. Do you somehow imagine that pacifism would have stopped Nazi Germany? The Soviets? The Mongols?
When your opponent wants you DEAD, pacifism just makes the job easy. If you want to sacrifice your life that way, knock yourself out. Me, I'd rather fight back against these barbarians.
Posted by: Evil Otto at April 30, 2006 04:52 PM (fcCt3)
Posted by: Evil Otto at April 30, 2006 04:53 PM (fcCt3)
21
Never mind.
Oh, and I meant to write "Kool-Aid" above. I guess "Kook-Aid" works too.
Posted by: Evil Otto at April 30, 2006 05:03 PM (fcCt3)
22
Damn! Great post. You nailed it.
Posted by: navypilot at April 30, 2006 05:50 PM (y6n8O)
Posted by: Ralph L.Bougher at April 30, 2006 07:57 PM (FaUdS)
24
Great post and there is now way any pacifist or democrat can show us how to accomplish this feat. It is a double edge sword isn't it. If we all of the sudden cave into the cindy shebitch theory and proclaim "enough" we bring all of our troops home.
2 years tops we get a nuke or bio weapon in the states. The first thing that will come out of their pie hole is "Why didn't we do something before this happened?"
Cant live with em, cant heard em like cattle into Mexico.
Posted by: Robert at April 30, 2006 09:50 PM (KNoit)
Posted by: johnny_yuma at April 30, 2006 10:03 PM (Jnsk3)
26
The insurgency in Iraq is a case in point. Do you think that all of these persons would be involved in the civilian bombing attacks were it not for the war? I thought removing Saddam was supposed to free all of the oppressed Iraqi people?
Pacifism must concede the possibility of becoming a martyr, or it fails. I have no doubt most of the antiwar protesters would not live up to such a costly standard. History does not show that those who are willing to lay down their lives for the sake of peace are simply letting the oppressors win.
Did the Romans continue killing the pacifists of the early Christian era for all time? No. The sacrificial lives of the martyrs led to the Roman Empire actually becoming Christian. It was not until the Christians advocated just war that the empire then fell apart.
The pacifists of the 1500s not only survived the wars of the Reformation, but the fastest growing wing of the Church today (evangelicals) advocate the practices and more closely resemble the theology of the Anabaptists (those killed by both Protestant and Catholic but who did not fight back) than the other Reformers.
Be clear that you are advocating more killing in response to killing, and you believe the new killing will somehow stop future killing. You can couch it in whatever terms make you feel better about your position, but in ten or twenty years if your killing produces nothing but more killing will you feel even a tinge of remorse? Probably not, because you will not even consider the possibility that nonviolence can somehow triumph over the violent. You will simply believe your way was the only way, probably as you are supporting another war in another time, another war in which you will hope the killing will somehow reverse a trend through human history and that this time, somehow this time, the killing will stop future killing. It will not work in this war nor in the next or the one after that. But rest easy, because you can mock those who would advocate another way.
And a greater issue with this particular war is that one need not be a pacifist to see the multiple mistakes by an incompetent administration. You want to go to war to stop the Nazis... that's an entirely different situation than what we have. If we were truly waging war because of how a regime is acting towards its populace, then we would be in Darfur. There are degrees to pacifism, and some would say war can sometimes be acceptable but that in this case, in Iraq, we are waging a war which will yield disastrous consequences.
You can say prove it all you want. It does not change the fact that at best, the war will not eradicate terrorism (and it's a farce to say the war was originally about terrorism in the first place since al qaeda did not have ties to iraq prior to the war). The war will not succeed in answering any of the questions the author of this posts directs to pacifists and others who oppose this war but may not be pacifists. It is merely empty rhetoric for those who support the war to cheer on under the guise of having intellectual merit. It is neither profound nor poignant. Simply, this post is a weak attempt to paint pacifists as intellectually bankrupt. But when the rhetoric fails so miserably, it shows whose mental bank account is lacking funds.
Posted by: Alan Hartung at April 30, 2006 10:06 PM (D/im4)
27
Alan, I have but one simple question: how has pacifism faced up against Islam, at any point in history?
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at April 30, 2006 10:12 PM (0fZB6)
28
Allan,
I am sure your "Current Affairs 101" Prof. will be very pleased with your posts, but in the real world you suffer from a number of logical flaws.
Most importantly of which is you fail to distinguish between your assumptions and an actual fact.
Secondarily and nearly as important is the assumption that your opponent has the same set of assumptions that you do.
If you wish to become a martyr, that is up to you.... in fact I would guess we could take up a collection and get you a ticket to Iraq..... but I'd rather fight the bastards than hide behind the US military (which is what you are doing).....
Edward
Ex-Physics Professor
Posted by: Edward at April 30, 2006 10:23 PM (utYqu)
29
Confederate Yankee -
How has war fared against Islam, in any point in history?
It is as fair a question as you asked me.
Edward -
If you want to enter into an argument about logic, you need to do more than just claim flaws. You may consider actually writing some substance with your accusations.
And the argument about hiding behind the military is hollow. I am very aware that I have a position of privilege because of the American military and being a U.S. citizen. But you use the fact as if it means we can't hold a contrary position simply because we have a powerful military. It certainly makes it easier to be a pacifist when your life is not in imminent danger, but simply stating that fact and saying we're hiding behind the military because of it lacks substance. The only thing you can prove is that my pacifism is largely untested. And I do concede that point.
Posted by: Alan Hartung at April 30, 2006 11:35 PM (D/im4)
Posted by: ben at May 01, 2006 02:25 AM (Rve1a)
Posted by: Komplex at May 01, 2006 03:11 AM (Tq372)
32
I think ya'll are being a bit stubborn in discussing the issue. I mean what's wrong with advocating pacifism until its absolutely necessary to go to war? Let me explain in terms of Iraq: Do I think we should have gone to war? In retrospect with regards to Iraq... no, I don't. Do I think we should leave Iraq... no, I don't. Leaving Iraq now would just make the whole thing worse in my opinion.
Posted by: Ryan at May 01, 2006 04:16 AM (BQ4FO)
33
Same thing at the Save Darfur rally in DC.
Posted by: Yehudit at May 01, 2006 04:54 AM (Q8+IG)
34
"How has war fared against Islam, in any point in history?"
. . . . to the shores of Tripoli . . .
We ended white slavery, put a dent in black slavery, pushed the Muslims out of Europe several times . . . war works. The problem is they keep pushing.
Posted by: Yehudit at May 01, 2006 04:56 AM (Q8+IG)
35
Allen, the last great Peacful Man was Ghandi, if I am not mistaken he was a Pacifist and he was killed by a Muslim. What you are not getting thru your "Liberal lets all hold hands and sing we are the world" college ed. is the PACIFIST WERE KILLED... They are dead... there still dead... I for one would rather go out fighting trying to keep my family alive than just stand by and be slaughtered. What the MSM and most college professors want to pump out is not what is going on over there. We are doing pretty well, kids are in school and women have a voice in Gov't. What you see on the news is the Hollywood version, ratings hype.. When they get to a million or two civilians killed, then they can say we are more evil than Saddam. I will gladly buy you a ticket to the Middle East so you can join the Pacifist crowd. Remember the christian Peace group. Didn't work out so well for them..Did it!!!
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at May 01, 2006 07:48 AM (nFSnk)
36
Awesome... great post Bob. Clear, passionate and purposeful. Can't get much better than that. Thanks.
Posted by: Chris at May 01, 2006 08:21 AM (tjuMq)
37
Alan, you have forfeited any authority to speak about any issue by pushing the same old liberal theme of "al qaeda did not have ties to iraq prior to the war". Ties have been proven time and again. Further, documents are being translated every day that prove these ties. As long as you and liberals like you refuse to be honest about the facts, you can never expect, let alone march around and demand, that anyone take you seriously.
Posted by: D-Hoggs at May 01, 2006 10:43 AM (4tYXp)
38
Faithful Patriot -
Many more Iraqi civilians have been killed than died in the 9/11 attacks. In fact, more Americans have now been killed in Iraq than died in 9/11. The Christian Peacemaker Teams have done an incredible work, and they were working before the war in Iraq. They have lost an incredibly small number of persons in proportion to the good they have done. You seem to want to count lives lost due to pacifism ten-fold, because they did not have a gun in their hands. They died without being able or willing to strike back.
D-Hoggs -
Then I guess you forfeit any right to talk about the issue by believing the conservative propaganda machine manufacturing ties to Iraq. You probably even believe there actually were wmd's, even though the Bush administration has admitted that intelligence was faulty. It's been admitted, yet I still hear constantly from conservatives that they really had them... Beyond the ones we sold to them before Saddam fell out of grace with the U.S. (remember we installed him as the leader over there), they did not have the facilities we were led to believe they had. They did not have the weapons we were led to believe they had. Basically the majority of the reasons we were given for going into Iraq was based on faulty intelligence.
This administration has no problem lying to the American public as long as they believe they're really doing the right thing. A case in point is the wiretaps. Whether it is illegal or not, which I'm sure many of you here have no problem signing off your civil rights and trusting this administration, he did lie about it. In 2004, while bolstering support for the Patriot Act renewal, Bush clearly stated that "when we're talking about chasing down terrorists, we're talking about getting a court order to do so... constitutional guarantees are in place, because we value the constitution." The president, flat out lying about wiretaps. You can watch the whole thing here: http://www.alanhartung.com/blog/index.php/2006/02/09/nothing-has-changed-we-value-the-constitution/
That was two years after they have admitted starting the NSA program of warrantless wiretapping. Whether you think it's illegal or not, this is Bush lying about his controversial program. And not only is he lying about it, he's lying about it in the context of bolstering support for legislation. This is appalling, and if it had been done by a democrat, conservatives would not let this go until impeachment. One president lies about moral infidelity (and for the record I thought Clinton's lies under oath was an impeachable offense), and one lies about a potentially (and very likely) illegal program wiretapping American citizens. What's really worse for a president to do? Come on, people.
I am not a democrat. I'm still a registered Republican, because I couldn't take the hypocrisy any more. I once believed the rhetoric about the liberal propaganda machine. Wake up! Business controls our media. If the liberal slant was really as powerful as suggested by the right-wing believe anything Bush says crowd, Bush would be impeached. He's committed the acts. The American public doesn't know about much of it. Even with the President's abysmally low ratings and important mid-term elections about to happen, the media is leaving many damaging issues to the President alone.
Posted by: Alan Hartung at May 01, 2006 12:09 PM (D/im4)
39
And everyone, I've talked mostly about pacifism in regards to the antiwar movement in this country, but the truth is most of the antiwar protesters are not pacifists. They are citizens who believe there are times for war, but they do not believe this to be a just war. This war is wrong in particular. The U.S. will not win this war in any tangible sense. When we are gone, they will elect a government hostile to the U.S. within the first decade of our being gone. We have wasted valuable resources, both human and military, which have weakened our nation. Soon, there will be military action in Iran further limiting our ability to act in other parts of the world. The number of Sudanese killed, raped, and tortured, exceeds the number of those Saddam's being accused of (you can look the numbers up, and please do so before accusing me of liberal rhetoric). But we are not there? Why? This administration is not interested in shifting the focus of the war in Iraq and the potential war in Iran.
People are disgusted with this war not because of liberal propaganda, but in spite of the lack of reporting on many of the details from the intelligence and decisions prior to the war. You don't have to be a pacifist to see that this war is not good for the United States and has created an environment in Iraq less stable than prior to the war. As awful and terrible as Saddam was while in power, what has replaced him in Iraq?
Posted by: Alan Hartung at May 01, 2006 12:16 PM (D/im4)
40
Pardon me, Alan, if I need something a bit more concrete than links to your site as evidence of anything.
You have thus far refused to answer what pacifism has bought in the fact if Islam, and you instead desperately seek to change to subject. If I were you, I would as well. Pacifists only by a grave in the fact of Islam, just as have those who have been to week to counter it. Did you know that Islam is the only religion so bloody that it named a landform after its greatest genocide? The mountain range than runs through Afghanistan and Pakistan is called the Hindu Kush. It comes the invader’s word “kushar” which means slaughter or kill. Think about that the next time you look at a map, and while you are looking at that map, look at the fires on the edges of Islamic territory. Everywhere Islam touches there is war, and that has been a constant for almost the entire 1,400 year history of the religion. There is only Dar al Islam and Dar al Harb, which translated are the house of submission and the house of war.
And what has war against Dar al Islam bought us? The Renaissance. Equal rights. Opera. A man on the moon. Virtually every modern communication and convenience at your fingertips today is due to the fact that a Pole stood strong outside the gates of Vienna in 1683. In all likelihood, if Jan III Sobieski had not stood firm on 12 September, you would be vehemently calling for jihad against the infidel right now with the same degree of misguided, misinformed passion.
As for WMDs, I’m simply relate you to Ray Robinson, formerly of the Iraq Survey Group of the Defense Intelligence Agency. He saw captured Iraqi documents as they were captured and catalogued, and is one of many currently having these documents translated and explained. At the very least, we’ve found that Bush didn’t lie as much as Saddam lied to him and everyone else. You seem almost eager to discount that George Tenet said that Iraq’s WMDs were a ”slam dunk” and that Saddam had used such weapons, and did his best to make it look like he still maintained them.
As for the NSA, you are in well over your head. IT is not illegal nor wiretapping, nor targeting American citizens. Career lawyers (meaning they were here before Bush, and will be there long after) at the NSA and Justice Department, so far the only lawyers to have seen the Bush Executive Order (instead of Glenn Greenwald simply and erroneously guessing at what they might contain), cleared it as being legal. The FISA Court of Review in IN RE Sealed Case (2002), and those current FISA judges who stated that the President was acting within his authority, at which the media largely lost interest in the story.
In Darfur, depending on who you want to cite, more than 100,000 up to a half million have been killed or displaced. Saddam was responsible for the Iran-Iraq was which killed and estimated 800,000-1 million all total, was responsible for the 1991 Gulf war which killed tens of thousands more, forced his nation into sanctions that some say resulted in more than a few hundred thousand people dying, not to mention the 100,000-400,000 he is accused of killing in his own country. Saddam’s “peace” was so brutal that fewer civilians have died on average each year under our war, and you are welcome to look that up, as well.
State-sponsored Islamic terrorism is something that has to be tamped out, state by state. Geographically, it ran on a constant, unbroken arc from Lebanon through Syria into Iran and terminating in Iran, with Lybia and Sudan thrown in for good measure. The arc is now shattered, with Afghanistan and Iraq isolating Iran and Syria, and Syrian support in Lebanon wavering. When Iran collapses (and it may of its own accord), Syria will fall, having few resources of its won. The state sponsorship of Islamic terror could be toppled across the Middle East for fewer lives than we lost in single days in prior wars, and you consider that a failure?
You would promote the stability of domestic terrorism, torture, gang rape and genocide in Iraq under a “stable” Saddam-led dictatorship that ended more than a 1.5 million lives, instead of allowing the Iraqi people even a chance to be free. You sicken me.
Be gone from my site, and do not darken it again.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 01, 2006 01:26 PM (g5Nba)
41
Wow! What an open minded group of people!
Posted by: Brian Smith at May 01, 2006 04:56 PM (DCLM1)
42
Seems like you are not very interested in a conversation. I guess shutting down the other side by banning them is appropriate to your camp.
Posted by: Shifter at May 01, 2006 05:56 PM (WHPU3)
43
Well, golly gee, Brian, I didn't know that being "open minded' meant we had to unquestioningly accept ever horseshit argument that came down the pipeline.
Posted by: Evil Otto at May 01, 2006 07:42 PM (fcCt3)
44
Brian, Shifter:
I am more than willing to have a rational discussion, but I'm not going to listen to a Saddam apologist trying to tell me things were better under Hussein's rule for anyone other than Sunnni Baathists.
Nor am I going to listen to a petulent child tell me war has never solved anything, when for better or ill, it is among the most drastic and sudden of agents of change.
Nor am I going to long suffer his ducking of legitimate counter-questions, his refusal to provide support for the majority of his bold statements, etc.
He came to preach, not have a legitimate back-and forth. But yeah, apologizing for Saddam regime by implying we've done nothing better... that was the final straw.
It is my site, and no there are certain things I won't tolerate.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 01, 2006 07:46 PM (0fZB6)
45
Otto:
Keep it PG, please.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 01, 2006 07:47 PM (0fZB6)
46
Sorry, CY. Horsepoop? ;-)
Anyway, I didn't want to eat up your blog's bandwidth or space, so I've fisked part of Alan's comments on my blog.
Posted by: Evil Otto at May 01, 2006 08:13 PM (fcCt3)
47
Interesting perspective. I appreciated Alan's addition to the conversation. However, when I just learned he was banned from commenting here. Can I ask why?
Jamie
Posted by: Jamie Arpin-Ricci at May 01, 2006 10:00 PM (MJviu)
48
Addressed above, Jamie.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 01, 2006 10:09 PM (0fZB6)
49
Ok, but this whole post relies on the idea that somehow a war in Iraq is effective againt domestic terrorism - which is a patently fallacious assumption. Show me how toppling a relatively stable and secular - if bloodthirsty and detestable dictatorship keeps "next time" from happening? Oh, wait, that was accepted prima facie, sorry, I'm not being patriotic.
Posted by: Alex at May 02, 2006 12:00 AM (FtAqW)
50
What the "Lets just give them a big hug" crowd do not understand or refuse to aknowledge is, that most Iraqi civillians are being killed by their own people and by insurgents. Now before the "It wouldn't be like that if we had not invaded" group jumps on the bandwagon. Saddam was killing his own people by the thousands or tens of thousands. He was a direct threat to the security of this nation. He has and even boasted about funding Islamic terrorist. Providing money to the families of suicide bombers. Alex, I would rather kill them there than try to track them down after they destroy an American city. There is absolutely no way to 100% secure this nation, it is too large and every time we get tough, groups like the ACLU and Arab American groups claim racial profiling or this waiting and sreening process is just to damn hard and I should not have to be inconvienced. Now the left wants to make all the illegal aliens U.S. citizens. Remember this, any religion that advocates the killing of innocent people, advocates and awards suicide attacks and the total domination of the world under one religion should be delt with. Again, obviously you have seen the destruction and bloodshed on TV wait till you see it up close then you will realize that its better to take it to them than set and wait.
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at May 02, 2006 07:20 AM (elhVA)
51
Did we have a problem with Saddam while he was killing people? I remember Donald Rumsfeld shaking his hand.
http://www.msamilwaukee.com/handshake300.jpg
Sure Saddam Is/Was Evil but you have to realize that this war has turned Iraq into chaos. They are in a civil war. Think about the family of a child that gets hit by a stray bullet or bomb. Do you think the mothers and fathers are going to say "hey this was all for a good cause" or are they going to want revenge and take up arms against our troops? We are creating more terrorists.
Posted by: Frank at May 02, 2006 09:35 AM (UnBie)
52
Frank, do you suffer from glaucoma? Is the treatment working? Lets think for a moment, if they don't shoot at us, we won't shoot back!
What about all the innocent men, women and children in this country? You and your fellow glaucoma suffer's need to start being more concerned about is our wellbeing more than what some jihadist thinks. Iraqi insurgents are killing civillians 100 time more than a stray U.S. bullit or arrant bomb strike.
Posted by: Faithful Patriot at May 02, 2006 10:31 AM (elhVA)
53
Some of us beleivers in Evolution (followers of Darwin?) are also believers in driving back and defeating the Jihad, and the philosophical sewer from which it crawled up.
And some of us believers in Evolution have no problem believing in Evolution AND God. It's not a fair either/or choice. After all, do you believe that bread comes into existence through scientific principles, or do you believe all that stuff about heat, carbon dioxide, moisture and yeast is a bunch of hooey, because bread is made by Bakers?
Posted by: Ben at May 02, 2006 07:29 PM (du794)
54
To answer Evil Otto's comment, being open minded does not mean you have to accept every argument that comes down the pipeline. But to shut down someone who was making a coherent argument that has at least arguable validity is not impressive, IMHO.
The situation in Iraq is complex. The war (thus far) certainly has not led to a more stable situation for the common Iraqi and I don't see how it's improved my security at all. To discuss possible alternatives is reasonable. I didn't see Alan making a blanket argument that pacificism is always the way to go, just that war hasn't solved all of the problems that we supposedly went to Iraq to solve.
Posted by: Brian Smith at May 02, 2006 07:31 PM (DCLM1)
55
Alan, you want to know why we are not in Sudan?
There's an old American saying, heard a million times a day throughout this land, and it goes like this:
"Please Stay on the Line. Your Call is important to us, and will be answered in the order in which it was received."
You don't think it's just luck that the USA has been terror free since the invasion of Iraq, do you? Do you know how easy it would be to get a bomb into a crowded shopping mall in this country? Think about it: the bad guys have the will, the desire, the means, and they definitely have the manpower, what's stopping them? Don't you think Achmed Jehadi would rather bomb Boston than get pasted in Ramadi? But... they know that the war for Iraq is vital. Iraq is this war's Guadalcanal. (where we lost 1600 taking one crappy island, btw) It's a hellish grinder that neither side can afford to lose. The bombs are not going off HERE because the enemy is forced to commit all they've got to fight is THERE.
Iraq is priority #1, if for no other reason than the enemy considers it worth dying for. I can think of many other reasons, so can you, be creative.
Other priorities... later.
If Sudan is that vital, call the Chinese. Big army, and they're not very busy right now. Think they'll care?
Ben
Posted by: Ben at May 02, 2006 07:40 PM (du794)
56
Brian,
I differ in your opinion that the common Iraqi is no better off. My Nephew and my Brother in Law just returned from Iraq. They spoke to the common Iraqi citizen on a daily basis and the truth (from what they gathered, not listening to the news) is they want us there to keep the country stable. There are no longer secret police making people disappear, goon squads, or power hungry local politicians (well, they may still be there but with the U.S. presence, they don't do what they used to do, unless they joined the terrorists and work it that way).
My point is, I really see that we are helping the common Iraqi there, they seem to see it that way too.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 03, 2006 05:24 AM (JYeBJ)
57
Retired Navy,
Fair enough. I guess opinions differ among the Iraqis. Some say things were more stable under Saddam. Some say things are better now. I guess the truth is it is a mixed bag. There's no debating that there is more random violence in Iraq now. But, there are not targeted attacks by secret police or goons squads. Just kidnappings and bombings by "insurgents".
Posted by: Brian Smith at May 03, 2006 06:35 AM (DCLM1)
58
One thing I do understand from when I was in that area, most of the people over ther (including the average muslim) just want to live their lives and provide for their families.
It's the extreme end of the spectrum that we have to curtail. That includes the ones we have here in the States as well.
Muslem Jihadist
Nazi Skinheads
Black Panthers
the list goes on.
Until all hate is removed from this world, there will be violence. It's up to all the rest of us to limit what that violence is.
Posted by: Retired Navy at May 03, 2006 07:35 AM (elhVA)
59
Posted on behalf of Alan Hartung because I was enjoying the reasonable debate you took offense at:
"For the first time, someone tries to actually present evidence for their support of the war (I’m talking about you), and then you end it by shutting off dialogue. Nice. I see these issues as very complex, and I was responding initially to your unfair portrayal of pacifism. Finally you present a post with some information worth talking about and discussing, but then you close it with telling me to be gone.
And by the way, the link to my site was to a video. You don’t have to take my words, you can watch Bush say it.
Some are willing to talk and engage those who think differently about difficult issues. You are evidently only willing to talk with those who already agree with you. Enjoy your pats on the back. I’ll let you talk amongst yourselves and ridicule the position which is now held by the majority of this country and you won’t have to fear any opposing voices coming in and disrupting your love of war-fest.
Banning a dissenting voice is very a propos for the camp you represent."
If you delete this post I won't be surprised . . . it is your site, after all. But if you leave it on, I'll appreciate it, since arguments aren't won simply by one party squishing the other party's mouth shut.
Posted by: mark at May 04, 2006 11:01 AM (9k9tO)
60
Oh yes, Alan. I see you have found his whining blog post at being banned.
But did you ever consider why?
I wrote this to one person who asked (Jamie, above) in an email, but I guess others want to know why as well.
Alan came in being combative and making false accusations, which is not a smart way to begin at someone else's blog. He made broad, sweeping generalizations that were inaccurate. He supported few, if any of his charges with facts, and some of his claims were patently false. He argues other areas that show historical and cultural ignorance.
When called by readers for his falsehoods and ignorant comments, he insults both me (which I'm used to) and my readers, and asserts a condescending holier-than-thou attitude instead of providing a legitimate answer. In short, he became a classic web "troll."
The final straw was when he had the gall to assert that Saddam Hussein's genocidal dictatorship was somehow better than the current messy attempt at democracy. Apologists for genocide, rape and torture are banned on my site rather quickly.
I welcome other viewpoints on my site, have several regular liberal commenters (several which I actively encourage), and in some instances, have actually allowed them far more latitude in their behavior than I would for my normal posters [note: "Fat Bastard" for those of you who remember him, was a case in point, until his vile language and empty threats became too extreme]. But I do have certain standards, and limits to my patience, and someone who is such a horrible guest has little reason to complain when he is disinvited.
Please note that even the last post from Mark where he posts Alan's comments, Alan is making misrepresentations. I never once mentioned pacifists; I spoke of the NY anti-war crowd in general. Quite frankly, Alan is the kind of troll that I can do without.
Don't just take my work for it, however. Read the comments on this threat from start to end, and decide for yourself.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at May 04, 2006 11:34 AM (g5Nba)
61
thanks for responding . . . that was a much clearer representation of your reason for banning him than i'd seen previously and i appreciate your time.
Posted by: mark at May 04, 2006 11:40 AM (9k9tO)
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