Illegal Immigration
The first forum is over and the next is about to being. This one is scheduled to run from 3:00-4:15PM ET. They just announced that Michael Decker was sentenced for 4 years in jail for accepting a bribe to change parties which changed the majority of the NC Legislature from what the people elected, Republicans, over to Democrats.
The first speaker was Mark Krikorian of NRO's The Corner:
Most of Washington is convinced there will be amnesty. They are committed to an amnesty -- the only decision is what they will call it and how they will sell it to the people. They have created a false choice: Either we have to forcibly deport everyone quickly; or we have to allow them to stay: amnesty, no matter what it's called. These are not the only two options. There's attrition through enforcment -- something that we have simply not attempted to do. Instead of forced deportation, engage in a policy of self-deportation. We have seen this actually work. About 400,000 illegal LEAVE each year for various reasons -- voluntarily.
The majority of Pakistani illegals left on their own after 9-11 when the US started to enforce immigration laws against them. We could quickly reduce the illegal population by half in 5 years with this process. There is some enforcement now -- and it works when it's tried. Illegals respond to incentives -- if you take away the incentive for them to be here, they will leave voluntarily. We are making progress right now with enforcement -- why should we stop this progress by allowing amnesty: amnesty would be a complete and total mistake. We CAN get control of this situation if we want to -- it's purely a matter of political will.
The next speaker is former Senator Fern Shubert:
Race and country of origin is irrelavant. Immigration is NOT the issue. It is about one word: ILLEGAL. It's obvious to me that if you reward certain types of behavior; then you will get more of that type of behavior. The NC DMV is now accepting federal temporary Social Security cards -- that may be expired; while they could be checking federal visas -- which would show that they were illegal. As long as some people make money off cheap labor; those people simply don't CARE.
Ms. Shubert wrote an article that outlined the cost of illegals in North Carolina. Those who support illegal immigration got the government to write a report on the "real" costs of illegals -- and they used clearly fraudulent numbers: such as calculating the cost of illegal education by simply using state numbers (ignoring federal education costs); and ignoring things like the cost of illegals that cause accidents and the insurance increases. Various studies that have shown how wonderful the economic impact of illegals are done by those who have a vested financial interest -- including reports even done by the Mexican consulate.
Why are we rewarding people who don't follow the rules? We need immigration reform; but first thing we need to reform is attitude: a lot of people are making a lot of money because they don't have to protect illegal immigrants. These people who will not reform driver's licenses should be named as accomplices in the next DUI murder by an illegal immigrant.
Ron Woodard is the Director of N.C. Listen:
NC Listen is a grassroots immigration reform organization that believes in sensible legal immigration, NOT illegal immigration. NC Congressional Republicans have a good voting record regarding illegals. Heath Schuler, just elected, says that he will vote against the illegals, but votes have not been held yet that show if he will or not. Illegal immigration is a huge source of criminals. The MS-13 gang is in various cities in North Carolina. We are spending $480 million a year educating dependents of illegals in NC. They are getting special attention while citizens' children are getting an inadequate education.
1/3 of the uninsured medical are illegals.
Are there jobs that Americans won't do? Farmers don't want to buy machinery when they can pay illegals less money and not pay benefits. We're often told that Hispanics are harder workers than Americans. Hispanic unemployment in the US is higher than overall unemployment. Who did the work before the illegals showed up? Construction workers make less now than they did in 2001. Cheap labor isn't cheap -- it's just cheaper for the employers that hire them.
We can use the 287-G program that helps local sheriffs identify illegals. We should deny government benefits to illegals. We should provide no in-state tuition to illegals. We should stop giving driver's licenses to illegals. We should fine any company that knowingly fines illegals. We should make English the official legislation of state business. Nearly all legislation introduced that will help with the illegal problem has been introduced by Republicans and Democrats continue to ignore the problem. Illegals will self-deport if you take away the incentives.
We need immigration, but we need legal immigration -- on our terms; in ways that help America, not harm it. We need to allow immigrants in without stressing and overloading our schools and government systems.
Steven Bizzell is the sheriff of Johnston County:
I'm dealing with Mexicans from Mexico who drive drunk and steal anything they can get their hands on. You can sugar coat it and call it whatever you want, but that's what I'm dealing with. Illegal is illegal. Everyone wants to talk about it; but the fact remains that they're illegal. I've got them rounded up in my jail, why aren't they [the federal government] coming and getting them?
209 were in my jail this morning. 26 are illegal Mexicans -- about 12%. We're spending $1187 a day in the county jail for medical benefits for illegal Mexican criminals. We have felony warrants for illegals and call the dept of Social Security -- and that deparment would tell us that the wanted felon was receiving benefits; but would not tell us when he was expected in next to collect his free money.
98% of the gangs in my county are being organized by illegal Mexicans. He doesn't like the 287-G program because we're already funding the federal government to enforce the borders -- so it doesn't make sense to spend even MORE money on a program that's not working.
The illegals also have no respect at all for law enforcement. Obey our laws; learn how to drive; get a driver's license; get insurance; or go home. We've got to stand up because the federal government clearly isn't going to do their job. I've had enough, I don't know about you. What do we do? I don't know.
80% of the drug activity in Johnston county is being conducted by illegal Mexicans. It IS a problem. As Sheriff, I want the streets of my county to be safe. But in the streets, there's illegal Mexicans driving drunk all over the state. That's just not right. We are funding a society of illegals. Enough's enough.
Comments and discussion from the audience then continued:
Why are we funding illegals when we cannot fund our elderly population. When the illegals talk about being "victims," let's talk about the real victims.
A massive deportation would be a waste of time and money because they'd come back. Instead, this is a large business. A large number of people are making a lot money off illegals -- so in order to get them to self-deport, you need to get the profits out of illegals. This is the same mentality that got us into the civil war.
The chief law enforcement officer of the United States has to WANT to enforce the law. Our current president simply will not enforce the law. Why not use their drug money to deport them? If we depend on Congress to come up with a solution to illegal immigration, hell's going to freeze over before we get a solution. Why don't the governors pressure the president? Ogre notes: because they don't want to.
We have lost the battle on the word -- we can't call them criminal aliens because people just won't accept that today. What are we doing about the people who are trying to do their job like the Border Patrol agents who are going to jail for doing their job? Ron Woodard said, "You can make a difference." Most Congressmen have one goal in life: to get re-elected. You can talk to them and they will pay attention.
Money is distorting the political process. But politicians DO track letters, faxes, and calls. They track it and they pay attention to it. Calling your Congressmen and Senators will make a difference. There is less pressure to deport illegals due to the social security system -- half or more of illegals are contributing to the system which is preparing to support the retiring baby boomers.
Why not just get rid of the 14th Amendment? It was put in there for African-Americans who were slaves. The whole intent was to give citizenship for blacks after slavery. That was 1868. By now, they're all citizens. Because there are very powerful people that make a lot of money by keeping things the way they are now. Follow the money. North Carolina is rapidly become the Hispanic capital of the East Coast.
Comments
1
It's so convoluted isn't it? This illegal immigration "issue"...and it is all about money...for cheap labor, votes for both democrats AND republicans...It has to end. Jobs? Soon enough we're gonna see higher skilled jobs go to illegals. Just watch. Did they mention NAFTA??
Posted by: Raven at April 27, 2007 11:41 PM (N0oGf)
2
They really did hammer the money issue on this today. Over and over again they hit on "follow the money."
Posted by: Ogre at April 28, 2007 12:32 AM (n3PbV)
3
well honestly i think all this commotion is a negitive to our economy and as a latino american know where this info is comming from but at least you have the money issue.
Posted by: scarlett at May 04, 2007 12:52 PM (vHd3f)
4
I think it's a negative to the overall economy, too. But there's a HUGE business surrounding breaking the law here, so no one seems to want to actually DO anything about it.
Well, except Tom Tancredo and Duncan Hunter.
Well, except Tom Tancredo and Duncan Hunter.
Posted by: Ogre at May 04, 2007 01:21 PM (oifEm)
5
A Sad Parrallel...
I bought a bird feeder. I hung it on my back porch and filled it with seed. Within a week we had hundreds of birds taking advantage of the continuous flow of free and easily accessible food.
But then the birds started building nests in the boards of the patio, above the table, and next to the barbecue. Then came the poop. It was everywhere: on the patio tile, the chairs, the table...everywhere. Then some of the birds turned mean: They would dive bomb me and try to peck me even though I had fed them out of my own pocket. And others birds were boisterous and loud: They sat on the feeder and squawked and screamed at all hours of the day and night and demanded that I fill it when it got low on food.
After a while, I couldn't even sit on my own back porch anymore. I took down the bird feeder and in three days the birds were gone. I cleaned up their mess and took down the many nests they had built all over the patio. Soon, the back yard was like it used to be...quiet, serene and no one demanding their rights to a free meal.
Now lets see...our government gives out free food, subsidized housing, free medical care, free education and allows anyone born here to be a automatic citizen. Then the illegals came by the tens of thousands. Suddenly our taxes went up to pay for free services; small apartments are housing 5 families: you have to wait 6 hours to be seen by an emergency room doctor: you child's 2nd grade class is behind other schools because over half the class doesn't speak English: Corn Flakes now come in a bilingual box; I have to press "one" to hear my bank talk to me in English, and people waving flags other than "Old Glory" are squawking and screaming in the streets, demanding more rights and free liberties.
Maybe it's time for the government to take down the bird feeder.
A Sad Parrallel...
I bought a bird feeder. I hung it on my back porch and filled it with seed. Within a week we had hundreds of birds taking advantage of the continuous flow of free and easily accessible food.
But then the birds started building nests in the boards of the patio, above the table, and next to the barbecue. Then came the poop. It was everywhere: on the patio tile, the chairs, the table...everywhere. Then some of the birds turned mean: They would dive bomb me and try to peck me even though I had fed them out of my own pocket. And others birds were boisterous and loud: They sat on the feeder and squawked and screamed at all hours of the day and night and demanded that I fill it when it got low on food.
After a while, I couldn't even sit on my own back porch anymore. I took down the bird feeder and in three days the birds were gone. I cleaned up their mess and took down the many nests they had built all over the patio. Soon, the back yard was like it used to be...quiet, serene and no one demanding their rights to a free meal.
Now lets see...our government gives out free food, subsidized housing, free medical care, free education and allows anyone born here to be a automatic citizen. Then the illegals came by the tens of thousands. Suddenly our taxes went up to pay for free services; small apartments are housing 5 families: you have to wait 6 hours to be seen by an emergency room doctor: you child's 2nd grade class is behind other schools because over half the class doesn't speak English: Corn Flakes now come in a bilingual box; I have to press "one" to hear my bank talk to me in English, and people waving flags other than "Old Glory" are squawking and screaming in the streets, demanding more rights and free liberties.
Maybe it's time for the government to take down the bird feeder.
Posted by: fedup at May 05, 2007 03:19 PM (BLR4c)
6
its not jobs that ya'll think we are taking that is hurting the economy, its the jobs that the rest of the americans dont want because you auctually have to work for a living, that gives hispanics a chance to earn some hard working money just like some of the rest of the people.and with some help from the government hispanics can get the chance to become legal, but with all the options that is frankily not being given to us how are we suppose to be able to try?so why should that opportunity be taken away from hispanics to support their families?
Posted by: Scarlett at May 08, 2007 12:46 PM (vHd3f)
7
Great example, fedup! Wonderful.
Scarlett, stop, that's just a lie. It's completely and totally not true that Americans don't want those jobs. How are you supposed to be able to try? Follow the damn laws! It's really not that hard. We welcome immigrants THAT FOLLOW THE LAWS. STOP BREAKING THE LAW.
Scarlett, stop, that's just a lie. It's completely and totally not true that Americans don't want those jobs. How are you supposed to be able to try? Follow the damn laws! It's really not that hard. We welcome immigrants THAT FOLLOW THE LAWS. STOP BREAKING THE LAW.
Posted by: Ogre at May 08, 2007 01:54 PM (oifEm)
8
Fedup! I have never heard such a wonderful analogy in my life! It IS time to take away the bird feeder. I completely agree that if we take away all the incentives for illegal immigrants to be here, then they would soon leave due to demand/desperation. That would require a lot of officials help and that doesn't come easy these days. We have never shunned immigrants. We are a diverse country with many difference people living here. Look at New York City. The population is practically all Asian decent. We have no problem with immigrants. All we're asking is for immigrants to come over legally. We have immigration laws for a reason. And if you can't respect our laws, you shouldn't be in our country, and you shouldn't even be given the opportunity to BECOME a citizen.
Posted by: Disgusted at May 12, 2007 03:14 PM (HCuIG)
9
That IS the solution, Disgusted -- and I think a few Republicans are starting to figure that out. We could get smaller government AND have less illegal immigration at the same time! But the bleeding heart liberals WILL fight any move in that direction tooth and nail.
Thanks for stopping along!
Thanks for stopping along!
Posted by: Ogre at May 12, 2007 06:41 PM (3+jVU)
10
I have never been one to look at people in a different way reguarding what their back ground is, but the past five years i have begun to look down upon the Hispanic community.We have given alot to these people since they have started migrating here. I have no problem with the ones that have come here for the right reason , to make a better life. But if they are going to live here they need to work and pay taxes, no more under the table pay. No more hand outs at the social service office. They pay for the birth of their child. One family to a house, and they must go fight in the war like any American that lives here is doing. Living here dont come free.
It is time you pull the plug on this culture. These people would not treat us with the same respect in their country so why are you bending over backwards to make them happy?
My other reason for being so hard on the Hispanic Community is that , Five years ago this June an Illegal Hispanic Murdered my father. He wanted money from him. He beat my father several times and stabbed him 16 times in his chest and neck. If you count the defense wounds to his arms and hands there were 32 wounds total on his body. The money he robbed and killed my father for payed for a prostitute and crack cocaine. This person is still on the run today. The local Hispanic community is not willing to help us in our search for him. The name that we have may not be his, so all we really have is just a photo of him from a prior arrest of DWI. I now have to live with the fact of him being out there living his life after he took my father's. As long as he stays in Mexico he remains a free man.
Somthing has to change in how we make laws to protect our people.
Theresa McClung
It is time you pull the plug on this culture. These people would not treat us with the same respect in their country so why are you bending over backwards to make them happy?
My other reason for being so hard on the Hispanic Community is that , Five years ago this June an Illegal Hispanic Murdered my father. He wanted money from him. He beat my father several times and stabbed him 16 times in his chest and neck. If you count the defense wounds to his arms and hands there were 32 wounds total on his body. The money he robbed and killed my father for payed for a prostitute and crack cocaine. This person is still on the run today. The local Hispanic community is not willing to help us in our search for him. The name that we have may not be his, so all we really have is just a photo of him from a prior arrest of DWI. I now have to live with the fact of him being out there living his life after he took my father's. As long as he stays in Mexico he remains a free man.
Somthing has to change in how we make laws to protect our people.
Theresa McClung
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